General Debate 28 July 2014

July 28th, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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305 Responses to “General Debate 28 July 2014”

  1. campit (467 comments) says:

    In April, 1956, a 21 year old security officer called Roi Rotberg of Kibbutz Nahal Oz was killed by Palestinian shepherds near the border with Gaza. His body was left hanging on the barbed-wire fence that marked the border.

    IDF Chief of Staff Moshe Dayan said this at the start of his historic eulogy to Roi:

    …Do not today besmirch the murderers with accusations. Who are we that we should bewail their mighty hatred of us? For eight years they sit in refugee camps in Gaza, and opposite their gaze we appropriate for ourselves as our own portion the land and the villages in which they and their fathers dwelled…

    This we know: that in order that the hope to destroy us should die we have to be armed and ready, morning and night. We are a generation of settlement, and without a steel helmet and the barrel of a cannon we cannot plant a tree and build a house. Our children will not live if we do not build shelters, and without a barbed wire fence and a machine gun we cannot pave a road and channel water…”

    Six months after delivering that speech, Dayan oversaw a “screening operation” – what became known as the Khan Yunis massacre. Israeli soldiers rounded up all men aged fifteen to fifty-five, lined up them up against the wall of a 14th century castle in the town’s center and executed, killing as many as 275 unarmed civilians. Days later in Rafah, the army killed 111 more.

    A nine year old boy witnessed the execution of his uncle. His name was Abdel Aziz al-Rantisi:.

    I couldn’t sleep for many months after that. It left a wound in my heart that can never heal. This sort of action can never be forgotten…They planted hatred in our hearts.

    Rantisi grew up to be one of the founders of Hamas.

    How much more hatred has Israel planted in recent weeks? What, exactly, is Israel trying to achieve in Gaza? How much longer before they accept that there is a link between the appropriation of land and the violence we see today?

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  2. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Re: the Mosaic Law:

    Reid: “You’ll of course be aware of the conditional nature of those instructions: i.e. unless Israel was obedient to God, the deal was off and He would bring forces of destruction upon them.”

    Wrong. If you look at the entire content of the Bible God only says that He will discipline His people, but that the Covenant promises are eternal.

    Reid is correct, the law of Moses describes the blessings of rain in due season and of success in battle, but if the terms were not kept then the the blessings were replaced with a curse. Daniel mentions the curse:

    Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, even by departing, that they might not obey thy voice; therefore the curse is poured upon us, and the oath that is written in the law of Moses the servant of God, because we have sinned against him.
    Daniel 9:11

    The covenant being broken was described by Jeremiah:

    Behold, the days come, saith YHWH, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith YHWH
    Jeremiah 31:33

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  3. kowtow (8,175 comments) says:

    Where’s Minto and rent a yob when you really need ‘em?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2707322/Heads-sticks-Sick-ISIS-video-emerges-showing-50-beheaded-Syrian-soldiers-impaled-poles-held-aloft-Raqqa-city.html#comments

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  4. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    New York Times Editorial Board Calls For Legalization Of Marijuana

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/07/27/opinion/sunday/high-time-marijuana-legalization.html?_r=0
    Repeal Prohibition, Again

    By THE EDITORIAL BOARD

    It took 13 years for the United States to come to its senses and end Prohibition, 13 years in which people kept drinking, otherwise law-abiding citizens became criminals and crime syndicates arose and flourished. It has been more than 40 years since Congress passed the current ban on marijuana, inflicting great harm on society just to prohibit a substance far less dangerous than alcohol.

    The federal government should repeal the ban on marijuana.

    We reached that conclusion after a great deal of discussion among the members of The Times’s Editorial Board, inspired by a rapidly growing movement among the states to reform marijuana laws.

    There are no perfect answers to people’s legitimate concerns about marijuana use. But neither are there such answers about tobacco or alcohol, and we believe that on every level — health effects, the impact on society and law-and-order issues — the balance falls squarely on the side of national legalization. That will put decisions on whether to allow recreational or medicinal production and use where it belongs — at the state level.

    We considered whether it would be best for Washington to hold back while the states continued experimenting with legalizing medicinal uses of marijuana, reducing penalties, or even simply legalizing all use. Nearly three-quarters of the states have done one of these.

    But that would leave their citizens vulnerable to the whims of whoever happens to be in the White House and chooses to enforce or not enforce the federal law.

    The social costs of the marijuana laws are vast. There were 658,000 arrests for marijuana possession in 2012, according to F.B.I. figures, compared with 256,000 for cocaine, heroin and their derivatives. Even worse, the result is racist, falling disproportionately on young black men, ruining their lives and creating new generations of career criminals.

    There is honest debate among scientists about the health effects of marijuana, but we believe that the evidence is overwhelming that addiction and dependence are relatively minor problems, especially compared with alcohol and tobacco. Moderate use of marijuana does not appear to pose a risk for otherwise healthy adults. Claims that marijuana is a gateway to more dangerous drugs are as fanciful as the “Reefer Madness” images of murder, rape and suicide.

    There are legitimate concerns about marijuana on the development of adolescent brains. For that reason, we advocate the prohibition of sales to people under 21.

    Creating systems for regulating manufacture, sale and marketing will be complex. But those problems are solvable, and would have long been dealt with had we as a nation not clung to the decision to make marijuana production and use a federal crime.

    In coming days, we will publish articles by members of the Editorial Board and supplementary material that will examine these questions. We invite readers to offer their ideas, and we will report back on their responses, pro and con.

    We recognize that this Congress is as unlikely to take action on marijuana as it has been on other big issues. But it is long past time to repeal this version of Prohibition.

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  5. RF (1,368 comments) says:

    I struggle to accept that precious Dan Carter spending time away on his world holiday was described as him ” taking his sabbatical”.

    For Christs sake…..

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  6. Chuck Bird (4,833 comments) says:

    Did anyone else see the documentary about these two homosexual paedophiles who adopted a boy from Russia and not only sexually abused themselves but provided him for other homosexual paedophiles?

    I am not saying for a minute this is what happens in the majority of case like you enabler will try and claim I am. It is no bloody wonder the Russians stopped adoptions to NZ.

    http://tvnz.co.nz/sunday/2014-07-27-video-6038767

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  7. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Reid is correct, the law of Moses describes the blessings of rain in due season and of success in battle, but if the terms were not kept then the the blessings were replaced with a curse. Daniel mentions the curse:”

    Reid is wrong, but then he gets his “theology” from youtube videos, so no surprise there.

    “He is the Lord our God; His judgments are in all the earth. He remembers His covenant forever, the word He commanded, for a thousand generations, the covenant He made with Abraham, the oath He swore to Isaac. He confirmed it to Jacob as a decree, to Israel as an everlasting covenant: “To you I will give the land of Canaan As the portion you will inherit” (Psalm 105:7-11).

    Note the use of “forever” and “eternal” which cannot in any way be interpreted as temporary, or conditional. The curse that God brings on Israel for disobedience is a temporary judgment, never an eternal one.

    Judgments against Israel occurred several times in it’s history, but they were always temporary.

    The New Covenant is a fulfillment of the Old, not a replacement. And as Paul makes clear in Romans the Jewish people are not cut off from the New Covenant, nor does it abrogate any of the promises made to Israel. To claim that it does is to make God a liar.

    Then again, considering who I think Reid is really serving, that may be his game plan.

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  8. bringbackdemocracy (423 comments) says:

    Tv1 poll
    Conservatives polling higher than any of National’s current support parties.

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  9. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Those Who Bless Israel Will Be Blessed, and Those Who Curse Israel Will Be Cursed

    In the Book of Genesis, Chapter 12, Verse 1-3, we see what God says about His response to how people treat Israel:

    “And I will bless those that bless you and curse the one who curses you. And in you shall all families of the earth be blessed.”

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  10. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Chucky
    Why dont you man up and admit to your self that your fascination with homosexuality is repressed desire.
    The only person you fool is your self.

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  11. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    “Hamas killed hundreds of children in the construction of its extensive tunnel network, built partly to carry out attacks on children across the Gaza border in Israel. That report–confirmed by Hamas itself–emerged in 2012, not from the Israeli government, but the sympathetic Journal of Palestine Studies, in an article that otherwise celebrated the secret tunnel system as a symbol of Palestinian resistance to the Israeli “siege” of the Gaza Strip.”
    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2014/07/27/Report-Hamas-Used-Child-Labor-to-Build-Tunnels-Hundreds-Died

    Free the people of Gaza from Hamas, their terrorist rulers!
    The last election was in 2005. When will the UN demand another?

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  12. EAD (943 comments) says:

    The Worlds oldest and most authoritative Conservative Magazine, The Spectator, warns that we are on the verge of another Central Bank caused economic crash on a much larger scale to the great crash of 2008:

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9271191/back-to-the-brink/

    They warn:
    “Yet alarming evidence is amassing that the global recovery is shaky, stock markets are over-hyped and the large western banks, for all the talk of reform, remain a serious liability. The reality, and it gives me no pleasure to write this, is that we could see a re-run of the ghastly credit crunch of 2007/08……….This autumn, as the end of Fed ‘tapering’ and rising interest rates loom larger, overvalued western stock markets will come under intense pressure. Our largely unreformed, debt-soaked, loss-hiding banks mean a sharp asset price correction could spark a systemic crisis, involving not only the ‘advanced’ world but the large emerging markets, too. I don’t want it to happen, but there’s a good chance it might”

    While I hope we don’t have another crash, if we do, we on the right need to be vigilante and don’t let the media try and paint it as another “crisis of capitalism” as they will use the opportunity to to bring in even more socialism. We need to point the finger squarely where it really lies – Debt addicted governments and their ponzi-like welfare schemes as well as their central bank enablers.

    “True, governments can reduce the rate of interest in the short run. They can issue additional paper money. They can open the way to credit expansion by the banks. They can thus create an artificial boom and the appearance of prosperity. But such a boom is bound to collapse soon or late and to bring about a depression.” – Mises

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  13. EAD (943 comments) says:

    Here are my predictions for todays General Debate:

    Posts on Israel/Palestine/The Bible: 105
    Number of minds changed about Israel/Palestine/The Bible: 0

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  14. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Griff

    I was thinking the same thing. It does sound like old Chucky doth protest too much, methinks.

    There is very little worse than a raving poof in denial, look what it did to Ian Thorpe.

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  15. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    It looks very much like Key has told the CCCP to go and get fucked. All in all a great decision.

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  16. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “Reid is correct, the law of Moses describes the blessings of rain in due season and of success in battle, but if the terms were not kept then the the blessings were replaced with a curse. Daniel mentions the curse:”

    Reid is wrong, but then he gets his “theology” from youtube videos, so no surprise there.

    “He is the Lord our God; His judgments are in all the earth. He remembers His covenant forever, the word He commanded, for a thousand generations, the covenant He made with Abraham, the oath He swore to Isaac. He confirmed it to Jacob as a decree, to Israel as an everlasting covenant: “To you I will give the land of Canaan As the portion you will inherit” (Psalm 105:7-11).

    The covenant made with Abraham was the covenant of the land, not the Mosaic covenant that Reid and I were talking about.

    The covenant of the land was to the benefit of all the descendants of Abraham (ie including Ishmael), not just the twelve tribes of Israel. The land that was set apart for the twelve tribes was only a relatively small part of the promised land of Genesis 15, which extended from the Nile to the Euphrates.

    The Oded Yinon Plan describes the appropriation of all of the land of the Abrahamic covenant by the Zionist state:

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815

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  17. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    National will not support CCCP because the policy’s of Colon Crag are no more than populist rantings with no real direction. Act allows national to pass policy more to the right of its voter base and allow the act party to take the fall out.
    Why they support possum head I have no idea.

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  18. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    @ Chuck Bird (4,681 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:10 am

    Yes I saw it. Very disturbing indeed. But I think we should remember that adoption comes with all sorts of risks, especially international adoptions. People (of all sexual persuasions) go overseas to find children when they are unable to adopt here in New Zealand. There is of course an imbalance between the number of babies put up for adoption here, due to many reasons. Contraception, abortion, cultural values regarding solo-parenting, government financial support and so on have all affected why less babies are offered. But the underlying value is that the ‘best’, the cream of parents with the best backgrounds and the most to offer that fits with the birth parents values, are accepted here now.

    Many are rejected simply because they are not deemed acceptable to adopt – and sadly it is many of those that go elsewhere, where the number of babies is plentiful and the rules less strict. There have been many horror stories, just as there were back in the days when NZ had an excess and babies were given to some very questionable people. Closed stranger adoption meant these people were seldom monitored and children suffered all sorts of atrocities.

    I would hate to see that sad case become solely about homosexuality because it is not, that is just part of it – the fact remains that there are some very sick people in this world that are somehow allowed legitimate access to children – because certain societies do not value children enough to make them our most precious possession. Sadly, some parts of New Zealand mirror those values in our terrible child abuse statistics.

    Most of us are horrified at the thought of putting a child through anything like that – we need to know more about why some be it through sickness of the mind, or some other weird value of life, think it is okay to treat the most innocent among us, in such a way.

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  19. Tarquin North (254 comments) says:

    Am I the only person who hates the exclusive brethren? Why do they get charitable status when they are nothing but lying hypocrites? I don’t mind competition but the playing field should be level. I didn’t mind them when they were just a bunch of inbreds selling home made furniture to each other, but now they are running large companies bringing in crap from China at rate that would make the Warehouse blush. I’ve sold to brethren companies for the last 12 years and watched them slowly bend there own rules. We are the unclean and there mission is to screw us. If they paid tax and adheared to the rules like the rest of us I wouldn’t mind but they don’t. Trust me, these businesses are growing like topsy on the backs of ordinary kiwis and their charitable status should be wiped. This should be an election issue – they don’t even vote!

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  20. Chuck Bird (4,833 comments) says:

    BB, it is retarded enablers like you who do even understand the meaning disproportionate or over represented unless it apples to Maori that allows this sort of abuse to go unchallenged.

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  21. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Those Who Bless Israel Will Be Blessed, and Those Who Curse Israel Will Be Cursed

    In the Book of Genesis, Chapter 12, Verse 1-3, we see what God says about His response to how people treat Israel:

    “And I will bless those that bless you and curse the one who curses you. And in you shall all families of the earth be blessed.”

    In the book of Genesis,Israel refers to Jacob, or his descendants, not to the Zionist state.

    And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel:
    Genesis 32:28

    The state of Israel acts as if it had divine protection, but it relies on the US for military support.

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  22. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “The covenant made with Abraham was the covenant of the land, not the Mosaic covenant that Reid and I were talking about.”

    They are one and the same. The Torah is one covenant.

    “The covenant of the land was to the benefit of all the descendants of Abraham (ie including Ishmael), not just the twelve tribes of Israel. ”

    The land was specifically given to the twelve tribes, and divided amongst them and them alone. When Israel allowed foreigners and foreign gods into tribal lands, including the descendant of Ishmael who worshiped false gods, they were rebuked by Him.

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  23. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    What if?
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2705042/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-What-Hamas-rocket-hit-BA-plane.html

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  24. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Why do they get charitable status when they are nothing but lying hypocrites?
    “They” being all church based business as well as the Maori trusts.

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  25. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “In the book of Genesis,Israel, refers to Jacob, or his descendants, not to the Zionist state.”

    They are one and the same. The “Zionist sate” is the partial fulfillment of God’s prophetic promise to Israel.

    “The state of Israel acts as if it had divine protection, but it relies on the US for military support.”

    God blesses Israel and provides for her in part through the USA.

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  26. James Stephenson (2,139 comments) says:

    Act allows national to pass policy more to the right of its voter base

    I’d say policy that’s popular with it’s voter *base* but likely to be less so with the floating vote they don’t want heading back towards Labour.

    There’s also a significant difference between ACT’s usual angle of adding more “spine” to the government and this weird stare-y guy’s “Keep the government on a short leash” tag line.

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  27. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    big bruv (13,269 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:30 am
    It looks very much like Key has told the CCCP to go and get fucked. All in all a great decision.

    I think Key has worked out that he probably won’t need the CCCP or anyone else (sigh) such is his (sob) popularity (imagine tears, tantrum and a leftie hissy fit). As Scarlet O’Hara said “tommorow is another day” or at least 2017 will be! :-(

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  28. duggledog (1,502 comments) says:

    Who the f*** is advising Craig on his public image? His billboards are just scary. He’s got Manson eyes. Terrible

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  29. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Shawn, judging by the deal Kerry is trying to force on Israel, I’m not so sure the US is on their side anymore. Certainly not the Democrat side but maybe God will help the GOP win control later this year and stop the rot.
    Ironically Egypt is more supportive than Obama and Kerry. God works in mysterious ways huh.

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  30. SGA (983 comments) says:

    ShawnLH at 8:50 am

    God blesses Israel and provides for her in part through the USA.

    So not so much “In God we trust”, but more “God trusts us” :-)

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  31. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “imagine tears, tantrum and a leftie hissy fit”

    I thought you weren’t a leftie Judith?

    “As Scarlet O’Hara said “tommorow is another day” or at least 2017 will be!”

    I wouldn’t get too excited, Key is looking good for four terms. ;)

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  32. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Shawn, judging by the deal Kerry is trying to force on Israel, I’m not so sure the US is on their side anymore.”

    In general, as a nation, it is. Polls in the US show support for Israel at it’s highest ever level. Governments come and go, and the degree of the support changes, but it’s always there.

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  33. itstricky (1,770 comments) says:

    There’s also a significant difference between ACT’s usual angle of adding more “spine” to the government and this weird stare-y guy’s “Keep the government on a short leash” tag line.

    Who the f*** is advising Craig on his public image? His billboards are just scary. He’s got Manson eyes. Terrible

    Yeah, think that when I see those billboards. Unfortunately, ‘leash’ is a bad choice of word too. I see weird Manson stare-y guy, then think chains, muzzles and leather leashes. Bad bad scary choice…moon boy….bad scary choice.

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  34. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Where’s Mikey? He can’t be at work since he’s not posting. Gone on holiday?

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  35. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    They are one and the same. The Torah is one covenant.

    Wrong. The Torah is a teaching, a covenant is a type of contract between two parties.

    http://www.jewfaq.org/torah.htm

    The exchange of value of the Abrahamic covenant is described in Genesis 15:

    And he believed in YHWH; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
    Genesis 15:5

    The belief of Abraham was about the number of his descendants, the value to Abraham was the possession of the land by his descendants.

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  36. Gulag1917 (852 comments) says:

    Those Who Bless Israel Will Be Blessed, and Those Who Curse Israel Will Be Cursed
    In the Book of Genesis, Chapter 12, Verse 1-3, we see what God says about His response to how people treat Israel:
    “And I will bless those that bless you and curse the one who curses you. And in you shall all families of the earth be blessed.”

    Old Covenant not so applicable under the New Covenant. One nuclear bomb on Israel and dispensational theology takes a devastating hit. Over simplistic dispensational premillennialists would never recover.

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  37. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    God blesses Israel and provides for her in part through the USA.

    The USA has been betrayed by the Zionists from the time of the Lavon Affair.

    A former Navy attorney who helped lead the military investigation of the 1967 Israeli attack on the USS Liberty that killed 34 American servicemen says former President Lyndon Johnson and his defense secretary, Robert McNamara, ordered that the inquiry conclude the incident was an accident.
    http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/ussliberty.html

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  38. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    ACT needs to remember why they are there. Because National has gifted them a seat. Otherwise they would have been long gone. Their current polling is bad, and for that matter so is the CP’s, and neither can get into parliament without National’s help. Yet both parties sometimes behave and speak as though Key owes them something.

    ACT has proven that it can work constructively with National, so let’s hope the current leadership stays that course.

    Craig on the other hand is looking more and more like a liability.

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  39. wreck1080 (3,866 comments) says:

    One major annoyance…..

    I tried to buy 40k of Genesis shares. But, I got allocated just a small fraction of that.

    Then, I hear about some american couple got 1.6 million dollars of genesis shares… how on earth?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/10315411/Asset-sale-screwed-NZ-buyers

    When you hear stories like this, you get a bit annoyed. Although, the fact they are american is fine, it sounds like they live here now so they are actually kiwis. Just that fact they were able to buy so many shares when I could not.

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  40. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Commonwealth Sevens final is on Prime TV. It’s currently 7-nil to NZ.

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  41. Gulag1917 (852 comments) says:

    Thanks Shawn for rugby update.

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  42. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “The USA has been betrayed by the Zionists from the time of the Lavon Affair.”

    All relationships have rocky times.

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  43. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,260 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:54 am

    I am not a labour supporter, but my values are more aligned with left-wing than right. However, you’d have to work very hard to convince me that we have any political party in New Zealand that adheres to either strongly, at the moment. There is no single party in New Zealand, at the moment that offers what I would call values that match my ideals. Most of them have one or two aspects I like, even National – but New Zealand politics stopped being dominated by strict left and right separations some time ago.

    I think you are over-estimating Key’s popularity. I’m sure there are some, such as yourself that worship the ground he walks on, but the reality is, at the moment he is the best on offer – at least part of his win will be due to the absence of competition – that does not make him better by any means. He’s always been exactly what he is – circumstances are what effect his ratings.

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  44. Nukuleka (297 comments) says:

    Hey, I know this is yesterday’s news but at least it gets us away from the Israel/ Gaza posts.

    We have a 16 year old PI lad from South Auckland staying with us at the moment. No doubt he’d be regarded as part of the ‘children living in poverty’ clan that the left tells us about so regularly. Big, fit lad, clearly not in any way suffering from malnourishment or deprivation of any sort. But when it comes to eating breakfast WE HAVE TO FORCE HIM TO EAT BREAKFAST BEFORE HE HEADS FOR SCHOOL. He doesn’t want any. He’s not feeling like eating this early in the day! It is a cultural thing, obviously, and a characteristic I have seen so often among Pacific Islanders.

    Hand-wringing white middle-class paternalists will never acknowledge that not everyone lives in the same way as they do. Minto of Mt Albert springs to mind!

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  45. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Fair enough Judith. It wasn’t an attack in any way, I was just curious.

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  46. Keeping Stock (10,265 comments) says:

    Someone from the Green Party didn’t do due diligence on their Love New Zealand slogan; it’s already being used by an organisation called LoveNZ.

    But what’s worse is the list of sponsors of LoveNZ; oil companies, rail and freight movers, airports, breweries, sugar-laden drink manufacturers; the whole nine yards of businesses the Greens actively oppose, and which allied organisations like Greenpeace actively protest against.

    That’s a big oopsie from Green Party HQ. Intellectual property theft is more the realm of the Internet Party’s founder.

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2014/07/did-greens-do-due-diligence.html

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  47. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Hey, I know this is yesterday’s news but at least it gets us away from the Israel/ Gaza posts.”

    I’m done. I felt it important to counter Ugly, but having done that I won’t be responding to anymore of his or the other Jew haters on KB. I’m bored with the topic myself.

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  48. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Bugger. 17-7 to South Africa.

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  49. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    South Africa win 17-12. :(

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  50. James Stephenson (2,139 comments) says:

    ACT needs to remember why they are there. Because National has gifted them a seat. Otherwise they would have been long gone. Their current polling is bad, and for that matter so is the CP’s, and neither can get into parliament without National’s help. Yet both parties sometimes behave and speak as though Key owes them something.

    Seymour’s point is a good one: John Key doesn’t get to cast those votes for the people living in Epsom, all parties tell their supporters which way they’d like them to vote (eg the Greens only asking for party votes) but at the end of the day it’s down to those people cast their vote the way they see fit.

    Epsom voters are smart enough to know that there’s no downside for National from having ACT around, so unless John Key specifically tells them he wants ACT gone, I suspect there’ll be at least two ACT MP’s in the next parliament.

    Plus, as we’ve previously covered, Key owes ACT for the fact that he gets to have some base-friendly policy without having to spend his own political capital with the floaters.

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  51. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “The USA has been betrayed by the Zionists from the time of the Lavon Affair.”

    All relationships have rocky times.

    Does the following sound like a minor spat?

    Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, even by departing, that they might not obey thy voice; therefore the curse is poured upon us, and the oath that is written in the law of Moses the servant of God, because we have sinned against him.
    Daniel 9:11

    9/11 is a case of monumental betrayal of the US by the Zionists. We have an official admission of the existence of evidence which links Israelis to the attacks of 9/11, as well clear motive and as a large of body of circumstantial evidence.

    And say, Hear ye the word of YHWH, O kings of Judah, and inhabitants of Jerusalem; Thus saith YHWH of hosts, Elahi of Israel; Behold, I will bring evil upon this place, the which whosoever heareth, his ears shall tingle.
    Because they have forsaken me, and have estranged this place, and have burned incense in it unto other gods, whom neither they nor their fathers have known, nor the kings of Judah, and have filled this place with the blood of innocents;
    Jeremiah 19:3-4

    I’m done. I felt it important to counter Ugly, but having done that I won’t be responding to anymore of his or the other Jew haters on KB.

    I don’t hate Jews. In the Bible, the end times associate the devil (slanderer) with the adversary (satan).

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  52. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Fair points James.

    I do think ACT will be constructive, they have very little choice anyway.

    I had some hope for Craig but his bottom line demand was just dumb, and came across as arrogant in the extreme given that his party has almost no hope at this point of breaching the 5% barrier.

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  53. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    “The media has engaged in journalistic malpractice by reporting casualty figures for civilians coming from Gaza as gospel. The figures come from the Gazan Ministry of Health, which is controlled by Hamas. The Ministry of Health counts everyone not in uniform as a civilian. Most Hamas fighters don’t wear uniforms. The UN is sometimes sourced for the figures, but the UN gets its figures from … the Gazan Ministry of Health. Contrary to early reports that 80% or so of the early casualties were civilians, Al-Jazeera published names and ages, and about 3/4 were men of fighting age (16-50), compared to a rough estimate of 20% of the Gazan population (40% to 50% of which is fourteen and under). Some of those men were undoubtedly civilians, but it strains credulity to believe that 80% of the casualties were civilian but just-so-happened to be overwhelmingly fighting-age men. ”
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/07/26/some-israel-gaza-notes/

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  54. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “9/11 is a case of monumental betrayal of the US by the Zionists. ”

    ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ…………………………

    Peddle it elsewhere UglyNazi. This claim is batshit crazy. And I’m done listening to your insanity for today.

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  55. oldpark (261 comments) says:

    @Shawn H .The guys wearing All Black jerseys,played like also rans,not like ALL BLACKS.All Blacks don’t play like arrogant geriactrics.Two of the players must have thought the final was a practice run.Hope this is not a fore-runner to the big game against Australia next month for Bledisloe Cup.

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  56. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    Could someone muzzle KB’s resident jihadist? :-)

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  57. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “9/11 is a case of monumental betrayal of the US by the Zionists. ”

    This claim is batshit crazy.

    “Your theory is crazy, but it’s not crazy enough to be true.” ~ Niels Bohr

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  58. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Could someone muzzle KB’s resident jihadist?

    Jihad means struggle. The struggle can be internal or external, violent or non-violent.

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  59. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Could someone muzzle KB’s resident jihadist?”

    I wonder if he realizes that the only reason he has this blog to rant on is because of the tolerance and good graces of a Zionist?

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  60. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    So what happened to the self crowned “worlds greatest rugby nation”?

    Well done to the Saffa’s. I could say that I won 20k on then in the final but I won’t, say that would only make me look like an unhinged idiot.

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  61. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Are you accusing DPF of being a Zionist, Shawn? I’ve seen him give demerits for badmouthing Muslims, which is not something a real Zionist would do IMO.

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  62. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    Only a really cool person could win 20k on a rugby game.

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  63. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,268 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 9:44 am

    I don’t want to get into an argument over the current war, but isn’t the value of the freedom to express our opinions, no matter which side they are defending, what makes this country what it is?

    Should people be prevented from viewing alternative opinions, just because some think differently?
    How can anyone have an objective opinion, unless they know the alternative points of view?

    I do not think that DPF expects anyone on this blog to express only opinions that agree with his worldview. It is the one thing I do like above everything else, that DPF does not feel challenged by the opinions of others, and seems to welcome them.

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  64. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Are you accusing DPF of being a Zionist, Shawn?”

    Accusing?

    “I’ve seen him give demerits for badmouthing Muslims, which is not something a real Zionist would do IMO.”

    That’s because your a bigot who has no clue what real Zionists are or think.

    Bye.

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  65. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    I’m bored with the topic myself.

    I can understand that, but unlike 9/11 the Gaza war is in the here and now and the enlistment of Western elites by Hamas is regarded as a key part of that war. So the propaganda can’t be ignored – even less so in a well-read blog like Kiwiblog where there is at least a chance of getting across the Israeli arguments that don’t appear in TV1, TV3, National Radio, etc.

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  66. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Judith,

    “I don’t want to get into an argument over the current war, but isn’t the value of the freedom to express our opinions, no matter which side they are defending, what makes this country what it is?”

    Yes.

    “Should people be prevented from viewing alternative opinions, just because some think differently?”

    No. I have never suggested that Ugly should be banned for his opinions.

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  67. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    I’ve learned a new word this morning – ultracrepidarian.
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/10317752/Call-to-end-kings-reign

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  68. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    I agree Tom which is why I have bothered to respond to Ugly and a few others recently. That said, there comes a point when it just gets tiresome, and we have an election on the way.

