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July 15, 2019 3:00pm by David Farrar

BBC Panorama on UK Labour’s anti-semitism

The video is only nine minutes long but has some compelling testimony from eight former Labour staffers.

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Comment55

International Politics
Uncategorized
anti-semitism
UK Labour

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Comments (55)

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Swifty

All over the world the left parade and trumpet themselves as paragons of virtue – when in fact they’re riven with hate, factionalism, envy, corruption and the naked lust for power.

Thirty years ago I’d regularly have a beer with these people, chew the fat and sometimes agree to disagree – but not now.

Now large numbers of them in the West have become just demented and deranged.
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July 15, 2019 3:19pm
- igm
  
  Well said, my sentiments entirely . . . we are seeing it here with this CoL in particular.
  
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  July 15, 2019 4:59pm
- Aunty
  
  You forgot one other D. And dangerous.
  
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  July 15, 2019 5:53pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Corbyn is an evil little gobshite, and unfortunately, his behaviour is well established in the Labour movement here. Our Labour Party even copied their latest constitution from the UK model. Carefully designed to give the Unions total control and make sure no populist moderate would ever lead Labour again.
  
  The Brits got Corbyn, who is an unreconstructed Marxist, who hates toffs and wants to control the means of production. Happens to hate Jews and has never met a Palestinian cause he didn’t celebrate.
  
  I sincerely hope the Brits will never, ever elect him, and under FPP, they probably never will.
  
  We sadly got the lipstick on a pig version. Angry Andy is very like Corbyn, but they bait and switched us with Cinders, exactly the same belief system and arrogance, but with a tilty head and Feelz ™ and under MMP, God help us, she got dragged over the line by that evil little man, Peters.
  
  In our Parliament, the overt anti-semites seem to have chosen to stack up in the Greens for some reason…
  
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  July 15, 2019 7:08pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Brilliant words deity, and heartily endorsed.
    
    14 0
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    July 15, 2019 8:07pm
  - The King
    
    “happens to hate jews”
    
    Well ok then, so what’s to like about jews?
    
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    July 16, 2019 1:09pm
    - Ehlana
      
      The same things there are to like about any humans.
      
      If you know nothing to like about jews, perhaps it is because you find nothing likable in the human you know best – yourself?
      
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      July 17, 2019 6:52am
- adamsmith1922
  
  Here is the full video until it gets taken down
  
  https://adamsmith.wordpress.com/2019/07/15/panorama-is-labour-anti-semitic-fulla/
  
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  July 16, 2019 7:15am
David Garrett

Does Corbyn seriously think he can publicly refer to “our friends in Hamas” and not be considered anti-semitic? Hamas’s openly declared desire is to destroy the Jewish state – not to negotiate a Palestinian state or peaceful co-existence with the Jews, but to destroy the state of Israel.

And let me be quite clear where I personally stand – the idea that the peaceful Jews took over an inhabited desert and made it flourish is simply hogwash. They dispossessed the people who were already there, or killed them if they refused to go. But the destruction of Israel is not the solution. It is no more acceptable than the illegal Israeli settlements on the West Bank.
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July 15, 2019 3:40pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  DG, did you mean an UNinhabited desert?
  
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  July 15, 2019 3:44pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Capt. Thank you, Yes indeed I did…Monday-itis, even for the self-employed.
    
    8 1
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    July 15, 2019 4:21pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Uninhibited…….
    
    2 0
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    July 15, 2019 5:07pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Yep, a lot of bad shit done in the founding of Israel. But you can’t fix the wrongs of 70 years ago in the present. You have to deal with the present. Israel isn’t going anywhere, and is a modern enlightened western country where people enjoy high standards of living and the full gamut of rights and privileges of the west.
  
  Compare and contrast to the surrounding states that started from basically the same economic level 70 years ago. Israeli culture lifts and improves itself, their neighbours mired in ancient theocratic/feudal strife and an inability to adapt their procreative traditions to modern healthcare/low mortality are mostly going backwards suffocating under insane population growth that will inevitably end in 10’s of millions dead through famine and war.
  
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  July 15, 2019 3:55pm
  - Bush Apologist
    
    70 years ago? Why are you only going back that far? You’re just pandering to agendas of other origins!
    
    3 6
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    July 15, 2019 4:22pm
    - Overworked
      
      This is a nice summary:
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY
      
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      July 15, 2019 8:29pm
      - MickMac
        
        Maybe this might help?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mR2W43t6tI
        
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        July 15, 2019 9:35pm
      - scrubone
        
        No, it’s not.
        It’s grossly oversimplified and ignores the difference between rule and residency. There were many times where the land was conquered but the Jews were still the people of the land.
        
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        July 17, 2019 12:14pm
  - PaulL
    
    The problem in that region is that for any perceived grievance, you can go back another hundred years and find the opposite. It’s like some sort of blood feud in the southern USA where everyone’s lost track of who started it, but are all certain that it’s the other family’s fault.
    
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    July 15, 2019 5:37pm
- mandk
  
  Not only destroy the state if Israel, but also to kill all Jews.
  
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  July 15, 2019 4:30pm
  - MickMac
    
    The Christians know what Islam is all about, sadly only the slavs remember…
    
    https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2019/07/why_eastern_europeans_fear_islam_the_siege_of_vienna_1683.html
    
    The EU behave like Dhimmis more and more and are anti semitic in their actions, not impartial at all. Truth is the EU and Nordic countries are enemies of Israel with what they have done the last 30+ years.
    
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    July 15, 2019 9:55pm
- MickMac
  
  what date David?
  2000- or + years ago or earlier?
  
  I am sure you have done your due diligence on the history but your post is indeterminate.
  
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  July 15, 2019 4:56pm
- igm
  
  Do you remember when Phil Goff hugged and kissed Yassar Arafat?
  Seems to be a Labour sentiment.
  At least Israel look after their own people . . . not forcing them to go and leech off Western nations where they are, in the main, unwanted.
  
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  July 15, 2019 5:01pm
  - Lance
    
    Ah yes, Yasser Arafat who not only promoted terrorism, but stole hundreds of millions of dollars from his own desperate people. Phil had much to admire.
    
    6 0
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    July 15, 2019 11:35pm
  - The King
    
    Im old enough to remember in 2014 when Israel sent their students to NZ and ripped off old people here for hundreds of thousands selling fake dead sea salt.
    
    0 5
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    July 16, 2019 3:45pm
    - scrubone
      
      A company acted unethically.
      
      If Fonterra acts unethically, does that mean that NZ did it? No.
      
      2 0
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      July 17, 2019 12:15pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  There is the little inconvenience of the Province of Judea, and the 2,000 years of Jewish habitation in their Holy Land.
  
  Other than that, spot on that man!
  
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  July 15, 2019 7:01pm
- Twinkletoes
  
  And who did the “dispossessed” people take the land from so many years ago? Swings and roundabouts.
  
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  July 16, 2019 11:40am
Brian McDonald

Tangled web.
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July 15, 2019 3:50pm
Shut the hell up you Fascist!

People come; people go. Armies come; armies retreat.

Jerusalem has always been Holy since nomads first found the east-facing spring there; Jerusalem will always be Holy.

People come; people go. Armies come; armies retreat.
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July 15, 2019 4:24pm
- David Garrett
  
  ..fascist: But its “holiness” is a major part of the Middle Eastern problem isn’t it…it’s holy to at least to major religions, each of which doesn’t want the other there….
  
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  July 15, 2019 5:36pm
  - PaulL
    
    Seems to me that they’re about 90% the same religion. There are a number of major religions that seem to all share the same holy book and most of the holy mythology, each with their own additions that have occurred over time. The Jews seem to still just have the old testament, the Christians add the new, the Muslims add the teachings of Mohammed, the Mormons add Joseph Smith, not sure what the Seventh Day Adventists add.
    
    As always, the most bitter fights are between those most closely related – hence the Sunnis vs Shia and the Catholics vs the Protestants seemed the most vigorous disputes, I don’t see a lot of conflict between the Buddhists and the Mormons (to pick an example).
    
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    July 15, 2019 5:40pm
    - scrubone
      
      I don’t see a lot of conflict between the Buddhists and the Mormons
      
      Because Mormons come from Utah, and most Buddhists are in Asia.
      
      Fights are between people who for whatever reason live in the same area. Have a look at the conflicts in India – there’s plenty of trouble there.
      
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      July 17, 2019 12:18pm
  - Twinkletoes
    
    Oh yes – only because the prophet began and ended his night journey on Buraq, the winged horse, in Jerusalem, Shame they didn’t stick to Mecca, which they recaptured, and Medina where they erased the five Jewish tribes of that then Jewish city.
    
    The world would be a better place had they not beaten the Eastern Roman Army in the 7th century to take the Levant and end up in the 12th and 13th centuries (?) contributing their ideology to the less wealthy areas of the Far East and most lands in between. As for the west – top marks for still trying, different approach tho’ this time, hopefully, an unsuccessful one.
    
    When will everyone wake up?
    
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    July 16, 2019 11:59am
  - The King
    
    Fascism is the immune system responding to semitic Bolshevism.
    
    Prove me wrong.
    
    0 1
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    July 16, 2019 1:10pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  My mum said visiting Jerusalem cured her of any residual religiosity.
  
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  July 15, 2019 9:06pm
Liberty

The BBC a maxcist cesspit. And yet it has the fortitude to broadcast
Such a program on the despicable Corbyn.
In contrast to the spineless TVone. Who to best of my knowledge.
Have not broadcast. Dear leader’s youtube “Comrade rant”
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July 15, 2019 4:25pm
cmm

I’m always a bit confused as to what the difference is between anti-semitism and being anti-Isreal and all the ideas and idealogies that go with this.

Communism and Jewish people, particularly Eastern European Jews, seem to go hand in hand. For example, the whole of the South African ANC and Communist Party were pretty much run by Eastern European Jews.

Yet the people that they need to associate with to do this seem to be rabidly anti-semitic. Commies and Hammas loving also hand in hand.

Can anyone square that circle?
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July 15, 2019 4:26pm
- Billy Collins
  
  When you say “anti-Isreal”, what exactly do you mean by that? What is it about Israel to be opposed to?
  
  Answer that, and it should clear some of the confusion.
  
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  July 15, 2019 5:37pm
  - PaulL
    
    There are many things that Israel do that people could be opposed to. Settlements for example, or some of their reprisals (admittedly under provocation) against the West Bank.
    
    I think it’s true that Israel is a better prospect that most of the other countries in the region in terms of their respect for human rights, but if we’re measuring them against the standards of a modern liberal democracy, they come short in some ways. We don’t usually measure, for example, the Iranians against that standard, as they’re clearly not close. But it’s OK to say that Israel is better than Iran but still say that there are things Israel could do better.
    
    4 2
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    July 15, 2019 5:43pm
    - Billy Collins
      
      Regarding your first paragraph, therein lies the issue. How is opposing settlements and some of the reactionary aggression or whatever anti-Israel?
      
      Australia does some things that are worth criticism and opposition. Does that mean you are anti-Australia? I assume not. You don’t want to destroy Australia. You want them to be better. Your intentions are good when you oppose them on something.
      
      The problem is: a lot of people don’t want Israel to be better. They want Israel to suffer. They are actually anti-Israel.
      
      That then raises the question: What is so unique about Israel? They don’t do much that is any different to numerous other nations in the world. What is it about Israel that makes them so unique to be hated?
      
      The only thing unique about them is that they are a majority Jewish country.
      
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      July 15, 2019 6:25pm
      - PaulL
        
        True enough. The trick I think is that when people say that something is anti-Israel, it usually doesn’t actually mean anti-Israel, it just means you disagreed with or criticised one particular thing that Israel did.
        
        It’s kind of like saying “that person over there is racist, how could someone be in favour of racism?” When in fact what that person did might not have been racist at all, it was just labelled as such by someone with an axe to grind. So someone like Don Brash becomes racist because he says “we shouldn’t have any race based laws”. Shades of Orwell.
        
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        July 15, 2019 10:04pm
      - Billy Collins
        
        “when people say that something is anti-Israel, it usually doesn’t actually mean anti-Israel”
        
        I’m not so sure about this.
        
        Just to put this in perspective. The creation of Pakistan was very similar to the creation of Israel. There was war, there was mass expulsion of people based on religion and ethnicity. Yet, the creation of Pakistan led to 10x as many deaths and refugees as the creation of Israel. Since the creation of Pakistan there have been numerous wars and conflicts with India started by Pakistan. Their laws are extremely oppressive to numerous groups. It deliberately hides and protects terror groups. Pakistan is recognised as one of, if not the most corrupt country in the world.
        
        Tell me, where is their constant condemnation from the UN? Where is their BDS movement? Where are the numerous nations not recognising their existence? Even India recognises their existence. Do a decent percentage of populations from numerous countries openly want the Pakistani people annihilated? Where is the worldwide protests? The only ones who seem to really care is India.
        
        We can extrapolate this point out to numerous other countries. Israel is already the most criticised nation in the world, so when someone is criticising Israel primarily and just ignoring every other country, you have to question their motivations: Why are they singling out Israel but ignoring, or actively supporting those who are far worse?
        
        You have to wonder about motivations? Of course in such situations, some people will label people anti-Israel or anti-semite too quickly.
        
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        July 16, 2019 8:21am
  - The King
    
    Perhaps setting 18 month babys on fire with petrol and blowing kids up with bombs on beaches?
    
    Or is this normal to you?
    
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    July 16, 2019 1:13pm
    - Billy Collins
      
      The beach tragedy was an accident.
      Come on.
      
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      July 16, 2019 9:59pm
Fentex

I’m still not entirely sure how much it is an issue within UK Labour compared to how much is Israel attacking it’s critics – but the party certainly does look heavy-handed, incompetent and somewhat suspect in their handling of complaints

At least some of which I think stems from Corbyn’s inabilities as a leader – he likes to assert how he disagrees with others but doesn’t seem very good at leading along the different path he wants followed and that’s crippled the party.

The job he took is not the place from which to pontificate about nuances – it’s where decisions are to be made, not eternally contemplated and Corbyn doesn’t seem to get that.
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July 15, 2019 5:21pm
- tf78
  
  It’s wonderful that we have as our HRC (Paul Hunt) one of Corbyn’s friends. Where is that going to lead NZ, I wonder fearfully.
  
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  July 15, 2019 6:02pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  It is an issue in UK Labour. They are losing members in droves.
  
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  July 15, 2019 7:40pm
Aunty

Why am I not surprised that the Labour Party is a fertile home for Jew haters, racists and other bigots. The buzz around like flies attracted to shit.
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July 15, 2019 5:52pm
- The King
  
  Nice buzz words who are you Golriz?
  
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  July 16, 2019 1:14pm
brett68

Is there anyway to disagree with Israel without being accused of antisemitism?

Seems to work something like this

Because Israel is full of Jews, saying anything negative about Israel is a direct attack of Jews and is therefore antisemitic, so you can never criticize Israel with being accused of antisemitism.

Personally I think that’s a pile of shit.
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July 15, 2019 6:08pm
- Muzza M
  
  Similarly, criticize Islam and you are presumed to be Islamophobic.
  
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  July 16, 2019 8:47am
Fisiani

Labour is trying to make itself unelectable. This documentary is just another nail in the coffin.
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July 15, 2019 7:44pm
Jack5

Time to look at the Corbynist who has been appointed New Zealand’s Human Rights Commissioner.

Professor Paul Hunt Hunt stood for the National Policy Forum of UK Labour as a pro-Corbyn socialist in mid-2018, just before becoming the Chief Human Rights Commissioner in New Zealand.

Watch this man and freedom of speech. The link below asserts that Hunt has said hate speech law is “back on the table” as a goal for the Commission.

It also contains the text of an interview in which Radio NZ’s Kim Hill tries to pin Hunt down on Corbyn’s race views:

https://shalom.kiwi/2019/04/why-wont-nzs-anti-racism-chief-condemn-corbyns-racism/
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July 15, 2019 7:51pm
Lee C

There are certain things that Israel do that I would be critical of. But not because I have any axe to grind about the state-religion of Israel. I do not think being born Jewish means that one will automatically endorse a single mind-set about any particular issue.
In the same way I do not think that being born Muslim means that one will automatically endorse a single mind-set about any particular issue. But there are certain things about Saudi Arabia that I am critical of.
Some may argue that the difference is that one exploits its religion to justify its atrocities, but think that is simplistic and reductionist. Terror resides wherever you might find it, regardless of the religion of the perpetrator. A suicide bomb is no more or less atrocious than a guided missile or a drone the only difference is its price.
Meanwhile certain naive individuals either blanket condemn or blanket endorse the team of their choosing. They are both equally gullible and culpable for extending the pain and terror IMO, as they are merely two different sides of the same coin.
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July 19, 2019 5:55pm
Lee C

meanwhile: https://www.facebook.com/NetflixANZ/videos/338468490181051/UzpfSTEwMDAwMzgzNDkwMDEzOToxNTY2MTEzMDI2ODU5ODQ2/
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July 19, 2019 6:12pm

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