General Debate 10 July 2013

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dime

SPC – what does welfare for families cost? what do interest free loans cost?

how much of a bump in tax take from people having more money, spending it, investing it etc.

im not backing the policy, just asking the questions 😀

imho we would be better off with a lower top rate. more money for people like me who actually invest and create jobs..
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July 10, 2013 12:05pm
calendar girl

nasska @ 10:24. As I said in my earlier post, much of what you said at 8:45 was correct. But also a little unbalanced, because it ignored the constraints that NZ imposed on itself by pursuing black & white economic theories of influential but misguided advisers.

Likewise my response may also have been a bit simplistic. One can’t address all the relevant factors and influences in a brief comment like that. My main point was that NZ Inc. did little that was constructive in the 50s, 60s and 70s – before its main export market was eroded seriously – to diversify its economic base and to prepare for inevitable changes to come. Governments on both sides were economically introspective, basking in the “wealth” created by an indulgent and protected export market, and internally applying punitive taxation that stifled true private enterprise.

No one ever prospered by wailing “Woe is me” when confronted by economic and financial challenges. NZ of the period under discussion was certainly a victim of protectionism internationally, but it gave as good as it got in that arena.
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July 10, 2013 12:13pm
Fletch

22 members of the media network Al-Jazeera have quit because of bias in support of the Muslim Brotherhood in news reports.

The news channel Al Jazeera Mubasher Misr saw 22 members of staff resign on Monday in Egypt over what they alleged was coverage that was out of sync with real events in Egypt.

Anchor Karem Mahmoud announced that the staff had resigned in protest against what he called “biased coverage” of the events in Egypt by the Qatari broadcaster.

Mahmoud said that the resignations had been brought about by a perceived lack of commitment and Al Jazeera professionalism in media coverage, adding that “the management in

Doha provokes sedition among the Egyptian people and has an agenda against Egypt and other Arab countries.”

Mahmoud added that the management used to instruct each staff member to favour the Muslim Brotherhood.

He said that “there are instructions to us to telecast certain news”.
Haggag Salama, a correspondent of the network in Luxor, had resigned on Sunday accusing it of “airing lies and misleading viewers”. He announced his resignation in a phone-in interview with Dream 2 channel.
Meanwhile, four Egyptian members of editorial staff at Al Jazeera’s headquarters in Doha resigned in protest against what they termed a “biased editorial policy” pertaining to the events in Egypt, Ala’a Al Aioti, a news producer, told Gulf News by phone.

http://gulfnews.com/news/region/egypt/al-jazeera-staff-resign-after-biased-egypt-coverage-1.1206924
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July 10, 2013 12:18pm
Fletch

Watergate all over again. Texas law offices burgled 3 times and information and laptops stolen that contained information a whistleblower was providing that incriminated the State Dept.

Attorneys for a State Department whistleblower maintain that sensitive information was stolen from their Texas law offices by politically motivated burglars.

Aurelia Fedenisn is a former agent at the State Department’s Office of Inspector General. Last month, she leaked a secret internal memo to CBS News detailing how high-ranking State Department officials pressured agents to cover up allegations of sexual assault and drug use by diplomatic security personnel and at least one ambassador.

During three separate break-ins between the afternoon of June 29 and the early morning of June 30, two unidentified individuals burglarized Schulman & Mathias, the Dallas-based law firm representing Fedenisn. They busted through a conference room wall, pried open a filing cabinet and stole three laptop computers.

They left all other items in the office untouched, including expensive video projection equipment and bars of silver.

LINK

The Obama administration is as corrupt as any/all other corrupt U.S administrations put together.
Meanwhile the ‘Overpasses to Impeach Obama’ movement spreads across the U.S.

http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conservative/2013/07/impeach-obama-overpass-movement-spreads-across-america-2677430.html
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July 10, 2013 12:24pm
lastmanstanding

Seeing as I don’t see anyone else has posted today marks the 46th anniversary of the introduction of decimal currency replacing pounds shillings and pence.
Rob Muldoon was Min of Fin and Keith Holyoake PM.

I well remember the catchy slogan on radio and TV (one channel black and white) ‘The tenth of July (next) this year.

My Dad was a bank manager so it was an important event in our household.

It went off very smoothly with no hiccups given the education campaign had run for a couple of years leading up to the big day.

BTW Australia changed in 1966 and UK in 1971.
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July 10, 2013 12:27pm
publicwatchdog

FYI Kiwibloggers 🙂

___________________________________________________________________________________________

10 July 2013

Councillor Des Morrison,

Please be advised that I will be attending the Auckland Council Regulatory and Bylaws Committee meeting on Wednesday 10 July 2013, at 1.30pm, Auckland Town Hall, and I shall be raising my concerns about the on the ‘Public Safety and Nuisance’ Bylaw, and related matters in Public Forum, for 5 minutes.

I have followed ‘lawful due process’ in my application for ‘speaking rights’, which I believe you are (unlawfully) denying.

I am quite prepared to test this in Court, if you want to try and have me arrested for taking the ‘speaking rights’ which in my considered opinion, you are unlawfully denying me.

If you wish to contact Auckland Central Police to have me (unlawfully) removed – here is their phone number: (09) 302 6400

You could directly contact Auckland Area Commander, Inspector Andrew Coster, if you wish.
(I have already copied him into my previous email correspondence on this matter).

Respectfully, I do recommend that you discuss with other the Mayor and other Councillors, my proven track record in Court, on matters pertaining to Local Government and the democratic/ human rights of citizens, because to date, it arguably
shows that I have a better grasp of the LAW in these matters, than those upon whom Auckland Council appear to be relying for legal counsel?

Please note the latest (UNLAWFUL) violation of the rights of your fellow elected representatives, as reported in today’s NZ Herald, by Bernard Orsman, by unelected senior Auckland Council Officers, (namely, CEO Doug McKay, General Counsel Wendy Brandon, and Chief Planning Officer, Dr Roger Blakeley – who appear to be running Auckland Council as if it were their own private company?)

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10896123

Request to see legal response on new rulebook denied.

Auckland Council’s senior management are refusing to give councillor Sandra Coney access to a legal review of the new planning rulebook for the city.

Ms Coney considers it essential to have access to the review to make good decisions on the rulebook – or Unitary Plan – that sets out more intensified housing to squeeze another one million residents into the city.

The council has undertaken a legal review of the plan, which chief planning officer Dr Roger Blakeley told Ms Coney was very specific and to help staff ensure it was legally correct for formal notification.

She disagreed. “You seem to think you can judge what is necessary for me to govern. This is fundamentally wrong. The legislation charged elected people with the responsibilities and accountability to govern well, not the management,” Ms Coney wrote in an email to Dr Blakeley.

Following a series of emails on the issue, chief executive Doug McKay said last Thursday he, Dr Blakeley and general counsel Wendy Brandon had disagreed with each of Ms Coney’s requests.

He said there was a difference between management and governance “and we have a duty to ensure advice we give is legally and technically accurate”. …..”

_________________________________________________________________________

What a DISGRACE!

Yours sincerely,

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption / anti-privatisation’ campaigner
2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate
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July 10, 2013 12:39pm
Nookin

Are we closer to knowing?

Person A had a bad day in the Court of Appeal when he lost his appeal and the Attorney-General won his cross-appeal in relation to the Rebstock report. The report will be finalised. It will be published. The suppression order continues in the meantime but could be set aside. Hopefully, it will be set aside. Even more interesting would be disclosure of the identity of Person A’s litigation funder.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/8901266/Mfat-leaks-finding-appeal-dismissed
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July 10, 2013 1:16pm
Kea

Fletch , Al-Jazeera is main stream media, though it is a little less pro Obama than Western media. Obama does not need Impeaching, he needs to hang on a dirty length of hemp rope. A brief show trial for his crimes should tick the required boxes. They hung Saddam for less.
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July 10, 2013 1:26pm
cha

National, the party of low taxes…..you’re right.

And Blinglish will be aware that a US court has ruled in favour of revenue gatherers.

http://www.accountingweb.com/article/online-sales-tax-court-decision-could-set-stage-supreme-court-showdown/221508
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July 10, 2013 1:41pm
Pete George

Winston Peters doesn’t appear to be satisfied with my response, and seems to think my lawyer should read his mind.

He has now mentioned defamation vaguely, and not mucking around. Peters vague on defamation.
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July 10, 2013 1:54pm
Judith

Pete George (18,269) Says:
July 10th, 2013 at 1:54 pm
——————————

Pete, I am not a lawyer, but I do wish you would contact one before pulling the tigers whiskers further.

From my meager understanding of defamation laws, anything that is said with the intention encouraging right thinking individuals to think less of a person, can be defamation if untrue.

The argument would probably come about by the amount of alcohol it takes to ‘alter the mind’. In short, (and I’m not defending Winston at all) your statement was in my opinion said in its context to suggest Winston Peters takes illicit drugs. You did not make implicit your statement – i.e. you did not say you meant tobacco and alcohol.

I think the law probably (hopefully someone can tell you) is more about intent rather than fact (i.e. Winston drinks alcohol) so please get some advice – we don’t want to have to bake you fruit cakes with files in them!
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July 10, 2013 2:04pm
dime

PG – im no lawyer either BUT when writing about Psychoactive Substances and then saying that hes been known to use mind altering substances it leads the reader to believe you are talking about drugs.

Not alcohol. drugs. like acid, or E or whatever.

I know you like to worm out of things (“alcohol is a drug”) but from my understanding it comes down to what a normal person would perceive.

the first thing a normal person would think when they read what you wrote was he takes drugs, not drinks alcohol.

but hey, if you wanna risk getting nailed by winnie, go for it.
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July 10, 2013 2:29pm
RightNow

PG – Alcohol is a Psychoactive drug (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychoactive_drug – includes alcohol in the depressants group).
Winston is known to consume it. You have little to worry about.
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July 10, 2013 2:39pm
RightNow

PG:
“Good afternoon

Thank you for your email.

The defamation is clear in the words you used.

If it is not your intention to apologise just say so.

Rt Hon Winston Peters
Leader
New Zealand First”

Send him a picture of himself holding up the NO sign.
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July 10, 2013 2:45pm
Kea

Judith, PG has defamed me too. He reckons I am a rapist, along with everybody else in NZ, but especially me.

It was not until I posted on KB that I knew I was a commie, prog, gay, women hating, rapist, fascist. I had never thought of myself as being that interesting ! 🙂
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July 10, 2013 2:46pm
Judith

Kea (5,842) Says:
July 10th, 2013 at 2:46 pm
————————————-

Just think of the money you can make when you write your autobiography!
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July 10, 2013 2:52pm
Pete George

You’re making things up again Kea. You’re being hypocritical accusing anyone else here of defaming, you often make obviously incorrect accusations.
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July 10, 2013 2:53pm
Manolo

Do not apologise. I repeat, do not apologise to the venal Peters.
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July 10, 2013 2:56pm
dime

“Send him a picture of himself holding up the NO sign.” – BAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA

PG – do you really want court costs etc?

Then again, it could be the making of you as a blogger of the highest order! ride the wave straight into parliament.
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July 10, 2013 3:02pm
Kea

Pete George, bullshit, you have been very nasty to me 🙂

I am on your side regarding Peters. I would add that your comments are unlikely to affect a persons existing view of Peters either way. Personally I think no more, or less, of him after reading your remarks. My personal view (not shared by many) is that freedom of speech should be free, with no exceptions, ever.
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July 10, 2013 3:02pm
Griff

PG.
Its not worth feeding the troll.
He gets off on the attention poor lonely little screen licker.
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July 10, 2013 3:03pm
Pete George

Thanks for the advise (several).

I’m surprised Peters brought up a quip made on an obscure blog post. All he can do is bring it to much wider attention. And if he wants to take some sort of action that highlights the state of his mind when he wrote his column that’s his risk.

Maybe rambling and bizarre is normal for him these days.

I’ve seen far worse written about how he appears when he’s speaking in Parliament, on Whale Oil and on Twitter to a much bigger audience. Maybe he has shut Cam up, haven’t seen it for a while.
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July 10, 2013 3:06pm
Dirty Rat

WHAT ????

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/8900719/Online-shoppers-could-face-tax-bill
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July 10, 2013 3:26pm
RightNow

“All he can do is bring it to much wider attention.”

Possible – he may have triggered the Streisand effect.
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July 10, 2013 3:28pm
Manolo

Yes, more taxes on the way if IRD and the National Party have their way.
Only the hue of red is different: Socialist Labour and today’s National (Labour Lite) are made of the same fabric.
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July 10, 2013 3:29pm
Kea

Griff, you got bail ! welcome back 🙂

Remember the standard conditions no alcohol or drugs… and cannabis is a drug dear Griffy.
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July 10, 2013 3:31pm
Tauhei Notts

Nasska at 11.02.
The most wise comment of the day.
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July 10, 2013 3:39pm
Kea

RightNow, I clicked on your name and it linked to a very interesting TED talk, which I am listening to now. Did you do that on purpose ?
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July 10, 2013 4:09pm
F E Smith

Just a quick stop by to link to a really good article on Swedencare from the Mises Institute. It is written by a Swede in response to an NYT article by a US economics professor praising the system, which was, of course, essentially a call for a single payer system in the US;

Anyway, I would like to quote a longish passage, that explains the issue and has a very good explanation of the benefits of capitalism in the health marketplace with a contrast of the type of bureaucratic system that, for example, NZ has:

Free universal healthcare came about in the 50s as part of the Social Democratic project to create the “People’s Home” (Folkhemmet). This grand effort also included free education on all levels, modern housing for the poor, mandatory government pension plans and more. Let us grant benefit of the doubt and assume that some of its proponents had good intentions; as so often, these intentions paved the road to a hellish destination.

It has taken awhile, but it is now becoming obvious even to the man on the street that every aspect of this project has been a disaster. He may not be able to connect the dots, but he can see that the system is definitely not working as advertised, and it is rapidly deteriorating.

Before the utopian project got under way, Sweden had some of the absolute lowest taxes in the civilized world and, not surprisingly, was ranked at the top in terms of standard of living. The project changed Sweden into a country with the second highest tax rate in the world (Denmark is higher), periods of rampant inflation, and a steadily deteriorating economy.

There is nothing economically mysterious about health care — it is just another service. Like any other it can be plentifully provided on a free market at affordable prices and constantly improving quality. But like everything else, it breaks down when the central planners get their hands on it, which they now have. To claim that the problems are due to a “market failure” in health care is like saying that there was a market failure in Soviet bread production.

Let us look at what happened when health care was provided for free by the Swedish government (i.e., taxpayers). Note that the same economic principles and incentives apply to any service that the government decides to take over and provide for free. The same principles will apply to Obamacare, with some slight variations.

First it was understood in Sweden that free healthcare was only for the poor. It would not affect those who were happy with their existing provider. But when government suddenly offers a free alternative, many will leave their private practitioner in favor of the free goods. The public system will have to be expanded, while the private doctors will lose patients. The private doctors are then forced to either take employment within the public system or leave the profession. The result is one single public healthcare monolith. Can one find economies of scale within its operations, as professor Frank claims? Maybe. But if they exist, they will be dwarfed by the costs and inefficiencies of the bureaucracy that inevitably grows to manage the system.

These results are clearly visible in Sweden. There are very few private practices left. Of the few that are left, most are part of the national insurance system. A huge bureaucracy has been erected to take on all the necessary central planning of public and pseudo-private healthcare.

When Swedes go to the polls every four years, they vote on three levels of government: national, landsting, and kommun. A landsting is a regional mid-level type of government and there are 20 of them. The landstings are almost entirely devoted to managing public healthcare. They are always short on funding and regularly make losses.

The advantage of a free market system, as I am sure the venerable professor Frank knows, is that supply and demand meet to form prices. These prices are signals to the practitioners and tell them what their patients need and value most. If there were a sudden surge in demand for open-heart surgery, the price of that service would, ceteris paribus, rise. The practitioners would be motivated by the rising price to move into fields where they can make higher profits. More doctors would move to provide open-heart surgery, the capacity for open-heart surgery would increase, the increased demand satisfied and the price would drop again. Some people protest and think that it is immoral for doctors to maximize profit and live well on other people’s medical problems. But why is it any more immoral than farmers profiting from peoples’ hunger?

Thus, free-market systems systematically allocate capacity (“supply”) and reallocate it quickly to satisfy patients’ needs (“demand”). Due to competition it has the added advantage of always striving for lower prices and higher quality. This principle is as true for medical services as it is for cell phones or gardening services.

The bureaucracy of a public healthcare system cannot use market prices to allocate resources. It must use some other means. First it will try to plan according to estimated demand. It will try to guess the number of bone fractures, open-heart surgeries and kidney transplants in the coming year. The estimates will invariably be wrong, causing shortages in some places and overcapacity in others — at the same — which translates into human suffering and economic waste.

Without the profit motive, there is no incentive to adapt to reality, to utilize expensive equipment to the optimum capacity, to improve the level of service, or treat patients with dignity. All change will have to be pushed down from the planners above by decree. Doctors and nurses will be frustrated because they are not free to exercise their art to the best of their ability and help people as much as they would like to. Many of the best leave for other fields.

It is impossible to put a number on it, but it is obvious that the level of energy in the medical professions in Sweden is low compared to America. It can be seen on several levels, from doctors and even down to students. An American medical student and friend of mine spent a year at a major Swedish hospital. He was shocked when he realized that students never spent any of their spare time in the operating room; there was no drive to become the best. There are of course enthusiasts who love their work regardless, and do a fantastic job, but the system is not conducive to this attitude.

Planning always fails. The planners come to realize that the market is superior but they will not back off. Rather they will try to mimic a market, using trendy techniques such as “New Public Management,” voucher systems, or healthcare exchanges. The results of these solutions are usually even more disastrous than outright planning. In order to work, they will have to reduce every medical condition to a code, every patient to an ID number, and every procedure to planned (arbitrary) cost and income numbers.

It was recently revealed in one of the major newspapers that doctors were told to prioritize patients based on their value as future taxpayers. Old people naturally have a low future-taxpayer-value, so they naturally became low priority in the machine and less likely to receive proper treatment. In a private healthcare system you can make your own priorities, you can for example sell your house and spend the proceeds on becoming well. In a socialized system somebody else sets the priorities.

As we know, every planner-induced action gives rise to five equal, opposite, and unintended reactions, each of which will be met with yet more planner-induced actions. Eventually you end up with a broken system such as the Swedish one, where service is “free,” but not accessible.

It seems to me that this would equally be applicable to such ideas as a single buyer for electricity.
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July 10, 2013 5:03pm
wreck1080

“An independent investigation will be held into the actions of embattled Christchurch City Council chief executive Tony Marryatt”

What is it about this guy that makes councils want to hire him?

He stuffed Hamilton city with the V8’s, so why on earth did Chch take him on?

You’d seriously need to ask why as it looks really dodgy.

Now, as I expected, he has performed poorly in Chch too. I wonder if he even lives in Chch — I heard he was living in Hamilton and flying to Chch although he may have moved there since then.

I wonder if councils will be lining up to hire him now? I wouldn’t be surprised given history.
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July 10, 2013 5:09pm
publicwatchdog

Hi Kiwibloggers!

FYI 🙂

___________________________________________________________________________________________________

I was (unlawfully) denied ‘speaking rights’ by Auckland Councillor Des Morrison, Chair of the Regulatory and By Laws Committee – so – I stood up on my hind legs (as it were) and TOOK ‘speaking rights’.

In my considered opinion, it was an extremely foolish move by Auckland Councillor Des Morrison, who claimed he was ‘a stickler for process’.

I’m a stickler for LAWFUL due process.

Auckland Council Standing Orders are based upon underpinning legislation. particularly – The Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act 1987.

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1987/0174/latest/DLM122283.html

4 Purposes

The purposes of this Act are—

(a) to provide for the availability to the public of official information held by local authorities, and to promote the open and public transaction of business at meetings of local authorities, in order—

(i) to enable more effective participation by the public in the actions and decisions of local authorities; and

(ii) to promote the accountability of local authority members and officials,—
and thereby to enhance respect for the law and to promote good local government in New Zealand:

(b) to provide for proper access by each person to official information relating to that person:

(c) to protect official information and the deliberations of local authorities to the extent consistent with the public interest and the preservation of personal privacy.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Auckland Council Standing Orders cannot be ‘ultra vires’ this underpinning legislation.

(ultra vires – beyond the legal power or authority of a person or official or body etc; “an ultra vires contract”

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ultra+vires )

Given the proven track record of arguably incompetent legal advice that Auckland Council has been receiving via their General Counsel, Wendy Brandon, on matters pertaining to Local Government and the human/democratic rights of citizens enshrined in the Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act 1987, the Local Government Act 2002, the Local Government (Auckland Council) Act 2009, the NZ Bill of Rights Act 1990, the Human Rights Amendment Act 1993 – in my considered opinion, it would have been sensible for the Regulatory and ByLaws Committee, to listen to what I had to say, for a mere 5 minutes.

As one of the two successful Appellants in the Occupy Auckland vs Auckland Council Appeal, which raised a number of similar legal matters, I have some proven expertise in this area, and was prepared to give my ‘considered opinion’ free of charge. (Situation normal).

Given that Auckland Council has already wasted at least over $200,000 in unnecessary legal expenses pertaining to the (unlawful) eviction of peaceful Occupy Auckland protestors from Aotea Square, by means of an injunction (which was quashed by the ruling of High Court Judge Ellis), surely it would have been simple commonsense to help prevent further potential wastage of Auckland Council public monies, based upon possible incorrect and incompetent legal advice?

http://www.occupyaucklandvsaucklandcouncilappeal.org.nz/?p=130

http://www.occupyaucklandvsaucklandcouncilappeal.org.nz/?p=113

Former Auckland City Councillors have learned that my word is not to be taken lightly, when it comes to defending my lawful rights as a citizen to participatory democracy.

If I am (unlawfully) denied speaking rights, after having applied in a proper way, I will defend these democratic rights, by taking them.

As always, I take full personal responsibility for my actions, which I was and am prepared to take to the point of arrest.

‘Faint heart never won fair go’!

Bugger the ‘Beggar By Law’! (As it were 🙂

‘Her Warship’

Penny Bright

‘Anti-corruption /anti-privatisation’ campaigner
2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate
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July 10, 2013 5:36pm
Left Right and Centre

publicwatchdog 5:36 pm How many votes do you reckon you’ll get?

Yawn…..

Most people think you’re a noisy braindead pain in the arse kook.

So what do you want Govt to own? Everything? Because most things are private eh? Do you want the Govt to own shops and businesses? Because they’re privately owned… and you’re anti-privatisation. I don’t know how many people are actually pro-corruption.
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July 10, 2013 5:50pm
Kea

Still no boyfriend Penny ?

Try this: http://www.findsomeone.co.nz/
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July 10, 2013 5:54pm
Left Right and Centre

lastmanstanding 12:27 pm It’s right up there with Red Nose Day and Athlete’s Foot Week of things I just don’t care much about.
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July 10, 2013 5:55pm
nasska

F E Smith’s link to that interesting article highlights the inefficiencies that always creep into any system run by bureaucrats & politicians.

There is another side to the argument about who pays for medical procedures & how they do it. A fairly good example of privatised medicine is the USA & it is not a good place to get sick.

A friend of mine who hails from a midwestern state & I were discussing medical costs recently. A typical premium for a young, healthy worker would be in the vicinity of $100/week rising steeply as one ages & more so if there is a history of health problems.

His brother owns an independent supermarket employing about 45 people. The wage for a low skilled employee is about $8/hour giving them a yearly income of say $17K. The minimum health insurance premium is $5K.

Small wonder that many US citizens cannot afford medical cover.
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July 10, 2013 5:57pm
Left Right and Centre

Kea 5:54 pm Tent action, Occupy protest. Natural overpowering sex hormone fragrance ‘eau de unwash’.
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July 10, 2013 5:58pm
calendar girl

F E Smith @ 5:03 – thanks for that extract. It should be required reading for every socialist and would-be central planner.
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July 10, 2013 6:03pm
nasska

LR&C

Enjoyed your 3.23 am comment on the Grey Power thread. 🙂
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July 10, 2013 6:04pm
Colville

nasska @ 5.57

My sons prospective father in law is an engineer/manager in a large coal mine in USA. He said that a miner gets around $100K/yr the mine pays around the same (100% of wages) in health/life insurance for a miner.

A miner recently got a payout of $1.3 mil for a broken ankle.

He has worked there for around 20 yrs and has been offered redundancy/retirement, sticking point is that his gold plated health care would run out one year after he leaves.
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July 10, 2013 6:15pm
nasska

Colville

….”a miner gets around $100K/yr the mine pays around the same (100% of wages) in health/life insurance for a miner”….

This is the point that many don’t consider. In a highly unionised work force where the union calls the shots health insurance for the worker & his/her family will be part of the agreement. Likewise where a person’s skills are in high demand health cover is a given as part of the remuneration package.

The premiums are massive…..someone pays for them & it will be the end user. If this puts the company out of business GDP suffers & unemployment rises.

From what I have gathered the insurance paid by hospitals & medical practitioners against medical misadventure is exorbitant too as a direct result of frivolous litigation being rewarded with huge payouts.

Wealthy lawyers & sick citizens…..I wonder if those absolutely opposed to public hospitals & ACC have really done their homework.
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July 10, 2013 6:28pm
Judith

Kea (5,852) Says:
July 10th, 2013 at 5:54 pm
Still no boyfriend Penny ?
——————————-

Now now Kea, that is not politically correct – one cannot discriminate.

That comment should have been ‘still no one, or thing, special’.
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July 10, 2013 6:33pm
Kea

Judith, What ever rings her bell. The poor girl needs some attention from someone/thing 😉
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July 10, 2013 6:48pm
publicwatchdog

Sorry folks – ‘taken’ (as it were 🙂

Thanks for your interest and concern.

Kind regards,

‘Her Warship’

Penny Bright

‘Anti-corruption /anti-privatisation’ campaigner
2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate
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July 10, 2013 6:51pm
Kea

Penny, I need to have a word with that boy. What is his number ? 🙂
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July 10, 2013 6:54pm
Judith

Kea (5,854) Says:
July 10th, 2013 at 6:54 pm
———————————

Kea, stop trying to hit on Penny’s bloke, get your own! 😉
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July 10, 2013 6:59pm
Kea

Peak oil update 🙂

Russia hits a 25-year record for daily oil extraction in June

Rosneft’s aspiration for new records in oil extraction looks logical, as the world’s oil giant has now a number of huge long-term contracts. Starting from July Rosneft needs to supply 8.6 million tonnes annually for the next three years to Polish oil major PKN Orlen, with another 365 million tonnes going to Chinese CNPC between 2014 and 2039.

Russia outpaced Saudi Arabia in terms of oil extraction long ago.
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July 10, 2013 7:16pm
Colville

Which is worse, ignorance or apathy? Who knows? Who cares?
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July 10, 2013 7:20pm
F E Smith

I was going to respond to nasska’s points on health care, but I have just noticed this come through on my rss feed from the NZ Law Society.

Transparency International, an independent anti-corruption organisation, has released the results of its 2013 Global Corruption Barometer. The barometer draws on global surveys of 114,000 respondents in 107 countries. The New Zealand results were gathered in a survey of 1,000 New Zealanders by Colmar Brunton in January-February 2013.

So far so normal, but what interests me are some of the results:

Of the New Zealanders surveyed, 3% reported paying a bribe

Seriously? In my life I have never been asked for or been paid a bribe. 3% of 1000 is 30 people, so that isn’t a miniscule amount of people. Does anyone else here have knowledge of bribery within (I suppose) the public service? I have had a couple of stories from clients, but that is all, and one of those incidents was 50 years ago, so that really can’t count.

This was not as low as Australia and Japan (both 1%)

Which makes me wonder whether they reversed the results, given how corrupt Australia can be!

Global survey participants were asked to rate the perceived level of corruption in a list of 12 institutions. “Political parties” was most chosen, rated first in 51 countries out of the 107 participating. This was the first-equal choice in New Zealand, along with the media (with only four countries – New Zealand, Australia, Egypt and the United Kingdom – selecting this option).

Again, I find this to be counter-intuitive. I often disagree with what political parties have as policies, but I haven’t found much corruption in them, at least in NZ. Now, if you were to talk about NSW Labor, then you would have a point!

Transparency International says of those who completed the New Zealand survey, 46% felt political parties were affected by corruption, 43% felt the media was affected by corruption, 33% felt Parliament was affected by corruption, 24% felt the Police were affected by corruption and 20% felt the judiciary was affected by corruption.

Ok, now I know something is wrong with this survey. I begin to wonder whether the respondents actually know what corruption is. They do realise that it does not mean that the person or group simply makes a decision that you do not agree with, don’t they? Because 20% of people thinking that the judiciary is affected by corruption means that 20% of people have rocks in their head. I also question seriously about the 33% of people who think that Parliament is affected by corruption and the 46% who thought that the media was affected by corruption!!!

Now, I am the first person to think that the media has a left wing bias, but in no way do I think that is corruption.

Does anybody have any explanation other than the respondents must have been the biggest muppets out there?
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July 10, 2013 7:47pm
nasska

Given that Al Gore is in between dreaming up wacky scare-
concepts, he decided to take a sightseeing vacation to
Europe. While visiting England, he is invited to tea
with the Queen.

He asks her what her leadership philosophy is. She says
that it is to surround herself with intelligent people.
He asks how she knows if they’re intelligent.
“I do so by asking them the right questions,” says the Queen.
“Allow me to demonstrate.”

She phones David Cameron and says, “Mr. Cameron. Please
answer this question: “Your mother has a child, and your father
has a child, and this child is not your brother or sister. Who is
it?”

David Cameron responds, “It’s me, ma’am.”

“Correct. Thank you and good-bye, sir,” says the Queen.
She hangs up and says, “Did you get that, Mr. Gore?”

“Yes ma’am. Thanks a lot. I’ll definitely be using that!”

Upon returning home, he decides he’d better put some of his old
friends to the test. He calls Obama and says, “Hi, Barack, I
wonder if you can answer a question for me.”

“Why, of course, Al. What’s on your mind?”

“Uhh, your mother has a child, and your father has a child,
and this child is not your brother or your sister.
Who is it?”

Obama hems and haws and finally asks, “Can I think about it and
get back to you?” Gore agrees, and Obama hangs up.

Obama immediately calls members of his staff, and they puzzle
over the question for several hours, but nobody can come
up with an answer.

Finally, in desperation, Obama calls Stephen Harper in Canada
and explains his problem. “Now look here, your mother has a
child, and your father has a child, and this child is not
your brother or your sister. Who is it?”

Harper answers immediately, “It’s me, of course.”

Much relieved, Obama rushes back to call Gore and exclaims,
“I know the answer, sir! I know who it is! It’s Harper in
Canada!”

And Gore replies in disgust,
“Wrong, it’s David Cameron in England.”
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July 10, 2013 8:00pm
mikenmild

Usually the only people who think the judiciary are corrupt are the those who have had a bad experience in the family court and believe they are being monitored by the SIS for their attempts to expose said corruption. In other words, a very small number.
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July 10, 2013 8:01pm
nasska

F E Smith

….”Does anybody have any explanation other than the respondents must have been the biggest muppets out there?”….

They are completely off this planet….NZ officials, MP’s & public servants are bumbling, time wasting, petty incompetents but certainly not corrupt. I’ve never been asked for, nor have I offered a bribe in any dealings I’ve had with them.
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July 10, 2013 8:04pm
F E Smith

Usually the only people who think the judiciary are corrupt are the those who have had a bad experience in the family court

Or else have just been denied bail!!!! You would be surprised how many complaints are made to the judicial conduct officer about that point.

They are completely off this planet….NZ officials, MP’s & public servants are bumbling, time wasting, petty incompetents but certainly not corrupt. I’ve never been asked for, nor have I offered a bribe in any dealings I’ve had with them.

Yeah, I agree completely, nasska; that matches my experience. Actually, I think that our public service is pretty damn good by comparison with Oz and the UK. Especially the UK. Although we are more talking different levels of incompetence rather than anything positive.

EDIT: That joke is fantastic, by the way.
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July 10, 2013 8:13pm
itstricky

Take ya racist blinkers off…you not seeing things as they actually are..

Having blinkers might be slightly better than being brainwashed into thinking that I am seeing something that is real that is actually something else.

If you stare hard enough your brainwashing will fade, you will pass through The Looking Glass and realise that they are exact opposites to the Mana party; whom you call racist. So, let’s attack racism with racism shall we? Punch for a punch, eye for an eye and all that? Sounds like a great idea cracked open by some of the country’s brightest and best intellects to me. Or, alternatively they could just be a bunch of divisive, whining xenophones. I know which one I chose. You decide yourself but always remember – Occum’s razor applies.
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July 10, 2013 8:30pm
Viking2

The Fence Repair
Three contractors are bidding to fix a broken fence at Government House. One is from Auckland, another is from Wellington, and the third is from Ngaruawhahia.
All three go with an official to examine the fence.
The Auckland contractor takes out a tape measure and does some measuring, then works some figures with a pencil.
“Well,” he says, “I figure the job will run about $900, $400 for materials, $400 for my crew and $100 profit for me.”
The Wellington contractor also does some measuring and figuring, then says, “I can do this job for $700. That’s $300 for materials, $300 for my crew and $100 profit for me.”
The Ngaruawhahia contractor doesn’t measure or figure, but leans over to the government official and whispers, “$2,900.”
The official, incredulous, says, “You didn’t even measure like the other guys. How did you come up with such a high figure?”
The Ngaruawhahia contractor whispers back, “$1000 for me, $1000 for you, and we hire the guy from Auckland to fix the fence.”
“Done!” Replies the government official.
And that, my fellow taxpayers, is how a Government Stimulus plan works – and retains the spirit of the Treaty
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July 10, 2013 8:31pm
nasska

It’s a primary school sex education class & a little girl asks “Teacher, can my Mum get pregnant?” The teacher asks “How old is your mother?” The little girl says “Forty”. The teacher says “Yes, Your mother could get pregnant”. The little girl asks “Can my big sister get pregnant?” The teacher asks “How old is your sister?” The little girl answers “Nineteen”. The teacher says “Oh my yes, your sister certainly could get pregnant”. The little girl asks “Can I get pregnant?” The teacher asks “How old are you?” The little girl says “I’m seven years old”. The teacher says “No, you can’t get pregnant”. The little boy behind the little girl gives her a poke and says “See, I told you we had nothing to worry about”.
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July 10, 2013 8:40pm
graham

F E Smith at 7:47 pm:

Never paid a bribe, never known anyone to pay a bribe, never even thought about it.

My thoughts on what you wrote:

1. Transparency International will, of course, be actively looking for examples of corruption. The problem with people who eagerly and passionately seek for something that they believe to be endemic and have a vested interest in, is that sooner or later they will find “something” that they consider to fit the bill. Or they will exaggerate something beyond all imaginings. Or they will find some aggrieved person who tells them what they want to hear.

2. I agree with your opinion that the respondents simply did not understand EXACTLY what constitutes corruption as such. Some MPs may be dishonest, or nasty, or lazy. Some judges may pass down questionable judgements, or sentences that many people feel is too light. This DOES NOT equal corruption.

3. Without knowing the questions, it can be difficult to know how proper or correct they may be. For example, if you were asked “Do you think that the Police HAVE EVER, IN THEIR ENTIRE HISTORY, been affected by corruption”, someone may honestly and correctly answer “Yes” when what they mean is that they can think of one individual policeman who they think may have been corrupt. Ask the same person “Do you think that corruption is a common problem within the Police?” and they may well respond “No”.
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July 10, 2013 8:43pm
Viking2

Talking about racism.

http://screencast.com/t/k0zjyNtjcf
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July 10, 2013 8:43pm
nasska

And you think you’ve got problems. 🙂

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tj1q7j7kc49dqc1/inco.jpg
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July 10, 2013 8:52pm
F E Smith

graham,

you make some very good comments and I agree with them pretty much completely.

The couple of examples of corruption involving money or goods have been told to me by clients and have involved the Police. I do consider our Police to have an unacknowledged problem with noble cause corruption in that many of them are too ready to commit perjury if they feel they need to in order to assist their case. However, outside of this, and especially when you compare it to what is regularly found to occur in Oz and elsewhere in the world, our cops are for the most part corruption free and I am pleased to be able to say that.

When it comes to other parts of government, I have never come across what I would consider to be corruption (and I suspect I have quite a high standard when it comes to that).

V2, that joke (the first one) is outstanding. Love it.
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July 10, 2013 8:53pm
RightNow

Kea (5,857) @ 4:09 pm

Yes – you can change your link whenever you want using the “Edit my profile” menu in the top right (when you hover over the bit that says Howdy, Kea)
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July 10, 2013 9:02pm
Left Right and Centre

nasska 6:04 pm Thanks boss.

I thoroughly enjoyed not really understanding the history of the farming business market.
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July 10, 2013 9:17pm
OneTrack

Judith – “Where is the honour and the maturity we used to expect from the leaders of our nation?

All we get is sniping, and bullying and dishonesty
”

You have been listening to left-wing politicians too much.
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July 10, 2013 10:29pm
Andronicus

Peter, I think you know exactly what to do with any e-mail from WP. Just make sure you flush afterwards.
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July 10, 2013 11:30pm
Manolo

The corrupt Messiah: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/07/09/196211/linchpin-for-obamas-plan-to-predict.html#.Ud2qqG1YVdk
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July 11, 2013 6:41am