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September 28, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 28 September 2025

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General Debate

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NeverMindTheBollocks

I was waiting for this. All those Radio NZ stories about how hard done by Kiwis are off to Aus for free drugs because the mean National government won’t pay for them.

Turns out that the Aussies don’t like freeloaders. No surprises there, and who can blame them.

“A Kiwi mum was told “don’t come” by disgruntled Aussies after she revealed she was moving to access a medicine her son needs that is not funded in New Zealand.

She was told by one Australian she would “burden our already burdened health care system” by shifting so her 2-year-old son Jax could access Trikafta to treat his cystic fibrosis”.
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September 28, 2025 8:03am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Adding the URL:
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360835992/mum-moving-australia-life-saving-unfunded-cystic-fibrosis-drug-trikafta
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:27am
- cmm
  
  Whether she was told that by disgruntled Aussies is rather irrelevant. All that matters is the law – can she actually get them?
  
  Of course nobody likes a free-loader.
  
  There are about 600 cystic fibrosis patients. If they were each getting $300k of drugs a year that would be $200 million a year.
  
  That is a chunk of money, but compared to some of the things we piss money away on it is hard to say that would be a bad deal.
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:08am
  - Ghost
    
    It is funded in NZ for those eligible, but not for kids under 6
    
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    September 28, 2025 10:26am
- pb
  
  New Zealand is one of two nations in the world that allows pharma to run ads on TV. We have some of the highest consumption of painkillers in the western world. Fentanyl and Tylenol babies galore. Why the begging and weeping for free drugs. Seems perverse. Asked a random guy yesterday about Tylenol and he proudly announced he was cutting down to 2 painkillers a day. He’ll be popping them like candy. Big Pharma running rampant in our minds.
  
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  September 28, 2025 6:38pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  People in desperate situations will take the opportunities that are available. Ignore the pig-ignorant and mean spirited armchair a-holes and take the opportunities available. FFS the women is trying to save her son’s life, just like any parent would.
  
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  September 29, 2025 6:41pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Mr Abdulal is free to express his opinion on NZ’s policy on recognition of the (non) state of Palestine. I wonder if that gives him pause for thought.

I’m going to go out on a limb here, and suggest that the answer is ‘no’.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/574352/new-zealand-palestinian-angry-upset-at-government-s-decision-on-statehood
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September 28, 2025 8:09am
- kowtow
  
  RNZ more than happy to promote emotionalism , lies and dis/misinformation.
  
  Note they call Hamas militants , not the correct term “terrorists”.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:23am
  - nathie
    
    Not just RNZ but also NZME’s left-wing news operation who also provide the slanted copy for ZB’s radio news bulletins.
    
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    September 28, 2025 12:45pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    A contrarian view. For those with closed minds please jump immediately to downtick)
    
    Kowtow, of course terrorist, militants are labels used mainly for propaganda purposes IMHO.
    
    I am sure many in the middle east many would label HAMAS as freedom fighters.
    
    The label terrorists has recently been used by some as, I dont like you label. eg Trump lableling ANtifa as terrorist group.
    
    So what is a terrorist organisation?
    
    Terrorism, in its broadest sense, is the use of violence against non-combatants to achieve political or ideological aims.
    
    On this definition, Israel is also a terrorist organisation.
    
    Something to think about before rushing in to the pile-on group.
    
    I wonder how I would define/lable the Pillocks group?
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:44pm
- Hugh Jarse
  
  As Mrs Brown would say, “that’s nice”. Pretty sure he can still get to the Gaza Strip if he wishes, where the regime may be more in tune with his thinking rather than staying in New Zealand.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:45am
- BananaLlama
  
  I’ll listen to their criticism when they recognise Taiwan.
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:36am
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    Indeed. This rush to recognize Palestine from governments that refuse to recognize Taiwan is a really such a joke.
    
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    September 28, 2025 8:35pm
- artemisia
  
  Maybe Mr Abdulal and his family members in Gaza support the Hamas government and its military wing. Their choice if so. And the consequences of their choice.
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:41am
- Inandout
  
  NM, has any journalist got the guts to ask Mr Abdulal about his opinion on the Muslim attitude to homosexuality? He is fixated by the Islam creed and as far as I know openly gay Pallestinians in Gaza are unknown. Why is this bloody elephant simply not seen by Pallyists?
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:08am
  - kowtow
    
    Whatever about homosexuals .
    
    What about their attitude to Jewish women , whose broken bodies were paraded through the streets of Gaza to the cries of Allah is Great .
    
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    September 28, 2025 12:37pm
  - Kaiser Wilhelm
    
    And Hamas’ rampant misogyny too.
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:28pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    Why not list all the countries that ALSO ban homosexuality. Its not just Palestine, nor just Islam/Muslim.
    
    Try this list before you get too excited.
    
    https://www.globalequality.org/component/content/article/166
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:54pm
- CJames
  
  I note the article (not just a few quotes) by Mr Abdulal is the only article on the RNZ site about the Gaza decision. If they were an impartial media organisation, they would have had a counter view, possibly someone whose relative was killed on October 7th. But that is not what RNZ does, is it.
  
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  September 28, 2025 12:41pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Mr Abdulah and his boiling blood should go home. How did he get residency anyway?
  
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  September 28, 2025 1:10pm
Chuck Bird

We should want more CO2, now less.

Ian Bradford: The Importance of Carbon Dioxide

https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2025/09/ian-bradford-importance-of-carbon.html
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September 28, 2025 8:14am
- Foxfour
  
  Unfortunately since Kyoto was signed by Jenny Shipley the taxpayers have had to make annual bulk purchases of “CO2 antidote” in the form of carbon credits
  This current financial years 25/26 cost is $2 bill
  
  ‘Allocation of New Zealand Units (M12) (A15)
  This appropriation is limited to the granting of New Zealand Units to sectors of the New Zealand Economy …$2,045,700’
  Vote Environment
  https://www.budget.govt.nz/budget/pdfs/estimates/v8/est25-v8-envir.pdf
  
  The current Pharmac budget is only around $1.7 bill pa
  
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  September 28, 2025 8:41am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Perhaps Radio NZ should start a campaign agitating that the carbon credit Danegeld is reallocated to Pharmac.
    
    But they won’t, of course.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:29am
    - Foxfour
      
      Maybe Kiwiblog could be agitating for that ? Dont hold your breath.
      Maybe groundswell could agitate for the taxpayers to be relived of their burden… wait a minute didnt they get the proposal for farmers to pay more directly to be cancelled so it fell back on the taxpayers again.
      The Carbon Pope demands his payments even from non believers
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:31am
  - Nikola Donatello
    
    I commented on this issue yesterday. This is not a real cost.
    
    The only issuer of New Zealand Units is the crown. So the government is just paying sectors to buy units from the crown. The money goes out one door and comes back through a different door.
    
    This mechanism is entirely different to the issue of New Zealand buying UNFCCC units offshore to meet our INTERNATIONAL commitments. That is a real and terrifying potential cost.
    
    The New Zealand ETS is a creation of the New Zealand government. All the New Zealand Units are issued by the New Zealand government.
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:41am
    - Foxfour
      
      The Government in 25/26 has budgeted for $2 bill “Expense” to purchase ‘units’ ie carbon credits to distribute to NZ businesses that dont buy carbon credits them selves
      Common accounting meanings of expense can just be magicked away. You have literally made up your claims with zero backing for this
      
      It is a REAL cost in Vote Environment. I had the link so you can see the relevant budget wording.
      
      Wheres your link to say its created out of thin air ? or the budget line where its revenue
      
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      September 28, 2025 4:26pm
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  Thanks for sharing this Chuck.
  
  Ian Bradford shows that increasing CO2 levels makes plants more productive, increasing the amount of food we can generate with no negative impacts on humanity. The commonsense that 3rd form science taught us.
  
  The hubris and arrogance of the climate change movement, has already resulted in reduced stocking on farms and farms converted from food generating to timber banks. What further harm could be done by active removal of CO2 from additional technology, legislation etc?
  
  It is possible that their arrogance will create conditions for famine, on a global scale not seen since the ice ages. If you are a radical green then there is no problem with this – mass starvation resulting in the reduction of humanity is a good outcome for these terrorists.
  
  Worldview is the shaper of climate change ideology. The greens believe that the planet is here and cannot cope with increasing numbers of people and therefore must be protected from humanity. Thus they happily wage a war on humanity. An alternative worldview is that we should be good stewards of this world and can be confident it has the capacity to support abundant life and we don’t need to fret about this. In fact constantly fretting about this will cause harm.
  
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  September 28, 2025 8:49am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Very proud of my Governments stance on Palestine and Winstons measured statement unlike the emotional claptrap from the idiots Albo, Starmer, Macron et al. Winston is the only one who pointed out the reality and the extablished and recognised international law around recognistion of a state.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:11am
  - kowtow
    
    I have a gut feeling this has promoted division within cabinet and is more to do with Winston and the next general election than any ‘international rules based order’………same with those Goons from Oz , Canada , Fr and UK ;all running scared of a certain growing and potentially violent constituency in their largest cities.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:28am
    - pdm
      
      kowtow I commented as follows elsewhere.
      
      It would be interesting to know how Cabinet came to this decision.
      This is what I think the three parties would have been looking for as they entered the Cabinet room:
      
      National – leaning towards recognition of Palestine.
      
      ACT – strongly against recognition of Palestine.
      
      NZFirst – Well Winston anyway. Neutral and thinking how can I personally and we as a party get maximum benefit from this announcement.
      
      Obviously ACT had the best argument and carried the day, possibly supported by Winston who saw good mileage for he and his Party with the stance taken.
      
      Were tempers under control?
      
      Were voices raised?
      
      Were threats made?
      
      Cabinet collective responsibility should ensure we `the plebs’ will never know so this is a good test for the Coalitions collective cohesion.
      
      To wrap it all up Winston then did an excellent job in his presentation to the United Nations.
      
      As a final thought – who wrote that speech?
      
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      September 28, 2025 2:24pm
      - Ghost
        
        God you people make up a lot of shit, rather than have the balls to congratulate the government for this. No surprise at who is pushing their own moronic version of events.
        
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        September 28, 2025 2:31pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Lighten up – speculation sometimes come up with gold.
        
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        September 28, 2025 3:07pm
      - pdm
        
        So Ghost are you saying it is not right to question how the Government came to a decision?
        
        We all know David Seymour and ACT were strongly in favour of the outcome arrived at.
        
        National we have no idea of except they are known fence sitters and PM Luxon likes `glad handing’ the big names like Starmer, Macron etc.
        
        Winston of course is – Winston.
        
        FYI I personally support the decision arrived at and announced.
        
        Be aware – we are not all perfectionists like you seem to hold yourself out to be.
        
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        September 28, 2025 3:44pm
      - Ghost
        
        I’m saying you need to grow up. You actually cannot give an ounce of credit to national, you have to spin things to fit into what you want them to be. Not surprising, you are the person who came on here and lied that Potaka used to be a member of the Māori party, lied about an interaction Potaka barely had walking into the house. You aren’t questioning, you are just making up crap to fit into what you want it to be, which seems to normal for you, and you wonder why your blog is dead.
        
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        September 28, 2025 4:01pm
      - pdm
        
        Ghost I have never said Potaka was a member of the Maori Party to my knowledge.
        
        I do believe he is cosy with the Maori Paryy and probably sympathetic to them which is a big difference.
        
        Apology please.
        
        BTW as you seem to know so much about No Minister Blog we assume you enjoy your regular visits and I thank you for supporting our blog – which is not my blob but, the blog of a collective group of blog authors.
        
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        September 28, 2025 5:37pm
      - pdm
        
        Blog not blob.
        
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        September 28, 2025 5:39pm
  - Foxfour
    
    This ‘international law criteria’ hasn’t been used by NZ before
    When the Balkan state Kosovo government declared independence NZ didnt recognise it
    
    The Houthis became in control of the capital and most of the populated territory of Yemen when the previous President was deposed and fled to Riyadh where he remains. Did NZ recognise this change , or followed the other western countries and Saudi oil muscle in ignoring it.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:50am
  - Grumpy Silver Top
    
    Me too! Not the first time NZ has stood up. I am reminded of David Lange’s nuclear free declaration. Assertions that our economy will be compromised by ignoring climate change agreements are specious. Our customers want our commodities.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:55am
    - PurplePen
      
      My recollection was Lange said no nuke powered military craft and no nuke bombs. It was never an outright ban of everything nuclear such as nuclear power. Me thinks it got hijacked along the way and to our detriment morphed into a ban on everything nuke-related.
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:41am
- pb
  
  We are carbon based lifeforms. The human body is made up of 20% carbon. Whats with all the Carbon hate? We are carbon critters.
  
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  September 28, 2025 6:40pm
CJames

There may be hope for NZers yet. over at his blog, Martin Martin calmed down enough to have a rant about Winston and Israel. Then in the comments, a surprising number are anti recognition.
Of course, he posts all the statements from the usual suspects on the left about how bad the decision is. However, on Gaza and climate, I suspect the majority of NZers see things like the weather and the All Blacks winning as far more important. Long may it continue.
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September 28, 2025 8:16am
Pope Punctilious II

Here’s the latest type of privilege, according to an “award-winning” doctor: skinny privilege.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/wellbeing/360836744/award-winning-doctor-calls-out-skinny-privilege-new-zealand-healthcare
Parroted uncritically by Stuff, of course. And the article manages to squeeze in some virtue-signalling about the “gender imbalance in science” too.
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September 28, 2025 8:21am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  This from a Maori doctor who had the opportunity to benefit from Med School Maori privilege too.
  
  As the Good Book says, it’s hard to see a splinter in someone else’s eye when there’s a mote in your own.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:31am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Good on her.
    Let’s hope she remains working in NZ… There’s no shortage of folks who could benefit from her skills.
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:20am
- wsk12345
  
  Now let’s talk about med school privilege.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:58am
- Foxfour
  
  “The reporting was produced by The Hui and has been published by Stuff with permission”
  
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  September 28, 2025 12:03pm
- Jack5
  
  Popular preferences of women’s body shapes vary over the centuries, old portraits show.
  
  At present thin is in, but is this best for having children and creating families?
  
  Dr Rahiri’s views are interesting.
  
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  September 28, 2025 12:19pm
- kowtow
  
  Odd .Today’s herald has an attack on one of the beauty pageant things for ‘racism and fattism’.
  
  It’s as if the media are running some sort of united campaign , again.
  
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  September 28, 2025 1:56pm
CJames

JK Rowling summed up beliefs really well in a recent tweet.
If you believe free speech is for you but not your political opponents, you’re illiberal.
If no contrary evidence could change your beliefs, you’re a fundamentalist.
If you believe the state should punish those with contrary views, you’re a totalitarian.
If you believe political opponents should be punished with violence or death, you’re a terrorist.

On those 4 factors, how many of the progressive “thought leaders” get the jackpot, ticking all of the statements?
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September 28, 2025 8:25am
- R
  
  How many?…..MOST!
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:36am
- Tauhei Notts
  
  You quote J.K. Rowling. I thought of her when I was impressed with Harry Potter’s play last night. But with my meandering mind I also thought of Israel Dagg, then I thought of that [ Mod – stick to issues ]
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:30am
  - pdm
    
    Speaking of Israel Dagg why does this formerly talented rugby player (and cricketer) allow SKY and the TAB to make him look and sound like a deranged idiot during test matches.
    
    Has to be the dosh I suppose.
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:30pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

The headlines, one after the other on TVNZ’s website, are self explanatory. No one there seems to have asked the question why some of those newly unemployed in Tokoroa should not simply move to the BoP for the work that’s available there.

http://www.1news.co.nz/2025/09/27/skilled-migrants-at-risk-as-english-test-barrier-threatens-bop-business/

http://www.1news.co.nz/2025/09/27/tokoroa-plywood-plant-workers-wait-to-hear-if-they-still-have-job/
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September 28, 2025 8:31am
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  Why can’t NZ be competitive making plywood? Are trees more expensive in NZ? Union seems to think so, primary product is expensive and so is the energy cost.
  
  Union doesn’t say anything about labour rates but I suspect they are high too.
  
  Union doesn’t ask why energy costs are going up. Could it have anything to do with The Great Leaders proclamations (Jacinda first, then Hipkins) that there will be no oil or gas industry in NZ?
  
  I’m sure another factor is the NZ factory will have had the scale to produce peak construction and infrastructure loading. With these sectors in a long recessionary slump it is natural they would look to scale down. Is this now the cost of too little cost cutting from the public service? Do we need Chris and Nicola to wake up to the fact they are now hurting the country by not addressing the bloat created by labour?
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:25am
  - R
    
    Chris and Nicola are very much awake. The ones who are ‘sleep walking’ to unemployment and financial misery, are those who support and promote, the UNIONS with their anti business policies. UNIONS as we have in NZ, now are long past their useby dates. We are now quarter way through the 21st century, not still living in the 17th century, like the union leadership is.
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:00am
  - Handyman
    
    I can provide some background re the Tokoroa plywood mill.
    
    It was built for a different time where structural plywood was in demand for timber building bracing, where appearance did not matter so much. Nowadays even building site fences require smooth paintable plywood. Standard imported plywood looks better and is cheaper than New Zealand pine plywood.
    
    The big costs of plywood are:
    Plant capital. The mill must run at capacity, so is not suited to New Zealand building cycles.
    Energy. Steam is used to dry the raw veneer so it can be glued together. The Tokoroa mill dries all veneer before selecting bits to glue together, while competitors first select wet veneers and only dry them.
    Wood. Pruned pine is not ideal as a standalone crop for plywood, (compared to northern hemisphere cold species) but is OK as part of a “whole of forest” portfolio.
    Labour. Labour costs are not a big deal and are related to running at capacity.
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:00am
    - PurplePen
      
      Having recently built our own house, ourselves, we used ply as the structural element and external envelope. Ply from Chile was always better quality than anything from NZ. Same price but Chilean ply warped less, was perfectly square (rectangle). NZ ply was more often than not ever so slightly skew which is pain.
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:47am
      - Jack5
        
        Presumably the Chilean plywood is from Pinus radiata, the same species that NZ scientists refined over a century from the Monterey pine, now an endangered species in its native California.
        
        Chile’s long shape gives it areas that compete strongly with NZ.
        
        Both countries make good wine. NZ firms have helped develop both dairying and salmon farming in Chile. What happened to those NZ investments? There was something similar going on with NZ investment in Uruguay dairying.
        
        Even the famous Bluff oyster is found also on the Chilean coast; the Bluff oyster’s scientific name is Tiostrea chilensis.
        
        The lesson for NZ primary industries is that it’s not enough to be ahead. You have to stay ahead. What’s happened with NZ and Chile is similar to what’s happened with the US and China in electronics.
        
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        September 28, 2025 12:55pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Not sure the trees are getting more expensive. But the electricity certainly is.
    
    So, low productivity workers, and ridiculously expensive electricity- plus high levels of regulatory compliance costs, and voila, the plywood manufacturing moves to China or Indonesia, and NZ goes back to exporting logs…
    
    Its a reverse miracle, but entirely predictable, but its OK because offshore wind and solar will save us!!!
    
    Oh,, and China promises that it cares that we stay in the Paris Accord!
    //S
    
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    September 28, 2025 1:16pm
Maggy Wassilieff

An opinion piece response view that Newsroom wouldn’t publish:

A Response to Dame Anne Salmond on Climate Change

https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2025/09/john-raine-michael-kelly-bryan-leyland.html
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September 28, 2025 8:33am
- Master Mariner
  
  Quote,
  “She draws attention to the risk to international trade agreements if New Zealand departs from existing obligations. However, Professor Salmond appears to be guided only by the mainstream politicised narrative on climate change”.
  
  This is the usual lazy statement peddled by the Mis/Dis informed, Ok Dame Salmond Please explain how with all this Wisdom ?
  
  Any one with an ounce of research could see the Climate Change Narrative was a built on a “House of Cards” ( Apart the Political lot representing us mere mortals).//
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:08am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Anne Salmond’s view on climate change should be no more relevant than mine. Despite being elected to the US National Academy of Sciences, she’s a social scientist (STEAM, anybody?). Her most famous book is about a dog.
  
  Back in your wheelhouse, Anne.
  
  From Akld Uni website bio:
  Dame Anne Salmond is a Distinguished Professor of Māori Studies and Anthropology at the University of Auckland, and a leading social scientist. She is the first New Zealander to be elected a fellow of both the US National Academy of Sciences and the British Academy,
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:38am
  - R
    
    Anther academic with no lateral vision
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:03am
- Handyman
  
  Imagine if the USA granted unlimited preferential tariff free access to all New Zealand products into the US market and forced its allies (eg Canada, UK) to do the same.
  There would be only one condition. New Zealand must stop building windmills and build a nuclear power plant.
  
  Imagine the outrage. “mercantile imperialism”, “neo colonisation”. “we have an independent foreign policy”, “we gave women the vote”.
  
  However, this is exactly what the EU has done. It allows countries (albeit limited, tariff) access to their market on one condition — that they produce their power (in their own country, for their own citizens!) using windmills.
  These baked-in clauses of the (not so) free trading agreements for the EU now throttle New Zealand’s ability to compete with all our other trading partners.
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:29am
- pb
  
  The US president addressed the Green Globalists in the heart of their Temple in New York: “the greatest con job ever perpetrated on the world” and described green energy initiatives as a “scam.” He warned world leaders, “I’m telling you that if you don’t get away from the green energy scam, your country is going to fail,” while criticizing renewable sources like wind turbines as “pathetic” and the Paris Climate Agreement as a “fake” arrangement.
  
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  September 28, 2025 6:44pm
Chuck Bird

Winston Peters delivers speech to United Nations – NZ not ready to recognise Palestinian statehood.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RQhxqQOii0
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September 28, 2025 8:39am
- Cassandra
  
  Battle lines drawn. In response to Winston Peters statesman-like decision to recognise a Palestine state at the right time (and that’s got to include Arab recognition of Israel) Labour, predictably, put all the onus on genocidal Israel. “Oh, and by the way, Hamas shouldn’t have attacked on 7 October”. Well, the Jews and America know which side the NZLP is on.
  
  There’s a simple solution to this problem: Arab nations recognise Israel and cease attacking it. Form a democratic nation amongst the residents of Gaza and the West Bank. Insist that Israel and Palestine negotiate their borders à la Oslo. Simple, difficult but not impossible.
  
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  September 28, 2025 8:53am
  - Im Right
    
    Ahhh Cassandra, you have been pulled into the mire, there is no ‘simple solution’
    When the arabs/Muslims want Israel (and all Jews) destroyed, there can never be a ‘simple solution’.
    Israel (and USA and Saudi) need to bomb Iran into submission.
    Iran is the major problem in the whole Middle East by its funding and arming most of the terrorist organisations.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:03am
    - R
      
      The Mullah’s of IRAN are the problem. A bit like trade unionists, living in the dark ages, will past their useby dates
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:05am
      - kowtow
        
        The Mullahs of Tehran are simply the latest iteration of the problem.
        
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        September 28, 2025 2:02pm
  - Scott
    
    Cassandra – “Form a democratic nation amongst the residents of Gaza and the West Bank”.
    
    Here’s the problem. Hamas was democratically elected. If the residents of Gaza and the West Bank got a chance to elect a new government they would vote for Hamas 2.0.
    
    No, Hamas needs to be defeated and the land conquered by Israel, all of the land. If people want to live in a Palestinian state they need only go to Jordan which is ethnically indistinguishable from the people of Gaza and the West Bank.
    
    Gaza started the war and to reward them with another state is madness. Israel needs to finish the war and take the win, including all the land.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:10am
    - Cassandra
      
      That isn’t going to happen. Might be a good idea in principle but even Trump is opposed. A realistic solution is required and Blair, Kushner and selected Arabs are moving there. And despite views to the contrary, it’s possible that majorities n Arab states will accept Israel, along the lines of Jordan and Egypt. Iran of course never, but that can be accomodated.
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:07am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Iran under the mad mullahs, maybe. The Iranians I know (part of the self selected voted-with-their-feet minority, admittedly) loathe their government and all they stand for.
        
        I sincerely hope that no one sees nukes as the only way to curb that beautiful country and its people.
        
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        September 28, 2025 12:44pm
    - Foxfour
      
      Hamas didnt win a majority in the GWB mandated election.
      Hamas then seized power in Gaza
      Fatah and Hamas both won low 40%s overall and in Southern Gaza was ahead of Hamas who led in Northern Gaza
      
      “Israeli obstruction during the election resulted in estimated 123,000 voters in East Jerusalem being prevented from registering until ten days before the elections, creating a number of logistical problems shortly before the election day. The checkpoints of Israel also continued to pose serious obstacles to all Palestinian parties during the electoral campaign as well as on voting day itself”
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election
      
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      September 28, 2025 11:52am
    - kowtow
      
      scott
      
      If I might be pedantic.
      
      ‘Hamas was democratically elected.’
      
      They were elected , but there is no “democracy” there , no underlying principles , no real representation , rule of law , accountability ; the things that do make real democracy .
      
      As is so often the case in those countries , as was once remarked .
      
      “One man , one vote , one time”
      
      Even the PA ( who the Goon leaders of the west want to “recognise” haven’t had a plebiscite for many many years .
      
      And have only just promised ( yeah right) to drop “pay for slay”. No doubt under massive pressure from their western pay masters.Poor optics you see.
      
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      September 28, 2025 12:44pm
    - Paulus
      
      Hamas may have been overwhelmingly elected at the end of a violence for people to do so.
      Like being a Union member in New Zealand become a member or your job is in serious jeopardy.
      
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      September 28, 2025 2:29pm
  - Swifty
    
    One point of clarification – Iran isn’t Arab.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:16am
  - Paulus
    
    There is no way that Mongrol Arabs of every type will stop attacking the west in the primary shape of Israel.
    The copious oil money can continue to fund this from a state of protecting themselves from themselves.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:27am
  - R
    
    Impossible to comprehend or champion, for ideological anti democracy activists doesn’t suit their agenda, nor that of their Marxist masters
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:39am
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    Impossible when there is hatred and commitment to the extermination of the Jews. Good luck with negotiating that out of people’s hearts.
    
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    September 28, 2025 10:05am
- Philview
  
  I looked at the Herald and Stuff this morning and they are surprisingly quiet so far today. They covered it yesterday but I thought it would still lead today.
  
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  September 28, 2025 9:10am
KH

Who is attacking who?
Israel in recent times has bombed Iran, Syria, The West Bank, Gaza, Yemen, Lebanon and ….
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September 28, 2025 9:00am
- Don Beckett
  
  Could you tell us WHY ??
  Thought not.
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:48am
  - Wandering Star
    
    Because Israel is an aggressive, belligerent, expansive power intent on nullifying any perceived regional challenger and emboldened to act in ways it otherwise couldn’t because of its US security guarantee.
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:14pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    Because they can under the “”protective”” umbrella of the USA. Just a thought.
    
    Sort of like some countries banning opposition parties???
    
    So bomb them to install a sense of fear?
    Oops that falls under terrorism definition?
    
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    September 28, 2025 4:22pm
- Southern Raider
  
  All defensive strikes. For example
  – Syrian forces were massacring Druze civilians
  – Iran was close to having nuclear weapons
  – Houthi territory (not broader Yemen) because Houthis were flying drones into civilian areas
  
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  September 28, 2025 12:50pm
Colville

Well done to the All Blacks but mannnn that ref had a patchy game.
Multiple calls against Aussie they can feel agreived about but early on the Aussie number 8 Wilson a diving no arm tackle 5 meters in front of the posts that wasn’t carded.. and he did it again later in the game.
Barrett should have been carded for his tip tackle, Potter was carded 5 minutes later for the same thing.
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September 28, 2025 9:09am
PurplePen

Herald has a 1 pager on Auckland voter turnout. Most of the text is devoted to Kerrin Leoni, mayoral candidate, complaining that turnout is appalling, reasons why. But the best quote is “We don’t want a 20% voter turnout… what kind of mandate would that give those elected members”. Presume Leoni wasn’t saying the same for the turnout for the recent Maori seat election which was 27%.
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September 28, 2025 9:35am
imalwaysright

A good description of Luxon from Wayne Brown on Q@A.

“A businessman OWNS businesses, he has his own money in the game.

Luxon is “business oriented”?

He is right, Luxon has always worked with other peoples money, never his own. No risk, no skin in the game, a guaranteed paycheck.
That’s not a businessman, that’s an employee.
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September 28, 2025 9:36am
- R
  
  Wayne Brown is a sort of businessman who is prolifically spending other people’s money also. No sign of any trimming of waste within Auck Council during Brown’s term so far!
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:11am
  - Foxfour
    
    A Mayor has only 1 vote at the council table of 19 + 2 Iwi Reps
    
    Its not the US system where the mayor is like a chief executive who can hire fire the department heads
    
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    September 28, 2025 4:07pm
- Inandout
  
  ima, and that goes for a great number of MPs who are hopeless academics with barely a clue how businesses operate.
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:16am
  - Foxfour
    
    Mps are legislators passing laws and their job also involves community engagement.
    How is that run like a business.
    
    Ministers only have a small office of advisors to run and Government departments operations are forbidden to take ministers interference except in a few limited cases
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:45am
    - Inandout
      
      Fox, experience is the key. Unless you have run a business, stressed when your income is exceeded by bills, worked all bloody hours to keep the outfit above water, then you can’t talk. Politicians love spending taxpayers money because they have no skin in the game. Yes Ministers aren’t supposed to interfere in how staff run the office, but these seat warmers can sabotage and interfere in the opposite direction.
      
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      September 28, 2025 1:33pm
- Gravelroad
  
  Mr Luxon owns several expensive properties which he presumably buys and sells from time to time.
  Does owning property at this level not count as being “in business”?
  And how does he not have his “own money in the game?”
  Where did he get the funds to buy and sell buildings then?
  I mean, really, it is one thing to criticise the way he handles being the PM, but to imply Mr Luxon knows nothing about business is just partisan politicking.
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:45am
  - Inandout
    
    Grav, property speculation is a soft way of being in business because the asset rarely disappears. Luxon is in effect an employee who reached the top of the Air NZ tree. His timidness and fence sitting openly display his history in business matters. Do you think Bob Jones, Tindall or Duke would have reached the pinnacle of the business world by being a shrinking violet?
    
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    September 28, 2025 1:43pm
  - Paulus
    
    How many houses does Helen Clark now have – is it 7 or now 8 ?
    
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    September 28, 2025 2:32pm
  - Scooter
    
    I think Luxon is looking at his role as the PM the same way. He is just focused on making NZ economically better, or like when you buy a dooer upper house put some paint on it etc and then flick it off. Trouble is who will be the new owner next year? He doesn’t care or know what to do about the Maori stuff, that’s too hard for him and he can just trot off overseas if it all turns to #@£*.
    
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    September 28, 2025 7:11pm
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    I’m not sure working an office job while flipping a bit of real estate on the side really qualifies as being in business.
    
    Might as well say that every shareholder in an fund tracking the Nasdaq is some kind of technology maven.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:10pm
Cassandra

And note Helen Clark’s defence of her “independent foreign policy “: NZ should be following the example of France, the UK and Australia. Note that her stance was the exact reverse of this over the nuclear issue. And also note that all three of those countries are responding to the very vocal pressure of their large Moslem populations. As usual Labour has Marxist principles. That’s Groucho, not Karl.
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September 28, 2025 9:56am
- KH
  
  And Iraq ?
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:30am
- Hugh Jarse
  
  As long as it’s bad for Israel, the only democracy in the Middle East and the US, Helen will move her principles to suit. Shes not a big supporter of the wrong sort of democracy. Interestingly most of her friends, Labour Party HO and her 1999-2007 Cabinet would have been thrown off roof tops if they had chosen to visit Gaza.
  
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  September 28, 2025 10:30am
  - MCōs
    
    That’s a mighty wild allegation that I’d like to see you back up and not with the bogus video clip which claims to show some gays thrown off a building in Gaza, which was actually perpetrated by IS elsewhere.
    Apart from that which cabinet ministers did you have in mind?
    https://www.reuters.com/fact-check/video-people-thrown-roof-shows-punishment-by-is-not-hamas-2023-12-14/
    
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    September 28, 2025 5:54pm
- crikey
  
  We should have some sympathy for Helen Clark. It must be hard coming to terms with being irrelevant in today’s world. 😂
  
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  September 28, 2025 3:55pm
  - R
    
    No sympathy at all. She was always irrelevant in the real world; worshiped by the mindless!
    
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    September 28, 2025 8:03pm
MCōs

An interesting article
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine
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September 28, 2025 10:22am
- Cassandra
  
  “The Mufti said in March 1948 to an interviewer from the Jaffa daily Al Sarih that the Arabs did not intend merely to prevent partition but “would continue fighting until the Zionists were annihilated.” Jamal al-Husayni warned the Jews that “The blood will flow like rivers in the Middle East”.”
  
  Indeed an interesting article. Despite all the shenanigans it’s inescapable that the n approved partition and the Arabs have never accepted it. But if Egypt and Jordan can ch age their minds why not the rest?
  
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  September 28, 2025 11:18am
  - Foxfour
    
    Why should they accept partition imposed on them by the UN after a rigged vote
    The British Government White Paper in 1939
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Paper_of_1939 ruled out partition because of the intolerable burden on Palestinians. Jewish terrorist militias stepped attacks on Arabs and British facilities
    
    The Partition of India on religious grounds came about after 1946 elections where the Awami league muslim party triumphed in what is now Pakistan and East Bengal.
    So partition reluctantly went ahead despite Congress Party and HMG not wanting that.
    
    When was the election in Palestine to partition on religious grounds
    
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    September 28, 2025 11:40am
    - MCōs
      
      When Germany started persecuting their Jews in the 1930s many sought to emigrate to somewhere safer or at least where they could be accepted — inasmuch as Jews are ever fully accepted and certainly in America in those days that were only tolerated
      America was an obvious destination, but they set quotas and picked only those they wanted. The UK, which had problems of their own, did much the same, but they controlled Palestine.
      About 30% of Jewish refugees went there, much to the annoyance of the existing Palestinians, both Muslim and Jewish
      
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      September 28, 2025 1:39pm
      - pb
        
        The Ottoman empire collapsed after WW1 leaving Palestine tottering. The English played Empire games for a while, but in the end couldn’t wait to get out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing
        
        The Zionist operation to take back Israel started in 1896, by Herzl: Der Judenstaat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism
        
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        September 28, 2025 7:00pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    An observation to those with an open mind. All with a stubbornly closed mind might as well go straight to down tick!!
    I dont care about the ticks, more interested in informed debate.
    
    So why would the Mufti say this in 1948???
    
    How about going back to 1919 and the Balfour declaration, organised by the richest family in the world (Jewish) headed by Lord Walter Rothschild.
    Which effectively (finalised in the UN decision) provided the New Israel with a colonial master relationship with Palestine.
    
    How about this review
    https://decolonizepalestine.com/myth/had-palestinians-accepted-the-1947-partition-plan-they-would-have-had-a-state-by-now/
    
    particularly this quote.
    
    ‘Every native population in the world resists colonists as long as it has the slightest hope of being able to rid itself of the danger of being colonised’.
    
    Think back to our own Maori Wars against the colonialists. And the rise of the current Maori Party in New Zealand.
    
    As always, history has a way of educating us as to why things happen before a seminal event. In this case the Hamas lead raid in to Israel 27th October.
    
    And to why the “colonialist”” Netanyahu wants to expand his empire.
    
    Food for thought for those with an open mind.
    
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    September 28, 2025 4:58pm
Yvette

Without any connection, but for the image of New Zealand on the international stage, will New Zealand’s stance on ‘Palestine’ as stated by Winston Peters yesterday before the United Nations, act as a measure by which one may gauge the international reaction, and threat to selling kiwifruit to the world, if New Zealand adopts a stance that our contribution is of no practical impact in global warming, particularly as it is Nature, assisted by some human influences, but not worth self destruction of our covid damaged economy?
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September 28, 2025 11:36am
- greybeard
  
  WHAT ?
  
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  September 28, 2025 5:33pm
Haast

Massive carbon sink in NZ agricultural soils, highest on dairy farms at 101 tonnes C per hectare. This amounts to 170 million tonnes of C on bad boy dairy farms alone. https://www.landcareresearch.co.nz/news/benchmark-results-from-the-national-soil-carbon-monitoring-system-for-agricultural-land-in-new-zealand?fbclid=IwY2xjawNFOylleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicmlkETBCTWJJeWVZdHh6ejJ5OXl3AR6XPfCPY667PfHHXd6HLK7JYibbICut2hYRYoYdldIVdptqVItb6gwYj4K8NQ_aem_BnRXtFy3TpRDMPAhnPBfDg
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September 28, 2025 12:44pm
MCōs

I thought this Milei bloke was supposed to be the bees knees?
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/25/us/politics/trump-argentina-milei-bailout.html
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September 28, 2025 12:49pm
Philview

Damien Grant’s article on Stuff today tells of how impressive Chris Hipkins has been recently. Chris Hipkins has always been a slick presenter but we mustn’t forget his inept performance across several portfolios in the last Government.
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September 28, 2025 1:28pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Just when you thought the competence of Wellington region Councils could fall no lower (I know, I know) …

“ Wellington city, Lower Hutt, and Porirua have moved to water restrictions which will limit when residents can use sprinklers.
The three cities join Upper Hutt City and South Wairarapa District on Level 1 with the latter two being restricted all year round.
At Level 1, households were asked to use sprinklers every second day only between the hours of 6am and 8am and 7pm and 9pm.
Even-numbered houses were asked to use sprinklers on even-numbered dates, and odd-numbered houses on odd-numbered dates”

I don’t know about the Wairarapa, but there’s been no shortage of rain this winter. If the dams aren’t brimming then that’s down to the disfunctionality of Wellington Water, and nothing else.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/574365/garden-hose-sprinklers-now-limited-to-alternate-days-in-wellington-areas
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September 28, 2025 1:42pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

So, Chile have beaten Samoa to qualify for the 2027 World Cup, with Samoa reduced to drinking at the last chance saloon (in the form of a playoff with Belgium, Namibia and the winner of Brazil-Paraguay – one to qualify).

Is this a case of Chilean improvement? I thought the business case for Manu Pacifica was to improve Samoan and other PI players.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/574383/samoa-have-one-last-chance-to-claim-world-cup-spot-after-loss-to-chile
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September 28, 2025 1:45pm
Hollyfield

I’ve been reflecting on this for a couple of weeks. My local MP, a National MP, sent a flyer promoting his works in the electorate. The top point he wishes to brag about is:

“A mother of five, facing eviction after more than 50 years in their home was, at the 11th hour, able to stay after our team advocated relentlessly with Kainga Ora and WINZ”.

An MP should help his constituents, so well done on that, but how is this anything but an indictment on NZ’s welfare state that this woman hasn’t been able to improve her situation in 50 years.

Mahatma Gandhi is credited with saying “a society is judged by how it treats its most vulnerable members.”

I judge it also on the opportunities it gives people to improve their lives, and to dream of and achieve better for themselves and their families.

A National MP should be working to improve people’s lives through building an environment which both provides opportunities and incentives/sanctions for people to take advantage of those opportunities, not celebrating that a person has been in a state house for 50 years.
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September 28, 2025 1:49pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  “Their”? Surely a mother of five is a “she”?
  
  Presumably, after 50 years, she no longer needs a state house that can accommodate a mother and her five kids. Assuming she still needs a state house, why would she resist moving to a one bedroom pensioner flat, thereby freeing up a larger home for the next family that needs the space?
  
  For context, my parents downsized to a smaller house in a neighbouring suburb, once us kids left home. Completely free market. It’s what people do.
  
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  September 28, 2025 7:04pm
  - Hollyfield
    
    I initially included a paragraph about the use of the word “their” but removed it, feeling it detracted from my main point.
    
    Agreed a mother should be “her” not “their” but the other possibility is a poorly constructed paragraph and the writer intended “their” to refer to the members of the family and not just to the mother. Either does not make me think positively about the writer of the newsletter.
    
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    September 28, 2025 9:03pm
- AitchW
  
  Your MP needs to move to Labour. State houses are not homes for life.
  
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  September 28, 2025 8:57pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/politics/360835206/my-heart-sank-nzs-palestine-decision-says-former-race-relations-commissioner
Perhaps someone here with a better memory than me could comment on the previous performance and opinions of this person. I recall some controversial decisions. Thanks.
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September 28, 2025 3:55pm
- Foxfour
  
  Just a talking head so has no insights or answers from the Jewish or Arab side.
  
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  September 28, 2025 4:02pm
MCōs

Race relations explained in ten seconds https://x.com/omarsakrpoet/status/1972038902681948514?s=61
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September 28, 2025 4:15pm
- Don Beckett
  
  Gold 😆 😆
  
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  September 28, 2025 5:34pm
Prince

There’s an article on Stuff, apparently the start of a daily series of whinging, about how tough Kiwis are finding things under the Coalition jackboot.
Frankly, I can’t be bothered reading the detail. But skimming through some claims stand out.

“…“It’s not just one thing. The mortgage went up…”
Why would the mortgage go up ? Under this Govt the mortgage interest rates have declined substantially. Of course that question never gets asked, let alone answered.

“The couple also restructured their insurance packages, with the cost of life cover alone topping $600 a month at one point.”
This is crazy. They appear to be in their forties. Pinnacle Life quotes on line $100 a month for insurance of $1M each.

““In the last quarter, groceries have gone up 6%.”
Nonsense. ANNUAL inflation has increased 4.4% for all food categories.

Another couple, both nearing 60, with a daughter who is 17…
“The food bill is $450 a month more than this time last year,”
Wow – based on a 4.4% (lets say 5%) increase, they spend $9,000 a month on food. That’s a lot of caviar, whitebait, fillet steak and oysters.

None of this can be true. But the basic maths is never questioned, and we will be getting this nonsense shoved at us each day, for a s long as they can find Green/Labour/TPM activists to feed them this bullshit.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360836512/it-all-just-disappears-how-rising-expenses-are-eating-family-incomes
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September 28, 2025 4:51pm
AitchW

Anyone else finding the siren in the crowd at the netball irritating?
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September 28, 2025 8:59pm

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