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October 5, 2026 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 05 October 2026

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General Debate

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NeverMindTheBollocks

TPM says that Maoris should receive Super earlier as they die younger than other New Zealanders.

An examination of the data tells a different story. While the Party’s statistic is correct when measured from birth, this is the wrong starting point. Super does not kick in until age 65; this is the correct starting point for determining how much Super a person will receive.

Stats NZ via AI tells us that the average years of life remaining at age 65 for Maori women is 19.6 years. The average years of life remaining at age 65 for pakeha men is, drum roll, 19.6 years.

It’s true that Maori men get just 17.3 years, while pakeha women live 21.9 years. It’s also true that Pacific Island men get just 16.9 years (conversely, Asian women get about 24 years).

The conclusion I draw is that TPM might have a point in respect of Maori men, though it would be more ethical to advocate for Pacific Island men. However, it’s unethical to advocate for Maori women to receive Super earlier than pakeha men, since on average they live the same number of years post 65.

As you would expect, women outlive men considerably from age 65. This is the true inequity, but don’t expect to see policy to push out the Super age for women from any party any time soon.
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October 5, 2026 8:01am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Since I am receiving a pension now, (still working, due to circumstance) paying 2nd highest tax rate on it.
  Perhaps pensions could start at minimum amount (TBD).
  and topped up depending on how many years you actually worked. Start with max 40years and work back from there.
  Compensation against actual ability to work.
  I know, subject to definition..
  Categories outside actual employment.
  Pregnancy
  injury
  illness
  Intellectual and physical disability
  may be more
  Complicated??, but fair.
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:24am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Sigh. It’s a benefit. Handed out to today’s recipients funded by taxes of current taxpayers plus a bit of borrowing ….
    
    Every other benefit is income tested and abated. Sometimes the results for other benefits seem a bit harsh. Some call the pension an “entitlement” – whatever that is – are there any others?
    
    Unfortunately there not a pension fund that has a little corner – saved from your previous taxes – with your name on it Bloody governments spent it all doing things like paying your olds a pension that their taxes hadn’t saved up for either …. They don’t make any adjustments for the possibility that your children (whose taxes would be helping with your pension) have shot through offshore.
    
    Not that any of this will change the views of those who paid taxes for years (like everyone) and now figure they deserve a handout (out of the sky) just because they are old. 🙂
    
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    October 5, 2026 10:42am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      I see it as a recognition of contribution.
      Look out your window, everything you see:
      Roads
      Rail
      Water
      Sewage
      Drainage
      etc
      All put there, maintained and payed for by a previous generation of workers. Through their actual work and their taxes.
      We just have to move on, improve and maintain whats there. Then pass it on to the next generation to do the same.
      Only question:Have we taught the next generation to respect the hard work that went before them and to put in the hard work to pass something worth while to the generation following them?
      
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      October 5, 2026 11:05am
      - rjay
        
        Actually a lot of those things are yet to be paid for because of borrowings, so will be yet another impost on future generations for things which benefitted the Boomers.
        
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        October 5, 2026 2:11pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        rjay..
        Did you actually read it.
        “Through their actual work and their taxes.”
        ACTUAL work and taxes already paid.
        No body present had to plan it, budget it and start paying for a project, in many cases, that they will NEVER get the use of. But you will.
        eg You don’t pay tolls on the Auckland harbour bridge anymore. I remember as a kid, while passing through Auckland on holiday, my Father did.
        But spare a thought for all the people that worked on it and never got to use it Toll free, or those whos taxes helped pay for it, and some, even their kids still haven’t used it.
        
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        October 5, 2026 2:59pm
- Scott
  
  Nevermind – I would say it is unethical to tie the payment of superannuation to any concept of race, at all, full stop.
  
  The Maori person of today is mixed race anyway, there are no full blooded Maori left. You also can’t tie payment of super to sex.
  
  I agree some reform of super needs to take place as the current level of super payments is unsustainable. There are less workers funding more old people. That’s just the demographic facts.
  
  However discrimination on race and sex is definitely not the way to go.
  
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  October 5, 2026 11:34am
  - Flossie
    
    Exactly – if you’re 25% Maori do you then get the whole Maori Entitlement, or does it start at 75% into the new Age of Entitlement for Maori? Very unfair if someone who is a little bit Maori could jump on that particular bandwagon.
    
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    October 5, 2026 12:25pm
    - Paulus
      
      How do you actually prove your 25% Maori unless it becomes subject to a DNA approved position, as it is well known that currently such percentages are probably that of a result of suitable untruths.
      
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      October 5, 2026 1:32pm
  - rouppe
    
    Have you taken into account the withdrawals from the nz superannuation fund, the first of which is expected in 2028?
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:16pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      The NZ Super Fund is a successfully invested heap of borrowed money. It will time shift the date where things become waaay to hard. So we can happily plan for things that gradually start to shift the age in 30 years time knowing it won’t affect us.
      
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      October 5, 2026 3:19pm
- BeaB
  
  Perhaps the extra years women enjoy on Super should be part of the equation when working out pay equity rates in the Public Service.
  
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  October 5, 2026 3:48pm
- cmm (semi-retired edition)
  
  Never:
  
  If the idea is to “be fair” between races, then clearly non-Maori should be paid a higher super because, on average, they contribute far more.
  
  There are just so many ways to skin the fairness cat, but, of course, none of them are really fair.
  
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  October 5, 2026 6:41pm
David George

The Telegraph has been going through the Omani pilot Jihadi’s disturbing social media account. This is Islam, it’s not an aberration or mental illness this is what the Prophet describes as the proper way to live in the world.

“He then quoted a passage from the Koran referring to offenders being “killed or crucified” or having their hands and feet cut off on opposite sides.
In one exchange, another user said a husband should take his “marital right” to sex “by force” and, if his wife objected, make her seek a divorce.
The account linked to Hammami replied that the husband had allowed his wife to become domineering and wrote: “If he had stomped on her head she would have been obedient with him.” “I’d stomp on your head, wipe the floor with you, make you an example to others, and then divorce you.”
The Herald have the story, not paywalled:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/flydubai-hijackers-hateful-rants-while-studying-at-british-university/P5OBO2X6UFHE5FBNENFEKWPKDY/
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October 5, 2026 8:01am
- mike
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Thank you for explaining Islam.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:03am
  - Boy Geoff
    
    No doubt your take on Islam is way more liberal and understanding. After all, it’s 2026 aye, mike!
    
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    October 5, 2026 9:14am
  - David George
    
    You are welcome.
    I can recommend Dan Burmawi’s ‘Islam, Israel and the West: A Former Muslim’s Analysis’ for further reading.
    https://www.amazon.com/ISLAM-ISRAEL-WEST-Muslims-Analysis-ebook/dp/B0FP16RQW8
    
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    October 5, 2026 9:28am
    - mike
      
      It’s nice to have your expertise. Is it your position that non-violent Muslims are not true followers?
      
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      October 5, 2026 9:47am
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        That is a view held within factions of Islam, a view that is possible to be taken by each new generation of followers and the children of non-violent muslims. Islam is a religion that will always create violent proponents. How do you propose we deal with that reality?
        
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        October 5, 2026 9:57am
      - David George
        
        A chap was telling the story of how was stung all over by a swarm of ants.
        [Deleted]: “Not all ants”.
        
        My position is irrelevant, this is what the Koran says.
        2:218: “Indeed, those who have believed and those who have emigrated and fought [jahadu] in the cause of Allah—those expect the mercy of Allah. And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.”
        3:142: “Or do you think that you will enter Paradise while Allah has not yet made evident those of you who fight [jahadu] in His cause and made evident those who are steadfast?”
        4:95: “Not equal are those believers remaining [at home]—other than the disabled—and the mujahideen [al-mujahiduna], [who strive] in the cause of Allah with their wealth and their lives. Allah has preferred the mujahideen… by degrees.”
        
        [Mod – we don’t need long copy and pastes, just a link]
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:02am
      - Notsofast
        
        If only 2% of the candy in the jar is poisonous and will kill you do you eat the candy?
        Raymond Ibrahim uses that analogy.
        
        I think this is the video
        
        https://www.youtube.com/live/kN-KdJZ2WP4?si=OyTiBHiClyoupij9
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:19am
      - Jethrod
        
        I’ll play your game.
        Do you have to be violent Muslim to be a true follower?
        
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        October 5, 2026 12:48pm
      - Fender
        
        Why not pigeon hole them all, you do it to kiwibloggers religiously putting a generalised slant on everyone constantly
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:05pm
      - Colville
        
        Notsofast.
        
        The way I heard it was…
        
        If you have a jar of 10,000 jellybeans. 3 of the 10,000 will kill you instantly. How many jellybeans will you let your grandkids eat?
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:13pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Mike: that is indeed my position; perhaps analgous to Catholics who ignore Rome’s absurd and often cruel edicts about birth control.
        
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        October 5, 2026 2:17pm
      - cmm (semi-retired edition)
        
        “Is it your position that non-violent Muslims are not true followers?”
        
        That is the Muslim position.
        
        PS: Misleading the ignorant Westerner is also part of being a True Believer.
        
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        October 5, 2026 6:44pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        You have to factor in the very strong enforcement forces of shame and honour within this cult.
        
        Yes there are nominal believers and weak believers but because of the strong enforcement factors of shame and honour, they have to keep their mouths shut and play the game if they don’t want to be shunned by their family and cult community, or much much worse.
        
        From GB News:
        Imprisoned for leaving Islam. Ex-Muslim speaks out after escape from Sharia nightmare:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIl4uasQdMY
        
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        October 6, 2026 4:52pm
- cmm (semi-retired edition)
  
  “This is Islam, it’s not an aberration or mental illness”
  
  Unless we take a step back and just say that Islam is a mental illness…
  
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  October 5, 2026 6:42pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    What we can say is it is in the long term demonstrably dangerous to free and democratic societies (if they want to remain free and democratic).
    
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    October 6, 2026 5:19pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

We’re told that 20% of New Zealanders are disabled. That’s a bullshit stat, if ever I heard one.

All sorts of extreme steps are being taken to accommodate activists of many stripes, including low sensory environments for the neuro diverse, but that’s still not enough. There remains the problem, I kid you not, for how people vote who cannot use their hands. The number of people who cannot use their hands to make a couple of Xs must be vanishingly small. The booth staff will help you, and if you’re worried about encountering staff who know you then go to a booth at the other end of your electorate.

Going the extra mile is one thing; going the extra ten miles is something else.

http://www.1news.co.nz/2026/10/05/disabled-voters-still-hunting-for-accessible-booths-private-ballots/
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October 5, 2026 8:02am
- Ghost
  
  I’m surprised about the wheelchair access. At least here there is always a sit down booth. A chair there for elderly to use, or to be removed for a wheelchair.
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:27am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  And the Ministry for Disabled is scammed daily, costing New Zealanders millions a year.
  
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  October 5, 2026 12:07pm
- cmm (semi-retired edition)
  
  Is this 20% disabled number just a result of playing the Victim Olympics for too long?
  
  Is a person who wears glasses or a hearing aid disabled?
  How about someone who cannot chew properly due to false teeth?
  Or can’t run due to obesity?
  Then of course all the kids with ADHD (real or imagined). After all, all that matters is their truth.
  
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  October 5, 2026 6:48pm
Anthony Melchett

From labour’s fiscal plan

“Public sector cuts scheduled to happen in the next four years will mostly not go ahead, saving Labour about $1.9b.”

Maybe I’m thick but how does not cutting the public service save 1.9 billion?

Are they saying that what the restructure costs? If so, should you offset the wage savings?

How can a restructure cost that much?

Is this all just made up socialist maths?
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October 5, 2026 8:06am
- RoboRob
  
  ‘Is this all just made up socialist maths?’
  
  Yes, Labours numbers have no basis in reality. At least with the Greens they admit they will just borrow and print money, Labour pretending that it can spend 10x as much as National and still get the economy into surplus in about the same time is just insulting.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:53am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Thank you Mr Google [ Mod – we don’t like to see the blog cluttered with web-search/AI dumps. You need to summarise it and/or provide a link.]
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:34am
- cmm (semi-retired edition)
  
  Of course there are some restructuring costs:
  * People will be paid out redundancy.
  * Leases would be broken on offices.
  
  Of course these are offset by reduced wages and long term reductions in lease and electricity costs etc, but they’re being creative.
  
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  October 5, 2026 6:51pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

ACT’s policy is to move the tax on Super dial from TTE to TEE, ie earnings within a Super scheme including KiwiSaver to be tax exempt.

So, could a 60 year old who receives an inheritance for which they have no immediate need simply pass it into their KiwiSaver account for tax-free returns?

Could a 65 year old maintain their KiwiSaver account indefinitely for on-going tax free returns?

I note that fund managers charge more for KiwiSaver accounts than they do for regular investment accounts – possibly because of additional regulation, I don’t know. This policy may funnel money into the fund managers’ higher fee earning products than otherwise.

It would be good to see the detail.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2026-act-announces-multi-billion-dollar-kiwisaver-tax-cut-to-remove-government-contribution/
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October 5, 2026 8:13am
- RoboRob
  
  Good point. People near or at retirement age could gain access to a ‘bank account’ that is tax free. I feel that my preference, tax free contributions, might deal with that issue but Acts policy would make more of a difference to actual savings levels.
  
  Re KS costs, there are a number of low cost KS funds, such as Kernal and Simplicity that are very competitive with non KS funds. Both of these charge the same fee for KS and for non KS funds.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:58am
- virtualmark
  
  The compliance costs for KiwiSaver are higher than for a regular managed fund.
  
  One global truth about regulators … they always underestimate, if not ignore, the cost that their regulation adds to the consumer.
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:10am
- KKNZ2025
  
  I voted for ACT last election. This KS policy is unprincipled BS. Why should a private individuals KS investment scheme have tax advantages over another private individuals savings thats in the same managed fund/s that doesn’t happen to be via KS?
  
  Noting also that they cant even be bothered killing off the unprincipled FIF regime that taxes unearned income.
  
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  October 5, 2026 12:44pm
  - Colville
    
    Isnt the tax advantage traded for no longer getting a government topup?
    
    So instead of the government taking taxes and wasting 30% of it in bureaucracy before giving it back in a KS handout they just let you keep more of your money?
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:16pm
    - KKNZ2025
      
      $260.72pa is a rounding error compared with the tax
      
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      October 5, 2026 1:45pm
  - RoboRob
    
    I think the concept of tax free KS is around the government removing / reducing their support for retirement (superannuation) and relying on Kiwis to save for their own retirement. Making retirement savings ‘tax efficient’ is the government doing their bit.
    
    I understand your point about all the other investment options not getting the same treatment. The difference is that KS are supposed to be ‘locked away’ for retirement. Now National broke this with first home withdrawals and we can see a trend towards hardship withdrawals too.
    
    FIF is a total pain in the arse but it probably doesn’t effect a huge number of people, especially since it was finally raised from 50k to 100k this term. I imagine Act has higher priorities or could not get support from coalition partners.
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:22pm
Yvette

For mushrooms, who feel they are kept in the dark waiting for the next load of horse manure to be dumped on them, scroll on by …
________________

Māori electorates give the party a concentrated, identity-aligned audience and a viable path to winning seats, which it would struggle to replicate in general electorates.

People on the Māori roll have already chosen to be represented through Māori seats, so the party’s pitch about Māori representation and tino rangatiratanga starts from a sympathetic audience, who may be more likely to believe the mantra that Maori are the victims of white privilege, colonisation, and that so many are at the lower extremes of social measurements – a mantra which likely carries less weight in general electorates.

Choosing the Māori roll in the first place is already a signal of engagement with Māori identity and politics, since many Māori are on the general roll. Then turning out within that already-selected group adds another filter. The current government’s decisions on Māori health, Treaty-related legislation, Māori wards, and te reo in the public sector affect Māori directly, which gives many voters substantive reasons to oppose it.

Anti-incumbent voting or disengagement more likely. Turnout on the Māori roll has historically been lower than on the general roll, so some of the “opposition” shows up as non-voting rather than a vote for the other side.

If Maori were not entitled to a more separate health system, why is a separatist voting system allowed to half exist – the electorate vote half?
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October 5, 2026 8:15am
- mike
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  The Māori seats are a constitutional guarantee of representation, and do no harm to the democratic representation of anyone else.
  
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  October 5, 2026 8:20am
  - AitchW
    
    Duh. Every person of voting age has a constitutional guarantee of representation: an electorate vote and a party vote.
    Maori have a race based party to vote for already, why compound the apartheid with race based seats?
    
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    October 5, 2026 8:27am
  - David George
    
    We all have “a constitutional guarantee of representation”. It’s called a vote.
    
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    October 5, 2026 8:30am
  - Yvette
    
    Mike, your comment relies on an idealized, non-legal definition of “constitutional guarantee” and overlooks how group-based electoral rolls interact with MMP mechanics, electorate quota calculations, and universal democratic principles. While proponents argue the seats protect minority rights against majoritarian rule, asserting that they carry no trade-offs or impacts on the wider electorate ignores established mathematical and philosophical counterarguments.
    Just watch
    
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    October 5, 2026 8:37am
    - mike
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      The answer to calls to abolish the seats is easy: convince Māori to switch to the general roll.
      
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      October 5, 2026 8:43am
      - Cassandra
        
        Asking turkeys to bring Christmas forward?
        
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        October 5, 2026 9:11am
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        Easy, yeah right! TPM are openly campaigning to use Māori seats and MMP mechanics to create over representation for Māori. Why would those who are weaponising this roll ever want to change? They wouldn’t. But I suspect you are quite pleased with this outcome as it gives disproportionate representation to Marxism and the Left.
        
        The fact that Māori seats aren’t just ensuring democratic representation and are in fact creating disproportionate representation means they are doing harm. This will ultimately create a bigger backlash and more desire to see the Māori electorate seats go.
        
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        October 5, 2026 9:14am
      - Ghost
        
        It’s pretty obvious, and that is Māori through these seats will always have an independent voice in parliament. Which isn’t about Māori getting elected through other parties representing what those parties stand for
        
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        October 5, 2026 9:16am
      - RoboRob
        
        @Ghost
        
        There is nothing stopping a Maori party existing without the Maori seats. Hunters and fishers have a party that represents them in the General seats. The Maori seats just make it much easier for the Maori party to get seats, as it would also be for the Hunters and fishers if there with H&F electorates. The
        
        Under MMP the Maori seats are a rort. Maori know this. They will never voluntarily give them up, why would you.
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:02am
      - Ghost
        
        Yeah, but that’s not the situation we have. The way to get there is to convince them that they no longer need dedicated seats, that is the only way they will be completely removed.
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:10am
      - leoj
        
        Only maori have a choice of rolls.
        
        Why not all of us?
        
        No, the answer is to have one roll – for all.
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:09am
      - RoboRob
        
        @Ghost
        
        How would we convince them to move to the General roll?
        
        We have given Maori a special privilege that gives them advantages when voting. How do you convince people to give that up?
        
        * Parties and the electoral commission have spent decades convincing Maori to move too the Maori roll.
        
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        October 5, 2026 11:01am
      - Ghost
        
        By convincing them they have more power on the general roll by effluencing the main parties, instead of voting for a party that has very little influence in parliament. By showing them that Māori interests are core responsibility of parliament and not a few dedicated seats.
        
        To take away the seats through a vote will see them reistablished by the next left government.
        
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        October 5, 2026 11:11am
      - Mr Nobody NZ
        
        Far easier to simply:
        1) Legally define that all New Zealand Citizen are considered to be ethnically Maori and member of an Iwi either via Historical Record or Geographical residency.
        2) All Iwi Members are equally elligable for any Iwi voting or benefit rights.
        3) The current general electorial role is de-established.
        
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        October 5, 2026 11:34am
      - greybeard
        
        The current discussions are around TPM using MMP features to secure electorate votes whilst at the same time giving their party votes to other left-wing parties ( Labour & Greens )
        
        TPM is contesting all 7 maori seats and have only one person on their list.
        
        1. There are maori who vote on the general roll, and these are the ones who probably support anyone but TPM. TPM is not contesting general seats.
        Maori on the general roll could party-vote for TPM but this seems counter-intuitive.
        
        2. There are maori who are on the maori roll, who will vote for their TPM candidate in their electorate and for someone else with their party vote.
        This is their Grand Plan.
        For some reason they think that by doing this that if elected in November these other parties will change their policies and priorities to benefit maori.
        
        3. There are maori who are on the maori roll, who will vote for their TPM candidate in their electorate and for TPM with their party vote.
        If they don’t get 5% with their party vote that single list candidate will miss out.
        Given that TPM is encouraging their supporters do do (2) above this seems the likely outcome.
        
        4. There are maori who are on the maori roll, who will vote for their TPM candidate in their electorate and not make a party vote at all.
        That seems dumb, but it will happen.
        
        5. There are maori who are on the maori roll, who will vote for someone other than the TPM candidate in their electorate.
        If TPM lose seats to other parties their whole plan will come unstuck.
        
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        October 5, 2026 11:39am
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Why do any convincing mike? Just abolish the seats and if those Maori registered on the Maori roll want to vote, they have to join the only roll left.
        
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        October 5, 2026 12:09pm
      - Ghost
        
        And when the next labour government reinstate the Māori seats and Māori roll, then what? Because they will
        
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        October 5, 2026 12:26pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Ghost why should only (part) Maori have this “independent voice in parliament” of which you speak?
        
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        October 6, 2026 5:22pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Maori are quite capable of winning General seats.
    There is NO argument that they are not represented in our Parliament.
    
    https://www3.parliament.nz/mi/get-involved/features/record-number-of-maori-mps-elected-to-new-zealand-parliament/
    
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    October 5, 2026 8:47am
    - mike
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      That’s not my argument.
      
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      October 5, 2026 9:01am
      - Cassandra
        
        I’ve yet to see your argument. State it.
        
        33 2
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        October 5, 2026 9:13am
      - Positan
        
        [Mod – this conversation will be respectful or your posts will be deleted]
        
        2 3
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        October 5, 2026 9:19am
      - Fender
        
        [Mod – debate the topic, leave the abuse for elsewhere]
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:18pm
    - Yvette
      
      Another aspect, Maggy, of representation politically is that in Government services a ‘converted’ portion of the ‘servants’ is rather pro-Maori – in education: from primary schools through to universities, welfare, healthcare,
      Kāinga Ora, Mana o te Wai, and many others.
      The reason, the motivation, for this totally escapes me.
      But the Maori Party could walk a very narrow fence line between nullifying this or deflecting attention from the inroads in public services – not the sharp end of politics, but government in actual practice.
      
      “There is NO argument that they are not represented in our Parliament”, and beyond that are, for some seemingly unfathomable reason, better represented in the government services themselves.
      
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      October 5, 2026 9:08am
      - mike
        
        What does ‘pro-Māori’ even mean?
        
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        October 5, 2026 9:42am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        It means Mike, championing and stereotyping (as either super dooper special, or as victims) one racial heritage grouping over others. In this case the (part)Maori in NZ. Which fits the dictionary definition of racism. Hope this helps.
        
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        October 6, 2026 5:27pm
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    So when they create disproportionate representation they are not serving their constitutional purpose!
    
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    October 5, 2026 9:15am
    - mike
      
      How is representation disproportionate?
      
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      October 5, 2026 9:42am
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        When the proportion of representatives exceeds the portion of voters in those electorates then that is disproportionate representation. The TPM decision to put up 1 list MP maximises their proportion of parliament and means they will be disproportionately represented if they win more electoral seats than their party vote. They are openly campaigning on this strategy.
        
        How do you view this undemocratic situation?
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:02am
      - RoboRob
        
        It is very easy to win an electorate seat when only specific kinds of voters are allowed in the electorate. Thats rigging the outcome, the same as if there were vegan electorates where you would always have the vegan party winning*
        
        *Yes I know Labour and TPM share these seats but in reality there is no difference between TPM and the Maori caucus, they are all related and mates. The Maori caucus operates as a Maori party within Labour.
        
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        October 5, 2026 10:06am
      - rouppe
        
        Because there are two overlapping electorates in any given place, one of which restricts entry by race. That alone is a distortion, resulting in disproportionate representation.
        
        Because it takes fewer votes to elect a candidate in a Maori seat, than a candidate in a general seat.
        
        It’s electoral MAPAS
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:40pm
  - Damocles11
    
    So you think race is the most important characteristic of a New Zealander do you Mike, rather than being a citizen of this country?
    As a citizen, we are all guaranteed representation regardless of our race, via our votes. We can be Chinese, Indian, Maori, Samoan, Japanese (etc) ethnicity and we all get representation via our democratic votes.
    
    [Mod – debate the topic, not the person]
    
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    October 5, 2026 9:15am
    - mike
      
      No, but what’s that got to do with the topic?
      
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      October 5, 2026 12:01pm
  - rouppe
    
    We don’t have a constitution, Mike.
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:29pm
    - kowtow
      
      We do.
      
      Only it’s not in one single document .
      
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      October 5, 2026 2:30pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Mike, baseless rubbish. Racism is harmful and creates division and disunity. Everyone alive today was born into the modern world and chooses to enjoy the modern systems, products and conveniences of the modern world. There is no rational reason for race based seats to exist in this day and age.
    MMP provides all the representation needed and this is proven by the number of (part) Maori in parliament (not that race should matter anyway). Convince me otherwise.
    
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    October 6, 2026 4:58pm
- MCōs
  
  I understand NZ First is opposed to Maori seats or at least have a referendum on the issue, which is somewhat cynical considering they held them all after the 1996 election
  Thirty years is a long time in politics
  Tight five and all that!
  
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  October 5, 2026 12:27pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

RNZ reports that a Marlborough iwi are taking back a feather cloak from the Pitt-Rivers museum in Oxford. The cloak was given to a British doctor in the 19th century in return for his medical services, going the extra mile for the local Maoris. His family gave it to the museum.

The report did not say why the iwi felt entitled to take the cloak back. The cloak was not stolen, it was freely given at the time. A gift is a gift, right?

I think that to claim back a gift is mana diminishing for the iwi concerned.

[Mod – include links so people can read the articles]
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October 5, 2026 8:27am
- Ghost
  
  Family have been fighting the museum for it’s return for a long time, and wanted it returned to where it came from.
  
  In 1913, Cleghorn’s relatives took the kahu kiwi to England and loaned it to the University of Oxford’s Pitt Rivers Museum for the exhibition South Seas Curiosities.
  
  However, when World War I started in 1914, the relatives returned to New Zealand in a hurry, leaving the kahu kiwi in the museum’s care and intending to collect it once hostilities had ceased.
  
  In 1920, two years after the war had ended, the relatives were finally able to return to Oxford to retrieve the cloak, only to be told that since it had been left with the museum for more than three years, it now belonged to the museum.
  
  Cleghorn’s great-great-niece, Ann Anderson, 80, of Pukekohe, said the family had “never accepted that” and had spent the last 105 years “trying to get it back”.
  
  Anderson said when the kahu kiwi was finally given back, she wanted it returned to Marlborough ‒ “its nesting place”.
  
  “He was the only European doctor who would treat Māori [in Marlborough], and they would repay him with any small gifts they could.
  “When it comes back, we want Ngāti Rārua involved in the return which I think is what great-uncle George would’ve wanted – he had great affection for them.
  
  Article
  
  Article is paywalled so just put a few relevant bits over
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:44am
  - MCōs
    
    Thank you for a fuller explanation of the situation
    ‘Leaving in the museum’s care’ is not the same as ’gave it to the museum’, which seems to be the basis for it’s return
    It’s a distinction that kids learn from an early age.
    
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    October 5, 2026 10:07am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Good background, thanks. RNZ’s broadcast this morning did not provide this information.
    
    Mod – I did not provide a link since, as far as I can see, RNZ have not yet published the report as a website story.
    
    [Mod – link added ]
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2019054583/kiwi-feather-cloak-returns-to-iwi-after-125-years
    
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    October 5, 2026 10:15am
Tomtoddy

If you need to ruin your day, try reading Verity Johnson on Stuff. She has managed to show how biased they are politically and how empty-headed they are all at the same time. It is pathetic but also dangerous, fostering interest in TOP.
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October 5, 2026 8:33am
- RoboRob
  
  She was biased and empty headed well before she joined Stuff. A little rich kid living in a dream world.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:12am
- Damocles11
  
  She is just awful, and a poor writer. I won’t read her c-rap.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:19am
Master Mariner

I stated to one commenter a week or so ago is One thing ME Suppliers honour existing contracts ( Over decades) rather than “Whims” of European Buyers.
https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Saudi-Arabia-Cuts-Europe-Off-From-October-Crude-as-Gulf-Exports-Surge.html
This is a shimmer of light for NZ.
“The program puts roughly 1 million to 1.5 million bpd of Saudi Gulf exports back into the market—with buyers in China, South Korea, India and Japan, and decidedly not Europe”
Same for Gas Contracts etc.
Meanwhile G7 are in a tight spot.
https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/G7-Moves-to-Release-100-Million-Barrels-to-Counter-Diesel-Crisis.html
So what does trump announce ?
https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Trump-Says-South-Korea-Deal-Includes-84-Billion-US-Oil-Project.html
And the reality ,
“South Korea’s industry ministry said the EOR investment was not included in the strategic investment agreement reached between the two countries. Seoul has asked Washington for clarification, according to Yonhap.”
You really can not make this up ?
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October 5, 2026 8:33am
- RoboRob
  
  I hear reporting, I think it was Hosking, that ME oil exports are majorly up and approaching or exceeding historic norms. It would appear the European oil issue actually more related to a drop in exports from Russia due to Ukrainian attacks rather then the ME.
  
  Also the 100m barrels of reserves announced is ‘funny’. Prices immediately dropped, as you would expect with new supply announced. Except it wasn’t new supply, it was just the remainder of the 400m they had previously announced at the start of the ME war which had not yet been released.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:48am
  - kowtow
    
    Yep , I raised that a short while ago.
    
    I have no issue with Ukr’s tactics .
    
    It’s the msm keeping the narrative endlessly and relentlessly anti American , anti Israel , and anti Trump.
    
    Making them pro Mullah and all their many proxies.
    
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    October 5, 2026 11:12am
    - RoboRob
      
      Yes, if it is true that the drivers of oil shortages are the Russian / Ukraine war we should know that. Our media should cover that. Leaving people thinking it is Trumps Iran conflict if it is not is dishonest and not what we should expect from (at least) the tax payers media outlets.
      
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      October 5, 2026 11:40am
- David George
  
  That was in reference to an $8.4 billion investment in advanced recovery (fracking and CO2 injection mostly) to reinvigorate a South Korean oil and gas deposit. It was not included in the recent strategic agreement because it was already announced back in November last year.
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:25am
- David George
  
  President Trump:
  “All of those countries that can’t get jet fuel because of the Straits of Hormuz, like the United Kingdom, which refused to get involved with the decapitation of Iran, I have a suggestion for you: Number 1, buy from the U.S., we have plenty, and number 2, build up some delayed courage, go to the Strait and just TAKE IT. You’ll have to start learning how to fight for yourself…….”
  
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  October 5, 2026 11:03am
  - kowtow
    
    Not to mention the decommissioned refineries in the UK as well as the outright refusal to aggressively exploit North Sea oil and gas creating a supply problem.
    
    Nut zero.
    
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    October 5, 2026 11:14am
    - RoboRob
      
      I imagine that if the UK increased North sea oil production (if that is even possible), they would be heavily penalised by the EU in the same way as the EU may penalise NZ for even looking for gas.
      
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      October 5, 2026 11:42am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Somehow, you never seem to hear that the Norwegians have been pinged by the EU.
        
        Could be because without Norwegian gas, the EU would be in for a chilly winter.
        
        A bit of hypocrisy goes a long way, over Europe way.
        
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        October 5, 2026 12:41pm
      - AitchW
        
        How did the member states of the EU allow it to be so totally captured by the wet, the woke, and the terminally bewildered?
        My dad used to say the that best thing De Gaulle did for the UK was block it from joining the (then) Common Market. I’m beginning to think he was right!
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:06pm
      - Paulus
        
        Norway are opening up North Sea Oil currently, as far as they are concerned.
        
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        October 5, 2026 1:49pm
Colville

This aint good. But I am assuming its contained or we wouldnt have heard about it till after half the world had got sick…!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world-news/361042374/russian-lab-worker-dies-pneumonia-unknown-origin-after-lab-accident-reports
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October 5, 2026 8:46am
- virtualmark
  
  Must be questions about whether the Russian lab worker died of the good old plague (which originated in marmots in Siberia), or from a Russian bio-engineered version of the plague (which we now know the Russians were developing during the Cold War).
  
  Classical pneumonic plague is treatable with modern day antibiotics, so it seems a little odd someone would die from it in this day and age in a society that has access to antibiotics.
  
  The bio-engineered version is thought not to be treatable that way (ie that’s the difference they engineered in).
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:15am
Ghost

Pretty sure I saw this movie already…

Health authorities in Siberia’s Irkutsk region have placed nearly 200 people under medical observation after a laboratory worker died from plague, according to media reports and a statement by a regional leader Friday.

Article
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October 5, 2026 8:50am
- rangitoto
  
  RuZZia have biolabs. Better invade the place.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:27am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Not much to worry about. Bubonic plague is not highly contagious human to human. It is also easily cured with antibiotics.
  
  It wiped out 25 percent of the European population in the 14th century because people in urban slums were exposed to fleas, which is how it is spread. Also no antibiotics. Obviously.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:35am
  - Ghost
    
    However the reason for the monitoring of the people is because she died of pneumonic plague, which is contagious. At most this will be a short lived local scare
    
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    October 5, 2026 10:00am
Damocles11

The Conservatives in the UK get set to expand childcare giveaways, while Chippy gears up to copy the Starmer / Reeves template.
Our parties just copy what their doppelgängers overseas are doing. 🤦🏻‍♂️
‘The Conservatives have unveiled a proposed £700m childcare giveaway for high earners ahead of their annual conference, saying they would end the “cliff edge” where free entitlement ends at salaries above £100,000.
Under the current system, put in place under Rishi Sunak’s government, families with young children in England are eligible for 30 hours a week of free childcare, but this cuts off if one parent earns more than £100,000, irrespective of another parent’s salary.’
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October 5, 2026 9:27am
RoboRob

What do people think of Acts Kiwisaver policy?

I have always wanted KS to be taxed less, my preference was that contributions are not taxed, but Acts changes are even bigger. I had always assumed that removing tax of KS earnings was too ‘expensive’, in that the governments tax take would drop significantly. I am surprised that it ‘only’ would cost about $2.6b.

It seems to me that NZ parties have always desired large KS investments as that would also drive additional tax take. It is certainly bold to propose removing the tax. I imagine most other parties would oppose this.
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October 5, 2026 9:28am
- imalwaysright
  
  “…in that the governments tax take would drop significantly.”
  
  Every Government is a spendthrift, why would reducing their ‘income’ be bad?
  
  Every dollar they take from us is turned into 50 cents, if we are lucky.
  
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  October 5, 2026 9:37am
- virtualmark
  
  It will be a trade-off between tax revenue vs lower future burden on the public purse vs potentially higher medium-term economic growth vs introducing some distortions into the tax system (ie higher income earners reducing effective tax rates by over-donating to KiwiSaver).
  
  Would be interesting to see if ACT have any economic analysis of those things.
  
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  October 5, 2026 10:18am
- greybeard
  
  Don’t forget that at the same time the Govt contributions to KS will be stopped, to offset the reduced tax take.
  
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  October 5, 2026 11:48am
Damocles11

‘All reports done prior to the year 2000 by the Waitangi Tribunal stated that Maori did cede sovereignty:
“S𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐞𝐢𝐠𝐧𝐭𝐲 𝐰𝐚𝐬 𝐜𝐞𝐝𝐞𝐝 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐟𝐢𝐫𝐬𝐭 𝐚𝐫𝐭𝐢𝐜𝐥𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐐𝐮𝐞𝐞𝐧 𝐨𝐟 𝐄𝐧𝐠𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝” and that “𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐚 𝐝𝐨𝐞𝐬 𝐧𝐨𝐭 𝐫𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐫 “𝐭𝐨 𝐚 𝐬𝐞𝐩𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐬𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐞𝐢𝐠𝐧𝐭𝐲 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐫𝐢𝐛𝐚𝐥 𝐬𝐞𝐥𝐟 𝐦𝐚𝐧𝐚𝐠𝐞𝐦𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐨𝐧 𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐞𝐬 𝐬𝐢𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐚𝐫 𝐭𝐨 𝐰𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐰𝐞 𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐛𝐲 𝐥𝐨𝐜𝐚𝐥 𝐠𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐧𝐦𝐞𝐧𝐭”
(𝐖𝐚𝐢𝐭𝐚𝐧𝐠𝐢 𝐓𝐫𝐢𝐛𝐮𝐧𝐚𝐥, 𝟏𝟗𝟖𝟖, 𝐩. 𝟏𝟖𝟕)’
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October 5, 2026 9:43am
Maggy Wassilieff

My eldest brother turns 80 this month.
He is the longest-lived male in his direct ancestral line (as far as I can tell from records going back 4-5 generations).

I decided to check on the highest age a NZ-born male has reached and realised that at 108 years old Sir Lloyd Geering is still alive, and is NZ’s oldest living male.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lloyd_Geering
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October 5, 2026 10:26am
- Jack5
  
  MW’s … Lloyd Geering is still alive …
  
  Whether he’s an atheist remains contentious , but the fact Sir Lloyd hasn’t been hit by lightning suggests either that he’s right, or that there’s a Supreme Being uninterested in us as individuals.
  
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  October 5, 2026 11:29am
  - Scott
    
    Jack 5 : Or, the phrase that comes to my mind is, “the devil looks after his own”. 😎
    
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    October 5, 2026 11:41am
    - Jethrod
      
      Or as Bill Shakes said
      “Hell is empty and all the devil’s are here.”
      
      The Tempest Act1 Scene 2
      
      Can really fit a lot of instances
      ie… countries, clubs, political parties ….. just endless
      
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      October 5, 2026 3:59pm
      - Scott
        
        Jethrod, quoting Shakespeare. I’m impressed.
        And from The Tempest as well!
        Personal note – back in my Massey days I was in The Tempest. 😎
        
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        October 5, 2026 5:17pm
artemisia

A few strikes current and – likely – upcoming. However their demands are worded they almost always mean unhappy employees asking for more money for themselves or for additional resources.

It’s a global economy nowadays. We are not the only country that can cost effectively make things, grow things, offer services.

Woolworths is moving customer services staff to Australia. A business decision made by a business, the largest private sector employer in NZ. If that business decision works for them, not a good idea to bet against more of the same esp if new costs are added.
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October 5, 2026 10:32am
- Jack5
  
  You can’t reconcile protests about Woolworths consolidating its “customer care” staff in Australia with protests about high supermarket prices. The move’s to cut costs by consolidating.
  
  NZ should ask why we didn’t attract the whole of Woolworths “customer care” staff from Australia to this lower-wage country.
  
  It can’t be merely that Wooworths doesn’t want to piss off Aussie customers with phone talk that includes: “yes, sixty-six dollars six,” followed by “no, I didn’t suggest that price sucks.”
  
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  October 5, 2026 11:05am
  - Taieri
    
    The move’s to cut costs by consolidating.
    ———-
    
    It will not affect prices.
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:30pm
Paulus

Had to go to KMart, Bethlehem, this morning but could not find what I wanted although spent some time as had found on line earlier.
Asked Cashier for help and within a couple of minutes a nice young lady gave me what I wanted albeit from aq huge selection.
I like that kind of shopping !
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October 5, 2026 11:34am
Ghost

No. Just, no. They have no problem finding and buying the land

The Labour Party would require the country’s transport agency to potentially give up surplus land for new petrol stations.

The idea is found is a new policy document released by the Opposition party today, which is aimed in part at improving competition at the petrol pump.

Article
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October 5, 2026 12:17pm
- Ian
  
  That wouldn’t float with the Greens if they get into bed with them. After all, more petrol stations – what? And Hipkins acknowledges cars are a necessity to most Kiwis – the Greens would rather he said that bicycles are a necessity…
  
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  October 5, 2026 12:46pm
  - RoboRob
    
    Yeah the Greens are stupid enough to think that more service stations means an increase in the amount of fuel used. Green logic.
    
    It seems to be a battle on the left to prove who is thicker.
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:31pm
- RoboRob
  
  OMG labour are thick. If there is an issue with competition in the gas station segment its not due to a shortage of service stations. FFS, there are shit loads of service stations, often almost on top of each other.
  
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  October 5, 2026 1:30pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    It is so stupid. If you live in a town bigger than about 2,000 people you are within 10 minutes of a petrol station.
    
    What is remarkable about New Zealand is that we have so many petrol stations, which almost always have petrol available in the most remote corners of an isolated country.
    
    Yet Labour says “Wait we can fix it.” 😳
    
    They would do nothing but f**k things up.
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:39pm
    - kevn
      
      BY… You are a visionary.
      
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      October 5, 2026 7:47pm
  - AitchW
    
    Very true. A small town near where I live has three stations within 100m of each other, with another 500m away and another a couple of Km away.
    Z, BP, and Mobil, and two independents.
    
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    October 5, 2026 4:15pm
  - Ghost
    
    There is no shortage. In the last year ashburton have had 2 self service stations built and a third one is currently under construction. Timaru has 8 self service petrol station. It’s creating a problem to fix that doesn’t exist.
    
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    October 5, 2026 4:30pm
Bobba Fret

So, saying it is Maori land (or even thinking it is Maori land) is like playing a trump card that beats everything, even a court ruling.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/home-property/361041403/former-olympian-refuses-leave-house-despite-court-order
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October 5, 2026 12:17pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  The interesting thing is whether Hill or Iraia whakapapa (ie are related to local iwi) to the land, or whether their claim is simply because they are of Maori descent.
  
  If the latter, the local iwi won’t be too impressed.
  
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  October 5, 2026 12:49pm
  - rouppe
    
    But the local iwi won’t do anything over because any win against “the Crown” is a good win
    
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    October 5, 2026 1:54pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Sigh. Activists are now calling for taxpayers to subsidise sunscreen. Is there no end to some people’s cupidity?

My suggestion is that either you prioritise sunscreen, or don’t go out in the sun, or wear a hat. But, take your hand off my wallet.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/health/1737760/experts-call-for-subsidised-sunscreen-in-effort-to-reduce-skin-cancer-rates
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October 5, 2026 1:03pm
- greybeard
  
  “McNoe said removing GST off sunscreen is something that could be done in New Zealand”.
  Ah, the old myth that removing GST means a lower selling price. How thick can they be: the retailer can set any price they like, and simply make more GP.
  Not to mention the complexity of doing such a useless thing.
  
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  October 5, 2026 1:57pm
- MCōs
  
  Cheaper sunscreen may/may not be an answer, but skin cancer is a huge problem in God’s own country accounting for around 500 deaths and up to 100k cases costing about half a billion dollars a year
  I’ve had two cancers removed; one subsequently requiring a skin graft, which is no small thing
  Grim story
  Is friend of mine from the sixties developed skin cancer on his nose. Instead of conventional treatment he believed he could cure himself with prayer.
  Didn’t work
  By the time he died he had a hole in his face where his nose used to be according to a mutual friend
  https://www.sunsmart.org.nz/skin-cancer/facts-and-figures/
  
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  October 5, 2026 2:57pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  To a degree I agree.
  They should not be subsidised but quality sunscreens are like any medication if prescribed by dermatologists to be worn then they could be funded by pharmac like other medicines.
  True, modern sunscreens are not like Coppertone.
  They are actually designed to use organic chemical filters that intercept incoming UVA/B radiation, turn it into a tiny amount of harmless heat, and release that heat away from the skin. They also include antioxidant technology to neutralise free radicals generated by the sun and environmental pollution and thus stops the sun from triggering abnormal changes in your skin and melanin which causes the cancers.
  
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  October 5, 2026 3:06pm
  - rouppe
    
    Pharmac already has a list as long as your arm for drugs it wants but can’t fund.
    
    We kept loading skills responsibility on schools – drivers licence, how to cook, how to have sex as a 10 year old – and how did that work out.
    
    Just throwing it on pharmac isn’t the answer. The risks are now clear, it’s no longer coconut oil as a tanning aid, deal with it yourself.
    
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    October 5, 2026 7:01pm
- cmm (semi-retired edition)
  
  According to skin cancer foundation:
  “Daily use of broad-spectrum sunscreen reduces the risk of melanoma by 50% and squamous cell carcinoma by 40%.”
  
  So while that would be a dent in the skin cancer cases (assuming everyone used their sunscreen daily and applies it perfectly), it is hardly a complete solution.
  
  Of course activists always call for stuff for “free” or “GST free” or whatever. Mostly this is just to make a noise.
  
  I seriously doubt that adding or removing GST is going to change anyone’s decision to purchase and use sunscreen (or not).
  
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  October 5, 2026 4:08pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/361042477/restaurant-ordered-pay-44k-after-chef-tricked-signing-dismissal-letter
Well, it didn’t take long to find this week’s first instance of “How to rip-off your fellow man”.
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October 5, 2026 2:17pm
rouppe

First time this had happened to me.

Having coffee at an expat group meetup this morning. Talking with a British woman and got to talking about renting out property, as some keep a house and rent it while away.

Renters rights, landlord rights blah blah blah then she goes “Blackrock has bought up large numbers of properties for their property portfolio”. Not sure if that’s true. But then came the clanger.

She asserts corporates have bought the politicians, and they’re all now “owned by the Israelis”. In the UK and the USA. In the USA via APAC.

I say there thinking what is APAC but I think she means “a PAC” as in Political Action Committee or maybe having just looked it up AIPAC as in American Israel Public Affairs Committee.

All very “ATLAS” vibes. Throws out a word but she couldn’t actually decode her own acronym.

I slid out of it saying “I don’t know if I’d ascribe to that as much as you but…” Sip coffee, change the subject…
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October 5, 2026 6:11pm
- Ghost
  
  yes, all NZ politicians are owned by Soda Stream…… Apparently, the Israeli government thought they weren’t worth buying so they gave soda stream full NZ political ownership…… On a positive, the Māori party has used this to their advantage, vote Māori, get a free SodaStream
  
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  October 5, 2026 6:18pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Many many people I come across these days think “the Jews”/”Israel” nefariously control, well pretty much everything in the world puppet-master style. I have a suspicion they have fallen for a lot of rabidly hate-fueled ROP astro-turfing in the comments sections of many influential sites in the last decade or so. Certain large dictatorships appear to be also in on this to promote division and disunity in countries they wish to weaken.
  
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  October 6, 2026 5:06pm

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