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December 2, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 02 December 2025

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General Debate

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Positan

Hipkins, in fatuously suggesting that “every person in prison represents a failing on the part of all the rest of us”, drives me to conclude he’s showing that not only has he not got a clue but that, transparently, he’s learned absolutely nothing from all those years he’s squandered in our parliament.

To make such an absurd and utterly nonsensical claim is as looney and fatuous as might have been uttered by a newby, tear-jerking, pretend-politico – NOT someone who is the Leader of NZ’s Parliamentary Opposition and who views himself as prime minister material.

Could it be that instead of shouldering some of the blame for 2007 Greens and Labour’s unbelievable stupidity in legislating the stopping of parental smacking, which almost totally undermined parental capability to instil the beginnings of meaningful discipline during youngsters’ formative years, he cannot see the irreparable social damage that has resulted from what Labour/Greens then inflicted?

Could it be also that during his own far-less-than-adequate performances as Minister of Police and Minister of Education, he spent so much time distant from the real world that even back then he was unable to recognise the worsening criminal situation for which he’d been inclusively responsible for creating and sustaining?

Could it be too that he was so deeply immersed in Ardern’s and his own utterly foundationless and ineffective touchy-feely policies to abandon jail sentences, that he’s still unable to appreciate the scale of the damage to this country that was occasioned by the self-same abject irresponsibility in past Labour/Green policies?

Whatever the answers – and intelligent, practical, rational individuals won’t have the slightest difficulty with them – when Hipkins seeks to blame the sane part of the electorate for any responsibility whatsoever in the numbers now presently incarcerated, the message is abundantly clear.

In no way whatsoever do Hipkins’ non-accomplishments to date remotely qualify him for any future position of practical decision-making or leadership – and in that I would include anything more complex than running a bath.

In uttering such inanity in proposing “policy”, Hipkins is effectively admitting his perspective and capabilities are a complete waste of time.
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December 2, 2025 8:03am
- R
  
  Running a bath……….Hipkins wouldn’t realize that you have to insert the plug first.
  Positan I am sure that you know from past observations, that Socialists never acknowledge, that their past policies are in any way responsible, for the demise of NZ. Don’t know about that other place a- ra- te-arower
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:40am
  - gravedodger
    
    @R he would never conclude a plug needed to be inserted in the hole the running water was disappearing into relying on his intellect?
    He would need a committee to research the disappearing water problem, to come up with solutions after the mandated Karakia, and reference to the Treaty, spent inordinate dosh on getting consultation with Iwi , held hui around the country and legislated a munificent sum of money to solve the problem.
    Then call tenders, giving priority to Maori for supply of a round rubber plug and have it installed after another round of Karakia and a Powhiri with some Koha and Kai to celebrate the successful solving of the original problem.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:50am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Many of them would not exist without our generous welfare system, but I doubt that’s what he meant.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:40am
- cmm
  
  This socialisation or failure is really just another form of white guilt, original sin etc.
  
  Some of us (typically Westerners) are culturally conditioned to feeling guilty, Some of us (particularly non-Westerners, as well as those with a victim complex) are not inclined to feeling guilty.
  
  Well I call bullshit.
  
  If someone wags school, joins a gang and ends up in prison then that is not my failure or my responsibility.
  
  Nor will me shouldering any of the guilt or responsibility help achieve what is needed. Until the criminal has a come-to-Jesus moment and accepts that they alone are solely responsible for their actions and the outcomes they will not do what is required to succeed.
  
  It is not a matter of who’s fault it is either. Fault is really irrelevant. All that matters is who has the capability to change things.
  
  That is why playing thevictim card is so destructive. It tells people that it is not their fault so they should just give up. It robs people of their agency.
  
  Of course having dependent people with little agency is exactly the sort of thing socialist control freaks love.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:47am
  - David Garrett
    
    cmm: If someone wags school, joins a gang and ends up in prison then that is not my failure or my responsibility.
    
    Absolutely. It is also bullshit to claim “it takes a village to raise a child”; what it takes is two parents, preferably married to each other, who are committed to raising a new generation of responsible law abiding adults.
    
    Both of my children “went off the rails” to a greater or lesser degree, and for different periods in their teenage years. Both are now back on the straight and narrow, one having completed their first year of law school.
    
    Both have now told me how grateful they are for – in my daughter’s words – “having been brought up properly from a young age”.
    
    In a very real sense, it is unfair to blame the gang member you refer to in the quotation above: if you are dragged up in a gang household where the only value is “being staunch:, and the only solution to challenge or conflict is violence, what hope is there that such a child will become a decent adult?
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:09am
    - cmm
      
      DG: The main point I was trying to make was that fair/unfair does not really matter when it comes to solving a problem – the only time it matters is with an assessment of moral culpability.
      
      No matter whether a gang kid had a “fair” or “unfair” upbringing, the only person who can fix that kid’s future is himself.
      
      Fairness is irrelevant.
      
      It matters not if I feel bad for the kid. All that matters is whether he actually realises that the power to change is in his hands and his hands alone.
      
      That takes agency. Telling people they are victims and life has not been fair to them robs them of agency.
      
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      December 2, 2025 10:40am
      - Phronesis
        
        Which is the problem with our justice system, it’s based on moral culpability. We literally let the worst offenders out sooner because they are less culpable for their actions. It should be a victim (past and future) based system where the major consideration is likelihood of reoffending.
        
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        December 2, 2025 11:08am
      - David Garrett
        
        cmm: I don’t disagree
        
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        December 2, 2025 12:10pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        Cmm. I guess you dont understand the social /parental pressure on some kids that represses their ability to “fix”” the problem.
        
        Over the years, I have come across many dysfunctional “kids”/teenagers that I have encouraged to “break free”of their toxic environment.
        
        Very little success as they have been conditioned to accept the “ruling” of those are the cause of toxic environment. Usually it is based on fear of doing wrong.
        
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        December 2, 2025 2:03pm
    - R
      
      DG..’takes a village’ is not BS. The parenting attitude of the adults in ‘the village’ has a strong influence on youth development, and that of young ladies to be. I grew up in a rural community of about 50 farmers, etc. It seemed like I had 50 fathers watching, particularly those with daughters my age group.
      
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      December 2, 2025 10:54am
    - AitchW
      
      DG there are those (I’m looking at you Chloe Swarbrick) who would suggest that your daughter thanking you for her upbringing is just proof that you abused her and now she is effectively a battered daughter!
      This is obviously woke stupidity, but there is a large chunk of our society who think along those lines.
      They’re the ones gluing themselves to roads, camping in aerial conveyors or throwing paint at irreplaceable artworks.
      Well done to you for sorting your kids out, some don’t bother.
      
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      December 2, 2025 12:36pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Aitch: The day I give two fucks what inverts like Chloe Swarbrick think of me is the day you can put me in an old men’s home.
        
        I actually have a mad lesbian half sister so I have “lived experience” – which is apparently superior to plain old “experience” – in dealing with people like Ms Swarbrick.
        
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        December 2, 2025 2:11pm
  - Jake Dee
    
    I find it interesting that you are willing to invoke the name of Jesus (just as a figure of speech of course, not with any real understanding of biblical teaching) as in “a come to Jesus moment”, and then also condemn the idea of feeling guilt as if that is a cause of moral failings.
    The guilt culture is a central part of Western civilization, the feeling you have done wrong and must do better.
    The other system is the honor/shame system, the code of conduct for primitive tribesmen, warlords, thieves and gangsters. whereby rules are obstacles to be overcome, there is no shame in crime only in being caught, and the winner takes it all.
    Refusing to acknowledge both individual and collective guilt will be the downfall of Western civilization, and you are helping it along.
    
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    December 2, 2025 5:12pm
- Nikola Donatello
  
  Insane. I recall a few years ago DPF ran a series “Meat a third striker”. These men, and they are 99 percent men, are terrifying. They not only should be in prison, but in prison forever.
  
  How is that my fault? Chris Hipkins should be confronted by the families of people murdered, maimed, raped and assaulted by these maniacs.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:50am
  - cmm
    
    “Meating” a third striker has some appeal…
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:41am
    - R
      
      True!. Damed predictive text is real annoying isn’t it
      
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      December 2, 2025 10:56am
      - Handyman
        
        I once had a secretary who declared there was no such thing as typing errors, only proof reading errors.
        
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        December 2, 2025 11:33am
- lastmanstanding
  
  To be effective responsibility must be accompanied by the appropriate level of authority. So Chippie give me the appropriate level of authority over those in prison otherwise go stuff your head up your miserable arse where its belongs.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:51am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Not wishing to hijack the thread but surprised our host hasnt done a post on the new Rate Capping proposal. Would be interested in his and others views, Mine are its BS and smoke and mirrors. Allows Council to increase at 100% of the RBs mid point inflation range, allows so many exemptions every Council will take advantage of them and allows Councils several years to increase by what they like to build up a slush fund to waste.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:56am
  - RoboRob
    
    I think they would have been much better having something like
    
    a) Cap of 4% on total extra revenue in a year. If they want to go above that then a binding local referendum is required. The referendum needs to get at least 30% participation.
    
    b) A fixed pct of spending needs to be on maintenance. With allowance for major new projects (stadiums etc).
    
    The advantage of (a) is that if covers ALL revenue sources. It doesn’t require a new national government agency to decide when the council can go outside of limits. The participation requirement reduces the risk of lobby groups taking over.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:15am
    - lastmanstanding
      
      This is an email I have just sent to Erica Stanford my local MP
      
      Hi Erica
      
      Well done on National listening to those of us who have for years been calling for a cap on rates. I am a long-time ratepayer in Browns Bay. Since 1979 our rates have increased 4.5 times the rate of inflation and the rate of wage and salary increases. In that time the rating base has increased significantly allowing fixed costs to be spread across a larger rating base.
      
      However, I have some concerns.
      
      There is no reason to delay the capping until 2029/2030. This will only enable rapacious Councils ( most of them) to continue with double digit increases to build up a slush fund before the cap. Secondly the cap should be the rate of inflation over the 3-year Council term to allow Councils some flexibility ( I am not completely anti Councils!!!) and thirdly the exemptions are so wide I can see most Councils being able to circumnavigate the cap. To avoid this, I suggest exemptions should be a on case-by-case basis with ratepayers being polled for any increase before the increase is allowed. This will force Councils to think very carefully about applying for an exemptions.
      
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      December 2, 2025 11:27am
    - pdm
      
      RR it should be starting from next rating round.
      
      It looks like National and NZFirst have watered it down by having the start delayed until 2029.
      
      That is bullshit legislation and councils will rip into double digit increases – closer to 20% than 10% – in the intervening years.
      
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      December 2, 2025 11:28am
  - sirknz
    
    There is also no mechanism to hold rates static, or move them back down should we ever be in an economic environment where this happens.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:36am
  - cmm
    
    Rate capping is looking at the problem from the wrong end.
    
    Do you think that a rate-capped council is going to ignore their vanity projects and focus on pipes in the ground? Really? I doubt it.
    
    Maintenance is hidden and is always easy to push off for another year…. or two… or decade… Long enough for Labour to come back into power, turn on 3Waters and get the taxpayer’s wallet involved.
    
    That’s what will happen if you rate cap. They will still spend frivilously and then need a bail out.
    
    I prefer that they just get the rates rises they vote for.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:46am
    - Phronesis
      
      The loophole has already been announced. The cap won’t cover three waters spending. So immediately all such spending will no longer be budgeted for under the cap, leaving a whole lot of money for vanity projects. Next rates rise, 4% on the capped and a special three waters rate of another 10%. Every year.
      
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      December 2, 2025 11:03am
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        Yes. Anyone foolish enough to believe that 3 waters entities have another source of funding than ratepayers wallets? Sleight of hand accounting tricks will not increase Council “headroom” to borrow and spend, they just take more bites out of their victims – us.
        
        Funny how Government never looks at the Standards that they are imposing for water quality – this is where the cost ramping up really lies. We simply take it for granted that the “experts” know best, when in fact they are bureaucrats living in tiny siloes solving one problem, not thinking in terms of risk or optimisation.
        
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        December 2, 2025 6:28pm
    - Handyman
      
      Ultimately, citizens get what they voted for. To be precise, the people who voted are getting what they voted for. The 70% who didn’t vote are getting the same consequences.
      
      For example, Wellington was able to spend $400million on a building no none will use, have 330 excess staff and still demand an annual 11% rates rise.
      
      We need to ring fence this folly to Wellington citizens and not spread it across Kapiti and Wairarapa.
      
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      December 2, 2025 12:02pm
- Eastlander
  
  That’s what they all think. It’s why all labourite believers belong in prison – if they aren’t criminals themselves they are unequivocally on the side of them.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:00am
- peterwn
  
  And his Government in 2017 dismantled welfare policies carefully developed by Paula Bennett and Bill English explicitly designed to nip problems in the bud so young people would not need to be dependent on the State and in particular to keep young people out of prison. Problem is fewer people would be dependent on handouts and hence be less inclined to vote Labour.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:09am
  - lastmanstanding
    
    Just an update. Cuddles Coster have now completed his first 3 weeks of paid leave. He is costing us $11,000 per week. I understand his lawyers are playing hard ball focusing on the statements made about him before he was placed on leave. They are looking for the balance of his contract (4 years) plus a big payment for “hurty feelz”. So around $2M for the contract and another $1 plus for the hurts. My betting is it wont go to the Employment Court because of what Cuddles knows and would tell. So he will get a payout probably tax free ( these can be structured as such as the lawyers know) and he will demand the amount remain secret.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:38am
- nigel2010
  
  i remember back in the 80s when they were getting rid of any physical punishment in school everyone was told that schools were going to be the bastions of peace and harmony that would show all the children what a wonderful world it would be, but without consequences what we got are spoilt little shits who have no respect for teachers or any authority and it’s got so bad some colleges now have permanent police during the school days
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:12am
  - R
    
    Back in that era there was an old, well worn cliche…’spare the rod and spoil the child’. The Marxist social experts new better, look where we are now!
    Thanks David Lange and cohorts.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:40am
  - cmm
    
    That is definitely only part of it.
    There has also been a massive change of demographics.
    Social media and the “gangsta culture” has also had a massive influence.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:56am
  - Colville
    
    nigel2010.
    
    A fair few near fatal beatings in my teens didnt deter me from being a total little shitbag , just made me sulk for half a day before going out again….!!
    
    and I was the last person ever caned at my highschool… the teacher involved was very lucky not to get twatted!
    
    I used to know an old fella..(he dead now, he hooked for Auckland back in the day) who was told he was getting caned in front of the class…refused…got in argument with teacher…belted teacher and knocked him out cold…walked out of school , he was about 14, walked up town and begged a job at the garage and stayed there for 10 years after doing apprenticeship. He also got his girlfriend of 13 pregnant at bible camp…so had a colourful young life!
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:06am
  - Ghost
    
    Don’t think physical punishment ever worked at school, it was always the same kids going and getting it
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:10am
    - David Garrett
      
      Ghost: I couldn’t disagree more. I was frequently caned at the Marist School I attended in the early to mid 70’s. I can’t remember any that I didn’t richly deserve.
      
      I was a right punk at 14, and the cane was the only thing I feared – and the only thing that made me modify my behaviour.
      
      50 odd years later I am still ashamed of some of the shit I and my mates put a middle aged female lay teacher through. Br Ralph’s cane fixed that problem.
      
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      December 2, 2025 12:21pm
      - Ghost
        
        Yet you were frequently canned…. as I said, it was always the same kids getting it
        
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        December 2, 2025 12:26pm
      - AitchW
        
        I too was caned (sandshoed in the junior school) a few times at boarding school.
        Most of them were deserved except one which still rankles, I should have refused the punishment until the headmaster was involved….
        The cane certainly was a deterrent for some behaviours, however boys will be boys….
        
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        December 2, 2025 12:41pm
      - grumpy
        
        I too was a frequent cane recipient. First day at High School got caned by Dennis Young, current All Black hooker, just back from tour of UK. I was a hero ( for a day).
        
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        December 2, 2025 3:59pm
      - Jake Dee
        
        Well, well well, how about this,
        Mr. Garrett remembering, if not fondly but clearly respectfully, being educated in morality and disciplined by Christian monks fifty years ago at approx. December 2, 2025 12:21pm.
        Also Mr. Garrett,
        “It is also bullshit to claim “it takes a village to raise a child”; what it takes is two parents, preferably married to each other, who are committed to raising a new generation of responsible law abiding adults.”
        approx. December 2, 2025 10:09am
        
        Those Christians, including unmarried monks are part of a tradition of moral instruction that reaches back over thousands of years. THAT is your village, it extends across space and time and is essential for moral instruction.
        But for you it can go from being “Bullshit” to “the only thing that made me modify my behaviour.” in about 2 hours.
        You need to reexamine your assumptions, because those two pieces just don’t fit.
        
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        December 2, 2025 5:32pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Ghost I was not one of the bad students at school (generally, apart from a bit of joining in the stirring of an eccentric and bizarre rage-prone teacher). I got caned for talking in class while a teacher was trying to teach. I didn’t do it again (even though being caned was kind of a badge of honour among boys).
        
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        December 2, 2025 8:51pm
    - Gary Benner
      
      Maybe, but it instilled fear in the rest of the class. I remember the lady teachers had three options to send the boys to for caning. One was light, one was medium, and the third, well, let’s say he was 6’4″, heavily built, and could belt the living dayights out of you. Just the threat was enough to help them keep order in the class.
      
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      December 2, 2025 3:04pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Its going to get worse. UK schools have 4 stabbings a week on average…. Coming here within the decade. The antisocial little scumbags are of course the real victims…
    
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    December 2, 2025 6:30pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Several generations of kids from low socio-economic backgrounds have been sacrificed on the altar of left wing ‘kindness’.
  
  The welfare state and feminization of education and flight from personal responsibility that left has endorsed has entirely fucked them, locking in destructive infantile behavior in lazy undisciplined careless parents and denying their kids any chance for success in life.
  
  Putting an instinct for feminine empathy ahead of sterner demands for proper self-sufficiency and disciplined behavior in social policy is terminally destructive for the bottom end of society. The inability to see that (through lack of intelligence, selective blindness, or perhaps amongst politicians just Machiavellian power-seeking clientelism of drop-outs) is the fundamental failure of the left.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:14am
  - Phronesis
    
    Sure those kids and the adults they become are damaged for life. But do you think any of them will ever vote right of centre? Of course not, so was it really a failure for the left or was it exactly what they intended.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:14am
    - NothingLeft
      
      I don’t think anyone is really that malevolent. People want to generally improve things, but the left doesn’t think past 1st order ‘thing bad – throw money at thing’ effects to secondary impacts from the bad incentives they create.
      
      The big lesson should be that empathy and charity without rigorous demand for good behavior from recipients hurts the recipients over the long term as their behavior gets more and more debased. Charity/welfare in families and small groups works because we police behavior and reduce help if recipients are lazy or misbehave. State welfare fails because it doesn’t or can’t police behavior of recipients.
      
      In short welfare doesn’t scale beyond administration by people who genuinely want the best for the recipient and have an immediate personal relationships that allows them to ensure that the recipient is trying their hardest to improve their lot.
      
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      December 2, 2025 12:50pm
- Philview
  
  This case sums up the problem with the last Labour Government’s judicial policy. A man is dead after the killer was discharged without conviction in 2022 for other violent offences.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360904385/ex-cop-had-seen-it-all-until-coward-punch-killed-his-son
  
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  December 2, 2025 11:48am
- Jake Dee
  
  There is nothing wrong with the statement that “every person in prison represents a failing on the part of all the rest of us”, it’s perfectly correct.
  Perhaps your dislike for Hipkins has made you unable to fairly assess what he’s actually said here.
  I don’t particularly like Hipkins, I actually have very little opinion of him at all, and the general weak tea liberalism of Labour is a poison and corrosive acid to society, BUT the idea that crime is a collective problem and therefore a collective responsibility is not a product of weak tea liberalism, it’s a half forgotten memory and a half digested scrap of a much older moral system.
  If a nation’s streets are full of garbage, thieves and rapists we say that society has serious problems that they must fix not just the dirty and criminal individuals.
  We recognize collective responsibility for social failures in other societies, so why not in our own?
  Also, have you noticed that your response is the laziest and most low energy response possible? You have investigated the problem of crime in the community just up to the point where you can declare yourself not responsible for any of it and so not liable to do any work at all to help solve it.
  Shameful.
  
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  December 2, 2025 4:51pm
Scott

It’s important that here in NZ we allow people to come in that are going to add something to our country.

Denmark got a hard lesson when they allowed 321 Palestinian refugees into their country in 1992. They tracked what happened to those refugees and the results are shocking:

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DPeO04wjYn6/?igsh=d25vb3Z4czVhZm10

No less than 204 of the 321 were convicted of a crime. How many ended up on welfare? The number is a staggering 176!

Then they tracked the second generation. The first generation had almost 1000 children! Of those children, 332 ended up being convicted of a crime and 372 ended up on welfare. Even the govt minister who presided over the whole thing declared allowing these refugees to come to Denmark was a mistake.

Here in NZ I would be interested to know what happened to the Somalian refugees we started accepting in 1993? How are they doing? How many have got jobs, how many are on welfare, how many have been convicted of a crime?

Let in the 3rd world, become the 3rd world. Denmark is a massive warning to other western countries.
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December 2, 2025 8:12am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Our refugee quota is not high and should be viewed as a form of charity. Though we could cherry pick which refugees we take rather than just accepting whoever the UN sends us.
  
  There is a larger number of immigrants who are not able to meaningfully contribute but are not refugees. That’s where the real problem is.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:45am
  - Jack5
    
    The world has 117 million displaced people, more than 36 million refugees, and 8.4 million asylum seekers. Those are UN figures (link below).
    
    NZ’s isolation has so far protected it from rubber-dinghy fleets of people, but the international criminals who are cashing in must be looking for other ways to farm this country.
    
    We’ve had cases of slavery of Polynesian workers, low-wage exploitation, and false skill qualifications in other migration scams.
    
    Another problem is that that half those from New Zealand seeking Australian citizenship were not born in NZ. Canberra’s going to influence our immigration policy; either that or we might lose visa-free access to Australia.
    
    Refugee statistics:
    
    https://www.unhcr.org/refugee-statistics
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:17am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Importing refugees is extremely poor economics. 3rd world refugees in the west costs something like $500k-$1000k in taxpayer money over a lifetime of likely welfare dependency and frequent criminality. That money is far better applied to improving the country and the lives of citizens. It’s also far cheaper to spend that money on improving conditions at the source of the refugees to improve lives of vastly more people instead of just a few lottery winners.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:18am
  - Phronesis
    
    It’s an expensive form of charity though. We could help a lot more in need if we were paying third world food and accommodation prices. Whats the advantage to anyone of having them sit on a benefit in Auckland and not somewhere more culturally familiar.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:11am
- cmm
  
  Remember that they outbreed everyone else too, so the demographics get worse with every generation.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:48am
  - kowtow
    
    It’s very much a form of “settler colonialism”.
    
    The difference in this case is it is fully “embraced” by the progessives .
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:51am
- Dougal10
  
  The lefty response would be the numbers committing crime have halved in a generation . And welfare has gone from over half down to a third and the success will trumpeted loudly .
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:50am
- Phronesis
  
  This is the article the numbers are drawn from https://piopio-dk.translate.goog/palaestinensere-er-endt-i-kriminalitet-og-paa-offentlig-forsoergelse?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp
  
  And this is the Danish Govt source for the above https://www.ft.dk/samling/20191/almdel/uui/spm/412/svar/1691136/2247791.pdf
  
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  December 2, 2025 11:28am
- Northshoredoc
  
  I wasn’t aware of the palestinian refugees in Denmark.
  
  Apparently there are quite a number.
  
  ‘Around 19,000 Palestinians live in Denmark today. Most of these came to Denmark during the civil war in Lebanon in the 1980’s. The older generation was born in Palestine, while many young Palestinians have never been to the country. They were born and raised in refugee camps in Lebanon.
  
  Palestinian refugees began to arrive in Denmark in larger groups in 1985. The civil war in Lebanon between 1975 and 1990 resulted in worsened conditions in the refugee camps.’
  
  https://www.danishimmigrationmuseum.com
  
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  December 2, 2025 11:34am
  - Jack5
    
    Chile has about — or close to — half a million Palestinian-origin people. Chile’s national population is about 18.5 million.
    
    The most — by far — of the Chilean Palestinians are Orthodox Christian, but they include a Catholic archbishop.
    
    Palestinians began migrating to Chile as long ago as the 1850s.
    
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    December 2, 2025 12:45pm
    - Northshoredoc
      
      Thanks for that Jack – always great to learn something new.
      
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      December 2, 2025 1:11pm
    - Christopher Thomson
      
      I would have thought they weren’t the problematic ‘Palestinians’ until after the Six-Day war.
      
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      December 2, 2025 1:38pm
- Conservatarian
  
  Ask the taxpayers of Minnesota, who are funding a series of giant scams for the benefit of Somali frausters. Even the NYT is forced to admit it.
  
  Ask the ratepayers of London. 72% of Somalians in London live in government housing.
  
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  December 2, 2025 1:27pm
RoboRob

The ‘free’ school lunch program really is the gift that keeps on giving for this government. Instead of taking the hard line and scrapping or capping the Labours school lunch program, they decided to just cut costs.

The result is almost two years of media bashing and politically motivated principals using it as a stick to beat the government with. Insterestingly the program seems to have been 100% perfect prior to this government.

Now today, instead of talking about the (likely incredibly popular) rates cap policy announced on Monday we are once again bombarded with ‘bad lunch’ stories.
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December 2, 2025 8:33am
- septic skeptic
  
  Could have and should have scrapped it in the first 100 days. That was the ACT position. Doubtless the MSM would still be wailing, but it might be wearing thinn.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:36am
  - Quail
    
    SS,
    Coalition and MMP at work again.
    Lack of courage by National and NZ First—- yet again!
    
    13 2
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    December 2, 2025 10:15am
  - RoboRob
    
    1 year free Uni and school lunches should have been gone (Act policy) but unfortunately the other partners are / were too timid.
    
    14 2
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    December 2, 2025 10:17am
  - R
    
    ACT position? I have seen no indication from Seymour that he doesn’t support the policy (Labour’s idea). Remember that ACT grew out of a few disaffected Labour ex MP’s
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:05am
    - septic skeptic
      
      Seymour is on record saying that his preference was not to have the scheme and it was somewhat ironic that he had been tasked with running it. He went on to say that if we had the scheme it should be run efficiently and at a much more reasonable cost to the taxpayers.
      
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      December 2, 2025 11:59am
- kowtow
  
  Election interference by te legacy media.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:53am
- Gnome
  
  It was mentioned that a teacher ate the lunches as well as the children, I assume there is more than one teacher eating the lunches provided.
  
  Can anyone tell me if the school is pay any fringe benefit tax on this ‘freebie’?
  
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  December 2, 2025 12:06pm
  - Ghost
    
    There were teachers at a primary school here that were taking left over lunches home and freezing them for their own meals.
    
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    December 2, 2025 12:13pm
  - AitchW
    
    Gnome according to the head mistress the teachers are actively encouraged to eat the lunches!
    I reckon she’s stretching the truth, that the teachers are permitted to eat surplus lunches.
    
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    December 2, 2025 12:45pm
  - Paulus
    
    Is that why there are no seconds or left overs after the children have had their lunches ?
    And who over ordered the required numbers ?
    
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    December 2, 2025 3:17pm
- artemisia
  
  Rotten lunches remained at school without refrigeration for three days – NZ Food Safety
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/580636/rotten-lunches-remained-at-school-without-refrigeration-for-three-days-nz-food-safety
  
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  December 2, 2025 6:25pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    what a surprise – another labour/media party beat up that backfires. So leaving lunches outside the fridge over the weekend is apparently proof the school lunch programme means David Seymour hates kids.
    
    Or that the Principal is an incompetent activist who is prepared to sacrifice children to “the message”
    
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    December 2, 2025 6:35pm
cmm

Seymour’s face is being pictured alongside the mouldy mince as if he cooked it and served it.

Parents should rather look at their “community” that actually provides the lunch.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360905623/parents-horrified-children-ate-mouldy-mince-government-funded-school-lunches
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December 2, 2025 8:35am
- septic skeptic
  
  I’m more concerned about how the kids will get fed over the upcoming holidays. Surely the government should take its responsibility more seriously and deliver lunches to the hungry kids at home //
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:41am
- PeterTrentham
  
  Seymour also told RNZ’s First Up that Haeata Community Campus principal Peggy Burrows was a “frequent flyer” with the media.
  Classic Seymour.
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:42am
  - Yvette
    
    Peggy Burrows was a “frequent flyer” with the media?
    PeterTrentham, it may just seem that way
    
    Haeata Community Campus, March 2025, scissor-attack incident; Burrows’ comments about suspension of student, investigation and staff support were included.
    Also Mar 2025 reportage, only a day earlier, concerning school lunches
    
    1 Dec 2025 Warning after contaminated / mouldy school lunches — Burrows alerted families, described meals as “rancid / completely rotten,” and said the lunches were recalled.
    
    The most concentrated mentions were around two clusters: the March complaints about the school-lunch provider and the December mouldy-lunch incident (the latter attracting immediate national coverage).
    
    Burrows may just be a little unlucky – but I would not stand next to her in a lightning storm.
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:40am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Ah yes, “unlucky”. When is she standing for Labour?
      
      Those mouldy school lunches didn’t plant themselves, they are part of an orchestrated campaign to discredit the coalition government and swamp out any good news about achievement figures!
      
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      December 2, 2025 6:38pm
  - Rumblestrip
    
    The tables have turned and it looks like the whining principal Peggy Burrows likely carries a good deal of responsibility for what happened. Pure Karma.
    
    I see Stuff has an update article but this time, Peggy Burrows’ name isn’t even mentioned. How curious.
    
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    December 2, 2025 7:51pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    A “frequent flyer” on BS Airlines?
    
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    December 2, 2025 8:56pm
- Southern Raider
  
  So the parent had time to be interviewed by Stuff, but doesn’t have time (or is unable to do basic tasks) to provide lunch to her own children.
  
  Also these schools receiving free lunches would have a high Māori attendance, yet where is the richest Iwi (Ngai Tahu) in supporting these communities?
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:59am
  - cmm
    
    Aah, but their children “deserve” food. Says so in the article.
    
    People will get nowhere if they keep up thinking they “deserve” everything handed to them.
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:27am
    - Ian Boag
      
      Particularly oldies with a solid income ….. 🙂
      
      3 29
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      December 2, 2025 9:29am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        What are you expecting those old people to achieve at their age? They’ve already lived their life and simply want to be comfortable so want some of their taxes back to make things easier.
        
        Big difference to kids that haven’t even really started their lives expecting everything from the get go.
        
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        December 2, 2025 9:37am
      - Ghost
        
        Their taxes are long gone. Spent giving their parents a retirement. Spent on roads, hospitals, education, military, police, etc etc. the taxes wealthy pensioners are taking are those of younger people struggling to make a life for themselves. How about if you don’t need this benefit then you don’t take it so that the money could better help those pensioners who are struggling and need it.
        
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        December 2, 2025 9:57am
      - cmm
        
        Ghost: “Their taxes are long gone. ”
        
        Not true at all. The Super contributions are at least somewhat ring-fenced by being paid into the Super Fund from which it is invested and then paid out (albeit with some top ups etc).
        
        The Super does not come out of the general tax pool on a day to day basis.
        
        The Super I shall start drawing in 14 months is, at least mainly, from the NZ Super Fund that was built by my tax contributions over the last 33.5 years.
        
        To say it is all just part of a general tax slush fund is disingenuous.
        
        17 1
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        December 2, 2025 1:02pm
      - SoloView
        
        @cmm
        
        The Super Fund is not paying out superannuation entitlements yet.
        So for the moment Super is paid out “the general tax slush fund”.
        
        From the Super Fund website:-
        “The NZ Super Fund invests Government capital contributions, and the returns from those investments, to contribute to the Government’s cost of paying superannuation entitlements in the future.”
        
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        December 2, 2025 2:33pm
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        I like to look at it as the tax I have paid being given back Ian. Sort of like Working for Families.
        
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        December 2, 2025 2:50pm
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        Facing 20% rates increases, double digit power price rises and the same in food prices, while living on fixed incomes – how dare they complain. They should simply downsize and live in bedsits!
        
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        December 2, 2025 6:39pm
- Simon
  
  Trivial nonsense. Non Nat Super welfare is at least $30 billion pa. Dancing monkey performing over food a distraction from welfare NZ can no longer afford. And non of those elected clowns can address or admit to.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:01am
- Scott
  
  Luxon made a mistake about school lunches. The programme should have been axed on day 1. Instead it’s become a whipping boy for the mainstream media to run constant stories belittling the govt.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:09am
  - imalwaysright
    
    I heard a Principal being interviewed a few months ago who ordered 900 lunches every day.
    
    He said that only half of the free lunches were claimed each day and the wastage saddened him.
    
    It didn’t seem to occur to him to only order half the amount….!
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:57am
    - Ghost
      
      The local high school puts them on Facebook every day. Last I heard a pig farmer still picks them up at the end of each day as no one wants them
      
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      December 2, 2025 10:00am
      - rouppe
        
        So on one hand you say that pensioners shouldn’t claim national super if they don’t need it, but on the other hand don’t say that principals are wasting taxpayer money, not to mention food, by ordering what they know they don’t need.
        
        Rather difficult to reconcile those two positions.
        
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        December 2, 2025 11:47am
      - Ghost
        
        No, this is just you being you. Stop being an idiot and twisting things to come up with something that only exists in your mind.
        
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        December 2, 2025 12:06pm
      - Ghost
        
        And since you are a little slow. I’ve always said the same thing on this blog about school lunches. It should be sandwiches targeted at the few genuine kids who need them
        
        Here are some posts for you
        Post
        Post
        
        Post
        
        Try harder next time
        
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        December 2, 2025 1:33pm
- sirknz
  
  There is a simple way to ensure that your kids don’t get mouldy school lunches supplied by the state.
  
  Make your kids lunch in the morning before they go to school you moochers.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:15am
  - Ghost
    
    Not that easy when schools don’t allow the kids to take lunch, telling the parents it is supplied for them.
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:18am
    - cmm
      
      Then you go to the school board meetings and argue with them.
      
      Stop being so bloody passive. These are just the rules of a petty bureaucrat. They can be changed. These are not the laws of physics.
      
      The law also says kids shall attend school regularly. Somehow the same people ignore that one.
      
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      December 2, 2025 9:29am
      - Ghost
        
        Can you get your anger management under control. All I’m saying is that some schools still don’t allow parents to send their kids to school
        
        3 32
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        December 2, 2025 9:55am
      - kowtow
        
        Thus the rampant truancy.
        
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        December 2, 2025 12:58pm
      - cmm
        
        Ghost, where’s the anger?
        
        You say that schools don’t allow kids to bring lunch and use that as an excuse to passively roll over and do nothing.
        
        Nonsense. Oppose the stupid rules.
        What are they going to do? Send your kid home for bringing lunch?
        
        Society does not progress if people take the first opportunity they get to give up.
        
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        December 2, 2025 1:05pm
      - Ghost
        
        No, you’re just adding things to a comment instead of taking what is written. All I have said is that it’s not easy when school policy is they provide lunch, parents aren’t allowed. You’ve then added you’re own stuff to that. And for the recorded one of the schools here the patents did fight it, went to the paper as well. They didn’t get the policy changed
        
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        December 2, 2025 1:11pm
      - cmm
        
        If they didn’t get the policy changed then I suggest they didn’t push hard enough.
        
        Where do these “policies” come from? What authority do they have to try to enforce such policies? Just lie and claim it is your religion. I don’t care.
        
        Rolling over because some power-tripping school board member decides it is school policy is pathetic victim culture at its worst.
        
        Take your kids out of these schools and take them to another. Yes, you might have to drive an extra 5 minutes? So what!
        
        Every day I see bullshit like this I am more and more convinced we did the right thing by homeschooling.
        
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        December 2, 2025 4:10pm
      - Observer of Life
        
        Why not just ignore the school and send your kids to school with a homemade lunch. Also necessary to go to the principal and TELL him/her what YOU are doing, therefore dont take it out on my child(ren).
        
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        December 2, 2025 9:18pm
    - Dougal10
      
      That policy was thrown out with the labour govt .
      
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      December 2, 2025 9:30am
      - Ghost
        
        some schools still have it as their policy
        
        4 18
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        December 2, 2025 9:54am
- Gravelroad
  
  Just another anti-coalition beat-up.
  The best bit in the article was this quote from the aggrieved parent:
  “They’re (lunches) not very nice at all. Some of them I wouldn’t even give my dog.”
  So what do you give your dog?
  Tins of food purchased from the supermarket?
  If you can afford that, you can afford to feed your kids – instead of expecting me as a taxpayer to do it.
  End this virtue signaling “free” lunch programme now.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:20am
- kowtow
  
  There’s talk on The Platform this am that the Herald today managed to post a photo showing Luxon with McSkimming.
  Since removed.
  
  Election interference.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:54am
  - MCōs
    
    Here’s the article here.
    McSkimming is shown in photos with several people at a time when there were allegations of sexual misconduct that were not being investigated
    The article is quite clearly not a hit piece on Luxon or the police minister for that matter
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jevon-mcskimming-police-ignored-sex-allegations-against-former-top-cop-prosecuted-the-woman-for-revenge-emails-instead/DAWYWAD33FAVNCI3Z6OXTXR3EI/
    
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    December 2, 2025 12:41pm
  - cmm
    
    Nope, it is still up.
    
    Disgusting putting up a photo like that to try to draw an association between the two.
    
    Why no pics of McSkimming with Cindy or Hipkins?
    
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    December 2, 2025 1:13pm
    - MCōs
      
      Maybe because they predated the time when the police should have been looking into allegations against him of a serious sexual nature.
      The point being McSkimming wouldn’t have been rubbing shoulders with the country’s leaders if the police had done their job.
      It’s a disgrace that Luxon and Mitchell and potentially others have been put in this embarrassing position
      
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      December 2, 2025 3:01pm
- Southern Raider
  
  So most schools in our major cities are bursting at the seems yet Peggy Burrows seems to have taken a different path
  
  When Haeta Community Campus opened in 2017 it had a role of 955 students, now its role is only 579.
  
  She’s done an impressive job of loosing nearly half the students while Chch population has grown
  
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  December 2, 2025 2:15pm
Yvette

… Persistent murmurs about Prime Minister Christopher Luxon’s leadership have increased in recent weeks, with senior MP Chris Bishop having to deny he was plotting to roll Luxon, while the Sunday Star-Times on the weekend featured a story by national affairs editor Andrea Vance calling recent actions by Bishop a “failed coup”.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/580575/how-leadership-challenges-happen-in-new-zealand-politics

• Craig McCulloch (RNZ) — 1 article (Chris Bishop denies plotting to roll Luxon).
• Nik Dirga (RNZ) — 1 article / explainer (How leadership challenges happen — references the Bishop/Luxon rumours) – linked above.
• Jamie Ensor (NZ Herald) — 1 article (Prime Minister’s office clarifies Luxon comment amid speculation).
• Andrea Vance (Sunday Star-Times / The Post) — 1 column (her “anatomy of National’s failed coup” / related column that sparked wide discussion). (The Spinoff republishes or summarises Vance’s column.)
• Catherine McGregor (The Spinoff) — 1 piece (The Spinoff column/summary referencing the Vance report and the “coup that never happened”).
• 1News (TVNZ/1News item — video/short writeup) — 1 item (coverage of Bishop denying any plot; often staff-produced/generic byline).

The above sweep of New Zealand newsrooms for 2025, so far, may not be entirely accurate but does probably indicate the real extent of “Persistent murmurs about Prime Minister Christopher Luxon’s leadership” – a political push by unbiased media :o)
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December 2, 2025 8:44am
- nathie
  
  RNZ = definitely lefties.
  NZH = NZME = their newsroom are typically lefties judging by the way they slant their news bulletins.
  SST/Post = say no more, lefties.
  Spinoff = safe space for lefties!
  TVNZ/TV1 = lefties of the worst kind eg ego driven and scruffy too, talk about having no standards, such a disgrace!
  
  But here’s the thing, the MSM journos left leanings are all backed up by academic surveys.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:37am
  - Albie
    
    Nathie- Forgive my shallowness, but I could possibly forgive TVNZ and TV3’s left wing bias in news reporting if they would just have hot weather girls!
    
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    December 2, 2025 2:48pm
- Dougal10
  
  There are lots of murmurings about his leadership , I’m sure MPs hear them all the time . Weather they have a forum to bring it up is another matter. Hearing luxon on radio the other day he didn’t seem as wishy washy as in the past , So maybe some of it is getting through.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:40am
- RoboRob
  
  Sure its likely a media beatup, in part becuase Dec is a slow news month. However, of course this was going to happen when National has an unpopular leader. Its one of the big reasons you don’t want and unpopular leder, the conversation is always around whether they will be rolled. It’s exactly what happened with Little and the other labour leaders prior to JA.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:32am
  - R
    
    There is nothing wrong with PM luxon’s leadership. He is a get on and impliment the agreed plan person; the sign of a motivated competent leader, who won’t be distracted by ‘wishy washy white noise’ from the MSM. Something that our MSM dislike; it’s the revolution at stake, don’t yu cha know.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:23am
  - Paulus
    
    Luxon was unpopular the day he was selected as National Leader, by Air NZ Unions and dissafected staff, even more so when elected to lead the Coalition.
    Spiteful mainly women spuring on stupid accolites, as they do as they are told.
    
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    December 2, 2025 3:25pm
I remember when

Brazilian soccer coach apologises for homophobia comment.
The comment?
“Colours don’t define gender.”
The sort of comment that destroys special “inclusive” apparel rounds in sport, that
shows they are truely inclusive.
Wow, who knew that being ‘inclusive’ was so easy and clearly defined?
When are we going to stop being lead by the nose (and exclusion)?
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December 2, 2025 8:46am
Paulus

I bet that the Principal is a fully paid up Labour Party member and a Union leader.
Another Publicity stunt with doubtful provenance.
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December 2, 2025 8:48am
- imalwaysright
  
  I get the impression from Peggy Burrows (Principal) that the kids going to school to eat their lunch is the only thing that matters.
  
  How about Peggy explaining the sub standard education that she and her ilk serve up EVERY day ?
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:49am
- RoboRob
  
  100%
  
  Great timing with the, likely popular, rates cap announced. Has once again sucked all the air out of an major announcement.
  
  I also note that not only are we feeding the kids, the teachers are also eating these lunches!
  
  p.s. I saw this woman on TV this morning and she said that she thinks the way of judging the quality is ‘would you buy these in a mall for $3’ and she wouldn’t. I call BS on that. Considering you can hardly buy water for $3 at a mall, I would 100% buy and eat one of those meals in a mall.
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:58am
  - Dougal10
    
    She probably would if you charged her $6
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:42am
    - pdm
      
      D10 – especially if someone else paid for it.
      
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      December 2, 2025 11:42am
  - rouppe
    
    The rates cap is a good sound bite but:
    1. Three years before implementation is dumb
    2. Too many exceptions, so total household costs will still rise strongly.
    
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    December 2, 2025 11:54am
- Simon
  
  So why not have him replaced. Just like National allowing corporates replacing their local employees with low wage immigration.
  
  Look it up. $25 ph employers are work visa accredited. National very fond of replacement.
  
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  December 2, 2025 8:58am
  - Raphael
    
    Because the school board has to do that, and I don’t think the government wants the bad PR that would come from mass firing multiple school boards.
    
    6 1
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    December 2, 2025 9:26am
  - cmm
    
    What is needed is a massive rebellion by the parents. Stand up and resist the school boards.
    
    But they won’t.
    
    15 1
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    December 2, 2025 9:32am
    - Tauhei Notts
      
      CMM, the parents cannot rebel because if they do the unionized teachers will make their childrens’ life a misery.
      For parents to rebel is an obscure form of child abuse. That is because the unionized teachers are a deplorable subset of society.
      
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      December 2, 2025 10:29am
      - imalwaysright
        
        30 sets of pissed off parents per teacher can be quite convincing.
        The teachers and their union wouldn’t dare take them on.
        
        But, as cmm pointed out, it will never happen.
        
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        December 2, 2025 11:44am
      - cmm
        
        Ultimately teachers need to live in the community too.
        
        They can only get away with a certain level of abuse of their position before they wonder whether people are spitting in their take aways.
        
        Ultimately most parents don’t really care enough and just want the daycare so they will just go with what is easiest.
        
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        December 2, 2025 5:32pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  This topic was on HDA last night, the principal has been very out spoken about good on schools, and spouts propaganda against the government on various topics, not that a principals be getting openly into politics.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:16am
  - rouppe
    
    School boards can fire principals.
    
    It really seems to be a circle jerk in schools between principals/ teachers/ school boards/ unions.
    
    7 0
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    December 2, 2025 11:59am
    - Paulus
      
      School Principals are fixed by the Department of Education and back door selections.
      
      0 1
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      December 2, 2025 3:27pm
- Raphael
  
  The problem is, that if he is (and Seymour’s calling him a frequent flyer suggests he is), by the time that is found out, the story will already be imprinted.
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:25am
- Ron Jeremy
  
  Yeah she took a PG against her old school . She then taught my kids for a year , both kids and I thought she was useless. It was always about her. Made them call her Dr Burrows . Google her it’s quite enlightening
  
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  December 2, 2025 11:04am
RoboRob

Kiwisaver and Super

The more I think about it the more it seems to me that even if we ‘scrapped’ super and made people pay for their own retirement, we would still end up with a system similar to what we currently have.

We would need a ‘safety net’ for people who haven’t saved anything for their retirement. People who have never / hardly worked would need something. Logically this thing should be less then the unemployment / sickness benefit. If it was not, then the incentive to save for your own retirement would massively decrease.

For disabled people I would envisage they would stay on the sickness benefit.

So if we have a safety net there are a couple of ways it can go. One is you give it to everyone, a universal basic income. This would be the fairest on those that have contributed through taxes and saved. Interestingly current super is essentially a UBI. Alternatively you would need some sort of government incentive to reward savers. The danger with the latter is that various governments would constantly play with the settings (like they have with Kiwisaver). These changes tend to undermine a scheme.

So essentially, the current scheme is where we might end up, the only difference being the amount of the UBI / Superannuation. The amount needs to drop to less (much lesss?) then the unemployment benefit. We could easily implement such a thing on a graduated scale. For example, people currently aged 50-55 might get current Super less 5%, 45-50 less 10%, 40-45 less 15%, 35-40 less 20%, 30-35 less 25% and everyone under 30 might get whatever the new UBI is. Obviously those figures are just an example.
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December 2, 2025 8:54am
- Dougal10
  
  If you are going to bring in a UBI all other forms of benefit need to go including WFF and a tax free threshold of income probably about 30k per individual introduced. GST would also probably have to nudge 20%.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:03am
  - Paulus
    
    We could to be like Denmark starting with VAT at 25%.
    
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    December 2, 2025 3:29pm
- Eastlander
  
  I can tell you right now that the ‘safety net’ will end up being what the Canadians refer to as MAID.
  
  6 2
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  December 2, 2025 10:07am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    “MAID stands for Medical Assistance in Dying, a legal process in Canada that allows eligible individuals to receive assistance from a medical practitioner to end their life under specific circumstances.”
    
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    December 2, 2025 9:12pm
- cmm
  
  Essentially Super is like a UBI for people over 65, so scrapping Super and replacing it with a UBI is just fiddling with the naming.
  
  If someone has lived on the benefit their whole life (slackness or sickness) and then switches to Super then that doesn’t really change anything either – just a name change and the amount changes a bit maybe.
  
  More generalised UBIs are a terrible idea in that they essentially put everyone on the dole and make work even more optional than it is.
  
  The only real benefit of UBI is that it removes the “welfare trap” where people see little point in working if they have to give up the dole. ie. if you’re getting, say, $20/hr in dole and lose that if you get a job paying $23 an hour, then you’re effectively working for only $3 an hour. Many people will see that as a bad deal – especially if that comes with extra costs (eg. transport, daycare etc).
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:14am
  - RoboRob
    
    Sorry, what I was trying to say is that current super is a UBI and that if we scrapped it would would end up with some sort of minimum payment anyway, which would likely end up being universal. Thus a UBI. The diference would simply be the size of the payement.
    
    No I 100% dont want a UBI for anyone who is not retired.
    
    I think the replacement for super (if there is one) should be significantly lower then the dole. If the dole is ~ $300 when perhaps the ‘retired persons UBI’ might be $200. i.e. people would want to top it up.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:39am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  It should be individual retirement accounts (similar to Kiwisaver) including a government contribution. The ‘safety net’ would be the amount the government contributes for low or zero income earners. Yes, that would somewhat decrease the incentive to save. However it would have two significant benefits:
  
  1. It would eliminate the ‘pyramid scheme’ aspect of the current system where payments rely on tax payments by subsequent generations, and is vulnerable if there are economic or demographic changes.
  
  2. People who have not lived in NZ their whole lives could not get a full pension. No more coming here at 55, hardly working, then retiring on full NZ Super.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:34am
  - RoboRob
    
    I like your suggestion. Re safety net, I assume you mean the government would pay a small amount in when you are not earning?
    
    4 1
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    December 2, 2025 10:42am
    - Nigel Kearney
      
      Yes, exactly. If a person earned nothing, the government contribution would be enough for them to have a bare minimum income from age 65. As a person earned more, the government contribution would decrease.
      
      I see just two drawbacks to this:
      
      1. Whoever is working when it is implemented has to pay twice, once for those already retired and once for themselves. But that will happen at some point inevitably I think.
      
      2. An unscrupulous politician might come along at any time and do what Muldoon did in 1975: campaign on returning the money immediately if elected.
      
      6 0
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      December 2, 2025 12:50pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        You want it to be fair and affordable ,,,,
        
        Raise age to 70 starting tomorrow. 4 or 6 or whatever months per year so things will take 10-15 years to fully happen. It worked OK for the 60-65 change over 10 years.
        
        Income test it. The $1-2bn (give or take) from pensions paid to the over $100k qualifies as pretty low grade spending. Sort of blows away the chicken feed stuff that people get excited about – like school lunches ….
        
        Leave KS as it is. The mechanics of transition to 100% KS or equivalent are just too hard – keep it simple. Muldoon’s big bribe …..
        
        5 8
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        December 2, 2025 1:09pm
      - peterwn
        
        Ian – re raising age to 70 effective immediately.
        Sorry, ain’t going to happen until Winston is pushing daisies.
        
        3 2
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        December 2, 2025 2:59pm
sirknz

‘Auckland woman’ by way of being born in Fiji and working here for 10 years as an economic migrant wants to bring her son in to NZ. Her son has cerberal palsy so he likley becomes a burden on the taxpayer upon arrival.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/talanoa/auckland-woman-fights-to-bring-her-son-who-has-cerebral-palsy-to-live-with-her-in-new-zealand/HKFFUJYHXZF5PIQSB3VBKUBAV4/

There is another way for her to be reunited with her son, and without being a burden to the taxpayer as well, go back to Fiji.
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December 2, 2025 9:07am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  She’s a qualified teacher. She’s left her son for more than a decade with her aged parents. What kind of a mother does that? Why would she not return to Fiji, get a teaching job and live with/ look after her son?
  
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  December 2, 2025 9:16pm
Cassandra

Outrage? Parents who can’t make their children a sandwich should not be making complaints to newspapers. Easy solution to this nonsense is to scrap school lunches. Parents whose children turn up to school without food should be arrested.
28 2
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December 2, 2025 9:17am
G the giant from Dunedin

Another day, another story from the Fersld about how to over throw a party leader ffs, this is becoming a joke, and if I thought about it a bit, snd joined the dots, I would guess that this whole bullshittery about over throwing Luxon has been orchestrated. For a started, all media started the crap st the same time saying they have been told blah blah blah, then they said Luxon was lying, Bishop has said no not happening, and if Bishop was trying to shaft Luxon, why the he’ll would he tell the vulgar media.

When Bishop said to HDA that this was bullshit last week, she said at the end of the interview Bish I’m sorry, as if she knew there was bullshit being spun.

Now Vance says it’s not an attempt to cut Luxon, it’s some other bloody thing that she waffled on yesterday about labour spokesman speaking to Peter’s about policy, asking Hipkins he says no they are not. There is some dirty filthy crap going in in the media
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December 2, 2025 9:23am
- BeaB
  
  They have no idea how to report actual news so have to make stuff up. Pathetic.
  
  17 2
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  December 2, 2025 9:41am
- Gravelroad
  
  How much conniving was there by the msm when it came to the shafting and removal of Mr Simon Bridges MP as the leader of the National Party?
  Or was that the result of internal discord?
  Honest answer please………….
  
  21 2
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  December 2, 2025 10:00am
  - RoboRob
    
    Heaps of coverage from memory. Same as Andrew little and the people before him who got rolled.
    
    I’m not saying they are trying to roll Luxon, but of course Luxon, Bishop and others are denying it.
    
    As I said above, this is one of the worst problems with an unpopular leader. You get these stories that may or may not be true but the party has no way to shut them down. As the old saying goes, everyone supports the current leader and doesn’t have leadership goals, right up until the leader is rolled and they take over.
    
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    December 2, 2025 10:45am
    - imalwaysright
      
      The problem with Bishop is that he is not blessed in the looks department.
      
      The ladies love Simeon Brown, who also must be one of the brightest and bravest in National, and that counts for a lot in this shallow world in which we live.
      
      9 1
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      December 2, 2025 11:49am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Little was never rolled
      
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      December 2, 2025 1:14pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Okay, yes I think there was great media backed up by pressure from the vulgar left (who had just finished buying media out) shafting Bridges.
    
    I clearly remember that pathetic post that blew up in Bridges fact. 25000 hate filled posts, I remember, because (I got just one chance to visit my dying father thanks to Hipkins shutting me out) the morning they post came out, I commented on that post, there had been about a 100 comments in 3 hours all very fair, non hate full comments, there was mostly smiley emojis, 3 hours latter 25000 comments turned up at once, and it was a cesspit of leftie hatred and disgust. I knew right there that media snd Labour had used a hit job.
    
    And I answer all my posts truthfully, sometimes I may get something wrong, but to my knowledge I try to give what I think is the truth, which is in itself very hard these days
    
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    December 2, 2025 1:23pm
  - lifesgood
    
    Judith Collins should be ashamed of herself over the shafting of Bridges. I have never heard such a stupid reason as the fact he made a slightly risque comment to some friends at a social function which was overheard by a precious petal who made a complaint. What man has never told a slightly risque story at some stage and it wasn’t as if it was meant for broadcast to the public. I used to like Collins but havehad no respect for her after this.
    
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    December 2, 2025 3:46pm
- Paulus
  
  Only some filthy crap in the media – bloody great lot now.!
  
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  December 2, 2025 3:32pm
BeaB

Why on earth are we feeding well-paid teachers too? The whole scheme is a typical Labour mess and should be totally canned. Only a small proportion of schools even get the lunches.
And Radio NZ is obsessed!
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December 2, 2025 9:40am
Quail

Parents should be providing the food (and checking its quality) for their own children.
It is parents responsibility
18 0
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December 2, 2025 10:06am
- OTGO
  
  Did a journalist to ask one of these whinging principals, “do you think parents could make a better school lunch?”
  Nah. Didn’t think so.
  
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  December 2, 2025 12:27pm
keepcalmcarryon

Speaking of Anglo-Saxon guilt, if you get some time watch this video on slavery, it is possible to quibble a little on mathematics and definitions but here are the 10 worst slave owning civilizations by numbers :
https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1AEHKhS81A/?mibextid=wwXIfr
It features multiple Islamic nations, the Nazis, China and African nations themselves.

Please note where England and the USA are.
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December 2, 2025 10:12am
- cmm
  
  The only people who have put in any significant effort to fighting slavery are the Americans and British.
  
  The Americans took on the Barbary pirates. The Brits took on the Arab slavers and their suppliers in Africa.
  
  Slavery was rife until after WW1, especially in the German colonies (Jerry turned a blind eye to it) of South West Africa and German East Africa and thousands of British soldiers and sailors died in these slavery suppression operations all the way up to about 1920.
  
  Both my grandfathers played an active role in this – especially my paternal grandfather in South West Africa. My parents had a collection of Owambo slave rings.
  
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  December 2, 2025 10:24am
  - kowtow
    
    As a slight aside .
    
    The Normans get an awful lot of stick.1066 and all that.
    Great churchmen , appalling Christians.
    
    They are rarely given credit for ending the slavery widely practised by the Anglo Saxon Jutes and other uncivilised savage tribes of those islands. And I suspect that civilising influence extended to their conquest of Ireland as the Gaelic tribes were notorious slavers , before the advent of the evil Sassanach .
    
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    December 2, 2025 1:13pm
  - MCōs
    
    From what I understand there’s more slaves in the world today than there’s ever been
    It just depends on the definition
    The Asian fishing trade is notorious
    NZ is not immune. Here’s an example
    https://www.1news.co.nz/2025/12/02/paeroa-business-fined-over-callous-exploitation-of-vulnerable-migrants/
    Don’t assume those chefs here on work visas doing the grunt work out the back are getting paid what they were promised
    
    9 2
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    December 2, 2025 3:27pm
    - cmm
      
      Exploited indentured servants are a long way from real slaves who are actually owned and sold etc.
      
      There were many of those exploited indentured servants back in the day too.
      
      8 2
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      December 2, 2025 5:27pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Someone I know in the UK is a descendant of V Adm Sir Edward Pellew RN who commanded the Anglo Dutch expedition to Algiers in 1816 to rescue European Slaves.
  
  He has the remains of his Battle Ensign framed. Over 200 years old.
  
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  December 2, 2025 7:50pm
waripori

The Washington Post reported Pete Hegseth had instructed US forces to kill two survivors from an initial strike on one of the Caribbean boats. Hegseth said it was fake news. Lots of people said it would be an illegal order and a war crime if that is what happened. White House now says that is exactly what happened.

Where does that leave the Secretary of War? Trump might think this is one mishap too many.
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December 2, 2025 11:29am
- Steve Todd
  
  Where does that leave the Secretary of War?
  
  Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti at Breaking Points discuss this matter, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlhpPCRvQMc [17:29]. See from 2:40, in particular.
  
  If the Dems take back the House next year (increasingly likely), and especially the Senate (at this stage, still a stretch), people like Pete Hegseth could well be in legal jeopardy. War Crimes cases take time, so Hegseth would probably not be able to rely on a Trump pardon.
  
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  December 2, 2025 12:39pm
  - keepcalmcarryon
    
    Trump could just pardon him pro actively like sleepy joes auto pen did.
    
    3 4
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    December 2, 2025 12:55pm
    - waripori
      
      I doubt anyone is sending Pete to Jail but hard to see how he can continue as the Pentagon boss if the actual troops dont trust him or his judgement. Trump wont take the heat for him.
      
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      December 2, 2025 1:17pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Katty Kay at the The Rest is Politics US (5 hours ago) reckons Hegseth is going to throw Admiral Bradley under the bus, then Trump is going to throw Hegseth under the bus. Neither action would surprise me.
      
      See between about 10 and 14 minutes, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omdFW3wdmMQ [40:16].
      
      2 3
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      December 2, 2025 5:18pm
- Christopher Thomson
  
  Watch this.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/shorts/lpmFcDzm3us
  
  A commentator with credibility.
  
  Also this one
  
  https://www.youtube.com/shorts/E569l0jUNNE
  
  Care to post a link to the Whitehouse statement?
  
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  December 2, 2025 1:59pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  They’re claiming the first strike wasn’t complete on the target so they did another and it was the commanding officer that made the call. That isn’t a war crime. The whole “Hesgeth said no survivors” thing doesn’t seem to have any evidence.
  
  It sounds like it wasn’t really a double tap like what Obama was so fond of.
  
  It’s also worth noting that this accusation came a couple days after a Dem was interviewed by Jen Psaki saying that this exact alleged scenario (killing survivors) would be an illegal order.
  
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  December 2, 2025 2:48pm
- Steve Todd
  
  Another, devastating, perspective: this one from the brilliant Lawrence O’Donnell, at MS NOW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8GbYvdyFmA [11:44].
  
  This matter is not going to go away. It could well lead directly to the downfall of Trump and to many of the people who have been silly enough to associate themselves with him.
  
  And, for your delectation, here’s the long version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvPGTEHgqwI [56:28].
  
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  December 2, 2025 7:19pm
Steve Todd

Further to my comment at GD on Saturday afternoon, I see Trump, Johnson, et al, are chucking everything at the special election in Tennessee’s 7th congressional district.

A win for Aftyn Beyn (D) would be catastrophic for MAGA. Even a close, say five- or so point defeat, would still send shockwaves through the Republican Party.

Realistically, Beyn won’t pull this one off, but hey, let’s face it, the race should not be this close. The fact that it is – and following the results of the off-year elections a month ago – indicates the end of MAGA may well be nigh.

See here for a good discussion (yesterday): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNVBDHgFkkA [11:53].
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December 2, 2025 1:09pm
- Conservatarian
  
  So Behn will be a plucky loser then? Win some sort of moral victory? That and $5 will get me a cup of coffee.
  
  The YouTube link is to a channel called “Stop Trump News”. A group of deranged ResistLibs if ever I saw one.
  
  I remember your total but severely misplaced confidence in the disastrous Harris-Walz ticket last year.
  
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  December 2, 2025 4:36pm
Burtland

seems National are slowly developing a backbone …

Willis has confirmed the government had no intention of buying offshore carbon credits to meet the 2030 Paris agreement as part of a “performative awards ceremony” even if that meant it would breach its commitment.

Wow

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/580609/a-bit-tired-a-bit-ratty-heated-exchange-between-willis-and-labour-mps-at-parliament
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December 2, 2025 1:15pm
virtualmark

The GOP must be worried that a good number of their congresspeople have incentives to retire before the mid-term elections next year. They should win this special election, and the one to replace MTG, but there are many other GOP seats that have smaller margins of safety than those.
1 0
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December 2, 2025 2:18pm
Chuck Bird

Sean plunket interviews Dr Happer on The Platform. The video is just 20 Minutes.

Dr William Happer Previews His Trip To NZ To Talk Climate Change Truth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xy0Fv4hiRVw
5 4
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December 2, 2025 3:21pm
Swifty

Fancy that!

People bringing their cultural practices to New Zealand and keeping them going.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/580614/virginity-testing-harming-women-in-new-zealand-researcher

Well I never….
0 0
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December 2, 2025 4:21pm
Graeme Hall

A rather novel approach to lower the costs of Christmas shopping.

Police told RNZ the pendant had not yet been recovered.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/580613/man-charged-after-allegedly-swallowing-a-pendant-at-an-auckland-jewellers
0 0
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December 2, 2025 5:50pm
Swifty

If anyone wants a glimpse, a taste, of what’s ahead of us if Loopy Labour, the Crazy Greens and the Racist Maori Party get in next year then watch this:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DIp5UTBFP7k

Andrew Neil with some sharp observations.
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December 2, 2025 5:53pm
Gravelroad

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360906647/law-boss-compulsively-watched-porn-work-which-female-staff-couldnt-help-seeing-frequently
So here is another weirdo allegedly “addicted to porn” while at work.
His name should be made public so that the buyer (customer) can beware .
If I go to consult a lawyer costing $hundreds per hour, I wouldn’t expect him to be distracted by a compulsive need to watch porn every second minute.
What is it with these people?
Not exactly professional, is it.
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December 2, 2025 7:03pm
NZer In Exile

Things that make you go hmmm (about the NZ judiciary):

Raglan road-rage couple sentenced over brutal attack on teens after bridge stand-off:
https://www.reddit.com/r/newzealand/comments/1pab3lw/raglan_roadrage_couple_sentenced_over_brutal/

“Paula Bielby – Sister Of Mitchell Te Kani Falls Victim To Grumpy Judge”
https://theplatform.kiwi/podcasts/episode/paula-bielby-sister-of-mitchell-te-kani-falls-victim-to-grumpy-judge

Knock knock National. Anyone home? Please fix this.
0 0
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December 2, 2025 10:46pm
Kevin

Newstalk ZB, except for Mr Leighton Smith, seldom provides much light. And the heat feels like a one bar Conray in a poor pensioners cinder block flat – enough to scorch the shins but still see the breath. Could do better. Prob does not for reasons.

However, today was a wonderful exception. Heather du Plessis-Allan getting miffy with David Seymour, and Vet Council fining
( retired) vet Leo Molloy $23,000.
Both stories show that despite all the ( often paid and well paid) lying, you can believe what is said when the hater and the hated come together.
Only a Saint or Satan would have the strength to put aside or hide this.
There isn’t such strength here.
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December 3, 2025 7:33pm

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