English flys King over Electoral Law breaches

April 2nd, 2008 at 10:28 am by David Farrar

NZPA reports on a flaying gave in the House yesterday over breaches of the Electoral Finance Act – they’re all being done by the three main parties which voted for it.

Keeping Stock has the exchange from Hansard – go read the whole thing.

A further example that Bill didn’t even use was the launch of the Tongan branch of Labour a few days ago.  Huge banners supporting Labour on the TV news, and no authorisation statement on them at all, plus other electoral breaches.

Also very amusing to see Winston trying to help Annette out. Winston, whose was so outraged that the asked questions over his secret donations to charities (instead of the taxpayer), that he has now directly threatened the with a review of ownership laws.

Such a good look to have a senior Minister threaten the media with a change to media ownership laws, because they question him in a way he does not like.

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31 Responses to “English flys King over Electoral Law breaches”

  1. Tane (1,096 comments) says:

    Except that Bill English is wrong about his allegations against the CTU:
    http://union.org.nz/news/2008/bill-english-wrong-on-electoral-law-allegations

    Just sloppy.

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  2. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    By the use of the word ‘except’ Lord Snooty, are we to accept an inferred agreement from you, with all the other stuff English said, or are you going to drip-feed us with faintly contemptuously expressed snippets of your superior knowledge throughout the rest of the day?
    I also liked the fact that you evidently have a distateste for ‘sloppy’ performance. Does this extend to the original drafting and revision including the hasty manner of teh special vote to pass it into law, or are we to infer that sloppy legislation is ok, but any objections to it deserve the minutest scrutiny, which if found to contain a single error will encourage others consider the rest of the law to be ok?
    Also, do you have an opinion about those who are in contravention of the Law? If so, what is it?

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  3. Tane (1,096 comments) says:

    Update here – http://www.stuff.co.nz/4460268a6160.html

    I imagine it’s the same story with the PSA.

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  4. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    By the by – how will the lack of observation of the law affect seats in Parliament? Will it be appropriate to challenge incumbents or challengers’ rights to an electorate majority they receive if these breaches have to be investigated and acted upon?

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  5. Bevan (3,924 comments) says:

    Also, do you have an opinion about those who are in contravention of the Law? If so, what is it?

    Sorry Lee, but do you really expect Tane to have any opinion on anything until he checks with HO?

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  6. Tane (1,096 comments) says:

    Na, I just don’t bother engaging with Lee over the EFA. We’ve had this debate before, and from many of Lee’s pronouncements it’s clear he doesn’t understand the law.

    The topic here is Bill English’s smear against the CTU. It’s pretty serious to falsely accuse someone of breaking the law. You reckon he’ll be apologising in Parliament today?

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  7. Bevan (3,924 comments) says:

    The topic here is Bill English’s smear against the CTU. It’s pretty serious to falsely accuse someone of breaking the law. You reckon he’ll be apologising in Parliament today?

    Sorry to disappoint Tane, but the topic is actually Labour and its Allies breaking the law they voted for. Your little rant about the English defaming the CTU is nothing more than a very week attempt to divert the issue.

    You really need to lift your game old bean.

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  8. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    It may well be the same story with the PSA, – but the stuff article is just a kinder rehash of the Hansard isn’t it?
    Also interesting how again, I have to say, regardless of how much of a ‘flaying’ English gave King, National are failing to even make a dent with their arguments. Perhaps Helen was right all along. This is a ‘Beltway issue’ and people are happy to have their freedom of expression snipped here and there. Next stop ‘foreign ownership of the media’ (but only in an election year – at first)? – Whaddayasay Tane, sound like a good idea?

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  9. Inventory2 (10,443 comments) says:

    Another thing English didn’t mention (another story for another day perhaps) was the video of Helen Clark accepting a cash donation at the Labour Party Tongan event. WhaleOil noticed it on the 3News video – there’s a link to it on this post on Keeping Stock (about 35sec into the clip): http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2008/03/pass-me-bucket.html

    We wonder if the donation will be disclosed!

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  10. phobius (46 comments) says:

    What about the clear breach by the Greens on their hoardings? And the Billboards in Tauranga. I’m not a lawyer or a politician but this seems pretty clear to me:

    65 Requirements for election advertisements that promote parties or candidates(1) A promoter must not publish, or cause or permit to be published, an election advertisement that encourages or persuades, or appears to encourage or persuade, voters to vote for a party unless the publication of the advertisement—

    (a) is authorised in writing by the financial agent of the party; and

    (b) contains a statement that sets out the name and address of the promoter of the advertisement.

    Could someone, perhaps Tane, please clarify?

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  11. slightlyrighty (2,475 comments) says:

    Yes Tane.

    Please clarify what should be done about breaches of the law by the very political parties that voted for these laws in the first place.

    And while you are at it, Tane, what do you think about the ranting of Winston to change ownership laws of media outlets because he does not agree with the content. Or are you happy with the notion that the government can dictate to media how to operate?

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  12. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    “The topic here is Bill English’s smear against the CTU. It’s pretty serious to falsely accuse someone of breaking the law. You reckon he’ll be apologising in Parliament today?”

    No Tane as much as you would like to delude yourself tht you are setting the topic today, the actual issue is the sloppy EFA and how those who voted for it in the interests of ‘transparency’ can’t be bothered to observe their own legislation.

    Re: ‘Na, I just don’t bother engaging with Lee over the EFA. We’ve had this debate before, and from many of Lee’s pronouncements it’s clear he doesn’t understand the law.”

    like I said you prefer to ‘drip-feed us with faintly contemptuously expressed snippets of your superior knowledge’

    For someone who is so into transparancy and egalitarianism you can be a secretive and pompous ass sometimes Tane.

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  13. Inventory2 (10,443 comments) says:

    Lee C said “For someone who is so into transparancy and egalitarianism you can be a secretive and pompous ass sometimes Tane.”

    Top slap-down that Lee – well done “bro”!!

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  14. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    Well, inventory. Tane is just attempting to engage in an effete form of bullying really. God, I hate a bully. Although at least he is consistent. In his readiness to control or try to shut down debate, I am sure his political circus-masters will be gratified to see that Tane has not only infused the letter, but the actual spirit of the EFA. Well done you, Tane!

    I can see that promotion you been hankerin’ for just on the horizon. If Labour win the next election, of course. Otherwise it will be back to cleaning actual, not metaphorical toilets. As it were. So I can see you have quite a lot invested in this issue. I on the other hand, am purely intersted in free speech for purely altruistic reasons. Soemthing which, I fear that it is you, Lord Snooty, not I, that is incapable of understanding. Got your number dude, you are just a wannabee, eager to dance for your masters. I on the other hand have my own mind intact and answer to no one*. I know you’d love to try it Tane, but that would require actual, – like – cahones.

    *But the wife. (Is that sexist of me?)

    Still live and learn.

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  15. Craig Ranapia (1,915 comments) says:

    The topic here is Bill English’s smear against the CTU. It’s pretty serious to falsely accuse someone of breaking the law. You reckon he’ll be apologising in Parliament today?

    About the same time Pete Hodgson is going to apologise for accusing John Key of making false declarations to the Registrar of Electors and the Companies Office — far from trivial legal breeches?

    And are you going to post the source for that graph in this lifetime, Slippery Tane?

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  16. paulhelen (99 comments) says:

    Annette King states that it is not her role to report breaches of electoral finance law, I just create the law and pass the law bugger enforcing it. I wonder if she has the same attitude to crime? I just pass the law and vote it in It’s not my role to report crime. Very public minded of you Annette. If she only realised how stupid she sounds.

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  17. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    i live-commented questiontime yesterday..

    here is how i read your ‘english-starring’ encounter..

    “..english has a whinge about those ‘proud to be green’ billboards..

    and some nz first billboards with no authorsation..

    king waves keys’ dvd around..(no..i haven’t seen it)

    (english/king have one of those (unedifying) mutual nyah nyah! sessions..

    (i know i’ve said it before..but english could ‘bore’ for new zealand..)

    and..in ‘summary’..

    summary..a questiontime in which national were used as a punching bag by all and sundry…

    and the puzzled/anxious faces of the national mps speaks volumes..

    their ‘crowing’ days seem to have come to an end..

    they know they are doing ok (for now) in the polls..

    but it must be disheartening for them to see their leader and deputy leader getting regularly ‘monstered’ at questiontime..

    they know only too well that the rest of new zealand will soon see/know what watchers of questiontime already know..

    (nobody stood out..a 4/10 questiontime..)..”

    phil(whoar.co.nz)

    (guess it must be in the eye of the beholder..eh..?…)
    .

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  18. Bevan (3,924 comments) says:

    We so need a philu to english translation function on this site.

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  19. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    Bevan – what you read is automatically filtered by kiwiblog – it’s just that even with the filter on, philu’s brain is so f**d-up that it defies even the latest state-of-the- art technology to make any sense of his utterances.

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  20. Nicholas O'Kane (168 comments) says:

    How about the Free Speech coalition, or someone actually prosecute Labour for this?

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  21. slightlyrighty (2,475 comments) says:

    Does anyone else see the irony in Winston Peters accusing anyone else of arrogant conduct, as he has just done in Parliament?

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  22. peterquixote (231 comments) says:

    I know this is boring, but the very fact that Winston fronts up fists first is why NZ votes for him. Thats why we put up with Muldoon. Confidence is power.
    There is only one way to neutralise the man, and that is NAT identifying a coalition partner.
    NAT can get 47% votes and still stay out of Government.
    And it can happen and it will happen because it always happens with Winston.
    ACT give you 1 vote,
    What next dudes

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  23. Graeme Edgeler (3,290 comments) says:

    The topic here is Bill English’s smear against the CTU. It’s pretty serious to falsely accuse someone of breaking the law. You reckon he’ll be apologising in Parliament today?

    He just did.

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  24. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    and questiontime today..?..i hear you ask..

    “..another example of national not achieving much..and labour strutting their stuff all over them..”

    phil(whoar.co.nz)

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  25. dad4justice (8,313 comments) says:

    I find it hilarious that our elected nincompoops would be arguing on Electoral Law when I have been assisting with the same scenario all day and have given a high court judge a big bad headache to ponder. Don’t you just love reserved decisions, but we all knew this stupid law was another grey area piece of legislation implemented by a corrupt and increasingly desperate government. Confuse them and control them. Like hell!

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  26. Pascal (1,969 comments) says:

    Graeme Edgeler: He just did.

    Interesting to note that he corrected and fronted up to his mistake so quickly. I can only laugh when I contrast that with Mallard’s rather delayed and forced apology.

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  27. side show bob (3,660 comments) says:

    Like many laws these wankers have fostered upon us the EFA has become the joke everyone said it would become. Prehaps copies of this bill can be put in all the Liarbore shithouses in the beehive, I only hope it has been printed on thin paper.

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  28. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    sideshow – I’d be prepared to pay the difference to have it printed on glossy paper – just for them.

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  29. clintheine (1,571 comments) says:

    Tanes attempts at a smokescreen is hilarious. Note he never addressed the other illegal actions from Labour?

    Most people holding their breath for Tanes graph sources have died or gave up as well.

    What’s the bet the EPMU/CTU got their fingers into the Labour pie other ways?

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  30. Pascal (1,969 comments) says:

    clintheine: What’s the bet the EPMU/CTU got their fingers into the Labour pie other ways?

    The Standard had their fingers in the Labour pie for their hosting. Labour had their fingers in the tax-payer pie for electoral funding. It seems that it is the nature of the beast to get other people to pay their way. So I would not take that bet, it’s a fools bet.

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  31. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    They have no choice their party memberships are so low that the only way to survive is by pilfering.

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