General Debate 28 December 2007
December 28th, 2007 at 11:07 am by David Farrar
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22 Responses to “General Debate 28 December 2007”
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December 28th, 2007 at 11:39 am
Dear David,
Your posts have been so interesting that I find myself commenting on a number of them. This is all rather good — except I’m trying to work.
Can you please either go and visit your friends and family and stop posting altogether or else try and be a bit less interesting for the next day or two?
Many Thanks
[DPF: Heh actually I have been out with friends a fair bit. I often do several posts in the early morning and time delay them to appear during the day]
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 11:54 am
PhilBest – how about you come here and talk about abortion.
Start by explaining at which point prevention of a potential human life is OK and at which point it isn’t.
My continuum runs something like this (in reverse chronological order):
– after birth but before child can focus on people
– at birth
– third trimester
– second trimester
– as a foetus
– as a blastocyst
– at point of fertilisation (i.e. prevent implantion)
– barrier to the sperm (i.e. prevent fertilisation)
– avoid sperm getting inside the women (i.e. rhythm method or some such)
– don’t have sex even though opportunity existed
Somewhere along that continuum it became wrong to terminate. I would definitely argue that the top two and maybe three are wrong, and that the bottom four are fine (so I’m not a catholic and therefore am OK with condoms three from the bottom, and also OK with IUDs four from the bottom). I’m generally OK with five and six from the bottom as well. So my grey area is the second trimester.
Care to explain where you see the line being drawn, and why?
[DPF: My gut reaction has been to look at what marks death - the cessation of brain activity. So what should mark life - the start of brain activity which is at around the 12 week mark]
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 12:54 pm
I find it sadly ironic that volunteer Christmas lunch servers were inundated by record numbers of poverty stricken clients from a cross section group of unfortunates. Or to put this is in our lovely Miss Klark’s own deluded words, it is ; “extrapolated from an anecdote ”
I do wonder how many kiwi families will leave this cess pit for greener pastures across the ditch before the election ?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 3:18 pm
I can well recall, D4J, having one Jenny Shipley sitting a few feet away from me (in a radio studio) and expounding upon how private charity ought to be doing the work of the welfare state and that if we simply kept cutting benefits then organisations such as those who fed the hungry and homeless at Christmas would simply do so every day.
(She also responded to my suggestion that government set aside allotments for city welfare recipients to grow veges, as happens overseas, with the opinion that ‘they wouldn’t know how’ to raise cabbages).
I can remember thinking that I’d just met the kind of politician who needed to be kept as far away as possible from the reins of power (so much for my wishful thinking – this was before she went on to become PM).
But that’s what puzzles me about those who come here and support the present government (and many of those who do so elsewhere). Do they not adhere to the worthy principles on which the Labour Party was founded? Because I don’t recall Savage et al ever giving voice to the kind of vision espoused that day by Shipley – yet that’s exactly what 9 years of this government has delivered to many people.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 3:28 pm
Rex,
9 years of government has delivered New Zealand a cot case society with lawlessness and child abuse rapidly spiraling out of control . Teachers are getting bashed at schools, while hospitals are struggling as mangers grab all the money and patients die on waiting lists . I could go on for 20 million words on how the liarbore socialist creeps have destroyed our Nation’s identity, as children struggle with low self esteem levels . Families are leaving this country at an unprecedented level , never seen before . Reason why = Helen Clark and callous corruption and incompetence !!
I think the Austrian economist Wilhelm Ropke was right when he said ;
Vote:” The welfare state is the favourite playground of a cheap sort of moralism, and cheap morality is anything but moral .”
December 28th, 2007 at 3:31 pm
And Rex,
Huge increases in invalid and sickness benefits make unemployment figures look good and over one million New Zealanders are on anti -depressants .
Reason , again Helen Klark !!
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 5:57 pm
Why are we worried about people leaving the country? Clearly this country has given them the skills and wealth necessary to move overseas and get employment there. If things were bad in New Zealand, people wouldn’t be able to afford to move overseas, and wouldn’t be able to find skilled employment overseas. Many overseas destinations for NZ-leavers are ones where the worst-off are far far worse off than they are in New Zealand. They’re advantageous to the wealthy, and New Zealand is producing wealthy families who move overseas to enjoy that advantage.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 6:02 pm
Ryan – sick of being a troll at the Briefing Room ?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 6:30 pm
I just can’t bear to be away from you, D4J. I cried the fourth or fifth time you said goodbye.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
Welcome to the life and times of a regular blogger – they get the nut case D4J in their face.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:28 pm
Calender girl asked you a question on the thread discussing today’s assassination
“James S (3.30),
What is “that area of the Middle east” that you think Pakistan is in?”
Haha , to think that the Prime Minister Hulun Klark said pubically she is glad to have you on board . James , what is the capital of Australia ?
It’s the money or the slag boyo , talk about Miss Klark !!
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:30 pm
James , it starts with C
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:32 pm
What part of Middle East is Lahore ?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:33 pm
James , is Karachi the Capital of Japan ?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:35 pm
James is Delhi in Denmark ?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 8:48 pm
DPF: I like your view on that – internally consistent. I think I will adopt it as well….
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 9:20 pm
D4J where did you goto school? Your grammar and spelling is quite simply atrocious. Also, why do you put spaces between your punctuation? Does that represent anything in particular or is this you trying to be “cool”?
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
James Sleep stars in Master Mind . First prize is a mauling from a yellow tiger in the green room sauna . Hi Tim and Pete .
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 9:30 pm
neontiger
Your message is crap but I do not give you heaps about your education.
Mind you I could the way you set yourself up.
Get a life and debate issues rather than take cheap shots.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 10:32 pm
neotiger – He was the first person to go on about me.
Hes a hypocrite.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 10:34 pm
Sorry – he’s not hes.
My apologies.
Vote:December 28th, 2007 at 11:08 pm
Well exactly James. As usual he’s just trolling.
Vote: