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December 24, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 24 December 2021

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General Debate

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Benedict Yu

This is propaganda.

“The drug is used to de-worm livestock and to treat a very limited number of parasitic diseases in humans, but the Ministry of Health has warned it could cause serious harm if used to treat or prevent Covid-19.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/127360835/doctor-challenges-seizure-of-ivermectin-the-unapproved-covid19-drug-he-imported-for-patients

I am not an ivermectin cheer leader. I have not devoted the time to looking at its efficacy. That is not the point of my comment. Rather it is the lies and propaganda in the article that would leave readers with the idea that ivermectin is for horses and would only be used by dangerous fools.

Ivermectin has been in widespread use for 40 years. It has saved millions from horrible diseases and has been given in BILLIONS of doses. With far fewer side effects than the covid vaccines.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/

The inventors won the Nobel Prize for the development.!!!

It would obviously be dangerous if you took the wrong dose or the veterinary versions. We are not cows.

But for Medsafe to say it is dangerous is pure lies. There is no evidence for that statement.
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December 24, 2021 8:03am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  They are lying again, just can’t help it.
  Fear porn never stops
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:07am
  - mawm
    
    This is pure evil disinformation. But I suppose that they have to start covering for the vaccine failure that we are going to see when Omicron starts spreading.
    
    https://dailysceptic.org/2021/12/22/triple-vaccinated-more-than-four-times-more-likely-to-test-positive-for-omicron-than-unvaccinated-data-shows/
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:17am
    - Don Beckett
      
      That’s correct.
      Anyway, my Ivermectin arrived last week – enough for myself & a couple of friends to take as advised by the likes of Dr. Peter McCullough and NZDSOS.
      It’s only going to be used if we get “the deadly” virus, so who knows – I may have it for the next deadly pandemic – where the “so-called-vaccine” in NZ has killed nearly as many people as the virus itself.
      
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      December 24, 2021 10:21am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        There are dickheads out there who think people would get the same dose as a horse.
        IQ of room temperature, and I am talking celsius
        
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        December 24, 2021 10:46am
      - Sideoiler
        
        Did you import it from overseas?
        If so could you direct me to a seller, how did things go through NZ Customs?
        
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        December 24, 2021 10:47am
      - Matt Long
        
        The mg/kg recommendation of ivermectin for people is very similar to livestock, I guess there are people who might give the same dose to a person as to a full grown horse but those kinds of people really shouldn’t be allowed outside without supervision.
        
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        December 24, 2021 12:13pm
      - bronny1
        
        From where please?
        
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        December 24, 2021 3:49pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        Are you trying to suggest that in NZ the vaccine has killed as many as the virus?
        Where did you hear that unmitigated lie?
        
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        December 24, 2021 6:36pm
      - mawm
        
        Fight4 – This is an interesting read. I don’t know if it is correct, I’m not a statistician. https://dailytelegraph.co.nz/news/relationship-between-vaccination-and-all-cause-mortality-for-the-60-cohort-in-new-zealand/
        
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        December 24, 2021 8:39pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        Another interesting read:
        https://www.newsroom.co.nz/medsafes-vaccine-safety-reports-misused-by-anti-vaxxers
        
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        December 25, 2021 12:02am
- Charmaine Hawke
  
  I think it is save to say instead of evidence based policy making now we have policy based evidence making.
  When we get out of this nightmare organisations like Medsafe will have much explaining to do.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:08am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Medsafe amuse me – they are effectively a standards approving organisation and require this for therapeutics they approve:
    https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/regulatory/Guideline/GRTPNZ/manufacture-of-medicines.pdf
    
    “Section 1: Good Manufacturing Practice
    Documentation”
    
    I wonder if they hold an independent systems quality certification themselves – say ISO? I doubt it.
    While following the COMIRNATY™ approval versions, I noted the updates referenced at the end. In one version move the approval additions for 12+ kids was referenced but not the 21 to 42 day jab interval change ( you-know – when supplies “weren’t short” in July) but because we were told it was the new best practice. I also note that that best practice is now 21 days in the the current version.
    Funny how a standards type organisation can’t follow basic document control standards!
    
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    December 24, 2021 3:01pm
- Pavel
  
  But they have an expert panel of fact checkers so you can trust what they publish is true (sarc). For a website that goes on about this one needs to ask, when will will they be held to the standards they claim to uphold? There needs to be laws in place to make them accountable for their actions. Stuff is an absolute embarrassment to the media industry in NZ. Often when I read their “stuff” I feel like I understand why some countries close down organisation’s like this and throw them all in jail. I don’t understand how they are allowed to keep operating when they spread so much b.s day after day after day. It’s like NZ media is in a race to the bottom.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:18am
  - redeye
    
    On one of their begging boxes that pop up asking for subscriptions they claim ‘they’re trying to make the world a better place’
    I’ve always thought that was a tacit admission they were not about news at all.
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:03am
- R
  
  I imagine Pfizer doesn’t want anything to interfere with it rapacious money-making vaccine. Pfizer is also making money from an anti-viral drug which NZ has purchased. Covid is like manna from heaven.
  
  New figures from the Peoples Vaccine Alliance reveal that the companies behind two of the most successful COVID-19 vaccines —Pfizer, BioNTech and Moderna— are making combined profits of $65,000 every minute [$93.6 million per day]…Meanwhile 98 percent of people in low income countries have not been fully vaccinated.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127200631/covid19-government-buys-new-pfizer-antiviral-drug-to-fight-virus
  
  https://reliefweb.int/report/world/pfizer-biontech-and-moderna-making-1000-profit-every-second-while-world-s-poorest
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:22am
  - Stellaboxer
    
    Interesting headlines in the UK Telegraph, “Omicron is up to 70 per cent less likely to cause hospitalisation, UKHSA reveals
    New government analysis also reveals that protection offered by Covid booster jabs wanes more rapidly against the variant” Looks as if Mother Nature has connived to end the politicians and big pharmaceutical companies beano doesn’t it. I’m sure Ardern, Baker and Hendy will go hard in attempting to keep it out when they should be encouraging it in and I’m sure they’ll advocate most strongly that everyone accept more jabs that don’t work against it and aren’t needed anyway but the truth is it’s over. Merry Christmas and a happy New Year and thanks to all on Kiwi blog that reassured me that the country wasn’t entirely going mad over the last year. May your god bless you in the next.
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:16am
    - Jim
      
      Maybe the foolish (yet enterprising) kiwi dude who received x10 vaccinations on behalf of ‘clients’ is actually ahead of the big pharma game. If he lives and doesn’t die of Delta or Omincon, big pharma should be reassured and use this as evidence to push for booster shot No 1-8 before Christmas 2022.
      
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      December 24, 2021 6:42pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    “Meanwhile 98 percent of people in low income countries have not been fully vaccinated.”
    
    They shouldn’t feel so bad – 100% of people who have received jabs and boosters are not fully vaccinated.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:00am
  - Spoff
    
    It is crucial to Pfizer and co that proven therapeutics such as Ivermectin are kept out of the picture. The “Emergency Use Application” (which is how they have circumvented the required testing procedure for the “vaccine”) is dependent on there being no other remedies available.
    Were any such remedies be approved, the “vaccines” would have to revert to proper testing procedure (five years worth) before being allowed back on the market.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:05am
- Marcus Vinicius
  
  Good post Benedict,
  
  There is also this that mentions that Ivermectin is approved by the FDA in the USA for treatment of some tropical diseases.
  
  https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:44am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Yep. And it’s become very clear, as experts warned from the beginning, that reliance on leaky vaccines during a pandemic only leads to evolution of variants that the vaccines don’t work against (eg Omicron).
  
  It’s a very bad idea to persist in such a long term damaging (to population immune systems due to ‘original antigenic sin’ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_antigenic_sin ) vaccine dependent approach. The leaky vaccine band-aid has to be ripped off ASAP.
  
  What is far more sensible is using pharmaceuticals to diminish risk – most of us better informed types are now taking zinc and vit D and maybe a few others like curcumin and quercetin for example), and there are other drugs that can be used as prophylactic antivirals (antivirals most effective in first few days after infection when you don’t even know you have caught it), if only medical establishment could shake off the malignant profit seeking influence of Big Pharma and promote unprofitable solutions instead.
  https://c19early.com/
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:46am
- Aunty
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Well if it’s that marvelous and is a cure-all for everything, let’s give it to cancer patients. It will cure them too, right? We could call it Doc Holiday’s Elixir To Cure All Ills. Dirt cheap at $5.99 a bottle.
  
  Until such time that a properly designed and conducted randomized double blind placebo-controlled clinical trial is carried out and the results published after peer-review it is not possible to say with any certainty that ivermectin has any benefit in the treating of covid patients. Until that time all claims are anecdotal.
  
  Ring-a-ring o’ roses,
  A pocket full of posies,
  A-tishoo! A-tishoo!
  We all fall down
  
  We have been here before.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:49am
  - septic skeptic
    
    The article says Ivermectin is dangerous in high doses. Therefore it should be banned even in appropriate doses. OK, then:
    Didn’t they say last week it was dangerous to get something like 8 shots of Pfizer in a single day? Therefore we should ban Pfizer on the same basis?
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:00am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Ivermectin won’t kill you unless you take something 10-200x the recommended daily dose (probably towards upper end as LD50 isn’t known for humans, only conservatively estimated based on animal tests). Paracetamol is about 30x and we *gasp* allow people to use that without prescription or oversight from medical professionals.
      
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      December 24, 2021 11:05am
  - RightNow
    
    Ivmmeta.com
    That enough proof for you?
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:03am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Aunty, yet in NZ you can be prescribed Remdesvir to treat Covid, and it has a well known peer reviewed study that shows it is completely ineffective, can cause serious kidney damage as a side effect, and costs something like $8K a treatment.
    
    Although you are trying (and failing) to be sarcastic, Ivermectin has no known specific anti-cancer activity (though some could be discovered), but does have a significant number of trials that show that it is effective against Covid. Many of the trials are relatively small scale, but for some reason the medical powers that be refuse to organise a larger trial to demonstrate its usefulness or otherwise. In fact if you propose to run one you are likely to have your medical licence suspended in many locations. That is absolutely a sign that the case against Ivermectin is purely political, not medical at all. As is this propaganda campaign about how it is dangerous.
    
    It is dangerous only in the sense that if it works s it appears to, it is about as effective as the vaccines – does not prevent infection, reduces serious symptoms, hospitalisation, and deaths by around 80-90%; and is dirt cheap and a hell of a lot safer than the vaccines. So you can see why the medical establishment that has nailed its colours to the mast over vaccination would find something that so thoroughly upset their wrong headed ideas would be dangerous.
    
    One point that can be made, Ivermectin is, when correctly prescribed, extremely safe, with a fatality rate of around 1 per 100,000,000. So if all of NZ was compulsorily dosed with it, there would be around a 5% chance of at most a single death. So, given its low cost, why not dish it out to anyone who tests positive as a treatment, the placebo effect alone would lead to a noticeable improvement in outcomes ! Right now, you get a positive test and don’yt need to be hospitalised, you get ZERO treatment. That is criminal neglect.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:15pm
- Spoff
  
  Robert Llewellyn Clancy is an emeritus professor at the University of Newcastle’s School of Biomedical Sciences and Pharmacy. He was previously Foundation Chair of Pathology at the University of Newcastle and earlier in his career, was the first clinical immunologist at the Royal Prince Alfred Hospital, Sydney. He was educated at North Sydney Boys High School. He holds a B.Sc.Med (Hons) and a MB.BS (Hons) from the University of Sydney, and a PhD from Monash University. He is a fellow of the Royal Australasian College of Physicians (FRACP) and the Royal College of Pathologists of Australia.
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Clancy_(doctor)
  “Thirty frontline doctors in Australia recently treated over 600 patients with Covid-19. The treatment strategy was ivermectin (IVM) with doxycycline and zinc. Five patients required admission to hospital for progressive Covid-19 symptoms. There were no deaths. In a similar number of contemporary Australian patients not treated with IVM, 70 were admitted to hospital and 6 died. This is consistent with world data bases: 31 randomised controlled trials show 62% benefit with IVM and 7 meta-analyses recorded a reduction in death between 57-83%. Experienced clinicians have moved on, to combine IVM with additional drugs, usually a broad-spectrum antibiotic such as doxycycline and zinc which has viricidal activity…….”
  https://www.nzcpr.com/robert-clancy-the-covid-enigma/#more-35829
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:50am
  - mawm
    
    Ssshh! Don’t tell Aunty, you might destroy her little world.
    Then there’s this as well – “Ivermectin effectively suppresses the proliferation and metastasis of cancer cells and promotes cancer cell death at doses that are nontoxic to normal cells.”
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1043661820315152
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:26am
- Allan
  
  The phfizer vaccine has most probably killed or seriously injured more people world wide than Ivermectin has. Ivermectin has a proven safe record as well as no known long term effects unlike the Mrna vaccines. Why are they so against this. Corruption is a word that springs to mind or is there something in the Phfizer contract that was signed stating that they would not promote alternative treatment other than the jab.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:52am
  - Philview
    
    If any opposition MPs read this I urge them to confront the Minister of Health about the number of people in cardiac wards around the country. I am hearing stories from someone in the healthcare field that there has been quite a spike in one hospital in recent weeks most likely related to vaccine reactions.
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:31am
    - curry4me
      
      Philview: I think if National did that; some of their big donors might close the cheque book, because they were being ‘irresponsible’. Ditto for ACT.
      
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      December 24, 2021 4:25pm
  - Local Miller
    
    The opposition to Ivermectin and any other existing treatments from CV-19 is based in the push for emergency approval of the vaccine. Big Pharma and Dr F know that FDA regulations prevent emergency use approval if there are any existing, already approved medications that could be used off label to treat the virus. They had to keep existing treatments off the table to get approval so they could make all that money.
    
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    December 24, 2021 11:24am
  - Spoff
    
    “The phfizer vaccine has most probably killed or seriously injured more people world wide than Ivermectin has.”
    Most assuredly.
    “Our experience, unlike that of Barkwell and Shields, shows that administration of ivermectin to geriatric patients does not produce an excess of deaths. This finding accords with several other reports in the published research noting a high degree of safety for this drug in both animals and human beings.”
    – The Lancet 07 June 1997.
    
    Last I saw, the U.S. VAERS had approaching 20,000 deaths reported associated with mRNA “vaccines”.
    
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    December 24, 2021 12:44pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Probably has, there is no doubt at all that the Pfizer vaccine has killed a lot more than 100 x the people who have died from taking Ivermectin. IM has a death toll around 55 for 4.7B doses. The number of deaths from the Pfizer vaccine is hard to get good numbers on because the data is (understandably from the medical authorities standpoint) obfuscated, but it is in the tens of thousands at the very least, for a somewhat larger distribution.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:19pm
  - Jim
    
    Just shut up and respect ‘the science’ and look forward to our government pushing Uncle Pfizer’s Snake Oil booster 1 and 2 before July 2022.
    
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    December 24, 2021 6:53pm
- crikey
  
  Widespread use of Ivermectin (millions of doses administered) in the Indian state of Uttar Pradesh as a prophylactic treatment for Covid-19 (with much-reduced vaccination by the way) puts paid to the lie about safety of Ivermectin for human consumption.
  
  Medsafe should not be engaging in what amounts to no more than a political spin campaign.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:01am
- Spoff
  
  From Medsafe:
  ” Thank you for your email. Please find some bullet points below regarding ivermectin. Ivermectin is not approved for prevention or treatment of COVID-19 disease in New Zealand, or in any other OECD countries. ”
  My response:
  “Please update your data:
  Ivermectin is approved for use in treatment of COVID-19 disease in Japan (off-label but widely used), Mexico, Slovakia, the Czech Republic, Portugal, – all OECD countries. In addition it has been used with remarkable results in Guatemala, Argentina, Brazil, Bolivia, India, Zimbabwe, Nigeria, Egypt and South Africa. There are currently clinical trials with ivermectin ongoing in the UK and Australia.”
  Medsafe replied:
  “Thank you for your email and for providing me with updated advice. I will update our advice…..”
  Then, after a dollop of double-speak:
  ” Medsafe has not issued any directive to GPs regarding ivermectin. Under the Medicines Act a doctor can prescribe any medicine to treat any condition for a patient under their care. ”
  
  Not sure how truthful this last is. I know a GP who has been forbidden to prescribe it.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:15am
  - Allan
    
    The medsafe site on ivermectin states.:
    “”The authorised prescriber must be satisfied that the individual’s clinical need for the medicine outweighs the risks of taking the imported medicine. By authorising release, the authorised prescriber takes responsibility for prescribing the medicine for that individual.””
    I know that if I do contract any version of Covid I will be taking a copy of this statement along to my GP along with articles that are on the beneficial effects of prescribing Ivermectin and proving its effectiveness and demanding that I be given a prescription for Ivermectin and doxycycline. There is so much evidence now world wide that this works Medsafe and the Medical Board of Directors must have blindfolds on not to have seen it.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:42am
  - solarsailer
    
    The Doctors have been silenced by their professional bodies. No debate or discussion because any who deviate can expect repercussions. Apparently the influence of Big Pharma in medicine isn’t an issue now, coincidentally resolving itself around the same time as Big Pharma started selling a covid vaccine .
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:25pm
- gorse
  
  I use an Ivermectin pour on on my livestock. You do get it on you when you do that. All the care in the world, but stroppy animals can and do cause spillage. Never felt any ill effects, and I have had a good dose from time to time.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:17am
  - Don Beckett
    
    My doctor has a hobby farm with some sheep. He gets his Ivermectin drench and runs it over his arms, then after a couple of minutes washes it off.
    He gets a regular dose. 🙂
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:30am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Yeah, but for best effect it really needs to be taken internally and at the correct dosage which is calculated on a per body weight basis.
      
      I don’t think that the dose could easily be accurately assessed for this sort of absorption !
      
      And in a very limited sense, this is the danger, with the mandated lack of human appropriate dosing, it is possible that some desperate and probably not too bright people might resort to using education prepared for animals. Those can have different binders and ingredients, as well as quite inappropriate doses. But people would only do that because they are denied ready access to the real thing. So any “accidents” with inappropriate dosages can be blamed on the ban as actual access to the real thing is extremely safe.
      
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      December 24, 2021 1:24pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Yes and the so called Covid vaccines have worked well havent they. First time Ive seen a so called vaccine that not only doesnt prevent you getting the disease but doesnt stop you passing it on. Forget the ‘oh but if your vaxxed its less dangerous” How many have died from the vax. I hear its over 100 healthy in NZ alone.
  As I have posted gotta wonder if the Drug Companies are milking Covid for their shareholders.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:55am
  - mawm
    
    Plenty of people who have been fully vaccinated have died from Covid as well.
    
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    December 24, 2021 12:01pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Strictly speaking, by the “old” standard of what a vaccine is, the current versions are not really what would have been labelled vaccines at all, but rather act as reasonably effective prophylactic immune system booster treatment to reduce serious illness. Useful as such but applicability restricted based in age and health status.
    
    Really one would expect a vaccine to have some impact in reducing infection and spread, at least one would have. In “newspeak” of course, this is a “real” vaccine, because they say so.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:28pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Exactly. As vaccines go, it’s a bit shit, eh.
      
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      December 24, 2021 6:31pm
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Medsafe’s whole existence depends on lies. It is an entirely harmful bureaucracy dedicated to controlling people’s lives that should be abolished.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:57am
  - Andrei
    
    “Medsafe” is an oxymoron
    
    How can bureacrats who never see patients know more than the clinicians who actually treat them on a daily basis?
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:23am
- Sacha
  
  I think that if we could read the contract for the supply of the Pfizer vaccine, between the Government and Pfizer we would know exactly why we are not allowed to have the benefit of Ivermectin treatment.
  Remember that use of the Pfizer vaccine was approved under Emergency Use Authority without extensive clinical trials, (because of the ‘pandemic’) which can only be given if. there is no ‘recognised’ treatment for the condition .
  And of course there is no profit to be made.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:11am
- fisho
  
  It’s not just that they’re lying, it’s the fact they’re effectively acting as the mouthpiece for commercial entities who have much to gain if they are the only option.
  It’s clear their product is nowhere near as effective as they initially trumpeted, so it would be more than good to have a layered approach to prevention and treatment which includes alternate/supplementary products, particularly if they’re already available, cheap and safe (in the right doses). And it does appear that wherever Ivermectin is in use, they are experiencing lower rates of major infection at least, significantly lower rates of symptomatic infection at best.
  The misinformation campaign as you’ve described it is nothing short of criminal. As is the failure to call for aspiration of the syringe when administering the vaccinations themselves.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:17am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Ivermectin would also meant the new cases of Covid would be much lower – kills the fear porn of Govt control
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:49am
- Fletch
  
  Meanwhile, the media are touting Molnupiravir, which supposedly was originally created for horses as a treatment for Venezuelan equine encephalitis virus (VEEV). Go figure…
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:28am
  - Ed Snack
    
    From what I can find out about Molnupiravir, it is one of a class of drugs that have been investigated before but not commercialised because they are potent cancer promoters.
    
