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April 10, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 10 April 2020

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General Debate

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MT_Tinman

How many people in the next two weeks are going to try to start their car for the first time in weeks and find the car won’t start, the battery is flat?

How many of those occasions will be in an emergency?
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April 10, 2020 8:00am
- Harriet
  
  Left to their own devices there would be one in every household. 😎
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:16am
  - igm
    
    Buy a couple of solar chargers and put them on cars or bikes not in use. They keep batteries charged up well.
    Damn good for keeping boat batteries up also.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:24am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      and if you don’t already have them, there is nowhere to buy them.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:25am
      - igm
        
        Anyone with half a brain who has a few vehicles surely has alternative charging arrangements for those that are not in permanent use.
        Solar are the way to go because they can be ignored.
        
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        April 10, 2020 10:35am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        igm
        Read and learn
        https://blog.nationwide.com/extend-car-battery-life/
        https://mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/17425/gases-from-car-batteries
        For lead-acid batteries under no load float charging (such as in SLI batteries), trickle charging happens naturally at the end-of-charge, when the lead-acid battery internal resistance to the charging current increases enough to reduce additional charging current to a trickle, hence the name. In such cases, the trickle charging equals the energy expended by the lead-acid battery splitting the water in the electrolyte into hydrogen and oxygen gases.
        NOTE:
        When trickle charging, remember to keep well ventilated:
        “….expended by the lead-acid battery splitting the water in the electrolyte into hydrogen and oxygen gases.”
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:27pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        igm
        Also, continual trickle charging, reduces battery life.
        and eventually capability to fully charge.
        Batteries have an internal resistance, meaning they discharge naturally.
        In order to prolong the life of your battery and it’s maximum charge capacity.
        Batteries should be cycled, charged, used/discharged and charged again.
        Note:
        Do NOT allow batteries to be FULLY discharged as they will need to be recharged carefully to stop the over current from heating and bending the plates.
        also charge too quickly and it gives off (as above) hydrogen and oxygen.
        A very flammable combination.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:32pm
      - igm
        
        RW: I have been trickle charging for many years, and find your argument totally flawed.
        Batteries usually last me at least three dutiful years, that being more than satisfactory.
        I can present many arguments against your baseless claims but am happy to keep going as I am.
        
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        April 10, 2020 6:20pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        Sorry igm, you are just wrong.
        I have about 30 yrs experience dealing with electronics and batteries, battery life, charge cycles life expectancy, diminished charge capacity.
        I think I got ya beat.
        and the literature backs ME up.
        
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        April 10, 2020 7:00pm
      - igm
        
        Literature to back your argument up is baseless.
        I have facts, the years I get out of batteries, not having to stuff around resetting ECUs and all the b/shit you are referring to.
        I also, have a lifelong background in the motor industry, and have heard all this electronic b/s before.
        Tell your story to a farmer who finds his tractor or quad won’t start in a back paddock on a large farm.
        
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        April 11, 2020 8:25am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Very few. Most people will have been going out to buy food. And those that didn’t would hopefully be smart enough to run the engine every few days.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:17am
- PhilBest
  
  I think of that regularly and when I go out on essential travel I am inclined to take tortuous routes to increase the battery-charging effect of the trip. I’m still close to home and on my way to a legitimate destination.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:23am
- Inandout
  
  MT, you would have to be pretty thick not to have started your car every few days, gone to the doctor, shopped for essentials, fueled up, or merely driven the vehicle around the block. But I agree, there will be some ‘first timers’.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:25am
  - MT_Tinman
    
    Inandout, All New Zealanders are “first timers”.
    
    There will be quite a few, particularly older, law abiding by nature, New Zealanders who won’t have thought of using their car during the house arrest.
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:43am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    Plenty of grannies and oldies that havent been anywhere near a car for weeks
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:43am
    - Belinda
      
      Ha speak for yourself, I’m a granny and take my car out most days, usually just drive somewhere within a km or two, park up and go for a walk, occasionally sneak into supermarket, or even just park up in supermarket carpark and people watch to remind myself there is still life out there.
      There sure isnt much life in a retirement village.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:17am
- slightlyrighty
  
  OK, you’re clutching at straws now.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:28am
- Kabull
  
  Inexpensive chargers are available from the likes of SuperCheapAuto (who will mail your purchase). I recently got one for $95 that is enabling me to keep a trickle charge going.
  Worth the investment.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:39am
- Ipanema69
  
  In situations where a vehicle is not being run on a regular basis or is only being used for short trips it should be exercised for at least 20minutes once a week.
  
  The exercise should involve driving at speeds greater than 50kph.
  
  This is to ensure that the oil temperatire reaches its normal operating range. At this temperature the oil is able to cook off contaminants that it acquires during operation.
  
  One of the secondary functions of an oil system is to clean the engine. This function is inhibited if the oil cannot cook off contaminants.
  
  Also additionally getting the oil temp up to its normal operating range will leave the internal surfaces coated in protective lubricant.
  
  Hope that helps. Im now off to drive on the motorway for 20mins.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:45am
  - Inandout
    
    Ipan, thank God there are Kiwis who look beyond the rules and adopt a little common sense.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:58am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    The blue lights behind you on the motorway are for you!
    
    Let the engine idle while you receive your lecture and direction to the poi classes that will be the soft cock idea of what constitutes punishment in NZ.
    
    None of those $11,000.00 fines like they have over the ditch, the idling during the 20 minute lecture will help charge the battery . . .
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:05am
    - Ipanema69
      
      Hey PG, just got back from the first vehicle exercise run. Didn’t get stopped but took the dog so I could say that I was taking him to the vet. Like the advice though.
      
      About to head out in the 2nd vehicle when I can find the cat!
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:25am
      - Belinda
        
        Love it, I might have to go and look for an injured bird.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:43pm
- John Warren
  
  I have five cars all connected to $12 Aliexpress trickle chargers, a couple of which are a good five years old and still going strong.
  
  The only vehicle in use right now has a 13km run (each way) to town to the supermarket (we’ve been only once) so it’s fine. But Phil, you don’t need to go mad. If your car is reasonably modern, a short trip is fine to keep the battery charged.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:34am
- peterwn
  
  Apparently some people start their car OK, go to the supermarket and there is not enough oomph in the battery for a second start. AA has been getting quite a few of such cases.
  Battery chargers, jumper leads and other automotive stuff are ‘essential’ items and can be ordered from Repco, SuperCheap, Jaycar (chargers), etc.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:40am
  - Inandout
    
    So long as people with modern vehicles remember when changing the battery that the electronics must be bypassed and kept in a separate unit while the battery is changed over. Otherwise dear people you will have one hell of a problem sorting the strange lights that will appear on your instrument panel.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:03am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  No start means battery is poked or alternator diode pack leaking. My cars start. Shit, my boat even starts and it has not been started since before Christmas
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:46am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Alternators charge at idle, it was the old DC generator’s cars that needed to be driven to charge up the battery.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:08am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yes alternators do charge at idle, even with a faulty diode pack. Alternators put out 2 phase alternating current, so there are 6 diodes to rectify this and convert to 12V DC. If 1 diode is faulty the battery 12V goes out through that diode and discharges the battery. There’s some basic motor mechanics for you.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:24am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Typo. That should read 3 phase
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:25am
    - peterwn
      
      It is three phase output (same as in electricity transmission and distribution networks). Hence 6 diodes.
      
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      April 10, 2020 2:05pm
      - peterwn
        
        moderator – please delete previous message – Steve beat me to it and unfortunately I did not notice.
        
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        April 10, 2020 2:15pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Don’t worry – it was my typo – my fault
        
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        April 10, 2020 3:49pm
  - trout
    
    The onset of autumn and colder temperatures regularly sorts out the aged and infirm batteries; a bit like covid19 really.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:28am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Yes it does. For those with automatics, replace the battery at the first sign. Unless it is calcium – they usually die instantly
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:07am
- Fletch
  
  I tried starting mine yesterday and it worked OK.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:40am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  Just disconnect the battery terminals. Problem solved.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:10pm
  - NoCash
    
    Never do that on a modern car (say post 2000), as that would cause all sort of issues with the computers. Potentially requiring a visit to the dealer to fix.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:02pm
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      That makes no sense at all. In that case, how do you change the battery? The computer has no idea the battery is disconnected, when the battery IS disconnected, because it doesn’t know anything without the battery’s power.
      
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      April 10, 2020 1:28pm
      - NoCash
        
        Nowadays when changing a battery, a second battery is connected to enable uninterrupted power supply to the computers before disconnecting the main battery.
        
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        April 10, 2020 4:04pm
- NoCash
  
  Yup, I posted the same a couple of weeks ago, urging people to run their car idle during the lockdown 🙂
  
  Anyway, when you run the engine idle for 10 to 20 mins each week, make sure you turn on the headlights, this will put the charging system to work more effectively.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:41pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    No need. Alternators have a ‘tickler’ to sense when to charge and when not. Headlights on means one thing – use more petrol/diesel
    
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    April 10, 2020 2:55pm
    - NoCash
      
      The advice was given to me by Skoda and VW, they each sent me an email about how to keep the battery charged when the car is not in use for a long time during the lockdown.
      
      The idea is that when the electrical system is under load, the idle speed would increase and hence the voltage of the alternator produces. The higher voltage enables more effective charging. Obviously there’s a limit in regards to how much the increased idle speed and voltage would be cancelled out by the consumption of an electrical accessory, for example running the A/C would not help charging, but it seems having the headlights on is beneficial, so that you can reduce the time running the engine idle.
      
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      April 10, 2020 4:15pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        At 68 I must be old school, and not up to date with 2020 stuff.
        I know this shit, but hey VW fucked with testing? Didn’t they?
        So reading in between the lines you mean that headlights on means the alternator is under load and outputs more????
        Why the fuck do you have to confuse it with a copy and paste????
        Fucks sake man.
        
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        April 10, 2020 5:27pm
mikenmildagain

Happy Siblings Day, brothers and sisters.
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April 10, 2020 8:04am
- Harriet
  
  Your not my bro milky.
  
  Maybe your the sister of someone here though. 😎
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:20am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Harriet,
    I must repeat myself.
    If you know the difference between your and you’re you know your shit.
    If you don’t know the difference between your and you’re you know you’re shit.
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:59am
    - Harriet
      
      Yeah yeah TN — I got it wrong — but I usually make sure I get it right.
      Anyway, thanks for taking the time to read my comment. 😎
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:50am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Chur bro
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:52am
- Lee C
  
  Happy siblings day to yo too Milky.
  You know teh difference between incest and necrophilia?
  
  On is dead boring, while the other is only relatively boring…
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:06am
Humble Capitalist

If only the cricket season was still going. As a seam bowler I would have had a field day on an Ardern directed underprepared pitch.
Would have brought back memories of my 10 wicket bag on a Maidstone Park minefield back in the day
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April 10, 2020 8:05am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Ever play on the infamous Hutt Rec pitch that humbled the mighty West Indies?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:17am
  - MCos
    
    I went to a game out there during the rebel Packer days. They weren’t allowed to use the Basin.
    Big crowd.
    Both teams scored low scores.
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:27am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      There is a good story told by Jeremy Coney about Grant Cedarwall getting a bag of wickets there. Cedarwall attributed it to trying different grips he had seen illustrated in a children’s guide to cricket, but it really was just a terrible wicket.
      
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      April 10, 2020 8:48am
      - Humble Capitalist
        
        The secret on Maidstone and Hutt back in the day was mix plenty of cross seamers in. They were the wicket taking deliveries. Terrible cricket but great for the bowling stats and to get the selectors attention
        
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        April 10, 2020 10:39am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    Certainly have Mike. I have friends that were in that team that shocked the Windies. A very good friend that passed away a couple of years back one of his career highlights was straight driving a young Malcolm Marshall to the boundary and drop kicking Joel Garner over square leg.
    A mate’s Dad told me he had a beer with ‘Big Bird’ Garner in the Bellevue across the road and he was a great guy
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:40am
  - Colville
    
    I was at that game. Was it very late 70’s?
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:43am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      1979-80
      
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      April 10, 2020 2:43pm
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    When I was playing in England I came up against the West Indian Collis King that was a world cup hero and played in that Hutt rec game. He was a great player, a character and great guy. When ‘Kingdom’ used to come to the wicket he would take guard and with a big toothy smile would say ‘bowler! I’m ready!’
    Then the Carribean swagger and flamboyance would flow.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:08am
- Biscuit
  
  Ah good ol’ Maidstone Park.
  
  Loved, back in the day, charging up my TAB phone account, making sure my tranny radio and cellphone were fully ‘operational’, grabbing a takeaway lunch and sitting on one of the benches dotted around MP for a nice, quiet arvo of watching lower grade Cricket.
  
  No longer, grrr…
  
  The Upper Hutt City Council ripped up the grass, installed plasticised Hockey and Rugby-cum-Football pitches and consigned Cricket to Trentham Memorial Park, 10 km or so away…
  
  Grrr, eh?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:36am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    I know – I was hoping to see the old ground when I visited last month for my son’s football but its covered by carpet.
    Its a real shame but it probably gets used more now and Trentham Memorial is a lovely ground
    Your Saturday afternoons sounded rather heavenly…
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:46am
  - GoVege
    
    Not just that, Biscuit!
    They ruined the beautiful Hutt River to put in a motorway.
    It used to have beautiful little waterfalls I have fond memories of as a child.
    (I was a bit scared to go to Maidstone Park, though, after my big sis told me there were “bodgies” hanging out there! 🙂 )
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:53am
    - Biscuit
      
      I quite often – but not lately, dunno why! – ‘do’ the River Road Trail walk, Go Vege.
      
      Only ‘waterfall’ you see now is that weir just south of the Silversteam Railway Bridge.
      
      Unless you count the occasional bits where – gasp – the still waters ripple as they descend 2 or 3 inches in a short space of time.
      
      I’ve been to Iguazú – now that IS a waterfall!
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtCBSx7TX_M
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:59am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      ‘Bodgies’, haven’t heard that word in 50+ years.
      
      Anyone unfamiliar with the word fancy a crack at it?
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:11am
      - Komata
        
        Paulua@1011
        
        And don’t forget their female equivalents!!
        
        (Now THAT will cionfuse the younger readers…)
        
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        April 10, 2020 11:21am
      - lifesgood
        
        And widgies.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:07pm
  - pdm
    
    Brother in law played Senior Club Cricket for Upper Hutt early to mid 70’s – he played one Plunket Shield game for Wellington. Left Arm opening bowler.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:06am
- Prince
  
  So you were that bowler. There was no way I nicked that – you guys scammed at least 3 wickets that day.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:41am
  - john
    
    LOL I still have a burning memory of being nicked out in a grudge match having in my mind been
    nowhere near the pill. The things that stay with us.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:58am
    - Biscuit
      
      Prince and John, I feels ya sporting pain…
      
      Literally, in my case:
      
      Way way back in in 1967-68 at Boarding School in Singapore (my Dad was an Army man based in KL 200 km north) I was playing Hockey for my House.
      The ball came off one of our guys’ sticks and went over the goal-line.
      So, a Long Corner, right?
      I picked up the ball and rolled it to the corner in question.
      The jumped-up, officious prat of an umpire we had that day promptly sent me off for ‘throwing a tanty’.
      And the so-and-so-with-unwed-parents reported me to our Housemaster.
      Who then applied a couple of cane stripes to my innocent (innocent, I tells thee!) butt…
      
      Sniff, eh?
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:24am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    35 all out and lost by an innings inside a day hardly a scam Prince haha
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:45am
Yvette

Phil Twyford usually kills dead any task by multiple press releases until they start contradicting themselves and like the rest of Labour he deluges us in “group referrals, committees, information and proposals” but little action.
So now that we seem to have three proposals for transport between Auckland Airport and the CBD, has anyone pointed out to Twyford that, with Covid-19 in making tourism more or less (particularly ‘more’) obsolete, we will not need any such project in the foreseeable future?
Perhaps the saving there of billions can go towards the bill Robertson has just racked up.
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April 10, 2020 8:05am
- mikenmildagain
  
  You think tourism is ‘obsolete’?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:18am
  - slightlyrighty
    
    In the short term, international tourism is a dead duck.
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:30am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Yeah, but that’s not what obsolete means.
      
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      April 10, 2020 8:49am
    - kowtow
      
      Dead duck or braised bat ?
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:23am
    - peterwn
      
      There would be quite a few people who need to take their deferred trips in the next year or they will lose their money. Airlines are not refunding, only allowing passengers to take trips later, even if the booked flight does not happen. Consumer NZ is griping about this.It would be nice if they could spin it out to 15 to 24 months.
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:45am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        I have had report of travel agents ignoring the contract and insisting on vouchers for future travel when tickets were purchased on the basis of a full refund if the journey was cancelled. Even worse the flights were cancelled by the airlines.
        Some jawboning worked.
        
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        April 10, 2020 10:57am
  - hullkiwi
    
    MMA, it is going back to the future. It will be the level of tourism we knew in the 1960s-1970s.
    
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    April 10, 2020 4:09pm
    - Brian Marshall
      
      I believe the TV advertisement was “don’t leave town till you’ve seen the country”. Well in the early 1980’s it was.
      
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      April 10, 2020 6:02pm
- PhilBest
  
  What proportion of tourists went from the airport to Auckland CBD anyway, and if it was significant, what would the point be in sustaining it other than as a form of economic rent to the benefit of CBD property owners? News flash: there are hotels all over the Auckland urban area. Why should they suffer from CBD-located competitors gaining an advantage courtesy of taxpayers money allocated by “unintentional crony” politicians?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:21am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Indeed, travel to foreign countries, infect the locals. A winning strategy.
  
  I see tourism flatlining for the next decade, and the hedonistic mass tourism may never come back – we used to joke about the locals hating tourists – but now they really do!
  
  For more evidence, look at how the locals are treating people with holiday homes in their towns – total pariahs. This is going to crash the bach market too 🙂
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:49am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Well with Dominion Road dead or dying, maybe it’s the perfect time to start building a railway line.
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12324021
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:55am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Railway: underground and coal fired. Alternatively, bring back pony trams.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:59am
- DeepBlue
  
  Phil has three options because he can’t decide on the brief: is it tourism, urban infill, speed. A very confused project.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:22am
  - Evadne
    
    And urban infill and intensive housing are de rigueur at the moment, as evidenced by NewYork, northern Italy, Wuhan et al.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:19am
Benedict Yu

I found these quotes from the climate commission pretty arrogant. They say that it is “unhelpful” that the price of oil has collapsed because it will discourage renewables.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/120945102/coronavirus-curveball-for-climate-change-commission

These guys are scheduled to recommend the first set of measures to allow a path to Zero Carbon in February 2021. So you have the prospect of a series of emissions regulations and taxes being imposed just as the recovery from this mess is beginning. If we are lucky.

Seriously the Government should amend their legislation to pause all of this for three years. That won’t happen of course but it would be a popular election promise if National adopted it.

In current circumstances, the fact that this work is in progress will make most voters more than unhappy. It will make them angry.
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April 10, 2020 8:06am
- Inandout
  
  BY. A reality check for the Zero guys: NZ is almost broke and the government needs urgent sources of income. The climate change loons can play videos of traffic-less highways and boarded up retail shops and practice circular wanking at the thought of Stone Age atmospheric conditions. The world will return to a commercial situation and of course a much leaner beast, without the extreme excesses we have witnessed of late.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:41am
  - Nickc2
    
    In setting the scene to bring us out of this enforced lockdown, the Government should consider:
    
    There are no successful and prosperous employees without successful and prosperous employers,
    
    No NZ Government has ever been a successful or prosperous employer and
    
    Alternate power sources can not exist without taxpayer funded subsidies.
    
    Do you think Cindy will take note? Of course not, it wasn’t written by Karl Marx.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:52am
    - alloytoo
      
      They should also consider that no one will want to get on a bus or train for the forseeable future.
      
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      April 10, 2020 12:14pm
      - Nickc2
        
        That includes the drivers and guards etc. But a massive pay increase may sort their problem out for a month or two.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:48pm
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    Yip. These situations tend to displace the ludicrous ideologies of people who live in such comfortable and plentiful circumstances that they have nothing better to occupy their time. Then, reality rears its head again, and real issues once again take priority.
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:15pm
- Kabull
  
  I’m waiting to see what happens to average global temperature levels with the [small] drop in CO2 levels resulting from the reduction in ’emissions’.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:42am
  - Spam
    
    Or more likely, the significant drop in smog and aerosols from aircraft.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:47am
  - Ian Hawthorn
    
    I’m waiting to see if CO2 levels drop at all. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Moana Loa CO2 measurements keep marching steadily upwards. Wouldn’t that put the fox among the chickens.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:10am
  - Nickc2
    
    If there is no change, you won’t hear about it from our MSM.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:54am
  - Ruawai
    
    Yes it will be a good test on their climate theories.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:08pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Cheap abundant energy is causative of increased health, better education, more leisure, increased trade, more social services and general human welfare.
  
  Anyone complaining about low energy costs is at best a complete and utter moron, at worst a eugenicist.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:46am
  - Ruahine
    
    The next ’emergency’ to be declared if Labour and the Greens get back into Gov’t this September will be before the 2022 election and the excuse will be the beloved so-called climate change. Gee Look. New Zealand is running out of water.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/120924000/auckland-drought-easter-rain-could-be-critical-to-mandatory-water-restriction-call
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:41am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  You lost me at “seriously”. Seriously, this clown show will see this as an opportunity not a problem.
  
  So a few thousand businesses go broke. You can’t save Gaia without sacrifices Comrade!
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:50am
- mstewart
  
  They could mothball the whole commission…
  Put the multi million dollar savings towards the Robertson Black Hole
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:58am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  It will cost each one of us $$$ (over 3,300)/year.
  
  In the meantime… the Country has an economy to recover, depts to repay, and folks desperate for employment.
  The country has been caught on the hop with regards to our real and present emergency.
  
  Wouldn’t it be best to shore up our current infrastructure and wait until 2030 to see how China is managing its emissions?
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:07am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Yes exactly. For at least the next two years climate change will be off the radar of all voters who rely on the real economy for their living. These guys giving interviews now saying that the pandemic is ‘messing with our climate modelling’ is sociopathic behaviour.
    
    National will probably drop the ball on this but hopefully David Seymour will be on the case.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:21am
  - JackRabbit
    
    The government has bigger things they should be worried about. Like their own poor performance during Covid-19. If they were a transparent government, that they keep preaching about from their pulpit, they would conduct an self audit. They would conclude from that audit, that they are unfit to govern.
    
    The country was expected to obey the Covid-19 lock down levels but the government didn’t. Under the governments own rules, when we went into Alert Level 2, the first item on the list was “Entry Border Measures Maximised”. There is nothing greater than maximum, yet the government did not maximise border entry measures until this week. This introduced new infection. This is an epic fail.
    
    Allowing thousands in, and handing them a pamphlet about Covid-19 is not Maximum Border Control.
    
    Neither is asking “Do you have Covid-19”. If the government was unable to test for Covid-19 how could the average public?
    
    Q: “Do you have Covid-19?”
    A: “No. I just spent $2,500,000 at the airport gift shop on an Electron Microscope. While waiting for my flight, I took a sample of my blood and inspected it at 85,000 magnification and there was no evidence of Covid-19. Would you like the screen shot?”
    
    Yeah Right.
    
    How can you trust a government that wants to control and regulate when it cannot follow its own rules?
    
    How can you trust a government that creates a problem by not following its own rules, and then puts in place a draconian solution because of what the “people” have not done?
    
    We could have remained at Level2 if those in power actually act like they give a damn.
    
    The sad thing is that they know not what they do. They are mostly unaware of their own incompetence, unaware of the damage they cause, unaware of their own unawareness. Unaware that they are not clever, and not just incompetent.
    
    They believe they are acting to right the world, because the general public are too stupid to be trusted. They have not figured out that the world does not need them. If it were not for interfering socialist busy bodies in the first place, the world would be a better place.
    
    Socialists and totalitarians rushing to fix the problems that socialists and totalitarians have created. “Putting out fire with gasoline.”
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:19am
    - krazykiwi
      
      A top comment
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:25am
    - Ian Boag
      
      Yawn.
      
      There ae a couple of relevant expressions in the avation world related to sticky situations. If takeoff is looking dodgy then all that runway behind you is of no use. If there is an obstacle to clear where it looks dodgy, then all that sky above you is no use.
      
      We are at where we are at. It is what it is.
      
      Looking back to how it might have been done differently may be satisfying to some, but the problems to be handled are all about what is in front of us ….. Many KBers seem fixated on the recent past …
      
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      April 10, 2020 5:01pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        If we don’t learn from the past, we are doomed to repeat it.
        
        Hope for the future is all very well, but it is patterns that endure. Awareness of patterns is important.
        
        If those in control have no self awareness, they will continue to follow the same patterns and make the same mistakes that we have to live through.
        
        Highlighting mistakes is not being stuck in the past; it is learning from the past, so that it does not repeat.
        
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        April 10, 2020 7:36pm
- Fletch
  
  Hosking was going on about a new windmill farm in Taranaki (I think it was?) and how it will supply enough energy for half the country. I just don’t buy it. What happens if the wind doesn’t blow? Wind energy can’t be stored. Other countries have gone down this route (eg, Germany) and found that it couldn’t be done without massive govt subsidies and gone back to coal. Turbines only have a lifetime of 20 years and then must be renewed.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:17am
  - Greg Ettridge
    
    20 years life span and they take 50 years to pay for themselves, great investment strategy.
    Don’t have to be very bright to work out who pays the difference.
    Hint it is not the owners of the wind farnms.
    
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    April 10, 2020 2:45pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      Exactly. Every wind turbine in New Zealand will be decommissioned years before it has generated electricity to the value of the equipment + maintenance. Corporate virtue signaling with the bill quietly passed to the consumer, and the taxpayer.
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:31pm
- hullkiwi
  
  Don’t worry Benedict, Auckland Council and Auckland Transport have already been signing contracts (CityLink and Waiheke Island) to start filling our streets with new electric buses. The only problem is public transport patronage has fallen off the cliff in the last two months and it is questionable if it will recover.
  
  this is because of:
  1. a depression coming;
  2. Chinese and other foreign students are not going to be coming back; and
  3. many businesses are starting to question the wisdom of having large office blocks in cities versus having staff working from home.
  
  End result, ideas about transport systems are going to need rethinking. There is just one problem, like Twitford’s LRT scheme/scam, there is substantial political capital (and money) invested in many projects/schemes that are going to be white elephants in the future – including CRL, Downtown Ferry terminal redevelopment, strangling Auckland’s CBD (Quay Street and Victoria Street) etc.
  
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  April 10, 2020 4:23pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Interesting hullkiwi. I hope you get the upticks you deserve.
    
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    April 10, 2020 4:40pm
krazykiwi

All about the bats behind Covid-19, Pangolins and wet markets
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April 10, 2020 8:08am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Your link seems to be broken.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:20am
- PhilBest
  
  Is it an intentional joke that the embedded link takes one back to this very page in a new tab?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:25am
- krazykiwi
  
  Sorry. Hyperlinks are not easy from the iPhone. Try this: http://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/bats-behind-the-pandemic/
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:48am
hookerphil

“A mountain biker in Australia has been fined over $1,000 for driving his bike to a park to go for a ride. The police officer who issued the fine said that the man had violated coronavirus safety restrictions.”
As The Age reports, “Mr Riordan was fined $1652 for ‘unnecessary travel’. The infringement notice stated it was owing to ‘travelling from Bonbeach to Red Hill to bike ride’, despite exercise being one of four permitted reasons to leave home in Victoria.”

It was later cancelled, it is not known if he apologised profusely to the Prime Minister and was ripped apart on a morning TV show and indeed whether he had also driven his family to the beach,
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April 10, 2020 8:08am
- PhilBest
  
  Mark Steyn on his show has a segment each time introduced by raunchy music which fades as the announcer’s voice says “and now – Mark Steyn gives us…. Brit Copper Wanker of the Day”…..
  
  Two days ago it was a wanker cop issuing a fine to a shop owner who had chalk-marked the pavement outside at 2 metre intervals for the customers lined up outside. That’s “graffiti”!
  
  But Steyn’s last show he diverted to a Commonwealth Copper Wanker instead. Some friends of a woman in isolation in Montreal with longstanding medical needs, who was unusually suffering under the restrictions, pulled up outside her house in their cars, wound down their windows and sang her “happy birthday” on her birthday. The wanker cop in this case turned up a few minutes later after everyone had gone and slapped the lonely and suffering woman with a $1500 fine for an “illegal gathering”.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:32am
  - GoVege
    
    I don’t believe it!
    He’s worse than a wanker….
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:44am
  - Liberty
    
    NZ the police are just as deplorable.
    Set up a roadblock in Murchison and with glee informed the peasants.
    That a number of Caravan and Motorhomes had been forced to return to Christchurch.
    Now I am no fan of Caravans. As all Caravans should be crushed for failing to pull over.
    Now why wasn’t a blockade set up at Amberley. It is pretty obvious to all concerned. At Easter weekend a caravan pointing north during a lockdown is out of their bubble.
    Instead of the freedom runners driving for hundreds of kilometers.
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:28pm
- calendar girl
  
  Who would have thought, before now, that a family (‘bubble’), living in its own home in Auckland, would be considered to be breaking the law by getting into the family car and driving directly to Rotorua to spend Easter weekend locked down in its own bach?
  
  Our politicians, of course, are not all locked down in Wellington, in their bubbles, for the holiday weekend.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:39am
  - burt
    
    Comrade, all animals are equal but some are more equal than others.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:43am
  - marcw
    
    The only MP’s in Wellington during the week are:
    Wellington region MP’s
    Essential MP’s working in Parliament
    
    Most other MP’s are working from their homes (if you watch the Epidemic SC on Parliament TV you would know this).
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:19am
- burt
  
  The guy must have shown the police he was a NZ Labour Party member and therefore unable to be prosecuted.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:42am
JibberJabber

Thomas Sowell

The left takes its vision seriously — more seriously than it takes the rights of other people. They want to be our shepherds. But that requires us to be sheep.
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April 10, 2020 8:09am
- mikenmildagain
  
  WAKE UP SHEEEEPLE!!!!!!!
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:19am
fernglas

I’m guessing that the demographic on this blog is one that is most at risk from the virus, ie, male and over 60. Could I conduct a straw poll amongst those who fit that bill and ask those who would prefer the lockdown to be lifted and to take their chances with the virus to give me an uptick and those who prefer the status quo to give me a downtick? It just seems that no-one has ever really asked us. Uptick to lift the lockdown, downtick to keep it.
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April 10, 2020 8:10am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I can’t answer that question unless I know what you would replace it with. I would have preferred a regime that sealed the borders and aggressively isolated everyone over 70 and people with certain health conditions.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:25am
- krazykiwi
  
  No one has asked you? My dear fellow, you might expect that in a functioning democracy. The problem is New Zealand is a Kleptocracy with trainer wheels.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:29am
- PhilBest
  
  Genuine experts around the world are asking the question: what is the effect on “all causes” mortality of the elderly, of them not being able to see family and friends; not being able to go to the club, Housie, group walks etc; not being able to get fresh air and sunshine; and generally being forced to “lose” what they cannot now “use”.
  
  I think a lot of elderly get this and resent that they are assumed to be too stupid to look after themselves, to the extent that the whole of society and the economy must be sacrificed “for their salvation”.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:37am
  - GoVege
    
    Don’t forget not getting their magazines in the mail!
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:55am
  - Evadne
    
    As I recently read from an older commentator: “In their race to save our lives they have stripped all our joy in living.”
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:23am
- Yvette
  
  Fernglas, you only present two options.
  A third of course would have been to exercise last nights border entry restrictions weeks ago.
  
  The first Health website mention of the number of tests done seems to be March 8, with only 1000 being reached either March 17, or 18 (no details given either date, but a 1000 tests suddenly processed March 20). The vast majority of those tests were confined to only the who had travelled or had direct contact with people who had travelled.
  
  Absolutely obviously overseas travel was the source of the virus, with little to nothing done about border inspection or security. “Go early go hard” is just a sloganised effort to thwart that fact.
  
  So your choices should have been –
  1) take your chances
  2) lockdown OR
  3) to have placed very much greater restrictions on our border back late February.
  
  But it now history, only remaining to be mis-spun for Election purposes and international adoration (Ardernation)
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:10am
  - JackRabbit
    
    “A third of course would have been to exercise last nights border entry restrictions weeks ago.”
    
    According to the lock down levels we were supposed to be at Maximum border entry control at Level2. Government locked down all the peasants to Level 4, while leaving the gates open.
    
    Would you trust this government to protect you during a Zombie apocalypse?
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:28am
  - fernglas
    
    Do people in New Zealand really think the virus could have been kept out? Has the PM thought through the consequences of her desire to keep the country closed down until a vaccine is found? Do we still subscribe to the notion that ours is a country where we can simply pull up the drawbridge and wait until things go away? Wake up.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:35am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      This is in planning. Why are the on-line school facilities been promoted? 17,000 new chromebooks or such like being distributed. Hipkins speaks like he knows a lot more of the desired socialist paradise awaiting.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:07am
      - JackRabbit
        
        “17,000 new chromebooks”
        Vote buying.
        
        $300 per vote, using public money. Wasted money. Those that need them probably already vote Labour. Green voters kids won’t need them. Chromebooks use power and power will be banned under a luddite nation.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:22pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        @Bunny
        
        Do you know what a Chromebook is? A relatively dumb laptop that pretty much only knows how to connect to the Net. Cannot be hacked and does not get viruses – a pretty much bulletproof way to get connectivity.
        
        Can be locked into the school and lock works pretty well. So not much point trying to on-sell it. I know hecause I bought some on EBay and got one that was locked. I am pretty computer literate, but in the end I binned it.
        
        Have you ever spent time in a classroom watching kids using them? The school where I did this was decile 1 and largely brown. I was pretty impressed. Your mileage may vary ….
        
        Probably more lke $200 if you buy that many.
        
        Total – change out of $4m. Peanuts in the scheme of things – the pension costs a bit over $1m/hour …
        
        Find something else to whinge about.
        
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        April 10, 2020 5:21pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @Bogus
        
        I am well aware of what a chromebook is, and yes anything can be hacked, including browsers.
        I am far more than pretty computer literate. I work, design and secure technology.
        
        $300 is still a realistic figure, adding in couriers fees and extra support to get it working.
        
        But you are deflecting. It is still vote buying.
        
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        April 10, 2020 7:43pm
    - Ian Hawthorn
      
      Why do you think we couldn’t simply pull up the drawbridge. We do have an unusually effective moat.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:15am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Indeed. And using that moat would return us to the [relative] stone age.
        
        Perfect for kleptomaniac leaders. We’d all become oppressed, begging daily for their merciful largesse.
        
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        April 10, 2020 11:30am
      - Ian Hawthorn
        
        I think you are being paranoid and extreme. It would hurt to be sure – to lose all that tourism. But other industries would go on just fine. Nobody is talking about stopping exchange of goods across borders.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:14pm
Humble Capitalist

As we are being told all over the place that we have the best leader in the world for dealing with the COVID crisis – if Ardern was leader of Italy what do you think she would have done differently there to prevent thousands of deaths?
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April 10, 2020 8:23am
- slightlyrighty
  
  There are economic and cultural factors behind the spread in Italy.
  
  Firstly, In order to keep costs down in the Fashion Industry, but keep the ‘Made in Italy’ label, thousands of workers flew on a regular basis from China to Italy. In 2010, there were 60000 Chinese workers living in Florence.
  
  The fact that this virus exploded after Chinese New Year is also relevant.
  
  Secondly, this virus has a higher mortality among the elderly, and Italy has an average age in its population of 45.7 (New Zealand’s is 37.3). Also there is a cultural trend of inter-generational living in Italy, with many generations living under one roof.
  
  If your country had an older population, living inter-generationally, with a high proportion of imported Chinese labour, it would be hard to think of a worse case scenario to have a disease like Covid-19 in your community.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:43am
  - fernglas
    
    Apart from the older population, that is New Zealand to a T.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:37am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Further, the population density is much higher around Milan than in the South.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:09am
- MCos
  
  She’s not the leader of Italy so it’s a moot point.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:45am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Not my leader either
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:17am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    Thanks for providing some thoughts on my parallel universe question Mcos. And here was me thinking I was basking in Sorrento but Im in Wellington sunshine
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:06am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Sorrento Bay?
      
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      April 10, 2020 2:48pm
- mstewart
  
  She would have looked exaggerated grim… twisted her head weirdly from side to side… and talked down humiliatingly to them like they were kindergarten 4 year olds.
  And guess what… they would’ve had a lot more deaths.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:06am
- Raphael
  
  Considering the Italians did a “hug-an-Asian” in response to the first cases (I think as a protest against Trump banning arrivals from China which the world condemned as racist and unnecessary at the time)
  
  I think our Glorious Leader would have been out there hugging as many people as possible, which would make it worse than it is.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:10am
  - DeepBlue
    
    We were so close to having our own hug an international visitor on 15 March. Thank you to whoever got under Ardern’s skin on that one. Dr Bloomfield?
    
    BTW it is amazing there was not a mass outbreak following WOMAD. I don’t understand it, other than to assume the virus was just not in the community then, given how contagious the Bluff wedding proved to be.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:30am
  - emmess
    
    ‘Hug a Chinese’ was a propaganda effort run by the CCP. Useful idiot mayors promoted it.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:31am
  - PhilBest
    
    I reckon Raphael is spot on. In a different time and place, Jacinda would have been increasing our vulnerability by virtue-signalling about Trump’s “xenophpobia”. In fact her slackness on our borders is probably largely based on that underlying belief system.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:15am
- Nickc2
  
  Best leader in the world? Pigs arse she is. She is nothing but a stupid self centred Sheila with a bent towards Marxism reading scripts written for her by others and pulling choregraphed twisted faces.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:11am
  - JackRabbit
    
    “…pulling choregraphed twisted faces.”
    
    They aren’t choreographed. It’s what she does to stop involuntary smirking and laughing because she her wet dream is coming to fruition.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:37am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      The smirking and laughing are a feature of childhood.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:11am
      - JackRabbit
        
        So she is a Child Hood then?
        
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        April 10, 2020 11:14am
    - Nickc2
      
      Ha Ha thanks Jack, I hadn’t thought of that yet? I will keep it in mind.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:38am
- stewmar
  
  As we are being told all over the place that we have the best leader in the world for dealing with the COVID crisis –
  
  In her own dreams
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:15am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Her dreams… …Our nightmare.
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:24pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  She would have been a gibbering wreck in a matter of days.
  
  There would have been a hundred baby stories and pictures a day instead of just a few.
  
  And just as many people would have died.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:27am
  - fernglas
    
    She is lucky to be the PM of an island nation with months of lead time. But will she be so widely admired when it turns cold and this virus rips through those suburbs where there is overcrowding, poor nutrition, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, smoking etc.?
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:33am
    - PhilBest
      
      I half agree with you – but months of lead time? Do we not get international arrivals from China at least at the same rate, proportionally speaking, as virtually everyone else does? Given the knowledge now that COVID-19 is asymptomatic or mild in everyone except a small minority, including among the elderly, it is perfectly plausible that it was just “flu, other” to GP’s here from around mid January onwards.
      
      The fact that we have 1200+ confirmed infections and no more than 14 people hospitalized, suggests that we have lucky advantages – you’re right that it is not our flu season, and also we might have the world’s luckiest seasonal environment right now.
      
      https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/pdf/10.1146/annurev-virology-012420-022445
      
      I also think we are lucky that there is a high level of insularity among our various communities – the people you refer to, crowded, smokers, etc – at least the most vulnerable elderly – are not living in Cuba St or Queen St, and not generally co-mingling with the globetrotting set, the vibrant downtowners, or the tourists, new immigrants or business people from COVID epicentres.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:24am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      If you kept up with things other than slagging the PM off everyday you would have read that it’s been known since February that smokers are displaying a lung resistance to Covid 19, and are reported deaths for smokers are very low. A poster put the published papers links up here 2 days ago.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:26am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Do you have a link?
        
        Maybe Covid-19 looks at the lungs and thinks “This poor twerp is stuffed anyway, I won’t waste my energy on him. Besides everything is so coated in tar, I don’t know where to begin”.
        
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        April 10, 2020 10:40am
      - JackRabbit
        
        That is fake news.
        
        https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7083240/
        
        http://www.tobaccoinduceddiseases.org/COVID-19-and-smoking-A-systematic-review-of-the-evidence,119324,0,2.html
        
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        April 10, 2020 11:19am
      - Brian McDonald
        
        Wednesday’s GD.
        It’s not comment on the benefits or not of smoking, just factual.
        It makes a lot of sense to me. Covid 19 is airborne, so something airborne that can attack Covid in the lungs or throat is going straight at the threat.
        I’m sure the papers have resulted in such thought and hopefully experiments. I’d been wondering for weeks if hemp had been tried against Covid, before reading about tobacco – either product could be filtered of tar and vaped or added to an oxygen supply.
        It wouldn’t be surprising if something common protected against or attacked Covid.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:09pm
      - Brian McDonald
        
        Here are the links, for a fuller explanation go to GD Wednesday Poster RdM:
        
        The poster was RdM on 8/4/20
        
        https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/all.14238
        
        https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2002032
        
        https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext
        
        https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanres/article/PIIS2213-2600(20)30079-5/fulltext
        
        https://www.qeios.com/read/article/554
        
        https://antithrlies.com/2020/04/04/can-smoking-protect-you-against-covid-19/
        
        Here is one of the abstracts:
        Abstract
        The study presents an analysis of the current smoking prevalence among hospitalized patients with COVID-19 in China, compared to the population smoking prevalence in China (52.1% in males and 2.7% in females). Through a systematic research of the literature (PubMed) we identified 7 studies examining the clinical characteristics of a total of 2352 hospitalized COVID-19 patients that presented data on the smoking status. The expected number of smokers was calculated using the formula Expected smokers = (males x 0.521) + (females x 0.027). An unusually low prevalence of current smoking was observed among hospitalized COVID-19 patients (8.7%, 95%CI: 7.6-9.9%) compared to the expected prevalence based on smoking prevalence in China (30.3%, 95%CI: 28.4-32.1%; z-statistic: 22.80, P < 0.0001). This preliminary analysis does not support the argument that current smoking is a risk factor for hospitalization for COVID-19, and might even suggest a protective role.
        _
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:33pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @Brian McDonald 12:09
        
        Smoking tobacco, weed, and vaping all impact the Cilia, slowing or completely stopping the Cilia beating. Long term abuse kill off the Cilia. The Cilia are small hairs that beat 1200 times a minutes, and in conjunction with mucus, transport debris and captured viruses, bacteria and viruses out of the lungs.
        
        Smoking tobacco or Marijuana, or vaping, can be compared to shooting your own troops in a war.
        
        https://www.msdmanuals.com/en-nz/home/lung-and-airway-disorders/biology-of-the-lungs-and-airways/defense-mechanisms-of-the-respiratory-system
        
        “It wouldn’t be surprising if something common protected against or attacked Covid.”
        
        Yes, clean air, exercise, healthy eating, stop smoking, all leading to healthy immune system.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:46pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @Brian McDonald 12:33
        
        It appears that you are a smoker and/or work for a company involved in the smoking or vaping industry, and trying to find proof that to justify your actions.
        
        This is all contrary to basic understanding of the how the lungs work. None of the data you have presented has clarified smokers not being at risk.
        
        From the US National Center for Biotechnology Information link I provided earlier related to the Chinese Covid-19 outbreak:
        
        “However, from their published data we can calculate that the smokers were 1.4 times more likely (RR=1.4, 95% CI: 0.98–2.00) to have severe symptoms of COVID-19 and approximately 2.4 times more likely to be admitted to an ICU, need mechanical ventilation or die compared to non-smokers (RR=2.4, 95% CI: 1.43–4.04).”
        
        2.4 more times likely to be admitted to ICU or die.
        That pretty much sums it up.
        
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        April 10, 2020 1:06pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @afternoon mod
        Bump
        
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        April 10, 2020 2:35pm
      - Brian McDonald
        
        You’ve lost the plot Jack Rabbit. I’m not advocating smoking. Those papers show the low incidence of fatalities in smokers. Why don’t take your foot out of your mouth and read them?
        
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        April 10, 2020 7:41pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @Brian McDonald
        
        Insults are irrational. Ideas are rational.
        
        I would say the 2.4 times increased risk based on the recorded deaths says it all. Very rational.
        
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        April 10, 2020 7:46pm
- Prince
  
  Idaly please. Do keep up.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:44am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    Thanks Prince for correcting my inabilidee to spell correctly
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:53am
- rightoverlabour
  
  Yes, but she’d only be a PM for about 3 months…. And Italian female MPs tend to be easier on the eye…
  
  https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GCEV_enNZ849NZ849&ei=D7OPXqCdHuWY4-EP9o2XwA8&q=beautiful+italian+female+politicians&oq=beautiful+italian+female+politicians&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzICCAA6BAgAEEc6BggAEAcQHjoGCAAQDRAeSgoIFxIGMTItMTQ0SggIGBIEMTItN1DbN1jyRWCRUWgAcAJ4AIAB9QGIAdYKkgEFMC40LjOYAQCgAQGqAQdnd3Mtd2l6&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwjg4PzvwtzoAhVlzDgGHfbGBfgQ4dUDCAw&uact=5
  
  Hope the link works..
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:44am
Chuck Bird

fernglas, It is not a simple yes or no. To go back to how things were on April 22 would be mad. However, it is important to get businesses that can operate safely back to work asap.
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April 10, 2020 8:26am
- hookerphil
  
  We can choose how we continue to operate, the risks involved – would we go to a crowded place, whether we wear a mask, join friends with a similar risk etc etc. Use our own judgement and own our own risks. Yes, I would do that.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:35am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    You’ll never ‘own’ your own risks. You’d spread your virus if you got it, lead to a cluster putting a resource under pressure and slow down the programme.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:31am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Top marks Chuck, you got it.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:31am
Jacinda's Prisoner #3999999

I am 60.

I’ve survived malaria.

And a nasty variety of illnesses and even a STD!

What scares the shit out of me is the lies from the world media and opportunist politicians.

And the fire-sale of New Zealand assets – at all levels from small business upwards – to Chinese interests.

BTW do you remember the ‘Foreign Control of Aotearoa’ folk? And our armies of human ‘rights’ lawyers from Waikato University?

Where the hell are they now???

A Wuhu sniffle? Not very much!
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April 10, 2020 8:27am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Exactly what the wise in Aussie are worried about.
  Looks like the same things that happened there have happened here. https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120927408/new-zealanders-caught-short-after-masks-sent-to-china
  
  And the NSW Labor Party were hailing the CCP as masterful geniuses in handling China’s crisis…
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:46am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    100s of people in NZ are making masks. A local manufacturer has lifted the production of quality masks from some 400,000 a month to over a million.
    On the other hand, Washington has run out of masks and don’t have swabs to go with their test kits. I believe NZ has access to some local supplies for both and forwarded orders from overseas.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:36am
G152

Eostre was a goddess of spring or renewal and that’s why her feast is attached to the vernal equinox,
So the ‘new’ religion had to take over established festivals and rename them to look kosher
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April 10, 2020 8:28am
- PhilBest
  
  I think you meant this to go on the earlier thread?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:38am
- rangitoto
  
  The word Easter is a quirk specific to some Germanic languages. I suspect it is just a regional folk term that stuck. I don’t think there was any conspiracy. Check out the word for Easter in French, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Greek etc.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:17am
Humble Capitalist

We have overtaken Victoria Australia in coronavirus cases. Victoria has a larger population and has done more testing. Despite considerably fewer cases per capita they have 12 deaths compared to our 1. Dodged a bullet NZ and Ardern.
Was letting the Ruby Princess disembark in Wgtn on March 14th (when I saw at the time that this was very risky at best or lunacy at worst) and up and down our East Coast good management or good luck considering that boat is now linked to more than 600 cases and 15 dead in Australia. Good luck or good management NZ?
Not to mention my friends from Italy and UK not having to self isolate around this date as well. Along with 100’s of other international flights. Good luck or good management NZ?
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April 10, 2020 8:29am
- PhilBest
  
  The difference in deaths will be due to environmenal factors, in which we are obviously uniquely lucky.
  
  https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/pdf/10.1146/annurev-virology-012420-022445
  
  I wish the experts actually knew what experts should know. NZ is obviously uniquely lucky to the extent that of all nations around the world, we are the one that should have stayed as close to “open for business” as possible.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:42am
  - JackRabbit
    
    No, that would not be in keeping with Mz Arderns agenda.
    
    “China has a problem with plastic bags, but NZ does not, but its the thought that counts, so lets ban plastic bags here. And the kindy kids back me up on that.”
    
    “China is overcrowded, severe pollution, and multiple families living under one roof. Covid-19 is many times as likely to propagate in China compared to NZ, and the mortality rate will be much higher than in NZ because of pollution and insanitary conditions. But its the thought that counts so lets lock down NZ as a show of solidarity.”
    
    The air quality in China is so bad, China and Japan and other countries were wearing masks decades ago.
    
    https://airlief.com/2018/04/23/why-do-chinese-wear-masks/
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:32am
- PhilBest
  
  I should also have pointed out that Aussie is also lucky in that it is not flu season, and has a much lower death rate than in the northern hemisphere because of this, in spite of not being draconian about containment. But NZ has even greater advantages that should have been recognised and capitalised on by now. Every day of Level 4 being perpetuated is another bullet in our own foot from our own gun.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:03am
- Peter S
  
  I wonder how much is due to our lack of high density housing and crowded public transport systems.
  
  Maybe a good argument against the push for their introduction.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:25am
  - artemisia
    
    I blame toxic reusable bags.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:20am
  - PhilBest
    
    Absolutely! Most crucial is that our elderly have not yet been forced by our planners, to abandon their empty-nest suburban homes and go into apartment blocks in which a full cross-section of society is also living, like the elderly in Northern Italy. Even the rest homes are generally surrounded by fields or native bush.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:27am
- Brian McDonald
  
  The protocol was to determine from the Captain the safety of the landing in view of the virus. He said things were safe. He is now, along with others being investigated for possible criminal offending in Australia.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:39am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    But still possibly a mistake on NZ’s part in the current circumstances. That landing resulted in a cluster on the East Coast.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:41am
    - JackRabbit
      
      But no-one died. So no harm, no foul.
      
      On the other hand NZ lax laws on letting in immigrants that have never held a productive job, and who do not contribute to society, has resulted in a cluster in Wellington, of socialist idiots in the Green party. That on the other hand is wrecking NZ. Definitely a mistake.
      
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      April 10, 2020 1:29pm
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
According to HDPA, internal polling shows Labour on 49%, National 35%, both Greens and NZ First at 5%…. This is exactly in line with my predictions. Bye bye National.
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April 10, 2020 8:34am
- PhilBest
  
  The sheeple deserve what they’re gonna get if they are truly this stupid.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:39am
  - Harriet
    
    In the very late 90’s there were large amounts of young female kiwis with worthless art degrees. There was great concern these women wouldn’t ever find work in NZ. The business community was even out saying so. Anyway Hulun won the next election. The worthless women were never heard of again. Then just before Key got elected National announced that the Clarke government had increased the public service by 47% in just 9yrs. The population never doubled.
    
    The current government have committed themselves to billions of dollars in spending. The economy is shut down. Tourism will take at least 2yrs to return to normal, with added debt. Households will not be spending also.
    
    Hence the talk of a Ministry Of Works…..it’s all about the immediate future……..mass unemployment including restless young males……… and the expansion of government. There will also be a whole of government approach to ‘re-build the economy’, ending in even more government expansion into the market place.
    
    As if that is the answer and the direction for NZ.
    
    If a prosecutor can’t win this election for himself, National and the NZ public —- in this real time of need —– then it’s time for National to pull up the stumps and fuck off into oblivion. 😎
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:41am
    - artemisia
      
      National may not be averse to staying on the sidelines as a new government stumbles and bumbles through austerity measures, business failures and a Green coalition partner.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:17am
    - DeepBlue
      
      I doubt anyone in National are putting their hand up to take over from Simon before the next election, even at 35%.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:18am
    - PhilBest
      
      National’s “Vichy” role to the progressive Left since 2008 is little different to oblivion.
      
      Our De Gaulle is probably David Seymour or Don Brash. Lonely and marginalized. The great majority are collaborators, something conveniently forgotten in France after 1945.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:30am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      You raise the indirect point about graduates. Graduates will be in deep trouble now with job competition they will find it a struggle to compete against an experienced – but shrunken workforce. Saying that, who knows what new opportunities will open as NZers get their hats on to deal with a changed economy and social environment.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:45am
- Inandout
  
  Sir CS, given your prediction then I say we all become beneficiaries, because the socialist nirvana that is Scandanavia taxes thus:
  ‘Top personal income tax rates are rather high in Scandinavian countries, except in Norway. Denmark’s top statutory personal income tax rate is 55.9 percent, Norway’s is 38.4 percent, and Sweden’s is 57.1 percent.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:49am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Quite possibly. On the other hand, this might be a good election for National to lose, given how horrific economic conditions are going to be for the next few years.
  
  “Lives matter more than mere money” is easy and popular to say in the short term, particularly when it’s not your money, but the consequences of economic ruination are pervasive and long lasting, and people will be feeling the continuing blight of that long after they get over any relief at having avoided what was always a fairly small chance of death.
  
  Labour in power after the election would not be able to blame National for ongoing hardship and their economic ineptitude would be harshly exposed. National in government would need to do horribly painful and unpopular things while Labour in opposition would claim that it wasn’t their fault and they could fix it easily and painlessly. They’d then win the next election just as National’s economic competence begins to pay off.
  
  With a view to the longer term, then, National might consider ducking this one.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:58am
  - Ruahine
    
    If one believes that we will continue to have General Elections every three years without some bogus Emergency being called to prevent that occurring then National would be prudent in not wanting to get all the blame for mess caused by the CoL in wanting to emulate Pol Pots Year Zero. They have made the mess. Let them clean it up. I am sure even Ardern has seen how it is so easy to break down your Lego into a pile of nothing compared to creating something, like Kiwibuild maybe.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:28am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  I reckon I could poll 49% if I had a daily half hour national TV electioneering advertisement.
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:59am
  - alloytoo
    
    Are you sure it’s not having the reverse her whining about not having done what everyone says should have been done, just before she actually does it is very irritating.
    
    Plus of course the absence of magazine covers….
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:32pm
  - JackRabbit
    
    Mr Ed and his talking horse could poll at 49% if they had a daily half hour national TV electioneering advertisement.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:36pm
- kevn
  
  @SCS… Sir Bob at No punches Pulled, is to comment on this Monday. Should be a good read.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:02am
- mandk
  
  UMR polling?
  Just like the polling that Andrew Little quoted when he was Labour leader.
  You know, the polling that had him on 40 percent plus.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:11am
- 3-coil
  
  SCS: Every cloud…goodbye (from govt) to NZworst too!
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:19am
- Nickc2
  
  What else would you expect from internal polling?
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:20am
- gorse
  
  Their last “leaked” internal poll had them at similar levels until real polls were done, then the situation was reversed. Wouldn’t mind betting it is no where near as bad as this.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:29am
- GazzaW
  
  The result of a UMR internal poll I believe. I think I’ll await the Colmar Brunton poll result for a touch of reality.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:38am
  - Tricati
    
    Correct – Labour internal polling will be geared to make them & supporters feel good; and for HDPA to present it as ‘fact’ is disingenuous to thinking people who know these labour polls don’t stack up against external ones.
    Just another MSM tool to make the PTPM look good at this time.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:25am
- DeepBlue
  
  She got a huge boost after 15 March 2019. Given wall to wall presidential style campaigning for a month and 88% approval rating of her decisions I’m surprised it is not higher.
  
  Based on these figures it will be certain she will go to the polls on 19 September, but that is still 5 months of the dark, cold, reality of winter, following this 4 week summer camp we have just had.
  
  Who and how this is going to be paid for still has to be explained to the masses.
  
  The figures add weight to why Simon and Winston have been talking about delaying the election.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:40am
  - peterwn
    
    Simon in particular is fully entitled to raise the issue of whether the election should be delayed. There is really an overwhelming case for it to be delayed until November (the latest date under the Electoral Act) and that should definitely happen.
    The usual campaign period must be allowed and must be unhindered so the campaign cannot start until things are back to ‘level 1’.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:01am
    - DeepBlue
      
      Need 75% to change date. This just won’t happen. The May budget is going to set the recovery tone for Labour.
      
      What could National re-strategize towards?. Only really three messages: which alternate major projects to do, what the new tax rates will be, how the new beneficiaries can find meaning in their life on $250 or so per week by working for the dole.
      
      None of the above is very appealing.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:26am
      - peterwn
        
        Jacinda can change date to November without 75%.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:13pm
      - DeepBlue
        
        @Peterwn. Thanks. I didn’t know that once the date had been set it could be changed. I don’t mind a November election.
        
        The more we see the new economic reality the fewer rose tinted glasses around.
        
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        April 10, 2020 1:44pm
- peterwn
  
  Let them believe their own BS.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:51am
- kloyd0306
  
  Are you willing to bet that these numbers hold until the election?
  If you are so sure, my $10 to your $50.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:59am
- Tony Stuart
  
  You lost me at “internal polling”. Labour’s internal polling has been proved over and over again to be completely unreliable.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:02am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    I read a link that had Colmar Brunton, I think it was, showing around 90% approval for the Government handling of other crisis. Didn’t copy at the time, but that could indicated a boost for Labour.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:51am
    - James Stephenson
      
      What other result would you expect when nobody but the Princess gets any coverage, and the coverage she gets is 100% saying how wonderful her leadership is?
      
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      April 10, 2020 2:59pm
  - calendar girl
    
    Surely you don’t suggest “massaged”, Tony? By our Labour Party?
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:10am
- Stephen Russell
  
  Previous reporting re Labour’s internal polling has shown considerable divergence from other polls. I would not place too much reliance on it.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:26am
- KevO'Brien
  
  How are you going to fix the resulting damage if that occurs. Be careful what you wish for. We have already had a taste of amateur govt under Winston’s proxy.
  The FM is a joke–was he the model for Gilbert’s Pooh Bah?
  The PM is a mag cover hunter. (Now she’s out of cover).
  Oh dear, never mind, Venezeuala awaits.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:22am
- Ruawai
  
  It would be a good time to conduct a landline poll as most people are home and have time to reply to a survey of questions.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:28am
  - peterwn
    
    You must be kidding. NZ used to have one of the highest landline uptakes in the world, even if many people were on party lines or had eggbeater phones. Landline penetration would now be reducing and will probably go into freefall. One big mistake the phone directory company made was not seeing this coming so there are more and more people not in the phone book.
    Therefore polling companies need to adapt and their methodology would be a trade secret.
    Relying merely on landlines perhaps augmented by mobile numbers supplied by the client is just plain daft.
    
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    April 10, 2020 5:20pm
artemisia

Is it true that Mr Tamihere instructed his Waipareira Trust staff to lie in order to be tested for Covid-19?

And that he, the Waitemata DHB and the Ministry of Health have all declined to comment?

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2020/04/09/how-the-treaty-and-indigenous-rights-are-being-brought-into-the-response-to-covid-19/#more-5861
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April 10, 2020 8:35am
- Inandout
  
  arte, keeping us in the dark is an art form among the left. Just don’t answer any questions and what the hell can you do about it?
  
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  April 10, 2020 8:52am
- KH
  
  Lets be clear. The government will try money at maori agencies to avoid the same old accusations.
  The agencies and staff will have a good time.
  Maori people will get nothing.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:14am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  This story appeared briefly on RNZa couple of days ago, but there doesn’t seem to have been any media follow-up.
  
  It seems very doubtful that the named doctor is lying.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:17am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Two Maori doctors have quit their job at the Covid-19 clinic because they wouldn’t accede to Tamihere’s demands.
    https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/doctors-accuse-john-tamihere-telling-staff-lie-coronavirus-test
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:20am
    - PhilBest
      
      I’d like to have believed that John Tamihere is consistently one of the “good guys” – I’d like a bit more detail on this case. He’s not known as a progressive white ant like the Treaty Industry people etc.
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:34am
- Nickc2
  
  Reading the linked article, its interesting that it quotes only 44k test kits available in NZ. Last night on TV, the PM stated that NZ was going to test all returning NZers and put them in compulsory quarantine. She also said they were expecting 40k returning NZers.
  
  Also of interest, she has previously stated that all incoming people could not be quarantined because there was insufficient facilities. Now there is. What gives?
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:45am
  - artemisia
    
    What gives? Implausible deniability.
    
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    April 10, 2020 9:54am
  - Stephen Russell
    
    The number of returning NZers has declined. Most who were coming home have already done so. Hence quarantine is now feasible.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:28am
    - Nickc2
      
      So in the meantime, we have thousands of returned and untested people all over NZ. How stupid is that?
      
      Do the authorities know who and where these people are? Don’t think so! Do they know who they have cohabited with? Don’t think so! Do those they have cohabited with know they have a likelihood of being infected? Don’t think so!
      
      I could go on but essentially, what she’s saying is that it has been a gross mistake to admit untested and unquarantined people cross our borders. Compulsory testing of those crossing our borders only started yesterday and we have known of the threat since January? Gimme a break FFS.
      
      No wonder the supposed rest of the world think Cindy walks on water. It’s because our MSM don’t publish the truth.
      
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      April 10, 2020 12:11pm
  - DeepBlue
    
    The number of test kits have been growing each daily stand-up, so I guess alternatives have been found.
    
    Recently I heard them talk about bulk testing of 50 at once. How it was explained was samples get mixed together, if negative in bulk then no need to test individually.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:31am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    What the quality of the test kits? Reports of 20% false indications! That’s not a test.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:24am
MT_Tinman

Pre-panic, tourism contributed approximately 20% of New Zealand’s income.

How come only now the dictatorship is being pressured from within to grant freedom of movement to NZers and when NZ needs to start opening up again to tourists is a tourism-killing quarantine being proposed?
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April 10, 2020 8:39am
- Yvette
  
  MT_Tinman, as indicated above, the obvious border constraints in force from last night, if enforced late February may well have alleviated the need to the shut-down and the economic mayhem that has and will cause, and costs back then of severe border restrictions may not have been as bad as having both the public lockdown and the border constraints now.
  
  Until a vaccine is found and generally applied worldwide, having any tourism will amount to entertaining those who are willing at their cost (it will have to be transferred to user pay) to stay for two weeks isolation in a hotel under Government choice and control, then touring the country as was normal.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:28am
  - PhilBest
    
    But how good are vaccines to coronaviruses generally? Once each coronavirus has run its initial pandemic course, ending with a critical mass of herd immunity, we pretty much just live with a few people getting it each flu season. Flu jabs are tweaked a bit but the medical experts are pragmatic about what is possible.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:37am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      What’s a virus season?–until the next variant.
      If we don’t face the present onslaught what immunity will exist throughout the whole population.
      We really have no choice but to brave the risks. Pharma can prescribe everything they make and sell but not stop risk. Viruses have leaked from labs and can be leaked from labs.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:30am
    - Ian Hawthorn
      
      It has yet to be seen how good vaccines will be. It depends on how variable the coronavirus turns out to be. Influenza is unusually good at changing its clothes to hide from the immune system. Most viruses don’t manage this trick so well and a vaccine can essentially wipe them out. Smallpox is gone from the world due to a good vaccine.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:31am
    - JackRabbit
      
      You will find a significant number of Doctors that don’t take the flu jabs themselves. When asked why, the usual answers are that if people ate healthy, exercised, and practiced better hygiene, only the sick and elderly with compromised immune systems need flu jabs.
      
      The casual and random sharing of beds, joints, bottles, needles, hugs, kisses and sex among the young woke is causing viruses to mutate and propagate at rates far exceeding that of decades ago.
      
      Hence the spike in Coronavirus cases in the 20-30 age bracket. But that spike is lower than the actual rate of infection for that age group. Being younger, their immune systems handle the virus better, with few if any symptoms, do not line up for testing, instead only being silent carriers.
      
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      April 10, 2020 1:59pm
  - JackRabbit
    
    If the mortality rate (number of those who as a percentage of those who are infected) is less than or equal to the mortality rate of the flu, what does it even matter? Remember Covid-19 is a coronavirus and coronavirus is just one of the many variants of what is called the flu.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:48pm
- emmess
  
  No, exactly the opposite
  We need the quarantine to stay in place and the domestic economy to start to open ASAP.
  I heard 2/3 of tourism is domestic, when Kiwi travel overseas that is a loss to the economy so the other third can be partially replaced. We can lift the quarantine by merging it with other countries to have a common quarantine, e.g. we could have one with Australia in a month or so.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:40am
  - DeepBlue
    
    Best way to promote NZers to see their country is to make public transport cheap. Imagine how many people would explore the South Island if they could take their own cars on the ferries for free off peak or max $50. In what is really a zero cost to government.
    
    Many motels/ activities etc will be heavily discounted due go market forces.
    
    Ditto cheap rail.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:37am
  - PhilBest
    
    Tourists will probably be attracted to a country with quarantine measures, rather than one without. Its kinda like you’d rather fly on an airline that puts you through a scanner first, than one that doesn’t.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:38am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      The quarantine won’t attract them, too long. But when a suitable test system can be established at both ends of the transist NZ’s reputation will be enhanced and be seen as a safe place to visit. The same will apply to our exports being seen as from a safe country.
      
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      April 10, 2020 7:57pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    The problem with domestic tourism is that it doesn’t generate overseas funds. As Muldoon once said “you can’t make a business out of taking in your own washing”.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:43am
- Brian McDonald
  
  You’re at the wrong bus station because the other end of tourism is now about where the tourist has been. If NZ comes out safe in terms of Covid, and we have developed safe screening for incoming tourists the Country will have an advantage.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:54am
a

I posted this on David’s post about transparency, but I was a little late so not sure if anyone will see it.

There are discrepancies in the number of masks that the government claims are in the national reserve supply. The Prime Minister and Minister of Health have both said that the national reserve supply has 18 million masks, but the Ministry of Health web page on the topic, which was recently updated, says that there are only 13.5 million masks. Where did the other 4.5 million masks come from?

Also, the Minister of Health and the Director-General of Health were both repeatedly saying that the Whanganui factory was producing 200,000 masks a day. Then suddenly they changed their story and the factory was producing 80,000 masks a day. Why did production drop by 60%?

Some more details are here: https://listed.to/authors/10129/posts/13581
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April 10, 2020 8:42am
- a
  
  After listening to questions from David Seymour at the Epidemic Response Committee meeting on Tuesday, I think that the “4.5 million masks” are probably not real masks, just the raw materials required to make 4.5 million masks.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:11am
- JackRabbit
  
  “Where did the other 4.5 million masks come from?”
  
  A thank you gift from China for all the loan contracts?
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:48am
Maggie Pie

I’m praying to God that he keeps us ALL safe
and continues to fill our lives with wealth and happiness.
HAPPY GOOD FRIDAY EVERYONE!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUxH2iVWsAArhpV?format=jpg&name=small
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April 10, 2020 8:43am
JibberJabber

https://twitter.com/tomhfh/status/1248318707690070018
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April 10, 2020 8:43am
Ruahine

This why there should have been a quarantine in place at our border six weeks ago. Ardren was reported a few days ago as saying that a quarantine was not necessary because infections were caused locally. No all infections were caused by people who arrived in NZ with it and then passed it on to someone else as did the person at the Bluff wedding.
So the rest of us have had to suffer what will be for many the equivalent of Pol Pots Year Zero. Thanks Labour for this piece of pig-headed policy making.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120863226/coronavirus-bluff-wedding-cluster-now-the-largest-in-new-zealand
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April 10, 2020 8:55am
- Ruahine
  
  In case some readers missed the salient point of the previous post.
  
  “Director-general of health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said the Bluff cluster was linked to international travel.”
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:00am
  - kevn
    
    @Ruahine… JA has cost NZ dearly with the half baked border control over the last 4-6 weeks.
    Feeling unwell upon arrival? Nah, all good mate.
    Self isolation? yeh right.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:41am
- PhilBest
  
  Buddy Earl!!! Did St Cindy really say that????
  
  “…a quarantine was not necessary because infections were caused locally…”
  
  ?!?!?!?!?!?!?
  
  Stats to date: cases of community transmission: 2
  
  1000+ tracked to known clusters started from overseas arrivals.
  
  If Simon Bridges can’t get any mileage out of this he doesn’t deserve to be PM, ever.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:41am
  - greybeard
    
    Is there any such thing as “community transmission”?
    Surely ALL instances are caused by infected overseas travellers passing it on to others , who pass it on to others, etc.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:25am
    - PhilBest
      
      In the stats, “community transmission” is really the infected that can’t be traced back that way. If COVID-19 is surviving on surfaces, for example, it is impossible to tell who left it on that seat on the bus or that EFTPOS terminal keypad.
      
      This number is significant in the countries with high death rates.
      
      The fact that NZ is so successfully tracing almost all the confirmed infections back to clusters of overseas origin, is quite remarkable proof of our lucky environmental resilience. We’ve done tens of thousands of tests but we haven’t picked up anything significant outside of the clusters.
      
      An antibodies test will be interesting one day; whether NZ has actually got a long way to herd immunity before we even started testing; or was our environment suppressing the survival of the virus itself and its transmission by air or surfaces?
      
      NZ could be “the” outlier case that proves the hypotheses in this paper:
      
      https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/pdf/10.1146/annurev-virology-012420-022445
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:55am
Southern man

Wonder what all the secrecy is behind those two new clusters. MOH refuses to release information citing privacy. Didn’t seem to be the case with all other clusters. I thought health concerns would override privacy issues. Most of our other rights seem to have been trampled over in the emergency.
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April 10, 2020 9:01am
- septic skeptic
  
  Right on point. If the was more clarity about the exact locations of these clusters we would be extra vigilant if we were close to known clusters.
  As a descriptor “Auckland” is pretty much useless. If we are going to stamp out this virus here, we can’t pussy foot about with the niceties. Trusting arrivals, trusting those infected and respecting privacy will see our efforts unravel. We are only as strong as our weakest links in this.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:51am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Privacy is an individual right and privilege. It cannot apply to an anonymous group object. Privilege must also be subject to not harbouring harm or preventing that being discoverable.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:36am
- Souvlaki
  
  ? Princes St Branch Labour Party??
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:12pm
Gravelroad

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120927408/new-zealanders-caught-short-after-masks-sent-to-china

And the same planned, concerted effort happened in Australia (allegedly) – this outflow of medical products to China that our own people could have needed. Pillaging the health related resources of a small country like NZ is reprehensible.
Up until recently, I have been skeptical of the “Red Peril” alarmists and WHO/CCP conspiracy theorists. Now not so sure………not at all so sure.
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April 10, 2020 9:03am
- artemisia
  
  It’s called trade.
  
  China had a need and paid to fill that need. Public or private buyers in New Zealand and Australia could have bought up those stocks but didn’t.
  
  But maybe the suppliers should have left their stock in the warehouse on the offchance someone else wanted to buy one day.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:36am
- MCos
  
  We asked around some pharmacies in Onehunga a month or so ago and eventually bought, I think, ten masks for about twelve dollars. Something like that.
  A few days ago my wife was digging around in the dark recesses of the bathroom cupboard and found a box of 50 surgical/dental masks she’d bought a couple of years ago and forgotten about.
  I checked the price on the internet ~$10.
  A box of 2000 would be a little over $200 if they were in stock.
  https://www.insinc.co.nz/selfgard-gloves.html
  Nice wee markup for the pharmacist.
  
  That stuff that’s being shipped off to China will be making someone a few bob, I’m sure.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:01pm
- curry4me
  
  Gravelroad: Let’s ‘pillage’ the CCPs tax take by leaving Chinese goods on the shelf permanently. Tell the respective store managers why.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:36pm
euro2019

Just think about all this what this smarties in Wellington promised.
1 . Zero Emission by 2050 is an absolute stupid statement and always will be. FAILURE
2. Child poverty is still rising. FAILURE
3. Entering Pike Mine and 50 plus millions later not even any close, just to discover some leftover bones and please some families. Winnie said that he would walk himself in there 2018 and he still couldn’t find the mine. FAILURE
4. Affordable housing for everybody 10’000 houses to be built per year. FAILURE
5. Providing homeless a shelter. FAILURE
6. Providing housing for low income families. FAILURE
7. Plant trees by the billions. FAILURE
8. PGF providing more jobs outside the big centers. FAILURE
10. Re-establish the railway system again. FAILURE
11. City Rail Link in Auckland. FAILURE
etc. etc.
Now, this virus disaster/lockdown scenario will cost the country far more lives than it saved, this is a fact.
With the statement in the believe to eradicate this virus completely is another absurdity by these clowns believing these experts and professors which never in their entire have done a decent day’s work another than producing a pile of irrelevant models.
This will be the safest way to run this country into serious downwards spiral and ending up like Venezuela etc. plus being completely governed by lunatics with an oversized ego and power drunk.
This way we will end up to be more communistic than the country run by oncle Kim Jong.
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April 10, 2020 9:06am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  But there is one thing they excel in – FAILING.
  Almost like it is a competition to see who can spend the most
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:05am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    By their own standards they are doing exceedingly well. Venezuela only 36 months away.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:38am
KH

That jerk Hone Hawawira talks of roadblocks to keep virus carrying tourists out.
At the same the telly interviewd a series of yobs infesting the busy Kaitaia main street, none of whom had any intention of keeping anybody virus safe.
Perhaps Hone should look to “his people” instead. But that means real work.
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April 10, 2020 9:09am
- burt
  
  Hone, the brown supremacist that he is, has always blamed all the issues his special people face on white people. Take any one of his speeches and where he says Maori change that European and vice versa. Read it out loud at a public forum and you’d be arrested for hate speech. Just try it.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:53am
- Inandout
  
  KH, what goes on behind the Maori blockades is seeping out, but rest assured hunting, fishing, communal boozing and receiving are the norm there. They are living the life of Rangi, untouched by the white man’s interference and yet still get their benefits paid. Oh and we mustn’t forget Jacinda’s recent Maori lolly scramble, $50 million wasn’t it?.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:43am
Justitia

So all the face masks in our hardware stores and pharmacies were bought up and shipped to China earlier this year on orders from the CCP to its front organizations in New Zealand: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120927408/new-zealanders-caught-short-after-masks-sent-to-china? How about that? Anyone around here still think the sun shines out of Xi Xinping’s backside?
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April 10, 2020 9:12am
- PhilBest
  
  I am certainly starting to get a little bit disturbed at the attitude of some of my friendly (to date) Chinese-NZ contacts, of defensiveness re Xi and the CCP. For the record, my attitude has always been that immigrants in the west from Commie countries are some of the clearest-minded people, more so than some of our young and stupid. But I’m starting to feel uneasy about this.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:47am
  - Komata
    
    Phil1047
    
    It’s always helpful to remember that for every Chinese ‘Immigrant’ that arrives in New Zealand, there is a family back in China West can be held hostage and upon which certain things can benflicted, if The ‘Immigrant to New Zealand’ does not co-operate and tow the CCP party line. It is also helpful to recall that no one leaves China without the express permission of the CCP. If you do not conform to party dictat, you are not allowed to leave. Believe it or not, NZ is being colonized from China in a manner similar to what has happened in Africa.
    Colonization does not need guns. It can occur via other methods.. We are just too thick as amazing to see that. It was suggested many years ago that this would occur, but at the time that such suggestions were made, those who did so were laughed to scorn It’s not so silly now.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:41am
    - curry4me
      
      Komata: I wonder if some governments will revisit ‘Chinese Exclusion Acts’ after this? They were a thing in the 19th and early 20th centuries.
      
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      April 10, 2020 12:40pm
- emmess
  
  I’m shocked, shocked I tell you
  
  Not really, we know it happened in Australia, the US, Canada, Brazil and Europe.
  But is anyone genuinely surprised to hear this?
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:28am
lastmanstanding

Yesterday in a piece in NBR Grant Robertson said the Government was going to get more involved in certain sectors that were “too big to fail”.

This is code of nationalising certain industries.

Be afraid be very afraid. I see NZ going back to the Muldoon Think Big era and we know how that ended.

Big Government. Big Taxes 66% at not more than the average income then 33% for part of average income earners.

I see a new tax rate of 45/50% as per Oz kicking in at $100K to pay for the borrowing and the future borrowing to set up the new Government Departments.

This is a Socialist wet dream for Government to be at least 50% of the economy and this lot aint going to waste a once in a life time opportunity.
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April 10, 2020 9:20am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Well we can only pray that we get the right result in the election.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:28am
  - Colville
    
    yeah I want a RIGHT result at the election too!
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:21am
    - Ian Boag
      
      You will have as many votes as everyone else ….
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:51am
- krazykiwi
  
  Ironically it was a Labour government that fixed all the damage done by Muldoon. To be fair, that Labour government was further to the right than ACT is today, but still.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:29am
- kowtow
  
  Too big to fail is just another way of picking winners and losers.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:40am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    When Government picks winners, losers pick Government….
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:15am
- Harriet
  
  “….I see a new tax rate of 45/50% as per Oz kicking in…”
  
  Australian taxation on one hand can tax you highly, but on the other hand you can place some in super, up to $25k at a lower tax rate, and defer even more tax if you can, via investment activity.
  
  Anyway what I’m saying is thus, someone once told me that with tax changes being introduced it has the effect of encouraging more people to ‘re design their affairs’ -not just their tax affairs – leading to lots of ‘different’ economic activity than they would ‘otherwise be doing’. Some people get into investments while others get out, and others again increase or decrease investments.
  
  That’s not to say higher taxes are good as taxation is not just a matter of good or bad, but both. It’s a matter of getting them right. NZ doesn’t.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:14am
  - artemisia
    
    For some of those on higher incomes, time is the new money. Increase the marginal rate and different decisions are made.
    
    Increase it a lot, look at what happened with France’s wealth tax. Some seriously rich took their ball and went home. Easy these days, and there will be struggling countries only too willing to throw open welcoming arms.
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:04pm
    - Harriet
      
      NZ has a customer base of just 4 million or so. Your neighbour Australia is a market place 6 times larger. The NSW economy 15yrs ago was 5 times larger than NZ’s — I don’t know what it is now.
      NZ is also a long way from international trading customers – where fuel is one of the biggest costs.
      
      To say NZ is a country ‘open to attract capital’ is being a little loose with the truth, as most large foreign businesses look as Australia as a market with NZ essentially part of that market. And they don’t look at NZ as an international producer of anything – other than what you grow.
      There is no one seriously rich in NZ either — ok a handful of people seriously rich in the eyes of kiwis. Irrelevant.
      
      Raise your tax free threshold to $40k or so and reduce all the ‘vote for a living’ crap — WFF, childcare rebates…..
      
      It would be better again to give people the choice for life — the current TFT or a higher one at say $80k — where you don’t get the unemployed, single mum, aged pension etc. payments — ever!!!!!
      
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      April 10, 2020 1:56pm
- Inandout
  
  lastman, remember the National govt PPP (public private partnership)? Key of course would never abide taking over industries because that would lead to certain failure, and with this cobble in charge, absolute disaster.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:51am
  - Harriet
    
    PPP’s are really for use in infrastructure — motorways, airports and ports etc. They are not meant for industry partnerships.
    I actually take issue with the CSIRO in aussie on this matter — since when should public money be used to make individual public servants wealthy? – it’s not like they invested capital from the outset – but only after a discovery — when it’s financially expedient to do so!!!
    
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    April 10, 2020 2:06pm
- Ian Hawthorn
  
  I don’t see some companies like Air New Zealand surviving without government help to be honest. And if the taxpayer is going to help them it is only proper that the taxpayer should get a share in the company in return. That way, when the world gets back on its feet, the government can sell the shares so that we don’t end up with a huge deficit.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:39am
- mark15
  
  Too big to fail was the message used in the UK by labour pollies who bailed out private banks.
  Fancy that
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:53am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    The term originated in 1980s USA.
    
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    April 10, 2020 4:59pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Oh wow! think of all the new career opportunities opening up for brown suited, petty-minded, officious, pen pushing, mid-level bureaucrats…
  I foresee a number of new degree courses on how to be a conscientious public servant starting at Victoria (if it’s still named that), Massey and Waikato
  
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  April 10, 2020 1:25pm
  - Nickc2
    
    You better believe it. All this in less than 3 years. Amazing what a crisis can do for a government.
    
    5 1
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    April 10, 2020 3:42pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    There are already a range of good courses available at most universities for you to pursue your interest in public policy and public management.
    
    1 1
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    April 10, 2020 4:55pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Aim high, Suze…
    Leadership is where it’s at.
    
    https://www.massey.ac.nz/massey/learning/programme-course/course.cfm?course_code=115212
    
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    April 10, 2020 8:51pm
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      Isn’t that the area that Dr Suze Wilson is in?
      If you progress far enough, you can always get to write glowing articles about our glorious leader’s leadership capabilities (provided you have the correct union pedigree and know the right people in the Labour Party).
      
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      April 10, 2020 10:28pm
Luke Piewalker

So Winston …. about that Capitalism that’s failed thing

Guessing you will be needing that Capitalism thing about now aye

Oh and how’s the SFO investigation going
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April 10, 2020 9:23am
- Nickc2
  
  Winston being the hypocrite he is said when he anointed Cindy stated that Capitalism was dead. Now, he’s asking for business to get involved in order to resolve our looming debt problem.
  This bitter and twisted fool knows no bounds. Come on SFO, bring charges ASAP.
  
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  April 10, 2020 4:35pm
Benedict Yu

Yesterday I remarked to a colleague that we are only in this mess because the Chinese seem to enjoy eating endangered species like pangolins. It seemed a perfectky reasonable observation. But my colleague was affronted.
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April 10, 2020 9:26am
- burt
  
  Your colleague is probably a Labour or Green voter who think this virus was caused by man made climate change.
  
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  April 10, 2020 9:56am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    He probably thought it was “racist”.
    
    16 2
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    April 10, 2020 10:02am
- 7kiwi11
  
  Think back to the guilt ordinary New Zealanders were supposed to feel when measles ravaged Samoa. Do you think China feels any guilt for the spread of the Wuhu flu and the collapse of the global economy? Yeah right.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:38am
krazykiwi

In response to GoVeg on another thread. What’s wrong with Amnesty International? Try this: Amnesty International: Failed Methodology, Corruption, and Anti-Israel Bias
NGO Monitor from NGO Monitor.
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April 10, 2020 9:28am
- mikenmildagain
  
  NGO Monitor is not a credible source, really, as its only interest is defending Israel against any criticism.
  
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  April 10, 2020 4:53pm
igm

Good Lord, it is yet another year past since the Wahine went down in Wellington Harbour, 10/5/1968.
Seems those who supposedly care do not think about 51 real Kiwis who lost their lives that fateful day.
Seems UN does not recognise this tragic event as a day of virtue signalling!
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April 10, 2020 9:30am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  About two thirds of us got to school that day (Wanganui). All of the Whangaehu crowd were absent.
  My bus was a bit delayed as fallen trees were still being cleared around Totara Street (Tawhero ).
  
  There was no problem getting home and it wasn’t until we turned on the TV that we saw the drama unfolding in Wellington.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:52am
  - burt
    
    I was in Wellington that day, it was a wild storm. Funny though, back then we called it a storm rather than evidence of climate change. If we had a storm that size and that intense today we’d all be talking about the need to reduce emissions. Aren’t we the smartest species on the planet.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:08pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  You must imagine the UN would have nothing else to do if it declared a day in memory of every minor disaster.
  10/4/68, btw.
  
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  April 10, 2020 2:55pm
Benedict Yu

So this woman in Samoa, who is fine and has family there, wants the New Zealand Government to charter a plane to return home to Auckland. And RNZ and Stuff think this is news worthy.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120948171/coronavirus-auckland-mother-in-samoa-asks-government-to-help-get-her-home
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April 10, 2020 9:42am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  We can not travel, therefore she can not travel. Seems fair
  
  21 2
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  April 10, 2020 10:11am
  - igm
    
    PIs and Islamists are accorded different rules with this disgusting and vile CoL.
    
    16 2
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    April 10, 2020 11:53am
    - burt
      
      True that.
      
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      April 10, 2020 1:13pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Why would Samoa welcome an aircraft crewed from NZ?
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:42am
- JackRabbit
  
  Maybe the poor lady believes in socialist equality but doesn’t understand about socialist corruption.
  
  Knowing that Jacinda pulled off a similar stunt with a separate flight as a result of working around her baby needs, at the cost of hundreds of thousands, and knowing that all Socialists preach equality and not giving themselves “special exceptions”, the women quite rightly though she could appeal to Jacinda as a mother.
  
  I say Jacinda should shout this lady the flight, paid for out of her own pocket.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:02pm
  - burt
    
    You were doing well up to the point where you suggested a socialist should pay for something with their own money.
    
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    April 10, 2020 1:14pm
MT_Tinman

A must read from Spiked On-line.com
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April 10, 2020 9:46am
Prince

Fifty two years ago a cyclone descended on our capital city, and a ship founded in the harbour. Fifty one people lost their lives.
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April 10, 2020 9:48am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Prince – it was a collision between the remnants of a tropical cyclone from the Pacific, and a deep southerly depression pretty much right over Wellington.
  
  I can still remember the day in Palmerston North; it was a foul day, with galeforce winds and driving rain, and of course it was even worse in Wellington Harbour. Some of the stories of survival are amazing, and there was some exceptional bravery from those who went to their rescue. That the toll was kept to 51 was miraculous.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:09am
  - krazykiwi
    
    My family home looked out on the entrance to Wellington harbour. I (vaguely) recall both the ferociousness of the storm, seeing the Wahine on its side and hearing about my parents who rushed to help the survivors.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:45am
kglm

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Simon Bridges and the National Party are doing a poor job of holding the Government to account. The only politician who appears to be providing any push back on our loss of freedoms seems to be Winston Peters.

Bridges, who is supposedly leading the Parliamentary committee whose job is to hold the Government to account, has largely gone along with the Government’s dictates that restrict our freedoms of movement and association and right to work. Bridges should be demanding the the Government provides evidence backed justification for taking our freedoms. For example, how does it spread the virus if an individual or bubble travel to the beach for a walk and maintain social distance from others at all times?

Simon, your job is the prevent us from becoming a Police State – step up and do that job.
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April 10, 2020 9:58am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Peters? Peters has been completely missing in action until yesterday, when he started his election campaign.
  
  Have you been watching the proceedings of the Epidemic Response Committee kglm? The questioning of Ministers and state sector CEO’s has been detailed and rigorous.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:13am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Bridges should be demanding the the Government provides evidence backed justification for taking our freedoms.
  
  On Tuesday Simon Bridges specifically requested Ashley Bloomfield to reveal the information Crown Law had furnished him with as to the extent of his powers during the National Emergency.
  
  https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/sc/scl/epidemic-response/news-archive/watch-public-meetings-of-the-epidemic-response-committee/
  (from 2 hour point)
  
  Simon Bridges made it clear that whilst Cabinet had been given information by Crown Law about the extent of Police and MoHealth powers during the Pandemic, that information had not been passed on to the Opposition.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:21am
- septic skeptic
  
  I reckon Peters has been cowering away in self isolation for weeks. Now that the lockdown appears to be working he feels emboldened enough to come out and criticize the measures that may well have saved his own sorry ass.
  The guy is an irrelevant distraction is all of this. Roll on September when we can administer the coup de gras to NZF.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:05am
  - Tricati
    
    The Serious Fraud Office might do it first if we are luck
    
    15 2
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    April 10, 2020 11:32am
  - Alboy
    
    I think he’s been laying low until he sees which way the wind is blowing. The fact that he’s starting to go
    Against his own government would imply that’s the sentiment he’s getting from the public. The creator of the mess wants to now be the saviour.
    
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    April 10, 2020 12:10pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  I think the Committee was a bit of a trap. I’m glad Simon did accept being part of it however and chairing it. The Committee remains an important aspect of the Government being questioned and held to account.
  The downside is that the Government takes the cream of the top (as it should) and therefore the Committee doesn’t necessarily get the credit it should.
  I did think its literal cross-examination of Bloomfield was stupid. It appeared they were questioning his credibility when he has been one of the most credible performers in this Crisis.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:15am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Simon did not appoint the PM–she’s Winston’s chattel.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:44am
- Paulus
  
  Simon’s job is to Chair the Epidemic Response Committee.
  He is not Prime Minister yet !
  
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  April 10, 2020 1:51pm
Maggy Wassilieff

NZ’s elimination strategy explained

https://www.nzma.org.nz/journal-articles/new-zealands-elimination-strategy-for-the-covid-19-pandemic-and-what-is-required-to-make-it-work
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April 10, 2020 10:11am
- Brian McDonald
  
  So between the lines, where do the line will be drawn on ‘protecting’ the elderly Maggie?
  From yesterday’s briefing I was already getting the impression there was going to a longer period of lockdown for the older generation.
  I had already thought that the Marist cluster meant Auckland was going to be longer in opening up, then sort of talked myself out of it – but seems it could be back on. That’s why I totally agree with reading the figures right up to decision-making time.
  I now understand the NZ Government’s effort to shelter the islands. I worry about Fiji however because they had an infection rate that doubled 1 day this week and now they’ve been hit by a storm.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:29am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I think the able elderly should make their own decisions.
    
    I’ve got a few “elderly” neighbours…
    One has given up his taxi run as his kids were worried he could be exposed to the virus when picking up passengers from the airport or on cruise ships.
    Poor bugger had just been selected to represent NZ in the over 70s Waka Ama Champs in Hawaii last month.
    (he has qualified also for the 2022 Champs in London).
    
    Another neighbour at 77 years old is my swimming buddy… Ok, I can do 2 -3 lengths to her 1.. but she can still do a 45 min workout in the pool and go home and mow her hilly section of half an acre.
    She is going spare being confined to quarters.
    
    My back neighbour is a 80-year old retired farmer whose lungs were damaged 6 years ago when he got caught in the smoke of a fire that was lit by some idiots on Kaiti beach and which raced up the ridge to his house. He’s keeping himself safe, and his wife is doing the shopping etc.
    
    These folks can manage their own risk… no need to put a blanket ruling on them.
    
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    April 10, 2020 2:10pm
Benedict Yu

So the country was shut down based on a feeling, after the PM was phoned by some am friends in the UK?

This does not make me feel better.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120954236/inside-jacinda-arderns-coronavirus-bubble-whats-on-the-pms-mind-during-covid19-crisis

“When friends overseas painted a bleak picture of the advancing pall of coronavirus, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern listened.

“[They were] saying, ‘Go, just shut down, because here I am in lockdown with thousands of people dying. Just shut down’,” she tells Stuff’s Coronavirus NZ podcast.”
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April 10, 2020 10:12am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  So what would have happened without that phone call?
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:27am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    I guess we will never know. I would have gone for Level 3 and quarantine all the old people. Which is essentially what Sweden has done.
    
    16 3
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    April 10, 2020 10:45am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      All of the ill old people. I am 68 and run rings around guys half my age (metalworking industry)
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:11am
      - PhilBest
        
        If you look at the stats, even among the elderly, it is only a minority where COVID-19 proves lethal.
        
        It’s lethal in something like 0.01% of children, 1% of young adults, 2% of middle aged; and 5% of the elderly. For the rest it is asymptomatic or mild. I wish the experts would conclude what the reason is for the dramatic difference, because it might help us formulate a policy other than “destroy the economy”.
        
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        April 10, 2020 12:02pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        I was thinking 75+
        
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        April 10, 2020 6:04pm
      - MCos
        
        In NZ it’s 2/92 for the 70+ age and zero for any any other age.
        
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        April 10, 2020 9:13pm
- JackRabbit
  
  Not surprising as she is a feelings based person.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:31am
- MrTips
  
  I’m sure Michael Baker, David Skegg and Peter Gluckman appreciate that a friend appears to have the same influence, if not more, than they do.
  
  Un-fricken-believable
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:52am
- PhilBest
  
  All the same, surely expert advisors worth their salt would have told her that it’s not flu season in NZ, our environment is to our favour, COVID-19 is mostly asymptomatic or mild, and deaths “with” a virus are not the same as deaths “of” the virus?
  
  If they don’t know these things, what are they doing with the time paid for by taxpayer coin?
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:53am
  - rockape
    
    I wonder how NZ will do if its the only corona free country in a sea of infected countries that may be so for a year. Will we keep our borders closed? What then. We will have little herd immunity when the rest of the World will. Would NZ then just be a late starter in the high death rates?
    
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    April 10, 2020 3:08pm
    - PhilBest
      
      I am more inclined to think we’re getting our herd immunity with hardly anyone dying or even getting especially sick. It doesn’t seem credible that all our flights from China didn’t bring the virus here the same time it went everywhere else.
      
      But if you’re right that hardly anyone actually got it via the great majority of carriers, it has to be because of our environment and lower urban density giving the virus less chance of transmission. In which case we should expect a worse outbreak than what we’ve had, probably in our own flu season. Starting about now / when we come out of lockdown. We should have saved the lockdown strategy for “then”. It is virtually impossible to eradicate the virus by locking down, it will always be in someone, undetected because of remaining asymptomatic – probably in young healthy people in essential occupations. Lockdown only “flattens the curve” which means the cases “under the peak” are moved to a longer and thicker “tail”. The experts have never claimed that lockdown is to “eradicate the virus”.
      
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      April 10, 2020 4:56pm
- kowtow
  
  Would be nice if our Media party ,instead of printing puff pieces did a bit of serious reporting.
  
  Premier House bubble . Would be interested to know where a chef ( if any) , body guard , and other staff fit in , if at all.
  
  Go early go hard.
  
  We’re allowing ourselves to be fooled by slogans , possibly paid for by us , to PR spin merchants.
  
  Denmark closed its borders at mid day 14 March .
  
  When did we close ? Five days later .
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:16am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    We never did close our borders– it was all smoke and mirrors. We were told they were closed but 40,000 people have come in since then!
    
    22 2
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    April 10, 2020 11:48am
    - Harriet
      
      Aussie did exactly the same “we’ve closed the borders” and scheduled and unscheduled flights remained coming into the country for another week, without testing and fuck all else upon arrival
      
      ‘Princess Ruby’ had Border Agents telling the media long after the problem that “Biosecurity isn’t our job, it’s another agency, it’s not our job to question passengers.”
      
      Smoke and mirrors everywhere.
      
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      April 10, 2020 12:35pm
- krazykiwi
  
  So $5 Billion in economic carnage, business failures, hardship, poverty, emotional trauma … because a friend said so. Ardern is a wrecker.
  
  23 2
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  April 10, 2020 11:20am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    What is this $5 billion? I think you mean $100 billion+
    
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    April 10, 2020 6:06pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      Um, yes. Intended to say $5b per week. It’s probably more than that when the costs of trailing social devastation start to feed through
      
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      April 10, 2020 9:39pm
- John Warren
  
  Fuck me, I was going to post on this very thing. Cindy tanks the entire fucking economy and plunges an entire country into dire poverty because her friends told her to. I really hope the lockdown it was actually based on better advice than that.
  
  Absolute power combined with absolute idiocy. The woman is just a mong.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:16pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Last sentence, no second opinion called for!
    
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    April 10, 2020 4:22pm
- nickle
  
  And her parents are staying with her… when do you think they left Tokelau?
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:52pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Ross Ardern, the Administrator of Tokelau, is usually based in Auckland. (MFAT’s Auckland office)
    
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    April 10, 2020 2:27pm
    - nickle
      
      Thanks, but still weird. So PM relocated to Wellington for lockdown to do her job, her parents just tagged along for the lockdown ride did they?
      
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      April 10, 2020 3:47pm
Yvette

It would be interesting to know if there is any truth in the rumour that Police, through state of emergency law, are able to check with power companies to have customers with a home and holiday home accounts explain this weekends power usage at the latter address, and whether this would spur many from Auckland, for example, who have taken up their second residence in places like Tauranga, (where locals in Papamoa note the Easter usage of a number of homes around them, known to be Auckland owned) to piss off back home where by lockdown law they should still be, or to avoid detection spend the rest of the weekend in the dark, as the aerosols deserve to be (uncharitable as this may initially seem, this Easter weekend, but justified under being our elderly brother, and sisters’ keepers).
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April 10, 2020 10:25am
- JackRabbit
  
  Police had these powers long before Covid-19.
  
  We are living in the age of the cloud and online data. You have to assume that if it is online, it is accessible, read, scanned, and tracked.
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:52am
  - Batman
    
    You’re giving waaaay too much credit to the state here.
    
    Aside from the fact that it would breach the Privacy Act to proactively do that, that isn’t as simple as checking with neighbours and locals, as well as reports from the online system.
    
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    April 10, 2020 10:58am
    - JackRabbit
      
      Information sharing goes on a lot more than you think, much of it informal to avoid messy paperwork And it is not the state per se, but individuals within govt organisations who use their contacts. I know this from people within those organisations, including the police, that tell me how it gets done.
      
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      April 10, 2020 11:10am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Agreed. I worked for a telco where our internal council was told to look the other way when raising privacy breaches resulting of enforcement officials making informal data requests
        
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        April 10, 2020 11:49am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    That surely requires a power of search for an individual, not the blanket cover of a data fishing expedition.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:50am
    - JackRabbit
      
      Please clarify?
      
      1 1
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      April 10, 2020 2:06pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Information to support a search warrant giving the right to inquire on suspicion of a nominated crime. Otherwise Police could pick up records as they please in bulk and troll through them hoping to find a possible crime.
      
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      April 10, 2020 5:58pm
The worm that turned

Someone needs to have a wee look at the behaviour of Eden Ventures and other Chinese backed companies here. This smells bad.
They bought a pile of PPE from Amtech (an Auckland based supplier) and promptly sent it all back to China. I’m sure Amtech will be horrified, I use them for my practice surgical supplies and they have been brilliant, especially during the lockdown.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120927408/new-zealanders-caught-short-after-masks-sent-to-china
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April 10, 2020 10:26am
- kowtow
  
  The Media Party won’t take that story much further , that would be racist.
  The comment section is velly intellesting. I leckon the United Front is working overtime there.
  
  We really have become a CCP vassal.
  
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  April 10, 2020 2:32pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

https://babylonbee.com/news/biden-cuts-holes-in-medical-mask-so-he-can-still-sniff-people
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April 10, 2020 10:34am
Ruahine

The Media Party is working Overtime.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120954236/inside-jacinda-arderns-coronavirus-bubble-whats-on-the-pms-mind-during-covid19-crisis
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April 10, 2020 10:43am
- Yvette
  
  From Ruahine’s link (thank you) –
  
  When friends overseas painted a bleak picture of the advancing pall of coronavirus, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern listened.
  “[They were] saying, ‘Go, just shut down, because here I am in lockdown with thousands of people dying. Just shut down’,” she tells Stuff’s Coronavirus NZ podcast.
  It helped make the decision to “go hard and go early”, to close New Zealand’s borders and enforce a lockdown.
  
  Was it Ardern’s famous decisions by impulse – much touted post March15 – that she heeded the lockdown advise, but not so much the border closure?
  
  The general main-stream media seem to play up Ardern’s part in this entire emergency. (Like, where is Winston – in his Northland holiday home?)
  With so much predominance in all of this, and no mention of the vast PR team she has in her department, if this yet goes sideways, tits up custard, how much blame will Ardern take since so many of the decisions being made are attributed to her?
  
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  April 10, 2020 10:53am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    “Go hard and go early” is 2020’s “nine years of neglect”; a Labour Party slogan, unsupported by actions.
    
    A more appropriate and accurate description might be that we went “firm, and only after what we did had been suggested by the Opposition”.
    
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    April 10, 2020 11:09am
Papalazarou

The Liar in Chief who previously said self isolation for new arrivals was working very well despite the fact the police weren’t checking and we didn’t need to quarantine , now tells us they were planning to quarantine all along! Her reason being that the 40,000 people who arrived after the lockdown were too much to cope with. Heather du Plessis-Allan pointed out it was 6600 and we have 140,000 hotel rooms across the country. Cindy just ignored this correction. https://www.iheart.com/podcast/211-heather-du-plessis-allan-24837940/episode/jacinda-ardern-defends-delay-in-quarantining-60983965/?
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April 10, 2020 10:56am
- MrTips
  
  She’s just in the zone isn’t she? Knows she won’t be challenged enough to worry. House on sand though….
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:06am
Lee C

Can we get Seymour to lead National?

Asking for a friend.
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April 10, 2020 11:08am
- The worm that turned
  
  What they said x1000.
  
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  April 10, 2020 11:18am
Maggie Pie

A friend of my partner lives in Queenstown. He txt to say he saw a guy shopping in New World yesterday taking Covid19 concerns really seriously – he was wearing a full-face rubber Gimp mask. LOL!!!

My partner wondered if Peter Thiel might be in town?
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April 10, 2020 11:09am
- PhilBest
  
  Lord Christopher Monckton (remember him?) rather delightfully wears a full-face motorcycle helmet as his protection.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:04pm
- gump
  
  Peter Thiel sold his place in Queenstown years ago and bought a big parcel of land in Wanaka.
  
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  April 10, 2020 12:30pm
- JackRabbit
  
  “He txt to say he saw a guy shopping in New World yesterday taking Covid19 concerns really seriously ”
  
  Or some woke left wing party stalwart after a sordid night of house “arrest”.
  
  2 2
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  April 10, 2020 2:28pm
Chuck Bird

I wonder how reliable the UMR online poll is. I bet Labour encouraged member to take part.

It would be nowhere as reliable as Colmar Brunton
20 2
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April 10, 2020 11:13am
- emmess
  
  It is obviously BS
  There is no way that the Greens have stayed stable and NZ First has risen. Green Party voters especially are the most susceptible to the ‘Jacinda has saved the country’ propaganda’
  I expect that National has taken a small temporary hit but nowhere near that big.
  
  10 1
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  April 10, 2020 11:50am
- bruceavon
  
  Well there is little value in a party having a poll that is biased towards them. Ask David. or see how Hillary Clinton felt towards the polls that told her she would win by miles. those polls did as much to lose the election for her as anything else. she didn’t bother campaigning in key states and lazy liberals didn’t bother voting because they thought she had it won. UMR picked 37 for Labour before the last election which was bang on and 40 for National which was low by 4. But Curia was off a bit too. 49 L 43 N. The most accurate was the Reid Research one. I have little doubt Labour are miles ahead now. And I don’t see any value as a National supporter trying to pretend it isn’t so and trying to deny this poll leak is a lie. Let’s wait for a real poll but the numbers are bound to be awful.
  
  5 2
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  April 10, 2020 1:56pm
- JackRabbit
  
  Polling results always mirror the demographic you survey, and the questions you ask. Results can be used to shape public opinion.
  
  6 2
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  April 10, 2020 2:30pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

I just realised something. No ads, not here, not on FB.
No ads on Good Friday I know
8 1
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April 10, 2020 11:52am
The Police

‘Ello, ‘Ello, ‘Ello..

I’m getting LOTS of your names for President Ardhern’s Re-education camp on the Chathams.
18 1
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April 10, 2020 11:54am
The Police

Maggie Pie
Chuck Bird
Steve (No longer on the North Shore)
Yvette
…
11 1
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April 10, 2020 11:55am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Thankyou, thankyou very much. Anything to get out of my house
  
  9 2
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  April 10, 2020 12:10pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    If Mike is a Warden, I’m not going
    
    10 2
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    April 10, 2020 12:11pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      You prefer Batman?
      
      6 0
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      April 10, 2020 2:30pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Batman has manners.
        But I will still throw a tantrum
        
        3 2
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        April 10, 2020 2:57pm
Fletch

A wee dollop of honesty from the usually very liberal New York Times. It seems that, yes, Cuomo and de Blasio were quite blasé about the whole virus situation and mismanaged the whole thing, only implementing measures days after other states.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/08/nyregion/new-york-coronavirus-response-delays.html
9 2
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April 10, 2020 11:56am
- PhilBest
  
  For a conservative analysis that does not mince words, see:
  
  http://sultanknish.blogspot.com/2020/04/identity-politics-lied-new-yorkers-died.html
  
  It’s not just the politicians, it’s the public health authorities head people there…!
  
  9 2
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  April 10, 2020 12:06pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXkxxnK4zdU
From NPC University.
2 2
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April 10, 2020 12:02pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xe37Y5dAUs
Feds start the presses to stimulate the economy. They should print masks, not money. Thanks CCP, and WHO. Businesses are closing, and the stock market has fallen. The credit market has dried up. Nobody wants to lend.
8 2
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April 10, 2020 12:03pm
- PhilBest
  
  Mark Steyn suggests that eventually the USA will solve its Rust-Belt unemployment problems by setting up money printing factories in the empty car plants and steel mills….
  
  3 2
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  April 10, 2020 4:58pm
curry4me

One of President Trumps latest campaign ads.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/04/09/trump-coronavirus-campaign-ad-features-joe-biden-cheerleading-for-china/
7 2
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April 10, 2020 12:04pm
niggly

Chuck: UMR have been seen as a bit of a joke over the years (eg generally speaking having Labour in the mid-high 40’s, National in the low-mid-high 30’s, support partners NZF & Greens always, always, always above the 5% threshold somewhere!

The only people that take UMR “seriously” are the likes of Heather + Bazza, Hooten and Slater (when it suits their narrative at the time)!

Oh and the Labour Party!! I mean, seriously, how could one survive as a Labour pollster, always giving them bad news over the years – to survive you’d have to really, really, really talk them up (with such talent as Clark, Twyford, and the rest of the front bench)!
13 3
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April 10, 2020 12:04pm
Martin Williams

Coronavirus: Taxpayers’ Union gives up ‘ideological purity’, accepts $60,000 in taxpayer wage subsidies

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/04/coronavirus-taxpayers-union-gives-up-ideological-purity-accepts-60-000-in-taxpayer-wage-subsidies.html

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!
8 23
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April 10, 2020 12:06pm
- Wired-one
  
  So hilarious, saving peoples jobs and livelihoods. You really are a moron.
  
  12 2
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  April 10, 2020 1:28pm
- The Police
  
  That is fine. Only stupid people turn down free money.
  
  The ONLY problem is if it changes their voting pattern.
  
  12 2
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  April 10, 2020 1:44pm
Ruahine

Interesting that there has not been a single reported COVID-19 infection from any of the much maligned but very popular fast food outlets such as KFC Maccas Subway etc, etc. I am sure we would have heard about it. Well Done all of them.
6 1
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April 10, 2020 12:15pm
oldfella

So where did this virus come from? Wuhan’s wet markets, or is the answer more sinister? This doco raises some interesting points. https://www.theepochtimes.com/coronavirusfilm?utm_source=Epoch_Times&utm_medium=Banner
9 1
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April 10, 2020 12:27pm
- andydownhere
  
  That was a very interesting doco which the whole world should watch. Thanks oldfella
  
  1 0
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  April 10, 2020 9:06pm
gump

I see the Taxpayers’ Union doesn’t believe in its own talking points. It reminds me of how Ayn Rand lived off Government social welfare payments for the last years of her life.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/04/coronavirus-taxpayers-union-gives-up-ideological-purity-accepts-60-000-in-taxpayer-wage-subsidies.html
5 9
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April 10, 2020 12:28pm
- Harriet
  
  “After brief deliberation, the Taxpayers’ Union board determined the welfare of our employees to be a more pressing immediate concern than ideological purity.”
  
  And that is the sole statement — except for crap calling on senior public servants to take a pay cut.
  
  To me the TU is a crap outfit, just like John Key they are lazy and pick and choose what their ideology applies to — rather than applying it to everything.
  
  $1 of unjustified spending is $1 of unjustified spending — and budgets alone aren’t the sole justification of money to be spent either.
  
  In some cases public money shouldn’t be involved in an issue at all —- childcare rebates is a prime example with WFF another —– but the TU says nothing.
  
  It’s pathetic – it’s just the National party and their asshole mates framing the economy for their own benefit.
  
  Bludging dishonest fucks. 😎
  
  8 15
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  April 10, 2020 12:53pm
  - barnacle bill
    
    As long as there is socialism for the rich, and rugged individualism for the rest of us, all will be well with the Taxpayers Union, Harriet.
    
    4 6
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    April 10, 2020 1:42pm
- Martin Williams
  
  Jordan Williams, the government waste pig, says:
  
  After brief deliberation, the Taxpayers’ Union board determined the welfare of our employees to be a more pressing immediate concern than ideological purity.
  
  Why don’t you do both, Porky? You could treat the wage subsidy like a loan, and PAY IT BACK!
  
  7 22
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  April 10, 2020 12:56pm
  - Swifty
    
    Agreed, not of their making but still not a good look, and they should pay it back at the earliest opportunity.
    
    5 4
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    April 10, 2020 1:56pm
  - Harriet
    
    Yep — just like I said — lazy and dishonest!
    
    Or as I once said — most useless fucken union for it’s members in the country. Scam. 😎
    
    2 9
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    April 10, 2020 2:53pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Although it’s not really a union, is it?
      
      4 4
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      April 10, 2020 4:42pm
PhilBest

Cop-car sirens going nuts around here for the last few hours, again. They must do blitzes on a particular neighborhood at a time, looking for lockdown-scofflaw drivers
7 2
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April 10, 2020 12:31pm
- PhilBest
  
  Papieren, bitte?
  
  9 2
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  April 10, 2020 12:31pm
Lee C

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5wn1qs_bBk&fbclid=IwAR0JGkLSsy0vfM0DfO5lUoXHuONb6O5dfVhxSoFvnzR5T0Vx6Ma_AF2Ci78
4 1
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April 10, 2020 12:45pm
- mara
  
  Lee C a very relevant and interesting clip. Thanks.
  
  1 0
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  April 10, 2020 8:27pm
curry4me

Thanks for the quick approval today, Mods.
6 1
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April 10, 2020 12:50pm
Poppa

I have now come to the conclusion that if this is what retirement is like I am not doing it…end of
9 1
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April 10, 2020 1:11pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120957413/coronavirus-more-international-praise-for-new-zealands-response-to-covid19

How to handle CV-19 like New Zealand.
1. Make your landlocked, overpopulated country into a remote underpopulated island somewhere on the edge of the world.
2. That’s it.
14 2
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April 10, 2020 1:29pm
- cmm
  
  3. Make sure it isn’t flu season.
  
  6 2
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  April 10, 2020 4:25pm
Critical Thinker

NZ on day 16 of the dystopian lockdown:
23 new confirmed cases of the China Coronavirus.
16 currently in hospital. 4 of them are in ICU.
2 died with the China Coronavirus. (Elderly women, that already had underlying health conditions).

It’s unarguably time to downgrade this lockdown to level 3, and properly secure our borders. As this extreme level 4 lockdown is currently proving to be more devastating to our lives than the virus.
16 2
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April 10, 2020 1:33pm
2ic

Two days ago I posted that Australia seemed to be doing as well as New Zealand in suppressing COVID-19 – and without the damage to their economy that the complete lockdown here is doing.

And almost on cue, just to make sure the public doesn’t start to question that we are leading the world in our response, the NZ Herald has to dig up someone to contest this:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12324069
11 1
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April 10, 2020 2:06pm
- Stu2
  
  They are doing better than us on cases (on a popn basis) but not deaths.
  
  If we had elderly kiwis on the Ruby Princess for longer then we would have been worse than two now.
  
  8 1
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  April 10, 2020 3:37pm
Prince

What a strange country we now live in.
Last year our Prime Minister was lauded for crossing boundaries and adopting Muslim dress, customs and lingo to connect with a section of our society.
This year, in the midst of an upheaval the likes of which NZ has not seen before, one of our oldest Christian festivals passes with the only reference being something about the easter bunny and chocolate eggs.
If she can don Muslim garb to reach out to that portion of society, why can’t she show some respect to our most influential belief, one that is built on the ‘Be Kind’ tenet that she has turned into a personal advertising jingle.
26 3
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April 10, 2020 2:46pm
- Poppa
  
  I would conclude that she is not a christian but could be muslim?
  
  11 2
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  April 10, 2020 3:43pm
  - cmm
    
    Pagan. Easter bunny is a pagan tradition celebrating what bunnies do best.
    
    8 0
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    April 10, 2020 3:54pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      No coincidence that the pagan traditions are the ones that remain most popular.
      
      3 10
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      April 10, 2020 4:36pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  I’m really not sure about this. Not caring one whit for religious babble myself, I’m not aware that we expect Easter messages form our political leaders. Anyone recall other PMs marking Christian festivals in any other way than generic holiday wishes and exhortations to drive safely?
  
  4 11
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  April 10, 2020 4:40pm
  - Prince
    
    But given she has taken away Christian’s traditional meetings this weekend (for good reason we hope), shouldn’t she have at least acknowledge their situation, rather than blather on to kids about the easter bunny.
    
    1 1
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    April 10, 2020 8:03pm
    - Batman
      
      No because it’s a private thing.
      
      I’m sure plenty of the Christians here on KB would get their knickers in a twist about her hijacking a sacred week if she gave them a verbal hug about it.
      
      1 0
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      April 10, 2020 10:29pm
alloytoo

Here is some food for thought.

https://mybroadband.co.za/news/government/347223-massive-salary-cuts-for-president-and-ministers-due-to-coronavirus.html

Should perhaps extend to mayors and Councillors.

I know of some CEO’s taking 50% cuts.
8 1
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April 10, 2020 3:41pm
Pheobe

Why is Justice Select Committee looking to defer other two bills on sexual voilence and protection of emergency responders, but rush prisoner voting ? Labour is saying ensuring fairer trials for rape victims and protecting emergency workers is not a priority but prisoners voting is !

If prisoner voting was such an urgent issue, why did govt not include it in its three other electoral amendment bills passed this term of parliament ?

When the rights of 4 million plus law abiding NZers are being curtailed by being confined to home, thousands of businesses banned from trading and community papers prohibited from publishing, why is the most important human rights issue prisoners’ voting rights rather than getting covid-19 under control so we can wind back lockdown ?
15 3
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April 10, 2020 3:41pm
- Harriet
  
  No one in the country is allowed to derive a direct benefit from someone’s incarceration, sure the beaten wife may have some relief and a prison guard a job.
  
  But the Corrections Minister’s job is to look after the welfare of prisoners – not have them look after his welfare.
  
  And besides, the government under urgency isn’t seeking further health funding for prisoners this winter, nor have prisoners serving less than 3 years asked to vote this November. Prisoners won’t riot if they can’t vote – as the eligible are out in less than 3yrs anyway.
  
  The whole thing is a total fucken scam to the point of corruption —— when the corrections minster himself derives a benefit! 😎
  
  9 1
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  April 10, 2020 4:35pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  More voter stacking?
  
  3 1
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  April 10, 2020 6:01pm
MrTips

And people think Trump is nuts.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2020/04/covid-19-anthony-fauci-says-coronavirus-could-see-the-end-of-hand-shaking.html

Fauci sounds a little bit zealous and kooky
11 2
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April 10, 2020 3:46pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This Fauci guy may know some shit but he is off the planet. New World Order shit – with Bill Gates.
  Put the cuckoo back in the clock – dangerous man
  
  12 6
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  April 10, 2020 3:54pm
  - Stu2
    
    At least he and others convinced Trump not to open the churches at Easter and relax the controls at the pandemic peak
    
    4 0
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    April 10, 2020 7:28pm
- David Moore
  
  I think Trump is going to regret trusting Fauci.
  
  7 7
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  April 10, 2020 4:14pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Well, Trump has never trusted anyone ~~who knows more than him~~,
    
    4 21
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    April 10, 2020 4:34pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yes. Similar to the nonsense from this Nigel guy in NZ. Lots of talk about how to prepare ourselves …..
    I say no more, I am mentally strong/deranged.
    You choose
    
    9 3
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    April 10, 2020 4:34pm
All_on_Red

And here we go…
‘Japan is willing to fund its companies to shift manufacturing operations out of China, Bloomberg has reported as the disruptions caused to production by the coronavirus pandemic has forced a rethink of supply chains between the major trading partners.
As part of its economic stimulus package, Japan has earmarked $2.2 billion to help its manufacturers shift production out of China. Of this amount, 220 billion yen ($2 billion)is for companies shifting production back to Japan and 23.5 billion yen for those seeking to move production to other countries.’
https://www.news18.com/amp/news/business/japan-will-pay-its-firms-to-leave-china-relocate-production-as-part-of-coronavirus-stimulus-package-2571011.html?__twitter_impression=true
13 1
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April 10, 2020 4:24pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  I’m not sure that would be a sustainable policy any more than tariff barriers.
  
  2 14
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  April 10, 2020 4:32pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Are you a qualified economic adviser to the COL?
    
    8 0
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    April 10, 2020 5:59pm
Benedict Yu

According to CNN the Prime Minister’s handling of the pandemic is an example for the world.

https://youtu.be/iuLWQK77rYk
6 11
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April 10, 2020 4:25pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  CNN. Saw my fucking cock off. Good example of PTPM’s shit Benedict Yu.
  The tentacles of the NZ Marxist Socialist go to CNN.
  Jesus fucking Christ. You think CNN researched this? No way.
  The PR of the Labour Party have been emailing CNN 24/7.
  Same shit was on Al Jazeera
  
  23 4
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  April 10, 2020 4:42pm
  - Poppa
    
    You have to hand it to the Labour PR machine
    
    They sure get their shit into the media
    
    10 1
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    April 10, 2020 5:54pm
    - marcw
      
      Labour have as good as promised a truckload of taxpayer funding to TVNZ & RNZ, and MediaWorks and Stuff are lobbying away behind the scenes to allow them to merge with NewsHub. Why the heck wouldn’t the news-whores promote and back the source of free money?
      
      15 0
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      April 10, 2020 6:05pm
    - kowtow
      
      Or
      
      You have to hand it to the Media PR machine .
      
      They sure get their Labour message into the mainstream.
      
      8 1
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      April 10, 2020 6:31pm
  - MCos
    
    Sounds like this lockdown is getting to you Steve.
    
    4 9
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    April 10, 2020 6:02pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Nah. The loopy left trolls here are LOL
      
      1 1
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      April 11, 2020 9:00am
  - James Stephenson
    
    I’ve had some UK-based mates blathering on “Can we have her…”
    
    Of course the obvious response is: “Sure, soon as you like, now Boris is on the mend we can have Dom Raab.” They seem quite non-plussed.
    
    9 0
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    April 10, 2020 7:11pm
- gorse
  
  Who watches CNN?
  
  9 2
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  April 10, 2020 6:45pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    PTPM does. Legend you know
    
    0 1
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    April 11, 2020 9:01am
Wayne1749

CNN and Ardern are as sickening as each other.

Australia has done an even better fucking job in spite of having had the virus a lot earlier than NZ and being a much bigger country
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12324160

So why has CNN not rushed out to praise Morrison, but instead Ardern.

I’d much rather have Morrison instead of that bimbo

And what about Hong Kong ….just 4 deaths and about the same number of cases as NZ in spite of having had the virus very early on, high population density and on the doorstep of mainland China.

Same with Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, and Japan, who under far more challenging circumstances have done a great job in containing the spread of the virus.

Ardern is an attention hog
2 0
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April 10, 2020 11:17pm
- Nickc2
  
  Don’t forget CNN, CNBC and Washing Post all support the Democrats and use fake news against the US President. Therefore, it’s no secret why they push Cincy’s cause.
  The NZ Herald takes it’s feeds from the Washington Post. When was the last time the NZ Herald published anything even remotely favourable to the US President.
  
  1 1
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  April 11, 2020 8:25am

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