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October 27, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 27 October 2025

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peterwn

A group is endeavouring to breathe new life into the Lake Onslow pumped storage scheme. This basically exploits the height difference of 570m between Lake Onslow and Lake Roxburgh (on the Clutha River) to pump water uphill to store its energy at times of low energy prices and to use the same water to generate electricity when demand and wholesale prices are high. In doing so it provides a ‘buffer’ for intermittent solar and wind power generation as well as dry year hydro support. The estimated cost is $15.7B.
It was promoted by the previous Labour Government but canned as uneconomic and a waste of money when National came to power. National did not see this sort of project an appropriate use of Government money and in my opinion its concerns were soundly based from its perspective.
However a consortium is now pursuing the project with a view of delivering it with non-Government money. The leading lights ate Keith Turner, electrical engineer and former CEO of Meridian Energy, David Parker, former senior Labour MP and Environment Minister and Rodger Finlay, Deputy Reserve Bank chair. Between them they provide technological, political and financial expertise. Keith Turner in particular needs to be taken very seriously – he has the smarts. In me opinion he was the smartest and best performing CEO of the four original gentailer CEO’s. He also spearheaded the Manapouri second tailrace project delivering it on time within budget and with no worker fatalities. He was consulted on the original Onslow project so would have a good understanding of the details and implications of the project.
The consortium has down the original groundwork and obviously considered the project is worth proceeding with. The main aspects would be economical (would it make a profit), technological, environmental and financial and it seems they have ticked the four boxes to take it to the next stage. The consortium claims that overseas finance is available for projects of this sort. I suspect there are investors and funds out there who want or need to invest in ‘green’ energy projects and Onslow would definitely fit the criteria. The lower expected rate of return on ‘green’ investments could get the project over the line. One issue I have is the consortium could be relying on Government support at some point to make the project viable (remember Manapouri which started off as a private project then the Government was forced to take ownership).
The consortium’s next task is to get the necessary resource consents for the project using the ‘fast track’ process. Without that further development work could be a waste of money. My view is the present Government should welcome the present project and give it moral support (but not financial support) especially with allowing its consent to be ‘fast tracked’.
It is now a ‘watch this space’ situation.
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October 27, 2025 8:00am
- Nikola Donatello
  
  I only have high school physics, so happy to be set straight…
  
  If you need to pump water up hill, where does the energy come from? Don’t you use the same, or more energy pumping the water up, than is generated by that water when it falls? I must be missing something.
  
  One name here sets off alarm bells. “David Parker”. He strikes me as obsessive and hard working, but to terrible effect. Remember he spent five years developing the most awful “replacements” for the RMA. They would have been worse than the RMA.
  
  It is ironic that this proposal is now relying on the “fast track” provisions of the current law. These are provisions that David Parker would have denounced as evil, and opposed, if he were still in Parliament.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:12am
  - peterwn
    
    The energy comes from other generators at the time there is a potential surplus of generation such as when solar and wind outputs are high. You are right the energy extracted from the water is very roughly 80% of the energy needed to pump it.
    In the past the hydro power network provided the ‘buffering’ needed for solar and wind energy, for example when there is lots of wind, hydro generation is throttled back a bit (signaled by slight changes of system frequency) and when the wind dies down, hydro almost instantaneously takes up the slack. You are not really missing anything.
    You are on the button concerning David Parker, the left wing is being a bit hypocritical here. The consortium would consider that David’s political skills and networking capability would provide a valuable contribution to the consortium’s work.
    The thought also occurred to me that assuming the project proceeds there would be a change of government during the project and David would be well placed to help negotiate to obtain concessions on various things from a future left wing government.
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:34am
    - AitchW
      
      What size battery could one buy for 15.7 billion?
      What is the efficiency of a battery compared to a lake?
      Could a battery be placed closer to the source of hydro generation and closer to the end purchaser of the power?
      What is the effective life of a battery?
      So many questions, I wonder if Parker can answer them?
      He was a typical Ardern government minister, ie useless, why would we believe he has any credibility on this matter?
      
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      October 27, 2025 8:41am
      - peterwn
        
        To cut a long story short, Onslow would have a long ‘lead time’ and much of the $15.7M would need to be committed long before there is any return on the investment. Battery capacity on the other hand can be provided at much shorter notice, can be provided incrementally and require much smaller financial commitments which start producing a return after just a few years.
        Also the location of Onslow is fixed by geography and is very sub-optimal. Batteries on the other hand can be placed where most beneficial to the network which in general would be fairly close to the loads especially in areas where there are network bottlenecks.
        On this basis, batteries appears to be a ‘no brainer’ compared with Onslow.
        I am therefore very interested to see how the consortium will make out the financial case for the project.
        
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        October 27, 2025 11:01am
      - Foxfour
        
        Battery output only follow the Grid frequency, not lead it like a hydro generator spinning at 50Hz.
        Thus when the frequency moves outside a very narrow range a battery backup cant prevent it declining even more.
        The result is load, ie users, are blacked more or less instantly to restore the frequency.
        Grid batteries may be great at releasing MW at a moments notice but grid stability requires high voltage stability plus the very critical 50Hz
        
        I see recently Transpower has downgraded its grid frequency/voltage numbers as of course the wind and solar farms are making it harder to stabilise under the older values.
        
        NZ doesnt have the inter connections to massive regional grids like they do in Europe or USA to smooth out the pulsating quivering beast
        
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        October 27, 2025 3:48pm
      - Dougal10
        
        He was also the man who kicked a couple of hydro power plans to the curb when he was a minister, which would have made this project completely off the table .
        
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        October 27, 2025 3:51pm
      - CJames
        
        Fox
        What you wrote is incorrect, batteries can follow the grid. They can program in triggers or droop. The former is they come in if frequency drops below a certain value. The latter is they will load up more as the frequency drops and back off when it rises.
        The NZ grid often sees relatively large frequency swings like when a big unit trips. Our swings are a lot bigger than Oz or US. But yes, the unpredictability of the unreliables make frequency keeping a lot harder. In Oz, with all its unreliables, the frequency curvey is not a bell curve but bimodal, centred around the deadband limits. A glimpse as to what can happen here.
        Go to Wattclarity to see what happens for batteries, they do a lot of articles about what the do (or don’t do)
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:12pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        @CJames
        
        “Fox” is now accompanied by ChatGPT or Grok. I have to admit that it’s a quite a change to the idiocy of past years but still….
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:21pm
    - R
      
      Pwin ….your thinking in ths second comment from you, is a lot more credible than that displayed in your opening comment.
      
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      October 27, 2025 9:15am
      - peterwn
        
        I was trying to make sense of a rather convoluted situation, so it is not too surprising that it lacked some sense.
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:32am
  - Ian Wright
    
    You are correct, you lose energy in the process. However, pumped storage is one of the ways to store energy generated by solar and wind, because those sources are not available all the time, and may not be available at times of peak demand. Without storage of some kind, this means that there must be enough generating capacity in the grid to meet peak demand, from reliable sources (i.e. not solar and wind.) Therefore, the capital cost for solar and wind is all in addition to the normal grid, it doesn’t replace any conventional generation.
    Thus, the desire to add grid storage.
    Batteries and pumped water storage such as this project are the main methods used.
    Batteries are more efficient – if you keep the charge/discharge rates low, they can easily be 97-98% efficient for the round trip. Power electronics is pretty good too, 98% is a reasonable target for the AC/DC conversion necessary to attach batteries to the grid, and again for the DC/AC. So the round trip (energy from the grid into the battery, and back again from the battery to the grid) can be as high as 93%. The problems are capital cost – this scales directly with storage capacity, and the batteries have quite a limited life – and pollution. There was recently a spectacular grid storage battery fire at Moss Landing in California, and the fallout polluted the croplands downwind for 50 miles or so. Not like Chernobyl, but not nice. You definitely don’t want to breathe the smoke. Yes, there are ways of making these fires much less likely or even prevent them, but that involves the use of more expensive batteries. A lot more expensive.
    Pumped water storage on the other hand scales better. The cost is largely determined by the power required, and the storage capacity is determined by the size of the storage lake. You get more storage for free by just choosing a better location with a bigger lake. So economically this method looks better. Of course it only works where you have a big enough lake with enough elevation change. An existing hydro dam, mostly.
    It is less efficient than batteries. I don’t know the realistic numbers for the pumps and turbines – Wikipedia says 70-80% round trip – but from experiments with pumps we (a startup company I’m consulting for) are currently doing that looks a bit optimistic.
    You could argue that since the energy is free the efficiency doesn’t matter, but of course it’s not free. There is a large capital cost, and capital is not free; there are maintenance costs, and there is a limited useful life. For batteries, it’s very limited compared to the rest of the grid equipment.
    The hope is that by adding the storage, the solar and wind can replace some of the conventional generation, not be in addition to it.
    Given the total costs (including the severely limited life compared with conventional generation of solar and wind generation alone) adding the cost of storage is usually not economically viable, compared with the conventional generation. But I don’t know all the numbers for this particular project.
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:02am
    - leoj
      
      There is 300 years worth of coal in Southland.
      
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      October 27, 2025 11:41am
    - Quail
      
      Not my field of expertise but a suggestion.Rather than pump water back into the lakes with excess generated power would it not be simpler to retain the surplus water in the lake and shut down the extra generators.
      Make less power generated and save the water (power )until needed.
      All that would be needed is a system of loch gates which may or may not be present now.
      
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      October 27, 2025 4:44pm
  - Paul Marsden
    
    I would avoid like the plague, any ex-politician’s involvement in any sort of business project.
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:02am
    - Foxfour
      
      Parker is not the only one with a ‘consulting arm’
      
      Did you realise Parker was a lawyer and businessman before entering Parliament , not like say Bill English who was a lifelong politician after a few years as Treasury policy analyst
      
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      October 27, 2025 3:53pm
      - CJames
        
        Wasn’t Parker a failed businessman?
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:15pm
  - PurplePen
    
    Here’s an idea. Why not just pump water back up into successive dams on the Waitaki and Mackenzie Basin schemes when power is cheap.
    
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    October 27, 2025 4:16pm
- CJames
  
  Peter
  Keith Turner wasn’t a particularly good CEO. He was Contact’s first one and the board rejected him for the poison dwarf. Turner was in charge when water was being spilled to keep the power price up. There were problems with his tenure at Transpower too.
  The problem with Onslow is how is it going to make money? The plant has to work by arbitrage – buying power cheap and selling it at a higher price. Now where is this cheap power going to come from? If it is cheap, then no-one will build it. If it is market price, then it has to sell very expensive power.
  Do the maths. If it cost $16B, they have to make a profit of about $1B a year to pay it off and pay for ongoing costs. So that is $30M a day average profit. NZ uses about 110GWH a day. That sells for about $130/MWh – $14M a day and you can make $30M on that?
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:23am
  - peterwn
    
    I would view Keith Turner in a rather different light. Keith successfully put Contact together before it was constituted as a company and when a Board was put in place, it appointed its CEO rather than Keith. He was a victim of bad luck in this instance. As far as spilling water was concerned there was instability with interactions between the newly split off generation companies until the whole thing settled down. I think Genesis preferred to run Huntly at a time rather than buy power in from other generators. as the system settled down and matured these excesses ceased. The authorities wanted to try and clobber Meridian for spilling water on a more recent occasion but Meridian argued there were sound technological reasons for spilling water. I suspect if Meridian was sanctioned, Meridian would have sought judicial review and have one.
    The current Onslow situation is a paradox. As you indicated, based on conventional costings, the project is a turkey, so I wonder what is going on.
    I can only think of three things and I am at pains to say it is my personal opinion. One is the consortium has found ‘value’ in the project which others have overlooked. Secondly the consortium is keeping the project warm and progressing ready for a future Labour government to sponsor. Thirdly [I will not say as it might be regarded as defamatory ……. ].
    Perhaps the Labour leadership has quietly indicated that it would reward the consortium for its work when it returns to power at some point.
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:10am
    - pdm
      
      I have only one thought on this – well I suppose two actually.
      
      1. If a private company wants to have a go at a scheme like Lake Onslow then they should go for it.
      2. If it requires Government money (and if David Parker is involved it almost certainly will) then it is a NO!!!
      
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      October 27, 2025 9:42am
      - peterwn
        
        Agree completely.
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:04am
      - AitchW
        
        This is a wet dream for a Labour/Green/TPM government.
        Labour can throw billions of tax dollars at it, the Greens can bask in the reflected glory of the environmental virtue and TPM can wallow in the oceans of cash extorted by iwi to appease taniwha, for the interminable iwi consultations and koha, and the inevitable opening ceremonies at every stage of the project.
        
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        October 27, 2025 12:06pm
    - artemisia
      
      There could be a reward from any government if the lights start to go out in New Zealand. Or the heaters. And on projected supply and usage that will be when, not if.
      
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      October 27, 2025 10:22am
      - peterwn
        
        The main gentailers are well aware of this and will plan their expansions to ensure the lights stay on without tying up too much capital in potentially idle plant. They are fully aware that if they do not deliver and the lights go out they will cop the ire of government.
        This is a fundamental reason for a government not to split the generation and retail, nor to allow small retailers not to parasite off the large generators. The main gentailers have an enormous incentive to keep the lights on for their individual clutch of customers. If they are not allowed to have their own customers the incentive to invest in generation largely disappears.
        
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        October 27, 2025 11:09am
      - Foxfour
        
        You lost me at ‘main gentailers have an enormous incentive to keep the lights on for their individual clutch of customers.”
        
        Transpower owns the high voltage grid so the instant any power is generated it becomes common property of the grid and the generators cant decide who does or doesn’t get the MW.
        Surely you know the electrical energy doesn’t travel along the grid like cars on a motorway
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:01pm
      - CJames
        
        No Foxfour Transpower is the common carrier but you can’t get power from them unless you have a contract to be supplied unless you are prepared to pay the price of a supplier. Often the long term contract and hedge prices are lower than spot prices. Most generators run so they generate enough to supply their customers with maybe a bit extra. There is no obligation to meet the demand of someone on the spot market.
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:19pm
    - Master Mariner
      
      Why not spent the money for a new Dam ?
      
      It also appears to need a lot of “unutilised renewable” power in the immediate area which is not the case. ie extra Solar / Wind etc. So this would need to be scaled up ?
      
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      October 27, 2025 11:02am
      - wsk12345
        
        Exactly – you can only “block dispatch” wind and stored hydro if they are on the same side of a transmission constraint. Can’t block dispatch lower SI hydro with NI solar and wind. The HVDC upgrade is years away, maybe not as long as it would take to build Onslow? But still. I’m sure there are more efficient options.
        
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        October 27, 2025 2:39pm
      - Foxfour
        
        Low rainfall will affect all dams, as we only have 3 catchments . Waikato, Waitaki and Clutha rivers.
        Waikato is the only one distant from the other two which are adjacent.
        
        The elephant in the room is Manapouri-Te Anau lake system- which drops water 180m or so- way way higher than other ‘dam’
        This should be bought back by Transpower as the dry year storage and not used for normal generation. Saving $15 bill. Comalco would have to shut up shop of course as they keep telling us the want to
        Best of all no need to buy power to pump back up , which is why gen-tailers love pumped storage
        
        Or we could build a new 500MW coal power station at Huntly to replace the old thermal units. Dry year problem solved !
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:08pm
      - CJames
        
        Foxfour 500MW is too big for our grid. No generator should be producing more than 10% because of grid behaviour if it trips. Needs lots of reserves.
        And very few manufacturers build units that small. Huntly was the last ones that size produced by Parsons. They were building mainly 5-660MW ones at the time.
        
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        October 27, 2025 4:24pm
  - Tomtoddy
    
    What it tells us is that energy costs are set to increase hugely in the next decade. Turner and co will be factoring that into their calculations. Part of the elite’s big plan is to force us to use less energy buy putting the price up.
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:26am
    - CJames
      
      Energy is already too expensive, that is why we are deindustrialising though not as far as UK and Germany have. Even Australia has the same problem. We are just exporting jobs to places where they can burn fuels with impunity.
      ETS/ carbon tax is a subsidy for the unreliables. Calculate what spot prices would be if it didn’t exist.
      
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      October 27, 2025 10:09am
  - CJames
    
    I stuffed up the calcs and my maths was wrong – those powers of 10 and I lost a zero. It’s average $3M a day average profit.
    On days like today, the power is cheap (windfarms will be losing money) but these are quite rare.
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:27am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Who owns the land that Lake Onslow sits on?
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:19am
  - peterwn
    
    The land itself is privately owned by local farmers, Dougal and Sarah Macdougall, who own Minzion Station. The water usage rights jointly sit with Pioneer Energy (a small gentailor) (formerly the Otago Central Electric Power Board) and the Teviot Irrigation Company (Wikipedia).
    The consortium would either need to negotiate with these entities or become a ‘requiring authority’ and take land (and/or rights) under the Public Works Act. It would most probably wish to come to an amicable agreement with property owners.
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:03am
    - Taieri
      
      The consortium would either need to negotiate with these entities or become a ‘requiring authority’ and take land (and/or rights) under the Public Works Act.
      ————–
      
      Can a private sector consortium take land under the Public Works Act?
      
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      October 27, 2025 11:13am
      - peterwn
        
        I know that a non-government company can seek a designation on land under RMA so I presume it can acquire the land under the Public Works Act. The acquisition is nominally handled by a Minister. The Ruakura inland port is a private enterprise project and successfully sought a designation so it acquire the land and build the port. An adjacent landowner argued successfully that his land was not required for the port and it was excluded from the designation. However it was found that port operations breach noise limits on that land and the Port had to pay a pretty full price to acquire that land.
        
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        October 27, 2025 2:46pm
- NothingLeft
  
  I would love to see a breakdown of the 16Billion estimate. The pumps, pipes, electricals etc will be well under a billion. The basin already exists and holds water. I’m guessing an earth dam needs to be built too. But really, what is the other $15 Billion for? I’d bet extreme and unnecessary safety/environmental mitigation measures like preventing any dust blowing about in a place where no-one live and other nice-to-haves that would have been laughed at 50 years ago.
  
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  October 27, 2025 11:04am
  - CJames
    
    The basin doesn’t really hold water. One of the reports put out by the anti=Onlow green groups documented how even at current levels, about of the water flows through the rocks, not stream beds. Raising levels would make it a lot worse.
    The rock there is rubbish. Hard to tunnel and even harder to seal. Look how costs in Dinorwic blew out and that was similar rock – slate not schist.
    The dam needed was far bigger than anything in NZ and one of the biggest in the world if built.
    
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    October 27, 2025 2:30pm
    - peterwn
      
      Which makes me wonder what the hell is going on in the background. As I noted previously “Thirdly [I will not say as it might be regarded as defamatory ……. ]”.
      
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      October 27, 2025 2:51pm
    - NothingLeft
      
      Thanks. Good detail.
      
      Sealing a Reservoir with Bentonite costs something like $10 million/km², which would suggest up to $1 Billion for 80km².
      
      Earth dams don’t cost that much to construct Benmore dam is huge 850m long 110m high, and about 1.2Billion in todays money using all the small old equipment available in 1950’s. Onslow dam is only ~80m but several km long, so probably a bit greater volume than Benmore
      
      Which still leaves me wondering where the other $12 Billion is going?
      
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      October 27, 2025 5:43pm
    - CJames
      
      Here is one of the reports EnergyWatch did.
      https://www.energywatch.org.nz/issues/EW85_7-2022.pdf
      and they are definitively not a pro industry lobby group
      
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      October 27, 2025 7:46pm
  - NeonTeepee
    
    Could build a 1200MW nuclear for that.
    
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    October 27, 2025 3:54pm
    - NothingLeft
      
      South Koreans build nuclear for about NZ$4000/kW so $16billion would buy ~4GW of nuclear. Far more than NZ needs.
      
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      October 27, 2025 5:45pm
- ISeeRed
  
  If it’s going to cost $16b, just spend that on new dams instead.
  
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  October 27, 2025 1:20pm
- PurplePen
  
  ODT reported the other day “The new backers (of the Lake Onslow battery project) had the advantage of having the information gathered by the previous study”. “The previous government… spent $30 million on analysis”. How much did the new private consortium pay us for the study. Does anyone know.
  
  Definitely a big NO to govt giving them any funding.
  
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  October 27, 2025 2:07pm
- grumpy
  
  Dumb idea. Better would be to stack some more turbines in Manapouri and run a new transmission line to Roxborough.
  
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  October 27, 2025 3:09pm
  - CJames
    
    No- that wouldn’t work. You need to distinguish between power and energy. Onslow was supposed to help alleviate the energy shortfall.
    But it doesn’t address the problem that the power is used in the top half of the North Island. Making down south means a massive grid upgrade from where it is generated to Whakamaru. Same problem would be there if you shut Tiwai.
    
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    October 27, 2025 5:24pm
- comm4nder
  
  Why not just build another hydro dam. It would cost less because you wouldn’t have to pay for the pumps.
  There are plenty of locations that would suit another dam.
  
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  October 27, 2025 3:45pm
  - R
    
    There have been about five proposed, and planned, during the last 50 years or so; all killed of by activists and environmental courts exerting their Marxist credentials.
    
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    October 27, 2025 4:41pm
- nz_aj
  
  The Onslow scheme was conceived as a “dry year solution” many years ago. It cannot work effectively as a battery to buffer renewables as the volume of water in Lake Roxburugh is too small. At proposed capacity the lake would be sucked dry in an hour or so. Siltation reduced much of its original capacity.
  It is also in the wrong island.
  We need additional reliable, dispatchable generation closer to the population centre. e.g. geothermal. It also needs to provide cheap electricty, so that prices can come down. Solar or wind plus batteries and inverters, or LNG, do not provide cheap electricty. If they did, we wouldn’t be burning coal at Huntly
  
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  October 27, 2025 6:26pm
Cassandra

UK Reform party’s newest MP is under fire for saying that TV adverts have too many blacks and Asians which does not reflect what the community actually comprises. She accuses advertisers of being overly focused on DEI. “Woke liberati in an arty-farty world”.

Seems pretty reasonable to me and I suspect that she’ll attract a lot of votes to her party. Seeing a black Duke on TV was silly – Michael Caine shouldn’t play Martin Luther King. I note KFC adverts here reflect its customers. Hardly a white face to be seen. Very apt.
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October 27, 2025 8:02am
- Nikola Donatello
  
  It is not something I can get worked up about. Advertisers and advertising agencies are private companies. If their ads annoy people, they won’t work.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:19am
  - Cassandra
    
    True but that’s not the point of the post. It’s really about politics. How much of our Maori wonderfulness is because the Blob doesn’t tolerate opposition? Say anything like this MP and you’re accused of racism.
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:23am
    - Mike
      
      Um, “I see too many brown people in TV adverts” is racist.
      
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      October 27, 2025 8:47am
      - Ghost
        
        Plenty of white people in ads
        
        New Zealand TV commercials 2025
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:38am
      - CJames
        
        Ghost Are you sure those people in the ads are white? Remember Statistics have a racial hierarchy in their rankings with whites being effectively the leftovers who can’t claim some other ethnic class in their ancestors.
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:51am
      - Cassandra
        
        No, Mike, it’s not. She was making the point that the ads did not reflect the community. Context is everything. If TV was entirely white it’d be just as bad. Ads should reflect their target audience; shows should reflect their story. Although having said that I thought Pacino’s Shylock was brilliant.
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:52am
      - MCōs
        
        Those ads are mildly interesting, Ghost, but while I was taking a quick look on YouTube I noticed this clip of Joan Baez from earlier this year.
        https://youtu.be/AFLKvHcSpvQ?si=SLWHg8V_zDU1eRbr
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:05am
      - Jack5
        
        I looked at the lyrics of the song Cossie refers to in his 10.05 post, Bob Dylan’s Farewell Angelina. I’m not sure what Cossie meant by quoting the song.
        
        What did Dylan mean by this play on a pack of cards:
        
        The jacks and the queens
        Have forsaked the courtyard
        Fifty-two gypsies
        Now file past the guards
        In the space where the deuce
        And the ace once ran wild
        
        On NZ advertising and race, it’s pertinent that Auckland, with one-third of the country’s population, seems far more multicultural than other parts of the country, and Auckland’s where most advertising creators, implementers, and purchasers live.
        
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        October 27, 2025 11:31am
      - kowtow
        
        ‘Plenty of white people in ads’
        
        Usually the ‘stupid’ / goofy looking male breaking things.
        
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        October 27, 2025 3:19pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        And kowtow you forgot the all-knowing female narrator in what I would call “lecture-ads” (yes with the dufus male klutz demonstrating what not to do or just being the token ass-clown).
        
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        October 27, 2025 7:42pm
    - Nikola Donatello
      
      Yes fair enough. The fear of Wellington public servants is being accused of racism. They will submit to anything to avoid that.
      
      Several months ago I witnessed something that proves my point. A gathering of about 80 public servants in Wellington. The purpose of the meeting was to listen to some presentations. There was the karakia. Fair enough. Then someone brought in a guitar for the waiata. OK ☹️ The final step was to bring in some dancers, Kapa haka style, to guide all 80 or so attendees through a series of Maori dance moves.
      
      I was a step too far for me. I left. But the vast majority stayed. Middle aged white people dancing Kapa haka style in a gathering of professionals supposedly to do serious business. I’ll never forget it.
      
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      October 27, 2025 9:08am
      - Gravelroad
        
        I used to go to parties where people got drunk and did the congar-line dance round the room – kicking their feet up as they went along.
        Could you suggest something like that for next time?
        It was inclusive, there was music, everyone knew how to do it and nobody cared if you fell over – or didn’t do it at all.
        Makes more sense than being forced to take part in another culture’s regime.
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:30am
      - David Garrett
        
        Nikola: Good on you for leaving – I left a very looooong karakia once when I was an MP – and caught dreadful shit for it. My pleas that there should have been a translation – as the very polite Tongans do up here when there are a number of palangis in the audience – fell on deaf ears. Including Rodney Hide’s; he said I just had to grin and bear it.
        
        That was 15 years ago – God knows what it’s like down in parliament now.
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:31am
      - Nikola Donatello
        
        Yes. Anyone can rote learn a short karakia. Nobody cares if you don’t know what it means. Making people sing in a language they do not understand. No. And making people dance… 😞It is fair to say that is the only time I have encountered the surprise dancing. But the singing is common.
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:07am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        At a Wellington Playcentre there was a regular karakia to start the day, with a guitar playing Maori leading the songs. All the young Mums were right into it. Then one of them asked what the words meant. It turned out that they were Christian songs. Most of these public servants gaming their maternity leave were decidedly not Christian, which led to rather conflicted views. Very funny.
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:16am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Its a tactic used to instill fear and mistrust..
        
        Every person present at these ridiculous events is, in the eyes of everyone else, a potential informer who will report any lack of compliance or insufficient enthusiasm to the Culture Police.
        
        Add to that the fact that each individual has allowed themselves to be humiliated, subjugated, and controlled and you end up with a population with greater unquestioning obedience than Pavlov’s dogs.
        
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        October 27, 2025 10:57am
  - kowtow
    
    That’s not the point though , is it.
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:48am
  - Scott
    
    [Mod – give the racism a break]
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:51am
  - septic skeptic
    
    There are two types of people on this planet regarding marketing and brands. You have to ask yourself are you a Bud Light or an American Eagle?
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:05am
  - peterwn
    
    On the other hand, edgy advertisements which annoy some people can work very well. Think of Hell Pizza advertisements.
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:12am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Basically irritating attention thieves.
      
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      October 27, 2025 7:47pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  It’s funny that white people, when present, have ginger hair in disproportionate number compared to the general population.
  
  But then, to expect TV advertising to be fully truthful is a exercise in futility.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:22am
  - wsk12345
    
    People with red hair are racists aren’t they, or fascists, or something. Thinking of the Disinformation Project woman and what she said about VFF. Red haired kids in braids?
    
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    October 27, 2025 2:44pm
- Jack5
  
  Some big TV advertisers seem to be into DEI.
  
  Do companies that buy TV advertising research whether they are getting a return on their spend?
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:18am
  - Flossie
    
    Someone I know quite well is an actor, with an agent. So many auditions they’ve been to for ads but “isn’t quite the right fit”, then later we see the advertisement featuring an non-pakeha person.
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:09am
- MCōs
  
  Apart from the obvious differences in accent Michael Caine is 92 and MLK was 39 when he died.
  But that’s a one off.
  What are the ads this Reform MP is grizzling about?
  Do they show historic white characters such as the Yorkshire Ripper or the Kray twins being played by Jackie Chan?
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:45am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Jackie Chan?
    
    Who? Jesus, how old are you? Silent Generation?
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:00pm
  - Sacha
    
    MLK ?
    
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    October 28, 2025 9:18am
- leoj
  
  Everyone is racist and it’s not illegal.
  
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  October 27, 2025 11:46am
- lifesgood
  
  If you watch NZ TV adverts you would think every single couple in the country is mixed race, i.e. one brown one white. It’s ridiculous virtue signalling.
  
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  October 27, 2025 1:06pm
- PurplePen
  
  If the KFC thing is correct, why hasn’t whatever Maori agency clamped down on this since some Maori feature poorly in health stats.
  
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  October 27, 2025 2:10pm
Tomtoddy

“Earth Nears the Brink of Total Uninhabitability: A New Planetary Boundary Is Officially Crossed” shouts the headline. It is mostly about ocean acidification. All the huge amounts of CO2 produced from fossil fuels is dissolved in the ocean making it acid. (need to be careful this summer to avoid getting a burnt skin in this acid when swimming) Dr. Sylvia Earle, former NOAA chief scientist. “Now it’s reaching a tipping point. We have to decide if we will respect those boundaries—or cross them knowing full well what’s at stake.”

Another “tipping point”, coming up. The fun thing is that these “tipping points” are always just around the corner – they never actually arrive.

Listening to a unionised teacher yesterday complaining that too much classroom time has to be devoted to teaching kids about the horrors of climate change. There is an answer to that, sweetheart. Just don’t bother. Stick to truth. Teach the essential basics.
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October 27, 2025 8:03am
- Chuck Bird
  
  I watched a video yesterday about nuclear fusion. It is still a while off, but it will solve the alleged CO2 problem.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:12am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Lake Onslow will be a waste of money, then.
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:23am
  - Cassandra
    
    Might. Bit like all the other miracles. Meantime in the real world we support the Indonesian coal industry. The Captain actually Called “Let’s feel good! The suckers don’t know zilch”.
    
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    October 27, 2025 8:26am
    - Taieri
      
      The Captain actually Called “Let’s feel good! The suckers don’t know zilch”
      ————–
      
      Not that the “Captain” knew much herself.
      The Republic of Congo is about to deploy another Floating Liquified Gas Facility as a part of the second stage of the Congo LNG project. The gas and oil sector currently accounts for about 50% of Congo GDP and about 80% of its exports.
      It can be safely assumed that the “Captain” knew a sweet FA about other gas and oil developments in West Africa, let alone anywhere else in the world. And that’s the problem with the current crop of “Captains”. They know nothing about anything, yet make very far reaching decisions affecting our lives. And they get away with it, to the applause of the significant portion of the Unwashed and not just the Unwashed…
      
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      October 27, 2025 9:03am
      - R
        
        Taieri, you Ned to define which genre of ‘captains ‘ you are referring to, for your comment to have any credibility
        
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        October 27, 2025 11:02am
      - Taieri
        
        for your comment to have any credibility
        ———-
        
        I don’t have to prove that my comments are “credible”. You have to prove that they are not.
        
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        October 27, 2025 3:07pm
    - Jack5
      
      Not just climate change. Some local body recyclers are rejecting tea bags on the ground that the bags contain plastic.
      
      At least one tea maker’s packaging says that enclosed tea bags are 100 per cent made from plant material.
      
      That’s probably not be enough to sooth the Greenies. This is from an international Green site:
      
      Some brands add bioplastic to their tea bags instead of regular plastics, but bioplastics are not always as green as they seem.
      
      They are typically made from plant-based materials rather than petroleum, which sounds promising.
      
      Growing plants for bioplastics requires a lot of land use and can cause pollution due to using fertilizers.
      
      Bioplastics can still contribute to plastic pollution if they are not disposed of properly.
      
      Plus, tea bags are generally single-use items, so there is always a demand to create new tea bags, which requires energy and resources.
      
      Once they get tea drinkers back to teapots, the Greenies will start work on the tea plantations.
      
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      October 27, 2025 9:32am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        I think the current shockingly brain-dead disposal methods for waste plastic ARE a real environmental problem.
        
        It’s being thrown out (or rather shipped to poor countries to fk up their environment and poison their people) so why is it not burned for energy instead? In Indonesia they have mountains of imported contaminated waste plastic which is then burned by poor people to cook food FFS. It should all be burned at high temps with scrubbers to produce electricity.
        
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        October 27, 2025 7:53pm
  - sirknz
    
    Fusion is always ~20 years away from viability, kind of like we are always 12 years away from the environment collapsing and the world ending.
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:55am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      It may be more than 20 or 30 years away, but I cannot see so many countries involved in the project if it were very unlikely to be successful.
      
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      October 27, 2025 11:16am
  - imalwaysright
    
    The ‘CO2 problem’ is that we don’t have enough of it.
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:07am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Helion are building a commercial demonstrator fusion reactor right now, they expect to be selling power within a couple of years. Chinese are attempting to build something similar.
    
    These groups both seem to believe fusion will be commercial before end of of decade.
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:58am
- Spam
  
  It’s not turning acidic. It’s becom8ng slightly less basic.there is a lot of buffering in seawater.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:33am
  - JohnRidd
    
    It’s worse than that Spam.
    
    The claims about the reduction in pH are based on models rather than observations.
    
    They use their theory to make a model which they use to make a graph showing the lowering of the oceanic pH.
    
    They then show the graph to us and claim this is evidence their theory is correct.
    So they are using their theory as evidence that the same theory is correct.
    
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    October 27, 2025 4:54pm
- kowtow
  
  Funny how lefties demand respect for the boundaries , legal protections and recognition even,they declare important.
  
  Other ones, not so much.
  
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  October 27, 2025 8:51am
- PeterTrentham
  
  We need a tax and digital ID for that.
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:28am
- David Garrett
  
  Tom: Another “tipping point”, coming up. The fun thing is that these “tipping points” are always just around the corner – they never actually arrive
  
  Not quite. Those “tipping points” DO sometimes arrive – but they pass unnoticed, because nothing much – if anything – happens.
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:34am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Yes, this Deity is still waiting for Y2K to destroy the entire banking sector, the generation grid, and bring on nuclear winter……
    
    Has the Arctic ice sheet melted yet? Is New York under water?
    
    Disappointed! But wish I had hoarded a lot more gold back then… Instead I am surrounded by dozens of pallets of toilet paper! 🙂
    
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    October 27, 2025 5:39pm
- NothingLeft
  
  ‘Ocean acidification’
  What a crock-o-shite. Almost the entire history of earth has seen CO2 above current levels – until current ice age started a few 10’s of millions of years back. Plant’s love it and animals can easily handle it.
  
  And Current CO2 peak is a blip that will abate as we run out of economic sources of gas and oil. Oceans hold orders of magnitude more CO2 than air and have millenia long turn-over/mixing times so Co2 will abate fast once we inevitably transition to other cheaper sources of non-fossil fueled power over the next few decades.
  
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  October 27, 2025 10:50am
  - Taieri
    
    Absorption of gases into water decreases with an increase in the temperature of water. Every boiler operator knows that.
    And that’s why it is not possible for the oceans to “acidify” due to CO2 absorption if their temperature is also increasing.
    
    (BTW: the preferable term is “alcaline” not “basic”. The latter term is too broad.)
    
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    October 27, 2025 3:05pm
    - Grumpy Silver Top
      
      I cannot ignore that Taieri. The ‘correct” spelling is alKaline (cap k for emphasis) and my chemistry training taught me that both terms mean the same thing, pH greater than 7.
      
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      October 27, 2025 4:28pm
- Cantabrian
  
  Joe Rogan recently spent a coupe of hours talking with Richard Lindzen and William Happer about the climate scam. It provides a very good assessment of the nonsense and puts a lot of blame on Al Gore for ‘An Inconvenient Truth’. If you have the time its worth listenting to the views of two old white men who atually know what they are talking about,
  Say after me – “There is no climate crisis”.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt32chvO_iY&list=WL&index=7
  
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  October 27, 2025 10:51am
  - Mike
    
    Excellent! Joe Rogan is definitely the Oprah of this era.
    
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    October 27, 2025 5:41pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Yeah right. Oprah having a meaningful conversation with Happer and Lindzen???? NFW.
      
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      October 27, 2025 10:00pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Chuckle. One time hero of the GW scam, Ted Nordhaus, has come clean…:
    
    “The heating of the earth,” Nordhaus once wrote in 2007, “will cause the sea levels to rise and the Amazon to collapse and… trigger a series of wars over basic resources like food and water”.
    …
    Now, almost two decades later, he confesses that such scenarios were never plausible. The old models assumed “high population growth, high economic growth, and slow technological change”—a trifecta of contradictions that cannot coexist. He points out that fertility rates are falling, economies are decarbonizing on their own, and technological progress accelerates efficiency regardless of political slogans. His admission is blunt: “I no longer believe this hyperbole.”
    
    As people are smashed by massively increased power bills it’s going to be funny to see how many more believers start saying that they “no longer believe this hyperbole.”
    
    Not the fanatics of course.
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:08pm
- PurplePen
  
  The oceans contain about 50 to 100 times more carbon dioxide (CO₂) than the atmosphere, making the ocean the largest carbon sink on Earth.
  
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  October 27, 2025 2:18pm
- Handyman
  
  It is chemically impossible to turn seawater acid, although it can be done in the lab in a beaker.
  
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  October 27, 2025 2:47pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Extra CO2 will lower the ocean pH with several not-good consequences ….
    
    https://chatgpt.com/share/68fee729-bf8c-800d-bfed-0681ff02d78a
    
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    October 27, 2025 4:30pm
    - NothingLeft
      
      Ocean pH is about 8.1, ie pretty close to neutral 7 and as a logarithmic scale, the change in free OH- ions concentration we are talking about is absolutely miniscule – going from 0.000001% to 0.0000008% or something like it. Shell building Molluscs can easily handle lower pH as they have through most of last half billion years when air had far high CO2, or when exposed to fresh water runoff – and in shallow coastal and surface waters there is large annual variability anyway due to temperature change.
      
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      October 27, 2025 5:57pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        https://www.noaa.gov/education/resource-collections/ocean-coasts/ocean-acidification
        
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        October 27, 2025 9:36pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Sigh
      
      2 1
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      October 27, 2025 6:16pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      So during an ice age (which last roughly about 100,000 years with roughly 10,000 year warmish periods called interglacials, one of which we are in now, in between) oceans cool and draw in more atmospheric Co2. And in drawing in more Co2 the oceans become a bit less alkaline. So where we are now climate wise has happened many many times in the geological past. Did coral reefs, crustaceans and shellfish get wiped out during those ice ages? Nope.
      
      Fun fact. When oceans warm, they RELEASE Co2. Just like when you take beer out of the fridge and leave it to go warm, all the Co2 spews out in a gusher when you pull the tab.
      
      Keep calm and enjoy the slight extra warmth while it lasts. Ice ages are shit for humanity!
      
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      October 27, 2025 8:03pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      It appears chatgpt regurgitates woke narratives. Many of these AI thingies regurgitate curated rubbish from wikipedia and reddit! When I click on the chatgpt link provided it does NOT display the sources for it’s information.
      
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      October 27, 2025 8:29pm
Im Right

I see the hand wringing and pearl clutching on the left over the possible closure/downsizing of some maori programming (The Hui, Marae, Whaka huia and Te Karare.).
I have a question: how many viewers are watching these tax payer funded shows?
Answer: No one knows! as maori TV shows are exempt for releasing viewings figures (tax payer outlets must and do release theirs, TVNZ/National radio for example)
I suspect the few million a year that these shows will be given to produce will equate to just a few thousand(?) actually tuning in on a weekly/daily basis.
It’s one of those delicious lefty conundrums where they will protest and be angered about something closing that they never supported by watching or viewing nor participated in.
Once again it’s ‘the feelz’
Ohhh and of course it’s ‘maori bashing’ by the govt, hoo humm
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October 27, 2025 8:37am
- AitchW
  
  Perhaps the multi billion dollar “Maori economy” could sponsor these programmes for the good of their whanau.
  
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  October 27, 2025 11:12am
- Ian
  
  It’s started already over on TDB – “the Green Party are gravely concerned…”
  
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  October 27, 2025 12:58pm
- mandk
  
  ” … hand wringing and pearl clutching on the left …”
  
  I don’t think lefties do pearls. More likely tikis.
  
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  October 27, 2025 3:16pm
Jack5

An interesting angle on Fonterra selling its consumer brands to Lactalis of France. It’s by agriculture-business commentator Allan Barber at interest.co.nz

A taste:

“The original justification for forming Fonterra was to be the champion of New Zealand dairy internationally creating sufficient scale to compete further down the value chain on equal terms with businesses like Nestle and Danone. Fonterra’s decision to abandon consumer brands and concentrate on ingredients and foodservice is essentially an admission it has failed to realise this ambition.”

Barber has an interesting comment on the Lactalis deal’s likely effect on the consumer price of milk and butter in NZ.

Interest.co is a fine resource for solid commentary on the farming industry, NZ’s economic keystone.

Allan Barber on Fonterra:

https://www.interest.co.nz/rural-news/135865/allan-barber-likes-way-dairy-sector-has-developed-one-major-company-strong
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October 27, 2025 8:59am
- kowtow
  
  ‘Interest.co is a fine resource for solid commentary on the farming industry, NZ’s economic keystone.’
  
  You think?
  
  I find the site rather ‘progressive” , which is anything but farmer or indeed business oriented .
  
  However the stats they publish are useful .
  
  And you do have to get past the TDS too.
  
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  October 27, 2025 11:54am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Good news! Stuff has identified the least windy towns in NZ. Step forward, Reefton and Taumarunui.

I’m not sure it’ll lead to a property boom, though.
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October 27, 2025 9:25am
- rockape
  
  Just looked at an article. Reefton property price rise highest in the country. A rise of 136% since 2019. Not too shabby!
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:57am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Yeah, but that’ll be the mining jobs, not the weather.
    
    PS – don’t tell the Greens
    
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    October 27, 2025 10:19am
  - Master Mariner
    
    Yep, Just might have something to do with the booming Mining Industry that brings in High wages and Profit to NZ INC.
    Compare that to Wellington which is a Leach on working NZ’ers backs and produces SFA.
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:26am
  - kowtow
    
    I think mining is having a bit of a renaissance there .
    
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    October 27, 2025 11:55am
  - Jack5
    
    Reefton is only about 38km south-east of the Alpine Fault.
    
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    October 27, 2025 12:08pm
  - wsk12345
    
    The weather there is pretty horrible in winter when it sits under fog for most of the day.
    
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    October 27, 2025 2:54pm
JJ56

The bias must now be subconscious at Stuff. Story today headlined “A grubby, grotty attempt to shirk responsibility for decades of horror” with a picture of Luxon and Willis in the House.

Turns out in fact Luxon is apologising to the victims of abuse in care on the introduction of legislation to give effect to the $744m compensation package.

I’d never have guessed it.
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October 27, 2025 9:38am
- Ghost
  
  The Story is about the government not giving compensation to those who were abused in state care that have ended up in prison. It’s about the story of the abuse not getting much coverage.
  
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  October 27, 2025 9:47am
  - David Garrett
    
    Ghost: I believe you are missing the point…which is that the headline is totally misleading, and suggests that the Nats – past and present – are responsible for a “grubby grotty attempt…” at something.
    
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    October 27, 2025 9:50am
    - David Garrett
      
      …but rather off topic, there was an hilarious sub-title on a BBC story late night which read: “Migrant text offender arrested in London”…it took them maybe 10-15 minutes to correct it to migrant SEX offender…
      
      Obviously someone verbally told the person responsible to put the tag line up…but surely the recipient would have questioned what a “migrant text offender” was?
      
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      October 27, 2025 10:00am
      - imalwaysright
        
        In Britain text offenders get jail time and sex offenders don’t.
        
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        October 27, 2025 11:13am
      - R
        
        A ‘third language is English’ immigrant employee?
        
        1 0
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        October 27, 2025 12:58pm
    - Gravelroad
      
      Added to which, it is not a news “story”.
      It is an opinion rant from a person who appears to have few qualifications apart from being a “writer and businessman owner “ (of a burlesque club).
      And a fervent opponent of Mr Luxon and the National Party.
      This “writer” has become a predictable bore.
      
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      October 27, 2025 10:04am
      - Quail
        
        GR,
        Take it that your post refers to JJ 56 .
        In which case I totally agree the article re Luxon and Willis is ridiculous!
        
        2 0
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        October 27, 2025 10:43am
      - MCōs
        
        Some people might say we’re all predictable bores on this forum
        
        1 7
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        October 27, 2025 12:41pm
      - kowtow
        
        ‘We’ kimosabe?
        
        3 1
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        October 27, 2025 2:13pm
    - Ghost
      
      I would say this is a grubby attempt to shirk responsibility. These people had a shit start to life, abuse most of us won’t even dream of in our worst nightmares, and abuse that for some did set them off on a criminal path. No, I’d says the headline is right. I don’t like giving payouts to criminals, and perhaps it would be better to hold it in a trust until they are out of jail, but what they went through, under state care, they deserve compensation.
      
      3 8
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      October 27, 2025 10:08am
      - CJames
        
        Ghost
        The counter argument is what would their life has been like if not taken into the at times appalling State care. How many of them would have been part of the killing one’s children’s statistics.
        
        9 3
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        October 27, 2025 10:21am
      - Ghost
        
        You don’t know what their life may have been, but you do know they were raped, shopped around pedophiles, beaten, tortured.
        
        2 7
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        October 27, 2025 10:26am
      - JJ56
        
        It is the juxtaposition of the photo and the headline.
        
        A photo of Iona Holsted (then Deputy Chief Executive at MSD) who was involved in the historical claims process, and who the Commission singled out for criticism, would be more appropriate perhaps, but that would no doubt create legal risks and Stuff would need to justify their claims whereas they slip by if it’s a general smear of some current politicians.
        
        I assume Stuff is now a Broadcaster so the Nats will be dusting off a complaint to the BSA.
        
        11 1
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        October 27, 2025 11:11am
      - Ghost
        
        No, the photo is correct, it is this government who have put forward legislation to do this.
        
        1 7
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        October 27, 2025 11:41am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        I gave you an uptick as uptick for what I consider a good post, regardless of who makes the post.
        
        2 0
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        October 27, 2025 11:20am
      - Jack5
        
        The number of abused kids seems astonishingly high.
        
        Two hundred thousand out of about half a million in care. Why wasn’t this noticed at the time?
        
        I recall as a primary school kid playing football and other sport against teams from a welfare home. The kids were better dressed than us, looked healthy, didn’t seem unhappy, and many holidayed with benevolent farm families.
        
        One swallow does not a summer make, but why didn’t we know more about what was going on?
        
        People weren’t co-erced into silence the way the Nazis kept German people quiet.
        
        10 1
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        October 27, 2025 11:47am
      - Ghost
        
        The numbers are a different story, we don’t know if they’re accurate or not. But you cannot judge a person on how they are dressed. If you could then all the kids being abused today would be easy to spot.
        
        I had a friend in primary school, you wouldn’t know from the outside he was physically abused. Kids learn to hide what they’re going through. Yes they are co-erced into silence, they also hide it because of the shame, anger, disgust, hurt, etc
        
        At the end of the day these kids were abused in state care, some went on to commit crimes because of that abuse. That link was shown in the royal commission, it’s been shown in studies as well. You can invent excuses that you saw the kids well dressed. But you didn’t see them getting. Raped, beaten tortured. Shit, there are parents who don’t know their own child is being sexually abused in their home by another parent, or by a friend of the family or relative, and you think seeing a kid during sports you can tell.
        
        3 3
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        October 27, 2025 12:44pm
      - JJ56
        
        “Ghost No, the photo is correct, … ” [accidentally hit Report looking for Reply].
        
        I suspect you are being willfully obtuse in this reply. The article berates those who delayed redress etc. So the Government is to be congratulated in being the ones that got this Inquiry going.
        
        9 1
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        October 27, 2025 11:47am
      - Ghost
        
        The article focuses heavily on the plans to not give compensation to those in jail or who have served time 5 years in prison and the royal commission finding that a link between their abuse and offending, suggest you actually read the article
        
        1 4
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        October 27, 2025 12:08pm
      - Ghost
        
        Hell, let me help you since you are only cherry picking what you read
        
        Last week, the Government made it harder for some victims to access compensation. Basically, if a victim of state abuse has gone on to commit a serious crime (5+ years in jail) they won’t automatically get compensation. They’ll have to fight on a case by case basis.
        
        So if you’re a good victim, who never rebelled against the system that destroyed you, you’ll get automatic access to compensation. But if you’re a bad victim, you won’t. You’ll have to be assessed for your worthiness.
        
        Christ.
        
        The Royal Commission explicitly found a link between the abuse these kids suffered, and their later life offending. There’s clear, consistent evidence that these kids went on to commit crimes because of what was done to them in “care”.
        
        That makes the State responsible – at least in part – for these kids’ later offending. So to turn around and say that, actually, sorry team, we ruined all these children’s lives equally, but we’re not going to acknowledge them equally, is disgusting.
        
        It’s a grubby, grotty, weaselly attempt to shirk responsibility for the State’s part in what it did.
        
        3 5
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        October 27, 2025 12:13pm
      - CJames
        
        Ghost
        I agree that some (I haven’t seen reference to just how many) of those children were horribly abused by the State that was supposed to be protecting them. A total betrayal of trust.
        However, the Verity Johnston article was compensation for all children, not just those which were abused. And there were children who weren’t abused. They may well have been a minority, but should they be compensated for those who were?
        
        10 1
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        October 27, 2025 12:03pm
      - JJ56
        
        You are correct the Bill “Redress System for Abuse in Care Bill” does make the presumption that financial compensation shouldn’t be for available for new claims from serious offenders, but also sets up a process to have this independently reviewed on a case by case basis.
        
        As you noted “I don’t like giving payouts to criminals, and perhaps it would be better to hold it in a trust until they are out of jail, …” ie you acknowledge there is the risk that payments could bring the scheme into disrepute.
        
        For this reason the Bill introduces a process for complainants who are serious offenders to apply to an independent Redress Officer if they are seeking financial compensation.
        
        2 1
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        October 27, 2025 12:55pm
      - Taieri
        
        Two hundred thousand out of about half a million in care.
        ————-
        
        That would depend on the definition of abuse. One story had it that a couple of children put by their father into a “care” for one day and having been subjected to corporal punishment (given a few smacks) there were “abused” with life-long lasting effects. This sort of claims tend to be somewhat inflated, particularly when financial compensation is within the reach.
        
        Of course such a story doesn’t mean that everything was hunky-dory, but some emotion-laden claims can be out of this world as in the accusations against Peter Ellis….
        
        6 1
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        October 27, 2025 3:20pm
      - MCōs
        
        The Abuse in Care Royal Commission of Inquiry was established in 2018 by the Ardern government and lead initially by former Governor General Anand Satyanand who Paul Henry suggested to John Key he replace with a dinkum Kiwi when the time came
        
        2 2
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        October 27, 2025 3:22pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        I disagree. Money won’t fix anything done to those kids that are now middle aged or older. A crime was done, but that doesn’t mean that current taxpayers should be turned into new victims by forcing them to pay for others historic bad deeds. This is a cash grab pure and simple.
        
        The modern world also does victims of abuse a great disservice in magnifying the supposed harms, incessantly picking at the scabs. Telling people that something is a massive problem that should cause them lifelong suffering and anguish is exactly the right way to ensure that they have life long suffering and anguish – as it is all constructed in our brains contextually based on what we are told to think by society. If we tell people it isn’t a big deal then for most that is what they will believe and they will be made a lot happier for it for not dwelling upon it. Humans are hugely influenceable in their beliefs.
        
        Focusing on thinking about bad things in our past is the antithesis of what is proven to produce best outcomes in practice (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy).
        
        3 2
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        October 27, 2025 6:11pm
    - R
      
      Deliberate misleading political heading by Stuff
      
      0 2
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      October 27, 2025 12:42pm
- sirknz
  
  Subconscious bias?
  
  It is very conscious. You missed the article about homeless folks living in cars on the North Shore with a picture of a homeless person sleeping on the ground near a bus stop with a sign from a National MP attached to a fence wishing their constituents a ‘Happy [made up holiday]’.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360864462/behind-these-tidy-streets-homelessness-crisis-unfolding
  
  13 0
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  October 27, 2025 10:01am
- MCōs
  
  It’s clearly labeled as an opinion piece by Verity Johnson who has few friends on this forum for her forthright views.
  
  7 9
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  October 27, 2025 10:23am
  - NothingLeft
    
    ‘forthright’ – you appear to have misspelled ‘bullshit’.
    
    13 2
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    October 27, 2025 11:16am
  - JJ56
    
    When it comes to the article I have a lot of sympathy for it. My beef is with the subbie (if they have such things these days) who flicked through the photo stock and added a photo of Luxon and Willis to it.
    
    I note that they both entered Parliament nearly 30 years after the period of abuse, and it was Paula Bennett who was Minister in 2017 and committed to the Commission of Inquiry. (I think).
    
    3 0
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    October 27, 2025 11:41am
- rouppe
  
  The piece of from Verity Johnson, whose writing has had a marked increase in venom for anything to do with the National Party since her burlesque club failed, for which she blames the National Party.
  
  8 1
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  October 27, 2025 2:15pm
Jack5

Verity Johnson’s weekly rave at Stuff is on historic abuse of kids in State care. With it, Stuff displays two illustrations of Prime Minister Luxon making the official apology in Parliament — last year.

This was for something half a century ago, and is not something Luxon can be rationally linked to, but, bugger, hang it on him if you can. Better than pictures of spokespeople for the abused, now adults.

Verity describes discussing the historic abuse at a dinner with her girlfriends, who, she tells us, were “all well educated, middle of the road professionals.”

Not abuse survivors, then, but likely backers when maturity takes Verity to the Right side of politics and someone suggests she stand for National.
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October 27, 2025 10:05am
- rouppe
  
  Verity describes discussing the historic abuse at a dinner with her girlfriends, who, she tells us, were “all well educated, middle of the road professionals.”
  
  The definition of AWFLs.
  
  Further, her girlfriends didn’t know anything about the matter at all, which suggests the Ms Johnson is perhaps a tad obsessed with looking for reasons to criticise this current government.
  
  9 3
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  October 27, 2025 2:18pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

The same people who forced Harvard to moderate its affirmative action admissions policy have turned their sights on the Kamehameha schools of Hawaii.

Established in 1884 by the will of Bernice Pauahi Bishop, the last royal descendant in the Kamehameha line, the schools focus on Hawaiian culture and admit only those of native Hawaiian descent. The trust that runs the schools has an endowment of $15B, coming from the circa 9% of the island chain’s total acreage at the time of Bishop’s death in 1884. The schools take no money from the federal government.

The activists argue that the school’s admissions policy is racist (undoubtedly); the counter argument is that within reason, people can do what they like with their own money.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/oct/26/hawaii-kamehameha-school-lawsuit-admission
12 1
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October 27, 2025 10:09am
CJames

If one wants to know why roads are so expensive, look at the cycle path alongside the new road to replace the Manawatu Gorge Road. It must have cost tens of millions with all the extra land needed all needing earth moving for the zigzags. Then add in the planting and sealing. And it gets a path that is too steep for many to handle – steady 8.5% slope on Woodville side.
Could be an interesting OIA request. Can’t be many users so cost benefit would be abysmal. Most bikes still do the “illegal” track along the old gorge road.
16 0
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October 27, 2025 10:18am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  The obvious thing to do would have been to turn the Saddle Rd into a cycleway, with the option to switching it back to being a road should the new motorway be blocked by a crash.
  
  Total cost: a gate at each end that admits bikes but not cars.
  
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  October 27, 2025 10:23am
- pdm
  
  I think the novelty will wear off as far as users go.
  
  I know a guy who lives in Greenmeadows (Napier) and the social bike club he is a member of hired vans or maybe trucks and did a day trip to ride the new Manawatu Gorge Road bike trail soon after it opened.
  
  Probably about 30 of them but, it will be a oncer for most if not all of them.
  
  12 0
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  October 27, 2025 10:44am
- Taieri
  
  a path that is too steep for many to handle – steady 8.5% slope
  —————
  
  Too steep for me and I’m a regular and enthusiastic cyclist. No electric for me, still sticking to the classic MTB though. But the age is slowly (?) catching up…
  
  9 0
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  October 27, 2025 11:19am
- R
  
  The ‘illegal track’ which should have been tidied up and made safe. The gradient and scenery are perfect for a cycle/walk track. The original idea of the John Key move for scenic tracks, highjacked by activists.
  
  0 0
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  October 27, 2025 12:50pm
- MCōs
  
  Here’s a video on YouTube from four months ago of someone cycling along that bike path. There seems to be plenty of people on bikes.
  I used to cycle home every day up the Ngaio Gorge Rd and parts of that are steeper than 21%. Overall from the Hutt Rd to Khandallah is 3%, but some of that is downhill
  https://veloviewer.com/segment/2663579/Ngaio+Gorge+-+Khandallah+climb
  
  https://youtu.be/14wbxXNhEGI?si=5AzZW1uZIofDyDR1
  
  4 1
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  October 27, 2025 2:04pm
  - Taieri
    
    Great for a downhill ride, but going the other way…not for this old fella anymore;)
    
    Looks like the people who made this video rode E-bikes or may be I’m just seeing things.
    
    6 0
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    October 27, 2025 3:36pm
    - MCōs
      
      Nothing wrong with that
      I wish they’d been around twenty or thirty years ago
      
      2 1
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      October 27, 2025 4:28pm
      - CJames
        
        To stop people going too fast down Woodville side, they put chicanes in every 200m or there abouts. I’m waiting to see all the accidents that happen there. The grannies on e bikes don’t seem to have braking sorted out, judging from the efforts seen on the concrete tracks.
        
        4 1
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        October 27, 2025 5:27pm
I remember when

The Dame Noeleen Taurua saga shows the fine line that exists for coaches between acceptable and complaints.
It is, of course, an invisible line which the players also have different opinions about.
Perhaps of more concern, are the problems of clear career pathways for both players and coaches in netball in New Zealand.
Add to that player development, especially at Goal Attack.
Ameliaanne has played for the Silver Ferns since 2014, she played for Australian Age Group teams so is not really a product of the Silver Ferns systems.
It is only in the last year that there has been a marked improvement with three potential options now available.
Is Liana Leota going to be the next Ferns coach when Noeleen retires?
3 0
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October 27, 2025 10:35am
- MCōs
  
  A problem with netball, which is the highest participation sport in NZ, I believe, is the poor renunciation. The top players earn about $130,000p.a and about half that at the next level down.
  Steve Adams, a middling NBA player, probably earns enough in a year to pay all their salaries including ANZ Premiership players for ten years.
  
  5 0
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  October 27, 2025 4:53pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    ‘Steve Adams, a middling NBA player, probably earns enough in a year to pay all their salaries including ANZ Premiership players for ten years.’
    
    Why is that?
    
    1 2
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    October 27, 2025 6:09pm
    - trout
      
      renunciation??
      
      2 0
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      October 27, 2025 6:14pm
    - MCōs
      
      The salary cap for all the ANZ Premiership teams is $500,000pa
      Steve Adams salary is about $20mil pa
      So you can fill in the gaps . . . . . .
      
      1 2
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      October 27, 2025 6:46pm
I remember when

It has been hard to know which days to call windy in Palmerston North during the last week or so.
Highest reading at Palmerston North Airport;

Sat 56 kph
Sun 56 khp
Mon 61 kph
Tue 76 kph
Wed 70 kph
Thu 87 kph
Fri 61 kph
Sat 50 kph
Sun 72 kph
5 0
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October 27, 2025 10:52am
- CJames
  
  I noticed that yesterday for Te Apiti, 8 turbines weren’t running. They can’t make money if they are broken down and not repaired.
  
  7 0
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  October 27, 2025 2:33pm
  - AitchW
    
    According to Transpower 99% of our electricity is currently being generated by renewables.
    Hydro, geothermal and wind producing almost all.
    https://www.transpower.co.nz/system-operator/live-system-and-market-data/consolidated-live-data
    The only non-renewable is 35mw of co-gen.
    No gas, no coal, no diesel and not even any battery.
    
    0 0
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    October 27, 2025 4:42pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Hydro and geothermal are baseload generation.
      
      Wind is indeed the much vaunted flake power.
      
      0 0
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      October 27, 2025 8:06pm
Pope Punctilious II

Churches campaigning for Labour:
https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/360860219/police-asked-probe-labours-church-campaigning-amid-concerns-spiritual-influence?cx_testId=10&cx_testVariant=cx_1&cx_artPos=0&utm_source=the_post_stuff_home&utm_medium=referral#cxrecs_s
2 0
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October 27, 2025 11:25am
NeverMindTheBollocks

1 in 20 immigration applicants airbrush their photos. One hopes it is for vanity purposes only.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/576988/altered-clients-photos-causing-headaches-for-immigration-advisers
3 0
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October 27, 2025 1:43pm
Steve Todd

How do I know Zohran Kwame Mamdani is going to win the NYC mayoralty on Wednesday, 5 November (our time)? Because Kiwiblog commenters are silent about this upcoming election, that’s how.

Check out Mamdani’s “New York Is Not For Sale” rally in Queens, New York, a few hours ago, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuiaXV5DR2s. The video is 1 hour 12 minutes. It kicks off with AOC, then Bernie comes on stage at 13:45, then the soon-to-be mayor-elect enters the stage at 36 minutes.

All three addresses are magnificent. Andrew Cuomo’s political career is about to come to an ignominious end. Good job!
4 2
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October 27, 2025 4:24pm
- MCōs
  
  You know Cuomo is struggling when a supporter puts this on X
  https://x.com/elliecohanim/status/1982107679158866188?s=61
  
  5 1
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  October 27, 2025 5:04pm
- Taieri
  
  How do I know Zohran Kwame Mamdani is going to win the NYC mayoralty
  —————
  
  Good on you Steve, you are a legend!
  
  Now, what are the winning Lotto numbers for next Wednesday?
  
  3 0
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  October 27, 2025 5:09pm
- Im Right
  
  I hope he does win Steve!
  NY has been Democratic strong hold for years.
  Let them enjoy what socialism really means, not just bumper sticker slogans nor just chants at rallies.
  Watch the exodus (money) and watch the city debt climb.
  This is a good thing, it will be such a delight watching the voters realise what a mistake they have made in a year or so.
  
  4 1
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  October 27, 2025 5:14pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Or; no one here gives a damn about the Democrat ****hole that is New York or other ****holes like Minneapolis, another bastion of Democrat corruption and abysmal management.
  They Vote him in- they deserve what they get.
  And its another example of Marxist Progressives ability to ruin a City.
  
  How is Letitia ‘no one is above the Law’ James, Court case going?
  Has she claimed its a vendetta or racist yet?
  Lol
  
  3 4
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  October 27, 2025 6:06pm
  - Mike
    
    Trump’s lawfare, like most of his pre-presidency businesses, will mostly fail.
    
    3 6
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    October 27, 2025 7:16pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Bottom line is he’s twice been elected US president and is in the black more than you ever will be. Oh and like many successful entrepreneurs he doesn’t give up when things don’t work out.
      
      3 1
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      October 27, 2025 8:42pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Chuckle. Who is Brandon Johnson? 😂
    
    Or Karen Bass for that matter. 😂
    
    2 1
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    October 27, 2025 11:31pm
- Inandout
  
  ST, of course he will win and of course New York citizens of some wealth and above will be taxed to high heaven. Only a brain dead NY business person would stay to get financially raped so Mamdani will borrow to cover the substantial losses. The voters will choose their poison, ignoring the old saying ‘there are no free lunches’.
  
  2 1
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  October 27, 2025 8:48pm
- rouppe
  
  Oh, OK.
  
  Mandami is probably going to win, and New York is going to become a pretty horrible place, much the same as what has happened in San Francisco and Vancouver.
  
  0 0
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  October 27, 2025 9:19pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  Because Kiwiblog commenters are silent about this upcoming election, that’s how.
  
  Chuckle. What observer of American politics hasn’t known this for months since he won the Democrat primary?
  
  2 1
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  October 27, 2025 11:29pm
Northshoredoc

What is it with the morons who haven’t been immunised against measles?
5 0
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October 27, 2025 6:06pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  They are worried that those who allegedly know best for them can no longer be trusted?
  
  Extreme ideological tribalism plus corruption of late probably hasn’t helped in that regard,
  
  6 1
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  October 27, 2025 8:08pm
Christopher Thomson

Is Obama going to be arrested and charged?

Sounds like he is in the firing line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZg1KbpWaL4
1 1
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October 27, 2025 7:21pm

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