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  69. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    If you engage in debate with the loony we all get the fall out

    Of course a poke once in a while is acceptable as long as its funny.

    The hypothesis about tin foil hats has never been proven. In fact, it has been determined that anyone wearing a tin foil hat is more likely to fall under control of any electronic mind control waves. It turns out that because the hat is open at the bottom, the hat behaves like a satellite signal receiving dish. It will actually focus and concentrate any microwave and radio signals directly to the brain.

    Hence the ugly truth command center
    http://bluejayblog.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/tinfoil-cubicle.jpg?w=640

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  70. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    ‘there is at least a chance of getting across the Israeli arguments that don’t appear in TV1, TV3, National Radio, etc.’
    You feel the Israelis don’t get a fair go in our media, tom?
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/10318646/Israels-PM-won-t-back-down
    Seems to me that Stuff is on message for you.

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  71. Scott (1,765 comments) says:

    I think the 1st post on this thread by campit is indicative of the lazy moral thinking that so many people have about the war in Gaza. He thinks it’s about land, he thinks it’s about legitimate grievances. But the fact of the matter is that Hamas is doing what Moslems do. They want to take over every square inch of what they call Palestine and establish an Islamic state, as ISIS is doing in Iraq and Syria. They are not interested in negotiations or peace, they are only interested in jihad to destroy the state of Israel.

    This is explicitly spelt out in their founding charter –

    ‘[Peace] initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and

    international conferences are in contradiction to the principles of

    the Islamic Resistance Movement… Those conferences are no more than

    a means to appoint the infidels as arbitrators in the lands of

    Islam… There is no solution for the Palestinian problem except by

    Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are but a

    waste of time, an exercise in futility.’ (Article 13)

    To check out the Hamas charter for yourself go to – http://fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/880818a.htm

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  72. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Accusing?

    Hell yes. Zionism was founded on betrayal, betrayal of Judaism, and betrayal of Jews who did not fit into the Zionists plan for Palestine.

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  73. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Heh, I loved your ugly command center Griff. :)

    Brilliant bit of humor, though I suspect it’s not far from the truth.

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  74. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    But the fact of the matter is that Hamas is doing what Moslems do.

    Fight against oppression, you mean?

    They want to take over every square inch of what they call Palestine and establish an Islamic state, as ISIS is doing in Iraq and Syria.

    Wrong, they have rejected a proposal to establish a Palestinian state.

    The acquisition of territory by the Zionists is well documented in the Oded Yinon Plan.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815

    They are not interested in negotiations or peace, they are only interested in jihad to destroy the state of Israel.

    The Quran describes a protocol for achieving peace with those who oppose Islam, and the end of the Zionist state is just when it is characterised by the repugnance of betrayal and of the murder or innocents.

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  75. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    ‘They are not interested in negotiations or peace, they are only interested in jihad to destroy the state of Israel.’
    Lucky that there’s no chance of that ever happening.

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  76. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    If you engage in debate with the loony we all get the fall out

    Hey Griff, seen this?

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/environment/10916086/The-scandal-of-fiddled-global-warming-data.html

    Goddard shows how, in recent years, NOAA’s US Historical Climatology Network (USHCN) has been “adjusting” its record by replacing real temperatures with data “fabricated” by computer models. The effect of this has been to downgrade earlier temperatures and to exaggerate those from recent decades, to give the impression that the Earth has been warming up much more than is justified by the actual data.

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  77. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    Two years too late:
    http://theweek.com/article/index/265418/speedreads-americans-really-wish-they-elected-mitt-romney-instead-of-obama

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  78. Scott (1,765 comments) says:

    Ugly truth – they want to take over every square inch of the state of Israel. It’s in their charter man. If you call yourself “truth” then it’s important that you do accept the truth when it’s laid out before you in black and white –

    Goals of the HAMAS:

    ——————

    ‘The Islamic Resistance Movement is a distinguished Palestinian

    movement, whose allegiance is to Allah, and whose way of life is

    Islam. It strives to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of

    Palestine.’ (Article 6)

    On the Destruction of Israel:

    —————————–

    ‘Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will

    obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it.’ (Preamble)

    The Exclusive Moslem Nature of the Area:

    —————————————-

    ‘The land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf [Holy Possession]

    consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgment Day. No one

    can renounce it or any part, or abandon it or any part of it.’

    (Article 11)

    ‘Palestine is an Islamic land… Since this is the case, the

    Liberation of Palestine is an individual duty for every Moslem

    wherever he may be.’ (Article 13)

    The Call to Jihad:

    ——————

    ‘The day the enemies usurp part of Moslem land, Jihad becomes the

    individual duty of every Moslem. In the face of the Jews’ usurpation,

    it is compulsory that the banner of Jihad be raised.’ (Article 15)

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  79. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    What hypocrisy from Grief- Ugly bores me stupid with his endless molten steel hate Israel crap but so does Grief with his endless preaching of the equally fantastical AGW religion. They’re birds of a feather.

    Reasonably sane commenters here would ignore both of them.

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  80. Scott (1,765 comments) says:

    While we’re talking about the religion of peace, I think someone has already mentioned this on the thread, here is just another example of the barbarism that people following Islam are doing right now –

    “The militant Islamist group Islamic State (ISIS – formerly the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) has ordered that all women in Mosul, northern Iraq, must undergo female genital mutilation (FGM).
    United Nations official Jacqueline Badcock, based in Irbil, said the fatwa applied to all women aged 11 to 46, which could result in the cutting of 4 million women and girls.

    – See more at: http://www.mychristiandaily.com/index.php/uk/186-generic-news-5-7/11385-isis-demands-all-women-in-mosul-undergo-fgm#sthash.ACIJMbbK.dpuf

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  81. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    WTF is the 7’s doing in the commonwealth or Olympic games?

    lol @ we choked.

    Not feeling patriotic today :D

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  82. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “WTF is the 7′s doing in the commonwealth or Olympic games?”

    Long overdue. It’s a great addition to the games.

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  83. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    When did the commonwealth games incorporate the special games people?

    I woke up this morning, I hear we got gold in the pool and i was like “holy shit”.

    Then i find out it was from the special olympics chick. Good for her but i dont think her medal should be on the same table as the able bodied or whatever you call them.

    It cheapens the real medals imho.

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  84. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Hey ugly tin head
    It stared in Godard s blog about a month ago and has spread from there of course Ive seen it
    it is nonsense .
    Best a study run by skeptical scientist reexamined the record and confirmed that its accurate years ago
    http://berkeleyearth.org/summary-of-findings
    You must adjust for changes to make a comparable record over time
    here is a graphic of such changes in Aucklands record

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  85. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Reasonably sane commenters here would ignore both of them.”

    Possibly Red, but how would you know given that you’re not a reasonably sane person?

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  86. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    dime says:

    “Then i find out it was from the special olympics chick. Good for her but i dont think her medal should be on the same table as the able bodied or whatever you call them.”

    Why?

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  87. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Hey Dime, get with it- when non-productive liberals/ progressives empower their governments to loot the productive sector they also decide where the money gets spent. EOS.

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  88. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    You feel the Israelis don’t get a fair go in our media, tom?
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/10318646/Israels-PM-won-t-back-down
    Seems to me that Stuff is on message for you.

    Well first up that’s simply a re-print from the LA Times, typical for a NZ paper. Is there really nobody on the staff who could actually write about this in a non-opinion piece? I guess they feel it’s not worth the cost. They may be right but it does mean that I can’t be bothered reading Stuff when I could see the same article in its original source.

    More on point, there is a great difference between blandly reporting what the Israeli PM says and then not keying off any questions or opinions based around that – as opposed to asking questions and stating opinions that sound like they come from the Hamas playbook. As an example, since you follow NZ newspapers, radio and TV, are you aware of any that have raised the points around Hamas’s control of the death statistics, or their social media guidelines, all of which are geared towards claiming that most deaths are civilian. I’ve not seen any here. Has Stuff re-printed that WaPo piece on the Hamas Ministry of Health? That would be real reporting.

    That’s the point.

    Lucky that there’s no chance of that ever happening.

    No. But this is the same type of argument that you and others have used in respect of Hamas vs. Israel: that just because you’re criticising Israel does not mean you’re supporting Hamas. Similarly here; while there is no doubt that Hamas cannot destroy Israel that does not change the fact that they want to, that it’s in their charter, and that they’re trying as hard as they can.

    Just because Israel has 200-300 nuclear weapons does not mean they should sit on their asses taking the hits. No nation, nuclear armed or not, would take that shit lying down. Proportionality is also a canard: it actually guarantees an endless war. If it were truly adhered to the Israelis would simply fire off an equal number of unguided rockets every day, aiming in general for downtown Gaza, since apparently it’s only a war crime when you actually target a civilian – at least according to one of the more eloquent defenders of Hamas I saw on KB the other day.

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  89. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Hey Dime, get with it- when non-productive liberals/ progressives”

    Got a job Red?

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  90. Scott (1,765 comments) says:

    Tom Hunter makes a good point. If we wanted proportionality then we should suggest that Israel fire 1200 unguided rockets into Gaza over the next 12 months.
    Now no one would reasonably agree with that suggestion but that is what Hamas has been doing for years now – firing rockets into Israel. That Israel has not had more casualties is because of their iron Dome anti-missile system, their network of shelters and their early warning system.

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  91. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    “dime says:

    “Then i find out it was from the special olympics chick. Good for her but i dont think her medal should be on the same table as the able bodied or whatever you call them.”

    Why?”

    because her gold winning time probably isn’t good enough to qualify for the games if she was able bodied.

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  92. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    Reasonably sane commenters here would ignore both of them. (Griff and UT)

    We already do.

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  93. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    ““WTF is the 7′s doing in the commonwealth or Olympic games?”

    Long overdue. It’s a great addition to the games.”

    are you the same sorta guy that enjoys olympic soccer?

    rugby gate crashing the games is just meh. 7’s isn’t even a decent game. boring as fuck.

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  94. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    :lol:

    fantastical AGW religion

    Oh dear red how stupid can you get?
    My church of agw is a scientific researched and backed fact
    Every scientific body in the world supports my views. EVERY ONE !!!!

    On rational examination you are the tinfoil wearing wing nut in this case.

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  95. Ross12 (1,383 comments) says:

    This is why the MSM have lost it and deserve the massive drop in circulation that is occurring

    https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/24563073/nz-herald-makes-jackass-mistake/

    Not only did the Herald make an unbelievable blunder but the make the apology via Twitter. It is possible they may have made an apology by phone or in person but then the writer of the linked article needs a kick in the rear end.

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  96. Lance (2,620 comments) says:

    Yes Jihad does mean struggle and indeed it can mean violent or non-violent.

    Although I struggle to remember ever once seeing a Muslim Ghandi or even a sit in with hymns being sung.

    So the point Ugly raises is actually meaningless, Jihad means violence in reality.

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  97. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    ‘Proportionality is also a canard: it actually guarantees an endless war’
    The positions of the two sides is what guarantees an endless war.

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  98. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    Dime listened to ZB from about 730-840 this morning.

    JK was on doing his thing. Happy as usual.

    The only thing I heard from Labour was that godawful Cosgrove complaining about CERA?! spending “an extreme” 1.8 mill on flights.

    Don’t get me wrong, it probably is up there and i don’t trust public servants. However, we are 50odd days out from the election and that’s the only message they got though on a monday morning. more bleating about crap.

    How can these fuckers not understand that the majority of voters are sick of hearing negative crap from them?

    I guess its just a reflection of who they are inside. Desperately unhappy losers.

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  99. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “Every scientific body in the world supports my views. EVERY ONE !!!!”

    Copernicus.

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  100. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “are you the same sorta guy that enjoys olympic soccer?”

    No.

    rugby gate crashing the games is just meh. 7′s isn’t even a decent game. boring as fuck.”

    Agree to disagree. 7’s is very fast and very entertaining.

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  101. Tarquin North (254 comments) says:

    In other news, I see Damien Spurdle, a Labour Party drone from Papakura photographed John Banks allegedly using a cell phone while driving. He them reported this crime to the police. A couple of thing here Damo, is it safer to take a photo than use a phone? Did you get a police five badge for this act of bravery? Are Labour focusing on the important things? Does anybody care? After all Mr. Banks is just a private citizen minding his own business, he probably didn’t expect a twat like you to jump out of the woodwork. And by the way Damo, nobody like a nark. A future leader in the making.

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  102. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Dime- taxpayer funded sporting events are just a public relations exercise underpinned by looting politicians anxious to quell anti-govt attitudes among the masses.

    Bread and circuses.

    Look it up.

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  103. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Got a job Red?

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  104. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “And by the way Damo, nobody like a nark.”

    Not entirely true.

    Used to be so but not today.

    Fans of big govt, and there are many in NZ (especially since education has been perverted into a socialist induction process,) love them and frequently desire to be one of them.

    Its the kind of vicious thinking that has underpinned most socialist/ communist states.

    Where children are even encouraged to nark on their parents. As in Hitler’s Germany and NZ today.

    BTW, the nark was a passenger when he took the photo. Or so he claims.

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  105. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Copernicus.

    Was an early scientist who helped develop the heliocentric model of the universe that the idiots tried to refute based on the words of the bible
    Your standpoint is that of those who opposed Copernicus.

    :lol:

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  106. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    The Progressive religionists hold all of the power in society today.

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  107. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    “Dime- taxpayer funded sporting events are just a public relations exercise underpinned by looting politicians anxious to quell anti-govt attitudes among the masses.

    Bread and circuses.

    Look it up.”

    Yep. I do enjoy them though!

    classic example – that waterfront eyesore stadium mallard floated to distract everyone from labour breaking laws.. people still talk about it… if only we had that stadium.. we should have done it blah blah

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  108. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    “Got a job Red?”

    why do you think red is unemployed?

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  109. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Was an early scientist who helped develop the heliocentric model of the universe that the idiots tried to refute based on the words of the bible”

    An urban myth Griff. It was in fact because the philosophy of Aristotle had become the underpinning for scholastic theology, especially that of Aquinas.

    “Francis Schaeffer explains the result of this synthesis: When the Roman Church attacked Copernicus and Galileo, it was not because their teaching actually contained anything contrary to the Bible. The church authorities thought it did, but that was because Aristotelian elements had become part of church orthodoxy, and Galileo’s notions clearly conflicted with them. In fact, Galileo defended the compatibility of Copernicus and the Bible, and this was one of the factors which brought the trial (Schaeffer, p.156).

