General Debate 07 December 2023

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Warren

So much for Grant Robertson and Chris Hipkins honesty.
For them to question Nicole Willis is a bit rich.

Labour’s transport plan was ‘unfunded’ and would increase emissions, Treasury warned

[Mod – link added]
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December 7, 2023 8:01am
- Media hater
  
  I am personally so disappointed in Robertson and Hipkins. I never could have foreseen this coming (sarc).
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:19am
- Warren
  
  As the mods removed my link which was the headline this is what labour were pulled up on by Treasury.
  As Labour attacked National for what they said was a unfunded Transport plan, Treasury warned Labour their plan was unfunded, undeliverable and would increase emissions.
  
  [Mod – if a post is edited a mod will put a note on it, please give the link]
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:09am
  - Warren
    
    [Mod – I will add that to your original post]
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:02am
    - Warren
      
      Thank you much appreciated.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:10am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Please note that this article is premium and you need to pay nanny Herald your hard earned money to read this. So moving on…..
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:47am
mikenmildagain

Happy International Civil Aviation Day!
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December 7, 2023 8:01am
- Jack5
  
  Milky, happy aviation day.
  
  Is that appropriate? It’s 82 years ago today that Japan bombed Pearl Harbour.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:41am
  - thirteenstars
    
    Indeed, very uncivil aviation practised that day.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:56am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Recognizes signing of the convention on international civil aviation on 7 December 1944.
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:07am
- JackRabbit
  
  Mike, I don’t recall you celebrating the 5th of October as “Happy Ivermectin Day”, commemorating the annual anniversary of the day that the creators of Ivermectin, William C. Campbell and Satoshi Ōmura were awarded a Nobel prize.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:22pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    I hope you had a very nice party to celebrate and that you are now free of worms.
    
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    December 7, 2023 2:27pm
Opie

https://www.publicservice.govt.nz/publications/government-expectations-of-commissioner-of-police/

Mark Mitchell’s letter of expectation to the commissioner of police.

Anyone who has navigated employment law knows exactly what happens next.

I’ll have coster gone by February if not before.
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December 7, 2023 8:02am
- bjools
  
  BTW…Note Jacinda, this what “open and transparent” Government looks like.
  Mitchel released this letter to the public.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:17am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    “Not necessarily something I would be aware of”//
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:36am
  - JackRabbit
    
    She meant open and Trans Parents.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:23pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Baaa!
      
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      December 7, 2023 6:36pm
- wisteria
  
  This is excellent information. Now, why don,t all Ministers do likewise. The expectations of all heads of Government Departments should be held to account in the same way.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:29am
  - hullkiwi
    
    The word is there more letters to come.
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:27pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  I agree, I have had HR Departments draft letters like this for me. Carefully worded to allow for maximum impact when the expectations are’nt achieved. You set the bar high but not too high just enough to put it out of reach and allow for “did not meet expectations.”
  
  I am hoping other Ministers copy and paste the sentiments so we can sluice out the Agean Stables that is the so called Public Service.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:06am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Incorrect. It’s a pretty standard letter of expectations. These are common across many public sector agencies.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:09am
  - herb1
    
    But are they released voluntarily . That’s the point
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:24am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Incorrect. It’s a pretty standard letter of expectations.
    
    No Mike.
    
    If they are that common, can you please provide a link to all the published expectations that Labour Ministers issued in 2017 and 2020?
    
    No?
    
    I thought not.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:25pm
    - Ghost
      
      Not Mike but sure
      
      Health
      
      Pharmac
      
      DIA
      
      Plenty more if you search
      
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      December 7, 2023 1:33pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        Yes, and I note that all those departments failed in a spectacular way. Not worth the paper they were written on.
        
        Under DIA is Mahuta’s letter of expectations to Taumata Arowai, the organisation set up after being voted on in mid 2020 when everyone was in lockdown incl MPs, by Covid State of Emergency powers, as part of 3/5/7/9 waters, and staffed by relatives and friends of Mahuta.
        
        Published expectations are expected to be truthful as well as transparent.
        
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        December 7, 2023 4:43pm
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Unlikely, very difficult to remove the Commissioner. He will do his term, unless the government arranges a suitably attractive offer.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:11am
  - cmm
    
    Even if he was put on gardening leave for the next 5 years at double pay it makes sense to replace him.
    
    The cost of crime is way higher than the cost of Coster’s salary & benefits.
    
    We now have Auckland labelled as the least safe city in Australasia. Apart from the direct costs of crime that’s got to hurt tourism and turn a way high value migrants.
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:48am
  - pdm
    
    If Clark could do it with Peter Doune then Mitchell and Luxon should be able to get it done.
    
    Mind you if my memory is correct Clark was alleged to have fudged the truth a bit.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:40am
  - rockape
    
    Creat a new job a scale above him like Chief Commissioner and put one of his subordinates in that. See how fast he resigns then.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:44am
    - Inandout
      
      rock, that is simiilar to being moved sideways.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:58am
    - Paulus
      
      Isn’t the Deputy Commissioner a woman, so that settles it !
      Best person for the job of course.
      
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      December 7, 2023 2:08pm
    - igm
      
      The procedure you refer to is “manage him out” of the position with a little humility for a bonus.
      
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      December 8, 2023 1:13am
- Opie
  
  But Police Association President Chris Cahill did not give such an endorsement when asked by Newstalk ZB’s Mike Hosking whether Coster was still “the man for the job”.
  
  Cahill responded with: “Well he’s the man that’s there and we’ve got to move on.”
  
  Can I revise my time frame to not coming back from Xmas holidays?
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:30am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Coster may be a genuine left wing activist, but it’s more likely he is just a snivelling coward who chose to appease politicians rather than uphold his sworn duty. Now the politicians in charge have changed, he might change too.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:45am
  - septic skeptic
    
    So we are hoping that we have a sniveling coward as police commissioner?
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:55am
    - David Garrett
      
      septic: I have no idea who YOU want for Police Commissioner, but I would like one who is determined to enforce the law – particularly with regard to the self proclaimed “outlaws” aka gang members. A person whose major concern is protecting law abiding members of the public from those who would harm us.
      
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      December 8, 2023 11:59am
- Keith White
  
  Opie – I’ll take that bet. If I lose, $100 to Riding for the Disabled. What say you 🙂
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:07am
  - Opie
    
    Sorry Keith, I’m an engineer not a doctor!
    
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    December 7, 2023 2:08pm
    - Keith White
      
      I’m not a NZ doctor anymore.
      
      Isn’t inflight WiFi grand!
      
      (Or maybe not).
      
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      December 7, 2023 6:07pm
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Opie bro – Coster ain’t going anywhere. So don’t dream.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:48am
- Graham Sharpe
  
  This should be the first of many letters from Ministers to departments and Crown Agencies. They should all be along the lines of, “These are my expectations and requirements, and if you are not comfortable with them I require your letter of resignation by February 1st 2024. Otherwise I will express publicly that you no longer have the confidence of your Minister, and therefore your employment is terminated, and this will be announced as your being fired.” Such letters should by now be in the mail to Health NZ, education, defence, housing, social welfare et. al. Similarly, all holders of ministerial appointments to regulatory bodies must receive the same letter. All these letters must be made public.
  
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  December 7, 2023 12:04pm
- Lenticular
  
  Why not just express no confidence? He only reports to the GG, right?
  
  So why not just say, “This guy is utterly incompetent and we need to be rid of him?”
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:13pm
- David Garrett
  
  Opie: The section on gang crime is particularly good – emphasizing as it does that Police already have laws at their disposal to significantly impact gangs.
  
  As I have said here before, I recall a news item a few years ago quoting a Mob member complaining about Police in some small southern Hawkes Bay town “picking on them”. What was happening was the local police – at the direction of their commander – were using every tool available to them to make life for gang members difficult.
  
  This ought to be the case all over the country, to the point where gang members are aware that whenever they step into the street wearing a patch, they are likely to be “picked on” constantly. Yes, there will be challenges by “human [aka criminal] rights” lawyers …whenever such a challenge is successful, an amendment to the law to get around the courts ruling should quickly follow.
  
  I agree that Coster is very unlikely to last very long with Mitchell as Police minister.
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:12pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/how-increment-by-increment-national-is-unwittingly-advancing-the-radical-maori-cause/
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December 7, 2023 8:02am
- Scott
  
  Winston Peters in a hard hitting first speech in the new Parliament reminds everyone in the House that they are all here to represent New Zealanders.
  
  He takes on the Maori party as a bunch of Johny come latelys whose interpretation of the Treaty of Waitangi comes from the sociology department of Auckland University. He harks back to the great Maori scholars and statesmen of the past as much more credible sources and authority to understand the Treaty.
  
  He takes on the media who he notes never covered NZ First even when they were packing out halls all around the country during the campaign.
  
  Winston is never happier than when he can get stuck into the opposition and the media. He is joyful, like a pig in muck with his joy. I mean that in a good way.
  
  The racist Marxists of the Maori party and the Labour Party do need taking on and I for one am glad that Winston is doing it. Although many may not like him, and for good reason, he represents a country called NZ, united as one people and one nation. His opponents represent the People’s socialist Republic of Aotearoa. I know the vision that I prefer.
  
  https://youtu.be/KJafGRNvJwg?si=gYhW_t9cN5QPfY6x
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:02am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The left and the media are now scared of him, because he has no problems in calling them out.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:49am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Classic Winston in full flight. I have never voted for him, but he certainly has charisma, and have always enjoyed the way he gets stuck into the opposition no holds barred.
      Go Winston. I’m sure Luxon is happy to have you there as the attack dog, along with Jonesy.
      
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      December 7, 2023 1:11pm
  - bennerg
    
    Something I hope Winston can sort out asap:
    
    https://www.teaonews.co.nz/2021/05/05/te-reo-maori-and-invisible-ink-to-be-phased-into-nz-passports/
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:14am
  - sungsamning
    
    As someone who loathed NZ First until very recently; I’m willing to cut them some slack now. I like the way Shane, and Winston are taking on the fake news, and the Maori Party.
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:07pm
  - Individual Responsibility
    
    Scott – anyone that watches Winston’s speech, may wallow in its razor sharp targeting, as I did, but watch Luxon’s facial expressions during the speech; very informative, me thinks.
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:51pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The psychology of takeover.
  Corrupt Stratagies”
  
  https://issuu.com/esisite/docs/the_psychology_of_takeover_rejig?fr=xKAE9_zU1NQ
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:10am
- Grunter
  
  Steve – a good read, which I agree with. A key paragraph from the Blog reads…
  
  “This is the big picture. The Big Picture is understanding, deeply, that Maori radicals are gunning to take over the whole country.
  The big problem we have is that politicians (and many Kiwis) are not viewing today’s ‘issues’ with Maori activism through the lens of this big picture.
  The big picture is everything. We must at all costs resist getting distracted by the minutiae.”
  
  Also of note, I perceive that NewstalkZB, since the election win, has attempted to ‘balance things’ and is now giving more air time to this ‘Maorification’ to justify it as being impartial. Yesterday HDA had some nonsense interview espousing special treatment of ‘Maori’ when it comes to health. Utter BS of course – why give racists any airtime?
  
  Any handout, rule, policy, statement, or comment that favours any race over another race, or races, is racism. And any racism is a bad thing.
  
  I fully support the positions of Seymour, Peters & Jones on this issue. And the Nats (and NewsTalkZB) are really starting to piss me off with their woke virtue signaling allowing a voice to this obvious racism.
  
  Racism is racism. These are just more small steps towards what the radicals from Tea-Party Maori are after.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:22am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Just because the Election is over and there is a new Govt, does not mean Stop Co-Governance is over. Julian Batchelor says the fight is just starting. The Gravy Train will come to a grinding halt.
    Co-Governance must never be allowed to resurface in any form.
    
    https://issuu.com/esisite/docs/how_to_rogue_james_freeman_version_of_the_treaty_c?fr=xKAE9_zU1NQ
    
    https://issuu.com/esisite/docs/new_coalition_don_t_for_a_second_think_the_fight_?fr=xKAE9_zU1NQ
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:01am
    - Nickc2
      
      Co-Goverance is still on Labour’s To-Do List. McAnulty stated words to this effect some time ago when Labour was struggling to fill vacant Ministerial positions after Cindy spat the dummy.
      PS: Be aware, McAnulty sees himself as Labour’s future leader.
      
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      December 7, 2023 10:26am
      - gravedodger
        
        Bring it on, yesterday’s man using yesterday’s bullying from the Union guide book, he will be as outstandingly successful as Cunliffe and Little, hell even the fish monger Shearer was a better bet until he was dragged down by Robber’son.
        
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        December 7, 2023 10:39am
      - Paulus
        
        McNulty for Leader – no way as he is believed to be a man.
        As an ex TAB Manager he should fact or the odds against him.
        
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        December 7, 2023 2:12pm
  - Keith White
    
    Side comment: just waiting at the gate to fly out to another job outside of New Zealand, while still paying taxes in New Zealand, because I can’t practice in New Zealand anymore.
    
    BTW: Whatever you hear and read about Auckland Airport AvSec processing, it’s not nearly as bad as the reality. And this is not just a one off, this is a repeat. But anyway, on with the Main Rant.
    
    The average Kiwi (54% last time I looked) pays no net tax. Even if xe’s not actually a direct or indirect employee of the government, xe’s a net recipient of the money that flows out, which is to say your money they they took in; & the net-unproductive get your $ through direct and indirect welfare and subsidy programs that you are NOT allowed to access because you’re the wrong income level, race, political affiliation, tribal affiliation, so on, so forth.
    
    Over the years, I’ve frequently found I had more in common with people of my own social + economic station when assigned overseas, than with an average JAFA or Kandallah or Penrose or Porirua rez. I suspect many of you would agree if you’ve travelled.
    
    Shared geography is not anywhere near as important as shared values.
    
    Shared ethnicity is not anywhere near as important as shared principles.
    
    Country of birth is not anywhere near as important as shared work ethic.
    
    It’s not a slippery slope. NZ has already jumped off the roof (pushed by Ardern & Co.), we’re now passing the third floor — and yet we’re mostly saying to ourselves “so far so good!”.
    
    Can the new government turn it around – and for the purposes of this admittedly-twisted metaphor – invent an antigravity machine so we can rise again?
    
    So far the omens don’t look good.
    
    3rd floor: The nattering journalist media smurfs and the threatening Che-wannabe ethnic ‘warriors’ already gots them their hobnail boots on and are pounding down Revolution Street (huarahi kotahi!!! (= one-way only!)) while the rest of us are still trying to thread the shoelaces on our Adidas.
    
    2nd floor: widespread civil disobedience from a physically active minority very unhappy that the gravy train is possibly about to be slowing down even just-a-little; their violent threats are praised and supported and yeah! encouraged by a very small bunch of journawokes, policymakers and nomenklatura of all melanocyte-titres who just want their tax-supplied troughs to remain full to overflowing.
    
    1st floor: Seen it before. In Belfast, Chechnya, Cambodia, Myanmar, Venezuela – and a few other places that might surprise you. Luckily, I always had a passport and tickets outtathere. We Kiwis won’t be so lucky.
    
    Ground floor: Failed state. Least worst outcome; Venezuela. Next worst outcomes: Papua New Guinea / Togo. Horriblest outcomes: present South Africa, past Rwanda.
    
    Go ahead, change my mind.
    
    Au revoir until next year.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:16am
    - Ra Henare
      
      because I can’t practice in New Zealand anymore.
      
      Why?
      
      I know docs still practising in their 70s?
      
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      December 7, 2023 3:21pm
      - Keith White
        
        Disagreed with the jab mandate.
        
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        December 7, 2023 6:09pm
  - Lenticular
    
    Take it out of their hands. Get a CIR using a petition. National would be forced to either acquiesce and follow the result, or have a snap election having just alienated all its voters.
    Either way, bye bye Treaty bullshit.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:17pm
  - ISeeRed
    
    Yep. The mainstream media giving the megaphone to racial supremacists to amplify their hate and expand their reach just blows my mind. If the racists were Hwite, there would be cancel campaigns on social media, advertising boycotts, street protests, stern statements from various political poseurs, the works.
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:11pm
Benedict Yu

It is only early December, and already Tova Obrien is winding herself up about the impending drama on Waitangi Day, still two months away.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/301022365/tova-podcast-put-the-bravado-aside–challenge-to-government-from-waitangi

This is a socialist activist masquerading as a political journalist. If she was a journalist, she could run a series of articles about the Government’s major policy priorities, interviewing the relevant Minister, and the Opposition shadow Minister.

It is going to be a long three years for her keyboard. 😅
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December 7, 2023 8:03am
- Paulus
  
  You are assuming that Tova keeps her job to Waitangi Day as the Stuff media is frankly bust.
  Stuff may not be in business much longer if what we are told – they were bought for one dollar before and I suspect not much is left.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:08am
  - Keith White
    
    “Faster, please.”
    
    I normally decry unemployment for anybody, but that does not apply to active saboteurs of the now-dying social contract.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:27am
  - sungsamning
    
    Yes, I don’t think they’ll survive past Kings Birthday 2024. The election is over. There will be Christmas ads, few ads in the silly season, back to school, and Easter. after that; not a lot. I hope the mini-budget claws back any PIJF funding that is yet unspent. And I hope there is no advertising at all from the new government. They should rely on social media, and The Platform etc. Winston Peters appeared recently, tasking calls. Other ministers should follow suit several time a week.
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:15pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  If you looked at any of aotearoa’s msm journos and told them they were biased, they would just stare blankly back at you and say what do you mean?
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:10am
  - Keith White
    
    You are of course correct, but I would rather just pass by on the other side.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:27am
- Blog-aholic
  
  You should read Karl du Fresne take on the NZ legacy media ‘journalists’. He is over the target completely.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:15am
  - Jack5
    
    A taste from the latest Karl du Fresne post on his blog (presumably the post Blog-aholic is referring to):
    
    ” … the media have taken a dangerous leap into new territory by acting as if contentious issues are definitively settled when in the public mind they may not be. In effect, they have assumed a mantle of omniscience.”
    
    https://karldufresne.blogspot.com/2023/12/a-massive-gesture-of-contempt-for-voters.html
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:14am
  - Keith White
    
    He was rather kind with his metaphor “mantle of omniscience”. I would favour “full-thickness make-up of bone-deep mediocrity, toddler-level stupidity and ingrained woke-clownishness.” But being succinct is always preferable.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:29am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Best to not even read her crap nonsense.
  I don’t.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:21am
- pdm
  
  Stuff have once again taken away the opportunity to disagree with the tripe she writes.
  
  Open and transparent journalism discussing the issues of the day!!
  
  No bloody way does Stuff want that.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:24am
  - MCōs
    
    No they haven’t
    She gets a blasting every day on this forum
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:47am
    - RightNow
      
      Kiwiblog for the win!
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:00am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    I noticed that too. They should open up her article for comments. They would very quickly be closed down again.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:10am
    - Keith White
      
      To be fair, her mind is so open her brains spilled out long ago. Is it really her fault? Actually, I don’t care.
      
      (Gotta love using voice dictation software at the boarding gate. Lots of looks and a few sniggers and a few frowns – including right now. Bwahaha.)
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:30am
- PeeJay
  
  The reason toxic Tova and her like attack National on stuff like Waitangi is that they know, with enough pressure, National tend to back down.
  
  Think I’m wrong? How about Key and abolishing the Māori seats? Recent example you say? How about Willis already looking to row back on the Te Reo bonuses in the public sector? No bonuses are now some bonuses – at this rate it will be bonuses for everyone by the end of the week!
  
  A little bit of pressure and National back off slightly.
  
  Toxic Tova will continue to ramp up the attacks on the government, and on National in particular. I suspect we’ll see a lot more of her trying to rile up the Māori issue over the next three years. The media know that National are sensitive to media pressure – therefore, expect constant media pressure throughout the next year.
  
  When will National learn that the media in this country will never, ever, give them a fair break? They should sell them all off, keep advertising to an absolute minimum and be done with them!
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:38am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    You need to realise that there is a faction of National Party MP’s who are quite ok with them backing off things like dumping the Te Reo bonuses, whether because of their almost Labour-like support of modern interpretations of the TOW or because they’re entirely comfortable with the large Wellington bureaucracies and don’t want to ruffle too many feathers.
    
    Example just the other day on Alwyn Poole’s education proposals, including firing the upper layers of management at the hopeless Ministry of Education, which I doubt many National voters care about:
    
    … asking for the resignations for the t0p 11 education officials is a complete non starter, and I am sure you know that. National has not, and indeed never does, advocate revolutions. We are more incremental than that
    
    And from the same source of smug, comfortable wisdom:
    
    You are right. There were (and are) a substantial number of National MP’s who would have similar views to myself.
    
    They won’t really touch TVNZ/RNZ and company because secretly they’re more than happy to see such media pressure applied to their own party where it is translated into “public pressure” to leave the bureaucracies alone so they can get on with running our health, education and social welfare sectors – and transforming our economy into a decarbonised one too just for extra kicks.
    
    None of that is held to be “revolutionary”.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:21am
    - Keith White
      
      Tom H nails it again!
      
      Disclaimer – I know him not but I like his point of view and wish to subscribe to his newsletter 🙂
      
      9 3
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      December 7, 2023 11:31am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        I blog at No Minister where you can read my EXTREME RIGHT-WING, FRINGE commentary on many subjects pretty much every day. 🙂
        
        Only thing is that I comment mainly about America, since they still fight over ideas there while NZ seems to just get along to go along.
        
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        December 7, 2023 12:08pm
    - Observer of Life
      
      How come you don’t get a bonus for learning NZ Sign Language? Also an official language of NZ. What gives?? 🤔
      
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      December 7, 2023 8:02pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Iirc to abolish the Maori seats you will need support from 75% of all MPs
    A Referendum might be a good start.
    They are no longer needed as Maori are very well represented already so I do think they should go
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:22am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      No. The Maori seats are not entrenched.
      
      A private members Bill in 2018 would have entrenched the seats. It failed.
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/bill-to-protect-maori-seats-fails-in-parliament/FGDARHJHIPP3Y2C4UQ3OOC3OYY/
      
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      December 7, 2023 10:06am
      - All_on_Red
        
        I still think you need the support of 75% of MPs to remove them- even if they aren’t entrenched
        Perhaps Steve Todd has a comment
        
        7 1
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        December 7, 2023 11:28am
      - Steve Todd
        
        @All_on_Red @ 11:28AM
        
        Yes, I believe you are correct, All_on_Red.
        
        While the Māori seats (section 45) are not entrenched, the formula pertaining to the calculation of the number of General seats (section 35), is.
        
        I set out my thoughts on that matter, here: https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2023/08/general_debate_28_august_2023.html/comment-page-1#comment-3426431.
        
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        December 7, 2023 1:03pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Thanks Steve
        Whilst that means its unlikely to happen I’m not unhappy about the requirement for 75%
        I am sure there are other things I would be very unhappy about being passed if it was lower.
        
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        December 7, 2023 1:16pm
      - Steve Todd
        
        Agreed. A 75% majority (in this parliamentary term, at least 93 MPs) effectively means that only non-controversial issues would ever attain that threshold.
        
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        December 7, 2023 1:34pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    This is why I keep saying that Luxon especially needs to HTFU.
    
    12 2
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    December 7, 2023 10:04am
    - leoj
      
      Luxon and the namby-pamby Nats are squish.
      
      It should have been Luxon to point out the bribery of the media, not Winnie.
      
      Get used to more Nats woke.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:21am
    - Keith White
      
      If there is a GoFundMe to send Luxon a cup of concrete, I’m all in.
      
      11 3
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      December 7, 2023 11:32am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Just pills, three times a day – and another if he wakes up in the night dreaming of socialism!
        
        3 0
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        December 7, 2023 6:42pm
  - thirteenstars
    
    The Governor-General should attend as the sole Crown representative, which in fact they are.
    
    The GG attended the Waitangi Dawn Service in 2023 and for all I know does so on a regular basis.
    
    7 0
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    December 7, 2023 10:05am
- gravedodger
  
  The Coalition should state now that in the interests of promoting Racial tolerance and understanding they will not have any presence at the slugfest for Native activists on New Zealand day and will be promoting harmony and understanding elsewhere, who needs a dildo anyway.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:43am
- rouppe
  
  She would also be calling out Maori that if you want conversation, you can’t be insulting people or throwing objects at them.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:12am
greybeard

This article may come as a shock to some drivers.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/133411140/nzs-cheapest-ev-recalled-over-concerns-it-can-electrocute-people

Not a very good plug for this vehicle !

Very negative, in fact.

Currently a very cheap EV, if you want to be positive.
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December 7, 2023 8:05am
- Master Mariner
  
  Interesting, I was following as well.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmKy7dBDBYQ&t=29s
  
  Surprised it made its way to NZ media too be honest
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:13am
- MarkF
  
  It is just pure laziness and lack of attention to detail. The issue is covered by the EV Standard and it is only software (no extra material cost). How that could have passed and complied with the standard is beyond me.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:15am
  - Master Mariner
    
    Nope, its a serious deadly flaw.
    There is no interlok between charger and charging, Which enables power while connecting / disconnecting.
    Definately not a “Programming error” as stated.
    
    Next question? Who in the hell would strap kids car seats in these bloody things !
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:21am
  - cmm
    
    In a safety situation, never send software to do hardware’s job.
    
    The industry learned about this 40 years ago with the Therac-25. But like many lessons from the past, the new wave of system developers think they know better.
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:56am
- Burtland
  
  wonder what other hidden delights it includes
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:21am
- tedbear
  
  The electric vehicle (EV) has yet to be invented.
  What’s currently available from the likes of Tesla are battery vehicles – they get their power to turn the wheels from the battery.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:22am
  - Master Mariner
    
    “they get their power to turn the wheels from the battery.”,
    Take it a step further and suggest most of the Worlds EV’s ( Battery vehicles) are powered by coal.
    
    So , Next generation Coal/Battery Powered vehicles.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:23am
- All_on_Red
  
  ‘Consumer Reports last week reported that EVs are far less reliable than gas-powered cars, with owners reporting “79% more problems than conventional cars.”
  “As more EVs hit the marketplace and automakers build each model in greater numbers, we are seeing that some of them have problems with the EV drive system motors, EV charging systems, and EV batteries (which are different from the low-power 12-volt batteries that power accessories),” it reports. (Keep in mind that Consumer Reports is a big booster of EVs.)
  EV owners are also finding that repair costs tend to be much higher. One study found that they cost 29% more to repair than conventional cars. Mitchell, a company that processes millions of repair transactions insurers and repair shops found that repair costs in the third quarter of this year were $950 higher, on average, for EVs than conventional cars.
  EVs are also more expensive to insure. An analysis by Policygenius, an insurance comparison shopping site, found that an EV sedan costs 18% more to insure, on average, than a gas-powered one. “Insurance for a Tesla Model 3 and Y costs $1,000 more per year than for a Ford truck,” it reports.’
  
  Links to these reports within the link
  https://issuesinsights.com/2023/12/06/evs-arent-the-edsel-of-the-21st-century-theyre-far-worse/
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:25am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    When owners turn the main motor off but leave accessories going they end up not being able to start the car.
    
    15 3
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    December 7, 2023 8:33am
    - info@cruzpro.com
      
      Same as a petrol car.
      
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      December 7, 2023 8:36am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        If a petrol car gets a jump start from another car or the AA the motor will recharge the battery unless the battery is totally stuffed.
        
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        December 7, 2023 9:15am
      - Paulus
        
        Nah – my German Car automatically looks around finds no bums on seats anywhere and shuts everything down after 30 seconds or so, so battery does not run down.
        
        9 0
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        December 7, 2023 2:19pm
    - miltonF
      
      I don’t think that’s possible in most EVs or any modern car for that matter. Everything is automatic and turns itself off.
      
      Most EVs charge the 12v accessory battery off of the main traction battery through a step down DC-DC converter. That means you’d have to run the main traction battery flat before they’d be a chance of draining the 12v battery. Very unlikely. Although there was a story in the news recently about some people who rented a Tesla, ran the traction battery flat, couldn’t figure out how to open the doors, and sat in the car with accessories running until the 12v battery went flat. So it IS possible, but you’d have to be a very “special” kind of person.
      
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      December 7, 2023 8:26pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Thankfully, the idiotic subsidies are now gone, and soon EV owners with pay road user charges.
    
    In the USA, there are signs that the early adapters have bought EVs. Increasing market share from here on will be more difficult. The same will happen in New Zealand. I expect that the growth spurt of the last two years is over.
    
    https://www.theverge.com/23934889/electric-vehicle-ev-transition-sales-delays-politics
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:34am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Road user charges should be back dated. No freeloaders!
      
      17 2
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      December 7, 2023 8:44am
      - imalwaysright
        
        They should pay higher rates.
        Also, many of them are heavier than the same size as a normal car.
        They also wear tyres out faster due to high torque motors and wear suspension bushes faster due to higher tyre pressures.
        
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        December 7, 2023 9:43am
    - All_on_Red
      
      This group which represents 4000 car dealers in the US agrees with you
      ‘Last year, there was a lot of hope and hype about EVs. Early adopters formed an initial line and were ready to buy these vehicles as soon as we had them to sell. But that enthusiasm has stalled. Today, the supply of unsold BEVs is surging, as they are not selling nearly as fast as they are arriving at our dealerships — even with deep price cuts, manufacturer incentives, and generous government incentives.’
      https://evvoiceofthecustomer.com/
      
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      December 7, 2023 8:49am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        It is interesting that Toyota has chosen to not make EVs. Instead they are backing their hybrid technology which they have been working on for 30 years. As I have commented previously, you can buy a hybrid Vitz for half the price of a Nissan Leaf and which has fuel economy of 5 litres per 100 km in the city.
        
        The new Prius is a nice looking car. Starts at $28,000..
        
        https://www.toyota.com/prius/
        
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        December 7, 2023 9:01am
      - k1w1
        
        Th elink to Prius that Benedict gave is to the US website and pricing. That model doesn’t exist on Toyota NZ’s page. Weird.
        
        5 0
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        December 7, 2023 10:42am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        It is interesting that Toyota has chosen to not make EVs.
        
        As has been the case for a long time. Back in 2000 California did the first of their now-standard trumpeting BS about emission-free cars and General Motors, showing the executive smarts that would seen them bankrupt in 2008, announced their first electric car, the EV1. Looked awful, was useless, and soon vanished.
        
        Meantime Toyota sold millions of hybrids in the State over the following decades.
        
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        December 7, 2023 11:29am
      - Taieri
        
        As I have commented previously, you can buy a hybrid Vitz for half the price of a Nissan Leaf and which has fuel economy of 5 litres per 100 km in the city.
        ——————
        
        My 2007 Kia Cerato diesel shows 5.7 litres per 100 km over nearly 90000 km. Paid $25K for it brand new. Only expenditure so far is: an annual service, one set of tires and a battery. Plus RUC and rego of course. Still in pristine condition.
        
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        December 7, 2023 3:59pm
    - Master Mariner
      
      “I expect that the growth spurt of the last two years is over.”
      The people who can afford an additional car bought an EV,
      Meanwhile us mere mortals just have 1 reliable car.
      Its over, Just need people to realise.
      Again political Green Dreams come to fruitition //
      What other ones are there ?
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:27am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Edsel. There’s a blast from the past. Never worked on one but they do have a reputation.
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:47am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Edsels didn’t sell well because the grill looks like “lady parts”
      
      Check out the growler on this:
      
      http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/cars-for-sale/edsel
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:58am
      - cmm
        
        That, plus numerous other problems.
        
        4 0
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        December 7, 2023 11:01am
    - sungsamning
      
      The name didn’t resonate with Ford employees who had worked there when Edsel Ford was running things. There was no dedicated Edsel assembly line. There was a recession in 1958. And the market research wasn’t that useful. It turned out to be a car few wanted.
      
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      December 7, 2023 3:29pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    Panel beating repairs generally require painting of fixed or replaced parts to colour match. To make the paint and coatings hard they are heated to about 80°C in large paint ovens (for best results)
    
    But you can’t do this for EVs due to danger of batteries immolating, they have to use a much lower temperature baking process with worse results.
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:59am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Multi coloured “Cling wrap”, Additional bonus would be holding it together //
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:28am
    - cmm
      
      You would think they’d just remove the battery, but probably insufficient thought was put into it.
      
      5 0
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      December 7, 2023 11:02am
      - Paulus
        
        Can’t just remove battery as the car is built over the batteries. Chassis would have to come of first.
        Am told that would cost something like $20,000 to replace a battery.
        
        5 1
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        December 7, 2023 2:23pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        It typically takes many days of highly skilled and somewhat dangerous work to remove and then re-install a battery, costing many $1000’s of dollars.
        
        4 1
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        December 7, 2023 3:27pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I don’t know much about these EVs.
  I always figured the rectifier would be on the charging station. Not so here. The rectifier is on the vehicle. (I think)
  The item mentions ‘cancelling out.’ This means discharging any residual charge before unplugging, same as discharging an electric motor capacitor before opening it up.
  I am sure the cancelling is explained in the manual, but there are always stupid people who don’t follow instructions. They think it is the manufacturer’s opinion!
  Why is this not standardised Worldwide?
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:43am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Can someone correct me on this if wrong?
    I have extensive mechanical knowledge but not much with EVs.
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:49am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Steve O, See my link above. It makes the most sense too me.
      Definately not a “soft ware” issue.
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:30am
    - Humai
      
      I had a poke around the internet on this so normal veracity waivers apply but in answer to your questions:
      
      1) The Ora has 2 charge plugs: One can charge from a high current DC supply and the other from an AC supply, confirming that a rectifier/charger is on-board for this purpose.
      
      2) The problem described refers to the AC charge circuit, implying that the arcs/sparks seen are from three phase AC supply (just as well, because high current DC arcs are very dangerous indeed).
      
      3) The problem refers to a software issue so one assumes there are already interlock sensors in place accessible by the software/microcode on-board or in the charger unit.
      
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      December 7, 2023 9:57am
      - gravedodger
        
        “high current DC arcs are very dangerous indeed”.
        As Steve Otto and many others well understand, hot enough to bond steel using the arc temperatures.
        
        Bit burny on human flesh though.
        
        7 0
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        December 7, 2023 10:53am
      - cmm
        
        Rule #1 for safety is to not rely on software where hardware should be used instead.
        
        5 0
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        December 7, 2023 11:04am
      - mawm
        
        Gravedodger – As seen when a spanner falls across the terminals of a 12V car battery. Been there, done that.
        
        5 0
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        December 7, 2023 12:13pm
- Yvette
  
  Greybeard, it is still early in the morning but I got all three
  plug, negative and positive :o)
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:58am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    You missed the “shock” – he had 4 live lines.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:45am
    - greybeard
      
      You also missed “currently”.
      
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      December 7, 2023 4:51pm
- Ghost
  
  Cars get recalled, it happens. Nothing really to see here. Ford rangers and Ram’s recently had a recall. Shit, if people stopped buying a car because of recalls you’d still be using a horse and cart
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:36am
- Keith White
  
  An EV designed and built in China has safety issues? I’m shocked I tell you, shocked.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:33am
- sungsamning
  
  The sound you just heard from Christchurch is me laughing my tits off. They were on display in Westfield recently. At least they’re not catching fire.
  
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  December 7, 2023 3:21pm
Nukuleka

If anyone ever retained the notion that the BBC was a beacon of impartiality in a sea of msm left-wing bias read its account of the Maori Party protests and weep.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-67621800
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December 7, 2023 8:08am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Anyone in the UK looking at the picture of Waititi would think that it was he that needed to come into the new century.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:18am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Quotes from the article:
  
  the government has said it is committed to improvements “for Māori and non-Māori”.
  
  The new governing coalition’s leaders have said they do not wish to divide the country along race, and have called for a review of affirmative action policies.
  
  “People may project onto us a whole range of things, and me personally,” Mr Luxon said. “My job is to model out what I want to see in this country: more unity, everyone doing well, and improved outcomes.”
  
  Quite biased, really.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:18am
  - RightNow
    
    Oh awesome, glad that guy is our new PM!
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:03am
  - Nukuleka
    
    Yes, Mikey, you are correct. The BBC have interestingly updated and modified their original news item in which they didn’t refer to ACT and NZ First by name but labeled both as ‘right wing fringe parties’, didn’t quote Chris Luxon extensively and merely parroted left wing talking points that could have been written by The Maori and Green parties’ PR machines. It’s interesting to see that the article has now been rewritten to give greater balance. Perhaps the BBC quite rightly received complaints.
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:00am
    - Paulus
      
      BBC Correspondent used to be in Auckland, and was an employee of Herald Group.
      Believe he was also for the Guardian newspaper.
      Possible still is !
      
      6 1
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      December 7, 2023 2:26pm
- Burtland
  
  no translation of the scab speech by Rawiri Waititi – no author either – maybe CrapGPT
  
  The BBC is a woke hive – worse, they are a major source of news for RNZ, who seems to reciprocate to the woke fest with appalling crap from Colin Peacock.
  
  the rest of the UK media have reported it
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/12/king-charles-world-media-reacts-to-te-p-ti-m-ori-s-controversial-swearing-in.html
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:48am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    His swearing in is here:
    https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/document/HansS_20231205_041190000/waititi-rawiri
    You’re welcome.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:45am
- Ehlana
  
  What about that made you weep? It seemed like a pretty good explanation to me – remember, they are writing for people who don’t know much about New Zealand.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:00am
  - Grunter
    
    Try these obvious Leftard statements…. at best distorted, but mostly outright lies. And they forgot to say that all the changes announced so far were part of the electoral manifestos that the MAJORITY of Kiwis voted for a few months ago!
    
    1. Prime Minister Chris Luxon’s right-wing government wants to re-interpret the nation’s Indigenous treaty ……
    
    2. Many in the Māori community have been angered by plans to reinterpret the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi, New Zealand’s 180-year-old founding document.
    
    3. The treaty, signed by British colonists and Māori chiefs, is the country’s chief document which sets out the rights of Maori, allocation of resources and recognition of political power.
    
    4. The new government has already announced it plans to …… switch the names of some departments from Māori to English.
    
    5. The Māori population remains disadvantaged to the general population when assessed through markers such as health outcomes, household income, education levels and incarceration and mortality rates. There remains a seven-year gap in life expectancy.
    
    6. Critics have also express dismay over the new government’s plan to reverse landmark environmental and safety laws enacted under Ms Ardern’s two terms in government.
    
    7. The new government says it plans to reverse a ban on offshore gas and oil exploration and also rewrite firearms legislation – which was beefed up after the Christchurch terrorist attack by a white supremacist in 2019, which killed 51 Muslim worshippers.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:51am
- bennerg
  
  I read that a new Chairman has been appointed, and in a breath of fresh air, he is reputed to be aggressively anti-woke. But let’s see …
  
  https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/12/06/samir-shah-announced-new-bbc-chairman/
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:12am
- Keith White
  
  Well, the BBC recently featured a couple of teenagers from Africa who had invented a completely-new never-seen-before-in-hooman-history method of purifying water to reduce the incidence of gastrointestinal illness in their village/school, filtering water through sand in a bucket.
  
  I am not repeat not downplaying the contribution these young ladies are trying to make to their immediate community.
  
  What I absolutely am slagging off is the useless British BS Corporation in promoting this as some sort of new development in the history of personkind.
  
  As someone else said, “witness the soft bigotry of low expectations”.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:38am
Maggie Pie

And great to hear Labor’s shadow minister for police Ginny Anderson on ZB Early Edition this morning, finally calling for a tougher stance on gangs.
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December 7, 2023 8:08am
- pdm
  
  New Zealanders already feel safer now Ginny is not Police Minister Maggie.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:27am
- NothingLeft
  
  She’ll be glad that National are govt then, maybe something will actually be done about Gangs.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:00am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Will she promise to be as tough on gangs as she is on her own staff?
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:04am
Paulus

Ginny is continue to push herself as the next short term Labour Leader.
18 1
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December 7, 2023 8:10am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  She will be your PM in 2026 or earlier if the coalition of chaos collapses…..
  
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  December 7, 2023 12:46pm
- Warren
  
  Well she has one thing in her favour, that’s Chris Hipkins popularity won’t last 3 years because he is all piss and wind, and hasn’t the balls to stand up for what’s right and that’s not Te Paki Maori.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:04pm
- Ghost
  
  I think they will have several leaders before they find the next PM, who I don’t believe is in parliament yet.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:07pm
G152

Interesting question asked on media.
Could you fly an airliner if the pilot became disabled?
First answer is
WTF happened to the other pilot who is very capable of flying the aircraft solo.
And the second answer is
I was a Private Pilot with 140 hours so yup
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December 7, 2023 8:11am
- OlderChas
  
  Fly it? Probably. Land it? There might just be a problem there!
  
  9 0
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  December 7, 2023 10:42am
  - Keith White
    
    My experience with both my PPL and my early hang-gliding off Muriwai Back In The Day is that I was always able to land, no question.
    
    But after some landings with the hang glider, I was less mobile and the kite was less symmetrical, than after other landings. I’m just guessing but I think this will probably extrapolate to wide-body airliners…
    
    Well that got some interesting looks here in the boarding lounge!
    
    Hi there! Ignore me, I’m just posting.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:41am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Interesting self belief with PPL and 140 hours probably in a light aircraft Cessna 152?
    
    Sit in the seat and steer an airliner? (presume Airbus size twin engine jet)
    Yep
    
    Sit in the seat and do an approach and landing (without a voice in your ear from a real pilot talking you thru it)
    Nope. No way.
    
    Approach profile is way way different and the inertia of a large weight means no tiddley power changes and expect instant response.
    
    So what do I know?
    Only 4,000 hours PIC including some time “steering” a 4 engine aircraft. 🙂
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:18pm
  - Terry Dalee
    
    Gawd… How do you tell a pilot at a party?
    
    You don’t, he’ll tell you ….
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:52pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/133377362/disabled-child-asked-to-leave-early-childhood-centre-over-walking-frame-request
This article does not actually give any details about the make, model and price of the required walking frame.
A figure of $15,000 is mentioned but it seems incredible that a frame for a two-year-old could cost that much.
The article does not allow comments so it is not easy to get more info from the writer.
Just another crap piece of reporting.
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December 7, 2023 8:13am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Specialist medical equipment/aids is incredibly expensive. Try buying any simple mobility aid, for example.
  ‘Conductive education’ sounds a bit cultish in its approach.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:21am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I think it is quite a balanced story. The barrier to the child accessing the aid is not price. It is about the philosophy of the centre which apparently objects to the use of the mobility aid on principle. The inference is that without a referral from the centre, the parents need to pay for the mobility aid.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:29am
- wsk12345
  
  We looked at a top of the line carbon full size walking frame with brakes and all for a family member. It was in the under 2k range (I think it was just over a grand). Not sure what extra functionality gets you to $15k!!!
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:51am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Might need to be custom-made for the particular child’s needs.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:47am
    - Keith White
      
      It might, but usually in that price range, there would be a really substantial range of electronic assistance, not only a stable physical structure that has to keep up with the child’s growth. 15 K just doesn’t sound right. But as always, we’d need to see the specs to make an accurate judgement. Hopefully the little one gets what they need and BS-sing bureaucrats are not the problem here.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:43am
Happy1

It’s clear to me that those on here who railed about NZ 1st and Winston got it wrong. NZ first are doing a marvellous job in punching the Māori party and the woke generally. National and Act would be floundering without them.
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December 7, 2023 8:17am
- Grunter
  
  But he still self-selected the former President of the World Socialist Youth Council to be PM in 2017 despite her obvious plan to wreak havoc on this country.
  
  He is however getting all my support on pushing back on Tea-Party Maori
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:55am
  - Keith White
    
    Yes, and Yes.
    
    6 1
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    December 7, 2023 11:43am
  - mawm
    
    Grunt – It does make one wonder what was in their coalition agreement.
    
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    December 7, 2023 12:18pm
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Nobody ever doubted they were good at talking.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:05am
- Notsofast
  
  A vital contribution by Winston to sanity.
  This video shows where NZ was heading. This promotes the transitioning of British children, celebrates an f to m student, and shows the indoctrination of children in real time.
  I hope Winston gets this stuff stopped dead. Inside Out is our state funded promoter of mental illness in children, this outfit is called No Outsiders. They have No Outsiders Schools. Posie Parker calls attention to this unmitigatedi catastrophe.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/live/G2uml3u-KWg?si=7C0r5Wwno1HUdXrW
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:11am
- Swifty
  
  Far too soon to judge.
  
  Come back in three years.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:20am
- MCōs
  
  National wouldn’t have the numbers without them
  Mr Luxon made it clear enough NZF are only part of the coalition because he had no choice and doesn’t Peters know it!
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:51am
- sungsamning
  
  Yes, I’m impressed so far. Lets hope it continues. Credit where its due.
  
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  December 7, 2023 3:36pm
Burtland

Yesterday the Governor General Cindy Kiro was forced to swallow a big fat rat,

she announced the reintroduction of benefit sanctions she was in charge of dismantling as head of the Welfare Expert Advisory Group.

https://lindsaymitchell.blogspot.com/2023/12/oh-irony.html
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December 7, 2023 8:18am
Maggie Pie

Was mesmerised by James Meager’s maiden speech yesterday.
His mum was watching from the gallery. She must be just sooo proud.

Compare Jame’s speech to that of the Rainbow Green ‘MP-for-Tijuana’ back in 2020…..

“In our queer community there is a saying that I love, BE GAY, DO CRIME”
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December 7, 2023 8:26am
- pdm
  
  MP – it is a crime that he (Ricardo Menendez March) sits in New Zealand’s House of Representatives.
  
  What a waste of space.
  
  40 2
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  December 7, 2023 8:30am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    OMG pdm… don’t get me started!
    To think our taxes are going to fund him and the rest of his ilk to do SFA for the next 3 years, that’s what is really criminal.
    
    Can you believe it’s over $7 million down the sewer.
    
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    December 7, 2023 8:43am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Maggie – I agree with you 100%. I can see him as the next National Party leader and PM in six years time unless he crashes and burns which could happen. He has charisma, fluency of both Te Reo and English and the presence. Wow, for once National picked a right candidate for once. He will be great leader for National. I salute his mum. She is a role model for many struggling single mums of our country.
  
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  December 7, 2023 12:51pm
Tom Barker

The new government’s overnight walk-back on cancelling the te reo Maori bonus for public servants is a very satisfying outcome of the previous day’s protest action. I hope to see plenty more of both.
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December 7, 2023 8:34am
- Grunter
  
  Was that sarc??
  
  Or are you part of the Maori separatist movement planning on wreaking our country?
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:58am
- Swifty
  
  Tom Barker is happy that people die from lack of surgery or cancer medicines so that money can instead go to well-heeled public servants in Wellington.
  
  He would rather tax money was spent on the already privileged rather than building access ramps for disabled kids.
  
  Yep, that sums up Tom Barker. Shame on Tom Barker. What a nasty individual.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:16am
  - nathie
    
    Exactly! Those $7,000 (s.e.v.e.n thousand!!) bonuses means taxpayer funding is being diverted away from the likes of Pharmac where it would make a meaningful impact on saving and improving people’s lives.
    
    Sure if there is a need for a public servant to learn/use te reo for their job, then ok yes that makes sense. But what doesn’t make sense is paying most of the public servants $7,000 when their job doesn’t need te reo at all. It’s virtue signalling elitism that is out of control being funded by thousands of other hard working tax-payers (who get no such breaks).
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:31am
  - MCōs
    
    Bit melodramatic
    I somehow doubt ACC or Pharmac will benefit if some public servants pay is cut
    Probably go towards tax cuts
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:40am
    - Swifty
      
      I refer you to my piece from yesterday:
      
      https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2023/12/general_debate_06_december_2023.html#comment-3481480
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:04am
    - cmm
      
      ie. Everyone would benefit.
      
      6 1
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      December 7, 2023 11:28am
      - MCōs
        
        By about thrupence
        
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        December 7, 2023 1:56pm
  - Ghost
    
    The money never would have gone to health etc. It probably wouldn’t have been allocated to anywhere for the simple reason we don’t have the money. Grant just kept borrowing for things like this. We’re broke
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:48am
    - cmm
      
      We’re worse than broke.
      Our unborn great grandchildren are in a hole that we dug for them.
      
      Let’s not blame Robbo and Cindy. They are just doing what the voters chose.
      
      10 2
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      December 7, 2023 11:30am
- Observer of Life
  
  Why don’t you get a bonus for learning/signing in NZ Sign Language??? A bit biased.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:24pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Our PM gave a very good Address in Reply speech…. doesn’t seem to have been covered by the MSM…

https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20231206_20231206_44/tab/video?page=3&mode=form
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December 7, 2023 8:38am
- mikenmildagain
  
  The days when newspapers gave detailed reports of parliamentary debates are long gone.
  
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  December 7, 2023 8:41am
  - RightNow
    
    Along with their readers.
    
    24 1
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    December 7, 2023 9:05am
  - MCōs
    
    Royal family gossip is more profitable
    
    12 0
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    December 7, 2023 9:21am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Providing an accurate précis of a speech or report seems to be a communication skill beyond the capabilities of our MSM journalists.
    
    19 1
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    December 7, 2023 9:52am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      No one cares about debates in parliament. If the media printed them, they wouldn’t be read. The (very) few interested can watch the debates live or read Hansard.
      
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      December 7, 2023 10:14am
Maggy Wassilieff

Michael Bassett on modern Maori myths and misleading journalism

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/michael-bassett-modern-maori-myths
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December 7, 2023 8:42am
- Grunter
  
  A brilliant, well writtem piece.
  
  For those who want to send The Herald a message….. Bassetts parting request below.
  
  Shayne.Currie@nzme.co.nz
  
  Murray.Kirkness@nzme.co.nz
  
  Rachel.Ward@nzme.co.nz
  
  Allison.Whitney@nzme.co.nz
  
  “Representing, as they do, a newspaper the share value of which is floundering these days, they constantly deny selling the paper’s independence on Maori matters in order to access money from the PIJF. If they continue to batter us with misleading journalism on the new government’s intentions then why not send them and others who engage in the same erroneous nonsense a message?”
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:47am
Grumpy Silver Haired Female

I had lunch yesterday with a dear friend who gets her news from the Herald and TV news. Her belief that repealing the smoke free legislation is a terrible mistake was based on those media. I opened Richard Prebble’s Herald opinion piece, headlined. “The Smoke Free Legislation was always going to fail” and asked her to read it. She now agrees with sensible folk like us, that the Government was right to cancel such a waste of money. All hail Richard Prebble.
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December 7, 2023 8:51am
- kevn
  
  Grumpy… This is intersting as well. Along the same lines.
  https://chriswaldburger.substack.com/p/thank-you-for-the-light-80c?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=33911&post_id=139489940&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=15bbs6&utm_medium=email
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:21am
Maggie Pie

Seems the anger is growing worldwide in relation to the Covid whidtleblower.

Self-confessed Conspiracy Theorist and Unofficial Queen of the WEF, Liz Churchill,
has doubled down on her calls for Cindy to be deported back to New Zealand to face charges of genocide 🙁

With nearly half-a-million views and comments in the last few hours, it must be of real concern.

https://twitter.com/liz_churchill10/status/1732233220261838911
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December 7, 2023 8:57am
- MCōs
  
  Real concern to who?
  
  2 4
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  December 7, 2023 10:29am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    ‘whom’
    
    12 2
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    December 7, 2023 10:45am
    - Max Mansplain
      
      who is whom?
      
      3 0
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      December 7, 2023 3:29pm
      - Keith White
        
        Whosoever has biology qualifications.
        
        1 1
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        December 7, 2023 6:26pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I too think Ardern needs to face the music.
  The amount of damage she did was incredible, but the Covid lies the worst.
  Then she said bye and walked away scot free, not even any apology. The woman is evil!
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:52am
  - mawm
    
    Probably just very shallow. She can’t see anything beyond her indoctrinated ideology. It’s the same with most communists – the true evil is at the top.
    
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    December 7, 2023 12:44pm
Matt Long

Which do you prefer; Jenniferanne.com
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/dot-com-town-reverts-to-pokeno/PG5OCK3VZ3B4JZIX25ZY3ON5VY/
Or Poo keno
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/pokeno-set-to-remain-as-pookeno-despite-community-opposition/BQHPAXLCRBHGFLEFDTB3WRY4C4/
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December 7, 2023 8:58am
All_on_Red

Its been mentioned on here a few times that the IPCC in AR6 has recalculated the effect of methane in Agriculture and that our Govt is ignoring that.
Same for RCP 8.5 which I understand is still used as the BAU model here
Can anyone provide some links which discuss and prove that please?
Thanks
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December 7, 2023 8:59am
- Benedict Yu
  
  It is not so much the Government ignoring the IPCC conclusions, but the UNFCCC. New Zealand can’t just make up it’s own accounting rules for methane. Every year it needs to submit a greenhouse gas inventory to the UNFCCC using the methodology approved by the UNFCCC.
  
  I am not doubting the new science from the IPCC. I am just pointing out the reality of what New Zealand has signed up for.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:08am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    The Climate Change Commissioner needs to be replaced.
    
    14 3
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    December 7, 2023 9:25am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Yep, Bring in a Meteorological Minister that deals with accurate forecasts.
      
      13 1
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      December 7, 2023 9:37am
  - Grunter
    
    BY
    “I am not doubting the new science from the IPCC.”
    
    All part of the Global Boiling scam. Even the “new science” is twisted.
    
    8 2
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    December 7, 2023 11:08am
- Chris Nisbet
  
  The IPCC recalc of the effect of methane emissions has made a far larger impact on “Climate Change!” than anything our farmers have done to reduce methane emissions.
  The best/cheapest thing we can do to ‘fix’ “Climate Change!” is just wait for the next adjustment. Who knows, they might reduce the CO2 ECS value next…
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:29am
- Burtland
  
  https://environment.govt.nz/assets/publications/Files/Interim-guidance-on-the-use-of-new-sea-level-rise-projections-August-2022.pdf
  
  8 1
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  December 7, 2023 11:43am
  - All_on_Red
    
    So looking at that, they acknowledge the lower assessment by the IPCC in AR6 but still want to use RCP 8.5
    Tricky aren’t they.
    
    7 2
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    December 7, 2023 1:19pm
  - Chris Nisbet
    
    I wonder – do the people who come up with these projections suffer any consequences if they’re wrong? The rest of us most certainly will, because we’re expected to upend our whole way of life in an effort to hold back the rising seas based on their projections.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:26pm
    - mawm
      
      Chris – I wonder what new “tax” we will have to pay the UN to stop the subsidence of the land. There must surely be something???
      
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      December 7, 2023 2:36pm
Matt Long

Auckland rail tunnels, proud to be most expensive in the world.
“Global study finds CRL’s 3.5km tunnel cost $1.5 billion/km. That’s 50% more than US tunnels cost, three times more than Australian tunnels & almost nine times more than in Finland, Spain & Portugal”
https://thekaka.substack.com/p/auckland-rail-tunnel-the-worlds-most
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December 7, 2023 9:00am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Just get the Americans over here to do it.
  Bonus is Americans do everything BIG, even in States like Alaska. (Seen it twice. Amazing motorways/freeways/tunnels for 732,000 residents.)
  Oh, they build proper roads not goat tracks that need repairs after 4 months (transmission gully.)
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:19am
Matt Long

Another ETS auction fails to meet reserve. That’s quite a few billion dollars the crown no longer has.
https://www.interest.co.nz/public-policy/125568/final-emission-trading-scheme-auction-2023-fails-clear-meaning-15-million
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December 7, 2023 9:02am
- krazykiwi
  
  Good. It’s a few billion dollars staying with productive entities rather than see it sluiced through state coffers and losing value at every step.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:18am
  - Tom Hunter
    
    I wouldn’t get too excited because according to the extremist fanatic No Right Turn:
    
    Being unsold at the end of the year, the units are scrapped, so no-one will be able to burn that carbon.
    
    This is a great result for the environment, and it has the effect of rebalancing the ETS by accident. In 2021 and 2022 Labour’s cheap carbon policy resulted in it dumping 14 million tons of extra carbon into the environment. That’s gone now. And all because they destroyed confidence in the market by ignoring the Climate Commission and trying to keep carbon cheap, resulting in low bids and auctions which didn’t clear.
    
    He goes on to talk about the carbon budget being lowered further next year, which will put more pressure on to NZ businesses to decarbonise, but how National/ACT/Winston might fuck that up.
    
    One can only hope so because given all the other cost pressures NZ businesses are facing nowadays, more than a few might just pack it in because they have no viable way of “decarbonising” to the extent required.
    
    Still, Cuba and North Korea have low-carbon intense societies and the likes of No Right Turn have always thrilled to those places.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:36am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “One can only hope so because given all the other cost pressures NZ businesses are facing nowadays, more than a few might just pack it in because they have no viable way of “decarbonising” to the extent required.”
      
      As I have said many times, it will be fascinating to see how the new Government handles this. He is right – the carbon price will start to ramp up considerably over the next two years. So will the price of petrol, diesel gas etc. If the Government intervenes to stop this, it will never meet the Paris Accord commitments, which Mr Luxon says he is committed to.
      
      The PM has just kicked this problem down the road. He is committed to “net zero” but, of course, refuses to admit that this commitment will result in massive increases in energy prices. The public have no clue either.
      
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      December 7, 2023 10:51am
      - Grunter
        
        Yep, all part of the implosion that has started as we hit the brick wall of reality. Unfortunately, things will now start getting ugly. The only way NZ can sustain this obnoxious contrived ‘carbon market’ is by going into more debt. I don’t think Luxon will be allowed to do that. So, …….tick, tick, boom!
        
        10 1
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        December 7, 2023 11:16am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        The public have no clue either.
        
        No they don’t. I’m picking 2030 as the “Wait! What?” moment. Especially when the $30 billion bill to foreign nations comes due. That will focus minds.
        
        It’s funny that so many on the Left who normally bemoan how putting humans under extreme economic pressure via wage/salary cuts or benefit cuts, or cost increases, does not cause them to better their practices or themselves and may even make things worse for them – are all in on the ETS scheme that will “force” us to decarbonise.
        
        Perhaps the same mentality is at work as seen with poor old British Socialist Michael Foot, an eloquent, passionate supporter of Socialism from the 1940’s on who got Labour’s leadership too late in life and went down to destruction against Thatcher in 1983. He believed in jacking taxes up as high as possible, dismissing any concerns about the overall impact by saying something along the lines of “the rich and corporates will be fine, they always have money”.
        
        It’s a bit like Labour’s tobacco taxes; they don’t seem to accept that such things only work within an envelope and then fail because the objective simply cannot be reached with everybody. The classic “resistance” or “elasticity of demand” and so forth comes into play.
        
        More to the point they do eventually recognise the limits of price theory – at which point the velvet glove is removed and the use of the product is simply made illegal.
        
        Given the physical/economic limits of decarbonisation I’d say we’re about forty years away from a Tobacco-Ban type law on CO2 emissions. Until then we’ll simply endure a lot of pain and misery for minor reductions in emissions.
        
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        December 7, 2023 11:21am
Ian Boag

Is it my imagination or has Winston magically morphed from zero to hero? 🙂
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December 7, 2023 9:05am
- krazykiwi
  
  I judge someone by their actions, not words. Winston talked a good story prior to the election, but I completely discounted this as he had one the same thing for many election cycles then abandoned those who put their faith in his words. Past behaviour is a good predictor of future behanviour … but then again Winston is wily enough to know he will want a positive legacy this time. The jury is still out for me.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:22am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    I hope that Casey Costello is the next Leader.
    
    13 4
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    December 7, 2023 9:28am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Winston Peters is Leader for Life. When that life ends, his cult will expire as well.
      
      5 15
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      December 7, 2023 9:51am
      - MCōs
        
        Après moi, le déluge or something
        
        6 2
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        December 7, 2023 10:19am
- Vinicius
  
  I’ll never be a Winston Peters worshipper, but his speech yesterday was entertaining.
  
  There were a lot of jibes at the media including describing them as, “becoming an unelected political party in this country”.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:23am
- RoboRob
  
  Yup. I cant stand Winston but currently I am very happy he is part of this government. I am loving NZF policies and even his grandstanding.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:29am
  - MCōs
    
    You can’t stand Winston except when you can.
    
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    December 7, 2023 10:11am
    - RoboRob
      
      There is a big difference between the personal attributes of a person and their actions. One can dislike a person but enjoy the benefits of their policies.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:32am
      - dcrane
        
        Thus arises much of Trump’s support, but you’ll almost never hear that from the so-called msm.
        
        7 1
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        December 7, 2023 3:06pm
      - RoboRob
        
        @dcrane
        
        Was going to mention Trump but decided better of it 🙂
        
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        December 7, 2023 5:12pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  This might be the election where people who voted for Winston don’t wind up regretting it! Lol.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:31am
- NothingLeft
  
  He’s the proverbial whale carcass washed up on the beach. Initially draws a bit of a crowd for the novelty and spectacle of it, but then over time starts to stink, and will at some random point in the future explode in a noxious cloud of effluent creating a colossal mess to be cleared up.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:46am
Matt Long

Sorry Mike, a Royal Society Te Apārangi’s Callaghan Medal may not be as prestigious as you think, rather like a Harvard fellowship.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/dr-mike-joy-receives-the-royal-society-te-aparangis-callaghan-medal/HG4O6TZ3I5HDJPGXVPYVVHFZEQ/
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December 7, 2023 9:06am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Isn’t he the guy who John Key so elegantly rebutted by pointing out that he could always get another expert to say something different?
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:53am
Maggie Pie

And I’ve just had time to study the full text and demands contained in the letter Mitch sent to the Police Commissioner.

There’s no doubt in my mind that Cuddles will resign before Xmas.
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December 7, 2023 9:17am
- RoboRob
  
  I haven’t read it, only heard about it breifly thuis morning. As Cuddles is someone who just cant be dismissed by the minister, this seems to me step one of his removal. In the same way as a staff member is given a written warning and a chance to improve.
  
  By clearly outlining his expectations either Cuddles steps up or he is removed for not meeting the Minister expectations.
  
  I am sure this isn’t want many wanted. But Mitchel needs to play the long game here.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:34am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    No, it’s a pretty standard letter of expectations. These are common across many public sector agencies.
    
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    December 7, 2023 9:56am
    - RoboRob
      
      While that might be true, my point is having clear expectations and a person not meeting them is grounds for removal. Mitchels expectations are quite different to how Cuddles has previously operated.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:34am
mandk

There is an interesting column from Fran O’Sullivan in today’s NZH (paywalled) that quotes a Boston Consulting Group report which characterises NZ as have three main groups of people:

“A complacent and well-off older group of New Zealanders who believed New Zealand was a good place to be and did not want anything turned upside down. They were happy with their share of the pie.

Another younger group of New Zealanders who did want to grow the pie but were concerned older New Zealanders were not interested, so they were more likely to leave to build their futures elsewhere.

Then a third, not so well off group, many Māori and Pasifika, who were less concerned about the size of the pie than needing a larger slice just to get by.”

I think that’s spot on. What do others think?
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December 7, 2023 9:17am
- Maggie's partner
  
  Simplistic, but acute
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:08am
- I remember when
  
  Once again Maori and Pasifika get a mention but not the ever increasing numbers of Asians.
  As European New Zealanders get replaced as the dominant sector of our population their views will have a considerable influence on government policy.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:09am
- Frank Hematuria
  
  My hunch is that the descriptions within your quotes are more Fran O’Sullivann bullshit than Boston Consulting Group’s descriptors. I just read the BCG’s report “New Zealand Consumer Sentiment Series #3” which I think must be the source of her opinion (I can’t access the Herald’s closed sections) and those words do not appear in it. Perhaps there is another report but right now I can’t find it.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:24am
Stellaboxer

Did anyone else hear the promotion of an event lampooning the government’s dumping of the Labour governments smoking legislation entitled “ Let’s make smoking great again “ embedded in a news bulletin on the Hosking program this morning? I texted in and must of struck a nerve:-
Congratulations Mike your unbiased media is now promoting anti government events dressed up as news stories lol. Make smoking great again event in the news bulletin even gave out the time and venue. Going to say anything? No thought not.
Reply
You do realise it’s satirical? It’s a satirical comedy event you are getting outraged about…
Reply
I’m not outraged. It’s promoting an event that is lampooning the government. That in itself is neither here nor there but placing it in a news bulletin is something its something that is called bias a lack of political neutrality. Satire is not neutral.

So Somehow it’s ok to promote an event that is solely based on a position taken and pushed by the opposition in itself a misrepresentation of the policy put it in a news bulletin as if it were news to the extent of giving out the time and venue and claim it’s ok because the event is satire! To top it off when someone queries it they are presumed to be outraged so obviously not having a valid point. How the Guy squares off his program with the half hourly news bulletins without any comment has always amazed me.
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December 7, 2023 9:21am
- lifesgood
  
  I think it’s called “Make cancer great again” even worse.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:15am
I remember when

Does the media reaction, and many people’s reaction, to the scrapping of the Smokefree Law, show us how little we have learned from government’s actions during covid.
Unless the individual makes the decision it is going to cause resentment and be very difficult to enforce.
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December 7, 2023 9:27am
Chuck Bird

I understand that Coster cannot easily be sacked. Does anyone know if the same thing would apply to Rod Carr, the climate change alarmist?
16 2
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December 7, 2023 9:32am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Carr is not so much an alarmist, he is more a cultist.
  
  That said anyone welded to the climate change carnage scenario is captured by that cult.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:41am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Board members of crown entities (the climate change commission is one) are appointed for fixed terms, which may be extended. Carr’s appointment was for five years from 2019 or 2020.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:02am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Unlike the police, his budget can be massively cut with no harmful consequences for the rest of us.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:14am
- imalwaysright
  
  Carr has a PhD in insurance.
  A square peg in an ozone hole.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:32am
I remember when

Air NZ orders electric aircraft: Rob Stock,
“The first electric aircraft ordered by Air New Zealand was never intended to be a commercial money spinner.”

What else should it be?
Air New Zealand is a money-making activity.
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December 7, 2023 9:34am
- Jack5
  
  Each plane carries five passengers and a pilot.
  
  Good luck, plenty of it, needed to make money with these.
  
  https://www.beta.team/aircraft/
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:49am
- Jethrod
  
  Was it the first day of April yesterday?
  
  8 1
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  December 7, 2023 10:29am
- rouppe
  
  They were only going to use it for freight.
  
  Then they were asked about range.
  
  It might be able to make it from Wellington to Nelson…
  
  Seriously…
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:21pm
oldpark

Think the third one .That lot has so much pie that even though they gorged on it thanks to the Ardern/Hipkins regime driving a wedge dividing the Nation .Yet they cant get enough.
Just imagine the disaster Ardern/Hipkins created .
That is why NZs voted out their Racist ideas and covert control of the Country of NZ .
Democracy is based on one person one vote . Not say 16% controlling at least 84% of the population .
Go figure .
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December 7, 2023 9:35am
Maggie Pie

Wonder what Effesso is doing this morning?
Probably just started breakfast 😀
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December 7, 2023 9:37am
- Jethrod
  
  Well Winnie made mincement of him yesterday !
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:30am
- imalwaysright
  
  Probably defusing bombs and fingerprinting death threats.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:36am
I remember when

“Consultation fatigue” phenomenom raised by two Maori ward coucillors: Gisborne Herald.
“Consultation fatigue poses a real risk in 2024 due to multiple consultations on fresh water, (the) regional policy statement and future development strategy, the report read.” Sustainable Tairawhiti Meeting.
“There are multiple organisations……and they are all trying to get a minute of our hapu, iwi and community time for that consultation.” Aubrey Ria, Maori Ward Councillor.

Oh dear, oh dear! We want to be consulted but not too often.
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December 7, 2023 9:55am
- imalwaysright
  
  I remember,
  
  Perhaps an example of ‘Be careful what you wish for ‘
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:43am
- wsk12345
  
  Well they will get plenty of $$$ for thrower efforts I’m sure.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:36am
vand

“There is an interesting column from Fran O’Sullivan in today’s NZH (paywalled) that quotes a Boston Consulting Group report which characterises NZ as have three main groups of people”
Mand -I think we need to encourage and support Maori esp to value education and get productive jobs- the stench of victimhood and the demagogues who keep them there are the real problems.
And the growing welfare state burden encourages the brightest to leave-half of our children have gone to Australia and don’t come back except to see family and friends. A third came back from Germany- a wise move!
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December 7, 2023 10:00am
lifesgood

That Wayne Brown is a treasure, takes no crap from anyone and calls a spade a spade. Aren’t we lucky to have him, as for that Tory Whanau, least said the better.
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December 7, 2023 10:17am
- NothingLeft
  
  When it comes to actually looking after the interests of their constituents far left politicians always suck. Whanau being a stand-out example.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:29am
  - All_on_Red
    
    I see what you did there
    Lol
    
    13 2
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    December 7, 2023 10:57am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Absolutely agree!
  Specially after having Pantsdown and Goof inflicted on us for the previous 12 years.
  Even saw him playing tennis at the club recently.
  
  We were all discussing just how much MORE Wayne’s shares would rise if he were to put a stop to those ridiculous Food-scrap Bins.
  Nobody uses the smelly disease ridden things around here. They’re a bloody health hazard and things will only get a lot worse with attracting Rats over summer.
  Lets hope they’re withdrawn before there’s an outbreak of Bubonic Plague or something similar 🙁
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:39am
  - Chris Nisbet
    
    We had a lady come to the house the other day to check to see if we were using ours. I told her ‘no’ (inconvenient, stinky, rat and fruit fly attractors). She told me that only about 50% of people are using them, but I think she’s dreaming – where we are it appears that maybe 10%of people put their bin out.
    It appears she had been to some sort of training course to teach her how to do the job – don’t stand too close to the door, ask the questions in just the right way etc.
    More rates money going down the drain.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:06am
    - Maggie Pie
      
      You realise of course Chris that she would have recorded all your personal details and reported back everything you said to her paymasters?
      
      Even if someone does manage to get on to our property uninvited, they soon realise they’re under electronic surveillance…. and we never answer the door anyway.
      We had some pr*ck from the council come nosing around recently when our lawnmower man left the gate open. Turns out he was their to check our pool fence. Kept ringing and knocking for about 20 minutes before he finally got the message and left his card.
      We had to stay ducked down upstairs for ages.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:51am
    - Inthe09
      
      My neighbour was the only one in my street using the food scrap bin, although I notice after it blew over a few weeks back and some animal got into it that she’s not used it since.
      
      Apparently we pay fortune for the truck that collects the food waste to travel god knows how far out of Auckland to dump the stuff?
      
      Wayne will know changing the normal rubbish collection to fortnightly would cost him the next election, it won’t happen. The people who come up with this stuff need to be ‘disestablished’.
      
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      December 7, 2023 7:53pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    We use our bins. The outer is in the kitchen for taking cardboard/beer bottles/cans out to the recycle bin. The inner is in the laundry with washing powder in it. I found a top that fits good.
    Food scraps go down the disposer where they are meant to go.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:09am
    - Chris Nisbet
      
      That seems like a good use for the inner bin. Where did you get the lid from?
      
      9 0
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      December 7, 2023 11:22am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Somewhere in my garage of junk!
        
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        December 8, 2023 7:56am
Jack5

Stuff continues to promote loser Hipkins. Let us rebuke it.

~~Hikpins~~ Hipkins questions a statement by ACT’s oil and gas spokesperson.

Stuff headlines the report:

NZ politics live: ACT MP Brooke van Velden rebuked for ‘misleading’ statement

To “rebuke” someone is to reprimand them.

The Speaker can rebuke an MP, but only in Stuff does one ordinary MP rebuke another MP. In Stuff’s case, of course, it will only be someone from Labour, the Maori Party, or the Greens doing the “rebuking”.
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December 7, 2023 10:25am
- Benedict Yu
  
  See my comment below. New Zealand will run out of gas in the 2030s unless new fields are found. Is Hipkins saying that New Zealand will then stop using gas? No, it will be imported as LNG on ships from Australia.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:32am
  - Taieri
    
    LPG is already imported from Australia.
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:12pm
Benedict Yu

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/301022416/nz-politics-live-act-mp-brooke-van-velden-rebuked-for-misleading-claim-on-emissions

Isn’t it simple? Without gas exploration, New Zealand will eventually run out of gas. Thereafter all gas will need to be imported as LNG on ships burning bunker fuel, so increasing global emissions.

What am I missing?
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December 7, 2023 10:29am
- Jack5
  
  All indications are New Zealand has new, untapped natural gas deposits close to the coast.
  
  Also it has large volumes of coal-seam gas within its extensive coalfields. The explosions at Pike River demonstrated this.
  
  Getting the explorers back to NZ might be the challenge.
  
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  December 7, 2023 10:38am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Pike River. Open cast it, as it should have been in the first place. It is top quality coal.
    Yes I know there are bodies in there. Just don’t mine that bit.
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:14am
    - Jack5
      
      The Greens, and possibly the cost of taking off a hill top, might make open cast mining of Pike River a challenge.
      
      Tapping the coal-seam gas (CSG) might be easier.
      
      They are taking gas out of coal in Australia, and this Government source says liquefaction plants for exporting it have been proposed.
      
      https://www.ga.gov.au/scientific-topics/energy/resources/petroleum-resources/coal-seam-gas
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:24am
    - Blog-aholic
      
      The only reason it had a 2.3km drift was because the greenies would not allow a road to be put in.
      
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      December 7, 2023 11:26am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Greens also only wanted one vent shaft, not 3.
        There is the problem.
        
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        December 8, 2023 7:58am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I have read this misinformation several times on Kiwiblog. According to the royal commission, Pike River was developed as an underground mine, because open cast mining was not economic owing to the depth of the Brunner coal seam.
      
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      December 7, 2023 1:14pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Downtickers for truth!
        
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        December 7, 2023 2:30pm
Swifty

Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons for a moment – I wonder what effect we’d see on New Zealand crime rates if our shopkeepers, signalling their determination to protect themselves and their families from violent, armed, predatory thugs, started killing a few of them?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12832387/Outrage-Italy-jeweller-shot-dead-two-armed-crooks-tied-daughter-robbed-store-jailed-17-years.html#comments-12832387

Or, alternatively, are we just going to accept as a society that every year for ever more some tens of our shopkeepers will be maimed or killed by violent thugs and there’s nothing we can do to prevent it?
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December 7, 2023 10:53am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Shopkeepers just need to go to Youtube and find how to make a 12G weapon out of two bits of pipe. Just store it under the counter – locked and loaded so to speak.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:17am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    I think that is an unwise, and quite possibly dangerous, piece of advice, Steve.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:15pm
    - Keith White
      
      You would, wouldn’t you.
      
      2 1
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      December 7, 2023 6:21pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      It works. I was tempted to make one. Had the pipes at work.
      Unwise? A pipe gun is more important than a life.
      What a sad wishy washy boy you are.
      
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      December 8, 2023 8:01am
- cmm
  
  It is time we all had a grow-up and recognised that NZ is no longer what it once was.
  
  We now have Auckland being labelled the most unsafe city in Australasia – quite an achievement.
  
  We don’t have to go to firearms, but I think we can perhaps have a reasonable conversation about pepper spray etc.
  
  Of course people using pepper sprays without good reason should be charged with assault and face extreme punishments.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:36pm
Jack5

Is it NZ Arab Muslims who want to bring “cuzzies” from Gaza to NZ, or is the call coming from Labour and the keffiyeh-flaunting Melon Greens?

How would we avoid get some of the fleeing Hamas monsters in the consignment?

If the Lefties did get their way, it might be acceptable if the refugees were only Christian Palestinians.

Christians have all but been driven out of the Middle East, but NZ has received few if any of them as refugees.

Stuff says “the pressure mounts” on the move to take Gaza refugees. Then talks of a petition with thousands of signatures.

What does “pressure mounts” truly mean? If the petition were to reach 40,000 signatures these would be from less than 0.8 per cent of the people of NZ. Some pressure.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/301022516/pressure-mounts-on-government-to-help-families-of-nz-citizens-escape-gaza-conflict
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December 7, 2023 11:05am
- NothingLeft
  
  I’d be OK taking a few Gazans, more malleable kids and women, so long as they were forced to completely integrate (not just hang out in cultural/religious enclaves breeding division). But not the angry men steeped in hate, indoctrinated in Islamic extremism, and bought up in a society that normalizes and celebrates abhorrent treatment and behaviour towards others of the type that resulted in Oct 7 atrocities.
  
  But it makes far more sense for Muslims to settle in muslim countries. There are more than 50 countries with >50% Muslims, more than a billion population, why not send muslim refugees to them as a default? The west’s great immigration experiment has shown that unlike all other cultures muslims in general clearly don’t wish to integrate with non-muslims.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:37am
  - cmm
    
    Do you really think that only men can act as vessels of hate and Islamic extremism?
    
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    December 7, 2023 11:46am
    - NothingLeft
      
      On average that is true, women have evolved with a stronger psychological tendency to seek social acceptance, high status and to fit in with their peers.
      
      In the past being socially marginalised or low status within a tribe or village could result in being singled out by the other ‘hens’ to free up limited resources. This saw malicious expression in things like witch burnings, shunning, gossiping/reputation destruction, enslavement etc, which would make it harder to successfully raise kids to adulthood. Iconoclastic or strong-headed women were historically almost always culled in societies where resources were scant.
      
      There was also a powerful need for women to quickly accommodate conquering armies in order to survive after their previous mates were massacred. Evolutionary pressure in this regard was brutal for much of last million years with ~3% average annual death rate from war concentrated in men.
      
      The result is that women have been warped by evolutionary pressures on largely genetically determined psychological traits to be more likely to adopt dominant narratives no matter how crazy or destructive so long as it buys social capital. As a result they are the primary spreaders and sufferers from various destructive social contagions. See for example anorexia, cutting, dancing manias, gender nut-jobbery, cult memberships, left wing indoctrination that occurs in schools, or female support for misogynistic and viscous religious practises through the ages, and of course prime practisers of virtue signalling behaviour. Peer acceptance and status uber alles, and mostly before any intellectual or rational considerations.
      
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      December 7, 2023 2:30pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    There is a reason why Islamic countries refuse to take them. And it should serve as a warning for us.
    
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    December 7, 2023 12:21pm
    - mawm
      
      One must especially take note of what their “brothers” in Jordan do.
      
      6 2
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      December 7, 2023 3:00pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Judging from these classroom comments at a Gaza UNRWA school it’d be too dangerous even with little kids.
    
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    December 7, 2023 12:38pm
- cmm
  
  These are specifically Gazans.
  
  There are less than 1000 Christians in Gaza so it is very unlikely than many of those have NZ connections.
  
  Nope, if this goes ahead then expect Hamas, NZ edition.
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:44am
  - Ra Henare
    
    cmm. You do relaise that Hamas is a response to the situation in Gaza created by the Israeli “occupation””.
    
    So your belief that Hamas would transfer to NZ in the bodies of people from Gaza puts you firmly in the “”didnt think that through” camp
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:24pm
    - Jack5
      
      Hamas is a response ..
      
      Didn’t Hamas attack across the border fence, boasting about its initiative with hang-gliders and drones?
      
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      December 7, 2023 3:52pm
    - cmm
      
      Israel has not occupied Gaza for a long time. Indeed, Israel even forcefully removed many Jews living in Gaza.
      
      When Israel was occupying Gaza it was to put boots on the ground for security.
      
      “So your belief that Hamas would transfer to NZ in the bodies of people from Gaza”. Not in their bodies but in their minds with their distorted religion, just like all those wonderful “immigrants” fucking up Europe.
      
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      December 7, 2023 5:25pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        Oh dear.
        Israel controls Gaza, nothing goes in or out of Gaza without Israel “”approval”” which is in no way automatic or easily given.
        Yep, thats why Israel can cut off fuel, food, water and energy at a moments notice.
        
        So while not physically having troops on the ground permanently, it has not stopped troops randomly and repeatedly entering Gaza and doing what troops do.
        
        You have fallen in to the Ben Shapiro propaganda of Gaza not being occupied.
        
        As to Hamas and immigrants to Europe. Even after 20 seconds of research you would know that Hamas and your Immigrants are comparing chalk and cheese.
        
        But hey, sorry. I was interrupting your less than educated rant against Hamas
        
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        December 7, 2023 7:10pm
    - Matt Long
      
      Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2004 in a failed attempt to establish a 2 state solution. Hamas then took over and started ramping up violence against Israel.
      But keep up your research, maybe you could start with the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, along with how the Joos drink the blood of innocent got children at Passover.
      
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      December 7, 2023 5:52pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        Matt
        
        Ooops. Israel has NEVER attempted a 2 state solution. They are against it!
        
        Hence the Camp David accords failing after Arrafat agreed concessions while Menachem Began gave NO CONCESSIONS.
        
        And then didnt keep his side of the bargain.
        
        Research is a wonderful thing when you can read. Especially history rather than propganda.
        
        Maybe this will help you a little bit. (But I suspect your mind is not open to historical evedence)
        
        In October 2004, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon’s senior adviser, Dov Weissglass, explained the meaning of Sharon’s statement further:
        
        The significance of the disengagement plan(IE END OF OCCUPATION) is the freezing of the peace process, and when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda.
        
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        December 7, 2023 7:19pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Maybe we could get them to put in the tunnel across to the North Shore?
  
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  December 7, 2023 11:56am
Swifty

Authenticity in Auckland real estate advertising:

📸 Look at this post on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/share/p/frx7znHffvPTS8jX/?mibextid=WC7FNe
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December 7, 2023 12:26pm
waikatosinger

A member of the commonwealth about to be invaded by another country. Are we going to just let this slide by without comment?
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December 7, 2023 12:30pm
- Ghost
  
  I believe Brazil are moving their military to the boarder to support them
  
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  December 7, 2023 12:45pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Colin Croft came from Guyana, and he barged one of our umpires, so yes.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:20pm
- waikatosinger
  
  If the UK, Australia, Canada and India (and maybe even little old NZ) were to send a naval vessel to visit Georgetown and some statements were made about members of the commonwealth taking a dim view of other members of the commonwealth being invaded then perhaps this could be stopped before it starts. Especially if one of the ships was HMS Queen Elizabeth.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:24pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q072L3IqYsc
Why greenies continue to be idiots with James Cockle.
Sean Plunket speaks to James Cockle from Restore Passenger Rail – Why greenies continue to be idiots with James Cockle. [5:02]
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December 7, 2023 12:50pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJ4ghjzMP5M
Is the media actively working to undermine the Government?
The fake news are election denialists. They’re trying to mount a coup by weaponising words, and using a negative narrative. How could the voters be so stupid? They’re not enlightened like us. [8:26]
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December 7, 2023 12:50pm
- Ghost
  
  Very obvious. They are going to make their attacks on the key government look amateurish to what the leftie media are about to unleash.
  
  The media have lost their sugar mumma and are going to go all out.
  
  But in reality calling them msm is false. They were simply the labour mouth piece, told what to print, told what to ask the ministers and PM.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:03pm
  - sungsamning
    
    Yes, I agree. I hope all fake news ad spend is withdrawn in the mini-budget. TVNZ, and RNZ should have their ‘news and current affairs’ programming closed down. Government ministers, and employees should totally ignore them.
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:10pm
Maggie Pie

R. E. UPDATE….

Next year will be yuge for Housing Investors brave (or silly) enough to get back into residential renting.
They will be able to terminate tenancies for NO REASON with 90 days notice.
About time!
And also, they’ll once again enjoy 80% interest-expense-deductibility from April 1 – rising to 100% a year later.

BOOM!! 😀 😀 😀
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December 7, 2023 1:03pm
- krazykiwi
  
  “They will be able to terminate tenancies for NO REASON”
  
  Not true. The reason of “because it is my private property and in a liberal democracy I should be permitted to do as I please with it” is a reason. As is “my mother-in-law want’s to stay and I’d rather she was there than under my own roof”
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:14pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Troo dat.
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:21pm
- Ghost
  
  I look forward to the property owner beside us kicking his tenant out.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:21pm
  - rouppe
    
    Only going to do that if they receive complaints.
    
    Have you complained to the landlord about whatever the behaviour is?
    
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    December 7, 2023 1:50pm
    - Ghost
      
      The owner has wanted him gone for a long time. A Hoarder who has wrecked the house and threatened the owner. Sadly will be a hell of a repair bill for the owner
      
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      December 7, 2023 2:13pm
      - rouppe
        
        Can be done under current rules. A bit harder but…
        
        Three documented instances of anti-social behaviour within 90 days. Each instance needs a written notice to be given to the tenant.
        
        The instances could be against the landlord, or a neighbour. Just document it.
        
        I’d put a lazy fiver that on the first or second notice, behaviour will suddenly change.
        
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        December 7, 2023 3:26pm
  - MCōs
    
    I used to think that about my rowdy South African neighbours until I found out they owned the house
    
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    December 7, 2023 2:28pm
- cmm
  
  The current restrictions on eviction just subsidise bad tenants at the cost to good tenants.
  
  Many people think that it is a cost to the landlord, but that really is not so.
  
  If the landlord is forced into a position of treating good and bad tenants the same, then he has to treat them all as bad tenants and the good tenants lose out.
  
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  December 7, 2023 1:31pm
- artemisia
  
  There’ll be a reason Maggie. But they won’t need to say what it is, or meet and then religiously follow all the current complex rules to terminate a tenancy.
  
  There will be terminations coming, not just a few either.
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:46pm
cmm

I wonder….
Is NZ the only country in the world where less than 1% of people can conduct their lives using the country’s official languages?
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December 7, 2023 1:27pm
Swifty

Bloody hell.

https://www.thepost.co.nz/nz-news/350126997/te-pukenga-disestablishment-confirmed?utm_source=stuff_website&utm_medium=stuff_referral&utm_campaign=stuff_skybox&utm_id=stuff_skybox

I have no strong views one way or the other on Te Pukenga, but what a massive waste; of effort, of time, of stress, of taxpayer money, of attention etc

I just don’t know.
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December 7, 2023 1:47pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  It was a waste of time, effort, money and human intellect. It was also an utter and complete failure. It was apparently dead upon arrival.
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:12pm
- dcrane
  
  Gives me hope the new government won’t let itself be absorbed by the sunk costs fallacy.
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:57pm
Maggie Pie

My partner’s mum reckons those useless arsehats in the Greens and Te Parti Maori
would be mighty pissed off.

They’d all have been looking forward to knocking-off today for the next 2 months.

LOL!!
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December 7, 2023 1:58pm
cmm

I see our Labour MPs are calling what Israel is doing in Gaza “genocide”.

If they can make that stick then of course we’d throw our borders open to genocide victims.

If Israel really are trying to commit genocide they’re doing a rather poor job of it. Sending in humanitarian aid would be a self-defeating exercise.

Of course it is nonsense. Targeting terrorists (I refuse to call them soldiers) is not genocide. It is self defence.
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December 7, 2023 2:45pm
- dcrane
  
  Interesting point, if true. By designating it a genocide, they can help Israel get what it really wants, which is to have all Gazans shipped somewhere else?
  
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  December 7, 2023 2:55pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  I agree it’s not genocide. Ethnic cleansing, perhaps, if the intention is to reoccupy the Gaza Strip. Mass murder, certainly, through indiscriminate targeting.
  
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  December 7, 2023 3:17pm
  - cmm
    
    “through indiscriminate targeting”
    Do you have even a shred of evidence to support that?
    
    From what I can see, every IDF target is extremely carefully chosen with care to minimise casualties while still achieving military targets. (ie. they are not holding back because Hamas are using human shields).
    
    Of course mistakes will occasionally be made and munitions will occasionally fail, but that is certainly not “indiscriminate targeting”.
    
    The only indiscriminate targeting I see is from Hamas using rockets that fall everywhere (a very large % not even making it out of Gaza).
    
    There does not seem to be any intention from IDF to reoccupy Gaza. Why would they want to do that? Gaza has absolutely nothing that Israel wants.
    
    They are very reluctantly having to put boots on the ground to secure the area.
    
    We see a lot of buildings being destroyed, but these are end points of the Gaza terrorist tunnels, making them Hamas assets and legitimate military targets.
    
    So I really struggle to see what you’re on about other than throwing shit and hoping some of it sticks.
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:46pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      15,000 deaths, the majority of them women and children, does not suggest much care to minimize civilian casualties.
      
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      December 7, 2023 3:59pm
      - Libertarians are right
        
        By children you’re including 14-19yo terrorists right?
        Also, considering Gaza has the highest population density in the world and Hamas actively surround themselves with “civilians”, that number is quite a bit lower than it reasonably could have been, especially assuming about 5,000 Terrorist deaths as advised by the IDF (which, just like Hamas’ death numbers should be taken with a grain of salt).
        
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        December 7, 2023 4:38pm
      - cmm
        
        The only source for these numbers is Hamas.
        In every previous conflict Hamas has massively inflated casualties. Of course they are doing so again.
        
        Of course they are taking steps to minimise casualties. If they were just bombing/shelling the crap out of the place with no warnings there would be hundreds of thousands of casualties.
        
        You bring zero evidence for your claims of ethnic cleansing or indiscriminate targeting.
        
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        December 7, 2023 5:14pm
  - Libertarians are right
    
    There is no indiscriminate Targeting. That is a lie.
    It looks like at least 25% of the deaths are Hamas terrorists (probably higher) and given that Hamas actively put their civilians in harms way, that’s a pretty impressive strike rate
    
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    December 7, 2023 3:48pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      You consider Israeli killing only 5,000 children to be impressive?
      
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      December 7, 2023 4:37pm
      - Libertarians are right
        
        No, I believe it is a tragedy.
        Israel is bombing Gaza to remove the terrorists. It has a right to do so. As stated, they have actually restricted civilian deaths to a considerably lower level than it could have been. When you add in the destruction of terrorist infrastructure (which again, they have a right to do) in incredibly dense population areas, it is actually an impressive level of restraint. It certainly isn’t indiscriminate as you dishonestly stated. As I stated though, it’s still a tragedy and Hamas are evil for putting their people in this position.
        
        Your reading comprehension is pretty much non existent at this point.
        
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        December 7, 2023 4:46pm
- Chuck Bird
  
  Did anyone else hear that MP co-leader call out “from the river to the sea Palestine will be free”?
  
  She should have been called out on that.
  
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  December 7, 2023 3:42pm
- Ra Henare
  
  [Mod – I have asked you before to stop with the insults you throw around at this blog and members on it]
  
  [Mod – deleted]
  
  I think of famous British Philosopher John Stuart Mill on freedom of speech.
  
  He argues that allowing people to air false opinions is productive for two reasons.
  First, individuals are more likely to abandon erroneous beliefs if they are engaged in an open exchange of ideas.
  Second, by forcing other individuals to re-examine and re-affirm their beliefs in the process of debate, these beliefs are kept from declining into mere dogma.
  
  [Mod – deleted]
  
  John White Wednesday.
  A long comment to support his apparent belief that thousands are not being killed in Gaza.
  
  Quote:
  “”So: Hamas is claiming 10-15,000 dead due to Israeli ground- and air-strikes. Where are the burials? Especially as their religion requires that Muslims are always buried, never cremated. It is a Koranic requirement that “the body be ritually washed and draped before burial, which should be as soon as possible after death”.
  Unquote.
  
  Of course a nonsequiter argument in my view.
  Because I havent seen it it. It isnt happening.
  
  But it did make me think.
  Firstly I figured with most western media downplaying the mass bombing of Gaza and the trope that they are only targeting Hamas fighters etc etc. Then of course that media would NOT be happy to post graphics or articles laying out the mass fatalities.
  
  Then I decided to see if I could get a better solution (yesterday I was on an international flight with no Internet, hence no immediate response to Johns comment.)
  
  Yes John there are mass burials. A simple 30 minutes would kick up numerous situations.
  A couple for your edification.
  https://twitter.com/i/status/1732437243808137584
  https://english.aawsat.com/arab-world/4684996-gaza-dozens-unidentified-bodies-buried-mass-grave
  https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/11/3/mass-graves-rushed-burials-funeral-rites-bypass-gaza-dead-amid-israel-war
  
  So John, I am sorry to say that evidence of mass killings in Gaza can be found.
  
  Israel targeting Hamas fighters ONLY.???
  
  Having served in a war zone and spend a portion of my life involved with “”distribution”” of bombs and rockets.
  The current propaganda from the west/Pro Israel camp would lead you to belief that explosions are done with surgical precision.. Therefore the civilians must have been in the same “rooms”” as the Hamas fighters.
  (a large portion of world population tag them as freedom fighters in the same way Nelson Mandela was tagged a terrorist by the South African Government of the day, but history as tagged him as a freedom fighter)
  
  Just a simple browse of video showing explosions in Gaza should educate you to the fact that this is not a Hamas only targeted strike. Keep in mind that munitions dont discriminate and can easily take out buildings in a zone of destruction which is many metres in diameter.
  
  Mass bombing means mass casualties to any life in the zone of destruction.
  
  There are many videos from drones showing complete city blocks reduced to ruble.
  
  [Mod – deleted]
  
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  December 7, 2023 3:54pm
  - cmm
    
    “Israel targeting Hamas fighters ONLY.???”
    
    There is a huge difference between targeting and killing.
    
    “There are many videos from drones showing complete city blocks reduced to ruble.”
    
    Yes, but consider that those city blocks have masses of tunnel entrances in them. A tunnel entrance makes the building a terrorist asset and a legitimate military target. Those are the rules of war. Any damage to the buildings caused in attacking these assets is on the heads of the people building these structures.
    
    The same goes for civilians killed because Hamas are using them as human shields. The rules of war forbid the use of human shields.
    
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    December 7, 2023 5:21pm
- NoFax
  
  It isn’t genocide as there is no attempt to kill Gazans as Gazans i.e killing will stop if Hamas surrenders. There is a clear war aim that does not involve the killing of civilians etc. It isn’t ethnic cleansing as the Gazans are not moving out of Gazans and Israelis moving in. The figure of 15k is from Hamas. Why would we trust anything they say? They said 500 dead at that hospital and it was deliberately targeting by the IDF – turns out it was one of the own failed rockets. I would have thought the murder and rape of civilians would have shown they are evil.
  Lastly, Gaza is not the most densely populated place on earth: Singapore has more people per square km than Gaza. Given the billions in aid that have flowed into Gaza, Gaza should be like Singapore not the hellhole that Hamas has made it.
  
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  December 7, 2023 9:16pm
Ghost

The Justice Minister is refusing to express confidence in Chief Human Rights Commissioner Paul Hunt and says he doesn’t believe it’s appropriate for the Human Rights Commission (HRC) to appoint its new Ti Tiriti-focused “shared leader”.

Article
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December 7, 2023 3:25pm
- sungsamning
  
  Well done that minister.
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:13pm
Master Mariner

The World needs New Zealand Covid Vax Data

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IswVM5FLaE

Why ? Because we vaccinated in NZ before any major out break of Covid.

Dr P McMillian, Vejon Health.
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December 7, 2023 3:35pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  It’s getting hot in the kitchen right?
  Someone ran.
  
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  December 7, 2023 5:28pm
Jack5

The down side of free trade enthusiasm of the last 75 years, enthusiasm which has seen so much manufacturing move to Asia …

When American’s Centre for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) simulated a war between the United States and China over Taiwan, the war game ended with Taiwan still free, but at a serious cost.

The Wall Street Journal says the game ended with the US losing two aircraft carriers and up to 20 destroyers and cruisers. China lost more 50 major surface warships sunk.

Rather than a draw, however, the game suggested a Chinese victory. China’s industrial power would it enable it to replace its losses fairly quickly, while it would take the US six years to rebuild its navy.

Eric Labs, a navy analyst for America’s Congressional Budget Office told the newspaper: “In terms of industrial competition and shipbuilding, China is where the U.S. was in the early stages of World War II. We just don’t have the industrial capacity to build warships…in large numbers very fast.”

In the early 1990s after the Cold War over, America pushed defence contractors to consolidate. Since then, emphasis on lowest-cost production discouraged the remaining contractors from having extra capacity needed to surge production, said Cynthia Cook, a defence industry expert at CSIS.

Meanwhile, the whole manufacturing base of the US has shrunk as labour-intensive production moved to Asia.

Ametrica’s defence industry now suffers from cost over-runs, and long production times.

Meanwhile in China, one shipyard that produces civilian vessels as well as submarines, has an annual production capacity higher than all the ships American has launched since 2014.

America’s defence industry now contrasts with the strength it reached in World War 2. By war’s end it had built more than 300,000 planes and launched all-welded “Liberty” cargo ships quicker than U-boats could sink them. It also built 29 aircraft carriers and 120 escort carriers.
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December 7, 2023 3:40pm
- All_on_Red
  
  A couple of things
  China no longer has access to the top tier Semiconductors it needs to make all that high tech military equipment so it cant replace what it has now and cant develop it anymore.
  They are all made in Taiwan, Netherlands, Japan, Sth Korea and the US and they have all agreed to ban exports to China. Biden has forbidden US citizens to work in China doing any of that.
  Chinese Jet engines also dont have the level of metallurgy the US ones do.
  On average a Chinese Fighter jet engine lasts around 3000 hrs.
  Boeing guarantees the engines in an F15 for 10,000 hours.
  Then there’s the Banking system. Good luck moving money without the US banks.
  And lastly all these war games pre-suppose that the Carriers will come within reach of China.
  They don’t have t0.
  Remember China imports 90% of its food and energy.
  Blockades a couple of thousand miles away will mean 100 million Chinese will die in the first year.
  Sure, they may capture Taiwan but the TMSC will get blown up so forget stealing those either.
  The US is retreating from globalisation with an intensive drive to onshore manufacturing.
  Asia will still be part of their trading partners but for low tech stuff.(lucky for us)
  Just my opinion anyway
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:10pm
  - Jack5
    
    China’s food imports, as raised by All_on_Red, are an interesting aspect.
    
    If there were a food blockade of China, NZ would suffer, too, as it’s our biggest export market (Australia’s, too).
    
    China’s food import sources:
    
    https://wits.worldbank.org/CountryProfile/en/Country/CHN/Year/LTST/TradeFlow/Import/Partner/by-country/Product/Food
    
    China’s share of Australian exports:
    
    https://wits.worldbank.org/CountryProfile/en/Country/CHN/Year/LTST/TradeFlow/Import/Partner/by-country/Product/Food
    
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    December 7, 2023 5:09pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Thanks Jack
      I have thought for some time that NZ should be focusing on developing our exports to India
      Its getting richer
      
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      December 7, 2023 5:59pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

This is where NZ Public Sector Departments have been infiltrated by the left.
“Julia Amua Whaipooti comes direct from left-wing criminal justice reform group JustSpeak, where she has promoted ‘a world without prisons.’ The appointment comes after the commission also hired Claire Charters, a co-author of the radically divisive He Puapua report,”
Drain the Swamp. Get rid of the Marxist deadwood.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/will-be-making-changes-justice-minister-refuses-to-express-confidence-in-human-rights-cmmr-says-two-ceos-not-sustainable/ar-AA1l7nV7?
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December 7, 2023 3:49pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  If two CEOs are willing to share the salary of one CEO, I s’pose that’s OK.
  
  But it looks like this Te Tiriti partnership of shared CEO is just a scambo for some Maori folk to ascend the greasy pole faster than others.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/301022433/human-rights-commission-unveils-new-shared-leadership-role-to-honour-te-tiriti
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:03pm
  - Swifty
    
    I wonder if they were directed to do that by the responsible Labour Minister, or if they have just done this off their own bat?
    
    Julia Whaipooti eh? On top of Clare Charters’ recent appointment our HRC really has become a nest of activists. Vipers who seek to impose their radical prescriptions on NZ society from within.
    
    Nuke it from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:48pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Got the bone carving and the barcode. Look at me, look at me!
      Share? Nope – all equal, but some more equal. Double pay.
      
      10 1
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      December 7, 2023 5:36pm
dave_c_

I see that a NZ gentleman has dropped a huge truth bomb, regarding what NZ Governmental data has to say about the real COVID death rates in NZ.
One hopes he is not put away for a long time, like many are predicting, as governments around the world are concurrently imprisoning anyone that reveals the ‘truth’ about the COVID vaccines current impact on humans.
If you think this is bullshit, I challenge you to view the following link.
https://theinfowar.tv/watch?id=6571207611af0259c0e352e1
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December 7, 2023 3:50pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  All I see is a bunch of sensational anecdotes.
  
  I just don’t see mass scale excess deaths in the data.
  
  https://www.stats.govt.nz/information-releases/births-and-deaths-year-ended-march-2023/
  
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  December 7, 2023 5:17pm
surfing

I just received this email from taxpayers.org.nz.

Regarding three waters…

At a confidential briefing last night, we discovered that the Department of Internal Affairs has hired 427 policy officials for Three Waters. That is whole office floors of bureaucrats working on policy alone.
….
As we suspected, they worked right through the election period – and were even signing binding contracts after the election and while the coalition deals were being negotiated!
…
The officials have gone about and signed up to exorbitant office leases, IT contracts we understand will cost around $500 million, and $12 million for ‘iwi collectives’ deepening the roots of co-governance.
…
All up, it looks like the officials have racked-up a billion dollars of contracted costs that the new Government can’t get out of.
That’s $503 for every New Zealand household – and not one cent of that went to actually fixing pipes!

It’s outrageous. Every single labour MP behind this should be rounded up and imprisoned for intentional negligence leading to a billion dollar loss.
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December 7, 2023 3:59pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Our public service is now run by cat like creatures. Luxon & Co must herd those cats. We must encourage Luxon & Co to do so.
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:29pm
- DimChappie
  
  As we know, scrapping 3/10 Waters was a big election promise so IMHO it must be done despite these extra costs. Note below officials are saying it is illegal to cancel it; so show us the Crown Law opinion on whether co-governance had to be in it.
  “We all knew that the last Government was doing all it could to embed Three Waters, but it is much worse than we thought.
  
  To put it mildly, the officials are going to town to pile on the ‘official advice’ that scrapping Three Waters is illegal and all too hard. They are delighted to have an unexpected (inexperienced?) Minister who hasn’t worked in the area and they are working hard to ‘school’ him on the sector.”
  
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  December 7, 2023 5:45pm
septic skeptic

More misrepresentation by Newshub:

Headline
“Really P*** me off: they won’t last”. Auckland Mayor sends strong message to Govt.

But the article:
Speaking with Newstalk ZB host Mike Hosking on Thursday morning, Brown made clear that if the central government “really p*** me off, they won’t last”.
And buried further down:
Brown said that Auckland council has been at odds with central government for a long time, something he hopes will change under the new National led government.

One can only hope that the coalition have the brains and guts to tackle the MSM head on. The contrast between the coverage of the first week of this government with what happened when Ardern got in speaks for itself.
It has got to the point where the most reliable and trustworthy item on the 6 o’clock news is the weather forecast!
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December 7, 2023 4:17pm
- MCōs
  
  Supposed to have showers today, but there’s been nothing but relentless sunshine in Manukau City
  Personally I was quite happy to see the disheveled Boris get his beans on the 6pm news
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:38pm
Maggie Pie

Sat down wth a glass of wine earlier intending to watch Question Time. But only to find it was a boring hour or so of ‘motion-passing’ on calls for a ceasefire in Gaza. Sheesh!

Anyway, what I was disturbed to see….thats the number of women MP’s on the left of the House, who were still wearing the same outfits they wore yesterday.

What does that tell you?
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December 7, 2023 4:18pm
- Ghost
  
  An hour to pass a motion? Damn, see your doctor, you need fibre
  
  I think you misunderstood them. Before parliament started it was their turn to wash up, they forgot to put the tea towels back.
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:23pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Who paid for the tea towels?
    Speaker needs to clamp down on dress standard.
    Wear it outside, but not in the House. This shit has t be stopped.
    Free speech my left tit. It is provoking to cause a reaction – or a diversion!
    
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    December 7, 2023 6:28pm
- MCōs
  
  I wonder how many blue pant suits Ms Willis has and how she tells them apart?
  Pant suits, trouser suits, business suits. What are they called in Godzone?
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:26pm
  - PeterB
    
    Looks classier that Arab tee towels the Greens are wearing.
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:34pm
  - fightingtemeraire
    
    They are colour coded!!!
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:35pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    How many different pha chang hung does your missus have cossie?
    
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    December 7, 2023 4:40pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    You just want to see her legs when she wears ‘hot pants’ right?
    
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    December 7, 2023 6:30pm
mogg

Luxon; “you had a 10 yr political mandate and you squandered it”.
Those words will be echoing in Hipkins’ ears until he is eventually booted out of leadership’
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December 7, 2023 4:26pm
Benedict Yu

What, practically, will this new senior appointment at the Human Rights Commission do?

“Advocate Julia Whaipooti has been appointed tatau-urutahi (shared leader) at the Human Rights Commission to honour the partnership intent of Te Tiriti.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/301022433/human-rights-commission-unveils-new-shared-leadership-role-to-honour-te-tiriti

I have read the article carefully. It is gibberish. I recognise that sounds harsh, but it is a correct description.

The HRC employs 80 people 🙁
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December 7, 2023 4:45pm
- Swifty
  
  The HRC has now become a taxpayer-funded incubator for radical, extremist and deeply unpopular human rights ‘claims’. It is now just a playground for far-left activists who seek to destroy our country as we currently know it and instead hand power and control to an elite and unelected minority.
  
  Get rid of it.
  
  The HRC has betrayed its charge, grossly overstepped its legitimate function and reach, and must now be closed down before it does any more damage. Any vestigial functions deemed essential can be folded into another Ministry.
  
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  December 7, 2023 4:59pm
  - PeeJay
    
    100% – it should be closed immediately.
    
    Yet Goldsmith is going to……drum roll please…….make some changes. Yep…..that will definitely work!
    
    Really? Literally tinker round the edges and keep the cancer in place?
    
    And the waste and gravy train continue, just managed slightly better.
    
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    December 7, 2023 5:13pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yup, drain the Swamp!
    
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    December 7, 2023 6:32pm
Steve Todd

I watched Vanessa Weenink’s maiden speech during the last hour or so. Oh, dear.

Weenink is the MP for Banks Peninsula, the former Lyttelton electorate once held by our nation’s first female MP, Elizabeth McCombs (from 1933 to 1935). Upon her death, her son Terence (Terry), succeeded her at the 1935 election, remaining the MP for Lyttelton until his defeat at the 1951 general election.

Terence McCombs (a former Minister of Education, 1947–1949) was the founding principal of Cashmere High School (1956–1968), which I attended between 1965 and 1969. He always made it very clear that his surname was pronounced McCombs, as in ‘combs’.

This afternoon, along came Vanessa Weenink, and what did she do, after proudly informing the House that she is the seventh female MP for Lyttelton/Banks Peninsula? She pronounced Elizabeth McCombs’ name as ‘McCoombs’!! Groan! When invited guests addressed us at morning assembly and thanked ‘Mr McCoombs’ for the opportunity to do so, you could see our headmaster visibly brace himself.

A very bad, and wholly unavoidable, fail on her part. If she was going to point out that she is the latest female successor in the seat to Elizabeth McCombs, the least she could have done was ensure she pronounced her name correctly.

In the great scheme of things, it’s not a biggie, but nevertheless, it was a mistake she should not have made.
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December 7, 2023 6:29pm
Swifty

Predator of children.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/convicted-sex-offender-cody-young-hunted-young-girls-on-the-streets-of-the-waikato/IQWQ7X6P7FAODCM6OIIHDDKFM4/
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December 7, 2023 7:49pm
- Ghost
  
  In 4 years time, if not less, I fully expect we will see a story of a sexually abused and killed girl from this monster
  
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  December 7, 2023 7:56pm
dcrane

Some AI fun for the night (if you can play twitter vids):

https://twitter.com/BrianRoemmele/status/1732505202430013820
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December 7, 2023 8:03pm