Carter, Jones and Ririnui

June 14th, 2010 at 8:10 am by David Farrar

Labour leader Phil Goff is moving quickly to deal with the fallout over the spending of some of the party’s former ministers.

Mr Goff returned from a trip to China today and was tonight talking to Shane Jones, Chris Carter and others embroiled in the scandal.

Party sources told NZPA that Mr Goff wasn’t going to wait for Tuesday’s caucus meeting and was likely to announce his decisions around noon tomorrow.

Mr Jones and Mr Carter are almost certain to be demoted and a third, Mita Ririnui, could also go down in the ranks.

Let’s review each of the three.

The decision to demote Chris Carter is an easy one. It was almost inevitable that he would have been demoted in the year end reshuffle anyway, and eas expected to retire at the next election anyway.

The potential danger around Carter is that if he got seriously disgruntled and resigned, he would cause a by-election in Te Atatu – a seat no longer guaranteed to stay with Labour – National narrowly won the party vote in 2008.

A demotion for Shane Jones is more challenging. There is no doubt it has to happen, but Jones was a potential rival to Goff as leader, and is unlikely to remain around for long if he sees himself in for a long spell on the backbenches. Hence he will be told that any demotion is temporary, even though I suspect it will be permanent. What they do not want is Jones resigning and bringing Judith Tizard back on the list.

Mita Ririnui lost his seat in 2005, and was lucky to make it back in 2008 as a List MP. He was also one of those expected to retire in 2011 anyway, so a demotion is no big thing. He wasn’t front bench anyway, and I can’t even recall what portfolio he covers.

Tags: Chris Carter, Mita Ririnui, MPs expenses, Phil Goff, Shane Jones

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40 Responses to “Carter, Jones and Ririnui”

Whaleoil (729) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:19 am
Demotion for an opposition MP is pure bullshit. Their salary and PS trough remains intact. There is zero cost to them.

Tugger Jones and Ririnui are scum List Mps, they should be sacked forthwith.

I couldn’t care less if No Shame Carter resigns and we have a by-election, even the cost of that would be a saving on the total troughing he has caused to feed his flights of fancy.
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Bob (373) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:27 am
I believe Ririnui is the associate Maori affairs cover. In spite of being a National supporter I liked Shane Jones. I thought6 he generally talked sense. I can’t for the life of me understand why people in good positions where reputation is important will allow their private lives to cross their professional lives especially when their private lives are a bit sleazy. Shane must have known that hiring videos on his parliamentary credit card would put his porn viewing on record.
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dimmocrazy (286) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:27 am
While your reasoning is probably correct, it is an abject shame that this type of political arguments are used to balance morally reprehensible conduct, which by itself is probably criminal as well.
The political fall-out should be huge and devastating, but given the short attention span on these matters they’ll likely to get away with it.
High time for much more transparency, like simply putting any and all expense claims online in an easy searchable database, as I’ve argued previously, and as is happening elsewhere, together with an oversight committee comprised of some voters.
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tvb (3,314) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:37 am
Goff simply has to call Carters’ bluff over resigning and demote him hard. And Jones next to him. Jones will just have to work his way back if he can. He is full of bluff and bluster but he has his supporters in the Labour caucus but he also has his enemies. The feminazi axis in that caucus probably loathe him. Mita Rininui is one of the lightweight Labour maori politicians who is on his way out. Nothing more needs to be said about him.
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Rich Prick (1,101) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:39 am
Bring back Judith! What a sorry state of affairs.
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freedom101 (355) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:40 am
Remember that Helen Clark promised a new standard in ministerial behaviour. I hope the administrators at the UN are watching all this and therefore closely examine the expenses claims of both H1 and H2 (no doubt lots of massages, flowers and general high living by gay girls!!). A control freak like Clark must have known all this was going on.
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Monty (868) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:45 am
Shane Jones was one of the very very Labour MPs that could probably equal his current salary in the real world – so may have options and resign. That would ring back judith – oh joy of joys for national.

What I cannot believe is that Anderton is coming out unscathed. The prick should be also demoted right to the back of the House. He is one of the worst troughers. he needs to front up to the media for a grilling and a public explanation.
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Manolo (9,948) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:56 am
Whale is correct: “Demotion for an opposition MP is pure bullshit.” Salary and perks are kept intact.

Carter is unemployable damaged goods and he knows it, so the trougher will accept the demotion and continue living at our expense. Where else would this parasite go?
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slightlyrighty (2,247) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:56 am
Well Monty, you can expect the Progressive leader to give Anderton a damn good grilling. It will probably be over a flash dinner followed by a massage and a taxi ride to see the sights of Wigram.
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stephen (4,063) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:57 am
Shane must have known that hiring videos on his parliamentary credit card would put his porn viewing on record.

If he was aware of that then he is clearly a maniac. I prefer to think he’s just stupid.
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3-coil (1,146) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:58 am
The current furore over the expose of Shane Jones’ ripping off the taxpayer with his personal spending, his pornography addiction etc etc is just the latest addition to the long list of undesirable traits this hypocritical Labour ex-Minister has displayed.

Jones has never apologised for his documented racist comments directed at the National party supporters during the last election. His ego is so inflated he feels accountable to nobody.

The vain racist thieving wanker has more baggage than he has chins (which is no mean feat) but the spineless Goff will still pussyfoot around with a gesture of “demotion” when he should be kicking the useless slob right out of Parliament.
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stephen (4,063) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 8:58 am
That would ring back judith – oh joy of joys for national.

A minor portfolio holder in opposition – why does National care?
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Yvette (2,419) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:05 am
“What they do not want is Jones resigning and bringing Judith Tizard back on the list.”

How has it come about that Tizard entering Parliament from the Labour List would be such a disaster?
• If this is the case, why is she on the List
• Is the List frozen in the form it was presented last election?
• Tizard evidently abused her credit card when in Parliament before. This was not evident when she was put on the List – so can the List not be changed on the grounds of new information?
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David Farrar (1,741) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:12 am
Yvette: The list is frozen.
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tvb (3,314) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:14 am
You might just cover yourself with this post but by repeating the story online you might have brought yourself in the loop. Might be best to take it down. I think Len has a point if the story is false.
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Inventory2 (8,810) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:16 am
@ DPF – has that changed since the Greens pushed people aside to bring Russel Norman in before the 2008 election?

[DPF: Their list did not change. They just bullied people higher than Norman to refuse to accept a seat when offered to them]
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big bruv (11,207) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:25 am
“Yvette: The list is frozen.”

Unless you on the Green party list, that can be rorted as often as they like.
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david (2,305) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 9:37 am
The difference is that a compliant Green on the list was “persuaded” to stand aside to allow Red Russel to take his place.
The question is would Judith be as willing to forgo another round at the trough?

She know she is damaged goods and won’t have a snowball’s chance of getting onto the list at the next election so what has she got to lose by sticking to her list place and having another swipe at taxpayer’s dollars for 18 months.
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Right of way is Way of Right (1,044) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:18 am
If Judith Tizard is the answer,how stupid was the question!
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Christopher Thomson (370) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:24 am
Can someone help me; I’ve come into this world of political blogging quite late and I have never seen an explanation as to why Tizard is so infamous. Can someone list (or link) to previous about her so I can get the perspective please.
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slightlyrighty (2,247) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:25 am
I see Carter is already using his sexuality to paint himself as a victim, referring to people seeing him as a “luxury-loving gay boy”.

Well Chris, I have a newsflash for you. Most New Zealanders probably don’t give a damn about your sex life. Just because you are gay, that is no excuse to misuse taxpayer funds. You won’t be let off because you’re gay, but you will be held accountable to the same standards as others (Except Parekura it seems………)
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Inventory2 (8,810) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:36 am
@ Christopher – where does one start? The fact that Judith Tizard was such a success as Minister for Auckland Issues that the role was disestablished might give you a clue. She was a wonderful patron of the Arts, managing to attend events the length and bredth of the country, often more than once. Are you getting the picture?
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stephen (4,063) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:47 am
Are you getting the picture?

If that’s it I don’t think voters are going to give a toss that she’s number 40-something on the Labour list nor are National going to care that she’s in Parliament – they’ve got bigger fish to fry, surely.

edit: though I guess they might be looking forward to running a pool to see who can be the first to get the word ‘Bollinger’ into a reply to a question she asks
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Inventory2 (8,810) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 10:54 am
Indeed Stephen. Tizard’s list of foibles is lengthy, and the Nats would have much fun at her expense were she to return to the hallowed halls of Parliament. Bottom line; she won’t. Not now; not ever.
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Pete George (17,596) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:09 am
Christopher, understand what sort of political blog this is. It’s DPF’s blog, his posts generally have an obvious and open National slant, with that in mind he’s rightish but reasonably balanced and fair and he’s usually prepared to praise good and slag bad across the spectrum. Understandably he stirs more to the left.

A significant core of posters here claim this as their right wing blog, from moderate to extreme, and follow the right good, left bad rule. Therefore Judith Tizard, being labeled as a leftie, will generally be looked on as all bad (similar to Helen Clark, Michael Cullen, anyone deemed a socialist, leftie etc).

For a sort of factual rundown on Judith Tizard try http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Tizard which implies (to me) unremarkable. Her apparent taste for Bollinger (on her ministerail credit card) suggests more “high life” than “hard yards”.

It’s unlikely Tizard returning would enhance Labour’s re-election prospects.
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Rich Prick (1,101) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:17 am
Christopher, so far as any of us can tell, Judith’s role was that of companion to the ex-PM. It seems to have been a full-time job as she certainly didn’t do much else.
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david (2,305) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:18 am
Nice one Pete “damned with faint praise” indeed
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LiberalismIsASin (257) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:23 am
I object to Chris Carter been labelled a luxury-loving gay boy – he is actually a luxury loving gay old man. Or elderly sodomite, whatever you prefer.

[DPF: 20 demerits for elderly sodomite]
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Pete George (17,596) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:37 am
Christopher, something that can be useful for catching up with the past is Google. Try:

“judith tizard” site:kiwiblog.co.nz
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MT_Tinman (2,228) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:37 am
20 demerits for stating fact seems tough.

Carter or Tizard – what’s the difference?
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lastmanstanding (1,038) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:38 am
Have the press had time to go thru all 7000 pages yet. If not their bound to more to come.
What was the time frame recall 2003 to ?

So unless bang up to date their gonna be more stuff to come. Bet it wont be repeated from now thou. Not for a while until one or more gets sloppy.

I do like the idea above of scanning their claims and putting them on line and also having a Committee of Citizens to examine and rule on marginal claims.

This is real democracy in action and therefore the pollies will run a mile. Dont they hate accountability.
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Redbaiter (13,197) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:41 am
I never shirk from calling a spade a spade. Tizard is a Fabian Communist from a family of Fabian Communists. She’s lazy and untalented and held her position in the Labour party because of her family’s influence and because she was a close personal friend of Helen Klark.

Liberty Scott has quite a good appraisal, although he left out her vicious attack on the internet by way of her attempt to introduce an amendment to the Copyright Act.

http://libertyscott.blogspot.com/2007/11/judith-tizards-eroding-career.html
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Redbaiter (13,197) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:44 am
“20 demerits for stating fact seems tough.”

To some, “elderly” is subjective.
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Murray (8,832) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 11:52 am
Because Tizard is a blithering idiot would seem to be the obvious answer Yvette.
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lastmanstanding (1,038) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 12:13 pm
Flicks just demoted the 3 of them and kicked Jones and Carter off the front bench. Wonder if Carter will chuck his toys and resign. Wouldnt it be great to see Tizard back
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slightlyrighty (2,247) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 12:19 pm
If Carter tossed his toys there would be a by-election, and Tizard would not automatically be back. Still, If such an election took place, and National won the seat, would the next person on the labour list get in to preserve proportionality?
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Chicken Little (774) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
Quote of the day? / Week?

…in Mr Jones’ case that he paid the money back and left the door open to rehabilitation down the track.

Rehabilitation? What does Shane Jones need rehabilitation for? Is there a bigger problem here?
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mavxp (436) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 12:39 pm
I think we should focus on the positives: Nikki Kaye was voted in in Tizards old seat of Auckland Central – the first National MP to do so in 90 years. Tizard was that good(!) – a socially liberal, pro Labour seat voted Conservative. Of course Nikki worked bloody hard by all accounts and is a social liberal herself, but the fact remains that the good people of Auckland Central have already voted on their view of Tizard as their Labour MP.

But returning to topic: If I was Goff I’d sack Carter completely – kick him out of Parliament entirely and make him the scape goat for the publics ire, and in doing so save Jones. In fact Goff should go one step further and recommend Carter’s case be thaken up by the Police to restore credibility to Labour as having principles. Jones should get demotion – pay his dues on the backbenches the rest of this term in Govt. But reassure him that once he has done so he can make a come back. Find positive roles for Jones to work on in the mean time that are genuine good work and not an overly transparent attempt at a PR campaign.
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Right of way is Way of Right (1,044) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
And a quick look at the pay schedules for Labour MP’s shows that the total loss of remuneration for the above 3 MP’s is………

Three fifths of sod all!

The bus ticket wasn’t even wet really!
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side show bob (3,660) Says:
June 14th, 2010 at 1:02 pm
Bring back Judith, unlike the other useless socialist wasters picking their noses while sitting in parliament she at least could knit a mean jumper.
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