General Debate 7 November 2014

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment200

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (200)

Login to comment or vote

alloytoo

@EAD at 11.42

A low inflation economic recovery. Yet you must find something to complain about.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:01pm
mandk

EAD (1,171 comments) says:
November 7th, 2014 at 11:42 am

Try this one. It’s more accurate.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11354810
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:12pm
stephieboy

Ed Snack, stop trying to squirm your way out through some sloppy and specious forms of reasoning . The facts are the GOP is just as much and “hypocritically ( BTW ) into Crony Capitalism as the Democrats .

End of Story,

,http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal/2011_09/

republicans_secret_love_of_cro032308.php

And equally notroiously, Corporate Welfare and other bail outs,

http://finance.townhall.com/columnists/danieljmitchell/2014/09/10/corporate-welfare-can-republicans-kick-the-habit-n1889571/page/full
3 5
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:13pm
EAD

Alloytoo,

Let’s agree to disagree on gold – I don’t think either will convince the other!

It is not a recovery, it is a credit and immigration fuelled bubble. When it pops, it will give me no pleasure to say “I told you so”.
2 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:16pm
wikiriwhis business

The national Socialist govt of 1999 took away mining inspectors and now we know why OSH has never been involved. Was this the same govt under the National Socialist gangster Bolger involved in Cave Creek???
0 11
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:20pm
wikiriwhis business

“The facts are the GOP is just as much and “hypocritically ( BTW ) into Crony Capitalism as the Democrats .

End of Story,”

In other words ….conspiracy
1 10
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:21pm
kowtow

“There are believed to be about 1,000 French citizens in Iraq and Syria, or en route to those countries, more than from any other European nation. ”

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/france-struggles-to-deal-with-young-jihadist-exodus-to-syria-a-1001254.html
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:24pm
Kea

“There are believed to be about 1,000 French citizens in Iraq and Syria, or en route to those countries, more than from any other European nation. ”

That is clearly false. The country that has sent most of its people to fight in these wars is the USA.
0 16
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:29pm
wikiriwhis business

“On the TPP, I doubt you have any understanding of what the treaty actually would do as regards legal enforcement of contracts, the spin out there about the “corporate takeover” is truly loathsomely dishonest.”

How would you know. No one knows. How would you know what the TPP says.

Wikileaks?? And it’s not good news
3 9
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:33pm
Shawn Herles

From Open Markets: WHAT WOULD A RETURN TO THE GOLD STANDARD MEAN?

“Bottom line? A gold standard would result in a relatively fixed money supply. Money supply couldn’t grow faster than the supply in gold, which would ultimately choke off growth. “It would force lending to slow down and the economy to slow down,” says Goldstein. Explaining the connection and impact on lending, Goldstein elaborates. “For every dollar a bank has, it can loan maybe $10-15 out. But, if those dollars are convertible to gold, that all collapses.

“If you can’t borrow, it would choke off the jobs growth, businesses can’t raise prices, and consumers can’t buy at higher prices because they can’t borrow. Basically, you put a chokehold on the economy.”Additionally, for anyone who has current debt now, including a mortgage, “our ability to pay it back would take us longer and would cause us to do without other things to pay it back,” says Goldstein. The gold standard would result in a devaluing of the dollar and it would buy less. That would include bonds issued by cities and towns, and corporate debt as well as consumer debt. “The lenders would benefit, but the people who suffer are people who have to pay back debt.”CPM Group’s Christian echoed those thoughts. “If we are going to manage our money supply, the economy cannot grow as rapidly as it wants to grow with periods of deflation, starvation and depravation that simply don’t have to occur,” he says, noting that repeated periods of starvation were seen in the U.S. through the 1870′s-1890′s “because the money supply could not grow fast enough to grow the economy.””

http://openmarkets.cmegroup.com/4510/what-would-a-return-to-the-gold-standard-mean

More here:

Did the Gold Standard Work? Economics Before and After Fiat Money

“How Did the Classical Gold Standard Actually Work in Practice?

For the most part, the answer seems to be things turned out pretty badly. Its heyday as common currency for the British Empire in the later part of the 19th and early 20th century was interrupted by the First World War. Even before then the mechanism had been tested by support for bimetallist alternatives to crucifying “mankind upon a cross of gold,” as William Jennings Bryan put it, and the 1880s trade depression with its attendant evils of the exhaustion of gold stocks and an explosion of gold hoarding (more below on this below).”

http://blogs.cfainstitute.org/investor/2013/04/16/gold-and-international-reserve-currencies/
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:35pm
wikiriwhis business

90-Year-Old Florida Man Faces Jail Time, $500 Fine For Feeding Homeless

A Florida city was quick to show how serious it is about its new homeless feeding ban by making an example out of a 90-year-old advocate who’s been helping the hungry for two decades.

Despite heated protests, Fort Lauderdale passed an ordinance early on Oct. 22, restricting charitable groups from doling out meals to homeless people in public, the Sun Sentinel reported. The city wasted no time implementing the law. On Sunday police cited two Christian ministers and volunteer Arnold Abbot, 90, who runs the advocacy group, Love The Neighbor, Local 10 News reported.

The three served less than a handful of the 300 meals they prepared before the police run in, according to the Sentinel.

They each now face 60 days in jail and $500 fines.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/04/man-90-arrested-feeding-homeless_n_6100738.html?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000063

This is what we are facing with TPP under the National Socialist gangster govt
0 9
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:37pm
Shawn Herles

“AC/DC are one of the greatest rock acts to come out of Glasgow ever.”

Hang on, I get the Glasgow connection, but strictly speaking aren’t AC/DC an Australian band?
0 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:38pm
stephieboy

This article expertly demolishes cherished myths about the Gold Standard perpetuated by Ron Paul , Zero Hedge , Conspiracy theorists, The Austrian School and Nostalgists etc.

The Gold Standard of Lunacy,

Excerpt,

Be prepared for some plane fair dinkum common sense ,

Excerpt ,

People who like the idea of a gold standard like the idea that gold has “real,” “intrinsic” value, which is a fancy way of saying it just is valuable, in the same way that lead is heavy. “Value,” they argue, is a property installed in gold by God or nature. An economy based on gold is thus an economy founded in natural law: gold bugs dream of an economy which government can’t tamper with. All values will be “real” values. The government can’t issue more gold, so it can’t create debt by simply printing more money.

This is mostly true, but most people stop and think a bit when it’s pointed out the the Revolutionary war, the Civil War, and WWII were all financed by printing paper money, as was the defeat of the Soviet Union in the Cold War, the construction of the Federal Highway system, the Manhattan Project, the development of the Internet, the founding of Microsoft-I could go on.
And also, a gold standard would not really stop the magical creation of money, unless you’re going to insist on using gold coins only. A bank always lends out more money than it has in its vaults: it has $50,000 in cash, but it lends out $100,000.

The bank is “creating money” by making a bet on the creative powers of the people it lends to, like Jimmy Stewart in It’s a Wonderful Life. A gold standard won’t stop this. And if it did stop it, it would be the end of industrial capitalism, which is based entirely on credit, and on creating new money by lending. When we get the loan, on good terms, we tend to like credit. When lots of loans default, as in 2008, we tend to think credit is bad and we want “real” values again….”

http://theaporetic.com/?p=914

And ,

Gold Rush,

What would happen if we returned to the gold standard?

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2010/11/gold_rush.html
3 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:39pm
Ryan Sproull

Gold is similar to Bitcoins in all of the ways relevant to these points, which may be food for thought to both those for and those against the gold standard.
2 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:41pm
wikiriwhis business

What the Tories won’t tell you in their ‘transparent’ tax statement

Only 3% of the welfare budget goes on unemployment, 46% goes on pensions. But if Osborne told us that, how could he justify more cuts?

George Osborne is spending £5m of public money to tell us how your money is spent. Soon every household will get an “annual tax statement” showing what our taxes are spent on. This plan, announced a couple of years ago, now conveniently comes to fruition as the Tories gear up for the election.

In the pointlessly fabricated language that politicians speak, Osborne said these new visual illustrations “will show how hard-working taxpayers have to pay for what governments spend”.

What about the begrudging, lazy taxpayer, Gideon? Or your ultra-rich friends who have more tax-dodging schemes than a comedian has nasty jokes? Still, this is a revolution. “A revolution in transparency.” Transparency is good. Knowledge is power and all that.

But actually, this is not what is happening. This is basically a giant mailshot to justify more cuts. What the Treasury has shown us so far is that the statements will be divided up into welfare, health, education and so on. So if someone earns £30,000 a year they will see that £1,663 goes to “welfare”, and £892 to “education”. They will see that the biggest chunk of their tax goes not to the sick, to pensioners or disabled people, but to this amorphous blob of “welfare”.

If people bother to go to the government website, where the welfare budget is broken down, they can see that only 3% of welfare goes to the unemployed, while pensions account for 46%. But this is not what we will see on our statements. It is designed to make people think we spend more on bad things (welfare) than on good (health).

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/03/tory-tax-statement-welfare-budget-unemployment-pensions-cuts
1 15
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:43pm
James Stephenson

That is clearly false. The country that has sent most of its people to fight in these wars is the USA.

More than any other European nation…
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:47pm
Shawn Herles

wikiriwhis business (4,066 comments) says:

“This is what we are facing with TPP under the National Socialist gangster govt”

I find wb’s claim of National being National Socialist rather amusing given that wb was going on about Zionist (Jew) plutocrats conspiring to undermine the world’s economy and bankrupt the West through theft, an idea that is no different in kind to the crap Hitler spouted.
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:48pm
wikiriwhis business

Calls for TPP transparency are code for destroying it, says Groser

Campaigners against the Trans-Pacific Partnership trade negotiations want the negotiating texts made public to help ensure the process fails, says Trade Minister Tim Groser.

“Those people who are opposed to the agreement want access to the texts so they can blow it apart,” he said in an interview with BusinessDesk ahead of a speech today to the ABAC Business Leaders meeting in Auckland where he rejected analysis challenging the claimed benefits of a TPP trade deal.

His comments come after Labour leader David Cunliffe was blocked in Parliament yesterday from debating release of the negotiating texts for the 13-nation TPP negotiations, which could create a new Pacific Rim free trade agreement that extends more deeply than past FTA’s into investment, regulatory, and other areas requiring a balance between national sovereignty and expected economic gains.

Auckland University law professor Jane Kelsey, a leading international anti-TPP campaigner, released a letter overnight signed by Opposition party politicians in seven of the negotiating countries: Australia, Canada, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand and Peru

http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/calls-tpp-transparency-are-code-destroying-it-says-groser-bd-151763

What a National Socialist criminal creep this unit Groser is.
1 13
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 12:54pm
dime

Quick search at stuff. Keywords “all blacks aura”. Articles from 2009/10/11/12/13/14 on how the ab’s are losing their aura. pathetic.
1 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:00pm
mandk

@ Kea,

I know you don’t have much of a regard for facts, but since when was the USA a European nation?
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:03pm
IGM

wkikiwoof: Stick to worrying about leeching from Treaty settlements and let real people do the negotiating. Your views are irrelevant, as is your doctrine.
7 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:04pm
Kea

This ISIS outfit is getting a lot of mention, accompanied by the usual fake concern for the Iraqi people, (as an excuse to kill even more of them.)

But who is really the biggest threat ?:

On Friday, 14 September 2007, ORB International, an independent polling agency located in London, published estimates of the total war casualties in Iraq since the US-led invasion of Iraq in 2003.[1] At over 1.2 million deaths (1,220,580),
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ORB_survey_of_Iraq_War_casualties
0 11
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:06pm
Rachael Membery

Tarquin North (318 comments) says:

November 7th, 2014 at 9:42 am

Where is this Nirvana of which you speak?
3 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:14pm
hj

Public Address
“What has happened to the esteemed Dr Greg Clydesdale?”

http://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-housing-hope-and-ideology/?i=100#replies
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:23pm
freemark

@ wikiwanka
“Auckland University law professor Jane Kelsey, a leading international anti-TPP campaigner, released a letter overnight signed by Opposition party politicians in seven of the negotiating countries: Australia, Canada, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand and Peru”

There is a reason that they are Opposition Party Leaders – no one thinks they know what they are talking about. If Jane Kelsey had anything to offer she wouldn’t be a perpetual Uni Academic trougher either.
10 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:26pm
Manolo

Everything he touches turns into shit: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/11/06/source-says-reported-letter-from-obama-to-ayatollah-fs-up-everything/
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:33pm
Shawn Herles

“This ISIS outfit is getting a lot of mention”

Most sane people are concerned about a terrorist group with massive resources and global reach.

“accompanied by the usual fake concern for the Iraqi people, (as an excuse to kill even more of them.)”

No, the concern is real. The only people who question it are those with an ideological ax to grind, and no facts.
4 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:37pm
Paulus

Farmer Pete and Tarquin

I am banned from Whale on what I consider a trifle comment – Pete is above himself I think.
Like you I will not crawl back.

But I am in good hands I was banned fro El Standard before the election in agreement with somebody.
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:37pm
Manolo

Little or no difference between this academic and a parasite:

A “sin tax” on unhealthy items is often touted as a way to stop people having them so often, but it might drive them to cheaper brands.

A team led by a University of Waikato researcher has just received $800,000 to study the idea, focusing on sugary soft drinks and cigarettes.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/10707350/800-000-to-review-sin-tax
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:44pm
Manolo

This Chardonnay socialist is even less popular than the Messiah:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/06/us-france-hollande-idUSKBN0IQ14R20141106

Half-way into his five-year mandate the popularity of French President Francois Hollande hit a new low on Thursday, hours before the Socialist leader addresses the nation to defend his shaky record on the economy.

In the worst score for a president in modern-day polling, Hollande received a 12 percent approval rating in the monthly survey by pollster YouGov, down 15 percent from the prior month.
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 1:55pm
publicwatchdog

How many pro-transparency Kiwibloggers will be attending the anti-TPPA marches that will be held all over NZ tomorrow?

FYI

MEDIA ALERT: Penny Bright “Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement – TPPA ?

What sort of ‘partnership’ excludes the public?

Whose country is this?

What happened to ‘the will of the people’ being the basis of the authority of Government?

‘Nothing to hide – nothing to fear?’

SHOW US THE TPPA TEXT!

If transparency would kill the TPPA – then surely – it deserves to die?

http://www.nbr.co.nz/…/calls-tpp-transparency-are-code-dest…

The TPPA is a corporate investor’s treaty – to look after the interests of big business.

Haven’t the public learned after 30 years of global neo-liberal ‘Rogernomic$’ – that what is good for big business, is not usually good for the majority of us?

So – who’s looking after the public interest?

We – the public!

Looking forward to seeing THOUSANDS of New Zealanders on the streets tomorrow, as we kick off the international day of action against this secretive TPPA – for which there is NO citizens’ mandate.

‘Where the people lead – the politicians will follow!’

NO PUBLIC SAY – NO TPPA!

(I’ll be speaking at the Hamilton rally.)

http://www.scoop.co.nz/…/thousands-of-kiwis-plan-national-d…

Events are planned in

AUCKLAND (1pm at Aotea Square),

HAMILTON (1pm at Garden Place)

TAURANGA (1pm at Red Square),

RAGLAN (10am at Raglan Jetty on Bow St),

ROTORUA (1pm at Kuirau Park Courts),

GISBORNE (1pm at Derby Street),

NAPIER (1pm at Napier Council Steps – 231 Hasting Street),

WANGANUI (11:00am at Majestic Square),

NEW PLYMOUTH (1pm at Puke Ariki),

PALMERSTON NORTH (1pm at The Square),

LEVIN (11am at Te Takere Library/Community Centre),

WELLINGTON (1pm at The Bucket Fountain),

NELSON (1pm at Millers Acre i-SITE),

CHRISTCHURCH (12:30pm at Shand Cres Park),

TIMARU (1pm at Bay Hill Piazza),

DUNEDIN (1pm next to the Otago Uni Dental School) and

INVERCARGILL (1pm at Wachner Place).
___________________________________________________________________________________________________

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption / anti-privatisation Public Watchdog’
1 19
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:14pm
Manolo

The CORRUPT Miss Dim is at it (again).
13 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:16pm
Shawn Herles

Noticed this bit of stupidity from EAD yesterday.

“Been using your multiple accounts today to down/up vote posts you disagree/agree with?”

I have one account only. You can check with DPF.

“Haven’t been on since the morning but all my posts castigating the National Party have been given a flurry of down votes since the Sheriff started his shift.”

That is because most people on KB, not just me, think your anti-National attacks are bollocks based on fringe far Right economics and silly conspiracy theories.

“We know how much he dislikes criticism of the Nats”

Valid, rational criticism is fine. Your hysteria based conspiracies are just dumb and lack any credibility.

“by the lengths he goes to to divert and distract,”

You mean shred your silly arguments.

“thinking he is the gate keeper to “right” wing thought. Dissenting ideas must not be put forward!!”

Bullshit. But when you do put forward your insanity, expect it to be criticized and mocked, and not just by me.

“Given your track record of this type of behaviour, is there anything you want to confess to kiwiblog?”

Yes. Your seriously unhinged and in need of professional help.

The truth EAD is that you and your ilk with all your laughable conspiracies from paid Kremlin web sites, want to swan in to KB and rant unchallenged, and when someone challenges you you cannot deal with it like an adult, so resort to character assassination and various, and monumentally dub, conspiracy theories as to why most people think your a loon.

If you just accept that you are a fringe loon, then life will be much easier for you! 🙂
9 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:16pm
alloytoo

@Penny

Most of us work during the week. Saturday therefore has slightly more value to us than watching you lot disrupt honest traders in the CBD. (especially as I understand it’s illegal to pelt you with rotten fruit).
14 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:23pm
Shawn Herles

“(especially as I understand it’s illegal to pelt you with rotten fruit).”

Ahh, the good old days. Any chance we can bring that one back? I have this list of folks, starting with anyone who rants about the 1%……… 🙂
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:27pm
Kea

“No, the concern is real”

Shawn, yet you did not even mention the fact America is responsible for over a million dead. The fact is the USA has killed far more Iraqis than ISIS and Saddam combined.

And here you are justifying more war and death. You are fake and the truth is you do not care. If they were dead Christians, or [Gasp !!!!] Jews, you would be hysterical about what the USA has done.
0 14
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:30pm
Tarquin North

She’s a bit of a work in progress there Rachael, should be a lot of fun trying. Plenty of entertainers ready to help. Paulus, getting banned from The Standard seems easier than getting a nomination to lead the Labour Party. Amazing as it may sound I haven’t been banned, then again I don’t like wasting my time arguing with low IQ preprogrammed zealots.
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:31pm
alex Masterley

1pm Auckland eh?
sorry Penny, I have another engagement in the hills of Mt Roskill.
The 3rd hole should be occupying my attention at that time!
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:32pm
Shawn Herles

“Shawn, yet you did not even mention the fact America is responsible for over a million dead.”

Because they are not. The person responsible for those deaths is Saddam, who decided to screw his people over by invading Kuwait. He got his ass whipped for doing so, but rather than learn the lesson proceeded to break every element of the cease fire agreement. The inevitable result was his fault.

“And here you are justifying more war and death.”

War and death is what we already have, from ISIS. I’m not justifying that, I’m supporting doing something about it.

” If they were dead Christians, or [Gasp !!!!] Jews, you would be hysterical about what the USA has done.”

Bollocks. Germany was Christian, more or less, and removing Hitler and his regime was the right thing to do, despite the fact that millions of Christians died as a result.

You can continue with this delusional fantasy that I hate Arabs and/or Muslims. But anyone on KB familiar with my posts knows this to be untrue.
7 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:41pm
publicwatchdog

I too work very hard during the week.

However – unlike you whining lot (meant of course in a caring way 🙂 – I’m not in paid employment and don’t get a benefit.

Kind regards,

Penny Bright

PS: And – I do put my name to my posts unlike most of you gutless wonders?

Hey! But you’re still ‘gumming’ away, so I must be striking a nerve …….

excellent ……. 🙂
2 22
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:41pm
Shawn Herles

“I’m not in paid employment”

I’m shocked! 🙂

“and don’t get a benefit.”

Not paying your rates is a nice little benefit.

So, you’re unemployed, and screwing the system to get a free ride that other ratepayers don’t get.

And we are supposed to be impressed by this?

Said in a caring way and posted under my own name. 🙂

Shawn Herles:

Attendee: The local Pub.
11 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:48pm
wreck1080

Procuring murder charge dropped against Phil Rudd.

I feel a bit sorry for him actually, the cops lay extremely serious charges which get flashed around the world then the next day drop them.

The incompetency astounds, and Rudd should be able to sue the buggers for laying spurious charges.
6 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:53pm
Tarquin North

No meeting in Whangarei Penny? Another great thing about living in Northland. Will be giving Waipu a whirl on the weekend Alex, you should try it, it’s a great links course and it’s been altered quite recently.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 2:57pm
Ryan Sproull

Because they are not. The person responsible for those deaths is Saddam, who decided to screw his people over by invading Kuwait. He got his ass whipped for doing so, but rather than learn the lesson proceeded to break every element of the cease fire agreement. The inevitable result was his fault.

Breaking ceasefire agreements was not the rationale behind the second invasion of Iraq, to disarm it of active WMD manufacturing. The resultant deaths of Iraqis in the ensuing violence, up to and including today, are on the US and its partners, because they were a predictable outcome of their breach of international law.

Had the invasion been sanctioned by the UNSC, the guilt would lie with that broader body and its processes.
0 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:16pm
alloytoo

I have it on good authority that Penny lives off her assets. (I hope she discloses that income to IRD)
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:21pm
Shawn Herles

“Breaking ceasefire agreements was not the rationale behind the second invasion of Iraq, to disarm it of active WMD manufacturing.”

Ryan, breaking the cease fire agreement was one of the reasons cited at the time, it just got lost in the media’s fixation with WMD’s.

” The resultant deaths of Iraqis in the ensuing violence, up to and including today, are on the US and its partners, because they were a predictable outcome of their breach of international law.”

What breach?

The UN ceasefire agreement allowed for military action if Saddam failed to abide. He failed. That China and Russia voted against military action DESPITE Saddam’s repeated breaches made a mockery of international law and the US had to act in support of that law and hold Saddam accountable.

So, it was Saddam’s fault, aided and abetted by his Russian and Chinese allies, and the deaths are on his head.

I have to work tonight, so apologies if I cannot respond further.

Have a nice night all.
3 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:23pm
kowtow

“How many pro-transparency Kiwibloggers will be attending the anti-TPPA marches that will be held all over NZ tomorrow?

DUNEDIN (1pm next to the Otago Uni Dental School)”

Personally I’d rather be inside the school getting a root canal job from a yet to qualify quack than be anywhere near a bunch of soap dodging commies tomorrow.
9 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:41pm
Kea

Shawn, give up on the fake concern.

The fact is Saddam was supported by the USA when he was at his worst. They also supported his attack on Iran, which resulted in numerous deaths on both sides.

America is out of control and either needs to go home and mind its own business, or be bought to its knees and destroyed as a super power.
0 11
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:46pm
Colville

1pm Auckland eh?
sorry Penny, I have another engagement in the hills of Mt Roskill.
The 3rd hole should be occupying my attention at that time!

Third hole? I must be counting wrong. I always thought it was the second hole from the back of the head?
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 3:49pm
Lucia Maria

From Leviathan director Andrei Zvyagintsev: ‘Living in Russia is like being in a minefield’

“It’s like being in a minefield, this is the feeling you live with here. It’s very hard to build any kind of prospects – in life, in your profession, in your career – if you are not plugged in to the values of the system. It’s a stupid construction of society, and unfortunately the eternal curse of our territory. The ideas of the rule of law, of equal rights are hardly discussed here. There is discussion in society, but it’s pointless. I have a feeling of the absolute futility of pretending to the right to have a say in any situation. I’ve turned 50 and I’ve never voted in my life. Because I’m absolutely certain that in our system it’s a completely pointless step.”

…

“We live in a feudal system when everything is in the hands of one person, and everyone else is in a vertical of subordination,” says Zvyagintsev, explaining the power structure of modern Russia that defines the film, where kissing upwards and kicking downwards are the main modes of operation.

Some very interesting comments.
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 4:00pm
IGM

Public Dog: You know you are, and always have been, nothing but a leech on society!
7 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 4:02pm
Kea

Is this WACIST ?

It says: “I am sorry to inform you that my client does not hire Irish people due to the alcoholism nature of your kind”.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/63012115/Irish-alcoholism-costs-jobseeker
2 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 4:18pm
Kea

Germany was Christian, more or less, and removing Hitler and his regime was the right thing to do, despite the fact that millions of Christians died as a result.

Was it ?

We were told that this [Nazi] evil regime was taking over Europe. All we did was clear the way for Russia to take over Eastern Europe, Central Asia and the Caucasus region. A bit of reading will reveal the communist regime was every bit as bad as anything Hilter had in mind. And it only ended in the 90’s.

If the goal was to free Europe, then the war was pointless. Around 70 million killed to install a brutal communist regime that took the world to the brink of nuclear annihilation. If that is what victory looks like I would not want to see failure.
1 10
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 4:45pm
wat dabney

“How many pro-transparency Kiwibloggers will be attending the anti-TPPA marches that will be held all over NZ tomorrow? ”

Are these anti-TPPA protestors in favour of economic freedom in all spheres, such as charter schools?
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:05pm
Shawn Herles

“Shawn, give up on the fake concern.”

Give up on the fake concern for Arab lives. The only thing you care about is your infantile anti-Americanism.

“The fact is Saddam was supported by the USA when he was at his worst.”

Saddam was never actually supported by the US, his primary supporter was Russia.

“America is out of control and either needs to go home and mind its own business,”

America is in control and provides a needed counter-power to China, Russia, and Islamic terrorists.

“or be bought to its knees and destroyed as a super power.”

And who is going to do that? Seriously, whackjob anti-Americans have been claiming that one or another power is going to see America off, and all have failed.

“We were told that this [Nazi] evil regime was taking over Europe.”

And it was, and almost did so. This is a fact, not merely something we were “told” unless you want to contradict every major historian in the world, not to mention the facts.

“If the goal was to free Europe, then the war was pointless.”

It did indeed free Western Europe, not to mention stopping the Holocaust. Of course, you may think that ending Hitler and stopping the Holocaust was pointless, but I seriously doubt that the victims of the Nazi’s thought so, the ones that were still breathing at least.

“Around 70 million killed to install a brutal communist regime that took the world to the brink of nuclear annihilation.”

And you are shilling for the new neo-Soviet empire. That seems a little contradictory, but I guess any port in a storm when you’re trying to claim white is black and black is white.

So the real question is how many hundreds of thousands of ethnic and religious minorities you are happy to see slaughtered while the world does nothing against ISIS?

A ball park figure of how many lives need to be snuffed out in the service of your anti-American nuttery will do fine.
9 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:31pm
Yvette

TPP
Auckland University law professor Jane Kelsey, a leading international anti-TPP campaigner, released a letter overnight signed by Opposition party politicians in seven of the negotiating countries: Australia, Canada, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand and Peru.
While New Zealand Green Party MP’s are among the signatories, Cunliffe and other Labour MP’s are not.
http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/calls-tpp-transparency-are-code-destroying-it-says-groser-bd-151763
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:44pm
Shawn Herles

Who armed Saddam?

The source for these figures is impeccable, the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute.

Note that the top three countries that armed Saddam are Russia, China and France, the very same nations who just happened to oppose military action against him. The US is not even in the top ten.

http://www.command-post.org/archives/002978.html
4 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:55pm
Kea

Shawn, The war had nothing at all to do with stopping the holocaust. Christians around the world could not have done less as the committed Christian and staunch Catholic, Adolf Hitler, went about his evil business.

Why no mention of the other 60 million who died Shawn, and why no mention of the one million dead Iraqis ?

It was people like you who designed and carried out the holocaust.
0 7
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:57pm
Kea

Shawn, why don’t you bugger off to Stuff and parrot your US propaganda there ?

It won’t last buddy. Eventually Russia and China will deal with the US. It won’t be flash for your mates in Israel either !
1 9
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 5:59pm
Zapper

Shawn Herles:

Attendee: The local Pub.

That’s gold
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:02pm
Kea

Shawn you really need to stop the lies.

Exclusive: CIA Files Prove America Helped Saddam as He Gassed Iran

The U.S. knew Hussein was launching some of the worst chemical attacks in history — and still gave him a hand.

The U.S. government may be considering military action in response to chemical strikes near Damascus. But a generation ago, America’s military and intelligence communities knew about and did nothing to stop a series of nerve gas attacks far more devastating than anything Syria has seen, Foreign Policy has learned.

===================

CIA ‘helped Saddam Hussein carry out chemical weapons attack on Iran’ in 1988 under Ronald Reagan
U.S. fed intelligence to Iraq about whereabouts of Iranian forces
Iraq deployed mustard gas and sarin in 1988 on the back of the information
U.S. administration supported Iraq during the eight-year conflict
Up to 20,000 Iranian troops were killed by mustard gas and nerve agents from Iraqi forces during the war

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2402174/CIA-helped-Saddam-Hussein-make-chemical-weapons-attack-Iran-1988-Ronald-Reagan.html#ixzz3IMALMOnK

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2013/08/25/secret_cia_files_prove_america_helped_saddam_as_he_gassed_iran
3 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:09pm
nasska

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9omi25nlyjq1hqb/Muslim%2016.jpg?dl=0
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:15pm
RRM

So the failure of the Arahura this morning turned out to be the 30 year old main board of the control unit that governs the pitch of the propellor.

As opposed to Union trechery, as was being posited earlier today. 😉

I guess sometimes shit just happens, and it’s not some malign incompetent bastard’s FAULT?
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:17pm
Ryan Sproull

“Breaking ceasefire agreements was not the rationale behind the second invasion of Iraq, to disarm it of active WMD manufacturing.”

Ryan, breaking the cease fire agreement was one of the reasons cited at the time, it just got lost in the media’s fixation with WMD’s.

The media’s fixation on WMDs? The media were reporting on George “We can’t wait for the smoking gun to come in the form a mushroom cloud” W Bush’s argument for invasion. Reporting on him and Colin Powell arguing about “mobile weapons labs” in front of the UNSC and failing to get their proposed resolution (to disarm Saddam) sanctioned.

” The resultant deaths of Iraqis in the ensuing violence, up to and including today, are on the US and its partners, because they were a predictable outcome of their breach of international law.”

What breach?

The UN ceasefire agreement allowed for military action if Saddam failed to abide. He failed. That China and Russia voted against military action DESPITE Saddam’s repeated breaches made a mockery of international law and the US had to act in support of that law and hold Saddam accountable.

Self-professed vigilantism is not acting in support of the law. The resolution about breaches of the previous ceasefire agreement (1441), which passed unanimously, did not sanction military force, and Iraq complied partly by opening up to UN weapons inspectors. There were significant shortfalls, but 1441 did not sanction military force without a further resolution.

That’s why the US tried to get a resolution that sanctioned military force and failed to do so.

“Should we have to go in, our mission is very clear: disarmament. And in order to disarm, it would mean regime change. I’m confident we’ll be able to achieve that objective, in a way that minimizes the loss of life. No doubt there’s risks in any military operation; I know that. But it’s very clear what we intend to do. And our mission won’t change. Our mission is precisely what I just stated.”
– George W Bush, press conference, March 6 2003. (http://www.acronym.org.uk/docs/0303/doc04.htm)

“I have indicated it was not in conformity with the UN charter from our point of view, from the charter point of view, it was illegal.” – Kofi Annan, February 2004 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3661134.stm)

And here’s Colin Powell’s embarrassing song and dance about mobile weapons labs: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/feb/05/iraq.usa
4 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:18pm
Kea

Yet another frigid winter in the Northern Hemisphere. I just heard, on the radio, some cities have vastly increased their coal supplies to deal with the cold.

“Waves of Cold, Snow to Invade Midwest and East Into Next Week

After a weekend with record cold and snow, more waves of cold air and snow are on the way through the middle of November from the Midwest to the East.

A storm last weekend produced the earliest snowfall on record in Columbia, South Carolina, on Saturday. Freezing temperatures settled over much of the South and, when combined with the snow in the southern Appalachians, allowed some ski resorts to open early.

Snow buried part of New England later in the weekend, as the same storm pushed off the coast, turned northward and ramped up.”

http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/cold-shots-snow-midwest-east/36784624
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:24pm
nasska

They must have got it wrong Kea. Just the other day, on these very forums, someone reckoned that the temperatures have been soaring & that it’s probably too late to save the planet.

Can you check that link….it could be one of those sceptic sites. 🙂
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 6:51pm
Kea

The freezing snow and ice is on the ground not on sceptic sites 😉
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:14pm
nasska

…”The freezing snow and ice is on the ground”….

Quick! Carbon taxes must increase….only they can save the planet.

NOW! 🙂
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:24pm
EAD

Lucia Maria 9.43 – “For in the early 90’s I was reading the exact same thing that you promote in various conspiracy magazines, which is paper money is not worth anything, banks make money out of nothing”

Shawn Herles 12.35 -“For every dollar a bank has, it can loan maybe $10-15 out. But, if those dollars are convertible to gold, that all collapses

Stephie 12.39 ,- “A bank always lends out more money than it has in its vaults: it has $50,000 in cash, but it lends out $100,000.”

So you all admit banks create money out of nothing, lend it to you (while taking your home as security) then charge you interest on the money they created out of nothing? So in other words you down all your life working for banks – sounds like slavery to me!

Money is a new form of slavery, and distinguishable from the old simply by the fact that it is impersonal – that there is no human relation between master and slave – Tolstoy
3 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:31pm
Don the Kiwi

” The war had nothing at all to do with stopping the holocaust. Christians around the world could not have done less as the committed Christian and staunch Catholic, Adolf Hitler, went about his evil business.”

Kea.

This is a deliberate and often repeated lie, that has been pointed out to you time and time again – but you insist on repeating it, in the same manner as Goebbels and the other left wing liars, who continually repeat a lie, so that it may be believed.

That is why I consider you to be nothing more than a leftie troll, a leftie liar and a complete fuckwit.

I cannot wait for the day when you really overstep the mark, and DPF bans you permanently.
12 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:31pm
Shawn Herles

“Shawn, why don’t you bugger off to Stuff and parrot your US propaganda there ?”

Silly child. Is this your blog? A pro-National blog is exactly the right place for a pro-American views. Duh.

The Stranded would find you an audience more suited to your crap.

“It won’t last buddy. Eventually Russia and China will deal with the US. It won’t be flash for your mates in Israel either !”

Russia and China have not got a hope in hell of doing any such thing. But delusions are free.

I doubt you would find a world dominated by China and Russia would have anything at all to do with freedom and peace.
4 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:38pm
Griff

Yet another frigid winter in the Northern Hemisphere.

Nope yet another cold blast in the north eastern usa The south western usa and Alaska is still baking
From the site you linked to.

A powerful storm is slated to move over the Bering Sea this weekend, possibly becoming one of the most intense storms to ever impact the region.According to Senior Meteorologist Brett Anderson, “In brief, when a typhoon curves away from Asia it causes the jet stream [steering winds] farther to the east across the Pacific and into North America to buckle and amplify days later.”This is the case for the remnants of Super Typhoon Nuri as it has already curved away from Asia and tracking northward toward Alaska.As a result, arctic air is expected to invade the Plains, Midwest and Northeast next week.

Dry conditions will persist over the Southwest well beyond the upcoming weekend, as the drought intensifies and fire danger continues.

http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/winter-weather
The usa is experiencing climate change. Stronger storms. More extremes in precipitation. More drought in dry areas.
2 6
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:41pm
tom hunter

That is why I consider you to be nothing more than a leftie troll, a leftie liar and a complete fuckwit.

I hate to tell you this Don, but Kea is actually quite right wing on many issues. It’s just that he loves having fights on KB focused on proving the purity of his mental essence, so the crazier they are the better, and if talking like a 1980’s Far Lefter will do the trick then it’s all good.
6 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:43pm
Shawn Herles

“as the committed Christian and staunch Catholic, Adolf Hitler, went about his evil business.””

Hitler gave lip service to Christianity when it suited him, but the facts prove that the Nazi’s were a neo-Pagan outfit opposed to real Christianity.

Don,

“This is a deliberate and often repeated lie, that has been pointed out to you time and time again – but you insist on repeating it,”

Because he is an idiot of epic proportions. Most, if not all of kea’s wildly hilarious nuttery has been proven wrong repeatedly, but kea, being both a troll and a moron, does not care about facts. This was proven the day he posted a video of drug cartel loons beheading someone and tried to claim it was an example of Catholicism! An argument so utterly stupid and dishonest that only someone with serious metal health issues would have made it.
9 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:44pm
Shawn Herles

“I hate to tell you this Don, but Kea is actually quite right wing on many issues.”

When it suits him, and assuming anything he says at all can be trusted. I’m skeptical that kea has any real political ideology at all, apart from the usual far Right and far Left obsession with Jews and Israel.
6 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:46pm
nasska

….”I cannot wait for the day when you really overstep the mark, and DPF bans you permanently”…..

I sense a slip in your façade of Christian forgiveness there Don. Five times round the church on your hands & knees while banging your head on the lawn every six metres will be your lot after your next confession m’boy.

We’ll deal with your other sins of coveting your neighbour’s arse & lusting after his goat next week. 🙂
6 9
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:49pm
OneTrack

“The freezing snow and ice is on the ground not on sceptic sites”

According to Andrew Little, the freezing snow and ice is all John Key’s fault. Is there no limit to Key’s power – he can even hold back Global Warming(tm)? We’re saved.
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:51pm
tom hunter

Because he is an idiot of epic proportions…

Actually he’s not. Like his doppelganger, the already infamous Stephieboy he will simply repeat the same thing again after he’s lost the debate, and then repeat it again, and then repeat it again, and …..

… but in Kea’s case it’s because this is all a great lark and a shit-stir – not a debate. As I once said, he’s an argumentative version of Johnboy – and I regard that as no great insult to the latter. 🙂
6 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:54pm
Griff

Kea This is a deliberate and often repeated lie,

Did you only just notice that kea tells lies don ?
He makes up story’s to suit himself and will repeat them ad nauseum if he thinks it will get attention.

proving the purity of his mental essence

Only if you think “purity of mental essence” has a good dose of the dark triad included.
6 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 7:58pm
Shawn Herles

Ryan,

“The media’s fixation on WMDs?”

Yes. The administration’s concerns were numerous, with WMD’s being only one aspect of that concern. It was the media that focused on that to the exclusion of everything else.

“That’s why the US tried to get a resolution that sanctioned military force and failed to do so.”

Only because Russia, France and China did not want their lucrative arms sales to Saddam interfered with. At that point the security council became irrelevant, morally and ethically, and the US acted to uphold the point of the law.

The same would be true of ISIS. If the security council failed to endorse military action, the US and it’s allies would be morally right to go ahead anyway.

Sooner or later, both national security and natural justice have to prevail. especially when international law was being corrupted, abused and misused by countries who’s only concern was continuing to arm Saddam.

If the US had waited, the outcome would have been a lot worse.
5 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:00pm
Viking2

The interesting relationship of the Resource Management Act and housing affordability.

A lot has been said about housing affordability lately. One of the lesser appreciated culprits is the Resource Management Act 1991 (“RMA”). Since this legislation took effect on 1 October 1991 New Zealand has declined from its record peak of 76% home-ownership down to just 63% and falling.

The purpose of the RMA is stated in section 5 with “the purpose of this Act is to promote the sustainable management of natural and physical resources”. Where did we go so badly wrong to delay or in some cases dash the hopes and aspirations of so many home-owners?

http://www.interest.co.nz/opinion/72802/fridays-top-10-david-whitburn-rma-and-housing-affordability-why-state-house-sales-are-

We need private residential property investors to keep taking the risk of personally guaranteeing collectively billions of dollars of loans, paying interest, risking vacancies and repairs and maintenance issues, and threats of regulation such as compulsory building warrants of fitness and ring-fencing of tax losses.
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:15pm
Griff

We witnessed the same effect we are seeing in Iran and Syria when the former Yugoslavia republic collapsed .
The vacuum created by the collapse of control resulting in formally oppressed radical factions coming to the fore and society rapidly decayed into conflict and atrocious war.
I dont know what the result will be in Syria and Iraq and dont support an escalation to total war in any context
Hopefully the west only concentrates on containing the conflict within the borders isis presently controls and lets them sort it out for them self’s.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:21pm
Griff

Zoning and town planning v2
Constrain the supply of land and place artificial restraints on the housing market and the result is always distortion in the markets ability to meet demand.
Why should councils control how or what you build? The market should decide if that means small cheap tower units or urban sprawl that should be the result.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:28pm
Shawn Herles

EAD,

The conspiracy theory in question has all the credibility of Elvis sightings and Area 51 ufo’s.

Actually, that is true of most conspiracy theories, and the truth is that these conspiracy theories are not new, go back centuries, and are deeply entangled with antisemitism, hence the obsession with Jews, Jewish bankers, the so-called “Zionist lobby” and Israel, which almost all of these theories have.

There is no NWO. Like all conspiracy theories, it’s just a lazy excuse for an inability to deal with the messiness of the real world.
4 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:30pm
Pete George

“a good dose of the dark triad included.”

In my sheltered life I hadn’t heard of the dark triad until recently. My introduction was from someone at The Standard: “Farrar, Slater and George form the dark-triad of NZ blogging.”

That’s pretty pathetic, in relation to DPF as well.
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:33pm
Shawn Herles

EAD,

Just to be clear my disagreement with you is about ideas and philosophy. I know we have had some run ins with each other, but it’s not personal for me, especially in your case. I think your an intelligent guy, and motivated by your own sense of right and wrong.

I just find conspiracy theories very hard to swallow, for a variety of reasons.

But, I would never down tick you just for the hell of it, and I do regularly up tick when I agree.

Anyway, gotta go.

Have fun and play nice children. 😉
3 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:41pm
Griff

Look it up and examine keas behavior PG
https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=trolls+dark+traid&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=fflb&gfe_rd=cr&ei=OHdcVKiMNM7C8ge4j4HoCA
When you posted here that they accused you of displaying the symptoms on kb the general consensus was laughter at the idea.
0 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:45pm
EAD

Shawn – I don’t deal in conspiracy theory (like you putting words into my mouth about the ayatollahs, where did I mention UFOs?)

The thing that has enabled governments to go into eye-watering debt is the removal of the gold standard as it acted as a brake on expansion of the monetary supply. This severing of the ties of money to gold was deliberate, not an accident. If you can’t see the ramifications of this delinking to gold and the expansion of government power that resulted then yes, your only defence is to run around yelling “conspiracy”, “Zionists”, “NWO” rather than engage in debate which is tough as all you have is a hammer.

PS: Likewise Shawn – nothing personal. I just don’t think we agree on much which comes from the way we each interpret our surroundings.
1 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:48pm
Griff

Ead there is simply not enough gold to support the worlds economy’s unless you drive the value to absurd amounts.
It also has actual value in industry your device for accessing the internet will have gold in its connections.
if we had a gold standard the constraint on supply would make modern technology unaffordable or result in lessor metals replacing its use making electronics slower and more unreliable.
2 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 8:57pm
Lucia Maria

EAD,

So you all admit banks create money out of nothing, lend it to you (while taking your home as security) then charge you interest on the money they created out of nothing? So in other words you down all your life working for banks – sounds like slavery to me!

Money is a new form of slavery, and distinguishable from the old simply by the fact that it is impersonal – that there is no human relation between master and slave – Tolstoy

No, it’s not slavery. At any time I can sell my house and leave the country. Just like when my husband and I sold the apartment that we owned (with a mortgage) in Australia and moved to NZ. If we were slaves, we wouldn’t be able to have those sorts of choices. To call indebtedness to banks slavery is a severe form of emotional hyperbole – it’s just not accurate.

What are people’s choices when it comes to home-ownership? – Saving up for years and years while paying rent, generally to a landlord who has a mortgage, thus paying off that mortgage – that’s an even worse proposition.

Also, once you have property, even if it’s mortgaged, you can loan against it for business purposes – something we found to be almost impossible when we were renters.

Like it or not, this money out of nothing creates opportunity that would otherwise not be there, therefore improving the lives of many, many people. To call it slavery is just ludicrous.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:08pm
nasska

The value of gold lies in it’s scarcity….raise the demand for gold & the price will skyrocket. Then mining will really take off which will in turn lower the price of gold.

Gold is only worth the price of its recovery….not a cent more or a cent less.
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:09pm
EAD

Borrow someone’s savings is moral, borrowing money that some red shield banker created out of thin air and pay interest on it is usury.

If you came to the bank of EAD and asked for a loan, instead of lending you my savings I just typed some numbers into a keyboard and made YOU GO WORK TO PAY BACK MY KEYSTROKES, in my book that is slavery. If you don’t pay back the loan I created out of thin air than BAM, EAD will take your house and all I had to do was punch some numbers into a computer.

This monetary system is what is destroying capitalism as it removes the needs for capital which is just another word to describe “savings”
3 6
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:21pm
Redbaiter

New political party?

Muriel Newman.

Five principles movement.

http://www.5pm.org.nz/policies/
3 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:27pm
mikenmild

Could be the movement you have waited for, seeing as Colin Craig and Christine Rankin couldn’t fulfill your fantasies.
6 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:31pm
Griff

There is constants on supply nasska
For the present amount already mined the figure calculated to back the wold economy is $10,000 to $40,000 per ounce, based on world GDP figures (roughly 100 trillion).
Yip we would be ripping up the entire west coast of NZ at that price.

but I would hate to think the price of say a cell phone or laptop
have a look at the battery connection that yellow connector is gold same for the chips.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:32pm
Redbaiter

Obama’s call to Julia Gillard asking a big favour.

Rumour is he asked it of John Key first but got nowhere there either.
3 5
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:37pm
Lucia Maria

It’s not quite like that, EAD.

The house itself represents the money. When someone buys it with a mortgage, it’s like the cash is transferred from the bank to the sellers, with the bank taking on the risk to get that money back.

This monetary system is what is destroying capitalism as it removes the needs for capital…

Well, no, because to get a loan you need something to secure that loan to – something that represents it. Without that, you can’t get any substantial amount of money, even if you want to invest it in a business. I know, because years ago we tried to get a loan to improve our business, but no, without a house to back that loan with, the bank won’t do it.
2 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 7, 2014 9:50pm
Kea

Don the Kiwi, Hitler was a Catholic and used his Christian faith to justify and support his persecution of Jews. That is a fact. You can squirm like a salted slug and make personal attacks on me all the like, but your lies will not change the truth. Of course you lying bigots want me banned, so you can secure KB’s position as NZ’s leading religious bigotry and hate site.

You would get banned from Stormfront for the stuff you lot write on KB daily. Such as calling for followers of some religions to be rounded up and their countries nuked and the people exterminated, as they are lice feeding on our society ! I will not sink to the level of the – reporter – but I am pretty sure the Standards Authority DPF joined might have something to say about those comments. Yet DPF has not issued one single demerit or even a warning on any of those sorts of comments. You would be banned for life if you said it about Jews though.

Pick yourself out the gutter. If you can not handle facts then is your mind that needs to change, because reality wont.

“The anti-Semitism of the new movement (Christian Social movement)
was based on religious ideas instead of racial knowledge.”

[Adolf Hitler, “Mein Kampf”, Vol. 1, Chapter 3]

“I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty
Creator. By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord’s work.”

[Adolph Hitler, Speech, Reichstag, 1936]

“I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of
the Almighty Creator.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp. 46]

“What we have to fight for…is the freedom and independence of the
fatherland, so that our people may be enabled to fulfill the mission
assigned to it by the Creator.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp. 125]

“This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the
practical existence of a religious belief.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp.152]

“And the founder of Christianity made no secret indeed of his
estimation of the Jewish people. When He found it necessary, He drove
those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp.174]

“Catholics and Protestants are fighting with one another… while the
enemy of Aryan humanity and all Christendom is laughing up his sleeve.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp.309]

“I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so”

[Adolph Hitler, to Gen. Gerhard Engel, 1941]

“Any violence which does not spring from a spiritual base, will be
wavering and uncertain. It lacks the stability which can only rest in
a fanatical outlook.”

[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, p. 171]
1 5
Log in to Reply
Report
November 8, 2014 1:12am
Kea

Don, Having read this you can do one of three things:

1. Cry troll.

2. Demand I am banned for providing evidence to support my claim, and continue to lie about it.

3. Accept it and maybe become a decent person (it is never too late, even for Catholics)

========================================================

The Christianity of Hitler revealed in his speeches and proclamations

Through subterfuge and concealment, many of today’s Church leaders and faithful Christians have camouflaged the Christianity of Adolf Hitler and have attempted to mark him an atheist, a pagan cult worshipper, or a false Christian. However, from the earliest formation of the Nazi party and throughout the period of conquest and growth, Hitler expressed his Christian support to the German citizenry and soldiers. In the 1920s, Hitler’s German Workers’ Party (pre Nazi term) adopted a “Programme” with twenty-five points (the Nazi version of a constitution). In point twenty-four, their intent clearly demonstrates, from the very beginning, their stand in favor of a “positive” Christianity:

24. We demand liberty for all religious denominations in the State, so far as they are not a danger to it and do not militate against the morality and moral sense of the German race. The Party, as such, stands for positive Christianity, but does not bind itself in the matter of creed to any particular confession. It combats the Jewish-materialist spirit within and without us, and is convinced that our nation can achieve permanent health from within only on the principle: the common interest before self-interest.
Hitler’s speeches and proclamations, even more clearly, reveal his faith and feelings toward a Christianized Germany. Nazism presents an embarrassment to Christianity and demonstrates the danger of faith. The following words from Hitler show his disdain for atheism, and pagan cults, and reveals the strength of his Christian feelings:

http://www.nobeliefs.com/speeches.htm
0 7
Log in to Reply
Report
November 8, 2014 1:23am
Pete George

New political party?

Muriel Newman.

Five principles movement.

Muriel was actively posting up until the election and then stopped on the 21st September. It sounds like the same old, repackaged.

“Government of the people, by the conservatives, for the people”.

They are fooling themselves if they thing government by referenda will enable their narrow ideals.

The mood for political change is an international phenomenon and New Zealand is not immune from its effects.

There was little sign of a mood for political change in the last election. The result was much the same as the previous election, with a bit more of a move against the only party that could lead a change government, Labour.
2 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 8, 2014 7:06am

More comments:

‹
1
2

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« Lake Titicaca Day 2

Reflections on the 2014 US Mid-term elections »

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Highlights

The Kiwis are fleeing
Inflation by term
Houston we have a problem
Our immunisation disaster

Never miss a post

Email Address

Links

Heather du Plessis-Allan: Judges should not be above criticism
Breaking Views
Animals
No Minister
Wash Post admits reality: ‘Amid explosive demand, America is running out of power’ – U.S. ‘power grid’ being pushed ‘to the brink. Utilities can’t keep up’ – ‘It is staggering’ – But WaPo frets energy shortage ‘threatens to stifle the transition to cleane
Utopia
Word of the day
Hompaddock
Populist Extremism and Culture Wars on the rise in NZ? We’ve been here before, but why it’s different this time
The Daily Blog
A crisis of ambition
Point of Order
Open mike 20/04/2024
The Standard
A who's who of New Zealand's dodgiest companies
No Right Turn
"Under a better Resource Management system [sic], there would be no need for fast-track approval processes."
Not PC
Despair - construction consenting edition
Offsetting Behaviour
RACIST ADVERTISING
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Is the state coming for churches?
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
Super Rugby Predictions for Week 9
Stats Chat
Coalition Promises
NZCPR
Tougher than that
Croaking Cassandra
ABs stripped of 2011 title after try disallowed
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz