Christchurch jobs

January 8th, 2013 at 10:00 am by David Farrar

There’s been a lot of stories about firms in Christchurch having problems finding employees. One in The Press today is:

Christchurch baker Diane McPherson has had an “absolute nightmare” trying to find staff for the past four months.

One applicant turned up for an interview in pyjama pants, another was texting during the interview and another flicked her tongue piercing in and out of her mouth and indicated she was not prepared to remove it during work hours.

McPherson, who owns the Brumby’s Bakery and Wendy’s Supa Sundaes stores at the Hub in Hornby, said many others did not return messages inviting them for an interview, or, having been offered a job, failed to turn up for work.

How many people in Christchurch are on the unemployment benefit or another work tested benefit?

One applicant for a job at Wendy’s Supa Sundaes decided he did not want the job because he did not want to mop the floors, and another did not want to have to wash dishes. A 22-year-old applicant for a job at Brumby’s Bakery arrived wearing a T-shirt, flannelette pyjama pants and socks, but no shoes.

Obviously trying hard to get a job.

McPherson approached the Christchurch Polytechnic Institute of Technology to see whether any recent graduates were interested, but “not one of them put their hand up”.

The McPherson is advertising all pay $14 an hour or more, with the bakery job starting at $20 an hour.

“I’ve had a couple of guys tell me, ‘Oh, it’s easier on the dole but we’ve got to be seen to be applying for work’,” she said.

And remember some parties want to increase the level of benefits, reducing the incentive to work even more.

McPherson has placed advertisements saying applicants could say when they wanted to work, but has still not found staff.

“There’s a whole different attitude to working. It’s all about themselves and if it doesn’t fit in with what they want to do, they don’t want to do it,” she said.

McPherson is now looking to advertise overseas.

If anyone is on a work-tested benefit in Christchurch for more than say a few months, then there is something wrong.

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78 Responses to “Christchurch jobs”

  1. Fisiani (847 comments) says:

    I am working in Christchurch and can confirm that it is really easy to get a job here. Too many people simply do not want to work. They just want taxpayers to give them money. Does anyone know how this problem is solved overseas?

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  2. david (2,482 comments) says:

    Time limit on benefit

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  3. rg (190 comments) says:

    Can you blame them? Why work when you don’t have to because the taxpayer is paying you. Why save for retirement when the taxpayer will pay you? Why cook xmas dinner when the Mission will do it?

    If the taxpayers are so dumb they keep electing socialist type National and Labour governments then they deserve to be ripped off by these bludgers.

    Have a look at ACT NZ’s policies if you are getting sick of governments creating bludgers.

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  4. MT_Tinman (2,790 comments) says:

    WINZ staff have told me more than 50% of those unemployed in ChCh are unemployable.

    There can be no doubt no one fit should be unemployed in ChCh now or for the next ten years.

    Time for a new incentive.

    I suggest all beneficiaries are required to attend a place of training, let’s call them Skill Houses, every weekday from 15 minutes after school starts until 15 minutes before school finishes. No exception except for provable illness or injury, both of which will see the beneficiary paid in vouchers or their bills paid by direct debit until the illness/injury is no more debilitating.

    These house provide for medical needs, schooling where necessary, counselling and budgeting advice and training, work training, gardening, general handyman training and job-finding assistance.

    As much staffing as possible to be done by the beneficiaries themselves.

    The gardens to provide food for those attending.

    WINZ (MED or whatever name they call themselves at the moment) staff to be on-site at all times.

    Penalties for non-attendance to start with all benefits being paid by voucher (i.e. no cash spending money at all).

    I have no doubt initial set-up costs will be recouped within a very short time should this idea be accepted simply by being able to close most WINZ offices and people learning skills necessary to support themselves and gaining pride in that achievement, thus no longer needing hand-outs.

    The only downside to this (other than the initial set-up cost) is that the local pokies operators and the benefitting charities would face a severe drop in income.

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  5. andretti (124 comments) says:

    This is not new.i have had issues such as this trying to employ staff over the past 2-3 years.It seems to be getting worse,these people obviously have a fall back position where they can get money to live.Hell even when you do employ them and dont ask them very nicely to perform a task they can take offense and just walk out the door. I belong to the local chamber of commerce and the subject of employing under 25s gets discussed frequently,most employers up here would rather have nothing to do with them if possible.

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  6. kowtow (6,684 comments) says:

    An awful lot of these losers are dope smokers. No get up and go,no pride,no ambition.

    But hey it’s cool bro we’re all looked after.

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  7. andretti (124 comments) says:

    I wouldn’t call them losers myself,they are just responding to the circumstances that they are offered,like FREE money from either mum or winz.These people along with the govt are they real losers as they are making these kids weak.Cant help but relate it to animal nature where the weak of the group are killed by the strong.While these kids dont get killed as such increasingly they are being thrown on the scrapheap of life and ignored.

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  8. wreck1080 (3,514 comments) says:

    I wonder how long one remains ‘unemployable’ after having all welfare cut off?

    Of course, many of those will have psychiactric problems and there is nowhere for them to go. I think it was a big mistake closing down the psych hospitals. The cost has just transferred to the justice and welfare system.

    But, if someone is medically fit for work and refusing to do so then cut off all payments. On problem is that the ‘children’ will suffer. The children are always used as emotional warfare by these scumbags as a way to get money without working for it.

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  9. Pete George (21,789 comments) says:

    An interesting parallel bunch of comments on this:

    “Does anyone actually believe this woman?”

    “Nope, she’s BSing.”

    “Yeah this kind of thing can be a problem. It often stems from youth who have left school and had an extended time unemployed without the benefit of immediate work experience with good role models. Or have been long term unemployed and simply deconditioned to work discipline”

    “So Ms McPherson got some of the unemployable, or marginally employable applying, but what about those that are capable and want any work going? Did she just conveniently forget to mention them? Is there something about McPherson, her job or her workplace that puts keen workers off? Or does she just want to recruit from overseas and is looking for an excuse not to employ locals?”

    http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-08012013/comment-page-1/#comment-570570

    And…

    “Also, if WINZ stopped pressuring people who are unemployable, or incapable of working a full day/shift to job-seek, maybe Ms McPherson’s job of recruitment would be a lot easier.”

    Yes, it would make recruitment easier if those who were incapable of working were filtered out of the training/work finding industry.

    And it would make it easier for those who can’t be bothered working to settle in to a liftetime of state support.

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  10. Manolo (12,604 comments) says:

    A profound sense of entitlement has taken hold of all these lazy bastards and bludgers. That’s why an overhaul of the welfare system is long overdue.

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  11. Ross Miller (1,624 comments) says:

    And the Labour/Greens answer ….. extend WFF to include those on the unemployment benefit.

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  12. MT_Tinman (2,790 comments) says:

    “interesting” Pete?

    How?

    If you need to read The Standard fair enough, go for it but do you have to share it?

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  13. Weihana (4,464 comments) says:

    McPherson is now looking to advertise overseas.

    For a baking position should be okay, but other minimum wage type jobs will not likely be accepted by INZ. The fact that NZers are unwilling to do the work on the terms offered does not mean there is a shortage. Sucks for employers but true. These people are technically “available” for work despite their PJs, their piercings, their attitude etc.

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  14. hj (5,674 comments) says:

    Motivation is a function of the value of a goal and the probability of achieving it. The people who interview for the bakery job know that they will never be able to acquire much in the way of assets, unlike previous generations who could have worked in a low paid job but at least had the goal of buying a little house in Hornby.
    The Savings Working Group put the blame fairly and squarely, on government policies for that situation.

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  15. kowtow (6,684 comments) says:

    Andretti

    They are not being ignored.The Labour Party is now dedicated to them (not to workers) and National is not far behind.
    Politicians are bribing these people with your money to stay in power. Western civilisation is being dragged into the gutter because our democracy has been so debased by welfare.

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  16. scrubone (2,971 comments) says:

    Seems that WINZ need an employability test of some sort.

    Setup a “basic skills” job interview like this and require things like:
    1. Turning up on time – making it clear that you are in fact supposed to be there significantly early just in case for those too dumb to work it out themselves.
    2. Dress correctly – refering people to places like the salvation army.

    If they are able to answer very basic things about themselves (we’re setting a low bar here) give them a job either filling in pointless paperwork or moving a pile of stones from a to b and back again. Again, they have to show up on time.

    Yes, this would suck to go through. But it would become quickly clear who had the good attitudes and can leave the test. Those who fail can go off benefit.

    If people fail these then we need to assess why. If they have drug issues, then they go into treatment. If they have attitude issues they can go somewhere where they can sort out their attitude issues. If they havn’t got a clue how to live their lives (sadly a common problem) we need to establish some sort of school to teach those issues.

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  17. bhudson (4,720 comments) says:

    @PG,

    Thanks for copying those comments from The Standard. When I read DPF’s post I was going to comment about Rufus Painter and how some had gone rabid on Shearer because he shouldn’t presume to know the man’s circumstances. I chuckled when I saw the same, or similar minded, people are also making excuses over this too.

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  18. Colville (1,765 comments) says:

    A mate of mine here (not chch) manages a large real estate company. Every week her gets half a dozen unsolicted CV’s/applications from people who are on the dole. These applications boldly state that they have either have a drug issue or criminal convictions which instantly makes them unsuitable. Buy hey they can show that they are seeking work so keep the dole!

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  19. scrubone (2,971 comments) says:

    The people who interview for the bakery job know that they will never be able to acquire much in the way of assets, unlike previous generations who could have worked in a low paid job but at least had the goal of buying a little house in Hornby.

    Uh, I think you’re reading in much higher level motivations than actually exist here! Their logic is quite simple – free money is better than money you have to work for, even if it’s slightly more. Why work when by working your wellbeing becomes your own responsiblity?

    A better point would be that these people may not see how starting in a low paid job can help them get ahead in life. But that’s because they think they’re entitled to the high paying job without working for it. But I somehow doubt many of these people would be willing to work for a higher wage either.

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  20. Allyson (35 comments) says:

    You can’t blame them.Is the same as the Greens turning down work employment opportunities with oil/gas. Sounds like some of these work shy mainlanders could turn into Green party activists.

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  21. Colville (1,765 comments) says:

    I was an employer for about 15 yrs, we used to hire guys (always guys) who came with some form of subsidy 2 or 3 at a time(usually at the start of a huge contract) and hope that one of them would be good enough to keep after the subsidy ran out.
    All they needed to bring to the job was a smile and willingness to work hard. We supplied basic training and very high skilled and motivated staff to mentor them and a future trade if they wanted to work toward it. Funny enough but ended up hiring about 10 qualified scuba instructors (off WINZ courses after they couldnt find scuba jobs) and they were generally quite good value.

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  22. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    If the labour market is that tight, then this part is quite understandable.

    “others did not return messages inviting them for an interview, or, having been offered a job, failed to turn up for work”.

    Those applying for the job found another one before the interview and those who were offered the job had another offer and took that.

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  23. bringbackdemocracy (349 comments) says:

    The unemployed aren’t doing jobs in Christchurch because Mr Key isn’t doing his job in Wellington.
    It’s time for some new parties in parliament so this shambles can be stopped.

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  24. andretti (124 comments) says:

    Personally i think the entitlement mentality runs deep throughout the western world.If you want to find out were we are headed type into Google why is California broke.All about us you find people who think things are FREE or should be,it matters not to them who pays or how,the modern catch cry is tax the rich that will fix everything.

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  25. Dean Papa (614 comments) says:

    Isn’t Kim Dotcom in need of a few reddies? They could employ him, although they would need to watch out in case he eats all the doughnuts.

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  26. Viking2 (10,683 comments) says:

    Unintended consequences. surely?
    We under educate them by insisting on teaching them nothing about work ethic and success. We give them a socialist education that tells that they are victims of everything and refuse to teach them about the way to success and that success takes effort and stick-ability.
    We reinforce their ego by telling them they are educated know all’s and that they are “entitled” to a pay rate that is greater than their ability and/or worth.
    The state even goes so far as to enforce that, by regulating youth pay rates (and everyone elses), a unrealistic levels that ensure they just simply are not worth the time to employ.
    The state has ensured that they never learn at a young age to accept the responsibility of work and reward.
    The state has decided to pay them, on our behalf, for behaving that way.

    So why are you surprised?

    Worse still, many of you have voted for the socialists who have passed into law this appalling legislation that robs people of their dignity and their right to work.

    More than that many of those moaning have been in the position to influence change but have failed to do so prefering to accept the status quo. i.e. the socialist position.

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  27. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    Viking2, the minimum wage level is not the issue in Christchurch. The cost/price factor is probably the level of rent because of the housing shortage – thus an inability to attract people into the city for low wage work.

    This could become a factor in Auckland with any recovery in the job market there.

    As to the rest areas of the country, would there be more jobs if the minimum wage was lower?

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  28. bc (1,251 comments) says:

    Come on people – aren’t you all supposed to free marketeers?

    She needs to offer a higher wage and/or better working conditions to attract better applicants. Isn’t that how the market works?

    Pay peanuts, get monkeys and all that.

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  29. OECD rank 22 kiwi (2,784 comments) says:

    Market Forces in Effect, with the usual Government interference.

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  30. Reg (544 comments) says:

    One of the main problems facing employers seeking unskilled labour in Christchurch is that that as soon as you tell the applicants that they will be facing compulsary drug testing they don’t turn up at the interview. The cold hard facts are, that the tax payers are funding through the unemployment benefit a drug taking culture that makes many unemployable.

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  31. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    Reg, that is one factor that is being dealt with in this years benefit changes.

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  32. bc (1,251 comments) says:

    Let’s see (based on this article):

    - There is a demand for good labour
    - There seemingly is a short supply.
    It’s been a long time since 5th form School Cert. economics (showing my age there), but doesn’t it follow then that the price goes up?

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  33. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    Colville says:

    A mate of mine here (not chch) manages a large real estate company. Every week her gets half a dozen unsolicted CV’s/applications from people who are on the dole. These applications boldly state that they have either have a drug issue or criminal convictions which instantly makes them unsuitable. Buy hey they can show that they are seeking work so keep the dole!

    Hold on, that’s a different issue. I’m peripherally involved with trying to find work for ex-prisoners. I’d say about half of them are genuinely committed to going straight and getting a job, and that cohort are usually people who’ve committed one offence, or a cluster of offences when they went off the rails – in other words they’re generally not violent and not “career criminals”.

    Yet they meet with the “criminal record = totally unsuitable” equation. Obviously you can’t become a licensed real estate agent if you have a criminal record but there are support roles where the only criteria are those set by employers. And in other industries, not statutory restrictions on hiring ex-prisoners apply.

    If employers set aside their prejudices they’d find that many ex-prisoners were keen to put their past behind them and start rebuilding their lives, starting with a job. Picking the promising ones is easy – you look for exactly the qualities you would in any other applicant. And in fact prisoners who’ve behaved well inside (and thus been released on their first application for parole) often have better self-discipline and work ethics than many of the pyjama-wearing layabouts mentioned above.

    Some will have even worked in the community during the latter stages of their incarceration and will have references from the “employer” (often a charity).

    Conversely, if former prisoners are virtually automatically barred from finding work, the likelihood of recidivism increases over time because they realise their only other option is a lifetime receiving the dole. So giving a suitable prisoner a job is a win-win-win, for the employer, the prisoner, and society at large.

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  34. krazykiwi (9,188 comments) says:

    Scrap the minimum wage, and have a forumla that calculates lowing the unemployment benefit, ie it drops the longer and/or more frequently someone has been drawing it. That free market would work. Some would be happy with bugger all and a surfboard, and others would get working. Problem solved.

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  35. unklefesta (13 comments) says:

    Just proves you can lead a lazy bastard to a job but you can’t make em work.

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  36. bc (1,251 comments) says:

    Rex – well said (again!)

    I was going to pick up on Colville’s silly comment @ 11.52am but he kind of redeemed himself with the next comment at 11.59am. Glad you pointed it out though Rex, you said it all perfectly.

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  37. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    Given the current rents in CHCH , I can’t imagine that any of these people are living well or even really living solely on a benefit..It is likely that they have some kind of cash or drug thing going to supplement the benefit.. Years ago , people were considered unemployable if they had been out of work for two years or more. The then Labour Dept employment service expressed great concern for these people and made big efforts to get them into work.. I never here any concern being expressed by Winz managers…How many NZers are in this ” over two years ” category?

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  38. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    joana, I can only guess, but most likely they are at home with parents and some are these are students on the summer break between semesters.

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  39. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    @joana:

    Long term unemployment as a percentage of total unemployment.

    Well look at that. Declined from 19.8% in January 2000 to just 4.4% in January 2008.

    Then started climbing, with the latest figure (for January 2010) at 9.9% and a clear upward trend.

    Gosh, I wonder what change befell NZ in 2008 that might have led to a complete lack of a plan to create jobs to shift the long term unemployed (let alone any unemployed) into work?

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  40. seanmaitland (400 comments) says:

    @Rex – so you think it is the governments responsibility to employ people?

    Seriously?

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  41. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    This shows the comparison between levels of long term unemployment to total unemployment across countries.

    Expect to be in for a surprise at our place in the comparison.

    http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/employment/long-term-unemployment-12-months-and-over_20752342-table3

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  42. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    @seanmaitland

    “a plan to create jobs” =/= “government employing people”.

    Did you actually need to be told that, or are you just trying to be argumentative?

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  43. Kleva Kiwi (267 comments) says:

    Wow Rex, just overlook a little incident that effected the world at the time why don’t you? I think it was referred to as a recession or something. There is a distinct possibility that this may have had some influence on global labour markets.
    Just saying

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  44. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    The rate of long term unemployed to total unemployment in the USA rose to 33% (and that is with some of their long term unemployed dropping out of the stats). It’s 19% in Oz and higher in much of Europe than in the USA.

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  45. OTGO (457 comments) says:

    Our company needed an employee in CHC who needed to have some welding and fabrication skills. We advertised on Seek and local papers offering about award wages and conditions. No NZers applied. So we hired an irishman and he’s turned out to be a great employee.

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  46. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    Should have been 31% for the USA (33% was the UK figure – still lower than for France and Germany etc).

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  47. seanmaitland (400 comments) says:

    Rex – again – thats not the governments job. Its the private sectors responsibility unless you are a communist.

    This government has dropped the company tax rate, reduced KiwiSaver contributions for employers and made it easier to trial employees without being taken to the cleaners if they are bad eggs. As far as I’m concerned thats bloody brilliant.

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  48. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    Kleva Kiwi posits:

    Wow Rex, just overlook a little incident that effected the world at the time why don’t you?

    Percent change, 2008 – 2010:
    New Zealand: 4.4 to 9.0 (an increase of 95%)
    Australia: 14.9 to 18.9 (an increase of 26%)
    UK: 24.1 to 33.4 (an increase of 38%)
    OECD average: 25.0 to 33.6 (an increase of 34.4%, and that includes shocking performers like the US, which tripled its long term unemployed over the same period).

    NZ’s performance – previously amongst the best in the world – has taken a greater hit than most since 2008, even allowing for the effects of the GFC. I’m no fan of Helen Clark but one thing her administration managed to do right was to reduce the percentage of long term unemployed from around 20.9% when she took office to around 4.4% by the time she left.

    We’re still doing better than most, but that’s an inheritance from the past couple of decades and we’re losing ground. I think that has more than a little bit to do with the problem of unemployment being the responsibility of a Minister who a Chief Executive described as:

    You have got senior government officials trying to reduce complicated ideas to graphs and pictorials because they know otherwise she won’t read them. We are trying to convert quite complex ideas into flow charts and graphs and diagrams. It’s astonishing.

    I don’t claim to have all the solutions (but then I don’t rows of bureaucrats at my disposal to mine data and propose options, either) but I seem to remember issues of productivity, burdensome regulation, and the effect of relatively high levels of government spending in discouraging investment in export industries were amongst the solutions canvassed in the much-heralded “2025 Taskforce”, set up as part of a commitment to close the income gap between NZ and Australia by 2025.

    While it’s website own has disappeared, the Taskforce’s report is being kept by Treasury.

    I wonder if anybody’s bothering to keep score of how far along the way we are to the stated aim of closing the income gap?

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  49. krazykiwi (9,188 comments) says:

    I’m no fan of Helen Clark but one thing her administration managed to do right was to reduce the percentage of long term unemployed from around 20.9% when she took office to around 4.4% by the time she left.

    Rex – Did you notice the invalids benefit numbers skyrocket at the same time? And the swelling public services – amost doubling on her watch and consuming an additional 13 hectares of office space in Wellington alone? I also know that the definition of long-term unemployed was VERY manipulated over the course of her reign.

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  50. wat dabney (3,422 comments) says:

    Hooray!

    hj managed to smuggle his dog-eared one-sided old reference to immigration into another thread!

    Is it some sort of drinking game, hj?

    Decent hard-working immigrants are not to be allowed into this country to do jobs which worthless Kiwis decline, and it’s all because of immigrants!

    Twat.

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  51. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    @krazykiwi

    I’m aware of the smoke-and-mirrors with invalids benefitrs, which I’ll admit accounts for some of the supposed improvement. But you can’t reverse the argument – people aren’t being pushed off the invalids benefit onto the dole and thus increasing the percentage because the Auditor General reported that:

    The number of people receiving invalids’ benefits has been relatively stable during the same period (the number increased by 2% from December 2008 to December 2010).

    So the figures don’t lie – genuine long-term unemployment has gone up 95% on Bennetts’ watch, and it’s not due to people being pushed off the invalids benefit onto the dole.

    As for the increase in public servants… I know they’re a pretty uninspiring lot kk, but I haven’t seen any sloping down Lambton Quay in their pyjama bottoms and socks :-D I doubt there’s a statistic anywhere to support either of our perspectives, but personally I’d be surprised if many of the new public servants were previously long-term unemployed. Short-term, yes, because as the figures SPC located prove, we don’t have an army of “dole bludgers” drawing lifetime benefits – most beneficiaires genuinely want to work – and those that are genuinely long term unemployed usually have some severe capacity issues (yes, too severe even to qualify them as a public servant).

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  52. pq (728 comments) says:

    yes, how much is Diane Mcpherson offering per hour, and what conditions. all is noit as it seems

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  53. hj (5,674 comments) says:

    wat dabney (2,215) Says:
    January 8th, 2013 at 5:49 pm

    Hooray!

    hj managed to smuggle his dog-eared one-sided old reference to immigration into another thread!
    ……………………………………..
    I wouldn’t call the Savings Working Group “dog eared”; Matt Nolan (the Visible Hand in Economics blog) called them “a great bunch of thinkers”. And they were independent (hence the unpalatable findings ) unlike the NZ Productivity Commission which is beloved of the Property Investors Assn.

    =============
    Watt unwisely says:

    “Decent hard-working immigrants are not to be allowed into this country to do jobs which worthless Kiwis decline”
    ….
    so you and your political allies would like to see wages sink to a low world average while property prises rise to levels set by the large rich minorities of over populated countries ? Globalisation in an over populated world.

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  54. kowtow (6,684 comments) says:

    put a “t” in the right place and wat becomes a twat too.

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  55. hj (5,674 comments) says:

    The Editorial in today’s Press slams the notion of bringing in unskilled workers while we have high unemployment.
    Proponents of immigration would argue that (miraculously) everyone benefits from immigration: the laws of supply and demand no longer apply.

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  56. Keeping Stock (9,786 comments) says:

    My daughter has been in Christchurch at university for the last four years. In that time, she has never been without part-time work. Much of the time, she’s been working more than one job. But as a graduate about to start her full-time career, even she cannot believe the lack of work ethic, motivation and general common sense of many of the people whom she has worked alongside.

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  57. hj (5,674 comments) says:

    We are hearing how bad the workforce is from libertarians. That same selective view that doesn’t agree with the scientific consensus on global warming because it doesn’t fit their beautiful theory which is “my greed benefits humanity”

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  58. hj (5,674 comments) says:

    You can’t over supply the labour market:

    “yes the work that has been done on that is varied and it’s virtually all non statistically significant..
    The work that’s been done impact of migrants on wages tends to suggest migrants release workers into the workforce elsewhere, it reduces the cost of some services, particularly food services, restaurant services, working in the kitchen, cleaning services, and generally raises productivity and efficiency in the economy.. and leads to higher growth rates so you get a virtuous circle. Virtually all the work that’s been done points to that. In very specific areas it might reduce wages

    No migration = North Korea, no borders = Europe.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/nights/audio/2539057/migration%27s-mighty-steps.asx

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  59. Colville (1,765 comments) says:

    bc @ 2.09. what the fuck was silly about my comment? :-)

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  60. SPC (4,580 comments) says:

    Would you rather they turned up an interview and mentioned the drug use and priors (wasting the time of both parties if this meant no hiring was then going to occur) or kept this hidden and was either later grounds for a contested dismissal or revealed by a check/test after the interview?

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  61. krazykiwi (9,188 comments) says:

    KS – My son is also in CHC at Uni. He’s articulate, intelligent (courtesy of his mum!), punctual and dilligent. I suggested he simply needs to do what’s expected of him and he’ll stand out from most of the others. He’s never had trouble getting a job.

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  62. Colville (1,765 comments) says:

    SPC. Obviously I was unclear. The only reason they “apply” is to tick the box with WINZ. Its a rort, same people apply every 2 months to be rejected again, for the same reason. No intention of working ever again.

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  63. pq (728 comments) says:

    yes yes, have any of the informed commenters checked on the coditions and pay offered by Diane Mcpherson yet

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  64. pq (728 comments) says:

    andretti (122) Says:
    January 8th, 2013 at 10:32 am
    This is not new.i have had issues such as this trying to employ staff over the past 2-3 years.It seems to be getting worse,these people obviously have a fall back position where they can get money to live.Hell even when you do employ them and dont ask them very nicely to perform a task they can take offense and just walk out the door. I belong to the local chamber of commerce and the subject of employing under 25s gets discussed frequently,most employers up here would rather have nothing to do with them if possible. end

    pq
    What was your pay rate offering Andretti, and terms of employment.

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  65. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    The answer to the pay part of the pay and conditions question is right there in the story, and DPF has even copied it into his post:

    The jobs McPherson is advertising all pay $14 an hour or more, with the bakery job starting at $20 an hour.

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  66. duggledog (1,097 comments) says:

    Well, sorry to come in so late in the piece with this gloomy thought but after reading SPC’s link it’s all semantics surely. If that’s the state those nations are in, ergo we’re toast sooner or later.

    Pity those who’ve grown up expecting the state to be there from cradle to grave, methinks that particular edifice is going to evaporate sooner rather than later.

    Nobody will starve or die of thirst or warlords though

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  67. thor42 (755 comments) says:

    *Surely* WINZ should be getting employers who interview bludgers to RING them after the interview??? Isn’t that “common sense”????

    All it takes is a phone call – “WINZ? Mr Jones here. You referred Mr Plonker to me and he showed up in pyjama-pants and smoking a joint.”

    That is ALL that is needed, and if WINZ aren’t doing this then they are FUCKING INSANE.

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  68. Griff (6,263 comments) says:

    totally agree hj
    All this talk of a free market then they dont pay what the market is demanding for decent labor.
    Unless we stop the welfare state subsidizing people it only makes sense that the subsidizing effects the employment market The noodles complaining will be earning way more than twice the minimum wage for their time,who was it that posted once that 250,000 was not rich, try living on a tenth of that. and they seem surprised that the reward for low wages is shit unmotivated uninterested workers. The result we import peoples from low wage economy’s to sate the greed of management.
    This will eventually backfire on the greedys as new Zealand’s social environment, crime and pollution heads towards the conditions our new citizenry escaped from

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  69. HC (130 comments) says:

    When I read the article in the press, I only see references being made to ONE employer. There is Diane McPherson, who runs a bakery by the name of ‘Brumby’s Bakery’ and another retail business called ‘Wendy’s Supa Sundaes’. She offers jobs above $ 14 an hour, which may be as low as perhaps $ 14.10, $ 14.50 or whatever. The “bakery job” is offered at $ 20 an hour.

    There is no information saying the jobs are full-time, part-time, casual or seasonal.

    McPerson is making very critical comments and is quoted saying things about certain applicants, whom she considers unfit to do the job, unprepared and in some cases bluntly unwilling to work.

    In all honesty, I find this article a bit bizarre. Surely, it is better to work and earn a living than having to put up with the these days draconian treatment WINZ staffers dish out to unemployed. It is expected that people make at least 20 applications per week, and reports and feed-back are asked for by case managers. I do not rule out that a fair number of unemployed are “unemployable”, as due to the not at all easy life one has to live while on a benefit (being honest), only the truly hopeless, least skilled and desperate tend to end up with WINZ for longer periods.

    Who in their right mind wants to live off just over $ 200 a week, with perhaps a little accom supplement top up, and struggle to survive on the dole in now rather expensive Christchurch?

    I acknowledge there are some attitudal problems with certain school-leavers and those under 25 or so, but I doubt that there is such a widespread problem with beneficiaries not wanting to work as this article and the employer mentioned try to portray.

    Even in good times bakery operators can have diffuculty finding staff, as even work ready people may find it difficult starting work at 4 am or so in the morning, which is part of what such a job entails.

    And polytech graduates may well know, that it is easy to get a better job in Christchurch now, than work in low paid retail. Perhaps McPherson is locally also well known to be a kind of employer one rather would not wish to work for? So all the prejudicial bene bashers do perhaps do a bit of reality check here.

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  70. scrubone (2,971 comments) says:

    thor42, I once heard of a WINZ office that started calling it’s “client’s” cellphones, and most didn’t even answer the call.

    If National wanted, they could halve dole queues overnight by putting simple tests on people to prove they were actually prepared to work. But the utterly pathetic requirement to have people reapply for the dole annually (gee, you’ve already done it once, how hard can it be?) is apparently a gross invasion of human rights on par with WWII.

    Seems to be there should be a citizens initiated referendum!

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  71. scrubone (2,971 comments) says:

    It is expected that people make at least 20 applications per week, and reports and feed-back are asked for by case managers.

    You’re dreaming.

    They might say that, but in reality you’d be luck to find someone who’s done a fraction of that.

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  72. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    Thanks for all the info re long term unemployment. I don’t expect to hear anything about it from anyone at Winz anytime soon. Odd comments from S Maitland..Your dear leader promised 170,000 jobs.
    Where are they?

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  73. Scott1 (357 comments) says:

    to be honest, in a very strong labour market it is appropriate for the employees to be picky.

    So if the job market is so tough that you can turn up to a job interview tell the employer that you plan on keeping your toungue ring in avoid mopping floors and do it all in your PJs and still get a job somwhere for enough pay to keep you happy.. well it isn’t your problem if employers are going out of business because they are offended by that.

    It could be these people are not getting employment anywhere in which case there is a issue for WINZ but if they are , after a reasonable search time, finding jobs… then it is the employer who we should be making fun of.

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  74. Paulus (2,289 comments) says:

    I have a builder friend from Tauranga who is in Christchurch.
    His two sons 17 (now in an apprentiship and 16 (who has to return to school) both have jobs.
    The younger one is under orders from Mum to return, but he would rather stay and work

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  75. Griff (6,263 comments) says:

    Paulus
    Some dicount the trades as a employment path
    For any young person capable and reasonable intelligent trades can lead to some very interesting and lucrative careers
    A easily achieved qualification as a licensed builder in four years or less would set him for life
    As would his extra income over that time as compared to some one still within education going for a degree or similar and their ever increasing student loan.

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  76. Colville (1,765 comments) says:

    Griff/Paulus. I agree. As a humble (cough) tradie I am very happy that I took the work and learn route rather than the Uni route.
    The ritualised 8000 hr beating that is a apprenticship is a great way to learn to work hard, communicate and plan a project.
    Its the planning and communication that are transferable to any field but working on the tools as with most things is about getting stuck in a getting the job done clean and fast with no comebacks. Learn that and you can make buckets.

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  77. HC (130 comments) says:

    scrubone: You apparently never had to deal with WINZ, nor do you know what demands are placed on unemployed these days, to prove they look for work. Who knows, maybe in the regions down somewhere different rules apply, but here in Auckland, that is ABSOLUTELY what WINZ expect job-seekers to make efforts for. And that is NOT selective. When coming back from overseas in late 2005 I was also faced with a job seeker seminar that WINZ now expects all applicants for unemployment benefits to attend. It was unbelievable, they rammed it home, they said, get so many applications a day, and prove it, get going and do not come back. That was under bloody Labour!!

    You and a few others have NO bloody idea about what is really going on at WINZ and the job market. You are just looking for excuses to rubbish some downtrodden, like the Nazis did with the gypsies, queers and jews of course.

    You better inform yourself or feel bloody ashamed!

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  78. kiwidream (1 comment) says:

    Hi there. You may find this post a little long.

    At present I am studying a business ethics course and part of our assignment is to comment on a blog in relation to a topic outlined in our course material. The story from The Press on 08/01/2013, in regards to “Trying to find staff ‘a nightmare’” is an interesting topic to which I would like to comment on.

    This article is a poor excuse for reporting, as it is clearly a tirade from a disgruntled employer, who discriminates based on appearance, which encourages businesses to seek employees from overseas, and it in no way supports the job market of NZ or the encouragement for the younger generation of our society.

    Hiring an employee is a monumental task management must face to gain the best candidate for the job. However, there are a proportion of NZ job seekers that have been taught through the generations that the benefit or Welfare system is there for people to abuse, to freeload from whenever possible, as the taxpayer foots the bill. But in saying that, the interview process and remuneration packages offered for certain jobs are a joke and businesses wonder why Kiwis are rushing to get off this Island. The people of this fine country are big on individuality, independence and showmanship which include anything from Tattoo’s, Piercing’s and the like. Though we are then penalised for our eccentricities and categorised as unwilling or misrepresented as gang affiliates or just a shady character. It can also be assumed that most people (male or female) don’t have access or own a business suit to attend an interview, or have access to a neat pair of shoes. However there are now organisations such as Dress for Success and Dress to impress that are available, where one can obtain a donated suit for male and female job seekers in this economically difficult time, to help you get that job from would be employers. Mental preparation is sometimes the key to success and if one believes that mopping a floor or washing dishes is degrading to a person’s self-esteem, then no amount of money would probably entice them.

    Discrimination based on personal or physical appearance is a violation in many states of the US (Forbes, 2012), under s21,1(k) of the Human Rights Act 1993, it is also illegal to discriminate against those that are a recipient of a benefit, and yet this woman clearly shows an attitude of disgust towards applicants of such a decree. I don’t believe in the use of Affirmative Action Policies, as it gives preferential treatment to a certain group of people, disadvantaging others in the pursuit of employment. In countries such as the USA or South Africa it would be a common place policy. But how effective or efficient is this type of practice? I believe it further divides the people of this world, categorising people like herds of cattle, and eventually affects the whole economic environment if all businesses used this approach. It appears to be another form of discrimination based on ethnicity, but is tied up in a little white bow and gives the illusion of equality for applicants. However here in NZ I would fear that it would disadvantage everyone. Our diversity has grown so much over the decades on such a small Island, that both Maori’s and Europeans are now the minority fighting for the right to be hired over, Indians and those of Asian descent.

    Labour laws in NZ, have now changed in that the minimum wage is $13.50 an hour (Department of Labour, 2012); after taxes, ACC levies, Student Loan deductions, Super deductions etc, there’s still rent, food, utilities etc; how is offering a full time job at $14 an hour going to pay for the necessities of life? There is no wonder that our young people of society have flocked to the Welfare system, as you get paid to do nothing. Making a profit is not all a business should be about. Nevertheless that is all a business owner generally considers, so why does an applicant get penalised for wanting exactly the same thing as an employer? Many jobs are out there and not just in Christchurch, but people are labelled as selfish, picky or lazy unenthusiastic bums when it comes to them not applying for these jobs. I know first-hand, as I have my cousin’s girlfriend living with us. She’s on the benefit. She doesn’t pay me any board. I can’t see her actively looking for jobs but I know she wants one. I see many jobs in the paper and online, and yet she doesn’t apply for them. So what is that mentality? McPherson takes it to the next level and makes it public. As an employer she believes that hiring from overseas will solve all her problems, but I wonder what type of offer would be made to secure that applicant. The remuneration package that goes out to overseas prospectors is likely to consist of the same offer she made to the NZ Public or would she raise the bar and include other benefits and increase the hourly rate.

    McPherson’s business ethics in relation to hiring employees appears to be lacking. She seems to have a “preference” of what a correct candidate would look like and act. Yet she feels it is her duty to announce to the public the shortcomings of others. Exposing herself as an employer with discriminatory tendencies; prone to ridicule and bullying tactics of others within the workplace and issues with independent and innovative thinking. She should try to have consideration for people of all walks of life, as she herself notes that she limits the opportunities for her business. If she could look beyond the exterior and not judge inappropriately she may find and hire an outstanding candidate for the job.

    Thank you

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