The Hager book

August 13th, 2014 at 8:13 pm by David Farrar

Rather bemused to find an entire chapter of ’s book is on me, and also how banal it is. Almost everything in there is in the public domain, as I live a pretty open life. But what Hager has done is wave his normal conspiracy theory through everything and make the fact that bloggers and other talk to each other, some sort of sinister thing.

Basically the chapter is a revelation that I am a member of the National Party! I didn’t realise this was a big secret.

He seems to have no curiousity at all over all the bloggers on the left who don’t blog under their real names, and are rumoured to actually work in Parliament. He also doesn’t worry about one blogger who has been on multiple party payrolls and never declared it, until outed.

What is very interesting is that his source is once again stolen e-mails. In The Hollow Men, he claimed they were leaked to him by an insider. In this book they are obviously hacked from Cameron Slater, which to my mind raises huge disbelief over his claims that the previous set of e-mails were leaked.

I’ve had a quick read through the chapter on me, and a few things I’ll point out.

  • Hager thinks my setting Kiwiblog up was due to my involvement in the IDU. That’s nuts. I’ve been debating politics online since 1996, originally through Usenet. I set Kiwiblog up because I like debate. It was not encouraged by anyone, and I was surprised it has turned out influential. In fact in the early days quite a few in National put pressure on for me not to blog.
  • I get e-mails from numerous people, including Jason Ede, pointing stories out to me, or suggesting things I may want to blog on. I get them from lots of ordinary blog readers, from friends, from some staff, and sometmes even an MP. But I decide what I blog, and they always accord with my political views.
  • A tiny proportion of what I blog comes from National sources. Way under 5%. I write Kiwiblog, and people send me ideas – and this is somehow a conspiracy. Very very very occasionally I might proactively ask for some info – maybe every couple of months, if that.
  • Most of what I blog is pro-National, as you would expect. But most weeks there is an issue I disagree with them on. I did multiple posts attacking the Government on the proposed copper tax, and even had Kiwiblog join an aggressive campaign against National on this. I have several times lobbied minor party MPs not to support National on bills or amendments. I recently said I think John Key should have accepted Gerry Brownlee’s resignation.
  • When Curia first set up, it of course had only one client. Since then it has grown nicely. At last count around 60+. The initial staff were mainly people I knew through National, as I took over what had been some internal polling, but today we have well over 100 staff and I don’t think any of them are Young Nats. The 2ic for Curia is a Labour supporter who told me the first time we socialised together that for a right wing bastard, I’m not totally bad. We poll for many clients, whose politics I do not share. I’ve polled for former Labour and Alliance MPs. I’ve polled for Family First, and disagree with them on 90% of their issues.
  • Nicky seems to think it is a secret I am National’s pollster. A bloody badly kept secret. It’s on my website. It is referred to often.
  • He is also excited that my staff do some canvassing work for National candidates or MPs. Yep. It creates extra work for my staff which is great. But we don’t just do it for them. While most of our work is polling, if people want to utilise our call centre, and pay for it, they can. Just last week I had one client contract our call centre to make 18,000 phone calls on their behalf – this is a totally non-political client. I’ll work for pretty much anyone who pays (so long as not a conflict of interest)

Most of the book is on Cam. Cam does some great stuff and he sometimes does some appalling stuff. Cam does not work for anyone, or even take guidance from anyone. He is his own force of nature.

Hager basically doesn’t like the fact the right now have voices. He basically says no media should ever use me as a commentator. He is threatened by the fact we finally have one organisation (Taxpayers Union) arguing for less government spending, to counter the 2,000 or so that argue for more.

My final comment is to note that people thought his book may be on the NSA and GCSB intercepting electronic communications. It would seem the person who is the biggest recipient and publisher of intercepted electronic communications is in fact Nicky Hager. If someone published a book of e-mails between a group of left-wingers, he’d probably call it a police state, and demand an inquiry,

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227 Responses to “The Hager book”

  1. Keeping Stock (9,368 comments) says:

    A second book from Mr Hager based on stolen/hacked e-mails that just “happened” to come into his possession; draw your own conclusions…

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  2. All_on_Red (1,733 comments) says:

    Yawn. What a complete cock Hager is. The spoilt mummy’s boy who likes crying wolf. National voters will say ” who cares” and vote for Key anyway. I look forward to the expose of the paid blogger who advises Leaders on how to set up secret trusts for fundraising. We have a right to know who is paying for influence! Never happen though- hypocrite.Bwhahahaha

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  3. AG (1,833 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  4. RF (1,483 comments) says:

    Typical left wing crap. Go national

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  5. mjw (401 comments) says:

    Haven’t read it yet, but I would be highly surprised to find anything untoward about you dpf. You may well spin and take sides – but that is politics. I have no doubt that you are fundamentally an honest person.

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  6. radvad (734 comments) says:

    Hagar’s book just confirms Keys description of him as a screaming left wing conspiracy theorist. And it is going to make a few media people look like fools starting with you Corrin Dann. “Bombshell” is it? Nah not so much.

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  7. trekkie626 (7 comments) says:

    It’s a who cares situation. The left do similar things too. All we have here is a puffed up popinjay with delusions of grandeur.

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  8. dime (10,202 comments) says:

    this book will be like porn to the extreme left.

    votes national will lose? zero.

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  9. soundhill1 (309 comments) says:

    “I’ve been debating politics online since 1996, originally through Usenet.” Yes you had quite a presence and I suppose you have private means but I always wondered at the time you were spending. Kerry seemed to be another with a fairly high profile and lots of time.

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  10. Drp (8 comments) says:

    Have not read the book at this time …
    Clearly this is a (far) left versus (far) right (in NZ 2014 terms) issue …
    but
    Is this also the last cry from the book writing journalists about the new media? How dare blogs have such influence – influence belongs to those who write books!

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  11. Demosthenes (3 comments) says:

    So Mr Hager has written a book, based on hacked private data, about how awful it is that some people used private data. #awkward

    And, as an expert on intelligence, he will know that the key question is always: provenance. Who gave it to you, and why? What bogus information was slipped in with the good?

    Finally, the real irony is that launching this book in the middle of an election campaign, when Parliament is dissolved, will unleash a torrent of mud. Well done, that man! #irony

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  12. Johnboy (17,015 comments) says:

    A weak-chinned little prat that’s trying to relive his glory corngate days and pay his rent.

    Only in sad wee, anti-national, pre-election NZ would anybody bother covering his printing costs! :)

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  13. dad4justice (6,587 comments) says:

    The pathetic little Hagar wimpster has gifted even more votes to National.

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  14. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    I tried to point this out to mikenmild who thinks Hagar is a serious researcher. In fact Hagar is an unhinged and rabidly partisan conspiracy theorist, except this time the “conspiracy” is already public knowledge.

    He has really over shot things this time. This book will seriously damage his credibility.

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  15. goldnkiwi (1,611 comments) says:

    Shall we mention the timing of the book launch, all coincidental I suppose. More media oxygen being sucked from the cabinet wannabes. Got to be good for National. Thanks Nicky.

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  16. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    “I’ve been debating politics online since 1996, originally through Usenet.”

    Wasn’t there a david.farrar.die.die group or some such thing at one point?

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  17. nickb (3,696 comments) says:

    I’m gutted he didn’t have room to write about the Standard/Labour/Presland/Cunliffe links? Do you think he will do a sequel?! “Seeds of Secret Trusts”?

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  18. holysheet (466 comments) says:

    Maybe he didn’t want to steal .coms thunder and reveal the crap about the snowden tapes and GCSB?
    Who give a fuck anyway, its all a load of shit.
    I guess we wait until the 15 for .coms irrelevant revelations.

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  19. Peter (1,694 comments) says:

    Corrin Dann was hilarious. Sternly revealing something as a “bombshell” (National in contact with Slater) that has been common knowledge for years, and has even featured, multiple times, on TVNZ News and 7Sharp. In the past few weeks, in fact.

    Does Dann pay attention to his own news organisation?

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  20. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  21. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    So a far-left activist with links to the green party writes a book, exposing the conspiracy that a right wing blogger has links to the National party.

    I mean, seriously. Who didn’t think the National party didn’t leak stuff to Slater? Seriously. I’m embarrassed that I live in a country where both major news hours lead with a story like that.

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  22. niggly (832 comments) says:

    Good on you DPF (and WO), Nicky Hager has bitten off more than he can chew and it will be a pleasure to watch you (and WO) dismember this odious little whiney creep’s conspiracy theories.

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  23. Tom Jackson (2,553 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  24. stephieboy (3,499 comments) says:

    Which network screens the Nicky Hager Comedy Show.?

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  25. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    Oh dear Ugly. Your getting seriously and sadly desperate. That issue is off topic and irrelevant to this thread.

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  26. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  27. Julian (131 comments) says:

    Well said.

    If even John Campbell doesn’t buy it, who does?

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  28. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    It’s off topic and an attempt to highjack the thread. Get a life loser.

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  29. Julian (131 comments) says:

    Also that utter scumbag from Campbell Live who harassed Cam Slater’s family should be fired. What a prick.

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  30. Johnboy (17,015 comments) says:

    When is Krim laying his evidence on the table of public opinion?

    He’s only got 8 weeks to drop the bomb! :)

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  31. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  32. convicted radical (65 comments) says:

    Limited research, that tells you something!
    Never let facts get in the way of a good story.

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  33. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    DPF, Ugly’s debate with me last night is not relevant to this thread, not even remotely.

