A worthy goal by Turia

April 13th, 2009 at 9:29 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

Up to $1 billion could be moved from specific projects for to a bulk fund aimed at broad goals such as improving education and health.

Maori Party co-leader is driving the radical proposal through her two portfolios as Associate Minister of Health and of Social Development.

She said it would help cut the huge compliance costs agencies faced and reduce the need for the Government to deal with many small contracts tied to specific goals such as youth work, social workers in schools and alternative education.

“We will get a better spend because people will be able to access a pool of money to deal with a range of issues,” she said.

“It’s a great opportunity to build trust because the sad thing about it is that the bureaucracy doesn’t trust the non-government sector and that’s why we end up with particularly prescribed contracts and with people being over-audited. I’d like to see that change.”

She said she had asked Massey University professor Mason Durie to produce initial ideas on how to do it, and was hoping it would begin at some level by the end of June.

Look forward to details. The aim is very worthy.

Professor Durie said the scheme would almost certainly start on a trial basis in a few places to find out “under what circumstances this would work and under what circumstances it wouldn’t work”.

Agencies said they often ended up working with the same families under various contracts.

Receiving a bulk sum of money to achieve broader social outcomes such as lifting families’ health status, education and work achievements would enable them to take a “holistic” approach to each family’s needs.

The Family Start programme takes a similiar holistic approach. I’ve always wondered why we don’t fund it more.

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26 Responses to “A worthy goal by Turia”

  1. Patrick Starr (3,675 comments) says:

    “Up to $1 billion could be moved from specific projects for Maori ”

    hopefully it’s from treaty settlements

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  2. EverlastingFire (291 comments) says:

    $1 billion “proudly” supplied by the tax payer I bet, then again treaty claims are tax payer money too.

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  3. Christopher (425 comments) says:

    From NZHerald.co.nz:

    In a shock press release, Associate Minister of Health and Social Development Tariana Turia has announced that she will introduce a Bill to Parliament outlawing all race-based social programmes and returning associated funding to the taxpayer in the form of tax cuts. “So long as Maori continue to rest on the crutch of race-based social welfare, they will always be looked down upon by mainstream New Zealand. It is time Maori actually earned some mana, rather than just claiming it by right of birth”.

    Oh, wait, sorry guys, that wasn’t actually the herald, it was an exerpt from a wet dream I was having….

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  4. mickysavage (786 comments) says:

    DPF

    I do not think the dog pack will like this.

    Labour tried something not too different, it was called “bridging the gaps” and it got shot down in flames especially after Brash’s Orewa speech.

    I can imagine National MPs raising all sorts of objections, for instance how will they ensure that twilight golf and hip hop tours are not funded?

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  5. Loco Burro (82 comments) says:

    seems like a little bit of hush money to keep the Maori Party a bit quieter over Auckland Local Governance?
    Very convenient timing eh? ;)

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  6. Patrick Starr (3,675 comments) says:

    Now that would be a hockey stick graph I could believe in,

    - taxpayer money thrown at maori
    - maori crime statistics

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  7. Viking2 (11,263 comments) says:

    Read it all properly guys. The sooner the behemoth called Dept. of social Welfare is demolished the better. They have Helenised everything to do with community assistance and programs. Everything has a predetermined outcome for funding and most voluntary organizations that existed before Helenisation have closed up and gone home.
    The Commandant at Welfare needs to be sent to an appointment with Helen in New York so they control the worlds poor together.

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  8. vibenna (305 comments) says:

    I’m all in favour of private (or Iwi based) Maori providers, and have no objection to people getting rich off it if they are doing the job. After all, they’ll save us all money in the long run, quite aside from the positive social outcomes. Besides, after the various government disasters and failures, I think Maori have a moral right to say “well, give us a go and let’s see how we do.”

    But am I the only one worried about the slashing compliance and delivering bulk funds? It sounds awfully like sending a billion dollars to Iraq in small bills on pallets in the back of a transport plane. Or shovelling fleas across a farmyard – not half of them will get there*.

    *apologies to A. Lincoln

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  9. reid (16,108 comments) says:

    I can imagine National MPs raising all sorts of objections, for instance how will they ensure that twilight golf and hip hop tours are not funded?

    Brash’s Orewa speech hit a chord not because those who agreed with it are racist but because they’re fair-minded. Some people particularly lefties fail to make that distinction. Either because they don’t understand it in the first place (because they’re idiots) or because they do understand it but disingenuously try to smear a good person (because they’re evil). There’s no third alternative, so pray tell mickey, in which camp are you?

    I’d suggest a primary way to avoid ineffective spending would be to avoid lefties getting their mits on any money. Apparently, as soon as they do, foolishness abounds in great quantity. I’m convinced those examples you give above were merely the more obvious and laughable and there were many more we’ve never been told about.

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  10. Scott (1,736 comments) says:

    Can’t agree with you there DPF. Another billion dollars to fund more government programs? How is that different to what Labour was doing?

    I would suggest more community-based initiatives that target people and encourage community responsibility and reciprocity. If the last nine years has shown us anything it is that throwing money at government departments to solve social problems is a waste of time and resources.

    Again I think localised community initiatives where people know who they are dealing with and there is reciprocity and accountability at the local level makes a lot more sense.

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  11. reid (16,108 comments) says:

    “Another billion dollars”

    Scott maybe I misunderstood but I read it that they’re proposing to use already allocated funds, just in a potentially smarter way to leverage the spending power. It makes sense, provided they execute it properly, which simply means using a very well designed set of procurement processes. PROVIDED they do that, it should work. PROVIDED…

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  12. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    So who is the custodian of the $1 billion when it gets moved to this “pool”? Sounds to me like this is an attempt by Turiana Turia to corner some political power.

    The National Party are of course a great disappointment in many areas, but their craven supplication to the idea that whatever perceived problems Maori suffer from can be solved by government money, government agencies and government social workers is one of the greatest disappointments of all. Where’s the difference from Labour??

    Three major points here in my mind.

    1) So called Maori have been received billions from the taxpayer over the last few decades by means of welfare, (Closing the Gaps) Treaty settlements, and payments to “tribes” extorted from business ventures. All to very little effect. Labour merely used welfare to expand its power base. Why isn’t National looking at turning off the tap completely?

    2) Turiana Turia and her party do not represent Maori. Only one Maori in ten voted for this gang of racists. Meaning nine Maoris in ten don’t want a bar of her separatist crap. I was deeply disappointed at Key’s decision to embrace this gang of racist political thugs. I think they should be marginalised, not invited to sit at the table of government, and I think the decision to include them was a bad one and probably made at the behest of self interested barren of principle “political advisers” rather than for any good reason.

    3) IMHO, Turia is one of the most odious people in parliament. I’ve observed her artifice and deceit and truculent arrogance during Question Time. Key made a mistake giving her and her acolytes a say in Government, as it allowed them funding and assets to improve their political position. The transfer of this $1 billion is designed to do more of the same. I reckon its a political maneuver designed to bring support to Turia and her racist party. Support they would otherwise not receive.

    Maori welfare is a disaster. It doesn’t work. It creates more problems than it solves. Millions have been wasted and pocketed by crooks. It should be stopped, not made easier and subject to less checks, and neither should it be used to prop up the political fortunes of Turia and her cronies.

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  13. burt (8,024 comments) says:

    Christopher @ 10:04 makes a very salient point. There is a problem with socioeconomic outcomes among Maori people. Throw more money, throw less money, throw the money in the middle, scatter it about. It’s all been tried before, under different stripes of govt and with different market placement (branding). It’s obvious we are treating the symptoms rather than the cause. A shakeup is needed to do something about all of this.

    Redbaiter;

    Maori welfare is a disaster. It doesn’t work. It creates more problems than it solves. Millions have been wasted and pocketed by crooks.

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  14. baxter (893 comments) says:

    Up to $1 billion could be moved from specific projects for Maori to a bulk fund aimed at broad goals such as improving Maori education and health.

    The last attempt to improve Maori education produced plenty of graduates of meaningless courses,and numerous rorts resulted in relations of the educators becoming immensely wealthy through their valueless contributions to various Wananga. Far from less auditing increased auditing and evaluation would need to apply to any future bulk funding. The idea is sound but finding personnel with sufficient integrity to implement it would be difficult. L:ikewise at the infant level it would be timely to evaluate whether the Kohanga scheme has really resulted in Maori children entering Primary with the same skill levels as graduates of kindergartens and play centres.

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  15. mickysavage (786 comments) says:

    Sorry my brain is still on holiday. I meant to say “Closing the gaps”.

    Reid

    I am happy for my hard earned money to be used on the poorer in my community. “Equality” of assistance, something that some people think is “fair” does not work because some are more in need than others. Regrettably Maori are by in large poorer and more in need of help and an indicator of a fair society is that they will not be disproportionately represented in the dole ques or in the prisons muster.

    What I was trying to say is that National supporters and MPs will vilify any attempt to bulk fund maori organisations on the grounds that there will be no checks on how the money is spent. It will also offend their sense of “fairness”. This policy should be developed as far as I am concerned but for you guys it will go down like a glass of warm vomit. How will you feel about your beloved leader John Key if he does this. If he does do it maybe he is Helen lite.

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  16. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    “I am happy for my hard earned money to be used on the poorer in my community.”

    Good go for it you idiot. Give it all to the fucken “poor”.

    I’ll use mine to support my family.

    At least I would if scum like you were’nt stealing it from to me.

    To waste it on buying the votes of losers.

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  17. reid (16,108 comments) says:

    Regrettably Maori are by in large poorer and more in need of help and an indicator of a fair society is that they will not be disproportionately represented in the dole ques or in the prisons muster.

    I agree mickey and the main argument between left and right is root cause of this phenomena, which everyone acknowledges exists.

    The left appear to imagine that situational circumstances operate on humans almost in a force majuer way. If you’re poor then its inevitable you’ll have poorer health issues for example. Therefore they think, we have to change the circumstances.

    Lefties who think this, in my view confuse correlation with root cause.

    There is nothing inherent in human nature that requires a person to be subjected by the force of their circumstances to adopt a negative approach. As a matter of fact, letting people believe that they are helpless is actually a cruel abrogation of the human spirit.

    The differing view is illustrated in many ways for example by the maxim: “hand-up not hand-out.”

    I don’t really understand why it is the left seem to imagine the former is some sort of human cruelty whereas the latter is simply human kindness. It seems to me the opposite is true, and anyone who’s really interested in helping people out and understood how life really worked, would plump for the former and not the latter. If I’m wrong then how do you explain the millions of counter-examples seen round the world daily where the human spirit triumphs over adversity using nothing more than discipline, focus and will-power? Of course it’s very difficult to get any focus at all if all anyone ever says to you is that nothing is your fault because you weren’t born as a rich-prick. Unfortunately that attitude which is perpetuated by profound ignorance is a very distressing but tragically common state of affairs.

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  18. mickysavage (786 comments) says:

    Reid

    “The left appear to imagine that situational circumstances operate on humans almost in a force majuer way. If you’re poor then its inevitable you’ll have poorer health issues for example. Therefore they think, we have to change the circumstances.”

    I do not think that it is that simple. Some of the policies are targeted at groups who have disproportionately poor results in a particular area. Why fund those groups that do not have disproportionately poor results?

    And I believe that Helen and Michael, God bless their souls, had a more sophisticated approach to things than they are credited for.

    Your maxim “hand-up not hand-out” I believe affected their thinking. A decision was made that “Working for Families” was to be available to working families only and not to beneficiary families. The policy was in part an incentive to people on the benefit to get jobs. It seemed to work because the unemployment rate hit lows not seen for a long time and employment rates were higher than ever. The far left did not like it either.

    Michael Joseph Savage’s motto was “from each according to their ability, to each according to their need”. This appears to me to be consistent with your views.

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  19. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    “Michael Joseph Savage’s motto was “from each according to their ability, to each according to their need”.’

    ..and he got that straight from Karl Marx, a committed communist, who by that very maxim, that is in reality a euphemism for legislative theft, demonstrates so well the amorality of leftism.

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  20. burt (8,024 comments) says:

    mickysavage

    Working For Families…. yes grand scheme. Where else in the world would a tax payer be classed as rich because they earn $60K and poor because they earn less than $120K?

    The principle of a guaranteed minimum family income is not new, paying people earning earning 2 times the average household income was however quite original. That was Labour’s ‘hands up (two ticks Labour)’ part of using both a hand up and hand out.

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  21. paradigm (507 comments) says:

    mickeysavage says:
    “I am happy for my hard earned money to be used on the poorer in my community. “Equality” of assistance, something that some people think is “fair” does not work because some are more in need than others. Regrettably Maori are by in large poorer and more in need of help and an indicator of a fair society is that they will not be disproportionately represented in the dole ques or in the prisons muster.”

    Mickey you must have failed basic arithmatic as this argument is a nonsense. If you supply assistance not based on race, but based on need (eg income level) then any abitrary grouping (including a racial grouping) that is over represented in poverty will be overrepresented in the assistance they recieve in a DIRECTLY PROPORTIONATE manner.

    There is simply no need to give extra asistance on the basis of race: I would argue that doing so is strongly counterproductive as generates the idea that the said race cant cut it without a hand up/out. It is much healthier to tell someone they are getting the hand up/out because they are going through some hard times rather than because of the colour of their skin. It is also more efficient as only those who we define as poor end up getting the assistance.

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  22. Trevor Mallard (245 comments) says:

    So Maori are going to be asked to give up their superannuation, their access to their local PHO and their kids right to go to their local school so that Aunty Tariana’s prefered groups get the funding. I wonder if the Maori Party votes in parliament are worth it?

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  23. expat (4,048 comments) says:

    The real question is, does NZ need a (Maori) race based electoral system? Answer – No.

    Obviously while Maori were tame Uncle Toms for the labour party it wasn’t a problem for the Labour Party but now the Maori Party have had the temerity to ditch Labour and sign up with John Key (Boo Hiss, twisting of Rich Prick moustache) the horse trading is beyond the rubicon eh Trev?

    I’ll wager a tray of your favourite tipple that John Key and the Maori Party see the partnership through the whole first term, keen?

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  24. Patrick Starr (3,675 comments) says:

    “I wonder if the Maori Party votes in parliament are worth it?” – and of course you must now ask yourself the same question over the greens party vote, the smacking bill and you in the opposition benches

    are you questioning MMP Trevor?

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  25. Trevor Mallard (245 comments) says:

    expat – I’ve known bioth Pita and Tariana for a very long time – they will swallow alot to retain the offices and cars -I predict has odds about right – so no bet. Having said that it is going to be really interesting to watch Key react to their approach.

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  26. Pat (76 comments) says:

    Trevor – Goff asked you to embark on a bridge BUILDING effort with the Maori Party – not bridge BURNING.

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