General Debate 01 July 2020

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krazykiwi

I like this succinct description of what free speech is, and the rationale for it:

Obviously, an independent organization like the Times is free to use any standard it likes. But if a publication wants to provide a proper forum for non-partisan debate, it ought to use what might be described as a conclusion neutral standard, under which arguments are judged by the reasoning that they employ and not the conclusions they draw. Arguments should be presented to readers for their contemplation based, not on whether or not they reach acceptable conclusions, but on the strength of their reasoning.

In principle, this means that liberals and conservatives have an equal chance of representation, since neither enjoys a monopoly on empirical rigor or rationality.

The conclusion neutral standard is the journalistic expression of classical liberal values. Like analogous manifestations in philosophy and law, it does not intend to restrict what individuals may express but only how they may express themselves.
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July 1, 2020 8:00am
- MH
  
  until someone puts a nougat in the wood pile.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:26am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Or a crooked stick in the faggot. (OED: FAGGOT: a bundle of sticks bound together as fuel. With today’s education I couldn’t be sure that anybody under 50 knows what the proper meaning of the noun is).
    
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    July 1, 2020 4:23pm
krazykiwi

US Gov website falsely inflating Care Home Covid deaths

Official monitor exaggerated care homes’ cases and deaths by orders of magnitude on new monitoring website.

Early this month the US CDC launched their Covid19 “care home tracker” website, which claims to list all the care homes in the US which receive government aid, along with the numbers of Covid19 cases and deaths for each.

The trouble was, as an article for MedPage Today pointed out, at least some of the recorded numbers were “insanely inaccurate”. Here are some notable examples:

☣ The Saugus Rehab and Nursing Center in Saugus, Massachusetts was listed as having 794 confirmed cases of COVID-19 in residents and 281 cases in staff. The facility only has room for 80 patients, maximum. Of which 45 tested positive along with 19 staff.

☣ Southern Pointe Living Center in Colbert, Oklahoma is listed as having 339 residents die of COVID-19 despite only having a 95 bed capacity, and officially reporting not one single case of covid19, let alone a death.

☣ Dellridge Health and Rehabilitation Center in Paramus, New Jersey is listed as the worst affected carehome in the US, with 753 deaths. The reality, according to their marketing director, is they have a 90 patient capacity, and have had only 20 deaths.

There are ~15,000 care homes in the US. Someone is falsifying the statistics resulting in increased fear.
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July 1, 2020 8:02am
- Jimmy White
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  15,000 care homes and you found three with incorrect information. So the site is 99.98% correct.
  Do I sense a bit of TDS.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:10am
  - krazykiwi
    
    So the site is 99.98% correct?
    Presumably you arrived at that figure by simple math, and without reading the linked articles. You may have a career opportunity in climate and/or pandemic modeling!
    
    Now, “I” didn’t find anything. I simply read and linked an article. On digging deeper is looks like a bureaucratic bungle, but even when this was pointed out the authority appeared to ignore the issue.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:03am
    - GT Build
      
      I get sick of these twats that read the first line of anything and are an expert from then on. Had a debate on facebook last night with 3 twats they were that silly they were even referencing web pages that shot their argument down so told them to learn to read as they must be reading between the lines I could not see as they were not there and left it at that
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:16am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Try some full stops and paragraphs please. Fuck, in 1967 I got less than 30% in School Cert.
        How about you catch up?
        
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        July 1, 2020 4:41pm
- RJ
  
  Problem in the USA and Brazil are that places are being paid for each COVID case they have by the federal government. There is fraud going on with the numbers places are reporting to get money
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:21am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Italy was paying the Rest Homes €169 per night for each one
    Over 7000 died in 2-3 months
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:49am
Maggie Pie

My partner was saying that’s what he loves about the ‘America’s Cup’. It’s the only sport that’s got it all.
Sun, Rain, Wind, Smoke & Fire.
😀
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July 1, 2020 8:06am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Fire today. Not public money/public money?
  Are the leftie liars involved in this scam?
  
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  July 1, 2020 4:43pm
Two bob

So BLM protests and riots seemingly made covid dissapear and 2wks later a massive surge in cases appear and cant pinpoint how its happened…

am waiting for the media tds to jump all over trumps rally and blame him for any surges in that state.
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July 1, 2020 8:07am
- Inandout
  
  Two, Trump is already being blamed by NY Times, as is their TDS.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:15am
- MH
  
  statue revenge syndrome
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:30am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    The Taliban took down the Bamyan Budda statues in 2001. But in 2020 their acolytes have spread their efforts to the west.
    
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    July 1, 2020 3:59pm
- Sector 7g
  
  Doctors aren’t allowed to ask people if they attended BLM protests when contact tracing.
  
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  July 1, 2020 2:53pm
rouppe

I can see this “adaptation” turning into a hit job.

Even this story sidesteps the fact that Hemi’s family was murdered by other Maori
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July 1, 2020 8:08am
Inandout

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
A US winemaker I hear contributed money to the Trump campaign. I must boycott these wines.
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July 1, 2020 8:13am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  If I could afford to drink them I would.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:33am
  - igm
    
    When one sees this type of article it makes one resolute in one’s detestation of “Stuff”!
    What about Labour leeches too tired to get off their arses and thieving off hard working taxpayers or lazy useless bed hopping breeders of ferals given millions for producing yet more socialist bludgers?
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300044851/multimillionaire-mp-alastair-scott-claimed-more-than-170000-from-the-government-wage-subsidy-for-his-winery
    I hope this type of article will see and end to Ardern’s publication sooner than later.
    
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    July 1, 2020 8:58am
    - kowtow
      
      Compare the two stories on real estate prices today in stuff and interest.co.nz
      
      Stuff reads like an ad for their advertisers , the real estate industry ( surprise surprise) while the interest story is more detailed .
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:47am
      - igm
        
        Like Ardern, Stuff will be greasing to REI to keep their venture alive however, Ardern is using taxpayers’ money, whereas REI are using their own.
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:18am
    - Ian Boag
      
      When one sees this type of article
      
      You mean they shouldn’t have reported it …. ? Public information and all that.
      
      Labour leeches … thieving … breeders of ferals … etc etc
      
      What about them anyway? You think someone should do an article naming and shaming some of these folk too? Actually you could do it yourself on KB and you would be buried in a blizzard of upticks.
      
      You think that because leeches .. ferals .. thieves was not “reported” then Scotty’s $170k should not have been mentioned either …. ?
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:34am
      - alloytoo
        
        Each and every wage subsidy was applied for on behalf of and paid to employees based on eligibility criteria.
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:53am
      - Ian Boag
        
        @alloy
        
        So … nothing to see. Eligible, so take it ….
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:57am
      - Antoine
        
        Sure! The wage subsidy was to help businesses and their staff, his business was eligible, it took the subsidy, it was helpful. I literally do not see any problem here.
        
        A.
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:38am
      - Southtop2
        
        The eligibility is the interesting question here: There are stories around the country of orchards (Kiwifruit and Apples) and vineyards receiving Taxpayer money for staff. Both Orchards and Vineyards were essential, therefore did not stop work … If the rumors are correct, what did we pay for?
        The staff were still going to be employed, the crops needed to be picked and packed.
        If these businesses were paid by Taxpayers to conduct their ordinary business, maybe the eligibility criteria was wrong. Surely that couldn’t be what happened with this government could it?
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:22pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        @southtop2
        
        Eligibility was “turnover down by 30%”. Fill in the form, send it off and the money ($7k per full-time staffer) arrives in a few hours …. no followup AFAIK
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:51pm
      - Antoine
        
        @Ian, people who found they did not qualify after all, could pay it back. If they did not pay back they could be audited and required to repay.
        
        A.
        
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        July 1, 2020 1:09pm
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        Go ahead and write the article Mr B, I have enough popcorn.
        
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        July 1, 2020 3:07pm
- BeeJay
  
  I gave NZ$40 to Joe’s campaign! I didn’t do that well on the exchange rate! Should’ve bought a Mt Difficulty Pinot!
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:16am
- Nickc2
  
  Up ticked by mistake.
  
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  July 1, 2020 1:54pm
Martin Williams

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Wow, this infighting in National is showing no signs of abating just 2 months out from the election.

They are just as unstable and unelectable as they were before. Many careers are about to end…

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/06/national-party-s-internal-polling-revealed-as-caucus-springs-another-leak.html
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July 1, 2020 8:19am
- Benedict Yu
  
  “as before” Before what? Before the pandemic? Simon Bridges would have had an excellent shot at being PM in September. The polling showed that.
  
  I think it is a shame that National dumped Simon. If Labour does win in September, the firehose of money will be shut off and the mother of all economic and fiscal hangovers will descend on the country. Unfortunately many people are in thrall of a shallow ‘communicator’ leading a pack of incompetents. Twyford, Clarke, Davis, Jones. These people could never be Ministers in any country I have spent time in. In Taiwan ?? they would not be employed doing anything but the most menial tasks. A Taiwanese Shane Jones would be shunned by society and probably end up in prison. A Taiwanese Twyford would be a cleaner.
  
  The consequences of this government will descend on everyone. There is no getting away from that. And like all incompetent governments, it will be the poor who will suffer. People with ambition will literally flee.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:37am
  - Random T Person
    
    Ben, may I just say, I generally appreciate your comments but this one is an absolute pearler.
    
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    July 1, 2020 8:47am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Excellent analogies – one quibble though, I know and respect some very good cleaners. I don’t believe Twyford would come anywhere near being a good cleaner…
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:32am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Yes good point. I employ two women who clean my apartment. They are great.
      
      I was simply trying to make the point that Twyford cannot deliver any kind of result that has a complex production process. He had proved that. As an Opposition politician he just had to shout and point fingers. Well anyone can do that. But when he was given the prize he had no idea how to deliver. And that will continue in whatever role he is given. If we just look at his role as Transport Minister. Something has gone wrong with Transmission Gully. We don’t really know how wrong and neither does Twyford. He admitted that a couple of weeks back and said he had never visited the project sites or spoken to the men and women on the ground delivering.
      
      The problem for a Labour leader is that there is no talent on the back bench. That is quite different in the National Party, notwithstanding the current unfortunate disquiet and Paula Bennet leaving. If we look at the CVs of the new National candidates, many of these will be talented Cabinet Ministers in 3,6,9 years from now. If you look at the Labour candidates, they will just be replacement Twyfords.
      
      EDIT My unusual long comments today are not result of no work to do. Am sick in bed. ?
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:57am
      - Bobba Fret
        
        Suze said what I was going to say about Twyford being an insult to cleaners.
        Benedict…if you employed Twyford as your cleaner, you would come home to a kitchen bench and sink covered in dirty dishes, a bathroom mirror smeared with dirt, un-vacuumed floors covered in rubbish…..and ironically none of it would be your rubbish!
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:52am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        Hope you feel better soon Benedict.
        
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        July 1, 2020 3:08pm
  - lastmanstanding
    
    Correct. Cindy et al are continuing to crash the economy because the low number of Covid deaths are all they have to hang their hats on. They dont want a Melbourne lockdown thats for sure.
    
    Post the election the morons that have voted for them will wake up to the Mother of all depressions debt that will take decades to repay.
    The economy is now back where it was in 1990 30 years ago. Stop and think about that.
    
    Cindy and Grant have mortgaged the kids and grand kids futures reducing their standard of living and increasing poverty.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:46am
  - Prince
    
    Muller is certainly a step backwards in electability.
    Three more years I’m afraid. At least Labour will reap what they have sown.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:59am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      By comparison with Cindy Muller is a priceless gem.
      
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      July 1, 2020 2:49pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      There is no silver lining. Labour’s failures will see all NZers bought low.
      
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      July 1, 2020 4:01pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    yeah i just saw the list of infrastructure “investments” being pissed against the wall.
    
    How many of them will contribute a net increase over the cost of capital and debt?
    
    Its sickening. These clowns really do think they are the smartest kids in the room.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:13am
    - Nickc2
      
      It was good to see Shane Jones put in his place this morning. Ports of Auckland are not going to North Port any time soon. Think of another election bribe for your cuzzies you pompous (expletive).
      
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      July 1, 2020 2:06pm
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        Whale? Wanker? Corruptocrat? Where to start with the Jonesy.
        
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        July 1, 2020 3:09pm
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Ben bro – Poor will suffer? They are waiting for the Greens to rob you and pay them.
    
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    July 1, 2020 11:46am
- Weinerpoop
  
  Maybe, maybe not, the more Ardern ducks for cover and avoids fronting hard issues the stronger the narrative gets around her being a weak leader. On the flip side the more airtime her ministers get the more they are shown to be severely incompetent. The last couple of weeks have been particularly brutal for Labour and the full impact probably haven’t been felt in the polls just yet.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:11am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    “the full impact probably haven’t been felt in the polls just yet.” – yeah right. Wait for the next poll. Sheeple will put Cindy back at 60%. Never underestimate the power of Sheeple who worship Cindy as their God.
    
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    July 1, 2020 11:48am
    - gorse
      
      You keep repeating she will be back to 60% sidecock. What are you basing that on? The slide has started, she is fronting the daily briefings again.
      As a consequence. Their internal polling must also be bad as she is starting to panic.
      
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      July 1, 2020 2:12pm
      - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
        
        Bro – Mullet has shared Nat’s internal poll to his caucus. The Nat rat who is leaking to Tova has given those numbers to Newhub. The poll has Cindy at 55% and Mullet at 35%. This means Cindy is BACK!
        
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        July 1, 2020 4:22pm
Martin Williams

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
@antihobbes:

National’s ‘strong team’ includes aspiring MPs jumping ship, embittered factions leaking to the press, a finance guy perplexed with how marginal tax rates work, and a health guy chasing ghosts of homeless people down the corridors of parliament.

— antihobbes (@antihobbes) June 29, 2020
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July 1, 2020 8:26am
- Benedict Yu
  
  So you are posting social media comments from unknown people. I guess you can do that all day.
  
  But I will play. Who are the “aspiring MPs” jumping ship? I have seen no National candidates jump ship. That would be a problem. Because if you read the CVs of all the new National candidates and compare them to the CVs of aspiring Labour and Green lawmakers, it is a sobering exercise. National has been successful in attracting amazing candidates. So fuck knows what you are on about.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:49am
  - MCos
    
    All three of you cannot know who these aspiring MPs are if they change their mind before throwing their hat in the ring.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:03am
  - burt
    
    We can summarise what he said in four words.
    
    Labour good, National bad.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:09am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Labour good BYE, National badly NEEDED
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:16am
- Lance
  
  Oh look……
  Martin Williams thinks anything posted on twitter is true.
  Seriously though, who even looks at twitter anymore?
  Its become a bilious sewer for the wreckers and haters. The natural home for social commentators
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:34am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

There’s a spike in Corona cases in Texas and other states. That’s because more are getting tested.
If we gave more people IQ tests there would be an alarming rise in idiots in this country too
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July 1, 2020 8:28am
- Two bob
  
  sad thing is the iq test isnt needed its blatantly obvious and only shows clinical signs, nothing asymptomatic about idiocy. the recent climate and covid hysteria proved idiocy/stupidity spread far outpaces any virus and affects a higher % of the population.
  idiocy/stupidity most likely has a far higher death rate too!!
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:34am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Do you mean Martin Williams might get found out?
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:36am
- Inandout
  
  Steve, I would like to know how many US WuhuFlu people actually die solely because of it? The Dems, to their discredit, are happy to drive these figures skyward to harm Trump.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:49am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    In the US there are people giving their details for a test, waiting in line, and giving up. Those unused tests are being processed and counted as positive. The numbers are false, just like they are in NZ
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:19am
    - Flossie
      
      I really don’t know if you’re right, but could you provide some evidence? Anything?
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:55am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Is your google machine broken?
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:38am
      - Flossie
        
        It must be broken. I couldn’t come up with anything to substantiate your claim SO
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:39am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Maybe the cache is being scrubbed? The Dems don’t like the truth
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:18pm
    - Alex13
      
      People making unsubstantiated statements should not be IQ tested but marked “fail” right away.
      
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      July 1, 2020 4:46pm
  - kloyd0306
    
    Yes, the media are also doing a wonderful job of conflating cases as being the same as deaths.
    
    Even deaths are questionable because most who die, die “WITH” the virus, not “FROM” the virus.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:00am
    - kowtow
      
      The Media Party and then politicians drove Project Fear .
      
      They have destroyed what was a thriving economy , created chaos , distrust and division .
      
      What’s their game ?
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:59am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  No need for any IQ test to identify idiots. Those who vote Labour-Greens are idiots. Very simple really.
  
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  July 1, 2020 11:50am
- SGA
  
  There’s a spike in Corona cases in Texas and other states. That’s because more are getting tested.
  
  In the first week of June (ending 7th), Texas averaged about 1500 cases per day. In the last week of June (ending 30th), the average was about 6000 cases per day. Not even the Texas authorities are attributing that dramatic increase to simply more testing.
  
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  July 1, 2020 12:56pm
  - Batman
    
    The rate in increasing, and that’s the key thing.
    
    No amount of chicanery can avoid that simple reality.
    
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    July 1, 2020 1:03pm
    - SGA
      
      Florida is even more dramatic
      First week of June, average daily cases – 1111
      Last week of June, average daily cases – 6990
      Again, I find it hard to dismiss that as solely an increase in testing.
      If hospitalisations and deaths follow that trend, you can see why some US officials are expressing concern.
      
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      July 1, 2020 1:42pm
Maggie Pie

Caught the interview with Judith Collins on ‘7 Sharp’ last night.
Jeremy really held her feet to the fire. Judith, as is her want, gave back as good as she got. Always ready with a quick answer or funny quip. And it’s all delivered with a smile.
Why she’s not leading National is beyond me.

Honestly, i watched QT yesterday. Couldn’t help but notice Amy Adams demeanour sitting there next to Sid. She looked so ‘glum’. Amy needs to be more… animated. Nobody expects her perform an impromptu twerk or anything, but a smile, an eye-roll, a bit of random finger pointing All that wouldn’t go astray.
Something a little….. ‘Paulaesque’
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July 1, 2020 8:29am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Amy comes across like a flopped pavlova.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:37am
- cmm
  
  I’d rather have competence for the job at hand over hamming it up for the camera.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:41am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Ditto, but swing voters are attracted to bubbly types. Need to be animated and entertaining to land the votes.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:41am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Sheeple cannot be persuaded any more. They are voting Cindy no matter what.
      
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      July 1, 2020 11:51am
Two bob

So the media is slamming the anti pot legalization crowd for getting support from a US based anti pot organization yet no mention of the hundreds of millions of USD that will flow in to setup and back an nz industry if started.
theres already foward contracts and agreements in place with us firms for medicinal exports and setting up a legal rec market here, Internationals already own large shares of nz companies that have been setup to grow an industry in nz.
what side do you think will get the most foriegn backing and interference with our referendum? doubt our leftist media will be fair and unbiased on this one…
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July 1, 2020 8:29am
- KevO'Brien
  
  A great tax bonanza underway.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:43am
  - kowtow
    
    More road carnage too.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:13am
    - MH
      
      split the indifference
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:41am
- krazykiwi
  
  Usual media lies. The Say Nope To Dope campaign receives zero government funding, and zero funding from overseas organisations. It is 100% funded by donations from NZers.
  
  By contrast, the NZ Government funded Drug Foundation managed to spend $300k of your money on advertising in one weekend recently, and Andrew Little shared the stage with US-based pro-legalisation activists who were paid to travel here by the Drug Foundation. NZ taxpayer money being is spent on US-based pro-legalisation activists.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:46am
  - burt
    
    Imagine if we lived in a world where we didn’t need to have a nanny telling us what we are and are not allowed to do with our own bodies.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:11am
    - Two bob
      
      yup imagine the whinging and outrage if the taxpayer didnt fund the poor life choices of those that want to be responsible for their own lives and actions.
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:44am
      - MH
        
        you have just lost 5 places in any racially based medical operation. Retract or die.
        
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        July 1, 2020 10:44am
      - burt
        
        That’s what we have now. The gangs make all the money tax free and the tax payers pick up the pieces of an unregulated and uncontrolled market.
        
        It makes me think we should examine the gang affiliations of the “say no” crowd because status quo is only serving the gangs so why are people wanting to keep it as it is?
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:04am
      - Two bob
        
        Burt ive been a heavy pot user for 15 years and only thanks to lockdown and issues sourcing it was I able to boot it (the withdrawls were cruel and severe btw, was a living hell)
        my no to legalization is purely based on my experiences and watching many friends and aquaintances decline on life and mental wellbeing.
        
        the pot and concentrates available now are extremely powerfull compared to even 10yrs ago and causes extreme paranoia and anxiety.
        the legal proposal only allows for 15%max while black market is 20-30% thc do you really think theyll will go buy mediocre legal weed? nope and same as overseas the black market will take an initial hit then boom better then ever.
        all a legal market does is force black market to up their game and get better more potent products, 80-90% extracts are easily made by anyone in minutes with basic tools the effects of which are mind blowingly devasting esp to young ppl.
        
        ill vote No because I want the best for my kids future and pot shops as common as bottle stores are not good for anyone. we have a mental health crisis now and this will be made far worse if weed is liberalized more then it is already.
        
        id vote for decriminalization for personal use but full on legalization is too far imo. slow down and take smaller steps.
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:35am
      - burt
        
        Two Bob
        
        the legal proposal only allows for 15%max while black market is 20-30%
        
        So it’s a system designed to fail.
        
        Good on you for quitting. Well done.
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:40pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Because Angry Andy backs legalising dope, that in itself is a good reason to oppose it.
    
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    July 1, 2020 2:23pm
    - Two bob
      
      spite is a poor way to vote. how do you think winston became king/queen maker? spiteful nat voters topped up his base.
      
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      July 1, 2020 6:59pm
- Ruahine
  
  There is already a lot of propaganda as to why we should become drug addicts appearing on media sites including TVNZ and even Youtube. Most paid for by the pro drug Drug Foundation which lives on taxpayer money.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:49am
  - burt
    
    It may shock you to know that there are people who don’t consume alcohol even when there are bottle stores in every small town. How do these people not become alcoholics? It’s almost like they have a choice and the legal status of alcohol isn’t the controlling factor in their choices.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:13am
    - MT_Tinman
      
      It may shock you
      
      It does!
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:22am
    - Paulus
      
      Possibly it is the fear that these druggies and drinkers do and can have on the majority when under the influences – combined along with P is beyond disaster as we see currently.
      
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      July 1, 2020 9:29am
      - burt
        
        Can you elaborate on how disastrous it will be if we stop the gangs being mega wealthy on tax free money?
        
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        July 1, 2020 9:39am
    - alloytoo
      
      These people are recovering alcoholics, that would explain there abstention, especially in these times.
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:59am
  - tf78
    
    Ruahine – you can thank Helen Clark for that pro drug propaganda.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:19am
    - Nickc2
      
      Not being a druggie, how many joints does it take to turn Helen Clark into a princess? Asking for a friend.
      
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      July 1, 2020 2:26pm
  - YesMinister
    
    If you drink alcohol, you’re already a “druggie” who consumes a much more virulent drug than weed could ever be. Most family violence is linked to alcohol consumption. So we should ban that, then, and call anyone who wants a drink a layabout lowlife.
    
    Also, conflating marijuana with P is akin to saying “Oh we’re having scones with jam and heroin.”
    
    Sometimes, this blog shows its age in hilarious and ridiculously out of touch and overly judgemental ways. This is one of those times. Also, as someone who grew up with an alcoholic parent who is now dying from their perfectly legal drug addiction, I cannot begin to describe the scornful loathing I have toward anybody who believes they’re entitled to their particular culturally sanctioned poison of body and soul, but everybody else must be forbidden from accessing plants.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:56am
    - lifesgood
      
      They are both drugs. What is wrong with you? Decrying one drug and praising another just because you are young and think pot is cool?
      Btw deadly nightshade is a plant too.
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:39am
      - TWEEDSE
        
        LG, your point being that all drugs should be illegal since you dont add weight to damage done.
        
        So on that basis we should ban the consumption of sugar, fat, salt, prescription drugs etc etc. They all do harm in varying amounts.
        
        Alcohol kills people. Marijuana does not (the toxicity is not high enough).
        
        So could all the peopled obssesed with marijuana please put their efforts into banning a widely available lethal drug. Alcohol.
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:20pm
      - Random Punter
        
        Alcohol is a food.
        
        4 1
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        July 1, 2020 1:03pm
    - Justitia
      
      Alcohol in moderation does not bring on schizophrenia. Marijuana does.
      
      14 2
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      July 1, 2020 11:49am
      - Batman
        
        In moderation or heavy use?
        
        2 5
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        July 1, 2020 12:15pm
    - Two bob
      
      where do mushrooms fit with that thought process? Tobacco? salvia?(Salvia was legal not anymore) ayahuasca?
      lsd opium heroin dmt and cocaine are all plant dirived are they ok.
      
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      July 1, 2020 12:55pm
- kowtow
  
  TVNZ and A Tale of Two Israels.
  
  They show the cage fighter smoking dope and saying “respeck” in a clear effort to endorse a yes in the referendum , but when the other Israel posted a biblical tweet it was “crucify him” .
  
  Funny how TVNZ one night endorse aNigerian born man who engages in an imported sport while the following night slamming so called American imported efforts to influence the referendum.
  
  The whole tone of the item was anti American and therefor racist .
  
  Love to see an item on Dutch HQed Greenpeace’s efforts to influence our leglislation , but that’s asking too much , easier to whip up hatred against conservative Americans.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:12am
- tf78
  
  I got an email from the “so called anti pot crowd” this morning refuting that headline – it is not true they are funded by Kiwi’s – I being one of them.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:18am
- Inandout
  
  Sean Plunket has changed his mind on pot as he used to be all for legalising. I suspect he judges the slowness and confused thinking of his heavy pot user callers and has now second thoughts. The elephant in the room of course is lung damage; tobacco inhaling is harmfull, marijuana inhaling is apparently harmless. Willie Nelson would disagree.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:22am
  - Two bob
    
    the other elephant in the room is roadside drug testing.
    pot contributes greatly to our roadtoll, usually in combination with other drugs but not always. the impairment and dulling of reactions from pot are probably worse then meth, meth problems/Impairment usually occur due to sleep deprivation or withdrawls.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:49am
I remember when

Is it called the “Green Party” because they all suffer from car travel sickness?
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July 1, 2020 8:40am
- Komata
  
  IRW@0840
  
  Yet ‘mysteriously’ such ‘sickness’ seems to be helped immensely by lots of air travel, preferably to places located at the furthest distance from New Zealand and at the taxpayers expense…
  
  Apparently ‘air sickness’ and ‘Green values’ (especially those relating to ‘Climate Change’) are not evident on such excursions…
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:59am
hullkiwi

What has happened to Garner & Newshub over the past 3 weeks. At the rate they are going, National will get worried that the Electoral Commission will suggest Newshub is giving them free promotion.

The past 3 weeks has been attacks on Labour, and this morning it is an attack on the “corruption” of Winston & his party’s influence over the country’s fishing policy, plus Garner’s interview with Todd Muller had the form of almost being a Campbell style love in with Jacinda.

Keep this up and we’ll be left wondering whether COVID has turned all our known beliefs on their heads!
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July 1, 2020 8:42am
- Benedict Yu
  
  National should not rely on Garner. I have never been impressed with him. National needs to find ways to bypass the mainstream media.
  
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  July 1, 2020 8:52am
  - fernglas
    
    Garner is like Soper, Hosking and the rest of them. They will say whatever they think their bosses want to hear, the more controversial the better.
    Once we learn the basic lesson that news is nothing more than packaged entertainment and opinion the equivalent of infomercials, it becomes a lot clearer. For truth, you could go elsewhere or just give up.
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:14am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Garner gave a rant the other day saying that the borders should be sealed shut including to New Zealand citizens. No mention of the fact that would be unlawful, breach several international treaties, set a terrible precedent, and be unprecedented for any Western country.
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:02am
      - fernglas
        
        That’s what prompted my comment above. It was ignorant and thoughtless. He obviously thought that everybody could just get a return ticket and hop on a plane, which is appalling ignorance for one who puts himself forward as an opinion former. On the other hand, there seems to be enough ignorant people around for him to have an audience
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:15am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Yes – being a citizen has got to afford some privileges – one of the key ones is you can actually return home and live in New Zealand without question.
        
        6 1
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        July 1, 2020 11:29am
      - Nickc2
        
        There has to be a first time for everything.
        
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        July 1, 2020 2:34pm
  - freethinker
    
    Ben, Judging by National lack of policies that benefit their core voter base I doubt the current “leadership” couldn’t by pass a lampost.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:49am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      There’s a major policy release coming on Monday; National’s economic plan, I believe. After that, there will be plenty of new policies being released.
      
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      July 1, 2020 11:00am
  - Isobar
    
    ” National needs to find ways to bypass the mainstream media”
    
    I agree, the challenge is how to do it and not simply preach to the converted – those that would have voted for you anyway.
    
    Dont fall into the Corbyn trap.
    
    They need to somehow target centrist voters that that can peel of voting for Labour and NZF.
    
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    July 1, 2020 4:00pm
- Ruahine
  
  Labour is drip feeding anti Peters info. They want to get rid of NZ First and then be able to govern with only the ‘Greens’ or govern alone ,which will be heaven for them both.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:18am
  - kwkiwigirl
    
    Nzf are going to get in unfortunately through Jones in northland or Marks in the Wairarapa. Labour want Greens and Nzf to okay off against each other.
    
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    July 1, 2020 11:15pm
- Jimmy White
  
  Maybe the cheque for their portion of the $50 Million has not arrived.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:19am
- Two bob
  
  garner is the media version of winston peters and takes the side of whatever he can get the most grandstanding.
  hes not that accomadating of todd muller and always cuts him off or speaks over him. when nats f**k up he’ll change sides and beat them up too.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:52am
JibberJabber

LoL, the Green Party party cancelled due to lack of interest.
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July 1, 2020 8:44am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Yes, an extraordinary admission.
  It said the event was cancelled due to there not being enough RSVPs.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/121994241/green-party-event-cancellation-unrelated-to-rose-matafeo-organisers-say
  
  But still they are pushing ahead for a larger party next month…
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:04am
  - JibberJabber
    
    I sent them an email about engaging a Morris Dance troupe, but they ignored it.
    Only got themselves to blame….
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:07am
    - MH
      
      well they were out of step, and as for waving their hankies about in a covid world, can you blame them ?
      
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      July 1, 2020 10:52am
  - herb1
    
    Scary that a party who can’t generate enough interest to fill a room , expect to determine the future of every citizen in the country and the next generation of citizens as well
    
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    July 1, 2020 11:21am
- Bobba Fret
  
  I love the way Rose says, she does not believe Gloriz cancelled her going due to her old relationship with Guy Williams as its too petty to mention…..even though she mentions it! And after being crapped on she says she will still vote Greens!!! lol!
  
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  July 1, 2020 11:17am
JibberJabber

From NZs Truth and Reconciliation working group, your daily reminder that only White people are wacist,
https://twitter.com/DannyBlack44/status/1277925015728517120
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July 1, 2020 8:48am
- freethinker
  
  Ben, Judging by National lack of policies that benefit their core voter base I doubt the current “leadership” couldn’t by pass a lampost.
  
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  July 1, 2020 11:34am
Yvette

It may display my ignorance but only yesterday did I learn, from emphatic statements on Magic Talk Radio, that the up-coming referendum on cannabis is non-binding.

The dedicated Government website https://www.referendums.govt.nz/cannabis/index.html however does not as far as I see, mention this fact. It says –

What happens after the votes are counted?
If more than 50% of people vote ‘Yes’ in the referendum, recreational cannabis wouldn’t become legal straight away. After the election, the incoming Government can introduce a Bill to Parliament that would legalise and control cannabis. This process would include the opportunity for the public to share their thoughts and ideas on how the law might work.

If more than 50% of people vote ‘No’ in the referendum, recreational cannabis would remain illegal, as is the current law.

It does not admit that if the vote is in fact “Yes”, the in-coming Government does not have to introduce the Bill as outlined, that it could actually introduce it own entirely different bill, delay any bill or introduce none at all.
Is that not what non-binding means?
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July 1, 2020 8:53am
- MCos
  
  The Brexit referendum was also non binding.
  I should imagine in either case if the government of the day tried to sneak something using jiggery pokery of some sort eyebrows would/would have been raised.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:12am
- cmm
  
  There is nothing really special about a referendum – binding or not.
  
  Any referendum is only binding on the people that made the agreement and even then only if they don’t back out of the deal. However backing out of a deal is perhaps poor politics.
  
  No law is binding either. A new government can change the law if they have the numbers – including laws that were put in place by a referendum.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:26am
- Two bob
  
  and if a labour green govt is elected and the reeferendum votes no… will greens use their position to just forge ahead anyway?
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:54am
  - Ruahine
    
    When Labour and the ‘Greens’ become the gov’t in September Cannabis use and mis-use will become legal.
    
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    July 1, 2020 3:46pm
The Boss

Who is this traitor in National that keeps feeding the snake that is Tova? How disgusting.
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July 1, 2020 8:56am
- MCos
  
  Homeless man
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:13am
  - RJ
    
    Since there are over 367 people the ministry of health can not track down, one of them can easily be a homeless man.
    
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    July 1, 2020 12:47pm
- Martin Williams
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Simon Bridges.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:32am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    See comment above about more IQ tests
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:35am
- Paulus
  
  Tova makes her own snakes assisted by JLR as she is expected to listen to him or he might tell.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:32am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  When the leak breaks into news, look at who has the biggest smile on his face. Happy man …..
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:42am
- Prince
  
  Tova’s keyboard ?
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:08am
Justitia

Timing and momentum are everything in politics, especially less than 3 months out from an election. Could someone please pass a memo to Todd Muller to tell him to shut up about reopening the borders, even 12 or 18 months out? Todd was gifted momentum when the quarantine failures were exposed, but he’s thrown it all away. Most kiwis are content to hunker down through the winter with the borders shut tight right up to the election. Ardern has seized the initiative again presenting herself as the true defender of New Zealanders’ security while the COVID plague ramps up for a second wave in Victoria and the Southern US. She has decided to resume her daily COVID briefings (party political broadcasts) because she recognizes Muller has left the field wide open for her with his tone deaf posturing. For those many of us who are desperate for a change of government Muller’s tactical inadequacy is a huge disappointment.

And as for the bleatings of the universities regarding reopening for foreign students, just don’t go there National. Another sure loser at this time.
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July 1, 2020 8:59am
- MCos
  
  I listened to Toddy on Morning Report and thought someone should throttle Hooten. (The murderer certainly won’t be anyone from the Labour Party.)
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:18am
- All_on_Red
  
  Isn’t Europe opening up for all travel today?
  ‘Most’ kiwis might be content but I doubt they will be that when joblessness starts to bite
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:58am
  - brett68
    
    If “most kiwis” are content, why the fuck is Muller taking the opposite position?
    
    Doesn’t he realise politics is mainly a popularity contest?
    Fuck me, this is basic stuff but obviously beyond Todd.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:29am
- Prince
  
  Surely the feedback he is getting must tell him he’s off course. Like you I want a change of Govt but he is handing them the election on a platter.
  Stop talking about opening the borders. Focus on the Govt mismanagement, and inability to do any of the things they said they would. Take the focus away from Covid and into the next three years. Keep banging on that message.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:31am
- bruceavon
  
  Yes I agree. People at a company I do work for were yesterday talking about National being the party who wanted to open the borders, and brought up an article by Mike Hoskings, as though they are going to do it as soon as they get in. A sure way to lose the election. don’t talk about it. Even if we do open our borders, it’s a long way away. I can’t see how this is a direction that will get votes off Labour.
  
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  July 1, 2020 12:49pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Are you a candidate for the Darwin award in economics and welfare?
  
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  July 1, 2020 3:01pm
Maggie Pie

Prof Anne-Marie Brady details New Zealand’s quiet China shift.

https://thediplomat.com/2020/06/new-zealands-quiet-china-shift/
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July 1, 2020 9:06am
- kowtow
  
  Not such a quiet shift. Bolt did quite a story last night on Jian Yang and the Nats/ China . Muller has promoted him a few slots .
  
  The kowtows won’t be voting National while they stay in thrall to the CCP.
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:26am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Anne also sez we shouldn’t forget the ‘Hubbard cartoon’ that appeared last year after Simon’s trip to China – staged by Jian Yang – that went badly wrong and damaged Simon’s reputation.
    
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbyUWqiU4AAERmw?format=jpg&name=small
    
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    July 1, 2020 9:45am
    - MH
      
      and the UK with Huawei ?
      
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      July 1, 2020 11:00am
      - Justitia
        
        The UK will not proceed with Huawei 5 G, especially after COVID 19. There are enough votes in the Commons to torpedo the necessary legislation if Boris were foolish enough to proceed. The US embargo on supplying chips to Huawei will also have a major impact.
        
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        July 1, 2020 11:54am
Benedict Yu

I see the EU opened its borders today to 15 countries including New Zealand. No 14 day quarantine in hotels.

The Government will everything shut tight until the election. But then what? What if there is no vaccine? At some point New Zealand is going to need to join the ‘containment’ club. Or stay closed forever. I have never heard the PM explain possible exit paths from where we are now. Surely there are people in government setting out these exit paths?
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July 1, 2020 9:19am
- Scooter
  
  If Labour get back in, expect borders to be closed for the next 3 years and kiwis will fall for it.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:10pm
Northland Wahine

Shane Jones and Grant Robertson announcing Shovel ready projects.

And guess what?

Nothing to do with planting those bloody trees.
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July 1, 2020 9:23am
- fernglas
  
  It’s no surprise, as Jones and his party are leaning on all the shovels left in the country
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:17am
  - Northland Wahine
    
    I couldn’t trust either with a stop and go sign, let alone a shovel.
    
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    July 1, 2020 10:37am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      I don’t imagine many of Jones’ “neffs” will be getting off the couch any time soon…
      
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      July 1, 2020 11:42am
      - RJ
        
        To be fair they have been getting off the couch for nearly three years now, hmmm. I would love to see their couch.
        
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        July 1, 2020 12:33pm
- Swifty
  
  You know, just thinking about it, here you have Shane Jones who it is clear has been moving towards a political career from an early age.
  
  For arguably decades he has made careful moves to position himself that results in him being a senior figure in a political party which emerges as the kingmaker at the conclusion of the 2017 election vote count.
  
  So at this huge and important point in his life, a situation a tiny, infinitesimal number of New Zealanders ever get and to make a difference, what does he demand from Labour in return for his support?
  
  “Give me money to spend! And lots of it!”
  
  It’s times like this I think if we’re talking about defunding things – I think we should defund NZ politicians.
  
  Peters is a charlatan and he has surrounded himself with charlatans, out for nobody but themselves.
  
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  July 1, 2020 11:26am
- SJ Actual
  
  Even though the purpose of the shovel ready projects is to help struggling businesses – they are going to announce the successful projects “over weeks”.
  Electioneering taking clear priority over helping companies stay afloat.
  
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  July 1, 2020 4:05pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Alex Jones. Sometimes he is off the planet but maybe not this time. The covid numbers are being fucked with.
https://banned.video/watch?id=5efa82b8672706002f363efc&fbclid=IwAR1htQnSVYg8rhjHNGQO_akIpBXAU__LRoXSGJUsvWFPpVBIpnH9nrI9LS8
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July 1, 2020 9:40am
- Jules99
  
  How many times has his conspiracy theories turned out to be conspiracy facts? Quite a few.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:37am
- doggone7
  
  Jones sometimes is off the planet and with the mere push of a button he travels hundreds of thousands of kilometres back to planet rational.
  
  When Loony Tunes says the covid numbers are being fucked with what’s the problem? If Loony Tunes and his loony followers want to believe that stuff so what?
  
  That’s just this morning. Later on today they can worry about the typical serious Jones stuff like how Joe Biden has planted transmitters in the middle leg on the left side of ants to have have them spy on all citizens. And the middle one on the right Hillary Clinton has planted scent glands laced with a substance to make election officials rig the election.
  
  It’d be great if Jones gets back from off the planet and lands on Planet New Zealand. I wonder if he’ll find anyone with so few brain cells they treat him as being anything more that King Looney Tunes?
  
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  July 1, 2020 11:07am
RW Capitalist

“On 1 July 2020, petrol excise duty will increase 3.5 cents to around 70 cents per litre and road user charges will increase by an equivalent amount (around 5 percent). The cost of a road user charges distance licence for a light vehicle (eg a car, van, ute) will be $76 (up from $72) per 1000 km, including GST.”
No NEW taxes, just increasing the old ones.
Mistakenly posted this on “fisheries” comments.
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July 1, 2020 9:41am
- burt
  
  Typical Labour policy, they claim they are taxing the wealthy but they always punish the low earners.
  
  When I fill up the tank on my gas guzzling 350hp fun car I’ll not give a second thought to the extra few bucks it costs – will the struggling family on minimum wage see it the same way when working out if they should put $20 in the car or buy some food for the kids?
  
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  July 1, 2020 9:46am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Also alcohol excise tax.
  At least we have proof that Labour are intending to increase taxes during a recession, they’ve already done it!
  
  12 0
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  July 1, 2020 12:56pm
Durden

Its funny that a corpulent nobody called David Cormack who runs a company of two can feel so miffed that he was replaced by Stephen Joyce as a writer on NZ Herald. Talk about self-important and pompous 🙂

https://twitter.com/David_Cormack/status/1276638327463047168

Why would I prefer the thoughts of a very successful business man and a very effective National party minister (Mr Fixit) for 9 years over the childish ravings of a little boy with delusions of relevance?

Obviously the very bright Julie Anne Genter would like free publicity for the Greens in the guise of a opinion column in a mainstream paper. Cormie’s revenge Patreon account is going to make him a lot of money no doubt — Lol

Having worked for the Greens in the past, he is shamelessly shilling for work and forlornly hoping that the Greens will give him a job after the elections. Good luck.
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July 1, 2020 9:55am
- Prince
  
  Would that be the Cormack who features in this hit-piece ?
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300045411/new-zealand-wineries-owner-gave-nearly-400000-to-trump-report
  I thought it was odd that a ‘PR firm’ would be able to manipulate Stuff so easily to attack one winery. Cormack obviously has some well-placed media buddies.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:40am
- Swifty
  
  While I admit I only ever read a few of Cormack’s columns (paywall) those I read were lightweight.
  
  Instead of thoughtful analysis of great issues of our time – his pieces were merely party political hack stuff and almost exclusively talking about people and who said or did what etc – and, invariably, left good, right bad.
  
  Maybe that was his brief – I don’t know. All I do know is that I never came away from any of his columns being pleased or uplifted I had read it.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:49am
Kabull

I see the woke Anglican church is falling further over the edge. The Dean of St Albans Cathedral in Hertfordshire is replacing the old painting of the Last Supper with one in which Jesus is portrayed by a Jamaican born model. Apparently this is because the church ‘finds itself in a weak place to preach racial justice. The re-worked painting challenges ‘the Western myth’ that Jesus looked European.
Spare me. If it is correct that Jesus was born in Nazareth then how can he be negroid, let alone Caribbean?
And this rubbish is support by Welby, the Archbishop of Canterbury …
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July 1, 2020 9:59am
- fernglas
  
  “It’s only a model”
  
  2 0
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  July 1, 2020 10:19am
- Albert_Ross
  
  If that’s really what the Dean of St Alban’s said, it’s a piss-poor rationale for what is actually a defensible theological and artistic approach.
  
  A better one would be to explain that Jesus was born into a race which was being oppressed and exploited, of which Western Europeans have never been a good example and Jews these days aren’t either.
  
  Thus if you want to represent, to today’s audience, what Christ stood for (which is far more important than what he looked like), somebody from a race which actually is being oppressed and exploited would be a more appropriate model. Although in that regard, in a UK context I would probably go for somebody from Sri Lanka rather than a West Indian.
  
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  July 1, 2020 10:39am
- Prince
  
  ‘He’ ?
  Shocked at this sexist portrayal by the Anglicans.
  
  5 0
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  July 1, 2020 10:41am
  - rangitoto
    
    Should be a midget trans something.
    
    1 0
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    July 1, 2020 10:57am
- MH
  
  and as the congregation sings Swing low sweet chariot….
  
  2 0
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  July 1, 2020 11:07am
- Fletch
  
  I don’t get it, really. Jesus was an Israeli Jew. Look over at Israel and how many Jews are black? Netanyahu? Prominent Israeli actors like Gal Gadot, or Natalie Portman? Perhaps it’s a modern thing, but in living memory I can’t remember Israelis as a race, being that dark.
  
  6 1
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  July 1, 2020 12:04pm
  - Batman
    
    Ummmmmmm, maybe it has something to do with a mass influx of European Jews circa 1946 onwards.
    
    I understand they had quite a bad time in Europe….
    
    4 1
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    July 1, 2020 12:12pm
  - MH
    
    Sammy Davis Jnr
    
    1 0
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    July 1, 2020 2:24pm
burt

Compare and contrast;

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300046017/woman-groped-by-air-force-boss-robert-roper-gets-another-shot-at-compensation

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/415115/young-labour-camp-offender-to-keep-fighting-for-name-suppression

One is a Labour party member – the other isn’t.
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July 1, 2020 10:53am
- rangitoto
  
  Did they ever name the person up to no good in the PMs office?
  
  14 0
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  July 1, 2020 10:58am
  - burt
    
    No, that was another one who had the Labour Party Shield.
    
    The #MeToo crowd went silent on that one too. Shame on them all for putting party politics before the rights of the victims.
    
    22 0
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    July 1, 2020 11:24am
  - RightNow
    
    No but after a brief time out last year he’s now back front and centre in the PMs office.
    
    12 0
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    July 1, 2020 12:23pm
- SB2
  
  burt , this is the big difference,
  
  “Woman groped by Air Force boss Robert Roper ..”!
  
  1 14
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  July 1, 2020 11:02am
  - RJ
    
    No, there is never any difference in people sexually abusing others. The only difference is the sick people that defend that abuse
    
    9 0
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    July 1, 2020 12:30pm
Durden

There is one thing that is happening that is making NZ poorer but going under the radar. Something people generally don’t keep an eye on–the NZD-USD exchange rate.

This rate has been down into the USD 50c region and now around 65c. It reached dizzying heights under the National government of up to 83c. The fall in Aug 2015 was a result of a market flash crash and global impact.

https://longforecast.com/nzd-to-usd-forecast-2017-2018-2019-2020-2021-new-zealand-dollar

That means a 21% drop from the top. What this means is NZ’ers are paying a hell of a lot more for their imports. Which means price rises across board. Winston Peters always thought that the NZD should be down because it suits exporters. A false economy if there ever was one. The CoL has been effectively debasing our currency. Effectively a tax on the spending of Jo and Jenny Bloggs.

It is being predicted that it ill drop to 55c by 2024 — which I am guessing assumes a left government of some sort and consequent increase in debt and money printing. That is a 32% drop.

Big consequence for prices in NZ. Big impact on capital purchases (think automation equipment, tractors, industrial plant improvements etc)

https://longforecast.com/nzd-to-usd-forecast-2017-2018-2019-2020-2021-new-zealand-dollar

NZ is getting screwed in more ways than one by this government.
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July 1, 2020 10:58am
- RJ
  
  Yeah, I laughed yesterday when our useless finance minister was talking about how cheap petrol is even with the new tax. Oh yes, let’s just wait until the world starts up again then tell us how cheap it is with all your new taxes and a shit dollar Grant.
  
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  July 1, 2020 12:29pm
  - MH
    
    new tanker Aotearoa will bring in gallons of the stuff unless the refinery has gone into mothballs and then there’s TY point closing shop.
    
    3 0
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    July 1, 2020 2:28pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Petrol is cheap for those who are driven in Crown limos.
    
    2 0
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    July 1, 2020 5:47pm
- chukar
  
  The more they print ,the less it will buy = inflation
  
  Then increase the yield to compensate —- interest rates
  Very very painful
  
  4 0
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  July 1, 2020 12:37pm
Maggie Pie

Been switching between MagicTalk and 1ZB.
I’ll tell yu what really jerks my chain…..
the way Kerry McIvor sez “NeeeewwwwsstalkZB”
6 0
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July 1, 2020 11:02am
Maggy Wassilieff

A long “investigative” tale about Winston’s new buddy that tells us precisely nothing

https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/01-07-2020/the-curious-case-of-winston-peters-and-brexit-bad-boy-arron-banks/
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July 1, 2020 11:08am
- RJ
  
  You get more detailed and accurate information from blogs now days, the media are just paid propaganda
  
  6 1
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  July 1, 2020 12:26pm
Swifty

A nice piece on the last days of Sir Roger Scruton:

https://thecritic.co.uk/the-philosophers-mind-at-its-end/

One of my favourite human beings.
6 0
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July 1, 2020 11:09am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Your google machine must be broken as well
5 1
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July 1, 2020 11:13am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Delete please. Troll Stupid Boy 2 removed his question
  
  6 1
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  July 1, 2020 11:31am
  - Durden
    
    Not sure why the mods let him back on to be honest.
    
    11 0
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    July 1, 2020 11:59am
Maggie Pie

Just been googling ‘Houses for Sale’ in Hong Kong.
Amazing what you can get there now for a couple of mill , compared to say somewhere like Mt Roskill.
5 0
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July 1, 2020 11:58am
Fletch

A conservative on Facebook points out the dishonestly of Chloe Swarbrick and others on the news last night decrying an anti-cannabis US organisation coming over here to push their view. The organisation was called upon not to interfere in NZ politics and the public was interviewed on the same subject. Brendan Malone points out –

Last night Andrew Little and Chloe Swarbrick appeared in the media to prop up false allegations about anti-marijuana activists from the US trying to interfere in the NZ cannabis referendum.

What they failed to mention was that late last year they both attended an event featuring two PRO-marijuana activists from the US that was organised by the Government-funded Drug Foundation and hosted at Parliament buildings.

This has all the hallmarks of a dirty politics hit job that was launched in retaliation to the new poll on Monday showing that pro-marijuana forces are lagging well behind in their very well funded efforts to try and have recreational cannabis legalised in NZ.
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July 1, 2020 11:58am
- RJ
  
  Hmm, so if foreign organisations shouldn’t get involved in New Zealand politics, what about the democrats that came last election to campaign for labour and complained about the slave like conditions they were subject to
  
  12 1
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  July 1, 2020 12:25pm
- kowtow
  
  The tone was also racist .
  
  Very very anti American dog whistle .
  
  5 1
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  July 1, 2020 2:42pm
- Ruahine
  
  All part of the 50 million of our taxes paid out to the Media. Just call them up, they come running to run with what they are told.
  
  5 0
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  July 1, 2020 3:33pm
I remember when

RNZ: Police crackdown on gangs’ gun suppliers.
At least one gang member a day is being charged with firearms offences.
Last year 402 people on police national gang list were charged with 711 firearm offences. This represents a 54% increase in offender and 60% increase in number of charges. In the first two months of this year 328 firearms were seized including more than a dozen semi-automatic military-style weapons.
There has been about one inter-gang shooting per month in the Bay of Plenty this year.
Police are now targeting supply of arms to gangs.
Last year 72 guns were seized at the border.
Between 2015 and 2019 customs seized about 500 guns, if paintball and BB guns are excluded.
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July 1, 2020 12:05pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  What are the Mongrel Mob and Black Power gun crackdown figures like? It seems likely they’re mainly just disarming their competition for them at the moment.
  
  5 0
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  July 1, 2020 12:50pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  72 guns at the border? UnPossible, I was assured by all the right people from Nash and Cahill upwards that the only guns that criminals in New Zealand have access to are those stolen from licensed firearms owners.
  
  Truly, one lives and learns /sarc.
  
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  July 1, 2020 4:25pm
Tauhei Notts

I have noticed that Fox News is topping the polls in American viewership. That is surprising as it is generally Trump’s fan base that watch Fox. But in the betting markets Biden is still hot favourite. Biden’s odds had been firming day after day, but I note that the increased support for him seems to have tailed off a bit over the past three days.
Consider those Fox News figures, and maybe Trump is still in with a show.
I hope so.
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July 1, 2020 12:24pm
- Fletch
  
  Yeh, I think Biden has dropped 4 points over the last week…
  
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  July 1, 2020 1:42pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Yea, Hillary was quids on to win the last election too.
    
    5 0
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    July 1, 2020 2:49pm
  - doggone7
    
    I can’t be that good at reading data. I couldn’t verify that claim on here:
    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/
    
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    July 1, 2020 2:50pm
- Nermal
  
  Like last time, I’m waiting for Biden to poll around 90% before I’m sure Trump will win
  
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  July 1, 2020 3:06pm
lifesgood

A very nasty, bitter, supercilious review by Steve Braunius of Judith Collin’s book on Newsroom today. Not surprising coming from a boring lefty. He praised Golriz’s book, though. Surprise, surprise. Those lefties are so predictable.
17 1
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July 1, 2020 12:31pm
- Prince
  
  Braunias, Russel Brown, Slack, Mau – the ageing coterie trying to stay relevant. Invariably ‘opiniating’ about how wonderful Labour/Greens are, and more often how evil National/Act. Life is so comfortable when you judge people by the colours they wear.
  
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  July 1, 2020 2:39pm
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    I’m more concerned about their lack of diversity – very pale & stale (and mainly male…)
    
    2 0
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    July 1, 2020 3:09pm
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Braunias and Brown are not male. FIFY.
      
      0 0
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      July 1, 2020 5:18pm
  - Ruahine
    
    The left are basically a Gang. Colours are important to gangs.
    
    3 1
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    July 1, 2020 3:30pm
- MCos
  
  Have you read the book?
  
  It’s a book review about yet another political autobiography.
  
  1 2
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  July 1, 2020 3:53pm
Fletch

The youth of today – so braindead that they can’t even figure out how to park at a petrol pump so as to have the gas tank on the correct side…

https://www.facebook.com/justinflomofficial/posts/10160047617832627
4 1
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July 1, 2020 12:45pm
- Batman
  
  Could say the same about a lot of middle aged women and various other Boomer types ?
  
  2 10
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  July 1, 2020 12:59pm
- RJ
  
  Just a set up for them to get views, no matter what way you park it that hose would reach.
  
  3 1
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  July 1, 2020 1:20pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This is what happens when you do drugs. Don’t do drugs
  
  2 1
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  July 1, 2020 2:24pm
- MCos
  
  It’s called a petrol tank and if the highlight of your day is filming someone struggling to fill it up you’d probably make an exceptionally dull dinner guest.
  
  2 0
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  July 1, 2020 3:37pm
- Two bob
  
  Not just the young, my aunty is late 50s and ive seen her do the same thing and shes also never fueled her own car ever!! Pulls in and waits, if no attendant comes out she drives to the next station.
  
  1 0
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  July 1, 2020 7:09pm
Maggie Pie

ORAL IN THE HOUSE
Q 12: Jan Logie to the Minister of Statistics……

Another reason to be back in FIJI on Census Day 2023 😀
5 1
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July 1, 2020 1:57pm
RJ

Perhaps police Ten 7 can Tory this

Video
0 4
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July 1, 2020 2:20pm
- RJ
  
  Try this
  
  0 2
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  July 1, 2020 2:28pm
Swifty

Five key moments in the evolution of the rock standard “Hey Joe”:

1. Niela Miller – Baby, Please Don’t Go to Town (1959/60)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xN7otqp3MfQ

2. Billy Roberts, Hey Joe (1961/62)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmrGOXJMQj0

3. The Leaves – Hey Joe (1965)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWv03Wgz0PQ

4. Tim Rose – Hey Joe, long version (1966)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BynwqM3gz30

5. Jimi Hendrix – Hey Joe, Monterey Pop Festival (1967)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fe82eYRjiBU
2 1
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July 1, 2020 2:54pm
RW Capitalist

The future of the minimum wage job?
Especially if you keep making large raises to the minimum wage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfkmdcIDg_8
2 1
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July 1, 2020 3:05pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  or
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMsNZsp4LE0
  
  1 1
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  July 1, 2020 3:10pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Non contact fast food…covid19 distancing dream?
    Did notice these machines, actually made the food look better than the minimum wagers do at the moment.
    
    1 1
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    July 1, 2020 3:11pm
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Given there is an increasingly good chance that at woke coffee shops and bars and restaurants the Womyns’ Studies graduates preparing your food and serving it to you will be giving you food that somewhere along the line someone has spat on or done worse things with, I say, bring on the food serving robots ASAP!
      
      2 1
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      July 1, 2020 5:20pm
Jack5

The West, or more accurately, non-Maori New Zealand, is racist in not recognising Maori science.

That’s the crux of a report by Stuff’s Carmen Parahi. She is quoting Rangi Matamua, who she describes as a Maori astronomer. Matamua won the 2019 $75,000 Prime Minister’s “science communicator” prize, administered by the Royal Society of NZ.

From Parahi’s report in Stuff:

“The scientific world is perhaps starting to realise the knowledge base we [Maori] have and maybe starting to understand science is more than just what western science practitioners believe it is. I think perhaps they have issues believing that what we do is science half the time.

“Yes, it is racist.”

Matamua, an academic in the Maori and Indigenous Studies at Waikato University, is best known for promoting “Matariki”.

Parahi reports Matamua as saying Maori have always been scientists, adding “you don’t navigate that expansive ocean on myths and legends.”

Did Maori have any science at all in the modern sense of the word?

The main “scientific” interest of Maori seems to have been the stars. Matamua, in effect, puts Maori star lore and navigation on a par with the work of thousands of years of Western astronomers ranging from Eratosthenes and Ptolemy through Copernicus, Brahe, and Kepler, to modern space exploration and radio astronomy. Then, there are the astronomers of the old Persia, India, and of China, which has a 3000-year history of astronomy, and invented astronomy devices like the Armillary Sphere – and, famously, the compass.

It’s not obvious that Maori knowledge slots in easily with modern science. However, given the importance of the night sky to ocean voyagers like old Maori and Polynesians generally, it’s relevant in Maori cultural studies.

That doesn’t seem to be the direction at present. Rather it seems to be to to subsume Western astronomy into Maori “science”.

Parahi’s report:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/300045463/first-ever-mori-science-award-winner-calls-out-racism

Piripi Lambert on new centre for studying Maori star knowledge:

https://www.teaomaori.news/maori-astronomy-school-preserves-ancient-knowledge-stars
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July 1, 2020 3:11pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  I’m still waiting for the Maori inventions?
  
  6 0
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  July 1, 2020 5:23pm
greybeard

Anybody else had enough of the new ( and crap ) “Stuff” website ?
God, what a mess.
They may be celebrating a 20 years anniversary but did they really have to celebrate it by getting 2 x 10-year-olds to do the new design?
5 1
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July 1, 2020 3:15pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Children having a party
  
  3 1
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  July 1, 2020 4:51pm
Inandout

What the heck is going on in New York with covid?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIngGuof9E0&feature=emb_logo
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July 1, 2020 3:34pm
kowtow

Now the depiction of an archangel , St Michael ,a mythical character , defeating a fallen angel Satan ,another mythical creation is racist and “literally” the depiction of what happened to George Floyd .

This is beyond parody.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/06/30/knights-call-racist-medal-redesigned/
2 1
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July 1, 2020 3:46pm
mandk

PM getting all cross and frowny with people who left quarantine and gave dodgy contact details.

She is starting to channel Violet Elizabeth Bott:
“If you don’t do what I thay, I’ll thcream and thcream until I’m thick”
(furrows brow, pouts and stamps foot)
9 1
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July 1, 2020 4:01pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Thermo nuclear meltdown soon, give more rope
  
  5 2
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  July 1, 2020 4:53pm
Bobba Fret

Robertson acknowledged some Labour policies such as KiwiBuild “have not gone the way we wanted them to”.
That’s the understatement of the year Grant!
9 0
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July 1, 2020 4:47pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Lost control, never were in control of KiwiBuild
  
  4 1
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  July 1, 2020 4:54pm
Master Mariner

Its a worry and not surprising I guess.

Kiss the idea of a Vaccine anytime soon if true.

https://www.aninews.in/news/world/us/mutations-may-be-making-coronavirus-more-contagious-researchers20200630120732/
4 0
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July 1, 2020 5:13pm
- RJ
  
  There won’t be a vaccine.
  
  4 0
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  July 1, 2020 6:46pm
Swifty

Tucker on fire yet again today and with lessons relevant to NZ:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS-bsetu01w
4 1
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July 1, 2020 6:15pm
- Kabull
  
  He and Laura are a must watch each evening. I’ve long stopped watching our mindless babblers.
  
  3 1
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  July 1, 2020 8:38pm
Engelbert Humperdink

Not that history always repeats itself as farce – but I remember, I was a junior hospital-grade body-mech when AIDS came out (years before we got the more politically correct HIV term).

Firstly, it was deadly.

Secondly, no one quite knew how bad the risk of contagion was/how easy you could contract it. Whether, for example, it could be contracted with the same relative ease is getting hepatitis B from a patient back in the day with no hepatitis B vaccine.

Thirdly, 40 years later we still don’t have a vaccine for HIV…

…repeated hopeful blathering by the Burka Queen about reopening the country when – she assumes based on zero evidence – a safe, reliable and effective vaccine is developed later this year or next year, doesn’t change the facts of vaccine development.
5 1
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July 1, 2020 6:31pm
- MCos
  
  We may not have a HIV vaccine, but Magic Johnson is still alive thirty years after being infected.
  There are about 3500 living with HIV in NZ. I’m not sure how many, if die anymore.
  
  1 0
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  July 1, 2020 9:38pm
  - Batman
    
    And we have PrEP to vastly reduce the risk of getting HIV in the first place.
    
    1 0
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    July 1, 2020 11:13pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Apostle Shane declaims

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/420252/shane-jones-slams-greenpeace-i-am-an-apostle-of-industry
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July 1, 2020 7:23pm
gorse

Nash is sorry. Oh dear, but that’s ok it’s fine then. NOT!
2 0
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July 1, 2020 9:16pm

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