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  34. Travis Poulson (46 comments) says:

    Good post David. For one of the nutters railing against the GCSB over spying, the hypocrisy must be asphyxiating.

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  35. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    Hager has Slugboy dead to rights as a paid shill.

    Yea, totally. Most of the left probably actually believe that.

    Which is one of the funniest things out of this whole joke.

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  36. Hugh Pavletich (423 comments) says:

    Mr Farrar … console yourself !

    As Mae West said “It is always better to be looked over … than overlooked !”

    Delve in to some wonderful Mae West quotes here …

    http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/mae_west.html

    … and in case any readers are unaware of her …

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mae_West

    As a housing / local government reform advocate (refer http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org ), I consider myself blessed with my adversaries … they are just so damn stupid.

    Ah … ha ha … you appear to be blessed as well !

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  37. adze (2,130 comments) says:

    scrubone

    So a far-left activist with links to the green party writes a book, exposing the conspiracy that a right wing blogger has links to the National party.

    Gold. :)

    Hager needs to stick to his tin of creamed corn.

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  38. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  39. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    It’s also widely forgotten that Hagar’s book about Brash was only blocked until Brash found out it was from Hagar. After that he could barley stop laughing long enough to request the court order be lifted.

    This looks to be much the same, if not more so.

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  40. AG (1,833 comments) says:

    What is very interesting is that his source is once again stolen e-mails. In The Hollow Men, he claimed they were leaked to him by an insider. In this book they are obviously hacked from Cameron Slater, which to my mind raises huge disbelief over his claims that the previous set of e-mails were leaked.

    Here we go – from Hager’s book …

    A ‘denial of service’ attack was launched against his blog site, overloading his server and shutting down the website for three days. It appears the online attackers also gained access to his computer. Thus an insensitive comment about a car accident victim may have led to long-held secrets being revealed about Slater and his political collaborators: right up to the level of senior government ministers.

    Some weeks later, out of the blue, I received a package: an 8-gigabyte USB digital storage device, the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater’s website.

    So, according to DPF, because Hager is honest about how he got the information for this book (which we assume he is being, right … no-one thinks an insider leaked Slater’s communications?), that means he must have been lying about how he got the information about the Hollow Men. That’s just old-fashioned logic, that is!

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  41. stephieboy (3,499 comments) says:

    Ugly Truth, NZ does not have an official religion of state or shall we beam you up.?

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  42. Johnboy (17,015 comments) says:

    A disclaimer:

    Hugely Patheticevitch does not really believe he is much more intelligent than his adversaries.

    He just likes to pretend he is! :)

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  43. jp_1983 (235 comments) says:

    I hope hager gets sued

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  44. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    The NZ state has no religion, Anglican or otherwise, and NO, your nonsense is not relevant to this thread.

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  45. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Well at least John Key will be able to laugh himself to sleep tonight.
    I guess a little worried about the possibility of a Snowden leak, and now a happy sense of relief that “tricky Nicky” after extensive research has come up with the “shocking” conclusion that Cameron and David have been communicating with members of a party that they support.

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  46. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    A ‘denial of service’ attack was launched against his blog site, overloading his server and shutting down the website for three days. It appears the online attackers also gained access to his computer.

    So let me get this straight.

    a) There was an attack on his site, flooding it with traffic and shutting it down.
    b) Hagar *claims* there was, at the same time, a hack of Slater’s home PC, copying 8-gb of files.

    Is it just me, or is Hagar deliberately playing on Joe Public’s ignorance of the vast differences here? The difference is parking across the Warehouse driveway, vs. breaking into my house and copying my hard drive. We know the former happened, but it seems to me he’s trying to use that to make the latter plausible.

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  47. davidp (3,585 comments) says:

    So Cam (and DPF) write blogs that include tipoffs from politically-motivated insiders and leaked information, and we’re supposed to be disgusted. But Hager writes a book that is full of tipoffs from politically-motivated insiders and leaked information, and we’re supposed to regard him as some sort of unbiased journalist and a hero of political ethics. I just don’t understand how Hager has so little self awareness. Hager is just Cam with a trust fund.

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  48. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Ugly Truth, NZ does not have an official religion of state

    This narrates the contentious establishment of a prayer for the House in the first days of 1854. Religious differences between Protestant and Catholic were deftly handled by Speaker Clifford (Catholic himself) in bringing the local Anglican clergyman in to do the honours.

    http://www.nzhistory.net.nz/media/sound/parliament-opens-with-a-prayer

    The NZ state has no religion, Anglican or otherwise, and NO, your nonsense is not relevant to this thread.

    The head of the NZ state is the “Supreme Governor” of the Church of England (Anglican).

    If there really was a conspiracy, then ShawnLH, as an Anglican, would have an interest in covering it up.

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  49. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    Now if he was really concerned about the non-issue of partisan bloggers, why is he silent about the Strandard and Greg Presland?

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  50. doggone7 (844 comments) says:

    Julian: “Also that utter scumbag from Campbell Live who harassed Cam Slater’s family should be fired. What a prick.”

    A reporter/journalist or whatever he is tries to do his job, not sit in an office and make a story up but goes to find out.

    He goes to the home of a public person who is central in a story of public interest. A person who according to David Farrar “sometimes does some appalling stuff”. The people in his family are bystanders. I wonder if Cameron Slater ever has qualms about collateral damage from his stories?

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  51. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    Stop trying to highjack the thread Ugly. The issue is Hagar’s book, not your irrelevant conspiracy theories.

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  52. Johnboy (17,015 comments) says:

    “I hope hager gets sued”

    I hope he get’s judithed…that would learn the little prick! :)

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  53. doggone7 (844 comments) says:

    ShawnLH

    Maybe he isn’t concerned about the Standard and Greg Presland. Maybe he thinks someone else would be interested in doing the story about them. Maybe you could be the one. Now there’s an opportunity.

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  54. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “I just don’t understand how Hager has so little self awareness.”

    Left. Wing. :)

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  55. RightNow (7,014 comments) says:

    AG (1,792 comments) says:
    August 13th, 2014 at 8:49 pm

    A ‘denial of service’ attack was launched against his blog site, overloading his server and shutting down the website for three days. It appears the online attackers also gained access to his computer. Thus an insensitive comment about a car accident victim may have led to long-held secrets being revealed about Slater and his political collaborators: right up to the level of senior government ministers.

    Some weeks later, out of the blue, I received a package: an 8-gigabyte USB digital storage device, the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater’s website.

    AG, you have no problem with his actions in keeping the USB stick, not forwarding it to police, and then using it to (potentially) profit from sales of a book? You are Andrew Geddis, Professor, Faculty of Law, University of Otago, aren’t you?

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  56. Nookin (3,556 comments) says:

    AG
    The response, using Hager reasoning, is that this is a ruse to deflect attention from the Brash email and being outed on them by admitting that he is now using stolen information. It follows that he wasn’t using stolen information previously? There is a conspiracy here. Are you part of it? Question. Do you believe someone who has admitted to using stolen material with a view to personal gain?

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  57. oldpark (410 comments) says:

    Corrin Dann Labour MP( IN WAITING) from the Labour Party Channel TVNZ.Corrin, Hager mislaid you before the book was launched, when he told you to say it would be a bombshell”.zzz” LOL.You took the carrot, hook line and sinker .Hard to believe you get paid for such naivety,and schoolboy stupidity.

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  58. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Stop trying to highjack the thread Ugly. The issue is Hagar’s book, not your irrelevant conspiracy theories.

    “That’s why you ran away like the snivelling gutless coward you are.” ~ ShawnLH, in reference to this debate.

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  59. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Maybe he isn’t concerned about the Standard and Greg Presland. Maybe he thinks someone else would be interested in doing the story about them.”

    Maybe he’s a partisan political activist pretending to be an objective journalist.

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  60. Julian (131 comments) says:

    doggone7 I agree with you to an extent but:

    1. Slater posted at 5:45pm that he was out of the country. It was dark when Campbell Live turned up at his doorstep so they knew he wasn’t there.

    2. The journo continued to harass whoever was inside, even after they’d said Slater wasn’t there. And he ridiculed the woman inside the house when she, like viewers – given what he said – expressed surprise that the journo hadn’t heard of Slater’s blog.

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  61. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Do you believe someone who has admitted to using stolen material with a view to personal gain?

    It wasn’t stolen, it was copied.

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  62. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    Reminds me of one James Sleep and his hysterical claims about our host.

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2007/04/some_interesting_blogs.html

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  63. Pete George (23,793 comments) says:

    The comments here are interesting, on how the data may have been hacked – ‘denial of service’ attacks being commonly used for cover for hacking.

    http://publicaddress.net/hardnews/dirty-politics/

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  64. Tinshed (170 comments) says:

    May I suggest, reluctantly at best, that you hop across to The Standard (I know, I know…) and read comments on their thread (http://thestandard.org.nz/cameron-slater-dirties-john-key-or-vice-versa/). The play of the left is that JK and his office used the organs of the state (SIS/GSCB) to spy on the Labour Party. The issue, for them, is not the links between DPF and Whaleoil and the National Party – that is too anodyne for words. They claim the National Party used state spying agencies to spy on the Labour Party and of course this means armageddon for the Tories. [Don’t worry – I will bathe vigorously after typing such arrant nonsense.]

    They are having wet dreams that this is New Zealand’s “Watergate” and that JK is Nixon reincarnated. It is all bullshit of course but let’s be clear about the lines of attacks.

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  65. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    He may be too busy to do anything about it now, but for what it’s worth I have emailed David about Ugly’s attempt to hijack the thread.

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  66. hj (7,133 comments) says:

    I watched Nigel latta on the alcohol industry. I’d like to know why, after commissioning a 545 page report the government accepts all but the most effective bits of the report. Also like to know why the government ignored the public’s point of view on an earlier issue in favour of the alcohol industry. Those sort of issues are the real story. Not silly enough to get caught out of course.

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  67. Richard (103 comments) says:

    There’s serious amount of butt-hurt in here. Almost as if the game is up!

    Here’s hoping this is the event which will allow New Zealanders their country back.

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  68. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    DPF – “In The Hollow Men, he claimed they were leaked to him by an insider. In this book they are obviously hacked from Cameron Slater, which to my mind raises huge disbelief over his claims that the previous set of e-mails were leaked.”

    I’d say your disbelief is well-founded, DPF.

    Over on WO’s site, commenter “Edwin Wigmore” said –
    “I would give about as much credence to Hagars book as a belief in tooth fairies. I remember Michael Bassett saying there was a whole page of emails in the hollow men that had not come from him. Hagar completely fabricated them.”

    Well, well…….

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  69. jakejakejake (143 comments) says:

    If Hooton doesn’t sue over Hager’s allegation that he organised for a liquor company to sponsor DPF and Whaleoil then it is either true or he has a large vagina.

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  70. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    And the hyprocrisy of the left plumbs new and exciting depths!
    A campaigner against the state’s intrusion of privacy, publishes the private emails of others.
    A serial leftwing activist uses a dark and sinister network of henchmen, to “expose” that the National party have the ability to network too.

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  71. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Here’s hoping this is the event which will allow New Zealanders their country back.”

    Not likely. And New Zealanders have voted for two National led coalitions, so the claim they have lost their country is laughable hyperbole.

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  72. Scott1 (588 comments) says:

    Journos do what Jurnos do, partisan bloggers do what partisan bloggers do. Neither should be particularly surprised by the other.
    They can be annoyed in a futile way if they want – after all – that is amusing…

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  73. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    Danyl Mclauchlan, about 2 hours ago Email Web
    Weirdly, most of the correspondence seems to be Facebook chats, which I can’t quite see how would possibly be hacked using a DDOS attack on the WhaleOil site.

    From the Public Address link above.

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  74. NK (1,259 comments) says:

    Here we go – from Hager’s book …

    A ‘denial of service’ attack was launched against his blog site, overloading his server and shutting down the website for three days. It appears the online attackers also gained access to his computer. Thus an insensitive comment about a car accident victim may have led to long-held secrets being revealed about Slater and his political collaborators: right up to the level of senior government ministers.

    Some weeks later, out of the blue, I received a package: an 8-gigabyte USB digital storage device, the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater’s website.

    Hager writes, “it appears the online attackers also gained access to his computer”. And then, “the contents of which appeared to have originated from the attack on Slater’s website”.

    As if Hager expects us to believe he doesn’t know, he just assumes. What crock!

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  75. AG (1,833 comments) says:

    @Rightnow

    AG, you have no problem with his actions in keeping the USB stick, not forwarding it to police, and then using it to (potentially) profit from sales of a book? You are Andrew Geddis, Professor, Faculty of Law, University of Otago, aren’t you?

    Yes. That is me. You’re not David Garret under another name, are you? It’s usually him that fixates on identities … but anyway.

    My point was simply to raise a pretty major inconsistency with David’s analysis … in particular, this bugbear that he and others have about the fact that someone/group in National knifed Don Brash back in 2008. Time to let that one go, I think.

    But on the ethics of using stolen information to write this book, you can read Hager’s own defence of it here: http://proseotalk.sharedby.co/rymPDj. You might not (OK – you won’t) agree with him, because you don’t like the message he’s delivering in this book. But try to think for a second … if you say that “stolen” information should never be able to be used to tell a story (including by “the media”, I assume, ’cause they make money off the papers/ads they sell), then how exactly do you think journalism is meant to work?

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  76. Richard (885 comments) says:

    “But what Hager has done is wave his normal conspiracy theory through everything and make the fact that bloggers and others talk to each other, some sort of sinister thing.”
    That sums up the whole book and frankly Hagers approach to anything in politics really.
    OMG- John Key knows Cam Slater! OMG right wing bloggers and party members talk to each other!! OMG they even discuss campaigning on chosen issues! And working together! And exchange information! Even worse- they may even be meeting in bars and pubs right now and discussing politics!!!! AHHHHH!! EVIL CONSPIRACY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Of course if that’s a crime then Labour and the Greens are also guilty, perhaps more so.
    On the plus side at least Hager didn’t find out about the deal Keys got going with the lizard men at the centre of the earth and the illuminati to take over the world…..

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  77. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    But on the ethics of using stolen information…

    Copying information is not theft because it does not deprive the owner of possession.

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  78. oldpark (410 comments) says:

    Everybody knows hagers emails fell off the back of a truck.A BIG BIG BIG TRUCK, Yeah Right.

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  79. Tinshed (170 comments) says:

    I meant to add this comment from The Standard to my earlier post upthread to give you an idea of the orgasmic frenzy the left is fapping itself into over this.

    It’s our Watergate, and it is delicious.

    As I said, let’s be clear what the left thinks of this and be prepared to counter it with all our might.

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  80. ross001 (233 comments) says:

    What is very interesting is that his source is once again stolen e-mails.

    What is more interesting is that instead of the Government talking incessantly about its achievements over the last 6 years – I presume there have been some? – Ministers cannot stop attacking Labour, the Greens, Dotcom, etc.

    What that tells me is that National is embarrassed at what little it has achieved…I have to say I agree.

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  81. Sir Cullen's Sidekick (899 comments) says:

    Friends – After going through the comments, I am feeling much better now. As I am overseas, I am only reading the newspapers, Kiwiblog and Whaleoil to get the coverage on this scum’s book.

    Corin Communist Dann is a resident commie left wing evil. Even if National increases its position by 10 points in an opinion poll, this guy will present that information as Labour is holding steady and that is a great for left block.

    None of the committed National voters will sway away from John Key and National unless John Key is Kim Jong-un in disguise.
    But the swinging voters should not be influenced by biased reporters like Corin and Paddy.

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  82. Adolf Fiinkensein (2,703 comments) says:

    Thank you Mr Geddis, for confirming journalists simply are simply a bunch of thieves.

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  83. Nookin (3,556 comments) says:

    AG
    Where do you draw the line? Say, for example that you are convinced that a well known builder receives half his income in cash under the table and said builder is about to stand for Parliament. Does that justify hacking the IRD computer to prove the fact?
    Would your answer be any different if the subject of your attention was a drug dealer who you knew was on a benefit and you hacked the MOSD computers?

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  84. hj (7,133 comments) says:

    If Hooton doesn’t sue over Hager’s allegation that he organised for a liquor company to sponsor DPF and Whaleoil then it is either true or he has a large vagina..
    ………
    He has strong views on immigration, which just happens to coincide with the wishes of the construction sector. :lol:

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  85. ross001 (233 comments) says:

    Hager basically doesn’t like the fact the right now have voices.

    What garbage. Some of those “voices” emanate from the sewer. The trouble being that the Prime Minister and other Ministers are talking directly with those voices – what does that say about the judgment of those Ministers?

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  86. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “What that tells me is that National is embarrassed at what little it has achieved”

    A reduction in Welfare numbers, A one billion drop in welfare spending. Steering the country through both the Christchurch earthquake and the GFC with the best economic recovery in the OECD.

    Sounds like a lot too me.

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  87. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    From an IT perspective alone, this is interesting. A DOS attack on a website and gaining access to emails, two different things. DOS attacks, and I remember watching the one on WOBH, are easy to hide in terms of source, and can be bought for very little $. From what we saw (my smart boys and girls who like this shit) the attack started from Eastern Europe or India – which doesn’t tell you much. You can buy DOS attacks online if you know where to look. Requires some web savvy.

    But an email extract, thats different. Yes, emails get held and are routed through web servers. But once they pass, unless you use a web email client, there is no record that a server hit could take and hold. You either access a computer with an email client (hack into it), or youve accessed the webmail client in real time. Thats wire fraud in the US, and theft in most places – including NZ – and against a number of provisions in relevant acts.

    Im not going to draw conclusions, thats for smarter people than me. But who, at the end of the day, would know how to buy a DOS attack; how to hack a web email client; and want to drop this into NZ pre-election.

    Who knows, maybe its for the wurst :)

    PS and disclaimer. Thankfully Ive only ever emailed Cam once, about the utter hypocrisy of a well known unionist and him leaving his house (and wife, who is a friend of a friend) and walking down the road to shag a neighbour. God forbid I should mention ANYTHING about senior labour members (!) and their liking for a nice hot Chinese for dinner. :)

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  88. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    As I said, let’s be clear what the left thinks of this and be prepared to counter it with all our might.

    I think that’s going to be hard, given how hard everyone is laughing.

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  89. adze (2,130 comments) says:

    @AG

    how exactly do you think journalism is meant to work?

    Is that what this is?

    In your opinion, how does Hager’s book compare with investigative journalist David Fisher’s book on Dotcom – another public figure – being banned under the Privacy Act by Justice Winklemann?

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  90. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Some of those “voices” emanate from the sewer.”

    That would be the Standard, which the Labour party has strong connections with. What does that say about their judgement, let alone the judgement of having an anti-Semite Jew basher as a candidate?

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  91. All_on_Red (1,733 comments) says:

    AG
    Good to see that Hagar supports the hacking and release of the Climategate emails. The truth will out and all that.

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  92. NK (1,259 comments) says:

    Nookin, clearly you are new around here. With the left, the ends justifies the means.

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  93. RightNow (7,014 comments) says:

    Thanks AG, no I’m not David Garret. I’m ‘fixated’ on your identity because to me it gives your comments extra weight when I read them.

    With regard to the ethics, the problem I have with this particular incident is that the attack on Whaleoil’s infrastructure had a material impact on his livelihood and the USB drive may have had some forensic value if it was able to be analysed. Viewed dispassionately there was a crime committed against a person going about their legitimate business.

    I understand the point you were raising about David’s analysis, it’s just I’ve never really cared about the Hollow Men book and the circumstances of how it came to be.

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  94. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    So help me get this straight.
    It’s criminal for “The News of the World” to hack into people’s private communications and publish them. There are lenghty court cases and people go to jail.
    But when Nicky Hagar repeatedly publishes private communications that have been hacked and stolen he is treated like a rock star.
    What am I missing?

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  95. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    let alone the judgement of having an anti-Semite Jew basher is a candidate.

    “Well, he IS a Jew hating Nazi. That’s just a fact.” ~ ShawnLH, Anglican liar.

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  96. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    It’s the truth Ugly, and you know it.

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  97. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    What am I missing?

    The fact that “intellectual property” is not actual property when nobody has exclusive possession of it.

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  98. ross001 (233 comments) says:

    Steering the country through both the Christchurch earthquake and the GFC with the best economic recovery in the OECD

    I’ll have whatever Shawn’s having – it must be good shit.

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  99. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    It’s the truth Ugly, and you know it.

    Just like it’s the truth that I’m running from the argument?

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  100. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    ross001, it’s called reality. And yes, you really should try it sometime. :)

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  101. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    Ugly, I think I speak for a few. Off you fuck. Please.

    Back on thread. The bit about ‘hacking into labours server’ – please. It was wide open, that wasnt a hack. My nana, bless her, could have moused her way in that particular front door. It was more wide open than the Bevan Chuang Welcome Mat :)

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  102. Alan Wilkinson (1,933 comments) says:

    Hager keeps himself at armslength fron hackers who steal emails in order to allege the PM keeps himself at armslength from a PR staffer who talks to influential bloggers.

    Stunning, but only in the depth of his hypocrisy.

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  103. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Ugly, I think I speak for a few. Off you fuck. Please.

    How is it that the best any of you can do is to avoid the issue of conspiracy when that is the subject matter of the thread?

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  104. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Thanks for your explanation DPF. It is good to be able to read a rational statement by someone who is involved. I agree with everything you say except of course think that slater is not worthy of any of the praise you give him. That opinion has nothing to do with the book. I have not read it yet. Unlike most on here I would prefer to make an informed comment after having actually read the book, rather than relying on preexisting bias.

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  105. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    You either access a computer with an email client (hack into it), or youve accessed the webmail client in real time.

    You hire a third party to make hit. They would clearly also have the required expertise to also crack open the safe. Your statement about hacking with email clients only is way off the mark.

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  106. Tom Jackson (2,553 comments) says:

    It’s also widely forgotten that Hagar’s book about Brash was only blocked until Brash found out it was from Hagar. After that he could barley stop laughing long enough to request the court order be lifted.

    And then Brash resigned because of the allegations in the book. Hager laughed last.

    ————————————————————————————————————

    So far we now know that despite denials, the PM’s office was donkey deep in the unauthorised access to Labour Party computer systems. They said at the time that they had nothing to do with giving it to Slater, yet Hager has Ede bragging about doing it.

    We now know that Slater receives $6500 a month from a tobacco lobby shill for services rendered.

    We now know that Peter Dunne has been taking money from the tobacco industry.

    And among other things, we now know that posts on this very blog were written by National staffers, so Farrar is a shill (I had honestly thought better of him – more fool me).

    But the best thing is that we now know that there is a file in the possession of quite a few New Zealanders which details a whole heap of Slater’s disgusting personal shit. He better be careful about what he says about other people or that shit is finding its way to Wikileaks.

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  107. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “How is it that the best any of you can do is to avoid the issue of conspiracy when that is the subject matter of the thread?”

    Hagar’s book is the subject matter of this thread, not the debate we had last night and not your bizarre and irrelevant notions about the NZ state.

    STOP trying to hijack the thread.

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  108. Tom Jackson (2,553 comments) says:

    Hager keeps himself at armslength fron hackers who steal emails in order to allege the PM keeps himself at armslength from a PR staffer who talks to influential bloggers.

    Stunning, but only in the depth of his hypocrisy.

    Isn’t it time for your rice pudding, you senile old fuck?

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  109. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    Not really itstricky, only if you assume the ‘hit’ was made in the virtual world. It could be made in the real world, but thats highly unlikely, given Slaters computer would be sitting on a desk in his home, and he (probably, maybe) uses an encrypted email client. If he doesnt, he’s silly. Probably will now :)

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  110. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Isn’t it time for your rice pudding, you senile old fuck?”

    Nice. Take your meds Tom.

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  111. AG (1,833 comments) says:

    @Nookin,

    Does that justify hacking the IRD computer to prove the fact? Would your answer be any different if the subject of your attention was a drug dealer who you knew was on a benefit and you hacked the MOSD computers?

    No. That would be illegal (s. 252 of the Crimes Act 1961). But Hager didn’t hack Slater’s computer (sure, sure … now there’ll be cries of “but how do you know he didn’t?” … whatever). He got information that was the result of a hack. That’s not illegal in itself. So the better analogy is, what if my neighbour is drug dealer who I think is on a benefit, and then someone slips MSD material under my door that proves this to be the case. Am I then obliged to return the material to the MSD and keep my mouth shut? If I put a big sign in front of my neighbour’s house saying “this drug dealer is on a benefit!”, reproducing the MSD material, have I done anything wrong?

    @adze,

    In your opinion, how does Hager’s book compare with investigative journalist David Fisher’s book on Dotcom – another public figure – being banned under the Privacy Act by Justice Winklemann?

    You’re mixing up apples and bananas there. Fisher’s book hasn’t been “banned” – rather, Dotcom was ordered to ask Fisher to reveal his sources under the Privacy Act. Which he did, and Fisher refused to say. So it’s not really comparable to Hager’s book at all.

    With regard to the ethics, the problem I have with this particular incident is that the attack on Whaleoil’s infrastructure had a material impact on his livelihood and the USB drive may have had some forensic value if it was able to be analysed.

    Really? I don’t know much about computers, but that strikes me as unlikely. And in any case, if the Police want that evidence (which they may ask for, if Slater lays a complaint), then the issue is decided under the Evidence Act … the same piece of legislation that Slater is invoking in order not to have to reveal his sources in Blomfield’s defamation case. So, you know – there’s irony piled on irony here.

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  112. NK (1,259 comments) says:

    AG calls this “journalism”.

    In his “book” Hager alleges senior Nats, and indeed Whale Oil, blackmailed Rodney Hide to get him to resign as leader of Act.

    Why doesn’t someone ask Nicky Hager if he spoke with Rodney Hide to confirm that before going to print.

    I know senior “journalists” read this blog so here’s the challenge to them: Ask Hager if he checked that allegation with Hide before going to print. That should be easy to do, it’s just a phone call to Hager.

    That will let us all know whether Hager is “journalist”, won’t it?

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  113. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hagar’s book is the subject matter of this thread

    His book is about conspiracy, and you appear to be set on shutting down any real discussion of conspiracy.

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  114. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    Hagar’s delusions about conspiracy, not yours Ugly. Go away or stay on topic.

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  115. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Judith I agree. Whatever ever DPF says, he is measured. Slater isn’t worth the virtual paper he is printed on however. Would not be surprised at all to learn some of the nastiness he pulls. I am really surprised that Key and Collins would choose to openly associate with him. This will probably be the end of that.

    Alls well Slater son you can always go back to that bastion The Truth. Oh actually…

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  116. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Hagar’s delusions about conspiracy, not yours Ugly. Go away or stay on topic.

    You are the one who is deluded Shawn, saying that I am avoiding the debate.

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  117. Brett Hudson (4,741 comments) says:

    if you say that “stolen” information should never be able to be used to tell a story (including by “the media”, I assume, ’cause they make money off the papers/ads they sell), then how exactly do you think journalism is meant to work?

    @AG,

    So you mean like Cam’s release of the Hell Pizza guy’s emails then? Perhaps you’d like to represent Cam in that case then? (Pro bono, of course, given your deep held belief…)

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  118. adze (2,130 comments) says:

    You’re mixing up apples and bananas there. Fisher’s book hasn’t been “banned” – rather, Dotcom was ordered to ask Fisher to reveal his sources under the Privacy Act. Which he did, and Fisher refused to say. So it’s not really comparable to Hager’s book at all.

    From what I have read, the essential reason why publication was prevented (Fisher’s refusal to reveal sources notwithstanding) is because the Judge didn’t consider the book “news” in the journalistic sense, in the context of the Privacy Act. That’s the part I’m comparing. Did the Herald get that bit wrong?

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  119. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “And among other things, we now know that posts on this very blog were written by National staffers,”

    So what? This is a national leaning blog. DPF is in the National party. This is common knowledge. Big whoop.

    You think the Standard is any different? Greg Presland from the Standard was the guy who set up Cunliffe’s secret trust. Anything in Hagar’s book about that?

    If not, why not?

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  120. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    And then Brash resigned because of the allegations in the book. Hager laughed last.

    Also wrong, on both counts.

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  121. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    Senior journalists? LMFAO. We had one ring tonight. Asking if we knew what a DOS attack was. When my help desk manager rang me and told me, we both damn near wet ourselves laughing. Yes, you know who you are :)

    The real question for me is simple. Did you commission a DOS attack, and did you hack an email account at the same time? The trick is knowing who to ask ;)

    There are tracks to follow here, and they are easy enough to follow, right to Hagars doorstep.

    How would the left feel if Silent T’s little secret came out in the next couple of weeks? As delirious as some of them are tonight? Maybe some “senior journalist’ should ask Alf’s husband what he knows :)

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  122. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “And then Brash resigned because of the allegations in the book.”

    Brash resigned because he lost the election. Whether that lost had anything at all to do with Hagar’s book is conjecture at best.

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  123. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    Thanks for the down tick ugly.

    Want to know how I know?

    I bet you do :)

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  124. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Brash resigned because he lost the election.

    You don’t know that for sure.

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  125. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Not really itstricky, only if you assume the ‘hit’ was made in the virtual world

    Making no assumptions about his infrastructure, it is entirely possible the DOS and email gather were the same thing. That is all.

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  126. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Thanks for the down tick ugly.

    Wasn’t me.

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  127. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    It has to be said that Professor Geddis sure has a weird fixation on DPF.

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  128. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “In fact, I prepared my election night comments on the basis that, if we didn’t win, I would announce my resignation.”

    Don Brash. He was prepared to resign IF he lost the election, not because of Hagar’s book.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10412124

    So yes Ugly, I DO know that for sure.

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  129. Don the Kiwi (1,808 comments) says:

    Ugly Truth.

    You are seriously demented. Take your meds, and crawl back to your asylum.

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  130. Richard (103 comments) says:

    English was pathetic when interviewed by Larry Williams at 6:10pm. “Whale-something?” HAHAHAHA!

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  131. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    It has to be said that Professor Geddis sure has a weird fixation on DPF.

    Kind of like how that Garrett guy has a weird fixation on Professor Geddis.

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  132. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    You know crap all homorightus which is why I gave you the tick. Perhaps you’d like to apologise to ugly now.

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  133. goldnkiwi (1,611 comments) says:

    I am sick and tired of hearing mention of the PM as a Jew, he has recent Jewish Ancestry. It is not even material imo, he is a New Zealander unlike some, but the amount that it is repeated makes it seem so. Time to move on.

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  134. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    You are seriously demented. Take your meds, and crawl back to your asylum.

    You are slandering me just like ShawnLH does, Don.
    I don’t think that you like the fact ShawnLH is lying about a debate that shows how Paul was a false apostle.

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  135. Nookin (3,556 comments) says:

    AG

    Apropos section 249, Crimes Act. Putting aside any opinions about state of mind at the time, if someone receives information form a computer system in the form of a thumb drive and makes use of it, is that person “accessing” information as that term is defined in the Crimes Act, and is the thumb drive part of the “computer system” given the breadth of the definition?

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  136. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    Not really itstricky, you equate the two with risk. Entirely possible they were different ‘hits’, because they had to be, hosting and email can be held separately, and usually are. If they were both ‘virtual’ that takes smarts, web and computer smarts. If the email hit (and I dont know the extent of it) was anything more than a few random emails, thats a human intervention thing, not virtual, thats real world.

    Thats a whole other ball game.

    PS. Ugly, yeah, it really was. Such a newb :)

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  137. Alan Wilkinson (1,933 comments) says:

    @Tom Jackson – choked on your sav again, did you? But you are not useless, you serve as a pitiful example of the Left’s inability to think, analyse and debate. Their first and only resort is to personal abuse. Hilarious.

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  138. goldnkiwi (1,611 comments) says:

    So if copying is not theft, there is no copyright? Better tell Hollywood and .com., he will be pleased to hear that. Sorted lol.

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  139. hmmokrightitis (1,596 comments) says:

    The day I take advice from you judith is the day I take any of your comments seriously. Not going to happen. Love your work :)

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  140. adze (2,130 comments) says:

    Me:

    From what I have read, the essential reason why publication was prevented

    Never mind, I now see the book was published last year. I was under the impression it was an upcoming release. Doh!

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  141. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    So yes Ugly, I DO know that for sure.

    No, you don’t know if he was lying about it. You refuse to admit that Paul lied, so why should your assessment of Brash have any value?

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  142. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “You refuse to admit that Paul lied,”

    Because there is nothing to admit. You failed. utterly and totally to make your case.

    “so why should your assessment of Brash have any value?”

    It does to anyone who is sane. That disqualifies you.

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  143. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    So if copying is not theft, there is no copyright?

    Copyright is real, but US fair use doctrine is not part of NZ law.

    Better tell Hollywood and .com., he will be pleased to hear that. Sorted lol.

    Hollywood is involved in predatory lawsuits, the US doctrine is essential to that.

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  144. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Hagerographia: a still rare ailment in remote South Pacific Islands in which deluded tribesmen suffering from acute ultra-paranoia preach that they can determine “truth” about those on whom they fixate merely and entirely by analysing bovine excrement. The term Hagerographia also applies to the delusion of the gullible who regard these disturbed tribesmen as millennium prophets.

    The name derives from the surname of a prominent sufferer of the illness.

    Treatment: Silence, the only feasible treatment at this time. Some private medical institutes are investigating setting up treatment regimes in co-operation with Trappist monasteries.

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  145. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Because there is nothing to admit. You failed. utterly and totally to make your case.

    What, when I said “Hilarious, goodnight”?

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  146. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Tom Jackson says:

    “We now know that Slater receives $6500 a month from a tobacco lobby shill for services rendered.”

    Oh dear, not the evil tobacco industry.
    Anything but the tobacco industry!

    The bogeyman of the left……
    I have also heard he doesn’t believe in Global warming, is (of course) in the pay of the evil Oil companies and eats puppies for breakfast!

    Apart from the fact that nobody cares, what has that to do with what we are discussing here?

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  147. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    The funny thing about claiming that whale is a paid stooge, is the lack of realization of the very obvious fact that he hates Labour more than enough to do it for free!

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  148. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “So if copying is not theft, there is no copyright?”

    Copying can be theft under the law, yes. Copyright is part of the law. Ugly’s fantasies about this, like his fantasy that he does not need a drivers licence, is of no relevance to the issue, or to reality.

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  149. Nostalgia-NZ (5,317 comments) says:

    It’s no conspiracy theory that WO was given access to Ian Binnie’s correspondence in record time and after hours, after which he waged a campaign against him and the report. I doubt that will be included in the book. Also that there was no evidence to support the claims at least twice by WO of death threats where he claimed to have known those making the threats and that he was taking the information to the police. I also doubt that will be in the book. From DPF himself ‘Cam does some great stuff and he sometimes does some appalling stuff’ – can’t argue with that or that Hagar would be able to prove the same about DPF. But no doubt more will emerge as the book is read while the election process continues to distort away from policy and the opportunity for nzers to decide on the true merits of policy and leadership as to where their votes should go.

    If there is anything to lay at Collins feet by way of the ‘use’ of WO, JK has already circumvented that to some extent. While I may be wrong (not having read the book) it’s bloody difficult to imagine that JK would have brought into the ‘shop’ WO process, it’s a leap from a single Minister, particularly one whose activities have now been curbed by JK, to trying to prove anything of the same sort against him. We shall see.

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  150. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    Can we *please* stop feeding the troll.

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  151. rouppe (983 comments) says:

    That is the first thing that popped into my head when I was watching Hagar talk about how there are communications between Cam and a whole bunch of people – that the Left already do the same thing via The Standard, Red Alert, No Right Turn…

    Secondly he was breathlessly calling this “attack dog politics”. Really? After watching F*** John Key video’s I have not seen anything even remotely similar initiated by either this blog or whaleoil. Some of his comments about “west coast ferals” and suchlike I find distasteful, but then those aren’t political and I can choose whether to stop reading any time.

    This is going to be a bit of a yawn unless there is something much more interesting buried somewhere

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  152. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    @Tom Jackson – choked on your sav again, did you? But you are not useless, you serve as a pitiful example of the Left’s inability to think, analyse and debate. Their first and only resort is to personal abuse. Hilarious.

    Tom’s comments are probably entirely appropriate given it is Slater we are talking about. He’s not known for not resorting to errr…personal abuse…. In fact, it was some such personal abuse that set off the attack on his site if I remember rightly. I wouldn’t hold him up as an example of a right wing thinker who is above the board by any means of anyone’s imagination. Ever.

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  153. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Some genuine questions from a layman.
    1. Is a DOS attack illegal?
    2. If yes what is the penalty for instigating a DOS attack?
    3. If as a result of a DOS attack, private communications are able to be accessed, is the keeping these communication illegal?
    4. Is it illegal to publish unlawfully obtained pivate communications?
    Any legal beagle help me here?

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  154. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Copying can be theft under the law, yes.

    Shawn doesn’t know shit about it.

    Larceny Ilarsaniy I. Felonious stealing, taking and carrying, leading, riding, or driving away another’s personal property, with intent to convert it or to deprive owner thereof. (Black’s 5th)

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  155. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Can we *please* stop feeding the troll.”

    Done. I will not give him further responses.

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  156. daniel carter (34 comments) says:

    Money breeds money, entitlement breeds entitlement. If you think this might be about you, you’re right, it is.

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  157. scrubone (3,097 comments) says:

    He better be careful about what he says about other people or that shit is finding its way to Wikileaks.

    One recalls that the last time people were saying that about someone on the right, the front pages of the nations newspapers were discussing the fact Helen Clark stole $800,000 of taxpayer’s money.

    Funny how none of *her* private emails made it out. Given what we knew in public, goodness knows what she was able to keep private.

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  158. Ryan Sproull (7,356 comments) says:

    Man, you guys read books way faster than I do.

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  159. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “This is going to be a bit of a yawn unless there is something much more interesting buried somewhere”

    I think you’re right rouppe, there is nothing here that will matter to Joe and Jane public. It will keep the activists and the people at the Stranded excited, but beyond that it will disappear from the news cycle pretty fast and make no difference to how people vote.

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  160. V (760 comments) says:

    If the email trail shows in any way that SIS information was fed to bloggers, I expect people in prison.

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  161. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Not really itstricky, you equate the two with risk. Entirely possible they were different ‘hits’, because they had to be, hosting and email can be held separately, and usually are.

    Entirely possible. But then it’s also entirely not possible. Held separately – possible. Not held separately – possible. Anything is possible. That’s why it is possible that the DOS and email gather were the same thing.

    “usually are” – Meh. If you’re in NZ and one of many thousands of SMEs with small time setups, maybe. So possibly that’s relevant to WO. Tells me where you’re coming from, for sure.

    Looking into it further, looks like he uses gmail so the two events happening together are less likely.

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  162. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Can we *please* stop feeding the troll.

    So you mindless muppets can get back to your straw men, you mean?

    ShawnLH is obviously a liar, and you airheads suck it all up like it is business as usual.

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  163. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Money breeds money”

    LMAO!!! :) :) :)

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  164. adze (2,130 comments) says:

    “Entirely possible. But then it’s also entirely not possible.”

    Wat.

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  165. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    “Entirely possible. But then it’s also entirely not possible.”

    Wat.

    Yeah, I know. Just trying to make a point.

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  166. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Entirely possible. But then it’s also entirely not possible.”

    Ummmmm…..what??? :)

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  167. flipper (4,326 comments) says:

    hmmokrightitis (1,534 comments) says:

    August 13th, 2014 at 9:56 pm
    *****
    Heh … Lake Tarawera..

    Good stuff.

    All the wet dreams at TVNZ and elsewhere will dry up when they realise that the little weasel has conned them.

    J H C on a Bike…his allegations (shock, horror, probe) are hilarious.

    Any serious political analyst would know all the links…. and so do idiots like Dann et al. They just signed their death certificates (figuratively speaking).

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  168. daniel carter (34 comments) says:

    @rouppe

    “he was breathlessly calling this “attack dog politics”. Really? After watching F*** John Key video’s I have not seen anything even remotely similar initiated by either this blog or whaleoil.”

    What planet are you on son? Or is it a lack of education? This blog and wharloil are constantly attacking the left and anything that moves within it. They don’t stop attacking. Perhaps that’s fair in love and war but the attacks are invariably based on rubbish stats and research or quoting ill informed media reports, amplifying the BS some reporter has been fooled into believing. Fomenting happy mischief says it all, in other words misinforming for the sake of the party. The first revelation of this book is that the three orgs – National, whale oil and kiwiblog officially work together to mount these attacks and have a symbiotic relationship to feed off each other. The fourth silent partner are various reporters on MSM.

    Images of a rampant, medieval ecstasy come to mind. Eurgh!

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  169. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Let’s not beat around the bush.

    It seems to me Hager is one of two things:

    1. Either he is unhinged with conspiracy theories and delusions of grandeur; OR

    2. He is a really smart marketer who knows how to maximise his book sales, by choosing publishing dates that will achieve maximum publicity and by content that deliberately panders to the Left-wing bent of the MSM and deliberately gives the MSM the illusion of sharing hitherto secret knowledge from inside the channels of political power.

    Definition:

    Hagiography: A biography that over-praises its subject; this term is derived from hagiography meaning biographies of Christian saints.

    Hagerographia: a still rare ailment in remote South Pacific Islands in which deluded tribesmen suffering from acute ultra-paranoia preach that they can determine “truth” about those on whom they fixate merely and entirely by analysing bovine excrement. OR a condition in which publishing marketers purport to be suffering from the disorder so that they can maximise publicity and sales.

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  170. Grizz (613 comments) says:

    So the PM talks to bloggers. Who should be threatened by this? I would say the print media. Disseminating information for centuries was the role of the print media. I knew long ago that they are typically left leaning. It is only in recent years when bloggers came along that right leaning politicians had an outlet for disseminating information. I have learnt from reading Kiwiblog and Whaleoil that you cannot trust what you read in the newspaper or see in the news on TV. Political news and all those social studies like current affairs stories often have a story behind them. On the whole, the media play favorites with left leaning spin. Take Campbell Live as an example. Look at Simon Collins, David Fisher in the Herald as further examples. Consequently I stop buying newspapers. I do not watch TV One and TV3. I am no fool.

    When JK has a story to tell, can he really trust the Mainstream media? It is no wonder he has turned to bloggers to get his information across. Recent examples show that the NZ Herald and other media will spin a positive story into a negative. For instance an anouncement in the Media that a new marine reserve being opened was overshadowed by endangered Maui Dolphins in the same sentence. Bloggers may me the new media, but are useful when they have an audience and are not carrying unhelpful baggage.

    So yeah, get over it Nicky. Bloggers are doing what the traditional media have done for years. While that may not be a huge issue for you, but as you have discovered, they do not all bat for the same team.

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  171. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “This blog and wharloil are constantly attacking the left and anything that moves within it. They don’t stop attacking.”

    So?

    “Perhaps that’s fair in love and war but the attacks are invariably based on rubbish stats and research or quoting ill informed media reports”

    Evidence?

    “The first revelation of this book is that the three orgs – National, whale oil and kiwiblog officially work together to mount these attacks and have a symbiotic relationship to feed off each other.”

    So? That is also true of the Standard, No Right Turn. “Bomber” Bradbury.

    Your double standards are showing.

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  172. Nookin (3,556 comments) says:

    Dead Earnest

    Here is a link to the Crimes Act. Have a look at sections 248 et seq.

    http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1961/0043/latest/DLM327382.html

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  173. David Garrett (7,694 comments) says:

    its an idiot: I have no “fixation” on Geddis…I do however find it…what… somewhat oily of him to comment here as “AG” – he says he does that so Google searches don’t pick him up commenting here – while he is quite happy to use his own name at the Standard…That in itself wouldn’t mean much – except that he also sets himself up as an impartial expert, when he is clearly neither.

    Oh, and he is welsher…Many readers will recall his furious back pedalling a week or so ago re Maori quotas in Law Schools…in a nutshell he claimed there weren’t any, offered to “bet money” on it – then furiously split hairs on the meaning of “quota” as several commenters posted the various Law Schools policies…Reminded me of Bill Clinton… “..that depends on what your definition of ‘IS’ is…”

    I am an old fashioned chap as readers will know…refusing to pay your bets is still grounds for blackballing at my Club….

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  174. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    “This blog and wharloil [sic] are constantly attacking the left and anything that moves within it.”

    So many delusional stupid lefties, so many stories, so little time.
    It is like shooting fish in a barrel.
    So much fun seeing you guys running around like headless chooks.

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  175. ross001 (233 comments) says:

    It’s no conspiracy theory that WO was given access to Ian Binnie’s correspondence in record time and after hours, after which he waged a campaign against him and the report.

    Well, Judith Collins apparently is a good friend of WO’s. But please don’t bring Binnie’s report into this – that report was hopeless and was always going to be discredited because it was so poorly written. WO can be blamed for some things but not for that!

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  176. Grizz (613 comments) says:

    @ Daniel Carter, There are some fairly deluded, vile and nasty people lurking over at the Standard and the Daily Blog. What goes around comes around I guess.

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  177. niggly (832 comments) says:

    Hahaha, just saw the opening teaser on the Paul Henry show and Hager froths the Key Govt is the most dirty since Muldoon. Hello Nicky, ever heard of the Clark Govt and her manipulation of the media to attack critics (both political and non-political), plus Pledge Cards and the rorting of the law etc??? Clark made Muldoon look like an amateur in comparison.

    Frankly the best thing the Key Govt could do is largely ignore Hager.

    Hagar’s timing is out – the public are getting tired of this negativity and will switch off (especially this week, where the media has been hi-lighting a so-called “dirty election campaign” etc).

    Edit: Just watching Paul Henry catching Hager out (Hager has no evidence of Key doing anything dirty).

    Hmmm It’s struck me what this is really is about whilst watching Hager on TV3 – Hager (and Co) resent the fact that DPF and Cameron Slater have successful (right wing) blogs and it is attracting a lot of ordinary NZ’ers, who can obtain a broad range of views (including, oh no, right wing views to counter the Leftist spin … to the detriment of Labour and the Greens etc)!

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  178. Unity (632 comments) says:

    I won’t be buying Hager’s book. I can’t imagine he would write anything worth reading. What a shame he will probably make lots of money out of it from the gullible people who will buy it. That’s the worst scenario for me.

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  179. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Hello Nicky, ever heard of the Clark Govt and her manipulation of the media to attack critics (both political and non-political)

    Yes, I think he has:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seeds_of_Distrust

    Noted as being labelled conspiracy theory.

    plus Pledge Cards and the rorting of the law etc

    Anyone would think Clark burt your Vogels or something. It was 15 years ago, Harold, just let it go.

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  180. mister nui (1,030 comments) says:

    And then Charles Finny, who has read the whole thing (twice!), says it’s a pile of dross drivel, of which 95% is already in the public domain!

    As yoof would say, FAIL!

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  181. chris (647 comments) says:

    Not really itstricky, you equate the two with risk. Entirely possible they were different ‘hits’, because they had to be, hosting and email can be held separately, and usually are.

    Entirely possible. But then it’s also entirely not possible. Held separately – possible. Not held separately – possible. Anything is possible. That’s why it is possible that the DOS and email gather were the same thing.

    They are separate. All it takes is a DNS lookup. whaleoil.co.nz’s email is hosted by Google Apps / Gmail, and the website elsewhere. (That’s assuming Cam uses an @whaleoil.co.nz email address, of course.)

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  182. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    it is attracting a lot of ordinary NZ’ers, who can obtain a broad range of views

    You’re quite right. I hadn’t heard the word ‘feral’ for quite some years. Now I use it in everyday conversation. Most illuminating and educational.

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  183. Grizz (613 comments) says:

    @niggly

    You say it better than me. What it all comes down to is that there is a large segment of the public who feel the tradional media do not represent them so they have turned to blogs and other improvised news outlets. It just so happens that some lean to the right and are now starting to threaten their reason to to be.

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  184. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    “Anyone would think Clark burt your Vogels or something. It was 15 years ago, Harold, just let it go.”

    Rubbish. Hagar is claiming that the Key government is the dirtiest since Mulddoon, which goes back a lot longer than 15 years, so bringing up the Clarke regimes dirty tricks is perfectly valid and relevant.

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  185. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    They are separate. All it takes is a DNS lookup. whaleoil.co.nz’s email is hosted by Google Apps / Gmail, and the website elsewhere.

    Which is what I said above in a follow up post.

    That’s assuming Cam uses an @whaleoil.co.nz email address, of course.

    And there we go with that whole “well it’s possible…” thing again.

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  186. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Professor Geddes (posting as AG) said at 9.15:

    … he and others have about the fact that someone/group in National knifed Don Brash back in 2008. Time to let that one go, I think.

    That is bullshit. National’s email was hacked, and a prime candidate of the hacker who fed Hager would be a rogue leftist within the GCSB.

    Geddes’s profile on the University of Otago web site says he: “… is a member of the Legislation Advisory Committee, and has provided advice on several occasions to parliament’s Justice and Electoral Committee and Privileges Committee.”

    And yet he accepts as fact the bullshit Hager the Horrible put out about his source of the hacked National Party emails. Can this guy ever become a judge?

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  187. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Rubbish. Hagar is claiming that the Key government is the dirtiest since Mulddoon, which goes back a lot longer than 15 years, so bringing up the Clarke regimes dirty tricks is perfectly valid and relevant.

    That’s a very literal interpretation of a comment. I’m mearly saying I couldn’t give two tosses about Muldon, or Clark’s cards. It takes a tired old person to waaaaaahhhhhhhh on about Clark’s cards, or Muldoon these days. And I’m certainly not going to stay any further past 11pm to listen to how all the bad humans in the world are lefties and all the good moral people in the world are righties. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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  188. rouppe (983 comments) says:

    @daniel carter at 10:34pm

    “Attacking” and “attack dog politics” are completely different things, in my opinion.

    Expressing a different view to Labour and their cabal of mis-fits might be “attacking” them, but if you think that is any different to what also happens on The Standard, No Right Turn etc then you are deluded. As such the book is not worthy of such excitement.

    I reiterate: To my knowledge neither this blog nor whaleoil have promoted F*** David Cunliffe video’s or anything similar. That sort of filth has come only from the Left. If you think Farrar or Slater have lied, take them to court.

    Good luck with that

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  189. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Hell, itstricky, fallen asleep (11.07).

    I thought you were talking in your sleep all the time.

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  190. ShawnLH (6,521 comments) says:

    Ok itstricky, you can throw all your toys out of the cot and run away. :)

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  191. Nostalgia-NZ (5,317 comments) says:

    The problem with arguing that the current government is not the ‘dirtiest’ since Muldoon’s is that it’s ultimately saying exactly that – not the dirtiest. Also, introducing bloggers as doing (reporting) something that the MSM will not, or will give a different hue to the reporting, isn’t a catchall. They could, as some are set up to do: simply report the intended message of their ‘makers’ rather than something investigated and verified.

    If Hagar has the emails, regardless of whether he should have them or not, or if they were properly obtained, they will show his claims to be true or not true. However, we all know of the emails released after hours by Collin’s office, and the ‘death’ threats claims – are hardly ‘alternative’ reporting. Just as it will be difficult for most to accept that only the ‘true’ stories come from blogs attached to political parties. Play another one Sam.

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  192. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ posted at 11.22:

    …If Hagar has the emails, regardless of whether he should have them or not, or if they were properly obtained, they will show his claims to be true or not true.

    To establish whether emails are genuine or mere forgeries (be damned easy to create, I imagine), their source would have to be verified.

    IMHO, Hager said the Brash-era emails came from within the National Party chiefly to do maximum damage to National, and secondarily to protect his source, which I believe was most likely a rogue leftist within the GCSB.

    If Hager the Horrible is all the Left have got, the Left is on the shovel and on the way to the dustbin of history.

    Please note the spelling of NZ’s crazy Hager the Horrible. Don’t confuse him with the Hagar of the American comic strip.

    There’s one thing in the comic character that may or may not be relevant to the NZ Hager, as this bit from Wikipedia shows:

    Helga demanded that Hägar speak the truth at least one time, Hägar agrees and does so, something that pleasantly surprises even God himself, who promptly makes angels playing the trumpets in celebration of this “miracle”.

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  193. Scott Chris (6,178 comments) says:

    He got information that was the result of a hack. That’s not illegal in itself.

    Is hacked information not classified a stolen good? (note: I don’t like Slater but I don’t like thieves either)

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  194. Maggy Wassilieff (482 comments) says:

    @ Grizz…Who should be threatened by this? I would say the print media. Disseminating information for centuries was the role of the print media.

    Precisely…. and why should I shell out $35 for a paper copy when I get a blow-by blow account and reviews (of all persuasions) of the book by all you astute folk.

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  195. Grizz (613 comments) says:

    Get a copy from Mega tomorrow for free.

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  196. Maggy Wassilieff (482 comments) says:

    oh look, a preview online…… sorry DPF, an old photo herein
    http://dirtypoliticsnz.com/

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  197. Nostalgia-NZ (5,317 comments) says:

    I don’t see it as if Hager (thanks for the spell check) is all the left Jack5, or any other direction, have. It’s the legitimacy of comparing a ‘pet’ to genuine reporting. To make my point, if this leak is verified it proves that general press releases signify democracy at work, and that selected, ‘helpful’ releases to allies is not. If it is all above board, then release to all msm.

    Arguing if the route of political material to the public, or ‘free’ media, is stolen unless it comes from ‘approved’ sources is sort of USSR.

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  198. Yoza (1,923 comments) says:

    ShawnLH (4,197 comments) says:
    August 13th, 2014 at 10:39 pm

    So?

    “Also in 2011 the PM’s office used its knowledge of secret SIS documents to tip off Slater and arrange an attack on Labour leader Phil Goff, and drafted Official Information Act requests for Slater to use in other attacks.”

    So, the Prime Minister’s office – that is the office of the guy who handed control of New Zealand’s most powerful spy agency to a close family friend – is using the SIS to spy on political opponents.

    Did you miss that bit, Shawn?

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  199. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Thank you Maggy (11.48).

    This from Hager the Horrible’s preface:

    There is no need to follow those who are least principled down into the pit.

    What a pretentious, sanctimonious hypocrite! He deals in stolen correspondence and labels others “least principled”.

    This guy is definitely deluded. He sees himself as some sort of moral superman, who can justify prying into stolen correspondence on the grounds he is doing good.

    Not totally unlike the hypocrisy of the British Prime Minister, Gladstone, who reportedly stalked the streets of London seeking to reclaim street prostitutes from a life of vice.

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  200. adc (558 comments) says:

    Yoza. There’s a difference between using information from a previous SIS report gathered for other purposes, and commissioning the SIS to spy on someone.

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  201. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Re Nostalgia-NZ at 11.51:

    The trouble with reported leaks is how do you verify they are true. Hager the Horrible never tries to prove this to us.

    Comparing these trifling pieces of communication with leaks from within the Soviet Union is not really balanced, Nostalgia-NZ. Hager babbles about nothing compared with the KGB files confirming Sutch was a spy, and apparently so was an unnamed member of the Labour Party.

    The relevant KGB files in Britain are valid, no question. Hager the Horrible’s material remains allegations unless he releases his sources for verification.

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  202. niggly (832 comments) says:

    “Also in 2011 the PM’s office used its knowledge of secret SIS documents to tip off Slater and arrange an attack on Labour leader Phil Goff, and drafted Official Information Act requests for Slater to use in other attacks.”

    Knowing Hager’s modus operandi (as evidenced in his previous books) I wouldn’t be surprised if he is simply conflating various (very obvious) information and trying to join them together to produce some dots.

    What’s probably more interesting then is, if Hager’s allegation has any truth, this simply reinforces the fact that Goff was indeed LYING about the SIS documents (as exposed by the likes of Cameron Slater).

    Another nice own goal by Hager against the Left!

    Thanks Nicky for supposedly confirming in your book then that Goff and Labour were indeed, in relation to the Chch/SIS issue, LIARS!

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  203. Yoza (1,923 comments) says:

    Scott Chris (5,923 comments) says:
    August 13th, 2014 at 11:33 pm

    Is hacked information not classified a stolen good? (note: I don’t like Slater but I don’t like thieves either)

    If the stolen/hacked information is of significant enough public importance, and the PM’s office using the SIS to spy on political opponents would pass that test, the ‘hack’ was the lesser of the two evils. No one likes thieves, but spy agencies being employed by elected officials to spy on their opponents, that’s banana republic corruption.

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  204. adc (558 comments) says:

    don’t the SIS have a report on all politicians?

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  205. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ also posted at 11.51:

    Arguing if the route of political material to the public, or ‘free’ media, is stolen unless it comes from ‘approved’ sources is sort of USSR.

    But the material does need to be tested, and available for test by all, Nostalgia-NZ. For that, Hager the Horrible needs to give full details of his sources.

    Remember Milton’s famous words:

    … who ever knew Truth put to the worse, in a free and open encounter?

    Before the encounter, we have to establish first what is truth in this case, and for that Hager the Horrible must come absolutely and fully clean about his sources – no anonymity.

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  206. niggly (832 comments) says:

    If the stolen/hacked information is of significant enough public importance, and the PM’s office using the SIS to spy on political opponents would pass that test, the ‘hack’ was the lesser of the two evils. No one likes thieves, but spy agencies being employed by elected officials to spy on their opponents, that’s banana republic corruption.

    Yoza – give it a rest mate! The SIS were not spying on political opponents (although that happened under Helen’s watch eg against Keith Locke early on, but under Key’s watch he put a very public stop to that). Hager’s beef is that allegedly information on what to OIA was passed on. So two different issues!

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  207. Yoza (1,923 comments) says:

    adc (555 comments) says:
    August 14th, 2014 at 12:05 am

    Yoza. There’s a difference between using information from a previous SIS report gathered for other purposes, and commissioning the SIS to spy on someone.

    No there isn’t, all we have is a wobbly assurance that the information from the report was gathered for the purposes the SIS claimed it was.

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  208. infused (582 comments) says:

    I’ve posted on TheStandard about why the ddos attack/theft is bs…

    http://thestandard.org.nz/hagers-dirty-politics/#comment-865822

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  209. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Thanks Nookin.

    From the Crimes Act 1961

    248 Interpretation
    For the purposes of this section and sections 249 to 252,—
    access, in relation to any computer system, means instruct,
    communicate with, store data in, receive data from, or otherwise
    make use of any of the resources of the computer system
    authorisation includes an authorisation conferred on a person
    by or under an enactment or a rule of law, or by an order of a
    court or judicial process
    computer system—
    (a) means—
    (i) a computer; or
    (ii) 2 or more interconnected computers; or
    (iii) any communication links between computers or
    to remote terminals or another device; or
    (iv) 2 or more interconnected computers combined
    with any communication links between computers or to remote terminals or any other device;
    and
    (b) includes any part of the items described in paragraph
    (a) and all related input, output, processing, storage,
    software, or communication facilities, and stored data.

    249 Accessing computer system for dishonest purpose

    (1) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding
    7 years who, directly or indirectly, accesses any computer
    system and thereby, dishonestly or by deception, and without
    claim of right,—
    (a) obtains any property, privilege, service, pecuniary advantage,
    benefit, or valuable consideration; or
    (b) causes loss to any other person.
    (2) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding
    5 years who, directly or indirectly, accesses any computer
    system with intent, dishonestly or by deception, and without
    claim of right,—
    (a) to obtain any property, privilege, service, pecuniary advantage,
    benefit, or valuable consideration; or
    (b) to cause loss to any other person.
    (3) In this section, deception has the same meaning as in section
    240(2).

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  210. Bogusnews (414 comments) says:

    UglyTruth you are talking a load of nonsense.

    For example, you say “Copying information is not theft because it does not deprive the owner of possession.”

    Try telling that to the people who are prosecuted for copying movies, or books, or pretty much anything else. I do wish you would stop reinforcing the view of the flexible stand on ethics so often shown by the left.

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  211. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Ok itstricky, you can throw all your toys out of the cot and run away.

    Or I could have, I dunno, a life or something.

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  212. IGM (611 comments) says:

    Hager and Bradbury are low lives whose word and integrity would be on a par with a rodent . . . even lower than Cunliffe!

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  213. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    UglyTruth you are talking a load of nonsense.

    No, you simply don’t understand fair use.

    For example, you say “Copying information is not theft because it does not deprive the owner of possession.”

    Which is factually correct.

    Try telling that to the people who are prosecuted for copying movies, or books, or pretty much anything else.

    That is due to the US doctrine of fair use, which is not a part of the law of New Zealand.

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  214. itstricky (2,017 comments) says:

    Ive posted on TheStandard about why the ddos attack/theft is bs…

    Just because he uses Gmail doesn’the mean, for example, that he didn’the use the same password for access to both. Or have some sort of interface between the two systems. Or other information that allowed them to get to his mail. Less likely maybe but not ‘bs’. Anything is possible.

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  215. RRM (10,096 comments) says:

    You’re a good guy DPF ;-)

    Nicky Hagar is nothing much…

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  216. Mark (1,502 comments) says:

    There is nothing quite as deflating for the author of an expose has having the so called conspiraters agreeing with the revalation and saying “so what”.

    Fuck me how stupid is Hager. He spends a chapter revealing Farrar is a national party supporter – fucking genious – he simply could have picked up the phone and asked him and I have little doubt DPF could have dictated the chapter for him , would have saved a lot of time that was clearly spent scurrying around a bunch of illegaly sourced emails. The great thing about honesty is it completely fucks the conspiracy theorists. Hager has come out of this looking a complete twat

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  217. dancealot (1 comment) says:

    Hey why doesn’t Hagar investigate Cunliffe’s dirty politics? When I helped campaign for him in 1999 when he first stood for parliament he and his cronies only ever referred to his opponent as “the black bitch”. I forget her name but she was a good person and the Labour camp disgusted me.

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  218. Ed Snack (1,931 comments) says:

    I’m with Infused, a “DOS” attack is an external attempt to flood a site with traffic so it can’t respond to other legitimate queries. It has NO relation to attempts to gain access to data held at the site; and by its nature, can’t be related to data theft. However the DOS attack *could* be associated with an entirely separate but simultaneous attempt to gain access to emails or data, the DOS being used if you like as a diversionary tactic to keep the target focused on a different problem.

    Hager’s story about being sent the 8 Gb drive anonymously is a pathetic joke, what we do need is all of Hager’s emails “hacked” to expose his links with politicians and other nefarious characters (often one and the same) to find out who commissioned this theft of data.

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  219. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Two further points:

    DPF posted at the head of this thread:

    What is very interesting is that his source is once again stolen e-mails. In The Hollow Men, he claimed they were leaked to him by an insider. In this book they are obviously hacked from Cameron Slater, which to my mind raises huge disbelief over his claims that the previous set of e-mails were leaked.

    In my view, there is a likelihood that a Leftist within the GCSB has stirred and gone rogue a second time.

    2. John Armstrong in the Hooerald opines that “Hager is credible”. So Armstrong’s reputation is now also fully on the line.

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  220. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Whale implies Herr Dotcom may also be involved in the hack behind Hager the Horrible’s publishing PR con:

    Two independent witnesses have placed Nicky Hagar at the Dotcom mansion on multiple occasions. Hagar has admitted to only one visit on radio this morning. It’s not true, but it doesn’t matter. The important part is that the whole thing is falling apart withing 24 hours – a bit like Labour Party policy.

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  221. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    You been listening to that pillock Plunket Jack5?

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  222. Jack5 (5,257 comments) says:

    Good morning, Jackinabox.

    Listening to Plunket, no.

    Hager the Horrible’s book is so obviously a smart publishing promotion that I don’t need to listen to Plunket.

    Do you reckon your old mates, the police, have the smarts necessary to track down the e-burglars, or should Key turn the SIS on to combing the GCSB?

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  223. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    That Dutchman Maarten Kleintjes might have the smarts to do the job but because he works for the cops his morals are suspect.

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  224. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    John Key said he didn’t know of Kim Dot Com until a day before the Coatesville raid and KDC said he has proof that John Key has lied about that.

    Do the damning Hagar revelations about John Key’s political advisor Jason Ede enhance KDC’s credibility?

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  225. goldnkiwi (1,611 comments) says:

    lol not that I think that there is anything earth shattering in Hager’s book but then that is anecdotal as others do the reading for me, but I do think it would be funny if some of the Hager nothings were the same as .coms promised nothings. ;)

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  226. donlawman (3 comments) says:

    Be great if Nicky would save us hiring hackers and voluntter to show us, or an independent neutral observer, all HIS emails for the last few years…?

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  227. donlawman (3 comments) says:

    Be a real shame if in two month’s time we have to present our new leaders as a criminal German political puppeteer, a disaster-prone socially uncomfortable Labour leader, a Firebrand Harawira, Cabinet Minister Minto, and an assorted racist bunch of Peterites….not helpful when we live in a global environment depending on trade to give us jobs….!

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