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September 14, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 14 September 2023

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General Debate

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Benedict Yu

I now question whether a coalition between ACT and National will work.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132934574/nationals-nicola-willis-promises-cuts-by-christmas-happy-to-work-with-david-seymour

For the last 6 years we have just taken such a coalition as a given. However now the prospect is upon us. I cannot see the policy divide being bridged. When ACT had one or two MPs, they had to be satisfied with beads and trinkets. That will not work this time round.

Seymour is not going to accept the retention of ruinously expensive left policies such as university fees free. Neither is he going to let go of deciding once and for all that New Zealand is a democracy with universal sufferage. This has become a defining policy for ACT.

I also don’t think that Seymour is going to let the Zero Carbon Act slide. He knows that the fiscal, economic, and social costs of that Act are going to hit like an avalanche well before 2030.

https://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/climate-economic-fiscal-assessment/nga-korero-ahuarangi-me-te-ohanga-2023

The reality is that National is now a centre-left political party. Based on any internationally accepted definition of that label. In turn, that means that tensions with David Seymour will periodically erupt.

I believe that it New Zealand First had the numbers, Chris Luxon would much rather have a collation with them than with ACT. However New Zealand First will not have the numbers. The most optimistic scenario would have New Zealand First and National far short of a majority.

Like everyone else, I don’t know how this will play out. However it will not be smooth sailing.

I would appreciate hearing other views, particularly from those who disagree with me.
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September 14, 2023 8:00am
- bartybart
  
  Nat 43%
  Lab 22%
  ACT 13%
  Gre 9%
  NZF 4%
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:02am
  - Tomtoddy
    
    Nat 41%
    ACT 18%
    Lab 20%
    Gree 12%
    NZF 6%
    
    ACT always polls low. Seymour’s wanderings will be long forgotten by election time.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:16am
    - Colville
      
      Nat 38%
      ACT 15%
      Lab 22%
      Gree 14%
      NZF 6%
      Others 5%
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:22am
      - Nickc2
        
        I don’t give a big rat’s arse about the figures, so long as Labour/Green/TPM don’t get anywhere near the Treasury Benches for at least the next six years.
        
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        September 14, 2023 3:18pm
    - Jethrod
      
      Can you please supply attributes for your figures please, rather than just bald figures!
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:54am
    - Mark Hanley
      
      As I’ve mentioned a few times, supporting ACTs sensible policies (charter schools and 3 strikes were both Bobby Dazzlers, as is the TOW referendum) is pointless without taking into consideration David Seymours poor track record.
      
      David ‘s only long term policy success numbers one. The referendum backed end of life bill.
      
      So, if you want real change, vote national or ACT.
      
      Then post election invest time and money into asking Chria Luxon to investigate Labour’s corruption, and to put in place a system which ensures it never happens again.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:55am
      - mawm
        
        Down ticked only because we should not have to wait until after the election to find out what Luxon is going to do. He has always been giving us signals as to how far left he is and I don’t think that is going to change.
        
        Seymour is being a bit of a dick but still is the only one offering good ideas.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:27am
      - Mark Hanley
        
        MAWN. Luxon is telling you what he is going to do and all his policies come from the centre right play book.
        
        * tax and spending cuts,
        * public service targets,
        * directly accountable commissioners,
        * measureable targets for ministers,
        * restore law and order,
        * beating inflation,
        * targeting gangs,
        * Building roads
        * Facilitating house building (unfortunately more immigration is the only short term answer to the mess we are in and theyll need somewhere to live)
        
        See for.yourself at…
        https://www.national.org.nz/plan
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:50am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Mawm, This happens nearly every Election.
        No Party will say who they will get into bed with.
        As Peters used to say ‘we will let the voters decide’ But how. [Mod – use his name ]is who will decide. What him, he is dangerous.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:58am
      - David Garrett
        
        Mark H: What does “restore law and order” actually mean? There is no specific committment to restore 3S…he could have put that on his pledge card, rather than that meaningless waffle
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:26pm
      - Ghost
        
        I just don’t know how you can achieve that. The justice system is fucked, a bunch of judges who are so disconnected from reality that they hand out home detention for rape. Prison has become less a punishment than it needs to be. Let’s also be honest, the crime isn’t out of control because of labour, it’s been going this direction for a long time.
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:33pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        I think the tax cuts are even less likely to happen this time than they were in 2009 when Peter Creswall (Not PC) wrote this:
        
        Significant tax cuts were a key election-winning promise for National, remember?
        And now they want to recant on that promise, just as I told you they would back in October. “Economic conditions” and a projected “decade of deficits” make it impossible, say Prime Minister John Key and his Finance Minister Bill English, to deliver the latter two of the three rounds of tax cuts they promised so loudly back in November.
        Excuse me boys, but isn’t it the case that these tax cuts, promised less than five months ago, were a key reason that the public gave you the jobs you have now? Shouldn’t you be doing now what’s necessary to do what you promised then?
        Isn’t it just a bit rich to say that “economic conditions” now make it impossible to deliver what you promised back before the election, because it was obvious back then to anyone with eyes to see that economic conditions were going to make it necessary to cut the government’s coat according to the cloth it could afford.
        To say that it wasn’t obvious to you back then is not an excuse not to deliver now, it’s a reason for your supporters to realise that you’re either not competent enough to do your jobs — since the whole world and his grandson could see back in October what was coming — or else you’re a pair of liars.
        No other alternative explanation is possible.
        
        And if his Randian Objectivism lends him perhaps too harsh a perspective, he also quotes the more fair-minded economic commentator, Michael Reddell on this elections National tax cuts:
        
        When the fiscal deficit as it as large as it is, a major political party promising tax cuts really should be able to convincingly suggest to the public that the cost will be fully covered and that if their programme was adopted it would not worsen the already-large deficit. National’s package does not pass that test at present.
        
        I’d love this to happen and god knows I could use the money, but I think “fiscal conservatism” will overwhelm the tax cuts. In case you haven’t noticed we’ve gone from 2017’s promise of indexing the tax brackets to inflation (could that not have been done after at least the 2014 election?) to a one-off reset now. Which is good, but it needs to happen annually otherwise it’s just handing another future victory to the Left in their endless quest to sneakily get more money to piss up against the wall.
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:27pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        David. restore 3 strikes is National Policy.
        
        The link I provided says restore law and order means..
        
        National will introduce stronger sentences for convicted criminals, by limiting the ability of judges to reduce sentences, making gang membership an aggravating factor,
        
        RESTORING THREE STRIKES
        
        and ending taxpayer funding for cultural reports.
        
        Perhaps MAWN can uptick me now?
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:14pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        Hunter. If you take the “think it won’t happen” approach to.policy announcements then where does it stop?
        
        We have no choice but to take politicians with a track record of successful large organisation change management at their word.
        
        Otherwise if you think policy announcements won’t happen. Who do you vote for?
        
        You certainly wouldn’t vote for ACT with their woeful record on long term positive government change.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:42pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        Ghost. The justice system has been screwed by the Labour Party’s “gang supporting” policies.
        
        I know judges and police, and they would love to lock those assholes away.
        
        The next question is why is the Labour hierarchy supporting gangs and ensuring a steady supply of new members by allowing brown kids to skip school (gangs don’t care if you can’t read or write but every legitimate employer does)?
        
        Only a forensic investigation of the money trail and the Labour Hierarchy’s bank accounts will uncover the corruption.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:48pm
      - Ghost
        
        The justice system has had problems for a long time. Let’s be honest. Sportsmen would get name suppression and wet bus tickets. A comedian that abused his daughter drunk one night got dismissed to protect his career. It’s got worse under labour but it was crap before labour
        
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        September 14, 2023 2:00pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Act will now be below 10%
      
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      September 14, 2023 1:56pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Lol
        You’re a Parody account- right?
        
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        September 14, 2023 2:09pm
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    barty O’ bart – after Robbo has wiped the floor with Nicola Willis on the tax costings and Chippie licking his lips to push Luxon into mud, here are the revised numbers:
    
    Nat 33%
    Lab 38%
    ACT 7%
    Gre 12%
    NZF 6%
    Others 4%
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:29pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  I’m taking a wait-and-see approach because politicians usually surprise us by “compromising” – that is, dumping their policies and promises. I’ve seen it happen in every election in my life and especially in the MMP era.
  
  Up until the C-19 affair I would have marked ACT as the party least likely to do that on their core beliefs or principles around individual liberty. But their attitude towards mandates seemed no different than that of Labour or National, and Seymour’s wooden-headed refusal to even talk about “possible mistakes” (that’s how it could be spun if he’s still worried about a MSM pile-on distracting from ACT’s election messages) have marked yet another typical politician’s play.
  
  So, he and ACT could well compromise on those things you mentioned? Or perhaps National could?
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:10am
  - Grunter
    
    ACT were against all “mandates” (on record) but they were very pro vacine and Seymour refuses to engage on anything COVID. He knows its a black hole with lots of foot trips that the left MSM will jump on and create hell for him.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:17am
  - I remember when
    
    Perhaps the partnership the National and ACT formed over the last three years gives some indication of their ability to work together.
    Why would we expect anything less after the election, even allowing for their election policies.
    Would Luxon’s advisors really be likely to suggest going with NZ First rather than ACT?
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:10am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Good idea to wait.
    Electioneering is a 4D chess game( the 4th dimension timeing)
    
    NOBODY will know YET what will come out after negotiations
    
    “There are no solutions. There are only trade-offs.”
    ― Thomas Sowell,
    
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    September 14, 2023 1:27pm
- kiwikidsnz
  
  People worry too much about disagreement & conflicting perspectives.
  
  In my decades working in the private sector multinational business Luxon started out in, generally a level of conflict between peers in open discussions leads to higher quality decisions being made. Everyone has to then back the consensus.
  
  Its the secret squirrel gameplayers that white ant successful businesses.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:13am
  - Dudley Quaffquaff
    
    But your businesses didn’t have to thrash through those differences out in the open, with hostile opponents salivating for the opportunity to scream “Kiwikidsnz.com is DIVIDED! Facade of Unity at Kkn is DESTROYED! Kkn Reduced to DISORGANIZED RABBLE!” did they?
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:49am
- Swifty
  
  Necessity is the mother of invention Benedict.
  
  They (ACT and National) will find a way to work together.
  
  They’d be mad not to.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:14am
  - Colville
    
    I believe its a done deal and has been since Luxon took over.
    Luxon sorted out the Nat caucus and got them in line…of course he would have had talks with Seymour/ACT about who does what going forward and where each party would push the media.
    To leave it till after the election would be incompetent and that aint Luxon…he may be a bit wet for my taste but he is extremely capable of organising a team and a large part of their success is due to that ability.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:41am
    - Kiwiguy
      
      I also believe this. They’re in no way strangers to each other.
      Behind the scenes, they’ve planned the path forward and what part each is going to play.
      National is carefully playing for the centre vote. (Volume)
      Act is strategically playing for the more right wing vote – more edgier, if you will.
      Once they’re in Govt together, I suspect they’ll gradually move more to the right. National will ‘blame’ Act for this, but it will have been planned.
      Bring it on.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:00am
      - Colville
        
        Agreed.
        Term 1(23 – 26) “will be a dont scare the horses” settling in period.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:02pm
- Matt Long
  
  Politics is the art of compromise, I expect there will be many. Both parties will have a lot of new MPs and the expectations and ambitions of these will need to be managed as well. Seymour may find a good number of National MPs more in line with his views than the wet faction currently holding sway in National.
  National having enough MPs to play Peters off against Seymour would be a disastrous result, fortunately both minor parties are against dividing the country by race.
  Finally,it won’t be until after the election we get to see some true colours, as one of my teachers said, it doesn’t matter who you marry, after the wedding you will find they were someone else.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:14am
  - rockape
    
    I think you overestimate Nationals wetness. Luxon needs to get elected and knows he needs the center and not to scare the horses to do so. Once he is PM and has proved tax cuts work for the middle and cutting burocracy can work for the economy and for improvements in the public services then things can change. Then I think you will see a move to the right and ACT will be a help in that. But looking at past elections. Nat / ACT tend to get around 49% of the vote so if people like what National achieve expect pressure to come on ACTs vote in the shorter term, ie the next 6 years.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:28am
    - hullkiwi
      
      👍 you have pretty much called it right. All the bs from the Actoids about “wet National” or “spinless National”, is just that, bs.
      
      What do they think the messages we have been giving directly to our National MPs/candidates?
      
      The only clueless ones have been Actoids channelling Matthew Hooton!
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:45am
    - Pope Punctilious II
      
      And what is this opinion based on? The voting records of most of the Nats, and their recent support for the government’s proposed “gender-pay gap” reporting, show just how wet they are.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:06am
      - Pope Punctilious II
        
        Down-voters – once again I’d like to hear your arguments.
        
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        September 14, 2023 6:55pm
    - mogg
      
      That is the most sensible comment I have read here in a long while. I think it has been obvious all along that this campaign is about what Luxon is not saying, and it is working very well.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:47am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    We have seen what Peters is like and what he has done. If National deals with him they will be very sorry. Time to piss off NZF.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:28am
    - Gravelroad
      
      I just cannot believe the people on here advocating for National to go into a coalition with Winston 1st.
      If Labour gets anywhere near winning, he will go back to support them – same as he did in 2017.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:37am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      If Peters holds the balanceof power and is told to piss off he will go with Labour.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:44am
      - RoboRob
        
        ‘If Peters holds the balanceof power ~~and is told to piss off~~ he will go with Labour.’
        
        FTFY
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:13am
      - Colville
        
        Chuck.
        Chippy will bend over and grab his ankles just like Jacinda did in ’17.
        Anything for power. Anything.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:04pm
    - rockape
      
      The time to piss off Peters will be the week before voting starts. Wait till he says something RACIST or really dumb, then Luxon can say he couldn’t work with him.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:54am
      - pdm
        
        rocky – Winston and Shane Jones are two of the few who can say (so called) racist things and get away with it. If I said what they say in Public the men in `white coats’ would be coming for me.
        
        Having said that Luxon needs to avoid Peters like the plague as far as any coalition is concerned.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:45am
      - Paulus
        
        Why do the media continually want Luxon to suck up to Peters ?
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:42pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      S.O
      
      This is why people are sick and tired of political parties and this electoral system .
      
      We are in the position of voting for something that does not yet exist.
      A coalition.
      
      The failure point is that the public have no opportunity to approve or reject the proposed government .
      
      This transfer of power to MPs to enable them to decide the form of the government is unacceptable.
      
      Either declare legally binding coalition intentions before the election or form a post election coalition and have a referendum to get public approval .
      
      Having a mathematical possibility of a radical party supported by 25% of the population being reelected to govern shows that this system is a failure .
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:55am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        This system is a failure yes. It does not mean ‘proportional’ anymore. It is a blackmail tool. Thinking back FPP was way better. FPP also meant National or Labour. The freak Parties never got a look in. They became hovels for commies to hang out in. I don’t think NZ can ever go back.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:17am
      - imalwaysright
        
        S.O
        Maybe end the party system and make each electorate MP able to vote independently.
        
        Imagine a Parliament that is based on what is good for the country rather than for political parties.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:23am
      - Flossie
        
        IAR – how would it work with electorate MPs voting independently but Party List MPs voting…? According to party instructions? The only reason the latter group is in parliament is because of their affiliations.
        I hate the whole system that does not allow us to be rid of useless MPs who happen to be near the top of their party’s list.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:53am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        imalwaysright, That would be true proportional representation.
        But who draws up the Electorate Boundaries? That is where the corruption will start.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:02am
      - waikatosinger
        
        You can’t end the party system by fiat. Parties evolved as the best strategy for success under the rules of the system. Abolish them somehow and they will just evolve again.
        
        Individuals are powerless, even in parliament. Politics is about the formation of alliances and coalitions – about individuals coming together to make groups to get things done.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:12am
      - Matt Long
        
        Singer, yes I remember National MPs talking about their impotence with rural issues in Key’s government as though they were opposition MPs and had not say in what the government was doing.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:47am
      - imalwaysright
        
        S.O, Flo, Wai, and Matt,
        Great points , thanks.
        The ideal is simple but the execution of the ideal is near impossible .
        At least we know what the ideal looks like.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:06pm
  - Cara
    
    Quote from Richard Prebble in the Herald:
    “There are some things politicians should not campaign on, but just do.”
    (They can always blame the previous government – with justification, as in 1984.)
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:47pm
- rockape
  
  I disagree with you. Both National and ACT want to move Government to the right. It may not happen as fast as ACT supporters want . But if their is movement in the 23 to 26 government then ACT will survive. If ACT make government difficult or cost us an early election then they will be toast. I will give the incoming government including ACT three terms and during that we will see movement in the direction we want. If ACT want it all to happen this term they are kidding and won’t last long.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:17am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    I can’t speak for ACT supporters but I’m not looking for a Rogernomics revolution in just three years. As a right winger I don’t trust revolutions, even when they’re pushing on things I favour.
    
    But at a minimum I’m expecting some bedrock stuff to be done early on that will grow over the next few years, driven not by National or ACT after the initial work but by voters who have been given real monetary and decision-making power – in healthcare and education to start with. If changes are made that are just central government decisions by NACT then they’ll fail because the next Labour government will simply reverse them (see charter schools).
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:24am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Rogernomics hurt NZ but it needed to be done.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:19am
      - zulumonster
        
        Short term pain, long term gain though. None of those reforms have ever been reversed by a Labour Party who even today seem to decry them as the reason for all every negative part of society today.
        Whereas this regime has delivered short term pain for long term pain … a very important difference!
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:20am
      - hullkiwi
        
        Zulu, they have not been reversed entirely. However, over the past 30 years we have seen backsliding back to where NZ was pre 1982. Why pre 1982?
        
        We’ve yet to see Labour agree to a price/wage freeze.
        
        National is ever likely to repeat that stunt. The National party itself would tear itself apart than go go back down the path of Muldoon again!
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:41am
      - cmm
        
        zulu is correct. Sometimes you just have to take your lumps.
        
        When you always try to take the painless option it ends up in more, worse pain.
        
        Look at all the Covid spending to avoid a relatively short term pain. Now we’re sitting in a $150+bn hole that will take generations to fix.
        
        Rogernomics was required. NZ was beyond screwed. And we’re right on the edge of the cliff again.
        
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        September 14, 2023 4:06pm
    - Mark Hanley
      
      Tom Hunter is bang on.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:29am
  - Observer of Life
    
    Rock: If National make government difficult or cost us an early election then perhaps they will be toast. Just a thought!
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:26am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Whichever party is percieved to cause an early election will be punished.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:24am
    - Paulus
      
      Media will do everything they can to make new Government’s life as difficult as possible.
      They have started already but why are they so rude – I suppose they were never taught any manners.
      
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      September 14, 2023 1:45pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Luxon was cuddling up to Labour far too often for me. He is looking for the center left vote. Those fools will be voting NZF, Greens, Labour, and other losers.
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:06am
    - Ghost
      
      Will they?
      
      I was talking to my gp’s practice manager the other day, so strongly labour, she and the other labour supporters are voting national, for a few reasons. One they’ve seen the damage to health labour have done and are doing. The other to keep act out. One of these people has a relative thar works in wellington for labour and her phones wallpaper is a pic of her and jacinda
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:11am
      - Paulus
        
        Bet she would still vote for Ardern if she were still in power.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:47pm
      - Ghost
        
        Hard to tell, since last year she, the gp’s and reception have been telling people that labour have destroyed health
        
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        September 14, 2023 2:08pm
      - cmm
        
        What do they think they would achieve by keeping Act out?
        
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        September 14, 2023 4:07pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Right rockape and as we have seen from the Labour Mob who tried change far too much and only served to stuff everything up. The new Government will have more than enough to put right just to get the country moving in any direction but forward is the No1 priority. Ministerial allocations will be crucial and lets hope they are selected on merit and ability rather than on gender or divisive criteria. Quangoes and useless Ministries created by Labour need to be shut down and the real work incorporated where best to be handled. Early contenders must be the Ministry for Pacific Peoples and Whaikaha – the Ministry of Disabled People who only spend but achieve nothing. Feel free to add t5o this list as thre are plenty of options where so many seem to do sweet FA but sing and spend as fast as it is allocated.
    
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    September 14, 2023 6:53pm
- Warren
  
  It’s your right to post what you believe BY but that doesn’t mean you are correct, so everyone to their own view, my view is I will never trust David Seymour after the deal he did with Winston Peter’s on the Euthanasia referendum.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:17am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Why? It seemed appropriate that such a pivotal law was endorsed by a referendum.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:00am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Ok Warren. Will put you down as single issue voter.
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:55pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I think David Seymour is just doing a bit of arm wrestling and flexing his muscles. You mention beads and trinkets in the past. Things are way different now. Act will have a lot of Party Vote seats. The beads and trinkets are gone.
  National are center-left, but Act will show them the direction back to the center ot center right.
  We have has six years of bullying from Labour. National does not need to cuddle up to them anymore.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:20am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    But that’s the thing, many in National have a “born to rule” attitude and think that ACT should be happy with “beads and trinkets”. This is why Seymour pointed out that they do have options and he will not accept being ignored.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:10am
- David Garrett
  
  I disagree.
  
  During my time ACT and the Nats had a confidence and supply agreement – that only compelled us to support the Nats on those two areas. Even though Key very cleverly also did a similar deal with the Maoris – so we could not “be the gatekeepers” as Rodney had hoped – we were still able to get them to agree to several of our key policies, the top of the list being three strikes, which I have since learned had little support among the Nats.
  
  We could, and sometimes did, vote against their legislation, most often further “treaty settlements”, and other Maori “giveaways” such as control of the Waikato river. On the latter measure, IIRC we were the only party in parliament who voted NO.
  
  Frankly I am surprised Luxon has not ruled out working with Peters as Key did. I suspect that a major reason NZF is now polling above 5% on some polls is that Luxon has not done that, meaning that those who have philosophical objections to ACT can vote NZF -which entails believing Peters’ bullshit, and believing that he could form a stable government with the Nats. On Peters’ past record, that would not be the case.
  
  God help us all if Luxon is forced to do a deal with Peters. Seymour has quite rightly ruled out working with him, so there could never be a Nat/ACT/NZF government. Nat/NZF would inevitably lead to Peters walking out – or being kicked out – as has been the case every time he has been part of the government, going back 30 years with Bolger.
  
  As well as being corrupt as hell, Peters is an opposition politician; that gives him the freedom to promise and say anything, without ever having to deliver.
  
  In short, despite major policy differences, the Nats and ACT could and hopefully will work well together.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:21am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    DG – I think the ‘freedom’ vote is worth about 4-6%. At least. Those adversely affected by covid policies and mandates etc.
    National are ignoring this group, Seymour in particular has antagonised them by denying the truth re all cause mortality and still claiming jabs are safe and effective. He’s also now ignoring them.
    
    I think that is more likely the reason for NZF rise in the polls rather than the reason you’ve given.
    I believe it’s a political hole that could be closed if National and Act were to speak out. But seems as though they’ve decided not to touch it.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:34am
    - RoboRob
      
      Yes the freedom group is clearly worth votes and Winston has picked up on that. The rest of his votes are likely Lefties unhappy with Labour and not crazy enough to vote Green of TPM.
      
      ACT and National cant focus on that small % as it would likely cost them MUCH more votes. Especially from middle aged woman.
      
      I am not sure National/Act can do anything to keep Winston out. I suspect there are easily 5% of left wing voters who may go with Winston first.
      
      Luxons refusal to rule out NZF probably gives Winston some right wing covid voters. I guess the ‘hope’ is that these people will look past that single policy area and remember Winstons past actions.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:20am
      - Surely Knott
        
        It was not a single policy area. It was 2 years from my life. Where we were forced out of society and made to feel like vermin and filth. Every day by all parties and media. Where they took our basic rights. Our right to refuse medical treatment, our right to free speech, our right to protest. Where they lied to us about the stats and the numbers to coerce us. It is the biggest breach of public trust in NZ. It has fundamentally changed us. And not a word from Luxon or Seymour of apology or understanding. I will be voting on that issue.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:25am
      - RoboRob
        
        @Surely Knott
        
        What exactly are you expecting Winston (who was part of the Covid government) to do?
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:59am
      - Ghost
        
        He was a part of the covid govt for about 6 to 7 months, everything else that followed, the vaccine, the mandates, the dividing the country was all Cindy
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:13pm
      - Surely Knott
        
        @roborob. It’s not what I’m expecting Winston to do, it’s what he’s already done. He has changed the conversation. Not just on mandates. Also Womens rights in sports and changing rooms, and acknowledging WEF and the influence of the globalists.
        
        Because it wasn’t simply a virus that escaped from a wet market and a NZ response. A major societal change is happening globally and in NZ. A change that will be hard to undo. A fundamental change to our democracy. I want someone who will have the discussion and respecfully listen. Yes I know his weaknesses to.
        
        And this poem “if ” read by Winston Peters might just have sealed the deal.
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csf4qNAN6f4
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:19pm
      - sparkhole
        
        @Surely and @Robo
        
        I would like Winston Peters, in person and publicly, to remove Jacinda Ardern’s knighthood and say “Yip, yip, that’s how it is”
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:21pm
    - Sparrow
      
      Clan I note you you have a lot of downticks I think they are wrong. You are correct Winston is filling a hole on two important issues to many. The mandates and co-governance. Winston is possibly the most and astute and cunning politician he has smelt the wind and zeroed into them. They are too hot to handle by other politicians. Mentioned this before living in Northland picked up an undercurrent of support for Winston. Sure nobody trusts the old bugger but he says what they are thinking. Many of the Wellington protestors came from this area. Can you trust any politician they are all liars. Now going through this bazaar bargaining shit one lot will give us x number of doctors the other lot promise x+y doctors. Give me a break.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:47am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Sparrow – yes, the downticks don’t bother me. It’s people venting because they don’t like the truth.
        
        I would much prefer to have been able to vote Act. I was almost guaranteed to until Seymour came out with his nonsense about negative all cause mortality.
        It’ll be what it will be, just good to have a forum to allow the conversation. The ‘single source of truth’ was never going to fly!
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:38am
    - pdm
      
      Clan – Ithink the Freedom Electorate Vote may surprise because the Tamaki follows will know their local candidate.
      
      Party Vote not so much.
      
      I have an Aunt and Uncle and their family who are well entrenched into the wider church set up – criticise Tamaki at your peril. They are likely to Party Vote NZFirst.
      
      I know, I know – don’t ask me why.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:13am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    That’s good to hear David. You have been there. I’m just a keyboard theorist. 😅
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:35am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    With today’s 1news/verian poll NZF is not needed. If Luxon now rules Peters out, National will gain more votes. Many are still not totally sure about the chance that Luxon may hold hands with Peters.
    We have seen what the evil Peters is capable of.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:38am
    - David Garrett
      
      Steve O: Spot on. I simply don’t understand why Luxon has not rule Peters out as Key very sensibly did – and they didn’t get back in 2008, although that was very probably because Peters had been called a liar by the Privileges Committee rather than Key’s decision.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:11am
      - Mark Hanley
        
        Could it be that Luxon likes the idea of…
        – ACT making the TOW referendum a bottom line
        – Peter’s making the covid response investigation a bottom line?
        
        It will allow Luxon to do the things he must know need to be done, without giving the despicable NZ media the means to scare off the (typically low IQ) swing voters before the election.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:40am
      - Stephen Russell
        
        Luxon may need Peters. If not in the next term, then maybe the one after that. He is mindful of what happened in 2017. Key shut Peters out for nine years. Which was great. But Peters got his revenge in 2017. If Luxon rules out Peters now that might work short term, but it would make it much much harder to get him aboard in ’26 or ’29 if Peters got the balance of power then.
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:53pm
      - cmm
        
        Stephen
        
        Is Winston still going to be around two or three elections form now?
        
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        September 14, 2023 4:09pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        cmm: “Is Winston still going to be around two or three elections form now?”
        
        Peters is 78. Henry Kissenger is 100 and still jet-setting around working. Anything is possible.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:41pm
    - Raphael
      
      Indeed. as an Opposition MP Peters is brilliant. He knows exactly how to skewer the MP’s on the treasury benches and is not afraid of getting down in the mud.
      Howevr if he’s on the treasury benches, he’s one of the worst of the lot at the trough.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:42am
      - kowtow
        
        Raphael
        
        I hate to be difficult , but a “brilliant ” MP represents his constituents .
        
        That man has never , ever done anything other than create noise around and about himself.
        
        There’s an old saying about these politicians along the lines of ;
        
        it’s easy to make noises and comment when you carry no accountability or responsibilty .
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:19pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    … which I have since learned had little support among the Nats.
    
    I thought that was obvious even at the time, given Power’s (?) slow-walking the legislation. I was annoyed because, as usual, I’d heard all about National being “tough on crime”, but then that’s pretty much the case across the board for them.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:40am
    - David Garrett
      
      Tom: You need to remember I was a totally green – with a small “g”! – MP at the time, and the duplicitous Power had several terms under his belt. It was only at the crucial summit meeting I have referred to here before that I realised he was a slimy bastard who had been playing games with me.
      
      Prior to that, I had made it my business to meet with and speak to all Nat ministers to explain; 1) how three strikes would work; and 2) why I thought it would work to reduce crime and increas public safety.
      
      The only Minister who refused to see me was English – for reasons which later became obvious – and the only nay sayer to my face was Wayne Mapp. All the rest professed support for it in varying degrees of enthusiasm.
      
      It was only after the Act passed that I found their caucus had been divided by the proposal – thus some of those had been lying to me.
      
      Once again, I had been in parliament less than a year at that time, and tended to take people at face value. Silly me!
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:17am
      - RoboRob
        
        The very same ‘Wayne Mapp’ who based on his posts here would have been better placed in the Labour or New Labour party.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:22am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        … and the only nay sayer to my face was Wayne Mapp.
        
        Haha.
        Not.
        A.
        Surprise.
        
        You are right. There were (and are) a substantial number of National MP’s who would have similar views to myself.
        
        Combine that with other comments made at the link and you can understand why I have grave doubts that the next National-led government is going fix very much that will prevent a future – and likely even more left-wing Labour-led government – from pushing us even further into the shit across all areas of society.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:25am
      - kowtow
        
        DG
        
        I love your insights .It helps to make this blog the success that it undoubtedly is.
        
        Could I ask what was English’s beef ?
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:05am
      - Matt Long
        
        Which reasons for English David? If you don’t mind sharing, I’m kind of addicted to background stuff.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:16am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        My recollection is that I didn’t oppose the whole concept. Rather I thought some improvements were necessary, basically removing some relatively minor crimes.
        Yes, I did directly discuss my concerns with you. Surely the right thing to do.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:55am
      - David Garrett
        
        Kowtow: I don’t exactly know what English’s beef was since he refused to meet with me – twice.
        
        I assume because he has opined that “prisons are a moral and fiscal failure” he couldn’t support anything that might lead even to a modest increase in the prison population.
        
        As it transpired, about 1% of prison beds were taken up with second and third strikers serving more time than they otherwise would have. The 7000 odd first strikers added nothing to the prison population because their sentence was as it would have been prior to 3S – the only difference was they got a first warning.
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:14pm
      - kowtow
        
        DG
        
        Thank you .
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:22pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Wayne: Oh dear…11 years on you still don’t know that the “strike” offences were all crimes of violence carrying seven years or more as a maximum penalty.
        
        The one major mistake I made was including indecent assault, which can be “relatively minor”, i.e. a slap on the arse.
        
        I was warned about that by Graeme Edgeler…I should have listened to such wise counsel.
        
        What other strike offences do you consider were “relatively minor” ??
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:35pm
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        David,
        
        You have just answered the very question that I raised at the time. The issue of indecent assault, which as you noted, can include some pretty minor assaults. Because the Three Strikes Act had almost no discretion, it was better to remove that offence.
        
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        September 14, 2023 3:39pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Re English with “prisons are a moral and fiscal failure”. I take that to mean society has become a mess (thanks loony left) and prisons are bloody expensive to run.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:44pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    “Nat/NZF would inevitably lead to Peters walking out ”
    
    David, the chance of National and NZF getting 61 seats is almost zero.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:52am
    - David Garrett
      
      Chuck: Please don’t take offence…you are a mate. I know you have been a member of both ACT and the Nats in the past; have you also been a member of NZF? I seem to remember you told me you had.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:30am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        David, I am talking logic not personalities. Do you think it possible that National and NZF could get 61 seats as ou appear to have suggested?
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:27am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        David, David Seymour has unknowingly helped NZF. Running Brooke against O’Conner because of his conservative views on abortion and euthanasia has upset Family First.
        
        Family First has been promoting Peters. Family First does have an influence on conservative voters.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:19am
      - David Garrett
        
        You haven’t answered my question Chuck, which was have you been a member of NZF as well as National and ACT?
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:16pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    DG: it is perhaps a bold statement to state that “there could never be a Nat/ACT/NZF government.”
    
    In 2017 there were plenty who said “there could never be a Labour/Green/NZF government” and yet that’s exactly what we got.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:41am
    - David Garrett
      
      Lodden: Seymour has ruled out being in cabinet with Peters, and that is one committment I am quite sure he would keep to. Seymour recognises that Peters is a force for chaos
      
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      September 14, 2023 12:17pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Bit of insight DG but time have changed and the real negotiations around a coalition will come after the election. I am surprised so many commenters think old Winston First might be anything other than an opposition party among the other opposition parties rather than with. This latest poll has him getting 5% or better but even if he joins with the Coalition of Chaos they could not compete with the total numbers of National and Act in the House.
    
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    September 14, 2023 7:18pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Its all political games at the moment but once the results are in I suggest that Real Politik will mean a deal between Nats and Act
  Both sides know it and that’s what will happen.
  I think Act will get some major concessions
  
  PS For the Pool guessing how many time G says Seymour is arrogant today, I pick 37 times
  //
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:21am
  - Grunter
    
    I agree Red…. reality will kick in pretty quickly on Monday morning Oct 16th and Luxon and Seymour will pull together a deal. I suspect they already have a ‘gentlemans agreement’ on the side whereby the Nats are targeting the centre left with, for example, climate net zero, and ACT are going hard on “one person one vote” etc. They may well already have a road map on how they bridge these key platforms/apparent disagreements.
    
    The economic reality NZ shown by PREFU is the ideal excuse for them both to say “thing’s are worse than we thought, Robertson has left us in the siht, so we are now cutting an extra $x Billion of woke stuff….”
    
    Plus, the dire situation of the global economy will dictate a major reduction in NZ Govt spend over the next 5-10 yrs. We simply won’t be able to ‘borrow & hope’ anymore.
    
    The lefties will hate all this of course, which will be fun to watch!
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:41am
  - 3-coil
    
    All_on_Red: Who is “G” ?
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:42am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      G the Giant from Dunners
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:12am
    - wsk12345
      
      [Mod – stop with the personal crap]
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:24am
- SmokerGuy
  
  I think they will make it work, what’s the alternative? National needs to accept that it has to cut more than it proposes as part of its policies and make some real reform. We simply cannot afford to keep going along like this. Alternatively ACT needs to realise their vote will be a third of Nationals and therefore they do not have a as much sway as Seymour likes to convey they do. They don’t want to be seen as the tail wagging the dog. They’re all adults and they will negotiate and come up with an acceptable arrangement I’m sure
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:22am
  - artemisia
    
    National and ACT have both signalled focus on wasteful spending. It will happen bigly, very bigly. I’m sure there is a long list and the red pen at the ready.
    
    Taxpayers will applaud. Troughers and negative taxpayers not so much. Oh dear, how sad …
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:13am
- peterwn
  
  Fear not, David Seymour has recognised he overstepped the mark and has pulled his head in. He will want to make the coalition work, if he is obstructive (ie declares ‘cold war’) then Labour would be guaranteed to win the 2026 (or earlier) election. I would not call ACT gains in the past (eg three strikes and charter schools) mere trinkets. David would not be happy if his access card does not let him into the Beehive and would want to avoid that situation.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:23am
- Nukuleka
  
  Sorry, Benedict. You have displayed very serious errors of basic good judgement in other areas and you are once again allowing poor judgement to cloud your vision. Every time DPF publishes poll results he clearly presents the combined National/ACT seat numbers as a combined coalition. I believe he is closer to the heartbeat of National thinking than you are. You are playing the media game of divide and conquer.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:23am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Nothing to do with the media. I am relying on the words coming out of the mouth of David Seymour.
    
    “The reason why other parties fail in negotiations is because they’re not prepared to lose, do you understand me? They go in there, they’re so power-obsessed, they’re not prepared to lose. And we’ve never failed at any negotiation ever because we’ve got one up on them: we’re prepared to say no, we’re prepared to stay on the cross benches.”
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/election-2023/497636/act-s-david-seymour-floats-confidence-only-partnership-no-supply
    
    How is that unclear? You think that Seymour is going to let idiotic National policies like retaining the fees free policy just slide?
    
    An ACT National coalition will not work without fundamental changes in National policy positions. Not at the margin.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:47am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Policies like fees free do not have to be a yes or no. It could be changes to fees free on the last year and/or bonding. Both parties could claim a win.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:00am
      - Colville
        
        Its giving money away that the government dosent have.
        It has to go.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:30pm
    - Piniwi
      
      Yes they will let it play out BY as the tertiary industry is needing every possible bum on a seat to survive as well as justify their funding allocations. Overseas student numbers will take some time to grow again as New Zealand does not have the same attraction as it had pre Covid. Apart from the growth in serious crime and even attacks on innocent members of the public, medical staff in carparks and the ram raids the tertiary establishments are too woke and being denigrated with too much native cultural crap. With so many pressing issues it is likely fees free cancelation might be a low priority revision.
      
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      September 14, 2023 7:31pm
- kowtow
  
  have a listen to Seymour on hdpa yesterday.
  
  despite the media and people like Tootin’ Hootin’ doing their best to destabalise a possible N/Act coalition , I believe there will be one .
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:25am
- cmm
  
  “Like everyone else, I don’t know how this will play out. However it will not be smooth sailing.”
  
  Smooth sailing to the Labour/National nirvana is the absolute last thing we need.
  
  For forever, NZ politics has followed the “wave” model:
  * Labour is the disruptive front of the wave that brings in policies and causes mayhem.
  * National is the back part of the wave that smooths things down, makes them work and beds them in.
  * Then Labour comes again…
  
  This gives us a relentless move in a direction that is not good for the longterm future.
  
  The growth of Act might change that, but it will take more than one term to do this.
  
  If we have to go through a temporary storm to come out somewhere better, then so be it.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:32am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    what is National going to do should it win this November beyond babysitting the institutions of Labour and the Left. Nursing those things along, tiring all the time and steadily losing votes simply by being in Government and getting blamed for the insanities of those self-same institutions. Until the day comes, one or two election cycles down the road, when a revitalised Labour gets back into power and gets to push forward some more. Ratchet Socialism at its best.
    
    Me here on Kiwiblog in 2008 and nothing seems to have changed except that the country has got worse.
    
    If the answer is National staying power for four terms or longer than that’s not a realistic answer. What’s needed was described long ago by Milton Friedman:
    
    I do not believe that the solution to our problem is simply to elect the right people. The important thing is to establish a political climate of opinion which will make it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:48am
    - cmm
      
      “The important thing is to establish a political climate of opinion which will make it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing.”
      
      All good in theory land, but in the real world the wrong people have no motivation to change the political climate.
      
      In a democracy we get what people vote for. Few will vote for belt tightening over lavish spending.
      
      It takes pain – real pain – for people to change their ways.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:11am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Jesus. I went back to 2008 on your link and scrolled up a little.
      Who did I find? That raving idiot PhilU (fool)…
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:41am
      - 3-coil
        
        I hope you took the chance to down-tick him…?
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:06am
    - Matt Long
      
      You were prescient Tom, I really believed Key would make NZ a better place, not take us further along Clark’s journey.
      One thing to keep in mind, the 2026 election is likely to see National take a significant proportion of ACT’s vote and any reforms not baked in by that point are likely to become bogged down in second term inertia.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:44am
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Benedict,
  
  I think National could agree on something like first year fees free. But not the Zero Carbon Act. The reason being is that Zero Carbon Act is tied to New Zealand’s commitments under the various climate change treaties. There is no way that National led government is going to have New Zealand leave these treaties. That would appeal to no more than 15% of voters.
  
  There will be other things where National and Act will broadly agree on and that is reducing the size of government bureaucracy, though perhaps not in the way Act would do it.
  
  I think one of the reasons why Act is dipping in the polls, is that Seymour has looked to much like power has gone to his head. Some National voters who had gone to Act, realise that National clearly needs to be the major party. Nevertheless, you are right, at 10% (one fifth of the government) Act gets some major policy wins.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:43am
  - Taieri
    
    That would appeal to no more than 15% of voters.
    —————
    
    Could you provide winning Lotto numbers for next Saturday as well?
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:53am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “The reason being is that Zero Carbon Act is tied to New Zealand’s commitments under the various climate change treaties.“
    
    Wayne that is incorrect. The commitment in the Paris Agreement is to reduce New Zealand emissions to 50 percent of gross emissions as they were in 2005, by 2030.
    
    The 2050 commitments are in the Zero Carbon Act but as far as I know they are not replicated in any agreement in the UNFCCC.
    
    As always, happy to be corrected.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:56am
    - Piniwi
      
      Correct BY but it is the means of meeting those levels that will get more attention now that there will be grownups running the country. Labour/Greens can only see it being dealt with by massive amounts of dollars when the first task is to find out what the real levels are and review the benefits/credits from untouched and protected native forest. Even Nationals farming policy just released has elements of emissions reductions elements included. So we could see some changes in how those targets can be reached at a much more realistic cost to the taxpayers.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:35pm
  - cmm
    
    I’m so sick of politicians using polls to justify their policies.
    
    It’s being a waitress and asking for people’s orders.
    
    That is not leadership.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:13am
    - NothingLeft
      
      But it’s a substantially better model for governance than what Labour have been doing with their sneaky racist anti-democratic policy agenda.
      
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      September 14, 2023 12:51pm
    - Colville
      
      cmm.
      You dont think selling customers what they want is a good business model?
      
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      September 14, 2023 1:32pm
      - cmm
        
        Selling customers what they want is not leadership either.
        
        The purpose of government is different to businesses.
        
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        September 14, 2023 3:00pm
      - Flossie
        
        Surely the purpose of an elected government is to carry out the will of the electors.
        
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        September 14, 2023 3:50pm
  - Dougal10
    
    Wayne , treaties are just agreements signed by politicians with other politicians. If they make life too hard for the people who actually do the work these treaties will need changed. If the politicians don’t listen they either get booted out or there is a revolution. This shit has been going on for thousands of years , climate treaties are just the latest incarnation that will come and go when the working man flexes his wrath.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:54am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  I doubt it will be plain sailing, but I hope there are enough people in National that want to do these things as long as they can claim someone else made them do it.
  
  Last time ACT was in government, they just caved in on almost everything and let National have what they wanted. I hope that doesn’t happen again.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:52am
- rouppe
  
  I think it is unrealistic that any party in government can expect to get all their policies through.
  
  If Seymour can get a couple of visible wins (eg close down a useless ministry or two, some firearms law changes) that would be something to leverage more.
  
  But no one, Seymour or Luxon, should expect every policy change from the January
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:56am
- Grumpy Silver Haired Female
  
  My, perhaps misguided, belief is that National is sympathetic to much of ACT’s hard lines but is carefully treading the centre road in order to gain the government benches. I truly believe that National’s financial heads are smart enough to realise that many left leaning policies are ruinous, to our society and to our economy and must be abandoned. We’ll see.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:57am
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    I thought this was a post worth addressing.
    
    In my view it is highly unlikely that National will do a whole lot of “hardline” things that they haven’t campaigned on. The main reason we got MMP is because the two major parties did some quite major things they did not campaign on, or in fact were the opposite to what they had campaigned on.
    
    That lesson has been well and truly learned.
    
    Of course the minor parties, on both sides of the spectrum, are well to the edge of their major coalition partner. However, the major party cannot afford to enact the radical proposals of the minor party. The reason being is that the major party has to own them.
    
    An example would be ACT wanting to turn the whole school system into a voucher system. National simply can’t take the risk of doing that. It would be radically different to what National has campaigned on. A hundred schools would be fine, but not the thousands of schools that make up the state school sector. So even if an Act person (Brooke van Zelden) was the Minister of Education, that is not carte blanche for her to reform the school system on the Act model.
    
    Broadly speaking, if the next Government is elected on the basis of 40% National and 10% Act, then the basic flavour of the government has to be National. There can’t be a secret agenda. The voters are entitled to believe that the major party gets to set the overall tone and style of the government.
    
    Yes, the minor party will get some serious wins. Certainly more than Act did in 2008, but on the fundamentals the government will be driven by National.
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:55pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  BY – the positive thing I’m seeing is, the situation is forcing the required conversations to be had around many things. It’s a pity that National and Act appear to have agreed to totally avoid the covid issue. It’s relevant to all of us, and important to a substantial number of people.
  
  It’s one of the most important conversation we need to have and it’s why there is a vacuum that Peters is exploiting.
  
  Tough discussion and debate helps resolve big problems. Ignoring them is disastrous policy.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:02am
- Rusty
  
  @Benedict,
  
  Ideology wise what did the Labour/NZ first coalition have in common between 2017-2020?
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:13am
  - RoboRob
    
    Prior to that election I was telling everyone I could that NZF and Labour policy were aligned and that a vote for NZF was NOT going to pull National to the right.
    
    NZF policy and labour policy was very closely aligned and many of the candidates for NZF were strongly left wing. My wifes friend was standing for NZF at the time and the social media conversations were clearly left wing and anti National.
    
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    September 14, 2023 9:32am
  - JimBobJoe
    
    A lust for power.. Its the core of Labours ideology as described by Lenin a long time ago… The rest is window dressing..
    
    As for NZF power is all Winston craves… Gives him the luxuries he wants and needs
    
    That lust forpower was enough for them to bond and form a government
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:15am
- Clownworld
  
  Nat and Lab are the uniparty. They simply take turns to destroy NZ and both work for the UN and the WEF as well as any globalust s.
  As for Act they came out of Lab as NZ First came from Nat. It’s all a charade, a game and we can see the Emperor has no clothes.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:44am
  - Rusty
    
    @Clownworld,
    
    If Luxon becomes PM he will be attending WEF forums and coming back telling us NZers “We are not doing enough to combat climate change and racial problems”
    
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    September 14, 2023 2:39pm
  - gravedodger
    
    You are blowing smoke from your arse Clown The Founders of ACT were Roger Douglas and Derek Quigley. Quigley was the leader of the attempt to overthrow Muldoon, a classic Socialist, squashed when MPs like Falloon all in favour until Muldoon landed back in the country and their courage deserted them, in Falloons case he defied a specific direction from his electorate committee.
    
    It grew from the right of Labour and the liberals from National hence Brash, Hide and Prebble.
    NZF is pure and simple the exercise of extreme narcissism of one person who has gathered and discarded many followers from anywhere, only Jones has survived. He even had Tracy Martin who would fit in well with current Labour ffs. In fact enjoys two places at the Trough courtesy of CHipkins, One as Chair of NZ Qualifications, the second as a board member of Potholes NZ once known as NZ Transport agency.
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:50pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Benedict by now you and most KBers should have come to realise that you never ever believe what a pollie any pollie says. Forget Chippie saying he wont work with Winston. If push comes to shove and Labour can form a Government with NZF they will do it in a flash. Chippie will just dismiss what he said as being before polling day and not knowing the final numbers.
  Betcha Labour will not walk away from the Treasury benches on the principle of not working with NZF. It wont happen.
  And that will apply to the Nats working with NZF which is why Luxon is boxing clever and not ruling NZF out. Similarly ACT will forget their hatred of NZF if necessary.
  IMHO all bets are off until the Specials are counted and the final result is known. It could go either way.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:48am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Benedict. IMHO at this point it could go either way. As Bob Jones predicts a landslide to the Nats and ACT or it could hinge on the Specials before we know which parties are in a position to form a Government.
  There is still 10% undecided. If they are mostly Shy Tories them it will be a landslide. If they are spilt along some of the recent polls then it could be very close either way.
  Election night will be fascinating. As usual Mrs LMS and I will be with a large group of mostly Nats and some ACT supporters.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:54am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  “University fees free” is ruinous if allied to the present funding model that compels universities to get as many bums on seats as possible. A much better model would be fees-free tuition allied to strict academic entry requirements. That way universities could focus on quality rather than quantity of education, and entry would be solely based on ability rather than money. We are producing far too many university graduates with degrees of doubtful value.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:12am
  - artemisia
    
    But but but, what about all those academics and other staff. Can’t have (more) job losses.
    
    If tertiary employees find themselves unemployed, would a tree fall silently in the woods?
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:52pm
- thirteenstars
  
  ACT would be satisfied with a few key policies and as 25% of the coalition they’d be entitled to it.
  
  For me it’s their student education accounts and reform to charter/community schools allowing easy registration. That policy alone would break the stranglehold the teachers and academics have on education. That’s where our woes started and that’s where they have to be solved. After three years of that so many parents will have got onboard there would be a significant protest vote against any move to roll it back.
  
  Net Zero insanity has to be tamed while allowing the Teals in National, including Luxon, to have their virtue signalling without killing our economy. The Teals would love to hold hands with the Greens in some Grand Alliance to show how committed they are but only if pushed hard enough. Luxon is still deluded that capitalism and green policies are compatible, that we can have our cake and eat it, too. Let him believe it but let saner policy reign.
  
  The CG referendum is not something National is giving to ACT. That doesn’t count. If the Nats can’t bloody stand fully for such a ref. then they are twice as dumb and useless as they often appear to be.
  
  The dissolution of the ~~monasteries~~ various government departments and agencies ACT has targeted won’t wash with the Nats who are too far to the left now to start tearing down the massive state they’ve had a big hand in creating, so ACT will have to pivot to pulling the teeth of especially the Human Rights Commission.
  
  Frankly, that’s not too much to ask for a 25% membership of a coalition. Either that or ACT gives confidence and supply and votes issue by issue.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:15am
- surfing
  
  Sorry but I agree with you. Seymour has certainly become more assertive that things will be done his way.
  
  I can’t agree with Seymour on cancelling Winston. MMP doesn’t work that way, and if the coalition can negotiate a power sharing agreement that reflects party vote then that would be acceptable.
  
  Labour sold their soul in return for government. I’m not suggesting that Seymour should do anything like that, if Winston is unreasonable then cut him out.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:15am
  - David Garrett
    
    surfing: Key “cancelled” the Great Charlatan in 2008, and it worked just fine – NZF weren’t in the 2008-11 parliament, let alone part of government
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:43pm
    - surfing
      
      Good point… Key didn’t need him to pass legislation though? Or, was there some agreement in place where he would support National?
      
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      September 14, 2023 12:55pm
      - David Garrett
        
        He wasn’t in parliament so there could be no agreement that he would support National. He wasn’t in parliament because Key had ruled out working with him – just as Luxon should, which would ensure the old fraud won’t get back again to cause chaos.
        
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        September 14, 2023 1:48pm
- KH
  
  Nats and ACT will work it out. No problem. Each have to accept the votes the other got.
  Democracy is the winner.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:25am
- Rumblestrip
  
  This is, and always has been, and always will be, the nature of a multi-party coalition government. Negotiate hard and get the policy wins you can, while acknowledging that you may not agree with your coalition partners on every issue. “Compromise” is simply the price of stability.
  
  I’m not sure what the alternative is… for a (junior) coalition partner to just demand everything they want, and bring down the government when they don’t get their way? No, you negotiate, and the more seats your party has, the stronger your mandate.
  
  David Seymour is no fool, and anyone who has followed Act closely over the last 20 years knows he has, in fact, sailed the Act ship subtly closer to the centre. (So much so, he recently incurred the public wrath of party founder Roger Douglas).
  
  That’s politics.
  
  The most important thing for right-leaning voters to do is give their party vote to the party that best aligns with their values, to give them the strongest possible position in the next government.
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:00pm
- kiwimike
  
  I think Co-Governance and the enabling of Tribal Apartheid will be ecnter stage.
  
  After the economy, infrastructure, education and health.
  
  Ot needs to be dealt to and is core to ACT.
  That every NZ citizen is equal and no race based laws to make sure.
  
  It’s all well fixing the economy, nut to live under Tribal Apartheid as we are doing now !
  
  We’ll see.
  I’m party vote ACT, because of that.
  Maybe National for the legislative vote if they look like beating Labour in Rongotai.
  The Greens Genter may split labours vote ?
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:29pm
- Master Mariner
  
  Thanks for the link.
  
  Nothing but word soup and subjective outcomes.
  
  Is this the best they can come up with?
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:52pm
- Lee C
  
  They shoild get on famously when it comes to fulfilling Big Pharma’s wishlist – why it’s almost like they are being bankrolled to do the bidding of theose who hold thepurse-strings: https://hatchardreport.media/pdf-files/we-are-all-set-for-more-of-the-same-and-it-won-t-be-pretty.pdf
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:49pm
Warren

Just because the media can’t see past Grant Robertson’s lies and deciet it doesn’t mean that he is trust worthy and the best Finance Minister for the job.
People forget what he did with the help of the two bob Pom the Council of Trade Unions Chief Economist Craig Rennie who was Grant Robertsons head advisor.
They dreamed up a story that the budget had been hacked and that National were the culprits behind it.
They also forget the promises made by Grant Robertson our Finance Minister made when borrowing billions for Covid-19 where he stressed the funds would only be used for those affected by Covid-19, whether it was helping businesses with problems associated with Covid-19 like wage subsidy, health, job losses and more.
But it didn’t take long for the Finance Minister to use it to pay for Labour Promises like the $3.6 billion to the Housing Excellaration Fund so they could purchace Housing that was on the market that the general public were also wishing to buy, they also funded free School lunches for all students , camera’s on our fishing boats and more to meet promises they made when elected.
So here we go again after (Prefu) was unveiled on Tuesday and the figures showing their is nothing left for other parties policies for this Election and a small surplus of $2 billion on $153 billion of core crown expenses in 2027.
On top of this you have Grant Robertson our Finance Minister wanting the Country to re- elect his Government too the Treasury Benches and give him the chance to balance the books by 2027.
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September 14, 2023 8:00am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Meridian to make EV drivers pay.

After three years of no charging fees, the move to payment for charging was “necessary to make the network commercially viable and support future investment in more and faster chargers”.

Wait for the squeals from the freeloaders.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/132932495/we-dont-see-petrol-stations-giving-away-free-gas-meridian-to-charge-50-cents-per-kwh-at-its-public-ev-charging-stations
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September 14, 2023 8:01am
- RoboRob
  
  I am stunned to discover it was free all that time. I knew it was at the start but assumed they were charging already. I’m not sure how commercially smart that move is, it doesn’t appear people are ‘locked into Meridians’ service in any way. If it was done for the environment I am not sure that Meridians shareholders should be happy with that !
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:36am
  - Matt Long
    
    Shareholders wouldn’t be unhappy, everyone knows you have to give addicts some free drugs to get your hooks into them.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:50am
    - RoboRob
      
      That was my comment on the ‘lock in’. Its standard business practice. Disney did it with Disney+. Launch really cheap, build a subscriber base and slowly increase pricing until you are profitable.
      
      Im just not sure that there is any lock in for Meridian. Its not like the Meridian users cant just use any old charger.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:02am
      - Matt Long
        
        Meridian is also a generation company, more EVs mean they get to put the price up for everyone and leverage shortages.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:56am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Reality bites. So it begins. Like our local transfer station installing a weighbridge 15 years ago. I asked was this so they could start charging for it? The answer was “no, we’re just putting it in for statistical purposes so we can calculate how much stuff comes in.” 😂😂😂😂😂
  
  2 years after it was installed the charging started, it’s gone up in price 3 times since. Now they’re wondering why our normally pristine and rubbish free roads are seeing it turn up. Law of unintended but totally predictable consequences strikes again!
  Charging more to dump your rubbish doesn’t make more people bring their rubbish to the dump.
  Poor people and those without a conscience don’t care.
  
  BTW I’m not opposed to charges, I’m opposed to being lied to. Doesn’t do much to foster trust in your local authorities.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:40am
  - wsk12345
    
    Water meters same. Read something recently about installing them for reasons other than charging – the reasons were poor so I can’t remember – but there is only one reason for them.
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:35am
    - thirteenstars
      
      Water meters make sense especially in low supply conditions since unmetered water has always suffered from the tragedy of the commons.
      
      The problem arises when run as a council utility because the rates component for water can be offloaded to a separate account and the rates demand remains the same or appears to have a correction which is then uncorrected in the subsequent years.
      
      That is, the councils can double dip. It’s all lost in the general increase in rates over time.
      
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      September 14, 2023 12:26pm
    - artemisia
      
      I have a voluntary water meter. Makes excellent $$ sense for small households with high rates.
      
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      September 14, 2023 2:01pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Labour have received no donations of note since early 2021.

It’s a pretty poor return on all that taxpayer largesse shovelled their way during the pandemic.

Just saying.
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September 14, 2023 8:03am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Their backroom boys and girls must be pretty useless.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:08am
- PeeJay
  
  Au contraire, while Labour may not have received any significant donations of note, Labour have made significant donations, via the taxpayers & increased borrowing, to the media which has proven to be a fantastic return on their investment!
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:20am
  - Matt Long
    
    And unions have given significant funds and resources.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:46am
- KiwiSapper
  
  Matthew 7:6New King James Version. 6
  “Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces”
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:28am
Simon

National announces its bat shit insane anti-NZ net zero policy pledge and suddenly its MSM polling goes from low 30s up to high 30s. Ok…. Time will tell. Luxon still looks like garbage every time he is interviewed. No corner turned there.
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September 14, 2023 8:03am
- lifesgood
  
  Great trolling Simon. You’re crying in the dark, though.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:51am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Simple Simon met a pieman …….
  You know the rest.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:54am
  - Dodger
    
    hahaha, Very good Capn.
    
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    September 14, 2023 1:36pm
Notsofast

Jill Ovens’ party is live, wait now for main media to acknowledge and promote its existence:

The Women’s Rights Party is proud to announce our List of 12 courageous candidates from all walks of life and across the nation who are prepared to stand up for women’s and girls’ sex-based rights and for the right to speak, to hear, and to assemble.

Our candidates honour the women of Aotearoa NZ who won the right to vote in 1893, the first self-governing nation in the World to legislate women’s suffrage. We combine this history with the imperative to create a society in which women are autonomous, and all women, men and children can live in harmony with each other to protect the future for our children and their children.

The Women’s Rights Party will be on the ballot in every polling booth in the country to give women, and men, the opportunity to register their vote in the interests of women’s and girls’ safety, fairness and well being.
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September 14, 2023 8:07am
- Flossie
  
  Lost me at “aotearoa NZ”!
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:14am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Jordan Williams of The Taxpayer’s Union emails:
Chris Hipkins and David Parker have announced that they intend to hike fuel taxes by 12 cents/litre (14 cents including GST) if they are in Government after the election.
Labour really don’t want to continue being in Govt do they?
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September 14, 2023 8:08am
- Benedict Yu
  
  To meet the 2030 climate change commitments, the price of New Zealand Units is going to need to at least double. National is rock solid in its support of those commitments. Unit prices of around $160 would see petrol increasing by 25 to 30 cents per litre.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/132817501/nz-wont-meet-2030-emissions-promise-without-further-action-imf-warns#:~:text=An%20increase%20in%20the%20%E2%80%9Creal,be%20closed%E2%80%9D%2C%20it%20estimated.
  
  Of course this gets no coverage because few people understand the topic. I am sure that Chris Luxon wants to keep it that way.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:17am
  - Matt Long
    
    But wait Benedict, surely you know Luxon’s commitment to Zero Carbon can be met at no cost to the economy because of ummmm, magic?
    I would love it if the current and hopeful MPs could be polled on whether they understand what a balance of payments deficit is.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:25am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Indeed. We are talking $3.30 for 91 octane petrol in 2023 dollars.
      
      And can National really finance its motorway plans without increasing petrol excise and RUC? I have not seen any recent modelling, but the petrol fuelled cars are going to become much more fuel efficient over the next 5 years. That means declining petrol sales which means declining petrol excise.
      
      Patrol excise is not a sustainable model to fund roads.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:33am
      - wsk12345
        
        I havent done the numbers but with adding RUC to EVs, cutting cycleway and public transport spend and ripping the woke shit out of NZTA, that should go some way…. Plus massive reduction in consultant costs for designing all the vanity works. Addressing the H&s legislation that results in cones and insane Traffic management is another area to consider to reduce costs.
        
        Beyond that, PPPs and tolls.
        
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        September 14, 2023 8:51am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        BY – that is something that the climate ideologues never mention. ICE vehicles have been reducing emissions year on year going back 4 decades. They are very energy efficient.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:44am
      - Ra Henare
        
        Sorry BY. I am well and truly over the use of the word modelling instead of the word forecasts.
        
        Modelling gets used by idiots as an excuse to believe their results are true.
        
        I however to support your patrol tax.
        
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        September 14, 2023 2:10pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Emissions, carbon credits, climate boiling is all a crock of shit – and the World is falling for it. It is nothing but playing with other people’s money.
    I really don’t know why people will just pay more tax without baulking.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:26am
    - cmm
      
      I think the world is starting to un-fall for it.
      
      The very green Germany built wind farms on top of coal fields to make a very clear statement that coal was dead and buried.
      
      Now they’re demolishing at least one wind farm to get to the coal underneath.
      
      The worm has turned.
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:39am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        The Green New Deal. AOC.
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmHFUzvY9XE
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:25am
      - cmm
        
        Do they understand that CO2 is plant food and makes the world a greener place?
        
        The deserts of the world are greening because of increased CO2. That they should do so is basic biology – stuff I was taught in primary school.
        
        Of course Aotearoan schools don’t teach that stuff any more.
        
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        September 14, 2023 12:05pm
    - kowtow
      
      ” ‘Arf a mo’ mate” , the Leader of the Free World and Democrat Most Wonderful has proclaimed that increasing temperatures by 1.5 degrees is the most existential threat to humanity over the next 20 to 10 years , even more so than a nuclear war .
      
      He said this in Hanoi .Very publicly.
      
      I’m still waiting for that army of media ‘fact checkers’ who hung on Orange Man Bad’s every utterance to make an announcement , but in the absence of which I must accept it as being true .
      
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      September 14, 2023 8:46am
      - Don Beckett
        
        Funny – I saw a report the other day that the temperature in the Roman Warm Period – 80 BC – 280 AD – was 2 degrees warmer than now.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:29am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Well, wife and I are spending all of the next two NZ winters sunning ourselves in southern Europe, and are looking forward to a bit of warmth!
      
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      September 14, 2023 12:43pm
  - cmm
    
    “To meet the 2030 climate change commitments”
    Screw the commitments.
    Nobody else is going to meet them and it will end up being kicked down the road anyway.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:35am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Sooner the better.
      The freaks need to get a haircut and get a real job.
      
      17 1
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      September 14, 2023 8:43am
    - Flossie
      
      Still wondering what caused the end of the Mini Ice Age 10 thousand or so years back. Humans giving up their ICE cars (pun intended) or not using their gas heating was it? The climate has always and will continue to change.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:19am
      - Don Beckett
        
        That w as the last glacial period Flossie. The mini Ice Age was – I think – from 1400AD approx till 1800 AD approx.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:31am
      - Flossie
        
        Thank you Don. I will remember that.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:46am
    - Master Mariner
      
      No one can meet the targets.
      Hence vague assumptions and mealy mouth announcements.
      The game now is the illusion of trying too meet them before it all crumbles.
      Unfortunately NZ is left behind believing it too be true.
      
      4 0
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      September 14, 2023 3:02pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Sensible countries need to form anti UN/WEF alliances to avoid being bullied by coward countries.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:54pm
  - Happy1
    
    B.Y. you ask how differences between the parties will be resolved. Basically there will be a combined caucus. While Luxon might be keen on the emission trading scheme he might find the the rural component of National with the support of Act mp’s constitute a majority. Not quite “gone by lunchtime “ but the mass planting of pine trees on good hill country will finish! One way or another.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:39am
    - peterwn
      
      There can never be a combined caucus. By definition a caucus consists of the MP’s of that party and a party needs its own space to work through issues. If a caucus is not happy with the direction the leader is taking it can procure or force the resignation of the leader. A coalition minority partner would have shadow ‘portfolios’ reflecting the portfolios of the majority partner to discuss and resolve policy differences. The trick of a successful potential coalition is for the minority to be very sparing with ‘bottom lines’ and for the majority to be economical with ‘bottom lines’ (except where there is common ground). That is why Chris Luxon and National are silent or vague about many areas. This has the problem that Labour and Greens can then try and put policy into National’s mouth. This needs skillful political handling. For example Labour announced that it would remove GST from fruit and veg (perhaps it was National who put the idea into Labour’s mouth) and National successfully trashed the issue so it ie effectively off the table.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:00am
      - Happy1
        
        Peterwn it will operate like the Māori caucus operates in the Labour government. The Rural community have been shut out of influence for 20 years. No more fob offs. The rural Nats plus Act mps, possibly with NZF, will be a force to be reckoned with.
        
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        September 14, 2023 9:14am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      AFAIK, the ACT Party supports the emissions trading scheme.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:06am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        I believe they just want that one scheme. Apparently they believe “the science™️” as prescribed by the climate cult echo chamber.
        
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        September 14, 2023 10:59pm
  - Taieri
    
    To meet the 2030 climate change commitments
    ————–
    
    These “commitments” CAN NOT be met.
    Without destroying what is still left of the NZ economy.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:56am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      It would not destroy the economy. It would require New Zealand Unit price of about $150. That would mean about 30 cents on a litre of petrol. It would also require spending several billion dollars annually on international emissions units.
      
      Yes it would make New Zealand poorer. Anyway National is absolutely committed. AFAIK no nation has rescinded its Paris Accord commitments.
      
      I do agree that this will be a major test for a National ACT Government. Has Chris Luxon read the Treasury Report on these costs that I posted up the thread? Maybe. Does Nicola Willis fully understand the implications of the 2030 commitments? Doubtful. Does the rest of the National front bench understand? Not a chance.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:15am
      - Master Mariner
        
        Im assuming Luxon knows how Carbon Credits and pricing are bought and sold?
        He must of been the main architect of Air NZ and its murky world of how credits are applied and paid for.
        Nothing more than a sham.
        
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        September 14, 2023 3:07pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “Im assuming Luxon knows how Carbon Credits and pricing are bought and sold?”
        
        I doubt it. Fuel for international flights is exempt from the ETS. Domestic fuel just gets charged by the petrol companies.
        
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        September 14, 2023 4:57pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        As with the Australian conservative coalition, National’s kowtowing to the climate cult will never be enough for the doomers. The media and the activists will be constantly banging the drum that National are laggards and scum for not addressing the fictional “climate emergency” enough.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:02pm
    - Surely Knott
      
      If cow farts and dairy are causing the main driver of climate warming, then why is so much of our climate fund dedicated to helping developing nations expand and improve their dairy industy?
      
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      September 15, 2023 2:40pm
  - Clownworld
    
    NZ’s Uniparty will make sure inflation hurts and you will own nothing and be happy or else.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:02am
Maggie Pie

Rumors coming from the Viaduct earlier this week that ‘OneEwes Weatherman’ Dan Corbett was considering running for a seat with Te-Pati-Maori, have proved to be unfounded…..

https://twitter.com/TheZeitgeistNZ/status/1701859433935208714
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September 14, 2023 8:11am
- Blog-aholic
  
  He isn’t the right sort of maori?
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:13am
- lifesgood
  
  The poor bloke. What an absolute disgrace on the part of TVNZ. Imagine being told you had to go on and read the weather in Russian or Chinese. For God’s sake, enough already. Fair to say most NZers suffer Maori language week in silence. When does it end?
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:25am
- Jade Warrior
  
  While I think it’s kind of admirable to see Dan struggling to learn some Te Reo, I must admit it is very painful watching him stuttering and stumbling all over himself in his forecasts this week. Thanks Dan, but you don’t really need to do this to us or yourself.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:27am
  - Flossie
    
    Probably he does need to do this – part of his contractual obligations in order to remain employed.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:21am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Yep. And who cares about the bloody actual weather forecast ?
      I have a lot of respect for his forcasts and is the only time i watch TVNZ.
      Sure is looney times we live in.
      
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      September 14, 2023 3:11pm
- Gravelroad
  
  He made a complete hash of it.
  It was so painful that the remote controller here felt obliged to change the Tv channel.
  Felt sorry for Mr Corbett. But that is the way we are now – even people who are proficient at their specialist subjects have to have their knowledge and communication skills compromised by virtue signalling.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:28am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    The trouble with dancing to another’s tune, is that one day they may say you’re out of step….
    
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/opinion-te-reo-maori-as-a-vehicle-for-decolonising-the-nation/RHYG2556VREI3HUCOEYSWX3JHQ/
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:48am
    - graham
      
      Indeed. We have seen some worrying that ChatGPT is getting “too good” at te reo, and that this is threatening Māori sovereignty of the language.
      
      “We’ve lost a lot of control over our land, we’ve lost a lot of control over the education that our children get; our own data and our own stories are kind of our last control over ourselves. If we lose that, if we lose sovereignty over that, it doesn’t bode well for the uniqueness that is Māori,” Keegan said.
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/how-will-chatgpt-impact-te-reo-maori-data-sovereignty-experts-weigh-in/PECJPDSA65HEXFKJLYI6C555NY/
      
      I’m more than happy for Māori to claim and retain “sovereignty” of their language. They certainly don’t need to worry that this Pakeha will be threatening it – I have no intention of trying to use “their language”.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:14am
    - herb1
      
      Maggie when it comes to decolonising I’d prefer a Colorectal surgeon to someone spouting in an incantation in Te Reo.
      
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      September 14, 2023 9:53am
  - Scooter
    
    He probably had no idea what he was saying or its meaning, just parroting and unfortunately couldn’t remember it. Good, it was an embarrassment, not for him but this Maori indoctrination ideology we are being forced in to
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:15am
- graham
  
  Felt sorry for poor old Dan … every year when Maori Language Week is rolled out he tries to stumble his way through with difficulty.
  
  As a weather presenter I like him. He knows his stuff and brings some enthusiasm and personality into the weather. For 51 weeks of the year he presents the weather well. But for this one week, he has clearly been put under pressure to incorporate a decent dollop of Maori language into his forecast. He is obviously way outside his comfort zone, as is the audience who hasn’t got a clue what he is trying to say.
  
  Once again we see pointless virtue-signalling from what is supposed to be our premier News program. Does Te Karare not present the weather in Maori?
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:30am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Every year? I thought it was every week.
    Must pay more attention.//
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:46am
    - Clownworld
      
      When is national English week?
      
      9 1
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      September 14, 2023 10:03am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        I think it may have to be booked years ahead.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:13am
  - thirteenstars
    
    Yeah, he does seem a good bloke when I occasion to watch him. Reminds me a bit of Jim Hickey in his animated and cheeky presentation.
    
    Weather presenters are like spokesmodels: takes a lot of energy to keep the same thing interesting night after night.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:22am
- Scooter
  
  Weather forecast in English or Maori is a waste of time in NZ anyway, better to look out the window.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:20am
Paulus

Is it me in that I appear to see that the so called media are going easy on Labour now, and that they are putting all their effort into denigrating Luxon.
I assume that this is a precursor to National/Act winning the election in that from day one they will do everything they can to upset the country,. and continue to denounce Luxon and National.
Why is it that the same group of political (sic) obviously highly paid women are at the forefront continually.
No wonder they helped lead the social and political destruction of New Zealand feathering their own nests in the process.
Sad really in that they are so unbalanced in their lives.
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September 14, 2023 8:17am
- Notsofast
  
  The women thing is intriguing, they are the indoctrinated graduates, but oblivious to this demonic contradiction in their lives. They will be pro Islam, and anti Christian for example. (Neither are good). They are heavily involved in eliminating gender discussion, considering this is done and dusted, except there is a fast tipping point in USA driven by money. The law suits will stop it dead, though far too late.
  These women had the full coming out in the Spark/Vodafone permitted speech travesty.
  Is it a bleak variant of misogyny?
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:43am
G152

Overheard an interesting comment from a current TV program which put Polynesian exploration and settlement of the Pacific Ocean and Machu Picchu together.
I suggest a quick look at a map of the area to see just how far they are apart.
Also DNA
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September 14, 2023 8:19am
Benedict Yu

I must hand it to Kellie Jay Keen. She is quick to turn adversity into a merchandising opportunity. 😅

https://xpsclothing.com/product/posies-courage-tomato-soup-shirt/

Reminder, she is speaking in Auckland next Wednesday. Zero press coverage so far.
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September 14, 2023 8:25am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I have been waiting for that to appear.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:51am
- dubya
  
  Apparel available in mens, ladies, and unisex!
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:54am
- Jack5
  
  Benedicgt Yu’s …Zero publicity for Kellie Jay Keen…
  
  Zero publicity, too, for the doctors’ strike, or near-zero publicity.
  
  It’s radical for doctors to go on strike – a big event for the health world. Has this ever happened before in NZ.
  
  When nurses grizzle it’s all over the media. The nurses’ organisation is riddled with Far-Leftists, and nursing has a high proportion of women. Bit like the news media themselves.
  
  (“Themselves” because media is a plural noun, and not for gender reasons.)
  
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  September 14, 2023 1:40pm
  - Ghost
    
    Strikes made our news
    
    Timaru Herald
    
    Lab technicians strike didn’t make the main news just the local free paper, and nothing on the strike two weeks ago.
    
    Courier
    
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    September 14, 2023 1:49pm
nathie

Seems to be a coordinated* hit job underway today against National’s tax cuts with focus on the lifting on the foreign buyers ban.

(* Seems to have been brewing for a few days, then TVNZ’s Jessica (of Jessica and Tova fame) gleefully announced yesterday it was coming today and sure enough RNZ Morning Report are running it – so changed channels – but see, it is coordinated)!

Anyhoo … this reminds me of when Labour last tried a similar hit job on foreign buyers, it was only a few years ago and Labour pointed the blame at those with “Chinese sounding names”. (Which was a massive untruth).

So how shameful of the MSM (using handpicked economists) to be repeating Labour’s antics again of xenophobia in 2023 (but obviously more subtlety this time) … sure it’s disguised as “there won’t be enough foreign buyers to raise the revenue National claim so how can you trust them with the math” but if one thinks about it, that’s a red herring. After all it’s a forecast!

Amazing how much effort Labour and their lick-spittle MSM put into questioning data – what a shame the MSM were missing in action (and not calling upon a group of economists) to scrutinize the hundreds of billions of printed money that Labour has wasted for no real gain for NZ over the last few years, which will need to be paid back by future generations!
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September 14, 2023 8:29am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  There is something the left just can’t fathom. Tax breaks for the middle income earners means more disposable income, which 1) stimulates the economy, even in a small way and 2) when spent there is more GST.
  Why is that so hard to figure out? A 10 year old kid can do it!
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:56am
- Prince
  
  The media cannot stand the concept of giving wage and salary earners a break finally after years of high inflation, higher mortgage rates, but no movement in tax brackets.
  But no-one questions where the $B’s of extra costs for Labour’s schemes announced each day, or the tax lost from GST, will come from.
  The media in general is about as balanced as Stuff’s daily cartoons.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:06am
kowtow

Te media pahti relentlessly banging on about Nat tax cut pledge and questionning its workability .

Across the whole spectrum .

And yet practically no commentary over the Prefu book cooking or how Labour and previously NZF got us into the monumental hole we’re in now.

And should there ( please God) be a N/Act govt , the same media pahti who refuse to question Labour crazy spending will hold N/Act to account for every dollar and will blame everything the Nats do on the tax cuts .( if they go through with it)
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September 14, 2023 8:32am
- Matt Long
  
  Interesting, isn’t it, how the media is all over National’s tax plans looking for holes, then swallowing Labours Prefu projections as if they weren’t as realistic as solar meeting New Zealand’s energy needs.
  
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  September 14, 2023 8:56am
  - Ehlana
    
    Matt, the journalists have been assured that their energy needs are essential and will be met from future renewable energy supplies.
    
    Your needs, of course, will probably not be deemed essential.
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:56pm
- Vinicius
  
  National are being rather dumb by not confronting this head on. They cannot let this story drag on in the media day after day like they are.
  
  Luxon is far too nice with the media.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:25am
My

Take a break from the election and get this feel good story about a 12-year-old schoolboy with autism, and who happens to be Maori, who wins the Aims Games 9 hole golf comp.
And hats off to the teacher aide, who got him into it. And family that supports him as well.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/autistic-maori-boy-wins-aims-games-golf-title-after-only-playing-three-games-ever/PA7UZ5FJIFEYREPDBBHLYG3B7M/
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September 14, 2023 8:34am
- Swifty
  
  Loved that story.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:05am
Bridgenag

Three Years of COVID: A Tale of S&M
How two weeks to flatten to curve turned into long years of S&M
….. So no longer need to wear a mask during masturbation unless that’s’s your thing…

https://open.substack.com/pub/tessa/p/three-years-of-covid-a-tale-of-s?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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September 14, 2023 8:36am
RoboRob

Got so tired of the obvious bias of Stuffs cartoons that I wrote to them. Very interested in seeing how they respond. Email below 🙂

Hi Nadia

I enjoy a good (clever) political cartoon. I am however saddened by the obvious lack of diversity of the coverage of Stuffs cartoons. Leading up to the election most of Stuffs cartoons were anti opposition, which historically is unusual for political cartoons. Normally the government of the day cops the most flack as the cartoons poke fun of policy. Now that we are in election mode I am stunned by the absolute lack of any coverage of the political left. I haven’t seen a single left wing cartoon this week and don’t recall any from last week either. When there are cartoons coving the left they generally are ‘nice’.

Now I can understand the your cartoonists might have a political bias, that’s only natural, however as you have multiple cartoonists surely you could find one willing to cover the left of politics?

I will remind you, although I shouldn’t need to, of stuffs published editorial code of conduct (https://www.stuff.co.nz/about-stuff/300106664/stuff-editorial-code-of-practice-and-ethics)

‘We seek to represent New Zealand’s diverse communities and interests. Stuff’s journalism depicts the reality of life, presents a healthy range of perspectives, reflects the everyday concerns of people living in Aotearoa New Zealand, and holds the powerful to account‘

I would strongly suggest that your political cartoon department is not meeting your own code of ethics.

I look forward to your response and hopefully a more diverse range of political cartoons that does cover a ‘health range of perspectives’.

Thanks
Rob
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September 14, 2023 9:10am
- cmm
  
  If they really wanted to represent the diversity then at least 50% of the cartoons would be putting the boot in on the Greens and Labour.
  
  But I think what you will find is that they really mean the diversity of their writers and friends.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:17am
  - RoboRob
    
    Yup. I suspect diverse probably means LGBTLMNOP to them, rather then the ‘english’ meaning of the word.
    
    I am mostly interested in how they respond to the ‘holds the powerful to account’ part. That would normally mean that the party ‘in power’ would face the most criticism, Stuffs cartoons clearly have not even attempted that.
    
    I focused on the cartoons because they are easy to quantify and measure. I believe their other ‘journalism’ is also biased, its just much harder to prove.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:12am
- Jade Warrior
  
  That’s an excellent letter Rob and I wish you all the best in your hopes of obtaining a response. But based on my own experiences of e-mailing Stuff on similar matters, I think the only response to your letter is likely to be …
  
  *sound of crickets*
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:24am
- lifesgood
  
  Great letter, RobRob but expecting a reply? Good luck with that.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:32am
- Prince
  
  Nice try, but I tried that last year.
  The response was they see no problem, the think their cartoonists represent a wide range of opinions !
  I guess that explains the rest of Stuff’s journalism and Opinion Writers.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:10am
  - RoboRob
    
    Wow. To claim that the cartoons cover a wide range of opinions would be batshit crazy. I guess if you want to close your eyes and pretend 99 Anti Nat/Act cartoons and 1 pro Labour cartoon is a ‘wide range’.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:59am
  - Paulus
    
    Which is why it is suggested that Stuff is stuffed and going broke.
    We have had nothing to do with Stuff for a while now even their so called Sunday paper is rubbish and totally biased by feminist writers and now Maori.
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:48pm
Jack5

Immigration rorters get home detention after judge says sentence calculation consideration began at three years prison.

Our justice system is weak as a whisper in a rock concert (an Internet metaphor).

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/09/auckland-couple-who-frauded-immigration-nz-exploited-migrants-jailed-and-fined.html
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September 14, 2023 9:16am
Spam

Crown Core Debt Interest

I’m confused.

I thought they said it was:
– “Free” prescriptions
– First-year “Free” university tuition
– “Free” public transport for children.
– “Free” school lunches.

You mean we actually have to pay??? WTF????
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September 14, 2023 9:26am
Maggie Pie

“HEY! TEACHERS! Leave them kids alone!”

I see there’s a new government-funded App available now, called…

‘Te Puawaitangi: Beyond the Birds and Bees’

Children are freely able to download it with no age restriction.
Under the heading ‘The-How-To’s-Of-Sex’, it covers all the major topics school kids
need to know about, such as……

> Masturbation
>Orgasm
>Fingering
>Intersex
>Anal Sex
>Oral Sex
>PIV Sex
……and lots lots more.

https://beyondthebirdsandbees.co.nz/app/browse-topics/
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September 14, 2023 9:32am
- Scott
  
  Thankfully my children have grown up and left school.
  
  How many people really believe that kids need to be taught about anal sex? Especially when Johny can’t read.
  
  We have become a perverse degenerate nation I’m sorry to say.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:50am
  - Notsofast
    
    At a common sense level, which is more helpful than the professional, boredom with sex should start a few decades later. This material undermines nature. It should be the biggest election issue by far, it is not an imported controversy, as Chris Hipkins is bound to say, after leading an all party vote that men are the female sex by an act of self will.
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:46am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “This material undermines nature.”
      
      How so?
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:11am
      - Notsofast
        
        An argument is that sex is better learned by experience than taught by well meaning activists.
        These people are clearly getting terrible results if gay children are being sterilized by mistake.
        I claim no expertise.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:30am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “An argument is that sex is better learned by experience than taught by well meaning activists.”
        
        Yeah but that genie can’t go back into the bottle. Male teenagers are “learning” about sex from pornhub. It is better to do something to at least partly counteract that.
        
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        September 14, 2023 5:11pm
      - Notsofast
        
        Ok maybe a good point, like the old lady that swallowed the spider to eat the fly?
        
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        September 14, 2023 5:42pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  I think the outrage and the complaints have worked. Certainly on Google Play.
  It’s now restricted to 18+
  
  https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=nz.co.beyondthebirdsandbees.app&hl=en_US&gl=US
  
  Not sure about Apple though, don’t touch their shit!
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:52am
  - All_on_Red
    
    ‘Not sure about Apple though, don’t touch their shit!’
    https://babylonbee.com/news/apple-announces-iphone-15-will-come-emblazoned-with-name-of-uyghur-slave-who-assembled-it
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:00am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Not even satire!!
      
      6 0
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      September 14, 2023 10:10am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Wow, more info there than really needed for children to access.
  
  9 0
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  September 14, 2023 9:54am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Good Grief..
  
  I’m 70 years old and I’ve never heard of PIV sex…..
  
  19 0
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  September 14, 2023 9:59am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    See it all the time now – mainly from the radical fems
    
    ….. Penis In Vagina
    
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    September 14, 2023 10:11am
    - rouppe
      
      Does that include strap ons for the lesbians?
      
      5 0
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      September 14, 2023 10:27am
      - Maggie Pie
        
        “Brings new meaning to the word strapadictomy”
        
        https://bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=324135
        
        😀
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:20am
    - thirteenstars
      
      Yeah, like “cis-gender” it’s meant to relegate the normal case to just another option on the menu of deviancy.
      
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      September 14, 2023 10:27am
  - NothingLeft
    
    AKA normal sex as practised by every ancestor for last 500 million years.
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:56pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Yeah about 30 – 40% of heterosexuals practice anal sex.
      
      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4949144/
      
      That pesky data again.
      
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      September 14, 2023 5:18pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        The 30-40% number in that paper is from a fringe low-socioeconomic status sample, high numbers of homeless, low numbers of whites.
        
        The fine old tradition of ‘up-the-bum-no-babies’ was common in numerous cultures. In times past euphemistically called “Greek sex’
        
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        September 14, 2023 6:40pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        “The fine old tradition of ‘up-the-bum-no-babies’ was common in numerous cultures. In times past euphemistically called “Greek sex’”
        
        Yes I’ve heard this bandied about. On closer inspection this appears to be largely BS spread by the gay lobby.
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:17pm
- kevn
  
  Maggie… Nothing about teenage pregnancy or life on the DPB.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:48am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Teen pregnancy rates, and teen abortion rates have declines drastically over the last 15 years.
    
    https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/teenage-births-halved-over-last-decade/#:~:text=The%20number%20of%20teenage%20women,every%2034%20births%20that%20year.
    
    It is not teens on the DPB that are the biggest problem.
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:20pm
- Ghost
  
  I remember my home room teacher on our first day at high school taught us about the birds and the bees. Drew a bird and a bee on the blackboard, told us both had wings, they both flew. Damn fun teacher
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:57am
- Benedict Yu
  
  The guidance says for children 12 and older. I think 12 is too young. But it looks pretty basic stuff for teenagers. What is your problem with it?
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:13am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    As one of the girls at tennis said….it’s nothing more than a grooming-tool disguised as education. And with a 12yo daughter at St Cuths she’s revolted by it.
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:28am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Totally lost me. Which part is grooming? You think teens don’t practice oral sex? I just don’t get it.
      
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      September 14, 2023 5:15pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  How the hell are kids going to learn reading, writing, math, and science?
  Not going to work with that distraction.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:25am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Really? The sex talk should last 30 minutes. Maybe a refresher 30 minutes 6 months later. Finished.
    
    I highly doubt that sex education is the barrier to maths and science education in New Zealand.
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:24pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      30 minutes at the start of class.
      You just know the flakes want this….
      
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      September 14, 2023 6:06pm
surfing

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/neighbours-at-war-clyde-locals-feud-over-abusive-airbnb-holidaymakers/CXL7DJ2IDJBUHAPJETWUK5DBLI/

Airbnb’s and similar are an atrocity. Either boost and enforce noise control/ nuisance laws, or ban Airbnb’s. Certainly the cost of noise control should be covered by Airbnb providers.

Feel sorry for these poor people, they’re certainly not going through all this hassle for nothing and the Airbnb owners need to be held to account.
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September 14, 2023 9:50am
- kowtow
  
  Agree about the airbnb thing but there appears to be more to that row , as the complainers may have been running a commercial gym from their garage .
  
  As per my usual complaint ; our media are shit and you learn very little from them .
  They could do better , much better.
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:43pm
ClanMcleod

Have a read and understand the implications of what is happening currently. It’s been warned by a number of people that covid was the warm up act for the war on ‘climate change’. That measures were implemented during covid to test how people would respond to draconian measures like lockdowns, digital passes, coerced/compulsory vaccination etc. That when the ‘fear porn’ inevitably pivoted to ‘climate change’, some of these measures may be attempted on the population. Well, things are warming up. Pun intended.

1. “Seriously guys, climate change is a public health issue”

For a while now OffG has been highlighting how the language used around “climate change” is trying to change it from a an environmental issue into a public health issue.

We’ve explained the reasoning before – if climate change is a public health threat, then you can use the Covid precedent to institute “climate lockdowns”.

Yet another example appeared in the news this week, with the Guardian reporting:

Climate crisis poses greatest risk to people with respiratory illnesses, experts warn

If the title isn’t quite on-the-nose enough for you, well here’s the subhead:

Call for EU to match WHO’s air pollution regulatory limits as impact of climate emergency interlinks with human health

They’re going to keep pushing this, until “climate change=public health” is ingrained in the public subconscious.

So this is another ‘conspiracy theory’. I hope it turns out to be wrong. I will acknowledge this if it does turn out to be wrong. From a recent article in OffGuardian. A source of information and analysis I have found to be extremely reliable over the last 10 years or so.

https://off-guardian.org/2023/09/12/this-week-in-the-new-normal-71/
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September 14, 2023 9:55am
- ClanMcleod
  
  The hyperlinks in that should be followed for more detailed information. It isn’t for the faint hearted.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:56am
- Grunter
  
  Clan – the Climate scam was ‘locked & loaded’ well before COVID. Things are coming to a head and the time bomb will blow up at some stage over the next 5-10 years.
  
  IMO there are two big runaway freight trains in ‘western developed countries’ that can not be stopped and will cause significant change of some sort.
  
  1. Massive debt mountains that can never be paid back (USA, Japan, EU, UK) Add in the China (our global factory) House of Cards local govt funding debts to that freight train… It now totals more than US$300 Trillion. Mathmatically impossible to ever pay that back.
  
  2. Climate Scam = massive inflation on energy as the whole thing hits reality. We don’t have enough minerals to make the ‘green transition’. The BRICS will control more and more fossil fuel supply and prices. Energy supply = geopolitical power.
  
  The madness of course isn’t driven by elected Govts. These nutcase ideologies are driven by unelected evil zealots at the UN/IPCC/WHO, the WEF, IMF, etc… The govts in western countries are simply enforcing the madness and using the printed money-go-round for personal gain (eg Ardern and her $20m+ where the phark did that come from??).
  
  Of course, this is all conspiracy theory (until it isn’t).
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:19am
BeaB

Radio NZ this morning wetting its knickers over a few hundred million dollars in Nationals election guff. Pity they totally missed the billions and billions and billions of wasted, misspent and borrowed dollars Grant Robertson has crippled the country with.
I just hope there is a ruthless squeeze on money for the media, the state media especially. Some of that money would be far better in our pockets so we can get our news from social media and ignore the Labour propaganda we are fed by TVNZ and Radio NZ.
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September 14, 2023 9:59am
- mogg
  
  Yes they also seem to have missed that the ‘opening of the books’ was signed off two weeks ago, on Government policy which does not include Labour’s promises of further spending on current election promises. Treasury did warn of dire consequences if their spending limits were broken which Labour are already doing.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:17am
- NothingLeft
  
  Far-left RNZ are very keen on certain motes amounting to 0.5% of tax take from National, but conspicuously uncritical of fiscal beams orders of magnitude larger from their mates in Labour.
  
  Methinks National could most helpfully address any shortfall by defunding all the left and far left media organisations that are sucking up taxpayer dollars.
  
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  September 14, 2023 1:00pm
  - GJM
    
    Fund tax cuts by defunding RNZ, TVNZ and all media subsidies and advertising. Win – win all here way, except for Stuff losing their $1 investment.
    
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    September 15, 2023 10:37am
  - Nickc2
    
    IMO, Nicola Willis should have made the following retort to Robertson.
    “Oh, and by the way Grant, if there is any shortfall in funding for tax cuts, there will be a sizeable amount of spare cash in the kitty as we will not be subsidising RNZ, TVNZ, and any other entity nominated by Willie Jackson and your Maori Caucus. Please also note, that within 100 days of taking office, so-called Maori Charities will be paying taxes. There you are Grant, as you can see, there will be plenty of spare cash sloshing around for our tax cuts despite what your hired and briefed help says.”
    
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    September 15, 2023 3:00pm
ClanMcleod

It’s not all bad…
Unvaccinated tennis-great Novak Djokovic won the US open on Sunday night, his 24th grand slam title, extending his own record. If not for being forced to skip several tournaments due to his refusal to be injected with the Covid “vaccine” he’d probably be at 25 or 26 by now.
The reason I mention any of this comparative non-news is just context for a pleasingly ironic video clip…

😳😳😳 pic.twitter.com/c2M10bvMSf
— Young Americans for Liberty (@YALiberty) September 11, 2023

Yes, this years US Open was sponsored by Moderna, and their oh-so-clever “shot of the day” was an unvaccinated man winning the title. Sometimes life is beautiful.
*

https://off-guardian.org/2023/09/12/this-week-in-the-new-normal-71/
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September 14, 2023 10:00am
- wsk12345
  
  Genius
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:58am
All_on_Red

Ukraine has used British Cruise Missiles to attack Sevastopol.
A Submarine and a Landing ship destroyed.
https://hotair.com/john-s-2/2023/09/13/ukraine-strikes-russias-black-sea-fleet-n577769
The Russians had already moved some of their Warships back to Russian bases on the Black Sea because of the Drone attacks.
Strategically this will make it a bit easier for ships to leave Odessa.
I don’t think the Ukes will take back Crimea this year (or possibly at all) but it is certainly more isolated from Russian assistance.
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September 14, 2023 10:06am
- Grunter
  
  Yeah that will teach those dirty Ruskies! Let’s make them really mad and drops some missiles on Moscow as well…..
  
  We need to do something to create a big war. And what on earth could possibly go wrong?? It’s not as if the evil Ruskies have any nukes, hyper-sonic missiles, a fleet of subs that can fire them……
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:33am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Lol
    Onward to Victory Tovarishch
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:35pm
    - Jack5
      
      But for our side of the world, Russia looks likely now to do as swap with North Korea: missile technology for artillery shells.
      
      Kim Jong Un’s rocket toys might suddenly become a more serious threat.
      
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      September 14, 2023 1:21pm
    - Grunter
      
      Red – I still don’t understand what your argument for war against Russia is? You keep referring to Tovarishch as it I’m a Putin lover? I hate the guy and Russian totalitarianism is one of the more evil societies….. BUT……
      
      Poking this evil grumpy bear will never achieve anything that is good. Russia physically can not be defeated by conventional warfare, to think otherwise is fantasyland stuff. So what is the point in firing off a few more NATO (UK) missiles into his Black Sea fleet??
      
      And the obvious final point, why risk that? Zero gain, massive risk, it’s just looney, scary stuff.
      
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      September 14, 2023 3:02pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Grunter – sadly there are many who grew up watching John Wayne movies and reading comics where ‘we’ always win and hardly anybody gets hurt.
        Unbelievable.
        
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        September 15, 2023 7:44am
  - NothingLeft
    
    The incremental escalation approach of western support for Ukraine has been demonstrably successful in destroying Russian military without sparking WW3, though the cost in lives to Ukraine has been fearful. The russian frog is nearly fully cooked in the Ukrainian pot, and this conflict has probably brought forward the dissolution and subsumption/realignment of the Russian empire towards Europe by decades.
    
    I recommend looking at video travel-logs through Russian empire. People’s existence there is miserable. Near to being an open air prison by our standards. The place is rapidly falling apart, and won’t survive if the people who live there have option of immigration (which they likely soon will have with west’s need for people to replace it’s aging population)
    
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    September 14, 2023 1:09pm
    - Grunter
      
      Seriously?
      
      Have you been watching Disneyland war movies again….? You know, the ones where the Good = Woke USA, and BAD = Russia/China etc…!
      
      The ‘West’ is clearly well and truly pharked up right now in so many ways. That does not mean Russia = Good, far from it. But to think that Russians are going to let the woke west takeover their country without a fight, or willingly become part of the “Men can have babies” culture is a bizarre arguement.
      
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      September 14, 2023 3:11pm
      - Master Mariner
        
        Sounds like he has listened to the CNN World news in First Nations language week and interpretation//
        
        My mind really does Boggle at times.
        
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        September 14, 2023 4:52pm
Maggie Pie

“If….

https://twitter.com/winstonpeters/status/1702068036994482245
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September 14, 2023 10:08am
- kevn
  
  Maggie… winnie must have a rapper writer/supporter.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:11am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    I think it’s Shane.
    
    6 0
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    September 14, 2023 10:16am
    - Matt Long
      
      Nice riff on Kipling, I note it’s no longer acceptable to say,
      “And what is more, you’ll be a man my son. “
      
      8 0
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      September 14, 2023 10:42am
- Guy Preston
  
  …Don’t deal in lies…
  the sheer cheek of it!
  
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  September 14, 2023 1:49pm
kevn

Herald anti Nats spin today… They seem determined to back… liars and losers.
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September 14, 2023 10:09am
- Prince
  
  Liars, losers, and their financial lifeline.
  Where else would they get PIJF Rel2, and a swarm of Govt advertising paid at full rates ?
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:14am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.
Not voting National, and an explanation of why Maori are NOT indigenous.

https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/great-letter-to-luxon-by-die-hard-national-supporter-i-will-not-be-voting-for-you-this-year-and-here-is-why/
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September 14, 2023 10:10am
- thirteenstars
  
  Good to see they’ve fixed their site speed issue. It used to crawl now it’s super-fast.
  
  Which is more than I can say for, ahem, Kiwiblog.
  
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  September 14, 2023 10:35am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Must have a new, bigger server. With the donations coming in, an upgrade became affordable.
    Got a handful of books to give out? This is a real thing.
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:32am
- Dave
  
  Debates about whether Maoris are indigenous or not (and by traditional definitions they are not) don’t negate the fact that they were the first people here (some dispute this, but the evidence is very thin) who were colonised by later arrivals and tend to distract from the more important issues, IMO, of equal rights and duties for all NZ citizens today, regardless of their (ancestors’) dates of arrival.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:00pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Liberalism is a mental illness.
No finger guns now. What the hell next?

https://redbloodedconservative.com/2023/09/13/warning-finger-guns-can-lead-to-suspension/
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September 14, 2023 10:13am
Suze Wainwright

Has National’s tax policy been critiqued for systemic racism yet?
22 0
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September 14, 2023 10:13am
- Lance
  
  Well since they used maths instead of feels, then absolutely racist and evil
  //
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:05am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Cash continues to Iran under Obama’s third term?

https://www.redvoicemedia.com/video/2023/09/cash-to-iran-continues-under-barack-obamas-3rd-term/
Money to be released to Iran for humanitarian aid?
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September 14, 2023 10:24am
Diogenes

A quote often attributed to Edmund Burke goes: “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Apparently Burke never actually said that (and no-one knows exactly who did). However, one that he is verified as saying runs: “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.”

And that looks perilously like the situation we find ourselves in today. The great majority of bloggers on KB agree that the situation facing this country is leaving us on the brink of a nasty precipice. But what, in reality, do we do about it? We are way short of anything effective.

We need good men and women to stand up and find a way of “associating”. I am in my late 70s; I worked as a journalist for much of my wage-earning years; in the 1990s I was hired by a fledgling political party as a media adviser (they didn’t take my advice!). I wish I could turn my back on this nasty mess and go tend my garden — which I am majorly enlarging to try and become more self-sufficient, given how the economy is tanking. For all my supposed experience of life, I am at a loss as to what to do, and I suspect many other bewildered citizens are in the same boat. I would not be surprised if the turnout for the coming election will be one of the lowest on record.

Where are the potential leaders who can articulate a vision for this country, and spur good people to indeed stand up? I have looked at the various party policies currently being promoted, and I don’t see any coherent vision for development, either socially or economically: development that is founded on tested age-old principles that have provided a solid foundation for a coherent society. It’s all so piecemeal — bits tacked on here and there, like sticking plasters on a close-to-fatal wound.

I suspect that too little time is left for action before this election. But I hope the shambles that I fear will follow — no matter which grouping of parties gains control of Parliament — will start to spur us into drawing together to turn back from becoming what Burke warned us against.
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September 14, 2023 10:45am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Diogenes – I’m in a similar situation. I’m off grid for everything, got a good setup, you would barely notice we’re on solar hot water and power except for the lack of microwaves and hair dryers! Plenty of water tanks and a big roof for collection.
  
  I’ve spent the last 3 years putting in more raised bed gardens and upgrading a chicken coop. Essential to be as independent as possible, particularly when it comes to food, water, power etc.
  
  I can’t see any decent leadership among those with the highest profile in NZ. I think democracy is in serious trouble. We’re networking as much as possible with others in a similar position and basically preparing for a bad situation while hoping it doesn’t happen.
  If it does turn to shit, most people will wake up and come together to fix it. History shows we always do, but sometimes it takes a crisis for this to happen.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:04am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Those with the brains to fix NZ will have long since seen the writing on the wall and departed for less degraded countries.
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:26pm
    - Grunter
      
      Where would you go NothingLeft? Europe? Ukraine?
      
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      September 14, 2023 3:13pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Argentina
        
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        September 14, 2023 8:11pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      I’m ‘casually’ looking around the globe, nothing in Europe attracts. America is a basket case. SE Asia has some possibilities but need further investigation.
      
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      September 15, 2023 7:46am
- Grunter
  
  I think ‘thing’s’ have become so polarised and weird that it is now impossible to fix without major conflicts. History shows us how ‘thing’s’ cycle, and right now there are big global and NZ conflicts occurring that will come to a head in some way. How that actually happens is anyone guess.
  
  The reality is no one can stop the change/conflict. It has always happened in the past and will continue into the future. That’s the way the world cycles.
  
  Just one example – NZ race relations. This election will no doubt sway us back towards a bit of sense, but the Maori Separatists won’t go away. Conflict of some sort will result because of it.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:51am
thirteenstars

Say what you like about Winston Peters–and many of us do–but the man knows how to sell a proposition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csf4qNAN6f4

Hang around for the final stanza. Takes a bit to get me, but that was good. Pays to take a break from cynicism occasionally.
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September 14, 2023 10:52am
mandk

“I will raise the bar if necessary” (Grocery Commissioner to Woolworths and Foodstuffs)

Sounds like poor old, impotent King Lear:
“I will have such revenges on you both,
That all the world shall—I will do such things—
What they are, yet I know not, but they shall be
The terrors of the earth!”
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September 14, 2023 10:53am
- I remember when
  
  “I will raise the bar if necessary.”
  
  So that those higher prices can slip under it?
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:19am
Maggie Pie

Just happened to hear on the Sports News that All Black Aaron Smith will be leaving after the WC to play in Japan 🙁

That’s quite sad really….
he was the only one in the team whose name I could actually pronounce.
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September 14, 2023 11:08am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Is that the English fella?
  
  5 1
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  September 14, 2023 11:15am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    I think he might be Maori?? Best known for getting sprung having sex with a disabled women in a toilet cubicle at Chch airport.
    
    LOL!!
    
    4 1
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    September 14, 2023 11:35am
    - Phil
      
      No no Maggie, shame on you you naughty pie, it was sex with an abled woman in the disabled toilet. I believe that the aforementioned toilet was suffering an identity crisis, being genderless.
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:45am
      - Ghost
        
        Hmm, sounds like a new version of Cluedo?
        
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        September 14, 2023 11:53am
    - Flossie
      
      LOL Maggie! But wasn’t it the other way round – i.e. a woman in a ‘disabled’ toilet?
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:54am
- JimBobJoe
  
  No a Rugger fan I se Maggie… Smith has been on a farewell tour all year!!!!…
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:05pm
- greybeard
  
  Yep, that team looks more like a Pacific Islands team every match.
  Even the captain is called Sami Kane.
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:23pm
I remember when

The New York Times is askinjg people to “Sign Up for the Climate Forward event” to be held on the 21st Spetember.
Guests will include:-
Ajay Banga, President of the World Bank Group.
Al Gore, former US Vice President.
Bill Gates, co-chairman of the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation.
Michael Bloomberg, founder of Bloomberg L>P> and Bloomberg Philanthropes.

So a full range of eminent scientists.
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September 14, 2023 11:16am
- cmm
  
  … all with private jets…
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:37pm
  - Taieri
    
    … all with private jets…
    ——–
    
    Nah, they will all arrive on pushbikes…
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:52pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Al Gore who manages to make billion$ from the Carbon credit $cam$ at the same time as he makes billions from C- emitting firms.
  
  https://nypost.com/2023/02/20/al-gores-eco-friendly-investment-firm-owns-shares-in-polluting-companies-report/
  
  https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/al-gores-climate-change-hypocrisy-is-as-big-as-his-energy-sucking-mansion/
  
  https://www.reuters.com/business/cop/al-gore-launches-climate-change-asset-manager-2021-10-27/
  
  https://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybell/2013/11/03/blood-and-gore-making-a-killing-on-anti-carbon-investment-hype/?sh=1197584d32dc
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:26pm
ClanMcleod

The recent and concerning collapse of the once revered scientific process in large parts of the climate change and medical community is detailed in a highly critical ‘open review’ paper from the Global Warming Policy Foundation (GWPF). Someday, charge the authors, there will need to be an inquiry into how so many scientific bodies abandoned core principles of scientific integrity, took strong positions on unsettled science, took people’s word for things uncritically, and silenced those who tried to continue the scientific endeavour.

Truer words haven’t been spoken in a while.

https://dailysceptic.org/2023/09/12/shocking-failures-of-climate-and-covid-science-highlighted-by-critical-new-report/
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September 14, 2023 11:18am
- cmm
  
  Well they kinda have to.
  
  Sure we’d all love to put scientists on pedestals and believe they put science, objectivity and the such first.
  
  But no, like anyone else they have mortgages, kids to feed and egos.
  
  Funding goes to those that mention climate change in their funding applications.
  Try doubt climate change and get a job at NIWA.
  
  So what happens is that if you want to eat, if you want employment, if you want your papers published, then you fall in lockstep.
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:36pm
- miltonF
  
  On a related note, a whistleblower is currently claiming that the CIA paid large sums of money to its “experts” to reverse course on the lab leak theory. I for one, would not be surprised. I’m not sure where this will lead. It would be nice to have some solid evidence on which to base some leads.
  
  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9J9cmeYeUuA
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:49pm
Surely Knott

Is the cancer website misleading.

They state “New Zealand has one of the highest bowel cancer age-standardised incidence rates in the world, it is currently the second most diagnosed cancer and the second leading cause of cancer-related deaths in the country[i]. Bowel cancer survival is poorer for Māori and Pacific and people living in areas of high deprivation. New Zealand has high rates of delayed diagnosis of bowel cancer, leading to poorer cancer outcomes[ii].”

And free bowel screening for Maori 50 years.

But actually the Cancer web tool shows that European have the highest rates of Colorectal cancer deaths. Euro/other (14.79) , Maori (13.02), Pacific (12.12), Asian (6.26)

If you read the cancer page statement again what is true is that higher deprivation quintiles have more bowel cancer. But it is not true that therefore Maori have more bowel cancer. The stats on Maori vs non-maori are measured. And non Maori have higher rates yet Maori are prioritised for screening.

https://tewhatuora.shinyapps.io/cancer-web-tool/
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September 14, 2023 11:18am
Jack5

An initial price of $NZ86.2 a share has been set for the launch on America’s Nasdaq stock exchange of ARM, the biggest technology company in Britain, and a hope of the nation. This puts the total value of ARM at $NZ92.5 billion.

The Japanese owner, the SoftBank conglomerate, is selling 10 per cent. It bought the company for $NZ54 billion in 2016. The stake being sold is thus likely to yield it about $NZ 10.5 billion.

British and American regulators earlier blocked SoftBank from selling ARM to the technology firm Nvidia.

ARM was founded in 1990 as a chip designer by: Acorn Computer, the British trail blazer in educational desktop computers; VLSI Technology, an electronics designer taken over by Philips Electronics in 1999; and Apple.

Nearly every smart phone has a chip that includes design by ARM, as do Apple computers, millions of cars, and huge data centres. Last year more than 30 billion ARM chips were manufactured.

The Wall Street Journal reports ARM expects its market to be worth nearly $NZ425 billion by 2025.

Last month, SoftBank bought the 25 per cent of ARM it didn’t already directly own from one of its own subsidiaries for a price that put the full value of ARM at $NZ108 billion.
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September 14, 2023 11:18am
- plc
  
  Meanwhile on the NZX, how are those My food bag shares going?
  
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  September 14, 2023 1:18pm
  - kowtow
    
    My fooled blags.
    
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    September 14, 2023 1:29pm
    - Jack5
      
      We can dream …
      
      What cost of New Zealand shutting down, borrowing and printing money during Covid, instead of soldiering on like Sweden?
      
      Disregarding inflation, the dollar cost was the equivalent of a controlling stake in the technology giant ARM.
      
      If such a holding were possible for NZ, it would put a supercharger on our farm and tourism based economy.
      
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      September 14, 2023 1:50pm
  - Jack5
    
    PLC’s query on My Food Bag shares….
    
    I recall Maggy Pie virtually giving a warning on My Food Bag shares when they listed at $1.75 in March 2021. Price today on the NZX just over 16c.
    
    No excuse for any Kiwiblog follower getting caught!
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:34pm
- cmm
  
  ARM is ubiquitous.
  Your mouse and keyboard have them in.
  Even your “Intel inside” PC probably has at least 10:
  * One in the Bluetooth chip.
  * One in the Wifi chip.
  * One setting up the display (and another one or two in the monitor if you have one).
  * One handling the power system etc.
  * One in the battery pack.
  * Two in each disk drive.
  * …
  
  But these things are cheap. We embedded engineers grumble if we pay more than $1 for an ARM chip. The cheapest ARMs are approx US25c. ARM will making less than 1 cent per chip on those.
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:31pm
  - Jack5
    
    Latest figures I could find for ARM’s revenue were for 2021.
    
    Total revenue was up 35 per cent on 2021 to $US2.7 billion ($NZ4.56b), and came from royalty on sales of chips using its designs, and from licensing those designs.
    
    Royalty revenue was up 20 per cent to $US1.54 billion ($NZ2.6b). ARM said sales were helped by continuing strong growth of 5G smartphones, plus more “ADAS and IVI chips” going into cars, and price increases in 32-bit microcontrollers.
    
    Licensing revenue was up 61 per cent to $US1.13 billion ($NZ1.9b)
    
    The company shipped a record 29.2 billion chips in 2021 and “partners” shipped more than 225 billion ARM-based chips.
    
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    September 14, 2023 6:02pm
Cinematic

Is the critique of National’s tax policy going to shift the polls in favour of the worst economic managers in this country’s history? Me thinks not.

Nonetheless critiquing of party policies is a good thing. It helps voters understand what is being offered and who should be avoided when voting. I look forward to the msm focussing on the lunatic policies currently put forward by the Maori Party and the Greens. Any day now surely?
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September 14, 2023 11:19am
- mandk
  
  The attack from Labour smack of desperation.
  
  They will do no good.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:35am
- Mrs_Right
  
  Who paid those economists?
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:30pm
  - Paulus
    
    We did as they are now going to University so called Economists.
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:55pm
  - Taieri
    
    One of those economists, Michael Reddell is definitely not a Labour supporter.
    
    And the analysis is actually quite valid.
    
    https://croakingcassandra.com/2023/09/14/how-much-revenue-might-nationals-foreign-buyer-tax-raise/#comments
    
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    September 14, 2023 4:05pm
surfing

On the Nursing college application form, applicants are asked to obtain a reference.

My partner is doing this reference for a friend and one of the questions is to rate the applicants knowledge of the treaty of Waitangi in New Zealand society.

They may as well force Maori students to be rated on their knowledge of the Magna carta and property rights!
This is an objectionable question. The treaty is irrelevant to nursing.
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September 14, 2023 11:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Magna Carta. Sounds fair to me.
  What’s that? Magna Carta is racist?
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:37am
- Ghost
  
  Good question, because I doubt many Māori would be able to answer it either.
  
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  September 14, 2023 11:42am
  - Matt Long
    
    It’s not knowledge of the treaty they’re asking for but adherence to the narrative about the treaty.
    
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    September 14, 2023 12:10pm
    - Paulus
      
      1215 the original Treaty which is still understood by all.
      
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      September 14, 2023 3:57pm
- wsk12345
  
  I’m sure her friends knowledge is excellent – relative to the importance of said Treaty.
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:03pm
- rouppe
  
  Apparently Maori patients get better health outcomes if someone says “Te nga koe” to them
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:25pm
  - Paulus
    
    Eh !
    
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    September 14, 2023 3:57pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    Its “tena koe”
    ‘nga’ denotes plural.
    
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    September 14, 2023 4:56pm
- kowtow
  
  This is ridiculous .
  
  How about a question on Queen Victoria’s Royal Charter and Letters Patent .
  
  Way more relevant to the creation of the modern state of NZ than the treaty of waitangi , which was simply a formal acknowledgement of her sovereignty and a preliminary sale and purchase agreement .
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:32pm
- cmm
  
  They might as well write:
  
  “Bugger off to Australia where you will be treated better. PS you will be paid more too.” on the form.
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:23pm
I remember when

No-one said it would be easy.

The NY Times states, that starting in 2025 California will prohibit recycling symbols on products not widely recycled in the state.
Manufacturers say that the focus should be on what could be recycled, not what currently isn’t.
Even when plastic can be reprocessed, it is more expensive than making it new.
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September 14, 2023 11:28am
Ghost

Ok, who misplaced their ET stuffed toy

Supposed aliens landed in Mexico’s Congress but there were no saucer-shaped UFOs hovering over the historic building or bright green invaders like those seen in Hollywood films.

The spectre of little green men visited Mexico City as politicians heard testimony on Tuesday from individuals suggesting the possibility that extraterrestrials might exist. The researchers hailed from Mexico, the United States, Japan and Brazil.

Article
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September 14, 2023 11:40am
Stu2

Don’t mention the war

I haven’t noticed any discussion on the impact of inflation of the minimum wage. Not trivial in the supermarket and retail sectors.
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September 14, 2023 12:05pm
BeaB

Red Radio leading all day with Nationals foreign buyer tax.
Remember when they used to do this to Grant Robertson when he was billions and billions of dollars out?
No, I don’t either.
So much bias, and we are paying.
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September 14, 2023 12:33pm
- mogg
  
  Yes but this so called controversy is a dead end for Lab/MSM. Polling shows that people just want tax cuts, they don’t give a monkey’s as to whether it’s fiscally neutral or not.
  As you say billions blown on ideology/nepotism/stupidity and Media have not said a dicky bird about it.
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:19pm
cmm

Anyone noticed how the MSM always serve up distractions?

ALIENS!!!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/non-human-mummies-mexican-politicians-hear-testimony-on-possible-existence-of-extraterrestrials/L6QYCHURJVCSXBU562CUTRFXEQ/
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September 14, 2023 12:37pm
- Ghost
  
  No distractions, it’s one story out of hundreds today and has been an ongoing story that crops up every few weeks with a different angle
  
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  September 14, 2023 12:45pm
- I remember when
  
  It’s part of the misinformation/disinformation action.
  Aliens might be possible to justify but covid conspracy theorists are not.
  
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  September 14, 2023 1:08pm
- NothingLeft
  
  If it was real someone serious would have seen it and it would have been instantly the biggest story on the planet. It’s not – just a modern example of an assembled fake cryptid corpse such as circuses and carnivals used to make, cashing in on current UAP craze
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:37pm
Fisiani2

Stuff are broadcasting the candidates for Wellington Central at 5.30. It is rumoured to be a three way neck and neck but Scott Sheeran will show why he is clearly the best candidate for the job
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September 14, 2023 12:43pm
I remember when

The Climate Change crowd seem to be making a real push to remove the ability to offset carbon emissions.

In an opinion piece in The NY Times David Wallace-Wells opined –
“Wildfires pump greenhouse gases into the atmosphere and carbon offsets are no longer looking effective.
Every year since 2001, Canada’s forests have emitted more carbon than they’ve absorbed.”

There is always a reason to justify an action.
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September 14, 2023 12:59pm
- cmm
  
  ” Every year since 2001, Canada’s forests have emitted more carbon than they’ve absorbed.”
  
  That’s probably just the wildfires.
  
  Remember too that every branch and leaf that fall to the ground rots. All that creates a lot of methane which then breaks down into CO2. Sure, some stays and gets absorbed into the soil, but most goes back into the atmosphere.
  
  Then that CO2 is further absorbed by plants, etc etc…
  
  The only real way to create a carbon sink with forests is to chop them down and take that wood out of the cycle. eg. use it as building material or by doing something like burying it or sinking it to the bottom of a deep ocean so that it doesn’t release CO2 back into the atmosphere.
  
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  September 14, 2023 2:21pm
  - miltonF
    
    There are other natural methods of CO2 sequestration that are never mentioned by the media.
    
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limestone#:~:text=and%20silicate%20sediments.-,Formation,CO%202)%20in%20the%20water.
    
    I wonder if people understand that the ocean itself absorbs CO2 from the atmosphere. Through biological and non biological processes, it is converted into calcium carbonate and deposited along the sea floor AKA limestone.
    
    There is so much science left out of the “climate change” debate. It’s unreal…Dunning Kruger central.
    
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    September 14, 2023 4:07pm
    - miltonF
      
      Some interesting facts about carbonates:
      
      Up to 25% of all rocks on earth consist of carbonates – limestone, sandstone, dolomite etc. Most of Earth’s carbon—about 65,500 billion metric tons—is stored in rocks.
      
      The formation of carbonates in the ocean is accelerated by higher temperatures and atmospheric CO2 levels. In other words, if the theory of CO2 driven anthropogenic warming is true – this will result in increased sequestration of CO2 as carbonates in the ocean.
      
      It’s almost like the earth is an equilibrium and we really shouldn’t worry about minor increases in CO2. Who whudda thunk?
      
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      September 14, 2023 6:07pm
Tasman devil

Regular readers of Kiwiblog comments sections will know of my regular comparisons of the present Labour government with the Muppets.

Well, as a scientist I know of the absolute importance of being research based in coming to such a conclusion.

I felt vindicated a few minutes ago when I found the link on the internet: There is a Muppet called “Lew Zealand.”

This explains the nearly 6 years of stupidity we have endured from these fools.
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September 14, 2023 1:41pm
Tom Hunter

This sounds familiar:

For Murray and our former vice-president, favoring the dissolution of the Department of Education (which Reagan promised to shutter), is an “unconservative” outrage. But why exactly is the call to abolish a department created by the Carter administration, as a favor to teachers’ unions, and which now vigorously pushes LGBT instruction in public schools a reckless, “revolutionary” act. And why is it equally revolutionary (perhaps I should say “insurrectionary’) to call for the abolition of the FBI, which has been so weaponized by the Left that it may be beyond “delicate” tinkering with. The FBI is not a constitutionally established branch of our government, like the judiciary, which the Left has also weaponized. The FBI is a federal agency that was placed under the Department of Justice. Why is the proposal from some on the right to abolish this dangerously politicized surveillance agency tantamount to calling for scorched-earth war against the Left?
…
This may be the key difference between what is now referred to as the populist Right and the conservative establishment. Those who grouse too loudly about our current political condition may distress our “moderates” even more than the only mildly objectionable Left.
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September 14, 2023 1:48pm
Fisiani2

I have shown a NATIONAL. SHEERAN hoarding to 17,100 sets of eyes in nine days.
Sheeran will win Wellington Central
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September 14, 2023 1:57pm
Dodger

hahaha, Very good Capn.
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September 14, 2023 2:04pm
Fisiani2

Voting is clear.
Party vote is all important -it determines the government
MORE OF THE SAME or CHANGE
Electorate vote makes no difference to the numbers but is simply who is the best person for the job as MP
I want CHANGE so will vote National
and I will vote Scott Sheeran as he is the best.
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September 14, 2023 2:16pm
- Prince
  
  I disagree slightly.
  Question is Change (National), or Even Worse (Labour/Greens/TPM) ?
  I will vote National, and National in the electorate (Willis vs O’Conner ? No contest).
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:06pm
surfing

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/crime/mongrel-mob-member-jailed-for-his-part-in-a-wellington-gang-retribution-attack/KCXBQIBQV5BBFDARAL7OJCNRTY/
Defence lawyer Chris Nicholls said Harper-Brown’s background was filled with cultural, social, health and educational disadvantages and the gang was the only future he could see.

Since cultural reports are so great, lets do pre-emptive cultural reports on all kids under 5yrs old.

Those who are inevitably destined for gangs and crime, then need to be taken from their families! Why wait until they are before a judge!
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September 14, 2023 2:59pm
- PaulP
  
  A little like Bill English’s plan on social investment to address the baddest families.
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:09pm
Maggie Pie

RANDOM IMPERTINENT QUESTION

Just spent the last hour rummaging around in the garage trying to find my grans old recipe books. No idea what I’ve done with them unfortunately.

But what I did come across, was a really old bottle of ‘Bars-Bugs’ Windscreen Cleaner. Honestly, it must have been down there for about 20 years!
Can’t even think of the last time I would have had to use stuff like that.
In fact I can’t think of the last time I’ve had a Bug hit the windscreen.

Is it still a thing?
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September 14, 2023 3:21pm
- Nickc2
  
  There was another product called Bars-Leaks (used as a temporary fix for leaking radiators).
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:45pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    egg whites in a pinch
    
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    September 14, 2023 4:31pm
  - kevn
    
    Nick… It was mainly an radiator water rust inhibitor.
    
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    September 14, 2023 7:24pm
    - Nickc2
      
      Agree. It wasn’t too effective as a leak stopper either.
      Glycol was a far better inhibitor.
      
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      September 15, 2023 3:05pm
- cmm
  
  We use that stuff all the time. Smacked a bumble be so hard today I thought it was going to crack the windscreen. But we have more bugs in Canterbury.
  
  If you can’t find nanna’s recipe books you will be happy to know you can now go to Whitcoullsand get replacement Edmonds Cookbooks written in Tereo Maori!
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:47pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Do you know that i haven’t even seen a Bumble here in the 09 for years!
    Wonder what’s going on?
    
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    September 14, 2023 4:43pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Tasmania has Bumble Bees (European and regarded as invasive apparently). Haven’t seen one on the Aus mainland though (yet). Did you know NZ has leeches?
      
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      September 14, 2023 11:33pm
Ghost

How about a judge allow the buildings owner to go paint over anything they own

Police have arrested three Restore Passenger Rail protesters after they spray-painted the front of a car dealership and glued themselves to the footpath.
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September 14, 2023 3:23pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/132938321/husband-and-wife-deny-scamming-oranga-tamariki-of-more-than-2m
Well goodness gracious me !
Who would have thought !
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September 14, 2023 3:26pm
- ISeeRed
  
  India sending their best and brightest, I see.
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:01pm
Ghost

A group of researchers are calling into question Pfizer’s and BioNTech’s early trial data on its original COVID-19 vaccine after a forensic analysis revealed significant inconsistencies between data in the companies’ six-month interim report and publications authored by Pfizer/BioNTech trial site administrators.

The preprint, published on Sept. 4, showed trial subjects vaccinated with Pfizer’s COVID-19 vaccine experienced a 3.7 times increase in cardiovascular deaths compared to placebo controls—a “significant adverse event signal” not disclosed by Pfizer when the vaccine was authorized for emergency use. In addition, the analysis found numerous instances where Pfizer/BioNTech attributed potential vaccine-associated deaths to other causes and undermined vaccine safety data.

Article
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September 14, 2023 3:41pm
cmm

No sweetie, they are not protestors.
Nor are they freedom fighters for Gaia or other guff.

They are vandals – eco-terrorists.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300971116/wellington-luxury-car-yard-spraypainted-by-protesters
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September 14, 2023 3:44pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Just stick some cones around the ones who have glued themselves to the pavement, leave them there and otherwise ignore them.
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:52pm
- miltonF
  
  You know what is funny?
  
  My mum bought her Nissan Leaf EV from this exact car yard. Gazley Nissan.
  
  The irony…
  
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  September 14, 2023 5:53pm
Prince

All those encouraging Luxon to discount Peters need to read the side panel of Polling on this Blog.
National/Act = 60 seats.
Labour/Greens/TPM = 53 Seats
NZ First = 7 seats.

If you want change, vote National.
If you can’t, vote Act.
But don’t throw NZ First out of the Lifeboat if you want a change of Government more that anything else.
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September 14, 2023 3:47pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Whew..

It looks like Health Minister Dr Ayesha Verrall has a suspicion that it is women who have pregnancies and babies…..

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2309/S00077/auckland-women-to-benefit-from-a-new-birthing-unit-at-waitakere-hospital.htm

However, I’m pleased to see that she leaves open the possibility that other “people” might get pregnant and have vaginal births.

This will also free up space in the Waitākere Maternity Unit for pregnant people
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September 14, 2023 3:52pm
- Mrs_Right
  
  Is this going to be built like those 100.000 houses they have promised?
  
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  September 14, 2023 3:56pm
- Taieri
  
  “Birthing units”…weren’t they called maternity hospitals once upon a time?
  Another contentious term is “midwife”. There’s never a midhusband, which is OK. But, shouldn’t this position be called a “midperson” these enlightened days?
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:03pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Of course Ayshea would be well aware of emerging technologies like Uterus transplants, which WILL make it possible for men to become preggers and give birth to children of their own.
  These days gender isn’t, nor should it be, a limiting factor……think Tamati for a start. If the rumors are correct, he’s aleady planning a thurd.
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:12pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    This trans woman wants a uterus transplant. To be impregnated. Just so she can be the first trans woman to have an abortion. 🙁
    
    Just when you think you have seen it all.
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjMFaT6oRwk&ab_channel=SkyNewsAustralia
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:28pm
    - Taieri
      
      This trans woman wants a uterus transplant. To be impregnated.
      ————-
      
      This trans “woman” would need an ovaries transplant as well. Not mentioning a brain…very conspicuous by its absence so it seems…
      
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      September 14, 2023 5:41pm
      - David Garrett
        
        …and a vagina…unless she plans to deliver the hapless kid out of her ass…
        
        1 1
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        September 14, 2023 8:45pm
  - Taieri
    
    Of course Ayshea would be well aware of emerging technologies
    ————–
    
    Whatever happened to Dolly the Sheep, anyone remembers?
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:37pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Apparently the uterus transplants are non functional (as in no bubs can happen) and are to help trans women (aka biological males who want to be the opposite sex) feel better. Correct me if I’m wrong.
    
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    September 14, 2023 11:41pm
- Ehlana
  
  Since it appears you no longer have to be a woman to give birth, does that mean those of us who are not pregnant can also go on pregnancy leave from work?
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:23pm
Paulus

Verrall is married to another lady and they have a baby from somewhere.
6 1
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September 14, 2023 4:00pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  ALICE through the looking glass.
  
  ‘When the world appears to be turned upside down….’
  
  – Lewis Carroll
  
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  September 14, 2023 5:18pm
- lifesgood
  
  Are there any labour MPs who aren’t gay? No aspersions on gays but how does it relate to the percentage in the population.
  
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  September 14, 2023 6:22pm
  - fightingtemeraire
    
    The % of them in Lab and Greens is far higher than the general population. Greens present line up is 40% Gay.
    
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    September 14, 2023 8:17pm
- Opie
  
  Ah, that explains why she is so angry.
  
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  September 14, 2023 6:35pm
- kevn
  
  Paulus… tamati coffey did his ‘thing’ for kiri allan and her wife. Told NZ proudly. Maybe he has a sideline going?
  
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  September 14, 2023 7:20pm
PaulP

Criminal put before victim again! Sounds like the only reason for the permanent suppression is to avoid the rough justice he deserves in prison.

No way he should get permanent name suppression if the victim and family want him named.

The damning part to me is this:
“The Crown took a neutral standpoint on suppression.”

If the victim wants the scumbag named the Crown should support that, not remain neutral.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/132940818/teen-jailed-for-abducting-and-strangling-girl-in-sex-attack-at-christchurch-park-keeps-name-secret
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September 14, 2023 4:13pm
- Ghost
  
  When I read the article I thought what a smart girl to hit 111. The justice system failed this survivor by not listening to her and her family and giving the creep name suppression, but as I said below, a positive that he actually got jail.
  
  I have no doubt that we will hear from him in years to come.
  
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  September 14, 2023 5:04pm
Maggy Wassilieff

How reassuring to learn that those who need to know about this violent sex offender know…

She submitted it was not in the public interest for him to be named, saying “the people who need to know who he is, know”.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/132940818/teen-jailed-for-abducting-and-strangling-girl-in-sex-attack-at-christchurch-park-keeps-name-secret

Such a pity that those who needed to know that this young man was out and about on a summer’s evening with ill-intent didn’t know.
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September 14, 2023 4:19pm
- Ghost
  
  I guess on a positive he was jailed and not given home detention.
  
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  September 14, 2023 4:24pm
Chris Nisbet

I’m a little perturbed. Somehow this election has become about whether or not a party who hasn’t been elected yet can find the money for some tax cuts that won’t really much difference to most people’s lives, instead of the carnage that the Labour government has inflicted on us over the last 6 years and the changes to our democracy that will come if they get voted in again.
We seem bothered about whether Act and National can work together, when the alternative would be a coalition of incompetents, racists, communists and Winston.
Apparently it’s good news that we’ll be in surplus a year or two later than previously predicted, and that’s if some kind of miracle happens.
Seriously, wtf?
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September 14, 2023 4:28pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  “Apparently it’s good news that we’ll be in surplus a year or two later than previously predicted, and that’s if some kind of miracle happens.”
  
  At the end of the day, whether New Zealand has a couple of billion deficit or surplus doesn’t matter a damn. Neither does it matter if the National tax policy is out by a few hundred million.
  
  That is because the Zero Carbon Act and the current account deficit and the productivity collapse and the education collapse, collectively, will left unchecked bull doze New Zealand in the next 10 years. Flatten. Good luck getting RNZ to run that story.
  
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  September 14, 2023 5:34pm
  - Taieri
    
    Ever the optimist, Benedict…
    
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    September 14, 2023 5:35pm
- Philview
  
  I had to leave the room tonight when TVNZ News went on and on about this story.
  
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  September 14, 2023 6:51pm
Taieri

Mine is bigger than yours or the Stories From the Sandpit…

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/barry-williams-refuses-resign
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September 14, 2023 5:34pm
Benedict Yu

Holy crap what a piece of work this journalist is. No wonder that radio station went broke.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300971104/tova-podcast-rock-solid-on-foreign-buyer-tax–so-will-nicola-willis-resign-if-it-doesnt-work

“Tova podcast: ‘Rock solid’ on foreign buyer tax – so will Nicola Willis resign if it doesn’t work?”

Perfect example of my comment above in action 🙁
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September 14, 2023 5:36pm
- gorse
  
  I can’t believe she is dumb enough to say that. Grant Robertson has a $13b hole exposed after the preefu, I didn’t hear her asking him to resign. Out to get National at every turn. This tax policy is Labour’s only hope – they think.
  
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  September 14, 2023 6:02pm
- Prince
  
  Will O’Brien resign if National are elected ?
  I’d pay to see that.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:53pm
miltonF

It’s kind of amazing how good of an investment gold has been. She’s only getting started too, I believe.

2017 $1600NZD per ounce.
2023 $3200NZD per ounce.

However here’s a couple of things I find quite suspicious.

Firstly, why is there no media coverage of this? The only asset that has outperformed gold is Bitcoin. How come gold can appreciate 100% in six years and essentially no one knows this fact? Instead, we get bombarded with media stories about how house prices have picked up 0.1% and you better get in now before you miss out! Lol

Secondly, I find it hard to believe that gold is being kept under the USD $2000 threshold. I highly suspect there is manipulation going on. Breaking the $2000 ceiling would be big psychologically and I think they are doing everything possible to prevent this. I do not believe for one second that the physical gold reserves match the liabilities of these IOUs in the paper markets.
5 1
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September 14, 2023 5:44pm
kevn

Toxic tova… toxic for labour by default.
13 1
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September 14, 2023 5:56pm
Swifty

Phil Rudd – the human metronome:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N_AcmtmegKI
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September 14, 2023 7:27pm
Ghost

Really, the thief could if he wanted lay an assault complaint…..

Crime continues to pay

As a man started to abuse staff and tried to leave a downtown Auckland supermarket without paying, news publisher Todd Scott says he acted on instinct – tackling the thief to the ground.

But after holding him down for 10 minutes as staff called police, the owner of the National Business Review said he was surprised by their response, telling him to let the person go or risk being arrested himself.

“I don’t know what I was thinking, but I fair tackled him,” he told the Herald. “There were some questions about whether or not I played rugby. I’ve dreamt about it a lot.”

Article
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September 14, 2023 7:41pm
- Rumblestrip
  
  Failure to enforce the law encourages lawlessness.
  
  Shame on the police (or more specifically, the current police leadership) for allowing this kind of thing to become an everyday occurrence.
  
  If a dairy owner catches a shoplifter and knows the police are likely to do nothing, there must be an awfully strong temptation to mete out some harsh private justice.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:31pm
Hugh Jarse

So the media definitely have their talking lines. No problems with the PREFU despite it showing some very heroic growth numbers that won’t come to pass. No we are off like Pavlov’s dogs chasing Luxon and his supposed funding hole. Not even the slightest appearance of balance.

No worries media we are now turning you off, so you will be talking within your own circle jerk. Have fun but you are wasting your time. We have switched off and just want Labour gone. As a short blonde repeater once said “It doesn’t matter what we say or do, , they still support National”
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September 14, 2023 8:24pm
Ghost

How about grant you show us the money

Show us where the $1.9 billion for mental health went
Show us how much you paid to store and then throw out RAT tests
Show us how much you spent on vaccines that were thrown out

Shit grant, show us where all the money has gone and why you have left generations in debt

7:30pm – Robertson has hit out at Willis over questions about his party’s spending. “At least I’ve got a plan. Where are your costing? Show us the costings, Nicola!” Roberton yelled.

Article

On second thought Grant, how about we just show you the door and you can piss off out of it never to be heard of again
16 1
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September 14, 2023 8:42pm
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Yep show him the door along with the rest of them on 15 October and no nice Board roles given to them by National.
  
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  September 14, 2023 9:37pm
  - igm
    
    While at it, recall that Mallard leech from his taxpayer-funded junket . . . add Goff in there also.
    
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    September 15, 2023 2:32am
Jack5

Problem for seven retired NZ ambulances painted with Maori names that have arrived in Ukraine.

Ukrainians won’t be able to read the words, let alone understand them.

Ukrainians use the Cyrillic alphabet, and Maori language with its macrons doesn’t translate into Cyrillic.

The good-hearted organisers might as well have put the Maori words into Braille.

Even Ukrainians who speak English will likely be puzzled.

The ambulances have been sent by Kiwi Aid & Refugee Evacuation (Kare), an NZ charitable trust.

Its trustees are Brent Impey, a former chairman of NZ Rugby and chief executive of Media Works; Graham Henry, former All Blacks coach; businessman Paul Dykzeul (former chief executive of Bauer Australasia); Sharon Hunter, who made her mark first in the computer business; Tenby Powell, former Mayor of Tauranga, businessman, and husband of Sharon Hunter.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/132929045/kiwi-ambulances-with-te-reo-mori-names-arrive-in-ukraine
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September 14, 2023 9:56pm
Ghost

Guilty until proven innocent….. this is a dangerous path to go down, especially when we have had over the years a few false rape complaints made

We have a problem in this country with sexual abuse, and a problem with how the justice system doesn’t give them suitable punishments, but this shouldn’t be the answer

Newshub can reveal Labour will campaign on a promise to overhaul sexual consent laws so it would be up to alleged offenders to prove their victim said “yes”.

Article
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September 14, 2023 11:32pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  “Labour will campaign on a promise to overhaul sexual consent laws so it would be up to alleged offenders to prove their victim said “yes””
  
  Labour wants women to sign a consent form before having sex?
  
  3 1
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  September 15, 2023 12:01am
kevn

Like a pre nup…
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September 15, 2023 7:10am

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