More Wikileaks
December 19th, 2010 at 11:57 am by David FarrarThis week it is the Herald on Sunday thatembass has the stories. Note, that these are the views of US embassy staff, and are not generally first hand accounts of meetings.
- This story is about how the US was poised to mend the rift with NZ in 2005, but Trevor Mallard’s slander about how the National Party was having its policy written in Washington DC pissed them off so much it almost caused a rift.
- This story is about how John Key told the Chinese Premier that he would not be meeting with the Dalai Llama. This is not exactly news, but still disappointing – I commented previously here.
- An index of cables is here. Lots of them
- This cable is called “the sleaze hits the fan” and is about Labour’s lies. Interesting they say “Goff agreed that a line had been crossed”.
- This one is quite big – reveals that the NSA has an officer in Wellington attached to the Embassy but actually has an office in the GCSB.
- An interesting profile of Jenny Shipley when she became PM
- This cable notes relations between George W Bush and Helen Clark: “We further note that PM Clark is apparently much more willing to highlight her excellent relations with President Bush when speaking to an Australian audience than to domestic Kiwi audiences.”
December 19th, 2010 at 12:21 pm
Shipley was responsible for fences around swimming pools??
Always knew she was no good.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:23 pm
So now we know who Labours infamous bagman was. Trevor, who would have though it.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:24 pm
Seems that embassy cables are an honest look at our MP’s and their policy.
Pity our MSM does not produce insight like this…
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:27 pm
DPF – you missed linking to my brief comments in the Herald
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10695269
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:32 pm
Key had no intentions of meeting with the Dali Lama when he said he was while in opposition. I think John Ansel said a year ago, on here infact, that the National Party chose to say “what voters wanted to hear” rather than run a principled campaign. I have lost a lot of respect for Key because all the signs in these last two years show this. Now other questions should arise, what about pandering to Maori elite, what is the real reason? about tax cuts, were they really to help his mates when 70 percent of the population feel that tax cuts haven’t helped at all?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:32 pm
Trevor – we know you read this blog and that also you would be too yellow to respond to this on Red Alert. So I am pleased for the chance to say this here – are a bully (well known already) and now you are proven as a liar. You are a disgrace and should resign from parliament before the election.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:40 pm
John Key has long had multiple personalities. A few for the masses and then one for each interest group he needs votes or cash from. He’s all sleaze. The foreshore & seabed is becoming his undoing. You can’t continue to speak out of both sides of your mouth when both parties are in the same room.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:41 pm
Well said Monty.
You left off adulterer, piss poor linesman and very,very average fifth rate rugby player.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:41 pm
and your point is… Bryce?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:47 pm
jackp: Key had no intentions of meeting with the Dali Lama when he said he was while in opposition.
Do you know that or is it your guess?
I could imagine an opposition leader thinking any chance to be in the limelight would seem like a good opportunity, but the realities of being PM take over once in office. I think the Lama drama is trivial stuff.
There probably will be but there shouldn’t be, because
Business interests driving political interests, now who would have thought that? Not much business in prayer wheels.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:51 pm
What a boring list of tidibits and gossip this WikiLeaks nonsense about NZ is.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 12:52 pm
Why the hell would the PM waste his time meeting a bloody old remnant of a corrupt feudal society.
Leave that for people like the Beatles, Madonna, Michael Palin, etc.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 1:33 pm
Is there really that much “news” here?
Isn’t there already wide consensus on the fact that Clark’s government was the most disgraceful, dishonest, duplicitous, self-serving and unprincipled bunch of creeps that ever crawled out of the western world’s political slime. Does anyone expect any more of Mallard? How could you? And Gaffey’s response to the yanks “not as carefully worded as it could have been? Classic Gaffe.
Is it any surprise that they should deal with our trading partners and allies any differently to the way they deal with their financial supporters (Owen Glen) and the people of this country.
There is no “news” here; merely more evidence, as if any were required, that the Labour hacks are rotten to the core; a collection of vile, shameless, misfits and miscreants. A sad-arsed bunch of truely evil pricks and arseholes.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 1:46 pm
thedavincimode.
@ 1.33 pm
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:01 pm
National having it’s policy written by the yanks, come on people both the Nats and Labour went yes sir when the yanks wanted our troops in Afghanistan.
Vote:So policy written by the septics, one could accuse both Labour and the Nats of being guilty of having policy written in Washington.
When the fuck did NZ join NATO ? when did we become a septic ally ?
December 19th, 2010 at 2:01 pm
>This story is about how the US was poised to mend the rift with NZ in 2005, but Trevor Mallard’s slander about how the National Party was having its policy written in Washington DC pissed them off so much it almost caused a rift.
At the time it was obvious that this would happen and the Americans obviously realised it. But why wasn’t it reported in the NZ media? Where were the headlines LABOUR HARMS NZ’S INTERESTS WITH CHEAP SMEAR? The media are supposed to investigate and break the big stories, not to miss things that are so obvious that any well read person knows what is going on.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:05 pm
thedavincimode @ 1.33 pm.
That’s got to be the best summary of the corrupt Clark administration I’ve read so far.
Clark and co must be almightly pissed off with Wikileaks. Let the leaks continue and expose Labour’s corruption!
So far this is what we always knew … so can’t wait until the real dirt on Labour’s double-crossing to emerge ….
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:28 pm
Johnboy, lefty rugby players, probably the best all round prop forward NZ has turned out was a lefty.
Vote:Where as those ranting right wingers would hide in the back line stating how physical it was.
December 19th, 2010 at 2:31 pm
Good article by Theodore Dalrymple HERE which makes the case that Wikileaks is actually doing the work of totalitarianism.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Come on now Grumpy. I respect you for some things, like your fear of Turkish bayonets and your fear of being dragged into the twentieth century by the colonialist oppressors, but give me a bloody break.
I will not accept that Mallard was the best all round prop forward that even the parliamentary team has ever had let alone the Blacks.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:37 pm
Shit man. I watched him trying to be a linesman at Hutt Rec.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:42 pm
And to think Hager and Co. had the audacity to call Brash et al the Hollow Men. Wikileaks is showing the world (and NZ) who the real hollow (wo)men are. The most translucent are Mallard and Clark.
Surprised?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 2:46 pm
Fletch>Good article by Theodore Dalrymple HERE which makes the case that Wikileaks is actually doing the work of totalitarianism.
Can’t disagree with any of that. Totally open information is the sort of policy a 14 year old girl would think up. I notice that Curran has been pushing this as a positive thing on Red Alert, but so far they’re not televising proceedings inside the Labour caucus room, or releasing transcripts of Labour MP barbecues.
Meanwhile, the Wikileaksleaks people have been busyleaking details of Assange hitting on a teenager. Creepy stalking, ringing her parents, and e-mails full of the pretentious nonsense we’ve seen from him before…
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1339287/WikiLeaks-boss-Julian-Assanges-stalker-style-emails-19-year-old-girl-exposed.html
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:04 pm
Good article by Theodore Dalrymple HERE which makes the case that Wikileaks is actually doing the work of totalitarianism.
Then it’s even more interesting that Assange’s lawyer has links to the Rothschild’s, isn’t it.
“We further note that PM Clark is apparently much more willing to highlight her excellent relations with President Bush when speaking to an Australian audience than to domestic Kiwi audiences.”
Man she was a poisonous ball of venom wasn’t she. I wonder how long it is before Carter gets a good UN job somewhere.
In a recent speech, Dr.
Brash called PM Clark “a petty, spiteful, deceitful leader
whose government was ‘rotten to the core.’
He was right, wasn’t he.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:06 pm
Grumpy, come clean and tell why you hate the US so much?
Under a Japanese/German regime you and your “hardworking” whanau wouldn’t have had much of a chance, but instead of being grateful you write with such vitriol against the great United States.
Why is that? Didn’t you win in the green card lottery or what?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:10 pm
Well it all further confirms for me that Labour, since the 30′s, to be essentially a party that supports the spread of the influence of totalitarian nations at the expense of democracies.
Vote:The leaks also confirm to me Nationals essential lack of comprehension when it comes to global security and defense issues.
December 19th, 2010 at 3:14 pm
Manolo (2,523) Says:
December 19th, 2010 at 3:06 pm
Grumpy, come clean and tell why you hate the US so much?
snip
Why is that? Didn’t you win in the green card lottery or what?
************************************
He, like most of the NZ population, know next to nothing about the world and how its works would be my guess.
Vote:A state of affairs that labour and the greens are happy to continue, keeps their propaganda all the more effective, as the leaks so amply demonstrate.
December 19th, 2010 at 3:14 pm
Trevor and diplomacy…never the twain shall meet!
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:15 pm
Helen Clark will go down in history as a spiteful, bitter, and manipulative character who wasted the boom years of the NZ economy on flawed initiatives and throwing money at useless causes.
The worst PM ever!
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:16 pm
This is a beauty:
[my emphases]
Goff endorsed the idea of US Embassy press releases!!
I can never forget the moment on 22 June 2005 when Clark actually said in Parliament what Mallard said outside it – that National had its policy written in the US.
Then when Mallard made his statement in public, the same one Clark said in Parliament, Clark was reported as “angry” that Mallard had made that statement/accusation. Hansard from 22 June confirms Clark’s accusation:
Goff is the real bagman. He’s endorsing US foreign intelligence methods in New Zealand. Clark speaks out both sides of her mouth. Mallard just tells lies, and Goff walks hand in hand with Arafat, but then cosies up to the yanks.
But I guess there is nothing to see here. Move along everyone. No issue with any of this. No Hollow (wo)men here.
Hey, that’s just politics, if Labour practices them.
However if Nact do the same…….
I’m beginning to love Wikileaks.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:18 pm
Just read the http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10695146 cable.
Farken hell. Clark, Cullen, Mallard and Goff all involved in swinging complete bullshit during the Brash campaign. When Mallard makes his US bagman claim alleging in careful language the US was funding the Nats, he’d had dinner with the US Ambassador the night before. Then Goff was asked to call the Charge who tore him off a strip, diplomatically as they do.
Yet more evidence if any is ever needed that Liarbore don’t give a fuck about whether they make it more difficult for us as a nation to prosper in the world, it was, is and remains, only about them winning, and fuck all the rest of us if that’s what it takes. What a bunch of lefty scum.
Gooner snap.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:22 pm
That’s one of the things that pisses me off most. They seem to think only they can rule NZ successfully, the other night Carter and Mallard seemed united in their belief only they could “rescue” NZ by winning next year, so it’s a win at all costs arrogance.
I think “party politics first” is past it’s use by date. We need MPs from all parties who will put the interests of the country first.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:23 pm
grumpy, didn’t Steve McDowell tour with the Cavaliers?
I know old Ken dodged the ’70 tour but I doubt he could’ve buckled the mighty McDowell!!! And Gary Knight was the best tighthead scrummager at his peak…
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:24 pm
“[Klark] The worst PM ever!”
Well yeah I guess so. Key running a pretty close second.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 3:26 pm
No wonder they wanted her gone, even mega doses of botox can’t resurrect a terminal fugley.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10695239
That’s when photoshop took over the contract.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:01 pm
Bank of America cuts off WikiLeaks
* From: AFP
* December 19, 2010 9:10AM
JULIAN Assange has denounced “business McCarthyism” in the US after the Bank of America halted all transactions to WikiLeaks.
The Australian, who is spending his second full day on bail, vowed the whistleblowing website will carry on releasing controversial leaked documents as he insisted his life is under threat.
Bank of America, the largest US bank, halted all transactions for WikiLeaks, joining other institutions that refuse to process payments for the website.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/in-depth/wikileaks/bank-of-america-cuts-off-wikileaks/story-fn775xjq-1225973376427
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:16 pm
What I think is most disturbing about these current releases is learning the extent to which senior NZ Public Servants have blabbed their mouths off to the US Embassy. Mary-Anne Thompson was described as an “invaluable behind the scenes contact” offering “valuable insights”.
And New Zealand’s chief trade negotiator Mark Sinclair told a visiting US State Department official that New Zealand had little to gain from a free-trade agreement.
These types of comments (doubtless a minuscule sample) indicate enormous disloyalty on the part of top senior civil servants. It almost borders on treason, and if Thompson was not already a convicted criminal, she sure as should be charged with something now, along with Sinclair.
It is utterly outrageous that highly paid NZ public servants are spilling their guts and undermining NZ’s position in this way. And what is most frightening is they don’t even know it. They would not have a clue before these releases that their words and views were being sent back, almost verbatim, to the US State Department.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:27 pm
“What I think is most disturbing about these current releases is learning the extent to which senior NZ Public Servants have blabbed their mouths off to the US Embassy.”
Would you prefer they spilled the beans to Dimitri Razgovorov or his successors perhaps Chris2?
http://www.eastonbh.ac.nz/?p=902
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:32 pm
Naive would be the nicest interpretation. Treason would be the older version for which they would be put on trial.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:32 pm
Item 2 about Key and Wen.
“Herald on Sunday senior staffers……Fisher and Milne”
“Key told Jiabao…….”
Key is a surname and Jiabao isn’t. The surname is Wen. So the senior staffers on this illustrious publication have so little experience of the world they don’t know a Chinese surname. Senior staffers ,yeah right.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:33 pm
Chris2 (317) Says:
December 19th, 2010 at 4:16 pm
snip
It is utterly outrageous that highly paid NZ public servants are spilling their guts and undermining NZ’s position in this way. And what is most frightening is they don’t even know it. They would not have a clue before these releases that their words and views were being sent back, almost verbatim, to the US State Department.
******************************************
Who says they are undermining New Zealand’s position? What makes you think our glorious leaders are correct in their policies?
Politicians come and go, have no requirements of educational standards and are not always that bright, to be honest. Civil servants are always there, and at the very least have a longer term view of the world.
Besides, you don’t think we get the same sort of thing reported to our government from US civil servants via our US embassy? I assure you that we do.
You need to watch Yes Minister/Prime Minister; the public see it as comedy, the civil service as a documentary and the politicians a tragedy.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:40 pm
Johnboy @ 4:27pm wrote Would you prefer they spilled the beans to Dimitri Razgovorov or his successors
There is no difference, except Sutch did his blabbing in the back streets of Aro valley to Russian diplomats. Thompson and Sinclair probably did it over a long lunch at some expensive Wellington restaurant.
And Sutch was actually charged with passing his information to the Russians, so these modern-day blabbermouths should be, too.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:41 pm
I think you’ll find it is part of a civil servant’s duties to converse with senior diplomats and officials from other countries. You can be sure that one bigoted person’s views will hold little sway amongst the weight of all the other accumulated gossip from hundreds of other half pissed nonentities..
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:45 pm
“of other half pissed nonentities..”
Whuck me Adolf.
Are you saying no one gives a rat’s arse what Groser has to say?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:47 pm
Dazzaman thats why I said best ALL ROUND prop, McDowell leaping for the ball at 2
.
Vote:Gray was far far better around the paddock than Knight ever was, an expert at taking the ball from the back of the lineout on the peel.
And his speed was better than any other NZ prop with maybe the exception of Meeuws, who I would rate ahead of Knight.
Just a typical lefty
December 19th, 2010 at 4:49 pm
It is utterly outrageous that highly paid NZ public servants are spilling their guts and undermining NZ’s position in this way. And what is most frightening is they don’t even know it. They would not have a clue before these releases that their words and views were being sent back, almost verbatim, to the US State Department.
I see other commenters already addressed it as well Chris2 but fucking d’oh. Like how naive are you to imagine that MFAT staff who talk to the Embassy don’t know their conversations will be reported back.
This is what happens Chris2, all the time, everywhere. Duh.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:49 pm
Stuart Mackey @ 4:33pm wrote Who says they are undermining New Zealand’s position? What makes you think our glorious leaders are correct in their policies?
Politicians come and go, have no requirements of educational standards and are not always that bright, to be honest.
Regardless of which party is in power, and how bright they are, Government Ministers are elected and representative of the people – if they want to spill the beans to another country that’s their perogitavive, regardless of how unwise it is. But they at least remain accountable.
Civil Servants on the other hand, are not elected, and it is not up to them to choose to spill their guts to a foreign power about NZ Government policy. By doing so, without approval, they exceed their authority. If a minor flunky in a Government department blabbed to a foreign power their CEO would dismiss them immediately.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:59 pm
reid @ 4:49pm – the fact the US embassy describe Thompson (who was never an MFAT official) as an “invaluable behind the scenes contact”, is conclusive evidence from the Americans themselves that she was very very very highly regarded by them.
They would not have written this (especially using the words “behind the scenes) if she was simplyt providing them with the usual run-of-the mill bilateral exchange of information that Governments share with diplomats. The description of Thompson is evidence she went far further than she ought to have in her relationship with the US Embassy. I wonder if it was fully documented by her?
This was a woman with a 20 year Government career, who reached the position of Acting Head of the Prime Ministers Department, albeit by lying for almost two decades about about having a PhD.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 4:59 pm
“Civil Servants on the other hand, are not elected, and it is not up to them to choose to spill their guts to a foreign power about NZ Government policy. By doing so, without approval, they exceed their authority.”
You really are awfully naive Chris2.
Vote:
December 19th, 2010 at 5:02 pm
Stuart Mackey hate, too strong a word, but unlike so many right wing types I do not believe I owe any loyalty to the yanks.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 5:21 pm
Johnboy – you are the naive one – relying as you do, on 30 year-old British television comedy shows, as your contribution to the debate.
This forum is for grown-ups. It’s gone 5pm, it must be time for your Mummy to tuck you into bed and read you a bedtime story.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 5:29 pm
Everything changes but nothing changes Chris2, if you think otherwise then you are the fool I am afraid.
I suspect I have been grown up for at least three or four times as long as you have.
Unfortunately my mummy has been dead for years so I will just have to cope on my own as far as the tucking in goes.
I’m happy to read more of your fairy tales though as my bedtime story.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 6:36 pm
Of course the saga of Marianne Thompson takes on more sinister overtones now. Given she was Acting Head of the PM’s Dept.
Privy to all sorts of information including information from other countries.
The Place leaked like sieve.
Perhaps our allies formed a complete mistrust of our Public Servants sometime ago and who could blame them?
Of course it also shows up just how usless our supposed security and intelligence Dept’s are. Maybe we should simply fire them all and save the cash toqards our 350 million per week deficit. Clearly they are not worth paying.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 6:40 pm
Another thought. Who was it that hired Thompson? Eltringham and Prebble. So the saga grows.
Now did Christine Rankin from Winz stumble across their little game? Did that cause the Preeble to be the nasty?
OOOh the intrigue get more interesting by the minute.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 6:43 pm
Chris2 thanks for raising the Thompson presence, I hadn’t previously noted that and it throws up a different conjecture.
What if Thompson was nothing more than a mole? Thompson operating as Hulun’s mole is definitely Hulun’s style.
Thompson’s subsequent series of “regrettable” events wasn’t on the horizon at that time.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 7:29 pm
>“We further note that PM Clark is apparently much more willing to highlight her excellent relations with President Bush when speaking to an Australian audience than to domestic Kiwi audiences.”
Hardly a surprise. Labour Finance Minister Cullen was much more willing to highlight his maintenance of the Roger Douglas fiscal reforms when talking to US rating agencies than he did when speaking to domestic kiwi audiences.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 7:54 pm
Hardly a surprise. Labour Finance Minister Cullen was much more willing to highlight his maintenance of the Roger Douglas fiscal reforms when talking to US rating agencies than he did when speaking to domestic kiwi audiences.
Neither instance is justifiable however Ross.
If it’s the truth then why is it conditional on the political venue as to whether or not people are told about it?
Is using message management like this acceptable or not?
See if it didn’t work they wouldn’t do it so it does work: i.e. domestically some (probably particularly thick) reef-fish ARE in fact getting sucked in by lying politicians and should that not be prevented nay exposed and then prevented?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:05 pm
They have been doing for years reid and it’s not just thick bastards who have been sucked in it is all of us.
As you said if it didn’t work they wouldn’t do it.
We all have a lot to thank Julian for even though he is only telling us what we already knew about the utter pieces of shit that rule us. (left or right).
Still we will happily believe their crap in 2011 and get all excited along party lines towards November.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:20 pm
Won’t we just Johnboy. Why I’ll be calling lefties morons left right and centre. It’ll be great fun.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:24 pm
Look at Goff though. Defending the indefensible. As if anyone believes him. What a right plonker.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:32 pm
Thats a bloody good read reid if you believe in bullshit.
Won’t help the prick when silent T makes his move though.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:33 pm
Must go and look at Palin climbing the Himalaya.
That’s Micky not Sarah.
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 8:58 pm
Johnboy.
What does that say about your preferences then eh?……eh?….eh?
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 9:08 pm
Poor ol’ Goffy, eh? Not only that, but again, the poisoned challice of acquiring the Labour leadership has dealt him another blow.
Imagine, if Helen Clark had won the 2008 election and was still PM … it would be her, not him, having to front up to the MSM and defend herself against the tsumani of Wikileak evidence outling her duplicity in handling US/NZ relations. Instead ol’ Goffy has drawn the short straw, whilst HC’s UN phone is off the hook and isn’t taking calls from NZ MSM …
Vote:December 19th, 2010 at 11:40 pm
They’re aware it was 2005 not 1987..?
Vote:December 20th, 2010 at 6:35 am
Goff involved in Guantanamo prisoner repatriation decision?
There’s no Uighur community in NZ so it seems the US was looking for any solution they could find, rather than what was practical and sensible. The Uighur detainees are believed to have been innocent – it had been determined they were “no longer enemy combatants”. That sounds like a euphemism for “fuck up”.
Vote:December 20th, 2010 at 8:44 am
Pete George-jackp: Key had no intentions of meeting with the Dali Lama when he said he was while in opposition.
Do you know that or is it your guess?
I could imagine an opposition leader thinking any chance to be in the limelight would seem like a good opportunity, but the realities of being PM take over once in office. I think the Lama drama is trivial stuff.
Pete, Key’s actions is proof enough, especially since he told his ministers not to see him. You might try to brush it over, but the Dali Lama is a very influential man with the public. Also, you said it yourself, politicians love the limelight and I can assure you this would capture all of New Zealands attention. Key didn’t take this opportunity because he is afraid what the Chinese would do. I understand this but Key never should have made this his campaign promise from the start. . I ask myself, if he lied about this from the start, lwhat else is he lying about?
Vote:December 20th, 2010 at 8:57 am
I agree it’s not the best of looks for Key, but it’s a minor issue in my opinion. If you want to take for gospel every campaign utterance then you should live on another planet – they can’t promise anything before they no if they will be the dominant coalition party, and what deals they have to make with other coalition parties.
Vote:December 20th, 2010 at 11:59 am
Bah! McDowell would have had old Ken down to a walk at the end of 80 minutes! Our best prop & loosehead since Whineray!
Cuzzy Kees wouldn’t live with Gary Knight, the worlds best prop from ’81 to ’84. Olo Brown was our best tighthead since Axle…Kees did a good haka though.
Vote:December 20th, 2010 at 10:19 pm
89 links to edited cables revealed – and some only “partial” ? – 1400ish to go.
Vote:December 21st, 2010 at 9:12 am
Pete, I always look at what the person does and when I start to notice inconsistencies, I doubt that person. John Key hasn’t lied only about meeting the Dali Llama, but he has lied about not raising taxes, getting rid of the maori seats, about not being the leader of climate warming, the list goes on. Am I living in another planet again, which seems to be your favorite comment, I don’t think so, I am very realistic. That remark that Key made about meeting with the Dali LLama started to sway me towards him. I didn’t vote for him on that one issue, but thought it would be a good start. But for him to make that comment and not intending to meet with him, doesn’t that say something about Key’s character? Key also said that if the submissions are to look like they are against changing the foreshore and seabed bill, he said he will drop it. It is looking that way now. Now, John Key is saying that the public doesn’t understand it. Total change of stance. Now, I am sure you think the foreshore and seabed bill is not big at all and I am living in another planet but Key is good at one thing, lying on the small issues and the big ones.
Vote: