Can’t even stop kids fighting?

May 28th, 2013 at 9:00 am by David Farrar

The Dom Post reports:

A woman has been banned from a Wellington childcare centre after a Ministry of Education staff member saw her “inappropriately restraining” a child.

What did she do? Did she put him in a head lock? Tackle him to the ground? Sit on him?

The child was not hit or hurt

Yet she got banned?

The daughter of the centre’s supervisor had been on the floor with the children and was seen “stopping” a 4-year-old boy from hitting another child by putting her hand on his arm, she said.

How terrible. She must be kept away from children in case she stops other children from hitting each other.

The centre had a no-hitting policy, but staff usually told children verbally to stop if they were found to be “rough-playing”.

And if they don’t, we send them a stern note asking them to stop.

UPDATE: A friend who owns and operates an ECE says that the issue is likely to have been the fact the woman was not a parent or teacher at all, yet able to have contact with the kids – rather than the actual action of stopping one kid hitting another.

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41 Responses to “Can’t even stop kids fighting?”

  1. Redbaiter (7,836 comments) says:

    Yes, all this is incredibly bizarre, but it keeps on happening.

    When is change coming and who is going to bring it?

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  2. Cunningham (827 comments) says:

    Sadly a sign of the times, and we wonder why children are so badly behaved.

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  3. wreck1080 (3,778 comments) says:

    Disgusting.

    This ministry of education employee needs to be fired. If she is just following procedures, the head of the MOE needs to be fired.

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  4. MT_Tinman (3,033 comments) says:

    Redbaiter (3,078) Says:
    May 28th, 2013 at 9:04 am

    When is change coming and who is going to bring it?

    Hell, I can answer that one.

    You! But you won’t do it while hiding behind your computer.

    Get out there and change things in the front lines.

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  5. MT_Tinman (3,033 comments) says:

    The sheila in question was not a staff member nor a parent.

    Could the Ministry’s problem be with that rather than what the sheila was doing while supposedly stopping the fight/bullying?

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  6. Chuck Bird (4,725 comments) says:

    @MT_Tinman

    “You! But you won’t do it while hiding behind your computer.

    Get out there and change things in the front lines.”

    What are you doing and what is your real full name?

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  7. alex Masterley (1,494 comments) says:

    There will be questions in the house!

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  8. slightlyright (93 comments) says:

    I don’t envy Hekia, it seems the Ministry of Ed is choca block with unemployable retards who couldn’t even make it as teachers, and these half wits are responsible for policy advice no wonder our education system is the way it is

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  9. kowtow (7,844 comments) says:

    Call yourself “progressive” .

    Chickens are coming home to roost.

    Reap as ye sow.

    Death of common sense.

    Quite simple really.

    Here endeth the lesson.

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  10. DylanReeve (179 comments) says:

    It really feels like we’re missing a big piece of the puzzle with this story.

    I’m assuming it has something to do with who rather than what

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  11. Rick Rowling (821 comments) says:

    What the childcare policy maker might look like. http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcty0szm6c1rx5nkvo1_500.jpg

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  12. MT_Tinman (3,033 comments) says:

    Two questions in one sentence Chuck? That’s plain greedy.

    Answers are;

    1/ Answering a question.
    2/ Mind your own business.

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  13. alwyn (397 comments) says:

    The critical questions were of course
    Is she a registered teacher?
    Is she a member of the NZEI?
    No to both! Get her out of there.
    Silly women for stopping a child expressing his feelings by hitting another child. You will scar him emotionally for life.

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  14. Judith (8,200 comments) says:

    I heard of a similar situation.
    The physical restraining of a child by an adult, was deemed to be bullying by the adult. Adults who use physical restraint are simply demonstrating bullying and setting a bad example – apparently.

    I can imagine how many children would be killed on the roads if their parents did not ‘bully’ them into stopping at the kerbside.

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  15. scrubone (3,074 comments) says:

    Given people who support the rights of parents to use reasonable force are routinely labeled as vicious child abusers in this country (and have changed the law so it reflects this), this has a surprise factor of close to zero.

    But yea, the law is working as intended.

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  16. kowtow (7,844 comments) says:

    And last week in Invercargill

    http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/enraged-pupil-sees-school-go-into-lock-down-5445584

    Police called!

    Bring back the biff.

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  17. David Farrar (1,867 comments) says:

    A friend who owns and operates a childcare centre has said that the issue is someone who is not a teacher or parent should not be interacting with the kids – so it seems the issue may be more the whom than the what.

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  18. Redbaiter (7,836 comments) says:

    How about the 13 year old girl who was interviewed by police for TWO HOURS for calling a football player of aboriginal descent an ape?

    Australia- at the hands of the Progressives, rapidly becoming a police state.

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/girl-13-was-rude-but-shes-not-the-bully/story-fni0ffxg-1226650913020

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  19. Nigel Kearney (902 comments) says:

    I think MT_Tinman is onto it. It sounds like an unpaid volunteer committing the sin of doing work that could have been done by a paid union member.

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  20. Neil (568 comments) says:

    I remember one experience I had with a “deranged” student who had been attacking his teacher in the Special Needs class. I managed to control him until the Principal arrived by sitting on him !!!!
    It’s gradually emerging the 2-3% of dysfunctional kids have to be managed in some way. Our current passive, look the other way, or cover ups are going to be blown apart when some major disastwer occurs. Schools just reflect what is going on in the home and community.
    What can be done ? A mpore anti-acceptance of bad home behaviour and school behaviour.
    Why should young energetic and able teachers be confronted by this kind of unacceptable behaviour!!

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  21. Chris2 (765 comments) says:

    It’s interesting all this PC shit only seems to occur in workplaces were women predominate.

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  22. James Stephenson (2,071 comments) says:

    It’s interesting all this PC shit only seems to occur in workplaces were women predominate

    Which is the cause, and which is the effect?

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  23. radvad (685 comments) says:

    So a school is disrupted for hours because they are not legally able to deal with an abusive child.
    In the present PC environment this is an appropriate response. In fact I suggest parents do this also. If the state denies parents the right to discipline or even restrain children then the state should be made to take that responsibility. A sort of civil disobedience in reverse. If police are flooded with callouts to deal with naughty kids there will be pressure for the change pendulum to swing the other way.

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  24. RRM (9,585 comments) says:

    UPDATE: A friend who owns and operates an ECE says that the issue is likely to have been the fact the woman was not a parent or teacher at all, yet able to have contact with the kids – rather than the actual action of stopping one kid hitting another.

    I love how DPF and all the other usual suspects on here defaulted to assuming it was feminazi political correctness gone mad. When all along there was a REASON for it… fancy that! :-)

    It must be hard work, being a lone genus in a world full of utterly incompetent fucking morons! How do you do it? ;-)

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  25. radvad (685 comments) says:

    “A friend who owns and operates a childcare centre has said that the issue is someone who is not a teacher or parent should not be interacting with the kids – so it seems the issue may be more the whom than the what.”

    Why should it matter who restrains a child from hitting another?

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  26. Redbaiter (7,836 comments) says:

    “When all along there was a reason for it”

    I can’t see that DPF’s “explanation” excuses the event. But then I can think for myself and not just respond to auto-suggestion like some smug pull string doll.

    Best the kid was allowed to hit the other kid right?

    Who’s the fucking moron?

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  27. RRM (9,585 comments) says:

    Ask yourself that question again when you have kids radvad.

    I don’t have mine in a daycare centre.

    But if I did, I’d want some reassurance that only the proper people are looking after them, not every man and his dog who drops in.

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  28. scrubone (3,074 comments) says:

    It must be hard work, being a lone genus in a world full of utterly incompetent fucking morons! How do you do it?

    It’s becoming increasingly difficult.

    http://news.yahoo.com/fired-word-negro-spanish-class-135016980.html

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  29. MT_Tinman (3,033 comments) says:

    Nigel Kearney (363) Says:
    May 28th, 2013 at 10:02 am
    I think MT_Tinman is onto it. It sounds like an unpaid volunteer committing the sin of doing work that could have been done by a paid union member.

    It sounds like someone not sanctioned to be there interfering with children left in the care of the business and the slime helping build it up, presumably to assist the business retain it’s under-threat practicing certificate.

    Fucked if I can figure your take on it. Are you deranged?

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  30. radvad (685 comments) says:

    “Ask yourself that question again when you have kids radvad”. Unbelievably stupid comment. What do you know about me?

    “But if I did, I’d want some reassurance that only the proper people are looking after them, not every man and his dog who drops in.” WTF!! If some kid was hitting any of my children I would not care who stopped them. Mind you I suspect my son would deal with it himself and good for him.

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  31. Fletch (6,090 comments) says:

    Years and years ago a friend of the family who was a teacher got fired because when two children were fighting, he grabbed one of the kids jersey and pulled him off. That’s it. And as I say, this was years ago, back in the 80s or 90s.

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  32. RRM (9,585 comments) says:

    Sorry radvad I’m not explaining myself very clearly.

    (And from your lack of concern about random people being in the classroom interacting with the kids, I presumed you didn’t have any, my apologies.)

    Child A was hitting Child B. It is GOOD that someone stopped that. No problem there.

    However, Person C who intervened is not on the staff, not answerable to the parents who chose to have their kids in that childcare centre, is just some random person who knew one of the staff and dropped by.

    I wouldn’t want a train driver handing over the controls to his daughter. This is similar to that (IMHO.)

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  33. OTGO (520 comments) says:

    Fletch 10.42 I don’t think teachers pulling kids off has ever been acceptable!

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  34. 2boyz (253 comments) says:

    How the hell did this person who is not a teacher or parent have infiltrated this child care centre, let along been able to touch a child. Owner and centre workers should be send to a Gulag in Siberia for reeducation.

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  35. Tautaioleua (291 comments) says:

    The person was quite possibly a support person or a volunteer. But surely, she did the right thing? the incident escalated quickly and there were no teachers or parents close enough to intervene in time. This volunteer took the initiative to take charge and is now penalised for it.

    Common sense in the workplace is now a thing of the past.

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  36. Nigel Kearney (902 comments) says:

    >I wouldn’t want a train driver handing over the controls to his daughter. This is similar to that (IMHO.)

    These places generally are very welcoming to parents and my daughter’s one even has a parent help roster. But being a parent is not much of a qualification for anything, compared to being an adult who is not a parent or is the parent of a kid not at that particular centre. So this is similar to a train driver refusing to let his adult daughter drive even though the passengers are welcome to drive whenever they like.

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  37. Judith (8,200 comments) says:

    Whilst I can understand the requirement for only the teachers, or the parents concerned to intervene – I do wonder what sort of message does that send to our children ” When you see someone doing wrong, you just walk on by”? A child hurting another child, and you watch until the right person notices !?! That defies the basic instinct to protect.

    No wonder we’ve got a big shortage of heroes in this country. It is only a few steps away from watching a person being murdered and waiting for the cops to come and stop it.

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  38. scrubone (3,074 comments) says:

    I think the problem here is
    a) She just took hold of the arm
    b) this resulted in a ban

    “a” might have been more violent than the reporting suggests but a ban still seems like an over-reaction.

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  39. Alan Wilkinson (1,838 comments) says:

    Nuts. But the world is full of idiots so kids need to be taught to deal with them young.

    “I wouldn’t want a train driver handing over the controls to his daughter. This is similar to that (IMHO.)”

    The market value of your opinions just dropped to zero.

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  40. Paul Marsden (989 comments) says:

    When I was a kid (and like most kids are), I could be a right little trouble maker from time to time. On those occasions, either my father or my mother, would thrash me within an inch of my life (an action that nowadays would have them arrested and incarcerated … probably for life!)

    Funny then, how I grew up with a real respect and a consideration for other people, property and the law….

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  41. Rufus (626 comments) says:

    “I wouldn’t want a train driver handing over the controls to his daughter. This is similar to that (IMHO.)”

    Yes, because you have to be trained for years and licensed to stop one kid from hitting another – like a train driver.

    Tell me RRM, what training did you partake in to learn to raise your kid? Got any licenses? Took an exam?

    I see your point, but the above was a ridiculous comparison.

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