General Debate 17 June 2019

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krazykiwi

Krazy K Cooks Stuff : Week 17

Thanks to my followers who emailed and tweeted after last week’s recipe. Most of you managed the cooking and salting pretty well, but I was amused that so many had trouble with the wrapping. It’s only Fish & Chips guys… Not. That. Difficult. Even our PM can manage this stuff.

Ok, so onward and upward. Today we’re going to learn how to bake The Ultimate COL Cake. It’s perfect for when friends and family descend on your place over the weekend. A word of warning though. As spectacular as the finished cake looks, best not let them eat it. It’s disappointingly hollow, as you’ll discover.

First things first, though. The Ingredients:
♦ 3 cups of high-grade hubris.
♦ 2 cups of selfies (can substitute with hugz).
♦ 1.5 tsp of Speaker protection.
♦ 2 cups of dark coca (can substitute with green gaia).
♦ 400g of softened MSM.
♦ 1 small, slurring drunkard.
♦ A pinch of Twyford oil (can substitute with 4 cups snake oil)
♦ 3 cups of green hypocrisy.
♦ Lawnmower clippings (Note to Mods: this is for decorative purposes).

Method:
♦ Pre-heat the oven to 320 MekaWhaitiris. Furiously hot – right?
♦ Combine all the ingredients in a large mixing bowl. Mix enthusiastically, adding extra softened MSM as required.
♦ Use some speaker butter to grease the cake tin and distribute the mixture evenly.
♦ Bake until fluffy, light and completely without substance.
♦ Remove from oven and sprinkle lawnmower clippings (note to Mods: see!)
♦ The cake now needs to be left to lie a while. Take a few moments to fabricate a story explaining your creation, then take some selfies to ‘gram. After this, use a prong to test that the cake is indeed hollow. If you’ve got it right, it should be completely without substance or integrity.

On confirming this you can safely toss the cake in the bin.

Next week, and in response to Taranaki followers’ requests, we’ll be making a Recession Pie. Very straightforward – it’s essentially baked potato peal. Great for when your job disappears unexpectedly.
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June 17, 2019 8:00am
- Sacha
  
  Will there will be a recipe book for Christmas giving?
  Sounds like a sure fire best seller!
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:57am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Yes. The working title is “Turkeys vote for Christmas”, and the book will almost certainly include “Duck Surprise”, a Basil Faulty classic.
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:43am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      From the Gourmet Night episode of Fawlty Towers, where Basil tries to raise the tone of his establishment.
      
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      June 17, 2019 11:14am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        And doubled the value of shares in British Leyback by thrashing the car with the branch of the tree!
        
        One of the best episodes ever including:
        
        Sybil- where are you going with that garden gnome Basil?
        Basil – I am going to do something physically impossible to Mr Potts the builder!
        
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        June 17, 2019 11:25am
    - Sacha
      
      @. krazyKiwi: Excellent. I will need 19 autographed copies. I know so many Turkeys –
      
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      June 17, 2019 8:31pm
- noskire
  
  Brilliant!
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:47am
slightlyrighty

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/politicians-mistakenly-agreed-to-ban-magazines-for-all-firearms/ar-AACXzXq?ocid=spartandhp

Turns out that David Seymour was correct to vote against rushed, kneejerk legislation.
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June 17, 2019 8:02am
- Charmaine Hawke
  
  Yes what say you now Chris Bishop, Judith Collins et al you all look bloody foolish
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:51am
  - Jack5
    
    Meanwhile here’s how a Leftist political reporter is reported on the Stuff web site:
    
    Newshub political reporter Jenna Lynch said the ACT Party had been “absolutely tone-deaf” since the Christchurch terrorist attacks.
    
    “All they have done so far is oppose the gun laws and try open up hate speech laws so we can be more racist,” she said. “However, I think they’re feeling emboldened because free speech is one of the only things that David Seymour seems to be getting any cut-through on.”
    
    Lynch’s dismissive remarks about free speech were made at Newshub, but are reported on the competitor’s web site.
    
    Our print media are enthusiastic about scuttling democratic rights of free speech.
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/113512521/act-party-rebrand-no-name-change-will-refocus-on-lifting-laws-against-racial-abuse
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:06am
    - lastmanstanding
      
      The Left MSM are morons. They fail to understand that if in the future a very Right Wing Government is elected ( an no one can say it wont happen) it will THEIR free speech that is curtailed .
      
      Dumb Dumb and Dumber. That the NZ MSM.
      
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      June 17, 2019 12:55pm
Souvlaki

Sooooo…. what news from Pike River now all the publicity seeking hoopla has faded? Is this because the whole expensive fiasco has ended in predictable ignominy ?
Come on ” investigative reporters”…WHAT is happening ?
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June 17, 2019 8:03am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  We will be required to put more money into this literal black hole to get the ‘truth’!
  
  That is as long as the truth does not show that the gas sensors were covered or the remnants of a packet of 20 Rothmans
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:27am
  - sooty
    
    That 2as the other week when thy were using empteen cement trucks to poour money down the black hole!
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:39am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Shall we tell the Ministers for Virtue Signalling in the CoL how much CO2 cement production creates?
      
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      June 17, 2019 1:05pm
  - lemuzz
    
    Or a joint or two.
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:55am
  - NoCash
    
    Did we have plain package back then? If so, it would be difficult to identify the brand.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:01am
  - KiWombat
    
    There does not seem to have been any activity at PR since all those cement trucks went in a week or so back.
    
    Should have added that the day before all those cement trucks went in there were several Police vehicles roaring past with lights ablaze. Not unusual to see Police vehicles going in there, but they don’t normally appear to be in such a hurry. Perhaps they were late for donut hour !
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:26am
- Yvette
  
  The Minister Responsible for Pike River Re-entry is responsible for a multi-year appropriation that includes:
  • $12.099 million in 2019/20 for the operations of the Pike River Recover Agency including the re-entry and recovery of the Pike River mine drift and rehabilitation of the mine site in accordance with the Memorandum of Understanding entered into with the Department of Conservation, and
   • $1.110 million in 2020/21 for the disestablishment of the Pike River Recovery Agency.  https://www.budget.govt.nz/budget/pdfs/estimates/v2/est19-v2-pikeriv.pdf
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:31am
- herb1
  
  FWIWhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ur_Wd8OUiXA&feature=youtu.be
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:02am
  - kevn
    
    @herb… So they have gone in 30m as at early May. ‘Only’ 2km’s (2000m) more to get to the rockfall.
    No mention of the flooding in the mine. From the video I saw it looked almost 1m deep.
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:10am
    - sooty
      
      That’s intersting!
      
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      June 17, 2019 12:03pm
Maggie Pie

A ‘word to the wise’ based on personal experience:
Beware of anyone [male or female] sporting a neck tattoo 🙁
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June 17, 2019 8:04am
- srylands
  
  Things to watch out for on first dates..
  
  Neck tattoos
  
  Homeopathists.
  
  Anti vaxxers
  
  Organic farmers
  
  Nissan Leaf owners
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:30am
  - sooty
    
    Never trust Bald and polished heads!
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:40am
    - kowtow
      
      Which is the danger sign , the baldness or the polishing?
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:53am
    - Ruahine
      
      I have found that it is what is connected to the bald and shaved heads is the problem.
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:54am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      In women?
      
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      June 17, 2019 6:00pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Vegans, although this breed of nut job usually confess to their condition with the initial meet and greet handshake followed by affirmation of their diminished mental wellbeing at intervals no greater than 150 secomds, so usually quite easy to spot.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:00am
    - stephieboy
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Paulus Gnome, the same could be said of Carnivores like you!
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:23am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        Stephie explains his illness in one sentence.
        
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        June 17, 2019 9:35am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    People who don’t wear socks with their shoes.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:18am
    - noskire
      
      The exception being knee-high socks with sandals.
      
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      June 17, 2019 10:50am
  - slightlyrighty
    
    Nothing wrong with Leaf Owners. They will have more cash to pay for dinners and booze.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:29am
- Fletch
  
  Or a neck beard….
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:25am
  - Chris R
    
    …especially on a female!
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:15am
Camryn Brown

I updated my guest post on wealth inequality based on comments received here on Kiwiblog and posted it on Medium… “The Negative Effects of Wealth Inequality Owe More to Jealousy than Poverty” https://link.medium.com/uMiYjvKkyX
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June 17, 2019 8:05am
- double d
  
  Good job Cam.
  I had a look back at comments from the original article in February. Worth a look back for KBers.
  Jealousy is the central plank for the COL and some good points and analogies in the article and comments.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:29am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Camryn Brown ,it does not boil down to an antiquated Victorian prescription moralising about ” “jealousy” as a prime cause.
  
  Other than that you’re vague on specifics other than detecting a kind of discredited trickledown theory in disguise .
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:31am
  - Camryn Brown
    
    I’m not sure how you get “trickle down” the article. First, wealth has already arrived at the bottom of the pile whether it trickled there or not. Our poorest experience vastly improved material conditions than in even the recent past. Second, I’m clearly supportive of ongoing government-led redistribution to provide public goods and services… just not to the extent it becomes punitive. That’s the specifics… “stay as we are, don’t do dumb stuff like the Green New Deal because it’s literally green with jealousy not green for the environment”.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:56pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Well reasoned. Whenever I have the “rich are getting richer” debate with leftie mates I challenge them with the statements that “At no time in human history has wealth and power been so evenly distributed”, and “every month more than two million Indians above the poverty line”. The but, but, butting that ensues is quite fun. Their envy is laid bare pretty quickly.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:40am
peterwn

Whaleoil’s ‘Face of the Day’ is some ridiculous made up pictures of baby Neve. It is IMO in extremely poor taste. No child should ever be ridiculed in such a manner. One more reason not to take out a whaleoil sub.
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June 17, 2019 8:08am
- mark15
  
  I’m surprised there isn’t a squirrel outfit
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:29am
  - sooty
    
    But you are fine for the parents to media whore the baby.
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:47am
    - sooty
      
      Note.
      I have been over to WO, for a bow peep.
      You do realise that you can dummys like them for amusement, instead of the plain old fashion ones.
      I think you are just an old Labour voter!
      
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      June 17, 2019 8:57am
    - stephieboy
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      sooty, I don’t think Neve will suffer later in life PTSD like you appear to do.
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:33am
    - alloytoo
      
      Both are in very poor taste.
      
      It’s possible to criticise the “Media Whoring” of the poor child without contributing to it.
      
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      June 17, 2019 10:16am
  - hullkiwi
    
    Did someone mention squirrel’s first birthday?
    
    Has she learnt to crawl yet?
    
    Or has she taken her first steps, yet?
    
    Did you know (because I didn’t want to know until I hear it on the radio on the weekend) that the mother is going to have time to bake a cake herself!
    
    News you didn’t want to hear brought to you by Labour spin and the NZ MSM!
    
    Message for the mother, the kid doesn’t eat cake….it’s all about the adults (& remember that sugar is bad for the teeth)!
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:55am
    - KiWombat
      
      Hullki, even if she has crawled or taken first steps, these will be banked for next year rather than released now, just like the “Pink play date!”
      
      They will need a few Womens Weekly front pages next year, so these will be saved, along with first words and honeymoon pics.
      
      Should manage to tie up the front page of Womens Weekly for a few months with those in an election year – genius !
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:31am
      - sooty
        
        Then the wedding, who were the guests, did the aunties get the invite, was there enough product provided.
        No she is not allowed to take time off from the parliament sitting days for the honeymoon!
        
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        June 17, 2019 10:40am
    - lastmanstanding
      
      I wonder when the bastards parents are going to get married
      
      https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/bastard
      
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      June 17, 2019 1:04pm
- waldonz
  
  Maybe if the parents didn’t use their child in such a cynical manner, then posts like the one on WO wouldn’t occur.
  
  I’m sick to my back teeth of Jacinda Ardern using her baby like toilet paper. Rolling it out every time she needs to clean up her shit.
  
  Note: the above was an actual quote I saw over the weekend on Twitter. It was both funny and oh so true.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:40am
  - sooty
    
    Well said that person!
    
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    June 17, 2019 8:58am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Nothing better to see KB poster getting wound up ,sweaty hot and bothered.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:35am
    - stigie
      
      Same as you at St Lukes, wound up, sweaty hot but couldn’t be bothered with their mother !~
      
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      June 17, 2019 10:19am
      - sooty
        
        Remember when you got all hot and sweaty because someone had left a note on the St Albans church notice board? Ralph!
        
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        June 17, 2019 10:42am
- Tony Stuart
  
  By all means criticise the parents. But Neve didn’t choose to be born to the Ardern-Gayford’s, and she doesn’t choose to be pimped to the media.
  
  As a general rule, I say leave politicians’ families out of the debate. However in Gayford’s place, he takes the title bestowed on him by the media, First Man, seriously, and loves to join the debate. That’s fine, but it makes him fair game to be held to account for his contributions to it. But let Neve grow up into some semblance of normality, away from the media spotlight.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:20am
  - gravedodger
    
    While I concur with the spirit of your comment Tony, it is the parents(advisedly) who need to understand the ethos.
    I see Labour spinners and weavers all over the management of the Neve Ardern-Gayford child, sadly it will remain in the ether for ever.
    When Speaker Mallard made his ruling I was in favour but there has been too much and it seems coincidentally to appear when things get a bit sticky for the Mother and her public life.
    
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    June 17, 2019 3:11pm
NZpatriot

I attended the ACT conference yesterday in Auckland. It was jam-packed.

After the Nats basically sold out on free speech and firearm laws, I’m voting for ACT in 2020.

I don’t agree with David Seymour on everything, but he’s a man of integrity who has been afraid to consistently advocate for the classical liberal view.

I encourage others to strongly consider voting for ACT too.
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June 17, 2019 8:14am
- srylands
  
  Yes I have switched too. I have decided to resign my National Party membership.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:31am
- Souvlaki
  
  Hear hear !
  The guy is smart, and arguably the MOST honest politician in NZ and head and shoulders above the bulk of the Nats.
  At least in Epsom…we have two very good MPs..Seymour and Goldsmith.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:35am
  - Ruahine
    
    Paul Goldsmith performance at QT in the House is such that it is a pity he does not have more questions available to ask.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:59am
- waldonz
  
  I’m seriously considering giving my party vote to Act and becoming a member.
  
  I can’t give my candidate vote to Act as there is no Act candidate in my neck of the woods.
  
  I oppose anyone who tries to silence free speech. Good on Mr Seymour.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:42am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    waldonz, adding to ACT’s last poor performance 2017 by one vote.
    
    Got for it!
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:37am
  - GJM
    
    I have never been a member of a political party. Just recently, I paid the sub using my own money (what little Jacinda has left me) and joined ACT.
    I didn’t leave the National Party, National left me.
    My late parents were life long National supporters and financial members, but towards the end, my father at least changed to ACT for the same reasons. I know David Garret’s 3 strikes law played a part
    
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    June 17, 2019 6:42pm
- The Feed
  
  I’ve also switched.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:45am
  - Sarkozygroupie
    
    As have I.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:48pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘After the Nats basically sold out on free speech and firearm laws,’
  
  I used to hold my nose and two ticks blue . And for the reasons you’ve mentioned I’ll be voting ACT.
  
  See also slightlyrightly at 802 above. The Nats bottled out totally and Judith ” Crusher” ( yeah right) Collins went OTT to express her distaste for the firearms community.
  
  Bye bye Nats , hello ACT.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:52am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    kowtow, life is full of unexpected surprises.
    
    Yawnn..
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:38am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  I’m seriously thinking about it. There seems to be some new energy in ACT.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:53am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Noooooooo Cap’n! You are the cheerleader for two ticks blue! Remember?
    
    For most of us, one tick blue and one for the pink!
    
    I always favour the pink me! 🙂
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:06am
  - stinkypete
    
    ive joined
    only possible vote for me now that nats dumped the gun owing community as soon as things got difficult
    will not forget ACTs strength on this
    $20 for 3 years seems the least i can do
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:14am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Captain Mainwaring, have alook at their Immigration policy before you make the tediously predictable jump ship!
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:42am
    - sooty
      
      But stephie, that maybe the only reason they are changing to ACT!
      
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      June 17, 2019 10:45am
  - Chris R
    
    I agree. David Seymour is a hard-working MP and deserves support. I would relish ACT achieving 5% at the expense of Winston First. Go ACT!
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:18am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Based on Kwiblog feedback, I’m sure there will be a significant lift in ACT support at the next polls. Maybe up to a 50% jump in the Curia public poll average?
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:23am
- dubya
  
  Check out the sneering coverage of the ACT relaunch in the rags today. ‘overwhelmingly white and male’.
  
  Hey, at least ACT ran their conference on a weekend, so all those net taxpayers who support them didn’t have to take a day off work.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:41am
  - The Feed
    
    Yes, heaven forbid white males have an opinion on something.
    
    Imagine if they ran a piece on a Green conference saying….well, mainly white and middle class.
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:12am
  - peterwn
    
    So does National and also Labour AFAIK. National did have mid week conferences years ago when farmers (in mid winter) and business/ professtional people could spare the time to go.
    
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    June 17, 2019 1:29pm
- Tony Stuart
  
  When did the Nats sell out on free speech? The only comment I’ve seen from Bridges is that National will refrain from commenting until the review Little instituted is completed and reported back at the end of the year.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:24am
  - White Anglo Saxon Protestant
    
    The moment Judith Collins dialed the Virtue Signal up to 11 when commenting on the value of the National Rifle Association.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:42pm
G152

Okay.
I’ve flown and jumped at Hood (where the two aircraft collided on final)
And Hood is based on the outskirts of Masterton and nowhere near where
claimed by our fake news…
So far all those ‘news’ items I’ve heard have had a rather
large airfield shuttling about the Waiarapa.
Enough already.
‘Reporters’
You should do a little research before rushing to print
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June 17, 2019 8:16am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Reporters, made me smile; I remember those back in the day of the Evening Post which I lugged in my canvas bag down and up the hills of Island Bay in the 60’s and then, just like my paper run, they disappeared to be replaced by twitterarti!
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:32am
  - G152
    
    Printed the Post for five + years.
    It was a good paper
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:06am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  The other fake news recently was the picture of the railway line dangling above a huge washout with the implication that this had been repaired. No, the washout is between Wairoa and Gisborne where the line is still closed.
  Labour fixed a few slips and reopened the Napier-Wairoa line.
  Whoopdedoo.
  National built Transmission Gully and the Kapiti Expressway.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:57am
  - Nookin
    
    Labour finished off a project started under National but claims all the credit.
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11723173
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:18am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    “That was your fault”
    “You’re mean”
    “No, you are”
    Had you thought of starting your own blog, Captain? You have a way with words and a refreshing and original approach to the discussion of public issues.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:25am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Captain Mainwaring , re Tansmission gully etc .But, but you have moved to ACT?
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:43am
    - MCos
      
      Only thinking about it and besides that was four minutes ago.
      
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      June 17, 2019 11:03am
otago-man

Stuff putting David Seymour’s Act Party relaunch under the Christchurch Mosque terror attack section is a disgrace
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June 17, 2019 8:17am
- The King
  
  Not really, that is how Marxism works.
  
  Can you hear the shock in the Marxists article when Seymour says people who use the N word or do a Nazi salute should not be punished by the state.
  
  A simple scroll through Joel McManus’s (the article writer) twitter tells me everything i need to know….
  
  Enemy of the people.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:26am
Paulus

Never thought that I might give my Party Vote to ACT albeit true blue underneath.
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June 17, 2019 8:21am
- tf78
  
  Paulus, do what we do in Epsom – Party vote National and Electorate vote Act. It works well for us. Act will never be big enough on their own but more seats for them would be wonderful.
  
  Bear in mind that David can say what he likes being a one man band, but with lots of MP’s you still have to remember there is a very large population you have to appeal to to regain power.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:52am
srylands

https://embed.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/first-up/audio/2018699900/life-or-death-under-pharmac-part-one

I see that RNZ is beating up on pharmac because it can’t fund everyone’s drugs.

” But its funded in Australia!! “

Yes because Australia spends double that of New Zealand on drugs per capita. Because it is richer.

Economic growth finances quite a lot of wellbeing.
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June 17, 2019 8:25am
- Psycho Milt
  
  When Jesus said “The poor will always be with us,” he could usefully have added “The stupid, also.”
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:40am
  - herb1
    
    Clearly you fit in both camps
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:08am
- kowtow
  
  Richer ,cos they dig stuff out of the ground and sell it.
  
  Here , the Left , who claim to want to fund all things bright and beautiful , do everything possible to keep us poor.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:55am
  - artemisia
    
    We also have stuff under the ground and under the sea. (We have a lot of sea.) And some of what is under the sea is significantly better for our land than we currently import and provide many many millions in income. Especially not the EU has set new rules about cadmium levels. But for sure there will be many and loud objections from certain quarters.
    
    Talking about phosphate from Chatham Rise – low cadmium, low leachate and not from disputed territories.
    
    PS Cadmium is bad.
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:09am
    - sooty
      
      But it looks very nice and shiney on cars.
      
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      June 17, 2019 12:08pm
hullkiwi

NZ has institutional racism, so says Beacroft and a reports going back to 1986 talking about the failure of New Zealand to care for Maori children.

The reason for this recent outrage is the Crown trying to uplift a child from a 19 year old mum who gave birth to a child at Hawkes Bay Hospital. The media has been full of stories about Oranga Tamariki taking 3 children a week from Maori mums and how bad it is. But is it?
In each case Oranga Tamariki has followed due process and is trying to be preventative, because in all cases the mothers are already known to the state, have addiction problems or have been involved in a history of family violence. So, they are trying to break the cycle, only to be told by do gooders that they are going the wrong thing….are they?
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June 17, 2019 8:32am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Once there is a court order, it should be enforced, using the police if necessary. The fact that the mother didn’t want to give up the baby and it is hard to watch, should not be surprising and is not relevant. Of course it is quite possible the order should never have granted in the first place. That seems to be the real issue here but it’s less interesting to the media because it involves thinking instead of watching a video.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:57am
  - peterwn
    
    However, Oranga Tamariki was too chicken to serve court papers on the mother and sought an ‘ex parte’ order behind the mother’s back. So it had no moral authority to try and take the child. IMO the Judge should have told Oranga Tamariki where to stick its application.
    
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    June 17, 2019 1:36pm
- kowtow
  
  It appears the state will only take these children in very extreme circumstances , if that is the case ,the “reporters” covering said event will know what those are and are actively refusing to cover that side of the story.
  
  Agenda.
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:59am
- KevO'Brien
  
  They probably are doing the wrong thing. Children with parents are less likely to become the future criminal crop. Re-homing children forces them to adapt to hostile society and to eventually associate with similar unfortunates. Foster home/state care/borstal/prison/prison… When institutionalised it’s very hard to escape. For many it’s impossible as prison becomes home.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:04am
- Northland Wahine
  
  I was made a state ward at the age of 10, 46 years ago. I aged out at 18. Social welfare , the name at that time, uplifted myself and 2 siblings. My other 2 siblings were in the care of an Aunty up north.
  
  I still recall how distressing it was to be uplifted by the police. I can tell you what each one of us were wearing that day, how we tried to make a run for it, police picking us up kicking and screaming. Social workers had been visiting us so I was somewhat aware what was going to happen but nothing prepared me for the trauma of that day, being held at the police station, the court appearance and then left with strangers, all in one day.
  
  We were in the care of my step father, my siblings biological father, as mum had left due to domestic violence. We were neglected, often left days on end with no adult in the house. However, it was better than when he was home.
  
  Being in care was suppose to mean we were better off. Yeah we were fed, clothed, attended school. We were also beaten, molested and ridiculed. Nothing much had changed. I made my social worker aware what was happening. Nothing was done. I doubt it was investigated.
  
  Fast forward I am currently caring for 4 foster children. And sadly, the uplifting of children is still just as traumatic. There are still fucked up parents, and the State doesn’t always get it right.
  
  I’m not a fan of different social workers I’ve had to deal with, since I’ve taken up fostering. Most have fallen into the category as being so young they have buggar all life experience. The others? Extremely arrogant, quick to wave their degree in your face however haven’t got the observation skills to pick up physical disabilities, ear and sight, obvious behaviour issues, possible sexual abuse.
  
  I’m saying that, I wouldn’t wish what they must see on anyone. It maybe a flawed system, but when separating child from parent? I doubt there will be an improvement in my lifetime.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:27am
  - sooty
    
    Thank you for caring!
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:10pm
  - oob
    
    Here is a voice on this issue we should be listening to.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:37pm
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Kia kaha NW.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:59pm
  - hullkiwi
    
    NW well said, and strength to you.
    
    I am not dismissing there are problems or that the issues are easy to solve. Listening to Beacroft this morning, he hasn’t a clue as to what to do, except be a critic and suggest Hapu and iwi can fix it. If that was so, why are we fed a constant diet of family violence, deaths of young children, neglect of children etc?
    
    It is because the issues are real, doing something about it has been a poor piece meal effort of failure.
    
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    June 17, 2019 1:32pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Your experience echoes what I am familiar with. Twenty three year old social workers determining future life outcomes. The brutality meted out to foster children sets them up for permanent alienation. This also applies to pakeha children.
    
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    June 17, 2019 5:27pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  NZ’s “institutional racism” = almost everyone doing a decent job of caring for their kids, thereby making the higher proportion of bad maori parents look bad.
  
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  June 17, 2019 1:13pm
- Micky
  
  There is definitely institutional sexism. If you have a penis – you are highly likely to be treated much more harshly by Oranga Tamariki and the Family Court – than if you have a vagina. They will remove children from men without any evidence of abuse. There is no due process for a high number of men. Judgement is made based on the fact you are a man.
  
  The same likely applies to Maori or Polynesians.
  
  There will no doubt be numerous cases where Oranga Tamariki are being too heavy handed and could have approached the situation more appropriately.
  
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  June 17, 2019 1:23pm
Maggie Pie

And in breaking news:
Hugely popular kids TV show ‘My Little Pony’ has introduded its first lesbian couple – Aunt Holiday and Aunty Lofty…

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/06/13/my-little-pony-lesbian-couple/

‘Alabama Public Television’ opted not to air the episode, saying parents have enough to be concerned about without subjecting their children to this type of behaviour. The station had previously pulled an episode of “Arthur” in 2005 when a character had two mothers 🙂
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June 17, 2019 8:38am
BarryB

I recently spent 6 weeks overseas on holiday. I had spent many months in Europe in my previous working life but never had the opportunity to just look at several European countries and their communities.
The most obvious thing was the physical and social maturity of Europe compared to our relative immaturity. Portugal for example has not been involved in war for hundreds of years so their old buildings and rural landscape are ‘Old’ – and the aspects of lifestyle that go with those ‘old’ things in culture are still in force.
NZ is both geologically and culturally young and immature – and I have no doubt that this has a big influence on how we behave. On arrival home all I hear on the news are stories about mental health problems and racism and colonisation etc. All of Europe has been colonised and over-run many times in their history – yet they don’t wail on about what happened and use it as an excuse for some sort of deprivation and bad behaviour.
I heard an interview the other day about maori not being keen to see a doctor because they are made to feel guilty about the cause of their illness – and they feel guilty because it’s the life style that has brought on the illness. Good God – feeling guilty about causing the problem oneself is essential to start making changes. Im really getting tired of the constant wailing from various maori (and other) sources about the reasons why some of them are social misfits.

Other observations:
1. No scooters did I see in Europe. Plenty of electric bikes though. I guess that’s because the rules about bikes are well established but for scooters they aren’t. ie: helmets, road or bike lane or footpath. And there some very good bike lanes.
2. Very few cars on the roads especially considering their populations. In Portugal and Belgium and France and Ireland and the UK – fewer cars on the road than I see every day here in Hamilton.
3. The minimum wage in the UK is UKP10/hr – about NZD20/hr. But their housing costs and entertainment cost are MUCH higher than NZ. And we think we have house price problems
4. I hardly saw anyone with a take-out coffee. The only Starbucks I saw were in Airports. We are addicted to coffee !!. Just think – a coffee a day from a café amounts to some $12000 in ten years – and I know of several (mostly women) who get two a day. That’s the house deposit – or part of it……………..
5. In England the police are testing facial recognition cameras on the streets (Im not too keen on the idea) and anyone who covers their face is liable for a fine. Currently they are manning the cameras so that they can actually detain anyone who has a covered face – no special exceptions such as burka .
6. In Birmingham there are parts where the muslim population out-numbers all other cultures – and they are demanding that Sharia law be introduced into the schools. There is only one outcome to this – trouble.
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June 17, 2019 8:55am
- hullkiwi
  
  Not just Birmingham, try Luton (Bedfordsire), Leeds/Bradford (West Yorkshire) and Oldham/Bolton (Lancashire). All have similar issues.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:26am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Portugal for example has not been involved in war for hundreds of years so…
  
  It’s still early in the day, but can I nominate this comment for a special prize?
  With bonus points for pointing out the long-term fiscal impact of drinking coffee. You forgot to point out the deletrious effects of heaving investment in smashed avocado on toast though.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:29am
- hullkiwi
  
  Barry, you couldn’t have travelled much in West London.
  
  From Fleet Street to Chiswick/Richmond via either High Street Kensington or South Kensington the area is saturated with Starbucks, and a stack of other chain coffee shops that included, but not limited to:
  Costa; Cafe Nero; Coffee Republic and Cafe Rouge.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:41am
  - MCos
    
    None of which hold a candle to any number of privately owned coffee shops in NZ, from my experience.
    BTW
    Min wage in the UK for over 25 is £8.21
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:12am
    - hullkiwi
      
      MCos, you are very correct. The two things about all the chain coffee shops was:
      1. Just like the fast food franchises, they are all the same branded exercise irrespective of where they are – so Starbucks in Hammersmith Broadway had the same look & feel, and provide the same product as Starbucks On the Strand; and
      2. The branded chains in London had pretty much driven the independent cafe owner out of business on the London High Street.
      
      NB. I am not saying, I preferred things this way, indeed I actually found it quite sad.
      
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      June 17, 2019 12:02pm
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  “.. culturally young and immature – and I have no doubt that this has a big influence on how we behave.”
  
  Patronisng hum bug!
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:50am
  - Ruahine
    
    Been to Europe both West and East a few times. NZ description : “culturally young and immature” fairly close to the mark IMHO.
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:13am
    - hullkiwi
      
      I agree also.
      
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      June 17, 2019 12:03pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘they don’t wail on about what happened and use it as an excuse for some sort of deprivation and bad behaviour.’
  
  Lots of Micks , Taffs and Jocks do .
  
  England and facial recognition. How scary. They took Bobbies off the beat , barely send crooks to gaol and won’t deport ne’er do wells ,ad the result is even more Big Brother a la Commuist China.
  
  Where England goes…….
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:03am
  - hullkiwi
    
    England is also the most watched “big brother society”. Thanks to CCTV cameras attached to nearly every lamp post.
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:05pm
- Ed Snack
  
  Sounds distinctly strange to me. Portugal was devastated between 1811-1813 during the Napoleonic wars, most of the countryside was completely ravaged primarily by French forces foraging for food – they were not supplied and had to forage locally to survive. Apart from
  The immediate Lisbon area, all the country was occupied and only freed after a lengthy campaign by Arthur Wellesley, later the Duke of Wellington.
  
  Portugal then had several wars overseas, they were for example kicked out of Brazil, and had colonial wars in Africa, but of no great scale.
  
  In 1914 Portugal declared war on Germany in accord with its treaty with Great Britain, and deployed at least 2 divisions in France. Those divisions were effectively destroyed in April 1918 in the German offensive near Ypres and not reconstituted.
  
  Portugal managed to sit out the Spanish civil war and also stayed out of WW2 in concert with Spain. They also followed Spain in having a conservative dictator for some years before he was overthrown in an essentially peaceful revolution. Portugal also abandoned it’s African colonies after that and it had been involved in a long term low level conflicts in those colonies.
  
  So, being at the fringe of Europe, Portugal is less likely to be involved in a war, but not immune. The UK has also not fought a war on it’s own soil though of course it has been affected by bombing campaigns in both world wars.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:57am
- Durden
  
  “anyone who covers their face is liable for a fine” and ” no special exceptions such as burka ”
  
  Patently not true. Otherwise we would have heard the bleating from here.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:12am
- Twinkletoes
  
  This is the result of long term planning by the muslims. Immigrate, build up a community rather than live apart from other muslims, elect their leaders to local council and then when the demographics are large enough take over the City Council. Which is what has been done – I did read that in Birmingham they are now building an Islamic Centre where the Adnan will be sung from the minarets in a twenty mile hearing radius. Apparently it is up to the town or city council to allow or ban this, when tried in Oxford there were not enough muslims on the council to push it through but as I remember, six out of the eight City councillors in Birminham are muslim.
  
  And, unlike many towns in UK, they won’t even need to cheat by nicking other peoples postal votes. I see the first announcement of a muslim stating that he would be standing for the council in Christchurch was made a few weeks ago. This is why the muslim refugee coordinator was complaining that refugees were being spread around rather than settled within the previous refugee communties. Demographics are power, especially in an MMP scenario plus a sympathetic public who in all innocence, have gone overboard in trying to compensate for the horror that happened to them in Christchurch.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:56am
  - MCos
    
    If you had done a little research you’d find Birminham has 101 City Councillors
    
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    June 17, 2019 3:45pm
  - Komata
    
    Twinletoes@1156
    
    Agree, a very ‘considered’ series of actions is being taken, and when you add to this the active attempts to convert gang mebers in jail, the furture does not look bright.
    
    I’m not sure of the current percentage of Muslims in NZ, but from memory 2% is all that is ncessary for the demands to start.
    
    Based purely on the comments by GG et al, I suspect that it may be close to that now.
    
    Let the fun begin, and to quote the old song title ‘We aint seen nothing yet’
    
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    June 17, 2019 4:05pm
trout

A thoughtful piece by Bryce Wilkinson in the NBR on the proposed new labour laws:
The government has largely put the KiwiBuild and capital gains tax fiascos behind it.
Next headed for the cold storage might be the recommendations of its Fair Pay Agreement working group.
Led by former prime minister Jim Bolger, the working group handed the government a hot potato late last year. The central recommendation of its report, publicly released on January 31, would return New Zealand to a mandatory sector-wide, trade union-dominated system of wage fixing.
This would be a vastly complex, fractious and problematic undertaking. Monolithic trade unions and employer groups would emerge to determine pay agreements for all. The biggest firms and unions could be expected to seize the most power.
The centralised bargaining of pre-1990s New Zealand required a barrage of advocates, litigants, tribunals, courts, regulators and dispute resolution procedures to make the system “work.” Similarly, specialist lawyers, tribunals, mediators and courts will now arise to litigate never-ending demarcation and other disputes. They will form an “industrial relations club” to take advantage of the system.
New Zealand’s previous attempt at centralised bargaining (aka industrial awards) was so strike-prone that ministerial intervention became common practice. That in itself was a sign of dysfunction.
The working group’s proposed reincarnation of the earlier industrial awards system is likely to hit small employers and the least employable the hardest.
Why? At its heart, the proposal is extraordinarily undemocratic. A mere 10% of workers in a sector or occupation could force the other 90% into the proposed procrustean system. Many of the 90%, particularly the self-employed and small enterprise employers, would have no meaningful representation.
No voice
Much worse, those with the most to lose – would-be workers – would have no voice at all. This includes school leavers. Would-be workers do not pay union fees. Unions’ duties are to their members.
Prolonged involuntary unemployment is a scourge. It is an affront to human freedom and dignity. It lowers self-esteem and deprives its victims of much of their sense of purpose. (The New Zealand General Social Survey is quantifying the orders of magnitude for the lower life satisfaction and sense of purpose experienced by the unemployed.)
Policies that make it harder for the least-skilled to get paid work are not ethnically neutral. The non-mixed Maori unemployment rate is 10.3%, three times higher than the 3.2% rate for non-mixed Europeans.
Yet, politicians are under endless pressure to make it harder for the least employable to get paid work. Pressures to fix wage rates above the productivity of the least employable are most unkind to those least able to fend for themselves.
The minimum wage is one tool for pricing the least employable out of work. On the latest OECD statistics, New Zealand’s minimum wage in 2017 was one of the highest among member countries in the OECD, relative to average and median wage rates. Those pushing to raise it further are not demonstrating kindness to those at the bottom.
It is not the only tool. Pressures on local authorities to pay a living wage are pressures to benefit those whose wellbeing is likely already high relative to that of the chronically unemployed.
Health and safety regulations imposing drug testing on workplaces are also likely to penalise those disproportionally who have the least sense of purpose in life. Prolonged unemployment is associated with drug-taking.
Raising the unemployment benefit is a palliative that does not address the affront to self-esteem and lack of purpose and contribution.
The trade unions would be the obvious winners from what the working group proposes. Their membership, income and clout would increase. Union officials might once again have the power to “bring the country to its knees” through strike action. (This was a battle cry of the likes of union leader Fintan Patrick Walsh in the 1960s.)
The prospect of gains is more nuanced for the larger firms. They do not lose competitiveness domestically if all firms face higher labour costs relative to productivity, and smaller firms go to the wall. But they would lose competitiveness if they face international competition.
We saw this dynamic at work in the 1960s. A nil general wage order in 1968 was overturned by what then Finance Minister Robert Muldoon described as an “unholy alliance” of unions and employer organisations. Devaluations and double-digit inflation followed along with, and from the mid-1970s, deficits and rising debt and unemployment.
The losers
In short, the losers are likely to be the least employable workers, small firms, self-employed contractors, larger firms exposed to international competition, customers, and the general public affected by increased strike action.
What is fair about Fair Pay Agreements that seem likely to drive the most vulnerable firms out of existence and the least productive workers out of work?
Regrettably, the working group’s report did not even attempt to define fair pay or attempt to characterise it.
From a human liberty and dignity perspective, pay by mutual uncoerced agreement would be a reasonable definition. That is how we operate as consumers. School teachers and hospital staff would rightly observe that options are few when government is a monopoly employer but these cases are the exception, not the rule.
From an economic perspective, the market tendency will be for workers’ pay to track their value to the employer – in other words, their productivity. That is fair in the sense that neither side is commercially disadvantaged.
The absence of any articulated concept of fairness makes the notion of Fair Pay Agreements look Orwellian.
The NZ Initiative is preparing a report evaluating the working group’s report. Our report will examine the group’s recommendations and supporting arguments. We will also propose a better approach to tackle the unsatisfactory features inherent in our current arrangements.
The government is getting used to handling hot potatoes of its own making. We hope that on this occasion, it will focus on labour market regulations likely to raise rather than lower the wellbeing of those who are already the least employable.
Dr Wilkinson is a senior fellow at The New Zealand Initiative.
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June 17, 2019 9:08am
- Ruahine
  
  It is all part of the bullying and dictatorial streak that runs right through this entire Government. From how you will do your shopping, how you will travel, what you will say publicly, what schooling your children will have, how you will earn your living, what recreational pursuits you will engage in if you own a firearm unless you are a gang member etc etc.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:20am
lastmanstanding

I see the Herald is advertising the (cough) Premium content for $2.50 a week for the first 8 weeks.

Must be having trouble getting the numbers. As a former retailer you only discount your product shortly after lunch when the sales are really really bad.

Betcha their readership numbers will be down and continue to fall.

Bye bye Granny.
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June 17, 2019 9:23am
- mikenmildagain
  
  The Herald has reported that they have already reached their initial target for subscriptions. It will be interesting to see how their approach works.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:15am
  - Tall Man
    
    Not even mildly interested mikey.
    
    They are just another wing of the ardern media department.
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:24am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    So you and who was the other?
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:57am
  - calendar girl
    
    I’ll bet, mma, that the Herald did no disclose publicly its “initial target for subscriptions” either on the introduction of subscriptions or when it made that comment about the alleged success of its new ‘paid content’ or ‘Premium’ policy.
    
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    June 17, 2019 3:00pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      10,000 or 12,000, from memory.
      
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      June 17, 2019 3:22pm
  - toby1845
    
    “The Herald reported…..”
    
    Bwahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!
    
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    June 17, 2019 3:22pm
Maggie Pie

I reaaly loved actress Suzy Amis in her role as Lizzy Calvert in the movie ‘TITANIC’.
Watching her last night in her new role as vegan Suzy Amiss-Cameron, i thort looking at ner now what a great advert she made as to why we should eat meat.
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June 17, 2019 9:25am
- Tall Man
  
  Fuck, giver a meal FFS.
  
  You can also see that the “vegan” diet has a proven link to a severe mental disorder… they start to think we give a fuck about what they say.
  
  Wait for the selfie with the hijab wearing harridan.
  
  That should get psycho and steffy changing their undies.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:33am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    How do you know if someone is Vegan?
    
    Don’y worry, they’ll tell you within the first 2 minutes of meeting them 🙂
    
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    June 17, 2019 11:31am
- Psycho Milt
  
  It’s really noticeable now when you watch movies set in earlier centuries, how starved-looking the actresses are. You can’t suspend disbelief when watching it, because the only women who looked like that back then were either suffering from or recovering from a serious illness. Anyone from the 19th Century looking at Suzy Amis-Cameron would wonder what disease she has and berate her husband for letting her leave her sick bed.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:41am
Nukuleka

For the life of me I cannot see why candidates for the UK Tory leadership would agree to a public TV DEBATE when it is the Conservative MPs and membership that elects the leader. Good on Boris for not demeaning himself and not participating in the airing of dirty washing which ought to be an internal Tory Party matter.
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June 17, 2019 9:27am
- MCos
  
  Where else is Boris supposed to be questioned about his ample dirty laundry for the information of the hundred thousand voting members?
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:33am
Fletch

I see that the media, not content that Israel Falou has been punished enough, now have footage of him making a sermon in his own church on his own time and are using it to attack him with yet again. Yup, if you’re gay or trans you’re somehow supposed to be immune from criticism of your lifestyle in today’s world. You’re a protected species, and anyone that disagrees must be hounded by the media using private footage to show others who think the same that no dissent for liberal thought around gays can be tolerated.

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/sport/rugby/israel-folau-targets-homosexuals-transgender-youth-in-latest-church-sermon
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June 17, 2019 9:31am
- Scott
  
  Fletch – it is amazing that once the media decide that they don’t like you then they are content to absolutely hound you where ever you go. Dissension must be crushed!!
  
  However on the positive side it is nice to see that the media are actually reporting sermons from a pastor and giving him an opportunity to freely spread his message 🙂
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:56am
  - Tall Man
    
    Good point. Their tiny little closed minds would have missed that bit 🙂
    
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    June 17, 2019 10:28am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Shouldn’t you be at this important conference, Scott?
    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/lake/os-lk-make-america-straight-again-protest-20190615-aey2joym3bewxmqco4cp6clbpu-story.html
    
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    June 17, 2019 12:47pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Thanks mikey but your keeping up with it is enough for the rest of us.
      
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      June 17, 2019 9:07pm
- SGA
  
  I wonder what Falou thinks about it? He may be very happy that he can witness to a larger audience. (I mean this as a serious comment.)
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:19am
- thetiedarch
  
  There’s quite a bit of irony in them publisihing all this.
  
  None of us would be aware of what he had said if they hadn’t reported on it – and thus no-one would be offended.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:38am
- GoVege
  
  Did Israel have anything to say about wife bashing ….a massive problem in his culture?
  After all, they were asking the churches to stand against family violence recently.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:06am
  - Tall Man
    
    You mean Aussie rugby culture?
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:08pm
- Durden
  
  I would like to see some footage, any footage, from synagogues, temples and mosques — especially the last one.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:15am
- MCos
  
  That article doesn’t attack Folau. It repeats what he said and gave some background.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:38am
- Psycho Milt
  
  Meh. News is a business, and “famous person spouting outlandish views” is a marketable product. It’s nothing personal.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:43am
  - Tall Man
    
    Unlike yourself eh psycho, nonentity spouting rubbish.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:09pm
- Alien
  
  Ah right so you have no problem a grown adult giving a sermon attacking children who are already struggling.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:56am
  - White Anglo Saxon Protestant
    
    Timestamps or quotes please.
    
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    June 17, 2019 1:25pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Pretty sure the kids weren’t there.
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:10pm
- Alien
  
  Now they have footage of him, you make it sound like they went and filmed the idiot when the idiot had it post d to the church’s Facebook page. If someone wants to publicly shame others then they should expect that back at him. Funny how the people that support him doing this typical are against muslims speaking against homosexuals. It’s alright fletch, we know you’re hiding in the closet waiting to come out
  
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  June 17, 2019 1:00pm
  - Tall Man
    
    You could just ignore the facebook page eh?
    
    How’s the volunteering going?
    
    1 1
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    June 17, 2019 9:11pm
BrownSnake

Terrorism Trial Hearing 3 of 3

For Reference.

That happened in Aus while Jacinda Adhern was in France.

What is interesting about this case(s) they are being charged with attacking other moslems (fire bombing a mosque?) as well as a planned attack on the general population.

The Australian Courts were really quite busy processing all the terrorist apprehended in preventative raids the weeks Jacinda was in France delivering a 3 page pdf? How effective that will be time will tell.

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6116047/trio-guilty-of-melbourne-mosque-terror-act/?cs=14231

Trio guilty of Melbourne mosque terror act

Two convicted terrorists who plotted a Christmas Day attack on Federation Square have also been found guilty of fire bombing a Melbourne mosque along with a third man.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/three-men-guilty-of-plotting-to-rain-christmas-day-terror-on-melbourne-20181102-p50dow.html

Three Melbourne men have been found guilty of plotting a Christmas terror attack at major city landmarks in a jihad-inspired plan to inflict mass carnage.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/seven-arrested-as-police-foil-planned-christmas-day-terror-attack-in-melbourne-20161223-gtgz90.html

Melbourne terror raids: Seven arrested as police foil planned Christmas Day terror attack in Melbourne

Men arrested over an alleged Christmas terror plot targeting Melbourne CBD landmarks appeared in court.

Four men have been charged with planning a terrorist act and remanded in custody.

Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull said the planned attack was “one of the most substantial terrorist plots that have been disrupted in recent years”.

He outlined that 12 major plots had now been disrupted since September 2014, when the terror threat level was raised to “probable”, and 57 people charged as a result of 25 counter-terrorism operations.

<

You have to hand it to Aus Security they have nailed it time and time again.

I think Turnbull/Abbot helped put in the legal framework so disruption happens before the “event” and the charges proceed as if the event “happened”.

Also I believe legislation has been put in place for units of the ADF to support the police in certain circumstances I have seen Black hawkes conduct drills in this city.

Whose methods and what methods are going to work most effectively, in the future?

Time will tell.
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June 17, 2019 9:51am
Yvette

We can not accept the proliferation of Islam in our country and think just because you’re tolerant, accepting and inclusive that we won’t end up like Great Britain, South East Asia, and most of Europe with violence, loss of the host country’s identity, their values and culture destroyed, and Sharia Law enacted. The outright destruction of Western Civilization and the removal of what has been the bedrock of that civil society…Christianity (all be it many have rejected it) is well into its advanced stages.
– Brian Tamaki https://www.facebook.com/ApostleBishopBrianTamaki/

How close are the ties between Brian Tamaki and the new Coalition Party?
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June 17, 2019 10:11am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Do we really want to be like Britain? The concerns as to sharia as legitimate.
  
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  June 17, 2019 10:45am
Sarkozygroupie

The New Zealand Government has deleted Israel from existence:

https://shalom.kiwi/2019/06/immigration-new-zealand-fact-sheet-erases-israel-and-distorts-history/

Interestingly, MBIE has quickly and quietly removed the link to the ‘fact’ sheet this morning.
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June 17, 2019 10:27am
- oob
  
  To be fair Israel isn’t a country, it’s a terrorist organisation occupying someone else’s.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:44pm
  - Sarkozygroupie
    
    Whatever oob. You lefty’s really crack me up with your outraged outrage. I can smell the Sulfur burning from here.
    Or maybe its a big fat doobie frying your synapses. But you be sure to feel all warm and glowing now as a Hamas-hugger.
    
    Hamas in case you didn’t know is a real terrorist entity. Backed by Hezbollah. Another one. FFS.
    
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    June 17, 2019 1:58pm
  - mandk
    
    You can’t be referring to Palestine when you say Israel is occupying someone else’s country.
    
    Palestine is not, and nor has it ever been, a country.
    
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    June 17, 2019 2:13pm
    - oob
      
      You need to visit the local war memorial in whichever NZ town or city you live in, look at the word PALESTINE inscribed on it, then offer profuse apologies to our Kiwi war dead.
      
      Then you need to stop listening to and mindlessly regurgitating zionAmerican propaganda and read a book. I recommend starting with T.E. Lawrence.
      
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      June 17, 2019 3:03pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Philistines, eh? But what can one do…?
        
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        June 17, 2019 3:24pm
      - mandk
        
        You’ll also see names like Somme, Gallipoli and Passchendaele.
        
        What countries are they?
        
        And it’s you who needs to do some history reading. Try the Encyclopaedia Britannica to start with: britannica.com/place/Palestine.
        
        In modern times, few Western countries have recognised Palestine, and nor does the UN formally recognise the region.
        
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        June 17, 2019 4:14pm
      - Komata
        
        OOB@1530
        
        Concerning ‘Palestine’
        
        It would appear that that country has a long and ancient history (at least according to its supporters; yourself included).
        
        As I cannot for the life of me find anything about this, can you please enlighten me and answer the following? (They’re serious questions BTW).
        
        What was ‘Palestine’s’ capital over the years?
        
        As the Middle East has been successively invaded over the centuries, there will have inevitably have been Palestinian ‘heroes’ of these conflicts; Generals, guerilla’s etc.; it’s the way things go in such situations..
        
        Please, can you give me any names of these people?
        
        HJave their been any Palestinian Authors / Philosophers/ Academics of note over the conturies? If so, what did they write/ The Greeks had Socrates, the Romans, Pliny, and given Palestine’s antiquity and its location at the cross-roads of trade, surely some famous person just has to have come out of it. A name (or names) would be appreciated.
        
        Did the Palestinians ever have a port on the Med or Red Sea? Given the location of their country, such a facility would have been essential. A name of the port would be appreciated.
        
        Finally, I’m a student of linguistics, and would be really interested in studying the ancient ‘Palestinian’ language, in the same way that ancient Greek, Hebrew and latin (or example) can be studied. are you aware of any resources which might be able to further my quest?
        
        As i said, these are serious questions, so a reply would be apreciated.
        
        Many thanks.
        
        PS: TE Lawrence is SO, SO recent, I’m after the older stuff.
        
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        June 17, 2019 4:29pm
    - The King
      
      Sorry, but the bible is not a mortgage document.
      
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      June 17, 2019 6:39pm
lilman

Was in Otaki yesterday,saw in a Maori themed art shop a large picture of a Pig with the word pakeha across its belly.
Asked if this was something he should be selling and how would he like it if someone put a picture of a piece of shit on a picture and the write on it Maori.

He couldnt answer even when I said it was wrong,offensive and bloody racist,said he was only the sales person not the artist.

I corrected him by saying he wasnt a salesperson,he was that art with his Moko and ponytail only missing the word Maori.
Went right over his head.
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June 17, 2019 10:36am
- Tall Man
  
  Definitely “hate art”.
  
  Go back and demand a “safe space”……
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:27am
- Sarkozygroupie
  
  Should have taken a photo of it and demanded Jacinda take action.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:17pm
- Colville
  
  No photo?
  
  5 0
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  June 17, 2019 12:35pm
  - lilman
    
    No sorry but its there,seriously couldnt believe it.
    
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    June 17, 2019 2:06pm
- Inandout
  
  Long Pig was what the cannibals called the missionairies.
  
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  June 17, 2019 1:26pm
- BrownSnake
  
  You Should have asked his if it as a Captain Cooker
  
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  June 18, 2019 12:30am
Hugh Pavletich

State of shock: How our buildings save lives but little else … Rob Mitchell … Dominion Post / Stuff NZ

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/nz-earthquake/113448477/state-of-shock-how-our-buildings-save-lives-but-little-else

Eight years on, the rumbling continues. The ground beneath remains unstable.

In Wellington and Christchurch, modern buildings constructed to the highest official standards and earthquake ratings lie empty; some will be repaired at great cost while others are set for demolition and replacement.

Apartment owners in the capital face insurance hikes and earthquake-strengthening costs that threaten not only their life savings and sanity but also the very idea of inner-city living. … read more via hyperlink above …
.
.
… With its late June announcements, will the New Zealand Government via its Housing & Urban Development Minister Phil Twyford (and others) FINALLY deal effectively with land supply / urban limits abolition and the proper debt financing of infrastructure … TO JUST ALLOW earthquake resilient low and light affordable building to be placed on sound ground ? …

New Zealaned Housing Minister Phil Twyfords speech to the New Zealand Initiative Members Retreat … New Zealand Government / Beehive

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/speech-nz-initiative-members%E2%80%99-retreat

From Kiwibuild to Kiwis Building … Dr Eric Crampton … The New Zealand Initiative

https://nzinitiative.outreach.co.nz/?Ns=&Na=view-msg-public&SMESG-oid=22150&Scontact=2149250d
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June 17, 2019 10:39am
- Happychappy
  
  Is he going to implement your plan for NZ housing Hugh because this the third or fourth time you have spewed your cut and paste on Kiwiblog in the last week.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:00pm
- Garbageman
  
  More Hugh More please
  
  6 2
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  June 17, 2019 12:18pm
  - Tall Man
    
    “Smack”……….
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzTFNWJWnWk
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU28GHMcYxM
    
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    June 17, 2019 9:01pm
Happychappy

Littles spending taxpayers money like a drunken sailor with all these enquiries he is setting up to change laws.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=12241094
I can see a lot more strikes on the horizon when people realize the amount of money being dished out to Labours mates to sit on these committees.
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June 17, 2019 10:45am
- Alien
  
  This is a tribunal set up to help those still in dispute with their insurance companies or eqc over the earthquake. And I think it is offensive to make out the judge sitting on it is a labour mate being dished out money.
  
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  June 17, 2019 11:53am
rangitoto

I was reading about Corbyn’s lastest plans to tax any gifts to children from parents where the lifetime total exceeds 125K pounds. Sounds like they will tally up food, school fees, birthday presents and anything else. Why hasn’t Taxinda thought of this idea yet.
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June 17, 2019 10:57am
- hullkiwi
  
  Don’t give her an idea above her level or capacity.
  
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  June 17, 2019 5:57pm
wreck1080

Whoa, ANZ just dumped David Hisco… over expenses!

I just wanna know how much he over claimed!

This is very rare for someone earning multiples of millions to overclaim a few expenses.
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June 17, 2019 11:06am
- Colville
  
  From what I read (in a 5 second scan) its for wrongly claiming some stuff (chauffeur driven cars ?) … I was thinking it might be the young lady he had in the back of said cars …. ??
  SIR John has fronted media about it…for him to be front footing the problem probably means its a deeper pool of poo than it first appears.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:19pm
- Alien
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/113536338/sir-john-key-fronts-media-over-hiscos-departure
  
  “ANZ’s chief executive, and the highest paid bank boss in New Zealand, David Hisco had tens of thousands of dollars spent on corporate cars among his expenses, it has been revealed.”
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:53pm
- MCos
  
  This gentleman may have claimed tens of thousands of dollars of expenses he was not entitled to.
  From what I understand he denies any wrongdoing blah blah blah
  In the last job I had in Bangkok our long term maid, who earned peanuts, pinches about thirty dollars and was gone by lunchtime.
  
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  June 17, 2019 4:10pm
  - Tall Man
    
    ” our long term maid, who earned peanuts”
    
    That’s one way of looking at it…
    
    Another way is
    
    ” our long term maid, who we paid peanuts”
    
    Which one makes you feel good?
    
    3 1
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    June 17, 2019 8:53pm
    - MCos
      
      The second statement is incorrect in that I had no control over anyone’s income.
      Nevertheless
      While her remuneration was very low it was high for her occupation due to her longevity in the job. This is what happens when effectively the minimum wage is almost non existent.
      
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      June 17, 2019 11:03pm
- Tall Man
  
  ardern manages to keep her ears just below the swill line @ $10k per week.
  
  And that is no mean feat……
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:55pm
Kabull

A heads up for those interested. Leighton Smith’s next podcast will be entirely devoted to climate change, and his guest will be Dr Tim Ball. This will be a ‘must listen’ episode.
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1049-the-leighton-smith-podcas-30246213/
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June 17, 2019 11:35am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Kabull,
  
  Timothy Francis “Tim” Ball[1] is a credential-fudging denialist crank.”
  
  “Ball also seems to be a creationist of some sort. In an op-ed in Canada Free Press, he wrote:
  
  “Even though it is still just a theory and not a law 148 years after it was first proposed, Darwinian evolution is the only view allowed in schools. Why?
  
  Such censorship suggests fear of other ideas, a measure of indefensibility”
  
  https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Tim_Ball
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:00pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Calling him a Denialist crank is rich coming from a Science Denying Creationist like you.
    That Sect you belong to looks real Fundamentalist with its odd rituals.
    
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    June 17, 2019 4:43pm
- wreck1080
  
  Tim Ball? I suggest you skip that. He is a professor of geography, not a climate scientist in any sense of the word.
  
  Tim Ball is also a creationist. . . he said…
  
  “Perhaps the ultimate irony is that the biblical views on nature, human roles and responsibilities are as logical as any other including modern environmentalism”
  
  Here is another nutty thing Tim Ball believes …
  
  The point I made was with regard to the Antarctic and Greenland ice
  sheets. I posed the question about what happens to the water level
  when an ice cube is placed in a glass which is then filled to the brim
  and the ice melts. The correct answer is the water level drops because
  the space occupied by the ice is greater than that occupied by the
  water it contains. Water expands when it freezes
  
  But, if he is saying things you wish to believe, then jump into the echo box.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:21pm
  - Psycho Milt
    
    Nor a scientist in any sense of the word. Geography is a social science, and creationism and science don’t mix. Still, when it comes to climate change, he’s probably operating at the kind of level Leighton Smith can deal with.
    
    3 16
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    June 17, 2019 2:08pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      He did his Doctorate in Historical Climatology.
      Ironically, apparently he had trouble getting funding as the Arts people said that’s about science and the science people said that’s about art!
      I don’t think he actually is a creationist. Could be wrong but I seem to recall that quote is in the context of a wider discussion.
      Anyway, he hasn’t been a Professor for 30 years.
      He is on the fringe and not really up to date.
      
      4 2
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      June 17, 2019 4:32pm
- Notsofast
  
  So you lap up this pompous twit with his intelligent design and denial that CO2 density in the atmosphere is increasing 2000 times the rate it ever did in geological history?
  Just stunning.
  
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  June 17, 2019 12:39pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    As I say above, I’m not sure he does believe in Intelligent Design (although you could use some help) and he certainly doesn’t deny CO2 has increased.
    Iirc he’s more about how the Vostok Ice cores show CO2 increase follows Temp.
    He’s also a bit nutty about the reasons the IPCC was set up etc etc.
    I won’t be listening to him.
    
    4 3
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    June 17, 2019 4:48pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Couldn’t Leighton find anyone that actually knows something about climate change?
  
  1 26
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  June 17, 2019 12:51pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Ahh mikey…
    
    “The great climate change myth”… also known as the income gatherer for the woke from the meek and foolish.
    
    12 3
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    June 17, 2019 1:19pm
  - Notsofast
    
    No, and he has done a power to damage to kids and plenty of adults who leave their brains on the coat hook.
    
    2 11
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    June 17, 2019 1:28pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      ‘Coat hook’
      Gosh, that’s almost as bad as Brains on your shirt!
      Lol
      
      7 2
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      June 17, 2019 4:35pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Well you certainly can’t retain your brain and vote labour can you and if you did, what would the lundy’s of this world have to smash out!
      
      4 1
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      June 17, 2019 8:50pm
  - softail 1450
    
    M M A,it always baffles me how you manage to uptick your own comments,LOL.
    
    10 0
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    June 17, 2019 4:41pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I rather suspect that you are baffled by a great many things.
      
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      June 17, 2019 6:18pm
- All_on_Red
  
  -1
  
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  June 17, 2019 2:34pm
Sarkozygroupie

Phil Twyford has the most ingenious response ever! Talk about dancing on the head of the head of a pin!

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/02/jacinda-ardern-breaks-the-first-promise-she-made-as-labour-leader.html
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June 17, 2019 12:20pm
- Tall Man
  
  The question has to be asked, was she just bullshitting before the election not expecting to actually have to do something?
  
  I personally believe that ardern and labour plus the minders, h1 & h2, just put out a whole bunch of lies without any serious costing or thoughts hoping that ardern’s stardust would see them through the year of bullshit, followed by the year of low expectation delivery to be followed by a new bunch of lies for the stupid in election year.
  
  The whole labour/ardern crap has been a well thought out con on the voters of New Zealand.
  
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  June 17, 2019 1:18pm
  - Alien
    
    They promised all they could never expecting to win, but it’s ok, just look at the lefties that post here’s, they don’t care their princess hasn’t delivered a damn thing, they will support her no matter what. She can lie her head of and no one cares. You can catch in a few lies every question time.
    
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    June 17, 2019 3:31pm
- mandk
  
  Excellent.
  
  I look forward to Newshub telling us about all the other promises the PM has broken.
  
  Let’s see, they could start with ‘the most open and transparent government ever’.
  
  Or they could try ‘no national strikes on my watch’.
  
  Or, what about ‘a kinder type of politics’?
  
  How about ‘1,000 Kiwibuild houses by the end of June 2019’?
  
  11 3
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  June 17, 2019 2:39pm
  - sooty
    
    I want to see the never needing to lie in politics!
    That’s a classic, that is!
    
    9 0
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    June 17, 2019 4:00pm
    - Tall Man
      
      This is usually when I jump in but batman and the other mods don’t like me stating the obvious.. again… and again… and again….
      
      4 1
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      June 17, 2019 8:47pm
      - White Anglo Saxon Protestant
        
        At this point, it’s a given…
        I’ve fulfilled my legal obligations, draw your own conclusions.
        
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        June 18, 2019 8:48am
Alien

Labour must be floundering, time to do some good old fashioned John key hit jobs

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12241168

“Connections between ex-Prime Minister and ANZ NZ chairman Sir John Key and departing ANZ chief executive David Hisco go further than just their business link.”
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June 17, 2019 3:12pm
- MrTips
  
  John Key does a property transaction and fires a dodgy CEO
  Oh my God!
  Call Hager!!! Call the Hfee crew!!!
  
  Bloody ridiculous
  
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  June 17, 2019 5:49pm
- Sacha
  
  Somehow I don’t think he’ll give a damn.
  
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  June 17, 2019 9:20pm
Micky

The family justice report recommendations are unlikely to fix the underlying issues.

So long as there is a financial incentive for one parent to have the children more than the other parent – there will always be adversarial disputes.

Forced mediation does not work when there is a financial incentive for both the parents and lawyers to push for a court hearing (which means a 12k payday for the lawyers).

https://www.justice.govt.nz/assets/Documents/Publications/family-justice-reforms-final-report-independent-panel.pdf
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June 17, 2019 3:25pm
- Micky
  
  2 down votes (probably from lawyers)
  
  In Denmark (or one of those countries) there is no financial incentive for custody.
  
  It is so effective that there is no ‘family court’. A judge there see about one child custody dispute case a year.
  
  Yet in New Zealand we spend hundreds of millions a year propping up an industry which feeds on the suffering of children.
  
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  June 17, 2019 4:51pm
Cobolt24

Govt considering banning three of NZ’s favourite cars
.
…extract…
The Government is considering banning the importation of cars with a low safety rating, which could see some of New Zealand’s most popular models disappear from our roads.
.
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/govt-considering-banning-three-of-nzs-favourite-cars/ar-AACYGkc?li=BBqdg4K
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June 17, 2019 3:33pm
- sooty
  
  Aiming to take their voters cars off them!
  That’s going to end well. NOT!!
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:34pm
Jack5

Listened to Red Radio’s Checkpoint tonight for the first time since Lisa Owen took over.

She was ripping into John Key.

For a minute, I felt I was in a brain storm, reliving an incident from decades ago when, single, I accompanied a young married friend to his home well after his night-with-the-boys curfew.

And, behind the front door, his wife was waiting for him …

Owen, her voice rising shrilly, flew into John Key like that furious wife who had been “nursing her wrath to keep it warm” — as Robert Burns once put it.

If you are to be interviewed by Owen, don’t let her get between you and the door.
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June 17, 2019 5:43pm
- Alien
  
  Labour’s in trouble, when labour is in trouble key is an easy target to try and get some movement against national
  
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  June 17, 2019 8:36pm
Martin Williams

Why can’t John Key keep his nose clean?

Most ex-politicians just disappear quietly, but here he is unable to keep out of controversy and looking as dodgy and deceitful as ever. ?
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June 17, 2019 10:03pm
Jack5

Auckland public relations professional and Muslim, Mehpara Khan, has resurrected a Huntly incident of 2017, supporting the campaign for tighter speech controls in New Zealand.

Khan, at the time a PR executive of the Automobile Association (she’s now with Baldwin Boyle), and four friends, wearing hijabs, were verbally abused in Huntly by a drunk 27-year-old woman, who threw a can of beer at them. The group videoed the attack.

Megan Sarah Louise Walton, of no fixed abode in Auckland, was charged with assault, assault using a can of alcohol as a weapon, and behaving “in an insulting manner that was likely in the circumstances to cause violence against persons”.

Stuff reported:”According to the police summary of facts – which mirrors Khan’s account of the incident – Walton said she was too inebriated to remember it.”

The assault with a weapon charge was amended to the lesser charge of assault under the Crimes Act – and through her counsel Walton pleaded guilty to all three charges. She failed to show for her first sentencing remand, but finally was sentenced to 12 months supervision.

Then Green MP Catherine Delahunty declared the incident was a case of pakeha racism, though it seems the offender was Maori or part-Maori. A family member said the offender had mental health issues, and the offender claimed her mother was a Muslim convert.

Video of the incident:

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2017/04/huntly-muslim-attack-offender-doesn-t-show-for-sentencing.html

Mehpara Khan resurrects the Huntly incident:
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/voices/audio/2018699402/muslim-kiwi-says-hate-crime-legislation-must-change
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June 17, 2019 10:33pm

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