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114 Responses to “General Debate 29 September 2012”
Righto slackers, off your arses and get to work. NZ needs your taxes
OK so drill baby drill.
Removes excess Govt expenditure. Prime candidate the failed GCSB & SIS !00 million per year we don’t have any faith in spending.
Must be a lot more in those places we can make unemployed.
Just curious Viking2; what did the police and GCSB/SIS do to you that makes you hate them all so much? You’re very quick to point out their faults, but sheesh; I wouldn’t and couldn’t be a cop no matter how much they were paying. The vast majority do a bloodgy good job, yet you delight in their stuff-ups.
Whale Oil’s ‘Burglar Load’ post yesterday created a lot of comment both there and on General Debate. Inevitably I was accused of many things due to speaking up. But some disturbing things came out of it. Comments like…
If a homeowner catches someone on his property committing a crime, he should have the legal right to shoot the bastard dead on the spot.
…were linked to the Conservative Party…
Vote Conservative for the Castle doctrine – then eliminating criminal scum is not on legal, it will be – in law – a civic duty!
The Conservative Party Party has few written policies but they do promote the castle doctrine (in less extreme language).
…law abiding citizens can – within some limits – do whatever they deem necessary to defend themselves or their property.
There have already been journalistic references to Ministerial Responsibility in relation to the GCSB/Police/Dotcom/Fibby saga. They do not paint John Key in a very good light. But they are out of date and relate to a period in the evolution of western democratic government which has passed us by.
Let us look at problem # 1 – The Labour Caucus elects its Cabinet. The Leader allocates portfolios.
National’s Leader selects his Cabinet and allocates portfolios. But both systems fail to recognise that they do not deal with western democracy in (well, almost) 2013.
The MSM has become the LSM and television news has been surpassed by “reality” BS shows.
Instant news circulated via the internet now rules. No wonder there are growing calls from “Yes Minister” types throughout the world to control the internet. The “Yes Minister” types realise that their control of information has gone (due also to OIA and FOI legislation) or, at best, doomed.
So bring this back to our little western democracy. The United States of America with nearly 350 million citizens does not have a “State Services Commission” or equivalent. Such an organisation would not be tolerated there, yet we, with our mere 4.5 million deem it necessary to have one. Further, once the “Secretaries” of Departments are appointed they make all staff appointments. Do they serve at the pleasure of the Government, the Ministers, or the MPs that we elect? No.
We now have the worst of all worlds: MMP parliamentary elections (where a multiplicity of minority parties can over-ride one that gets almost 50 % of the nationwide vote) , the Nation’s leader selected and appointed by an elite few, Ministers selected by either one person, or the elite few, departmental secretaries (please, let us not continue with the Chief Executive crap. That is private sector speak that is accompanied by a need for profitability and responsibility – not the spending of large sums of money extracted by force from taxpayers.
And now we have the GCSB/Police/Crown Law/ Fibby/Dottiecom farce. We are expected to have confidence in these organisations because we are told that we should.
But take just one example: We now know that GCSB sought to cover its involvement in the Dottiecom affair by having W.English sign a Ministerial Directive., That directive has now been exposed. But has it been withdrawn? It has certainly been exposed by what it is (rubbish!) /was. We now know that JK followed Royal Commissions Rule 101 and wrote terms of reference for Neazor to ensure that he (JK) got the answer he wanted. We also now have the red melons asking for a Police investigation . Really? The Police have powers that over-ride GCSB and the SIS? One thinks not.
For reasons of space, this is a scatter-gun piece, but the drift will be evident.
Time that this whole porridge was referred to the Constitution Commission – or whatever it is called in 2012.
CHARLESTON, WV—According to the results of a Gallup poll released Monday, the overwhelming majority of rural white Americans said they would rather vote for Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad than U.S. president Barack Obama. “I like him better,” said West Virginia resident Dale Swiderski, who, along with 77 percent of rural Caucasian voters, confirmed he would much rather go to a baseball game or have a beer with Ahmadinejad, a man who has repeatedly denied the Holocaust and has had numerous political prisoners executed, than spend time with Obama. “He takes national defense seriously, and he’d never let some gay protesters tell him how to run his country like Obama does.” According to the same Gallup poll, 60 percent of rural whites said they at least respected that Ahmadinejad doesn’t try to hide the fact that he’s Muslim.
So good, that the Iranian News Agency Far News picked it up as real news.
Conservonutters forget to read the bible and ignore the teachings of Jesus again
KOWTOW would you like to tell us what Jesus said to do if a man takes your cloak.
All good points & just to bring it all home we were informed recently that a Communications Tribunal would be set up ostensibly to look after poor little children who get cyber bullied & thin skinned business people worried that their dodgy deals may be published on the net.
Or maybe our political masters could be persuaded to admit that the Tribunal’s real work will be to suppress details of the myriad cockups & abuses of procedure occasioned by agencies of the state.
People who aren’t or who refuse to connect to their own spirituality and by that I don’t mean religion I mean recognition we are spiritual beings living a temporary physical existence, completely fail to understand just how extraordinary and special every single person alive really is. The fact that our primitive science hasn’t yet touched on it or when it does it ignores it, does not mean it doesn’t exist. Yet that’s precisely what many seem to hallucinate. Touching, really, the way they place their entire epistemology into the hands of people who have been specifically trained to ignore anything which points to an expansion of it.
Question: It’s quite evident GCSB used various tactics to justify surveillance they knew was illegal, like getting English to sign the warrant and disingenuously asking Police about Dotcom’s status. Quite why they clearly never anticipated that a multi-millionaire would hire top legal counsel who would procede to pick carefully over every single entrail escapes me but they obviously didn’t anticipate it for it doesn’t take more than a child’s imagination to predict that when their demonstrably disingenuous approval process hit the light of day the things that are currently happening, both legally and in the media, would in fact, happen. But never mind all of that. My question is, what if Dotcom really is guilty as sin? And what if the courts decline to extradite and we lose the TPP? Plus our relations with the US plunge back to where they were in 1986?
No kowtow Jesus did not say angry gruff did someone shit in your porridge
he said kowtow you are such a stupid pratt I am ashamed that you say you follow my teachings yet don’t even remember them
just kidding
he is supposed to have said
Luke 29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also.
Jesus said “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
Seems that conservonutters like kowtow dont live by their scared text they would kill for their possessions not give them away as Jesus said
reid – I suspect the BCSB are not familiar with operating on a level(ish) legal playing field.
The Dotcom case has to go through due process, if the extradition case is good enough he’ll have to go. If not he won’t have to. I don’t know why that will affect the TPP. If the US use one issue to try and leverage the TPP I don’t think we should deal with them.
The alleged crime didn’t occur specifically in NZ & doesn’t to the best of my knowledge affect any NZ nationals so who cares?
…”And what if the courts decline to extradite and we lose the TPP”….
Should we be so lucky to lose a trade treaty where we concede everything (ie give US corporates rights over our own citizens) yet gain zilch (ie the treaty will exclude the only thing we do well that being agricultural produce) may I suggest that the appropriate response should be dancing in the streets.
…”our relations with the US plunge back to where they were in 1986?”….
“I n the Darwinian perspective, order is not immanent in reality, but it is a self-affirming aspect of reality in so far as it is experienced by situated subjects. However, it is not so much reality that is self-affirming, but the creative order structuring reality which manifests itself to us. Being-whole, as opposed to being-one, underwrites our fundamental sense of locatedness and particularity in the universe. The valuation of order qua meaningful order, rather than order-in-itself, has been thoroughly objectified in the Darwinian worldview. This process of de-contextualization and reification of meaning has ultimately led to the establishment of ‘dis-order’ rather than ‘this-order’. As a result, Darwinian materialism confronts us with an eradication of meaning from the phenomenological experience of reality. Negative theology however suggests a revaluation of disorder as a necessary precondition of order, as that without which order could not be thought of in an orderly fashion. In that sense, dis-order dissolves into the manifestations of order transcending the materialist realm. Indeed, order becomes only transparent qua order in so far as it is situated against a background of chaos and meaninglessness. This binary opposition between order and dis-order, or between order and that which disrupts order, embodies a central paradox of Darwinian thinking. As Whitehead suggests, reality is not composed of disordered material substances, but as serially-ordered events that are experienced in a subjectively meaningful way. The question is not what structures order, but what structure is imposed on our transcendent conception of order. By narrowly focusing on the disorderly state of present-being, or the “incoherence of a primordial multiplicity”, as John Haught put it, Darwinian materialists lose sense of the ultimate order unfolding in the not-yet-being. Contrary to what Dawkins asserts, if we reframe our sense of locatedness of existence within a the space of radical contingency of spiritual destiny, then absolute order reemerges as an ontological possibility. The discourse of dis-order always already incorporates a creative moment that allows the self to transcend the context in which it finds itself, but also to find solace and responsiveness in an absolute Order which both engenders and withholds meaning. Creation is the condition of possibility of discourse which, in turn, evokes itself as presenting creation itself. Darwinian discourse is therefore just an emanation of the absolute discourse of dis-order, and not the other way around, as crude materialists such as Dawkins suggest.”
Given that people are often banging away about the lousy relationship the USA has with Muslim countries in the ME, the following article by long-time, roving reporter, Michael Totten, should be of interest: What A Real Alliance Looks Like.
That part of the world also needs a stable rock somewhere—not the stultifying stability provided by the House of al-Saud in Arabia, and certainly not the tyrannical sort that Moammar Qaddafi managed for a few decades in Libya.
No, what the Middle East and North Africa need right now is progressive stability, the kind that slowly advances human and political development without triggering the kinds of violent reactions and shocks we’re seeing in so many places right now. Morocco is one of the few countries that’s pulling it off.
As with a number of other Arab countries there was an alliance against communism during the Cold War, but Morocco did not simply use that external enemy as a reason for being dictatorial at home. The writer contrasts that specifically with Egypt:
Egypt’s Hosni Mubarak was sort of an ally of the United States, but he wasn’t a real one. He was part of America’s security architecture in the Eastern Mediterranean, and Washington propped him up with assistance, but he did nothing—nothing—to liberalize or modernize Egypt and prepare it for a future of peaceful relations with itself, its neighbors, or with the rest of the world. Every day his state-run media cranked out as much anti-American and anti-Semitic invective as Nazi Germany, and it did so for decades. He threw liberals as well as Islamists in prison. His military regime ruthlessly repressed anything and everything that even smelled like civil society. Revolutionary Egypt was not even remotely primed for tolerant liberal democracy. “We’ve had 7,000 years of civilization,” an activist told me in Tahrir Square last year, “and 7,000 years of oppression.”
My favourite was when Mubarak’s newspapers (not ones run by any Islamist group) informed their readers that recent shark attacks along the coast were the work of Mossad, who had trained the sharks to attack people for the purposes of destroying Egypt’s tourist trade.
By contrast, civil society is flourishing in Morocco. The state doesn’t have a paranoid view of non-governmental organizations. It doesn’t think they’re part of a sinister foreign conspiracy like the Egyptian government did when Mubarak was running the place and like it still does today. Morocco has long had a pluralistic view of outsiders, the kind that only exists in a few isolated pockets elsewhere in the Arab world like Beirut and Tunis.
And just to give the full picture, Totten points out that:
While Morocco is not a democracy and Mohammad VI wasn’t elected, the country does have democratic institutions and its people are slowly developing democratic habits of mind. The king’s father, Hassan II, began liberalizing Morocco decades ago, and Mohammad VI stepped on the accelerator as soon as he came to power. He did it before widespread disgruntlement threatened to bring down the government, which is the best time to do it, not only because it’s the right thing to do on general principle, but because it’s the only way governments can maintain legitimacy over the long term.
Reforms aren’t likely to placate hundreds of thousands of furious demonstrators, but genuine reforms will likely prevent hundreds of thousands of furious demonstrators from taking to the streets in the first place.
Fascinating stuff, and you might consider hitting his PayPal tipjar to continue to get the sort of reporting the MSM has given up on.
Our old friend The Comedian is back in the news again; appealing what was a pretty lenient sentence for confusing the private parts of a four-year-old girl with those of an adult woman. What he did was not funny then, and it is not funny now, and somehow, I don’t think that appealing to the High Court is going to “make people laugh”. He clearly thinks that he was hard done by.
PG, I think GCSB is used to the legal process. It’s composed of rather bright people plus this is what they do for a living, so I’d be very surprised if they weren’t actutely aware.
nasska my view is that IF Dotcom is as guilty as sin, then he should be extradited. Just as someone who did something in NZ who lives in the US equally should be. I too aren’t a great fan of the TPP based on what I’ve read about it and what I’ve observed of the negotiations process which makes me suspect it won’t be terribly good news. But I may be wrong and who am I to stand in the way of a treaty with one of our historically closest allies in the whole world. The UKUSA pact sets the US, UK, Aus, Canada and ourselves aside and the damage done by the commie Hulun to separate us from those other four, is just being repaired now, thirty years on. It would be a diplomatic tragedy for us once again, if the idiot media were once again largely responsible for separating us again at this juncture, just as they are and were for the popularity of the anti-nuke policy. If the media has done its job in 1984 and explained the diplomatic ramifications rather than jumping on the popular bandwagon as they did, just as they did with the Uruwera raid and just as they are doing with Dotcom, then this wouldn’t happen. The worst part about it is, that as a result of the media lies and one-sided reporting, why naturally it gets 95% of the fuck-headed mentals who comprise around 80% of the public, on the side of their propaganda. And then the mentals point to that popular support as if it wasn’t manufactured, as a justification for their one-sided reporting. I’d call it a circus but in a circus, they have trained animals so it’s not even that.
Luke, you may understand why your 10:04 is relevant, but I sure don’t.
ABC news report detailing how the Libyan attack was a premeditated terrorist attack (confirmed by Secretary of Defence Leon Panetta), and had nothing to do with any youtube video.
The insurgents knew enough to go to the safe house half a mile away where Ambassador Stevens had been taken and attack it with mortar fire.
If sufficient evidence is produced to satisfy a NZ Judge that Dotcom has a case to answer in the States then obviously the principles of any extradition treaty we are party to must prevail. The MSM (& others) have lost sight of the fact that it doesn’t matter how many procedural cockups have incurred…..Dotcom will be extradited if the Yanks can produce the evidence.
The mentals who represent eight out of ten of us will have to content themselves with in depth research by paragons of intellectualism such as the Tracy Watkins who will hyperventilate at the chance of fomenting another wave of anti John Key hysteria amongst the wittering classes.
Those of us with a somewhat less superficial outlook on international politics will be ignored as we analyse the trade treaty for the likely load of crap it is.
Obama lied indeed, but yet the MSM is unwilling to raise the subject. The Messiah’s reelection campaign must not be disturbed by the unpalatable reality.
The incompetent Kenyan is the unAmerican president.
I don’t have much faith that the US MSM is really going to go after this issue, but perhaps their hand has been forced by the occasional reporter who has cracked the WH’s armor. Still, the story the WH told was such obvious bullshit from the start that it may have always been ready to fall apart.
When you have Obama voters and supporters like Howard Finemann at the HuffPo and Kirsten Powers starting to complain about the useless coverage of an issue that could hurt Obambi, you do have to wonder if things are changing. As one commentator said of Powers, “Good lord, I think she’s gone rogue”:
There are so many unanswered questions, not just about Libya, but also about Cairo. Who is it that Rice thinks “widely disseminated” this “movie”? Surely she can’t believe that the Egyptian Coptic Christian who made the video had the capacity or even desire to put it in the hands of the people who did the inciting. Also, has the administration noticed that the mob in Cairo, so spontaneously upset about the video, just happened to be carrying an Islamist flag to hoist over our embassy? On 9/11. What a massive coincidence.
Also, where did Rice get her very detailed information about the attack in Libya? She referred to the attackers as “a small handful of heavily armed mobsters” who merely took advantage of a growing protest over the video, a protest that now appears never to have occurred, as was reported three days before her appearances. The administration is careful to point out that Rice couched everything she said as being the best assessment at the time. Fine. But where did that assessment come from and how could it have been so wrong, especially when all signs pointed to a terrorist attack?
We know now that before the attacks on 9/11 that killed 3,000 Americans, more attention should have been paid to attacks against the U.S. overseas. These were warnings of what was to come. They say curiosity killed the cat. In this case, lack of curiosity on the part of the American media very well may kill more Americans.
That last is a very good point. They’re supposed to be the Fourth Estate after all – not bloody shills for Obama.
I am not sure flipper of the American system, where one man appoints his non elected cabinet,his Secretary of Defense,his/her Secretary of state,where locals vote in and out their Police Chiefs,where the Bechtel group gets the big projects around the world and where if your name is Kennedy, Clinton or Bush the public pray like mad that you will declare yourself a dynasty and natural heir to the Throne of America.
And I like Americans and an honest SSC in NZ that keeps an eye on underware purchases,Hide and Hone’s extra sight seeing jaunts. When the minutiae of Parliamentary foiblings are ignored then we are well on the way to corruption and excess.America does have a Senate as well,so they have a myriad of over representation.
Amidst the Kim Dotcomedy – Finance Minister Bill English says iwi have told the Government they want the Crown to deal directly with iwi regarding water rights, not the Maori Council.
The round of consultation hui with tribes on the partial privatisation of state-owned energy companies wound up in Christchurch on Thursday night.
The six meetings were held after the Government decided to delay the sale of shares in state-owned company Mighty River Power until early 2013. There was little interest, however, in the idea of offering Maori shares with extra benefits.
The Waitangi Tribunal has proposed that iwi and hapu affected should be given a special shareholding (known as shares plus) in the partially-privatised power companies and rights above those of other shareholders. http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/116855/english-says-iwi-don't-want-to-deal-with-maori-council
Good god, you think things are bad in the US in general? Take a look at where California is leading in this article based on a recently published book: Crazifornia: Tales from the Tarnished State:
The PEER axis bankrolled and sold California voters on the Water Quality, Supply and Safe Drinking Water Projects Act (aka Prop. 50), an initiative that added $3.4 billion of indebtedness to California’s already overburdened economy. Thanks to fine print in the newly enacted legislation, the Ocean Protection Council, which has nothing to do with drinking water, managed to get its hands on Prop. 50 money. Lunacy ensued:
So, what are Californians getting for their money, which costs them $227 million a year in interest payments? For starters, the bureaucrats that serve as the council’s staff engineered a quarter-million-dollar grant to a Portland, Oregon outfit called Ecotrust to develop a pilot program for a seafood market at San Francisco’s Fisherman’s Wharf that would be filled with “regionally sourced” seafood. Talk about inept. Any visitor to Fisherman’s Wharf can tell you free market enterprise has already filled the place with fishmongers hawking regionally sourced seafood. That doesn’t keep Sacramento’s eco-bureaucrats from subsidizing an Oregon group’s seafood stand on the Wharf, even if it has nothing to do with the clean water voters thought they were voting for when they passed Prop. 50.
There’s lots more where that came from:
There’s nothing unusual in California about a pro-environment, anti-business regulation. What is unusual is that trucking regulation was based upon provably false data. Even more unusual is the fact that the California Air Resources Board, which promulgated the regulation, knew that the data was false, termed the falsity a “distraction,” passed the regulation, and suspended the malfeasor for a mere 60 days.
Balancing those 60 days out, however, was UCLA’s decision to fire the professor of epidemiology who exposed the fraud. UCLA reached this decision because the professor’s work was “not aligned” with his department’s academic mission. (The professor has appealed that decision and is still working.)
I don’t think “dysfunctional” even covers this sort of government insanity.
My brother-in-law recently moved there from Seattle and I warned him not to put roots down no matter how much money he’s earning. I think this book will be a Christmas present.
Waitangi Tribunal? Yes. Can it.
Now can we all move on to things that matter…like the deficit (say, France is going to introduce austerity measures- along with a 75% tax rate for the few that will remain FRENCH TAXPAYERS!!!!) and on to things that Petersfirst, the red melons and labour say are unimportant ???
Isn’t California the State that got nearly all it’s income tax take of ‘rich pricks’ because they didn’t tax so called ‘poor’ people?
- and then when the GFC came along and the ‘rich pricks’ lost most of their taxable income, the state then went broke because ‘rich pricks’ no longer had to pay tax because they were now ‘poor people’ too?
Only taxing ‘rich pricks’ IS gambling on the share market – lefties are fucked in the head.
Keeping Stock (8,138) Says:
September 29th, 2012 at 8:35 am
Just curious Viking2; what did the police and GCSB/SIS do to you that makes you hate them all so much? You’re very quick to point out their faults, but sheesh; I wouldn’t and couldn’t be a cop no matter how much they were paying. The vast majority do a bloodgy good job, yet you delight in their stuff-ups.
As I said; just curious…
Curiosity killed the cat.
Actually nothing.
But the answer is that they act in unprincipled ways and are strangers to the truth so often. They want to and and act all powerful when in fact they are all servants of the taxpayer. Just like school teachers and any other civil servant.
They should be harshly questioned if only to ensure that they don’t become servants of the powerful and the politicians rather than servants of all kiwi’s or use that power they are given to abuse process as they often do.
Had English raised the questions that he should have then Key would not be being villified for what happened as it would and should have been exposed but English didn’t and indeed it looks bloody dogy that he did sign the coverup.
And its more so that given the GCSB knew on the 16th of Feb they waited till key departed to the USA.
I actually have some sympathy for Key at this point except to say the he should have come staight out in Parliament as soon as he was informed and laid it out and let the cards fall where they should. Instead now it will go on and on and it will rear its ugly head just when its not needed.
Looking at ebineazor’s report one gets the impression of a party of vested interest reporting on those interests with a suitable outcome. I recall reading this morning about that cosy little arrangement.
I have a rule and its this: never involve oneself with people who will do your bidding and dirty work for a price for once you do tyou are forever beholding to them. e.g. getting gang members to collect money for you or other activities like that.
Once compromised you are forever in their control orbit.
Akin to doing the bidding of the FBI, Hollywood etc and forsaking clear principles for expedience. NZ is forever in their control. and the problem is that the FBI have manufactured their charges against Dotcom on a civil matter so as to use our
Legal system to exact Hollywoods revenge.
for me the complete case rests on the alleged action. That action is apprently loss of copyright fee’s through the actions of others using Megaupload.
No I;m sure you wouldn’t close down the postal service for distributing porn via a paid service. You would go after the writers. (and they used to).
That is undoubtably a civil matter. End of story. And Hollywood can address that without the help of Obama and the FBI.
I have to defend my patent as do many other companies. I know of one Kiwi company that spends around 100k per month doing just that.
That is a civil matter and not a police matter.
The rest of course turns on the FBI turning that civil action into a crime which its not.
Viking – you seem to be jumping to wrong conclusions again. All I have done is question the wisdom of bragging about misuse of shotguns online, and where to draw lines in how far individuals can go in the protection of property and person.
I have never been against a reasonable level of self protection, and I have never proposed banning firearms – and I’d like to keep my own. And I am fully against burglers and home invaders, I despise them, like almost everyone apart from a few crims.
Almost everyone (except for a few here and on Whale Oil) are against a wild west society.
It’s just that a few drongoes hear “don’t blab about firearm use, and should the law be tweaked or not” and say “ban everything and welcome all criminals”. That’s a bit pathetic.
Prof Devlin is courageous. Even with tenure, this is career-limiting stuff in the same way Buchanan’s relatively moderate statement about the female student was. These days academia seems to require leftism no matter what, or else. I noted on Morning Report the other day that Steve Hoadley’s become a human rights expert in international relations these days, possibly as insurance against a Buchanan-like attack on him, I wondered. He used to be just an expert in international relations. I imagine that’s no longer sufficient in our brave new academic world.
If we had a proper media they would have exposed this constitutional review charade ages ago and forced it through a vigorous on-going campaign to change its track notwithstanding the resistance from the politicians and the panel which would have been put up. Fuck em, this is our country not yours, should have been the attitude from our intelligent, alert, vigorous and courageous 4th Estate watchdogs. But no. We don’t have that, do we.
It’s true that people do get the kind of democracy they deserve, but it’s a real tragedy the idiots in the public arena who haven’t even heard about the panel or if they have, don’t care, are the vast vast vast majority. It’d be quite good if one of the recommendations is that there’s an opt-out clause for those New Zealanders who think the review is a piece of shit and don’t want a bar of it. And those of us who get to tick that box get to makeup our very own constitution which just applies specifically to us, while all the rest of the morons have to live with whatever the fuck the panel put together. I suggest the following from Animal Farm just to get the ball rolling. Suggested alterations in italic:
Four legs good, two legs better!
No animal human shall sleep in a bed withwithout sheets.
No animal shall drink alcohol to excess. But humans can if we want to.
No animal shall kill any other animal without causeunless they look delicious.
All animals New Zealanders are equal, but some animalsNew Zealanders who didn’t agree with the stupid constitutional review panel FFS, are more equal than othersthe silly mentals who thought it was perfectly fine or just didn’t care till it was too late to do anything about it, fucking d’oh.
“….All I have done is question the wisdom of bragging about misuse of shotguns online, and where to draw lines in how far individuals can go in the protection of property and person….”
Wasn’t it Bob Jones who suggested that all women should be allowed to carry guns to protect them from rape?
Or was he just taking the piss out of all the feminists who can only see evil in men?
Either way, policing is about ‘risk assessment’ and the police executive must then see only good in men as they don’t allow women to carry lessor weapons that don’t harm, like capsicum spray etc.
Which in itself is a warning – stamp out any talk from feminists who call for stronger laws to protect women: The risk has been assessed by ‘professional risk assessors’ and law changes are not needed: NZ women are generally safe!
i see even the supposedly ‘tame’ muslims in Dearborn Michigan USA are starting to play up now and calling for any
criticism of mohomed or islam to be made a criminal offence.
There are no exceptions to the rule that muslims in any western society will cause problems eventually.
No exceptions anywhere, not in Australia, and not in New Zealand.
Dearborn is home to the largest mosque in USA and the largest % of muslims in any US city.
Nutter Netanyahu warns future of world at stake over Iran’s nuclear programme.
Benjamin Netanyahu warned on Thursday that Iran will have enough enriched uranium to make a nuclear bomb by next summer and urged the world the draw a clear “red line” to stop it in its tracks.
In a bold challenge to Washington and the West, he said it was getting “late, very late” to stop Iran and that “the future of the world” was at stake.
What a fucking mental. Sadly, he’s right. IF either the US or Israel DOES attack Iran then the future of the world IS at stake. But THEY DON’T HAVE TO DO THAT, DO THEY. I mean what a tosser. Who does he think he is, to threaten the world?
Do you know BTW that one of the scenarios is that Iran already has nukes courtesy of the Chinese (notice that IF that’s true, they haven’t used them, have they, which kinda puts you Islamphobes out to lunch, doesn’t it). But IF Israel attacks it, Iran will use them. (Notice that they didn’t use them before, which kinda etc…) And there’s a limited nuclear exchange in the ME. The west uses the ensuing panic to impose martial law, using the laws and the infrastructure they’ve already got in place. Then the west releases a genetically engineered flu-like virus on the Chinese, killing hundreds of millions. Of course there are western bio-warfare casualties as well, but the populations are under martial law so outbreaks are much contained. Once that works its course it then becomes a full nuclear exchange in which round about half of the entire world population dies. Heard of the Georgia Guidestones? Google that and have a read. There’s more of course, as in who did this and why and how they survive, but I won’t bore you with details. Did you know though there’s a seed-bank in a granite mountain in Norway that holds stocks of all the worlds plants? Why do you think that’s there?
tom hunter (3,565) Says:
September 29th, 2012 at 10:18 am
Given that people are often banging away about the lousy relationship the USA has with Muslim countries in the ME, the following article by long-time, roving reporter, Michael Totten, should be of interest: What A Real Alliance Looks Like….
Michael Totten is a paid propagandist for Israel. It funds a lot of his work. In return, Israel is always the hero.
The Middle East needs just three easy steps to enable its people to live in harmony and free of threats:
1. Israel must reform itself and abandon the apartheid model.
2. The US must disengage. Fully. That may happen sooner than many think given the headlong rush towards self-sufficiency in fuels.
3. Islamophobia needs to be consigned to the mists of time, lost in the pages of history.
Note that all the above are acts required of the west, not the east. The east will take care of itself if we just give it the space it deserves, exactly as we demand for ourselves.
“…..Nutter Netanyahu warns future of world at stake over Iran’s nuclear programme….”
There is a saying in the Islamic World:
“First comes Saturday, then comes Sunday.” It refers to the Jewish prayer day Saturday and to the Christian Sunday.
To interpret: Annihilate the Jews then annihilate the Christians. Islam’s goal is to conquer the world through violent overthrow. Learn from history and do not be deceived by the recent academic voices in Orthodoxy and elsewhere, advocating the tragically erroneous view that Islam is peaceful and Christianity fairs well under their domination.
Just look at what the nutters did last week – in Sydney of all places.
It finishes quoting Israel sources: for the first time in public, unequivocally set the summer of 2013 as the last chance to stop the Iranian nuke before it’s too late.
read Tom hunter # 10.18 link. It backs up what you’ve just said.
BTW – Anatoly Fyodorovich Dobrynin was a Russian statesman and a former Soviet diplomat and politician. He was Soviet Ambassador to the United States, serving from 1962 to 1986 and most notably during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
In his book ‘In confidence’ he stated that the KGB have learnt to ‘never trust the ME.’
He gave the background to why that view is held[pre Russian/Afganistan war] and a quote from the KGB “they knew we were friends to them but they ALWAYS stabbed us in the back”.
I’ve long held the view that the ME should be bombed into the middle of a working week to civilize them.Democracy however will do just that!
Harriet, isn’t it curious then that Christians live peaceably in Iran alongside all those angry Muslims?
There will be no peace in the ME until Iran has a genuine open democracy rather than its current theocratic shamocracy.
chiz (and Harriet), it’s a bit unfortunate for your prejudice isn’t it that historical facts show that Iran hasn’t invaded anyone since the 1700′s. How many times have your beloved defenders of fweedom and democwacy done that, in the last hundred years?Note that I’m also a fan of the US and Israel in that, I recognise the good they have done and what they represent. This doesn’t mean, unlike it appears some, that I’m therefore quite extraordinarily and wilfully blind about the expected results of their factual actions. As in, if you act like a bully, WTF do you expect people to think about you? And please don’t munt on about justification for them acting like a fucking arsehole. There IS NO justification for that. You can carry a big stick, and you still don’t have to act like a fucking arsehole. As in, just because you have a big stick, doesn’t mean you have to swing it around as we see the Israelis in Operation Cast Lead do, and as we see the US do when they take out the odd wedding party here and there and have an “accidental” Abu Gharrib incident every now and then. NONE OF THIS IS REQUIRED ACTION IN ORDER TO PROTECT THEMSELVES FROM THE THREAT PRESENTED. WHAT THE FUCK ABOUT ANY OF THAT IS DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND? AND WHAT THE FUCK DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT CAUSE AND EFFECT, EITHER?
YouTube video of Pat Condell, not afraid to speak the truth re: the Religion Of Peace™ and the current protests around the world. He really socks it to ‘em
You’re joking, right?
Bibi is 100 times the leader Obama is.
Obama is a puppet, taking the lead from Valarie Jarrett and his other handlers.
I kind of feel sorry for Obama. He has been brainwashed his entire life by everyone from Frank Marshall Davis to Jeremiah Wright to Bill Ayers to Derrick Bell to George Soros. Socialists and Marxists. Even his parents. The poor kid never had a chance. He’s only ever been a pawn.
Some facts on Iran, Israel and the west, for those whose brows furrow when faced with the reality that some of us haven’t been sucked into the western propaganda vortex
Israeli leaders meet Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in NYC [and explain the difference between real Jews and Zionists]
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance…it is the illusion of knowledge.” A thought-provoking and powerful documentary film on the current and historical root causes of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. http://www.occupation101.com/multimedia.html
Reid:it’s a bit unfortunate for your prejudice isn’t it that historical facts show that Iran hasn’t invaded anyone since the 1700′s
Iran doesn’t need to invade anyone when its has proxies and surrogates to do its dirty work for it. And what, pray tell, is prejudicial about my comments? Iran is not a democracy and sponsors terrorism.
Maybe the yanks are just real jealous of what the Brits have been doing with their surveillance cams so they decided to just go ahead and do it all, right now. That’ll learn em. Too bad about us, though, isn’t it. But we don’t matter, apparently. It’s a freakin war [on terror] folks! If you don’t want your balls irradiated by a giant isotope-cannon, then you’re just not being patriotic, are you, you terrorist commie bastard you.
-Had there been no egoism, distrust, malicious behaviors, and dictatorships with no one violating the rights of others;
Egoism, maliciousness, rights violations – a good summary of his own government.
If the tragic incident of September 11, and the military actions against Afghanistan and Iraq that left millions killed and homeless had not happened, and if, instead of killing and throwing the culprit into the sea without trial or without informing the world and people of America, an independent fact-finding team had been formed to make the general public aware of the truth behind the incident, and prepare for bringing to justice the perpetrators
More 9/11 denialism.
-God Almighty has promised us a man of kindness, a man who loves people and loves absolute justice, a man who is a perfect human being and is named Imam Al-Mahdi, a man who will come in the company of Jesus Christ (PBUH) and the righteous. By using the inherent potential of all the worthy men and women of all nations and I repeat, the inherent potential of “all the worthy men and women of all nations” he will lead humanity into achieving its glorious and eternal ideals.
Endtime nuttiness. He then goes at length about how the Mahdi will end oppression, immorality, poverty, discrimination and bring peace and love and justice and so on. No mention of whether the Mahdi will end crappy TV about the Ridges.
A man went to the doctor to get a double dose of Viagra, but his request was denied.
“Why can’t I have a double dose?” the man asked. “It’s not safe,” the doctor replied.
“But I need it really bad,” the man explained.
“My girlfriend is coming into town on Friday, one of my exes will be here on Saturday, and my wife is coming home on Sunday.”
“Okay, I’ll give it to you,” the doctor relented. “But you have to come in on Monday morning so that I can check to see if there are any side effects.”
On Monday the man dragged himself into the doctor’s office with his right arm in a sling. The doctor asked, “What happened to you?”
Poor old Pete George is getting very defensive today. @ 3.54 etc.
Still trying to obfuscate and backtrack and re explain the position he took on yesterdays GD
“I have never, I have never, I didn’t, ” etc etc etc”
Pathetic Pete.
This is what happens when a compulsive fence sitter makes a huge blunder and takes a position on a subject.
Pete, just go back to arguing in favour of both sides. It’s safer, it’s hard to be wrong. That’s where you belong.
Take a position, you are found out.
You made a mistake, and you have been found out.
There’s no one home.
This is my sister in this video and as much as I agree that poverty is bad in NZ liz told a lot of lies…… We always had shoes and my mum never put a bill befor feeding us and we always had lunch and dinner. Yes we were in the breakfast program for a time and it was a hard time for us. But my sister has lied and over dramatised a situation to get attention
So the media has now started describing criminal offences as an “Act of Utu”.
I wonder just how long before assault,robbery,rape and murder on Pakeha by Maori are justified and defended as an “Act of Utu” (For historic grievances of course…)
Bearing in mind that the Constitutional Review (that the ‘lefties’ are just wetting themselves in excitement over) will almost definitely advocate seperate justice systems for Maori and Pakeha….
chiz thanks for that. Do you think Ahmadinejad’s meeting with those Jewish leaders in NY was anti-semetic?
Do you think the term “anti-semitism” is thrown about quite often and used as a propaganda term in the sense that someone who criticises the state of Israel is often labelled anti-semetic when all they’re doing is criticising the govt of Israel?
I found very little fact in that pdf, he seems a bit hysterical. Perhaps he was feeling guilty about the war. His biggest mistake which threads through his whole thesis is that, like many in the west, he conflates zionism with Jews. The two have nothing in common, apart from the zionists pretending they act in the best interests and on behalf of the jewish people. But they don’t. Many in the west believe they do, because this is what the western media tells them. The same media whose owned by zionists. Murdoch for example. Same with the Hollyweird studios. Thus you have conflation after conflation. The old story. Repetition, repetition, repetition.
Most of his arguments are extremely weak, like this one.
It is therefore problematic, to say the least, when the leading Iran expert atColumbia, Prof. Hamid Dabashi, downplays the role of the current Iranianleadership by calling Ahmadinejad “a week demagogue” and an “irrelevantfootnote”. In fact we are talking here about the leadership of a country thatdisposes of the world’s largest oil reserves after Saudi Arabia and the largestgas reserves after Russia.
What has one got to do with the other? And of course he raises the terrorist support issue. Of course the west never does that do they? Israel doesn’t support Fatah does it? The US and the west doesn’t support the Al-Qa-ida thugs who took down Libya and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the thugs who are today operating in Syria today, do they. Of course they do. So once again, it’s definitely not ok for Iran to do that or to have nukes, but it’s just fine for Israel and the west to do that and to have them.
I’m afraid chiz anyone who still maintains the old western view from the 80′s that we’re the good guys and we’re desperately defending the bastions of freedom and democracy, is simply blind to history and facts that are quite obvious and just a google away, so there really is no excuse.
“I’m afraid chiz anyone who still maintains the old western view from the 80′s that we’re the good guys and we’re desperately defending the bastions of freedom and democracy, is simply blind to history”
I still firmly believe we are the good guys-I must be blind to History.
Hang on a minute- one of my degrees is in History…
It must be irrelevant though… because Reid says so??
Something else Ahmadinejad said at the UN which somehow chiz omitted to mention:
Therefore, Together We Need to:
1-Place our trust in God Almighty and stand against the acquisitive minority with all our might, so that they become isolated, and can no longer decide the destiny of other nations.
2-Believe in the God’s bounty of blessing and mercy and seek it in the integration and unity of human societies. Governments emerging from the free will of nations must believe in their own ceaseless capabilities and know that they can achieve victory if they vigorously fight the unjust order and defend human rights.
3-Pave the ground for the joint global management by insisting upon justice in all its aspects, strengthen unity, friendship and expand economic, social, cultural and political interactions in independent and specialized organizations.
4-Care about the interests of all the people of the world and join hands to reform the current structures of the UN with our joint efforts and coordination. It is necessary to note that the UN belongs to nations. Thus, the existence of discrimination amongst the members is a great insult to all. The existence of discrimination and monopoly in the UN is in no way acceptable.
5-Have more coordinated efforts to generate and propagate and firmly establish the language needed for designing the required structures of the joint global management filled with justice, love and freedom. Participation in global management is the basis of lasting peace. The Non-Aligned Movement as the second largest trans-regional group after the UN, held its 16th summit in Tehran with the motto of “Joint Global Management”, cognizant of the importance of this issue and the shortcomings of the current mismanagement in the emergence of crises and problems afflicting the world today. During the Summit, participating Heads of State and representatives of more than 120 countries underscored the necessity of a more serious and effective participation of all nations in the global management.
Gosh isn’t he wicked. What an aggressive awful thing to say. Why I feel like blocking my ears and shouting lalalalala he’s so aggwesive and anti-semetic.
Seriously, notice he’s one of the only leaders in the world who consistently puts God at the forefront. He does it all the time. This is one reason why the Muslims consider Iran to be the purist Islamic state. Sorry if that gives you Islamophobes the shits, but I have no idea why, when you read what he said above.
Hang on a minute- one of my degrees is in History…
That’s wonderful Longknives. So tell us, precisely how many countries has Iran invaded since 1700? And precisely how many countries has (a) the US and (b) Israel invaded in that same period of time?
your problem is that i do get it. That is your huge problem
You have been found out.
i have found you out.
You made a mistake. For the first time in your life you committed to one point of view.
Now you twist and squirm, trying to turn back time and revert to your always safe position on both sides.
Too late.
You can insult me by bastardising my non de plume but that really doesn’t earn you any points.
In fact it just reveals your true colours.
Reid:Do you think the term “anti-semitism” is thrown about quite often and used as a propaganda term in the sense that someone who criticises the state of Israel is often labelled anti-semetic when all they’re doing is criticising the govt of Israel?
This is true. But it goes the other way too. Some people who purport to merely be criticising the Israeli government are doing so because they are anti-semitic.
The US and the west doesn’t support the Al-Qa-ida thugs who took down Libya and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the thugs who are today operating in Syria today, do they. Of course they do
The west didn’t support Al-qaeda in Libya and they aren’t supporting them in Syria either. One of the reasons the US and the EU aren’t keen on supplying weapons to the rebels in Syria is precisely because of the possibility that they might end up in the hands of jihadists.
You’re looking at his speech with a western understanding of God and peace.
Ahmadinejad’s “god” is Allah, the god of Islam, and the “peace” he talks about can only come about by the submission and subjugation of the world. “Islam” literally means “submission”.
This is the same man bent on the destruction of Israel and the U.S and who thinks that violence and destruction will hasten the return of the Mahdi.
Quite the salivating Ahmadinejad fanboy aren’t you Reid?
Tell me- have you got his autograph yet? That poster over your bed??
I don’t give a flying rat’s arse what your hero said to the joke that is the United Nations. Anyone with any knowledge of History (or any nous whatsoever) will tell you that the League of Nations is a pitiful joke…
Some people who purport to merely be criticising the Israeli government are doing so because they are anti-semitic.
Really? I’ve never heard or read anyone who did that, I’m not saying it doesn’t happen I’m sure it does, but do you have a major example? Someone who calls Israel the zionist entity doesn’t count, in case you think it does.
The west did support Al-Qa’ida in Libya and they are supporting them in Syria, look it up. It may not be on Fox or CNN, but it’s just a google away.
I’m aware the public line is as you say re: the weapons, but they give them intelligence on where the local govt caches are which they proceed to raid, with or without special forces help. And of course they don’t ship them Nato weapons, there are plenty of arms dealers with Russian stocks. It’s who pays for them which is what counts. And since they no longer use Universal Exports as the front company, your intrepid FoxNews war correspondent isn’t likely to stumble onto the story, are they. It’s all about plausible deniability chiz. And as we all know, that’s just code for vapid bullshit.
Apparently no one has ever explained this to you before so it falls to me to point this out: not everything you read on the internet is true.
but they give them intelligence on where the local govt caches are which they proceed to raid
After 9/11, the US and the EU are NOT assisting or aiding Al-qaeda in anyway. They are not going to take the risk. We’ve already seen what happened in Libya where assistance wasn’t controlled very well with the result that arms eventually ended up in the hands of jihadists anyway and subsequently caused problems in Mali. The west is not directly or indirectly supporting jihadists in Syria. If you have read on some website that they are supporting jihadists then you should take that as a sign that that website isn’t reliable.
Just while i’m waiting to see if there is any response from Pete George to being found out.
Why would otherwise sane people try to educate Reid regarding the middle east situation ?
His ilk will still be apologising for western civilization as the true believers sodomise him and drag his
corpse through the streets.
That’s how they will thank him for his support.
This is the same man bent on the destruction of Israel and the U.S and who thinks that violence and destruction will hasten the return of the Mahdi.
Do you know him personally Fletch or did Bill O’Reilly tell you that when he was interviewing the US Defence Secretary?
Quite the salivating Ahmadinejad fanboy aren’t you Reid?
No not especially Longknives but I call bullshit when I see it and the Iran-nuke-hysteria is A-grade manufactured bullshit from start to finish just exactly the same as AGW is. I also know that an attack on Iran is not going to be some localised conflict which won’t touch us, it will set the world ablaze. You will see massive car bombs and terrorist attacks in cities all over the western world. Tens of thousands of white people will die. And this is not just ragheads Longknives, these are REAL people just like you and me. Who knows, maybe your kid will be blown up in an Auckland terrorist bombing. And it’s all unnecessary because as I have said since day one, where is the evidence apart from hallucination and fantasy, that just because Iran gets a weapon it will automatically use it. I have repeated the logic so many times I’m sick of it and not once has anyone ever been able to poke a hole in it. MAD applies. Even if Iran has a nuke. What the fuck about that, doesn’t every single person in the whole fucking world, understand? So why go to war? Because Isweal says so? What the fuck has happened to people’s logical capacity that as soon as Isweal SAYS it’s under threat, whether or not logic and facts and REALITY says so, that every single person in the whole world grovels around and wrings their hands and rends their clothes and cries for poor widdle Isweal, yes, we will save you, widdle Iswael, you’ve NEVER hurt anyone ever. You’re a fucking victim. Your enemies are my enemies forever and ever and ever and ever.
Seriously. That’s what the world actually, truly, in fact does. I prefer actual reality, myself. That’s why I take the position I have for the last ten years.
“…Do you think Ahmadinejad’s meeting with those Jewish leaders in NY was anti-semetic?…”
Yes.
“….In November 2006 Mohammad Hassan Rahimian, the representative of the Iranian SupremeLeader, who stands even higher in the Iranian hierarchy than Ahmadinejad,stated that, “the Jew is the most stubborn enemy of the believers. And the decisive war will decide the fate of humanity…”
Harriet perhaps you mis-understood. I linked to a video above @ 7:09 showing NZ Jews meeting with Ahmadinejad. That’s what I was referring to. Here it is again.
So I’m not too sure what this has to do with your quote. I’d also suggest you have a look at another link in the 7:09 which gives the timeline back to the 1990′s of the bullshit “Iran will have a nuke in the next 5 mins” allegations, it might help. Also, what provocative statements have the zionist leadership of Israel been making toward Iran for all those years, and do you think if I did a quick google I could find an even more inflammatory comment from the zionists about Iran?
“….Also, what provocative statements have the zionist leadership of Israel been making toward Iran for all those years, and do you think if I did a quick google I could find an even more inflammatory comment from the zionists about Iran?…”
NO…..’cos here’s another from ya munted idol Reid!
“…..He reiterated this belief in his most recent speech at the United Nations in September 2007:
“The age of darkness will end”, he enthused to the General Assembly and “the peoples in Europe and America will be liberated from the burdens the Zionists have inflicted on them”.
So let me now sum up on this final point: There are other dictatorships in the world. But only in Iran are the fantasy-worlds of anti semitism and religious mission linked with technological megalomania and the physics of mass destruction. The specific danger presented by the Iranian nuclear option stems from the unique ideological atmosphere surrounding it – a mixture of holy war and high-tec, of anti semitism and weapons-grade uranium, of death-wish and missile research, of Shiite messianism and plutonium….”
“You will see massive car bombs and terrorist attacks in cities all over the western world. Tens of thousands of white people will die.”
What a strange comment- What about peaceful people of other ethnicities? Are they somehow immune to bombings? Arent we always bleating on about being a “Multicultural Society”??
“Who knows, maybe your kid will be blown up in an Auckland terrorist bombing.”
Morbid stuff Reid- Thankfully I don’t have any children…Are you masturbating over these bombing fantasies? Because I find them rather odd..
Stick a pig, listen to him squeal.
Struck a raw nerve there did i Pete ?
Answering a question with a question is a pathetic response.
Pete made it three out of three.
P.S. Pete.
My non de plume is ‘bereal’
Bastardising it may score points for you in your mind.
Still, if thats all you have, …
Firstly Harriet, Israel’s the one with the actual nukes, missiles, biologicals, chemicals, weaons-grade uranium and plutonium.
According to a lot of people in Israeli and US intelligence, Iran doesn’t in fact have anything except missiles. Isn’t that a shame for whatever the hell it is you’re attempting to say.
What is wrong with some people that they hallucinate that Iran is some sort of mad mullah’s desert fiefdom where the only one who gets a say is the Ayatollah who lives in a tent with his horses? That’s what some seem to hallucinate Iran is Harriet and it’s funny, because that’s precisely what western propaganda since the hostage crisis has taught through media associations to all those western people who are incapable of independent thinking because their tiny minds can’t accommodate more than a few compatible ideas lest the cognitive dissonance seep in and hurt their tummies.
It’s a shame really, the whole interweb thingy with all the answers it offers, is completely lost on such people. They probably just use it for social media purposes so they can explain to all their fabulous friends they’ve just finished breakfast and now they’re on their way to whatever, but just before they do they just need to pop in brush their teeth and they’ll be back in just a jif to resume their mindless twittering. At least people like you Harriet have made it to a political blog. Compared to those people that’s like earning a Ph.D and yet oddly, just like those people you still haven’t dropped that mindless propaganda those other people aren’t even aware they’ve been inculcated with, and that’s a shame.
There was no such thing as a suicide bomber up to about 20yrs ago.
There were no recorded suicide bombings in the entire afganistan/russian war. Bin Laden fought in most of that war.So too did others who went on to become the Taliban.
Even in the 70′s planes were only ever hi-jacked and demands were always made for themselves to survive.Sometimes ‘shootouts’ happened, but that is not nesseceraly suicide.
Tell us what all the ME demands are Reid – to secure enduring peace?
I know one of them: Recognition of Israel to exist!
Longknives it was phrased like that since a lot of people who are on your side of the debate don’t seem to understand Arabs and Iranians are also human, just like us and a lot of people who are your side of the debate also seem to imagine that an Iran attack will just be a bigger version of Libya and Syria but it won’t mean a whole hell of lot to them. But they’re completely wrong, on both counts.
Harriet it’s now 11:15 daylight saving time so I’m not going to enter into the ME peace resolution process with you right now. Sorry about that.
I meant to add in that last post that suicide is fanaticism. For what? What is the great demand that you would give your life for? And kill a hundred or two fellow Muslims in the process?
There is no hallucination Reid. Ahmadinajad, Khamanei and other “mad mullahs” are on record as to their beliefs. And Iran’s poor human rights record is also well recorded.
Well, that was a pleasant Saturday night – one not spent on Kiwiblog that is. And what do I find upon returning the cyberworld ….?
Some people who purport to merely be criticising the Israeli government are doing so because they are anti-semitic.
Too true, and there’s a great example of that in this thread, where Luc Hansen is so obsessed, as usual, with the Jews that he unloads the following comment …
Michael Totten is a paid propagandist for Israel. It funds a lot of his work. In return, Israel is always the hero.
… about an article that Totten writes on Morocco. Rather than actually comment on the whole point and focus of the article – that Morocco is a Muslim Middle Eastern nation that has made progress on democracy, civil liberties and all-round modernity – Luc simply uses it as as a crutch to dump out all his standard, far-left diatribes and prejudices: Jewish ‘apartheid’, the evil USA, oil, and of course Islamophobia. Precisely the things that Morocco seems to not waste time obsessing about. There may be a lesson there.
It’s those sorts of unthinking, kneejerk, soundbites that have gained Luc the low reputation for debate that he has on this blog. He should have stayed in the front lines of protests, as in his good old pro-Ho Chi Minh days, where the only requirement is mindlessly bellowing slogans, banging the empty skin drum known as his head.
“people who are on your side of the debate don’t seem to understand Arabs and Iranians are also human”
Yep- That’s the problem. Humans by nature are violent,warmongering animals….
And at this particular point in time your beloved Muslims (the type that take great delight in blowing innocent people up..Durka Durka) are the most fucking violent,aggressive and dangerous people on the planet.
As far as I’m concerned they must be stopped, using any method necessary- much like the Nazis had to be stopped 70 years ago…
Reid (11,737) Says:
September 29th, 2012 at 6:22 pm
Harriet, isn’t it curious then that Christians live peaceably in Iran alongside all those angry Muslims?
Reid you are joking aren’t you?
or are you pig stupid. Nah you’re not that.
No other faith is able to live peaceably in IRAN, they are abused daily and most would like to get out.
But then you know that don’t you, pillock.
Pete George, I see on your website you have written that the Conservative Party’s policy is ‘extreme’, whatever that means. You quote:
The Conservative Party will support the following:
- Clarifying the rights of citizens to defend themselves and their property, both inside and outside the home.
- The Party supports the “castle” doctrine under which persons who invade others’ homes or property have few rights, and law abiding citizens can – within some limits – do whatever they deem necessary to defend themselves or their property. Only in the rarest and most extreme circumstances should law abiding citizens find themselves facing charges arising out of situations where they have protected themselves against criminals threatening either themselves or their property. Those “rare and extreme circumstances” should be clearly stated and enshrined in legislation.
What’s extreme about this? It’s actually very difficult to criticise it properly, because they have stated that “the rights of citizens to defend themselves and their property” need to be clarified, and “Only in the rarest and most extreme circumstances should law abiding citizens find themselves facing charges arising out of situations where they have protected themselves against criminals …” and that those circumstances should be clearly stated in legislation.
So where’s the problem? Until you know what the Conservative Party defines as “rare and most extreme circumstances”, it’s rather difficult to criticise it.
Seems to me you’re trying to beat this up to support yourself.
graham – it’s very easy to criticise such loose policy.
The problem is they have loosely defined it, leaving it up for interpretation. And some are interpretating it as an extreme policy, one that will allow virtual open slather – or open slaughter.
Their policy should make it clear what they actually intend, if they leave it open to interpretation it will be interpreted however people want to see it.
In any case unless they can get majority support for any of their policies they won’t get anywhere with them, especially if they do have extreme intentions.
Or are Conservatives deliberately appealing to certain constituencies without any intention of delivering what they want?
Or are Conservatives deliberately appealing to certain constituencies without any intention of delivering what they want?
You mean like United Future?
Some of UF’s policies which they obviously hope will appeal to the “had-enough-of-the-Maori-gravy-train” folks:
- Establish a new national day on which all New Zealanders celebrate the unique gift we possess by being part of this nation. This will be separate from Waitangi Day, which will also be retained and celebrated.
- Commit to the goal of 2014 for the settlement of outstanding historical grievances, and resource the claims process to ensure that this becomes a reality.
- Ensure that settlements fit within the norms of a modern liberal democratic society – i.e. they should not give one class of citizens’ greater rights than others but should recognize the unique place that hapü, whänau and iwi have had in our country.
graham, the reality for small parties is that IF they can get into a coalition arrangement they can only progress some of their policies, so they have to prioritise, and the policies they promote have to be compatible with a majority of parliament.
UF put a priority on getting a Super discussion going, which they have achieved.
Act put forward fiscal restraint legislation that looks like failing because neither the Maori Party nor UF will support it, as is their right. That’s the nature of coalition politics.
None of Act, UF or National promoted ToW policies.
The Conservative Party have a reasonable chance of making the threshold and getting into parliament, in part due to vague policies that appeal to some extreme voters, but I think they will struggle to get anywhere near sufficient support for their ‘castle doctrine’ policy.
If the Conservatives get a reasonable bloc of MPs and can form a coalition with National, and possible Act and UF, and if they promote ToW policies as a priority, they have more chance of success there.
Manolo – Dunne is often criticised (usually by disgruntled supporters of failures) for being one of the most successful MPs of the last few decades. Isn’t that the prime aim of being in parliament, to be in a position to actually do things in Government?
Tell me which MPs you think don’t aspire to be ministers. And which parties don’t aspire to be in Government.
Do you know BTW that one of the scenarios is that Iran already has nukes courtesy of the Chinese (notice that IF that’s true, they haven’t used them, have they, which kinda puts you Islamphobes out to lunch, doesn’t it). But IF Israel attacks it, Iran will use them. (Notice that they didn’t use them before, which kinda etc…) And there’s a limited nuclear exchange in the ME.
So what is it Reid,they do have the bomb that Afterdinnerjacket keeps saying they haven’t and are not pursuing? Isn’t that support for a bald faced liar? I’d rather he said we have the bomb,keep away. Why all the denial? Why all the secrecy,whom do you trust? The Wisconsin Project information given their bias etc and the UN reports are hard to brush off. Do you honestly believe that the fickle west will do anything more than send a Chamberlain-plot archetypal maid sympathiser to Iran who will no doubt return with a Peace in our time promise. Gives you time to dig a shelter and stock up on bags of Fuller’s earth.
September 29th, 2012 at 8:16 am
Ahead of the first.
