Brown confirms he acted as a referee for his mistress

October 17th, 2013 at 12:30 pm by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

Auckland mayor has confirmed he provided a reference for his ex-mistress to help her get a job at the council-run art gallery.

Bevan Chuang – with whom Mr Brown admitted to a two-year affair – received a reference from him when she successfully applied for a job at the gallery in August last year.

This was a year after she and Mr Brown started their affair.

This confirmation adds a new dimension. It is bad judgement to agree to be a referee to anyone you’re in a covert relationship with. But to agree to it, when they are applying for a job at an art gallery that is part of the Council you are the Mayor of is shockingly bad judgement.

Nick Smith resigned for providing a personal letter of support for Bronwyn Pullar, as that had a conflict of interest.  Nick’s letter wasn’t even advocating that she get compensation or a job – just stating how successful she was before her accident.

The mayor’s office is still considering questions from the Herald about how Mr Brown dealt with the issue in terms of the council’s code of conduct and conflict of interest policy.

Badly, I’d say.

I’d say it is inevitable that someone will file a complaint that Mayor Brown has not complied with the Council’s code of conduct and conflict of interest policy.

Providing a reference for your mistress for a job at an organisation that is part of the Auckland Council is incredibly dumb. He should have just said no.

Tags: ,

184 Responses to “Brown confirms he acted as a referee for his mistress”

  1. Andrew (83 comments) says:

    I suspect that, given the fact he was cheating on his wife, providing a reference was like a drop in the bucket.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 21 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  2. Colville (2,261 comments) says:

    I’d say it is inevitable that someone will file a complaint that Mayor Brown has not complied with the Council’s code of conduct and conflict of interest policy.

    Especially now that a few thousand people will read this and think “shit, that is a great idea!”

    :-)

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 26 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  3. Ed Snack (1,851 comments) says:

    The other sins are of a sort of personal nature, but this, this is surely prima facie unacceptable behaviour. Of course Len is firmly of the belief that there’s one set of rules for the great unwashed; and another far more lenient set for the elite like him, but this is for me the point where he should be forced to resign.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 27 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  4. berend (1,705 comments) says:

    DPF: Providing a reference for your mistress for a job at an organisation that is part of the Auckland Council is incredibly dumb.

    Let he who has never been dumb cast the first stone.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 2 Thumb down 29 You need to be logged in to vote
  5. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    This just confirms how wet Lying Lennie is.

    You’d get a senior staff member to sign off the reference.

    People in positions of authority should never be doing this anyway let alone when she was knob polishing

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 28 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  6. Colville (2,261 comments) says:

    Andrew.
    I think Brown could live thru this if he had been shagging someone totally unrelated to his work but when he uses his name and position to get his lady friend a job (which she got sacked from a month later) that is abuse of power and very poor judgement.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 36 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  7. Harriet (4,857 comments) says:

    It’s starting to make her look like a whore…..getting paid one way or the other for ‘services in kind’.

    Ain’t Brown smart……..getting the rate payers to pay for it!

    Vote: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  8. Peter (1,700 comments) says:

    It will be Whale Oils fault, somehow.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 23 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  9. Redbaiter (8,558 comments) says:

    Nope- leave it alone.

    This is done and Len has won.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 18 You need to be logged in to vote
  10. Lance (2,635 comments) says:

    @Peter
    No
    It’s mostly National’s fault with Whale Oil as an accomplice.

    Get with the program.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  11. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Still got the books to audit – paper trails ,love ‘em

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  12. kowtow (8,326 comments) says:

    ‘He should have just said no”

    In’t that at the heart of so many problems?

    Vote: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  13. Urban Redneck (234 comments) says:

    The “liberal” Left are circling the wagons around Len and they don’t hold to any standards of behaviour – virtually anything can be justified to gain/retain political power.

    Such standards only apply to political enemies. (Alinsky Rule #4 – make your enemies live up to their own set of rules)

    The likely upshot of this is that it will go the way of most of Slater’s scoops. The perps (in this case Len) will get away with it and Slater will end up looking like the dork. (As Emmerson’s merciless lampooning in the Herald is already demonstrating)

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 29 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  14. Adolf Fiinkensein (2,889 comments) says:

    Drip, drip, drip, drip, drip…………………………………..

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  15. Redbaiter (8,558 comments) says:

    So right UR. Slater is just another leftist in that he doesn’t know that if there is any laxity from Brown it is manifested in his untrustworthiness.

    His disloyalty to his wife and family transfers into potential disloyalty to his supporters/ voters. That is the only hit on Brown available to the right but most of them (Slater especially) are so infested with Progressivism they can’t see it.

    So they ignore the one thing they can get him on and go for a whole bunch of off putting salacious detail and wonder why it backfires on them.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  16. gump (1,638 comments) says:

    I find it more interesting that she has a recent conviction for dishonesty.

    I’m still waiting for somebody to explain why C&R didn’t consider this a barrier to electoral representation.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  17. Colville (2,261 comments) says:

    I assume someone is going over Lens Council credit card statements with a magnifying glass?

    Vote: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  18. Elaycee (4,378 comments) says:

    I can but wonder the MSM reaction if the person at the centre of this fiasco was not actually Mayor Brown, but one of the senior staffers within Council (for example, CEO Doug McKay). I’m sure there would be howls of indignation and a chorus of calls for his resignation – and rightly so.

    Because, if the CEO had promoted / recommended his mistress of over a year for a role within another Council owned entity, then the CEO would be sacked. No question.

    So why should it be any different just because the person at the centre of this storm, is the Mayor?

    The silence is deafening

    Vote: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  19. radvad (755 comments) says:

    If this affair is so private why is “2 minute Len” using publicly funded spin weasels to try to extract him from the “private” mess he is responsible for?

    Vote: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  20. tvb (4,366 comments) says:

    Brown will get away with this because there is NO mechanism to fire him. He is bullet proof for 3 years unless he becomes insane bankrupt or commits a serious offence. This is none of those so he can just sit it out which I predict he will do. The position for Ministers is different because they hold office at the pleasure of the Governor General which means the PM.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  21. radvad (755 comments) says:

    Let’s be honest guys, aren’t we all having fun?

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  22. Manolo (13,590 comments) says:

    Go, lecherous and CORRUPT Len, just go!

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  23. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    I don’t want len gone.

    I want him there everyday and I want him reminded everyday and asked ‘ Had a pull in ya office today Len.’ Any where we can’t go today Len ? I don’t want to stumble across you nailing some staffer.”

    Leave him there and just give him arseholes

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 24 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  24. Ashley Schaeffer (475 comments) says:

    Ref checker: “Can you tell us why you think Bevan would be suitable for this position.”
    Pants Down: “In my experience Bevan is suitable for any position really. I believe she can turn her hand to anything.”
    Ref checker: “A good fit then?”
    Pants Down: “(cough) Yep.”

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 25 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  25. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    If true, this certainly changes my mind about Brown’s situation. I still believe politicans are entitled to keep their private lives private, but in this case there seems to be a clear abuse of power. Brown should go.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  26. Elaycee (4,378 comments) says:

    I wonder if the Health and Safety people at Council will place a box containing latex gloves outside the Mayoral office – complete with a sign : Visitor Use”?

    I wouldn’t want to shake Brown’s hand – it would be hard to tell if he just had sweaty palms or…. [gulp] 8O

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  27. Alan (1,087 comments) says:

    @Colville

    “I assume someone is going over Lens Council credit card statements with a magnifying glass?”

    Len doesn’t have a council credit card. Never has as mayor of Auckland.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  28. Chuck Bird (4,848 comments) says:

    i would like him to go on TV and do to his dick what he did to his credit card and then I would believe he was remorseful.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  29. liarbors a joke (1,069 comments) says:

    heh..death by a thousand cuts..poor old Len

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  30. Tom Jackson (2,553 comments) says:

    This would have mattered more yesterday.

    Now it’s come out that Palino’s staff have been manipulating this woman for political gain. She’s even provided the text messages to the paper to prove it.

    That’s worse than the supposed crime.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 15 You need to be logged in to vote
  31. liarbors a joke (1,069 comments) says:

    What do Len Brown and Kodak film have in common ?

    They both used to come in yellow boxes…

    Vote: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  32. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Yes, Tom but Palino’s staff don’t hold any public office do they?

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  33. swan (665 comments) says:

    No Tom,

    Palino has been tarnished – agreed. But Brown now is in a world of trouble.

    With Palino and Brown out of the way, does this open the door to Stephen Berry winning the mayoralty?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  34. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    The world has gone crazy – We have a politician in court for breaking electoral funding laws and a lefty Mayor admitting the things he was accused of ….

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  35. kiwi in america (2,428 comments) says:

    My money’s still on Brown toughing it out. Listening to Webster and Anae breezily dismissing the affair and criticizing George Wood (former North Shore City Mayor) on Nine To Noon with Kathryn Ryan dropping her usual even handed approach a tad was a reflection of the establishment left’s position.

    The referee revelation shortens the odds of a resignation. If more women come forward with tales of a quick naughty on the mayoral desk, it might be the straw that breaks the camel’s back.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  36. Tom Jackson (2,553 comments) says:

    Yes, Tom but Palino’s staff don’t hold any public office do they?

    Only because they couldn’t bully Bev Chuang to state before the election that she’d been humping Brown.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 12 You need to be logged in to vote
  37. tamati (75 comments) says:

    This is clearly a far bigger deal.

    Brown provides a character reference for his mistress, for a council organisation. His mistress is later FIRED from the Art Gallery for hacking into her bosses email.

    IMO this is far bigger than the mere fact he was cheating on his wife!

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  38. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    If true, this certainly changes my mind about Brown’s situation. I still believe politicans are entitled to keep their private lives private, but in this case there seems to be a clear abuse of power. Brown should go.

    Well done for not being tribal. Yoza and the aptly initialled SS take note

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  39. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    She was fired from the Museum, not the art gallery tamati. You almost had a scoop!

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  40. Dean Papa (784 comments) says:

    Len may have been the referee, but it was bev blowing the whistle.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 23 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  41. TomYum (23 comments) says:

    Good old Len… rooting for Auckland since ages ago.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  42. PhilP (163 comments) says:

    “I assume someone is going over Lens Council credit card statements with a magnifying glass?”

    Didn’t he cut it up ages ago after the previous fiasco early on in his first term? At least that’s what I thaought he said on Campbell Live.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  43. nostrils (53 comments) says:

    Come back Aaron Gilmore…… all is forgiven!

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  44. Mark (1,481 comments) says:

    Len Brown has demonstrated an unbelievable lack judgement not only in having an affair (small brain at work) but as it now turns our writing the woman a reference for a job in an organisation owned by Auckland City (no brain at all involved in this one). The simple question is it acceptable to have a man with such with demonstrably poor judgement as mayor of New Zealand’s largest local authority. I care not what political persuasion Brown is, this issue is now going to become a festering sore for the remainder of his term. He should resign.

    The question Aucklanders should also be asking is if his wife and family cannot trust him who the hell can.

    Vote: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  45. ChardonnayGuy (1,199 comments) says:

    That’s not all. Have you seen the unnaturally close relationship between the defunct anti-sexworker vigilante group PROS and certain members of the Otara-Papatoetoe Local Board? How much did Brown know about that?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  46. David Garrett (7,112 comments) says:

    Crikey Yoza, is that THREE times I have agreed with you now??

    He can’t survive…and Ms Chuang is coming to be seen as less and less deserving of sympathy as the day wears on…

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  47. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Jobs for cock. Not an HR policy I’d recommend though.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  48. Yvette (2,786 comments) says:

    DPF – I’d say it is inevitable that someone will file a complaint that Mayor Brown has not complied with the Council’s code of conduct and conflict of interest policy.

    Let it not be Graham McCready [the heel who got Banks' arhilles]– he’s from Wellington isn’t he?
    It should be someone from the Auckland City Council region – or do they have no sense of shame or pride or whichever it takes?

    Ha – and it won’t be Penny Bright who has just declared her support for Len Brown on Radio Live. The Anti-Corruption Public Watch Dog seems to have missed that Brown acted as referee for his mistress, nor has Penny Dime unravelled the other council position Bevan Chuang held.

    We’re So Proud – LEN WITH US … no, thankyou.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  49. Elaycee (4,378 comments) says:

    PhilP (1.40):

    Didn’t he cut it up ages ago after the previous fiasco…

    Yup… Brown was sprung for putting personal items on his Manukau Council Credit Card – including a stereo, groceries and personal meals. He had to reimburse $529. He said he then cut up the card.

    At the time he was quoted:

    “I try and set the best examples on all fronts. I’m not going to be bulletproof and I don’t set out to be perfect. I just set out to be my best and be accountable for it,” Mr Brown said.

    That worked, didn’t it!!!

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10650246

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  50. Pete George (23,481 comments) says:

    “She was fired from the Museum, not the art gallery …”

    I thought she was fired from both, from the Museum for illegal email access for which she was convicted, and from the art gallery when they found out about her conviction.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  51. tvb (4,366 comments) says:

    The wife is silent. I think she will stay in the background for some time. Len might use his daughters for hostess duties etc. She has her own position to consider and may prefer to be like Hilary Clinton and keep Len at arms length for a year or so or sack him.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  52. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    Sorry in that case Pete, you may be right.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  53. Urban Redneck (234 comments) says:

    It’s easy to see how this is playing out. If you want to play the Left at their own game you need to know that there are no rules – it’s only the result that matters.

    The narrative is that Chuang is a spiritual and emotional train-wreck (no argument from me there) who was close to members of Palino’s mayoralty campaign. Daddy Slater, a former National Party President none the less was the manager of this losing campaign. Therefore, in an act of retribution, Daddy Slater’s shameless spoilt brat of a son (again, no argument from me there) sets himself onto Len. So on both fronts, Len Brown is effectively a victim in all of this too.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  54. Pete George (23,481 comments) says:

    From Whale Oil on resignations:

    But what Chuang didn’t disclose to art gallery bosses when applying for the job was the fact she had a criminal conviction relating to the unauthorized use of a computer.

    The conviction dated back to 2010 when she was an employee at the Auckland Museum. Chuang provided a contractor with a password to access a confidential email account believed to contain information detrimental to plans to restructure the museum.

    When Chuang’s conviction came to light about a month after starting work at the art gallery she was sacked.

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2013/10/exclusive-brown-helped-chuang-get-council-job-gave-personal-reference/#axzz2hddZGEt7

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  55. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    UR, you could go the whole way and say that Brown slipped and inserted himself into Chuang by accident.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  56. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    NZH breaking news about a council inquiry into 50 Shades of Brown

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  57. David Garrett (7,112 comments) says:

    UR: You are taking the piss, right? Surely??

    I take no pleasure in seeing a man destroyed, but Len a VICTIM??

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  58. Colville (2,261 comments) says:

    So Stuff has…
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/9295009/New-claims-may-save-Brown
    on its site…opinion by Colin E Spin er
    Interesting that comments are not allowed.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  59. Chuck Bird (4,848 comments) says:

    Ipredict has jumped almost 7 cents to $0.31 a short while ago.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  60. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    So lucky we have the balanced reporting of Colon Espiner to help us form judgement.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  61. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Remind me never to committ a crime with most of you. You are so easily distracted its embarassing

    This Bevan – mad as a cut snake, no argument from anyone surely. A stupid woman, but lets be honest lots of us would be virgins without stupid women

    Whale – is a blogger, he scored a try with this. The MMS would not have broken it. He could have put the boot in before the election but he did’nt for several reasons. but

    Len Fucking Brown is the story here – he has proved again he is weak and a liar and what has come out will only be the tip of the iceberg.

    Stop blaming Whale and this chick – Len Brown, its about Len brown, he has proved he is stupid and cheap, we knew this but its his triennial reminder to the good folk of Auckland.

    His family are collateral damage I’m afraid, if Lennie had been such a tool, there is no story.

    Its not about the rooting its about his judgement and his sense of entitlement – both are appalling. This is the man supposed to lead a council through three very important big spend years and he can’t even organise a fuck properly, what does that tell ya.

    Vote: Thumb up 20 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  62. Sir Cullen's Sidekick (876 comments) says:

    He still won’t resign and the media and the public are all fine with Len’s behaviour. So move on, nothing is going to happen with Len.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  63. Redbaiter (8,558 comments) says:

    “This is the man supposed to lead a council through three very important big spend years and he can’t even organise a fuck properly, what does that tell ya.”

    He’s the kind of man the left love. Look up Bill Clinton. (Or maybe you’ve already heard of him)

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  64. Pete George (23,481 comments) says:

    Bad timing to say that Sir Cullen’s Sidekick.

    Inquiry into Brown sex scandal expected

    Auckland Council chief executive Doug McKay is this afternoon expected to announce an inquiry into the Len Brown sex scandal.

    The decision was made following inquiries from the New Zealand Herald about whether Mr Brown’s affair breached the council’s code of conduct and conflict of interest policies.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11141735

    That means at the very least this story won’t quickly fade away. Pressure on Brown continues to build.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  65. lastmanstanding (1,287 comments) says:

    Heh Lennie the Loop. ever heard of the offence of misfeasance in public office. Well my friend on the strength of what we know never mind whats to come Id say there is a more than fighting chance of you being bought to Court to face this charge and being found guilty. And then mate its all over for you as Mayor

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  66. Nostalgia-NZ (5,121 comments) says:

    Part 1 was Bevan outing Brown. Now it’s oil and she outing each other – that will be an interesting story as it unfolds and there might be more tears. Len won’t mind the second fight at all. He, however, will be worried sick about ‘other’ matters he has been involved in this suddenly small city. So far he’s confirmed all the allegations made against him. If he was taking advice from the wise Michelle Boag he would possibly be considering outing himself as part of the damage control as the dig into his affairs continues. There is the question of sitting on his hands in case more comes out, or taking control and being frank about everything now. Possibly no one would be surprised if he did as the picture already looks bad enough, but he would need to be considering that to this point he has only responding to what’s dug up and many will be considering and searching for that which is yet to surface.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  67. Harriet (4,857 comments) says:

    “…..UR: You are taking the piss, right? Surely??……I take no pleasure in seeing a man destroyed, but Len a VICTIM??…”

    Give the left and it’s MSM arm another couple of days DG…….and Len will be a rapist!

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  68. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    There is the question of sitting on his hands in case more comes out, or taking control and being frank about everything now

    Nosty

    Mea culpa is not in the lefts lexicon. Its always some elses fault never whose fault it actually is.

    Financial shenanigans next , whose paid for all this lovin’? Lennie won’t even buy dinner so I can’t see him shelling out for a motel

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  69. Chuck Bird (4,848 comments) says:

    Ipridict has just jumped to $0.60.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  70. Ashley Schaeffer (475 comments) says:

    Ref Checker: “Anything else to recommend Bevan for this Art Gallery role?”
    Pants Down: “Well, breathing new life into old masters certainly seems to be a passion of hers.”

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  71. Elaycee (4,378 comments) says:

    I guess there’s another expression we’ll never hear Len use…..

    “Wait for me” ….. :D

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  72. davidp (3,580 comments) says:

    Brown helping Chuang to obtain a Council job is way beyong ethical. The damage to him may be lessened if he declared the relationship to the reference checker. But there is a reason that you don’t list your mum or your husband as a referee… no one expects them to judge your character accurately and to report it without bias. If Brown concealed the relationship then he has behaved dishonestly.

    There is also the aspect that Brown was in a position of power over the gallery staff. Being seen to influence any employment decision was unwise. Giving a reference for anyone applying for any council job is a bad idea and he should say no.

    I’m curious about how Chuang was appointed to the ethnic advisory panel. I understand that the appointment was made by Brown. Chuang doesn’t appear to be obviously qualified for such a role, except for the fact she was born overseas. Were appointments to the panel made by an independent person or group, and rubber stamped by Brown? Or was Brown actively involved in the process? Did Brown interview Chuang before the appointment was made? If Brown was actively involved in the selection, then is it possible that Brown’s hormones were one of the selection deciders?

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  73. BeaB (2,119 comments) says:

    The more you criticise Chuang the more you cast doubt on Brown’s judgement in making lecherous advances to a woman young enough to be his daughter.

    I am sorry but the image of a the Mayor of Auckland sitting with wanking with his trousers round his ankles in the mayoral chair in the mayor’s office is beyond any kind of excuse.

    I hope Mrs Brown will not join that sorry procession of wronged wives we have seen standing, mortified, beside their unsavoury American politician husbands.

    We don’t need these sleazy creeps in positions of public trust. We don’t want them meeting our daughters, we don’t want them shaking our hands, we don’t need them representing us at home or abroad.

    Len Brown must go.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  74. SGA (998 comments) says:

    davidp at 3:00 pm

    The damage to him may be lessened if he declared the relationship to the reference checker.

    According to the story on Stuff, his office supplied the reference in July, but their sexual relationship didn’t start until August. That would be about the time the art gallery dismissed her, I’m guessing.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9292175/Brown-helped-Chuang-get-a-job

    FWIW, I’m starting to take Ms Chuang’s story of the relentless pusuit required to “win” her with a grain of salt at the moment given recent revelations.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  75. bhudson (4,738 comments) says:

    Now that he a Grand Poobah Mayor, not just Mayor of Manukau City, will Len think he can ignore requests to provide itemised receipts and details for his expenses over the 2 year affair period simply by slapping his face?

    He certainly won’t be able to use principles as a reason, as he did in Manukau. He’d be hard pressed to prove he has any.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  76. Colville (2,261 comments) says:

    If the 2 minute man does not have a council credit card how does he operate? who buys coffee? or its asssumed if you go to lunch with Len you are picking up the tab?

    There MUST be a trail of dinners, dinners and gifts. A 2 year relationship and She didnt come away for a weekend with him while he was working? and no freaking way did She pay for that herself.

    Does everything just go on his personal card and get reimbursed after a lacky checks it? now those are the things the public needs to see.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  77. RightNow (6,988 comments) says:

    “I am sorry but the image of a the Mayor of Auckland sitting with wanking with his trousers round his ankles in the mayoral chair in the mayor’s office is beyond any kind of excuse.”

    There’ll forever be a brown in that chair…

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  78. davidp (3,580 comments) says:

    Colville>If the 2 minute man does not have a council credit card how does he operate? who buys coffee?

    He keeps the receipt and expenses it. The same as most people do.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  79. David Garrett (7,112 comments) says:

    I assume the references to the “two minute man” are to Len’s staying power?

    I haven’t bothered to read the affidavit from the silly – or calculating, depending on your POV – young woman….does she go into that kind of detail?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  80. Pete George (23,481 comments) says:

    Brown inquiry to look at code of conduct and expenses.

    An independent review will be held in relation to Auckland Mayor Len Brown’s sex scandal with ex-mistress Bevan Chuang.

    Auckland Council chief executive Doug McKay has confirmed the inquiry, which will look at whether Mr Brown breached the council’s code of conduct.

    Mr Brown confirmed on Tuesday he had an affair with ex-colleague Ms Chuang, which lasted around two years.

    READ MORE: Smith doesn’t want comparisons over letter

    Mr McKay says Mr Brown has no council credit cards and all invoices and payments are checked and approved by the council’s chief of staff.

    “I have received an assurance from both the Mayor and his chief of staff that no mayoral office funds were used in relation to the Mayor’s relationship with Ms Chuang,” says Mr McKay.

    “However, I have agreed to independently review this to confirm that is the case.”

    It was revealed earlier today Mr Brown provided a reference for Ms Chuang to help her get the job at Auckland Art Gallery in 2011.

    http://www.3news.co.nz/Inquiry-announced-into-Mayors-sex-scandal/tabid/1607/articleID/317662/Default.aspx

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  81. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    How bad is it that a Mayor of a big bit of dirt can’t trust himself with a credit card?

    And people voted for him dear oh dear

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  82. Scott1 (529 comments) says:

    That Len’s hormone based reference got a person a job, and they later lost that job care of a criminal conviction for the sort of activity that makes them clearly unsuitable for that sort of a job (even if it was done elsewhere in the super city) is the worst part of this for me.

    Len reveals himself to be a terrible referee who should not be trusted. That makes me wonder if he is suitable for a position like being a mayor and I say that as a person who found the affair in itself fairly irrelevant.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  83. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Sorry to mention an inconvenient truth, but at the time of the reference there was no sexual relationship, so she was not his mistress at the time.

    How many other people has the Mayor, other candidates and councillors provided a reference to – just to put the matter of providing references into the appropriate context. And are their rules applying to the provision of references that have been broken here, in general practice or within the council code of conduct

    She was after all she had been appointed by the Council to a board and thus seeking a reference from him or Northey is unsurprising – most people seek a reference related to former or existing positions.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  84. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Scott1, two different jobs, is this thread a fact free zone?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  85. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Oh dear, history is already being re-written by our lefties friends. He was playing hide-the-sausage with her at the time. I’m sure even Brown doesn’t act as a reference for people he doesn’t know.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  86. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Rich Prick are you following the story – she was appointed to the board by Northey in March, she met Brown as a member of a council board in May, the reference was in July, they first had sex in August.

    Develop a story based on the facts and then you don’t have to be corrected as to the facts.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  87. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    1. Presumption – that his reference was decisive in her getting the job.

    2. Precedent – has it been determined in any past case that providing a reference to someone you LATER slept with is a conflict of interest.

    3. Precedent – has there been any determination in the past that a Mayor cannot recommend anyone for employment at the council or anyone at a council funded organisation – such as the Art Gallery – because it would be a conflict of interest. If not, why is it in this case?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  88. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Oh, in July he had only had a wank over her in the mayoral office. Got it. She didn’t get a proper seeing to until August. The August encounter must have been the jizzing all over her episode. When did she get the clap? I’ve lost track of the mayor’s efforts to be honest.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  89. bhudson (4,738 comments) says:

    Sorry to mention an inconvenient truth, but at the time of the reference there was no sexual relationship, so she was not his mistress at the time.

    @SPC,

    You are so right! Accuracy is crucial! So was that during the time when he was chasing after her then?…

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  90. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Rich Prick, my money is on the Palino staffer giving her the clap – it’s one reason to end a 3 month relationship. It’s little wonder it was some months before Brown later did it again and began asking her to supply condoms (a married man of his age cannot find a good reason to be seen buying them himself).

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  91. Scott Chris (6,068 comments) says:

    Len’s reference:

    Bevan was an exemplary employee who was good on the desk, was eager to stay outside office hours and literally worked her pants off. She proved to be both flexible and compliant and was always willing to go the extra mile for her boss.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  92. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Geeez SPC, I don’t have all marked out on my wall-planner like you seem to. In fact I find the sordid detail all a bit icky.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  93. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    bhudson, clearly – but equally as someone she had met while on a council appointed board, just the sort of reference one would seek whether anything otherwise was going on or not.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  94. bhudson (4,738 comments) says:

    bhudson, clearly

    @SPC,

    You might just want to pause, re-read that and think about what it means for the investigation into the reference…

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  95. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    RP, it’s the historian in me, understanding a story is based on developments over a timeline. I just read a report/the reports and it’s so processed.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  96. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    bhudson, the person hiring at the Art Gallery would simply note the council appointment to the board and presume she was seeking a reference from the head of the Council. Just as anyone else with former employment or current employment or community organisational role would get the top person to provide the reference if they could.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  97. swan (665 comments) says:

    I cant believe the guy hasnt resigned yet. Fully expected him to after this came out.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  98. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Does it not strike every one else just how untenable Brown’s position is? The mayor of the Southern Hemisphere’s largest city is being discussed in terms of which date he had a wank over the phone with his mistress, when he first boned her properly, albeit for less than two minutes and jizzed all over her, as though the discussion was about his diary’s list of public engagements for the month.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  99. Steve (North Shore) (4,547 comments) says:

    David Garrett,

    I haven’t bothered to read the affidavit from the silly – or calculating, depending on your POV – young woman….does she go into that kind of detail?

    Yes there is a lot of detail, I think this was done by design. Ms Chuang did not want the trained and skilled reporters and churnalists to have any chance of creating ‘Chinese Whispers’
    Like it or not, she is smarter than the average TVNZ, Herald, or Radio fuckwit

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  100. swan (665 comments) says:

    SPC according to the affidavit they became intimate in late June. I dont think when full penetration to completion first occured is really of consequence in the scheme of this issue.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  101. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    RP et al, I got an important detail wrong – it was August 2012 when the reference was given not August 2011, so there was a sexual relationship at this time.

    However I will still quibble over the term mistress, this usually implies kept woman – hardly the case here.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  102. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    swan, the detail over months is not that relevant, given it was actually 2012 not 2011.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  103. Griff (7,520 comments) says:

    Way to go speedo len
    did you really make her go chocho whooooooaaaaa ?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  104. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    I think it was more damp squib by all reports Griff.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  105. Psycho Milt (2,411 comments) says:

    “I am sorry but the image of a the Mayor of Auckland sitting with wanking with his trousers round his ankles in the mayoral chair in the mayor’s office is beyond any kind of excuse.”

    Please keep your bizarre sex fantasies to yourself.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  106. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    “RP et al, I got an important detail wrong – it was August 2012 when the reference was given not August 2011, so there was a sexual relationship at this time.

    However I will still quibble over the term mistress, this usually implies kept woman – hardly the case here.”

    Thanks for the acknowledgement. So far as being “kept”, Brown was pretty miserable, just a gift of cheap knickers a few sizes too big for her. Now that I think about it, that may have been the beginning of his undoing.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  107. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Psycho Milt, you might want to read the woman’s sworn affidavit. You will need a degree of intestinal fortitude for such an endeavour though.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  108. OECD rank 22 kiwi (2,746 comments) says:

    Just as well New Zealand lost the America’s Cup. Imagine Len Brown representing the best of New Zealand.

    Auckland should stick to what it’s best at, being a backwater.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  109. bhudson (4,738 comments) says:

    <blockquote.However I will still quibble over the term mistress, this usually implies kept woman – hardly the case here.</blockquote)

    @SPC,

    I think you strike an incredibly important thread here. But not to be disassociated from the quality of lingerie

    After all, how can you be described as a mistress if he only buys you cheap knickers???

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  110. Steve (North Shore) (4,547 comments) says:

    Oh yeah OECD rank 22 kiwi,
    I forgot about that angle. Len was so obsessed and involved with the Americas Cup coming to Auckland that he forgot about a tango – no damage control – and now he blames everyone except himself.
    Privacy and yet Commie Campbell, privacy and ‘on behalf of Sam….’
    The man is a cork soaking narcissist. He is desperate.
    Next time I meet the cunt I will be far more agressive to make my point

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  111. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    Running the defence – let’s ignore what occurred because a lefty snout in the trough is at stake here……

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  112. KevinH (1,221 comments) says:

    “At least if I was a hooker I would have got something out of this, but I got nothing. I was starting to feel like Monica Lewinsky” she told the Whale Oil blog site.

    That statement is an insight into the mentality of an ambitious young woman who despite receiving a reference from Len Brown that secured her a coveted position asserts that the illicit relationship produced nothing for her.

    There is no question that Len Brown’s reference influenced Ms Chuang’s appointment.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  113. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    KevinH, how do you know that another person who applied for the job did not have a Mayoral reference as well? Or that the reference was decisive?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  114. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    KevinH, how do you know that another person who applied for the job did not have a Mayoral reference as well? Or that the reference was decisive?

    You mean mean he was nailing another chick at the same time SPC -the dog

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  115. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    burt, ignore what?

    1. Name an elected person who resigned for having an affair. Is this normal?

    2. Has it been determined in any past case that providing a reference to someone you slept with is a conflict of interest.

    3. Has there been any determination in the past that a Mayor cannot recommend anyone for employment at the council or anyone at a council funded organisation – such as the Art Gallery – because it would be a conflict of interest or undue influence. If not, why is it in this case?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  116. RightNow (6,988 comments) says:

    “I am sorry but the image of a the Mayor of Auckland sitting with wanking with his trousers round his ankles in the mayoral chair in the mayor’s office is beyond any kind of excuse.

    That’s a bold new format for the Mayor in the Chair.
    Perhaps he could get a guest spot on 7 Days. I don’t see how that could go badly.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  117. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    PEB, maybe Len will provide a reference for anyone who asks. Or anyone who works for council – whether an employee or a board appointment? I doubt she is the only person he has provided a reference for, or that sexual favours were required for this. So why presume that the reference for her was because of the sex?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  118. bhudson (4,738 comments) says:

    KevinH, how do you know that another person who applied for the job did not have a Mayoral reference as well?

    Well indeed SPC. Are you suggesting he was banging others (or wishing to) at that same time?

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  119. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    did he campaign on a family man platform – game set and match…. Stop digging around in the weeds making a fool of yourself.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  120. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    SPC

    You are sounding desperate. Even without the sex the mayor should not be giving references for people for council positions.
    That in itself is as unprofessional as hell- couple that with he was nailing this woman and you have a massive conflict and if you can’t see that you are very dim and don’t deserve an internet connection.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  121. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    Len’s campaign and exposed deeds is akin to electing somebody on a Green platform and finding out they have shares in a strip mining company…. Do you get this ?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  122. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    SPC, give it a bone. Even the sound the mayor makes when he *ahem* arrives, with his pants round his ankles at his desk, is in the public domain. I think your defence of him is flogging a dead horse.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  123. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    So no one can name an elected person who resigned for having an affair.

    No one knows of a case where it has been determined in any legal/employment case that providing a reference to someone you slept with is a conflict of interest.

    No one knows of any determination in the Auckland council or any other that a Mayor cannot recommend anyone for employment at the council or anyone at a council funded organisation – such as the Art Gallery – because it would be a conflict of interest or undue influence.

    For example did not John Key a PM help short list (more than reference) a candidate for a government position?

    Was this undue influence?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  124. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    No, we just don’t care. Brown is *ahem* spent. Mop-up in aisle 14.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  125. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    SPC

    Its not about the sex numb nuts its about using his positon -jesus

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  126. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    David Petraeus

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  127. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Anthony Weiner

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  128. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Who elected Petraeus?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  129. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Representative Chris Lee of New York

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  130. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Mark Souder of Indiana

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  131. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Palino and Wewege may have presumed that American personal life attack politics apply here too, but no local examples?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  132. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    John Ensign, Senator from Nevada

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  133. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    PEB, so now its using his position – not the sex. In one day the attack line changes.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  134. Rich Prick (1,682 comments) says:

    Maybe Pants Down Brown gets to be our first. But he has no honour, so I doubt he wants that *gig*.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  135. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Is using ones position, supplying a reference to someone one knows personally unrelated to employment matters?

    John Key helped short list (more than reference) a candidate for a government position while PM?

    In the end its only the sex that differentiates this case.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  136. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Eliot Sptizer

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  137. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    John Profumo

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  138. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Iris Robinson

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  139. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Petr Nečas. PM of the Czech Republic.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  140. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Colin Moyle

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  141. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Guess not, no one at all.

    I wonder how many people have reason to fear being number 2, if a precedent is set.

    The roll call of Americans demonstrates that once there is a precedent there is no end to it.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  142. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Michael Palmer, Speaker of the House in the Parliament of Singapore

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  143. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    PED, if CM had fit the category the then PM was next in line.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  144. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, I suppose you truly believe in those who are without sin casting the first stone.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  145. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Minnesota Senate Majority Leader Amy Koch

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  146. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Mark Oaten, UK Liberal Democrats

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  147. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Not at all. We are none of us perfect.

    But you asked the question. Don’t get shirty just because you couldn’t be bothered googling for about 3 minutes.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  148. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, you did not stop to think that I was referring to the New Zealand context?

    Or could not find any such examples so went trawling in other waters?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  149. Nostalgia-NZ (5,121 comments) says:

    It has become quite clear that Cato, who has been relatively sensible to this point, has decided to adopt a new posting style called one liners, Thousands of trees in SE Asia are inhaling carbon monoxide in relief.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  150. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, I suppose your motive was to imply that expecting those elected people to resign if they are caught having affairs is commonplace overseas and you think it should apply here.

    I wonder how many people are blackmailed overseas because of their policy and what that does to use of public money and public policy votes?

    Maybe our lower level of public corruption is because we do not confuse public and personal stuff.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  151. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    New Zealand is a small place and if you want to shift the goal posts, fine.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  152. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, a correction of your perception of the meaning and the context of my post is not my changing the goal posts …

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  153. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    Two consenting adults had sex – big deal – nobody is arguing with you about that. Do you get the comparison of electing a Green candidate who turns out to have shares in a strip mining company ?

    You battle on demanding names of people ( specifically MPs I guess ) sidestepping the real issue. Are you going to keep in defending the indefensible on some shed of misplaced tolerance and acceptance for normal human behaviour by completely ignoring the context ?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  154. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Sorry, just posting as I trawl through Google. Sorry if it’s annoying. But in NZ – I’d classify Darren Hughes (resigned though no charges were laid). Same goes for Richard Worth.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  155. cha (3,946 comments) says:

    Careful SPC – Cato knows shit.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  156. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    You asked whether any elected person has ever resigned anything? You didn’t specify New Zealand and since we’ve had very few public sex scandals there’s no logical reason why we can’t look to other English speaking jurisdictions or other democracies.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  157. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    Cato

    SPC will be wanting to play the Labour apologist ‘others did it too’ card. It’s in the ‘Defending our team 101′ manual. Saying ‘others did it too’ is often said in conjunction with ‘it’s not fair to just punish him when others were not punished’ and of course ‘move on’.

    Advanced comrades get to use the DDD ( deny, delay, denigrate ) strategies in level 2 courses. SPC seems yet to progress as he’s still defending the action rather than attacking WhaleOil…

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  158. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    I thought (s)he was asking a question in good faith. My mistake. I guess I should have realised when (s)he stated that giving him an answer he didn’t like was tantamount to being a Pharisee wanting to stone a woman to death and incurring a rebuke from Jesus.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  159. Nostalgia-NZ (5,121 comments) says:

    Perhaps Len will write a book explaining the rules for acting as referee for mistresses.
    I’d probably read that, well the headlines anyway.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  160. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, Hughes and Worth resigned because of police investigations, not for consensual sex (and before it was known whether charges would be laid – they were not).

    Why do you think we have had so few public scandals for consensual sex?

    Muldoon is said to have done it, but Labour made nothing of it. Lange and Pope at the workplace, National made nothing of it. Cabinet Ministers and MP’s have traded one wife for another while in the House, no matter how messy the transfer, it’s not been an issue. They have been allowed their privacy.

    The one exception is Brash, he attacked Clark on the lack of children – family values card and others on the “gay” husband. He was taunted and others revealed the second affair – but he did not resign over it, it was more Key’s rising poll ratings that led to the change.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  161. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    Perfect, Muldoon and Lange did it too…. They didn’t need to resign – why should my Len…. You’re ignoring the context – is that because you can’t win a battle debating the situation in context or is because your a dim-bulb lefty who’s stupid enough to believe socialism works even when it never has anywhere ever,

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  162. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Thanks for pointing that out. From my perspective, National have made nothing of L. Brown’s affair either. I stand ready to be corrected if you like.

    I didn’t know that Don Brash attacked Helen Clark for not having children. When was that? When did he say that Peter Davis was a homosexual? I’m sceptical, but open to correction.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  163. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, do you think that all politicians who engage in extra-marital affairs should resign or not?

    And the context of those without sin casting the first stone, is of course equivalence – if one is judged for it then it should be an across the board standard – not just the person a mob has it in for at the time. It is the principle of the rule of law itself. Justice for all.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  164. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    I think it depends on the affair. I certainly don’t think that making a prudent decision that somebody is unfit for a particular public office in the context of a particular extramartial affair is tantamount to casting a judgment on the man’s soul. I find that an incredibly reductive approach.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  165. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, can you not comprehend the meaning and role of the word others of “The one exception is Brash, he attacked Clark on the lack of children – family values card and others on the “gay” husband.” Really?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  166. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    SPC

    I’ve shagged around, I’ve never campaigned on a family man platform while shagging around and I’ve never given a reference for somebody I’m shagging. So in context – I’m qualified to throw stones …. Is this so hard for you to understand….

    Let me guess – it was right that Winston didn’t resign when found out to be using secret trusts even after campaigning against the use of secret trusts – because according to Winston – others were doing it to. ( remember ‘it’ in that context was actually illegal but Winston was shielded long enough for responsibilities under the law ( six months under that legislation at that time) had lapsed.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  167. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    No because the precise meaning of “others” is not clear in how you chose to phrase that sentence. It could, for example, refer to the “cards” you think Don Brash was playing. Given that you’re naming specific politicians involved in sex scandals it seems weird that you would simply randomly insert an observation about ‘others’ on Peter Davis’s sexuality – especially in the context of explaining why Don Brash’s philandering was an acceptable news story.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  168. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, enabling selectivity as to who is judged for the same action is course to divide and conquer. Enable some to be above and beyond judgment, but not all. If justice is not for all, then it is not for all. Nor is salvation.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  169. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    But I also still don’t get your point about National making nothing of earlier affairs. They haven’t this time either. They’ve studiously avoided making it an issue. The media has made it an issue. So times have clearly changed.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  170. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    I’m not making a moral judgment on Len Brown – that’s between him and God and his family. Nothing to do with me – and there but for the grace of God go I as far as I am concerned on that front. But withholding moral judgment on the man does not require withholding prudent judgment on the political matter of whether he is capable of running New Zealand’s only world city.

    Your reductive reading of Christianity puts me in mind of Young-Earthers, you just choose different parts of the Bible to be fundamentalist about.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  171. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, well at least you now realise what I meant, without me needing to explain it. Well done.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  172. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    Glad to have pleased you.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  173. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    But Cato

    Muldoon ( that guy SPC obviously respects to use as a comparison ) – he did it too – and he didn’t resign!

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  174. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato I was referencing that

    1. we have no tradition of making the private life in public politics. Neither party has.
    2. there are exceptions to the rule – and that involves people seen to be hypocrites in glass houses – Moyle maybe, and then Brash.

    Times have not changed, the blog has simply allowed stuff to come into the public domain more easily – this does not mean we have to change the separation of private from public that has held till now.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  175. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    How is Brash a hypocrite? Oh right, because other people claimed Helen Clark’s husband was gay. And if that’s not what you claimed, then WTF did you cite it as justification for Labour making a big deal about Brash’s affair?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  176. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, reductive view, bollocks – don’t bring your superior “Church theology” semantics – series of learned put downs of the views of the heretics (a set of validating opinions to mount one self up as someone special with a special understanding above that of others) to an area where it is not relevant.

    The issue of the time was the interface between faith and law and the principle being taught was double edged. One in the field of faith in God and what that could mean, as distinct from obedience to law, and on the other in the field of law – that all were accountable. This is a principle that equality (before God and) before the law was built on.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  177. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, Brash raised the issue of Clark not having children – a family values card in reference to the coming 2005 election and who best understood families. An irony given Labour was targeting tax cuts so more would go to those with children to support.

    Labour’s taunts of Brash in parliament were an appeal to the media to see Brash as hypocrite and enlighten the public as to what they were referring to – a second affair.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  178. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    So what did that have to do with Peter Davis?

    Actually, you’re the one who, for some reason, brought religion into this. I don’t think that withholding moral judgment on the man proscribes me from making a prudential judgement about whether he has the discernment to execute his office. Maybe he does – I haven’t made my mind up. Nobody has the right to public office.

    Do you think Alexander VI was a good pope? He didn’t teach any heresies. So if he wasn’t a good pope, please explain why (without throwing any stones).

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  179. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    burt, you were throwing stones at the Brown candidacy long before his affair became known, but sure you can say his action makes him unfit for office as well if you like – but you would be expected to say the same of others if you did. There is a form of hypocrisy in there being that form of double standard as well.

    Yes there those who campaign against something should not be doing it themselves and yes the ability of those who have affairs to play the family values card anymore is “diminished”.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  180. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, the other attacks on Clark (not from Brash) related to her marriage may have played a part in determining the Labour response – tit for tat politics.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  181. Cato (1,095 comments) says:

    How illogical.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  182. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, not making a moral judgement of the private lives of others is what describes current practice in New Zealand (the exception occurring on grounds of hypocrisy). Making a prudential judgment on their capacity for the public role is the status quo.

    You are coming around to understanding the way we have done it to date and why.

    Which is why the ground of this case is moving from the sex to periphery matters related to judgement.

    Was council money used, influence and interest etc.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  183. SPC (5,595 comments) says:

    Cato, sure. That is the nature of tit for tat and why when it ends both sides are reluctant to get back into that state.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  184. burt (8,241 comments) says:

    Tit for tat … The highly mature way of the lefty – you did it so I’ll do it too… Oh and I’ll tell everyone how corrupt and self serving you are for doing it then being dumb enough to believe in socialism I’ll say it’s ok I did it because you did it too…

    If the world is ever free from self serving partisan hack apologist lefties politics might get back to what it should be – governance – not some school kid mentality game of – but they did it too.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote

Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.