General Debate 14 June 2017

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William of Ockham

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https://www.aps.org/policy/statements/07_1.cfm
American Physical Society (Adopted by Council on November 18, 2007)

Emissions of greenhouse gases [CO2, CH4, N2O] from human activities are changing the atmosphere in ways that affect the Earth’s climate.

The evidence is incontrovertible: Global warming is occurring.

If no mitigating actions are taken, significant disruptions in the Earth’s physical and ecological systems, social systems, security and human health are likely to occur. We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now.

https://www.aps.org/policy/statements/15_3.cfm
(Adopted by Council on November 14, 2015)
Earth’s changing climate is a critical issue and poses the risk of significant environmental, social and economic disruptions around the globe. While natural sources of climate variability are significant, multiple lines of evidence indicate that human influences have had an increasingly dominant effect on global climate warming observed since the mid-twentieth century.

The APS reiterates its 2007 call to support actions that will reduce the emissions, and ultimately the concentration, of greenhouse gases …

Know more than the American Physical Society? Really? Tick right below.

———————————————-

🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
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June 14, 2017 8:01am
- William of Ockham
  
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  Wow! Look at that! 14 delusional deniers in 7 minutes!
  
  Maybe a few sock puppets?
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:08am
  - KevOB
    
    Make it 18.
    You want it cold mate? Where’s the freezing we were promised in the 70’s?
    Why does the IPCC forecasts show the actual data consistently way below even their error bands?
    Where are the mathematicians? Averages of models have no validity. Anyone for forecasting from chaotic systems?
    
    See Willis Eschenbach for his work on the global temperature automatic control system. The science is not settled. If you believe a sociologist’ 97% figure read the actual paper.
    See also the videos of Richard Feynman on the nature of science and how to be a scientist.
    
    The greater cost, the greater the caution required.
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:22am
    - ross411
      
      And what about that Paris climate agreement? It if fulfilled to 100% by the people who signed it, accomplishes an insignificant amount and merely diverts attention from the “problem” and prevent real solutions from being considered instead. That’s assuming the problem is finally defined, which it isn’t, except through virtue signalling and fake news media.
      
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      June 14, 2017 8:46am
      - William of Ockham
        
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        So. You admit you think you know more than the American Physical Society.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:18am
    - William of Ockham
      
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      http://www.amstat.org/asa/files/pdfs/POL-ASAStatementonClimateChange.pdf
      American Statistical Society
      
      IPCC drew in leading experts and assessed the relevant literature in the geosciences and related disciplines as it relates to climate change. The Fourth Assessment Report finds that “Warming of the climate system is unequivocal, as is now evident from observations of increases in global average air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice, and rising mean sea level. … Most of the observed increase in globally averaged temperatures since the mid-20th century is very likely due to the observed increase in anthropogenic greenhouse gas concentrations. … Discernible human influences now extend to other aspects of climate, including ocean warming, continental-average temperatures, temperature extremes, and wind patterns.
      The ASA endorses the IPCC conclusions.
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:22am
      - Peter
        
        William, rather than waste time lecturing people who have also considered the evidence but reached a different conclusion to you, why don’t you move on to actually do something about decreasing the worlds temperature?
        
        I’m sure The Green Party agree with your position but you may have noticed that they aren’t proposing much that will lower the temperature. Like you, they speak all the words, but what hard actions are they undertaking?
        
        If you, and the Green Party are indeed serious, and I believe you are, then now is the time to propose the radical hard medicine as non-negotiable policy. Yes, the voters won’t like being told they will have to pay much more for their petrol, and everything else. Yes, the voters won’t like being told polluting air travel is only for politicians and important people. Yes, they won’t like being told that they will have to significantly reduce their materialist standard of living, but you know that reducing the global temperature by a fraction of a degree over the next 100 years (New Zealand’s contribution) is worth the sacrifice.
        
        So, convince us you’re serious and go lecture your Climate Change party. Convince them to stop pussyfooting around.
        
        Will you?
        
        Are you serious enough, or is it just our attention you crave?
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:39am
    - William of Ockham
      
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      how to be a scientist.
      
      Yeah. The RS, NAS, AAAS, APS, ACS etc etc etc need lessons in science from you.
      
      Think for a minute. Who decides what science is?
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:27am
      - KevOB
        
        Read and re-read Feynman.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:30am
  - Keeping Stock
    
    What happened to “dumb c*unts” William. You appear to have edited that pithy epithet out. 😎
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:26am
    - William of Ockham
      
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      If the cap fits wear it!
      
      Dutch cap, I suppose…
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:16am
  - kowtow
    
    The sock puppets are the “scientists” pumping out shite in order to get ripped off taxpayers money.
    
    Fuck knuckle.
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:53am
    - William of Ockham
      
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      30,000 scientists publishing in climate science and every scientific institution and society on the planet, representing 2,000,000 working research scientists, including dozens of Nobel Laureates.
      
      But you know better? Nah.
      
      You don’t know you don’t know.
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:14am
      - Tarquin North
        
        Every week in India they need to create 10,000 new jobs just to keep pace with their burgeoning population. I’m no scientist but don’t you think this is having a greater effect on things than anything happening here? Better yet, take your self imposed sack cloth and ashes and stop boring us with your dodgy socialist crap.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:22am
      - Peter
        
        The time for talking is over, William. Obviously “the science is settled”, in your view. Climate change is urgent and needs action now.
        
        So why waste time trying to convince upwards of four people who read your posts (I accept that might be a wild over-calculation) and instead use your time to bring down the worlds temperature?
        
        Or are you just hot air?
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:16am
    - Gabby
      
      You’ll never know will you.
      
      Kobknob.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:32am
      - kowtow
        
        Who knows?
        
        Fanny flaps.
        
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        June 14, 2017 12:15pm
- Yvette
  
  Global warming figures have been calculated by Labour
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:33am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    100% credible then, I mean, those guys can really make numbers work! ?
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:48am
- Scott
  
  Speaking of false stories and false narratives, is there any precedent for the false narrative that Trump colluded with the Russians to steal the election from the Democrats? The so-called hearings go on and on and so far not one piece of evidence has come forward that the Trump campaign colluded with the Russians.
  
  Today Jeff Sessions has been questioned about his meetings with the Russian ambassador as if that was somehow unusual or evidence of collusion. In fact the Russian ambassador meets with everybody including high-level Democrats.
  
  The first thing I would recommend is that people understand that there is no evidence of Trump colluding with Russia and this is an entirely fabricated narrative given by the Democrat party to the mainstream media to overturn the result of the election and bring down a democratically elected president.
  
  Secondly I would recommend that the Republicans put on their big boy pants and stop kowtowing to Democrat and mainstream media pressure and end these investigations as soon as possible. They are a distraction from the running of the country and the implementing of the Republican agenda. They should tell the Democrats and the mainstream media to get stuffed and with one voice say there is no collusion and it is all fake news.
  
  Interestingly the only Republican so far to publicly totally get behind Trump is a new GOP chairwoman Ronna McDaniel who on Fox News Sunday said he is our president and we are totally behind him.
  That is great! The only sad note for me is that it takes a Republican call Ronna to get on her big boy pants and get behind Trump. If only the men in the Republican Party could man up and get behind the president. Then we would see much-needed reforms getting done!
  
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  June 14, 2017 10:11am
RalphT

Here we go again.
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June 14, 2017 8:02am
- thedavincimode
  
  I think greater understanding might be called for here. As senility and dementia set in for poor old denis, it’s quite possible that this is a sorry substitute for his morning dump because he’s unable to attend to the real thing without medical intervention.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:51pm
William of Ockham

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https://www.ecowatch.com/solar-tower-power-2440360717.html?utm_source=EcoWatch+List&utm_campaign=d356f0bbca-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_49c7d43dc9-d356f0bbca-86111021
Concentrated Solar Power Works Day and Night With No Batteries

[Dubai] has just announced electricity from a proposed 200 MW CSP project will be priced at 9.45 cents per kWh.

The cost is well above the 3 cents kWh of the cheapest solar PV [photovoltaic], but will run at full power during the night.

CSP has many variations… Two main types use parabolic troughs or mirrors to aim the sunlight at a central tower. [heat storage] sodium nitrate and potassium nitrate heated to 566°C. A heat exchanger produces superheated steam for the turbines.

Dubai plans to reach 1000 megawatts of CSP to boost capacity for its solar park from 1,000 MW [2020] to 5,000 MW by 2030. [Perspective: NZ total installed 10,000 MW]
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June 14, 2017 8:02am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  And again in case we didn’t get the earlier messages or yesterday’s message(s) sigh . . . .
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:08am
  - William of Ockham
    
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    Science advances one funeral at a time – Max Planck
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:15am
    - stephieboy
      
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      Brilliant !
      
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      June 14, 2017 8:45am
      - sooty
        
        And the echo chamber, chimes in!
        
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        June 14, 2017 4:39pm
    - cmm
      
      “Science advances one funeral at a time” – Max Planck
      
      If you are going to use quotes like that, then use them in context.
      
      What he was referring to were people just like the climate scientists who push a narrative that keeps them in prestige, power and gravy and stifle opposing views, despite contradictory evidence.
      
      He first used this term against the people (particularly academics) who opposed quantum physics because it ran counter to everything they’d been writing about in their scientific papers which had built up a consensus.
      
      Right now that consensus is held by the climate scientists who’ve written huge numbers of papers and continue to ignore the holes in their theories.
      
      So if you want to swing Max Planck’s quote around as a weapon, it only has force against the climate science consensus people that you love so much.
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:09am
      - William of Ockham
        
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        More greenhouse gas GHG greater greenhouse effect GHE. Normal Physics.
        
        Why don’t you learn some science instead of spouting nonsense from the crank denier sites?
        
        You a scientist? Don’t make me laugh. Having a science degree doesn’t make you a scientist. Sorry.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:34am
      - William of Ockham
        
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        Science advances on funeral at a time – Planck
        
        Or, you can’t teach old dogs new tricks.
        
        Planck was referring to the difficulty people have changing their minds to accommodate new evidence.
        
        No scientific institution or society on the planet rejects the consensus: human activity is changing the climate, which has been stable since the dawn of civilisation 10,000 years ago. No coincidence.
        
        We’re destabilising the climate and we will pay dearly.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:44am
      - Kimbo
        
        Planck was referring to the difficulty people have changing their minds to accommodate new evidence.
        
        Then quoting Arthur Schopenhauer would have been more effective, indeed precise:
        
        All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:49am
      - Ed Snack
        
        Learn some science WoO. At 280 ppm CO2 absorption bands are saturated, as the concentration increases you get more absorption at the edges and in depth, but NOT linearly.
        
        And that is a simplistic view, there are feedbacks both negative and positive. Absent any feedbacks, the approximate increase in temperature from doubling CO2 is 1 degree. So the feedbacks are critical, and the value and even sign of some feedbacks is not well known.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:05am
      - rightoverlabour
        
        I rather think Max Plank is right. But we can’t wish for misfortune on bloggers here. What I can’t understand is why some people who obviously do a huge amount of research to strengthen their point of view, refuse to consider the alternatives. When I did my MSc 20 years ago I was convinced of the danger of Global Warming. Now I am convinced we don’t have a clue about what is causing climate change. And that is far more worrisome.
        
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        June 14, 2017 12:09pm
- stephieboy
  
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  “Censorship is the child of fear and the father ignorance ”
  
  Laurie Halse Anderson
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:50am
  - Garbageman
    
    “Stooopid is as stooopid does”
    
    everybody on KB
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:46am
duggledog

National is totally exposed on Immigration.

And Seymour needs to pull his head in and stop intimating that opposition to record immigration is a racist thing.

Not all Asians are like Lydia Koh and the nice rich ones in Epsom David.

I think Bill English must call Little and Peters out on the immigration issue and smash it right now, using plain language.

Otherwise they will just keep repeating the line that there are all these unemployed kiwis battling away and having their jobs taken off them by evil foreigners. Fact is, if you are an able bodied, sentient kiwi who can’t find work by now, you never will.

English must reiterate his stance (already on the record) that tens of thousands of young kiwis are just friggin’ useless – and must be replaced by those that will work. The only people he will upset will be the already useless.

BUT more importantly, English must blame the policies that Little and Peters would seek to reintroduce for making people useless in the first place – the no-fault welfare state.

Problem is, National is a fully signed up member.

Cap benefits: Two years eligibility over a lifetime and DPB for the first child only.
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June 14, 2017 8:02am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Very true. The more you do for people, the less they will do for themselves.
  That’s the critical flaw in welfare; it only works properly in a moral society in which there is shame and community push-back against those who choose not to provide for themselves and their family (as is the case in many parts of Asia).
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:10am
  - Reid
    
    Which also used to be the case in the lefty’s “stellar example,” Sweden. Unemployment for able-bodied used to be frowned on by everyone including the individual’s own family.
    
    (Before that country’s social fabric was decimated by the recent invasion.)
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:17am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      Yes. Swedish traditional societal pressure worked well against native Swedes.
      Unfortunately, the Swedes’ herd mentality works against them when their leaders dictate that the immigrants are above criticism.
      One of the key weaknesses of social systems (such as in old Sweden and in Japan) is that social convention is enforced by bullying and the voice of dissent tends to be crushed from within the ranks.
      They tend to listen to outsiders and their leaders, but ignore or drown out the voices of their dissenting peers.
      
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      June 14, 2017 8:24am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    The Swedish model of community self-regulation would only work if:
    – Swedes can criticize non-working immigrants
    – The immigrants understand what the natives Swedes say, and feel a desire to comply
    – The immigrants want to work
    – Swedish businesses can offer jobs to the immigrants which the immigrants want to do
    – Immigrants want to comply with Swedish cultural norms
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:13am
    - Reid
      
      Apologies O-s, I didn’t pick up when I first read it, on the significance of your original reply to my 8.17. Had I done so perhaps useful discussion might have ensued.
      
      Opportunity lost.
      
      My apologies, and thank you for your always constructive comments.
      
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      June 14, 2017 6:40pm
  - VicParking
    
    So right take the following for instance:
    “The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people.
    Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us “Please Do Not Feed the Animals.”
    Their stated reason for the policy is because “The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves.”
    
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    June 14, 2017 11:11am
  - GoVege
    
    The west is rich and the rest are poor because western men know they are supposed to support their wives and children.
    Most other cultures are sexist and their males think women are there to wait on them and take any abuse they choose to inflict.
    This is true of Maori and many cultures we import here.
    That’s why most of our poor are Maori and Polynesian.
    The women don’t like being punch bags, so go on the DPB to escape.
    Far from Pakeha culture exploiting Maori etc, their cultures are often relying on the Pakeha to support their women and children.
    Unfortunately if any politician tries to address this abuse and neglect by males, he is endlessly mocked by the ignorant public who don’t realise he is probably referring mainly to sexist males of other cultures.
    
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    June 14, 2017 12:05pm
- Simon
  
  Immigration is out of control. National have been using immigration to generate Economic growth because the business as usual shit weight of the state is a job killer
  
  All those leased new commercial buildings and soaring demand for housing has helped paper over a chicken shit economy but the effects of over crowding, roads, schools, hospitals and the infrastructure is being felt
  
  It is game over for immigration and National’s mad economic policy
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:13am
  - cmm
    
    There is single thing that is “immigration”.
    
    Bringing in high skill people that build the economy is beneficial because it increases the economy for everyone. They make a bigger pie.
    
    Bringing in third world labouring immigrants (farm workers, petrol station pump-jockeys, …) does not bring value into the economy. They don’t make the pie bigger. Those jobs should be filled by people on the benefit.
    
    If the Kiwis won’t do those jobs then either:
    1) The benefit is too high and is too comfortable to live on so they’d rather not work.
    2) The value they create is so low that it is not worth paying them more.
    
    Either way, reduction in the benefit and low skill migration are both required to fix the problem.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:17am
    - Kimbo
      
      Bringing in high skill people that build the economy is beneficial because it increases the economy for everyone. They make a bigger pie.
      
      If the Kiwis won’t do those jobs then either:
      1) The benefit is too high and is too comfortable to live on so they’d rather not work.
      2) The value they create is so low that it is not worth paying them more.
      
      Either way, reduction in the benefit and low skill migration are both required to fix the problem.
      
      So what is the priority – economic growth in and of itself, irrespective of who benefits,
      
      …or paying people a sufficient wage so that, if they work a full time job, they can avoid poverty, and have sufficient opportunity to improve their lot? It’s the latter value, rejecting the law of the jungle, that distinguishes us from a third world nation.
      
      Supply and demand may be inexorable and inescapable, but it was the development of urban slums as a by-product of the Industrial Revolution (from which New Zealand’s first European inhabitants were fleeing in search of a better life), that means that we created the welfare state and other modifications so “no one should fall through the cracks”. That is an essential part of New Zealand’s cultural, social and political DNA, or at least it has been for over 120 years.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:19am
      - Odakyu-sen
        
        Kimbo,
        “no one should fall through the cracks”
        
        Agreed. No civil society can allow its weakest members to starve on the streets.
        
        And yet, too many wastrels are using the great NZ social safety net as a hammock.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:46am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Odakyu-sen
        
        And yet, too many wastrels are using the great NZ social safety net as a hammock.
        
        Not by the standards by which NZ operated from 1891-1984. Instead, in allowing a “race to the bottom” with wages, and develop economic opportunities, particularly in the provinces or beyond the McJobs of the big cities, our government is failing to protect its own people.
        
        Or didn’t you now, with that paternalistic policy, we used to be one of the richest in the world, and it is at the very least a foundation that formed our present nation – a nation to which some immigrants have now arrived and are grizzling about “bludgers”? Yeah, ok, anyone can suggest improvements including better targetting and implementimg. But if you don’t like our essential commitment to a welfare state…maybe NZ is not the country for you. Perhaps time to move to, say, Bangladesh…
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:56am
      - Ed Snack
        
        Kimbo, that’s a massive non-sequitur. NZ was relatively wealthy in the late 1940’s-early 1950’s for one reason only, external prices for produce were at an all-time high.
        
        With our “paternalistic policies” since then we slipped rapidly down the ranks until 1981 or so. Another nation with less paternalistic but similarly nationalistic policies that slipped down rapidly in the same time frame is Argentina.
        
        And you ignore the significant change in attitudes and the social approval/disapproval afforded welfare from then until now. Welfare worked best when there was a general aversion to taking it unless one had to, so it could be targeted towards widows for example and the chronically unemployable. But most people worked and much preferred work. “Bludgers” no doubt existed (human nature doesn’t change), but the numbers were smaller and social disapproval was strong. Now, social approval of bludging is high in some groups, and as a result the relative number of bludgers is higher.
        
        Similarly the social change around solo-parent families. Back in the 1950’s say, probably the majority form of solo-parent families were widows (or widowers) with dependent children as solo-parenthood was very much frowned upon. Now it can be a lifestyle choice. The numbers aren’t huge but that group exists and is much larger than it used to be.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:16am
      - Kimbo
        
        Kimbo, that’s a massive non-sequitur. NZ was relatively wealthy in the late 1940’s-early 1950’s for one reason only, external prices for produce were at an all-time high
        
        But I wasn't talking just about the 1950s (Korean War wool boom, btw). I said 1891 (the first Liberal government) to 1984 (Muldoon losing the election).
        
        Also, it is not about resources and commodity prices in the long run. Singapore has to import its own water, ffs! Instead it is about human capital…hence allowing large groups to “fall between the cracks” is a failure.
        
        Also, despite your comment about welfare – fair in and of itself, btw, – you forget the most expensive benefit is National Super. Also, governments used to foster regional development for some 100 years. And it was a time of compulsory unionism, tariffs, import protections.
        
        I am not saying they will work again (although Donald Trump seems to imply it! 😉 ), but I do think there is one thing we can do that we did then – do all we can to make our people fit to participate in a 1st world nation.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:26am
      - kowtow
        
        Is the gummint allowing groups to fall through the cracks or have groups allowed themselves to fall through the cracks?
        
        The taxpayer pumps vast quantities of money into education ,housing , health etc so people can get an education ,have a roof over their heads and yet ther left have moved the goal posts away from “equality of opportunity” (which is what all this spending is aimed at producing) to equality of outcome , which if one was cynical would mean we should all be at home sniffing petrol and blowing ourselves up ,instead of being at school and learning to become a useful , future , productive citizen.
        
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        June 14, 2017 12:31pm
      - cmm
        
        No, of course growing the economy is not the most important thing there is. The economy serves the people, not the people serving the economy.
        
        The role of the economy is to create the value (ie. the wealth and resources) that the people want (or at least need).
        
        It is really easy to create work, but much harder to create value.
        
        For example we could decide to ban all earthmoving equipment and only build roads with people using shovels and wheelbarrows (or better yet, buckets and teaspoons).
        
        We could also ban imports of TVs and cars etc and require those all be built here, but that would end up in shitty products that nobody would want (or could afford).
        
        So we need to focus on improving value. Value primarily comes from intelligent people conducting the use of resources.
        
        ie. If you want to increase value then you need to increase the amount of intelligent people. Just adding more low-intelligence people does not help.
        
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        June 14, 2017 4:37pm
    - Lance
      
      Agree
      However there is another factor here.
      Often ‘former immigrants’ want to bring in the extended family + friends from their former country so make make shit up, deliberately will not employ locals or make it so difficult nobody in their right mind would do it.
      I know this is going on especially in the food + service industries.
      Some of the behaviour of our new ‘citizens’ is at best disgusting
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:26am
    - Gabby
      
      3. Bludger employers would rather the gumming found them some cheap workers than pay attractive wages.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:41am
      - Kimbo
        
        …and subsidising the crap wages with Working for Families.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:57am
  - Notsofast
    
    I agree Simon.
    There is a rental crisis in KeriKeri. Wanganui claims a serious shortage. National have been allowing a net gain of 3 people to one completed bedroom for several years, because it is the only way to cover for the shocking economy underlying our country. Dairy intensification has been rampant and encouraged, as has tourism. The result is a quantum change in the clean green lie in a couple of decades, yet our grandchildren are scheduled to see the next century in.
    A practical solution I suggest.
    
    Process the applicants, but allow them to enter as spaces for beds are issued certificates of compliance. If they get bored waiting their turn there are plenty in the queue behind.
    
    One applicant in for two beds until there is no housing crisis, which we know is a catastrophe currently.
    It is destroying kids’ futures in real time.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:52am
    - VicParking
      
      You can still buy a house in Whanganui for under $100,000. The only housing shortage is in social housing. They are evan putting homeless in pensioner housing, while pensioners sit on waiting lists. Whanganui is filling up with Superannuitants and those paid by MSD.
      
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      June 14, 2017 11:20am
      - Keeping Stock
        
        Actually Vic, job numbers have been increasing in Whanganui faster than population growth. For the first time in some years the population is growing.
        
        In the last month there have been more than 80 new job advertisements placed on Trade Me for Whanganui; the difficulty employers are having is getting good staff, especially in the trades. There is work available for those who want it.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:28am
- Reid
  
  Immigration would not be the issue it is if National hadn’t used it like it has: i.e. to shield us from the effects of the GFC by generating faux (paper) wealth in NZ’s biggest political market (Akld).
  
  This IS what they did, it IS why they did it and no amount of bullshit about supply can cover it up. And people know this.
  
  The global economy is going to take a massive hit this year, in which all the debt chickens are going to come home to roost not of course in the hands of the people who’ve laid them but in the taxpayer’s hands. Privatise the profits and socialise the losses. Key knows this and to me it’s the most likely reason he resigned, because he doesn’t want the blame for all the bankruptcies to be laid at his door.
  
  But regardless of that upcoming calamity, the fact people know that National used immigration to do what it has done means that it cannot credibly claim its suddenly recognised immigration as an issue and now, suddenly, plans to do something about it.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:14am
- KevOB
  
  And the waste people to the ….
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:26am
- KevOB
  
  The so called immigration problem is not of National’s making. Immigration refers to 12+ month stays, not students on 9mth courses.
  Citizens are the real problem we don’t have control over them: can’t stop them going or make them go and can’t stop them coming back either. Sound government has made NZ a desirable place to reside.
  How could ANY government plan for this?
  
  Annual net permanent and long term migration
  
  (Approx. interpolated from Stat. chart.)
  YR 000’s
  ___________
  2006 8
  2007 13
  2005 5
  2009 5
  2010 21
  2011 0
  2012 -2
  2013 0
  2014 26
  2015 55
  2016 65
  2017 70
  See: http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/population/Migration/IntTravelAndMigration_MRJan17.aspx
  
  The foolish are always wise in their own hindsight.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:13am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    2014 was when the great migration to Australia went into reverse. Do we need to force people to go there or stop NZers coming back?
    You choose.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:44am
- Gabby
  
  Bingles doesn’t unnerstand why useless druggie kiwis are too lazy to take a pay cut and work harder.
  
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  June 14, 2017 10:36am
  - Garbageman
    
    Good one Gobby pay cut eh I thought to earn pay you had to get out of bed every morning and earn it not be given free money your socialist paradise is paid for by the rest of NZ
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:45am
mikenmild

Happy World Blood Donor Day, everyone.
https://www.nzblood.co.nz/give-blood/sharing-for-lives/
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June 14, 2017 8:09am
- Kimbo
  
  Any Jehovah’s Witnesses in the house who can call it out as the celebration of an abomination? 😉
  
  Seriously, the Watchtower and Bible Tract Society (the JW version of the medieval Papacy, based in Brooklyn, NY) has lots of…’scuse the pun…blood on its hands demanding that prohibition of its members.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:13am
Inandout

While we watch news of a Pakistani man being put to death for saying things about mohamed and wonder if those types settle in NZ……

http://www.expat.com/en/nationalities/pakistani/in/oceania/new-zealand/

Notice the number ‘planning to live in NZ’. Stephie could probably throw some light on this.
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June 14, 2017 8:14am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Inandout , why not create a support group on fb for the poor gent or does the” shithole ” he happens to live in not merit it ?
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:47am
  - Inandout
    
    He was born into the shithole amongst the other followers of the pedo. We don’t want that mentality here, but you can hang out on FB if you like.
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:53am
- kowtow
  
  Yesterday RNZ media commentary celebrating proposed European censorship of how Muslim terror is reported.
  And of course the attacks have nothing to do with one of the world’s great religions…….
  
  http://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=201847330
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:00am
  - Swifty
    
    Kowtow – I just get an ‘interest rate rise’ story on that link.
    
    Would you please check it? I’d like to listen to that story. Thanks.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:05am
    - kowtow
      
      http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/201847324/media-commentator-gavin-ellis
      
      swifty
      
      Here’s another try.
      
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      June 14, 2017 1:01pm
Happychappy

KS: Do Labour have a chance of upsetting National in Whanganui because Chester Burrows is retiring or is Labour just dreaming. You look at the crowd Anndrew Little drew to his meeting of give aways if he can form a Government after September 23rd 2017 and being election year it looked very small. Also has Andrew been taking the same Drama Classes that Jacinda took as he seems to have learn how to pull faces and roll his eyes when speaking now days.
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June 14, 2017 8:14am
- Reid
  
  Does he neigh like a horse yet or is he still learning how to do that?
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:15am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    No, Little will stick to braying like a donkey because that has worked so well for him in the past and howling at the moon would be creepy, well more creepy than he is usually
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:54am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Of course they have a chance Happychappy, but in my view it is a pretty slim one. Borrows is retiring with a majority of 4500, and that was after boundary changes in 2014 that were supposedly favourable to Labour.
  
  I didn’t go to the meeting last night (there was rugby on the telly), but what I have heard from a couple of people who did attend is that they were underwhelmed by Little, and that Ms Ardern was the more polished performer. Perhaps Little needs to keep up the drama lessons, because they haven’t made a Jolly lot of difference yet 😀
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:24am
Paulus Gnome

That evil whitey oppressor coloniser, Darwin, right again!

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11875534

I am sorry for the world of pain that these people are going through but a modicum of common sense may have gone a long way.

Petrol + match = omfg, I never saw that coming!
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June 14, 2017 8:14am
- Deadly pony
  
  What a depressing story. House paid for by tax payers – check. Five people between the ages of 14 and 20 in the house drugging when they should have been at work or school – check. All smoke alarms removed – check. Tax payer now funding hundreds of thousands of dollars in hospital care – check. Tax payer now repairing damage to house – check. Tenants asked to take responsibility for their own lives – joking!
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:45am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    There’s 5 of Angry’s 90,000 unemployables – all in one room.
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:57am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    What’s the likelihood that the five were from broken/solo-mother-on-welfare homes, and were raised in a culture where diligence, literacy, hard work and the desire for self-improvement were unknown.
    Always, it will never be their fault. (And many who claim this will be those whose livelihood depends on the management and care of these wastrels.)
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:59am
    - GoVege
      
      “Fault”?
      I blame National for their stupidity and greed bringing in the ECA 25 years ago.
      The poor soon figured out they got paid more to breed than work.
      Now we have the result:
      A generation of depressed, purposeless young people dragged up on the benny.
      
      4 2
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      June 14, 2017 10:42am
      - Odakyu-sen
        
        Tinfoil hat time!
        
        I recon that Big Government likes to have a significant number of helpless, aggressive, dependent breeders in the population because it provides excuses for the expansion of Big Government powers.
        – More bureaucracy to manage “the poor”
        – More spending on government programs
        – More taxes to pay for all of this
        – Greater State powers to enforce more rules for a dumber population
        
        Note however that all this is predicated on unending economic “growth”/asset inflation/borrowing.
        
        What happens when there is a downturn, the likes NZ has not seen in 30 years?
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:57am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Odakyu-sen
        
        Tinfoil hat time!
        
        Not according to Jim Bolger, on whose watch the ECA and benefit cuts were introduced, and who now says they were a failure.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:00am
  - cmm
    
    This can all be solved very easily.
    
    Send some cops to go harass the dairy owner down the road.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:20am
    - Kimbo
      
      Yeah, but for what? Forget selling alcohol, or even cigarette lighters. Seems lately South African immigrants topping up their BBQ bottle are also in the running for the “Darwin award”:
      
      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/618730
      
      ..and they have historic form with charcoal too! :
      
      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/617056/Poisoning-tragedy-survivor-remains-seriously-ill
      
      4 9
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      June 14, 2017 9:23am
      - cmm
        
        Woosh!
        
        That one flew right over your head…. Earlier this week cops were harassing a legal business to stop them getting a liquor license. It is the way: blame everyone but the victims of their own stupidity.
        
        Nobody has the monopoly on stupid. There are plenty stupid South Africans.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:52am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ cmm
        
        Woosh!
        
        That one flew right over your head.
        
        Nope.
        
        Earlier this week cops were harassing a legal business to stop them getting a liquor license.
        
        Yes, hence I was referencing the fact that the same legal businesses (dairies and petrol stations) also sell charcoal and cigarette lighters among other items.
        
        Nobody has the monopoly on stupid. There are plenty stupid South Africans.
        
        Indeed. But then I wasn’t the one who kicked off the thread in which we are participating with a sarcastic reference to the “evil whitey oppressor coloniser”…with an implied reference that the race of those who were injured is both self-evident, and to be expected. So it wasn’t a shot at you, cmm, nor saffers. But thanks for clarifying that race had little or nothing to do with it – uncomfortable and/or unwelcome as that idea may be to some Kiwibloggers. Hence they would never have mentioned the accident if they suspected it was white saffers.
        
        Stupid subcultures and/or individual stupidity? Yep, now we are in agreement…
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:06am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Paulus Gnome , no just more trolling by yet another nasty piece of work from alt right white trash !
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:01am
  - waikatogirl
    
    stephie, tell us how you see the stupidity of lighting a cigarette while sniffing petrol?
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:17am
    - stephieboy
      
      waikatogirl ,unlike you or PG I don’t use someone’s misfortuante ifor hurling racist invective and abuse.
      
      If the burn victim had been white ?
      
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      June 14, 2017 9:20am
      - Reid
        
        It would have been the same response, moron.
        
        PG wasn’t commenting on their race, fool.
        
        He was commenting on their stupidity and the well-known well-documented tendency for many of a certain ethnicity and socio-economic status to blame their plight on colonialism, idiot.
        
        What about any of that escapes you, dummy?
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:35am
      - waikatogirl
        
        Who mentioned race.
        Misfortune brought on by their own stupidity, but then who sniffs petrol unless you aren’t very bright to begin with. Then they exacerbate their decision making by lighting a cigarette.
        
        I wouldn’t wish burns on anyone, but as I said if it wasn’t so tragic it would make you question their ranking in the Darwin Awards!
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:42am
      - Rich Prick
        
        You reveal your own prejudices with that comment. No one hurled racist invective nor abuse. Pulling the racist card out of your arse simply doesn’t give a free pass to moronic behaviour.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:53am
      - Rich Prick
        
        alt right white trash !
        
        Although pulling the race card out of your arse while hurling racist invective and abuse about is kind of funny, in a really retarded way.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:31am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ wikatogirl
        
        Who mentioned race.
        
        @ Rich Prick
        
        No one hurled racist invective nor abuse.
        
        For once stephieboy has read it right. Yes, someone did, at 8:14AM in a sarcastic opening statement that kicked off this thread, and which, by inference implied, dissembling and obfuscating about common sense to the contrary, that the race of those injured was predictable:
        
        That evil whitey oppressor coloniser, Darwin, right again!
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:36am
      - Rich Prick
        
        If that’s racist invective and abuse, then the colour I’ve just had my kitchen painted will have you dropping kittens.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:40am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rich Prick
        
        Yes, it’s different when it not one’s own race. Then it’s just funny, and anyone who says otherwise, including in clumsy reverse sarcasm like stephieboy is just a case of “PC gone mad” (drink!).
        
        Go back to the NZ Herald report to which Paulus Gnome linked:
        
        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11875534
        
        Nothing at all in it that states or even implies some SJW snowflake is blaming “the racist system” for the accident in…Otara (or does mentioning the name of the suburb now imply it?!). So how come a sarcastic comment about race kicked off and tried to set the agenda and tone for the entire conversation?
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:46am
      - Rich Prick
        
        Sorry Kimbo, but no one successfully tells me what to do. Particularly when it involves dancing on a pin-head.
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:56am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rich Prick
        
        Sorry Kimbo, but no one successfully tells me what to do. Particularly when it involves dancing on a pin-head.
        
        Pfft. Only imperative I could find in my post was “Go back to the NZ Herald report to which Paulus Gnome linked”
        
        …which was an answer to your prior (false) statement “No one hurled racist invective nor abuse.”.
        
        But if you want to call the facts of who did and didn’t first drag race into the thread a matter of “dancing on a pinhead”, feel free (that’s a suggestion, btw, not a command) to flounce off to contemplate the colour choice of your kitchen decor.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:13am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rich Prick
        
        …oh, yes, and if it was “dancing on a pinhead”, how come even Reid, dissembling and typical dishonest denial to the contrary, got it?:
        
        PG wasn’t commenting on their race, fool.
        
        He was commenting on their stupidity and the well-known well-documented tendency for many of a certain ethnicity and socio-economic status to blame their plight on colonialism, idiot.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:19am
      - waikatogirl
        
        Who mentioned race.
        
        Apologies Kimbo, I will be more succinct next time for the pedantic KB’ers. I should have said, “I didn’t mention race” ?
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:20am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ waikatogirl
        
        You call “pedantic”, I say, “if you don’t like the answer, don’t ask the question”. However, I do acknowledge that, even though we are all participating in a thread kicked off by Paulus Gnome, race was not your concern. Not that I have a desire to do Susan Devoy’s (non) work. Nonetheless, I find the subtleties of what people object to, and what they ignore and/or overlook and and/or rationalise as of no importance…intriguing.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:33am
      - waikatogirl
        
        Are you a school teacher Kimbo?!
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:56am
      - Kimbo
        
        No, just an observer and participant in on-going Kiwiblog conversations…where, admittedly, I struggle to resist answering questions, especially when there is an incorrect assumption or careless and/or self-satisfied rhetorical character to them. Plus I value the rule of thumb “divinity is in the details”.
        
        Like I said, don’t like the answer?…don’t ask the question. But at least I also try and diagnose my own (many) faults. 😉
        
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        June 14, 2017 12:01pm
      - stephieboy
        
        Reid, same response ?
        
        I don’t believe so.
        BTW what has “Darwin award” got to with the price of fish
        
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        June 14, 2017 2:43pm
      - GoVege
        
        WG: taking any kind of harmful drug is pretty stupid, but plenty of people do it.
        These were teenagers.
        They should have had enough parental guidance and supervision not to be doing this at their age.
        IMO our society is largely responsible for allowing the people who brought them into this world to escape their responsibilities.
        
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        June 14, 2017 9:02pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    @stephieboy
    
    what’s wrong with white trash, eh?
    
    Do you only associate with white folks of genteel sensibilities?
    
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    June 14, 2017 11:15am
- Garbageman
  
  Almost as thick as those petrol sniffing ferals is the muppet that decided a non removable navigation pane on their new website was a good idea my head hurts looking at that invasion of space
  
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  June 14, 2017 10:03am
Tom Barker

Ivanka Trump’s fashion clothing line is made not in the USA but in Indonesia. The great majority of the workers are Muslim. Is this what is known as a diversity dividend?
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June 14, 2017 8:17am
- ross411
  
  It’s just as well she’s a separate person from her father, and not some subservient who does what he tells her to do. Deary me, heaven forbid she should be her own person.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:49am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  It is known as ‘being in business’, a bit on an alien concept to those who are unaware of how wealth is created or how value is added to an idea
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:59am
  - Kimbo
    
    …like, Donald Trump? Because “bring back the jobs” to the Rust Belt means coal-mining, steel manufacturing and car assembly, which you can pay someone a lot less to do in the third world.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:02am
    - rangitoto
      
      The coal mining was shut down for EPA reasons not economic ones.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:15am
      - Kimbo
        
        Yeah, which is why they are still intensively mining coal in other 1st world nations like the UK (where the Industrial Revolution began), and Australia…oh, hold on!
        
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        June 14, 2017 10:26am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Might be why Adani is planning on a big new coal mine in Queensland
        http://money.cnn.com/2017/06/06/news/economy/coal-mine-australia-india-adani/index.html
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:21am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Let me know when the pits re-open in the Rhonda Valley of South Wales and also Yorkshire…
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:40am
  - GoVege
    
    Yes, Paulus.
    Some years ago I heard a Kiwi businessman on the radio excitedly talking about how much money he could make in Asia, because the workers are paid $50 a week.
    Wonder how much Ivanka pays her Indonesian workers?
    And didn’t dad say he was going to give jobs to Americans?
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:58am
    - Ross12
      
      GoVege
      Ivanka would not be paying the workers. It would be the contract manufacturers.
      If there are complaints to be made it would be the working conditions in some of the factories.
      The wages maybe low compared to our or USA standards but that is not the comparison that needs to be made — the rates should be compared to what the worker’s alternative would be. Steady work in a factory would be far preferable to intermittent work lower paid ( or maybe similar paid)back in the country side village.
      
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      June 14, 2017 12:18pm
      - GoVege
        
        True probably, Ross12, but I believe another comparison needs to be made:
        The difference between what the workers who actually make the products are paid, and what the westerners, who buy them, pay.
        Would it really hurt Ivanka and others to ensure those workers are paid something they can live on?
        She has the added advantage of being the president’s daughter.
        Wouldn’t this be a great opportunity to set a good example to other companies?
        
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        June 14, 2017 6:50pm
    - Garbageman
      
      Do you care as much about the poor souls that made the devices you use to type that statement make calls etc GV or is that just a rather pitiful attempt to attack Trump through his daughter
      
      4 3
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      June 14, 2017 2:31pm
      - GoVege
        
        My intention was not to “attack” Trump or Ivanka, G Man.
        I am sure I heard Trump say he was going to provide jobs for Americans, and Ivanka is said to be a close advisor to him, so I wonder why she is setting up businesses in Asia, not the US.
        I care very much about the “poor souls” who make our devices as well as clothes etc.
        I want to see them all get decent pay for their hard work, not peanuts.
        
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        June 14, 2017 6:20pm
- cmm
  
  Just because people have incompatible cultures and religions doesn’t mean they can’t do business together.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:56am
- virtualmark
  
  No, it’s just Ivanka making America great again.
  
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  June 14, 2017 5:39pm
Keeping Stock

Can Labour do anything right? It seems not:

Labour has admitted it hasn’t weighed up the economic impact of its immigration crackdown.

More than 130,000 international students came to New Zealand to study last year.

The sector is our fourth largest export industry and now, the target of Labour’s immigration crackdown.

Andrew Little wants to reduce the numbers by up to 22,000 and insists that won’t hurt the economy.

But the economic impact of cuts in our international education could be significant.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/immigration-crackdown-labour-hasn-t-considered-economic-impact.html

Seriously, did no one in the Labour Party pause for a moment to consider that slashing the number of international students would have a detrimental effect on one of the country’s most significant export industries? That is truly mind-boggling.

And these cowboys want to manage the country’s finances? Labour needs to prove first and foremost that it can actually do the heavy lifting and fully cost its policies before announcing them, and trying to out-Peters Peters.
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June 14, 2017 8:17am
- brett68
  
  I thought this pdf was interesting
  
  From a peak of 126,503 international fee-paying enrolments in 2003 there was a 27.7% decline to 91,388 enrolments in 2008, and a subsequent 8.8% recovery to 99,446 enrolments during 2010. Compared to 2011, during the 2012 calendar year there was a 5.7% decrease in international student enrolments to 92,995.
  
  http://www.educationcounts.govt.nz/__data/assets/pdf_file/0012/115050/Enrolments-of-international-students-2006-2012.pdf
  
  There were around 130,000 students here in 2003, why have overseas students now become an issue?
  
  This looks like more race baiting bullshit from Labour and NZ First, hopefully they get crucified by the media.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:39am
  - KevOB
    
    They can’t deal with the actual migration problem caused by uncontrollable citizens coming or not going and preferring National’s NZ to Labour’s fancies.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:21am
  - Gabby
    
    Be more interesting if it included the next 4 years.
    
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    June 14, 2017 11:07am
- MCos
  
  We had a family member from Thailand stay with us a couple of years ago while she did a half year English course.
  I don’t know what she learned because her English, seemed at about the same level when she left. I was suprised to find she was allowed to work 20hr/wk. No wonder bottom of the heap jobs pay so little when all these students are out there prepared to work for peanuts.
  Maybe these students bring in heaps of dough, but something doesn’t seem right to me. It’s a bit like getting a high from sugar. A short term high, but in the long term nothing, but bad health.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:54am
  - 4077th
    
    No, the peanuts you mentioned are minimum wage. The same minimum wage my student daughter earns today.
    
    12 1
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    June 14, 2017 9:23am
- sooty
  
  Flop Little will do a flip next week, when they cost it.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:54pm
Reid

Lots of truth bombs in this interview:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMJoAO5OZY8
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June 14, 2017 8:19am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Like What ?
  
  Pizzagate ? Manchester false flag etc ?
  
  1 34
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  June 14, 2017 8:58am
- Gabby
  
  Is that another fake facts set up by your goatle underlings?
  
  3 8
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  June 14, 2017 11:09am
Stars And Stripes

Govt to fund pēpi pods for every family that needs it
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/332959/govt-to-fund-pepi-pods-for-every-family-that-needs- it
“The government will spend $2 million on reducing the high number of unexpected deaths in infancy, providing wahakura – baby baskets also known as pēpi pods – and helping pregnant women quit smoking”

More koha from this government, this time to try and stop stoned mothers from smothering their kids while in a stupor.
I doubt it will have much effect as most of these pods will end up chucked out in the backyard for the dog to sleep in or possibly used to store weed.
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June 14, 2017 8:29am
- Longknives
  
  They would make a nice Dog Basket for the Pit Bull and her puppies!
  
  19 1
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  June 14, 2017 8:50am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    The difference between the pit bull and its owner?
    The pit bull will not smother their puppies nor ‘give them the bash’ if they survive infancy
    How high up the food chain is the pit bull when compared to its owner?
    Discuss – 10 marks
    
    24 1
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    June 14, 2017 9:05am
Manolo

Violent invaders in today’s Europe:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4599108/Armed-migrants-set-burning-road-blocks-Calais.html

Police reinforcements including at least 150 riot control officers have been drafted into Calais as UK-bound migrants set up burning roadblocks to stop lorries.

They use the motorway obstructions to get lorries heading to England to stop, so they can climb aboard and hide until reaching their destination.
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June 14, 2017 8:43am
- MCos
  
  Just what England needs!
  People with initiative
  I bet those people don’t sit around grizzling on social media
  
  3 18
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  June 14, 2017 8:56am
- cmm
  
  Just need a truck-size version of the car-jacker flame thrower:
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLhWzMOccTg
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:22am
publicwatchdog

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
EXPOSING THE ($1.6 BILLION)
TAMAKI ‘REGENERATION’
GENTRIFICATION $CAM!

(The word is getting out …..)

Transcript of Anti-corruption campaigner Penny Bright’s address to the Board of Auckland Council Controlled Organisation (CCO) Panuku Development, 31 May 2017:

“All right – for those of you who don’t know me, my name is Penny Bright.

I am an anti-privatisation /anti-corruption ‘Public Watchdog / Private Ombudsman’ (as it were) and I choose to work on a self-funded basis and have done that for the last 17 years.

I have attended 6 International Anti-Corruption Conferences, and although I am a time-served Tradesperson, with Advanced Trade in Sheetmetal Engineering, New Zealand’s first ticketed woman Welding Inspector, and a welding tutor for 9 years at Manukau Tech, I have never been to University, never had a days formal legal training in my life, but have actually been invited to The Hague, as one of New Zealand’s experts for the World Justice Project International Rule of Law Forum, which will be happening in mid-July.

https://worldjusticeproject.org/our-work/engagement/events/world-justice-forum

So – why am I here?

I’m here to tell you as the Board of Panuku I’m deeply concerned about what has been happening in Tamaki.

I believe that the facts prove that the Tamaki ‘Regeneration’ project has actually been a Tamaki GENTRIFICATION project and I believe that MPs, Councillors, public and the tenants have been misled over what’s been happening.

I believe it’s effectively been a State-sponsored land grab for property developers.

The role of Panuku, as I understand it, was to represent the 41% shareholding that Auckland Council has in the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited, this new Crown /Council hybrid.

The facts are that the public were told via the Local Government and Environment Select Committee Report on the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited (TRC) that the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited (TRC) was established in 2012 as an urban redevelopment company:

https://www.parliament.nz/resource/en-nz/51DBSCH_SCR68578_1/244291aaab825db7d3685cce7e3ccd49a2a7589e

“It is a Crown entity with joint shareholdings by the Crown 59% and Auckland Council 41%.

The company aims to achieve social, economic and housing objectives in the Auckland area of Tamaki during the next 20 – 25 years.

…

Transfer of housing stock from Housing NZ Corporation on the 31st of March 2016, the company will take over ownership of about 2,800 properties in the Tamaki area.”

______________________________________________________________________________

As it happens, the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited did not get one house.

What ended up happening was that 2,704 former Housing NZ properties were transferred to a new company – Tamaki Regeneration Limited.

Although the original 100 shares in Tamaki Regeneration Limited were 100% owned by the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited, on 15 April 2016, suddenly 1.6 billion shares were created, which meant the 100 shares in which Auckland Council had the 41% shareholding – basically vanished into oblivion.

https://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/5840214/shareholdings

Now – so how did this happen – and I know that there was one member of the Board (of Panuku Development) that is also a Board member of the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited and

Tamaki Regeneration Limited, because the Directors are the same.

So, I believe that there has been massive misleadership here of what has actually happened.

Now, I have spent 2 weeks of my own time going around 2,704 addresses, (with the help of drivers) and have checked 2,704 addresses to see whether these houses appear to be occupied, empty or bare sections, and what I discovered is:

76 bare sections where Housing NZ properties used to be, and are now grass with big fences around, and also about 70 empty (former) Housing NZ properties.

So – I’m deeply concerned that given that the public were told that there were going to be another 7,500 houses built in Tamaki – where the hell are they, and why do we have all these empty sections and empty houses?

https://www.parliament.nz/resource/en-NZ/51SCLGE_ADV_00DBSCH_ANR_67870_1_A474440/ab00c41388e91d4ec98005b3c231a5cbde53fbb3

What I believe is that it is a land grab of prime real estate, and the purpose of this Tamaki ‘Regeneration’ project was actually to get rid of poor people off prime real estate.

If you actually drive around there, as I have, you can see that’s really obviously what’s happening.

I’m also deeply concerned about what’s happening with the Point England Development Enabling Bill, because again the public are being misled.

The name Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited is what MPs are told are the ones who own the assets.

They don’t.

The key question is that Tamaki Regeneration Limited as the owner of the assets – they are the ones who decide how much money the Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited is going to get.

So – let’s see it shall we?

How much money has been spent on ‘regeneration’ projects in tamaki?

Who exactly has organised these projects?

Where’s the money gone?

Where are the results?

We had all the fine words about what was going to happen to these poorer communities in Glen Innes, Panmure and Point England – the results don’t seem to match the talk.

What I also want to include – I did an Official Information Act (OIA) request to John Holyoake, who is the CEO of Tamaki Regeneration Limited and asked some very, very hard questions.

That OIA request has now been acknowledged – it’s in the ‘sausage machine’ and I want it to be attached, formally, to these Board Minutes.

Also – an OIA reply I had from Stephen Joyce, who is one of two Crown shareholding Ministers, and he explained how it was that Tamaki Regeneration Limited was set up.

It was pushed basically by the Board of Directors – which – as i say are the same for both Tamaki Redevelopment Company Limited and Tamaki Regeneration Limited, plus Treasury.

So – other concerns I have that I wish to raise with the Board of Panuku as an anti-corruption campaigner:

I’m very keen to see a very clear ‘Register of Interests’ of any interests that any of you Board members have with property development companies.

I think that should be made available for the public to see.

I’m deeply concerned that the role of Panuku appears to be to facilitate the turning of public land over to private property developers, particularly public reserve land.

According to research that I did, I got a Social Services Select Committee inquiry into why was it that everyone appeared to be saying that there was going to be an extra million people coming to Auckland by 2040, when Auckland Transport and Watercare Services, two key infrastructure providers were working to the ‘medium’ population growth projection of an extra 700,000 people coming to Auckland.

I was successful in getting a Select Committee inquiry and basically, it boiled down to two people pushing for an extra million people coming to Auckland – the former Mayor Len Brown and former Auckland Council Chief Planning Officer, Dr Roger Blakeley.

https://www.parliament.nz/resource/en-NZ/50DBSCH_SCR5953_1/9f8a825ae96c25bddf7d0c8bddb58511039a4d16

https://www.parliament.nz/resource/mi-nz/50SCSS_EVI_50DBHOH_PET3157_1_A338307/c0545be9171849399f2468c6567ae9303ce418ce

Now – how is it that when you go around the corner to Britomart – you see an Auckland Transport sign that says there are going to be an extra 700,000 people coming to Auckland by 2040, which is why these transport changes are happening?

How can you be 300,000 people ‘out’?

Because that extra 300,000 people helped to push the Special Housing Areas legislation.

So – if population growth is such a major ‘driver’ – wouldn’t you expect infrastructure providers, and Council and Government to all ‘be on the same page’?

Because they’re not.

In the Unitary Plan for example, it does not include the apparently 33,000 empty private sector houses that were uncovered in the (2013) census.

I hadn’t actually realised, as someone who opposed the ‘Supercity’ from day one, (and understood the bigger contracts for fewer but bigger private contractors) how the ‘One Plan’ for Auckland, was to ‘uncomplicate’ things – not for citizens and ratepayers – but for property developers.

Because yes – it does get complicated when you’ve got 3 District Council Plans, 4 City Council Plans and one Auckland Regional Council Plan – much easier to have one plan – but I can tell you right now that people, ordinary people of Auckland had a hell of a lot more say over what was happening in their street and their area – back in those ‘bad old days’.

I’ll leave it there – thank you.”

#StopCorruption

(Authorised by Penny Bright
2017 Independent candidate for Tamaki, 86A School Rd,
Kingsland, Auckland 1021).
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June 14, 2017 8:45am
- ross411
  
  What’s your point?
  
  23 1
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  June 14, 2017 8:52am
  - G152
    
    Penny was, is and will always be pointless.
    It’s the nature of the beast
    
    22 1
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    June 14, 2017 9:13am
- Kimbo
  
  Would anyone like me to critique the abundance of Penny’s emphatic adverbs? 😉
  
  17 2
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  June 14, 2017 8:59am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    No, just someone to take one for the team and bother to read the mad woman’s diatribe, prepare an appropriate response, or not, the or not option is looking good
    
    21 0
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    June 14, 2017 9:11am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Have you paid the rates bill for 86A School Road, Kingsland, Auckland 1021 yet Penny?
  
  If the answer is “no”, come back when you have because then we might be able to take your self-appointed role of “private ombudsman” more seriously.
  
  30 2
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  June 14, 2017 9:08am
- 4077th
  
  FFS, what a load of verbal diarrhoea. Dream on Penny and BTW… PAY YOUR F*CKING RATES!
  
  24 3
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  June 14, 2017 9:30am
- Awww C-mon
  
  Penny you are actually onto something this time… broken clock I guess
  
  What can be done?
  
  12 1
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  June 14, 2017 9:35am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  A river of pink flows through Kiwi Blog….
  
  9 1
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  June 14, 2017 10:06am
- Swifty
  
  ‘Private Ombudsman’.
  
  The self-delusion is indeed strong in this one…….
  
  14 0
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  June 14, 2017 10:12am
- Garbageman
  
  “So – why am I here?”
  Umm to compete with WoO & Hugh P in the copy and paste world championships would be my guess Penny otherwise no-one cares sad but true for you sorry
  
  13 0
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  June 14, 2017 10:13am
- Entity
  
  How long did it take to type that? All that effort only to get ridiculed by every single KB reader…
  
  4 0
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  June 14, 2017 12:28pm
Longknives

Sorry Penny- You lost me at “Publicwatchdog”…
38 1
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June 14, 2017 8:51am
- RalphT
  
  Fair’s fair; at least she doesn’t bombard us with four postings in a row.
  
  15 0
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  June 14, 2017 9:01am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    There is time and we are all aware of her modus operandi, a slow boring death by a 1,000+ repetitive posts
    
    19 1
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    June 14, 2017 9:14am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Me too, what a waste of a scroll wheel.
  
  17 1
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  June 14, 2017 9:03am
  - marcw
    
    A bit like the Herald’s new format.
    
    17 0
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    June 14, 2017 9:26am
    - 4077th
      
      Don’t get me started. What an utter shambles that new format is. 20% of the screen realestate taken up with the navigation bar is just the start.
      
      16 1
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      June 14, 2017 9:32am
      - Keeping Stock
        
        Meanwhile the website developer is laughing all the way to the bank…
        
        7 0
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        June 14, 2017 11:33am
dime

what is more punishing for National?

A vote for Winnie, or does Dime just not vote at all?
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June 14, 2017 9:04am
- mikenmild
  
  Well, we’re probably all a bit better off if the ignorant and uniformed don’t vote.
  
  8 28
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  June 14, 2017 9:13am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    That’s you right?
    
    22 0
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    June 14, 2017 9:16am
    - mikenmild
      
      Only if you think so, Paulus. But that would mean I was talking about myself in the third person, and what kind of egotist would do that?
      
      6 20
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      June 14, 2017 9:19am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      Actually that is not fair. You are not ignorant or uninformed at all, some of your posts have merit and occasionally some credibility
      
      It is the manner with which you phrase the responses and constant superior attitude with righteousness that rankles with me
      
      22 0
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      June 14, 2017 9:22am
    - mikenmild
      
      Don’t worry; you won’t have to put up with it for much longer.
      
      8 5
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      June 14, 2017 9:41am
      - Jack5
        
        GFR!!!! 😛
        
        1 0
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        June 14, 2017 2:08pm
    - Kimbo
      
      It is the manner with which you phrase the responses and constant superior attitude with righteousness that rankles with me
      
      Meh. Is likely more a reflection of your insecurities. Now, as with my good friend holysheet (who offers an outstanding bush lawyer and IP consultation service, btw), where do I send the invoice for my psychological consultation and advice fees?
      
      8 6
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      June 14, 2017 9:53am
  - Kiwi Dave
    
    Including those who are ignorant of the difference between ‘uninformed’ and ‘uniformed’. 🙂
    
    13 0
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    June 14, 2017 9:39am
    - mikenmild
      
      Good spotting. I’d like to say it was a Freudian slip, but many of the uniformed are in fact quite well informed.
      
      3 11
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      June 14, 2017 9:43am
  - dime
    
    “uniformed ”
    
    what do you have against cops, firemen, nurses etc?
    
    i can understand why you dont like me. its not easy for a girly beta male like yourself in this world.
    
    19 3
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    June 14, 2017 9:43am
    - mikenmild
      
      Kiwi Dave beat you too it. Were you always slow?
      
      3 13
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      June 14, 2017 9:47am
      - dime
        
        “Kiwi Dave beat you too it. Were you always slow?”
        
        yes milky. Im slow.
        
        have you always picked on slow people? does that make the lilttle beta man feel big and strong?
        
        16 3
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        June 14, 2017 9:52am
    - Gabby
      
      Dim’s gettin angry..
      
      1 15
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      June 14, 2017 11:15am
  - Dafixeruppa
    
    I would down tick you for calling another KB’er ignorant and uninformed, but I actually agree that ignorant and uninformed shouldn’t vote, but I also think that it would be better to try to educate them than to dismiss them (hat tip to Dime)
    
    2 2
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    June 14, 2017 1:04pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Dime holds his nose and does two ticks blue, unless he wants the rest of us to be subjected to the coalition from Hell.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:52am
  - dime
    
    i dont know if i can. i like bill but joyce and bennett… and the “wage increase” for thos on the bene while dime gets nothing.. then, after 3 terms i get a 20 a week? urgh
    
    13 1
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    June 14, 2017 10:13am
- rangitoto
  
  A vote for winnie or not voting is a vote for material girl.
  
  14 0
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  June 14, 2017 10:17am
  - dime
    
    yeah true. yikes.
    
    i want to go ACT! but hes a bit smarmy about muslim immigration
    
    14 1
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    June 14, 2017 10:24am
Stars And Stripes

The only thing I actually find surprising about this situation is that they poured water on her.
Usually it would have been Lion Red.
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June 14, 2017 9:14am
Hugh Pavletich

Posted at … https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/06/links-14-june-2017/#comment-2887529

New Zealand housing bubble bursting …

Harcourts says the house prices that were being achieved at the height of the market are no longer realistic | interest.co.nz

https://www.interest.co.nz/property/88264/harcourts-says-house-prices-were-being-achieved-height-market-are-no-longer-realistic

The country’s largest real estate agency says average house prices are starting to fall, and the inflated prices that were achievable last year are no longer realistic.

Harcourts chief executive Chris Kennedy said the agency sold almost 15% fewer homes in May than it did in May last year, and average prices are being affected by declining sales.

That is particularly noticeable in Auckland where the average price in May was below the average in May 2016, for the first time since sales started declining late last year.

The average price of Auckland homes sold by Harcourts in May was $947,809 which was well below the $1,024,317 benchmark set in April this year, and down 0.7% compared to May last year.

In Christchurch the slide in price has been even more severe, with May’s average sale price of $498,370 down 10% compared to the average price of $553,114 in May last year.

“Vendors are starting to adjust their expectations when it comes to prices,” Kennedy said.

“The inflated prices that were achievable at the very height of the market are no longer realistic.” … read more via hyperlink above …

… confidence evaporates …

Barfoot and Thompson sold 17% at latest Manukau auction, 34% on the North Shore | interest.co.nz

https://www.interest.co.nz/property/88257/barfoot-and-thompson-sold-17-latest-manukau-auction-34-north-shore

… because … no longer are people prepared to pay a million bucks in Auckland (or $600,000 in the case of Christchurch) for what should be $250 – $300,000 … refer …

2017 13th Annual Demographia International Housing Affordability Survey

http://www.demographia.com/dhi.pdf

… mid March report …

The NZ homeowners who hate high house prices are revealed in Labour polling | Stuff.co.nz

http://i.stuff.co.nz/business/money/90244287/The-NZ-homeowners-who-hate-high-house-prices-are-revealed-in-Labour-polling
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June 14, 2017 9:24am
- Hugh Pavletich
  
  https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/06/links-14-june-2017/#comment-2887545
  
  It was a great shame John Key failed to deal with the housing bubble problem out of the 2008 election as promised … and as I explained at the time of the release of this years Demographia Survey 23 January, within ‘New Zealand’s political consensus: Where is the political leadership’ …
  
  http://pc.blogspot.co.nz/2017/01/auckland-worlds-fourth-hardest-to-buy.html
  
  Back in 2007, Mr Key was clear in what needed to be done …
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPgoAI1cLE
  
  https://www.google.co.nz/?gws_rd=ssl#q=john+key+housing+reform+2007&spf=1497365086376
  
  Further extensive information via … http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org
  
  Where is the accountability ?
  
  3 30
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  June 14, 2017 9:25am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Bingo! The trifecta so early in the day!
  
  WoO, the return of the welder from Kingaland and now the voice of doom from Chch!
  
  Help me out here Capt’n!
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:27am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Paulus, shall we mount a search for the key of the asylum?
    
    13 2
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    June 14, 2017 9:55am
    - Hugh Pavletich
      
      Gareth Vaughan suggests that whoever is in government after the September 23 election, the RBNZ’s unlikely to get a DTI tool and largely has itself to blame … Interest Co NZ
      
      https://www.interest.co.nz/opinion/88245/gareth-vaughan-suggests-whoever-finance-minister-after-september-23-election-rbnzs
      
      By Gareth Vaughan
      
      Has the Reserve Bank missed the boat on getting itself a macro-prudential debt-to-income (DTI) ratio tool?
      
      That may seem a premature question when the prudential regulator has only just issued a consultation paper on the concept, and submissions aren’t due until August 18 meaning the process has months to run yet.
      
      But, ahead of the September 23 election, the lukewarm response from the Finance Minister and his Labour shadow must be concerning to the boffins at number 2, The Terrace. That’s because, under its Memorandum of Understanding with the Finance Minister, the Reserve Bank must get said minister’s approval to have a DTI tool added to its macro-prudential toolkit. … read more via hyperlink above …
      
      1 25
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      June 14, 2017 10:12am
      - Garbageman
        
        Hugh while I admire a mans passion on their chosen favourite subject you don’t happen to have any other hobbies or interests you might avail the good readers here on KB with, I am not trolling you that is a genuine question and not an excuse for you to add another long copy & paste like you always do that only gives the locals here RSI
        
        15 1
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        June 14, 2017 10:25am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Garbageman … thank you for the suggestion.
        
        Housing is the number one political issue going in to the election 23 September.
        
        Accountability time.
        
        1 16
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        June 14, 2017 11:25am
      - Swifty
        
        Then why don’t you direct your spam to the Labour and National party sites, instead of subjecting us to it day in and day out.
        
        Loser.
        
        11 0
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        June 14, 2017 11:52am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Posted at … https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/06/nz-house-prices-rise-may-sales-volumes-collapse/#comment-2887758 … behind paywall …
        
        Hugh Pavletich MEMBER
        June 14, 2017 at 10:01 am
        
        Conditions do change quickly in bubble markets …
        
        Canada’s Garth Turner of the Greater Fool blog in discussing Toronto ( Canadas largest metro … population about 6.6 million ) interesting perspective on how housing bubbles burst …
        
        Garth Turners Greater Fool Blog … ‘MAYDAY ?’
        
        http://www.greaterfool.ca/2017/05/01/mayday-2/
        
        … That’s the funny thing about bubbles. Everybody’s horny to get their hands on rising assets – until they’re not. It always happens fast, whatever the asset and no matter the trigger. Greed is a powerful emotion, but it wilts before the dominance of fear. If enough people fear houses will stop rising (prices don’t even need to decline), they’ll cease making the Herculean sacrifice required to buy one. And down she goes. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
        … as the Toronto bubble bursts … 7.7 Median Multiple … Demographa Survey accessible via …
        
        http://www.demographia.com/dhi13-s1.pdf
        
        http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org
        
        Mr Turner recently provided the May results …
        
        … extract …
        
        WARNING: What follows is based upon Toronto Real Estate statistics. Be advised it may contain misleading Frankenumbers, unhealthy assumptions, coarse calculations and adult situations. Reader discretion is advised.
        
        Average price drop during May: – 6.2%
        Total sales drop in GTA during May: – 12%
        Drop in sales year/year: – 20.3%
        Average price: $863,910
        Average detached house one-month price drop: –$64,221
        Decline year/year in detached sales: –26%
        Average price reduction (all properties) over one month: –$56,881
        One-month increase in new listings: 19.4%
        Increase in active listings year/year: 43%
        
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        June 14, 2017 12:08pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Most interesting Christchurch perspective …
        
        Hello Hugh Pavletich,
        kiwikaryn replied to your comment on NZ house prices rise in May, but sales volumes collapse:
        
        “If enough people fear houses will stop rising (prices don’t even need to decline)”. This was the exact point made by Michael Burry in The Big Short. The gig is up when prices stop rising, not when they start falling. In Chch I am seeing huge amounts of stock coming to market, mostly low end, clearly investors trying to get rid of investment properties now they are struggling to rent them at prices to cover their escalating mortgage costs. Stock is at the highest its ever been (across the 14 suburbs, and price brackets that I monitor) and its June, when it should be at its lowest. God help them when all the spring stock hits the market in a couple of months.
        
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        June 14, 2017 6:11pm
    - Happychappy
      
      We only need Jack5 now to post on his vast experience on the Economy, Youth employment and this Governments GDP figures.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:37am
      - Jack5
        
        Thank you for inviting me in Happychappy. 😛
        
        I don’t have “vast experience” on the economy, but I can sniff-detect lying political-PRs’ bullshit.
        
        The GDP per capita figures for the quarter will be out this week. They were down in the latest quarter already reported. You might like to keep an eye out for them. Remember it’s the per capita GDP that counts.
        
        In the meantime, enjoy this: the current account deficit is blowing out. Put a glow on that if you can.
        
        http://www.interest.co.nz/news/88285/current-account-deficit-widening-faster-treasury-expected-record-imports-boost-quarterly
        
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        June 14, 2017 4:14pm
Harriet

This is what an Australian sex offender registry would look like:

http://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/this-is-what-an-australian-sex-offender-registry-would-look-like/news-story/37baeb2c18dc3223e98cf46c30f18068
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June 14, 2017 9:51am
- kowtow
  
  Shouldn’t need a register. Just a 50 cent bullet.
  
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  June 14, 2017 10:32am
Dafixeruppa

I normally don’t repost these
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11875801
But it resonates with so many people I know, both the mothers and the fathers in various cases.
We don’t know the story here, only what the father has penned, But we do know that when relationships sour, it is incredibly easy for the custodial parent to maintain their custody and keep the other parent away. The only way for many of these parents to see their children is to beggar themselves going to court, paying for ever more expensive lawyers and fighting till they drop from exhaustion.
There is no incentive for the custodial parent to follow anything agreed in the family court as there is no penalty for refusing.
I do not have an answer, except to say, when there are kids involved, parents need to get rid of their egos and do what is right for the kids. The courts need to actually enforce their decisions and the legal fraternity need to recognise that ripping off parents trying to be a part of their children’s lives is morally wrong and should reduce their exorbitant fees accordingly. (Remember that generally law firms put their cheapest lawyer on these cases for most of the work, but charge them out at more than 4 times what they pay them.
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June 14, 2017 9:52am
- mandk
  
  One important point to make in circumstances like this is do not to leave without first consulting a lawyer.
  
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  June 14, 2017 10:09am
  - Harriet
    
    If most people ended their relationships and sorted out their affairs BEFORE getting new boyfriends or girlfriends, then most relationships would end ‘relatively’ peacefully.
    
    New boyfriends and girlfriends unintentionally/intentionally antagonize the situation.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:35am
    - Dafixeruppa
      
      Actually, I think if more people sorted out their affairs and left their relationships before getting a new boyfriend or girlfriend, then the levels of acrimony would be less.
      
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      June 14, 2017 1:06pm
Manolo

The new horse for 2020:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/terry-mcauliffe-2020-name-one-democrat-who-can-stop-him/article/2621171
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June 14, 2017 9:54am
mandk

I won’t reply directly to Penny’s 8.45 drivel because she doesn’t have ears to hear, but I will point out that it is people like her who are contributing to high house prices, the housing shortage and homelessness in Auckland.

Planning for the redevelopment of Tamaki has been going on for the best part of 10 years. No one in need is being asked to leave the house they live in without being offered an alternative. And the houses that are scheduled to be removed are outdated and sited on overlarge sections that almost no one wants to maintain nowadays.
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June 14, 2017 10:04am
- Happychappy
  
  Bright Penny should be questioning Labour’s Kiwi build because when it happens if they become the Government it will mean we will return to the slum housing that was built in the 1950/60. This will also suit Labour’s purpose with house prices collapsing from the cheap built housing and state rented dwelling around them.
  
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  June 14, 2017 11:15am
  - KevOB
    
    It was not slum housing that was built in 1950/60. It was architecturally designed mostly by the Ministry of Works and supervised. Then it was very adequate and without water tightness problems. The areas were typically 80-120m² and there was pride in how they managed to fit an affordable efficient 3 bedroom family home in a small area.
    Many of those homes are past their planned life now but one I purchased, used, with the family benefit deposit scheme is still looking well lived in. Maintenance does make a difference.
    Having participated in building 3 during 60’s I know how solid they were and how even us amateur builders could be assisted to build our own to meet loan requirements.
    
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    June 14, 2017 12:16pm
    - Happychappy
      
      My father was a a carpenter also and i was one of six siblings that lived in a three bedroom State House but successive Governments let them become slums in some districts and having seen places like Cannons Creek do we really want to go back to the past and built cheap hovels to end up with the same situation. Some tenants in NZ believe that they should be able live and behave like animals in state homes without reproach so that’s what happens when you build a lot of the same lookalike homes for the poor.
      
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      June 14, 2017 1:19pm
  - waikatogirl
    
    Is Penny’s friend still squatting in the taxpayers’ owned state house and holding up the development of housing for those needing housing?
    
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    June 14, 2017 12:20pm
- Keeping Stock
  
  Blimmin’ heck mandk; why did you spoil Penny’s wonderful conspiracy theory by quoting FACTS at her? That’s not fair 😎
  
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  June 14, 2017 11:37am
Manolo

Article worth reading:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/columnists/janet-albrechtsen/selfdeceiving-liberals-may-lead-themselves-to-oblivion/news-story/3d7c3eb6e90fd8e509af0345f3882a6b

Politicians don’t talk about their failures. They rarely admit mistakes. Lies are so commonplace they can’t admit broken promises. A levy is not a tax, a politician said with a straight face. Climate change was the great moral challenge of our time, said another, until it wasn’t. There will be no carbon tax under a government I lead, a leader assured us, until there was. The learned self-deception, a polite term for mastering the bullshit factor, is so complete, those in senior levels see little need to explain to voters or admit errors to themselves.
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June 14, 2017 10:49am
MCos

I listened to a couple of minutes of Jeff Sessions.
Couldn’t remember this, couldn’t remember that and a vehement denial that he’d ever betrayed his country.
This, of course, was like a signal to some that he’d been up to no good and was conveniently forgetting incriminating meetings with some Russian bogie man.
It’s a desperate situation in US politics when guys like this are automatically treated with such suspicion.
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June 14, 2017 11:10am
- Gabby
  
  Is he mentally up to the job, one has to ask.
  
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  June 14, 2017 11:19am
Reid

Everyone except people who don’t understand politics knows the Clinton Foundation is the biggest charity fraud in history. The best researcher on this is a guy called Charles Ortel.

Here’s three pieces from him if you’re interested in knowing the depths of the Clinton’s depravity in this field. (Which BTW, is only touching on the Clinton’s actual depravity, which goes far deeper.)

Summary review:
“Clinton Foundation Is Charity Fraud Of Epic Proportions”, Analyst Charges In Stunning Takedown
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-07/clinton-foundation-charity-fraud-epic-proportions-analyst-charges-stunning-takedown

His homepage: http://charlesortel.com

If you prefer a vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2F2n-MT43zY
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June 14, 2017 11:22am
- MCos
  
  I see that chap equated Key’s resignation to his involving NZ with a donation to the Clinton Foundation
  I
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:58pm
  - mikenmild
    
    Snigger.
    
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    June 14, 2017 1:09pm
  - Reid
    
    Is that all you saw?
    
    How sad for you.
    
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    June 14, 2017 1:32pm
Fletch

Ship of Fools III – Global Warming Study Cancelled Because of ‘Unprecedented’ Ice

“It became clear to me very quickly that these weren’t just heavy ice conditions, these were unprecedented ice conditions,” Dr. David Barber, the lead scientist on the study, told VICE. “We were finding thick multi-year sea ice floes which on level ice were five metres thick… it was much, much thicker and much, much heavier than anything you would expect at that latitude and at that time of year.”

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/06/13/delingpole-ship-of-fools-iii-global-warming-study-cancelled-because-of-unprecedented-ice/
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June 14, 2017 11:31am
- Brigitte
  
  Interesting how he quotes an extract which misses the important context part:
  
  “Dr. David Barber, who was heading the research project, said warming temperatures have made the ice in the high Arctic thinner. When buffeted by storms and high winds, the ice can move much more freely and travels south on ocean currents.
  
  “I have been in the Arctic for 35 years and this is one of the most incredible experiences I have ever had,” he said Monday.
  
  “Normally these conditions aren’t so bad. This is climate change fully in action – affecting our ability to make use of marine resources and transport things.”
  
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  June 14, 2017 11:59am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Well spotted Fletch. All those climate scientists predicting catastrophic ice melts wouldn’t want to get trapped in “unprecedented ice conditions”.
  
  Oh, wait; that’s already happened – http://news.nationalpost.com/news/scientists-trapped-in-antarctic-ice-await-dramatic-helicopter-rescue-after-week-spent-singing-with-the-seals
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:01pm
  - William of Ockham
    
    Witless bullshitting imbecility.
    
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    June 14, 2017 12:22pm
    - Keeping Stock
      
      You describe yourself perfectly WoO. I couldn’t have done any better myself 😀
      
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      June 14, 2017 2:05pm
- jonar
  
  And the unprecedented ice conditions near Canada are caused by….
  
  Essentially, the Arctic ice, because of climate change, is having its thickness reduced which in turn allows the ice to become more mobile. The ice was able to escape the Arctic to the Labrador current and make its way south. Barber says that situation works as a microcosm that showcases the need for Canada to start planning for the transformation climate change is, and will, bring, as it will affect our everyday activities and trade routes.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:02pm
  - Fletch
    
    Of course it is. Whether the temperature gets hotter or colder, it’s all because of climate change, and we humans are at fault. /sarc. Very convenient. I wonder what the effects of NO climate change would look like then? Probably no different than now.
    
    Meanwhile, a new study shows that climate models have been estimating rainfall incorrectly this whole time.
    
    NASA and four universities compared climate data from 1995 to 2005 to 23 climate model simulations for the same period. More than 70 percent of the climate models underestimated the amount of rain compared to the real world observations.
    
    http://dailycaller.com/2017/06/12/study-climate-models-have-been-estimating-rainfall-incorrectly-this-whole-time/
    
    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms15771
    
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    June 14, 2017 12:20pm
    - William of Ockham
      
      Why don’t you go to the science sites?
      
      Crank sites comfort you?
      
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      June 14, 2017 12:25pm
      - mikenmild
        
        He doesn’t know any other sites.
        
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        June 14, 2017 1:10pm
- William of Ockham
  
  Ah, yes the well known scientist Delingpole publishing in the pear-reviewed Breitbart. The icebreaker was needed to rescue fishing boats getting caught amongst ice floes that wouldn’t have been there except for global warming.
  
  The Arctic warming dramatically – as predicted – and ice permanently lost.
  
  But hey, what do 30,000 climate scientists know compared with arts graduates like Delingpole and Booker.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:21pm
  - Fletch
    
    ice floes that wouldn’t have been there except for global warming.
    
    Oxymoron.
    
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    June 14, 2017 1:24pm
    - jonar
      
      This is what we’re up against. People that don’t get that if the arctic ice melts and breaks up it ends up somewhere else…
      
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      June 14, 2017 2:24pm
rightoverlabour

Once again police chasing soft targets.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/93638234/community-sentence-for-wellington-stepdad-who-beat-up-rapist-after-provocation

The guy should never have been charged. The rapist should have been shot.
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June 14, 2017 11:44am
- Garbageman
  
  While I agree with the sentiment and would gladly pull the trigger if this happened to my daughter we cant have people randomly going around bashing people or worse there are to many liars and false complaints for this to be the way to run any society that said I am very happy he got off
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:01pm
  - Dafixeruppa
    
    He came out of his house to find his daughter naked hiding behind cars with the “alleged” rapist standing over her. He then saw the same “alleged” rapist walking free in the street a couple of days later and snapped over the fact that the “alleged” scumbag was walking free.
    
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    June 14, 2017 1:11pm
Fletch

Dr. Sebastian Gorka, deputy assistant to the president, speaks out about Trump’s success in the Middle East already.

“On the national security front, the Qatar situation is fascinating,” he observed. “The president goes to the heart of the Muslim world. He asks for action. Action is taken, and now we have to see the sponsorship of terrorism end.”

We didn’t see any immediate action such as this after Obama visited there on his Apology Tour in 2009.
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June 14, 2017 11:52am
- KevOB
  
  Qatar–where Sunni and Shia meet. Boom, can’t have that.
  
  Perhaps the travel ban should extend to Americans visiting the Middle East.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:21pm
- Manolo
  
  The Arabs knew Obama was made of piss weak stuff.
  
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  June 14, 2017 1:10pm
  - Harriet
    
    Yep.
    
    Trump acknowledged Mecca and Medina and said nothing of the Dome of the Rock in Israel.
    
    Then he flew directly to Israel from Saudi Arabia – where no one else has ever done so.
    
    The US is no longer going to listen to bullshit – and the Arabs know it.
    
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    June 14, 2017 2:30pm
Captain Mainwaring

Instalment 134/69,708 of the MSM kick the Govt. stories which we’ll have to put up with until Sept. 23.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff-nation/93441299/moving-to-nz-was-a-culture-shock-even-for-an-aussie

Feeling hard done by? – the MSM wants to hear from you.
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June 14, 2017 11:56am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Good old Fairfax, with their anti-government activism.
  
  Interestingly, the editorial in today’s Dom-Post refers to Labour making a mistake by targeting people with “foreign-sounding surnames”. I could have sworn that the smear run by Phil Twyford and Rob Salmond was specifically directed at people with CHINESE-sounding surnames.
  
  It was a classic piece of anti-Asian rhetoric by Labour, and right out of the Winston Peters play-book. The Dom-Post however seems determined to rewrite history.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:05pm
- MCos
  
  What’s your specific gripe with the details in the article? Some of it I read quite regularly on this forum. Specifically the reference to domestic violence, lower renumeration than Oz & high accommodation costs.
  
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  June 14, 2017 12:45pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Daniel Barenboim returns to the West Bank
http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-middle-east-40256081/israeli-conductor-daniel-barenboim-visits-west-bank
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June 14, 2017 12:01pm
- Manolo
  
  Thank you, Maggy. He is a wonderful pianist and conductor. Outstanding musician.
  
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  June 14, 2017 1:09pm
Reid

Just so you know, this is why they banned laptops on planes:

The officials told the Times that in the first weeks of 2017, Israeli “cyberoperators” hacked a small cell of Syrian militants skilled in bomb-making. They found that the team intended to create small explosives that closely resemble computer batteries. The “batteries” would then be placed inside a laptop and smuggled into airports, where it would be able fool X-ray detectors.

https://sputniknews.com/military/201706121054565456-leaked-intelligence-israel-hacking-daesh/
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June 14, 2017 12:13pm
cha

How sad, never mind.
/

Ken Ham wants to push back against that narrative (for obvious reasons), and he’s finally figured out how to do it. Instead of taking responsibility for his underwhelming Ark, or offering an excuse like it’s too early to see economic growth resulting from the attraction, he’s blaming atheists for the negative publicity.

Recently, a number of articles in the mainstream media, on blogs, and on well-known secularist group websites have attempted to spread propaganda to brainwash the public into thinking our Ark Encounter attraction is a dismal failure. Sadly, they are influencing business investors and others in such a negative way that they may prevent Grant County, Kentucky, from achieving the economic recovery that its officials and residents have been seeking.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2017/06/13/ken-ham-is-now-blaming-atheists-for-the-economic-failures-of-ark-encounter/?
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June 14, 2017 12:20pm
rightoverlabour

For anybody that has a better understanding of Maths and Physics this is a must read. This paper also explains why CO2 increases lag warming peaks, if I have read it correctly.

https://www.scribd.com/document/25071132/The-Saturated-Greenhouse-Effect-Theory-of-Ferenc-Miskolczi
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June 14, 2017 12:46pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Another paper that will cause much consternation. Basically destroys the myth that increasing CO2 causes warming
  
  http://www.biocab.org/Overlapping_Absorption_Bands.pdf
  
  Also if you have time read all the responses to this page. https://skepticalscience.com/argument.php?p=9&t=451&&a=82
  
  The arguments get quite heated. The science is far from settled!
  
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  June 14, 2017 2:43pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Another good site to refer to when arguing with Religious (Climate) Nutters
    
    https://scienceofdoom.com/about/
    
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    June 14, 2017 2:50pm
Stars And Stripes

Just come back from a photo exhibition put on by the local retailers association to celebrate diversity in the community.
I couldn’t unfortunately identify anybody in the CCTV images.
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June 14, 2017 12:51pm
JasonJohns

what is this money for since moriori don’t exist anymore
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/93625780/treaty-settlement-officials-spend-more-than-57000-of-taxpayers-money-travelling-to-chatham-islands
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June 14, 2017 1:30pm
Reid

Sarah Huckabee Sanders To Replace Sean Spicer As WH Press Secretary

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/06/exclusive-breaking-report-sarah-huckabee-sanders-replace-sean-spicer-wh-press-secretary/
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June 14, 2017 1:35pm
- Rodney Randall
  
  Sarah had that front row of propagandists squirming.
  
  Did you see the look on their faces?
  
  Cat’s puckered arsehole..all of them
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:05pm
  - Reid
    
    Her grasp of esoteric detail is outstanding isn’t it. I personally wondered over some of Trump’s early appointees and still do, but slowly, he’s becoming Presidential.
    
    His selection here is on the basis of that initiation by fire, excellent.
    
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    June 14, 2017 5:01pm
4077th

Here are a couple of real winners. Ferals imitating pin cushions as well as scribble all over themselves told a $200k lie.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11875941

Still too dumb to make their FB profiles private.
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June 14, 2017 1:42pm
Jack5

Folk interested in freedom of speech, of expression, and of news coverage, especially of Islamic terror attacks, should listen to Radio Labour’s Kathryn Ryan chatting with media commentator Gavin Ellis (link below).

They were talking yesterday about media coverage of Islamic terrorism, and reported that a meeting set up by the Council of Strasburg is organising a meeting to recommend standards for European media coverage of Islamic extremist terror attacks.

Ellis said he hoped the outcome would be to “stop this tendency to villify Islam”.

He advocates more coverage on the lines of the video of a Muslim shaking hands with passersby in Manchester are the ISIL terrorist attack.

Ellis in the chat called for media to stop publicising such phrases (used by terrorists) such as, “This is for Allah”.

Listen and make up your mind.

My conclusion is that the presented views of Ellis and Ryan favour a wimpy approach by the media that would deny, rather than minimise, connection between Islam and the terror attacksin the Western world. That would be a lie. It would be gross self-deception.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/201847324/media-commentator-gavin-ellis
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June 14, 2017 2:05pm
- KevOB
  
  Read Churchill’s Second World War volume I. It seems it was like that in the 30’s too. People wished for peace so much they imputed their wishes to all.
  
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  June 14, 2017 2:28pm
- Reid
  
  Why the left never bother to explain the difference between Sunni Wahabbism and the rest of Islam, which would be illuminating to the sheeple, is beyond me.
  
  The left is correct in that the sheeple, as they do, have got hold of the wrong end of the stick: not all Islam holds the ISIS philosophy, only certain branches do. And that’s obvious.
  
  But naturally the sheeple don’t get that because evidently their heads are full of concrete just like the real things, and they’re incapable of holding two opposing ideas in their head and still functioning (i.e. all terrorists are Muslim but not all Muslims are terrorists, is something the sheeple are evidently incapable of grasping).
  
  So as I say, why doesn’t the left explain the issue? I suspect it’s because Wahhabbi Muslims aren’t white men. If they were, the left would have been onto that in no time at all, but since they aren’t, their victim|oppressor matrix worldview doesn’t compute.
  
  Don’cha just hate the left.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:21pm
Harriet

Current inferno in multi story London apartment block — probably about 12 stories high. People heard screaming.

Tell me it ain’t so.
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June 14, 2017 2:14pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  It’s actually 27 stories and looks like there will be a lot of casualties.
  No evidence that a Muslim terrorist set it on fire.
  Yet.
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:11pm
Stars And Stripes

Gang members to be blocked from firearms licenses
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/333008/gang-members-to-be-blocked-from-firearms-licenses
“The Police Minister Paula Bennett intends to block any gang member or prospect from getting a firearms license and will bring in tougher penalties under the Arms Act”.

Is this a joke or what?.
How many gang members who use firearms in robberies or shootouts actually have a firearms licence anyway?.
I suspect it is probably close to zero.
So this is actually all a crock of shit which will be roundly ignored by ferals as it is now.
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June 14, 2017 2:41pm
- mikenmild
  
  How do you legally establish membership of a gang or being a prospect?
  
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  June 14, 2017 2:52pm
  - Swifty
    
    Good question. I’d presume it will just be a call made by the local plod – based on known associates etc.
    
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    June 14, 2017 3:14pm
- Padriv Ustoev
  
  Just a segway for the next step of tightening fire arm ownership laws and disarming the population.
  
  A wise Roman once said that only slaves are unarmed.
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:11pm
Maggy Wassilieff

So no reply yet from stephieboy about why he refers to some people as white trash?

http://isreview.org/issue/103/waste-people-white-trash

It’s a worry when the so-called left are so disparaging of poor folks.
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June 14, 2017 2:53pm
- stephieboy
  
  Maggy Wassilief , spare us your crocodile tears. I ‘ve been subjected to all kinds of abuse on this blog by most of your fellow alt right loons and associated rednecks
  
  I repay back in kind .
  
  Get used to is and once again get over yourself .
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:24pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I’m not crying, stephieboy.
    
    I’ve met you faux-socialists many, many times.
    
    Happy to preach at us here on KB, but no way would you sully yourself with talking to “trash”.
    
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    June 14, 2017 3:41pm
  - Reid
    
    I ‘ve[sic] been subjected to all kinds of abuse on this blog by most of your fellow alt right loons and associated rednecks
    
    No you haven’t. I’ve exercised extraordinary restraint.
    
    I repay back in kind .[sic]
    
    No you don’t. Being insulted by you is like being insulted by a little girl poking her tongue out at one.
    
    Notwithstanding the extraordinary restraint we all exercise toward you given we understand your extraordinary limitations, thinking that you reciprocate in kind even to that mild criticism is a dream too far stephie. The only way you could possibly equal our self-restrained mild critiques of you is if you lived to 250 years old when hopefully gene therapy has advanced sufficiently to undo whatever the fuck it is which makes you, you. Because that my friend is what would be required and that’s around about how much time it’s probably going to take before science is capable of untangling and understanding the enormous challenge you represent.
    
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    June 14, 2017 4:10pm
- Manolo
  
  I reckon our multiculturalist is colour blind.
  He has managed to throw a few barbs and insults at darkies like this humble correspondent. 😀
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:34pm
Manolo

The lying Democrats and the MSM will continue crying Russia forever and a day:
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/06/13/sessions-calls-suggestion-he-colluded-with-russia-a-detestable-lie-239507

Sessions calls suggestion he colluded with Russia a ‘detestable lie’.
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June 14, 2017 3:20pm
- stephieboy
  
  Manolo , I’m sure you and your master Trump and his sidekick Seesions are deeply , deeply disturbed by current events in Russia ? ,
  
  Anti-Kremlin protesters fill Russian streets, Putin critic Navalny jailed
  
  “Baton-wielding riot police broke up anti-corruption protests and detained hundreds of demonstrators in Moscow and other Russian cities on Monday, before a court sentenced opposition leader Alexei Navalny to his second prison term this year.
  
  The protests, called by Navalny, a strong critic of Russian President Vladimir Putin, drew thousands of people and were some of the biggest in Russia since 2012….”
  
  https://www.reuters.com/article/us-russia-opposition-protests-idUSKBN192167
  
  I’m sure you with the aid of fellow Putin apologists like Reid will characterise the protests as yet another example of a nefarious Hillary Clinton inspired conspiracy .
  
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  June 14, 2017 3:31pm
  - Reid
    
    Here’s what really happened. I’ve been waiting for someone to mention it. I’m glad it’s you stephie, as it gives me a chance to prove how wrong you are, about everything, again and again and again and again and again.
    
    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
    
    Perhaps you just shouldn’t believe fake news like Reuters, don’t you know who owns that? Just one of the biggest 0.1%ers of all. I thought you’d be against people like that, being pwogwessive and all. Don’t you know who you’re shilling for, stephie?
    
    https://www.rt.com/politics/391890-russia-day-protest-rallies/
    
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    June 14, 2017 3:59pm
  - mikenmild
    
    Gee, who to believe – Reuters or the Russian government propaganda channel?
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:27pm
Ross12

First significant MSM company in this part of the world to go down. Who will be next ?
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-14/ten-enters-volutary-administration/8617078
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June 14, 2017 3:37pm
Reid

You remember Kevin Ives? Ring any bells?

He was one of the boys killed in Arkansas and placed on railroad tracks where the coroner ruled the deaths were accidental because the boys had smoked dope and fallen asleep. The mother didn’t accept this and after some appeals their bodies were exhumed, found to have stab wounds and a murder investigation was opened. Bill Clinton then governor of Arkansas claimed the coroner was stressed, gave him a pay rise and promoted him into a govt job during a time when there was a hiring freeze, which caused a political outcry.

Now the mother is suing all the alphabet agencies for the documents they hold on the details of the case, and she’s being stonewalled. Two judges have already recused themselves and the third has been holding the application since Nov 16.

For those who don’t know, the airfield at Mena Arkansas was the drop point for the drugs coming from Central America as part of the drugs-for-guns exchange that was the basis for Iran-Contra. Those who understand politics know there is a very close connection between the Bushes and the Clintons, and this operation was the first between them, which formed the basis of their criminal partnership. If you want details on the murder and the coverup thereof there are many sources but the Clinton Chronicles video is as good as any,

And this is why the govt isn’t releasing anything. Let’s hope there are some white hats somewhere in the loop, inside one or more of those alphabet agencies.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2017/06/no_author/this-could-sink-the-clintons/
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June 14, 2017 3:40pm
Reid

Massive fire in 24 story London apartment block. People trapped.

https://www.rt.com/uk/392135-west-london-tower-inferno/
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June 14, 2017 4:01pm
- Rich Prick
  
  Oh God. I know that building, it’s quite close to Shepherds Bush and Holland Park and stands out because it is the only high rise in the area.
  
  It was completely refurbished a few years ago and under UK building codes that automatically requires upgrading to modern fire protection systems especially for residential use. There is something very, very suspicious about this.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:21pm
  - Reid
    
    Yeah, what happened to the sprinklers.
    
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    June 14, 2017 4:25pm
  - sam green
    
    https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/11/20/kctmo-playing-with-fire/
    
    November 2016
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:54pm
    - Stars And Stripes
      
      Yeah just another social housing agitation page with all the usual slogans and dogma in it.
      Penny Bright produces stuff like this as well since you seem interested.
      
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      June 14, 2017 7:02pm
      - sam green
        
        Good troll. Well done. Hope you feel better.
        
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        June 14, 2017 7:06pm
      - sam green
        
        Prophetic though.
        
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        June 14, 2017 7:20pm
      - Stars And Stripes
        
        It’s a numbers game Sam.
        In rundown areas it’s only a matter of time before someone burns the place down.
        If the TAB took bets on where the next house was going to be destroyed by fire in this country the hot favourite would be Mangere or Porirua.
        Probably kid with a cigarette lighter would be the favourite for cause of fire as well.
        
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        June 14, 2017 7:27pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    Witnesses reportedly say the stairwells were the first to be fully engaged by fire. Given concrete doesn’t spontaneously combust, a lot accelerant poured down them would explain fire protection systems not coping. I’m picking a vibrant with a grudge or a yearning for his virgins. Time, and an investigation will tell.
    
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    June 14, 2017 7:27pm
noskire

Looks truly horrendous and terrifying. Odds are on that our brothers from the religion of peace are behind it.
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June 14, 2017 4:05pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Read the link properly. Faulty fridge, badly maintained building.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:09pm
  - noskire
    
    Bollocks. The building (completed in 1974) was completely renovated in 2015-2016.
    
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    June 14, 2017 4:13pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      So are you saying that a Muslim rewired the fridge?
      
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      June 14, 2017 4:23pm
      - Rich Prick
        
        They presume everything will run on 8 D-size batteries.
        
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        June 14, 2017 4:32pm
      - noskire
        
        No, maybe your head needs rewiring.
        
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        June 14, 2017 4:45pm
    - sam green
      
      You might want to read this.
      
      https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/11/20/kctmo-playing-with-fire/
      
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      June 14, 2017 6:48pm
Captain Mainwaring

Hugh, were you saying Auckland was expensive?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/homed/houses/93662155/this-derelict-london-house-costs-44-million
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June 14, 2017 4:06pm
- Reid
  
  Akld ain’t London and it ain’t Sydney or Vancouver either.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:26pm
- calendar girl
  
  The Stuff report says $4.4 million (£2.5 million), not $44 million.
  
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  June 14, 2017 4:42pm
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Bargain!
    
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    June 14, 2017 4:50pm
  - Ross12
    
    cg
    Stuff would have created the URL link , I presume.
    
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    June 14, 2017 4:59pm
skyblue

Sad what is happening in London right now with the 24 story apartment block.http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11876078
Someone has said anyone on 4th floor upwards will be toast.
Why I would never like to live in an apartment. This is one reason. You are possibly at the whim of an idiot starting a fire.
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June 14, 2017 4:45pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Link here: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/fire-engulfs-west-london-apartment-tower/news-story/fb60934d3d345bc7f7ed4ad517301d75
  
  A 27-story apartment block on a low-income housing estate (built in the 1960s). Recently re-cladded (the company that did the cladding since filed for bankruptcy). Ref: http://www.constructionenquirer.com/2015/09/14/cladding-firm-harley-curtain-wall-pre-packed/
  
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  June 14, 2017 5:20pm
Rodney Randall

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_qGTsK1_SM

Tommy Robinson: Cops threaten store over “Don’t fund terrorism” sign

Tommy Robinson of TheRebel.media talked to a Sunderland shopkeeper whose response to reports that other stores are ISIS money launderers has attracted attention, not all of it positive

The British Police have sided with Islam.
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June 14, 2017 5:00pm
sooty

Why do we not have women in the allblacks. Surely this is sexist. Surely its the womens turn now. Boy this is going to be interesting.
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June 14, 2017 5:22pm
- stigie
  
  Women have periods sooty, you just cant rush off the field to change the bloody thing when it suits..?
  
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  June 14, 2017 5:50pm
  - nasska
    
    …..”Women have periods”…..
    
    Not a problem stigie. The sisterhood promote “free bleeding” for such occasions.
    
    The real reason they’re not in the All Blacks is that most of them are too fat to make it from halfway to the try line.
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:01pm
    - stigie
      
      A good pair of boots for the heifer from Dad can make a huge difference in performance Nasska..?
      
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      June 14, 2017 6:08pm
SGA

Just got door knocked by a Christian group (the atheists are such a lazy bunch, they never drop by 🙂 🙂 ). Presentable young man with two young asian women. Didn’t stay long – I guess they figured I was a lost, albeit polite, cause. “Elohim” (of which I’d never heard) – stuff about God the mother. Looked it up after they left – seems to be attached to Korean outfit (World Mission Society Church of God). I guess that explains the young asian women. Anyone else come across them?
I was also left wondering – has anyone had the situation where, say, the Jehovah Witnesses turn up when the Mormons are already there? What’s protocol – should you ask them wait, or organise a debate between the two groups?
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June 14, 2017 5:51pm
- nasska
  
  …..” What’s protocol “…..
  
  I’ve found that answering the door holding a freshly severed goat’s head usually does the trick. 🙂
  
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  June 14, 2017 5:58pm
  - SGA
    
    Fresh! You do the rituals regularly? I’m impressed.
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:13pm
- Kimbo
  
  Yes, but did they try the trick “we are students taking a survey. Would you like to help us by participating” line? 😉
  
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  June 14, 2017 6:12pm
  - SGA
    
    That’s them! Wasn’t much of a survey 🙁
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:15pm
    - Kimbo
      
      Then maybe took you to the Book of Revelation, and started babbling about the “New Jerusalem” and the “bride of Christ”? You can try nasska’s method, but, as with Jehovah’s Witnesses, send ’em round my place. 😉
      
      Usually, within ten minutes they are running out the door. Rule # 1 when dealing with a cultist (or your average Kiwiblog propagandist/zealot, subject doesn’t matter – climate change, Muslim immigration, mine re-entry feasibility studies 😉 )
      
      …don’t let ’em take control of the agenda or question-framing. That way they have to play away from home, and not according to their coach’s pattern, and well-practiced drills. Once you do that, it’s like the All Blacks vs Georgia. Yeah, they do ok for awhile, but you know they will run out of puff, their discipline will slip, they’ll lose their temper, and drop the ball.
      
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      June 14, 2017 6:31pm
      - nasska
        
        They can’t beat a professional Godnutter having a good day. 🙂
        
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        June 14, 2017 6:36pm
      - SGA
        
        Then maybe took you to the Book of Revelation, and started babbling about the “New Jerusalem” and the “bride of Christ”?
        
        No, they didn’t bother – their hearts didn’t seem in it.
        
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        June 14, 2017 6:49pm
  - nasska
    
    That’s when you mumble something like “I’ve got to get back to my sacrifice……Satan’s waiting” & close the door Kimbo. 🙂
    
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    June 14, 2017 6:16pm
    - mikenmild
      
      I don’t let them in unless they have the right spell to turn wine into blood.
      
      3 4
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      June 14, 2017 6:33pm
    - Kimbo
      
      I’ve found the flaw in your method, should these guys ever start evangelising, rather than, as per Anton Levay, cashing in on the incredulity and stupidity of Christian fundamentalists to given them free publicity and resulting downstream enrichment (same wheeze worked for Ozzy Osborne and Black Sabbath, btw) 😉
      
      http://www.churchofsatan.com/
      
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      June 14, 2017 6:35pm
      - noskire
        
        Just sit them down on your couch and let them watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xagqiIVW6qk
        
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        June 14, 2017 7:05pm
rangitoto

Sacre Bleu. The frogs running out of butter.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4601452/Surging-price-butter-threatens-France-s-pastry-makers.html
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June 14, 2017 6:03pm
Hugh Pavletich

Aussies getting the glums …

Consumer sentiment sinks – MacroBusiness Australia

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/06/consumer-sentiment-sinks/

Consumer sentiment fell again in June The Westpac–Melbourne Institute Consumer Sentiment Index decreased for the third consecutive month, by 1.8 per cent in June following decreases of 1.1 per cent in May and of 0.7 per cent in April, indicating that consumers in Australia are becoming less optimistic. At 96.2, the Index is 5.8 per cent below its level a year ago. Read more via link above …
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June 14, 2017 6:05pm
MCos

Cop: Sir, do u know how fast u were going?

Me: That’s confidential.

Cop: Sir?

Me: Executive privilege.

Cop: Step out of the car, sir
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June 14, 2017 6:13pm
noskire

After nine episodes, I’m finding Better Call Saul to be a bit of a drag.
Sure, the acting and bespoke cinematography is great – but I’m sure that those who hadn’t seen Breaking Bad would stick it out this long.
I’m wondering if it might have been better to focus as a background story about Mike Ehrmantraut?
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June 14, 2017 6:39pm
- howitis
  
  I agree with that.
  
  I tried Breaking Bad. I gave it 3.5 episodes and it did not enthuse me. goneburger!
  So I tried Better Call Saul. I had no idea who anyone was as I did not see B/Bad. I had seen the actor Bob Odenkirk on Series one of Fargo as the wimpy Police chief.
  Given vague knowledge of B/Bad I expected a bad arse lawyer. A cry baby loser would not last in the tough world of drug running.
  The first 2 programs were weak. I stuck with S.1 to episode 4 and he was still in loser mode. I jumped to S.2 and after 2 or 3 episodes gave up. This was on Lightbox.
  Then s.3 was announced. I watched half Ep 1 and it was still loser mode. Hard to get behind the guy.
  I found the Mike E story held interest but unlike a DVD where you can fast forward to catch the next scene with him in it, on streaming you have to jump to a specific spot. Ergo: too hard to follow.
  I jumped to S3. Ep 3 and gave up into that.
  
  The guy who played Mike E I vaguely recognised. It turns out he was the bad guy in Beverly Hills Cop (1) that went to Detroit to murder Axel’s friend that set it all off. That was over 30 years ago. He was pretty rough looking even then.
  
  The blond lawyer was a very attractive woman and I doubt in the real world she would attach herself to a loser when she had worked so hard to get where she was.
  The brother storyline with his phobia was a bit much.
  
  I found it pretty bad and wonder how it has rated well or how it lasted so long. I would even rate Season 2 of True Detective as better and that was marginal and heavily padded to make it last 10 episodes.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:45pm
  - Reid
    
    Who knows taste but you may be making a mistake with Breaking Bad. Just it takes a lot to get me interested in something and it’s rare, but that one really did it once I’d got into it.
    
    Haven’t tried Don’t call Saul.
    
    But like I say, taste is taste. What do I care. Just that good series are few and far between, take em when you see em.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:52pm
Rodney Randall

https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/11/20/kctmo-playing-with-fire/

“We believe that the KCTMO are an evil, unprincipled, mini-mafia who have no business to be charged with the responsibility of looking after the every day management of large scale social housing estates and that their sordid collusion with the RBKC Council is a recipe for a future major disaster.”

“It is a truly terrifying thought but the Grenfell Action Group firmly believe that only a catastrophic event will expose the ineptitude and incompetence of our landlord, the KCTMO, and bring an end to the dangerous living conditions and neglect of health and safety legislation that they inflict upon their tenants and leaseholders,” the group writes.

We have blogged many times on the subject of fire safety at Grenfell Tower and we believe that these investigations will become part of damning evidence of the poor safety record of the KCTMO should a fire affect any other of their properties and cause the loss of life that we are predicting:”

Scary stuff.
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June 14, 2017 7:44pm
- Rodney Randall
  
  “In October 2015 a fire ripped through another KCTMO property, the 14 storey Adair Tower in North Kensington, causing mass panic and resulting in a number of residents taken to hospital suffering from smoke inhalation. It is reported that had it not been for the swift actions of the London Fire Brigade the consequences of this fire and potential loss of life could have been much worse.
  
  http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11967592/50-rescued-from-burning-flats-in-Kensington.html
  
  In the aftermath of the Adair Tower fire the London Fire Brigade found that the KCTMO had not been looking after the safety of residents properly and issued an Enforcement Order compelling them to improve the fire safety in the escape staircases and to provide self closing devices to all the tower block’s front doors. A further audit by the London Fire Brigade of the neighbouring Hazelwood Tower (located alongside Adair Tower) found similar breaches of health and safety legislation and an Enforcement Order was also issued for this property forcing the TMO to address the serious concerns of the Fire Brigade’s inspectors. What is shocking is that a decade ago a fatality occurred due to a fire at Hazelwood Tower and the Fire Investigation Team ordered that the grills on the fire escape staircase be covered over. This never happened and it is believed that the uncovered grills at Adair House (Hazelwood Tower’s twin block) acted like a chimney and were responsible for the accelerated spread of the fire and smoke damage.”
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:14pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  A contact in the UK mentions the following possibilities:
  
  – Alarms not going off/going off in hallway only
  – No sprinkler system
  – Residents warning last year the place was a fire hazard
  – The escape routes full of suitcases/used for storage
  – Gas pipes running through the escape stair well
  -Little advice to residents what to do in the event of a fire. What little there was was to stay put and wait for fire service
  – Flammable building cladding. Photos of the fire show flames shooting up the side of the building (cladding on fire) to jump from one floor to another
  – Also the cladding seems to have produced awful plastic fumes.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:04pm
  - sam green
    
    No comment thus far from Theresa May. No -“we’ll get the bastards” – potentially given that it looks likely that a private management company has blood on its hands rather than islamacist extremists.
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:40pm
    - Gabby
      
      Company does shit job then goes bust so no liability – never happen here thank goodness.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:30pm
    - sam green
      
      It took a while but the PM is now “saddened”.
      
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      June 14, 2017 11:21pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  I looked at coverage of that awful fire in West Kensington. I watched Qatari Tv (Al Jazeera), Russian Tv and the BBC.
  Amongst the big number of concerned residents I never ever saw any white skinned people who spoke with a Pommy accent.
  This must be a different part of the olde England that I love.
  Not the sort of people who call Stamford Bridge, or White Hart Lane, home.
  
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  June 14, 2017 9:40pm
  - sam green
    
    Funny – I’m just watching one now?
    
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    June 14, 2017 9:42pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    Try buying a bottle of wine in Whitechaple and making the walk back to Tower Hill with a black off-licence bag. The Muslims will assault you. I had to stand up to one of them and threaten to bottle him if he didn’t fuck off. It’s rife. What’s happened to lovely England? The one I used to love.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:22pm
    - Rich Prick
      
      Just for the down ticker, I spend a lot of time close to the fringe of the East End, do you really want to encorange me to actually bottle the next Muslim fucker in his doily head gear and pyjamas out on the street harrassing me? Because I’d happily insert the pointy end of a bottle of Sav into an eye socket.
      
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      June 14, 2017 10:48pm
      - sam green
        
        How on earth could a mere downtick “encorange” anyone to do anything. Perhaps you need some psychotherapy for your PTSD.
        
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        June 14, 2017 11:53pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    Taheui, hate to shatter your fond memories of London, but that building was full of Muslims from Somalia, Iraq, Syria, Pakistan, Eritrea, Sudan, and every other shithole you can imagine. West London ain’t immune. They weren’t nice folk from Norway, France or Italy. It went up in flames for a good reason and Allah will reveal all soon. Of that I am sure.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:34pm
  - howitis
    
    It is now Londonistan, Tauhei.
    
    The decline of the Anglo-Saxon population in London in the last 20 years (since Tony Bliar) has been rapid, and very rapid in the last 6 years …so only this decade.
    Londonistan even has its own Mooslem Mayor now.
    Kensington was lost to the foreigners years ago.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/article-3412616/How-Labour-turned-London-foreign-city.html
    
    It is not only London but the Northern and Midland places started 50 years ago.
    
    The politicians have done the British a great disservice. Enoch was right.
    
    All the British conquering has had consequences years down the track and the recent lax attitude of not defending their borders has come at a cost this century.
    You understand the vote for Brexit when you understand this.
    The country that fought tooth and nail 75 years ago for its survival, culture, and language has simply and meekly given up.
    Well, the treasonous politicians have.
    
    Sydney less than 3 hours flight away is on the same track.
    Very rapid change inside 10 years and the jolly ol’ taxpayer pays for their breeding program.
    
    Coming to a city near you…..
    Yay for Globalisation!!
    Yay for Social Welfare.
    Just whose welfare, we need to identify.
    
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    June 14, 2017 10:42pm
sooty

William of Ockham, wins internet idiot of the day. With 550 odd down ticks at 7.45pm. He far exceds Hugh,stephieboy and the stupid old lady that will not pay her rates must pale in to insignificance compared to the onslaught by WoO. She must be pissed
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June 14, 2017 7:55pm
- nasska
  
  Another sterling effort by WofO. I’ve noticed that even in the somewhat slower weekends he can make it out of the back door in a little over an hour.
  
  Pimping climate change ain’t the doodle it used to be. 🙂
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:12pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    I imagine it must be like being a Blackberry salesman in an Apple world.
    
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    June 14, 2017 8:22pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Give him his due, he’s an insomniac so he’s usually ready to hit the button right on 8:00 when Hugh and the mad woman are still deep in dreamland.
  Which they are during the day as well.
  And so is William.
  
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  June 14, 2017 8:36pm
Jack5

An interesting perspective on NZ’s immigration changes from an Asian immigration consultant.

https://youtu.be/Gi7uZbI5nGk
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June 14, 2017 10:25pm
fernglas

America’s first act of terrorism since Trump’s election. Not Muslim, but one of those vets that Trump has promised to help. The man seems mentally unwell. The answer to preventing terrorist acts is clearly more complex than a travel ban.
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June 15, 2017 3:58am

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