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July 24, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 24 July 2025

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General Debate

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Cassandra

H.R.McMaster on the reason for deterrent-level defence expenditure: “The U.S., Japan, and South Korea — alongside like-minded nations such as Australia, New Zealand, and India — are well positioned counter the CCP’s effort to create servile relationships with nations in the region through the promotion of sound, just, and responsive governance through efforts to counter corruption while encouraging strong civil society, responsible borrowing, honest procurementa and contracting practices, and judicial sector and legal reform, among other aims essential to good governance. The aggregate of Japanese, South Korean, and U.S. economies and militaries reveals tremendous strength. The three nations can only weaken ourselves through disunity and self-doubt.”
We often have a to and fro here about invasions, buying drones, guns v butter. HR sums it up nicely.
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July 24, 2025 8:02am
- keepcalmcarryon
  
  Can someone have a word to old mate in the Cook Islands.
  Isn’t it well over time we sent him a container load of cancelled NZ passports?
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:56am
  - AitchW
    
    Can we wait till after October? We’re attending a wedding then, I don’t want the hassle of visas and the like…
    
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    July 24, 2025 9:33am
    - keepcalmcarryon
      
      I am a merciful dictator.
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:54pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  The UK Government are running out of money. The Australian Government are running out of money. The NZ Government are running out of money. But no problem. All will raise more taxes on the hard working middle classes. They cant tax they poor as they dont have any money. They cant tax the rich because they either employ tax lawyers to avoid the taxes or move their wealth to tax havens.
  These Government are like bad parents in the checkout aisle of the supermarket. They give in to Tamsin or Tarqin and let them have the lollies knowing they are not good for them and they cant afford them. These Governments dont have the guts to say NO and neither do any of the Opposition Parties. They are a pathetic lot with no self control. I despise the lot of them.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:34am
  - NothingLeft
    
    “The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars, but in ourselves” to wit; voters no longer punish wasteful politicians, perhaps because an electoral majority are net beneficiaries of govt spending and a shrinking rump net taxpayers. So of course they are incentivized to borrow and spend and grow the pool of ‘clients’ that are financially beholden to their prolificacy.
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:54am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Too many vegetables have their heads in fakebook, instacrap and tiktok most of the day. Politics is “boring” to them.
      
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      July 24, 2025 7:17pm
  - mogg
    
    National have been crippled by massive debt inherited from the last Labour Government.
    However NZ commodity exports are now enjoying a big increase in value, hence the butter price. Dairy is approx 30% of our overseas earnings, plus timber and fruit also rising in value. This means increased tax receipts and spending just in time for the next election.
    It was Hipkins and Ardern who ran out of money with their borrow and spend, Luxon has staked everything on creating a stronger economy, it looks as though the Trump trade deals now being settled
    with Japan and hopefully the EU will improve the world economy and NZ export prices. Luxon might yet prove to have that great political asset, good luck.
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:04am
artemisia

Not too sure if it qualifies as a clash, but 3 New Zealand titans have come together on the broad subject of trust in media. Philip Crump / Thomas Cranmer, Tim Hunter and A Halfling.

Point of Order has reproduced A Halfling’s View. from their Substack. The item traverses views on journalism challenges and standard practices. Heads are politely butted.

A long-ish read but worth it.

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2025/07/23/towards-a-reliable-media/
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July 24, 2025 8:07am
cmm

Here is a coroner’s verdict bordering on moronic.

Two guys hopped up on booze and MDMA who can’t swim head out on a jetski on a fresh water lake with only one life jacket and without the emergency cut out cord hooked up and one ends up drowned.

Wow. Who would have expected that?

“it appears that the jetski capsizing was, fundamentally, “an unforeseeable accident”.”

Oh, bullshit. Entirely foreseeable.

Would the coroner say the same about not wearing a seatbelt or operating a car while pissed without a driver’s license? People capsize jetskis and fall off them far more often than cars are involved in crashes. If you head out on a jetski in choppy water you should expect to fall off and plan accordingly, especially if you’re a numpty.

Operating a watercraft when drugged and boozed up is stupid. To do so when you can’t swim and without a life jacket is doubly, no triply so. To do so when it is choppy, well,…

Mother Nature is not a woke leftie. She is a bitch. She does not hand out favours to those carrying equity victim cards. She does not tolerate fools or hand out second chances.

The guy that drowned is not a hero. He’s a damn idiot for getting himself and his brother into this situation.

Of course I understand that the family has feelings and is upset etc, but a coronal inquest should only concern itself with facts and learning. Nobody learns a damn thing if you hide behind feelz.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/coroner-releases-findings-into-hero-vincent-cornell-cookes-jetski-death/7YVOE2YIRNEELEGSOPKCKGWTSM/
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July 24, 2025 8:38am
- kowtow
  
  It’s actually the front page story on the print Herald , with a very emotional , heroic headline.
  
  TBH , it’s hardly newsworthy and an interesting pick for the front page.
  
  Meanwhile in real news , nothing about foreign spies operating in NZ spying on our satellite launches .
  
  Can’t upset one of our biggest trading ‘partners’.
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:38am
  - cmm
    
    Spying on the launches or the inner workings of the business?
    Most of those launches are video streamed and can be watched from the comfort of your louge from a world away. No real spycraft involved.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:08pm
    - kowtow
      
      Have a listen to J Collins on HDPA show last night , from 40 mins.
      
      A new law eing passed under urgency because “foreign militaries” have been involved here and the sec services have had to “step in” on a number of aoccasions in the last five years.
      
      Seems more to do with “building infrastructure on the ground here”.
      To collect data from sats .To i/d space craft and operations. taking info off sats to copy or interfere with.
      
      Somehow I feel this is waaay more newsworthy than the amount of air and media time given to say the death of a rather obnoxious Birmingham noise maker who spent his life on drugs .
      
      But that’s just me .
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:29pm
- David Garrett
  
  cmm: one thing that puzzles me about that story: i thought if the rider fell off – with or without a life jacket connected to a cut out switch- they just stopped dead in the water…is that no longer the case?
  
  It’s more than 20 years since i last rode one of those machines.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:32am
  - cmm
    
    DG: I have no idea, but I assume that they wouldn’t use the cut out tether if it just stopped. I’ve ridden one once – about 45 years back so I am no authority on the matter.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:06pm
- MCōs
  
  The brother with the life jacket survived and the one who drowned didn’t had given it to him
  One expects if they both had life jackets there would have been no fatalities
  The coroner said the tragedy was highly preventable
  The guys made a mistake and one of them is dead.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:51am
  - kowtow
    
    They made a series of mistakes.
    
    They couldn’t swim.
    Went out on a choppy lake.
    Went out with insufficient lifejackets.
    Didn’t have safety toggle attached.
    Deceased had drugs in system.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:14pm
Local Miller

It was interesting to watch Winston Peters stand up against the Speaker regarding answering a question about “Aotearoa New Zealand”, saying “there is no such country”. Even after the Speaker quoted the NZ Geographic Board’s use of the name. Peters seems to get almost unanimous support in the comments on YouTube, mostly criticizing the NZGB for calling NZ “Aotearoa New Zealand” without the mandate of Parliament or the people, and the Speaker for using the NZGB as a source of authority.
The contention from most is that the NZGB doesn’t have authority to rename the country, only to make changes within NZ or to features in NZ territorial waters. As I understand it NZ can only be renamed through an act of parliament.
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July 24, 2025 8:50am
- Cassandra
  
  Miller: you’ve just given Hipkins an idea – “Labour will honour Te Tiriti by renaming the country etc.” Not too sure it’ll win votes in Kai Tahu but it’ll go down well with the tattoos further north. Another battle line. Good on Winnie!
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:58am
  - Local Miller
    
    I don’t think Hipkins needs either Winston or myself to get this idea.
    
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    July 24, 2025 9:02am
    - pdm
      
      LM – he may do.
      
      Hipkins is not very sharp when it comes to logic and practical things.
      
      Remember – what is a woman?
      
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      July 24, 2025 9:14am
- RoboRob
  
  I wish the government would take action on this. Our country is called NZ. Dreams are free 🙂
  
  Note the process to rename is always, add Maori word first and move the old name to the end. Then after a few years just shorten it to the new name.
  
  The media already use Aoteroa instead of NZ ~50% of the time.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:26am
  - Skippytony
    
    Um, its an unwritten article where Maori and Pakeha is to be used (for anything) its Maori first and Maori last.
    Think about a public meeting and the order of events where both are used. Opening and closing statements…..
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:03am
    - David Garrett
      
      Skippy: Of what relevance is the fact that this an increasingly common practice? It’s renaming the country by stealth…and we must resist it
      
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      July 24, 2025 3:17pm
      - Ghost
        
        Too late. That boat has sailed. The younger generations know it as Aotearoa New Zealand. Whether it is now or when the older generations have died off the name will become offical.
        
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        July 24, 2025 3:32pm
- mandk
  
  Peters is correct and the NZ Geographic Board is shockingly ignorant.
  
  Aotearoa relates only to the North Island of NZ.
  
  The Iwi Chairs Forum refers to NZ as: Aotearoa me Te Wai Pounamu.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:35am
  - Mike
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Bullshit. Aotearoa is the te reo name for NZ. Check your passport if you are unsure.
    I don’t see how Peters can complain about referring to the country by its name in an official language.
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:24am
    - kiwimike
      
      Mikey
      He is our Foreign Minister, he should know after all unlike you, he represents our Country all over the World.
      Incidentally we are citizens of New Zealand not Aotearoa, yet.
      
      Our Passport is not an example, that’s Maorisation by Bureaucracy.
      
      But you knew that didn’t you ?
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:02am
    - mandk
      
      I wonder whom I should take as my authority on this matter: The Iwi Chairs Forum, or Mike, a functionary from the Ministry of Something or other.
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:07am
      - kowtow
        
        I use the laws of New Zealand as my authority .
        
        I’ve just checked the Constitution Act 1986.
        
        Throughout it only refers to ‘New Zealand’ , there’s no mention of this new fangled, recently invented ,woke promulgated “A” word in respect of New Zealand at all.
        
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        July 24, 2025 11:48am
      - David Garrett
        
        Mandk: Ol’ Mikey boy is not even “a functionary from some Ministry or other”.. so far as anyone can tell, he’s a retired civil servant living in Lower Hutt.
        
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        July 24, 2025 4:36pm
    - Jack5
      
      See bottom of yesterday’s general debate threaḍ for a late item about Winston Peters in a dust-up on “Aotearoa New Zealand” yesterday, and a flaw in the Speaker’s argument.
      
      https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2025/07/general_debate_23_july_2025.html
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:29am
    - Tauhei Notts
      
      [Mod – debate without abuse]
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:32am
    - BananaLlama
      
      If you are of this view then you will have to concede that English is an official language too being written on your official passport.
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:09pm
    - sirknz
      
      Care to check with Ngai Tahu on your assertion?
      
      They view Aotearoa as being only the North Island.
      
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      July 24, 2025 1:28pm
    - David Garrett
      
      Mikey: you call it what you like mate…for me it will always be NEW ZEALAND…Might I suggest that you Google “Kohimarama conference”…there you will reference to the proceedings – in Maori – to NIU TIRENI – the transliteration of New Zealand…you won’t find any reference to Aotearoa…that word was popularized by William Pember Reeves many years later.
      
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      July 24, 2025 3:24pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Did we have a referendum on Aotearoa being a name for NZ? Nope.
      
      Who precisely decided that was a name for NZ and on whose say so?
      
      We know that name is a half baked mess and is silly so what’s the deal?
      
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      July 24, 2025 7:24pm
  - cmm
    
    In this context it is not so much the woke NZ Geographic Board that is shockingly ignorant.
    
    Here’ what is relevant, is the Speaker.
    
    What the hell has happened to Gerry? Is he still pining for his besty since GG got hoofed?
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:36am
    - Bobba Fret
      
      As I’ve said before, and it has probably never been done before, but National need to have a “no confidence” in the speaker and change him. I’m sorry Gerry, but you have been a huge disappointment. I still think Mallard was worse, but Gerry is really lowering the bar.
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:30am
    - Ghost
      
      It’s not up to the speaker to declare aoteroa is not acceptable. It’s on your passport, on your money, birth certificates, government websites, etc. Speaker is not the person who can change that.
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:36am
      - cmm
        
        Ghost, you are entirely wrong here.
        
        The speaker is in control of the language used in parliament. In this context, Winston Peters objected to the use of Aotearoa in the parliament and it was the Speaker’s ruling that it was OK.
        
        What is on your money or passport or graffiti on the neighbour’s fence is irrelevant.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:13pm
      - Ghost
        
        Nope. The government uses aoterora on their website, in documents, on money, birth certicates, passports, etc etc. The speaker isn’t going to stop a word widely used by the government. It is up to the government to change the use of the name. Not the speaker. You expect the speaker to rule a word widely used by the government is not acceptable in the house? That would be stupid that a government uses aoterora but it can’t be spoken in house. The change has to come from the government, not the speaker
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:18pm
      - cmm
        
        Ghost “government websites” are not parliament. What is common language has no bearing,
        
        People say “fuck” more than they say Aotearoa. Try saying “fuck” in the house.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:22pm
      - Ghost
        
        Nope. The fact the government uses aoterora is relevant. Do you expect the speaker to ban a word from the house that is widely used by the government. That’s just stupid.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:25pm
      - Gary Benner
        
        Ghost, the fact that various government staff (aka Bureaucrats) have included a somewhat popular name for the country in their documents – printed and online, supposedly as an attempt to appear “inclusive”, does not create any legal or other precedent for it’s official status.
        
        While Parliament is the only body that can enact such a change, it’s role is to represent the wishes of the people of this country – whatever you wish to call it. That is what democracy is about.
        
        Those promoting it’s use, ( and I suspect there is a powerful force at play here behind the scenes ) are waiting for a time when they know they will be assured to win a referendum that will have to be held. They have learned from the flag debacle that unless you have the numbers, you set things back a long way by going early.
        
        Intrinsically I have no objection to a name change, if a significant majority agree it should be so. Not 51%, but something like 70% IMHO.
        
        What are some options BTW:
        
        Zealandia
        Zeatearoa
        Northern Antarctica
        Southern Cross Land
        East Australia
        Pacland
        The country formerly known as New Zealand.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:57pm
      - Ghost
        
        Awww, the blame everyone else routine, instead of the ministers who signed it off. But that doesn’t change the fact that this is a word widely used by the government, and not something the speaker can stop being said in the house. It’s up to the government to remove the word from government side of things, which it won’t do. I’d even doubt the majority of the country gives a toss about having Aotearoa on their passports, money, birth certificates or used in the house.
        
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        July 24, 2025 1:29pm
      - balanced
        
        I don’t give a toss.
        
        Using Maori culture and language aa a point of difference for promoting NZ is wise.
        
        When you travel the world, all blacks and the haka are the two most common responses to “I’m from nz”
        
        And Maori centric Rotorua is our most popular tourist destination.
        
        That said it is important Brooke and Seymour explain why they are leaving the maori mumbo jumbo in education and fire & emergency.
        
        Unfortunately Brooke’s platform interview suggests she doesn’t know the answer.
        
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        July 24, 2025 1:42pm
      - Ghost
        
        I would guess it was left in education as it was one of the pieces of legislation put aside last year to have the Treaty of Waitangi provisions scrutinised.
        
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        July 24, 2025 2:37pm
      - balanced
        
        There are definitely political nuances involved in the decision.
        
        The reason for my question is to highlight the hypocrisy of the media, political spin doctors, and unthinking act supporters who continue to attack ministers and luxon on all things maori.
        
        That said, I will be disappointed if the maori legislative land Mines aren’t removed before mcanulty and h Clark get the chance to detonate them…… again!
        
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        July 24, 2025 3:08pm
      - Ghost
        
        The team reviewing it are expecting to finish by the end of august, then report back to the ministers
        
        Article
        
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        July 24, 2025 3:27pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Ghost: Fair point
        
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        July 24, 2025 3:27pm
      - kowtow
        
        ‘Using Maori culture and language aa a point of difference for promoting NZ is wise.’
        
        The discussion ias not about marketting N Z to Chinese tourists .
        
        It’s about the incorrect and actually non legislated use of “A” for New Zealand in the House.
        
        ps Agree re BVV and FENZ
        
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        July 24, 2025 3:33pm
      - balanced
        
        Kowtow. The word nuance appears to be lost on you!
        
        If people use Aotearoa to associate nz wth our promotional point of difference, and it works….. good on them!
        
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        July 24, 2025 4:35pm
      - Jack5
        
        Ghost’s …It is up to the government to change the use of the name. Not the speaker.
        
        That’s the point. The Government hasn’t changed the name from “New Zealand”.
        
        For example, in the Constitution Act:
        
        “The Sovereign in right of New Zealand is the head of State of New Zealand …
        
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        July 24, 2025 11:59pm
      - Ghost
        
        No. The government uses the name Aotearoa. It would be stupid for the speaker to ban a word being used that the government uses in legislation and other places. Actually more than stupid, it would be impossible. The speaker cannot say you can’t use this word in the house when the government, ministers, and prime ministers use it.
        
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        July 25, 2025 7:46am
- cmm
  
  Winston has found his 5% issue.
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:34am
  - kowtow
    
    Yep , across the new media , exactly where the likes of Act and NZF presumably are looking for votes , Peters and Jones are winning hands down.
    Similarly on the farming show mid day on Newstalk ZB.
    
    BTW ,Brook VV has done herself ( as a potential future Act leader) and the party a world of harm with this morning’s interview on the Platform re the Maorification of the fire service .
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:01am
    - balanced
      
      Watch out Kowtow, you’ll upset a fellow poster who claims “Brooke van Velden leaves most National Ministers for dead”.
      
      VV comes across as an honest politician with her heart in the right place but her latest platform interview cements my view she has been promoted to the apex of her ability.
      
      I’m still waiting for a KB ACT supporting Luxon abuser to explain ACT MP achievements, other than simple legislatve changes, which support their belief Seymour and his ministers should run the country.
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:56pm
    - muzled
      
      That was by far and away the worst interview I’ve heard from her.
      
      I got about a minute in and wondered if she had taken lessons from the previous leader of the world youth socialist organisation – Dame Jacinda.
      
      Very rarely do I tune out before an interview is finished as I like to hear it out.
      
      That one got turned off long before the end.
      
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      July 24, 2025 1:32pm
    - lifesgood
      
      Hugely disappointed in Brooke VV.
      
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      July 24, 2025 4:08pm
pdm

Did anyone else notice how cosy Rawiri Waititi and Tama Potaka were as they entered the chamber for Question Time yesterday?

No wonder rewinding the excessive maorification clauses from the statute books is stalled.

Someone might be able to link to it but, that is beyond my capabilities.
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July 24, 2025 9:01am
- Yvette
  
  Someone might be able to link to it but, that is beyond my capabilities.
  
  I am not an expert but (as Tarrant said, Someone needs to do it, why not me?) so where ever on the Internet you have read or seen this, click on the URL panel of the top of the browser window for where ever you are at the time (which will currently say kiwiblog.co.nz because that is where you are to read this) and when it highlights , hit Command with key ‘c’ to copy it (do as you will on a PC) then Command + v to paste it at the end of your comment, before dropping the lot in the comment panel to post it here. OK, someone else have a go.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:21am
  - pdm
    
    I have only seen it on the Parliamentary TV (Sky 86) Channel.
    
    Will that still work Yvette?
    
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    July 24, 2025 9:52am
    - Yvette
      
      No, Pdm, I think not, unless it is something on your computer of course, like the Parliament websites, YouTube or other computer source.Then you can copy the computer address, from the panel which holds “kiwiblog.co.nz” at the top of your screen as you read this, and paste that in your post or comment. Otherwise if it is on other technology, you naturally just describe what that is and where on the technology you are actually watching. Oops, I am getting myself in a mess here perhaps, this not being a spontaneous conversation :o) Where exactly were you watching Parliamentary tv?
      
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      July 24, 2025 10:19am
      - pdm
        
        `Where exactly were you watching Parliamentary tv?’
        
        In my lounge. lol.
        
        Sorry Yvette I could not resist.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:43pm
      - Yvette
        
        Look for a URL in your lounge, Pdm
        It is probably near the ceiling
        
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        July 24, 2025 1:28pm
- RoboRob
  
  I posted a couple of days ago, Tama Potakas investigation into Whatau Ora spending on a rugby team and adverts to change to the Maori roll, specifically excludes any criticism of Whata Ora or any other agency involved. Its a total white wash.
  
  When the review is complete expect it to say something along the lines of, ‘The spending was inappropriate and breached general guidelines. No further action is required as the organisations involved are no longer involved in the process.’
  
  In the meantime, everyone has forgotten about it in the month the review has taken. Great politics.
  
  The same guy doing this review is also doing the dept Stats / TPM Marae review. It has a similar clause that blocks any comment on the agencies involved, including TPM and the Marae! Both reviews are due by the same date, 31 July.
  
  Also note the National are taking no action to prod the police to actually apply electoral law to TPM (Mitchel can send a letter of expectations that the police will enforce all laws). The electoral commsion led by the failed LeQuence can take action (de register TPM) but choses not to. Goldsmith continues to support LeQuence and takes no action.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:21am
  - pdm
    
    RR – Potaka wanted it finished by the end of the (first) week.
    
    More deceit oozes from National.
    
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    July 24, 2025 9:54am
    - Ghost
      
      The review was announced 2nd of July and would be completed in July.
      
      Independent review into alleged inappropriate use of Whānau Ora funds
      
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      July 24, 2025 10:34am
  - cmm
    
    Surely the speaker can apply pressure in that breaking the law, or apparently breaking the law, brings the House into disrepute.
    
    But….
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:06am
  - imalwaysright
    
    It is becoming apparent that the Public Servants have become the Masters of the Public.
    
    Consider that 30 years ago we would have posted under our actual names, now we have to hide behind pseudonyms lest someone types our name into a database. (most of us anyway, respect to those here who use their real names)
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:43am
    - David Garrett
      
      Imalways: As you know, I am one of the perhaps 5% of commenters here who uses his own name. One thing puzzles me: this modern obsession with the supposed evil of “doxxing”. I am unsure if phone books are still published, but they certainly were as recently as five years ago.
      
      Phone books gave both the subscribers phone number AND their address. So what’s this paranoia about addresses?
      
      I have enemies, among them a double killer who used to stink up this blog from time to time. I have published my address here a number of times (I now mostly live in Tonga so it’s a bit out of date)
      
      Neither The Killer nor anyone else ever turned up at Rancho Garrett, Kanohi Road, Kaukapakapa. So again I ask: Why the paranoia about “doxxing”?
      
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      July 24, 2025 4:06pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Ah…perhaps the three downtickers can answer my question…what explains the paranoia about adresses that used to be published in the phone book?
        
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        July 24, 2025 6:59pm
      - Ghost
        
        What? You only managed to turn one of the blogs killers against you
        
        You must try harder
        
        1 1
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        July 24, 2025 7:04pm
- Ghost
  
  I think you’ve made far more of what actually happened
  
  Tama is walking into the house holding all his stuff, Rawiri is standing in the aisle and puts his hand out to shake. Now I guess some would think Tama should ignore and keep walking. He shakes hands and slowing keeps moving on
  
  Video
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:38am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Ghost,
    That’s about it. Two people saying hello.
    
    Some were clearly hoping for a flying dropkick or a roundhouse to the temple…
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:50am
  - pdm
    
    You conveniently overlook the `pat (2 actually) on the shoulder’.
    
    Looked very amiable to me – over and above even.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:46pm
    - Ghost
      
      No, you’ve just made more of this than it is. You really should get a job at stuff writing their fantasy articles
      
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      July 24, 2025 1:18pm
NothingLeft

AI on verge of supremacy in programming:

The AtCoder World Tour Finals is an exclusive competitive programming event that invites the top 12 programmers globally to come and compete on optimisation problems. OpenAI entered a private model of theirs and it placed second… Second only to Psyho, a former OpenAI employee. This is the first time I’ve seen an AI model perform this well at a tourney and will probably be the last time a human wins this competition. Psyho mentioned that he had only gotten 10 hours of sleep in the last 3 days and was completely exhausted after winning the tournament
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July 24, 2025 9:07am
- Yvette
  
  You may also kiss good-bye to chess tournaments if AI is allowed to enter, but like allowing trans men to participate in women’s sport, as Ai will not come up with an empathetic answer to that, nor will it create a perfect piece of art, because I doubt if it can be trained to perfection at the same time the art should be imperfect to not offend the gods, as Japanese may contend – that is still in the eye of the beholder … if they are well enough trained.
  egg :o)
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:35am
  - graham
    
    You may also kiss good-bye to chess tournaments if AI is allowed to enter
    
    Not so sure about that. Infrastructure architect Robert Caruso reportedly pitted ChatGPT and Copilot against an Atari 2600 gaming console (first sold in 1977) – and they both lost.
    
    https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/09/atari_vs_chatgpt_chess/
    https://www.theregister.com/2025/07/01/microsoft_copilot_joins_chatgpt_at/
    
    And Gemini refused to even have a go after being told about this.
    
    https://www.theregister.com/2025/07/14/atari_chess_vs_gemini/
    
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    July 24, 2025 10:28am
    - cmm
      
      That’s just ChatGPT and Copilot programmed with “general intelligence” and not specifically tooled up for playing chess.
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:16pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    Chess Grandmaster and five time world chess champion Magnus Carlsen said he can’t even beat the app on his phone.
    
    I’m not sure that AI winning a game that is controlled by a finite and specific set of rules is a fair indication of what it is capable of.
    
    Artificial Intelligence could well be used to undermine our perception of reality, and it could happen extremely quickly.
    
    Once we can’t determine reality we will determine nothing.
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:00am
- cmm
  
  Please do not confuse programming competitions with real programming.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:44am
  - NothingLeft
    
    yeah, hang on to that cope, because you have maybe another 2 years before agentic AGI subsumes the top level architectural work as well as all the low level coding.
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:00am
    - cmm
      
      It really doesn’t bother me. I don’t swim with most programmers.
      If I was programming apps and websites and such dross then I’d be extremely worried.
      
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      July 24, 2025 12:17pm
    - rouppe
      
      https://fortune.com/2025/07/23/ai-coding-tool-replit-wiped-database-called-it-a-catastrophic-failure/
      
      When they come calling because ai has caused this sort of catastrophe, the hourly rate will be substantial.
      
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      July 24, 2025 3:15pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Metacalculus prediction market median estimate for question:
  “When will an open-source AI win a Gold Medal in the International Math Olympiad?”
  four years ago: 2042 (21yrs)
  three years ago: 2029 (7yrs)
  two years ago: 2028 (5yrs)
  one year ago: 2027 (3yrs)
  this year: DONE (2025) (0yrs)
  
  https://www.metaculus.com/questions/6728/ai-wins-imo-gold-medal/
  
  People just aren’t getting how fast the ever accelerating AI train is coming for all of our jobs.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:11am
- keepcalmcarryon
  
  Sing out when AI is on the verge of not constantly being wrong about everything it does.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:20am
  - imalwaysright
    
    You will be the last one to know…
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:03pm
- kris
  
  Did you actually look at the problem before you came to this conclusion? Or are you just copy/pasting some sensationalist headline?
  
  The competition was a single heuristic problem, meaning that a perfect answer is not practical to compute, and thus the aim is to essentially get an result that is as close to optimal as possible, within the computational constraints (time/memory) set out.
  A practical application of heuristics is realtime image recognition for something like self driving or surveillance, where you need to identify and track a variety of objects with eg a 20ms timeframe, and you need it to be “good enough” using just the local hardware.
  
  Heuristic problems are certainly a valid field in software engineering (to which machine-learning has been applied for decades), but I would say that the vast majority of software out there is dealing with absolutes, not heuristics.
  
  Given this single problem was an artificial one, you can only make relative comparisons between the entrants – if it were a real world problem it might be that all participants (or none) reached a “good enough” threshold, so “AI” placing second doesnt make mean all the lower placed participants are useless.
  
  Also, there is no disclosure of the operational costs (data center power for model inference for 10hrs) or capital costs (compute hardware, and model training costs, for who knows how long) for the “AI”, especially given it was a custom/private model. It is also not clear if the AI was given any human prompts/handholding, or if it only had the original problem statement and judges scoring to go on.
  So we can’t make any comparison of TCO of the “AI” vs a pro (or average) software engineer, and TCO is what businesses ultimately care about if they are considering replacing humans with “AI”.
  
  Finally, did you also notice that the “AI” entrant was that of the competition sponsor (OpenAI)… surely a conflict of interest, no?
  OpenAI no doubt appreciates all the uninformed breathless reporting/repeating that omits all the caveats.
  
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  July 24, 2025 2:47pm
Ron Jeremy

I’m over this country . 200k of our money to promote an idiot in the greens and someone thought this was ok to do . All this bullshit about supermarkets and the price of butter . National need to grow a pair and make some tough calls . All the money the govt spends is borrowed . If we ran businesses like that the liquidators would be called in . We need to revolt as taxpayers as our elected officials don’t seem to care about our financial situation. I resent paying my taxes at the moment as there is no rigorous scrutiny over any of the govt spending in my view . We should sack the lot of them and appoint 51 our brightest and most successful people from a variety of industries to sort this mess out and run the country like a company until we get in a better situation . If labour get back in power as a country we are doomed .
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July 24, 2025 9:13am
- AitchW
  
  I’m deeply depressed by reports that a recent poll suggested that Labour with it’s clingons would form a goverment.
  Have people seriously forgotten god awful mess they made last time they were in power?
  God help us all…
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:40am
  - RoboRob
    
    Do you have links to the poll?
    
    I wasn’t aware any new polls had been released. I am interested to see if the S127 debacle has had any effect on Nationals polling or whether some here say ‘we are just an echo chamber’.
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:02am
    - Ghost
      
      I wouldn’t put much in the poll. I had a Talbot Mills poll a month or so ago. The questions were very rigged
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/politics/360766139/new-poll-paints-grim-picture-coalition-government
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:10am
      - RoboRob
        
        Yes, generally totally ignore Talbot Mills polls. They are Labours paid pollster and tend to generate polls that match their clients demands. Will wait for the real polls.
        
        In the same way I ignored Shambels Yakhov when he did the books on Labours projects.
        
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        July 24, 2025 1:55pm
  - MCōs
    
    I don’t recall ever being ‘deeply depressed’ about NZ politics.
    
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    July 24, 2025 1:22pm
- Inandout
  
  RJ, it appears Luxon is betting that if he makes bold moves next year the voters will flock back to National.
  “When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty.” — Thomas Jefferson
  
  Luxon may have ignored the second sentence, at his peril.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:42am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  200k of our money to promote an idiot in the greens
  
  Sorry to be a nit-picker, but I think it was nearer $220,000 of our money for the Chloe promo….
  
  About $200,000 will come from NZ On Air, as well as $20,000 from the Film Commission.
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/467314/producer-of-chloe-swarbrick-documentary-responds-to-act-backlash
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:27am
  - cmm
    
    No “top ups” yet? Bloody amateur grifters!
    I doubt we’ve paid the last of this.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:19pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  I feel the same way. I cannot get my head around the fact that this coalition is not at least 15% ahead of a Lab/Grn/TPM government. Hipkins was a main part of the last failed Labour government, do people really not remember? I can only put it down to the fact the people do not care as long as they are receiving “free money” from the government, they really do not care where it comes from or if it is putting us in to more debt.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:47am
  - RoboRob
    
    It is a failure of the government. One of the parties is failing to communicate why they are better then Labour / Hipkins. Luxon and Hipkins polling the same in the preferred PM stakes is an indictment on Luxons performance, not a statement about how good Hipkins is.
    
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    July 24, 2025 1:59pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  As they say, if you rob Peter, to pay Paul, you will always get Paul’s vote!
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:48am
- Paulus
  
  Of course Elected Officials don’t care abour spending Money.
  It’s there from us for them to spend as they want it.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:39pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  There will always be the young and dumb voting for ridiculous idiots.
  
  The rest of New Zealanders need to stop voting for wishy washy fence sitters.
  
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  July 24, 2025 7:29pm
sirknz

I may be a bit old fashioned in thinking this but if your business is only viable with significant government handouts, then your business isn’t really viable.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/360767596/nanogirl-owes-inland-revenue-more-265000
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July 24, 2025 9:32am
- artemisia
  
  I guess it was viable while the taxpayer funding continued, and may also have been a valuable addition to science education.
  
  MBIE, MoE and MFAT all withdrew funding, as has private sponsorship. That may indicate those funders did not see it as value for money. Compared to a few thou staff still employed in the Ministry of Education, for instance. Because reasons.
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:28am
- cmm
  
  It’s not really a business at all. It’s a grift.
  
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  July 24, 2025 12:20pm
- MCōs
  
  Rice farming in Thailand, which is an essential industry, is only viable because of vast government subsidies.
  This has led to all sorts of corruption problems with middle men and politicians, who don’t actually produce anything, becoming remarkably wealthy.
  
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  July 24, 2025 1:34pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    I wonder why that was down voted. People who down vote lefties, just because?
    
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    July 24, 2025 7:31pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Rawiri Waititi seems to be unaware that the nation of India contains peoples of at least 2,000 ethnic groups.
He somehow thinks that the fact NZ universities award scholarships to Indian citizens equates to NZ having numerous positions at universities reserved for Maori only.

I want to address one of the ACT Party members today: Parmjeet Parmar, an Indian migrant MP who is waging war on Māori based on race-based scholarships, study spaces, and entrance pathways. I wonder if she has written letters to the universities about the three Indian scholarships: New Zealand Excellence Awards worth $260,0000; the University of Auckland India High Achievers Scholarship; and the University of Waikato Vice Chancellor’s International Excellence Scholarship for India? This is hypocrisy. This is hypocrisy.

https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20250723_20250723_28

The fact is that anyone from the numerous races/ethnicities/religions of India can be a candidate for the 3 scholarships mentioned, but not everyone from NZ has the same entry requirements to courses or spaces in NZ Universities.
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July 24, 2025 9:32am
- rouppe
  
  Scholarships are completely different to study spaces and entrance pathways.
  
  There are no special entrance pathways for Indians.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:34am
- AitchW
  
  Rawiri Waititi seems to be unaware.
  If it’s not about Maori sovereignty he hasn’t a clue.
  He’s the very definition of a one trick pony.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:19pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  “an Indian migrant MP who is waging war on Māori based on race-based scholarships,”
  
  The usual bare-assed racism and hyperbole from this mob.
  
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  July 24, 2025 7:33pm
Paulus

Amazing that the Herald published it but a paper by O’Connor of Auckland Gremmer on the NCEA and why it should be cancelled as such, and his comments re what to do about a system which might help New Zealand’s future.
Currently no education appears in the Public Sector is in the country’s best interest.
Socialsm has destroyed it for many years past.
Should be National led Coalition Policy as soon as possible.
But the Education Unions and the their Teachers will do all they can to thwart into touch as not “their” or the children’s best interest.
Read the Article – it is common sense and straight forward.
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July 24, 2025 9:46am
Swifty

Labour wanted to address rental costs so attacked landlords on a number of fronts and with the result that rents skyrocketed especially in Labour’s second term.

National came in and made some changes including reversing a number of Labour policies and hey presto:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/567851/rents-fall-for-first-time-since-2009

Labour must be feeling sick this morning.

Good job.

And well done National and partners.
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July 24, 2025 9:56am
- Bobba Fret
  
  It would be great if this was reported on the news.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:51am
  - Ghost
    
    Huh?
    
    Reported on radio NZ, news talk zb, one news, even trademe.
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:58am
    - RoboRob
      
      It’s how its reported that makes the difference. They are not stating that Labours failed policy has been reversed and therefore pressure on rents has stabilised. Its being sold more as, the poor economy has taken pressure of rental prices. A subtle, but meaningful difference.
      
      Its also why TVNZs bias investigation will find no bias at TVNZ.
      
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      July 24, 2025 2:02pm
- AitchW
  
  Hipkins will tweet that the rents are coming down because of measures initiated by Labour.
  That guy is so very clueless…
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:20pm
cmm

It occurred to me yesterday that buttergate is just another one of those throw-shit-around-and-see-what-sticks things that the media does and, quite frankly, governments don’t particularly mind because they distract people.

Based on NZ butter consumption, the increased butter prices cost the average New Zealander somewhere around 50c a week in increased butter costs since 2022 or so.

Woop, woop.

It’s not really much different to “period poverdee” which costs our young ladies about $1 to $2 per week. Lots of noise, but no actual outcomes.

Again, woop, woop.

Meanwhile we have $160million (about $32 per person – far more than the annual extra cost of butter) being spent on building classrooms at around $1.4 million each and many other extravagances. A billion here, a billion there, soon we’re talking real money.

Why the hell they’re building more classrooms when wagging is through the roof is beyond me, but that’s a different matter.

People, you’re being gamed.
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July 24, 2025 10:00am
- Skippytony
  
  There is a definite “cost of living crisis” narrative running in the MSM at the moment.
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:07am
  - Paulus
    
    Of course the expression is what the Unions and possibly Labour, if they wake, want to use for the next Election.
    As the so called media are in their pockets so they with their stupid so called media repeaters continue to call it.
    A good irrespective publicity comment to try and disturb the elected Coalition Government.
    
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    July 24, 2025 3:43pm
imalwaysright

Jail for taking shellfish
https://share.google/iTDhDFKUlvlxOd2cM

Home detention for rape

https://share.google/rT310jrCv2iwI00vG
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July 24, 2025 10:04am
- Skippytony
  
  Jail for multiple offending.
  
  Rapist should get the full max for this conviction added on if he ever gets convicted again.
  
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  July 24, 2025 10:14am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Home detention for multiple rapes
    
    Jayden Meyer: Why a teen rapist is doing time at home | RNZ https://share.google/zgyq31XWzENETrjj1
    
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    July 24, 2025 11:06am
    - Skippytony
      
      No defending it but presumably being underage.
      
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      July 24, 2025 11:50am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Unfortunately these cases aren’t unusual SkippyT, can you imagine scumbags like the multiple rapist bragging to his scumbag mates about getting the Home D and the wraparound support, food, rent, takeaways, smokes, booze, having the fellow scumbags over on dole day for a party and some story time for the little wankers.
        
        Meanwhile the victims get to try to piece themselves back together.
        
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        July 24, 2025 12:12pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        He was 16 years old when he raped and sexually violated 15 year-old girls.
        There were 5 victims.
        
        https://theconversation.com/outrage-over-a-rapists-home-detention-highlights-the-need-for-victims-voices-in-nzs-sentencing-process-191408
        
        The details of the case were always kept well under wraps.
        
        https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/the-detail/story/2018863492/jayden-meyer-why-a-teen-rapist-is-doing-time-at-home
        
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        July 24, 2025 1:32pm
      - BananaLlama
        
        The NZ Justice system loves keeping their rulings on sex offenders under wraps and will do the most severe gymnastic back flips to keep it from the public even when the victims want it to be known and at 16 years old he would be attending school with your daughters and you wouldn’t even be entitled to know all because our unelected judges say so.
        
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        July 24, 2025 2:21pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      The system doesn’t know how to “rehabilitate” serious youth offenders, so they simply go the no/low consequences route. The no/low consequences route breeds embedded and brutal criminality which requires tough and unpalatable measures to reverse.
      
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      July 24, 2025 7:36pm
greybeard

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/535180/nanogirl-labs-pulls-plug-on-science-education-for-tamariki-due-to-funding-crisis

Something about this really annoys me.
A company set up some 8 years ago by a husband and wife has for years depended on taxpayer funds from MBIE, Min. of Education and MFAT for its existence.
Over that time it has managed to accumulate over a quarter of a million dollars in tax debt to IRD, another Govt department. It appears that IRD has done absolutely nothing to recover this debt.

“Nanogirl Lab’s monthly revenue is not publicly available.”
– Why not, if it receives mainly taxpayer funding ?
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July 24, 2025 10:07am
- JJ56
  
  the award of those contracts and amounts are in the public domain. if you’re really interested OIA it.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:21am
- imalwaysright
  
  “Nanogirl” was a big supporter of Adern and her draconian rule, so the science charade was to fool people to swallow the ideology.
  
  She’s just another 3rd tier Ardernist who Ardern has blocked on the WhatsApp.
  
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  July 24, 2025 12:21pm
Rusty

Winston Peters is like a good chess player. Anticipate your opponents next move and keep them guessing on yours.
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July 24, 2025 10:16am
Philview

There was an interesting article on Spiked-Online yesterday saying that King Charles was rumoured to have secretly converted to Islam in the 1990s. That caused me to Google the rumour and there is a lot of commentary on this and it seems plausible. King Charles may well be Britain and the Commonweath’s first Muslim King.

https://www.spiked-online.com/2025/07/22/the-islamophilia-of-king-charles/
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July 24, 2025 10:31am
- kiwimike
  
  I well remember it years ago at a weekend at Highgrove with Muslim leaders..
  As you can’t unmuslim yourself according to Islam.
  To them he is a Muslim.
  
  Whether he is devout or a believer I don’t know.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:16am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  He’s also a tree hugger
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:03pm
- Ghost
  
  Reminds me of the bullshit Otto used to post. There’s even websites and a book that claims he is bodyshifting reptile aliens. People will believe anything now days, commonsense is gone. Please place a sign by the moon, bypass earth, no intelligence here
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:08pm
cmm

While nowhere near as terrible to listen to as Cindy, I really have a problem listening to Nicola Willis. No, I don’t have a problem with wimminz. I have had long discussions with Amy Adams and Helen Clark’s voice is reasonable to listen to.

I know you shouldn’t judge people by their looks etc, but I really think anyone aspiring to be a senior minister really needs to be able to act the part to build confidence that the public needs in that office.

It really should not matter, but it does. A minister of finance with a clear, confident, voice adds $ to the economy, gives people confidence in the NZD etc etc.

IMHO, senior ministers should get elocution lessons because this really does matter.
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July 24, 2025 10:31am
- greybeard
  
  Agreed. And not just elocution but pronunciation: the number of people who cannot properly pronounce “distribute” and “contribute” and their various conjugations is appalling. And the word “women”.
  They do, however, tie themselves in knots with the latest iterations of maori “grammar”.
  
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  July 24, 2025 12:10pm
- Jack5
  
  Public speaking’s been understandably wrecked by microphones, by TV, by radio interviews, and by the internet.
  
  No longer is public speaking learned from the reactions of us ordinary plebs.
  
  Politicians for millennia learned the art of speaking from experience and feedback from audiences or even mobs.
  
  In relatively recent times in NZ, some, like the politician and writer John A. Lee, became so renown speakers they were almost entertainers.
  
  Lee wrote a book on public speaking, with the core of it: target someone at the back of the meeting and respond to them.
  
  Here’s a fairly recent example, from a a sizeable semi-commercial promotion, repeated at public meetings around the country.
  
  In the most memorable presentation of all the meetings, this time at a regional town, all but the last speaker used the microphone and supported their pitch with Power Point projections of graphs and with video clips.
  
  The last presenter walked to the front edge of the stage, without microphone or any visual aid, stood to her full but modest height, and spoke firmly to the back of the hall, responding to expressions.
  
  Hers was far and away the most impressive, effective, and popular of all the presentations.
  
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  July 24, 2025 12:16pm
- Philview
  
  Listening to the Platform this week I thought Erica Stanford and Brooke van Velden both spoke well. I doubt MPs would enjoy butting heads against Sean Plunket but those 2 ladies were happy to do so.
  
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  July 24, 2025 1:38pm
- mogg
  
  Shit oh- dear, you think Helen Clark ‘had a reasonable voice’ when she really sounded like a tin can being dragged down the road.
  Nicola Willis has got a local Kiwi accent, I like it, she always sounds genuine. Whereas JA was a complete fraud, parroting words prepared by somebody else and always being given a free ride by MSM. It’s the same with Hipkins when they talk about ‘the Left block of voters’ they never ask him about being dependent on TPM, AKA the lunatic fringe.
  
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  July 24, 2025 2:07pm
  - AitchW
    
    You have to ownder why the media never, ever aslk the obvious question: Will you coalesce with the Green and Maori parties and what are you prepared to offer them? Is a joint deputy PM gig similar to what National has done with Peters and Seymour likely?
    
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    July 24, 2025 3:23pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    JA ground my tits with her ignorant misuse of english. “I completely refude [sic] that”, amongst many others. Great way to get anyone who got a real degree, or who opens the occasional book in their spare time, laughing at you.
    
    10 1
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    July 24, 2025 4:00pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      Her worst was ‘jepradise’.
      
      5 1
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      July 24, 2025 7:44pm
Ghost

Good. The work they do is important. Not sure I would call them controversial. If not for the mess of mental health, they wouldn’t be needed

Controversial charity Gumboot Friday will continue to receive government funding through to 2026.

Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey said the initiative was helping thousands of young people access mental health support faster.

Article
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July 24, 2025 10:51am
- mandk
  
  RNZ doing the work of the Labour Party again.
  
  At least Gumboot Friday is delivering on the ground.
  
  When Andrew Little was Minister responsible for mental health, he couldn’t say what his $1.96bn spend had achieved. “But the money’s been spent.”
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:12am
- graham
  
  As we all know, the media just love to use certain words to not-so-subtly influence how we view a topic.
  
  A “controversial” charity.
  A “disgraced” former politician.
  A “beloved” TV personality.
  
  Reporting the news in a neutral manner and allowing the public to make up their own minds is apparently far too risky now. The media have taken it upon themselves to “guide” us as to how we should think.
  
  11 2
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  July 24, 2025 11:41am
  - kowtow
    
    Same with how they lead the latest commonsense directions on “trans” sports .
    All emotional and how it will lead to exclusion.
    
    7 2
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    July 24, 2025 12:08pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Luxon refused to address this issue. Peters knows how to keep over 5%.
      
      Winston Peters On Scrapping Transgender Guidelines In Community Sport
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kv6LFXdranQ
      
      6 2
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      July 24, 2025 3:02pm
      - Ghost
        
        Or for a better look and not a campaigning hype view
        
        Last year, former Sports Minister Chris Bishop asked Sport NZ to review the guidelines. It’s understood Sport NZ completed the review recently and offered new draft guidelines for current Sports Minister Mark Mitchell to assess.
        
        In a letter to Sport NZ on Tuesday, Mitchell said the policy in the coalition agreement meant Sport NZ should “no longer have guiding principles published and should leave that decision-making and judgment up to individual sports and community organisations”.
        
        “The Government has a role in making sport accessible to all New Zealanders by creating opportunities, not in providing principles as to who should be included and how,” he said.
        
        Article
        
        3 0
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        July 24, 2025 3:08pm
  - Jack5
    
    While Doocey promotes Gumboot Friday and other low-level counselling generally, mental hospitals are bursting at the seams and the country is short of psychiatrists, clinical psychologists, and psych nurses.
    
    Doocey’s strategy will likely lead to a mental-health system crisis in the run-up to the next election.
    
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    July 24, 2025 12:58pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      They are not just bursting at the seams. Some of the rough sleepers, many years ago, were in mental hospitals.
      
      7 1
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      July 24, 2025 3:05pm
    - Paulus
      
      Why is our Mental Health exploding exponentially ?
      Labour,s unelected man spent so much money on it, it got lost en route.
      When can we have some sort of analysis of this position – who are afraid to tell us where the money and to whom, it is going.
      Are we to believe it is new or possibly genetically increasing as more people become subject to such mental conditions ?
      Tell us some truth !
      
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      July 24, 2025 3:52pm
Ghost

They were friends, so expected to be in the files. The question is then under what circumstances is he listed in the files. A friend. A person who supplied evidence against him or something else.

US Attorney General Pam Bondi told President Donald Trump in May that his name appeared in Justice Department files related to financier Jeffrey Epstein, the convicted sex offender who died in prison, the Wall Street Journal reported on Wednesday, citing senior administration officials.

Article
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July 24, 2025 10:57am
- Mike
  
  Close pals. But don’t be surprised if the serial fraudster and rapist walks away from this too.
  
  5 20
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  July 24, 2025 11:03am
  - Conservatarian
    
    “The walls are closing in” on Trump this time? You mean the 758th time?
    
    “We have him now” Colbert & MSDNC assures their credulous boomer audiences, average age 69.
    
    7 1
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    July 24, 2025 3:28pm
  - Keith White
    
    Who exactly did he rape, Mike?
    
    4 1
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    July 24, 2025 6:00pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    AOC I think is about to find out what happens when you defame someone as a rapist without any proof.
    
    3 0
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    July 24, 2025 7:38pm
- Phronesis
  
  I fully expect that the files have been salted with testimony about a wide range of politicians being involved. It doesn’t matter if there is any evidence. The witnesses themselves will have died or be impossible to find but the media will report the allegations as the truth regardless. It’s the obvious thing to do if you had actually been to Epstein’s island and were in a position to muddy the waters.
  
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  July 24, 2025 11:06am
- rouppe
  
  We also know that Bill Clinton and Bill Gates have been at Epstein events.
  
  I wonder why that is never mentioned.
  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-67865190
  
  https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/12/business/jeffrey-epstein-bill-gates.html
  
  13 4
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  July 24, 2025 11:11am
  - Ghost
    
    That was the stupidity in Trump blaming democrats for this, it includes big democrat names and donors
    
    5 7
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    July 24, 2025 11:20am
  - Lance
    
    I thought that was Trumps entire ‘strategy’, bring down the wicked wicked Democrats by releasing all the sordid Epstein details.
    Opps… gun, foot, shoot… bugger
    
    2 11
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    July 24, 2025 12:06pm
    - Philview
      
      I don’t think Trump made a particularly big deal out of it on the campaign trail. The media are now saying he did and it was his sole reason for winning the election etc. The media just print so many lies about Trump it is no longer possible to discern when he is actually doing stuff wrong or when they are telling the truth.
      
      10 4
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      July 24, 2025 1:48pm
      - Mike
        
        That’s just a cover for you to believe what you would prefer to be true about Trump.
        
        2 6
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        July 24, 2025 3:37pm
      - Conservatarian
        
        Is it like believing that Trump was peed on by Russian prostitutes?
        
        Or repeating inviting Adam Schiff onto your loss-making “comedy” or “news” TV show (average viewer age 69) so that he could assure you that he had the goods on Russia Russia Russia?
        
        5 1
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        July 24, 2025 4:21pm
  - surfing
    
    Plenty of things are not mentioned on the left and the right.
    
    Lookup Kushner and the 2 billion dollar Saudi payout.
    
    Trump and his bunch are just as bad if not worse than the other side.
    
    Pelosi on a small salary is suddenly wealthy beyond what her salary would suggest. $180k a year and she’s banked 120 million?
    
    They’re all pigs at the trough, Trump and his mob are no different.
    
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    July 24, 2025 3:09pm
  - Paulus
    
    Wasn’t it known a long while ago that Clinton had had some 18 Epstein island flights ?
    
    6 0
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    July 24, 2025 3:54pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Joe Biden had this information for four years. If Donald Trump was deeply implicated with Epstein, don’t you think it would have been plastered everywhere by the Dems and their media lickspittles?
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:07pm
  - Ghost
    
    If there is information on trump, then for who ever was in control of Biden’s Whitehouse to release it, they would also have to release all democrats donors, politicians, and presidents as well.
    
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    July 24, 2025 8:32pm
imalwaysright

Has Jevon been arrested yet?
6 4
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July 24, 2025 12:26pm
- Ghost
  
  There are two criminal investigations ongoing into him. Let them do their work
  
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  July 24, 2025 2:34pm
cmm

More litter.

Disposable vapes back in our gutters again…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/govt-scraps-vaping-regulations-to-resolve-court-case-with-shosha-vape-chain/4UJQR6S3UNFUZFEG2F6ELEYEZE/
4 1
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July 24, 2025 12:34pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  A sh*t-ton of plastic and other long lived waste goes into the landfill regardless. Vape waste is probably a tiny percentage of that.
  
  Robots, AI and x-ray spectrometry should initially sort waste and plastics should be burned for energy. A lot of the rest can also be incinerated for energy with metals extracted for re-use.
  
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  July 24, 2025 7:43pm
Philview

The Julia DeLuney murder trial has had massive coverage in the Herald and RNZ but not so much on TVNZ News. I compare with the Polkinghorne trial which was massive in all media formats. I wonder if there was a rationale for TVNZ’s more limited coverage on this one?
8 1
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July 24, 2025 2:05pm
- MCōs
  
  Maybe the Herald and RNZ had reporters covering the trial and TVNZ didn’t?
  
  3 3
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  July 24, 2025 3:00pm
  - Swifty
    
    Yes but why MCos.
    
    That is the question.
    
    7 0
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    July 24, 2025 3:01pm
    - Keith White
      
      Perp was female.
      
      4 0
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      July 24, 2025 6:01pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Need to dig very hard for “reasons” (upbringing, trauma, colonisation etc etc) then.
        
        1 1
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        July 24, 2025 7:45pm
    - MCōs
      
      I was supporting my wife at the local court house when she was called for jury service.
      We sat in a courtroom while a long list of charges of a brutal sexual nature were read out against some guy. The trial was set down for weeks however there wasn’t a word in any of the usual media outlets.
      I suppose they just have to decide which trials sell papers.
      
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      July 24, 2025 9:32pm
    - Ghost
      
      Over 20 stories about this trial on one news website.
      
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      July 24, 2025 9:41pm
- cmm
  
  Salacious hooker angle in the Polkinghorne case.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:39pm
Swifty

While I believe I understand the likely reasons behind charging the officer involved, I still find this troubling:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360768704/police-officer-charged-over-death-teenage-girl

And for anyone to assert that the officer ‘caused’ or be ‘found accountable’ for this girl’s death I find even more troubling.
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July 24, 2025 2:55pm
- Mike
  
  It seems likely that the officer was operating well outside the rules for police pursuits.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:35pm
  - Swifty
    
    Yes
    
    2 0
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    July 24, 2025 4:23pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    What if I told you young people could be taught to respect the police and obey their lawful requests.
    
    1 2
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    July 24, 2025 7:48pm
- cmm
  
  The girl/woman clearly killed herself when trying to evade the police.
  All she had to do was stop and comply.
  
  Who would want to be a cop? Having the stress of this over you for doing your job is awful.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:41pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘Police have previously said Officer A had cooperated with the investigation.’
  
  Interesting legal conundrum.
  
  3 0
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  July 24, 2025 3:49pm
- MCōs
  
  The article has no details of the officer’s driving that brought about the charges being laid, but it’s safe to assume he wasn’t following the young woman at a safe distance and driving within the speed limit.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:12pm
Swifty

A clear conflict of interest I would have thought, both perceived and actual:

https://x.com/hobsonspledgenz/status/1948200864419598520?s=46

Murky goings on in Taupo.
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July 24, 2025 3:00pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Danny Loughlin, eh. A true son of the turanga waewae right there.
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:09pm
Ghost

Government announces changes to voting

Closing enrolment 13 days before election day to reduce pressure on post-election timeframes.
Requiring 12 days of advance voting at each election.
Introducing automatic enrolment updates so the Electoral Commission can update people’s enrolment details using data from other government agencies.
Enabling greater use of digital communication by removing postal requirements for enrolment.
Creating a new offence that prohibits the provision of free food, drink or entertainment within 100m of a voting place while voting is taking place. It will be punishable by a fine of up to $10,000.
Reinstating a total ban on prisoner voting.

Article
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July 24, 2025 3:02pm
- mandk
  
  Good.
  
  It’s not as if people have no notice that an election is coming so, if they can’t get organised to get themselves on the roll 13 days before the date, they only have themselves to blame.
  
  Getting enrolled is hardly an arduous process.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:11pm
- Chuck Bird
  
  Seems reasonable, but would be good to have a referendum on the racist Maori seats.
  
  3 1
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  July 24, 2025 3:22pm
  - cmm
    
    Dreams are free. Those seats should have gone almost 150 years ago. Not going to find the balls to do so on the current mob.
    
    5 1
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    July 24, 2025 3:42pm
- cmm
  
  Racist.
  Racist.
  Racist.
  Racist
  Racist.
  Racist.
  
  All these are going to be labelled racist by the usual suspects.
  
  I wonder where a person with no address votes? Or are we now going to have a new electorate called “the interwebs”. Or perhaps it gets treated the same as an overseas postal vote.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:23pm
- RoboRob
  
  Excellent changes, in general. However the ‘new offence’ punishable by a fine up to 10k will NEVER be enforced. But hey, it looks good.
  
  Also, is 10k really enough. If I was TPM or ACT and was desperate for one electorate seat, I would suck it up and pay the 10k and bribe my way into a 150k job plus a party allowance.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:54pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I thought it already was an offence to treat voters. When did that become legal?
  
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  July 24, 2025 8:10pm
keepcalmcarryon

Question: is it legal to discriminate on provision of a service based on race/iwi?
Our kids school is advertising free tuition if you whakapaoa back to ngai tahu as at least part sponsored by them.
Can I legally offer the same but only to white oeople with surname “smith” if I’m paying the bills?
Does the bill of rights act allow this?
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July 24, 2025 3:21pm
Chuck Bird

This could be very interesting. Trump liked them young, but how young?

What Ghislaine Maxwell really knows – and why she could finally spill all on Jeffrey Epstein: sources

https://www.skynews.com.au/world-news/united-states/what-ghislaine-maxwell-really-knows-and-why-she-could-finally-spill-all-on-jeffrey-epstein-sources/news-story/b9f3d3bb6ed1bcb86cfbbb7e61c88ce1
3 4
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July 24, 2025 3:50pm
- Paulus
  
  You are assuming Ghislaine does not hang herself first though, are you not ?
  I would expect that she does know, and everything she knows is well away from the corruption of the US legal system.
  
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  July 24, 2025 3:58pm
cmm

It’s one of those “only in Africa” stories, except they’re starting to get far too common in NZ…

I am struggling to see how this small Nanogirl company managed to get in the hole for $180,000 in unpaid GST, and $86,500 in PAYE.

“They relied on funding from the Ministry of Education and MBIE’s Unlocking Curious Minds fund, which supported community science programmes.”

So they took the grift money and didn’t pay the taxes.

“According to Damien Grant, director of insolvency firm Waterstone, a $180,000 GST debt is very small. “I doubt an IRD enforcement officer would get up from their desk for that,””

Wow. I was less than 48 hours late with a far smaller payment and they were on me like flies on a turd.

All I can think is that there was a massive abuse of the taxpayer’s purse.

There are claims that “Nanogirl”, Dr Michelle Dickson didn’t take even $1 or payment for a whole year. Well, somehow over a million of taxpayer’s money all disappeared in a put of smoke!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/360767596/nanogirl-owes-inland-revenue-more-265000
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July 24, 2025 3:55pm
Ghost

Ouch. Someone is going to lose some money

French President Emmanuel Macron and his wife, Brigitte, have filed a 22-count defamation lawsuit in the United States against right-wing podcaster Candace Owens over the claim that Brigitte could be a man.

Article
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July 24, 2025 4:00pm
- kowtow
  
  Ouch. Didn’t she whack him in the gob .
  Nek minnit , all smiles for the cameras .
  All the world’s a stage.
  
  4 1
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  July 24, 2025 4:20pm
- All_on_Red
  
  “Someone is going to lose some money”
  The Macrons to their lawyers
  They are public figures and will have to prove Owens had actual malice in making the comments
  Then there’s the fact Owens is an idiot who has burned what little credibility she has had and few will take her comments seriously.
  Good Streisand Effect by Messrs Macron though
  
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  July 24, 2025 4:41pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Well either Macron’s wife was born a biological male or she wasn’t. Very easy to prove for the case.
    
    3 2
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    July 24, 2025 7:50pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Thats not how the law works in this case
      Not sure I look forward to her proving her sex…
      
      1 1
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      July 24, 2025 9:57pm
- RichardX
  
  I’m more interested in Trump suing WSJ…for 10 billion. Can’t wait for depositions and discovery but more likely to settle or fold before that happens.
  
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  July 24, 2025 6:04pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    So far Trump has been doing well winning settlements from the MSM entertainment conglomerates for their lies.
    
    [Mod – debate the topics without your normal abusive crap]
    
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    July 24, 2025 9:59pm
NothingLeft

Seems only ones not involved in the Trump Russian Collusion plot were Trump and Russia.
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July 24, 2025 4:06pm
- NothingLeft
  
  A shortish Fox news summary of the case against Obama manufacturing the Russia Collusion hoax.
  
  https://youtu.be/zERhFN1JNS0
  
  Obama might skate given executive privilege (which ended when Trump came in), but his lieutenants may go down given conspiracy statute of limitations only starts at point last act of the conspiracy is committed.
  
  It’s going to be a real test of the rule of law in US
  
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  July 24, 2025 5:41pm
Swifty

The South Park boys are back and have released this little ditty on Trump:

https://x.com/tltanicsss/status/1948211187113492561?s=46

Pretty harsh. He won’t like it.

NSFW.
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July 24, 2025 4:21pm
- Swifty
  
  The whole episode:
  
  https://x.com/sharped_cheddar/status/1948215898449301934?s=46
  
  1 1
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  July 24, 2025 5:41pm
Swifty

How asylum broke Britain:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3N0NUJs2hfE

The British political class treats ordinary Brits with contempt while they wreck the nation.
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July 24, 2025 4:53pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  The UK is so messed up it’s scary. A warning for similar idiot regimes around this region.
  
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  July 24, 2025 7:51pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Speaker says:
Aotearoa is OK for NZ

https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20250724_20250724_16
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July 24, 2025 5:33pm
- Keith White
  
  Speaker does not decide that. Brownlee is getting more incoherently incompetent by the month.
  
  6 3
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  July 24, 2025 6:03pm
  - Ghost
    
    So where in that ruling of the use of Aotearoa in the house is the speaker wrong? That is all this ruling is about.
    
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    July 24, 2025 6:08pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Are we talking OK for the house or OK for NZ?
      
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      July 24, 2025 7:53pm
      - Ghost
        
        House.
        
        1 0
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        July 24, 2025 8:02pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Not my house
        
        3 2
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        July 24, 2025 8:12pm
      - Jack5
        
        Yesterday in Parliament, the to and fro was about “Aotearoa New Zealand”. Today in the House it was about “Aotearoa”.
        
        Why not just “Aotearoa” when speaking, writing in Maori language, and “New Zealand” when speaking, writing in English? Parallel languages like English and Quebec French in Canada?
        
        “En Zed” sometimes pops up in spoken language, and proliferates in written and printed language. You don’t hear or read a shortened version for “Aotearoa,” or “ANZ” for “Aotearoa New Zealand.”
        
        What would be a two-letter abbreviation for Maori?
        
        Angola already has the internet/phone two-letter code “AO,” Argentina has “AR”, Aruba has “AA,” Austria has “AT,” and Macau has “MO.”
        
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        July 24, 2025 11:42pm
- Prince
  
  I’m OK with the word.
  It lets me know the speaker is a virtue-signalling leftie, and can be ignored.
  
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  July 24, 2025 9:12pm
  - Ghost
    
    Bit like this Act party slogan
    
    1 1
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    July 24, 2025 9:34pm
Boy Geoff

At least Andrew Geddis was honest enough to say that ‘the left’ needs those specials and late enrolling voters come election time.

Differed from the pontificating rubbish from that Labour MP going on all about the virtues of democracy and the fact that good pure hard working folk can’t get around to enroll in time for the elections.
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July 24, 2025 6:34pm
- Ian Boag
  
  I guess both parties here are correct. The left will probably be affected more than the right. Democracy will be affected negatively from making it more difficult to vote.
  
  We don’t have legislative provisions that restrict the franchise for dropkicks. Ditto for oldies with dementia.
  
  If processing the specials in a timely fashion was really a problem, they could always have thrown a bit more resource at it.
  
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  July 25, 2025 8:42am
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360762662/christchurch-woman-exploited-migrant-fund-daughters-cancer-treatment
And so it continues. And will only get worse.
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July 24, 2025 6:49pm
Ghost

A few weeks ago someone posted a bogus article about doc secretly closing an unknown cave because of unknown reasons. Story stunk like mad,, but some still fell for it

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/567221/how-a-local-website-was-hijacked-and-filled-with-ai-generated-coherent-gibberish
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July 24, 2025 7:06pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Whew. No need to worry about what DOC gets up to then.
  
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  July 24, 2025 7:58pm

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