About
Contact
Advertise

Facebook
Twitter

October 17, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 17 October 2023

Like this:

Like Loading...

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment484

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (484)

Login to comment or vote

peterwn

Mai Chen, Constitutional Lawyer said it may take time to undo Labour’s programmes (sorry when I went to look for a link I could not find one). She would have had the Fitzgerald v Muldoon case in mind. In that case the Chief Justice confirmed that Executive Government (ie Ministers or Cabinet) cannot suspend laws that Parliament had passed. He said that Rob Muldoon was wrong to tell employers that they need not continue deducting from wages contributions to Norm Kirk’s short lived superannuation scheme because the obligation was enshrined in the superannuation legislation. At first look this indicates that Labour’s programmes need to be shut down by specific legislation effectively repealing each bill which could take months of Parliamentary time. However the Government can often halt programmes without the need for legislation. For example the previous Labour Government decided to stop issuing Oil and Gas exploration permits and could do this because issuing these permits was discretionary. Chris Hipkins wanted to kill off Charter Schools and there were sufficient discretions in the legislation that the Ministry of Education could make life impossible for Charter Schools. David Garrett recently described how aspects of the Justice system were changed (eg lighter sentencing) by informal pressure from Ministers.
Therefore incoming National Ministers have a range of informal means to halt or delay programmes they promised to halt without infringing Fitzgerald v Muldoon. Admittedly they cannot re-start programmes halted by legislation such as ‘three strikes’ without introducing formal legislation.
There is one thing the incoming Government can do if halting some programmes would infringe Fitzgerald v Muldoon. The Government could at the start of its Parliamentary session introduce a bill (possibly under urgency) to temporarily suspend a list of programmes for one year pending permenant repeal legislation. Now that would have the Opposition, some constitutional lawyers and possibly DPF up in arms. However this is arguably justified as needed to implement National’s campaign promises since National is obligated to implement these promises as soon as practicable. Care would be needed to avoid political backlash and protest in cases such as changing employment law.
46 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:01am
- Handyman
  
  There is a simple (partial) solution: for every bill that was passed under urgency it can be repealed under urgency with a one sentence bill. That won’t stop the left (aka hypocrites) and media going crazy, but it will be fun to watch.
  Repeal is also simpler than replacing with alternatives. There is no need to delay in order to come up with a new improved policy. A simple clean repeal will take us back 12 months to the state as it was then.
  Labour had a habit of giving orders at the pulpit of truth and to departmental CEOs without any legal backing so there are probably heaps of regulations that can be undone. For example, doctors were instructed to give priority to Maori and Pacifica.
  
  40 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:01am
  - Skippytony
    
    Oh yes, please ***grabs the popcorn and beer***
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:46pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “Repeal is also simpler than replacing with alternatives.”
    
    In most policy areas that is impossible. For example you can’t repeal Labour’s new resource management system without replacing it with something.
    
    https://environment.govt.nz/acts-and-regulations/acts/natural-and-built-environment-act-2023/
    
    There needs to be law governing resource management. You can’t just have a vacuum.
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:33pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Just an addendum. While it may be frustrating, the new Government is going to need to fix things properly. That means replacing bad policy and laws with good policy and laws. Yes, to do the lot, it will take three years. That means prioritising.
      
      Of course there may be some interim solutions. For example the new resource management system is so awful that an interim solution should be to simply repeal the Act and reinstate the RMA.
      
      https://environment.govt.nz/acts-and-regulations/acts/natural-and-built-environment-act-2023/
      
      That could be done under urgency in one day.
      
      Then devote the next year to developing a resource management system fit for a developed, democratic nation.
      
      10 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:39pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        devote the next year to developing a resource management system fit for a developed, democratic nation.
        
        An aspirational thought that we would all endorse. The last two gummints had form in not getting there in multiple years – let alone one 🙁
        
        So we end up reverting the old one “for the time being”. I suppose that’s the best of a list of bad options …..
        
        0 0
        Report
        October 24, 2023 1:26pm
    - peterwn
      
      Currently the new legislation sits alongside the RMA pending a phase in. The new Government can by a simple bit of legislation pause the phase in meaning the new legislation is ineffective and the current RMA remains operative for practical purposes. The new legislation would be repealed when the Parliamentary timetable allows.
      A big objection to the new legislation was that there would be courtroom battles to determine what it actually means. These battles have already occurred with RMA and the people who have to deal with the RMA have some certainty as to interpretation and meaning. Hence the way forward is amending, improving and updating the RMA without destroying the body of precedent behind it.
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 2:06pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Trump’s idea was – for every new law created we get rid of two others.
    Or something.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 3:38pm
    - MCōs
      
      Regulation not law
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 5:38pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Correct. It was a word that was escaping me. I knew Law was not quite right but could not come up with ‘regulation.’ Thanks.
        
        0 0
        Report
        October 18, 2023 8:43am
- surfing
  
  Seems obvious. Promises are not law… the Labour govt was very lazy. Many of our laws are archaic but Labour (and previous governments) have not been modernising law to reflect changing times, nor fixing poorly written laws.
  
  Much of Labour’s nonsense will take a while to wind back.
  
  I once had an employee whom we would have been better off paying them not to work because of the damage they did to our systems. And we’d have to waste time assessing and repairing the damage.
  
  I view Labour like this problem employee! We’d all be better off if they’d done nothing!
  
  24 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:36am
- plc
  
  The best Xmas present New Zealand could receive would be for Steve Joyce to be appointed Public Services Commissioner.
  
  Real savings and realignment would then be achieved.
  
  38 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:41am
  - David Garrett
    
    plc: I’m sure the extremely wealthy Mr Joyce has much better things to do with his time.
    
    12 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:20am
    - NothingLeft
      
      I dunno, he still does consulting work. He appears to have a strong motivating ethic to do public good, and civil service is clearly in dire need.
      
      29 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:30am
      - MCōs
        
        The last thing we want is more consultants
        
        1 3
        Report
        October 17, 2023 5:40pm
    - John Loveridge
      
      It’s a pleasant thought all the same.
      
      13 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:48am
    - Colville
      
      He got wealthy from sale of Radioworks in about 2000 I think….so he was wealthy prior to being a Ploi…why not have another crack?
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:41pm
  - Ghost
    
    He’s looking after his son, and is far more important.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:22am
    - My-Gumboot
      
      Absolutely and that is his priority.. But he would do a better job than the incumbent Mr Hughes even if he worked half time.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:39pm
  - Paulus
    
    Stephen would be the best State Services Commissioner as the current one retires shortly.
    But he is not a women I know.
    All recent many top Public Services roles, and their numerous Deputies, have all been the best for the jobs, and of course women.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:16pm
  - Lara
    
    His book is very informative. I think everyone should read it.
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:26pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Haven’t heard from Mai Chen or Geoffrey Palmer since our human rights were illegally suspended by the government.
  Probably not an area they would be familiar with I suppose, or perhaps an abrogation of civil and ethical duty.
  
  Good word abrogation.
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:34am
- Benedict Yu
  
  “The Government could at the start of its Parliamentary session introduce a bill (possibly under urgency) to temporarily suspend a list of programmes for one year pending permenant repeal legislation.”
  
  Under Standing Orders, I don’t think that is possible. You can’t introduce a single Bill to repeal multiple, unrelated Acts.
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:35pm
- Liberty
  
  It didn’t take long for the Constitutional Lawyers to crawl out of under their rock.
  For 6 long years, Labour and its lickspittles have imposed their vile socialist agenda.
  Hundreds were sacked on the guise that the unvaxed would kill grannies.
  Where were the Constitutional Lawyers?
  Labours Storm troopers dawn raided “ The Protest”
  Where were the Constitutional Lawyers?
  On Saturday the country said NO to the draconian Labour and its lickspittles.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 3:14pm
peterwn

Chris and Nicola should frame and hang this in their Caucus Room – ‘The overarching objective of a political party is to get into power and if in power to STAY IN POWER’.
19 9
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:02am
- Ehlana
  
  I’d prefer my elected representatives to have the overarching objective of serving the people of New Zealand.
  
  I agree you can’t implement your policies unless you are in power, but trouble looms when politicians start to conflate what is good for their Party staying in power with what is good for the country.
  
  58 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:53am
  - peterwn
    
    My answer to that is – if the party does not serve the people, it is not going to stay in power – is it?
    The objectives of serving the people and staying in power are one and the same. It is all about the Party staying on track.
    The National caucus need to keep in mind ‘what do we need to do to win the 2026 election – starting now!’. And that requires keeping as many of the voters as possible happy for as much time as possible.
    There is no point in Ministers devising and implementing policies, no matter how elegant, if they are unpopular.
    Also Caucus members (Ministers and party MP’s) need to keep this overarching objective in mind when they conduct party business and their own personal affairs.
    A party also has to keep its core supporters in mind too – they expect appropriate conduct from those that they support. They are the people who do the telephoning and door knocking. Chris, Nicola and Bish recognise how important these people are to Party success. If these people get peeved off then the Party membership and donations diminish and that means fewer votes.
    
    9 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:26am
    - AJL
      
      >>The objectives of serving the people and staying in power are one and the same. It is all about the Party staying on track.
      
      That’s…. just not true.
      As in, in a democracy, we TRY to synch those two up as best as we are able, but that doesn’t mean we succeed. There are plenty of times where lying to the people will make you more popular. There are plenty of times where crushing the free press, or starting a war will assist with staying in power.
      
      There’s also the (far more mundane) detail of… decisions which are “optimal” *now*, and will help maintain power for the next decade (cheaper taxes, reduced infrastructure spending), may well NOT serve the people over the longer term. There is an inherent disconnect, and personally, I want politicians who will navigate that disconnect, and occasionally take risks and actually *believe in something*, rather than just power.
      
      20 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:49am
    - Paulus
      
      Between now and then the best the new Government can do is to sort out the biggest Social, Financial and Cultural messes that this country has ever encountered.
      That will do for the next Election.
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:18pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    I agree. Serving the people. And protecting our rights, our nation and our security, and our economy.
    
    I think one of the key things that Nats need to do is wind back the left’s propoganda and influence machine.
    
    David’s referendum on the Principles (principles that aren’t actually in the treaty but edicts from various courts and activists) that were being embedded in NZ courts and govt websites and schools is a good examples.
    
    Defund Disinformation Project and publish all internal communications. Defund the media. Or make media funding like Charter schools where the public can allocate the spending. Appoint an independent to the head of the Charities commission not a Labour MP. Defund activist charities with out real outcomes. Stop lobby groups coming onto school property or influencing curriculum as we see happening wiht Sex Ed in schools. Industry bodies with monopolies who control people’s ability to practice their trade (like health, or sports) need to be broken up and allow choice. Eg. you should be able to have a different opinion and still be a doctor .
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:22pm
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  No, no and a million times no. They need to do, soon and hard, what’s in New Zealand’s best interests and not be deflected from that. They probably won’t, and who can blame them when the incentive structure facing them is so hopelessly skewed against good governance, but they should.
  
  19 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:04am
  - mawm
    
    They probably need to fight for our rights as a sovereign nation and our individual sovereignty which are about to be usurped by the WHO with their amendments to the pandemic plan. I don’t hold much hope for Luxon doing so. Maybe the “libertarian” Seymour might regain some of his party’s principles and do so.
    
    If you do not understand what is at stake here is some information outlining what is happening.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lyeO9IqJzc
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:07pm
- Nigel Kearney
  
  I doubt Chris and Nicola need any reminder of that. They probably have it tattooed somewhere anyway.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:08am
  - peterwn
    
    They don’t. However other members of Caucus need to be reminded of this now and again. The National government lost its way in the late 1990’s because it forgot what it was all about. If National had played its cards better it should have been able to win the 1999 election, instead it lost three successive elections.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:31am
- Che Guava
  
  “The overarching objective of a political party is to get into power and if in power to STAY IN POWER.”
  
  Surely staying in power is secondary to doing something and cementing real change when you get there. The overarching objective of a political party is actually to formulate a set of fundamental principles, identify the areas of society that do not align with or conflict with those principles, then implement long-lasting policies that fix the misalignment or contradiction.
  
  In other words, it’s a waste of time being in power for its own sake if you have no idea or understanding of what needs to be done and how you’re going to do it.
  
  18 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:40am
  - peterwn
    
    “In other words, it’s a waste of time being in power for its own sake if you have no idea or understanding of what needs to be done and how you’re going to do it.”
    Agreed and it is a waste of time as you would be out on your neck at the next election.
    But it has to be remembered that adherence to ‘founding principles’ does not win elections.
    
    2 5
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:16am
    - Taieri
      
      But it has to be remembered that adherence to ‘founding principles’ does not win elections.
      ——–
      
      So what does? Buying votes?
      While principles are not eternally immutable, without principles we are nothing.
      
      14 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:42am
      - peterwn
        
        The principles are there – see article 4 of the National Party Constitution –
        https://www.national.org.nz/governance
        
        0 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:12pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  ‘The overarching objective of a political party is to get into power and if in power to STAY IN POWER’.
  
  This is an eye-rolling statement because it can’t be made to last more than 2-3 terms – and then your back to the Left pushing their agenda and the Overton Window further Left again, with you chasing it.
  
  No matter how relentlessly any Party keeps that objective in mind, sooner or later, perhaps for reasons beyond their control, loses power anyway.
  
  So, knowing that in advance, what any government should be doing is making sure they’ve embedded a bunch of things that remain even when they do lose power:
  
  I do not believe that the solution to our problem is simply to elect the right people. The important thing is to establish a political climate of opinion which will make it politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing. Unless it is politically profitable for the wrong people to do the right thing, the right people will not do the right thing either, or if they try, they will shortly be out of office.
  
  Instead we have this, which is from America re the GOP but applies perfectly to National, This sounds familiar:
  
  Democrats know that if they can get those policies implemented now, many of them will remain forever. They’ll lose Democrats in the process, but so be it — there will be more Democrats in the future. It’s impossible to watch politics professionally for over a decade, through some of its liveliest battles in a long time, and not come to the understanding that Democrats in general do politics differently.
  …
  When it matters, Republicans look around and say, “Oh no we can’t do that, we’d lose a man. The Democrats would take seats.” They are virtually a majority for the sake of being a majority. They just want to polish it up, put it on the shelf, and look at it.
  …
  To put it simply, Republicans approach politics like America fights wars: They don’t want to lose a single man. Democrats, on the other hand? They look at politics like the Russians looked at Stalingrad: The congressman in front votes now; when they fall the next man gets elected and he will vote too.
  
  Although I’ll grant you the Greens and Te Paiti Maori are more for that level of fanaticism nowadays than the incompetent Labour Party.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:03pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Reading peterwn’s post reminds me why I voted ACT.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:34pm
  - peterwn
    
    And David Seymour and ACT needs to remember too. There were some mis-steps from ACT during the campaign but they quickly realised that they were detrimental to victory.
    
    4 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 2:13pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/has-co-governance-the-maorification-of-new-zealand-morphed-into-a-toxic-new-religion/
35 4
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:02am
- Scott
  
  Julian Batchelor, who is a Christian, knows what a different religion look like. He is right, the obsession with race and especially the Maori race is something of a cult.
  
  I do like the idea of a referendum on the Treaty. The Treaty has 3 articles –
  1) the Maori accept the sovereignty of the Crown, ar the time Queen Victoria.
  2) the treaty establishes property rights and the rights of Maori to own land and if they sell their land they must sell it to the crown.
  3) in return they get the rights and protections of British subjects.
  That’s subjects, not partners. There is no partnership. A referendum would make that clear.
  Then we could move on together, one nation, one people with equal rights for all.
  
  42 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:17am
- lastmanstanding
  
  The Aussie media like the NZ media are in meltdown. In their case its the loss of The Voice referendum. They are blaming Disinformation and Misinformation. What they regard as Disinformation and Misformation we of the Right regard as alternate opinion.
  Analysis of the Polls show the Elites and inner Urban voters together with some indigenous but no where near all supported the Yes vote. 14 of the 20 Top ASX companies donated millions of dollars of shareholder funds to the Yes campaign. Their Boards and CEO will face some tought questions at their next Annual Shareholders Meeting asking why they pissed shareholder funds up against the losing wall and reminding them they werent elected and appointed to be Social Justice Warriors but to maximise shareholders returns to allow shareholders to decide which side to contribute to.
  There is a lesson here for NZX Boards and CEOs. Dont get involved in political or in fact any cause that is likely to be controversial. You risk pissing off your shareholders employees suppliers and customers. Stick to the knitting.
  
  47 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:16am
  - krazykiwi
    
    “They are blaming Disinformation and Misinformation.”
    
    It’s an epidemic of elites blaming disinformation. This is Fauci in an interview defending is $US1m/month, taxpayer funded security detail:
    
    Concluding the interview, Fauci told Newshub, a Warner Bros. Discovery-owned outlet, that he is worried about the spread of “disinformation” on the internet.
    
    “I don’t want to make it seem so melodramatic, but it seems to erode the foundations of democracy because if you can’t believe the truth,” he said.
    
    “If you look back historically on how governments have failed and tyrannies ever have risen, it’s when people essentially take control over information, a lot of which is untrue. That’s a very scary situation,” he added.
    
    Yes, the man who oversaw, encouraged, and even demanded the fastest roll up of power in U.S. history is worried about the rise of tyranny.
    
    Emphasis mine. No, no, no. Tyrannies arise where governments take control of information. The people’s job is to prevent that.
    
    33 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:57am
  - krazykiwi
    
    “You risk pissing off your shareholders employees suppliers and customers. Stick to the knitting”
    
    I’ve just switch away from ASB’s Kiwisaver on account of their Blackrock-demanded worshiping at the ESG altar.
    
    31 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:59am
    - Ghost
      
      I forget to mention the other day, Blackrock are also partnered with AMP. So is ANZ investments. Looks like they are connected with westpac as well.
      
      16 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:14am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Going with Milford. I wish they offered a non-ESG fund, eg assets that have no affiliation with ESG-promoting private equity businesses.
        
        7 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:09pm
    - Master Mariner
      
      Its pretty hard to get away from with the Reserve Bank treating ESG as Gospel along with CDBC’s and implementation.
      
      On another note, Congress has banned them.
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PAu7thGgmA&t=381s
      
      No wonder Blackrock treat the ex PM with the red carpet. Useful idiots springs to mind.
      
      Meanwhile the World is wakening up to the “Cult” of ESG and investment and by default The mis/dis/mal information “projects” springing up around the Globe.
      
      The Global elites do not understand that the Globalised World has crashed and Protectionism is the order of the day.
      
      Meanwhile NZ still stumbles along thinking Globalisation is the order of the Day.
      
      Meanwhile,
      https://www.rt.com/business/585043-putin-brics-g7-purchasing-power/
      
      11 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:24am
  - Paulus
    
    It is my opinion that the large Shareholder Companies gave to the Yes referendum so that they can be seen relatively to be somewhere in the middle, bearing in mind that the employees and shareholders only have one individual private vote.
    Good Corporate Political and Social tactics.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:25pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Sadly NZ has become a racist society over the past 45 years. I was lucky to grow up in the 50s and 60s halcyon days when skin colour was ignored as far as the friends I had at school. It just didnt matter. We didnt see each other as white brown or yellow. We were just mates getting on with each other having fun.
  It was the Left and the Elites especially the Maori Tribal Elites who forced racism on our society in order to divide and rule. They are a venal feral nasty bunch of haters and wreckers. They seek to pitch Kiwi against Kiwi for their own agendas. They have no interest in Maori people. They see Maori people as cannon fodder to further their own ends. I say good Kiwis regardless of race must unite together call out and drive out there wasters from our society.
  
  57 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:37am
  - John Loveridge
    
    Your experience mirrors mine in the 70s and 80s. It’s all so ironic, isn’t it?
    
    22 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:51am
  - House
    
    Negative uptick by mistake sorry. I need a bigger screen or smaller thumbs!
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:42pm
- David Garrett
  
  Julian Batchelor is an evangelical Christian. I have nothing (much) against evangelical Christians but he is absolutely the wrong person to be leading this charge against co-governance.
  
  What is needed is someone who: 1) has an excellent knowledge of NZ history; and 2) has a good understanding of treaty jurisprudence going back to at least 1875; and 3) has a good working knowledge of the legal system and our constitution generally; and 4) has better public speaking skills than either Batchelor or Don Brash; and 5) is someone who isn’t afraid to get into serious scraps and physically stand up to racists like Tamihere, Waititi and Harawira.
  
  Such a person should be “not young” but not old either.
  
  22 16
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:40am
  - NothingLeft
    
    A unicorn hunt
    
    10 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:07am
  - Scott
    
    Umm… Evangelical Christians are awesome! 😎
    Julian Batchelor is leading the charge. Good on him I say!
    
    17 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:13am
    - David Garrett
      
      Scott: To only slightly misquote one Mandy Rice-Davies – the like of whom I’m sure a good God fearing man like you has never encountered – “Well you would say wouldn’t you”
      
      7 6
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:50am
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    If you make it contingent on arguments about history or jurisprudence, it will get bogged down and go nowhere. The swamp will win.
    
    A better approach is to just state and continually repeat the moral principle that nothing ever justifies government treating people differently based on race, and move forward making (and repealing) law and policy accordingly.
    
    27 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:16am
    - David Garrett
      
      Nigel K: I didn’t say anything about arguments about history and jurisprudence; I suggest that the right person will have very good knowledge of those areas of expertise.
      
      As an example of a little knowledge being dangerous, we frequently see it stated as a fact on here that Geoffrey Palmer inserted principles into the treaty jurisprudence. He did the opposite – he referred to “principles” in the SOE’s Act at a time when there were no “principles” in any legislation or case – an exercise he told the Lange cabinet was “meaningless window dressing – leading Sir Robin Cooke and his mates on the Court of Appeal to come up with some.
      
      Some smarter than average journo raising points like that would, I suspect – I may well be wrong, I am not a leftie – leave someone like Julian Batchelor floundering.
      
      8 4
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:28am
      - Skippytony
        
        OK, what is to stop NZ having a referendum to say, put a use by date on the TOW? Decide that say Oct 2024 the TOW is no longer valid. End of life. Has no further legal standing – its just an interesting historical relic.
        
        Doesn’t anything else like trying to weave it into the legislative framework just add force to the document?
        
        So no need for tribunals, its got no standing at all.
        
        If the majority agree, isnt that what democracy is for?
        
        4 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:56pm
  - Ghost
    
    I agree David. He is not the right person for this, and he won’t get more than a few behind him. A little digging and the pro co governance can easily shut him down
    
    7 7
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:17am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      The only times Julian has been shut down is when the woke Police did not do their jobs.
      Orewa, I was there. The young Maori woman ripping up the books. Police just stood there and watched her.
      Shut down in the sense of pressure being put on Councils so venues closed. He found another one.
      Julian is dealing with strange deluded people, egged on by the Elders and Elites.
      
      18 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:25am
      - Ghost
        
        I’m talking about shutting him down, not the meetings. He’s not the right person to be doing this and when the pro Co coverance people starting looking they will easily shut him down
        
        3 10
        Report
        October 17, 2023 10:30am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        @Ghost,
        
        I guess you have to meet him. Shutting him down will be a task, but yes he needs help.
        I don’t know who.
        
        6 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:43am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Nobody else has stood up to do what he is doing.
    But another person “not young” but “not old” I don’t know of anyone who would fit this. Julian Batchelor stopped working to pursue this. He is committed he says.
    He is also 65 which I did not know. He does not look 65.
    I don’t deny that he needs help. He also has to watch his back. There are many unhinged Maori out there – the ones brainwashed by the rogue post 1975 Treaty.
    
    So yeah, anyone up to helping Julian Batchelor? Please speak out.
    
    18 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:19am
    - David Garrett
      
      Steve O: you are right, he is in great shape for 65.
      
      If I was 20 years younger and didn’t carry the baggage I do, I would gladly step up to help. I truly believe we are rapidly heading for a possible civil war – many young and not so young Maori have been brainwashed that all the problems of their people are our fault. That is only going to get worse
      
      15 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:31am
      - Matt Long
        
        I thought that as Batchelor was the only one stepping up , it had to be you taking over DG.
        Best to be someone with a Maori ancestor though.
        
        11 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 10:40am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        DG, I am sure Julian would be pleased with your comment if he reads this.
        The “Coup” is a very real thing. People don’t seem to believe it.
        We have two generations of brainwashing since the Waitangi Tribunal was formed and the Treaty re-written. That is what makes Maori so angry when you tell them their Treaty is false and even illegal. As with any debate when there are no more answers they fly off the handle and brand you “Racist.”
        
        8 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:51am
  - leoj
    
    Batchelor is a bloody hero and has guts.
    Much more guts than some on here who criticise from the sidelines.
    It’s just a pity that many our gutless politicians have ignored the real problem of maorification.
    I don’t see pushback against Bob Jones whose phrase “maori wonderfulness” is virtually the same stance.
    
    24 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:54am
  - Salacious Crumb
    
    @ David Garrett – you mean someone like
    Dr Michael Bassett?
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:00pm
  - lnz
    
    The person I’d really like to see speaking in public with a wide* audience on this would be Prof Elizabeth Rata. She can clearly and calmly explain the history, how we got where we are and the consequences of different paths forward. *(I’d like to see her in a Kim Hill interview on RNZ; and a prime time current affairs TV interview on TV1 or 3). Another potentially good speaker is Casey Costello.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 5:49pm
artemisia

Interesting take on ZB PLUS (paywalled) from Philip Crump about what’s now likely to happen to the public service. New Zealand appoints its Chief Restructuring Officer

The ‘who else’ in the below extract refers to Peter Hughes, the Public Service Commissioner who recently announced he is leaving the role before the end of his contract.

The challenge for Luxon is not therefore that the public service is too partisan but that it has begun to act more politically, not just on behalf of whoever is in power, but also for themselves. By flattering their political masters, they have secured an element of political independence for their own projects. The question, therefore, is who else from the top tier of the public sector needs to be removed from their posts in order to reset expectations?
36 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:04am
- kowloon
  
  question, therefore, is who else ……
  answer to artemesia; MOST of them!, nearly all of them are political activists in varying degrees; supported by similar minded departmental staff.
  
  21 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:55am
  - artemisia
    
    Staff might not be similarly minded. They could be quite keen to carry on paying their mortgage. In any case public servants are required to implement the policies of the government. That includes the new government.
    
    ‘Shall I stay or shall I go?’ A lot will be learned from those decisions.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:48am
- plc
  
  Send Steve Joyce an SOS/Bat Signal
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:44am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Plc
    Send him $20million . A bargain if he can sort this mess out.
    I think the incumbents are out of their depth, not putting them down but there aren’t many with the necessary skills to repair damage of this magnitude , they should form a think tank with all interested parties and start the repair from common ground with private sector cooperation.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:17pm
Gravelroad

One of the inmates here is currently baking some morning tea for the workers.
Using a well known brand’s baking mix.
New packet has Te Reo interpretation of contents and expected results:
“Te Ranunga Tununga Takakau.”
Have googled for translation into Te English, but can’t find any reference to scones – at all.
Any assistance appreciated.
Life goes on……..
44 2
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:05am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Maori bread is the closest.
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:13am
- rouppe
  
  I’m developing an opinion that Maori don’t have any cultural sensitivity.
  
  Everything has to be turned into Te Reo, even when it’s clearly ridiculous, like the word for coffee – kawhe.
  
  Every other language will take on the original word for a new concept. Cafeteria. Kindergarten.
  
  Take St John ambulance service. Maori had no concept of saints. This person’s name was John. He was a Saint. Saint John. Why does that have to be obliterated by calling it Hato Hone?
  
  It seems Maori have to obliterate everyone else’s culture. There’s a word for that.
  
  47 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:14am
  - David Garrett
    
    rouppe: Quite so…I would add to that list of ridiculous new “Maori” words kooti for Court, and…can’t remember what the “Maori” word for library is.
    
    21 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:44am
    - pdm
      
      DG – kooti’s were crawly things in your hair when I and even our own children were kids.
      
      16 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:03am
    - Taieri
      
      can’t remember what the “Maori” word for library is
      ————-
      
      Whare pukapuka.
      
      There’s even one for the alphabet – according to Google Translate it’s rarangi reta.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:50am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Puka = book.
        Maori has no ‘b’. ‘oo’ sounds like ‘u’ Chuck on ‘a’, because.
        
        Puka = 1 book
        Pukapuka = 2+ books
        
        1 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 6:24pm
    - John Loveridge
      
      Whare pukapuka I think. House of books. At least that’s what I saw on a building in a tiny Otago town where no Maori has ever been seen.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:08pm
  - 7kiwi11
    
    It annoys me that St Johns is now Hato Hone St Johns. Which translates to St Johns St Johns.
    
    16 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:04am
  - Taieri
    
    It seems Maori have to obliterate everyone else’s culture.
    ———–
    
    With a (not so) little help from their Pakeha fellow travellers…
    
    14 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:46am
    - Sarkozygroupie
      
      In Australia place names are being “renamed” by Māoris ie Canberra is now Kanapera. A manufactured word that isn’t even real in te reo, and not sure that the Aussies appreciate having their country renamed for them without being asked.
      
      Isn’t this cultural appropriation? Wonder what the Aboriginals make of other brown people coming in and trampling over them.
      
      Watch it happen in other countries next…except I bet Māori don’t start renaming towns and villages on the Pacific Islands.
      
      0 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:49pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Hikareti = cigarette. No shit!
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:55am
    - James Stephenson
      
      Kotanga = car aerial was my first introduction to Billy T as a new arrival to these shores. When did NZ stop producing comedians that actually made one laugh?
      
      13 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:55pm
      - hullkiwi
        
        James, down that line (and for those old enough to remember the vehicle from the 1960s & 70s)…..
        
        Where do the voters of the Maori seats get their Kommadors from?
        
        Answer off Komma vans
        
        9 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:50pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Off Commer vans
        
        1 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 6:26pm
  - Paulus
    
    I have stopped giving to St John with with whom we have had great experiences.
    Sad, but cannot believe that according to very ancient written word I cannot accept that St John was a Maori !
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:31pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      In Auckland every time you need an Ambulance it will cost you $98.
      If you join, it is $90 per year for all the residents of your house.
      Sounds like a good deal. I don’t know how other places in NZ operate.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 4:45pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Wellington Free Ambulance
        
        Name says it all
        
        1 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 6:26pm
- wsk12345
  
  It has a Maori name so like all the government departments with such names will deteriorate quickly. Suggest a fdifferent brand when you run out of this one to avoid failed baking in future.
  
  22 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:05am
- RoboRob
  
  I think the message is…
  
  ‘F U we dont care about our customers and would rather virtue signal.’
  
  My advice dont buy that brand.
  
  45 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:15am
  - leoj
    
    Such as The Warehouse’s virtue signalling with their Market Kitchen grocery line.
    
    Obviously some lefty nerd who believes in “maori wonderfulness” (thank you Bob Jones) is high up in their marketing dept.
    
    The whole translation of everything into maori is a complete waste of time – even for maori!
    
    Products look interesting but won’t be going in my pantry.
    
    16 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:45am
Matt Long

This makes me really angry. The people who approved this grant need to be fired, then the people who hired them, then the people who hired them.

“Out of curiosity, Ive read about one of the leaders of the “Free Palestine” mob that demanded that Auckland Museum apologises for commemorating victims of the Hamas attack.

Her recent project, Working to End Racial Oppression (WERO), has received an MBIE Endeavour Fund grant of $10m (!!!).
(TEN MILLION OF TAXPAYER’S MONEY!!!!!)
Why on earth is MBIE funding these kinds of projects under this fund? The fund is officially meant to “support innovative research to support growth”. The grants are even referred to as “investments”.

Perhaps David Seymour is right to want to shut MBIE down..”

https://x.com/MHReddell/status/1713725340542177594?s=20
68 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:05am
- Benedict Yu
  
  The head this museum is pathetic.
  
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2023/10/auckland-museum-apologises-for-distress-hurt-after-lighting-building-up-in-support-of-israel.html
  
  52 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:16am
  - kowtow
    
    So is David Williams at the Herald .His article on the thugs veto at the museum contains this by way of an explainer;
    
    “Last week the Palestinian militant group Hamas sent rockets and military into Israel as part of their historical and long standing feud.
    More than 1300 Israelis have been killed in the initial assault and rocket attacks from Gaza.
    The overwhelming majority were civilians.”
    
    No mention of the hostages or atrocities , and a total absence of the “t” word.
    
    I understand that the craven museum is currently featuring a Holocaust exhibition . Perhaps the so called pro Palestinian thugs could cancel that too , or the museum apologise for even staging it , after all someone’s feelings might be hurt.
    
    The diversity dividend is really paying off. //
    
    36 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:30am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Link, please.
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:29am
      - kowtow
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/auckland-museum-apologises-for-lighting-up-in-support-of-israel/ITXLY6GLUNDGLE5R27EKGFADR4/
        
        8 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:23am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Thanks Kowtow.
        
        3 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:59am
  - Hugh Jarse
    
    Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.” – George Santayana
    
    24 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:30am
    - Stephen Russell
      
      Those who do will find new ways to err.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:15pm
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Well there’s an easy win immediately National take the reins. Taxpayer funding for activists. There will have been so much of this over the last 6 years.
  
  36 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:17am
- RoboRob
  
  Steven Joyce did a lot of good things but MBIE was not one of them. Under Labours piss poor management this has just turned into an unstoppable cruise ship. Even if the current government can get it under control, we need to think about future governments.
  
  28 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:17am
  - kowloon
    
    RoboRob, the present performance and policies of the MBIE are not anywhere near as envisioned, and implemented, by Steven Joyce.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:57am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  MBIE just needs to be told to stick to core business or else, remember MBIE is 4 ministries rapped into one, we may see more consolidation of like for like consolidation, the portfolio to thd right person will work, but if you get a numpty like we have had it will be a mess
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:45am
- artemisia
  
  MBIE had their instructions from Ministers directly and from the Maori caucus very slightly less directly.
  
  Maorification by stealth? The people have spoken.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:26am
jp_1983

Imagine your highlight of being an MP was having Koru Lounge access and now as a former MP he gets the redlight of doom.

I guess that shows how out of touch Labour got..
44 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:06am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  That was pathetic, he sums up the labour Mp wonderfully
  
  23 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:47am
  - kowloon
    
    perhaps if Labour MP’s had stuck with Lemonade, they may have been capable of making sensible decisions.
    
    23 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:59am
- Kiwiguy
  
  Imagine having to work hard enough and do enough mind-numbing air travel to actually earn Koru Membership on your own merits, instead of having it gifted to you.
  They would have no idea.
  
  22 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:51am
  - kowloon
    
    having it gifted to you…
    courtesy of the hardworking motivated Kiwi taxpayer.
    completed the thought for you!
    
    15 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:01am
  - David Garrett
    
    Kiwiguy: re “mind numbing are travel”…Quite so.
    
    I am currently living in Tonga; to live here long time requires frequent albeit only short absences from the Kingdom in order to stay sane.
    
    In just over a year I have returned to NZ six times. When I last checked my Airpoints $ balance was less than 100; in ten years time I might have racked up enough miles to get a free trip home, but nowhere near enough for Koru membership.
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:57am
- Ehlana
  
  Good news – it turns out they sell Koru memberships. You don’t have to be an MP!
  He can just buy himself one and continue to enjoy the benefits.
  Or, you know, sit out in the airport with the people.
  
  Surely that’s where a Labour man would rather be?
  
  29 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:58am
  - ecco
    
    The Wellington airport main area is just as pleasant as in the koru lounge.
    
    2 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:50pm
- Vinicius
  
  Even on the AM programme on Newsbub they were poking the borax at this guy and Jan Tinetti.
  
  No more sucking on the public teat.
  
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/10/election-2023-am-hosts-slam-bizarre-reactions-from-ousted-labour-mps-jan-tinetti-dan-rosewarne.html
  
  18 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:02am
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Although I note he was ex military it does seem that he continues to manifest the expression of some animals are more equal than others.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:28am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I’m not sure he was being particularly serious
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 6:41pm
Vinicius

Tremains post-election cartoon about Chippie and Labour entitled ‘Stuffed’

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/tremain-stuffed
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:07am
Maggie Pie

Great advice….
“It’s important to manage your expectations while a new government is formed”.

A short vid compilation of how the LEFT is coping 🙁

https://twitter.com/EerjkMcRaeOF/status/1713771003334295842
43 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:07am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Just like Democrat meltdowns.
  
  23 6
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:27am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    4 Democrats on Kiwiblog – wow!
    
    18 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:44am
- Local Miller
  
  Hysterical, and incredibly politically and socially unaware. After 6 years of Liebour and the poverty they have visited on NZ, to be saying a National lead Goverment will make things hard on all of us is being wilfully blind to reality.
  
  65 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:36am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    What else can they say? There is no way the brain dead will congratulate National on a win. Make New Zealand Great Again.
    
    33 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:47am
    - Kiwiguy
      
      MAGA!
      Make Aoteoroa Great Again!
      
      (Ducks & runs 😉 )
      
      19 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 9:15am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Needs to be on a hat/cap.
        Oh wait, I have 6 MAGA hats!
        
        7 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:58am
      - bjools
        
        Or more colloquially.
        
        M.A.N.Z.A
        Make
        Aotearoa
        New
        Zealand
        Again
        
        16 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:02pm
  - Dudley Quaffquaff
    
    The sooner National says bluntly and plainly that getting out of the mess we’re in is going to be hard on all of us, the better. Most people ought to be able to grasp the analogy that while sitting on the couch is more comfortable than putting in hard yards, the former will only get you overweight and unhealthy and it’s the latter that gets the results you want
    
    27 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:59am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Exactly. It is a bit more than grabbing the bull by the horns.
      The attitudes of 6 years of lefties will be against this.
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:00pm
  - wsk12345
    
    The bit I find hard to stomach – the “poor” have have massive pay increases. The benes have seen large increases in benefits. But those of us earning a wee bit more than that, we haven’t had anything to dea with cost of living.
    
    They go on about tax cuts like they are somehow a disgrace because it’s not more money for the bottom earners/benes. Instead of accepting that others need a turn too.
    
    30 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:13am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Tax cuts create more disposable income for the working families. The extra spent stimulates the economy. Small bits but over 5 million it adds up, and so does GST!
      
      8 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:03pm
  - Pavel
    
    They all have very short memories. Every single thing they claim will get worse under National all happened in record time in the last 6 years; child poverty, housing crisis, cost of living crisis, health care crisis, education crisis, crime crisis and all at a speed that no living person can remember. Everything is at such a low point that it would take a lot less energy to fix things than to make them worse.
    
    27 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:37am
- bjools
  
  WOW…a whole video of delusional young people.
  That are blaming the new govt. for things that haven’t happened yet.
  OOOHHHH sorry….these are the things that have happened….under Jacinda and Chippie….and there stupidity and dishonesty is the reason they were voted out and we are in the shit NOW.
  PS….It is not kind….for babies to get measles.
  It is not kind….for teenagers to die of meningitis.
  It is not kind….for people to wait in hospital waiting rooms
  It is not kind….for people to NOT get operations.
  It is not kind….for people to WAIT for cancer treatment
  It is not kind….for people to queue at food banks
  and above all….
  It is not kind….to subject generations of NZers to such large debt, that it will take a generation to (I hope not) to recover from.
  
  29 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:38am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    My 4 month old Great Grandson will be paying, and his unborn children.
    You just don’t get a debt of this size and pay it back in 15 years.
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:09pm
- hmmokrightitis
  
  And in about 10 years time they will all look back on those little cries for help and go…
  
  WTF was I thinking…
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:44am
  - kowloon
    
    were they actually thinking. our education system presently only teaches ‘what to think, NOT how to think’
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:07am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    They won’t think at all. Socialists see it as destruction of Capitalism.
    They will be ecstatic over how much shit they created. Strange people really.
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:15pm
- slightlyrighty
  
  It’s a common trend that people who have these opinions or feelings find it difficult to express them in non emotive terms.
  
  Their reactions are not based on what they have learned, but what they have been told.
  
  Case in point, the constant narrative of Luxon being a fundamentalist Christian who is anti LBGTQ and doesn’t believe in dinosaurs, when it was under his stewardship that Air New Zealand became one of the most LBGT Friendly employers in the country.
  
  It’s just that when you look at their reactions, there seems to be no reasoning with some of these people.
  
  21 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:03am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Is this does not believe in dinosaurs true or just something to have a go at Luxon.
    
    5 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:08pm
    - Warren
      
      I would rather take Chris Luxon at his word before any of the Journalists and wannabe comedian.
      For fucks sake how many times does have to address these malicious arsholes.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:34pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        If he denies saying what is claimed that should be he end of it unless they can show a video.
        
        2 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 2:48pm
      - Warren
        
        Chuck what has he done here,
        
        https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/10/election-2023-national-leader-christopher-luxon-takes-swipe-at-newshub-for-unbelievable-dinosaur-question.html
        
        0 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 4:52pm
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Two lessons they will never learn:
  
  1. People stopped voting for them because they ran the country badly.
  
  2. The reason they ran the country badly is not incompetence (though that didn’t help). It is that their guiding philosophy is to insulate people from the consequences of their actions, which will always lead to people choosing less effective actions and so take the country backwards.
  
  43 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:06am
  - alex Masterley
    
    Also people need to remember that in Auckland people actually hate Labour because of the lockdowns they imposed on us.
    
    35 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:30am
    - Stu2
      
      Doubt the long running restrictions in the south island with exactly zero cases have been forgotten either.
      
      And that’s before we get to who got through the border and why.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:05pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    Gonna disagree – poo-fingered incompetence was a major factor too, but also their regressive ideological head-up-arsedness.
    
    23 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:33am
- Matt Long
  
  It only took one day after he lost office for James Shaw to play the Thugs Veto card.
  https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/133123493/it-could-lead-to-violence-james-shaws-warning-about-acts-treaty-of-waitangi-referendum
  
  45 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:14am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Another leftie that turns nasty when things go wrong for them.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:22pm
- sirknz
  
  That looks like a lot of self inflicted mental health issues.
  
  20 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:14am
- emmess
  
  That’s too pathetic to even laugh at
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:25am
- Gravelroad
  
  They remind me of the old nursery rhyme about the three little kittens:
  Three little kittens, they lost their mittens
  And they began to cry
  “Oh, mother dear, we sadly fear
  We’ve lost our mittens by”
  “What! Lost your mittens? you naughty kittens
  Then you shall have no pie”
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:05am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Lol Mags, very funny! Nearly all of them were only about 15 though. So no surprises they were utter numpties.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:57am
- John Loveridge
  
  Is that what the peeps do these days, Maggie? Lie around and film themselves pulling faces?
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:23pm
Matt Long

I hope the new government will continue to clamp down on farming for their cavalier attitude to water pollution.
Fortunately according to Greenpeace urban pollution is no problem.
“Nothing to see here, move along.”
https://i.stuff.co.nz/environment/133117228/up-to-13-million-litres-of-sewage-overflowing-into-harbour-after-sinkhole-bypass-work-begins
37 2
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:09am
- hullkiwi
  
  Really. No more sewerage from Wynyard wharf then or the western bays….all for the cameras and the lazy media. Nothing new, move on…
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:26am
- bjools
  
  “In total, our farmers will fence 24,400 kilometres of waterways which means another 4000 kilometres to go. … Every kilometre completed is added protection for waterways and contributes to clean and green New Zealand. ”20/11/2013
  
  NOTE THE DATE.
  
  18 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:42am
Flossie

Is it not a law in this country that all those aged 18 and over must enrol on the electoral register? Failure to do this must be punishable by at least a fine.
Why do we not have a rule that if you have not enrolled by at the very least the last day before voting begins then you are not able to vote.
The voting places would run much more smoothly.
18 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:09am
- bjools
  
  The rule should be…..you must enroll with enough time to the last voting time, such that your eligibility can be verified.
  How can you verify their eligibility on Friday before the election?
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:18am
  - Ghost
    
    The votes aren’t counted until they are verified. They will now be going through the process of verifying if those people have given correct information and if they are eligible to vote
    
    11 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:34am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      So the lazy useless bastards are yet another reason for the final result delay.
      Why are they not fined for not being on the roll?
      
      9 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:28pm
- Ehlana
  
  A sensible use of taxpayers’ money might actually be to run adverts at intervals between elections to remind people of this. Rather like the ones we currently run to encourage bowel screening.
  
  11 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:22am
  - bjools
    
    You comparison, is almost Freudian.
    Bowel screening…..to elections….
    HHHMMM….I can almost see that.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:58am
  - Skippytony
    
    Just do what they do in Australia.
    Election is gazetted and you have X weeks to get to get on the roll or miss out
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:06pm
- Sacha
  
  I’m fairly sure that at one time you had to enrol by a certain date so that the electoral roll would be printed and ready for voting day.
  Such requirements placed importance on doing one’s duty as a mature citizen – emphasising the importance of the voting process.
  Unfortunately, in the interests of making it less demanding on lazy ‘voters’, the whole process has become something of a joke with ‘special’ votes now becoming the final arbiter on who becomes the government. Last minute decisions . . . . . .
  Thus were the lazy and indifferent enabled.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:32am
- ecco
  
  Laws was saying on his show that Labiur changed it so people could just bowl up to the polling booth unregistered, on the day and vote. Hope that gets reversed asap.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:08pm
Tomtoddy

Ben O’Keefe wont be refereeing any more big games if the French have any say. He missed some very blatant mistakes including Estebeth’s “knock down” and the charge down which was clearly illegal. there were many other poor decisions – some France’s way and some S.A’s way. He should have gone to Spec savers – his own.
16 7
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:12am
- rouppe
  
  For what it’s worth…
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby-world-cup-2023/133126287/rugby-world-cup-2023-referee-review-whats-the-ruling-on-deliberate-knockons
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:27am
- Prince
  
  ‘Knock-down’ went backwards so perfectly legal.
  Charge down was perfectly legal.
  Any other issues ?
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:36am
- Colville
  
  SA just flopping off their feet in the last minutes to slow it down was blatant and ignored.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:45am
- Gravelroad
  
  I’m no expert, but I thought that was what the people upstairs were there for – to advise the referee if a mistake has been made.
  Isn’t that what happened when the English team complained about the try Samoa scored?
  And the try was disallowed after the conversion had been successfully taken?
  That was a new one on me.
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:49am
  - RoboRob
    
    I’m no expert but I think the issue is the rules. We had three games with ‘knock downs’ and three entirely different ref decisions. If refs, absolute experts on the rules, cant get it right then world rugby needs to sort the rules. It would also make rugby more accessable to casual / new followers.
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:21am
- Nickc2
  
  AFIK, a conversion can be charged down!
  However, from the camera’s angle, I do agree with you as regards Estebeth’s “knockdown.
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:58am
- zulumonster
  
  I’m not a great fan of O’Keefe as a referee but I believe the Etzebeth knockdown was a marginal call which was confirmed by the touch judge and TMO as a knock back in fact. So a good call in the end.
  And the chargedown was a result of Kolbe knowing how long the kickers routine took from playing with / against him in France – the replay video shows it was another tight call but again probably right.
  But where you are right is that the French will complain so much he doesn’t have a chance of getting the final- which is not possible anyway if the All Blacks beat the Puma’s.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:16am
- Burtland
  
  France had 60% of territory and 60% possession – and they blame the ref
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:35am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Sorry Tom, don’t agree with your take at all. Estebeth knocked the ball down alright, but not forward. Entirely legal. And the charge down was fine as well (and legal). They have TMO’s who monitor pretty much everything, so if O’Keefe was wrong, then they would have hopped in. France are just doing what Warren Gatland always does (and for that, thank goodness he’s not AB coach), and that’s have a sook after losing.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:00am
  - Tomtoddy
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ge0C83qUHAI
    dont agree with all the conclusions in this video but the Estebeth knock down went forward.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 5:35pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Anyone else fed up with referees, during the game, coaching players ?
  I would say we would certainly have different results if referees stayed silent and relied on the whistle and hand signals.
  We now have the situation where the ref gives out two or three warnings of infringement before actually blowing the whistle.
  The player’s knowledge of the rules is part of being a player.
  Especially at this level .
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:33pm
Matt Long

Dr Sharma is having a schadenfreude time.
https://x.com/gmsharmanz/status/1713809447423037833?s=20
https://x.com/gmsharmanz/status/1713732111654605042?s=20
https://x.com/gmsharmanz/status/1713468916008366478?s=20
49 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:13am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Wow he is totally over the Labour Party. 😂
  
  “A quick plug here for my friend Kiri Allan who has started a new consultancy. If ur organisation needs help protecting drink drivers who run away from Police or if ur organisation has just lost the election & needs PR spin or if u want to hinder OIA request Kiri is ur go 2 person”
  
  66 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:19am
  - Colville
    
    Its a laugh…
    
    What kind of moron would you need to be to spend good money to lean on f**king Kiri Allen for business advice???
    Unless of course you see the advice of an ineffective liar who punched down on defenceless staff to hide her own failings as something you can learn from?
    
    27 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:51am
  - RoboRob
    
    I read about Kiri’s new business venture. Seems like a total failure to me. Without government contacts what exactly do her clients expect to receive. Maybe she can pull in the LBGTQLMNOP crowd that wants political / businesss advice but thats a pretty small percent of the population.
    
    I think she will fold before Stuff, who I am giving 12-18mths.
    
    25 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:24am
    - NothingLeft
      
      Kiri will only get work from woke organizations, majority of whom are public institutions or NGOs with money. Almost all of which are in the end funded by govt. NAct will have failed if they are still dolling out money to the likes of Kiri in 6 months.
      
      23 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 9:37am
      - kowtow
        
        Almost all of which are in the end funded by the tax payer.
        
        It can’t be said often enough , the govt has no money of it’s own.
        
        And that’s another reason , if needed , for the rule of law , a democratic principle to be front and centre ie all power in the country is accountable to the voter ( not appointees, race representatives etc)
        
        10 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:14pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Good God….what exactly is she going to offer advice on, other than how to completely blow a promising political career because your former tongue-in-groover found a new mate in record time?
    
    29 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:51am
    - Gravelroad
      
      She could offer advice to wine and beer producers on how to get people to drink more wine and beer.
      
      17 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:11am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  His sense of humour is working and he is/was a leftie!
  Expect more about a certain bully that he was gagged on.
  
  35 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:50am
Rusty

Not that it’s important but is Jacinda Ardern now living and working in Boston/USA?

Our media hasn’t said much about her whereabouts or work since her runner in January.
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:21am
- hullkiwi
  
  She is still a fellow at Harvard. How I don’t know? The question that begs is how? Given Ardern since graduating from Waikato has demonstrated zero academic intellectual capacity. Harvard is meant to be US Ivy League, may be their standards are slipping? Sarc///
  
  19 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:08am
  - kowtow
    
    Ivy League “standards”.
    
    ‘A Cornell University professor was caught on camera telling students Hamas’ terror attack on Israel — which has left more than 1,400 dead — was “exhilarating” and “energizing.”’
    
    https://nypost.com/2023/10/16/russell-rickford-says-hamas-terror-was-exhilarating-exciting/
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:26pm
  - John Loveridge
    
    I think you’ll find she didn’t demonstrate much intellectual capacity while at Waikato, never mind since.
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:28pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Why would anyone care, so long as she’s not screwing up things up in NZ anymore, and we don’t have to pay for her (other than pension)
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:16am
  - Drone
    
    Free transport in NZ, return international flight first class at least once a year, free travel in NZ for the DJ boyfriend, probs diplomatic protection squad when in NZ, I’m sure the list goes on for life so not over yet..
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:34am
- imalwaysright
  
  I thought her pre election message to the country would be her and hubby with child on her knee in a lounge with a pleasant view.
  
  Instead , she is alone, holed up in an attic in her pyjamas with not an ounce of slap on her dentine rich visage.
  Great effort Jacinda . Class act.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:40pm
  - Flossie
    
    What husband?
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 3:04pm
Maggie Pie

Arose earlier, opened the drapes, took in the view over the harbor and beyond.
Got the feeling a long-black-cloud has been lifted off the land.

Just saying.
70 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:21am
- NothingLeft
  
  Back in the safe stewardship of the wrong white crowd.
  
  16 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:50am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The stench is going too.
  
  24 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:52am
- mogg
  
  Hipkins was right about one thing, there was a light at the end of the tunnel.
  
  20 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:00am
  - herb1
    
    Yes the light at the end of the tunnel was unfortunately, for Hipkins, an oncoming train
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:38am
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  Aptly, the weather here in Wellington is filthy this morning
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:01am
  - Kiwiguy
    
    Also aptly, the weather in Auckland is really nice – not too cold, not too hot, nice and settled. 🙂
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:00am
    - Colville
      
      Weather in Brisbane is 28C-31C this weekend in Brisbane and that is where I will be!
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:47pm
- Sacha
  
  Grey clouds, with the sun trying to get through. It’s not happening yet –
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:35am
Matt Long

The medical establishment is still persecuting people for having divergent views, in this case a doctor who inadvertantly shared information about treatments used overseas and verboten information about vaccine effectiveness and safety.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/gp-breached-code-when-she-sent-woman-with-covid-19-anti-vax-information/D7EJYBNW7VA7VOQKFGIJSA4ONA/
31 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:22am
- wsk12345
  
  Yeah “we don’t recommend treatments” – which included vit C and D – here in NZ for early treatment of covid. You might get better and stop believing the BS from the single source of truth.
  
  18 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:21am
  - Ehlana
    
    Fortunately, we do recommend 5+ a day. And your fruit and vegetable are packed with all sorts of boosts to your immune system.
    
    And getting out in the sunshine and fresh air will not only boost your Vitamin D, it will improve your mental health (as long as you don’t listen to Parliamentary question time while you’re walking).
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:13pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Been waiting for the sun. Get out on the deck on a beach pad and get some Vitamin D.
      Might even soak up some heat. I am one of the lucky one who don’t get sunburn.
      
      Then, when I wake up, grab a boor and jump in the spa pool.
      
      6 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:40pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Jesus! beer* of course!
        
        2 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 4:50pm
- ISeeRed
  
  The new government must stop this. Same with arbitrary bans on Ivermectin etc. Doctors should have the freedom to prescribe and advise as they see fit.
  
  20 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:26am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Maybe Mai Chen could take her case pro bono publico.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:45pm
oldpark

Wonder who is in charge of the waste of space and almost bankrupt Wellington Post .

Notice after all the poison they printed to kneecap National /Act Party before the General Election on 14 10 2023.
Maybe in their low rent ignorance of the results, or is it ignorance of the truth and their sour grapes.
In todays print a clown masquerading as a cartoonist has once more carried on the theme to denigrate National /Act Party .
Seems they are certainly helping to hasten their bankruptcy any time soon .Go figure .
21 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:23am
- hullkiwi
  
  The Wellington Dom/Post will survive, because the left Labourites and Greenies need a newspaper masthead to validate and confirm their “world views”.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:03am
  - Inandout
    
    hull, and do the crossword before starting ‘work’.
    
    10 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:28am
    - Paulus
      
      Is that before the Maori daily screeching, called a powphiri, before free coffee and cake – all before Morning Tea !
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:47pm
  - Skippytony
    
    happy for them to survive – just not on the taxpayers dime
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:14pm
  - Paulus
    
    May be but Tova needs big money to continue her anti National, Act, Luxon Government diatribe !
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:45pm
- ecco
  
  Does anyone know if it’s true that The Post is funded by one of the Maori tribes?
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:11pm
emmess

Time to start thinking about the next election in 26
In 2008 Labour got 34% and crashed to 27%/25% in the next two
So about where they are in 2023.
I am pretty sure they can never repeat a 2017, no one would fall for another Jacinda again.
So I’d say that means they are likely to drop further to the low twenties at best for the next election.
18 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:29am
- NothingLeft
  
  “I am pretty sure they can never repeat a 2017.”
  
  NZ is, on average getting dumber and less educated and easier to manipulate. Smartphones have burned out most peoples ability to learn or focus for more than a few seconds.
  
  21 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:40am
- kowloon
  
  no one would fall for another Jacinda again….
  the electors in Tamaki did, chose an real world inexperienced,but physically attractive, young woman.
  
  9 9
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:15am
  - oldpark
    
    Amongst other very debatable thinking. That was one reason why our 20 votes went to National in another electorate . Thank you Kowloon for your common sense observation . Nuff Said.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:17pm
  - wsk12345
    
    BVV at least has an economics degree and some work experience. While it remains to be seen, I think she is a lot more than a pretty face. The previous one wasn’t even that.
    
    9 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:58pm
  - John Loveridge
    
    Brooke van Velden is no Ardern. Just sayin’.
    
    11 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:31pm
  - sirknz
    
    She has been highly visible in the electorate for quite some time. O’Connor was nowhere to be seen other than a weekly thing on Facebook. I can count on one hand the number of times I have seen him (with fingers left over) since moving to the electorate a couple of years ago and they have all been in the last 3 weeks of his election campaign.
    
    5 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 4:03pm
    - wsk12345
      
      I’m not in your electorate but he was out in it every day for months before the election I’m told by people who helped him.
      
      Blue not as obvious as bright pink ofc.
      
      0 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 18, 2023 9:31am
Matt Long

Luxon doesn’t know Elon Musk, doesn’t appreciate his congratulations.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/entertainment/2023/10/i-don-t-know-him-christopher-luxon-shrugs-off-elon-musk-s-well-wishes.html
I wonder if he’s heard of the WEF yet, or agenda 2030?
Maybe he knows this person?
14 19
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:34am
- Matt Long
  
  https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://resources.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/v/n/y/o/n/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.710×400.1vnv7z.png/1561060384332.jpg&tbnid=V8D9Rqn2FUsXOM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/113647823/luxons-path-from-national-carrier-to-national-party-wont-be-simple&docid=HxnLBb5I0qe58M&w=709&h=400&hl=en-GB&source=sh/x/im/m1/4&shem=uvafe2
  
  3 10
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:43am
- Che Guava
  
  What a bozo. Arrogant, ignorant, or both. I don’t trust him at all at this point.
  
  8 17
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:29am
- greybeard
  
  I comment here on DPF’s blog and I don’t know him.
  Nor does DPF know me.
  So what ?
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:59am
  - Matt Long
    
    So if DPF congratulates you for a success, you say thank you, not try to disassociate yourself from him.
    Unless you disagree with him so much you won’t acknowledge him, or you’re afraid of upsetting Greg Presland and Nicky Hager.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:23am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Yes Matt, but that wouldn’t be reported in the media. And what Luxon did say, what context he said it in, and what gets reported in the news are generally two different things.
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:03am
      - Ghost
        
        Reminds me of Mike Hosking a few weeks ago was talking about how he watched online everything Luxon said one day, and then read what was reported. Everything reported was completely different to what was actually said
        
        15 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 11:11am
- Ghost
  
  I’m not sure where you get he doesn’t appreciate Elon’s congratulations.
  
  4 6
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:05am
  - Che Guava
    
    Maybe from the fact he hasn’t acknowledged it and is publicly distancing himself from Musk? Luxon doesn’t have any obligation to acknowledge, but it speaks volumes about his character. I think it’s obvious that Luxon, or more likely his advisors, are scared of being seen to associate with someone who allows “conspiracy theories” on his social media platform. This is the “real change” many KBers predicted and hoped for.
    
    5 10
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:12am
    - Ghost
      
      No what is obvious is that you read too much into things
      
      9 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:35am
      - Che Guava
        
        These things matter. And things happen (or don’t happen as the case may be) for a reason. People are watching him and are therefore making judgments about what they see.
        
        4 3
        Report
        October 17, 2023 10:42am
      - Ghost
        
        No, listening to what is said without making shit up is what matters, you are as bad as the msm
        
        2 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:25pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      I think Luxon is sometimes too literal , as with his stating that he doesn’t know Winston.
      He is making a true statement that can be subject to ambiguous interpretation.
      
      He’s more naïve than he is calculating. Probably nothing more than that.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:57pm
  - Matt Long
    
    “I appreciate his congratulations, we don’t see eye to eye on everything, but it’s great National’s success is getting noticed on the world stage.”
    How hard is that?
    As hard as meeting with people protesting against the government you’re supposed to be in opposition to apparently.
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:26am
    - Che Guava
      
      I don’t think he has any political instincts. Certainly not good ones.
      
      4 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:44am
      - Paulus
        
        Are we not sufficiently tired of Political Instinctists Ardern, Robertson, Chippy, Little and so many pure imperfect politicians- we need a good professional Manager which is what was voted for.
        I would like to see Joyce actively and back within the Country too !
        
        7 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:52pm
    - Flossie
      
      But did Musk actually congratulate him? I thought he said “thank goodness”?
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:48pm
      - Matt Long
        
        “Congratulations and thank goodness!”
        https://x.com/chrisluxonmp/status/1713143121041899644?s=20
        Musk is strongly against cancel culture and government overreach, Luxon, I’m not so sure of.
        
        7 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:34pm
- Philview
  
  Most of NZ probably wouldn’t know there has been a prominent global news story about the science curriculum in NZ. Eion Musk has strongly supported the science side of the debate and would make sense he would welcome the demise of the NZ Labour Party which have undermined the science curriculum.
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:20am
- thirteenstars
  
  Doesn’t he look oh-so comfy on that couch.
  
  The media ain’t stupid. Reel this guy in. Make him perform. Get into his head.
  
  We’ve all been there. After a while you don’t want to bite the hand that strokes you.
  
  3 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:37am
TripeWryter

I’ll write this here because I don’t rust the moderators at The New Zealand Herald. Also what I want to say is not constrained by their word limit.
But clutching my cup of coffee I clicked on to Simon Wilson’s think-piece this morning; he wrote how Auckland is a city of immigrants.
Now, that’s not new. Auckland’s always been that. But what he said happens to coincide with what I see there when I visit.
One of my daughters began living in Auckland in 2010. She ran a corporate call-centre (200 people were her staff).
She showed me around one day: South Africans, Chinese, Indians, other ‘Asians’, Pacific Islanders, – people from all over the world at work.
She now works elsewhere; in 2016 she became pregnant, went on parental leave, the corporate did a restructure, she found herself out of a job. The corporate was generous, though. The redundancy helped them through covid a few years later.
Anyway the birth of her daughter has given me a reason to visit Auckland and spend time there. Often for several weeks.
I take note of the ‘new’ Auckland. My granddaughter’s father was born in Manila. Her Lolo and Lola and later titos and titas and their children migrated from The Philippines in the 90s because they wanted a better life.
Largely they’ve got it.
They’re honest, hard-working, generous (oh, so generous), and aspirational people. They taught their children well to be similarly hard-working and honest. They will give you the cliché’d shirt off their backs.
My daughter and granddaughter are why I go to Auckland several times a year.
Her pre-school was managed by a woman from Poland. The teachers were Maori, Chinese, Indian and other immigrants. My granddaughter mixed with other little kids often with exotic, almost unpronounceable names.
I was there for her 4th birthday. Eight friends and their parents came – Chinese, Indian, South Korean, Malaysian, Filipino, South African.
The parents were aspirational: they were professionals, small business. They knew about working hard.
They believed in education. Why is it that migrants to this country have since World War 2 understood the value of education and urged their children to pursue it with everything in them? Look at the kids and listen to the accents of the pupils at the top colleges there.
Meanwhile Maori ‘leaders’ – academics and the like – for the last 20-30 years have disdained what they call ‘pakeha’ and ‘coloniser’ education. Education they themselves benefited from …
My granddaughter is now a schoolgirl. At her school she has teachers who have done well to teach her how to read and she is beginning to enjoy how that has expanded her world.
She plays sport – her team-mates come from migrant families including the little Chinese boy who seems overwhelmed to be in the company of boisterous little girls.
I take the buses and trains when I go around Auckland. The transport system there seems to rely on migrants as drivers, train guards, security. The shops in Queen St are mostly ‘Asian’.
The beggars and street people seem overwhelmingly Maori and Pacific Islanders.
I worry a lot about the racism directed at Asians that I see and hear when I’m in Auckland. I also see and hear it in Wellington. A lot of it seems to come from young tangata whenua and Pacific Islanders.
They take ‘our’ jobs. They buy ‘our’ houses. The only time I hear ‘nigger’ is from them.
A few months ago in the Hutt Valley a young, brown New Zealander with a baby at her breast berated a migrant bus driver and repeatedly called him a ‘nigger’.
I was three seats away from her. He pretended not to hear.
My granddaughter has had racist slurs directed at her – and not by white people.
Incredible, eh?
The reason I’ve posted this was because some of what Simon Wilson wrote in the Herald today I have also seen and heard.
I tend to avoid a lot of his stuff.
Migrants want to do well. They want something better for their families.
They do not understand how in New Zealand children can be out ram-raiding and being little thugs in the dead of night and there are no consequences.
How can that be?
How can people squirt out kids and not do that most basic duty of a parent – to love and care and discipline their children?
Simon Wilson says Labour must learn to connect with these people if they want their vote.
So must any political party because they are the future here, which is what I think some Maori are afraid of.
They fear, it seems to me, being swamped. Hence the occasional racist barb.
40 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:41am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Well said and I agree. The problem is Maori and PIs have been patronised for the past 50 years and have lost the ability to fend for themselves. They have been welfare dependent. The welfare state has destroyed them.
  
  33 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:49am
  - David Garrett
    
    lastman: Quite so. I am presently living in Tonga, which is a textbook case of what happens when a country becomes dependent on the aid tit.
    
    Before it finally blew down in a cyclone a few years ago, at the back of the Tongan parliament chamber was a framed letter from the British Air Ministry dated September 1940. The letter thanked the Tongan people for their gift of TWO spitfire aircraft to help Britain in its fight for survival in the Battle of Britain.
    
    At that time the only industry here was copra. There was no squash (Tonga fills a short gap in Japan’s demand for this unappetising product); there was no fishing, and no tourism. Most people lived a life of subsistence farming.
    
    Two spitfire aircraft in 1940 were worth today’s equivalent of two modern jet fighters. Today, addicted as it is to the aid tit, Tonga couldn’t buy the cockpit canopy for one fighter, let alone two whole ones.
    
    23 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:00am
  - NothingLeft
    
    welfare is infantilizing. Not requiring able bodied people to provide for themselves or behave responsibly turns them into pathetic unhappy children.
    
    13 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:19am
- Che Guava
  
  What’s the end point of immigration? There isn’t one. It is an end in itself. The goal is to have unceasing immigration, and lots of it, indefinitely. No doubt there are many “good” immigrants, but there is much to be said for having and sustaining a society with a stable coherent core (i.e. shared history, traditions, ethnicity, culture etc.) It’s easy to sit here and say “all these immigrants are wonderful.” It’s particularly easy when, like Simon Wilson, you (very probably) live in a leafy suburb with few immigrants. But what happens when Europeans eventually (and inevitably, on the current trajectory) become 50, 40, 30 and 20 % of the population? At that point, you’re a minority in your own country. Your grandkids and great grandkids have become second-class citizens (which is already an overt attitude when we are still the large majority). They have to pay for our inaction and acquiescence. Why this would be a desirable situation is very difficult to rationally explain, yet mathematics demonstrates that this will be the case, not just here but everywhere (and only) in the White Western world.
  
  Europeans and Maori built New Zealand from nothing. We have every right and it is completely rational to want to maintain it as “ours” and that means we have to say “no” to immigrants who aren’t like us. They have no automatic right to come here, just as we don’t have any automatic right to move to their countries (and not that we usually would, because their countries are worse, otherwise they wouldn’t want to leave and come here).
  
  6 12
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:52am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Increasing internal markets via population increase is better for NZ’s economic prosperity and competitiveness over the long term as we can provide more product and service niches indigenously and benefit from increased competition and economies of scale (eg see supermarket prices of food in NZ vs Australia). We have enormous dependence upon tradeables that countries with larger populations don’t.
    
    4 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:27am
    - Che Guava
      
      New Zealand is my home. I’d much rather be poorer in a good and decent society that is bound together by intangibles than be richer and have more “stuff” in an open economic zone subject to being raped by anyone from anywhere who sees my home as something they can take advantage of for a few dollars. If we cannot say “no” to the world then we don’t have any sovereignty over our country.
      
      8 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:50am
    - Taieri
      
      Increasing internal markets via population increase is better for NZ’s economic prosperity and competitiveness over the long term
      —————-
      
      Vide housing, health care, education and so on…
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:57am
      - NothingLeft
        
        NZ has ridiculously low population density, less than 10% of most European countries, almost half of sparsely populated USA.
        
        3 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:51pm
  - Miritu
    
    The elephant in the room that gets ignored is our generous welfare system. Past immigrants built NZ without govt handouts. I’d advocate open borders subject to no claims on state welfare. That will attract high calibre immigrants.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:55am
    - NothingLeft
      
      how about open borders provided you pay an average of more than $50k income tax a year.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:55pm
- kowtow
  
  Once “we” all start treating people as people and not as “ethnicities” or “communidies” then we can all get on together as citizens , not as races .
  
  The left ( and media) deride the right as divisive ( see the Voice) but it is the left that seeks to highlight and emphasise race as a distinguishing feature , not our common humanity and citizenship.
  
  13 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:00am
  - Che Guava
    
    The thing that divides us by race is that we are different races. The thing that divides us by culture is our different cultures. The thing that divides us by religion is our different religions.
    
    We do share features with all of mankind, but a concept like “our common humanity” is invoked in order to bring in a homogenous and undifferentiated whole that is easier to rule over. I reject the idea that division is something to be erased or attenuated. Right across nature, you need division and differentiation in order to have actual diversity; but under the empty slogan of “diversity” we will end up with homogeneity.
    
    3 7
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:55am
    - Skippytony
      
      Hmmm. I grew up in Australia. There you have a small percentage of the population whose culture had /has no concept of the idea of personal ownership of anything. The idea that you can own property is just nonsensical. If no-one owns stuff a) no-one looks after it, because why bother? and B) If I need that bit of stuff and I dont recognise the concept of ownership, why should I care that you think its your stuff?
      If you reject outright these Gubba (unkind aboriginal slang for white folk) ideas, why pay tax? Why obey laws? Why not just take whatever you want?
      
      In what, 250 years, Australia has made surprisingly little headway with these attitudes, and I suspect it has a lot to do with the awful awful plight of most of the “first nations”
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:27pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  ‘Squirt out kids’ means more money.
  The IQ is the same as room temperature – celsius.
  
  5 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:51pm
Matt Long

Not a Catholic but appreciate this man’s courage and humanity.
Jerusalem Catholic Patriarch offers to be exchanged for Gaza hostages.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/jerusalem-catholic-patriarch-offers-be-exchanged-gaza-hostages-2023-10-16/
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:50am
Frank the tank

Where’s Willy?

Jackson has been really, really quiet since Saturday night.

Also I wonder if Jess MM has calmed down yet. Never seen a more angry presenter during the election coverage.

Brought me back to 2016 and Trump.
21 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:52am
- Libertarians are right
  
  I found it hilarious that Katie Bradford was at the ACT Party party and Maiki Sherman was at the National Party party. Both looked like they needed a mental health day.
  
  17 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:28am
Vinicius

The CTU continue to have lost touch with reality.

CTU chief executive Richard Wagstaff joined AM on Tuesday and when asked by AM’s Ryan Bridge (Newshub) if he regrets getting involved and “being so negative” during the campaign – he said he does not.

Another lefty who lives in an alternative universe and cannot fathom why their Labour mates got a flogging from the voters.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/10/election-2023-council-of-trade-unions-proud-of-campaign-against-national-says-money-well-spent-despite-result.html
29 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:59am
- Paulus
  
  Presumably Andrew Little will rejoin the Unions he left and buggered over a Coal Mine in the West Coast.
  He was their Union Leader remember.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:22pm
- ecco
  
  Noticed Wagstaff not prepared to say how much the ctu spent on that negative campaign. What a gutless wonder.
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:26pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Battlefield Robots that can eat dead people to fuel themselves.

https://www.redvoicemedia.com/video/2023/10/battlefield-robots-that-can-eat-dead-people-to-fuel-itself-what-could-go-wrong/?
15 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:00am
- Inandout
  
  SO, and here was me thinking Haley Joel Osment only saw dead people.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:12am
- NothingLeft
  
  I used to do martial arts at a club that had a joking moto on t-shirts of “we eat our dead”
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:45am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Biden must be stood down. America is in trouble.

https://www.redvoicemedia.com/video/2023/10/73000-potential-terrorists-have-entered-the-united-states-on-bidens-watch/?
14 3
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:02am
- All_on_Red
  
  https://babylonbee.com/news/texans-strangely-unconcerned-about-global-day-of-jihad
  
  Bonus
  ‘GAZA — Members of the terrorist organization Hamas were left frustrated after hearing many leftists in the United States and throughout the world were skeptical that Hamas had brutally massacred over 1,300 Jewish civilians after Hamas had put serious effort into livestreaming the atrocities.
  “What’s a guy have to do around here to get credit for mass murder?” asked Hamas terrorist Durka Mohammed. “We provide video after video clearly identifying our victims as helpless women and children, we film the execution, we leave the bodies out for evidence…what more do you people want from us??”
  https://babylonbee.com/news/hamas-disappointed-leftists-dont-believe-they-massacred-jews-after-they-went-to-all-the-trouble-to-livestream-it
  
  16 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:54am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Too soon.
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:06am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Is a bit.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:58pm
  - Che Guava
    
    If we are going to get into the objective facts and numbers of dead as the basis for our levels of outrage, then let’s look at some of the figures since 2008 to Sep/Aug 2023.
    
    https://www.ochaopt.org/data/casualties
    
    Fatalities:
    
    Palestinian 6,407
    Israeli 308
    
    Approx 20 x difference
    
    Injuries:
    
    Palestinian 152,560
    Israeli 6,307
    
    Approx 20 x difference
    
    2 13
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:31am
    - All_on_Red
      
      Gee Hamas look to be really shit at waging War and terror
      Oh, there’ll be even less of them by the end of this week
      Looks like they made a BIG mistake slaughtering, raping and torturing those people
      Anyway, while I have your attention
      What’s the correct speed for driving a motorcycle through Gaza while dragging homosexuals behind it?
      
      16 4
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:24am
    - kowtow
      
      No , it’s the intent that matters.
      
      Hamas terrorists were clearly intent on genocide , possibly to instigate a wider war , possibly at the behest of Iran to wreck normalisation between Israel and Saudi Arabia.
      
      Deeply evil and nothing remotely like “self defence” .
      
      Talking of intent , what’s in it for Hamas holding their own people hostage and not allowing them to escape the possible Israeli rescue operation?
      
      All these so called pro Palestine protesters should worry more about their own so called leaders than anything the israelis are ever likely to do.
      
      Hamas and other Islamic interests in the wider region are entirely responsible for what’s happening in Gaza right now.
      
      11 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:32am
      - Che Guava
        
        The facts are that the Jews are killing Muslims at a rate 2000% higher than the other way round. And that’s just since 2008. Yet the Jews are supposedly the oppressed victims? That’s a very hard argument to sustain.
        
        4 9
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:20pm
      - Lance
        
        @Che
        This bullshit came out last time terrorists fired thousands of rockets at Israel.
        The Jews need to lose people at the same rate as the terrorists or it’s not fair.
        FFS, what a piss poor argument
        
        11 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:37pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Police kill criminals at 2000% rate that criminals kill police. So we should let criminals kill more police and restrict police from killing criminals more. (BLM!! Defund police! though of course that resulted in a net increase in homicides, darn those obvious but unintended consequences)
        
        It’s a bad argument. There is no moral equivalence between the criminals and the police. One is instigating violence and the other resisting. There is no way of stopping a violently intended criminal without violence, and failure to end their threat just ensures repeated violence into the future with more and more innocent victims (as was the case with ISIS).
        
        4 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 5:40pm
    - bjools
      
      and of those….
      How many were instigated by:
      Hamas…… All of them
      Israel……. none of them.
      ie….don’t start something, you are not prepared to take the consequences for.
      I’m sure, if I punched Mike Tyson in the face….
      There may be some consequences.
      
      10 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:53am
      - Che Guava
        
        “How many were instigated by:
        Hamas…… All of them
        Israel……. none of them”
        
        I wonder what your evidence for this claim is. It doesn’t exist because it is not true. You’d have to be seriously one-eyed and completely disregard reality to accept this statement.
        
        1 10
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:31pm
    - Burtland
      
      the objective fact is Hamas want to obliterate Israel and kill the Jews. They’ve backed their words of their Covenant up by their actions in the last week. Supporting Hamas is supporting genocide – good luck negotiating a solution to this.
      
      THE COVENANT OF THE HAMAS
      
      ‘Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it.’
      
      ‘The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight Jews and kill them. Then, the Jews will hide behind rocks and trees, and the rocks and trees will cry out: ‘O Moslem, there is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him.’
      
      https://irp.fas.org/world/para/docs/880818a.htm
      https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp
      https://irp.fas.org/world/para/docs/hamas-2017.pdf
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 2:07pm
    - JimBobJoe
      
      Che… Not for the want of trying, as you well know, is Hamas body count not much, much higher.
      
      Both sides need to stop. Hamas needs to embrace peace and submit to peace.
      
      Gaza could be a Gulf State on the Med Coast if Hamas stopped its violence – as the Arab World has large wealth and could turn Gaza in to something special.
      
      BUT Hamas wont embrace Peace, Hizbollah wont embrace Peace either.
      
      Lebanon was something special – then the Palestinians turned up and screwed the country… them seems to a theme..
      
      I find your veiled antisemitic posts quite disturbing as you are obviously a highly intelligent person and have some insightful thoughts on politics and economics. Sad
      
      4 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 5:01pm
- Raphael
  
  while I don’t disagree with you, the alternative is Kamala Harris, which would be even worse.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:02am
Scooter

Will Hipkins rue the day he chose In it for You as Labour’s slogan. More like he Ruined it for Labour.
25 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:02am
- bjools
  
  Graffiti was too easy
  
  “In it for you”
  becomes
  “In sh…it for you”
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:31am
- David Garrett
  
  Scooter: Nothing could possibly be worse than Ardern’s vapid “Let’s do this”
  
  Do what?
  
  And I thought the Nats’ slogan “Choose a brighter future” in 2008 was bad enough.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:17pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Ardern ruined it for Labour. Hipkins just finished it off.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:02pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Help required!

According to Tova, Labour needs someone to ” dive back into the sands of time to excavate the precise moment that Labour lost its way and stopped working for the people.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300990290/resignations-reflection-and-recrimination–what-comes-next-for-labour

Perhaps a job for our intrepid history-buff troll, mikenmild?
34 2
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:03am
- Flossie
  
  Can I suggest possibly six weeks or so prior to the 2017 election?
  
  19 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:06am
  - hullkiwi
    
    No, it was during the era of Helen Clark. A period when Labour moved from being a party of the “cloth cap worker” to a party dominated by university arts graduates, who had bi lines in their CVs of being political activists, or union organisers.
    
    Many of Clark’s generation cut their “political teeth” in the anti-Springbok Tour marches of 1981. These people had nothing in common with the working man. The Clark govt did not know who a factory work was & they still don’t.
    
    22 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 9:49am
    - bjools
      
      They are a party, that in the 63 years of my life, have been “in power” for 24 years.
      In that time they have done only ONE good and lasting thing for the people of NZ.
      
      GST
      
      14 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:35am
      - Ian Boag
        
        Kiwisaver?
        Cullen fund?
        
        1 0
        Report
        October 24, 2023 1:54pm
    - David Garrett
      
      hull: Actually on reflection I think you are pretty well right.
      
      Mike Moore was the last Labour PM who would have actually experienced banter in the smoko room…and Clark stabbed him in the back when he damn nearly pulled off a win in 1993… Evil witch of an invert woman
      
      13 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:21pm
    - Paulus
      
      Helen Clark, Margaret Wilson, and Judith Tizard decided that to achieve their brand of Socialism was to break up the family unit, and they did via the welfare State, and Ardern continued it to her Marxist ways, saw what she wanted and ran away leaving her little people to get stuffed, along with New Zealand on the way.
      
      8 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 2:27pm
- Vinicius
  
  In the 5 stages of grief, they’re in denial, cannot figure out why they’ve been dumped and who they’ve hurt.
  
  The fun will start when the anger phase kicks in and the various fractions of the Labour Party start sharpening their knives.
  
  26 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:08am
- ecco
  
  -dive back into the sands of time- is truly cringeworthy wording by a supposed journalist.
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:13am
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  And maybe Tova could do some similar historical analysis to try to work out why she didn’t notice
  
  27 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:19am
- Kiwiguy
  
  If Labour really need to do a deep dive to find out why they lost their way, then it shows how out of touch and blind they are.
  It was blindingly obvious to most of the population.
  It shows that they’re still clinging to their failed ideals and can’t understand why the population didn’t agree with them.
  
  26 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:19am
- 7kiwi11
  
  It stopped working for the people and started on it’s on self interests and agendas around 17th September 2017.
  
  21 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:23am
- crikey
  
  Maggie: It might be better to identify when did Labour start working for the people. If it means working for the people collectively, remembering Ardern’s comment to ‘work for all New Zealanders’, the answer is Never.
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:23am
- RoboRob
  
  I think Tova might be offering to help. After all her time at Stuff is limited and she has future Labour leader written all over her.
  
  The problem is, how can she help them when she claims to have been stunned that Labour lost. Perhaps a year or two out of Wellington doing actual work, rather then interviewing her type writer, would help.
  
  Oh and Tova when I said actual work I didn’t mean with the Unions.
  
  23 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:28am
  - ecco
    
    Wouldn’t have a sh*t show of being made Labour leader, she’s damaged goods by association with Cindy.
    
    0 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:30pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Look at the photo that accompanies the piece. sums up labours problem.
  No-one other than white middle class lanyard wearers.
  You can say whatever you like about national but in auckland at least they have embraced diversity in the city. The names Rima Nakhle, Carlos Cheung, Paulo Garcia, Melissa Lee all spring to mind.
  Simon wilson, yes i read his column, makes the same point.
  
  18 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:37am
- David Garrett
  
  Jesus Mags…if Mikey/milken/milkenmild again is the answer then, as the saying goes, it must have been a bloody silly question.
  
  FFS don’t wake him up. This blog is much the better without him.
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:40am
- plc
  
  Tova, to quote Dwayne Johnson:
  
  “IT DOESN’T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK”
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:58am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Sssssshhhh! We don’t want him back here.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:04pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

Chippie said “it couldn’t be done” 🙁

Yet within THE FIRST 48 of becoming Prime Minister, Christopher has pulled-off what Labour was unable to do in six years…..

Secured a FTD with India!

https://twitter.com/BhavDhillonnz/status/1713786477631680603
24 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:08am
Tauhei Notts

Kiri Lyndsay Allan.
Just two weeks after her driving mishap she had a Takapuna man set up a company specialising in business consultant service. The company’s address was at Plummer’s Point, a small settlement between Katikati and Tauranga. That was unusual as Kiri is the sole shareholder and sole director and she lives in Gisborne. The company is KLA Limited.
25 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:11am
- Inandout
  
  TN, I wonder why Project Natives Ltd was removed from the companies register?
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:22am
- Im Right
  
  I suspect the maori party and the greens will throw tax payer cash into her new venture, be interesting to see her end of year tax returns and see how much was thrown her way for probably easy or non difficult work by the 2 parties, hell Labour probably a good few thousand also.
  A rort!
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:23am
- Nickc2
  
  Over-inflated egos never sleep!
  What’s the bet she’ll be back supporting some Alphabet People’s Cause and/or Maori Charity rort?
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:24am
- Ian Boag
  
  So what?
  
  Is there something evil and/or devious going on here?
  
  4 12
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:24am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Assume she’s still pulling in her ministerial salary?
  
  And as a bestie said…..”Who’s going to break it to her that providing ‘consultancy services’ to Labor just got a whole lot less lucrative”.
  
  25 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:34am
- All_on_Red
  
  Its not unusual in that the Companies Registered Office is at her Accountants in Whakatane
  Her address is listed as being in Gisborne
  https://app.companiesoffice.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/8850888?backurl=H4sIAAAAAAAAAC2LMQoDMQwEf%2BMmxb1AhKtSxEUg%2BcBiicRwlh1LDtzvzxzpdobZpeEttqRaGjTPZYKePtdSWcgcyugcfG9Cop59JuFL97hetlyyCwfwD5qEH1DZyPuQcJb7a56M1hj%2F%2FHT4sFuvo536ANtBp9d7AAAA
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:00am
- David Garrett
  
  Tauhei: Nothing unusual or sinister there mate. As others have said “Plummers Point” is apparently where her accountant lives…clearly a very sensible chap; it’s a lovely bit of coast down there. A company can have its registered office anywhere it likes, so long as that address is accessible to the public.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:45am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    David, what I could have added is that the company’s address seems to have been hurriedly set up as Plummers Point, before she engaged a Whakatane accountancy firm, four weeks later. Plummers Point is quite some distance from her home in Gisborne.
    Weird.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:51pm
- Paulus
  
  Surely this is not Kirimate Allen, former Maori accident car driver ?
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:30pm
JohnRidd

How many people here have seen Elon Musk’s tweet that his pronouns are Prosecute/Fauci?

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1601894132573605888?lang=en

For those that do not know, there are a lot of people who believe the “Lab Leak” theory is the most likely explanation for the origin of the pandemic virus and that Fauci’s funding of the gain of function research at the Wuhan Institute of Virology means Fauci has some questions to answer.
No mention of this in the recent Newshub story.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2023/10/dr-anthony-fauci-who-led-us-fight-against-covid-19-faces-threats-from-right-wing-extremists.html
17 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:14am
- NothingLeft
  
  Rand Paul is gunning hard for Fauci. Claims he has evidence of perjury, Wuhan institute of virology coverup, and deliberate malfeasance in avoiding safety protocols to fund work that created covid.
  
  https://youtu.be/C7vZiXxM_QM
  
  18 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:55am
ecco

I see the NZH is already attacking Luxon and the Nats with unflattering photos of him. Never once saw this happen with Ardern and her grin.

NZH are entering shaky territory if they continue to do this. Hope the centre right clobber that media bribe machine that Ardern & co set up to control the media narrative in one direction.
39 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:15am
- kowtow
  
  The tv1 self described “news” last night ran a piece with footage playing on the idea of the new Nat MPs being lost on the grounds of parliament .
  
  A very silly and juvenile item.
  
  The same media were very slow on the uptake when the Ingrid Leary Labour MP for Taieri turned up at an organised crime meeting and then claimed she thought she was at an election promotion event .
  
  ( She retained her seat )
  
  22 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:08am
  - rouppe
    
    Surprisingly on the news last night, they showed an exiting Labour MP (who I’ve never heard of) lamenting that the biggest thing for them was that they’d lost their Koru Club membership
    
    14 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:00am
    - nova
      
      Ironically the parliament website is now returning a 404 for Dan, so not only has he lost his Koru membership, he has now been erased from parliament, never to be spoken of again:
      
      https://www.parliament.nz/en/mps-and-electorates/members-of-parliament/rosewarne-dan/
      
      (Surely it would make sense to keep these pages around and update them to reflect they were no longer an MP as of a certain date, than remove them entirely??)
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 2:10pm
- Miritu
  
  I see many Kiwi-bloggers still wasting their precious time consuming NZH and other legacy media
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:01pm
  - ecco
    
    Joyce, Prebble and Cotterill write decent articles that are behind the paywall.
    Also quite fun to have a go at the outgoing Labour government when the Nzh do decide to open up commenting. Or else even just send a comment to the Nzh editor to tell him what an idiot he is.
    
    I just tell them I’m going to cancel it and get a deep discount every time. Although I’ve subscribed to the platform lately which is really entertaining since Plunket and Laws are unrestrained there!
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:38pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Nice people really:

https://therightwingclub.com/americanpatriotclub/hamas-using-social-media-to-make-murders-very-personal/?utm_placement=americanpatriotclub
11 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:20am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

NZ is famous overseas.
DPF gets a mention:

Comments from conservatives on their victory were likely reflective of the massive swing to the right, with experienced conservative polling expert David Farrar describing it as a “bloodbath” for the liberals.

https://feedsnorth.com/house-of-cards-another-country-joins-the-push-ditched-their-liberal-party/
15 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:32am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

More from the nice people.

https://feedsnorth.com/watch-doctor-gives-first-hand-account-of-hamas-carnage-at-music-festival/
8 2
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:38am
- crikey
  
  SO: I would never call Labour ‘liberals’ (or any others of the left mob), and I don’t think true liberals would either.
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:26pm
hullkiwi

Interesting stats out of the election and a hint to what the polls are missing.

The count on Sat was National 39%+, but in Auck the National party vote was over 45%. And despite losing Ak Central to the Greens, National exceeded thel Green Party vote. In Wellington the situation was reversed.

Therefore:
1. Polls in modern NZ & the MMP environment don’t work unless they are area specific; and
2. The incoming govt will need strategies to both work with the Wgtn bureaucracy (which is left leaning & will be hostile to the new govt) and to work around it in order to achieve its policy objectives.
21 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 9:38am
- NothingLeft
  
  strategies to both work with the Wgtn bureaucracy
  
  I suggest firing most of them and encouraging them to go work in private sector or emigrate and find jobs where they actually have to produce value to an employer. Either of which would be formative lessons in the nature of reality to the far left nut jobs that infest govt sector in Wellington.
  
  25 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:58am
  - Matt Long
    
    What Wellington needs is a gigantic does of salts, starting with the State Services Commisioner, then anyone who has pronouns in their bio.
    
    19 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:10am
    - Paulus
      
      Current SS Commissioner is retiring early I hear and his lady replacement is already within the Wellington System arranged by Labour of course before they got the boot.
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 2:34pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    How about new rule: Can’t work in public sector until you have spent a minimum period of a few years working in private sector. That would fix much that is wrong with public sector.
    
    16 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:29am
    - cmm
      
      PS: after school work in a chip shop doesn’t count.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:33pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I have worked with those useless people. Quick chat with the boss – he goes or I go. Reason? Safety. Idiot in an Engineering Workshop, dangerous. I have no idea why he was employed.
      So what I am saying is people are in the Public sector because they are un-employable in the Private Sector.
      
      5 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:14pm
    - Colville
      
      NL.
      Pretty silly.
      Public sector picks up the slack on a lot of training of new grads at reasonable pay, dont do that and a lot (more) grads will piss off to Oz.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:26pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Frequently low accountablity and productivity in the public sector culture is a terrible finishing school for graduates – setting them up for life-long bad entitled beliefs that will make them less successful in the long term. We’d be doing them a favor to have them work elsewhere for a while.
        
        The grads that piss off overseas because they couldn’t get jobs in civil service are perhaps exactly the sort of people we don’t want in the civil service.
        
        5 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 2:35pm
    - info@cruzpro.com
      
      I’ve worked in both the public and the private sectors. There were good hard working employees in both and some so bad you were better off paying them to stay home.
      
      The difference was that the bad employees don’t get fired in the public sector whereas the private sector figures out how to get rid of them.
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:34pm
  - Dudley Quaffquaff
    
    Here’s the problem that policy advisers everywhere and always have: doing their job properly can and often does require them to tell Ministers something that they’re not going to like. Ministers always say that they want frank and honest advice “without fear or favour”, but in practice they don’t really want to hear about the potential downsides of their ideas; and they most certainly don’t want the public and the Opposition being told about them. That’s why a look at regulatory impact statements will show that in many cases the analysis in them has simply been back-engineered to deliver a conclusion in favour of the policy choice that the Minister wanted in the first place. Various mechanisms have been tried both here and in other countries to shift the incentives on both civil servants and Ministers in giving and receiving advice, but it’s difficult to see what might actually work when Ministers are faced with the daily reality that the media and the voters like shiny new things that don’t impose any cost except on other people, and they’re not interested in the persistent hard slog that’s needed for long term outcomes.
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 10:32am
    - rouppe
      
      The children of a neighbour of mine became policy advisors in MSD.
      
      They went from school to uni to policy advisors. What do they know about anything?
      
      19 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 10:58am
      - David Garrett
        
        rouppe: Quite so. Many of the guys/girls I was at uni with – the vast majority of whom were, unlike me, straight out of school – went on to become “policy analysts” of various kinds.
        
        One of the females I kept in touch with for a while post graduation used to carry a teddy bear around with her all weekend…so Tremain’s caricatures of Hipkins was perhaps closer to the bone than most would think.
        
        10 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:26pm
    - Miritu
      
      Interesting observation DQ. The only solution is to remove the state from so many areas of our lives, and allow the market (and thus individuals) to function unhindered.
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 12:23pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        In the engineering field compliance is beyond ridiculous. Some regulators are in the business of putting small businesses out of business – and the pricks enjoy it!
        
        8 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 1:19pm
  - Paulus
    
    No make them all Redundant and that they must reapply for their Reorganised jobs and Departments.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 2:32pm
greybeard

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/new-ambassador-spain-0
I think this may be the reason Mahuta was in Spain recently: the new ambassador was due to start a couple of months ago.
Obviously this was a golden opportunity for Mahuta to get in a little sightseeing and a lot of freebies before her inevitable political demise.
18 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:05am
- david
  
  Along those lines and a propos of nothing at all, how long do Phil Goff, Trevor Mallard and Annette King have before Crown Removals will be called?
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:27pm
Matt Long

I think it’s generally agreed that no one will touch the Maori seats at present, however JT isn’t stupid, nor are Maori voters, how do people feel about an overhang of up to seven seats in the future?
In most Maori seats the party vote for Labour significantly exceeded the Electorate vote.
12 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:07am
- kowtow
  
  The Maori seats are particularly un democratic.
  
  Created in a long gone era of the property franchise .Under a FPP system at that.
  
  We now have MMP and a universal franchise .
  
  Another aspect is how the winning MP in those seats can be elected on a relatively small turnout ( compared to general seats) and how under MMP they get two bites by getting in a radical race exponent ( maori Party , electorate) and then voting heavily for Labour on the party list.
  
  This is a win win for a very select small section of the electorate and a lose lose for the majority .
  
  That is hardly “democratic”.
  
  Voting rights must not be based on race characteristics in a modern liberal democracy .
  
  17 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:16am
  - thirteenstars
    
    No, they shouldn’t, but when Luxon calls something as doable as a referendum on Treaty principles “divisive” you know the Maori seats aren’t going anywhere under his watch.
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:30am
    - Ghost
      
      The Maori seats should only be up to Maori to get rid off. If there was a Maori only referendum to keep or get rid of them I believe enough Maori would vote to get rid of them.
      
      3 10
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 11:48am
      - David Garrett
        
        Ghost: I don’t agree that the majority of Maori voting today would get rid of them. Look at the massive majority that tattooed idiot Waititi got. The man is as thick as a sackful of hammers, but that apparently didn’t matter at all.
        
        Remember most Maori voters are under 40 – probably even under 35 – and they have been endlessly told throughout their lives that all their people’s problems are our fault.
        
        16 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:29pm
      - kowtow
        
        Our democracy is not based on the notion that only sectional interests get to make constitutional decisions .
        
        That is utterly ridiculous.
        
        ps It would have been the colonial white oppressor MPs in parliament who created the seats in 1867 .
        
        It is presumably the right of a parliamentary simple majority to abolish them.
        
        Afterall the RC into MMP recommended abolishment , so I can’t see why this is so controversial.
        
        12 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:46pm
      - Ghost
        
        David, if you look at the numbers most Maori aren’t on the Maori roll.
        
        It’s the only real to get rid of the seats, if it is done without Maori voting we can expect hell from the radical side of maori
        
        8 2
        Report
        October 17, 2023 12:52pm
  - BeaB
    
    Why not just leave them as is? It is an effective bulwark against demands for greater governing powers. The success of those seats and the Māori winning general seats shows they have a voice and can use it.
    
    4 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 12:35pm
    - thirteenstars
      
      Because it hasn’t had the effect you claim.
      
      The Maori seats have existed since the 19th century yet the Treaty grievance industry has grown apace as have demands for race-based representation on local councils, and many have already implemented it.
      
      And none of that has slowed the demands for co-governance across all areas of government.
      
      You can’t appease a race-based mentality because it’s fundamentally corrupt and will continue to make demands.
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:29pm
- ecco
  
  Hope Tamihere gets his Waipareira Trust payments slashed very soon.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:43pm
wsk12345

Good article on The Free Press (Bari Weiss’ site)

https://open.substack.com/pub/bariweiss/p/can-the-donor-revolt-save-american-universities?r=z5cij&utm_medium=ios&utm_campaign=post

The gist is that donors are finally saying Enough of the woke shit. Celebrating Hamas was the final straw and donors are withdrawing funding in which colleges depend. And withdrawing job offers to student signatories to statements supporting Hamas.
14 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:08am
Ian Boag

Two die-in-the ditch issues for Winston

Super age stays at 65.

Given that the Nats want to increase it to 67 in 20 years (!) time, this one can probably be fudged.

the foreign house buyer thing

Might be a bit harder to fudge.
8 3
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:14am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Yet another person making the mistakes of associating Peters’ actions with his words.
  
  Based on his previous actions not words, there will be one ‘die-in-the-ditch’ issue for them and it will be a Ministerial appointment for Peters that is prestigious but does not require him to do much actual work.
  
  20 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:54am
  - Ian Boag
    
    I would guess that “no CGT” and “PGF” were die in the ditch issues last time …
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:12am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Winston First’s 2017 bottom line was to have a referendum on Maori seats. But then he demonstrated for the nth time that he is a liar.
    
    6 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 3:28pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      Dunno if it was a “bottom line” or an aspiration. Politics – coalition formation – involves horse trading.
      
      Obviously the Maori seat thing was not a die in the ditch issue. 9 years of Key govt had not seen it going anyplace and it had not been a Labout policy. So why hang it on Winston other than you loath him? I don’t much like him myself, but noone else on either side seemed to want it ….
      
      Do I take it that you voted for him and are disappointed? 🙂
      
      1 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 6:57pm
Durden

Winston Peters is the perfect person to lead to completion the Electoral Act Review process that is currently underway. This should also include an review and update of Electoral Commission functions and powers, elections management process and regulations.

He will have to work with all parties. He can deliver a long lasting legacy.

Perfect qualifications in that he is pMaori*, a lawyer, NZ’s most experienced statesman/politician, has a very clear and correct idea of equality and, one standard for all.

Key things he can sort out:
– Parliamentary Term
– Voting Age
– pMaori Electorates and pMaori Roll unfairness**
– MMP rules– e.g. Party with majority must be in government, party vote threshold, parliament size etc..
– Suitability of overseas voting eligibility rules
– Unfair gaming advantage from being able to change between General and pMaori Roll

Elections processes and Fraud.
– Address current inability to provide completet forensic proof with data and reports showing that only eligible people voted, voted only once, did not impersonate some one to vote or to enrol on behalf of someone without their knowledge – vote harvesting

– Formal verification of ID, residential status instead of hiding behind the fact that “we have a trust based system using statutory declarations”

Oh…and if he can legislate a None Of The Above option for local body elections.

* “pMaori” – Is a common noun for part Maori. The small “p” reflects the component of Maori heritage in the majority pMaori. In pronunciation, the “p” is silent.

** pMaori have won 25% of seats in Election 2023
a) https://www.stuff.co.nz/sunday-star-times/features/decision-08/657690/Douglas-Graham-A-very-peculiar-practice

b) https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/government-to-introduce-changes-to-racist-maori-electoral-voting-laws-national-vows-to-block-it/EG3RQG67TWCRLK6RKXWVCMXTR4/

c) https://www.thepost.co.nz/a/nz-news/350092308/maori-electorates-masterclass-strategic-voting-electors-split-vote
10 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:22am
- rouppe
  
  That’s what I would advocate for: Bring him in to focus on 1 or 2 things that he’s hot on. It takes the heat off Luxon and National, and has him and his MP’s busy helping the government, not hindering it.
  
  Same with ACT
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:52am
  - thirteenstars
    
    This is what many of us have advocated for some time.
    
    ACT have a couple of bottom lines. Let them have at it. Let them do the hard yards. Let them prove themselves. Same with NZF.
    
    The difficulty for Luxon and the Nats is understanding that in a coalition it’s all for one and one for all. It’s simply untenable to have part of your coalition advocating for a policy and actually implementing it while another part makes it clear they are not onboard with it, yet are obligated to vote for it because they have a coalition agreement.
    
    Tricky time ahead for those who want to duck and dive, unwillingly to stand up for what’s right lest they be bullied by the media and threatened with civil unrest.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 11:26am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      No need to be bullied by the media. Do it Trump style, “YOU ARE FAKE NEWS” then ignore them. They are not going to give National any favours, so just ignore them.
      
      5 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:27pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Peters is useless for anything that requires more than 15minutes of surly haranguing a day. Certainly nothing that requires reading or remembering details.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:03pm
  - Keith White
    
    Accuracy, demonstrated.
    Well done that man.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:39pm
Maggie Pie

It’s amazing the effect Labors annihilation at the polls has already had on some people. One of the girls from tennis was saying she no longer feels any guilt about telling someone to “go fuck yourself” again.
Actually finds it quite liberating.
20 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:29am
- mogg
  
  Only in the best possible taste of course.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:18pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Exactly! As my gran used to say…”It’s not what you say. It’s HOW you say it”
    
    3 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 2:15pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

US Army wants to cut down the Green Berets to save money.
”
This will gravely compromise our national security and send the wrong signals to both our foreign allies and adversaries.”
What is it with the woke and wanting to make the Nation weaker?
Meanwhile soldiers want to transition to soldierettes, and the Military will pay for it. (may not be happening now, but it was.)
https://buzzbombmedia.com/2023/10/16/pentagon-wants-to-slash-thousands-of-positions-from-special-operations-to-save-money/?
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 10:54am
thirteenstars

Spiegel International:

“Güner Balci is the integration commissioner for the Neukölln district of Berlin. In an interview, she speaks about widespread hatred of Israel in her neighborhood and the failures of German political leaders to combat anti-Semitism.”

https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/muslim-anti-semitism-in-berlin-wide-swaths-of-arab-speaking-population-harbor-sympathies-for-terrorists-a-f7c73040-7be1-4509-9150-810266818f49

Balci: I would not advise anybody to make their Jewish faith visible in Neukölln. Those who wear the kippa already faced the prospect of being spat on or insulted in quieter times. As a sign of solidarity, we have raised an Israeli flag in front of the Neukölln City Hall – and have done so under police protection just to be on the safe side. Isn’t it sick that such things have become normal in Germany?

Perhaps “have become normal” should be, have become normal again.
9 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 11:17am
Terry Dalee

“Hipkins on his new relationship
Hipkins confirmed his partner Toni is ‘Toni with an I’ and they are in fact a woman.

“It’s not an easy job in which to have a new relationship, and I made that decision to not have it public until after the election.”

He said the couple had discussed his public message of thanks to her on election night, and that they were old friends who had reconnected earlier this year.” – NZ Herald

I don’t know..
This is from the Hipkins that could not answer, “What is a woman?”

https://youtu.be/PnSB5uT65aM?si=Yp5_AicWGlW5faJq

Are you sure she is a woman?
22 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 11:26am
- H. Upmann
  
  I am sure he has checked the plumbing….
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:13pm
- lifesgood
  
  And then he left his wife and young children. I have no respect.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:51pm
- John Loveridge
  
  I came here to ask the same question. Is Chippy sure? He seems to have trouble differentiating.
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 7:42pm
Its only I

Maybe it’s just me but doesn’t it feel like an oppressive weight has been lifted off us all?

A long six year blizzard has ended and the sun is out.

Optimism returns when Labour are dismissed.
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 11:37am
- Drone
  
  Wait till Nicola opens the books and reads the first page..//
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 11:56am
- krazykiwi
  
  Yes to the sun. Labour HQ’s party was still a smoldering pile of tear & chardonnay soaked ash when the All Blacks won their quarterfinal.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:02pm
Maggie Pie

When this clip popped up on the TVNews last nite,
first thing my partner said was… “who’s this koont”?

Turns out he’s yet another dumped Labor MP
that we’ve all been donating to for the last 3 years!

https://twitter.com/AgentSmith_NZ/status/1713826703905313154

Goes by the name of Daniel Rosewarne, from Chch.
Never even heard of him.
11 3
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 11:52am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Him “Champagne to Lemonade”. Tinetti “Its like a weight lifted of my shoulders”.
  Clearly they are not fit for purpose.
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:09pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  ‘My life as a Koont’
  
  https://nzonscreen.com/title/edwin-my-life-as-a-koont-2013/awards
  
  😀 😀 😀 😀 😀
  
  9 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:09pm
- H. Upmann
  
  Can you imagine if EVER Hipkins, Robertson or even the Evil Witch, anyone, said “We should get Dan Rosewarne onto it; he would be good at that”?
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:42pm
- Sarkozygroupie
  
  I think he came on the list when Mallard went off to Ireland.
  
  I expect Mallard has started packing up his abode ready for the return trip shortly.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:54pm
- John Loveridge
  
  I live in Christchurch and I’d never heard of him. But then I don’t spend much time in the Koru lounge.
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 7:43pm
BeaB

Hipkins says he wants to stay on. Of course he does. His parliamentary salary is far more than he’d earn anywhere else. Of course the caucus may dump him. And should.
The media is already scrutinising the minutiae of National policies.
Just as they did with Labour. Ha ha.
I hope Luxon stops repeating the same answer over and over again and learns to answer once and then move on, or bring the questions to a close. Just as Labour always did and the media lapped it up.
21 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 12:19pm
- Clyde
  
  You are right BeaB. Hipkins has no other options apart from politics and he will always have a Liemore base in the Hutt to support him. Even if his teddy bear stood, it would get in. So he can rest easy knowing he doesn’t have to do anything for the rest of his “working” life to be on the taxpayer teat with a cushy retirement already sorted. In terms of transferable skills, he is unlike the detestable Ardern, who has an established base in the socialist network of Universities around the world and through her commie mate, Helen, an in within the useless UN. Bet you Hipkins is now realising just how much he was played for a fool by her of the “kind” Ardern.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:49pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Prior to Being second or third worst PM in NZ History (after Ardern and arguably Geoffrey Palmer), Hipkins was the worst education minister in NZ’s history – degrading educational outcomes to an historically low level.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:07pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Hopefully Luxon will improve his dealing with the media. John Key was a tad wobbly, but stronger that Luxon, from the outset. Key went on to get much, much stronger. His style was to minimise and downplay anything extreme or urgent and this worked very well. Gave a ‘safe pair of hands’ feeling to following the toxicity of Clark. Luxon would do well to emulate Key in this regard.
  
  6 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:30pm
  - Gravelroad
    
    That woman on Seven Sharp, along with her side kick Jeremee, tried very hard to make Luxon look lame last night. They gave him a cake and then tried to make him look more foolish by getting him to discuss various necktie knot options.
    By the smirk on the face of Hilary Barry, it was a deliberate attempt to undermine.
    I’m not sure if Mr Luxon picked it. He grinned and played along, but will need to be more aware of potential media ridiculing tactics next time.
    
    5 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 2:29pm
    - John Loveridge
      
      Hilary Barry is a sanctimonious imbecile. If you watch her again we’ll make you write lines, Gravelroad.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 7:46pm
    - Colville
      
      Luxon needs a handler by his side 24/7 and one that the media know not to fuck with.
      
      Poke the bear and you lose access to the big guy.
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 8:23pm
- Keith White
  
  Troughers gotta trough.
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:41pm
Ghost

Andrew little has retired from politics
16 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 12:43pm
- rouppe
  
  The first rat to run from the sinking ship
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:44pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  Little retired the day he was elected.
  
  18 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:49pm
- krazykiwi
  
  So good.
  
  And we can probably expect DPF’s grace-filled eulogies to start any day now 🙂
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:17pm
- Flossie
  
  Good
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:19pm
- Observant Octagenarian
  
  So his resignation now suggests he actually thought Labour was going to be re-elected and he would still be a minister.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:40pm
- Matt Long
  
  Yet when I asked him a few days ago if he was back to the Unions or looking for a SOE board position after the election he didn’t answer, maybe his applications hadn’t come back yet.
  New Mayor of New Plymouth?
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:51pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Not likely. New Plymouth has already rejected him twice.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:54pm
- Ghost
  
  Adults thinking they are cool should resort from posting such stupid photos to announce their retirement from destroying the health system
  
  https://twitter.com/AndrewLittleMP/status/1714083137704378695?
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 3:00pm
- Rumblestrip
  
  Wonderful, wonderful news.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 4:15pm
- JimBobJoe
  
  Never won an electorate seat – reject multiple times
  
  Never won a General Election as Leader – rejected in the polls so badly, that Labour organised a coup and installed J. Ardern…
  
  Thankfully failed in his push to establish Guilty till proven Innocent for sex charges
  
  Failed to protect his Union members when head of the Engineers Union… Pike River Mine was all good according to him…. and this lead to his waste of countless dollars with the Pike River Mine re-entry project..
  
  Thankfully he is gone, but i suppose he has made his pile of cash and has a great pension lined up . Doubtless will get some cushie Union related or NGO related job….
  
  Good riddance to bad Rubbish
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 5:05pm
BeaB

First rat off sinking ship: Andrew Little
15 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 12:45pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Anyone going to miss him?

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/500377/senior-labour-mp-andrew-little-announces-he-will-retire-from-politics
11 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 12:48pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  Running before the Health reform enquiry starts…..
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:50pm
- slightlyrighty
  
  He won’t be the last….
  
  I’d expect Grant Robertson to be weighing his options, and Ayesha Verrell as well, possibly David Parker. I would have thought Rino Tirakatene might move on because of his age, but then I found out he’s only 51!
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:24pm
- Clyde
  
  Short answer “NO”. Dolittle was a thoroughly nasty piece of work raised entirely in the far left side of the tracks. NZ politics is better off with his leaving and my only regret is that he was there in the first place. Another thing to thank the CTU for I guess.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:33pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Angry Andy chucked it in rather than be in opposition. Good riddance to the obnoxious prick.
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:53pm
- crikey
  
  Miss who?
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:38pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Even his mum wouldn’t vote for him.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 3:30pm
Maggy Wassilieff

For Maggie pie:

Was this Andrew Little’s finest moment?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CrkhZD_VMAERh6n?format=jpg&name=900×900
12 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 12:51pm
- lifesgood
  
  Repulsive. Mind bleach required.
  
  9 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 12:57pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  LOL!! His missus looks happy 😛
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:05pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    That isn’t Mr Littles wife.
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:13pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Are you sure of that…..it’s not Toni is it?
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 1:20pm
- Flossie
  
  That is gross!
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:18pm
kowtow

NZME reporting Damian O’Connor told the parliamentary press gaggle to “fuck off” when asked was Hipkins staying on.
13 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:01pm
- krazykiwi
  
  “fuck off … I’m busy sharpening my knife” was what he held back from saying.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:14pm
  - Matt Long
    
    I imagine Damien is sharpening his CV for Landcorp chair, oops I mean Pamu.
    Meanwhile it’s about time our woke for broke SOE went under the hammer. Dire financial performance should see it on the market or broken up for treaty settlements in the first 90 days.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 1:48pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Landcorp does in part administer land that’s been earmarked for Treaty Settlements
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 7:33pm
- Vinicius
  
  Imagine the media storm if someone from National or Act said that……
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:28pm
- Clyde
  
  Another display of “kindness” from the fwit O’Connor.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:37pm
- Sarkozygroupie
  
  Here’s the video;
  
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/video.html
  
  The looks on Jenna Lynch’s and Jessica Mutch McKay’s faces are priceless. Perhaps they’ve just realised the Labour Party played them for fools and now they’ve lost power Labour has no use for the media useful idiots anymore.
  
  Damien O’Connor was just showing his true colours – now the world can see for itself.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:48pm
  - Gravelroad
    
    Oh dear, how absolutely dreadful – and after all the help and support Jessica-then-Tova and Jenna have so freely given to the Labour Party and their ministers over the past 6 years.
    You’ve been played, girls.
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 3:13pm
- rouppe
  
  I’ve been advocating for some National or Act leaders to do that for awhile now.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:51pm
lifesgood

Couldn’t sleep last night so turned ZB on. That idiot Roman Travers was beside himself when someone rang in saying they were opposed to the fact that NZers were basically forced to take the vaccine. Travers was incredibly rude to said caller, virtually called him an idiot and was to all intents and purposes dancing around the studio with his fingers in his ears going la, la, la. What a moron. I got the impression that Travers kind of knew the caller was right but couldn’t bear to think he’d been sucked in. Hey, ZB, sharpen up your act, get someone sensible on.
16 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:06pm
- Clyde
  
  I accidentally heard this idiot Travers once and wondered why he was employed. Anyone called Roman that insists on his name being pronounced roMAN is on a losing streak anyway, but he truly is a moron. ZB have some talented people – but this coot is not one of them.
  
  17 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:36pm
  - greybeard
    
    He always sounds as if he was 12 years old.
    
    2 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 5:23pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  YIP! Him, and that woke leftard Tim Roxbruh, would be the worst EVER so-called ‘talkback hosts’ on ZB!
  Neither do any research for their talkback shows, and unless callers crawl up their bums they simply get cut-off with a… “thanks for your call” (unless they happen to be Maori)
  
  Hearing either of them is an immediate turn-off.
  They both make my flesh crawl 🙁
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:50pm
- Colville
  
  night time jocks basically work for free to learn the trade… give the poor prick a break.
  When he is a net taxpayer he will grow some hair on his balls and have an opinion.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:29pm
Maggie Pie

JUST RELEASED

Heartbreaking stuff from the Daily Mail as they post Hamas hostage vid 🙁

To think it could be any of our daughters in this frightening position….

https://mol.im/a/12637737
11 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:24pm
- Matt Long
  
  And here are Harvard students who support the terrorist atrocities.
  https://x.com/ChayaRaichik10/status/1714063738016329857?s=20
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:44pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    Job offers being pulled left right and centre. Donors to foundations that fund Universities are closing their wallets.
    There are always consequences…
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 4:32pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Is that Che we see in there?
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 4:34pm
mogg

Hipkins has to go, he has been pushing policies which the vast majority of NZ doesn’t want, that includes most labour voters.
Their next leader will be the fat man, it will give him
something to do between meals.
10 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:32pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Chippie ain’t goin’ anywhere!
  
  He’s already left his poor wife and kids for a new bird….and thats not cheep.
  Where else is he going to get a job where taxpayers are donating him 300k a year to do SFA?
  
  19 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 1:56pm
  - mogg
    
    He will be in an impossible position, he now represents everything that the vast silent majority have voted against. He has only just discovered ‘bread and butter’ issues in time for the election. His real hidden agenda has been voted down, but the damage done and division caused will still be there.
    He has tried to poison young people against traditional NZ values purely out of his own political self interest. I hope that he does try to hang on so that he can be given the well deserved knife in the back. I do completely accept your view that he is a trougher, and only being PM for 9 months comes with no benefits. The down tick was a mistake.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 3:01pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Waddya mean the downtick was a ‘mistake’?
      Try and be a bit more careful next time moggsie.
      
      SHEESH!
      
      7 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 3:43pm
      - mogg
        
        Please refer back to your comment about what the girls a tennis are now saying!
        
        3 0
        Report
        October 17, 2023 4:54pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        It not wot you say – but how you say it 😀
        
        5 1
        Report
        October 17, 2023 5:33pm
- rouppe
  
  It would be pretty shitty if he left Parliament. He’s won an electorate seat, so leaving Parliament triggers a bye-election.
  
  Might get rolled as leader, but he should stay in Parliament.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:44pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Yep. He can stay in Parliament and take his lumps.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 7:36pm
    - Colville
      
      on a back benchers salary? no fugging way!
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 8:36pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Don Brash, from Hobson’s Choice (emailed)

As this new Government is formed and coalition talks progress, National must prioritise:

1)Delivery of health services on the basis of need, not race.
2)Dismantling of the Maori Health Authority.
3)Removing of co-governance.
4)Protecting the name of our country: New Zealand.
5)Rewriting the ahistorical history curriculum for schools.
6)Returning to use of English in public service, road signage etc.
7)Resolving the increasing conflict around the role of tikanga in law.
8)Re-establishing the right of ratepayers to decide whether to have Maori wards
I know that there needs to be a pause while the incoming Government sets the wheels in motion, but we shouldn’t allow ourselves to get distracted or complacent.
20 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:38pm
- rouppe
  
  Give 1, 2 and 7 to NZ First to do
  
  Give 5 and 6 to ACT to do
  
  National do 3, 4, 7, 8, and set the expected outcomes for the others.
  
  That is how you do coalition.
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:42pm
Hugh Jarse

Watching Damian O’Connors performance to the media this morning as he left the caucus room for a slash, I would say the Labour caucus is a bit testy. The forensic cleaning team might be needed to mop up all the blood and body parts.
17 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 1:46pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  The good news is that for a man of Damien’s age it did not take him long to have a leak.
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 2:14pm
Maggie Pie

Can’t see this project being finished before 2027 either …
and with a likely budget-blowout in the millions.

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1714052617607807276
6 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 3:07pm
David Garrett

I am delighted to read that Andrew Little is retiring as an MP, and is likely off back to his brothers in the unions.

He often described the three strikes law as “silly”, but to the best of my knowledge never explained – and was probably never asked to explain – just what he meant by that.

During its 10 years in force, there were about 5,500 first strikers, 475 second, and less than 30 third. That, even to blind Freddie – but obviously not to Little – is an example of what is called specific deterrence, i.e. deterrence of a specific type or class of offender, in this case strike offenders.

Among those 6000 odd convictions TWO gave rise to what I can agree were unjust outcomes: seven year sentences without parole for two low level indecent assault offenders who can’t control themselves. 6000:2 – I wouldn’t call that remotely silly.
14 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 3:16pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  Little had little ability to expalin anything in even the littlest detail…..never did, never has, never will. He is a little man stuck in a big mans world.
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 3:43pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  He’s returning to lawyering
  
  Andrew Little expects to return to the law.
  
  https://www.labour.org.nz/release_andrew_little_to_retire_from_politics#:~:text=Andrew%20Little%20expects%20to%20return,Party%20List%20will%20be%20elected.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 4:27pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    Thats a joke.
    Andrew is pulling our legs.
    He wouldnt survivc in the real world. The first hurdle is getting a practicing certificate. Becasue he hasn’t had a practicing certificate for over 10 years he will have to convince the powers that be that he has what it takes.
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 4:35pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      He could partner up with Kiri…
      
      Woops, maybe she hasn’t got a practicing certificate….
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      October 17, 2023 6:47pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Mags: What does he mean, return to lawyering? The only “lawyering” he ever did was for the EPMU, as it then was.
    
    “Lawyering” – unless you work for yourself or a union – involves earning three times your salary in fees for the firm you work for. That requires 10 hour days at least five days a week, and usually some hours over the weekend.
    
    Unless somewhat like Presland employed him and set him a sissy budget to achieve, he wouldn’t last a year.
    
    0 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 18, 2023 8:29am
Vinicius

RNZ has an article about what some of the leftie journalists and commentators think of Labour’s smashing defeat. Matt McCarten is scathing.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/500390/the-left-s-postmortem-on-labour-s-defeat
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 3:29pm
- Inandout
  
  Vin, the working class who traditionally voted Labour have been left in the dust by the socialist academics. They sidelined these loyal voters at their peril.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 5:53pm
goNZ1

Absoludely incredible that Hipkins hasnt resigned as leader after overseeing probably the worst defeat in Labour history – shows how they still have no idea what its alla bout. And then today we have a Minister from the party of Kindness swearing at a reporter on live TV !
How the mighty have fallen !
16 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 3:40pm
- bjools
  
  He has to have the job.
  1. He can’t do anything else. (Not that he was any good at this)
  2. He is the best Labour have…..now there’s a big statement.
  
  12 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 4:28pm
Maggie Pie

Just heard HDPA saying that with Angry Andy’s resignation, it will pave the way for Shannan Halbert to return on Labor’s list.

Can’t see Damien O’Connor being too chuffed about that.
17 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 4:15pm
- Colville
  
  Shannan Halbert is the perfect poster boy for a modern Labour Party… chinless liar that couldnt punch his way out of a wet paper bag.
  But great knife in your back.
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 8:41pm
surfing

Two things annoying me today. Not that it matters post-election.

Labour supporters who do not know that it is Jacinda Ardern, NOT JACINTA Ardern! Stupid people!

And selective memory on Chris Hipkins–
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-omicron-chris-hipkins-formally-apologises-over-charlotte-bellis-emergency-miq-saga/DX35AVZARU5RPUFTFUKDCNMK5A/
and…
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/09/northland-border-blunder-apology-from-officials-but-not-from-chris-hipkins.html
and…
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/former-otago-polytechnic-ceo-seeks-apology-from-chris-hipkins/TYVWAD2GGZW6MMSWFZKNLQE4DM/

Why do so many voters place more importance on media puff pieces such as Hipkins eating habits rather than judging him on his character and ability? Banal publicity gets traction and it makes me want to vomit. Maybe I’m just a killjoy?
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 4:19pm
- bjools
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/95781530/today-in-politics
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/08/bill-english-condemns-labour-s-chris-hipkins-in-aussie-citizenship-saga.html
  As opposition, meddling in a foreign countries politics, should have disqualified him straight away.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 5:44pm
- RdM
  
  “Why do so many voters place more importance on media puff pieces such as Hipkins eating habits rather than judging him on his character and ability? Banal publicity gets traction and it makes me want to vomit.”
  
  Reminds me of (reading of ages ago on another blog)
  Guy Debord’s The Society of the Spectacle.
  
  An easy introduction might be this:
  https://hyperallergic.com/313435/an-illustrated-guide-to-guy-debords-the-society-of-the-spectacle/
  
  Wikipedia has:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Society_of_the_Spectacle
  
  21 years later, 1967-1988, he wrote a commentary
  https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/guy-debord-comments-on-the-society-of-the-spectacle
  
  I see too that you can get the original book (translated) from:
  https://files.libcom.org/files/The%20Society%20of%20the%20Spectacle%20Annotated%20Edition.pdf
  
  Also I see that someone has written
  The Spectacle 2.0: Reading Debord in the Context of Digital Capitalism
  which is freely downloadable.
  https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctv5vdd8n
  
  Marxism in the media?
  
  Life goes on … ;=})
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 10:16pm
Ghost

Kiri Allan’s radio nz speech released

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/rnz-releases-kiri-allan-speech-transcript-following-ombudsman-decision/PGPGUZPK7BFFDAGBPPIQ4ZIWKA/
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 4:24pm
- Prince
  
  I recall Dunlop interviewing David Seymour around the 2017 or 2020 election period, I can’t recall which.
  It was a disgraceful interview. Dunlop intense dislike of Seymour was evident – she would not let him answer a question.
  I complained at the time to the BSA, but got an answer to the effect it was not necessary for a broadcaster to provide balance, nor to show common decency.
  Of course to Dunlop (and Allen), Seymour was just fair game as he must be racist.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 7:32pm
Ghost

Article

Iran’s top envoy said that a “preemptive action” could be expected in the coming hours, state TV reported on Monday, adding that Israel will not be allowed to take any action in the Gaza Strip without facing consequences.

“Leaders of the Resistance will not allow the Zionist regime to take any action in Gaza. … All options are open and we cannot be indifferent to the war crimes committed against the people of Gaza,” Foreign Minister Hossein Amirabdollahian, told state TV.
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 4:27pm
- MCōs
  
  I first read about that hours ago
  
  1 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 5:50pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300990792/teens-arrested-after-twohour-110km-police-pursuit-across-auckland
The punishment for these ferals will probably be as long as their car chase.
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 5:20pm
- Jack5
  
  The NZ justice system, with its pampering of criminals, will give them a feather-light sentence.
  
  As in this Christchurch case. A 19-year-old kills an innocent 61-year-old in the street with a martial-arts kick to the head.
  
  The judge gives the thug just two years imprisonment, then grants him leave to apply for home detention.
  
  Bloody outrageous!
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/133135046/teenager-jailed-after-fatal-martial-artsstyle-kick-to-mans-head
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 5:44pm
  - DimChappie
    
    Utterly outrageous sentence. In the same justice system, this man got 13 years jail for blackmailing a woman for sex.
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/crime/man-jailed-after-putting-spyware-on-his-partners-phone-blackmailing-her-for-sex/TBJIP2JWFFDENH6REJTC7XPXTE/
    
    10 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 7:13pm
  - surfing
    
    Is this the most lenient sentence ever handed down in NZ? This is terrible.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    October 17, 2023 8:27pm
Hugh Jarse

Who feel sorry for the media ?, after grifting for Labour for the last 6 years, now getting told to fu*k off by them, then getting the cold shoulder from the party they have been giving shit to for the last 6 years. Yeah nah me neither.
18 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 6:00pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Media? We still have media?
  The ones who give us ‘News?’
  Nope. We have repeaters struggling to hold a job down, They are TOAST!!!!
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 6:54pm
Maggie Pie

I see Nanaia and Andrew have just deleted their ‘X’ formally known as Twitter accounts.

Just saying.
9 0
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 7:09pm
RdM

I see NZ Post has gone woke with Aotearoa New Zealand on its 2023 Christmas stamps.

https://collectables.nzpost.co.nz/christmas2023

And from the end of the description:

Finally, each gift is finished with a silhouette tag that references the Christmas story.

I don’t see how any of the cardboard looking cutouts reference “the Christmas story”
(NB that it’s just a story!) – a star, tree, dove, and presumably an ‘angel’.
(Or a hawk, eagle, modern fighter jet etc.?)

Good grief.

Just part of the hypnotising modern media spectacle infiltrating into our lives, urging us to become it… and live through appearances… !

If it keeps getting pushed through, what do “they” think NZ’s ‘new’ internet code should be, taking it to logical extremes?

Can’t be .ao, since Angola has that.
First letter, last letter? That would be .aa.
(not hardly quite NZ’s credit rating, perhaps?)

And .aa would make it 1st on the list…
https://www.worldstandards.eu/other/tlds/

Is that what they want? (I shouldn’t give ideas!;-)
Can you imagine the cost of changing everything?

“Oh but it’s worth it, it helps us establish our new identity on the world stage”.

Pure spectacle… see Guy Debord’s The Society of the Spectacle.

This needs to be challenged, the Aotearoa invention insidiously becoming a default idea.

But will it be?
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
October 17, 2023 8:58pm
- Jack5
  
  Yep, NZ Post following renames the country Aotearoa New Zealand, and de-Christianises Christmas.
  
  It’s following the Department of Internal Affairs, which plastered passports with Maori words to confuse international processors who overwhelmingly are familiar with English language but don’t know even what language the Maori words are in.
  
  It’s the Woke trying to show the world NZ is multicultural, when it doesn’t rank in the 140 most culturally diverse countries according to this ranking:
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_ranked_by_ethnic_and_cultural_diversity_level
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  October 17, 2023 9:56pm

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« Australian Voice Referendum Results

Shame on Auckland Museum »

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Highlights

The Kiwis are fleeing
Inflation by term
Houston we have a problem
Our immunisation disaster

Never miss a post

Email Address

Links

MMT and Boiling Frogs
Not PC
Brendan O'Neill: Biden’s unforgivable betrayal of Israel
Breaking Views
The work culture that is German, something about France too
Utopia
Labour’s legacy
Hompaddock
Open mike 10/05/2024
The Standard
Jews Finally Admit They Are “White Colonisers”
No Minister
$200k to quell protests on US Campus + why Macklemore’s Hind’s Hall is a turning point in Israel’s ethnic cleansing war crime
The Daily Blog
Justice for Bainimarama!
No Right Turn
What’s new? A social agency with an emphasis on “investment” instead of “wellbeing” – but (psst!) we have had one of these before
Point of Order
Fashionable follies
Offsetting Behaviour
New trans guidelines for schools will be welcomed by families
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
KEYBOARD COWARDS
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
The Treasury and productivity
Croaking Cassandra
Super Rugby Predictions for Week 12
Stats Chat
Media Link: “A View from Afar” on the moment of friction, and more.
Kiwipolitico
Mana or Money
NZCPR
ABs stripped of 2011 title after try disallowed
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

editor@kiwiblog.co.nz

PO Box 12270, Thorndon, Wellington 6144

Facebook
Twitter
FourSquare
Instagram
LinkedIn
Google+

Archives
Disclosure Statement
Editorial Policy
Privacy Policy
Complaints Policy
Comments Policy

Design by cre8d

%d

Share this:

Like this: