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August 25, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 25 August 2023

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Scott

Donald Trump is about to be arrested for allegedly trying to over turn the results of the 2020 election in the so-called sedition of January 6. The capital riots have been reported as an attempt by Trump supporters to overturn the election and an act of sedition.
But here is an interesting summary of what actually happened on January 6 focusing on one particular actor – Ray Epps.

https://youtu.be/dkFfATBy0cw?si=uIc5VFq-cEVRvrfk

Ray Epps is filmed telling everyone to go into the capital. He appears to be a ringleader. He is on video going through the first security barrier and he goes through the second barrier. After the “riots” he sends a message to his nephew that “he orchestrated it”.
Despite all of this Ray Epps has not been charged with any crime and is a free man. Given that people who seem to do far less are still in prison for the events of January 6, one wonders why was he not prosecuted?

It seems that Ray Epps was likely a federal agent? Under oath an FBI representative when questioned by Sen Ted Cruz about whether Ray Epps was a federal agent, said she couldn’t answer that question. If Epps was not a federal agent why did she not say that?

It seems the authorities have admitted there were eight federal agents in the crowd on January 6. According to the video above there may have been 40 federal agents? If there were so many federal agents is it possible that they incited the capital riots and incited people to do what they would not otherwise have done? I would say this is likely. In another incident it appears that the FBI and other authorities entrapped people to plan a kidnapping against Gov Gretchen Whitmer. They got them to plan what they otherwise would not have planned.

Ray Epps is a symbol of the two tiers of justice that currently exist in the United States. If you are on the Democrat side it’s all good. If you are a Trump supporter you can expect to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and beyond.

Ray Epps is also a symbol of the Democrats and their allies in the FBI and the Justice Department that are determined to stop Trump at any cost
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August 25, 2023 8:00am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  What is never reported is the infiltration of the Trump rally was on social media 2 weeks before Jan 6th. Pelosi knew, Trump knew. Trump wanted 22,000 National Guard Troops for security. Pelosi refused. 10,000 Troops and she still refused.
  Pelosi knew it was going to get nasty. Even helped her daughter setting her up to video it all.
  10,000 Troops would have stopped it in it’s tracks. Fact checkers say the request for Troops is false. Note, they write items about the false claim but it is all wild goose chases, naming other people that say false. The TDS is strong. Troop request was real.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:42am
  - RichardX
    
    Troop request was real.
    
    Neither you or Trump saying it was real makes it real.
    
    Provide evidence, other than it’s true because Trump said it’s true, that Trump requested troops prior to Jan 6.
    
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    August 25, 2023 11:11am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I would if I could, but the internet google thingy has been scrubbed.
      Might try Duck duck go.
      
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      August 25, 2023 12:03pm
      - RichardX
        
        I would if I could, but the internet google thingy has been scrubbed.
        
        Provide evidence the ” internet google thingy has been scrubbed.”
        
        Very Trumpian of you to tell new lies in support of previous lies.
        
        Have you considered that the reason you are unable to provide evidence is that the claim is false?
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:25pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Richard accusing another of being a liar without his own evidence, only his assertion – what a twat.
        
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        August 25, 2023 2:13pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        @ Don.
        It gets to a stage where Richard is trying to confuse. I don’t know why.
        Best ignored. I sent a message telling him where to go. Mods removed it, fair enough.
        Richard is trying to prove he is the smartest one on this blog. Fine, he can think that.
        
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        August 25, 2023 4:08pm
      - RichardX
        
        Not the smartest on the blog Otto, just more interested in evidence for assertions than some.
        
        Was your deleted comment telling me you were not going to engage with me….for the 4th time?
        
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        August 25, 2023 5:44pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        “Very Trumpian of you ”
        
        Oh dear.
        
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        August 25, 2023 7:40pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Watch the interview with the ex Chief of Capital Police
      
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      August 25, 2023 12:31pm
      - RichardX
        
        The ex Chief of Capitol Police does not make the claim Trump requested troops which is the claim Steve has made many times.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:35pm
      - Ghost
        
        The only thing I’ve ever been able to find is
        
        According to Miller’s testimony, Trump asked during that meeting whether the District of Columbia’s mayor had requested National Guard troops for Jan. 6, the day Congress was to ratify Joe Biden’s presidential election victory.
        
        Trump told Miller to “fill” the request, the former defense secretary testified. Miller said Trump told him: “Do whatever is necessary to protect demonstrators that were executing their constitutionally protected rights.”
        
        Article
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:37pm
      - RichardX
        
        Miller’s testimony refutes Otto’s claim and has been offered to him previously.
        
        Otto still prefers his version of 2 requests for troops by Trump with Pelosi denying the request.
        
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        August 25, 2023 1:07pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Here you go Richard
        ‘Retired U.S. Army Lt. Gen. Keith Kellogg said last week that former President Donald Trump did in fact request National Guard troops be deployed in Washington D.C. before the breach of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021. Kellogg said he was present at the time of Trump’s request, and Congress should release his testimony to the public.’
        https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/08/gen-kellogg-trump-did-request-natl-guard-troops-on-jan-6th-asks-congress-to-release-his-testimony/
        
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        August 25, 2023 3:37pm
      - RichardX
        
        Thanks AoR.
        
        That is certainly more than “Trump said so” and it would be good to know if there was a valid reason to discount the testimony.
        
        Shame Pelosi denying the request is still not proven.
        
        Otto may have been half right.
        
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        August 25, 2023 5:40pm
      - RichardX
        
        Turns out someone is lying.
        
        I had a look at the published transcript of Kellogg’s deposition.
        
        It does not support the comments he made in the interview to which you linked.
        
        https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-J6-TRANSCRIPT-CTRL0000034610/pdf/GPO-J6-TRANSCRIPT-CTRL0000034610.pdf
        
        From page 49
        
        Q So we understand that Ms. Pierson may have met with President Trump and Max Miller on January 4th at the White House where the President discussed the need for 10,000 National Guard troops for the rally on January the 6th.Are you familiar with that meeting?
        
        A No
        
        Q Did you ever talk to the President about having National Guard troops at — on standby or available for January 6th?
        
        A No. And the reason I say no is I was thinking rally hard,.. In the entire 5 years, we had never had a need for extra police or National Guard at any rallies we’d had had in 5 years. We never had a single issue with a rally in 5 years. So there was no reason for me to have said that because I had never seen that needed.
        
        It goes on and on from there.
        
        Worth a read.
        
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        August 25, 2023 6:07pm
      - RichardX
        
        I guess Kellogg could be like Miller and prepared to say one thing to the media but not the same thing while under oath.
        
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        August 25, 2023 6:13pm
      - RichardX
        
        Turns out Otto isn’t even half right.
        
        Kellogg states Trump asked for troops on Jan 6.
        
        Not that Trump made more than 1 request prior to Jan 6, which were refused by Pelosi as Otto continues to claim.
        
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        August 25, 2023 6:48pm
    - Lee C
      
      https://www.bizpacreview.com/2023/08/11/capitol-police-chief-tells-tucker-what-really-happened-on-jan-6th-in-riveting-hour-1385736/
      
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      August 25, 2023 6:24pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Why two downticks? Two with TDS!!
        
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        August 26, 2023 9:27am
- Che Guava
  
  It’s not Dems v GOP, that’s just a completely fake soap opera staged to prevent people really seeing and understanding what’s behind the curtain.
  
  The true dynamic is Dems & GOP v anyone who steps out of the agreed line and attempts to change anything.
  
  Donald Trump’s only crime is that he stepped out of line and attempted to change things and, even worse for the Establishment, he is extremely popular among Americans who are getting screwed over by an elite that detests them.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:29am
  - mawm
    
    So it’s a bit like NZ currently.
    
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    August 25, 2023 2:07pm
    - thirteenstars
      
      Indeed.
      
      Those with raging TDS who salivate over every attack on Trump should realise that the co-governance bandwagon, the corrupt media and the rent-seeking bureaucracy now fomenting a revolution in NZ, when they finally get their way, will make the persecution of Trump look a dainty Anglican picnic by comparison. But at heart they will be the same thing: the weaponisation of the law to destroy political opponents.
      
      Live by the sword, die by the sword.
      
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      August 25, 2023 3:31pm
Warren

Jenna Lynch : Luxon has a major hypocrisy problem for failing to adhere to his own standards.
Well this coming from someone that does hypocrisy like Vladimir Putin trys to kill her enemies off to reap the benefits from the Goverment that pays her wages because her employers can’t meet the bills, so the need to beg the Government to help them out.
Then you have the Prime Minister’s situation with his sick child that is in hospital and while I’m a firm believer in leaving people’s family out of politics I wonder why as the media have no scruples in what they perceive as fair game ,( Chris Luxon ) I can not fathom out why the media have not taken Chris Hipkins to task on his sick child as most would say this has been played for the sympathy vote to help Labour claw back some of the votes it has lost by stupidity.
But most would say you can’t kill the goose that lays the golden egg or you can’t bite the hand that feeds you.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/jenna-lynch-analysis-christopher-luxon-has-a-major-hypocrisy-problem-for-failing-to-sack-tim-van-de-molen-for-contempt-of-parliament.html
The media and Labour have decided to fight this Election with filth but many will see they are out of their depth with no-where to go with dirty politics left as their only choice.
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August 25, 2023 8:01am
- Paulus
  
  Isn’t Jenna Lynch in association with somebody in a current Political Party – no, certainly not National .
  She should review her body language when having a go at Luxon.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:53am
  - Close Hen Counters
    
    I might be wrong but I thought I read from another KB entry she is engaged to the president of the ACT party? Not Seymour though – another bloke
    
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    August 25, 2023 12:13pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    The animus is in full view, isn’t it? I wouldn’t mind playing poker with these cheerleaders. They don’t have any problem lying, but it’s written all over their face and body language.
    
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    August 25, 2023 12:15pm
- Yabster
  
  I think the more the likes of Lynch mob tries to dig up dirt on National/Act the better for the right- most now know how pathetic and biased and irrelevant the msm are.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:57am
Dougal10

It’s very noticable that no media outlets have picked up the labour cash for articles scam at tvnz and red radio. We know they also used to do this through the likes of housing nz as well. Is this so wide spread that all nz media are in on the money splash .
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August 25, 2023 8:03am
- Yabster
  
  Yep desperately trying to cover it up- obvs the likes of Stuff won’t cover it.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:58am
Surely Knott

“Vivek Grabs the spotlight” the Herald reports on the Republican GOP debate.

Vivek “started to throw elbows” and said “I’m the only person on the stage who isn’t bought and paid for”

So they report a comment that smears all Republican candidates, but they leave out what he was referring to and what he said next, which is “So I’m going to say it. Climate change is a scam and a wet blanket on the US economy.”
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August 25, 2023 8:06am
- Che Guava
  
  I thought the most striking and bizarre thing is that Asha Hutchinson, a man hoping to run for POTUS, had a prominent foreign flag on his lapel. Even Trump, “Mr Russian Collusion/foreign influence,” didn’t have a foreign flag on his lapel in 2016.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:39am
Matt Long

Yesterday there was a comment that New Zealand couldn’t hope to compete with Australia because of our lack of mineral resources, I couldn’t find the study but I saw somewhere that NZ natural resources compare favourably with Australia, our problem is moronic rules that prevent us making best use of them.
Also New Zealand’s productivity per hour worked is one third less than Australia’s, there’s no way we can compete with that handicap.
Such is our lack of productivity that a presenter yesterday told us Huntly can source Indonesian coal at one third the cost of digging it from the ground on which the power plant sits.
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August 25, 2023 8:08am
- David Garrett
  
  Matt: Ah yes, but then it is foreign coal causing all those nasty climate changing emissions!
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:12am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Burning Indonesian coal in New Zealand counts against New Zealand emissions obligations, exactly the same as if Huntly burned New Zealand coal. Makes no difference.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:15am
    - David Garrett
      
      Bene: I am being facetious Sir….you are usually much sharper!
      
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      August 25, 2023 8:21am
    - cmm
      
      There’s where it gets stupid.
      Why does the chain only stop at Huntly?
      If the electricity generated in Huntly, using foreign coal is then used to pump water on a dairy farm to make milk that is exported and consumed in Mexico then why is it not part of Mexico’s emissions?
      
      Ditto all our “farming emissions”.
      
      It’s all just an accountant’s wet dream.
      
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      August 25, 2023 8:33am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Because the UNFCCC has accounting rules that determine how emissions are measured. Emissions are the obligation of countries in which there is a production process that produces emissions. For example Australia exports coal to Japan. When Japan burns that coal, Japan is responsible for the emissions.
        
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        August 25, 2023 8:39am
      - David George
        
        Yes, our farms harvest CO2 from the atmosphere that is locked into meat, dairy, fruit etc.
        The consumers of said produce release the CO2 when they eat it. We (NZ) are, therefore, already “Net Zero”. No?
        Not sure how “we” managed to screw this up but we’re getting a very raw deal out of this BS.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:00am
      - cmm
        
        BY: Exactly. It’s all accounting.
        The determination of the rules is not based on reality. It is based on what some activists decided.
        
        If NZ is generating some extra CO2 to make milk that Mexico consumes, then why should that really be seen as NZ’s problem?
        
        Ditto Chinese industry making stuff for elsewhere.
        
        If you look at farming in NZ (and many other countries), farmers are pointed to as evil green house gas producers, but in reality they are using photosynthesis to extract carbon from the atmosphere and turn it into food. Farmers should be counted as carbon sinks, not as producers.
        
        These accountants are pushing an agenda. They are not based in reality.
        
        Like pretty much everything that starts with UNxxx these lot should be run through the shredder.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:03am
      - Yvette
        
        And amongst all this, is it not true that New Zealand coal could be cleaner burning than that from Indonesia? Less emissions – less cost?
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:12am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “It is based on what some activists decided.”
        
        No the rules around counting emissions were not determined by accountants or activists. They were determined by officials from all the governments.
        
        New Zealand was instrumental in negotiations around agricultural and forestry emissions over many years, led by delegations of officials from the then Ministry of Agriculture and the Ministry of Forestry. The negotiatons lasted several years prior to the start of the Kyoto Protocol in 2008.
        
        So the current rules around emissions counting have not been imposed on New Zealand by some activists. The New Zealand government endorsed these rules, and in the case of agriculture and forestry emissions, New Zealand officials led the way.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:15am
      - cmm
        
        Oh come on BY: “Officials from all governments”…… who are activists!
        
        Who do you think were the officials from governments who put this together and negotiate it? It’s Climate Change Ministers and their entourages (ie. jets full of James Shaw types and their mobs who zoom off to exotic locations to make these deals).
        
        Where are the chemists and physicists who cut out all the nonsense and focus on the facts?
        
        Where are the people pointing out that photosynthesis extracts carbon from the atmosphere and makes it into food?
        
        Why is cutting down a forest and burning it for biomass considered carbon neutral, but a similar cycle involving farming and food is the most evil thing out?
        
        It’s all bullshit. Just because it is government endorsed bullshit does not make it less bullshit.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:33am
      - Jack5
        
        Matt Long’s …I saw somewhere that NZ natural resources compare favourably with Australia …
        
        Matt was probably misled a few years ago when Brash wrongly said something on those lines.
        
        Brash wasn’t trying to say NZ had the same land minerals as Australia, which has about 30 times NZ’s area.
        
        Brash was misled by a report about minerals on the sea floor of NZ’s ocean economic zone. He was misled because the report was talking about about sea-floor hydrates as an energy source to rival oil. (It wasn’t talking about manganese or fertiliser nodules.)
        
        There is no economic way to extract usable energy from the hydrates, and they are present also in quantity near and beside the big potential markets in Asia, Europe, and America. NZ’s sea-floor hydrates at present are of zero potential value.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:36am
      - bjools
        
        I would say that here is where it is stupid.
        https://www.climatecommission.govt.nz/public/Advice-to-govt-docs/ICCC-technical-appendix-8-carbon-sequestration-on-farms.pdf
        From the doc.
        However, currently only post-1989 forests are eligible for units under the NZ ETS. They also need to:
         be larger than 1 ha in area
         reach at least 5m in height when mature
         have a tree crown cover of forest species of more than 30 percent in each hectare and
        be wider than 30m.
        So
        gorse covered hill in your suburb don’t count
        Council parks don’t count
        Trees on road side berms , don’t count
        Trees in your garden don’t count
        Farm shelter belts don’t count
        Do our Kauri forests count? (pre 1989)
        Do orchard and vineyards count?
        But they use CO2 to grow, and they DO grow.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:48am
      - I remember when
        
        Sorry Yvette
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:54am
      - Spam
        
        The on-farm emissions are counted against New Zealand’s emissions. BUT – it would be fair(er) if the CO2 locked-up in the milk (as carbohydrates) could used as an offset.
        
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        August 25, 2023 10:05am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        I can’t comment on the efficacy of the accounting rules. Beyond my expertise. However the body that negotiated the agricultural accounting rules was chock full of agricultural scientists.
        
        https://unfccc.int/process/bodies/subsidiary-bodies/sbsta
        
        As was the New Zealand delegations, at least in the period from 1999 through to 2005.
        
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        August 25, 2023 10:23am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Which is why Saudi doesn’t have emissions problems the size of Mt Everest
      
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      August 25, 2023 9:51pm
- Simon
  
  By any measure NZ is behind Aust. It’s like compound interest. A 2% pa account is going to fall steadily against a 6% account
  
  NZ is finished as a normal place to live long term. The garbage from Wellington is too overwhelming. As NZ is just now an economic unit with society farmed as much as possible by borg.govt.nz extract as much as you legally can from NZ and plan to head overseas.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:17am
  - mawm
    
    Don’t get your hopes up, Australia and every other Western country is doing their darnest to follow the same trend downwards.
    
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    August 25, 2023 2:16pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  I did not claim that New Zealand could not “compete against Australia”. I simply stated that proven and extractable mineral reserves in Australia dwarf such reserves in New Zealand.
  
  No I have not cited a comparative study. I am relying on what I know about the sheer size and diversity of the Australian extractive industries.
  
  https://www.ga.gov.au/education/classroom-resources/minerals-energy/australian-mineral-facts
  
  I stand to be corrected by any credible evidence to the contrary. 🙂
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:20am
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    The sum total of our natural resources, including minerals, farmland, water, fisheries, and so on, is quite generous for our population size. I have no idea how it compares to Australia but it’s more than enough. Our problem is governments trying to stop people using those resources to generate income.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:26am
    - cmm
      
      Agreed, they are large for our size (both population and geographic).
      
      Size matters. It brings down costs and improves the reliability of the supply chain.
      
      The tiny coal trains taking coal to Lyttleton (and the tiny ships that can be served there) are extremely expensive per ton.
      
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      August 25, 2023 9:07am
  - Matt Long
    
    Australia certainly has scale in extractive industry. It’s pretty hard to compete with, which means NZ policy settings need to be better than theirs for us to enjoy a similar standard of living.
    2015 Treasury report citing World Bank study showing NZ ranks above Australia in Natural Capital per Capita than Australia.
    Economic and Financial Overview 2015 – The Treasury New Zealand https://treasury.govt.nz/sites/default/files/2010-04/nzefo-15.pdf
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:47am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Indeed. Singapore and Switzerland have literally no recoverable mineral reserves. They found other ways to be rich. New Zealand is finding ways to be poor. 😭 Simply because we are electing politicians who are doing that to us.
      
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      August 25, 2023 8:53am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        NZ is what it is today because of a lunatic socialist/communist.
        This all started in 2009 with that speech.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:09am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Sadly the choices of who to elect are stiflingly narrow in their scope.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:16am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        I dislike extreme comparisons, but I don’t think it’s too far of a stretch to suggest we’re heading down a similar path to Venezuela.
        
        It may surprise people to know that Venezuela has the highest oil reserves on the planet. Estimated just last year at 304 billion barrels (nudging Saudi Arabia’s 298 billion barrels into second place).
        
        Yet the way Venezuela has managed its staggering natural resource, especially compared to countries such as Saudi Arabia and Norway, is as much an indictment on corruption and mismanagement as it is on the underlying socialist ideology.
        
        New Zealand is being led at a rate of knots down this same path, and the current labour government’s efforts bear more than a passing resemblance to what happened, and is still happening, in “Little Venice”.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:49pm
- artemisia
  
  New Zealand has a massive EEZ. There’s a lot of seabed extraction going on around the world.
  
  Take your point about low productivity here though. Why?
  
  Oz company Trans Tasman Resources has been trying for years for consent to extract valuable iron sands from a small area well off the Taranaki coast. Multiple applications, and court cases brought. If their final appeal (Supreme Court) fails I guess they will take the ball and go home.
  
  Or it may be more accurate to say part of our pie growth has vaporised, along with other potential resource investors.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:32am
  - cjn
    
    Venezuala is also one of those very fortunate countries to be sanctioned by the USA for the sin of electing the wrong man.
    
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    August 25, 2023 4:46pm
- rockape
  
  West Coast gold could pay off Robertson’s debt.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:36am
  - All_on_Red
    
    And Gt Barrier and Coromandel Gold could create a Sovereign Fund for all NZers
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:52am
    - KiWombat
      
      Not to mention all the lithium we have here, more than sufficient to supply a home grown industry to supply electric vehicles, if only we were able to extract it !
      
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      August 25, 2023 9:09am
      - Yabster
        
        Lithium is huge in Aussie- multi billion dollar companies- even the explorers are worth half a billion- Kiwombat- what part of NZ do we have spodumene pegmatites?
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:27am
      - KiWombat
        
        Band from Taupo north to Coramandel – lithium salts in southern area to lithium feldspar in Coramandel. Also some feldspars in West Coast, but not as plentiful as North Island, nor as easy to extract !
        
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        August 25, 2023 10:04am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Not sure about Coromandel, but mining on Gt Barrier is a logistical nightmare which is why it was abandoned years ago. It was discussed again in 2010, Nikki Kaye went against the Party in opposing the idea.
      
      It earns more money as a tourist destination.
      
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      August 25, 2023 9:24am
      - Surely Knott
        
        “It earns more money as a tourist destination”
        
        Well it does for now. But even our Natural assets being used for tourism are heavily curtailed. The Waitakere Ranges Park 90% closed and even when open didn’t allow or cater for sports like Mountain biking like you’d see in every Canadian town. Where they encourage outdoor recreation. Coromandel the latest to have bits of it’s forest closed.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:51pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Then Robertson can get his arse out there and dig for it. A bit of real work would not do him any harm.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:19am
    - I remember when
      
      No Grant is looking as if his days are long and his exercise
      
      No Grant is looking as if his days are long and his exercise isn’t.
      
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      August 25, 2023 9:59am
  - Matt Long
    
    Woods putting a bit more boot in to mining in case people weren’t aware they’re BANANAs; build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything” (or “anyone”).
    https://www.interest.co.nz/public-policy/123896/government-passes-law-removing-any-obligation-promote-mining-industry-it
    
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    August 25, 2023 11:58am
- cmm
  
  Most minerals are not rare. Most can be found all over the globe.
  What is the limiting factor is being able to access them and bring them to market at a reasonable price.
  Those limitations are many:
  * Government regs.
  * Transport costs.
  * Reliability of the supply chain.
  * Amount that can be extracted.
  
  For example, South Africa has massive mineral wealth but struggles to bring them to market due to a collapsed rail infrastructure, dysfunctional ports and astoundingly low productivity.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:39am
  - artemisia
    
    The NZ company not allowed to mine seabed phosphate here identified rare earth minerals as a potential byproduct.
    
    Oh, phosphate is agri fertiliser. That we import in large quantities from the other side of the world. Makes perfect sense.//
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:50am
    - Jack5
      
      Is the NZ company “not allowed to mine” the sea-floor phosphate, or is it just locked out of the market?
      
      Existing phosphate processing, storage and distribution in NZ, sometimes owned by agricultural co-ops, own the facilities and are unlikely to allow their facilities to be used for competition with their imported-phosphate fertilisers.
      
      Sea-floor mining may also face opposition from the fishing industry, as well, of course, from the Greens.
      
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      August 25, 2023 11:09am
      - artemisia
        
        The NZ company is Chatham Rock Phosphate. A lot of info online. EPA turned down the application, there were objections from some groups, though the local iwi was Ok.
        
        The local phosphate is different from imported. And there are other issues with the imported (territorial).
        
        Believe the company will be appealing the EPA decision. Meanwhile they have offshore phosphate projects well under way in Oz and French Polynesia. Including selenium and rare earths.
        
        The Oz projects have support of Queensland Govt. Here, not so much.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:00pm
      - Matt Long
        
        Accessing the high quality phosphate nodules from the Chatham Rise was killed by the EPA in order to keep our status as a BANANA republic intact.
        Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything” (or “anyone”).
        The farmer coops exist to get fertiliser at the best cost possible for members.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:04pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  NO DIGGING! Ardern said so. Do as she said or else!
  Greens even want to stop gold mining in the Coromandel, but they don’t mind wearing gold wedding rings.
  Senseless. Almost everything we need or use comes out of the ground.
  Soon you won’t be allowed to dig your garden. Control freaks.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:39am
  - Blackbob
    
    They should tell that to the children working in cobalt mines to make EV batteries for ” No Emissions” cars.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:04am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      I have literally never heard any advocate for EVs in New Zealand even acknowledge the environmental impact of battery production.
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:28am
      - Jack5
        
        Steve Otto on the Greens: … but they don’t mind wearing gold wedding rings …
        
        The Greens are getting married? That means they are reproducing! 😲
        
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        August 25, 2023 11:14am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        Let alone the risks of battery transportation, and the enormous difficulty in safely disposing of them once they reach end of life.
        
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        August 25, 2023 12:57pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    That is a big difference in Australia. The two main political parties support the Australian mining and petroleum industries. So investors will happily sink billions in investment knowing that there is not going to be a crazy Prime Minister who cancels everything.
    
    Similarly there are no major disagreements on foreign policy and defence policy, including the alliance with the USA.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:35am
    - JimBobJoe
      
      Australian Labour supports mining and extraction because it gives them a huge honeypot of moolah to splurge when ever they get into power. They have a hard realistic attitude…
      
      NZ Labour on the other side are a bunch of idiots who have been busy killing the golden goose of what ever profit centres NZ has in its industries
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:44am
      - artemisia
        
        Talking about geese and golden eggs, it is noticeable that there are a lot of firms in the construction industry going under. Some big ones. That’s not so much trickle down as waterfall.
        
        The % of new builds in Trademe homes for sale has doubled in 18 months. From 10% to 20% approx.
        
        Behind every one of those unsold there’s a bank getting antsy and a business owner wondering when they’ll have to lay off the crews. Australia looking good.
        
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        August 25, 2023 2:48pm
- PeeJay
  
  I see the issue in three parts. First in relation to quantity, the second is location and the third is political.
  
  In terms of quantity, Australia has vast resources – as an example, read up on some of their projects on the North West Shelf in the north west of Western Australia – massive projects and easy to find information on. From the reading I’ve done (not exhaustive), NZ may have lots of resources available, but not to the same scale as Aussie does.
  
  The second part is location, and I think this is where things take a turn for the worst in NZ. Australia is blessed with resources in locations there are very few people living in. Remote doesn’t even come close to describing it. They are also relatively easy to extract. It’s had to get worried about a huge plant 1000’s of kilometres away – it’s not in your backyard, brings good jobs and you house price goes up – not a problem! NZ on the other hand, has the opposite problem – resources either tend to be close to population centres or leisure areas, or worse, in areas that are difficult to extract (off East Cape).
  
  The biggest issue though, I think, is political. In Aussie, both the Coalition and Labor support the resource industry – the Coalition are more supportive but Labor water down any of the nutbar stuff they propose in opposition once they are in power. They are really very similar in a lot of ways (they both support negative gearing of property for example). Unfortunately, in NZ, regardless of whether National would ever support a gungho drill-drill-drill policy (I don’t think they would given their current leadership), nobody would be interested due to Arderns captains call. Most projects take many years to come to fruition – this means you need a politically stable environment. The moment Ardern made her call, this effectively killed the resource extraction industry in NZ. No company will commit vast investment to a project that can be arbitrarily cancelled at the next election – or worse, when a flaky PM is heading offshore and wants some ‘feelz’ publicity.
  
  In short, it doesn’t really matter what provable resources we have in the ground – due to the above factors, but mostly political, I don’t really see this ever being a viable industry again.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:04am
  - artemisia
    
    Location – I mentioned iron sands and phosphate. Both based on research and costs v benefits.
    
    Ready to go if ever allowed. Until the expertise and investment says bye.
    
    As is said, capital flows where it’s wanted but only stays if it’s cherished.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:50am
  - Skippytony
    
    Fundamentally, NZ has voted to keep the resources in the ground and be poor but maybe principled. Thats the decision thats been made over and over again. Sacrifice wealth, jobs and productivity for the protection of the environment.
    Thats it, over time, we just get poorer and poorer.
    
    For example, what is the likelihood of another large scale hydro dam ever getting built in NZ? Answer Zero. Who is going to invest literally millions going through the consenting process to open a new mine when some clown can just come along and make a captains call and put a red line through the project?
    What just happened to the big aquaculture proposals for the Foveaux straight? Create 100s of jobs in an economically depressed area, earn foreign exchange? Nah, pass bro….
    There are literally dozens of these examples. Don’t dredge Lyttleton Harbour it might upset the Hectors. So we will trade a productive port, stop bigger more efficient ships coming in to protect a few dolphins.
    Who is going to buy land for perfectly legal housing developments when the government steps in and effectively nationalises your property at the behest of a third party? Lets really put the stake through the heart of it, lets give Iwi the right of veto over planning decisions.
    Wonder why the productivity is so low in NZ? Its because, in large part, there is a deep ideological bias that drives capital and productive investment away. Its just not rational to invest.
    Its not one big decision its the hundreds of small and medium decisions that do the damage over time.
    It is the simple mindset of refusing to honestly consider the trade offs. Its very easy to make a captains call about perfectly legal mining leases when its not your capital and investment plans that are at risk.
    This is the New Zealand people here have voted for, time and time again.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:55am
  - cmm
    
    I agree with pretty much everything, except: “The biggest issue though, I think, is political”
    
    Politics is a feedback cycle. The politicians only have those policies because that is what the voters choose.
    
    Ask any of our mainstream politicians what they think and all they will do is refer to the polling and tell you what the pollsters tell them the public want.
    
    If NZers were pro mining then all our major political parties would be pro mining too.
    
    Andern could only get away with it because that’s what her supporters wanted.
    
    We, as a whole, get the parties we choose. We are not victims to the parties that are available.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:59am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Not sure i agree. If you start telling kids at primary school that the earth is being destroyed by manmade emissions, that mining, logging, industry, capitalism, employers, landlords, business owners etc are bad and evil.
      
      These kids never here an alternative viewpoint until their late teens, and every time they do, those alternative views are characterised as “Far Right”, or “Neo liberal” or “racist” or whatever insult is currently fashionable.
      
      Then it isn’t terribly surprising that low information voters will vote for exactly the policies they have been programmed to support.
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:52am
  - I remember when
    
    Smaller quantities also make the cost of shipping marginal for the transport industry.
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:07am
- thirteenstars
  
  Natural resources are not the problem. Japan is a nation severely lacking in natural resources with 125 million people on a mountainous island chain only a bit larger than NZ yet it’s the third wealthiest country on Earth.
  
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  August 25, 2023 3:38pm
G152

Wow. So Parliament went all out on that terrible National member who had the cheek to stand near a liebor party member and say naughty words.
A good thing indeed that a liebor party member would never confront a national party member and punch them and become the Speaker of the House.
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August 25, 2023 8:09am
- Paulus
  
  Do I understand that it was not the offended Labour member who complained but a Labour List woman who said she saw it all – there were no physicals as they were one metre apart apparently.
  What was it that was said that upset Van Molen ?
  Just another Labour shit stir in desperation for the many who will lose their jobs shortly.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:02am
- I remember when
  
  Michael Wood’s shares and his actions were clearly visible.
  Tim van de Molen’s actions were a question of personal opinions.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:11am
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  And Mega-Fightery got hands on with a staffer, and was said to have left bruises from grabbing at them, and got to hang around until she chose to jump ships.
  But standing over/looming over a seated person is ‘threatening behaviour’ and very serious. I do agree that it is not professional or appropriate, but the minimising of or maximising of offenses becomes dishonest.
  A bit like a hug can be ‘akin to rape’ depending on the interests of the speaker/Speaker.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:49am
- jon
  
  The seasoned credible Barry Soper sounded rather dismissive of this episode on ZB adding he had seen worse in his years of reporting at parliament. Suspect too many sensitive, esp younger souls out there who need to toughen up.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:50am
Kiwiguy

I’ve been filling out one of those mandatory Stats NZ Business Surveys.

There were the typical eye-roll questions I expected to see these days relating to whether we were a Maori business or not, etc.

But then there was this one:

“In the last financial year, estimate the % of employees who participated in the following types of training:”

Amongst the training options was: “Treaty Of Waitangi training. ”

WTF does the TOW training have to do with my business, or any business??

The whole ToW thing is becoming so insidious and divisive. It’s been completely manipulated and re-interpreted by modern-day activists/elites. The whole thing should be scrapped.
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August 25, 2023 8:10am
- leoj
  
  Yet Luxon and the Nats are not interested in ACT’s referendum.
  
  It’s no wonder that many do not see that much difference between Labour and National, except the pale blue tie.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:05am
- Loddenthinks
  
  May I suggest a better solution – simply chuck it in the bin. Don’t engage, don’t reply, completely ignore their follow-ups, their threats that it’s a legal requirement and you’ll be breaking the law if you don’t.
  
  I’ve been doing that for my business for 15 years. Originally we complied and filled them out, which only encouraged them to send more frequent requests, and eventually I got sick of it and told my Business Manager not to complete them any more.
  
  She gave me the reminders, follow-ups and threats with a bit of trepidation, but I just said ignore them and they’ll go away, which they did. After a few years our company seems to come up again, and each time I ignore, refuse to engage and carry on as usual.
  
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  August 25, 2023 1:03pm
- Ghost
  
  Did all your employees have Waitangi Day off? If so that was their treaty training.
  
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  August 25, 2023 1:08pm
Taieri

Are there any adults in charge?

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/raft-speed-reductions-proposed-city

Don’t these people understand the purpose of transport?
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August 25, 2023 8:11am
Matt Long

A tale of two valedictories, Ian McKelvie asks Ministers to own problems and not blame their predecessors, Muller casts shade.
Thanks for the Jacinda years Todd.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/resigning-national-mps-give-final-speeches-in-parliament-dont-hide-from-the-problem/KYSCEOCVJVD5LFXHRGU7IKMDGA/
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/todd-muller-bows-out-with-plea-for-climate-action-and-more-co-operation-between-national-and-labour/OX4COMMLCVFF7EUF3WB4D6XDRM/
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August 25, 2023 8:14am
- Chuck Bird
  
  Muller should have been in the Green Party.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:16am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Mr Muller will be the next Jim Bolger. Rolled out by the next Labour/Greens government to defend their socialist policies.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:38am
  - All_on_Red
    
    More like Social Credit
    I bet he knows the words to ‘Kumbaya’
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:13am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I didn’t think he was that mad, just not a leader.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:24am
- Matt Long
  
  Also valedictories from our BLM minister, and green matrons Logie and Sage. Watch out Ecan or Christchurch Council divisive tougher incoming.
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2023-green-mps-jan-logie-eugenie-sage-and-labours-poto-williams-give-valedictory-speeches/S4CU7HRN7VH5RPFYEYT7RE5TME/
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:18am
  - pdm
    
    Matt – maybe he will turn up there at the 2026 election.
    
    As a pale, stale, male he will probably need to cut off an arm or a leg to qualify for selection.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:23am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Did you read the bit about Poto joking about a cattle prod and David Seymour?
    
    15 1
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    August 25, 2023 9:00am
    - jon
      
      Chuck, am sure the outrage from the media will be forthcoming today over the threats of violence contained in Poto’s joke! Yea right!
      
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      August 25, 2023 11:00am
  - Matt Long
    
    One thing I will say for Poto, she does claim to have confronted Willie Jackson for his disgusting on air comments about victims of sexual abuse. Sounds like not many in Labour did.
    I saw recently that some states in America have introduced laws requiring porn sites to get legal ID proving users are over 18 before they have access. I wonder if the roastbusters would have been less likely to offend if they weren’t influenced by online porn.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:13am
    - sirknz
      
      What could go wrong with having legal ID tied to a porn site? It’s not like it would be a magnet for hackers to use as blackmail in the future. It would be a matter of when, not if, a hack would succeed.
      
      You don’t need a legal ID for pretty much any other website that is used by the masses.
      
      For what it is worth, I think that the porn industry is pretty heinous but parents need to be better equipped to restrict access to them, not the state mandating that everyone signs in to it.
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:44am
      - Che Guava
        
        Sexual “liberation” is a form of political control. Give people free access to porn, hyper-sexualise the culture in general, repudiate past norms of moral behaviour and pretty soon you’ve everyone in a post-coital state of abject submission.
        
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        August 25, 2023 11:49am
- Benedict Yu
  
  That speech by Todd Muller is utterly depressing. What were National MPs thinking making him leader?
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:41am
  - kowtow
    
    There must be a bigly story behind the Bridges coup and no one wants to tell it.
    
    All very very strange.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:46am
    - Dougal10
      
      Collins collins collins
      
      4 1
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      August 25, 2023 9:49am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    You need to ask Mathew Hooton
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:08am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  The Nats need to ask themselves how someone as clueless and as glass-jawed as Muller got to be leader of the party.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:31am
  - Mark Hanley
    
    and how did Muller get promoted to Fonterra’s Group Director of Co-operative Affairs?
    
    Muller (a thoroughly nice chap) took me on a tour of parliament when I attended my daughter’s award ceremony.
    
    When Muller became National leader, I mentioned to my wife that I didn’t see any clues Muller had an intellect worthy of National Party Leadership and I questioned how he became a director at Fonterra.
    
    Turns out my assessment was correct.
    
    I still wonder what is going on at Fonterra. Given the importance to NZ, are Fonterra recruiting and promoting people with the required skills?
    
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    August 25, 2023 12:49pm
    - Dougal10
      
      You have to remember that fonterra is a merger of 2 milk co-ops and the nz dairy board. I suggest that muller would have fitted into the dairy board side . I think he may have come out of zespri first, all of which shows him to be a socialist.
      
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      August 25, 2023 6:17pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  yup, a bad egg. Weak, vain and arrogant. Good riddance Muller.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:54am
  - mawm
    
    “Weak, vain and arrogant” – sadly that could be used to describe so many that inhabit the Bee Hive.
    
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    August 25, 2023 2:33pm
Kiwiguy

So NZ Taxpayers paid the Helen Clark foundation $400 Million:
https://twitter.com/jumbypassmore/status/1694397561241747796

Then Helen Clark matches donations to Labour, to the tune of $400k.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2023-helen-clark-backed-labour-donation-drive-hits-400k-in-a-week/OMRAK7KFNNHWVEWII2MZ3HWJIA/

So we, the taxpayer, have ended up funding Labour’s election campaign.

Very clever.
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August 25, 2023 8:15am
- Ghost
  
  I believe you may have meant $40 million. But the claim needs evidence, not just Twitter posts. You’d also need to provide evidence that the foundation paid her donation and not her
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:53am
  - Kiwiguy
    
    Thanks for the correction re the $40m.
    Does H1 draw a salary from that Foundation?
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:27am
    - Ghost
      
      She’s a multi millionaire. And this donation isn’t even her, it is from a group of people that she is part of.
      
      From the article you linked
      
      And in just over 24 hours since Clark announced she was part of the group of “fund-matchers”, the party raised nearly $270,000.
      
      It is currently unclear how much Clark, who was Prime Minister from 1999 until 2008, will be contributing but if it is above $20,000 – as with any others – it will be required to be reported publicly by the party within 10 working days.
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:37am
      - Kiwiguy
        
        Thanks for the clarification.
        
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        August 25, 2023 11:54am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING NOW

Just watching the live-stream of ’45’ on his way to Atlanta.

Donald Trump supporters gather near the Fulton County Jail ahead of the former presidents expected arrival to surrender to authorities…..
“The indictment is a bunch of bullshit!”
“They should make Trump the king. KING TRUMP”

https://twitter.com/carrieksada/status/1694791227374457187
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August 25, 2023 8:18am
- Inandout
  
  Oh Maggie, that T shirt says it all, and with the famous N.
  
  6 0
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  August 25, 2023 8:39am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    He has “left the plantation”
    Saying by Candace Owens.
    
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    August 25, 2023 12:26pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Proud man.
  My name is “Niggas 4 Trump 2024”
  
  6 1
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  August 25, 2023 9:31am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Im no Trump supporter but IMHO it was a smart move to be interviewed by Tucker Carlson rather than turn up at the first Debate. The Debate was a lack lustre affair. Desantis didnt do well. Pence did OK as did the new bloke Ramaswamy who no doubt picked up some support.
  But I dont see any of them replacing Trump as the Candidate. Alas I see Trump up against either Biden or Harris and Trump winning despite the attempts to jail him. These are only increasing his support.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:40am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Trump will lose Georgia, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania and lose the Election because of it.
    
    3 4
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    August 25, 2023 9:54am
    - Lee C
      
      I don’t think he will lose Wisconsin.
      
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      August 25, 2023 10:33am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Of course he will! The mail in ballots will turn out like its 2020! Biden will still be the most popular cadaver ever to win a US election.
      
      4 2
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      August 25, 2023 10:57am
    - Tom Hunter
      
      Given that the 2020 covid voting rules are still in place in the latter two states – mail-in ballots with ballot harvesting and minimal to no signature or address checking – I’d say any Republican candidate will lose them.
      
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      August 25, 2023 11:05am
Grunter

Productivity is a result of our sector mix in the economy. We are reliant on trading sectors that have low productivity indexes – agriculture, horticulture, wine and tourism, etc. Therefore our overall productivity is low.
Our trading sectors are a result of our comparative advantage in those sectors (which why other countries buy those things from us).
We are actually very good at what we do, and our agricultural productivity is one of the best in the world. But if we want to lift our overall country productivity we need to get good at other things, eg financial services. Easier said than done of course.
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August 25, 2023 8:19am
- Matt Long
  
  While agriculture’s productivity has climbed at a satisfying rate despite government attempts to stifle it, primary industries make up only 6.6% of GDP meaning the low productivity of others sectors, such as financial services (?) keeps the country poverty bound.
  Despite primary industries making up a small fraction of GDP they continue to dominate exports, and New Zealands terms of trade are looking terrible due to the failure of other sectors to step up.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:13am
artemisia

BRICS expanding – fast. The ‘west’ bloc is not anywhere near the only game in town. New Zealand no doubt has a position but if so it’s not obvious and almost certainly comprised of inoffensive weasel words.

Maybe New Zealand should ask to join.
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August 25, 2023 8:20am
- Burtland
  
  maybe comrade dame doctor Cindy can get a job at BRICs given the UN doesnt seem to be forthcoming – shes got enough gongs to match a soviet general
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:01am
- kowtow
  
  Our democratic conventions have been degraded enough ……so perhaps we could join their ranks.
  
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  August 25, 2023 12:33pm
  - artemisia
    
    Sad but sadly becoming the case.
    
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    August 25, 2023 2:21pm
Bobba Fret

Someone over on the BFD site made a good comment:
“Van De Molen is not a minister, did not drive drunk and ram a car, did not get tracked by police dogs, did not get arrested and threaten police with their jobs.
He said hurty words to a Labour MP.
Luxon major hypocrisy for failing to sack him” according to Jenna Lynch
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August 25, 2023 8:21am
- leoj
  
  A Nat MP with a spine…
  
  Well, I never…….
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:10am
Matt Long

It seems preparing food for kleptocrats is a dangerous business, first Obama’s chef;
https://www.foxnews.com/us/death-obamas-chef-marthas-vineyard-ruled-accident-autopsy-confirms
Then Putin’s butcher.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-wagner-group-prigozhin-putins-butcher-ukraine-war-russian-revolution/
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August 25, 2023 8:22am
- Frank the tank
  
  Jeff Epstein and the Clintons says hello
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:34am
- All_on_Red
  
  Was Prigozhin even on the plane?
  10 on the Manifest but only 8 bodies found….
  What are the odds he pops up in North Africa in a couple of months?
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:04am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    Red, there is some talk that another of Prigozhin’s private jets landed at Ostafyevo airport in St. Petersburg around the same time the other plane crashed. So who knows? Prigozhin has faked his own death before, in the Congo in 2019.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:24am
    - Thought Criminal
      
      He’s dead I reckon.
      
      Putin never forgets a betrayal.
      
      10 3
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      August 25, 2023 9:34am
    - Jake Dee
      
      Some disinformation channel claiming he’s dead is not the same thing as Prigozhin faking his own death.
      
      4 3
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      August 25, 2023 9:35am
  - Matt Long
    
    Did Prigozhin ever leave Putin’s basement after heart to heart chats with Putin’s intelligence agents? In a world of AI created images it gets even harder to guess.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:29am
Lee C

I have a theory. If you ask the question “Is there a correllation between a person’s intelligence and their willingness to endorse Donald Trump?”
The calibre of the repsonses will inadvertently betray the answer.
So:
“Is there a correllation between a person’s intelligence and their willingness to endorse Donald J. Trump?”
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August 25, 2023 8:26am
- Frank the tank
  
  TDS is long term illness I wish you well in your recovery.
  
  23 2
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  August 25, 2023 8:33am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  There is a lot of power in telling people things they want to hear, regardless of truth. The same applies to supporters of that scumbag I won’t name who helped Ardern gain power.
  
  I don’t think the problem is a lack of intelligence. I think it is a lack of wisdom and experience that comes from observing the relationship (or lack thereof) between what politicians say before elections and what they do after they get elected. Especially when the person has been elected fairly recently and their record in office can be evaluated.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:36am
  - Paulus
    
    It is reported for a recent Poll that of the women polled 52% are still Labour voters, and are over 50 years of age.
    They would welcome Ardern again with open arms.
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:10am
    - leoj
      
      Whose idea was it to give women the vote?
      
      4 3
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      August 25, 2023 11:12am
    - NothingLeft
      
      Women subconsciously prioritize social acceptance amongst their peers and hierarchical status far more than men – a tendency baked in by evolution due to deadly effects of social exclusion and low status on women who relied upon others to provide resources (never enough food due to excessive birth rates that always meant half to two thirds of humans born had to be culled somehow) and protection throughout human history. Being bottom of pecking order or outcast was frequently fatal and they had to be willing to follow the tides of social pressure and dominant power structures to survive – throughout history generally 80% of women successfully raised kids, whereas only 40% of men did. Men had to be more willing to take risks and push against the grain to find the conspicuous success necessary to become a father.
      
      The result is far fewer women than men are iconclausts or ‘free thinkers’ coming to their own conclusions, they go with the dominant narratives.
      They’ll adopt silly fashions and beliefs to fit in with social movements (stalwart supporters of even malignant religions, evil leaders etc), and mostly not ever realize why they’re doing it. But that tendency is sadly bad for democracy as they form a fickle and easily influenced voting block that won’t always prioritise good government or good long-term policy.
      
      It’s not to be taken for granted that democracy can survive long term preference of numerically dominant women for ever increasing state-provided support and security. They will push us ever further left until we inevitably wind up with repressive authoritarian rule. Much of west is close to that point now.
      
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      August 25, 2023 4:49pm
- kowtow
  
  I have a theory .The rise of the Trumps in current politics is because voters are sick of being betrayed by the uniparty and the pretense that pollies are there to represent their interests and not the interests of big business and even bigger government.
  
  Is there a corelation between TDS and imbecility.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:52am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Definitely.
    
    8 4
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    August 25, 2023 9:41am
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    Trump was President for four years. During that time, the deficit and economy in general got worse, and none of the stuff you mentioned was fixed or even seriously addressed. He appointed three good judges, but any Republican can do that, and otherwise he just sprayed money like a Democrat.
    
    It is not TDS to like what Trump is saying but also understand that none of it will actually happen if he gets elected.
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:11am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      See what happens in 2024 and post 2024.
      USA is in a mess, caused by Biden and his Admin.
      Giving billions to Ukraine and not to his own States is downright communist.
      
      6 5
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      August 25, 2023 10:47am
      - leoj
        
        Giving billions to Ukraine is part of the Hunter scam.
        
        Joe has no choice, otherwise all the Biden shakedown corruption will be exposed – by Ukraine.
        
        Thank heavens the GOP won the House in 2022 or none of this would be in the news.
        
        Shell companies, up to $50 million in bribes going to the Bidens.
        
        James Comer and Jim Jordan are heroes.
        
        7 4
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        August 25, 2023 11:17am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        “Giving billions to Ukraine is part of the Hunter scam.”
        10% for the big guy.
        
        2 2
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        August 25, 2023 12:29pm
      - mawm
        
        Leo – “James Comer and Jim Jordan are heroes.”
        I’ll wait to see how strongly worded their letters are.
        
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        August 25, 2023 2:42pm
- Jake Dee
  
  What if I support Trump because that will burn the whole rotten house down ? Or alternatively, what if I support the Dems and Deep State’s Lawfare to lock him up because that will also burn the whole rotten house down? Do either of those count as high IQ takes ?
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:40am
- greybeard
  
  I have a theory.
  Is there a correlation between opposition to Donald Trump and lousy spelling ?
  
  6 1
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  August 25, 2023 9:47am
- Tom Hunter
  
  You might all get a laugh from this 2017 article, Why Trump voters weren’t irrational
  
  But endless past betrayals by the GOP establishment also have a lot to do with it.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:10am
Bridgenag

First Covid deaths were fully vaccinated, Queensland Government records show
When the border opened and Covid started to spread in highly-vaccinated Queensland, the first Covid death was double vaccinated. So were the majority of deaths thereafter.

https://news.rebekahbarnett.com.au/p/first-covid-deaths-were-fully-vaccinated?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
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August 25, 2023 8:27am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Must have had experts like NZ.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:43am
I remember when

In a Sunday Star Times article on Pakowhai they have recorded Nic Peet, HB Regional Cpuncil Chief Executive, as saying,
“It is an accident of history in the way that these rivers have moved and communities have grown.”

Is it an accident of history that –
* The mouths of the Tutaekuri and Ngaruroro Rivers were joined.
* Is it an accident of history that the removal of aggregate has become over regulated.
* Is it an accident of history that riverbanks, that have not even been threatened in over eighty years, have been breached in numerous places.
* Is it a matter of history that the raised Hawke’s Bay motorway impeded water flow from upriver breaches.
* Is it a matter of history that water from upriver breaches was unable to escape at Waitangi and headed back, because of riverbanks.
* Is it a matter of history that the pumping station to clear the motorway’s obstruction is reported to have failed.

Do Pakowhai residents have a greater right to ask for market value payouts, because their problems were caused by Government or local body decisions?
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August 25, 2023 8:27am
- kowtow
  
  Another aspect of this pathetic beat up is they reported a number of persons were so ‘concerned” they were contemplating calling security .
  
  Once again the media or the anti mob using emotion over evidence .
  
  If people really believed there was going to be violence , they’d have simply stood between them and calmly said ok lads lets be sensible. Then it would be over .
  
  Instead we get the oh so woke , pearl clutching , “gosh it was such a bully moment , I wet my panties” was triggered , got flash backs , have ptsd ,need counselling , had to take the rest of the day off etc
  
  Everything is being hyperpoliticised these days , including politics , funny that.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:53am
Tricati

I have been trying to understand what precipitated the incident with Tim van de Molen took place at the Transport and Infrastructure Select Committee in June. From what I can find he was asking for some additional questions to allow National to get to the bottom of an issue, with that request being denied.
Clearly the Labour majority on the Select Committee wasn’t going to allow further questions if it hi-lighted problems on their part.
From what I heard Barry Soper say on HDPA’s show last night, what van de Molen did was stand up close to the Select Committee chair, Labour MP Shanan Halbert and stood in his way – If in fact that was all that happened, then Labour are weaponizing the Privileges procedures which has set a dangerous precedent.
Watching Shanan Halbert being interviewed last night I got the impression he’s not enjoying the attention and that he has come across as a ‘cry-baby’. But it has given the likes of Jenna Lynch another stick to whack Luxon with.
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August 25, 2023 8:30am
- Paulus
  
  Typical Labour hypocrisy from a dead Government.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:13am
Bridgenag

Dead Man Talking cross-posted a post from Dystopian Down Under

Joel Smalley
Aug 24 · Dead Man Talking
In case you still had any doubts, the evidence is compelling, way, way beyond levels of “reasonable doubt” that would convict alleged baby-killers:

1. COVID is only deadly for very old or otherwise moribund people, not a serious risk to general public health.
2. The “vaccine” was absolutely useless in preventing transmission, serious illness or death.
3. The adverse events of the “vaccine” (including death) easily outweigh the benefits which are evidently zero.
4. Governments lie, resulting in the deaths of thousands of innocent citizens.
5. The main stream media wilfully aids and abets them in the democide.
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August 25, 2023 8:30am
- miltonF
  
  6. The gain of function research that resulted in the creation of the virus was funded by US taxpayers.
  
  The grubby evil socialists have their fingerprints all over this entire ordeal.
  
  Who created the virus – govt
  Who locked down the country – govt
  Who funded the propaganda – govt
  Who funded the vaccine – govt
  Who implemented vaccine mandates – govt
  Who censored crucial information about the virus and the vaccine – govt
  Who gave Pfizer immunity from prosecution – govt
  Who violently shut down protests – govt
  
  Govt govt govt govt govt.
  
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  August 25, 2023 2:16pm
Frank the tank

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/tim-van-de-molen-christopher-luxon-says-contempt-of-parliament-doesn-t-meet-sacking-threshold.html

Reason #164 for white, working class males not to vote for a Luxon/Willis/Bishop led National.

Who wouldn’t get upset having to be part of a Shannan Halbert led select committee….All that was needed was a “back-of-the-bikesheds” chat with Tim (don’t do it again) and then be firm with the feckless. Now this will fester and be an attacking line with them.

If Act gets >15% and NZ First >5% primarily they have Luxon and his wets to thank.
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August 25, 2023 8:32am
- Stuart
  
  The right will never learn – Labour would have never voted against one of their own in the privileges committee. Taking the high road hasn’t got us anywhere.
  
  And there was nothing to apologise for. Calling out Labour politicians for their deliberate attempts to shut down debate was the correct course of action. If we had more politicians who could stand up with some force, instead of being polite pansies we might get something done.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:19am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  The problem goes way deeper than Luxon. Don’t forget the Young Nats want the party to be more “treaty-focused”, or that all but 8 National MP’s voted FOR the so-called “Conversion Practices” legislation that criminalizes parents who are reluctant to endorse medicalization of their child’s gender dysphoria.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:39am
Chuck Bird

I bet James Shaw or Chris Luxon would not debate with Barry Brill.

BARRY BRILL: A Climate Crisis? Let’s Ask an Expert

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/barry-brill-a-climate-crisis-let-s-ask-an-expert?postId=863346a0-ca48-441d-b500-ea7f1e022076&utm_campaign=ca839998-77f5-42c3-8b9d-59b8d665325f&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=6418a327-dfb4-42f7-974a-d87c0a25cd1e&cid=5ad2ad14-ab55-4e15-92b1-7b9538cabd9b
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August 25, 2023 8:32am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Indeed, but in the same vein, David Seymour won’t debate the efficacy of covid vaccines and/or the rise in excess all cause mortality in NZ with a tradie with zero medical training.
  
  I’m guessing there’s not a chance of him publicly engaging with Dr Peter McCullough or Dr Matt Shelton here in NZ?
  
  Politicians don’t debate anyone on topics they have taken a position on which is provably wrong. They close their eyes and ears and hit the ‘block’ button.
  That’s the level of dishonesty in NZ politics and media these days.
  
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  August 25, 2023 8:40am
  - Cassandra
    
    Leave off, Clan, more important things to worry about and we need ACT at 20%. Tackle this after the election.
    
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    August 25, 2023 8:47am
    - leoj
      
      Surely, you are dreaming Cassandra.
      
      If Seymour and ACT get 20%, Seymour will read that as proof of his pro-vaxx stance.
      
      No, Seymour and Luxon need to be made uncomfortable defending some of their stances.
      
      They’re OUR servants, not the other way round.
      
      I don’t trust ANY of them and for good reason.
      
      5 7
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      August 25, 2023 11:25am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Cassandra – your not even slightly disturbed that not only is your preferred party leader refusing to state his position on the worst abuses of human rights in many decades, but what he actually is on record as saying is lies?
      
      What makes him any different to Peter’?
      
      3 4
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      August 25, 2023 12:05pm
    - mawm
      
      Cass – Why should one vote for the libertarian party that did not support the peoples rights to individual sovereignty, body autonomy and freedom of movement. As I see it, the first time they were asked to stand for their principles they failed.
      
      From their website in bold –
      
      We believe it is inherent in the nature of human beings as individuals that they are the owners of their own lives and must be free to act according to their own judgments so long as they accept and respect the like freedom of others.
      
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      August 25, 2023 2:53pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Clan,
    Your fixation with David Seymour is getting boring.
    
    39 8
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    August 25, 2023 8:50am
    - cmm
      
      I think the word you are looking for is “uncomfortable”.
      
      PS: At this stage I will still be holding my nose using both hands and voting for Seymour, but it’s getting close to saying fuck it and not voting at all.
      
      22 13
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      August 25, 2023 8:56am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        If too many do that we will get 3 years of Hipkins lying.
        No thanks.
        
        13 2
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        August 25, 2023 9:48am
    - Yabster
      
      have to agree- every day multiple times a day- I think we know your position on Seymour and mandates- the comment above was about climate change you managed to change the subject entirely…
      
      17 2
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      August 25, 2023 8:57am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Yabster – so you’re a fan of a ‘single source of truth’ and narrative control? Or do we wait until you decide to change the subject? You don’t have to read my comments.
        
        I understand, Nat and Act supporters want to follow their leaders and pretend the worst abuse of human rights occurred over the last four years never actually happened.
        
        Worse, one of them is actively pushing a fraudulent narrative, yet his supporters tell us to shut up and just vote for him anyway?
        
        I’ll keep bringing it up as long as they keep trying to pretend it didn’t happen.
        
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        August 25, 2023 9:40am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Way to play the man and not the ball, Clan.
        It is truly monotonous.
        Those that agree, will agree and have agreed. Those that aren’t obsessed or are looking at other issues are fatigued and the only impact is an eye roll.
        You dont need to keep harping on and assert that anyone who is not onboard 100% with every point you make is immoral or blind or part of the system.
        Here’s a challenge; try to go one day without using the words “Covid, Mandates, Vaccine, or excess deaths”.
        
        You must be really fun at parties, I bet.
        
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        August 25, 2023 11:07am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        “Worse, one of them is actively pushing a fraudulent narrative, yet his supporters tell us to shut up and just vote for him anyway?”
        
        The issues around 2020-2021 is not an issue of ‘one’ political party. Not sure why you are singling out David Seymour might have only made the mistake of engaging with you via email perhaps.
        Try emailing Winnie and ask why he tweeted for there to be a ‘no jab – no dole’ policy.
        That would have made life even worse for people who lost their jobs after all.
        But now, since he cynically plays to your side, he is your boy.
        
        2 2
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        August 25, 2023 11:13am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Captain – don’t read my comments.
      
      It’s an accurate observation, the fact it doesn’t fit with your desired worldview is irrelevant.
      
      18 10
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      August 25, 2023 9:31am
  - cmm
    
    Clan:
    There are many golden rules in politics, one being don’t ask a question in the House unless you already know the answer.
    Another is to avoid any debate etc you know you’re going to lose.
    
    24 0
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    August 25, 2023 8:54am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      For someone with only passing interest in politics and politicians up until a few years ago, it’s been eye opening, that’s for sure.
      
      Especially my naive belief that I should be looking to vote for someone honest and of good character.
      
      What I’ve learned is, apparently both traits immediately bar you from becoming a politician.
      
      Tragic.
      
      14 4
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      August 25, 2023 9:34am
      - Colville
        
        Politics is the art of the possible.
        Perfection is not possible.
        
        0 1
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        August 25, 2023 4:55pm
Fisiani2

Just 41 days till voting starts. Last election 69% of people voted early. How low will Labour go?
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August 25, 2023 8:33am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  However low it will take. Watch the KFC “voter enrollment” drives kick off in South Auckland.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:01am
- blue collar
  
  Gonna be a landslide brother Fisi ….. labo 23%
  
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  August 25, 2023 5:05pm
Aldousk

Does anyone understand what the cartoon in today’s Press refers to?
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August 25, 2023 8:34am
- Diogenes
  
  I actually took a couple of minutes to study the Press cartoon (two minutes of my life I will never get back). Short answer, Aldousk: NO.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:39am
- Ghost
  
  So the numbers in the cartoon are 29, 33, 41, 48
  
  Elaine Naidu Franz was 29 on the list
  Darren Gilchrist Was 48 on the list
  Anto Coates was 33
  Scott Boness was 41
  
  These are all the candidates that have been dropped
  
  Cartoon
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:53am
- kowtow
  
  All you need to know is it’s yet another attck on the right.
  
  Did they ever do one on Hipkins herding his cats ?
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:06am
I remember when

I see the Western allies are blaming Putin for Prigozhin’s plane blowing up and crashing.

Oh! Come on.

What are the chances of that?
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August 25, 2023 8:34am
- Jake Dee
  
  Oh, I don’t know, never say never. But I’d put the chance of it being western aligned hit at 5~10%. I’ve just been looking at the list of powerful people killed in dubious aircraft crashes, it’s a hell of a list.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:49am
- Bridgenag
  
  simplicius has many articles worth looking at it you are following the Ukranian/Russian war
  
  Special Report: The Curtain Closes On Yevgeny Prigozhin
  
  https://open.substack.com/pub/simplicius76/p/special-report-the-curtain-closes?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:23am
Bridgenag

A State of Exception
Government’s ability to transcend the rule of law in the name of the public good.

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/a-state-of-exception?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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August 25, 2023 8:36am
Maggie Pie

You probably have to feel a bit sorry for all those ‘believers’ who rushed in 6 years ago and bought those shitty 1&2 bedroom Apartments without carparks, near the proposed route of Auckland’s-Light-Rail-Corridor 😀

Although Dame Cindy had promised it would be completed by 2021….

https://twitter.com/NewsroomNZ/status/1694789231174942777
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August 25, 2023 8:37am
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

Hoots bro is suggesting National should not be offering tax cuts 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️. Not sure why people even bother to offer him a platform .
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August 25, 2023 8:39am
Maggy Wassilieff

The untold side of the “Climate debate”

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/barry-brill-a-climate-crisis-let-s-ask-an-expert
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August 25, 2023 8:46am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump not in the first debate?

https://thepoliticalmovement.com/2023/08/24/trump-to-interview-with-tucker-carlson-instead-of-attending-first-debate/

This is how quick he is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XzL1sQWRd4
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August 25, 2023 8:46am
NoCash

About the Japanese article saying China also releases nuclear power plant wastewater into the sea, I’ve read the below comment from a different forum.

Any engineer or scientist here can comment on this controversy?

You realise that all reactors release tritium but the Japanese ex-reactor has released dozens of types of contaminants not only tritium.

Highly misleading Japanese article focusing only on ONE aspect of the measure.

Other nuclear reactors do not release this much radioactive Cesium isotopes into the water. Not to mention material from the reactor explosions, fragments, debris, fuel and so on. What Japan has done here with that propaganda piece is as bad as Soviet/North Korean levels. Japan is no better to be honest.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jul/24/fukushima-fish-with-180-times-legal-limit-of-radioactive-cesium-fuels-water-release-fears
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August 25, 2023 8:50am
- cmm
  
  The devil is always in the details.
  
  What exactly is meant by “waste water”?
  
  Almost all reactors placed on the coast extract water from the sea for cooling water and dump it back into the sea.
  All that water is “waste water”.
  Quite often the water it treated in some way. For example, the last thing you want is barnacles forming inside your nice shiny pipes, so sometimes water is treated to stop that.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:47am
  - NoCash
    
    After reading the comment and the Guardian article, my question is how creditable are the Japanese officials saying the wastewater is safe, considering they are only citing the amount of Tritium and not other radioactive isotopes and contaminants that are not present in wastewater of operating reactors.
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:48am
    - NoCash
      
      Also, desalination is part of the treatment to remove contaminants, so if the treated wastewater is considered very safe, why not just use it for irrigation?
      
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      August 25, 2023 3:17pm
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    I have snorkelled on the beach within eyesight of the Nuclear power station at Kending, Taiwan, on more than one trip. The coral there is alive with fish. From knee-deep, there are tonnes of little fish, and further out they are larger. The parrot fish can be heard chewing at the coral.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maanshan_Nuclear_Power_Plant#/media/File:Maanshan_nuclear_power_plant.jpg
    Never had any concerns about the spillway there. But in China, I would. The rule of law, environment, and even basic morals are not even close to the same level on the mainland.
    
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    August 25, 2023 12:46pm
    - NoCash
      
      People are not concerned by wastewater being released into the sea from operational nuclear power plants regardless of where they are, be it Japan, Taiwan, the USA, or even China, as when water is used for normal cooling and for making steam to drive the turbines, contamination is limited and controlled.
      
      But that’s not the situation in Fukushima, the water is used to cool the broken reactors directly without segregation, hence contamination is much higher and with other radioactive isotopes in much larger quantity than wastewater from operational plants.
      
      The concern for many is about how effective is the treatment of the wastewater before being released at Fukushima, and the credibility of the Japanese officials.
      
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      August 25, 2023 1:42pm
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Hi, was replying to CMM and ‘almost all reactors’ comment about wastewater to the sea.
        
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        August 25, 2023 3:38pm
- miltonF
  
  Yes I was wondering about this exact thing. I think many people are so eager to support nuclear that they jumped the gun in support of Japan’s decision to release contaminated water.
  
  They had a reactor explosion…they’ve been flushing the exposed reactor with seawater. You’d have to be blind Freddy to believe that this water is safe.
  
  I don’t fancy the arguments that the contamination will be diluted by the ocean so it’s all fine and dandy. So what, we’re just dumping all of our waste into the ocean now? Why bother with waste treatment plants. Just pump the poos straight into the ocean. They’ll be diluted to safe levels. Nah…it’s not good enough.
  
  From Japan’s perspective, they really don’t have any other option that won’t bankrupt the country. This is why nuclear is not actually cheap. It is extremely expensive when you take into account all factors. Cost to build, cost to staff and maintain, cost of nuclear fuel, cost to decommission, cost to dispose of waste and cost to cleanup if anything goes wrong. It’s a fools errand in most cases.
  
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  August 25, 2023 2:39pm
cmm

Has anyone noticed that those pressing for diversity only accept a very narrow definition of diversity.

A group of people I work with is blamed with being insufficiently diverse because they are only white males.

But they are still diverse:
* Some are taller. Some are shorter.
* They were born in 5 different countries.
* Out of the 14 of them, they can speak 9 different languages.
* 4 of them were in the military (from two different nations).
* Some have shot people, some have been shot at by people.
* Their parents include farmers, engineers, doctors, nurses, mental patients, soldiers, government employees and sex workers.
etc etc etc

We’re told that diversity is important because different people have different life experiences. So which life experiences count?
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August 25, 2023 8:51am
- Blackbob
  
  Skin colour and Gender ( the real one) are the only realities here.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:09am
- Jake Dee
  
  Are you really surprised that some characteristics count and others don’t when it comes to calculating diversity? Has there ever been a policy advocated by an activist who doesn’t expect some benefit from it, directly or indirectly?
  You don’t even have to go so far as saying “you only want that because you’ll get a pay-off from it.” As plants grow in the direction of the water and the light, so political policies grow in the direction that makes that political faction stronger.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:51am
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  The oddity is that the D&I doctrine requires seeing people primarily as their immutable birth-characteristic. Skin colour or gender.
  Kind of like racist and sexist people do.
  It does not seem to count for individual ways of working, or differences that exist within individual members of identity-politics groupings.
  You know, like assumptions and stereotypes around members of groups. But good ones, in this case. Including the soft racism of low expectations.
  Hence why these D&I people are simply hypocritical, and think discrimination is an answer to inequity.
  Also why blacks who support Trump, or gays who don’t support the Trans movement are great head-exploding material for the bigotry of the so-called caring leftists.
  
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  August 25, 2023 12:53pm
Libertarians are right

OK, fun question time:

Labour have now created a precedent where an MP can be censured for bringing parliament into disrepute by stopping an MP from being able to do their job.
Specifically, the bar for this is incredibly low – blocking an MP’s path for 20 odd seconds.

Given this, who else should be sanctioned?
Shanan Halbert (and all other Labour Committee heads) for deliberately and repeatedly denying Opposition MPs the ability to do their jobs.
Every Labour MP who has lied in Parliament or delayed/stopped releases of information.
Chris Hipkins for deliberately speaking quickly at a deliberately early time so that the firearms vote could be had without Seymour’s attendance to deny him the right to vote.
Iain Lees-Galloway for hiding behind a pillar to deny himself the ability to do his job by being held accountable for his actions to the media.

Who else?

Also, I get that the three staffers who were there saw the same thing. That makes sense. But, how did they have the exact same reaction? People react to things differently. This means they were either schooled or there is extreme homogeneity of ideology in Parliamentary staffers. Either one makes their statements worthless.
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August 25, 2023 8:58am
Jack5

How come this young, would-be media mogul didn’t get gold from the Jacinda subsidy train, the Flying Left Express?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/130382418/failed-media-company-director-jailed-for-fraud-driven-by-greed-grandiosity-and-selfentitlement
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August 25, 2023 8:59am
- Matt Long
  
  Should have joined Young Labour.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:31am
Yabster

putting this out there- Mama Hooch guys got 16 years- which is probably fair- but I assume no cultural reports for these guys (not a fan) and from some of the murder and other rape cases we have seen over the past few years that involved “cultural reports” the sentencing is not consistent at all….
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August 25, 2023 9:03am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump unloads with Carlson.
He will probably get bigger ratings than the actual debate.

https://finishtherace.com/ella-ford/trump-during-tucker-carlson-interview-regarding-his-critics-they-are-savage-animals-they-are-people-that-are-sick/
Vid 1.15.

Ten Liz Wheeler vid 34 min. Fox News rules are bananas.

https://twitter.com/Liz_Wheeler/status/1694466413560283291
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August 25, 2023 9:03am
Matt Long

Is Blackrock feeling the pushback on ESG? Perhaps even the biggest cartel on earth has concerns about investor law suits.
https://beincrypto.com/blackrock-esg-policies-bitcoin-etf-decision/
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August 25, 2023 9:05am
Rusty

So what does Putin/communists and the woke/ far left have in common other than being liars?

Answer: They are stupid liars.
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August 25, 2023 9:05am
ClanMcleod

Just more evidence of governments withholding evidence that the vaccines didn’t work.

In NZ, they covered up information that the vaccines were dangerous to young people.
In Queensland, they knew the vaccines didn’t work but hid that information.

First Covid deaths were fully vaccinated,
Queensland Government records show

When the border opened and Covid started to spread in highly-vaccinated Queensland, the first Covid death was double vaccinated. So were the majority of deaths thereafter.

The case death records in Dr Gerrard’s affidavit show that the Queensland Department of Health knew this. A sane and compassionate government would acknowledge that their policies were not even coming close to achieving the desired outcome and adjust their messaging and strategy to respond to the situation on the ground.

But instead, the Queensland Government doubled down, maintaining proof of vaccination restrictions for most venues until April 2022, and retaining work mandates well into the year – some are still in place. Palazczuk, who is not a medical doctor, continued to push boosters to young people, despite the fact that Australia’s vaccine advisory body did not recommend it.

Very similar to what happened here.

It is a chilling prospect that a government could hold evidence that its policies are not working, and are potentially causing the deaths of its own citizenry, and not take action to prevent further harm.

https://news.rebekahbarnett.com.au/p/first-covid-deaths-were-fully-vaccinated

Chilling doesn’t begin to describe it. In NZ? Get your booster!!
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August 25, 2023 9:06am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I was involuntarily exposed to TVNZ last night. There was an ad showing a Maori woman talking to her “auntie” telling her that she needed to get boosted.
  
  I almost spilled my wine. What a waste of money.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:22am
  - Yabster
    
    yep and the language- is pigeon english- “we on”… embarassing.
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:32am
  - Random T Person
    
    Well I am assuming that you saved the wine, so no money wasted, well done ;-).
    
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    August 25, 2023 9:49am
  - Burtland
    
    if you watch TV you would think that nz is ethnically 90% maori and the remaining 10% are a bunch of dumb arses – the Mitre10 adv is classic upside down neo marxist narrative.
    
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    August 25, 2023 1:32pm
  - miltonF
    
    You’ve pretty much just described every Covid jab advert!
    
    I wonder what we’d call it if we had a government targeting an ethnic minority with a product that causes death, disability and infertility?
    
    Wakey wakey people.
    
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    August 25, 2023 3:02pm
  - kevn
    
    BY… A rather odd form of ethnic population control. Low fertility and poor birth rate is well proven.
    
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    August 25, 2023 5:15pm
Jake Dee

Anyone here mourning the death of Prigozhin?
I’m going to guess no. Sometimes a guy’s just got to get got, you know what I mean? You can’t let ’em get away with nothing. But maybe you’re feeling bad for the flight crew who went down with him. I’m not so sure about that one. If you’re on the flight crew of the private jet of a mercenary leader during a hot war, you’ve crossed over the line between civilian and soldier
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August 25, 2023 9:06am
- Tom Hunter
  
  Russia is just a larger Mafia organisation nowadays.
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:22am
Jack5

Stuff gets around to what National MP Tim van d Molen is accused of actually doing that caused him to be, as Stuff describes it, found in contempt of Parliament.

It wasn’t on Guy Fawkes scale. Here is the Stuff extract:

‘Three members of Parliament staff considered calling security during the incident. The report said van de Molen lent over Halbert, said “stand up mate”, and then stopped him leaving the room.’

You would have had to be there to judge how heavy van de Molen’s actions was, but there do seem to be increasing reports of Parliamentary staff being upset by MPs – of both Government and Opposition.

Staff deserve to be treated with the respect and dignity due to all people, but are Parliamentary staff themselves now more sensitive, more aware of Woke norms? If there are now more female staff, is this a factor?

The Stuff report:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132809718/it-is-serious-nationals-waikato-mp-tim-van-de-molen-found-to-have-threatened-labour-mp
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August 25, 2023 9:10am
Maggie Pie

Not sure how many ‘sitting-days’ are left, but does anyone know when Kiri Alan will be giving her Valedictory speech?

Asking for a number of friends.
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August 25, 2023 9:13am
- cmm
  
  Are the tennis girls going to end up throwing rotten fruit at the TV?
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:20am
- Vinicius
  
  Last sitting day expected to be August 31st. The dissolution of Parliament is September 8th.
  
  https://www.parliament.nz/en/visit-and-learn/parliament-in-election-year/election-2023-timeline/
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:27am
- Benedict Yu
  
  There are 3 sitting days left 29, 30, 31 August.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:30am
- imalwaysright
  
  MP,
  
  I think Kiri Allan’s statement to the police through her lawyer should be read by the Speaker and entered into Hansard as her valedictory speech.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:34am
- NothingLeft
  
  I bet Labour MPs just want her to stay away, fake a sickie or whatever.
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:46am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Probably not September 4th
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132627807/kiri-allans-court-date-revealed–but-she-might-not-need-to-show
  
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  August 25, 2023 9:59am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  maybe send a police dog to look for her?
  
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  August 25, 2023 11:05am
I remember when

Isn’t biofuel just fossil fuel with the processing short cutted?
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August 25, 2023 9:13am
Jack5

Emperor penguin colonies are shrinking as Antarctic ice shrinks, says the Wall Street Journal as it gives a nod to environmentalists.

Penguins might find a better place to be, in the Norwegian King’s Guard – bizarrely in Edinburgh.

https://youtu.be/g0Hh9a7cok8?si=JAIflAqXPx7G5vzB
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August 25, 2023 9:17am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Never ever see a dead penguin. When one dies, all the others dig a big hole and stand around singing “Freeze a jolly good fellow”
  Then they kick him in the ice hole.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:56am
Yvette

Who was Jacinda Ardern?
And is there a directive to media
to not mention her?

Oops –
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August 25, 2023 9:25am
- bjools
  
  She’ll pull off that mask, mission impossible style, and you’ll find she’s really one of the following:
  Helen Clark
  Moa
  Kim
  Castro
  Lenin
  Stalin
  Pick your favourite.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:13am
BeaB

Perhaps that little chappie chairing the select committee was frightened by big burly Tim Molen with his big black beard. Perhaps the whips did sort it out between themselves. Perhaps Rachel Boyack saw a chance to haul a National MP before the ‘mighty’ Privileges Committee to make up for Labour ministers’ dismal record this year. Perhaps the whole incident became overblown, helped along by well-paid legal advice and exaggerated fears of ‘intimidation’.
Perhaps Luxon should have said, “Don’t worry. Tim didn’t raise a hand but one day he could become Speaker and even an ambassador, just like Trevor Mallard.”
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August 25, 2023 9:28am
BeaB

And, perhaps, considering the dreadful time Tim Molen has had over the past few months, someone, even in Labour, could have reached out a helping hand to give him support and sympathy.
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August 25, 2023 9:30am
BeaB

Sorry Tim van de Molen.
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August 25, 2023 9:37am
graham

Even getting a jab was not good enough for some hysterical companies, including one who fired a respected worker after he was seen (GASP!) sitting in a tea room less than one metre away from a colleague and not wearing a mask.

Despite the fact that he had received his first jab.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/damar-industries-to-pay-33k-after-firing-partly-vaccinated-rotorua-worker-during-covid/NFC4QLMESZEGHC5J5WEKAUMTLU/

The worker in question has been awarded $33,000 after claiming a personal grievance.

Quality control officer Jonathan Collier – who, incidentally, was also a health and safety representative – had advised Damar Industries that he did not think that the risk assessment had given an accurate measurement of the potential for Covid to catch and spread in the workplace. He viewed the risk assessment as made against a worst-case scenario, which he thought was unlikely to occur.

He also believed getting vaccinated could harm his health and mandatory vaccination would unreasonably interfere with his right to choose to get vaccinated or not.

Yet a hysterical company ignored the advice FROM THEIR OWN HEALTH AND SAFETY REP and fired him. Apparently “My Body My Choice” only applies to some.

Very slowly, it is beginning to become apparent to more and more people that the incredibly harsh rules forced on the entire population may have been slightly disproportionate …
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August 25, 2023 9:40am
Nickc2

Question for today

What attributes, values, and expertise should a politician have in today’s world?

NB: It’s election time.
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August 25, 2023 9:41am
- bjools
  
  Work ethic
  Management skills (especially his own)
  A knowledge of and willingness to do something about the issues in each electorate
  Basic economics
  BUT most especially, the ability to work for all citizens, residents and visitors in NZ. Whether they voted for them or not.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q25aJ6UNvhw
  She’s a hard road to find the perfect politician, either.
  Perhaps the concepts of perfect and politician are mutually exclusive?
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:00am
  - bjools
    
    BTW
    Imagine we counted all the GRASS, on farms, back yards and parks etc.
    It grows too, just like trees.
    
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    August 25, 2023 10:47am
    - bjools
      
      OOPS, should have been replied to myself under the ETS discussion above.
      
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      August 25, 2023 11:05am
      - Colville
        
        What is your point?
        Grass gets turned into say milk or meat which is consumed and shat out… Where is the carbon sink?
        
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        August 25, 2023 2:04pm
      - bjools
        
        Colville…….Conversion to milk etc ….in your back yard, rugby field etc?
        
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        August 25, 2023 5:57pm
- mandk
  
  Experience of working for at least five years outside of politics. Time working as a party apparatchik not counted.
  
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  August 25, 2023 10:59am
- Guy Preston
  
  Success in Private sector.
  Doesn’t view politics as a ‘career’ to be perused.
  Articulate.
  Based.
  Prepared to melt snowflakes and give zero fucks.
  
  9 0
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  August 25, 2023 11:03am
- newview
  
  Some basic knowledge of the portfolio’s they may end up with would be nice.
  
  9 0
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  August 25, 2023 11:04am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Know what GDP means.
    
    9 0
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    August 25, 2023 11:29am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Know what a woman is.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnSB5uT65aM
      
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      August 25, 2023 1:41pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/maori-comment-on-one-of-our-videos-you-stole-and-murdered-our-maori-whanau-first-when-you-came-to-aotearoa-what-is-the-truth-of-the-matter/

Then the defamation
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August 25, 2023 10:16am
Ghost

Interesting, the new Covid variant is more likely to infect those whose have had the vaccine or Covid

Based on what CDC knows now, existing tests used to detect and medications used to treat COVID-19 appear to be effective with this variant. BA.2.86 may be more capable of causing infection in people who have previously had COVID-19 or who have received COVID-19 vaccines.

Article
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August 25, 2023 11:04am
- mandk
  
  Do you know what proportion of the population has neither been vaxxed, nor had COVID?
  
  I’m guessing the % would be pretty small. And, if you are correct, it would mean the large majority would be more likely to get infected.
  
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  August 25, 2023 3:55pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I have had both. Two jabs to get a passport, bullied into it.
  Then a few months ago got a strep throat. Tested and it was positive.
  Safe and effective, where is this effective bit when I got Covid anyway?
  Oh, but if you were not vaxed it could have been much worse. Says who? Who can prove that – it is bullshit?
  I am fit and Covid didn’t even make me stay at home.
  Ardern, you are a liar, but you got paid handsomely for your lies!!
  
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  August 25, 2023 4:20pm
- cmm
  
  After all the lies why the hell believe anything this time?
  
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  August 25, 2023 7:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Dan Bongino I follow on Facebook.
“In a furious twitter exchange with a Clinton aide, former secret service agent Dan Bongino threatened to reveal new details about Bill Clinton’s 26 documented trips aboard notorious pedophile Jeffrey Epstein’s private jet, nicknamed the “Lolita Express.”

https://libertyresolve.com/ss-agent-fears-for-his-life-as-he-threatens-to-release-details-bill-clinton-and-epsteins-orgy-island/
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August 25, 2023 12:00pm
- Jake Dee
  
  I doubt it. It’s not that I doubt Bill Clinton got up to some seriously shady sex stuff with Epstein and many others, I just doubt that this Dan Bongino character has the goods on him.
  Apart from the fact he would be breaking with the secret service and hence the entire federal government, if you really have solid incriminating evidence you either release it or you don’t. If you actually have it and then you publicly tease that you might release it, you’ll just get the dogs set on you for no benefit.
  There’s no advantage in half setting off a bomb, Samson didn’t try to pull down just a piece of the temple on his head.
  It would only make sense if he was trying to raise a bit of stink and sling a bit of mud because he doesn’t have the real dynamite.
  
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  August 25, 2023 12:29pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Bongino was with the Secret Service in the Whitehouse. He quit because he did not like where Obama was going – did not want to work for Obama any more.
    
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    August 25, 2023 2:05pm
    - Jake Dee
      
      OK, fine let’s say he was a Secret Service agent and he has incriminating evidence (or at least believes he has). What’s his game plan here? Why hasn’t he released it yet? Is he waiting for the best moment? Is he waiting for the best moment and also telling the world that he has incriminating evidence?
      
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      August 25, 2023 2:15pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Uptick.
        Dan Bongino is a good man. Religious, trained with guns, MMA fighter.
        He has his own cable show. He is an interesting man.
        What his game plan is I don’t know. With anything Epstein I guess he wants to stay alive. Many high up people in the black book and the plane log.
        Why is the black book kept secret? Who has the book? Epstein is dead, so why the secrecy? Ever heard of Arkancide?
        
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        August 25, 2023 3:06pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Bongino.
        https://rumble.com/Bongino
        
        Here he is with an Australian reporter.
        
        https://www.facebook.com/dan.bongino/videos/60-minutes-goes-to-dan-bonginos-home-just-to-get-rekt/767293757258760/
        
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        August 25, 2023 3:24pm
  - Colville
    
    Has the goods on a Clinton?
    Is he still alive?
    So no he dosent’t.
    
    5 2
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    August 25, 2023 2:09pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Both Clintons I would think. Many, many have been on the Lolita Express many times.
      I won’t drag any other names out because I want to stay alive, and I also like this place.
      
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      August 25, 2023 3:09pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  I follow Dan on Tiktok and X. Dan is THE man.
  
  Hates both Obama and Joe with a passion!!
  
  https://twitter.com/dbongino/status/1694871999464534500
  
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  August 25, 2023 3:22pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Good. He is straight up, no mincing words.
    
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    August 25, 2023 4:37pm
Maggie Pie

TRUMP WATCH

Trumpy’s mug-shot has been released….30 million views already!

More importantly, here’s a bit of background on
Fulton County DA Fanni Willis –

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1694811429101035530
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August 25, 2023 1:06pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I still don’t know why the media are going crazy about a mugshot.
  There must be millions of Trump images.
  Anyway, he does not look happy.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l086jEZRdJU
  
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  August 25, 2023 2:08pm
Chuck Bird

If you do not know who Jane Smith is listen to this for 8 miutes.

The Country 25/08/23: Jane Smith talks to Jamie Mackay

https://www.iheart.com/podcast/53-the-country-28628176/episode/the-country-250823-jane-smith-talks-121774649/
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August 25, 2023 1:46pm
- greybeard
  
  She has been on numerous Country programs: one of the most intelligent, articulate, experienced and sensible people in NZ.
  
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  August 25, 2023 5:00pm
Swifty

No doubt it’ll be Welsh schoolkids behind all this:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/increase-in-youth-violence-prompts-daily-police-patrols-at-aucklands-whangaparaoa-college/S5KZLMQVDNG7NFKA5KJG3QYO5A/

Or Irish. Or failing that Jap.

All ne’er do wells.
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August 25, 2023 1:57pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  They were talking about this on ZB and whether the police should be involved. A father phoned up to say he had a daughter at the College. Said he won’t say what ethnicity the girls are who are doing the bullying for fear of being labelled ‘racist’, but his own child is in Y10, a slightly built blonde who’s lucky to weigh 50kg.
  The girl that’s been bullying her is a Y11 kid that would easily go 120kg. She catches the bus from Red Beach by the sound of it.
  
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  August 25, 2023 2:55pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘Youth Aid Sergeant Jon Williams said it was “good old-fashioned policing” and the patrols were carried out by two uniformed Youth Aid officers or community officers.’
  
  More regime claptrap newspeak.
  
  Old fashioned policing ? There was never a need for police patrols in the “old days” .
  
  Schools had control , by one means or another.
  
  Visible police patrols in schools are a sign of abject failure and social collapse.
  
  ps swifty , if it’s the Micks causing problems it’ll be the Left Footers ……..
  
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  August 25, 2023 3:17pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Schools had control. Schools also had the strap and the cane.
    I know this! 🙂
    
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    August 25, 2023 4:03pm
    - kowtow
      
      The principal on hdpa , it’s not police patrols , it’s positive engagement.
      
      There ya go , newspeak.
      
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      August 25, 2023 4:13pm
CAKE FACE1

If you a centre-right person, you will be described as a Nazi by some neo-Marxist nutjob at some point of your life. For some people on the centre-right, this happens quite frequently.

Of course, only neo-Marxists are allowed to describe people in these terms. I see that some Act candidate used Nazi rhetoric about Cindy Ardern’s vaccine mandates in a blog post, and there was huge faux outrage from the far-left extremist Team of $55 million against her. It was quite absurd and hypocritical.

New Zealand has many problems at the moment – for example, rampant inflation, uncontrolled government spending and an eye watering current account deficit.

However, the number one challenge this country faces, in my opinion, is that we have the most left-wing media in the Western world.

A cabal of shadowy neo-Marxists control OnePravda, Red Radio, Stuff and the rest, and ceaselessly bombard the population with extreme left-wing propaganda.

This means that NZ inevitably adopts extreme left-wing policy, which almost guarantees economic and social failure.

After they are elected, National / ACT need to find a way to break the extreme left stranglehold on the media. At the very least, the National / ACT politicians need to stand up and hold firm against the tyranny of the fanatically left-wing media. I am tired of seeing politicians of the centre-right being bullied by these neo-Marxist extremists.

If they fail to do this, we are doomed as a country…
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August 25, 2023 2:36pm
- Burtland
  
  Its not just the media – its the prevailing narrative in the schools, the techs, universities, media, councils, government departments, advisory bodies (NZCER), political parties – the foot soldiers are everywhere.
  
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  August 25, 2023 3:40pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  South Venezuela/Zimbabwe.
  I have a Zimbabwe Banknote – 100 Trillion Dollars.
  It is worth say NZ$4?
  
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  August 25, 2023 4:43pm
- gorse
  
  New Zealand is in a position that I don’t it can recover from. Ardern put in motion a number of things to make certain we will become a socialist nation, not unlike Venezuela. Spend the country into economic ruin. We are never going to recover from this. Increase taxes, the 39% quickly put on was just the start. The “rich” can cope with this better than most. Wealth taxes etc are next, might be three terms away, but coming. Increase benefits, get a lot more people on Government payment schemes, basic universal income next, three terms away. Shut down and much industry that generates wealth as you can, think oil and gas, make farming difficult. Disarm the people, full disarmament coming in three terms. Take over the education system, brainwashing the young. Then create division, we have race division, rich versus poor division, just to start. I could ramble on at length. I believe none of this is reversible now. We are on a slide to pretty much a third world country. Of course National and ACT will get the blame, as it will happen in the next three terms. Labour will get back in then and finish the job. I am trying to get my adult children to leave the country. Begs the question “where too.”
  
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  August 25, 2023 6:12pm
I remember when

Well that proves it was an accident.
The plane was being repaired shorty before the flight.
Move away people nothing to see here.
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August 25, 2023 2:46pm
Jack5

With Japan putting nuclear material into the Pacific, it’s a good time to bone up on nuclear waste disposal with this video by German physicist Sabine Hossenfelder.

She’s a good explainer of science to us lay folk.

https://youtu.be/aDUvCLAp0uU?si=hhNOnlyDuDLWWOlu
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August 25, 2023 3:33pm
Jack5

The Herald web site calls “bizarre” a suggestion by a retiring politician that NZ might be better as part of Australia.

Why bizarre?

A century and a quarter ago, or slightly more, a relevant and discussed issue was whether NZ would join the colonies across the Tasman as part of the new country of Australia.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jamie-strange-valedictory-should-new-zealand-join-australia/45MSHPHLBNF65C33DKOL2GMVJM/
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August 25, 2023 3:38pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

More than just a Political figure? These percentages will only get better.

Trump was also seen as the most honest and trustworthy candidate with 61% of people who said honesty was important. Ron DeSantis was the runner-up with 17% of the vote. Even now those with TDS will not believe this.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/trump-voters-think-the-former-president-is-more-trustworthy-than-their-family/ss-AA1fJ7Sq
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August 25, 2023 3:40pm
- fernglas
  
  I believe it Steve. 25% of Americans believe God influences who wins the Superbowl, too.
  
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  August 25, 2023 5:12pm
cmm

Well there’s a new variant in town. Better vote for Labour coz that saved us last time!

BA.2.86. Bigger number. Surely is must be more dangerous and more “sneaky”?

“University of Otago evolutionary virologist, Dr Jemma Geoghegan said it reminds her a lot of when Omicron first emerged: “It was different from anything before”.“That is the really concerning thing,””

Fuck me sweetie… it’s a new variant. Of course it is different! Surely we don’t need to explain that to an evolutionary virologist, but then Otago isn’t quite what it used to be.

variant
/ˈvɛːrɪənt/
noun
noun: variant; plural noun: variants
a form or version of something that differs in some respect from other forms of the same thing or from a standard.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300957705/a-new-highly-mutated-covid19-variant-ba286-has-scientists-on-alert.
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August 25, 2023 4:27pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  How do people get these career jobs, paid by the Taxpayer, when they are not the brightest bulbs in the chandelier?
  
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  August 25, 2023 4:50pm
Maggie Pie

The type of people who hate Donald Trump are the same sort of losers we have in this country… those who get perverse pleasure from coining Mercedes and Porsches parked on Parnell Rd.
Labor/Green voters.

Just saying 🙁
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August 25, 2023 5:38pm
Ghost

LOOKING FOR CLUES in the CANADIAN FIRES

Robert Brame is a forensic arborist who has analyzed 38 California fires and has come up with hundreds of photographic evidence of IMPOSSIBLE normal fire behavior. Let’s use this information to help us look for CLUES in the CANADIAN fires to see if the same anamolies exist.

Article
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August 25, 2023 6:04pm
- cmm
  
  “forensic arborist” Seriously?
  WTF is a forensic arborist?
  Can they tell you if someone was killed by being hit by a flower arrangement, possibly roses?
  
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  August 25, 2023 6:31pm
  - Ghost
    
    Seems to be a usa thing
    
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    August 25, 2023 6:48pm
kevn

Arson/firebugs?
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August 25, 2023 6:56pm
Ghost

The Justice Department filed a lawsuit today against Space Exploration Technologies Corporation (SpaceX) for discriminating against asylees and refugees in hiring. The lawsuit alleges that, from at least September 2018 to May 2022, SpaceX routinely discouraged asylees and refugees from applying and refused to hire or consider them, because of their citizenship status, in violation of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA).

Press release

Elon Twitter

Exactly.

SpaceX was told repeatedly that hiring anyone who was not a permanent resident of the United States would violate international arms trafficking law, which would be a criminal offense.

We couldn’t even hire Canadian citizens, despite Canada being part of NORAD!

This is yet another case of weaponization of the DOJ for political purposes.
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August 25, 2023 7:39pm

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