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January 19, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 19 January 2021

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General Debate

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Happychappy

Yesterday Chris Hipkins made a statement to Mike Hosking that shows how Cocky and Arrogant that he and the Labour Party are, Hipkins: NZ border measures are ‘ pretty dam ‘ close to full proof, your never going to have something that is full proof but you can get pretty dam close and I think we are pretty dam close now.
https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/mike-hosking-breakfast/audio/chris-hipkins-new-zealands-border-measures-are-pretty-damn-close-to-foolproof/
This is in the light of our experts calling for tougher measures at our borders but just like the previous Health Minister David Clark, Chris Hipkins knows better.
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January 19, 2021 8:02am
- tf78
  
  Happy should it have been ‘foolproof’.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:41am
  - septic skeptic
    
    A sufficiently talented fool will find a way.
    
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    January 19, 2021 12:03pm
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Yup. I used to sell reasonably complex enterprise-class software to large organisations, and would often be asked if the system was “idiot-proof”. Mostly by government departments, strangely enough.
      
      I would always reply that no system can resist a determined idiot with time and opportunity on their hands.
      
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      January 19, 2021 2:07pm
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  If I remember correctly Chippy won with a higher majority than last election. So he can be cocky and arrogant. Sheeple worship at his feet.
  
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  January 19, 2021 1:08pm
Don Beckett

Sounds like the Occupy Wall Street bunch are back, but this time it’s Washington D C. Why don’t those Alt Right Extremists just go home. //
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January 19, 2021 8:02am
- coge
  
  Sooner the old political establishments are fully upgraded and digitized. The sooner the economy won’t have to bear these enormous costs, imposts and daily inefficiency.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:33am
yossarian

I see that the NZ Herald is comparing Biden to FDR already? Get use to MSM completely ignoring his obvious dementia and failing mental health
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January 19, 2021 8:05am
- Luke Piewalker
  
  Biden is elder abuse
  
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  January 19, 2021 8:53am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  And his clearly demonstrated corruption using his relatives as bag-men. When will media turn on him to get their identity politics poster child installed?
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:33am
- burt
  
  Has he been awarded a Nobel Peace Prize yet ? He’s a democrat and got elected so why are we waiting ?
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:40am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    May be waiting for Kamala Harris to take over.
    
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    January 19, 2021 1:09pm
- Nickc2
  
  What saddens me is that Beijing Biden and his son’s crimes will probably be ignored unless the GOP start impeachment proceedings against Beijing Biden himself and I can’t see that happening for a couple of reasons: Kommie Kamala has the last say in the Senate and I believe the average US citizen is suffering from impeachment fatigue for the time being.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:42am
  - virtualmark
    
    There’s only the small matter of evidence, and detailed charges. But hey, no doubt you support the party of “law and order”.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:32am
    - Nickc2
      
      I’m not sure what your point is but yes, I do support Land [Law] and Order. To do otherwise is to sanction anarchy.
      If evidence is your issue, there is plenty of it and the most incriminating is self-admission.
      
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      January 19, 2021 11:04am
      - IC5000
        
        > I’m not sure what your point is but yes, I do support Land [Law] and Order.
        
        So no doubt you will be looking forward to the MAGA mob trials then?
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:47pm
      - virtualmark
        
        Let me be clear what my point is.
        
        When you say “Biden and his son’s crimes” just exactly what crimes are you referring to? Lay out for me the exact charges you think the FBI and DoJ should bring against them.
        
        Then lay out for me exactly what evidence you have for those charges. You believe there’s plenty of it, so it shouldn’t be hard to set it out here right?
        
        Because all I can see in your original comment is a child frothing at the mouth about make believe fantasies.
        
        Clear enough?
        
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        January 19, 2021 4:00pm
      - Nickc2
        
        IC5000
        I don’t care so long as Antifa and BLM operatives are bought to justice as well. Do you think that will happen? Nah, Pelosi, Schumer, Harris and even Biden himself will prevent that (if he can read what is put in front of him by an Auto-que). IMO, corruption in American politics as in American business knows no bounds.
        The CANCEL merchants are seeing to that. Same here in lil-olde-New Zealand where words uttered against Cindy’s mob don’t even make to the MSM (cancelled in transmission).
        
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        January 19, 2021 5:32pm
  - Steve Todd
    
    Nick: I’m shocked, that after two impeachments in 14 months, you still don’t seem to understand the process: that the Senate can only try impeachments (for “high Crimes and Misdemeanors”), that have been initiated and voted on in the House of Representatives.
    
    The best you can hope for is that the Republicans gain control of the House at the 2022 mid-terms, but even then, they won’t have a two-thirds majority (to convict Biden) in the Senate.
    
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    January 19, 2021 1:32pm
    - Nickc2
      
      TKS. I forgot about the 2/3 majority bit.
      However, it looks like he will go the distance unless Pelosi resorts to the 25th Amendment. IMO, America will be in deep shit if Kamala Harris gets to be POTUS.
      
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      January 19, 2021 2:00pm
- NoFax
  
  A more apt comparison would be to Wilson.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:52am
- David George
  
  The man that intends to unify America announced that minority owned businesses will be prioritised for assistance.
  Al’s Diner gets zip while the Mexican outfit next door gets bailed out.
  Is Joe Biden completely clueless to be stoking resentment at this time. Perhaps it’s intentional, provoke a reaction and all means are justified to oppress it?
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:32am
- Stu2
  
  Wow, what nonsense! Biden only got elected as the alternative was Trump
  
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  January 19, 2021 11:37am
- Blackbob
  
  The same FDR who made the Great Depression last longer than it should’ve?
  
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  January 19, 2021 12:15pm
- Crisplion
  
  Well, FDR died in office, which is something that Biden is also quite likely to do, so then they’d have something in common at least.
  
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  January 19, 2021 1:45pm
Maggie Pie

“When is the election?”
– Joe Biden
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January 19, 2021 8:07am
- Simon
  
  Democratic Presidential Nominee Joe Biden recently bragged that Democrats have created the “most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics.”
  
  “We’re in a situation where we have put together, and you guys did it for our administration…President Obama’s administration before this. We have put together, I think, the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics,” he said.
  
  https://thefederalist.com/2020/10/24/joe-biden-says-democrats-created-the-most-extensive-and-inclusive-voter-fraud-organization-in-american-history/
  
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  January 19, 2021 8:18am
  - Batman
    
    Amazing that 25 people have so far upticked a deliberately out of context quote which is designed to feed a lie.
    
    It’s not even hard to prove it wrong…
    
    https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact-check-biden-voter-protection-not/fact-check-clip-of-biden-taken-out-of-context-to-portray-him-as-plotting-a-voter-fraud-scheme-idUSKBN27E2VH
    
    Meanwhile the GOP was doing this…
    
    https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/13/dark-money-gop-fund-funneled-millions-groups-that-pushed-voter-fraud-claims.html
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:21am
    - Charmaine Hawke
      
      Nah Batman Biden just says the quiet bits out loud. Enjoy President Xiden for as long as he lasts.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:28am
    - Bevan
      
      Wow….
      
      So, when a Democrat says this its a slip of the tongue. If a Republican said it, the MSM and countless celebrities would be re running the clip and demanding Trump self impeach, be prosecuted etc. We’d never hear the end of it. But nah, it was a Democrat so you know – its all good.
      
      Mind you kind of fits.
      
      BLM protest turn in to riots, burning, looting whatever can be found, people killed. … Lefties: “Crickets”
      
      Trump election protest turns into riots, invasion of Capitol building, theft of property, people killed. Lefties: “IMPEACH!!!!” “DEPLATFORM” “REPROGRAM”!!!!!!!!
      
      Damn I love me some hypocrisy.
      
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      January 19, 2021 3:54pm
      - Batman
        
        What’s your point?
        
        The claim about the Biden fraud quote is probably and obviously a lie.
        
        The rest is just a rant from you because you don’t like the reality.
        
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        January 19, 2021 4:33pm
      - Bevan
        
        I thought the point was quite obvious, would you like me to use smaller words? Pictures maybe…
        
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        January 19, 2021 5:54pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Fact checkers are not worth a tin of shit. I can’t even share a teeshirt ad on FB without some 18 year old getting his panties in a twist. Fact checkers are trainnee reporters for CNN, MSNBC, and now Fox
      
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      January 19, 2021 4:18pm
      - Batman
        
        Steve you sound upset that people calmly point out that the things you want to believe are actually horseshit
        
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        January 19, 2021 4:31pm
Simon

Never go full retard. Military control of the capitol to install fake puppet president, woke capital, label anyone who says rigged election as a white supremist, fake political impeachment, MSM full on propaganda wing of the Dems and mass political censorship.

Wait Ted Cruz still hasn’t been arrested yet. They havent followed DPF’s advise. Almost there.
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January 19, 2021 8:11am
- Inandout
  
  That extremely intelligent Mark Levin was cancelled by YouTube for ‘inappropriate content’. Most permitted videos from other contributors seemed to be 1-4 months old. Welcome to group think.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:20am
  - Batman
    
    Are you guys sad that your false reality bubble is being burst?
    
    Snowflakes. Harden up.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:22am
    - Inandout
      
      Bat, luckily we don’t rely on your news feed from CNN. Censorship good, free speech bad, eh Bat?
      
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      January 19, 2021 11:07am
      - Batman
        
        When you don’t have an argument, talk about CNN and smear the other person.
        
        Classy as usual!
        
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        January 19, 2021 11:11am
- Bevan
  
  In the words of my daughters favourite movie: Let it go, let it go…
  
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  January 19, 2021 3:55pm
Simon

Comrades everything is fine! At the moment Central Planning is carrying out massive reviews of the economy to work out how much money needs to be printed.

There are extensive spread sheets being prepared to calculate how much money needs to be printed to keep Labour polling in the high 40s for the next 3 years. Onwards!
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January 19, 2021 8:13am
Maggie Pie

MAGA. In the last month alone, President Trump has authorised the execution of five death row inmates, 17 since last July.

On his first day in office, Sleepy Joe is expected to overturn Trumpy’s travel ban, which prohibited people from Muslim countries entering America.

Old Chynaa saying – “We live in interesting times”
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January 19, 2021 8:18am
- igm
  
  Wait till the terror attacks start again . . . see what Biden has to say then!
  
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  January 19, 2021 8:19am
  - MCos
    
    They never went away.
    
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:16am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    False-flag “alt-right insurrectionist terror attack” on 20th Jan?
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:59am
    - Batman
      
      Just like all those Antifa rioters who are turning out to be dedicated MAGA followers, eh?
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:10am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        Really? Haven’t heard that fairy tale.
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:18am
      - emmess
        
        Like John Earle Sullivan and possibly hundreds others
        https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2021/01/07/utah-man-with-a-history-of-organizing-blm-protests-was-inside-the-capitol-n2582766
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:31pm
      - Batman
        
        People keep raising Sullivan but haven’t found any more, except for vague claims like yours, yet the avalanche of actual Trumpers is far longer…
        
        Here is a running (and enormous) list of arrests:
        
        “ARRESTED: Couy Griffin, a New Mexico county official & founder of Cowboys for Trump who vowed to return to Washington after last week’s riot at the U.S. Capitol to place a flag on House Speaker @SpeakerPelosi’s desk.”
        
        https://t.co/2fk4EK9S94
        
        https://t.co/iP37i6hDJ3
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:50pm
- Ehlana
  
  In what alternate reality is executing citizens the measure of a nation’s greatness?
  
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  January 19, 2021 8:27am
  - Nukuleka
    
    Many NZers think that executing citizens through aborting the innocent unborn is indeed a sign of a nation’s greatness.
    
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    January 19, 2021 8:32am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Leviticus 24:19 – 21
    
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    January 19, 2021 8:41am
    - Ehlana
      
      Leviticus may have permitted execution Maggie, but it did not make it the measure of the greatness of a nation.
      
      Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”
      and
      Romans 6:23 “For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.”
      
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      January 19, 2021 8:52am
  - kevn
    
    @Eh… US citizens (and the others) are busy killing each other anyway.
    
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    January 19, 2021 8:47am
  - cmm
    
    I don’t advocate the death penalty, but I can understand why some societies choose to use it for extreme cases.
    
    What are the alternatives? Is society better when we let them out after 10 years?
    
    There’s a big difference between executing the worst of the worst and using it like the Middle East and China do.
    
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    January 19, 2021 8:50am
    - fernglas
      
      Capital punishment debases the society in which it is used, in my opinion. More objectively, when a justice system is unable to guarantee the guilt of all those executed but allows the death penalty to be carried out regardless, then it calls the whole system into disrepute. Look up DNA exonerations in the USA.
      “To date, 375 people in the United States have been exonerated by DNA testing, including 21 who served time on death row.”
      
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      January 19, 2021 9:10am
      - cmm
        
        Perhaps you could make a case that capital punishment debases society, but letting extreme crims out after 10 years or less to offend again debases society worse and we have a system where people will go in for a long stretch and come out and offend again.
        
        Quite likely the sweet spot is somewhere in between.
        
        Have you ever considered how different life would be without criminals?
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:12am
      - Harriet
        
        “….. then it calls the whole system into disrepute. Look up DNA exonerations in the USA….”
        
        The inverse then holds true – executions are reputable with dna.
        
        180 people given life sentences in the US and who were released then went on to kill 600 people between them. That’s not a single mistake.
        
        The science is settled. Your argument is out of date. 😎
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:38am
      - fernglas
        
        That would be so if it was only DNA which was involved. False confessions, bad identification and lying jail house snitches are also responsible for a large number of wrongful convictions in capital cases in the US. Is your suggestion that the death penalty should only be imposed in cases where there is DNA? You’ve been watching too much CSI. DNA is the exception rather than the rule in homicide cases. And I’m afraid that courts in the US, UK and here are all agreed that science is never settled.
        
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        January 19, 2021 11:07am
      - Brian McDonald
        
        Harriet, narrow argument but big leap into uncertainty. There have been cases when an innocent person’s DNA has been present in a mixed DNA result with the major contributor being found guilty only for later to be discovered that the minor contributor was the offender.
        
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        January 19, 2021 12:07pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        Just as bad is having people hanging about on death row for 20-30 years then arbitrarily executing them after that torture. Barbarity. Anyone not executed after 10 years should be released unconditionally.
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:42pm
      - Harriet
        
        “….You’ve been watching too much CSI. DNA is the exception rather than the rule in homicide cases…”
        
        You are still almost 600 cases short of an argument.
        
        21 people were wrongly convicted and wrongly got the death sentence. But 150 murderers were released, and over 600 more died. That’s 150 wrong decisions by the government that actually killed people.
        
        Out of the 150 murderers over the last 50yrs plenty should have got the death penalty if their dna had put them well in the frame. That’s if you are allowed to get off the death penalty with dna. It’s called justice. 😎
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:28pm
      - fernglas
        
        Where did you get that figure from? Is it only people for whom the death penalty was available, rather than, say, drug dealers sentenced to life? But your point makes no sense. How many more people were killed by people who were sentenced to prison for less than life? Or by people with no convictions at all? How many people sentenced to life imprisonment didn’t kill anyone after release? And what does that have to do with innocent people being wrongfully sentenced to death?
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:48pm
    - Liberty
      
      Capital punishment of citizens is wrong.
      But only in a third world country like the usa. That condemned convicts rot away on death row for an average 15 yrs. 5 people have been terminated in the last few weeks by a vindictive President on the way out.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:22am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Trump is doing ‘We The People’ a favour. This who get terminated will never murder again. Good job Mr President
        
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        January 19, 2021 4:23pm
  - MCos
    
    Last year there was a total of 17 executions in America.
    At the same time there were about 16,000 homicides.
    
    Leaving aside the moral considerations I’m not exactly sure what these executions achieve?
    It’s certainly not a deterrent.
    
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    January 19, 2021 8:54am
    - Maggie Pie
      
      It certainly prevents recidivism.
      
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      January 19, 2021 9:11am
      - Harriet
        
        That’s if he cares to check the facts between death penalty states and those without. Not are there only less killings but it also costs more to hire a hit man in death penalty states. The same would go for bikies and other criminals who are in the business of illegal business and retribution.
        
        “…Leaving aside the moral considerations I’m not exactly sure what these executions achieve?….”
        
        Women and children are safer. While your sick kind of politics is in danger. 😎
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:37pm
    - Nigel Kearney
      
      It’s either execution or life in prison. Both achieve the outcome of preventing the criminal from victimising anyone else, and allow previous victims and their families to sleep better at night. Execution achieves that with greater certainty and at lower cost.
      
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      January 19, 2021 9:11am
      - Chris R
        
        In principle I agree. The problem I have is that it can be as long as 20 years between the time of the crime and the execution. Therefore is the state actually executing the same person who committed the crime? Some people do redeem themselves while incarcerated.
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:19am
      - MCos
        
        From what I understand it’s an extremely expensive outcome when someone is sentenced to death in America.
        There are currently about 2,500 on death row. Obviously they’re not going to be executed unless there’re very unlucky and in the meantime they are going through an endless string of expensive appeals.
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:37am
      - SB2
        
        Naturally, the collateral damge of those wrongly convicted and executed makes it even more worthwhile .
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:43am
      - kowtow
        
        Chris R
        
        The prisoner might have changed , but his victim was never given a chance to live another minute ………..
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:35am
      - curry4me
        
        Nigel Kearny: I don’t support the death penalty. The state can’t say sorry afterwards if there’s a mistake. They can if its life in prison.
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:38pm
      - Steve Todd
        
        @Chris R @ 9:19AM
        
        I am implacably opposed to capital punishment. But, I also believe there are some convicted murderers (in New Zealand) who should never be released.
        
        I remember the furore surrounding the impending execution of Karla Faye Tucker (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karla_Faye_Tucker), who was executed by the state of Texas on February 3, 1998 – the first woman to be executed in Texas since 1863 – after Governor George W. Bush declined to commute her death sentence.
        
        While in prison, she “found God”. Whether or not that was true, I have no doubt that, after 14½ years in prison, she was a “different”, and better, person, on the day she was executed, than the person she was in June 1983. So yes, she is one person who probably redeemed herself while incarcerated, but when you read what she did, well, for me, it deserved a sentence of life without parole.
        
        Many years ago, I was watching an American TV program, in which the prosecutor, introducing his case against the defendant, said—
        
        “Your Honour, we intend to prove that on [insert date], the defendant, one [insert name], did knowingly, wilfully, unlawfully, purposely, feloniously, deliberately, premeditatedly, with malice aforethought and with a malignant and abandoned heart, kill and murder one [insert name].” (The actor playing the prosecutor reeled that off so flawlessly, I had to record it. Fortunately, I had recorded the program.)
        
        My point is; the defendant was facing the possibility of being convicted of what the Americans refer to as “murder in the first degree”. Any New Zealand defendant facing a murder charge that is proved to comply with that description – say, ambushing someone – deserves to be put away for at least 25 years, if not be given life without parole.
        
        But, there are murders that do not fully comply with the above TV prosecutor’s description, for which a set non-parole period, between 10 and 25 years, is appropriate. It should never just be either execution or life without parole.
        
        We should never forget that the hangings that took place in New Zealand in the 50s, were carried out within three to five months of the murders taking place – not the convictions being brought down; the actual murders. That, in itself, is disgraceful, but there were no appeals, either!
        
        I have read about three of the murders (of four, I think) – two young chaps in Auckland in 1955, and the old chap who was the last person to be hanged in New Zealand (in 1957). In my view, by today’s standards, upon conviction, all three would have been given a non-parole sentence of between 12 and 15 years.
        
        Having said all that, I consider that, on balance, our law allows judges to treat many convicted murderers too leniently.
        
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        January 19, 2021 3:27pm
    - kowtow
      
      ‘It’s certainly not a deterrent.’
      
      Would be if they popped enough of them .
      Same with incarceration . Would work if you kept enough of them in for long enough.
      
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      January 19, 2021 9:15am
  - WaveyDavey
    
    Let’s just remind ourselves what one particular (ex) inmate was responsible for shall we:
    
    “Lisa Montgomery: US executes only woman on federal death row”
    
    Oh the poor wee sausage and a woman! How very dare they?
    
    Her crime?
    
    “…executed on Tuesday for the murder of a 23-year-old woman who was eight months pregnant. In December 2004, Montgomery, who was 36 at the time, strangled Bobbie Jo Stinnett before cutting the baby out of her womb and kidnapping it. Stinnett bled to death.”
    
    Generally I am opposed to the death penalty but it’s hard to see this case as unjustified
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:00am
    - Batman
      
      A truly terrible crime, and full disclosure that I am against the death penalty.
      
      This woman was mentally ill, as diagnosed by the prison’s own medical team, and had been since at least childhood. She should probably have been tried as insane but wasn’t.
      
      So this case was more complex than meets the eye when you highlight the bare facts of the crime itself.
      
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      January 19, 2021 9:07am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        It’s always complex for you BM when it does not support your agenda. Everything else is straightforward when it enables acting-out of TDS.
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:15am
      - Nigel Kearney
        
        Having a mental illness is not necessarily a defence to anything. What matters is whether she knew right from wrong and understood the nature of her actions, which was obvious from the level of long term planning and deceit involved in the commission of the crime.
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:15am
      - SB2
        
        And yet mass murderers like Joesph DeAngelo can plea bargain and avoid death row altogether
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:00am
      - Batman
        
        Another uniquely American thing which benefits those with leverage and fucks over those without any
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:07am
      - Batman
        
        Humper, what the heck has the made up issue of TDS got to do with the death penalty?
        
        Take a chill pill, man.
        
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        January 19, 2021 10:26am
      - WaveyDavey
        
        @SB and here you are with your predictable whataboutery
        
        9 1
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        January 19, 2021 12:08pm
      - WaveyDavey
        
        Mentally ill, maybe but certainly competent enough to manufacture an online persona in order to fool the victim into allowing the muderess into her home
        
        Also competent enough to fake several pregnancies for various reasons
        
        Loopy almost certainly but also completely culpable given the planning that she put into her heinous crime
        
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        January 19, 2021 12:14pm
    - SGA
      
      @Wavey Davey
      
      “Lisa Montgomery: US executes only woman on federal death row”
      …
      Generally I am opposed to the death penalty but it’s hard to see this case as unjustified
      
      I had the opposite reaction Davey. I look at a crime like that, and I reservations about the death penalty – even if the person failed to meet the technical definition of “not guilty” on an insanity defense, I suspect that there is some sort of diminished responsibility going on that should affect sentencing.
      
      Personally, I have less sympathy for someone who kills their spouse for the insurance money or to set an example in the drug world (even though the manner in which the person was killed was less ghastly than in your example).
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:18am
      - WaveyDavey
        
        Ah “diminished responsibility” much the same as “victim of colonisation” which is bandied about in NZ courts eh?
        
        Where do you draw the line on that defence?
        
        Oh, and “less ghastly” FFS She eviscerated a pregnant woman and left her to bleed to death (and presumably in unbearable agony) to steal a child. I can’t think of any mitigation that counts against that; loony-tunes or not.
        
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        January 19, 2021 12:04pm
      - SGA
        
        Where do you draw the line on that defence?
        
        Yep, out in the real world it isn’t easy – I doubt you can draw hard and fast rules and need to take things on a case by case basis. The motivation for her crime was bizarre, what she did to woman was ghastly (I can’t imagine doing that to anyone, can you?), and she had little to no chance of getting away with it. She also has an established history of mental illness. On the face of it, she isn’t playing with a full deck, and I genuinely wonder if she has a complete grasp of reality. Sorry, I don’t see that as the same ballpark as “victim of colonisation”. We will have to agree to disagree.
        
        Insanity defenses require a really high bar in many parts of the USA. For example, I was gobsmacked when Andrea Yates was convicted of murdering her five kids (but at least in that case, the jury chose not to go for the death sentence, and she was eventually released).
        
        As I said above, I have more sympathy for Lisa Montgomery than I do for people who kill for their spouse’s insurance money, as part of some drug dispute, or as some sort of political statement. Again, we will have to agree to disagree.
        
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        January 19, 2021 12:51pm
  - mandk
    
    I know Joe Biden slips into and out of being compos mentis because of his dementia, but the word you are looking for is ‘alternative’.
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:23am
    - Ehlana
      
      Not sure how Joe Biden got into this, though he is American and so, apparently, is the use of alternate as an adjective (alternate route, plan, universe). (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/alternate).
      
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      January 19, 2021 1:37pm
- Chris R
  
  President Trump has jurisdiction only over the Federal Executions. All of those set down for January 2021 have been carried out. (The others for this month are the responsibility of individual states and interestingly of those five there has been 2 repreivals and 3 stays.) Not one of the Federal Executions was for an offence involving terrorism but were all breaches of criminal codes.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:09am
- tf78
  
  Maggie, has Joe forgotten about Covid already or are they going to vaccinate each and every one of them.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:44am
- theoldbloke
  
  I do wish people would research stuff before they burst in to print.
  Death penalties in USA are divided in to State Law executions and federal law executions.
  The Death penalty is decided by the Jury
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_by_the_United_States_federal_government#Legal_process
  Final appeal against the sentence is by the Supreme Court
  The President has the ability to apply clemency, same as State Governors.
  
  So to be pedantic. The President does not authorise the execution.
  
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  January 19, 2021 4:54pm
kowtow

Across the Media Pardy commentary pages I’ve noticed a push to label Trump as a fascist . These are opinion pieces penned by academics etc

No mistake , that is a less than subtle attempt to further legitimise the Antifa ,far left violent methods movement .

This while the same media are doing all they can to claim that the Trump march to the Capitol was an “insurrection” and coup attempt , which is also a contemptible ‘big lie’ by the media.

Note too all the stories and preparations , vastly exagerated, about the threat of violence for the inauguration . This is part of the theatre to show how potentially evil the Trump camp is , a legacy of division and disfunction .
And finally once again we see the Media Pardy christening an incoming Democrat president elect , following an ousted Republican as nothing less than a miracle working “healing” , all embracing Messiah.

We’re being played , bigly . And if that doesn’t stick out to you like the proverbial dog’s bollocks then you’re an ostrich with your head up your bum.
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January 19, 2021 8:26am
- Fletch
  
  Yep as Matt Walsh wrote yesterday –
  
  One of my dad’s most common refrains, if ever he caught one of his children trying to deceive him, was “Don’t insult my intelligence.” It’s bad enough, he would say, for us to do whatever wrong thing we were trying to cover up, and it’s even worse that we chose to lie about it. But the final and perhaps worst indignity is that we would lie in such a blatant and obvious manner, insulting his intelligence by assuming that he would fall for the ruse.
  
  As a parent myself now, I can relate to how he felt. My four-year-old son recently looked me straight in the eye, while holding a blue crayon and standing next to a blue scribble on the wall, and insisted that he did not cause the scribble and has no idea how it might have ended up there. But I can also relate as a citizen of this country. In this capacity, we are lied to all of the time, especially in recent months, and what makes the lies all the worse is how obvious, and thus insulting, they are.
  
  https://www.dailywire.com/news/walsh-as-biden-prepares-to-take-office-democrat-leaders-are-suddenly-interested-in-opening-the-economy-again
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:04am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  I anticipate a false flag. From what I can see, the only people talking about some vague threat of violent gatherings on inauguration day is the MSM. In contrast, from what remains of the right side of Twitter for instance, the message seems to be “stay away from DC on the 20th.” Pumps are being primed.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:06am
  - Batman
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Priming yourself and others to explain away any violence from your fascist friends I see ?
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:32am
    - RiP NZ
      
      R’tard.
      You’ve gone full r’tard
      
      18 2
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      January 19, 2021 10:57am
    - Libertarians are right
      
      The second Trump won in 2016, the Left in the US started claiming that he won’t leave when he loses in 2020 and will blame it on election fraud.
      
      Based on your argument, they were just priming everyone to explain away any accusations of impropriety from the Democrats during the 2020 election.
      
      Maybe your statement is just priming yourself and others to explain away any potential false flag?
      
      That argument could go on forever.
      
      The fact is that there are Americans who would be willing to do this on both sides. The fact is that a false flag is possible, as is far right nutjobs doing it.
      
      6 2
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      January 19, 2021 3:27pm
      - Batman
        
        I think that was more because it was clear to those who looked at Trump’s psyche, and he said it in both 2016 and 2020, that he is pathologically unable to accept losing. This all goes back to his father and being told that losers were the worst kind of people and only winners are worthy.
        
        He has spent his life manufacturing ‘wins’ via any means necessary, legal and illegal, moral and immoral.
        
        False flags never turn out to be true. They are always the figment of imagination for those wanting to deny and distract reality. From 9/11 to Sandy Hook to white supremacist terrorism.
        
        Aside from anything else, false flags never happen because they would require a level of organization and discretion which is simply not possible in this day and age. Just Google the mathematics required for the moon landing to be kept as a conspiracy, it was mathematically impossible for it to have been a conspiracy.
        
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        January 19, 2021 4:40pm
- oldfella
  
  kowtow: remember it’s different when the left do it. As this article explains.
  ++
  The violent intrusion into the Capitol was met with near-universal condemnation worldwide, including by virtually every media outlet, broadcaster and commentator.
  Yet the language on display from much of the media yesterday was a sharp departure from rhetoric deployed by journalists last summer at the height of the Black Lives Matter-led riots and violence that gripped the country intermittently for several months.
  https://justthenews.com/accountability/media/black-lives-matter-boomerang-how-media-flipped-script-violent-protests-after
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:33am
- curry4me
  
  kowtow: The NPC media says ‘orange man bad’, and president GaGa good.
  
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  January 19, 2021 1:41pm
I remember when

So how many Alt Right Extremists are there to just go home.
They appear to be like the ‘reds under the beds’ very hard to find other than as a ‘fear’ factor.
Whole news items on increasing fanciful speculation about the potential danger. A danger that is always present with any US President.
The ground is being prepared for what the ‘left’ intend to make a long reign.
There are only two directions according to media articles read lately – Right, which is really Left or Wrong which always means Right which is Alt Right Extremist.
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January 19, 2021 8:27am
- tf78
  
  I ru, aka normal, rational thinking people.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:56am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  We and anyone else harbouring dissenting opinions are all “insurrectionists” now, apparently. Terrorists who need to be rooted out . Better than a “racist homophobe” though, I suppose …
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:08am
  - Batman
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    They stormed the seat of government in a “revolution” of their own making. Therefore they are insurrectionist.
    
    A large majority are also still racist homophobes who wish to discriminate against people of colour and LGBTQ people.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:13am
- oldfella
  
  IRW: talking of alt-right extremists…
  +++
  A dangerous, far-right extremist has suggested that we treat people of all races equally, shocked and horrified sources confirmed Friday.
  The hateful bigot has been canceled for his controversial comments that people should be treated with respect no matter their skin color.
  https://babylonbee.com/news/far-right-extremist-suggests-treating-people-of-all-races-equally
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:36am
stephen2d

It must have been missed from the “leader of the world” thread and my claim that Boris will not finish the year as the PM, to which David offers a wager, so here is my reply here:
@David Garrett: with pleasure. I don’t particularly care whether he is or isn’t the PM. I am in the UK now, and there is a growing anger at Boris even from within the Conservatives. I don’t bet money, but any Central Otago Pinot Noir, and the bet is on!
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January 19, 2021 8:36am
- lifesgood
  
  Don’t waste a bet. Most of us didn’t think Jacinda would last her last term and look at her now. Simply unbelievable. There is no accounting for the stupidity of the sheeple.
  
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  January 19, 2021 3:01pm
Padriv Ustoev

Just got a ticket for going 105kmh on a state highway up north during the holidays.
5kms over. Cool cool cool NZ police. Good to know that speed rules arbitrarily change throughout the year. Cool cool cool.
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January 19, 2021 8:37am
- fernglas
  
  I think they said they have decided to abolish all tolerances. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/122592414/zero-tolerance-on-speeding-drivers-all-year-round-as-copsmotorists-get-tough-on-
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:13am
- crikey
  
  If your speedometer showed 105 then your true speed was about 102. Speedometers (in NZ) over-read by about 3%.
  
  So, you were ticketed for doing 102.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:16am
  - Colville
    
    Exactly wrong.
    
    If he was ticketed for 105 he was doing 108 at least.
    
    The Police gear is wound back so it reads under so they KNOW they have you at the number on their screens.
    
    Ie: I was ticketed at 119 and as doing closer to 130.
    With a trailer 🙁
    and a warning for not carrying my licence.
    But he was impressed I could remember my DL number 🙂
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:07am
    - Ian Boag
      
      I doubt that police gear is “wound back”. It just reads the right number. Your speedo is based on rpm and tyre radius and stuff, but the radar just reads how fast you are going. Same if you measure it with a GPS in the car ….
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:17am
      - Colville
        
        I disagree.
        If their gear reads 105 and there is a +/- tolerance of say 2 then their screen will say 103.
        They know you are doing AT LEAST that much and it cant be challenged.
        
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        January 19, 2021 11:11am
      - WaveyDavey
        
        GPS is by no means accurate as it make no account of increases and decreases in elevation just distance between points
        
        Easy enough to illustrate with a triangle: the hypotenuse is the distance you travel but GPS measures the shortest side.
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:14pm
    - Batman
      
      130 with a trailer is fucking irresponsible. You should by rights have had your licence stripped for doing 40 over the speed limit of 90.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:34am
      - Colville
        
        Cry me a river snowflake.
        
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        January 19, 2021 11:12am
      - Batman
        
        I do a fair bit of driving with a trailer and while seeing silly idiots like you is on the one hand concerning, it’s almost nice to know that eventually the small penis syndrome that you’re making up for will come back to bite you.
        
        Enjoy your eventual comeuppance!
        
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        January 19, 2021 11:19am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        Andrew Little, is that you?
        
        16 2
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        January 19, 2021 11:44am
      - Zapper
        
        Seriously, Batman is a moderator??? Amazing
        
        18 2
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        January 19, 2021 1:52pm
      - Batman
        
        That speed with a trailer is seriously irresponsible. And literally criminal ?
        
        Views my own and differ from moderation tasks, of course.
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:56pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Your views may differ Batman but you certainly seem to get a little more leeway in how you express yours compared to me for example.
        
        Yes I know, whinge to David ………..
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:07pm
      - Batman
        
        “fucking irresponsible” is not quite the same as some of what you try to post, my vertically enhanced friend.
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:21pm
      - Loddenthinks
        
        I find myself in the uncomfortable and incredibly surprising position of agreeing with you 100%.
        
        We live in strange times BM.
        
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        January 19, 2021 2:17pm
      - Tall Man
        
        I think we both know Batman that my posts have not been as issue at all in fact I have had less than half a dozen posts deleted in recent months and yes I have spoken with David.
        
        When I see a comment of mine deleted with exactly the same comment posted by another I think the issue is not my communication skills at all.
        
        Recently some of your comments directed at other posters with whom you disagree have been borderline at best and under my pseudonym would have definitely been deleted.
        
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        January 19, 2021 9:16pm
    - rangitoto
      
      If you have sat nav or a passenger with a smart phone, you can compare your real speed from the GPS with the speedo speed. In my car 106 on the dial is actually 100km/hr on the GPS.
      
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      January 19, 2021 12:18pm
      - david
        
        Mine is 4kph variance across the speed range.
        
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        January 19, 2021 1:41pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Checking against a GPS, every speedo I have bothered to check reads 5% high. So one would not be surprised that if the actual speed was 105, the speedo would have read 110 ….
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:15am
  - Tall Man
    
    That is not correct at all. We have three cars at the moment and the two largest currently have accurate speedos which compared with both gps’s we have in use.
    
    They are running realtively new tyres which would help.
    
    The Fiat reads about 2kms above the gps on the speedometer.
    
    Maybe Japanese cars oiver read to make up for the poor handling and ugly design 😉
    
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    January 19, 2021 2:05pm
- calendar girl
  
  At 105 kph (margin of error territory?), it’s dumb to issue a ticket when a good talking-to would be equally effective.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:32am
  - DeepBlue
    
    If the ticket says 105 the speedometer would show 108. The Police were very vocal about removing all tolerances last year.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:04am
    - kowtow
      
      ‘The Police were very vocal about removing all tolerances last year.’
      
      Just wondering if that vocality (?) makes it OK for them to to turn on an otherwise very law abiding public ?
      
      “The ability of the police to perform their duties is dependent upon public approval of police actions.”
      Sir Robert Peel
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:25am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      road toll going up steadily so their doctrinaire focus on speeding (really just revenue gathering) is obviously working brilliantly.
      
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      January 19, 2021 7:17pm
  - Padriv Ustoev
    
    Yeah but they can’t collect $30 if it’s just a talking to.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:08am
  - redflagged
    
    A good talking to? It’s not PB4L in schools and talk about our feelings, everyone will have a sob story.
    
    Then people will continue to speed 6 minutes later. i.e. next to no consequences for actions, and then gloat about getting off a ticket.
    
    Serious Demerits would be the way to go, then crush cars if caught driving without a license, if not making it a pure financial learning experience.
    
    Driving whilst disqualified is the biggest joke there is on NZ roads. Punishment’s need to have teeth (time to crush), at the moment they just disqualify you for more time solving nothing but rewarding negative behaviours.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:27am
  - virtualmark
    
    It’s quite hard for a camera to give you a good talking to.
    
    7 1
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    January 19, 2021 10:37am
  - curry4me
    
    calendar girl: That doesn’t generate any dosh for the government though. So, it’s ticket time.
    
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    January 19, 2021 1:45pm
- redflagged
  
  Limit: a restriction on the size or amount of something permissible.
  
  100kmh is the maximum limit, not the minimum limit. Getting away with it previously isn’t a great argument.
  
  Maybe we should crush cars for going 1kmh over. It will only take 173 idiots to get their cars crushed on Day 1 then people may never speed (drive over the limit) again.
  
  More lives saved in a month than Covid’s killed in a year in NZ.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:17am
  - Padriv Ustoev
    
    Yeah. Crush cars for going 1km over the limit makes total sense and doesn’t sound like the onset of old age dementia at all.
    
    13 1
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    January 19, 2021 11:46am
- septic skeptic
  
  My wife got ticketed on her trip back from Northland. On a downhill section of the toll road – the only proper four lane divided highway on the whole trip. Doubtless a good place for revenue gathering, but spare us the bullshit about trying to improve road safety.
  
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  January 19, 2021 12:24pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  Pretty sure the speed limit of 100 kph hasn’t changed at all. You acknowledge breaking the speed limit by 5 kph.
  
  You have no defence at all. Stop whining, pay up and stick to the limit if you don;t want the uniform branch of the IRD to extract more hard-earned from your wallet.
  
  Full disclosure: I often exceed the speed limit. I think I’m a safe driver but I might be wrong. When I get a speeding ticket I pay up and shut up, it was my choice to exceed the limit. Nobody held a gun to my head. It’s called owning your shit. Try it. Cool?
  
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  January 19, 2021 2:14pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Tax. If you want to go fast, you have to pay the Tax. Safety my left tit
  
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  January 19, 2021 4:28pm
cmm

$1uff-but-I-want-90-cents-back is running a new campaign selling the idea that the contact tracing system is a shield against infection.

I can’t be the only one that feels that misinformation turns people off the message.

The degree of confusing messaging is extreme. So much so that you really can’t take it seriously.

We’re told that you need to be close to someone for 15 minutes (which is the basis of social distancing). We’re told that the virus travels in large droplets which fall on the ground if you’re more than 2 metres away.

Now they’re saying you need to scan because you might walk past a courier in the lobby of a building or walking past someone in a supermarket.

Ok, what is it?

This is not science that’s for sure.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/123966930/stop-scanner-time-on-the-push-to-get-every-kiwi-scanning-every-time
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January 19, 2021 8:40am
- BAM
  
  They’re not doing it for free.
  The constant stream of Covid awareness advertising is one of the ways the government is paying the media.
  
  35 2
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  January 19, 2021 8:58am
  - Nickc2
    
    Another is that new-age Maori speak advert about V8 cars and alcohol. Geez, is that grose.
    
    19 1
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    January 19, 2021 10:03am
- Yvette
  
  Cmm
  If one person (me, perhaps – since I am one of a dozen old people left in New Zealand who does not actually have a cell phone) does not scan the shop code or have bluetooth on (whatever that is) can result in a freeze frame that “Stops Summer”, as we are so often shown in those absolutely unscientific television commercials, consider how many people must have proceeded the character they are showing, who have not complied with the requirement, so summer must have already stopped months ago.
  
  That would be back about the time any election PR value dropped off for Ardern to have daily 1pm television exposure as Saviour Saint of New Zealand, and media announcements covered two days, then – as now – often refer to “over the past three days”.
  
  Isn’t the drop-off in media PR and the drop-off it now reflects in interest or urgency, called an “own-goal” or something like that?
  Should the general public be somehow blamed for the growing lack of interest that the Government itself displays?
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:02am
  - calendar girl
    
    Speaking of PM Ardern, where is she presently? And is she – 3 weeks and 4 days after Christmas Day – still on her annual leave? (I hope that she has found such break enjoyable and refreshing.)
    
    As a matter of interest, how much annual leave is a New Zealand Prime Minister entitled to, contractually, under his or her appointment contract / conditions?
    
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    January 19, 2021 12:08pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Can sh please have the rest of the year off too–it’s been peaceful for a while.
      
      8 1
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      January 19, 2021 1:50pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Very little of this is science. More like factoids, hand-picked to support the alarmist narrative, and then force fed to the masses via state-funded media sycophants.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:04am
  - SB2
    
    krazykiwi, were you not one of them hailing Sweden’s herd immunity approach a stunning success?
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:47am
    - rangitoto
      
      Says the poster who claimed CV19 was no threat.
      
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      January 19, 2021 12:33pm
      - SB2
        
        ????
        
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        January 19, 2021 3:22pm
- Ehlana
  
  I thought scanning was for cases like mine, when I went to a coffee shop and then discovered someone who was positive had been there at the same time. We could well have been sitting within 2m of each other for 15 minutes or more.
  
  I agree the evolving Covid situation is confusing; I think the theory at the moment is to test anyone who may have come into contact (however briefly) in the hope of identifying any cases as soon as possible and containing it.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:10am
  - tf78
    
    Ehlana, there seems to be some skepticism because of all the false positives from the PCR tests. So how much faith should the people actually have in the testing. All the so called ‘positive’ tests in our quarantine facilities yet as far as I know there’s been no deaths nor hospital admissions. What gives?!
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:26am
    - MCos
      
      On that basis do you just let everyone through?
      I read once that kerbside drug testing of drugs found in cars on the TV show Cops is only 50% accurate.
      On that basis do you just let everyone off?
      
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      January 19, 2021 11:26am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Where did the ’15 minutes’ come from?
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:17am
  - cmm
    
    15 minutes was one of the numbers bandied about at one time.
    
    You don’t get infected just walking past someone without a mask on. You need to pick up a substantial viral load (probably millions of the little sods – depending on your current health). Unless someone sneezes straight in your face this takes a while.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:01am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Note to self: avoid a substantial load straight to the face, and all shall be well. Note ends.
      
      14 1
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      January 19, 2021 10:10am
    - artemisia
      
      Wellington had a plan, partly executed, to remove parking spaces and place road cones on the road edge to widen footpaths because covid panic. Paid for by ratepayers of course. Council pulled its head in eventually. Not sure if there was a plan to widen the rainbow pedestrian crossing.
      
      Think I recall it happening in parts of Auckland though.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:13am
- redflagged
  
  I’ve laid a complaint with the Advertising Standards Authority, in regards to them saying “So let’s all start scanning again and keep everyone safe.” Basically, how scanning QR codes will stop you getting the virus.
  
  under sections
  
  Rule 1 (g) Fear and distress, where advertisements must not exploit superstitious or vulnerable audiences. In this case as well, Stuff.co.nz has used a cartoon kiwi to attract older viewers (light’s out) and kids.
  
  Rule 2 (a) requires that all advertisements are readily recognised as such. It’s disguised as a “news campaign”.
  
  Under Rule 2 (b) Truthful presentation, stuff.co.nz needs to explain with evidence how an individual scanning QR codes, protects them from contracting Covid-19
  
  Under Rule 2 (e) Advocacy advertising, Evidence (e.g. academic studies, expert opinion) in support of factual information must be appropriate and robust and must be readily available and obtainable, of which Stuff.co.nz failed to provide.
  
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  January 19, 2021 11:28am
Paulus

I understand that in yesterrday’s Herald there were 14 anti Trump articles.
Is this a record ?
I have not take this rag for years.
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January 19, 2021 8:42am
- alloytoo
  
  Haven’t needed the Herald since my son’s bird died.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:21am
- Fletch
  
  Well shoot, you should see the NewsHub feed on Facebook. They have well and truly swallowed the liberal Kool-Aid. Just regurgitating anti-Trump stories from overseas one after the other. Even 1 News isn’t that bad.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:08am
- BananaLlama
  
  Trump sells big it gets everyone foaming at the mouth.
  They probably look at the analytics and see that they get more interactions on a single article about Trump than they do for every other snore piece.
  Another big draw is housing, anything to do with houses prices and you see all the bald little zoomers gnashing wailing about living in rental purgatory.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:11am
Maggy Wassilieff

Essential Workers coming to NZ

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2021/jan/19/i-cannot-wait-rupaul-and-michelle-visage-to-judge-drag-race-down-under-in-new-zealand
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January 19, 2021 8:52am
- Padriv Ustoev
  
  Yes, that’s what we need. Let’s let let in foreign transvestites into the country ahead of our own citizens and perm residents.
  So stunning, brave and compassionate.
  
  49 1
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  January 19, 2021 9:09am
- Charmaine Hawke
  
  Yea and in the meantime we are telling clients that if they want to go overseas to see a dying relative then March is the earliest we can get them home.
  We also have the rediculous situation of MIQ spots not being available yet past the end of March and booking travel is almost impossible. People need to realise there are many reasons people travel and having to say goodbye to Mum, Dad or any dying relative via FaceTime is cruel.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:21am
- alloytoo
  
  Why do you need to judge a drag race?
  
  The car that reaches the finish line first wins. (or posts the fastest time)
  
  Burnout competitions are generally judged by spectator acclaim.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:23am
  - NoCash
    
    LOL… I assume you’re taking the piss 🙂
    
    5 1
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    January 19, 2021 11:27am
  - Pharmachick
    
    Your sarcasm font is showing
    
    4 0
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    January 19, 2021 1:02pm
  - Sacha
    
    @ alloytoo: That was my first reaction too – haha.
    
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    January 19, 2021 3:05pm
- cmm
  
  Have you seen what the skills shortage list looks like?
  
  Apparently Auckland has an immediate need for snow sports instructors
  
  https://skillshortages.immigration.govt.nz/assets/uploads/immediate-skill-shortage-list.pdf
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:08am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    And no mention of rain dancers…?
    
    10 0
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    January 19, 2021 11:25am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Snow Planet prob now forced by Health and Safety to have technicians
    
    2 1
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    January 19, 2021 4:32pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  The cultural war needs a boost
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:30am
- Master Mariner
  
  Its pretty dis heartening seeing all sorts coming in when there are 10 people I know personally who are spending months at sea keeping International Trade going knowing full well the “roll of the dice” dictates whether you can get back into NZ.
  Unfortunately until the Wharehouse empties of goods or the prices of goods increases out of reach then and only then will NZ accept Seafarers as Key workers.
  https://www.offshore-energy.biz/45-countries-designated-seafarers-as-key-workers/#:~:text=Forty%2Dfive%20IMO%20Member%20States,the%20ongoing%20crew%20change%20crisis.&text=The%20situation%20has%20become%20a,ports%20closed%20to%20crew%20changes.
  
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  January 19, 2021 12:35pm
  - Master Mariner
    
    Wahoo.
    
    NZ has finally accepted Seafarers as Key workers.
    https://www.hellenicshippingnews.com/bimco-covid-19-weekly-report/
    
    Now time for action. Keep you posted.
    
    https://www.bimco.org/-/media/bimco/ships-ports-and-voyage-planning/crew-support/health/novel-coronavirus-2019/imo-circular-letter-no4204add35.ashx
    
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    January 19, 2021 1:07pm
Maggie Pie

‘New Blog’……

“I don’t think it is an exaggeration to say that Trump will go down as the worst President in US history – at the very least in my lifetime”
– Don Brash (80) NZ Chairman. Commercial Bank of Chynaa.

LOL!!! 😀
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January 19, 2021 9:08am
- SGA
  
  Well, what do you expect if you read such left wing propaganda.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:17am
- Andrei
  
  He is pretty tone deaf
  
  The worst president evah had presided over the lowest unemployment rate in the USA in 60 years , didn’t start any wars and negotiated 4 peace deals in the Middle East among other things
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:19am
  - oldfella
    
    Andrei, in lefty land, those accomplishments still make Trump the worse president ever.
    Just cos… he’s Trump.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:44am
- Inandout
  
  Don washes his own socks.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:24am
- alloytoo
  
  I suspect Biden will hold that dubious honour before too long.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:24am
- Wayne Mapp
  
  So who is worse since, say 1960?
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:36am
  - Padriv Ustoev
    
    Obama for example or Bush junior. Iraq war, hello!
    
    21 1
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    January 19, 2021 9:48am
  - cmm
    
    I suppose it depends on how you are going to measure it and what importance you set on various factors.
    
    Who has made the most war?
    Who has made the most peace?
    Who has kept his dick in his pants?
    Who has been the best for employment?
    Who has been the best for black employment?
    Who has been the best for promoting UN?
    Who has been the best for the military industrial complex?
    Who has been the best for the swamp?
    etc etc etc.
    
    You really can’t just say “who’s the best/worst” without deciding how you’re going to measure.
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:49am
  - SB2
    
    Umm, you could well be seriously challenging MP’s general knowledge.
    
    2 31
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    January 19, 2021 9:49am
  - Andrei
    
    What exactly did Donald Trump do Dr Mapp that makes his Presidency so dreadful?
    
    Can you point to just one thing that makes Donald Trump’s presidency so disasterous?
    
    37 6
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    January 19, 2021 9:53am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Decency, Andrei, decency. Sure, send the country inexorably down the toilet for generations to come in accord with powerful sponsoring special interests, but, for God’s sake, at least be “decent” while you’re doing it!
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:17am
      - Sacha
        
        If we chucked out all the ‘decent’ politicians, we wouldn’t have a government anywhere.
        There is always an element of self-service in anyone who seeks public office, but they are often (not always) the people who get things done.
        
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        January 19, 2021 3:11pm
    - Wayne Mapp
      
      The few weeks cancels out all the good that he has done.
      
      The one thing that is a bottom line for anyone committed to democracy is to accept the election results. Of course Trump was entitled to contest specific results, but that had all played out by the time the Electoral College met on December 14. After that Trump debased the meaning of democracy.
      
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      January 19, 2021 1:18pm
      - cmm
        
        “debased the meaning of democracy”
        
        Again, a very abstract nothing. How about something specific.
        
        11 3
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        January 19, 2021 1:40pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        It’s also customary for the opponent not to cheat. When I can detect fraud here from NZ those who are closer are staring it in the face. “Decency”?
        
        The cost of the deception is yet to be paid.
        
        16 3
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        January 19, 2021 1:56pm
  - NoFax
    
    Not only was Obama far worse but when it comes to foreign policy Trump will be seen as one of the best Presidents in the modern era.
    
    Despite the rhetoric from the Left, China is the biggest threat and not Russia. It is time we realized that too. Also Trump wound down wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and secured a number of peace deals in the middle east and between Serbia and Kosovo.
    
    What did Obama do? Drone strike weddings mostly.
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:59am
    - Batman
      
      This is an extremely simplistic take, which is why you’ve come to such a black and white conclusion.
      
      Trump has been terrible but also good in some ways.
      
      Obama was kinda useless but also good in some ways.
      
      Neither will be remembered as the greatest, unless one is a shameless partisan for either.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:09am
      - NoFax
        
        I disagree – Trump’s foreign policy will be followed by the next few presidents, even Biden. It is simplistic because we are writing a few lines and not a dissertation. Looking at results – such as peace deals, Trump exceeds Obama and many other presidents.
        
        He was “terrible” only because the media label all Republicans as such. They accused John McCain of been a Nazi and Mitt Rommey a sexist.
        
        16 2
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        January 19, 2021 11:26am
    - amospicton
      
      Obama’s legacy is the Trump presidency. Without Obama there would have been no orange-man in the White House.
      
      17 1
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      January 19, 2021 11:03am
      - Mike
        
        True. Trumpism is largely a backlash against the horror of having a black man in the white house.
        
        4 9
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        January 19, 2021 4:31pm
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    Depends on what ‘worse’ means.
    
    If it means what sort of human being they are, morally, socially, and intellectually, then I agree Trump is worst.
    
    If it means how have their actions impacted the overall happiness and standard of living of the people they represent compared to what an average President would have done, it is too soon to really evaluate Trump, but I doubt he could be worse than LBJ.
    
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    January 19, 2021 9:59am
    - Fletch
      
      LOL. Trump is “morally” worse than Obama? Really? As far as I see, most of Trump’s policies have been moral. And his stands.
      
      21 5
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      January 19, 2021 10:10am
    - curry4me
      
      Nigel Kearny: LBJ was a mixed bag. On one hand there is the Great Society program which started paying children to have children. On the other is asking DARPA to begin work on what eventually became the internet.
      
      1 3
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      January 19, 2021 1:54pm
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    “Worse” for whom, is the pertinent question. Trump probably was the worst president ever, if one is a paid up (or bought?) member of the political status quo.
    
    17 4
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    January 19, 2021 10:13am
  - kowtow
    
    Talking of wars and Prez’s :
    
    Note current Media Pardy theme . Trump , who did promise to pull the troops out , is now laying a cynical ambush for Biden , by doing what he long promised to , pulling the troops out .
    
    The Media Pardy, who all were against an international policeman , militarist , adventurist USA , is now in favour of same ,if it’s done by Biden .
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:30am
    - MCos
      
      Punctuation and spelling are not your strong points, cobber, to the extent they distract from whatever point you’re trying to get across.
      Apologies if you feel I’m being pedantic.
      
      5 9
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      January 19, 2021 11:37am
- oldfella
  
  The same Don Brash who was nearly our Prime Minister after almost toppling Helen.
  Don’t agree with him about Trump, but applaud his unflagging commitment to equal treatment for all Kiwis, and free speech.
  BTW, wonder if he’s pitched those ideas to the Commercial Bank of Chynaa, which I’m sure is controlled behind the scenes by the CCP.
  Probably not.
  
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  January 19, 2021 11:00am
- emmess
  
  Biden is already the worst president of my lifetime.
  
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  January 19, 2021 1:36pm
Surely Knott

News During Trump’s Presidency when he wasn’t silenced by Twitter….

18 Dec 2020 NZ Herald. Headline “Covid 19 coronavirus : Myths debunked as conspiracies resurface online”

Said, “Myth” “Social media users and fringe websites weaved together a conspiracy theory that the virus was leaked – either accidentally or intentially – from a lab in Wuhan, China, before the World Health Organisation declared Covid – 19 a pandemic in March. The falsehood was espoused by elected officials including Trump.
The origins of the virus are far less scandalous it likely originated in nature. Bats are thought to be the original or intermediary hosts…. Yet the conspiracy theory continues to travel online, and made a resurgence in september when a Chinese virologist repeated the claim on fox news.”

19/1/2021. Biden’s presidency, election finalised, guards installed, election banners hung, Trump and his supporters have been removed from Social Media.

NZ Herald reports today, “Wuhan virus lab scientist thought to be ‘patient zero’ still missing”

“Huang Yanling, who worked at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, was one of scores of doctors, scientists, activists and journalists who disappeared during the Chinese Communist Party’s suspected cover-up.” “During the early weeks of the outbreak last February, rumours swirled on Chinese social media that the graduate student was “patient zero”, creating a direct link between the controversial lab and the virus outbreak. Chinese officials quickly stepped in to censor the reports from the internet.”

So it was leaked from the lab. I love how the story just changes but without any admission of error.
It wasn’t just chinese officials who covered up. It should say chinese officials with the help of worldwide mainstream media quickly stepped in to censor AND spin claims it may have leaked from the lab using their usual tactics of name calling and censorship and deflection.

Now new president new truths. New reality.
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January 19, 2021 9:37am
WaynelSexton

Democratic politicians are afraid to enter Washington DC
https://nypost.com/2021/01/18/andrew-cuomo-skipping-biden-inauguration-over-capitol-threats/

They recognize what’s going on. Why don’t you?
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January 19, 2021 9:49am
- kowtow
  
  I recognise political theatre , for that’s what it is .
  
  As to Cuomo , the media have left him off the hook for sending covid patients from hospital to care homes where carnage ensued . But of course that’s Trumps’ fault , innit.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:32am
- Batman
  
  Wayne you’re setting yourself up for a huge disappointment.
  
  And I see that the Pelosi laptop which you all crowed was with the FBI and she was sure to be arrested…. It turns out a MAGA terrorist stole it and was going to sell it to the Russians!
  
  Talk about a cliche that neatly sums up the traitorous nature of the MAGA movement and Trumpism in general.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:37am
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Batman,
    Somehow you have got a bit confused about where I stand. I have consistently opposed Trump. I am probably in a similar camp to Senators Collins and Romney.
    
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    January 19, 2021 1:21pm
    - Batman
      
      Oh no sorry Wayne I’m not replying to you but to waynelsextion.
      
      Definitely not aimed at you at all, good sir.
      
      4 12
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      January 19, 2021 1:53pm
DeepBlue

Helen Clark interim Covid report: calling for ‘Global Reset’at WHO and more funding.
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January 19, 2021 10:08am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Leftists can be guaranteed to always want more funding to go to whoever is doing a poor job. Those canapés won’t pay for themselves.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:22am
Fletch

I see that one of the first things Biden will do will be to cancel the Keystone XL Pipeline. He will wage a war on fossil fuel like never before, and watch the price of fuel go up while the U.S loses its energy independence and has to rely on the Middle East for oil again.
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January 19, 2021 10:11am
Fletch

Melania Trump Farewell Message.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCHYHVB_QyA

Now that, Democrats, is how you make a unifying speech.
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January 19, 2021 10:12am
- Batman
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Hollow words while her husband refuses to concede, and they both refuse to meet with the new President and his wife.
  
  To paraphrase Melania, “who gives a fuck about unity? But I have to do these things, you know?”
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:16am
  - Inandout
    
    Bat, do you honestly think Joe would remember any meeting with Donald? CNN are crowing that Joe intends to start working the afternoon of the 20th because he has ‘mountains of paperwork’. Cue to Oval Office: ‘Joe, we have sorted all that paperwork for you, nothing to worry about, nap nap time’. ‘Well ok Kamala, I do feel a tad tired after all those words on the prompter being so small’.
    
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    January 19, 2021 10:25am
  - Fletch
    
    Democrats, and being “uniting” –
    
    https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=saved&v=444000876756843
    
    9 3
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    January 19, 2021 10:28am
    - Fletch
      
      ie, Melania might privately pass a comment about having to be uniting (a comment that no one should ever have heard) but when it comes down to it, she actually is in her public words and deeds. In contrast, the Democrats talk about being uniting (it is the theme of Biden’s inauguration, apparently) but blatantly do the opposite right in your face, in public.
      
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      January 19, 2021 10:44am
    - Batman
      
      Random facebook videos?
      
      No thanks, Facebook boomer.
      
      4 28
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      January 19, 2021 10:47am
    - amospicton
      
      The Democats have not done a single thing post election in order to unite. Quite the opposite in fact.
      
      18 2
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      January 19, 2021 11:07am
      - Batman
        
        It was very disappointing that the Democrats selfishly failed to unite behind the revolution to overthrow democracy and install Trump as ruler.
        
        A disgraceful lack of unity.
        
        3 27
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        January 19, 2021 11:10am
      - alloytoo
        
        They’re too busy making a list of 75 Million deplorables.
        
        Twitter and Facebook are busy trying to figure out how to make their platforms compulsory like unions.
        
        8 2
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        January 19, 2021 1:08pm
    - Surely Knott
      
      Good watch. Thanks for the link Fletch.
      
      10 4
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      January 19, 2021 11:21am
  - Sacha
    
    Gosh, Bats, are you really as nasty as you sound?
    Maybe you are.
    
    6 2
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    January 19, 2021 3:27pm
    - Batman
      
      No, just delivering reality in an unvarnished format.
      
      1 9
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      January 19, 2021 4:41pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    BATMAN. This is a Woman who left Socialism, became an American Citizen, and now finds herself being surrounded by Socialism.
    Your paraphrase is repugnant, and I have no problem informing you of that
    
    7 2
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    January 19, 2021 4:59pm
    - MCos
      
      ‘Surrounded by socialism’
      
      ?????
      
      1 3
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      January 19, 2021 5:28pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Please pay attention to the American left.
        Whooooossshhh.
        AOC, Nancy, Ilhan, Horizontal Harris.
        Shall I say these are not socialist?
        
        5 3
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        January 19, 2021 6:09pm
- curry4me
  
  Fletch: Thanks for that link. I just do YT on library PCs. Melania is the best First Lady since Jackie.
  
  10 2
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  January 19, 2021 2:05pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    That Jackie was married to the last true Democrat, and look what the fucking Dems did to him
    
    5 3
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    January 19, 2021 5:04pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      […], and look what the fucking Dems did to him[.]
      
      Wot? Do you think the type of people in the CIA and the Mafia, who took out JFK, were Dems? I’m going to be nice to you, Steve, and simply say, you are misinformed.
      
      I’m going to leave it at that.
      
      1 1
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      January 19, 2021 7:56pm
- tf78
  
  Fletch, she is one fine Lady. I watched some clips of her in her “Be Best” foundation which is quite remarkable, but not worthy of remark from our ‘journalists and storytellers’. Donald can’t be that bad if he is married to such a refined and eloquent lady.
  
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  January 19, 2021 5:06pm
- Monique Watson
  
  And she will slingshot headlong into obscurity. Stupid vapid cow. Even my Republican friends from my Republican Woman’s club have no time for her. Why would we. We care to discuss politics not fashion mistakes installed in the White House.
  
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  January 19, 2021 7:46pm
Monique Watson

So re the comments earlier about Biden and dementia. That’s just an unfounded smear. There is so much more material out there by experts pointing to the drain circling Trump that he has conditions affecting his cognitive performance. I know something about brain injuries and watching Biden walk and speak he doesn’t appear to be in any kind of cognitive decline. He has a strong gait. When he smiles he is completely symmetrical. Anyone who is losing it has short term memory problems but this is not evident.
You’ll have to attack him in his policies, Guys. Ain’t it wonderful a maniac is no longer in charge?
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January 19, 2021 10:22am
- Batman
  
  Monique I’ve been pointing this out for months, in a less clinical fashion to be fair, yet none of them will accept it.
  
  They are divorced from reality and no facts or logic presented by you or I is going to change that.
  
  But yes you are totally correct.
  
  This all comes from Biden’s stutter which occasionally causes him to pause or linger, or use the wrong word.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:42am
  - tf78
    
    Batman, I’ve never noticed a stutter affect your awareness of where you are before, that’s very interesting to know.
    
    3 2
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    January 19, 2021 5:08pm
  - Monique Watson
    
    Yep yep. Repeat a lie often enough and the truth seems offensive and the lie the only reality one can cling to.
    I preferred to think Trump was a victim because the party aligned with my preferred point in the political spectrum.
    Right up until he started openly acting in defiance of the Constitution.
    I can recognize and admit when I’m wrong. That is the point where a large chunk of America is at. It’s sucks to be taken for a ride. To think that you trusted your President and this trust was misplaced.
    There are Fuck all people except in the boonies who don’t think that Trump didn’t need to go. That’s why Georgia went to the Dems.
    It’s not a conspiracy. Trump is a false prophet. Even if Biden is a bit doddery as long as he doesn’t pocket rape us through higher federal taxes much, America will breathe a sigh of relief. Fingers crossed.
    
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    January 19, 2021 7:57pm
- virtualmark
  
  Agreed.
  
  I’ve commented here at Kiwiblog several times about Trump’s apparent physical signs of dementia. Gait, balance, speaking, drinking etc. I suspect that within a few years he will be in assisted living. I’m not a Trump fan but I also wouldn’t wish that future on him.
  
  The “Biden has dementia” claim originated with Donald Trump Jr. If there’s one thing we’ve learned about the Trumps it’s that they project their own behaviours on to others.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:44am
  - Inandout
    
    virtual, I expect better judgment from you. It was trotted out on here that Joe had a ‘speech impediment’ that caused his forgetfullness, and he smothers young women because he is ‘overly friendly’. Any bloody excuse except the obvious.
    
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    January 19, 2021 11:00am
    - virtualmark
      
      In,
      
      The first signs of neurological diseases like dementia are nearly always in gait and balance. Trump exhibits them (the West Point ramp is the most obvious sign, but you can see them practically every time he walks). Biden doesn’t.
      
      Personally I think Biden is too old for the role. But I do accept he appears in good health for someone his age (appears on TV at least, usual qualifications that I am not a/his doctor etc etc). Occasionally he stumbles over some words, but I couldn’t say if that’s age-related or – quite likely – he’s just always been like that.
      
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      January 19, 2021 3:51pm
      - tf78
        
        virtualmark, I call BS on that statement. My mother and my sister never showed any such signs. You’re deluded with you diagnoses.
        Biden may very well be in good physical health (he can jog) but his mental health issues are very clear to anyone.
        
        Don’t ever ask him about any numbers for goodness sake, he goes from 2,500 no, 25,000 no, 250,000 – he wouldn’t have a clue.
        
        5 3
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        January 19, 2021 5:12pm
      - MCos
        
        He has a stutter
        
        2 5
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        January 19, 2021 5:31pm
      - virtualmark
        
        tf78,
        
        Very common early visible signs of dementias and other neurological conditions (Parkinsons is another example) are often foot dragging, difficulty walking in a straight line, difficulty standing steady without swaying, difficulty with stairs (particularly going down stairs), difficulty leaning backwards (without toppling), and difficulty keeping balance as you turn your head (so people often subconsciously turn their torsos more than their necks).
        
        As it progresses people lose fine motor control of their tongues. So you might see a protruding tongue on sounds that have the tongue at the front of the mouth (watch how Trump says “thank you”). And it makes it more difficult for them to eat without spilling food or drink out of their mouth (when was the last time you saw Trump eat anything on film, and remember the infamous water bottle incident … which was also partly because he didn’t/couldn’t tip his head back).
        
        It’s not that every dementia sufferer will have all of those symptoms. But those are common signs that someone is beginning to have problems.
        
        Trump does exhibit all of those symptoms.
        
        I think he also has the loss of impulse/social control that often comes with dementia (ie people with dementia start to say things that would be impolite or best not said, but their brains are no longer inhibiting that). It’s easier to say mean things about the libs if your social inhibitions are declining. But then Trump has always been an asshole so it’s hard to know if that’s really a new development.
        
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        January 19, 2021 6:12pm
- Inandout
  
  MW, this stuff has been trotted out for months, of course plenty of ‘look over there’ stuff about Trump, but mountains of videos on Joe’s strange behaviour. Face facts, Joe’s WH press meetings will be softly, softly, not savage like Trump’s were. The man is a 47 year career politician with a wayward son and brother who is a wide boy. He will be treated with kid gloves by the press luvvies because they know he is ‘fragile’.
  
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  January 19, 2021 10:54am
  - kowtow
    
    And cos they’re all on the same team .
    
    3 2
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    January 19, 2021 3:19pm
- James Stephenson
  
  Yeah sure, that’s why he had to have his wife by his side all the time to remind him that he was running against Donald Trump and not George Bush.
  
  You know, the thing!
  
  27 4
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  January 19, 2021 11:07am
  - Batman
    
    I realise that when you take the Trumps as a model of a good relationship, wanting to have your spouse with you may seem strange but let me assure you that it is not.
    
    4 26
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    January 19, 2021 11:08am
    - James Stephenson
      
      I’m not chasing that squirrel.
      
      Just compare this Joe Biden, talking Corvettes with Jay Leno, with the current shell.
      
      https://youtu.be/mP-hyDSlmUs
      
      8 3
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      January 19, 2021 11:39am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Dad bought it for him. What does that tell you? Another thing that somebody else paid for …..Admit Joe is a comfortable driver, not a steering wheel gripper. 2016 though.
        
        2 2
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        January 19, 2021 5:20pm
- amospicton
  
  Maybe you’re right Monique, Joe’s always been a laughing stock.
  https://www.the-sun.com/news/us-news/1277457/robin-williams-clip-mocking-joe-biden/
  
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  January 19, 2021 11:11am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  He’s nearly 80, he’s in serious cognitive decline just like all 80 year olds. IQ down 20 points or more from when he was 50, the same as all geriatrics. Clearly forgets where he is and what he’s supposed to be doing in what little media fronting he does. He covers it with practiced go-to sentences and deflections. He’s already a joke president that no-one believes will be anything other than a puppet for establishment players which is why he has nobody interested in what he says during his campaign or since. He’s just a figurehead.
  
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  January 19, 2021 12:40pm
  - curry4me
    
    UrbanNeocolonialist: Yes, he’ll be Wilson 2.0
    
    2 3
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    January 19, 2021 2:10pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      You mean the Wilson looking over the fence? Hi de hi neighbour
      
      3 2
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      January 19, 2021 5:22pm
      - curry4me
        
        Steve Otto(North Shore) -;) No, I meant Woodrow Wilson. The man who almost singlehandedly revived the KKK by showing Birth of a Nation in the WH.
        
        2 1
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        January 19, 2021 6:18pm
Black with a Vengeance

Radiate Love!
3 7
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January 19, 2021 10:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Shit, this will be funny – Not
  
  4 1
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  January 19, 2021 5:23pm
cmm

When you and I hear the term “human trafficking” we probably think along the lines of what this used to mean: slavery of one sort or another such as bringing in people and exploiting them as sex slaves or underpaid kitchen workers.

But “[t]he United Nations defines human trafficking as when people are exploited by others through the use of threats, coercion, abduction or other abuses of power. ” and, being nice UN luvvies, we toe that line.

Based on that definition gangs are entirely human trafficking organisations. Everything they do depends on threats, exploitation and coercion.

When the cops participate in threatening and coercive illegal roadblocks are they human traffickers?

That nice “teddy bear” that got killed a few days ago was really a pimp for a gang. Why wasn’t he called a human trafficker?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/123976551/women-are-the-primary-victims-of-human-trafficking-new-zealands-plan-to-stop-slavery-forgot-them
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January 19, 2021 10:59am
- alloytoo
  
  That definition appears to include governments which collect income tax.
  
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  January 19, 2021 11:57am
Black with a Vengeance

I’ll share a secret with you…Q Anon means Cue Anonymous.

The hacker group who decided to hack people rather than systems.

Best way to identify the extreme right wing nutjobs is to allow themselves the opportunity to.

Tell them what they want to hear, and let them amplify the message.

All the alt right gullible walked right into it…lol

…and remember shhhhh, dont tell anyone!
3 19
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January 19, 2021 11:06am
- Batman
  
  A long shot but if it did happen to be them, they should probably feel pretty shitty about all the child kidnappings, assaults, broken families, a couple of murders, and general bad shit that has happened as a result of QAnon.
  
  4 25
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  January 19, 2021 11:15am
  - Inandout
    
    Bat, you mean as a result of our lockdowns, don’t you?
    
    15 3
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    January 19, 2021 11:27am
  - Black with a Vengeance
    
    They’d feel no more shitty than a car manufacturer whose vehicle was used to ram a crowd or a gun maker whose products were used to massacre innocents.
    
    What’s more believable. Child molesting cannibals controlling America or a bunch of 4.chan hackers fomenting happy mischief, to expose the nutjobs ?
    
    3 15
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    January 19, 2021 12:00pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  DPF let you out of jail, won’t be long sonny
  
  4 1
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  January 19, 2021 5:24pm
oldfella

Interesting study on medical marijuana.
++
More than half of people who use medical marijuana products to ease pain also experience clusters of multiple withdrawal symptoms when they’re between uses, a new study finds.
And about 10% of the patients taking part in the study experienced worsening changes to their sleep, mood, mental state, energy and appetite over the next two years as they continued to use cannabis.
Many of them may not recognize that these symptoms come not from their underlying condition, but from their brain and body’s reaction to the absence of substances in the cannabis products they’re smoking, vaping, eating or applying to their skin…
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-01-people-cannabis-pain-multiple-symptoms.html
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January 19, 2021 11:22am
- cmm
  
  All drugs have side effects – natural or not.
  
  Withdrawal symptoms, changes to sleep, mood, mental state and energy… sounds like coffee.
  
  6 1
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  January 19, 2021 12:15pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yer, alcohol make me go to sleep. Side effect/affect? Gotta go to sleep, I am not a meth head.
    Some here are I’m sure
    
    4 1
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    January 19, 2021 5:28pm
Maggie Pie

Just been the last hour or so downstairs in the gym.
Really hectic workout to be honest.
But OMG! Nearly wet myself laughing listening to Banksie on Magic!!
He is sooo worth tuning into after all those leftards spouting shite on ZB for the last month 😀
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January 19, 2021 11:37am
cmm

Darwin tried hard…

How the hello does anyone think it’s a bright idea to have a bucket of petrol in a car? Probably smoking too…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/three-people-were-inside-car-when-bucket-of-fuel-ignited-at-bp/QBOEL4SPWZG53SH5CEL2X6INOU/
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January 19, 2021 11:37am
Colville

It pains me to say it but it would be best (for NZ) if Aussie beat India today at the Gabba.

I really like the idea of English groundsmen preparing a wicket for a Aussie Vs NZ test match….my feeling is they would do everything they can to help lil ole NZ humiliate the Ockkers 🙂
6 1
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January 19, 2021 11:56am
- Colville
  
  F*8k it…India are playing so well , I hope they get there
  
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  January 19, 2021 8:20pm
oldfella

Bad: (Joseph McCarthy 1950s) “Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Communist Party of the United States?”

Good: (Big Tech 2021) “Are you now, or have you ever been, a supporter of Donald J. Trump?”

It’s different when the left do it.
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January 19, 2021 12:16pm
sooty

Jesus batman. You are over the top this morning with your comments this morning!
21 2
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January 19, 2021 12:19pm
oldfella

In 1948, MLK spoke to Morehouse College about the purpose of education.
In which he made the extraordinary statement to teachers that: ‘If we are not careful our colleges will produce close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists’.
https://projects.seattletimes.com/mlk/words-education.html

Sorry, Martin, guess what happened? They chose not to heed your warning.
17 3
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January 19, 2021 12:30pm
Maggie Pie

My partners mum txts…..

‘After lengthy investigation, the gin soaked shiny arses at the IPCA, have found that a member of the AOS was justified in kicking a man twice, in the belief he had a weapon.
HALLE BLOODY LUJAH!’

TBH – (me speaking) who would want to be a cop?
13 5
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January 19, 2021 12:33pm
Padriv Ustoev

5 months home detention for police corruption. What a fucking joke.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/123935891/five-months-home-detention-for-former-highachieving-cop
18 1
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January 19, 2021 12:42pm
oldfella

When an Aussie idiot like Nick Kyrgios labels another tennis player a “tool” you gotta laugh. I did.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/tennis/300208458/djokovic-is-a-tool-nick-kyrgios-slams-serbian-star-after-list-of-demands-ahead-of-australian-open
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January 19, 2021 12:49pm
- Pharmachick
  
  Pot, meet kettle…
  
  7 0
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  January 19, 2021 1:08pm
- Biscuit
  
  oldfella, we all have our ‘tool’ days, heh.
  
  But Nick on Novic, and his Australian Open ‘demands’, is 100% spot on!
  
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  January 19, 2021 2:35pm
  - oldfella
    
    Yep, we all have ‘tool’ days, Biscuit. If only I could remember where I left my hammer. 😉
    
    And re Nick Kyrgios, wouldn’t he have slotted effortlessly into the current Aussie cricket team on stupidity and crassness alone. Wouldn’t even need to bat or bowl.
    
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    January 19, 2021 4:20pm
    - Biscuit
      
      Oh, agreed!
      
      My latest ‘tool’ day was last week.
      My partner murmured ‘You could do with a haircut.’
      Not being a fool, I replied ‘You know, I think I might go get a haircut.’
      Did that, reached into my pocket for my cash card, nothing…
      
      Still, at least I found that my face is honest enough for them to let me out, to skedaddle home, to return and to profusely apologise…
      
      6 0
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      January 19, 2021 5:49pm
Inandout

The mad world of Xiden.
https://trends.gab.com/feed/5e52dfc91f94b1111db105ed/item/60061e2474fa442529f7939c
7 2
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January 19, 2021 12:49pm
WaynelSexton

No one’s having more fun than Trump!

https://t.me/GeneralMcInerney/20
8 3
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January 19, 2021 12:56pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING ON TWITTER…..

https://twitter.com/MhairiMcF/status/1351092154664443909
6 4
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January 19, 2021 1:04pm
- Don Beckett
  
  Lady Gaga and Poppa Gaga. 😆
  
  8 3
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  January 19, 2021 3:07pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, such a change, she is touching him.
  
  2 2
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  January 19, 2021 5:55pm
Unity

Does anyone know if it’s true Trump is going to release some declassified documents or is this just a myth and we have been ‘played’.
7 1
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January 19, 2021 1:05pm
- Batman
  
  It’s a myth created by the conspiracy loons to explain away reality
  
  5 15
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  January 19, 2021 1:06pm
  - Unity
    
    Did you see the interview on Fox News of Lou Dobbs with John Solomon? It all sounded very factual.
    
    7 2
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    January 19, 2021 2:10pm
    - Batman
      
      Yes, it *sounded* factual because that’s what Lou and John intended.
      
      They are spinning unfounded rumour to juice up the base who are leaving Fox in droves for various reasons.
      
      3 13
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      January 19, 2021 2:20pm
  - WaynelSexton
    
    Coming from a guy who is saying that an army 4x the size of the NZ army is only there for riot control.
    
    11 6
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    January 19, 2021 2:16pm
    - Batman
      
      In a country of 310 million, and an immediate district of 700,000.
      
      Your delusional state is not healthy, Wayne. Seek help and take some time away from the social media and website feeding you the content.
      
      4 18
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      January 19, 2021 2:18pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        310 million? right Batman. It must be a typo right?
        Tell us more.
        https://www.google.com/search?q=us+population+2020&oq=USA+po&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0i10i433i457j0i10i433j0j0i10j0i10i131i433l2.8098j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
        
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        January 19, 2021 5:32pm
  - lifesgood
    
    Batman, how would you know either way. How can you be so certain? Do you have a direct line to the white house or something.
    
    3 4
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    January 19, 2021 3:24pm
    - Batman
      
      Because out of everything we’ve heard leak from the White House lately, from pardons to red carpet ego-sendoffs, this isn’t up there.
      
      If he does, I’d wager that it will not deliver the result Trump wants so will have been thoroughly cherry picked to try and frame it in the desired way.
      
      2 8
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      January 19, 2021 4:43pm
- curry4me
  
  Unity: Here is a link to a NBC item.
  https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/extraordinary-move-trump-declassifies-documents-related-russia-probe-n910486
  
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  January 19, 2021 2:21pm
  - Unity
    
    Thanks for that curry4me. I’m wondering if our media will pick it up and what else will be de-classified, if anything.
    
    3 1
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    January 19, 2021 4:51pm
    - curry4me
      
      Unity: No, I don’t think $tuff I want 90c change, or the ‘Sux O’clock Ewes’ will broadcast it.
      
      1 1
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      January 19, 2021 6:22pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  He will be granting another 100 pardons tomorrow…. so keep an eye on FOX.
  Some of my twitter bezzies are speculating a number of them will be to piss off Hillary.
  So possibly Julian A will be among them?
  
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  January 19, 2021 2:22pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Hope it’s not over 100 Democrats just for farting
    
    6 2
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    January 19, 2021 5:33pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nalBkP8aQj0
Parler Returning.

Parler is back. Extremist cancel culture types want Newsmax etc cut off
by their ISPs. Parler CEO John Matze said they will be back in business soon.
The parler team is intact. They have filed a suit against Amazon for
cutting them off.
12 3
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January 19, 2021 1:29pm
- Batman
  
  Yes and they’re now hosted by the Russian Federation.
  
  It’s almost poetically funny ?
  
  5 21
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  January 19, 2021 1:51pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    You’re almost pathologically absurdist BM. FIFY.
    
    5 2
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    January 19, 2021 7:19pm
    - Batman
      
      Not an argument. So I’ll take that as you conceding that fact.
      
      2 5
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      January 19, 2021 7:27pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOD70XfWCko

New Reform UK MP.

Former Tory MSP Michelle Ballantyne has jumped ship and joined Reform UK, which is Nigel Farage’s newly rebranded Brexit Party. And she becomes the first Reform UK politician to hold office above council level. And now that the name of his party has been officially changed to Reform UK one assumes he will be looking to field as many candidates as he can in Scotland as well as in England and Wales. I don’t believe the party is registered to stand candidates in Northern Ireland. One of the advantages that Farage has, is the structure of his party. Reform UK has supporters but no members. Now most parties have a membership list and party rules usually mean they have to select candidates for elections from that membership list.
4 2
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January 19, 2021 1:30pm
curry4me

https://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/uk-news/2021/01/06/nigel-farages-brexit-party-changes-name-to-reform-uk/

Brexit Party Becomes Reform UK.

Nigel Farage’s Brexit Party will now be known as Reform UK after the Electoral Commission approved a name change.
The party will broaden its agenda to call for a different approach to the coronavirus crisis, as well as reform to the economy.
Party leader Mr Farage said the UK also needed to make changes to the voting system, civil service, BBC and House of Lords.
6 2
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January 19, 2021 1:30pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Are you Jerrais??? I was bought up there.
  
  1 1
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  January 19, 2021 2:30pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Helen Clark & Co conclude the bleeding obvious…

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/434766/helen-clark-led-covid-19-independent-review-panel-criticises-china-who

As evidence emerged of human-to-human transmission, “in far too many countries, this signal was ignored”, it added.

Specifically, it questioned why the WHO’s Emergency Committee did not meet until the third week of January and did not declare an international emergency until its second meeting on 30 January.

“Although the term pandemic is neither used nor defined in the International Health Regulations (2005), its use does serve to focus attention on the gravity of a health event. It was not until 11 March that WHO used the term,” the report said.
12 2
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January 19, 2021 1:53pm
Biscuit

Let’s give the Trump-lovers/Biden-haters something to downtick…

Which countdown to the Exit of the Trump is most apt:

A round-by-round recapping of the over 300 golf games DJT has had since first plonking his butt in the Oval Office?
A laugh-by-laugh resume of the over 30,000 lies he has run past theAmerican public in the same period
A roll call of the 399,000+ deaths on his watch to an illness he downplayed from the start?

Downtick away!

Me, I shall just chortle, occasionally LESS than quietly…
7 16
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January 19, 2021 1:55pm
- Tall Man
  
  You need to get out more and when you do, try to find a life.
  
  17 6
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  January 19, 2021 2:28pm
- Sacha
  
  @ biscuit – you really counted? Thank God for people like you who do it so we don’t have to.
  
  6 1
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  January 19, 2021 3:57pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Uptick Biscuit. You know why??
  You just passed the satire stage and became a troll mate
  
  5 2
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  January 19, 2021 5:37pm
  - Biscuit
    
    Soz, Steve, I gather you quite like soon-to-be-Mr Trump.
    
    I don’t.
    
    We can agree to differ heh…
    
    I’m sure as hell not gonna call out/incite a mob to hunt you down…
    
    2 4
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    January 19, 2021 5:46pm
cmm

So this cop commits multiple frauds undermining the judicial process, yet the dudge concludes:

“Judge Phillip Cooper said Ruru’s actions were outside of her police role which meant she hadn’t undermined the police.”

Nonsense. Of course anyone reading the documents would have trusted them more because she was a cop.

She has certainly tarnished the image of the police having been a police poster-girl. When she was selected as Police Sportsperson of the year she puts a face on the police showing the world that this is what a model cop looks like.

Of course such a high profile fall from grace undermines the police and increases distrust in their ability to select the right sort.

C’mon dudge…

“The two-week trial included defence evidence from Rotorua-born actor Temuera Morrison, who did boxing training with Sykes and Ruru.

He told the jury Ruru “lived and breathed the law””

Well there’s Morrison’s credibility shot to hell…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/rotorua-policewoman-melissa-mae-ruru-champion-boxer-tyson-sykes-sentenced/UXS7YHRPYZYVAZXTDAKJCIJUCM/
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January 19, 2021 2:08pm
- Harriet
  
  Those kinds of charges are serious matters of ‘dishonesty’ – a big personal short coming.
  
  Recently in Victoria a female sergeant was jailed for leasing out empty houses to unsuspecting tenants, two houses were in regional towns and two in Melbourne.
  She would hear of an empty house and check owners lived over seas or interstate, remove personal contents and store them if there was any, and then rent the house out furnished, after changing the locks. It was all her own private dealings.
  
  8 1
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  January 19, 2021 2:51pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  You mention Biden. I think very dodgy election result. You mention Sykes and Rotorua; I think something dodgy is going on. It is not the sulphur, but there is something awfully pungent about the Sykes name in Rotorua.
  
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  January 19, 2021 6:33pm
Maggie Pie

BREAKING….

A very close friend of ours is a resident of Palm Beach. She txt earlier to say that she saw 4 huge removal trucks arrive at President Trumps home Mar-a -Lago this morning
8 3
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January 19, 2021 2:13pm
- MCos
  
  Whose maid is that?
  
  5 5
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  January 19, 2021 2:26pm
  - Harriet
    
    The wife of the Supreme Commander of the Indo Pacific, Redbaiter. 😎
    
    6 1
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    January 19, 2021 2:59pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    She’s white, silly!
    
    6 5
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    January 19, 2021 3:28pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Not yours sonny
    
    3 3
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    January 19, 2021 5:40pm
- Kevin Herlihy
  
  Trump must be cleaning out the Whitehouse, taking everything that isn’t nailed down. He will need the funds from the sale of the furniture to pay his legal fee’s, especially with Guiliane on $20 k a day.
  
  4 21
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  January 19, 2021 2:41pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Redundant apostrophe alert!
    
    13 0
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    January 19, 2021 4:09pm
  - IC5000
    
    I guess the entire supply of embroidered white house towels has mysteriously gone missing…
    
    3 2
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    January 19, 2021 5:43pm
  - Fletch
    
    Actually, that is what Hillary and Bill did. CLeaned out the WH and took gifts that were given to them as representing the Office – not for them to keep. I think Hillary had to give some back and pay for some. She even took paintings that had been hanging in there for years.
    
    5 1
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    January 19, 2021 7:45pm
    - IC5000
      
      > Actually, that is what Hillary and Bill did.
      
      Trump played golf with Bill Clinton for years when he was a Democrat. I guess when Bill bragged about what he took Trump had to do his thieving.
      
      1 4
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      January 19, 2021 8:50pm
- Sacha
  
  He owns the Mar-a-Lago Club and Golf Course, much to the chagrin of the Palm Beach self-titled aristocracy. He’ll just be chucking out all of his residential records – or preparing to write a book about his experience.
  
  6 1
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  January 19, 2021 4:05pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  That is only the food for the party after Trump steps off Air Force One.
  4 truckloads? Seriously? 10 semis for sure
  
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  January 19, 2021 5:39pm
I remember when

Biden giving priority to minority business looks like a ‘two birds with one stone’ decision.
Should rile the alt right to remind his supporters while pleasing much of the left.
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January 19, 2021 2:48pm
Maggie Pie

And once seen….. cant be unseen 😀

My partner thinks that nasty little piece of work on CNN Anderson Cooper – looks like a gay whitebait.

LOL!!
12 6
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January 19, 2021 2:56pm
- Don Beckett
  
  I’d say he’s probably correct.
  
  10 4
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  January 19, 2021 3:17pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    I think it’s those glasses he wears what does it 😀
    
    10 3
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    January 19, 2021 3:27pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, he is a strange talking head.
  ‘Rekindling the old flame. Anderson Cooper got back together with ex-boyfriend Benjamin Maisani before welcoming his son, multiple sources exclusively reveal to Us Weekly’.
  
  5 2
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  January 19, 2021 6:03pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    My partner hates him for some reason 🙁
    He was saying his mother was Gloria Vanderbilt who died recently and left the little poof a 100 mill.
    
    5 3
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    January 19, 2021 7:14pm
I remember when

“Police took Sykes’ phone and discovered hundreds of damning Facebook messages revealing his offending with Ruru.’
Obviously wasn’t the silent partner.
5 0
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January 19, 2021 3:03pm
Don Beckett

Interesting what is going on in the USA WRT Inauguration Day – the Dems appear to be panicking
– and gaslighting:
https://the-american-catholic.com/2021/01/18/running-scared/

A couple of the comments are on the money.
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January 19, 2021 3:26pm
Maggie Pie

If you listen to what some of the commentators are saying on CNN, more than seventy-five percent of the National Guardsmen stationed in Washington DC, are only there to assassinate Joe.
16 3
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January 19, 2021 3:36pm
- kowtow
  
  They keep reporting the FBI doing the checks , despite also reporting there’s no intelligence to indicate a threat …….
  
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  January 19, 2021 4:43pm
  - fernglas
    
    I don’t recall there being any intelligence indicating that Tarrant was a threat either. Perhaps they are just being extra careful.
    
    5 3
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    January 19, 2021 5:02pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Entirely different scenarios.
      
      Why do some people feel the need to keep trying to bring the actions of a retarded Australian into a conversation.
      
      6 2
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      January 19, 2021 6:11pm
  - [email protected]
    
    Who checks the FBI personell that are checking the National Guardsmen ( should be National GuardsPEOPLE)?
    
    6 1
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    January 19, 2021 7:05pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Why would we listen to that? TV1 network ewes is better – and they have opinions that the NZ left understand.
  15 min and it is all go.
  Spa pool for me
  
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  January 19, 2021 5:45pm
Maggy Wassilieff

“The Government is still on holiday, but the gangs have never been busier.

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2101/S00038/gun-crime-out-of-control-only-act-making-sense.htm
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January 19, 2021 3:44pm
- cmm
  
  “I once again call on the Government to pick up ACT’s constructive policies to tackling some of New Zealand’s longest term and most difficult problems.”
  
  Good luck with that.
  
  Here’s more like what’s going to happen:
  Wally : “The muggles are getting restless. We have to make it look like we’re roughing up the gangs. Sorry bro but we have to turn up the heat a bit.”
  Mob mate: “Yeah well we could give you some dirt on the Comancheros. Hit them. That would tidy up a few things for us too.”
  Wally: “Ok, sounds like a plan. By the way: you guys need any more equipment and cop clothing for your roadblocks? There might be another lockdown and we want to to be ready.”
  
  14 1
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  January 19, 2021 5:07pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Now, about those roadblocks….
    Do we non-Maori folk have to observe them?
    
    https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/by-what-authority-do-maori-groups-impose-restrictions-on-the-rest-of-the-community
    
    13 1
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    January 19, 2021 5:22pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Why even bother venturing into those areas.
      
      5 1
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      January 19, 2021 6:07pm
Maggie Pie

And have you noticed how 90% of the female hosts, reporters, and invited commentators on FOX NEWS, are all blondes?

jUST sAYING.
8 3
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January 19, 2021 4:25pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Must be photoshopped by CNN, CNN are real bitchy atm
  
  7 2
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  January 19, 2021 5:48pm
oldfella

Just started to read what I thought might be a mildly interesting article on thespinoff, about a man who, supposedly, has a mandate to change the way Kiwibank thinks about Maori. I say started to read until I hit the second para. Which states.

“At home Pihama was surrounded by te reo Māori me ōna tikanga. Of Te Ātiawa, Ngā Māhanga-a-Tairi, Tainui, Ngāti Maru whakapapa his taha Māori was always a core part of his identity, but it was during high school at Auckland’s Te Kura Kaupapa Māori o Hoani Waititi under the philosophy of Te Aho Matua that he invested himself fully into the language and culture of te ao Māori.”

I have to assume from that para that the article is aimed only at people who speak the lingo. I don’t, like most Kiwis, so I guess whatever the writer was trying to say will have to remain a mystery to the majority. Even if it might be interesting to a wider audience.
https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/19-01-2021/the-man-with-a-mandate-to-change-the-way-kiwibank-thinks-about-maori/
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January 19, 2021 5:03pm
- Tall Man
  
  So why bother wasting a non recoverable part of your life wasted even starting to read it?
  
  7 2
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  January 19, 2021 6:06pm
- Inandout
  
  old, there is a real estate voice who now calls NZ Aotearoa. Luckily there are a host of agents to choose from.
  
  7 1
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  January 19, 2021 6:09pm
- graham
  
  Nailed it, oldfella.
  
  I assume the media organisations, companies, journalists, websites, and so on who are using ever-increasing amounts of Maori language are trying to be ‘inclusive’, show how seriously they take the calls to revitalise the language and increase the use of it in every-day situations, which seems to lead to them attempting to outdo each other in their use of Maori words and phrases.
  
  Honestly, it doesn’t worry me that much – if they want to use more and more of these words and phrases, no skin off my nose. I know it annoys some people intensely, but it doesn’t bother me too much. However, like you I don’t understand Maori and I have no great desire to learn it. It’s quite simply of no use or interest to me. So – again – like you, by and large I simply can’t understand articles like the one you quote. I assume it can’t be that important, and I ignore it. Because surely, if it was actually important, they would present it in a way that the majority of people actually understood. Why not write the article in both English and Maori? That way people can understand it, AND have the opportunity to read the Maori translation. Or just put the English translation of phrases such as ‘te reo Māori me ōna tikanga’ in brackets next it. How hard would that be?
  
  I wonder if these companies, in trying so hard to ‘revitalise the language’, have lost sight of their core function – to inform and communicate. Because it seems to me that if you’re writing large chunks of your articles in a language that – let’s be honest – very few people actually understand, you’re kind of failing at what should be your primary goal.
  
  9 1
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  January 19, 2021 7:20pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I could cope with most of the stuff written in Te Reo
  (although I don’t know the Grammar of Māori… so didn’t recognise the me ōna construction)..
  
  But It does smack of virtue signalling…talking to a select group.
  
  I can do similar when I want to communicate with folks who have a smattering of Latin or specialist botanical knowledge… but what is the bloody point of so doing if I want to convey a message to a wide and varied audience?
  
  Actually, the sentence that really bugged me in that article was written in plain old English….
  
  Banking is a colonial institution based in western individualism.
  
  If that is an indication of Kiwibank’s knowledge of Banking, I don’t think they’ll be getting any recommendation from me.
  
  9 1
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  January 19, 2021 8:00pm
- Jack5
  
  The Spinoff article starts:”A distinctly colonial institution, banking has long ignored te ao Maori.”
  
  Colonial? Banking’s origin and basis – lending and charging interest goes back to Ancient Greece, and modern banking begins in Italy in the late Middle Ages and Early Renaissance.
  
  There is inherent conflict between banking and Maori culture.
  
  Lending entails loans being secured by borrowers’ assets. In Maori culture, now being reinforced by Maori activists, land assets are generally communally owned and are thus useless as loan security. Land everywhere is the prime asset for bank lending.
  
  There have been steps in New Zealand such as allowing moveable houses as security, but in general Maori land is unalienable, that is unsaleable by an individual. A bank cannot use it as security. This is one reason why Maori home ownership is lower than that for non-Maori New Zealanders.
  
  Banking ratios are set internationally through the developed world. There are minimum ratios for lending secured over borrowers’ land.
  
  Here’s what will happen if Kiwibank follows the path advocated by Teahooterangi (Teaho) Pihama.
  
  Kiwibank will become a State aid agency for the Maori section of the New Zealand population, but Kiwibank, as a commercial bank, will wither to insignificance.
  
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  January 19, 2021 9:59pm
  - Ehlana
    
    If the tribe owns the land, perhaps the answer is for their people to return to it and live on it? Houses can literally be built from the dirt beneath your feet, after all, and they would have trees available. Composting toilets, rainwater collection, natural filtration – there’s a whole world of eco-friendly, low impact living out there to embrace and enjoy.
    They could even create their own banking, based on pooling resources and lending to one another within their tribal group. “Colonial” banking, like other colonial commerce, facilitates lending, borrowing and trading among strangers, hence the use of security. But an iwi bank wouldn’t need or want that.
    
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    January 20, 2021 8:13am
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/weather-news/123992461/winds-cranking-up-causing-disruptions-in-wellington
117 kph winds on some Remutaka Road ?
Nothing !
I can recall far worse winds on the infamous Rimutaka Road between Upper Hutt and the Wairarapa.
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January 19, 2021 5:11pm
- Inandout
  
  Yes grey, a steam engine was once blown off up the Rimos.
  
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  January 19, 2021 6:11pm
oldfella

Just spotted this:

“U.S. defense officials say they are worried about an insider attack or other threat from service members involved in securing President-elect Joe Biden’s inauguration, prompting the FBI to vet all of the 25,000 National Guard troops coming into Washington for the event.”

This is what happens when you define half the population as enemies of the state.

And nothing says “normal, legitimate election” like a swearing-in behind 12 feet of razor wire and 25,000 troops that you’re not sure you can trust.
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January 19, 2021 5:22pm
- Inandout
  
  old, considering Joe is as sillly as a barrell full of monkeys what’s the bet he has a stand in? From a distance and all that.
  
  8 1
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  January 19, 2021 6:15pm
- Fletch
  
  Real authoritarian, communist stuff…
  
  4 2
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  January 19, 2021 7:48pm
Maggie Pie

LOL!!
My partner reckons the boys down South might have been watching too much CNN……

https://twitter.com/NZStuff/status/1351366029524439041
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January 19, 2021 7:57pm
Monique Watson

Well the previous President did try to test the waters for a military coup.

Also. Trump has forgotten who’s going to be Prez soon showing signs of mental decline. He just ordered the borders to fully reopen. Biden had to issue a statement shutting him down. You couldn’t make this shit up. The guys a loon and probably on the sauce.
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January 19, 2021 8:01pm
UrbanNeocolonialist

Eric Weinstein from twitter:

What is going on is this: mainstream media and tech are co-creating an illusion. The illusion is this: the entire Left has gone stupid, corrupt & insane. And the way it is accomplished is by collective institutional make-believe.

All the civil libertarians are still here. The “free speech for ideas we hate” crowd is still here. The “Woke doesn’t make any analytic sense” crowd is here.

Ironically the Left leaning institutions are “manufacturing our consent” w forced “diversity & inclusion” loyalty oaths.

Now, individually, we object. But I’m told we’re “thirsty” by the internet if I say: “NPR, I used to have John Ydistie on speed dial” or “NYT I would talk to Robert Pear or Dennis Overbye or others with some frequency.” until something about 8-9years ago: Our lines went dead.

This was about the time of the Obama Era “Dear Colleague” letter that converted the Universities to indoctrination factories. This is the era of the DOJ “Operation Chokepoint”. And many of us who objected were suddenly just frozen out. More or less completely with no explanation.

Now, via you, I’m seeing this differently. I don’t need NPR/NYT or any of these outfits to talk to me. But they stopped taking to ALL of us. Effectively center Left media ghosted EVERYONE who didn’t sign on to the new extra crazy version of identity politics and safety culture.

And this is leads to several illusions:

A) The Left is insane & wants the police abolished so some can riot, firebomb courthouses, suspend policing at will.
B) The Left hates borders.
C) The Left is all in on collective guilt for slavery.
D) The Left is done w due process.
E) The Left has traded in Free Speech for Safety culture.
F) The Left wants equity as a cover for new discrimination and racism.
Etc.

But that is not what is happening AT ALL. The true Left HATES this institutional strategy. So institutions have settled on “Smear & isolate”.

We just don’t exist if media never talks to us. And if we manage to poke through using podcasting we are classified by the zealots running this strategy as Alt Right despite an enormous number of Jewish surnames and prominent black intellectuals in our ranks. As if we vanished.

So here is what I want to say. I’m on a platform here which has the power to throttle my speech. But if this tweet reaches you as an ANTI-Identity politics/pro-free speech-for-ideas Democrat, quote tweet the lead tweet of the thread & say that you still exist. We’re here dammit.

What I now see is that I allowed the internet hyenas to push me off. The point isn’t that I need to speak to the press, but that the press has to speak to the Left who HATE the direction of our modern Democratic Party away from equality & fairness for all independent of identity.

With smear&ghost, they have simply disappeared an enormous wing of the party. Vanished without a trace.

So if you are here and sick of our insane tech-media-academic-political “leadership” undoing our civil liberties, add your name?

With numbers, they can’t gaslight us all.
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January 19, 2021 8:21pm

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