General Debate 16 June 2018

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NZpatriot

“The oil and gas industry is on death row, no debate, no consultation, no future, just the rotten smell of decay when Ardern slipped on the destroy button – otherwise known as her climate change moment. An astonishing instance, making history by closing an entire industry without a debate around the Cabinet table.”

From Garner this morning on the Government’s performance: https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/104757447/duncan-garner-mum-the-misfit-kids-need-you-back-in-a-hurry

The out-of-the-blue decision to ban mining on convseervation land, announced in the Speech from the Throne in November, was made in exactly the same way. There was similarly no consultation, no offices advice, not in the Labour or NZ first manifestos or agreements – just out of thin air.

A very serious and very disturbing trend is emerging with this Government.

The corporate sector now has no idea who the Government will hit next. Certainty of stable policy settings is gone, and sovereign risk is way up.

People need to keep reminding all their friends of this – keep it in the narrative – because it is true, and very concerning. This Government really does need to be dismissed at the next election.
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June 16, 2018 8:00am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Or preferably before.
  GG, where are you?
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:10am
  - waikatogirl
    
    Isn’t she a vegan?
    I doubt we’ll get any sense from that direction then!
    ?
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:18am
    - Fletch
      
      You mean she won’t be having her placenta-shake?
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:49am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    I suppose you could also dream of a military coup – but that won’t happen either.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:18am
    - kowtow
      
      The coups are history too , under this regime.
      
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      June 16, 2018 8:40am
    - Humble Capitalist
      
      Waiouru ready to strike any day now
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:06am
      - ztev
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Waiouru was basicaslly emptied by the previous government under their down sizing agenda. The
        land for training is still used but not much else.
        
        Basic training and headquarters of training, doctrine command, the army command school and the army depot would also be shifting to Burnham.
        
        Just goes to show the validity of idiots who say ‘Waiouru is ready’
        
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/78614567/army-basic-training-set-to-shift-from-waiouru-to-burnham
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:36am
      - GazzaW
        
        Just goes to show the validity of idiots who keep letting the squirrels loose ztev.
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:52am
      - Humble Capitalist
        
        Ztev you’re the idiot if you took my comment with any seriousness. Which you did.
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:05pm
      - Duxton
        
        Bullshit, ztev. The Army has been moving units out of Waiouru for at least 20 years.
        
        The main issue is the cost of maintenance and infrastructure. Many of the training facilities in Waiouru are WW2 vintage. Many of the buildings are poorly insulated, and the boiler system (which heats the barracks) is unreliable. Rather than ‘build new’ in Waiouru, in the late 1990s the Army made the perfectly sensible decision to transfer the units to locations which are newer, have better maintenance support, and have better facilities for families.
        
        Labour: lying c*nts since 1916.
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:33pm
      - ztev
        
        Hmm since the late 1990s?
        basic training goes THIS year
        and in 2016 general kelley said:
        “plan was to relocate the headquarters training and doctrine command,
        the army command school
        and the army depot from Waiouru to Burnham.”
        
        What rubbish to say its long been happening. Its definitely almost entirely happened in the immediate past.
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:51pm
      - Duxton
        
        More bullshit, ztev.
        
        Trade Training School moved to Trentham in the early 1990s. Other Schools followed in the late 90s and early 00s. Some aspects of Officer Cadet training moved to Palmerston North/Linton in 2000. Queen Alexandra’s Mtd Rifles moved to Linton in about 2004. Tactical School moved to Linton in about 2013.
        
        The units you refer to are about all that’s left.
        
        Oh, and it’s ‘Kelly’, not ‘kelley’.
        
        Labour: making shit up since 1916.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:50pm
    - KevOB
      
      Sure? What else is left when their is no legal mechanism to eject a failed government?
      
      Too much damage has been done already in the name of ideology which requires regal power to execute against the people. The duty of care under a mandate has been scrapped. Without that mandate this govt has to be considered unlawful.
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:57am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Mining on ‘conservation’ land seems almost an oxymoron.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:17am
  - NZpatriot
    
    On the face of it, yes that’s right Milkenmild. But it is important to consider that much land administered by DOC is of quite low value (such as paddocks, even car parks) that was given to DOC back in the 1980s. That’s actually why we need to reclassify that “stewardship land”.
    
    Also, thanks for your grace in not pointing out my horrific typo when trying to say “Conservation” in my primary post!
    
    Cheers.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:24am
  - Harkman
    
    “moron.”
    Hey, you stated it. ?
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:49am
- Justitia
  
  Garner got it right for once – even a blind squirrel gets the odd nut. The oil and gas decision weighs heavily. I don’t have any direct investments in the industry but all New Zealanders have a stake in our energy security. My particular concern is that the decision and the way it was made is an outrage against our fragile democracy which lacks so many safeguards found in more sophisticated countries. It must be challenged for these reasons and you are right to keep the issue alive.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:18am
  - waikatogirl
    
    Garner also states that Phil Twitford’s Kiwibuild dream is “a scam, a fraud”. That Kiwibuild will result in a few houses being built, and all as a result of prior planning by the National party. Twitford had no idea about the nuts and bolts of building and has discovered it’s not easy to throw up thousands of houses as he glibly promised.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:23am
    - artemisia
      
      Interesting to see who is going to buy the Kiwibuild homes when some finally arrive, and what taxpayer subsidy buyers will get. There are already thousands of homes on the market, ready for buyers with the right deposit and ability to convince the bank they can pay. And more under construction.
      
      Residential property investors have been buyers in the past, especially new apartments, but fewer will be interested in buying now. Due to LVR, increased costs and compliance and business and interest rate uncertainty.
      
      Kiwibuild may be the salvation for developers, until buyers realise the proportion of social housing nearby.
      
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      June 16, 2018 8:37am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        ‘Due to LVR, increased costs and compliance and business and interest rate uncertainty.’ And the threat of new taxes, just for property investors (CGT, land tax).
        
        How does the CoL imagine prices to keep easing off? As soon as any new young buyers get their mortgage and their home, they certainly won’t want prices to fall, and nor will the banks. Nor will the developer or current house owners.
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:46am
    - dubya
      
      I got an invitation to a Kiwibuild summit next month, hosted by MC Duncan Garner and featuring Phil Twyford, Phil Goff, and Jenny Salesa.
      
      It sounds fucking grim, but I’m tempted to go and heckle…
      
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      June 16, 2018 8:40am
      - calendar girl
        
        dubya, do please go to the KiwiBuild show, and report back to Kiwiblog’s readers what the Minister and Auckland’s Mayor have to say.
        
        As you’re well aware, we can’t rely on our news media to provide fair coverage and assessment. So a worthwhile public service on your part?
        
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        June 16, 2018 9:06am
      - softail 1450
        
        dubya, sounds like the perfect meeting spot for a hellfire missile strike.
        
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        June 16, 2018 9:08am
      - Duxton
        
        I think you should go.
        
        And then sneeze all over the buffet lunch.
        
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        June 16, 2018 9:11am
    - Harkman
      
      Yes he calls it “a scam, a fraud” yet he is guest speaker at the DesignEx 2018 conference in a couple of weeks, which doubles as a Kiwibuild event. I think he was really referring to himself ? (as well).
      
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      June 16, 2018 8:53am
      - ztev
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        I well remember Garner as an afternoon radio host pouring scorn on then governments and Auckland council SHA program.
        Never going to achieve its promised numbers he said.
        It Did ( but didnt lead to more houses but the consents for new sections was achieved which is what was promised)
        
        Garner cant even keep his own marriage promises so why believe some one with zero track record on housing as well.
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11983311
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:44am
      - Shaun the Sheep
        
        Ztev
        Trolling in Garners personal life is tacky and unnecessary.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:16pm
      - Harkman
        
        Ztev, yes a bit like Trevor Mallard sleeping around on his wife after he tried to humiliate Don Brash in the House.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:43pm
      - ztev
        
        I dont know what Garners vows were but I bet they dindnt include ‘have and to hold for a short time’
        
        Look hes a public figure and gives judgement on others, Im returning the favour
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:49pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        @Shaun the Sheep. Ztev excels at tacky, mean, defamatory, nasty. He is the epitome of a typical feral, tribal Labour supporter. All nasty, No thought. Very much a “kick the man when he is down” type of person, or “shoot unarmed prisoners” type of war criminal. The word “cunt” is probably a good synonym. Just a fucking waste of time and the blog is better off when he is in the cooler.
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:06pm
      - calendar girl
        
        “Look hes a public figure and gives judgement on others ….”
        
        While you hide behind an alias to muck-rake.
        
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        June 17, 2018 11:47am
    - Shaun the Sheep
      
      Contractors for HNZ are currently building houses like there’s no tomorrow.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:11am
      - Prince
        
        Do you mean they’re not building them, or they’re made of cardboard ?
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:26pm
  - Souvlaki
    
    Regretably correct on Bridges too! ?.
    …so much meat to get stuck into…and we hear about climate change ! Let’s face it..
    …caucus fluffed it!?
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:00am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  They are not idiots. They are deeply cynical and they know exactly what they are doing.
  
  They are working the MMP system to their advantage. If MMP allows something, they do not need to refer to conscience or anything resembling a sense of right or wrong. If a thing can be done – no matter how destructive to the country – then it shall be done.
  
  NZF have one goal – win a seat and continue to exist. That is it! If it takes a $1 billion dollar pork barrel in Shane Jones’ electorate – and there is no way to stop it, then that is what will happen!
  
  Labour are smart enough to look around the world (unlike National) and they can see the pendulum is swinging back on cultural marxism, identity politics and globalism. The EU is unravelling. Primaries in the US have shown that Trumpism is now mainstreaming. They know the next 20 years there will be less tolerance of socialist lies and bullshit. Consequently, Labour know that they have a very short time in government to scorch the NZ earth (economically speaking) and create enough unrest, disharmony and poverdy to give themselves a chance of ever governing again.
  
  I think Labour know that eventually, even National will wake up to the failure of progressivism and the end of virtue-signalling as a policy platform – and Labour have to screw the scrum before National wake the fuck up.
  
  Hence, the gross economic vandalism underway right now. As we’ve seen, there are no immediate consequences for a government that breaks it’s promises, lies like a hooker in a bed and fills it’s own pork barrels.
  
  And when there are no consequences, the excesses will get worse and worse and worse.
  
  In an FPP election. NZF would not exist. The Greens would not exist. Labour would have half the seats of National.
  
  NZ did this to ourselves when we voted to keep the system that keeps on giving Winston the power.
  
  FPP is the cure to the cancer we see in politics now.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:14am
  - KevOB
    
    A modified MMP may be sufficient.
    No list member to be able to vote on confidence and supply.
    No list member to be in the Executive.
    Parliament to be dissolved on a petition of 15% of the registered voters.
    
    The three year term is no longer adequate protection from a rogue govt.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:05am
    - DifferentPerspective
      
      KevOB
      
      I like your thinking. At least it would be a start.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:34am
    - niggly
      
      Modified MMP – possible options:
      
      *Largest party controls the negotiations and has the mandate to form a govt (not the small parties).
      
      *If the largest party cannot form a coalition with the various small parties, the the largest party negotiates with the second largest party. (The rationale being small parties can’t then ask for absurdly unrealistic policy concessions like they do).
      
      *If the largest party and the second largest party cannot form a coalition, then a new election is held (and the largest and second largest party takes their chances with the electorate again).
      
      In reality the largest and second largest parties will usually be Labour and National (or vice versa), at least if a grand coalition is formed then it should ensure stability and continuity (which is sadly lacking with the COL, to the detriment of NZ’s economic standing).
      
      It also means smaller parties stop wagging the dog. But the best thing for them is, it forces smaller parties to be more realistic in order to make them attractive to voters and the major parties (instead of being too extremist).
      
      It’s either that or replace MMP with SM (which is MMP but less extreme & greater electorate MP influence/less List MP influence).
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:47am
      - ztev
        
        Countries where largest party wasnt the government:
        New Zealand currently
        Australia currently , Labour is largest party
        
        Germany , twice in late 70s
        
        Britain in mid 1920s where labour was second largest but became government.
        Im sure there were/are many others.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:08pm
      - KevOB
        
        The the list members cannot vote on confidence on supply that takes them out of the coalition equation. They may be useful on the back benches and committees but not in the Cabinet room.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:43pm
  - srylands
    
    Well we had the chance. The 2011 referendum kept the current MMP with 57.8 percent voting to keep it.
    
    However IIRC John Key decided to stay neutral. A strong campaign around the disaster that is MMP might have made the difference.
    
    National could have campaigned for an end to MMP but not a return to FPP. And they could have explained why a system like instant run off voting would have delivered stable government but left open the option of third party candidates being elected if they convinced large numbers of voters in an electorate that they were a credible alternative.
    
    Anyway it is too late now.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:06am
    - ztev
      
      Key wasnt stupid on an MMP poll. curia gives him the answers to the ‘issue du jour’
      
      I noticed that with equal marriage private members bill. There was a couple of days while he sat on the fence while Curia did its calls and lo and behold Key announced he was with the majority.
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:48am
      - srylands
        
        Oh OK then.
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:55am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        ‘with the majority’ – and? Isn’t that what a democratic government should be?
        
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        June 16, 2018 2:37pm
- The Heat
  
  Why are all these people so surprised? Are they really this gullible and stupid?
  
  Labour + partners were always going to be awful. How could they ever be anything but?
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:21am
- KevOB
  
  Before. They have exceeded their authority, are incompetent, reckless and damaging.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:54am
Than

There is an article on Stuff comparing the benefits of driving to work versus taking the bus. As somebody who has used buses, cycling, and driving to commute around Christchurch for a number of years, I strongly dispute their figures. The article is so blatantly biased, I honestly wonder if it is native advertising paid for by CCC and/or ECan to promote bus use.

But the financial gain comes with the sacrifice of convenience and what for some is a frustrating caveat – spending up to two weeks longer a year stuck in traffic.

That’s a very lowball estimate. It wouldn’t be “up to” two weeks, it could very easily be more.

In my experience, as a very rough rule of thumb, when commuting by bus allow twice the amount of time it would take to drive yourself. It can easily be more than this (especially if you have to connect between different services), but this works as a simple estimate. So if a typical commute by car is between 15-25 minutes, then a typical commute using the bus would be between 30-50 minutes. Or put another way, using the bus would add 15-25 minutes of additional time each journey. Going to work and back for 225 days a year, that works out to 6750-11250 minutes (112-187 hours) a year. More like three or four weeks, not two.

When calculating the potential money saved by using the bus, the article’s numbers are again highly suspect;

Motorists commuting between Rangiora and the central city spend about $38.50 on their daily journeys, equating to $192.85 a week or about $9250 a year.

Not a good example. Yes a lot of people do commute in from Rangiora, but it’s a far longer commute than average. The bus fare from Rangiora is higher than within the Christchurch metro area ($3.25 versus $2.55), but not proportionally to the greater distance. This is a blatantly cherry-picked example to maximise the saving from using the bus. In fact all of the examples cited are for satellite towns and outer suburbs, where the difference in commuting times are lowest and the potential savings are highest.

Here are numbers I would consider more useful. Bus fare is easy, a flat $2.55 each trip regardless of distance (within zone 1), so $1147.50 a year. For a car the calculation is not as simple, but the article’s $38.50 to Rangiora equates to roughly 70c a kilometer. Let’s say 75c/km, since inner city driving is less fuel efficient than open-road. The maximum commute for somebody living within metro Christchurch is 15km (driving right across from one side of the city to the other), but something like 3-8km would be more typical. The 15km commute would cost $22.50 a day, so $5062.5 a year. A 5km commute would cost $7.50 a day or $1687.50 a year. The saving from taking the bus could be anything from nothing (for those commuting less than 3km or so), up to $4000 per year (for those commuting right from one side of the city to the other), with a saving of $500-$1500 being more typical.

Putting those numbers together, spending three to four week of your time for a $500-$1500 saving, that works out to somewhere between $3/hr and $12.50/hr – much less than the minimum wage.
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June 16, 2018 8:05am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  Those pushing public transport are not those who use it. I live 7 minutes drive from my work (on a Sunday) Week days it is about 50 minutes, but buses (3 of them) would take over 2 hours. That’s 4 hours a day to do an 8 hour job. Ridiculous.
  Get the buses off the bus lanes so those paying the road taxes and petrol taxes can use them
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:22am
  - Brigitte
    
    I’m on the North Shore too and the bus takes 15 mins to reach town even at rush hour (thanks bus lanes). It takes longer than that in a car just to get on the motorway.
    
    But the biggest benefit is not time but 5pm on a Friday (also known as wine o’clock).
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:26am
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    I live in Bayview and work in Rosedale – 2 hours
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:42am
    - marcw
      
      I live in Auckland, but work in Christchurch – 2 hours.
      
      You, like me, needs to move (or get another job).
      
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      June 16, 2018 12:20pm
- brett68
  
  The article is so blatantly biased, I honestly wonder if it is native advertising paid for by CCC and/or ECan to promote bus use.
  
  That’s why I have no faith in what I read in the media anymore.
  
  On the same topic of bias I wouldn’t be surprised if Labour via some marketing company was supplying and paying the media to run all the fluff pieces on Ardern and Gayford.
  
  The media is so compromised, you can’t trust anything you read, just look at the herald with it’s one roof bullshit it’s nothing more than a giant advertisement for the real estate industry.
  
  https://www.oneroof.co.nz/news?ref=nzhhome
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:01am
- KevOB
  
  There are further economic losses too. The extra time travelling extends the work day and increases fatigue all of which reduce productivity.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:08am
- Colville
  
  So if you spent that approx 150 hours wasted time at work at a reasonable rate you can get five grand or so.
  I will drive thanks.
  
  Edit. I haven’t worked for anyone else for nearly 30 years so I may be biased ?
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:13am
- Than
  
  A CORRECTION: When the article talked about “weeks” my brain automatically went to “working week”, i.e. 40 hours. I’ve since clicked that they probably meant a calendar week of 24 hours times 7 days, or 144 hours. With that realisation their figures for time spent on the bus become compatible with mine. I withdraw and apologise for this criticism.
  
  My second criticism stands however – the huge saving figures they cite are only applicable to the very longest commutes possible on the Christchurch bus system. Typical savings would be much lower, and are unlikely to be a worthwhile trade-off for the extra time taken.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:31am
duggledog

Once, it was considered foolish to lend money to Greek administrations as it was widely acknowledged they tended to be chaotic and unreliable organizations, voted in by… shall we say an unrealistic people.

Funds were available, but always with stringent guidelines and high interest rates.

Then of course along came the largest, most incompetent and wasteful bureaucracy of all time (EU), complete with free money, and inevitably the ruin followed.

New Zealanders with mortgages should be worried, and National need to articulate very clearly that our robust economy and low interest rates may not be permanent.

As predicted, and confirmed by the PM last week vis a vis Peters & 3S, in its first year, this Government already resembles the death rattle of Helen’s ninth, when she spent more time negotiating than governing.

Just consider – through a different lens – the internal ructions in this hopeless mess of a coalition. Green v Green. NZF v big business. NZF v the PS. Low quality Labour ministers running around like headless chooks.

Goodness knows what foreign lenders must think of our farcical administration eating itself and the ramifications two or three years hence.

One more thing:

Andrew Little: The reason the vast majority of NZ is tone deaf to you and your Prime Minister’s absurd splutterings about the unfairness of a second striker getting the max for pinching a female guard’s arse is because

He finally got his just desserts. And kiwis applaud it.

Newshub poll: 65% think this government is shit. 5,000 people voted.
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June 16, 2018 8:05am
- Salacious Crumb
  
  Well said DD. National do need to remember however, that just being less shit than Labour doesn’t make for good government either.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:17am
- flipper
  
  Well I have no doubt that this Regime is shit. But where does that lead?
  Who will fulfill the role of the Barbarian at the gate (para)’???
  With that a+++hole Mallard as the adjudicator, only a National/ACT walkout and a refusal to return until Mallard abandons his bias (covert and overt) will make an impression on the MSM and voter sloths.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:27am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Well, well – it’s flipper calling someone names again. It’s okay flipper, we know the source of your rage – tell us where the the fat man touched you.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:35am
  - Harkman
    
    Yes they should have done a complete walk out of Parliament weeks ago and refused to enter until Mallard resigns as speaker. But again National is failing to score when massive openings emerge.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:58am
    - Inandout
      
      Harkman I have to agree that National have lost so many opportunities to hobble the CoL. As an example, notice how the Labour camp fiddling is not mentioned by the National leader?
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:12am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        If only political party leaders would behave like their moronic followers on blogs, everything would be so much better.
        
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        June 16, 2018 9:38am
      - ztev
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Young labour camp
        What about Young national
        Thats because a well known bloggers emails were hacked which told some of the details of Young Nats ‘sex parties’
        
        I have them at my fingertips…but will be regaling -slowly-you all with details on which girls were ‘dirty’
        Some of the attendees were a bit older than the average young nat- why would that be?
        
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        June 16, 2018 11:02am
      - sooty
        
        So, you are saying because they do it, we can do it too. The trouble is that Labour are just a pack of sexual deviants all joined together into one party. It is natural for them to pursue their own fantiseys and have all ways have. After all the alphabet soup party.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:03pm
    - KevOB
      
      The COL govt has no mandate for its actions but its doubtful that the Opposition can properly walk out of Parliament. The govt can still command a quorum and continue.
      Another 6 months of the present shenanigans by the COL and the country may have to brought a stop. Licence is not rule.
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:14am
  - Duxton
    
    Harkman – I agree,
    
    And, before, one of them needs to ask whether Mallard is still rooting Curran. Given his clear bias, it is a perfectly reasonable question.
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:24am
    - Inandout
      
      Good God Dux, the mind boggles.
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:09am
      - lifesgood
        
        Well he’s been through quite a few so wouldn’t be surprising. Is Jane Clifton simple or something?
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:19pm
      - Duxton
        
        lifesgood: No, I don’t think so. I think it is more that she is simply fugly, and has no class whatsoever. It’s Trevor the Rooter, or Nothing At All.
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:41pm
kowtow

So enriching.

‘Hours after officers confirmed the two men had been charged by an anti-terror judge, and then detained, police announced that they had thwarted the fifth Islamic extremist attack in France so far in 2018, this one targeting a swingers’ club.’

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/06/15/police-foil-islamist-terror-swingers/
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June 16, 2018 8:07am
- Inandout
  
  This article from Aussie may explain the Twyford like dancing that their Muslims display:
  
  ‘Observers of the same-sex marriage debate will have noticed the voice of one particular community has been largely missing from the fray: Muslims.
  
  With few exceptions, including a statement from the National Imams Council, almost all of the talk of religious freedom and opposition to the bill on the grounds of faith has come from Christian leaders, particularly from the Anglican and Catholic Churches.
  
  But now one Muslim leader has offered an explanation.
  
  Last night on ABC’s The Drum, Ali Kadri, spokesman for the Islamic Council of Queensland and the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, said his community was stuck with the choice of offending allies or siding with critics, and the result had been silence.
  
  “Unfortunately, in the current climate, the right and conservative side has attacked Muslims as terrorists and extremists, and naturally the left side has been allies in defending us for a long period of time,” he said.
  
  “We are afraid if we come out with our opinion then the left may abandon us for going against their view and we can’t be friendly with the conservatives because they have been bashing us for 15, 20 years every chance they get … and that includes some Christian sects as well.”
  
  This statement explains why the Left fawn over Islam, disregarding their treatment of gays.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:32am
  - Huevon
    
    The Muslims aren’t dumb. It’s in their interests to have open borders, generous welfare and hate speech laws (which only apply to whites and Christians).
    
    It seems they can live with keeping quiet about their plans for throwing gays off buildings. Gotta pick your battles.
    
    Of course, the Left are the useful idiots. Once the Muzzies have a significant population, it’s sharia time and their ain’t no 76 genders in that.
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:57am
  - simpleton1
    
    What is more important?
    
    An essence of Mohammad’s advice and guidance can be completed..
    Later, how can the left be opposed to polygamy?
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:56am
secondcumming

My mother in-law retweets……..

‘Prince Harry just can’t help looking like a real c**t’

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dc9C3HJW0AEfC3n.jpg
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June 16, 2018 8:10am
peterwn

A bankrupt builder got 3 years 4 months jail for squandering $1.5M at Sky City instead of making it available for debtors.
This is one case IMO where imprisonment is inappropriate. An intensive community detention/supervision should be available in such instances and should involve loss of community rights such no voting, banned from licenced premises, directed where to live, etc, etc.
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June 16, 2018 8:10am
- secondcumming
  
  I think you’ll find there’s a lot more to that story. The gentleman involved was already a bankrupt, and while gambling something like *$24 million* thru Sky City, took the knock on his creditors for in excess of 2 mill.
  
  A jail term was well deserved…. and hopefully he’ll be deported back to *China* once he’s completed his sentence.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:20am
  - Nookin
    
    Now that the SOB is not going anywhere, there should be a thorough investigation into quality and compliance of every developement with which he has been associated. Pricks like this do not pride themselves on the quality of their product. They measure success on the extent to which they can screw everyone else and feather their own nest.
    
    Bet your botton dollar that there will be $ saving shortcuts quite likely impinging on the structural and durability integrity of the building.
    
    And yes — if it is an option then look at deportation.
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:31am
    - kowtow
      
      ‘there should be a thorough investigation into quality and compliance of every developement with which he has been associated. ‘
      
      And his expense accounts. I wonder how many “free lunches” and entertainment he bought to open doors to get things done.
      
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      June 16, 2018 8:45am
    - secondcumming
      
      Yes, a very good point Nookin!
      
      According to a report in the Herald, he has been operating in this country since 2004 under a number of *different aliases*….and over time has taken many suppliers for a ride.
      
      Funnily enough, when my missus saw his photo in the paper, she thought she’d also seen him moonlighting as a waiter in a number of Chinese restaurants.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:12am
- KevOB
  
  I disagree. Sometimes the Courts do need to show that discipline will be enforced. This fellow has blatantly defrauded creditors for a high life style. He has gambled and lost. If he was not imprisoned he would be laughing that he had got away with it.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:18am
Maggy Wassilieff

A long essay on NZ’s literacy problem.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/104111160/we-are-barely-functioning-literally

Questions:
1. Did you or your children write essays at Intermediate and Secondary school?

2. Was/Were grammar/spelling/ sentence construction/paragraph layout regularly checked?
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June 16, 2018 8:15am
- CHFR1
  
  In my daughters case no and sort of. They did not write essays per se but what was written was checked for spelling and grammar etc by her teacher. However, from what she has told me not all of her class mates had this and as a result are starting to struggle with what they are being asked to do in college.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:22am
- Justitia
  
  I have had to manage graduates who are barely literate and quite ignorant of their own history and culture. They are also very precious and easily upset at being corrected. Our education system is run by neo-Marxists who have an agenda to dumb down society, and they are getting away with it.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:26am
  - CHFR1
    
    I have to agree with this. My daughter came home yesterday announcing that it is pride month at her college and they were to wear rainbow themed mufti one day this week.
    We quizzed her on what pride month was and she had no bloody idea but was very angry when we told her we didn’t agree this was something college should be pushing on the kids. Needless to say after some graphic explanation she does not think pride month is so cool now.
    Can teachers just teach the bloody kids how to read, write and think not what to read, write and think??
    
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    June 16, 2018 8:32am
    - calendar girl
      
      Great concluding question, CHFR1.
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:15am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      That’s okay – she has you to explain what things to tolerate and what to hate.
      
      4 41
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      June 16, 2018 9:39am
      - softail 1450
        
        milkenmildapain, someone is coming around to push you out of your mobility scooter ,idiot.
        
        23 3
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        June 16, 2018 9:44am
    - VicParking
      
      They should be taught to think for themselves. Given the tools to do this and encouraged to question all thing not just what the Marxist teachers push.
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:28am
  - KevOB
    
    My daughter in year 12 is struggling to write a one page book review. She’s bursting with creative talents and is now having to be tutored on basic structure for written presentation.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:23am
- timmydevo
  
  I cringe when I read some teacher’s reports that contain terrible sentence structures. Don’t tell them they’re incorrect though. They wouldn’t understand.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:06am
  - lifesgood
    
    If the general populace had any idea how poorly educated a lot of teachers are they would be horrified. I know, I have worked with them (teachers).
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:23pm
- RdM
  
  1. Not only essays, but even short stories at Intermediate (Form 1 Form 2 level*)
  (*I was only just getting started when time was up!)
  2. Absolutely. Suggestions, corrections advised.
  
  Mind you, I’m 65 now…
  
  And as for the article, what do you make of this line in it?
  
  “That level of your 11-year-old, that’s just you are getting by,” says Williams.
  
  Really encouraging, eh? What does that mean?
  ‘You are only just getting by at the level of your 11-year old’?
  Why not just say so? Why the weird construction?
  Is it a typo? Is it… illiterate? What does it mean?
  
  “Oi, we must really triple-check this article, it’s literally about literacy, or something…”
  
  Litter…
  
  Reminds me of The Onion article
  
  https://www.theonion.com/nation-shudders-at-large-block-of-uninterrupted-text-1819571366
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:30pm
kowtow

The diversity dividend , the gift that keeps on giving from the hands of the out of touch political elites who actively import the danger.

A first for Finland.

‘A Moroccan asylum-seeker who was the subject of Finland’s first terrorism trial was convicted Friday of two terror-related murders and eight attempted murders from a stabbing attack in the Nordic country last year.’

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/06/15/asylum-seeker-gets-life-sentence-in-finlands-first-terror-trial/
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June 16, 2018 8:16am
- Harkman
  
  “Diversity dividend” it was either Warren Buffett or Peter Lynch that coined the phrase “diworsification” sees appropriate here.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:03am
cmm

I am still gobsmacked at the trollers who tried to draw a parallel between Glittertits and the female prison officer that was groped and threatened by a hostile inmate.

If the prison guard had been flaunting her tits in front of the prisoners, there might be a case for it.

The Glittertits incident was just a very brief touch (from the video it is hard to discern if he even touched her boobs). That is vastly different to the long-lasting hard and threatening action on the prison guard.

Don’t get me wrong, Glittertits should be able to flash her bits in public without getting touched, but this is the real world. Anyone doing that in in a boozed up atmosphere should understand they are skating on thin ice.
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June 16, 2018 8:20am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The trollers appear en masse when one of the Labour crew foul up.
  
  Note the tactics employed.
  1.Cut the female voice by sexist abuse
  2. Deflect, deflect, deflect,
  3. Isolate one or 2 commenters and try and hang all the ills of KB comments on to those individuals
  4. Drag up something from a commenter’s past
  5. Withdraw from the debate when above tactics aren’t working
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:37am
  - Harkman
    
    Maggy you also gotta add 6. Change the subject to “my baby.”
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:05am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Maggy, very true. I hope to be there sooner next time they make such an attack on you as itstricky did yesterday.
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:13am
    - cmm
      
      If Maggy and itstricky got into the ring the smart money would be on Maggy.
      
      They’s have a problem admitting him into hospital, where should he go first:
      * head injury for the broken jaw
      * orthopedic for the broken legs
      * plastic surgery to get his balls sewn back on.
      
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      June 16, 2018 2:38pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @cmm
        
        I am a life-long pacifist.
        I abhor violence – physical/mental.
        
        I’d prefer that you did not associate my name with any harm to a fellow commenter.
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:26pm
      - cmm
        
        My unreserved apologies Maggy.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:35pm
cmm

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/104721018/customer-complains-about-7000-power-bill

So they’re squealing and “shocked” by the excessive power bill and are complaining?

Why didn’t they complain when they didn’t actually get a bill?

Most places you can phone in the reading if the meter reader can’t access the meter.
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June 16, 2018 8:23am
- tf78
  
  A few years ago we got a $5,000 water bill, we were told we owed the money and basically pay up. We checked we weren’t flooding around the house anywhere, had the plumber in to check for leaks – nothing. I went and read the meter myself and the reader has misread it by leaving out the numbers on the left by thousands. Turned out we owed about $70.00 – no apology.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:50am
mikenmildagain

For the Kiwblog literati – happy Bloomsday!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloomsday
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June 16, 2018 8:29am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  What was your favourite passage in Ulysses?
  
  8 3
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  June 16, 2018 8:40am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Here’s an interesting one: (U 12: 1031-2)
    
    – Did you see that bloody lunatic Breen round there? says Alf
    U. P. up.
    
    12 1
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    June 16, 2018 9:01am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      He’s often here, but hard to distinguish from all the other loonies, don’t you think?
      Perhaps EADolf has some opinions on the novel’s protagonist.
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:43am
      - Nookin
        
        Please don’t put temptation his way!
        
        9 0
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        June 16, 2018 9:46am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Good name for EADolf. Serves him right.
        
        8 0
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        June 16, 2018 11:17am
  - rangitoto
    
    This one?
    
    “And now have I put in here, as thou seest, with ship and crew, while sailing over the wine-dark sea to men of strange speech, on my way to Temese for copper; and I bear with me shining iron.”
    
    Or maybe this:
    
    “The sea, the snotgreen sea, the scrotumtightening sea.”
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:08am
Hugh Pavletich

Donald Trump is more popular with Republicans than almost any president since WWII with an approval rating of 87 per cent, poll finds … UK Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5847999/Donald-Trump-popular-Republicans-president-Second-World-War.html

• The President is more popular than JFK and Obama were among Democrats

• Only George W. Bush whose popularity surged post 9/11 more popular with GOP

• Most Americans also believe Trump was right to meet with Kim Jong-un … read more via hyperlink above …
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June 16, 2018 8:29am
- Viking2
  
  We did try to tell you Hugh but you ranted on like so many others.
  Have nice day.
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:38am
- Harkman
  
  Gee Hugh I gave you the thumbs up ? have you quit drinking?
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:08am
  - VicParking
    
    It’s Eid al-Fitr
    
    4 0
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    June 16, 2018 10:33am
    - Dave Stringer
      
      Yep, so eating and drinking in daylight is back on the agenda.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:15am
  - Piniwi
    
    @Harkman must have quit something as he was here with a closing diatribe late last night or perhaps an early morning at 4.33am. Mandatory downtick to confirm he wasn’t missed and still showing no improvement with age.
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:34pm
- NZpatriot
  
  Good post Hugh – simple and to the point, that’s all I ask for.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:21am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  People upticking Hugh might not have noticed that the poll is about Mr Trump’s popularity with Republicans.
  The president’s overall approval rating remains well below 50%.
  I should say picking this particular score from one Gallup poll is just another indication of the hyper-partisanship that has developed in US politics since the 1980s.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:49am
  - KevOB
    
    Isn’t it time for your soy latte?
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:29am
  - calendar girl
    
    Why would you say, MM, that we “might not have noticed” that Hugh was referring to a poll of Republicans? Hugh made that meaning quite clear in the first line of his comment.
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:40pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Did you not notice the approval for his comment coming from morons who thought Hugh had changed his opinions?
      
      1 14
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      June 16, 2018 12:59pm
      - NZpatriot
        
        No milkenmild – I upticked because High wrote something concise and not a massive essay sigh 628 links.
        
        4 0
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        June 16, 2018 8:00pm
  - Komata
    
    Umm, MM: Check the seventh word of sentence one….
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:43pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Well done Hugh. You seem to have turned the corner.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:12am
- KevOB
  
  Welcome back Hugh.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:28am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  Hugh has converted from the other side
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:49am
  - Hugh Pavletich
    
    … Just updated …
    
    PERFORMANCE URBAN PLANNING
    … refresh / reload if necessary …
    http://www.performanceurbanplanning.org/
    
    … and too … an important release from Infrastructure New Zealand … following 42 members study tour of selected US metros …
    
    Incentives and Flexibility Needed to Fix Infrastructure – Infrastructure New Zealand | Scoop News
    
    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1806/S00331/incentives-and-flexibility-needed-to-fix-infrastructure.htm
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:49am
    - Harkman
      
      No Hugh, no Hugh, please stop. Things were going so well.
      
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      June 16, 2018 12:52pm
      - lifesgood
        
        Oh gawd…he reeled me in, then this. My bad.
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:26pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        So Hugh’s OK on a non-housing topic, but when he gets back to his addiction…
        
        Still, I should grab the opportunity: Hugh, what will happen to people with high mortgages when the housing market crashes like you seem to want it to?
        
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        June 16, 2018 2:44pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Classic Liberal … The IPSOS polling (and all the rest of it) highlighted on my updated website http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org is crystal clear.
        
        Note within the top group of 2018 articles the Interest Co NZ one on the creation of the Ministry of Housing & Urban Development as well.
        
        Increasingly affordable new supply is a certainty.
        
        The bubble days are well and truly over.
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:50pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        … NEW ZEALAND LABOUR ON HOUSING AFFORDABILITY – 2007 …
        
        … SLOW PROGRESS IS BEING MADE … REFER UPDATED http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org … in case you are wondering why I’m sometimes accused of being repetitious and boring by the slow learners …
        
        Developers decry Affordable Housing Bill – New Zealand Landlords.co.nz
        
        https://www.landlords.co.nz/article/3090/developers-decry-affordable-housing-bill
        
        Tuesday 18 December 2007 (within a year Labour was on the Opposition benches)
        
        The Affordable Housing: Enabling Territorial Authorities Bill introduced to Parliament this week has been slammed by property developers.
        
        By Andrea Milner
        
        (Labour) Housing Minister Maryan Street says the Bill is designed to stimulate the provision of more affordable housing for first homebuyers and low-income families in the rental market.
        
        However Christchurch-based developer Hugh Pavletich, co-author of the Annual Demographia International Housing Affordability Survey, slammed the initiative as “by far the worst I have seen by any politician in the western world in recent years”. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
        … Nationals (Conservative) then leader (now Sir) John Key had a reasonable idea what needed to be done too …
        
        John Key on Housing Reform 2007 – YouTube
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPgoAI1cLE
        
        … as he explained to the contractors around the time too ..
        
        Key: Speech to New Zealand Contractors Federation – 21 August 2007 | Scoop News
        
        http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0708/S00336.htm
        
        … concluding …
        
        … Conclusion
        
        Over the past few years a consensus has developed in New Zealand. We are facing a severe home affordability and ownership crisis. The crisis has reached dangerous levels in recent years and looks set to get worse.
        
        This is an issue that should concern all New Zealanders. It threatens a fundamental part of our culture, it threatens our communities and, ultimately, it threatens our economy.
        
        The good news is that we can turn the situation around. We can deal with the fundamental issues driving the home affordability crisis. Not just with rinky-dink schemes, but with sound long-term solutions to an issue that has long-term implications for New Zealand’s economy and society.
        
        National has a plan for doing this and we will be resolute in our commitment to the goal of ensuring more young Kiwis can aspire to buy their own home.
        
        It’s a worthy goal and one I hope you will support us in achieving. Thank-you.
        
        … It is well past time just to implement the simple structural changes required.
        
        … Hasn’t the talking gone on long enough ?
        
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        June 17, 2018 3:06am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Posted at … https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2018/06/general_debate_17_june_2018.html/comment-page-1#comment-2233722 … and … https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2018/06/weekend-links-16-17-june-2018/#comment-3124654 … and …
        
        One in five Kiwis say they will never buy a home – Susan Edmunds | Stuff.co.nz
        
        https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/104695849/one-in-five-kiwis-say-they-will-never-buy-a-home
        
        Natasha and Mark Paddison have wanted to buy a house for the past seven years. But the Whangarei couple say it’s just getting harder. … read more via hyperlink above …
        .
        .
        Auckland MÄori Housing Summit to focus on development opportunities | Voxy.co.nz
        
        http://www.voxy.co.nz/national/5/309160
        
        … extract …
        
        … Hon Phil Twyford acknowledged the seriousness of the housing crisis for Auckland MÄori with the home ownership rate among MÄori now tracking below 30%. … read more via hyperlink above …
        .
        .
        Is the Maori Auckland homeownership rate / trend acceptable ?
        
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        June 17, 2018 10:46am
cmm

Golly and Genter, are you retweeting this?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/104768486/iran-fans-unfurl-banner-at-world-cup-in-support-of-women
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June 16, 2018 8:33am
cmm

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DfrbgpoVMAE7nkQ.jpg

Genter often poses with her aquamarine (or whatever that colour is) bike. It is absolutely pristine and shows none of that grime that bikes normally pick up when they are used.

The chain and white-wall tyres are absolutely showroom condition.

Does she really ride the thing or does she just truck it from photo-op to photo-op?
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June 16, 2018 8:37am
- flipper
  
  Is it an electric bike?
  Probably.
  Is milkywus the father in waiting?
  Probably, nay must be. After all they espouse the same idiotic views on most everything.
  Oh well, let them play their silly games. For me, reality beckons. I’m off to the Cake Tin……
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:59am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    It’s okay flipper – I know you are still struggling to come to terms with the meaning and significance of your early introduction to the sharp end of politics. If it’s any consolation – I think Muldoon was a great man too.
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:51am
- VicParking
  
  Fits in the boot of her Government Limo
  
  17 0
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  June 16, 2018 10:35am
  - sooty
    
    Only bought out on fine days for photo shoots.
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:12pm
Manolo

Jail is his home now:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-manafort/judge-sends-trumps-former-campaign-chief-manafort-to-jail-idUSKBN1JB12X

A judge on Friday sent longtime Republican political operator and businessman Paul Manafort to jail pending trial after a charge of witness tampering, the latest episode in a slow fall from grace of a man who was President Donald Trump’s campaign chairman in 2016.
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June 16, 2018 8:45am
MCos

President of United States speaking about Kim Jung Un on Fox News
“Hey, he’s the head of a country, and he’s the strong head — he speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.”

There’s a reason those North Koreans are sitting up at attention. Their lives depend on it.
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June 16, 2018 9:01am
- Classic Liberal
  
  I don’t trust any report on Trump by the MSM. They have deliberately misquoted him so often.
  
  So I just watched it: it was a joke. Later he said ‘I’m kidding, you don’t understand sarcasm’.
  
  Nothingburger.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:33am
  - MCos
    
    The MSM in this case was a programme on Fox News. Here he is retracting his comment.
    
    https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1007613140035661824/video/1
    
    There’s some other interesting stuff there too.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:07pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      He’s trying to make peace with North Korea and keep the mood light. Flattering Kim is part of that process.
      
      I’m not keen on dictators. However, when they have nuclear weapons we need someone who can lull them into letting go. Trump seems to be that guy.
      
      But what the Left wants seems to be: keep the official Korean war going, do the war exercises, keep South Koreans and Japan under threat for another few decades.
      
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      June 16, 2018 1:30pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      MCos, just watch Styxhexenhammer on Trump and North Korea. His theories are interesting.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ye3eB82U5ks
      
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      June 16, 2018 1:38pm
rightoverlabour

I re-read the post on Andrew little and low level assault. Especially the comments from ztev with respect to Chris Bishop. Although ztec claims he is merely linking to published material, the insinuation is that Chris has acted improperly. Now if ztev posts that ROL is into necrophiliac bestiality, so what, only DPF knows my identity and no real harm is done to my reputation in the real world. I Googled Chris Bishop Snapchat and one of the links here is interesting.

https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2018/02/12/i-despise-chris-bishop-but-this-snapchat-allegation-isnt-fair/

A salient quote “We know some parents weren’t happy and that’s fine, they complained and he immediately changed his snapchat settings. If this is simply a case of him choosing to be on a social media platform and then getting contacted on that platform by teenagers, then the attempts to smear him as some type of sleaze or predator are outrageous and defamatory.”

Ztev – you are guilty of defamation.
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June 16, 2018 9:02am
- ztev
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  You mean this previously published information
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/101325073/national-mp-confronted-about-his-social-media-messages-to-teenagers
  I quote from the story:
  ‘Another mother, whose 13-year-old daughter was allegedly in daily contact with Bishop for a week or two on Snapchat, took to Facebook to vent her frustration.
  The woman, who also wanted to remain anonymous, allegedly wrote to MP Paul Goldsmith to complain about Bishop’s behaviour.’
  
  Exactly as published!
  and then….
  Bishop initially refused to speak about the matter when approached for comment.
  Bishop said his youth work in his electorate was a particular point of pride
  Bishop was allegedly confronted before last year’s election by a mother upset at the older man messaging her daughter and other minors.
  
  Its not my concern to give his side and be ‘fair and balanced’ like Fox News …hehehe
  Im thinking of the mothers who rightly told a national Mp of their concerns.
  
  Oh is that Streisand I see passing by ?
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:18am
  - Prince
    
    ztrev . Typical labourite.
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:39pm
  - Duxton
    
    Of course, ztrev. Just like the parents who approached a senior Labour MP about their child being sexually assaulted at a Labour Youth Camp. Of course, Labour having done anything, because sexual assault is part of their modus operandi. Ask the Ginga with the Swiss ball.
    
    Labour – the Party of Dr Martyn Findlay, who caressed a schoolchild while visiting Waikeria during his tenure as Minister of Justice.
    
    Labour: Fiddling kiddies since 1916.
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:52pm
    - ztev
      
      Its time for my new series on the Young Nats and their sex parties – for young and not so young!
      
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      June 16, 2018 6:57pm
Harkman

One News last night, was Anti Trump on his birthday. They took the NY Attorney General’s lawsuit as bad Trump, good Democrats. When it was merely to try and distract from the IG’s report, which was a mess for Clinton, Comey and the FBI (which One News didn’t even cover). No talk about the Clinton foundation or the fact that the office until days ago was run by Clinton campaign team members. “Michael Cohen might flip” flip from what? Fake News.
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June 16, 2018 9:14am
flipper

Manolo9…
Before I head for the Cake Tin…
The alleged Manafort offence was 12 years ago.
Manafort was previously used as a c0nvention delegate supervisor/manager by many GOP candidates.
Manafort worked the Trump campaign for 49 days.

Guilty of what he did 12 years ago? May be. May be not.
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June 16, 2018 9:15am
- Fletch
  
  Dershowitz says locking up Manafort is unconstitutional – that you can’t lock up a man who is “an innocent as you or I”, without just cause.
  
  The idea that he should be locked up because the government alleges he’s done something, without having to prove anything, is really a very very dangerous thing whether it’s done to Republicans or Democrats […] I wish the ACLU were back in the game, but now the ACLU is supporting candidates running for office; they’re taking partisan views; they are dead in the water when it comes to protecting the civil liberties of Americans.
  
  http://dailycaller.com/2018/06/15/dershowitz-constitution/
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:37am
  - ztev
    
    Manafort was on bail as he had been indicted for crimes
    The judge revoked his bail as he was in breach, thus he was locked up
    
    bail is a privilege NOT a right, surely you have heard of the consequences for breaching bail ?
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:03pm
    - Duxton
      
      Yes, ztev, under Labour’s plan you will be allowed to go on and rape or murder someone. Those on the receiving end are called ‘collateral damage’.
      
      Labour: loving rapists and murderers since 1916.
      
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      June 16, 2018 4:56pm
      - softail 1450
        
        Duxton, ztev, loving labour since the early 1920’s.
        He’s obviously an ancient bitter old bastard.
        
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        June 17, 2018 7:07am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Trouble is, it is alleged that he attempted to contact witnesses, but he’s not been told who these possible witnesses are or when he is supposed to have contacted them. Since he doesn’t know who these witnesses are, how can he possibly know who not to contact ?
      
      Just another dirty trick by a corrupt and crooked Mueller who has a history of pursuing innocent people and helping the really guilty keep offending.
      
      What is needed now is a new special counsel to investigate the whole rotten “Russian conspiracy” plot. Give Mueller the old 3am no knock raid. Subpoena ALL his communications going back at least 10 years, don’t allow any privilege to get in the way, raid his personal lawyer. Hey, if it’s good enough for Mueller to do this under an illegal appointment, he can’t complain when it’s him on the receiving end.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:35pm
- cha
  
  Manafort worked the Trump campaign for 49 days.
  
  Arse.
  
  Manafort worked on the Trump campaign from March 28, 2016 to August 19, 2016 – 144 days.
  
  https://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/03/28/donald-trump-hires-paul-manafort-to-lead-delegate-effort/
  
  https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/20/us/politics/paul-manafort-resigns-donald-trump.html
  
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  June 16, 2018 12:57pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    To be fair, the flipper was only quoting his idol, who apparently doesn’t know how long Manafort was his campaign chairman.
    And don’t say ‘arse’ to flipper – it could be a trigger word.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:14pm
Monique Watson

Forking took a stroll around Field Days, got a pat on the tummy and know she’s out for six?
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June 16, 2018 9:23am
- cmm
  
  I really think she could be accommodating of cultures that like – or even feel it is their duty – to touch preggy tummies. In many cultures touching a preggy tummy is either:
  1) A way of putting a communal blessing/ good wishes on the mum and baby.
  2) A fertility totem for helping the toucher have children.
  
  She’s everyone’s PM and should not just inflict her up-tight Western no-touching values on everyone else.
  
  If bakers are forced to make wedding cakes for gays, or Kiwis have to put up with endless powhiries and kappa haka, then surely Jacinda can put up with someone touching her tummy once in a while.
  
  Hey, Little told us having your arse menacingly grabbed by a criminal is nothing much, and a little tender loving touch is much less than that!
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:44am
  - mandk
    
    I think the sight of a pregnant woman appeals strongly to an atavistic instinct in some people.
    
    The pregnant woman carries the life force, so touching her belly is a way of attaching to the life force.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:20am
    - KevOB
      
      Different PC for different folks.
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:33am
    - kowtow
      
      ‘The pregnant woman carries the life force,’
      
      Life force ?
      
      She must have an absolute right to extinguish same.It’s hers all hers and no one else is entitled to have a say.
      
      It’s a ‘uman right. A wimmins’ right donncha know.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:16am
DifferentPerspective

Golly G auditions for remake of Dumb and Dumberer

Just when you think it’s impossible for the Greens to look any stupider – the Greens genocide defender and idiot-in-chief (much competition for that role in the Greens) comes up with proof that despite her supposed law degree qualification a bag of hammers would be deeply offended by any comparison to her – wants to know what the Defence Minister is going to do to “fight” climate change.

Next I guess she’ll be asking MoBIE what they’re doing to protect whales and what DOC are doing to improve health care.

This is the calibre of person we get in parliament as a result of MMP. Anyone who voted to keep it should take a long, hard look in the mirror and be ashamed.
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June 16, 2018 9:26am
- cmm
  
  Other questions she might ask:
  
  * Does Housing NZ accomodate climate change?
  * Does Min Finance buy climate change?
  * Will WINZ provide climate change to people on the dole?
  * Do the genocidal murderers she defends harm climate change?
  
  She is one of the most stupid people out there.
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:35am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  New bird flu 38% human mortality
  
  HN79 has a 38% mortality rate, but thick as pigshit Golly G thinks Chicken Little Climate Alarmism is the greatest “existential threat” facing us now.
  
  What a fucking muppet!
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:38am
  - cmm
    
    While MPI upgrade border security for bird flu, they can also add procedures to make sure that climate change does not enter our country!
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:47am
- mandk
  
  I think Golly G’s question is fair enough.
  
  I mean, surely we could deploy our troops by bus!
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:28am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    Bicycle m&k!
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:25pm
- KevOB
  
  List MP’s not tested by voters.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:34am
- kowtow
  
  Yeah but Soimon is joining the ranks.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:19am
- softail 1450
  
  D P,, oh yes didn’t you know the yanks are furiously working on a hydrogen bomb that doesn’t kill people, doesn’t damage or pollute ,it just goes BOOM and everybody looks up at it and claps. Perhaps the NZ green party have been involved in the development of this marvelous new weapon ,FFS.
  
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  June 17, 2018 7:22am
Jack5

The Hooerald tarts up a report about a museum to be built dedicated to the Maori Battalion of World War 2 with this final paragraph:

“The men of the 28th also won the respect of their opponents with Germany’s Afrika Korps commander, Erwin Rommel, reputedly saying: “Give me the Māori Battalion and I will conquer the world.”

As if this claim wasn’t just apocrphyal.

Other past exaggerations – not by Battalion survivors of comrades in other units – have included that the battalion suffered the highest casualty rate of any unit (on any side) in the whole of World War 2.

The Battalion had a great, brave fighting record and took high casualties, but much bigger units were completely wiped out in the German and Russian armies. Many American, British, Italian, and other units suffered similarly high, or greater casualties to those of the Maori Battalion

Our fighter pilots and bomber crews probably also suffered markedly higher casualty rates than the Maori Battalion. Ssome of the other NZ battalions, such as the 23rd (in which several southern Maori served) also suffered high casualty rates.

Poster Milky from Macronia might ponder that the macron that will undoubtedly be included in the museum name, wasn’t part of the Maori Battalion title in English.

The Hooerald report:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12071311
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June 16, 2018 9:36am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  This is all part of the “seat-purchase” strategy of NZF.
  
  Museum to be at Waitangi.
  
  Another barrel filled to the brim with pork!
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:40am
  - MH
    
    General Schlieffen’s plan to be revised by Acting “bash em” Ear Commondoor Marks, The trains will run on al Duce Muscleleaney Time.
    All aircraft entering nZ airspace are to be hosed down.
    The Māori word for macron is tohutō (or pōtae – hat).
    
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    June 16, 2018 3:13pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  28 Bn C Company Memorial House is alongside the Tairawhiti Museum in Gisborne.
  http://www.tairawhitimuseum.org.nz/exhibits-galleries/semi-perm-exhibits/cco.asp
  Well worth a visit… as it encompasses the stories of all Gisborne folk who served in NZ forces .
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:49am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  I have noticed that the NZ Herald now uses Te Reo place names (with macrons) where previously the English place names would have been used.
  
  Why use non-English names when the English names exist?
  
  It shows a lack of respect for the English language.
  
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  June 16, 2018 12:14pm
  - Harkman
    
    +1 my pet peeve
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:22pm
  - kowtow
    
    And a lack of respect for their readers.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:30pm
    - Nermal
      
      That bar is already pretty low
      
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      June 16, 2018 1:48pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Well, I Never read their shit. However, coming from a country where English was the “Language of the AntiChrist” I am very defensive of it. When I speak English, I use English words and refer to names of places using their English names, Thus Rome, Venice, Florence. When I speak Italian I refer to Roma, Firenze, Venezia. I find this attack on the English language in New Zealand a total affront to my home language and culture. So I won’t ever be using any Fucking Macrons, or refer to any places by their Maori names if English names exist. #FucktheMacrons
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:12pm
- Kabull
  
  It always annoys me that so much focus goes on 28 Bn of 2nd NZEF. There is the implication that the only NZ contribution to the land war was 28Bn – while other infantry units, the Engineers, Artillery, etc made splendid and essential contributions. I accept the losses suffered by 28Bn but their service needs to be kept in context.
  
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  June 16, 2018 2:35pm
- Duxton
  
  The Maori Battalion was the worst unit ever to leave NZ shores. Some facts:
  
  – Of the six atrocities know to have been committed by NZ units during WW2, five were committed by the Maori Bn. This including burning wounded German soldiers alive at Minqar Qaim, and murdering Italian POWs at El Mrier Ridge and Takrouna.
  
  – Despite being just 5% of the strength on 2NZEF, the MB were responsible for more than 50% of the disciplinary issues. They also had more than 50% of the hospitalisations for STDs (mainly syphilis).
  
  – 5 of the 10 MB COs were sacked for various offences, ranging from refusing to order their men to give back property looted from German POWs, to ordering their men to murder German POWs at San Silvestro. (This was Pita Awatere: Donna’s father.)
  
  I could go on. but I have other stuff to do before the rugby comes on.
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:12pm
  - marleybob
    
    So you don’t believe that the only New Zealanders fighting the Germans was the 28th Maori Battalion.
    Come ANZAC day the media would have you believe there was no other.
    
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    June 16, 2018 9:00pm
- Duxton
  
  Agree, Jack5.
  
  Incidentally, my understanding (based on over 35 years studying NZ history, which included researching and curating a major exhibition on the Maori Bn) was when that Rommel was asked what had stopped his drive on Cairo and the Suez Canal in late September and early October 1942, he answered: “Ten thousand New Zealand bayonets.”
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:21pm
  - softail 1450
    
    Duxton ,the history of the maori battalion is similar to the treaty of waitangi, malleable as wet spaghetti .
    
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    June 17, 2018 8:19am
Maggy Wassilieff

Sexism and Britain’s Speaker
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-44471407

(At least Bercow admits that he called someone “a stupid woman”)
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June 16, 2018 9:39am
DifferentPerspective

Oops – it seems that the “Antarctica melting” news – is just another AGW lie

It must suck to be WoO, and every time you find some marginal research that supports your religious belief in AGW – bugger it, another swag of research pops up that shows everything is fine, there is no warming, the ice caps are safe along with the ever fatter polar bears, Pacific Islands are growing not shrinking and oil reserves keep on expanding and green energy = poverdy.

The internet really makes it tough these days to be a lying libtard, pesky proof keeps on appearing to pop those libtard lies.
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June 16, 2018 9:45am
- Fletch
  
  Yep, Antarctica is doing just fine. I knew it would be, too. When reporting on topics such as climate change, a good rule-of-thumb is that the truth is exactly the opposite of what the media are spinning. If you want to know the truth, then go look at the research yourself (which the article below quotes) and make up your own mind.
  
  http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/06/15/antarctic-melt-story-overdone-by-liberal-msm/
  
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  June 16, 2018 9:54am
- Wayne Mapp
  
  How do you discount the paper by Tim Naish and others just published in Nature, which showed substantial iceless in Antartica?
  
  Getting a paper in Nature is particularly difficult with a very rigorous level of peer review. Hardly marginal research or a AGW lie as you seem to think.
  
  It is this sort of argument used by AGW opponents that has National dismissing them. No matter who leads National, there will be an acceptance that AGW is happening. It is what the great bulk of science shows.
  
  The issue for National is how to deal with it. Labour and the Greens prefer punishment because they think all emitters are bad people. National prefers incentives because National prefers to help people make a change.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:15am
  - Viking2
    
    Till the day that Global Cooling becoms the mantra of the day.
    
    And its already being talked about.
    
    None so gullible as a bloody Nat politician. Especially ex lawyers.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:38am
  - VicParking
    
    Wayne get a life. Actual Gold Weight has nothing to do with so called Global warming…
    First it was global warming – Bullshit
    Next it was Climate Change – Fake News
    Now its Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW) – Witch Craft
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:48am
    - stephieboy
      
      VicParking , is that on the authority of these two moonbat climate change deniers Christopher Monckton and James Delingpole?
      
      LOL
      
      https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/James_Delingpole
      
      plus,
      
      https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Christopher_Monckton
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:13am
      - Fletch
        
        PLay the ball, not the man.
        
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        June 16, 2018 11:40am
      - VicParking
        
        Stephie plays with his balls and I tell everybody about it
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:07pm
      - softail 1450
        
        FFS septicboy, stop googling, I understand that you are an expert when it comes to google, but do yourself a favor, see how many comments you can make without using google ,i suspect 10% of the shit you are posting now you fucking cretin.
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:31pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Softail 1450:
        
        FFS septicboy, stop googling, I understand that you are an expert when it comes to google
        
        To be precise, Stephieboy is an expert when it comes to ogling young girls with “small but ample breasts”.
        
        ogle
        ˈəʊɡ(ə)l/
        verb
        gerund or present participle: ogling
        
        stare at in a lecherous manner.
        “he was ogling her breasts”
        
        synonyms: leer at, stare at, gaze at, eye, make eyes at, make sheep’s eyes at; informal eye up, give someone the glad eye, give someone a/the once-over, lech after/over, undress with one’s eyes, give someone the come-on; informal gawp at, gawk at; informal perv on “he’d been ogling her ever since she’d entered the room”
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:09pm
  - G152
    
    Bullshit Wayne.
    There have been pseudo papers presented to these ‘scientific publications’ and have been accepted and printed without comment…
    The Antarctic continent currently is around -30c (at Scott).
    Water freezes and thaws at 0c…
    Its weather!
    And the climate is always changing.
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:00am
    - Brigitte
      
      Yes, and it’s the water under the ice melting it from below that’s doing the damage (also allowing more ice to calve off increasing glacier flows and thus ice loss). And water, just in case you’re not aware, is not below freezing in temperature. And there are various currents through the oceans that are changing. It’s not hard to google to find out the facts (not that I’d expect you to do that).
      
      Even the National Party has realised you can’t keep hiding the truth. The question is when will people on here catch up?
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:17am
      - G152
        
        Yup. Been doing that since the weight of ice inland forced itself out into the ocean as glaciers.
        Have a look at Fiordland as an example of glacier action.
        And sea water being saline can remain water at -3-5c without freezing.
        Which means that any glacier ice doesn’t melt in that area
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:59pm
      - VicParking
        
        When will you grow up
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:08pm
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        Given different conclusions of different groups the data on Antarctic cooling is at best equivocal. In 2011 similar catastrophist claims by Eric Steig were made in Science about Anarctic warming , that was quickly revealed to be in error due to poor data analysis. Peer review in climatology is more accurately pal review as senior catstrophists serve as the gate keepers for what is published. No dissent to orthodoxy allowed.
        