    Historian Herbert Butterfield similarly writes, “… the Aristotelian view of the universe had become entangled with Christianity more closely than necessity dictated.” And he attributes Galileo’s condemnation to the “anti-Aristotelian argument” in Galileo’s book, The Two Principal World-Systems (Butterfield, pp.56,68).

    So the controversy surrounding the “Copernican revolution” was NOT “the Bible vs. science” – it was Aristotelian science (which had been merged with the Bible) vs. the “new” science. The real culprit was the changing nature of medieval science.”

    http://www.dtl.org/bible/article/science.htm

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  110. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “why do you think red is unemployed?”

    He spends a lot of the day posting on blogs, and I’m curious as to whether he walks the talk so to speak.

    In answer to your next question I’m self-employed, and when I have a client my timetable is dependent on them, thus I tend to work odd hours.

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  111. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    Red isnt unemployed.

    Lots of us spend a shit load of time on blogs.

    Im always doing something else between comments.

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  112. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Shawn is just another lying big govt supporting/ leftist coward with the usual attempts at unsubstantiated smears.

    Some of it will stick is the idea.

    Also a delusional troll much in the style of Ugly and Grief. And another weird Redbaiter obsessive.

    In the main, best ignored.

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  113. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    I’ll take your word for it dime. I’m still suspicious.

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  114. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Shawn is just another lying leftist coward with the usual attempts at unsubstantiated smears.”

    A: Not a leftist. I’m more genuinely Conservative than you are, by a long shot.

    B: All you had to do when I first asked the question was say yes or no.

    “In the main, best ignored.”

    That’s your excuse, but the truth is that your afraid of me Red. You have no idea how to debate with someone who is genuinely Conservative but still thinks your a bit of a dick. :)

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  115. OneTrack (2,979 comments) says:

    Tarquin – “In other news, I see Damien Spurdle, a Labour Party drone from Papakura photographed John Banks … ”

    I saw that. He, and the Herald, have really got that lefty hate thing going, haven’t they. It’s like a dog with a bone – they got their man but they still have to keep chewing. I guess all their lefty readers (that’s all they have left) would have liked it.

    Earth to Herald, I don’t want to see pictures of a private citizen on the phone on Page 5. Unless you are doing a feature on road safety, I don’t actually care. How about some real news instead of glorified gossip? Alternatively, how about some scantily dressed girls on Page 3, which seems to be where you are heading.

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  116. cricko (290 comments) says:

    dime
    thanks for the heads up re the MMA yesterday, saw your post in time to catch the last two bouts.

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  117. OneTrack (2,979 comments) says:

    Griff – “Copernicus.

    Was an early scientist who helped develop the heliocentric model of the universe that the idiots tried to refute based on the words of the bible
    Your standpoint is that of those who opposed Copernicus.

    Copernicus was an early scientist who challenged the orthodoxy of the establishment ie the science is settled, just don’t look at the empirical measurements because we have our models.

    I think they probably called Copernicus a “denier”.

    fify

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  118. david (2,571 comments) says:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/10319030/Man-critical-after-allegedly-invading-home

    An interesting article. Interesting more for what isn’t said than what is.

    For one, I don’t want to know any more and applaud the person whose home was invaded. Perhaps the intruder will reconsider his career choice.

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  119. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “the truth is that your (sic) afraid of me Red.”

    You’re a patronising poorly educated fool with paper thin political perceptions and you also demonstrate weirdly obsessive behaviour that strongly hints at mental disorder. You will also lie without compunction.

    Discussion with you is pointless. I just do not have the time to spare or waste engaging with loons.

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  120. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “You’re a patronising poorly educated fool”

    Well, im a few papers away from having a uni degree, so……

    “with paper thin political perceptions”

    Political perception requires understanding political realities. As you have your head in the sand regarding political reality, I think it’s a fair call to say that your political perceptions are paper thin.

    “you also demonstrate weirdly obsessive behaviour”

    It’s called debating Red. It’s what we do on KB. Plus, given the fascinating emotional content in your posts I’m not sure you should be throwing around that accusation. Have you ever considered anger management classes?

    “Discussion with you is pointless.”

    Nah, your just a coward who ignores people that frighten and confuse you.

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  121. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Great tweet-

    Semaj Ragde ‏@SemajRagde Jul 25

    I was a democrat for 67 of my 73 years. Then I learned that my political party was a lie machine of unbelievable capacity. I detest liars!

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  122. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Ugly truth – they want to take over every square inch of the state of Israel. It’s in their charter man. If you call yourself “truth” then it’s important that you do accept the truth when it’s laid out before you in black and white –

    I’ve previously made it clear that Hamas is part of the problem. Hamas claim to follow Islam, but its goals conflict with the Quran:

    “Bear in mind the words of Moses to his people [the Children of Israel]. He said: ‘Remember, my people, the favour which God has bestowed upon you. He [Allah] has raised up prophets among you, made you kings, and given you that [the Torah and the Land of Israel] which He has given to no other nation. Enter, my people, the holy land [of Israel] which God has assigned for you. Do not turn back, and thus lose all'”.
    Qur’an 5:20

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  123. Fletch (6,251 comments) says:

    Actor Mark Pellegrino (Supernatural, Tomorrow People) schooled some folk on Twitter as regards Israel.

    http://twitchy.com/2014/07/24/rock-on-israel-actor-mark-pellegrinos-defense-of-israel-should-be-required-reading/

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  124. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Copernicus was an early scientist who challenged the orthodoxy of the establishment ie the science is settled, just don’t look at the empirical measurements because we have our models.

    :lol:
    the measurements
    http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/2014/5

    Global Highlights

    The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for May 2014 was record highest for this month, at 0.74°C (1.33°F) above the 20th century average of 14.8°C (58.6°F).

    http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/

    Global Highlights

    The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for June 2014 was the highest on record for the month, at 0.72°C (1.30°F) above the 20th century average of 15.5°C (59.9°F).

    The models
    http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate2310.html

    Abstract

    The question of how climate model projections have tracked the actual evolution of global mean surface air temperature is important in establishing the credibility of their projections. Some studies and the IPCC Fifth Assessment Report suggest that the recent 15-year period (1998–2012) provides evidence that models are overestimating current temperature evolution. Such comparisons are not evidence against model trends because they represent only one realization where the decadal natural variability component of the model climate is generally not in phase with observations. We present a more appropriate test of models where only those models with natural variability (represented by El Niño/Southern Oscillation) largely in phase with observations are selected from multi-model ensembles for comparison with observations. These tests show that climate models have provided good estimates of 15-year trends, including for recent periods and for Pacific spatial trend patterns.

    Your post is a pratt
    point refuted a thousand times

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  125. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    The facts are the Church at the time supported Aristotelean Orthodoxy regarding the nature of the universe. Both Galileo and Copernicus challenged that orthodoxy.

    The consequence of suppressing Galileo ‘s finding was scientific enquiry and advancement moved to the north where there was no monolithic church to challenge alleged heretical beliefs about the nature of the world .
    Basic stuff really.!

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  126. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    An odd response from Colin Craig to this:

    After weeks of speculation, Prime Minister John Key has indicated that he will not pull Mr McCully from the seat.

    …as reported by NZ Herald – Craig: ‘Better for us’ if McCully stands in East Coast Bays

    Conservative Party leader Colin Craig says he’d prefer National incumbent Murray McCully to stand in East Coast Bays, and has taken a shot at the deals National does with the Act and United Future parties.

    He never said he didn’t want National to gift him a seat and left the option “up to National” but when they say they won’t he claims it is his preference. Yeah right. And…

    And he has opened the door to Labour, especially if they are open to his bottom line of binding referenda.

    But Mr Craig said he supported a third term for National, if they won the largest share of the party vote – though he could not rule out working with Labour.

    If Labour agreed to the Conservative’s bottom line of binding referenda, and National did not, then “that would be a very interesting scenario, and perhaps Labour would be prepared to do that”.

    He said he did not expect to beat Mr McCully in East Coast Bays this election.

    He’s all over the place there.

    He has repeated what he has said a number of time – that he’d go with the largest party, which will obviously be National.

    But now he’s saying that’s only dependent on Labour not backing his bottom line on referenda. This really seems crazy.

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  127. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Yes Jihad does mean struggle and indeed it can mean violent or non-violent.

    Although I struggle to remember ever once seeing a Muslim Ghandi or even a sit in with hymns being sung.

    So the point Ugly raises is actually meaningless, Jihad means violence in reality.

    http://forusa.org/groups/religious-peace-fellowships/muslim-peace-fellowship

    Muslim Peace Fellowship / Ansâr as-Salâm, founded in 1994, was the first Muslim organization specifically devoted to the theory and practice of Islamic nonviolence. We understand unarmed struggle in pursuit of wise, just, and compassionate social transformation to be the original and enduring genius of the Prophetic jihad. Part membership group, part think tank, and part movement builder, MPF is a gathering of peace and justice-oriented Muslims of all backgrounds who are dedicated to making the beauty of Islam evident in the world.

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  128. kowtow (8,175 comments) says:

    How’s that Arab Springey thingey going?

    Well done Obama ,Camoron and Hollande you’ve knocked over one evil prick and created a potentially bigger mess. And some have the cheek to call them “statesmen”.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/10994333/British-diplomats-attacked-during-evacuation-from-Libyan-embassy.html

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  129. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Colon Grag is a loony PG
    National have made the correct decision. He is a toxic loon who will only cause problems. National have indicated they have no intention of playing to his tune and will just ignore the fool.

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  130. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “But now he’s saying that’s only dependent on Labour not backing his bottom line on referenda. This really seems crazy.”

    It’s monumentally stupid. The one and only reason most ECB voters would vote for Craig would be that he will provide National with more coalition options. Now that he’s willing to put Labour in power over binding referendums he has just taken away the only reason for people to tactically vote for his party.

    He’s lost the plot. Totally.

    The shame of it is that I would like to see a viable, socially conservative party in NZ. But the CP was never all that conservative, and a successful party has to be run by someone who knows how to win and get into Parliament.

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  131. kowtow (8,175 comments) says:

    Islam was founded originally as a peaceful ,charitable religion as Mo plagiarised the Old and New Testaments (there was nothing original about his ‘revelation”)

    Once he left mecca for Medina and found he had an army at his disposal,it all changed and the sword was announced as the instrument of faith!

    Simple historical fact,that can’t be denied.

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  132. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    kowtow, wrong.!

    There is no evidence that Obama or Cameron initiated and had a hand in the Arab Spring. Also America had no major role in the over throw of Colonel Gadafffi . It was done largely at the behest of London and Paris.

    http://www.juancole.com/2011/12/top-ten-myths-about-the-arab-spring-of-2011.html

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  133. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Islam was founded originally as a peaceful ,charitable religion as Mo plagiarised the Old and New Testaments (there was nothing original about his ‘revelation”)

    If he plagiarised the gospels, then why does the Quranic account of the crucifixion differ?

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  134. Other_Andy (2,572 comments) says:

    “…..dedicated to making the beauty of Islam evident in the world.”

    Not working very well then….

    More than 23.000 terror attacks by muslims since 9/11

    Just in June:
    Jihad Attacks: 56
    Dead Bodies: 625
    Critically Injured: 608

    beautiful….

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  135. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    Shawn – when you have one person founding and mostly responsible for financing and running a party then personal the risk of stupidity coming through magnifies.

    Money might buy attention but it obviously doesn’t buy political common sense.

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  136. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    ‘there was no monolithic church to challenge alleged heretical beliefs about the nature of the world .’

    You commies just won’t get the point will you?

    Whatever your perceptions about who was suppressing viewpoints back then, today’s Progressive movement that you (and Grief) follow and foster is far more guilty of far more repression, and anyone who opposes you suffers the same attacks from your kind as Copernicus suffered in his time from the orthodoxy then.

    Progressivism is in a more enlightened future going to be viewed as the “dark ages” of 20th and 21st centuries.

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  137. David Garrett (6,977 comments) says:

    Sorry if someone has already posted this…

    A home invader in Napier got more than he bargained for when he attacked a bloke in his own home with a hammer…while the bloke was actually in bed FFS…

    Victim turned the tables on invader, who is now in hospital in a critical condition…Perfect illustration of the “castle doctrine”…invade someone’s house = get what is meted out to you….Hope the cops have the good sense not to charge the house owner….

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  138. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Hope the cops have the good sense not to charge the house owner….”

    Hopefully, but I’m not sure they have a good track record on that front.

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  139. David Garrett (6,977 comments) says:

    Late edit: I see “david” linked to the story @ 11.56…Like him, I don’t want to know any more of the facts…the salient ones are: 1) prick invades house and attacks householder; 2) Victim fights back and seriously injures attacker; 3) Scrote Shouldn’t have invaded a mans home and attacked him.

    Shawn: Yes…precisely why the party that adopts the castle doctrine and pledges to quickly make it law gets my vote…

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  140. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    Also America had no major role in the over throw of Colonel Gadafffi . It was done largely at the behest of London and Paris.

    Much as I can admire your defence of Israel you have a gigantic blindspot when it comes to your worship of Obama. It’s very well understood that the French and British would not have lifted a finger unless America led the way. I don’t know how on earth you define “major”, but the use of cruise missiles and other precision weapons to degrade the air defences of Libya was seen as essential by the French and British military and not something they could do alone.

    Moreover, in the immediate aftermath of Gadaffi’s fall from power the Obama administration was more than willing to bask in the glory of R2P and the rest, with “Leading From Behind” being the celebrated nostrum of the day. Several years later and there are merely the usual practices happening that are inherent in the phrase, Defeat is an orphan.

    Finally, what is it with these links you supply that you apparently have not read. The Cole piece is almost three years old and hence very much out of date, with it’s talk about the “moderate” nature of the new Muslim Brotherhood government of Egypt being the least of it’s stupidities. As usual it’s Cole trying to talk up the secular, non-Jihadist nature of such events, which is why so many Western Leftists so often quote him on the ME. He really is far more out of touch than he claims or implies. The other problem he has is that time passes on such claims, especially when he twists himself into a pretzel for US partisan reasons, as in the following:

    Muslim radicals have not been able to take advantage of these largely peaceful movements in the way they could of George W. Bush’s invasion and occupation of Iraq, ….

    Muhahahahah. Sure sweetie. Cole could make that claim in 2011. In 2014 not so much, where Libya and Syria now look every bit as bad as Iraq with secular revolutionaries almost entirely powerless against Jihadist groups. The only place for which it is still true is Tunisia where it was always the case anyway, and Morocco, which has managed to ease the transition over the years without a revolution and better than any Arab country, while still maintaining good relations with different US administrations.

    If anything Obama was far too slow to act, and there was danger of Egypt turning seriously anti-American if he had not stepped in when he did.

