General Debate 31 October 2020

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krazykiwi

62 years ago C.S. Lewis, a man gifted with critical thinking skills that I aspire to have wrote this:

“Again, the new oligarchy must more and more base its claim to plan us on its claim to knowledge.

If we are to be mothered, mother must know best. This means they must increasingly rely on the advice of scientists, till in the end the politicians proper become merely the scientists’ puppets.

Technocracy is the form to which a planned society must tend. Now I dread specialists in power because they are specialists speaking outside their special subjects. Let scientists tell us about sciences.

But government involves questions about the good for man, and justice, and what things are worth having at what price; and on these a scientific training gives a man’s opinion no added value. Let the doctor tell me I shall die unless I do so-and-so; but whether life is worth having on those terms is no more a question for him than for any other man.”

He saw it all coming and gave us a prescient warning against technocracy. In respect of climate and Covid-19 we have seen junk science used first to bamboozle politicians, who then proceed to use it as a weapon against those they were elected to lead. I wish more people would wake up to this phenomenon.
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October 31, 2020 8:00am
- Jimbob
  
  Hear hear.
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:04am
- towaka
  
  Equally prescient KK was Lewis’s short story ” Screwtape proposes a toast”, where Screwtape has a cunning plan to turn the sin of envy into “fairness”.. so sums up the politics of envy of the modern world!
  
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  October 31, 2020 12:24pm
- crikey
  
  The key is ‘junk science’.
  
  All science does not need to be conjoined, but by the same token scientists should stop playing politics.
  
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  October 31, 2020 3:24pm
  - C J Southern
    
    And not just politics; When many don’t get funded, peer reviewed, or published unless/until they deliver adverse findings it really makes a sham of much of the “research”.
    
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    October 31, 2020 4:08pm
krazykiwi

An on-target piece from The Telegraph

In this terrifying new Covid dystopia, the unthinkable is already blurring into the banal. While women are banned from buying tampons in Tesco, and Scottish pubs are barred from selling alcohol, cancer becomes a disease of second-rate concern. The danger is that, as insanity morphs into normality, we will accept what is coming next with a shrug: the total re-engineering of normal life, in order to suppress “endemic” Covid over the long term.

Sir Patrick Vallance’s warning, that we will have to learn to live with Covid even if a vaccine materialises, was the biggest clue yet that the Government is mulling its long-term strategy should Covid prove ineradicable.

But the vice-grip of epidemiologists on policy, and No 10s own track record, hint at a statist solution, based on dependency and control. Seasonal circuit breakers, and semi-permanent shutdowns underpinned by an Orwellian test-and-trace regime and a bloated welfare state could soon become the norm.
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October 31, 2020 8:01am
- C J Southern
  
  Meh.
  
  From where I’m sitting our current problems are far more due to the stupidity of the population general (who alone hold the ability to eradicate Covid from the planet in less than a month if they’d all stop behaving like dickheads and start following easy to do infection control procedures) than they’re due to any government over-reach.
  
  I couldn’t give a shit if the government knows I went to the corner dairy and bought a mars bar before going into town and checking my PO box. And guess what – the government has better things to do than track 5 million people doing those things too.
  
  Sure, any government will take advantage of any situation handed to them on a plate but if people really want to meet those responsible for their current situation they need only look in the nearest mirror. Most are so busy entertaining irrational thoughts of paranoia that they’re oblivious to the big picture (and it’s associated consequences); they are by far their own worst enemies.
  
  By my reckoning many here (myself included) could do with far less time in this microcosm we call the internet and far more time out in the real world.
  
  I prescribe a few bush walks and more time in nature.
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:46am
  - Surely Knott
    
    Nonsense, the people do not have the ability to eradicate the virus in less than a month. It’s a widespread virus that exists all over the world. No country except for a few isolated islands in the southern hemisphere have managed to eradicate it with strict border isolation. It’s not realistic nor possible that a European country nor US state could eradicate the virus at this stage any more than they could eradicate colds or the flu with behaviour change. As evidenced by the states And countries that have had stricter lockdowns and mask wearing still have widespread virus. A vaccine maybe could eradicate. Otherwise we can only learn to live with and manage it.
    
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    October 31, 2020 4:23pm
    - C J Southern
      
      Nonsense to your nonsense!
      
      It continues to spread – and thus exist – because not enough people practice effective infection control. End of.
      
      If people would suck it up for a month by socially distancing – ventilating rooms – sanitising (hands and surfaces) – and stop congregating at parties – weddings – funerals – movie theatres – churches – pubs – restaurants and other non-essential places (etc) then there would be no transmission – and thus all those infected would recover (or die) within a couple of weeks and that would be the end of it.
      
      WILL that ever happen? Of course not. People are far too stupid to cooperate to that degree;
      
      – You have the religious nutters who believe “god will protect them”
      
      – You have the selfish generation who aren’t interested in giving up their partying and socialising.
      
      – You have the “flu”/”plandemic” idiots who persist in doing their own thing.
      
      – You have the “it’s my right” tossers.
      
      My point is that eradicating it quickly and relatively easily is well within our human capability – it’s just a testament to our global stupidity that people aren’t disciplined or intelligent enough to suck it up for a month to make it happen; they prefer long-term suffering – poor health outcomes for many – and widespread economic destruction for some stupid reason.
      
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      October 31, 2020 5:56pm
      - Surely Knott
        
        If this theory was correct. Then all human transmitted viruses would be eradicated by isolating the whole world simultaneously for a month.
        
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        October 31, 2020 6:56pm
      - tf78
        
        CJ – do you realize that the ”influenza” we have today originated from the Spanish Flu, that was over 100 years ago now. This one ain’t goin anywhere anytime soon. Get on with it and get over it!
        
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        October 31, 2020 7:53pm
Justitia

It is intolerable that a man who was a member of the British Labour Party who supported Jeremy Corbyn and refused to condemn his anti-Semitism when invited (by Kim Hill) to do should be our Human Rights Commissioner: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2020/10/30/time-boot-jeremy-corbyn-labour-party-good/

So long as Mr Hunt remains in that position the Human Rights Commission has no credibility whatsoever.
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October 31, 2020 8:05am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Apologies for being flippant, but your wise words can be distilled to just the last 8:
  
  “the Human Rights Commission has no credibility whatsoever.”
  
  It hasn’t had any credibility for several years, and adopts the same standard to investigating sexual abuse allegations as the Labour Party.
  
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  October 31, 2020 11:39am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    The very bigoted Marama Davidson worked for them. Tells you all you need to know about their culture. They are the opposite of what they claim to be.
    
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    October 31, 2020 12:54pm
- freemark
  
  HRC currently advertising a GM level position (with fat cat package no doubt). Part of the ad goes ” You will identify and lead opportunities for improvement of human rights.”
  Sounds like these guys go out fishing for trouble.
  Crazy State we are in…
  
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  October 31, 2020 7:02pm
KevO'Brien

A world without coal and carbon–life is a bit funny:
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/10/30/friday-funny-greta-thunbergs-perfect-petroleum-free-world/
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October 31, 2020 8:07am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Don’t the good citizens of aotearoa expect free electric cars for all in 10 years time…?
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:44am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I think we’ll all be up the awa in our waka without a hoe.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:08am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  I love the ads on the tv where all the eco fascists are saying ‘goodbye to oil’ in their Corolla with the plastic dash, plastic steering wheel, nylon wove seat, rubber tyres and the 22,863 components making up that car that are touched by oil in its manufacture including the battery it runs on and the insulation on the wire that they hold to plug their 1:1 Scalextric into the wall.
  
  Knobends.
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:57am
  - snowflake melter
    
    shared via their smartphones that are only possible by mining and fossil fuels.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:07am
  - Hard Cheese
    
    I think they’re expecting everything to be replaced with hemp and bamboo, we’ll be in cars looking like Fred Flintstone, pushing with our feet.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:10am
  - alloytoo
    
    to be powered Primarily by coal?
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:52am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Please do NOT interfere with our symbolic messaging!
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:53am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Using technology to wage war on the existence of same technology is also played out in the “Grandfather Paradox”.
    
    Where someone time travels to the past and kills their own grandfather before the conception of their father or mother, because they hate everything their “old white capitalist” parents stood for… And in the act of doing so prevents the time traveller’s existence.
    
    Same stupidity as children suing their parents for having brought them (children) into the world without their prior permission.
    
    https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/2/7/18215586/india-man-suing-parents-giving-birth-antinatalism-raphael-samuel
    
    https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2019/feb/05/consent-being-born-man-suing-parents-for-giving-birth-to-him
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:42am
  - JackRabbit
    
    All filmed on a TV camera derived from oil or processes made possible by oil. Including electric power and hydroelectric power that would never have been harnessed were it not for the products of coal and oil.
    
    The idiots in the adverts would be more accurate if they were clothed in the fur of a sea lion, and holding a wooden club. Because if coal and oil and all the byproducts created through the use of coal and oil were removed, this is what these idiots would be reduced to. But I forgot, killing seals is banned so they would be starkers.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:52am
- snowflake melter
  
  A world without carbon/coal would be great, the snowflakes wouldnt survive and brats like greta would never have been born.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:00am
  - Nickc2
    
    Without Schnapps, that brat wouldn’t have been conceived.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:20am
- JackRabbit
  
  It is funny, but also tragic in that Greta would not see it funny, as she has no sense of humour, having being brainwashed, first by education, and then by her parents who are also brainwashed.
  
  Greta is symptomatic of what is wrong with young self entitled people today who believe previous generations got things wrong.
  
  Previous generations didn’t always get things right, and there is a constant battle between good and evil – man’s inhumanity to man – and all that requires for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing.
  
  War is no longer only fought on the battlefield. It is a battle of ideas – for decades it has slowly crept into schools, and then our media. As years roll by and children become adults, the message becomes more intense with each new generation.
  
  Until finally we arrive at the point where the messages are firmly embedded in the minds of children and then adults, and these messages have taken control of their thinking processes like some alien parasite. Or perhaps more accurately like the Dr Who Cybermen, who while still human before becoming interned in metal bodies, received all their news and directives via airpods.
  
  It is not the airpods per se, it is the constant indoctrination of fabricated news that follows impressionable children and adults everywhere.
  
  Unlike books and reading, TV and broadcasts do not give the person time to evaluate, research or dissect the messages. They are just accepted at face value. Technology has increased the number of ways to learn, but has dumbed down the population.
  
  https://images4.fanpop.com/image/photos/14700000/Doctor-Who-Rise-of-the-Cybermen-david-tennant-14792011-768-448.jpg
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:37am
KevO'Brien

The government has discovered the power of public fear to let it get its way
Government by decree: Covid-19 and the Constitution
Lord Sumption
Cambridge Freshfields Annual Law Lecture
27 October 2020, 6pm

https://resources.law.cam.ac.uk/privatelaw/Freshfields_Lecture_2020_Government_by_Decree.pdf

HT Dellingpole, Breitbart
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October 31, 2020 8:12am
- krazykiwi
  
  Sumpton is a brilliant thinker, and an articulate speaker. I wish we had people of his caliber leading us in place of our freshly returned, slogan-totting imbecile
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:28am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    His speech outlines a very similar situation in NZ–different details but same principles.
    
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    October 31, 2020 8:41am
    - tf78
      
      “Labour” lack of principles is now a world wide phenomenon – it seems to be the Lefties doctrine. At this point, without a TRUMP WIN it’s unstoppable. I’m so pleased I’m old with no grand kids (yet anyway). It won’t be life as we knew it.
      
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      October 31, 2020 8:27pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Where are our constitutional lawyers? Have they been struck by COVID too?
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:23am
    - fernglas
      
      You find an argument for them to mount and they will come.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:24pm
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Bought wholesale to hypocrite retail.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:34pm
- IC5000
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Talking about fear have the Stalinist purges begin yet in the Peoples Republic of Aotearoa that your all grimly forecast or was that a load of twaddle that no one else KB posters believed?
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:13am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    The government has to build a few detention camps first…
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:31am
    - Harriet
      
      Or just have her announce another covid outbreak hey Milky. 😎
      
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      October 31, 2020 9:46am
    - alloytoo
      
      Disused hotel will do.
      
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      October 31, 2020 9:53am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        All full of quarantining travellers, aren’t they. I’m sure ‘vocational training centres’ are the answers – seems to work for the Chinese.
        
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        October 31, 2020 10:34am
      - BeeJay
        
        There aren’t any! The hotels are filled with people in Quarantine and the motels are filled with homeless! Great fucking government- another 3 years!
        Great Architect of the Universe help New Zealand, nobody else will!
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:28am
      - sooty
        
        MMA. How is this government going to build detention centres, when the can’t build houses?
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:30am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Kept under a fear lock and key!
        
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        October 31, 2020 2:19pm
    - JibberJabber
      
      Fortunately given Labours inability to build anything other than a kiddies slide, the construction of Gulags is a fair way off…
      
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      October 31, 2020 11:16am
      - tf78
        
        JJ – Auckland will have (one day) the CRL going where exactly.
        
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        October 31, 2020 8:28pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      @mikenmildagain
      
      Thanks for your insight.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:19pm
    - Lee C
      
      “The government has to build a few detention camps first…”
      
      So it’s safe to say it will never happen?
      
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      October 31, 2020 2:37pm
  - rouppe
    
    Have they happened yet in the USA as was predicted in 2016? Has the nuclear war that Trump was predicted to trigger occurred?
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:51am
Catgurl13

So what deal are the Greens getting from Labour? It’s been funny watching them beg and try to talk themselves up after meetings with Jacinda. I wish Chloe would lose that seat she has been gloating about.
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October 31, 2020 8:14am
- Harriet
  
  The Greens aren’t going to get too much – Cindy may well be the ideological daughter of Salvador Allende, but she is also the daughter of Caesar Mendoza.
  
  Caesar Mendoza was the police commissioner at the time – for Pinochet – for light and good order – 5 eyes stuff.
  
  With what is going on in the US and western civilisation, Cindy, Golriz and Cloe are three useful idiots on the wrong side of history.
  
  And Cindy’s dad knows it! 😎
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:41am
- Prince
  
  After years of Peters’ posturing and preening, I honestly didn’t expect the Greens to be worse, with their 8% of the vote.
  They have lost their way as an independent Party, now just longing for the comfort of leather seats, chauffeurs, expense accounts and fawning media.
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:03am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Interesting that James Shaw seems more desperate than the general membership of the party he co-leads…
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:05am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    James Shaw is confident that he can make progress on environmental policies if he is a minister. Greens’ members generally are probably a bit more revolutionary.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:36am
    - sooty
      
      That’s Chloes job as higest ranking green!
      Elected trumps list everytime!
      
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      October 31, 2020 11:32am
      - tf78
        
        I hope she grows up and joins the NATS. Apart from her being on the wrong side she is a bright young thing.
        
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        October 31, 2020 8:31pm
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      Ah, so James Shaw is just a common, garden variety politician then…?
      
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      October 31, 2020 11:37am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Chloe got her seat from an under campaigning Labour candidate and the National Party’s botched selection process (Nat picked a good candidate but far too late)
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:08am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Well, Nikki Kaye would have held the seat easily, so the loss of Auckland Central is just another casualty of the party infighting.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:37am
    - sooty
      
      Toddy Who, has a lot to answer for!
      
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      October 31, 2020 11:34am
      - Martin Williams
        
        It all leads back to Simon Bridges, I’m afraid. His performance in the first months of Covid sealed the National Party’s fate and they (and you) can blame no one but him.
        
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        October 31, 2020 6:04pm
    - freethinker
      
      MMA- rare uptick, keep up the common sense Milky who knows you may even get to be accepted as a respected commentor.
      
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      October 31, 2020 1:00pm
    - C J Southern
      
      But “so what”? If Swarbrick didn’t get elected via Auckland central she’d still be exactly where she is now in parliament as a list MP …
      
      … and Labour would have been one step closer to needing the greens (and all of their associated money-grabbing fruit-loop policies) to govern.
      
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      October 31, 2020 6:00pm
- Martin Williams
  
  Cat lady is not taking the annihilation of the National Party well.
  
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  October 31, 2020 6:02pm
raven

Have the results of this SFO investigation come out, that allegedly links Labour to the Chinese Communist Party? I don’t recall seeing this on MSM prior to the election?

https://tfipost.com/2020/07/jacinda-ardern-is-under-probe-for-alleged-links-with-ccp-that-makes-kiwi-politics-completely-sinophilic/amp/
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October 31, 2020 8:21am
- RJ
  
  Ardennes is not under investigation. If you want to read what the sfo is investigating you can read their press release
  
  https://www.sfo.govt.nz/sfo-commences-investigation-in-relation-to-labour-party-donations
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:43am
  - RJ
    
    What the hell did spell check do there
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:21am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      RJ: Saw the forest instead of the tree.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:36pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Probably correctly ascribed ardern to her rightful place in history like the battle of Ardennes resulting in a massive loss of almost 60,000 dead and injured and a French defeat.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:43pm
  - Tall Man
    
    labour is ardern as without ardern there is no labour government.
    
    I would also doubt that she is bright enough to have done any critical thinking about who was paying what to the party. The media has concentrated their attacks on Chinese money in our political system on the National party and virtually avoided the same analysis of the labour party’s corruption.
    
    Luckily the SFO is doing it’s job and looking at the issue as well as both goof and the liar in Christchurch……….. “Oh my husband does all that”………. yeah right.
    
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    October 31, 2020 12:49pm
    - pdm
      
      TM – you could/should have stopped at thinking!!
      
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      October 31, 2020 7:01pm
WaynelSexton

Franco-Swiss model predicts Trump victory
https://www.newsweek.com/professor-economic-model-trump-2020-election-win-prediction-1542851
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October 31, 2020 8:29am
- oldfella
  
  WS: even Michael Moore, well known Trump hater, believes he can still win this.
  Moore said in an interview: “Don’t believe these polls, first of all. Second of all, the Trump vote is always being undercounted,”
  https://nypost.com/2020/10/30/michael-moore-says-trump-vote-is-always-being-undercounted/
  
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  October 31, 2020 11:12am
Brian McDonald

The herder’s hero capitulates:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/covid-19-coronavirus-sweden-hits-grim-virus-record-as-country-is-warned-infections-will-get-worse/SOUBPBGL76FRWRTJKYQB25BLDE/
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October 31, 2020 8:31am
- Cinematic
  
  Where’s the capitulation?
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:35am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Right here.
    
    “Dr Anders Tegnell has warned that pursuing herd immunity isn’t ethical or justifiable after the country’s Covid-19 cases ballooned by 70 per cent in a week.”
    
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    October 31, 2020 3:06pm
    - Martin Williams
      
      Tegnell doesn’t look like someone with a lot of self awareness. Lots of shrugging, though.
      
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      October 31, 2020 6:06pm
- WaynelSexton
  
  Wow 3000 people have the sniffles
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:44am
  - snowflake melter
    
    no probably only 20 have the sniffles, the rest are totally unaware they have the deadliest virus the media can spin.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:09am
    - JackRabbit
      
      30 people die every year from weed, and 24 ‘died with Covid’ (but none that wouldn’t have died anyway).
      
      So:
      1) 24 dead from Covid and the response is “lockdown the country”.
      2) 30 dead from weed, and the response is “lets see if we can legalise it”.
      
      Does anyone see something wrong with this?
      
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      October 31, 2020 2:26pm
  - SB2
    
    Wayne Sexton, 5,985 have died of your ” sniffles”!
    
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    October 31, 2020 11:38am
- Inandout
  
  BM, 4900 deaths from what? Sweden must remain the ‘bad boy’ by any means. NZ stats for cancer deaths are buried in the painfully slow moving and ‘approved’ departments. We have had the wool pulled over our eyes in a big way but people will soon see that Labour has no answers, merely slogans.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:07am
  - Martin Williams
    
    Perhaps we’d have better cancer treatments if you paid a little more tax.
    
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    October 31, 2020 6:07pm
- kowtow
  
  Swedish Health Minister said in an Al Jazeera interview in August that they “didn’t have a goal of herd immunity”, that that was “not the strategy”
  
  Amazing how the Media and others would like to see the relatively open Swedish strategy fail . One wonders what the Control Freaks really want out of this Chinese virus .
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:13am
  - BAM
    
    The answer is here
    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/06/now-is-the-time-for-a-great-reset/
    
    14 2
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    October 31, 2020 9:33am
  - Martin Williams
    
    Whether or not Tegnell called it ‘herd immunity’, that’s what their strategy was. Now he’s distancing himself from that strategy.
    
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    October 31, 2020 6:08pm
- emmess
  
  PANIC
  
  https://www.google.com/search?q=coronavirus+deaths+in+sweden&oq=coronavirus+deaths+in+sweden&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l4.774j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:33am
artemisia

The photo on Stuff today would have cemented the views of those who voted No –

“Chloe Swarbrick with cannabis advocate Gary Chiles outside Parliament. Her side lost.”

(I voted yes BTW, on the grounds that people will carry on doing what they are already doing anyway, the police are not worried about a bit of personal use, weed is easy to obtain and there’s a little less government control of our private lives.)

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300146269/how-drug-reform-advocates-just-lost-the-battle-for-a-generation
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October 31, 2020 8:53am
- snowflake melter
  
  id bet my left nut that cindy and co will proceed and legalize or decriminalize it anyway, watch this space.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:11am
  - DeepBlue
    
    I think A Little has been getting ahead of himself announcing they won’t re-look at legislation. He has form for not consulting his wider cabinet. Notably Jacinda has been quiet.
    
    Little may find himself shunted out of Justice so Chloe can work on another bill as undersecretary. Going to the electorate in 2023 with an actual decriminalization bill ready.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:28am
    - RJ
      
      Arden will respect a no vote, someone has to get their left nut removed.
      
      After the result was released on Friday afternoon, a spokeswoman for the Prime Minister confirmed that Ardern voted yes in both referendums, and will progress any legislation in line with the will of the people following the release of the final results next week.
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:15am
      - sooty
        
        Where is she hiding?
        
        8 0
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        October 31, 2020 11:36am
      - DeepBlue
        
        “will progress any legislation in line with the will of the people following the release of the final results next week.”
        
        I read this as saying Jacinda hasn’t made a decision yet. If the specials cause the vote to be much closer to a 50:50 result, the “will of the people” could be – too close to call, so we clearly need more research and I have tasked Ministry of Health (not Ministry of Justice) to review all opportunities for responding to this health issue.
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:36am
      - Jimmy White
        
        “Will of the People.” Her goal is to cut all our Willys off.
        
        5 0
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        October 31, 2020 2:29pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    I’ll take that bet . . .
    
    6 1
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    October 31, 2020 9:35am
    - snowflake melter
      
      Sweet, what the odds, 1x left nut: 1oz of hydro weed?
      
      4 2
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      October 31, 2020 9:48am
  - RJ
    
    I’d bet you’d be wrong
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/123253543/referendum-result-cannabis-legalisation-abandoned-by-government-greens-wont-concede-defeat
    
    So I guess time you go see your gp and have your left nut removed.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:45am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Implied in the challenge, I believe, is a certain amount of suffering, so the said testicle should be removed without medical care,
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:41am
    - snowflake melter
      
      you jump to conclusions pretty quick, jacinda will do what jacinda does best… everything except what she says theyre doing.
      
      it will be at minimum decriminalized by next election, if it wasnt for winston most drugs would be already decriminalized. Cindys role model is pushing for hard drugs to be legalized/decriminalized abroad so watch out for that in nz within the decade.
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:51am
      - RJ
        
        Nope, Jacinda office has addressed the referendums, time you book into a doctor, and supply a medical certificate afterwards to confirm the removal. Next time you make a dickhead bet you should read the news of what the government has said.
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:34am
      - Tall Man
        
        RJ, ardern also said she would eliminate “child poverdee”. She also promised “light rail” and “100,000 houses”.
        
        I also remember a statement to the effect that she didn’t need to lie in politics.
        
        I’ll take what cindy says with a big bag of salt.
        
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        October 31, 2020 12:37pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Why is the US media not reporting this? They are running cover for the sick pedos.
https://www.lawenforcementtoday.com/u-s-marshals-rescue-45-missing-children-in-anti-human-trafficking/?
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October 31, 2020 9:03am
- Inandout
  
  Steve, the US media is fixated on Trump and pedos are allowed a free pass. Epstein’s followers and Hollywood are a good starting place if you are looking for pedos. Then turn to certain Dem politicians currently in the news.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:12am
  - Harriet
    
    If the left wins or loses, Biden, Clintons and all the rest of the old white guard will be booted – some due to legal matters. The democrats are no longer the party of John Kennedy.
    Hunter Biden and Jeffery Epstein have made this so. And either way Khamala Harris will do so. If Trump doesn’t do it first.
    
    This election will see the young takeover the Democrats.
    
    That is why the left are quiet on their pedo front. 😎
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:23am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Always said JFK was the last true Democrat, and look what they did to him
      
      6 2
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      October 31, 2020 2:04pm
  - FatTony
    
    Try going to Google Images and searching for “ jeffrey epstein donald trump”.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:40am
    - RJ
      
      Yes, trump the only one to help the lawyers trying to take Epstein down.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWvOyrf_OQs
      
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      October 31, 2020 9:53am
    - FatTony
      
      “I’ve known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy. He’s a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side.”
      
      Donald Trump – 2002.
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:14am
      - RJ
        
        So? You do realise that most people know pedophiles and never know what is going on behind the doors, never know they are a pedophile or what they are doing. Trump found Epstein hitting on a girl and kicked Epstein out of Mar-a-Lago and gave all the information he knew to the lawyer that contacted him. On top of that Virginia Giuffre Has stated she never saw trump with any of the girls she knew.
        
        Trump loves woman, beautiful woman. It’s not illegal to love woman. And Epstein was teenagers and children, not woman.
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:19am
      - Batman
        
        Trump is the guy who referred to Michael Cohen’s 15 year old teenage daughter by saying “look at that piece of ass. I would love some of that”
        
        So I’ll take your argument with a grain of salt.
        
        And let’s not forget, he said it’s okay to call Ivanka a piece of ass.
        
        Ref: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/09/michael-cohens-daughter-reflects-on-his-time-with-trump
        
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        October 31, 2020 11:35am
      - Jimmy White
        
        I’ve known Fat Tony since 1991. He was a bit of a worry and no fun to be with. Tony is a mobster and the caporegime of the Springfield Mafia. His cousin Fit Tony took over the Springfield Mafia when he supposedly died. I understand however he survived the hit, came to New Zealand and is hiding in the Basement of Fraser House.
        
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        October 31, 2020 2:45pm
      - FatTony
        
        LOL ?
        
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        October 31, 2020 4:10pm
      - C J Southern
        
        @”Batman”
        
        “Trump is the guy who referred to Michael Cohen’s 15 year old teenage daughter by saying “look at that piece of ass. I would love some of that”
        
        And about 1/2 the population use exactly the same kind of language at the pub on any given night (and I kid you not when I say I’ve heard worse from 8 year olds in a classroom when the teacher ducked out).
        
        Trump is clearly from the alpha-male / “arrested development” generation – but that’s not a crime.
        
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        October 31, 2020 6:07pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        “locker room talk”…
        
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        October 31, 2020 6:35pm
- emmess
  
  I think it is pretty obvious why left-wing MSM doesn’t cover it, in this case
  But I have thought for a while now, that right leaning media should be covering more stuff with no obvious political angle, so as to reduce the need to use the MSM at all.
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:46am
  - Tall Man
    
    Where do we find this right leaning media of which you speak?
    
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    October 31, 2020 12:31pm
- MCos
  
  https://www.nbc12.com/2020/10/30/us-marshals-recover-missing-children-virginia-after-five-day-operation/
  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-marshals-recover-45-missing-children-operation-autumn-hope/
  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/10/26/operation-autumn-hope-45-missing-children-ohio-179-arrests/6049990002/
  
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  October 31, 2020 12:59pm
Happychappy

Has anyone heard anymore on the Chec drug smuggler and whether he has been allowed to stay in NZ as a lot of new laws were amended under the COVID 19 to help Labour and the Coalition to get around sticky situations and Jacinda seems to have told a lot of lies that were hidden leading up to the Election only for them to be drip fed to the public lately . Seeing as Karl Strobeck was a well known acquaintance of Jacinda and her friends it will be interesting to see what has happened since Lee’s Galloway had to resign.
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October 31, 2020 9:06am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  He was granted parole in August, due for release in September.
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/423802/convicted-drug-smuggler-karel-sroubek-granted-parole
  
  I think he is trying to appeal his deportation order from NZ.
  
  I can’t find any media coverage about his release in September.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:41am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Here’s his Parole Board release decision… in the name of Jan Antolik
    
    https://www.paroleboard.govt.nz/decisions/2020/jan_antolik_-_17_august_2020#:~:text=Mr%20Antolik%20will%20be%20released,after%20his%20sentence%20and%20date.
    
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    October 31, 2020 9:48am
    - Ruahine
      
      I suspect that Jan Antolik being a friend of a friend, a friend has probably suggested to some other friends to give the story a low profile.
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:13am
    - Inandout
      
      Maggy, I would put Jan in the same camp as Ghislaine Maxwell, a person who knows too much.
      
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      October 31, 2020 10:21am
    - Nickc2
      
      Wow, if I didn’t know better, I would say this case has been given a liberal coating of Labour Party White Wash in order to arrive at this solution.
      Then again, maybe I don’t know better?
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:20pm
      - freethinker
        
        I noticed two female parole board members and a female Dr just saying.
        
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        October 31, 2020 1:25pm
      - Nickc2
        
        @ freethinker 1:25PM.
        Are we still allowed to come to those conclusions? If so, we may as well make the most of it as Angry Andy will sure as hell include such free thinking in his Hate Speech laws.
        
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        October 31, 2020 2:00pm
Billy Collins

Ukrainegate, russiagate, and all the rubbish attempts to find corruption on Trump have been pretty weak, IMO

However, this here could be something, depending on what Trump and Bill Barr’s explanations are:

https://hotair.com/archives/allahpundit/2020/10/29/thats-trump-barr-dumped-u-s-attorney-charge-sdny/

Even Trump supporters need to realise that this does not look good for Trump, and makes his Ukraine call look pretty innocent by comparison.
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October 31, 2020 9:12am
- Inandout
  
  BC, I trust this news is all over Twitter, uncensored?
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:23am
- All_on_Red
  
  It’s been debunked
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:31am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Interesting that both FBI director Christopher Wray and attorney general Bill Barr were partners in firms involved in dodgy Biden pay-for-play influence Deals before getting their govt positions.
    
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    October 31, 2020 1:11pm
Maggy Wassilieff

It will be interesting to see how much attention our PM and the Green Refugee Warrior MPs give to the plight of the Hongkongese in NZ.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/429456/labour-and-national-mps-urge-jacinda-ardern-to-adopt-hong-kong-lifeboat-scheme
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October 31, 2020 9:16am
- oldfella
  
  Maggie: hands up everyone who thinks Cindy would do anything that might upset the CCP? Especially if she has dreams of running the UN one day.
  Remember, ‘China is asshole,’ and they don’t play nice as Australia is finding out.
  
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  October 31, 2020 11:18am
  - freethinker
    
    Xi Jiping has few friends-N Korea & Iran -and has made many powerful enemies, Putin is totally pissed off with Xi claiming Vladivostock as part of China and half of an adjacent Stan. China imports 30% of its food and is now releasing large quantities of food from strategic reserves blaming Covid lock downs for reduced production so if the 3 Gorges dams does fail the devastation and consequences will be beyond comprehension, hope the dam holds as the 400 Million Chinese in its path do not deserve a disaster. Covid lockdowns floods in the US and weather events elsewhere will have reduced food production and the world will see the consequences soon.
    
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    October 31, 2020 1:33pm
kowtow

From the ODT . Why only hint at the job this guy did .

“I thought the blue uniform you were wearing would make us safe — that was our biggest mistake,” one victim said.

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/crime/man-who-abused-boys-%E2%80%98scum%E2%80%99
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October 31, 2020 9:16am
- sooty
  
  What was the blue uniform?
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:17am
  - oldfella
    
    Sooty, sounds like the guy was a cop. But why be so coy about it? And if not a cop, exactly what kind of uniform was he wearing?
    Sound like ‘Journalism 101’ to clarify that, but we have plenty of ‘so-called’ journalists in this country who skipped that particular class.
    
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    October 31, 2020 11:28am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Cahill’s Rules. Cover, suffocate, deflect and lie.
      
      7 1
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      October 31, 2020 12:39pm
  - kowtow
    
    Doesn’t say . Very poor journalism.
    
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    October 31, 2020 2:00pm
Tony Stuart

Aupito William Sio is Minister for Pacific Peoples, Associate Minister for Courts and Associate Minister of Justice. On that basis, he clearly has redeeming features that were obvious to Jacinda Ardern, and to his Labour Party caucus colleagues.

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/minister/hon-aupito-william-sio

That goodness Minister Sio doesn’t have a portfolio in the Finance area, given that he has a problem with basic numeracy. Not only did he tweet a photo of Labour’s four new Pasifika MP’s yesterday, but his staff put out a congratulatory press statement as well.

There’s just one problem; there are FIVE MP’s in the picture, not four, all of whom are Pasifika, and all of whom are new!

https://twitter.com/TonyStuart55/status/1322254190823919616

We pay our Ministers a very good sum of money to do their jobs, so it’s a bit of a concern when one of them can’t count to five. It’s also an indictment on the level of competence available to Jacinda Ardern, when she comes to appoint Ministers. The talent pool is as shallow as a car park puddle on a hot summer’s day, and if ever there was a time when the number of Ministers could be reduced, this is it.
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October 31, 2020 9:17am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Thank you for link~~whor~~ing to your twitter post, Tony. Without it, this important mislabelling of a caption might have gone unremarked upon.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:36am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Thank you for your tolerance of mediocrity mikenmild. It seems to be the hallmark of the current Government.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:21am
    - Tall Man
      
      And many of those currently employed by it.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:26pm
- Paulus Gnome
  
  He may have lost a finger in a childhood bike accident, everything now has a base of four . . .
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:40am
  - alwyn
    
    If he was working with a base 4 numbering system his announcement would have o have talked about 11 MPs, wouldn’t it?
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:01am
Catgurl13

Jacinda kept quiet about which way she was voting in the Cannibis referendum so as not to lose the Muslim votes. She knew very well this would not align with their ultra conservative values with a vote in favour of it. She should have said what she believed in during the debates when asked. People need to know upfront if their own values are the same as politicians requesting our votes for them.
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October 31, 2020 9:18am
- snowflake melter
  
  Jacinda clearly said what she believes in… anything that will get her a vote!
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:37am
- Flossie
  
  Following that logic are we to assume muslims are okay with euthanasia?
  Why did the PM announce her preference on that referendum but keep her cannabis decision so secret?
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:48am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Catgurl’s arguments do not bear even cursory analysis. But apart from your point, one should remember that there are only about 25,000 NZ Muslims of voting age. Hardly a significant source of votes.
    
    4 12
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    October 31, 2020 10:45am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Some muslims are so into euthanasia that a minority of them apply it prematurely without informed consent. Nice truckers, Bataclan shooters, London stabbers, Charlie Hebdo killers, ISIS, 9/11, Taliban are all ‘aye’ voters for euthanasia.
    
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    October 31, 2020 12:41pm
- Yvette
  
  I would be vaguely interested if someone sifted politicians statements or admissions to reveal how each voted on the cannabis referendum, to compare , if it were a Parliamentary conscience vote whether it would have passed – in other words, whether political decisions reflect the wish of the public.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:49am
- Ehlana
  
  Yet she was not quiet about her vote on the euthanasia law. Why the inconsistency?
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:05am
  - Yvette
    
    Ehlana, because the euthanasia bill was voted on in Parliament, but needed final referendum approval to become law, Ardern’s vote is known from that, while the cannabis law still had – if given the go ahead by its referendum– to go through the Parliament process like the other bill already did.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:15am
  - DeepBlue
    
    Because she had already voted yes to the EoL Act as an MP last year. It was already on record.
    
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    October 31, 2020 10:31am
  - fernglas
    
    She’s a politician, for whom there is no inconsistency in taking two completely different stances on the same issue as long is it gives her political advantage. It does put paid to her claims to be a leader.
    
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    October 31, 2020 11:05am
  - kowtow
    
    Very strange indeed.
    
    Encourage the country to bump off granny but not want to in relation to some dope smoking , weird.
    
    But then these people are full on for abortion , so the moral barrier to killing the vulnerable was crossed a long time ago, indeed literally proudly celebrated. Not so much with killing brain cells by dope inhalation , very strange times.
    
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    October 31, 2020 11:07am
- Fletch
  
  Of course she voted yes. A drugged up populace is more pliable, open to suggestion. The govt would love it if we were required to take our daily SOMA dose.
  
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  October 31, 2020 10:38am
- rouppe
  
  Muslims in Pakistan and Afghanistan are some of the biggest growers of opium poppy in the world and have no problem selling it to the West.
  
  Why do you think “the Muslim vote” in NZ has any different view?
  
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  October 31, 2020 11:01am
- MCos
  
  How do you know what the Muslims in NZ do in their spare time, Catgurl?
  You wouldn’t have a clue otherwise you wouldn’t gone on as if you were an expert.
  
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  October 31, 2020 1:11pm
I remember when

RoboRob
“House prices continue to rise because cost of buying section and cost to build now is too high.”
Is that right or does the high cost of existing housing mean section and building materials are able to rise.
Many years ago bobby calves were selling in saleyards for $9. Milk powder and calf meal prices were such that this allowed some enterprising operators to earn $1000 per hectare.
It became a growth industry.
The competition meant that within a few years calves were fetching over $100 and the price of milk powder and calf meal had also increased year by year. Demand often outstripped supply for parts of the season.
Result was that profits shrunk and it stopped being a growth industry.
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October 31, 2020 9:23am
- snowflake melter
  
  simple supply and demand issues. the latest increases are all due to this govts covid response and cashed up folk coming home.
  
  all the freedom campers and tourists leave = empty campers and hotels.
  
  cashed up folk come= buy up ANY and EVERY house available leaving short supply and spiraling prices.
  
  the cindy govt will tinker with housing again and exacerbate the problem further, regulation and taxes have the opposite affect of their intentions but are to blind and naive to see that.
  
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  October 31, 2020 9:44am
  - fernglas
    
    I’d like to see some evidence that the current market is due to returnees. Most of them seem to be unemployed from Australia and assorted riff-raff from around the globe. Unless they were lucky or shrewd enough to sell up before the pandemic hit, I’d be surprised if they had the money. Most of the settled people overseas seem to be riding it out in their new home country.
    
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    October 31, 2020 11:01am
    - Tall Man
      
      Last month’s bank lending figures were interesting and bear out your comment.
      
      1.3 biilion to first time buyers, 1.7 billion to investors and the rest to upgraders. That’s 4 billion or approx 60% to locals already here and I am quite sure much of the 1.3 went to those already here.
      
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      October 31, 2020 12:23pm
      - artemisia
        
        17,811 borrowers in September. 3,023 first home buyers. 4,419 investors. The rest existing owner occupiers.
        
        So Tall Man that does support your view.
        
        Also a note about residential property investors from that data set. Last 3 months have seen a level of investor numbers not seen for, oh, three years but still well down on the 6,000+ in 2016. Reasons for recent increase – cheap money and LVR changes obviously.
        
        Numbers matter because each borrower represents at least one rental added to the pool. Not necessarily immediately. And new buys or builds in the current market will be helping along rent increases.
        
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        October 31, 2020 1:05pm
      - david
        
        Re Artemesia’s comment,
        In no way does a house sold mean that there is any addition to the ‘housing stock’. It might mean one more rental but it also implies one fewer owner-occupied or just a rental that has moved from one landlord to another.
        You must get more houses built than are destroyed for any change to occur in the number who can be accommodated in the country as a whole.
        
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        October 31, 2020 7:13pm
      - artemisia
        
        And a few thou new dwelling consents issued each month that flow through to borrower loans over time. Unless cancelled. They are additions to the dwelling pool, offset by dwellings removed from the pool. I don’t know that number though.
        
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        November 1, 2020 6:09am
Ehlana

And as a follow on from the story of Greta’s first day in an oil-free paradise…

Meanwhile, in the USA, the Universal Society of Hinduism president Rajan Zed, finding his own country in a state of unmatched perfection, has turned his kindly eye upon New Zealand.

Seeing our sufferings and wishing to bring us to America’s state of blessing, he has identified our greatest need and offered a solution: the government should make Diwali a public holiday, “as the country’s demography has changed.”

“He said it’s unfair for the Hindu community to be at work or school on their most popular festival and making it a public holiday would be a “a step in the positive direction”.”

Just in case you wondered, no, Radio New Zealand, who brought us this story, could not find any actual Hindus in New Zealand who supported the notion. It appears Rajan Zed doesn’t know that the birthdays of Buddha and Mohammed are also not public holidays in New Zealand, nor is there any day for the Sikhs or the Jews and RNZ didn’t ask him about that. Perhaps they didn’t want to show us up.
21 1
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October 31, 2020 9:46am
JibberJabber

Swarbrick having a Tanty because democracy didn’t work the way she wanted ?.
Like all Leftist twats has no real concept of the meaning of the word Democracy.
54 3
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October 31, 2020 10:13am
The Housekeeper

Robin Scholes, producer of teleseries Black Hands, says that she was urged by Bain family and friends not to make her fictional series. “She admits this is a show they do not want to see.” One family member told her, “I have to grieve for my family dying all over again,” Scholes says, “It’s incredibly painful for them. They would much prefer we didn’t do it.”

So why did Scholes feel so compelled to ignore their pleas and make her show which “Scholes and the producers stress is a ‘complete fiction'”? “The only reason we decided ultimately to do it is that someone else would have done it.” Others scripts had been written which were “terrible”. She and executive producer, Phillipa Rennie “were better off doing a job that would have been done with or without them.” So they were actually doing the family a favour.

“Between us as a team we felt we were a safe pair of hands for what is a really complex and nuanced story … the weight and burden of telling real people’s stories is something we have carried with us …” But it’s fiction, a dramatisation, so where’s the weight and burden?

I won’t be watching it and I really feel for the Bain family and friends to have to be put through the wringer again simply so others can make money. I can’t help wondering what would happen if Scholes decided to dramatise the mosque shootings.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/tv-radio/300141205/bain-family-warned-black-hands-producers-the-tv-series-would-make-them-grieve-all-over-again
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October 31, 2020 10:23am
- Fletch
  
  The guy who plays David Bain looks like a Hollywood heartthrob along the lines of Brad Pitt…lol
  
  Hardly going to be realistic.
  
  11 2
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  October 31, 2020 11:46am
Komata

JJ@1013

So she’s lost her seat then?
4 0
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October 31, 2020 10:38am
Maggy Wassilieff

Does Labour even know what it does from one day to another?

On October 5, National leader Judith Collins unveiled a plan to let state housing tenants buy their own properties.

Moments after the policy was released, Labour leader Jacinda Ardern weighed in, saying that “to suggest as an answer to the housing troubles that New Zealand has experienced that we should sell off state houses I think is absolutely wrong”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300146319/election-2020-labour-caught-selling-off-state-homes-to-tenants-after-rubbishing-national-policy
33 3
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October 31, 2020 10:51am
- RJ
  
  Does Labour even know what it does from one day to another?
  
  NO
  
  31 1
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  October 31, 2020 11:15am
- Wired-one
  
  The hypocrisy of the left and all that…reap what you sow NZ, you voted for these incompetent fools.
  
  22 0
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  October 31, 2020 11:32am
- niggly
  
  Hmmm very interesting, Labour’s duplicity exposed (including MIA Ardern and Megan Woods – caught out)!
  
  But also noted is the lack of balance in the final reporting (and the standard get-out-of-jail-free card tactics for Labour). We have Labour (Megan Woods) being interviewed and spinning her pro-Labour/anti-National per-prepared response lines but no-one from National to defend against Woods’ accusations nor present their viewpoint.
  
  C’mon Stuff, you can do better!
  
  20 0
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  October 31, 2020 11:53am
  - Tall Man
    
    No they can’t.
    
    23 1
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    October 31, 2020 12:18pm
- Tall Man
  
  Again, rhetorical I assume.
  
  12 1
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  October 31, 2020 12:18pm
thirteenstars

Stephen Franks from the Free Speech Coalition today:

The Human Rights Commission report released yesterday has called for a balance to be struck between “freedom of speech and the right to be safe.”

It seems that no one told Human Rights Commissioner Paul Hunt that safety isn’t a human right. Not in the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990. Not in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

We cannot rely on the Human Rights Commission to defend free speech. Will you contribute to the Free Speech Coalition’s fighting fund, to make sure there is a voice unequivocally standing up for this basic human right?

Someone should also tell Mr. Hunt that it isn’t his job to start inventing human rights.

This was not the only baseless assertion from the man in charge of protecting New Zealanders’ human rights. In inquiring about the adequacy of New Zealand’s “hate speech law”, he stated that:

“hate speech is defined as speech that can be proven to cause a third party to act with violence or hostility towards an ethnic or national group…”

The key question this statement raises is; what on earth he is talking about?

New Zealand doesn’t have a “hate speech law” so the origin of this definition is quite mysterious. The Human Rights Act 1993 outlaws racial disharmony (s61), racial harassment (s63), and incitement of racial disharmony (s131), and along with the prohibitions on discrimination and the other common law restrictions on free speech.

But nowhere in New Zealand’s statute books will you find a “hate speech law.” In fact, the Human Rights Commission’s own report from last year states “No definition of hate speech exists under international law and definitions under national laws vary.” Seeing as Mr. Hunt signed off on this report, it is surprising to see him suddenly arrive at a definition, seemingly out of nowhere.

I recommend you give this report a read, as it provides quite a comprehensive overview of New Zealand’s current laws restricting speech but also an insight into the thinking of the Human Rights Commission.

With Labour’s majority in Parliament they will no longer have NZ First acting as a brake on their ambitions to enact hate speech laws.

The supporters of such laws will be emboldened to demand these laws be enacted. Labour will either be forced to submit to these demands or finally admit that not only does New Zealand already have laws which punish and restrict speech deemed threatening, abusive or insulting to people on the basis of race, colour, ethnicity and nationality, but that the extensions to these already existing laws lack any kind of logical consistency.

We can expect more of these demands to restrict speech on the basis of ‘safety’ over the course of the next three years, and that is why it is so vital that there is a voice calling for a principled defence of free speech.

Get involved. Donate. Do something.

https://www.freespeechcoalition.nz/
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October 31, 2020 10:52am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Thanks for the intro to the Free Speech Coalition.
  
  15 0
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  October 31, 2020 12:40pm
  - thirteenstars
    
    No reflection on you, but it saddens me that even on a forum like this the FSC is flying under the radar.
    
    Hey, mods, how about putting a link to the FSC on the sidebar? I know DPF is a member. Get the word out. Our speech on this very forum will be dramatically affected by the proposed hate speech laws.
    
    9 0
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    October 31, 2020 1:21pm
    - Jack5
      
      Hunt is a Corbynist. Our own David Farrar posted on 23 October 2018:
      
      Just two months ago he was standing for the National Policy Forum of UK Labour as a pro-Corbyn socialist. It appears he was too left wing even for UK Labour, and wasn’t elected.
      
      Here’s ACT’s David Seymour on Hunt in April 2019, discussing a radio interview of Hunt by Kim Hill:
      
      Asked yesterday to condemn Corbyn’s anti-Semitism by Kim Hill, Hunt failed miserably, instead weakly suggesting that all prejudice was bad, says Mr Seymour.
      
      “It is deeply troubling that the bureaucrat charged with tackling racism in New Zealand cannot bring himself to condemn his former leader’s bigotry.
      
      “Mr Hunt appears to believe that prejudice is acceptable when it is committed by people who share his political beliefs.
      
      Andrew Little, as Labour Justice Minister, in October 2018 appointed Hunt as Human Rights Commissioner.
      
      Hunt succeeded David Rutherford in the position after a ministerial review found the commission was unable to provide proper care and support for a sexual-harassment victim on its staff.
      
      Stuff reported that the review followed a sexual harassment incident in October 2017, where a young American woman cut short her internship after she was groped by the organisation’s chief financial officer at a work party.
      
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      October 31, 2020 2:52pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Hearse follows Biden campaign bus.
https://notthebee.com/article/trump-supporter-trolls-biden-campaign-bus-with-hearse-reading-collecting-democrat-votes-one-dead-stiff-at-a-time?
19 6
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October 31, 2020 11:05am
RJ

Hmmm

Several Queens Village (NY) residents are receiving pre-filled out ballots for Joe Biden and being told to just send them back to the Board of Elections. This is blatantly ILLEGAL

https://twitter.com/jakejakeny/status/1321900543451799559/photo/1
16 3
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October 31, 2020 11:14am
- Batman
  
  Hmmmm, the freelance former Larry Kudlow show producer, Jake Novak.
  
  Hopefully he passes all information to the NY Board of elections as they requested of him.
  
  4 10
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  October 31, 2020 11:38am
  - RJ
    
    Saw their post and the media, good to see they are quick to get onto it
    
    6 1
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    October 31, 2020 12:02pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

https://babylonbee.com/news/ben-shapiros-voice-now-available-for-your-gps-unit?
4 4
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October 31, 2020 11:16am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Software being withdrawn because Shapiro keeps telling people to turn right ….
  
  3 3
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  October 31, 2020 2:05pm
  - mark15
    
    Or straight.
    Can’t have that…
    
    2 2
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    October 31, 2020 4:16pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

https://babylonbee.com/news/multiple-sources-accuse-donald-duck-of-walking-onto-movie-sets-without-any-pants?
8 4
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October 31, 2020 11:28am
oldfella

UK comic, Abi Roberts, on how ‘free speech’ is conditional on not supporting terrible people (TERFS) like J.K. Rowling. Which she did, and got cancelled for it by the ‘tolerant’ left.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/10/30/this-ladys-not-for-burning/
10 2
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October 31, 2020 11:47am
greybeard

To hell with the economy, housing, poverty, education, crime, immigration etc.
Jacinda is back to doing what she really knows best:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/parenting/big-kids/five-to-ten/123260465/jacinda-arderns-asks-young-creatives-to-help-design-official-christmas-card
19 5
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October 31, 2020 12:10pm
- RJ
  
  Prime minister takes moment out of her day to ask kids to have fun and create a card. Grumpy old bugger moans about it. Pick her apart for her many failures, not something that gets kids having a bit of fun.
  
  7 23
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  October 31, 2020 12:14pm
  - The Housekeeper
    
    Oh yes, Beloved Leader can sit round the campfire in the appropriate christian headgear, toasting sugar-free marshmallows with all the happy children she has saved from poverdy. They will wish she was their real mother, her hair is so beautiful and she is so kind. When designing their christmas cards they will be entranced listening to her wise stories of baby Jesus and his struggles to overcome the inauspicious circumstances of his birth. She can tell them that Mary and Joseph were naughty for not ringing Oranga Tamariki and asking for help. Beloved Leader and her helpers could have arranged everything and taken baby Jesus off their hands straight after the birth and there wouldn’t have been all that nastiness later on. Mary and Joseph’s poor decision-making was undoubtedly due to colonialism.
    
    The children were so earnest that for a split second she was tempted to let them into the secret. But how could she explain to the children that it’s just a handy narrative to allow non-achievers the excuse to feed off the productive? How can she tell them that not only will the fruits of their own labour go to wastrels who choose not to abide equally to moral codes but those same wastrels will claim the moral highground due to their circumstances and happily expect handouts from those they claim to despise. No, plenty of time to find all that out much later.
    
    Strangely, all the children claimed that she was surrounded by a very bright Blue/Green/Yellow aura but their claims were dismissed as nonsense as none of the adults present seemed to notice. All the parents were so impressed with her gift for communication.
    
    After much debate and in deference to one of the cardmakers being non-Christian, it was decided to ban all mention of Christianity from the christmas cards. When one of the children cried because she wanted to draw a a picture of baby Jesus on her card Beloved Leader quickly defused the situation by giving her a photo of baby Neve to copy instead, explaining that baby Neve was also the child of a God so same same.
    
    After much guidance from her, Beloved Leader was eventually thrilled with the cards the children produced, most of them being portraits of herself or baby Neve. “I’m so thrilled the children have loved my stories and have really grasped the true meaning of Christmas. After all, it’s a fun summer holiday and there’s no reason Christians should get it all to themselves. Everyone is special, but, and let me be very clear about this, some of us are a lot more special than others.”
    
    12 2
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    October 31, 2020 2:40pm
    - Papalazarou
      
      Brilliant
      
      4 1
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      October 31, 2020 6:52pm
  - greybeard
    
    “Pick her apart for her many failures”:
    Did you not read my first sentence ? These are certainly her failures, and should be taking up 100% of her time, especially after the last 3 woeful years.
    
    4 1
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    October 31, 2020 3:38pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Seems a bit dodgy encouraging children to undertake an activity with “official” Christian connotations.
  
  (Tho’ I expect the winning card will have sun, sea and pohutukawa in the mix with no sign of a cross, or a star or baby Jesus)
  
  15 3
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  October 31, 2020 2:03pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Hunter Biden’s laptop is front page news in all countries in the World except USA.
23 4
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October 31, 2020 12:12pm
- RJ
  
  It’s getting there, a cbs affiliate reported on it yesterday, today a cbs journalists is reporting on the fbi investigation. This weekend will be interesting.
  
  12 3
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  October 31, 2020 12:17pm
- MCos
  
  Here’s a bit of news for you.
  https://www.thedailybeast.com/tucker-carlson-suddenly-says-its-time-to-leave-hunter-biden-alone
  
  2 5
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  October 31, 2020 1:23pm
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Another bullshit headline form a far left partisan site. What Carlson actually said was he want’s to leave Hunters personal life out as much as possible – because he is obviously horrible messed up, but where Hunter’s involvement and messages shed light on Joe’s corruption it needs to be examined and bought to light for the impact a Corrupt and compromised president would have on USA.
    
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    October 31, 2020 8:37pm
- Ralph
  
  Hunter Biden’s laptop is front page news in all countries in the World except USA.
  
  ???
  
  3 1
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  October 31, 2020 1:39pm
  - Nickc2
    
    and lil-olde-New Zealand. Am I surprised? Not one bit. Leftist scribblers are all tarred with the same brush IMO. Their aim is to control the narrative just as they did during and leading up to our so-called free elections.
    
    7 3
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    October 31, 2020 1:52pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    You don’t get it do you? The US media is corrupt fake news
    
    7 4
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    October 31, 2020 2:07pm
    - fernglas
      
      Can somebody point me to the piece of evidence that shows Joe Biden received any personal benefit from Hunter’s dealings, or is it just that Hunter took advantage of his father’s position to line his own coffers? If it’s the latter, then why the problem? The junior Trumps seem to have done the same.
      
      4 8
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      October 31, 2020 2:21pm
      - Robert
        
        Yep follow the trail all the way to the New York Post who were the first to air all this info. They posted it on their twitter page and were immediately shut down. Ted Cruz villified the CEO (there a video of that), over the censorship of the 4th biggest paper in the USA. Its all out there if you look.
        
        https://trendingpolitics.com/total-backfire-ny-post-s-twitter-account-gained-almost-19-new-followers-after-being-censored/
        
        5 1
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        October 31, 2020 6:05pm
      - gravedodger
        
        Any comment on Tony Bobulinski’s information 10% for the “Big Guy”. Now who could that be, asking for a friend?
        
        4 2
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        October 31, 2020 6:31pm
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        There is clear electronic records pointing to Hunter serving as bagman for Joe, Hunter complaining about “pop” taking 50%, discussion of deals with 10% for Hunter and 10% for the big guy where Hunter ends up receiving 20% in final recorded deals. Biden lying about not having any knowledge or involvement contradicted by Bobulinski’s several meetings with Joe (that there is documentary evidence for). It’s a damning and detailed trail. Biden is dirty, and with all this documentary evidence and witness testimony pointing to criminality there will inevitably be a proper in depth financial investigation that is certain to bring Joe and his 4 family bagmen down.
        
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        October 31, 2020 8:45pm
sooty

Cindy’s been lying again and got caught out, doing it!
She sold at least 105 state houses,in the last three years. When Judith Collins suggested it. Cindy wades in as though they were selling children!
25 4
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October 31, 2020 12:43pm
lifesgood

Well, well, well! A Canterbury farmer was on talkback last night complaining that the Labour Government is telling farmers when they can plant their crops. I had to laugh, those idiot farmers voted Labour, so they can jolly well suck it up. To use a farming analogy, you reap what you sow.
19 13
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October 31, 2020 1:07pm
- Dougal10
  
  No we fecking didn’t .
  
  4 1
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  October 31, 2020 5:13pm
- gravedodger
  
  Utter Bullexcrement I know many farmers and rural support people and they would laugh you out of the room. Just take Nosey’s threats and actions, he would have a bigly target on his back, for rotting fruit of course.
  
  4 0
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  October 31, 2020 6:34pm
- lilman
  
  Agreed,Im a ex farmer,lol, the did it with winston 3 years ago and now they are doing again.
  
  4 1
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  October 31, 2020 7:43pm
tranquil

Hi all –

A blood-chilling article here about how **utterly evil** the Left are in America –
https://thefederalist.com/2020/10/26/7-open-leftist-threats-that-political-terror-is-coming-to-america-whether-trump-wins-or-not/

I am proud beyond words to be on the opposite side to such evil.
12 4
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October 31, 2020 2:18pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  It’s a terrible path that these Marxist idiots are trying to set their country upon. Pushing things to violence will make them hated pariahs by the vast majority of Americans, guaranteeing that their side loses and that rest of society swings right.
  
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  October 31, 2020 8:51pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

This is the hearse that follows the Biden bus. Hilarious.
https://twitter.com/KamVTV/status/1321902646706528256?
9 4
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October 31, 2020 2:33pm
Jack5

Any petrol heads, whoops, electric heads out there been tinkering with home repairs of hybrid or full-electric cars?

You Tube has plenty of helpful Americans telling how to replace hybrid batteries, or cells, with reconditioned versions at home and save hundreds of dollars.

I see reconditioned Prius batteries on sale in NZ for $1000 to $2,500 (depending on guarantee, three months to two years), but the replacement isn’t trivial. One Youtube video shows a professional replacing a battery in less than 20 minutes, but for home electric-heads it would be much longer, especially the first time.

A tutorial on how to replace a Prius-hybrid battery with a reconditioned model:

https://youtu.be/Q3RCdrh666w
5 2
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October 31, 2020 3:21pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  I now have me an EV motorcycle.
  
  I loves me the ease of use and the phenomenal acceleration (not in that order).
  
  I could GAF about replacing the battery, because my hip replacement has been delayed further, because I am Not Maori. So I slide farther down the waiting list. Because they can do that, because I do not meet the Tribal Threshold of Triage.
  
  FYYFF.
  
  That is all.
  
  4 1
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  October 31, 2020 4:51pm
  - Jack5
    
    Can they hear you coming and get out of the way, Engelbert?
    
    Hope your turn for a hip replacement comes soon.
    
    0 0
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    October 31, 2020 9:12pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Wonder if this works? If not I will delete – if that function is working.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1322204363775864833
3 3
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October 31, 2020 3:30pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I think it was taken down by the lefties. Trespassing on private property. But another went up somewhere else?
  
  2 4
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  October 31, 2020 3:33pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

96 miles of support for DJT. Then again it could be fake news //
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dYzKPrs7lk&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR07eYioNqU23eHsJo6rvHKETgWuu2cNY2nGiW2e3mZPL_Zytg8T8pjHLV4
4 4
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October 31, 2020 3:50pm
- Ralph
  
  Was it this 6 mile one in Utah?
  
  https://www.abc4.com/news/top-stories/6-mile-long-trump-train-rolls-through-utah/
  
  1 1
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  October 31, 2020 6:52pm
RJ

no more lockdown – Van Morrison

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUOWS7arfw4&feature=emb_logo
2 2
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October 31, 2020 4:07pm
RJ

The Prime Minister will release the text of the proposed deal between Labour and the Greens at about 4:30pm. That will be followed by a press conference, which Newshub will livestream above.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/10/nz-election-2020-live-updates-greens-to-vote-on-proposed-labour-deal.html
4 2
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October 31, 2020 4:11pm
- RJ
  
  Greens will be our bitch and do what ever we demand of them
  
  The Green Party agrees to support the Labour Government by not opposing votes on matters of confidence and supply for the full term of this Parliament. In addition, the Green Party will support the Labour Government on procedural motions in the House and at Select Committees on the terms set out in this agreement.
  
  4 2
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  October 31, 2020 4:41pm
  - alwyn
    
    Oh dear.
    Browning, and I mean Robert not Steffan, got it right.
    To parody his work I would have to describe this as people such as former Green MPs Locke and Bradford would say.
    “Just for their bums in the Beemers they left us,
    Just for the word ‘Honourable’ in front of their names.” etc.
    They are very cheap to buy aren’t they?
    Still what did one expect? After three years of travelling in the up-market manner of a tax-payer supplied limo James Shaw couldn’t possibly go back to travelling in a taxi. After all you can’t possibly know who among the common folk might have been sitting there before you.
    
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    October 31, 2020 8:58pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  hahahahaa! the Greens got well shafted!
  
  Again
  
  🙂
  
  5 1
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  October 31, 2020 6:06pm
- sooty
  
  Too bad if the green members reject it!
  Will they want Chloe to be leader?
  
  4 2
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  October 31, 2020 6:39pm
- kwkiwigirl
  
  Shaw obviously couldn’t bear to lose all the ministerial baubles. Must have got to used to them. Will be interesting to see if he continues to throw stones at Labour after accepting this deal.
  
  1 1
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  October 31, 2020 9:27pm
kowtow

Journo must have been looking out the window……

‘But whether or not the deal is accepted is up to the a group of Green Party delegates, who are debating weather or not to accept it right now.’

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/decision-2020/labour-offers-greens-confidence-and-supply-arrangement
4 2
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October 31, 2020 5:00pm
Happychappy

Wow Nationals nine years of neglect in state housing has taken a turn in fortunes as Labour has now been caught using Nationals policy by selling old state houses to tennents that want to own their own home.
https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300146319/election-2020-labour-caught-selling-off-state-homes-to-tenants-after-rubbishing-national-policy
So it seems there is one rule for Labour and Jacinda Ardern and another for those that Jacinda needs to score political points against, what a bunch of hypocrites Jacinda and Labour are.
9 2
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October 31, 2020 5:04pm
Fletch

Kamala Harris – her and Joe’s first job will be to get rid of Trump’s tax cuts.

https://twitter.com/TrumpWarRoom/status/1322313887107239936

Anyone who votes for them is an idiot…
6 2
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October 31, 2020 5:51pm
Flossie

The PM ….blah blah blah …Greens…blah blah
“But that’s not how I do politics”.
The woman has such an ego. How about “it’s not how our party (or Labour perhaps?) does politics.”
She is more and more unaware that she is part of a government, not the whole thing.
Let’s try to remember Jacinda, that there’s no “I” in Team.
9 3
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October 31, 2020 6:09pm
Robert

Ted Cruz vs Twitter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_LB3Y51CTg
3 1
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October 31, 2020 6:25pm
Surely Knott

Possible: Keeping virus out of country.
Not possible: Keeping drugs out of a festival.

Have they got drug dogs at the entrance to the festivals?
0 0
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November 2, 2020 10:24am

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Highlights

The Kiwis are fleeing
Inflation by term
Houston we have a problem
Our immunisation disaster

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Graham Adams: Chlöe Swarbrick’s education in disaster management
Breaking Views
"Whate'er thou canst not clearly say thou know'st not."
Not PC
Sowell says
Hompaddock
Declining PhD student numbers are a warning sign for NZ’s future knowledge economy
Point of Order
Treasury says one thing in a speech but quite another in the BEFU
Croaking Cassandra
Utah’s The Independent is Right, Climate Activism Ignores or Harms the World’s Poor
Utopia
A short history of National’s fascination with boot camps
The Standard
Hysteria Playing Here Soon
No Minister
The Planet is melting – at some point we are going to have to admit this
The Daily Blog
Foreshore and seabed 2.0
No Right Turn
Interchange fees
Offsetting Behaviour
Climate Change is NOT a Major Problem
NZCPR
A TRICKY LEGAL POSER
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Who is JD Vance and is he a social conservative?
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
NRL Predictions for Round 21
Stats Chat
Still the 5 Eyes Achilles Heel?
Kiwipolitico
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

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