General Debate 04 August 2020

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Frank the tank

I see Biden has been endorsed by the American Communist party leader

well I never……..

I’m sure he’s going to be better than Trump that is, if he lasts 12 months……..

It’ll be good this time, honest word.
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August 4, 2020 8:03am
- kowtow
  
  And a NYT op ed calls for an end to Presidential debates.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:18am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Quelle surprise. Working to defend the indefensible. Appalling that DNC + pals are all trying to install an empty-head puppet president with intent of replacing him with their VP pick – intentionally subverting the power of the voters in a situation where the incumbent is so dire that many voters will feel like they have no choice.
    
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    August 4, 2020 8:40am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Well, if their candidate is still hiding in his basement to disguish advanced dementia, probably better to hide him away for as long as possible.
    
    Makes the VP pick vital. I am still going with Michelle O. Just watch.
    
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    August 4, 2020 8:41am
    - Komata
      
      The deity etc.@0841
      
      I would suggest that the VP will be HRC; she who is convinced that she lost because of the actions of the ‘Deplorables’ and wants revenge.
      
      She can’t Arkanside them all, BUT she can make their lives very, very miserable.
      
      ‘Hell hath no fury etc…’
      
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      August 4, 2020 9:01am
      - Batman
        
        Deity and Komata, I will take a bet that it won’t be HRC or Michelle.
        
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        August 4, 2020 4:47pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Still think it’s Kamala Harris
      
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      August 4, 2020 9:07am
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        Her record as Attorney doesn’t work with black people – she was pretty brutal and locked up a lot of them. This is probably why it is taking so long. That and:
        
        1. Hillary still won’t go away, so is probably threatening behind the scenes
        2. The Party still belongs to Obama, they want Michelle, but only if the win is in the bag. Going down with Biden would wing her political career.
        
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        August 4, 2020 9:26am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        Kamala Harris is black, though. It doesn’t matter if “she was pretty brutal and locked up a lot of them” because, unlike typical whites, blacks have a racial consciousness and vote tribally. They could select a black pudding as the VP and still get 95% of black voters. This is why the GOP are utterly deluding themselves and wasting their time trying to woo “the black vote.”
        
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        August 4, 2020 9:58am
      - Frank the tank
        
        It will be Harris – there isn’t another competent half-decent looking straight black women out there in democratic land since Gabbard went full loco with Billary…..
        
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        August 4, 2020 11:10am
      - virtualmark
        
        Or Susan Rice
        
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        August 4, 2020 4:28pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I still reckon Killary. We have not seen the last of her by a long way. Yeah yeah, her name is not on the list. Killary has ways and means
      
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      August 4, 2020 5:02pm
      - Rachael Membery
        
        Epstein’s list?
        
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        August 4, 2020 8:22pm
  - gorse
    
    I am surprised Adern hadn’t called for an end to the leaders debates here.
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:32am
    - Frank the tank
      
      Apparently she is trying
      
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      August 4, 2020 3:22pm
- Jimmy White
  
  Reminds me of the movie ‘Dead of Stalin’
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:36am
fernglas

I have had Covid-19. Why should I be forced into isolation and made to pay $3100 if I leave and come back? By all medical parameters I will be immune and not therefore able to transmit the virus. I am one of possibly 15,000 New Zealanders in this position. Where is the policy on this issue?
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August 4, 2020 8:04am
- Jimmy White
  
  However don’t be upset if I fail to invite you to my nursing home.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:40am
  - Tall Man
    
    Can you be sure you haven’t already …………
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:00am
  - fernglas
    
    Your loss, Jimmy. I could come and bore your lot to death about Covid, and that’s a far worse fate than the real thing
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:22am
  - Sacha
    
    A person who has had the virus illness will have personal immunity – and is no more likely that anyone else to be carrying the virus in their pharynx.
    
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    August 5, 2020 10:04am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Has it been confirmed “by all medical parameters” that having had the covids means the you are immune and can’t transmit the virus? Citation please?
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:51am
  - fernglas
    
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/31/opinion/coronavirus-antibodies-immunity.html And if I don’t have immunity, then waiting for a vaccine is pointless.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:11am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      I’ve read that article carefully. It does not say that having had covids makes you immune to it.
      
      It’s certainly true that if you don’t have immunity then waiting for a vaccine is pointless.
      
      Keeping you in isolation, however, is not.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:00am
      - fernglas
        
        In the absence of evidence that there have been reinfections, and based on the science around viruses which has been established for many years,the default position of the medical community must be that it would confer immunity. Otherwise, why are we looking for a vaccine? The only way to prove to the contrary is to provide evidence of a case where it has happened that someone has been infected twice, and that doesn’t exist. Or do we just shut people up because no-one has yet proved a negative?
        
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        August 4, 2020 10:26am
      - Albert_Ross
        
        Your article made the case, and it seemed reasonable, that at this stage we cannot conclude that having had the virus doesn’t confer immunity, and therefore we cannot conclude that a vaccine is impossible.
        
        That is, however, not at all the same thing as determining that having had the virus does confer immunity and therefore that a vaccine is possible.
        
        Perhaps best to leave the medical community to decide for itself what its position on these matters is?
        
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        August 4, 2020 11:06am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Has it been confirmed that 15,000 New Zealanders have had COVID-19?
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:18am
    - fernglas
      
      1500 positive tests, and the asymptomatic/ untested infection rate can be 6-10 times higher than the number of positive tests. So a ball park figure, but as good as any other.
      
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      August 4, 2020 9:38am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Does anyone even know of anyone, or has even heard of someone who knows someone who knows someone, who has tested positive? Let alone been hospitalised by, or died with it?
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:19am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        🙂 key word. With it – not from it
        
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        August 4, 2020 5:05pm
- Blackface Twin Reverb
  
  Because:
  a) there are cases of apparent re-infection.
  b) we can’t afford to keep giving people 2 weeks of room & service.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:07am
  - fernglas
    
    There are no proven cases of reinfection. Those that have been talked about in the MSM are either false positives or dead cells from previous infections still showing positive.
    I don’t want two weeks of room and service, as you might understand if you read my comment.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:41am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  I will check with Covid-19 specialist Cindy and let you know.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:24am
- tedbear
  
  This covid19’s supposedly a flu variation and nobody in NZ at least has died from it.
  
  But, more than 200,000 New Zealanders contracted the flu last year. Of these, it’s estimated that 400-500 people died either directly or indirectly from its effects.
  
  So can Ardern or one of her advisors remind me, why have we been in total lockdown over a flu variation (covid19) that nobody in New Zealand have died from it?
  
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  August 4, 2020 11:56am
  - tf78
    
    As I’ve said right along – it’s “the Newflu”.
    
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    August 4, 2020 12:50pm
LTA1955

Suns shining, blue sky in paradise…..Ohhh we owe we owe it’s off to work we go!
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August 4, 2020 8:05am
- kowtow
  
  You go to work so the ‘cuzzies’ can stay on the couch , smoking dope …….
  
  And a majority of voters endorse this new New Zealand , or to mimic the Media Pardy , Aotearoa.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:21am
  - calendar girl
    
    May I record here my strong distaste for the name “Aotearoa” being imposed on my country, New Zealand. And being imposed on at least one major sporting competition, as well on an assortment of New Zealand places, events and institutions.
    
    This is happening without my agreement, and without that of a majority of New Zealanders who are qualified to vote in a General Election, or in a National Referendum. Our country is in danger of being taken over by a bunch of self-appointed agitators, each prepared to impose his or her narrow will on New Zealand’s established institutions and democratic processes.
    
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    August 4, 2020 3:53pm
    - Nickc2
      
      More upticks required!
      
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      August 4, 2020 7:47pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  You have a job. Good for you!
  More and more people may not in the months ahead…
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:03am
  - MCos
    
    I don’t.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:43am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      Me neither.
      
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      August 4, 2020 1:10pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Shit, sorry… hope you’re both retired, with good funds (seriously, no /s).
        
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        August 4, 2020 3:56pm
Simon

State of Victoria in hard lockdown. Losers. All this time to plan and they come up with hard lockdown. Utter fucking losers.

Should there be a community outbreak here then NZ cant repeat this level 4, economic & civil liberties crashing bull shit again.

Its National’s job to put those [Deleted – Mod] in labour on notice.

There is now plenty of time for planning. What are the plans for isolation of the most vulnerable and to keep things moving so there isn’t the same bull shit panic over reaction from March. This is National’s job to work something out or make it an issue because the clowns in Labour aint up to it.

An election issue not to repeat the panic mistakes of March.
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August 4, 2020 8:06am
- Justitia
  
  Yes I agree Simon, National should be going on the front foot here. There is growing unease about the prospect of a second wave, thanks to events in Victoria, which the government is encouraging via its messaging as part of its election strategy that “only Jacinda can save us”. National need to make clear there will be no further Level 4 lockdown – that would be the final blow for the economy and many people’s mental health. Instead we must shield the vulnerable, keep the borders tight but otherwise let people go about their business. We have to be like Taiwan.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:26am
  - igm
    
    Biggest problem National have is Laboour leader and minions are not prepared to debate or produce policy.
    
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    August 4, 2020 8:50am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    If National are going to lose, then they may as well lose saying the right things. Chamberlain was lauded when he was waving his piece of paper around, but history has shown that he was gullible and naive. The present is only one aspect of the arc of history: what becomes “the past” remains so forever. National should think about how history will view them when the reality of covid can no longer be denied. Forget what their “focus groups” are likely telling them, and let’s have a dose of reality.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:10am
- JackRabbit
  
  An election issue not to repeat the Ides of March, during which NZ freedom was assassinated.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:26am
- thirteenstars
  
  National will fall in line with whatever the government does, just like it did back in March.
  
  National doesn’t want to upset the natives by endorsing anything else lest it be blamed for unnecessary deaths. Since there’s no higher emergency than a complete lockdown, they can’t be blamed for not doing everything they could.
  
  Politics in a safety-obsessed world is a recipe for draconian laws, and not just in times of emergency.
  
  You don’t want to kill granny, do you?
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:25am
  - Justitia
    
    Goodness no, not granny! But it seems we are perfectly happy to let more than 500 cystic fibrosis sufferers, mainly young adults, die an awful death by refusing to fund the new miracle drug Trikafta. Cindy said yesterday it was “nuddin to do with her”. All the money’s committed to buying the election.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:00am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    Let’s face it: National in 2020 are too weak and spineless to stand up to the baying mob. They cannot differentiate themselves, in any way that actually matters, from the liberal consensus advocates, because they are liberals at heart themselves.
    
    The GOP is the same: 90% approval for Trump from party members, yet their representatives don’t care about what the rank-and-file want. They just want their salaries while the country is dismantled around them.
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:13am
Justitia

So COVID 19 was devised in a Chinese military (PLA) laboratory (the wet market story was a ruse): https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12353248

No doubt Helen Clark and her colleague will be given full access to the lab, its records and the scientists involved in their WHO inquiry. For the sake of transparency?
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August 4, 2020 8:07am
- emmess
  
  But but but, that is a ‘conspiracy theory’ and nobody but the mainstream media should be able to suggest it.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:29am
- Kiwi_in_Paris
  
  That woman was saying that on Youtube like a month ago. Why did it take the mainstream media so long to wake up? Cindy suddenly needs a distraction, or a scapegoat?
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:37am
  - cmm
    
    To be fair lots of people are saying all sorts of rubbish on Youtube all the time.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:25am
- NoCash
  
  This looks explosive indeed, so I googled her, all results are dated within the last or so month, her Wikipedia page was created in mid July this year. So nothing on the Internet about her until about a month ago. Go figure…
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:50am
  - NoCash
    
    Looks like she’s been discredited by the University of HK.
    https://amp.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3093342/coronavirus-hku-school-head-chides-former-worker
    
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    August 4, 2020 1:13pm
    - GJM
      
      Hong Kong, that part of China that recently ignored the handover treaty to pass a law allowing the Chinese Stasi to disappear people who say hurt words against Xi or China, which they then set some examples to encourage the others? No bias or influence there then.
      
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      August 5, 2020 6:40am
- Tall Man
  
  Please explain the reports of the virus being found earlier than November last year in the US…
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:01am
  - Justitia
    
    Perhaps you could explain Tall Man why the virus waited until it had traveled to within a few hundred metres of the Wuhan Institute of Virology to reveal itself….
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:02am
    - Batman
      
      Uhhhhh, because it made its way into a major metropolitan area where medical services and testing are present. Whereas in rural China things are still pretty ropey in terms of medical care.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:16am
    - Tall Man
      
      Because that is the Chinese site of an outbreak, not the only outbreak it would seem and certainly not the first place in the whole world but hey, if it helps you sleep at night, believe what you will.
      
      According to the news reports my wife has been reading to me, it seems covid 20 is well advanced within the bat population but I guess they’re card carrying CCP member bats 😉
      
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      August 4, 2020 11:07am
Simon

Biggest fake news in NZ at the moment. Stuff asking for donations because journalism

What a racket.
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August 4, 2020 8:09am
- igm
  
  They should be prosecuted for dishonesty.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:53am
- Frank the tank
  
  I’d say with confidence that Stuffed is trading insolvent.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:16am
  - igm
    
    Stuff have no assets to speak of, and are at the mercy of Fairfax (Aus) for pre-press and printing, and if they lose any more major advertisers their survival is precarious.
    This is why they are so supportive of Ardern and her party that is squandering $50m buying media compliance.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:11am
    - Tall Man
      
      Are you saying our media aren’t free honest and independent ………
      
      You’re right.
      
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      August 4, 2020 11:09am
- coge
  
  Banning half of the folk who used to comment on Stuff’s articles (some of whom were subscribers) Lost what remained of the public’s goodwill.
  
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  August 4, 2020 3:05pm
Yvette

Back in history, three years ago, pre-last Election, Ardern was having a conversation about charging for water – since opposition to the Chinese bottling brazilians of litres a day, to send it overseas, had lead to discussion of farmers paying for irrigation water – but when the conversation turned nasty with Labour’s David Parker threatening farmers in a meeting saying “I’m not here to negotiate, don’t push me or it will be 2c instead of 1c”, talking about water that farmers already spent 17c per cubic litre to get to their farms.

Ardern suddenly realised a degree of uncertainty was creeping into policy, could not conceive how people could vote on doubts, and in a Captain’s Call she declared all tax matter, including water tax, would be considered by a Tax Working Group and there would be no new tax introduced by Labour until after this now up-coming 2020 Election.

So much for the curse of uncertainty.
So what has happened?
Labour planning a policy free campaign
Speaking to RNZ this morning, Ardern said voters should not expect a “large-scale range of policies” from Labour this election.

How many committees, working groups, and delaying consultants have been employed in the passing term to supposedly avoid uncertainty. I think National, David Farrar and the Taxpayers Union gave up counting at about 125 working groups. Some have probably never reported back on whatever they were created for.

But that is now all gone? Just believe in the tooth-fairy?
Because the Guardian tells the world we have a Saviour dedicated to New Zealand interests – and much lower down the item you find the writer is interviewing Helen Clark as a source.

Tony Blair commends Jacinda Ardern, Kiwis’ ‘top of class’ response to pandemic
It is like, seeing she has painted us into a corner, admiring the bloody brush-work.

Her party’s priority is the Covid-19 recovery
Don’t bother me, while I am saving you … again
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August 4, 2020 8:12am
- JackRabbit
  
  Labour planning a policy free campaign.
  
  That’s because their plan of state control is already in place.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:29am
  - Nickc2
    
    What’s the bet all tax increases including a CGT will be blamed on COVID-19?
    Note, she’s not answering questions about future taxes at the moment and my bet is she won’t before the election. Then, standby, all those taxes you’ve heard about in Communist and Socialist countries will come into force with a vengeance all courtesy of a compliant MSM and their advance payment of $50m Plus.
    No doubt all Landlords (of which I was one) have witnessed a pretext of how vengeful a Socialist government can be. They will make even the Greens look like armatures.
    
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    August 4, 2020 1:49pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  “Her party’s priority is the Covid-19 recovery” yes that’s the whole point, you daft bint.
  
  That is like, literally, the only thing you have to do, so what about a few policy ideas of how you’re going to do it?
  
  And don’t insult our intelligence by mouthing platitudes such as a “5-point plan” there’s no such thing. Well, apart from the one that David Seymour and ACT have been promoting for a couple of months now, because they’ve been paying attention and actually have some ideas.
  
  She really does think the vast majority of New Zealanders are stupid, and tragically, she may not be far off the mark.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:35am
  - Ruawai
    
    Maybe National can become the government and employ Jacinda to hold daily 1pm covid briefings to calm the people.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:07am
    - Tall Man
      
      “Hugmeister”
      
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      August 4, 2020 1:47pm
- Tall Man
  
  And again, and again, and again ………..
  
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  August 4, 2020 11:10am
Bobba Fret

I think Labour are genuinely worried that they cannot beat Judith or National in any debates and will run from all ‘fights’ and simply rely on the “we are concentrating on eliminating Covid-19 and saving lives” ticket.
Jacinda expects us to vote for her and trust her to do whats best even though she wont tell us what that is.
Thus she will not rule out (or rule in) tax cuts and make very few if any promises or policy announcements that they can be measured against.
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August 4, 2020 8:12am
- bruceavon
  
  I doubt Ardern is scared of Judith in debates, she was up against Bill English last time, he’s no slouch and knows as much about policy as anyone ever. But politically why would Ardern bother with a debate? When you are this far ahead you simply don’t need it like the opposition does. Boris was miles ahead in the last British election, refused to go on TV, did as little as possible, because any publicity works for the opposition. Besides that, who will watch the debates? No one under 50 even watches TV anymore. I will be very very keen to see one. But I would say their relevance is declining. So what will happen, like when Judith and Ardern were up against each other in parliament for the first time, most people will only see the zingers or one big score they make, which will of course probably favour the PM.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:56am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Ardern has the incumbents disadvantage of having to defend her record for the last three years.
    That’s pretty weak ground to stand on
    
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    August 4, 2020 2:02pm
- DeepBlue
  
  Does Judith get to make a speech for the allotted debate time? She could bring along a puppet of Jacinda and H1, H2 etc could stand behind and pull the strings.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:20am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Clint Eastwood style, talking to the chair with an invisible Obama. “You can’t do that to yourself”
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:54am
- Classic Liberal
  
  “ Thus she [jacinda] will not rule out (or rule in) tax cuts ”
  
  Huh?? If she gets back in it will be huge tax increases, cuts out of the question, surely?
  
  She’ll she it as a right to go ‘socialism full steam ahead’. Wealth tax, inheritance tax, cgt, higher top rate, assets no longer yours but essentially the state’s. Wait for it!
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:16am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Ardern is know to read from her tablet.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:55pm
Benedict Yu

https://i.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/122094610/mori-and-pasifika-severely-underrepresented-at-science-faculties-study-finds

Stupid on full display. This ‘study’ berates science faculties for not employing enough Maori scientists. Of course that is because few Maori study science. This is not some nasty conspiracy in progress which is the underlying tone of the authors.

And this situation will get worse as Maori students are encouraged by activists to study “Maori Science”. Well that didn’t work out too well over the first 800 years they occupied New Zealand. There was not too much scientific advancement on display.
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August 4, 2020 8:12am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Yep,
  If secondary students don’t have a decent wodge of Maths and Science NCEA credits by the time they reach university, they are going to be on struggle street coping with graduate and Post grad level courses in the Sciences.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:34am
  - Jimmy White
    
    You don’t need Maths and Science, or even common sense to succeed at University. I have an example if your want comrade.
    
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    August 4, 2020 8:44am
    - hullkiwi
      
      Yes, she may have gone to university and may have even had a “Bachelors” degree conferred upon her. However, that does not mean she is a graduate of a degree course grounded in academic learning, reading and research!
      
      In other words she has a piece of paper that can be used to prove she can do a news conference at which she is asked pre-scripted questions by her favored media reps.
      
      Please don’t insult those of us with University graduate and post grad degrees grounded on academic research with such comparisons in the future!
      
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      August 4, 2020 9:28am
      - Ian Boag
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        I was not aware that you are an authority on university standards. Oxford man perhaps ?
        
        Just out of curiosity can you point us at some stuff we can read that supports your view of Waikato U?
        
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        August 4, 2020 9:40am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Ian, you are aware that Maori are getting into med school now w far lower results than Asian and Caucasian students?
        
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        August 4, 2020 10:20am
      - hullkiwi
        
        Ian, I read for my post grad degree in the UK. The Russell Group of Universities, do not recognize degrees such as Jacinda’s.
        
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        August 4, 2020 10:35am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Ian – Are you really suggesting that a ‘Communications Degree’ from Waikato is a serious degree?
        
        10 years ago I was involved with firms in New Zealand recruiting graduates with degrees in finance and economics for entry level jobs. After a couple of years we stopped short listing Waikato graduates. We wrote to the faculty explaining why. No response.
        
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        August 4, 2020 11:27am
      - lifesgood
        
        What a complete and utter waste of money it is to pay for a frothy communications degree when you can easily get as good, if not better, training in communications from Toastmasters for next to nothing.
        
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        August 4, 2020 1:10pm
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Yes but Waikato degrees only count as 3/5th of a real degree.
      
      Note all the A++ grades from their graduates. Remarkable.
      
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      August 4, 2020 9:29am
      - Tall Man
        
        “Vege degrees” are what most call them.
        
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        August 4, 2020 11:14am
- JackRabbit
  
  I object to there being NO Ferengi or Klingons in their either. How racist!
  
  “Well that didn’t work out too well over the first 800 years they occupied New Zealand.”
  
  The Tahitian Maoris may have only been here for 800 years, but previous inhabitants stretch back thousands of years. But a lot of that history was wiped out.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:36am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Where are the middens of the previous inhabitants? The charcoal of their fires can be carbon-dated.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:05am
    - JackRabbit
      
      Plenty of evidence to be found, in forms far more solid than long gone campfires, so long as you start looking.
      
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      August 4, 2020 6:13pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “The Tahitian Maoris may have only been here for 800 years, but previous inhabitants stretch back thousands of years.”
    
    Any evidence? You can’t have people here for thousands of years who leave nothing behind.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:49am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      They were the original “tidy Kiwis”?
      
      9 0
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      August 4, 2020 11:56am
      - JackRabbit
        
        You mean the ones that planted crops and raised animals and did not eat human flesh?
        
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        August 4, 2020 6:12pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      Benedict, if you have to ask that question it means you seriously haven’t considered the question and therefore haven’t done any research.
      
      Throw a few hours research into it and you will find an abundance of data. After all don’t you want to know the history on NZ? 🙂
      
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      August 4, 2020 6:11pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        OK – so point me to some links to get me under way. And BTW I have lived here for 24 years so I can do without being patronised.
        
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        August 4, 2020 9:07pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        A good series of videos to start with is at:
        https://plummtreeproductions.vhx.tv/. This brings together research from many researchers and authors. Best watched in sequence.
        
        Or on Youtube:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvMAtePt3PQ
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf_inGOubEg
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g15ROUH3gAQ
        
        Google “Song of the Waitaha”, Celtic NZ
        https://waitaha.org/
        http://www.celticnz.co.nz/
        
        https://treatygate.wordpress.com/category/politics/treatygate/david-rankin/
        
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        August 5, 2020 6:47am
- Frank the tank
  
  Perhaps they lose interest when the realize that taniwha aren’t real?
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:53am
- Clyde
  
  Any “study” that comes out of these departments such as Maori Studies or whatever is not even worth reading. And why should there be a “quota” of Eastern Polynesians in any Department. How many Eastern Polynesians are there in the Department of Irish Studies? Or in Peace and Conflict Studies? Why do we have quota for Eastern Polynesians getting into Medical School despite having poorer entry qualifications? This is racism pure and simple but just because its being practised by bleeding heart liberals or brown people it doesn’t change things. “Positive discrimination” is racism and it should be called out. What is important is equality of opportunity and recognition of simple hard work.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:07am
- Ruawai
  
  I want to lay a complaint that Chinese New Zealanders are under represented in super 15 rugby teams.
  
  25 2
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  August 4, 2020 10:10am
  - Blackface Twin Reverb
    
    Didn’t the ex-Japan halfback play a couple of seasons for the Highlanders?
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:44am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  I’m far more outraged by the fact that it is says “mori” in the link.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:23am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Maori science: the invocation of taniwha droppings.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:53pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  Thanks for the link. What a joke that article is, and how desperate are the left to blame lack of representation by one or more sectors of society on “institutional racism” when it’s nothing of the sort.
  
  Desperate to do whatever it takes to ensure equality of outcome, when they should be focusing on equality of opportunity, which in fact is now skewed towards those of less ability, talent or work ethic, simply because of the colour of their skin.
  
  Two telling quotes – firstly blaming it on those damned Asians (what with all their hard work, persistence, tenacity, valuing of education and a determination to better themselves – the despicable b*stards!), and secondly on a lack of “institutional will” whatever that is.
  
  “Most academics in science faculties at New Zealand universities were European and there had been a consistent increase in Asian academics through the years.”
  
  “The paper highlighted the lack of institutional will to build a sustainable Māori and Pasifika workforce.”
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:57pm
Maggie Pie

Look, I don’t wish to sound pedantic, but surely you would say, “I did not murder anyone”, rather than, “I murdered nobody”.

Honestly.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12353078
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August 4, 2020 8:12am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Maybe Nobody had it coming?
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:30am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Well, nobody’s perfect.
    
    7 0
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    August 4, 2020 12:58pm
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      definitely had it coming then, smug bastard that Nobody!
      
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      August 4, 2020 4:23pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  Jacinda styled sophistry. Maybe he considered the person he murdered to be nobody and is therefore telling the truth?
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:12am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Actually, a simple “Not guilty” or “guilty” were the only acceptable answers.
  
  Perhaps he asked for a Jury trial?
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:01pm
Tony Stuart

Jacinda Ardern November 2017:

The Government I lead will be the most open and transparent government ever in New Zealand

Jacinda Ardern August 2020:

“What we will be doing over this election period is adding some additional aspects [of policy],” she said.

“But I would flag to voters not to expect to see the large scale manifestos that are a significant departure from what we are doing.”

This is the Government which appointed Clare Curran as Minister for Open Government. This is the Government where both the Minister and Associate Minister of Transport refused to release correspondence between the two. This is the Government which is likely to be found by the High Court to have unlawfully detained New Zealanders in the first nine days of the Covid-19 lockdown. This is the Government which decided, by “captain’s call” and without any official advice, to ban future oil and gas exploration in Taranaki especially, and other parts of New Zealand. This is the Government which nominated Trevor Mallard to be Speaker, despite him having a conviction for fighting in a public place, when he allegedly punched another MP, and despite Mallard’s history of hyperbolic claims, abuse of public servants and members of the public, and homophobic interjections towards a gay MP.

I could go on; the list is long. But the point is made. Jacinda Ardern is asking us to accept her assurances that their will be little departure from what her government is currently doing.

I, for one, will not accept that assurance, and I will continue to campaign with vigour for a change of government.
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August 4, 2020 8:14am
- JackRabbit
  
  “The Government I lead will be the most opined and trans-parents government ever in New Zealand”
  
  This is more accurate.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:38am
- BAM
  
  She can do that because the media is now government-funded, they do what Ardern says.
  
  There is now literally no way for National to get their message out without it being twisted or trashed, apart from Facebook all other options are closed.
  
  Can anyone ever remember seeing an election year where the opposition party is the one being constantly rubbished and heavily scrutinised while the party in power gets a free pass to say and do what they please?
  
  Where’s the holding the government to account? it’s non-existent.
  I guess this is what it’s like living in Russia.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:51am
- hullkiwi
  
  Tony, why is this a surprise? They wasted 9 years in opposition and had no policies other than 5 failed policies (LRT, CGT, KiwiBuild, End Child Poverty, & Free Fees), with such a record why offer up more doomed policies?
  
  The question is how big is Ardern’s ego & how stupid is Megan Woods? Will they allow Ardern to go head to head in TV debates against Judith?
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:44am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    1. Immeasurable
    2. Immeasurable
    3. Unlikely
    
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    August 4, 2020 1:14pm
- jv
  
  “Let’s just keep flouncing”
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:04am
- Classic Liberal
  
  “ manifestos”. Wtf? Who uses that word except a communist? I think the mask slipped further in the use of that word.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:24am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    No, it’s a very common, if not expected, part of any serious political party’s preparations for an election and to govern.
    
    The dictionary definition is: “a public declaration of policy and aims, especially one issued before an election by a political party or candidate.”
    
    The fact there isn’t one says everything you need to know about Labour’s dearth of ideas, although they do evidence a kind of rat cunning. If you don’t say you’re going to do anything, I guess you can’t be criticised when you inevitably fail to do it.
    
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    August 4, 2020 1:19pm
- Rachael Membery
  
  They are also banking on NZ not tending to have one term governments.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:47pm
Nukuleka

Meanwhile the msm continue their ongoing assault on Judith Collins in a mirror image of the CNN/NYT/WP anti-Trump style. It won’t matter what Judith says or does in the next pre-election weeks she will be demonized and her words and actions twisted against her to suit the St Jacinda narrative.
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August 4, 2020 8:30am
- Ruahine
  
  Judith does not have $50 million of OPM to throw at the media sycophants.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:35am
- Tall Man
  
  And like Trump it could work in her favour.
  
  The media have a point of view that the majority of NZ do not subscribe to. Pointing out that Judith doesn’t fit their interpretation of what is right may well assist her.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:38am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Forces are being stirred. Ardern cannot do as she pleases. The whole COL is a fraud.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:50pm
Kiwi_in_Paris

REALITY CHECK Coronavirus is a ‘nasty infection’ that ‘simply brought deaths forward by a few weeks’, says UK Govt advisor:

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12293799/coronavirus-nasty-infection-brought-deaths-forward-government-advisor/
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August 4, 2020 8:31am
- cmm
  
  Yup, essentially the same happens every winter/spring in Flu Season.
  
  Winter comes along and we get a larger number of people dying, then less dying outside of flu season.
  
  Those “excess deaths” in flu season just result in less deaths in summer.
  
  CV19 has done pretty much the same by time shifting deaths by a few weeks for mainly frail and sick people who were soon to die anyway -CV19 or not.
  
  This is completely different to, say, the Spanish Flu which mainly killed otherwise healthy people in the prime of their lives: 30s and 40s who would otherwise have expected another 40 years of life.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:37am
  - hullkiwi
    
    Ahhhhhh but cmm, have you not noticed, CV19, doesn’t seem to pay any heed as to what the season is?
    
    Irrespective of what some commentators have said, CV19 is more severe than flu, with higher death rates and contrary to the opinions of some is not a winter only flu bug – look at Florida and other US states, the re-emergence in Catalonia and other European centers.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:50am
    - Ruawai
      
      Can’t work out why NZ and Taiwan seem to have such low rates of covid.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:14am
      - hullkiwi
        
        Isolated islands?
        
        Taiwan is interesting, because Covid spreads easiest in population dense environments aka New York, Europe and Asian centres. So you would expect issues in Taiwan.
        
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        August 4, 2020 10:49am
- Lance
  
  So that’s why front line medical workers are dying as well?
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:13pm
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  This may seem crass, but Covid19 ending your life a few weeks before it would have anyway might save you a few weeks of misery.
  
  I’m 73 years old and would rather go quickly than slowly.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:29pm
jimbo3

Had a laugh this morning. Heard the broadcasting school advertising “NZBS”
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August 4, 2020 8:33am
- Tall Man
  
  We have the same humour button.
  
  Thought the BS was extremely apt.
  
  Wonder how long it will take to change.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:40am
  - Blackface Twin Reverb
    
    Moarify it – works every time.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:46am
oldpark

Came across this quote that sums up Commie/Socialist Ardern and her band of too sweet to be whole gang of ne’er do wells .
“I hate it when Someone one tells me they “Care” and are “Kind” when their actions show me they don’t”.
Check out their track record of control of NZs population . Right out of the Karl Marx Playbook .
Ardern going to kindys and schools being a certain type of grooming of our children with velvet gloves and honeyed words hiding a total hidden agenda of control of what Ardern has in store for us all should her and her ilk get Three More Years. And a dress rehearsal for what in now taking place for NZs Adults . Just check out the frantic passing of punitive legislation this week against all of us . Control! Control! Control! Thats this side of the General Election. Just a sniff of what lies ahead should they con NZs to vote them in .
Maybe it is now time NZ took back their country from what is going on . Such as Ardern scaring the crap out of us all with Coronavirus Testing especially no signs of any of it being internal in the last Three months . Surely if one has to die . “It is better to wear out than rust out “.
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August 4, 2020 8:36am
Maggie Pie

Had to pop into the city yesterday to purchase more of my absolute fave eau de parfum. Needless to say, parking was non-existent. Ended up using a Disability Park way up by the Town Hall. That meant I then had to hoof it about a km all the way down to Mecca.
Now let me just say, i reckon this government is feeding us an absolute load of shite about the borders being closed to everyone except New Zealanders returning to the country. Honestly, from what I could see, most of Queen Street was still crawling with Asians.
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August 4, 2020 8:38am
- Jimmy White
  
  Good thing you are not an MP Maggie. Statements like that will loose you your Job. Using the word “pop” is so ageist.
  
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  August 4, 2020 8:48am
- Tall Man
  
  Have a look at “PriceRightMart” online in Oz. Very tasty pricing and the real deal.
  
  https://priceritemart.com.au/
  
  The boss uses them when we head over to Oz but they do post here. Better than Duty Free.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:44am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Thought Auckland city centre had turned into a deserted wasteland thanks to anti-car policies?
  
  https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/mike-hosking-breakfast/opinion/mike-hosking-aucklands-foot-traffic-is-down-is-anyone-surprised/
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:03am
Kiwi_in_Paris

Some people are saying there were between a half a million and million corona virus protesters in Berlin.
The mainstream media reported 17,000 to 20,000 Neo-Nazis lol.
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August 4, 2020 8:40am
MCos

Polling for the election starts one month from tomorrow, boys and girls.
That’s 24 days after National finally sorts out who will be their candidate in the most marginal seat in the country, Auckland Central.
But wait there’s more!
If they select Nuwanthie Samarakone (Peter Goodfellow’s preference) as their candidate they must turn around and find a new candidate for Manurewa, a safe Labour, which they also have had problems with.
Maybe she’s already tossed in the towel over there.
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August 4, 2020 8:43am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Just as well Peter Goodfellow doesn’t get any say in the Auckland Central selection then, isn’t it MCos.
  
  Candidate selection will be decided by the ballot of the 60 Auckland Central members who have been elected by their peers to form the selection panel, and apart from maintaining a watching brief, Head Office will have no input whatsoever.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:20am
  - pdm
    
    But but but shouldn’t the Unions select the candidates.
    
    Ooops – wrong party – it is Labour that do that.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:29am
    - MCos
      
      Looking at the Labour Party constitution, unions have nothing to do with candidate selection.
      You’re thinking of the party leader selection, where they do have a say unless it’s within three months of a general election.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:12am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        The labour party constitution is influenced heavily by the unions and always has been.
        So the union influences who may be a candidate, then the party selects the “best” of the unions selection.
        
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        August 4, 2020 10:35am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        But in the real world, the Unions have significant power in the Labour NZ Council so yeah, they do have significant power over candidate selection.
        
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        August 4, 2020 11:19am
  - MCos
    
    Ultimately he doesn’t, but in this case he has still made his preference know.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:58am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      National Party candidate selection panels have a long history of giving the upraised middle finger to attempts by Head Office to dictate selections MCos.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:40am
Paulus

May I assume that the people due to arrive for the Christchurch shooting massacre sentencing are or have arrived – understand there will be many large families – and they’re or will shortly undergo quarantine at our five star hotels as believe all expenses are being paid by us and it is scheduled for three days mainly due to victim impact statements for each and translators.
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August 4, 2020 8:57am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Yes
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:37pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Iran lied about the prevalence of Covid-19 in the country early this year

Coronavirus: Iran cover-up of deaths revealed by data leak
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-53598965

Perhaps not surprising then that our first positive case was from that country
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August 4, 2020 8:58am
- Tall Man
  
  Who lied about her movements in order to sneak back in. Again, what a surprise.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:02am
- hullkiwi
  
  Maggy, indeed. And what is not being reported widely anymore, is the little known facts that Iran is still struggling to contain incidents of Covid19, and the death rate is still as great as March.
  
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  August 4, 2020 3:44pm
Justitia

So Jacinda thinks it’s legally risky to charge returning citizens and permanent residents for their quarantine expenses? Okay, howabout they be asked to contribute towards their costs by means of a “suggested donation”? The names of all those who contributed could, with their permission of course, be published weekly on the Beehive website for a grateful nation to praise and admire. There’s more than one way to skin a civet cat.
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August 4, 2020 9:00am
- Durden
  
  “Quarantine charging is Love”
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:18am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Everything according to Jacinda is hard and complicated to implement. Which is why they get nothing actually done.
  Does anyone know if they have managed to put through the pay cut for Covid of 20% for six months yet?
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:09am
  - Batman
    
    It’s ten percent once averaged across the year. So even that was a fib
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:13am
    - Tall Man
      
      “fib” ….”fib”……..
      
      Jeez Batman, harden up. It was a lie. Another in a long endless list FFS.
      
      4 1
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      August 4, 2020 2:38pm
- lifesgood
  
  Couldn’t the airlines tack on a $3000 surcharge which could then be handed over to the govt as a landing tax, or whatever. I don’t believe this BS about it being illegal to charge returning citizens. Australia are. How come they can do it. Honestly, if you have a will there are ways and means.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:15pm
WaynelSexton

Ask yourself this: why are Democrats wargaming the loss of the election if Creepy Joe is genuinely ahead in the polls by seven points?
https://www.breitbart.com/2020-election/2020/08/02/democrats-war-game-for-election-includes-west-coast-secession-possible-civil-war-john-podesta/
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August 4, 2020 9:09am
- Critical Thinker
  
  John Podesta played the part of Joe Biden in the war game. In which he refused to concede in a scenario that looked a bit like the 2016 election results.
  
  In this scenario, California, Oregon, and Washington then threatened to secede from the United States if Mr. Trump took office as planned. The House named Mr. Biden president; the Senate and White House stuck with Mr. Trump. At that point in the scenario, the nation stopped looking to the media for cues, and waited to see what the military would do.”
  
  To avoid this bloodshed Trump needs to win the 2020 election in a landslide.
  
  Thankfully great swathes of free thinking Americans are finally now waking up from their manipulation induced slumber.
  
  The future is now looking truthfully bright indeed ?
  
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  August 4, 2020 11:42am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    You have reminded me of something: does anyone else recall a NZ TV interview with John Podesta, days before the Mosque attacks. He was in the country for some reason, and apparently, we were a “juicy target”? I recall the phrase because it was vaguely suggestive of his reputation.
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:59am
    - Critical Thinker
      
      Yes that’s indeed true.
      
      The victim of the world’s most notorious political “hack” is warning New Zealand’s election next year is at serious risk of a major cyber-attack by Russia and China.
      
      During the campaign, tens of thousands of Mr Podesta’s emails were hacked by the Russia government.
      
      The “hack” and release on WikiLeaks was believed to be a major factor in Ms Clinton’s loss to current president Donald Trump.
      
      He says we’re a “juicier target”, and should guard against hacked information being weaponised as fake news.
      
      “What’s new is this weaponisation – the use of social media to spread discord, lies, dissatisfaction – that’s I think what you’ve got to look out for,” he says.
      
      Mr Podesta played a starring role in one of the great conspiracy theories of the election – his hacked emails included an exchange about a Washington DC pizza joint called Comet Ping Pong.
      
      “[The rumours were] that HC and I were running a child porn ring, which had no basis in anything, but a guy showed up with a gun and ended up shooting up a pizza parlour,” he says.
      
      https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/03/2020-new-zealand-election-a-juicy-target-for-major-hack-john-podesta.html
      
      The more you know… ?
      
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      August 4, 2020 12:17pm
  - Critical Thinker
    
    President Trump SURGES Past “Hollow Joe” Biden in Latest Economic Poll
    
    The survey, from the Democracy Institute commissioned by the Sunday Express newspaper, shows Trump leading Biden 48 percent to 46 percent. What’s more, Trump has opened up a bigger lead according to this poll in the crucial battleground states, meaning the president by this pollster’s estimates currently is projected to win 309 electoral votes—more than he did in 2016.
    
    Crucially, President Trump has a lead of 48 percent to 43 percent in the swing states Florida, Iowa, Michigan, Minnesota, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin which would put him back in the White House with an electoral college tally of 309 to Biden’s 229.
    
    https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1317435/donald-trump-polls-us-election-2020-joe-biden-latest-news
    
    Q: Why are the DNC/Media and co pushing for continued lockdowns and mail-in voting?
    
    A: Everything is at stake this election.
    
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    August 4, 2020 12:00pm
Maggie Pie

ZB reports ex Prime Minister Helen Clarke ‘called out’ Elon Musk on Twitter for his racist remark suggesting….. “aliens built Egypt’s pyramids”

She ought to talk. LOL!!

https://i.imgflip.com/4abl1a.jpg
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August 4, 2020 9:10am
- RJ
  
  Meanwhile in a base on the Dark side of the moon an alien is watching and commenting, I think that was the human the probe malfunctioned in
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:55am
- RW Capitalist
  
  So is Helen going to apologize for airbrushing her campaign photos, to make her look more human?
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:38am
  - Tall Man
    
    This you mean
    
    https://www.whaleoil.net.nz/images/2010/03/she-best.jpg
    
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    August 4, 2020 2:23pm
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Now that
      is assault with a deadly meem.
      
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      August 4, 2020 3:28pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      I though that was a Photoshop advert showing before photoshop and after photoshop. I seem to recall the after photoshop pic used on election billboards.
      
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      August 4, 2020 6:23pm
    - Nickc2
      
      She hasn’t changed a bit! That thing on the left I mean.
      
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      August 4, 2020 7:55pm
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  If interstellar-travel-capable aliens had done so, they would be perfect. They are as near to perfection as humans could get, but there is some error in the alignments.
  
  But the bronze-age Egyptians certainly did not: they just did not have the requisite technology at hand. The “experts” are so dogmatic, that they attempt to attribute totally impossible engineering feats to a culture that could not have done so. More likely (in addition to the various other incongruous structures in South America, Asia and India, for instance) they were constructed by humans, but in an antediluvian age.
  
  As one example, look up “Lost Technologies of Ancient Egypt” by Christopher Dunn. Dunn is a CNC engineer, and, as a very brief summary of his thesis, the various extant gigantic megalithic statues and various artifacts (such as diorite bowls and ornamental jugs, with intricate internal drilling producing nearly inconceivable curves) show all the hallmarks of equivalence to contemporary machining techniques, in some cases even superior.
  
  The symmetry, the near-perfection of the finished products, evidence in the form of striations and the objectively ascertained rates of ploughing-out that would be necessary (requiring enormous pressures on sometimes tiny cutting/drilling heads), various examples of “mistakes” where a high-speed rotating saw blade has left marks that would not have been the case with hand tools etc.
  
  Dunn doesn’t speculate as to who did this work, or even necessarily when it was done: he just concludes that it was done, and his case is rigorously argued based on his engineering expertise.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:21pm
  - JackRabbit
    
    So, created by an advanced ancient civilisation, before it was overrun with socialism and arrogance and they blew themselves up.
    
    As you say, many countries have artifacts. Stuff is turning up all over the world. There has been an abundance of programs on Nat Geo and other channels.
    
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    August 4, 2020 6:29pm
- Justitia
  
  But they did! I saw the movie with Eric Von Daniken.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:31pm
Happychappy

Jacinda must be starting to get worried about the upcoming Elections soon as the morge holidays from our banks can’t last forever and the Governments handouts will become more noticeable the closer we get to the Election. So don’t be surprised to see mortgages sales beginning to hit the market very soon.
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August 4, 2020 9:11am
- lifesgood
  
  Just as Labour previously handed out the expensive and ridiculous election bribe of interest free loans to students I expect them to pull a similar trick the week before polling starts. Something like a renewed wage subsidy for the next 6 months. They are a loathsome bunch who will do anything for power.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:18pm
- Paulus
  
  Property crunch will not come until autumn next year after the holidays.
  Needs time to gestate.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:58pm
Albert_Ross

I see Sam Stubbs has again taken over some column inches at Stuff to resist changes to KiwiSaver. He says that the reason Australia’s economy grew faster than ours is that they started pension saving sooner than us and now have a larger pool of pension funds.

Nope. The money that’s now in KiwiSaver accounts isn’t additional money in the NZ economy; it’s money that has been diverted from elsewhere in the NZ economy. Some of that money, particularly that which is sitting in conservative funds, would have done better elsewhere. Certainly, some of it would have done worse; and some of it would otherwise have gone into non-KiwiSaver investment funds where there is no evidence that its performance would have been much different.

The extent to which KiwiSaver has led to a real improvement in the economy as a whole is unquantifiable (it’s impossible to know exactly what would have happened without it), but it is most certainly not equivalent to the entire amount held in KiwiSaver accounts. And the same goes for Australia
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August 4, 2020 9:15am
- Tall Man
  
  From my looking … It seems most of the “Industry Super Funds” have done better than most of our funds.
  
  My sister, now retired, did exceedingly well.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:48am
  - Tall Man
    
    https://www.finder.com.au/industry-super-funds
    
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    August 4, 2020 1:59pm
- hullkiwi
  
  Having known Sam Stubbs since University, I am astounded at his career path.
  
  However, Tall Man gives a hint to why Australian Savings Funds have done well, it is the same reason their economy did well for most of the past 30 years. That is, investment in mineral extraction industries!!!
  
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  August 4, 2020 3:07pm
- KH
  
  Disagree Albert. The ultimate benefit flows to the owner. Because NZers gave away ownership far too much we became hardworking but low wage stressed servants.
  Kiwisaver is a step back to New Zealanders being owners. It’s a small step so far, but the magic thing about ownership is that it snowballs.
  
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  August 4, 2020 6:46pm
Durden

Like every other test, we know that PCR tests for Covid-19 are not 100% accurate. According to one report below, applying Bayesian theorem, close to 5.5% could return false negatives i.e. have Covid but return a negative result.

https://science.thewire.in/the-sciences/covid-19-rt-pcr-serological-tests-false-positive-false-negative-rate-bayes-theorem/

This means for every 10,000 people returning to NZ, potentially up to 550 people with Covid could be been turned loose into community. That is a potential for a lot of clusters. Despite strenuous denial, would the people leaving NZ who tested positive in South Korea (1) and in Sydney (2) simply represent the tip of the iceberg of community transmission in NZ ?

Why is it that reporters have so far never asked Ashley Bloomfield about how many false negatives are likely to have been returned since we started managed isolation and quarantining?

We have seen our contact tracing system, approved by Labour list candidate Dr. Ayesha Verral is woeful. Did we ever find out how many of those in the early stages released untested and gave false contact details were actually finally “found” ? How many more are still giving false contact details or simply disappearing into community?

Ignorance is not bliss. Compliant media playing dumb for the $50M++ handout does not bode well for speaking truth to power and for the country.
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August 4, 2020 9:17am
- SGA
  
  This means for every 10,000 people returning to NZ, potentially up to 550 people with Covid could be been turned loose into community.
  
  I agree that false negatives would be a problem, but if they adhere to a 14-day quarantine with two tests that should at least mitigate that risk somewhat.
  It does, however, suggest that a simple test at the border (as Iceland are doing) is not a good strategy?
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:38am
  - Durden
    
    Maybe Iceland might be more confident about their contact tracing efficiency and effectiveness.
    Iceland is a much smaller country (about half NZ) and a smaller population < 400k.
    
    Two tests is a good strategy because two false negatives are less likely. But given we are hearing in print news that people from different cohorts of arrivals are sharing smokes and potential viruses together in the management facilities along with the friendly guards, two tests might not mean much.
    
    Also quite possible that day 3 test may be too early to pick up last minute infection, and a false negative on the day 12 test would then result in release after 15 days They obviously have to be physically symptom free at final checkup–if such a thing is in the standard operating procedure.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:58am
    - SGA
      
      I don’t want to dismiss your idea about false negatives being a risk, because it is a valid point. You are overestimating the risk though.
      
      This means for every 10,000 people returning to NZ, potentially up to 550 people with Covid could be been turned loose into community.
      
      Well, no. That would be true only if ALL 10,000 were infected. Let’s say that 1 in a 100 are actually infected (that might be a little low, but it makes the numbers easy and seems roughly consistent with the true positive rates that they are reporting). Instead of 550 false negatives, you are dealing with 5.5 false negatives per 10,000 arrivals. If you then factor in the odds of the series of circumstances by which they manage to get through both tests, and that they were still infectious after 14-days quarantine, then that figure gets reduced even further.
      
      So, yes, it is a risk, but probably not as dramatic as your initial analysis suggests.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:08am
      - Durden
        
        I agree.
        
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        August 4, 2020 2:29pm
      - Durden
        
        I agree it is possible. But read the part in the linked article which says assume people in a particular colony are being tested, and 20% of them actually have the disease.
        
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        August 4, 2020 2:37pm
RW Capitalist

I see the AM Show was discussing the tenancy act and how it has (already) driven landlords out of the market. BUT no mention of:
Section 55A would allow two weeks of unpaid rent every 90 days. This breaches every tenancy agreement which requires rent to be paid as agreed.
Section 36 would permit two separate instances of anti-social behaviour every 90 days. This also breaches every tenancy agreement which forbids anti-social behaviour.
Section 32, which would end contractual terminations by owners, means that the only ways for owners to end tenancies are to renovate, move into, or sell the property.
From yesterdays blog.
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August 4, 2020 9:18am
- fernglas
  
  That blog was wrong. Try reading the Bill for yourself, particularly the proposed amendments to s50 (not s55A)
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:48am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    http://legislation.govt.nz/bill/government/2020/0218/latest/LMS294929.html
    Under 55a
    3 However, the Tribunal must not make the order if satisfied that—
    (a)doing so would be unfair because of the circumstances in which the behaviour occurred or the notices were given; or
    
    4 In deciding whether to make an order under subsection (2), the Tribunal must not take into account the impact that terminating the tenancy would have on the tenant.
    
    Contradictory much?
    
    6 In this section, anti-social behaviour means—
    (a)harassment; or
    (b)any other act or omission (whether intentional or not), if the act or omission reasonably causes alarm, distress, or nuisance that is more than minor.
    No mention of criminal behaviour?
    section 36
    (aa)the tenancy is a periodic tenancy and—
    (i)on 3 separate occasions within a 90-day period the rent has been at least 5 working days in arrear; and
    (ii)on each occasion the landlord gave the tenant written notice advising the tenant of the arrear, the dates for which rent was overdue, the amount or amounts of overdue rent, and the tenant’s right to make an application to the Tribunal challenging the notice (see sections 77(1) and 78(1)(a) regarding the Tribunal); and
    (iii)each notice stated how many other notices (if any) the landlord had given the tenant under this paragraph in relation to the same tenancy and 90-day period; and
    (iv)the landlord’s application to the Tribunal was made within 28 days after the landlord gave the third notice;
    So the landlord has no come back if every 90 days the tenant does not pay the rent for 2 weeks, so long as those weeks don’t overlap the next 90 days.
    
    Did you think I wouldn’t or haven’t read it???
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:13am
    - fernglas
      
      I just assumed that if you had, you would have seen that s55A was about anti-social behaviour, not rent arrears.
      
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      August 4, 2020 12:54pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Another way is to call a bulldozer and void the tenancy.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:48pm
Boxing junkie

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12353392
Have a read. This is not an accusation, all I’m saying is a little introspection never hurt anyone. There is no reason why National supporters should behave like this.

[Mod. note: Some Kiwiblog posters need to reflect on this too – intelligent debate is missing in many of the comments we delete, and, in spite of what is suggested by others here, we would prefer not to delete any comments.]
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August 4, 2020 9:18am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Meh. Have you ever looked at the standard?
  
  Funny how National has to disown anyone on their team because it must take responsibility for them, but Labour never has to take responsibility for its storm-troopers rioting, vandalising, or threatening their political opponents (remember kill John Key and rape his daughter – that catchy track was sung at the Arias).
  
  I think we should all celebrate that page, and spread the funniest memes, because obviously they are hitting a nerve.
  
  Alinsky Rule 5 and Rule 6.
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:38am
  - Boxing junkie
    
    Don’t get bitter, get better.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:43am
  - Boxing junkie
    
    But also to your point, if you see examples of racism on the Standard call them out on it. There’s no reason left wing bloggers should get away with it either.
    
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    August 4, 2020 9:54am
    - Blackface Twin Reverb
      
      Ha HA lol.
      that’d be just asking for iPrent (or whatever his handle is) to swing his Ban-Hammer.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:57am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Funny how I have been around (in a minor way) the National party for 40 yrs and have NEVER seen this.
  I have seen some anti National vitriol on “The Standard” though.and
  From a party that paid
  Private detectives to go through Bill English’s rubbish.
  Sent people to Australia to dig dirt on John Key
  Meddled in Australian politics to support the Aussie Labor party
  Sent people to spy on a National party PRIVATE function.
  etc etc
  Are you sure it was a genuine National supporter, or someone pretending to be?
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:46am
  - RJ
    
    Are you seriously saying you have never seen national and act supporters posting “extremely racist and highly offensive comments by members in relation to Māori, immigrants and an opposition MP”. Shit, I’ve seen it on whaleoil, ysb, and here before it was moderated. There are fruitcakes on the left and the right and they are just as nasty as each other
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:28am
    - MT_Tinman
      
      Shit, I’ve seen it on whaleoil, ysb,
      
      From NZF and CCCP supporters then?
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:50am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Examples???
      I have been on both the sights you mention, over the past dozen years and not seen what you claim.
      I have seen people question norms on racism and sexism,but not actually be these things.
      
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      August 4, 2020 10:54am
      - RJ
        
        Well examples would get me moderated and with one post ysb had up is an instant ban. That place is just like slatter was, spreading bullshit that never had any truth to it. But let’s see there was the often racism on whale oil, anti Muslim, anti Maori, beneficiary bashing, spreading bullshit lies about MPs that slatter would claim was going to come out and never did. You’d have to be blind to not see it and stupid to think that the way people see the left as acting isn’t also happening on the right, it does, and it is just as bad. It happens on both side of the fence I’m sure if the mods could show you the stuff they delete you’d realise how bad it can get. Hell I’ve hit report a few times here on shit that the mods have missed.
        
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        August 4, 2020 1:23pm
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Please define “extremely racist and highly offensive comments by members in relation to Māori, immigrants and an opposition MP”
      
      If we are discussing a term such as ‘offensive’ then we had better first determine what the term refers to, so that we may categorise comments on that basis. I don’t think that “I believe that x is offensive” is a very robust criterion.
      
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      August 4, 2020 12:55pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  It doesn’t actually say what the “racism” was though? Don Brash is called racist for saying that Maori shouldn’t get special treatment. The same can be said for sexist statements – denying the gender pay gap etc.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:25am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  “Offence” is utterly subjective, and is not a reason to ban comments. People are free to take offence, because we live in a relatively free-society. Only cases of direct incitement to violence or other crimes, doxxing people, and defamatory comments should be off the table, imo. “Racism” is just a BS word that is used as a get out of jail free card for people who hold indefensible positions.
  
  How are we ever to identify the pertinent issues, and then debate solutions to those, when some vested interests are too precious to have them raised?
  
  I don’t really care if discussing certain topics makes certain people uncomfortable. The usual groups always complain when their objectively observable behaviour is called out. This really says it all , and suggests that the “offending” comments are likely on the mark, does it not?
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:56am
- Tall Man
  
  I’m staying out of this one except to say that having a comment deleted is frustrating and I would prefer that the comment be left with the word or phrase removed. It would give us a chance to see what exactly was offensive in my comment as I for one believe that many of my delted comments did not breach any rule, just annoyed a particular mod.
  
  If they were truly rule breaches leaving them up with words or phrases deleted would remove all doubt wouldn’t it.
  
  I also remarked yesterday that in the comments rules David indicated that from time to time they would/may put up some of the deleted comments to show what the issue was. So far I have not seen this.
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:09pm
Komata

Maggie P@0812

Unless, of course, the ‘Murderer’ did actually consider the deceased to be a ‘nobody’; it’s apparently not unusual to have that viewpoint in such situations and can rationalise the deed in the mind of the perpetrator…
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August 4, 2020 9:25am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Fair enuff Komata – I hear ya.
  But surely any educated person would have said, ‘a’
  nobody.
  Just saying
  
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  August 4, 2020 9:42am
Happychappy

This is the type of Jounalism we need and want in the lead up to the General Election in September. Stewart Forsythe gives both the Leaders of Labour and National a fair assessment in comparing the strengths and ability.
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/jacinda-ardern-judith-collins-and-the-looming-glass-cliff
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August 4, 2020 9:33am
- Durden
  
  Yes. One of the more reasonable ones. But.
  
  “Ardern might not have developed the Covid-19 communications strategy but she combined clarity (“stay home and save lives”) with empathy (connecting with people in terms of the hardship they faced in taking on these changes)”
  
  Empathy or empty words ? Cheap.
  
  On potential foreign influence on election — “Ardern would be more likely to go for a review by an independent authority”
  
  So kick the can down the road to until after election? Or effectively do nothing like her myriad other failed working groups and their ignored recommendations.
  
  He conveniently forgets that the bribed media party is joined at the hip with Jacinda+Labour and it is a huge advantage in driving public narrative and Collins towards the glass cliff.
  
  Two examples he quotes, “visit…to a Chinese company where her husband was a director, and her purported undermining of the boss of the Serious Fraud Office” continually pumped by the lefty media were proven wrong and she was absolved by enquiries/investigations.
  
  I would take straight talking, past experience and effectiveness and use of past proven strategies to stimulate growth and reduce debt associated with Collins any day compared to an overload of head nodding, empty words and promises and the faux empathy of Jacinda.
  
  And more importantly, I would not trust the captain’s calls of Jacinda (Oil and Gas ban) and her strutting the world stage for personal international profile (e.g. search JAcinda’s speech i forum chaired by Melinda Gates) where she talks about already having committed NZ to the UN Agenda 30’s sustainable goals without any discussion of what that means openly with NZ public.
  
  Jacinda is a fake, smiling, two-faced manipulator.
  
  Labour is a party of working groups and lots of announcements associated with throwing money around only, with clearly proven failures in delivering most of their big promises.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:31am
MT_Tinman

Partemuremu Prison are claiming it costs ~$150,000 per month for them to house the mad Ocker.

Given the outfit was built as a maximum security prison this cost suggests someone up there is on the wrong side of the bars.
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August 4, 2020 9:34am
Durden

I abhor Tarrant, his ideology and his actions. But equally, I abhor the ignorance and hypocrisy of Feroze Ditta.

Today in NZ Herald about Tarrant — “He’s still going on his rants and his twisted ideology of racism”

And the very twisted logic here — “mosque attack victim Feroze Ditta did not believe Tarrant should be afforded the rights to segregation for his own safety. “Who are we protecting here? It’s somebody who slaughtered 51 people. He came to do much more damage and 41 – the rest – were lucky to survive. It’s talking about his rights to segregation and as a result it’s a cost to the Government.”

So Ditta is supporting summary prison justice? Not good signs of assimilating NZ values, systems and culture, just promoting customs from back home.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12353361

And if Tarrant is still ranting, why are we bringing people from around the world for his upcoming sentencing ? To give him an audience ? Or are we going to see him in “Silence of the Lambs” style mask and chains ?

Will we put him in stocks outside the court and let the big group of visitors and survivors seek justice by stoning him ?
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August 4, 2020 9:40am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Tarrant’s victims are being afforded the same rights and opportunities as any other victim of violent crime in New Zealand. No more, and no less. How else would you have it?
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:28am
  - Tall Man
    
    Not quite Albert. I didn’t see many Romanians in court last week at the sentencing of brian mcconchie…… Did you?
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:35am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      I’m not aware of the case and have found no reference to it in a Google search so can’t comment. Perhaps you could provide a link to further information?
      
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      August 4, 2020 12:56pm
      - Tall Man
        
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/122303839/killer-gets-life-sentence-for-street-murder-that-shocked-bystanders
        
        “Scantee was planning to move back to her home country of Romania and talked to McConachie about her plans.”
        
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        August 4, 2020 1:51pm
    - Jack5
      
      For those who have been loud about American treatment of terrorists at Guantanamo Bay, and about our soldiers handing over Taliban to the Afghan Government forces.
      
      Reflect whether the following conditions apply in Tarrant’s confinement.
      
      The conditions are from the United Nations Standard Minimum Rules for the Treatment of Prisoners (the Nelson Mandela Rules), adopted in 2015:
      
      Rule 43
      
      1. In no circumstances may restrictions or disciplinary sanctions amount to torture or other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment. The following practices, in particular, shall be prohibited:
      
      (a) Indefinite solitary confinement;
      
      (b) Prolonged solitary confinement;
      
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      August 4, 2020 1:37pm
  - Durden
    
    A_R What I am saying is Tarrant’s victims (or one anyway who claims to speak on behalf of the Muslim Council) want special additional rights by treating Tarrant differently in prison and subjecting him to premature incident.
    
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    August 4, 2020 2:40pm
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  I don’t think Tarrant needs to “rant” (i.e. say something that people don’t want him to say about Muslims and third world immigrants in general, just in case it resonates with the wider public) when this guy above is really saying it all for him.
  
  In a supposedly open society, you’d think we would want to find out exactly why someone shot 91 people. Instead, it seems the preference is to ban both his written reasons and prevent him speaking from about it, substituting the primary source for a prepackaged simplistic set of motivations, centered around the amorphous concepts of “hate” and “evil.”
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:43am
  - Tall Man
    
    Saw it way back when.
    
    Truthfully, even he is confused.
    
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    August 4, 2020 11:36am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Well, I’d like to judge that myself, and I think that all New Zealanders also have a right to do so. I saw the video on the day of the shootings, before it was classified, and I think there is a case for banning that: it was very graphic of course, and you can get the idea without it. But when a guy puts his thoughts on paper, it surely gives us some understanding.
      
      Criticism of mass immigration is only incidentally criticism of Muslims, for instance. It is, however, primarily criticism of State policy. That is why the notion “hate speech” is so pernicious. In principle it is like banning debate on any other policy, which is anathema to democratic principles. What next, effectively banning criticism of the covid-19 response policy? Oh, wait…
      
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      August 4, 2020 12:42pm
RJ

Awww patreon looks like it might have problems for cancelling people it didn’t like. I was listening to one person last night asking his 800 patreon members to all file a complaint so they can financially screw over pateron.

Court sides with fans of controversial content creator, potentially exposing company to further legal trouble

A California court sided with the fans of Owen Benjamin, a controversial right-wing comedian, Friday after Patreon — a US fan-funding service — sought an injunction against their arbitration suits against it.

Owen Benjamin, a comedian and an actor who is reportedly no stranger to anti-Semitic outbursts, as per the Jewish Telegraphic Agency, was removed from Patreon in late 2019 over alleged hate speech.

Article
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August 4, 2020 9:41am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Been following this for the last couple of months. Funny as a funny thing. Patreon is going down, and their legal bullshit and squirming has annoyed a lot of creatives.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:36pm
PaulDunmore

Ministry for the Environment has just released a big report on risks of climate change for NZ, as a step towards a national adaptation strategy.
There will be a lot to digest, but at a first glance there is no mention of the greatest and potentially most damaging risk: bad Government policy responses which make matters far worse. So far, that is the category of climate-related risks for which we have the most actual experience.
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August 4, 2020 9:43am
Inandout

Banks had Simeon Brown, National Corrections spokesman and you would swear Brown was a Labour person. If this is the best that Judith throws up I am definitely voting ACT.
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August 4, 2020 9:59am
- rangitoto
  
  Banks called him a womble lol.
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:19am
  - rockape
    
    Well if we want a law that says Kiwis serve their sentences in NZ and Aussies do the same in Australia then e have made a huge rod for ou on backs. Just think of all those Kii gang members in Aus e would be paying for. If you think the few we get post sentence is a problem then think again.
    
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    August 4, 2020 10:37am
RW Capitalist

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/08/revealed-the-dental-funding-proposals-the-government-wanted-to-keep-secret.html
yet another example of CoL LAZINESS.
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August 4, 2020 10:51am
- Tall Man
  
  Bet it was the flouridation recommendation that caused it to be put to bed.
  
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  August 4, 2020 11:27am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trader Joes, showing how to deal with pussies.
https://babylonbee.com/news/trader-joes-makes-baffling-business-decision-to-ignore-angry-people-on-the-internet-who-dont-even-shop-there/?utm_content=buffer4ed12&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer&fbclid=IwAR3OWQ_T_FpT3VOICNpbCBfwX34L5hu7IgvYRmFzEK3gbDGqJo77z-DIN18
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August 4, 2020 11:05am
- Inandout
  
  Steve, don’t go woke, don’t go broke. Other US companies are catching on, or in the case of mad Seattle, are moving out.
  
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  August 4, 2020 11:40am
Liberty

The Auckland paper ran a hatchet job on Peters. I don’t have a problem with that.
As it is basically all true.
What I do have a problem with is the claims are nothing new. Peters has been
Full of shit since the wine box. The media have been his lap dogs ever since.
Until now.
Now the Old Dog is politically stuffed. The lap dogs have grown a spine and
Are now sticking the knife in.
Maybe the 50m media slush fund is more enticing than a whisky at the Green parrot.
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August 4, 2020 11:05am
- hullkiwi
  
  Correction Liberty, Peters was full of it before Winebox. The only thing was he was meant to be part of the National team from 1978 to 1993. Unfortunately, he never was a team player as he was and always has been Winstone First & foremost!
  
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  August 4, 2020 6:52pm
WaynelSexton

T.B and malaria deaths double but at least we saved Grandma.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/03/health/coronavirus-tuberculosis-aids-malaria.html#click=https://t.co/6zRkcIvv1F
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August 4, 2020 11:20am
- WaynelSexton
  
  10,000 children dying from hunger a month because of unnecessary lockdowns. https://apnews.com/5cbee9693c52728a3808f4e7b4965cbd
  
  12 1
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  August 4, 2020 11:55am
  - fernglas
    
    And the people responsible for the shutdowns, and therefore those deaths, tell us that Black Lives Matter.
    
    10 1
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    August 4, 2020 12:39pm
  - kowtow
    
    As it stands , prior to Wuflu it was estimated that 4 million people died every year from lower respiratory tract infection ……..
    
    But as they are/were brown or black and it doesn’t happen in the OECD ……..yawn.
    
    Yet our Media Party says BLM.
    
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    August 4, 2020 12:49pm
Benedict Yu

https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/122327667/does-christchurch-have-too-many-car-parks-the-council-says-probably#comments

Christchurch has lots of parking. Because there are vacant sites that are now parking lots. Because that is the ‘highest use’ of the land. Over time, if there is a higher use than parking, the market will direct the land to a higher use (housing, recreation, whatever).

At least that is what should happen if the Council did not interfere. The Acting Mayor thinks that too much parking is encouraging people to use cars which is bad because Climate Change. So if he fences off the parking, people will catch buses.

I wish Councils across the country would just Foxtrot Oscar.
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August 4, 2020 11:39am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  hahahaha! Yes of course they will catch buses, or alternatively they might go and shop somewhere which is friendly to cars and has parking?
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:40pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    It is like the Greens. Step 1 – say EVs are great. Step 2. Subsidise EVs. Step 3. Ban petroleum powered cars.
    
    A couple of years back this person said to me “I can’t understand why most people don’t buy electric vehicles.” I explained that we do not need to understand. Price, personal preferences and needs, and affordability will determine what kind of cars folk buy. Those preferences and personal budgets are all different and that is why there are so many different types of cars. Just let the market decide and STFU.
    
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    August 4, 2020 6:02pm
Inandout

Liberty, the Media Party are fully funded by Labour so expect more Peters hate. I suspect as a last ditch action Winston will expose what has gone on behind closed government doors.
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August 4, 2020 11:43am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Yeah, but who’s going to publish it…?
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:11pm
  - Inandout
    
    Suze, most people thankfully don’t tune into our MSM, so the blogs take over.
    
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    August 4, 2020 3:05pm
- Liberty
  
  It is becoming apparent there is a lot of resentment between labour/Green and Peters. The big question is will the coalition hold it together until the election. Or will the coalition implode.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:41pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    When we grok that the judiciary are appointed for life by the people who because their appointments will never go against their deep state goals, then we know that many (there are honourable exceptions) judges are as corrupt as many and worse than most because they appear to be independent.
    
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    August 4, 2020 5:14pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Please sir, rather than an implosion, can we have an explosion? Asking for a friend.
    
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    August 4, 2020 5:14pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    It doesn’t matter – Parliament is finished.
    
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    August 4, 2020 6:23pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  What, threaten to expose his own corruption and venality if they don’t stop bagging him?
  
  hahahahahaha!
  
  A certain scene from Blazing Saddles springs to mind.
  
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  August 5, 2020 9:57am
BeaB

If there is any doubt about Jacinta’s brilliance the announcement there will be no new policy for the election confirms her genius.
What is her major problem?
Delivery.
How to solve this?
Have no policy to deliver
26 1
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August 4, 2020 12:04pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  What can they do?
  
  If they announce end child poverty or more houses it is not credible.
  
  I would bet on more benefit increases. Or free childcare or 2 years paid parental leave. Stuff like that which simply requires a money tap to “deliver”. There is no way they will announce anything difficult.
  
  Seriously this is just like Argentina all over again.
  
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  August 4, 2020 6:39pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    When does Saint Cindy burst into song?
    
    “Don’t Cry for meeeeee aooooooteaaaaarooooooaaaa!”
    
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    August 5, 2020 9:58am
Maggy Wassilieff

Jacinda Ardern is in hiding..

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/08/judith-collins-accuses-jacinda-ardern-of-arrogance-hiding-behind-covid-19-recovery.html
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August 4, 2020 12:23pm
- wimpston peeeders
  
  go judith!! go hunt her out and take the fight to cindy if she wants to be a coward.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:06pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Heh, and to think that just last week RNZ were saying that Cindy couldn’t rely on COVID and that she’d actually have to announce some ‘policy’ for her next govt.
  
  No doubt the journalists have now been instructed to pull their heads in re any thoughts about asking Cindy for any policy…
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:20pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggy, I can imagine Jacinda saying to the rest of the coalition ‘look guys, you chose me to get you across the line, not debate with Judith; you know I suffer from anxiety’.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:17pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  What is there for the PM to do now on COVID? We are all safe in our bubble. She must have stacks of free time.
  
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  August 4, 2020 6:40pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh dear..

Our CoL doesn’t know how to quarantine folks with obvious mental health problems.

He described the lack of any mental health assessment and additional care for those suffering from such issues in managed isolation as “a major failing”.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/422702/woman-given-suspended-sentence-for-escaping-covid-19-isolation

This was the woman that had gone missing in Queensland only a few weeks before flying to NZ.

https://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/news/police-plea-to-help-find-missing-nambour-woman/3996334/
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August 4, 2020 12:32pm
- kowtow
  
  Our Media Party know full well to exploit her condition to the max . They knew she wasn’t well and yet made massive “copy” out of her.
  
  And they have the temerity to run # campaigns , and advisories at the bottom of many of their stories about where to seek help etc.
  
  Feral hypocrites.
  
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  August 4, 2020 12:40pm
wimpston peeeders

well my mate is in govt quarantine, hes having a great time he rang last night off his chops.
drugs are easier to get in there then on the streets and a great selection just a tad more expensive.
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August 4, 2020 1:01pm
mandk

Comrade Hipkins still urging people to use the contract tracing app.

Just admit it, Comrade, the app was, is, and will continue to be, a useless failure.

Another example of the CoL’s failure to deliver.
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August 4, 2020 1:08pm
- hullkiwi
  
  Be warned Level 2 is on it’s way….
  
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  August 4, 2020 6:56pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  Total bullshit waste of money. Nobody is using it. My phone through Google Timeline records everwhere I go. I use it because that information is often useful to me. Like I visited a Panel Beater 2 years ago but I can’t recall his name, and I need more work done. Google Timeline will tell me. Sure they get some personal info, but I live with it. Others can choose not to.
  
  But there is no way I am using a New Zealand Government tracing app. It is a bit like when Julie Ann Genter opens her mouth. Always makes me feel like buying a V8 SUV.
  
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  August 4, 2020 7:20pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4K2kI2KoSk
Wall of Moms v BLM.

The ever lovin, ever lyin left are eating their own
As per usual. The demontrations have fizzled in Portland
Thanks to arrests by the Feds. The ‘moms’ formed a human shield
between the BLM, and the police. They were untouchable
two weeks ago. Not any more. They have been accused of
failing to protect black women in the ‘protest’. Don’t
Shoot Portland highlighted the ‘Wall of Moms’
Leadership being all white.
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August 4, 2020 1:36pm
- RJ
  
  I must admit the left are entertaining, now they are going after their prized god Ellen and wanting her cancelled.
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:57pm
  - Inandout
    
    RJ, Ellen comes across as all sweetness and light in public, but apparently is a right bitch behind the scenes. And what with the groping going on?
    
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    August 4, 2020 4:21pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      and remember her catch cry…..
      Be Kind
      
      https://bekindbyellen.com/
      
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      August 4, 2020 5:26pm
    - RJ
      
      But but but she cares, *tilts head* my show will now be about fighting injustice.
      
      Hmmm, Ellen sounds familiar…..
      
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      August 4, 2020 7:20pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEgv_m_6s-Q
More Debt Trap Diplomacy.

Things look bad for a post pandemic China. So they want to
Keep up their influence in the ‘stans’. The BRI runs through there.
They’re building a dry port in Kazakhstan. Tadjikistan is dependant
On Beijing for gas exports. Debt write offs can be done, in exchange for ceding
disputed territories. The US has little interest. Putin is more interested.
He’s broke though. A small amount has come in from the EU. So
the presitator wants the BOR stuff to restart ASAP. Anti Chinese
sentiment in Kazakhstan, and Kyrgyzstan due to the CCPs
treatment of Uyghurs.
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August 4, 2020 1:36pm
RW Capitalist

I hear on the radio
Shane Jones claiming success, for the provincial growth fund.
13 000 jobs created…(my first thought….bull)
He spend $3 billion.
approx…$230 800 per job
Can’t help thinking, I could have done better with:
1 Less money
2. more jobs created
Would have been better spent if he imported 13000 doctors from abroad.
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August 4, 2020 1:43pm
- RJ
  
  Well the good news is question 10, let’s see if his radio answer matches what he says in the house
  
  Hon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE to the Minister for Regional Economic Development: Does he stand by his statement that the Provincial Growth Fund will “create sustainable jobs in the regions”, and how many new permanent roles have been created that did not exist prior to Provincial Growth Fund funding being allocated to those projects?
  
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  August 4, 2020 1:56pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Looked at the answer
    He included
    temp jobs
    contractor jobs
    short term “infrastructure” jobs (thought they missed a trick here, I would have asked…how many people worked on more than one project and were therefore counted twice?)
    
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    August 4, 2020 5:10pm
- mandk
  
  The media reporting of the report on which Jones bases his claims doesn’t tell us whether the jobs are:
  a) actual or expected
  b) full time/part time, temporary or permanent
  c) associated with projects that would have gone ahead anyway
  d) associated with projects that simply displace other employment generating activity.
  
  Taking all these factors into account, I would expect the real number to be much closer to zero than to 13,000.
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:35pm
  - hullkiwi
    
    If you want a good laugh, catch the RNZ Checkpoint interview at 18.10 between Lisa Owen and Jones about the Auditor General’s Report into the Provincial Slush Fund. Jones had no real answers and blamed either MBIE staff for not having processes in place; the projects not being started; they are on-going projects & can’t be measured; they were projects in the CoL Agreement & not his fault.
    
    In other words, none of it is his fault…..
    
    So, where is our money?!
    
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    August 4, 2020 7:08pm
Maggie Pie

Just gotten back home. Went out earlier to see if i could get any of that ‘Kentucky Seasoned Flour’ that MW had recommended to the group for battering chicken.
Went to every Japanese, Indian, and Asian shop I could find on Google maps – none had even heard of it unfortunately.
But what i did find in the Indian Superette out Panmure way, was this amazingly strong brand of Fly Spray, called ‘Green Leaf’. Talk about potent!
When I read the label, (in Hindi but loosely translated to EN), it advised, “….put all animals and children outside before spray”
At 7 bucks a can it ain’t cheap. But boy, is it effective! Smells really sort of chemical, and leaves an oily residue on the window, but the Fly that managed to get across here from Mt Roskill didn’t stand a chance.
Will be heading back there tomorrow to buy a doz for summer.
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August 4, 2020 1:53pm
- Tall Man
  
  Next time let your fingers do the walking and call them up.
  
  Regarding the flyspray, get that list of ingredients translated, DDT derivatives still feature in some Asian sprays and the toxicity is remarkable and the surface residue will robably kill anything that licks it of their hands feet or paws.
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:12pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Whoa – thanks soo much for that TM 😀
    When i go up to the dairy next i’ll show it to Raj and see what he reckons about it.
    
    Hey, have you ever tried phoning one of those places to ask them something? I often find MYSELF apolgoising for speaking English…. LOL!!
    
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    August 4, 2020 2:56pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Geez Maggie Pie…
  If I can find the stuff in Gizzy, it must be lurking somewhere in Tāmaki-makaura.
  
  Here it is…
  https://www.asiangrocer.co.nz/product/580-kentucky-fried-chicken-flour-200g
  
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  August 4, 2020 3:08pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Look thanks Maggs!
    No wonder i couldn’t find it – online only 😀
    
    Actually, I did discover a Moshim’s store and he offered to get it in. The Indian guy asked for my phone number and said he’d call me once it arrived. The greasy creep must have thort I was born yesterday…..gave him the number of the Newmarket police station which i know off by heart. Bet he gets a fright when he rings. LOL!!!
    
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    August 4, 2020 3:44pm
- kowtow
  
  Manufactured by Union Carbide ?
  
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  August 4, 2020 3:22pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggy, I was tired of the well advertised and useless fly sprays sold in supermarkets so I decided to try a farm supply outlet. They tend to carry more powerful farm type (and well tested) insect killers. One I found OK is ‘Slay’ at about $12, and knocks cockroaches also.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:28pm
RJ

Question 12 should be the quickest answer in history, and also one Jacinda won’t have to think about, oh wait, she will make shit up

DAVID SEYMOUR to the Prime Minister: What are some of her Government’s policy achievements?
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August 4, 2020 1:54pm
graham

Two people, Malcolm Moncrief-Spittle and David Cumin, have returned to court to argue that Regional Facilities Auckland (RFA) acted unlawfully when they reneged on a deal to hire the Bruce Mason Centre to host Stefan Molyneux and Lauren Southern.

The High Court rejected a review of RFA’s decision, so Moncrief-Spittle and Cumin have gone to the Court of Appeal.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300073301/lauren-southern-and-stefan-molyneux-thugs-veto-canned-visit-court-told

Sad to say, I suspect that Moncrief-Spittle and Cumin are wasting their time. Of interest in particular are the following two comments:

The Court of Appeal president Justice Stephen Kós has said that another venue was found for Southern and Molynex – essentially implying that therefore it’s no big deal that RFA reneged on their deal. “Auckland’s awash with these. And they found an alternative.”

Of course, as we know, they were subsequently cancelled from the Powerstation also.

And tellingly, Justice Mark Cooper has objected to the term “thugs’ veto”, saying it is “loaded” and probably best avoided. “What’s wrong with a protesters’ veto?”

I wonder if the irony of presiding over a case which is essentially about the freedom of expression, and not allowing a lawyer to use a specific term “because it’s loaded”, has occurred to Justice Mark Cooper?

And as Auckland Live cited “health and safety grounds” when they cancelled Southern and Molyneux from using Auckland Council-owned venues – IE they basically had threats which were of a sufficient level to mean they ‘claim’ that SAFETY was a concern, which is nothing if not code for ‘threats of violence’ – what’s wrong for calling this exactly what it quite obviously was? An effective veto due to the actions and threats of a bunch of people whom the term ‘thugs‘ would seem to be rather accurate?
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August 4, 2020 2:00pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  When we grok that the judiciary are appointed for life by the people who because their appointments will never go against their deep state goals, then we know that many (there are honourable exceptions) judges are as corrupt as many and worse than most because they appear to be independent.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:22pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  Begone you down-tickers, begone. Descend onto the nethermost regions of Marianna trench level scum, because that’s what you are. I know you cannot stand that graham is right, but that defines you not him. So sod off into the darkness and wail and Nash* your remnant teeth. (*Gratuitous political reference).
  
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  August 4, 2020 7:21pm
Durden

Is this comment in Stuff’s begging bowl on every page they serve up still true ?

“We uncover hidden truths – from the Defence Force’s activities in Afghanistan “.

I thought the recent findings report put paid to that as dressed up tosh from Hagar and Stephenson.
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August 4, 2020 2:48pm
- igm
  
  The sooner Stuff, along with their so-called journos, are consigned to the gutter, the better for all NZ.
  
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  August 4, 2020 2:53pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    The gutter is too high. Could we try for down with the Balrog? Thank you.
    
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    August 4, 2020 4:20pm
Jack5

Independent tertiary trainers – the international colleges in NZ – suggest they will fight any Government plans to cut their life line.

This lifeline is their, in effect, selling citizenship entry to New Zealand.

Here’s part of an interview at RNZ with Paul Chalmers, of Independent Tertiary Education New Zealand:

ITENZ would oppose the government if it wanted to reduce enrolments in one-year programmes that led to employment and residency.

“They may hold those views and I think we have to challenge them on those views,” he said.

Chalmers said reducing students’ work rights would harm enrolments, but not as much as it would have before the pandemic.

The citizenship-for-study rort has been a prime cause of New Zealand jumping to probably the fastest population growth among developing countries, super-growth that is sending down our international wealth as measured by GDP per capita.

Perhaps citizenship-for-study can become an election issue. It definitely will be an issue when unemployment soars.

Ignoring citizenship-for-study, the Government seems to be on the right track in international education.

You’ll find the independent tertiary sector’s views in this report:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/422694/nz-international-student-sector-more-focus-on-quality-education-than-work-rights-cabinet-papers
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August 4, 2020 3:03pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  This government hasn’t been on the right track in all it’s brief history. We all understand that whores gotta whore, but we’uns who are not the johns of the international educational sector, don’t want to pay.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:20pm
  - Jack5
    
    Not sure about that, Engelbert.
    
    We had a good education system before the beginning of sale of citizenship to entice foreign students.
    
    Some great names came out of it: Ernest Rutherford, Harold Gillies, Archie McIndoe, Alan MacDiarmid, Bill Pickering, Bill Phillips … to name a few.
    
    Selling citizenship by “educationists” is a rort that sells out the country.
    
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    August 4, 2020 5:11pm
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Jack5: My apologies, I misunderstood. I was certainly not referring to the well-previous system of properly educating everybody who came regardless of their diverse characteristics or what they were paying; that was good for everybody. I completely agree with you that the sale of citizenship is prostitution without the happy ending.
      
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      August 4, 2020 7:19pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Richie Hardcore features in a spat being played out in the Waitakere District Court

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/122339042/pebbles-hooper-in-court-after-social-media-posts-about-simone-anderson
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August 4, 2020 3:17pm
- Inandout
  
  I normally stand on ‘pebbles’.
  
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  August 4, 2020 4:30pm
Engelbert Humperdink

Maggiy W: Like Kissinger said of Iran and Iraq, I hope they both lose.
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August 4, 2020 4:18pm
Batman

Like any car crash, you can’t look away

https://twitter.com/axios/status/1290497186489348096?s=19

https://www.axios.com/full-axios-hbo-interview-donald-trump-cd5a67e1-6ba1-46c8-bb3d-8717ab9f3cc5.html?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=organic&utm_content=1100
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August 4, 2020 4:47pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  More tests = more cases. Jacinda knows this. But she eliminaded Covid in NZ – so the World says.
  In reality The COL wants a second wave, because they are losing power.
  Socialists never relinquish control without a fight.
  History
  
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  August 4, 2020 5:16pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    I believe the significance of the COL-government making it illegal to import covid 19 tests, has been lost in the general static.
    
    The fact that they don’t want us to know whether we have been exposed or not very directly signals that they want to retain control of the epidemiological information, and therefore control of the decision algorithms, at all costs.
    
    They are in fact, bastard-coated bastards with a bastard filling and bastard sprinkles.
    
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    August 4, 2020 7:15pm
- wimpston peeeders
  
  well at least trump probably knows what building hes in.
  biden dosent and is far less coherant then that.
  
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  August 4, 2020 7:02pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  Yeah yeah. You’ve made your mind up, and so have other people. The thing is, Based on your postings so far, you only have 10% of the average cerebral cortex to pontificate with. Not because I disagree with your conclusions, but because you seem to inhabit a zone entirely free of facts relating to real-time consequences of liberal decisions.
  
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  August 4, 2020 7:17pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Wonder where Ross Ardern is right now? Perfect time to escort Daddy to Tokelau in 2 weeks
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August 4, 2020 5:09pm
JimBobJoe

Hilary Clinton’s legacy…Libya still in chaos and it’s getting worse as the age old Egyptian v Turkish enmity threatens to burst into flames.

HRC was unfit to be a high office holder in the Obama administration and is definitely not fit to have anything to do with US national politics ever again..

https://www.egypttoday.com/Article/1/90327/We-will-face-Turkish-presence-with-bullets-Libyan-army-commander
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August 4, 2020 5:27pm
Fletch

I thought Wendy Petrie had finished doing the 6pm news, and it was going down to one presenter. But there she is tonight, co-presenting with Simon Dallow. ?
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August 4, 2020 6:05pm
Lance

Bloody hell, on TV1 news they interviewed (unchallenged) some clown who stated that empirical science is RACIST!

The idiots are all coming out in this woke environment.
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August 4, 2020 6:25pm
- krazykiwi
  
  I was visiting my elderly parents this evening, and they had “the news” on. I never watch, so this was an eye opener. There must have been three magazine-style segments on Maori/Pacifica matters. Not current events/news. Just slot-fillers. The bit about science being racist because so few Maori/Pacifica people chose to become scientists was itself racist bollocks which, as you point out, went unchallenged by TV1
  
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  August 4, 2020 10:00pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Clare Curran takes aim at RNZ…

She suggested that the state-funded RNZ had “lost its way” and was no longer holding the rest of the news media to a higher standard.

Such a pity she didn’t demand a high standard from them when she was Minister of Broadcasting.
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August 4, 2020 7:52pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Surprise, surprise…

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/422757/provincial-growth-fund-should-be-more-transparent-auditor-general
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August 4, 2020 8:45pm

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