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August 5, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 05 August 2022

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General Debate

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Tomtoddy

I received a letter from Manatū Ahu Matua this week giving me advice on Te haumarutanga kai i te kāinga and signed Nga Mihi.

Question: How did this piece of conceited, arrogance, from someone to someone who both know no Maori help stop the 11 year old Maori kid who ram-raided a shop last week driving a stolen car? How did it combat colonialism that has apparently blighted that kids life? How has it helped his regularly stoned mother get the kid a decent meal, off the dope and back to school?

The letter was from MPI about food safety. But they are so weak-minded and woke they have succumbed to the ‘one-up-man-ship’, spent a heap of my hard earned tax money on names, logos, consultants, images and write unintelligible gobbledegook to me, their client
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August 5, 2022 8:06am
- pdm
  
  TT – I have never heard of Manatu Ahu Matua and do not want to.
  
  Mihi on the other hand was a lovely Maori lady in her early 80’s who was our next door neighbour for 3 years until she died suddenly in July last year.
  
  She had no time for the crap you refer to.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:13am
- Cassandra
  
  Meaningless drivel, akin to Stuff and its every second paragraph. Very few Maori understand it, let alone the rest of us. By all means write to people in Maori if you can and they want it but this pijin mania is dopey.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:18am
  - Batman
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    25% of Maori speak Te Reo as a first language.
    
    Plenty more understand it, including non-maori.
    
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    August 5, 2022 10:18am
    - oldfella
      
      Te reo Māori, listed by the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization as ‘vulnerable’, is only proficiently spoken by around one in 100 New Zealanders. Another 2.7 percent are able to hold a basic conversation, according to census figures – all up that’s around 185,000 people.
      https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/01/m-ori-language-likely-doomed-despite-recent-uptick-in-speakers-study.html#:~:text=Te%20reo%20M%C4%81ori%2C%20listed%20by,up%20that's%20around%20185%2C000%20people.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:22am
      - Batman
        
        Old fella that is a completely different stat to what I cited.
        
        It’s also from January 2020, under one year after the Revitalisation Act was passed, so before the increased use began to filter through.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:45pm
      - alloytoo
        
        hmmmm
        
        so 17.1% of the population are Maori.
        
        @25% (quoted by Bats) that’s 4.3% of NZ
        
        That suggests that there’s been a 330% increase in proficient Maori speakers during the Covid era.
        
        Doesn’t pass the sniff test.
        
        Notwithstanding of course the 2.7% with basic conversational skills are unlikely to be fully literate in the language.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:10pm
      - Batman
        
        They will most likely be different questions with different answer. So yes, comparison is likely not reasonable or possible.
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:36pm
    - Matt Long
      
      Riiight, 25% of Maori spreak te reo as their first language, and Jacinda is the best prime minister we’ve ever had.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:24am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        And Batty is intelligent, reasonable and well-informed. I like this game, is it called Polar Opposites?
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:38am
      - Batman
        
        Matt and Lodden: see below
        
        https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/#:~:text=Now%20almost%2025%25%20of%20M%C4%81ori,phrases%20of%20te%20reo%20M%C4%81ori.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:28pm
      - Matt Long
        
        Funny, the ESOL and ESL teachers I know have never spoken about their Maori clients….
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:38pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      That sounds quite high
      Can you prove it?
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:43am
      - namron
        
        According to google – “Some 50,000 people report that they speak Maori well or very well.
        127,100 people self-report SOME knowledge of the language.” {The population of NZ is given as 5,084,000.}
        Maori [deleted, racist – Mod] language has the most ridiculous Maori-ised words which are required to permit the language to have any relevance in the 21st century.
        It is significant to know that English is an official language in “67 different countries and 27 non-sovereign entities.
        It is disturbing to read that Maori has become a part of schools’ syllabus and hours are being spent on it. Obviously “reading, writing and arithmetic” will not now be getting the teaching time they used to get.
        {I’m pleased I’m retired from 47 years of primary teaching!!}
        
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        December 5, 2021 12:19pm
      - Batman
        
        Certainly
        
        https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:39pm
    - Yabster
      
      thats complete crap batty
      
      In the 1996 Census, one quarter of Māori said they could hold a conversation in Māori, and it remained at that level in 2001. Although there were around 1,100 more Māori who could hold a conversation about everyday things in Māori in 2006 than in the previous Census, the Māori population had grown by a greater number and so the proportion of Māori who could speak conversational Māori declined, from 25.2 percent to 23.7 percent. However, at the 2013 Census, the number of Māori who said they could hold a conversation in Māori had declined by 6,200 from 2006, further lowering the proportion of Māori who could speak conversational Māori to 21.3 percent.
      
      In the Te Kupenga 2013 Survey, an estimated 257,500 (55 percent) of Māori adults reported they could speak more than a few words or phrases in te reo Māori.46 Overall, 50,000 adults (11 percent) could speak te reo Māori very well or well, 12 percent could speak fairly well, and 32 percent could talk about simple/basic things in te reo. The remaining 45 percent could speak no more than a few words or phrases. Māori who were able to speak te reo Māori very well, well, or fairly well were more likely to use the language outside the home than inside. There is a strong relationship between te reo Māori and other aspects of culture: Māori with te reo Māori as their first language (learnt from childhood), who knew all aspects of their pepeha (Māori tribal identity), and who felt it was very important to be involved in Māori culture were more likely to speak te reo Māori very well or well.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:56am
      - CJames
        
        I agree with your analysis. There is a world of difference between knowing a few words and being able to be fluent in the language. And there is just as bigger gulf between those who are fluent and those that use it as a first language. Realistically, the last group is significantly probably less than 1% of Maori and would mainly live Western Bay of Plenty/ East Cape where there is still very high percentage Maori population..
        What seems to have happened is that the “analysis” has run the three groups together.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:44pm
      - Batman
        
        I think you’ll find, yab, that you are talking complete crap with your amateur analysis and back of the hand extrapolation.
        
        https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/#:~:text=Now%20almost%2025%25%20of%20M%C4%81ori,phrases%20of%20te%20reo%20M%C4%81ori.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:50pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Batman’s figure of 25% seems way to high to me, having many Maori relatives, knowing that probably only 10% of them speak Maori, and knowing a smattering of te reo Maori myself.
        However, if his figure is accurate, that is a very good thing that Maori are leading the charge in learning and speaking their own language. If the Maori language is to survive, it is up to Maori themselves to ensure it.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:17pm
      - CJames
        
        Really Batman? How many Maori do you know? And how many speak it as a first language?
        I have contact with and am on nodding acquaintence with maybe a hundred or so Maori. Probably more than that as I know quite a few refuse to identify as such, but I know their background. And NONE speak it as a first language, though probably about 10 speak it fluently – almost all those are pensioner age. When I was reffing hockey a few years back, the local kura had several teams in the competition. On the field, all communication was in Maori (the opposition didn’t know their plans), but when the game finished, they chatted among themselves in English. That means their first language was the latter.
        Those examples are anecdotal but very unlikely to be a statistical anomaly.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:17pm
      - CJames
        
        Batman your assertions cannot be matched to the actual statistical data. Here it is:
        https://www.stats.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Retirement-of-archive-website-project-files/Methods/Measuring-te-reo-Maori-speakers-A-guide-to-different-data-sources/measuring-maori-speakers.pdf
        To quote the report In 2013…. Fifty-thousand Māori (10.6 percent) could speak te reo Māori ‘very well’ or ‘well’”, They define speaking it very well and well as – very well (I can talk about almost anything in Māori) well (I can talk about many things in Māori)
        So how can 10.6%, many of whom were elderly in 2013 so are possibly no longer alive, who speak it well morph into 25% who have it as a first language?
        Looks like you have a real problem with reality
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:04pm
    - kowtow
      
      Citation required.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:28am
      - Batman
        
        Freely and happily
        
        https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/#:~:text=Now%20almost%2025%25%20of%20M%C4%81ori,phrases%20of%20te%20reo%20M%C4%81ori.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:51pm
      - CJames
        
        Batman
        That isn’t a citation. It is only an advocacy news article. You need to supply hard data like Yabster did to refute him.
        There are supposed to be about 800,00 Maori in NZ (16% of 5 million). Where are the 200k who speak it as a first language?
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:22pm
    - Media hater
      
      Wow, what an absolute character you are. And a moderator to boot!
      
      Of course 25% of Maori speak Te Reo as a first language, who could possibly think otherwise? Haha!
      
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      August 5, 2022 12:40pm
      - Batman
        
        Clearly a new account for someone? Interesting.
        
        Anyway, yes it’s true: https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:50pm
      - Yabster
        
        Woke Batty it’s not my ‘amatuer’ analysis- why would I waste my time ffs.
        
        its from that paragon of accruracy MSD.. so stick those stats where the sun don’t shine lol
        
        https://socialreport.msd.govt.nz/cultural-identity/maori-language-speakers.html#:~:text=46
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:26pm
      - Batman
        
        So the numbers are broadly the same, and remember different survey have different questions. Speaking ‘well’ or ‘very well’ is not the same criteria as first language. It’s likely to have been a question about preferred first language, which would be an important distinction.
        
        Cjames, these stats are ten years old. I think I’ll take updated ones over that and your anecdata based around who you associate with. I’m sure if you asked, a surprising amount of Maori you know would like to see more te reo spoken in everyday life.
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:46pm
      - Media hater
        
        My first and only account Batman.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:26pm
      - CJames
        
        Batman
        Statistic NZ hasn’t done a follow up. So it is the most recent data. Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence which you haven’t provided. Your linked blog post (with no citations I note) and written by a freelance journalist (https://www.vicbooks.co.nz/journal/getting-to-know-baz-macdonald ) isn’t data any more than my anecdotes. And you still haven’t explained how people who speak Maori well can change into 4 times the number that have it as a first language. Even the Maori Language Commission admit the trends on fluent speakers are going the other way.
        The Maori I know may well want more Maori spoken around the place. None have said that they are taking language classes, so I don’t think it is high on their list of priorities.
        Having more fluent Maori speakers is another A for aspiration and E for execution thing. Or do they need a bigger government handout?
        
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        August 5, 2022 3:13pm
      - CJames
        
        I found the actual relevant piece of infor from Stats NZ put out just a month ago (is that recent enough Batty?) It says “(In the latest data, almost a quarter (23 percent) of Māori said they spoke te reo Māori as one of their first languages, up from 17 percent in 2018. ”
        So it wasn’t their first language – it was ONE of their first languages – meaning they understood and could converse in some Maori. Emphasis on the word some.
        https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/te-reo-maori-proficiency-and-support-continues-to-grow/
        
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        August 5, 2022 3:53pm
    - lastmanstanding
      
      BullShit. Show me the independent evidence not some crap from a self conflicted government agency trying to jusify itself. I reckon less than 5% if that can even string a sentence together.
      
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      August 5, 2022 1:48pm
    - Dave
      
      Batman
      
      Nearly 100 years ago Irish was declared the preferred official language of Ireland, became a compulsory subject in school with competence in it a requirement for entry into university and the civil service, though the last was relaxed in 1974.
      
      According to the 2016 census, as reported by Wiki, 40% of Eire say they can speak the language, but only 1.5% use it as a daily language outside education. This raises some questions relevant to Maori, whose answers I don’t know:
      
      1) What are the benefits of teaching/learning Irish?
      2) Are those benefits sufficient to justify compulsion?
      3) What benefits has Ireland missed out on because something else was not taught/learnt?
      4) How unsuccessful for how long can a curriculum policy be before its supporters will concede the policy has failed?
      
      When teaching in South Auckland for many years I attempted to learn the most popular playground language after English spoken in the playground – Samoan – but these days I have mostly forgotten it. I sometimes speak Chinese (very ineptly) and fragments of Cantonese because these are the languages I want to master, especially Cantonese, spoken by my wife and our acquaintances.
      
      What are the benefits of learning Maori?
      
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      August 5, 2022 2:13pm
    - Ra Henare
      
      Ok Batman. Manup time.
      Where did you get this dubious statistic from>
      
      25% speak Te Reo as a first language!
      
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      August 5, 2022 3:00pm
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Ministry of Primary Industries.
  
  Would have taken you less than five seconds to google it.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:21am
  - MarkF
    
    “Would have taken you less than five seconds to google it.”
    Why should I have to?
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:26am
    - riffer
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Jesus, do I really have to answer this?
      
      Because when you don’t, and you have access to all the information at your fingertips, you come across as either a bigoted jerk, or an imbecile.
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:37am
      - Yabster
        
        bigoted because he doesn’t want to look up the meaning of some Maori sentence?- thats your patheic opinion rifraf – and re the imbecile- with want you post it clear who that is.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:41am
      - Batman
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        A refusal to engage with the Maori language always comes back to bigotry, disguised under arguments about level of use and a false theory of coercion.
        
        The reality is that a small subset of people do not want to engage with anything Maori, and believe the state should be entirely English and white in its language and culture. This is despite hundreds of countries having multi-language governments and societies.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:34am
      - H. Upmann
        
        …..”bigoted jerk, or an imbecile”. Hmmm
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:47am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        Only to bigoted jerks.
        
        There is no good reason for the proliferation of Maori names for government institutions.
        The fact is that very few people in NZ speak Maori whereas almost everyone speaks English.
        Forcing everyone to look up what the Maori name means is just arrogance and is wasting everyones time.
        
        I get and respect the want to revive Te Reo but that’s only for people that are interested in it. It shouldn’t be forced on everyone else and it definitely shouldn’t be pigeonholed into non-Maori correspondence.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:56am
      - kowtow
        
        Exodus 20.7
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:00am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        You may not have noticed, but NZ is an English speaking Country.
        Having to google every time a stone aged language is used means the language is being FORCED upon us.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:00am
      - alloytoo
        
        You seem have missed the point, Tomtoddy received the letter, it behooves the sender to make themselves comprehensible.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:26am
      - Lance
        
        So according to riffers logic, he would be happy for all govt depts and info to be in sign language, wee hand symbols?
        That’s all good because he only has to google them every time.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:42am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Rather Batman, when such a small % of the population understand it, and the shoe-horning of Maori words into governance and engineering and technical concepts or entities for which they are not at all well suited, means communication suffers.
        Why pretend this is not the case?
        I mean, what is the benefit for not using a language which reaches a vast majority greater at least alongside Maori, or with primacy with consideration of the make-up of NZ’s population in 2022, if AUTHENTIC COMMUNICATION was the goal?
        And “You are a bigot” is a piss-weak response.
        It might be true sometimes, individual by individual, but it doesn’t mean the current trend is not fucking stupid.
        I understand a bit of Maori through being born here and my own study, and I find the Maori names for services and departments ponderous and unpragmatic.
        It is like some silly game being played, decided away from the public eye. About as useful as inserting ‘we have considered Te Ao Maori perspectives’ statement into policy around sourcing of plasterboard.
        Something that seemingly must be done every time, in the alternative world of the public sector jack-offs.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:50am
      - rouppe
        
        @batman
        
        The reality is that a small subset of people do not want to engage with anything Maori, and believe the state should be entirely English and white in its language and culture.
        
        That’s nonsense. No one has said “never communicate in Te Reo”.
        
        But what these departments don’t consider is how to communicate with the people they are purported to serve in a culturally appropriate manner.
        
        Not everyone is a Maori. Not everyone wants to, or even can, learn multiple languages.
        
        These departments, if they want to impart important information, must make sure everyone can understand it.
        
        If that means duplicating the message in multiple languages, fine. But mixing those languages too the extent that is currently happening, isn’t working, and ultimately could be dangerous if the message isn’t understood
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:30am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        @Batty: “This is despite hundreds of countries having multi-language governments”
        
        Hundreds of countries – there goes any credibility you may have had down the toilet.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:42am
      - Alan Wilkinson
        
        @Batman, if you can’t see coercion here you have your eyes firmly closed
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:26pm
      - Batman
        
        Right well a series of replies above but most resort to personal attacks.
        
        The avalanche of overly offended replies gives away the game. The old fashioned and intolerant absolutely do not like their biases being pointed out to them for what they are.
        
        The arguments about other languages, useage, and clear communication and all strawmen arguments to deflect from the very simple fact that you do not want your government to acknowledge and support the other partner in the treaty which founded this country.
        
        It’s too late, it is happening and the childish screeching will be relegated to irrelevance. People below 40 know common te reo phrases and words, and can easily accommodate it into every day life.
        
        Only the stubborn and, frankly, the racists, actually have a problem with it.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:57pm
      - alloytoo
        
        @Batman
        
        Not wishing to engage with the Maori language does not mean that an individual wishes to dictate how the state interacts with other people.
        
        That’s a cheap shot.
        
        It simple means that the individual wishes to deal wishes to deal with the government in a language they understand.
        
        In Multi-language societies governments engage their citizens in the language of their choice, not in pidgin version of all languages.
        
        By your logic the South African government should engage with it’s citizens in a pidgin of 11 different languages.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:21pm
      - Batman
        
        Except of course in the real world we don’t have 11 languages and are not creating a pigeon language. A few additional words or phrases is not going to make fuck all difference to understanding and reading comprehension.
        
        Frankly, as department can name themselves whatever they like. Heck, you all know what Oranga Tamariki is right?
        
        Some OTT enthusiasm for throwing in additional te reo will fade after a while and it will settle of a common set of customs that will integrate some Reo where appropriate and possible.
        
        Meanwhile, if the argument is about efficiency and understanding, a shitload of pakeha businesses need to change their names to something descriptive because who the fuck knows what many of them stand for and do!
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:32pm
      - Yabster
        
        oh know Battys pulled out the “racist’ card- aka he is getting desparate lol are you all ashamed now? Even those that have Maori blood posting against his weak argument?
        
        And what partnership do you refer to- can you cite that in the Treaty for me Bats old fella?
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:34pm
      - alloytoo
        
        Bats said “Heck, you all know what Oranga Tamariki is right?”
        
        Ah no I don’t.
        
        And neither do many other people, especially if English is not their first language.
        
        It would not be difficult to find 11 different languages (including Maori) in an Auckland suburb. I know people who speak Mandarin, Russian, Japanese, Afrikaans, Tamil Portuguese and Dutch. That’s just people I’m acquainted with.
        
        More people than I know who can speak Maori.
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:55pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      riffer is best ignored MarkF. He is going to push this.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:01am
  - Swifty
    
    Why should a citizen be forced to Google public organisations communicating with them?
    
    Comms 101 fail.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:26am
    - Batman
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      What you really mean is that as a white person, you haven’t had to engage with other languages domestically and don’t like it.
      
      Immigrants who come here, no doubt have had to Google various things. Same for you when looking up the Italian immigration department, for instance.
      
      The problem is solved through a tiny amount of basic learning. And a refusal to do so makes it clear who is who 🤣
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:27am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        That’s great for the immigrants. I’m not an immigrant and I don’t wish to learn a [deleted, racist – Mod] language that wasn’t even in written form until your ancestors arrived.
        
        Te reo Maori is pukaru. Wiremu and Eruera told me as much when we were on the korowhai course.
        
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        December 5, 2021 11:44am
      - leoj
        
        Why didn’t this govt agency send the entire message in te reo?
        
        You know why. You are simply stirring the pot.
        
        Some moderator.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:37am
      - Batman
        
        Crying about moderators won’t help. Get over it.
        
        Tomtoddy is quite clearly selectively quoting and misleading about the true nature of the letter. 95% of which will have been in English.
        
        The things people will do for upvotes and to scratch their pet itches huh?
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:42pm
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Why try and paraphrase (and fail) on what someone said, and inject a strawman motivation.
        
        You know essentially sweet FA about most the posters here; what their ethnicity is, what the extended family make up might be, and what languages they speak.
        I have a degree of understanding of more than one language, both written and spoken – and making people have to Google translate on government comms is nonsense.
        When a pamphlet might come out for NZers with multiple languanges, from Hindi/Chinese/Tongan for critical comms this would make sense alongside English and Maori, but when you say “Drop the English” here and there, “the bigots can Google it” it shows a very very poor logic in terms of comms………….almost like the people making the material are being mischievous more than anything.
        What is this game? What is the intention?
        And ‘fuck you: Google it’ is not really what I want as a response from public servants.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:58am
      - Swifty
        
        You are quite wrong Batman.
        
        I will state again, it is the state coercion I have issue with.
        
        I have no issue with communications being provided with a Maori translation, separately and not mixed up or embedded.
        
        And the next time you even hint on here that I’m some sort of racist for believing so I’ll be taking the matter up with DPF immediately.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:48am
      - Batman
        
        Swifty, I was generalising but not directing at you outside of the part that was referencing your comment.
        
        State coercion is a terrible argument, ignoring as it does the chequered history of bans on Te Reo being spoken and violence dealt to those who spoke it.
        
        Surely you must concede that the state effectively coerces the teaching and speaking of English? And in effect, any government rule or law is coercion? That’s what the conservative/ libertarian bloc would say anyhow.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:04pm
      - I remember when
        
        “95% of which will have been in English.”
        Exactly, so what is the point of the other 5%.
        Is it right that a Maori translation should be 5% in English?
        With the number of Maori pupils at Kura now there will certainly be a growing number of Maori speakers.
        However, the present approach doesn’t seem to be encouraging the language amongst non-Maori.
        Surely that is what is needed – tiny steps with encouragement.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:27pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        Government departments are charged with communicating with the relevant population.
        If they want to communicate effectively then surely they should allow choice of the two official languages.
        Just as a citizen has a right to communicate with Government in Te Reo, the same right surely should exist for those waning to communicate in English.
        
        At the moment it appears that virtue signaling is each departments top priority
        
        Wouldnt it be great if some brave MP put forward a bill that all communications from any Governmnet Department or LOcal Body be presented in the Official language of the recipients choice.
        ie You can access either the Maori Version or the English version. Like many multi lingual countries whereas an option for language is at the head of all Websites or you can register with any government department, local body etc to receive communications in either language.
        
        That would stop this virtual signalling in its tracks and force people to act like adults rather than rebellious teenagers
        
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        August 5, 2022 5:46pm
      - Loddenthinks
        
        It will probably stop most of the virtue signallers Ra, but Batty will be there till the end, making a lot of noise like an empty vessel does, lecturing us on our raaacism and clutching his pearls at the shameless bigotry expressed in the simple act of wishing to be communicated with in the (de facto) official language of our country, New Zealand.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:55pm
  - CJames
    
    That is another stupid comment from you riffer. Give it a rest.
    Why should government departments send out information in language the recipient cannot understand? At the very least, it’s arrogance.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:29am
    - riffer
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Because its the official language of the country.
      
      At the very least, your comment is ignorance. At worst, it’s bigotry.
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:38am
      - CJames
        
        Then where is all the information in sign language? That is also official.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:42am
      - Flossie
        
        Not “the” official language – an official language. And just incidently why do you not post here in Maori Riffer? Possibly because you wouldn’t be understood?
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:44am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Riffer – here’s an idea. Do all your posts in te reo and help educate us racists. I think that would be a wonderful contribution from you for the cause. In fact, I’m going to skim past all of your comments now unless they are written in te reo.
        
        nga mihi.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:53am
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Lordy riffer, and your comment is just plain stupid. Even given Maori is an official language, less than 1% of MAORI are fluent in it, which means approx .0017% of NZ’ers are fluent. So NO Government Dept should be communicating in Maori. And if anyone’s comment is ignorant, it’s yours.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:56am
      - Batman
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Not only are you wrong, by a factor of 25, but you’ve also let slip the real background argument here, which is a desire not to see Te Reo used anywhere with the consequence that it dies out.
        
        How very 1860s of you.
        
        Here’s some awkward reading: https://www.renews.co.nz/te-reo-maori-only-became-an-official-language-in-nz-35-years-ago-today/#:~:text=Now%20almost%2025%25%20of%20M%C4%81ori,phrases%20of%20te%20reo%20M%C4%81ori.
        
        With 40% of 15-34s able to speak more than a few words, it is the sign that the dinosaurs will die out, as is the way of all things.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:50am
      - kowtow
        
        CJames
        
        The regime is using sign every day .To taxpayers. The two fingered salute.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:01am
      - Jack5
        
        To be consistent Riffer should post his rubbish in Maori language, complete with macrons.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:02am
      - RichardX
        
        Seriously CJames, you think sign language is used for written communication?
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:03am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        English is the official language. Moaris is a language – so is Sign, but English is the language 99.99% of us use.
        Stop forcing your crap on us.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:07am
      - riffer
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        You are incorrect Steve Otto.
        
        Te Reo is an official language. English is not actually an official language, mainly because it is so widespread it is considered a de facto official language.
        
        There is no language called Moari.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:10am
      - Jack5
        
        z
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:21am
      - alloytoo
        
        The language status is meaningless, if next to no one understands it.
        
        They might as well send it out in Latin.
        
        I at least know someone who could translate it for me.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:28am
      - leoj
        
        Name calling is a fail and won’t change the fact that the maori language is spoken by a tiny number and understood by even fewer.
        
        Keep the language, by all means, but don’t expect me to use it just because you say so. Also, don’t expect my taxes to promote it.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:41am
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Batman, try this: https://socialreport.msd.govt.nz/cultural-identity/maori-language-speakers.html
        
        So you can see that in 2001, 25% of Maori could hold an everyday conversation. That appears to be the case today. “Everyday conversation” doesn’t make them fluent. Somewhere, I read that 1% were fluent. I will try and find it and reproduce it.
        
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        August 5, 2022 2:10pm
    - RoboRob
      
      The thing that really makes me laugh / cry is the radio adds where they say ‘to find out more information search Nga ikiasd awrr sf sad kljsdfh erjlj dfsdf qwerewr e rua’. Dude you just paid for an add that helps no one.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:03am
    - JeffW
      
      I wonder if part of the attraction is to reduce accountability. If no -one knows what department is what, what they are doing and what they are saying, how can citizens hold them to account?
      
      11 0
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      August 5, 2022 10:36am
      - Batman
        
        Via the contact details on the letter/email/letterhead?
        
        Honestly, that’s not a very good theory.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:43pm
    - alloytoo
      
      Far worse than arrogance, it may well block immigrants from accessing state services to which they are entitled to.
      
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      August 5, 2022 1:24pm
    - I remember when
      
      I have nothing to suggest that Batman’s 25% figure is not correct.
      But if I was standing in a queue at the bookies I know where my money would be placed.
      
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      August 5, 2022 1:32pm
  - colinm
    
    Riffer, why should I as a customer of MPI, have to use google to translate a letter to me? Once again, it appears that a government department is not communicating clearly, that is, using a language that the recipient is unlikely to understand.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:30am
  - Simon
    
    “Would have taken you less than five seconds to google it.”
    
    Lol – keep it up. People are increasingly losing confidence in government, including all this woke shit. Confidence declines to a point where is becomes easy for the centre-right to start closing down the shit.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:32am
  - pdm
    
    Nah – googling it is not my job.
    
    Government correspondence to people should make sense.
    
    I see you have the downticker working hard – rostered on for how long?
    
    72 2
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    August 5, 2022 8:34am
    - riffer
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      I don’t downtick. Don’t believe in it. I don’t give a fuck if you downtick either. I am not here for the ticks. It’s called General Debate. I am allowed to not agree with you, and to present my opinion. Some (many people) here can’t handle that. Especially when I point out their bigotry and ignorance.
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:39am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Yes you are entitled to your opinion, but like a true leftie, you think your opinion is the only thing that counts
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:59am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        Just so you understand what you’re saying:
        
        You are making clear assumptions when you accuse people of bigotry. You don’t know the reason behind their choices but call them bigots.
        
        That doesn’t mean they are bigots. There are a plethora of reasons not to be interested in Te Reo, and almost none of them relate to bigotry.
        On the other hand, your accusation of bigotry is entirely due to your assumptions of other peoples reasons.
        
        In short – you’re the one guilty of bigotry here.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:00am
      - Jack5
        
        Riffer, when you brand those you disagree with as bigots and ignoramuses you aren’t debating.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:14am
      - Batman
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        I’m sure the KKK used that argument when trying to claim they were just Christian Nationalists looking to protect the family unit
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:51am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Riffer, your comments at 8.38 and 9.10 contradict each other. 8.38 you said “Because its THE official language of the country.’
        At 9.10 you said “Te Reo is AN official language. English is not actually an official language, mainly because it is so widespread it is considered a de facto official language.”
        Can’t have it both ways sonny
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:30am
      - Sacha
        
        Dear Riffer: For debate to take place, you need to be able to discuss points, and concede that there may be disagreement among those involved – but still make your point courteously.
        It is counterproductive to the debate if one party will not listen to the others, or will only denigrate their opinions.
        It is also mischievous to enter a forum and distract others by baiting them into an argument which neither side will ‘win’.
        The ‘other side’ would be wiser to recognise and disengage.
        You would be wise to stop while you are (just) ahead.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:37am
      - Cassandra
        
        Objecting to being written to in a language I do not understand is not bigotry. Insisting that it’s OK is.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:51am
      - Opie
        
        I think you will find it is you that is arrogant, happily forcing the view of the minority onto the majority because it makes you feel that you are better than everyone else.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:27am
      - Bobba Fret
        
        You should go over to The Standard, they would like you there.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:28am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Mods will be along soon to have a chat with him.
      
      15 3
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      August 5, 2022 9:08am
      - riffer
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Well if that is the case, then it will be a sad indictment on this site, as it will reflect that there is no opportunity for actual debate on here.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:11am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        riffer, debate all you want, but stop the force feeding shit.
        Speaking of debate you have not answered the question from CJames – “Then where is all the information in sign language? That is also official.”
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:18am
      - RichardX
        
        Steve, do you know anyone who uses sign language for written communication?
        Is it because you think deaf people can’t read?
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:01am
      - leoj
        
        Batman will give riffer a cuddle…….
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:43am
  - Yabster
    
    lol you just proved the point how stupid this is rif raf
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:38am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    But that is the point. The purpose of language is to communicate efficiently. I agree that government departments should issue communications in the Maori language. However issuing hybrid versions is ridiculous and is unprecedented anywhere globally apart from PNG. I have looked. (OK not exhaustively but I did devote a couple of hours browsing government communications from countries with one or more official language.
    
    For example the Belgium government issues communications to Flemish speakers and French speakers. It does not muddle then together because that would cause confusion and probably a riot.
    
    I am astounded that making such an obvious point in New Zealand can be seen as controversial. I guess the difference is that the French speakers in Belgium are not trying to force the Flemish speakers to learn French, and vice versa.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:01am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      BY, good comments about Countries with more than one official language.
      MPI sending out a letter in a language that most do not speak is not communicating efficiently – and they fucking know it!
      We are being force fed by public sector cancer.
      
      37 2
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      August 5, 2022 9:14am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      The fact is.. the majority of NZers are basically monolingual and do not in their daily life communicate or read in more than 1 language.
      
      Some folks may feel that by adding a few words of te Reo into their writing or speech, others will become conversant in that language.
      
      I’ve had over 55 years exposure to Latin and whilst I’m familiar with a number of words (mainly botanical Latin), my proficiency in the Language is about as poor as it was the day I first sat in Ms Salmon’s Latin class.
      
      35 1
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      August 5, 2022 9:31am
  - alloytoo
    
    Google is such a colonial affectation.
    
    Shame on you for suggesting it.
    
    8 1
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    August 5, 2022 9:23am
  - Thought Criminal
    
    But it’s not 5 seconds is it. It’s every department. Every name. Every citizen. Every attempt to access taxpayer funded information. It’s a barrier to easy understanding and access. Imagine a world where every citizen has to jump on Google every time they want something from the government.
    
    Crazy.
    
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    August 5, 2022 10:34am
  - Michael J Baker
    
    We had Big Gerry in fourth form and generally we thought he was great. Funny, didn’t take any shit from punk adolescents, and was quick to help when you actually needed instruction.
    But I can imagine he wouldn’t appear to women in the same way. Or effeminate or insecure Kiwi males.
    
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    August 5, 2022 10:59am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  I’m bored with this whole topic of too much te reo in New Zealand, primarily because it’s coming from a bunch of people who simply refuse to make any attempt to learn the language, despite it more and more becoming part of everyday society.
  
  What I will point out is that you may want to consider how you learned to speak and understand English… from people constantly talking it around you. It’s the same thing happening with te reo… because it works.
  
  Some people still act like NZ Post did to Naida Glavish 38 years ago.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:26am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    What has it got to do with you which language I do or don’t want to learn? It is none of your business. If I want to learn another language I’ll do so when it suits me. The arrogance of this policy is stunning.
    What is the point of my learning Maori? What benefit will it bring me?
    I studied Latin at school. I feel exactly the same way about it as I do about Maori, French, German or any other language.
    
    67 3
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    August 5, 2022 8:33am
    - riffer
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Well for a start it would help you understand more about the world you live in.
      
      2 74
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      August 5, 2022 8:40am
      - Swifty
        
        Ah, more of the ‘annointed’ ordering the rest of us about and telling us what’s good for us like we’re too stupid to work that out for ourselves.
        
        Got it.
        
        The arrogance of the left personified.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:44am
      - Yabster
        
        [tone it down or you’ll go on holiday – Mod]
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:46am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        I learnt French and Latin. I had a crack at Greek, I started on Japanese in the early nineties. My daughter carried on with the Japanese and is reasonably proficient in it. These were all done for personal reasons, free choice. Not because some ideologue thinks we have to.
        Your aggressive approach and calling people racist for not agreeing you will have exactly the opposite effect of what you are aiming for. Idiotic.
        
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        August 5, 2022 8:59am
      - riffer
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        I am not calling them racist. I am calling them bigoted. There is a difference.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:12am
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        What utter nonsense riffer. Me being able to speak French, a bit of German and a bit of Italian doesn’t give me any better understanding of the world. It is useful when I am in those countries because they are the main language of those countries. Other than to Maori, the Maori language is utterly useless in this country. If Maori want to save it, then go ahead and speak it amongst yourselves and put on your own language courses. It’s not as though they haven’t been paid billions to better their people. It is not my, or any other taxpayers responsibility to rescue the Maori language. Particularly when they can’t be arsed saving, or even speaking it themselves!
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:15am
      - BeaB
        
        You do write a load of trite and childish nonsense, Riffer. The fact is very few people in NZ speak, write or understand Māori. When I taught it in the 70’s the top students were all Pakeha. The local marae had very few speakers so for most kids it was a couple of years study as a novelty and quickly forgotten through disuse.
        It’s pointless sending out any sort of information, official or otherwise, in a language around 3% understand.
        And even those of us with some proficiency cannot be bothered with the new longwinded Māori names for government departments.
        Certainly preserve the language as a historical artefact and support those who want to use it.
        But English rules and always will.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:43am
      - Tomtoddy
        
        Riffer you are welcome to your opinion and to promote your views where you can. It is not my blog to say whether you can use it to push your ideas and debate with others.
        
        There are are number of sound, logical arguments against forcing people to participate in a second language like Maori.
        
        1. It is quite a limited language with letters and sounds.
        2. It has zero use outside NZ
        3. It has no value as a trade language.
        4. Many of its concepts have indistinct meaning and are potentially a nightmare for misinterpretation especially at judicial and commercial level. However it is relatively easy to learn and having a second language is helpful in our learning process. Individual choice.
        
        It is the unsubtle and arrogant manner that is being deployed by elitists that is unhelpful and abrasive.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:45am
      - Stellaboxer
        
        When dealing with government departments that print important information in several languages such as Samoan , Hindi , Mandarin do they bastardise them with Māori ? Or do they just print the information in Māori as well? Thought as much. This cringe worthy attempt to engineer some type of unique New Zealand English Māori hybrid is both farcical and insulting to lovers of both languages. It’s not organic and will do more to hamper Te reo than help it. People don’t like being nudged by their governments and when they realise they are there is generally a backlash . Of course socialists don’t allow for human nature or individual agency which is why of course they fail at every attempt yet rise up some place else to try it all again. I have lived in multi lingual countries and they most certainly didn’t embarrass themselves like this just simply respected all languages equally.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:47am
      - Matt Long
        
        Bigots Riffer, a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.
        “don’t let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city”
        Take a look in the mirror while you try and force others follow your failed agenda.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:32am
    - kipper
      
      I learned latin at school and what little I still remember is FAR MORE USEFUL than this te reo stuff. With latin I travel around Spain, France and Italy work out what’s going on without being able to speak the lingo.
      
      What we are seeing is ideology in action, it’s as simple as that.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:12am
    - Bluegrass
      
      In the Maori context, let’s take Switzerland, with 4 official languages – German, French, Italian, and Romansh.
      
      German, French, and Italian have equal status as official languages at the national level within the Federal Administration of the Swiss Confederation, and Romansh is used only in dealings with people who speak it.
      
      That works, and illustrates the reality – Romansch being a minor player.
      
      But what would Switzerland know, riffer (in case you read this response to ClanMcleod)?
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:55pm
  - RightNow
    
    I’m bored with te reo too, what a woftam.
    Am learning Bahasa Indonesia at the moment, much rather chat with the lovely Balinese people.
    Selamat pagi !
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:36am
    - Ra Henare
      
      You will be pleased to know that Bahasa is very much alighned with Maori.
      When I learnt Bahasa in the 1970s. A main tutor was an Indonesian Linguistics Professor who had taken on a job at Victoria University.
      
      She did not know Maori, but during the welcoming ceremony, she said she understood most of the maori being spoken, due to its similarity to Bahasa, obviously some differences, but she could get the gist of the welcoming Ceremony.
      
      Due to lack of use, my conversational Bahasa has sadly fallen iby the wayside. But I still enjoy ordering food at Indonesian Restaurants in Bahasa. Get some very surprised (but positive) reactions and GREAT service.
      
      Enjoy your learning
      
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      August 5, 2022 5:59pm
  - CJames
    
    Most of the Maori language in use is not te reo. It is a corruption of English words. It has also imprecise meanings.
    People don’t speak it because it is hard to learn and it is useless for living in the real world. In my work environment, we have many special terms with very precise meanings that cannot be translated. Look at parliamentary legislation, particularly the technical Regulations. Translate those. Translate mortgage documents.
    I believe people who speak or write mixing the two languages in a woke form of pretentiousness are arrogance personified
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:41am
    - RockyJ
      
      Great comment. In my experience in dealing with activists, all pakeha, using the vagueness of Te Reo to deliberately obscure their hidden agenda.
      English is much more precise and less open to multiple meanings.
      Here’s a tip. When someone like Riffer posts to you in Te Reo it usually is a sign they admit defeat. My response to that is to post a reply in Latin, another dead language
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:53am
      - Bluegrass
        
        And Latin is a very precise language, governed very strictly by its grammar.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:57pm
    - CJames
      
      I note the government puff pieces like press releases are in English. There is no te reo terminology.
      https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/government-opens-new-research-and-innovation-hub
      
      Here riffer, translate this passage from the document into te reo so that it conveys exactly the same meaning “Te Pā Harakeke will be occupied by Callaghan Innovation’s partner the Ferrier Research Institute. The Institute is a team of carbohydrate, analytical and bio-chemistry experts and will work on site with lipid nanoparticles to build research and manufacturing capability for mRNA vaccines and related technologies. “
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:54am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Stop making sense – he will still have to type a Moari translation in ENGLISH text!
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:35am
      - Bluegrass
        
        Does the research and testing involve cooking pots at all? If so then I’m guessing that there would be quite a few Maori words dealing with the subtleties of cooking pots, contents etc – reminiscent of the many words the Lapps use to describe snow.
        
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        August 6, 2022 12:06am
  - Swifty
    
    People are free to learn Maori if they wish to – it’s a matter entirely for the individual.
    
    It’s the aspect of state coercion that gets me.
    
    One anecdote I’ve never mentioned on here – I’m old enough to remember the lead up to the advent of Maori Television.
    
    I distinctly recall proponents promising that ‘this move will save language, and all by itself – nothing more will be required….’.
    
    Well, what a great big fucking lie that turned out to be. In the years since, Maori speaking rates have barely moved – and audience figures have been and continue to be abysmal.
    
    And those same liars are still around today – telling more lies in their pursuit of things that advantage them and at the public’s expense.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:42am
    - Batman
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      By publishing 99% of information in English and providing lessons in schools, by default the state is coercing people to learn and speak English.
      
      Tyranny!!!!
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:31am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Folks learn their first language before they arrive at school.
        
        I didn’t learn to speak English at school… I learnt it at home.
        
        My husband’s first language is Russian; his 2nd is German. He learnt English when he started school and requested that his parents and gdparents spoke to him in English.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:43am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        My son is equally fluent in his mother’s language from speaking at home, being read to, hearing stories, interacting with relatives, etc.
        Cost to the taxpayer – zero $.
        Big song and dance about it, national campaign, guilt, moral and political pressure; Nope.
        
        There is no need for public compulsion or massive investment if the speakers of the language themselves put in the effort within their own ‘whanau’.
        The banning of speaking of Maori in school is a distorted trope both in the rationale behind it (and WHO wanted it) and the real impacts it might have had.
        Alternatively, forcing people to use a language is not going to work.
        Oddly enough (AGAIN), the answer to improvement of any statistic here is with the Maori people themselves.
        And again no huge cost is needed on the nation collectively if there was genuine will and drive.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:40am
      - Swifty
        
        What an utterly fatuous statement.
        
        If you can’t see the distinction, well that’s something you’ll have to live with.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:51am
      - Batman
        
        Woosh, and the point went right over at least three people’s heads.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:31pm
      - Yabster
        
        english lessons at school ? writing/spelling sure, but couldn’t you speak english before you went to school Bats?
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:40pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Rubbish..
        
        Nothing went over my head,
        
        Maori of yesterday made a conscious decision to converse in English with their children..
        
        Just as my grandparents spoke to their children in English and not Gaelic.
        
        Just as my husband has chosen to never speak to our children in Russian.
        
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        August 5, 2022 4:25pm
    - Nickc2
      
      I agree with you Swifty but the tactic did gain them a TV Station of their very own paid for and supported by the taxpayer, by which to spread their propaganda eh?
      I’m picking that if Labour wins the next election, all TV channels will be required to have Te Reo sub-titles.
      Willie Jackson won’t let that chance go by to divide us.
      No doubt the contract for supplying sub-titles will be awarded to Mahuta Corp without tenders being called for.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:49am
  - Rodney Hide
    
    Hi Riffer
    
    I have no wish to bore you but others may be interested in the debate. Language is fascinating and very human with grammar being genetically programmed.
    
    It’s also spontaneous and evolutionary with intense selection pressure. It has proved immune to government diktat and elite control.
    
    Logically we should all speak esperanto!
    
    But we don’t even all speak an english that we can all understand — even in England.
    
    We use language to communicate. And we choose it.
    
    It can’t be chosen for us.
    
    It’s the arrogance and hubris of those who live off the rest of us telling us how we should communicate that irks. Along with them having the luxury of sloppy communication.
    
    The grim reality is that te reo is doomed. We can unintentionally save some words and phrases by incorporating them into English, and we can keep it alive in government departments and language museums, but for everyday communication it is simply not useful nor efficient — it’s only purpose now is to prove oneself a member of the leisure class.
    
    Rodney Hide
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:03am
    - RoboRob
      
      Well said. The whole purpose of language is to communicate.
      
      Bludgeoning token Maori phrases into adverts and documents the message is lost. The same is true when we allow people to identify as alternate sexes or attack helicopters. The message is lost. This morning I watched a story on an American basketball player detained in Russia. I felt some sympathy for this Woman. Then they showed ‘her’ and it was a him with a womans name. Without the video clip I would never have known.
      
      Yes Maori is one of three official languages in NZ, the same as sign. Would TV news alternating between English, Maori and Sign help get the message across.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:12am
    - Jack5
      
      RH’s ….grammar being genetically programmed.
      
      That’s Chomsky’s theory, nativism. Probably goes too far, but this, from “Neuroscience News” is interesting:
      
      ” … genetic variation in the FOXP2 gene is strongly associated with the ability to learn a foreign language during adulthood. The FOXP2 gene, expressed in the human brain, has been previously implicated in disordered speech and language.
      
      https://neurosciencenews.com/foxp2-language-learning-genetics-2096/
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:37am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Jesus, that’s a bit harsh Rodney, but true.
      Stop making sense.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:38am
    - leoj
      
      Last sentence – replace “leisure” with “woke” and you are spot on!
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:52am
    - Frank the tank
      
      Boom!
      
      Post of the year.
      
      By a mile.
      
      Get back into politics – you are wasted in your current roles. NZ needs you.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:13am
    - Rodion Raskolnikov
      
      English is spoken organically in New Zealand by way of a natural cultural transmission, unlike the use of Maori. An artificial, ideologically-driven imposition by the managerial state and its institutions is the only thing keeping Maori language even marginally relevant. If this artificial imposition or enforced usage were removed, Maori would at once begin to recede back to its natural sphere, which is among a tiny elite of committed Maori. The difference with English is that it isn’t imposed, so its use is organic, and the opposite is the case: even with Maori language being foisted on us, English would still remain the dominant language.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:44am
      - Ra Henare
        
        RR you say
        The difference with English is that it isn’t imposed,
        
        So please explain why English is a compulsory subject in state schools and all tuition is in English as is all legislation rules, road signs etc
        
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        August 5, 2022 6:04pm
    - Fuzzysnuggleduck
      
      Not doomed, but perhaps fated to not become more than it already is.
      
      It will still be spoken on marae, and in certain settings, and within homes, and by people who choose to.
      And this is good.
      
      What is NOT good is the hijacking of our public departments.
      I would prefer they stuck to their knitting.
      At best it is a pitiful attempt to be culturally competent on the surface, and negatively impacting communication – at worst it is a hint at the degree of influence of Maori nationalism, an impractical and almost religious trajectory by useful idiots, expanding upon the cancer of the wording of ‘Treaty Principle’ insertions into government policies since the 1980’s: a blatant distortion of the original wording and intent of the Treaty.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:54am
    - Bluegrass
      
      See my comment above on Switzerland, c/f Romansch.
      
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      August 6, 2022 12:10am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “’Im bored with this whole topic of too much te reo in New Zealand…”
    
    You are still missing the point, perhaps willfully. I have no issue at all with Government resources being devoted to communication and media in the Maori language in New Zealand. However I do not want to be forced to comprehend, literally, a pidgin version of English. To repeat, the only other country that does so is PNG. For reasons that should be obvious to anyone who is sane.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:17am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      BY, if you should get a letter from MPI; will it be in a Chinese language just for you?
      Not trolling, genuine question – to emphasise that we are being force fed Moari whether we like it or not!
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:23am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Not often.
        
        MPI and Customs do publish Chinese language versions of the regulation of ‘high risk’ activities such as food standards.
        
        https://www.mpi.govt.nz/food-business/running-a-food-business/forms-documents-food-plans-programmes/
        
        Another good example is Customs declarations forms. They don’t want someone claiming they brought in dried raccoon dog meat because they did not understand the form. “-)
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:33am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Hawaiians speak a sort of mixed version
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:39am
      - Cassandra
        
        But the State Government doesn’t write to its citizens in a mixture. Apart from “Aloha” which is now almost an English word and the first name of a NZ politician.
        
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        August 5, 2022 9:58am
      - Batman
        
        Cassandra that isn’t an argument in your favour, it’s yet another piece of evidence that state institutions are largely mono-cultural and not living up to representation of the people they govern.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:36pm
      - Paulus
        
        Maori is dialectic as many different spoken versions exist between the many Iwi.
        As here was no written Maori language it is all made up.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:40pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      I have an issue with it as it is costing NZ well north of a billion a year in lost productivity, wasted taxes spent on a racist initiative to benefit preferences of people that on average use far more than they contribute to NZ. Other ethnicities in NZ manage to preserve their language without subsidies, just requires interested parents to pull finger and teach their kids.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:34am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Bored already? That did not take long.
    Is that ‘bored’ feeling thing in the room with you now?
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:20am
  - alloytoo
    
    No one around me talks Maori , so clearly that’s a fail.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:31am
  - Lara
    
    Most people learn to speak their own language at home from their parents. There was never anything to stop Maori learning the same way.
    
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    August 5, 2022 10:16am
- surfing
  
  This is the way of the woke.
  
  They’ve put maori up on the pedestal, to be praised and showered with gifts.
  
  Non-maori are the oppressors.
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:53am
Warren

I have reposted this from yesterday as it hadn’t cleared moderation by the time I went to bed.
While the Minister for Education Chris Hipkins, with Grant Robertson, Micheal Wood , Shane Te Pua, Haden Munro,and many others from the Labour continue to write articles for the Herald on National against National Leader Chris Luxon this corrupt Media source take the stories away that should be high lighted showing the mess that Jacinda Ardern our Prime Minister has turned New Zealand into and divided many New Zealander’s, Jacinda Ardern has turned democracy into a dictatorship by her quest to give Maori with 17% of the population 50% of the vote to Govern New Zealand.
With Education , Health, Immigration, Housing , Crime, the Economy and our Police Force in disarray the media have been paid by our Prime Minister not to criticize her decisions but allow her and there Journalists to smear the opposition Parties at will while New Zealander’s do it hard through there inability to control inflation.
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August 5, 2022 8:06am
Maggie Pie

CNN just reported that President Biden is about to declare ‘MONKEYPOX’ a Public-Health-Emergency. 🙁
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August 5, 2022 8:11am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Oh, that was a surprise, nothing like that has ever happened before…….//
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:14am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Imagine your doctor telling you….” You’ve got monkeypox”
    
    How EMBARRASSING!!
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:21am
    - Inandout
      
      How embarassing if Joe got it.
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:25am
    - pdm
      
      Or any other sort of pox for that matter Maggie.
      
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      August 5, 2022 8:36am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Imagine turning up to tennis with the pox.
      
      21 1
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      August 5, 2022 9:02am
      - Maggie Pie
        
        Or even worse….a knock-off Rolex 🙁
        
        18 4
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        August 5, 2022 9:10am
- Frank the tank
  
  Maybe “Butterupmykegs” just caught it?
  
  Petey has been rather quiet recently.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:15am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Perhaps some facts may help understanding.
  
  https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30401-1/fulltext
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:28am
  - Scott
    
    riffer – are you the next version of Mikey? You seem to have the same style?
    Those that have done any tiny little bit of research on monkey pox will find out that 99% of the people who contract monkeypox are men. And of those 99%, at least 95% are homosexual men who contracted monkeypox having sex with other men.
    
    Apparently the main concern from health authorities is people discriminating against homosexuals. The idea of actually giving people proper information appears to be of lesser concern?
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:33am
    - Batman
      
      Any source for that? While it is correct that the most affected communities are gay and bi men, the virus obviously doesn’t care about such distinctions and will transmit itself via the methods it knows, skin contact and fluids (saliva et al).
      
      You can contract it via droplets but that is much less common.
      
      So it makes sense to prioritise the communities affected first. As a way to stop it getting out and into much larger groups such as young straight folks (who are equally prolific in the casual sex department).
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:40am
      - RightNow
        
        Stop panicking Batty, the vaccine will be available soon and you can get your 4 shots of it. In the meantime just wear a butt-mask to protect others.
        
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        August 5, 2022 10:55am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        It’s less the male gay sex than male gay mass sexual orgies that are spreading the disease, Monkeypox (a modest proposal):
        
        We’re not talking about the two dads at home with the kids.
        
        No, specifically, gay men who have lots of sex, usually anonymous sex or sex with randos or group sex or orgies: high-volume hyperpromiscuous sex of the kind practiced nigh-exclusively by gay men and paid prostitutes. It’s not actually a sexually transmitted disease, but it does require a lot of skin contact with multiple people, as shown by these excerpts from one BabethePigBoi
        
        Now I seem to remember that in the time of General Tso’s Sickness, the government was also very aggressive about pushing non-medicinal interventions, like forbidding certain behaviors as well as outlawing groups larger than ten getting together for any reason at all.
        
        So I have a modest proposal – modest because I’m inspired by Scientists like Professor Neil Ferguson, Dr Fauci, Dr Birx, Prof Baker and Souxie Wiles, among many others.
        
        Why don’t we just ban male homosexual group sex – just for two weeks. Just get yourself one steady fuck buddy for that time – or maybe longer.
        
        Public health and all that. You know, just “to Flatten the Curve” or perhaps longer “to Slow the Spread”.
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:22am
      - Rodion Raskolnikov
        
        “We report 528 infections diagnosed between April 27 and June 24, 2022, at 43 sites in 16 countries. Overall, 98% of the persons with infection were gay or bisexual men, 75% were White, and 41% had human immunodeficiency virus infection; the median age was 38 years. Transmission was suspected to have occurred through sexual activity in 95% of the persons with infection” – New England Journal of Medicine
        
        https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2207323
        
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        August 5, 2022 11:50am
      - Inandout
        
        Bat, this doesn’t help, in fact it is a lesson in stupidity.
        
        ‘Height of hypocrisy: Newsom declares monkeypox a state of emergency in Cali after allowing gay, leather kink festival to go ahead – but BANNED kids from going to school during pandemic’.
        
        Mailonline.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:10pm
      - Scott
        
        https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/18/health/monkeypox-lgbtq-safety/index.html
        
        CNN admits it is mostly gay men. I can’t find my initial source. But they said it was almost exclusively gay men.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:27pm
      - Scott
        
        Also gay men are far more prolific in the casual sex department. Having 100 or more sexual partners is common among gay men.
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:28pm
      - Batman
        
        Rightnow, a very droll but rather crude troll.
        
        Tom, that is a completely unverified and rather stereotypical observation. Frankly it’s pretty fucking homophobic.
        
        Inandout, yes that’s bait designed to get you to click and read and feel mad. A festival of any type should be allowed unless it’s the Californian state sex champs. The purpose of the event is linked but isn’t, say, an orgy, banning it would be anti-freedom which I’m sure you must be against.
        
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        August 5, 2022 1:44pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        Frankly it’s pretty fucking homophobic.
        
        But not racist. Thank goodness for that.
        
        If you’ve spent any time in the male gay community over the last 30-40 years – and it doesn’t sound like you have – you’d know damn well that there is a rather large segment of it that is all about having as much sex with as many partners as fast as possible. You can read the (sanitised) tweets from BabethePigBoi as a perfectly ordinary example.
        
        Not new. Not disgusting to me. But also stupidly unsafe with this virus going around. Asking them to cool it for a few months and stick with one guy is hardly being “homophobic” but then you threw that because you had no counter argument.
        
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        August 5, 2022 3:12pm
  - westernScientist
    
    Perhaps some ‘lived experience’ which might help your understanding:
    
    https://www.amazon.com/Archipelago-Peterson-introduction-Aleksandr-Solzhenitsyn/dp/1784871516
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:54am
- Ghost
  
  Looking at page 10 I guess they are right on schedule
  
  https://www.nti.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/NTI_Paper_BIO-TTX_Final.pdf
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:16am
- Im Right
  
  Of course he will Maggie, the Dems are in for a hiding at the mid terms in Nov! Now watch for them to spin it out to be a national health risk and restrict movement by Novembers voting…..mainly mail in votes for certain states?…..it’s the Democratic party at work here, watch this space.
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:26am
  - Batman
    
    Meanwhile, 70% of the new voters in Kansas who signed up following the Roe decision were women. And the abortion measure (which was intentionally worded to deceived and the GOP sent out texts to trick voters) was drubbed at the ballot box.
    
    There are signs all around that the midterms are not going to go as forecasted.
    
    Claims of mail fraud still hold no water.
    
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    August 5, 2022 12:20pm
    - CJames
      
      Batman
      Here is the actual wording of the Kansas referendum:
      “Because Kansans value both women and children, the constitution of the state of Kansas does not require government funding of abortion and does not create or secure a right to abortion. To the extent permitted by the constitution of the United States, the people, through their elected state representatives and state senators, may pass laws regarding abortion, including, but not limited to, laws that account for circumstances of pregnancy resulting from rape or incest, or circumstances of necessity to save the life of the mother.”
      If you actually had read it, you would see they can pass any law they like pro or anti abortion.
      
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      August 5, 2022 7:10pm
      - CJames
        
        My personal view is I would voted against the bill solely on the grounds I couldn’t understand what it says. That is regardless of my views on the abortion debate.
        
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        August 5, 2022 7:15pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Gods way of punishing gays? Just like Aids was?
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:56pm
- I remember when
  
  Just like covid ‘Monkeypox’ has just been researched at the Wuhan Institute.
  Then again, just like covid, it makes a leap almost halfway around the world to Europe and North America.
  Right into some of the countries most able to fund the cost of a new vaccine from the pharmaceutical companies.
  The pharmaceutical companies must scarcely be able to believe their collective eyes.
  
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  August 5, 2022 2:37pm
artemisia

An excellent opinion piece on the current housing market by Matthew Gilligan, an actual expert. Comprehensive and quite a long read, but worth the time for those with an interest in the housing sector.

Property market, Labour Government and Reserve Bank: an adversarial and unconstructive relationship

He reviews recent changes and their impacts (failures), what’s next (recession, increased migration), advice (don’t panic).

https://www.landlords.co.nz/article/976520569/opinion-property-market-labour-government-and-reserve-bank-an-adversarial-and-unconstructive-relationship
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August 5, 2022 8:11am
Maggy Wassilieff

Newsroom seems to be the only MSM outlet that is attempting to give a detailed account of the Court proceedings for the Labour donations case.

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/minister-pressed-on-what-he-told-sfo
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August 5, 2022 8:17am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Matthew 7:3-5 comes to mind here Maggy.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:23am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    It is true that I have gifted a painting…
    
    but it was to the purchasers of our house sale…
    
    Now, whether they went on to donate that painting to the Labour Party, I do not Know.
    
    But here’s the kicker…..
    
    The house sale was in Island Bay……and that place is crawling with Labour voters.
    
    Feel free to relay my details to the SFO.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:35am
    - Warren
      
      Like Rick Barker before Micheal Wood Labour were charged with Electoral Fraud the evidence had more than a of whiff of corruption , but as usual they were able to escape without Punishment. Now they would have you believe that Micheal Woods phone calls to those facing charges were just to check the facts that Labours Art sales were above board and legitimate.
      Two many of those involved like Haden Munro were quick to get others to try and cover up the facts.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:09am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        They went into corruption mode when the Nat accused said they donated equally to Labour, ( labours were not declared) that right there outed Labour, they had to start muddying the waters, I see Little in court today with Arderns argument he did not know about the sale of a painting, once again that is bullshit, it was common knowledge they were doing this even last election
        
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        August 5, 2022 12:38pm
- Swifty
  
  I’ve often wondered, are there actually any legitimate reasons for these ‘art auctions’?
  
  If you want to donate, just bloody donate – why all this auction palaver?
  
  Or are these ‘auctions’ designed for one purpose, and one purpose only – to deceive?
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:24am
- peterwn
  
  There are 55 million reasons why other media are not reporting it.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:26am
- kowtow
  
  The trial’s been on for 2 weeks and barely a peep fromthe 4 th estate .
  
  My prediction is when Simon B is in the box , then it’ll be big news.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:42am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    But they have been charged with misleading the Nat party, so they can say what ever they want
    
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    August 5, 2022 12:39pm
RockyJ

Don’t ya just love it when the media tells you why you think something?

This morning on Newshub Simon Chapple, a policy wonk at Victoria University, tells us the real reason we oppose Three Waters is because we don’t like centralisation.

It may be true we don’t like centralisation, Simon, but the real reason is that is a racist theft of assets. Stop lying!

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/08/analysis-what-the-government-got-wrong-with-centralisation-and-why-there-is-so-much-pushback.html
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August 5, 2022 8:19am
kevn

Next please…
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August 5, 2022 8:23am
lastmanstanding

I fear “Te Reo” is going to lose the elections for the Nats and ACT. To use an old saying hes too wishy washy. We know the media are anti Nats and ACT so he has to make definitive statements that cant be misinterpreted.
He has to state the case for DEMOCRACY. Labour/Greens and Maori Party are anti democracy and he has to point that out in short sentences.

Like” the Nats stand for One Person One Vote every vote to count equally”

‘We will repeal any legislation and regulation that doesnt conform to the long standing principles of DEMOCRACY”

Unless ‘Te Reo” does this look forward to a Labour/Green/Maori Party Government. The Toxic Trio.
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August 5, 2022 8:26am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Hmmm… that would be one person, one vote, unless you own multiple properties. Will National be changing that little law that harks back to the days when only the landed gentry were entitled to vote?
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:29am
  - artemisia
    
    Umm, one person one vote per election. Does that really need to be said?
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:32am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    They have bowed to get rid of this racist apartheid law, read Mike Goldsmiths comments
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:01am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    You are being obtuse. If I own a property in Auckland and a property in Wellington of course I should be able to vote in each council area. I am paying rates to each council. However the critical point is that I only have one vote in each jurisdiction.
    
    That is not the same at all in someone having a weighted vote in ONE jurisdiction. As was attempted in Rotorua and as we now have in Canterbury.
    
    Disclosure: I have never voted in a local government election.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:09am
    - Spam
      
      There’s another solution – require the rates to be paid (directly) by the tenants. They’re consuming the council services after all. This is how it works in the UK.
      
      I look forward to Labour promoting this policy, on the basis that it solves the voting in local body elections issue.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:22am
      - Flossie
        
        What about the situation where the second property is a bach and it’s not rented out?
        
        4 0
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        August 5, 2022 10:35am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Promoting it? It’s now law
        
        4 0
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        August 5, 2022 12:40pm
    - oldfella
      
      BY: I would love to vote in the upcoming local body elections, but can’t because that bloody MahutaCorp woman dumped the Tauranga City Council after the last elections and installed some like-minded mates to run things.
      She liked the idea so much she’d extended the deal into the next term, so again, no votes for Tauranga ratepayers. I don’t think she trusts us, especially as we had a history of vetoing Maori wards whenever they were proposed.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:35am
  - Steve Todd
    
    Hmmm… that would be one person, one vote, unless you own multiple properties.
    
    Ridiculous comment.
    
    Let’s say Christopher Luxon owns three properties (of seven, apparently) in the Auckland Council local authority area (where he is usually resident), two in the Wellington City local authority area, and one each in two other local authority areas. That means he is entitled to cast one set of votes in Auckland (mayor, council, local board), one set of votes in Wellington, and one set of votes in each of the two remaining local authority areas.
    
    In other words, he does not get to cast multiple sets of votes; he gets to cast four sets of votes in four separate local council elections. That is right and proper. Why? Because, under this example, he pays rates in four separate local authority areas.
    
    No taxation without representation, riffer. Do you not agree with that?
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:33am
    - Tom Hunter
      
      It’s just the talking point that’s all over The Standard, The Daily Blog, etc.
      
      Riffer was re-programmed and launched.
      
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      August 5, 2022 11:26am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Do some homework, Bats are saying in a Nat ACT government they will restore democracy in elections through vote equality, look up Paul Goldsmith, he stood in parliament and savaged Labour after the disgusting racist law
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:40am
  - leoj
    
    …and where was te reo?
    
    (Answer: Nowhere)
    
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    August 5, 2022 11:01am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      He was in Samoa you fool
      
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      August 5, 2022 12:41pm
- septic skeptic
  
  I am very confident that ACT/National will get enough votes to form the next government. The economy and Labour constant failures will ensure that in spite of the best efforts of the MSM.
  I’m less confident that Luxon won’t try to shaft ACT by jumping into bed with the Maori party and/or the watermelons. I’m even more worried that ACT won’t get enough seats to ensure a meaningful change of direction. National are too frightened of a backlash and media criticism to make bold reforms. Their aim will be to roll back a few of the worst excesses, manage the government better and hold the line for as many terms as possible. If that happens, and Labour doesn’t change its spots, then NZ is gone when the next Labour government completes he Puapua.
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:32am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Nats will not go MP and leave a right party in the dark, Nats and MP would never get enough support, Luxon will know the MP voted against most things the Nats did
    
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    August 5, 2022 12:43pm
All_on_Red

Why should he have to?
It sort of defeats the purpose of communication if 90% of people don’t know what you are talking about.
This ‘minglish’ is just vacuous virtue signaling for the leftie morons.
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August 5, 2022 8:26am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  No it isn’t. It’s as much virtue signalling as it is racism to not want to learn te reo. It all stems from the work done – which all parties agreed to – to stop te reo from dying.
  
  You may not like it, but it doesn’t make it wrong.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:31am
  - chuk
    
    Riffer: Do you know sign language? If not, does that make you an able-ist?
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:38am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Take a hike, go learn ya Māori words, but don’t ram that shit down our throats
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:41am
  - All_on_Red
    
    It is wrong.
    Other countries who also have several official languages provide separate versions.
    Thats the way to do it.
    Oh, and I am Maori. Sad that I’m off the Plantation eh racist.
    I bet you want to put me back ‘where I belong’, dependent of welfare or Govt funding.
    What a bunch of hypocrites.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:45am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      “Off the Plantation” is a brilliant term. Not sure, but I think the term came from Candace Owens. Black Americans ‘off the plantation – meaning they refuse to be people who rely on the Democrats.
      Her book “Blackout” is brilliant.
      Anyway ‘off the plantation’ is starting to be seen here in NZ. They are seeing that Labour and greens are truly Socialists, heading to tyranny
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:08am
    - oldfella
      
      Red: saw a comedian on youtube the other night talking about being part American Indian (he used the ‘Indian’ word and joked about it).
      He then asked if there were others in the audience with Indian blood, and what percentage they were? It seems that some tribes require as much as 25% Native heritage, and most require at least 1/16th Native heritage, which is one great-great grandparent. If you don’t know who in your family was a tribal member it’s unlikely that you would be able to meet the blood quantum requirement.
      Imagine if that were to apply the blood quantum test for Maori? Might be a few on the current Maori gravy train who’d get chucked off.
      https://dna-explained.com/2012/12/18/proving-native-american-ancestry-using-dna/
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:49am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Pocahontas thinks she is Native American.
        1/1024th Indian? OK. Maybe wrong here but what about the other 1023 Pocahontas?
        Think I will go and register as Moari tomorrow. I feel like I am Moari – and I get special things right?//
        
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        August 5, 2022 5:00pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    How is not wanting to learn a language racism? Your comment is inane.
    
    It is virtue signaling to appease a useful political ally. Nothing else.
    If there are enough people prepared to do the work to preserve the language with their own efforts then it will survive. Just like Gaelic in Ireland.
    It’s as insane as the idea that Greens and DOC have that they have identified the most perfect period in 2 million years and they will protect the species that are here at this miniscule point in time forever. Capture time in a bottle, because evolution isn’t a real thing.
    These people are certifiable. The only thing sure in life is change. The discussion should ALWAYS be – is this positive change or not.
    The idea that only native plants are permitted in certain places is the most blatantly racist policy imaginable. It is also the most stupid idea ever. Just like net zero by 2050.
    The people responsible for these ideas should be prevented from eating with metal knives and forks, they are likely to hurt themselves trying to figure out how to use them.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:48am
  - Yabster
    
    [abuse another commenter like that and you’ll get a fortnight off – Mods]
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:49am
  - westernScientist
    
    Is it racist to not want to learn hindi, or mandarin?
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:57am
  - Swifty
    
    Why would it die if Maori and non-Maori folk value it as much as is claimed?
    
    If it died out – they can’t have valued it very much or at all, could they?
    
    Perhaps, just perhaps, this is all a big con – designed purely to result in large buckets of taxpayer cash be delivered to Maori under the cloak of saving the language.
    
    I’ve said before, my oldest mate in the world is Chinese – every Saturday morning as a kid he got shipped off to language lessons with the Chinese Association in Wellington. As a result he grew up totally fluent and not a cent of taxpayer money involved – it was all parent and community led and organised.
    
    [deleted, racial stereotyping – Mod]
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:02am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    Languages I don’t want to learn:
    Mandarin
    Greek
    French
    Italian
    German
    Cantonese
    Dutch
    Swahili
    Samoan
    Te Reo
    etc
    
    That doesn’t make me racist.
    You’re not wrong because I don’t like your stupid comments.
    You’re wrong because your stupid comments have no grounding in reality.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:06am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “….to stop te reo from dying.”
    
    If the language has utility it will not die. You seem to be suggesting that the Government should intervene in the decisions that people make about learning. I can’t believe you are serious.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:12am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      As per the point I make above, bureaucrats are deciding which animals and plants should be forever preserved and protected. Nature and evolution can’t compete with a government department.
      
      Delusional arrogance.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:23am
  - Frank the tank
    
    It will die anyway RifRaf. That is the irony of the WEF/UN-inspired virtue signal here. With Globalization there will only be about 4-5 mega languages within the next 50 years. Unfortunately for RifRaf English will be one of them.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:15am
  - cmm
    
    riffer: Government policies won’t stop te reo from dying.
    
    What might help te reo is Maori people actually taking the effort to learn it and use it in their private lives. They do not need to force it on anyone else. They do not need government policies.
    
    It isn’t a money problem or a policy problem, it is a use problem.
    
    Until Maori care and put in some effort why should anyone else care?
    
    I learned Zulu, Xhosa and Afrikaans in South Africa.
    I would learn Maori in NZ if Maori could speak it too.
    
    Afrikaans still exists, and thrives. as a language despite government efforts to stamp it out and there being a smaller % of Afrikaners in the population than there are Maori in the NZ population. Around 7% of South Africans are white Afrikaners or Afrikaans-speaking Cape Coloured.
    
    How many Maori could hold a basic conversation, let alone use Maori as their primary language? That’s the problem: not funding, policy or time in school.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:24am
    - zulumonster
      
      CMM – “I learned Zulu, Xhosa and Afrikaans in South Africa.”
      Was Afrikaans not a compulsory subject at school?
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:37am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Careful, they will call ya a red neck 👍🏻
        
        2 0
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        August 5, 2022 12:59pm
      - alloytoo
        
        Afrikaans was indeed compulsory, but I learnt it to watch Buck Rogers and Six Million Dollar man which were dubbed into Afrikaans.
        
        4 0
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        August 5, 2022 2:00pm
      - cmm
        
        Yes, but the Afrikaans I learned at school was not really sufficient to be fluent. I only became fluent when I chose to speak Afrikaans almost exclusively for 2 years in the Army.
        
        6 1
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        August 5, 2022 2:55pm
  - Jack5
    
    Hell’s teeth, Riffer: your …it is racism to not want to learn te reo…
    
    Is it also racist not to want to learn other languages spoken here?
    
    These include Samoan, Tongan, the rest of the Polynesian languages (there are 38 of them), Chinese, Hindi, Dutch, Arabic, Pashto, Russian, Ukrainian, French, German …
    
    Don’t be such a racist, Riffer. Post in Maori language!
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:29am
  - alloytoo
    
    Your premise is wrong, we don’t all agree on stopping “te reo” from dying.
    
    I don’t care if Maori dies as a spoken language.
    
    I’m utterly indifferent.
    
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    August 5, 2022 1:53pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  In other words the riffer crowd.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:34am
  - riffer
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Yawn…
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:41am
    - Cassandra
      
      That’s your idea of a debate, riffer? No wonder you get more red ticks than a New England deer.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:03am
    - glowworm
      
      Perhaps it’s time for you to go back to bed Riffer? You remind me of myself when I was three years old.
      
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      August 5, 2022 10:47am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    I think he hands had too many reefers
    
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    August 5, 2022 1:00pm
Simon

Luxon / National problem is they think its 2019 and can proceed like it is. There is no understanding of the wreckage inflicted on NZ by the zero covid nutjobs. (of which at very best National looked the other way)

Zero covid nutjobs structurally harmed NZ. Its not business as usual for National to get back into power and bumble along and pretend the last 2.5 yrs didnt happen.
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August 5, 2022 8:28am
SmokerGuy

I’m disappointed with National over their tax policy. Adjusting brackets for inflation is the right thing to do but I think they made a big mistake saying they’d remove the top tax rate. I know a lot of people will disagree with me but at a time when low and middle income voters are against the wall, they’ve walked right into the government and media’s trap. They’re now perceived as only caring high earners, this narrative will firm up and bite them hard. And will they really gain any votes from removing that tax rate at this time? Now they’re dropping the tax policy altogether and are going to bring out a different one. It’s about perception (even more so for National as the media are always harder on them) and for a party that pushes their economic credentials they’re all over the place on tax. They’ve given the government a stick now to whack them with. So bloody frustrating!
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August 5, 2022 8:29am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Go and listen yo what the Nats have said. They will have a total policy, indexation was only one part of their tax policy that is not compete, there may well be several parts to the policy, why the hell are you listening to the corrupt media and the rotten Hipkins? What Willis said was anything but what was reported, and so was the funding for health snd education earlier in the week
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:03pm
  - SmokerGuy
    
    They need to be crystal clear with EVERYTHING they say!!! The media and government are just itching for anything they can skew. I’m not most people, most people see this shit on the msm sites and news programs and they believe it. National need to be incredibly organised and disciplined, unfortunately over the last couple of weeks they let themselves down with this.
    
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    August 5, 2022 5:57pm
Nickc2

When I get stuff like that, I use an online translator and send my reply back in 普通话 (simplified Chinese). I haven’t been told not to do it so far.
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August 5, 2022 8:31am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING….

Labor’s own internal polling now shows Grant Robinson to be running neck-and-neck with the late David Lange.

https://twitter.com/Joseph_Davieson/status/1555008869583032321
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August 5, 2022 8:41am
- riffer
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  I am so gonna enjoy the memes if that [deleted, offensive names – Mod] ex woodworking teacher becomes the Speaker.
  
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  December 5, 2021 8:42am
  - krazykiwi
    
    And you were deriding bigots above. Mirror called for. Gaze deeply, riffer. A nasty, bile-filled individual will stare back at you.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:57am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      The mental picture of riffer to me is Gollum on a really bad day.
      
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      August 5, 2022 9:04am
  - Swifty
    
    The real riffer reveals himself….
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:11am
  - Frank the tank
    
    [deleted for offensive names – Mod]
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:20am
  - peterwn
    
    Almost anyone would be an improvement on the current Speaker.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:29am
  - BeaB
    
    It always amazes me how Lefties ridicule teachers. Labour has used his former profession as an insult for years. Just like Mallard used to hurl homophobic insults.
    Lovely lot, Labour. The true nasty party.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:49am
- Scooter
  
  Maybe he can borrow a better fitting one from his bestie
  
  https://images.app.goo.gl/MWdcn9Pgg59cV14CA
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:52am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Bwhahahahaha, I have shared Hippo Robertson with a large part of the Dunedin community, many thumbs up and laughs, the girls at tennis will be proud of ya posts today 😃👍🏻
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:06pm
- david
  
  Had to laugh Maggie at the Twitter policy to call a comment about protesting as possibly offensive while allowing comments about bodily functions and sexual proclivities to go through as normal comments.
  Another indication of the fact that as a country we are rapidly going up Schitts Creek
  
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  August 5, 2022 3:12pm
Nukuleka

There are 14 councilors elected to ECAN by the people of Canterbury. In addition there will now be 2 appointed Ngai Tahu representatives: a total of 16 councilors. Does this mean that the annual budget for ECAN is now to be divided up so that the ratepayers of Canterbury will contribute 7/8 ths of the $264 million expenditure and that Ngai Tahu will contribute their fair share of the remaining 1/8 th? Or doesn’t co-governance work that way?
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August 5, 2022 8:44am
- Yabster
  
  Ngait Tahu doesn’t give money to anyone unless your part of the fat cats – members of the iwi get some benefits but they could do alot more- lets just hope the law and all the other race based policys gets repelled.
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:54am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    That is factually in correct, my mate snd his father are as white as anyone, thru have nothing to do with the Māori fraction of their heritage, yet they both get an annual hand out from Ngai Tahu because of who one of their great grand parents were, I hate the hand outs and the divisive state of the country, but I will speak up when you post things like this that are untrue
    
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    August 5, 2022 1:09pm
- edhunter
  
  The only contributing they will we do, is to increase spending & add another level to the already bulging at the seams bureaucratic class that is so endemic to NZ (one might say Western world) at the moment.
  If someone could point me at a country’s govt that has a lean mean fighting machine mentality as opposed to the bloated, hand wringing, what we need is another meeting white elephant we currently have I’d be most interested.
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:31am
Skippytony

Dear National Party,
I am a rusted on National voter. In 45 years I have never voted Labour. I’ve been self employed for over 20 years. I have two related thoughts for you. The accelerating drift to the left, the erosion of the rule of law, gifting of control to unelected minorities, the long term rise in the cost of living and the general view that I am a resource to be harvested, are starting to weigh heavily. You apparent indifference to these issues, let alone any meaningful commitment to reversing these trends are forcing some hard decisions on me as I contemplate my retirement choices. Let’s be clear, I didn’t leave you, you left me. Unless you give me a reason, I’m voting ACT next year. Second, please understand, it’s getting to the point where, after living here 15 years for the first time we are seriously contemplating cashing out and moving back to Australia. It’s come to that, sadly.
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August 5, 2022 8:45am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Do some bloody homework, they are vowed anti the statements you have just made, we are stuffed unless people like you start thinking for your self and not what the vulgar media are telling you
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:11pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Jacinda’s Caring Government is placing vulnerable children who have committed no crimes into Remand Homes alongside young crims.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/129440849/oranga-tamariki-putting-children-in-care-with-young-offenders-when-options-run-out
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August 5, 2022 8:50am
- oldfella
  
  Yeah, Maggy, but it’s being done by that Oranga Tamariki crowd. I’m sure the Ministry for Children would never be unkind to the kids they are there to protect. //
  
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  August 5, 2022 11:07am
cmm

Herald has an article on how a woman’s expired returning resident’s visa was handled. Shocking.

I had almost exactly the same thing happen to me back in 1997 or so (other than being 20 weeks pregnant).

I went on a business trip to USA and on return I discovered that my RR Visa had expired a few days previously. Luckily South Africa had recently been added to the visa waiver program so I was given a 30 day tourist visa and told to go to the immigration officies to resolve this.

At that stage I was now in NZ as a tourist. I could not work. In theory I was no longer a resident and would need to reapply. The 5-year wait for citizenship would have to restart etc etc.

So the next day I went to immigration. After a 10 minute wait a very nice official said no problems: reinstated my NZ residence status and told me it would not impact future citizen applications etc.

All sorted in 5 minutes.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/stressed-and-shaken-pregnant-mum-stripped-of-residency-status-after-being-unaware-of-expiry/66Z3R6N3PC2R5V75LZ66PLATRU/
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August 5, 2022 8:52am
- cmm
  
  Side Issue
  
  Why does Auckland City need a general manager of people and culture?
  
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  August 5, 2022 8:56am
  - peterwn
    
    The position is basically head of Human Resources and is pretty well an essential job. ‘People’ would refer to employees and ‘Culture’ to internal organisation culture.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:26am
  - stewmar
    
    Why does Auckland City need a general manager of people and culture?
    
    In the old money, that’s an HR manager
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:41am
  - Swifty
    
    It’s the old personnel department – but now on steroids.
    
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    August 5, 2022 9:42am
    - david
      
      And a significant uplift in the banding level. At a guess $400K?
      
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      August 5, 2022 1:10pm
- MCōs
  
  “a very nice official said no problems”
  
  Did you have to slip them a few bob under the counter, or doesn’t that work here?
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:52am
  - cmm
    
    This was 1990s. Remember, people didn’t even accept tips back then.
    
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    August 5, 2022 10:29am
  - Opie
    
    That only works here if you have the correct skin colour or your wife cousin is a government minister.
    
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    August 5, 2022 11:06am
    - MCōs
      
      Which skin colour would that be, Opie, & how do you know?
      
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      August 5, 2022 4:34pm
- Spring Bank Westie
  
  Unfortunately times have changed, cmm.
  I recently needed to urgently apply for the transfer of my RR visa to my new passport due to a family emergency in Australia, and did what you did and went to the Immigration office.
  However I was not allowed in without an appointment, which could only be booked by phone.
  I pointed out to the security guard that I had tried to contact Immigration to discuss my urgent need, but the wait time on the Immigration 0800 number was over 2 hours.
  He laughed knowingly and sent me on my way.
  So I took a risk and applied for the transfer of my RR to my new passport and flew out without a visa to return, expecting to have the visa applied to my new passport electronically while I was away.
  The application process involves sending a hand written application and associated documentation by mail to Auckland, and despite the indications on the website that it might take from 7 to 22 days on average, the current processing time was at least 14 business days.
  
  Before I could return to NZ I spent another 2 hours on hold (awful hold music BTW), and eventually a nice customer service person offered to put a priority flag on my application and I managed to get the visa back the following week.
  
  Compared to the Australian system , which can all be done online, it is a bit antiquated, and I didn’t have have much difficulty, you can’t just turn up at a government office these days. They seem to want to make dealing with the government as hard as possible so it’s a deterrent.
  
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  August 5, 2022 10:18am
  - MCōs
    
    I think the guy who went into WINZ in Ashburton and killed two officers in 2014 may have caused a big tightening of security around places dealing with potentially disgruntled members of the public.
    
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    August 5, 2022 4:48pm
Maggie Pie

Imagine having to put your mum into a government run Nursing-Home while Angry Andy’s in charge 🙁

https://twitter.com/PrisonPlanet/status/1554944807377768449
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August 5, 2022 8:56am
cmm

I am glad to report there has been some, if only cosmetic, progress at the Housing NZ site I drive past.

The previous houses were demolished in February or so and the site was levelled, then nothing….
In June they installed a site portaloo. That’s it.
In July two containers turned up.
Now they seem to park a digger there, but it isn’t actually doing anything.

I have not seen an actual person at the site since the
demolition.
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August 5, 2022 9:01am
- MCōs
  
  July was only a week ago.
  It’s been raining constantly in Chch since then.
  
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  August 5, 2022 9:57am
  - cmm
    
    It was at the start of July. All other building sites are active – rain or not.
    
    What did they do in March, April, May? Waiting for Matariki to give them permission to build?
    
    12 1
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    August 5, 2022 10:31am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      I don’t know what is going on at that site.
      
      However Kainga Ora does have a number of sites around Christchurch where houses have been demolished and building is underway and progressing quickly. I know this because as we drive around my partner points them out.
      
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      August 5, 2022 12:30pm
  - Yabster
    
    why make excuses for that rabble??
    
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    August 5, 2022 11:10am
- JimBobJoe
  
  They are getting consents – that may take some time. Demoing the old houses stops the wholesale stripping of anything of value by looters
  
  Madeline/Esprance in Glen Innes/Tamaki clear and redevelop site in the late 90’s had all the copper piping, hot water cylinders and any easy to remove wood or value, fireplace surrounds etc stripped by looters night after night
  
  its better to demo and clear instead of allowing the looting, squatting and meth smoking in empty houses to occur….
  
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  August 5, 2022 10:04am
RightNow

[warning, more abuse like that and you’ll receive a ban – Mod]
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August 5, 2022 9:07am
- RightNow
  
  [antagonising the Mods, one week holiday – Mod]
  
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  December 5, 2021 10:57am
cas

I got an email last night advising me that the 3 waters select cttee is meeting in the Tron on Tuesday 16 and I can speak for 5 minutes. i don’t need to read my submissions.

First I can’t imagine they will have read all the submissions by that time and secondly it is about a 7 hour round trip to speak for 10 minutes.

No democracy here.
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August 5, 2022 9:12am
- cas
  
  I must have got excited when I said in the last para I could speak for 10 Minutes. Sadly it is really only 5.
  
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  August 5, 2022 12:07pm
Libertarians are right

The FBI agent in charge of the Whitmer kidnapping plot/case (where almost everyone got off due to the obvious entrapment) has been promoted and is now in charge of the Jan 6 investigation.

So instead of in jail for a plot against a US Governor (there’s actually more evidence against the FBI and their CIs than the “Criminals”), they get to head a huge case where they’re accusing mostly innocent citizens (the vast majority were at worse trespassing tourists) of ridiculous crimes.
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August 5, 2022 9:12am
- RichardX
  
  What should happen to the minority who weren’t “trespassing tourists”?
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:22pm
  - Libertarians are right
    
    Obviously they should be held accountable to the law (i.e. those who attack cops etc) – just like any other rioter.
    
    In fact, Left wing rioters tend to get off lightly and I would prefer harsher penalties, including for the Jan 6 rioters. The problem is that the BLM summer of love didn’t exactly set a precedent of harsh sentences for rioters so they have reasonable grounds to expect similarly light sentences. I don’t think they should get light sentences however.
    
    The guys who stood on the grass and were being charged with destroying federal property (for standing on the grass) definitely didn’t deserve harsh sentences though (or any really).
    
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    August 5, 2022 3:10pm
ClanMcleod

At least there are some politicians in Australia speaking up about the abuse of powers claimed during a made up emergency.

https://t.me/CoronvirusPlushie/4128
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August 5, 2022 9:13am
Yvette

The U.S. declared a public health emergency over monkeypox, but its supply of the vaccine will be limited for months because officials waited too long to ask the maker to process enough vials.

They didn’t go early or hard
Neither has New Zealand
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August 5, 2022 9:15am
Maggie Pie

“My work here as a labor-lackey is done.
I looking forward to Fa’anana Efeso applying the coup de grace”

– Phil Goof. Ex Mayor-of-Auckland

https://twitter.com/Kevjoseph6/status/1555115053510144000
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August 5, 2022 9:31am
ClanMcleod

The fissures in the covid narrative are getting bigger. It is only a matter of time before the whole edifice collapses under the weight of the deceptions involved. NZ will be behind the UK in timing, but the same outcomes are guaranteed here.

“Another crack in the edifice has been exposed by the recent tweets by the head of Israel’s Biological Institute, the most senior medical scientist in Israel (equivalent to the UK’s Chief Medical Officer Chris Whitty or the US’s Dr Fauci) indicate that the facade of safe and effective vaccination and claims of ‘Covid misinformation’ cannot surely hold up much longer.”

Israel’s most senior medical scientist (think St Ash) recently tweeted:

“I agree that the rickety tower of evil is collapsing, I’m just afraid it will bury us all under it.”

https://twitter.com/ClareCraigPath/status/1553647074029207552?

The full article is very good and I recommend reading it.

https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/as-vaccine-toll-rises-twitter-has-banned-me-but-the-fightback-is-under-way/

But Ardern and her army of pandemicists keep doubling down. The epitome of insanity. The longer they try and hang on, the bigger the backlash is going to be.
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August 5, 2022 9:39am
bwooce

Hmmm, Cactus Kate removed all her blog posts referencing Mahuta (or possibly some other superset of those). Anyone know why?
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August 5, 2022 9:39am
kevn

@Clan… Yes, followed by Canada and USA. Brits are slowly awakening.
USA happily jabbing children 6 months and up. Virtually infanticide with so little long/medium term knowledge.
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August 5, 2022 9:50am
- MCōs
  
  It’s a pity you weren’t around when gunpowder was invented
  
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  August 5, 2022 10:22am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    My son had a severe adverse reaction to the first jab. Potentially with severe, life long negative consequences.
    Doesn’t count as the vaccine’s fault because causation isn’t provable.
    
    Still, pretending there are no adverse reactions is dishonest and dangerous.
    
    15 1
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    August 5, 2022 10:57am
tknorriss

Unbelievable.

Just got the incredibly annoying and pointless Stats multi-page Research and Development survey posted to me again.

How is this still happening in these days of climate enlightenment when this could all be done online at zero cost to the environment?

But a government department is still responsible for the unnecessary killing of trees to produce this. All the carbon emissions to send it out, and have it returned etc.

Someone should resign.
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August 5, 2022 9:54am
- kevn
  
  @tkn… Someone will be clipping the printing job.
  ‘something’ corp?
  
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  August 5, 2022 10:02am
Maggie Pie

TWITTER TRENDING

My fave reply…. “The poster boy for bum fluff” 😛

https://twitter.com/DavidAndrew88/status/1554986316219047937
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August 5, 2022 9:59am
thirteenstars

Happy Birthday to the US Coast Guard. 232 years old today.
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August 5, 2022 10:03am
MCōs

The Blackcaps (#5) made hard work of putting away the Dutch (#18) team this morning.
The women’s team (#3) were seriously hammered by England (#2) and have no chance against Australia (#1) in the semifinals at the Commonwealth Games.
Despite what someone said here yesterday the netball team never looked like beating England and now play Jamaica in the semifinals.
The ABs play tomorrow night and nobody gives them a chance.
Grizzle Grizzle Grizzle
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August 5, 2022 10:14am
- Nickc2
  
  I would have to agree with you on this one MCōs.
  However, never fear, the Mods aren’t clearing my posts from last night or today so you probably won’t see this post.
  
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  August 5, 2022 10:20am
- Biscuit
  
  MCōs, look on the bright side:
  
  A brand new English Premiership season kicks off overnight – admittedly with a decidedly low-key Crystal Palace vs Thugenal London derby – and Liverpool are about to (again) do some of their famous You’ll Never Walk Aloning…
  
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  August 5, 2022 11:03am
  - MCōs
    
    Can’t say I’m particularly in English football.
    The guys in our Thai office were wild over the EPL.
    They had screen savers, mouse pads, cushions, the works. They belonged to fan clubs and argued among each other on Monday morning about the games.
    Thai tv had discussion panels.
    None of the games were on TV except pay for view, which none of the guys subscribed to because it was all English language.
    
    2 1
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    August 5, 2022 12:01pm
- Frank the tank
  
  But Gavin Hubbard competed at the last Olympics, Women have pay parity with the men in the cricket (well kinda) and the NZ Rugby Board is now diverse and woke.
  
  This is Gruntersport in 2022 Cosy. Complete with a CEO that has left every previous organization in an absolute mess. It will take time but we will be back to the early 2000s in terms of sporting success (lack of) within a decade.
  
  But look on the bright side the haka “performance’ will be reeeeeal special.
  
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  August 5, 2022 11:25am
  - thirteenstars
    
    I said it here just a few weeks ago: diversity, equity and inclusion culture eventually infects everything, degrades everything and then kills it.
    
    Look forward to more such loses. Woke doesn’t only make you go broke, it makes you crap at winning.
    
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    August 5, 2022 2:48pm
  - MCōs
    
    That would be Laurel Hubbard.
    Men & women cricketers have match fee parity, but payments to contracted players are vastly different.
    https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/new-zealand-s-female-players-get-match-fee-parity-in-new-five-year-deal-1323208#:~:text=The%20match%20fees%20across%20formats,the%20Plunket%20Shield%20NZ%241750.
    The NZR board has eight members. Five male, three female. They hardly look like a bunch of raving radicals.
    https://www.nzrugby.co.nz/about-nzr/governance/our-board/
    The CEO is Mark Robinson. What organizations has he left in a mess?
    
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    August 5, 2022 5:19pm
- Prince
  
  Thought the Black Caps were quite decent again. Have enjoyed this tour – I know, second class oppo etc etc, but throughout many players have stood up, everyone has had their day.
  Surprises to me were:
  Cleaver – a decent keeper.
  Ben Sears – developing nicely.
  Bracewell – esp batting.
  Even Tickner has improved lately, Bowling quicker.
  Mitchell, Phillips, Guptill, Santner, Sodhi, Neesham (batting) and Ferguson have earned their keep.
  
  But the Women – an embarrassment.
  
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  August 5, 2022 2:01pm
- I remember when
  
  We are now in a position where we need to rebuild for the future.
  We also suffer because we usually use zone defence while most teams use man-to-man.
  As a result almost every time a Fern makes any contact with a player a contact is called, while man-to-man contact is often called fair contesting.
  But, no, not our only problem.
  
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  August 5, 2022 4:25pm
  - MCōs
    
    I find netball rulings, and basketball for that matter, difficult to fathom at times. I watched some of this morning’s game and thought our woman looked bewildered with a couple of the rulings too and that’s all it takes for a score to blow out.
    Apart from that their defenders around the goal were pretty effective.
    
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    August 5, 2022 5:28pm
Lee C

I have to say, there are certain contributers here that I tend to scroll past (for a number of reasons) but usually it takes a littel while for me to achieve the impatience required to decide.

riffer, you’ve broken all my previous records in this regard.

I salute you.
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August 5, 2022 10:28am
- All_on_Red
  
  [Riffer, edited by Mod] is one of those Trolls who practice the ‘Pissing in the Well’ Strategy.
  Basically just behave like a complete prick to purposely disrupt the blog.
  rimmer’s style looks very much like ztev who has a permanent ban.
  The Mods should look into it.
  
  [Intentionally misspelling another commenters name is another form of that. If you want to lecture then make sure you comply with all of the comments policy – Mod]
  
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  December 5, 2020 10:49am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Yep. He’s been all over this thread like a mad woman’s shit, as opposed to…
    – Surgery backlog (no comments)
    – Benefit numbers still way up from 2017 (no comments)
    – Labour’s idiocy on inflation (no comments)
    – The terrible numeracy and literacy results (one comment only)
    – The backfiring cost of living bribe (six comments)
    
    Even that last is just the usual defence-via-attack mode, with the Non Playing Character programming of “RICH PRICKS” – as opposed to his re-programmed cry here of WASCIST,….. WASCIST….. WASCIST
    
    KB needs a better class of shit-posting troll. More of “Batman” perhaps?
    
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    August 5, 2022 11:39am
    - Batman
      
      I’m flattered Tom, but you’re again mistaking a difference of opinion to trolling. Not everyone has the time to comment on every topic.
      
      This may help: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Trolling
      
      3 13
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      August 5, 2022 2:06pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        Meh, the UD is weak. My definition of a troll is someone who just dumps in dumb, throwaway comments designed to rark people up. You fit that definition perfectly.
        
        4 1
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        August 5, 2022 3:19pm
      - MCōs
        
        Some people here used to rark me up until I realized they’re so headstrong there’s little point in engaging with them.
        
        1 0
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        August 5, 2022 5:37pm
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    You need dissenting voices to make sense of things (in the fine old philosophical tradition of thesis antithesis and synthesis). Don’t seek to emulate the regressive tendencies of the left in silencing opposition.
    
    7 1
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    August 5, 2022 11:41am
    - Batman
      
      Quite, we don’t need to emulate the regressive tendencies of the left in silencing opposition vis a vis te reo by piling on and downvoting into silence. That’s sad cancel culture.
      
      1 13
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      August 5, 2022 2:08pm
      - Jack5
        
        Batman lapses into the “royal we”.
        
        Remember Mark Twain:
        
        “Only kings, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to the editorial ‘we’.”
        
        6 1
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        August 5, 2022 2:20pm
  - Bernard Black
    
    The name is Riffer, alluding to the fact that he/she/them whatever can play guitar.
    Having been a musician for 40 years it is my experience that people who constantly point out that they play guitar usually can’t play guitar for shit.
    
    18 2
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    August 5, 2022 11:57am
- glowworm
  
  I rarely read riffers dribble, but do contribute to the down tick pile on!
  
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  August 5, 2022 11:00am
Maggy Wassilieff

Brilliant spin from Labour

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/08/national-s-tax-cuts-stance-means-it-can-t-be-trusted-on-abortion-michael-wood.html

Looks like Labour is getting very worried about something lurking in the woodshed.
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August 5, 2022 10:48am
- Swifty
  
  Wow – desperation stuff from Labour.
  
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  August 5, 2022 11:55am
- Surely Knott
  
  Labour And their media arm desperate to get abortion trending in the news again.
  
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  August 5, 2022 12:04pm
Lara

I’m not against anyone learning Maori. What I disagree with is inserting it into English so that we will end up with pidgin English – we could call it Manglish!
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August 5, 2022 11:00am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Kiri Allen wants Maori taught in schools as a main subject. I disagree with her on that.
  
  What I do agree with her is that statements etc should be either in English OR Maori with a translation. Not this mangling of both languages.
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:19pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Kiri Allen wants Maori taught in schools as a main subject.
    
    The fact is there aren’t many qualified teachers capable of teaching Maori competently to school children from year 1 to year 11. (The core subject years).
    
    9 1
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    August 5, 2022 4:11pm
  - MCōs
    
    I disagreed with French & Latin being forced on me at school, but I had no choice.
    Didn’t like woodwork much either, or school cadets.
    Looking back I’d rather have been taught a more comprehensive history of NZ rather than the one sided version preferred in those days. I also believe you can’t understand a people without knowing the language.
    
    1 3
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    August 5, 2022 5:57pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      How come all the Thai girls we know here are waitresses?
      
      Do they not train them to be Nurses or something?
      
      3 1
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      August 5, 2022 6:53pm
curry4me

https://www.ruralnewsgroup.co.nz/rural-news/rural-opinion/is-it-time-for-a-change
Is it time for a change?
Mental health pressure, regulatory fatigue and anxiety is rife. Exiting the industry is high on the list for many and may be the only economicallyviable option for some. Ironic given that product returns and opportunities to shine as an efficient, pasture-raised, freerange, protein-producing country have never been better.
A lot of time and energy has been spent blaming the current government’s agenda for an irrational regulatory modus operandi.
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August 5, 2022 11:13am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVUlk9dBMcM
Legislated Racism Advances Under The New Zealand Government.

I hate racism, and so do all decent people Maori or Pakeha or whatever. The NZ Govt has advanced Legalised
Racism and the further SMASHING of democracy. [8:29]
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August 5, 2022 11:13am
oldfella

I suspect Winston is considering a run next election. And think he’s got a ready made platform to get him at least 5%.
++
“Unelected iwi positions with full voting rights and power – a deception which Willie Jackson conveniently calls ‘a maturing of democracy’. Kiwis
need to wake up and understand this racist divide
Labour are creating is a deliberate and calculated
dismantling of our ‘one person one vote’ democracy as we know it. ”
Rt Hon
Winston Peters
Leader of New Zealand First
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August 5, 2022 11:21am
- mandk
  
  Peter’s is responsible for that stuff.
  
  He put Labour in power after they had been soundly beaten by National.
  
  7 2
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  August 5, 2022 4:27pm
  - Ghost
    
    National voters put Labour into power by voting for Winston. He would never form a government with English or Bennett. They then put her back into power by voting for labour to try keep the greens out of power.
    
    4 0
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    August 5, 2022 5:34pm
  - MCōs
    
    Still smarting over election result?
    
    1 1
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    August 5, 2022 6:00pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

From my FB on US voting:

If they can put serial numbers on money, cars and guns…..they can put them on ballots too!
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August 5, 2022 11:27am
Surely Knott

The NZ Herald should not be labelling candidates – it is grossly undemocratic. Herald headline “Controversial candidate Leo Malloy loses key campaign figure. “. What right do they have to discount , write off, and label a candidate making as controversial meaning they are not a credible option. Leo Malloy loses a campaign figure is the news. Whether that is controversial is up to the reader. And no , I’m not a Leo supporter, but this is wrong.
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August 5, 2022 11:39am
- Harry Knuts
  
  it’s controlling the narrative. By saying they are hoping a certain percentage of the population will believe it without questioning it. And Labour will be feeding this shite to the horrid requesting they publish it. After all they are now on their knees to Labour 55mil times.
  
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  August 5, 2022 1:53pm
Maggie Pie

Just listening to ZB News reporting the ‘armed stand-off’ in Levin.
We stopped off there once to fill the car.
Pretty sure I can understand how that guys feeling 🙁
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August 5, 2022 12:12pm
- Ghost
  
  What did you fill the car with, being Levin was it cannabis?
  
  6 0
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  August 5, 2022 12:50pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    LOL!!
    My partner was delivering a Bentley Mulsanne to a client in Wello.
    Rather than just switch on the pump when we pulled up, the guy behind the counter signaled him go in and pay first.
    SHEESH. Honestly, eh.
    
    7 3
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    August 5, 2022 3:18pm
    - greybeard
      
      The counter-guy probably recognised him from a previous visit…….
      
      9 0
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      August 5, 2022 3:43pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        😀
        
        6 2
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        August 5, 2022 4:33pm
    - Ghost
      
      Don’t blame him, in Levin only the drug lords would drive a Bentley
      
      8 0
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      August 5, 2022 4:18pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Thought it was a Porch
        
        1 1
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        August 5, 2022 5:09pm
Yvette

Businesses want Brian Tamaki-led protest to steer clear of Newmarket
Newmarket Business Association chief executive Mark Knoff-Thomas said local shops were prepared for the worst.
He said the last protest had a dire impact for business owners.
“Some of our retailers had a really ropey afternoon, because foot traffic died off, cars couldn’t get in, people couldn’t get into car parks, and the motorway was gridlocked,” he said.

Has Mark Knoff-Thomas just told Brian where the Temple traders are
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August 5, 2022 12:12pm
Ghost

Bit of advice for Alex Jones, don’t attack the judge you’re sitting in front of

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42BxbOFc8hk
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August 5, 2022 12:13pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Some American stuff from a 7 year old Patriot:

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=saved&v=743250350217083
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August 5, 2022 1:03pm
Alex13

A sincere question: is it fashionable nowadays, or what, for a Doctor of Science working at a University to walk around and be photographed for a newspaper unshaven, with untidy hair and wearing a shabby t-shirt? Wouldn’t a more professional presentation be more appropriate? – https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-omicron-outbreak-computer-modeller-david-welch-predicts-daily-cases-to-dip-to-low-thousands/XMVK545WWSAAYF2E2LOCJCW4BU/
7 1
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August 5, 2022 1:12pm
- greybeard
  
  You must have the correct image !
  Expensive hairdresser , expensive pre-ripped jeans, carefully maintained facial hair….
  He is probably a friend of S. Wiles.
  
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  August 5, 2022 3:42pm
Maggie Pie

Not even BATMAN escapes! 😀 😀 😀

https://twitter.com/LovePower_pages/status/1554503562863861760
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August 5, 2022 1:19pm
- Batman
  
  Well I do love a drive in the country when I can. Really let the jet drive breathe ya know?
  
  4 8
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  August 5, 2022 2:10pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Here’s one from a twitter bestie…
    
    Q: What do you call Batman when he doesn’t go to church on Sunday?
    
    A: Christian Bale.
    
    (Get it 😀 )
    
    12 4
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    August 5, 2022 2:28pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      No.
      
      2 0
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      August 5, 2022 8:08pm
mogg

Some on KB are allowing themselves to be played by riffer/Batman. They are only winding you up, far better to treat with ignore.
13 0
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August 5, 2022 2:29pm
septic skeptic

Two Newshub headlines to confirm how impartial and objective our media are:

National’s tax cuts stance means it can’t be trusted on abortion – Michael Wood

Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern slices hand while unveiling plaque, spreads icing all over herself while visiting Christchurch school

And just in case there is any confusion – no, the second article is not an angle on how Ardern fails on delivery!
9 0
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August 5, 2022 3:11pm
Hugh Jarse

Two articles in the NZ Herald today questioning Chris Luxons leadership of National. None questioning Nanaia Mahuta’s or Willie Jackson’s leadership of Labour, none on Nanaia’s governments performance, none on giving money to ex-pats, none on giving money to dead people, none on only one work visa issued in the last three weeks and one on the ex PM Jacinda Ardern slicing her hand at some opening. Seems she is only the ceremonial head of labour now. Gotta love that editorial balance
16 0
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August 5, 2022 3:18pm
Maggy Wassilieff

For Fuck’s Sake!!!!

When will folks in Oranga Tamaraki realise that violent & abusive parents are NOT caring whanau and little kiddies need to kept away from such folks?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/129475495/oranga-tamariki-returned-boy-to-couple-who-beat-him-nearly-to-death
18 3
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August 5, 2022 4:01pm
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Only when the body count can’t be hidden anymore Maggy
  
  10 0
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  August 5, 2022 4:15pm
- greybeard
  
  I find it unbelievable that two people can downtick this item: the thought of adults abusing tiny defenceless children is beyond comprehension.
  If I had my way I would take these pieces of shit to the nearest rubbish tip and …………..
  
  12 0
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  August 5, 2022 6:18pm
Maggie Pie

NBS twitter feed just in –

Firey crash as car speeds thru intersection killing at least 5 people….
(faaarrrrk 🙁 )

https://twitter.com/RosaNBCLA/status/1555336023541833728
2 1
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August 5, 2022 6:44pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Obvviously full of drugs. We’re going to get more of this stuff here thanks to Labour.
  
  5 1
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  August 5, 2022 7:52pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Sorry about the typo. But the fact that some nutter can stay awake in Levin for over 27 hours while people have to vacate their houses is proof of what I say.
    
    3 0
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    August 5, 2022 7:55pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Someone on twitter reckoned it all started when he missed out on the Cost-of-Living allowance. You’d think they’d just give the clown a $116 and all go home.
      
      3 2
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      August 5, 2022 8:42pm
  - Ghost
    
    I guess only time will tell but reading some comments the car is coming down a step hill, so a brake failure could be possible. Seems to be a recall on for the make of car for a possible fault that can cause a fire. May even be a medical event and the driver passed out. Thing is we don’t know what caused it.
    
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    August 5, 2022 8:43pm
Bluegrass

To the mods – some posts have a report option only – no reply option appears.

Why is this?
0 0
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August 6, 2022 12:18am
- Bluegrass
  
  You like warnings, Mods – but how about answering my genuine question?
  
  Or do I have to be abusive (which I am not) to get your attention?
  
  [ Mod : this is really a tech support question. I guess that WordPress only lets “replies” get to a certain depth. Not that I am an expert … Ask DPF]
  
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  August 7, 2022 1:19am

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