General Debate 1 August 2014

August 1st, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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234 Responses to “General Debate 1 August 2014”

  1. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    The Hoorald is telling porkies – again!

    In another breathless expose they ‘revealed’ Tim Groser had eaten the Antarctic tooth fish in a Singapore restaurant and the ‘journalist’ claimed the fish was a protected species. The headline screams: “Groser dined on protected fish”.
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11302217

    Bollocks. Both the Antarctic Tooth Fish and the Patagonian Tooth Fish are caught under quota. https://www.ccamlr.org/en/fisheries/toothfish-fisheries

    The Hoorald shoots…… own goal!

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  2. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    Well done David Cunliffe; he’s managed to imply that every New Zealander who chooses not to drink alcohol is a “wowser”; I sense another apology is imminent!

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2014/08/cunliffe-insults-non-drinkers.html

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  3. fernglas (157 comments) says:

    48% of New Zealanders believe Dotcom about whether Key knew of him before the raids, 34% believe Key, which only means that less than one in five of us is prepared to keep an open mind on something about which there are no facts.
    Sherlock Holmes said that it was a mistake to to theorise on the basis of insufficient data. Here it seems to be a virtue to be certain on the basis of none.

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  4. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    All across the world the followers of the religion of peace show that tolerance and respect are hallmarks of the prophet,peace be upon him.

    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/asia-pacific/2014/07/china-kills-suspects-uighur-imam-murder-2014731143855645225.html

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  5. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    http://wikileaks.org/aus-suppression-order/

    Australia bans reporting of multi-nation corruption case involving Malaysia, Indonesia and Vietnam

    Today, 29 July 2014, WikiLeaks releases an unprecedented Australian censorship order concerning a multi-million dollar corruption case explicitly naming the current and past heads of state of Indonesia, Malaysia and Vietnam, their relatives and other senior officials. The super-injunction invokes “national security” grounds to prevent reporting about the case, by anyone, in order to “prevent damage to Australia’s international relations”. The court-issued gag order follows the secret 19 June 2014 indictment of seven senior executives from subsidiaries of Australia’s central bank, the Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA). The case concerns allegations of multi-million dollar inducements made by agents of the RBA subsidiaries Securency and Note Printing Australia in order to secure contracts for the supply of Australian-style polymer bank notes to the governments of Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam and other countries.

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  6. duggledog (1,558 comments) says:

    Interesting discussion on Jim Mora’s ‘The Panel’ yesterday afternoon. Venerable guest Gordon McLauchlan posited the assertion that of course, the best answer to welfare is 100% employment.

    Yep, that’s right. And I’m pretty sure he was sentient through the 1970s and 1980s. So, the answer to NZ’s hard rump of unemployable losers is either full employment, with the associated made-up jobs and all that that brings (see: Rogernomics), or billions on welfare cash.

    The story of New Zealand for the last forty years, the future and beyond!
    Not really challenged on that statement of course.

    On that note, has anyone heard the intro music for Checkpoint? Either RNZ is trying to save money by using a theme written in the early 1980s, or there’s some guy sitting in a studio coming up with really dated jingles. Hope it’s the former!

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  7. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Toyota start production of the Hydrogen car. Pretty ugly but it’s a good to see they’ve surmounted many of the issues. 300 mile range and refuelling in three minutes.
    Mind you only California has the refueling stations and even then there only 12! But you gotta start somewhere.
    Personally I think it’s the best solution.
    http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2014/7/31/Toyota-s-Hydrogen-Fuel-Cell-Car-Will-Be-Called-7721719/

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  8. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    Don’t know which is worse, Wowser Sellman or the ganja Greens.

    http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/311283/greens-face-binge-drinking-criticism

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  9. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    All across the world the followers of the religion of peace show that tolerance and respect are hallmarks of the prophet,peace be upon him.

    Bigoted much, kowtow? The article doesn’t say what the religion of the attackers was.

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  10. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    And the savages make inroads in Libya: http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/07/jihadists-declare-emirate-in-east-libya-benghazi-has-now-become-an-islamic-emirate

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  11. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Elaycee
    I hope Groser insists on a correction by the Herald. That Isaac Davison is a real smear merchant.

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  12. oldpark (331 comments) says:

    Great news the latest Roy Morgan Poll.It is bad newa for the potential NZ economy wreckers the commie “Greens” and the decaying Labour Party.National Party voters have been awakened from their slumber of being asleep at the wheel and thinking National were sleep walking to victory on 20 09 2014.Their “COMPLACENCY ” has now been shattered,realising that forgetting to vote or not voting for National could in fact let loose on NZ on 21 09 2014 a group of sickos, made up of a group of never do wells even worse than Dantes inferno.Thanks to Roy Morgan, National voters have been given the biggest wake up call they will get in their lifetime.

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  13. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    @kowtow: The paedophile prophet Muhammad only wanted peace after molesting one of his young brides. Some sleep was needed before the next one.

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  14. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Hey Manolo, do you slander your “mates” as well?

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  15. hj (7,023 comments) says:

    Mixed views on new drink-drive limit

    Public health experts say the change brings New Zealand into line with other countries, including Australia.

    Professor Doug Sellman, the director of the National Addiction Centre at Otago University, says there is finally an effective piece of law reform which will prevent dozens of deaths, hundreds of injuries and save the country millions of dollars.

    However, he is disappointed by the low key way in which the Government has finally passed the legislation and suggests it is embarrassed about being associated with alcohol reform.

    “It really makes you feel that this Government is actually more interested in the health of the New Zealand alcohol industry, rather than the health of the New Zealand public.”

    Labour’s associate health spokesperson Iain Lees-Galloway, whose private members’ bill was drawn last year before being taken over by the Government, says Ministry of Transport officials made the case for change as far back as 2009.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/251114/mixed-views-on-new-drink-drive-limit

    – Serious consideration of the impact of the level and variability of immigration on national saving, and the impact that this might have on the living standards of New Zealanders. There are indications that our high immigration rate has pushed up government spending, house prices and business borrowing.

    http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/reviews-consultation/savingsworkinggroup/pdfs/swg-report-jan11.pdf

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  16. Left Right and Centre (2,979 comments) says:

    Super Rugby:

    I love the one-eyed spinfest from the Crusaders concerning the Waratahs ‘giving up their home advantage’ by switching from Sydney Football Stadium to ANZ Stadium, the latter accommodating a further 38 000 odd spectators.

    Oooo – we’d never do that – how dreadful. We’re treating it like it’s being played at a ‘neutral venue’.

    Ahem – maybe they’re right – to a point. Debating the ‘loss of home venue’ when the Crusaders are away from home is laughable. The Crusaders have never lost a play-off game at home – but they’ve lost some on the road. So – as long as the Crusaders are ‘on the road’ – that’s all you need to care about. Especially if ‘the road’ last ended with a title in the year 2000. Wow – how long ago boss ?

    83 500 capacity. If most of them are home fans I’m sure that won’t be a factor in the equation seeing as the Crusaders have failed to mention it. What’s a few extra tens of thousands of home supporters, huh ?

    Oh yeah – it’s a good job the Crusaders believe so strongly in not ‘giving away home advantage’ by changing venue seeing as, unlike Sydney, had the Crusaders hosted the final Christchurch has no other suitable venues to ‘upgrade’ to. Even before 2011 that would hold true. Hahaha – the best they could do would be to go to Eden Park. Or perhaps the MCG ?

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  17. tom hunter (4,852 comments) says:

    On the good news front – and god knows we need that nowadays – there’s Vietnam:

    So I headed back toward Hoan Kiem Lake during early business hours, and when a young woman on the sidewalk beckoned me over and told me about a café upstairs, I eagerly agreed to let her show me the way.

    She led me inside a building that looked like a parking garage, though nobody parked there. Empty boxes, a discarded broom, and other detritus were strewn about. There was a café upstairs? Really? I felt a twinge of uncertainty. What kind of café would be above this? The building looked derelict.
    ….
    If I were anywhere in the West I would have turned around and gone back to the street, but my instincts are different abroad. I ascended the stairs, feeling curious about what I’d find though doubtful that I would like it.

    I reached the top of the sweltering stairway, pushed open a glass door, and found myself in a café worthy of South Beach in Miami tucked into an air-conditioned aerie. The place was packed with comfortable sofas and chairs and stylishly dressed Vietnamese with laptops and iPads drinking from cups of Italian-style espresso. The entire south wall was made of glass from floor to ceiling and revealed a 180-degree view of the lake and the skyline below.

    Almost everyone in the café was staring at a personal electronic device.

    Who during the Vietnam War on either side of the conflict could have imagined that such a bourgeois place would ever appear in Hanoi while the Communist Party still ruled? Ho Chi Minh sure as hell didn’t expect this. Nor would he have wanted it. Fidel Castro would hate it. Of that I assure you.

    Pol Pot would have wanted to murder everyone in there.

    You have yourselves a communist revolution, fight a war with capitalists, kill a shitload of class enemies, push a ton of others out to sea, sit on your ass with five year plans until it all gets worse – and then you go back to capitalism anyway. Brilliant.

    Stories like this must really fill thepeoplesflag and Yoza with despair. :)

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  18. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  19. EAD (1,087 comments) says:

    I don’t profess to take a side in the Israeli-Palestinian debate as I don’t think it is quite clear cut (either way) as many believe but there is certainly a lot of truth in the below article.

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/07/31/The-Left-Hate-Israel-Because-It-Is-Everything-They-Despise-Capitalist-Conservative-and-Patriotic

    It never ceases to amaze me the level of vitriol aimed at Israel compared with other far worse atrocities being committed across the world – I.e. the massacre of Christians across the middle east.

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  20. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Who would buy one of these ugly things

    http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2014/7/31/Toyota-s-Hydrogen-Fuel-Cell-Car-Will-Be-Called-7721719/

    when you could buy one of these

    http://www.teslamotors.com/models

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  21. hj (7,023 comments) says:

    Fracking ban in teaxas
    http://www.texastribune.org/2014/07/25/denton-fracking-ban-could-spur-wider-legal-clash/

    “the stone age didn’t end because of they ran out of stone and the frack age won’t end because we run out of fracks..”

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  22. big bruv (13,902 comments) says:

    Was there not a thread on this blog yesterday about Labour’s secret plan to make Maori compulsory?

    If so, where has it gone?

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  23. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    UT

    Bigotted much? This is what it says.

    “killed on Wednesday by “three thugs influenced by religious extremist ideology”‘

    Mormons perhaps?

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  24. tom hunter (4,852 comments) says:

    It never ceases to amaze me the level of vitriol aimed at Israel compared with other far worse atrocities being committed across the world – I.e. the massacre of Christians across the middle east.

    I think a big part of the answer is a purely utilitarian one. The Western protestors against Israel – for all their blood-curdling language about the Israelis – know that as a liberal democracy it may actually listen to them and be influenced by them. They know that’s not the case for Syria, Libya, Russia and other such states, let alone groups like ISIS or Hamas.

    But it seems to me that an increasing chunk of the West, and especially the Israeli population, have wised up to this. Hence the relative lack of success of such protests and protest groups.

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  25. Left Right and Centre (2,979 comments) says:

    Really dated jingles for really dated listeners. Makes sense really.

    Hard rump of unemployed losers – hehehehe – kiss my unemployed loser hard rump !! Kidding.

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  26. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    Another piece from A Bolt on Hamas and children.

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/hamas_to_the_children_shoot_jews_and_turn_their_faces_into_tomatoes/

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  27. itstricky (1,831 comments) says:

    Well done David Cunliffe; he’s managed to imply that every New Zealander who chooses not to drink alcohol is a “wowser”; I sense another apology is imminent!

    If JK had said it, he would have been “an ordinary bloke” being a joker. And if, oh I don’t know, Turei had written the post you just did, she would have been hammered for being a “sensitive, politically correct castle princess”

    So whilst DC has an image problem that is entirely his fault, your post – KS – is again an obsessive nit picking partisan hack. Those “right of centre” don’t ever engage in “gotcha” politics, do they?

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  28. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Jerkinabox
    Oh yeah the Tesla. Paid for by subsidies from taxes on the poor so the .001% can buy them and support their own sanctimony.Remind us all about how those batteries are made? . Got shares in rare earth mining companies? You really don’t care about the environment do you.
    And besides this looks miles better. It actually works too. The BMW i8. Here in Jan
    http://www.bmw.com/com/en/newvehicles/i/i8/2014/showroom/index.html

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  29. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    jackinabox (613 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 8:28 am
    Who would buy one of these ugly things

    NEITHER! When they stop making Holdens, and my last one dies, then I will simply stop driving (by then a mobility scooter is probably all I’ll need anyway).

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  30. Chthoniid (2,047 comments) says:

    @Keeping Stock

    As someone who as chosen not to rink for two whole days now, I’m offended!

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  31. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    Well it had to happen one day.
    I agree with jackinabox

    The Tesla is friggin cool. Pin you against your seat acceleration and fast.
    As far as practicality goes; neither at the moment. So I will go with cool instead.

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  32. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    http://english.al-akhbar.com/content/israel-kills-20-unrwa-school-bombing-amid-shaky-truce-prospects

    Israeli bombings on Wednesday killed more than 130 Palestinians in Gaza, including at least 20 at a UN school and 17 in al-Shujayeh, on day 23 of Israel’s assault against the besieged strip.

    ….

    “There were five shells — Israeli tank shells — which struck the people and killed many of them as they slept. Those people came to the school because it is a designated UN shelter,” he said.

    Five of the wounded were in critical condition, Halabi said. It was the second time in a week that a UN school sheltering hundreds of homeless Palestinians had been hit.

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  33. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ itstricky (1,579 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 8:43 am

    You’re surely not suggesting that our Keeping Stock is part of the ‘nit picking’ brigade, who in the absence of any decent policy to talk about from their own team, will simply nit pick on anything and everything else? I simply don’t believe it! :P

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  34. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @Ugly
    Is Hamas still firing rockets and mortars at Israel from inside or close to schools, hospitals and UN centres?

    Simple question.

    Maybe one day you will answer it?

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  35. EAD (1,087 comments) says:

    Is this the start of the economic crash?

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-31/markets-turmoil-russell-2000-plunges-most-over-2-years

    Might be time for the central banks to print up MOAR currency!! QE to infinity!!

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  36. G152 (341 comments) says:

    All hamas have to do to stop the shelling is stop firing rockets into Israel.
    Why is that to hard for them to understand ?

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  37. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    A few more minutes of freedom, a discharge, a fine?

    Anyone taking bets?

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  38. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    @Lance

    And here is how they do it:
    1. State subsidies.
    2. Shaking down other car companies.

    They would go bust yesterday if they actually had to compete.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmichaels/2013/05/27/if-tesla-would-stop-selling-cars-wed-all-save-some-money/

    With most (if not all) ‘Green’ schemes, it usually is an expensive scam run by and for the ‘elite’ and paid for by the plebs.

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  39. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    Elaycee and Red…

    Yep, totally agree since I posted yesterday:

    ***1. flipper (3,572 comments) says:
    July 31st, 2014 at 4:28 pm
    This piece by a smart arse prick named Davison, is about the nadir of “gotcha” politics. Read the Herald.. but the headline is:
    ” Groser orders protected fish for dinner
    Trade Minister Tim Groser. Photo / Ben Fraser
    A plate of protected Antarctic toothfish and controversial dish foie gras were on the table at a lavish taxpayer-funded dinner hosted by Trade Minister Tim ….. ”
    Goes on to say it was in a Singapore restaurant, last January….
    J H C on a Bike. How low has the Herald stooped?
    Davison is just an arsehole…. “

    A few points folks:

    1. I sent a copy of the post to Tim Groser. He responded in person, and suffice to say, he was not impressed by Davison.

    2. Bloody stuff also got into the act describing the meal as “sumptuous”, and highlighting a $300 bill, and a $90 C O Pinot…

    3. On planet stuffed herald, $300 buys a “sumptuous” dinner in Singapore??? Try NZ’s top restaurants in Akld and Wton.

    4. Davison is an arsehole, intent on promoting an anti-National narrative.

    5. J H C on a bike :-)

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  40. oldpark (331 comments) says:

    Heard a blonde bimbo on Newstalk ZB called Rachel Smalley who not sure if she works for that radio station or KPMG the accountancy firm,who are of jewish extraction.Well Smalley a TV3 reject not short of putting her mouth into action before her brain is engaged has done it again.She called all NZ women who weigh over 70K HEIFERS and LARDOS.Now for her to step into the international debate on the war between Israel and Hamas and take sides beggars belief.KPMG clients will not be impressed when they hear her rhetoric,and realise mouthpieces like Smalley supporting an unelected terror organisation like Hamas.With comments like hers, she must be in bed with mana/dotcom and Unite Union group.As that is the same sicko attitude and stance they have been operating under.Hasnt she realised that Israel has a democratically elected Government.

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  41. Harriet (4,972 comments) says:

    Fucken unbelievable.

    Play School TV – Hamas style.

    2mins of two lttle girls sitting in a Play School studio and talking to the TV presenter – about shooting ALL jews.

    [thanks to smoeone at TS]

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  42. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    @ itstricky – my wife chooses not to drink. Those who know her well know that she is anything but a wowser; she has simply made a choice based on medical advice.

    I mentioned Cunliffe’s comment to her this morning before she disappeared for the day. She has little interest in politics, but volunteered the opinion that this was an idiotic comment from Cunliffe, and would be particularly offensive to those who have chosen not to drink because of alcoholism; he demeans the inner courage required to beat the bottle. That’s why I blogged about this.

    David Cunliffe needs to think before he opens his mouth.

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  43. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Lance says:

    “Is Hamas still firing rockets and mortars at Israel from inside or close to schools, hospitals and UN centres?”

    Of course they are.
    They are keeping their fingers crossed the Israelis will make a mistake.
    As they are using women and children as human shields wherever they go, they reckon they will get ‘lucky’ sometimes.

    And when that happens, the compliant Hamas embedded media (As guilty as Hamas itself for perpetuating this conflict) can blame Israel again.

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  44. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    Play School TV – Hamas style.

    2mins of two little girls sitting in a Play School studio and talking to the TV presenter – about shooting ALL Jews.

    Can we be sure that translation is accurate?

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  45. minus (197 comments) says:

    Stuff this morning – Labour leader David Cunliffe also met “Mr X” recently but has said if he had known about the case no such meeting would have happened.
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/10335109/Victim-files-for-right-to-be-named

    Mr Cunliffe admits a prominent New Zealander’s possible sexual offending had been raised with him before he met with the man in Queenstown last week.
    The Labour leader says the meeting went ahead because no proof had been supplied.
    – Newstalk ZB

    Cunliffe introduced the Man With No Name to Labour candidate Liz Craig – “a very personable young lady” Mr X said on his Facebook page, then later removed it – but Cunliffe claims Mr X’s”status” was not an issue.
    So why did they met and why the introduction?
    Is the Man With No Name now possibly a secret donor to the Labour Party?
    And, if so, he is immune from comment that would put it in context?

    And since it is reported [apparently no less reliably than most other reports on Cunliffe] that the Labour Leader knew before the two met, why the untruth to start with?

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  46. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    Newstalk Zb was kind enough to give me my daily update on how many Palestinians have died in the latest conflict.

    Once again, no mention of how many Israelis have perished.

    ZB wouldnt take sides would they?

    Anyway, an update from debka.com – these guys usually know whats going on.

    The Israeli Air Force bombed 40 mosques in Gaza Tuesday night, July 30, in the most extensive operation against Hamas’ religious institutions-cum-military bases so far. In total, at least 50 mosques have been blown up along with their stockpiles of rockets and arms caches.
    These concentrated air strikes on rocket arsenals are as integral to Operation Protective Edge as the ground work in destroying tunnels. They have been stepped up in advance of the preparations launched by the government on Wednesday for the possible termination of the IDF ground operation in the Gaza Strip and the withdrawal of troops.
    DEBKAfile’s sources say that the order to end the ground operation in Gaza would not mean that the war is over. There are no illusions about the Palestinian extremist groups laying down their arms. In practical terms, therefore, Israeli troops will regroup and spread out along the border as a barrier against future Hamas attempts to keep up its terror offensive by means of cross-border commando raids using undiscovered tunnels and firing rockets and mortars into Israel.
    Israel’s war planners believe the IDF ranged outside the Gaza border is capable of repelling these assaults by means of tank and artillery fire and air force drones.
    The confrontation with Hamas will thus morph into an ongoing war of attrition.
    This past week has also seen the first deployment in action of the Air Force’s brand new Hermes 900 UAV, an unmanned aircraft also known as the Star. Never before used in wartime operations, the drone’s debut was rushed forward because of its useful properties: The aircraft can fly nonstop for 30 hours at an altitude of 30,000 feet, the while conducting surveillance, gathering intelligence and relaying communications to and from military personnel in the field.
    Star carries 300 kg of attack weaponry. Its cockpit and operating systems are superior to previous models, enabling commander, operator and crew to work together seamlessly.
    It has been functioning almost nonstop in the Gaza operation with great success.
    Manufactured by Elbit Systems, the drone had until this week only flown test flights and was not scheduled to become operational until 2015. But Operation Protective Edge called for an upgraded version of the Air Force’s Hermes 450 – a UAV that flies similar missions — and so the 900 was fast-tracked into the fleet.
    As it is relatively untested in battle, the Star is only being used for certain types of missions. When the current war ends, the air force will resume further study of its performance in emergency situations and diverse altitudes and weather conditions.

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  47. minus (197 comments) says:

    Disgraced National List MP Claudette Hauiti was among the biggest spenders in the April to June period, chalking up $30,824 in domestic travel alone

    As a LIST Member, presumably without an electorate?

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  48. oldpark (331 comments) says:

    Hone Harawira beats that 52,000 DOLLARS in spending same period.He represents so called poor Maoris.He dosnt like white mofos so must have spent taxpayers money on whanau.

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  49. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ oldpark (32 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 9:48 am

    So what you are saying, or trying to say is that it is acceptable for someone to do this, because other people have?

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  50. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    It looks like John Banks is going to “take” the conviction. Some unknown Michael Wood from Labour is out there saying JB should apologise to Epsom and his reputation is in tatters. What BS –it had nothing to do with Epsom ( except that Epsom is part of Akl ) as it was to do with the Mayor’s election campaign.
    As for his reputation in tatters –I think most people can see through the charade that the whole episode has been.

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  51. Pete George (23,567 comments) says:

    Regarding Kelvin Davis and hoardings in Te Tai Tokerau I’ve had a response from Jenny Kirk this morning:

    Its a big electorate and Kel’s hoardings are being put up all over the place as we speak !

    If that’s the case then Kelvin is true to his word.

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  52. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    The enemy within. From the pan to the fire: http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/1000-children-fleeing-violent-honduras-heading-violent-chicago

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  53. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    oldpark

    There’s an interesting dynamic going on in the media world,disguised as pro palestinian and anti violence rhtoric(can that be possible) commentators get away with anti semitism,unremarked by all those so quick to go on the offensive when remarks on race,gender etc are made.

    But someone says “cheeky darkie” and that’s the end of his broadcasting career.

    The double standard is stark hypocricy.

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  54. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Ross12 (1,154 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 9:56 am
    As for his reputation in tatters –I think most people can see through the charade that the whole episode has been.

    I think people saw through the charade, which is why Mr Banks is standing where he is right now.

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  55. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Community detention and community service. An appropriate sentence. Four nights a week with a curfew, isn’t going to be too hard to adhere to. 100 hours community service, great, giving back to the community that has been harmed, is also good. I’m happy with that.

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  56. Tarquin North (298 comments) says:

    Flipper, Tim Groser should be congratulated on being frugal for his dinner in Singapore. Last time I was there you could blow $300 on a steak no worries, a stubby of VB and a small glass of wine was $38 + taxes at a cheap bar!

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  57. J Bloggs (241 comments) says:

    oldpark: in fairness to HH, he, at least, is an electorate MP and his electorate is mainly comprised of small widely scattered communities over a very large area. By comparison, Jacqui Dean (National, Waitaki – another large rural electorate) has racked up over $30K, so I don’t think that HH’s expenses are unreasonable, given he has party leadership stuff to do as well.

    The Green party, which is all list MP’s, is a completely different kettle of fish – All but one of them have racked up 5 figure travel and accommodation expenses, with over half of them being more than $20K.

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  58. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    Judith,
    I would not disagree with the “sentence”. But I take issue with you on “..giving back to the community that has been harmed, is also good.”

    How was the community “harmed”?

    The whole exercise has been politically motivated, AND Wylie J may yet be appealed. Dotcom is a proven liar, but Wylie found him credible. BS. We must await developments on that.

    Now for the main event: Herald v Wylie J on contempt, in case folks have forgotten. Should be fun. :-)

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  59. superflynz (14 comments) says:

    Pray tell, Judith, how exactly has the community been ‘harmed’? He was found guilty, yes. He is unlikely to ever reoffend. His service to his community has been far greater than yours, I am willing to bet.

    Don’t use up all that sanctimony in one thread, its only 10am!

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  60. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    I am sure all the lefties will scream, whine and moan about Banks sentence. He doesn’t adhere to collectivism, is white, a male (not ashamed of being a man) and is successful.
    Should have got ’20 years in the electric chair’

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  61. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    A tweet from Russia’s Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin mocking Obama.

    https://twitter.com/Rogozin/status/494919386185355264/photo/1

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  62. calendar girl (1,236 comments) says:

    KS: “David Cunliffe needs to think before he opens his mouth.”

    You are making the gross assumption that he’s capable of thinking logically. There’s not much that we’ve seen so far that supports that assumption. His education and background point to his being an intelligent person, but his lack of sincerity and consistency demonstrates an absence of true principles and ideals to guide him.

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  63. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    Tarquin North (140 comments) says:

    August 1st, 2014 at 10:07 am

    Flipper, Tim Groser should be congratulated
    ****

    Quite agree. I’ll bet Murphy spent more than $300 on the Herald’s tab (which is tax deductible, so we carry some cost) while injh US recerntly.

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  64. tom hunter (4,852 comments) says:

    The following should be a thread all on it’s own. Some time ago, during an argument about Israel-Gaza, I mentioned that Clinton had backed off from killing Bin Laden, documented in at least a couple of books, Ghost Wars and The Looming Tower.

    Well in Australia the other day a remarkable audio tape appeared – you can see it discussed here on Sky’s Paul Murray show. You have to go to about 5:30 in the recording to hear it.

    The audio was recorded as Clinton was visiting Australia and he’s responding to a question from the audience about terrorism in general and a rather obscure person called Osama Bin Laden. The incredible thing is when this happened, as noted by another commentator:

    A time capsule from Australia via MSNBC, captured for posterity at what would have been around 11 p.m. [Sep 10, 2001] New York time. The hijackers may have been ritually shaving themselves as he said it.

    Previewing the audio, the host says Clinton “almost brags” about his decision. Of course he does; at the time, it would have been a no-brainer for a politician to congratulate himself for sparing a terrorist in the name of also sparing dozens (or, if you believe Clinton, hundreds) of civilians, even if that terrorist was responsible for the U.S.S. Cole attack.

    Twenty-four hours later, I guarantee you he wasn’t bragging anymore.

    Of course not, and more …

    In fact, you can draw a straight line from this audio to America’s drone policy today. These 20 seconds or so are precisely why Obama ended up pulling the trigger on Anwar al-Awlaki and why he continues to pull the trigger on Al Qaeda’s bigger fish even if it means incinerating civilians in Waziristan or Yemen in the process.

    Which is yet another reason why the Israelis will take little or no notice of the USA’s formal protests about artillery shells falling on schools – you do it too buddy. For that dwindling band of former Obama supporters who are gutted at how their lefty hero of 2008 could be in this spot there’s this comment:

    He’s never going to let a statement like this come back to haunt him. Post-9/11, when you’ve got a big fish on the hook, you reel him in come what may. A presidency can survive anger from doves and civil libertarians that the White House was overly aggressive in targeting jihadis. It can’t survive having skyscrapers knocked over by someone who, you’re sheepishly forced to admit, you had a clear shot at killing years before.

    A September 10 mentality that still exists – along with the following crucial component:

    Exit question: Clinton says at one point that, had he bombed Bin Laden with civilians around him, “I would have been no better than him.”

    Does he still feel that way? Does he think Obama is no better than Al Qaeda for trying to neutralize threats from terrorists who take civilians as their main targets? Does Hillary think that? It’s 3 a.m. and the phone is ringing.

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  65. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Oh yeah the Tesla. Paid for by subsidies from taxes on the poor so the .001% can buy them and support their own sanctimony”

    The loan was paid back with interest.

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  66. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ superflynz (11 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 10:14 am

    The community need to have faith in their elected politicians to be honest with them. It is perhaps one of the most responsible positions in the country. When one of them lies, and continues that lie for an extended period of time, and is then found guilty, it demeans the integrity of all politicians because like it or not, mud sticks.

    Therefore the community is harmed – it is on going issues like this, the suggestion of corruption within parliament, that is dominating the political arena, and distracting attention from things that do matter to the overall welfare of our country.

    We need to be able to trust these people, and for many years to come, John Banks, along with other such people, Dunne, Hauiti, Hughes etc, all people whose integrity has been bought into question, will lead to a general mistrust.

    The general community has to have evidence that when such things are proven, that the perpetrators are punished. Therefore deeming the acts to be wrong, rather than excusable because they are MP’s.

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  67. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “I am sure all the lefties will scream, whine and moan about Banks sentence. He doesn’t adhere to collectivism, is white, a male (not ashamed of being a man) and is successful.
    Should have got ’20 years in the electric chair’”

    All that is important is that he was CONVICTED. Yay! The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree.

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  68. unaha-closp (1,165 comments) says:

    I am sure all the lefties will scream, whine and moan about Banks sentence. He doesn’t adhere to collectivism, is white, a male (not ashamed of being a man) and is successful.

    If only John Banks were still in parliament, he would put an end to this namby pamby liberal pantywaist slap-em-with-bus-ticket lenient sentencing malarkey. It never works, why with this sort of criminal activity, colluding with foreign fugitive from justice, the stink of corruption.

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  69. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ jackinabox (616 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 10:29 am

    I agree Jack. I think the Court is sending a very strong message to the House, and to the electorate. “We will not tolerate dishonesty, nor will corrupt politicians, be allowed to get away with it”.

    Hopefully some of the others will sit up and take note.

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  70. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    jackinabox says:

    “The loan was paid back with interest.”

    He said SUBSIDIES not loan.
    Reading isn’t your strongest point is it?
    Since 2013 Tesla netted more than $250 million a year in federal subsidies and on top of that every car is subsidised to the tune of $5,000 or $12,500.00 if you live in California.
    It is a toy for the rich sanctimonious hypocritical ‘elites’ , paid for by the plebs.

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  71. superflynz (14 comments) says:

    @jackinabox

    that is a particularly hateful and malicious comment.

    His father was a career criminal, whilst John grew up having to fend for himself and has given decades of his life for the good of his community.

    Notwithstanding the fact that a Court found him guilty of filing a false return, I believe that he is a decent man who gave his best for his community.

    You on the other hand… well, your comment speaks more about you than I ever could.

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  72. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ superflynz (12 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 10:37 am

    So you are saying, as I have heard many an offender claim, that a person’s family history is a reason for them to be dealt to lightly by the courts, and in the court of public opinion?

    Banks has done a lot for the community, and was a community leader, a role model and someone people looked up to – therefore, when he errs, it is more harmful, because more are aware of it, and more are let down by it.

    The higher up a person is, the further they have to fall – which is why it is very wise to be sure you don’t do anything dishonest, whilst sitting on the pedestal.

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  73. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    The Obscenity of Islam. Warning: The pictures in this article are extremely disturbing.

    http://www.islam-watch.org/authors/138-jake-neuman/1552-the-obscenity-of-islam.html

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  74. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @ShawnLH
    Maybe Ugly Truth can explain why horror stories like this are going unreported. Now that’s a real conspiracy!!!!!

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  75. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Native American Tribal Support for the State of Israel.

    “The Palestinians and their supporters have attempted to present their struggle as parallel to that of the Native Americans. This push was led by George Bisharat, an anti-Israel activist whose ancestors only immigrated to the holy land in the 1920’s, yet who nevertheless insists that he is an indigenous person who was forcefully uprooted, just like the Native Americans were. In reality, the Jews are Israel’s indigenous people, but that has not stopped pro-Palestinian organizations such as Adalah and the Students for Justice in Palestine from playing on the Native American struggle to serve their own interests. However, numerous Native Americans have rejected any comparison between their struggle and that of the Palestinians, preferring to identify with Israel instead.”

    http://unitedwithisrael.org/native-american-tribal-support-for-the-state-of-israel/

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  76. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Government by Intimidation
    Our leaders would prefer critics to keep quiet and get with the programme.

    ‘We’re in a cold war, first foretold when beneficiary Natasha Fuller’s details were made public after she criticised the cutting of access to a training incentive allowance…

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11302143

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  77. 103PapPap (131 comments) says:

    Super Rugby Final.

    I see that there are two Israels but no Gazas in the final.

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  78. stephieboy (3,091 comments) says:

    More on the deluded George Golloway convert to a special brand of Islam,

    http://leftfootforward.org/2014/01/is-george-galloway-really-the-authentic-voice-of-all-muslims-ev

    And Neo Stalinist Delusions and pretensions ,

    “What is that position? “I am on the anti-imperialist left.” The Stalinist left? “I wouldn’t define it that way because of the pejoratives loaded around it; that would be making a rod for your own back. If you are asking did I support the Soviet Union, yes I did. Yes, I did support the Soviet Union, and I think the disappearance of the Soviet Union is the biggest catastrophe of my life. If there was a Soviet Union today, we would not be having this conversation about plunging into a new war in the Middle East, and the US would not be rampaging around the globe.”

    http://liberalconspiracy.org/2012/04/20/george-galloway-on-bbcqt-and-his-own-praise-for-the-soviet-union/

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  79. superflynz (14 comments) says:

    @Judge Judy (10:43am):

    Um, no. Let me help you out…

    Jackinabox said the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree, making reference to his father, which has absolutely nothing to do with his conviction and is a twisted low blow.

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  80. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    On further consideration, the Home D is unjustified.

    In fact it is absurd.

    On the other hand, the only real offence against the community is the contempt shown by the NZ Herald.

    Ergo, a Home D sentence on the APNNZ CEO (not editor) to focus the corporate mind would be the minimum. :-)

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  81. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    What superflynz said. It speaks volumes for the egalitarian nature of New Zealand that the son of career criminals, alcoholics and back-street abortionists could become Minister of Police. It also speaks volumes for John Banks’ strength of character, and his determination not to end up like his parents.

    That he has transgressed at the end of a long career of service is sad, but it does not in any way take away from the service John Banks has given during his career, and the many tens of thousands of dollars in donations he has given anonymously. That is a very sad irony in this case.

    People like Jackinabox kicking the man when he’s down are showing a particularly nasty and cowardly streak.

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  82. DJP6-25 (1,387 comments) says:

    All_on_Red 8:09 am. That’s good news.

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  83. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Notwithstanding the fact that a Court found him guilty of filing a false return, I believe that he is a decent man who gave his best for his community.”

    What makes the conviction particularly satisfying for me is the fact that Banks was once Police Minister.

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  84. stephieboy (3,091 comments) says:

    We may concur with this thoughtful piece :

    What, Exactly , is Hamas trying to prove .?,

    http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/07/what-exactly-is-hamas-trying-to-prove/374342/

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  85. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    Just to upset the anti-smite mob, sample Whale’s demolition of Smalley:

    Hamas Hugger Rachel Smalley is dead wrong
    by Cameron Slater on August 1, 2014 at 10:30am

    Rachel Smalley is now a self declared Hamas Hugger.
    She shows her complete ignorance this morning on NewstalkZB, and she cannot go unchallenged for her mad ranting.
    She self describes herself as “the serious Journalist”…but ignores facts and evidence as she joins the jihad against Israel.

    “I can’t sit on the political fence anymore on the Israel-Palestine situation. It has always been a difficult conflict to report on, to balance the position of both sides. There is no place for judgement.
    Well, not anymore. Not for me.
    I can’t report the situation in Gaza with balance anymore because there simply is none. Israel’s actions are abhorrent. The killing, the targeting of civilians, the toddlers and the babies who are dying every day. It reveals the Israeli regime for what it is – a callus anti-Palestinian killing machine.
    Israel’s conflict should be with Hamas, but it’s not. It’s with the Palestinians. Almost two million people who live in the Gaza Strip, entrapped and caged in an area that is 40 kilometres long by ten kilometres wide. The bombardment of Gaza is akin to caged lion hunting in South Africa. There is no escape – only terror as bombs and bullets rain down.
    The Israelis say they ‘regret’ when a civilian is killed. Rubbish! They regret nothing. They put no value on a Palestinian life.”

    Mad ranting, and largely fact free…she then lies outright. Israel does not target civilians, Hamas uses civilians as human shields. It is Hamas that puts no value on Palestinian life.
    In fact watch this video as Israeli pilots pull out of attacks because civilians are in the vicinity. Now who is right Rachel Smalley or me? Rachel Smalley the “serious journalist” or Israel?

    She continues her mad ranting:
    “And then there is the latest war crime – the bombing of a school.
    The UN says it gave the school’s co-ordinates to Israel 17 times. 17 times it gave Israel the co-ordinates and said the building was housing children and displaced civilians. And yet Israel bombed it. They bombed it and killed every civilian inside.
    That is an outright lie. For a start is still unclear who shelled the school…but you would have thought that a “serious journalist” would have bothered to find out the facts…Whoever bombed the school did not “kill every civilian inside”.

    The Daily Mail reports otherwise and quotes a UNRWA representative…you’d think a “serious journalist” would get basic facts like this right.
    ‘Our initial assessment is that it was Israeli artillery that hit our school,’ United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) chief Pierre Krahenbuhl said.
    He made his statement after representatives of the agency visited the scene and examined fragments, craters and other damage.
    Blood splattered floors and mattresses were seen inside classrooms at the Jabalya Girls Elementary School.
    And survivors picked through shattered glass and debris for flesh and body parts to bury.
    If there were survivors how can she even remotely claim that Israel killed “every civilian inside”. That is a lie, a deliberate falsehood.

    Perhaps she should watch a CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) interview (30 July) with John Ging, Director of the Operational Division at the UN’s Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA), the UN official admits that Hamas and other terrorist organizations fire rockets from the vicinity of UN schools and other facilities in the Gaza Strip, as well as from residential areas.

    After being asked about human shields and whether Hamas or Islamic Jihad are launching rockets near shelters, including UN schools, John Ging replies in the affirmative: “Yes, the armed groups are firing their rockets into Israel from the vicinity of UN facilities and residential areas. Absolutely.”
    Before joining OCHA, John Ging was the Director of UNRWA Operations in the Gaza Strip from 2006-2011. Pity Rachel Smalley hasn’t informed herself of these facts, a “serious journalist” would.
    And she dares to describe herself as a “serious journalist”.

    “How has Israel responded? It has responded by calling up another 16,000 reservists. Is there a more arrogant and antagonistic administration in the world today?”

    She lies again…surely a “serious journalist” would know that it is 18,000 reservists not 16,000.
    The IDF said it will be calling up 18,000 additional reserve soldiers during the night.
    It’s attention to details like that that make you a “serious journalist” not ranting madly on a radio show.
    She wants peace and a diplomatics solution but what does the mad Hamas Hugger suggest as her solution? That’s right sending home the ambassador…how will that help diplomacy?
    If Rachel Smalley really wants the title of a “serious journalist” then perhaps she might like to get basic facts right.

    – NewstalkZB, Times of Israel, Ynet, Daily Mail

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  86. Chuck Bird (4,884 comments) says:

    The latest news is that John Banks is appealing.

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  87. minus (197 comments) says:

    It seems Jackinabox is linked to “bent cops”, so his/her remarks may attract about the same prejudice as his own comments display.

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  88. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    George Galloway in his own words folks, thanks to Stephie.

    “If you are asking did I support the Soviet Union, yes I did. Yes, I did support the Soviet Union, and I think the disappearance of the Soviet Union is the biggest catastrophe of my life.”

    The Soviet Union killed around 20 million people, including 14.5 million needlessly starved to death. Yet the darling of the anti-Israel left think’s it’s demise a catastrophe.

    What does that say about the haters of Israel in the Western Left?

    20 million killed by the CCCP? “No problem.” Anything Israel does to defend itself against terrorism? “WAR CRIME!”

    Remember this the next time an anti-Israel apologist for Islamic terrorism starts ranting about “justice, peace and war crimes.”

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  89. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Whale’s demolition of Smalley:”

    Whale should stick to demolishing pork pies.

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  90. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “The latest news is that John Banks is appealing.”

    He’s about as appealing as Jerry Brownlee in a tutu.

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  91. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ superflynz (13 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 11:08 am

    Whilst I agree, John Banks has done some wonderful things, and I’m not knocking that at all.

    BUT – and I can only be driven by the court’s decision here – he is guilty of dishonesty now.

    He made a conscious and deliberate decision not to tell the truth. He extended that by carrying on the lie for a prolonged period of time. He broke the law – and I agree, no where near at the same level of his father’s offending, the fact remains that John Banks did offend – and did so without coercion.

    He is now a convicted criminal, and therefore, has exposed himself to the statement jackinabox gave him and also from as many people that wish to use it. Such is the nature of being a criminal. Perhaps that is something Mr Banks should have considered.

    I give no sympathy to Banks for what he has, through his own actions, now exposed himself and his family to – including taunts about his fathers past. He bought this on himself and therefore has to live with the consequences. He has ruined a wonderful career, his good name and his employment opportunities, not to mention other spin off effects. There is no one else responsible for that, than him.

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  92. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    *** “We need to be able to trust these people, and for many years to come, John Banks, along with other such people, Dunne, Hauiti, Hughes etc, all people whose integrity has been bought into question, will lead to a general mistrust.

    The general community …”

    Yep, that is partially true.
    But I would like you, Judith, to run the provable case against P Dunne.
    And I would liked to see similar retrospective cases run against Peters (theft of $150,000), Clark and Simpson (theft of $500,000 odd; Clark for fraudulent art and making a DIA driver carry the can for driving her too fast when ALL SHE HAD TO DO was to declare that she was engaged on “urgent public business”.

    You see once the political worm wriggles from the can, one can never tell where it will stop – or who it will infect. :-)

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  93. fernglas (157 comments) says:

    So that’s why he didn’t want a discharge without conviction; he couldn’t appeal if he wasn’t convicted. Looks really interesting, and he’s clearly been clued up about what is needed when leave is sought to call new evidence at appeal, i.e. that it is fresh, cogent and could not reasonably have been made available at the first hearing. It does limit his options slightly; although he could say the Judge got it wrong on the evidence before him, that is somewhat inconsistent with saying the Judge was misled by the absence of certain evidence. Watch this space. It may mean Dotcom’s credibility takes a blow.

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  94. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Chuck Bird (4,685 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 11:20 am
    ” The latest news is that John Banks is appealing.”

    He has a nice smile, but calling him appealing? I guess that would depend on one’s particular tastes. Now young Simon Bridges, he’s appealing in all sorts of ways and a few others similarly so, but John, nah, I don’t see it. ;-)

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  95. backster (2,172 comments) says:

    Judy and Jack see you at the celebration party at Penny’s (anti corruption dogs) place tonight.

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  96. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    I wonder if he’s booked his return passage on the cabbage boat?

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  97. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    All in red

    To make hydrogen takes electricity or is manufactured from fossil fuels .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production
    When made from fossil fuels you have around fifty percent co/co2 to dispose of and the process losses 20% of the energy anyway.
    The process of using electricity is around fifty percent efficient.
    A lithium battery does the same job of storing energy but its 99% efficient.

    A method of storage that has enough energy density for mainstream transport usage and is cost competitive and safe is not yet developed.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_storage
    We all have a wall socket to plug an electric car into particularly in nz where we use 240v not the yanks 110v. There are very few hydrogen fueling stations any where.
    Car batteries can be used to buffer the grid when renewable generation like solar and wind become more prevalent.

    The hydrogen car released by Toyota is a small basic sedan with a price on par with the large and very quick telsa Super Luxury sedan.
    http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/Tesla_Model-S/

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  98. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    Oh look
    Jackinabox made 2x ad hominem’s in row at 11:22 and 11:26

    Great debating there Jackinabox, very venal and nasty. Is that because you have nothing to say other than insults?

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  99. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ flipper (3,582 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 11:32 am

    Exactly Flipper, the list of names in the last 20 years is very long … but it seems to be building up steam. Whilst most of them do not have the Court conviction, the Court of Public opinion has indeed made many a decision against them.

    Dunne, yes, probably nothing illegal, I don’t think distracting the truth being known is illegal, but still, he has plotted his copy book and will forever be taunted by his actions. Same with Clark, and the others as we see on an almost daily basis on here.

    IMO There is a difference when one is dishonest for their own benefit, such in Banks case, and arguably Winston’s case, as opposed to signing a painting for a charity, in which there was no direct personal gain – however, dishonest it is, even if not in intention, and therefore, should not occur.

    I hope I live long enough to see corruption cast out from the house, a sort of political exorcism is required – as yet, no one seems to have appeared with the necessary skills to conduct such an ceremony.

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  100. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ backster (2,082 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 11:34 am

    Oh dear, are we a little bit upset and feeling angwry about it? It’s so howwible when we can’t manipulate the courts to do what we want, isn’t it? Nawaughty Judge for not recognising the wonderful person Mr Banks has been and letting him off this small slip up.

    That’s right sunshine, you take it out on the people that think its time these dishonest politicians started being accountable for the lies they tell to the electorate.

    You stick up for dishonesty Backster – good on you!!! Just what the country needs.

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  101. minus (197 comments) says:

    The judge said Banks could have used a secret trust to receive anonymous donations and it was “ironic” that Banks did not use a trust because he believed it was against the spirit of the law.

    So, if John Banks had handled it the way Cunliffe attempted to, he would have been OK?

    A pre-sentence report said Banks’ offending had a “profound” effect on his wife Amanda who had moved to Central Otago as a result.
    She had affirmed her “on-going support” for Banks, the judge said.

    This is a little unclear. Was it Bank’s offending, or the attendant publicity which has had a “profound” effect?
    Are the Banks couple separated as a result?

    It will be interesting to learn of Banks’ new “unimpeachable water-tight evidence” that would “completely exonerate” him.
    Perhaps it will be released five days before the Election too?

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  102. wf (442 comments) says:

    Was it the Israeli PM who commented:

    “Ceasefire? We cease. They fire.” Seems a simple solution in there somewhere. Shouldn’t be too hard to find.

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  103. Fletch (6,390 comments) says:

    A Spanish journalist tells an Israeli media figure that Hamas would kill journalists if they reported anything remotely negative about Hamas.

    I met today with a Spanish journalist who just came back from Gaza. We talked about the situation there. He was very friendly. I asked him how comes we never see on television channels reporting from Gaza any Hamas people, no gunmen, no rocket launcher, no policemen.. We only see civilians on these reports, mostly women and children. He answered me frankly : “it’s very simple, we did see Hamas people there launching rockets, they were close to our hotel, but if ever we dare pointing our camera on them they would simply shoot at us and kill us.”
    Wooh, impressive. Then I asked him “would you mind saying that on camera? I can film you explaining this…”
    For some reason I cannot really understand he refused and almost ran away. I guess my camera is as dangerous as Hamas threats…
    So just for you to know, the truth will never appear on the images you see on television.

    https://www.facebook.com/michael.grynszpan/posts/10152140390486065

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  104. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Great debating there Jackinabox, very venal and nasty. Is that because you have nothing to say other than insults?

    Pork pies = lies.

    Banks appealing = Peter Doone suing.

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  105. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “So that’s why he didn’t want a discharge without conviction; he couldn’t appeal if he wasn’t convicted.”

    If he wasn’t convicted he wouldn’t need to appeal. He knew his cabbage boat was foundering so he, rather than go down with the ship like an honourable man, scuttled ashore like a rat. All this new evidence stuff will turn out to be an attempt at relitigating the old “I can’t remember” crap.

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  106. Rowan (2,394 comments) says:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11301680

    Right Demler is “innocent” of the Crewe homicide because the police say so, If I was Rochelle I certainly wouldn’t be buying this crap from the cops, just more denial, there is certainly evidence that Demler was the killer and that his girlfriend was an accessory after the fact, the reports give no evidence that excludes them so to come up with the conclusion that they were ‘in no way involved’ is just wrong, even if you don’t think the evidence is strong enough, this doesn’t make him “innocent” the conclusions in both reports are baseless and shows that the police are not interested in the truth, just covering their own arses. It also highlights the need for a Criminal Cases review commission in this country rather than the “Kangaroo court” as Ross Meurant puts it where we have the police investigation investigated by the police or the IPCA which even with its so called ‘independence’ is woefully inadequate.

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  107. OneTrack (3,107 comments) says:

    Judith – “The community need to have faith in their elected politicians to be honest with them”

    Like Len Brown and his secret trust for his donations?

    What was Banks’ mistake? Obviously he didn’t use a trust, like the lefty did. He should have known better.

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  108. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “the police are not interested in the truth, just covering their own arses.” Amen to that!

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  109. flipper (4,067 comments) says:

    Now someone will correct me if I am wrong, but if J Banks has and presents to the CoA new evidence that could over-turn Wylie J, then the Court of Appeal is now compelled to hear/view that evidence, and if it is compelling, and throws doubt on the decision under appeal, to allow the appeal and either order a new trial or quash the conviction.

    My recollection (without checking) is that the nasty Law Lords of the Privy Council found and ordered thus, on Lundy. No?

    Banksie may be many things to many people. But he would NOT make the statement that he has made unless it could be sustained.

    Oh dear…

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  110. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ OneTrack (2,619 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    So you are saying that because someone else gets away with a ‘crime’, everyone else should?

    Because someone else uses a lawful means, John Banks should be excused when he chose to use the unlawful means?

    Stop making pathetic excuses. I’m not sure what your mother taught you, but mine taught me very clearly that what other people do is of no consequence or a defense for bad behaviour – it is what I do that matters.

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  111. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Banksie may be many things to many people. But he would NOT make the statement that he has made unless it could be sustained.

    Oh dear…

    Well the previous statements he has made haven’t turned out too good for him so far…

    I especially loved the one about not remembering being in the helicopter … yep, if he says it, it must be true – except that wasn’t, was it?

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  112. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    The buggers are swamping the United Sates: http://www.krgv.com/news/immigrants-to-be-housed-in-suites-near-san-antonio/

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  113. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Israel does not target civilians

    WheelOil doesn’t know shit about it.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israeli-soldiers-reveal-the-brutal-truth-of-gaza-attack-1746485.html

    Troops’ testimonies disclose loose rules of engagement and use of civilians as human shields:

    “No one is supposed to be there. If you see any signs of movement at all, you shoot. These, essentially, were the rules of engagement.”

    “if we see something suspect and shoot, better hit an innocent than hesitate to target an enemy”

    “You see something and you’re not quite sure? You shoot”

    “A civilian man between 50 and 60 who was unarmed but carrying a torch was shot dead after the unit’s commander ordered his soldiers not to fire warning shots but to hold their fire until he was 50m away. The soldier said the company commander announced over the radio after the incident: Here’s an opener for tonight”

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  114. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Banks’ sentence ‘appropriate': McCready

    11:44 Fri Aug 1 2014

    byAAP

    The man who successfully resurrected the case against former ACT MP John Banks is happy with the community-based sentence his target received.

    Banks avoided a jail sentence and up to a $10,000 fine when he was sentenced to two months’ community detention and 100 hours’ community work in Auckland District Court on Friday.

    He also had a conviction entered for falsely declaring two $25,000 donations from Kim Dotcom anonymous after his 2010 failed Auckland mayoral bid.

    In 2012, police said they wouldn’t prosecute Banks, but the case was taken up by serial litigant Graham McCready, whose success sparked the Solicitor-General to take over the case.

    Outside court on Friday, Mr McCready told reporters a fine would have been like a parking ticket to Banks.

    “Community detention and community service is very appropriate.”

    He pointed out that Banks could not have applied for a discharge without conviction because he had a previous conviction. In 1991, when minister of police in a National government, Banks was fined $750 for answering his mobile phone while on a flight.

    Mr McCready is also taking a private prosecution against police for not prosecuting Banks in the first place and that would be his next project.

    He has named Prime Minister John Key as an accessory and the case will be back in court next month, he said.

    However, he would immediately celebrate by “doing his laundry” and catch up on a few jobs and friends.

    “The celebration is for the system itself and for the New Zealand public. As the judge said this whole thing is about confidence in the natural system.”

    In 2007, Mr McCready took a private prosecution against Labour MP Trevor Mallard over an altercation with National’s Tau Henare. Mr Mallard admitted fighting in a public place.

    Mr McCready, 68, was asked why he took these cases.

    “It’s what I have been doing for 50 years. Nothing different, nothing new. I don’t go out looking for them, people find me. While I have got breath in my body and I am in reasonable sort of health I will continue to do it.”

    “Mr McCready is also taking a private prosecution against police for not prosecuting Banks in the first place and that would be his next project.”

    Yay Mr McCready!

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  115. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    Looks like there is a 72hr. ceasefire going into effect in Gaza at 8.00 am ME time – that would be around 5 pm. today our time, if my guess is correct.
    Brokered by Egypt after Ban Ki Moon’s visit last week.

    Will be interesting to see if Hamas honours this ceasefire – the haven’t the past three. Here’s hoping.

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  116. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    I hope that the truce is not used by Israel to invest an extra 16000 troops into their genocidal operation or to resupply the ammunition of the current bunch of kid killers.

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  117. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    “……or to resupply the ammunition of the current bunch of kid killers.”

    Well, let’s just hope that Hamas stops shielding themselves with children then, eh jackoffinabox. The cowards have done that for 30 years, and have made an art form of it.

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  118. big bruv (13,902 comments) says:

    jack

    I hope the Israel’s do just that. I hope they are totally prepared the next time these Islamofacists kick off, I hope they wipe the bastards off the face of the earth.

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  119. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    jackinabox
    I am !00% sure that any peace will be used by Hamas to re supply and increase the troops for their openly declared genocidal war on Israel.

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  120. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    “The buggers are swamping the United Sates:”

    Of course they are , more ‘diversity” ,less American ,more future Democrat voters,more central, big government.

    The only answer is the grass roots democracy of the patriotic Tea Partiers.

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  121. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    An individual calling itself jackinabox opines:

    “I hope that the truce is not used by Israel to invest an extra 16000 troops into their genocidal operation or to resupply the ammunition of the current bunch of kid killers.”

    Take a look at REAL kid killers ya dick. These guys make anything at all done by Israel in defending itself look perfectly reasonable by comparison. Kids raped. Kids, even toddlers, having their hearts cut out, by Muslims. But of course, it’s not being done by Jews so you could not care less. Don’t pretend to care about children when you and your ilk are silent about crimes likes this:

    http://www.islam-watch.org/authors/138-jake-neuman/1552-the-obscenity-of-islam.html

    Hypocrite.

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  122. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    What that ISIS crowd does to its victims has no bearing on the fact that Israel is a terrorist state.

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  123. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Judith I simply dont know if Banks is lying,I dont know, but a court has found him guilty s based on evidence provided he must be.
    He has the right of appeal and is doing so,his right.
    1.Do we call him innocent or guilty?
    2.Do we believe him?
    3.Why do you question his honesty,when you always believe David Bain,as he never lied did he?

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  124. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Just because he was found guilty doesn’t make him innocent.

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  125. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “What that ISIS crowd does to its victims has no bearing ”

    Translation: “I don’t care about kids being raped and having their hearts cut out because the perpetrators of these crimes are not Jews, and my Lefty masters have told me not to criticize anything done by the enemies of the Jews.”

    “on the fact that Israel is a terrorist state.”

    ISIS is a terrorist state. Gaza is a terrorist state. Iran is a terrorist state.

    Israel is a democracy.

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  126. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Israel is a democracy.”

    So is the USA but that doesn’t stop it from doing massive terrorist acts.

    The only way to stop terrorism is to address the issues that lead people to do desperate acts.

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  127. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    The Left really needs a new slogan.

    “Socialism. Excusing the worlds worst evils since 1917.”

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  128. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “The only way to stop terrorism is to address the issues that lead people to do desperate acts.”

    Yes. It’s called Islam. But the Left does not want to address that. It’s politically incorrect. Which is why you and your ilk stick your heads in the sand about it.

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  129. minus (197 comments) says:

    Uh oh, are Mrs Cunliffe and Shan Inglis about to move in together and share war stories?
    comment – http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/08/give-eating-chinese-instead/#disqus_thread

    Seems to be enough smoke for you to wonder if there is a fire somewhere
    It could be good to know before the Election with this one?

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  130. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Take a look at REAL kid killers ya dick. These guys make anything at all done by Israel in defending itself look perfectly reasonable by comparison. Kids raped. Kids, even toddlers, having their hearts cut out, by Muslims.

    These horrific crimes conflict with the principles of Islam, just as the targeting of the innocent by the IDF conflicts with the principles of Judaism. Also, the article mentions that the worst crime was carried out by Syrian opposition fighters backed by the Obama administration.

    The common theme here is the criminal behaviour of US-Zionist alliance. Blaming any particular religion for it simply deflects attention from the real cause of the problem.

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  131. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Shawn, I’m not a Lefty or a righty, an inny or an outy, I’m just a spectator. I say it as I see it and what I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide. Netanyahu and his gang of insane killers are behaving like Nazis.

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  132. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Shawn, I’m not a Lefty or a righty,”

    Bullshit. Your posts always take a Left wing pov.

    “and what I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide.”

    Then you don’t understand what the word genocide actually means.

    “Netanyahu and his gang of insane killers are behaving like Nazis.”

    Islamic fascists are the real heir’s to the Nazis, and you support them.

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  133. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    CHRISTIAN COPTIC GIRLS KIDNAPPED-RAPED AND FORCED TO CONVERT TO ISLAM (EGYPT)

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  134. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Don’t talk tripe Shawn.

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  135. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    The Muslim – Nazi Connection.

    Support for Nazism was not limited to the former Mufti. Here are some quotes from Arab leaders on Hitler, and Nazism:

    “We admired the Nazis. We were immersed in reading Nazi literature and books . . . . We were the first who thought of [an Arab] translation of Mein Kampf. Anyone who lived in Damascus at that time was witness to the Arab inclination toward Nazism,” recalled Sami al-Joundi, one of the founders of Syria’s ruling Ba’ath Party.

    Indeed, a popular WWII song was heard in the Middle East featuring words: Bissama Allah, oria alard Hitler – in heaven Allah, on earth Hitler. Picking up the theme of the book, posters were put up in Arab markets and elsewhere proclaiming, “In heaven Allah is thy ruler; on earth Adolph Hitler.”

    Nazi Roots of Palestinian Nationalism

    “On November 28, 1941 the former Mufti was officially received by Hitler, who agreed to establish a bureau for al-Husseini which was used to spread propaganda on behalf of Nazi Germany, organize spy rings in Europe and the Middle East, and, most importantly, establish Muslim Nazi SS divisions and Wehrmacht units in Bosnia, the Balkans, North Africa and Nazi-occupied parts of the Soviet Union. After the meeting, the Mufti was also named SS gruppenfuehrer by Heinrich Himmler and referred to as the “Fuhrer of the Arab World” by Hitler himself.”

    https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2013/07/19/the-muslim-nazi-connection/

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  136. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Why Did so Many Wanted Nazis Convert to Islam?

    “There are Nazi grafts in Arab-Islamic terrorism.

    At the top of the most wanted list of the Simon Wiesenthal Center there is a man who today would be one hundred years old. His name is Alois Brunner and he is responsible for the deaths of over 130,000 Jews. The Nazi hunters still place him in Syria, where he was last seen in 2001, protected by the regime of Bashar al-Assad.

    Brunner was one of the most zealous ideologues and officials of the “Final Solution”, the plan for the extermination of the Jews. The idea haunted him to the point that in 1985 he said to the German magazine Bunte: “I regret that I didn’t finish the job”.

    When the United Arab Republic of Syria was formed, Dr. Brunner took up residence at 7 George Haddad, in the embassy district of Damascus. In 1961, the year that Adolf Eichmann was captured by the Israelis in Buenos Aires, Brunner received a bomb-letter, probably from the Mossad and lost an eye.

    Brunner, a personal friend of Hafez el Assad, took part in the construction of Syria’s secret services on the model of the Gestapo.”

    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/14066

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  137. big bruv (13,902 comments) says:

    jackinabox

    “The only way to stop terrorism is to address the issues that lead people to do desperate acts.”

    Clearly you have no idea of how the Islamofacists think. Nor do you have any appreciation of history. Of course the other explanation to your seeming stupidity might be that you are just telling lies.

    What least these rag head fuckwits to do ‘desperate acts’ is their religion. The ‘desperate acts’ you talk about are mandated in the Quran and the Hadith.

    Tell me Jack, just where do you start addressing the issues with a group of people who have a bottom line of reintroducing the holocaust all over again?

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  138. KiwiGreg (3,255 comments) says:

    “what I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide”

    No you’re not. If the Israelis wanted Gazans dead, they’d be dead. Syria with a far weaker military has killed multiple numbers of Syrians in a much more difficult country. Israel gains nothing by killing a couple of thousand Palestinians and loses much. Unless you think the Israelis just aren’t very good at killing Palestinians.

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  139. Pete George (23,567 comments) says:

    Craig’s Chinese farm deal reveal – how Conservative is this?

    Mr Craig said Conservatives would oppose all large, productive land sales and change the Overseas Investment Office criteria “so that our country is not sold up”.

    “The National party waved through the Crafar Farms deal against our national interests and doubtless will do the same with Lochinver station.

    “We are standing up for Kiwis who want this country to remain New Zealand owned,” he said.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11302623

    Doesn’t sound very right wing or free market.

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  140. Yoza (1,875 comments) says:

    tom hunter (4,435 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 8:23 am

    Who during the Vietnam War on either side of the conflict could have imagined that such a bourgeois place would ever appear in Hanoi while the Communist Party still ruled? Ho Chi Minh sure as hell didn’t expect this. Nor would he have wanted it. Fidel Castro would hate it. Of that I assure you.

    Pol Pot would have wanted to murder everyone in there.

    You have yourselves a communist revolution, fight a war with capitalists, kill a shitload of class enemies, push a ton of others out to sea, sit on your ass with five year plans until it all gets worse – and then you go back to capitalism anyway. Brilliant.

    Stories like this must really fill thepeoplesflag and Yoza with despair. :)

    Why? You seem stuck in some weird bubble, Tomithy, where everyone must conform to the stereotype you have developed for them.

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  141. mandk (993 comments) says:

    jackinabox: “I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide”

    That’s just plain dumb.

    If that is what Israel wanted, they could have done it inside a week.

    The ones bent on genocide are Hamas – its part of their charter.

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  142. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    Wouldn’t it be a hoot if John Banks’ “watertight” new evidence showed that Kim Dotcom had perjured himself at the recent High Court trial. That’d certainly put a cat amongst the pigeons…

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  143. stephieboy (3,091 comments) says:

    Yoza, yet another Stalinist and Maoist apologist for Pol Pot and the now rather more bourgeois Vietnam Communist party.

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  144. Longknives (4,753 comments) says:

    Stay Classy Tangata Whenua..

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11302518

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  145. stephieboy (3,091 comments) says:

    “Conspiratorial” Right-Wing Media Claim Obama “Deliberately” “Planned” Border Crisis

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/07/16/conspiratorial-right-wing-media-claim-obama-del/200123

    I understand that Queen Sarah is considering her options including advice from her court both within the US , here and elsewhere to nuke the border area.

    The whole charade of baseless hysterical accusations by the far right has Benghazi , Boston Bombing and Sandy Nook written all over it.

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  146. big bruv (13,902 comments) says:

    Longknives

    That is what colonisation does to people. It is not her fault.

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  147. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “The whole charade of baseless hysterical accusations by the far right”

    Lois Lerner.

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  148. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “what I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide”

    “No you’re not. If the Israelis wanted Gazans dead, they’d be dead.”

    Israel wants all Palestinians dead, that’s obvious. If it weren’t for the fact that the whole world is watching the murderous criminal gang currently ruling Israel would have their very own version of the killing factories that the Nazis had during WW2. They’ve had to call it quits at 1000 plus this time because most of the right thinking people in the world have said, enough already, you fucking gang of kid killers.

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  149. big bruv (13,902 comments) says:

    jack

    “Israel wants all Palestinians dead, that’s obvious”

    Obvious to who?. Nobody but the most deluded think that Israel is doing anything other than fighting back or defending herself. You really must stop telling these lies.

    You are well aware that the Israelis are showing restraint, if they wanted to demolish the whole of Gaza they could.

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  150. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    Jahadinabox.

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  151. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Israel wants all Palestinians dead, that’s obvious.”

    Bollocks. So in actual fact you have zero evidence for your “genocide” claim other than your bias.

    Thanks for admitting you’re a liar.

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  152. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “what I am currently seeing is the terrorist state of Israel committing genocide”

    No you’re not. If the Israelis wanted Gazans dead, they’d be dead.

    You’re ignoring the problem of the very bad press that would arise from an overt act of genocide by the Zionists.
    There is a fair amount of public opposition to the assault on Gaza from both within and without the state of Israel, public knowledge of genocide could cause the Zionists a real PR headache.

    According to the Oded Yinon plan the objective is not genocide but rather the acquistion of territory. Apparently the current strategy is to make life unbearable for the Palestinians so that they leave, enabling the state to expand its territory.

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  153. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    A rebuttal to the genocide lie from a people who actually have experience with the real thing.

    “I cannot remain silent and allow the Palestinians to gain credibility at our expense by claiming commonality with us. I cannot stand by while they trivialize our plight by tying it to theirs, which is largely self-inflicted. Our population of over 65 million was violently reduced to a mere 10 million, a slaughter unprecedented in human history. To compare that in whatever way to the Palestinians’ story is deeply offensive to me. The Palestinians did lose the land they claim is theirs, but they were repeatedly given the opportunity to build their state on it and to partner with the Jews — and they persistently refused peace overtures and chose war. We were never given that chance.” – – Ryan Bellerose, a member of the Métis nation of Canada

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  154. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    ‘ if they wanted to demolish the whole of Gaza they could.”

    They could and would if the whole world wasn’t watching.

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  155. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Thanks for admitting you’re a liar.

    Oh, the irony.

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  156. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “According to the Oded Yinon plan the objective is not genocide but rather the acquistion of territory.”

    Except the Oded Yinon plan is not and never has been Israeli state policy.

    Liar.

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  157. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “They could and would if the whole world wasn’t watching.”

    Liar. Provide the actual evidence otherwise all you have is opinion, not fact.

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  158. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Except the Oded Yinon plan is not and never has been Israeli state policy.

    Wrong.

    In his Complete Diaries, Vol. II. p. 711, Theodore Herzl, the founder of Zionism, says that the area of the Jewish State stretches: “From the Brook of Egypt to the Euphrates.”

    This is not a new idea, nor does it surface for the first time in Zionist strategic thinking. Indeed, fragmenting all Arab states into smaller units has been a recurrent theme. This theme has been documented on a very modest scale in the AAUG publication, Israel’s Sacred Terrorism (1980), by Livia Rokach. Based on the memoirs of Moshe Sharett, former Prime Minister of Israel, Rokach’s study documents, in convincing detail, the Zionist plan as it applies to Lebanon and as it was prepared in the mid-fifties.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/

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  159. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Liar. Provide the actual evidence otherwise all you have is opinion, not fact.:

    They kill sleeping kids in a UN “safe Haven” while the world is watching, just imagine what they’d do if they had somewhere secret to do it in.

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  160. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    THE LIES OF THOSE WHO HATE ISRAEL AND HOW TO STOP THEM: THE ODED YINON CONSPIRACY THEORY.

    .’This theory centres on an obscure journal article written in 1982 by Israeli journalist Oded Yinon entitled ‘A Strategy for Israel in the Nineteen Eighties’ in the Zionist journal Kivvonim. This article is the basis for ream upon ream of anti-Zionist writing upon the internet, a quick google will uncover potentially exponential numbers of crank articles on Israel’s true intentions.

    Oden Yinon’s article was originally published in English under the title, ‘Making the Arab World Collapse’ in the Journal of Palestinian Studies (1982, University of California Press). It was re-translated – for deliberately political ends – by ‘self-hating Jew’ Israel Shahak. As anyone familiar with Shahak’s work could hazard a guess on, the Shahak translation is rather different from the one that is presented in the academic journal. This may perhaps seem like a rather onanistic splitting of hairs, but in the context in which those who hate the state of Israel use it, it is all rather important.”

    https://allthemorereason.wordpress.com/2006/07/07/the-lies-of-those-who-hate-israel-and-how-to-stop-them/

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  161. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “In his Complete Diaries, Vol. II. p. 711, Theodore Herzl, the founder of Zionism, says that the area of the Jewish State stretches: “From the Brook of Egypt to the Euphrates.””

    So? That was his opinion, and it has never been Israeli State policy.

    Liar.

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  162. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “They kill sleeping kids in a UN “safe Haven””

    Because HAMAS uses civilians and safe havens to hide behind. The fault is your Muslim friends, who amongst other things seem to like raping ten year old Christian girls and cutting the hearts out of toddlers.

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  163. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    ’This theory centres on an obscure journal article written in 1982 …

    Actually, it centers on the fact that the founder of Zionism described the territory of the Zionist state in the same terms as the land of the Abrahamic covenant of Genesis 15. If the Zionist state truly represented the rebirth of the nation of Israel, they why would the founder of the state attempt to dispossess the descendants of Ishmael of their rightful inheritance?

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  164. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Italian reporter confirms: Hamas rocket killed children on playground.

    “Hamas blames the IDF, of course, and so does the international media. But now this reporter, out of Gaza and safe from what he tellingly refers to as “Hamas retaliation,” confirms the Israeli account. The propaganda facade is broken yet again.”

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/07/italian-reporter-confirms-hamas-rocket-killed-children-on-playground

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  165. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “why would the founder of the state attempt to dispossess the descendants of Ishmael of their rightful inheritance?”

    Israel is not their rightful inheritance. Most so-called “palestinians” are recent Arab immigrants from pretty much every in the ME EXCEPT Israel.

    It’s a standard Muslim tactic. Flood an area with Muslims, make false claims that they have rights to the land, wage terrorist war against the real rightful heirs.

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  166. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    ISIS is a terrorist state. Gaza is a terrorist state. Iran is a terrorist state.

    Israel is a democracy.

    I told you all back in 2011 that the Zionist plan for Iraq was to break it up into three states: Sunni, Shiite and Kurd. The Kurd’s territory sits on the bulk of the Iraqi oil fields. And guess who’s been chuming up to the Kurds ever since 2003? That’s right. Iswael.

    Where did ISIS come from? How can a force like that come out of nowhere? In the real world, people don’t just organise themselves like that, do they.

    Everyone who’s educated knows that Syria’s troubles have been caused by the US-sponsored “insurgent” groups (notice the labelling the presstitutes use for the useful idiots…). ISIS is now a big problem in their territory as well.

    This, like Ukraine, has Brzezhinsky’s architectural paw prints all over it. And we all know Brez is a neocon at heart. And we all know the neocons are pulling Obama’s strings. (When I say “we” I am of course referring to those who’ve bothered to educate themselves in how the world works, which isn’t, strangely, a subject featured on Fox or any of the networks or even any of the compliant, clubby think-tanks and lobby groups websites, either. Go figure…) Anyway…

    1+1=?

    And when ISIS and other assorted thugs pretending to represent Islam but in reality, just being the thugs they really are, do what thugs do, Shawn, the useful idiot with a hammer, pretends this doesn’t mean 1+1 hasn’t sponsored, equipped, trained and commanded them. Talk about a moron.

    And of course as I’ve also been telling you for years, we are being lead into a Muslim-Christian conflict. That’s the big picture in which to place all these individual puzzle pieces.

    And duh, if that’s really what they’re doing, then der, of course it’s not going to be “Israeli state policy” or “US state policy” or anything else. Der.

    I mean, anyone who really thinks the way the world works is by politicians fulfilling the will of the people by promulgating then executing “state policy” and that’s all that ever happens and that explains every little and big event we’ve ever seen happen in the whole world, is a galloping meathead moron times eleventy gajillion who probably poohs their pants and dribbles a lot.

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  167. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    IT’s about “Zionism” not Jews, right????

    Germany: Muslim throws petrol bombs at synagogue.

    BERLIN: German police arrested an 18-year-old man after petrol bombs were thrown at a synagogue in the western town of Wuppertal overnight, they said in a statement on Wednesday.

    “According to investigations, three suspects threw several incendiary devices at the entrance,” police said. No one was hurt and it appears no damage was done to the synagogue, they said. A local resident had alerted them when she saw a fire close to the building.

    Prosecutor Hans-Joachim Kiskel said the nationality of the arrested suspect was not clear but added that the man had told authorities he was Palestinian.

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/07/germany-muslim-throws-petrol-bombs-at-synagogue

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  168. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    Israel is not their rightful inheritance.

    So where is the land that is the rightful inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael, Shawn?
    It didn’t just cease to exist as the Zionists would have you believe.

    The founder of the Zionist state described the bounds of the territory of the state of Israel, are you going to contradict him with some new state policy?

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  169. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Digging Out the Graves of Non-Muslims for Vengeance or Looting – A ‘Holy’ Tradition of Prophet Muhammad.

    “Recently a Christian father in Egypt was murdered in broad daylight on the street in front of his son by the followers of the ‘religion of peace’. The killing itself didn’t become big news for the world community, as if it is the right of Muslims to oppress and kill non-Muslims in Muslim-majority countries. However, the incident became a news only after the Muslim barbarians did the unimaginable: They dug out the corpse of the murdered Christian father from his grave, dragged it through the streets, and mutilated it.

    This incident will certainly be shocking to non-Muslims. It will also be shocking to most of the ignorant Muslims, who bang their heads five times a day, without ever knowing much about their ‘religion’. But had they known Islam, the ‘Religion of peace’, well enough, this incident would not have been shocking or unusual to them. It is indeed a Sunnah, the holy tradition of Prophet Muhammad, left to his followers to emulate for the eternity to come. There are many incidents during the prophet’s time recorded in Sahih Hadiths, wherein Muslims dug out the corpse of non-Muslims from graves as a vengeance or for looting.”

    http://www.islam-watch.org/authors/117-ghalib/1541-digging-out-the-graves-of-non-muslims-for-vengeance-or-looting-a-holy-tradition-of-prophet-muhammad.html

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  170. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “So where is the land that is the rightful inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael, Shawn?”

    Arabia.

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  171. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-31/markets-turmoil-russell-2000-plunges-most-over-2-years

    Buy silver.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2710772/Mystery-rechargeable-batteries-lose-charge-rapidly-revealed-discovery-lead-cells-30-YEARS.html

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  172. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Muhammad and His Sahaba Were All Rapists.

    “In this article, I do not provide much analysis as the evidence from hadiths talks for itself. I provided evidence in an earlier posting, showing that Muhammad was a rapist. In this article, I extend on that evidence to show that Muhammad’s male comrades, called Sahaba, were also rapist. I also show that Muhammad himself gave approvals to the rape actions of the Sahaba as acceptable practice.”

    http://www.islam-watch.org/authors/59-kammuna/1505-muhammad-and-his-sahaba-were-all-rapists.html

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  173. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “So where is the land that is the rightful inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael, Shawn?”

    Arabia.

    Do you mean the northern part of Arabia which falls within the land of the Abrahamic covenant and the territory of the Oden Yinon plan, or the southern part below it?

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  174. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    I mean any land that is Arabic due to history and ethnicity, which excludes the State of Israel.

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  175. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Debunking the Palestine Lie.

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  176. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Chaos by Design

    At the center of chaos, the wild-eyed President Obama strikes blindly, oblivious of the consequences, willing to risk a financial debacle or a nuclear war. He enforces sanctions against Iran; imposes sanctions on Russia; sets up missile bases five launch minutes from Moscow; sends killer drones against Pakistan, Yemen and Afghanistan; arms mercenaries in Syria; trains and equips Kurds in Iraq and pays for Israel’s savagery against Gaza.

    Nothing works.

    The Chaos President is blind to the fact that starving one’s adversaries does not secure submission: it unites them to resist. Regime change, imposing proxies by force and subterfuge, can destroy the social fabric of complex societies: Million of peasants and workers become uprooted refugees. Popular social movements are replaced by organized criminal gangs and bandit armies.

    The US-backed Kiev aviation authorities re-directed international passenger airlines to fly over war zones bristling with anti-aircraft missiles while Kiev’s jets bombed the rebellious cities and towns. One flight was shot down and nearly 300 civilians perished. Immediately an explosion of accusations from Kiev blaming Russian President Putin flooded Western media with no real facts to explain the tragedy/crime. War-crazy President Obama and the slavering prime ministers of the EU ejaculated ultimatums, threatening to convert Russia into a pariah state. ‘Sanctions, sanctions, everywhere . . . but first… France must complete its $1.5 billion sale to the Russian navy.’ And the City of London exempts the Russian oligarchs from the ‘sanctions’, embedded as they are in London’s money-laundering, parasitical FIRE (Fire, Insurance and Real Estate) economy. The Cold War has returned and has taken an ugly turn… with exceptions…for business….

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-emperors-rage-let-chaos-envelop-the-world/5393817

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  177. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    I mean any land that is Arabic due to history and ethnicity, which excludes the State of Israel.

    So you are saying that the territory of the state of Israel has priority over the land of inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael?

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  178. calendar girl (1,236 comments) says:

    Judith @ 11.30am. No “milk of human kindness” from you in the final paragraph of that comment, Judith. Perhaps not surprisingly when you associate yourself with jackinabox’s odious comment (although without quite understanding its metaphorical significance.

    The Court has found that John Banks broke the law, and has sentenced him accordingly, but for myself I still feel able to experience sadness for a man who has beaten the depressing odds of his family and his upbringing, and contributed much to society through his public service. Despite his lapse that the Court has now punished, he has always appeared to me to be a decent person of substance and integrity.

    I also think in these situations of errors that I have made in my own life that have gone undetected and unpunished. Most of us find ourselves in that situation from time to time, and I’ve heard some of a religious bent sometimes saying something like “There but for the grace of God go I”.

    You yourself don’t seem to have any such ‘past behaviour’ regrets, Judith, as the absence of compassion at the end of your comment testifies. What I prefer not to assess, however, is the degree to which pure politics may have motivated the unbecoming vitriol in your final paragraph.

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  179. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    “So you are saying that the territory of the state of Israel has priority over the land of inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael?”

    No answer from ShawnLH. The outcome here is either to accept that the state has the right of premption of a pre-existing covenant, or to accept that the land of inheritance remains the same as it was in the beginning, with separate areas for Jews and Muslims with the area between the Nile and Euphrates.

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  180. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Who was America’s first Pres? (It wasn’t Washington)…

    http://rense.com/general96/whowasamfirst.html

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  181. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “So you are saying that the territory of the state of Israel has priority over the land of inheritance of the descendants of Ishmael?”

    No, I am saying that the descendent’s of Ishmael have no right to the land of Israel. The blessing of God follows the line of Isaac and his descendent’s.

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  182. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    The Steady Rise of African Zionism.

    “There is something quite remarkable happening on the African continent. A groundswell of love and support from African Christians for the State of Israel, forged in biblical ties and a mutual love of the land.

    It is a relationship that has endured and survived political hardships. And at a time when Israel is feeling increasingly isolated, it is very welcome. Voices calling for boycotts, divestment, and sanctions against the Jewish State grow louder around the world, but the ties binding us to Africa grow stronger.”

    http://www.whyisrael.org/2014/04/29/the-steady-rise-of-african-zionism/

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  183. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    UglyTruth

    A Google query reveals that Ishmael was born in 1911BC. Muhammad didn’t invent Islam until about 700AD so the original divvy up of the ME favouring the Israeliis is probably the correct one.

    Unless you mean land taken by conquest in which case the Turks being descendants of the Ottoman Empire probably have more rights to the land than those who call themselves Palestinian.

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  184. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Israel is a sign of hope: A conversation with Rabbi David Brodman.

    “There is a story in the Talmud about Rabbi Akiva, who came to the Temple Mount with his friends for the first time after the destruction of the temple. They saw then that everything had been ploughed up. The Romans wanted to wipe out every reminder of the Jews from Aelia Capitolina. Everything had been ploughed up and they saw foxes coming out of their dens. Then they started to cry: ‘the place where only the high priest was allowed to enter, once a year and now foxes are running around there!’ Then Rabbi Akiva laughed and said: ‘why are you crying?’ ‘And why, then, are you laughing?’ He said: ‘when I saw the foxes I knew that what the prophets say is true. For first it says: Zion will be ploughed up like a field and foxes will walk on it. When I saw that I did not know whether I was to take it literally. But then I saw that the prophet also says: ‘old people, women and men, will again sit in Jerusalem’s streets’ and I did not know whether I was to take that literally. Now, however, after the destruction, that I see how literally the negative prophecy has been fulfilled, should this not give me the courage to believe in the other prophecy, that Jerusalem will be rebuilt; that the old people will sit there and children will play there?’ And then I say: we are seeing now what Rabbi Akiva saw to a limited extent – and a lot more. We are two thousand years further on and everything lay desolate for two thousand years. The Temple Mount was sometimes treated in a terrible way. And see, we are coming back. Old people are sitting in Yerushalayim; children are dancing in the streets. ”

    http://www.whyisrael.org/2012/02/13/israel-is-a-sign-of-hope-a-conversation-with-rabbi-david-brodman/

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  185. goldnkiwi (1,304 comments) says:

    Do I get a tee-shirt? :)

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  186. cricko (330 comments) says:

    So. This little arsehole maintains his innocence but is so very, very remorsefull.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/10338246/No-parole-for-Rod-Petricevic

    Shit he’s only been in jail 5 minutes, good decent honest people lost everything because of
    his dishonesty.

    You can bet that he has kept up his membership of the Remuera golf club while “paying his debt to society.”

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  187. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Good analysis of the widespread use by the West of the propaganda “human shield” meme.

    Not of course that the useful idiots enthralled by the puppeteers will be watching any of it. No. They’ll naturally stop the wretched video after the first 5 seconds and reach for the mouse to aim at the downtick, before screaming outraged in their fevered delusion: don’t you know it’s – gasp – RT????????!!!!!!!!! FFS!!!!!!!!!!

    All the while pretending to themselves it was their mind using logic, rather than the real cause, their tummy; that was resisting the quite logical, quite factual information transmission; lest they regard themselves as quite the fool, for all these years, for ever having been so stupid as to ever believe such palpably and transparently false complete and utter bollocks.

    To Shawn: on Rabbi Akiva: http://rense.com/general60/ereh.htm

    P.S. Don if you read this, you should read that too. This is the heart of the issue.

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  188. Fletch (6,390 comments) says:

    Charles Krauthammer has an excellent article about how John Kerry is totally stuffing up negotiations. Egypt already had a ceasefire proposal in place, which Kerry just had to agree to, and which would have defanged Hamas. Most of the other Arab countries (especially Egypt) want to see Hamas gone as well.

    Instead, what does Kerry do? He flies off to Paris and works out a different deal there – almost acting as Hamas’ lawyer.

    John Kerry is upset by heavy criticism from Israelis — left, right and center — of his recent cease-fire diplomacy. But that’s only half the story. More significant is the consternation of America’s Arab partners, starting with the president of the Palestinian Authority. Mahmoud Abbas was stunned that Kerry would fly off to Paris to negotiate with Hamas allies Qatar and Turkey in talks that excluded the PA and Egypt.

    The talks also undermined Egypt’s cease-fire proposal, which Israel had accepted and Hamas rejected (and would have prevented the vast majority of the casualties on both sides). “Kerry tried through his latest plan to destroy the Egyptian bid,” charged a senior Palestinian official quoted in the Arab daily Asharq Al-Awsat — a peace plan that the PA itself had supported.

    It gets worse. Kerry did not just trample an Egyptian initiative. It was backed by the entire Arab League and specifically praised by Saudi Arabia. With the exception of Qatar — more a bank than a country — the Arabs are unanimous in wanting to see Hamas weakened, if not overthrown. The cease-fire-in-place they backed would have denied Hamas any reward for starting this war, while what Kerry brought back from Paris granted practically all of its demands.

    Which is what provoked the severe criticism Kerry received at home. When as respected and scrupulously independent a national security expert as David Ignatius calls Kerry’s intervention a blunder, you know this is not partisan carping from the usual suspects. This is general amazement at Kerry’s cluelessness.

    Kerry seems oblivious to the strategic reality that Hamas launched its rockets in the hope not of defeating Israel but of ending its intra-Arab isolation (which it brilliantly achieves in the Qatar-Turkey peace proposal). Hamas’s radicalism has alienated nearly all of its Arab neighbors.

    ●Egypt cut it off — indeed blockaded Gaza — because of Hamas’s support for the Muslim Brotherhood and terrorist attacks on Egyptian soldiers in Sinai.

    ●Fatah, the main element of the Palestinian Authority, is a bitter enemy, particularly since its Gaza members were terrorized, kneecapped, expelled and/or killed when Hamas seized Gaza in a 2007 coup.

    ●Hamas is non grata in Syria, where it had been previously headquartered, for supporting the anti-government rebels.

    ●Hamas is deeply opposed by Jordan, Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states, which see it, correctly, as yet another branch of the Islamist movement that threatens relatively moderate pro-Western Arab states.

    Kerry seems not to understand that the Arab League backed the Egyptian cease-fire-in-place, which would have left Hamas weak and isolated, to ensure that Hamas didn’t emerge from this war strengthened and enhanced.

    Why didn’t Kerry just stay home and declare unequivocal U.S. support for the Egyptian/Arab League plan? Instead, he flew off to Paris and sent Jerusalem a package of victories for Hamas: lifting the blockade from Egypt, opening the border with Israel, showering millions of foreign cash to pay the salaries of the 43,000 (!) government workers that the near-insolvent Hamas cannot.

    Forget about Israeli interests. Forget about Arab interests. The American interest is to endorse and solidify this emerging axis of moderate pro-American partners (Israel, Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and other Gulf states, and the Palestinian Authority) intent on seeing Islamist radicalism blunted and ultimately defanged.

    Yet America’s secretary of state doesn’t see it. Speaking of Hamas-run Gaza, Kerry actually said in Paris: “The Palestinians can’t have a cease-fire in which they think the status quo is going to stay.” What must change? Gazans need “goods that can come in and out . . . a life that is free from the current restraints.”

    But the only reason for those “restraints,” why goods are unable to go in and out, is that for a decade Hamas has used this commerce to import and develop weapons for making war on Israel.

    Remember the complaints that the heartless Israelis were not allowing enough imports of concrete for schools and hospitals? Well, now we know where the concrete went — into an astonishingly vast array of tunnels for infiltrating neighboring Israeli villages and killing civilians. (More than half a million tons, estimates the Israeli military.)

    Lifting the blockade would mean a flood of arms, rockets, missile parts and other implements of terror for Hamas. What is an American secretary of state doing asserting that Hamas cannot cease fire unless it gets that?

    Moreover, the fire from which Hamas will not cease consists of deliberate rocket attacks on Israeli cities — by definition, a war crime.

    Whatever his intent, Kerry legitimized Hamas’s war criminality. Which makes his advocacy of Hamas’s terms not just a strategic blunder — enhancing a U.S.-designated terrorist group just when a wall-to-wall Arab front wants to see it gone — but a moral disgrace.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/charles-krauthammer-clueless-in-gaza/2014/07/31/d781a286-18e8-11e4-9e3b-7f2f110c6265_story.html

    Kerry is a f***** disgrace. The U.S is supposed to be on Israel’s side, but these lefties obviously aren’t.

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  189. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Trapped in Gaza: How Hamas punishes reporters for the truth

    Journalists who have taken pictures of Hamas operatives preparing to shoot rockets from civilian structures and/or fighting in civilian clothing have been threatened by Hamas operatives and had their equipment confiscated.

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/trapped-in-gaza-how-hamas-punishes-reporters-for-the-truth/story-e6frg6zo-1227007768903

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  190. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Not sure if the annoying YouTube indexing has advanced that 6.04 vid through the playlist. If so this is it without the index.

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  191. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    From the master of brainless gullibility, Reid: “To Shawn: on Rabbi Akiva: http://rense.com/general60/ereh.htm

    From the same web site Reid promotes:

    “Will Ferrell Promotes Jewish Agenda (big surprise)” ( Note that phrase, the JEWISH AGENDA.)

    “The Illuminati Depopulation Agenda”

    “Brave Jew Sniper Executes Injured Palestinian”

    “Jews Using Gaza Slaughter To Solicit Donations!” (Again, note the use of “Jew” not Zionist or Israeli)

    “Alien Artifacts On The Moon”

    “UFOLOGY Has Little Influence In The Scientific Community”

    “UFO Seen Hovering Over Neighbor’s Home In PA”

    “12 Reasons To Stop Using Microwaves NOW”

    “Do Animals Have ESP?”

    “William Moore – UFO Opportunist Or Disinfo Agent?”

    “Has Chemtrail/Geoengineering Movement Been Hijacked?”

    “The Word Warfare Of Rabid Psychotic Zionism”

    So, here folks is the kind of web site Reid uses for information. UFO’s. Alien artifacts on the moon, Chemtrails. Evil Microwaves. The Illuminati. Animals have ESP. And of course lots about evil Jews.

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  192. Grant (444 comments) says:

    Bloody hell Reid! You really are quite mad.
    G

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  193. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    From the same web site Reid promotes:

    Websites aren’t important Shawn. It’s the information they contain. But if you’ve only got a hammer, then you wouldn’t understand that elementary and logical distinction.

    You should read Ehrlich’s books. I guarantee you’ll learn many things. And he’s a much holier man than you, your wife, or I. And he’s a Jew.

    Bloody hell Reid! You really are quite mad.

    Yes, cognitive dissonance sufferers might think that G. Perhaps if you can stop thinking with your tummy, you might make some progress toward unfolding reality. Lest it all surprises you, when the hammer finally falls, and your world changes in an instant, straight out of, to you, nowhere.

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  194. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    Whereby “quite” means a thousand million times. :-)

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  195. Fletch (6,390 comments) says:

    A very good documentary film made in 2005 called The Forgotten Refugees about the nearly 1 million Jews that were forced from Arab lands.

    The Forgotten Refugees is a 2005 documentary film produced by The David Project and IsraTV that recounts the rich history of the ancient Jewish communities of the Middle East and North Africa and their rapid demise in the face of persecution in the decades following the creation of the modern State of Israel in 1948. The film was directed by Michael Grynszpan with Ralph Avi Goldwasser serving as the executive producer.

    The film won two awards –

    The Forgotten Refugees won the “Best Documentary Film” at the 2007 Marbella Film Festival.[1]

    In 2006, the film won “Best Featured Documentary” at the Warsaw Jewish Film Festival.[2]

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  196. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Whereby “quite” means a thousand million times.

    You made me smile Manolo so I gave you an uptick, whereas if you’d said eleventy gajillion, I would have bothered to do some rearch and discovered how to give you two.

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  197. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Websites aren’t important Shawn. It’s the information they contain.”

    LOL!!!! :) :) :)

    Anyone else with more than two braincells to rub together see a wee problem with Reid’s statement? :)

    THAT Reid is cognitive dissonance!!! :)

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  198. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    ….”I would have bothered to do some rearch and discovered how to give you two.”….

    Just get hold of Baity Reid….he’s cracked it. :)

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  199. tom hunter (4,852 comments) says:

    Investigative Reporting?:

    The idea that one of Hamas’ main command bunkers is located beneath Shifa Hospital in Gaza City is one of the worst-kept secrets of the Gaza war. So why aren’t reporters in Gaza ferreting it out? The precise location of a large underground bunker equipped with sophisticated communications equipment and housing some part of the leadership of a major terrorist organization beneath a major hospital would seem to qualify as a world-class scoop—the kind that might merit a Pulitzer, or at least a Polk.

    It’s not a scoop as most of the reporters already know about it, which is hardly surprising because the Israelis themselves built it back in 1983 as a huge underground operating room, not that Hamas is being secretive either:

    So why isn’t the fact that Hamas uses Shifa Hospital as a command post making headlines? In part, it’s because the location is so un-secret that Hamas regularly meets with reporters there. On July 15, for example, William Booth of the Washington Post wrote that the hospital “has become a de facto headquarters for Hamas leaders, who can be seen in the hallways and offices.” Back in 2006, PBS even aired a documentary showing how gunmen roam the halls of the hospital, intimidate the staff, and deny them access to protected locations within the building.

    That’s pretty brazen – but it would still require some degree of cooperation from the reporters.

    To that end, the rules of reporting from Shifa Hospital are easy for any newbie reporter to understand: No pictures of members of Hamas with their weapons inside the hospital, and don’t go anywhere near the bunkers, or the operating rooms where members of Hamas are treated. While reporters can meet with members of Hamas inside the hospital—because it’s obviously convenient for everyone—they are not allowed to take pictures.

    Reporters inside Gaza who are risking their lives to bring the world whatever news they can should hardly be blamed for obeying Hamas’ media rules, which the organization has helpfully written down in case anyone has doubts about what they are permitted to show.

    The Hamas websites are really brazen. It’s like they don’t care who knows thus stuff, and in the case of those rules:

    Reporters who bravely or foolishly violate Hamas’ rules even on their social media accounts can be seen to repent with such alacrity that it’s not difficult to imagine how scared and dependent they are. Nick Casey of the Wall Street Journal, for example, tweeted that “You have to wonder w the shelling how patients at Shifa hospital feel as Hamas uses it as a safe place to see media.” Casey then quickly deleted his tweet, which didn’t save him from being put on a list of journalists who “lie/fabricate info for Israel” and “must be sued” – a threat which is surely the least of Casey’s fears.

    Last week, French-Palestinian journalist Radjaa Abu Dagg was summoned to Shifa by Hamas and interrogated. He wrote about the experience of “attempted intimidation” for Liberation—and then quickly had the paper take down the article.

    I guess that’s why we haven’t seen this story in all the Jewish controlled Western media, right? The article points out exactly what we do see on TV1 and TV3 every night:

    What Hamas has done, therefore, is to turn Shifa Hospital into a Hollywood sound-stage filled with real, live war victims who are used to score propaganda points, while the terrorists inside the hospital itself are erased from photographs and news accounts through a combination of pressure and threats, in order to produce the stories that Hamas wants. So if reporters aren’t entirely to blame for participating in this sick charade, then who is?

    Good question:

    it’s the job of editors, sitting thousands of miles away, at a very safe remove from the battlefield, to note that dispatches were produced under pressure, or that key information was removed by a government—as nearly all mainstream media outlets do when battlefield dispatches pass through the hands of the IDF censor.

    A good editor might attach similar notes to dispatches from combat zones controlled by terrorist organizations. He or she might also decide that reporting only the news that Hamas deems fit to print from Shifa Hospital isn’t actually reporting at all: It’s propaganda.

    A good editor? In the West?

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  200. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Yes, cognitive dissonance sufferers might think that G.”

    No, SANE people do not get their information from web sites that indulge in UFO conspiracies, the evil of microwave ovens, Chemtrails, Alien artifacts on the moon, and quite likely the odd sighting of Elvis Presley. It’s not cognitive dissonance to criticize the kind of whackjob nuttery you use in place of thinking.

    “Perhaps if you can stop thinking with your tummy”

    You really should get professional help with this creepy obsession with other peoples tummies.

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  201. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    Just get hold of Baity Reid….he’s cracked it.

    I’m taking him at his word nasska. He denied it and said it was a Whale beatup. Frankly I like both characters so I don’t wish to come down on a side when it’s not even my problem, but IMO RB isn’t the sort of person who would bother doing something like that for such a trite reason, and I’ve been following his line of thinking since he first surfaced here. Which is just over a decade. I may be wrong but that’s where I’m at on that.

    It’s a bit of a nasty one quite frankly. I mean how do you defend yourself against it. A bit like being accused of hating an entire race of people. When you only hate the leaders of that race because they’re leading that race to destruction… And you don’t even hate them, you only hate their actions.

    No, SANE people…

    As I’ve said Shawn, when you do [ALL] your thinking with [ONLY] a hammer, everything but everything looks like a nail. The real world doesn’t work like that. It has things called nuance, etc etc etc. I’m surprised your theological training clearly didn’t teach you that. Perhaps you wagged that particular lecture.

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  202. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “A bit like being accused of hating an entire race of people. When you only hate the leaders of that race because they’re leading that race to destruction… And you don’t even hate them, you only hate their actions.”

    I have never accused you of hating Muslims.

    And the only person here with a hammer is you Reid. Your hammer is conspiracy theory. The real world is far to complex and nuanced to try and fit everything into conspiracy theories. THAT is simplistic, hammer-like thinking.

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  203. cricko (330 comments) says:

    What a travesty of Justice.

    This slag should have been released into the farnow. She dun nuthin rong.

    This poor slag was just misunderstood.

    Clearly she is remorsefull, we can all see that.

    http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/methadone-mum-jailed-over-son-s-manslaughter-6043714

    In fact ‘Dame’ Susan Devoy should have nominated her for an award for services to motherhood.

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  204. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    I have never accused you of hating Muslims.

    Shawn since this issue between us started, has it ever occurred to you that perhaps I’m operating under a different gifting from the one He has given you and perhaps this is what generates our obvious chalk and cheese perspectives?

    I don’t know what you have, but perhaps you have the gift of compassion. I don’t know if that’s true, but what if I have the gift of deliverance?

    If that’s the case, then would that explain our interactions?

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  205. Southern Raider (1,830 comments) says:

    Tom
    An Italian journalist has just left Gaza this week and started exposing what is actually going on and admits that the journalists inside Gaza are shit scared of Hamas.

    It amazes me that with all the information made available by the IDF like satellite videos that the western media still chooses just to take the account from Hamas

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  206. Reid (16,468 comments) says:

    What a travesty of Justice.

    That’s a tragedy not a travesty cricko. Look at her face. My reading of that expression is it’s not because she’s being sentenced, it’s because she’s being sentenced for inadvertently killing her own baby. The jail term means nothing. She’s already in the midst of punishing herself for something she wishes never happened.

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  207. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    Yip some one well known for proclaiming repeatedly that he has fifty up votes on whale in in no way is focused on the karma.
    The method was to log out then log in repeatedly using alternate ids giving a tick to your own post every time.
    Strangely redbaiter was the only poster who amassed such large karma results so quickly and the phenomena stopped once The controversy was exposed.
    No one on whale now gets such rapid and distorted karma since the voting system was tied back to the person doing so.
    coincidence only circumstantial evidence ?
    Redbaiter was banned for abusing the moderators when the allegations first surfaced.
    It amuses me that he has accused me of running multiple accounts and doing the same thing even going so far as to claim he has inside knowledge of my offending. This was a total fabrication as would be easy discovered by just comparing style with my poor grammar punctuation Malapropism frequent spelling errors and my habit of missing the r on your.
    Griff was Griffith for a while.. I advertised the fact with Griffiths first post and again when I changed back to Griff.

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  208. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Shawn since this issue between us started, has it ever occurred to you that perhaps I’m operating under a different gifting from the one He has given you and perhaps this is what generates our obvious chalk and cheese perspectives?”

    No. I personally think the basic problem is that you have spent far too much time imbibing conspiracy theories, to the point where it’s actually preventing you from seeing reality clearly. The metaphor of a hammer you use is telling, because I think that is exactly what you’re doing, using the hammer of conspiracy theory to approach almost every issue, even if the issue has to be forced to fit. After a while it prevents you from being able to think an issue through logically.

    I also think you play fast and loose with the issue of Jews. You may well not hate them, but you certainly do not see the issue clearly, in part because of the narrow range of material you have read, and given recent history (the Holocaust) a responsible person, especially a Christian, should exercise great care in the words they choose and the kinds of accusations they make.

    I have no personal animosity towards you. I just think your wrong about these issues and careless in how you speak of them.

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  209. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “Redbaiter was banned for abusing the moderators when the allegations first surfaced.”

    That boy is not well in the head.

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  210. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    “I’ve just bought myself a butt plug.” the Labour MP admitted to his benchmate under his breath. “I don’t want it getting out.”

    “The secret?”

    “No….the gerbil.”

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  211. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Gerbil abuse is a serious issue naaska. If Johnboy turns up he might be able to give us some insight into this evil practice.

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  212. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    We await our resident expert on bestiality & sundry ovine perversions Shawn. :)

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  213. Southern Raider (1,830 comments) says:

    I’m a bit confused.

    ChCh council is $900M short of cash for the rebuild but have decided its a good time to compulsorily acquire the last 20% of shares in the poor performing lyttelton port after it has lost its major contracts.

    Socialists always make such wise business decisions

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  214. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Gerbil abuse?

    Oh dear, things have deteriorated around here!

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  215. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Southern Raider (1,590 comments) says:
    August 1st, 2014 at 8:24 pm

    They are trying to get the shortage up to $1billion – it makes for much tidier book keeping.

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  216. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/lco0yehfgnncc4f/Gerbil%201.jpg

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  217. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    That’s a lovely picture nasska but a tad diminutive. I’ve always been a man that use’s a bit of 110mm drainpipe and a Ferrett in those poses! :)

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  218. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    Aarrh!

    The mention of perversion and the thought of sheep has Johnboy all excited and aroused – he must have mental telepathy – or something ;-)

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  219. Redbaiter (8,916 comments) says:

    Funny thing is, immediately after I was banned, I apparently managed to come back and vote for myself 38 times.

    Grief is a liar and a coward as the actual exchange where I was banned by Slater shows clearly.

    ——————————————-
    Redbaiter • a year ago

    “Now that our politicians have allegedly ignored the vast silent majority and passed a gay marriage bill”

    Yes, a bunch of liberal coward politicians messed with something they had no right to, and they did that with your enthusiastic endorsement arsehole.

    Don’t think that will ever be forgotten.

    Trying to win back some ground with Conservatives on the smacking issue won’t work. Just makes you look like a hypocrite.

    You made your bed. Have the courage to lie in it. 38
    —————————-
    Cam Slater Mod Redbaiter • a year ago

    Fuck off. You don’t get to come to my place and call me an arsehole. See ya cunt. 10

    —————————–
    Mr_Blobby Cam Slater • a year ago

    Now now Whale boy take a chill pill. Redbaiter and BR make a good point. The vast majority of commentators on this site were against the legislation, the few supporters you had like GayCunt have now left. The arsehole comment was a bit rough, but we have called others worse. Say sorry RedCunt. 21
    —————————————
    BR Cam Slater • a year ago

    Redbaiter makes an extremely valid point. I don’t know of any poll which indicated majority support for homosexual “marriage” The poll you ran here did not come out in favour of it either, despite your obsessive promotion of it. Calling you an areshole might have been somewhat unnecessary, however he is right to call you out on your hypocrisy on this topic. The left wing labour private member’s bill that now allows the state sanctioning of homosexual “marriage” was steamrolled through parliament against the wishes of the people of this country. The politicians should have at least waited until the next election to have a referendum on it, but no; just like the anti-smacking bill, also promoted by the extreme left, it was rammed through parliament against the wishes of the people. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for campaigning on behalf of the most disreputable liars, cheats and crooks in the NZ parliament.

    Bill

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  220. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    Not really Don old chap I just thought I should crack 15000 pointless comments really! :)

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  221. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    I gave you a tick for that Red as I spotted some utter asshole gave you a thumbs down. Must be the same bastard that does it to me! :)

    ps: Sorry about the smilie…It’s just the way I am! :)

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  222. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Have you ever though of anger management classes Red?

    Seriously.

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  223. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    Yip redbluster Griff is a coward and a lair if it rotates your willy
    meantime back in the real world….

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  224. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    Your life seems full of disappointment & bad luck Griff….you’ll probably end up reincarnated as Baity’s blowup doll. :)

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  225. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    After Red’s blown him up! :)

    http://sociorocketnewsen.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/2012-07-17_213237.jpg?w=500

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  226. nasska (11,518 comments) says:

    Where’s the air valve? :)

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  227. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    Redbaiter (7,643 comments) says:
    November 20th, 2013 at 10:30 pm

    Here’s the deal derps.

    Kiwiblog used to be read by people with influence. Even GD. So it was worth the time and effort to comment here.

    Now look at it. Mostly a collection of boring prog trolls with fuck all of consequence to say about anything.

    (Excluding my RW buddies here of course. You know who you are)

    Sorry. I want to change the political culture in NZ and I won’t do that here with a bunch of time wasting nitwits like the Ekatahuna Imbecile.

    I’ve moved on to better things.

    :lol:
    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2013/06/redbaiter-would-have-been-redfaced-if-this-feature-was-available-back-then/
    There were only two credible answers:

    1) he did it himself
    2) he has a group of people following him wherever he goes who provide the majority of upvotes on his comments within a very short period of the comment being posted

    Answer 1 is simply more plausible.

    One of the most upvoted commenters is Travis Poulson. And even when he chucks out one of his pearlers it takes several hours to accumulate the upvotes. In comparison, redbaiter would collect his within the first 15-30 minutes, with a few stragglers following over the rest of the day.

    This sort of “upvote pattern” is exclusive to redbaiter. Nobody else enjoys that sort of instant approbation from the readers. So, unless he has a couple of dozen groupies hanging on every utterance the moment he shares it, I truly believe his popularity, such as it is, is largely of his own creation.

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  228. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    “you’ll probably end up reincarnated as Baity’s blowup doll.”

    Given the number of times Red feels the need to tell people how uber-masculine he is compared to all us progressive girly-men, I strongly suspect his blow up doll is male. If there was ever a case for someone over compensating because they can’t admit they might be gay it’s Red.

    Either that or he has a really small…….. :)

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  229. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    That’s very interesting Griff. I keep getting at least one down vote everytime I comment. I suspect I have an anti-Johnboy out there. It never happened till they got the LHC working properly. I think I’ll give Stephen Hawking a call! :)

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  230. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    “Either that or he has a really small……..”Gerbil” ? :)

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  231. Griff (7,722 comments) says:

    You are doing it your self JB subconsciously so the rest of us dont think you are perfect.

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  232. Johnboy (16,583 comments) says:

    I haven’t drunk enough to be subconscious yet Griff?

    Still the wife always says I’m a perfect prick. I thought it was a compliment till now! :)

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  233. ShawnLH (5,124 comments) says:

    Heh, a poster from that Whale Oil thread nailed Red’s style perfectly.

    “If you take the emotive language out of his post there is fuck all left to read.”

    Yup. :)

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  234. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    stephieboy is incensed, fuming at this: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/08/01/russian-official-burns-obama-with-putin-leopard-pic/

    Russia is turning to Twitter to drop a sissy bomb on President Obama, using photos to challenge the manliness of America’s commander in chief, while pumping up their main man, President Vladimir Putin.

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