About
Contact
Advertise

Facebook
Twitter

July 11, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 11 July 2025

Like this:

Like Loading…

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment268

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (268)

Login to comment or vote

NeverMindTheBollocks

True colours revealed.

It just goes to show: you scratch a journalist, you find a left wing activist.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/566573/former-broadcaster-oriini-kaipara-to-contest-tamaki-makaurau-by-election-for-te-pati-maori
57 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:01am
- kowtow
  
  Not just “left wing” , the Maori party as currently stands is extremist and anti democratic.
  
  And that is not hyperbole.
  
  67 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:24am
  - mogg
    
    Labour’s co-governance is anti democratic, Willie Jackson’s “ tyranny of majority rule” is openly anti democratic,
    The Not-Green party with their extreme positions on everything are mainly Marxist, only democratic when it suits them.
    TPM crazies are openly anti democratic.
    These people are all in the running to form our next coalition government. Hipkins is never asked any questions about this situation, and he is desperate enough to give away anything in negotiations.
    Chloe for minister finance?
    
    18 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:50am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    And weren’t the media luvvies pushing her barrow. Watch for all out wall to wall coverage how cool she is
    
    7 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:11am
- Notsofast
  
  The first AI consideration on health risks for tattoos suggests these should be strongly discouraged rather than celebrated and promoted as a cultural event for young women.
  
  “Tattoos carry several health risks, primarily due to the potential for infection, allergic reactions, and long-term health concerns related to the ink. Infections can result from unsterile needles or improper aftercare, while allergic reactions can occur to the pigments used in tattoo ink. Additionally, there is emerging research suggesting a link between tattoos and an increased risk of certain cancers, particularly skin cancers and lymphomas.”
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:55am
  - NothingLeft
    
    If people choose to mutilate themselves with all the health and cost downsides in order to brand themselves as silly fashion victims then I am all for it.
    
    Its a great way of immediately visually filtering out a whole lot of superficial/air heads and various noxious types I have no interest in dealing with
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:57pm
Chuck Bird

If Trump or his advisors listen, this could be trouble for Albo.

‘Cancel culture isn’t the answer’: American Rabbi calls on Trump to ban Albanese from the US

https://www.skynews.com.au/opinion/cancel-culture-isnt-the-answer-american-rabbi-calls-on-trump-to-ban-albanese-from-the-us/video/d8ca4ea85c3185c9648f25070c92ace7
19 8
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:06am
Cassandra

Ani O’Brien: “Let’s not beat around the bush: Islam, in its most orthodox forms, is not compatible with Western liberal democracy. That’s not bigotry. It’s a fact. Name a single Islamic-majority country that upholds the values of free speech, women’s rights, safety to be gay, and secular law to the same degree as even the most fraught European democracy. I’ll wait.”

I agree. Islam is incompatible with the NZ I was born in and prefer. People who come here to live cannot expect to bring their prejudices with them. In matters of dress, music, diet and so on immigrants can retain their country of origin but in almost every other respect they’ve got to accept the New Zealand way of doing things and our language. This isn’t an option, it’s compulsory.
94 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:07am
- Keith White
  
  Gotta wonder what the critical level is where the parasitical ethnic bigots overwhelm the ability of the shrinking percentage of productive live-and-let-live Kiwis to subsidize them and keep the lights on and the shelves stocked…
  
  44 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:11am
  - sirknz
    
    A ~2% of the population, they start demanding special rights. At ~10% you have significant social problems.
    
    16 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:20am
    - Michael Sommerville
      
      See the UK right now.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:28pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    Apparently the “point of no return” for a subset population is ten percent.
    
    The Islamic population in France exceeded this a couple of years ago and it seems that the task of repatriating or even reducing them is now impossible.
    
    There are probably now more EU countries at or above this level.
    It would be interesting to know the NZ Islamic population, but we don’t do the census anymore so we will never know…
    
    10 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:24am
    - Don Beckett
      
      I read a recent report that the Muslim population in NZ is around 150,000, so on that basis they are about 2.7%
      
      6 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:07pm
      - sirknz
        
        This would explain their interest in pushing hate speech laws.
        
        6 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 2:06pm
- kowtow
  
  Turkey is a darling of the Establishments , citing it as a democratic beacon of democracy in the Middle East . War criminal Blair made a big play of Turkey being a bridge between Europe and the Middle East .
  We in NZ are regularly treated to quotes from Mustafa Kemal Ataturk , a genocidaire , whose idea of a “secular” Turkey only truly included Sunni ethnic Turkish folk and not any of the many many diverse and ancient groups who inhabited and still inhabit that troubled land.
  
  Anyway , how’s that “democracy” working out now under the Islamist Erdogan and before that “democracy” only depended on the military elites keeping the Islamists out.
  
  25 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:26am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Yes, we should not forget the genocide by Turkey of the Armenian people who were predominantly Christian around the time that Ataturk cam to power.
    
    13 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:42am
    - zulumonster
      
      The the underground cities in Cappadoccia were built for protection from Muslims well before Ataturk …
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:41am
      - Don Beckett
        
        Yes, but the Armenian genocide took place around 1915 – 1923.
        
        3 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:08pm
    - Cassandra
      
      Don Beckett: that’s untrue. Ataturk became president at about the time the Armenian slaughter stopped, 1923. It started in 1915 when Kemal was a brigadier defending Gallipoli.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:26pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Ah yes. I stand corrected – Ataturk was not to blame.
        But the genocide did happen.
        
        5 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:49pm
      - kowtow
        
        Mustafa Kemal was a member of the Young Turks.
        
        The Young Turks are cited as implicated in the Armenian genocide.
        
        btw The Gallipoli peninsula was largely Greek populated . They were ethnically cleansed from their ancient homeland prior to the Allied landings by the Turkish military.
        
        Please remind me where Mustafa Kemal served in 1915.
        
        4 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 1:09pm
- Philview
  
  I agree with your sentiment but is New Zealand still a Western Liberal Democracy. There are many things going on here that indicate we are half way to being a Tribal controlled nation. On the plus side those Tribes will not have a bar of any rising Islamic theocratic governance if such an issue ever arises in NZ.
  
  38 7
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:32am
  - Keith White
    
    “On the plus side those Tribes will not have a bar of any rising Islamic theocratic governance if such an issue ever arises in NZ”
    
    …except that a very high % of converts to Islam in UK prisons are ex- the local equivalent of bikie gangs, meth-dealers, and generalized mayhem-wreakers, of whom NZ has a full and complete share.
    
    31 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:17am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      The tribalists may just have started to strike a nerve on level headed voters. The big swing back to the government in the TPU poll shows that the voters are getting restless, I am sure the previous poll had opposition leading, if not it was neck and neck, yesterdays poll had a 6 seat difference.
      
      Roy Morgan poll that kept telling us the left or the right were both below 50% and could not for government swung right in behind the coalition last week as well, noting the votes heading to NZF in both polls are coming from Labour, as both had Nats and NZF either stable or slightly up, Peter’s seems to be carving up Labour centrists who will not want a bar of Greens or TPM
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:16am
  - kowtow
    
    The race hustlers will use any ‘allies” or cause that they think promotes their agenda.
    
    If they ever did take power and those allies were in any significant numbers or position to oust the race hustlers then you’d see a war between the two.
    
    This sceario has been played out, in one way or another all across the Global South ( nice term for non democratic authoritarian African / ME countries)
    
    18 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:30am
  - yobi
    
    I think you might find the “Tribes” you speak of may well have very similar beliefs that our islamic foe have.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:16am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      They are likely to differ on:
      1. Consumption of alcohol and drugs
      2. Presence of dogs in and around the house
      3. Eating pork…..
      
      but otherwise…
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:54pm
      - sirknz
        
        Mostly 2. I went to a Jordanian guy who used to cut my hair and he was against moving his family to some of the more Islamic parts of town or to Australia because of the rampant drug and alcohol use within the community.
        
        Regarding 3, the few I have heard of that tried it on the sly, rated pork very highly.
        
        2 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 2:26pm
  - Positan
    
    Up-ticked in error.
    
    1 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:01am
  - mogg
    
    In Europe the Left have formed an alliance with Islam, the UK now has sectarian voting in parliament. Islam will overwhelm by sheer weight of numbers, two thirds of births in London are now to parents who were born outside of UK, not all Muslim
    but a majority will be.
    There are now people in Parliament here, who would happily support any fanatical/activism to undermine the status quo.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:19am
  - Wandering Star
    
    Liberalism and democracy practically guarantee social collapse. This was spelled out beginning thousands of years ago by various philosophers who saw where excessive openness and lassitude leads.
    
    It is the very openness and “freedom” (which really means licentiousness and lack of constraint) of such societies that exposes them to corrosive ideas and eventual subversion from within the body politic.
    
    Only in a “Western Liberal Democracy” would a once cohesive and strong ethnic, racial and religious majority willingly give way to hoards of foreigners and promote a racial minority to the top of the heap. This is common to all current systems if this kind.
    
    How? By entertaining and eventually adopting outside ideologies that encourage diminished community and common virtues, self-loathing, collective shame and chronic altruism towards outgroups. The conditions for this outcome are excessive openness and tolerating the introduction and propogation of harmfully subversive ideologies, characteristic of and underpinning Western Liberal Democracy.
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:08pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Islam with its various exhortations to reprehensible behaviour, violence and murder and is theofascism ‘everything in the state’
  
  24 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:49am
- MCōs
  
  Does that apply in reverse?
  
  6 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:57am
  - herb1
    
    Clearly it does. There are also serious penalties if you don’t do so voluntarily
    
    7 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:08am
  - Cassandra
    
    Do you mean if I want to live in, for example, Malaysia? Of course. I’ve done just that. Used Bahasa as much as possible, did not criticise the Sultan and did not engage in forbidden acts. Alcohol and smoking were legal.
    
    18 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:10am
    - MCōs
      
      There are many immigrants from European speaking cultures who live in Thailand and never pick up more than a few words of the local language
      They hang out in bars with names like the Londoner, German Beer Garden, Irish Paddy’s Pub and complain how the migrants back home don’t fit in.
      
      14 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 9:25am
      - kowtow
        
        Are they trying to change the govt or engaging in political violence , funding foreign terrorism ,soaking up billions in benefits , converting and controlling the prison populations .
        Yes they might engage in sexual activities with the local women , but those women aren’t under the “care ” of the state and are paid and willing ……unlike the thousands of abused in England.
        Oh and they’re not marrying their cousins in huge immigration scams.
        
        27 3
        Report
        July 11, 2025 9:35am
      - Taieri
        
        There are many immigrants from European speaking cultures who live in Thailand
        ———-
        
        And how many of them are real immigrants that is permanent residents or/and citizens of Thailand? How many can vote and fully participate in Thai society? How many of them are protected from being kicked out of the country should the political sentiments change?
        
        A few answers can be found here:
        
        https://immiguides.com/immigration-guides/thailand/
        
        Permanent Residency
        
        Extremely limited: Only 100 granted annually
        Wait: Usually 1-3 years
        Requirements:
        Hold non-immigrant visa for 3+ years
        Fit one of these:
        Invest 3-10 million baht
        Work/Business
        Family (related to Thai citizen/resident, or guardian of Thai child under 20)
        Expert/Academic
        
        Citizenship (Naturalization)
        Requirements:
        3+ years living & working in Thailand
        Basic Thai language
        3 years tax payments
        Clean record
        Minimum 80,000 baht/month income
        Interview & written test often required
        
        14 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 9:43am
      - NoFax
        
        They are not immigrants – they are temporary residents that will never become citizens, are not entitled to benefits, and are not participating in the political process or demanding that Thailand change its culture. In fact, most expats want Thailand to keep its culture. I lived in Thailand, and you are right, I never learnt the language – but I never claimed it was my right to live there and that Thailand bends to my will. I was and will always be a guest in Thailand.
        
        8 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 10:58am
  - Keith White
    
    MC: If you’ve been or are now an expatriate, you know it does. Often, extremely forcefully-enforced…
    
    5 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:19am
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    Yes it does. I have little sympathy for Western tourists who find themselves in trouble for getting drunk in public or for wearing revealing swimwear in Muslim countries. When in Rome …
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:51am
- David Garrett
  
  Cass: …they’ve got to accept the New Zealand way of doing things and our language. This isn’t an option, it’s compulsory.
  
  The problem is it’s not compulsory mate – in fact the lefties stridently proclaim that with very few exceptions – female genital mutilation being one that comes to mind – immigrants from cultures incompatible to ours can keep living how they lived in whatever sandy shithole they left.
  
  Some examples: six bedroom state houses for small families so the sexes can be separated; “muslim only” hours at municipal swimming pools; the “right” to wear a hijab with only the eyes showing etc. etc. etc.
  
  36 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:34am
  - PurplePen
    
    Covering the face in public is very unkiwi. Yet unkiwi culture is somehow allowed to over-rule (need a better word here) our local kiwi culture which seems unfair.
    
    Part of our way and culture is to bend over backwards to accommodate. But there’s a limit to this.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:30am
    - rouppe
      
      It’s becoming common.
      
      Covid face masks in court. Masked store raiders.
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:01pm
- Paulus
  
  Got to relete in its own way to the Maori Renaissance in New Zealand.
  Once started cannot slow down or stop.
  
  5 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:52am
- mandk
  
  Islam is the worst pestilence in the world. It is brutal, violent, intolerant, and oppressive.
  
  Yet dim westerners – especially left-wingers and supposedly intelligent people – have bought into the notion that it is the religion of peace. Or they see support for radical Islam as a way of bringing about the collapse of liberal democracy.
  
  NZ should do its utmost to keep it out.
  
  15 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:05am
- PurplePen
  
  Agree. It raises several thoughts. Why do Islamic peoples wish to rush to non-islamic or Christian countries and democracies. There doesn’t seem to be much demand for Islamic peoples to rush to other Islamic states.
  
  Why is it only “white” nations feel they need to be or must be multicultural and inclusive.
  
  Surely as much as the government tries to protect our flora and fauna from invaders, they should also ensure the same protection for our kiwi way from foreign invaders.
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:37am
- Ra Henare
  
  Wonder if you could apply that filter (incompatible to NZ) to. Anyone coming here since 1840, Chinese, Indian, Jews, Buddhists, Red Neck Evangelists, Australians, etc etc.
  
  0 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 12:15pm
  - PurplePen
    
    Well prior to 1840 there wasn’t a single nation on the islands that make up what we know to be new Zealand today. So no immigration filter, no national identity no structure nor government.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 7:58pm
- kiwimike
  
  This should be a stop many people from coming here as visitors, students or workers…..
  
  let alone citizenship……
  or seats on parliament !
  
  0 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 12, 2025 6:29am
Biscuit

Not MY work but, topically, this is from the SMH…

If a famous Duke was wearing his favourite boots while dining on his favourite dish in his favourite New Zealand city, it would be a Wellington for Wellington in Wellington in Wellingtons.
32 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:18am
- mandk
  
  Did you hear about the Won family, from Korea, who went to the casino?
  
  At the end of the evening, they did a quick reckoning and discovered that one Won won one Won.
  
  18 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:29am
  - mogg
    
    One one was a racehorse, one two was one two,
    One one won one race, and one two one won two.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:02am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Two and too are not the same.
      
      1 1 was a racehorse, 1 2 was one too;
      1 1 won one race, 1 2 won one too.
      
      or
      1 1 was a racehorse, 1 2 was 1 2.
      1 1 1; 1 2 1 1 2.
      
      5 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:02pm
      - mogg
        
        Thanks I already know that to, two, and too are not the same, I was sitting in the queue for a warrant, my attention was elsewhere. Neither am I concerned with pedantry 🤣🤣
        
        4 2
        Report
        July 11, 2025 2:05pm
- Mike
  
  Would he have a beef with that?
  
  14 11
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:05am
  - Boy Geoff
    
    Not with mushrooms cooked in Victoria
    
    20 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:31am
  - Colville
    
    Its the mushrooms that worry me.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:39am
- kowtow
  
  Biscuit .
  
  If I might.
  
  If his father , a not so famous Earl ,was wearing a particular brand of casual polo shirt while snacking on his favourite cake , in his favourite Melbourne suburb it would be a Mornington for Mornington, in a Mornington, in Mornington.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:21am
pdm

Even mrspdm agreed that was clever Biscuit.

Greeting you from Wanganui this overcast, soon to be wet morning.
18 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:29am
- Biscuit
  
  Still fine/overcast here in the Riviera Of The South, pdm, but don’t you just bet that it’ll be peeing down before I get to watch those nice TMO chappies decide who will win tomorrow night’s Test at the Cake Tin…
  
  21 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 8:33am
  - pdm
    
    Biscuit I am sure you will indulge yourself, your good lady and the CAT by having covered Test seats.
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 8:47am
    - Biscuit
      
      There are such things as UNcovered seats?
      
      My good lady and the feline aren’t going…
      
      Last weekday of the school hols today and me and next door’s boy are going together on the morrow…
      
      13 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 8:58am
      - MCōs
        
        Last blokes’ test match I went to was this one when John Eales kicked the winning penalty.
        https://youtu.be/mbjVUuhDEDs?si=Zu0Z0udthOfG6hae
        
        6 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 9:10am
      - Tauhei Notts
        
        Mcos, I loved that bit where the Aussies named John Eales “Nobody”.
        Why?
        Because nobody’s perfect.
        
        9 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 9:47am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Its amazing that they can get people to pay to go to these matches.
    Expensive parking
    Expensive tickets
    Expensive beer (in plastic)
    Expensive bad food
    Usually cold and dark
    Slow games due to too many rules that no one person knows nor comprehends.
    TMO who goes back so many phases that he would qualify as a historian.
    Tries that are later disallowed.
    Players getting sent off for playing rugby.
    
    You can see why basketball rivals rugby in NZ.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:45am
    - hookerphil
      
      You forgot to mention all the over the top security, bag checks etc. Excelling in how to make the evening unpleasant. We have never been back anywhere since my wife had an unopened bottle of water taking from her and tipped out.
      
      3 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:27pm
- Ra Henare
  
  and greetings from another sunny day in SIem Reap, with maybe a shower later in the day.
  Off down to the market to buy as many fresh eggs as I like. $2.60 NZD a dozen.
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 12:19pm
Dudley Quaffquaff

Well, yeah, of course immigrants from Muslim countries ought to abide by New Zealand laws, same as immigrants from everywhere else and same as people born here. Who is saying otherwise?

What else do you mean by “accepting the New Zealand way of doing things”, is it being able to shear a sheep, supporting the All Blacks, going on caravan holidays, finding Rhys Darby funny, liking beetroot in a burger? I suspect a lot of us would fail a lot of those.

As for having to “accept our language”, I’m not sure what that means or why it should apply to immigrants from Muslim countries any more, or less, than it applies to immigrants from anywhere else. Everybody “accepts” that we speak English here. Nobody’s arguing that Arabic or Urdu should replace English as a public language of New Zealand. Not all immigrants speak good English, some don’t speak it at all, but that’s not specific to immigrants from Muslim countries. For that reason many official notices and communications are provided in several different languages. Is your contention that this shouldn’t be done at all, or that those languages should not include Arabic or Urdu?
8 33
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:34am
- Cassandra
  
  I’m sure you’ll work it out in due course, Dudley.
  
  27 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:12am
  - john1234
    
    I’m not
    
    10 4
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:22am
  - David Garrett
    
    Cass: I wouldn’t bet on it mate…he doggedly maintained that it was unclear who said the bottomless brunch was not true in yesterday’s debate on GG’s latest bit of objectionable behaviour
    
    19 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:40am
    - Cassandra
      
      I was being hopeful or perhaps even a tiny bit //.
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:42am
- Rusty
  
  @Dudley
  
  Why do immigrants from the Muslim countries want to come to this country in the first place if they are not interested in our culture?
  
  32 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:18am
  - G152
    
    Because they have a cause.
    They are not getting free of the religion they are bringing it with them
    
    18 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:29am
    - PurplePen
      
      In some respects NZ will always be protected from any serious infiltration and takeover such as being seen in the UK and parts of Europe by some Maori and the whole ToW business, plus also the likes of the Destiny Church. I don’t say I agree with what they might say and stand for, nor their approach, but they do offer some protection.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:44am
    - R
      
      with them ……. to resue the apostates and save said apostates from themselves!
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:29am
  - Dudley Quaffquaff
    
    Again – What do you mean by “our culture”, and why is it only immigrants from Muslim countries who are somehow required somehow to demonstrate an interest in it?
    
    3 18
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:29am
    - Pope Punctilious II
      
      Because Muslims’ track record shows they are less likely to assimilate than most other immigrant groups, that’s why Dudley.
      
      11 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:55am
  - Mike
    
    Why did the European migrants to NZ in the 1840 not adopt the native culture?
    
    7 26
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:33am
    - keepcalmcarryon
      
      Because cannibalism and slavery weren’t very nice.
      
      18 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 9:44am
    - Scott
      
      Mikey – the people who came to NZ from Britain wanted a better life. Becoming a Maori would not give them a better life. Living in a grass hut with bare subsistence living and fighting your neighbouring tribe was not many British people’s idea of a better life.
      
      Western civilisation is far superior. And everyone here agrees with me.
      
      19 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:03am
    - Taieri
      
      Different culinary requirements. They didn’t like roasted long pigs.
      
      11 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:10am
    - Swifty
      
      Because ours was better.
      
      9 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:27am
    - NothingLeft
      
      Because Maori language and culture are very poorly adapted to a post-paleolithic (and barely agrarian) technology base. Their militarised tribal order involving slavery, cannabilism, extreme patriarchal heirarchical control where chiefs and fighting men held all power and incessant warfare etc made their lives miserable and short. It isn’t fit for purpose in modern world, holding Maori back and losing out to basically every other culture by comparison.
      
      And pre-medieval beliefs of an arabian warlord who’s culture survived on predation of silk road trade and slaving and who plagarised various religious traditions from the middle east to create a religion designed to benefit middle aged men like himself to detriment of basically all other members of society is a similarly badly adapted culture for an industrialized technologic world where brains more than muscles or violence matter.
      
      Islam survives only through extreme guarding/walling off and control of their children, especially the girls with threat of violence and/or banishment against what western culture has to offer individuals, particularly women in the way of greater freedom. They enslave their women to preserve their male privileges.
      
      16 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:35am
    - Eastlander
      
      New Zealand is not a Maori country. It did not exist until migrants from Great Britain and Ireland created it, so the native culture is what those migrants brought with them.
      
      And now for the more obvious reply – if they had adapted to the Maori way then Maori would have been exterminated, and the only evidence they ever existed would be a few place names and middens filled with gnawed human bones.
      
      17 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:39am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Actually, to a degree they did. But the natives were much more interested in learning from the new migrants and adopting much of their culture, while preserving their own language & customs.
      
      15 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:54am
      - kowtow
        
        DB
        
        I’d suggest the colonials weren’t interested in the local cuisine ( of which culture is such a big part) , seeing as it involved eating one’s neighbours .
        
        8 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 11:26am
    - Pope Punctilious II
      
      Why would they have wanted to adopt a neolithic culture that practiced (amongst other things) slavery and cannibalism?
      
      10 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:57am
    - NoFax
      
      And how did that work out for the native? Should we not learn from history? Or are you saying it was a good thing that Maori lost their entire country?
      
      0 5
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:00am
      - keepcalmcarryon
        
        They didn’t have a country.
        
        5 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:55pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Correct keepcalm..
        Each tribe had it’s own tribal area & were in constant conflict with some of them – the others being friendly because of intermarriage or some thing else – but could become enemies at the drop of a patu or mere.
        There was no country as we know it.
        
        3 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 4:49pm
    - R
      
      Which one of the numerous tribal cultures did you have in mind?
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:31am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Mike: “Why did the European migrants to NZ in the 1840 not adopt the native culture?”
      
      Because it was obviously about 10,000 years behind their own. Simples.
      
      0 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 13, 2025 5:52pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Rusty: That’s an excellent question, but apparently even asking it is objectionable
    
    17 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:41am
    - Rusty
      
      David — I wasn’t labelling all muslims in NZ as not being interested in our culture but there are a number who don’t.
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:36pm
  - Scott
    
    Rusty – immigrants from Muslim countries want to stay Muslim and continue the Muslim way of life. The reason they come here is they can have a better standard of living while doing so.
    
    7 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:59am
    - Rusty
      
      Scott — yes I know that. I was referring to Muslims who show no interest in our culture. I’m sure there are Kiwis who don’t care either way.
      
      1 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:40pm
  - Keith White
    
    It’s what their Koran / Qu’ran teaches them to do.
    
    The Qur’an describes the faithful’s obligation to spread Islam, which should involve the conversion of individuals and communities to the faith – or to leave some unconverted as long as they agree to and assume the inferior status of dhimmi.
    
    The expansion of Islam is a divine blessing and must be striven for to signify (their) God’s favour.
    
    6 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:42am
  - Jethrod
    
    10 to 20 years age I noticed an infiltration of Islam into the Maori culture. On the surface it appears a reasonable thing , but extrapolated out I think it would be horrendous.
    I notice SBW is very involved still in Islam.
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:55am
  - gravedodger
    
    They are advancing the march of Islam, it is their sacred duty.
    Christendom were oh so fortunate the Winged Hussars turned the Muslim hoard back at “The Gates of Vienna nearly 350 years ago.
    
    11 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:24am
    - Don Beckett
      
      And about 100 years before Vienna, A Catholic Fleet under the command of Don John of Austria defeated the Muslim fleet at the Battle of Lepanto thus denying the dominance of the Mediterranean by the Ottoman Empire.
      
      “The Battle of Lepanto, fought on October 7, 1571, was a decisive naval engagement in the Gulf of Patras, off the coast of Greece. A Catholic alliance known as the Holy League, formed by Pope Pius V, defeated the Ottoman Turkish fleet. This victory marked a significant turning point in the Ottoman Empire’s expansion in the Mediterranean Sea and boosted European morale. ”
      
      So twice in 1oo years, the Catholic forces saved Europe from Muslim dominance. I wonder if we can do that again in our time?
      
      11 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:49am
    - rangitoto
      
      Memorialised by Sabaton:
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxlRJsQ7p2k
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:38pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        That’s great – haven’t seen it before. 🙂
        
        1 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 4:51pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    Same reason that A merry Cans come. For the opportunity to live a good life while sticking with their old customs. ie Telling everyone how great they are, eating hotdogs with mustard!!!!, travelling long distances every November to eat Turkey!! (when Christmas is a couple of weeks away).
    
    Muslims eat differently and have religious ceremonies/customs that may seem weird (I am reminded of Jewish and Jehovahs etc who also fit in to this category)
    
    1 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 12:25pm
- Mike
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  I think it’s a bit unfair to ask Cassandra to consider all the implications of his straightforwardly xenophobic comment.
  
  2 37
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:22am
  - Cassandra
    
    We’ll just have to agree to disagree, mike. As usual. Your definition of xenophobia not the same as mine obviously. My PoV is that immigrants should assimilate on all the important issues. IMO that’s not xenophobic.
    
    22 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:47am
    - graham
      
      I suppose Mike would also consider Australia’s citizenship test and interview to be xenophobic.
      
      To prepare for the test you should read the Australian Citizenship: Our CommonBond (OCB) resource booklet which is available in English and a range of community languages. The test is conducted in English only. All test questions are based on the OCB resource booklet.
      
      Questions in the citizenship test are based on:
      
      – Australia and its people
      – Australia’s democratic beliefs, rights and liberties
      – government and the law in Australia
      – an understanding and commitment to Australian values based on freedom, respect and equality.
      
      https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/citizenship/test-and-interview/prepare-for-test
      
      18 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:34am
  - Jethrod
    
    Who is the one up-ticker? It can’t be Mike!
    
    6 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:57am
- Simon
  
  “accepting the New Zealand way of doing things”
  
  In NZ you can say Islam was founded by a child molester. Its fairly simple.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:44am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Interesting that the Quran and the Bible have a lot of commonality????
    
    A quick extract.
    
    Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, and others: The Quran and Bible recount stories of these prophets, such as Abraham’s willingness to sacrifice his son (Ishmael in the Quran, Isaac in the Bible) or Moses leading the Israelites. So Abraham ultimate child molester?
    
    Jesus: The Quran acknowledges Jesus (Isa) as a prophet and messenger, born of the Virgin Mary, but does not affirm his divinity or crucifixion, which are central to the Catholic Bible.
    
    Mary: Both texts revere Mary (Maryam in the Quran). The Quran dedicates a chapter (Surah Maryam) to her, emphasizing her piety and the miraculous birth of Jesus, though it does not elevate her to the same theological status as in Catholicism.
    
    3 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 12:30pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      That is because Mohamed gained an imperfect knowledge of the Old & New Testaments in his travels around the middle East & Greece which gave him a foundational basis to justify his new religion, that he could gather his followers to in his campaign against his Arabian countrymen and other peoples.
      Islam is actually an extreme heresy of Christianity – as is claimed & explained by Hilaire Belloc.
      
      7 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:54pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Mohammed never left the Arabian peninsula. He lived almost his whole life in Mecca, brief travels to Syria in his youth and Medina when he was battling for dominance
        
        3 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:11pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Syria is in the Middle East. And don’t you remember his overnight flight on a winged horse from Mecca to Jerusalem? 🙂
        
        1 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:31pm
    - kowtow
      
      ‘Interesting that the Quran and the Bible have a lot of commonality’
      
      And do you know why.
      
      The founder of Islam was very influenced by Christianity and Judaism in his early days. It is thought he learned of it on the camel caravans into Christian territory . He was literally founding a new religion against his home town crowd of Meccans , who made money from pilgrims going to the Kaba there .
      
      That’s why early Koran/Islam is a religion of peace , it plagarises the Bible .( Christian and Jewish)
      
      He had to leave Mecca and took up in Medina . The Medina folk were robbers , made their money stealing by the sword . They forced his hand as they had no time for turn the other cheek niceties . Thus came the sword verses , to post event justify the Medina violent attacks and his subsequent use of that army to conquer all before him.
      
      Prior to his going back to Mecca in glory as the new prophet he had his followers pray towards Jerusalem . The most recalcitrent of folk in the Arabian peninsula that he was now conquering were Jewish tribes . They refused to convert. That’s why there’s so much anti semitism in the Koran . They fought against him to defend their towns , women and children. In defeat the men were beheaded and the women sold into slavery ( also involving sex slavery)
      
      Sound familiar ?
      
      Muslims rightly say Jesus is a prophet of Islam , but one dare not claim that Jesus is God .That is a blasphemy that could get you killed in many places in the Muslim world and will certainly get jail time .
      
      The daily Muslim prayer is an affirmation that Islam is the only true religion and by extention that Christianity and judaism are apostacies. This is repeated 5 times a day and is accepted as literal truth .
      
      “Guide us on the straight path,
      The path of those who You have bestowed favor, not of those who have evoked [Your] anger or of those who are astray”
      
      Jews are those who have evoked God’s anger and the Christians are the ones who’ve strayed.
      
      4 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 3:14pm
- rouppe
  
  Every form I’ve filled out here in Thailand is written in Thai and English. English as the global common language.
  
  Since in nz our dominant language is English, I expect official notices and communications to be in English. Not Arabic. Not Urdu. Not mandarin. Not French, German, Italian or anything else.
  
  I otherwise get by with Google translate. That’s on me. I will take formal Thai language classes in the increasingly likely event I move here.
  
  2 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 2:10pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  This is two years old but the naivety reported in this WaPo article still amazes and amuses me:
  
  “We welcomed you,” former council member Catrina Stackpoole, a retired social worker who identifies as gay, recalls telling the council this summer. “We created nonprofits to help feed, clothe, find housing. We did everything we could to make your transition here easier, and this is how you repay us, by stabbing us in the back?”
  
  Her reaction caused by the decision in June 2023 of the six-member council of Hamtramck, Michigan to block the display of Pride flags on city property.
  
  Hamtramck has gone from being “little Warsaw” to “little Yemen” in the space of two generations.
  
  3 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 5:14pm
NothingLeft

Tracking the ‘just how fucked are we’ progress of AI, today xAi releases Grok4, which is now significantly smarter than humans on wide range of tasks. It scored >50% on “humanities last exam” test questions created by university researchers, basically a large corpus of PhD questions across a wide array of fields where lacking the wide sweeping cutting edge generality of AI few if any humans alive could score better than 5%

Full release video here:
https://youtu.be/SFzrcPwvrBw?t=38

Progress continues to be scarily rapid. AI on track to surpass almost all humans intellectually in next 1-2 years.
5 7
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 8:59am
- Mike
  
  Grok is already reaching high intellectual levels – by turning Nazi.
  https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jul/09/grok-ai-praised-hitler-antisemitism-x-ntwnfb
  
  9 14
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:20am
  - Simon
    
    AI is about pattern recognition. What is going on!?! on.
    
    7 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:39am
    - Mike
      
      Apparently there was a tweak to Grok so it would support ‘white genocide’ conspiracy theories.
      
      1 5
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 9:53am
    - RoboRob
      
      It is fed on twitter posts and this is picking up a bunch of crazies as well as bots spam posting Nazi / racist propoganda. Not a good diet 🙂
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:00am
      - Ra Henare
        
        Easy solution. Add to your Grok request.
        do not use content from x.
        Ask me questions to ensure your response is 95% accurate.
        
        This last one is very very helpful. In my experience, very good questions.
        
        Remember, if you use Grok instead of Google, you will get crap answers IMHO.
        
        1 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:33pm
    - PurplePen
      
      Something which human brains are adept at, pattern recognition and putting things in boxes and labelling them.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:46am
    - Wandering Star
      
      Grok and AI in general isn’t subject to the same social pressures requiring the rest of us to conform to certain ideological and political dogma. As others note, it reaches conclusions based only on masses of data and a highly deveopled sense of pattern recognition. That’s what leads Grok to become a Nazi and “antisemite.” Remember how almost nobody had such attitudes prior to instant access to information and shared opinions largely via smartphones?
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:42pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    I don’t know about Grok, but if you put a macron over the “o” you get something approximating the breeding call of the white-faced heron: “grōk”.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 12:55pm
- Gary Benner
  
  You could say that even Google Search currently outperforms most humans on general knowledge.
  
  But understand that AI is simply computational (to an amazing degree admittedly), but is not sentient and able to replicate the higher processes that lead to high emotional IQ.
  
  A good example is from the movie Rainman where the Dustin Hoffman character could do amazing calculations, count the sticks dropped on the floor etc, but lacked what we all know is human being”ness”, ie being the full quid.
  
  It is the humans who employ AI that will benefit most.
  
  10 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:20am
  - Taieri
    
    Google Search currently outperforms most humans on general knowledge
    ———–
    
    Google Search has no knowledge. It can’t think. It’s just, as you acknowledge, a pattern matching algorithm.
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:12am
  - waikatosinger
    
    People once imagined that AI would do very well at the scientific stuff and would suck the humanities. But it has turned out to be the exact opposite.
    Those in the humanities who thought they could never be replaced by AI because what they did was oh so human and emotional were actually among the first to be replaced. AI can instantly make beautiful art and can write amazing stories.
    On the other hand AI still struggles with advanced maths, although it is rapidly improving.
    
    5 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:13am
- Paul
  
  Nah, the PhD “comprehensive” exam (it goes by different names in different places) tests whether you should be allowed to start on your thesis work. If you do not know enough about your discipline, you would just be wasting everyone’s time.
  I would expect a decent AI model to do well on that test. But the next stage involves actually creating new knowledge and writing it up in a thesis. And on that, AI models will fail horribly, because creating new knowledge is not what they do.
  
  11 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:28am
  - David Garrett
    
    Paul: creating new knowledge is not what they do.
    
    Not yet. I find the rapid advance of AI quite scary. I saw an interview with Bill Gates recently. He said that the AI revolution will be of much greater effect on humanity than the invention of the computer – and particularly the PC. If anyone has some conception of what is coming it must be Mr Gates.
    
    9 3
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:45am
    - Paulus
      
      As one who stared using IBM computers commecially in the late 1960s, the thought of AI frightens the hell out of me, and I have live computers right through.
      At 85 I am only alloowed to think the Good Lord, when I get there, will not test me in AI.
      
      13 2
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:02am
      - Quail
        
        The accuracy of AI doing what appears to be averaging data/ fact is highly suspect ,
        In particular technical data is being altered to a degree that we need to pick up a book to confirm or otherwise accuracy
        This very real problem will mean AI credibility ,where precision is required ,could limit use to the incompetent and or lazy! Downstream more major problems could arise.
        
        5 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 11:38am
    - Taieri
      
      He said that the AI revolution will be of much greater effect on humanity than the invention of the computer
      ————-
      
      It will. Because it can and will be controlled by a very narrow selection of people. Not necessarily for entirely altruistic reasons.
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:18am
    - Gary Benner
      
      Anyone who suffered through the Microsoft dominance knows that Gates is not a technological visionary – he was simply an opportunistic businessman. And all credit to him for that. But compared to the likes of Jobs, Ritchie, Torvalds, Vinton Cerf and Robert Kahn, Postel, etc, he is just another tacky, self seeking individual adding little to the overall quality of life of society.
      
      Gates himself has missed the boat in regards to AI, having focused on vaccine$ that have now met their Waterloo. Musk is building the biggest AI data centre (Collosus), along with Amazon, OpenAI & Google. Microsoft is having to catch up having put most of their efforts into their Azure systems technology. Sure they have CoPilot in Windows 11 but they are not leading the fray. Gates is only a part time advisor to Microsoft, but to say “he has some conception of what is coming” is bit of a stretch.
      
      Saying that “the AI revolution will be of much greater effect on humanity than the invention of the computer” is somewhat facile, because what we call AI is just the latest iteration of “computer” technology. AI has been around a while. I worked with systems that employed “neural networks” (machine learning model) that is the basis of AI over 20 years ago. Giving it an acronym is just marketing. Microsoft were good at that. .NET was their marketing buzz for their current version of whatever they were developing, all built on previous technology.
      
      We will shortly all get used to the advantages, and side effects of AI, as we have done with websites, email, search engines et al, coping with the viruses, phishing sites etc that come with it (all from humans I might add). Then it will be on to the next hyper-technology that gets foisted on us, all the while making greater use of what technology affords us.
      
      5 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:04am
    - Ra Henare
      
      Maybe 20 years ago, Gates would have been a guru, now he is a rich k id throwing money at pet projects.
      
      Have listened to some of his musings over recent years, gave up as I perceived he was in his own limited intellectual/thinking bubble.
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:38pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    you misunderstand HLE, it’s not a standard test administered to PhD candidates, it’s a corpus of 2500 questions composed by a large number university researchers to test cutting edge knowledge across myriad fields, and so is used as a test of AI systems reasoning in difficult and esoteric tasks:
    
    “The dataset consists of 2,500 challenging questions across over a hundred subjects. We publicly release these questions, while maintaining a private test set of held out questions to assess model overfitting.”
    https://agi.safe.ai/
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:39am
    - Paul
      
      Thanks for the link, NothingLeft. On the first page, I find “HLE tests structured academic problems rather than open-ended research or creative problem-solving abilities, making it a focused measure of technical knowledge and reasoning.” That’s what I said, although I think I said it more clearly. 🙂
      Actually, the source tells us the performance of various models on this test, and I was surprised how poorly they perform – none of them gets much above 20% accuracy, and half are below 10%. I expect their accuracy to improve rapidly because the designers will tune them to improve on this test, but they will still not be “creating new knowledge and writing it up in a thesis.”
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:55pm
- Jethrod
  
  The only thing you can’t do with AI is take it home to meet Mum and Dad!
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:59am
- R
  
  all humans…..this won’t be difficult in many cases. Winston Churchill identified this intellectual shortfall back in the 1950’s or thereabouts
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:35am
Chuck Bird

There are a lot of people in the CO2 Coalition.

https://co2coalition.org/about/
5 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:04am
- Jethrod
  
  Wow wee. Certainly a lot of heavyweight learning there.
  
  2 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:13am
- john1234
  
  I hope they aren’t expecting any more research grants to come their way s as they’ll be cancelled shortly.
  
  5 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:28am
- JJ56
  
  Not many sheilas.
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:53am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    I noticed that and wondered why.
    
    1 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:26pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      There are some women who are not woke.
      Our own Maggy W is a perfect example. 🙂
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:33pm
RoboRob

NZ first now third largest party…

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/politics/nz-first-surges-past-act-in-new-taxpayers-union-curia-poll/

Nat 33.9
Lab 31.6
NZF 9.8
Green 9.4
Act 9.1
TPM 3.5

‘Labour’s Chris Hipkins and National’s Christopher Luxon have almost identical levels of support in a new poll.’

Margin between Nat and Lab 2.3%

Comment
Interestingly the trend for minor parties in coalition government is for them to drop in the polls, often substantially. NZF is also traditionally weakest mid term.
20 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:14am
- MCōs
  
  Come the next election three of the minor parties have no choice, but stick with a predetermined main party.
  NZF has a history of flip flopping depending on where Winston feels he can gain the most influence.
  I wouldn’t put it past him to side with Labour again particularly as by doing so he could sideline TPM. I don’t think he cares too much for Act either.
  It would be back to 2017.
  Mind you Labour might not stomach the idea of having Jones and Costello in cabinet
  
  15 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:42am
  - RoboRob
    
    Winstons ability to go with either side gives NZF far more power then the other minor parties. The Greens and ACT would both be wise to do this too.
    
    Act could certainly work with Labour. If that was a possibilty National would need to work harder to keep right wing voters happy. At the moment National seem to think, ‘oh well if we piss them off they will just go to ACT and we get back in anyway’.
    
    5 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:04am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Seymour did try it in 2023, at 18% he stated he could sit on the cross benches with the left if he did not get his way seen Act lose half their support but never ever recover
      
      1 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:16pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    Willy Jackson might not stomach the idea of having Jones and Costello in cabinet, either. And the social conservatism of most NZF MP’s is anathema to the white liberal luvvies who make up most of the Labour caucus.
    
    6 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:00am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Labour Greens and NZF won’t be enough, if he delivers us Labour and Greens again he can stick his surge up his jacksy
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:23am
    - RoboRob
      
      NZF and ACT are benefitting from Nationals weakness. If Winston goes with Labour next election do we blame Winston or National?
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:18pm
    - rouppe
      
      On the poll above those three make 50.8%
      
      How is that not enough?
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:17pm
- Jethrod
  
  It seems unfortunate that when David Seymour starts making comments, his popularity goes down. He has been more in the news lately, because he has been deputy PM, and appears a lot on the News.
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:06am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    It’s his attitude, I said NZF we oils take over the third biggest party, and what has happened? act has gone from 3 rd biggest at one stage and within striking distance from Labour, to now 5th biggest and on its day TPM are snapping at their heels. I know i will be down voted hugely, but it’s fact, and Morgan poll kind of mirrors this poll
    
    0 6
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:19pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Only one party should be worried about this poll and it’s Labour. Nats slightly up, Act stable, NZF surge taking support on Labour. Greens and TPM radicals are scaring Labours centrist, and as long as Labour stay below Nats it should be status quo next term.
  
  I note the Morgan poll shows Nats stable, Act stable, NZF up as well, it shows the coalition well in front with Labour on 28%
  
  8 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:22am
  - RoboRob
    
    National should be very worried they are only 2.3% ahead of a very weak Labour party.
    
    It’s like a sports team, if you win games you make the finals, if not you end up relying on other teams results. Does National really want to rely on NZF and ACT to get into power?
    
    4 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:20pm
RoboRob

Cant find a link but, HDPA referenced it this morning.

From Co pilot

‘As of today, the government has officially announced a dedicated team to lead the review of Te Tiriti o Waitangi clauses in the Education and Training Act, including Section 127. This team will be responsible for:

Evaluating the clarity and consistency of Treaty references across the Act

Advising on whether these clauses should be retained, revised, or removed

Reporting to the Justice Minister, who is overseeing the broader Treaty clause review’

Seems like good news and a reversal from the government. Until you read whos on the team. Then you understand its just a delaying tactic to remove focus on this issue….

‘👥 Members of the Review Team

The team includes a mix of legal experts, education leaders, and Māori representatives:

Sir Kim Workman – Former Police officer and respected advocate for Māori justice reform

Dr. Kathie Irwin – Māori education specialist and academic

Professor Andrew Geddis – Constitutional law expert from the University of Otago

Dr. Hana O’Regan – Ngāi Tahu leader and Māori language advocate

Judge Craig Coxhead – Māori Land Court judge and expert in Treaty jurisprudence

They’ll be supported by officials from the Ministry of Justice and Ministry of Education, with input from iwi and community stakeholders.’

So this is just a sop to upset right wing voters. The team will recommend keeping the clause, like National wanted to, and provide ‘expert guidance’ on why it is important to do so. A political game and total waste of tax payer funds.
36 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:22am
- Ghost
  
  I wouldn’t trust ai, this is what nz herald reported yesterday
  
  Story is paywalled.
  
  A former member of the Waitangi Tribunal will lead a panel of four people to review every Treaty clause in the statute book.
  
  Former member of the Waitangi Tribunal David Cochrane, a lawyer, is chairing the group. He is also part of a review of the…
  
  He is joined by Marama Royal
  
  The fourth member of the group is James Christmas
  
  Our job is to provide advice to ministers and that’s what we’ll do,” he said.
  
  He said the review would be unlikely to go beyond August.
  
  Article
  
  8 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:34am
  - RoboRob
    
    Tried hard to find an article. Looking up these guys (you only listed 3 of the four)
    
    David Cochrane –
    Appointed to Waitangi tribunal by Labour.
    
    Worked on treaty policy with Chriss Finlayson who is recently quoted as saying ‘There is never a problem on the Māori side. There’s always a problem on the civil service side. And I don’t blame the politicians for this. I blame the civil servants..…’.
    
    Marama Royal
    https://edenpark.co.nz/trust_biographies/marama-royal/
    
    Ngati Whatua Orakei Reserves Board – Chair
    Ranginui 12 Trust – Chair
    SkyCity Community Trust – Chair
    AUT – Pro-Chancellor
    Auckland Police Taumata – Co-Chair
    NICF (National Iwi Chairs Forum) – Chair – Pou Take Ahuarangi
    
    James Christmas
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2023-meet-james-christmas-potential-attorney-general/6XEAWAZBPFAUDL4ADXG7A4SVZE/
    
    James Christmas MA LLB is a barrister who was senior ministerial advisor to Christopher Finlayson (2011–16)
    
    ‘Audrey Young talks to lawyer and author James Christmas, who is tipped to become Attorney-General and Treaty Negotiations Minister if National forms the next Government.’
    
    Yup, doesn’t seem much better then the AI list ! Either Maori or people with the same belief set as Chris Finlayson.
    
    11 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:24am
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    If anyone from the Tribunal is involved in the “review”, there’s no chance of section 127 being removed from Stanford’s bill. And I think she knew that.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:10am
    - RoboRob
      
      Which is why this is a political stunt in attempt to calm the voting base.
      
      2 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:21pm
- Paulus
  
  Sound like a load of crap will emanate from this unbiased Committee.
  Bye National !
  
  22 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:05am
- imalwaysright
  
  ‘Evaluating the clarity and consistency of Treaty references across the Act
  
  Advising on whether these clauses should be retained, revised, or removed’
  
  “Clarity and consistency” are odd features to measure if one of the options is to remove the references.
  
  Wouldn’t it be logical to evaluate “conflicts”, caused by treaty references, that are detrimental to the prime purpose of education?
  
  Clarity and consistency suggests a rewrite to make the references more palatable, or hide them in the minutiae, knowing full well that every school Board of Governors will know they are there and only implement policy that supports the references.
  
  10 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:09am
- RoboRob
  
  Ok RNZ has posted this…
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/566635/reviewers-of-legislation-treaty-clauses-expected-to-report-back-in-months
  
  This is massively different to what I understood. I thought this review was just into the education act. It appears they are doing the whole thing!
  
  We understood from the PM and others, that Goldsmith was doing the review. I guess he has spent the last 1.5yrs defining the terms for the review and hand picking the members. Seems strange to spend so long setting up the review and then to give them so little time. It’s almost like this is all a reaction to some sort of politcally damaging recent event.
  
  I suspect the outcome will be rewording, at best. Labour and Maori will claim the world is ending and National will say ‘look we did good, they are angry’. Will be very happy to be proven wrong.
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 1:36pm
  - Ghost
    
    It doesn’t need much time to be done.
    
    1 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:27pm
    - RoboRob
      
      So the 1.5yr wait for it to start was because?
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:32pm
      - Ghost
        
        It was announced in October last year that they were doing it. Why are you in such a rush. The review will be done by the end of august with the recommendations then given to each minister they relate to.
        
        3 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:27pm
Gulag1917

I have worked with 16 Muslims for the last 15 years and not one ounce of trouble. Model citizens.
11 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:26am
- David Garrett
  
  Gulag: That is entirely unsurprising – and the reason is they are currently less than 1% of the population.
  
  In every western country which has allowed its Muslim population to exceed 2% there is “trouble” – just over the ditch in Australia included, where the current Muslim population is about 2.5%.
  
  In every western country which has allowed its Muslim population to reach 5% there has been Islamic terrorism. Check it out for yourself.
  
  42 6
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:49am
  - David Garrett
    
    Perhaps the downtickers (Not Mikey, he never responds) could cite ONE European country which: 1) has a Muslim population of 5% or more; and which 2) has NOT yet experienced Islamist terrorism.
    
    26 5
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 9:59am
    - Mike
      
      We specifically investigate rates of immigration from Muslim majority countries and countries involved in armed conflicts. We find no relationship between immigration and terrorism, whether measured by the number of attacks or victims, in destination countries.
      
      https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0167268119302471#:~:text=We%20specifically%20investigate%20rates%20of,or%20victims%2C%20in%20destination%20countries.
      
      2 10
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:20am
      - Jack5
        
        Mike/Milky, the article you link to is a couple of months short of six years old.
        
        Lot of Muslims have moved into the West since then.
        
        5 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 1:52pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      DG, Oz does not have 5% but has had Islamic terrorism as recent as a week ago.
      
      10 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:36am
  - Inandout
    
    DG, absolutely spot on with percentages and this is the result of over 5%.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZypdNYhA9OI
    
    7 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:27am
  - Gulag1917
    
    David, The British seem to have less trouble with Muslims than the French because the former handle things better.
    
    3 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 12:11pm
    - kowtow
      
      Gulag
      
      Do you follow the English news .
      Rape gangs ignored .
      prisons now under control of the muslim gangs
      cousin marriage
      ghettoes
      New political groupings based on religion, not politics
      Today’s news is Iran interference
      Terror funding
      Huge numbers travelled to join ISIS
      Two tier policing of public order events
      
      and the 20th anniversary of 7/7 has just passed .
      
      6 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:52pm
      - Gulag1917
        
        Comparison of Britain v France, the latter is in a worse state.
        
        0 0
        Report
        July 12, 2025 9:23am
- Ultima
  
  Gulag, my experience too. However, Muslims are good because they are good people, but the religion is not good.
  
  4 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:11am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Good for what?
    
    0 6
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:31pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      That’s a bit rough, Chuck.
      I bought my last car from a Muslim of Indian ethnicity. Did a good deal & a good person. There was a case of a young woman who had bought a car from one of his associates (not the same business) The car broke down after a few weeks & the dealer would not take responsibility.
      This man replaced her car for free, even though he had noting to do with the trade. Of course he was protecting his faith, but good on him. My female dentist is also muslim.
      
      2 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 1:37pm
    - Ghost
      
      Actually good for a lot.
      
      The Muslim orthoepic surgeon at our hospital is a bloody good guy. As are the Muslim nurses at the hospital and the lab.
      
      3 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:31pm
- sirknz
  
  I’ve worked with a number of Muslims over the years too and even been somewhat friendly with a few. Very often they are quite nice people, but the more I learn about Islam, the less I trust them.
  
  Going off overseas examples, when they are minority they are very friendly and behave very well. As their numbers increase to roughly 2% of your population, they start to demand special rights (like the halal kfc lady a few years back) and then by a certain part of the demography (internet cited as 10%), they cause significant social issues.
  
  13 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:34am
- rouppe
  
  I happened to speak with an Australian guy yesterday who’s friend lost their business because the four Muslim guys working in the store/ distribution area stole over quarter of a million dollars of stock.
  
  Why didn’t audits pick it up? They did the audits.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 2:22pm
  - Taieri
    
    They didn’t steal because they’re Muslim. They stole because they’re thieves.
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:40pm
    - rouppe
      
      Sure. I was simply posting a counter to Gulags experience
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:01pm
john1234

Nary a mention of this poll in the media. Where are you Maiki?
11 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:29am
sirknz

I note that nowhere in Whanau’s response did she deny that the events happened.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360753982/ray-chung-says-neighbour-was-source-salacious-new-years-party-gossip-email-about-mayor-tory-whanau

Yay for dirty politics…
18 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:41am
- MCōs
  
  She flatly denied it ever happened
  Ms Whanau may or may not be a particularly good mayor, but to cast such groundless aspirations is disgraceful
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/exclusive-wellington-mayoral-candidate-ray-chungs-sex-and-drugs-gossip-about-tory-whanau/YIEIRU6J3FF7POYARBERTAW6FA/
  
  5 9
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 9:53am
  - David Garrett
    
    MCos: Well, if the allegations are groundless, and she can prove that, her defamation suit against Mr Chung would be very successful, and result in considerable damages plus costs.
    
    The claims that she: 1) groped a man in a bar; and 2) told him he could have the best night’s sex with her that he had ever had; and 3) boasted about having drugs at her house [it’s unclear whether she made that statement] and 4) had a night of anonymous sex with the said man are all highly defamatory.
    
    Trust me – I’m a lawyer!
    
    24 5
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:04am
    - Mike
      
      Kiwis ranked doctors, police and scientists as significantly more trustworthy than the government, media or lawyers.
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/rebuilding-better-poll-reveals-the-key-institutions-most-trusted-by-kiwis/QSZZBUTYBZGNPOL255PQKIO3UM/
      
      5 6
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:17am
    - MCōs
      
      I was pointing out that she has indeed denied that the events happened.
      I added that I thought Mr Chung’s aspirations were disgraceful. He repeated some lewd gossip.
      Whether Ms Whanau wants to sue the guy is up to her, not me.
      Breaking!
      She’s taking legal advice.
      https://www.1news.co.nz/2025/07/11/whanau-hits-back-at-chung-over-malicious-sexist-rumour-sent-to-councillors/
      
      4 5
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 10:54am
      - David Garrett
        
        MCos: What have Mr Cheung’s “aspirations” got to to with anything? He aspires to be mayor of Wellington…nothing wrong in that,
        
        9 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 10:59am
      - MCōs
        
        Wrong word, should have written *aspersions*
        as in ‘casting aspersions’
        
        7 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 11:03am
      - David Garrett
        
        Well, I can tell you exactly what her legal advice would be: 1) The allegations against you are defamatory – perhaps grossly so; 2) If they are groundless, and you can provide evidence to establish that claim, a defamation suit brought by you would be successful; and 3) you are likely to recover substantial damages and costs; but 4) If the allegations are true, or even partially true, you would be most unwise to sue Mr Cheung; and 5) If, notwithstanding the truth of the allegations you sued Mr Cheung anyway, you would lose, and probably be ordered to pay as substantial portion of Mr Cheung’s costs.
        
        20 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 11:12am
      - imalwaysright
        
        DG
        
        “2) If they are groundless, and you can provide evidence to establish that claim, a defamation suit brought by you would be successful;”
        
        That’s interesting that the onus is on her to prove she didn’t do what was claimed.
        
        6 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 11:40am
      - greybeard
        
        “She denied that the events happened” is not to say that the events did not happen. They could have happened but she still denied it. More to come I think.
        
        12 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:07pm
      - David Garrett
        
        I’m always: Yes, defamation can be confusing for lay people. Let me elaborate a bit.
        
        In a defamation action the onus is on the plaintiff to prove that: 1) statements were made referring to her, either directly or by innuendo; and 2) that the statements were defamatory; and 3) that any defences the defendant(s) put forward – such “fair comment on a matter of public interest” – do not justify the defamation proved.
        
        In any defamation case, “truth” is a complete defence. In other words if a defendant can prove by evidence that what s/he said about the plaintiff is true, then the defendants have a complete defence – which is not the case with some of the other defences.
        
        14 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:33pm
      - cmm
        
        “Taking legal advice” means sweet FA.
        It’s a way to sound tough.
        
        12 2
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:35pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        DG
        Thanks.
        
        5 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 2:28pm
      - rouppe
        
        So it all comes down to whether the other people involved can be found, and will give a statement.
        
        The other thing is that I’ve never heard this set of allegations until recently, and they happened several years ago.
        
        So is Tory Whanau releasing the email creating the defamation on herself? I suppose the writing of the email is itself defamatory, but it went nowhere, and the general public didn’t know about it. It’s only now that it’s being circulated widely, and she did the circulating.
        
        7 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 2:34pm
      - Jethrod
        
        Is it even possible to “asperse”?
        
        4 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:11pm
      - Skottowe
        
        [Mod – we don’t post rumours here]
        
        0 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 6:11pm
    - R
      
      It is a case of ‘smoke and fire’; always go together.
      
      8 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:40am
  - mandk
    
    She also denied her drunkenness, and its impacts, until she could no longer defend the indefensible.
    
    23 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:11am
  - Swifty
    
    How do you know for a fact they’re groundless?
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:14am
  - Eastlander
    
    She *fatly denied it ever happened.
    
    12 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:34am
    - Pope Punctilious II
      
      Naughty Eastlander!
      
      4 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:58pm
      - Eastlander
        
        Yes, I’m a bad little boy.
        
        3 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:53pm
  - sirknz
    
    Saying a rumour is false is not the same as denying it ever happened. What could be false is one aspect of what was repeated by Chung.
    
    This is PR speak.
    
    9 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 10:55am
- Ultima
  
  I think most Wellingtonians don’t mind who Whanau f*cks, as long as it’s not them.
  
  23 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:14am
  - RoboRob
    
    Unlucky for them, she fucked em good and proper. But to be fair the were ‘asking for it’.
    
    10 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:23pm
- SmokerGuy
  
  With all due respect, who gives a shit? I can’t stand Whanau but how is a story like this relevant to her being mayor? It really is a great example of dirty politics. Stunning lack of judgement by Chung.
  
  7 5
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:34am
  - Eastlander
    
    Her escapades and consequent hangovers led to her not showing up to meetings. Personal catastrophes have a habit of bleeding into work.
    
    8 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:15pm
    - SmokerGuy
      
      So let her be judged on not turning up, absolutely no need to spread shit like this. It’s really low and whether you are left or right there is no excuse to get down in the gutter like that. They have an important job and this is pathetic immature behaviour.
      
      1 4
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:54pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    I agree Smoker, its her own business what she does after hours, but I think she was sometimes absent from work because of hangovers.
    
    Most would say that was a good thing….
    
    6 2
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:37pm
    - Ghost
      
      You don’t know that, you have no evidence of that. The sad part of this whole conversation here is it goes to show some on the right are just as pathetic as those on the left they complain about
      
      3 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:57pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Oh, it’s dirty politics, alright…
  
  Labour must be running scared
  
  Even Andrew Little has entered the fray.
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/566607/ray-chung-defends-sending-gossip-about-tory-whanau-to-other-councillors
  
  15 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:47am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Seems like a private email to 3 co-councillors from 2 or 3 years ago asking their opinion on allegations has been resurrected by someone who doesn’t like Chung.
    
    10 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:17am
    - David Garrett
      
      Don: If that is the case it is of limited relevance – although it could be argued that the person who circulated the email is a “publisher” and is therefore also guilty of defaming the bibulous Ms Whanau.
      
      12 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:21am
    - MCōs
      
      If it’s a private email how did it get into the public domain?
      There are four people one of whom must have either forwarded the email or had their account accessed by another person.
      Whatever
      Guy was a fool for putting the unverified gossip in writing.
      
      9 3
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:31pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        The way I read the report, he was asking a question – not making the accusation himself, which IMO is a reasonable question concerning the conduct of a potential public figure with some power.
        
        4 2
        Report
        July 11, 2025 12:57pm
  - David Garrett
    
    She faced a bumpy time as mayor amid drinking problems and an ADHD diagnosis.
    
    The wording of this is very interesting – notably the absence of the phrase allegations of… before the reference to “drinking problems”. It may perhaps be careless wording – although that is unlikely given the PR resources available to Ms Whanau as mayor – but as written, and assuming she has been accurately quoted, she is acknowledging having both a drinking problem and having been diagnosed with ADHD.
    
    15 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:30am
    - RoboRob
      
      She has publicly admitted to both. They are her excuse for a number of failings.
      
      14 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 11:48am
    - Colville
      
      Whanau is of course the one who, while shitfaced, walked out of a restaurant without paying having already tried the lines, “dont you know who I am” and “I am the Mayor of this town!”
      
      ….she left after being refused service…and I seem to remember she grabbed a bottle of wine off another patrons table on the way out!
      
      18 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:06pm
      - DimChappie
        
        Ray Chung’s big mistake was passing on this story without any evidence. Surely there are photos out there if it happened? There were no pix released of the earlier alleged incidents either.
        
        4 1
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:19pm
    - Eastlander
      
      Doctor-shopping for an ADHD diagnosis is common among rather dim women.
      
      6 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 12:37pm
    - Skottowe
      
      None of it is allegation: the Mayor has herself admitted to having a drinking problem, and to being diagnosed with ADHD. Nor, at the time, did she deny the incident referred to above.
      
      I don’t think that her being off duty is any kind of defence. As a former Mayor pointed out at the time, one is always the Mayor, which entails discretion in one’s behaviour whenever one is in public. Her reputation was, I believe, terminally damaged by that incident.
      
      1 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 6:29pm
  - R
    
    Labour running scared…….this tactic us straight out of Labour’s political operations manual
    
    13 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 11:43am
  - muzled
    
    https://matuakahurangi.com/p/the-lefts-desperate-smear-campaign?utm_campaign=email-half-post&r=127xi&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
    
    Ray Chung is under attack, and it reeks of desperation. The moment someone starts speaking truth and gaining real public support, the leftist political machine kicks into overdrive. The latest example? The hit job they’re trying to pull on Wellington City Councillor and mayoral candidate Ray Chung. It smells a lot like it’s being backed by taxpayer-funded outfits bankrolled by the so-called Preventing and Countering Violent Extremism Fund which I wrote about today. That fund has nothing to do with extremism and everything to do with censorship and shutting down dissent.
    
    The same voices that said nothing while Wellington fell apart under Tory Whanau are now outraged over an email. Not corruption. Not incompetence. Not the endless stream of dysfunction. An email. Ray Chung passed on gossip he heard from a neighbour about Whanau’s drunken New Year’s antics. He didn’t fabricate it. He didn’t embellish it. He simply relayed what he was told.
    
    10 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:54pm
- PurplePen
  
  I like Chung and at this stage still has my vote. But to put what he did in writing does show a degree of lack of control and immaturity.
  
  12 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 10:55am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    After listening to Ray Chung’s radio interview, I do not think I would vote for him now. Sending an email like that based on hearsay of some lads on a night out is pretty stupid.
    Perhaps Karl T is the better candidate after all. If I was in Wellington I think that is who I would vote for now.
    
    2 4
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:25pm
- SoloView
  
  @ sirknz
  
  Some halfwit makes up a story and passes it on to someone. The someone like any other gossip passes it on.
  
  I wonder what Joe Blogs down the road would have to say about Ray Chung….
  
  2 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:06am
  - Eastlander
    
    Nobody cares about this story because everyone in Wellington knows that whatever it was, Whanau did it and was probably filmed doing it. This is coming out now because labour cannot defend their record in council or offer anything better going forward.
    
    9 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 12:19pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      Yes, Little has probably seen a poll that shows Chung is doing well.
      Solution: start digging the dirt.
      
      13 1
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 2:40pm
      - Eastlander
        
        Reckon so. Whanau bowing out probably hurt him rather than helped him – when she was on the menu he might have marketed himself as the lesser evil.
        
        8 0
        Report
        July 11, 2025 3:34pm
  - sirknz
    
    Pretty sure that drugs and a night of drunken sex with a rando won’t be on offer.
    
    8 1
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:44pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  Tory’s To Do List Today:
  1. End Mr Chung’s mayoral ambitions
  I think she can tick that one off now. I wonder if Andrew Little has thanked her yet.
  
  7 4
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 11:29am
- Grizz
  
  There seems to be a media beat up of Ray Chung, probably to promote the Medias preferred candidate Andrew Little.
  
  The Media should know that more and more people are able to see through what they are doing here.
  
  10 1
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 1:31pm
Swifty

Bring back public stocks.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360753071/absolutely-astounded-thieves-cut-copper-spouting-home-broad-daylight

An agreed number of hours per day for day a week with a big printed sign of the likes of “I stole from you all by looting the copper spouting from the Scouts Hall/kindy/community centre etc”

As a society we’ve dispensed with the public shaming aspect of our justice system – to our detriment.

I’d go for a bit of public flogging at times too – but that’s a non-starter in these ‘enlightened times’ apparently.

😃
16 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 9:48am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Perhaps Pak n Save can donate the surplus tomatoes that are beyond their eat-by date.
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 12:47pm
  - kowtow
    
    $14 a kilo . No way .
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 2:40pm
- Swifty
  
  *for a few days a week…
  
  3 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 1:09pm
- kowtow
  
  swifty
  
  From Dunedin .
  
  These two buildings are city landmarks , historically and culturally really important . Some might even call them “treasures” and yet this vandalism . I’m shocked the msm aren’t more shocked on behalf of the good Pressy burghers of Dunedin , in a way they would be if another groups “treasures” had been so violated/defiled.
  
  ‘Two of Dunedin’s most treasured historic churches have been hit by brazen thieves, sneaking on site in the dead of night to steal tens of thousands of dollars worth of copper piping.’
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/the-star/copper-worth-50k-stolen-dunedin-church
  
  7 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 2:43pm
  - Swifty
    
    Disgusting.
    
    This is not the NZ I grew up in.
    
    We need to come down much, much harder on such people.
    
    We need to completely upend the risk and consequence versus reward ratio.
    
    9 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 3:15pm
    - kowtow
      
      Yes , incredible isn’t it.
      And that level of theft has to be beyond a few druggies doing it willy nilly .
      
      It’s got to be organised.
      
      The fact it’s not a really big deal in the media is appalling.
      
      3 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 5:41pm
Mike

.
0 10
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 10:17am
SmokerGuy

Looks like Ray Chung’s mayoral campaign is over. I’m no fan of Tory Whanau by any stretch but what an absolutely idiotic thing to do. If this is an indication of his judgement then he may as well pull out now.
10 8
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 10:32am
- Bobba Fret
  
  He has lost his backer now thanks to this email.
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/wellington/sir-mark-dunajtschik-withdraws-support-for-ray-chung-after-dirty-politics-sex-gossip-email/GTMETSVYDRALXKP6KTLJQGYFWU/
  
  4 3
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 2:41pm
  - SmokerGuy
    
    And so he should!
    
    0 4
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 5:54pm
- Hugh Jarse
  
  Smoker guy – to your original post – My thoughts exactly.
  
  0 2
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 6:36pm
kiwikidsnz

ID to Google in Oz…what could possibly go wrong

“From December 27, Google and Microsoft will have to use some form of age-assurance technology on users when they sign in, or face fines of almost $50 million per breach.”

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2025-07-11/age-verification-search-engines/105516256
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 10:57am
- cmm
  
  “Are you older than 18?” Yes [ ] No [ ]
  
  6 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 12:31pm
  - kiwikidsnz
    
    “There are seven main methods listed in the new regulations:
    
    Photo ID checks
    Face scanning age estimation tools
    Credit card checks
    Digital ID
    Vouching by the parent of a young person
    Using AI to guess a user’s age based on the data the company already has
    Relying on a third party that has already checked the user’s age”
    
    3 0
    Log in to Reply
    Report
    July 11, 2025 1:00pm
    - Jethrod
      
      Surely grandma’s photo will be used by some of these little never-do-wells?
      
      7 0
      Log in to Reply
      Report
      July 11, 2025 3:20pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  $50m per breach?
  
  Can I ask an entire primary school to have a go?
  
  Might be able to bankrupt Microsoft yet.
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 7:11pm
AitchW

Surely “dirty politics” is a tautology?
8 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 11:14am
Philview

I had an email from Amnesty International today asking me to join them in supporting the fight for Te Tiriti rights. NOPE!
I have been happy to support the fight for political prisoners in places like China but not an ethno fascist agenda in New Zealand.
24 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 1:06pm
- mandk
  
  Amnesty International is just another one of those organisations that start off with noble intentions, only to be captured by the left.
  
  This includes the NZ Council for Civil Liberties, Greenpeace, Problem Gambling Foundation and many more.
  
  16 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 3:16pm
- Jack5
  
  Amnesty International: long captured by the Woke Left and wrecked.
  
  14 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 3:19pm
Taieri

How much is a life worth?

3 years and 3 months it seems, because that’s what the Justice Rob Osborne just priced it at.

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/nowhere-near-enough-bus-hub-victims-dad-slams-jail-sentence
7 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 2:43pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  He wont serve all of that either.
  
  4 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 3:26pm
- Ghost
  
  Interesting, let’s hope that the likelihood of the boy being deported is more than a likelihood
  
  Also interesting that they blurred out his necklace, guessing it is a religious one.
  
  5 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 3:33pm
Swifty

Ardern lashed – all style, no substance.

https://www.spectator.com.au/2025/06/jacinda-arderns-triumph-of-style-over-substance/

All gong, no dinner.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 4:23pm
vand

David, The British seem to have less trouble with Muslims than the French because the former handle things better.?
Well you reckon? Labour in the Kk are apparently bringing in an anti “Islamophobia policy to all government depts so the UK would be finished as a liberal free democracy if that occurred
They were secreting consulting with various Muslim groups but no other groups – but have been found out now.
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 5:18pm
Swifty

Winston and Rubio:

https://x.com/keeganlangeveld/status/1943543105988256242?s=46
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2025 6:56pm
- Ghost
  
  Compared to another time our Foreign Affairs Minister was at ASEAN
  
  1 0
  Log in to Reply
  Report
  July 11, 2025 7:17pm

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« No evidence of harm reduction

The key question that should be asked »

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Never miss a post

Email Address

Join 13K other subscribers

Highlights

Target achieved II
Good progress on attendance
Health Target 5 – elective treatments
Health Target 4 – Specialist appointments

Links

"The principal view of human laws is, or ought always to be, to explain, protect, and enforce such rights as are absolute, which in themselves are few and simple."
Not PC
The response to Budget 2026 has been unusually muted
Point of Order
You know what “does not pass the sniff test”? Labour’s incremental response to blatant corruption – this is why they plunged 7.5%
The Daily Blog
When is a Free Speech Union not a Free Speech Union?
The Standard
We Are a Country That Decided Housing Was The Economy
No Minister
My Opening Statement for the UATX Caplan-Jones Immigration Rematch
Utopia
Woman of the day
Hompaddock
Playing with numbers.
Kiwipolitico
A crime
No Right Turn
Another non-tariff barrier
Offsetting Behaviour
Rugby Premiership Predictions for Round 18
Stats Chat
Budget 2026
NZCPR
UK Conversion Therapy Ban, Digital ID, Rallies, Elections
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
A central banker’s fiction
Croaking Cassandra
THE WORKING FROM HOME RACKET BY PUBLIC SERVANTS
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Get Vaccinated Tomorrow Or Shut Your Pie Hole
Cactus Kate
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker

[email protected]

PO Box 12270, Thorndon, Wellington 6144

Facebook
Twitter
FourSquare
Instagram
LinkedIn
Google+

Archives
Disclosure Statement
Editorial Policy
Privacy Policy
Complaints Policy
Comments Policy

Design by cre8d

%d

Share this:

Like this: