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September 11, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 11 September 2023

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General Debate

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The Redbaiter

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Yesterday, during his appearance on Q and A, Christopher Luxon single-handedly destroyed any perception that the Nats are going to bring badly needed competence to NZ’s government. The interview was a disaster of monumental proportions.

Hard core Nat supporters are accusing Jack Tame of constant interruptions. However the interruptions were necessary as almost every time Mr Luxon gave an answer, it was bland boilerplate waffle designed to deflect and obfuscate.

Sure, Tame put Mr Luxon under more scrutiny than he does his left wing mates, but this is no excuse for Luxon’s embarrassingly poor performance. Mr Tame has always been a partisan actor and the Nat’s campaign team should know this more than anyone. Mr Luxon should have been far better prepared.

It was an appalling display of bluster and buffoonery, and the only worthwhile thing we learnt from it is that whatever faction within National decided the incompetent political neophyte Luxon should be leader, they should one and all be expelled from the party. Especially in the event the Nats lose what should be an easily won election.

I’ve been observing NZ politics for a long time. I can’t remember a worse interview performance from a Nat party leader. IMHO Mr Luxon is Labour’s most effective weapon in their quest to be re-elected in October.
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September 11, 2023 8:01am
- Cinematic
  
  I thought Chris did fine. No need to rock the boat as Labour and the left implode.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:20am
  - The Redbaiter
    
    Cinematic- “No need to rock the boat as Labour and the left implode.”
    
    Have you looked at the polls my friend? Without ACT National would be in real trouble. Bottom line is even with the worst Labour govt ever, Nats are not attracting enough support to be effective in govt. They will be controlled by ACT and NZ First. (given the Nat’s left wing standpoints on so many issues, not necessarily a bad thing)
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:01am
    - Colville
      
      Red.
      Without ACT National would be polling 50%
      Where else are those voters gonna go?? the Greens??
      
      National have moved left..no question. But its sensible. They have an election to win. The country is far more left they it was 6 years ago so to win National needs to appeal to the voters.
      
      The job is to win and set the country back on proper axis!
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:13am
      - kowtow
        
        That kind of winning is losing .
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:05am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        But those answers and the policy released to date indicate that National won’t “set the country back on a proper axis!”. That’s the worry.
        
        And have you or any other National supporter ever noticed the one thing that Labour and all their minions, including the MSM reporters and activists (blog and other) never, ever do?
        
        They never talk of appealing to the Centre Voter. I don’t think the word “centre” ever escapes their lips nor is their any indication in all that they say and do that the thought crosses their minds.
        
        They just get on with policies and regulations and vast amounts of spending and hiring of thousands of bureaucrats that perpetually push this country Left. Free first year varsity was opposed by National just six years ago (just like WFF was “communism by stealth”), yet now it’s also embedded.
        
        Which leads us to the question of whether National criticisms of all these Labour actions really are good faith arguments, knowing they’ll be bad for this nation, or just stuff that has to be said in opposition – until the time comes to shut up about them and get elected?
        
        Through the 1950’s-1980’s National cruised on keeping First Labour government institutions, winning many elections and staying in power for long periods of time.
        
        And that led us to 1983/84. I have this awful foreboding that we’re heading there again, but this time on more than just economic issues.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:16am
      - Che Guava
        
        Great point Tom. The only ones who talk about “winning the centre” are the self-described “centre-right” (instructive in itself). The left just push and push to the left relentlessly, while the “centre-right” follows them, because the latter don’t have any foundation. They are completely elastic and malleable. Their only beliefs are what (they assume) the public believes, based on focus groups and the like. That is the opposite of leadership based on core values and a set or bedrock principle, a la the left. Pretty soon, you’ve got a completely cucked so-called right wing who advocate all of the progressive liberal ideas of the left, just slightly less extreme. Then you end up with a lot of disillusioned people who can’t see any point voting for National.
        
        Many on KB advocate the “we just need to win, and that means getting the centre.” At what cost, though? Like a dog chasing a car, what happens when the dog “gets” the car? Stands there not knowing what to do with itself, presumably.
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:43am
      - septic skeptic
        
        I listened to a Plunket – Roger Douglas interview. One of the things Roger said was :
        
        “If you want to help people you tell them the truth. If you want to help yourself you tell them what they want to hear.”
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:47am
    - bjools
      
      This applies, considering the lies the left are telling.
      
      Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.
      
      Napoleon Bonaparte
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:27am
      - kowtow
        
        How did things work out for him.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:50pm
      - Paulus
        
        Sun Tzu “Know your Enemy ” likewise !
        
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        September 11, 2023 1:56pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      I agree with Red. Luxon is a climate change alarmist. He refers to are not alarmists as deniers or minimalists. I suppose he would call Dr. Steven Koonin a minimalist because he does not accept that there is a climate crisis although he accepts that human emissions cause the earth’s temperature to rise slightly.
      
      Consequently, Act is not the farmer’s party.
      
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      September 11, 2023 1:55pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        “Consequently, Act is not the farmer’s party.”
        
        Should be
        
        Consequently, Act is now the farmer’s party.
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:49pm
    - NothingLeft
      
      Kiwiblog is mostly an Act echo chamber (I’m saying that as a somewhat covid-policy-conflicted Act supporter myself).
      
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      September 11, 2023 3:34pm
      - ProtectBabiesFromPredators
        
        Well, it is a Forum where a good number of intelligent commenters shoot down Bullshit Balloons.
        A point: such phrases as “echo chamber’, and ‘keyboard warrior” serve no purpose, as we all engage in this fashion. We all do what we accuse others of doing. Guilt springs to mind.
        
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        September 11, 2023 5:42pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      “They will be controlled by ACT and NZ First.”
      
      G O O D !
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:20pm
    - slightlyrighty
      
      Have you looked at the polls? That comment did not age well….
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:25pm
    - sharont
      
      ACT down in the polls today. I’m not surprised after David Seymour’s comments that are more or less a threat to bring a National Government down if they don’t conform to what he wants. What has happened to Seymour? He has lost my vote. I’ll be voting two ticks National because I think Seymour is too risky and he’s actually making NZ First look a better choice, and I never thought I’d say that.
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:57pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    I think there is something in this though it’s hard to swallow. We all (on the centre right) want this utter shit show the far left has created cleaned up pronto. However, there is the problem of low-resolution-thinking voters, voters who vote based on idiotic feelings, and those brainwashed by the far left (and the far left media). National does need to win. Then they can move the dial by improving the economy, removing idiotic waste and propaganda from the institutions, then getting people onside with referendums (please!!!).
    
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    September 11, 2023 3:06pm
    - rouppe
      
      National have never moved “right” after winning an election.
      
      If they aren’t saying it now, they aren’t going to do it.
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:03pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Fair observation. Hopefully NZF and ACT will encourage them to move towards the sensible centre at least.
        
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        September 11, 2023 7:57pm
- Random T Person
  
  I cannot stand it when an interviewee (I interview people daily as part of my work) constantly deflects to prepared ‘talking points’. It is massively inauthentic and represents an individual controlled by their PR and marketing people, rather than by their own faculties and intelligence. Authenticity matters.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:33am
  - peterwn
    
    An interview is a two way thing. An interview is for the mutual benefit of both parties. Some interviewers have such big ego’s that they thing they are entitled to control and dominate the interview. The person being interviewed is quite entitled to keep the interview on track. Afterall the audience wants to know what the interviewee thinks, the interviewer is supposed to be the facilitator.
    So the likes of Random T Person can jump in the lake as far as I am concerned.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:33am
    - Random T Person
      
      What would I know, only been interviewing people TO HELP THEM GET THEIR MESSAGE ACROSS for 23 years.
      Nice season for lake jumping, in any event.
      Also, note the difference between Seymour and Luxon. Seymour is principled, intelligent and versatile. He answers questions, rather than deflecting to ‘talking points’ – Ardern is a famous example of the ‘talking points’ vs intelligent and articulate.
      
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      September 11, 2023 10:09am
      - Mark Hanley
        
        Is that the same “principled” Seymour who denies all cause mortality has been running at approx 116% since the introduction of the covid jab?
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:28am
      - Matt Long
        
        Hooten agrees with you. Hooten has apparently also forgotten his part in Muller’s Klutz’s Coup.
        https://www.patreon.com/posts/why-luxon-is-or-89032836
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:31am
      - hullkiwi
        
        That is rubbish. Tame was asking questions in a manner to inflict maximum embarrassment on Luxon & National. If you care to listen to Luxon, you will find he is the only leader with any principles. Just because an interviewer asks a question, it does not entitle the interviewer to get an answer or the answer they are looking for. This has been all too common with Tame.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:41am
    - rockape
      
      An interview should be to get information. Far too many of these lefty media people thing their job is to attack on behalf of their masters, the Labour Party.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:25am
      - Paulus
        
        Isn’t Tame one of the people involved with the TV Election panel questions along with Jessica Mutch – both Labour favourites out to make their fame by attacking National.
        Not sure of any other participants.
        
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        September 11, 2023 2:00pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    This is where Winston shines. He joyfully slaps the media around, wins support and gets his point across very clearly (off the cuff no less), all at the same time!
    
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    September 11, 2023 2:48pm
    - I remember when
      
      And has been voted out of Parliament twice and never reached more than 13.35% Party vote.
      
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      September 11, 2023 3:02pm
    - dutyfree
      
      and puts Labour into power
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:17pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        I presume he was seeing a Helen Clark style Labour with a fresh face.
        
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        September 11, 2023 7:59pm
- RRM
  
  Labour’s most effective weapon in their quest to be re-elected, is the unashamed, obvious and overwhelmingly left-wing biased news media. That isn’t anything new, and I doubt the National Party are unaware.
  
  Luxon isn’t exactly lighting the place up the way Key did, but the polls appear to be heading in the right direction. Hard-right firebrand has never been the National Party’s style, Luxon is sticking to that brand well IMHO. Perhaps he is trying to avoid interrupting his opponent while they are making mistakes?
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:49am
- Tomtoddy
  
  I think Luxon is too well prepared. He rushes in with heaps of stats and figures when he only needs a strong, focused answer that stops the questioning. Luxon is desperate to tells us he is all over the numbers but he loses us in the complexity.
  
  He needs a dose of mongrel rather than trying to be the happy chappy all the time. PM’s have to be tough and ruthless, not kind and full of platitudes a la Ardern. He should have stomped on Tame a couple of times. His smile is a little forced – like the person with new false teeth. I guess he cant help that but less of that slightly artificial pleasantry would help him.
  
  He was caught out badly on the “what to do with the tenants who are misbehaving”. He should have been briefed on that.
  
  Having said that Tame is a dreadful interviewer, too much to say, too cocky, too much interruption. I believe Luxon will be a good ‘chairman of the board’, a good Cabinet leader but he has a lot to learn about politics, especially the dark arts. He is still transitioning from the Head Office, being a successful businessman to being the consummate pollie.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:53am
  - Yabster
    
    Lames a socialist little snot who thinks his opinion and view of the world is far superior to other plebs-
    
    I don’t often agree with “RED” but National/Luxon should have expected that line of aggressive questioning as Lame has form.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:09am
    - slightlyrighty
      
      To a certain degree, I agree with you, however, Luxon’s background in business and as a CEO doesn’t have that adverserial public aspect that politics, and in particular, political media has.
      
      Sometimes it shows that Luxon may not have the media savvy that a more seasoned politician has…
      
      But then again, Luxon has a better level of personal and public achievement that puts anyone on the political left in NZ to shame.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:37am
      - The Redbaiter
        
        Slightlyrighty- “Luxon has a better level of personal and public achievement”
        
        Yes, but of course when you’re making the comparison with Labour, this doesn’t mean much.
        
        In fact Luxon’s business career is not as wonderful as he makes out. At Unilever, a plodding march through the tiers of management selling icecream and toothpaste with a dash of socialist messaging thrown in for extra flavour.
        
        At Air NZ the company did well but much of its success was due to a world wide increase in air travel. In fact there was much internal criticism of Luxon’s management and especially over the ill-fated alliance with Virgin Australia. The Virgin boss was pretty critical of Luxon at the time.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:04am
      - cmm
        
        CEOs exist in a bubble where everyone around them fawns over their existence. That’s a bit diffeent to being a PM or such.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:15am
      - alwyn.a
        
        @The RB
        The alliance with Virgin Australia was created before Luxon worked for Air New Zealand. The alliance started in 2010 and was terminated in 2018. Luxon didn’t join Air NZ until 2011 and didn’t become CEO until 2012. How is he responsible for the alliance being started.
        He is responsible for it being terminated. That is in his favour, When the termination was announced the Air NZ share price rose and the Virgin price fell. After all, Air NZ were no longer going to be carrying Virgin Australia.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:34am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      His name is not Lame, it’s Tame, as you well know.
      
      What are you, twelve?
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:56am
      - kowtow
        
        Tame he certainly isn’t , he’s a little yapping lefty cur.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:07am
      - Unity
        
        Lame is his nickname and suits him as his interviewing technique is very lame. He was so hard to watch/listen to yesterday. He was like a Rottweiler, not an interviewer. He should learn some manners.
        
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        September 11, 2023 1:36pm
      - Yabster
        
        Plenty of nicknames used on KB, Lodden and that one suits the lil snot – if you don’t like I don’t give a shit.
        
        “What are you, twelve” ..”as well you know”- no I am not… although if I was, look at all those ramraids I could get up to without any consequences…
        
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        September 11, 2023 2:04pm
  - kowtow
    
    ‘He was caught out badly on the “what to do with the tenants who are misbehaving”. He should have been briefed on that.’
    
    Caught out ? Briefed ?
    
    nah , if you want to be PM you’ve got to have the answers , at the very least , to the obvious questions , not from a brief but from your brain .
    
    Seymour would have owned Lame in a heartbeat .
    
    I’ve seen both on the hustings . Seymour has what it takes in a stand , sadly Luxon doesn’t .
    
    But he’s all we’ve got .
    
    Which is sad.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:09am
    - Prince
      
      So what would Seymour have said ?
      I’d send in the troops ?
      I’d chuck ’em out on the street ?
      I’d have a chat ?
      
      IMO, there is no ‘good’ answer, and Tame knows it.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:31am
      - rangitoto
        
        If they abuse assistance from the tax payer then they will have to find their own accommodation.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:28am
      - kowtow
        
        Can’t speak for him , obviously , but having seen him in action with numerous hecklers ;
        
        He’d have turned it on lame and asked him ;
        
        Are you happy for the tax payer to keep being hit by extremely badly behaved tenants who have no sense of personal responsibilty .
        
        he’d have said , at some point people must accept responsibility for their own actions , don’t you agree Jack ?
        
        He’d have said , why do we keep rewarding poor behaviour ;
        
        Etc
        
        And he’d have left the Lefty Little prick in tears .
        
        ps this forum is constantly filled with “hey housing NZ (KO) get your shit together ”
        
        And suddenly now we’re all cowering on behalf of Luxon on the same subject.
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:04am
      - emmess
        
        The correct answer is
        ‘ I don’t give a fuck. Don’t participate in anti-social behaviour then.’
        Just worth it to see that weasel Tame’s reaction.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:51pm
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Maybe “if they are anti-social, and disrupt other tenants (who are being sheltered by the taxpayer) lives to that extent, and will not change their behaviour, they can go back and live with their parents. Else they will be on the streets. Living in a taxpayer provided accommodation is a privilege and comes with responsibility. No-one has a right to have their shelter paid for by other people”.
        
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        September 11, 2023 1:41pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Heather Du Plessis Allan said she does not care.
        
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        September 11, 2023 5:37pm
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        Prince – IMO there is no good answer – is probably accurate but Luxon owes it to the communities and the next generation learning from and being harmed by these anti-socials to have good answers.
        
        Firstly, we need to get back to basics and do the things that make our society strong. We would have a stronger society if more people decided to only have children from within a monogamous, wedded relationship. While this is an abrahamic religious view it is also been shown throughout history to be a fundamental of strong civilisations. So teaching of relationships and sexuality at school needs to be on the basis of what makes a strong family, makes a strong society, which ultimately reduces the number of people being harmed.
        
        Secondly, we need to protect children and communities from the harm that anti-social people cause when housed in close proximity. If they are not functioning socially then we owe it to the community around them and the family under the roof to remove the harm.
        
        Thirdly, we need to support the anti-social people who want rehabilitation. Teaching them reading, parenting skills, basic skills for running a functioning household, caring for a property etc. Not doing these things should result in reductions to benefit payments.
        
        Anyone wanting to lead the country must be capable of having a vision and providing answers on how we move things forward.
        
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        September 11, 2023 8:16pm
    - RRM
      
      Luxon is older and more accomplished in life in general. But Seymour has been a right political party leader for much longer. H’s been called all the names, had all the rocks thrown at him, naturally he’s a bit more battle hardened.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:36am
      - hullkiwi
        
        That makes Seymour a political street fighter (who didn’t handle himself well with media last week) & this in itself doesn’t necessarily make him PM material though.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:48am
    - peterwn
      
      Seymour has the privilege of saying what he likes. Luxon is the leader of one of the two major parties and therefore if his party prevails is accountable for his pre-election utterances. Indeed more so than Labour’s leader.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:37am
      - septic skeptic
        
        I hope that’s NOT the case with Luxon. Because if he really is ruling out everything he says “is not our policy” we are in for a term or two of re-arranging Labour’s deck chairs before they come back in to steer us into the iceberg.
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:57am
    - The Redbaiter
      
      kowtow- “Seymour would have owned Lame in a heartbeat”
      
      Well said. Here is David Seymour showing how its done and completely demolishing Tova O’Brien in the process.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:38am
      - Opie
        
        Seymour: Not giving someone (beneficiaries) someone else’s money is not punishing them.
        
        That’s probably the most important statement made in theast 20 years
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:03am
      - kowtow
        
        And he did a great demolition job on the dweeb from tv3 too.
        
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        September 11, 2023 2:27pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Seymour excellent. Tova utterly vile there, as usual. I’m not sure why David F has such a shine for her.
        
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        September 11, 2023 2:57pm
    - rockape
      
      What’s your definition of misbehaving. There may be different answers dependant on the behaviour. There is a World of difference between threatening or actual violence and parking your car on the verge or playing music too loud.
      
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      September 11, 2023 10:06am
    - I remember when
      
      The answer was that what will be done with difficult tenants is the secondary problem.
      Firstly, they have a duty to protect the rights of those being disadvantaged by the behaviour of a few.
      How the difficult tenants are dealt with will be decided once the bigger problem is under control.
      Hopefully, strong and decisive action will deter others from following in their footsteps.
      Lastly, they are a relatively small group while their actions have much larger consequences.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:50am
    - Pineapple Lumps
      
      What about suggesting a new system to Tame?
      
      Jack, I’m sure you don’t believe people who are unable to function in society should be responsible for bringing up the next generation of Tamariki? That’s how you get intergenerational dysfunction.
      
      The majority of good people in social housing will get places that are of a high calibre – plus a rent free bonus every 12 months they have up to standard property at inspection, no damages, place kept well, and no complaints from neighbours.
      
      Those that are anti-social will be moved to anti-social housing units. Constructed out of concrete, fully water washable internal surfaces, located in a location that is separate from the community. Children removed to care by family or if not possible state care. The children deserve better than to be left with people who can’t function in society. Raising these children is too important to leave it to people that can’t even function properly as individuals.
      
      Yes, some of these children may have less than favourable experiences in state care. But that is less of an issue than how many are harmed staying put or the damage whole communities sustain when the scum are allowed to carry on in our midst.
      
      Antisocial housing for antisocial people.
      
      Now these people aren’t irredeemable – if they are prepared to attend education programs: learn to read, learn what it means to be a fully functioning member of society, positive parenting courses. Then they can get themselves out of the anti-social housing unit.
      
      Alternatively, get a job, show a landlord you can take care of their property and pay the rent, and get yourself out of the ASHU.
      
      Either way we have safer, better communities.
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:58pm
  - Colville
    
    Tom.
    Luxon needs to just not drop an absolute clanger in the next 5 weeks and he has won it. So being prepared is good/safe. That is his job. To win.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:18am
  - Random T Person
    
    Caught out? Should have been briefed? How about having a view and expressing it clearly. This is precisely what I am getting at.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:12am
    - Paulus
      
      Luxon is the Leader of a team and it is not the team Leaders job to have a detailed knowledge of whether the person delegated, as the subject matter team participant, will have the detailed answer which they would be expected to know.
      Ardern would just lie in a forceful manner.
      We are going to get rid of that attitude shortly.
      
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      September 11, 2023 2:09pm
  - I remember when
    
    Why are childcare and kindergartens hot beds for illnesses this year that don’t seem to be covid, flu or any of the usual suspects?
    Certainly have similar symptoms but very hard to clearly define what the illness is.
    How much of our current illness is due to our rather lengthy periods of isolation from the usual causes of infection.
    Is it time for serious research into our need to be
    constantly generating immunity to numerous virus and bacteria.
    
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    September 11, 2023 11:37am
- KiwiSapper
  
  “….an appalling display of bluster and buffoonery..’
  .
  I totally agree with this view and add that the appalling aspect of this has existed from day 1. Luxon’s unsuitability was clear and has become greater and more entrenched.
  .
  I have reached the opinion that those who would vote for Luxon fail to see that the King wears no clothes and they are as sheep like as the Gadarene swine who would vote for Winston Peters. Sadly it seems New Zealand voters really are deserving every disaster that has emerged from our Pandora’s Box and worse, the remaining hope has been trampled to death.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:57am
  - kowtow
    
    How much of this goes back to the internal machinations in the National Party to oust Bridges , which set off such ructions and ending now with a victory for the wets and what may be a dissappointing victory in the GE .
    
    Bridges was actually doing OK ( for all his faults)
    We’re not being told what was really behind that coup.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:14am
    - Paulus
      
      Media were behind Simon’s departure as they were disgraceful against him and his family.
      As a neighbour at the time I am aware of various disgraceful attempt to denigrate him publically from within, and get any media attempt to lower his rating by innuendo which they suceeded.
      
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      September 11, 2023 2:13pm
    - Pineapple Lumps
      
      Astute comment kowtow!
      
      I was recently incensed by Andrea Vance’s article about the factions in National. Particularly her reference to the social conservatives in the party being called the Taliban. While I think Vance is a lefty troll, I have found other articles where the ‘Taliban’ faction in the Nats is referenced.
      
      IMO, Luxon is not in a position to front foot this. As Vance points out he is an evangelical Christian and so would be seen to be part of this faction. So it is really the Deputy’s job to call this out and put Vance in her place. The fact that Willis hasn’t done this suggests that the liberal faction in National really do refer to the Conservatives as the ‘Taliban.’
      
      As you have suggested, pushing Bridges out was very much a power play by the woke liberal faction in National. Mueller’s breakdown foiled them but it suggests Luxon holds a bit of a weak position internally.
      
      In my opinion, this socially liberal element of National explains the more left of centre, wet, woke feel of the party. To a degree I think their sway over Luxon is making him a weaker leader.
      
      I will admit I am wrong if Willis comes out strongly condemning Vance’s despicable comparison of National MPs with a Christian faith with an extremist, militant, terrorist organisation. In the meantime the ongoing silence condemns the liberal faction in National.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:34pm
  - The Redbaiter
    
    Kiwisapper- “Sadly it seems New Zealand voters really are deserving every disaster that has emerged from our Pandora’s Box”
    
    Yes, it is sad, but its also true. NZ under the present Labour govt has truly reached a terrible low point in its political and social condition. However its not all Labour’s fault. National over the years has played a big part in this outcome.
    
    Now the blind who voted Jacinda in 2020 are shifting their vote to National and are just as blindly electing National’s own male version of Jacinda.
    
    The tragedy is if voters exercised their power, they could make their support conditional on National changing course, but they won’t do this. They’re therefore giving the Nats licence to be as left wing as they want.
    
    Nats under Luxon won’t bring about the change in course this country needs. In ten years NZ will be as bad as or worse than Venezuela, and the most tragic part is the damage will have been brought about primarily by the blindness and apathy of the NZ voter.
    
    Bent on electing Jacinda after Jacinda after Jacinda.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:22am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Trudeau strikes me as sort of a male version of Jacinda. I don’t think Luxon is that bad to be fair. He’s older and at least has real leadership and business experience for starters.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:04pm
  - Prince
    
    I’m firmly of the opinion that those who rubbish Luxon would like nothing better than to see three more years of Labour Govt and total collapse of our Economy, Health, Education and Justice systems.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:34am
    - kowtow
      
      Utter nonsense.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:06am
    - leoj
      
      Rubbish.
      Luxon is merely Labour with a blue tie.
      Luxon’s powder is still dry and many of us do not see much difference between the two major parties.
      The Nats have a history of managing Labour’s bad policies.
      Key blew it when he had a mandate to abolish the maori seats but chickened out. Luxon is following suit by refusing to discuss a referendum on the true meaning of the ToW.
      In other words, both are gutless.
      All this “maori wonderfulness” (thank you Bob Jones) is bringing the country to its knees.
      
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      September 11, 2023 2:57pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Luxon & Co need to find sensible and moderate achievers in the “Maori community” who want to see Maori descendants stop using the distant past as an excuse not to get ahead. Then start programmes to encourage looking forward and getting ahead in life (through training and education).
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:48pm
    - sharont
      
      I agree. I think that Seymour’s performance today is likely to assist Labour and certainly not National. He has undermined a National/ACT coalition and given voters the idea that National/ACT will not form a stable government. If Labour is reelected then Seymour can be credited with assisting them back in to power.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:23pm
  - rockape
    
    And you know him so well. How many times have you met him? Me it’s about a dozen now and I say your talking ballocks.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:08am
  - coge
    
    All of Luxon’s obvious shortcomings will continue to dog him as PM. His proclivity to mindlessly back the latest thing, whatever that happens to be. Is likely to be his undoing.
    
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    September 11, 2023 3:21pm
  - ProtectBabiesFromPredators
    
    Jesus! Can’t you wait until he gets in power? He must placate the middle-class women, white, who vote Green. It is a strategy, not fait accompli!
    
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    September 11, 2023 6:00pm
    - sharont
      
      I agree that it is a strategy. Luxon can always be ousted if that doesn’t turn out to be the case, but Seymour has shown he’s a bit of a flake and is helping to get Labour back into power behaving and speaking in the way he has today. Very disappointed. Up until recently he has not put a foot wrong. Seymour has lost my vote now for sure. I would rather put my party vote with National and aim for a stable government than have someone who is behaving like a loose cannon. Seymour has not only undermined National but he’s also undermined ACT with his performance today.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:28pm
- mogg
  
  Considering your long time observations’ you have very naive views on political interviews and what Tame’s intentions really are.
  Slippery Hipkins with his manufactured smile and wrap around kindness, is everyday having to backtrack on moronic ideology and lies made by his mouthy colleagues who don’t know when to shut up .
  Why does Luxon want to cause any distraction from that??
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:14am
- Sacha
  
  Red is back on form!
  Hi, Red!
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:46am
- Rusty
  
  @Redbaiter,
  
  I would like to know how many Nzers watch that boring Q&A programme — not many?
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:55am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Rusty, only people who watch Q & A are a handful of political tragics, including the self opinionated KB tragics, who are so far down the rabbit hole they have lost sight of the sun.
    
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    September 11, 2023 12:44pm
    - Rusty
      
      @Ra.. Agree
      
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      September 11, 2023 2:33pm
- banksie
  
  I agree.
  
  Jack was always going to be a hostile interview but most of the questions he asked we fairly predictable and should have been easy to answer.
  
  His worst was the question of what to do with the people Kaianga Ora evict. It was always going to be the talking point that National just want to chuck these people on the trash heap. Even as I am sympathetic with the point Luxon was trying to make that it wasn’t fair on the law abiding resisdents of KO facilities he desperately needed an answer as to where these people go.
  
  He also could have been a lot less evasive on the issue of the modelling underlying some of the policy they have put out. Heck he could have put Jack on the defensive by pointing out that he hasn’t asked for modelling of policy for anyone else during this election cycle.
  
  It wasn’t a good interview at all.
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:08am
  - Random T Person
    
    Tuquoque is not a defence, logically speaking. Oh but you are hanging negroes. It is a distraction and diversion. Answer the question as asked, don’t whine about why someone else wasn’t posed the same question. It’s weak.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:15am
- imalwaysright
  
  Redbaiter,
  
  Very good analysis.
  Luxon got slapped around the room by a third rate interviewer.
  What an embarrassment.
  You can see how easy it was for ardern and mallard to dictate to him what he must do over covid.
  He’s weak.
  We need strength.
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:14am
- JJ56
  
  Yes, poor interview. Pretty easy to anticipate the line of questioning: last resort accommodation; cancelling so called climate policies; number of houses to tax; rules around taxing them.
  
  No got-yas there.
  
  The problem for Luxon he (and his) clearly thought it had got to the point in the campaign where seeming prime ministerial was important, so talk about the big picture: fairness to existing renters; building a consensus on climate change; and assure that tax relief would come what may.
  
  Tame (and his) tried to characteristic the specifics as issues of values and credibility. But Luxon didn’t have the quick replies to shut off the obvious questions allowing Tame et al to draw the inference.
  
  The concern is Luxon didn’t recognise the ground had changed and change his. An interview isn’t like a negotiation where you can withdraw and regroup, it happens in real time.
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:31am
- Liberty
  
  Redbaiter
  “I’ve been observing NZ politics for a long time.”
  Redbaiter has been observing for a long time.
  In his heyday on Usenet.
  any left-leaning individuals foolish enough to employ the word “we” were met with severe reprimand. While Redbaiter possesses merit, he tends to display ambivalent tendencies. Admittedly, his criticism of the Labour, Green, Maori and various special interest parties is understandable. Notwithstanding, NZF, National, ACT and libertarianz have also been the subject of his condemnation. In an ideal scenario, what qualities would you seek in a political party, Redbaiter?”
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:42pm
  - ProtectBabiesFromPredators
    
    In an ideal scenario, what qualities would you seek in a political party, Redbaiter?”
    
    We will never know. Baiting is fishing, trolling in a real sense. Solutions are never offered by Redbaiter, because he has none.
    
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    September 11, 2023 6:07pm
- Warren
  
  Ha ha Chris Luxon out touch and the worst interview ever seen according to Redbaiter yet National now have 40% of the vote with Labour not being able to put a Government together with their partners the Green’s and the Maori Party. The School children on here that have been calling the National Party Leader all sorts of names and calling him out of touch will need to vote Labour to get rid of him if they are lucky.
  
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  September 11, 2023 6:25pm
Benedict Yu

This Tova O’brien is a piece of work.

“Not quite believing our ears, we asked it another way, would he consider working with parties with anti-vaxx candidates?

Whether it’s dressing, talking and fighting like a pirate or consorting with conspiracists, Christopher Luxon seems prepared to do anything to get into power.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300967901/sword-fights-to-antivaxxers-christopher-luxon-will-do-anything-to-win

An “antivaxxer” used to be someone who was convinced that the MMR vaccine caused autism or a range of other imaginary evils. They really annoyed me. OK super understatement there

Fast forward. What is a Tova antivaxxer? Someone who hated the covid vaccine mandates? How about someone who points out that they are not very effective, another understatement?

Would that make me a Tova antivaxxer?

She is setting herself up as the arbitrator of views that are evil and which should exclude those who hold such views from public life.

The label “antivaxxer” has nothing to do with science. It is another weapon in the identity politics war, like transphobic.