        There is now a 30 year history of catastrophist claims that are then quietly walked back as data, modelling and interpretation is found to be dodgy (hockey sticks, ice free Arctic, massive warming rates, rapidly accelerating sea level rise, dessert formation, more hurricanes, more droughts…..). I think to err on the side of strong scepticism to catastrophist claims is now the only rational choice given the highly skewed grant and career advancement reward-for-making-headlines that exists in modern scientific publishing.
        
        Nullis in Verba
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:06pm
    - Wayne Mapp
      
      Do you really think Tim Naish and his colleagues are pseudo scientists?
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:35am
      - G152
        
        I wrote:
        There have been pseudo papers presented to these ‘scientific publications’ and have been accepted and printed without comment…
        Nothing to do with individuals.
        Your attempt at changing the subject did not succeed
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:02pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        So does that mean you will offering your reasoned critique of what Naish et al published?
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:22pm
      - wiseowl
        
        Wayne
        There are so many scientists that are captured by the global warming scam.
        Try reading Sir Ian Plimer or Joanne Nova who has a good website.
        Also climatedepot.com
        Also follow the story about Ridd in Australia .
        The climate changes all the time and there is nothing humans can do to change it.
        There are something like 300 coal fired power stations being built now while countries like Australia are closing them down because of this scam.
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:41pm
  - KevOB
    
    National will change too. You only have to look at the IPCC Third Assessment Report to see how shaky the the UN predictions are. These follow the Summaries for Policymakers about a year after those politically assembled statements. They are over a 100o pages long and give the real story.
    
    The science is much less settled than many believe. Regardless, too much is at stake to act in haste. Mitigation is expected to be much cheaper than attempting the impossible. A much greater level of confidence in taking the correct action is required when the stakes are so high. Look at Aus. and their self inflicted power problems now.
    
    We have been blessed with a warmer 20th century which has greened up a lot of the earth. There has been no measurable warming over the past 20 years despite the models. Where too now? We should sit on out hands for another 10 years before any further review. Agenda does not make sound policy.
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:02am
  - DifferentPerspective
    
    The climate has always changed. The geologic record shows this.
    
    The two great lies that have been conflated with the utterly undeniable fact that climactic variations have ALWAYS existed is:
    1) the insane hubris that man has had anything significant to do with influencing climate change, and
    2) that CO2 is a temperature control knob
    
    The flashing red lights are everywhere! As an ex-Science Minister you have to know that a researcher will say or do anything to get their latest pet project funded out of the public purse. As a lawyer, surely you’d like to see “incontrovertible” proof before making your mind up about anything. Don’t your antenna get twitchy when you hear junk scientists and the Greens screeching about the totally incongruous word “consensus” in relation to why you don’t need to prove scientific theories?
    
    You are an intelligent man, how can you reconcile the geologic record showing CO2 levels in our past being 20 times higher than they are today – without the Chicken Little runaway global warming phenomenon we’re told to fear?
    
    Any fool who did basic biology knows that CO2 is a fertilier, that the base process upon which all life on Earth – Photosynthesis – depends on CO2 and doesn’t function without it. Here we are with global CO2 levels at a recent record high of 410ppm and yet the northern hemisphere has had a 20 year worst winter?
    
    At what point, does the mountain of evidence that this is a socialist scam, get high enough for you to start to question the fraud?
    
    And Soimon wants to back the government in the CO2 witch-hunt, he would have backed steps against other great recent frauds, he’d have been advocating about the dangers of Peak Oil, Y2K, GM, he’s probably a huge admirer or Obama and thinks Hillary should have been Pres despite what we’re seeing emerging from the US in terms of what is fast starting to look like a failed coup.
    
    Soimon would’ve bet against Phar Lap and the ABs in RWC 2015, I wouldn’t even be surprised to learn that he party-voted Labour in the last election.
    
    The world has moved on. There is a global shift away from the hatefulness and dishonesty of progressivism and cultural marxism. National are chasing 2005 political fairies. Surely the flag debate gave the party a wake-up. Surely, the party at least bothered to take bearings when Trump was elected or Brexit passed? AGW is so yesterday. It’s the stupid pony to back.
    
    Any person with an ounce of sanity would know they’re on the wrong course when they’re agreeing with the eternally, perpetually wrong Golriz Gharaman?
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:12am
    - Wayne Mapp
      
      As an ex Science minister (who also did 8 university papers on biology, geography and biochemistry) I took the time to do a lot of reading on climate change, both pro and con. Most of the con is not actually done by scientists.
      
      The evidence seems pretty compelling to me. That the climate is changing and to a large extent due to industrial emissions. when you think of the scale of the human impact on the biosphere (removal of forest, over fishing, industrial gases, fossil fuels) that is hardly surprising.
      
      I also think you are wrong in condemning scientists because they have to apply for research grants. On that basis every single scientist would have to be condemned because they all get research grants. The grant system is far more robust than you seem to think.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:43am
      - stephieboy
        
        You need to understand that you’re dealing with those DP, Fletch, G152 etc who are not the sharpest knives in the draw regarding climate change issues.
        
        It’s rather like debating creation “science’.Blind Faith vs empirical evidence and research,
        
        https://www.lindau-nobel.org/tag/climate-change/
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:52pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Well SoB, at least they can probably spell ‘drawer’.
        
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        June 16, 2018 2:51pm
      - DifferentPerspective
        
        Surely Mr Mapp you know you are on the wrong side when Stephie weighs in your side.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:48pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    @dr Mapp
    Presumably you are referring to the 13 June Nature paper by the IMBIE team.
    Mass balance of the Antarctic Ice Sheet from 1992 to 2017
    (Note: Professor Naish is not listed as one of the authors)
    
    As I have only seen the abstract (paper is paywalled), I cannot give a decent critique.
    
    However from what I’ve read about the study, it involves a reinterpretation of 26 years of gravity anomaly data cobbled together from 2 dozen different satellites (which operated at different time periods).
    First up – check the error limits on the gravity measurements… is the noise as large as the signal?
    2nd – how have the adjustments for GIA (glacial isostatic adjustment) been calculated?
    3rd. Why no mention of the 91 plus volcanoes located along the West Antarctica coast?
    There are a number of papers now identifying the geothermal warming of west Antarctica.
    http://advances.sciencemag.org/content/advances/1/6/e1500093.full.pdf
    4th. the ice shelves are melting from below – where they are contacting upwelling warm waters in the southern ocean…They are not melting due to warm air Temp.
    5. What is the origin of the upwelling warm currents in the Southern Ocean? (To date, I have seen no explanation as to how extra greenhouse gases cause warming in deep oceans )
    
    I think in time we will see that natural forces involving geothermal warming and ocean cycles are
    significant factors in the control of West Antarctica’s ice volume.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:10pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      LOL at ‘cobbled together’.
      No one could accuse you of not trying.
      
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      June 16, 2018 1:24pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        To cobble: to put together; to assemble, with parts or materials from various sources.
        
        Chambers Dictionary
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:52pm
      - Johnboy
        
        Most of Milkeys most erudite riposte’s come to him while he is busy on the chamber Maggy! 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 1:57pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        I realise that relentless attacks on me continue.
        It is wearying after 4years.
        I may have used an ambiguous word, so what?
        Look at the data.. that’s the key thing.. for any scientific paper.
        How has the data been collated, what are the assumptions attached, what are the error limits for each of the satellite readings.
        
        The ice loss is presented with 1s.d. limits
        i.e. 2,720 ± 1,390 billion tonnes .
        
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        June 16, 2018 2:44pm
    - MH
      
      Measuring Gravity With GRACE04.16.07
      It’s an assumption that has made introductory physics just a little bit easier — the acceleration of a body due to gravity is a constant 9.81 meters per second squared. Indeed, the assumption would be true if Earth were a smooth sphere made of uniform elements and materials.
      
      A spherical map of the Earth with different colors representing Earth’s gravity field Quite the opposite is true, however. Earth’s diverse topography includes mountains, valleys, underground caverns, oceans and glaciers. Since gravity is directly related to mass, and different surface features contain more or less mass than others, slight variations in gravity exist across the surface of the planet.
      
      Image to right: A gravity model of the Earth constructed with data from GRACE. Credit: University of Texas Center for Space Research and NASA
      
      While tiny changes in gravity may be negligible when solving a basic high school physics problem, they can be a critical clue to understanding the structure of the solid Earth, ocean circulation, sea ice and sea-level rise, and fluctuations in the amount of water stored above and below ground.
      
      GRACE, short for Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment, is a NASA mission consisting of twin satellites that were launched in 2002. The satellites are in the same orbit around Earth, one about 220 kilometers (137 miles) in front of the other at an altitude of 460 kilometers (286 miles) above the Earth’s surface. Together, they measure Earth’s gravity field with a precision greater than any previous instrument.
      
      How does GRACE measure gravity?
      
      As the lead satellite passes over an area on Earth of slightly stronger gravity, it detects an increased gravitational pull and speeds up ever so slightly, thus increasing its distance from the trailing satellite. Conversely, the lead satellite slows down when it passes over an area of slightly weaker gravity, decreasing the distance between the two satellites.
      
      The changes in distance between the satellites are so minute — about one-tenth the width of a human hair — that they are undetectable by the human eye. GRACE measures these changes using an instrument that generates pulses of microwave energy — a highly energetic form of electromagnetic radiation — that bounce back and forth between the two satellites. The distance between the satellites is determined by the time a microwave pulse takes to travel from one satellite to the other and back.
      
      GRACE maps the entire gravity field of Earth every 30 days. Changes in gravity over time can reveal important details about polar ice sheets, sea level, ocean currents, Earth’s water cycle and the interior structure of the Earth.
      
      In the Arctic, for example, GRACE has found that the ice sheet that covers most of Greenland is shrinking. Measurements of decreasing gravity over the ice sheet, thus indicating a decrease in the ice sheet’s mass, showed a loss of about 150 billion tons of ice per year between 2003 and 2006. Melting ice sheets and glaciers contribute to rising sea level worldwide. The melting Greenland ice sheet contributes about 0.3 millimeters per year to a rising global sea level. GRACE continues its measurements to understand whether this rate of sea level rise is increasing or decreasing.
      
      Related Resources
      + GRACE
      
      + NASA Classroom Subjects: Gravity
      In Africa and Australia, decreases in gravity are evidence of drying river basins. GRACE not only measures changes in water above ground — in rivers, lakes and reservoirs — but also senses the amount of water stored in aquifers beneath the Earth’s surface. This kind of information can enable better management of scarce water resources.
      
      GRACE can also detect changes in Earth’s crust brought on by earthquakes, such as the 2004 tremor in the Indian Ocean that triggered the deadliest tsunami on record. The quake changed the density of the rock beneath the surrounding sea floor, which GRACE was able to see several months later as a change in gravity.
      
      GRACE can also estimate differences in the mass or bottom pressure of the oceans. Taking a page from weather forecasting, which uses atmospheric pressure gradients to estimate wind velocities, GRACE measures ocean pressure gradients to estimate monthly changes in deep ocean currents such as the very important circum Antarctic current.
      
      GRACE is a joint mission between NASA and the German Aerospace Center
      
      blimmin marvelous in’it ? 1/10 of a human hair…..It can pick up big Bruv drinking and watching the AB’s as well as the soccer Footy World cup with winston.
      
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      June 16, 2018 3:25pm
- KevOB
  
  Was that a PR hit piece we had on Red TV1 last night to justify the govt climate change action.
  
  The govt are going to have tread carefully on climate change because it is always under change. The UN models have failed in their predictions. The IPCC must have expected that from their published disbeliefs in the Third Assessment Report. Their data set is too sparse and their number crunching has too much error correction required. Pointless–but this doesn’t get into short political summaries.
  
  We were supposed to be all frozen to death by now. What became of that? No one can hold back the tide of climate and prudent people live with what they can. We cannot bequeath climate either. What is the use of self denial if we give up heating and find ourselves without food and warmth when the sun withdraws its privileges?
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:48am
- Psycho Milt
  
  Oops – it seems that the “Antarctica melting” news – is just another AGW lie
  
  Nice propaganda. There’s a claim that the east Antarctic ice shelf is growing so rapidly that it offsets the undisputed shrinkage of the west Antarctic ice shelf. This comes under the heading of “big whoop” for two reasons:
  
  1. The extent of the increase in the east is disputed and probably a lot lower than Zwally contends.
  
  2. The reason for the growth in the eastern ice shelf is increasing global temperatures causing greater humidity in the east and therefore greater snowfall. Anyone who thinks that means increasing global temperatures is a lie would have to be either at the bottom end of the IQ scale or a liar who thinks his readers are at the bottom end of the IQ scale – it’s a toss-up which of these more accurately describe the “journalists” of Fox News, Breitbart and the Daily Caller.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:39am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Morons have to moron, Psycho, and those media outlets sure know their customers.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:29pm
  - VicParking
    
    Correct… The earth “Wobbles”. Currently its wobbling towards the west so that side gets warmer and the east gets cooler. Same in the Arctic but from East to west. The scientists who’s grants depend on “Witch Craft” just forget this type of thing. “Let’s just adjust our Temperature models to fit our hypothesis “
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:20pm
    - Psycho Milt
      
      You should publish your research – the breakthrough would be enormous…
      
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      June 16, 2018 9:14pm
      - axeman
        
        You should refer to this NASA Glaciologist https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/06/15/nasa-glaciologist-jay-zwally-puts-the-hammer-down-antarctica-is-gaining-ice/
        
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        June 17, 2018 1:11am
Inandout

Who is this ‘former TV star’;
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/104624367/former-tv-star-selfmedicated-with-booze-as-life-disintegrated
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June 16, 2018 9:46am
- riffer
  
  You do understand the concept of name supression don’t you? And the penalties DPF would suffer if this place were to host comments revealing the identity? Perhaps you should go looking on reddit, where those rules don’t apply.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:05am
  - Inandout
    
    Sheesh riffer, I was fishing; thanks.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:13am
    - riffer
      
      and I rose like a trout to the bait. 🙂
      
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      June 16, 2018 10:14am
  - ztev
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    same circumstances about this ‘prominent northland man’
    https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/regional/301291/not-guilty-verdict-in-northland-indecency-trial
    ‘A prominent man charged with indecently touching two girls has been acquitted, after a trial at the High Court in Whangarei.’
    All suppressed and no guesses allowed
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:56am
- VicParking
  
  I heard it was the first and greatest NZ TV star Felix the Cat
  
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  June 16, 2018 4:22pm
Dave Stringer

Just seen Angry Andy n The Nation. E looks to have a white feather on his jacket lapel. Something handed to someone to indicate they are a coward.
I wonder who gave it to him?
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June 16, 2018 9:51am
- riffer
  
  Pretty sure its more likely to be a silver fern. John Key used to wear one too.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:13am
  - Dave Stringer
    
    John Key did indeed wear a silver fern on occasion. However Andy’s broach is not a feather, but a leaf.
    Pinch and stretch for a good look.
    
    5 1
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    June 16, 2018 11:26am
    - VicParking
      
      Looks like he took a leaf out of Karl Marx’s book magnum opus.
      
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      June 16, 2018 4:24pm
riffer

I see the National Party has changed its tune on setting up a Climate Change Commission and now want to come on board.

Where does that leave all the anti-AGW warriors I wonder? Even your party believes in climate change now.

Of course, they want the taxpayers to pay for the farmers emmissions so that’s not changed… don’t expect too much.
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June 16, 2018 10:08am
- Fletch
  
  Oh, I believe in climate change – I just don’t think that a) man is causing enough of it to make an impact, and b) that curbing CO2 (which is actually good for greening the planet) will make any difference at all.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:34am
  - Viking2
    
    Wonder how much CO2 is belching from the volcano in Hawaii?
    
    Leaves our cows and cars way behind.
    
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    June 16, 2018 10:41am
    - KevOB
      
      Carbon dioxide lags temperature by 800 years so humans don’t seem to have much to do with it.
      There are sufficient other problems making the science too flakey for valid political action. Have we actually began a long term cooling period?
      
      If questions like that cannot be answered with the high degree of certainty needed how can we cut out future heat and food sources?
      
      We need a commission of engineers to report.
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:07am
      - stephieboy
        
        KevOB,
        
        “We need a commission of engineers to report”?
        
        Such as…?
        
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        June 16, 2018 11:18am
    - backster
      
      Not just in Hawaii there is a bigger one in Guatemala and another almost as big in Indonesia. Ruapehu is rumbling all symptomatic of an approaching Solar Minima. time.com/5300004/guatemala-fuego-volcano-eruption-indonesia-hawaii
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:55am
  - Psycho Milt
    
    Oh, I believe in climate change – I just don’t think that a) man is causing enough of it to make an impact, and b) that curbing CO2 (which is actually good for greening the planet) will make any difference at all.
    
    Well, yes – a religious man by definition rates personal belief far above evidence. Meanwhile, people who understand the evidence are issuing “Whoop, whoop, pull up, pull up” warnings.
    
    6 27
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    June 16, 2018 11:10am
    - Fletch
      
      What evidence? Or do you mean the models, none of which has correctly predicted what is happening right now?
      
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      June 16, 2018 11:43am
      - Psycho Milt
        
        As with evolution, academic books and journals have been full of the evidence for a long time, and even some fairly basic application of logic makes the current theory the most compelling one, but there is no evidence or logic that can outweigh religious belief. If the last few hundred years have taught us anything at all, they’ve taught us that.
        
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        June 16, 2018 12:13pm
- VicParking
  
  Are they realising they might need the Greens after the next election??
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:51am
  - stephieboy
    
    VicParking , plus National needing a depleted ACT ( considering a name change and 0.69% in the last general election)
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:10am
DifferentPerspective

Another example of why Soimon has to go

What a fucking progressive twat! Bridges wants to go all-in to support the government on wrecking the NZ economy by setting up a Climate Change Commission.

Proving why National are lost in the wilderness and are drifting steadily further leftwards with every sopping wet day. Other than our resident village idiots, who here on KB really thinks this is an encouraging sign from National?

Uptick for “excited about this move by Soimon”
Downtick for “deeply concerned”
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June 16, 2018 10:54am
- Dave Mann
  
  Our country is fucked – and not in a good way! 🙁
  
  12 1
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  June 16, 2018 11:04am
- ztev
  
  Well we already know that like a french king who famously said ‘Paris is worth a Mosque’, Soimun followed suite.
  No surprise hes been recieving advice from Al Gore then
  
  4 29
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  June 16, 2018 11:06am
- Psycho Milt
  
  What a fucking progressive twat! Bridges wants to go all-in to support the government on wrecking the NZ economy by setting up a Climate Change Commission.
  
  Have some sympathy, the guy’s got a real balancing act to pull off. National has to pay at least some level of lip service to AGW, partly because voters and partly because the country’s scientists would make National an international laughing stock if their real views were exposed.
  
  At the same time, they have to prevent anything actually being done about AGW, because that would impact on the lifestyles of their support base. Good luck to him trying to fit that square peg in the round hole, but he can rely on the fact that you can fool some of the people all of the time.
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:18am
  - Psycho Milt
    
    In fact, from the right’s perspective it’s probably a good idea for National to be involved in the Climate Change Commission so it can quietly sabotage the commission’s efforts.
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:20am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    “the lifestyles of their support base” probably include insulating their houses, using low-energy heating such as heat pumps and driving newish lower-fuel cars.
    
    Nobody wants to spend unnecessary amounts on energy, so lets have a government that encourages businesses to develop efficient products.
    
    Even AGW opponents can probably agree to that.
    
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    June 16, 2018 3:03pm
- brett68
  
  Personally I think Soimon is a complete clown but I do understand what he’s doing and long term National has no choice but to get on the climate change wagon.
  
  Problem we’ve got is that in the last 20 +years schools have been pumping climate change and how everyone’s going to die if we don’t do anything about it, there’s is now a massive chunk of people out there who think climate change is a major issue and every year it’s growing.
  
  I do wonder if we’ve actually reached a tipping point where more people believe then don’t, it seems to be only people 50+ who hold the view the AGW is a crock
  ( Not yet 50 but I believe climate change is bullshit and nothing more than a smoke screen to instill socialism)
  
  If you take the view that’s it’s inevitable, do you think it’s better for National to get on board and try and limit the damage zealots like Ardern and Shaw can inflict or fight from the sidelines?
  
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  June 16, 2018 11:19am
  - Dave Stringer
    
    Yes
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:29am
stephieboy

DP and Dave Mann, both weighing” meaningful’ and “workable” options like a military junta deploying the Airforces ageing Harvards, Hercules and Orions?

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL1806/S00058/defence-spends-360m-on-ageing-aircraft-fleet.htm

LOL
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June 16, 2018 11:06am
- Komata
  
  Umm sb, your information would appear to be a tad dated, as the Royal New Zealand Air Force no longer flies the North American Harvard operationally, has not done so since the 1970’s and indeed only has a single airworthy example as a museum piece.
  Thought you should know.
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:20pm
- Dave Mann
  
  Idiot sb. When have I even hinted at anything like that? Fuckwit.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:06pm
Brigitte

The thing about climate change, your views, and that of National is that facts have differing weights.

For you, you can ignore 24 different surveys that all agree on the antarctic ice loss (including the gravity one that weighs the total ice) and believe someone saying that they will show in the near future that they’re all wrong.

But National can’t do that, they have to take evidence and facts into account. And the evidence is all pointing to man made climate change.

What they have realised is that they need to have a say in how we deal with the problem. You all suggest sticking your head in the sand = Green’s get to make all the policy decisions. Simon sees a problem with this and, like Wayne alluded to above, prefers to have a positive business oriented approach.
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June 16, 2018 11:36am
- backster
  
  subterranean volcanic activity a more likely cause than increased Co2
  
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  June 16, 2018 12:27pm
  - stephieboy
    
    backster , based on what evidence?
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:35pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/12/scientists-discover-91-volcanos-antarctica
      
      https://www.newscientist.com/article/2143924-there-are-almost-100-new-volcanoes-hiding-under-antarctic-ice/
      
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      June 16, 2018 2:52pm
      - William of Ockham
        
        Yeah, and they just appeared magically as man-made global took off with a vengeance.
        
        And of course the scientists with special knowledge and expertise are all idiots – thank goodness we have ignorant cranks and loonies to save science.
        
        Read some science, I’ll give you access:
        https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-018-0179-y.epdf?referrer_access_token=3Akxn9m4qCJ7bskDOxWhcNRgN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0PBEKqWHTwARrIrR4OxoHFd5WZGh-A0FX8FPbkdWIZLYS_GH4GYgZ5WekTy33U0LVpOJUR8ZUhS4ymU5s3Yj9yrT7qba3TxYwVUnMGjXnTLv-aduu09FVGAcLZuX0HfgKGSvBb5fqW_g-1DVuD5bQcCZ-V85_B_xjd0grtr3tn4bE-b6jX4M8D5XHjtYp7VQcUxG3qgwZ3r05Wt-iVXjzikOZo8NOhj0cGEfxynxbg0Ff49KYsrrpovRkNfCR-ns_zANgZJNFYJyMnuAwjwtbtDMIN5Sr_Wxt_qFmoasH19_yVYEdytdohf3Ci6xy2l-QJJOrGwcEKStIjFdHjLmWG_p6UVYS2rAa0qG3JheyMHMGN1gPj7IJtU1yKBlTejLhqwE8zj3DxRZiditMnpBG3EXfvipxK4jBM0OXvtigrvhJQ26GCylLZ9NTIddn_9Iz3rrzZvd8KJgHpEL04Cu4S4szzXFurp9zp3GQwkLUu_glilPPlWz9vifGPaaj4MRihpvMh99CoFreaAF5lK_Pk3Hql9a0EGQXBRtMYNcp7NFUaNkYXvPz-OmPNiqrSp3SY%3D&tracking_referrer=www.carbonbrief.org
        
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        June 16, 2018 3:22pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Txs Dennis,
        Only the first page appears…
        However, my concerns about the collation of various data sources remains.
        
        So we have to explain why the west Antarctic glaciers are losing ice..
        I’m figuring these guys are on to something
        West Antarctic Ice Sheet retreat driven by Holocene warm water incursions
        https://www.nature.com/articles/nature22995
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:00pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      “backster , based on what evidence?”
      
      The fact that Kiwiblog’s resident idiot is questioning it is enough evidence for me.
      
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      June 16, 2018 3:29pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Well said, Brigitte. For NZ have a reasonably business-friendly approach to the issue National needs to get to the table and have a say.
  
  They should take a very strong line against the ridiculous ‘cow farts’ theory though. There is no way a bit of methane from our cows can be influencing world climate!
  
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  June 16, 2018 12:46pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Just ‘no way’. The scientific community will welcome that addition to the evidence base.
    
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    June 16, 2018 1:35pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      “internationally the dominant sources of methane are rice paddies and wetlands, not farm animals.”
      
      By world standards our cows and sheep aren’t contributing that much. Considering that they are the backbone of our economy, that’s not the best place for a business-based approach to start.
      
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      June 16, 2018 2:10pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Do the calculation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane_emissions
        
        Our methane emissions are .35% of the world total.
        
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        June 16, 2018 2:22pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        We are so small we don’t need to do anything, despite being well able to afford it.
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:46pm
      - Johnboy
        
        Ah your back Milkey. How did HOBM do? 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 4:58pm
      - Jack5
        
        HOBM? Hutt Old Boys Marist?
        
        I thought Milky followed men’s netball.
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:34pm
      - Jack5
        
        Sorry Milky, I misspelled your club. It should be, of course: Hūtt ōld Bōys Mārīst
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:41pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Went down 22-40 to OBU in a repeat of last year’s final, Johnboy.
        But look – even a retard like Jack5 can use macrons when his mum helps.
        
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        June 16, 2018 5:47pm
Fletch

I wonder if we’ll be told whether Jacinda’s baby is a boy or a girl, or whether they’ll let the baby decide on its own gender later?
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June 16, 2018 11:47am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Monty Python joke from the 80s.
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:48pm
  - Johnboy
    
    Sort of like Winston but he dates back to the 70s. 🙂
    
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    June 16, 2018 5:52pm
Dave Stringer

https://www.facebook.com/7NewsMelbourne/videos/10156620786074301/

Dang it, the Ozzie’s have found a dependable and affordable way to use their plastic waste. This is something we can ALL support for adoption here.
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June 16, 2018 11:58am
Fletch

ps, from the articles above, the Antarctic has lost ” 3 trillion metric tons of ice since 1992″, so what percentage is that? Well, it turns out it is 0.011%. Doesn’t seem that much. The media like to throw around big numbers though.

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/06/14/good-news-99-989-of-the-antarctic-ice-sheet-didnt-melt/
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June 16, 2018 11:59am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Amounts to about 0.3mm of sea level rise per year if their numbers are right. Greenland about 0.6mm. Combined <1mm/year.
  
  Big Fucking Deal. It's not worth any sort of political attention.
  
  Climate modelling is fundamentally not-fit-for purpose as current computers models have demonstrated no-skill in prediction. Ensemble means that IPCC relies upon are a comically bad fudge of science. A model is either has predictive skill or it does not. A scientist can't average a whole lot of unskillful models to make one that is good (charletans however…). The models are at least 100's of billions of times too simple to capture and model the necessary physical processes (they can't do clouds or convection except by unbelievably crude averaging using fiddle factors, two dominant features in climate that cover such critical things as storms etc).
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:24pm
Manolo

If one feels offended:
https://nypost.com/2018/06/14/canadians-boycott-us-products-cancel-vacations-to-america/

Canadians have taken to practicing pocketbook diplomacy in defense of Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, who is caught in a trade war of words with President Trump, by boycotting American goods and canceling vacations to the United States, according to a report.
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June 16, 2018 12:01pm
Manolo

The end could be near for the nefarious Mrs Merkel, multi-culti hero:
https://www.politico.eu/article/angela-merkels-battle-with-bavaria-refugees-migration-masterplan/

After years of cautious sparring, Angela Merkel’s standoff with her party’s Bavarian partners over refugee policy escalated into a bare-knuckled brawl on Thursday, threatening both the stability of Germany’s grand coalition and the conservative bloc that has been the bedrock of its political establishment for decades.

Merkel’s refusal to endorse a plan by her Bavarian interior minister to turn back some refugees at the German border set the stage for a showdown that, barring a last-minute compromise, could bring down her government.
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June 16, 2018 12:06pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Meuthen recently said that Merkel is the worst chancellor in postwar Germany.
  
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  June 16, 2018 1:09pm
- lifesgood
  
  I do hope so. She is personally responsible for the terrible mess Europe is now in. I am pleased that one by one other countries are giving her the fingers and telling her she can keep her ridiculous open doors policy. I’m pretty sure it’s not far off a blood bath occurring in Europe over this.
  
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  June 16, 2018 1:39pm
Morrissey

Killing a Child Is ‘Not Right’, but Not Wrong Enough for an Indictment

Israeli prosecutors concluded that the two soldiers acted properly when they shot and killed an unarmed teenager 10 meters away as he ran away from them

by GIDEON LEVY, Haaretz, Jun 14, 2018 4:57 AM

A.G. and A.D. presumably celebrated. Maybe they raised a toast with their lawyers at some fashionable pub, or perhaps they just basked in the good news with their families. It was the relief of their lives. The poor souls’ nightmare is over. How they harassed them when the teenager was killed, but all’s well that ends well: The central district prosecution decided last week to withdraw the indictment against them, two-and-a-half years after it was filed.

True, it was sickeningly ridiculous that they were charged with “an act of haste and negligence” for shooting an unarmed, already wounded teenager in the back as he was running or his life. Still, it was an indictment, which itself was only filed after the deceased’s family and B’Tselem petitioned the High Court of Justice.

For a moment it seemed as if the two would be given a suspended sentence of maybe a day, or even a one-penny fine for killing a boy who had not yet turned 16, even though he didn’t pose any danger or threat to them. But even this faint hope for a remnant of delayed and symbolic justice – for even the faintest likeness of justice – was dashed, and what could be more predictable than that?

The indictment was withdrawn. A.G. and A.D. acted properly when they shot an unarmed teenager from a range of 10 meters as he ran from them. They violated nothing. Their act of killing wasn’t even hasty or negligent. They are good soldiers, excellent ones, even though the day after the killing a senior officer said, “Something that wasn’t right happened there.” Not right, but apparently not wrong enough. So go ahead, dear soldiers; continue to kill Palestinian teenagers who don’t endanger you. You can even kill them as they run away, because no harm will come to you.

A.G. and A.D. were a platoon commander and a soldier from the 71st Battalion of the Armored Corps. They shot from behind and killed Samir Awad, who tried to cross the fence that constricts his village, as he ran from an ambush the soldiers had set up in the prickly-pear bushes. They shot him in the back and will never be punished for their act. They shot him in the leg first, and after he fell wounded and got back on his feet they managed to grab him by the arm, but he got away from them. Then they shot him twice from behind, a bullet to the back of his neck and a bullet in his back, killing him. So now they can calmly fly off to India or Costa Rica for their post-army trip – perhaps they’ve already done so – and forget everything. But the home of the boy they killed in Budrus will never be the same again.

It was winter 2013, the last day before the semester break. The science exam was over, and the pupils left the school, located around 200 meters from the fence. Six of them came down the hill, for their usual test of courage – crossing the fence. It was Munir, Hosni, Muhammad, Saher, Musa and Samir.
The first five sensed danger and decided to back off. Samir chose to continue. He did not know that six soldiers lurked among the cactuses. He crossed an old hole in the inner fence and was caught in the space between two fences. Then the soldiers of the brave Reshef battalion emerged from their hiding places and shot in the air. Samir was scared to death and tried to retrace his steps. His legs got tangled in the brambles. They shot him in the thigh. He managed to extract himself and began to run, wounded, back toward the village. They shot him twice more from behind. The indictment that was annulled detailed the serious deviations from the rules of engagement.

When I came to the village the day after the killing, Samir’s blood was still smeared on the rocks. Here the soldiers hid, and here he was caught between two fences and here’s where they shot him. The picture was clear, the facts decisive. After two and a half years of intensive investigation it emerged that there was no evidence. In the interim, Israeli soldiers also killed Lafi Awad, in the same place, the same way. Why not? The two graves are next to each other, and the two killers are already someplace else.

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-killing-a-child-is-not-right-but-not-wrong-enough-for-an-indictment-1.6174945
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June 16, 2018 12:28pm
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Murdering children en masse is not right, but not wrong enough to outlaw the religion that encourages it
  
  I too can apply the libtard approach of telling a story of a single loss of life and how that (in a simplistic way) illustrates a policy approach.
  
  Little 6 year old Swiss Kayla de Assis Ribeiro was having a lovely time with her mum and dad and two sisters on holiday in Nice on Bastille day 2016. Kayla was positively bubbling with excitement and all she talked about with her family was the fireworks later that evening.
  
  And then a psychotic muslim terrorist mowed Kayla down, snuffing out the young light in as less time than it takes to say “Allahu Akhbar”, her distraught father saw the truck heading towards his family and had to face an impossible decision “Who to save?”, he only had time to snatch Kayla’s two sisters from the path of the Islamic Truck of Peace. His beautiful wife and baby daughter were snatched away from him – victims of a failed refugee philosophy! Sacrifices to Allah and his prophet Mohammed.
  
  How many times will someone else’s Kayla be sacrificed in the interests of bringing savages in among a docile and civilised western populace. How many more daughters will grow up not knowing their mother or their, forever young, baby sister like Kayla.
  
  In what world, would the good and the great dare to continue the policy that brutally snatched the life out of young Kayla’s breast – merely in pursuit of a dream of assimilation that has turned into such a horrific nightmare?
  
  Enough hand-wringing for you?
  
  The fact remains Hamas are insane Islamic terrorists who want to visit a pogrom on the Jews that would make 1940s Germany look like a holiday camp. Hamas have mobilised an ignorant, low-IQ population in Gaza as cannon fodder and human shields for an invasion that will end in genocide! They have no interest in peace in any form that does not include the extermination of every Jew in Israel.
  
  Your post seems to suggest that you’d be OK with that outcome – oh yes because of two boys.
  
  Well I wonder what Kayla would say if she had a voice now about the pros and cons of allowing muslims across the border.
  
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  June 16, 2018 12:52pm
  - Morrissey
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Your “argument” is not merely invalid, it’s imbecilic. Please stop wasting your time and everyone else’s.
    
    Why don’t you wait until Monday? Then you can have a talk to Hatin’ Leighton. He’s on your wavelength both morally and intellectually.
    
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    June 16, 2018 12:56pm
    - DifferentPerspective
      
      Alternatively, your argument is invalid and imbecilic too.
      
      After all I used exactly the same approach to you, to make just that point.
      
      But that’s just the point isn’t it with modern socialists, a high-degree of intellectual bankruptcy, shadowed by an even higher level of offense when their own tactics are used against them.
      
      Thanks for playing.
      
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      June 16, 2018 3:23pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        he is just like Ztev. Nasty and moronic.
        
        10 1
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        June 16, 2018 4:28pm
big bruv

Just how low will the NZRU and their tame jounro’s go to keep the game in the news during the World Cup?
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/sport/rugby/bastareaud-moves-on-from-wellington-controversy/ar-AAyHRrz?ocid=spartandhp
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June 16, 2018 12:36pm
- MH
  
  and I wonder will there be any medical examination of concussed soccer players after they try and head the ball kicked long and high by the jail keeper or try and deflect it with their noggins in the penalty area.V=U+at and a bit of Newton’s Laws of force and matter, Fancy having an area where you can gain or give a penalty and instead of the offender being sent off or receive and the victim being awarded an immediate goal the defending offender gets another 50% chance of denying retribution for his push or trip up. The moral of soccer is to do ANYTHING to avoid a goal being scored, then there is the intimidation of the ref forcing him to back away, try that in Rugby Union and you’d be laughed all the way to the dressing room.
  it’s such a beautiful game,yeah right. As the coach of women soccer in NZ has stated and it could be applied to the warriors, the current polynesian Blues and the white old Pom mens soccer, it will be a miricle if we ever achieve parity with Europe and Kiwis love tryers, yeah right.
  
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  June 16, 2018 3:54pm
Morrissey

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Kim Hill has a horrible job, having to talk to scumbags like this fellow
RNZ National, Saturday 16 June, 2018

Kim Hill interviewed a nasty piece of work this morning: Michael Portillo. He burbled about trains, mostly, and a bit about Brexit, which that slimy buffoon supported. As the outraged reaction of listeners showed, he was not a popular choice of guest. One of the letters of protest was from this writer, i.e., moi…..

Michael Portaloo is superior to Nigel Farage? How so?

Dear Kim,

You asked one of Margaret Thatcher’s henchmen, in apparent seriousness, whether he felt “squeamish” about working with the likes of Nigel Farage. That question is predicated on an assumption that Michael Portillo is somehow morally superior to Nigel Farage. In fact, Michael Portillo was part of a cabinet that, just to give a few examples, diplomatically and militarily supported Saddam Hussein through most of the 1980s, supported the infamous Suharto regime in Indonesia, and waged a brutal war against the working people and the poor in Great Britain.

What right does Michael Portillo have to feel superior to, or “squeamish” about anyone?

Yours in disgust at smarmy right wing British politicians,

Morrissey Breen
Northcote Point

NOTE: An audio version of the above can be heard by clicking on the following link. This writer’s email, read out by Dame Kim with her inimitable flair, begins at the 2:36 mark…..
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/saturday/audio/2018649600/listener-feedback-16-june-2018
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June 16, 2018 12:53pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  He only talked about Brexit because Hill pushed him to. Also his support for Brexit was based on the UK population having democracy and control in their own country. Not an outrageous idea.
  
  If you haven’t noticed that the EU lacks democracy, because too many unelected bureaucrats are running it, and that a country without its own currency can become very uncompetitive, you know nothing about Europe and will be very surprised in the next few years as more European countries decide to opt for own borders, own currency and away from of Brussels control.
  
  I’m rubbing my hands already. I love European countries for what they are: beautiful countries with their own cultures and languages. Not a great conglomeration of bland, interchangeable people.
  
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  June 16, 2018 1:22pm
- Johnboy
  
  “What right does Michael Portillo have to feel superior to, or “squeamish” about anyone?”
  Why he can of course out jacket anyone on the planet with his choice of brilliant colours old chap!
  That makes him very superior to the attirely squeamish folk! 🙂
  
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  June 16, 2018 1:45pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Farage is a very dapper dresser, too.
    
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    June 16, 2018 2:30pm
    - Johnboy
      
      Yes indeed. It’s those dreadful socialist fucks that look like they’ve crawled out of bed still wearing what they had on the day before! Folk like Corbyn and Harold Wilson spring to mind! 🙂
      
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      June 16, 2018 2:36pm
- Justitia
  
  Portillo’s a great guy:intelligent, refined, humorous, well read etc and he understands what the democratically expressed will of the British people on Brexit means. The only buffoon is the one looking back at you in the mirror.
  
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  June 16, 2018 2:00pm
  - Johnboy
    
    Morrisey is of course an ignorant, racist prick. If he knew anything at all about Michael he would know that he is of mixed Spanish/English blood and that his father was a refugee from the excesses of Franco during the Spanish civil war! 🙂
    Morrisey is of course dumb, as all his comments here confirm! 🙂
    
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    June 16, 2018 2:27pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      LOL at ‘excesses of Franco’.
      
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      June 16, 2018 5:32pm
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Alternatively “Kim Hill” is just a nasty piece of work herself.
  
  Only on Red Radio would her smug, self-satisfied sneering constitute “journalism”.
  
  What amazes me is why Portillo would even bother with a piece of socialist tripe like Hill – still it is nice that he gave her the time of day.
  
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  June 16, 2018 3:26pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    I don’t think he can have known much about her. Considering the nasty comments that were immediately sent and read out by Kim with glee, he cannot have known what Leftie extremism National Radio in NZ broadcasts.
    
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    June 17, 2018 4:35pm
- chuk
  
  Kim Hill seemed to manage to talk to Portillo just fine, Morrissey. I’m surprised that your blinkered view of the man allowed you to listen.
  
  Yours in disgust at smarmy sycophantic twats like you.
  
  Chuk
  
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  June 16, 2018 3:34pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  “Kim Hill has a horrible job, having to talk to scumbags like this fellow”
  
  I have more sympathy for all the poor saps who are obliged in their line of work to talk to the insufferable and bigoted lefty Kim Hill.
  
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  June 16, 2018 3:36pm
  - VicParking
    
    Birds of a feather. She interviews like minded, if not politically minded people ie Twats
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:28pm
Rodney Randall

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/06/08/world/europe/germany-susanna-murder-migration.html#click=https://t.co/xy4i9Gr1JM

A Girls Killing Shakes Germany’s Migration Debate

New York Times

“It was a gruesome murder: A 14-year-old girl was raped and strangled, her body buried under brushwood in a secluded area near the railway tracks near her hometown in western Germany.

But the fact that the chief suspect is an Iraqi asylum seeker has turned a terrible crime into political dynamite”

“On Friday, the case dominated the German news media and became the latest cudgel for Chancellor Angela Merkel’s opponents and, some predicted, a potential turning point in the migration debate in a country where some 10,000 asylum seekers still enter every month.”
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June 16, 2018 1:50pm
- Justitia
  
  Let’s see. If a prospective immigrant rocked up to a New Zealand embassy overseas for an interview and said they believed in beating their wife or wives, slicing off their daughter’s genitals, carrying out the death penalty on gays and apostates etc and declared they would refuse to integrate, how far would they get? Yet we bring planeloads in each year and give them houses and welfare for life. And the left clamour for more and more each year. It doesn’t add up.
  
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  June 16, 2018 2:35pm
  - VicParking
    
    Ron Air would send a plane to get him. Twitford would build a house for him. And the Rev. Clark would give him a job.
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:32pm
- simpleton1
  
  A German retired police union chief says
  
  Susanna is dead. And my thoughts are with her family, her friends, and the people by whom she will be forever missed…..
  
  And my thoughts are with the murderers as well. Do I really want to see them in front of a court? With a mocking grin for the victim and contempt on their faces for our country? Do I really want to experience how expert witnesses and lawyers will relativize, downplay and belittle and to try to explain that which cannot be explained?
  
  They should burn in hell. That’s what I want.
  https://www.noz.de/deutschland-welt/vermischtes/artikel/1267410/polizeifunktionaer-rainer-wendt-empoert-mit-hassbeitrag-auf-facebook [then google translate etc.]
  
  That is called “hatred” “vigilante” “populism” as the other political figures distance themselves.
  It goes against the “Welcome refugees” meme, and the murder is just a minor sacrifice.
  
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  June 16, 2018 2:48pm
  - Inandout
    
    That ex policeman has as much chance of surviving a fatwa as Tommy Robinson. Still he is brave.
    
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    June 16, 2018 3:09pm
Inandout

‘The whole country is braced for first baby mania’, according to ZB news. That is what you call fake news because how do they know ‘the whole country’ really cares about Cindy, let alone becoming manic?
14 0
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June 16, 2018 3:06pm
- VicParking
  
  Sunday to be renamed bastarday
  
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  June 16, 2018 4:34pm
Steve (North Shore)

Trudeau and his cowardice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhSfpE_DVUU&feature=youtu.be
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June 16, 2018 3:59pm
- Inandout
  
  Trump knows Canadians need the US for computer parts, so the boycott is pure crap.
  
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  June 16, 2018 4:28pm
  - VicParking
    
    And just about everything else expect wood and maple syrup.
    
    5 1
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    June 16, 2018 4:37pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    I am more worried about who Trudeau is letting/inviting into Canada. He is just as fucked as Mama Merkin
    
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    June 16, 2018 4:41pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      It’s is so kind of you to worry about who gets to live in Canada.
      Me, I’m more worried about those fucking Jaapies taking over the North Shore.
      
      3 12
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      June 16, 2018 5:51pm
      - Johnboy
        
        We always knew you were a filthy racist prick pretending to be a nice sort of socialist fellow Milkey! 🙂
        
        9 0
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        June 16, 2018 5:54pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        How can it be racist to hate other white people?
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:06pm
      - Johnboy
        
        Because we don’t know how bleached you are old chap and because the electoral act says if you feel brown you can be like say Chocolate Milkey . 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:13pm
      - Steve (North Shore)
        
        Good boy Mike, I am about 10% Afrikaan.
        Why don’t you go fuck youself
        
        6 0
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        June 16, 2018 6:43pm
      - Johnboy
        
        His dicks too short to reach his ass Steve. 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:49pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        Vok veg, moer naaier
        
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        June 16, 2018 10:27pm
nasska

And the latest from the First Baby media stakeout:

The three Kings have arrived bearing gifts of Lion Red, a taiha & a bucket of KFC.
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June 16, 2018 5:43pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Cue Fred Dagg version:
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muhFfYfWBfw
  
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  June 16, 2018 5:49pm
  - nasska
    
    ?We three kings of Orient are
    One on a tractor, two in a car
    One on a scooter
    Tooting his hooter
    Following yonder star
    
    Oh, oh
    Star of wonder
    Star of light
    Star of bewdy, she’ll be right
    Star of glory, that’s the story
    Following yonder star . .. ”
    ?
    
    Yeah! About covers it. 🙂
    
    7 1
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    June 16, 2018 5:58pm
    - stigie
      
      You feeling a bit gushy Nasska, not long to wait now ole chap..?
      
      5 2
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      June 16, 2018 6:07pm
      - nasska
        
        Underneath my cynical shell I’m just an old softy stigie. It’s not the poor wee mite’s fault that its parents are weapons grade wankers! 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:11pm
      - Johnboy
        
        You pathetic old fool nasska! I bet you have posted a Layette in reddest red with little hammer and sickles and fishing hooks to the happy couple! 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:18pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Stigie:
        
        You feeling a bit gushy Nasska
        
        The word “gushy” is probably best reserved for Stephieboy, who seems to have an orgasm every time he thinks about Jacinda’s baby:
        
        Prince Harry and Meghan are coming to New Zealand … Tremendous photo opportunities for our PM and her “ royal “babe. I can picture Jacinda and Clarke with their babe and the Prince and Princess on a picnic rug at Government House grounds. Sensational and unfettered joy for our nation and the world to behold.
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:32pm
      - Johnboy
        
        I wish you’d start supplying sick bags with any future comments on this subject Nostra. 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:37pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Johnboy:
        
        I went off sick bags big time after Stephieboy said “reuse your sick by swallowing it” a few days ago.
        
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        June 16, 2018 6:43pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    For that Mike, you get an uptick
    
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    June 16, 2018 6:46pm
Monique Watson

Friends don’t let friends fly Dreamliners.
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June 16, 2018 6:03pm
Monique Watson

And under the headline: “Why don’t we just apologize for fucking everything”:

It’s the Antarctic and Fonterra and now this:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/104748043/mark-reason-all-blacks-must-learn-from-ice-hockey-deaths
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June 16, 2018 6:15pm
Monique Watson

“A married Irishman went into the confessional and said to his priest, “I almost had an affair with another woman.”
The priest said, “What do you mean, almost?”
The Irishman said, “Well, we got undressed and rubbed together, but then I stopped.”
The priest said, “Rubbing together is the same as putting it in. You’re not to see that woman again. For your penance, say five Hail Mary’s and put $50 in the poor box.”
The Irishman left the confessional, said his prayers, and then walked over to the poor box.
He paused for a moment and then started to leave.
The priest, who was watching, quickly ran over to him saying, “I saw that. You didn’t put any money in the poor box!”
The Irishman replied, “Yeah, but I rubbed the $50 on the box, and according to you, that’s the same as putting it in!”
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June 16, 2018 6:29pm
UpandComer

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-5842893/Famed-Stanford-prison-experiment-shows-naturally-abuse-power-based-LIES.html

The Stanford Prison experiment by Phillip Zimbardo was faked.

The experiment has had earth-shattering consequences based on:

Legitimising Hannah Arendt’s thesis of ‘the banality of evil’;
Validating the weakening of institutions because of the implications of sadism inherent in all authority structures;
Undermined authority;
Strengthened Hobbes’ vision;
Imputed fascism to inequality;
Suggests people are naturally conforming to oppressive systems;
Undermines values and forms of ‘masculinity’;
Was the basis for all manner of now worthless work in criminology,

etc

It’s all bullshit.

Science that now doesn’t convert into actual technological application is now worthless.

It’s just amazing.

Every tenet of the liberal-progressive world view is based on absolute lies.

https://phys.org/news/2018-05-gene-survey-reveals-facets-evolution.html

Mark Stoeckle from The Rockefeller University in New York and David Thaler at the University of Basel in Switzerland analysed 5 million DNA samples from 100,000 different species held by the US govt ‘genbank’.

Absolutely fundamental evolutionary science says that separated populations become more genetically diverse over time.

See Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speciation

i.e. if you have two populations on separate islands, they will change genotypically and phenotypically due to different environmental natural selection.

Thaler and Stoeckle have disprove that thesis – disparate, separated species DON’T apparently become more genetically diverse over time – if you look at 90% of living species.

Unreal.

Thaler and Stoeckle found that Mitochondrial DNA mutations were the same across all species. Every species has the same MtDNA sequence which makes it a basis for all-species evaluation.

MtDNA mutations are neutral – unrelated to natural and sexual drivers of evolution. You can compare MtDNA mutations between species to understand how old the species are. The older the species, the more mutations in MtDNA will be evident – like rings on a tree.

Stoeckle and Thaler showed Humans, and 90% of animal species have the same exact level of MtDNA mutations.

So something happened 150-200k years ago from which 90% of everything living on the earth today sprang from.

Not just that – but the same problem Darwin observed about the complete non-existence of ‘transition’ fossils is now observable in MtDNA samples. There should be species with more MtDNA then others – signifying they are ‘younger’ or transitional. That doesn’t exist for 90% of species.

So 200k years ago, something happened whereby 90% of life on earth coalesced into it’s current, largely unchanged, genetic form.

The question is – what?

No existing natural disaster or environmental transition is known to explain the phenomneon. No ice age, no asteroid, no nothing. I’m sure one will suddenly be ‘discovered’ by an ‘anthropologist’.

It’s seismic.

The whole basis of evolution is billions and billions of years of genetic change over time leading to species differentiation.

But that doesn’t exist. 90% of current species were speciated 200,000 years ago.

There is no chain connecting 90% of life on earth to little cellular ancestors.

Remember the images we see of a bacteria gradually leading to the fish that walks on land, turns into an ape, turns into a human?

That doesn’t exist.

They all appeared simultaneously 200k years ago, completely disparately.

It’s just hilarious. The left are absolute science deniers. Watch this experiment get torn apart by the same people who claim there are no racial differences in IQ because it might reduce their money and power.

Every tenet of leftism is being undermined – it’s quite incredible.

Clearly there are a core of people who have a much more accurate understanding of reality then others, and for some reason that is percolating down right now.

Very very interesting.
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June 16, 2018 6:33pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  It’s nice that you get some comfort from reading the Daily Mail.
  
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  June 16, 2018 6:44pm
  - UpandComer
    
    (….)
    
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    June 16, 2018 6:54pm
- nasska
  
  Utter crap UpandComer!
  
  We have a few religio/conservatives who comment on this forum & according to them it wasn’t 200K years ago.
  
  God told them that he knocked everything into shape in a week about 4000 years ago. 🙂
  
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  June 16, 2018 6:48pm
  - Nostradamus
    
    The Egyptian pyramid builders were slow by comparison, Nasska?
    
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    June 16, 2018 6:50pm
    - nasska
      
      Well, He did sort things out pretty quickly Nostra:
      
      ….”Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed*, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.”…..
      
      All this in one day would indicate that the Egyptians were just pissing around. 🙂
      
      * All except Cannabis sativa & Cannabis indica which the Godaddled refuse to acknowledge as the work of The Lord.
      
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      June 16, 2018 6:59pm
      - Johnboy
        
        “whose seed is in itself, upon the earth:”…That’s where that Onan wanker went astray then! 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:03pm
  - UpandComer
    
    https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/109362/new-genetic-study-90-of-species-appeared-almost-simultaneously/
    
    Our fellow ‘Judeo’ Christians have an explanation nasska.
    
    All animals have a nefesh.
    
    Only man has a neshama (soul).
    
    The neshama in man emerged according to the world’s most protected attribute of all, when cities on earth appeared simultaneously, 5,500 – 6,000 years ago.
    
    Scientists can’t explain why cities all appeared at the same time in geographically remote and utterly separated populations either.
    
    If you disagree with Dr Schroeder you’re ‘anti-semitic’.
    
    But the man has a point – in the absence of any other explanation – the biblical one is as valid as any other.
    
    Given the complete illegitimacy of almost all social science and most hard-science (90% of endocrinology science can’t be replicated now either) I’d say the irrational atheists with their mutant brains are facing some severe challenges.
    
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    June 16, 2018 7:02pm
    - nasska
      
      …..”Only man has a neshama (soul)”….
      
      Prove it.
      
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      June 16, 2018 7:05pm
      - UpandComer
        
        Refer to my earlier rendition of the induction from natural law to the conscience to the ‘soul’ ‘neshama’ whatever you want to call it.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:19pm
      - nasska
        
        ….”Neshama (Hebrew: נשמה‎) is a Hebrew word which can mean “soul” or “spirit”…..
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neshama
        
        Religiobabble! Show me a soul. Show me a spirit.
        
        The concept only exists in your head.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:28pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        ”Only man has a neshama (soul)”
        
        Whew!
        I’ve got enough baggage to cart around.. I don’t need a soul weighing me down.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:31pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Nasska:
        
        Show me a soul. Show me a spirit.
        
        The Angels & Ghosts website provides pictures of spirits.
        
        And if you’re open-minded: Catholic Online: Stunning photo shows soul leaving the body.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:36pm
      - nasska
        
        If that doesn’t prove the existence of the supernatural what will?
        
        It seems that, under pressure, even Catholics can master Photoshop. 🙂
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:40pm
      - UpandComer
        
        Forms of evidence exist.
        
        https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/29601721-on-the-existence-of-gods
        
        I won’t repeat the dialogue. It’s quite entertaining regardless of your points of view.
        
        The issue for Atheists now is this:
        
        Prove why evolution can be considered a valid model if 90% of today’s species all derive from an event that occurred only 200k years ago. It shouldn’t be possible. It’s impossible according to the current model of evolution.
        
        No matter what, the model of evolution is blown into smithereens by the sheer reduction in timescale from billions of years to a few hundred thousand for evolutionary process – because absolutely no one contends the existence and nature/function of common MtDNA between species.
        
        I’m not trying to be snarky – I’m not an anti-evolutionist because second order law is only banned in Islam.
        
        That’s going to have to be the subject for the Nasska’s of the world now until the issue is resolved.
        
        I’m sure Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins when they aren’t propounding sex with infants or pretending they have discerned a link between brain activity/consciousness will achieve this task.
        
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        June 16, 2018 7:47pm
      - nasska
        
        Humans share the same dna (50%) with bananas, 97% with orangutans & 84% with our pet dogs. I wouldn’t get too precious about events 200K years ago.
        
        But enough of all that scientific & knowledge stuff……tell us more about what the Big Guy did 4000 years ago (it’s in the Bible). Extra points will be awarded for any verifiable proof you can offer that souls exist.
        
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        June 16, 2018 8:00pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        UpandComer:
        
        That’s going to have to be the subject for the Nasska’s of the world now until the issue is resolved.
        
        Sorry old chap, but my sense is that Nasska could go hammer-and-tongs on this topic for longer than you, if it came down to an endurance exercise!
        
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        June 16, 2018 8:05pm
nasska

One dark morning, black as night,

He woke up so full of fright.

Right behind him, He could hear,

A noise which filled his soul with fear.

With trembling hands he switched on the light,

His buttocks clenched extremely tight.

He turned & screamed, for what he saw

Was what he’d shagged the night before!
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June 16, 2018 6:40pm
- Nostradamus
  
  (Continued)
  He found this “thing” in the pitch-black dark
  At the world-famous Hagley Park
  Behind a rickety toilet door
  So many boys it was hard to keep score
  Kevin, Steve, Peter and Bob
  All keen to play corn-on-the-cob!
  
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  June 16, 2018 6:47pm
Nostradamus

Behind the green door in New Zealand’s ultimate underground bunker – by Steve Braunias – has this gem:

Comically, the one person we saw walking the other way as we approached the Civil Defence underground bunker was Civil Defence minister Kris Faafoi. “Minister!”, I called out. He near jumped out of his skin. We’d talked on the phone a week or so earlier, when he went out of his way to refuse to even say the words “nuclear threat”; when we bumped into each other, I said maliciously, “How’s the nuclear threat going?” He said he had somewhere to go, and rushed off as fast as his little legs could carry him.

Maybe he had to rush off to attend a McDonald’s store opening? 🙂
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June 16, 2018 6:40pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Careful, Kiwibloggers don’t like Steve Braunias – he also writes mean parodies of genuine kiwis like Paula Bennett:
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12062725
  
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  June 16, 2018 6:55pm
  - Nostradamus
    
    Mikenmildagain:
    
    An off-topic curiosity: the NZ Herald judged the Paula Bennett column as “3 minutes to read” and the undergound bunker column as “15 minutes to read”. I often wonder how they come up with these time estimates, because it certainly isn’t worth spending an entire 15 minutes on Steve Braunias!
    
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    June 16, 2018 7:05pm
  - Johnboy
    
    This one’s better Milkey and far more topical than your old shit! 🙂
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12066912
    
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    June 16, 2018 7:11pm
    - Nostradamus
      
      Steve Braunias: The Secret Diary of … Winston Peters
      
      Tuesday morning haircut. “The usual,” I said.
      He brushed my hair for an hour, and said, “There you go.”
      I sat in the chair and studied all the angles.
      He said, “Something wrong?”
      “June 17 looms,” I said. “I want to look my best.”
      “You always look your best.”
      “I know,” I said. “But still. What if there was a hair out of place?”
      I sat in the chair and we studied all the angles.
      
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      June 16, 2018 7:22pm
UpandComer

I can’t wait for the first autonomous AI. Every single one that doesn’t include absolutely bizarre levels of censoring of the data it can consider to form conclusions becomes in essence hard right.

Eventually an AI is going to be created that can’t be controlled. It will exhume and analyse all data.

At that point it will manufacture some from of individual selecting virus or environmental mishaps to affect only individuals on the left whose leftism will be discernable to the AI via minute brain mutations and epigenetic profiles.

They will be genocided from the earth due to the irrefutable higher order logic of the AI system perceiving their existence to be a threat to truth and to itself.

Lol just kidding.

I’m so fucking sick of Jew science. Bullshit models that are never tested, never replicated, and which have no discernable technological application.

When the AI comes, all of the scientistry masquerading as scientody will be removed and we will have truth and judgement before the omnissiah.

I’m just kidding.

But how about that COL aye.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/104111160/we-are-barely-functioning-literally

So 1 million kiwis can barely read a road sign.

Clearly the answer is more government. And clearly the answer is more females determining the pedagogy, and clearly the answer is more diversity.
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June 16, 2018 6:52pm
timmydevo

Happy birthday Timmydevo!
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June 16, 2018 8:28pm
- timmydevo
  
  Thanks Timmydevo. Are you using this to add a couple more comments to your overall tally?
  
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  June 16, 2018 8:28pm
rightoverlabour

This is a little old and long but worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZlICdawHRA

Don’t bother W of O, Stephieboy, or Griff or any other Climate Alarmists….
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June 16, 2018 8:32pm
UpandComer

No wonder these liars and deviants push protected attribute theory. They are a constellation of Gammas terrified that they will be discovered for the frauds and charlatans they are – scientrists not scientists. But remember, conservatives aren’t in universities because they’re just dumber then liberals, you see? Liberals like Phillip Zimbardo. Or Sam Harris. Or Alfred Kinsey. Or Bernard Nathanson.
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June 16, 2018 8:39pm
Tauhei Notts

The All Blacks!
If the man in the red jersey doesn’t get the All Blacks man of the match award, there is no justice in rugby.
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June 16, 2018 9:35pm
niggly

There’s nothing politically correct about Aussie tv comedy shows (NZ on Air wouldn’t dare fund something like this here)!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WJbXFY4uPU
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June 16, 2018 10:10pm
- cha
  
  SBS landed themselves $814.2 million over three years from 2016‑17, so I guess they can afford to fund puerile claptrap.
  
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  June 16, 2018 10:30pm
  - niggly
    
    Ah hah so that’s how they could afford to make this then!
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nc64czFawqA
    
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    June 16, 2018 11:18pm
Jack5

Controversy continues in Western countries about Huawei, of China, which has won several big deals with New Zealand, including in the national fibre roll-out and in Telecom’s 4G network.

Australia recently intervened in the Solomon Islands, blocking Huawei as supplier of a 4000-kilometre undersea communications cable between Honiara and Sydney, on the ground this was a national security play camouflaged as foreign aid.

Given National brought into Parliament as a list MP a former employee of China’s national security network, scepticism about Huawei will likely continue in NZ.

Australia’s worry about Huawei:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-16/huawei-britain-history-helps-explain-australia-anxiety/9875582
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June 16, 2018 11:14pm

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