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June 13, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 13 June 2023

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Tony Stuart

When is an open letter not an open letter? When the New Zealand Herald publishes it behind their paywall:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/opinion-sir-ian-taylor-an-open-letter-to-chloe-swarbrick-on-wealth-tax/ODLKEE7T7BDYRL23HSJ3FE6U4Y/

I somehow doubt if that’s what Sir Ian Taylor has in mind, because it’s a piece that everyone should read. So here goes:

OPINION

Dear Chlöe
[ Mod : sorry – block quoting something (copyrighted) from behind a paywall is not on ]
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December 13, 2022 8:22am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Right to the point.
  
  V few in Labour/Greens/Maori Party have even run a business or put up the collateral to start one.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:29am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Chlöe Swarbrick was once an up & coming entrepreneur :
    She owned/part owned:
    
    A fashion business – The Lucid Collection
    A magazine – “What’s Good”
    A digital consultancy – TIPS
    A cafe & gallery – Olly
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chl%C3%B6e_Swarbrick
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:02am
    - alex Masterley
      
      None of the enterprises listed appear to have been starting successes.
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:46am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Startling successes?
        
        They received quite a lot of publicity – especially from the Auckland media luvvies….
        
        https://www.nzfashionmuseum.org.nz/the-lucid-collective/
        
        https://theregister.co.nz/2017/02/08/olly-cafe-art-built/
        
        But.. none are in existence now.
        
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        June 13, 2023 10:09am
      - Joe Banana
        
        Yes, her ability to build and succeed in business is only equalled to her ability as a politican.
        
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        June 13, 2023 1:37pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Then that makes her a virtue signalling nut bar
      
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      June 13, 2023 11:39am
    - slightlyrighty
      
      All of which are either no longer in existence or she is no longer associated with.
      
      In any case, she should be more than aware of just how hard it is to run a business in NZ, and not be espousing politics that make it harder.
      
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      June 13, 2023 11:58am
    - Overworked
      
      A bigger beef with Swarbrick is that she comes from a background of, in NZ terms, unusual privilege and has no idea how middle NZ’s family finances work. If this tax is introduced, even in diluted form, inflation creep will soon see the struggling working middle squeezed even further.
      
      The woman is a noveau Lady Bountiful. She’s clueless.
      
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      June 13, 2023 12:00pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        A bigger beef with Swarbrick is that she comes from a background of, in NZ terms, unusual privilege and has no idea how middle NZ’s family finances work.
        
        And Nicola Willis? Not that it’s her fault.
        
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        June 13, 2023 7:15pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Interesting. Wealthy parents?
      
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      June 13, 2023 6:52pm
- Gravelroad
  
  @TS-
  Dear Ian ( forgive me if I don’t call you Sir – colonialism and all that):
  Thanks for your letter. I hope to read it all eventually.
  Hey, Ian, if I don’t happen to get back into parliament after the election, can you give me a job (or preferably a place on the board of directors) at Animation Research?
  I don’t know much about what you do, but I am very popular in Auckland and have great connections with the LGBT community. I am sure you could do with some advice about inclusiveness etc.
  Thanks in advance,
  Chloe.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:38am
  - backster
    
    Chloe forgot Nga Mihi and Kia Ora.
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:12am
    - Matt Long
      
      And Tamaki Makaurau, and, They/them.
      
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      June 13, 2023 10:54am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        I note yesterday media calling Obamas wife his partner, they won’t even say wife anymore fFS
        
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        June 13, 2023 11:40am
- Cassandra
  
  Very good letter. Pity he’s a Labour supporter because that means his judgment is faulty. And lending his name and support to the more tax brigade just opened the door for the Greens. Taylor is an idiot in that respect. Rich but still a very silly thing to do. Hope he’s sent a million or three to the IRD account number Seymour gave him. He wouldn’t want to look like a hypocrite, would he?
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:52am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    He’s far less of a Labour supporter than he was. He regularly wrote critical pieces during Covid where at times he was absolutely scathing about what Labour was doing. Here’s an example:
    
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/sir-ian-taylor-the-labour-party-i-used-to-know/3GG7OAKR35HE3AI7G5MXR5CQNY/
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:07am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    He has started Labour will not receive his vote this time, infact I think he stated the left will not receive his vote, when you have lifers saying this thrn they have no show
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:41am
    - Dougal10
      
      You 2 will both have ” not voting labour this time ” to talk about next time you have a beer together at the glass house🤣😂🤣
      
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      June 13, 2023 1:56pm
- Simon
  
  Nice letter. But where is his letter for attacking the high rates of personal income tax his valuable employees paid?
  
  This is good though.
  
  “The annual tax take is $113 billion a year. Of that, $19b is spent on health, $17b is spent on education. Both are on the verge of collapse.”
  
  Basically govt revenue / spending is now the same size the NZ economy was in 2000. Where has all that money gone? Govt.nz.borg.
  
  What is National’s plan to gut Govt.nz.borg? It cant be “managed” it needs to be dismantled and rebuilt.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:07am
  - Swifty
    
    When Clark took office in 1999 NZ Government spending was $33Bn.
    
    It has quadrupled since then. In a mere two decades.
    
    The monster of now completely out of control and it will be the ruin of us.
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:43am
    - Ghost
      
      When Helen took office our population was 3.835 million. Now an estimated 5,199,100 million
      
      I’d hate to think the other stats that have changed since then with crime, poverty, etc
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:52am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      150 billion this year I think they stated in budget, 70 billion more than 2017 and there is no covid money in this budget, extraordinary, I note Willis saying she will release Nats full costed set of books soon, not at the conference in two weeks, but not long after.
      
      I would love them to come out and say here’s where the money will go, here is the crap that will be cut, and this 20 billion will go back to tax payers
      
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      June 13, 2023 11:45am
      - leoj
        
        Can’t wait to read about National’s spending on climate change issues.
        
        On that, they are just as pathetic as Labour/Greens.
        
        Woke Luxon to the fore!
        
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        June 13, 2023 1:59pm
    - miltonF
      
      Exactly. I often ponder on how far socialism has progressed in lil old NZ without the populous being any the wiser.
      
      Govt spending is now more than half of the economy. You could say we are now more socialist than we are capitalist. It’s a very clear trend and all the wellbeing metrics are declining. Somehow deluded lefties still insist capitalism is the problem. I suspect that when the govt is 100% of economy AKA communism, the lefties will still find some way to blame capitalism.
      
      I feel we have progressed much much further than people are willing to admit. I feel like the conversation around wealth taxes is a sign that we are actually near the end of the socialist experiment. They’ve run out of other people’s money already. Now they are coming for the assets, which will be the death knell for the economy.
      
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      June 13, 2023 5:19pm
  - Tony Stuart
    
    The four biggest areas of government expenditure now, in order, are Welfare, Health, Education and Interest costs on debt.
    
    We’re paying $22 million a day in interest costs alone, and that’s before a single cent of debt is paid down. Given that Robertson has again borrowed heavily to pay for all his spending in the 2023 Budget, that daily sum is only going to go in one direction.
    
    That’s why we need a government that will stop wasteful spending, and at least try to live within its means; Robertson doesn’t even pretend to do that.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:12am
    - kowtow
      
      The people on welfare are poor.
      
      The people who need health are on or been thrown off waiting lists .
      
      Schools have a huge truancy problem.
      
      We pay huge taxes to keep a totally disfunctional system on its feet ; in fact I’m beginning to think al l that money is simply keeping public “servants” in very good employment for doing the square root of sfa.
      
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      June 13, 2023 12:26pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        Roughly half the “welfare” figure is the pension – which KBers (being mainly old men) largely support.
        
        Heavens I’ve been collecting it along with my busimess income for 13 years now … 🙂
        
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        June 13, 2023 5:59pm
      - Swifty
        
        Ian, you’ve got this massive thing with the pension.
        
        You mention it seemingly multiple times per week and I never get the point you’re trying to make.
        
        Would you care to spell it out for me?
        
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        June 13, 2023 8:00pm
    - leoj
      
      …a government with a steel spine, rather than the linguini version offered by Luxon and the Nats.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:02pm
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Paulus – I object you calling my master hypocrite. He is famous for Kiwisaver, Cullen Fund, Rich pricks tax.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:52pm
  - Bullion
    
    NZ Govt revenue and spend has been mostly around 30% – give or take 1 or 2 % for decades (spending peaking at GFC/Chch earthquakes and Covid)
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:33am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Peaked? Not one cent to covid this budget but Robertson added 9 billion to the spend, it’s utterly nuts to think about that with no covid spend
      
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      June 13, 2023 11:47am
      - Bullion
        
        as a % gdp core crown expenditure was 34% in 2011 and 35% in 2022. That’s the peak over a 25 yr period where mostly hovering around 30%.
        
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        June 13, 2023 11:57am
      - Swifty
        
        Here we go.
        
        Please define ‘core crown’ and please list all NZ government expenditure that falls outside ‘core crown’.
        
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        June 13, 2023 2:12pm
      - Bullion
        
        This is what is considered core crown expenditure:
        https://figure.nz/chart/5yYyYLslS1NvJTmk
        
        untidy copy paste (% are of gdp year to Jun 2022) :
        Social security and welfare, GSF 11.92586264946%
        Health 7.730107099033%
        Education 5.01492819718%
        Core government services 1.591599028345%
        Law and order 1.514801592712%
        Defence 0.788008469978%
        Transport and communications 1.295817600525%
        Economic and industrial services 2.24771625017%
        Heritage, culture and recreation; Primary Services, Housing and community development, Environmental protection, Other 2.048488120049%
        Finance costs 0.8024775520539%
        
        Of “Social security and welfare, GSF” – superannuation the largest portion of spend in that category
        https://figure.nz/chart/2eIStXKBWssxMIze
        
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        June 13, 2023 2:52pm
      - Swifty
        
        Thank you very much Bullion.
        
        Your link notes the following:
        
        “Total Crown: Includes the core Crown (defined below) plus Crown entities and SOEs as defined by the Government Reporting Entity
        
        Core Crown: A reporting segment consisting of the Crown, departments, Offices of Parliament, the NZS Fund and the Reserve Bank.”
        
        Pray tell us why you chose to use the ‘core crown’ figures to attempt to portray government expenditure instead of ‘total crown’ and which also includes all the SOEs, crown entities etc?
        
        Kainga Ora, alone, plans to spend $35Bn over the next 20 years on construction costs not including the cost to run themselves.
        
        You weren’t trying to mislead us were you?
        
        And if we’re looking at the total cost of government in NZ we should also include local government. What’s NZ government spending as a proportion of GDP when you add ‘total crown’ and local government spending Bullion?
        
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        June 13, 2023 3:47pm
      - Bullion
        
        Not trying to mislead, core crown is the normal metric to measure Govt spending. SOEs are Crown-owned companies that are expected to be as profitable and efficient as comparable businesses not owned by the Crown for instance.
        
        Total crown expenditure is higher, ~5 to 10 percentage points higher – with a few standouts, 2011 48.1% of gdp (and 14 percentage points higher than core crown) followed by 43.6% of gdp in 2009 and 2020, and 42.7% in 2012 and 42% in 2022 rounding out the top 5 years as % of gdp.
        
        https://figure.nz/chart/ntR15Hidl1tW3A3F
        
        BTW. Google is a thing, I’m not your “Ask Jeeves”.
        
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        June 13, 2023 5:28pm
      - Swifty
        
        Thanks Bullion.
        
        You’re half right, ‘core crown’ is the number used by those who seek to mislead New Zealanders as to the total of NZ government spending because it is significantly smaller than ‘total crown’.
        