If we go back 15, 20 years, the typical anti vaxxer was a university educated young mother of infants and young children. Educated in politics or liberal arts, never science. Disproportionately from the left, and a Greens supporter. The rationale was that vaccines were not “natural”. This was at the height of the GMO madness.

Fast forward to today and the Green Party is the champion of the mrna vaccines. A prominent Green MP went so far as to complain publicly that the infant vaccine for 6 months old infants was unavailable in New Zealand.

“Why is the pediatric vaccine not approved/available in NZ yet? Please change the stupid process that is preventing this from happening. We’re in a massive next wave and the babies deserve protection too.”

https://twitter.com/JulieAnneGenter/status/1580434690770550784?t=sxodbRwBg-X_2S2q3XMQpw&s=19

Of course, the COVID vaccine for babies and infants was never made available in New Zealand.

So why the transformation of the Greens from “GMO is evil” to “let’s give mrna vaccines that don’t work very well to babies at negligible risk from COVID?

IMO it was the use of mandates and crushing the lives of people who disagreed with government mandates. If you can control the speech and movement of people who question the COVID vaccines, you can do the same to people who want to drive their SUV. A trial run for future action.
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September 11, 2023 8:01am
- kevn
  
  BY… Toxic tova.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:06am
- NK
  
  Like most modern journalists, Tova is trained to not read nor think. If she wanted to read something about the Pfizzer Vax for example, she could read the contract Pfizzer had with the South African government, likely to be identical to ours, which has just been released.
  
  It contained these words, “Purchaser acknowledges that the long-term effects and efficacy of the Vaccine are not currently known and that there may be adverse effects of the Vaccine that are not currently known. Further,…The Vaccine is not serialized.”
  
  Safe and Effective we were told.
  
  And media like Tova brought it hook, line and sinker. Politicians laughed at us for believing otherwise.
  
  Shame on the lot of them.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:13am
  - NK
    
    Bought it….
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:13am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    I believe Tova and the rest of the mainstream media did exactly what they are paid to do. Promote the jabs.
    
    Some may have been gullible useful idiots, but it is impossible that 100% of them fit this category. Many simply refused to rock the boat for fear of losing their overpaid jobs.
    The silence of those who had concerns but kept quiet is disturbing.
    
    The same way it is statistically impossible that not one of 121 MPs has concerns about the safety and efficacy of this experimental product. The silence of these people is beyond disturbing. It threatens what we call democracy, the foundation stone of a stable society.
    
    (For the sake of argument, we’ll put Peters into the political opportunist basket, and not someone who is a true crusader against the injustices of the last 3 years.)
    
    The uniformity of messaging from media and government is North Korean in scope. That should truly concern any person who wants to live in a free and democratic society.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:00am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Clan
      
      The real virus is the media.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:22am
  - Winsome Peters
    
    Thanks for that mate. So in terms that a blue-collar hick like me can understand.
    
    The buyer understands that:
    1 – we don’t know if the vax even works.
    2 – we don’t know what the acute adverse effects may be.
    3 – we don’t know what long term side effects may be
    
    . . . sign here.
    
    PS – What does the “not serialized” condition mean ??
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:35am
    - NK
      
      Basically no serial numbers, vials cannot be traced to individual patients.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:59am
  - Sacha
    
    There was a similar leak from one of the South American contracts early on. It vanished from the internet very quickly!
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:49am
- kowtow
  
  It’s clearly attack on all fronts from te media pardy .
  
  Like Jack Lame’s questions on Q+A relentless . When was he or TVNZ so relentless in questioning Ardern’s numerous failures , lack of costings , spending .
  
  And Claire Trevett , in Ferald today is clearly disappointed that Q+A doesn’t have a bigger audience and is looking forward to the tv debates so “the rookie MP with no answers ” gets shown up.
  
  They really are out to get him , in a way Ardern and her regime were never done over.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:21am
  - The Redbaiter
    
    kowtow- “They really are out to get him , in a way Ardern and her regime were never done over.”
    
    Yes of course they are, but who is surprised? The Nats should have a strategy to counter left media bias that has existed for decades. If they don’t their campaign managers need to be sacked.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:51am
    - RoboRob
      
      Agree. In the US Trump and Desantis actually do best when under attack from partisan ‘journalists’. It is an opportunity to show strength and decisiveness. People on the left openly attacked CNN for the Trump debate / interview, arguing that it was a gift to him.
      
      Desantis has been slipping in the polls since he stopped doing interviews with hostile media. A number of political commentators are arguing it’s what he needs to do to get back in the race. Turns out smacking down intellectual midgets on tv is a great way to bolster your image.
      
      Luxon should be doing the same. However he is trying very hard to not offend people.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:07am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Indeed…
      
      And if the Nats fail to sort out the bias in RNZ /TVNZ, when they are in Government then they shouldn’t be surprised that they are constantly on the back foot when communicating with the public.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:08am
      - RoboRob
        
        They should immediately defund both. There is no justification for the government to own its own media outlets.
        
        Back in the day we could argue that niche content wouldn’t be available without RNZ. Now with podcasts and Youtube RNZ and TVNZ server NO social purpose. They only present the danger of state funded information campaigns, which our Labour overloads have leaped in and taken advantage of.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:20am
      - Sacha
        
        I think that the government could have a radio broadcast where new policy announcements could be read out by a neutral voice without comment.
        Then the other communication channels could interpret as they see fit, but the original would be available for reference.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:54am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        I hate to tell you this Maggy, but there is a chunk of National MP’s who are quite happy to have RNZ/TVNZ constantly pushing the narrative on Climate Change, TOW issues and so forth, because it helps them win those same arguments in Cabinet by talking about “everybody agrees….”, which is the alpha and omega of National.
        
        So they’ll happily take the brickbats from RNZ/TVNZ on other issues.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:38am
    - hullkiwi
      
      They have got a strategy, or as seems to be common with some on here, you haven’t been paying attention.
      
      Just because Luxon isn’t saying, or responding the way you want, it doesn’t mean there isn’t a very effective National campaign happening.
      
      If you want evidence, may I suggest you get out on the street, or look what happened to the CTU campaign…..
      
      If you care to look…
      Hipkins is being viewed as hapless, and without friends, while Luxon is being talked about as the Prime Minister in waiting. That does not happen by accident.
      
      As for Tame, who will remember yesterday’s interview tomorrow? Just the small group of people who watch that show, of which there are not many…. So, debating what was or was not said by Luxon on Q&A is/was academic
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:08am
- Gravelroad
  
  Ms O’Brien is on board with Labour’s divide and conquer election policies – based on fear and control.
  The best thing Mr Luxon can do is stay dignified and inclusive.
  If he talks to people who questioned the vaccines and mandates (even if didn’t at the time), so what?
  This campaign by Ms O’Brien is just an extension of the Labour financed witch hunt of outing “unsuitable” candidates at the local body elections last year.
  Not the media’s finest hour, but they were paid to do it, so why not?
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:21am
  - mawm
    
    Maybe we should be questioning Mr Luxon as to why he supported the vaccines, the mandates and PM Ardern when our own Medsafe had issues with their safety and effectiveness, and as we have more recently found out from the Pfizer contract, the long term effects and efficacy were unknown and that there maybe adverse effects not currently known. As the leader of the opposition why did he not publicly question our then PM who was straight out lying by saying they are safe and effective. Instead, without thought to the consequences, he rolled over and did her bidding. Is this the man you want to make decisions affecting us and our country? Or even Seymour?
    
    I have had it with our spineless politicians who are supposedly our representatives not standing up for our sovereignty and who seem to be in lock-step with an unelected supra-national body out to control our lives.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:50am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      In all fairness to Luxon, he was not Leader of the Opposition in Feb 2021 when the first Covid vaccines arrived.
      
      He didn’t become leader until 30 Nov 2021.
      
      If you recall, Simon Bridges tried finding out what information Ardern & Co had about Covid, PEPs, Lockdowns, and vaccines…… but he was stymied all the way.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:13am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Maggy – I don’t think anyone is blaming Luxon personally for what happened during covid. I certainly am not. But he’s the leader of a party that supported the policies at the time.
        The negative impacts of those covid policies are still with us and will be for many years.
        Not speaking about it is not a good strategy I believe, for reasons I have highlighted in another post if you search for it.
        
        I know Bridges got attacked for bringing it up, so did hundreds of thousands of NZers, and worse, were punished in indescribable ways for doing so.
        That’s even more reason to speak up against tyranny.
        Giving up because it is ‘too hard’ is exactly what you’re supposed to do. Don’t do it.
        
        Fight this all the way because it is the right thing to do.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:40am
      - wsk12345
        
        Anyone know if Bridges took the vax? I can’t recall when he left but wasn’t it about that time?
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:42am
      - Ghost
        
        He left a year after the vaccine started rolling out, a couple of months after his son had an awful accident.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:51am
      - I remember when
        
        And didn’t Simon Bridges do well because of his approach to covid!
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:05pm
    - wsk12345
      
      I wonder how much info they had. If you were assured by the PM that they had all the testing and approvals would you think she was outright lying to your face? I would never have believed that a government could be so nasty and dishonest that they would put their citizens at auch massive risk. Until this happened.
      
      Of course now I look back and see that it’s been happening around the world for years eg the AIDS stuff with Fauci, vioxx, OxyContin,….
      
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      September 11, 2023 10:40am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Big Pharma have deep pockets and zero scruples. They are responsible for destroying trust in our health systems.
        
        There will be a number within those systems who are responsible for nothing more than not paying attention and trusting those pushing these products. Naivety could be a generous excuse.
        
        But there will be many who either realised it was wrong and said nothing to protect their own careers, and there will be some who are actively and fully complicit in pushing this nightmare for either financial or political gain. Possibly both.
        
        We know the government were advised of the risk to young people and we know they suppressed this information. It will need a real Royal Commission with no limits on the Terms of Reference to really get to the bottom of this.
        
        There will be many in parliament and in the government bureaucracy machine for whom this will be career ending and possibly even bring criminal charges. No wonder they are fighting so hard to suppress the information and shut down the conversation.
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:20pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    The refusal to talk about or talk to those most negatively impacted by the totalitarian response to covid is the reason why this country is currently heading down the toilet.
    
    As for those who constantly moan that there are more important things to worry about and to stop talking about covid, tell me which of those issues weren’t dramatically and negatively impacted by the covid response?
    
    Health?
    
    Education?
    
    Crime?
    
    Economy?
    
    Poverty?
    
    Homelessness?
    
    Then tell me how pretending the worst abuses of human rights in at least a generation is going to fix this problem?
    
    The horrific covid response, and the guarantees of what will be done post election to fix the damage, should be front and centre of this political campaign. Anyone wishing it to go away is as delusional as they are irresponsible.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:24am
- Random T Person
  
  She’s a child and writes like a child.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:33am
- Ruahine
  
  When Covid came along Labour and the Greeds saw the future and they enjoyed every minute of it.
  Yip. Yip.
  Bullying and Bossing is their thing.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:07am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Those who advocated and injected young people under the age of 18 should be brought up on criminal charges. This age group were at statistically zero risk and should not have been subjected to this experiment. Willingly or not.
  
  It was known from the very earliest days of the rollout of this poison that there were numerous groups for whom their was zero data and no trials had been done. This was not communicated to the public. This was deliberate policy by government (and all other parties) to ensure maximum uptake of jabs in this experiment.
  This is malfeasance of the highest order.
  
  Here’s a link to the Risk Management Plan on the Medsafe website for those who want to take the time and read it. It clearly states that there was ‘missing information’ regarding effects on some of the most vulnerable groups, yet this poison was promoted heaviest to these people.
  
  https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/COVID-19/Comirnaty-RMP.pdf
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:11am
- imalwaysright
  
  B.Y
  
  Good points .
  It looks like the media want to select our candidates .
  
  The main sticking point in getting the media blessing seems to be disbelieving their previous three years of covid propaganda.
  
  I wonder why.
  
  Is it that they don’t want MPs who dare to think for themselves ?
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:34am
- Philview
  
  Most people I know have had the covid jabs including myself but I don’t think people are interested in getting jabbed again. The reason being that we know fit, healthy people who have died from or had heart attacks. I suspect the numbers getting boosters will dwindle.
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:16am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Philview – there have been concerns from many genuine experts about what the long term impacts of this experiment might be for anyone who took it.
    Particularly threats to the innate (natural) immune system, which the whole concept of mRNA has been trying and failing for over 20 years to mimic or improve.
    
    It had been a complete failure up until the C19 experiment came along, no product had ever made it to market and for good reason. They are dangerous experiments. Apparently the C19 jab was the ‘miracle’ breakthrough that the Pharma industry has been wetting their pants over for the last couple of decades.
    
    Except it is a miserable, dangerous failure.
    
    The evidence is emerging of the damage these things are doing to just about everyone, and it isn’t just myocarditis and pericarditis.
    
    COVID-19 mRNA Vaccines Reduce Immune Response to Other Infections, Potential Concern of Immune Deficiency
    
    https://www.theepochtimes.com/health/covid-19-mrna-vaccines-reduce-immune-response-to-other-infections-potential-concern-of-immune-deficiency-5486433
    
    A recent study on the immune effects of Pfizer’s COVID-19 mRNA vaccine has scientists raising concerns over vaccine-acquired immune deficiencies.
    
    Vaccine-acquired immune deficiency syndrome (VAIDS) is a new colloquial term coined by researchers and health practitioners since the COVID-19 vaccine rollout. Though not recognized as a medical condition, some experts believe the COVID-19 vaccines may impair or suppress immune responses.
    
    It actually isn’t a new term, I read about it via Eugyppius and El Gato Malo, 2 medical expert bloggers who were warning about it over 2 years ago.
    Similar warnings are in the Risk Management Plan on the Medsafe website. This includes but is not limited to:
    
    Important potential risks
    
    Vaccine-associated enhanced disease (VAED) including Vaccine associated enhanced respiratory disease (VAERD)
    
    https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/COVID-19/Comirnaty-RMP.pdf
    
    Also this from the same Medsafe website:
    
    This document is a summary of the updated risk management plan (RMP) for Comirnaty, Comirnaty Original/Omicron BA.1, and Comirnaty Original/Omicron BA.4-5. The RMP is created by the vaccine manufacturer and is submitted to medicine regulators as part of the vaccine approval and safety monitoring processes.
    
    So far so good, then we get to this:
    
    The RMP details important risks of Comirnaty, Comirnaty Original/OmicronBA.1, and Comirnaty Original/Omicron BA.4-5, how these risks can be minimised, and how more information will be obtained about Comirnaty’s risks and uncertainties (missing information).
    
    If that doesn’t describe a medical experiment I have no idea what does.
    
    I didn’t get the jab, but can anyone who did, tell me if they remember their doctor, pharmacist or other jabber explaining these ‘risks’ to them as part of their ‘informed consent’?
    
    I’ve yet to hear anyone say they heard anything at all except ‘safe and effective’.
    
    But our political parties want us all to pretend none of this happened!
    
    Fill your boots people, I will never forget.
    
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    September 11, 2023 4:11pm
    - sharont
      
      I didn’t get the jab after reading the information from Doctors with Covid Ethics. It’s quite clear that a lot of damage has been done to people’s health with this experiment. However, nothing will be done about it. It will be covered over for future generations to unpack and expose. We need to concentrate on the most important thing at hand, which is getting rid of this Labour Government. If we achieve that, at least some parts of the country might get back on the right trajectory. I am sure that in future more people will refuse something so unproven and nor will many accept the lockdowns that were forced on us and wrecked the economy.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:45pm
- emmess
  
  So why the transformation of the Greens from “GMO is evil” to “let’s give mrna vaccines that don’t work very well to babies at negligible risk from COVID?
  
  Because they hate humanity and see humans as parasites on the planet
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:54pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Apart from themselves. Obviously.
    
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    September 11, 2023 7:12pm
- miltonF
  
  How to make a greenie’s head explode – explain to them they’ve injected themselves with a genetically modified gene therapy. KABOOM!
  
  The greens were only second to the ACT party in showing their true faces during Covid.
  
  Green Party anti GMO, pro nature etc?? Not a chance…
  
  ACT party libertarian and pro human rights? Not in your dreams.
  
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  September 11, 2023 3:30pm
- ProtectBabiesFromPredators
  
  Don’t forget that Tova O’Brian is minimum wage or close to it, elevated by being able to publicly accost random strangers.
  She is poor.
  The Media Card has no responsibility any longer, they all must FOLLOW THE MONEY.
  
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  September 11, 2023 6:14pm
peterwn

Concerning David Seymour’s thoughts on post-election arrangements if National and ACT happen to get a majority. Commentators here and elsewhere are goading Chris to respond. Chris Luxon is not obligated to negotiate with ACT before the election. Indeed Chris Luxon would be foolish to do so. Threats from ACT about what they might do after the election are completely hollow at this stage. They can only be taken as tub-thumping for the benefit of ACT supporters. I cannot understand why Seymour is making threats at this stage, doing so is counterproductive and could lose the centre right.a sliver of support which could be essential for victory or give Winston a foot in the door. Quite apart from counting chickend before they are hatched.
Agreed after the election there would be intensive negotiations in the proverbial smoke filled room if National and ACT are potentially in a position to form a government. There will be rats to be swallowed on both sides. While Chris may not be a top ‘platform’ politician he will be a tough negotiator.
However if Winston obtains the balance of power, Winston will negotiate with the two Chris’s, not with other minor parties. ACT and Greens will mot get a look in based on what happened in 2017.
Best thing David Seymour can do at the moment is to shut up on this.
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September 11, 2023 8:01am
- David Garrett
  
  Best thing David Seymour can do at the moment is to shut up on this.
  
  I quite agree. I have detected more than a hint of hubris in Seymour recently. While he is not my cup of tea – nor I his – you have to give the guy credit: he has brought ACT from the brink of oblivion to a party likely to have 14 MP’s post election.
  
  Everyone knows that like the Greens and Labour, ACT has only one coalition partner. He should shut up; most especially he shouldn’t be talking “bottom lines” – either now or later. At best he risks getting egg all over his face.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:27am
  - RalphT
    
    David, sorry I can only partly agree with you. While Seymour has played a part, I think that most of the credit for Act’s rise should go to the National Party. If it were not for their steady drift left and into to the world of woke, people like me would continue to support them. From now on it’s Act for me.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:42am
    - Random T Person
      
      It is the same for me RalphT. Nats are singularly unprincipled. ACT principles might be a bit pliable, esp WRT mandates and vaxes vs personal liberty and responsibility, but still a better bet.
      
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      September 11, 2023 10:17am
      - peterwn
        
        Principles do not win elections. Political parties have to move with the times. If National does not move more towards the centre it will be history in due course. The number of hard right ‘founding principles’ adherents is diminishing over the years.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:00pm
    - hullkiwi
      
      Ralph, your comment is and isn’t correct.
      
      As has been written before, most of the support that National/Act have gained has been because of government failure, with most of that vote (circa 16%) going to National. To earn most of that vote, National has not needed a plethora of radical non-work policies. What was needed was exactly what we have seen a cohesive, united & disciplined caucus. It has not needed a leader that mouths off at every little provocation or mouths a new policy every five minutes like a barking dog.
      
      Undoubtedly, some, like yourself have considered this approach woke, and like yourself, they have switched their support to Act. What can I say, other than be careful what you wish for.
      
      Many on here, have said Act is not representative of the woke agenda, and many have claimed that by supporting Act, this will prevent National from implementing the woke agenda further. They have also gone as far to say that Act will give National a backbone and Act will keep National honest.
      
      Really, and where have I heard all that before? I seem to recall, that was the battle cry of those who were urging support for Peters in 2017 e.g. Slatter & his followers ….and how did that work out?
      
      Agree with him or not, Wayne Mapp, has been correct and consistent, being in government is about compromise. A National/Act government needs to be realistic about what should and may be done over the next 3 years. Else the agendas of some, would have a National/Act government in opposition at the following election in 2026. Is that what we really want? All because we consider Luxon/National too woke for our personal preferences.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:55am
    - David Garrett
      
      Ralph: I think you may well be right – or at the very least, partially right.
      
      The only way to find out would be to do a poll exclusively seeking the view of prospective ACT voters and asking “What is the main reason you will be voting ACT?”
      
      There would be any number of answers, including “Because Luxon is so wet”. But I’m sure ACT would not waste precious campaign dollars on such a poll…For ACT – and Seymour – it doesn’t much matter why the punters are voting ACT at this stage, the important thing is that they are.
      
      Our gracious host might decided to do such a poll, just for fun…
      
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      September 11, 2023 2:02pm
- The Redbaiter
  
  peterwn- “Best thing David Seymour can do at the moment is to shut up on this.”
  
  Mr Luxon and National are the authors of their own misfortune in this matter. If they had not decided to take National far to the left, in an attempt to attract left wing voters, ACT and NZ First would not be building in support. They would therefore not have the power to dictate in terms of post or pre-election negotiations.
  
  Seymour and Peters only have this power because National’s poor election strategy, (alienating a large part of their traditional vote base) has handed it to them.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:30am
  - All_on_Red
    
    National moving to be centre left and Act taking up the void on the right looks like a sensible strategy to gain as wide a spread of support and win the Election…
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:00am
    - RoboRob
      
      Agree. With regards to Winston, he was always going to mop up the voters who cant stand to vote National but have had enough of Labour.
      
      I know sensible people that dont particularly like Winston but who are none the less Left wing voters, they are probably going to vote Winston first.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:25am
      - rockape
        
        Does Nationals misfortune under Luxon include going from 25% in the polls to 36% ?
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:26am
      - RoboRob
        
        @rockape
        
        I was agreeing with All_on_Red. Having a centrist right wing party and a hard rigth wing party is a common sense way of getting the right into power. I am not attacking Luxon here. Although I do think he could be a little less timid.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:58am
      - peterwn
        
        Sensible people and Winston supporters are mutually exclusive.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:02pm
    - peterwn
      
      Yes, the community at large has moved to the left over the years and gained a social conscience in things such as health, education, welfare, climate change etc. A centre right party has to accommodate this trend if it is to survive. The likes of Redbaiter and others who claim that National should return to its ‘founding principles’ blah blah are merely spokespeople for a diminishing group of voters.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:45am
      - The Redbaiter
        
        peterwn- “the community at large has moved to the left over the years and gained a social conscience in things such as health, education, welfare, climate change etc. ”
        
        Yes, mainly because the National party has been purposefully infiltrated by the left, and turned into a party that will not confront this slide.
        
        The Nats have completely failed to make any counter arguments, so it is no surprise this leftist drift has occurred.
        
        Anyone who thinks the things Peterwn lists above, and what he calls “social conscience” is mistaken if they think this is a good thing. They are disastrous socialist policies that will eventually bring utter ruin upon NZ.
        
        These ill considered concepts are actually the reason NZ is in such dire straits at the moment, and will be in even more dire straits if leftists who think like peterwn are not kicked out of the National party and it does not take stand on the matters it was originally formed to take a stand on.
        
        NZ is behind the times in taking steps to fix the failures of its center right parties. The UK and the US and many other countries are realising this truth, that their “center right” parties have been similarly infiltrated.
        
        Its why the right is rising in Europe and politicians like Vivek Ramaswamy, Donald Trump and Ron Desantis are leading the polls in the US. NZ needs to similarly get up to speed, and it begins with kicking all of the leftists like peterwn out of the National party.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:28am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        … and gained a social conscience in things such as health, education, welfare, climate change etc.
        
        I would have thought the the long-standing institutions of our Public Healthcare, Public Education and Social Welfare would already have indicated a “social conscience” embedded in the NZ psyche, and even in the National party one, since they’ve never shown the slightest indication of pushing Health and Education solely or even partly into privitisation – beyond what has long existed with a minority usung health insurance and private schools – and with mere tinkering around the edges of Social Welfare.
        
        What you really mean is that the Left have successfully defeated the Right in argument on these issues in defining them as being even better for being even bigger than before. In fact the only dramatic path change we’ve had in decades was courtesy of a Labour government, one that National watched in envy.
        
        And if the group of voters who think much of this will eventually destroy the nation but are “diminishing” in number then what’s the point of voting for National.
        
        Oh right. Social conscience with good management capability. As if that changes fundamental flaws in systems design.
        
        What was that phrase? “Tired of all the winning”?
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:51am
      - rockape
        
        Some people forget that we elect representatives . If the people who vote for parties move in a direction why wouldn’t you follow what they want. That plan only ends up with being sidelined. Do we really want voters to follow parties or parties to represent the wants of voters? If a party gets elected as Government or at least gets the most votes then it’s probably got things right for voters. If it’s polling 5% then it’s not representing 95% of voters wishes.
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:06am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        The ‘community’ hasn’t moved to the left. The
        ‘community’ has been brainwashed, propaganised and lied to for thirty years about nonsensical concepts like ‘climate change’ in particular, but a whole raft of other delusional ideological nonsense. ‘Gender’ is just the latest one.
        
        If we don’t return voluntarily to founding principles, based on millennia of hard learning, we will be forced back there in the most unpleasant manner (for the majority of unsuspecting people). Those who have been mesmerised by the last 40 years or more of ideological indoctrination regarding the ‘war on terror’, ‘war on drugs’ and lately the ‘war on viruses’ and the ‘war on the family unit’ which is being waged with venom.
        
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        September 11, 2023 4:26pm
- redeye
  
  How come the young liberals in the media persist in asking Seymour about getting his policies over the line during coalition negotiations, but The Greens can announce any stupid policy they like and not one journalist asks how they expect them to get theirs over the line. Especially considering Hipkins has specifically stated they wont be implemented.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:32am
  - Matt Long
    
    Because ACT and National are rising to the bait, instead of “we will have those negotiations after the election. ”
    However I do think it’s a good idea for Seymour to let people know he has other choices than just being Luxon’s poodle and his voters won’t have wasted their energies.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:11am
    - peterwn
      
      Centre right voters will have wasted their energies if any National / ACT combination falls apart requiring a premature election (for which ACT would get most of the blame). Labour / Greens would be guaranteed to win any such premature election. In other words ACT risks shooting itself in the foot by being excessively stroppy. ACT needs to stop counting chickens before they hatch. ACT needs to shut up on this for now and concentrate on helping National to beat Labour/ Greens. It is ACT posturing and making all the noise on this at the moment, not National.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:56am
    - rockape
      
      He can do that post election. Right now he is just shit stirring!
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:09am
- Benedict Yu
  
  “Winston will negotiate with the two Chris’s, not with other minor parties. ”
  
  I agree. Winston would not give David Seymour the time of day. I think that if there was a potential New Zealand/First/Maori Party/Greens government, Mr Hipkins would jump at it. He would find some formula of words to step back from his commitment to not work with New Zealand First. Next minute, Hipkins is PM again. And Winston is at the front end of an Emirates A380 heading to Geneva, or Paris, or Washington as Foreign Minister. I’m not even kidding here 🙁
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:37am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    BTW, I think that Seymour is entitled to convey prerequisites for entering government. But… they should be very few in number (I’d say two at the most), and his language needs to be measured. I agree that he seems to be over doing things.
    
    On the referendum on the Treaty interpretation, he should have said, only once…
    
    “This is such an important objective that it will be a prerequisite for us being part of a government. I will leave the detail for any coalition negotiations.”
    
    He could have said that once, and if asked again refer back to his previous statement.
    
    That is quite different to banging on about multiple “bottom lines”.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:41am
    - Mark Hanley
      
      Without bottom lines…..
      
      ACT stands for nothing!
      
      Don’t belive me? Has Winston ever had a bottom line?
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:58am
      - RoboRob
        
        Winston has had plenty of bottom lines. I think he termed the phrase?
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:26am
      - Colville
        
        Winston has had lots of bottom lines..absolute guarantees… and every single one of them changed the day that it mattered.
        
        A worthless piece of dog shit.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:31am
      - kowtow
        
        colville
        
        I’m amazed that after some 25 years of his guile there are still more than a few folk taken in by his “charm”.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:43am
      - Jethrod
        
        He is a bottom trawler.
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:49am
      - rockape
        
        I keep hearin Winston is such a smart politician. And. Seymore is appealing to so many as he has experience. How then is National on 36%, ACT on 12% and NZ First on 5%?
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:30am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Tell us what you really think Colville!🤣
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:54pm
      - Colville
        
        NZer..
        
        I have tried to get other comments posted with my views on Winston but they dont get past the Mods.
        
        I was pleasantly surprised this morning…
        
        I know where the line is now…so now I know where to push 🙂
        
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        September 11, 2023 6:08pm
    - peterwn
      
      But not if he risks sinking the centre-right ship. As it was said in WW2 ‘Loose talk sinks ships’.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:58am
      - kowtow
        
        Lips
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:54pm
- BeaB
  
  This seems a serious misjudgement by David Seymour. The last thing any new government needs is a self-important minor party yapping at its heels all the time. He should have a chat with Winston and ask him what his term in the wilderness felt like. ACT’s credibility is already being undermined by its exodus of strange candidates. Seymour should reconsider his strategy.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:37am
  - jv
    
    And an over cocky leader who needs to take a couple of deep breaths and calm down and behave like a grown up (as Jacinda never learnt)
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:27am
  - wsk12345
    
    “It’s exodus of strange characters”.
    
    Know any of them?
    
    4 left because they don’t share Seymour’s views on the vaccine mandates. Given that 30% of Kiwis supported the Anti Mandate protest in Wellington I’m not sure why you think these people are “strange character”- actually They Are Us. It’s Seymour that is out of touch.
    
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    September 11, 2023 11:41am
  - sharont
    
    Seymour certainly needs to reconsider his strategy. ACT has gone down in today’s poll – probably because Seymour has been behaving like a bit of a prima donna and people may feel safer voting for National. If there is any truth to the rumours, and they get out into the public domain, ACT could be struggling come polling day.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:56pm
- ProtectBabiesFromPredators
  
  ” I cannot understand why Seymour is making threats at this stage.”
  Yes, you can. It is his reading of the Electorate. Right or Wrong, he is positioning for more votes. He has nothing to lose this election. If you opine that Seymour is hysterical, look at Labour?
  
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  September 11, 2023 6:21pm
- ecco
  
  Obviously Act’s internal polling is telling him their party vote is much bigger than what the mainstream polls are saying.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:19pm
Dougal10

With all his mouthy posturing has Craig Rennie just put a nail in the coffin of the CTU.
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September 11, 2023 8:02am
Scott

Here are my quick notes from the Air NZ video safety briefing when I flew to Australia last week –
Tane Mahuti is the guardian of the world. Tangoroa is the guardian that gave us our language.
Papatuana is our mother earth.
Ranganui is the stars who guide us.
We invite you to go on Tiaki’s quest to care for the people and the culture of Aotearoa.

This is completely pagan mythology. Apparently at Air NZ, Maori animist beliefs are OK?

But imagine if they said this – in the beginning was the word and the word was God. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. That’s Christianity, that’s no good!

But pre Christian pagan myths, that’s all good. In fact it’s compulsory you listen to this indoctrination into the pre Christian pagan world view dressed up as a safety briefing.

The people will have a religion. You can have the hour a week in church or you can have 24 hours a day of pagan wokeness. Opting out it seems is not an option.
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September 11, 2023 8:03am
- Cinematic
  
  Agreed, Māori mysticism has no place in the modern world other than as an amusing example of silly old beliefs.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:24am
  - Sacha
    
    I regard it as akin to ‘lucky 4 leafed clover’ – or throwing spilt salt over my right shoulder. 🙂
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:04am
  - MikeS
    
    “mysticism has no place in the modern world other than as an amusing example of silly old beliefs.”
    
    Does that include Luxon’s religious beliefs?
    
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    September 13, 2023 9:39pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  As soon as anyone lectures me about the “earth mother” I switch off, and become annoyed. Because I am trapped in a seat on a plane, and someone is spouting religion at me. It is as simple as that.
  
  After hundreds of flights, I do know what to do in an emergency, so I don’t need to be told again. But what about a new flier?
  
  The safety briefings should be provided in English with Maori subtitles.
  
  It should start with:
  
  “What we are about to tell you could save your life in an emergency. So stop talking and pay attention.”
  
  It should end with:
  
  “If we need to use the evacuation slides, do NOT take your personal belongings with you. Anyone who does so will be banned from all airlines for life.”
  
  But no, the safety briefing is a cross between virtue signaling and entertainment.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:29am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    If you switch off and ignore it you may have to buy your own plane, like Bob Jones did.
    I am more likely to be killed by Hillary Clinton than in a plane crash.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:50am
    - Yvette
      
      Steve, drawing the attention of Hillary Clinton to yourself may not be a smart move.
      She could kill you
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:28am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        She doesn’t know where I live.//
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:53am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    “The safety briefings should be provided in English with Maori subtitles.”
    
    Not just safety briefings. Everything, if the govt wants to placate the minority posers and activists that actually care about this virtue signalling.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:09pm
- alex Masterley
  
  I had to put up with the same bollocks travelling to and from Australia yesterday.
  I just tune out now.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:32am
  - Colville
    
    The answer to the problem.
    
    https://www.sony.co.nz/electronics/headband-headphones/wh-1000xm5
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:42am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      I have those headphones. I can attest that if you have them on during the safety briefing, you will be approached by a grumpy face and asked to remove them.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:07am
      - Colville
        
        Bene. It must be your disposition. I have never been asked to remove them . Just smile more 🙂
        
        and I wear them from the moment I get onboard until I leave…so I dont have to listen to the shite Māori singing!!
        
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        September 11, 2023 9:35am
      - peterwn
        
        And remember that while Bob Jones was able to afford a private jet when he got booted off a Air NZ flight (for refusing to remove his headphones for an exit row briefing), the average person cannot.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:02am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        I think it is because I frequently sit in the exit row. IIRC that is how Bob Jones got thrown off the plane a few years back.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:03am
      - dutyfree
        
        Just stare at the screen, thats what I do.
        
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        September 11, 2023 7:24pm
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Sadly no, the crew will pester you to take them off. I read a book rather than watch, these videos are offensive bullshit plus the production values are rubbish. If I wanted a deity paddling a flying Waka, I’d look in the mirror!
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:49am
      - peterwn
        
        Well, you can always fly Jetstar. Presumably their safety presentations are simple ad traditional like Qantas.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:04am
      - Flossie
        
        Petwrwn you can’t always fly Jetstar – their destinations/departures are fairly limited.
        
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        September 11, 2023 10:45am
    - alex Masterley
      
      The screen in front of me had the safety briefing. If you had earphones on you could not hide. I took the earphones off and gazed into space.
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:11am
- kowtow
  
  That wasn’t a safety briefing it was indoctrination.
  
  Probably in breach of all sorts of international agreements ……….if so could te media pahti take that up in the same manner they do the alleged breach by the Nat’s tax policy and housing…..didn’t think so.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:54am
- Ehlana
  
  The book of Genesis is thought to have been written about 1450 years BC. It’s part of the Jewish scriptures that were incorporated into Christianity. That means it was already 2,500 years old when Maori first arrived in New Zealand.
  And Christianity itself was already 1200-odd years old by then.
  It could be argued that Maori animist beliefs can’t be described as pre-Christian, because Maori society didn’t exist in pre-Christian times.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:22am
  - Scott
    
    Fair enough. My comments relate to the religion of this land which was pagan worship of the gods. Christianity arrived in the 19th century with the first sermon preached by Samuel Marsden on Christmas day 1814 in the Bay of Islands. ✝️
    
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    September 11, 2023 1:07pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Why not just change the name to New Zimbabwe Airlines and be done with it.
  
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  September 11, 2023 4:06pm
- PeeJay
  
  I suppose you could always try and refuse to listen or pay attention and try and use the Bill of Rights as a defense?
  
  Off the top of my head, the safety briefing could constitute a breach of section 9 – Right not to be subjected to torture or cruel treatment?
  
  Or, as this is clearly religious in nature, claim this is a breach of section 13 – Freedom of thought, conscience, and religion?
  
  Be bloody funny if some sharp legal eagle tried this!
  
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  September 11, 2023 6:01pm
Benedict Yu

“A trio of Māori academics from Aotearoa is in Peru to reinforce indigenous bonds and rewrite a shared history that transcends colonised boundaries.

The delegation, led by Waikato University academic Kelly Klink, is working with Raul Diez, a professor at the University of San Ignacio de Loyola, to document the pre-colonial historical ties between Māori and the Inca people.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/maori-delegation-in-peru-to-set-record-straight-on-ocean-voyaging/37K6URVXTBBGJILZBJNX7W3BUM/

🤯 Maori arrived in New Zealand from Polynesia in the 13th century. Then they set out for Peru in the 15th century? No credible evidence cited.

I am sceptical. Travelling from Stewart Island to South America in the 15th century, by canoe, and establishing deep cultural ties with the Incas? 🤔 That is 10,800 km across the Pacific Ocean.

I would challenge these three academics to undertake that journey now, in a replica 15th century canoe, wearing replica period clothing, and equipped with replica 15th century food and water stores. And with 15th century navigation aides. 🤯

This is the problem over and over. Too many academics in New Zealand have strayed from teaching and research, using the scientific method, to become activists, steeped in Te ao Maori. It is not evidence based science.
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September 11, 2023 8:03am
- Blog-aholic
  
  There is a new TV show being advertised about the Maori roots and South America etc etc. The ad I saw basically says ‘hey look at us we’re moari we came from here, and here and here so we can’t really be indigenous then can we’?
  
  Peters is correct on that count.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:12am
- herb1
  
  It’s easy when you have no written history. There’s no annoying books to upset your “ interpretation “ of history.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:14am
- pdm
  
  Kelly Klink – sounds German to me.
  
  Is he/she a descendant of Colonel Kink from Hogans Heros?
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:15am
  - Tomtoddy
    
    klink n. empty, hollow sound
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:18am
    - Stellaboxer
      
      I worked with a corrections officer with the surname Kline and one named Locker.
      
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      September 11, 2023 8:49am
  - Kiwisaint
    
    Was there a Schultz to?
    …’I know nothing!’
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:47am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  As the Kumara plant had already spread through Polynesia by the 15th Century, there must have been some prior contact by Polynesians with South America (or as is more probable.. s.American Indians with Polynesia).
  
  One question of primary significance is whether kūmara came first into the Marquesas or Rapa Nui with the arrival of Amerindians in the twelfth to fourteenth centuries (Ioannidis et al. 2020) on their own sailing rafts, as has long seemed more probable than otherwise (Anderson et al. 2007; Wallin 2020).
  https://thepolynesiansociety.org/jps/index.php/JPS/article/view/491/365
  
  https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2487-2
  
  (Kumara – Ipomoea batatas is a S. American plant – cultivated for centuries in central and S. America)
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:29am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Fast forward 600 years and I can’t afford kumara 🙁
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:45am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      BY – grow your own. It’s pretty easy to grow!
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:33am
      - Jack5
        
        Not easy to grow south of about Kaikoura, ClanMcL.
        
        That’s one of the reasons Maori population was so sparse in the bottom three-quarters of the South Island.
        
        They nearly all lived on the coast or around Foveaux Strait. After the last moa was cooked, and until sealers and whalers arrived with potato plants, southern Maori ate mainly fish, other sea food, and muttonbirds.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:05pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Jack5 – apologies, you are 100% correct. I forgot that not everyone lives in the sub tropics.
        
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        September 11, 2023 4:29pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    this issue was settled decades ago. There is no way that South American technology could have reached polynesia. Thor Heyerdahl’s raft needed to be towed out of the current that runs south to north.
    
    David Lewis’ book “We the Navigators” convincingly demonstrates that the polynesian double hulled canoe was more than capable and fast enough to make long passages. The canoes in tahiti were bigger than Capt Cook’s Endeavour.
    
    However, that is not to say that this sort of trip was normal. I suspect that voyages of exploration were very rare, and probably due to resource pressure on the home islands. I also expect that for every successful mission there were many, many failures where all the crew starved or were wrecked or ran out of water.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:23am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      …for example, the trip to NZ was clearly one way… if you missed NZ, I hope you dressed up warmly! 🙂
      
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      September 11, 2023 11:58am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        According to Andrew Crowe, “Pathway of the Birds” he has a pretty convincing narrative that for about 150 years (1250 to 1400) two way voyaging was highly probable, even if infrequent. NZ artefacts from this period have been definitely found in the Kermadecs, and possibly in Rarotonga.
        Some two way voyaging was essential. Exploratory and discovery trips would be essential. People (colonists) would not set off into the wild blue yonder without any knowledge of what lay over the horizon.
        By 1400, the end of the Medieval warm period, climatic conditions and wind directions had changed sufficiently that setting out from New Zealand would have been too difficult with the waka of that time.
        
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        September 11, 2023 1:09pm
      - kowtow
        
        ‘the end of the Medieval warm period, ‘
        
        I expect the Holy Roman Emperor’s ban on fossil fuel use and exploration had the desired effect.
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:39pm
      - Jack5
        
        Re kumera and South America and Kelly Klink…
        
        The Herald report says of the Klink trio’s talks in Peru:
        
        …. their research are ties symbolised by the likes of kumara and totara.
        
        “So they have these totara reeds [sic], and they call them totara, they used them for building kayaks. We have the totara tree, which obviously is the tree we used for waka, and there are so many of these similarities,” Klink said.
        
        Poster Maggie Wassilieff, from her scientific field, may be able to tell us if totara trees are native to both NZ and South America, or whether they are two specimens that are just “close”.
        
        I was under the impression that “Southland Beech” trees were found native to southern Chile as well as to NZ, and I know that Bluff oysters are also native to Chile, where they are farmed.
        
        If these links are true, surely they are likely to be evidence of plate tectonics – movements of land masses hundreds of thousands of years ago – rather than of cross-Pacific trade in canoes.
        
        Bluff-Chile oysters:
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dredge_oyster
        
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        September 11, 2023 3:40pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        The bulrush sedges which South Amerindians used for rafts are called totora
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schoenoplectus_californicus
        
        So… NOT the same word as the Maori word – Totara.
        
        (and completely different types of plants).
        
        It’s about as nutty as thinking Maori must be descended from Egyptians… as they both call the sun Ra.
        
        There is a S. American tree which is very similar to our totara – It is Podocarpus nubigenus.
        
        It is known as manio/male maniu.
        
        https://www.conifers.org/po/Podocarpus_nubigenus.php#:~:text=Distribution%20and%20Ecology,the%20southernmost%20species%20of%20Podocarpus.
        
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        September 11, 2023 8:06pm
  - Taieri
    
    there must have been some prior contact by Polynesians with South America
    ————–
    
    Thor Heyerdahl tried to prove this hypothesis. At the time, the prevailing scientific opinion rejected his findings. Frequent Maori travels to Antarctica is an established fact though, perhaps kumara came from there?
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:44am
  - Raphael
    
    The Phoenicians also sailed far and wide. who knows if they helped with the spread of Kumara?
    
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    September 11, 2023 12:23pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Sceptical is an understatement.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:31am
  - BeaB
    
    Thor Heyerdahl?
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:39am
    - greybeard
      
      Thor & Co. were blown from east to west.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:14am
    - Jethrod
      
      He of the book “The Kon Tiki Expedition” circa 1950
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:56am
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        Yeah, he cheated. Towed out of the current on his raft.
        Successfully proved nothing (other than insane levels of bravery)
        
        Polynesian double canoes clearly were seaworthy, fast and capable – and must have made at least one return voyage – the kumara is pretty convincing evidence.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:01pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  That would be one of the canoes going to Antarctica that misread the stars and got lost in the night.//
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:55am
  - Matt Long
    
    Maori found that by taking their Waka across the South Pole they shortened their trade journeys to Argentina by a considerable amount.
    The shorter journeys meant they needed less slaves for food and could carry more cargo. This was how Maori invented productivity.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:21am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Willie will be around for a chat shortly.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:55am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Ben, I think you will find there is quite a bit of evidence (I have read a couple of texts on it, just can’t remember them off the top of my head) to show that Maori lost their ability to sail long distances reasonability quickly after settling in NZ, as they didn’t need to any more. So for anyone to claim now that they sailed to Peru is far fetched at best.
  
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  September 11, 2023 2:06pm
Kiwiguy

This is a good summary on Chris Hipkins from an overseas perspective. Often things are clearer from a distance, and this guy nails it.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/patrick-robertson-80ab01204_chrishipkins-newzealand-vaccinemandate-activity-7105818470243549185-csSP/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop
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September 11, 2023 8:04am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “There was no compulsory vaccination, people made their own choices.”
  This idiot has no idea that there is this internet thingy – everywhere.
  
  https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/Stuart-Smith-Kaikoura-MP-National.pdf
  
  Ardern was helping him out with her lies.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:02am
  - Ehlana
    
    He should watch more tv. Tina from Turners says “online’s everywhere”
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:31am
  - MikeS
    
    So there was compulsory vaccination in NZ ?
    
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    September 13, 2023 9:57pm
Gravelroad

Is Novax Djokovic going to win the US Open tennis this am?
I say yes.
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September 11, 2023 8:04am
- Flossie
  
  Good call Gravel!
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:43am
- Tony Stuart
  
  24 Grand Slams for Djokovic now. His claim as the best of all time is becoming more and more compelling.
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:52pm
  - MikeS
    
    Yep he’s certainly got to be considered as the GOAT. I always wish Borg hadn’t retired so young would have been interesting to see how many he might have won if he stayed in the game. (and was fully into it)
    
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    September 13, 2023 10:00pm
artemisia

Hundreds of Auckland Council jobs gone and seems many more to go. Have to wonder what they did all day, and whether anyone will notice they’ve gone. And BTW not blaming for a moment those made redundant, but rather the bosses who engaged them and told them what to do.

Having said that, it is usual, indeed required, to use restructuring process to exit poor performers, but again those same bosses already had plenty of ways to deal with them. And didn’t.

Auckland Council redundancy bill $8m and rising as budget cuts hit jobs

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/local-government/132899758/auckland-council-redundancy-bill-8m-and-rising-as-budget-cuts-hit-jobs
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September 11, 2023 8:05am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  All of the Public Sector needs cleaning out, not just Councils.
  Some at Auckland Council are getting more than the PM.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:12am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  There’s a substantial redundancy payout there.
  
  In my industry, you’re expected to work your notice, collect any annual leave owing & that’s it.
  
  The notion of redundancy, paid for by ratepayers, belongs to the Dark Ages.
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:34pm
  - artemisia
    
    Interesting to know if there was a voluntary component. If plenty of years under the belt and a generous contract, why wouldn’t you?
    
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    September 11, 2023 1:19pm
  - MikeS
    
    “In my industry”
    
    Nah… probably just in your contract. Any employee can negotiate to include a redundancy clause in their contract if they want to.
    
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    September 13, 2023 10:02pm
Grunter

For those that are interested in a serious discussion on the situation in Ukraine. This goes for more than an hour but very interesting stuff.

Three international geopolitical guys, a Brit, an American and a Norwegian.

Make up your own mind what you think.

https://youtu.be/bUHKa3JNkBQ?feature=shared
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September 11, 2023 8:05am
- Colville
  
  Can you give us a TL/DR 100 word synopsis??
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:44am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Don’t bother
    ‘The Duran’ is a Russian propaganda outlet
    They are based in Cyprus and one of the Directors is involved in RT
    I’d take what they say with some scepticism
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:51am
    - Ra Henare
      
      All on- Yep you’ve got! it stick your head in the sand and forget rational thinking.
      
      So believe TVNZ, BBC, any American News outlet ,even Aljazeera sadly, as they are Ukraine/The Wests)propaganda outlet.
      
      So I hope you are reading them with some skepticism.
      
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      September 11, 2023 1:05pm
  - Grunter
    
    The main commentator is John Mearsheimer (US). He does a decent enough substack. Lots of detail. His view is that Ukraine was always bound to lose (fewer people, fewer weapons, Russian air superiority, etc). His conclusion on where to from here….
    
    “Regrettably, there is no diplomatic solution in sight. There are irreconcilable differences between the two sides over security guarantees for Ukraine and territory, which stand in the way of a meaningful peace agreement. For understandable reasons, Ukraine is deeply committed to getting back all the land it has lost to Russia, which includes Crimea and the Donetsk, Kherson, Luhansk, and Zaporizhzhia oblasts. But Moscow has already annexed those territories and made it clear that it has no intention of returning them to Kyiv.
    
    The other unresolvable issue concerns Ukraine’s relationship with the West. For understandable reasons, Ukraine insists that it needs a security guarantee, which can only come from the US and NATO. Russia, on the other hand, insists that Ukraine must be neutral and must end its security relationship with the West. In fact, that issue was the main cause of the present war, even if American and European foreign policy elites refuse to believe it. Moscow was unwilling to tolerate Ukraine joining NATO. It is extremely difficult, if not impossible, to see how both sides can be satisfied on either the territorial or neutrality issue.
    
    In addition to those obstacles, both sides view each other as an existential threat, which is an enormous obstacle to any kind of meaningful compromise.
    
    The most likely result is that the war will go on and eventually end in a frozen conflict with Russia in possession of a significant portion of Ukrainian territory. But that outcome will not put an end to the competition and conflict between Russia and Ukraine or between Russia and the West.”
    
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    September 11, 2023 11:16am
    - Lance
      
      Russia may have superior numbers but the carnage is making any Russian victory look rather Peric at best.
      How much more destruction of equipment can they tolerate. Many specialist aircraft they are loosing are no longer manufactured with no possible replacement. Not to mention the economic cost of sanctions and colossal war budget.
      
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      September 11, 2023 1:57pm
- Ra Henare
  
  Ukrainian amputees as limb loss epidemic grow
  
  After 18 months of devastating proxy warfare, the scale of the depletion of the Ukrainian military is so extensive that even mainstream sources have been forced to concede the cruel reality.
  
  On August 1, The Wall Street Journal reported that “between 20,000 and 50,000 Ukrainians” have “lost one or more limbs since the start of the war.” What’s more, the outlet notes, “the actual figure could be higher” because “it takes time to register patients after they undergo the procedure.”
  
  By comparison, around 67,000 Germans and 41,000 Britons underwent amputations during the entire four-year span of the First World War.
  
  The publication quotes the head of a group of former military surgeons who train Ukrainian military medics who maintained that “Western military surgeons haven’t seen injuries on this scale since World War II.”
  
  Note: Many of the Military Surgeons are US Military with Surgeries being done in Germany.
  
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  September 11, 2023 1:36pm
Maggy Wassilieff

It’s Maori Language Week, in case you haven’t noticed.
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September 11, 2023 8:06am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  I thought it was now Maori language week every week.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:11am
  - pdm
    
    Nailed it Capt.
    
    Worth more than one uptick.
    
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    September 11, 2023 8:16am
- greybeard
  
  I have once again assembled all of my French books and textbooks ready for maori language week.
  Bonne semaine.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:17am
  - kowtow
    
    The Maoris didn’t want the French as imperial masters . The marion du fresne expedition and massacres in 1772 put paid to that.
    
    The Maoris wanted and invited British Imperialism .
    
    NZ became a stable and properous democracy under the Crown , something that wouldn’t have happened under the French .
    
    Part of our “history” curriculum ?
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:02am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Maori also ceded Sovereignty.
      Something they say they did not.
      Read the original Treaty, not the post 1975 Waitangi Tribunal rogue version.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:30am
    - Ruahine
      
      Kowtow.
      In 1840 the French were still doing slavery. Many Maori had sailed on European ships to other parts of the world by this time and had personally seen what slavery was.
      The British had abolished slavery in the Empire by 1830.
      “If we did not do something we will be taken over by the French or the Americans or the Spanish.” This was told to be by a Nga Puhi gentleman from Kaitaia many years ago.
      
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      September 11, 2023 10:33am
      - Jack5
        
        Ruahine’s … Many Maori had sailed on European ships to other parts of the world by this time and had personally seen what slavery was.
        
        But slavery was part of pre-colonial life among Maori. That is, within New Zealand. This included enslavement of whole tribes (first link below) and occasionally of white people.
        
        The Treaty of Waitangi made British citizens of Maori and thus outlawed slavery.
        
        The current contentions are who took the lead in changing Maori views on slavery, and how severe or cruel Maori slavery was.
        
        Some early observers said slaves were at times eaten, but the official NZ Encyclopedia, which traditionally leans toward Maori culture, takes a more liberal view (second link below).
        
        https://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-TreRace-t1-body-d9-d2.html
        
        AND, from the National Dictionary (Te Ara):
        
        https://teara.govt.nz/en/turanga-i-te-hapori-status-in-maori-society/page-1
        
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        September 11, 2023 11:41am
      - kowtow
        
        Ruahine
        
        Very interesting.
        Never thought of it like that.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:45pm
  - Martonman
    
    I know one teacher who taught French in Maori language week even though an Inspector was due.
    
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    September 11, 2023 12:47pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The speaker of the house was watching Breakfast on TV1.
  Maori luggage totally overdone.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:14am
- Ehlana
  
  It’s getting so we need an English language week, where they speak entirely in internationally understood English for a whole week. I actually wonder if some of them would be able to do it.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:33am
  - Jack5
    
    Our State-owned or State-subsidised media are more likely to cause an NZ Pidgin Week, the way they garble Maori and English together.
    
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    September 11, 2023 11:44am
Blog-aholic

From my viewpoint the majority of people who where against the Covid ‘vaccine’ were firstly against the mandate, against the lockdowns, against the requirement to get a barcode pass and against the re-vision of what a vaccine was….lastly they were against it because they did not believe it was what the producers, the government and people like the experts said it was.

In a large part they were and are not anti-vaccinations (per se) they were just against this particular ‘vaccine’.
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September 11, 2023 8:10am
- David Garrett
  
  Blog: Putting “vaccine” in quotes is entirely justified; it acted like no other vaccine in the usual sense of the word: it didn’t stop you getting it – more than once – and it didn’t stop you infecting others.
  
  It would far more accurately be described as an experimental treatment – and a pretty ineffective one at that.
  
  (To my shame I had three jabs; I certainly won’t be getting any more)
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:41am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Had two just to get a silly ‘passport’ that nobody ever asked me for.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:32am
  - cmm
    
    DG: No shame mate, so long as you learned from it.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:33am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    A fast-tracked emergency rollout of a not that effective, and not that safe prototype vaccine technology by panic stricken pollies?
    
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    September 11, 2023 4:16pm
- NK
  
  This is/was exactly my position. Vaccines have served the world well. I was not against a vaccine per se, just this one and the way it was introduced and forced upon all of us. All of that was despicable in a country like ours, or should I say a country that should be like ours.
  
  The worst part of all for me was the complete “falling into line” of all political leaders. The one I thought would have common sense and see through all the BS was David Seymour, but he wanted the V forced-fed to children before anyone else.
  
  It’s worth repeating the terms from the Pfizer contract with the South African government, “Purchaser acknowledges that the long-term effects and efficacy of the Vaccine are not currently known and that there may be adverse effects of the Vaccine that are not currently known. Further,…The Vaccine is not serialized.”
  
  Serialized means no serial numbers, viles not traceable. That in itself is appalling.
  
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  September 11, 2023 8:52am
  - NK
    
    More from the Pfizer contract with the SA government, “Purchaser acknowledges and agrees that (i) Pfizer’s efforts to develop and manufacture the Product are aspirational in nature and subject to significant risks and uncertainties..
    
    Safe and Effective.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:05am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I am sure my first shot had a batch number on the syringe.
    Not sure about the second, it was not shown to me.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:34am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    It was all about money. Big Pharma sold $1.4B billion worth to NZ.
    The “Safe and Effective” forcer got paid handsomely.
    
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    September 11, 2023 9:39am
    - NK
      
      And the parties of the left who claim to be against big this and big that, (excess profits etc) clapped happily to the excessive profits made by Pfizer on the vax.
      
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      September 11, 2023 9:57am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        One person in particular.
        
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        September 11, 2023 12:21pm
  - MikeS
    
    “Purchaser acknowledges that the long-term effects and efficacy of the Vaccine are not currently known”
    
    What’s controversial about that? It was a new vaccine so long term affects unknown.
    
    “there may be adverse effects of the Vaccine that are not currently known.”
    
    Again not controversial just standard arse covering in case an adverse affect pops up that they didn’t know about.
    
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    September 13, 2023 10:12pm
Kiwiguy

Stuff is now running Labour ads in a massive way. The ads don’t seem to be rotating to other ads like online ads usually do. Labour must have paid a significant amount to Stuff for this level of coverage.
Now that the PIJF has ended, it appears that Labour are doing one last financial fling to their media buddies before the election.
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September 11, 2023 8:15am
- Its only I
  
  Proof Labour wastes money. Stuff are “all in” on another coalition of Liers/Infants/Racists term without financial incentive from its prefered parties “to make aotearoa/north island a better place” as they claim in the begging banners.
  
  Stuff have replaced their politics section with a Tova and simply given up on news.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:08am
RRM

Reminder that there are kids with degrees who were born after 9/11.

I was a student at Canterbury Uni in 2001… on 11th of September (NZ time) I went to a live performance of the Brahms Piano Quintet at the great hall of the old Arts Centre. Went home, and on the following morning September 12th (September 11th evening U.S.) the morning news was rather sensational…
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September 11, 2023 8:15am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  22 years ago. Man time flies.
  I was walking past the TV on my way to work. Glanced at it, saw clips of planes hitting the towers. Thought it was a trailer for a movie. Boy was I wrong.
  Pretty hard to take in board at the time.
  
  I see that Biden wants to waive the death penalty for those involved in planning.
  Biden hates America.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:47am
  - virtualmark
    
    ?
    
    Biden refused to approve a recent plea deal **because he thought it was too soft**. That’s left the prosecutors & defence lawyers to re-negotiate a new deal. It’s possible that new deal might take the death penalty off the table but there’s been no news or decision on that yet … and it’s up to the lawyers, not Biden.
    
    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-declines-grant-conditions-911-defendants-seeking-plea-negotiatio-rcna103799
    
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    September 11, 2023 3:36pm
- Ehlana
  
  For the current generation of young New Zealanders, at least, the equivalent event is probably the Christchurch mosque shootings.
  
  The current young Moroccan’s are living through theirs right now. I seem to recall seeing a lot of movies shot in Morocco in recent years. I hope the film companies remember the people they filmed among at this time.
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:19am
- NothingLeft
  
  Ah yes, when “Some people did something”, Ilhan Omar, infamous brother marrying Democratic congresswoman. Another example of how (immigration fraud) laws only apply to non-democratic politicians in USA.
  
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  September 11, 2023 3:31pm
BeaB

Can you imagine the outcry if Corin Dann had been as rude and overbearing to the sainted Jacinda as he was to Nicola Willis this morning?
He showed no empathy at all to the fact that she is a woman, a mother, young – all Jacinda’s pass cards.
As an even younger woman and mother, surely Nicola should be treated with the kid gloves Corin used to put on with Jacinda.
Remember those peaceful days when she could rabbit on meaninglessly while her media acolytes and devotees would nod in silent adoration?
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September 11, 2023 8:44am
- Burtland
  
  Corin Dann used to be able to add some value to the national conversation in a past life – unfortunately his brains been turned to mush working at RNZ
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:55am
Lance

Good grief
The AM show was in Nelson this morning with the Labour and National candidates.
The woman representing Labour was Megan Woods mark 2.
She looked like Megan Woods, she spoke like Megan Woods, she incessantly burbled on about nothing like Megan Woods and aggressively interrupted and spoke over the top of the National candidate.
An awful clone
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September 11, 2023 8:54am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Did she have a pie?
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:48am
- BeaB
  
  Is she the one who snitched on Tim van de Molen weeks after he had given that sissy a fright?
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:53am
Maggie Pie

Mark this date down for next week….

Wednesday 20th September, 1pm, St Patrick’s Square, Auckland.

POSIE PARKER is back for another ‘LET WOMEN SPEAK’ rally.

Let’s hope the Police are there in force to keep-the-peace this time, and that we see a lot more ‘real men’ in attendance…..not just the ones who get around with their dicks tucked between their legs 🙁
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September 11, 2023 9:00am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I am keen to listen to her. A nice punchup would be great. At 71 I need to give something to someone who deserves it.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:59am
  - kevn
    
    SteveO… I’ll look out for ‘Jack Lives Here ‘T shirt.
    
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    September 11, 2023 11:12am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      And a MAGA hat.
      
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      September 11, 2023 12:24pm
  - MikeS
    
    At 71 I doubt you could give anything to anyone. dreams are free though…
    
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    September 13, 2023 10:17pm
Prince

Have the Greens paid for the Stuff cartoon ad this morning ?
Shouldn’t it have a ‘Advertisement’ printed underneath ?
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September 11, 2023 9:01am
- cmm
  
  No, YOU paid for it.
  
  Remember that media types are predominantly greenies.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:11am
kevn

NK… There are batch numbers. Note the variance, some real bad.
https://howbad.info/pfizer.html
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September 11, 2023 9:07am
- miltonF
  
  Most of the jabs were placebos. It’s the only thing that makes sense.
  
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  September 11, 2023 3:56pm
Suze Wainwright

So Hipkins is planning to use tomorrow’s shocking PREFU results obtained under his govt as part of his election strategy to say ha ha to the National Party, you can’t afford your tax cuts. Gotcha!
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September 11, 2023 9:08am
RoboRob

Ryan on the AM show had national and Labour candidates on from Nelson. They started talking about state / emergency housing. The Labour candidate proudly talked about spend on housing and increases. She attacked National for actually reducing the number (by 6) in their last term.
The national candidate had a great opportunity to answer with something like. ‘We believe an increase in emergency housing is a bad thing, we would rather have fewer homes because the need for them was less. Under the last National government people were better off and the houses weren’t needed.’

Instead, like his leader, he was scared to offend and just went with the vanilla ‘we will build too’
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September 11, 2023 9:14am
cmm

Here’s one for Wayne Mapp’s EV garage:

BMW to launch affordable EV… only $80k!

On what planet is $80k “reasonable”?
After you’ve splashed that out, you might only get a range of 265km in cold weather and can only carry about 500kg (including passengers).

This really show how out of touch the EV fans really are.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/132882955/bmw-to-launch-affordable-ix1-ev-in-new-zealand
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September 11, 2023 9:22am
- Lance
  
  Being BMW at least it won’t be a pile of poorly designed and shoddily built shite like Tesla’s or Leaf’s .
  But yea, it aint cheap
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:54am
  - cmm
    
    The compromises they have to pull to turn a gas guzzler into an EV will probably compromise some of those BMW standards.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:19am
  - NothingLeft
    
    BMW? LOL. From a UK site tabulating car reliability BMW ranks 23rd out of 29 and furkin expensive to fix as well. Friends don’t let friends buy Euro-trash like Porsche, BMW, Landrover, Audi or Mercedes, and especially never ever second hand (their reliability goes steeply downhill after a few years)
    
    https://www.carwow.co.uk/blog/most-and-least-reliable-car-brands-revealed#gref:
    Brand Reliability score Average repair cost
    Land Rover (including Range Rover) 38% £1,260
    Porsche 40% £1,550
    Jaguar 51% £1,020
    Chevrolet 53% £900
    Alfa Romeo 53% £720
    Audi 53% £970
    BMW 53% £1,090
    Mercedes 56% £920
    Mitsubishi 58% £1,060
    MINI 60% £790
    SEAT 62% £660
    VW 62% £710
    Citroen 62% £580
    Vauxhall 62% £580
    Volvo 62% £790
    Skoda 64% £620
    Peugeot 64% £570
    Nissan 64% £740
    Mazda 67% £790
    Renault 67% £560
    Ford 67% £610
    Kia 69% £530
    Suzuki 71% £520
    Fiat 71% £510
    Hyundai 71% £570
    Smart 73% £460
    Toyota 80% £600
    Lexus 87% £1,100
    Honda 87% £530
    
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    September 11, 2023 3:24pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Hmm. My next car might be a Honda Hybrid.
      
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      September 11, 2023 7:34pm
- Jack5
  
  Henry Ford embraced mass manufacturing techniques like the production line to produce the Model T at a price for ordinary folk.
  
  Only weeks ago, the Ford Motor Company announced it was cutting production of electric vehicles because it was going to lose $US4.5 billion making them this year. It lost $US2.1 billion making them last year.
  
  Electric vehicles are too expensive for most people.
  
  Meanwhile, Biden’s government announced a $US9.2 billion loan to Ford and a South Korean partner to build three EV factories in southern regions of the US.
  
  In China, “graveyards” of unsold EVs are springing up (second link below).
  
  Ford losses:
  
  https://www.newstarget.com/2023-07-31-ford-loses-billions-electric-vehicles-production.html
  
  China EV graveyards:
  https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2023-china-ev-graveyards/
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:59am
  - cmm
    
    FMC, and others, fired up their EV lines because of the subsidies and handouts. It was probably also a condition for various bail outs etc.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:21am
- Burtland
  
  the 3-tier society
  1. those with a recent EV still in warrantee, enjoying the subsidies
  2. those with an EV with a failing battery, grappling with replacement and disposal
  3. the masses having to use public transport, screaming its not fair
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:08am
- NZer In Exile
  
  People who have lived their whole lives in wealth generally have no clue how middle income people live, let alone poor people.
  
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  September 11, 2023 4:25pm
- MikeS
  
  “On what planet is $80k “reasonable”?”
  
  For a brand new BMW SUV 80k is reasonable.
  
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  September 13, 2023 10:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Pledge Card – Hipkins.
If you believe this I have a bridge catalogue.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/imitation-is-greatest-form-of-flattery-hipkins-reveals-pledge-card-takes-aim-at-national-getting-on-labour-bandwagon/ar-AA1guzP8
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September 11, 2023 9:23am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  National jumping on the Labour bandwagon?
  Hipkins, you jerk, National released their pledge card last week. What is the matter with you?
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:26am
  - cmm
    
    I think he means that Labour owns the idea of pledge cards because Auntie H did one back in the day.
    
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    September 11, 2023 10:18am
- Flossie
  
  Bunch of six year olds in the playground – “My pledge card is bigger than yours! Anyway you copied…so!”
  I’ve heard more grown up arguments from my wee grandkids!
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:51am
Fisiani2

In 21 days voting starts. By October 14th more than 80% of votes will be cast. Party votes are either for more of the same, or for time for a change.
More of the same would be tragic. It would ruin the economy even more. The toxic trio of Labour, Green Maori would do untold damage.
Change is either moderate or extreme. It is needed.
80% will choose moderate -National
and 20% will choose extreme – ACT
Electorate votes determine who is the best candidate for the job of local MP. Split voting is common and growing.
For instance in Wellington Central all the people who Party Vote Labour or Green will struggle to justify their EV for their party rep. Many might give their EV to the very impressive Scott Sheeran who is the National candidate and make him the potential winner. That would make no difference to the numbers in Parliament but would only affect the membership
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September 11, 2023 9:33am
- bjools
  
  Tactics in an election are to win as many party votes as possible.
  Strategy for the future, also win as many electorate seats as possible and keep them.
  This gives each Electorate MP a budget to conduct affairs within the electorate (effectively making them the onl voice heard for 3 years) good for the next election.
  However there is a drawback to this.
  That seems to effect Labour more than National, but not exclusively.
  Sooner or later, if you don’t improve your electorate or at least work within your electorate, you WILL be removed.
  I am speaking in hope, about YOU Mr HIPKINS.
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:41am
Jack5

A Moriori spokesman was on Red Radio this morning campaigning for a Moriori “language week” to join the current nine Polynesian “language weeks” New Zealand holds.

C’mon, Rawiri Waititi, man up. On behalf of Maori, specifically Taranaki Maori, and on behalf of the Maori Party, apologise.

Apologise to Moriori for Maori enslaving them in decades before the Waitangi Treaty. Apologise, too, for Maori sneekily holding some Moriori in slavery after the Treaty.

Moriori people intermarried with their enslavers and enslaver descendants, much as many African Americans also have genes of their enslavers.

It was interesting to hear that the majority of Moriori now live in Auckland.

Does the Woke History brigade in our schools teach Moriori kids about the enslavement of their ancestors?
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September 11, 2023 9:37am
- BeaB
  
  Don’t worry. Remember the Crown has already apologised and compensated Moriori for the genocidal actions of Taranaki.
  The Crown = you and me, the poor old taxpayer.
  
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  September 11, 2023 9:56am
  - Jack5
    
    Michael Laws, National MP from 1990 who defected to NZ First, announced a discovery about his heritage today.
    
    On the Internet video programme, The Platform, interviewing Winston Peters, Laws said he had found out that he was one-sixty-fourth Moriori.
    
    This is 2:12 into this video clip of Winston Peters on fire in an interview with Laws:
    
    https://youtu.be/A3ADIrdjPIs?si=q5pU8db3nRr-Ub04
    
    And Laws’s time in Parliament – National to NZ First – to resignation:
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Laws
    
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    September 11, 2023 4:28pm
Maggie Pie

I’m a EUR 37 / GB 4.5
You can tell a lot about a woman by her feet 😀

https://twitter.com/The_sigma_fem/status/1700567138296377356
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September 11, 2023 9:47am
- Ra Henare
  
  Especially when said feet spend a lot of time in the air 🙂
  
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  September 11, 2023 1:16pm
Rusty

The Moa was here before both Maori and Europeans arrived.
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September 11, 2023 9:59am
kevn

Maggie… He/her must be getting close to prostate check up age?
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September 11, 2023 10:03am
Maggie Pie

Sounds like Rawiri believes Maori are some kind of….NZ ‘master-race’

https://twitter.com/TheZeitgeistNZ/status/1700764578311999548

Yet according to Winnie, they came from Chynahh!

https://twitter.com/winstonpeters/status/1700983506187493607

LOL!!
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September 11, 2023 10:36am
- Ghost
  
  Very strong in him, so strong he needed a stomach bypass
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:40am
- kevn
  
  Spokesman for the spoonfed.
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:05am
- Jack5
  
  A weird metaphor from Rawiri when questioned by Tame Jack about the Maori Party web site statement, since taken down: “it is a known fact that the Maori genetic make-up is stronger than others.”
  
  Rawiri: “How can it be racist when you are trying to empower a people that are climbing up from the bottom of the bonnet of colonial violence for the last 183 years …”
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:20pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    That last statement puts the lie to Maori having ‘stronger genetic make-up’.
    
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    September 11, 2023 1:32pm
  - Yabster
    
    compare [Mod – use correct names] (that ones for you Lodden) interview style (almost passive or in fact tame…) when interviewing the deluded cowboy hat wearing Waititi, vs the aggressive interview he had with Luxon.
    
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    September 11, 2023 2:17pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    It appears the cowboy wants to start a race slagging match. Don’t get sucked into it.
    
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    September 11, 2023 4:30pm
- graham
  
  Rawiri justifies the statement on the Maori Party web site (which was quietly taken down last year after David Seymour drew attention to it):
  
  “It is a known fact that the Maori genetic make-up is stronger than others.”
  
  Well, says Rawiri, we’re directly talking to Our People ™ and trying to boost their confidence, and therefore there’s nothing wrong with stating that we’re better than everybody else.
  
  And yet it’s Act and National who are supposed to be “dividing the country by race”?!
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:47pm
- Raphael
  
  I had a conversation on Twitter a while ago (can’t find it, and I think I have since been blocked) where the chap claimed that after you account for all lifestyle habits, Maori still have poorer health outcomes. This would suggest a genetic inferiority. I think it was after I asked him if he was sure he wanted to go with that argument that I was blocked.
  
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  September 11, 2023 4:00pm
slightlyrighty

https://www.thepost.co.nz/a/nz-news/350068593/labour-confirms-wellington-central-poll-keeping-results-secret

I wonder why???
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September 11, 2023 10:39am
- Blog-aholic
  
  No need to wonder.
  
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  September 11, 2023 10:49am
- artemisia
  
  Mr Omer said Ms Paul is not in the lead in that poll. So that could put him first (in that poll), but that would IMO be a bit unlikely as he is not a strong candidate and Labour is overall sliding. So does that suggest Mr Sheehan in the lead (did I say ‘in that poll’?).
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:14am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Nothing would please me more that Tamatha Paul and Ibrahim Omer cancelling one another out, allowing Scott Sheeran to come through the middle.
    
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    September 11, 2023 12:57pm
    - Libertarians are right
      
      I disagree strongly.
      Every weak electorate MP Labour gets removes one List MP and the List is where Labour have almost all of their craziest and nastiest politicians.
      
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      September 11, 2023 1:16pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Probably not going to happen, Tony.
      
      Last October, in the Pukehīnau/Lambton General Ward (the more-or-less local equivalent of Wellington Central), 12,493 (first preference) votes were cast, of which 5,206 (41.67%, or 1.67 quotas) were given for incumbent councillor, Tamatha Paul – that’s really impressive. Incumbent right-wing councillor, Nicola Young, received the next highest number of votes, being 2,075 (16.61%).
      
      At 11:50AM last Friday, Nicola Young told Nick Mills on Newstalk ZB’s Wellington Mornings show, that she had attended a candidates’ meeting the night before, where “a poll” – I can’t recall her exact words – was released. It showed a close contest between Paul and Sheeran, with Omer well back.
      
      I’m picking Wellington Central as a Green GAIN.
      
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      September 11, 2023 5:21pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Tabatha Paul is batshit crazy
        
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        September 11, 2023 7:26pm
Flossie

Free dental care for under 30! What a load of rubbish. For a start it is basic checks and fillings.
And why aren’t the Labour party’s feet held to the fire to explain where the funding is coming from?? National are expected to give detailed costings of their proposals.
Now let’s find out how many dentists there are going to be to carry out this wonderous new deal.
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September 11, 2023 10:59am
ecco

Labour obviously not that cash strapped. Hipkins popping up everywhere on the NZ news sites with his pathetic ‘in it for you’ slogan. Those ads must be costing a fortune. He obviously doesn’t get that he will need to do more than put out slogans to win the next election. Be interesting to see what he thinks his track record is of achievements whilst in power. No talk of that from Labour is there.
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September 11, 2023 11:01am
- herb1
  
  Needs an asterisk underneath with “ in it because of you”
  
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  September 11, 2023 12:05pm
kevn

“In (sh) It For You”…
Yep, he done well there.
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September 11, 2023 11:06am
- Blog-aholic
  
  “(ru) IN (sh) IT FOR YOU”.
  
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  September 11, 2023 11:27am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Even if a bee could explain to a fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly would not understand.
Like explaining why capitalism is better than socialism to a Labour supporter.
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September 11, 2023 11:10am
- MikeS
  
  Or like trying to explain to someone on here why they both have good and bad parts which is why modern democracies use a bit of both.
  
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  September 13, 2023 10:34pm
bjools

Over the years, I have observed the bill boards of National and Act defaced and destroyed by the juvenile left.
However, it is disappointing to see, in Stokes Valley, 2 of Mr Hipkins bill boards defaced with Lying ***, in black paint.
Free speech is free speech, allow him to speak and critique that.
But please don’t copy the loony left.
But maybe I have it wrong. maybe they are newly converted from the left and have not yet caught up with the beliefs and etiquette of us on the right.
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September 11, 2023 11:32am
- I remember when
  
  I always enjoy Alwyn’s columns but wonder if he has any information on the unevenness of the access to teachers aides and classroom support.
  It appears, from education sources I listen to, that some of the higher achievement schools travel a less stony and difficult path with access.
  Also considerable mention of the fact that when they do get the necessary support it is slowly whittled away.
  There appears to be some great programmes available, but access is usually limited due to lack of available spaces.
  Travel also seems to be a burden, due to distance to assistance source and the funds available to low income families needing places.
  
  4 0
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  September 11, 2023 1:03pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  Why assume he’s from the right? He could be a National supporter.
  
  8 2
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  September 11, 2023 1:12pm
  - Colville
    
    🙂
    
    3 0
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    September 11, 2023 6:18pm
- emmess
  
  The difference is that the left always organise vandalising of the centre-right party’s billboards.
  But here in Auckland this year, I am noticing a much more organic vandalisation of left wing parties billboards.
  Oh no, anyway
  
  0 0
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  September 11, 2023 8:03pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Just watching te news.
Where is the steel reinforcing? The building standards of some Countries is ridiculous.
10 1
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September 11, 2023 12:11pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Forgot the edit. I was referring to Morocco.
  
  9 2
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  September 11, 2023 12:17pm
- cmm
  
  A lot of the problem in the 3rd world come from replacing traditional materials with modern materials but not updating the building methods to match them.
  
  Many of the buildings in this area are traditionally built with adobe (mud+grass). That’s incredibly tough stuff because the grass acts as reenforcement.
  
  Even Roman concrete had a lot of stuff mixed in which provided reenforcement.
  
  But the modern stuff, especially the 99 cent stuff, has little strength and needs extra reenforcement. But they don’t add it, so buildings fall down.
  
  10 0
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  September 11, 2023 12:36pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Earthquake just shakes it to bits.
    
    2 0
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    September 11, 2023 6:14pm
Benedict Yu

This is funny.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/132895032/auckland-councillor-likens-climate-goal-to-unwinnable-cricket-match

In 2020 Auckland Council sets 2030 emissions goals. Including “halving private motor vehicle use”. Now one-third of the way to the target date. Emissions have not fallen. At all. Now they are all squabbling about the reasons. Auckland Transport say they need “more money”. 🙂

I guarantee that around about 2027, this will play out nationally as it becomes clear that New Zealand’s 2030 targets cannot be met without handing over several billion dollars for international emissions credits. Right now, Luxon is all “let’s do this” but wait until 2027. He will not be so unicorns and sunshine.
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September 11, 2023 12:23pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Driving in Auckland needs to halve by 2020?
  Why not just shut the City down altogether?
  Where do these idiots com from?
  
  18 1
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  September 11, 2023 12:34pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    That is what it says:
    
    “The key document in achieving the goals is the Transport Emissions Reduction Pathway (TERP) which, among other things, calls for a halving of driving [and] public transport use of nearly four times higher than forecast.”
    
    9 0
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    September 11, 2023 1:02pm
  - Chris Nisbet
    
    I wouldn’t be surprised if somebody gives it a go.
    We’re in the midst of an existential threat don’t you know? Given that, what isn’t outside the bounds of possibility?
    – We’ve had carless days before – why not again?
    – Petrol prices will keep rising until we can’t afford to buy the stuff – that’s the plan anyway.
    Hopefully there will come a time when people start asking themselves if net zero makes much sense. Hopefully it’ll be before the carnage that comes with it gets too bad.
    
    8 0
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    September 11, 2023 1:09pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “Petrol prices will keep rising until we can’t afford to buy the stuff”
      
      I would say that has already hit some folk.
      
      15 0
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      September 11, 2023 1:43pm
    - Yabster
      
      15 minute cities…….
      
      4 0
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      September 11, 2023 2:20pm
    - cmm
      
      All very well, except that diesel as a transport, mining and agricultural fuel is going to be with us for a very, very long time yet.
      
      To give up their addiction to fuel, people will also have to give up a bunch of other bad habits too. Like eating, importing stuff, travelling, ….
      
      12 0
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      September 11, 2023 2:22pm
  - cmm
    
    These “visionary” documents are from people who work in offices.
    
    Hey, why don’t we all just work from home like we did during Covid?
    
    Works fine if all you do every day is make power points and attend Poi-waving training.
    
    But if you’re a fork lift driver you can’t really take your work home – it wrecks the carpets.
    
    10 0
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    September 11, 2023 2:25pm
    - chwaga
      
      Tried for jobs as a truck driver or a “stop go” person but was turned down as I wanted to work from home
      
      10 0
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      September 11, 2023 2:49pm
- thirteenstars
  
  Luxon’s OK with congestion charging, which means in designated parts of a city non-EV drivers get hit with a charge to drive there. So if petrol pricing is not enough, slap on an instant road user charge.
  
  In London they call it ULEZ.
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_Low_Emission_Zone
  
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  September 11, 2023 3:16pm
- kowtow
  
  Voters really need to set our own targets.
  
  Net zero stupidity from our elected ‘representatives’.
  
  Immediately.
  
  5 0
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  September 11, 2023 3:26pm
Ghost

So can we expect this election the PM to keep wasting dentists time to use them for campaign shoots?

Hipkins is currently visiting a dentist in Nelson
15 1
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September 11, 2023 12:32pm
Mrs_Right

Another Reid Research poll out tonight on Newshub.
7 0
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September 11, 2023 12:32pm
- Colville
  
  40% for Nats…
  
  7 0
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  September 11, 2023 6:19pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    And 26% for the liars.
    
    2 0
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    September 11, 2023 7:35pm
Maggie Pie

Surely we should all be concerned when even ELON says….

“There is something strange going on” 🙁

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1700793474868535542
4 1
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September 11, 2023 12:36pm
- Ghost
  
  I agree, who the hell wants 11 children. Strange.
  
  4 1
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  September 11, 2023 12:46pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  Just one strange thing?
  
  6 0
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  September 11, 2023 12:51pm
- cmm
  
  There used to be a saying about Stephen Fry:
  
  a stupid person’s idea of what an intelligent person looks like
  
  Move over Fry, Musk has taken your place.
  
  The Musk Image is carefully curated.
  He’s the guy who invented electric cars: nope
  Well at least he founded Tesla: nope
  OK, he’s a co-founder then: nope
  
  He bought enough shares in Tesla to do a hostile take over.
  Basically he did exactly the same as he did with Twitter.
  
  10 3
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  September 11, 2023 1:55pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Hard to be the richest person thingy on earth if you are a thicko.
    
    7 1
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    September 11, 2023 4:34pm
    - ISeeRed
      
      Same can be said about Trump. You can NOT be a moron and become a billionaire at the same time. TDS sufferers share a lot with MDS sufferers. Principally, they’ll believe other people’s negative takes on Trump/Musk rather than watch or listen to their actual words in full. (No, gotcha quotes or spicy soundbites don’t count. We can all be selectively edited to look worse than Hitler.) It’s trendy to hate on both of them, but you don’t have to be a “fangirl”, “fluffer” etc. to recognise some criticisms are just ignorant, unhinged horseshit.
      
      1 1
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      September 11, 2023 6:54pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Agree. You also would not to be able to withstand the 24/7 venom, subterfuge and lawfare thrown at you, and be able to keep fighting on.
        
        0 0
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        September 11, 2023 7:41pm
  - Colville
    
    Wow …that comment wins the internet.
    
    Staggeringly stupid.
    
    1 0
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    September 11, 2023 6:21pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Which comment? The comment nesting is still haywire.
      
      0 0
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      September 11, 2023 7:37pm
      - Colville
        
        From cmm
        
        0 0
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        September 11, 2023 8:01pm
Prince

Other teams are there for the rugby. France, South Africa, Ireland, England, Wales, Fiji, even Australia focussed on winning their first games.

But New Zealand are special. We took a wooden carving over, and wondered how the French would respond to our haka. It was clearly a big deal for us.
As it was, the French simply stood in a line and watched.
Then thrashed us in the game.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby-world-cup-2023/300967940/rugby-world-cup-why-the-all-blacks-introduced-a-paddle-to-the-haka
23 1
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September 11, 2023 12:50pm
- Martonman
  
  Maybe time for a rethink and do away with the Haka. Maybe a bit more energy for the game.
  
  23 2
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  September 11, 2023 1:00pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    They won the haka, but the effort left them exhausted.
    
    15 2
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    September 11, 2023 1:40pm
    - lifesgood
      
      Anyone else fed up to the back teeth with the bloody haka. A whole heap of boy/men posturing and trying to look tough. I knew when I saw the haka on Saturday that the ABs would lose.
      
      22 3
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      September 11, 2023 1:57pm
  - sharont
    
    The novelty value of the Haka is long gone. Completely over it and find it embarrassing.
    
    3 0
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    September 11, 2023 9:09pm
- cmm
  
  What the fuck is it with these violent people from a backward island?
  A death threat isn’t enough, so this time take weapons too.
  
  Good luck trying that shit out with the South Africans. I’d put my 50 cents on a Zulu over a Maori any day.
  
  And I’d put a whole dollar on a Pondo stick fighter. They sorted the Zulus out no problem. PS: And they’re peace loving people too.
  
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  September 11, 2023 1:46pm
DimChappie

This comment by Matthew Hooton came as a bit of a shock to me:

(There is no prospect of a National-Act Government because National insiders say their party plans to do anything to avoid it, on the grounds Act would force it to develop and implement a comprehensive and effective, but perhaps unpopular, reform programme.)

https://www.patreon.com/posts/why-luxon-is-or-89032836
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September 11, 2023 1:44pm
- Lance
  
  You lost me at “This comment by Matthew Hooten”
  
  22 1
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  September 11, 2023 2:09pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    Wonder if he wants to bring back Todd Muller?.?
    
    8 0
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    September 11, 2023 2:24pm
- cmm
  
  “Act would force it to develop and implement a comprehensive and effective, but perhaps unpopular, reform programme.”
  
  Unpopular amongst the National MPs and such, but maybe a bit more popular outside of Wellington.
  
  15 1
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  September 11, 2023 2:18pm
- JimBobJoe
  
  Who is paying Hooten to write his current tripe? He is a pen, and a poisoned one often, for hire…
  
  The guy has lost all credibility
  
  7 0
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  September 11, 2023 6:56pm
Tauhei Notts

This is a political blog site and so far I have seen no mention of Shane Jones’ wonderful speech delivered yesterday. If anybody can provide a link to it, please do.
I got the impression that Shane Jones could do more to increase NZ First’s vote than Winnie can.
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September 11, 2023 1:46pm
- septic skeptic
  
  🤣🤣🤣
  That odious narcissistic blowhard!
  🤣🤣🤣
  
  18 0
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  September 11, 2023 2:15pm
  - kowtow
    
    How that prick can still be in the running after charging us for his porn says an awful lot about NZF supporters , not to mention how a media pardy so self obsessed with all things allegedly high ground and morally correct haven’t ripped him a new one .
    
    I can only imagine the media pardy love having these almost literal clowns around to keep the fricken circus going.
    
    But the future of the country is just far too important to have them anywhere near the levers of power .
    
    11 0
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    September 11, 2023 2:35pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    You forgot corrupt and onanistic. Gifted orator, but like Winston should never be allowed anywhere near reins of power.
    
    4 0
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    September 11, 2023 3:37pm
- John Loveridge
  
  It sounds like classic Shane Jones form: all hui, no do-ey.
  
  1 0
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  September 11, 2023 7:24pm
Hugh Jarse

Interesting continual attacks on Luxon going on at the moment. Obviously some people are very concerned about him and his continual rise as the preferred PM contributing to the rise of National and fall of labour. They are attacking him as a way of bringing National down. And one of those attacks comes from someone whose judgement gave the country Todd Muller FGS.

I have sat and listened to Luxon in meetings a couple of times now and both times come away thinking he will make a good PM both from his style and his parties policies. We don’t have a presidential style election here so most people vote for the party and it’s policies.

So Jenna, Jack and Matthew I am sick and tired of you trying to influence my decisions with your carping criticisms. You are not informing me you are criticising my judgment. I can make my own decisions thank you very much based on my experience, hopes, judgement and values.

Maybe focus on the leader whose party is sinking in the polls, whose preferred PM status is sinking and maybe the previous PM and aforementioned current PM who got us into the economic and divided shit state we are in.

Then I might think you are not biased and trying to take my vote and my voice away.
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September 11, 2023 2:15pm
- Prince
  
  It’s not just on this blog either. The attacks are coming from the media and Labour Politicians as well.
  
  5 0
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  September 11, 2023 3:17pm
- Taieri
  
  We don’t have a presidential style election here so most people vote for the party and it’s policies.
  ————
  
  Except of the 2017 and 2020 elections. Very much “presidential style” both of them.
  
  5 1
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  September 11, 2023 3:45pm
Nickc2

Still undecided about who to vote for?

The difference between Animals and Humans.
Animals would never let the dumbest of the herd lead them!

Jurgen Meister
11 1
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September 11, 2023 2:37pm
- cmm
  
  Give an animal handouts and you can do whatever you like with them.
  
  Do you think you’d stand a chance against a horse or a cow if it was wild?
  
  Well pretty much the same with politicians and voters: make them dependent and they’re putty.
  
  6 0
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  September 11, 2023 5:13pm
Maggie Pie

NEVER FORGET…. SEPTEMBER 10, 2021.

On this day, American Secretary-of-Defence Donald Rumsfield holds a press conference to state that The Pentagon was missing $2.3 TRILLION.

https://twitter.com/UltraDane/status/1701069484164006345

But the NEXT DAY SOMETHING HAPPENED
and everybody forgot about this. 🙁

You never know what tomorrow holds. Just saying.
10 3
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September 11, 2023 3:49pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  Building 7 had some interesting tenant Maggie.
  
  https://wtc7.net/background.html
  
  6 3
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  September 11, 2023 4:34pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    WOW!
    
    And the more you delve into the facts now emerging…
    it becomes even more curiouser and curiouser
    
    https://twitter.com/TPV_John/status/1701067081498726732
    
    6 3
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    September 11, 2023 5:01pm
Jack5

Far-right activist Kyle Chapman has been arrested on firearms charges, Stuff tells us.

The newspaper chain describes Chapman as a former leader of a neo-Nazi group and head of a white supremacist party.

What they don’t say is that Chapman is part-Maori.

One of Chapman’s earliest clashes with the law came from a molotov-cocktail fire attack on a marae building in the far south.

In 1909, by then an ex-leader of the National Front and reportedly the father of five children by four mothers, Chapman married a Mormon lady and swore he was taking a new direction.

“I intend to live a calm lifestyle; I can’t do that as the leader of anything,” Stuff reported Chapman saying.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/132915998/far-right-activist-arrested-on-firearms-and-ammunition-charges
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September 11, 2023 4:01pm
- cmm
  
  2009?
  
  3 0
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  September 11, 2023 5:03pm
  - Jack5
    
    Yep, thanks CMM. 2009!
    
    2 0
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    September 11, 2023 5:17pm
Jack5

Sorry, wrong part of thread. Cancelled.
2 0
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September 11, 2023 4:26pm
rockape

Ouch that Read / Newshub poll must have hurt !
19 0
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September 11, 2023 6:12pm
- Colville
  
  I wonder when Chippe is really going to start his campaign…??
  
  anyday now…??
  
  16 0
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  September 11, 2023 6:23pm
  - Flossie
    
    Yeah….just watch this space…
    
    7 0
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    September 11, 2023 7:06pm
Ghost

Article

Labour needs to break the glass and hit the panic button as this is its crisis poll.

The party’s support has collapsed into the terrifying twenties at 26.8 percent. That is a catastrophic 5.5-point fall from our last poll.

On the other side, National will be sounding the celebration siren. It is on 40.9 percent, up 4.3 points.

After tomorrow when the books are opened it will only get worse for labour
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September 11, 2023 6:22pm
- Prince
  
  Oh but Woke Luxon blah blah blah.
  National need to return to the low twenties etc. National, at over four times the Act vote, need to move further to the right.
  Bring back Judith.
  
  6 5
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  September 11, 2023 6:28pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    National are benefiting from the collapse of the worst government in NZ history. Very little they have done had caused this increase in support.
    
    National supporters who think the poll results are down to great management by Luxon are delusional. He’s benefiting from a horrific train wreck, he’s no better than an ambulance chasing, hick lawyer.
    Net Zero 2050? What a clown.
    
    5 4
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    September 11, 2023 8:21pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  “The party’s support has collapsed into the terrifying twenties at 26.8 percent. That is a catastrophic 5.5-point fall from our last poll. On the other side, National will be sounding the celebration siren.”
  
  The battle is not over until it’s over.
  
  6 1
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  September 11, 2023 7:49pm
Warren

And Chris Hipkins is not the most popular person for Prime Minister anymore.
Many on here and the media will be losing sleep over this change Luxon has always said he wants over 40% of the vote and finally he has achieved that with 5 weeks to go to the 2023 General Election.
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September 11, 2023 6:33pm
greybeard

Greens have more support than ACT ?
Rubbish.
13 1
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September 11, 2023 6:37pm
- Colville
  
  It’s bouncing around a few percent.
  
  But the trend is our friend 👍
  
  4 0
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  September 11, 2023 6:45pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Makes sense se to me. If they were stupid enough to support Labour last month, why not the watermelons this month?
  
  9 0
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  September 11, 2023 6:50pm
- ISeeRed
  
  I could believe it. The young are the most ignorant about life, history, reality. They are the most brainwashed in today’s schools. Hence, the Greens are overrepresented in the youth vote.
  
  11 1
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  September 11, 2023 7:01pm
- than
  
  I hate Greens as much as you do, probably even more, but that increase for them would be because of left leaning Labour voters who can’t bear to vote for National ditching them in their death spiral.
  
  5 0
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  September 11, 2023 8:08pm
Colville

“” Hipkins has been refusing to set a sacking point for himself, at this rate he doesn’t have to – as Prime Minister, the voters are doing it for him.””

🤣
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September 11, 2023 6:48pm
Biscuit

I hope Chippie and his pals have been spending up big – with their own money, I mean – on claiming Sir Robert Jones’ very generous odds against a Labour win on October 1…

If Sir Robert is reading this, could he please confirm my suspicion that he has had no contact at all from any Labour Party apparatchiks…
5 0
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September 11, 2023 7:08pm
- Biscuit
  
  October 14, I mean.
  
  Sadly…
  
  Thirteen days extra to wait!
  
  5 0
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  September 11, 2023 7:09pm
Warren

After Chuck Bird was telling us that Act now is the party of the farmer, this result should haunt him and David Seymour as Luxon has the 40.9 % that he’s worked for and should silence the school children that have been calling him names on this blog.
9 2
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September 11, 2023 7:45pm
- Colville
  
  Warren. With respect but this poll has Nats higher than the other polls and has ACT lower…
  I love the 54% collective score but think the shares might be slightly different 👍
  
  2 1
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  September 11, 2023 8:05pm
- emmess
  
  Why? he could be polling 90%, but it doesn’t change the fact he is woke.
  
  4 0
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  September 11, 2023 8:16pm

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