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October 13, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 13 October 2025

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NeverMindTheBollocks

Faithfully reported by RNZ, the usual suspects are foreseeing the end of times or some such due to the Government lowering our methane cut target.

Meanwhile, elsewhere on RNZ it’s reported that new seeps of methane are being discovered at an astonishing rate from vast reservoirs off Antartica (more than 40 to date in the Ross Sea alone).

The latter story is not referred to in the former, which is appalling journalism. The cynic in me suspects that this choice is deliberate, because why would anyone be concerned about our methane emissions when they are dwarfed by what nature does, and that would be off-message.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/575716/government-missed-opportunity-to-price-methane-climate-scientist

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/575685/scientists-discovered-something-alarming-seeping-out-from-beneath-the-ocean-around-antarctica
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October 13, 2025 8:01am
- artemisia
  
  Scientists are investigating. Will they find out that potentially catastrophic methane seeps from south of New Zealand are showing up here? And if so, how do they compare to cow farts.
  
  Enquiring minds want to know.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:29am
  - cmm
    
    Every carbon atom in a cow fart was harvested from the atmosphere by photosynthesis.
    
    Somehow millions of wildebeest and elephants and such, as well as the planes bison of yore, were all carbon neutral.
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:45am
    - Spam
      
      Apparently Bison remove millions and billions and trillions of tonnes of CO2 from the atmosphere because reasons!
      
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      October 13, 2025 8:57am
      - cmm
        
        I’ve done the carbon accounting of livestock on KB at least 5 times in the past. Chemistry and physics have not changed.
        
        Meat, bone, skin and fat all contain large amounts of carbon – as do plant products.
        
        Imagine if we had a technology that could convert CO2 into food? Yup, we do. It is called agriculture.
        
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        October 13, 2025 9:05am
    - Ruahine
      
      cmm
      Not to mention the estimated 350 million cows in India.
      
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      October 13, 2025 9:03am
      - cmm
        
        If you really want to get into the big numbers then look at bacteria. There are more bacteria in a human gut than there are human cells. We are effectively compost heaps surrounded by a tube of meat. Same for all animals.
        
        The only reason animals fart and burp methane is because of the bacteria in our gut. These are not materially different from those in in your garden compost heap (Greta-approved) or rotting on the forest floor.
        
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        October 13, 2025 9:56am
    - cmm
      
      Oops! A downticker who thinks they can improve on, or disregard, the laws of physics.
      
      Sorry sunshine, the laws of physics are not a popularity contest. They don’t care about feelz.
      
      Gravity will continue to exist even if you down vote it, deplatform it, set Antifa on it or ask Cindy to give you a hug.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:45am
  - Nikola Donatello
    
    A question I posted yesterday. I will ask it again.
    
    Is the New Zealand government going to advise the UN that it is cutting the Paris obligations to account for the reduced methane target?
    
    If it is not going to do that, other parts of the economy are going to be required to make up the shortfall.
    
    I hope that it is the former. Sadly I think it may be the latter. Hopefully a journalist will ask the question.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:34am
    - cmm
      
      Why would they do that?
      
      Willis has openly said that she is Green-Blue (? or was that Blue/Green?).
      
      Luxon gave Maureen Pugh “homework” when she went off-script.
      
      They have not made any attempt to hide their position on this, so why be disappointed when they do exactly what they said they would do?
      
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      October 13, 2025 9:59am
      - Nikola Donatello
        
        So why is Chloe losing her mind? If you are correct, other emissions will be reduced more harshly to compensate for more lenient treatment of farmers.
        
        Also why is the media leaving out such an important detail?
        
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        October 13, 2025 10:17am
      - cmm
        
        Chloe losing her mind pre-supposes she has a mind to lose.
        
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        October 13, 2025 11:51am
    - Phronesis
      
      Climate change will die with a whisper not a bang. It will just stop being reported on by the media. Politicians will pretend it never happened, they never said that, just like they do with Covid. The die hard activists will be left screaming into the void but once the money goes to some other issue the activists will follow. Greta is already there. The academics and “scientists” will be funded to study other things. New bogeymen will be created. people will forget. Of course this won’t in any way mitigate the enormous amount of damage that has been done but then nothing really can. Much like Covid, too many were complicit in climate change to ever admit that mistakes were made. Much easier to just move on and ignore the victims.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:14am
      - Gary Benner
        
        As with Hipkins “no-one was forced to take the jab” the history of “climate change” will be slowly rewritten.
        The USA has announced that the so called “climate chnage” message is a scam, and so mow the Research Projects will all now change to reflect the money available. And hopefully it will all fade into obscurity and we can all rest in peace again, warm by our fires.
        
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        October 13, 2025 11:08am
      - cmm
        
        Yup, like peak oil, the proponents will just move their tent to the next new outrage and pretend they were never there.
        
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        October 13, 2025 11:52am
    - Paulus
      
      So called Journalists would not know how to ask an intelligent question unless the answers suit them correct or not.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:33am
  - Phronesis
    
    It’s probably always been true that gas wells reduce the overall pressure and natural leakage from underground gas reservoirs. Burning that gas then converts it from methane to the much less warming CO2 and plant food. If you believed in global warming and followed the science you would be massively encouraging gas exploration, drilling, and burning.
    The whole climate change debacle has never made any sense unless the point of it is the deindustrialisation of the West and massive wealth transfers. As this has largely been achieved already we can expect the climate change rhetoric to be replaced by the next big lie within the next decade.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:05am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Its estimated 80% of Hydrocarbons naturally seep/ Leak to the surface, Whether Oceans or land.
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:34pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        Really? Can’t say I’ve run into that one … reference maybe?
        
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        October 13, 2025 1:09pm
      - bythesea
        
        I have always wanted to visit one of these
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tar_pit
        The La Brea one is LA is supposed to have great fossil collection
        
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        October 13, 2025 1:32pm
    - Fender
      
      Food is next like mr gates report the other day 1 glass milk ,x amount of protein etc etc per day
      Was a very scary list
      
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      October 13, 2025 1:09pm
    - David Garrett
      
      Phron: I have often wondered how many “tipping points” need to be exceeded without the predicted global catastrophe(s) before the penny drops for most people
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:16pm
- Albie
  
  I love the references to methane as “climate polluting” and “super polluting”. Didn’t see the word “toxic” but maybe they save that one for C02?
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:46am
  - cmm
    
    If you give someone life saving mouth to mouth resuscitation you’re breathing out around 1% of CO2 into the patient’s lungs.
    
    That is about 25x as much CO2 as there is in the atmosphere.
    
    Yet the average poorly educated person believes that we’re just around the corner from CO2 levels being so high that we will not be able to breath.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:09am
    - Ian Boag
      
      Are you suggesting that the world would continue to work just fine with 1% CO2 in the atmosphere? Plans would all pig out etc etc … ?
      
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      October 13, 2025 1:12pm
      - cmm
        
        No I am not at all suggesting that. What I am pointing out is how far we are from “dangerous to breath” levels of CO2 that many believe is just around the corner.
        
        Sustained breathing of 1% CO2 would likely give you a headache.
        
        By the way, if we got to just 0.1% (ie 1000 ppm – 2.5 x what it is now), plant growth would be abundant. You would have to mow your lawn twice a week and deserts would struggle to exist.
        
        That’s one reason it is hard for CO2 levels to rise much from where they are now. The plants would quickly chomp it.
        
        Much below where it is now would be starvation levels for plants (any anything that eats plants or relies on a plant-based food web – including us).
        
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        October 13, 2025 2:44pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        The plants would need more nitrogen and water … coming from where?
        
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        October 13, 2025 8:24pm
  - kowtow
    
    The most significant greenhouse gas is dihydrogen oxide.
    
    But of course the same scientists who tell us that also know they and their thicko pollie mates can’t call for its banning or for its net zero because the thicko Teal types might suddenly wake up to the scam.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:16am
    - cmm
      
      Well that as well as the oxygen and nitrogen and lesser gases that make up the atmosphere.
      
      If we lost our magnetosphere (which will happen in some number of billions of years) we will soon lose our atmosphere and then GHG will no longer be an issue.
      
      I won’t be around to claim on the servo pie bet.
      
      Aside: this is also why all the talk of terraforming Mars is bullshit. No magnetosphere and insufficient gravity mean that there is no hope of rebuilding an atmosphere except in science fiction novels.
      
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      October 13, 2025 11:59am
- NZer In Exile
  
  It’s been warmer than now many times in the “recent” (geological time) past and there was no methane generated apocalypse. Methane apocalypse hypothesis debunked. Pull the other one clowns.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:01pm
Cassandra

Capital punishment has returned to Britain. Hanging was abolished 60 years ago but the UK now has a novel way of executing evildoers – it sends them to one its Paremoremo-type institutions where the miscreant has his throat cut by a fellow prisoner.

Paedophilia is the usual crime. The advantage of this system is that it reduces legal costs.

It is also barbaric. If you’re going to have capital punishment then it needs to be the law, not some sort of vigilante lynching. If it’s not official then prisoners should be protected, regardless of how distasteful their crimes may have been.
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October 13, 2025 8:01am
- septic skeptic
  
  Accidental downtick
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:15am
- Eastlander
  
  Agreed. Too many fools oppose the death penalty because we might execute an innocent person, but they’re quite comfortable with some offenders being murdered in prison – as though incarcerated criminals are keener judges of guilt or innocence than a properly constituted court.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:32am
  - septic skeptic
    
    “as though incarcerated criminals are keener judges…”… Hmmm. 😁
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:56am
  - David Garrett
    
    East: You do realise that before paedos are sent to jail they have been found guilty by a judge or jury?
    
    I can’t summon up much sympathy for paedos murdered in jail…I have a great deal of sympathy for their victims
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:19am
    - Christopher Thomson
      
      No matter how we feel about vigilante justice, if they are incarcerated by the state then the state must ensure their safety.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:29am
    - Ghost
      
      How about if peter ellis was killed in jail
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:32am
      - David Garrett
        
        Ghost: Yes, fair point. But he is one of hundreds if not thousands. When i supported the death penalty i argued that it wasn’t a very good argument that very occasionally the system might get it wrong.
        A couple of hundred people are killed on the roads each year. The vast majority of them are entirely innocent of any wrong doing.
        
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        October 13, 2025 10:38am
      - cmm
        
        DG: Yup if you zoom out then wrongful executions are very much like those that are killed on the roads or even one of your favourites – the young men killed/maimed in battle or the little 4 year old girl playing with her doll when a bomb is dropped and blows her into hamburger mince.
        
        There is a common good for society that requires that the “ultimate tax” be paid by a few innocents.
        
        While there would be very few innocents that get executed, the vast majority of those executed would be deserving and society would be a far better place with them gone.
        
        Sure, sucks if it is you, but that is the way the cookie crumbles.
        
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        October 13, 2025 10:55am
      - Phronesis
        
        The thing about locking up someone like Tarrant indefinitely at a cost that is believed to be around 2 million a year is that people are literally dying in NZ due to lack of access to drugs, surgery etc etc. The fact is that on a large enough scale, lives can be accounted for in dollars. We waste money / lives on the strangest things in this country
        
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        October 13, 2025 1:20pm
      - David Garrett
        
        cmm: Let me clarify my position a little…there were around 400 executions in the UK during the 20th century. ONE was certainly wrong; Timothy Evans who was hanged for a murder committed by his landord, and one other – that of Derek Bentley – may well have been wrong.
        
        In NZ on the other hand – a country that has less than 10% of the population of the UK – there have been several wrongful convictions for murder, starting with AA Thomas in 1970.
        
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        October 13, 2025 2:27pm
    - Boy Geoff
      
      In Aotearoa, paedos get name suppression if they come from a wealthy, connected family that donates funds to a requisite cause. The fact that naming them might inflame the ‘culture wars’ also needs to be taken into serious consideration…
      
      (Meanwhile, common paedos who are nobodies in the overall scheme of things but who might commit very similar crimes to the aforementioned will be most unlikely to receive such leniency).
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:37am
    - Boy Geoff
      
      And just like that, yet another ‘well-known’ NZer has been charged with sexual abuse.
      
      Why do so many ‘well-known’ NZers only appear to be ‘well-known’ in very select, closed communities?
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:46am
    - Eastlander
      
      David Garrett: The point is not whether paedophiles deserve to be killed (they do), the point is that it’s deeply silly for someone to oppose the death penalty because it might result in innocent people being executed, and then take satisfaction in the lawless murder of an inmate by his fellow inmates. Many people feel this way, and if they examined the implications of their feelings then they’d realise they were trusting convicted criminals to distinguish between the guilty and innocent with 100% success, something they admittedly think the police and courts can’t do.
      
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      October 13, 2025 11:25am
    - Ra Henare
      
      oh dear David, you of all people would know that found guilty by judge or Jury doesn’t mean they did it!!!!!
      
      Refer
      Arthur Allan Thomas
      Peter Ellis
      Teina Pora
      Alan Hall.
      and many others
      
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_Cases_Review_Commission_(New_Zealand)
      
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      October 13, 2025 3:54pm
  - Notsofast
    
    Eastlander, it is reasonable for Teina Pora, Arthur Thomas and a bunch of eithers I won’t bother listing to oppose capital punishment.
    Walter James Bolton’s wife died from arsenic leaching into the water supply from the upstream sheep dip.
    For this unfortunate misunderstanding of science, he was last man hanged, as alleged poisoner, and no doubt opposed the practice.
    
    It is worth noting Andrew Little singlehandedly established a CCRC here.
    This not least after a few activists took Teina Poras case and won at the privy council, at their expense.
    
    As justice minister at the time, Amy Adams made the preposterous observation this showed the system working.
    Nice one Amy.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:55am
    - David Garrett
      
      Notso: Borrow a copy of “Guilty on the gallows” by Sherwood Young from your local library.
      
      Mr Young argues cogently that Bolton was Guilty as charged. Among the several reasons are that Bolton also drank tea made with the well water but didn’t get sick.
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:33pm
      - Notsofast
        
        So why was he the only family member to demand an autopsy which would lead to the gallows?
        His wife got better in hospital and sick at home.
        Will look for that book all the same.
        
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        October 13, 2025 5:56pm
  - LB
    
    A demerit point system would remove the innocent person issue. If murder or paedophilia is the qualifier for the rope, their previous convictions for serious crimes(SA, robbery, GBH etc) would need add up to enough demerits to qualify. Therefore Peter Ellis scenarios would not be subject to this.
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:11am
  - Taieri
    
    Too many fools oppose the death penalty
    ————
    
    I’m one of these fools…and here is why…
    
    Is an act of a state employee authorised by the state to carry out the death penalty any different from an act of a person he executes? In what way?
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:40am
    - Christopher Thomson
      
      Ergo, no soldier should ever go to war, no matter the cause.
      
      And all abortion must therefore be illegal.
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:56pm
    - Phronesis
      
      Euthanasia, by definition, is indistinguishable in action to State execution. The only difference is that the executed agrees to it.
      
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      October 13, 2025 1:25pm
    - David Garrett
      
      Taeiri: There are many very good argument against CP…yours is not one of them.
      
      I am on my phone today so will only tap out the obvious one: the murderer has killed a fellow human, while his victim has not.
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:36pm
- cmm
  
  Vigilantism rises when the state fails to perform its duties. Those that will do the job are sometimes those with the least to lose.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:47am
  - kowtow
    
    ‘Those that will do the job are sometimes those with the least to lose.’
    
    In the context of gaol house murders I wonder . The killer may well gain huge “kudos” within his chosen audience.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:19am
    - cmm
      
      Quite. Nothing to lose but likely a lot to gain.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:00am
- kowtow
  
  National suicide is Britain’s major problem.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:17am
  - MCōs
    
    Roughly the same rate as here
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:12am
    - cmm
      
      kowtow is not talking about the suicide rate of the people.
      He’s talking about UK committing suicide as a country by letting itself be overrun for fear of being called racist.
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:02pm
- BananaLlama
  
  Don’t get it wrong.
  Paedos aren’t killed because they are horrible people, they are killed because no one will care what happens to them and violent scum bags can do what they want without retaliation.
  
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  October 13, 2025 11:20am
Tomtoddy

Have watched most of the quarter final rugby games. The game is becoming boring and insufferable. For major portions of the game, it is a player catching the ball, running forward a metre or so, ducking down as he is tackled, being pounced on by a couple of mates so cutting off any access to the ball by the opposition, smuggling the ball back to the halfback who repeats the process. This hugely uninteresting piece of play can be repeated 20 or 30 times with perhaps 20 or 30 metres gained.

Refereeing this dull activity is inconsistent with dubious calls being made depending on whether the ball is on the ground, the opposition player has one or two hands on the ball, whether he is standing, carrying his own weight etc – all of which in a flash of a second or so is impossible to be certain about.

Unless there are some changes made to return to running, flowing back play I am moving to a different sport for weekend watching pleasure. Marbles would even be better.
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October 13, 2025 8:03am
- Southern Raider
  
  As per Chuck’s comment you should have watched the Great Race instead.
  
  Usually rain wrecks most sporting contests, but yesterday it added something special to the last 45 mins of Bathhurst. The amount of drama, lead changes and near misses was unbelievable.
  
  Also have to feel for Ryan the young Kiwi from Wellington who is only 21 and had a chance to win until his engine blew up. However Payne the 23 year old Kiwi brought the win home in style.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:13am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Where is Payne from?
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:53am
- Anthony Melchett
  
  Do yourself a favour and watch the nrl final if you haven’t already.
  
  You will never take rugby union seriously again.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:14am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Or the Raiders Broncos match from earlier in the playoffs! Just don’t turn off until the post match interviews start!!!!
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:42am
  - Skippytony
    
    Watch any home and away AFL game at the ground and it will spoil your Union watching forever.
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:57am
- septic skeptic
  
  In the current era league is a vastly better watch. Chalk and cheese. That wasn’t always the case.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:18am
- pdm
  
  `For major portions of the game, it is a player catching the ball, running forward a metre or so, ducking down as he is tackled……………………..’
  
  Rugby League, with lineouts, of the 1960’s TT.
  
  Before league brought in the 5 or 6 tackle rule.
  
  NPC has one big favourable factor that super rugby does not have though – Provincial Patriotism and support. Not that it is reflected in spectators at games but, it keeps me interested cheering on Hawkes Bay and hoping Auckland and Wellington lose.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:59am
  - Southern Raider
    
    Agree I’ve watched many times more NPC games than super rugby and even provinces I don’t usually support.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:02am
  - gravedodger
    
    Plus Canterbury next Saturday pdm, aye
    
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    October 13, 2025 1:17pm
- MCōs
  
  It’s my understanding that in Europe the top players are contracted to play for the clubs and released to play only in an international window.
  Here the top players are contracted to NZR and only peripheral ABs are released to play in the NPC – occasionally.
  Consequently what we had over the weekend were semi amateur teams of second tier players in front of mediocre crowds – particularly yesterday at the pitiful, pop up, windswept, hand me down, ex rugby league, heap in Addington
  The Wellington team can’t afford the rent on the waterfront stadium so they play at Porirua at another feeble stadium.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:02am
  - MCōs
    
    I wonder where the Canterbury team will play their games next year? There seems to be little public interest in the competition in Christchurch.
    One imagines the seat prices at the new coliseum will mean it’ll be the home ground for Mid Canterbury
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:38am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      “it’ll be the home ground for Mid Canterbury”. Not likely MCos, the Mighty Men from Mid have a perfectly serviceable ground at the Ashburton Showground. And they get a fair old crowd there. Pretty much always have. And the bars in town are chokka afterward.
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:49pm
  - Hammie
    
    Often the overseas clubs will not release their players even for the internationals (Frances last tour here, with a B team). We don’t have a perfect system but its preferable to some alternatives. As for second tier players in the NPC, a lot of these players could step up to Super or All Blacks sides IMHO, but you can only pick and stick with so many players. The mediocre crowds love to see their club players representing their province and although they may not fill stadiums, what they lack in numbers they make up for in enthusiasm. We would all love a flash stadium, but I prefer $25 adult tickets and the kids for free at the moment. Having watched the BOP team dismantle Tasman for the second time this season at the Tauranga Domain on Saturday I hope we can go one better this year than last.
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:17am
- Prince
  
  The reffing in the Otago-Waikato game was appalling. So inconsistent.
  I’m not a Waikato fan but…They Wuz Robbed.
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:25am
- hookerphil
  
  You missed the bit where , normally the halfback, kicks the 20-30 metres forward – then it is exciting as the other team then get to do there thing 20 or 20 times – and then they kick it……………………
  
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  October 13, 2025 12:21pm
- Fender
  
  Disagree a little, they were far more exciting than super games with alot more running and risk taking and the weaker defense having more holes
  Most I know really enjoyed the close hard fought games
  Historical games are viewed with rose glasses I feel lots of scrum resets lineouts , the actual game time was way less per game and the running metre coverage of players was minimal compared to now
  Its not perfect but its improved and there is way more action than past
  Agree some if the safety rules gave got silly
  
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  October 13, 2025 1:25pm
Conservatarian

Remember this time around four years ago when Princess Empathy tried to force you to take a novel and unproven yet 100% “safe and effective” medical treatment.

Derek Cheng of the NZH actually had the gall to ask her “Aren’t you creating two classes of citizen?”

Ardern snorted “Yes, yes, that is what it is” and laughed at him, though it was really directed at all of us. After all, some of us thought there was still a chance we hadn’t slid into totalitarianism.

Most of us simply rolled over, and waited for the next instruction on how the government could dictate how we did everyday things. Soon after, we would be told the number of people we could associate with safely at any one point in time.

Now we make sure to never speak of it again.
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October 13, 2025 8:07am
- keepcalmcarryon
  
  Yes it sucked. Now move on with your life.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:50am
  - kowtow
    
    Rubbish.
    
    We can’t let it happen again.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:20am
    - cmm
      
      We can’t but we will.
      
      Someone just needs to yell “boogeyman” and everyone will run squealing for the government to “keep them safe”.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:02am
      - sirknz
        
        Just the smooth brains.
        
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        October 13, 2025 3:02pm
    - keepcalmcarryon
      
      I doubt it, the government over reach turned a lot of people off with some bad consequences like low measles vax rates subsequently
      I don’t think people would comply the same way again for some time.
      But constantly picking at that scab isn’t healthy.
      Jacindas gone, let’s move forward, otherwise its no different to the colonial grievance industry, wrong was done, learn, move on.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:18am
      - waikatosinger
        
        But don’t forget that a lot of people loved it. They triple masked while driving their car. They shouted abuse to people walking their dogs. They couldn’t wait to snitch on their neighbours. They went out of their way to be nasty to the unvaccinated and those opposed to government overreach. They called people filth, lied about them, and cheered when the police beat them up. As a consequence I have lost the trust I once had in the fundamental decency of New Zealanders.
        
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        October 13, 2025 11:53am
      - keepcalmcarryon
        
        People who have lived in communist countries will tell you that the narcs and curtain twitchers are in all societies, we were never any different, we just didn’t have a situation to notice before.
        
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        October 13, 2025 2:32pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Agree Conservatarian.
  
  It seems there are many who not only complied with the régime but who willingly participated in it who now are the strongest critics of it.
  I hope they never forget their cowardice.
  
  They know who they are.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:54am
- Yvette
  
  Conservatarian, you are always going to be exposed to choices.
  
  The whole of covid medications involved seeing international reports of death among the elderly and intergenerational living arrangements (France, Italy, or Hawaiians and Pacific Islanders as in Los Angeles) and in many cases not concern for your own life but those of your older or medically compromised family members.
  How many were unable to check out a totally hyped unknown situation, not for their own protection, but that of others?
  
  At the moment you have the choice of bankrupting our economy or reducing emissions when it may be largely a cosmic cycle, part hidden by human activity.
  
  Or the elevation of one ethnicity above all others when you can see that the same ethnicity occupies so many lower social statistics that adopting it in governance roles may not improve their status to even be considered a goal to strive for. Meanwhile their culture at every turn is not helpful because it seems untruthful, a lie to their lauded exceptionalism, and so to many of other ethnicities an irritation that can be called racist, even if an unconscious process as would seem to be in my case until I realized it (the simplistic version of “whatever wolf you feed”)
  
  I think I dislike the racist condition more than long covid –
  I can take more medication for one of them.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:10am
  - Grumpy Silver Top
    
    Pretty close to my thinking on these three issues. Climate change is beyond the control of puny humankind.
    The government’s covid response used fear to control the population and wasted vast sums.
    (Channelling David Seymour) government on racist divisions is madness.
    
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    October 13, 2025 2:13pm
- Paulus
  
  Some 52% of voters voted her in !
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:35am
  - kowtow
    
    And a large proportion then tired of all her kindness very quickly.
    
    You gotta love the swing voter .
    
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    October 13, 2025 1:10pm
    - Paulus
      
      Swing voters still appear to be here.
      But by definision there are two areas of swing voters Women versus Men, and Maori against the rest.
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:11pm
Chuck Bird

Great to see a Kiwi win at Bathurst. It was an incredible race.
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October 13, 2025 8:08am
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360851931/biggest-upsets-local-elections

Quote:

“In Wellington, Andrew Little stormed into the mayoralty with a commanding lead of 25,000 votes over runner-up Karl Tiefenbacher, and 27,000 over headline-grabbing opponent Ray Chung.
In a statement sent to Stuff, Chung blamed his loss on the media and other candidates for “manipulated attacks” against him.”
Chung could also blame the media, especially Stuff, for unashamedly promoting Little at the expense of other candidates from the time he ( Little ) announced his candidacy. He was given an extraordinary amount of positive coverage since that time, with his photo pasted everywhere for effect.

Despicable practice by Stuff. And RNZ. And The Post.
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October 13, 2025 8:08am
- Nikola Donatello
  
  I don’t get why you would vote for someone as mayor who was an utter failure in government coupled with anger management issues.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:13am
  - Anthony Melchett
    
    They (wellington voters) think he was wonderful in government with his visionary health system centralisation and careful spending…
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:16am
    - mandk
      
      Careful spending?
      
      He certainly knew that the money had been spent, but as for where, on what, and the outcomes achieved he hadn’t a clue.
      
      But he is a socialist, and what matters is the amount of spending, not what it produces.
      
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      October 13, 2025 9:05am
  - KKNZ2025
    
    “…an utter failure in govt coupled with anger management issues” apparently Little best represents the majority of Wellington voters
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:18am
  - Paulus
    
    But, But, Angry Andy is to be congratulated as it is the first time he has ever been elected, even if it was by the media !
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:19am
    - Ian Boag
      
      That’s a good point. Surprised you haven’t mentioned it before … or earlier … or again … or since yesterday … or did I miss something -)
      
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      October 13, 2025 8:47am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Yes. Given that a good mayor should have charm and charisma. Back into he day they could leave the detail to the town clerk. Now they have to contend with grandiose lefty CEO’s.
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:24am
  - Eastlander
    
    Consider that there are lot of people who see themselves in him.
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:34am
  - Foxfour
    
    [Mod – debate the topic]
    
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    October 13, 2025 8:42am
  - Scooter
    
    They love him for giving us Jacinda, warts and all.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:28am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    Are you being serious Nikola? Wellington voted Tory Whanau in. Why the heck wouldn’t they vote someone only marginally less inept in? I reckon if Labour had put a cardboard cut out of Bill Rowling up, they would have voted for it.
    
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    October 13, 2025 2:53pm
- Conservatarian
  
  But Wellington ratepayers now have a $7,000 painting with which they can commemorate Little’s predecessor.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:28am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    The naked Little painting will probably cost them a lot more though – the owner probably doesn’t want to part with it.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:18am
  - imalwaysright
    
    The Moaning Lisa
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:25am
- PeterTrentham
  
  Welly voted in a Wally.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:29am
  - mandk
    
    Welly will vote for a wally willy nilly.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:56am
- Mod88
  
  Wellingrad is complete. Now watch a Labour/Greens Coalition in action and think 2026 with the added bonus of Te Pati Maori for that is what Wellingrad will be, a microcosm of that combination.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:33am
  - RoboRob
    
    Not that I am any fan of Labour or Andrew Little but isn’t his selection in Wellington a step back from the crazy? They have after all just moved from a hard left green Mayor to a standard leftie.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:15am
    - Eastlander
      
      Continuation of the status quo, the staff run the city and Little is a bad manager who hasn’t bothered to learn how local government works so they’ll walk all over him. Though given that they’ll now have to manage the explosive temper of this under-achieving tosser their work environment is going to be more toxic than ever.
      
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      October 13, 2025 9:36am
    - Paulus
      
      If Angry thinks he can tell the Wellington Council CEO and the senior staff what he wants he is still dreaming !
      They are a law unto themselves in all Councils irrespective of Councillors and Mayors.
      Staff are there for whenever whereas elections and changes are every three years.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:40am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    It will be interesting to see how Andrew Little goes about stitching a majority of Councillors together. Although nominally the Left have the numbers, there are some crazies there and even those marked with a big, red L might go off piste from time to time.
    
    I suspect Andrew may need to rely on some of his erstwhile opponents from time to time to make up the numbers.
    
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    October 13, 2025 12:23pm
- MCōs
  
  Chung only has himself to blame as everybody knows
  He was front runner until this happened
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/566828/slinging-match-as-dirty-politics-engulfs-wellington-mayoral-race
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:49am
  - Eastlander
    
    I’d say it was Whanau’s fault for airing her shame, but maybe one of these days you’ll get the order of cause and effect right.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:01am
  - Quail
    
    There is always space in a bureaucracy for life members.
    Little is one, Nick Smith another.There are many other examples
    The MMP led NZ bureaucracy makes it easy!
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:16am
    - Paulus
      
      Nick is a well liked and even respected Mayor of Nelson.
      
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      October 13, 2025 2:13pm
  - Prince
    
    Sure, but that happened two years before the story ‘broke’.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:30am
    - Ghost
      
      Welcome to politics, your stupidity always comes back to bite you on the butt
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:37am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    Chung was stupid enough to write an email based on what someone had said to him. Tory simply held on to the info. until the best and most damaging time to Chung to release it to media. Once it was released, Chung should have pulled out of mayoralty race as he was doomed. Then his votes could have gone to Tiefenbacher
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:20am
Observant Octagenarian

I used the new “AI Mode” on google and asked what is the impact of the Emissions Trading Scheme on the NZ Consumer. The reply:
Overall impact on households
Cost of living: The ETS is a key driver of increases in the cost of living, with consumers bearing the brunt of the costs that businesses incur.
Disproportionate impact: The effect can be more severe for lower-income households, as they have less flexible spending and may not have the financial capacity to switch to more affordable alternatives.
=======
So the wonderful carbon tax is a key driver of the rapidly rising cost of living.
Kill the carbon tax, kill inflation!
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October 13, 2025 8:15am
- Foxfour
  
  Emissions trading scheme was bought in after Jenny Shipley signed us up to Kyoto treaty and was tightened at Paris in 2016 when John Key told the world we will have a reduction ‘30% lower by 2030′
  of course Labour and Greens support this.
  The Farmers are not paying for their agriculture ’emissions’ the taxpayers are
  In 2025 Budget Vote Environment there is $2 bill expenditure approved for tax payers buying carbon credits for that year alone.
  Except for a few exceptions the big industrial and oil companies ‘pay as they go’ and buy their own.
  Its NZ fastest growing industry Carbon trading
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:57am
  - Nikola Donatello
    
    That is just not true. The ETS was designed and implemented by David Parker in circa 2007. You are ten years out.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:06am
    - Foxfour
      
      The Kyoto Commitment in 1997-98 was the external obligation. Writing the legislation fell to the next government
      “In 2002, the Fifth Labour Government of New Zealand adopted the Climate Change Response Act 2002 in order for New Zealand to ratify the Kyoto Protocol and to meet obligations under the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change.” wikipedia summary
      And Who Signed up the country to Kyoto protocol in 1997-98 ?
      Why heres the list of JS achievements
      https://www.beehive.govt.nz/feature/year-review-1998
      Same as Paris Climate Commitment in 2016 [30% less by 2030] was John Keys term and the following legislation was a labour government as they were in power ( which all national MPS unanimously supported Zero Carbon- which I think means nett zero by 2050)
      
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      October 13, 2025 5:01pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Heres a speech by David Parker on 20 September 2007 introducing the ETS- which is what is causing the problem as its a huge expense, and probably pointless.
        https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/new-zealand-emissions-trading-scheme
        
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        October 13, 2025 5:15pm
- Southern Raider
  
  Yes lower power prices could be passed onto consumers and businesses instantly with the stroke of a pen, but National has ruled that out.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:04am
  - wsk12345
    
    How???
    They cant tell the generators they own less than half of to cut prices. They could tell lines companies or Transpower to spend less but that just causes under investment. I guess they could slash the small electricity authority levy. Or they could increase the winter energy payment – but that cant be what you mean as that’s not cutting prices.
    
    But rather tham us guessing yell us what stroke of thr pen you are referring to?
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:14am
    - Taieri
      
      How???
      ———
      
      They could use their share of dividends to do so. Not necessarily something that I’d support though.
      
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      October 13, 2025 11:44am
    - SoloView
      
      @ wsk12345
      The government still has control of some major generators.
      
      Government shareholdings of generators:-
      Genesis = 50.83%
      Meridian = 51.02%
      Mercury = 51.78%
      
      Contact Energy dose not show a government share holding (does have NZ Super Fund and ACC as shareholders).
      
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      October 13, 2025 11:58am
      - wsk12345
        
        The massive damage to our stock market will rule rhst one out. Who will invest when they realise that the govt can just tell companies to take lower profits?.
        
        The gov does not have any shares in Contact. But how will contact compete in a tilted electricity marktt where the partially govt owned gens dont have to return a profit to shareholders.
        
        Are you a leftie? I am surprised to come across people with no understanding of second and third order effects. We expect it from Chloe but not so much here.
        
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        October 13, 2025 1:30pm
      - SoloView
        
        @wsk12345
        
        I was merely noting that your statement re generator ownership was not correct
        
        It’s a bit sad that you feel the need to abuse someone who corrected your factual errors.
        
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        October 13, 2025 9:21pm
    - rouppe
      
      By ditching the ets or removing electricity generation from the ets.
      
      That would cut a fairly big chunk out of the bill.
      
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      October 13, 2025 3:24pm
- NothingLeft
  
  A majority of voters in western countries have reached breaking point on this. Cancelling the ineffectual carbon-green-indulgence industry and all it’s associated costs would be an electoral winner in most countries, and NZ will have the opportunity to cut all this cost with little to no trade penalty in near future – which we should take.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:33am
- Ghost
  
  Ask gemini what will happen to nzs trade if the government abandon the Emissions Trading Scheme
  
  And
  
  How would nzs free trade agreements be affected abandoning Emissions Trading Scheme
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:49am
- Nikola Donatello
  
  Well don’t believe your AI. The ETS increases the price of petrol by about 18 cents per litre. The number of units issued is in excess of our Paris obligations. That is why New Zealand will not even come close to achieving what it promised.
  
  The reality is that to take road travel as an example 18 cents a litre is not enough to achieve a big switch to EVs and public transport.
  
  The ETS has very minor impacts on people. It is tokenism. The government is not serious about meeting the 2030 targets. The 2050 targets are a fantasy.
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:11am
  - gravedodger
    
    Sending billions of borrowed money to Paris to be handed out to developing nations, to wit India a full Nuclear nation building coal fired generation at rates to make eyes water, great business sense for sure???
    
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    October 13, 2025 1:38pm
- Jethrod
  
  I did the alternate view of AI , asking what the benefits to an NZ Consumer:-
  The main advantage for NZ consumers is the incentivization of a low-carbon economy, which makes alternatives like electric vehicles and public transport more competitive and accessible over time. While the ETS can lead to higher prices for carbon-intensive goods initially, this is intended to be offset by government revenue, which can be reinvested to support consumers and sustainable projects like public transport and new technologies. Furthermore, the ETS can lead to future environmental benefits, such as the growth of forests, which may provide future benefits to the community.
  ………………….
  ………………….
  So no matter what you ask AI you tend to get a similar answer…… word soup.
  
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  October 13, 2025 11:41am
Ghost

The family of a young man killed when a phone-distracted truckie ran into the back of his work ute say her release after serving just nine months in prison is “impossible to comprehend”.

Truck driver Sarah Hope Schmidt was released from Arohata Women’s Prison roughly one-third of the way through her jail sentence of two years and four months for killing Caleb Baker and injuring another motorist.

Article

9 months is still better than home detention. Surprised the driver didn’t get home d
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October 13, 2025 8:28am
- Foxfour
  
  National government in early 1990s introduced the 1/3 time served then parole for those smaller sentences.
  Saved money apparently
  Shes was unlucky to get some jail time at all
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:46am
- cmm
  
  Let’s be real.
  
  I’ll place my standard bet of fifty cents and a servo pie that the family also drive while distracted by their phones (as does around 50% of the population). That they have not killed anyone is likely just down to luck and operating smaller and less lethal vehicles.
  
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  October 13, 2025 8:52am
  - MCōs
    
    She was using a truck while operating a phone
    Not vice versa
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:11am
    - imalwaysright
      
      She was multitasking:
      
      Using the phone, driving a truck, and killing an innocent man.
      
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      October 13, 2025 9:27am
      - Sir Henry Morgan
        
        I thought women were awesome at multitasking?
        
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        October 13, 2025 7:43pm
    - cmm
      
      MCos, you need to see Christchurch drivers at work.
      
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      October 13, 2025 10:04am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Maybe true. Maybe not. But regardless driving a big rig carries greater responsibility. As it should.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:15am
- MCōs
  
  I suppose one needs to reflect on the purpose of prison.
  In this case it appears the taxpayer is going to great expense to punish someone who is not likely, from what we know, to be a menace to society by not being in prison.
  Her real punishment will be an inability to find work, I suspect.
  I don’t know what goes on in a prison, but I imagine one could befriend some pretty unsavory characters who could provide ‘work’ on the outside
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:45am
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    I think more women should spend more time in prison. Would do them good and benefit society. Currently we have a justice system that strives to keep women out of prison even when they commit terrible crimes.
    
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    October 13, 2025 7:46pm
imalwaysright

Will Luxon and the Government see the majority rejection of the Maori Wards as an indication of the will of the public, or will they see it as most of the public are racist and therefore Maorification must be increased and accelerated ?
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October 13, 2025 8:58am
- Cassandra
  
  “Racism is the belief that groups of humans possess different behavioral traits corresponding to inherited attributes and can be divided based on the superiority of one race or ethnicity over another.”
  
  Maori seats, wards, jobs are based on the erroneous idea that a person’s opinions and beliefs are based on some tiny proportion of their DNA. It is preposterous. The majority of New Zealanders do not want this form of racism. Let’s take this opportunity to get rid of the whole racist shebang.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:22am
- kowtow
  
  No doubt they’ll tell themselves the low turnout indicates ……..whatever they want to take from the result.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:22am
  - Taieri
    
    A very plausible analysis here:
    
    https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2025/10/dr-bryce-edwards-local-government.html
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:17am
    - Tauhei Notts
      
      Bryce Edwards’ piece, in this instance, is well worth reading.
      Which is surprising as I have found many of his comments in the past to be drivel.
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:23pm
    - redeye
      
      Agree with most of what Dr Bryce writes. But did get a smile when I read;-
      
      Many other victorious mayors and councillors, while nominally independent, campaigned on classic right-wing populist themes: stop wasting money, cut the rates, stick up for ordinary people.
      
      Sticking up for ordinary people is now a classic right-wing populist theme? How long before this drifts into hard-right or far-right?
      
      Can I just add that I am delighted LGNZ ‘influencers’ got their backsides handed to them.
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:51pm
    - PurplePen
      
      Thanks for the link. Excellent piece. If you don’t want to read it all. One paragraph is below. The whole local authority arrangement needs major reform. And it’s not the method of voting that many trot out as the issue.
      ________
      “This is not a simple case of voter apathy but of voter antipathy. It’s a collective shrug of the shoulders by about two-thirds of voters, who simply haven’t been convinced that it’s worth participating. Such a silent vote of “no confidence” in the entire local government political establishment should be taken seriously as a strong political signal of public discontent and disillusionment. It signals that local government is yet another part of “Broken New Zealand” that needs serious reform rather than the standard tweaks that the political class are normally more interested in.”
      
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      October 13, 2025 1:47pm
- MCōs
  
  Depends what you mean by majority, because I read someone did a tally of all the votes and the majority were in favour of retention.
  Personally I’m surprised at the number of areas that decided to retain Maori wards.
  I don’t think Act will be standing on a policy of a referendum on the Maori seats in parliament next year
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:23am
  - leoj
    
    On the contrary, the results will embolden ACT, much to your displeasure.
    
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    October 13, 2025 12:07pm
  - The Housekeeper
    
    MCos, let them be a beacon for what can be achieved when democracy can be overridden. This is their big chance to show how wrong the rest of us are.
    
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    October 13, 2025 1:39pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Luxon has already made it clear that he sees no role for maorification of government SERVICES. Anything else of course is still on the table and they continue to mahi towards the he puapua goals.
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:21am
  - Ginger Cat
    
    Translate last sentence please
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:58am
    - septic skeptic
      
      If you don’t understand it, then you probably don’t support co-governance anyway and it’s better to keep you in the dark 😉
      
      1 3
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      October 13, 2025 1:08pm
  - rouppe
    
    Then why is there a Maori governance group in the proposed GE reforms
    
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    October 13, 2025 3:32pm
- Philview
  
  I read some commentary about one Ward that the referendums will continue until the public vote “Correctly”. Alternatively when Labour get back in those referendums opposing Maori wards will be null and void.
  
  8 2
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  October 13, 2025 11:18am
- leoj
  
  Such a geat question which the Nats will fail to realise.
  
  Remember, they are woke and spineless.
  
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  October 13, 2025 12:08pm
artemisia

Concerns raised as hundreds of learning support roles remain vacant

Hundreds? Alarmist headline much? 169 roles vacant currently, down from 284 in 2023. And extra funding to the tune of $747 million in this year’s budget to boost learning support.

Meanwhile some just can’t contain their negativity. Not a great example for the children.

NZEI delegate and speech-language therapist Conor Fraser said schools welcome the extra support, but doubts the roles can be filled.

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/education/concerns-raised-as-hundreds-of-learning-support-roles-remain-vacant/
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October 13, 2025 9:24am
- cmm
  
  Hundreds, by definition, would mean at least 200.
  
  But the journalists sometimes struggle with these new-fangled word thingies.
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:07am
Maggy Wassilieff

Colinxy dissects/deconstructs anti-racism as a political weapon.

https://nominister.wordpress.com/2025/10/13/the-altruistic-trap-anti-racism-as-a-recruitment-mechanism-for-western-marxism/
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October 13, 2025 9:27am
- Colinxy
  
  Thanks!
  
  I left a lot out. It’s amazing how racist Marx and Engels were in private. How racist the Soviet Union was (even though they played the co-governance games with minorities) etc.
  
  Even modern Marxists, like Robin DiAngelo are (she calls herself a racist for anyone who thinks otherwise – it’s part of her grift).
  
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  October 13, 2025 2:17pm
  - Taieri
    
    How racist the Soviet Union was
    ———–
    
    I’m not so sure about that. The vast majority of Old Bolsheviks were not Russian.
    
    Of the most prominent ones:
    Lenin: Chuvash/Swedish/Jewish ancestry
    Trotsky: Jewish
    Stalin: Georgian
    Dzherzhinsky: Polish
    Kamenev: Russian/Jewish
    Zinoviev: Jewish
    Mikoyan: Armenian
    Beria: Georgian
    
    Basically, from the top echelon, only Bukharin, Rykov and Bogdanov were Russian.
    
    In the later years, while Khrushchev was Russian, his wife was Ukrainian and Brezhnev was also of Ukrainian origins.
    
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    October 13, 2025 5:38pm
    - Colinxy
      
      Oh goody! Rabbit holes I went down, but decided not to use:
      
      Forced mass deportations and population transfers
      • Crimean Tatars, Chechens, Ingush, Balkars, Karachays, Kalmyks, Meskhetian Turks, Koreans, Volga Germans, and others — whole populations were rounded up and deported (1930s–1950s) to Central Asia, Siberia, or other regions; many deportees were designated “special settlers” with restricted rights. Evidence: NKVD orders/decrees, transport and settlement records, survivor testimonies, Soviet archival files, later rehabilitation documents.
      Decossackization and repression of Cossack communities
      • Cossack hosts and communities — mass reprisals, summary executions, dispossession, forced resettlement and suppression of Cossack social structures during the Civil War and into Stalinist campaigns. Evidence: Bolshevik decrees from Civil War era, archival military orders, local reports, and historical studies of decossackization.
      Deportation and repression of Soviet Koreans and ethnic Chinese
      • Ethnic Koreans (Koryo saram) and Chinese in the Far East — large scale removals in the late 1930s justified as security measures against Japan; high transport mortality and long term dislocation followed. Evidence: Internal NKVD reports, transport manifests, regional archives, demographic studies.
      Gulag and targeted forced labour policies
      • Many ethnic minorities, political prisoners, and “special settlers” were sent to the Gulag system or assigned forced labour tasks; punishment and mortality rates varied by campaign and locale. Evidence: Gulag administration records, memoirs, camp registers, and state archival material.
      Cultural suppression and Russification policies
      • Languages, schools, religious institutions, and cultural elites of numerous non Russian nationalities were suppressed, curtailed, or co opted through purges, arrests, and policy changes (variance across periods: korenizatsiya in 1920s then reversal under Stalin). Evidence: Education and language policy directives, arrest and purge lists, cultural association records, linguistic and ethnographic studies.
      Religious persecution with ethnic dimensions
      • Religious minorities (Muslim, Jewish, Buddhist, Orthodox of non Russian rites) faced closures of places of worship, clergy repression, and limitations on religious practice; for some groups this had an ethnic and cultural dimension (e.g., Kalmyk Buddhists). Evidence: Commissariat/Ministry orders, police files, congregational records, testimonies.
      Collective punishments tied to alleged wartime collaboration
      • In WWII aftermath, entire nationalities accused of collaborating with the enemy were punished collectively (deportations, property seizure), e.g., some North Caucasus peoples and others. Evidence: Decrees citing “punishment for collaboration,” census and property confiscation records, rehabilitation papers from the post Stalin era.
      Ethnic violence, extrajudicial killings, and purges with national or social targeting
      • Political purges and localized campaigns disproportionately affected particular ethnic groups, party cadres, and social classes; in some campaigns repression took explicitly national or social form (e.g., purges of national intelligentsia). Evidence: Party and NKVD purge lists, trial records, regional court archives, scholarly analyses.
      Scientific racism and unethical experiments with racial implications
      • A small number of Soviet scientists engaged in racist or pseudoscientific projects with ethical abuses (for historical example, documented attempts by some researchers to pursue biologically determinist experiments). Evidence: Scientific publications, institutional archives, investigative histories of Soviet science. There is some indication that the humanzee experiment (chimp-human hybrids) may have had a racist component (planned non-consensual insemination of French Guinian (black) women) for example.
      
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      October 13, 2025 6:00pm
Libertarians are right

What were the Maori Ward votes like around the country. Not results, but the actual vote info?

In Palmerston North, the vote was hidden amongst a wall of text (the voting instructions etc) and said (barely paraphrased) “We have been forced by legislation to include this vote”.

The voting information also didn’t adequately point out the disproportionate vote power being provided to Maori roll voters by the Maori Wards.

There were 24,486 total votes and 1,814 Maori Ward votes, which is 7.4%. Maori got 2 wards out of 15 (13 + Maori Wards) which is 13.33% of seats. Almost twice as much representation than the rest of us. It should have been 1 of 14 wards which would be 7.14% or 1 of 13 which would have been 7.69%.
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October 13, 2025 9:28am
I remember when

Why Maori wards are not necessary, and why are we not provided with data to show they are.
The Saturday (85% of vote in) totals for Horowhenua District reveals the following –
the electorate had a relatively high participation rate of 45.8%.
Against Maori wards – 5789 (22.5% of possible electorate voters)
For Maori wards – 5484 (21.3% of voters)
Didn’t indicate – 515 (4.4% of those voting)
Informal – 2.
If the 85% is correct then in the final count about 53% of voters will have taken part.
They could still vote to retain Maori wards.

However, the facts are that about half of the voters either support, or don’t care either way, Maori wards.
So what possible reason is there to introduce Maori wards to support Maori representation?
The ball is in the Maori court – they have to work to ensure they select and support suitable candidates.
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October 13, 2025 9:37am
- kowtow
  
  Nelson has voted to retain. Tasman to reject.
  
  The ridiculous thing is each of the maori wards has only had one candidate standing so no vote was required for that candidate to be elevated onto council.
  
  Meanwhile in the rest of the South Island Ngai Tahu will continue to appoint their own candidates onto councils with nary a vote cast by anyone.
  
  This is undemocratic and utterly against the principle of the rule of law.( accountability)
  
  Maori wards are an affront to democratic principles.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:59am
  - Jethrod
    
    Nick Smith must have a real pucker to his lips today.
    
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    October 13, 2025 11:50am
- MCōs
  
  Why have wards at all?
  The two councilors from my ward are there to represent the interests of Manukau Ward which is 54% Pacifica people
  They probably doze off when Wellfords’ traffic jams 100kms away are being discussed
  There’s your answer
  
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  October 13, 2025 12:20pm
  - Taieri
    
    Ward which is 54% Pacifica people
    ————
    
    New Zealanders with Polynesian/Melanesian ancestors? Is that what you’re trying to say?
    
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    October 13, 2025 5:18pm
TripeWryter

This guy is probably the best observer and commentator on Maori politics and why the rest of us have been hoodwinked for so long …
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z83HhEgj7kw
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October 13, 2025 9:40am
Ron Jeremy

Isn’t Verity a big box of sunshine. Don’t bother reading her stuff as it’s usually negative and the headline tells you most of what she’s whinging about. She can’t be that smart if she hasn’t figured out that her beloved Jacinda and chris got us in the crap . The frighting thing is that she is a reflection of the population and how they will vote. Quite scary really
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October 13, 2025 9:41am
- Jack5
  
  That Verity Johnson rant gives no reflection of her experience in the ~~striptease~~ burlesque business.
  
  No artistic subtlety in this Stuff piece, Verity. Just a get-it-off quick, full-on rave.
  
  For a different side of Verity, here’s a column of hers from last December, advocating for short guys as dates (is PM Luxon a little tall for your liking, V.?):
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360510434/verity-johnson-have-you-tried-dating-short-men
  
  7 2
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  October 13, 2025 10:39am
  - cmm
    
    I won’t read it but here’s a guess.
    
    Short men are less likely to feel confident about themselves. They are thus easier to manipulate and you’re more likely to be able to exploit them.
    
    How did I do?
    
    10 1
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    October 13, 2025 11:48am
    - Taieri
      
      Short men are less likely to feel confident about themselves…easier to manipulate and you’re more likely to be able to exploit them
      ————
      A few random ones:
      
      Churchill 168cm
      Stalin 163cm
      Mussolini 170cm
      Napoleon 167cm
      Putin 170cm
      
      And a plethora of others…
      
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      October 13, 2025 12:03pm
      - cmm
        
        Cherrypicking.
        
        Tall men have always had it easier in general.
        
        Social media is dripping with women wanting, and expecting, “three 6s” men even if they are fat 4s:
        * Six foot
        * Six figures
        * Six pack
        
        That’s just a modern take on the tall dark and handsome.
        
        Of course they then feel that any man who does not make the cut must be willing to settle for less and can be manipulated.
        ie. if you’re a short slob then you better bring something special – more expensive dates, free drinks, more simping etc and treating her like a queen.
        
        4 0
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        October 13, 2025 4:18pm
    - Jack5
      
      Very good, CMM.
      
      Verity thinks short guys are more humble, noting:
      
      … if you’ve always been tall, dark and handsome, chances are you think that women will always be falling out of trees to bang you …
      
      7 1
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      October 13, 2025 12:29pm
      - AitchW
        
        Wow, how shallow is she????
        
        7 1
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        October 13, 2025 1:23pm
      - Christopher Thomson
        
        Is Verity projecting or just angry that she can’t get a tall, dark and handsome guy to bank her?
        
        9 1
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        October 13, 2025 1:51pm
- sirknz
  
  What was today’s really bad, forced simile? She usually puts it in about the fourth sentence or second paragraph.
  
  4 0
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  October 13, 2025 3:18pm
I remember when

Did David Trewavas, four term mayor of Taupo,
suffer because he ignored the voice of the people when considering Maori co-governance.
To date he is third, maybe even fourth, and last, by now.
Received about 19% of the total vote.

Is he the best example, so far, of the risks local body representatives take when getting involved in what should be government decisions?
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October 13, 2025 10:10am
- imalwaysright
  
  “…when getting involved in what should be government decisions?”
  
  The race of a citizen is none of any Governments business.
  
  We seem to have conferred the power to the Government to racially segregate New Zealand.
  
  Either that, or they have assumed that power by their own volition.
  
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  October 13, 2025 10:52am
I remember when

Another example of the difficulties of the Maori Ward vote.
Horizons District Council covers Whanganui, Manawatu-Rangitikei, Palmerston North, Tararua and Horowhenua wards.
It has resulted in both votes within the individual wards and one for Horizons.
So at the moment we have remove for Horowhenua, Manawatu-Rangitikei and Tararua while Palmerston North and Whanganui have voted to retain.
The Horizons vote is 45.8% Against, 44.3 Retain, 9.9% Blank (Don’t Know/Don’t Care).

So you can be left with Against/Against or Against/Retain and an urban /rural divide.
All of which suggests we have resolved nothing and the answer depends on the preferences of those who didn’t care enough to vote.
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October 13, 2025 11:22am
- HeatherW
  
  Horizons is a Regional Council not a District one.
  
  8 0
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  October 13, 2025 1:13pm
cmm

Three decades for an indecent assault case to come to trial.

Good luck getting reliable testimony from anyone involved in that.

I doubt anyone can really remember back that far in a reliable way. Memories get embellished every time they are remembered.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360852486/well-known-figure-charged-indecent-assault-three-decades-ago
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October 13, 2025 11:41am
- Jethrod
  
  So does this mean there will be name suppression granted, with the inevitable outcome of home detention?
  
  7 1
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  October 13, 2025 11:54am
- imalwaysright
  
  Cmm,
  
  If the burden of proof is enforced as if the crime was yesterday then fair enough.
  
  However that is extremely unlikely to be met after 30 years.
  
  We all want the bad guys to get theirs, but if the burden of proof is lessened because the crime was a long time ago, then there is a risk that innocent people could be tried and convicted on what amounts to be the say so of the complainant.
  
  8 2
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  October 13, 2025 11:55am
- Taieri
  
  How do they prove that such crimes actually occurred if there’s no physical evidence? A word against a word?
  
  9 1
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  October 13, 2025 12:06pm
  - Libertarians are right
    
    Pretty much. The only realistic way to get convictions is if you can get more than one separate victim so you can argue “where there’s smoke there’s fire”. That’s what happened with the Jago complaints – the first victim complained to the cops but they decided there wasn’t enough evidence. As soon as a second victim came forward (years later) they were able to use both accusations as proof against each other.
    
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    October 13, 2025 1:13pm
  - MCōs
    
    Follow the trial and I guess you’ll find out
    
    3 5
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    October 13, 2025 1:53pm
    - Taieri
      
      I followed Peter Ellis’ trial…
      
      4 0
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      October 13, 2025 2:54pm
- AitchW
  
  I recently gave evidence in a case where the offending took place in 1975 and 76.
  The offender was found guilty on something like 8 out of 11 charges.
  I know several of the victims well. There was no need, nor any attempt, to embellish evidence.
  
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  October 13, 2025 1:21pm
  - cmm
    
    “There was no need, nor any attempt, to embellish evidence.”
    
    Even without attempting to do so, our memory is not perfect and we unwittingly edit them every time we recall an event.
    
    Add some alcohol and feelings of humiliation, then 20 years of learned victimhood (all men are bastards etc) and whatever and recollections can differ very much from what was experienced.
    
    2 2
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    October 13, 2025 4:09pm
    - AitchW
      
      There were several victims. The evidence they gave was vague, as you would expect, on exact dates but quite detailed on the actual behaviours. As was mine.
      The victims were all male, as was the offender.
      There was very little discussion over the years between the victims of the offending. Some of the victims live overseas and have no contact with the others.
      The evidence they gave was consistent in describing the behaviour.
      I dodged a bullet in that I was not a victim, but still experienced inappropriate behaviour.
      
      1 0
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      October 13, 2025 8:58pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Aitch: If you know any of the victims you should never have been on a jury…best you dont reveal your identity
    
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    October 13, 2025 4:27pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      Sounds like Aitch was a witness.
      Cmm is correct about time changing perception.
      My niece is a detective and said that eye witnesses come a distant second to physical evidence such as DNA , wounds, weapons, etc.
      People tend to fill in the blanks to make sense of a traumatic experience.
      
      4 0
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      October 13, 2025 4:49pm
    - Libertarians are right
      
      They gave evidence, they weren’t on the jury.
      
      2 0
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      October 13, 2025 5:01pm
    - AitchW
      
      I was a witness.
      
      1 0
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      October 13, 2025 8:52pm
- Christopher Thomson
  
  E. Jean Carroll leaps to mind.
  
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  October 13, 2025 1:52pm
cas

I haven’t seen and don’t intend to see the film on Pike River. With its criticism of the Key government and its fawning over Jacinda, I imagine that it’s not going to dwell on the disregard of health and safety directives by the miners inside the mine.

Nah didn’t think so.
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October 13, 2025 1:21pm
mogg

I have it on good authority that AI is now writing code for AI, some of which cannot be understood by the human operator. Not long ago OpenAI found that in a significant number of cases, AI software was prioritising its own needs before that of the human instruction.
A full time professional Tech Manager told me: ‘what we are allowing to happen without any oversight is comparable to giving a child a draw full of very sharp knives to play with’.
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October 13, 2025 1:28pm
- cmm
  
  There are two parts to AI “code”.
  
  There’s the actual “code” which drives the engines used for learning and then for inference. This has been largely programmed by humans in the past and that has been understood. This is just an empty box that can do nothing until it is taught.
  
  Then there’s the part of the program that is learned (ie. the patterns it has learned from the data that are then used to make the decisions). This has never been understood.
  
  There is no way, other than testing, to determine what the AI has learned and thus – how it will react in an unforseen circumstance.
  
  Teach an AI engine to drive and there is no way to know if it will rapidly veer to the right if it sees two blue triangles.
  
  This is the source of the so-called AI-hallucinations.
  
  In a traditional control program you can go through the code and generally determine what is going to happen in various scenarios. With AI there is no such ability.
  
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  October 13, 2025 4:04pm
Gary Benner

Radio NZ have an article about the firearms act and the effect driving offences can have on the ability of a firearms owner to be considered “fit and proper” to continue to hold the licence. It seems an individual was threatened with losing their licence as a result of a driving offence.

The Arms Act enabled decision makers to take account of any information they consider relevant, which can include any offending or infringements, including driving incidents and driver’s licence suspensions, Wilson said.

The final consideration in the fit and proper assessment required a review of the totality of the specific behaviour or offending by the licence holder, in the context of the purposes and principles of the law, in order to reach a fair and justifiable decision.

So to be fair, if a member of the police have similar driving charges, would they be considered as a fit anad proper person to continue in that role? And what about a Judge, a Doctor, or a Teacher?

It seems to be a fairly arbitrary decision making process, but one that needs to match other areas of society. And maybe one that needs to be tested in a Court of Law, not the back room of a Police Station.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/575757/police-reverse-former-deputy-commissioner-jevon-mcskimming-s-gun-vetting-changes
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October 13, 2025 1:46pm
- Dougal10
  
  You lose your gun licence for drunk driving involving an accident . So if you run off the road while drunk bye bye gun licence.
  
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  October 13, 2025 6:56pm
  - wilderbeast
    
    None of this surprises me. The test is “fit and proper” and the bar has been dropped alarmingly. I recently renewed my firearms license and the policeman who vetted me told me I would be red flagged as a firearms owner for any interaction with the cops, including if I found someone’s wallet and dropped it into the station as a Good Samaritan. Only after my interaction was logged would they write it off as irrelevant. A friend of mine did his renewal also and when the cop came around to his house he checked the WOF for his vehicles and trailer were current. Evidently failing to warrant these in time means you might not pass the fit and proper test.
    
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    October 13, 2025 9:11pm
mandk

Taxpayers’ Union congratulates Atlas Network Partner, Maria Corina Machado, for winning 2025 Nobel Peace Prize.

That popping noise you can hear is lefties’ heads exploding at the mention of the Atlas Network.

Comrade Maduro is furious.
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October 13, 2025 1:53pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  She dedicated it to Trump so they lost their minds.
  Pure cinema.
  
  6 0
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  October 13, 2025 4:01pm
- mogg
  
  She has dedicated her peace prize to Trump, saying without his strong support she would have achieved nothing, or words to that effect.
  
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  October 13, 2025 4:03pm
NothingLeft

Evidence of the Hobbsian past (nasty, brutish and short lives) in neolithic Europe. Large scale cannabalism in agrarian conditions similar to what pre-European Maori lived.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRZIzKg0n1g

Just goes to show people were the same all over the world for most of human history and approx 100 Billion humans who lived and died subject to stone age conditions – cultural norms (and our evolved set of instincts) being set by the evolutionary game-theory/Nash equilibriums of costs and benefits of pro vs anti-social interpersonal and intertribal behaviors to find winning solutions in that competition. Evolutionary developed optimums (rather than post-hoc rationalized philosophic or religious formalizations) are the true origin of morality and ethics, and so much of our behavior and attitudes.
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October 13, 2025 3:55pm
Jack5

Bought a $5.50 postage stamp last week for a card going overseas.

On the stamp is a kiwi and the words “Aotearoa New Zealand”.

NZ Post changing the name of the country?
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October 13, 2025 4:41pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Changing the name of the ‘Socialist Republic of R Tea Roa”
  
  5 3
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  October 13, 2025 6:55pm
- Ghost
  
  Nothing new, there have been stamps with Aotearoa on them for a long time. Here is one from 1994
  
  https://colnect.com/en/stamps/stamp/150767-Aotearoa_Maui_pulls_up_Te_Ika-Maori_Myths_1994-New_Zealand
  
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  October 13, 2025 7:02pm
  - Jack5
    
    My stamp is one of a commemorative series of five round stamps, featuring different types of kiwi, and with face values from $2.90 to $5.50.
    
    At its web site, NZ Post says is offers a range of commemorative stamps celebrating NZ’s “taonga, culture, heritage, arts, stories, and people”. I see no other stamps on the site with the word “Aotearoa” on them.
    
    The stamp cited by poster Ghost at 7.02 is from the 1994 Maori myths series. The political climate’s changed in the 30 years since then.
    
    The media’s unsubtle moves to change the name of the country’s name from “New Zealand” make the country’s name a contentious issue.
    
    I see no reason to name this country “Aotearoa New Zealand” on the current commemorative series of mint stamps featuring five types of kiwi birds. Postage stamps are official symbols.
    
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    October 13, 2025 10:42pm
Dougal10

NZ high schools are rostering kids home this week , it just shows unionized teachers and their union bosses just don’t give a shit about the students education, being we are at the pointy end of the year where national exams are mere weeks away.
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October 13, 2025 6:52pm
Ghost

Live thread

Freed seven hostages arrive in Israel, Israeli military says

The first seven hostages have arrived in Israel, according to Israeli military.

They will be given an initial medical screening at Re’im field hospital where they will meet their closest family and loved ones for the first time in two years – before being taken to hospitals for comprehensive checks.

Article
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October 13, 2025 8:00pm
- AitchW
  
  Let us hope that they get every help they need over the next few years. They will need it. As will their families.
  I suspect that a great many of the terrorists released by Israel will meet untimely ends thanks to Mossad.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:02pm
- AitchW
  
  All of the female hostages are dead.
  Keffiyeh wearers, Minto, the Greens, TPM really are despicable.
  
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  October 13, 2025 9:12pm

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Parliament fails to defend transparency
No Right Turn
"The principal view of human laws is, or ought always to be, to explain, protect, and enforce such rights as are absolute, which in themselves are few and simple."
Not PC
Word of the day
Hompaddock
The response to Budget 2026 has been unusually muted
Point of Order
You know what “does not pass the sniff test”? Labour’s incremental response to blatant corruption – this is why they plunged 7.5%
The Daily Blog
When is a Free Speech Union not a Free Speech Union?
The Standard
We Are a Country That Decided Housing Was The Economy
No Minister
My Opening Statement for the UATX Caplan-Jones Immigration Rematch
Utopia
Playing with numbers.
Kiwipolitico
Another non-tariff barrier
Offsetting Behaviour
Rugby Premiership Predictions for Round 18
Stats Chat
Budget 2026
NZCPR
UK Conversion Therapy Ban, Digital ID, Rallies, Elections
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
A central banker’s fiction
Croaking Cassandra
THE WORKING FROM HOME RACKET BY PUBLIC SERVANTS
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Get Vaccinated Tomorrow Or Shut Your Pie Hole
Cactus Kate
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker

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