About
Contact
Advertise

Facebook
Twitter

November 27, 2024 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 27 November 2024

Like this:

Like Loading...

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment265

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (265)

Login to comment or vote

Yvette

Perhaps just read the bits in bold type –

Treaty Principles Bill: David Seymour’s acknowledgement of rangatiratanga raises ‘a whole lot of questions’

Summary –
David Seymour’s acknowledgment of Ngāi Tahu’s tino rangatiratanga over much of the South Island underlines contradictions in his Treaty Principles Bill, according to legal experts. Critics argue the Bill is inconsistent, recognising Ngāi Tahu’s settlement rights while rejecting broader iwi rights under Te Tiriti o Waitangi. Dr. Carwyn Jones highlights Seymour’s reliance on courts for interpretation, despite opposing their role in other Treaty matters. Experts contend the Bill undermines Treaty principles, freezing them in the past and ignoring their constitutional significance for all iwi and hapū
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/534907/treaty-principles-bill-david-seymour-s-acknowledgement-of-rangatiratanga-raises-a-whole-lot-of-questions

ACT Party leader David Seymour’s acknowledgement that Ngāi Tahu have rangatiratanga over most of the South Island shows the inconsistency of his argument, says a legal expert.
Another says the “apparent concession” shows how “unworkable” his Treaty Principles Bill is.

The fact that David Seymour’s bill doesn’t satisfactorily address this situation, does emphasise that the same “controversy” of Ngāi Tahu having rangatiratanga over most of the South Island, whatever that implies, exists under the Treaty of Waitangi anyway.

Can Mr Luxon come off the fence that he is trying to sit on, and explain this situation to us.

Also can Winston engage with this situation, since his stance of “the Treaty has no Principles so we aren’t involved with a bill that in its name implies that there are, does not help here, as the situation does arise from the Treaty itself saying – as the late Maori King stated “There’s no principles, the Treaty is written. That’s it” – so Article 2 guarantees Māori rangatiratanga, which is the right of chieftains to exercise authority over their lands, villages, and other properties, is “actually written”, and the Ngai Tahu rohe is pretty much the whole of Te Waipounamu – Cook Strait to the Bluff, and Rakiura beyond.

So it is not a only a problem with Seymour’s bill, which at present will go away when Luxon and Winston help vote it away, but a problem also of the Treaty which remains – it will not go away – because “it is written”

Obviously Treaty Article 3 – all are same as the “people of England” – does not allow the exercise of tino rangatiratanga in Article 2, since that is an unworkable situation, that the “people of England” did not, and still do not have – and that is as it is written

But of course what has happened is that the rohe, the tribally controlled area, has by Ngai Tahu’s own acceptance (until now maybe, but it is too late) that the Pakeha settlers and their generations are interspersed among the rohe all over the place, so the rohe can not now be defined, a circumstance unforeseen.

So Ngai Tahu is in control of what? The Treaty, as it is “just written” has become obsolete, itself unworkable, overtaken by obviously unforeseen circumstances, which now questions the Treaty’s all-knowning wisdom and sacred tapu status.

An alternative may lie in the 7am post on Kiwiblog –
Berlin police chief says Jews and gays should hide
Entire neighbourhoods that are ~~pro-terrorist~~ ! pro-tino rangatiratanga

Doesn’t happen – so, is the Treaty keeping up?
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:02am
- rouppe
  
  My view is that tino rangatiratanga doesn’t mean Ngai Tahu, for example, get to make decisions that affect everyone else.
  
  It means that if they want to build a shed on their property, they can, just like I can on my property, with both of us subject to local planning rules.
  
  A loss of tino rangatiratanga would mean they can’t do what I can do, or worse, I can negatively affect them by dint of my race.
  
  25 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:15am
  - Burtland
    
    do you have tino rangatiratanga over what you have legally sold ?
    – seems a stretch, but hey, the treaty has become just one big stretch
    
    20 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:54am
    - rouppe
      
      My answer to that would be no.
      
      The current owner now has it on that parcel.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 10:36am
    - KH
      
      “…..tino rangatiratanga….”. The rugby club has it over the rugby club. As do Federated Farmers have it over Federated Farmers, but not all farming.
      And Ngai Tahu have it over their organisations, but nothing much else.
      Nothing stopping any of those just getting on with it. Go for it folks.
      
      0 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:29pm
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    That’s right. The Waitangi Tribunal’s official translation of the Maori text says that ‘rangatiratanga’ is best understood as the English concept of ‘trusteeship’, which is essentially looking after property on behalf of others. It does not include law making or other political or constitutional powers.
    
    https://www.waitangitribunal.govt.nz/en/about/the-treaty/maori-and-english-versions
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:04am
    - Yvette
      
      It may not be that simple Nigel, as the Confederation Declaration of Independence was all about ‘rangatiratanga’ – chieftanship, ruling an area – and that was not redefined by the Treaty (vast mistake) with its new terms, and that was just 5 years earlier compared to any interpretation 184 years after the Treaty. – Devil’s Advocate, downtick away …
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:59pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

‘Lawyer up guys’: MAGA lawyer threatens Trump’s prosecutors — with a specific statute.
Trump did say he was going to do this. Let the fun begin. Prosecutors, Lawyers, Judges etc are all in the crosshairs. They all thought Trump was going to lose especially with the Democrat cheating.

“That’s when government officials conspire amongst themselves, and including private citizens like Andrew Weissman and Norm Eisen and others – when they conspire to violate the constitutional rights of Americans – you’re violating 18 USC §241,” Davis said. “When you politicize and weaponize intel agencies and law enforcement to go after your political enemies for non-crimes, that is the very definition of a violation of 18 USC §241.”

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/lawyer-up-guys-maga-lawyer-threatens-trump-s-prosecutors-with-a-specific-statute/ar-AA1uKEw4?
33 5
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:12am
- All_on_Red
  
  It’s nice froth for clickbait but I’m not sure Trump will
  Hard to prove a Conspiracy unless you have documentation showing they deliberately worked together
  The Democrat way is more like ‘having a common purpose with a mutual interest ’ and each doing their part separately but in step
  That’s easy to do if 90% of the Govt votes Democrat
  Trump will likely stamp down on preventing non citizens from voting and get the DOJ to chase those elected officials who are flouting the law but I wonder in the sake of unity he forgoes revenge on the other nonsense
  We’ll see
  His popularity is now up to 54% so taking revenge might leave a sour note
  Heck, he’s destroyed Obamas legacy…
  
  18 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:06am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Good point about proving conspiracy without documentation.
    The Dems will have conspired verbally, in person.
    Labour does the same and tells new MPs to avoid putting anything in writing until it is approved.
    Probably the other parties are the same.
    
    14 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:24am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Trump wants crooked Judges such as Engoron and Merchan prosecuted.
    I mean Engoron wanted Trump on a bail/bond of way over $400 million. That is Election interference. Then there are people like Jack Smith, Letitia James, Alvin Bragg who just wanted to jail Trump on jacked up charges.
    
    13 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:52am
    - leoj
      
      At the very least it will keep the Dems on the back foot.
      
      The scum Dems (just look at the way they tried to ruin a good man like Bret Kavanaugh) need to be held to account so I hope Trump does not relent now that he’s in control. The Dems deserve no less than firing where appropriate and jailing too, if laws were broken.
      
      As my all-time favourite radio talk-back host Rush Limbaugh always said: The Dems are against all that is good about the USA but we should keep a few around just to remind us how bad they are for the country.
      
      Personally, I want the Dems crushed beyond recognition.
      
      4 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 1:29pm
  - Keith White
    
    When you’re 78 and have twice been elected POTUS and beaten all the Democrat traitors and lawyers and assassins (but I repeat myself) – what sour notes would you worry about?
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 5:41pm
- peterwn
  
  The US Supreme Court would have to be completely warped to uphold the use of this enactment to persecute Trump’s enemies. There is also the matter of judicial immunity (no judge is going to accept appointment if they risk being thrown into jail because their decisions are not flavour of the day). But then anything is possible. So USA may become a one party dictatorship with a succession of presidents appointed by their immediate predecessors starting with Trump.
  
  7 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:12am
  - imalwaysright
    
    “to persecute Trump’s enemies..”
    
    Trump may be the focal point, but these people undermined the Constitution and the American democracy.
    Next time it won’t be Trump, but the same tactics, unless eliminated, will be used against any other opponent.
    This is about excising a cancer.
    
    12 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:55am
    - peterwn
      
      That is for the US Supreme Court to decide unless they are completely politically biased. Also probably every dictator has spouted similar BS to your comment to justify flexing their power.
      
      3 5
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:16am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Somewhat an overreaction to a straightforward comment, but thankyou for your extrapolation.
        
        5 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:44am
Matt Long

Genocide, ˈdʒen.ə.saɪd. Noun, whatever Israel does. “Israel is committing genocide in…”
Genocide denier, anyone who attempts to define genocide according to historical or etymological norms.
https://www.wsj.com/opinion/the-u-ns-anti-israel-genocide-purge-c8feef1a
21 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:12am
Maggy Wassilieff

Did the NZ taxpayer pay for the organisation of last week’s Hikoi?

While evasive regarding answers surrounding the use of parliamentary resources in relation to the hīkoi to Parliament, organised by a Te Pāti Māori staffer, Eru Kapa-Kingi, Ngarewa-Packer admitted: “He’s partly paid by parliamentary services.”

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2024/11/26/centrist-debbie-ngarewa-packer-admits-maori-have-different-rights/
56 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:13am
- Cassandra
  
  Yes, taxpayers funded the whole thing.
  
  47 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:15am
  - john1234
    
    And taxpayer owned TVNZ did the car koi’s PR promotion work for free!
    
    48 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:22am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Even the Wellington civil servants were paid while attending.
    Corruption.
    
    49 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:26am
  - kowtow
    
    No doubt we also funded the advertsing for it ,for that is what te media paahti’s role was .
    
    If not directly to the media through state broadcasters but also “private” ones as we spend a huge amount invarious govt stupid ad “campaigns’ into the media world too.
    
    33 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:55am
    - imalwaysright
      
      And don’t forget the schools who used the children as political fodder.
      
      No principals sacked yet.
      Waiting …
      Waiting….
      
      28 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:27am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Other peoples children.
        
        6 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:45am
- Yvette
  
  The Wolf is out of the bag
  – the Wolf of Wall Street …
  “We have different expectations and different rights, absolutely.”
  She argued these rights are essential to protect all New Zealanders from “corporate exploitation” and the “Atlas agenda coming at us”.
  Ngawera-Packer offered as proof of an “Atlas conspiracy” the suggestion that the libertarian-leaning Atlas Network is chaired by Debbi Gibbs, whose mother, Dame Jenny Gibbs, is an ACT party donor.
  https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2024/11/26/centrist-debbie-ngarewa-packer-admits-maori-have-different-rights/
  
  Only days earlier –
  As part of the messaging, we should make clear the ties that Seymour and his backers have to corporate interests, both domestic and international and their plans to appropriate and exploit natural and public resources for private enrichment. The message should be simple: The Treaty protects all New Zealanders from corporate exploitation. This bill is about the people (tangata whenua and tangata tiriti) vs corporate profits.
  https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2024/11/general_debate_22_november_2024.html#comment-3647752.
  
  17 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:34am
  - peterwn
    
    And even Curia polls is alleged to be part of the Atlas network!
    
    26 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:02am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Where in the Treaty is there mention of ‘Tangata Tiriti’ ?
      That is a radical Maori construct, trying to prove partnership.
      
      14 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 10:56am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Don,
        These activist fuckers have succeeded in showing how privileged and entitled they themselves are.
        They couldn’t care less about the real people they pretend to represent.
        In fact, once the activists get their hands on the money, the existential threat becomes those very people.
        God forbid they ask for a share if the spoils !!
        
        7 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:52am
  - Swifty
    
    Politics 101.
    
    Identify an enemy, cloak them with all sorts of demonising language (invent it if you need to) to get people all scared and riled up, and then position yourselves as the cavalry riding to the rescue – “If you want to be protected from these Nazis them vote for us”.
    
    Yep, classic playbook stuff and so extraordinarily fake and transparently so.
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:19am
    - Swifty
      
      *For Nazis, feel free to substitute Jews, ‘bosses’, white mofos, anyone on the right etc etc….
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:33pm
- AitchW
  
  Every week it appears that the Maori party is caught out spending money from the taxpayer to promote itself or to subsidise its members lifestyles.
  And every week the media pretty much ignore it and there appear to be no consequences for its blatant grift.
  What does it have to do to be pulled up and made accountable?
  
  49 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:46am
  - RoboRob
    
    I think the Maori party would need to have a non Maori member. Then TVNZ / RNZ etc could do negative stories around that person. As we all know, by lived experience, the media wont run negative stories around Maori.
    
    31 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:00am
Cassandra

TOP NATO OFFICIAL: BUSINESS LEADERS MUST GET ON A WAR FOOTING — Dutch Admiral Rob Bauer, the chair of NATO’s military committee, urged the private sector in NATO countries to prepare for a wartime scenario, including by adjusting supply chains to lessen dependence on adversaries. “If we can make sure that all crucial services and goods can be delivered no matter what, then that is a key part of our deterrence,” Bauer said today. This is a crucial matter – NZ has no supply capability, everything that’s essential for a functioning state (energy, medicine, many food items, vehicles, spare parts) is imported and funded by exports. When the supply chain closes – and it will unless we take action – we’ll cease to function. People like Don Brash and Helen Clark, who argue for disarmament, are living in lala land.
28 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:14am
- Simon
  
  There will be no supply chain breakdown. Your chain is being pulled. China isn’t a threat to NZ.
  
  Missiles and drones to defend NZ. We don’t need NATO. Independent NZ, free from GAE, guaranteed by new military reality. Pure defence affordable and possible.
  
  7 21
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:28am
  - imalwaysright
    
    NZ can’t be defended.
    Anyone could park a submarine in any of our harbours and it would be total instant surrender.
    
    21 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:09am
    - rouppe
      
      If it’s a nuclear submarine then Russell Norman could paddle out to it in his kayak and deal to it… //
      
      27 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:19am
      - Don Beckett
        
        Yeah – beat it into submission/sinking with his fwag. 😆
        
        9 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:58am
    - nathie
      
      Not quite, Navy and Air Force have anti-submarine capabilities. And we work with our allies to help track them.
      
      Which as a small nation is to our advantage as the (greater) costs are largely carried by them. We need to do more to contribute.
      
      But guess who tried to “kill” those anti-submarine capabilities off when she was last in power? – Yep good ol’ Red Helen!
      
      And guess who continues to rally against working with our allies? Yep good ol’ Red Helen! And her band of merry collaborators and useful idiots!
      
      20 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:27am
      - nathie
        
        To clarify, Clark’s Labour Govt refused to upgrade the P-3 Orion aircraft’s 1960’s-era anti-submarine warfare systems when in power in the 2000’s.
        
        Here’s an article discussing this back in 2001. So who to believe – Clark or the actual people that are the subject matter experts?!
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/sub-hunters-say-pm-out-of-her-depth-over-claims/7KAYWMQLKWSYHSKZMZXK4B2Y4M/
        
        Note that the threat then were from Soviet submarines from their limited Pacific fleet, nowadays the threat is from an ever expanding CCP Navy that far, far exceeds the former USSR’s efforts).
        
        (National finally upgraded them when they replaced Clark’s govt in the 2010’s).
        
        Thankfully (to their credit) the recent Labour Govt carried on with National’s plans to replace the 1960’s vintage P-3 Orion aircraft with the new P-8 Poseidon aircraft, but that was due to NZ First holding the Deputy PM and Defence Minister roles and forcing the issue. Presumably Clark wasn’t impressed!
        
        Clark, of course, wouldn’t fund the replacement of the 1970 bought Leander-class anti-submarine Frigate, HMNZS Canterbury in 2000, instead bought patrol boats for EEZ patrols (with zero anti-submarine systems nor self-defence systems) which cannot be put into harms way to defend NZ or NZ’s interests in the South Pacific!
        
        The Coalition Govt needs to get cracking and sort these capability shortfalls out (and it takes time to bring new capabilities into service, so get on with it)!
        
        15 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:52am
      - NothingLeft
        
        Drones and AI are going to rapidly revolutionize cutting edge military tech. Likely most of what is currently fielded will soon be obsolete.
        
        And soon there will be space weapons (given how cheap space access will soon be) That is terrifying from a first strike perspective – a thousand stealthy warheads could be targeted from space to re-enter and strike globally distributed targets within a few seconds of each other, and with no more than 3-4 seconds warning. No possible defense and no way of identifying origin.
        
        9 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:42am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Nathie,
        The last thing the New Zealand navy sank was themselves, but you make good points.
        
        11 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:00am
    - David Garrett
      
      imalways: No need for said submarine to be “parked in a harbour mate”, one such vessel offshore armed with MIRV’s would do it. One MIRV missile could take out every city in NZ with a population of 80,000 or more.
      
      16 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:30am
      - imalwaysright
        
        If we can convince them to allow one of our lady luvvin’ lady navy boat drivers to have a go driving their submarine we may just have a chance…
        
        12 2
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:08am
      - alwyn.a
        
        I have been told, by someone who was familiar with the technology that the missiles targeting is limited to a “few hundred kilometers” apart for the individual warheads.
        They might have to use 2 or 3 of them to cover the whole country.
        That doesn’t cheer me up very much though.
        
        10 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:21am
    - pdm
      
      Wouldn’t want to see an unfriendly aircraft carrier cruising south past Cape Reinga.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:19am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      iamalwaysright – Who says NZ can’t be defended? The toxic greens and the TPM warriors will row a boat to the submarine and start singing and do a haka. Game over.
      
      8 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:04pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      Anyone could park a submarine in any of our harbours and it would be total instant surrender.
      
      You mean in addition to the ones already in our waters?
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:03pm
    - Terry Dalee
      
      “God defend New Zealand…”
      
      Not just a national anthem… But fundamental New Zealand defence policy…..
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:32pm
    - Ra Henare
      
      Why is it that Keyboard warriors cant think past the end of their nose!!!
      
      Re China invading NZ.
      1. Why!!!!!!!!!!!
      They have NEVER invaded a country that is not on their border!!!
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_People's_Republic_of_China
      
      2. The defence of NZ will not be done by formal military Units, as any brief look at a map will attest. 15,000 Km Border!!!!
      It will be done with Freedom fighter tactics(dare I say terrorism against the invader…..)
      Oops I promised myself not to compare Palestine’s struggle against the Invader….FAIL.
      
      3 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:49pm
      - Grunter
        
        Exactly Ra…..
        
        I now try to avoid geopolitical debates on KB as it is mostly pointless, brainwashed rubbish. But often I can’t resist.
        
        The biggest scam in Western society right now is the crap that the US Military Industrial Complex (MIC) spew out and the old-school MSM just copy & paste as ‘News’
        
        3 3
        Report
        November 27, 2024 4:24pm
  - Dead Earnest
    
    Worked for Belgium did it Simon???
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:17am
  - Cassandra
    
    If there’s military action around Taiwan, for example, or South Korea then the supply chain will be disrupted. So Singapore has a large Navy and Air Force plus a 4 Division Army for no reason? Japan is rearming just for fun? The Aussies are spending umpteen zillions because they have nothing better to do? Get real. If we don’t play a part in keeping the sea lanes open then we will be isolated with nothing going out or coming in. It’s not a matter of “defending New Sealand”.
    
    18 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:41am
  - JackRabbit
    
    China isn’t a threat to NZ.
    You are correct. China needs trade to survive.
    
    China is however a threat to the USA economy. China is sneaky and commercially competitive. But so is the USA.
    
    As old man Rockefeller said “Competition is a sin”.
    
    Rule 57 from the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition: “Good customers are as rare as latinum—treasure them.”
    
    Old Chinese proverb: “If you shoot your customers today, you will have no-one to sell your wares to tomorrow.”
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 2:11pm
- kowtow
  
  I’d be a marginally impressed with all this NATO sabre rattling if their govts weren’t going Lala over climate spend and deindustrialising the west .
  
  latest news from Germany in decline is Thyssenkrup layoffs.
  
  You can’t make gun barrels out of soy lattes.
  
  26 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:58am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Kow
    Two sides of the same coin.
    War/ Climate Change.
    Both mean taking money from the public.
    Its the greatest heist in human history.
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 11:06am
    - JackRabbit
      
      War/ Climate Change / Deadly Vaccines.
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:17pm
- Grunter
  
  Lala Land thinking that we can magic up all our own stuff somehow……”unless we take action….”
  
  And the obvious question Cassandra – What action are you suggesting we take? Specifics….?
  
  6 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:39am
  - Cassandra
    
    Replace the frigates. Plus a bit around the edges but the important thing is to play our part. Three frigates would do it.
    
    10 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:25am
    - Grunter
      
      3 frigates…..? We may as well do nothing. Seriously, this line of “we must do our part” is just nonsense in today’s modern warfare world.
      
      If there is a war over Taiwan then the global supply chain and the interdependent global economy is buggered.
      
      3 NZ frigates would be sitting ducks for any enemy missiles. They’d be sunk on Day 1 of any war.
      
      6 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 10:38am
      - imalwaysright
        
        G
        Correct.
        The only consideration of the enemy is the cost of the three missiles necessary to destroy our port bound navy versus the unlikelihood of them actually reaching a conflict zone.
        
        2 2
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:11am
      - Cassandra
        
        Our frigates would be part of an ANZAC contribution to an Allied fleet. Each component would have its complementary role. Ours would probably be ASW, with air defence provided by USN. The allied navies would all work together, as has been planned and rehearsed for decades. Ever since the first ANZUS desk officer of which I was number 20 about what feels like a century ago. Grunter: stick to commenting on things you know something about.
        
        7 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:08pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        Cas
        “Ever since the first ANZUS desk officer of which I was number 20..”
        
        Not sure what exactly that is, but I assume you were in the armed forces and at a level that was influential.
        However, NZ is fixated on being a much smaller variation of Britain but without the wherewithal.
        NZ Defense Force would struggle to get out of the mess nevermind fight a battle, assuming they could get there.
        Look around the world. Wars aren’t fought with people and rifles, they are fought with drones and missiles.
        Bravery and good intentions are irrelevant.
        
        1 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:45pm
      - Grunter
        
        Cassandra
        That might have worked decades ago but now it’s totally out of date.
        “stick to commenting on things you know something about…” Yep – that convinced me!
        
        0 4
        Report
        November 27, 2024 4:30pm
    - pdm
      
      I heard Seymour say yesterday part of ACT’s wish list was to start upgrading NZ Defence forces.
      
      Obviously that dipped out in the Coalition negotiations.
      
      Looking at you Christopher Luxon and Winston Peters.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:24am
      - Cassandra
        
        They’ve both said it’s got to happen but with the implication that it’s “not yet”. Yet has arrived.
        
        4 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:10pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      With the money Ardern and the Stooges borrowed and printed and then pissed up against the wall, we would have enough for several squadrons of F18’s and a second hand aircraft carrier or two.
      
      Being a narrow country, with 4 main centres, defense aircraft could be anywhere in 20 minutes from take off.
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:15pm
- nigel2010
  
  if those out there don’t think this will happen a DHL jet crashed in Europe only this week killing the pilot, it is reported as suspicious so the disruption begins
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:14am
- JackRabbit
  
  …NATO countries to prepare for a wartime scenario…
  
  Yep, NATO has that war planned…
  
  0 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 2:01pm
Yvette

Dr Bryce Edwards – Democracy Briefing: Foundations of a constitutional crisis?

Summary
David Seymour’s Treaty Principles Bill has sparked debates about sovereignty, governance, and judicial activism in New Zealand. The bill asserts Parliament’s supremacy, while Te Pāti Māori argues Māori never ceded sovereignty. Beyond this, tensions between Parliament and the courts have emerged, with concerns over judicial overreach. Critics like Roger Partridge and Liam Hehir highlight cases like Taylor v NZ Poultry Board and the Peter Ellis case as examples of courts asserting quasi-constitutional roles, often invoking the Treaty of Waitangi ambiguously. Former PM Geoffrey Palmer advocates for checks and balances, warning unchecked judicial activism could erode democratic principles and create governance paralysis.
https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/dr-bryce-edwards-democracy-briefing-foundations-of-a-constitutional-crisis

Consider the Ellis case –

• Peter Ellis appeal derailed by legal curveball on possible tikanga Māori approach
The case was adjourned for five weeks to allow both sides to bring submissions addressing the issue of tikanga, and will continue in the new year. [it in fact took longer, and several assembled experts later]
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/117435500/peter-ellis-appeal-derailed-by-legal-curveball-on-possible-tikanga-mori-approach.

So it was not a matter of arguing common decency of protecting an ongoing reputation although the victim of legal misconduct had died his legacy should be corrected, as akin to tikanga for example? No, the matter of tikanga had been waiting attention –

Justices Joe Williams and Susan Glazebrook threw a curveball into the arguments from both sides when they suggested that New Zealand didn’t need to follow decisions set in any other country, and could establish an entirely new rule based on tikanga Māori.

“There’s nothing to say that the appellant’s case dies when they do … This is a very western idea that on demise you have nothing to protect,” Williams said.

Has the Supreme Court of New Zealand perhaps with the Peter Ellis case introduced a tikanga agenda, purportedly relating to the respect of Peter Ellis’ reputation, but in fact utterly disrespecting the case overall, to progress its own case / agenda?

So David Seymour’s Treaty Principles Bill did not appeal to the Hikoi o Muto and the Supreme Court may not be thrilled with it either

The flak [fliegerabwehrkanonen] is always heaviest over the target. If it’s coming at you from all sides, chances are you’re closer to success than you may think. Keep going, you’re almost there.

And, can Luxon not see past the sand-bags?

Caleb Anderson: The Emergence of a State Religion and the Deification of the Treaty –

I believe that we should be very concerned about the creep of pantheistic religion into public life. Increasingly, references to things spiritual have been used to silence debate, or to fill the gaps when logic, reason, and facts are lacking. Not infrequent assertions that the Treaty is a spiritual taonga, vested with mystical power, in and of itself, is a clear effort to make the arguments of its most animated adherents uncontestable. When you move into the realm of the mystical, reason no longer applies, and familiar democratic safeguards can be progressively dismantled.
https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/caleb-anderson-the-emergence-of-a-state-religion-and-the-deification-of-the-treaty

Fliegerabwehrkanonen, Flak!
15 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:19am
cas

Some interesting comments in the latest Listener by Danyl McLauchlan about how Chris Luxon is struggling with the Treaty principles Bill.

He makes the observation that “TPM instead öf being a parliamentary party is an activist movement operating out of Parliament. Its goal is to challenge the sovereignty of that institution and deliver self governance for Maori, not to indulge the ritual and procedures of the house”.

He doesn’t think Luxon is dealing well with the problems but does say “But there’s a contingent of Luxon’s party who quietly worry that Seymour might be right. The courts and many public sector agencies have adopted positions on the treaty that are closer to Te Pati Maori’s than Nationals, The next left-wing government will almost certainly have Te Pati Maori ministers in cabinet, leading to a rapid and radical shift towards political separatism. Isn’t it better to prevent that now, instead of trying to wind the clock back after the fact?
38 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:20am
- nathie
  
  Well if leftie Danyl McLauchlan is outing TPM for being radicals (which we here know of course) with a non-democratic agenda, then hopefully it leads to this fact being more openly discussed (particularly amongst the centre-left and msm) and both National AND Labour does more to call them out.
  
  Sometimes National does (more please, of course), but the pressure needs to be applied Labour to acknowledge the “threat” and change course.
  
  Presumably leftie Danyl McLaughlin can see that threat and is speaking out. A bit like how Chris Trotter does the same (but is shouted down by his own side).
  
  Perhaps TPM being the radical divisive fools themselves may finally start getting called out instead of being given a free pass (by the likes of the MSM), but more importantly moderate Maori people speak out against them.
  
  And some of them are already saying so, by stating that TPM do not represent all Maori. (And perhaps woke leftie Pakeha can then take note – stop enabling racial division by appeasing these radicals and their agendas). May more of these authentic voices be heard!
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:16am
- pdm
  
  “But there’s a contingent of Luxon’s party who quietly worry that Seymour might be right. ”
  
  It would be interesting to know some names. I will start the ball rolling with a few absolute guesses:
  Mark Mitchell
  Scott Simpson
  Suze Redmayne
  Dana Kirkpatrick
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:32am
  - leoj
    
    Mitchell is weak. Who are those others?
    
    The only Nat making sense is Simeon Brown. Otherwise, the namby-pamby description fits the party well.
    
    Luxon needs to be rolled. Woke, weak and completely out of touch.
    
    2 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 1:36pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  But there’s a contingent of Luxon’s party who quietly worry that Seymour might be right. The courts and many public sector agencies have adopted positions on the treaty that are closer to Te Pati Maori’s than Nationals,…
  
  Otherwise known as the “Doh!” contingent of National. This is why we’re in this situation now; in the previous Key government these people just dum-de-dummed along like Winnie The Pooh while the cunning ones who support this – Finlayson to the fore – kept busy changing those legal and public sector structures.
  
  Now the Bears Of Little Brain are “quietly worried” about the resulting divergence?
  
  Idiots.
  
  But in a few years they’ll be gone and a new generation of National MP’s will just accept the Finlayson-Judicial-Public Sector view and talk about how they’ll manage it better, preventing its excesses, once they get back into government, circa 2038, just in time for the TOW turning 200. That’s how it works and Te Piati Maori and the activists – who are chatting happily with those parts of National – know it.
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:25pm
Mark Hanley

Is it just me or is Jenna Lynch getting angrier and not even attempting to hide her anger at the successful coalition governing NZ?

Unfortunately for Jenna she fits the mold of most NZ political journalists. Jenna’s inane questions and accusations are easily battered away by Luxon and Seymour.

Seymours position allows him to be more direct, and he pointed out Jenna’s wish to make the news rather than report the news, rather well.
37 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:20am
- Paulus
  
  You must feel sorry for Jenna but Tova is away at the moment so time to showus her true faces.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:36am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  She can see this will not be a pone term government, the stupidity of them to think so to begin with says it all, there was many many very angry voters including many lifetime Labour voters, look at Nats winning a couple of seats in Labour strong holds in Auckland. good luck with their stupidity thinking centre voters will want greenies and TPM in cabinet
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 2:00pm
  - Bobba Fret
    
    But she will continue to discredit the government and do everything she can to try and make them a one term government.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 3:27pm
Matt Long

Congratulations to the Mighty All Blacks on their new sponsorship deals with Bud Light, Jaguar and Parliamentary Services.
Aoteoroa stands behind you.
56 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:20am
- Paulus
  
  Pity New Zealand once again loses out !
  
  24 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:31am
- Burtland
  
  is Razor better than Raygun?
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:04am
- Burtland
  
  NZRFU is fully infected with the “DEI mind virus” – goneburger
  
  the last edifice of the patriarchy slides into the swamp
  
  21 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:47am
Bridgenag

who is the media now?
buggywhip manufacturer berates henry ford

“they’re just awful. all they do is lie. the ones the government pays for are on record calling the truth a distraction from getting things done.
one cannot help but be struck by how contrived, captured, and corrupt media has become. and an awful lot of people have seen it and walked away. the ratings drops have been savage, relentless, and seemingly unstaunchable.”

https://open.substack.com/pub/boriquagato/p/who-is-the-media-now?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
13 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:21am
- blue collar
  
  Until musk buys MSNBC…..
  its ratings will skyrocket and be the highest
  
  Until then , Joe Rogan , Sean Ryan and X will dominate
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 2:52pm
Simon

If NZ had a functioning media we would already know what happened with that Navy boat Manawanui. In the end it’s NZ’s boat not the navy. But MSM are part of the state.
24 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:21am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  RNZN to issue the interim report this week.
  
  That is FAST. When a civilian ship is investigated it takes months if not years for the MSA and/or TAIC to report.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:16am
  - Paulus
    
    Bet we see nly the redacted report of this sinking – and why ?
    
    8 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:37am
- imalwaysright
  
  The media sold their independence when they signed up to the Adern diktat over coverage of the proposed trial of the Christchurch murderer.
  They agreed to publish only what the Adern regime told them to.
  They have been willing eunuchs ever since.
  
  18 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:35am
- Nobby2
  
  Simon, it’s a ship not a boat. Suggest you do some research before you make a comment on something.
  
  0 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:18pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Elon Waiting For Black Friday Half-Off Sale So He Can Buy MSNBC For Just $30.
Bummer, what is Rachael Maddow going to do?

https://babylonbee.com/news/elon-waiting-for-black-friday-half-off-sale-so-he-can-buy-msnbc-for-just-30?
17 3
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:46am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I would be surprised. Wouldn’t it be better to just let MSNBC to go out of business?
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:49am
  - Cassandra
    
    He’d take some pleasure in 1. getting rid of most of the staff, and 2. turning it back into a profitable business. Although I suspect he’s quite busy in DC at present.
    
    14 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:53am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Yeah, in DC he’s going to do what’s needs doing in NZ.
      You’re fired, FIRED!!
      
      12 4
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 8:58am
      - Fender
        
        while I totally agree with eliminating the overstuffed bureaucracy especially the MOE, I am also, for last few months looking for work after 23 years in one place and it is not good, word is that the downsizing of wellington has suddenly given agencies a huge boost in their choice of applicants where they were starved of good choices previously. An IT job I applied for last week had 206 applicants in a week and that’s not in a big city. I am not entitled to dole as my wife works and mentally it’s tough, I’m not sure we should be celebrating so many being out of work. Who knows what they did before the ministries ramped up apart from teachers moving to MOE. Where did they all come from because there doesn’t seem to be the option of them just going back.
        
        13 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:30am
      - NothingLeft
        
        Oof. May not get better.
        
        AI industry insiders are now generally picking smart-as-human AGI in ’26-27, and smarter than all humans ASI within a year or two after that.
        
        World seems to be pretending that life is just going to continue as usual, but the next 5 years are going to be absolutely brutal as AGI progressively eliminates office jobs and then likely whole professions – staring with graduates and rapidly going up the chain. Most won’t be able to find new jobs and our economic system, predicated on human labour having value, can’t survive such a radical change – it will cause social/economic collapse.
        
        When will population (and politicians lagging them) finally wake up to this asteroid hurtling towards us?
        
        4 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:24am
      - Local Miller
        
        NothingLeft – The future of AI is no where near a certain as some pendants like to claim. AI as we see it is based on massive processing power that doesn’t scale down into small devices the size of a human brain. While there are claims that AI is approaching human capability, there are significant counter claims that it’s hitting a brick wall of ability. A small increase in ability requires a massive increase in processing power.
        Look up Sabine Hossenfelder on YouTube particularly her article “Has AI already hit the wall”. She’s a physicist who left the plantation when she saw how corrupt it was.
        It will be a very long time before machines are anywhere near capable of replacing people in any significant capacity and numbers.
        
        4 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 1:37pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Local Miller; I have been following AI technology closely for years. Sabine is smart, and I watch most of her vids, but she’s necessarily an AI dilettante given all the things she spends time on.
        
        All the barriers to AGI exceeding human reasoning are rapidly evaporating. AGI is not here yet, though AI is already superhuman in many capabilities, but there is diminishing doubt that there is any impediment to it being created in near future. Might be as little as a year, could be as much as 10years, but most likely in 2-5 years range according to leaders of big AI developers – a belief mirrored in prediction markets.
        
        The key at this point is developing the best methodologies for recursion – feeding outputs back to inputs to sense check and filter out most promising results, just as our own brains do. There have been breakthroughs in last 12 months in this that lead most insiders to believe we are very near to AGI, and AI is rapidly climbing up towards (or has already exceeded) human level on all the various assessments that have been developed (eg ARC-AGI prize sees top AI system currently at 48% on test that humans average about 60% on – prize will be awarded at 85%)
        
        0 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 3:22pm
    - carlsbad apple
      
      Yet the $13 billion that Elon Musk borrowed to buy Twitter has turned into the worst merger-finance deal for banks since the 2008-09 financial crisis.
      
      0 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:44pm
      - Conservatarian
        
        Musk paid a $15b premium ($44b paid less its then valuation $29b) to buy back free speech for Twitter users. The pushback from the Twitter board and management and the Democrat-media complex at large from Mush acquiring Twitter means the leftists valued this avenue to control the narrative at at least $15b.
        
        As a result X is now ideologically evenly spread and the right gained an even playing field of this avenue of news and opinion to go with their dominance of podcasts and new media. This is why Leftists are losing it over Musk.
        
        2 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 6:23pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    $30 is a good price to make a News Channel.//
    
    10 4
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:56am
    - Burtland
      
      thats $30 more than Stuff
      
      12 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:07am
      - Blog-aholic
        
        $29.00 more.
        
        9 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:32am
      - Flossie
        
        $29 more isn’t it?
        
        13 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:39am
      - Paulus
        
        NAH !~
        $29 more
        
        8 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:39am
      - Burtland
        
        more like $50 at the current exchange rate 🤣
        
        5 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:04am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Yes, I don’t see any point in buying it
    More people get news from X than they do from MSNBC
    He’ll generate better Ad revenue from that rather than a small Cable network
    Besides Maddow just signed a five year contract for $25m
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 8:58am
    - Inandout
      
      AoR, yes she may have signed a contract but the devil is in the detail as to where the escape clause for MSNBC is situated.
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:13am
    - Blog-aholic
      
      Better to let it goes bust and by the assets….MadCow is no asset.
      
      9 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:33am
      - carlsbad apple
        
        MadCow? Really? It’s as if some of you get scripts from Bannon and Stone.
        
        1 3
        Report
        November 27, 2024 2:46pm
    - Raphael
      
      can you imagine if Musk did buy it and made Joe Rogan her co-host
      
      3 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:32pm
- NothingLeft
  
  MS~~NBC~~DNC
  
  5 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:11am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  You guys do know the babylon bee is satire right?
  
  6 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:18am
Benedict Yu

So New Zealand’s biggest solar energy provider has gone bust.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360500886/nzs-biggest-solar-power-provider-solarzero-liquidation

Despite receiving $80 million from the 100 percent government owned Green Investment Finance.

https://www.nzgif.co.nz/about-us/who-we-are

Why is this company still giving out money and receiving capital from the government?

I keep saying it. Yes this government has killed some of the last government’s most spectacular idiotic policies, like the RMA replacements, the mega polytechnic and a dozen others. However there are hundreds of poor policies that are still intact. The current government’s climate change policies, for example, are not materially different from those of the last government.
46 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:48am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  That money came from the previous government.
  
  Who set up this green investment finance? i seem to have heard this for sometime
  
  11 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 8:50am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    As usual, you do not address my comment.
    
    Green Investment Finance Limited is still operating. Simon Watts and Nicola Willis are the two shareholders. In other words, the current government. The company is happily carrying on, taking on commercial risks while being 100 percent owned by the government.
    
    Can you explain why?
    
    26 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:06am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Don’t as usual me.
      
      The fact is this company was started under the previous poisonous regime
      
      3 19
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:13am
      - Grunter
        
        “Don’t as usual me….” 🤣🤣
        
        That’s funny..!
        
        12 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:44am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        You still don’t address my comment.
        
        If the company is poisonous why hasn’t the government wound it up?
        
        I won’t “as usual” you as soon as you stop answering me in non sequiturs. 😅
        
        16 4
        Report
        November 27, 2024 10:47am
      - Matt Long
        
        G, that is why we have elections, if one party is setting up things we don’t like, we elect another party to dismantle them.
        Or we elect a party that justs carries on as Labour Lite.
        
        6 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:43am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Grunter
        
        Again i will not be dictated too or ridiculed by anyone
        
        0 4
        Report
        November 27, 2024 2:02pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Diddums.
        
        1 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 3:41pm
    - blue collar
      
      Because Willis is a green lunatic
      She will do anything to push the agenda
      National need to sack her and kick her and any other green psychopaths out of the party
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:59pm
    - Ra Henare
      
      Bene, rather than acting the petulant child.
      ie As usual you do not address my comment.
      
      Sure pose the question.
      Can you explain why. But maybe throw in some ideas of your own.
      
      Perhaps, cutting down a Forrest can’t all be done on day one, so select the biggest fattest trees(Policies/staffing) first.
      Leave the saplings(This small fry company, few employees?) until later.
      
      Just a thought
      
      https://www.treasury.govt.nz/information-and-services/commercial-portfolio-and-advice/commercial-portfolio/nz-green-investment-finance
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 3:04pm
  - RoboRob
    
    BY’s point is that this agency still exists and is therefore still being funded by the tax payer. Still existing means that the current government still supports it.
    
    However I will give the current govt some slack as they have had a lot to shut down and reverse in the first year. That said if this and other virtue signalling slush funds are not cut this coming year I strongly challenge the govts cost cutting measures claim.
    
    Remember at this point the # of govt employees is only down to just under what it was when they came to power and the govt is borrowing MORE money then GR was. We need to see major departmental restructuring including the closing of a large number of departments (Womans, childrens, PI, Islanders, Maori1, Maori2, Maori3, Maori4 etc)
    
    23 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:11am
    - imalwaysright
      
      “We need to see major departmental restructuring..”
      
      The past year has seen very little progress in this area.
      The government has to take drastic measures, we are in the equivalent of a post war economy. A war that we lost.
      Trying to talk the public service into reducing their cost and increasing their service is futile.
      We need enforced sackings. Legislate for it. Get it done.
      I would rather pay an ex public servant 20k on the dole than 100k to “work from home”.
      
      12 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 9:56am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        The problem seems to be closing a part of some Ministry but those public servants are relocated in the same Ministry.
        One outfit (can’t remember who) was to get rid of over 700 public servants. Fine. 300 went and 400 had a new job in the same department.
        
        8 2
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:31am
  - Burtland
    
    government has no money – its probably came from ETS tax
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:35am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  It is giving out taxpayer money because the Government (Labour and National), think they can identify winning companies better than anyone else (its never happened before, but they don’t believe that there’s anyone more clever than them). And because it is taxpayer money, there is NO PENALTY for screwing it up.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:14pm
- Raphael
  
  yes, as a customer I am directly affected (and somewhat concerned as to what this will mean for me). From memory Blackrock is the majority owner.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:57pm
Scooter

The Bud Lite ad of cars? I hope so, the more these wokesters end up with egg on their face the sooner we can get back to saner times. Ditto with the All Blacks, you could say the Haka is an ad for them so pushing politics is just as likely to turn people off.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/22/jaguar-new-branding-cars-donald-trump
18 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:53am
- Paulus
  
  Beer I like, but Budweiser – no comparison with Stenie.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:41am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Budweiser should not be called a beer.
    Let’s have some Stella Artois.
    
    6 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 11:33am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Try Vailima, its a Samoan beer, comes in single 750ml bottles at about $6 each.
      Apparently the Germans taught the Samoans how to make it.
      Its really good.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:08pm
      - Jack5
        
        Tsingtao, China’s second-biggest beer brand, was started by Germans when Qingdao was a German colony before the First World War.
        
        German migrants also founded some of America’s biggest brewers: Anheuser, Pabst, Schlitz, Busch. Similarly, Quilmes beer in Argentina. Germans were prominent brewing pioneers in Brazil, now the world’s third biggest beer market.
        
        0 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:29pm
  - pdm
    
    Paulus – Tui is the beer round here.
    
    6 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 11:36am
    - Don Beckett
      
      As I get older, I tend to prefer the darks ales -Speights Old Dark, Montieth’s Black, Black Macks etc. My previous beer of choice was Mack’s Green Beret, or other IPA’s or APA’s, also of the Hazy kind.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:46am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Don,
        Have you tried Cooper’s Stout. 750ml single bottles.
        Its a great beer. It think it is one of the few beers that improves in the bottle since it contains yeast lees. May be wrong, but it tastes great. Sneaks up on you! Be careful
        
        3 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:13pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Yes I have. Actually, back in the early 1990’s I used to brew beer – Coopers Lager was very good, and I brewed Coopers Stout for my father – who reckoned it was better than the bought stuff – how could I disagree.
        When I was a kid dad & a couple of neighbors did home brewing, and dad said he was saving about 2/- shillings per bottle – so he reckoned the more he drank, the more he saved. 🙂
        
        4 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 3:45pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        Easier than the brewing Don. Its like nectar in a 750.
        That’s marketing for you/ us.👍🏻
        
        0 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 4:34pm
- blue collar
  
  Jaguar are done
  So are the all blacks
  
  1 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:01pm
Swifty

“F**k you and f**k your clients,” Hone Puriri William Harawira said in a message to a lawyer.

“I’m giving you the chance you fkn [sic] maggot piece of s**t k**t to do the right thing … lawyers like you are a parasite on society aye Boy,” he said in another message.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/man-has-human-rights-case-thrown-out-after-threatening-lawyers-family/NCCVY4GOHVCN5CXSCEFFKHJY34/

If this is what Hone Snr and the Maori Party grifters deem as Maori standing up for themselves and leading the country into broad, sunlit uplands then leave me out.
47 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 8:56am
- herb1
  
  Why hasn’t he been arrested as he seems to have made threats against several people. I’m sure a non Maori making similiar threats would very quickly be in dock
  
  36 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:18am
  - kowtow
    
    Too right and the “warrior” has threatened their families too .
    
    I can’t wait for the usual suspects in te media paahti to roll out their go to Maori customs experts to tell us that this is just the Maori way , and AOK ,afterall there was no shortage of that b/s after the war dance threats in parliament.
    
    ‘and eventually escalated to threats of violence.
    
    “I’ve dreamed about catching up with you on my terms ..It fkn Baffles me how Weasel litigation Lawyers like you think Police are some type of deterrent to people like me! It’s personal now and I hate you more than anyone in the world,” an email to the NZMA’s lawyer in September reads.
    
    “You have the misfortune of crossing a Ngapuhi Warrior prepared to kiss his family goodbye 1 more time …Watch this Space… You WILL learn that getting a degree in this type of legal Work where you’re simply defaming victims win or not for a fkn Paycheck was the worst thing for you family your wife and your Children and I’ve always considered mentioning Children as Tapu but with you that’s now null and void.”’
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 2:47pm
  - Keith White
    
    That’s different, because melanin.
    
    2 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 5:43pm
- Swifty
  
  Yep, a real ‘Ngapuhi Warrior’ alright:
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/86798434/hone-harawiras-son-jailed-for-assault-on-girlfriend
  
  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfzPjKxzZuA
  
  30 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:23am
  - David Garrett
    
    A 42 year old man with a “teenage girlfriend”…and that’s alright with Hone and the whanau?
    
    27 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:37am
    - Scooter
      
      Looks like it runs deep in the Harawira whanau.
      
      https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/508055/hone-harawira-s-brother-on-trial-for-historical-child-sex-abuse-charges
      
      15 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 10:14am
      - Swifty
        
        To be fair, he got off those charges.
        
        4 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:09am
      - graham
        
        Indeed …
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/brothers-sentenced-for-assaulting-john-key/SV72X7RV4E46CTU5HP5GMGASSI/
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/harawiras-nephews-to-face-trial-over-attack-on-12-year-old/JV7XLXJV45ZFXD5NBD5EOI6BDU/
        
        5 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:46am
      - carlsbad apple
        
        It does run deep. Hone’s mother, Titewhai, was jailed for nine months for assaulting a patient at Carrington hospital in the 1980’s. Her daughter and her son took part in the assault.
        What a disgraceful mob.
        
        2 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 5:16pm
    - NothingLeft
      
      Young women have always been attracted to powerful men.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 10:48am
      - Swifty
        
        So powerful he is still on taxpayer funded training courses in his middle-age, throws abusive tantrums when he doesn’t get what he wants, and needs WINZ to pay his bus fare from Hamilton to get home.
        
        And yet he labels others as ‘parasites in society’.
        
        11 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:46am
      - kowtow
        
        You think ?
        
        I suspect it’s more along the lines of stupid , vulnerable women attracted to thugs they , wrongly, think can provide for them.
        
        5 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:08pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        @kowtow, that’s saying the same thing with different words. Almost all young adults are dumb/naive, and most women (particularly younger ones who haven’t developed adult awareness and intellect) are unquestioningly primarily attracted to what they perceive as high-status/powerful men – just as they have been for all of human history. Coming from a relatively deprived background only exacerbates that.
        
        1 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 3:29pm
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Of course David. The old ways. Raupo huts, rape, pillage and a good leg of Maori for a boil up.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 12:16pm
    - cmm
      
      Maybe that explains some of the rise of Islam.
      
      I see that Iraq is returning the age of consent to Prophet-approved 9 years old.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:15pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        ‘consent’ = inability to fight your pedophile husband/rapist off.
        
        Bangladesh (from 13 years back) 14 year old girl whipped to death by police for ‘adultery’ after being raped by her 40 year old married cousin:
        https://msmagazine.com/2011/02/07/bangladeshi-rape-victim-flogged-to-death/
        
        Such an abominably evil religion.
        
        0 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 8:40pm
- fernglas
  
  Even worse, he can’t spell “eh” properly
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:26am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Why haven’t the HRC and the lawyers filed a police complaint…..they are specific threats to violence.
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:40am
  - Swifty
    
    Yes, a very good question.
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:07am
- artemisia
  
  Interesting to know what course enrolment was declined due to his age. Have to assume there was a lawful reason, as on the face of it that is discrimination.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:50am
  - Swifty
    
    Yes, a pity the journo didn’t probe further on that issue – not that it excuses Harawira Jnr’s abusive and threatening responses.
    
    Perhaps they were ‘getting the nephs off the couch’ courses specifically set up and funded for young folk? If 50-year old Harawira gets on it denies a place for a young person? Or that the provider misses out on the (young person) targeted funding?
    
    I just don’t know.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 11:08am
    - artemisia
      
      I had a quick look at the site, lots of courses. A few have free fees based on age (16 to 24) – Youth Guarantee Funded. And some scholarships for Maori or Pasifika aged 16-40.
      
      Maybe having to pay was Mr Harawira’s issue.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:01pm
- pdm
  
  John Hatfield’s son I assume.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:39am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Santa’s Elves Complain Of Declining Wages As Undocumented Elves Flood North Pole.

https://babylonbee.com/news/santas-elves-complain-of-declining-wages-as-undocumented-elves-flood-north-pole?
13 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:00am
- peterwn
  
  Meanwhile in Christchurch Santa’s elves are forced to use phones to take pictures of kids on Santa’s knee because the chief elf is too tight to provide them with a decent SLR camera.
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/santa-stoush-outrage-as-christchurch-locals-pay-25-for-santa-photos-taken-on-phone/SS3BM6AZ75AYFMHFKJAZ6UG5CM/
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:16am
  - rangitoto
    
    DSLR are obsolete these days. All the manufacturers have gone mirrorless.
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 9:38am
    - peterwn
      
      Then the Chief Elf could have picked up one cheap from Cash Converters. Perception is everything with this sort of thing.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:19am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      My DSLR works just fine. Sure it is 9 years old but with two trips to Alaska via Hawaii, and what we have taken in NZ it has been good for some 28,000 images. All on discs and SS external drives. Stored in about 4 different places. Even USB flash drives and SD cards don’t last forever.
      
      4 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:42am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Is there an appreciable difference in quality?
        
        3 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:19pm
      - Fender
        
        28000? Its really interesting that level of photography, We have just been through it with father in laws death meant clearing house for sale and now my mothers death and father entering a home now we are doing it again.
        hours of genealogy record keeping of families and holidays, albums, slides, even digital collections and now sorting through phones, snapchats, facebook etc. nobody wants them and there’s too many to even begin to sift through them for anything especially good. You feel extremely guilty but we kids are all reluctant to just take them home because we know they will never get looked at and our closets are full already. I’ve come to the conclusion that big collections are so unweilding that they actually close themselves to ever being looked at. I spent hours finding relevant photos for funeral service etc and came across lots of my parents in their early days I had never seen but in the end, despite the guilt, they are all going to disappear.Some of these Facebook pages like early Havelock North are fantastic because you can upload something interesting that you know others will appreciate.
        
        5 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:33pm
      - rangitoto
        
        I have an older DSLR myself and sure they keep working just like steam trains do. My next purchase will probably be the mirrorless Canon EOS R6 mark II (or later). The autofocus on the newer mirrorless cameras is amazing.
        
        2 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 12:58pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Yes Imalways.
        but at least they are still there. I print a lot on my own printer. Got a canon with refillable tanks, works fine. My other printer can even print on CDs and do covers.
        Neither set as default, I choose.
        
        0 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 5:37pm
kevn

Swifty… Actual words fail him. They are a porangi lot.
13 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:02am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

MTG.
Marjorie Taylor-Greene Up for New Job – Report Claims She Has Spot on New Committee.
“This subcommittee isn’t just another government task force. It’s a MAGA dream team designed to expose inefficiency, corruption, and unnecessary red tape in Washington. Greene, never one to mince words, told Fox News Digital she’s thrilled to partner with Trump, Musk, and Ramaswamy.”

Popcorn!!

https://pjnewsletter.com/marjorie-taylor-greene-might/?
9 4
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:13am
- carlsbad apple
  
  Will be a member of the Gazpacho police or perhaps she will study the culture in her Peach-Tree dish.
  “all the best people”
  
  0 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 5:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump’s Justice Revolution: The Deep Clean Begins at DOJ.
“After watching the weaponization of federal agencies like the DOJ to target political adversaries during the Biden-Harris administration, Trump is poised to drain the swamp for good. The first target on his list? The Department of Justice itself.”

Remember, Trump said he would do this. 2016 was tough, this time he knows the tricks and is ready.

https://pjnewsletter.com/trump-justice-deep-clean/?
14 6
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:20am
- newview
  
  Looks to me he’s just creating his own swamp Steve. Trump only listened to himself last time and imo this time will be no different.
  
  4 13
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:35am
  - All_on_Red
    
    ‘Trump only listened to himself last time’
    Not true. Part of his problem was he listened to those in the swamp- which included Republicans
    Polling shows Trump has good support for his current picks- although some invariably aren’t happy.
    We know you don’t like Trump but hopefully when you get over such a huge loss and being totally wrong you may be able to be a little bit objective
    Lol
    
    10 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 10:45am
    - newview
      
      AoR
      “Part of his problem was he listened to those in the swamp- which included Republicans” I admit to not being totally absorbed by US politics like you and Steve and others here but some examples of him listening to anybody who didn’t agree with him would be great. My observation was that he just fired anyone who didn’t agree with him and many who worked with him never new what he might do or say next. As for my great loss, I couldn’t give a shit what happens in the US , it’s what happens outside of it that matters to me.
      
      3 6
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 11:17am
      - All_on_Red
        
        ‘Trump only listened to himself last time’
        So you just made this up
        
        6 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 11:40am
      - cmm
        
        “My observation”
        
        Unless you were actually there you have no observation.
        You’re just getting a picture that comes through many very biased filters.
        
        “I couldn’t give a shit what happens in the US”. Well Americans, obviously, put their interests first. They don’t give a shit about you and why should they?
        
        5 1
        Report
        November 27, 2024 2:03pm
      - newview
        
        CMM, My observation is every bit as good as your opinion which is based on the sorts of media we both might might look at. If you think what you believe is unbiased you stay with the dream.What you chose to believe is your truth and it’s the same for me. If you are suggesting Americans are putting their interests first and are referring to tariffs, imo tariffs mean short term gain and long term pain. I never said Americans should care about me or NZ but tariffs aren’t the answer . They are inflationary, they protect inefficiencies, they lead to an over priced market place. They might be justified if a trading partner already has a Tariff on your exports but thats all.
        
        2 3
        Report
        November 27, 2024 3:39pm
      - cmm
        
        newview: Yes, you are making opinions, but not observations.
        Observations happen when you are actually seeing things with your own eyes. If you are only getting your infomation via layers of media and other people’s opinions then that is hearsay – not observation.
        
        I in no way think my opinions are more valid than yours. I do not have any inside information (well not much).
        
        2 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:01pm
      - cmm
        
        newview: Tariffs are not the only thing to consider, but subsidies too.
        
        Both subsidies and tariffs distort the playing field. Both can be weaponised.
        
        If, say, China is subsidising their export industries then that gives them an unfair trading advantage. It would seem perfectly fair to apply tariffs against those subsidised goods to correct for that.
        
        Trump would appear to be using the threat of punitive tariffs as a way to force compliance. For example, if Mexico does not do something to control drugs then perhaps Trump would apply huge tariffs to Mexican made goods to force such compliance.
        
        1 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:10pm
    - My-Gumboot
      
      ‘Trump only listened to himself last time’
      Yeah that’s why he has got Elon on board and Vivek and RFK and Tulsi.. All yes he \ she \ him \ her \ them \ they \ it \ cat folks, that Trump can push around.
      
      0 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 4:35pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    If he is creating his own swamp it will not be corrupt like the existing one that is decades old.
    
    5 6
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 11:45am
    - Fender
      
      wishful thinking, power corrupts, plenty of fault on both sides, you can’t tell me he wasn’t above taking advantages as a businessman in his fortune making,
      I agree with you totally but saying it won’t be corrupt is dreaming
      
      2 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 1:32pm
    - MCōs
      
      “he is creating his own swamp
      it will not be corrupt like the existing”
      
      Then I’ll get on my knees and pray
      We don’t get fooled again
      Don’t get fooled again, no, no
      Yeah
      Meet the new boss
      Same as the old boss
      
      Peter Townshend
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 5:18pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Just remember, I was the one who predicted 312 for Trump with the Electoral College.
      I was bang on.
      Tell me I was wrong.
      
      1 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 5:41pm
- MCōs
  
  Do you want a privatized judicial system?
  The best justice money can buy.
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:00pm
Yvette

Parliament at a tikanga ‘crossroads’ – Te Pāti Māori
Speaker of the House Gerry Brownlee is facing a choice: Crack down on those performing haka without prior consent, or open the House doors to tikanga

Pros
Last week, NZ First minister Shane Jones said he was concerned that Parliament’s rules were “incapable of dealing” with an event like the Treaty principles haka. He called for tighter rules around conduct in the House, later suggesting the haka and other displays in the House were for the benefit of Te Pāti Māori’s social media audiences.
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon also said those rules – known as Standing Orders – needed to be clarified so debates in the House didn’t “degenerate into disruption”.
“No disrespect, what we saw on Thursday was unacceptable and we need to make sure that we can have debates on difficult subjects without people threatening other members inside of Parliament.
“It’s pretty basic and I appreciate whether it’s around haka or individuals walking up to other individuals in the Parliament and going off at them; that’s not acceptable behaviour.”

A Con
Te Pāti Māori co-leader Rawiri Waititi – who is a consistent challenger of the rules and norms of Parliament – was quick to back his MPs’ haka, saying “everyone should be proud to see [the haka] in its true context”.
“We love it when the All Blacks do it, but what about when the ‘blackies’ do it?” he said.
Waititi also talked about using all tools available to their MPs during debates in the House, including haka and waiata – things that were a natural part of debate on the marae.

Will it evolve to the apparent marae practice of signing, waiata, to drown out speakers?
22 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:38am
- Blog-aholic
  
  If tikanga is acceptable then anything is and thus anarchy become reality.
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:18am
  - Paulus
    
    I believe it was the Helen Clark Supreme Court who used Tikanga in deciding that Peter Ellis should be be found not guilty of the offences for which he was found guilty.
    Who the hell are these people who create new laws – Parliament remain Paramount and must be seen to be, not some floozy Judges who believe they are above Parliament.
    They should be sacked, and a careful new selection made every five years or so.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 2:33pm
    - Ra Henare
      
      They didn’t decide that he was not guilty because of Tikanga.
      But that the case could continue after his death.
      Normally, the case is suspended(finishes) when the litigant dies.
      
      The Supreme Court Judges, decided that because of Tikanga(remembering that Ellis was not Maori) his Mana should be respected after death.
      
      WOKE IDIOTS!!!
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 3:21pm
- Don Beckett
  
  Haka may be acceptable on the Matae, but not in the Wharenui when komatua are in discussion.
  
  10 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The whole circus has to be tidied up. No haka in the House. No approaching another Member and screaming in their face.
  Standard of dress: suits for male and female. Ties for men. No hats. This is the NZ Parliament, not a primary school class.
  
  20 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:50am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Yip
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 12:21pm
  - Paulus
    
    It won’t happen !
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 2:34pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      And you know why it ‘may’ not happen.
      The activists IN National!!!
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 5:44pm
NothingLeft

Rasmussen head pollster discusses clear ‘lying’ by other US public pollsters during the election just gone:

https://youtu.be/WjXqw-mPVDc
7 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:08am
- NothingLeft
  
  Kamala Harris’ internal polling NEVER showed her leading President Trump, her aides tell HuffPo
  
  The entire campaign was a TOTAL LIE.
  
  And yet the whole of the left-aligned MSM and their lying/corrupt pollsters declaimed to all for months that Kamala was leading, and that lie was used to pull in more than a billion in donations for her campaign
  
  Incredible that knowing they were trailing she still avoided interviews and press so much? Shitist candidate ever.
  
  https://x.com/nicksortor/status/1861531910339465373
  
  10 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:05pm
Philview

I read Sir Ian Taylor’s article this morning on the Hikoi. Per the article, Ian joined the Hikoi but he makes some confusing arguments. He condemns Seymour but talks of the need for debate but says Parliament is not the place for that debate. It left me wondering where the rest of the country is meant to go to debate this stuff. Ian like many others seems unaware of what was happening under the last Government that led us to this point. The argument appears to be that New Zealand was a happy place until Seymour came along with his Bill.
34 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  New Zealand has not been a happy place since the introduction of The Treaty of Waitangi Act 1975. An Act so the Net Taxpayer pays forever.
  
  16 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 11:52am
- imalwaysright
  
  Is that “Sir” Ian, knight of the realm?
  Might be time for Ian to do the right thing and discontinue his honorific.
  Why did he accept his knighthood ?
  It isn’t compulsory.
  Maybe he should preface all of his statements on the state of maori activists with “From the perspective of a Knight of the British Realm, I think….”
  
  Like fuck he will.
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:30pm
- cmm
  
  “The argument appears to be that New Zealand was a happy place until Seymour came along with his Bill.”
  
  Yup, the “he started it” argument is pathetic.
  
  The only reason Seymour ended up with 246k votes is because 246k people care about this issue.
  
  Since there is a strong correlation between Act supporters and net tax payers, it would be rather short sighted to tell those people to get lost.
  
  11 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:58pm
- JackRabbit
  
  The argument appears to be that New Zealand was a happy place until Seymour came along with his Bill.
  
  “And the Maori were peaceful, respectful, law abiding race, with a full language, literary works, wireless communication devices, evidence of Antarctic expeditions, and interplanetary travel to Uranus. Until the colonists came along.”
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 2:24pm
- Ra Henare
  
  I think Sir Ian has moved on from being a superb animator businessman to thinking his opinion matters!!!!!!!!!!
  
  I am at a loss as to why he gets published, especially in STUFF, surely not because he is a successful Maori?
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:27pm
mogg

Robbie Starbucks with Megyn Kelly, all woke is now a Trojan Horse for hard left values. This is where Māori and Green Party activism is coming from.
He is the man who used DEI tactics on Harley Davidson, Walmart and many other American Corporations to de-woken their operations, with immediate results.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=byr7WBF2vjA&pp=ygUbTWVneW4ga2VsbHkgcm9iYmllIHN0YXJidWNr
6 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:28am
Jack5

Can someone explain any significance of what David Seymour is reported to have said to Smarmy Jack about Ngai Tahu “sovereignty” over the South Island?

Surely this is more distortion by Red Radio?

Or do southerners need to take MMP a step forward and form a South Island party?

Red Radio on Seymour and Ngai Tahu legislation:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/534907/treaty-principles-bill-david-seymour-s-acknowledgement-of-rangatiratanga-raises-a-whole-lot-of-questions
10 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:37am
- Yabster
  
  Lame Jack up to his biased tricks again- pushing his agenda- compared Seymours interview with Packers. Seymour, he constantly interjects and is a rude arrogant prick, Packer, he hardly asks a tough question – TVNZ what a shit-hole.
  
  NZERS in my opinion shld stop watching it and watch it collapse under its own bullshit- and any advertisers on it should be ignored..
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:14pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    Well yes Yabster – but you have to practice what you preach and actually just stop watching this crap. Period.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 1:55pm
    - Yabster
      
      tend to agree- I did watch the clip only and on Youtube.
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 2:51pm
- kowtow
  
  Thank the Nats .
  
  The Ngai Tahu deal was down to them.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:35pm
- kiwikidsnz
  
  Seymour added a last minute clause to the Treaty principles bill separately recogising Treaty settlements. Tame was attempting to wedge this given Ngai Tahus apparent control of 90% of the SI.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:56pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    Wouldn’t it be nice if some facts were included in this conversation.
    Ngatahu DOES NOT have sovereignty over 90% of the South Island.
    
    Yawn. BS MSM AGAIN!!!!
    
    This was the agreement I suggest Seymour was referring to.
    
    Settlement, 1998
    Charles Crofts and Doug Graham
    
    Charles Crofts and Doug Graham
    
    In 1998, after nearly 150 years, Ngāi Tahu completed their efforts to have the Crown address their grievances. They signed a Deed of Settlement that provided compensation valued at $170 million. This confirmed Ngāi Tahu’s ownership of pounamu, granted certain rights to sites of significance and allowed them some role in managing conservation estate resources within their boundaries.
    
    https://nzhistory.govt.nz/politics/treaty/the-treaty-in-practice/ngai-tahu
    
    5 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 4:13pm
    - Jack5
      
      Ra Henare – there was an $180 million settlement top-up for Ngai Tahu in 2018:
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/waikato-tainui-and-ngai-tahu-receive-370-million-treaty-top-up/QI6TBZHQOZLN6ZQADC6G2TPNQE/
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 5:35pm
    - kiwikidsnz
      
      It was Tame who referred to ngai tahus 90% SI, are you saying he was wrong? (shock…)
      
      From the rnz link
      “Seymour’s acknowledgement came on TVNZ’s Q+A show, where host Jack Tame asked, under his proposed principles, whether Seymour accepted that Ngāi Tahu had “full sovereignty over 90 percent of the South Island”.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 6:35pm
- cmm
  
  South Island Party?
  Naah, South Island Independence.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:46pm
cmm

So apparently the TPM rally (aka Hikoi) managed to get 3000 more onto the Maori roll.

Everyone on the Maori roll is a radical extremist. 3000 more identified and signed up.

Is this what we are going to see again and again: More such events to drive up TPM power?
23 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:57am
- Fender
  
  if we all signed up could we not sway the votes or all not vote, wouldn’t that disrupt their matrix?
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 12:41pm
Swifty

We all know that the Maori Party, Waipareira and the Tamihere clan have played fast and loose with public money, charity money and political donations of late and adopt a cavalier attitude to their lawful obligations around the filing of financial statements etc.

The evidence is clear and open for all to see in that front.

(I see just today Ngarewa-Packer giving slippery, slimy and evasive answers to questions about the Parliament-funded Eru Kapa-Kingi and whether he was doing hikoi organising activity in his (parliamentary) work time. I take it from her evasive answers that he absolutely was – and that therefore taxpayers directly funded his partisan hikoi work.

A corrupt practice in my view – using his public position for private or political benefit.)

As a result, some questions that have been on my mind recently are:

1. In NZ’s history have we ever seen a person and an immediate family simultaneously in receipt of hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars of late (via Waipareira and as Whanau Ora service providers) AND in total control of a significant political party with representation in New Zealand’s Parliament?

2. How confident can New Zealanders be, given all the recent Maori Party misuse of charity money and unlawful donations etc that the Maori Party, Tamihere’s Whanau Ora service provision and Waipareira are keeping strictly separate their respective activities with absolutely no crossover – even through John Tamihere (and his immediate family) is at the centre of each and every one of them?

3. Or are we in a situation where the New Zealand taxpayer is in effect directly funding Maori Party activities as the Tamiheres are using Waipareira charity money and/or Whanau Ora money and resources in the pursuit of Maori Party aims and activities?

4. When Waipareira and Tamihere’s Whanau Ora staff and ‘navigators’ deal with thousands and thousands of families annually are they in fact on Maori Party recruiting drives as they do so? Do they ever hand out Maori Party pamphlets? Do they ever direct people to the Maori Party website? Do they ever encourage people on to the Maori roll? Do they ever voice support for the Maori Party in any way?

Perhaps our ‘fierce and independent’ news media companies can do some probing investigative journalism and find out the answers to these questions as a matter of extreme public interest?
14 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 11:41am
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Fierce and independent news media – hahahahahahahhahahahahahhahahaha
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:07pm
- Quail
  
  Where is an independent audit of the taxpayer spend on Race related social payouts?
  NZ taxpayers are entitled to know where ,when , how much , what for , and who their hard earned dollars are spent on . This is a bare minimum.
  Annually how much is paid to individual groups and who are they?
  Is this information clearly available anywhere?
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:47pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z89apQGboc8
Special Prosecutor Gaetz?
Matt Gaetz can’t be AG. But a Special Prosecutor doesn’t need Senate confirmation.
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 12:23pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “They can stop one of us, but they can’t stop all of us!!”
  
  5 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:32pm
  - sungsamning
    
    Yes, that is indeed the case. There are also possible recess appointments. Its doable.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 6:53pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Not much point going after members of Biden admin – conviction on an impeachment requires 66 senators, and in these hyper partisan times Republicans have no chance of convictions with only 53 senators.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:37pm
  - Keith White
    
    The process can be the punishment… turn about is fair play.
    
    0 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 5:46pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHVZvCDNm4I
Walmart Kicks DEI and Woke to the kerb.
Politics is downstream of culture. Bud Light won’t be using Dylan Mulvaney again.
7 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 12:23pm
Burtland

1500 more jobs to go at Health NZ
– 700 are vacant

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/public-sector-cuts-health-new-zealand-planning-to-cut-nearly-1500-more-jobs/M5ZFZX422NBMFCQSFSECADPC4I/
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 1:04pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  So it is really only 800 jobs to go.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:10pm
  - sungsamning
    
    Well, its a start.
    
    0 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 6:52pm
- cmm
  
  Cut does not mean fired. Likely many of those 700 vacancies won’t get filled and will count towards the 1500 cut.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:16pm
  - greybeard
    
    It is nothing more than removing all the “non-jobs” implemented by 6 years of Labour-led government, their way of reducing the unemployment numbers.
    If they were honest, HealthNZ could probably do the job with about 30% of their current staffing.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 6:18pm
MCōs

On Koh Samui, Thailand a prosperous French businesswoman ravaged by cancer committed suicide earlier this year
In her will she left around B100mil to her maid of seventeen years.
Suddenly, after all this time the authorities decided she’d been operating her business illegally. A foreigner cannot own more than than 49% of a company and I suspect that after seventeen years of no problems there is a problem.
Consequently the maid has been deprived of her inheritance, which has gone who knows where, but I suspect there’ll be a few generals driving round in new a Benz
My wife, who has a lot of empathy for women at lower reaches of the social ladder, was furious about this daylight robbery
16 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 1:26pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  I love the smell of corruption in the morning….
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:31pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Relatives? When someone with money dies you find out how many relatives you have.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 1:39pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

The End of an Era? Trump’s Promise to Abolish the Department of Education Gains Steam in the Senate.

Please, can we have someone from Trump’s team come to NZ? We have an Education Department that is totally out of control.

https://pjnewsletter.com/trump-abolish-doe/?
16 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 1:31pm
- blue collar
  
  Wouldn’t hurt to go back to teaching under a basic curriculum would it ?
  Get rid of all the brainwashing and agendas .
  Introduce winners and losers .
  If a teacher can’t pass a test they can’t teach .
  Simple shit
  N bring back the cane !
  
  7 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:11pm
- MCōs
  
  Do you want a privatized public education system too with schools run by consultants?
  Back in 1988 the Ministry of Works was abolished and the work they did was put out to tender, with mixed results.
  I used to work for the MOW and there’s no denying there were inefficiencies, but I also worked for some big private companies and there were inefficiencies there too, plus they had to make a profit
  
  5 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 3:24pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    In a couple of years most post-primary teaching will be by individualized AI tutors currently in development – which will lift student outcomes by about 2 standard deviations over current results.
    
    Teachers will likely be relegated to maintaining discipline and order.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 3:42pm
  - Inandout
    
    MC, I want waste slashed in government departments. Us plebs have to budget our household expenses and so should they.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 4:14pm
  - mandk
    
    Now, there’s a thought.
    
    Probably worth a try. After all, it’s difficult to imagine how the public education system could be run less well than it is now.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 4:16pm
  - Swifty
    
    I want all New Zealand children receiving the best primary and secondary education the world can offer. To be number one. To have an education system the envy of the world.
    
    The New Zealand state education monopoly has proven singularly unable to achieve this. What’s worse, in recent decades it’s getting poorer and poorer as compared to other nations and attempts at arresting this slide have repeatedly failed.
    
    We now throw more taxpayer money at education in real and nominal terms and per student than we ever have in our country’s history and our results have never been as bad.
    
    So the question now is – what are we going to do about it?
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 4:18pm
    - MCōs
      
      Which similar country to NZ do you believe provides the best education for their children?
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      November 27, 2024 5:04pm
      - Swifty
        
        I don’t have any country in mind.
        
        Here’s something I’ve noticed though with regards to the education of our kids. I find that people in New Zealand can be grouped into two broad categories:
        
        1. Those that believe the most important feature of our education system is that it is a state monopoly (they generally use the euphemism ‘public education’) and that irrespective of the poor results we suffer end endure that cannot change and no alternatives can be explored.
        
        2. People who want a world-class education for all our kids and are less concerned how this is delivered.
        
        I am in the latter camp.
        
        I would add that with the blatant and completely unacceptable politicisation by the Left of our education system in recent decades I think it is essential for the health of our democracy that our education system is transformed that a better balance is restored.
        
        If that means the privatisation of education then I’m all for it.
        
        I also think it essential that more excellence and innovation is brought into our education system and it appears the state monopoly is just unable to provide it.
        
        3 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 6:23pm
      - fernglas
        
        Finland. Estonia. Singapore. Canada. Australia. To name just five
        
        2 0
        Report
        November 27, 2024 9:02pm
  - greybeard
    
    The old MoW implemented some of NZ’s best infrastructure. Probably because of the high-quality, dedicated , experienced and patriotic people who joined the Ministry after WW2.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    November 27, 2024 6:14pm
blue collar

Can we sack all doctors that didn’t achieve 90% to get into med school please

While we are at it , sack more managers and any cultural advisors

Apply above to the all blacks .
1 manager , 2 coaches , sack the rest .
11 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 3:34pm
- Keith White
  
  In the Pliocene era when I was at Auckland Med School, the admitted-via-Polynesian-Preference classmates could pass the same written and MCQ exams in Years 1-5 with fewer (at times as low as 30 fewer) marks than us Paletypes. They were sniggeringly proud of it. And yes, I have a long memory for that sort of thing.
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 5:50pm
blue collar

I feel the all blacks should stand down everybody involved in the photo with the sovereignty flag for a year , no pay , no guaranteed spot after 12 months .

Send a strong message

I personally don’t care as that’s the end of my all black support . Lost a fan . They are WOKE n can fuck off .

But it would help any remaining fans that with a strong message sent , hopefully any lunatics will refrain from political intrusion in the future
16 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 3:37pm
mogg

Blackrock have just declared a very nearly 6% holding in Infratil.
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 4:19pm
Swifty

The trouble is, Ayesha Verrall, that after all your and the rest of Labour’s MP’s lies and distortions these last few years, I don’t believe a bloody thing you say:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/534982/te-whatu-ora-staff-filled-with-anxiety-over-proposed-job-cuts

I really don’t think I have been more misled and misdirected than I was 2017-23 and I’m damned if I am going to believe you now.
12 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 4:50pm
Jethrod

The Herald is reporting , via the reporter, Thomas Coughlan, the Labour party will have a vote on what they call, “Captains calls”. It appears that Hipkins made a call in 2023 about CGT, which it now appears wasn’t a popular call.
However the reporter doesn’t say anything about the enormous Captains call, J Ardern made re the oil and gas exploration industry. It would have been helpful if the reporter had used that instances as a comparable issue, seeing as how important and fateful it was for New Zealand.
14 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 4:53pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Making A Submission For The Treaty Principles Bill Made Easy.
I have been given permission to post here from this source by DPF, that is David Farrah.
So to make a submission follow this, Jan 7th 2025 is the deadline.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sAx7Hpvp14
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 5:58pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Oh, you can add your own submission on the same template.
  
  3 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 6:08pm
Quail

Here we go again.
More inflation on the way as Orr cuts the OCR 0.5% .Balance of payments in disaster mode.Productivity likewise.
Oh and Gavernmen spending is still right up where it does not belong.
Savers , those on fixed incomes the elderly , beneficiaries etc will feel this harshly
The stability of the NZD is at risk.
5 2
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 6:30pm
- cmm
  
  If you’ve got $1M sitting in term deposits etc then that 0.5% is $5k a year. Bugger.
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 9:15pm
- Max Howler
  
  You would have Orr hold the rate high? and fully tank the economy! That was never going to happen. Only debate is how much the reduction was going to be.
  
  0 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 27, 2024 10:00pm
- 70andstilllearning
  
  “The stability of the NZD is at risk.”
  Given it’s actually settled into an appreciated level against both the ‘greenback’ and the ‘aussie’ looks like the market had overcooked the price build in anyway. Would hardly consider the kiwi a major ( other than in name only as a quirk of history) so it’s likely only going to follow the pack anyway.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  November 28, 2024 11:19am
Rumblestrip

I see Immigration NZ has just banned Candace Owens from entering New Zealand.

This is a disgrace. (Associate Immigration Minister, Chris Penk, is in charge of these decisions.)

To be clear, I think Candace Owens is a bit nuts and some of her stated opinions are risible. That’s not the point. As a free, liberal first-world democracy we shouldn’t be afraid of visitors with unusual or controversial views. If people were prepared to hear her speak, let her speak.
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 9:58pm
NZer In Exile

OK this is a random question.

Does anybody remember an ad on NZ TV (I think in the nineties) where I guy is sitting in a deck chair, makes a wish, crushes a beer can on his forehead and then smiling attractive women in swimwear (two I think) then materialise next to him?

If so, what was the product being advertised?
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:13pm
Quail

CMM,
The interest on your million is really chicken feed compared with the huge damage to your $1m purchasing power caused by the effective devaluation of same.NZ dollar. Inflation.
This is a tax Friedman spoke of.
Once Governments used to deal in Millions, now it is billions looking to trillions.
Devaluing the NZ dollar affects every person .in NZ mostly adversely.
Orr knows this yet stokes the fire!
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
November 27, 2024 10:19pm

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« Berlin police chief says Jews and gays should hide

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Never miss a post

Email Address

Join 40.6K other subscribers

Highlights

Health Target 5 – elective treatments
Health Target 4 – Specialist appointments
Health Target 3 – Emergency Dept Waiting Times
Health Target 2 – Immunisations

Links

Walter Williams on social justice
Not PC
An interesting paper about the first 50 years of Nobel Prize winners in economics
Utopia
Woman of the day
Hompaddock
She Should Have Plenty Of Money To Pay The Rent!!
No Minister
Open mike 23/05/2025
The Standard
Drawn
No Right Turn
Budget 2025 – The War on Workers Budget – stealing today what tomorrow never brings
The Daily Blog
Trump’s theatre of the absurd.
Kiwipolitico
The (deeply underwhelming) Budget
Croaking Cassandra
The Delusion of Porn’s Harmlessness
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
Yes but
Point of Order
Good Policy Requires Courage
NZCPR
How many coffees is a house?
Stats Chat
Social media slippery slopes
Offsetting Behaviour
THE WORKING FROM HOME RACKET BY PUBLIC SERVANTS
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

[email protected]

PO Box 12270, Thorndon, Wellington 6144

Facebook
Twitter
FourSquare
Instagram
LinkedIn
Google+

Archives
Disclosure Statement
Editorial Policy
Privacy Policy
Complaints Policy
Comments Policy

Design by cre8d

%d

Share this:

Like this: