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April 17, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 17 April 2023

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General Debate

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Warren

Should ex Prime Minister’s be able to hide there dealings with the elite of the world after they have resigned from Parliament after all as they were just like every other Public Servant with a lot more power.
This is one of the reasons that the Official Information Request Act is not fit for purpose and should have a major overhaul.
Jacinda Ardern has decided to keep her messages with Harry and Megan the Duke and Dutchess of Sussex secret from New Zealander’s after her resignation of Prime Minister for now.
The Herald has appealed that decision to the Ombudsman.
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April 17, 2023 8:01am
- kevn
  
  @Warren… Let’s be seeing any Pfizzer comms at the same time.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:41am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    The release of the contract with Pfizer should be compulsory. If there were provisions in it to bar the use of other treatments like ivermectin and HCQ etc, then those who signed it should be arrested. Similarly if they gave Pfizer indemnity from prosecution for injuries and deaths caused.
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:06am
    - Mark Hanley
      
      Pfizer has legal protection and so it seems does Adern.
      
      We must demand a forensic investigation into all crown spending over the last 5 years, and an investigation into how much of it ended up in the back pockets of the Labour hierarchy!.
      
      We must demand an investigation into the incentives which encouraged Adern t0 lie to us all about the safety and efficacy of the COVID vaccine after she received the medsafe report stating the vaccine neither safe nor effective.
      
      Then we must demand prosecution of any politician who can be proven to have lied and harmed us all. .
      
      We must expose and end the Labour hierarchy “get rich at taxpayers expense” scheme or it will continue where it left off in 9 years!
      
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      April 17, 2023 11:54am
      - Ian Boag
        
        We must demand a forensic investigation into all crown spending over the last 5 years
        
        A decent size working group should be able to plough through this and report in about another 5 years …..
        
        how much of it ended up in the back pockets of the Labour hierarchy!.
        
        Can we take it that you have some knowledge of this? Please share.
        
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        April 17, 2023 2:18pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        This was released on the internet almost 2 years ago.
        
        https://ti-health.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Albania-Pfizer.pdf
        
        Many discussions were had, the general consensus was that it was almost certainly legitimate and that all countries would have had a very similar contract with a few variations on price etc depending on volume purchased.
        I haven’t read it. I left it to those people familiar with such documents to do that.
        
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        April 17, 2023 4:17pm
    - Sacha
      
      Pfizer claimed approval for the use of the covid vaccine under Emergency Use Authority, claiming that even though it had had limited testing, it was needed for treating the victims of the pandemic.
      One of the conditions for granting permission for its use was that there was no existing effective treatment (as proven by clinical trials). Ivermectin was an off-label cheap & well known SAFE drug and enterprising doctors thought to use it against the virus – and it worked!
      Pfizer had to scramble to protect its captive market, and brought pressure to bear on health authorities to restrict Ivermectin’s use (untested, remember?) and we were unable to access a safe, cheap drug all because of big-pharma greed.
      The rest is history.
      
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      April 17, 2023 4:05pm
    - Sacha
      
      I understand that Pfizer has indemnity from prosecution – if it wasn’t given, then no vaccines! The government in its ignorance, was terrified (80,000 deaths!) and capitulated.
      
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      April 17, 2023 4:08pm
- Paulus
  
  I do not want to know !
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:20am
- Rusty
  
  @Warren
  
  If those messages were sent in a official capacity from the Susexx’s (royals) to Jacinda Ardern (PM) then they are public property.
  
  Ardern has no right to withhold them.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:38am
krazykiwi

From Cranmer’s substack: –

Court of Appeal to hear appeals on vaccine mandates in New Zealand this week. It seems that the government did not fully disclose all material facts to the Courts or to mandated workers.
:::
This week’s first appeal is brought by teachers (NZTSOS) challenging Justice Cooke’s decision in NZDSOS Inc & NZTSOS Inc v Minister for Covid-19 Response, which was delivered in April of last year. The second appeal is by members of the New Zealand Defense Force who are contesting Justice Churchman’s decision in Four Members of the Armed Forces v Chief of Defense Forces, which was delivered in September.

I hope these appeals succeed. Having a precedent set for government to run roughshod over human rights for political gain would be disastrous.
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April 17, 2023 8:02am
- ClanMcleod
  
  kk – they have to succeed, or the country will carry on down the toilet where it has been going for 5 years.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:12am
  - Frank the tank
    
    It won’t be overturned as there is too much at stake for the 9% and the 1%.
    
    Democracy is effectively dead in most Western Countries. This is part of their grand plan via institutions such as the UN and WEF.
    
    Concepts such as democracy, human rights and national sovereignty are annoyances for them. Don’t believe me – listen to how the last 2 PMs have described the concept of democracy.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:36am
    - mawm
      
      The WHO pandemic plan will remove any vestiges of human rights and national sovereignty from us. With a pandemic declaration for any reason what so ever by them they will be able to confine us to our homes and force any kind of medication they want on us. Hipkins will probably sign onto it as his last deed, and if by some chance it is not ready to be signed then I have absolutely no trust in Luxon not doing so. The same for all the fools governing the liberal Western democracies.
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:12pm
- Simon
  
  National party wiped its arse with the Bill of Rights. Criminals had more “rights” than the average member of civil society.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:35am
- Grunter
  
  A very detailed and excellent Substack post as usual from Cranmer. If the court of appeal fails, based on the evidence provided, the only conclusion is that our courts are corrupt as well.
  
  It is very clear that Bloomfield has not been fully transparent with all the information, AND grossly mislead the NZ public.
  
  The most damming piece of evidence is that Medsafe did not recommend that the jab be approved – and Medsafe had very good reasons why they didn’t want to approve it. Medsafe concluded,
  “Due to the unresolved concerns and additional quality, safety and efficacy data to be provided at the time of completion of the evaluation, MEDSAFE IS UNABLE TO RECOMMEND THAT THIS PRODUCT BE GRANTED CONSENT.”
  
  And you wonder why trust in the Govt and the health system has collapsed???
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:03am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Grunter trust didn’t collapse, it has been destroyed.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:21am
  - Clownworld
    
    Still in the past when shown to break their own laws for lockdowns, the court simply said yes technically the law was broken but extraordinary circumstances mean no charging for breaking the law. I am paraphrasing.
    
    So it will be a miracle of truth if accountability is taken and people are charged for these crimes.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:32am
- Jim
  
  Go well NZ justice and the scientific truth, I applaud those supporting NZDSOS and NZTSOS.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:41am
kevn

@kk… Interesting that the (clearly politicized) unions aren’t supporting the action.
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April 17, 2023 8:07am
Nickc2

Kieran McAnulty told the truth. There’s no co-governance involved with 3Waters. It’s now total Maori governance.
He also stated ‘one person, one vote’ isn’t applicable to NZ.
There ya go, dictatorship in our time!
Who would have thought?
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April 17, 2023 8:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This is what Julian Batchelor and Sop Co-Governance have been saying.
  We are in the middle of a ‘silent’ Coup.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:42am
Tony Stuart

Just what did former TAB bookie Kieran McAnulty mean yesterday “There are provisions that we have in this country that wouldn’t stand up to a purely academic democratic framework but that’s not how we work in New Zealand.”

It’s given National and Act some fertile territory on which to attack the government:

Earlier this week, National leader Christopher Luxon confirmed he would repeal the legislation if he was successful in this year’s election.

Party justice spokesman Paul Goldsmith said McAnulty’s comments were “confusing and concerning”.

“One of the founding principles of the National Party is equal citizenship,” he said.

“We recognise Māori have rights and interests in water, but do not accept that 50-50 co-governance is required to give effect to that.

“The Prime Minister needs to clarify immediately why his Government has moved away from an equal standard of citizenship, and he should ask New Zealanders if they agree.”

Act leader David Seymour did praise McAnulty for his honesty but said it represented a “dangerous mixture of naivete and ignorance about the Treaty and democracy”.

“McAnulty is at least more honest than his predecessors, but he has now opened a pandora’s box that the Treaty required co-governance of every aspect of New Zealanders’ lives.

“By confusing Treaty Articles II and III, and calling democracy merely academic, he has declared war on New Zealand as a modern, multi-ethnic liberal democracy with a place for all.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/local-government-minister-kieran-mcanultys-comments-on-democracy-concern-opposition-amid-water-reform-debates/4WMAQKWWRJHPPOMQKC225GCNBQ/

If Chris Hipkins was to ask the country whether they agreed with moving away from an equal standard of citizenship, I would offer odds of 9/1 that the answer would be “No”. What odds would McAnulty offer?
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April 17, 2023 8:13am
- JJ56
  
  As I’ve noted before, we can run a mixed tribal democratic society but its only fair you should have to choose which way you get represented, Iwi or the electorate.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:22am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    No, we can’t. You either have a modern, liberal democracy with equal suffrage, one standard of citizenship and free elections, or you can have a race-based tribal ethno-state.
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:28pm
- redeye
  
  John Tamihere says Maori already own the water. It’s their taonga he says.
  Owning water is like owning the air, or the energy from the sun.
  However this 3 waters debate is about control of pipes, filtration plants, gutters, sewerage farms etc. None of which were around in 1840 when the treaty was signed.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:23am
  - Ehlana
    
    The “Maori own water” idea doesn’t make sense when you come to know that water, air, light, soil and other necessities of life exist outside New Zealand. Or that about 60% of every human being is water.
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:33am
    - Mike
      
      That’s one idea. You might be surprised to find that there are quite well-established mechanisms to describe ownership of land (soil), to take one example. People are perhaps less accustomed to the idea of ‘ownership’ of water and air, although one might suggest that a community’s power to regulate use (and abuse) of these might be founded on similar concepts of ownership, even if it is some nasty communistic version of collective ownership, or more proper conceptions of everything belonging to the monarch unless granted to specific subjects.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:35am
      - Jack5
        
        Mike/Milky is correct in that concepts of ownership of water are being created by Maori activists and the Labour Government.
        
        There is more to the concept of ownership than making decisions and allowing use, or selling access to what is owned. The structure of ownership of a natural resource can bugger a country, and that’s what the Labour-Maori water plans will do to New Zealand, and soon turn it into another Third World backwater, and called Aotearoa.
        
        Maori economic development has been hampered by Maori concepts or equivalents of land ownership.
        
        Maori, like some other indigenous peoples, have not been able to use Maori land to raise the capital needed for development. This is because it legally cannot be sold, and so is useless as security for raising capital.
        
        Would Maori-owned water rights be alienable (saleable) and thus of use as security for financing say a huge dam? Of course not.
        
        Hernando de Soto (the Peruvian economist, not the explorer) has received much international attention for his work on indigenous land ownership. His views spark interesting ways at looking at Maori activists’ resource grabs.
        
        A taste:
        
        https://www.proplogix.com/blog/the-citadels-of-dead-capital-hernando-de-soto-on-property-rights/
        
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        April 17, 2023 11:14am
  - Paulus
    
    How will Iwi stop the bloody rain and floods if they own them ?
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:22am
  - Jack5
    
    “Maori already own the water” …
    
    Not as mad as giving them, as a race, ownership of part of the radio spectrum, and more than that. It’s going to “mark a start of a new era in Maori participating in telecommunications.”
    
    This is from news item in February last year:
    
    Digital Economy and Communications Minister David Clark said the agreement was exciting.
    
    “It recognises the critical role Maori are able to bring to the telecommunications sector,” Clark said.
    
    To carry out the commitments in this agreement, a permanent Maori Spectrum entity will be established further information will be made available later this year.
    
    “Supported by funding and long-term access to spectrum, the Maori Spectrum entity will work with the government on spectrum policy decisions whilst advocating for Maori interests in radio spectrum. This includes digital enterprise and jobs, healthcare, rural economy and connectivity, education, broadcasting, and revitalisation of te reo Maori,” Clark said.
    
    Guess who will pay the salaries and expenses of the “Maori Spectrum entity”?
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/460743/maori-interests-in-the-radio-spectrum-start-of-a-new-era
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:46am
  - Stellaboxer
    
    It’s funny but not long ago we were being told that many of the land deals with Māori were morally invalid because Māori had no concept of ownership in the European sense of the word. Seems they do though when it comes to water.
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:12am
  - Piniwi
    
    It is obvious redeye that they see it as the best possible money stream they can lay claim to while we know without a doubt their made up claims and words mean squat.
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:04pm
    - kevn
      
      @Piniwi… With the Asian population now overtaking theirs percentage wise, there is a race on to claim every/anything.
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:34pm
- Cinematic
  
  What mandate was given to this rabble of losers currently posing as our government to fundamentally alter NZ’s democracy?
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:26am
- krazykiwi
  
  “We recognise Māori have rights and interests in water, but do not accept that 50-50 co-governance is required to give effect to that.”
  
  Weasel words.
  
  What he should have said is something like this: “Under a National government all public assets will always owned by the people of New Zealand. Ethnicity will have no part in that ownership right. “
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:30am
  - kowtow
    
    I still wonder why no one made a fuss ( I’d be happy to be corrected) over the appointing of Maori “representatives” to local councils where they can overturn democratic decisions.
    
    Will the Nats or Act repeal that ?
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:35am
    - Paulus
      
      This morning announced two new Judges, guess what, both Maori and Wahine.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:23am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        They announced a rusting shipwreck as a Judge? Well that just about takes the biscuit.
        
        I mean, it’s stretching credulity to define a river and a mountain as “natural persons” (Wanganui/Egmont), but making a shipwreck a Judge? What, do we have to row out to receive a hearing?
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:31pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      If National and Act win in October, they will have to repeal this if they want to stay in power.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:47am
      - mawm
        
        To win in October they have to come out unambiguously and strongly against it. No weasel words!
        
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        April 17, 2023 1:21pm
  - Simon
    
    “Under a National government all public assets will always owned by the people of New Zealand. Ethnicity will have no part in that ownership right.”
    
    lol – National intend giving hundreds of millions to iwi mafia pa as well as unaccountable political control over planning and decision making where iwi can extort payment or other contributions.
    
    This is already happening. Of course National MPs will be aware but pretend not happening to gaslight the general population.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:41am
  - JJ56
    
    That is of course rubbish, public assets can be disposed of and the other party can be Iwi. Further, ownership of the assets may be disputed.
    
    The Nat’s position seems quite realistic.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:43am
  - septic skeptic
    
    I’m more concerned about Goldsmith’s comment than McAnulty’s. I know Labour are on board with apartheid. But it is very concerning to hear apparent acceptance of water rights based on ethnicity and ancestry from National.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:50am
    - Che Guava
      
      Every time National makes a challenge it has to come with a secondary statement that modifies and dilutes the challenge. They cannot make any statement of opposition to anything in absolute terms, it seems. They are completely hemmed-in and self-restricted by their basic acceptance of the moral and political paradigm and worldview of what are nominally their political opponents.
      
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      April 17, 2023 12:01pm
      - Close Hen Counters
        
        There are some very clever folks on this blog site and when I see your non de plume it makes me laugh so much!!! Another is Frank haematuria …. Must be a medic lol!! Have a great day Che 🙂
        
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        April 17, 2023 1:42pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    Under a National Government we will uphold Te Tiriti and give the Natives of New Zealand Her royal protection and imparts to them all the Rights and Privileges of British Subjects.
    
    We will all have those rights.
    We are a democracy.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:56am
  - Mike
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    You expect a government to never sell any assets? How charming.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:58am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    Sounds great, but doesn’t actually mean all that much in practice. Questions such as who has the right to extract water, how much, from where and when, at what price; who has the right, or the duty, to prevent that; who has the right to pollute water, to what extent, where and when; who has the right, or the duty, to prevent that; who decides what level of water quality is appropriate to require, and at whose expense should that quality be achieved and maintained; who is responsible for keeping water in its place, and for redressing damage caused when it isn’t; who gets priority when there isn’t enough of it – none of these are usefully answered in practice by, “the people of New Zealand”.
    
    And that’s without getting to the question as to what is a “public asset” and who gets to decide that. Were you opposed to the asset sales under John Key? Are you advocating that those assets should be bought, or taken, back into public ownership? What about former state houses?
    
    For certain, appointment to authority on the basis of the appointees’ race is a bad approach, here or in practically any other area of public policy. But there are real practical issues here which do need to be addressed, and “it belongs to the people of New Zealand” does not help and may actively hinder efforts to address them.
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:00am
  - Mark Hanley
    
    Weasel words or pragmatic approach?
    
    Luxon spells out his stance on co-governance in his interview with sky news Australia.
    
    The reporter actually allows Luxon to answer her questions without the regular interuptions and spiteful criticisms employed by the despicable NZ media (the weekend interviews = Tame Brown, Wright Luxon =are an absolutely disgraceful example of the despicable NZ media’s bias)
    
    Luxon’s stance that co-governance of some parks as part of treaty settlements is fine by me. NZ needs to keep working to improve the lives of every day Maoris and if done right co governance of some natural parks gives young Maori a pathway into jobs.
    
    If you ignore the Maori problem/solution, activists profiting from disharmony will flourish and we will all continue to pay a heavy price.
    
    PS. Luxon also hints we’ll have a referendum on NZs name and that he prefers NZ. It is not a far stretch to see ACTs TOW referendum included as well.
    
    https://www.skynews.com.au/world-news/global-affairs/nzs-opposition-leader-sits-down-with-sky-news-australia-in-wideranging-interview/video/fcc88d007062763ccc6d294e7c5dad52
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:22am
    - crikey
      
      Mark Hanley: “ Luxon’s stance that co-governance of some parks as part of treaty settlements is fine by me.”
      
      It’s not fine by me if the way Tuhoi addresses co-governance of Urewera is sets the standard.
      
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      April 17, 2023 9:31am
      - Paulus
        
        Where and when did Tuhoe even sign the Treaty ?
        They never did I understand.
        
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        April 17, 2023 10:25am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Those scum that burnt down DOC huts were charged were they not?
        
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        April 17, 2023 10:41am
      - Mark Hanley
        
        In line with Chris Hipkin’s and Labour’s complete and utter failure at everything (I hope you all have cash under the mattress to get through the next 12 months), Labour has failed to enforce the Te Urewera Act (provide for Te Urewera as a place for public use and enjoyment, for recreation, learning, and spiritual reflection, and as an inspiration for all).
        
        I’m perplexed you see that as proof Luxon won’t be a great prime-minister or that we should stop providing opportunities for young Maori (especially the 60% of gang members who want to leave).
        
        Te Urewera Act.
        The purpose of the Act is to establish and preserve in perpetuity a legal entity and protected status for Te Urewera for its intrinsic worth, its distinctive natural and cultural values, the integrity of those values, and for its national importance, and in particular to:
        
        strengthen and maintain the connection between Tūhoe and Te Urewera; and
        preserve as far as possible the natural features and beauty of Te Urewera, the integrity of its indigenous ecological systems and biodiversity, and its historical and cultural heritage; and
        provide for Te Urewera as a place for public use and enjoyment, for recreation, learning, and spiritual reflection, and as an inspiration for all
        
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        April 17, 2023 11:38am
      - Che Guava
        
        crikey
        Do people never learn? Anyone who thinks that co-governance can or would stop at “some parks” is deluded. Essentially, National cannot be unequivocal about anything, because they lack sufficient principles to ever draw a line in the sand. A “pragmatic” so-called conservative National Party has got us where we are, we don’t need more limp-wristed pragmatism.
        
        Mark Hanley says “NZ needs to keep working to improve the lives of every day Maoris”
        
        Do we? We need to work to improve everyone’s lives, not specifically Maori. Maori can focus on doing that themselves, since they have such a separatist mindset.
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:12pm
  - James Stephenson
    
    How about “the fact that we have Maori ministers of the crown, shows we already have the co-governance promised by the treaty”?
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:28am
  - Colville
    
    KK.
    
    Public assets?
    
    What about Lake Taupo and the water that comes from it. That isnt a public asset.
    What about Waikaremoana? etc etc.
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:49am
- pdm
  
  Inv New Zealand has been going through a new progressive phase of Governance since 2020.
  
  `Dickheads Rule’.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:52am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Just what did former TAB bookie Kieran McAnulty mean yesterday
  
  He means that Democracy is knackered; it’s run its race; it’s dog tucka.
  
  There’s a new filly on the books; she’s a sure thing.
  She’s got a light-weight jockey at the reins.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:52am
- Mike
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Is ‘former TAB bookie’ a clever new angle for you?
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:53am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    It’s a simple statement of fact Mikenmild, no more and no less. Before McAnulty became the candidate for Wairarapa in 2017, he worked as a bookie for the TAB, and regularly made public comments on behalf of his employer on a variety of farming and sporting programmes. He traded very much on the “l’m a real bloke” image.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:11am
    - Mike
      
      I’m just wondering about your purpose in highlighting this, as if being a TAB was a bad thing. When you refer to the esteemed Chris Bishop, for example, would you regard the prefatory phrase ‘former tobacco industry shill’ as useful context?
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:40am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      Milky, why do you persist in making a total arse of yourself?
      
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      April 17, 2023 11:12am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        “It’s in my nature”
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:35pm
  - graham
    
    47 seconds.
    
    That’s how long it took me to enter ‘Kieran McAnulty’ into my preferred search engine, pick out a likely result, and confirm what Tony has written above.
    
    C’mon Mike, you can do better than that.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:38am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Its fact, perhaps he is worried McAnulty might gamble our democracy away.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:44am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    I guess Mike, it’s just like John Key being constantly prefaced with “former investment banker” as a term of perjorative. I’d suggest “former TAB bookie” can be held in the same regard. I mean yeech. A bookie. How scum can you get?
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:01pm
- Cassandra
  
  Maoris do not have any rights re water. Rivers yes ie the land, but the water comes from the sky and in any case, in the case of the Waikato, most of it runs over Tuwharetoa land first. The Labour position is tutaepuru and National’s needs some work on it.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:43am
  - Mike
    
    ‘tutaepuru’?
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:42am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    What happens when the water reaches Port Waikato? Do Maori own the mixture of waters?
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:59am
- Prince
  
  There are also ‘provisions that we have in this country that wouldn’t stand up to a purely academic framework to avoid corruption’, such as a Cabinet Manual that states Ministers should not provide details about discussions within Cabinet to their funders.
  But in good ol’ NZ, that Ministers stays in Parliament collecting more dosh for 10 months, and the media assures us there is no suspicion of gross corruption, ‘cos he’s a good bloke.
  The principles that built our country, of democracy, of ethics and integrity, are being trashed daily by the more corrupt administration in our history.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:35am
- thirteenstars
  
  This is the worrying bit from Goldsmith/National:
  
  “We recognise Māori have rights and interests in water, but do not accept that 50-50 co-governance is required to give effect to that.”
  
  And he’s right. You can effectively hand control to Maori even without the notion of unequal representation raising its ugly head. What else does “…Māori have rights and interests in water…” mean?
  
  We all have interests and rights in water. Why mention Maori in particular unless you plan to give them more influence over that water? Else it’s meaningless. But it’s not meaningless. What it is, is a fig leaf, euphemistic doubletalk, to give unequal representation while distancing yourself from co-governance.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:51am
Clyde

McAnulty has now joined the racist Jackson in saying that NZ needs a new sort of democracy. Just shows how powerful the racist pack of clowns in the East Polynesian caucus of the Liemore Pardy are.

What is mine is mine, and what is yours is also mine.

Much stronger condemnation from National needed on this crap.
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April 17, 2023 8:16am
Maggie Pie

A bestie tweets….

So, KBNZOTY has published an open letter to the Minister-of-Immigration asking him…. “Was it worth it” to allow Posie Parker into New Zealand?

https://nzherald.co.nz/author/shaneel-lal/

Surely the bigger question is, was it worth it for NZ to allow HIM settle here?
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April 17, 2023 8:19am
- Widogast Corwin
  
  Thanks. I’ll skip reading it thanks.
  
  Kellie Jay Keen held a rally in Belfast overnight. Good attendance. 40 armed police formed a cordon around the women speakers.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/live/-LF5Nn-rNfY?feature=share
  
  How hard would it have been to do this in Auckland to keep a violent mob under control? They managed to find 800 police to control the peaceful anti mandate protesters at Parliament. 🙄
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:29am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Bullshit castle’s head honchos support “Trans Joy” and all in it entails therefore you won’t be getting this type pf control.
    
    And yes it would have been easy to do.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:40am
  - kowtow
    
    The cops in Northern Ireland have vast experience in maintaining the Queen’s Peace ( in the face of death and terror) while here the police are becoming agents in undermining the constitution ( illegal road blocks , irregular enforcement of and favouritism to elites during lockdown ((Wiles and Pal at beach)) , prisons full don’t make arrests) .
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:41am
  - mogg
    
    Hipkins has said that he believes in ‘personal choice and self ID’. So what he is really saying is that women can have penises, and that those trans women can go tackle out in front of young girls and real women in changing rooms at sporting events.
    As with Nicola Sturgeon this is a minefield for any politician, and he is being allowed to gloss over it.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:44am
    - Widogast Corwin
      
      “Hipkins has said that he believes in ‘personal choice and self ID’…”
      
      It is a free country. Not as free as five years ago, but folk can do what they want. I would favour a regime something like this:
      
      – men are free to ‘identify’ as women. If they dress as a woman they do not deserve abuse. They have the same rights as everyone else. However society is not required to recognise these men as ‘women’. Forget using women’s changing rooms.
      
      – no biological men in women’s sports. Ever.
      
      – children reporting that they feel the opposite of their sex are given intensive counselling. The aim is to resolve their dysphoria. If they still feel the same at 18, move to Plan B.
      
      – Plan B requires three years of counselling and psychiatric assessment. If after five years the diagnosis of gender dysphoria persists, and all the experts agree, the person is free to take hormones and have FULL gender reassignment surgery.
      
      – ‘Trans’ women who have had full reassignment surgery can have their new gender recognised by the state.
      
      I guess this makes me a nazi 🙁 Underpinning this approach is empathy and intensive support for people reporting ‘gender dysphoria’. However the goal, especially for children, is to overcome what is a mental illness.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:07am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        I’d support your first 4 points, the last two only if they are entirely self-funded or paid for by a health insurance provider (that I don’t belong to).
        
        The last point is nonsense – Trans’ women who have had full reassignment surgery can have their new gender recognised by the state.
        
        They don’t have a new gender. They can never have a new gender. They are in fact still men, and will never be women. The qualifier “trans” makes this clear. They are ersatz women, fakeanistas, wannabes but they are immutably male and shall ever be.
        
        Besides which, having the state falsely agree that they are women negates your point about women’s sport. You can’t be both a biological male and a woman. End of.
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:42pm
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “The last point is nonsense – Trans’ women who have had full reassignment surgery can have their new gender recognised by the state.”
        
        I am searching for a ‘peace settlement’ that is preferable to the current insanity. Your position means never ending war.
        
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        April 17, 2023 6:03pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    The comments are a breath of fresh air also. 99.9% supportive of the woman and what she says.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:55am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Hear hear, what that man said.
      
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      April 17, 2023 11:05am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    “How hard would it have been to do this in Auckland to keep a violent mob under control?”
    Well first find out who gave the order to hide the Police around the corner.
    The Police did not do it by themselves. Someone held them back.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:55am
    - septic skeptic
      
      Maybe. But IMO when called to assist they could have chosen to do so, but didn’t. Maybe they were handpicked for the job and aren’t representative of the average cop. I reckon they should also be held to account.
      
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      April 17, 2023 9:02am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        I suspect that the person giving the orders to hold back was in cahoots with the media, and got a nice kickback.
        Holding back to wait for the predictable violence so the media could record it.
        Making news!
        Who was it? Who is the top cop in Auckland?
        
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        April 17, 2023 11:15am
  - Gravelroad
    
    I see that even the opportunistic British media outlet the Daily Mail, describes Ms Keen as a “women’s rights campaigner”.
    Here, of course, she is described as an “anti trans , Nazi, right wing activist”.
    And our msm accepts that as gospel and the people don’t care.
    
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    April 17, 2023 8:58am
  - Dave
    
    But, Widowgast, in reading it I learned from the Herald that “ We are your advocate, Aotearoa. Uncovering stories that matter, asking hard-hitting questions of those in power…” I didn’t know that.
    
    As for the letter, he seems a bit upset that after a riot threatening the safety of Parker, he has received retaliatory threats.
    
    In either direction, the threats are indefensible, but if he wants to avoid what-goes-around-comes-around, he should try less riling up with hysterical hyperbole and misrepresentation of his opponents’ views, more civil discourse.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:17am
oldpark

Watched Hipkins NZs PM who recently selected an ex bookie called McNulty as Labours’ mouthpiece on the Co Goverance scam or fiasco .
He was being interviewed on TVNZs Q and A .By interviewer Jack Tame.
Now to paraphrase his comments .
In true bookie form he seemed to be laying the odds on CO-GOVERANCE 50/50 with 3/5/10 Waters in favour of 16% of Population being better qualified against 84% also rans to be in control.
Just in case there was a protest veto rights were also an option for the 16%.
He also said Democracy in NZ one Person one vote would not make it to the starting line in this instance, or words like that disqualifying 84% of NZs voters.
With the Hipkins selected McNulty talking for Labour with such anti Democracy comments he should be swabbed and the whole 3/5/10 Waters scam or fiasco should be scratched .
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April 17, 2023 8:25am
- nathie
  
  That old keffel McAnulty will be dog tucker come the election!
  
  Bully-beef flavor too!
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:38am
- thirteenstars
  
  Interviewed by that nasty little shit, Jack Tame, he of “well I guess she’s got dinner sorted” infamy as Posie Parker was pelted with eggs and women were being violently assaulted at Albert park.
  
  It’s like the fox#1 interviewing fox#2 as they both stand guard at the chicken coop.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:56am
Yvette

Three Waters reset: McAnulty explains why co-governance stays
Kieran McAnulty says having a co-governance component in its Three Waters reforms helps the Government give effect to the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi and makes it easier for new water entities to borrow money.

A quite lengthy article follows, link here –
https://www.1news.co.nz/2023/04/16/three-waters-reset-mcanulty-explains-why-co-governance-stays/
– but the last two sentences challenge most of its content –

ACT leader David Seymour accused the Government of “trying to sell an unpopular idea by branding it differently”.
“The ‘new’ Three Waters will still expropriate ratepayer assets and it will still divide New Zealanders by ancestry through co-government.”

McAnulty said that the shake-up retained a co-governance component, a highly divisive subject for some, partly due to the Crown’s Treaty obligations. “There’s a good reason for that — we signed a Treaty. The Treaty recognises Māori have special rights in water in particular. That is something that’s been tested in the courts and found to be part of New Zealand law,” McAnulty said

… McAnulty said Māori, in terms of the overall population, make up a disproportionately large part of each regional representation group..

Is this why – Willie Jackson says democracy has changed from being the tyranny of the majority and people need to stop being scared of co-governance.
“Democracy’s changed….We’re in a consensus-type democracy now. This is not a majority democracy. First-past-the-post has finished,” he told the Q A programme.
… “Democracy’s changed….We’re in a consensus-type democracy now. This is not a majority democracy. First-past-the-post has finished,” [1]

When asked if that meant the representation groups didn’t follow a ‘one person, one vote’ model, the minister</b<

[McAnulty, again] said: “There are provisions in our laws around the Treaty that aren’t democratic. The co-governance of the Whanganui and Waikato rivers, for example.
“There are provisions that we have in this country that wouldn’t stand up to a purely academic democratic framework. But that’s not how we work in New Zealand. We recognise that this country was founded on a Treaty that gives Māori particular rights and interests in certain things.”

But while “The co-governance of the Whanganui and Waikato rivers” may equate with Article 2 of the Treaty, co-governance of all PUBLIC WATER resources and infrastructure is not in the Treaty

Just as the US Supreme Court says abortion (but we are not talking about that) is NOT in the American Constitution (that is what I am fucking talking about!) so, likewise, ownership of public water is NOT in the bloody Treaty of Waitangi!
Or expressed more timidly –
Luxon said he had concerns about co-governance moving from management of local and natural resources into the delivery of public services.

Louder, Luxon – say it a little louder …

_____________
[1] https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/willie-jackson-says-democracy-has-changed-co-governance-is-good-act-leader-is-a-hypocrite/VZZAIF66LH76WWEXUXUXAZQ3XA/
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April 17, 2023 8:25am
- crikey
  
  Yvette: “ Louder, Luxon – say it a little louder …:.
  
  Say it a lot louder and repetitively.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:35am
  - septic skeptic
    
    A day late and a dollar short. Again.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:11am
  - mawm
    
    He seems to be ok with management of local and natural resources!
    
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    April 17, 2023 1:36pm
- Yvette
  
  OK – I kind of fouled up there above with the formatting after ‘the minister. Bloody cataracts. Please, read with consideration, if you got that far. So it should’ve read – only if you couldn’t decifer it –
  
  When asked if that meant the representation groups didn’t follow a ‘one person, one vote’ model, minister McAnulty said. “There are provisions in our laws around the Treaty that aren’t democratic. The co-governance of the Whanganui and Waikato rivers, for example. There are provisions that we have in this country that wouldn’t stand up to a purely academic democratic framework. But that’s not how we work in New Zealand. We recognise that this country was founded on a Treaty that gives Māori particular rights and interests in certain things.”
  
  But while “The co-governance of the Whanganui and Waikato rivers” may equate with Article 2 of the Treaty, co-governance of all PUBLIC WATER resources and infrastructure is not in the Treaty
  
  Just as the US Supreme Court says abortion (but we are not talking about that) is NOT in the American Constitution (that is what I am fucking talking about!) so, likewise, ownership of public water is NOT in the bloody Treaty of Waitangi!
  Or expressed more timidly –
  
  Luxon said he had concerns about co-governance moving from management of local and natural resources into the delivery of public services.
  
  Louder, Luxon – say it a little louder …
  Much louder and repetitively, crikey says
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:19am
  - Ehlana
    
    What seems to be missing in this conversation is an acknowledgement that in 1840 Britain did not have universal suffrage. It was only in 1832 that suffrage was extended to men meeting a property qualification. It would be well into the 20th century before full suffrage was achieved there – actually after it was achieved here.
    
    Governance has evolved since 1840. Rule by hereditary elites has been replaced with universal suffrage, which acknowledges all adult citizens (and, in NZ, also permanent residents) as equal participants in government.
    
    Why do we consider ourselves bound to do things the way they might have been done in 1840? If the Treaty had enshrined slavery, would be returning to that too?
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:05pm
- thirteenstars
  
  Oh, and does Luxon and the rest of the National Party have the intellectual wherewithal to exploit this?
  
  There are provisions that we have in this country that wouldn’t stand up to a purely academic democratic framework. But that’s not how we work in New Zealand. We recognise that this country was founded on a Treaty that gives Māori particular rights and interests in certain things.
  
  Hell, anyone with half a brain cannot fail to recognise that as a gift from political heaven. You can rip the Labour Party and the whole co-governance movement a new one with material like that.
  
  But they won’t, and they won’t because they can’t, and they can’t because they are intellectually disarmed, utterly and irrevocably.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:07am
In Vino Veritas

New taxation Bill pushed through. Around 200 new clauses. With, laughably, 42 different application dates. Way to make things even more complex than they are.
And one change is a doozy, put in toward the end. You will be exempt from FBT if you ride a bike to work (but not exempt if you use it privately). In your suit, with your laptop bag and documents. What could possibly go wrong in Auckland? Labour and the Greens are packed with ideological simpletons.
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April 17, 2023 8:26am
- Dougal10
  
  Tax only works if it is simple and easy to understand. With the 200 new clauses and the different application dates , it will make enforcement nigh on impossible and probably resulting in a loss to the IRD for chasing it up. It will be yet another cluster for labour.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:17am
Surely Knott

What proportion of the 16% of people with a Maori ancestor are signed up with their iwi?

Will people not signed with their iwi get a vote?

What is the turnout like for iwi voting? Is it private and secure? If they are to cogovern shouldn’t it be written and go through the electoral commission?

How many of the 16% of Maori people are signed up with more than one iwi. Do they get to vote for each iwi.

Where can non iwi members see the details of Iwi voting, Eg how many people they have on their iwi books, voter turnout, given they control public assets that affect us all.
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April 17, 2023 8:27am
- Dougal10
  
  We will probably need to ask Fiji for guidance on how to make it work //
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:18am
Maggie's partner

Despite an OIA request, our former leader has declined to reveal the contents of texts messages between here and a certain former Royal couple. My leaker has been able to access them, and I thought them worth sharing…….

On relocation:

JA to MM: Hi Your royal highness, have you considered New Zealand as a place to live?

MM to JA: Thanks Jane, lol rofl lmfao

On womanly advice

MM to JA: Hey J, what was that scent you were wearing?

JA to MM: Oh, did you like it? It’s a local one, Hokachicka

MM to HRHR: I know what to get the cook for Christmas

On the Coronation

MM to JA: hey J Babe, should I go to the Coronation?

JA to MM: No way M Babe. Fly down and we can watch it on TV over beers and prawns

MM to JA: Why aren’t you going?

JA to MM: call you later
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April 17, 2023 8:31am
hullkiwi

Green, rent-a-mob, students,anti-private transport protesters at it again on Wellington motorway.

These morons don’t want roads, but they don’t understand how people live.

Transport is an aspect of peoples’ lives, it helps people to do what they need to do.

It is not a case of people living for transport, & then being grateful for what some centralised socialist believes people need.

We do not all live in the “15 minute town”!
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April 17, 2023 8:32am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  When finished protesting they walk around the corner, jump into their 1972 Datsun and smoke off down the road.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:27am
kowtow

Carnage on the roads this weekend .

All that money spent on ridiculous , infantile ads ( Just one of the kids) would be better spent on enforcement .
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April 17, 2023 8:36am
- MCōs
  
  The stretch of road near Geraldine where three people were killed is pretty much straight and unobstructed with a short section of guard rails well back from the carriage way.
  Have a look on street view
  Maybe that’s what the campervan hit causing three deaths.
  What ‘enforcement’ do you want?
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:54am
  - Ghost
    
    There was an accident there, hmmm, before covid. Someone hit a car with a pregnant lady in, she lost the baby. People always speeding along there. I do wonder if the campervan driver fell asleep.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:00am
    - MCōs
      
      I did wonder, but I’ve long since learned not to jump to conclusions.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:18am
      - kowtow
        
        yet you imply w/o knowing the casue of the geraldine accident that enforcement won’t help and that it occured on a straight section of road.
        
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        April 17, 2023 10:42am
      - Ghost
        
        What enforcement will stop bad drivers at 1am in the morning? Accidents are going to happen
        
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        April 17, 2023 4:39pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    No mention of whether they were Kiwis or Tourists. If Tourists, just a lapse in concentration and driving on the right.
    That is one of the reasons I would not drive in Alaska. Host Family offered us a Dodge Ram to drive up to Flat Top mountain in Anchorage. I declined. If I was 20 it would be different.
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:34am
    - Ghost
      
      Foreign Tourists
      
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      April 17, 2023 4:41pm
Maggie Pie

Maori actually make up less than 1% of Registered Nurses in NZ.
Yet they’ve changed the name of the NSNZ to…..

‘Te Kahui Tapui o Aotearoa’

No wonder we’re over 4000 Nurses short!
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April 17, 2023 8:39am
- Clyde
  
  Lets assume for a moment that National/ACT get into power in October. How is this absolute nonsense of renaming organisations into a Poly word soup going to be reversed? I’d suggest no Govt funding of any sort if there is not a clear English name.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:44am
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    I know I am a broken record…. but NO nation with two or more official languages does this. You go to the Belgium government portal you click on the language you want:
    
    https://www.belgium.be/language_selection_page?destination=/node/8521
    
    Same with Canada.
    
    It would be unthinkable to compel the Dutch speakers of Belgium to decipher French names for organisations. There would be riots (I mean literally).
    
    A vanishingly small number of people could read and pronounce “Te Kahui Tapui o Aotearoa” and tell you what that means. Maybe one percent of the population.
    
    Language has one purpose:
    
    To enable communication of sophisticated concepts, meanings and reasoning.
    
    Sophisticated spoken and written language has literally allowed modern society to develop.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:23am
    - cmm
      
      Canada is VERY different. Both English and French are REAL languages both capable of expressing modern ideas.
      
      Ditto Belgium.
      
      What would be a better comparison would be looking at whether Canada waffles on in Cree. Is Cree displacing English and French as the “official” language of Canada?
      
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      April 17, 2023 12:38pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Is there any regulation of the size of the text?
    NS Hospital signs have large text in Maori and small text in English. What is that telling us? Ngati Pakeha is not as important as Maori?
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:39am
    - Paulus
      
      What the hell makes you think that 85% Ngati Pakeha is more important than 15% Maori ?
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:50pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yep. Toilet and Male/Female, no in betweens.
    Te Whare Iti is in small letters.
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:19pm
- Simon
  
  Wide open for National to close down worse than useless shit govt departments like RNZ and channel the funds into hiring more nurses / doctors but they wont.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:44am
- Frank the tank
  
  The wonderfulness of the greatest culture in the world continues.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:50am
- Mike
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  I’ve read many times on Kiwiblog that te reo Maori is a simple language, but you appear to find it very complicated. Why is that?
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:56am
  - Ehlana
    
    Quite simply Mike, people want a common sense approach. By all means given government departments and taxpayer funded organisations names in Maori. But they should also have names in English. The English name and words from the English language should be used for English language communications; the Maori name should be used for Maori language communications.
    
    Why does that seem so difficult?
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:20am
    - Taieri
      
      the Maori name should be used for Maori language communications
      ————-
      
      And the Maori name should accurately describe what an organization is and not to be a meaningless “metaphor”.
      
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      April 17, 2023 9:52am
  - Burtland
    
    ‘Te Kahui Tapui o Aotearoa’
    Google translate
    “The Holy Family of New Zealand”
    
    complicated or simple?
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:24am
    - Ehlana
      
      Well, I guess Mary nursed Jesus. But in a largely non-Christian country, how many people would know that?
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:09pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Thort I should brush up on DPF’s ‘Comments Policy’…
    
    LANGUAGE:
    [Mod – deleted]
    
    Phew…lucky I checked.
    
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    April 17, 2023 9:29am
  - Clyde
    
    Mike [ Mod – hard to identify the “debate” here ]
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:17am
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    For the same reason I find Arabic very complicated.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:25am
  - pdm
    
    Mike -because it is bastardised with made up words that are half and half.
    
    Black and Tan like a half and half beer and stout.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:34am
    - Mike
      
      kowtow should be along shortly to say how wonderful the Black and Tans were.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:56am
- Ehlana
  
  This morning I heard a radio report about an outbreak of scabies. It quoted a Maori-name organisation. It was only when they started talking about students rather than sheep that I could determine what form of scabies outbreak we are currently facing.
  
  There are perfectly good, internationally understood, words in English for both human and animal health care. Governments departments for these should have appropriate names.
  
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  April 17, 2023 8:59am
  - Dougal10
    
    The general population of nz became sheep a little over 3 years ago so that would make the article very hard to decipher .
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:25am
- Nickc2
  
  No wonder we can’t gain any interest in the job internationally.
  English is the international language and I believe all other countries advertising for nurses use the International language.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:00am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Plus… they’ll need to take a cultural safety exam before they can work in NZ
    
    https://waateanews.com/2022/09/06/cultural-safely-lessons-for-new-foreign-nurses/
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:03am
    - Nickc2
      
      We are fighting two ideologies: Cloth Cap Pommy Labour where screwing the bosses is the name of the game and New Age Maori who assume they own everything and are above the law.
      It’s going to take more than the Pacific Ocean to turn this ship around. Can/will a Nat/Act Govt be able to do it? I have my doubts. They will tinker around the edges whilst not wanting to offend anyone, whereas, offending some people and putting them back in their boxes is what’s required IMO.
      Sorry Maggy if this post doesn’t quite fit with your post, but I have the best of intentions.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:25am
    - Widogast Corwin
      
      Why would any overseas nurses come here with Australia paying more and without having to jump through these hurdles? I am surprised any come at all.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:26am
      - Mike
        
        To meet some of the awesome people they have read comments from on Kiwiblog?
        
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        April 17, 2023 10:57am
      - Matt Long
        
        They’ll be lining up to shake your hand and get your autograph Mike.
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:04pm
      - Piniwi
        
        Family or fellow countrymen WC like for example filipinos who already number high in medical or care jobs. The together in areas where they have numbers and everybody back home get all the goss. Usually about 40000or so who don’t get work will soon be part of offshore workforce that provide about 10% of GDP sending money home. Saudi is way ahead of Oz or NZ and the workers are prepared put up with bad local attitudes for the big bucks.
        
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        April 17, 2023 12:44pm
      - Nickc2
        
        I’m currently undergoing Chemotherapy and have counted two non-Asian Nurses in nearly four months whilst being treated. In addition, there are two Senior Nurses who are not Asian, however, one of them is of European extraction. I find them all extremely gracious, courteous, and professional in their dealings with me and those that share the same treatment times as myself.
        I casually mentioned to one Asian Nurse when I had completed my treatment for the fortnight that she was worth more money. She laughed and told me I was being naughty. That was before all these Nurses’ Strikes manifested themselves.
        IMO, if we can’t train and retain Nurses in NZ, we MUST import them because, without them, there wouldn’t be any Health Care NZ.
        Whilst it’s fine building bigger and better-equipped Hospitals, if we can’t staff them with the right people, we’re fucked.
        
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        April 17, 2023 2:44pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        In the hope they might (initially at least) survive a nuclear WW3? I can’t think of many other reasons.
        
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        April 17, 2023 5:48pm
- jp_1983
  
  Te Kahui Tapui o Aotearoa’ is actually the NZ Law Society
  https://www.lawsociety.org.nz/news/law-society-statements/recent-new-zealand-law-society-te-kahui-ture-o-aotearoa-initiatives/
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:49am
  - Ehlana
    
    OK. From their websites:
    
    NURSES SOCIETY OF NEW ZEALAND
    
    TE KAHUI TAPUHI O AOTEAROA
    
    The New Zealand Law Society Te Kāhui Ture o Aotearoa
    
    So it looks like nurse = tapuhi while law is ture.
    
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    April 17, 2023 1:16pm
Stu2

I watched the Tane interview with Mayor Brown yesterday on the auckland flood report. It was the first time I have felt sympathy for Wayne.

There were endless questions about lack of empathy, as the report said that the communcation from emergency management lacked empathy.

Hardly the point. The emergency system hardly communicated, wasn’t on top of the severity of the event and reacted far, far too slowly. And it did a poor job of keeping the mayor in the loop. Utter failure is the issue, not empathy.

Wayne made some interesting points. Some of the areas built in that are flood prone were opposed by the council but overridden by the environment court. Well, well. Now who is responsible for looking after home owners who need to abandon hopeless properties?
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April 17, 2023 8:51am
- Maggie Pie
  
  And loved BROWNIE’S response to Tame’s rabbiting on about him showing a lack-of-empathy when he said…..
  “I’m not a hugger. I was voted in by the ratepayers to get things done”
  
  MAGA….Making Auckland Great Again!
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:39am
  - BeaB
    
    Let’s see how Wellington gets on with tons of empathy and nobody to ‘get things done’.
    They will make a pretty good case of comparison.
    I just hope Wayne Brown doesn’t give up, exasperated with a hostile media and intransigent bureaucracy. We need more like him.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:00am
    - Mike
      
      Every episode like this makes Wellingtonians feel grateful that they dodged ACT’s plan for another ‘super city’.
      
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      April 17, 2023 10:59am
      - Dougal10
        
        Effectively it is already when you look at the control the regional council has over the greater wellington area.
        
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        April 17, 2023 11:29am
- Burtland
  
  Some of the areas built in that are flood prone were opposed by the council but overridden by the environment court
  
  the same happened in Christchurch with liquefaction – the government paid out all the owners in these areas – poor old net-tax payer picked up the bill
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:50am
  - Paulus
    
    Professionally some years ago I did a report for the Mayor’s Office on Liquifaction, and the then increasing construction in these areas.
    Believe it was basketed by the then Mayor, who had left wing orientation, and he still speaks in the media on how he is most knowledgeable.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:37am
    - kowtow
      
      I wonder if it was the same Mayor who had a copy poster of the 1916 Irish rebels’ proclamation of a republic displayed in his office.
      
      The one that talks of the support they had from “gallant allies in Europe”.
      
      Note well , the Empire and its Dominions were preparing for Somme 1916 at this time.
      
      Lest we forget.
      
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      April 17, 2023 12:39pm
Swifty

Damien Grant knocks it out of the park on education:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/opinion/131770805/damien-grant-our-schools-are-broken-and-nationals-tinkering-wont-fix-a-thing
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April 17, 2023 9:12am
Maggie Pie

NZ’s TRADE DEFICIT FORCAST TO BE THE
WORST AMONG ADVANCED ECONOMIES

– NZHerald 17 Apr. 2023
—————————————————–

So had to larf when my partner just showed me an email he got sent….

“This is like picking pieces of sweet corn out of a turd and telling us how delicious it is”

https://www.labour.org.nz/economic-recovery-graphs-2022

LOL!!
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April 17, 2023 9:21am
- Burtland
  
  LABOURs separate reality
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:42am
Surely Knott

Co-governance under the guise of fairness to indigenous minorities is a trojan horse for the UN, Agenda 21 and their globalist great reset . It’s about removing democracy from those pesky voters. Removing land rights. Removing assets from public accountability..

Is the Great Reset a new colonialism. Are we selling out NZ and our democracy.
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April 17, 2023 9:23am
- Burtland
  
  co-governance is just word soup
  
  Willie Jackson can discuss it with dozens of Maori Elites at hui all over the country, but he still cant define it to the rest of us plebs – obfuscation is its best descriptor
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:38am
  - Yvette
    
    Burtland
    Willie’s problem is, by his own admission, knocking the Maori ēlite response into a shape his Caucus colleagues will accept and support.
    His consultation with Maori ēlite took about six months as allowed for 72 hui, but his adaptation has taken about three times that six month period and it will still not be presented to Caucus and the public now until after the Election – if Labour wins it. Which means any definition will be [1] not what Maori ēlite dictated to him (so kind of pointless after all that), and [2] not ready in time (Ardern had promised by the end of the year – last year) so not ready prior the upcoming Election, as already mentioned.
    
    So Luxon should define “co-governance” whatever way he wants and invite Willie Jackson to state if he disagrees, or accepts Luxon’s definition.
    Luxon needs to stick it to Willie – and both fucking LOUD AND SOON
    
    I need to take the bloody meds – where are they?
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:04am
- pdm
  
  sk said:
  `Will 3 Waters and the Te Mana o Wai statements
  allow iwi to control access to all our forests and regional parks’
  
  You can guarantee it – in McAnulty speak it is even money .
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:43am
- Mike
  
  Is the Great Reset a new colonialism.
  
  No, but perhaps it should be. I have read many times on Kiwiblog that colonialism was good for the colonized, so maybe we should have more of it.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:03am
Ghost

Yesterday a post was put up claiming more female teachers are now sexually abusing students than males, Mike asked for evidence, everyone piled on and no one gave it, everyone just believed that the statement the member made must be real or that Mike should look for it.

Is there evidence that female teachers are now sexually abusing students at a higher rate than males because I was unable to find much on it, these two articles.

Here is an article from last year

Men also made up the vast majority, with over 80% of the arrests.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/at-least-269-k-12-educators-arrested-child-sex-crimes-first-9-months-year

Another article

https://floridaactioncommittee.org/likely-sexually-abuse-child-sex-offender-teacher/
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April 17, 2023 9:52am
- ClanMcleod
  
  I doubt “everyone just believed that the statement must be real”, I know I didn’t form a definite opinion. As with many other posts, I thought it was an interesting idea. I don’t know the answer.
  
  In reality shouldn’t the question be, is this on the increase? Or is media just reporting it more? Is this an agenda? Another attack on women? Is it coincidence? I don’t know.
  
  Undoubtedly men commit more sexual assault, one of the key reasons would be they generally have the physical ability to overpower the person and impose themselves.
  
  On the other hand, the female assaults seem to be mainly those who have power over their victim, generally teachers with students. How many aren’t reported? How many adolescent male teens actually would like to shag their twenty something female teacher? How many did and neither party reported it?
  Anyway, here’s a report saying that it is on the rise.
  
  https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sexual-victimization-by-women-is-more-common-than-previously-known/#
  
  As for Mike being asked to do their own research, it’s a fair call. I can’t recall them ever presenting an alternative view that contained anything resembling data or evidence. It’s generally nothing more than a snide, trolling remark that adds nothing to any debate.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:02am
  - Ghost
    
    I do believe it is the reporting. Yesterday when I was searching there were a number of male teachers that were not getting the same coverages as the woman.
    
    As for Mike I think he gets a bit of a hard stick, honest questions are ignored because he’s asking, and some who bitch he is trolling end up trolling him
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:16am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      I’ll agree to disagree re Mike, it’s almost always a pure troll. Very rarely honest questions. Tiresome is the best word to describe it.
      Yup, best not to engage at all.
      
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      April 17, 2023 11:27am
- Matt Long
  
  I would be very interested to see this post, I did indeed see a related post about more reporting of female abuse and asking why.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:25am
- cmm
  
  I think part of it is that boys getting leg over a female teacher don’t consider themselves victims.
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:21pm
  - Ghost
    
    There was a case a long time ago now in the USA, teacher got pregnant to a student, sentenced to jail, did her time and is now married to that student
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:24pm
    - Joely Doe
      
      Mary Kay Letourneau
      
      Married after serving the prison sentence; had 2 kids.
      Died 2020
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:21pm
  - Ehlana
    
    Whether or not the boys think it’s ok, it’s not. There is a distinct power imbalance – what happens to their grades/ college applications if they say no? Power imbalances won’t end when they leave school – what if the next predator is a (male or female) boss at work?
    
    Professional ethics generally forbids sexual relations with clients or subordinates and that should apply to teachers as much as anyone else.
    
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    April 17, 2023 1:25pm
    - cmm
      
      I’m not saying it is right. Just saying that many a boy would give his right wossname to be such a victim.
      
      I know of one incident when the only reason the story broke was that the “victim” was bragging about screwing the biology teacher and a male teacher (who had been trying to screw her) got vindictive after he felt humiliated.
      
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      April 17, 2023 5:09pm
Maggie Pie

RANDOM QUESTION….

Does anyone know which Minister the ‘Race-Relations-Commissioner’ comes under in Parliament?

Asking for a bestie from tennis who would like to go over his head.
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April 17, 2023 9:56am
- Ghost
  
  Justice? I know Andrew little appointed foon when he was justice minister
  
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  December 17, 2022 10:04am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The Race-Relations Commissioner is part of the Human Rights Commission which falls under the ambit of the Minister of Justice – Kiritapu Allan.
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:08am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Thx for that Maggz!
    Sent Prue a txt to let her know.
    Although now she says it might be a waste of time anyway since they both come from gizzie…could be besties?
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:38am
Surely Knott

Will 3 Waters and the Te Mana o Wai statements
allow iwi to control access to all our forests and regional parks.

The Waitakere Ranges and the Hunuas have the Water infrastructure.

Iwi have already campaigned to closed the Waitakere’s with a rahui based on spurious council report which council then supported the closure. That closure has never been reviewed. And the vast majority of the inner track network is permanently closed. Tracks are reopened with iwi consultation which isn’t public. My understanding is it’s one or two people from the iwi who walk around with council staff. This is not transparent or democratic. This is Auckland’s largest regional publicly owned park.

They haven’t gone through an official process of declaring them closed. They are just removing the tracks and paper roads off the public record maps.
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April 17, 2023 9:58am
- ClanMcleod
  
  It’s abuse of power, arbitrary and racist power. Unelected, unrepresentative and undemocratic power.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:56am
- Chris Nisbet
  
  “This is not transparent or democratic. ”
  Yep, that’s kinda the point.
  I wonder if our leaders will eventually not bother with this pesky voting thing, as it costs loads and will be pretty pointless. Even if they don’t the people actually doing the voting will soon realise they’re wasting their time.
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:31pm
ClanMcleod

I’m presuming our doctors and medical centres get paid for jabbing people? Is there anywhere I can contact to get the relevant numbers and money involved?
I ask after reading this post by El gato malo exposing the perverse system that operates in the US.

I keep trying to follow “the science” but it keeps leading me back to “the money.”

https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/vaccine-pay-for-play

Your primary care provider was bribed to suggest you should take the COVID vaccine.

https://twitter.com/RepThomasMassie/status/1646696738013454336?s=20

this is a gross misalignment of incentives and conflict of interest.

doctors should NOT be paid per prescription to dispense drugs, not by insurers (likely getting federal gravy), drug companies, or anyone.

this is the most anti-patient, anti-informed consent practice imaginable.

we really have gone off all the rails on kleptocracy here.

and it’s long past time for some VERY pointy questions about just who these regulators and government program administrators work for.

If NZ paid injectors per jab then the same serious questions need to be asked here. It is a perverse incentive. It is not based on health.
The loss of trust in our medical systems will take decades to get back. This will lead to worse health outcomes for society in general.
Less genuine vaccination. Less diagnosis of serious treatable diseases.

Ardern and Labour have done incalculable damage to this country.
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April 17, 2023 10:00am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Well I found the information at this useful substack.
  
  https://nzcovidresponse.substack.com/p/how-much-vaccinators-were-paid-and
  
  Not the levels as per the US. But a financial incentive nonetheless. The blog also highlights the money thrown at various promotions/bribes. Of note was the moronic “vaxathon”.
  
  The actual cost of just the Saturday 1 day event was $1,074,584.50
  
  Astonishing. Over a million dollars to convince people to take part in an untested medical experiment. Of course, this is nothing compared to the amount spent on advertising in general in the mainstream media.
  
  The outcome of this spending?
  
  “The overall outcome of the day was it raised the vaccination rate of people who had 1 dose by 2% (to a total of 85%), and the proportion fully vaccinated increased by 3% (to 65%).”
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:06pm
  - Ghost
    
    Government paid $36.05 per dose. I’ve seen it higher elsewhere, but, how much money has the government flushed down the toilet
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/486843/covid-19-1-point-4-million-doses-of-vaccine-to-be-destroyed-by-the-end-of-the-week
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:10pm
    - cmm
      
      That is just for the dose itself (ex Pfizer + maybe transport to NZ).
      That does not don cover all the other costs: storage, administration costs, advertising,…
      
      All up I doubt it cost less than $100 per jab.
      
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      April 17, 2023 12:13pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        cmm – absolutely 100% guaranteed. $100 is likely well short of what the actual cost would have been.
        
        The cost of the product and the cost of giving a does is well over $60 alone. That’s just for 1. Most people would have got at least 2, many would have got 3 and some 4. There will be those lining up to get this bivalent.
        
        As you say, add on delivery, distribution, advertising and promotion on TV, radio and in every other place you could imagine, buses, billboards etc etc. It would be interesting to find out exactly how much was spent on that.
        
        Is this the biggest waste of money every spent by any government in NZ history? Surely it’s up there?
        
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        April 17, 2023 4:09pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Ghost – as per the above link in my post on it:
      
      “If they delivered vaccinations after 8pm and before 8am on weekdays or between 5pm Friday to 8am Monday, or on public holidays the PPD was $48.72.”
      
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      April 17, 2023 3:59pm
- mawm
  
  Clan – they probably did not get paid per dose but were offered excessive hourly rates to turn up at a vaccine centre to do the work. This happens with hip, eye and cardiac surgery wait-list backlogs just before elections irrespective of the party.
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:52pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    mawm – check out the link for yourself. The information is direct from an OIA and other official government sources. They were paid per dose administered.
    
    https://nzcovidresponse.substack.com/p/how-much-vaccinators-were-paid-and
    
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    April 17, 2023 4:02pm
    - mawm
      
      For primary health carers PPD (price per dose) was paid at a set rate of $36.05 per dose during normal business hours.
      After 8pm and before 8am on weekdays or between 5pm Friday to 8am Monday, or on public holidays the PPD was $48.72.
      
      How much do the DHB’s pay to primary health carers per patient consultation? It varies from DHB to DHB. I don’t know how much it is but it must be round about that amount. The after hours amount is not much either. These are fees that GP’s normally get for any visit. I can’t see much incentivisation. This is different to the vaxathon which was just throwing money mindlessly at whatever moved.
      
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      April 17, 2023 5:26pm
Grunter

I think that it’s worth clarifying the co-governance and Te Mana o te Wai Statements will be run not by Maori but Mana Whenua. Mana Whenua is the local iwi that has ‘historic rights over the land’. The Maori population is reportedly about 17% of the total NZ pop. The Mana Whenua % is much lower and varies by region. In Otago/Southland for example, there are only a few hundred Mana Whenua out of a total population of over 330,000. So lets estimate they make up about 0.1% of the Otago/Southland population. A very small and powerful group of people dictating what happens with our waterways.

How on earth can the ODT continue to ignore this dangerous change to how we operate in society??
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April 17, 2023 10:09am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/former-labour-mp-and-cabinet-member-michael-bassett-on-the-crisis-maori-in-new-zealand-face-today/
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April 17, 2023 10:14am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  For those in the Sandringham/Kingsland area, this is for you. The venue is on the website.
  I wonder if Jaspinda will go?
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:12pm
ClanMcleod

Another excellent blog post regarding excess mortality at the beginning of the pandemic and currently.
The numbers of covid deaths at the beginning were exaggerated by the use of “with” instead of “from” covid. It now looks certain that many of those deaths were

‘iatrogenic’ deaths, i.e. those caused by medical interventions rather than the disease itself.

These iatrogenic deaths were caused by a number of mis-steps in the early part of 2020, including inappropriate intubation, seeding of the virus into care homes by discharging infected elderly patients from hospital, a rush to place infected care home residents on ‘end of life pathways’ involving Midazolam and other drugs, and the withholding of prophylactic and therapeutic treatments – such as Vitamin D, Ivermectin, and anti-biotics – from sick people.
It is therefore entirely feasible that Covid deaths would not have exceeded 50,000 in the UK if the machinery of state had done nothing at all. Furthermore, if doctors had simply been allowed – better yet encouraged – to treat patients in accordance with their professional judgment, many thousands more could potentially have been saved. It is quite possible that Spring 2020 might have looked no different to a moderately severe late winter flu season.

The numbers were inflated in many ways, but always for one purpose – to terrify people into compliance. This has been proven already in many countries. It is also true of NZ.
All to drive as much of an uptake of the experimental jabs as possible. Fear, coercion, bullying, bribing. On a scale never witnessed in history. Why?

The evidence of a major role for the vaccines has become increasingly compelling ever since the initial rollout began in December 2021. Yet, rather than addressing this growing scandal, governments and their media collaborators continue to gaslight populations across the world. Anyone asking reasonable questions or speaking out – such as the courageous Westminster MP Andrew Bridgen – is ruthlessly ridiculed and/or censored by the same people responsible for the agenda-driven tyranny of the past 3 years.

How long can the official narrative be sustained, given the ongoing hugely elevated mortality levels worldwide? It is completely unfathomable to many, including ourselves, that the whole edifice of lies has not already come crashing down, but eventually the facts will surely become undeniable

The facts are already undeniable. The only reason it isn’t already laid bare is the blanket refusal to even talk about it by the government, bureaucrats and mainstream media.

https://johnsullivan.substack.com/p/covid-vaccines-and-the-grim-reaper
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April 17, 2023 10:18am
- mawm
  
  The unanswered question – Why? Why have they wanted a vaccine in every arm at such a cost for every country?
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:56pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “iatrogenic” Nice name. How many will use the Google Machine, or not bother?
  Why not say ‘non covid related’ deaths? Too many smartarses.
  Let’s face it, the power mad socialists wanted those death numbers as high as possible, so they could push the fear porn!
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:19pm
MCōs

I thought this was quite funny in a grim sort of way
https://twitter.com/mikegalsworthy/status/1647686432608120833?s=61&t=yFkzCNMWRCaVt1p5eRxUog
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April 17, 2023 10:24am
- Mike
  
  kowtow would like to put ‘dismantling the Good Friday Agreement’ on display there.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:09am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Why? Why the snide remark Mike?
    I could just as easily say the tweet posted by MCos is like the inside of your head.
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:22pm
- kowtow
  
  That ‘museum’ , like other English museums should be a target for ‘decolonising” , the sign is written in the language of the dominant oppressor !
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:29pm
Maggie Pie

NEWSHUB TWEETS

Is it just me…
or can anyone else see something odd with the pic they’ve chosen for this story?

https://twitter.com/NewshubNZ/status/1647444738205966336
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April 17, 2023 10:45am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, let’s see. He has ‘moons’ on his thumb, the cuffs are too loose, he is dark skinned….
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:03am
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    Violent criminals do not have finger nails that are manicured like that.
    
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    April 17, 2023 11:20am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Wido – oh I don’t know about that, I imagine a number of the thugs who attacked Posie Parker likely had well manicured nails…….
      
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      April 17, 2023 11:29am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Freshly done that morning in case they got on TV.
        
        7 1
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        April 17, 2023 2:25pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Well what my partner pointed out is that the woke clowns in this country never handcuff crims when they appear in court here….let alone use a BELLY-CHAIN!
  
  I mean who are they trying to kid?
  Pretty sure even Brendon Tarrant only ever appeared in the dock wearing nothing more a grey tee-shirt.
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:38am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    The photo originates from Idaho, USA.
    
    https://wowway.net/news/read/article/straight_arrow_news-idaho_to_allow_death_by_firing_squad_for_death_row-sanews
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:16pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Oh well sourced Maggz!
      
      And that’s something else the woke arsehats at New Shub failed to point out…..we don’t allow ‘death-by-firing-squad’ either. Unfortunately 🙁
      
      12 1
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      April 17, 2023 12:24pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Why the hell did he travel all the way from Idaho just to rob a NZ store?
      
      7 1
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      April 17, 2023 2:28pm
  - nathie
    
    Exactly, he should have been photographed holding a wet bus ticket whilst doing a group hug with his new wrap around service providers!
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:28pm
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    Brenton
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:11pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Well spotted.
      
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      April 17, 2023 2:29pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    From the same article:
    
    “Police hope this arrest provides reassurance to the community that we work hard to hold offenders to account,” a spokesperson said.
    
    Yes I’m sure they do a single rare success while Rome burns all around them. Reminds me of the single Israeli tank captured during the 6-day war, which is proudly on display in the town square in Suez, with lights on it at night and everything.
    
    We drove past hundreds of rusted, exploded and broken-down Egyptian tanks all the way to Suez, and afterwards down to Sharm El Sheikh, but they got one, by golly, and aren’t they proud!!!
    
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    April 17, 2023 3:54pm
- jonno1
  
  ‘Getty Images’ might provide a small clue.
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:19pm
mandk

Food price inflation 12.1% in the year to March; the fastest rate of increase since September 1989.

Labour: caring for the poor since never.
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April 17, 2023 10:56am
- kowtow
  
  Labour still polling relatively well.
  
  The electorate ; turkeys voting for Christmas.
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:24pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Poor since never keeps them dependent. The free shit should have started by now.
  Labour Bribes coming in 3, 2, 1 Boom!
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:32pm
Frank the tank

https://www.foxnews.com/media/buttigieg-points-roads-designed-built-reason-racial-disparities-road-fatalities

I’m sure “whack a katar he” will be in all on this soon.

BTW is this the end of Mayor Pete? This AOC-level delusion
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April 17, 2023 11:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I’m not sure he is all there. Says some strange things, or is he attention grabbing?
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:35pm
thirteenstars

For space fans don’t forget, SpaceX will attempt to send the largest rocket every built into orbit from its Boca Chica base in South Texas beginning at 12:00am (midnight) NZ time, tonight, April 17.

The launch window is 2.5 hours and weather permitting Ship 24 atop Booster 7 will ignite with 8 million lbs (3,600 tonnes) of thrust.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuidILNs1-g

Live watch link, here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pR70bDC5Y1g
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April 17, 2023 11:38am
- Ghost
  
  Thanks for the reminder, was rather pleased yesterday saw my first NASA balloon fly over
  
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  April 17, 2023 11:56am
  - thirteenstars
    
    Nice. Watching Starlink trains being deployed is also a great thing.
    
    https://starlink.co.nz/starlink-tracker-nz/
    
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    April 17, 2023 1:16pm
    - Ghost
      
      Yeah, watched that go over a few times
      
      4 0
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      April 17, 2023 2:36pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Really? You too? Wonder where it came from as we have easterly winds.
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:37pm
cmm

Chippy to reduce class sizes in school……
By ONE pupil!
What a piss-taker.
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April 17, 2023 12:10pm
- nathie
  
  And seeing there is also a teacher shortage … Labour are being “aspirational” again – even if they win the election they won’t deliver! Again!!
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:31pm
- Paulus
  
  Remember the demographics – child production is reducing in Ngati Pakeha families leaving it well open for the others,
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:55pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Ngati Pakeha is smart. Ngati Pakeha understands economics. Maybe I got that wrong.
    Ngāti Pakeha does not understand ‘real’ economics???
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:41pm
Maggie Pie

Little bit of ‘Advice-For-Life’ from a colleague I thort worth sharing….

“Never have anything to do with anyone who has visible Tattoos. Particularly if they’re on their face or neck. Avoid at all costs”.
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April 17, 2023 12:10pm
- cmm
  
  People “dress for success”.
  
  If you put on a flash shirt and tie, then it is a signal to be treated as a professional/whatever.
  If you put on a sparkly short black dress and hang around singles bars, then it’s a message you want to be plied with drinks and are out for a one night stand.
  And if you put tats all over your body it’s a message that you want to be treated like a gangster.
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:17pm
  - lifesgood
    
    I detest tats and have been hoping for years this ugly fashion would die a death but it doesn’t seem to be. I really wonder how regretful these tattooed people will be in old age. There is no dignity in them. Don’t try walking around Japan with tats…you are marking yourself out as a gangster.
    
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    April 17, 2023 12:26pm
    - kevn
      
      @lifes… About 80% of police have tatts and lots of them.
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:42pm
    - Paulus
      
      Didn’t Mahuta get away with the Tats in Japan recently ?
      Sadly she came back.
      
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      April 17, 2023 1:58pm
    - MCōs
      
      Tattoos have been around for centuries.
      Don’t hold your breathe.
      
      3 1
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      April 17, 2023 5:06pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Couldn’t agree more cmm!
    
    (Except for ‘the short blavk dress’ bit 😀 )
    
    4 1
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    April 17, 2023 12:27pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, this gay HGTV host has tatts galore.
  https://i.pinimg.com/originals/15/29/86/1529862c2410f80cf3ac121b322d8f69.jpg
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:46pm
  - Ghost
    
    What the fact he is gay got to do with it?
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:32pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Tattoo of himself on his shoulder. Clever!
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:43pm
- Sacha
  
  I’m not fond of them either – but I know I’m old-fashioned.
  But – there is a you-tube hairdresser who has a channel ‘Regal Gentlemen’- he’s covered in tats, and has a very engaging personality
  And there is a very knowledgeable woman in the USA who is an expert on horse’s hoof care, and she has more tats than one would think could fit.
  But neither of these people have facial adornment.
  
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  April 17, 2023 5:17pm
lifesgood

Could this government be any more stupid? Oh wow! How amazing! Dropping the number of students in Yrs 4 to 8 from 29 to 28! How wonderful! Idiots. Be way better to get rid of the disastrous open plan classrooms. How on earth do they think they will have enough classrooms and teachers? Oh well, it’s not until 2025 so it won’t happen because they will be outski.
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April 17, 2023 12:15pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Told ya Labour are no good with numbers – and they are running the bloody Country (into the ground)
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:44pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Snail mail just came. BNZ. Our Trust is non-profit but we keep a small amount of money in two accounts. Earned 8 cents in interest. Tax? 8 cents!
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April 17, 2023 12:33pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  You should consider a switch to ‘Heartland Bank’….I see they’re doing 6% for 1 year.
  
  LOL!!! 😀
  
  4 1
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  April 17, 2023 1:03pm
  - Paulus
    
    Westpac offering 5.7% for 12 months today.
    I expect to see another rise after the next RBNZ rise, but when you look at it Westpac was at 5.5% before the last 0.5% RBNZ rise but only gave investor a small share of the increase.
    Con Persons as they are now almost all run by women Australian CEOs.
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:03pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Freehold for 9 years now. We don’t owe nobody nothing.
    Except the Power, Rates, Spark, and WATER!
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:56pm
Widogast Corwin

Education is falling to bits. This is the solution 🙂 Reduce class sizes by one student. Too funny.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/131786828/live-class-sizes-to-decrease-by-one-for-years-4-to-8-requiring-an-extra-320-teachers

“The Government promises to reduce class sizes for years 4 to 8 by one, by the start of 2025.”
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April 17, 2023 12:38pm
- Ghost
  
  So with the rampant truancy, how many will actually be in the reduced classes anyway?
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:42pm
- kevn
  
  @Wido… Amazeballs stuff. 2025. One less student per class.
  Now, about the massive absenteeism numbers.
  Clown circus are just taking the piss out of NZer’s.
  
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  April 17, 2023 1:40pm
- Paulus
  
  So did David Lange in “Tomorrows World” some many years ago.
  What happened ?
  SFA like again now.
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:04pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  Ahh, so they’re promising to do something several years into the future, are they?
  
  Right, that will definitely happen then, and it will be a massive success….
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:47pm
- NothingLeft
  
  I remember as a kid there might have been one or teachers only days a year.
  
  Now they are up to 4, always on a Friday, Monday or eg next monday to give a long weekend with Anzac day. Clearly nothing but added holidays for the slackest and underperforming profession in the country. Taking away another 2% of the teaching year, aside from all the half days on other pretexts (like parent teacher meetings that are now see kids sent home from school rather than being done at night as in past) , and of course it saps parents of kids for another 4 days of out-of-school cover per year.
  
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  April 17, 2023 5:41pm
Surely Knott

3 waters co-governance is feudalism. Land rights are held by a birth right class the water lords. You can not move out of your class. You are a serf who will pay money to a birthright decision making class. Serfs will have severely curtailed rights.
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April 17, 2023 12:39pm
- Prince
  
  The odd thing is that we self-identify as serfs. There is no DNA testing to prove Maoris are, in fact Maori.
  This must be the next step in the glorious march to Apartheid.
  
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  April 17, 2023 12:48pm
  - Paulus
    
    There are No pure Maori, only made up ones, and DNA would agree.
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:05pm
  - cmm
    
    Most Maori are mostly non-Maori.
    
    It would be interesting to see a breakdown of Maori by genetics. I don’t know what the numbers are but I suspect that less than 25% of people claiming to be Maori are actually more that 50% Maori genetically speaking.
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:21pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  There is a Documentary about water in Europe. Saw it on Al Jazeera.
  Water Lords? This is on a huge scale, not silly NZ 3Waters.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:00pm
kowtow

For the record , I have twice today reported “Mike” for moderation.

I’ve never done that before.

The guy is repeatedly posting on comments totally unrelated to the debate in question to me .

I’m sick to death of his childish trolling and constant attempts to goad reactions.

I’ve reacted , not to him but to the Mods .
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April 17, 2023 12:45pm
- Mike
  
  It’s a general debate. Irrelevant diversions and playful references are part of that. Those who imagine this is some solemn debate club could bear that in mind.
  
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  April 17, 2023 4:44pm
  - Swifty
    
    Who are you trying to kid?
    
    Some of your posts set out to deceive.
    
    You post dishonestly and put words in people’s mouths and then criticise them for those words.
    
    Nothing playful about that.
    
    You’re deluded. Or lying.
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:30pm
mandk

The Hipkins/Tinetti plan to reduce primary school classes from 29 to 28 is simply laughable.

Based on a five hour contact day, this would increase the average amount of attention per pupil by 24 seconds.

But the worst part is that the plan does nothing to address the dire need for greater attention to literacy and numeracy teaching.

Nor does it address the problem that many new teachers have poor literacy and numeracy themselves, and aren’t taught to teach these things while they are at teachers’ training college.

God Defend New Zealand from another Labour term in office!
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April 17, 2023 12:46pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  It is the Marxist teachers that need a higher attention span.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:01pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Met some have you Steve? Noted their short attention span? Is this trolling or just making a silly comment in response to another silly comment … ?
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:25pm
- Nickc2
  
  I believe it’s going to come into force in 2026, should they be re-elected. They’ve had almost six years to do this and it’s only now that National’s announced its Education Policy that they try and outdo them.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:54pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Do NOT play on logs in the water

https://www.gisborneherald.co.nz/breaks-to-both-sides-of-pelvis-after-being-stuck-buried-by-log
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April 17, 2023 12:47pm
[email protected]

Read that Christchurch is going to lower the speed limit from 50 km/h to 30 km/h near schools.

“There are 145 schools within the council’s boundaries, meaning each school zone would cost the council about $46,300 if the money was split evenly among all the schools.”

Not sure what is involved to change the speed limit but I hope that for $46,300 per school they are doing more than just changing the speed signs.
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April 17, 2023 12:59pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Here on the Shore local to me it is 40kph. It is on LED signs before school and after. Some schools there are three speed humps each side of the school pedestrian crossing.
  Safety? People can’t see kids and teachers with hi-viz at crossings? Big STOP signs not visible?
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:13pm
- MCōs
  
  The speed limit near most urban schools schools is currently 40kph at certain times of the day.
  Christchurch has decided to lower it further to 30 over the next ten years.
  Hardly a big imposition if it saves a kid getting bowled if they’re not paying attention.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:13pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Making it 8kmph would be a lot safer
    Why dont they do that?
    They could put some cones out too
    That’d do it
    
    4 3
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    April 17, 2023 4:06pm
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    Most drivers are vigilant at schools. 40 kmh is fine. The idiots who speed will still speed if the limit is reduce to 30 kmh.
    
    This is the problem with the attitude of the Council. they think they can regulate idiots into driving safely. They can’t.
    
    Look at the CBD. The speed limit is 30 kmh. The traffic usually moves at about 40 – 45 kmh. I know I drive through it every day. You make a stupid law people will hold it in contempt.
    
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    April 17, 2023 4:48pm
    - Biscuit
      
      REminds md of Washington DC, Widoast:
      
      I drove along suburban streets and en route went past a junior High School … and chuckled.
      Whyever so?
      Well, as you turned into the school’s street, there was a sign saying:
      SPEED LIMIT 15 MPH
      Fair enough, I thought, so I slowed down. But, closer to the school, there was a second sign; this one saying:
      SPEED LIMIT 20 MPH WHEN CHILDREN ARE PRESENT
      Was I supposed to speed up?
      
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      April 17, 2023 4:59pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Go to Sydney. School zone limit 40 kph 8-930 am and 230-430 or so. If you get nailed on a camera (they float about) …
    
    Currently the penalty for drivers who are caught doing up to 10 km/h over the speed limit in an active school zone is $494 and two demerit points. In the current Australia Day double demerit period, the same offence would see a driver lose four demerit points.of demerits.
    
    Whether there are any kids in sight or not. Four of their demerits is like 40 of ours. As far as I could tell, the consequences were enough to keep speeds within the limit.
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:33pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    40 to 30 saves lives, and petrol/diesel.
    Nope, the vehicle can’t travel all day at 30 which is where this is heading.
    Maybe school should teach kids about paying ‘attention’
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:33pm
emmess

YESSSSSSS
Elon did it
https://twitter.com/OzraeliAvi/status/1647730110425096194
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April 17, 2023 1:30pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Officially Government Employees – or should I call them Public Sector Employees?
  Yah! That means you dickheads on playschool TV1, which the speaker of the house insists on at news time.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:18pm
Maggie Pie

I see they’re saying Green Party candidate and #20 on the list, Jack Brazil, has been seriously injured in a shooting!
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April 17, 2023 1:54pm
- Jack5
  
  A 2020 interview with Jack Brazil is included in this clip from the Otago Daily Times:
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/news/the-south-today/environmental-activist-hopes-turn-dunedin-green
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:12pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Hadn’t even heard of him tbh until he popped up on a ‘Posie Parker’ twitter thread I was following last month….. LOL!
    
    https://twitter.com/what_the_jack94/status/1639873597102772224
    
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    April 17, 2023 2:45pm
Maggie Pie

And great to see Elon has labeled RNZ as…

‘Government-funded Media’

https://twitter.com/radionz
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April 17, 2023 2:20pm
- Swifty
  
  I see they are complaining about it – banging on about their editorial independence.
  
  They are successful applicants to the PIJF where they have agreed to support Labour Party policy in return for the funds.
  
  They haven’t got a leg to stand on.
  
  And they expect me to trust them.
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:55pm
- nathie
  
  Crikey RNZ is taking a pasting in the comments feed.
  
  What will Stuff do if the same thing happens to them? Lmfao!
  
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  April 17, 2023 2:56pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Jesus H Christ – they are squealing like stuck pigs!
    
    11 2
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    April 17, 2023 3:50pm
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    Hilarious. This comment 🙂
    
    “Just think of it as a new pronoun.”
    
    🙂
    
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    April 17, 2023 5:30pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  And I’ll tell you what….they’re REAL pissy about it too!
  
  https://twitter.com/radionz/status/1647789959389249536
  
  Seriously considering telling Elon to stick the ‘Blue Tick’ up his arse 😀 😀 😀
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:05pm
  - emmess
    
    Oooooh whatever will he do without and extra eight US bucks a month?
    
    9 1
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    April 17, 2023 3:38pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      OK, confess. You are one of the ones exposed? 🙂
      
      3 3
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      April 17, 2023 3:52pm
- Nickc2
  
  RNZ have sold their soul to the Devil (the current Govt) and deserve all the scorn they get from all/any source.
  They can throw all the hissy-fits they like but the evidence is there for all to see.
  Come on RNZ, return all the money you’ve received to Treasury.
  Ya won’t will ya?
  Fuckin lying hypocrites!
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:26pm
  - Swifty
    
    I see they’re also bullshitting by omission about Musk’s ‘government funded’ definition.
    
    https://twitter.com/gigglenox/status/1647795651588280321
    
    11 1
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    April 17, 2023 3:52pm
- graham
  
  So … for years these media outlets have been only too eager to label people and organisations. “Anti-vax”, “white supremacists”, “conspiracy theorists”, “trans-phobic”, “homo-phobic”, “racist” … the list is seemingly never-ending.
  
  Now they have ONE label applied to them, one relatively benign label – and suddenly, the world has ended. Shrill demands to have the label removed or revised, or else they’ll … GASP! … leave the platform. Oh dear, how sad, never mind.
  
  Cry me a river.
  
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  April 17, 2023 3:55pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Certainly a great start!
    
    Now what about @stuffnz, @nzherald, @newshubnz, etc etc….
    
    9 2
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    April 17, 2023 4:19pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  Pity he didn’t give it the more accurate name.
  
  “Government bought and paid for propaganda”
  
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  April 17, 2023 4:53pm
graham

And in a decision which – sadly – will surprise nobody here, the Media Council has “tossed out complaints about Tusiata Avia’s The Savage Coloniser poem published on Stuff“.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/04/media-council-tosses-out-complaints-about-tusiata-avia-the-savage-coloniser-poem-published-on-stuff.html

Multiple complaints were submitted to the Media Council and Creative New Zealand received backlash from the ACT Party after revelations the stage show received taxpayer funding.

The Media Council, in a decision released on Friday, said those complaints have not been upheld.

According to the decision, the complainants “have right to express their disgust and disagreement, take a different view of colonisation, write letters to the editor, not to read Stuff and consume other media. But they do not have the right to not be offended”.

Hmm.

While I can at least take some heart when I see the Media Council saying that people “do not have the right to not be offended“, I somehow doubt they will apply that equally.

I can’t help but recall the story of Rangiora Toyota’s radio ad being removed due to the mispronunciation of a te reo Maori place name, Rangiora. The ASA (yes, I know, different organisation) declared the mispronunciation of “Rangiora” was disrespectful, showed a lack of knowledge of Maori language, and was likely to offend consumers.

https://autotalk.co.nz/mispronounced-maori-name-causes-advert-ban/

So … mispronouncing a place name is awful and will not be tolerated, but a poem about hunting down white men and killing them is fine. Because it’s “Art”.
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April 17, 2023 2:40pm
- Swifty
  
  Thanks graham.
  
  6 1
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  April 17, 2023 3:54pm
- Nickc2
  
  The two faces of the Media Council and Creative New Zealand.
  All this while the Race Relations Conciliator sat on his arse and did nothing.
  
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  April 17, 2023 4:33pm
miltonF

On the South Island scabies outbreak:

Has anyone made the connection that the most effective scabies treatment, ivermectin, has effectively been pseudo-banned via the govt and media demonisation as a “horse dewormer”?

If I was a doctor that wanted to keep his job, I would be avoiding prescribing ivermectin at all costs.

Unexpected consequences meet reality.
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April 17, 2023 2:52pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Wot if they have scabies and worms?
  
  3 2
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  April 17, 2023 3:58pm
nathie

All the best to the Strippers for their employment case against exploitation …. but is that really Jan Logie taking up the pole?

https://twitter.com/janlogie/status/1647461509721907207/photo/1

Is that why one of the reply commentators said:

“Is that one of those images where on one side its the advertisement for the business the other side what you actually get?” !!!

Could have been worse I suppose if JLR was on the other side!
11 0
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April 17, 2023 3:05pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Ouch!
  
  5 2
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  April 17, 2023 4:01pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  First reply:
  Shaneel Lal (Him/Her)
  
  5 3
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  April 17, 2023 4:02pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Steve Otto – I prefer (she/it)
    
    Shit.
    
    5 2
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    April 17, 2023 5:03pm
miltonF

On racial division in NZ:

I see many posters suggesting various reasons and explanations on why we see increasing racial division in NZ and seperate laws and treatments based on race.

Let me share with you a recent tweet I read, which hopefully will shine some light on the situation. RE special treatment for Māori. “Why is it wrong to have different laws and benefits for different sections of society? We treat disabled people differently to the rest of society, for example”.

Ouch. The poster equates Māori with disabled people. This is the epitome of racism. However I would suggest it is a widely and strongly held view on the left wing of politics in NZ. There is a commonly held belief, that Māori are inferior as a race, hence the need for special treatment so that we’re all “equal”.

This widespread racism needs to be denormalised before we can progress anywhere as a country. Martin Luther King would be rolling in his grave…
10 2
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April 17, 2023 3:11pm
- All_on_Red
  
  The soft bigotry of low expectations
  
  9 0
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  April 17, 2023 4:03pm
- Dave
  
  Disabled by 180 years of racist colonialism, I presume.
  
  2 0
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  April 17, 2023 7:03pm
graham

Is sanity FINALLY starting to come out of hiding and return to our world? It just might be poking a very tentative toe in the water.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/harry-potter-tv-show-the-uncancelling-of-jk-rowling/2CNAEWRCMBGEHOKSY6VEBPX4ZM/

Harry Potter TV show: The uncancelling of JK Rowling

Amid a backlash against her views on women’s rights and transgenderism, even mentioning Rowling’s name next to her works has been taboo in recent years.

At one event to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone last June, a journalist was infamously blocked from asking a question about her absence.

Thus eerily mimicking the famous reference to Voldemort as “He Who Must Not Be Named”. I wonder if these people have ANY sense of irony?

The decision to work with Rowling again generated instant outrage from trans activists, with some vowing to boycott the show before it has even begun filming.

But it may be a sign that the tide is turning for Rowling and others who have been ostracised by the media establishment for their views on women’s rights and gender.

One senior film industry source says the uncancelling of Rowling will ruffle feathers but is ultimately the right call.

“If you look at what JK Rowling has actually said and done, this is a woman who herself was a victim of domestic violence, who was a single mother, and has now devoted herself to women’s rights and helping other women who have suffered,” the source adds.

“Yet because she took a position, out of concern about those issues, she was just completely thrown under a bus”.
10 1
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April 17, 2023 3:29pm
- mogg
  
  If you want to see the tide turning on trans, just take a look at Anheuser- Busch and their But Light disaster.
  
  10 1
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  April 17, 2023 4:01pm
  - graham
    
    Yes, that gets a mention in the article:
    
    Brands are facing a growing backlash for wading into trans issues, with the US beer maker Budweiser embroiled in a row over adverts featuring transgender influencer Dylan Mulvaney and Disney locked in a feud with the US Republican Party for its opposition to “don’t say gay” laws in Florida.
    
    Re Budweiser, one bar owner put it like this:
    
    “In Bud Light’s effort to be inclusive, they excluded almost everybody else, including their traditional audience.”
    
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    April 17, 2023 4:54pm
Maggie Pie

On a serious note, you’ll remember a few months back I posted about Chynah having a ‘Secret-Police-Station’ located in Parnell. Some people scoffed.

Then our Foreign Minister Nanaia Mahuta said she considered the matter ‘concerning’ ….and would be “looking into it”

Since then – CRICKETS.

Wonder how long before we see this here?

https://twitter.com/littlemykonos/status/1647729522371072000
9 2
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April 17, 2023 3:31pm
- Nickc2
  
  Our illustrious Foreign Minister has been to China recently, probably to ask them to move their Police Station somewhere else.
  I think they’ll find value for money in Remuera with the Tennis Courts being an added extra.
  
  4 1
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  April 17, 2023 3:41pm
- Ghost
  
  She looked into it and signed them up to work for the family businesses …….
  
  9 1
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  April 17, 2023 3:45pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Yep, sponsored by Mahuta Corp. What could possibly be wrong with that?
    
    4 1
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    April 17, 2023 3:48pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    And rebrand the cars as…. ‘Mahutacorp Hainamana Tangohanga’
    
    😀 😀 😀
    
    5 1
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    April 17, 2023 4:13pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  They’ve been down in Wellington sorting stuff out with the Minister…
  
  https://www.newsroom.co.nz/kiwi-police-work-with-hong-kong-force-accused-of-brutality
  
  6 0
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  April 17, 2023 4:20pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    hmmm…. vely vely intalesting 🙁
    
    6 1
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    April 17, 2023 4:26pm
- Dave
  
  My HK born wife and I have seen 2-3 times a car with large Chinese writing saying ‘Police’ in Chinese. She assumes most or all Chinese social organisations are infiltrated by people reporting back to Chinese authorities.
  
  4 0
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  April 17, 2023 7:16pm
cmm

Interesting to see the shitstorm over informed consent. Rightfully so.

“In a decision released on Monday, Deputy Health and Disability Commissioner (HDC) Dr Vanessa Caldwell found the nurse breached the Code of Health and Disability Service Consumers’ Rights.”

“Caldwell said health services may be provided only if the consumer made an informed choice and gave informed consent – a rule the nurse breached.”

Where was Caldwell during the CV19 vaccination power play to fight the corner for “informed choice”?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/131788558/nurse-gave-girl-hpv-vaccine-at-school-despite-mother-withdrawing-consent
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April 17, 2023 4:00pm
- mandk
  
  Given that the form people taking the vaxx were asked to sign included false and misleading information, it is true to say that no one gave informed consent (unless, of course, they understood that the information was shonky and went ahead anyway).
  
  7 1
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  April 17, 2023 4:13pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    mandk – I have lost all trust in our whole health system and those who work in it.
    I was given a tetanus shot over a year ago after getting a hook in my leg. Nobody told me it was combined with 2 other vaccines.
    I’m not saying I would have refused it, but I wasn’t told about it. That is bullshit.
    
    6 1
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    April 17, 2023 5:14pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  The nurse should be sacked.
  
  Many doctors and nurses lost their jobs for doing the right thing and giving informed consent.
  The concerning thing when reading that story is, it sounds like the nurse presumed to mother was objecting to the covid vaccine.
  
  The nurse thought the concerns related to a different vaccine. She reassured the girl and her father that the vaccine she was administering was for HPV, then administered it.
  
  If that is the case then it is even more disgusting and outrageous that she would override the concerns of the parents. Especially as we know now without any shadow of a doubt, that the vaccines are utterly useless in young people and in fact, are dangerous.
  
  She should be facing criminal charges. Thank God it wasn’t my daughter, this would be far from over.
  
  4 2
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  April 17, 2023 5:12pm
ClanMcleod

I posted earlier about increased all cause mortality that coincides with the jab rollouts around the world. Correlation is not causation, but there is more than enough concerning information now available to have all of these jabs stopped immediately.

Excess Deaths Back With a Vengeance in the UK and Germany
After a lull, excess mortality 21% in the UK, 11% in Germany

Vaccine advocates say, “It is definitely not the vaccine,” without offering viable alternatives. The health authorities refuse to investigate the situation as if they do not want the answers to be known. Without extensive autopsies, pathology research, and individual-level statistical exploration, we cannot know the exact mechanism that caused 21% more than normal deaths among Brits in the week ending on Mar 31, 2023, and that caused 11% more than normal deaths among Germans around the same time.

https://igorchudov.substack.com/p/excess-deaths-back-with-a-vengeance

NZ saw a similar rise in excess mortality. The government tried to pull a con job by stating that all cause mortality for the last 3 years was lower than normal. That is true, but it is misinformation of the worst kind.
If you check the numbers for excess all cause mortality since the jabs were rolled out ours is up there with the UK.
7 2
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April 17, 2023 5:20pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  Here’s the reality.
  
  https://www.nzcpr.com/best-in-show/
  
  Professor John Gibson from Waikato University does the numbers properly.
  
  From late April 2020 until late October 2020 there was a continuous run of fewer deaths than expected. This spanned a national lockdown and a later Auckland lockdown being imposed and relaxed. Cumulatively, 1900 fewer deaths than expected occurred (a mortality deficit of about 9%) in the first seven months of the COVID response. The next year saw a slight rebound, so by November 2021 cumulative excess deaths were roughly -1800 (that is, over 20 months there had been a total of about 1800 fewer deaths than expected). Notably this period covered another lockdown, the “delta lockdown” starting on August 17, 2021.
  
  This all began to change from November 2021. Since then, New Zealand went from -1800 cumulative excess deaths to +1150 by the end of July 2022. In other words, in the last eight months there have been almost 3000 excess deaths (which is 13% above what was expected). The surge in excess deaths in 2022 far outweighs the mortality deficit from 2020.
  
  The chart is quite different to the happy-talk from government ministers about New Zealand having no excess mortality. In case anyone doubts the chart, the same pattern is seen at Our World in Data (here) except that source lacks the most recent deaths (which matters as the last week of July 2022 had over 200 more deaths than expected for that week of the year).
  
  As has happened throughout the last 3 years, we have been lied to, gaslit and bombarded with astonishing levels of misinformation by this government and their “experts” and supporters of the covid circus.
  
  6 2
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  April 17, 2023 5:41pm
  - kevn
    
    @Clan… via Herald: Doc in Taranaki getting hung out to dry for ‘speaking out’ about his jab opinion.
    Brave fellow and I hope he presents solid evidence to back himself. Plenty of data out there.
    I’m sure the NZDSOS team are with him.
    
    4 2
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    April 17, 2023 5:52pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      kevn – yes, there is an absolute tsunami of information yet the government (and opposition) refuse to acknowledge any of it. Same with the media but of course we know they are bought and owned.
      
      There are more and more organisations like NZDSOS and they are becoming better organised with every passing week.
      
      6 2
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      April 17, 2023 6:18pm
      - kevn
        
        One Dr Canaday… They said his (fair and reasonable imo) comments amounted to unprofessional criticism of other health professionals.
        Never mind the patients of course…
        
        6 2
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        April 17, 2023 6:25pm
ClanMcleod

Here’s the latest data for NZ. The numbers don’t lie.

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years, by age

[Mod – fixed link]
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April 17, 2023 5:46pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  Thanks mod. Appreciate it.
  
  3 1
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  April 17, 2023 6:19pm
- kevn
  
  @Clan… Thanks. I hope the senior economist is reading this. World In Data was his sole tool to deny there was an excess deaths issue.
  I gave up.
  
  5 0
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  April 17, 2023 6:21pm
- Ignoranus
  
  So what are you suggesting?
  
  If the vaccine were causing deaths then the numbers would be higher for 2021, but they are higher for 2022 because that’s when Covid spread.
  
  The vaccine has saved lives, it is the disease that is killing people. True the vaccines are not perfect. Nothing is.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:31pm
Swifty

Those damn violent white cis-males!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/weekly-beatings-began-while-locked-down-in-shearers-quarters-during-covid-19/ZQBYRH4L2RHNNN75AN24VDYHKA/
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April 17, 2023 5:48pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Why do women so hate living alone that they return to such an animalistic male homo sapien. One cannot describe the offender as a man.
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:17pm
Ghost

Good interview with Caitlyn Jenner about woman’s sport

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElLaNJAnI3o

Caitlyn’s new movement. https://www.fairnessfirst.us/
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April 17, 2023 6:55pm
Ghost

Former Labour MP Louisa Wall is understood to be thinking about running for Te Pāti Māori in Manurewa in this year’s general election.

Meanwhile, Buttabean Motivation (BBM) founder Dave Letele has confirmed he is in talks with the party about standing in Māngere.

Wall won the Manurewa seat for Labour in 2011 and retained it with a comfortable margin in 2014 and 2017.

NZ Herald
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April 17, 2023 7:30pm
- nathie
  
  Pity National didn’t try to snap up Dave Letele for Mangere?
  
  Anyway would be a hoot if the TPM’s “angry radical racists” Debbie Ngarewa-Packer and Rawiri Waititi didn’t make it back in the election … but Wall and Letele did!
  
  Both Wall and Letele have shown that they can work with others across the political spectrum (eg Wall with Simon O’Connor in Parliament and Letele seems to get on well with Leo Molloy)!
  
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  April 17, 2023 10:03pm
Ignoranus

Denying your daughter the HPV vaccine, and supporting a doctor who recommends Ivermectin as a treatment for Covid.

Evolution at work.
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April 17, 2023 7:51pm
Tauhei Notts

So the European Union countries said they must all support that country run by people with doubtful ethics, viz Ukraine.
So now Ukrainian grain is sending the Polish and Hungarian grain farmers into bankruptcy. The arse has fallen out of the grain prices. The Poles and Hungarians are not too chuffed about that.
“Not too chuffed?” They are far kin ropeable.
The law of unintended consequences strikes again.
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April 17, 2023 9:10pm
- Ignoranus
  
  Ukraine has exported huge amounts of grain for years. So what is different now? Is it not going to the countries it once did?
  
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  April 17, 2023 9:23pm
  - Taieri
    
    Ukrainian grain in question is an industrial grade wheat, which is sold in Poland as consumer grade wheat at below market prices and is marketed as a Polish-origin wheat. This amounts to dumping. This grain wasn’t meant to be sold in Poland at all. Industrial grain is used for production of spirits or as an additive to biofuels, it is not meant to be used as a raw material for flour production. As an aside, one of the biggest merchants-middlemen selling this stuff was registered as a company exactly on the day the EU removed duties from the Ukrainian grain.
    
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    April 17, 2023 10:02pm

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