        Government spending is government spending, irrespective of what accounting bucket label it falls into and especially as it ALL comes out of the pockets of New Zealand families.
        
        You attempted to portray a level of government spending as a proportion of GDP, and make the case that this government is spending at levels commensurate with previous governments, while deliberately leaving out significant government expenditure and the you called this a ‘normal’ thing to do.
        
        Really? Does that not seem misleading to you?
        
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        June 13, 2023 6:03pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Defence 0.788008469978%
        
        WTF? Still living in Comrade Hulun’s no-threat fantasy world are we?
        
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        June 13, 2023 6:55pm
      - Bullion
        
        Swift, of course as % of gdp. As the economy grows the more we can afford – that’s what Luxon keeps saying anyway.
        
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        June 13, 2023 8:36pm
- notreadyet
  
  you can read the full text of the letter over in a comment in general debate section of the bfd
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:58am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    You lost me at BFD
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:48am
    - leoj
      
      Can’t handle Slater’s truth bombs about Luxon?
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:03pm
      - rockape
        
        Slater is just an angry man. He was kicked out of National. His father was sacked as party president, nationals worste ever who was president for the 1999 election and was let go just before the 2020 election. He thought Collins was the saviour, yes that Collins that gave us Nationals second worst election result. Sorry but Slater has nothing to offer Nz politic# other than a constant naysayer.
        
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        June 13, 2023 2:51pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        No, can’t handle his corrupt support of Peters, Slater use to had him, don’t patronise me about refusing to listen to people like Slater who is full of shit
        
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        June 13, 2023 2:57pm
- Taieri
  
  Full, not pay walled version can be read here:
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/opinion/taking-risks-and-paying-taxes
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:52am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Tony Stuart bro – Few points here:
  
  1. Sir Ian Taylor addresses the letter to Chlöe Swarbrick whose only policy and only aim in life is to make all Kiwis smoke canabis. She has no idea on taxation.
  
  2. Sir Ian Taylor is a Labour supporter. He was one of the signatories who begged the gummit to tax them more.
  
  3. So anything he says or writes is best ignored. Yes I read his “open” letter and not impressed. He is willing to pay more tax and he can pay. Not me.
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:45pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Yes, but he has ruled out voting for labour go figure
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:58pm
Yvette

1
Professor Claire Charters, the indigenous lead at the Human Rights Commission, said the Doctrine of Discovery was the legal grounds by which the British claimed the South Island. They used Te Tiriti o Waitangi to justify their actions in the North Island.
“As we know, under Te Tiriti o Waitangi, there was no cession of sovereignty, in fact, quite the opposite – the retention of tino rangatiratanga by Māori,” Prof Charters said.

2.
… Although New Zealand historian Professor Paul Moon is adamant there is no need.
“Basically, the people who call for that are completely wrong. This is an area where historians don’t disagree, they’re very clear about it. The Doctrine of Discovery is a Catholic doctrine going back to the 1400s,” he said.
The important word there is Catholic. The British missionaries and most of the settlers in New Zealand weren’t Catholic, they were Church of England, or Anglican.
“It has absolutely nothing to do with British colonisation here in the 1700s and 1800s.. So it’s really asking for an apology for something that wasn’t done. It doesn’t make sense on any level,” Prof Moon said. …
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/06/maori-leaders-call-on-king-charles-new-zealand-government-to-reject-doctrine-of-christian-discovery.html

3
Waitangi Tribunal > The Treaty of Waitangi/Te Tiriti o Waitangi > Meaning of the Treaty
Article 1.
In the Māori text of article 1, Māori gave the British ‘kawanatanga’, the right of governance, whereas in the English text, Māori ceded ‘sovereignty’.
One of the problems that faced the original drafters of the te reo Māori text of the Treaty was that ‘sovereignty’ had no direct equivalent in the context of Māori society. Rangatira (chiefs) exercised full authority (‘mana’) over land and resources on behalf of the wider community.
The term used in the te reo Māori version, ‘kawanatanga’, was a transliteration of the word ‘governance’, which was then in current use. Māori understanding of this word came from familiar use in the New Testament of the Bible (when referring to the likes of Pontius Pilate), and from their knowledge of the role of the Governor of New South Wales, whom they referred to as ‘Kawana.’.
https://www.waitangitribunal.govt.nz/treaty-of-waitangi/meaning-of-the-treaty/

4
20 APRIL 2010 – National Govt to support UN rights declaration. –
Prime Minister John Key announced today the New Zealand Government has given its support to the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. …
… ■ reaffirms the legal and constitutional frameworks that underpin New Zealand’s legal system, n •oting that those existing frameworks define the bounds of New Zealand’s engagement with the declaration..

5
Professor Claire Charters
The chair of the committee that produced the contentious He Puapua report. has been appointed to lead work on Indigenous issues, at the Human Rights Commission (Te Kāhui Tika Tangata).
Legal scholar and Auckland University law professor Claire Charters (Ngāti Whakaue, Ngāti Tūwharetoa, Ngā Puhi, Tainui) will provide ‘tangata whenua leadership’, with a ‘view to enhancing the commission’s governance’ the commission said in a statement.
https://www.teaomaori.news/he-puapua-co-author-appointed-human-rights-commission-role

6
Jacinda Ardern was asked what speech her Government would target. She replied: “When you see it, you know it..”
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/112742472/dont-let-politicians-use-the-law-to-shut-down-speech-they-dont-like

LET’S UNDO THIS
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June 13, 2023 8:01am
- Cassandra
  
  I’ll settle for governance. The Kawana was in charge, full stop. The chiefs accepted that. The chiefs can have their mana but Article 3 makes it clear we have a British system ie one adult man/person, one vote. If tribe members are happy to be ruled on tribal matters by for example the Mahuta family then they can go for it but everything non-tribal is decided by the city council or Parliament. End of debate.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:44am
- RoboRob
  
  As we know, under Te Tiriti o Waitangi, there was no cession of sovereignty, in fact, quite the opposite – the retention of tino rangatiratanga by Māori,” Prof Charters said.
  
  What utter nonsense, although what you might expect from the PC brigade at the HRC. We don’t know that, we actually know the opposite. Maori specifically released sovereignty / self governance to the crown and we allowed control of their assets. You can argue that Maori understood that control to encompass more than just personal property but you cant argue they didn’t give up sovereignty.
  
  This sort of statement is gas lighting. Tell people what you want them to know and hope they never bother to read the treaty.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:59am
- nathie
  
  So Dr Paul Moon calls out the activist academics as being completely wrong …. but the activists still get sympathetic airtime by the Newshub reporter allowing the academic activists to dominate the story and spread their disinformation.
  
  (Heck, even Chippie by correctly quoting how NZ’s UN Rights Declaration back in 2010 demonstrates how the activist academics are incorrectly re-interpreting events that have no application in pre-and-post 1840 NZ)!
  
  Ironically the UK (who were reluctant to devise such a Treaty (i.e. ToW) for many, many years and only appeared to take on such urgency when it became apparent that the French did want to colonise NZ), it could be argued perhaps did save NZ/Maori from the Catholic Doctrine of Discovery if the French did end up colonising and annexing NZ. There would be no ToW/Te Tiriti that’s for sure … simply brute force, oppression and death, for the last two hundred years.
  
  What do the academic activists think about that?
  
  Another point, isn’t it ironic (if not hypocritical) that the Left/MSM mock Luxon for saying that NZ has become a “very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking country” … however that is exactly what the academic activists supported by the MSM are doing – they are literally “very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking” belittling efforts to unify the people of NZ!
  
  But even worse the taxpayer is funding this “very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking” academic activist research via Govt research funding for them!!
  
  Suggest it is time to change the research grant funding criteria to promote good citizenship and harmony etc … I bet a lot of new researchers will emerge from hiding (from being “cancelled” for daring to speak up against the prevalent academic activist narrative) both Maori and Pakeha, looking at ways to positively improve and celebrate race relations bring everyone together (and cut out this divisiveness crap)!
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:21am
  - Burtland
    
    Megan Woods changed the research grant funding landscape for NZs largest research fund, the PBRF, by introducing Institutional Racism to encourage Maori research …
    
    The ODT commented another Government behemoth quietly slipped out of the shipyards and headed out to sea, largely below the radar
    
    Graham Adams wrote …
    
    Extraordinarily, in the new PBRF criteria, research into Māori knowledge has been given pole position for the highly contested grants. It now has a research funding weighting of 3, up from 1. To put that into context, engineering and clinical medicine, which are the most expensive research subjects, have a weighting of 2.5.
    
    The criteria also rate work by Māori researchers at 2.5 times the rate of non-Māori academics.
    
    https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2022/01/graham-adams-follow-money-matauranga.html
    
    https://www.odt.co.nz/opinion/editorial/govt’s-next-big-experiment
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:38pm
- nathie
  
  Another reason why this current Activist Academic research and promotion of the (Catholic) “Doctrine of Discovery” is a nonsense today is …. it could be argued all cultures (or many) had their own informal “doctrines of discovery”.
  
  It may not have been written down as the Catholic one was … but cultures explored and migrated across the planet.
  
  Including early Maori who came to NZ/Nu Tireni and claimed these lands as their own and fought (and killed) other tribes for their own territorial conquests.
  
  So does it really help the harmony of modern day NZ (or “Aotearoa” if you like) to be constantly re-interpreting the past into modern day contexts?
  
  Otherwise what happens when the next generation of “activist academics”, satisfied with knocking European colonialists, finally go full circle turn inwards to look at pre-colonial Maori and their conquests, slavery, brutality and so on?
  
  What does that serve but to tear apart societal harmony and cohesiveness (potentially similar to how the likes of totalitarians such as Mao did which resulting in (millions) of innocent people being killed due to some obsession with “purity” and “shaming” by those with influence)?
  
  Perhaps it’s time for some “defunding of the institutions” before things get really out of hand?
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:40am
  - Swifty
    
    Very good nathie.
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:15pm
Warren

Has Chris Hipkins admitted defeat by his actions in deciding that the overseas jaunts to China and the UN is better than sitting around Parliament making fuckups in his announcements and giving National the advantage before the 2023 General Election.
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June 13, 2023 8:02am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Last time he left the country Meka Whaitiri buggered off to TPM without telling Hipkins. Who will bail from the sinking SS Labour this time?
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:15am
  - Nickc2
    
    Haven’t heard from Nanaia Mahuta for some time. Has she defected to TPM already and Te MSM is receiving money for keeping it quiet?
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:25am
    - kowtow
      
      You’ll notice how very quiet the Labour PR Spin dept aka te media pardy have been on all things 3,5, 10 waters , W Jackson , Mahutacorp etc
      
      Wasn’t good for the polling you see.
      
      Instead the guns are now targetting Lux , to take the heat off Wood Louse.
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:05am
      - Tricati
        
        That’s all the more reason National/ACT should be raising the co-governance issues at every opportunity. Labour have clearly attempted to hide it, but it needs significant sunlight before the election.
        
        22 0
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        June 13, 2023 10:51am
    - sirknz
      
      Witless protection probably. We are unlikely to hear from her till much closer to the election.
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:55am
  - Paulus
    
    Presumably Acting Prime Minister will be Deputy Sepuloni.
    Should be fun as she and her accolytes are pushing her as favourite to take over when Chippie gets pushed after the election.
    They are now saying that Labour needs another woman leader as the Labour MPs will be dominated by women and they did best under a woman, sic Dame Jacinda.
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:37am
  - pdm
    
    Inv – based on his answers to Mike Hosking this morning he probably would not even notice if half of his Caucus was gone when he got back.
    
    There were times this morning when I almost thought he made Jacinda look on top of every miniscule detail ofGovernment..
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:39am
    - Scooter
      
      Mike went for the jugular this morning, Hipkins was left stuttering.
      
      39 0
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      June 13, 2023 9:03am
      - Monty
        
        Hipkins was utterly useless and as we see each week unprepared – he can’t even seem to fluff and and manipulate his way thru interviews
        
        35 0
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        June 13, 2023 9:34am
      - nathie
        
        Mind you at least Chippie tries … at least we no longer have to put up with Ardern “refuting” reality and saying things are “complex”. Even very rare moments of honesty were just as grating and ill-considered (“yip yip that’s what it is”)!
        
        25 0
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        June 13, 2023 9:46am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Everytime he opens his mouth lately he make Cindy look good, have you noted how often he chokes on his words?
      
      11 0
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      June 13, 2023 3:02pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Well, he has to consider what his fuckwit ministers may have said/leaked to Te MSM.
        Have you noticed how his Maori Caucus has kept a very low profile since Cindy was given the DCM? Even Willie Jackson has chosen to keep his racist comments to himself.
        
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        June 13, 2023 4:22pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Exactly, he probably knows something will happen, if he shafted wood cause ambition, then maybe wood might go with Māori caucus
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:51am
- Dougal10
  
  News report says he is likely to meet Xi if he doesn’t will it be considered a total mission failure .
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:02pm
  - Nickc2
    
    By going to China and not meeting with Xi, he’s doing Mahuta out of a job. As Foreign Minister, I believe it’s her job to go to China and grease the skids for a visit by her Prime Minister.
    PS: There’s always a chance Mahuta may go to China and defect to the Chinese Communist Party. That’d take their minds off Militarising the South Pacific for a while eh?
    
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    June 13, 2023 4:28pm
Gravelroad

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/132261664/governments-climate-donations-set-up-dairy-farming-overseas
While farmers here are harrased and harshly judged for climate and environmental vandalism, taxpayers are funding the establishment of dairy and “meat farms” in “developing nations” such as Fiji, Laos, Sri Lanka and Uruguay.
This “investment” costs $325m per annum.
All part of the Green Party’s climate change rort. Why people keep voting for these shameless hypocrites beats me.
PS- so heartened to see that Uruguay (population 3.3m) was able to fund their football team to the World Cup last year and the Under 20 World Cup this year.
Fabulous
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June 13, 2023 8:05am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Uruguay is a v nice place.
  
  Been there once in the mid 70’s. Montevideo is a lovely city and they are far more civilised than the other lot across the River, the Argies.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:24am
  - Gravelroad
    
    But they need kiwi money to establish dairy and meat farms? To fight climate change?
    Really?
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:40am
    - Ehlana
      
      And those places are all closer to the equator than we are. So wouldn’t that mean they are hotter now and will be even hotter in future.
      
      I hope some of this money is going into air conditioned stables for these cows.
      
      24 1
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      June 13, 2023 8:57am
      - Jack5
        
        Uruguayans are nice people – Fightingtemeraire is right.
        
        Quite a few have come to NZ to work on our dairy farms, and NZ companies have invested, without great success, in Uruguay’s dairy industry.
        
        NZ Farming Systems Uruguay was at one time listed on the NZ Stock Exchangee, but was taken over by by Olam Global, of Singapore, in 2012.
        
        Uruguay, one of the great small countries in football/soccer, seems to have a growing interest in rugby, and will be the first opponent of the All Blacks in the 2023 World Cup.
        
        Uruguay has a land area of about 176,000 sq km, compared with NZ’s 264,000 sq km, but is dead flat, while less than half NZ’s land area is agricultural. Uruguay has a population of about 3.5 million, and it’s around 34 degrees south, compared with, say, Canterbury, which is around 43 degrees south.
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/ibrian-gaynori-hopes-for-uruguay-dairy-farms-sour/CECTUJ7VBOF2DEGMDPWSHE2TG4/
        
        And an NZ farming view of dairy farming in Uruguay:
        
        https://www.farmersweekly.co.nz/news/uruguay-dairy-similar-but-different/
        
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        June 13, 2023 9:11am
      - marcw
        
        NZ play Uruguay on 6 October, and the AB’s first game is vs. France on 9 September (the opening game).
        
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        June 13, 2023 10:58am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Nope. Beef and wool are the two biggest industries in Uruguay. They know what they’re doing, they don’t need any assistance, but they’re not so stupid as to turn it down when numpties offer it.
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:27am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Yes, and PGG Wrightsons has a large foot hold in Uruguay, they are set up as an agri specialist as they are here, I think they may also own some farms there
        
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        June 13, 2023 11:54am
      - Dougal10
        
        The chinese owned pggwrightsons have a large interest there. Fixed it for you.
        
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        June 13, 2023 2:01pm
  - kiwi_chileno
    
    Chile is very nice, too, and I agree about the Argies. Last year, Fonterra divested it’s stake ($1.2 bn) in Soprole, one of Chile’s largest dairy companies. Many Kiwi ex-pats work in agriculture in southern Chile.
    
    My partner’s home-town is Valparaiso. Valpo was popular with Argentinians for summer holidays. Argentinians are loud, rude, and flashy. I think it’s because the majority of Argentinians have Italian ancestry.
    
    Chile and Argentina have a fraught relationship. In the latest incident, Chile has protested that Argentina deliberately diverted the waters of a trans-boundary river. There are long-running tensions over Patagonia and the Magenalles. In the War of the Pacifc (1879- 1883), Argentina backed Peru and Bolivia against Chile. Chile conquered what is now northern Chile (there be lithium) – it’s the reason Bolivia is landlocked. But, post-war, Chile was forced to cede parts of Patagonia to Argentina.
    
    During the Falklands War, Chile provided the UK with early warning of Argentinian air attacks and there are rumours that British special forces operated from Chile. The Brits, perhaps in gratitude for Chilean help, provided refuge to General Pinochet. There’s a story that, if Argentina had been victorious in the Falklands War, Argentina would next have invaded Chilean Patagonia and the Magenalles. Argentina has put pressure on Chile to to stop flights and maritime traffic between Chile and the Falklands. Whatever you do, don’t mention the [Falklands] war around Argentinians.
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:41am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Yep a pain trying to get to Falklands, Lan Chile via Easter Island was 1 route I’ve taken. Other times military Plane.
      Don’t get me started about transfering Falkland Is Pounds at the cambio of the home port of General Belgrano on anniversary day of its sinking.
      Right “Balls up”.
      
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      June 13, 2023 12:20pm
  - Hard Cheese
    
    I hear it’s a very nice place to retire. I’m going to put it on my list in case the Greens or Labour get anywhere near passing their wealth or capital gains taxes.
    
    10 0
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    June 13, 2023 1:06pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Dougsl10
    
    No you are wrong, the Chinese company divested their shares in PGGW some years ago, don’t say no they did not, because they were forced to by the US sharemarket for not telling them they owned shares in PGGW
    
    So as I said, get ya facts right
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:06pm
- Paulus
  
  Is perhaps the $ figure well out of date and the actual figure is very much larger ?
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:38am
- Simon
  
  Green party eh?
  
  National party are also man made climate cranks as well. Luxon believes with all his might in man made climate fraud. National along with the Gweens are a party of cranks.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:00am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Yet he will use his head and science innovation to do the heavy lifting in agri unlike Green Labour who will simply tax the over worked under paid farmers, snd pick their farms off and let foreigners plant unproductive pines so they can carry on flying their private jets.
    
    You have two choices
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:58am
- Stellaboxer
  
  Uraguay is not a bad bolt hole to keep an eye on. Just in case the circus of death get back in.
  
  13 1
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  June 13, 2023 10:05am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Looking for some cheap Spanish lessons? 🙂
    
    2 0
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    June 13, 2023 6:06pm
- Burtland
  
  heres a report on where all the Climate Change money is going
  
  https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/climate-change-finance/
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:49pm
Tony Stuart

The full quote from Christopher Luxon to a farmer yesterday:

“We have become a very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking country, and we have lost the plot, and we’ve got to get our mojo back.”

Unsurprisingly, the Left has bleated and moaned about this quote, but Luxon is dead right. The post-Covid hangover is still evident, and by and large, we HAVE lost our mojo.

Let’s get our mojo back by changing the government 👍
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June 13, 2023 8:08am
- yossarian
  
  Probably won him some votes.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:14am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    I doubt it will have cost him any. Those who a whining about it wouldn’t vote for him anyway, and those who were thinking of voting for National are probably thinking “He’s got a point here”…
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:37am
    - Jack5
      
      Luxon’s right that NZ has lost the plot.
      
      Who taped his comments, though? Was it a Stuff reporter?
      
      Is there a legal issue here? Do taped conversations’ copyright belong only to one of the parties being recorded, or two both of them in this case – or can anyone do anything like with snooped conversations?
      
      Perhaps it will be like the snooped conversation of John Key in an Auckland coffee bar, where a reporter “accidentally” left his switched-one tape recorder nearby.
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:22am
      - Tony Stuart
        
        No, he made the comment while being filmed by a news crew.
        
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        June 13, 2023 9:57am
      - Jack5
        
        Thanks, Tony. I see that it was a 1News video. Presumably it was broadcast.
        
        On the web site right now, Stuff features as its lead story – and above the comments of Luxon – Hipkins calling the assault on a 12-year-old child “unacceptable”.
        
        New Zealand’s crime rate has soared like a space rocket under Labour, and Hipkins tisks-tisks that this is “unacceptable”.
        
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        June 13, 2023 10:24am
      - kowtow
        
        And recall some snake leaked “gone by lunch time’ re Brash.
        
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        June 13, 2023 12:32pm
- Tricati
  
  Luxon was correct – the very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking are those that are criticizing him (Lloyd Burr) and the majority of the MSM.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:25am
  - stiff cheese
    
    Yes, Burr has found a new home at Newshub, after his TodayFM gig folded. Last night, he took Luxon’s heavily edited conversation, and inserted his own snide remarks.
    Straight from the Jenna Lynch School of ‘Journalism’.
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:12pm
- The Redbaiter
  
  Tony Stuart – “Unsurprisingly, the Left has bleated and moaned about this quote, but Luxon is dead right.”
  
  Good for you Tony. Have the Nats finally realised that kneeling to corrupt partisan media will not win them votes from their core constituency, who despise said media?
  
  A great display of courage (sarcasm) to this time defend Mr Luxon’s statement as one of truth rather than trying to weakly pass if off as a “joke”.
  
  Now get some new advisors, (Hamish is hopeless) and a new campaign manager. (Bishop is even worse) Then get some leaders who understand the true purpose of the National party. (the voters perceive Luxon and Willis as representing the Green Left)
  
  Then you might be on the way to creating some space between you and the Labour party. It could even give you an election win.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:33am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Go away, your party wants to sit on the cross benches
    
    1 3
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    June 13, 2023 3:08pm
- Simon
  
  “Let’s get our mojo back by changing the government ”
  
  Govt.nz.borg will remain in place while a Luxon govt fluffs around the edges too chicken shit to undertake reform of the borg. Place holders while govt.nz.borg will not stop growing.
  
  Post -covid? National were a core zero covid nutjob supporters. Economic crushing zero covid policies and now its all about the economy for National.
  
  “This election is about the economy and who is best able to manage it to help you get ahead”
  
  https://www.national.org.nz/plan
  
  Do you not see how insane National are? Also to think they “can manage an economy”
  
  Gut govt.nz.borg is the only way forward. National aint up to it.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:55am
  - ISeeRed
    
    Looks like you’ve triggered the Social Nationalists again judging by the downvotes.
    
    2 0
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    June 13, 2023 7:21pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  And of course, like little tattle-tales thinking they’ve scooped a gotcha moment, $1uffed runs excitedly to Hipkins and trumpets: Luxon said we’re a wet, whiny inward-looking country, what do you think about that?
  
  Pathetic, the lot of them.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:31am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Thd Newshub poll of this was well in Luxons favour, so much so when it got to 70% they completely took it down, they didn’t just stop the poll, it’s gone
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:10pm
- MCōs
  
  Who’s he actually referring to?
  Nobody I know.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:36am
  - Groggy
    
    People on this blog!
    
    2 7
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    June 13, 2023 12:30pm
- sirknz
  
  There’s a poll on Dollar Store media now:
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300903899/yeah-nah-is-nz-a-negative-wet-whiny-inwardlooking-country
  
  Currently sitting at 59/41 for the ‘yes we are’.
  
  I expect this to disappear before midday.
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:55am
  - rouppe
    
    61% yes to 39% no atm lol
    
    14 0
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    June 13, 2023 12:25pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    When it got near 70% for it was taken down
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:11pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Go to Newshub, they have a yeah man poll, yeah is winning 61%, I think he did that on purpose, as has a couple of other things he has said lately like the have more babies joke, possibly even the prescription charges, note the left have stopped saying he is anti women cause $10 a year to mate, the dumbasses did not even realise that contraceptives are free apart from that small prescription charge
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:02pm
Maggie Pie

Good morning Opotiki 😎
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June 13, 2023 8:10am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  How many other towns in NZ are held hostage to thugs like the Mongrel Mob?
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/132301628/schools-out-in-ptiki-over-gang-tensions
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:16am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Gunshots rang out in the town last night. Three houses set alight in the last couple of days. Schools and businesses closed. Residents told not to leave their homes.
    
    – 1 Ewes
    
    When will Ginny tell us… “the country has never been safer”?
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:25am
    - Ruahine
      
      Maggie P.
      I think this is co-governance in action.
      
      30 0
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      June 13, 2023 8:59am
    - RoboRob
      
      Hipkins on AM show this morning saying its up to the police to sort this. Somewhat true but Labours policy have tied the polices hands. The soft on crime approach has emboldened the gangs and he is now leaving it up to the police to deal with his mess.
      
      31 1
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      June 13, 2023 9:10am
      - Jack5
        
        A Kiwiblog follower from, or formerly from, the police might tell us whether Woke recruitment is affecting the police?
        
        Seem to be a lot more little people in blue, and, from a quick look some don’t look tough.
        
        Soon, I guess, it will be multi-gender as well as multi-cultural criteria driving recruitment.
        
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        June 13, 2023 10:30am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Fabulous. We could make Columbia a sister country and a city here a sister city with Bogota!
      
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      June 13, 2023 11:11am
  - Gravelroad
    
    @ MW-
    Teachers can close schools down when it suits.
    Now gangs can shut schools down when it suits.
    Police can stand and watch.
    Ministry of Ed – what you doing?
    When did NZ become a country where education for our children is so little valued?
    
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    June 13, 2023 8:25am
    - rouppe
      
      It’s not just schools and education.
      
      Multiple stories of KO tenants harassing neighbours with noise, threats and ugly behavior. What does KO do? 18 months into a “crack down” 3 tenants are relocated. Not evicted, relocated. Ergo, no consequences.
      
      No consequences for retail crime.
      
      No consequences for beating up schoolgirls.
      
      No consequences for gang intimidation.
      
      Gangs and their associates and their children are running rampant. With no consequences. There’s your problem
      
      34 0
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      June 13, 2023 8:44am
  - Inandout
    
    Maggy, we have been conditioned to lockdowns thanks to the podium of truth. The gangs do dictate our lives and if there is no action taken by the next government then we can kiss goodbye to tourism as a source of income.
    
    23 2
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    June 13, 2023 8:55am
  - kowtow
    
    This is the what happens in failed states , not modern functioning liberal democracies.
    
    There’s something very rotten in today’s NZ. And it runs deep.
    
    29 1
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    June 13, 2023 9:18am
  - backster
    
    Chirpy and the Government cop out by saying it is an Operational Manner, The Grande Dame’s choice as Police Commissioner is so woke and committed to Diversity, Maori elites and Policing by consent, he leaves it to the locals. Previous Commissioners, and Police Ministers Banks, Jamieson, Walton, etc would be up in Opotiki right now overseeing the re=establishment of Law and order in compliance with their oath of office.
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:19am
    - sirknz
      
      ‘Operational matter’ – This could be politically bad for me so I am going to put this at arms length to me so that the stink doesn’t land on me.
      
      13 0
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      June 13, 2023 10:36am
  - wreck1080
    
    Mt Maunganui over the weekend.
    
    Motorcycle gangs rule the place. Police should be out in force arresting riders and confiscating every motorbike that is louder than a jet aircraft on take-off …. i.e, all of them.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:54am
  - Ghost
    
    Timaru council bought its third or fourth gang pad a few weeks ago. Demolished the buildings then sells the land
    
    13 0
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    June 13, 2023 10:57am
    - kowtow
      
      Bought
      
      4 1
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      June 13, 2023 2:45pm
- Opie
  
  Please show some respect. A gang leader has been killed //
  
  The town should be closed for celebrations.
  
  One down, 8356 to go.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:31am
  - wreck1080
    
    Last time I was in Opotiki there was half a dead horse by the boat ramp. Just lying there, all ripped up.
    
    There is a weird sense of normality in that town.
    
    13 0
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    June 13, 2023 10:56am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      School lunches wreck….
      
      6 0
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      June 13, 2023 11:13am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Good morning yo da Brossssssssssss
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:03pm
mandk

There was a delicious juxtaposition of headlines on Stuff this morning.

The first one said: “Luxon calls NZ a ‘very negative, wet, whiny, inward-looking country’.”

The second said: “Are we too offended now? Why we need to stop taking things so personally.”

QED by Luxon, I reckon.
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June 13, 2023 8:23am
- mandk
  
  Poll on Stuff currently showing 60:40 split in Luxon’s favour, with almost 6,000 votes so far.
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:21am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    61/39 now, can’t take all the credit for that myself…
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:41am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Thee we poll is gone
    
    1 1
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    June 13, 2023 3:11pm
    - Ghost
      
      It’s still up
      
      1 0
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      June 13, 2023 3:13pm
Ruawai

RNZ saying this pro Russian sentiment is the only time it has happened at RNZ, what about the constant slant promoting Labour and disparaging National and especially Luxon.

Quote from Paul Thompson RNZ CEO “The best part of working in RNZ is the fierceness with which we defend our editorial standards and it’s galling that the activity in a very small area of the organisation can affect us all.” Maybe he needs to look at NZ political articles to see if there is bias there as well.
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June 13, 2023 8:42am
- Prince
  
  Looking at RNZ, there is no programme that is not fronted by a Left-wing presenter.
  Possible exception Katherine Ryan, who at least tries to maintain a balance.
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:23am
- Loddenthinks
  
  I’m not sure the reason why, but milk-sops seem very keen on declaring how “fiercely” they do things when the reality is the exact opposite.
  
  It’s a bit like being a lady – if you have to tell people how fierce you are, you’re really not.
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:43am
- Burtland
  
  RNZ chief executive Paul Thompson “Trusted journalism is our bed-rock ” 🤣🤣🤣
  
  Another government agency for the dumpster
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:02pm
  - Swifty
    
    Trusted is fair.
    
    Trusted to pump out leftist spin. For decades now.
    
    I remember years and years ago successive National Ministers pulling their hair out at their failure to ‘rehabilitate’ RNZ even after putting in new Boards etc.
    
    It never worked. The staff just carried on as usual.
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:52pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Newsroom names the RNZ digital journalist placed on leave

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/media-shooting-itself-in-the-foot
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June 13, 2023 8:43am
- Cassandra
  
  Excellent article about the decline and fall of the media in NZ. The editorial team should be dismissed. Hall, the journo responsible, should be prosecuted. With any luck he’s an immigrant and can be deported after his prison sentence.
  
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  June 13, 2023 8:57am
  - Matt Long
    
    He’s been stood down, management faces a conundrum; if they fire one journalist for making things up will it set a precedent, and how then will they generate content?
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:46am
- Ehlana
  
  And New Zealand made the BBC news overnight: “New Zealand radio station sorry for ‘pro-Kremlin’ garbage”.
  
  Don’t it make you proud?
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:02am
- Simon
  
  RNZ is utter dog shit. Its part of the problem. Close it down or move it onto subscription service for all the left.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:14am
- kowtow
  
  Newsroom suffering from Keys/Luxton syndrome.
  
  ‘The two political veterans were commenting on the Arden government’s…..’
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:21am
- Jack5
  
  News media have often mixed sources in single reports about activities such as wars.
  
  The standard seems to have been that each source was clearly identified, and the over-all edited result was fair and balanced.
  
  Did the RNZ journo lack skill or training rather than wilfully distort reports?
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:53am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    I think he received his training like a good little propagandist fifth-columner.
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:45am
    - Paulus
      
      It is conceded that the changed reports have been done for the last five years.
      In the UK trial of the media by Prince Harry a senior newspaper person conceded that he/she was told by his Managing Editor to amend or change articles about Harry.
      But he cannot win against media opinion.
      
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      June 13, 2023 1:44pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  And this is the problem with journo’s today. All they are is keyboard warriors. Literally none of them go out and hunt stories, interview people (from both sides of the isle (or even argument). They are forced to produce a certain number of stories a day, and can’t do real journo stuff anymore. There was a brilliant interview of AG Sulzberger in the New Yorker which talks about this.
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:18am
  - Burtland
    
    theyre all low quality foot soldiers from the polytechs and installed themselves in a hermetically sealed echo chamber
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:10pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  In fact everyone should read it. Link here: https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/a-g-sulzberger-on-the-battles-within-and-against-the-new-york-times
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:21am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Is a “digital journalist” one that keeps showing right-thinking New Zealanders the middle finger?
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:44am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    That’s correct Lodden. Read the article I posted. Sulzberger nails it. And his family own the NYT!
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:27pm
Chuck Bird

Anyone going to Field Days on Thursday?
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June 13, 2023 8:53am
- Inandout
  
  CB, will climate extremists be there?
  
  5 1
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  June 13, 2023 8:57am
  - Gravelroad
    
    Will there be a rainbow tent/exhibition/road crossing/speech making opportunity for trans farmers?
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:53am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Chris Luxon will be there. I hope to have a word with him.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:06am
- Tony Stuart
  
  I thought you were a confirmed Act voter now Chuck. Why would Luxon want to talk with people who clearly aren’t going to vote for National?
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:14am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    He would be rather stupid to say he does not want to speak to me as I am voting Act becausese of his support of James Shaw.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:39am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      He does not support Shaw in any way fFS, stop being fooled by the media, he has stated there will be no dialogue with the greens after the election, and you may well be voting for ACT to sit on the cross benches, if so Act will have no say in anything
      
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      June 13, 2023 12:08pm
      - rouppe
        
        you may well be voting for ACT to sit on the cross benches, if so Act will have no say in anything
        
        Well that’s not true…
        
        Give confidence and supply to form a minority government, then National would have to collect 15-20 votes from elsewhere to pass legislation.
        
        You think the Greens will give them those votes? Māori Party?
        
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        June 13, 2023 12:34pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        FYI
        
        The reason for me leaving National is a Newsroom article I recently came across. Below is an excerpt from the article and a link to it.
        
        And it’s not just Labour being dished compliments; he says Climate Change Minister and Green Party co-leader James Shaw is “someone I really respect and have spent a lot of time with’’.
        
        He wants his climate change spokesperson Scott Simpson to have a close working relationship with Shaw and to work hard on a bipartisan approach.
        
        “The background is that I was very much about embracing net carbon zero.’’
        
        https://www.newsroom.co.nz/chris-luxons-desire-to-work-more-with-the-government
        
        I wish I have come across the article when it was written as I would have likely made my move sooner. Todd Muller stated in an email to me the following.
        
        Hi Chuck
        
        Personally I do think the world is in a climate emergency. The challenge as it always has been is to get global action as opposed to global speeches and talk fests.
        
        I am in strong agreement with Scott that we have to get NZ action in a sensible place – function of ETS price, available technology, and sensible conversations with larger emitting sectors to build a plan – cutting cows and stopping NZ steel etc.
        
        Kind regards
        Todd
        
        I thought that was bad but did not think that was National policy. After reading the Newsroom article it appears that it is. We now have a National Party supporting taxing farmers for methane and agreeing with the Greens about reducing livestock numbers and farmers’ incomes.
        
        There are two possibilities for Luxon’s attitude. One is that he is a Greenie like Shaw and Muller. The other is that he is going on polling and believes that is the surest way to get to be PM. I tend to think it is the latter as I view him as a narcissist.
        
        A Labour lite government will be slightly better as Act will stick up for the hard-working farmers. Act MP, Mark Cameron is a farmer and hopefully be Agriculture Minister if we have a National-led government. You can hear Mark’s maiden speech below.
        
        https://www.parliament.nz/en/mps-and-electorates/members-of-parliament/cameron-mark/
        
        My view on climate change is that we have anthropogenic global warming and the sea level is rising. New Zealand should play its part in reducing CO2 but not to the extent of harming our farmers. If farms are converted to pine forests rural communities will die and will not come back.
        
        Kind regards
        Chuck
        
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        June 13, 2023 1:25pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Roupee
        
        They have given confidence and supply before, but they left the Nats to run government, can’t be out of the camp and think you cant stomp ya feet
        
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        June 13, 2023 3:15pm
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        G – I get that as an ex-labour voter you are excited by a National party that is more like the Old Labour Party than the current Labour party. However, you do seem to be a wee bit excitable about dissuading others from ACT. ACT are likely to hold 30-40% of the seats in a National ACT government. They will have a greater influence on a new Government than you suggest.
        
        ACT aren’t the party they were in the Prebble-Douglas or Brash eras. They have moved more towards where the Old National party sat.
        
        Barring the Covid election we don’t have FPP anymore. Why do you have such a problem with a Nats ACT government?
        
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        June 13, 2023 7:20pm
  - Gravelroad
    
    No don’t agree with you there @ TS-
    A positive leader should be prepared to talk to any potential voter.
    A clever leader would back themselves to listen to the other person’s point of view and try to change it with facts and vision for a better future.
    Refusing to speak to or listen to someone you think isn’t going to vote for you, isn’t going to get them to change their minds and vote for you on the day.
    
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    June 13, 2023 4:49pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      Refusing to speak to or listen to someone you think isn’t going to vote for you, isn’t going to get them to change their minds and vote for you on the day.
      
      A zillion upticks. The normal KB approach is to tell those who disagree that they are idiots. Guaranteed to change their minds … 🙂
      
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      June 13, 2023 6:16pm
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        “Refusing to speak to or listen to someone you think isn’t going to vote for you, isn’t going to get them to change their minds and vote for you on the day.”
        
        That was Jacindas approach – didn’t end well for her.
        
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        June 13, 2023 7:23pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Yesterday one of the commenters here asked a question about a “correction note” the NZ Herald had just published.

I couldn’t locate the story that was being corrected…..and subsequently learn that is has disappeared into the ether..

While RNZ’s troubles have led its own news bulletins and featured in most media, NZME, the publisher of New Zealand Herald has escaped the same sort of scrutiny after one of its reporters was taken in by false information over a woman claiming to have gone from a Mongrel Mob background to a high-powered legal career.

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/media-shooting-itself-in-the-foot
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June 13, 2023 8:54am
- Burtland
  
  try the waybackmachine https://archive.org/web/
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:18pm
Rusty

I hope Luxon will make a lot of noise on what is happening in Opotiki.

A criminal gang can close down the infrastructure of a town for a week to have a tangi on a dead thug criminal leader is unbelievable.

And Hipkins and the police find that acceptable?

Luxon has got to speak for every decent law abiding Nzer and insist Hipkins and the police kick this vermin out of Opotiki immediately.
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June 13, 2023 8:58am
- nathie
  
  Since the gangs are all in one place how about a Police/AOS operation and round them all up?
  
  Anyway isn’t ironic how the Left and MSM mocked and ridiculed Simon Bridges for advocating for Police “Raptor Squads” … when it is exactly what the Police need!
  
  Smash the gangs – raid them every week confiscating assets and proceeds of crime, and put them in their place until they learn to stop ripping off society.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:52am
  - Rusty
    
    @nathie
    If the gangs can get away with this in small towns then what’s stopping them doing it in South or West Auckland — if not already?
    
    Just outlaw gangs congregating in large public gatherings.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:23am
- Gaetano
  
  I just cannot imagine any developed country allowing a gang to close a school.
  
  New South Wales police would rain hell fire on a bikie gang that terrified a school into closing.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:53am
  - wreck1080
    
    Just wait ten years… record numbers of Maori kids dropping out of school. These kids don’t exactly have good employment prospects for the remainder of their short(er) lives. Gangs will pick them up.
    
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    June 13, 2023 11:05am
  - Richard
    
    Not sure about NSW, but in Queensland they would all be arrested for socialising together. Of course in the media here we get sob stories about how the Barbarians president was a good guy, he did good for the community, was anti meth etc. Remember the last time we got sold that line by the Waikato mob? Turns out they were running a meth ring while preaching anti drug messages. What is happening to our country?
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:09pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Perhaps, like vape shops, gangs can be banned within a 1km radius of any school. Or church. Probably not maraes, though.
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:46pm
    - Ghost
      
      Can we ban politicians from schools as well, there is no reason for the amount of school visits they do
      
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      June 13, 2023 9:57pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Goldsmith is, he is the justice spokesman, snd has torn Labour a new one for closing schools there for a week to celebrate
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:09pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

These naughty boys should have handed the gun in when Jaspinda told them to.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/south-auckland-local-says-guns-now-as-easy-to-get-as-drugs-amid-spate-of-shootings/ar-AA1cqMGE

Making a gun register available public is yet another crazy Labour idea. What the hell is the matter with them? Crims know where to steal guns ffs.
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June 13, 2023 9:00am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  But you wouldn’t want the crims breaking into houses at the wrong address, would you?
  
  Better to identify where all the legal guns are held so illegal gun holders aren’t hassled.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:05am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I wonder what Special “K” has to say about the gun register? If we could understand what he says…….
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:16am
Maggie Pie

Heard the PM interviewed on ZB earlier…..

Came across as an ill-informed, wet, whiny, negative, inward looking wimp.

Just saying.
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June 13, 2023 9:05am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Lost his Mojo, has he?
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:05am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Did he ever have any mojo in the first place?
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:20am
    - Burtland
      
      is a mojo a brand of meat pie?
      
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      June 13, 2023 1:21pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  So exactly like what Luxon said about New Zealand yesterday?
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:06am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Wondered where I’d heard it 😀
    
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    June 13, 2023 9:40am
- Simon
  
  Nothing more inward looking that National taking orders from the UN. Like they did with indigenous rights rubbish.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:16am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Luxon has stated before the UN do not run this country, I have not heard any other leader say the same
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:17pm
    - mawm
      
      We wait anxiously for him to follow up with action.
      
      I have absolutely no doubt that he will enthusiastically support the WHO and their pandemic plans and their drive to have every man, woman and child vaccinated with a substance that is toxic, even fatal, in order to travel or even socialise.
      
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      June 13, 2023 7:32pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Are there two different people with the nick “Simon” on here?
    
    [Mod – no]
    
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    June 13, 2023 6:57pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Okily Dokily. Thanks for the update!
      
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      June 13, 2023 7:51pm
- Hollyfield
  
  Don’t hassle Chippie about his interview with Mike. It’s the entertainment highlight of my week, topped this week only by the listener who later texted in about an interview I think with Qantas “did you give Alan Joyce the list of questions in advance, or did he just know his stuff” (I’m paraphrasing)
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:29am
  - Paulus
    
    Did I not read that finally Alan Joyce is retiring as he has wanted for some time
    Done a good job too –
    Suceeded by best person for the job, another woman I believe.
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:50pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  He always does, he tried to say that’s nice Luxon is running nz at home instead of overseas now, he was all tongue tied again when asked, fact is his crazy government have created the sentiment
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:11pm
Observant Octagenarian

Reading an article recently that mentioned Waka Kotahi and Kiwirail in the same sentence, I observed that Kiwirail, unlike other Government departments, never had a Maori name.
It’s a sitter for ‘Waka Choo Choo’.
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June 13, 2023 9:06am
Ehlana

“Tertiary Education Union organiser at Waikato University Shane Vugler said the union was “shocked and appalled” by the amount of money the university had spent on Joyce Advisory.”

Joyce Advisory is run by one Steven Joyce, former National Party Cabinet Minister.

According to the University, Mr Joyce’s help has resulted in Waikato “increasing its market share of school leavers over the past two years, despite a decrease in both the Year 13 cohort size and the proportion of students achieving University Entrance.”

I wonder if the Union organiser is most appalled that an ex-National Minister is getting University money, or that he has actually achieved something measurable.
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June 13, 2023 9:25am
- barnacle bill
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  The article came across showing just what a money hungry prick Joyce is.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:59am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Oh Dear…
    
    Do you think all that advisory money should have been heading into Jacinda’s old mates’ hands?
    
    Since January 2020 University of Waikato has paid a $6900 monthly retainer to Capital GR, spending about $262,000 to February this year.
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/lobbying/486312/lobbying-firms-earning-hundreds-of-thousands-from-contracts-with-government-agencies
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:31am
  - sirknz
    
    Ex National MP gets measurable results in a declining, difficult market, and you’re miserable , wet, inward looking self is whining about him charging for his services.
    
    This isn’t the win the left thinks it is.
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:46am
    - waikatosinger
      
      Since most staff at the Uni didn’t know about it, I wonder how measurable the results were. How would you even measure the effect of the advice of a consultant. What if any concrete changes were made as the result of this advice?
      
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      June 13, 2023 12:51pm
      - sirknz
        
        Declining cohort numbers nationally with an increase in student numbers seems to indicate that concrete changes were made, probably to the marketing strategy, and that there was a measurable effect.
        
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        June 13, 2023 4:20pm
      - Ehlana
        
        They did measure it. The advice was about marketing Waikato to students, it seems, and the University says the result was an increase in their share of the school leaving cohort choosing Waikato. So a measured positive result.
        
        Would most staff be aware of what management is doing regarding marketing to new students? I’d think they would be more focussed on other things, so probably not.
        
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        June 13, 2023 5:24pm
  - Swifty
    
    Hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars A WEEK gets handed to private firms by this government but it’s only money going to Stephen Joyce’s company which attracts Bill’s wrath (with the entirely predictable accompanying personal slurs).
    
    Tells us a lot about him, doesn’t it?
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:59am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    That was the union thugs idea
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:13pm
- Burtland
  
  smearing Joyce – hes not even in parliament – getting desperate
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:27pm
  - Paulus
    
    Wish he were back in Parliament !
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:51pm
  - Swifty
    
    They hate him for his effectiveness.
    
    Makes them all look bad.
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:54pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

Anyone who is now aware of this or do not care need to wake up!
A Coup is happening!

Elite iwi moving to shut down free speech. Especially anyone objecting to the Maori takeover of New Zealand.. Will the Govt shut down Julian Batchelor and the ‘Stop Co-Governance’ movement? Remember, we are dealing with Marxists here. Dr Muriel Newman has a few words in an item.
It means Iwi, Maori, via the government, will be able to fine people up to $200,000 if they say anything which is deemed by the regulator to be ‘culturally unsafe’

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/government-about-to-clamp-down-on-stop-co-governance-movement/
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June 13, 2023 9:31am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Dr Muriel Newman’s item expanded – with comments. Free speech is a right and shouldn’t be regulated by Law. Regulated by Law means regulated by the Communists. South Zimbabwe is coming.
  
  https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Media-Freedom-to-be-Muzzled-NZCPR-Site.pdf
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Included in today’s post is:
  Rowan Atkinson On The Absolutely Necessity Of Guarding The Right To Free Speech. No, it’s not comedy, he is deadly serious.
  
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  June 13, 2023 9:44am
- NZer In Exile
  
  I’ve worked with people who at the time seemed nice but now seemed to be involved in cheering on warped revenge “take-back” of NZ for “Maori” (whatever the hell that means in 2023). It’s a culture of messed up racism among certain Maori descendants.
  
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  June 13, 2023 7:01pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The rot started in 1975 with the Waitangi Tribunal and a rogue Treaty.
    Geoffrey Palmers interference in 1989 is unbelievable, but he made everything ok, right?
    
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    June 14, 2023 8:14am
alan

In case you all haven’t seen this posted by NZCPR.
https://www.nzcpr.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/TreatyOfWaitangiBySirApiranaNgata.pdf
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June 13, 2023 9:31am
Maggie Pie

Bestie has provided an UP DATE on the unwashed trans activist coward, who appeared in court yesterday charged with the vicious assault on an elderly lady at Albert Park during the ‘Posie Parker’ Convention.

For reasons unknown, the hearing has been rescheduled to OCTOBER 9th@11am. There was no explanation provided by the court registrar for the delay in proceedings.

Hmmm. Maybe they’re hoping people might forget about it…just a few days out from the election and all that stuff?

Lest we forget:

https://twitter.com/l1ber_te/status/1639917380569821185
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June 13, 2023 9:33am
MCōs

Silvio Berlusconi died yesterday
NZ never has PMs like Mr B. We prefer the comfortably bland types who never get caught bonking someone they shouldn’t.
David Lange was as colorful as they come in these parts and he didn’t last.
Jacinda was far too cheerful for us.
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June 13, 2023 9:58am
- mandk
  
  “Jacinda was far too cheerful for us.”
  
  Really? I would have said that she was too weak, incompetent and fake to last the course.
  
  But I guess she realised that she was beginning to be found out, and decided to get out with her reputation intact amongst a large chunk of the population.
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:21am
  - kowtow
    
    JA fucked the whole country over , royally.
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:40pm
    - sirknz
      
      DAAAAAAAMMMMMME!
      
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      June 13, 2023 4:21pm
- Tony Stuart
  
  Well, we’ve never had a PM who attended BungaBunga parties before. Aspects of Sir Robert Muldoon’s tenure we pretty out there, not least his state of sobriety when he called the 1984 snap election 😵‍💫
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:24am
  - Paulus
    
    Saw Muldoon in Rocky Horror Show – great fun too !
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:54pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Cheerful MCos? I thought she always looked miserable. That was why she was so good when bad things happened. Though I suppose if you are picking up a lazy $500k or so for a 40 hour week, and before becoming PM, there was zero chance that would ever happen, you do have a reason to be cheerful.
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:33pm
Maggy Wassilieff

James Shaw of the Green Party has repeatedly made the link between increasing tax for the wealthy as the means to reduce child poverty in NZ.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300903301/newsable-do-wealth-taxes-actually-work

So how is Norway’s wealth tax working out for their kiddiewinkles?

11.7% of all children in Norway are now considered to be living in low-income households. As you’ll see from the chart below, it’s a trend that continues to climb.

https://www.lifeinnorway.net/dramatic-increase-in-child-poverty-in-norway/
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June 13, 2023 9:59am
- mandk
  
  One of the problems that the Scandinavian countries face is that many of the immigrants on benefits find themselves with a standard of living that is unimaginably high, compared to the countries from which they came.
  
  This means that the incentives for immigrants to work towards improving their circumstances are weak.
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:16am
- Gaetano
  
  What would James Shaw know?
  
  Jacinda promised to end child poverty. Did she fail or something?
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:40am
  - Ghost
    
    Jacinda did a great job, don’t know why people bag her. Thanks to her most of us now live in poverty…..
    
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    June 13, 2023 10:47am
    - Christopher Thomson
      
      But we are all equally poor.
      
      Job done.
      
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      June 13, 2023 1:24pm
      - waikatosinger
        
        Of course some are more equally poor than others.
        
        9 0
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        June 13, 2023 3:46pm
    - Burtland
      
      gong in the bag 🏆
      
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      June 13, 2023 1:33pm
      - Paulus
        
        Robertson to follow, arise Sir Grant !
        
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        June 13, 2023 1:55pm
    - Hugh Jarse
      
      That’s equalidy in action !
      
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      June 13, 2023 6:00pm
kevn

@Maggy… We can be sure any utterance from shaw will be meaningless.
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June 13, 2023 10:15am
Maggy Wassilieff

A 14 year-old girl has been charged with assault after the attack on a young girl

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/132298912/14yearold-charged-after-girl-assaulted-outside-mcdonalds
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June 13, 2023 10:40am
- sirknz
  
  Thought she was getting the usual hugs and there theres from the wraparound agencies that never seem to produce much in the way of winners.
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:51am
- Swifty
  
  Welsh I bet.
  
  Any time a kid with the name of Davies or Jones befriends our kids we run a mile.
  
  Oh they come across all well initially, asking you to join their choirs, or throw a footy ball around, but there’s a hidden side to the Welsh.
  
  Steer clear is my advice!
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:05am
  - mtamati
    
    Swifty…
    The Welsh have been at it for years….I can still remember my grandmother telling me as a kid, “Taffy was a Welshman, Taffy was a thief…Taffy came to our house and stole a leg of beef”.
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:14pm
    - Swifty
      
      A wise woman was your granny.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:24pm
  - Prince
    
    9-3.
    Lest we forget.
    Sospan Fach.
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:16pm
    - Swifty
      
      I remember that game, I was just a little kid and just couldn’t understand how it had happened!
      
      😀
      
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      June 13, 2023 4:01pm
Maggie Pie

With the deadline to return the ‘2023 Census’ now extended out to the end of this month, perhaps Deborah should consider dispatching a few Field Collectors into Opotiki armed with Forms and KFC vouchers.

Be a good chance to catch all those maori boys in one place who may have needed help completing them earlier?
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June 13, 2023 10:40am
- Ghost
  
  Let’s just extend the deadline until the next census is due
  
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  June 13, 2023 10:46am
  - Paulus
    
    Like the 2018 Census incomplete and inaccurate, like this one as Maori have not had enough Koha yet, so the figures will be moderated to give whatever the Stats and Government want to justify Maori seats.
    16 % – show me and prove it !
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:58pm
- Prince
  
  Still waiting for Deborah ‘Addicted to Spending’ Russell’s resignation that she said would follow if the Census failed to get 90% completion rate.
  https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=402412258489113
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:21pm
Maggy Wassilieff

The 3-Waters foul-ups continue apace

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/former-pm-unauthorised-three-waters-law-changes-caused-by-strains-in-parlt
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June 13, 2023 10:43am
Maggie Pie

TBH, you would think the Opotiki situation would be an ideal opportunity for Cuddles to show some real mettle. But not a Dickey-Bird heard from him so far 🙁
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June 13, 2023 11:02am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, I suspect he is holed up in his Police HQ basement. Leaders often go to their basements when the shit hits the fan.
  
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  June 13, 2023 11:08am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Gentle Ginny and Cuddles Coster are the last people you would depend on for a crackdown on gangs.
    
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    June 13, 2023 12:04pm
- kevn
  
  @Maggie… Not a word from one kiri allan either. It’s on her turf.
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:49pm
Maggie Pie

And something else that’s gone all sort of…. Secret-Squirrel 🙁

What’s happening with negotiations in relation to sale of ‘The Chateau’?

I see where even the Ruapehu-District-Mayor Weston Kirton says…. “he’s not privy to any information, but like everyone else, he’s concerned”

Is there likely to be any urgency to have the matter settled before the October election?

Asking for an interested party.
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June 13, 2023 11:54am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, think Ihumatao and Shelly Bay.
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:06pm
wilderbeast

An interesting day in NZ…as I understand it gang violence has effectively shut down Opotiki – schools closed for a week, public transport closed, people urged to stay in. A quick scan of the MSM headlines fails to show any sign of the story whilst on others it’s well down the list behind the likes of climate change pronouncements by Hipkins, Nicola Sturgeon stories (she’s from Scotland ffs) and other assorted irrelevancies. What has happened to NZ? I’m beginning to conclude that we’ve abandoned the social contract and duty of care to all NZers. The law abiding citizens of Opotiki are being royally insulted and let down, just as many in Hawkes Bay were a few months ago. The government is absolutely culpable but it’s looking like a wider malaise in political focus and moral standards, because it seems that no one cares…? We should all put ourselves in the shoes of Opotiki residents and ask how we would feel.
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June 13, 2023 12:05pm
- Inandout
  
  wild, it is now pronounced Opawtiki, except Hosking.
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:09pm
- Prince
  
  To borrow a phrase from FJK…
  Today, in the world of freedom, the proudest toast is ‘Ich bin ein Opotikian’.
  Come October, I am voting for all New Zealanders to go about their lawful business whether there is a gang funeral in town or not.
  And if the new Govt doesn’t take action on this, I’ll vote for change again, until I find one that does.
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:12pm
Prince

Hipkins is now blaming ‘the other side of the House’ for the lack of Hate Crime Laws, that he claims has allowed a 14 year old to attack a younger girl over the weekend.
Precisely what Laws had Labour proposed that National/Act rejected ?
Can some brave journalist ask that question please ?
Our PM is not only weak – he is duplicitous, corrupt, and quite simply an outright liar.
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June 13, 2023 12:07pm
- Prince
  
  Hipkins said the lack of agreement in Parliament would make it unlikely to go through in an election year.
  “From our side of the isle, we do think there is more that could be done in the area of hate crime, but we have not gotten agreement from the other side.”
  
  https://www.1news.co.nz/2023/06/13/assault-on-girl-12-outside-mcdonalds-horrific-unacceptable-pm/
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:16pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Funny that Prince since they have an outright majority that has allowed them to push through any legislation they choose and so much under urgency and compressing the select committee process. Included in the compression process is the rejection of chosen submissions with so9 much being ok when the left do it. Is he refereeing to the Maori caucus when he claims it is the other side restricting progress. The real funny bit is: “From our side of the isle, we do THINK there is more that could be done in the area of hate crime”. LOL
    
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    June 13, 2023 1:50pm
  - Gaetano
    
    A 14 year old bashing a 12 year old has nothing to do with ‘hate crime’. The 14 year old should be locked up. A generation ago she would have been locked up.
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:10pm
    - Swifty
      
      Exactly.
      
      A complete and utter red herring from Hipkins.
      
      He’s trying to pull the wool. Usual Labour bullshittery.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:27pm
- kowtow
  
  Did he miss the bit where it’s already against the law to bash people .
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:34pm
  - Swifty
    
    Hipkins thinks New Zealanders are stupid.
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:27pm
    - Ghost
      
      Looking back over the past few years, he’d be right to think that.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:28pm
      - Swifty
        
        It pains me to think that you’re right Ghost.
        
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        June 13, 2023 4:03pm
- Master Mariner
  
  You sound surprised?
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:35pm
- H. Upmann
  
  Why is this a Hate Crime Hipkins? It sounds like crime to me.
  
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  June 13, 2023 12:44pm
- Ghost
  
  Labour have a majority, they can pass the hate crime bills. But the problem isn’t the lack of hate crime laws, the problem is some little child got up and beat the shit out of another little child and will get bugger all punishment. You don’t need a special hate crime bill to deal with her, the laws are already in place, but nothing will come from soft on crime labour. Sorry my mistake, they aren’t soft on crime they don’t do a damn thing for crime.
  
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  June 13, 2023 1:36pm
  - Paulus
    
    Can’t do sweet fa as I believe only 30 Parliamentary sitting days left.
    Labour MPs will be tidyng up their desks and boxing up anything legally acquired as an MP.
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:01pm
    - Ghost
      
      If they wanted to do the work, plenty of time.
      
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      June 13, 2023 2:27pm
      - Swifty
        
        They would have to admit to the problem first and I don’t see them doing that.
        
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        June 13, 2023 4:04pm
Chris Nisbet

Sheesh, a headline tells me that some economist thinks the party is over for NZ.
As far as I’m concerned, people started leaving when Labour got into power, there were only a few stragglers left once the Covid restrictions finally came off, and the lights went off a while back.
If we don’t get rid of them come election time I suspect some ne’erdowell will set light to the building to completely finish things off.
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June 13, 2023 12:35pm
- Piniwi
  
  But Chris the very sober looking Cameron Bagrie was not just highlighting the latest dive in tax revenue falling short by $1.7 Billion. This is undershooting predictions and seems to be indicating a growing trends as it is even higher than the previous month that undershot expectations by $1.5 Billion. A reality check for the [Use proper names. mod.] as he points out: “You raise costs, you hit firms margins, hit firms margins lower profits, lower profits less tax and that’s a little bit of ideology getting checked by economic reality.” But there is some good news as well: Core Crown expenses for the year so far are $330 million lower than expected, at $103.5 billion. Somebody better check the back of the couch again.
  
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  June 13, 2023 2:04pm
  - mogg
    
    https://gdplive.net/Dashboard
    Further good news for Labour: Massey live inflation/ GDP tracker is showing an optimal OCR of 8.7% needed to control current inflation @ 6.7%.
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:29pm
- MCōs
  
  “some economist”
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:38pm
Master Mariner

Not sure if any ones posted this, But here goes.

From the podium of truth. Fact checked by Dr Campbell.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlSdCTx762M

And Stats from NZ on excess deaths,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95T2Bqht4Xg

Any answers from the Ministry of Health ?

And if interested, A great explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihgXQqfajKg
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June 13, 2023 12:46pm
Maggie Pie

Huh??

“Former senior political figure charged with abusing teen boys fights to keep interim name suppression. Lawyer tells court naming accused could affect election outcome ”

– ZB News

Soon as I heard about it I txt the girls from tennis to see if they knew.
Thirteen replies so far…..all different.
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June 13, 2023 1:05pm
- Ghost
  
  I’d agree, name suppression until the day after the election.
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:18pm
- Paul Marsden
  
  Maybe that means there are 12 others yet to be charged?
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:19pm
Christopher Thomson

I haven’t read all the posts and don’t know if this info is already out, but I got advised of this today; It’s no longer a proposal.

“80kph on rural sealed roads, 60kph on rural unsealed roads, 40kph in urban areas and 30kph around urban schools, town centres and some urban streets.”
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June 13, 2023 1:18pm
- Gaetano
  
  I thought it was just in Waimakariri?
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/local-democracy-reporting/300901992/sweeping-changes-proposed-for-waimakariri-speed-limits
  
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  June 13, 2023 2:05pm
  - Dougal10
    
    I have seen mackenzie as well, its probably every council area and implemented because they are dependant on nzta funds , weather it makes the news depends on the editorial bias of local rag .
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:48pm
    - Gaetano
      
      Hell. Imagine being stuck at 80 kmh on those long straight Canterbury backroads. 🙁
      
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      June 13, 2023 3:06pm
      - Christopher Thomson
        
        Tell me about it. The longest straight piece of road in New Zealand is Tram Road.
        
        It is used every day to commute between Oxford and the Christchurch motorway. Currently 100k and takes about 30 minutes.
        
        This is going to be a godsend for the jackbooted revenue collectors.
        
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        June 13, 2023 3:18pm
- [email protected]
  
  How about adjusting road speeds based on the accident rate?
  
  Too hard?
  
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  June 13, 2023 7:49pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Luxon found his cojornes. I wonder whoes purse they were in?
Chasing the farmers vote? Who cares if it is?
Finally Luxon is bringing out policy. Maybe it is just me, wanting policies defined.
Good job Chris Luxon.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/watch-luxon-calls-new-zealand-very-negative-wet-whiney-inward-looking/ar-AA1cqy48
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June 13, 2023 1:47pm
- Prince
  
  Stuff is running a Poll.
  But it isn’t getting the result it expects !
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300903899/yeah-nah-is-nz-a-negative-wet-whiny-inwardlooking-country
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:01pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Yes, some much do it has disappeared
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:22pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Heard Willis say on Newshub that the conference in two weeks will be policy focused
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:22pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Something we have been waiting for. I understand the delay, because those other Marxist people will steal it.
    What is it with the left and stealing? Not just NZ – Worldwide.
    
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    June 13, 2023 3:34pm
    - sirknz
      
      It’s ‘redistribution’ when they do it.
      
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      June 13, 2023 4:31pm
leoj

The Warehouse is selling a new line of food products called Market Kitchen. All the products have alternative maori names for each product.

Among them is coffee.

I did not know that maori had coffee before Abel Tasman, Capt Cook, Samuel Marsden and James Busby.

They didn’t.

All this maori naming conversion is made up nonsense.
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June 13, 2023 2:08pm
- Gaetano
  
  They didn’t have dishwashers either but here we are 🙁
  
  “Pūrere Horoi Maitai”
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:08pm
- Paul Marsden
  
  And some wonder why we are losing cohesion in NZ society. I don’t.
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:15pm
The Veteran

So, a Gang Tangi in Wairoa and the town goes into shutdown. Schools closed … library closed … car torched … good people prevented from going about their lawful business.

New Zealand … the way you’ve got it. The Mongrel Mob calls the shots. Sad, shameful … words fail me.

Along with a 13 YO Philippine immigrant attacked suffering significant injuries to her head outside a McDonald’s … her crime, eating a meal and supposedly looking at another girl. Her attacker referred to Youth Aid (and one can only surmise wet bus ticket stuff) … give me strength.

And ‘Chippy’ pushes back on the suggestion that NZL is no longer a safe place. Something for nothing … it sure was a hell of a lot safer before Winston First propelled Labour into power.
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June 13, 2023 2:19pm
- gravedodger
  
  Might be Opotiki Vet, you’re welcome, just take SH2 to avoid Te Urewera, nice drive I did it c1977, in the other direction.
  A very different NZ indeed
  
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  June 13, 2023 2:52pm
I remember when

Do the media ever wonder what happened after ‘it’ was news?

Remember the 8000-km-wide sargassum seaweed mass that was the largest ever seen.
Was it ‘climate change’ they wondered.
Perhaps not, as after about two week’s of horrified speculation, it appeared to disappear.
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June 13, 2023 2:20pm
Maggie Pie

$tuff reports 🙁

So imagine if you were part of a travelling Women’s Interclub Tennis Team, but you were told not to shave your vagina, then be required to show it to the host clubs Chair Umpire…..to prove that you were in fact Female before play could commence.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/132304406/swedens-players-forced-to-show-their-genitalia-at-2011-fifa-womens-world-cup

You can blame the likes of that nasty trans activist Shaneel Lal for what’s happening to biological women out there now.
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June 13, 2023 2:29pm
- Ghost
  
  Well Maggie it does say that
  
  CORRECTION: An earlier version of this story said players were forced to prove their sexuality by showing their genitalia. It should have said their gender. (Updated 1.11pm, June 13).
  
  Therefore why show their vagina? Since gender is a state of mind you just need to say, I’m a female because I believe I am………
  
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  June 13, 2023 2:40pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Thnx Ghost….trying to save themselves any embarrassement if you ask me.
    Anyway, how would tell someone not to shave their ‘gender’?
    
    Asking for a friend
    
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    June 13, 2023 2:54pm
    - Ghost
      
      I would have thought you would want them to shave, don’t know what they could be hiding 🙈
      
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      June 13, 2023 3:01pm
      - kevn
        
        @Ghost… A merkin lurking?
        
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        June 13, 2023 3:55pm
  - mandk
    
    Those Stuff journalists are so dumb they have totally confused themselves.
    
    The women were asked to prove their SEX by showing their genitalia.
    
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    June 13, 2023 4:48pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  That activist should go stir shit in Fiji – where it comes from.
  
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  June 13, 2023 3:10pm
- Swifty
  
  Totally predictable now that men demand to be seen and play as women.
  
  Don’t blame FIFA. Blame the men.
  
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  June 13, 2023 4:20pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Now this could turn into a separate post for DPF and Kiwiblog.

https://www.stoplanguagedetours.co.nz/
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June 13, 2023 3:12pm
mogg

Orr’s reappointment RBNZ was politically motivated.
By Oliver Hartwich
Hindsight is a wonderful thing. It is often only after time passes that one realises what one should have done differently. These are decisions one should not have made if one had known about later events.
However, hindsight can also provide a cheap excuse. That is when one blames one’s past mistakes on future events — even when there is no link between them.
The Reserve Bank of New Zealand (RBNZ) is currently engaged in this kind of history falsification. It conveniently shifts the blame to Vladimir Putin for NZ’s high inflation. No matter that the RBNZ mainly has itself to blame.
Last week, the RBNZ’s Governor Adrian Orr appeared before parliament’s finance and expenditure committee. It was a regular appearance following the release of the Bank’s latest
Financial Stability Report. Orr used the opportunity to defend his record.
“For us to have maintained inflation between the 1 to 3 per cent target range, we would’ve had to predict the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine back in early 2020,” Orr said in his opening remarks.
With that claim, he shifted the blame for NZ’s inflation record to external events, away from the RBNZ’s monetary policy. He maintained this position throughout his testimony.
It sounds plausible, at least superficially. NZ is experiencing high inflation, but much of the world is as well. Also true is that inflation accelerated after Putin’s Russia invaded Ukraine on 24 February. The war has affected food, fertiliser and energy prices, especially in Europe.
Still, it was a bit cute for the RBNZ Governor to wash his hands of any responsibility for domestic inflation. Too cute indeed.
For all its international implications, the Ukraine war affected the NZ economy less than it did Europe. Unlike many European countries, NZ is a major net exporter of food. Any food price increases would have bolstered NZ’s terms of trade, strengthened the Kiwi dollar and been a dampener for domestic inflation. Also, NZ’s electricity is largely powered by domestic renewables and thus insulated from the European energy crisis.
There are no good reasons to believe that Putin’s war caused NZ’s inflation. The data does not support such a link in any case.
Michael Reddell, previously an economist with the RBNZ and now one of NZ’s most-read economic bloggers, had none of Governor Orr’s excuses. He calculated what NZ’s consumer price inflation would have been if war-related items were excluded.
Even without food, household energy and petrol, Reddell found inflation at around 6 per cent for September. Remarkably, this adjusted inflation rate was already at that level at the beginning of the Ukraine war.
So, if Putin cannot be blamed for NZ’s inflation, who is responsible for it?
Answering that question takes us right back to the RBNZ. It also requires a bit of monetary economics.
In the 1990s, US economist John B. Taylor studied monetary policy records to figure out how central banks target inflation. By devising a formula, he managed to replicate real central bank decisions.
Eventually, this formula became known as the Taylor Rule. It can be used for more than simply describing what central banks do. Using it can also help central banks decide what they should do.
A central bank trying to achieve an inflation target can thus use the Taylor Rule to figure out what official cash rate (OCR) would get it there.
In an ideal world, there should not be much of a gap between the OCR and the rate calculated under the Taylor Rule. The Taylor Rule is designed to achieve the same inflation target the central bank should achieve. So when there are large discrepancies between the Taylor Rule and the actual OCR, it means that the central bank is likely to get off track.
This makes calculations by Christoph Schumacher, an economics professor at Massey University, telling. Going through NZ’s monetary policy history, Schumacher calculated the Taylor Rule gap for the past two decades.

Since the beginning of the century, the OCR was oscillating around the value prescribed by the Taylor Rule. For the first decade, the OCR was a bit lower than the Taylor Rule would have prescribed. For the 2010s, it tended to be just a bit too high.
In 2021, however, something remarkable happened. The difference between the two became large.
By June 2021, the Taylor Rule suggested the cash rate should be above 2 per cent when, in fact, it was still only 0.25 per cent. Today, it should be close to 7 per cent when the OCR only stands at 3.5 per cent.
Schumacher’s findings indicate that the RBNZ was setting interest rates at a level far too low to achieve its inflation target. By the time the Ukraine war started, that gap had been positive for more than a year and stood at more than 3 percentage points back then.
As far as monetary policy is concerned, this is a smoking gun. Based on this evidence, the RBNZ’s policies were grossly misaligned. The RBNZ’s monetary policy was so far removed from where it should have been under the Taylor Rule, there was no chance the Bank could have achieved its inflation target.
Never in the past two decades has the RBNZ deviated so much from where it should have set its OCR. The difference is so enormous, it calls into question the RBNZ’s professional judgment.
Perhaps that is the real reason Governor Orr now tries to distract from his Bank’s disastrous policy decisions. By blaming Putin, he has found a convenient scapegoat — and it even sounds halfway plausible.
Once you go through his claims, however, Orr’s fairy tale falls apart. What remains is the story of a Reserve Bank that completely lost the plot and caused one of the most severe inflation outbreaks New Zealand has witnessed in recent decades.
Is this a record that warranted Governor Orr’s reappointment?
NZ’s Minister of Finance, Grant Robertson, obviously thought so. Just a week after Orr’s Russian fairy tales in parliament, Robertson reappointed Orr for another five-year term.
Dr Oliver Hartwich is the Executive Director of The New Zealand Initiative (www.nzinitiative.org.nz).
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June 13, 2023 3:28pm
- Swifty
  
  Facts.
  
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  June 13, 2023 4:08pm
- miltonF
  
  Great comments by Oliver. People who say the RBNZ is independent have got to be having a larf. So many smoking guns, like cutting to emergency OCR rate 0.25% and simultaneously inflating the currency supply by $50b WHILE shutting down the economy and restricting goods and services. That’s the perfect storm for an inflation crisis. The RBNZs actions have been so contrary to standard economic practice that it can only be explained by political interference. Grant and Orr will go down in history as “dumb and dumber” and that’s being kind. There’s a good argument their actions are for political and financial gain.
  
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  June 13, 2023 6:31pm
Swifty

I’ve noticed this bloke’s hyperbolic and flowery language before, but man he’s now just off the charts!

https://i.stuff.co.nz/opinion/132292878/the-idea-that-new-zealand-is-safe-from-russian-disinformation-is-an-enduring-fiction

Not a single fact, just extreme claim after extreme claim. Wading through his prose is like getting to the cow shed across a wet, boggy paddock.

The guy has missed his true calling as a Mills and Boon writer. I just can’t take him seriously.
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June 13, 2023 4:17pm
- Ghost
  
  It’s a side show to distract from labour government disinformation
  
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  June 13, 2023 4:19pm
Maggie Pie

What is interesting, my partner has just seen figures that show between 2018 and 2023, Labor has given NZME $12,507,766…..mainly for Maorification of the media.

Hard to see why NZME would want to see a change a government.
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June 13, 2023 4:20pm
Hugh Jarse

That New Zealand’s social cohesion is being pulled apart shouldn’t really be a surprise. A couple of examples. In the last 6 years we have been divided into different identify groups, some vilified and some promoted when once we were generally one population made up of a lot of different cultures. We were multi cultural, now bicultural.

We have had the name of the country changed unilaterally from New Zealand to either Aotearoa or Aotearoa New Zealand, take your pick. Some struggle to identify with these new country’s because they were never asked whether they wanted change or to what. It was done by stealth by this government and the media. That has damaged trust in those institutions we should be able to trust.

So in my view when looking for reasons for social cohesion being damaged, look no further than this government. While they may get tossed out on their arses in October, like good little activists they will pick up where they left off when they get re-elected.
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June 13, 2023 4:27pm
wreck1080

NZ Herald ramped up the campaign against National/Luxon in the last week.

Today alone, accusing him of double standards on Tesla cars/rebate, and the captured audio where he said NZ lost it’s mojo.

Herald were also attacking Luxon about his possible theoretical views on abortion and trying to pin the USA abortion situation directly to him. That was having a go at his religious beliefs too.

Herald has gone nuts, so I cancelled my subscription.

Stuff are still atrocious though, just slightly less atrocious as they maybe realise their woke nonsense was repelling the majority of the nation.
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June 13, 2023 4:42pm
Maggie Pie

Well, butter my butt and call me a muffin.

Turns out the unwashed trans-activist who violently assaulted the 72 year old lady in Albert Park had received Diversion, hence his non appearance yesterday!!

It’s not what you know…..
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June 13, 2023 5:09pm
- kevn
  
  Soft co*k result. Keeping those crime stats tidy eh… as per instructions.
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:11pm
- Swifty
  
  I think it’s a pretty high bar to get diversion for assault. A mate got it once, years back, and it was a bit of a mission as I recall.
  
  At least the old lady basher will have had to admit to the assault to qualify for diversion and perform a good deed.
  
  It does seem a little odd that you get your assault (assuming you record is clean to date) for free in that it will not appear on your record.
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:15pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  NZ Herald reporting the story..
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/posie-parker-protest-young-man-accused-of-punching-elderly-woman-granted-diversion/UK6SUZYJVJDMJJMJRP5ZCJNODQ/
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:34pm
kevn

Silence from kiri allan about the gang takeover in Opotiki. It is her ‘turf’ as such.
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June 13, 2023 5:10pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  They are all cuzzies.
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:22pm
- Ghost
  
  I like Kiri, a good minister so I’m going to defend her.
  
  I’m pretty sure that Kiri is currently writing a pretty strongly worded email asking the gang to please behave……
  
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  June 13, 2023 5:53pm
Swifty

Satire my arse:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/132302493/the-hoax-letter-sent-by-an-activist-granny-thinly-veiled-defence-of-satire

This was a deliberate attempt to disrupt other people going about their lawful business. She hasn’t got a leg to stand on.

If she had clearly marked her letters as ‘not to be taken seriously’ or similar then she would have a case. But she chose not to do that. Everything points to her attempting for those letters to be taken seriously and as legitimate.

Let her off this and it’s a green light to others to engage in this holier than thou civil disruption and disturbance, at the cost of those targeted.
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June 13, 2023 5:35pm
kevn

tom cog tells us breathlessly in the horrid how Luxon almost got to ‘get’ a Tesla. Then changed his mind… the shock horror of it all. Yawn.
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June 13, 2023 5:44pm
Ghost

Wondered when they would do this

Fox News has sent a “case and desist” letter to Tucker Carlson, after the former Fox host racked up a combined 169 million combined views in his first two episodes of his show on Twitter, Axios reports.

Article
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June 13, 2023 6:17pm
- kevn
  
  @Ghost… Musk will win.
  
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  June 13, 2023 6:34pm
- [email protected]
  
  I suspect that Elon Musk will cover the legal bills for Tucker Carlson if FOX takes Tucker Carlson to court.
  
  Fox might not like the world to know about some of the things that would come out in a trial during the discovery phase.
  
  I like Tucker Carlson and hope he’s got some serious security.
  
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  June 13, 2023 7:12pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Apparently the Fox Contract doesn’t have Twitter on the Non Compete List as at the time Fox didn’t consider Twitter a competitive broadcast platform.
  Carlson is not being paid by Twitter so his argument is he is practicing Free Speech.
  ‘View’ numbers are deceptive. A View means its been seen in someone’s feed. Its probably 20% of that which actually watch him, which at 33 million is still huge.
  
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  June 13, 2023 7:13pm
Swifty

Warms the cockles of your heart….

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/immigration-nz-denies-asylum-to-man-convicted-of-sex-assault-and-counterfeiting-cash/PAUIKVYQEBANXDRMRPREHNS6TE/

Bye!
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June 13, 2023 6:18pm
Tom Barker

I wonder whether Trump will have to share a cell with a Proud Boy.
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June 13, 2023 6:21pm
- Swifty
  
  Would you like to be in between them?
  
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  June 13, 2023 6:42pm
Swifty

“We never fished there but we might do in future, but even if we don’t you still gotta pay us….”

https://i.stuff.co.nz/environment/132307610/government-faces-dilemma–and-a-court-battle–over-ocean-sanctuary

Pay us now thank you.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8L4HHPTiZN8&pp=ygUPRnVjayB5b3UgcGF5IG1l
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June 13, 2023 6:30pm
Maggie Pie

OPEN LETTER to nasty trans & KiwiBank NZ’er-of-the-Year Sheneen Lal…..

https://twitter.com/MatuaOutcast/status/1668088998047408128
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June 13, 2023 7:02pm
kevn

he/she/whatever must have friends in high places to allow the same modus operandi.
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June 13, 2023 7:35pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Wow, Luxon has had his cojones stitched back on. Impressed with this interview.
Keep this up and he might restore my faith in National.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/what-return-has-that-money-generated-luxon-slams-govt-after-pgf-reset-catches-attention-of-watchdog/ar-AA1cvrF5
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June 14, 2023 4:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Kari Lake as VPOTUS? I am not sure. She is smart enough. DeSantis? Ron is better off looking after Miami. His turn will come for sure – in 2028.
What’s that noise? Dem heads exploding?
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/army-of-supporters-follow-donald-trump-to-miami-as-court-appearance-looms/ar-AA1ctphX
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June 14, 2023 4:29pm
- Ghost
  
  Robert Kennedy is taking Trump supporters, and doing well
  
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  June 14, 2023 4:39pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Did not see any of flags/banners mentioning Kennedy.
    I must try harder.
    
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    June 14, 2023 5:06pm

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