    Moderna claims that their version (Molnupiravir) does not have that side effect, but from what I can see there is insufficient evidence to make that claim except that in the very short term no statistically valid impact is seen in the data that has been released. The risk is however, significant. I would be very wary of receiving this except in extremis.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:32pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      and latest trials have shown it to be nearly useless – though that is no impediment for FDA approval when you have Big Pharma’s influence.
      
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      December 24, 2021 3:28pm
- Jim
  
  Joe Rogan covered this well and exposed the corruption of the medical fraternity. Big pharma and medicinal regulators are common bedfellows.
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:48pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  That is a truly disgusting action. Also by the MoH who basically are saying it is dangerous. It is lying by using deliberate misinformation. Whoever is responsible for it should be sacked instantly. This is a new low for this government and the sycophants and shills who have sold their souls for 20 pieces of silver. Nauseating actions.
  
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  December 24, 2021 3:20pm
- John Pakes
  
  For goodness sake Benedict, you are slowly getting worse and worse. The link you provided alerted me to:
  Invermectin has been used with great success in the tropics and saved millions from horrible diseases as you say.
  You are correct.
  The diseases are Onchocerciasis which is caused by a parasitic worm that is transmitted by the blind fly, and Lymphatic Filariasis which again is a parasitic worm and transmitted by mosquitos. It has also been used in the treatment of lice and head mites in humans. It is given in one annual dose. (Those folk who have ordered more should ask for their money back)
  I am surprised that you would ever need research to prove the efficacy of something in the treatment of a virus when it was developed to look after worms. It just will not work. You are wasting yours and our time in your crusade to belittle medsafe.
  
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  December 24, 2021 4:04pm
  - Fletch
    
    Actually, IVM has proved very successful in fighting Covid as demonstrated by the countries who have used it such as Utter Pradesh in India and Japan (from August). Articles in the American Journal of Therapeutics also rate it highly against Covid.
    
    Just because a drug or medicine was designed to fight a certain malady doesn’t mean it cannot be used off label to fight something else.
    
    Ivermectin works in many ways, one being as a protease inhibitor which inhibits viral replication.
    But it shouldn’t be dismissed.
    
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7996102/
    
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    December 24, 2021 4:30pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Hi John, you wouldn’t take a drug that was formulated to poison rats, would you? Would you?
    
    Step forward, Warfarin. Used widely as a blood thinner by many heart patients.
    
    It is not uncommon for medicines to be repurposed as new efficacies are uncovered.
    
    So, open your mind and do some research. You might surprise yourself.
    
    8 1
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    December 24, 2021 6:40pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    With every comment you make you reinforce your ignorance and bitterness. It’s a sad thing to witness a human being so twisted out of shape. Get some help.
    
    1 1
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    December 25, 2021 1:40pm
  - Spoff
    
    Read and digest John:
    https://www.nzcpr.com/robert-clancy-the-covid-enigma/#more-35829
    
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    December 25, 2021 2:38pm
fernglas

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/21-year-old-man-arrested-and-charged-with-murder-following-death-of-10-month-old-baby-in-auckland/VEYKY6HBNEZWX3HKY24UDJRQBQ/
Statistically, in New Zealand, the chances of a child being beaten to death by a family member are about 5 times higher than of them dying from Covid, and there are many more who don’t die but suffer long term physical and psychological effects from violent abuse. Has Pfizer been looking into a vaccine against this? What measures does the Government propose to prevent this from happening again?
Is this what caused the death of the under 10 year old who tested positive for Covid after death? And if it was, why is the fact that the child had Covid allowed to be made public, but not the actual cause of death?
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December 24, 2021 8:04am
- R
  
  Has Pfizer been looking into a vaccine against this?
  
  The Government has spent billions trying to save the lives of people in their 80s and 90s. But young children with their whole lives ahead of them, that’s put in the too-hard-basket.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:31am
  - Prince
    
    Worse. Govt has borrowed $135 Billion, $74,000 per household, growing at $83 Million per day.
    
    But Robertson is ‘relaxed’, and believes that some magical growth in GDP due to, who knows what, will spin his crap into gold sometime down the track.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:41am
- fisho
  
  [Deleted – not here thanks. mod.]
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:25am
- Jim
  
  Please don’t tempt big pharma, Omicron had only been identified for 2-3 weeks and despite Governments needing more data (than SA provided) big pharma confidently offered a specific percentage efficacy of their existing vaccine! Get the booster! Really?! Amazing speed and good fortune.
  I wouldn’t be too surprised if given any opportunity big pharma would also claim 76.7% reduction in family violence, despite it not guaranteeing prevention of infant death.
  
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  December 24, 2021 1:00pm
Tony Stuart

60 people have been hospitalised in Auckland this year due to gunshot injuries. And there was another fatal shooting last night in Mt Roskill, which has also led to two people being admitted to hospital.

Labour seems to have conceded defeat against the rising incidence of gang-related gun crime #ChurJacinda
78 2
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December 24, 2021 8:06am
- pdm
  
  Inv – 9 people have died in road accidents this week alone.
  
  29 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:11am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Time to lockdown the roads and put masks on the cars then
    
    5 0
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    December 24, 2021 5:25pm
- Julie
  
  We are staying in Auckland over New Years, i think we have more to worry about from gun violence than Covid!
  No vaccinations against that disease unfortunately.
  
  45 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:11am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    No, as far as I know there is no vaccine for high velocity lead poisoning!
    
    29 0
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    December 24, 2021 9:20am
    - Jack5
      
      Ardern’s clampdown on law-abiding New Zealand gun owners has really worked, hasn’t it?
      
      Seymour was the only MP with the intelligence and guts to try to get measured review by Parliamentary committee of NZ gun ownership, but they shut him down at the last minute.
      
      People like Kim Workman think society rather than gangs are at fault. They would abolish prisons for all but the worst handful of crimnals.
      
      Ardern-Workman type zealots are taking us into chaos.
      
      35 0
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      December 24, 2021 9:31am
      - gravedodger
        
        Why be concerned with those worst handful, give the data on the increase in actual danger if they let them all out, not a massive increase I might guess
        
        4 0
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        December 24, 2021 1:03pm
    - Master Mariner
      
      A Tetnus jab may offer some protection\\
      
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      December 24, 2021 2:38pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    Yes. Woke up two nights ago at 1 am. And on my facebook community group their was gun shots and car chase reported followed by the sound of the police chopper. I don’t think it was reported on the paper then next day. Same neighbourhood as the last two gun incidents.
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:25am
- kowtow
  
  The Fourth Estate have conceded defeat and surrendered their “sacred” duty of holding power to account and handed their responsibilities over to this govt and their left wing agenda.
  
  Big article in the Whoreald today from the pathologist who performed the autopsy on young fit healthy Rory Nairn .
  
  This is clearly part of the vaccination campaign and to counter the recent, brief , passing , publicity around Rory’s death from the vaccine.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:27am
- Cinematic
  
  Indeed. NZ has become the Wild West under this government.
  
  25 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:37am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    The wild west implies cowboys and Last Chance saloons.
    
    We are more the Shitbucket South with ex-cannibals, tinnie houses and pubs that sell Lion Red . . .
    
    4 0
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    December 24, 2021 3:05pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Everything Labour touches turns to poo. But results don’t matter when you have getting close to 1000 people employed as propagandists, both in-house and out-house (paid off media) and almost no real journalists left to contradict the lies.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:52am
- I remember when
  
  Yet another ‘learn to live with’ replacing ‘elimination’?
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:05am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  3 men dead in Wellington harbour in the last 4 days.
  
  16 0
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  December 24, 2021 10:04am
  - Prince
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvCI-gNK_y4
    
    0 1
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    December 24, 2021 10:45am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    We need to lock down wellington harbour!
    
    16 0
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    December 24, 2021 11:09am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Killed more people than Omicron.
      
      Bad harbour.
      
      3 0
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      December 24, 2021 6:43pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Those naughty boys did not hand in their guns when Jaspinda told them they had to
  
  16 1
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  December 24, 2021 10:51am
Chuck Bird

THe world is getting strange unless you are far left.

Transgender man who gave birth slams nurses who called him ‘mum’

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/transgender-man-who-gave-birth-slams-nurses-who-called-him-mum/Y3SZGZ4TGKKOJJSVTMFZOSDUKE/
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December 24, 2021 8:06am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Yes and he must be called a “chest feeding person”. No I’m not making that up. ?
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:08am
  - mandk
    
    She.
    
    11 0
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    December 24, 2021 8:16am
    - plc
      
      “They”
      
      9 0
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      December 24, 2021 9:03am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        “It”
        
        16 1
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        December 24, 2021 9:33am
      - Alan Wilkinson
        
        What. One what is not very bright.
        
        8 0
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        December 24, 2021 9:59am
  - Tempist
    
    The extant guidance put out by then former National Minister of Labour, Kate Wilkinson, cleverly eschews this whole mess and refers to “infant-feeding breaks” – focusing on the infant receiving the nutrition, rather than the potential narcissist delivering it…
    
    18 0
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    December 24, 2021 8:53am
  - DeepBlue
    
    Pregnant people.
    
    12 0
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    December 24, 2021 9:11am
  - ByGolly
    
    How can it chest feed if it had breasts removed?
    
    5 0
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    December 24, 2021 10:09am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Use a chest feeder…
      https://www.mother.ly/parenting/device-allows-dads-to-breastfeed/
      
      5 0
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      December 24, 2021 12:09pm
- mandk
  
  Don’t buy in to the nonsense, Chuck.
  
  The person who gave birth is clearly a female.
  
  In the Life of Brian, John Cleese spoke an undeniable truth about who can give birth.
  
  29 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:15am
- The GreyGhost
  
  Weird. It’s almost as if he’s never heard the words “shut up, no one cares.”
  
  28 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:21am
- Cinematic
  
  Poor kid.
  
  23 1
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  December 24, 2021 8:38am
- David Garrett
  
  The world is going utterly mad..
  
  Despite the challenges that come along with transitioning, he said becoming pregnant never made him question his gender identity. The only issue he has encountered so far has been the way medical professionals have misgendered him
  
  And “he” says he was utterly relieved once his breasts were removed…but then, because he still had a uterus, “he” got pregnant…
  
  Those who made the ultimate sacrifice in WW II must be spinning in their graves. Imagine giving up your life so this utter freak of nature can get all antsy about nurses in a maternity ward not knowing what the fuck to call it….him…them.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:07am
  - Nickc2
    
    Hey David, we let it happen (the whole gambit of wokeness that is) and why did it happen? IMO, because the lunatics in Govt lacked the courage to call a halt to such stupidity. Politicians were too interested in grabbing votes and remaining at the trough, regardless of the consequences,
    Start cleaning out the universities now!
    Ignore lunatics spreading wokeness!
    Clean up publicly owned media outlets of woketards!
    Concentrate education on the essentials of life!
    Reward success!
    Hold radicals accountable and don’t finance them!
    Encourage competition!
    Set a minimum education standard and
    Set a maximum collective time for welfare dependence, regardless of personal situation.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:01am
    - Local Miller
      
      I agree that “we let it happen” Nick2, but I don’t think you I should blame government. People gave up the absolute standards of the Bible because they wanted to enjoy the things the Bible calls SIN. Things like homosexuality. Conservatives, and Christians specifically warned back then that this was slippery slope that would lead to more depravity, and we have been proved correct.
      Now propel talk about the world having gone mad, but it was all a natural consequence of the decision people made to shun God and His standards and “do our own thing”.
      I don’t care if you (everyone on the forum) are a Christian or not, but 150 years ago the majority of Europeans accepted a Biblical basis for their moral code, whether committed believers or not, and this prevented the excesses we now see.
      I hope you are all happy with the twisted world you have helped create by throwing God’s standards out.
      🙂 I look forward to the downticks.
      
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      December 24, 2021 11:46am
      - Nickc2
        
        If pre-Christianity people were still alive, I guess they would be saying the same things about the advent of Christianity.
        I won’t offer a downtick because I believe we are all entitled to our beliefs and draw the line at enforcing my beliefs on others.
        
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        December 24, 2021 12:06pm
      - Local Miller
        
        But Nickc2, “you” do force your beliefs on others. By “you” I don’t mean you personally because I don’t know you, but “you” as in non-Christians. This particular article is a case in point. If I were interacting with this person, I would be being forced to address them as he, him, father,… when clearly they are actually she, her, mother, etc. What is that if not forcing your beliefs on others?
        
        4 3
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        December 24, 2021 2:30pm
  - Sacha
    
    Oh, so he is a mutilated woman.
    Decided to become a male, but kept the female reproductive organs.
    One wonders . . . . . . .
    
    15 1
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    December 24, 2021 10:17am
    - lifesgood
      
      Yeah, a seriously screwed up individual. Wants to be a man and yet wants to be a woman. Obviously has sex with a man like a woman, so either actually gay or a woman. Good lord! When is the world going to stop giving these people any sort of credence and give them psychiatric treatment. That poor child. Imagine being born to such a complete loon.
      
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      December 24, 2021 11:52am
  - Fletch
    
    Wait a minute. A woman can only get pregnant after being impregnated by a man with a man’s sexual organ. So this self-described “man” was having sex with another man. How does that work? He/she is obviously still attracted to men. So she is now a gay man? The mind boggles.
    
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    December 24, 2021 11:57am
  - Bluegrass
    
    DG (this format sucks in who to respond to) – Dr. Paul R. McHugh, the late former psychiatrist-in-chief for Johns Hopkins Hospital and Distinguished Service Professor of Psychiatry, said that transgenderism is a “mental disorder” that merits treatment, that sex change is “biologically impossible,” and that people who promote sexual reassignment surgery are collaborating with and promoting a mental disorder.”
    
    When confronted with that citation on another blog, one leftard replied “That was then; this is now. We have a different truth”.
    
    There you have it…
    
    17 1
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    December 24, 2021 12:15pm
- Centrist
  
  Back in the good old days this person could’ve made a living as a bearded woman.
  
  Feel sorriest for the baby.
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:07am
Maggy Wassilieff

A message from the Chief Executive of the RSNZ

https://www.royalsociety.org.nz/news/message-from-tumu-whakarae-chief-executive/
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December 24, 2021 8:06am
- Benedict Yu
  
  What a load of crap. The whole thing has gone pear shaped and now they are trying to be all “constructive”. What a ? clown.
  
  On the subject of pidgin English, I tuned into RNZ yesterday for the first time in months. I lasted 5 minutes.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:13am
  - Tomtoddy
    
    Look at me. I am able to write in Maori. I am kind and inclusive. I listen to all views. Aren’t I clever and progressive. I am a leader in my community.
    
    In reality a self serving, smarmy prat.
    
    59 2
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    December 24, 2021 8:23am
    - G152
      
      … [Deleted – unwarranted explicit accusation, not here. mod.]
      Advocating for one race to the exclusion of all others
      
      10 2
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      December 24, 2021 8:33am
    - Prince
      
      Self serving, smarmy, very highly paid prat, if you please.
      
      16 0
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      December 24, 2021 10:51am
  - tf78
    
    BY, the good thing is, it makes them easy to ignore.
    
    14 0
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    December 24, 2021 8:33am
    - JJ56
      
      You should check out how much public money they get to spread around.
      
      7 0
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      December 24, 2021 12:30pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Benedict: Moi aussi…I have – or rather had – been listening to Morning Report for more than 30 years. The relentless ramming of Maori down my throat has finally done me in. The ultimate absurdity is Suzie Ferguson speaking “Maori” with a thickish Scottish accent
    
    46 3
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    December 24, 2021 8:52am
    - MCōs
      
      She also speaks English with a Scottish accent.
      I look forward to the day when radio people return to speaking the Queen’s English.
      Karyn Hay has a lot to answer for!
      
      24 2
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      December 24, 2021 9:40am
      - lifesgood
        
        Karyn Hay had a shocker of a low class kiwi accent. Funny thing is she now sounds quite well spoken. Is that the case or have we got so attuned to poor speech that it now seems normal.
        
        9 1
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        December 24, 2021 11:55am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      with a thickish Scottish accent
      
      Not to my ears… Susie Ferguson was raised in Edinburgh and went on to study Drama in England (Stratford-on-Avon)
      
      My father was raised in Glasgow, and although his accent wasn’t as heavy as “Taggart”‘s – Mark McManus, it was still readily identifiable as Glaswegian even after 50+ years in NZ.
      
      Here’s a Tory MP from NZ who can’t understand a Glaswegian accent
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7G4z5uEQnE
      
      6 0
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      December 24, 2021 12:04pm
      - Ed Snack
        
        Yay for the Taggart reference, one would thing we’re just a bunch of jessies, as the man himself would have put it !
        
        7 0
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        December 24, 2021 1:39pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        It’s murrrrdah!
        
        2 0
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        December 24, 2021 6:51pm
  - Diogenes
    
    For those who are finding RNZ hard to take, I have to presume you are talking about the Notional programme. Concert is still okay. They play a lot of music by white male composers, with not a word of woke criticism. Oh dear, perhaps I should not have pointed that out!
    
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    December 24, 2021 11:03am
    - lifesgood
      
      There is some nutter now reading Newstalk ZB news who is spouting off several maori sentences before getting onto the job at hand. Newstalk, please stop this, you are or have been a sanctuary. We else can we go!
      
      9 1
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      December 24, 2021 11:57am
    - pussycat
      
      Have you not heard Shona Jounas from concert spouting gibberish in a very show offy way?
      
      4 0
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      December 24, 2021 2:12pm
    - curry4me
      
      Diogenes: I have a bunch of downloaded YT classical music videos on an old cell phone which I use as an MP4 player. They were on my new one. But Google asked for money and I said forget it.
      
      2 1
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      December 24, 2021 4:40pm
- The Feed
  
  ” The aim will be to further explore and deepen the Society’s, its members’ and hapori communities’ understanding of mātauranga and its relevance to science and vice versa. ”
  
  It falls under existing categories of knowledge, such as Anthropology. Obviously.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:39am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Good on the royal society for pointing out the obvious: it is not going to become a plaything for culture warrior who know nothing of New Zealand.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:59am
  - Alan Wilkinson
    
    Not a plaything but an object of scorn to honest people.
    
    21 0
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    December 24, 2021 10:36am
  - The Feed
    
    Post-modernist gibberish.
    
    Meaning is anything they feel it is. So, if mātauranga is felt to be science, then it is. Strangely, this doesn’t work in the opposite direction – if someone feels it isn’t, then it isn’t.
    
    If only we had a way of removing feelings, culture, personal agendas and so on, and focused only on observation through experiment?
    
    We could call it science, or something.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:53am
  - Kiwi Dave
    
    But is the RSNZ willing to be the plaything of New Zealand culture warriors who know nothing of science, or to put the matter less hyperbolically and more accurately, who appear to partly conflate science and woo?
    
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    December 24, 2021 5:01pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Mikey, you forgot the //
    
    1 0
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    December 24, 2021 6:53pm
- David Garrett
  
  The Society continues to support, foster and recognise research within multiple knowledge domains and continues to uphold the value of mātauranga Māori, mana whenua, te ao Māori and a commitment to te tiriti in practice
  
  Can someone explain to me what ” a commitment to te tiriti can possibly have to do with – say – the study of physics? Serious question.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:11am
  - fightingtemeraire
    
    Der Kommisar at Massey came out and said that they were “A Te Triti led University”
    
    What the hell does that mean???
    
    27 1
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    December 24, 2021 9:29am
    - Cobolt24
      
      Not only that, the university obviously was not even a signatory of the treaty (the simple document which Maori ceded sovereignty to the crown with all the rights). So why do they think they need to be part of it?
      Let alone the revisionist version dreamed up in the 1980s about a supposed partnership.
      
      23 1
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      December 24, 2021 10:44am
    - Prince
      
      It means they get a 50% salary increase, and jobs for life.
      
      15 0
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      December 24, 2021 10:53am
  - Swifty
    
    It means whatever they want it to mean, now or at anytime in the future.
    
    Have you not noticed, DG, how these things ‘evolve’ over time?
    
    19 1
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    December 24, 2021 9:29am
    - Unity
      
      The stupid thing about it all is that the Treaty is NOT our founding document. We were administered from NSW when it was signed and all it did was bring the native people under the same laws as the rest of us. Nothing else. They have now reinvented it to mean something it never ever did mean.
      
      Our true founding document is Queen Victoria’s Royal Charter/Letters Patent. It set up New Zealand’s political, legal and justice systems under one flag and one law, irrespective of race colour or creed. It’s long overdue for the Charter to be recognised as our true founding document.
      
      14 1
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      December 24, 2021 11:24am
      - Nickc2
        
        I couldn’t agree more Unity. However, it’s rather convenient that a whole generation has been bought up to believe the TOW is something more than what was intended.
        It’s easy to educate, impossible to uneducate. However, it’s possible to overwrite what has been imparted as education with truth over time.
        The trouble is, those imposters in the education system want changes made to NZ’s history now and our woke Govt is bending over backwards to assist.
        
        9 1
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        December 24, 2021 11:53am
- Justitia
  
  Mumbo jumbo, neither one thing nor the other.
  
  14 1
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  December 24, 2021 10:12am
  - Nickc2
    
    Someone should tell him those who sit on fences, only get splinters in their arses.
    
    12 1
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    December 24, 2021 11:19am
- nathie
  
  Looks like the Woke Canceler Society are doubling down by continuing to spread the myths and lies (by launching a new initiative to propagandise Maori science) … the first part seems to be reassuring their poor woke canceling supporters that the Society acknowledges their own hurty feelings as Real Scientists around the world push back and call these fraudsters out and laugh at their ignorance and child-like mindsets!
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:22am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Weasel words from weasels. Was there a complaint? An investigation? An outcome? Inquiring minds want to know. Weasels don’t want us to know.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:34am
- JJ56
  
  Don’t think the RSNZ is a reliable witness in these matters, or the Academy is somehow a neutral bystander.
  
  Some may recall that the Society joined in the kicking of the Listener correspondents back on July 27 when this all started.
  
  The Joint statement from President and Chair of Academy Executive Committee reads in part:
  
  “The Society supports all New Zealanders to explore, discover and share knowledge.
  
  “The recent suggestion by a group of University of Auckland academics that mātauranga Māori is not a valid truth is utterly rejected by Royal Society Te Apārangi. The Society strongly upholds the value of mātauranga Māori and rejects the narrow and outmoded definition of science outlined in The Listener – Letter to the Editor.
  
  “It deeply regrets the harm such a misguided view can cause.”
  
  The reason for quoting is first to note this is the view of the Chair of the Academy Executive Committee, that is now being touted as the independent group to investigate this complaint.
  
  The second reason to quote it is the statement has been disappeared off their web site record of news, and the URL now resolves to the CE’s statement above. No comment, explanation, or humble pie that I can see.
  
  Trust them … Have I got a cycle bridge to sell you.
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:27pm
mandk

Medsafe cannot be trusted.

As part of Pfizer’s provisional approval for the jab, Medsafe are required to monitor adverse effects post-vaccine.

But the reporting of adverse events to medsafe is not mandatory.

They have no real idea of how common adverse events are.
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December 24, 2021 8:09am
Maggy Wassilieff

Some Academics are capable of reading and understanding what is written.

There is nothing in the Listener letter that, to our reading, seems to justify either the vitriol directed against its authors or the investigation by the Royal Society. The authors do not devalue, insult or disrespect mātauranga Māori. Indeed, they say that it is “critical for the perpetuation of culture” and that it “plays key roles in management and policy”. The debate in which they were trying to engage is clearly important.

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/academics-dont-stifle-healthy-debate
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December 24, 2021 8:10am
Maggy Wassilieff

The future of Science in NZ

Soon the government will be evaluating feedback after launching the Te Ara Paerangi – Future Pathways Green Paper to prompt a consultation on the future of the country’s research, science and innovation science system.

Associate science minister Ayesha Verrall ominously said at the launch:

“Te Tiriti needs to be embedded right across the design and delivery of the system, and more opportunities need to exist for mātauranga Māori.”

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2021/12/23/royal-societys-handling-of-complaints-against-two-fellows-could-shape-the-future-of-nz-science-and-of-kiwi-reality/
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December 24, 2021 8:17am
- I remember when
  
  There is a lot of effort being put into the ’embedding’ of Te Tiriti.
  Perhaps some thought can be put in to deciding where to permanently embed it.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:27am
  - RalphT
    
    Deep under a motorway pillar?
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:33am
  - lastmanstanding
    
    The attempted Maorification of New Zealand will not end well. We have seen what happens when a minority attempts to command and control a majority. Eventually the majority rise up against their oppressors and seek to reclaim their position.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:05am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  TLDR: If you’re in STEM go to a country that hasn’t been corrupted and ruined by the regressive indigenous cultural appeasement industry.
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:56am
  - nathie
    
    Yep they have ruined (taken over) the Education, Health & Nursing, Psychology and recently the Law disciplines …. now they are turning to the remaining areas that aren’t affected by (important, culturally, but irrelevant, scientifically) mythology like the Sciences.
    
    Scientists … push back … against non-science!!
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:26am
- Ruahine
  
  When a flying mammal is named as the ‘bird’of the year by the usual grandees and semi-elites it tells you something about the about the state of Science in New Zealand.
  
  https://www.google.com/search?q=NZ+Bird+of+New+Zealand+2021&sxsrf=AOaemvIZ-yvAfSqPEby6rnRwWwJqb8v0Og%3A1640289489464&source=hp&ei=0dTEYfCNGsme4-EPnqSakAc&iflsig=ALs-wAMAAAAAYcTi4fl-liyM1slXZHS2SS3Mvxnpc7Uf&ved=0ahUKEwiwuuLC2vr0AhVJzzgGHR6SBnIQ4dUDCAg&uact=5&oq=NZ+Bird+of+New+Zealand+2021&
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:02am
  - alloytoo
    
    Well at least said mammal actually flies, more than can be said for some of the birds.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:17pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Yeah, I wouldn’t take that too seriously, Ruahine.
    
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    December 24, 2021 6:56pm
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Clearly a positive move to employ more useless people doing useless work. Real scientists should leave the country now.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:41am
Maggie Pie

Santa to wear full Ghillie Suit when delivering Presents tomorrow in the Mt Roskill hood. .

Fears traditional ‘Red Jacket’ may see him mistaken for opposition Gang Member and shot.
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December 24, 2021 8:21am
- Salacious Crumb
  
  Good question. Is just a coincidence that Labour and the Mongrel Mob share the same colours?
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:39am
  - MCōs
    
    Not to mention the American Republican Party and the Welsh Rugby Team.
    
    8 6
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    December 24, 2021 9:42am
  - RichardX
    
    Don’t forget Man U and the Crusaders
    
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    December 24, 2021 9:44am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    And conversely:
    National and Black Power – Blue
    
    Act and Killer Beez – Yellow
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:11am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Is there a green gang? Apart from the Greens, of course.
      
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      December 24, 2021 6:57pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Teeing off on the 15th at Akarana Golf Club could be an interesting exercise then.
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:05am
I remember when

Grazing licence decision ‘a big win for wetlands’:
Stock will not be allowed back on Queen Elizabeth Park, with environmental concerns outweighing the risk of fire.
Meanwhile
Kaimaumau fire labelled an ecological ‘catastrophic disaster’ for near-extinct species.
Answers aren’t always 100%.
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December 24, 2021 8:23am
- DeepBlue
  
  More info please. Are you saying the Northland fire was in a previously farmed/grazed wetland?
  If so it has huge implications.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:14am
  - Sacha
    
    I ‘heard’ it was peat land , and continuing to travel underground, as peat fires do.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:21am
- backster
  
  I recall 50 years ago before it was grazed those peat lands at Queen Elizabeth Park often caught fire and for weeks smoke drifted across the highway. Very difficult to put out.
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:24am
artemisia

Thomas Lumley over at StatsChat on PCR and RAT testing. Definitely worth a glance (as usual).

His final paragraph –

In New Zealand at the moment the situation is more complicated. We’re on the boundary between zero Covid and low-level suppression. The government is still trying to keep control of test results, which has clear benefits in contact tracing and elimination, but removes the ability for everyone to use rapid tests to reduce their individual risk of spreading Covid. Whether you think the government is making the right decision here depends a lot on how much you trust the public health system, and on how much you trust other people.

https://www.statschat.org.nz/2021/12/22/types-of-tests/utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=types-of-tests
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December 24, 2021 8:24am
alloytoo

John Campbell

Todays Covid update https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qzKh_S4Qs0
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December 24, 2021 8:27am
Aunty

This is what happened to a New Zealand man who foolishly thought Covid wasn’t real so he didn’t get himself vaccinated……………

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-coronavirus-it-is-real-mans-message-after-battling-virus-in-hospital/XLQGEBZJDNXYVPNZ4IPIG25YZM/
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December 24, 2021 8:31am
- Charmaine Hawke
  
  Clearly he relied on our MSM who told him obesity was not a co-morbidity to covid. If he had been on the pages of this fine blog he would have known he had a major risk factor and got himself vaccinated. See it is simple really, if you are at risk do what you need to do, if you are not get on with living.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:37am
  - Alan Wilkinson
    
    Odds on he has diabetes – a prime factor in serious Covid illness. Extraordinary journalism that omits the fundamental facts to push its campaign.
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:07am
  - Aunty
    
    If he didn’t believe in Covid in the first place, Charmaine, why would he need to worry about being obese and catching a virus that in his foolish mind (a common feature among contributors to this blog on covid I might add) doesn’t exist?
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:54am
    - alloytoo
      
      Could you please point me to a regular contributor who denies the existence of Covid?
      
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      December 24, 2021 1:23pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Maybe if he was allowed to take Ivermectin at the onset of symptoms he would not have needed to go to hospital ? Who NOWS, but I would think that with rare exceptions, everyone posting here would agree that if one has one or more of the known comorbidities (obesity, diabetes, disorders of blood lipids, etc) then “vaccination”, despite any associated risks, is definitely of value and would be recommended.
    
    However most would not go so far as to say that they MUST take the treatment.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:47pm
- Hard Cheese
  
  I notice they never run a story on any of the thousands of unvaccinated people who are feeling perfectly well and happily going about their daily business. Why is that?
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:41am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    They are the evil carriers who spread the virus//
    
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    December 24, 2021 10:59am
- Fletch
  
  As someone pointed out in a comment on the Herald story on Facebook,
  
  “Halligan said he doesn’t know where he caught the virus and had been cautious – wearing a mask, social distancing from others and even ordering groceries online to avoid visiting the supermarket.”
  The headline said he thought it was a hoax but his actions of wearing a mask, social distancing and ordering online would imply that the media are lying again because it sounds like he was very cautious which you wouldn’t be if you actually did think it was a hoax
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:00pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Also suggests that all those touted precautions are, as has been noted, useless against an airborne aerosolized virus.
    
    Probably caught it off a fully “vaccinated” person who was, as a result of the treatment, largely asymptomatic but carrying a large viral load and spreading it efficiently.
    
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    December 24, 2021 1:50pm
The GreyGhost

Another gun murder in Auckland this morning. Yet last week, academic and spokesperson for the Howard league Jarrod Gilbert published this deluded historical piece in the Herald, citing a gang feud in Timaru in the 90’s as evidence worsening gang violence “doesn’t bear great scrutiny.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jarrod-gilbert-is-gang-violence-in-nz-the-worst-its-ever-been/RZXL4PMDBEZNVRLJBILSGAPE6I/

This is the academic equivalent of the reporter standing in front of burning buildings calling the BLM rioters ‘mostly peaceful’.

Move on. Nothing to see here.
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December 24, 2021 8:33am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Jarrod Gilbert = gangsta fanboi, wannabe and apologist. Best to ignore or openly jeer at.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:12am
Maggy Wassilieff

Looks like you have to pay $140 for a Covid test.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127366814/man-told-to-pay-140-for-covid-test-despite-colleagues-testing-positive

I can see why this Government isn’t too keen on folks self-testing at home.
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December 24, 2021 8:35am
Warren

I wonder how many of the team of 5 Million will be wishing our Celebrity Prime Minister a Merry Christmas this year because I doubt a lot of them that have in the past, trust her anymore and rightly so .
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December 24, 2021 8:41am
- Justitia
  
  Nonsense. We have sooo much to thank Jacinda for! Why just the other day we received the updated cv for our house. Its value has DOUBLED in just 3 years. That Grant Robertson is a bloody financial wizard! Better than going to the races! Couldn’t have happened without Jacinda.
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:37am
  - lifesgood
    
    You should have added sarc.
    
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    December 24, 2021 12:02pm
    - Justitia
      
      Thanks, but I respect the intelligence of the readers.
      
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      December 24, 2021 4:19pm
Tomtoddy

I am heartily sick of the “team of 5 million” crap and all the Karens who write piffle about how we all pull together amd how wonderful we have done fighting Covid.

Our accountability is as individuals. Feelings and out doing each other on how clever we are especially if we can add some pidgin Kiwi is ultimately dangerous leftist nonsense. Hiding in the team of 5 million – actually the state – allows them to avoid responsibility.
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December 24, 2021 8:44am
- Unity
  
  I absolutely agree with you, but please, I do wish people would stop referring to ‘Karens’. I have a lovely niece with this name and she is nothing like the so-called ‘Karens’ mentioned in a derogatory way. Just saying ….
  
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  December 24, 2021 11:28am
  - Jack5
    
    I agree Unity. Wokies use “Karen” as a sneer at White non-Woke women.
    
    In the link below is an explanation of the origin of the (originally Danish) name”Karen” as a sneer.
    
    In summary:
    
    1. The name’s popularity peaked in the 1960s, so it is the name of many middle-aged (or older) women.
    
    2. Derogatory use began when blacks satirised White women’s false claims about threats by Black men.
    
    3. A comedian, Dane Cook, from 2005, used the name Karen as the “friend that no-one inthe friend group actually likes”.
    
    https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/origin-karen-how-name-became-meme-don-pumphrey-1e
    
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    December 24, 2021 12:05pm
Yvette

As well as the dis-ease of covid happening, so is racism?
■ ‘Rage at the violence of racism‘: Marama Davidson joins chorus of outrage at Farmers

•… Aiomai Nuku-Tarawhiti, 15, and her cousin, Shae Brown, 25, were visiting a Farmers store in Tauranga’s The Crossing to do some Christmas shopping earlier in December when they were approached by a staff member who told them to leave.
“She pointed at my cousin [Aiomai] and said, ‘you look undesirable, I don’t think you’re going to buy anything and I will have to ask you to leave’,” Brown told Newshub.

… Now, a Farmers representative has told the family it doesn’t believe the incident to have been racially motivated.
“I can advise that on the information available to me so far, Farmers does not consider that there is likely to be any basis for the allegations of racism,” they wrote in a December 16 email to Aiomai’s grandfather shared with the Rotorua Daily Post.
The email said Farmers was open to discussing the findings with the family, the Post reports, and suggested this be done with the Human Rights Commission mediating to help “enable us to understand each other’s point of view and bring matters to a conclusion”.

And, to not show any bias whatsoever, or engender any further speculation before the Family concerned, Farmers, and Human Rights meet and make any further comment public, Newshub offers as a conclusion to their article –
… A survey earlier this year found 93 percent of Māori experience racism daily. Most said they had been followed, watched, or asked to open their bags in a shop, and a quarter said they were followed by staff all of the time or often.

When Kelvin Davis, for supposed pure political gain, uttered yet again, but succinctly encapsulated the now historic mantra: “No mana for Māori” : Māori are more likely to be overweight, depressed, homeless, incarcerated and uneducated according to these disturbing statistics produced under National’s watch. [1] – and now least vaccinated. What are business owners to believe – when Maori themselves define a national profile … and many enact it as prominently that it is then reported in the news, as is this matter?

And then to underline their neutrality, an accompanying video, transcript, states –
There is a warning from the New Zealand Asian Community, racism is rising and needs to be stopped before there is a tragic repeat of the Christchurch terrorist attack or the Atlanta Spa shootings.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/12/farmers-tells-family-of-m-ori-teen-called-undesirable-it-doesn-t-think-the-incident-was-racist.html

■ There ain’t nothing like Newshub to toss a little petrol on a match to put it out.

■ Pressure has been building on Farmers in recent weeks over its handling of the incident, with even Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson accusing the 112-year-old department store chain of minimising “people’s understandable rage at the violence of racism”.
… with even? ‘that usual’ or ‘that surprising’?
No – Marama was in like a “rabid (hungry, famished) wolf” or “rabid (fanatical, dis-eased) wolf” – and if a Human Rights mediation is more positive, will Davidson apologise … this time?

■ Some “news” matters take several days to settle down or turn into something else, after bias and agendas are enacted, so occasionally it is wiser perhaps to then look a little later at the original item and how it evolves.
So wait a week, Marama, and then go ballistic – if you, yourself, have not become part of the matter … then it is a little more complicated, perhaps
__________________
[1] https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1702/S00255/no-mana-for-maori.htm
My opinion: a Maori helping re-colonise Maori for a second time – contributing to a long and slow process ?

The latest medication – for over all nerve pain – does actually work (nice something does, and seems not to need another medication to counter the effects of this medication, as with so many) but it takes the edge off things, and probably also gently blunts a little the above comment – not quite so rabid
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December 24, 2021 8:45am
KevO'Brien

Enjoy. Lengthy, techie and funny based on a pre-print.
https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/jessica-rose-mrna-covid-vaccines-innate-immunity/?utm_source=salsa&eType=EmailBlastContent&eId=313f5c39-0690-421a-9124-f8861b4b1e8f

An amazing piece of writing showing what happens on the inside when a virus turns up. It presents a particularly good argument against Covid child vaccinations.

Indirectly it presents the complexity of what are life forms, For these to simply evolve through random occurrences the complexity of the internal subsystems needs explanation–beyond our maths. Even the virii are terribly complex.

My warmest Christmas greetings and blessings to you and yours with best wishes for the year to come.
Kevin
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December 24, 2021 8:54am
I remember when

Ecan exposed: regulator hides damning report: Newsroom:
Are the problems with this report’s issue, a sign of the ongoing friction in the battle of water issues.
Something similar occured with the ‘One Plan’ exercise in Horizons and the speed at which faults are remedied seems to be the ‘crux’.
Staff working in Regional Councils have access to information not readily available to most people.
This means they are involved in the making of decisions that may not agree with their personal opinion/beliefs.
We seem to have general agreement that everyone must be saved from covid regardless, but that farmers can go to the wall so that water issues are solved immediately.
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December 24, 2021 8:59am
plc

I was watching “Chernobyl” again last evening.

My clear takeaway was how much better off they would have been relying on Maori Science.
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December 24, 2021 9:02am
- Manu-Rau
  
  Given that Maori never had any accidents with any of their nuclear power plants, you are clearly correct.
  
  In the same way, Maori oral records don’t mention any deaths during the Black Death. Clearly we would all benefit from an injection (no pun intended) of Maori medical science into vaccine research.
  
  This could be a winner!
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:53pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Ah, the magic healing of poi strikes again . . .
    
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    December 24, 2021 7:56pm
NoFax

That’s me for a while here as I am leaving NZ for some opportunities overseas. This place was a haven for me during the times when all of the world had gone insane. It is good to see that more and more NZers are becoming sane again. Unfortunately, we have 2 more years of the worse PM I have ever seen.

I wish everyone a Merry Christmas and I pray that 2022 brings us back to real normality.
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December 24, 2021 9:06am
- Philview
  
  It started off for me “Am I imagining this”. The media bias with Jacindamania etc in 2017. I stumbled across Kiwiblog and David Farrar was talking about the Russian influence on the NZ 2017 election. The NZ media frothing at the mouth about Trump and Brexit and Russia but ignored concerns about influence here. It was great to discover other people in NZ on the same page.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:42am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

Thanks to the appearance of Prime Minister Ardern at Auckland International, wedding singer LORDE, able to forgo usual Customs formalities on her arrival from the Big Apple.

https://twitter.com/EvilArthurFleck/status/1473802209393405952
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December 24, 2021 9:08am
- Hard Cheese
  
  A couple of pretty vacant-looking specimens there, you can tell there’s not much going on upstairs. Look at that jacket she’s wearing, like she’s on an expedition across Antarctica on foot. No wonder her face is bright red LOL
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:51am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, the white powder and the fruit…hilarious. By the way, where were the masks?
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:11pm
- MCōs
  
  That photo was September 2018
  https://www.allblacks.com/news/lorde-jacinda-and-the-farah-palmer-cup/
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:53pm
KevO'Brien

This test has been puzzling me–how can so modified?
Bear in mind, in recent developments, the PCR test is being routinely used to allegedly “identify”the variants including Delta and Omicron, which is an impossibility as well as a lie.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/bombshell-cdc-no-longer-recognizes-the-pcr-test-as-a-valid-method-for-detecting-confirmed-covid-19-cases/5765179
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December 24, 2021 9:10am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qzKh_S4Qs0

Positive UK data. [Dr John Campbell video – repeated. mod.]

Less people going to hospital with Omicron infection compared to Delta infection. Apologies, I had a few technical problems with today’s video. [10:40]
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December 24, 2021 9:21am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_Tzhi_2eVI

This is the end of The Democratic Party!

More and more pundits are coming out and admitting: the Democratic Party is imploding! That’s right! In this video, we’re going to take a look at the latest trend in the mainstream media to acknowledge what we’ve known for quite some time now, that the Democratic coalition is collapsing; we’re going to see what’s really behind the collapse, and stick with me to the very end of this video when I’ll reveal why this collapse may mean the end of the Democrats for at least the next decade. [9:08. Lets go, Brandon.]
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December 24, 2021 9:21am
- Parnell Gun Club
  
  I like what Dr Steve Turley has to say and wish it were all true. Unfortunately he does tend to exaggerate too much. He’s an awesome classical guitar player though.
  
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  December 24, 2021 9:42am
  - curry4me
    
    Parnell Gun Club: I like him too. Although he is a tad triumphalist. He seems to think it risks turning into a minor party for African-Americans.
    
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    December 24, 2021 4:55pm
Maggie Pie

Getting ready to head up to the Beach this arvo 😎 😎

“Wishing a Merry Christmas to ONE & ALL here on KB”

Following the example of Kate and Wills, we have ALSO have opted to send out a ‘Personal E-Card’ this year…..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DvPkxxLWwAARVWT.jpg

REMEMBER: Be careful out there!!
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December 24, 2021 9:40am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Have a good Xmas and avoid people with no SOH, Maggie. Thanks for all the laughs.
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:44am
- Bridgenag
  
  Thank you Maggie. As a new chum I have thanked the site for being there for folk to rant and rave and learn. No news without Kiwiblog and no fun without people like you Maggie. Odd trolls [think I made the grade with 2] and Lefties making sure they try and muddy the waters. Happy Christmas and let’s hope the sheepies awake next year with the courage to fight the system!
  
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  December 24, 2021 2:35pm
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Fred West?
  
  Is he the closest you could get to Santa?
  
  Little girls who sat on his lap never did so twice . . .
  
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  December 24, 2021 8:00pm
Loddenthinks

Cognitive dissonance, unfortunate juxtaposition, propaganda or sheer stupidity?

First item on Fake News 1 – all about how countries are heading back into lockdown “to keep people safe”.

Second item on Fake News 1 – the tragic explosion in whooping cough cases for young and “vunnrable” babies/toddlers caused by lockdowns. The problem being that babies and toddlers are being kept away from early childhood centres, play-dates and general interaction, are not being exposed to germs and bacteria etc, and their immunity is lower.

So, lockdowns keep people safe, and lockdowns make babies get preventable diseases. Got it.
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December 24, 2021 10:05am
- septic skeptic
  
  Babies don’t vote. Grannies vote. Do the maths ?
  
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  December 24, 2021 10:34am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Real problem is that modern politicians are goldfish that 99% of the time aren’t focusing on anything beyond what they think tomorrow’s headlines will read, and even in their longest term strategizing never think beyond the next election. Big problems and long-term issues requiring considered and sophisticated don’t get any attention cos they’re all focused on the childish battles of twitter
    
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    December 24, 2021 11:35am
Homas

I was somewhat disappointed to see Stuff loudly trumpeting the sob story of a woman with a penis who experienced some inconvenience with aviation security due to her “irregular” circumstances.

Come on Stuff, surely you guys should be the first to concede that if the past couple of years or so has taught us anything, it’s that in this proud team of five million we all have to take one on the chin for the greater good now and then!
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December 24, 2021 10:11am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Actually the story has a reasonable point that the bureaucratic rules are simply stupid and offensive. There is absolutely no good reason she couldn’t have been allowed to take off the belt and pass through the check on a green light. Idiots with far too much power.
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:41pm
  - Homas
    
    There’s nothing stupid about aviation security progressing to a more rigorous procedure if any sort of preliminary red flag is raised (as for offensive, I’m not offended).
    
    On the other hand, refusing a pat-down and then whining to the papers…
    
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    December 24, 2021 2:10pm
    - Alan Wilkinson
      
      Of course it’s stupid if she can pass through without the belt – completely brain dead. And has our Aviation Security ever caught a terrorist?
      
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      December 24, 2021 4:53pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    He. There is absolutely no good reason he couldn’t have been allowed to take off the belt…..
    
    Also, he could’ve understood the rules when he went through, removing his belt and putting it in a tray like everyone else does.
    
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    December 24, 2021 11:24pm
Stu2

The NSW outbreak continues to astonish

Daily cases up 10 fold (536 Dec 12, 5,612 yesterday)
Hospitalisations doubled (171 Dec 12, 382 yesterday)
ICU doubled (24 Dec 16, 53 yesterday)

And that is despite 93%+ of the eligible population double vaxxed. Pfizer double dose doesn’t look to be preventing Omicron infection much at all. Which suggests our vaccine passes have a limited future.

Those ICU numbers don’t stress the aussie system in the slightest, they have 2000 staffed ICU beds.
But the hospitalisation and ICU numbers will go far higher.
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December 24, 2021 11:42am
- Bluegrass
  
  Mortality rate is the test.
  
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  December 24, 2021 12:21pm
  - Bridgenag
    
    Went for our booster today. Took all my strength not to comment. Waited the “time” with the biggest people I have ever seen. Kept thinking about the help they needed and the fact that they will be a covid statistic not an obese death
    
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    December 24, 2021 2:39pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      How does that work then? Optimal vaccine dose must be linked to bodyweight, so if you are above 150kg do they give you one in each hemisphere?
      
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      December 24, 2021 5:29pm
- bronny1
  
  Of course they won’t tell us what proportion are vaxxed….going by places like Denmark will be more than 80%
  
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  December 24, 2021 5:27pm
Jack5

New Zealand isn’t the only country where freedom of speech is a battle ground.

In America, however, restrictions from the Right side of politics that block Critical Race Theory teaching in schools, are being seen by opponents as oppressive.

The Wall Street Journal reports:

” … school districts from Texas to Vermont are pulling hundreds of books from library shelves, following directives from state elected officials or challenges from parents that the books, which often focus on race and gender themes, are inappropriate for students.”

At least 12 states, including Texas, Idaho, Tennessee and Oklahoma, recently passed laws or issued rules that define how schools and colleges can teach subjects related to discrimination, race, and gender.

However, many parents support the ban on Critical Race Theory teaching.

The Wall Street Journal reports parents who support New Hampshire state restrictions say they’re necessary to curb a movement in classrooms and in teacher training to encourage children to identify themselves primarily by their race or gender, as schools address discrimination through curricula and diversity and inclusion policies.

Rachel Goldsmith, who founded a New Hampshire chapter of Moms for Liberty, a conservative group, said: “Teachers shouldn’t be teaching that certain groups of kids are inherently racist or oppressive because of characteristics they’re born with.”
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December 24, 2021 11:46am
Fletch

From a presentation by the Canadian COVID Care Alliance. They go through the shoddy testing that Pfizer did as regards the vaccines to get them approved and the spin around it all –

https://www.canadiancovidcarealliance.org/media-resources/the-pfizer-inoculations-for-covid-19-more-harm-than-good-2/
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December 24, 2021 12:12pm
TT500

I would say that Phizer,s 2009 US 2.4 Bn dollar fine
for market fraud would be mere chump change
compared to their current gig
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December 24, 2021 12:15pm
westernScientest

I know we like to joke about New Zimbabwe, etc. but Turkey is probably a more relatable economy right now. If your interested in macro economics, this is worth listening to, I didn’t realise just quite how similar their monetary policy was to ours. A glimpse into the near future:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5HCDvEaxSU
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December 24, 2021 12:15pm
Maggy Wassilieff

A word of advice for young newly-weds….don’t buy into your in-laws’ traditions…..

I’m about to start the great Cabbage boil up for the stuffing of little Russian pies – Piroshki.

– that’s the afternoon gone.

We’ve all agreed on a simple Xmas dinner for tomorrow… “Great”, I said.. “I won’t have to bake piroshki.”

“Oh yes, you must” …ordered the eldest offspring.

So, after 40+ years of baking the bluddy little things, I fear I’m turning into hubby’s babushka who used to say “never again” больше никогда.
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December 24, 2021 12:46pm
- lifesgood
  
  Ohh errr…does the house smell like an old folks home?
  
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  December 24, 2021 1:28pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Sure does…and for days!!!!!
    
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    December 24, 2021 2:44pm
- Jack5
  
  One previous Christmas on Kiwiblog, I think I gave you this link to Russian honey cake.
  
  It’s in English and Russian. You can text for the Russian dialogue from Youtube’s Captions:
  
  https://youtu.be/Bk_DAS3br9k
  
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  December 24, 2021 2:27pm
  - Jack5
    
    Edit: you can read English text for the Russian spoken dialogue by using the captions button at the bottom of the Youtube picture.
    
    One of the two women does translate into English a the video progresses, but seeing the words helps.
    
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    December 24, 2021 2:41pm
Rusty

No merry christmas to David Farrar from fellow bloggers here?

Thanks mate for the year.
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December 24, 2021 12:57pm
- Jack5
  
  Good point:
  
  ?Merry Christmas DPF to you and your family, and a great 2022 as well.
  
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  December 24, 2021 2:43pm
Bluegrass

A poster today raised accents, in that, as I recall, someone had a strong Scottish accent despite having lived in NZ for years.

That’s no surprise. In my experience no Scot loses their accent, even if having lived outside of Scotland for centuries.

What other accents prevail, in your experience, in the English-speaking world?

IMO, Geordie is a permanent accent.

American rhotic [hamburrgerrr] is permanent.

Some northern UK accents [e.g. Yorkshire] are permanent.

Foreign? It’s probably easier to ask who can speak English without a noticeable accent. I would say the Swedes and the Dutch, in my experience. And some of the old-school Indian sub-continentals speak pukka Brit BBC English.

The foreigners who never lose their foreign accent when speaking English?

The Slavs. My second wife’s Polish parents spoke English as though they had swallowed a jar of honey and marbles [altho, to be fair, folk from Kentucky also speak like this] – all slurred words and no vowels.

I asked her why the Poles had sold all their vowels to the Finns – and paid a spousal price accordingly.

The SE Asians – there are no lingering run-on sentences – just monosyllabic staccato. Fl li OK.

Japanese -when I lived there I found that many Japanese were capable of speaking English very well.

Have I missed anyone?

PS maybe Kiwis – is it me, but when I hear current Kiwi accents they are quite different from those of say 50 years ago. There seems to have been a vowel change to some degree.

As a German speaker, it’s somewhat reminiscent of the Dutch going more Dutch, so as to avoid any comparison of being a North German dialect.

Maybe it’s do with being different from Australia?

Comments?
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December 24, 2021 1:01pm
- Jack5
  
  Bluegrass, Jacinda Ardern seems to be undergoing the equivalent of the High German Consonant shift, as she is pronouncing “t” as “d” – Auckland ciddy, etc.
  
  The rest of us are stuck with the English language “t”, similarly, I think, to speakers of the other North German language group members – Frisian and Plattdeutsche (Low Saxon or Low German).
  
  Otherwise, national TV and national radio may be eroding the country’s only regional accent – Southland and Otago English, spoken in the quarter of the country around Gorrrre.
  
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  December 24, 2021 2:22pm
  - Bluegrass
    
    Thanks for that, Jack5.
    
    Frisian is interesting – if you go into a pub in that region and don’t tune in, it sounds like you are in an English pub, after you have had a mild stroke. The intonation and cadence is uncanny.
    
    And when you do tune in, around 15% of Frisian can be comprehended by an English speaker – helped by the fact that a number of the Dutch vowels are dipthongs – not pure vowels.
    
    But my Kiwi point was that there seems to have been a vowel change from i > u: according to my Kiwi cousin-in-law, who has lived in California for over 60 years (he’s now 82) and who remarked on this when he flew back a few years ago to visit after an absence of 60 years.
    
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    December 24, 2021 3:16pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    She refudes that
    
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    December 24, 2021 6:25pm
- Cassandra
  
  It’s the Australians who’ve changed the most. Compare PM Menzies with any recent politician. All started with Bob Hawke.
  
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  December 24, 2021 3:04pm
- 0A
  
  I agree with your permanent accents. A Scouse accent is the same. I used to think Afrikaans accents were unable to be compromised but I’ve found that a few people, to give an example, that have been here a while sometimes have a tendency to change the way certain “a” sound, e.g. car = “kor” but then becomes “kaa”, like a higher Dutch register.
  
  To me it often depends on what period in their lives a person emigrated. Children more prone to picking up accents.
  
  I was born in Rhodesia but grew up in South Africa so I’m most often asked if I’m British.
  
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  December 24, 2021 4:25pm
- Diogenes
  
  Hi Bluegrass. I teach English to immigrants from a wide variety of countries, though East Asians are the predominant. I joke that I don’t understand why they come to NZ to learn English when we don’t speak it! But without exception, they struggle hugely with the current Kiwi accent. The common difficulties are the poor articulation (Kiwis don’t open their mouth, and speak very quickly, swallowing many of their words); running words together so that sounds are collapsed. Then there’s the huge number of idioms in the language, in most of which the words give you no clue to the meaning. To say nothing of the increasing number of Maori words being forced in.
  I began work in radio/TV in 1970, and had the benefit of voice lessons from the then Chief Announcer in Christchurch (one Wally Chamberlain), who straightened out the worst of my pronunciation, to the point where most people have difficulty picking where I come from — and no, I don’t have a plummy accent, I just like to speak well. And because I mix a lot with immigrants I work hard at slowing down so they don’t have to work so hard at understanding.
  Certainly I believe the NZ accent has changed hugely in the last 60 or so years — there seems to be an acceleration in the change. These days I find it very difficult to understand high school students, whose pronunciation shifts seem much more accute.
  Incidentally, the overseas accent I struggle with most is Indian, even those whose first language is English. Not all Indians, but a high proportion. I have much less problem with other East Asian accents, although I find the Beijing accent the most difficult of the Chinese. It seems to me more gutteral than, say, Shanghai or Singapore. Then again, Beijing people also seem to find my Chinese more impenetrable than do Singaporeans or Taiwanese. And when I try hard, one of my Chinese friends says I speak like a Chinese opera!
  
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  December 24, 2021 6:05pm
Yvette

■ Tweet
The Real Joker @EvilArthurFleck
Lorde says that by some inexplicable miracle she was able to completely avoid Covid MIQ requirements into NZ like other people need to & that this complete miracle will allow her to sing at Ardern’s wedding where it appears her agent forgot to charge her normal appearance fee. :o)

If this is true, there definitely needs to be a Royal Commission Covid Pandemic Inquiry into whether Ardern’s Labour Government has any links with New Zealand, or not.
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December 24, 2021 2:00pm
Chuck Bird

NSW had 5612 and Victoria had 2095 cases today.

NSW had 1 death and Victoria had 8 deaths today.

This has been repeated for many days.

NSW has a little higher vaccination rate than Victoria so just vaccination rates should not be the answer. I wonder what is. Could it be contact tracing? Anyone got any idea?
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December 24, 2021 2:55pm
- Stu2
  
  NSW had some pre-Christmas social events/concerts that were super spreaders
  
  And I think they were in front of Victoria in terms of relaxing restrictions.
  
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  December 24, 2021 3:26pm
- greybeard
  
  “NSW had 5612 and Victoria had 2095 cases today.”
  Those were reported/identified cases.
  In reality both states probably had five or ten times that many people infected for the first time and who never noticed it or just ignored it.
  That would change the death-to-cases ratio dramatically , wouldn’t it?
  
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  December 24, 2021 4:27pm
- bronny1
  
  Vit D?
  
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  December 24, 2021 5:31pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Aussie deaths have been constant for a month at around 6-10 – all Delta. Omicron has taken known covid case numbers up 10x or more in last couple of weeks (and about half of omicron cases are asymptomatic so likely way higher), but no sign of a significant uptick it in deaths yet.
  
  In new south wales:
  32,174 Active cases
  382 Admitted to hospital
  53 In intensive care
  12 Requiring ventilation
  probably most of these are still delta
  
  It does appear highly likely now that the Omicron ‘Cold-vid’ is going to kill very few and not overly tax the hospitals.
  
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  December 24, 2021 5:44pm
TT500

Been looking everywhere for my bubble , just in case
i need it over xmas.

Should be pretty clear to anybody that finds it
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December 24, 2021 3:16pm
surfing

Biggest load of BS and spin I’ve heard this year….
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/bay-of-plenty-times/news/rates-not-impacted-by-pacific-apartments-29m-settlement-payout/AXT6OTNJ27VP7NJXLAIGBOLGFM/

Tauranga council just had to fork out 30 million dollars of ratepayer money for their incompetence (one of many 10-30 million dollar screwups).

Council say…

Tauranga ratepayers will not be footing the bill for an almost $30 million settlement to historical defective building claims at an apartment building in Mount Maunganui, the council has confirmed.

So, where does the money come from? Thin air? I smell a rat. Reading further….

Paul Davidson stated there had been a “redirection” of finances from the council’s stormwater fund to address unfunded debt from weather-tightness claims.

So, they redirected ratepayer funds from storm water projects to pay this 30 million dollar negligence claim.

So, where does the money come from to fund the defunded stormwater fund? Of course, from the ratepayers.

The council are a lying pack of thieves. One way or another, ratepayers fund it.
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December 24, 2021 3:36pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Looks like Tauranga Council will be keen to jump on the 3-Waters waka.
  
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  December 24, 2021 5:35pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    They know which side the rewena bread is buttered on
    
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    December 24, 2021 6:23pm
- Ra Henare
  
  Open your mind half an inch. The answer will be obvious.
  Its called liability Insurance!!
  
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  December 25, 2021 2:21am
CAKE FACE1

Will Santa sign in with his vaccine pass?

I wonder if Santa is anti-vax?

He’s high risk – I suspect that he might have co-morbidities.

He typically looks a little obese, so perhaps he has diabetes? The bright red face is also a concern – this is indicative of high blood pressure, perhaps?

Merry Christmas to everyone, vaxxed angels and unvaxxed devils alike!
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December 24, 2021 4:41pm
Fletch

You see, this is why I hate the Herald and their misinformation – an opinion in today’s Herald stating that the virus is 100 times riskier than the jab. I’m sorry, but that just isn’t true. I had to set my folks right after they asked me about the article.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/dr-noelyn-hung-data-indicates-covid-100-times-riskier-than-jab/IZX4DLSHRCMVPKCEQHBU4D6MWE/

Total propaganda. The the Herald stops comments on the story after they post it on Facebook, because they KNOW people know others who have died from the vaccine.
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December 24, 2021 5:34pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Is there anything a leftie finds funny? Yeah ok, the Bee, but this is true.
https://rumble.com/vr8fpw-elon-musk-wokeness-is-a-mind-virus-that-wants-to-make-comedy-illegal.html?
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December 24, 2021 5:35pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Lefties, debunk this. Come on, stop hiding behind fake news. Liz Wheeler calls them out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJGL1xrWNNg
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December 24, 2021 6:21pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/127383996/stolen-pug-morticia-reunited-with-family-on-christmas-eve
Wainuiomata.
Say no more.
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December 24, 2021 7:43pm
tf78

To my Kiwiblog friends : All my best wishes to you and your families for a wonderful Christmas. We have a brand new year coming up to change the world – We can do it! Stay strong, take care of each other and God bless you all.
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December 24, 2021 7:46pm
alloytoo

Wishing everyone a peaceful Christmas and a Happy New year.
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December 24, 2021 8:11pm
Don Beckett

“He who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities” – Voltaire.
We have had this during this past year. Let us hope that the coming year will clear away the insanity.
Merry Christmas everybody.
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December 24, 2021 10:29pm

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