    Too late. Obama’s equivocation on Mubarak pissed off both sides in Egypt. Running the same back-and-forth play on Morsi a year or so later just made things worse: the overwhelming attitude among Egyptians of all camps now is that the USA, and Obama in particular, has tried to screw them over. It’s some achievement to get everybody to distrust or even hate you. Well played Barack.

    Idiot.

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  141. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    Shawn: Yes…precisely why the party that adopts the castle doctrine and pledges to quickly make it law gets my vote…

    …for this party?

    My opinion is that all law abiding citizens should have the right to own a firearm, and yes I am a supporter of the “castle doctrine” which basically says that if someone invades someone else’s home then a violent response in self-defence is acceptable.

    Craig is looking for all the support he can get and seems willing to work with anyone who will back his policies.

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  142. dime (9,806 comments) says:

    Cricko – good stuff!

    The lawlor/brown fight was just awesome.

    rumble johnson is a scary man too. considering he used to fight at 170, he was average back then. at 205 he is a beast of a man

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  143. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Redbaiter , its almost a waste of time responding to your irrational and moon bat thinking .It’s worthwhile repeating once agin.
    In the face of the Church’s opposition to Galileo’s findings that the earth was not the center of the world” progressive” science moved and developed in the protestant north where there was no monolithic orthodox church to contend with. Scientific advancement progressed and flourished there .
    But if you want to turn the clock back to Mediaeval thinking then fine .!!
    Thats if you don’t mind making an ape and clown out of yourself.!

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  144. David Garrett (6,977 comments) says:

    PG: Perhaps I should have added “…and has a realistic chance of quickly making it law”…

    I don’t know who is advising Colin these days, but IMO they are doing much of a job…Mind you, I suppose his “moon landings” blunder is no worse than Mr Whyte’s “No philosophical problem with incest”…

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  145. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    tom hunter, more of your libertarian and pro far right Republican illusions shine through . Study e.g UN Resolution 1973 which, among other things China and Russia did not Veto , that sanctioned air strikes against the Gadaffi regime.It was Britain and France that carried out these strikes . Not the US.
    Behind your saber rattling rhetoric looms the Benghazi Conspiracy promoted by your far right cabal, including Fox News and the Washington Times etc ,which you happily parrot .

    And try this this myth about Mubarak and the Arab Spring,

    “3. The Obama administration threw Hosni Mubarak under the bus.

    The Egyptian president was the author of his own demise. Washington had assumed that Mubarak would ride out the storm. As Egyptians came together to topple the dictatorship, the Obama administration was hobbled by confusion, expressing a presumptuous intimacy with the man while most Egyptians had nothing but contempt for him. Mubarak had long been the pillar of America’s relations with the Arab world. Remember that just a few weeks before he fell, Clinton said that the Egyptian regime was “stable.”

    America should not write itself into every story: There are forces in distant nations that we can neither ride nor extinguish. Egypt, a patient land, had given Mubarak three decades. In return, the ruler toyed with his people and belittled them. He sat at the apex of a lawless regime and never designated a legitimate successor. (Even the most obtuse could see that he intended to bequeath power to his pampered son.) He had risen out of the armed forces, and the officer corps came to see that dynastic ambition as a brazen affront. In this Egyptian drama, those at the White House and in Foggy Bottom were mere spectators.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-the-arab-spring/2011/12/21/gIQA32TV

    You see things are rather more complex than your far right propaganda machine and mantras would like us to believe.

    I shudder to think what would happen if your Sarah Palin had a a hand in all of this . US troops embroiled further into Middle East uprisings and conflicts that potentially would make Iraq 2003 a mere sideshow.

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  146. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “Redbaiter , its almost a waste of time responding to your irrational and moon bat thinking”

    Just what the orthodoxers said to Copernicus.

    Except its not a parallel circumstance. There are in fact plenty of Conservatives out there, its just that bubble living progressives like you never come across them.

    Nevertheless Conservatism is a rock solid political principle that has stood the test of time for more than a century and its more a reflection on the sad ignorance of the uneducated ignorant of history Progressives that they think anyone subscribing to that school of thought is insane.

    What crippled and blinkered minds you really must have to think that anyone who is not a Progressive is nuts.

    What an incredible waste of human resources.

    Get a fucking education for fucks sake you sad lamer.

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  147. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “om hunter, more of your libertarian and pro far right Republican illusions shine through ”

    Oh come on Stephie. For a start nothing in Tom’s posted was specifically libertarian, and certainly not “far right” by US standards.

    Just a friendly heads up, when you say things like this it makes you look like Redbaiter. This is not a good thing.

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  148. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Except its not a parallel circumstance. There are in fact plenty of Conservatives out there, its just that bubble living progressives like you never come across them.”

    Stephie comes across us all the time on KB.

    “Nevertheless Conservatism is a rock solid political principle”

    Yup. So when are you going to come over to the conservative side? And what does libertarianism have to do with conservatism?

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  149. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    What do you believe a conservative is?
    http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/01/what-americans-mean-when-they-say-theyre-conservative/252099/
    definition of conservative.
    An aversion to rapid change; a belief that tradition and prevailing social norms often contain within them handed down wisdom; and mistrust of attempts to remake society so that it conforms to an abstract account of what would be just or efficient.
    A desire to preserve the political philosophy and rules of government articulated in the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution.
    A belief that it is imperative to preserve traditional morality, as it is articulated in the Bible, through cultural norms.
    A belief that it is imperative to preserve traditional morality, as it is articulated in the Bible, using cultural norms and the power of the state.
    An embrace of free-market capitalism, and a belief in the legitimacy of market outcomes.
    A belief that America is an exceptional nation, a shining city on a hill, whose rightful role is leader of the free world.
    A belief that America should export its brand of democracy through force of arms.
    The conviction that government should undertake, on behalf of the American polity, grand projects that advance our “national greatness” and ennoble our characters.
    An embrace of localism, community and family ties, human scale, and a responsibility to the future.
    A belief that America shouldn’t intervene in the affairs of other nations except to defend ourselves from aggression and enforce contracts and treaties.
    A desire to return to the way things once were.
    Affinity for, identification with, or embrace of Red America’s various cultural cues. (For example, gun ownership, a preference for single-family homes oriented around highways rather than urban enclaves organized around public transit, embrace of country music, disdain for arugula and fancy mustard, etc.)
    Disdain for American liberalism, multiculturalism, identity politics, affirmative action, welfare, European-style social policies, and the left and its ideas generally.
    A desire to be left alone by government, often coupled with a belief that being left alone is a natural right.
    A principled belief in federalism.
    The belief that taxes should be lower and government smaller.
    The belief that the national debt and deficits put America in peril.
    The belief that whenever possible, government budgets should be balanced.
    Consciousness of the fallibility of man, and an awareness of the value of skepticism, doubt and humility.
    Realism in foreign policy.
    Non-interventionism in foreign policy.

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  150. Ryan Sproull (7,093 comments) says:

    I can understand that, but unlike 9/11 the Gaza war is in the here and now and the enlistment of Western elites by Hamas is regarded as a key part of that war. So the propaganda can’t be ignored – even less so in a well-read blog like Kiwiblog where there is at least a chance of getting across the Israeli arguments that don’t appear in TV1, TV3, National Radio, etc.

    This has traditionally been my reason for commenting on Kiwiblog, but from the opposite perspective. I get asked by friends why I bother, and why I put up with the various kinds abuse that sometimes comes with responses to my posts, etc. I explain that for every commenter on Kiwiblog, there are probably several readers who will never comment, and are unlikely to be exposed to (what I hope are) sane and polite explanations of left-wing positions that are outside of their usual social and online circles and exposure.

    My second, complementary reason, is to ensure that I am also exposed to positions, ideas and arguments to which I would not normally be exposed in my usual social and online activities.

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  151. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Shawn L H, so e.g Fox News is not far right and Libertarians like Ron Paul generally are non critical or neutral about Obama’s policies during the Arab Spring .??

    Griff, I like the following,

    A desire to be left alone by government, often coupled with a belief that being left alone is a natural right.
    A principled belief in federalism.
    The belief that taxes should be lower and government smaller.
    The belief that the national debt and deficits put America in peril.
    The belief that whenever possible, government budgets should be balanced.

    Hardly the case under GWB and his Republican congress .!

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  152. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Stephie,

    “s o e.g Fox News is not far right”

    No. Not even close.

    “and Libertarians like Ron Paul generally are non critical or neutral about Obama’s policies during the Arab Spring .??”

    A lot of people on the right were critical, not just libertarians.

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  153. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    @Ryan Sproull, I just come here for the laughs.

    E.g from Griff: “These tests show that climate models have provided good estimates of 15-year trends, including for recent periods ”

    ROFLMAO! Which models Griff? Wasn’t it “the best 4″ of over 30 models? And did they name which 4? Because the way I read the study thay said almost 90% of CMIP models were completely useless and the rest were as useful as a coin toss.

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  154. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    Behind your saber rattling rhetoric …

    Heh, heh, heh. I almost feel sorry for you as you deploy the very same “hysterical polemics” that you whine about Far Leftists like Yoza using against you.

    In case you missed it the “sabres” consisted of US cruise missiles and other precision guided weapons – and they were not just being rattled but actually fired against Libya – by your hero Obama.

    Study e.g UN Resolution 1973 which, among other things China and Russia did not Veto …

    There you go again. I’d be careful about pushing the line on respecting UN resolutions, since many such resolutions against Israel are only held back by the US veto – and the overwhelming majority of your leftist mates regard that as criminal.

    … In this Egyptian drama, those at the White House and in Foggy Bottom were mere spectators.”

    With regard to this WaPo quote it is simply the same example of partisan blindness that you exhibit. As it happens I agree with part of it, but for more than two decades all I heard from Leftists was how Mubarak only survived because US Presidents allowed him to survive and Bush was a special target of that criticism.

    But now in the age of Obama we’re told that There are forces in distant nations that we can neither ride nor extinguish.. That’s right and I look forward to you giving a future GOP president of the US the same benefit of the doubt.

    I won’t be holding my breath.

    I shudder to think what would happen if your Sarah Palin

    Oh god.That would be the woman who said at the time of Obama’s “Red Line” incoherence: Let Allah sort them out. Yeah, she sounds like a real interventionist. Besides, although I know she’s hot, you’ve got to stop thinking about Sarah. She’s not running in 2016 so it’s probably time to drop your obsession with her.

    Finally there is this point. I actually supported Obama’s action in Libya, as I supported his decision to finally abandon Mubarak, but that does not blind me to the incompetence of how those actions were executed nor the aftermath managed – just as was the case with my support for Bush’s decision to finally take out Saddam and what followed.

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  155. Other_Andy (2,572 comments) says:

    “90% of CMIP models were completely useless”

    I disagree with that.
    Useless in which sense?
    Some activists (Suzuki), politicians (Gore) and grant-whoring consensus scientists (Gleick) have done financially extremely well from the whole scheme.
    They are laughing all the way to the bank.

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  156. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Shawn LH , and it would be interesting to find out what the right were proposing as alternatives to Obama. More direct intervention as witnessed in Iraq 2003.?

    Enlighten us please,.??

    Your view of Fox News is interesting ,

    http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Fox_News

    Hardly a radical liberal agenda there..?

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  157. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Shawn LH , and it would be interesting to find out what the right were proposing as alternatives to Obama. More direct intervention as witnessed in Iraq 2003.?”

    Well that’s the thing Stephie. There is no “the Right.” There are multiple Rights that often have very different views on issues, so which Right do you mean?

    Most of the reasonable criticisms of Obama are not always about a particular course of action, but his tendency to be half-assed, and his dithering, trying to please everyone and offend nobody. This is not a good recipe for effective action.

    “Your view of Fox News is interesting”

    It’s accurate. The term “far right” in normal usage means fascists and neo-Nazis. Fox is by US standards mainstream Right.

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  158. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    tom hunter, I do not propose to debate further with you as you about the Arab Spring and the various conspiracies and myths that it endeared especially by the far right , Fox news and you.
    At least Obama has kept the US out of another military adventure like Iraq 2003 but I can see you and the Republican far right can’t wait for much, much more .
    Possibly to be paid for by even more tax cuts and deficit financing. ?
    Sarah Palin may not be standing for 2016 but still has had a major influence on how people like you perceive the middle east and International relations.
    The Arab Spring and Benghazi is not capable of the simplistic and small minded analysis that far right partisan politicking and you would have us believe.
    You abysmal ignorance about e .g the background and causes of the Arab Spring with the over trow of Mubarak or Gadaffii come as no surprise. Your total unwillingness to e.g examine in any kind of depth the background and after math of UN Resolution 1973 is pretty typical.

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  159. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Shawn, Glenn Beck not far right .? My link and myself begs to differ on Fox News.

    http://thedailybanter.com/2013/05/5-nuttiest-glenn-beck-quotes-of-all-time/

    Now please be specific and tell us what you think the US should of done with the advent of the Arab Spring and its aftermath. ?

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  160. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    Redbaiter alert!

    Ooops, no it’s Stephie. Getting hard to tell thse two apart. :)

    You can repeat “far right” till the cows come home Stephie. It’s just an attempt to slur people without engaging with them seriously.

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  161. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Shawn, Glenn Beck not far right ”

    Glenn Beck’s no longer on Fox, and no, he was not far right. As I said, in normal usage far right refers to fascists and neo-Nazis.

    “Now please be specific and tell us what you think the US should of done with the advent of the Arab Spring and its aftermath. ?”

    Nothing. There was no advantage to the US in supporting it or opposing it. That is just my opinion, and I’m not an isolationist.

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  162. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Here’s one of my favourite explanations of Conservatism.

    I have posted it here before but seeing as you need an IQ at least above 65 to read, its apparently well beyond the comprehension of most of the uneducated dull witted Communists that frequent Kiwiblog. (Grief, Stupifiedboy, Milksop etc.)

    http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2014/01/roger-scruton-what-do-conservatives-believe.html

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  163. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Shawn LH, its not my fault that your so unexpectedly pro Fox News and Republican far right.

    Again what should the US have done say militarily in the wake of the Arab Spring that was different to Obama.??

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  164. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Only a slow witted ignoramus would post political definitions from far left web sites and think they mean something. Leftists telling us what Glen Beck is? Lefists telling us what Conservatism is?

    FFS, talk about retarded.

    You people don’t have the mental resources to tell us if its raining or sunny let alone anything about right wing politics.

    You live in a bubble, you’ve only been half educated and you know fuck all about fuck all.

    Or as Reagan said so correctly- “The trouble with Progs is not that they know so much, its more that they know so much that isn’t so.”

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  165. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    Not sure how to explain this Conservative, but it’s another wee setback. The Electoral Commission has ruled that the CP can’t use a logo with ‘Vote’ on it.

    There were 148 objections but the Commission should have ruled against it anyway.

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  166. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    I do not propose to debate further with you …

    Awwwww. Don’t be like that Stephie. We still have to tag team while we defend Israel against most of your left wing mates.

    Oh well. At least this way you can continue to rabbit on with your endlessly repeated spurts about …
    “Fox News”
    “Far Right”
    “Sarah Palin”
    “various conspiracies and myths”

    … and I can continue to make you look like a partisan tool whilst getting silence in return.

    Excellent. :)

    BTW

    …. simplistic and small minded analysis that far right partisan politicking and you would have us believe.
    You abysmal ignorance about e .g the background and causes of the Arab Spring ….

    Ahem!

    Irony – esp. Dramatic or Tragic Irony
    literary technique, originally used in Greek tragedy, by which the full significance of a character’s words or actions are clear to the audience or reader although unknown to the character.
    Oxford American Dictionary

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  167. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Glenn Beck is so far right he’s taking Teddy Bears to comfort a horde of foreign invaders.

    Fucking hopeless loons with no idea.

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  168. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    Reagan talked about ‘Progs’? Doesn’t sound right.

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  169. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    “Shawn LH, its not my fault that your so unexpectedly pro Fox News and Republican far right.”

    No, it’s your fault that you misuse terms to slur people or organizations in an unfair manner. It’s just like your repeated claim that if someone opposes Obama it’s because of racism.

    Don’t be a dick like Red, use honest arguments.

    And by US standards I’m mainstream Conservative, not “far right.”

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  170. Southern Raider (1,800 comments) says:

    Big cock up with NZ Herald posting wrong photo of NZ IDF solider that was killed by Hamas.

    Disgraceful lazy journalism just copying a photo from Facebook and assuming this is the correct person

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  171. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Idiot LW trolls spewing uninformed inaccurate crap here all day every day and attempting to call it debate.

    All it is is an illustration of what utter and complete ignoramuses the left wing faction of NZ politics is made up of.

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  172. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    Makes me wonder why you persist Reddy.

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  173. ShawnLH (4,481 comments) says:

    The US on any foreign intervention should either be all in or all out. Obama’s problem is that he cannot make up his mind, so we get the worst result, a half-in half-out dithering that is far more dangerous. This can be seen with Syria. If Obama had agreed to arm the original rebels the war would likely be over, and possibly to the West’s advantage. But instead he dithered and dithered, so the rebels went looking for help elsewhere, and Al -Qaeda saw the opportunity and jumped aboard.

    The result is ISIS.

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  174. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    :lol:
    Wrong often and other aunty with their retarded anti science nonsense
    You dont understand English to well do you right now…

    We present a more appropriate test of models where only those models with natural variability (represented by El Niño/Southern Oscillation) largely in phase with observations are selected from multi-model ensembles for comparison with observations.

    The extreme of 1998witch added an extra .35 degrees due to a massive elnino is now expected for a neutral year This means natural variability “weather effects” is overwhelmed by the warming signal.
    The effects of elnino SOI are obvious from the temperature graph with the soi highlighted http://www.realclimate.org/images/climcent_sat_enso.png
    As to your naming Gore et el
    Wingnuts do that mind trick to stop the cognitive dissonance that admitting the entire scientific community is in agreement about AGW would induce.
    What a couple of wing nuts :lol:

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  175. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Griff
    How much do you think the temperature will rise by 2100?

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  176. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “Makes me wonder why you persist Reddy.”

    You might have noticed I don’t waste too much time with open commies like you. That’s because you’re done.

    Its those who enabled you and who pose as right wingers who have always been the real problem in NZ.

    I prefer to focus on identifying and shining some light on those people. That’s really the area where we need change now.

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  177. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    And do you think you’re having any success? Record numbers of visits to your own website?

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  178. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    ROFL even more Griff:

    We present a more appropriate test of models where only those models with natural variability (represented by El Niño/Southern Oscillation) largely in phase with observations are selected from multi-model ensembles for comparison with observations.

    And they found the “best 4″ out of 38 models were “largely in phase with observations”. They wrote off 89% of the models. And you think this is proof that models have some degree of accuracy?

    Wingnut.

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  179. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “Record numbers of visits to your own website?”

    See?

    That is what I mean by the knuckle dragging black hole stupidity that typifies left wingers.

    Utter inability to apply reason to any situation.

    Why would people visit a website everyday when it is only updated at random monthly intervals. You expect them to read the same stuff over and over again? Pray tell.

    The real issue is that fools like you have been beaten down to the bottom of the political ladder and its time to send your enablers down there too.

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  180. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    So how do you measure your success? Upticks?

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  181. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    How do you measure your lack of it?

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  182. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Griff? Griff?
    Don’t need any links, just what you think.

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  183. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    I’m not the one on a crusade against the modern world. I accept reality.

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  184. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/2014/5
    Global Highlights
    The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for May 2014 was record highest for this month, at 0.74°C (1.33°F) above the 20th century average of 14.8°C (58.6°F).

    http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/
    Global Highlights
    The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for June 2014 was the highest on record for the month, at 0.72°C (1.30°F) above the 20th century average of 15.5°C (59.9°F).

    The same website is quoting two different figures for the 20th century average temperature. What’s up with that, and which is the real one? Or is this a simple misquote?

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  185. stephieboy (2,678 comments) says:

    Ah Shawn LH, you’d be wrong there. Obama did seek congress backing to intervene in Syria but was met with instead the ” Anti Obama Reflex “,

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/09/03/syria-and-the-conservative-anti-obama-reflex/195704

    The result not ISIS but your partisan BS, IMHO.!

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  186. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    How much co2 do you think we will add to the atmosphere by 2100?
    At preset rates we will blow past doubling pre industrial co2 by 2050 that’s around +3C +-1 for double according to the IPCC
    with no change in the growth of emissions we will double that again by 2100 so that’s around +6C+-2 by 2100.

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  187. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    tom
    Maybe it’s May versus June averages.

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  188. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “I accept reality.”

    You wouldn’t know reality if it was chewing your commie arse off.

    Almost every comment you make here demonstrates that fact.

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  189. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    I’m not the one living out a fantasy where my comments on a blog contribute to a global revolution (or whatever you call it).

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  190. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Ok, well IPCC WG1 from AR5 gives the range for doubling of CO2 at 2-6 but ok, you reckon a 6 degree K rise (+ or -2) over the next 84 years.
    I guess we will see. Considering CO2 has been rising consistently and the temp has hardly moved for 17 odd years I suspect you are praying for an El Niño.

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  191. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    @tom hunter, homogenisation adjustments ;)

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  192. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Its the months average global temperature Tom The northern hemisphere effects temperature more than the mostly ocean southern hemisphere hence its cooler globally in the northern winter
    20th century average of 12.0°C January
    20th century average of 15.5°C for June
    20th century average of 15.8°C for July
    20th century average of 12.2°C December

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  193. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    “I’m not the one living out a fantasy where my comments on a blog contribute to a global revolution (or whatever you call it).”

    Its no fantasy that the hard left (that’s you) are fucked.

    I was delivered exactly the same criticisms from the left when I started my crusade against them. On usenet they would not even accept the use of the term left. So fuck ‘em. Look where they are now. That’s the fucking reality loser.

    You have to throw stones to get the pond to ripple, and ripple it sure has.

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  194. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    How’s that ‘crusade’ going then?

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  195. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Right Now
    The margin of error on Stevenson temperature measuring screens range from .8 to 2 degrees K. They are pointless and it’s a farce that results are produced to tenths of a degree.
    Even Best acknowledge it and it’s only now that NOAA are introducing a network of new gauges and that’s only in the US. It just makes me laugh when warmists use the numbers. And of course the homogenisation is just an even bigger joke. And they call Rolf Harris a fiddler!

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  196. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    What’s it like down there in the sewers with all the other LW rats?

    You’re a bubble living Prog Milksop- that’s why you’ve ended up in a hole and that’s why you cannot detect the growing wave of discontent with parties like National, The Republicans and the UK Conservatives.

    Its only a matter of time and the enablers in those parties will be down there with you.

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  197. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    Ouch, that hurts.

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  198. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    you are praying for an El Niño.

    I dont want the temperature to rise ! it is of that there is no doubt
    The southern osculation index. it causes temperature to osculate about the norm it eventually averages out to 0 over around thirty years That is why to make sense of the trend in the short term record you must allow for its effects
    Also when looking at climate models you must allow for the state of the soi that is the message in the abstract I linked to.

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  199. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    the ” Anti Obama Reflex “,

    Well aside from ye old warmonger John McCain, who’s always gagging to attack Middle Eastern countries if I remember my 2008 Obama partisan rhetoric correctly.

    Then there’s that hardline partisan group of RWNJ known as Moveon.org: Say “No!” to US strikes on Syria!

    It’s not a problem in any case since Obama said that First of all, I didn’t set a red line; the world set a red line., and it was the world that turned out to have an anti Obama reflex, which appears to be spreading.

    Mediamatters.com should just rename themselves as Chucklethon.com.

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  200. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    Ah. Thanks for that Griff.

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  201. stigie (1,063 comments) says:

    Hey Milky, you need to except that Reddy thinks you are a prog,knuckledragging communist coward just like me and all rest of us that dont go along with his way of thinking !~

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  202. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    From Key presser:

    The prime minister has confirmed that at the end of the day the voters are the people that determine who is in parliament.

    Key says on deals he prefers to work with Act UF and Maori.

    Prime Minister John Key has officially announced he’ll do electorate deals with Peter Dunne in Ohariu and ACT in Epsom.

    Key announces National will do a deal with ACT in Epsom and United Future in Ohariu. No deal with Conservatives in ECB.

    As expected.

    Nats “carefully considered” Conservatives in ECB. Pulling McCully out “a bridge too far”. Could work together if they get into Parliament

    Would consider working with conservatives however, and NZFirst should the form part of the next parliament

    “There’s not going to be a last-minute change of mind.” – Key on East Coast Bays.

    Key rules out changing mind and pulling McCully at last minute, even if could mean the difference in returning as Govt.

    John Key says he won’t change his mind on East Coast Bays leading up to the election – even if conservatives are polling close to 5 pc

    BREAKING: Key pronounces “Ohariu” correctly several times. A double coup for @PeterDunneMP

    Key not following his own advice. Will vote two ticks blue in Epsom.

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  203. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    I’m just not feeling the love in here at the moment!

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  204. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Griff
    ENSO is very complex. They are really only starting to understand how it works, it’s drivers and how it link to other oceanic currents/ systems.
    I read a lot of what Bob Tisdale has done and think he’s one of the best, even though he posts on a wing nut denier right wing nut bar web site.(tm griff)
    Ever read any of his stuff?

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  205. Redbaiter (8,318 comments) says:

    Its not hard to detect a Progressive Stoogie.

    The most common denominator is a very under -developed ability in comprehension.

    Its the result of a schooling system converted from an education facility to a progressive induction process. The less you know and the less ability you have to think critically, the more valuable you are to the socialist system.

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  206. Colville (2,252 comments) says:

    PG @ 4.05

    The position Key has taken WRT the Cons is a peace offering to Winston, paving the way to a deal after the votes have been counted.

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  207. stigie (1,063 comments) says:

    Its ok Judith, Johnboy will be along shortly to make you feel loved… hes really good at that !~

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  208. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    At the risk of being picky Griff, it’s oscillation not osculation.
    http://bobtisdale.wordpress.com/2014/01/10/an-illustrated-introduction-to-the-basic-processes-that-drive-el-nino-and-la-nina-events/

    It gets more advanced. Natures cooling system

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  209. Pete George (23,429 comments) says:

    He’s certainly keeping that option open Colville, as unpalatable as it may be.

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  210. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    The margin of error on Stevenson temperature measuring screens range from .8 to 2 degrees K. They are pointless and it’s a farce that results are produced to tenths of a degree.

    it is not the actual temperature its the anomaly you are measuring
    The trend from the gauges tells us temperatures are rising that you refuse to except that us why i call you a wing nut.

    You quote rss and its measurement in your “no rise for seventeen years” yet again yet you are not even aware of what rss measures and the trend derived from the rss measurements that’s is the most important from the satellites to prove of agw
    http://images.remss.com/msu/msu_time_series.html
    That is the trend in the stratosphere c14 of -.76K decade.

    Bob Tisdale :lol:
    magic thinking dude

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  211. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    David Garrett (6,395 comments) says:

    “July 28th, 2014 at 12:52 pm

    Sorry if someone has already posted this…

    A home invader in Napier got more than he bargained for when he attacked a bloke in his own home with a hammer…while the bloke was actually in bed FFS…

    Victim turned the tables on invader, who is now in hospital in a critical condition…Perfect illustration of the “castle doctrine”…invade someone’s house = get what is meted out to you….Hope the cops have the good sense not to charge the house owner….”

    Cops and good sense don’t go together. Only the NZ Police have the right to use weapons in self-defence, everyone knows that!

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  212. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    Griff:

    You dont understand English to well do you right now

    The southern osculation index. it causes temperature to osculate about the norm it eventually averages out to 0 over around thirty years That is why to make sense of the trend in the short term record you must allow for its effects

    Oh Griff! You’re so adorable I could osculate you!

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  213. Fletch (6,251 comments) says:

    According to the IPCC report itself, the temp isn’t predicted to rise that much.
    According to the latest report, it might rise 0.7 deg C at the most

    “Overall, in the absence of major volcanic eruptions – which would cause significant but temporary cooling – and, assuming no significant future long term changes in solar irradiance, it is likely (>66% probability) that the GMST [global mean surface temperature] anomaly for the period 2016–2035, relative to the reference period of 1986–2005, will be in the range 0.3°C–0.7°C (expert assessment, to one significant figure; medium confidence).” (IPCC, 2013, p. 11-52).

    The warming is more likely to be at the lower end of the range [equivalent to about 0.4 Cº over 30 years]. If that rate continued till 2100, global warming this century could be as little as 1.3 Cº.

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  214. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    yip a spell checking derived typo
    so funny right now
    Not as funny as wingnuts and their global conspiracy theory

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  215. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    Thousands of no-hopers invade: http://www.wnd.com/2014/07/children-crossing-border-obama-will-take-care-of-us/

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  216. Viking2 (11,367 comments) says:

    dime (9,422 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 11:06 am

    Dime listened to ZB from about 730-840 this morning.

    JK was on doing his thing. Happy as usual.

    The only thing I heard from Labour was that godawful Cosgrove complaining about CERA?! spending “an extreme” 1.8 mill on flights.

    Don’t get me wrong, it probably is up there and i don’t trust public servants. However, we are 50odd days out from the election and that’s the only message they got though on a monday morning. more bleating about crap.

    How can these fuckers not understand that the majority of voters are sick of hearing negative crap from them?

    I guess its just a reflection of who they are inside. Desperately unhappy losers.
    ===========================
    Ha dime; heard that myself and thought that someone should add up all the flights that fuck knuckle plughead has ever taken between CHCH and Wellington on our behalf and let him know that the total amount was not only a waste of taxpayers money but a fraud upon th taxpayers as well for he is of no use to any taxpayer.

    would make great fodder for a parliamentary question.

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  217. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    yip a spell checking derived typo
    so funny right now

    I know, it’s very childish of me to still be laughing about it, but the fact you actually bolded the word to give it emphasis was just too good to let pass.

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  218. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    “Conservation Minister Nick Smith is considering legal action after he was accused of trying to stop advocacy group Fish and Game from lobbying for cleaner rivers.

    Dr Smith attended a meeting with Fish and Game Council, an independent advocacy group, on July 18.”

    “considering legal action”

    Threatening legal action is a form of bullying is it not?

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  219. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    @ jackinabox (576 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 4:37 pm

    Yes it is, but reading what Dr Smith said to them, requesting them to stop doing what they are legislated to do, I’m not surprised they are complaining. Smith clearly thinks he’s above the law, so its a bit of a laugh that he’s calling on it in an attempt to distract from his appalling domination attempts.

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  220. Exclamation Mark (85 comments) says:

    Tarquin North (126 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:45 am
    Am I the only person who hates the exclusive brethren? Why do they get charitable status when they are nothing but lying hypocrites? I don’t mind competition but the playing field should be level. I didn’t mind them when they were just a bunch of inbreds selling home made furniture to each other, but now they are running large companies bringing in crap from China at rate that would make the Warehouse blush. I’ve sold to brethren companies for the last 12 years and watched them slowly bend there own rules. We are the unclean and there mission is to screw us. If they paid tax and adheared to the rules like the rest of us I wouldn’t mind but they don’t. Trust me, these businesses are growing like topsy on the backs of ordinary kiwis and their charitable status should be wiped. This should be an election issue – they don’t even vote!

    You aren’t alone – talk to any business owner that has an Exclusive Brethren competitor and you will get inundated with accounts of almost unbelievable skulduggery and dodginess.

    I can totally understand the right-wing blogoshphere siding with the EBs over the election pamphlet thing but if people knew what this Mob (with a deliberate capital ‘M’)got up to, they would be shocked.

    Tarquin: I encourage you to bring this up on Whale Oil where it can probably be more fully discussed.

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  221. Longknives (4,686 comments) says:

    “So what happened to the self crowned “worlds greatest rugby nation”?”

    Bruv you will be shocked to know they are griping and complaining about the Ref all over talkback….

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  222. cricko (290 comments) says:

    Viking2 @ 4.27

    Says.
    “Would make great fodder for a parliamentary question.”

    OK V2, Care to give us an example of the kind of question you had in mind, and who you would
    direct it to.

    Or, are you just full of it, as usual ?

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  223. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Griff
    “The trend from the gauges tells us temperatures are rising that you refuse to except that us why i call you a wing nut.”

    Don’t say I ” refuse to accept” that Griff. It’s just not true. I have always acknowledged the temp has risen and have described myself as a “Lukewarmer” several times. Lukewarmer because I don’t think it’s going to rise as much as you do. I have stated to you on numerous occasions I think that sensitivity is around 1.3 and not 3 like you think. Ok?
    And I’m not the only one here who thinks that.
    That’s what we disagree on so no need to be insulting with your wing nut labels.

    Edit, just saw Fletchs post- I agree

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  224. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    I found this really good article today –

    “Ten Reasons Why I Am No Longer a Leftist” –
    http://www.americanthinker.com/2014/07/ten_reasons_i_am_no_longer_a_leftist.html

    I liked the bit on “selective outrage” –

    Quote – “I was an active leftist for decades. I never witnessed significant leftist outrage over clitoredectomy, child marriage, honor killing, sharia-inspired rape laws, stoning, or acid attacks. Nothing. Zip. Crickets. I’m not saying that that outrage does not exist. I’m saying I never saw it.”

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  225. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    As I said a wingnut denier trying to hide his anti science behind weasel bullshiting

    The ipcc gives 1.5 to 4.5 with 3 as the most likely
    That is a range supported by actual scientific papers not bullshit from some wingnut blog
    You are well under their minimum with 1.3 where do you get your figure from wwwnumberssoutyourarse.com ?
    give me a link else its just more made up bullshit

    The problem with Fletchs post are in two forms
    If you had a luke warm IQ you would work them out for your self

    1 his maths sucks

    2 It has taken us almost two hundred years to add 160ppm we will add another 120 in the next thirty, another 520 in the next fifty after that. if we continue business as usual. This is not a liner rise in co2 and the temperature rise will not be liner also.

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  226. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    And since there was some mild discussion about the Libya clusterfuck earlier today there’s this from Obama voter (but not a braindead partisan), Russell Mead:

    But luckily for Team Obama, the mainstream press would rather die than subject liberal Democrats to the critiques it reserves for the GOP. So instead, as Libya writhes in agony, reputations and careers move on. The news is so bad, and the President’s foreign policy is collapsing on so many fronts, that it is impossible to keep the story off the front pages. “Smart diplomacy” has become a punch line, and the dream Team Obama had of making Democrats the go-to national security party is as dead as the passenger pigeon. But what the press can do for the White House it still, with some honorable exceptions, labors to accomplish: it will, when it must, report the dots. But it will try not to connect them, and it will do what it can to let all the people involved in the Libya debacle move on to the next and higher stage of their careers.

    Smart Power!

    I wonder if Mead would like to have back his vote for Obama in 2008, and likely 2012 as well.

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  227. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Griff
    I pick 1.3 . Pretty close to 1.5 huh. You’re such a dumb cunt.
    See, anyone can do insults. It’s also linear not ” liner”

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  228. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    Watched TV1 tonight and saw some raghead muslim newbie NZ moaning about gaza and the nasty ISRAELIES so i rang TVI news and the phone was answered by a team member called mohammened,fuck its normaly a indian now the face of TV1 is a muslim the jews dont stand a chance

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  229. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    You must have missed the bit where the family’s daughter wished for peace for both sides.

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  230. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Dear dear losing the plot and getting all wobbly
    :lol:

    shall I go to DPF and do the blub blub like you? Am I a little kiddy who runs to mummy ?

    Nope I will just keep pointing out you are a wingnut in denial. Making fun of you saves me the cost of pot :lol: as laughter at your wobbly reasoning and stupid links to a known idiot like Tisdale is more fun than the munches.
    1.3 is not any where near 1.5 to 4.5 most probably 3 math challenged wingnut
    Where are the links ? Or as I suspect its the old www:factsoutanidiotsasre.com.
    I will help you The crap you want comes from a post on GWPF a wingnut blog site.

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  231. tom hunter (4,695 comments) says:

    Oh christ, and here’s another one. Yes, this one is partisan, it’s a Republican member of Congress who’s retiring, Armed Services Committee chairman Buck McKeon. He’s responding to a letter sent earlier in the day by National Security Advisor Susan Rice, requesting that Congress repeal the 2002 law authorizing the use of military force in Iraq:

    Obama Administration officials are warning us daily that the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria is ‘”worse than al-Qaeda” and an extreme threat to the American people.
    ….
    Why on earth is the President’s national security adviser pleading with Congress to help build Americans’ confidence that the President will not confront a clear and present danger to the United States? He needs no help there. Where is her plan to stop this looming threat? Where is her request for additional intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance assets to monitor the situation? Why isn’t she over here, building support to stop a common enemy? Why is she fighting Congress instead of ISIS? Why on earth is she refighting the 2003 Iraq War in 2014?

    This isn’t just absurd. We’re past absurd. This is dangerous. This Administration is fiddling while the world burns, and now they’re demanding Congress play with them.

    If the Administration fought terrorists with half the tenacity they fight straw men, we wouldn’t be in this mess.

    Never a truer word than that last one. Fuck this is bad.

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  232. dad4justice (8,062 comments) says:

    “shall I go to DPF and do the blub blub like you? Am I a little kiddy who runs to mummy ?”

    But last night Gripp you threatened to do just that. A bit of advice nerd, to be a good liar you must have a good memory.

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  233. Reid (16,224 comments) says:

    Reid is wrong, but then he gets his “theology” from youtube videos, so no surprise there.

    No I don’t actually Shawn. I’ve read the Bible from cover to cover seven times and then I started really getting into the detail of each and every chapter which is why I recommended David Pawson. But I came across him 25 years after I’d already acquainted myself with the basics.

    How many times have you read it, from cover to cover?

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  234. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Oh look loony stalker dude is attacking me.
    Missing big bruv loony stalker ?
    No threat on my behalf just a general warning that if someone did inform dpf there would be repercussions
    I dont tell tales as a rule not being a blub blub like a certain whining wing nut.

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  235. dad4justice (8,062 comments) says:

    “I dont tell tales as a rule”

    Hahahahahaha coming from a certifiable climate change loon. Gawd help me hahahaha………………………..thanks for the laugh………….hahaha…………………..priceless comedy.

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  236. cricko (290 comments) says:

    lurcher1948

    then we have the likes of, ….(Well you insert the name of the fuckwit of your choice.)
    Or even worse, the likes of one such as Reid
    fuckwits such as these may come to their senses as their muslim ‘mates’ crucify them.
    As they hang on the cross they will scream, “But, I was your mate.”

    Even then they may not get it.

    Edit: “Will” not get it. Are not capable of getting it.

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  237. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Hollow sound there loony stalker dude.
    but like someone whose afraid of the dark.
    The thing is your and others attacks on me as a loony when it comes to climate change are quite funny when I have the backing of every major scientific body in the world.
    Sorta gives me a certain license to write such posts of as the waffle of a obviously deranged mind dont ya thunk?

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  238. Yoza (1,777 comments) says:

    cricko (195 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 7:19 pm

    lurcher1948

    then we have the likes of, ….(Well you insert the name of the fuckwit of your choice.)
    Or even worse, the likes of one such as Reid
    fuckwits such as these may come to their senses as their muslim ‘mates’ crucify them.
    As they hang on the cross they will scream, “But, I was your mate.”

    Even then they may not get it.

    Edit: “Will” not get it. Are not capable of getting it.

    So you have abandoned your attempt to pretend you are reasonable and are going with the rabid bigot now.

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  239. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Griff

    I see you have a new bestie. You are welcome to him. :)

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  240. cricko (290 comments) says:

    Yoza
    Happy to discuss.
    Thing is, do you have a point ?
    Duh !
    Are you able to articulate your point ?

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  241. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Has anyone said that you dont need to sort out a team of National Party Activists to pop round drawing beards and moustaches on Labour Party election hoardings.

    All their wimmen and most of their men have them already…boom..boom! :)

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  242. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    Thanks but no thanks .
    I have my own stalkers already. Some wing nuts read every one of my posts just to pick up on my often funny typos
    Not quite as mad as your bestie but give them time I say.
    Still I wear a personal stalker fan base as a true badge of honer on kb.
    shows you get right up their noses.

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  243. cricko (290 comments) says:

    Now there is a sage comment that should bring us all back to reality, thanks Johnboy.
    Onya.

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  244. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Slipping into the absurd is par for the course here cricko old chap!

    Glad to see you can recognise the onset of reality! :)

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  245. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    cricko

    Have you got over the fact that the self proclaimed “worlds greatest rugby team” got beaten this morning?

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  246. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Speaking of nutters. I see Phil the Magpie got his tailfeathers singed at that pizza oven of logical thinking “The Stranded” today.

    Miracles can happen folks! :)

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  247. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Johnboy

    In what thread did Phool get a kicking?

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  248. dad4justice (8,062 comments) says:

    The Crusaders booked a place in the Super Rugby final when they beat the Sharks 38-6 in their Semi . Great odds were had for any sport bet that went with the 13 plus win option. Money for nothing. Double up on this weeks game and off on another holiday. So easy thanks Canterbury.

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  249. cricko (290 comments) says:

    big bruv

    so far New Zealand have done very well in the Commonweath Games.
    We are producing at or well above our weight per capita so far and much more to come.

    Why do you delight in disrespecting our team and by extention yourself ?

    I do not get it.
    Can you explain ?

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  250. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    They all look the same to me bb. I think it was their version of GD.

    Do I detect a faint hint of a magpie stalker here? :)

    Give it away old chap. I feed Phillup, Phillus and Phillit the child these days.

    I saved Phillit from the 11000 volts a few months ago! :)

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  251. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Johnboy

    Did you manage to make $20,000 on the rugby on Saturday night?

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  252. dirty harry (446 comments) says:

    That pot smoking bus driving smelly hippy Phool..oh how I miss him , I wonder if he’s still busy in the kitchen cooking…

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  253. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    cricko

    So if I am not a raving fan of the NZ rugby team I am disrespecting myself?

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  254. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Petty cash is of no interest to me bb.

    However I will derive interest from watching milkey eat shit next Saturday if that should come to pass! :)

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  255. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Johnboy, not sure if you are going to want this but I am fully behind Wainui for this game. For this week and this week only the can assume the mantle of ‘Mighty’

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  256. Dean Papa (787 comments) says:

    Intercepted Israeli military communication ..

    IDF tank commander: Sh!t, we just fired on a school. HQ come in….
    IDF HQ: HQ here
    IDF tank commander: We just fired on a school, there are going to be civilian casualties
    IDF HQ: Did you see enemy activity in the area before firing?
    IDF tank commander: Negative
    IDF HQ: Yes you did soldier. So I’ll ask again, did you see enemy activity in the area before firing?
    IDF tank commander: Affirmative

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  257. Reid (16,224 comments) says:

    Edit: “Will” not get it. Are not capable of getting it.

    That’s what I think about you guys cricko, who support state-sponsored murder.

    The thing none of you seem capable of wrapping your clearly tiny minds around, is the fact that just because people are against your beloved state which sponsors murder, this doesn’t mean they’re in favour of anyone else who is committing clear wrong against that state.

    But you’re not capable of drawing that distinction, are you.

    Which my friend, demonstrates something very profound about the emotional basis of your position, as opposed to a logical basis.

    In other words, you and all others who think like you do on this issue, are being played like violins, and you’re all too fucking dumb to know it.

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  258. dirty harry (446 comments) says:

    back to the marae with you papa..youre talkin out ya arse again ? Are you out on bail ?

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  259. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    If it’s any help to you in your grief bb I really felt for Mighty Ories as the pretend Catholics put them to the sword! Sob!!

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  260. cricko (290 comments) says:

    big bruv
    Disrespecting yourself ? Who knows ? Probably.
    The Question is, why would you, take such a unique perspective and consistantly put down your national team ?
    Why ?
    Who else on earth shits on themselves ?

    Why do you do it ?

    You tell us.

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  261. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    phillip ure 12.1
    28 July 2014 at 9:29 am

    we have been ‘at war’ since clark/goff signed us up for the invasion/occupation of afghanistan..

    ..we are eager spear-carriers in americas’ long-war…

    (this has long been our role/place in the world..first for britain..and now for america..)

    ..and we are now a vassal-state of america..(as we were once a vassal-state for britain..until they told us to just piss-off!..(what world wars sacrifices..?..)

    ..and as the snowden/greenwald/dotcom data/secrets-drop will clearly show..

    ..that is how they view/treat us..

    ..any ideas of our sovereignty as a nation are just a joke..to america..

    ..and we need to take our country back..

    Round about here bb! :)

    It went downhill and he fucked off to lick his wounds! :)

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  262. cricko (290 comments) says:

    Hey Reid,

    As your muslim mates crucify you as an infidel what will your last words be ?

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  263. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    Is that your fantasy martyr’s death, cricko?

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  264. Dean Papa (787 comments) says:

    There has been an interesting development concerning the identity of the racist lawyer. I have been tossing up whether to reveal what I have been told in here, or to send the the information on to the NZ Law Society.

    Now, a poster in here has said to me -what does it matter if a lawyer is a racist anymore than a mechanic or a plumber? The point of difference is that with a lawyer, you are handing over your trust, in dealing with your personal information and confidences. It is a special relationship, one that you do not have with your plumber.

    What if you are an Arab-New Zealander, or even a Palestinian New Zealander? How would you feel if the lawyer you have put your trust in regards you as a “rag-head”. I believe this to be an issue that is far from trivial.

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  265. nasska (11,154 comments) says:

    “It’s sodomy. It isn’t gay love, it isn’t natural, it isn’t acceptable in the eyes of the Lord, it isn’t right,” roared the priest from the pulpit.

    “And it isn’t my turn this week,” shouted a choirboy from the back of the church.

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  266. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Cicko

    Because I detest nationalism, I also detest arrogance in sporting teams and their supporters.

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  267. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    You will get demerits from DPF if you start spraying guesses about Kiwibloggers’ identities.

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  268. cricko (290 comments) says:

    pathetic mikenmild,

    even you rose to a laughable cringewothy new low with your 8.28

    Wanna argue the point ?

    Will you tell on us to the teacher, you sick fuck ?

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  269. mikenmild (11,246 comments) says:

    What point were you trying to make, cricko?

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  270. Reid (16,224 comments) says:

    As your muslim mates crucify you as an infidel what will your last words be ?

    Forgive them Father for they know not what they do.

    Same as I say about you guys, cricko.

    Why?

    BTW, to cricko and the two others who gave him an uptick on his last comment: is it possible for someone to be both against Israel and terrorists who attack Israel at one and the same time?

    Yes or no?

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  271. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Any of you chaps follow Derryn Hinch’s blog? :)

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  272. dad4justice (8,062 comments) says:

    I do Johnboy why?

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  273. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    If you do you’ll know why dad.

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  274. freemark (561 comments) says:

    Griff desperately hoping the earth will burn so he can feel “right”
    Papa Dean spouting shit about the peace wanting Israelis & the child murdering Hamas again..
    Now where is that other alleged “victim” & her lying man-hating supporters?
    The NZ Left..pure fucking comedy gold, who needs the Commonwealth Games?

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  275. dad4justice (8,062 comments) says:

    Johnboy – Are you referring to the ex All Black and the Queenstown incident? That’s old news. I could say more but my fan club would nark me off to Farrar faster than Klarkula late for a rugby match.

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  276. Johnboy (15,903 comments) says:

    Well up you Mr. Knowitall! :)

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  277. cricko (290 comments) says:

    Lets tell it like it is.
    http://www.zoklet.net/bbs/showthread.php?t=279298

    Did Viking2 die in his arse ?

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  278. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    :lol;
    I searched the lawyer years ago
    He is as far as I can tell retired.
    There are references to him on the web and in blogs.
    As you admitted hes anonymous . Anyone of us using names could be who we say or a ring in.
    you would need to actually get the IP address of dpf to prove its him.
    Chance of that happening are zero . I believe it highly likely that you would need to have a legal warrant to get such information and even then you would be buying into a fight with a man who has numerous lawyers who comment on this blog who would work pro bono.
    but please try. I think you would find the same result as if one of us named who the McD clown is.
    Even though many of us know to name him is an instant demerit if not a ban

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  279. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Papa Dean spouting shit about the peace wanting Israelis & the child murdering Hamas again..

    It Turns Out Hamas Didn’t Kidnap and Kill the 3 Israeli Teens After All
    http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/07/hamas-didnt-kidnap-the-israeli-teens-after-all.html

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  280. freemark (561 comments) says:

    This essay is especially for the deluded Alarmists.
    http://www.nzcpr.com/cool-it/#more-11621

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  281. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    mikenmild (10,686 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:33 pm
    You will get demerits from DPF if you start spraying guesses about Kiwibloggers’ identities.

    But its still okay if we imagine them sitting at their keyboards naked, isn’t it, or will that get us demerit points too?

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  282. RF (1,368 comments) says:

    Johnboy. I am a poor sad lonely soul apart from my pet lamb that tries to kick me out of the bed. I have just realised I spend my spare time giving you thumbs up for the most diverse threads. The more scotch I drink the more I am inclined to troll back through old postings to find your posts to give the thumbs up.

    I guess its time to get rid of my lamb. Do you have a sister ?

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  283. nasska (11,154 comments) says:

    Since this is a family blog Judith we can’t show gratuitous nudity but this should give you the idea. :)

    Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/jvw3nesc5z04ope/Wankstain%203.jpg

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  284. freemark (561 comments) says:

    UglyTruth (3,980 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:55 pm

    Gosh, a “lone cell”

    You dumb fuck, do you think that much goes on without the express or tacit approval of Hamas..or that it is easily just another little red – herring put out as the thinking world is realising that they are being conned by your mates?
    Lot’s of blood on your hands Ugly.. you cheer those that sacrifice their own children, ensuring that they will happily slaughter more of them.
    Why don’t you go over and take up arms..fire rockets from a hospital, a school, a house..to deliberately target Israeli civilians, and deliberately place Palestinian civilians in the firing line..
    Fucking scum…

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  285. stigie (1,063 comments) says:

    Is that Reddy Nasska ?

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  286. nasska (11,154 comments) says:

    I can neither confirm nor deny stigie. :)

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  287. big bruv (13,702 comments) says:

    Judith

    I am sure that Johnboy imagines you sitting at you keyboard naked.

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  288. Maggy Wassilieff (325 comments) says:

    @ Griff 4.00pm; All-on-red 4:12pm; RightNow 4:16pm
    Romance and Climate…
    Dear readers.. forgive me for taking the piss… but Griff may be on to something … only trouble is we need a hypothetical planet (Z), that has to mysteriously disappear …. but it fits the facts (and is probably peer-reviewed too)

    http://arxiv.org/pdf/astro-ph/9909464.pdf

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  289. Judith (8,532 comments) says:

    nasska (10,659 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 9:05 pm
    Since this is a family blog Judith…

    There is no way you want my family here – hell I come here to escape them!

    It’s really hard to take anyone seriously when you imagine them typing away butt nekkid. :-)

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  290. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    You dumb fuck, do you think that much goes on without the express or tacit approval of Hamas..

    According to Rosenfeld it does. Do you know better, dipshit?

    The Israeli Police Foreign Press Spokesman, Micky Rosenfeld, appears to have falsified the Israeli government’s claim that Hamas was responsible for the killing of three Israeli settler teens in June, by saying responsibility lies with a lone cell that operated without the complicity of Hamas’ leadership.
    http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2014/Jul-26/265229-hamas-not-complicit-in-teens-kidnap-israeli-police.ashx#axzz38kjuJXPD

    or that it is easily just another little red – herring put out as the thinking world is realising that they are being conned by your mates?

    Who do you think my mates are, and what do you think the “con” is?

    Lot’s of blood on your hands Ugly..

    How’s that? Pointing out that the whole sick episode was based on a fiction is hardly a form of support for the violence.

    you cheer those that sacrifice their own children, ensuring that they will happily slaughter more of them.

    Fuck you, freemark. I do no such thing.

    Why don’t you go over and take up arms..fire rockets from a hospital, a school, a house..to deliberately target Israeli civilians, and deliberately place Palestinian civilians in the firing line..

    Because that would mean acting against my core values.

    Fucking scum…

    You stupid fuck, freemark, did you even understand what I wrote?

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  291. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Seriously, how fucking retarded do you have to be to come to the conclusion that I support Hamas just because I support the position that they were falsely accused of the original crime that led to the violence?

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  292. freemark (561 comments) says:

    Ugly.
    You don’t write, fool. I’m not sure you can even think for yourself- all you do is regurgitate, parrot & post links from similarly brainwashed idiots.
    “Because that would mean acting against my core values” you mean Cowardice..like your Hamas mates who hide behind women & children..or do you deny that?
    “Who do you think my mates are, and what do you think the “con” is?” – your mates are similarly deluded lefties, the con is that 1000’s of civilians are being murdered, or that Israel is the aggressor.
    The blood of the innocents is on your hands.. with every comment in support of the murderers, more blood.
    Proud of yourself are you?

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  293. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    freemark (443 comments) says:
    July 28th, 2014 at 8:59 pm
    You my friend are the deluded wingnut
    I have already referenced the gwpf today I am extremely well informed about the idiot fringe that you guys get your misinformation from.
    Watch this its the reason why I think you lot are nuts
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cjuGCJJUGsg

    Doctor Wassilieff
    very dry
    but you lose to me to often for someone of your education compared to my lack of. :lol:
    Real climate: from real climate scientists the comments in Unforced variations are well worth perusing for a synapse of the latest research and debate from those in the field.
    http://www.realclimate.org/
    Open mind for clearly presented statistical analysis and demolishing of many wingnut talking points and the idiots who post them
    http://tamino.wordpress.com/
    Skeptical science with a linked to published papers rebuttal of all wingnut arguments in graded degrees of difficulty
    http://www.skepticalscience.com/
    If after perusing these sites for a reasonable time you still doubt at least you will be a truly informed skeptic

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  294. itstricky (1,770 comments) says:

    What if you are an Arab-New Zealander, or even a Palestinian New Zealander? How would you feel if the lawyer you have put your trust in regards you as a “rag-head”. I believe this to be an issue that is far from trivial.

    I dunno. Why don’t you ask David Garrett, he seems to have a predilection for making such statements.

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  295. itstricky (1,770 comments) says:

    The blood of the innocents is on your hands.. with every comment in support of the murderers, more blood.
    Proud of yourself are you?

    I guess neither of you wonder whether calling each other sweeping statements like “fucking stupid” “scum” “murderer” “blood on your hands” “you stupid fuck” etc no matter who is right, or who started it, is what causes wars in the first place?

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  296. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Ugly.
    You don’t write, fool. I’m not sure you can even think for yourself- all you do is regurgitate, parrot & post links from similarly brainwashed idiots.

    If I can’t write then what have you been reponding to, fuckwit?
    I do a lot more that repost other material, as you will find out if you don’t run from this argument.

    “Because that would mean acting against my core values” you mean Cowardice..like your Hamas mates who hide behind women & children..or do you deny that?

    By core values I mean honour and respect for justice.
    Hamas are not my mates, freemark. Seriously, you are the most stupid fuck I have ever met on kiwiblog.

    “Who do you think my mates are, and what do you think the “con” is?” – your mates are similarly deluded lefties, the con is that 1000′s of civilians are being murdered, or that Israel is the aggressor.

    What delusion? I have never suggested that 1000’s of civilians are being murdered in Gaza. The axe that I have to grind is with the Zionist state called Israel, which has a history of betrayal and violence – The Lavon Affair, the attack on the USS Liberty, the Sabra and Shatilla massacres, and the 9/11 terrorism.

    The blood of the innocents is on your hands.. with every comment in support of the murderers, more blood.

    What comment of mine do you think supports murder?

    Proud of yourself are you?

    Yes, I am, you useless fucking moron.

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  297. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    But its still okay if we imagine them sitting at their keyboards naked, isn’t it, or will that get us demerit points too?

    No demerits, it just perpetuates NZ’s rape culture. [edit: should that be alleged rape culture? Oh why won't someone just tell me what I'm meant to think?]

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  298. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    itstricky, do people who make false accusations about the murder of innocents deserve abuse or not?

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  299. Maggy Wassilieff (325 comments) says:

    @Griff…. I only use my academic title when booking flights…. Maggy suffices everywhere else.
    I don’t play competitive games… so no winners or losers in my little sphere.
    I do like wordplay though…… even better when it has some relevance to my interests.

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  300. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    Maggy, will you give us a brief critique of Griff’s links pretty please?

    Then I have some links for Griff to critique, they’re to catholic church senior clergy, among whom there’s 97% consensus that we’re all by our own actions doomed to a fiery climate in hell.
    It seems there’s some wingnut deniers that dispute that, but they’re not senior catholic clergy so we can disregard them. The point is there’s a consensus among the exclusive group of experts and unless we change our (but not their) evil ways (except the senior clergy, they’re exempt) then we’ll all fry!

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  301. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    :lol:
    I have a small chip about education but am only a small person so it shows.
    I only ended up interested in AGW by reading the links of those in denial and seeing the holes in logic exposed in the arguments .
    Before that I was against any action due to my political philosophy identifying as liberal right wing.
    Unfortunately I can no long support no action as a viable future for humanity. I know far to much about the subject.
    That leaves me in the political wilderness with no valid party worthy of a vote that is congruent to my present position.

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  302. Nostalgia-NZ (5,097 comments) says:

    ‘That leaves me in the political wilderness with no valid party worthy of a vote that is congruent to my present position’

    Try a mental hospital.

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  303. Griff (7,343 comments) says:

    :lol:
    That’s pretty rich for someone of your record.
    If I was you I would be dead by my own hand already from the remorse of my deeds.
    Some of us have morals.

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  304. Maggy Wassilieff (325 comments) says:

    @ Right Now….. Griff’s links are often very recent, up-to-date summaries.
    I’m not qualified to comment on the quality of scientific work in climate research, meteorology, mathematical modeling etc.
    I’m mildly sceptical when there are heavily vested interests in people holding to certain positions.
    However, once science moves from the lab/field into public policy, then I suppose we are as qualified as each other to inform ourselves as to how our lives and environment will be affected.
    i.e. … I’m not going to do your thinking for you…..

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  305. RightNow (6,968 comments) says:

    I just come here for the laughs

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