Egypt gets closer to civil war

August 15th, 2013 at 10:00 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

Security forces stormed two huge Cairo protests by supporters of ’s ousted president Mohamed Morsi, prompting the resignation of vice president Mohamed ElBaradei and sparking nationwide violence which left at least 149 people dead.

With clashes breaking out across the country and rioting erupting in Egypt’s second city Alexandria, Egypt’s army-installed authorities declared a month-long state of emergency effective from 4:00 pm Wednesday (2am Thursday NZ time).

They also slapped Cairo and other provinces with curfews between 7:00 pm and 6:00 am.

Gory photographs and video images of the Cairo bloodbath dominated social media networks as world powers called for restraint and condemned the show of force by Egypt’s security forces.

Four churches were attacked in Egypt, with Christian activists accusing Morsi loyalists of waging “a war of retaliation against Copts in Egypt”.

The violence is not just between the Army and the Muslim Brotherhood. The Brotherhood is also attacking Coptic churches.

But the anger against the Islamist movement was evident Wednesday as residents of several neighbourhoods clashed with Morsi loyalists.

Clashes also erupted between security forces and Morsi loyalists in the northern provinces of Alexandria and Beheira, the canal provinces of Suez and Ismailiya and the central provinces of Assiut and Menya.

In Alexandria, hundreds of angry Morsi supporters marched through the streets armed with wooden clubs chanting “Morsi is my president”.

An AFP reporter said the protesters set fire to car tyres and tore down pictures of army chief Abdel Fattah al-Sisi, who was behind the Islamist leader’s July 3 overthrow.

At one cafe where Sisi’s picture was hanging, they smashed the doors and beat up the patrons as they shouted “Sisi is a killer”.

It is difficult to see how Egypt can return to having a democratically elected President, who is seen as legitimate by the overwhelming majority of the country.

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26 Responses to “Egypt gets closer to civil war”

  1. Manolo (13,357 comments) says:

    It seems all this shit happens in countries ruled by the vile religion of peace, e.g., Lybia, Egypt, Syria, Irak, Iran, Sudan, Mali, etc.

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  2. Alan (1,062 comments) says:

    I’m going to go out on a limb here and say who cares?

    We have no strategic interests in Egypt other than call centres; there’s no energy concerns, suez will stay open..

    The days when the west cared or would intervene in these situations are gone.

    Its just not that important to anyone in geopolitical terms, same as Syria.

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  3. anonymouse (695 comments) says:

    @Alan, Fodafone abandoned its Egypt call center experiment after the 2011 uprising,

    NZ sells about 380 million in Dairy to Egypt, but not much else,

    The country with the biggest strategic interest in Egypt is Israel, as if Egypt seriously goes seriously south the border to Gaza will melt and there will no controls on who or what enters…..

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  4. backster (2,076 comments) says:

    The Army should Sub divide the nation and relocate according to religion as I believe was done in India-Pakistan.

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  5. RRM (9,445 comments) says:

    You know what I like about islamic countries?

    Nothing.

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  6. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    I wonder who Obama will support this time, after supporting the destabilisation of the country by the radical Muslim Brotherhood ? I wonder why Obama is working so hard to destroy the countries surrounding Israel, that is the real question ?

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  7. jims_whare (398 comments) says:

    Looks like the Arab Spring is heading back to Winter

    Arabs – if they aren’t fighting and killing foreigners they are fighting and killing each other

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  8. Scott (1,707 comments) says:

    I couldn’t agree more Kea. The West has got a lot to answer for with their support of insurgents in Syria, Egypt and Libya. The West has overthrown Mubarak in Egypt and Gadaffi in Libya and is trying to overthrow Assad in Syria. To what purpose? The so-called Arab spring has just been an excuse to elect radical Islamists who oppress the people and persecute minorities, particularly the Christians.

    The churches have just been hammered in Egypt and Syria and Libya as a result of Western intervention.Thousands of Christians have had to leave the Middle East and try and find asylum in Europe. None of those dictators were wonderful leaders, don’t get me wrong. But at least they oversaw a stable country and there was some rule of law.

    Why President Obama would support the radical Muslims is beyond me?

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  9. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    jims_whare, you mean fighting and killing the foreigners who invade their country ? It shows how effective propoganda is that resistance to invasion is seen as aggression. Even the Muslim Brotherhood is a movement made up of imported Jihadists, and backed by the USA.

    If Iran did in Israel, what the USA is doing in Afghanistan, would we see the Israelis who fought the invasion portrayed as the bad guys in our media ?

    Wake up and think !

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  10. Andrei (2,500 comments) says:

    Obama has supported and encouraged the destabilization of the ME – Vladimir Putin has opposed this and has warned of the consequences.

    Why do you think Obama has been going on about Gay Rights in Russia in the last few days – its a distraction from the mess he has created and to divert from what Putin has been saying

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  11. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Scott, I agree and I really have no idea why Obama slaughters Muslims in some places, while backing the most radical Muslim zealots in other places. I can only speculate that the goal is to weaken those countries, but that is just a guess.

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  12. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    You know what I like about islamic countries?

    Nothing.

    RRM, the countries of the Middle East are where Christianity came from. The exact same ones described as “Muslim”. They claim Mohamad was the last prophet and the perfected way of god. To descredit their views is to also decredit Christianity, which they also invented.

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  13. Chthoniid (2,028 comments) says:

    It is difficult to see how Egypt can return to having a democratically elected President, who is seen as legitimate by the overwhelming majority of the country.

    I would like to nominate this as the “2013 Understatement of the Year”

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  14. Scott (1,707 comments) says:

    Kea – you are quite right that the countries of North Africa and around the Middle East were very Christian until overrun by Moslem conquest. It is often not appreciated how old Christianity is in Egypt for example. The Coptic Christians have been there for millennia. Under President Mubarak there was at least the rule of law and the local Christians and Moslems seemed to coexist reasonably peacefully. Once the Moslem brotherhood was elected violence and mayhem increased and the local Christians have suffered incredible persecution. What we are seeing is not an Arab spring involving any rise in democracy. What we are seeing is a resurgent Islam back to its old tricks of persecuting religious minorities, particularly the Christians.

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  15. jims_whare (398 comments) says:

    “RRM, the countries of the Middle East are where Christianity came from. The exact same ones described as “Muslim”. They claim Mohamad was the last prophet and the perfected way of god. To descredit their views is to also decredit Christianity, which they also invented.”

    Umm I think you need to study a little history Kea as you make yourself more the fool with your one eyed and inane statements.

    Christianity predates Islam by several centuries and did not originate from ‘muslim middle east countries.’

    I won’t say anything more than that you should get learn to engage brain before typing .

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  16. mavxp (494 comments) says:

    I can only hope the Army will establish a secular dictatorship (as Ataturk did in Turkey), and then set about a long process of aiming for democracy in a few decades time after the establishment of strong secular institutions and constitution. If they set up the country based on secular principles that treat everyone fairly regardless of religion, Egypt may come out of this better off. Let their politics be arguments between left and right, not Islamic and Christian.

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  17. Manolo (13,357 comments) says:

    @Kea, your Muslim proclivities are letting you down. I advise you to read a few history books.

    I’m an atheist without time for myth, but you will have to concede nothing surpasses Islam as the vilest of all cults. These violent and backward-looking people are still anchored in the 7th century.

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  18. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Manolo, there is nothing “Muslim” about me. If you are referring to my ties to the land in which Christianity arose and the fact I was raised in a Christian family, then you would be on more solid ground.

    I agree that currently Muslims are the ones causing most problems all around the world. When you look back a little further you will see a different story.

    I do not pre-judge people on the religion they were born into. I speak as I find. I do not have any atheist friends I can think of off-hand. I do have Muslim, Buddhist, New Age, Christian, Hindu, Jewish friends. None of them dislike each other and all think I am strange for being an atheist. :)

    The new agers are the only ones I argue with about spirtual matters. They are painful !

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  19. iMP (2,236 comments) says:

    Queue the great Obama Cairo speech followed by the Nobel Peace Prize. (Ahem…something caught in throat!).

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  20. sbk (308 comments) says:

    @mavxp “the Army will establish a secular dictatorship”…i may be wrong but havn’t the Egyptians already tried this?…but regardless,Egypt is fucked…if the Brotherhood regains power,it is all over for the tourist trade…(besides the fuckers will tear down anything worth visiting) and if they dont…its civil war…Islam takes no prisoners,it is all or nothing… and they smell blood.

    But interesting to note that the Brotherhood claim to have the goods on Obama(if ?,then probably Mossad also)……..

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  21. Pita (366 comments) says:

    “Arabs – if they aren’t fighting and killing foreigners they are fighting and killing each other”

    It reminds me of the tale when Morsi was a student in America; a big fan of Star Trek, Morsi met Gene Roddenberry and asked
    “Why, on the obviously multicultural starship, were there no Arabs?”

    “That” replied Roddenberry “Is because star trek is set in the future!”

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  22. Scott (1,707 comments) says:

    Some news about what is really happening in Egypt from the Christian Daily-
    “Days after the overthrow of Morsi, the supreme leader of the Muslim Brotherhood, Muhammad Badie, was first to attack by name Coptic Pope Tawadros for supporting the popular June 30 Revolution, which saw tens of millions of Egyptians take to the streets.
    After Badie’s demonization of the Copts, assaults on Christians began in earnest. Many churches were attacked and burned and several Christians were murdered in Upper Egypt; over in the Sinai, a young Coptic priest was shot dead, while the body of Magdy Lam‘i Habib, a Christian, was found mutilated and beheaded.

    This anti-Christian fury is far from sated and has taken on genocidal proportions.

    While Al Jazeera was covering (and distorting) events in Egypt, a Libyan man named Tamar Rashad called in and said “I want to offer the good news to [Pope] Tawadros that, Allah willing, the day is coming when no Copt will ever again tread the ground of Egypt – and no churches. We will no longer allow churches to exist.”

    When the TV host appeared to protest, Rashad interrupted him saying, “It’s already decided, take your cameras and go to the churches and you’ll see what’s going to happen soon, Allah willing.”
    - See more at: http://mychristiandaily.com/index.php/uk/186-generic-news-5-7/7272-al-qaeda-flag-flies-high-above-christian-churches#sthash.OExDqyqM.dpuf

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  23. Jinky (170 comments) says:

    I visited Cairo last year. The ordinary people were warm and friendly. Pyramids are even more awesome up close. It’s a very odd place, Seldom saw men in traditional clothing but you’ see them walking down the road/around hotel in the Lacoste shirt, designer jeans, trainers and sunglasses with his wife behind covered head to toe, teenage kids decked out like any other pop obsessed Californian. Weird shit. Same with the news on TV now. Male protesters/rioters look exctly like those in the UK ones a few years back but the women are in burqas.

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  24. Rufus (621 comments) says:

    The Muslim Brotherhood is very good at portraying itself as the victim here – it knows exactly how the lamestream media operates and which buttons they push. And the media laps it up.

    What is not so well known is that this violence was planned for some time. Previous mass demonstrations (Tahrir square 2011 and early 2013) were, for the most part, relatively peaceful. Muslim Brotherhood demostrations in the last 6 weeks or so have been characterized by vocal calls for violence against the military, the government, minorities (read Coptic Christians, the ones at the bottom of the totem pole that invariably get it in the neck every time), etc.

    The Muslim Brotherhood have been fomenting violence for some time now, and people have been preparing. First aid/triage stations were being set up before the violence started – people knew it was coming, and soon.

    They had a choice which route to go down, and they chose violence. They chose to loot and burn and kill. They chose to go on a rampage.

    They invited a military response by their actions. I think they didn’t expect the response to be so harsh.

    The ensuing military-actioned carnage is terrible and not right – but I do not for one believe that the protesters didn’t have it coming.

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  25. Yoza (1,536 comments) says:

    Glen Greenwald retweets:

    @billmon1
    Obama admin: We strongly condemn the non-military non-crackdown by the non-junta that staged the non-coup in Egypt.

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  26. Yoza (1,536 comments) says:

    The ensuing military-actioned carnage is terrible and not right – but I do not for one believe that the protesters didn’t have it coming.

    I too am not one who would deny that those who do not accept responsibility for acts which they cannot be held accountable are guilty of anything less than that which would be acceptable to any reasonable person who wasn’t affected by an unaccountable lack of common sense following the time the event occurred.

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