Experts on Dotcom video

August 8th, 2014 at 8:03 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

Auckland University political marketing specialist Jennifer Lees-Marshment said the video’s rhetoric about revolution and changing the Government looked effective, but “reminds me of propaganda, chanting-type campaigning more reminiscent of Hitler and fascism [in Nazi Germany] than New Zealand in the 21st century”.

For the record I don’t think Dotcom is a Nazi, even though he collects their memorabilia. But I do think he is a bit of a German nationalist, as see by the tapes of him in the car boasting (incorrectly) to Mona about how the Germans built the Eiffel Tower and Statue of Liberty.

Massey University political marketing expert Claire Robinson said the video undercuts Ms Harre’s claim to integrity. “Laila Harre was expressing such indignation about John Key’s ‘sugar daddy’ comment and the need for respect in the political debate, and at the same time you have posting a video inciting hate speech, in effect.

“It is sinking to such a low, and completely at odds with what she’s trying to do, exposing yet again the enormous disconnect between Kim Dotcom’s hatred for John Key and the way that she wants to campaign.”

Laila gets offended when Dotcom tweets a silly joke about Batman killing a hooker because he used his real name, but thinks there is nothign wrong with the party she leads posting videos of people chanting “Fuck John Key”.

Imagine if a group of young activists were filmed a few years ago chanting “Fuck Helen Clark”. Laila would be demanding they be arrested for hate speech, or something.

Family First NZ yesterday laid a complaint about the video with the Advertising Standards Authority.

That could be interesting. It is worth recalling again this wasn’t a video shot by an audience member. This was an official video of the Internet Party.

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124 Responses to “Experts on Dotcom video”

  1. redqueen (562 comments) says:

    It was also ‘spontaneous’, not staged, apparently. She would have ‘acknowledged’ them, under the circumstances. When do they start issuing free armbands with ‘Internet Mana’ on them?

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  2. nasska (11,491 comments) says:

    ….”“Fuck Helen Clark”.”…..

    The visual imagery that conjures up can not be unimagined!

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  3. RF (1,397 comments) says:

    redqueen. 8.07am.

    Not spontaneous….. Paid members in the crowd kicked that off. The actions of a very evil fat slob.

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  4. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    A few years ago it would have been “bugger John Key” but Toyota took the sting out of “bugger” so what are the poor students left to chant aye? C$$t John Key?

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  5. Neil (586 comments) says:

    Harre sounded terrible in her Morning Report interview this morning. She couldn’t see anything wrong with this- that tells you so much about the values of the left.
    This will not run well in suburban NZ. Don’t worry, I wouldn’t think too many of those young idiots will vote.
    JK don’t react. Let middle NZ do that on September 20

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  6. Duxton (651 comments) says:

    This has brought NZ politics to a new low.

    However, I agree with both commentators cited by Dave. The half-crazed dickheads in the video were never going to vote for John Key, but their actions may well push a few more mature waverers over to him.

    Simply stupid. The sooner the fat German slug is escorted through the departure gates for a flight to LA, the better.

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  7. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  8. Tarquin North (297 comments) says:

    Plenty of brown shirts in the crowd. Nuremberg all over again. The paralells are truly scary, the sooner we get this nazi sympathiser political manipulator into an American prison the better. Hopefully Laila and Hone will get fried in the fall out. We do not need this in our country.

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  9. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    Some people, notably Russell Brown, have been vigorously criticising any linking of Dotcom and Nazis.

    Godwin has come into many discussions too – but this is different, it is not an eventual claim of Hitler in a discussion, it was an immediate peerception.

    The fact is that on seeing many people got the immediate impression of Nazi connotations in Dotcom’s performance in working the crowd and promoting revolution and taking down the government.

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  10. Simon (723 comments) says:

    Two types of Nazis.

    First is the beer hall Nazi. Fat thugs, louts & piss heads. Good at smashing windows & beating old people that’s about it.

    Second type of Nazi lives on dogmatic ideology and loves the smell of diesel & cordite. Quite dangerous. There have’t been the second type since 1945.

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  11. redqueen (562 comments) says:

    @RF

    That was my sarcasm. If you read the article, her statement is that it was the crowd’s ‘response’. She says this was ‘youth expression’. I remember being young, stupid, and loud. And I also remember being able to string together more than ‘Fuck you’, except when supremely pissed, and usually about things a bit more localised than politicians…If they’re all that drunk, it hardly seems a shining example of democracy.

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  12. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Tarquin North (156 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:22 am

    What a load of absolute crap. Brown shirts indeed. The only thing in that crowd were drunk star struck teenagers, ready to give the finger to authority, their parents and anyone else they could.

    I have a 19 year old. My house is always full of teenagers – we DON’T mention KDC here for the simple reason that every time someone from our generation says how terrible he is – it makes the young people look at him closer. They see a internet giant with billions of dollars – something they’d all like to be. They look at John Key and see a balding man in a stuffy suit, who might be rich, but he’s not KDC rich, they see nothing they want in him. If parents start nagging their kids telling them not to vote for KDC – they will, just to prove they are ‘grown up’ and independent.

    Trying to frighten them by saying it is brown shirt Nazi stuff – isn’t going to scare the kids – they were there, they know exactly what it was, and besides all that ‘Nazi’ stuff was so long ago, they really don’t associate it.

    We got to start looking at this for what it is in reality and not glorifying it (in the negative way) or we will just be helping KDC get votes.

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  13. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    If you read the article, her statement is that it was the crowd’s ‘response’. She says this was ‘youth expression’.

    ‘Expression’ in a revved up crowd is one thing.

    What Harre has failed to address – and she has been asked about it – is why the Internet Party chose to promote this edited video to promote their party, and why she thinks that is ok.

    Harré defends Internet Party video – but only up to a point.

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  14. BeaB (2,123 comments) says:

    Nazi or not this creepy German collects memorabilia and has no scruples about whipping up a crowd. It all looked very sieg heil to me.
    Along with the anti-Semite defacement of National billbioards you have to wonder what kind of sinister ideas are starting to take hold in NZ. And where they are coming from.
    With this awful German demogogue and John Minto’s rabid anti-Israel protests and Leila Harre’s icy socialist pragmatism perhaps we don’t have to look very far.

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  15. Linda Reid (415 comments) says:

    I find the phrase “bring down the government” offensive. It’s fine to want to change the government – we get that chance every three years and regularly do change the government – but bring it down? No. Just no.

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  16. radvad (765 comments) says:

    It is all based on the hatred of one man for another and the left lap it up. Incredible.

    Combined with the outright evil graffiti on National billboards, it is a new low, not only in our politics, but also for life in NZ.

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  17. Paulus (2,627 comments) says:

    As both my wife and I were brought up in London during the War we are ashamed to see such a video in New Zealand.
    It is sad to see that fat criminal standing up in front of a chanting screaming crowd like the Hitler Youth.
    As a country we should all be very sadly disappointed to find that the education of our children has allowed them to think in such a way, led by this criminal.
    This comes principally from their parents, exacerbated by the kind of teaching we have now as the norm.
    Both Sydney and Melbourne are currently undergoing a serious anti Jewish revival.
    Remember Kristallnacht – violence is starting up again this time led by young “Australian” Muslims.
    In Paris the media a re preventing from reporting such violence which is very serious as it is believed that by reporting it will only encourage it. Many parts of Paris are No Go.

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  18. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Linda

    It’s term for god’s sake. A slogan, a hyped up expression to get their interest. Calm down!!

    I cannot believe how you are all buying into this and playing KDC’s game. This is exactly what he was paying for, and you lot are giving it to him. Those kids know they can’t bring down the government – its just more of the hyped up illusion stuff they like – they get it when they play their games, their music and so on. Apparently they know a little more than most of their parents do though – .

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  19. flash2846 (284 comments) says:

    What the hell are we doing talking about Dot Krim et el? just giving them exposure.
    JK and National should be ignoring them instead of doing battle while Labour gain traction conning the naive.

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  20. Viking2 (11,470 comments) says:

    You lot should stop fucking moaning.
    Nothing here is new. Go back to the thirties and we had Labour followers doing a similar thing, just not videoed.
    We had a National Govt. invoking use of the Army to attack workplace relation failures. ( I can remember army guys with guns sitting on top of delivery trucks and my Mum & Dad not being able to help my Nana & Gdad because he was a member of a Union at the time.
    The Nats. are not covered in glory.
    We had plenty in the 80’s doing the same to Roger Douglas and don’t forget Muldoon’s use of the dancing Cossack’s and his Red’s under the Bed’s bullshit you all swallowed.

    We can look back at Clark & Co’s attacks against the military people who went to Vietnam. A much more disgraceful act.

    So nothing new but certainly an expression of how some feel.

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  21. rouppe (971 comments) says:

    Isn’t exhorting people to not vote National (bring down the government) an election advertisement that requires a promoter statement?

    Cause I couldn’t see one…

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  22. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    Go Family First!

    Judith, your own irrational and extreme hatred of John Key has of course got nothing at all to do with your perceptions of the issue, right?

    Yeah right.

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  23. holysheet (386 comments) says:

    God help us if the same judge that yesterday discharged without conviction, the thugs that killed the young man Stephen Dudley, continues to sit in judgement on the crim.com extradition case. If she shows such poor judgement in this decision, what confidence can we have in any of her future decisions. I hope the crown will appeal this stupid decision.

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  24. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    I don’t think the “F*** John Key” chanting – nasty though it is – is the biggest concern here.

    The more disturbing part of this is Kim Dotcom talking about getting ready for a revolution, getting ready to take down the Government, getting ready to extradite John Key.

    Not to sure if he realises, but that’s not actually how politics works here … we have this thing called “democracy” and “elections”. By and large, our electoral system works just fine. Sure we may grizzle about MMP and the rules, but at least it’s all out there in the open, we all know how it works, and (despite Penny’s raving) there’s no corruption involved.

    Getting ready for a revolution, getting ready to take down the Government, getting ready to extradite John Key … isn’t this sort of talk what the term “sedition” refers to? Or does Dotcom fancy himself as a coup-leader?

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  25. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    Linda – Laila Harre tried to excuse that expression:

    Michael Horne ‏@mashley_h
    And in this country we have elections we don’t ‘take down the government’.

    @lailaharre
    Come on. Don’t you know Internet terms?

    She obviously doesn’t.

    She later tried to prove her online credentials:

    @lailaharre

    I got 8/10 on Quiz: How well do you know internet slang
    http://www.theguardian.com/technology/quiz/2014/aug/07/quiz-internet-slang-bae-how-well-yolo-tbt-mean … via @GuardianQuiz

    Her crash course has had variable success.

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  26. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,829 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:47 am

    I can rationalise my dislike of John Key very well, thank you Shawn, although I am not sure you can rationalise your blind adoration and man-love for him, to the same degree. If you can’t see what I’m trying to say here, then I sincerely hope you don’t have teengers, and are telling them not to vote KDC with some of the passion you have for JK, because if you are – I suspect they will vote IP, just to secretly give you the finger! Do you remember being a teenager?

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  27. grumpy (260 comments) says:

    Judith, I am sure there were many voices of reason like yourself during Hitler ‘s rise to power. Shame on you for your deliberate attempts to minimize this huge threat to our society.

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  28. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “I find the phrase “bring down the government” offensive. It’s fine to want to change the government – we get that chance every three years and regularly do change the government – but bring it down? No. Just no.”

    “Bring down the government” is frequently used in and out of Parliament, you must be offended a lot Linda Reid.

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  29. thePeoplesFlag (245 comments) says:

    So many angry old white people.

    The fainting fits and hysterical clutching of the head by smug right wing authoritarians in reaction to this video has cemented the Internet Party as the genuine protest vote for a connected generation.

    Thanks!

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  30. Gulag1917 (915 comments) says:

    Germans are very direct whereas Anglo Saxons are far more subtle. Not excusing this German, his cavalier attitude to things Nazi has turned me off.

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  31. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ grumpy (241 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:50 am

    Bullshit – KDC is no threat unless you make him one – which you are doing by putting him all over the newspapers and reacting to him. If the press ignored him, you wouldn’t even know about him and neither would the young voters.

    Besides, KDC is going to be out of here next year – there is no ‘threat’ from him – but whilst you are concentrating on him, you’re not watching some, who could be.

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  32. SGA (1,025 comments) says:

    Give it up Judith – The Internet Party held a Nuremburg Rally for their brown shirt supporters, the Greens are conducting a jihad, Labour supporters are conducting their own Kristallnacht against John Key’s hoardings, and NZ First … ummm … well Winston gets more lizard like every year, so I’m expecting UT to tell us he’s a shape shifting reptilian anytime soon. We are doomed.

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  33. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Judith, I am sure there were many voices of reason like yourself during Hitler ‘s rise to power. Shame on you for your deliberate attempts to minimize this huge threat to our society.”

    Maybe we should give him a seat in Parliament and that way we can control him. LMAO. Grumpy, you make me laugh my arse off.

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  34. Nookin (3,341 comments) says:

    Judith, take your blinkers off.
    KDC hates Key.
    KDC says he wants to destroy Key’s government.
    KDC turns up to two rallies with a placard of Key ( just happened to have one handy in case Key became a topic of rational and objective discussion).
    KDC leads a chant.
    On two consecutive occasions the KDC mantra turns into the hate John Key mantra.
    KDC waves the John Key placard in support of the chant.
    The video is official IMP advertising. That is the message that they are promoting.
    And you say he had nothing to do with the chant and it was just drunken teenagers spontaneously letting off steam?

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  35. Keeping Stock (10,339 comments) says:

    From Jessica Williams and Lloyd Burr from RadioLive after the Wellington Party Party, the night after Christchurch:

    Mr Dotcom wants a revolution, but as you’ll hear from his brief speech (if you call it that), he’s far from made the case. Punters paid $30 a ticket for the promise of seeing Mr Dotcom in the flesh. And after four hours, he finally appeared, to give a 2 minute speech, which worked out at 15 dollars a minute.

    “Wellington! Are you ready to party party all night? Yea!,” yelled Mr Dotcom to great applause.

    “Are you ready to change the Government this year? Are you ready for a revolution?”

    The crowd went mental and loved it, which showed his political capital with this audience. But if any of them wanted to hear *why* there should be a revolution, they’d have been disappointed.

    “Don’t let your parents decide who rules this country. You vote this year, we’ll take this country back, the young people of New Zealand.”

    He already has the vote of those willing to pay good money to see him in the flesh, but he’ll need much more than that to get the ‘revolution’ started.

    After this, he led the crowd in a ‘f*#k John Key’ chant, followed by: “Do you want to extradite John Key? All right! Woohhooo!”

    “Wait downstairs, I’m coming downstairs to give you all a hug,” Mr Dotcom finished with.

    http://www.radiolive.co.nz/The-two-minute-speech-that-cost-30-Kim-Dotcoms-revolution/tabid/815/articleID/50870/Default.aspx

    There’s a bit of a trend emerging here. And Laila Harre’s faux outrage over the sugar daddy comment is exposed whilst she is telling fibs to defend her boss, pay-master and puppet-master.

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  36. Liam Hehir (125 comments) says:

    Of course Russell Brown would be downplaying any Nazi comparisons – because their validity is conditional on whether you approve or disapprove of the person being targeted. For example, regarding Destiny Church he said:

    “Stormtroopers …” says the guy next to me.

    I nod. I don’t like to bandy about the N-word, but it’s actually really hard to avoid the comparison as the black-clad men (and several dozen school-age boys) of the kapa haka group march past, chanting “enough is enough!” and pumping their right arms in the air in unison. I don’t know if they know how ugly it looks, or whether they simply don’t care.

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  37. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Give it up Judith – The Internet Party held a Nuremburg Rally for their brown shirt supporters, the Greens are conducting a jihad, Labour supporters are conducting their own Kristallnacht against John Key’s hoardings, and NZ First … ummm … well Winston gets more lizard like every year, so I’m expecting UT to tell us he’s a shape shifting reptilian anytime soon. We are doomed.”

    Like KDC said in Rotorua, “I can smell the fear, I can smell John Key’s fear!” LOL

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  38. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Nookin (3,057 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:54 am

    The chant ‘f John Key’ started in the crowd. KDC did not chant it, although he didn’t stop it either and encouraged it.

    Yes, KDC is all the things you have said – and the video is on his site – and thanks to the media and now your promoting it, a whole lot of young people know where they can find it – watch it, read his propaganda and probably vote for the Internet Party.

    Don’t you see – if the media and National and all you lot just ignored the bloody video – the vast majority of our young people wouldn’t even know it exists. Sometimes I wonder whether some of you are actually in KDC’s press team.

    DPF – by posting this thread, has probably just scored a couple of votes for KDC because at least one or two of these stupid people will rave on to their young people, voting for the first time, and tell them where to find the video, and not to vote for ‘that man’ – which is exactly what a rebellious teenager will do!!

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  39. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    “Are you ready for a revolution?” pretty embarrassing really. Who the hell does he think he is? This one statement shows how much of an ego this guy has. Thinking he is some sort of revolutionary leader. What a dick! Maybe he should go to North Korea and try start one there!

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  40. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ jackinabox (665 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:58 am

    It’s unbelievable — do these people live in the same world? Do they ever leave their computers?

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  41. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    @ ThePeoplesFlag

    “So many angry old white people.”

    I’m not white.

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  42. SGA (1,025 comments) says:

    Cunningham at 9:00 am

    “Are you ready for a revolution?” pretty embarrassing really. Who the hell does he think he is?

    Roger Daltry or Pete Townsend, at a guess.

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  43. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    “I can rationalise my dislike of John Key very well, thank you Shawn”

    I have never seen any evidence of that.

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  44. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Are you ready for a revolution?” Students were chanting that in the 70’s, but I guess you won’t remember that, probably still shitting your nappies.

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  45. Gulag1917 (915 comments) says:

    It was not very diplomatic of John Key to use the term sugar daddy; it was slanderous.

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  46. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    The chant ‘f John Key’ started in the crowd. KDC did not chant it, although he didn’t stop it either and encouraged it.

    What do you base this on Judith, were you there? As KS notes above the two reporters who were there state that KDC started the chant.

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  47. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,832 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:03 am

    pffft – live with me do you? Of course you haven’t – I don’t ‘live’ on a blog – I have a real life where my opinions and beliefs are mostly formed. I read and comment here giving snippets of those – but really shawn, if you think any of the ‘whole’ person exists on here for any one of us, its time you logged off.

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  48. Nookin (3,341 comments) says:

    So you think that we should all ignore the rancid stench steaming out of the internet mana party and pretend that it doesn’t really mean that there is something very wrong, very corrupt and very, very disturbing about a criminal wanting to buy his way out of the justice system and politicians who are more that happy to help him, closing a blind eye to his repeated gaffes, so long as they can get their hands on his filthy lucre? Actually, it is not even his. According to the last court decision, there is an arguable case that he stole it. Not that Hone or Laila seem to give a toss.

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  49. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ciaron (1,329 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:05 am

    According to those who had looked at the tape – I refuse to go to the site and up the viewer numbers – the ‘f john key’ part started in the crowd – some believe probably by KDC plants, but who knows – he did however start the discontent with his statements about bringing down the govt, and he did encourage the chant to keep going – which no responsible parent would do. However, if a responsible parent had ‘stopped it’ no teenager would vote for him.

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  50. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    So Judith, you are taking the word of someone watching the tape over someone who was actually there?

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  51. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Nookin (3,058 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:07 am

    I think the media should comment on the political aspects, referring to Laila and Hone, but I think they should keep as far away from KDC as possible. Report factually on the legal aspects, and even where the money came from and so on BUT totally ignore his grandstanding and events and other similar stuff.

    Evidence has shown time and time again that giving people like this a voice through the media only influences the vulnerable and immature. Just ignore him – he can put what he likes on his site, and only a few will see it – but advertise it in the media, even if it is negatively criticising him, and thousands will view it.

    You are all buying into the game – you’re doing exactly what he wanted, and what he’s paying for. I can’t believe what suckers you are!

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  52. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    “The fainting fits and hysterical clutching of the head by smug right wing authoritarians in reaction to this video has cemented the Internet Party as the genuine protest vote for a connected generation.”

    lol at the expense of the Green vote.

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  53. Keeping Stock (10,339 comments) says:

    @ Judith – the Internet-Mana tape has been very carefully edited, showing the tail-end of the chant. It does NOT show how or where it began.

    I suspect that Jessica Williams and I are poles apart politically, but when she, as a reputable, professional radio journalist says “After this, he led the crowd in a ‘f*#k John Key’ chant, followed by: “Do you want to extradite John Key? All right! Woohhooo!”, I know whose word I am accepting. And it’s not Laila Harre’s.

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  54. James Stephenson (2,177 comments) says:

    cemented the Internet Party as the genuine protest vote for a connected generation.

    Hahaha, yeah right, unfortunately the Electoral Commisson don’t count Facebook “likes”.

    Sheesh, I thought us Gen-Xers were supposed to be the slacker generation.

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  55. Tarquin North (297 comments) says:

    Judith, you have the mentality of a lobotomised green voter. The reason the likes of Hitler ever came to power is because mental midgets like yourself didn’t believe it could happen. It did happen and it can happen again. As far as teenagers are concerned – I’ve had a couple, they tend to do anything they can to be anti establishment. Our daughter spent quite some time wandering around in black sheets with a satanic bible. I wasn’t allowed to say anything and she eventually came right. What the fat kraut is doing is entirely different and is basically a marketing campaign. This is straight out of the nazi/nationalist handbook on how to whip up a frenzied crowd into a mob that will do your bidding. Why are so many National signs getting vandalised? Is it just teenagers being teenagers or is it the next step? And you think I speak crap. wake up noddy.

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  56. Evadne (88 comments) says:

    What I find particularly distasteful is the lightning bolt logo on the screen behind Dotcom in that video. It did not get there by accident – it would have been a conscious choice. While lightning bolts may be innocuous in other contexts, within politics and political rallies it has one major significance & affiliation: as the symbol of facism.

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  57. EAD (1,082 comments) says:

    Wow – quite disturbing the level vitriol in this video. I bet you if you asked these useful idiots what specific points they disapprove about John Key, you would hear either silence, fabricated b/s or “he’s a rich prick”.

    I can understand National Party supporters attacking them from the right, but these people attacking him from the left? Just how much more of your agenda do you want him to implement before you’re happy (or are they they ultimate example of red team = good, blue team = bad)?

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  58. eszett (2,408 comments) says:

    But I do think he is a bit of a German nationalist, as see by the tapes of him in the car boasting (incorrectly) to Mona about how the Germans built the Eiffel Tower and Statue of Liberty.

    Oh please, you are really desperate on this one.

    It doesn’t make him a german nationalist, it makes him a german idiot. Emphasis on idiot!

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  59. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Keeping Stock (10,136 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:16 am

    If you listen to the tape on the link you gave KS, you will find the fuck john key chant starts at approximately 1.00 minute during KDC’s speech, and WAS NOT started by KDC but by some in the crowd. If you listen from the beginning you can hear a weak attempt to start it earlier than that, and then it stops, and starts again.

    Now, I’m not sure what happened after that tape ends, but the initial chant was NOT started by KDC.

    BUT you are still ignoring the fact, even if he did start it – you are giving him space he doesn’t need or deserve – ignore it

    And lets face it, thousands of NZ say ‘f john Key’ every day !! IT’s not exactly unusual.

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  60. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    thePeoplesFlag (189 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 8:51 am

    So many angry old white people.

    The fainting fits and hysterical clutching of the head by smug right wing authoritarians in reaction to this video has cemented the Internet Party as the genuine protest vote for a connected generation.

    Thanks!

    Yes, Thanks! This should cost the Greens a few MPs.

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  61. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Tarquin North (157 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:18 am

    You poor paranoid little ducky! You really really are the sort feeding this and giving weight to something that you clearly dislike. Do you realise it was the poor paranoid souls like you that actually gave Hitler and other dictators, their young people on a plate!

    I think prozac works well for paranoia, but maybe you need a bit a lithium too – but please whatever you do, stop being a KDC supporter by giving him our young people!

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  62. Nostalgia-NZ (5,200 comments) says:

    Hard to not to have the impression that the teenagers would have happily expressed themselves by singing the same chant and a different name – all a bit meaningless, much like ‘f… the ref’ at an English soccer game. I doubt that many of those in the chorus even intend to vote and were joining in the mantra simply because somebody else started it. KDC doesn’t seem sure at the moment if he is a ‘rapper’ any longer – but one thing for sure he ain’t no teenager. But what do ‘oldies’ expect a staid gathering in the local community hall, biscuits and a cup of tea – turn off the radio folks its 2014.

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  63. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    A personal vendetta and self-interest is not a “revolution”. I can see how it appeals to the gamer kidz but I’m still trying to figure out whether he actually believes his own rhetoric. I suspect his ego has run away with him, and that is indeed the case.

    There’s little tech or innovative about dot.com. He’s a (gifted) marketer and opportunist. Storage (hard drive on a server) and file swapping (Napster) was nothing new. It was commodity. What was different was MegaUpload’s “selling” point, a point which the US now want to ask him a few questions about.

    That is all there is to it.

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  64. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    What are you talkin about Nookin?

    “pretend that it doesn’t really mean that there is something very wrong, very corrupt and very, very disturbing about a criminal wanting to buy his way out of the justice system and politicians who are more that happy to help him”

    Are you talking about Peter Whittle buying his way out of the justice system and the politicians who were more than happy to help him?

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  65. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    “but really shawn, if you think any of the ‘whole’ person exists on here for any one of us, its time you logged off.”

    Pathetic excuse Judith. Many times people have asked about your hatred of JK and no rational answer has been forthcoming. What you may or may not say in your home is irrelevant to that.

    What I do know is that you are unable to let the slightest positive comment about JK go, and on every thread about him you are making post after post after post, easily outnumbering anyone else, telling us all how wrong we are and how bad/useless JK is.

    So of course here you are again, desperately and sadly doing the same.

    Now fair enough, we are all entitled to our opinions and views, but please, don’t pretend you have a rational approach to JK or this video.

    I’m not buying that, and I doubt many others are either.

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  66. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    Judith says:
    …and WAS NOT started by KDC but by some in the crowd.

    The reporters WHO WERE THERE say you are incorrect.

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  67. Nookin (3,341 comments) says:

    Don’t be a prat, jackinabox.

    No politicians were involved in the Pike river settlement. A judge presided. The money went to the families– not the politicians. The reasons were fully explained. Address the subject or start your own blog and your own thread. If you are going to do so, I suggest that you provide a very detailed analysis of the decision to drop the proceedings including the basis upon which you challenge the view of the Court and the Prosecutor that the proceedings could not succeed.

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  68. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    I was there carion, it was me that started that chant, you blimmen liar!

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  69. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,833 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:34 am

    I don’t give you an answer, because my reasons for not liking John Key are around an area of not being able to trust him, and to give you the details of why I formed that opinion, would allow you to find out my identity.

    Besides Shawn, its none of your business why I like or dislike Key. I’ve been honest and admitted I don’t – I don’t see why anything other than that, has anything to do with it.

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  70. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    BTW: teenagers would still see dot.com and certainly Harre as “old people”. Someone in their mid-20s is old to a 18 year old.

    From what I’ve heard from the local teenagers is that the only thing sadder than an old git is an old git who tries to act and sound hip. What is cool to a teenager is nuanced. They see right through old people (anyone over 25) trying to approximate it.

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  71. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “No politicians were involved in the Pike river settlement. A judge presided. The money went to the families– not the politicians.”

    Your faith that all is above board in the legal system is truly touching Nookin.

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  72. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ciaron (1,331 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:35 am

    Listen to the friggen speech on the link KeepingStock gives you prat – it’s pretty bloody obvious about 1 minute into it – but hey, you’ll believe what you want to believe, reality is obviously a little hard for you.

    I have to add, I feel for you – if you believe absolutely everything you read in the media, life must be very tough!

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  73. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    “I don’t give you an answer, because my reasons for not liking John Key are around an area of being able to trust him, and to give you the details of why I formed that opinion, would allow you to find out my identity.”

    That is very convenient Judith.

    “Besides Shawn, its none of your business why I like or dislike Key.”

    Yes it is, because you choose to inflict your views on the rest of us. If you want to publicly declare your hatred, then it becomes other peoples business.

    You can’t have it both ways. If you do not want the reasons discussed publicly, don’t declare your hatred publicly.

    And frankly, doing so on a National leaning blog and then whining when your questioned as to reasons, is monumentally arrogant, and more than a little delusional.

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  74. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    @Liam Hehir

    Of course Russell Brown would be downplaying any Nazi comparisons – because their validity is conditional on whether you approve or disapprove of the person being targeted. For example, regarding Destiny Church he said:

    “Stormtroopers …” says the guy next to me.

    I nod. I don’t like to bandy about the N-word, but it’s actually really hard to avoid the comparison as the black-clad men (and several dozen school-age boys) of the kapa haka group march past, chanting “enough is enough!” and pumping their right arms in the air in unison. I don’t know if they know how ugly it looks, or whether they simply don’t care.

    Russell has responded to that:

    It was a march targeting a minority, led by self-styled foot soldiers. And there were people from the National Front on it.

    So he can justify his impressions comments, but doesn’t think anyone should try and justify their impressions now.

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  75. Tinshed (170 comments) says:

    What is interesting to me is that it is we “angry old white people” and “smug right wing authoritarians” who are calling this out for what it is: semi-fascist demagoguery. I thought it was the role of the Left to call these things out. No post/article on The Standard as of this morning. My, how times have changed.

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  76. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    Ok Judith, lets work through this. On one hand:

    Two radio live journalists, who were there, saw and reported that KDC started the chant.

    on the other hand:

    A video that pans off KDC to the crowd, fades to a IMP logo on black background, then the audio of the crowd chanting “fuck John Key”

    And you still think the latter is more credible????

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  77. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ShawnLH (3,834 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:47 am

    I am really touched by your sentiments – you make it sound as if anything I say actually matters.

    It’s a blog shawn – a BLOG – nothing you or I say matters in the slightest in the bigger picture. I don’t ‘inflict’ my views on anyone that doesn’t want them. You see shawn, to know my views, you have to voluntarily read them – if you don’t want to do that – I believe you can simply scroll past them. Like I do with most of your rants over religion, the gaza etc (things that you have no expertise in and therefore authority in, only opinions like the rest of us).

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  78. hj (7,010 comments) says:

    What is the difference between chanting by these youths and control of media by advertising and sophisticated lobbying and spin?: one is overt the other is covert.

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  79. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ciaron (1,332 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 9:52 am

    Well certainly not you, because the journalists said he LEAD the chant, however, when you listen to the sound clip (which is unedited, unlike the video) you can hear very clearly where the chant starts – in the background when Kim Dot Com is still talking. Now he might be talented, but I don’t believe he can throw his voice and talk about something else at the same time. If you listen to the voice clip, you actually hear him stop the chant.

    But hey – you take your reality from an edited video clip and the media – you deserve to believe what you do!

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  80. Rich Prick (1,700 comments) says:

    Perhaps Dotcom needs reminding that he is a guest in this country. And he is wearing out his welcome.

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  81. Liam Hehir (125 comments) says:

    Pete George – except he was remarking on the optics of the situation – like the chanting, the fist pumping. He did not appear to me to be saying they were Nazis. But nor is DPF here. He is also comparing the same things – the optics. So the complaining has an element of hypocrisy to it.

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  82. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    Judith, they put it out, therefore endorsed the chant.

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  83. ShawnLH (5,025 comments) says:

    “It’s a blog shawn – a BLOG – ”

    Really? What was your first clue?

    ” Like I do with most of your rants over religion, the gaza etc (things that you have no expertise in”

    Actually I am an expert on religious issues.

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  84. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    How come we have all these “political marketing experts” at universities?

    What a waste of taxpayer money. Worse, what a waste of university focus and resources. We want engineers, technicians, agronomists, fisheries experts, maths teachers, and a modicum of culture specialists and far fewer law students. The accountants can at least start their learning in other tertiary institutions.

    We don’t need “political marketing experts” financed by taxpayers, and to a lesser extent from the student borrowings of students from taxpayers (that may never be paid back and set kids out on working lives with huge debts).

    The country’s education strategy and implementation is berserk. You wonder whether it will take NZ down.

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  85. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Peter (1,605 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 10:01 am

    Oh exactly – and I’m not saying otherwise. And didn’t they do a really good job by putting it out there on a very well edited video, that everyone is rushing to watch, and analyse and splash all over the media – allowing other impressionable young minds to see it, and think ‘how cool’ and probably vote for him/his party.

    Imagine how would be if you had all ignored it – left it where it was – how many views do you think it would have got then?

    How many kids would have never known of its existence if you’d all just bloody left it where it was – honestly, you are feeding this giant – you think you are turning young people off with talks of Nazi and so on – and all you are doing is making him a hero to them, because he’s managed to upset the ‘oldies’.

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  86. kiwi in america (2,449 comments) says:

    Judith
    Imagine a wealthy Swiss IT millionaire who made his money stealing artistic IP on line and got NZ residency. Helen Clark is PM and she signs a warrant for a police raid because the Swiss man is wanted in the US because of the IP he has stolen. There is a legal stuff up with the extradition and the Swiss man not only fights the extradition but decides to use his wealth to oust Clark. He forms a party called the NZ Pirate Party, persuades Ohariu MP Peter Dunn to merge with him and funds the new United/Pirate Party hybrid to the tune of $4 million.

    The UPP hold parties for students up and down NZ shouting them free or cheap booze. The Swiss man who hates Helen Clark gets on stage and urges a revolutionary overthrow of Labour and leads a chant of “F*** Helen Clark” and the UPP film the rally and THEY put it up on their website and social media. Would you honestly be on blogs downplaying the clip as just ‘kids being kids’?

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  87. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    I like that chant, it’s catchy. I wouldn’t be surprised if it suddenly appears on most of National’s hoardings.

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  88. chris (647 comments) says:

    The Greens must be quaking in their boots. InternetMana may well cause their vote to collapse for two reasons:

    1) Disaffected youth who might have otherwise voted for the Greens now voting for InternetMana. (On the other hand, they may not have voted anyway, and still may not.)

    2) Trendy middle class urbanites who might have voted Green “for the environment” but now see how dangerous IMP and the rest could be to the stability of the government and economy and vote National (or other) instead.

    This is certainly going to be a very interesting election. If IMP manage to get a seat then their votes aren’t wasted. If IMP don’t, then National should sail home easily. The Nats should be campaigning in Te Tai Tokerau to get people to vote for Kelvin Davis.

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  89. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ kiwi in america (2,446 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 10:07 am

    I’d be doing exactly what I’m doing now in the circumstances you mention, just because I don’t like John Key, doesn’t mean I’m a Labour supporter – although I am more left wing than right. This is not a political issue for me. It’s got nothing to do with my personal dislike of John Key. I am hoping National are able to form a government without being in a coalition – any other form of government is going to be disastrous at this time – and I have said so many times on here.

    This is about young voters – and who and what they vote for – and about the standards of political campaigns – which are getting more and more complicated, and nasty.

    KDC, is playing John Key’s game of personality politics, and advertising – but KDC is using it on our very young and impressionable first time voters. I work with young students, and I have five kids of my own – I know exactly how many of them are impressed – and KDC is playing to them – and the media – and its working.

    I am trying to make you all aware of the fact that voicing your disgust is EXACTLY what was expected. KDC released that video knowing full well the media would make something of it – it would feature on all the right wing blogs, and parents around the country would talk to their young people about how disgusting it is. Now sure, some of those young people will listen to their parents, but countless amounts of research has shown that young people listen mostly to their peers – and their peers think its cool — and it has the added bonus of peeving the parents off as well.

    You have bought into and are feeding a corrupt political campaign – its appalling!

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  90. Keeping Stock (10,339 comments) says:

    At the risk of repeating myself Judith, the video has been very cleverly and selectively edited to give the appearance that Dotcom did not lead the chant. But eyewitnesses have confirmed that the video is dishonest, and does not give the whole picture. Sober eyewitnesses are far more reliable :D

    But keep on defending the indefensible; your dislike of John Key is threatening to bubble over into anger, and I respectfully suggest you get help to deal with it.

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  91. OTGO (549 comments) says:

    It would’ve been ok if the IMP had a disclaimer, “no MP’s were harmed during the filming of this video”.

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  92. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Keeping Stock (10,137 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 10:18 am

    FFS, listen to the RAW sound clip – something that hasn’t been edited. That shows you exactly what was said and when. That sound clip was taken by the radio hosts, and is not an IP propaganda clip.

    It’s got nothing to do with John Key – it is about you lot giving Kim Dot Com attention – you’ve bought into his crap and are playing his game – you may as well join his bloody party because you are giving him votes by advertising for him!!

    If none of you had mentioned that friggen video – thousands of young voters would never had seen it – you and others are promoting it – just like KDC wanted you to – I hope you’re proud of yourselves!

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  93. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    Judith

    Imagine how would be if you had all ignored it – left it where it was – how many views do you think it would have got then?

    The people who follow political stories on the news aren’t his target market. The people who follow political stories on the news are “old people”. Hipkins appears to understand this as he realises the video will keep Labour voters at home, or encourage some to vote National.

    It seems that KDC is following a……how shall I put this…..”template”, but trips over as many times as scores because he doesn’t appear to understand context.

    This is an epic fail.

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  94. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Keeping Stock (10,137 comments) says:

    August 8th, 2014 at 10:18 am

    At the risk of repeating myself Judith, the video has been very cleverly and selectively edited to give the appearance that Dotcom did not lead the chant. But eyewitnesses have confirmed that the video is dishonest, and does not give the whole picture. Sober eyewitnesses are far more reliable :D

    But keep on defending the indefensible; your dislike of John Key is threatening to bubble over into anger, and I respectfully suggest you get help to deal with it.”

    If it wasn’t for the fact that it was me that started the “FUCK JOHN KEY” chant I’d say it was the right wing media that started it!

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  95. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Peter (1,607 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 10:27 am

    The people who follow political stories on the news aren’t his target market. The people who follow political stories on the news are “old people”.

    Yes Peter, old people – parent’s of young first time voters, who watch the news, see how disgusting it was – talk to their young people about it – raising their awareness to it – so they go and find it – think how cool it is because they know someone there, or just because chants and rap and crap is ‘cool’ – so they go to Uni or work or where ever, and show their mates, who look at it, and tell others – and so on. And the whole of this is made so much cooler because Mum and Dad (old people) tell us NOT to vote for him – and stuff them “lets do it” – just to peeve the ‘olds’ off, if for no other reason!!

    Like I said – he’s playing a game – and you’ve all been ‘played’ – well done! He knew if it was disgusting, but not ‘too disgusting’ the media would pick up on it –

    Its not a fail. Its been a ‘epic’ success – because everyone is talking about it – and that video has been watched by thousands, when before only a handful might have seen it, and within that thousands will be some people that will think its cool, and brave and familiar to them.

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  96. TMC (75 comments) says:

    So not sure why Judith is getting so much flack…she has a point about much of it just being stupid teenage liquor fuelled angst/rebellion. Dot Com is stupid to think they’re all along for him and not just the free booze. In fact, have a read of the Dad’s letter over on Whale Oil. He brings up many of the same points. Admittedly, I’ve skimmed over the back and forth above so am just responding to her original post.

    As for bringing attention to the video, I think there will be some people that look at it now and decide yeah that’s great – count me in dude. But overall, the general feeling is revulsion and it will be a net galvanising affect against IMP. So somewhere someone is probably weighing up the two tracks and deciding to go with giving it as much sunlight as possible.

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  97. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    When the porkie bastards did their illegal ninja raid on the Coatsville Mansion I said to the Missus, “here we go again, stoopid mongrel cops are at it again. The dopey idiots haven’t learnt a thing from their Urawera debacle.” So when Dot Com called for people to sign up for the new Internet Party I was in there like a chinaman at the gates of Lochinver Station.

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  98. Dean Papa (784 comments) says:

    “For the record I don’t think Dotcom is a Nazi, even though he collects their memorabilia”

    hahahahaha!!!

    DPF oozing sincerity like pus from a boil !!

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  99. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    Judith:

    Yes Peter, old people – parent’s of young first time voters, who watch the news, see how disgusting it was – talk to their young people about it – raising their awareness to it – so they go and find it – think how cool it is because they know someone there, or just because chants and rap and crap is ‘cool’ – so they go to Uni or work or where ever, and show their mates, who look at it, and tell others – and so on. And the whole of this is made so much cooler because Mum and Dad (old people) tell us NOT to vote for him – and stuff them “lets do it” – just to peeve the ‘olds’ off, if for no other reason!!

    The teenagers I know display much more nuanced behaviour. The fact that old people are talking about it **at all** will just as likely turn them off. KDC becomes an “old persons thing” simply because old people are talking about it.

    Teenagers don’t need their contexts defined for them (for or against KDC), they can define their own contexts. The internet provides endless contexts in which to exist and express themselves. It’s also the reason they’re less engaged with mainstream activities, such as politics. There are many things competing for their attention.

    The teenager you’re describing appears to be a reactionary 60’s clone. Perhaps talking about yourself?

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  100. Psycho Milt (2,412 comments) says:

    So he can justify his impressions comments, but doesn’t think anyone should try and justify their impressions now.

    Well, yes Pete – but that’s because he actually had some justification for his comments, as opposed to the parade of dumbasses on here claiming that a crowd of people shouting is just like the Nazis.

    …the video has been very cleverly and selectively edited to give the appearance that Dotcom did not lead the chant.

    Hardly seems worth the bother. The fact that Dotcom and Key don’t like each other isn’t exactly breaking news.

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  101. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “…the video has been very cleverly and selectively edited to give the appearance that Dotcom did not lead the chant.”

    Where are the “independent” media videos proving that Dot Com started the chant?

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  102. grumpy (260 comments) says:

    Judith (7,811 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 10:33 am

    Wow, Judith 7811 comments! Some people are paid by Labour, Greens and Unions to sit in front of the computer all day and write on The Standard, and then a few lucky ones get to post here……………

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  103. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    Well, yes Pete – but that’s because he actually had some justification for his comments, as opposed to the parade of dumbasses on here claiming that a crowd of people shouting is just like the Nazis.

    It’s not just “dumbasses on here claiming” Psycho. I’ve sown the video to a number of people not involved or interested in politics and their initial reaction was generally along the lines of Nazi connotations. Someone I know well who grew up in Germany immediately thought “Nazi”.

    It’s not the people in the crowd that’s the problem, it’s the deliberate manipulation of the crowd for political purposes that’s chiling for many people, along with calls for revolution and deposing the government..

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  104. backster (2,171 comments) says:

    Chris….”The Nats should be campaigning in Te Tai Tokerau to get people to vote for Kelvin Davis.”

    ……….No Labour and Davis should be reminding the constituents of TeTai Tokerau that Hone has sold out his Mana to a German Criminal of the type that their forefathers in the Maori battalion laid down their lives to protect their people from in World War 2, and if they value their memories they won’t betray them at the ballot box.

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  105. Unity (583 comments) says:

    Kim Dot Com is bringing politics in this country to a new low. Putting that video on YouTube is utterly disgraceful. The sooner he is extradited the better. In the meantime we should ignore him. He just loves the attention and is drawing the rebellious young people to his Party.

    Laila Harre loses her credibility by trying to excuse the chanting and resultant video. She should resign – but she won’t because she just loves those lovely dollars.

    Also, the ‘f’ word which seems to be now ingrained into everyday language, just disgusts me. The young can’t seem to appreciate what an awful word it is. What sort of kids are we now rearing?

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  106. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ grumpy (242 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 11:15 am

    That’s right grumpy, when you can’t refute the message, attack the poster and pass doubt on their integrity.

    Sorry to disappoint you, but I post only for myself. I am self employed by contract, some of which involves me being on line in case required – my work has nothing to do with politics.

    The fact that you don’t ‘attack’ other posters who have more comments than me, demonstrates your hypocritical stance – your contempt is only given to those with a large amount of posts – who don’t think the same as you – are you always hateful to those who are different to you?

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  107. SGA (1,025 comments) says:

    Pete George at 11:20 am

    It’s not just “dumbasses on here claiming” Psycho. I’ve sown the video to a number of people not involved or interested in politics and their initial reaction was generally along the lines of Nazi connotations. Someone I know well who grew up in Germany immediately thought “Nazi”.

    Sorry Pete – if I had to put a soundtrack to that video, it would be “The Who” or “The Sex Pistols”, not Wagner.

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  108. OneTrack (3,092 comments) says:

    “No Labour and Davis should be reminding the constituents of TeTai Tokerau that Hone has sold out his Mana to a German Criminal of the type that their forefathers in the Maori battalion laid down their lives to protect their people from in World War 2, and if they value their memories they won’t betray them at the ballot box”

    Except Labour needs KDC in parliament to prop up their government. So Labour say one thing openly but all their actions indicate the opposite.

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  109. grumpy (260 comments) says:

    Judith (7,813 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    Funny…..some of your grammar and word useage, like frequent use of “hateful” has a familiar ring to it……….?

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  110. chris (647 comments) says:

    @backster

    Chris….”The Nats should be campaigning in Te Tai Tokerau to get people to vote for Kelvin Davis.”

    ……….No Labour and Davis should be reminding the constituents of TeTai Tokerau that Hone has sold out his Mana to a German Criminal of the type that their forefathers in the Maori battalion laid down their lives to protect their people from in World War 2, and if they value their memories they won’t betray them at the ballot box.

    Absolutely they should, but they’re not going to and appear to have done a shady backroom deal with IMP. They’re quite prepared to use coat tailing to allow a coalition partner into Parliament, but apparently are going to revoke the coat tail rule if elected. Hypocrisy much?

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  111. Goldsmith (27 comments) says:

    With fat dotcon in front, for a moment I thought they were chanting…. KFC, KFC, KFC!

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  112. Paulus (2,627 comments) says:

    The Gastarbieter (Guest worker) will soon start to teach the Horst Wessel song.

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  113. Jinky (185 comments) says:

    I’m highly amused at the faux outrage on here because some dodgy bloke who has been hyped by media for months gets on stage and gets a bunch of pissed up teenagers to shout a few swear words!! Seen much worse at punk gigs, football matches and Anti Poll tax marches in UK. F**K off Maggie was always popular in Scotland in the Eighties. These same kids will flock to see John Key, Dan Carter or Richie McCaw.

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  114. Dean Papa (784 comments) says:

    I don’t get it either, Jinky. When I saw it on the telly I laughed. The Hitler comparisons are hysterical. But I suspect that all of this faux outrage is really a thin mask, behind which lies much fear and paranoia. Something to do with the upcoming election, I believe.

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  115. Pete George (23,559 comments) says:

    But it’s not just “some dodgy bloke who has been hyped by media for months gets on stage and gets a bunch of pissed up teenagers to shout a few swear words”.

    The same bloke and the party he is founder and visionary of used footage of this to promote his party.And it doesn’t help that the bloke looked chiilingly like another bloke to many people. As one person put it – “He’s put on an awful lot of weight and shaved off his funny little mustache…?”

    And the leader of the party has claimed this shows how young people express their feelings of anger and disillusionment in the current Goverment. To her it’s a major political message, except that it’s also claimed to be just a bunch of young people being sweary chanty young people.

    Is it trivial or is it a sign of a revolution brewing? Depends on who they are trying to appease or please.

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  116. jcuk (686 comments) says:

    I am with Judith … I have not seen the clip, nor will I search it out … I will just ignore it and regret the state of the media these days and remind myself that the ‘old white men’ of whatever actual colour are much the same as when I was a young person and deserve the finger as they pontificate.

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  117. burt (8,269 comments) says:

    I wonder if Dotcom has the mental capacity to appreciate that although he is enjoying whipping up anti govt hysteria that IF he were to become PM himself these same people would be shouting “F##K Dotcom” withing 4 years of him being their new messiah.

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  118. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ grumpy (246 comments) says:
    August 8th, 2014 at 12:07 pm

    Yeah, you got me, every single person that has ever used the word ‘hateful’ on here is me.

    There is no one else in New Zealand that doesn’t like John Key but me.

    Do I really come across as someone that is insecure and would care enough about what others think that I would have multiple logins to a blog? Why on earth would I do that? If I was that sensitive, the last place I’d post as a leftie, is on Kiwiblog. If you are familiar with my posts you’ll know that ‘impressing people’ is certainly not something I try to do. I have no desire to be one of the crowd that wants to bottle up John Key’s farts to take home and sniff, and I’m not afraid to say that, even on here among his biggest fans.

    I’ve had one other login in, under the name of Jinny, which I can’t access and haven’t been able to for a couple of years, which is why I have this one. Maybe you are a bit delicate and sensitive to what people think about your words on an anonymous blog – but I’m no shrinking violet honey! Please don’t mistake me for someone that cares that much!

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  119. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    F***ing John Key: How Kim Dotcom and Internet-Mana transformed the Right into their best recruiters.

    By Chris Trotter / August 8, 2014

    ARE YOU READY FOR A REVOLUTION? When was the last time anybody asked a crowd of young New Zealanders that question? Seriously? When was the last time a political party, with a reasonable chance of putting at least five people into Parliament, had five candidates for whom the idea of participating in a revolution wasn’t utterly abhorrent?

    Honestly? The last time such a thing happened was nearly 100 years ago, when Peter Fraser openly admitted that, were he in Russia, he would be a Bolshevik; and when Labour’s first parliamentary leader, Harry Holland, in his maiden speech, informed the New Zealand Parliament that:

    “We of the Labour Party come to endeavour to effect a change of classes at the fountain of power. We come proclaiming boldly and fearlessly the Socialist objective of the Labour movement throughout New Zealand; and we make no secret of the fact that we seek to rebuild society on a basis in which work and not wealth will be the measure of a man’s worth.

    “We do not seek to make a class war. You cannot make that which is already in existence. We recognise that the antagonisms which divide society into classes are economically foundationed, and we are going, if we can, to end the class war by ending the causes of class warfare.”

    Both Peter Fraser and Harry Holland were former members of the militant trade union organisation known as the “Red Feds” (The New Zealand Federation of Labour) and were well versed in the ways of inspiring their mostly young audiences. Being good Edwardians, they would have shied away from the public use of Anglo-Saxon expletives but, as good Socialists, they would not have hesitated to state in 3,000 impassioned words what a boisterous crowd of Canterbury students this week condensed into just three. Confronted with this government’s and this prime minister’s record, the essence of Peter Fraser’s and Harry Holland’s message would also have been: “Fuck John Key!”

    The young advisers to the Internet-Mana Party, at whose urging the in/famous FJK clip was posted on YouTube (21,665 hits and counting) knew what they were doing. Quite apart from accurately anticipating the reaction of their peers, they also hazarded a shrewd guess as to how the “offensive” clip would be received by the political and media guardians of the status-quo.

    And they have not been disappointed. Almost to a person, the conservative commentariat has condemned Internet-Mana in the most extravagant terms. PR maven and political commentator, Matthew Hooton, tweeted that the clip contained images reminiscent of a Munich beer-hall circa 1920, thereby setting in motion a Kim-Dotcom-as-Adolf-Hitler meme that within hours would infect huge chunks of the mainstream media. Curiously, very few media commentators appeared to consider how gratefully such criticism might be received by a movement whose primary objective is to be seen as the antithesis of everything old and well-behaved and conventional and boring.

    The over-riding goal of Internet-Mana is to be branded as dangerous and transgressive. The Powers-That-Be have co-operated splendidly.

    Then again, they may have had no choice. The internal polling of the major political parties may well be detecting the invisible effects of what the visible manifestations of Internet-Mana’s efforts are signalling. The packed halls and enthusiastic chanting of the hundreds of young people who have turned out for the party’s public meetings may simply be the tip of a vast iceberg of political re/engagement on the part of those who usually keep well away from the electoral fray. The pool of voters may be expanding; bringing into play for the first time since 2005 the marginalised, the disillusioned, and – most alarmingly for the forces of the Right – the angry and aggrieved. The sort of people who need very little excuse to begin chanting – “Fuck John Key!”

    This is the stuff of nightmares for the Right. Rising participation in the electoral process has always spelled doom for conservative administrations. John Key’s best-case scenario has always been one of mass political somnambulance: in which hundreds of thousands of voters, convinced by the pollsters and their journalistic interpreters that the election was already won, would march, zombielike, into the polling-booths and make the media’s prophecies come true. Kim Dotcom’s unparalleled ability to disturb and disrupt has put this fantastical scenario to the sword. Even worse (from John Key’s perspective) the political spell he has cast cannot now be recalled.

    Even were all the rumours of dark secrets soon to be revealed proved correct, the effect of their release would likely be very different from that anticipated by their purveyors. The Establishment, in its hysterical reaction to the FJK clip, has already demonstrated a willingness to do almost anything to upend Internet-Mana’s campaign. Even the most scurrilous revelations will now be received by the insurgent party’s target audience as yet further proof of the extraordinary lengths to which the Powers-That-Be will go to bring Dotcom down.

    The optimum strategy to derail Dotcom was always to completely ignore him. But even that option is now denied his enemies. In his Auckland Town Hall meeting of the 15 SeptemberDotcom has laid a trap which the National Government cannot escape. If it attempts to persuade the news media to stay away from the meeting and/or wilfully misrepresent its significance, Dotcom’s case will be made against Key with a force equal to or greater than any evidence he may, with Glenn Greenwald’s internationally visible assistance, produce.

    Like Brer Fox and his Tar Baby, Kim Dotcom has, in Internet-Mana, created an object which the Prime Minister and his allies simply could not resist. In his version of the story, however, there will be no Briar Patch into which the Prime Minister can, like Brer Rabbit in “Uncle Remus’s” famous tale, be conveniently thrown and thus escape his fate. If all goes according to Dotcom’s plan, the refrain upon which this story ends will not be “Born and bred in the Briar Patch, Brer Fox! Born and bred in the Briar Patch!” but “Fuck-John-Key! Fuck-John-Key! Fuck-John-Key!”

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  120. Viking2 (11,470 comments) says:

    I note that tonight that nasty piece of short man from Christchurch has come out describing all this as nasty and he doesn’t think any NZ Pm should be subject to free speech.

    Ah well me thinks he has a very short memory just like himself and his dick.
    I’m sure DG will be really impressed.

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  121. Nostalgia-NZ (5,200 comments) says:

    Chris Trotter didn’t explain how the difference between Fraser and Holland’s time translate to his theory that event, is similar, to what the IP is doing. The earlier message reached into working families, it’s far from clear where DC is reaching – but the idea that popularity (or revolution) rises from political party meetings where slogans as deeply thought out as fjk by people who don’t appear to really know what they’re shouting for, certainly not about empty stomachs, housing, wages or similar are a rising force in this election is off beat. They still seem certain of collecting an important vote, even though the message they appear to absorb is diverse and unclear.

    Peters probably wins with this. People disturbed by the IP or DC don’t see Labour as anything but obscure on the issue, now – as Trotter says, JK is ‘on notice’ as to what will be ‘revealed’ about him before the election. No answer from either party (Lab or Nats) to any concerns – while Peters smiles from the election boards having been both neutral and committed on the issue of DC. It’s an interesting playing field, and apparently a ‘fair one’ because every party knows to expect anything, at any time – particularly fine planning that steps through many phases, either by accident, improvisation, or good planning. Meanwhile Winston knows he will go which ever way the wind blows.

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  122. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Screw it. Seriously. The ridiculous reaction to this video and the god winning, concern trolling, atrocious and mendacious reactions from the usual suspects had solidified my intention to vote IMP as a big FU to the lot of you. I voted Nat/Act in 96 in a fit of youthful rural conservative know nothingism and since then have voted lab/lab lab/lab lab/green lab/green lab/nzf but over the last couple of years have increasingly felt like throwing a brick through a bank window would be useful. But now, screw it. Count this 36 year old father of two, owner of two properties, 4wd driving, private sector consultant, blue rural seat dweller as so totally F’n peeved enough to vote to cast my vote for chaos. Burn it all down, just burn it all down and start again.”

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  123. masterman (19 comments) says:

    Those who use the Nazi connotations obviously have no concept of history. Hitler’s “win Volk, win Reich, win Fuehrer (one, people, one empire, one leader)” is much much closer to National/Act politics than anything Internet/Mana come up with. You need look no further than your Key party billboards to see where we are heading (one leader), and Jamie Whyte trying to philosophise implicit racism of one nation, one law for all far closer to Aryanism.

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  124. masterman (19 comments) says:

    Those who use the Nazi connotations obviously have no concept of history. Hitler’s “ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Fuehrer (one, people, one empire, one leader)” is much much closer to National/Act politics than anything Internet/Mana come up with. You need look no further than your Key party billboards to see where we are heading (one leader), and Jamie Whyte trying to philosophise implicit racism of one nation, one law for all far closer to Aryanism.

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