TGIF
Just received this e-mal from Ian Wishart:
TGIF EDITION this weekend will be breaking a massive story, implicating two current cabinet ministers and a former Labour cabinet minister, in an unprecedented political scandal.
We have the documents and the bodies. Read the burial notice on the front page of TGIF EDITION, out this weekend, and exclusively available to subscribers via http://www.tgifedition.com
Sounds interesting, to say the least!
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Tags: Ian Wishart, TGIF
October 16th, 2008 at 4:13 pm
I believe the bowl of petunias said it best. “Oh no, not again.”
October 16th, 2008 at 4:13 pm
Interesting Freudian French typo
An E-mal
This is an email that bears bad tidings
October 16th, 2008 at 4:13 pm
Bring it on! Will this flush out any remaining recorded transcripts from the Nat conference?
October 16th, 2008 at 4:27 pm
I do hope it’s not another damp squid.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:32 pm
From the “General Debate” Thread early this morning:
Nomestradamus (1773) Vote: Add rating 4 Subtract rating 0 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 7:49 am
“Goodness, I see Ian Wishart has Labour in his sights again, another scandal apparently:
BREAKING NEWS: TGIF EDITION SCALPS TWO MINISTERS
TGIF EDITION this weekend will be breaking a massive story, implicating two current cabinet ministers and a former Labour cabinet minister, in an unprecedented political scandal.
We have the documents and the bodies. Read the burial notice on the front page of TGIF EDITION, out this weekend, and exclusively available to subscribers….”
October 16th, 2008 at 4:33 pm
Heh – looks like wishart’s set to bring down the corrupt, lersbian comminust cabal …. yet again ….
Oh, and that’s “damp squib” Adolf – you perennial drongo.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
Squib. And we banned ‘em.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
Adolf: by the sounds of No Minister, it won’t be:
“Imagine if it was the biggest political scandal the Clark administration has ever faced, bar none. Well, that’s what Ian told me earlier”
http://nominister.blogspot.com/2008/10/todays-riddle-comes-with-promise.html
October 16th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
Helun was out seen with another man…..
Horomia has given up the pies…
Cullen has stopped being a c##t
There’s my trifecta… now whats it paying
October 16th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
And later on the same general debate thread:
# PhilBest (3057) Vote: Add rating 3 Subtract rating 0 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 11:13 am
Nomestradamus (1773) 3 0 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 7:49 am
“Goodness, I see Ian Wishart has Labour in his sights again, another scandal apparently:
BREAKING NEWS: TGIF EDITION SCALPS TWO MINISTERS
TGIF EDITION this weekend will be breaking a massive story, implicating two current cabinet ministers and a former Labour cabinet minister, in an unprecedented political scandal.
We have the documents and the bodies. Read the burial notice on the front page of TGIF EDITION, out this weekend, and exclusively available to subscribers……”
Thanks for that tip, Nomestradamus. I WONDER if the “Right Wing In Name Only” will blissfully ignore Wishart YET AGAIN regardless; just to show their credentials to the PC Left when it comes to “fundamentalist wingnuts”, never mind if the fundamentalist wingnut is far and away the most effective operator on the Right. It is at least partly thanks to this head-up-the-arse attitude that the Heleban gets away with so much. YES, that’s right, I’m talking about YOU, you know who you are………
October 16th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
I am so excited I had to get me pace maker checked.
Edit – Hi rogered nome I hope you got many Liverpool kisses.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
Hmmm, Looks like all leave has been cancelled by Troll HQ
October 16th, 2008 at 4:44 pm
Cullen has stopped being a c##t
Rest assured you will lose the Trifecta, best stick with the double but even them odss are long.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:45 pm
Ah so good to see the liar Nome back.
At the risk of repeating myself. I have just posted the following at No minister in response to a poster believing it to be the Annette King HBDHB mess.
The problem with Wishart is that he is always on the bus that arrives tomorrow.
We all know that King and her hubby with a few mates took the taxpayers for a fair whack. we also know that Cunliff jumped in and saved her arse. The problem is that the info has been leaked slowly over such a long time that everybody has moved on. It is not a good thing, but has happened. So if this is the big reveal, it wont matter what proof he has, the train has gone. And in the shallow ethic-less wasteland that is NZ politics, last weeks rape was simply a misunderstanding between a consenting adult and his underage charge.
Bok
October 16th, 2008 at 4:46 pm
According to No Minister:
“Imagine if it was the biggest political scandal the Clark administration has ever faced, bar none. Well, that’s what Ian told me earlier today.”
October 16th, 2008 at 4:48 pm
This is all very well but if after asking me to pay for another month’s sub, he then goes and sends out FREE copies to all and sundry, I’ll be so DamnedAngry!
October 16th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
ANd will this have a pathway in to the MSM in time to do any good? I hope so. Will a precis be placed on here DPF?
October 16th, 2008 at 4:51 pm
HA ! This MUST be serious, the 9th floor has even got the Grandmaster of Trolling back on here after a long absence……RogerNome……..welcome back….NOT…….but we couldn’t have wished for a better time to meet up again….HA HA HA……..
October 16th, 2008 at 4:54 pm
Rogernome you really are an ignorant jerk. Do try to keep up.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:55 pm
I am a great believer in political, sexual and religious freedom. And I have to say that I totally dislike the whole attitude islam has to any-one that says anything bad about their religion. But it pisses me off when christians has this stupid idea that the way they bring religion into politics is different from islam. Philbest, Wishart is a good journalist. He is the best investigative journalist around at the moment, but he is a fundamentalist christian. And that will always make his work less important to any-one other than christians. I cannot ever accept his thoughts or writings as unbiased, because he states his beliefs as his driving force. Therefor, his opinions is clouded as far as 90% of the world is concerned. Just because a muslim believes that females are property, does not make them property, just as much what christians believe is only relevant to them.
October 16th, 2008 at 4:56 pm
Hey Bok, that’s unbelievable…you’ve already got excuses lined up before you even know what the revelations are, and even worse you even throw in a RAPE of a MINOR as though it would be of no great consequence in today’s politics???
You Labour fuckwits really take the cake!
Obviously been rubbing shoulders or something worse, with your Green buddies for too long.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:01 pm
Here’s HOPING, Right OfWayIsWayOfRight……..at least DPF is on the case, SO FAR. He’s been far too ready to disown Wishart in the past, (christian fundy wingnutter, you know what I mean), he’ll even drop this like a hot potato if it involves anything too offside with the political correctness Gestapo.
But here’s hoping the MSM are losing their power to just bury anything that doesn’t fit their leftwing narrative…….I read a very good article once that said that the MSM in the USA lost that power in the year 2000, thanks to Matt Drudge, and the Pajamas Media crowd, and a few other blogs with clout. I still think they will prevail in the case of the truth about Barack Obama, even though the New York Times and CBS and all the rest of them are conducting a massive “Operation Whitewash”.
NZ is still behind the US situation, though, in terms of ability to keep our MSM honest. Let’s make 2008 OUR equivalent to “the year the US MSM lost it”……..eh, David P. “NZ’s Matt Drudge” Farrar?
October 16th, 2008 at 5:06 pm
DamnedAngry
I suggest you have a look through the comments here and you will find that I am in fact an National/Act supporter you dickhead. The great thing about being on the blue side of the fence is that we are allowed our own opinions. But fair enough. lets just take it a bit further ” worse you even throw in a RAPE of a MINOR as though it would be of no great consequence in today’s politics” It is not. Because Labour made it so by excusing the whole DPB saga. (Feel really stupid yet?) Or maybe the fact that I intimated that how low NZ politics has fallen under a Labour government should have tipped you off? No?
The reason the left has such success is because we on the right are burdened with idiots who jump in feet first without thinking, and then accuse the left of doing the same.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:07 pm
Helen caught blaming that high pitched whining noise on Judith, when in fact it’s poor old Mickey Savage doing 7000RPM in his grave? Well it meets the “two current plus one former” criteria.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Murray: “I believe the bowl of petunias said it best. “Oh no, not again.””
I’m with Murray. Not another overblown, over-hyped pseudo-scandal that turns out to be old news rehashed, a damp squib or, more usually, both.
Criterion, Rex.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Ian Wishart. The most insane person on the face of the planet (and that’s saying something considering we all know D4J)
This is going to be brilliant.
Shut up, shut up, shut up! Sex, sex sex, must get sex into it. Wait,
I see a television commercial-
There’s this nude woman in a bath holding a bit of your string. That’s
great, great, but we need a doctor, got to have a medical opinion.
There’s a nude woman in a bath with a doctor–that’s too sexy. Put an
archbishop there watching them, that’ll take the curse off it. Now, we
need children and animals.
There’s two kids admiring the string, and a dog admiring the archbishop
who’s blessing the string. Uhh…international flavor’s missing…make the
archbishop Greek Orthodox. Why not Archbishop Macarios? No, no, he’s
dead… nevermind, we’ll get his brother, it’ll be cheaper… So, there’s
this nude woman….
October 16th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
Okay Bok, I read your comments out of context so my apologies, but I do get DamnedAngry pretty easily, especially when I detect any postings from possible commies spewing crap
BTW I don’t have any problems with Ian being a fundamentalist christian…IMHO we need more of them than the family destroying commie bunch we’re currently saddled with!
October 16th, 2008 at 5:18 pm
AH, “bok”, I WELCOME the opportunity to discuss the secular liberal attitude to Christianity and Islam with someone on this blog.
Consider: nations with a christian background: the rule of law, prosperity, growth, conditions for business, trust, honesty, fairness, respect for authorities, social order, charity, schools, hospitals, responsibility, providing for future generations …….
direction of net migration; INBOUND, in the millions.
Nations from the Islamic background: poverty, nepotism, exploitation, fatalism, despotism, slavery, women men’s property, backwardness, susceptibility to conspiracy theories and mob hysteria, economic malaise……..direction of net migration, OUTBOUND, in the millions, INTO Christendom.
And our secular leftists say that Fundamental Christianity has NOTHING to bring to the table in its favour? BAH. Our secular leftists say Christianity is merely one culture among many equally valid cultures? BAH. Is secularisation itself “merely one valid culture among many equals”? Not where our secular liberals are concerned.
But let’s toss their relativism out the window, besides comparing Christianity and other ancient cultures, let’s throw in a comparison of what THEIR secular “culture” has done and is doing for our society and our economy, shall we? Because, make no mistake, the “equality of cultures” thing does not apply to them, their culture trumps all others in terms of the validity IT demands be accepted. So…….family breakdown…..social breakdown…..crime…….moral hazard…….economic disincentives, followed by loss of growth……..
shall I go on?
October 16th, 2008 at 5:19 pm
And as I was writing my comment, who turns up but that Tazerphobic Greenie twat Paul!
I believe he’s just helped me prove my point…
Oh and what you just said PhilBest!!!
October 16th, 2008 at 5:23 pm
Is this the biggest most unprecendented political scandal since the last one?
October 16th, 2008 at 5:38 pm
Bok said:
“But it pisses me off when christians has this stupid idea that the way they bring religion into politics is different from islam.”
It is different. Generally speaking Christians do not engage today in things like suicide bombing. Christians in the west especially engage in political activity through democratic means, which is their right.
The argument that “religion must be kept out of politics” is meaningless and hypocritical. A religion is simply an overarching worldview. Everyone has a worldview, even if they do not recognise it, therefore everyone brings their religious views into politics. Some of the most fanatically religious people In have met are the secular followers of Helen Clark on the left, and the secular followers of Ayn Rand on the right.
Ian Wishart is an evangelical Christian, not a fundamentalist. Contrary to Helen Clark, Sue Bradford and the secular MSM, they are not the same thing.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:52 pm
“Ian Wishart. The most insane person on the face of the planet (and that’s saying something considering we all know D4J) ”
This twisted jerk Paul was a teacher? What a weirdo creep he is.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
I’ve scooped Wishart (and that’s saying something)
http://concernedoflinwood.wordpress.com/2008/10/16/hold-the-press-the-insane-ian-wishart-is-going-to-reveal-all/
Evil teachers – there ought to be a law!!!
notice how they get under your bed, they infest every corner of society. I hear there’s even been a sighting of a teacher in Epsom.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:02 pm
“Ian Wishart is an ….” Unpublishable sorry
October 16th, 2008 at 6:03 pm
Thanks, guys. Let’s continue the theme, I’m “damned angry”, too, I’ve had enough, but because I’m a Christian, I’m not going to go out and blow up some secular atheists.
Who will make the best leader of society: Someone who believes in a “higher authority” to whom they are answerable, or someone who thinks “nothing’s out there”, if no human sees what I’m up to, I’ve got no reason to worry?
Someone who believes in the sanctity of the life of a human foetus, or someone who believes in the sanctity of life of whales, polar bears, snails, trees, and “biodiversity”?
Someone who believes that babies born into the world are a gift from God, deserving the nurture of a dedicated mother and a dedicated father; or someone who believes that “sexual liberation” is everything and that babies can be perfectly adequately reared into functional contributing adults, by the State?
Someone who believes that there IS “true” and “false” about an issue, or someone who subscribes to the theory that we are all entitled to our own notions of “truth”?
Someone who believes we are where we are today, the best off people in the world, because of our “best practice” traditions worked out over centuries; or someone who believes that all cultures have equal validity and we got to where we are by chance and by oppressing and exploiting the rest of the world?
FAAAAAAAAArrrrrrrrrrrr………….and that’s all just off the top of my head. Am I living in some “Matrix” where everybody has taken leave of their SENSES? Are they all MAD? Have the secularists put something in the water that I and only a handful of others are immune to?
October 16th, 2008 at 6:12 pm
How does it go, do unto others…
Will Wishart end up in his own lewd ending?
There’s more to come in this continuing story of a Jurno who’s gone to the dogs..
October 16th, 2008 at 6:15 pm
Bok:
“……The reason the left has such success is because we on the right are burdened with idiots who jump in feet first without thinking, and then accuse the left of doing the same….”
No, it’s because the “right wing” is full of mealy-mouthed appeasers who want to ingratiate themselves with the “progressive” agenda, and who repudiate the most effective operators on their own team. It’s because they’ve fallen for the Left’s successful “divide and conquer” strategy.
It is interesting to see the better intellectuals today, the ones who actually deal in reality rather than with parallel universes of their own imagination, doing lengthy analyses of the situation in which Western society finds itself, and concluding that we need re-Christianising, but almost never daring to say it in those words. For example, Francis Fukuyama, in “The Great Disruption”, Edward Skidelsky in “The Return Of Goodness”, or Jurgen Habermas in “Christianity and Liberalism”. Even if they believe it, they know their careers would be over if they dared to say it. Just as no main party political candidate these days dares to say they even believe in God. Although it is part of a wonderful “representative” government if we have Gaia worshippers and Rastas and a token Muslim and people who believe in Taniwha included in it. BAH.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:16 pm
It doesn’t take belief in a creator spirit to make a decent human being. Let’s not start that sort of thing please, Phil!
(Someone else might just as well say: Wouldn’t a leader who is a believer be more inclined to just hand the controls over to god, when the shit hits the fan, than a non-believer who has no faith that there is a big guy up there keeping an eye on things, and who therefore is more aware that the buck stops with him/her and his/her own deeds??)
(Based on a “true story” I heard about a floatplane pilot who admitted in later life that he tended to “hand the stick over to God” on odd occasions when it got really bumpy!)
October 16th, 2008 at 6:16 pm
Haha – told you Paul had a bee in his bonnet, change that I meant a wasp in his head. May God have mercy on him.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:18 pm
“But it pisses me off when christians has this stupid idea that the way they bring religion into politics is different from islam. Philbest, Wishart is a good journalist. He is the best investigative journalist around at the moment, but he is a fundamentalist christian. And that will always make his work less important to any-one other than christians. I cannot ever accept his thoughts or writings as unbiased, because he states his beliefs as his driving force.”
Well bok, perhaps you could tell this evangelical christian exactly how you would implement this partial revocation of citizenship based on belief.
How could it be done? Oh…I know, anyone who believes in anything other than what a panel of esteemed experts has established has to remain silent, no…that wouldn’t work, cause if the experts were atheists that would make us communists, and if they were religious that would make us a theocracy like Iran.
How about everyone who believes in social justice, no, socialism again
Ummm…everyone who believes in anthropogenic global warming…. no, more problems
Just cause christians are honest about their “religion” dosen’t mean they should be denied a voice in politics.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:25 pm
# Paul (1220) Vote: Add rating 0 Subtract rating3 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
“……..Evil teachers – there ought to be a law!!!
….notice how they get under your bed, they infest every corner of society. I hear there’s even been a sighting of a teacher in Epsom……”
Ann Coulter actually devoted a chapter of “Godless” to teachers. She described them as the priests of the church of liberalism. She also pointed out that it is taboo to make any criticism of them in the media, no matter how bad stuff they might be guilty of. Unlike priests in the catholic church, which is of course now considered to be a haven of child molestation on the grounds of a fractional incidence of this crime than what occurs in the teaching profession.
Having got that off my chest, I will give credit where it’s due to good teachers doing a good job in trying conditions; it’s just that hell will freeze over before any secular liberal gives the same credit to good priests doing a good job in trying conditions. Like, can you imagine a good priest doing a good job under trying conditions, in ANY movie produced by Hollywood? Or if there ever is one, will he NOT be outnumbered 100 to one by all the crooked, hypocritical practitioners of the Christian religion cast by Hollywood?
October 16th, 2008 at 6:26 pm
“May God have mercy on him”
I don’t need anyone’s god thanks. When I die there’s a patch of land that’s going to get my body to rot (after all the bits have been donated) and that’s it. Finito – finished – I will be a has been, this parrot is no more, he’s pushing up dasies….
Why I’m Not a Christian, Bertrand Russell, should be essential / core reading for all school kids, that and Monty Python.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:27 pm
RRM (1269) Vote: Add rating 0 Subtract rating 0 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 6:16 pm
“It doesn’t take belief in a creator spirit to make a decent human being. Let’s not start that sort of thing please, Phil!…”
And in a serious crisis, when one is severely tempted to bend the rules, who would YOUR money be on, RRM?
October 16th, 2008 at 6:28 pm
And Paul, “Mere Christianity”, by C.S. Lewis, should LIKEWISE be required reading.
What did he say again; “……the young atheist cannot be too careful what he reads……”?
October 16th, 2008 at 6:28 pm
“(Based on a “true story” I heard about a floatplane pilot who admitted in later life that he tended to “hand the stick over to God” on odd occasions when it got really bumpy!)”
So RRM, are you saying that God saved this fellow on a number of occasions then?
Sounds like trusting his God worked for him, if made it to later life!!!!
October 16th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
Paul,
still finding it hard to put together a rational argument?
So far all you have done on this thread, and mostly on the rest of the blog for that matter, is rant, call names, and spew personal abuse and hatred.
Your a stuck record mate, and like philu, a boring one. I would be happy to debate with you and any other secular liberal-lefty, but in order to do that, you have to actually be capable of stringing together a few sentences that actually amount to a rational argument. So far I have seen nothing to suggest that your capable of that.
What I have seen leads me to seriously think you and philu have psychiatric problems. I mean, why spend all the time you do coming to a blog that you know is right wing and filled with folks who are not going to agree with you, and ranting at people? Really, what exactly do you personally get out of it? Nobody here cares what you think. Your not challenging us in any way. Your hardly likely to make any converts because you just do the blog equivalent of yelling at people and calling them names, which leads to others yelling back at you, meaning nothing of value is achieved.
Life is short mate. You should try filling it with things that actually create value in the world.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:33 pm
Shunda Burunda;
“……Just cause christians are honest about their “religion” doesn’t mean they should be denied a voice in politics……”
ABSOLUTELY. But they ARE. Have you noticed the media trying to trap Nats into admitting they so much as believe in God, and just salivating at the prospect of the holocaust they will put the poor sap through in the event that he’s honest? Why is society NOT sickened at the treatment people like Graeme Lee and Paul Adams and Gordon Copeland have got at the hands of op-ed writers, not to mention George W. Bush and Sarah Palin? Oh, tolerance only applies to everyone BUT Christians, doesn’t it?
October 16th, 2008 at 6:35 pm
I’m afraid that when Ian Wishart talks about scoops I say “Here we go again”.
Wishart’s last book was a disjointed jumble of petty accusations which added up to very little.
I’ve always voted National . I think Wishart does very little to the crusade to get rid of Auntie Helen. It’s more about selling the “Investigate” magazine, which I don’t rate highly.
Heard Wishart talk about US politics, he sprayed around liberally so called facts. In fact most of them were quite wrong.
Remember, he was the man who gave so much credence to Winston over the Winebox.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:36 pm
Anne Coulter – cookoo
You should have seen the liberal shite I was teaching the kids.
Wellington is the Capital of NZ, it sits on a Fault Line (I don’t think the church has plans to disagree with this yet). Also the water cycle, now that’s a doozie. There’s evil secular molecules, and they do evil tricks like transforming to vapour, rise up (mocking Jesus) into the air and form these strange things called clouds (work of the devil they say), and then there’s this evil marxist outfit, they make the clouds rain and drown people on the ground. But wait it doesn’t stop there, there’s the small matter of the sand dunes, moving on their own – who ever hear of such evil. My personal fav was glaciers – Frozen water that actually moves – that’s way to difficult to explain away safely here (wishart might be reading), but Mulder and Scully and a smoking man are involved.
And all this in a Christian Catholic Girls School in wellington, what will they teach them next…
And there’s any fucking reason teachers feel so unappreciated in this country with crack-pots like you guys.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:39 pm
There is a joke that I have told to certain of my fellow Christians because THEY needed it.
A very staunch Christian is stranded on a desert island. A boat comes by and the captain hollers off the bridge, “are you all right, mate?”, and the Christian replies, “yep, God will save me”.
A floatplane lands and the pilot hollers, “are you all right, mate?”, and the Christian replies, “yep, god will save me”.
A helicopter hovers overhead and a loudspeaker hollers, “are you all right, mate?”, and the Christian replies, “yep, god will save me”.
The christian starves to death; and asks St Peter at the pearly gates, “why didn’t God save me?”; and St Peter replies, “He sent you a boat, a plane, and a helicopter……..”
October 16th, 2008 at 6:40 pm
“Why I’m Not a Christian, Bertrand Russell, should be essential / core reading for all school kids, that and Monty Python.”
Nothing anti-Christian about Monty Python. I’m a Christian, and I liked Life of Brian.
I have read Russell’s book, and his arguments are shallow and have been well and truly refuted by others.
I find you “required reading” line interesting. Sounds like biased secular fascism. In other words brainwash the little kiddies, right?
I would be happy for them to read Russell’s book, if they also read C.S. Lewis, and, for a recent example, Timothy Keller’s ‘The Reason for God’.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:41 pm
OK Lee, how does calling teachers “She described them as the priests of the church of liberalism.” be taken as anything as abusive bullshit?
I take the piss out of Dad for so many reasons, where to start.
“psychiatric problems” and you base this on years of experience as a psychologist. Which school of psychology did you go to, I might know some of your colleagues, for my sins some of my friends are shrinks – drink too much red wine.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:41 pm
The fact that Wishart has made his beliefs clear should have no bearing on whether he is accepted as a journalist ….. unless of coarse you are a secular fundmentalist bigot!.
The guy is either telling the truth or he isn’t, the fact that he is a christian should have nothing to do with it.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:43 pm
PAUL; you just said:
“And there’s any fucking reason teachers feel so unappreciated in this country with crack-pots like you guys…..”
I SAID, several minutes before that:
“……..I will give credit where it’s due to good teachers doing a good job in trying conditions; it’s just that hell will freeze over before any secular liberal gives the same credit to good priests doing a good job in trying conditions. Like, can you imagine a good priest doing a good job under trying conditions, in ANY movie produced by Hollywood? Or if there ever is one, will he NOT be outnumbered 100 to one by all the crooked, hypocritical practitioners of the Christian religion cast by Hollywood?”
I rest my case.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Paul (1223) Vote: Add rating 0 Subtract rating1 Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 6:41 pm
“OK Lee, how does calling teachers “She described them as the priests of the church of liberalism.” be taken as anything as abusive bullshit?……”
Ann Coulter is a deeply satirical writer, and in that book, she takes the aspects of religion that are mocked by secular liberals, and does a “send-up” of some particular sector that is dominated by secular liberalism, drawing on the secularists own arguments against religion.
She drives liberals into fits of apoplexy. And being on her side of the fence, she makes me chuckle, just like nasty, nasty anti-christians like Bill Mather doubtless make YOU chuckle.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Paul and philbest
i have nothing against christians. it is just that they are the same as bhudists and muslims and hindus and every other religion that you care to name. Yes i agree that muslims kills in the name of their religion, a bit like the spanish inquisition. The point is not which religion is better. The point is you are asking, like the muslims are, me to believe that they have it on a higher authority, that what you do is right. Now to complicate things even more, I actually believe in a higher authority. i just dont let others tell me what that higher authority is actually saying. My philosophy has always been that if “god” is to busy to speak to me personally, or if “he she or it” needs a translator, then i’ll look for a god that can. “God” speaks to your inner being. about being good to others. Some call him a conscience, some ethics, some a good heart. Some call it the good samaritan.
Philbest – comparing what one religion achieves over another is at best transference, at worst it is dishonest. The worst human injustices was done during the puritan era under the guise of christianity. Witch hunts, slavery, enslavement of people.
Some of the worst abuses in modern times of children, in a society where children should be safe (the western world), was perpetrated in religious orders, schools and institutions.
You see the problem is not religion. religion is good. It provide a common focus, a need to do good. A sense of belonging. The problem is that there is people involved.
Years ago I sat in a church listening to Ian Bilby rip seven cans of shit out of his music pastor for having an affair. And saying that what he did was beyond forgiveness. Only to be found out as having an affair himself. Does this only happen in christianity? No. My point is that it is the people who has screwed the believe system. The same can be said for every other belief system. And yes , I know, now you will have 20 examples of this religion and that doing so much worse. But two wrongs has never made a right. And surely if faith and adherence to the “teachings” is something to go by, those murdering pillocks (and they are) the muslims can teach the christians a thing or two.
RRM is wrong. It actually does take a belief in something bigger to make a decent human being. It is just the bullshit that humans hang around it that destroys the value. I’ll give you an example. Christians believe that Jesus was the full-stop. Why, it is even written that God i the Alpha and the Omega and Jesus is God not so? So why did the chritians buy into the bullshit which is Paul (Or Saul of Tarsus?) What?, god forgot a few things? Jesus was not clear enough? At least the muslims (and they are a horrible lot -anyone who would kill to bring their point across need red hot poker up the… ) stuck to the one set of rules.
So you want an argument, sure we can talk text and verse (seven years at seminary gave me a little bit of an idea), but we will only talk of all man propagated religions on the same level. Dont tell me that you know you are right because of your personal experience, because i will bring muslim, jew and hindu that would say the same.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:48 pm
Yeah well fair enough I guess. I’ll be signing up for 6months after my trial of two moths runs out. You have to admit, it’s pretty darn good journalism. Without getting all socialist – I don’t mind “subsidising” free views if it means the paper stays around. No one else does this stuff.
He’s the best around – period. No need to point out his race, or his religion at all – unless you’re a liberal type who talks the talk, but doesn’t walk the walk. A common affliction it seems.
Unless you’ve forgotten our country was founded on christian principles because that’s what the people brought with them, and unless I’m mistaken didn’t start to go down hill till liberal social policy took hold. I’d far rather drift into the area containing our founding morals and concepts than drift further to the liberal left under the supervision of the Herald “writers”. I am not a christian and I can immediately see when he is using Wishartian Hyperbole, or his standard bias, and can filter it out. It is far less unpleasent filtering his bias than filtering socialist/liberal/communist bias. One is like the sensation of finding a bone in your fish, the other is like drinking a cup of cold sick.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:48 pm
But! But! How does a belief system invalidate a skill? Would it matter if he were atheist, Muslim, Zen Buddhist, or agnostic? Can’t you assess someone’s actions objectively rather than applying a [bigoted?] subjective lense?. I thought you were better than this Bok.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:51 pm
Lee:
“…….I find your (Paul’s) “required reading” line interesting. Sounds like biased secular fascism. In other words brainwash the little kiddies, right?
I would be happy for them to read Russell’s book, if they also read C.S. Lewis, and, for a recent example, Timothy Keller’s ‘The Reason for God’.”
Well said, Lee, and well said about Bertrand Russell too. I recommended “Mere Christianity” by C.S. Lewis just a few comments ago, and noted what he said, “….the young atheist cannot be too careful what he reads….”. You are exactly right, secularism works by fascist control and brainwashing and by denying a forum to counter-arguments.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:55 pm
Jesus, so that’s it – went to seminary school, found some hypocrisy, hasn’t stopped crying since. Grow up, mate, it’s everywhere, in everything. If you were serious about your religion you’d still hold it, regardless of pastors screwing pigs, dogs or choirboys, or anything else. It is after all, all about you, and god, no one else.
Nothing is more boring than hearing a bloke bad mouth a christian because he couldn’t hold onto his religion and has a bone to pick, axe to grind and is generally a big fuckin’ academic know-all compared to the “flaws of religion and the Bible. Boo fuckin’ hoo.
October 16th, 2008 at 6:56 pm
Ah, Bok, you said a lot of sensible things in that 6.47 post. So can YOU not be an honest practitioner of any religious faith; does so much dishonest practice by others give YOU an excuse to reject something sublime, particularly as you can tell what IS honest or dishonest behaviour?
October 16th, 2008 at 7:00 pm
I’m running out of time to address all the points, “Bok”, but:
“…….Philbest – comparing what one religion achieves over another is at best transference, at worst it is dishonest. The worst human injustices was done during the puritan era under the guise of christianity. Witch hunts, slavery, enslavement of people….”
BOK, did Christianity originate slavery, or was it the first religion to include specific condemnation of the inhumane aspects of it? And in the past eras of humanity, was slavery not the norm and was it not quite often the only alternative to death or starvation? Would you rather have been a slave to a Christian who went by the teachings of his religion, or a slave to the Huns, or the Aztecs, or to the Mongols, or to the Muslims?
October 16th, 2008 at 7:03 pm
I would challenge any atheist who claims to be secure on their views and truly open minded to read Timothy Keller’s book. It’s one of the most intellectually articulate defenses of Christianity I have ever read. Keller planted a church in one of the most hostile places possible, New York, filled as it is with cynical, liberal and deeply secular people, and has made it one of the most successful mega-churches in the US. Part of his skill is getting beyond the left-right culture war and making his arguments appealing to people across the political spectrum.
I have generally found that many atheists and liberal secularists, who like to claim that they are rational and open minded, are terrified of reading anything which might challenge their worldview.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:05 pm
BOK:
“….I have nothing against christians. it is just that they are the same as bhudists and muslims and hindus and every other religion that you care to name. Yes i agree that muslims kills in the name of their religion, a bit like the spanish inquisition…..”
Do Muslims think that Muslims who kill in the name of their religion, will go to hell? Because Christians think that about “Christians” who kill in the name of THEIR religion.
Was the Spanish inquisition a norm or an aberration?
What countries in the world today, practice religious tolerance; and is there ONE religion that, TO THIS DAY, when it is a nation’s national religion, oppresses, eradicates, and kills off all other religions?
October 16th, 2008 at 7:06 pm
For example Lee , Paul from Linwood as a case study in hatred!
October 16th, 2008 at 7:08 pm
Sorry, got to go now, but there is some very good advice coming from some other Christians here, God bless you all.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:11 pm
No Philbest, it simply clouds what a person says.
Getstaffed it does not make them less skilled. It simply affects the way they think. Let’s take the gay issue. Most of us believe that your sexuality does not make you a good or a bad person. in fact some churches now allow gay preachers. Yet it goes against everything that christians believed for centuries. Now would you , if you were a secular person, put much score about what Whishart (who I still believe to be one of the only competent journos in NZ) has to say on the subject of sexuality? Or would you read a wine review by a muslim journo?
October 16th, 2008 at 7:12 pm
bok,
“You see the problem is not religion. religion is good. It provide a common focus, a need to do good. A sense of belonging. The problem is that there is people involved.”
Then why did you make your post that started this? why not just say you don’t like Wishart instead of throwing all of christendom into it?
News flash: “people” are involved in every ideology that has ever swept this planet, not just religion. And “bad” people have managed to corrupt every “good” idea that humanity has ever come up with.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:15 pm
Shundra
Yo are right. I apologize. It is so way off subject that it’s not funny.
I just replied to a post by Angry, but got carried away.
Apologies all round
October 16th, 2008 at 7:16 pm
Paul,
In response your questions:
“OK Lee, how does calling teachers “She described them as the priests of the church of liberalism.” be taken as anything as abusive bullshit?”
Its an opinion, not abuse. Abuse would be saying something like “all teachers are assholes”. Saying that teachers are often liberal in their views, and that they pass those views on to schoolchildren, is an opinion, not abuse. You seem to have a problem differentiating criticism from abuse.
““psychiatric problems” and you base this on years of experience as a psychologist. Which school of psychology did you go to, I might know some of your colleagues, for my sins some of my friends are shrinks – drink too much red wine.”
I’m just making an observation about the amount of time you spend here given that your talking to people who are never really going to agree with you. I mean seriously, what do you hope to achieve? What do you get out of arguing with people here? And why bother when you clearly take things too personally and get offended all the time? I just think its an interesting activity for you to engage in as often as you do, given that it cannot be very pleasant for you.
In answer to your question, I have had training an basic counselling and Gestalt therapy. But I was being sarcastic with the psychological problem comment, and I’m honestly sorry if it was offensive to you. I’m just curious why someone with your views would come here all the time.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:21 pm
“It actually does take a belief in something bigger to make a decent human being”
and there we have it folks, blanket condemnation of fellow human beings just because they don’t believe in god.
Smug superior complex tosser.
I thought this thread was about the merits of a so called political scandal, but some how the religious have turned it into blanket condemnation of non believers (how very christian of you).
I thought Jesus/God taught you not to judge, only he could judge.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:24 pm
Bok, hitting my thumb with a hammer at age 5 has changed the way I think. The fact that my mother dislikes the sea has had a measurable impact on my life. Seeing a deaf student taunted by a classmate who I previously respected has changed my world view.
So what?
I am 40 something, married, Christian, male, very kiwi, tech brained, humanitarian philanthropist, economically liberal, blue eyed, nasty bump on my left thumb, mountain bike riding person. Is there anything that I should avoid having an opinion on lest you discount that opinion based on your perception of my world view?
October 16th, 2008 at 7:30 pm
“and there we have it folks, blanket condemnation of fellow human beings just because they don’t believe in god.”
Hardly. He’s just pointing out that ALL of us are imperfect and prone to evil thoughts and actions, and therefore need a higher power to overcome our limitations. Thats not a blanket condemnation of those that do not believe in God, its a blanket condemnation of the entire human race. And it is true.
“I thought this thread was about the merits of a so called political scandal, but some how the religious have turned it into blanket condemnation of non believers ”
You and others chose to bring the issue of Wishart’s Christianity up.
“I thought Jesus/God taught you not to judge, only he could judge.”
There was no judgment of others in his statement, only truth.
On the other hand, virtually every post you make, including this one, is filled with bitter hatred and judgment of others. You might want to look at your own heart before attacking others for their imperfections.
October 16th, 2008 at 7:31 pm
jafapete says:
They pulled it down, so I started drinking at the Tramway. But if you’re buying…
October 16th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
“need a higher power to overcome our limitations”
Says who?
I didn’t even mention Whishart’s beliefs, they are of no concern to me.
Ah but then you are assuming that a so called truth can be found in that statement.
I hate no one. I find Dad a filthy bugger (just go through this blog and see his vile crap). The above statement was a judgement of those without a deity in their lives and that is simply not good enough, because you are not to judge me.
Funny isn’t it. Accused of being a vile leftist brainwashing teacher, yet I was the one who taught at a christian school -go figure.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:00 pm
If I was asked to qualify my beliefs, I would describe myself as a semi lapsed quasi-agnostic. I do believe in a higher form of life because I am not prepared to believe that we are the be-all and end all of existence.
I know that there are others who have a far more fervent belief than I will ever have, but I am not prepared to dismiss all that these people say just because I find some or all of their beliefs questionable or ridiculous. Ian Grant is a well known Christian Broadcaster, and has strongly held views and beliefs that don’t sit entirely well with me. But his views on child raising have a lot of relevance in the secular world.
Also I would probably find a lot of what Ian Wishart says to be a bit off. That does not mean that I will ignore him when he is right. As to the possibility that he is right or not, I’m prepared to wait until I have at least read the article in question. Those who prejudge the veracity of an article before having read it, based on nothing more than the supposed beliefs of it’s author, are only guilty of same prejudice they rush to condemn.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:06 pm
Paul,
““need a higher power to overcome our limitations” Says who?”
‘Says who’ is not an argument. But nevertheless I will respond with, God (in Scripture), me and hundreds of millions of other people now and throughout history have come to that conclusion.
Now if you want to seriously debate the point thats fine, but historically your in a tiny minority. That does not automatically mean your wrong of course, but its a little childish to get offended at something the majority of the human race (not just Christians) have found to be self-evident.
“I hate no one.”
Bullshit. Your a human being. All human beings feel hate for others now and then. And your personal abuse of others on this forum are expressions of hate.
“The above statement was a judgement of those without a deity in their lives and that is simply not good enough, because you are not to judge me.”
Firstly, you judge people here all the time, and your doing so right now. So if judgment is “not good enough” then stop doing it yourself before telling others too.
And as I pointed out, he as NOT judging others, merely making an observation about human nature.
So again we get back to your own hypocrisy. You want the right to spew abuse and judgnment at people on this blog who don’t agree with you on any issue or who challenge your views, but then you get offended when others throw it back at you.
If you don’t like it, don’t dish it.
Also, we get back to the issue of why you feel the need to come here in the first place if your going to be offended all the time.
Got an answer for that?
October 16th, 2008 at 8:06 pm
“I find Dad a filthy bugger (just go through this blog and see his vile crap).”
Paul ; if you find me vile then you will be shocked with the news to come.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:11 pm
Dad,
are you talking about the Ian Wishart thing?
October 16th, 2008 at 8:15 pm
I just hope it is not some grubby sexual nonsense that the general public won’t care about.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:15 pm
Well looking at the postings above since about 4.54pm has to be empirical proof positive that the right-wing is intellectually incapable of playing dirty politics – give them a sniff of scandal and corruption and they all launch headlong into a frenzy of …. theology.
Compare this to the mileage the VDS would get out a the shocking revelation that John Key farted in his bathtub back in 1974, and you begin to see where I’m going with this..?
Even if Wishart releases video footage of Helen, Cullen and Cunliffe wearing KKK regalia, surrounded by slaughtered puppies, and wearing bondage-gear, in froint of a ninety-foot burning crucifix, out of their heads on P, you can bet your boots that the world and his wife will spend the day talking on radio live about whether John Key’s ‘credibility’ is threatened because he recently refused to spread his buttocks for for the Maori Party.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:22 pm
I know Wishart has been a bit sparodic. But he has also come out with some fairly devastating stuff. For instance, the John Tamihere interviews as a case in point. I know that he is definiitely not on the PM’s Christmas Card list (if she ever sends them). So, it will be interesting to see what comes out of the wash.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:25 pm
The nastiest, and most angry individual on the NZ blogosphere is redbaiter.
No Christian, no nothing, just a vile persona that never reacts to real criticism.
Autistic or a 9th Floor stooge?
October 16th, 2008 at 8:28 pm
“give them a sniff of scandal and corruption and they all launch headlong into a frenzy of …. theology.”
Personally I was launching into a frenzy of theology + bourbon and coke. The two often seem to go together rather well.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:37 pm
LeeC – we have a sniff, but that’s all we have for now. The point is that too many people discount Wisharts investigative journalism because of their personal dislike of his faith. Strikes me as just a tad subjective. Pointing that out is less to do with theology, and more to do with valuing objectivity.
Bok- Apology accepted. Thanks. Appreciated the discourse. No hard feelings.
October 16th, 2008 at 8:41 pm
Yes, thanks Bok. It shows guts, character and decency to apologize.
Gotta go, Criminal Minds is on.
October 16th, 2008 at 9:07 pm
I’ll believe it when I see it. Wishart has promised before without delivering – but it would certainly be nice to see some dirt thrown back.
October 16th, 2008 at 9:15 pm
We’ll just have to wait till tomorrow night, won’t we.
It could be more about Benson-Dope along with some of his ex buddies and his B&D and SM sessions with Heilen as the Dominatrix – a function she performs admirably (not from experience, mind)
October 16th, 2008 at 10:12 pm
It will be interesting to see what the new information is. It could be a significant spanner in the works for Labour’s campaign.
October 16th, 2008 at 11:31 pm
Paul the dyslexic pesudo intellectual managed to get through a whole thread without mentioning Vancouver and its public transport. Llew enod, Luap. Keep taking the tablets, especially the ones that taste like almonds.
October 17th, 2008 at 12:04 am
Bug, if this scandal doesn’t involve a massive dong, lube, drugs and more than one person in bed I’m going to be pissed off.
“pesudo intellectual” why thank you very much, do I hear someone raise that with “pinko commie bastard” or see me for a “priest of the church of liberalism”.
BTW those attacking my liberal brainwashing, I’d love to know your stance on the hydrological cycle or the tectonic plates or the fluvial and alluvial processes that shape the land, they are all obvious rouses to get the socialist subliminal message in.
Cunning plan I know, after every overhead of the rate of snow melt on a given surface on a glacier, i threw a quick pic of Marx in his undies. Seems geography is up for socialist or conservative interpretation these days.
October 17th, 2008 at 12:17 am
I bet that whatever it is it’ll be nowhere near as damning as anything that pinko Hager reveals, and I bet that it won’t be picked up by the MSM.
October 17th, 2008 at 12:29 am
Well would you pick up anything Wishart’s found, considering there’s probably body fluids and residue illicit substances.
Pinko is a crime now? Round the bastards up, every one of them, what if they get in our schools and brainwash our kids minds with things like geography and science (or a lovely poem or two). There really ought to be a law, and why hasn’t Key proposed one. He’s already made a doozie this week announcing that the super fund should not seek to maximise profits.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:03 am
They’re already in our schools and brainwashing our kids, but not with the picture you try to paint!
Never met one pinko kid during all my years at school in the 60′s, but since the 80′s you can’t turn around without bumping into one! All thanks to commies like you taking over the eductation system as well as parliament.
Thankfully we can start to get some control back in a few weeks time.
October 17th, 2008 at 9:33 am
Are there photo’s of the police dog in the Wishart story or has it’s identity been kept secret ?
October 17th, 2008 at 9:42 am
“commies like you”
Yeah, I’ve been teaching that little known Trotsky styled geography. There’s comrade Geomorphology, foot solider Meteorology and of course bother Periglacial landscapes.
It’s more a systemic version of Autonomism than say your run of the mill, common or garden variety Frankfurt School geography as practised by brother fluvial action.
We’ve always looked at the hydrology cycle with a little scepticism ever since they took up the work of J P Satre – too much existential state changes between liquid, solids and gasses.
October 17th, 2008 at 10:09 am
wow this “Paul” guy is a jerkoff.
October 17th, 2008 at 10:24 am
paul you rock, the rest of you are cute though…like young christian children arguing over whether or not they’ll get into heaven.
October 17th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Anybody know what time TGIF comes out?
October 17th, 2008 at 11:08 am
Yeah, the edge of my seat is getting all worn down.
October 17th, 2008 at 11:11 am
“jerkoff” badge of honour – yeah cheers thanks very much
October 17th, 2008 at 11:13 am
I think it comes out when the moon is rising and the only ones that kill him need a silver bullet, or stake or something along those lines.
October 17th, 2008 at 12:56 pm
Still waiting?
October 17th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
Teaser Ad …
http://briefingroom.typepad.com/the_briefing_room/files/tgifscoop.mp3
Labour association with internation crims who managed to secure NZ passports
October 17th, 2008 at 1:12 pm
Ok, from the sound of it this could be as big as he’s saying, but we need more information. Certainly if two cabinet ministers have ties to an international criminal with Interpol warrants for his arrest, and they facilitated him getting a NZ passport, thats damn serious.
October 17th, 2008 at 1:17 pm
Well he says it’s about passports so that has to be Cosgrove and Cunliffe.
October 17th, 2008 at 1:18 pm
… or (long shot..) Winston?
October 17th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
cool will there be a Neuremberg styled trial. Will cunliffe need to wear silly looking headphones, or just a good lynching by cowards with hoods and horses. All very exciting.
October 17th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
… or (long shot..) Winston?
I hope not – his constituents wouldn’t care. Wishart is very clear in linking this to Labour
October 17th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
RPM, I am with Philbest because humans can’t rule over each other. Look at what is happening in the world. It can’t be done. When I look at Christianity it really isn’t too bad of a deal. It gives solutions, positive solutions. People are lining up to get into Christian Schools in the states because they show more discipline and put more responsibility on to the students. I don’t believe in the primary schools here when police come in to give 6 or 7 year old talking to about how their parents could be criminals if they hit them. This is one example of destroying the family and the family unit is number one. I look at the Hamish who sent the wife of the person who “executed” their 5 children in Penn. a few years back. Talk about guts, mate. They sent her a letter of condolence. They knew she was in as much pain as they were. That says it all to me. IT takes more guts to forgive than to get even or lash out. It is a better way. I am far from the mark, though.
October 17th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
It’s got me intrigued enough to short sell some PM.LABOUR stock over on iPredict.
October 17th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
So intrigued I’ve stumped up $3 for a one month trial. I wait with bated breath.
October 17th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
Larry Williams is interviewing Wishart this afternoon on NewstalkZB.
Thank fuck somebody from the MSM is taking an interest in this story.
October 17th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
Heh! Mind you, I was intrigued by Whaleoil’s hunting trip riddles too and nothing came of them.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:13 pm
Apparently it involves 2 x Cabinets Ministers and 1 x ex-Minister arranging citizenship for c Chinese national with criminal connections, in return for a donation to the Labour Party.
Documents leaked by internal Affairs. The story will be release between 2300 and 2359 tonite. Ministers will be named then.
Hmmm…..Public Servants turning feral.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
A friedn of mine who was seconded from another Govt dept to the Immigration Section of the Labour Dept mentioned to me earlier this year that something would be coming. Unfortunately I couldn’t pin her down as to details.
It has been worth the wait.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:19 pm
Wishart;s on now. The Chinese person has been named on Larry Williams show. His application was supported by a Labour MP and went to two cabinet ministers as due to his background he needed ministerial approval before getting citizenship. one of the Cabinet Ministers knew him personally through involvement in fundraising activity.
He says DOL staff have been leaking and that the person said to them that he was a Labour donor
October 17th, 2008 at 5:20 pm
Get the Liarbour prison cell ready, as Mr China just sentenced Miss Klark into criminal status.
Police should arrest and hold the entire Liarbour Party for interrogation.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Sounds like he can’t definitely tie the donation part back to Labour due to the method of donating not precisely identifying the donors. However, what it appears the documents DO show without doubt sounds serious enough in itself:
1. A very dodgy character applies for citizenship.
2. Internal Affairs warns the government against granting citizenship for these reasons.
3. A minister who knows the character pushes for citizenship anyway.
4. Citizenship is granted.
Even without the rest, this has to raise a lot of serious questions about why the government would press ahead against the advice of its own department, especially when there were very valid concerns about this individual.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:50 pm
Even if it cannot be conclusively proved that he provided a donation in return for help with his citizenship, the mere whiff and accusation that he may have is enough for JK to use this to verbaly beat the crap out of Clark and her ministers. Good timing too.