Vote:Righto slackers, off your arses and get to work. NZ needs your taxes
September 29th, 2012 at 8:16 am
http://dailycaller.com/2012/09/26/taxpayers-spent-1-4-billion-on-obama-family-last-year-perks-questioned-in-new-book/
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:22 am
Righto slackers, off your arses and get to work. NZ needs your taxes
OK so drill baby drill.
Vote:Removes excess Govt expenditure. Prime candidate the failed GCSB & SIS !00 million per year we don’t have any faith in spending.
Must be a lot more in those places we can make unemployed.
September 29th, 2012 at 8:24 am
You could get rid of 90% of them and they would not be missed V2
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:35 am
Just curious Viking2; what did the police and GCSB/SIS do to you that makes you hate them all so much? You’re very quick to point out their faults, but sheesh; I wouldn’t and couldn’t be a cop no matter how much they were paying. The vast majority do a bloodgy good job, yet you delight in their stuff-ups.
As I said; just curious…
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:38 am
A US man fatally shot a masked teenager he thought was a burglar in self-defence outside his neighbor’s house and then discovered it was his son, state police said.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:44 am
Whale Oil’s ‘Burglar Load’ post yesterday created a lot of comment both there and on General Debate. Inevitably I was accused of many things due to speaking up. But some disturbing things came out of it. Comments like…
…were linked to the Conservative Party…
The Conservative Party Party has few written policies but they do promote the castle doctrine (in less extreme language).
Thats why Nutters Anonymous is attracted to the Conservative Party – they think Colin Craig will give them a license to kill. The Conservative Party’s ‘castle’ doctrine.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:45 am
So scott chris ,what’s the point of your post?
There’s one less perv/burglar in the USA ,and a grieving father who knows a bit more about his teenager’s strange activities.
Shit happens.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:48 am
Pistol Pete must have stewed on that all night.
I love the way he frames so many of his posts in terms of ” I copped flak cos I’m this that or the other…..” Bit of a martyr our pete.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:57 am
There have already been journalistic references to Ministerial Responsibility in relation to the GCSB/Police/Dotcom/Fibby saga. They do not paint John Key in a very good light. But they are out of date and relate to a period in the evolution of western democratic government which has passed us by.
Let us look at problem # 1 – The Labour Caucus elects its Cabinet. The Leader allocates portfolios.
National’s Leader selects his Cabinet and allocates portfolios. But both systems fail to recognise that they do not deal with western democracy in (well, almost) 2013.
The MSM has become the LSM and television news has been surpassed by “reality” BS shows.
Instant news circulated via the internet now rules. No wonder there are growing calls from “Yes Minister” types throughout the world to control the internet. The “Yes Minister” types realise that their control of information has gone (due also to OIA and FOI legislation) or, at best, doomed.
So bring this back to our little western democracy. The United States of America with nearly 350 million citizens does not have a “State Services Commission” or equivalent. Such an organisation would not be tolerated there, yet we, with our mere 4.5 million deem it necessary to have one. Further, once the “Secretaries” of Departments are appointed they make all staff appointments. Do they serve at the pleasure of the Government, the Ministers, or the MPs that we elect? No.
We now have the worst of all worlds: MMP parliamentary elections (where a multiplicity of minority parties can over-ride one that gets almost 50 % of the nationwide vote) , the Nation’s leader selected and appointed by an elite few, Ministers selected by either one person, or the elite few, departmental secretaries (please, let us not continue with the Chief Executive crap. That is private sector speak that is accompanied by a need for profitability and responsibility – not the spending of large sums of money extracted by force from taxpayers.
And now we have the GCSB/Police/Crown Law/ Fibby/Dottiecom farce. We are expected to have confidence in these organisations because we are told that we should.
But take just one example: We now know that GCSB sought to cover its involvement in the Dottiecom affair by having W.English sign a Ministerial Directive., That directive has now been exposed. But has it been withdrawn? It has certainly been exposed by what it is (rubbish!) /was. We now know that JK followed Royal Commissions Rule 101 and wrote terms of reference for Neazor to ensure that he (JK) got the answer he wanted. We also now have the red melons asking for a Police investigation . Really? The Police have powers that over-ride GCSB and the SIS? One thinks not.
For reasons of space, this is a scatter-gun piece, but the drift will be evident.
Vote:Time that this whole porridge was referred to the Constitution Commission – or whatever it is called in 2012.
September 29th, 2012 at 8:58 am
The Onion at it’s best again
http://www.theonion.com/articles/gallup-poll-rural-whites-prefer-ahmadinejad-to-oba,29677/
So good, that the Iranian News Agency Far News picked it up as real news.
http://o.onionstatic.com/images/articles/article/29/29677/FARS.png
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:00 am
Conservonutters forget to read the bible and ignore the teachings of Jesus again
Vote:KOWTOW would you like to tell us what Jesus said to do if a man takes your cloak.
September 29th, 2012 at 9:13 am
Angry gruff ,did someone shit in your porridge?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:30 am
flipper
All good points & just to bring it all home we were informed recently that a Communications Tribunal would be set up ostensibly to look after poor little children who get cyber bullied & thin skinned business people worried that their dodgy deals may be published on the net.
Or maybe our political masters could be persuaded to admit that the Tribunal’s real work will be to suppress details of the myriad cockups & abuses of procedure occasioned by agencies of the state.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:34 am
http://www.wakingtimes.com/2012/09/13/97-percent-of-our-dna-has-a-higher-purpose-and-is-not-junk-as-labeled-by-scientists/
People who aren’t or who refuse to connect to their own spirituality and by that I don’t mean religion I mean recognition we are spiritual beings living a temporary physical existence, completely fail to understand just how extraordinary and special every single person alive really is. The fact that our primitive science hasn’t yet touched on it or when it does it ignores it, does not mean it doesn’t exist. Yet that’s precisely what many seem to hallucinate. Touching, really, the way they place their entire epistemology into the hands of people who have been specifically trained to ignore anything which points to an expansion of it.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:47 am
Question: It’s quite evident GCSB used various tactics to justify surveillance they knew was illegal, like getting English to sign the warrant and disingenuously asking Police about Dotcom’s status. Quite why they clearly never anticipated that a multi-millionaire would hire top legal counsel who would procede to pick carefully over every single entrail escapes me but they obviously didn’t anticipate it for it doesn’t take more than a child’s imagination to predict that when their demonstrably disingenuous approval process hit the light of day the things that are currently happening, both legally and in the media, would in fact, happen. But never mind all of that. My question is, what if Dotcom really is guilty as sin? And what if the courts decline to extradite and we lose the TPP? Plus our relations with the US plunge back to where they were in 1986?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:53 am
No kowtow Jesus did not say angry gruff did someone shit in your porridge
he said kowtow you are such a stupid pratt I am ashamed that you say you follow my teachings yet don’t even remember them
just kidding
he is supposed to have said
Luke 29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also.
Jesus said “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
Seems that conservonutters like kowtow dont live by their scared text they would kill for their possessions not give them away as Jesus said
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:54 am
Shearer on TV3 is getting torn apart. He just called the USA “a long term ally”.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:56 am
reid – I suspect the BCSB are not familiar with operating on a level(ish) legal playing field.
The Dotcom case has to go through due process, if the extradition case is good enough he’ll have to go. If not he won’t have to. I don’t know why that will affect the TPP. If the US use one issue to try and leverage the TPP I don’t think we should deal with them.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:58 am
Reid
…”what if Dotcom really is guilty as sin?”….
The alleged crime didn’t occur specifically in NZ & doesn’t to the best of my knowledge affect any NZ nationals so who cares?
…”And what if the courts decline to extradite and we lose the TPP”….
Should we be so lucky to lose a trade treaty where we concede everything (ie give US corporates rights over our own citizens) yet gain zilch (ie the treaty will exclude the only thing we do well that being agricultural produce) may I suggest that the appropriate response should be dancing in the streets.
…”our relations with the US plunge back to where they were in 1986?”….
We survived then & we will survive in the future.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:01 am
Griff
…”they would kill for their possessions not give them away as Jesus said”….
‘kowtow’ will be organising a garage sale for next weekend.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:04 am
A bit of education for reid
“I n the Darwinian perspective, order is not immanent in reality, but it is a self-affirming aspect of reality in so far as it is experienced by situated subjects. However, it is not so much reality that is self-affirming, but the creative order structuring reality which manifests itself to us. Being-whole, as opposed to being-one, underwrites our fundamental sense of locatedness and particularity in the universe. The valuation of order qua meaningful order, rather than order-in-itself, has been thoroughly objectified in the Darwinian worldview. This process of de-contextualization and reification of meaning has ultimately led to the establishment of ‘dis-order’ rather than ‘this-order’. As a result, Darwinian materialism confronts us with an eradication of meaning from the phenomenological experience of reality. Negative theology however suggests a revaluation of disorder as a necessary precondition of order, as that without which order could not be thought of in an orderly fashion. In that sense, dis-order dissolves into the manifestations of order transcending the materialist realm. Indeed, order becomes only transparent qua order in so far as it is situated against a background of chaos and meaninglessness. This binary opposition between order and dis-order, or between order and that which disrupts order, embodies a central paradox of Darwinian thinking. As Whitehead suggests, reality is not composed of disordered material substances, but as serially-ordered events that are experienced in a subjectively meaningful way. The question is not what structures order, but what structure is imposed on our transcendent conception of order. By narrowly focusing on the disorderly state of present-being, or the “incoherence of a primordial multiplicity”, as John Haught put it, Darwinian materialists lose sense of the ultimate order unfolding in the not-yet-being. Contrary to what Dawkins asserts, if we reframe our sense of locatedness of existence within a the space of radical contingency of spiritual destiny, then absolute order reemerges as an ontological possibility. The discourse of dis-order always already incorporates a creative moment that allows the self to transcend the context in which it finds itself, but also to find solace and responsiveness in an absolute Order which both engenders and withholds meaning. Creation is the condition of possibility of discourse which, in turn, evokes itself as presenting creation itself. Darwinian discourse is therefore just an emanation of the absolute discourse of dis-order, and not the other way around, as crude materialists such as Dawkins suggest.”
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:07 am
More evidence coming to light from the Left and the Right, that Obama lied about Libya. The LItany of Lies, to quote Judge Mahon, here:
http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2012/09/29/the-white-house-litany-of-lies-over-libya
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:18 am
Given that people are often banging away about the lousy relationship the USA has with Muslim countries in the ME, the following article by long-time, roving reporter, Michael Totten, should be of interest: What A Real Alliance Looks Like.
As with a number of other Arab countries there was an alliance against communism during the Cold War, but Morocco did not simply use that external enemy as a reason for being dictatorial at home. The writer contrasts that specifically with Egypt:
My favourite was when Mubarak’s newspapers (not ones run by any Islamist group) informed their readers that recent shark attacks along the coast were the work of Mossad, who had trained the sharks to attack people for the purposes of destroying Egypt’s tourist trade.
And just to give the full picture, Totten points out that:
Fascinating stuff, and you might consider hitting his PayPal tipjar to continue to get the sort of reporting the MSM has given up on.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:21 am
Our old friend The Comedian is back in the news again; appealing what was a pretty lenient sentence for confusing the private parts of a four-year-old girl with those of an adult woman. What he did was not funny then, and it is not funny now, and somehow, I don’t think that appealing to the High Court is going to “make people laugh”. He clearly thinks that he was hard done by.
http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/09/we-thought-wed-heard-last-of-him.html
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:07 am
PG, I think GCSB is used to the legal process. It’s composed of rather bright people plus this is what they do for a living, so I’d be very surprised if they weren’t actutely aware.
nasska my view is that IF Dotcom is as guilty as sin, then he should be extradited. Just as someone who did something in NZ who lives in the US equally should be. I too aren’t a great fan of the TPP based on what I’ve read about it and what I’ve observed of the negotiations process which makes me suspect it won’t be terribly good news. But I may be wrong and who am I to stand in the way of a treaty with one of our historically closest allies in the whole world. The UKUSA pact sets the US, UK, Aus, Canada and ourselves aside and the damage done by the commie Hulun to separate us from those other four, is just being repaired now, thirty years on. It would be a diplomatic tragedy for us once again, if the idiot media were once again largely responsible for separating us again at this juncture, just as they are and were for the popularity of the anti-nuke policy. If the media has done its job in 1984 and explained the diplomatic ramifications rather than jumping on the popular bandwagon as they did, just as they did with the Uruwera raid and just as they are doing with Dotcom, then this wouldn’t happen. The worst part about it is, that as a result of the media lies and one-sided reporting, why naturally it gets 95% of the fuck-headed mentals who comprise around 80% of the public, on the side of their propaganda. And then the mentals point to that popular support as if it wasn’t manufactured, as a justification for their one-sided reporting. I’d call it a circus but in a circus, they have trained animals so it’s not even that.
Luke, you may understand why your 10:04 is relevant, but I sure don’t.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:17 am
This weed is being ripped out of the nations gardens on a daily basis. It’s hell on skin cancers.
Vote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-12275507
September 29th, 2012 at 11:28 am
ABC news report detailing how the Libyan attack was a premeditated terrorist attack (confirmed by Secretary of Defence Leon Panetta), and had nothing to do with any youtube video.
The insurgents knew enough to go to the safe house half a mile away where Ambassador Stevens had been taken and attack it with mortar fire.
http://youtu.be/t-RZEg-lJV8
“People died; Obama lied”
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:37 am
Reid
If sufficient evidence is produced to satisfy a NZ Judge that Dotcom has a case to answer in the States then obviously the principles of any extradition treaty we are party to must prevail. The MSM (& others) have lost sight of the fact that it doesn’t matter how many procedural cockups have incurred…..Dotcom will be extradited if the Yanks can produce the evidence.
The mentals who represent eight out of ten of us will have to content themselves with in depth research by paragons of intellectualism such as the Tracy Watkins who will hyperventilate at the chance of fomenting another wave of anti John Key hysteria amongst the wittering classes.
Those of us with a somewhat less superficial outlook on international politics will be ignored as we analyse the trade treaty for the likely load of crap it is.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:38 am
Obama lied indeed, but yet the MSM is unwilling to raise the subject. The Messiah’s reelection campaign must not be disturbed by the unpalatable reality.
The incompetent Kenyan is the unAmerican president.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:42 am
I don’t have much faith that the US MSM is really going to go after this issue, but perhaps their hand has been forced by the occasional reporter who has cracked the WH’s armor. Still, the story the WH told was such obvious bullshit from the start that it may have always been ready to fall apart.
When you have Obama voters and supporters like Howard Finemann at the HuffPo and Kirsten Powers starting to complain about the useless coverage of an issue that could hurt Obambi, you do have to wonder if things are changing. As one commentator said of Powers, “Good lord, I think she’s gone rogue”:
That last is a very good point. They’re supposed to be the Fourth Estate after all – not bloody shills for Obama.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:45 am
60 Minutes should be interesting Sunday. Anna Guy is asked about the rumour that Ewen was Gay and Scott found out. I will be interested in her answer.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
I am not sure flipper of the American system, where one man appoints his non elected cabinet,his Secretary of Defense,his/her Secretary of state,where locals vote in and out their Police Chiefs,where the Bechtel group gets the big projects around the world and where if your name is Kennedy, Clinton or Bush the public pray like mad that you will declare yourself a dynasty and natural heir to the Throne of America.
Vote:And I like Americans and an honest SSC in NZ that keeps an eye on underware purchases,Hide and Hone’s extra sight seeing jaunts. When the minutiae of Parliamentary foiblings are ignored then we are well on the way to corruption and excess.America does have a Senate as well,so they have a myriad of over representation.
September 29th, 2012 at 12:13 pm
Reid – Dotcom will be extradited if the Yanks can produce the evidence.
And that may depend on how much American evidence was illegally obtained in New Zealand and presumably is inadmissible.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 12:13 pm
Amidst the Kim Dotcomedy –
Finance Minister Bill English says iwi have told the Government they want the Crown to deal directly with iwi regarding water rights, not the Maori Council.
The round of consultation hui with tribes on the partial privatisation of state-owned energy companies wound up in Christchurch on Thursday night.
The six meetings were held after the Government decided to delay the sale of shares in state-owned company Mighty River Power until early 2013. There was little interest, however, in the idea of offering Maori shares with extra benefits.
The Waitangi Tribunal has proposed that iwi and hapu affected should be given a special shareholding (known as shares plus) in the partially-privatised power companies and rights above those of other shareholders.
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/116855/english-says-iwi-don't-want-to-deal-with-maori-council
So the Waitangi Tribunal is WRONG?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 12:28 pm
Good god, you think things are bad in the US in general? Take a look at where California is leading in this article based on a recently published book: Crazifornia: Tales from the Tarnished State:
There’s lots more where that came from:
I don’t think “dysfunctional” even covers this sort of government insanity.
My brother-in-law recently moved there from Seattle and I warned him not to put roots down no matter how much money he’s earning. I think this book will be a Christmas present.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 1:03 pm
Sofia…
Waitangi Tribunal? Yes. Can it.
Vote:Now can we all move on to things that matter…like the deficit (say, France is going to introduce austerity measures- along with a 75% tax rate for the few that will remain FRENCH TAXPAYERS!!!!) and on to things that Petersfirst, the red melons and labour say are unimportant ???
September 29th, 2012 at 1:46 pm
Tom Hunter#
Isn’t California the State that got nearly all it’s income tax take of ‘rich pricks’ because they didn’t tax so called ‘poor’ people?
- and then when the GFC came along and the ‘rich pricks’ lost most of their taxable income, the state then went broke because ‘rich pricks’ no longer had to pay tax because they were now ‘poor people’ too?
Only taxing ‘rich pricks’ IS gambling on the share market – lefties are fucked in the head.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 1:52 pm
“…Anna Guy is asked about the rumour that Ewen was Gay and Scott found out. I will be interested in her answer…’
It’s probably all bullshit…..gays mostly kill themselves, they very seldomly kill others.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 2:02 pm
Tom hunter # 10.18
That was very good reading. Thanks.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:11 pm
Keeping Stock (8,138) Says:
September 29th, 2012 at 8:35 am
Just curious Viking2; what did the police and GCSB/SIS do to you that makes you hate them all so much? You’re very quick to point out their faults, but sheesh; I wouldn’t and couldn’t be a cop no matter how much they were paying. The vast majority do a bloodgy good job, yet you delight in their stuff-ups.
As I said; just curious…
Curiosity killed the cat.
Actually nothing.
But the answer is that they act in unprincipled ways and are strangers to the truth so often. They want to and and act all powerful when in fact they are all servants of the taxpayer. Just like school teachers and any other civil servant.
They should be harshly questioned if only to ensure that they don’t become servants of the powerful and the politicians rather than servants of all kiwi’s or use that power they are given to abuse process as they often do.
Had English raised the questions that he should have then Key would not be being villified for what happened as it would and should have been exposed but English didn’t and indeed it looks bloody dogy that he did sign the coverup.
And its more so that given the GCSB knew on the 16th of Feb they waited till key departed to the USA.
I actually have some sympathy for Key at this point except to say the he should have come staight out in Parliament as soon as he was informed and laid it out and let the cards fall where they should. Instead now it will go on and on and it will rear its ugly head just when its not needed.
Looking at ebineazor’s report one gets the impression of a party of vested interest reporting on those interests with a suitable outcome. I recall reading this morning about that cosy little arrangement.
I have a rule and its this: never involve oneself with people who will do your bidding and dirty work for a price for once you do tyou are forever beholding to them. e.g. getting gang members to collect money for you or other activities like that.
Once compromised you are forever in their control orbit.
Akin to doing the bidding of the FBI, Hollywood etc and forsaking clear principles for expedience. NZ is forever in their control. and the problem is that the FBI have manufactured their charges against Dotcom on a civil matter so as to use our
Legal system to exact Hollywoods revenge.
for me the complete case rests on the alleged action. That action is apprently loss of copyright fee’s through the actions of others using Megaupload.
No I;m sure you wouldn’t close down the postal service for distributing porn via a paid service. You would go after the writers. (and they used to).
That is undoubtably a civil matter. End of story. And Hollywood can address that without the help of Obama and the FBI.
I have to defend my patent as do many other companies. I know of one Kiwi company that spends around 100k per month doing just that.
That is a civil matter and not a police matter.
The rest of course turns on the FBI turning that civil action into a crime which its not.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:17 pm
Hey Pete, just for you. All about guns.
http://screencast.com/t/QgY7xVaL
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:19 pm
““…Anna Guy is asked about the rumour that Ewen was Gay and Scott found out. I will be interested in her answer…’”
And this is on what is supposed to be a premier nz news program. ffs.
At least it will look good on the producers resume when they finally try for their career goal of working for Womans Weekly.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:30 pm
The Incompetent in Chief plans to fund the savages: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/world/middleeast/white-house-move-to-give-egypt-450-million-in-aid-meets-resistance.html?_r=0
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:38 pm
http://johnansell.wordpress.com/2012/09/29/hobbling-new-zealand-the-agenda-of-the-constitutional-advisory-panel/
A good read for the afternoon.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 3:54 pm
Viking – you seem to be jumping to wrong conclusions again. All I have done is question the wisdom of bragging about misuse of shotguns online, and where to draw lines in how far individuals can go in the protection of property and person.
I have never been against a reasonable level of self protection, and I have never proposed banning firearms – and I’d like to keep my own. And I am fully against burglers and home invaders, I despise them, like almost everyone apart from a few crims.
Almost everyone (except for a few here and on Whale Oil) are against a wild west society.
It’s just that a few drongoes hear “don’t blab about firearm use, and should the law be tweaked or not” and say “ban everything and welcome all criminals”. That’s a bit pathetic.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 4:52 pm
Why do they emigrate? http://news.msn.co.nz/worldnews/8540544/girl-cannot-skip-swim-class-german-court
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 4:58 pm
Even the biased useless are entitled to an opinion: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10837316
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 4:59 pm
V2 @ 3:38, excellent link, most grateful.
Prof Devlin is courageous. Even with tenure, this is career-limiting stuff in the same way Buchanan’s relatively moderate statement about the female student was. These days academia seems to require leftism no matter what, or else. I noted on Morning Report the other day that Steve Hoadley’s become a human rights expert in international relations these days, possibly as insurance against a Buchanan-like attack on him, I wondered. He used to be just an expert in international relations. I imagine that’s no longer sufficient in our brave new academic world.
If we had a proper media they would have exposed this constitutional review charade ages ago and forced it through a vigorous on-going campaign to change its track notwithstanding the resistance from the politicians and the panel which would have been put up. Fuck em, this is our country not yours, should have been the attitude from our intelligent, alert, vigorous and courageous 4th Estate watchdogs. But no. We don’t have that, do we.
It’s true that people do get the kind of democracy they deserve, but it’s a real tragedy the idiots in the public arena who haven’t even heard about the panel or if they have, don’t care, are the vast vast vast majority. It’d be quite good if one of the recommendations is that there’s an opt-out clause for those New Zealanders who think the review is a piece of shit and don’t want a bar of it. And those of us who get to tick that box get to makeup our very own constitution which just applies specifically to us, while all the rest of the morons have to live with whatever the fuck the panel put together. I suggest the following from Animal Farm just to get the ball rolling. Suggested alterations in italic:
Four legs good, two legs better!
Vote:No
animalhuman shall sleep in a bedwithwithout sheets.No animal shall drink alcohol to excess. But humans can if we want to.
No animal shall kill any other animal
without causeunless they look delicious.All
animalsNew Zealanders are equal, butsome animalsNew Zealanders who didn’t agree with the stupid constitutional review panel FFS, are more equal thanothersthe silly mentals who thought it was perfectly fine or just didn’t care till it was too late to do anything about it, fucking d’oh.September 29th, 2012 at 5:23 pm
Pete George#
“….All I have done is question the wisdom of bragging about misuse of shotguns online, and where to draw lines in how far individuals can go in the protection of property and person….”
Wasn’t it Bob Jones who suggested that all women should be allowed to carry guns to protect them from rape?
Or was he just taking the piss out of all the feminists who can only see evil in men?
Either way, policing is about ‘risk assessment’ and the police executive must then see only good in men as they don’t allow women to carry lessor weapons that don’t harm, like capsicum spray etc.
Which in itself is a warning – stamp out any talk from feminists who call for stronger laws to protect women: The risk has been assessed by ‘professional risk assessors’ and law changes are not needed: NZ women are generally safe!
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:31 pm
i see even the supposedly ‘tame’ muslims in Dearborn Michigan USA are starting to play up now and calling for any
criticism of mohomed or islam to be made a criminal offence.
There are no exceptions to the rule that muslims in any western society will cause problems eventually.
No exceptions anywhere, not in Australia, and not in New Zealand.
Dearborn is home to the largest mosque in USA and the largest % of muslims in any US city.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:36 pm
Nutter Netanyahu warns future of world at stake over Iran’s nuclear programme.
What a fucking mental. Sadly, he’s right. IF either the US or Israel DOES attack Iran then the future of the world IS at stake. But THEY DON’T HAVE TO DO THAT, DO THEY. I mean what a tosser. Who does he think he is, to threaten the world?
Do you know BTW that one of the scenarios is that Iran already has nukes courtesy of the Chinese (notice that IF that’s true, they haven’t used them, have they, which kinda puts you Islamphobes out to lunch, doesn’t it). But IF Israel attacks it, Iran will use them. (Notice that they didn’t use them before, which kinda etc…) And there’s a limited nuclear exchange in the ME. The west uses the ensuing panic to impose martial law, using the laws and the infrastructure they’ve already got in place. Then the west releases a genetically engineered flu-like virus on the Chinese, killing hundreds of millions. Of course there are western bio-warfare casualties as well, but the populations are under martial law so outbreaks are much contained. Once that works its course it then becomes a full nuclear exchange in which round about half of the entire world population dies. Heard of the Georgia Guidestones? Google that and have a read. There’s more of course, as in who did this and why and how they survive, but I won’t bore you with details. Did you know though there’s a seed-bank in a granite mountain in Norway that holds stocks of all the worlds plants? Why do you think that’s there?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:38 pm
Bereal
A light hearted look at the problem.
Ref: http://www.faithfreedom.org/comics/comics.htm
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:48 pm
Michael Totten is a paid propagandist for Israel. It funds a lot of his work. In return, Israel is always the hero.
The Middle East needs just three easy steps to enable its people to live in harmony and free of threats:
1. Israel must reform itself and abandon the apartheid model.
2. The US must disengage. Fully. That may happen sooner than many think given the headlong rush towards self-sufficiency in fuels.
3. Islamophobia needs to be consigned to the mists of time, lost in the pages of history.
Note that all the above are acts required of the west, not the east. The east will take care of itself if we just give it the space it deserves, exactly as we demand for ourselves.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:53 pm
There will be no peace in the ME until Iran has a genuine open democracy rather than its current theocratic shamocracy.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:55 pm
“…..Nutter Netanyahu warns future of world at stake over Iran’s nuclear programme….”
There is a saying in the Islamic World:
“First comes Saturday, then comes Sunday.” It refers to the Jewish prayer day Saturday and to the Christian Sunday.
To interpret: Annihilate the Jews then annihilate the Christians. Islam’s goal is to conquer the world through violent overthrow. Learn from history and do not be deceived by the recent academic voices in Orthodoxy and elsewhere, advocating the tragically erroneous view that Islam is peaceful and Christianity fairs well under their domination.
Just look at what the nutters did last week – in Sydney of all places.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 5:58 pm
Interesting take on the Bibi UN fiasco:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/28/binyamin-netanyahu-un-bomb-admiration
It finishes quoting Israel sources: for the first time in public, unequivocally set the summer of 2013 as the last chance to stop the Iranian nuke before it’s too late.
That’s simply delusional.
Besides which, Bibi hasn’t got the balls.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 6:11 pm
Chiz#
Spot on,
read Tom hunter # 10.18 link. It backs up what you’ve just said.
BTW – Anatoly Fyodorovich Dobrynin was a Russian statesman and a former Soviet diplomat and politician. He was Soviet Ambassador to the United States, serving from 1962 to 1986 and most notably during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
In his book ‘In confidence’ he stated that the KGB have learnt to ‘never trust the ME.’
He gave the background to why that view is held[pre Russian/Afganistan war] and a quote from the KGB “they knew we were friends to them but they ALWAYS stabbed us in the back”.
I’ve long held the view that the ME should be bombed into the middle of a working week to civilize them.Democracy however will do just that!
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 6:14 pm
KS. just for you from Whale.
Comment of the day
Vote:by Whaleoil on September 29, 2012
http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Screen-Shot-2012-09-28-at-12.52.41-PM.png
September 29th, 2012 at 6:22 pm
Harriet, isn’t it curious then that Christians live peaceably in Iran alongside all those angry Muslims?
There will be no peace in the ME until Iran has a genuine open democracy rather than its current theocratic shamocracy.
chiz (and Harriet), it’s a bit unfortunate for your prejudice isn’t it that historical facts show that Iran hasn’t invaded anyone since the 1700′s. How many times have your beloved defenders of fweedom and democwacy done that, in the last hundred years?Note that I’m also a fan of the US and Israel in that, I recognise the good they have done and what they represent. This doesn’t mean, unlike it appears some, that I’m therefore quite extraordinarily and wilfully blind about the expected results of their factual actions. As in, if you act like a bully, WTF do you expect people to think about you? And please don’t munt on about justification for them acting like a fucking arsehole. There IS NO justification for that. You can carry a big stick, and you still don’t have to act like a fucking arsehole. As in, just because you have a big stick, doesn’t mean you have to swing it around as we see the Israelis in Operation Cast Lead do, and as we see the US do when they take out the odd wedding party here and there and have an “accidental” Abu Gharrib incident every now and then. NONE OF THIS IS REQUIRED ACTION IN ORDER TO PROTECT THEMSELVES FROM THE THREAT PRESENTED. WHAT THE FUCK ABOUT ANY OF THAT IS DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND? AND WHAT THE FUCK DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT CAUSE AND EFFECT, EITHER?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 6:47 pm
YouTube video of Pat Condell, not afraid to speak the truth re: the Religion Of Peace™ and the current protests around the world. He really socks it to ‘em
Vote:
September 29th, 2012 at 6:53 pm
Oh look these Coptic Christians in Egypt and their Islamic persecutors mustn’t have got deluded Luc’s memo that it’s all Israel’s fault.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2012/09/201292820814460621.html
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 6:59 pm
Besides which, Bibi hasn’t got the balls.
You’re joking, right?
Bibi is 100 times the leader Obama is.
Obama is a puppet, taking the lead from Valarie Jarrett and his other handlers.
I kind of feel sorry for Obama. He has been brainwashed his entire life by everyone from Frank Marshall Davis to Jeremiah Wright to Bill Ayers to Derrick Bell to George Soros. Socialists and Marxists. Even his parents. The poor kid never had a chance. He’s only ever been a pawn.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:07 pm
Tom Scott’s cartoon concerning three SIS agents on Stuff today. So funny. The best for years.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:09 pm
Some facts on Iran, Israel and the west, for those whose brows furrow when faced with the reality that some of us haven’t been sucked into the western propaganda vortex
Israeli leaders meet Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in NYC [and explain the difference between real Jews and Zionists]
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Middle-East/2011/1108/Imminent-Iran-nuclear-threat-A-timeline-of-warnings-since-1979/Earliest-warnings-1979-84
The full text of his UN speech:
http://www.policymic.com/articles/15364/mahmoud-ahmadinejad-un-speech-live-stream-iran-president-speaks-at-un-general-assembly
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance…it is the illusion of knowledge.” A thought-provoking and powerful documentary film on the current and historical root causes of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
Vote:http://www.occupation101.com/multimedia.html
September 29th, 2012 at 7:11 pm
Reid:it’s a bit unfortunate for your prejudice isn’t it that historical facts show that Iran hasn’t invaded anyone since the 1700′s
Iran doesn’t need to invade anyone when its has proxies and surrogates to do its dirty work for it. And what, pray tell, is prejudicial about my comments? Iran is not a democracy and sponsors terrorism.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:18 pm
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is an enemy of the West and of Israel. He shouldn’t be given any attention.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:22 pm
Reid, here’s something for you to read, about the Ahmadinejad and the religious nutters running Iran, and their endtime beliefs.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:35 pm
http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/19-signs-that-america-is-being-systematically-transformed-into-a-giant-surveillance-grid
Maybe the yanks are just real jealous of what the Brits have been doing with their surveillance cams so they decided to just go ahead and do it all, right now. That’ll learn em. Too bad about us, though, isn’t it. But we don’t matter, apparently. It’s a freakin war [on terror] folks! If you don’t want your balls irradiated by a giant isotope-cannon, then you’re just not being patriotic, are you, you terrorist commie bastard you.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 7:46 pm
From Ahmadinajad’s UN speech:
Egoism, maliciousness, rights violations – a good summary of his own government.
More 9/11 denialism.
Endtime nuttiness. He then goes at length about how the Mahdi will end oppression, immorality, poverty, discrimination and bring peace and love and justice and so on. No mention of whether the Mahdi will end crappy TV about the Ridges.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:00 pm
A man went to the doctor to get a double dose of Viagra, but his request was denied.
“Why can’t I have a double dose?” the man asked. “It’s not safe,” the doctor replied.
“But I need it really bad,” the man explained.
“My girlfriend is coming into town on Friday, one of my exes will be here on Saturday, and my wife is coming home on Sunday.”
“Okay, I’ll give it to you,” the doctor relented. “But you have to come in on Monday morning so that I can check to see if there are any side effects.”
On Monday the man dragged himself into the doctor’s office with his right arm in a sling. The doctor asked, “What happened to you?”
The man said, “No one showed up.”
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:02 pm
Poor old Pete George is getting very defensive today. @ 3.54 etc.
Still trying to obfuscate and backtrack and re explain the position he took on yesterdays GD
“I have never, I have never, I didn’t, ” etc etc etc”
Pathetic Pete.
This is what happens when a compulsive fence sitter makes a huge blunder and takes a position on a subject.
Pete, just go back to arguing in favour of both sides. It’s safer, it’s hard to be wrong. That’s where you belong.
Take a position, you are found out.
Vote:You made a mistake, and you have been found out.
There’s no one home.
September 29th, 2012 at 8:05 pm
rhiannon hart wrote:
This is my sister in this video and as much as I agree that poverty is bad in NZ liz told a lot of lies…… We always had shoes and my mum never put a bill befor feeding us and we always had lunch and dinner. Yes we were in the breakfast program for a time and it was a hard time for us. But my sister has lied and over dramatised a situation to get attention
Read more: http://www.3news.co.nz/Breaking-the-cycle-of-poverty/tabid/817/articleID/270750/Default.aspx#ixzz27qNa0n6g
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:17 pm
So the media has now started describing criminal offences as an “Act of Utu”.
I wonder just how long before assault,robbery,rape and murder on Pakeha by Maori are justified and defended as an “Act of Utu” (For historic grievances of course…)
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/7747450/Attack-was-revenge-for-assault-on-son
Bearing in mind that the Constitutional Review (that the ‘lefties’ are just wetting themselves in excitement over) will almost definitely advocate seperate justice systems for Maori and Pakeha….
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:24 pm
chiz#
Thanks for that link.
I’m glad that someone in the world sees Ahmadinejad for what he is – a menace to the whole of mankind!
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:28 pm
Not surprisingly beweal still doesn’t get it.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:34 pm
chiz thanks for that. Do you think Ahmadinejad’s meeting with those Jewish leaders in NY was anti-semetic?
Do you think the term “anti-semitism” is thrown about quite often and used as a propaganda term in the sense that someone who criticises the state of Israel is often labelled anti-semetic when all they’re doing is criticising the govt of Israel?
I found very little fact in that pdf, he seems a bit hysterical. Perhaps he was feeling guilty about the war. His biggest mistake which threads through his whole thesis is that, like many in the west, he conflates zionism with Jews. The two have nothing in common, apart from the zionists pretending they act in the best interests and on behalf of the jewish people. But they don’t. Many in the west believe they do, because this is what the western media tells them. The same media whose owned by zionists. Murdoch for example. Same with the Hollyweird studios. Thus you have conflation after conflation. The old story. Repetition, repetition, repetition.
Most of his arguments are extremely weak, like this one.
What has one got to do with the other? And of course he raises the terrorist support issue. Of course the west never does that do they? Israel doesn’t support Fatah does it? The US and the west doesn’t support the Al-Qa-ida thugs who took down Libya and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the thugs who are today operating in Syria today, do they. Of course they do. So once again, it’s definitely not ok for Iran to do that or to have nukes, but it’s just fine for Israel and the west to do that and to have them.
I’m afraid chiz anyone who still maintains the old western view from the 80′s that we’re the good guys and we’re desperately defending the bastions of freedom and democracy, is simply blind to history and facts that are quite obvious and just a google away, so there really is no excuse.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:39 pm
Hello. Welcome to the Psychiatric Hotline
If you are obsessive-compulsive, please press 1 repeatedly.
If you are co-dependent, please ask someone to press 2.
If you have multiple personalities, please press 3, 4, 5, and 6.
If you are paranoid-delusional, we know who you are and what you want. Just stay on the line so we can trace the call.
If you are schizophrenic, listen carefully and a little voice will tell you which number to press.
If you are manic-depressive, it doesn’t matter which number you press. No one will answer.
If you are anxious, just start pressing numbers at random.
If you are phobic, don’t press anything.
If you are anal retentive, please hold.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:42 pm
“I’m afraid chiz anyone who still maintains the old western view from the 80′s that we’re the good guys and we’re desperately defending the bastions of freedom and democracy, is simply blind to history”
I still firmly believe we are the good guys-I must be blind to History.
Vote:Hang on a minute- one of my degrees is in History…
It must be irrelevant though… because Reid says so??
September 29th, 2012 at 8:45 pm
Something else Ahmadinejad said at the UN which somehow chiz omitted to mention:
Gosh isn’t he wicked. What an aggressive awful thing to say. Why I feel like blocking my ears and shouting lalalalala he’s so aggwesive and anti-semetic.
Seriously, notice he’s one of the only leaders in the world who consistently puts God at the forefront. He does it all the time. This is one reason why the Muslims consider Iran to be the purist Islamic state. Sorry if that gives you Islamophobes the shits, but I have no idea why, when you read what he said above.
Hang on a minute- one of my degrees is in History…
That’s wonderful Longknives. So tell us, precisely how many countries has Iran invaded since 1700? And precisely how many countries has (a) the US and (b) Israel invaded in that same period of time?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:49 pm
Dear Pete George, @ 8.28
your problem is that i do get it. That is your huge problem
You have been found out.
i have found you out.
You made a mistake. For the first time in your life you committed to one point of view.
Now you twist and squirm, trying to turn back time and revert to your always safe position on both sides.
Too late.
You can insult me by bastardising my non de plume but that really doesn’t earn you any points.
In fact it just reveals your true colours.
There are none.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:49 pm
Reid:Do you think the term “anti-semitism” is thrown about quite often and used as a propaganda term in the sense that someone who criticises the state of Israel is often labelled anti-semetic when all they’re doing is criticising the govt of Israel?
This is true. But it goes the other way too. Some people who purport to merely be criticising the Israeli government are doing so because they are anti-semitic.
The US and the west doesn’t support the Al-Qa-ida thugs who took down Libya and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the thugs who are today operating in Syria today, do they. Of course they do
The west didn’t support Al-qaeda in Libya and they aren’t supporting them in Syria either. One of the reasons the US and the EU aren’t keen on supplying weapons to the rebels in Syria is precisely because of the possibility that they might end up in the hands of jihadists.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 8:53 pm
Reid, don’t be a sap.
You’re looking at his speech with a western understanding of God and peace.
Ahmadinejad’s “god” is Allah, the god of Islam, and the “peace” he talks about can only come about by the submission and subjugation of the world. “Islam” literally means “submission”.
Vote:This is the same man bent on the destruction of Israel and the U.S and who thinks that violence and destruction will hasten the return of the Mahdi.
September 29th, 2012 at 8:57 pm
Quite the salivating Ahmadinejad fanboy aren’t you Reid?
Tell me- have you got his autograph yet? That poster over your bed??
I don’t give a flying rat’s arse what your hero said to the joke that is the United Nations. Anyone with any knowledge of History (or any nous whatsoever) will tell you that the League of Nations is a pitiful joke…
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:02 pm
Some people who purport to merely be criticising the Israeli government are doing so because they are anti-semitic.
Really? I’ve never heard or read anyone who did that, I’m not saying it doesn’t happen I’m sure it does, but do you have a major example? Someone who calls Israel the zionist entity doesn’t count, in case you think it does.
The west did support Al-Qa’ida in Libya and they are supporting them in Syria, look it up. It may not be on Fox or CNN, but it’s just a google away.
I’m aware the public line is as you say re: the weapons, but they give them intelligence on where the local govt caches are which they proceed to raid, with or without special forces help. And of course they don’t ship them Nato weapons, there are plenty of arms dealers with Russian stocks. It’s who pays for them which is what counts. And since they no longer use Universal Exports as the front company, your intrepid FoxNews war correspondent isn’t likely to stumble onto the story, are they. It’s all about plausible deniability chiz. And as we all know, that’s just code for vapid bullshit.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:11 pm
but it’s just a google away
Apparently no one has ever explained this to you before so it falls to me to point this out: not everything you read on the internet is true.
but they give them intelligence on where the local govt caches are which they proceed to raid
After 9/11, the US and the EU are NOT assisting or aiding Al-qaeda in anyway. They are not going to take the risk. We’ve already seen what happened in Libya where assistance wasn’t controlled very well with the result that arms eventually ended up in the hands of jihadists anyway and subsequently caused problems in Mali. The west is not directly or indirectly supporting jihadists in Syria. If you have read on some website that they are supporting jihadists then you should take that as a sign that that website isn’t reliable.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:14 pm
Just while i’m waiting to see if there is any response from Pete George to being found out.
Why would otherwise sane people try to educate Reid regarding the middle east situation ?
His ilk will still be apologising for western civilization as the true believers sodomise him and drag his
Vote:corpse through the streets.
That’s how they will thank him for his support.
September 29th, 2012 at 9:15 pm
This is the same man bent on the destruction of Israel and the U.S and who thinks that violence and destruction will hasten the return of the Mahdi.
Do you know him personally Fletch or did Bill O’Reilly tell you that when he was interviewing the US Defence Secretary?
Quite the salivating Ahmadinejad fanboy aren’t you Reid?
No not especially Longknives but I call bullshit when I see it and the Iran-nuke-hysteria is A-grade manufactured bullshit from start to finish just exactly the same as AGW is. I also know that an attack on Iran is not going to be some localised conflict which won’t touch us, it will set the world ablaze. You will see massive car bombs and terrorist attacks in cities all over the western world. Tens of thousands of white people will die. And this is not just ragheads Longknives, these are REAL people just like you and me. Who knows, maybe your kid will be blown up in an Auckland terrorist bombing. And it’s all unnecessary because as I have said since day one, where is the evidence apart from hallucination and fantasy, that just because Iran gets a weapon it will automatically use it. I have repeated the logic so many times I’m sick of it and not once has anyone ever been able to poke a hole in it. MAD applies. Even if Iran has a nuke. What the fuck about that, doesn’t every single person in the whole fucking world, understand? So why go to war? Because Isweal says so? What the fuck has happened to people’s logical capacity that as soon as Isweal SAYS it’s under threat, whether or not logic and facts and REALITY says so, that every single person in the whole world grovels around and wrings their hands and rends their clothes and cries for poor widdle Isweal, yes, we will save you, widdle Iswael, you’ve NEVER hurt anyone ever. You’re a fucking victim. Your enemies are my enemies forever and ever and ever and ever.
Seriously. That’s what the world actually, truly, in fact does. I prefer actual reality, myself. That’s why I take the position I have for the last ten years.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:15 pm
“…Do you think Ahmadinejad’s meeting with those Jewish leaders in NY was anti-semetic?…”
Yes.
“….In November 2006 Mohammad Hassan Rahimian, the representative of the Iranian SupremeLeader, who stands even higher in the Iranian hierarchy than Ahmadinejad,stated that, “the Jew is the most stubborn enemy of the believers. And the decisive war will decide the fate of humanity…”
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:27 pm
Harriet perhaps you mis-understood. I linked to a video above @ 7:09 showing NZ Jews meeting with Ahmadinejad. That’s what I was referring to. Here it is again.
Israeli leaders meet Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in NYC [and explain the difference between real Jews and Zionists]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCw-oWp1wf8&feature=player_embedded
So I’m not too sure what this has to do with your quote. I’d also suggest you have a look at another link in the 7:09 which gives the timeline back to the 1990′s of the bullshit “Iran will have a nuke in the next 5 mins” allegations, it might help. Also, what provocative statements have the zionist leadership of Israel been making toward Iran for all those years, and do you think if I did a quick google I could find an even more inflammatory comment from the zionists about Iran?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:31 pm
Yeah right, found out. I still haven’t found out what you’re going on about beweal. Do you agree with BR:
Do you agree with 2ndAmendment?
Do you agree with Conservative Party policy?
Or are you going to sit on the fence patting yourself on the back?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:36 pm
“….Also, what provocative statements have the zionist leadership of Israel been making toward Iran for all those years, and do you think if I did a quick google I could find an even more inflammatory comment from the zionists about Iran?…”
NO…..’cos here’s another from ya munted idol Reid!
“…..He reiterated this belief in his most recent speech at the United Nations in September 2007:
“The age of darkness will end”, he enthused to the General Assembly and “the peoples in Europe and America will be liberated from the burdens the Zionists have inflicted on them”.
So let me now sum up on this final point: There are other dictatorships in the world. But only in Iran are the fantasy-worlds of anti semitism and religious mission linked with technological megalomania and the physics of mass destruction. The specific danger presented by the Iranian nuclear option stems from the unique ideological atmosphere surrounding it – a mixture of holy war and high-tec, of anti semitism and weapons-grade uranium, of death-wish and missile research, of Shiite messianism and plutonium….”
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:50 pm
Pride and shame are the two pillars that hold up the entire Muslim/Arab world.
You can’t reason with them Reid.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 9:54 pm
“You will see massive car bombs and terrorist attacks in cities all over the western world. Tens of thousands of white people will die.”
What a strange comment- What about peaceful people of other ethnicities? Are they somehow immune to bombings? Arent we always bleating on about being a “Multicultural Society”??
“Who knows, maybe your kid will be blown up in an Auckland terrorist bombing.”
Vote:Morbid stuff Reid- Thankfully I don’t have any children…Are you masturbating over these bombing fantasies? Because I find them rather odd..
September 29th, 2012 at 9:56 pm
Stick a pig, listen to him squeal.
Struck a raw nerve there did i Pete ?
Answering a question with a question is a pathetic response.
Pete made it three out of three.
P.S. Pete.
Vote:My non de plume is ‘bereal’
Bastardising it may score points for you in your mind.
Still, if thats all you have, …
September 29th, 2012 at 9:58 pm
That’s a wimp out. You whinge but you don’t front up. As usual.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:04 pm
Good nite Pete,
Good luck to you, and to your family.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:12 pm
Firstly Harriet, Israel’s the one with the actual nukes, missiles, biologicals, chemicals, weaons-grade uranium and plutonium.
According to a lot of people in Israeli and US intelligence, Iran doesn’t in fact have anything except missiles. Isn’t that a shame for whatever the hell it is you’re attempting to say.
What is wrong with some people that they hallucinate that Iran is some sort of mad mullah’s desert fiefdom where the only one who gets a say is the Ayatollah who lives in a tent with his horses? That’s what some seem to hallucinate Iran is Harriet and it’s funny, because that’s precisely what western propaganda since the hostage crisis has taught through media associations to all those western people who are incapable of independent thinking because their tiny minds can’t accommodate more than a few compatible ideas lest the cognitive dissonance seep in and hurt their tummies.
It’s a shame really, the whole interweb thingy with all the answers it offers, is completely lost on such people. They probably just use it for social media purposes so they can explain to all their fabulous friends they’ve just finished breakfast and now they’re on their way to whatever, but just before they do they just need to pop in brush their teeth and they’ll be back in just a jif to resume their mindless twittering. At least people like you Harriet have made it to a political blog. Compared to those people that’s like earning a Ph.D and yet oddly, just like those people you still haven’t dropped that mindless propaganda those other people aren’t even aware they’ve been inculcated with, and that’s a shame.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:13 pm
Reid #
There was no such thing as a suicide bomber up to about 20yrs ago.
There were no recorded suicide bombings in the entire afganistan/russian war. Bin Laden fought in most of that war.So too did others who went on to become the Taliban.
Even in the 70′s planes were only ever hi-jacked and demands were always made for themselves to survive.Sometimes ‘shootouts’ happened, but that is not nesseceraly suicide.
Tell us what all the ME demands are Reid – to secure enduring peace?
I know one of them: Recognition of Israel to exist!
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:19 pm
Longknives it was phrased like that since a lot of people who are on your side of the debate don’t seem to understand Arabs and Iranians are also human, just like us and a lot of people who are your side of the debate also seem to imagine that an Iran attack will just be a bigger version of Libya and Syria but it won’t mean a whole hell of lot to them. But they’re completely wrong, on both counts.
Harriet it’s now 11:15 daylight saving time so I’m not going to enter into the ME peace resolution process with you right now. Sorry about that.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:20 pm
I meant to add in that last post that suicide is fanaticism. For what? What is the great demand that you would give your life for? And kill a hundred or two fellow Muslims in the process?
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:24 pm
There is no hallucination Reid. Ahmadinajad, Khamanei and other “mad mullahs” are on record as to their beliefs. And Iran’s poor human rights record is also well recorded.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 10:50 pm
Well, that was a pleasant Saturday night – one not spent on Kiwiblog that is. And what do I find upon returning the cyberworld ….?
Too true, and there’s a great example of that in this thread, where Luc Hansen is so obsessed, as usual, with the Jews that he unloads the following comment …
… about an article that Totten writes on Morocco. Rather than actually comment on the whole point and focus of the article – that Morocco is a Muslim Middle Eastern nation that has made progress on democracy, civil liberties and all-round modernity – Luc simply uses it as as a crutch to dump out all his standard, far-left diatribes and prejudices: Jewish ‘apartheid’, the evil USA, oil, and of course Islamophobia. Precisely the things that Morocco seems to not waste time obsessing about. There may be a lesson there.
It’s those sorts of unthinking, kneejerk, soundbites that have gained Luc the low reputation for debate that he has on this blog. He should have stayed in the front lines of protests, as in his good old pro-Ho Chi Minh days, where the only requirement is mindlessly bellowing slogans, banging the empty skin drum known as his head.
Vote:September 29th, 2012 at 11:13 pm
“people who are on your side of the debate don’t seem to understand Arabs and Iranians are also human”
Yep- That’s the problem. Humans by nature are violent,warmongering animals….
Vote:And at this particular point in time your beloved Muslims (the type that take great delight in blowing innocent people up..Durka Durka) are the most fucking violent,aggressive and dangerous people on the planet.
As far as I’m concerned they must be stopped, using any method necessary- much like the Nazis had to be stopped 70 years ago…
September 30th, 2012 at 12:06 am
Bereal
Vote:That’s all Pete Does.
Asks “nice” questions.
September 30th, 2012 at 12:11 am
Reid (11,737) Says:
September 29th, 2012 at 6:22 pm
Harriet, isn’t it curious then that Christians live peaceably in Iran alongside all those angry Muslims?
Reid you are joking aren’t you?
or are you pig stupid. Nah you’re not that.
No other faith is able to live peaceably in IRAN, they are abused daily and most would like to get out.
Vote:But then you know that don’t you, pillock.
September 30th, 2012 at 1:03 am
*Sigh*
Pete George, I see on your website you have written that the Conservative Party’s policy is ‘extreme’, whatever that means. You quote:
What’s extreme about this? It’s actually very difficult to criticise it properly, because they have stated that “the rights of citizens to defend themselves and their property” need to be clarified, and “Only in the rarest and most extreme circumstances should law abiding citizens find themselves facing charges arising out of situations where they have protected themselves against criminals …” and that those circumstances should be clearly stated in legislation.
So where’s the problem? Until you know what the Conservative Party defines as “rare and most extreme circumstances”, it’s rather difficult to criticise it.
Seems to me you’re trying to beat this up to support yourself.
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 1:17 am
graham – it’s very easy to criticise such loose policy.
The problem is they have loosely defined it, leaving it up for interpretation. And some are interpretating it as an extreme policy, one that will allow virtual open slather – or open slaughter.
Their policy should make it clear what they actually intend, if they leave it open to interpretation it will be interpreted however people want to see it.
In any case unless they can get majority support for any of their policies they won’t get anywhere with them, especially if they do have extreme intentions.
Or are Conservatives deliberately appealing to certain constituencies without any intention of delivering what they want?
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 1:41 am
You mean like United Future?
Some of UF’s policies which they obviously hope will appeal to the “had-enough-of-the-Maori-gravy-train” folks:
- Establish a new national day on which all New Zealanders celebrate the unique gift we possess by being part of this nation. This will be separate from Waitangi Day, which will also be retained and celebrated.
- Commit to the goal of 2014 for the settlement of outstanding historical grievances, and resource the claims process to ensure that this becomes a reality.
- Ensure that settlements fit within the norms of a modern liberal democratic society – i.e. they should not give one class of citizens’ greater rights than others but should recognize the unique place that hapü, whänau and iwi have had in our country.
Do let me know when those policies get passed.
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 7:43 am
This shameless liar could become the scapegoat: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0912/81808.html
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 7:46 am
graham, the reality for small parties is that IF they can get into a coalition arrangement they can only progress some of their policies, so they have to prioritise, and the policies they promote have to be compatible with a majority of parliament.
UF put a priority on getting a Super discussion going, which they have achieved.
Act put forward fiscal restraint legislation that looks like failing because neither the Maori Party nor UF will support it, as is their right. That’s the nature of coalition politics.
None of Act, UF or National promoted ToW policies.
The Conservative Party have a reasonable chance of making the threshold and getting into parliament, in part due to vague policies that appeal to some extreme voters, but I think they will struggle to get anywhere near sufficient support for their ‘castle doctrine’ policy.
If the Conservatives get a reasonable bloc of MPs and can form a coalition with National, and possible Act and UF, and if they promote ToW policies as a priority, they have more chance of success there.
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 7:47 am
UnitedFuture’s “policy” can be surmised from the whorish Dunne’s motto: “It does not matter what as long as I’m made a Minister“.
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 8:00 am
Manolo – Dunne is often criticised (usually by disgruntled supporters of failures) for being one of the most successful MPs of the last few decades. Isn’t that the prime aim of being in parliament, to be in a position to actually do things in Government?
Tell me which MPs you think don’t aspire to be ministers. And which parties don’t aspire to be in Government.
Vote:September 30th, 2012 at 3:46 pm
An earlier post from Reid
Do you know BTW that one of the scenarios is that Iran already has nukes courtesy of the Chinese (notice that IF that’s true, they haven’t used them, have they, which kinda puts you Islamphobes out to lunch, doesn’t it). But IF Israel attacks it, Iran will use them. (Notice that they didn’t use them before, which kinda etc…) And there’s a limited nuclear exchange in the ME.
So what is it Reid,they do have the bomb that Afterdinnerjacket keeps saying they haven’t and are not pursuing? Isn’t that support for a bald faced liar? I’d rather he said we have the bomb,keep away. Why all the denial? Why all the secrecy,whom do you trust? The Wisconsin Project information given their bias etc and the UN reports are hard to brush off. Do you honestly believe that the fickle west will do anything more than send a Chamberlain-plot archetypal maid sympathiser to Iran who will no doubt return with a Peace in our time promise. Gives you time to dig a shelter and stock up on bags of Fuller’s earth.
Vote: