UK bans Dutch anti-Muslim MP
February 12th, 2009 at 1:32 pm by David FarrarHow disgraceful to have the UK ban a Dutch MP, because he is seen as anti-Muslim, Would they ban someone who is anti-Christian?
Many western countries slowly but surely are imposing self censorship. We saw thi with the Dutch cartoons. There is no right not to be offended by criticism of your religion.
Mr Wilders is under 24-hour police protection because of his anti-Muslim stance.
He has been receiving death threats from Muslim groups outside Holland since the anti-Koran film appeared on the internet earlier this year.
The film features verses from the Koran alongside images of the terrorist attacks in the US on 11 September 2001, Madrid in March 2004 and London in July 2005.
The film equates Islam’s holy text with violence and ends with a call to Muslims to remove ‘hate-preaching’ verses from the Koran.
So Wilders says the Koran encourages violence, and to prove him wrong, he recieves death threats. And now to really prove him wrong the UK Government bans him from entering the UK, because they fear the violence that may erupt. Anyone see the irony?
I oppossd David Irving being banned from NZ. He may be a anti-semitic Holocaust denier, but the correct response is to let him attend and speak, and allow those who disagree with him, protest, mock and ridicule him. This is not hard with Irving.
Now Wilders is no Irving. Yes he is anti-Islam, but that is no excuse for the death threats he receives and the UK banning him.
I recall No Right Turn agreeing with me that Irving should not be banned from NZ. I wonder if he agrees the UK Govt should not ban Wilders, no matter how much some may be offended by him?
Related posts:
- The Dutch-Muslim Culture War
- The Muslim Madonna
- Muslims speaking out against terrorism
- Muslim women say burqa is affront to human dignity
February 12th, 2009 at 1:36 pm
Agreed.
But don’t think that Wilders himself is a great supporter of freedom of speech. He has called for the Koran to be banned in the Netherlands.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 1:39 pm
The important thing that Britain has done is ban a sitting MP from a EU country from visiting the parliament of another EU nation……the precedent of this and the implications are enormous.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
Alternative Headline-
“Multi-culturalists shoot themselves in both feet”
Let them carry out more such attacks on freedom of expression. Every time they do, they’re painting themselves further into a corner and losing more and more public support.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
Strongly oppose the banning, as I see it as a direct assault on freedom. Regardless of whether I agree with someones message or not, I strongly support their right to express it.
I would also be inclined to agree with Redbaiter here as this is quite a contradiction to what the left claims to represent.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 1:53 pm
I wish you were right red, I really do.
But you’re not.
The reason you’re not right is this: “Public support” in Britain these days is whatever the Socialist Anti-Human League (a.k.a the government) tell them it is.
The Orwellian state is alive and well, my friend, and we are all much, much too late.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 2:03 pm
Hardly a surprise when Lord Achmed the only Muslim Lord in the UK threatened to bring 10,000 fellow jihadis to westminster to lay seige to Lords if Wilders showed his film to select MPs who had invited him in the first place.
The UK is dead and gone. To think that the English Parliament was called the mother of parliaments. Now it is just a dhmmi slave.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
DPF, I suspect you mean danish cartoons, not Dutch.
Anyone who has the time, and the stomach for it, should read the following analysis of the koran.
http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com/articleprint.php?num=384
You are right about Irving and right about Wilders. And Wilders is right about Islam.
[DPF: Yes sorry Danish cartoons. And nice to agree on some things
]
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 2:32 pm
Is he actually anti-Islam or is he just pissed that the Koran has lots of horrible bits in it? A Christian pointing out ‘orrible bits in the Bible wouldn’t be anti-Christian, presumably.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 2:37 pm
What would a society based on the Qur’an look like?
For orthodox Muslims, the Qur’an is a perfect book and Muhammad is the model human. If we accepted both of those assertions to be correct, then what form would a society based on those ideas take?
Non-Muslims, with the possible exception of some Jews and Christians, would be banned from the country, for ‘Allah is the enemy of the unbelievers’ (2.98), who are ‘unjust’ (6.157), ‘evil’ (7.177), and ‘the vilest of animals in Allah’s sight’ (8.55). Children would be raised to have contempt for non-Muslims, who are destined for eternal torment in the flames of hell.
Jews and Christians would be second class citizens, banned from proselytising or publicly declaring their faith, seen as ‘unjust’, and shunned by Muslims, for ‘whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them’ (5.51).
Jews would be seen as untrustworthy and anti-Semitism would almost certainly be endemic.
All criticism of Islam, the Qur’an, and Muhammad would be banned.
The society would be male dominated and men would have multiple wives.
Women would be required to wear the hijab or a similar garment.
Arranged marriages would be permitted, as would child marriages.
Homosexuality would be outlawed and any sexual activity outside marriage would result in public floggings.
The criminal justice system would be based on retaliation and enforced with violent punishments. All court cases would be brought before religious leaders.
Slavery would be permitted.
Consumption of pork and alcohol would be forbidden, as would ‘games of chance’.
Evolutionary biology would be rejected in favour of creationism.
Studying, learning, and reciting the Qur’an would be seen as the most important aspect of a child’s education.
This society represents the antithesis of Enlightenment thinking and the liberal, secular, free societies that have developed with the modernisation of the West. Almost every aspect of social and intellectual progress that has been made over the last couple of centuries would be undone by a society such as this. In short, we would see a society with many similarities to countries such as Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Afghanistian under the Taliban. The people of those countries are not intrinsically, genetically inclined towards living in socially backward, superstitious, and brutal regimes. At the very heart of the problems seen in the Middle East and beyond lies a deep reverence for the Qur’an and an attempt to puts its teachings into practice. Put simply, strict Islamic societies quickly become failed societies, and the Qur’an underpins the backwardness and stagnation that we see in many majority Muslim countries. Many like to point to the supposed ‘golden age’ of Islam, and talk of successful, tolerant societies of the past that were (nominally) Muslim. However, they are missing the point. Muslim societies of the past that did not represent a totalitarian theocratic nightmare were only so because of a lacklustre approach to enforcing the teachings and rulings of the Qur’an. Muslims are liberal and questioning and thoughtful precisely when they throw off the shackles of Islam. When we encounter self-professed Muslims exhibiting the qualities that we associate with a modern, rational, and cosmopolitan outlook, this is not the result of their proclaimed devotion to Allah, Muhammed, and the Qur’an, but rather it is the result of the influence of, and their acceptance of, secularism and Enlightenment values.
A snippet from the above link.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 3:20 pm
Geert Wilders speaks the truth about islam and this is unacceptable to the marxist governments of Britain and the EU.
Vote:I admire his courage in defending his country, culture, and heritage from the onslaught of massive muslim invasion into
Europe. islam and Western culture are incompatible. Where ever you find islam, you find trouble. Wonder if our
hopeless media will even mention this story.
February 12th, 2009 at 3:55 pm
How disgraceful to have the UK ban a Dutch MP, because he is seen as anti-Muslim
Wilders himself has stated that he isn’t anti-Muslim, he is anti-Islam. The difference is important. Once can’t help it if one is born a muslim. But Islam is a religeon, and one has a choice whether one wishes to subscribe to it’s violent, intolerant, hate-filled beliefs.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 4:03 pm
Interesting Jman, as I was just considering a post re Ïs wilders anti-islam”, or is he pro freedom and education. Perhaps labelling him anti Islam plays into he hands of the Islamists. It also tends to put things in a nice either/or situation, when we know the world is far more multi facetted than that.
I am not anti Islam, but I am pro freedom, pro education and pro peace. OK, that pits me against Islam, but it also pits me against others like Shrub, Howard and Blair who were all anti freedom, anti education and anti peace.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
This is just gut-wrenching, watching historical signposts going past, that too few people seem to be awake to the implications of. What percentage of the Russian population were Bolsheviks? What percentage of the Chinese were Maoists? What percentage of the Germans were Nazis?
To take over a nation, and bring about international calamity yet again, you only need a few percent of the people dedicated enough to your cause, and prepared for total brutality; and the 90% of “good people” to do nothing. Fjordman, Robert Spencer, Hugh Fitzgerald, David Horowitz, Melanie Phillips, Geert Wilders, et al; are RIGHT.
The Western-culture-self-hating Left is setting this up, and it doesn’t even care if it doesn’t end up in the drivers seat after the revolution. Good people doing nothing, goes right back to NOT throwing Herbert Marcuse and Jacques Derrida and Jacques Foucault and all the rest of the originators of all this rot, into jail, instead of giving them jobs writing the texts that our youth would be taught out of. Sorry, there has to be an exception to the freedom of speech rule; if we want to keep it, those who would ultimately deny it need to be silenced.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 4:28 pm
Yes I believe in freedom of speech Just as long as what you say is in agreement with what I think
This is the mind set of the people we are dealing with If they say Black is white then you must agree or face the most terrible consquences
If you say black is white then you will suffer the most terrible consquences.
You must only say what they agree with and agree with what they say.
And the pollies civil servants and so called liberals of the UK and others have lain down and fallen for this crapola.
there are a disgraceful bunch od handwring whingeing arseholes
For me I disagree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say and believe it.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 4:47 pm
MyName Is Jack – for once I agree with you. Nice to see a leftie who acknowledges the threat Islam poses to free societies.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 4:58 pm
Britain’s Ban – Was it a political statement (seems to be assumed) or just to save themselves the expense and hassle? Neither are good reasons.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 5:24 pm
Philbest, I think you mean Michel Foucault, not Jacques.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
Thanks for spotting the error, stephen, I used the name Jacques twice in error; that’s Derrida’s first name.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
Fancy going around telling people which bits of their holy book they should keep and which they should get rid of! No wonder the Muslims want to shove the mighty sword of Allah up him – the guy’s an idiot.
I understand where DPF is coming from, and agree there’s a slippery slope whenever you start saying “THESE ideas are not acceptable, but THESE ideas are acceptable…”
HOWEVER I don’t think this is exactly that scenario, and nor would the David Irving ban be. There’s something profoundly ugly about taking up arms against a whole race or religion, or judging them as wrong. For that reason if Geert Wilders or David Irving came to my door, I’d tell him to eff off, so I have very little trouble with a civilised western country as a whole telling someone like this to eff off too.
Making an organized bid to denigrate a whole race or faith is just really, really shit behaviour and I have no time for it.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 5:58 pm
“The Western-culture-self-hating Left is setting this up”
Philbest – NO NO NO NO NO!!!!!!!!!! For f*ck’s sake you’re smarter than that.
Can’t a Westerner show some empathy or even sympathy to Muslims and yet not necessarily hate their own culture? Or do you not credit your fellow westerners with the capacity for such “subtlety” of thought?
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 6:46 pm
And now we will begin to see the rise of Nationalism again, no wonder the left have such Feral looks in their eyes things are really starting to spiral out of their control.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 7:47 pm
So the fundy Muslims see yet again that their threats of violence work a treat everywhere. Any surprise the fanatical wing of Islam grows bigger by the day? It gets what they want.
Pity what they want is so misanthropic. But then, so are a lot of religious ideas.
Silly, silly Britain.
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 8:01 pm
Kay. And er, Philbest, what exactly has Foucault said that’s got you so riled? Or was it just general po-mo-ness?
Vote:February 12th, 2009 at 9:24 pm
Read the decline and fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbons if you want to understand what is happening (abridged version if you want to actually see what is happening). It explains everything from John Keys inclusion of the Maori party to England’s decline, very good book.
Vote:February 13th, 2009 at 12:33 am
The irony is that by banning the Dutch MP, the British Government actually increases the news worthiness of the story.
See my weblog for links to Geert Wilders Youtube Videos – they’re quite provoking to say the least.
Vote:February 13th, 2009 at 9:02 am
Wilders seeks the Koran banned on the same basis as Mein Kamph in the Netherlands. Neither should be banned of course.
He is largely libertarian, the rest of his policies are to drastically cut taxes and welfare and be tough on crime.
It’s a disgrace that the UK government bans people because of their opinions.
Vote:February 13th, 2009 at 2:25 pm
A small point but IMHO a very important one folks – be under absolutely NO illusions, this is going to happen HERE – in little old NZ!
Thanks to the last administration and the ‘trendy lefty’ do-good bleeding hearts, we have a growing number of Muslims in NZ – and as far as they are concerned wherever they put their feet is THEIRS (the Koran tells them so)! These people are hereby very deliberate design and intent and they are playing for keeps – THEIR keeps!!
Why did Ahmed Zoui decide to stop off here after ripping-up his passport? NOT because we are a lovely liberal country or because he was actually fleeing from oppression (nice story though it was), but to support his fellow Muslims – and Locke, Clark, Codington et all were stupid enough to not only accomodate him, but almost fall down prostate before him.
How he kept a straight face through the legal farce I have no idea – he played his part well. No doubt it reinforced his views about the soft, stupid, ‘enlightened’ west and how gullible we are (and made some pollies and lawyers feel good too).
Sadly, we may well rue the day when we allowed so many Middle Eastern ‘refugees’ into the country that was once ‘God’s Own’
Just some thoughts you might like to consider – while there is still time to do something about it!
Vote:February 13th, 2009 at 11:02 pm
The President of the National Secular Society said that Home Secretary Jacqui Smith was patronising Muslims by painting them as likely to riot if this guy was let into the UK.
Last night, his anti-Koran film was shown in Westminster with not a single demonstrator in sight.
Apparently the UK Muslims believe in freedom of speech much more than UK Labour.
Vote:February 13th, 2009 at 11:05 pm
“Last night, his anti-Koran film was shown in Westminster with not a single demonstrator in sight.”
Just as long as there’s not a bombing in the London tube tomorrow.
Vote:February 14th, 2009 at 11:22 am
The UK government has indeed stuffed up on this issue. Not to worry though as they will be booted out of office in 2010.
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