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May 31, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 31 May 2021

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General Debate

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Happychappy

State of emergency in Canterbury as ‘red warning’ weather turns rivers into torrents.Just like the disasters this Government keeps making and the failures they keep dishing up the rivers have broken their banks and towns with farmland are like torrents from the sea.
So let’s face it and ask the next question how are we going to pay for this next disaster as our Earthquake and Natural Disaster funds must be getting close to dry as New Zealand goes from one catastrophe to another over the last few years.
Well isn’t it lucky we have our Celebrity Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern in charge and our whizz kid Finance Minister holding the purse strings to help create more publicity how they will fix this problem and send our children with their children in to greater debt that they will take year to clear.
Will Jacinda Ardern ditch Scott Morrison the Australian Prime Minister in Queenstown to chase votes with hugs and love to the people affected like she has with every other tragedy or disaster that has engulfed New Zealand in her time as Prime Minister or will she give the job to Grant Robertson to weave his magic and come up the billions that will likely be need to fix this one in a a hundred year disaster that they are calling this.
https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/300320443/state-of-emergency-in-canterbury-as-red-warning-weather-turns-rivers-into-torrents
I wonder whether Maori would be prepared to pay their share of this as they want to have their share of everything else that New Zealand has.
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May 31, 2021 8:00am
- graham
  
  You make an interesting point in your last paragraph, Happychappy.
  
  We are constantly being reminded that Maori are the guardians of our waterways. If they wish to claim guardianship, then surely they must take responsibility for looking after – or maintaining – those waterways.
  
  If those waterways cause property damage, can we sue the guardians of the waterways?
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:49am
- RockyJ
  
  Your last point is interesting. When Maori have ownership of the water, seabed and foreshore will they be liable for any damage caused by these assets? Just saying
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:52am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Here’s a hint. It won’t be maori.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:13am
  - Keith White
    
    When someone drowns in the Wanganui River, which is a Person, how is the Person punished – should the local iwi not be held responsible for not vetting that Riverperson properly?
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:24pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Try as I might when I look at ScoMo I see a competent leader of a Western Government. When I look at Cindy I see an incompetent trying to lead a banana republic.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:31am
  - TWEEDSE
    
    It is such an embarrassment seeing them together. Scomo, a world class leader. Cindy acting like the milk monitor.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:56pm
  - Unity
    
    I felt embarrassed for ScoMo when he had to rub noses with our PM. For goodness sake, she isn’t Maori is she? Why on earth do we do this? It gives me the creeps. I wonder how he enjoyed being so up close and personal with the PM when I’m sure he doesn’t even like her?!! We’ll all be going back to grass skirts very soon the way things are moving in the direction of all things Maori.
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:03pm
    - JibberJabber
      
      Heh, I reckon he did it on purpose, she didn’t look to happy about it and it would have made her look like a **** if she’d tried to dodge it. LoL ?
      
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      May 31, 2021 2:07pm
      - Sacha
        
        AND, she isn’t vaccinated –
        
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        May 31, 2021 4:43pm
    - Goatie
      
      I agree – absolutely cringeworthy!
      
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      May 31, 2021 6:40pm
  - Faroffsound
    
    In Australia for the most part the grown-ups are in charge.
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:40pm
    - jon
      
      Just watch a sitting of the Aust Parliament on Sky News you will note the quality of their MPs. Unlike the the NZ Parliament in session where you soon realize so many arent there on merit.
      
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      May 31, 2021 3:54pm
      - igm
        
        None of the Aussies have bar codes on their chins . . . and that is a merit.
        
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        June 1, 2021 7:39am
- MCos
  
  In Dec 2019 there was major flooding of the Rangitata River further to the south.
  Most of the responsibility for flood protection lies with Envirnment Canterbury Regional Council.
  From their web site
  “The flood event was beyond what the Rangitata flood protection scheme was designed to withstand (about 1500 cumecs).
  The river protection scheme, primarily funded by those farmers and landowners who benefit from a level of flood protection, is discussed annually at a rating district committee meeting.
  The recommendations then go to Council for consideration in the Annual Plan process.”
  One imagines it will be the same in this area.
  BTW
  The acting Emergency Management minister was in Ashburton over the weekend.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:44am
  - sooty
    
    Fly in on Saturday. Has he left yet?
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:48am
    - MCos
      
      No
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:34am
- Bloody Dago
  
  When everything turns to crap unless Ardern is sent packing, this is the outcome is a possibilty within ten years for New Zealand, just replace Columbia with Australia and Venezuela for New Zealand in this report from the “once lucky country”:
  
  High unemployment and difficulty in accessing food and other basic necessities have forced millions of Venezuelans to flee the country in search of a better life. Hyperinflation has devalued the Venezuelan bolivar by several orders of magnitude, compounded by wages that have fallen far behind the inflation rate. The U.S. dollar is now often used as currency, but it cannot be transferred between banks. The “dollarization of the private sector” has led salaries to grow by 22.7% from January 2020 to January 2021 as almost half of salaries are now paid in dollars. A study from the Venezuelan Observatory of Finance on workers’ salaries also found that private sector workers make around $70/month versus public workers who make $4.70 per month.
  
  These factors have created a complex humanitarian emergency (CHE) in Venezuela and surrounding countries, particularly Colombia. This emergency has become much more intense because of COVID-19. While COVID-19 initially brought many refugees back to Venezuela, shortages of fuel, electricity and clean water have caused riots and renewed emigration in the fall of 2020.
  Despite having the world’s largest oil reserves, Venezuela is experiencing critical country-wide fuel shortages due to a lack of refining resources. These fuel shortages, along with shortages of natural gas, electricity and clean water – all caused by a lack of infrastructure maintenance – led to an average of 25 demonstrations daily in September 2020, according to the Venezuela Observatory of Social Conflict, as reported by the Associated Press.
  
  Though Colombia officially closed its border with Venezuela in March 2020, this has only served to increase the danger while doing little to nothing to stop the flood of people leaving Venezuela. Instead of crossing at official points, the lack of options is forcing people to use illegal border crossings where they are subject to extortion demands by border gangs. At the end of April 2021, two NGOs – Human Rights Watch and the International Crisis Group – drew attention to the problem of increasing violence along the Colombia-Venezuela border. On March 21, 2021, Venezuelan armed forces launched an offensive reported to be against a faction of the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) located in the Venezuelan state of Apure. There are reports that the presence of the military and the armed insurgents has resulted in raids on family homes, death threats and assaults by military and police, along with many other human rights abuses. As a result, more people are fleeing across the closed border in dangerous ways by using illegal routes and human smugglers.
  Overview
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  Source: Policía Nacional de los colombianos
  Overview
  Venezuela has been in the midst of a severe political and economic crisis for several years, which has been worsened significantly by ongoing political turmoil. The humanitarian, health and economic challenges are more complicated because of a significant ongoing leadership conflict between Nicolas Maduro, who won a heavily disputed election in May 2018, and Juan Guaidó, leader of the National Assembly, who proclaimed himself president on Jan. 23, 2019, using a constitutional provision. The United States and dozens of other governments around the world recognize Guaidó as the interim president. China, Russia and several other countries, as well as the Venezuelan military, have declared their support for Maduro. Maduro denies that there is a humanitarian crisis in the country and blames sanctions from other countries for the existing problems. Aid, including food and medicine, is being stockpiled in Brazil and Colombia, but Maduro’s forces are not allowing it to reach Venezuelan citizens. Clashes between the military and aid organizations or Venezuelan citizens are common when officials attempt to make aid deliveries.
  
  High unemployment and difficulty in accessing food and other basic necessities have forced millions of Venezuelans to flee the country in search of a better life. Hyperinflation has devalued the Venezuelan bolivar by several orders of magnitude, compounded by wages that have fallen far behind the inflation rate. The U.S. dollar is now often used as currency, but it cannot be transferred between banks. The “dollarization of the private sector” has led salaries to grow by 22.7% from January 2020 to January 2021 as almost half of salaries are now paid in dollars. A study from the Venezuelan Observatory of Finance on workers’ salaries also found that private sector workers make around $70/month versus public workers who make $4.70 per month.
  
  These factors have created a complex humanitarian emergency (CHE) in Venezuela and surrounding countries, particularly Colombia. This emergency has become much more intense because of COVID-19. While COVID-19 initially brought many refugees back to Venezuela, shortages of fuel, electricity and clean water have caused riots and renewed emigration in the fall of 2020.
  
  Despite having the world’s largest oil reserves, Venezuela is experiencing critical country-wide fuel shortages due to a lack of refining resources. These fuel shortages, along with shortages of natural gas, electricity and clean water – all caused by a lack of infrastructure maintenance – led to an average of 25 demonstrations daily in September 2020, according to the Venezuela Observatory of Social Conflict, as reported by the Associated Press.
  
  Though Colombia officially closed its border with Venezuela in March 2020, this has only served to increase the danger while doing little to nothing to stop the flood of people leaving Venezuela. Instead of crossing at official points, the lack of options is forcing people to use illegal border crossings where they are subject to extortion demands by border gangs. At the end of April 2021, two NGOs – Human Rights Watch and the International Crisis Group – drew attention to the problem of increasing violence along the Colombia-Venezuela border. On March 21, 2021, Venezuelan armed forces launched an offensive reported to be against a faction of the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) located in the Venezuelan state of Apure. There are reports that the presence of the military and the armed insurgents has resulted in raids on family homes, death threats and assaults by military and police, along with many other human rights abuses. As a result, more people are fleeing across the closed border in dangerous ways by using illegal routes and human smugglers.
  
  In addition to the land crossings with Colombia, desperate residents along Venezuela’s Caribbean coast are turning to a dangerous water route in hopes of reaching Trinidad and Tobago, only 15 miles (24 km) off the coast. The New Humanitarian says: “But in order to get there, they have to cross the Bocas del Dragón (Mouths of the Dragon) – a dangerous waterway known for human smuggling, narco-trafficking, shipwrecks, and even piracy – before hoping to slip past immigration officials upon landing in Trinidad.”
  
  In late 2019 and early 2020, researchers at the Andres Bello Catholic University performed the equivalent of a national census in the absence of an official government census. They were only able to interview just over half of their desired respondents because of COVID-19; of the 9,932 households interviewed, more than 96% of the population lives in poverty according to income levels. Venezuela’s economic situation continues to worsen with a year-over-year inflation rate of 3,500%. Once the country’s primary economic driver, the oil industry has been reduced to a single producing well.
  As of March 2021, more than 5.6 million Venezuelans had left their homes, with approximately 4.6 million of them in other countries in the region, primarily Colombia, Peru, Chile and Ecuador.”
  
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  May 31, 2021 12:01pm
krazykiwi

With the benefit of hindsight, governments could be forgiven for making poor quality decisions about the lives and welfare their people. What cannot be forgiven is the weapons-grade hubris that manifests as a pathological aversion to subsequently admitting any error, and then doubling down with lying and manipulation of data to defend their actions.

We are starting to see more of this phenomena as evidence of the net harm caused by lockdowns goes mainstream, evidence of the low/zero efficacy of masks gathers pace, and as bodies charged with maintaining statistical records increasingly place their fingers on the scale.

This latter category has become a defense of choice for lying leaders. The strategy is simple. First, quietly manipulate any inconvenient evidence and obfuscate if anyone raises concerns – much easier if the media are in your pocket as their probing can be irksome. Then sometime later cite the data you fraudulently manufactured as evidence of your value to the people you have surreptitiously deceived.

Here is an example from a comment I made on 23-Feb in respect of just-published child poverty statistics:

Here’s the 2019 data commentary from DPF based on the Stats data published in Feb 2020

Child poverty in Labour’s first year increased on seven of the nine measures and dropped on only two of them.

Yet now, after Stats ‘technical revisions to methodology used to produce these statistics’ we can see that [in respect of 2019 data] seven measures of the nine measure have now IMPROVED, while just one has declined.>

Labour have clearly manipulated the statistical model, not simply to hide the truth, but to re-write history in a favourable light, one they can point back to. It is industrial scale lying, and sadly not challenged by our predominantly ineffectual media.

There are countless examples of the type of tampering. One I highlighted last week was the CDC manipulating ‘break through infection’ data to prop up vaccine effectiveness.

This week the CDC have been at it again, this time by declaring that asymptomatic infections in fully vaccinated people would not be included in the statistical analysis of vaccine efficacy.

This comment sums both of CDC’s recent manipulations well.

From the beginning of the so-called pandemic, waves of asymptomatic cases were deliberately created by running unreliable PCR tests on 100,000s of perfectly healthy people every day.

The entirely predictable false positives were called cases, and these manufactured cases of Covid19 were used to build up the illusion of a global plague.

This was a prolonged campaign of deception in order to bring about sweeping changes in the construction of our society.

To this point asymptomatic cases have been the backbone of the Covid narrative. But now the CDC has attempted to remove them from the reckoning by instructing medical labs and hospitals around the country to stop looking for them, but only in those who have had the vaccine.

This is a new prolonged campaign of deception, spinning the narrative that these untested, experimental vaccines truly are effective against a pandemic that was built on statistical smoke and mirrors.

In short: before the vaccine they needed asymptomatic infections to create a problem, after the vaccine they are actively hiding asymptomatic infections, because their existence undermines their solution.

Politicians have always lied and manipulated to varying degrees. What is different now is that the traditional media has been stacked with sycophants, and/or bribed into submission. At the same time the God-like power of new media has been unleashed on anyone who dares question the ascendency of the global elite.
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May 31, 2021 8:00am
- graham
  
  Very well said, kk.
  
  On a related note, I have found it interesting to observe how politicians and health experts have used the phrase “the benefits outweigh the risks” recently, when justifying their positions:
  
  (a) We must have Lockdowns: Even though lockdowns adversely affect people, their wellbeing and their jobs suffer, they are necessary to make sure that people don’t die. The benefits outweigh the risks.
  
  (b) We must take the Vaccine: We know that some people will have adverse reactions to the vaccine, and in some cases may even die – but taking the vaccine is necessary to ensure that the rest of the world is safe. The benefits outweigh the risks.
  
  Remember how we were all told that we had to do our part and follow the lockdown laws so that Granny didn’t die? Now apparently we all have to get the vaccine, even though we know that some otherwise healthy people WILL die as a result.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:25am
  - Keith White
    
    I wonder why so often, logical reasoned propositions attract downticks. If you want to downtick graham’s post, go ahead, knock yourselves out, but why not at least attempt to refute* his assertions by logic and reasoning, yourselves?
    
    (* your heroine’s favorite phrase…)
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:02am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      Refude.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:14am
    - Wayne Mapp
      
      Because both prior posts are effectively anti lockdown and anti vaccine. I note that Kiwiblog is becoming quite a repository of anti vaxers (in the comments, not DPF). Of course they are dressed up with all sorts of arguments, but the intent is clear enough. Krazy and many others on the site are adamantly opposed to all the covid vaccines. I might note Pfizer is the most effective with the least amount of side effects.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:08am
      - graham
        
        For the record, I am not anti vaccine. I will most likely get the vaccine when it is my turn, although I have no particularly pressing need (in my early 50s, no underlying health issues, and no plans to travel anywhere in the next year or so).
        
        My post was more of an observation at how cynically those people who would advise us can change their tune depending on the circumstances.
        
        In situation (a) the reasoning is that if we don’t do x then people may die. Therefore we must do x.
        
        In situation (b) the reasoning is that we must do y even though people may die.
        
        (a) People may die; therefore we must do x.
        (b) We must do y; even though people may die.
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:41am
      - krazykiwi
        
        What I am opposed to is the agenda which denies individuals the information they need, or rather the information that they are entitled to under the Nuremburg Code, as part of making their own, informed decision. I have been vaccinated for a laundry-list of illnesses, and once Stage-III clinical trials have been completed and efficacy and risk data can be reviewed I will make a decision about whether of not to get a Covid-19 vaccine (or gene therapy).
        
        So you misrepresent me.
        
        Again.
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:46am
      - grumpy
        
        Has our Dear Leader had her vaccination yet? Curiously, although widely speculated that she hasn’t, it is the one thing that the media is not rushing to publicise about her………
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:57am
      - kevn
        
        @WMapp…. I don’t see ‘anti-vaxxers’ per se, but people questioning and finding issues, only with the covid jab process.
        I’m certain they have all had the measles/mumps and the other true immunity type vaccines.
        So, not anti-vaxxers are they ?
        
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        May 31, 2021 11:14am
      - gravedodger
        
        So The ex government empowered, we know best is suggesting anyone declining with, completely understandable natural reluctance to accept the words of people who will never be held to account, as anti vaxers. Nice one Wayne.
        A male who clearly had little exposure to the truly daunting outcomes for those who went to Thalidomide as a drug relief for Hyperemesis Gravidarum so common in pregnancy that resulted in rather sad deformations of babies including life ending damage. Estimated at around ten thousand affected pregnancies before the world woke up with a death toll at forty percent, that drug resulted increased extensive trialling and testing for pharmaceuticals that could have a decade of such activity before a new and never tried line of development might be released as a relief. That the Rona vaccines have been accelerated to around one tenth of that time, should be accepted as something to be at least questioned without those asking being denigrated and boxed as “Anti Vaxers”
        
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        May 31, 2021 11:25am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        Not anti vax, in fact very PRO vax.
        I have been anti lock down from the beginning.
        Because, I actually read the “Influenza Pandemic Response Plan, c2017”
        Where lock down is only mentioned as a LAST resort.
        First thing to do , considering we are an Island chain in the middle of the Pacific (they phrase it as “geographical location”), is to “Keep it out”…shut the border.
        But by the time our useless PM got round to doing anything significant, it was already here.
        She panicked and locked down the economy.
        Then spent the next year with the “We went early and hard” lie.
        Using what has come to appear to be her mentors advice.
        “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
        Joseph Goebbels
        
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        May 31, 2021 1:06pm
      - Juliet2554
        
        I am not anti vaccine. I am anti this vaccine. It is a new type of vaccine as it doesnt include the actual virus. It is fast tracked, FDA approval for emergency use only & still in clinical trials for 2 more years. I am not a guinea pig.
        I am definitely anti lockdown.
        
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        May 31, 2021 1:35pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        When folk here vote for National in 2023 I wonder how many of them will consider how many other Wayne Mapp’s they just voted for: “Right- Wing” people more than happy to slime their opponents as “anti-vaxxers” and such like, just as would any Labour or Green partisan.
        
        Good to know though.
        
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        May 31, 2021 3:06pm
      - Batman
        
        Or are probably encouraged knowing that 95% of the candidates are not broken-brain anti-vax ninnies!
        
        Might swing me back from ACT if they get their shit together and denounce fringe crap from both sides
        
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        May 31, 2021 3:14pm
    - Rumpole 294
      
      Lefties don’t do logic, they replace it with emotion and ego aided by lies & deceit.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:56am
  - Batman
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Graham, nobody who is otherwise healthy will die. There is simply no way you can make that claim in good faith.
    
    It makes the rest of your argument look like a groundless scepticism and a desire to resist something simply because of political colour.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:05am
    - kevn
      
      @bat… Drop in again, say 5 years on with your reassurance. The Pfizer trials won’t be completed until 2023.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:14am
      - Batman
        
        Yeah nah bro
        
        “Pfizer and BioNTech Conclude Phase 3 Study of COVID-19 Vaccine Candidate, Meeting All Primary Efficacy Endpoints | pfpfizeruscom” https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-conclude-phase-3-study-covid-19-vaccine
        
        I’ll enjoy my vaccinated lifestyle, once the list gets to young healthy folks like me
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:39am
      - kevn
        
        @bat 9.39am… A Pfizer website endorsing. Really ?
        There are concerns from medical and vaccine developers about the medium and long term effects.
        Simple as that. Bro.
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:09am
      - Greg Ettridge
        
        “Enjoy my vaccinated lifestyle”
        It is a wonder you walk across the street in case you get run over.
        They tested over 20,000 in Victoria in a day, .02% tested positive.
        They now have over 250 hotspot sites and 40 cases.
        one person is in hospital.
        Batman, just stay home it is really dangerous out there.
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:30am
      - Pharmachick
        
        It doesn’t matter when the original close date was. They all had a priori interim analyses built into the protocol, the interim analysis showed efficacy and safety, hence early finish.
        
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        May 31, 2021 12:58pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      There are a lot of cases where people have developed blood clots in days following vaccine and died. It’s low (about 10 per million) and about 2 per million die – call it 10 deaths to vaccinate NZ population, far worse than most vaccines.
      
      I favour vaccination, but there will be a body count.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:35am
    - Matt Long
      
      I’m confused Batman, are you talking about the Vaccine or Covid 19?
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:57am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Risk/benefit is undertaken by so-called experts who use whole population averages, and authorities subsequently attempt to plan responses that target the ‘average person’.
    
    The problem, of course, is that there no such thing as an ‘average person’ so an planning to manage the
    unquantifiable is doomed from day-1.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:07am
    - Fidel Cashflow
      
      Our technocracy is populated by people who deal mostly in the abstract: models, what-ifs etc. Abstractions are wonderful things and are the hallmark of human cognition, but most of us have to approach our daily lives with regard to ‘in concreto’ versus ‘in abstracto’ calculations.
      
      I saw the other day that prominent technocrat-celebrity Michael Baker was calling for the Tokyo Olympics to be cancelled because “people will die” if they proceed. So what Michael? Maybe people other than you in your well-funded and secure Ivory Tower may wish to take the risk.
      
      Real life is full of trade-offs. Most of us address all the information at hand, accept the risks and act in accordance with our own free will. This guy would have us locked down so nobody dies ever if he could. But of course, he’d be deluded to think that could possibly beat mortality.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:42am
  - redeye
    
    Pfizer has said that they cannot know how long it vaccine will be effective for. They’re only guaranteeing it for 6 months as they only have data for six months. They say it may be effective for 12 or more and they’ll know more when the time passes.
    My question is, if they don’t know if it’ll be effective in 12 months how can they also claim it wont be dangerous in 12 months?
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:01am
    - oldfella
      
      Redeye, If I get both shots next month as planned, I’m confident Chippy and co are already organising the next round of vaccines in either 6 or 12 months, depending on how long this one lasts.
      After all, we are front of the queue. Eh, Chippy?
      And I just know our MSM will keep grilling him to make sure our gummint doesn’t drop the ball. /s
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:11am
  - krazykiwi
    
    As as aside, the mRNA “vaccines” created by Moderna and Pfizer are in fact gene therapies. They fulfill all the definitions of gene therapy and none of the definitions for a vaccine.
    
    mRNA contain genetic instructions for making various proteins. mRNA “vaccines” deliver a synthetic version of mRNA into your cells that carry the instruction to produce the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein, the antigen, that then activates your immune system to produce antibodies.
    
    Moderna and Pfizer both admit that their clinical trials aren’t even looking at immunity. As such they do not fulfill the medical and/or legal definition of a vaccine.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:22am
    - Matt Long
      
      One of our family doctors isn’t overly impressed with either the efficacy or the safety of the vaccine, https://www.covidplanb.co.nz/data-science/an-open-video-from-nz-gp-damian-wojcik/
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:02am
      - Pharmachick
        
        Pfizer is efficacious and safe. The trials are published. GPs generally don’t get clinical trials design or analysis in their training (I spent the first 20 years of may career, including training in Med Schools, and still teach them). On the other hand Epidemiologists, Pharmacologists, Pharmacometricians etc do.
        
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        May 31, 2021 1:01pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Pfizer is efficacious and safe
        
        I’m surprised you feel comfortable asserting that. For me a determination of ‘safe’ can start to be considered once clinical trials have been fully completed, even more important given the record-breaking speed with with these vaccines/gene therapies have been developed, and also the novelty of the mRNA mechanism being used.
        
        I’ll accept these are ‘safe’ once they’ve been FDA approved (EUA does not constitute FDA approval), and subsequently used for several years. Remember, it took five years after the initial licensing of Thalidomide before anyone realised Thalidomide crossed the placental barrier and caused serious birth defects.
        
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        May 31, 2021 2:25pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Please don’t use Thalidomide as an example. About 10 years ago they found a filing cabinet in a building in Germany that was about to be demolished. Grunenthal KNEW about the suspected teratogenic safety signal, in nurseries from their own workers. It’s also very disrespectful to the surviving Thalidomide babies and their families.
        
        Also, Thalidomide was never approved in the US due to the heroic efforts of a woman called Frances Oldham-Kelsey. Both bureaucrats and drug company lobbyists tried to constructively dismiss her from FDA. Its a hell of a story (here if you’re interested): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frances_Oldham_Kelsey
        
        Similarly Astra has not received EUA in the USA…
        
        Finally to those that say the mRNA vaccines are gene therapy not traditional vaccines, that’s actually kinda correct – they use a different type of technology that is more closely aligned with gene therapy. But they’re still vaccines as they stimulate immune response (B-cell and T-cell immunity).
        
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        May 31, 2021 3:05pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        I’d not heard of Kelsey. What a courageous woman. Retired at 90! Had she been working today she would no doubt have been slimed as an anti-vaxxer.
        
        What I said about gene therapies isn’t “actually kinda correct” … it is technically 100% correct. If you want to classify a vaccine as something that ‘stimulates an immune response’, then by that definition a virus would be a vaccine!
        
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        May 31, 2021 6:39pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    All vaccines have risks, the MMR vaccine kills some recipients, but the important point is that the risk/reward ratio is very positive. The MMR Vaccine risk is about 1 per million, the disease risk is about 1 per 10,000 or so (orders of magnitude, not exact !). Thus taking the vaccine is very beneficial in general if unfortunate for rare individuals.
    
    With the Covid vaccines, we are still finding out about the risk/reward ratio. And for some age cohorts that ration could be negative. It is relatively early (one reason why vaccines typically take 2-3 years to develop is that the extended stage 3 trials take at least 2 years to complete) and the early numbers may well change.
    
    In one review of data from I believe Denmark, for people under 20 the vaccine risk is around 3 x the disease risk. On that basis vaccinations for young people should not proceed until either ew research clarifies the issue, or the safety of the vaccine is improved. To continue is completely unethical. Just to note, better figures may already exist, I continue to look for such numbers and if anyone has links they would be appreciated. This sort of analysis is of course subject to new information.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:17pm
    - Pharmachick
      
      The Denmark data is specific to the AAV vaccines (Astra, J&J). And you are correct, this is why Canada doesn’t allow Astra as a first dose anymore, and Aus only for 50+. CAN is re-evaluating whether they will allow Astra as a second dose, province by province.
      
      Data out of Ontario showed the risk for women 30-40 at 19/million (1/55,0000) and 40 – 50 10/million). I could have taken Astra a full month before my age group came up by registering with a pharmacy in BC. As one of the above is my age group, no way José, I waited for my Pfizer shot.
      
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      May 31, 2021 3:09pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    I pointed this out in Another argument that is no longer off-limits:
    
    But the real point I want made clear here is that what Walensky is saying has previously been declared to be completely off-limits for over a year by the powers that be. In fact, it’s the kind of thing that has often gotten right wing-leaning sites in trouble with the social media censors of FaceTwit and company.
    
    Yet, here is the Biden administration saying what was previously labeled as taboo, just because it now fits their narrative, which is driven by the motivation to reduce the death count rather than increase it because the latter would blow up the vaccination programmes. Meanwhile, the media don’t question it, and the social media overlords just shrug
    
    The argument put forward by none other than the head of the CDC when questioned about Covid-19 vaccine deaths:
    
    CDC Director Rochelle Walensky, somewhat confusingly, says they are aware of 223 people who have died with covid after being vaccinated.
    
    “Not all of those 223 cases who had covid actually died of covid. They may have had mild disease but died, for example, of a heart attack.”
    
    Well yes.
    
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    May 31, 2021 3:14pm
- crikey
  
  Comment by Rafael Nadal today: “We wouldn’t be where we are today without the media.”
  
  Ring any bells?
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:26am
  - pdm
    
    Except he earned his status and maintains very high standards.
    
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    May 31, 2021 8:56am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Gobels?
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:15am
  - Biscuit
    
    crikey, speaking of Nadal, the French Open have honoured him with a nifty statue at Roland Garros:
    
    https://www.tennis.com/baseline/articles/roland-garros-unveils-rafael-nadal-statue
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:37pm
- Simon
  
  covid-19: Three weeks ago i looked Italy, academics said we were 3 weeks behind: Lets go back to Mar 18/Italy = average age of positively-tested deceased is /-81 years. 10% of the deceased are over 90 years old. 90% of the deceased are over 70 years old.
  
  80% had two or more chronic diseases 50% had three or more chronic diseases. (cardiovascular problems, diabetes, respiratory problems,cancer) Less than 1% of the deceased were healthy persons, i.e. persons without pre-existing chronic diseases.
  
  https://twitter.com/adamscrabble/status/1246261726624067585
  
  For US 600,000 covid related deaths. At 1 % 6,000 are heathy people. So far the Ro Vaxxs in US have killed 4,000. The Ro vaxxs are unsafe as they are still experiments. 4,000 dead should have stopped the Vax roll out.
  
  At 1% Ro vax will end up killing more healthy people than the Ro itself.
  
  For sure take the Ro vax if you are in the danger range. 70 yrs plus with heart problems or cancer.
  If you are healthy think about the risk. The state shouldn’t force healthy to take the risk on a unsafe and unproven vax.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:34am
  - I remember when
    
    US covid deaths:
    Donald Trump: 18 Mar 2020-22 Jul 2020 (127 days)
    147,691 Deaths.
    Why 18 March: That is when the first wave of covid deaths started to peak sharply.
    Joe Biden: 21 Jan 2021-27 May 2021 (127 Days)
    182,735 Deaths.
    Trump:
    No initial immunity to impede transmission.
    No vaccines to help reduced numbers and increase immunity.
    Some available information was conflicting as ‘new’ virus.
    Biden:
    Vaccines became available early in Presidency.
    Better treatment of those with covid reduced deaths.
    At least 10% of population already had some immunity from earlier infections.
    Nearly a year’ knowledge of control methods.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:01am
    - Batman
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      This is totally dishonest. You’ve cherry picked the first wave and ignored the second and third waves which were much larger.
      
      The desire to save Trump’s disgraced record is just so desperate. Get over it.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:08am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        A little bit of butt hurt there Batman?
        
        The partisan reporting of the facts of convenience are the a large part of making any reasonable analysis of this whole covid shit, difficult to say the least.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:19am
      - Batman
        
        No not at all, just tired of shady clever dicks trying to virtue signal how great the snake oil salesman was, using increasingly thinly sliced examples.
        
        You’ll be terribly disappointed to learn I have plenty of other things to think about today ?
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:36am
      - WaveyDavey
        
        Trump: 400,000 deaths in 10 months* (1,333 deaths per day)
        Biden: 156,000 in 3 months** (1,591 deaths per day)
        
        I hold no brief for Trump but (a) the figures are more than comparable and (b) the virus is gonna do what the virus is gonna do
        
        * https://khn.org/news/nation-records-400000-covid-deaths-on-last-day-of-donald-trump-presidency/
        
        ** https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/04/30/fact-check-post-detailing-covid-deaths-under-biden-ignores-trend/4889416001/
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:20am
      - Batman
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Devoid of all context, you can make data do almost anything.
        
        You’ve left out important context such as the poisoning of the well for political purposes, open resistance against common sense distancing and hygiene measures, encouraging a patchwork states response that doomed the entire country to failure.
        
        Trump left a completely fucked system, aside from the vaccine which was too complex for him to interfere with other than provide cash and green lights for it, and the Biden Admin has been cleaning it up as best they can with 30% of the population refusing to participate because they want to show fealty to their political god in Florida.
        
        They’re not remotely comparable.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:29am
      - I remember when
        
        No, you are being dishonest.
        Just ignore the Trump/Biden part of the figures.
        You have repeatedly stated that the lack of sense has resulted in increased deaths, without acknowledging the facts don’t entirely support this.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:33am
      - I remember when
        
        Second wave deaths in the US did not exceed those of their first wave.
        Third wave yes.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:38am
      - WaveyDavey
        
        You mean like your 2nd and 3rd wave comment?
        
        Which btw is incorrect as the 2nd wave led to fewer deaths than the first – it’s deaths not cases that we’re discussing
        
        And if Trump’s response was so bad (which it most certainly was) what does that say about the higher daily death toll under Biden?
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:05am
      - Greg Ettridge
        
        A Cherry picked gem for you
        The covid death I am impressed with the most, is the young guy that rode his motobike into the back of a truck at high speed.
        I would have thought the sudden impact of the truck would have had some affect, no he died of covid, tested positive months before.
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:35am
      - sooty
        
        Maybe that’s the reason he run into the truck!
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:55am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Correction:
      Vaccines became available early in Presidency.
      Should read
      Vaccines being administered at the rate of
      1 000 000 per day early in in Biden Presidency.
      NB which included Biden himself, which he tried to claim there was no vaccine before him.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:25am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        early in in Biden Presidency.
        double check…should read in week BEFORE Biden inauguration.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:47am
- RockyJ
  
  Great insight krazykiwi. The gold standard of both data manipulation and story manipulation is the climate change cult. Not saying our NIWA manipulates data (for insight into serious data manipulation look up Michael Mann, the inventor of the hockey stick, and his battles to keep his data out of the scrutiny of US courts) but they twist the story.
  Whenever we have a hot day NIWA scientists show up in the media saying things like “third hottest month since records began etc”. Don’t mention that accurate records only began around 1990. When we have a cold period (like this autumn) they are strangely quiet.
  Another tactic of NIWA is to find hot spots in the ocean, something that has happened all time and that none of us can experience directly.
  The third strategy is to tweak a computer model to produce a scary future prediction of out of control warming. A University climate scientist did this recently to a conference of ski field facility owners at a conference. Yet as John Christy has shown all but one of the hundreds of climate models have seriously overestimated warming in comparison to what has happened.
  Finally, the most outrageous manipulation of data in this field was the “97% of climate scientists…” claim. But that is a long story for another time- my thumb hurts.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:48am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    NIWA joined in with the deception revealed in the leaked HADCRUT emails –how to manipulate data to increase apparent global warming.
    Dishonesty from UK’s premier Met Office.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:52am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Yes Rockyj,
    
    The “97% of climate scientists…” claim wasn’t even a manipulation of data. It was all bogus – a claim with no evidence what so ever. It was a fabricated stat, with no substance to it. It was pulled from thin air.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:05am
    - RockyJ
      
      Indeed. John Cook did a survey of climate scientists asking if they thought human activity was the main driver of our warming trend. Of those who had an opinion either way 97% said “yes”, 3% said “no”. However, what he ignored was that out of the total number surveyed 64% said “I don’t know”.
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:32am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      The computations for the 97% were actually quite elegant. Everything else was sidelined and the result based on a very small part of the sample.
      
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      May 31, 2021 12:08pm
      - RockyJ
        
        Yes. Survey manipulation can be really simple. Like the Newshub survey on preferred prime minister when there is one choice from the left (Queen Jax of the Plague) and four from the right- Judith Collins, Simon Bridges, Christopher Luxon, John Key.
        
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        May 31, 2021 1:26pm
- Happy1
  
  Because excess deaths in countries like the U.K. were greater than the number of deaths attributed to Covid there was speculation that the surplus excess deaths were caused by the lockdown I.e. delayed medical treatment, suicides etc. However that was discarded after data from N.Z. and Australia, both of which had hard lockdowns, showing a drop in deaths, a death deficit. The surplus excess deaths were, obviously, unattributed covid deaths.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:02am
Than

Well, it was probably inevitable it would happen at some point – somebody is genuinely advocating we give up industrial civilization in order to save the planet.

No. Not negotiable, not even remotely on the table.

Trying to look on the bright side, I guess it’s good that they’re acknowledging the limitations of renewable energy. But I don’t think they quite grasp how much of a reduction in quality of life would be required to meaningfully reduce our energy use. The author may be willing to live an ascetic existence in dedication to environmental puritanism, but sorry I am not. Like I said, that is totally non-negotiable. Living with climate change is by far the lesser evil.
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May 31, 2021 8:03am
- graham
  
  Unfortunately your link is to a Stuff article, and I refuse to visit their website (I wearied of being told that as a pale stale male of British descent I represent all that is wrong in this country), so I can’t read it.
  
  But surely this has been happening for years to varying degrees. There seems to be a never-ending chorus of people who would basically have us give up many of the advances that have made our lives easier over the past 150 years, in order to save the planet or some endangered snail.
  
  And like you, I’m damned if I’m going to give up the vast swathe of modern-day technology and make my life considerably harder. If these hippies want to walk everywhere, grow their own food and use scythes to cut their lawns, good for them. But don’t expect me to.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:03am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Caves are not known for manicured lawns, the scythes would be redundant.
    
    Caves are know for being cold and damp which may well bring a premature end to the Luddites.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:23am
    - kowtow
      
      Ha, and another thing the “anti industrials” always fail to mention in their denigration of so called fossil fuels , be it coal or more recently petrols.
      
      Without those there’d literally be no forests left .
      
      Not to mention how unhealthy all that charcoal cooking was for the wimmins and children in those dark smokey hovels the Greens think was paradise.
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:08am
  - Than
    
    Oh, sure, the whole concept of a back-to-nature, simpler lifestyle has been around for ages.
    
    But traditionally this has been a matter of individual choice. There have been plenty of people who advocate such a lifestyle, but few who advocated forcing it on people against their will.
    
    Now that the issue is being framed in terms of climate change and hyperbole about the end of the world things become different. People who genuinely believe this may feel it is necessary to compel this sort of lifestyle on everybody whether they like it or not.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:53am
    - kowtow
      
      Back to nature is ok for the rich and the few hippies still around whose brain cells haven’t been fried yet .
      
      Meanwhile in the real world the impoverished rural masses still make their way to the urban industrial cities to try and make their lives a bit more bearable , to get an education for their numerous children and to stop having to tread through the shit that surrounds their hovels all day long .
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:12am
- hullkiwi
  
  Than, giving up our industrialised style of life is a blunt way of saying we have to change our ways if we are to continue sustaining life on this planet. While the tenor of the author’s views may be extreme, if we don’t change our ways life will become unsustainable. In the next 30 years, it is forecast that the world’s population will increase by 50%. In order to sustain this extea population, there will be greater demand for food production and exploitation of resources to sustain life styles. Given you don’t want to give up your lifestyle, how do we ensure future exploitation of the planet is done in a sustainable manner? And taking this point one step further, how do we determine what a sustainable life style is and how would we enforce such a mantra?
  
  Reality is, the human population is growing at rate in some areas of the world that is unsustainable; and humankind is more ravenous in our use of resources than any other species on earth? Who says it is this current eras’ right to consume as much as we do, with little thought for the future?
  
  The reality humankind will face over the next 100 years will include: 1. What is a sustainable population on earth? 2. How to address/reverse the damaging impacts on the environment, that have been because of human activity.
  
  This is not a right versus left debate – it is about humankind continuing to survive on the “3rd rock from the sun” and on a planet where we have exploited more finite resource in the past 200 years, than in the previous 50,000 years. All because “we want a better standard of living”
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:52am
  - Than
    
    hullkiwi, your argument seems less about climate change and human impact on the natural environment (which are the focuses for the linked article) and more Malthusianist, i.e. that population growth cannot continue indefinitely.
    
    The standard rebuttal to that is to point out that similar predictions have been made multiple times before. And so far every time they have failed to materialize. In each case new developments have led to more efficient use of resources, permitting the population to grow larger than it otherwise could have.
    
    Of course there is no guarantee this pattern will continue into the future. But to date it has held.
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:20am
    - Ian Boag
      
      The standard rebuttal … failed to materialize
      
      Until it does. The biggest “new development” for food was the green revolution. Basically driven by new plant breeds and nitrogen fertilisers. The latter made possible by the infinite supply of natural gas . Also there is more and more irrigation from wells that draw on ancient (non-replenished) water deposits. All “capital” stuff, not income.
      
      Mining the oceans for fish also looks like it could well run out of steam (or at least diminish significantly) in a non-geological time frame. We will just fish further down the food chain until Friday night dinner is plankton and chips …
      
      more efficient use of resources – we got better at mining stuff – ie able to extract more quicker. If you want to call that “efficient” we can agree to disagree ..
      
      There’s a good book I read a while ago – “When the rivers run dry” (Fred Pearce) … Well researched – not alarmist – just the facts about major rivers like the Mekong, Yangtse, Colorado, Murray and a whole lot of others.
      
      Leaving aside the CO2/warming thing … There is a KB faction that sees this as something between harmless and “plant food”. I doubt that “natural”(?) CO2 will ever supplant urea as a food growth promoter. Noone ever gets into where ocean acidification will take us.
      
      These are issues about how to sustain what happens now, not how to cope with a 50% population increase ….
      
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      December 31, 2014 6:04pm
  - ISeeRed
    
    Hilarious. You literally reference the fact we are just one of several planets in the solar system yet fail to see the bigger picture. One average asteroid also contains more mineral ore and metals than what we’ve “exploited” in the previous 50,000 years. Imagine if we could eventually relocate all heavy industry and mining activities to the solar system and make Earth one giant nature reserve? No ecosystems to pollute or indigenous people to colonise, just barren rocks, hard vacuum, 24/7 solar energy and mineral wealth a billion times what we have on Earth. Expanding into the solar system and becoming a thriving spacefaring civilisation is certainly a more hopeful and exciting future to offer our children than climate crises, systemic racism and eventual eco-collapse.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:10pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      Fruit loop stuff. Have a look at what it costs for a sub-orbital space ride and do some sums about planting a few million people on Mars …..
      
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      May 31, 2021 6:16pm
      - ISeeRed
        
        As fruity and loopy as heavier-than-air vehicles, splitting the atom, breaking the sound barrier, and many other concepts that were once science fiction or “impossible”.
        
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        May 31, 2021 7:55pm
Raphael

I see that RNZ has a puff piece on Mahuta: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/443639/nanaia-mahuta-s-words-matter-but-is-there-more-than-meets-the-eye

I want her to publicly acknowledge one things: Is Taiwan a country and does it deserve to exist?
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May 31, 2021 8:04am
- cmm
  
  Her answer will be something like this:
  
  The dragon needs its nest and the taniwha its own too.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:09am
- Maggie Pie
  
  My partner’s mum txt a link to an article in ‘The Spinoff’ last week, where they have referred to Nanaia as….”a wombat with a barcode”
  
  😀
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:17am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    That’s really funny. But it does have a serious side. She will not be taken seriously in some countries because of her appearance. And in Japan people will recoil. I’m not promoting this behaviour. It is simply a fact.
    
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    May 31, 2021 8:37am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      The Japanese foreign ministry officials will not be fazed by the NZ Foreign Minister’s appearance, since they are professionals; however, the average Japanese TV viewer will not know what to make of this obese woman with a facial tattoo.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:12am
      - Paulus
        
        They will think she is a Yakuza looking possible person and be feared so there.
        
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        May 31, 2021 3:30pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Love it!
    
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    May 31, 2021 8:45am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I want to know too ?
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:33am
- peterwn
  
  She (as with any other NZ Foreign Minister) can never declare Taiwan is a country. China would only establish diplomatic relations with NZ on the basis that NZ broke off diplomatic relations with Taiwan which is just what Norm Kirk did. If NZ tried to re-establish formal diplomatic relations (a ‘two China’ policy)with Taiwan all hell would break loose with China and all Foreign Ministers from the 1970’s to the present has recognised this reality. NZ does have a pseudo embassy in Taiwan which is called an ‘information office’ or the like and its head is a career diplomat.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:40am
  - sabre
    
    So we should just roll over and do what the filthy CCP virus inventors wants?
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:20am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Yes, in order to get our biscuit.
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:29am
      - Biscuit
        
        Loddenthinks, leave our Biscuit ALONE!
        
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        May 31, 2021 10:09pm
  - Raphael
    
    I don’t think they should. But I think with the Wuhan mess, the Western world should collectively punish China by formally recognising Taiwan.
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:15am
- oldfella
  
  Raphael, I think Mahuta should check first with John Cena re Taiwan’s status.
  He’ll tell her it’s a big problem to ‘wrestle’ with.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:19am
artemisia

There was a column in the Spectator recently by Matt Ridley. Referred to Ludwig Erhart as the creator of the post war German economic miracle. He said that an economist later summarised the Erhart actions as

Don’t just sit there, undo something

National / ACT – are you listening?

(Found it on his blog – https://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/repeating-post-war-mistakes/)
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May 31, 2021 8:04am
- cmm
  
  Germans have always been inventive and industrious. No other country could have staged two world wars without masses of external support and survived as long as they did.
  
  Take away their oil and they make it from coal and get it going in a few months rather than the 10 years it would have taken anywhere else.
  
  Sure they used some forced labourers as slaves etc, but so do Libya and they’re a basket case. It was really German ingenuity that kept them going as long as they did.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:45am
- Tom Hunter
  
  It was also covered in a 1978 Reason article: The German Non-Miracle.
  
  I appreciated the fact that one of the reforms was that laborers working over-time were allowed to retain almost 100 percent of all extra pay. Things like that sparked an economy that had been hit with a supply shock rather than the more usual demand shock. All economies have been hit with the former due to lockdowns and I don’t think Keynesian approaches will work:
  
  Industrial output increased 50 percent within the year, and national income, which had fallen 20% below that of 1936, was restored to that level in just over a year and continued to climb fast. Unemployment did climb and peaked at 10.4% by 1950, but steadily dropped for the rest of the decade.
  
  Morever, this approach beat the publicised plans of the proponents of central planning. Their “Long Term Plan of 1948 predicted that by 1952-53 the industrial production would reach 110 percent of the 1936 level and agriculture 100%. Another study done in 1950 by four German research institutes – which supposedly already took account of things like the Marshall Plan, the Korean War and the success of the Freiburg plan to that date – said that five years would be needed by government planners to hit their goals – and needed another $1.5 billion in US aid beyond the Marshall Plan.
  
  Under the Freiburg plan all those targets were met and exceeded: Industrial production in 1952-53 averaged about 150 instead of 110. Net agricultural output was 111 percent of pre-war instead of 100. The overall balance of payments was highly favorable and even the dollar sector was approaching balance.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:38am
cmm

I see the prison that was partially burned down is now being rebuilt at the cost of $750M. By the time it is actually built we can expect that to blow out to $1bn.
$750M for a 500 prisoner facility. $1.5M per crim (or more like $2M when it is finished).

Insane.

That got me wondering about what these bastard criminals costs society.

In just dollars and cents, they are responsible for the costs of all the prison services (massive building/asset costs + approx $100k per inmate per year).

They are also responsible for approx 75% of our police budget. Sure, we’d still need cops to sort out traffic accidents and look for lost children etc, but the majority of their time is soaked up by criminals.

The same too for the judicial system which employs some of the highest paid civil servants + defence layers etc. Sure, we still need some for civil cases, but criminal cases are more than 50% of those costs.

Then there are the other factors. Without criminals you would not have to lock your doors. No need for alarms, security cameras etc. No need for security guards. No need for passwords or PINs on your ATM card. All these cost us an arm and a leg in time, inconvenience and money.

Groceries, and everything else we buy, would be cheaper. Shoplifting, and store security, ultimately gets paid for by the consumers.

As we throw up security walls around us, we weaken our interactions with other people. This has detrimental impacts on many people.

Criminals tear at the very fabric of society. They should not be housed in $2M-per-bed facilities.
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May 31, 2021 8:05am
- artemisia
  
  Cheaper to identify the worst and the young wannabes and park police cars outside. And/or just pay them more generously if they stay out of trouble.
  
  Think laterally.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:25am
  - Keith White
    
    Hang ’em high for murder, rape, child molestation. Pour discourager les autres…
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:05am
- stewmar
  
  Criminals tear at the very fabric of society. They should not be housed in $2M-per-bed facilities.
  
  What do you propose as an alternative?
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:38am
  - Nickc2
    
    A prison consisting of used shipping containers. These can be added and recycled as required to suit various requirements. Prisoners can carry out the necessary modifications such as fitting toilets etc themselves. Meals will be served in containers through a slot in the door likewise linen changes etc.
    Who says prison cells must resemble 5-star accommodation FFS?
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:15am
    - Sacha
      
      You’d give them linen? Clean linen?
      
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      May 31, 2021 5:08pm
Nukuleka

Interesting statistic about murder in the USA. 3% of the population are responsible for 51% of murders. And that 3%? Black men aged between 16 – 44.
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May 31, 2021 8:09am
- Keith White
  
  We never get the analogous figures for NZ because, partnership, colonization, rayyycism, something or other.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:06am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Someone said to me once…
  “There are very few really, really bad people in this world, ……they just get a round a lot.”
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:16am
- Ruawai
  
  Probably similar stats for those that are murdered.
  Not rocket science why police arrest more black men in USA and BLM protest about this fact!
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:31am
Maggie Pie

For those who may have missed it last night, here’s the link to…. ’60Minutes.

https://youtu.be/8d3Lyk_vlW4

The takeouts for me, were Jacinda constantly saying to the Aussie interviewer…. “I reject the premise of your question” and, just how old Mike Hosking is looking these days.

(I did try leaving a comment about the Hosk’s saggy jowls, but comments were turned off)
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May 31, 2021 8:09am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, rising at 3.30am Mon to Fri with only weekends, public and school holidays off does age you. Look at any breakfast host over the years and notice this.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:43am
- Yabster
  
  Cindy looked weak and upset at actually being asked a hard question by someone in the media- clearly she’s not use to that- she was fully prepped for wedding questions however…
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:06am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Thanks Maggie
  for those that don’t have time to watch the whole thing, Jacinda being questioned around 16:25 is interesting. She is not happy.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:42am
- greybeard
  
  What I took from that program was:
  – Michael Barnet has been bought-off
  – The Aussie winemaker has principles
  – The guy from ASPI was brilliant
  – Our “PM” dislikes mature questions
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:02am
  - Yabster
    
    Barnet was embarrassing- sat there with a smirk on his face the whole time.
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:47am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Yes, what a weasel. An embarrassment to any kiwi who believes in standing up to bullies.
      
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      May 31, 2021 1:50pm
- Rumpole 294
  
  I guess Mike Hoskins will now answer arderns unacceptable/untrue answers with – I reject the premise of your answer – adding not based on facts etc.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:47am
Vory v zakone

CDC data shows over 200,000 Adverse VAERS Reports after COVID Vaccines, including 943 among 12 to 17 Year-olds

VAERS data released last week showed 227,805 reports of adverse events following COVID vaccines, including 4,201 deaths and 18,528 serious injuries between Dec. 14, 2020 and May 14, 2021.

Of the 4,201 deaths reported as of May 14, 23% occurred within 48 hours of vaccination, 16% occurred within 24 hours and 38% occurred in people who became ill within 48 hours of being vaccinated.
https://21stcenturywire.com/2021/05/28/latest-cdc-data-show-reports-of-adverse-events-after-covid-vaccines-surpass-200000-including-943-among-12-to-17-year-olds/
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May 31, 2021 8:10am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I don’t have time to address this properly. But the vaccine did not CAUSE 4,201 deaths and 18,528 serious injuries in the USA over the last six months.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:42am
  - Batman
    
    The short version is that there is a government hosted list of people who have died, for any reason, and had received a vaccination recently.
    
    This is done to enable researchers and the industry to check and detect any patterns or points of concern.
    
    If you get a vaccine then get into a drunken late night fight with an alligator, you go on the list.
    
    If you get a vaccine then cheat on your wife and she kills you, you go on the list.
    
    If you get a vaccine and you’re 85, then die of natural causes three months later. You go on the list.
    
    The list is absolutely not a list of people who died from vaccines. To say so either means you have been hoodwinked, or you are actively lying to push a stupid agenda.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:00am
    - Keith White
      
      OK BM let’s play your game.
      
      If you get a positive over-cycled PCR test then get into a drunken late night fight with an alligator, you go on the Covid Dead list.
      
      If you get a positive over-cycled PCR test then cheat on your wife and she kills you, you go on the Covid Dead list.
      
      If you get a positive over-cycled PCR test and you’re 85, then die of natural causes three months later. You go on Covid Dead list.
      
      The Covid Dead list is absolutely not a list of people who died from the XiVirus.
      
      See how that works…
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:08am
      - Batman
        
        Keith you don’t have an argument so you’ve chosen another pet peeve to argue with?
        
        You get an F. Try again next time.
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:15am
      - Keith White
        
        Ah BM you never fail to disappoint when the occasion appears to you to enable an ad hominem insult 🙂
        
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        May 31, 2021 9:57am
    - krazykiwi
      
      I have every confidence that some of VAERS deaths will be purely coincidental. I am equally confident that people are dying as a consequence of taking vaccines. I would be happy to be proven wrong, but the evidence suggests I am right.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:18am
  - krazykiwi
    
    I don’t have time to address this properly
    
    You’d need more than time, Benedict. You’d need data, and lots of it. So far we have unexplained correlations that provide some cause for concern, and for further investigation.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:21am
    - kevn
      
      @kk… There are concerns but buried in all the other data.
      kti.org.nz has info.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:31am
- JackRabbit
  
  VAERS data released last week showed 227,805 reports of adverse events following COVID vaccines, including 4,201 deaths and 18,528 serious injuries between Dec. 14, 2020 and May 14, 2021.
  
  And these are only the short term effects! And we won’t know about effects on future pregnancies and childbirths for years to come.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:15am
- Pharmachick
  
  Those numbers include people that report a sore arm from taking the vaccine!
  
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  May 31, 2021 1:14pm
krazykiwi

Some extracts from a helpful ‘New Normal’ Lexicon:

Infection fatality rate (IFR): Probably the most important metric in assessing the lethality of a pathogen, IFR is the percentage of infected people who die. For SARS-CoV-2 the current estimate is between 0.24% and 0.15% – for comparison bad flu is between 0.1 and 0.2% and rabies is 100%. Due to its vital importance, IFR is never mentioned by the mainstream media and most people have no idea what it means.

Variant: something 99.7% identical to an original thing, but with a scary name and good PR e.g. “the quadrupal super-deadly [insert random geographical location] superspreader variant”

Expert: Someone occupying an eminent position in academia who says the right things.

Source of misinformation: Someone occupying an eminent position in academia who says the wrong things (cf. ‘Expert’)

Adverse reaction: Totally coincidental illness or death following vaccination.

The Science: A subset of scientific knowledge which cannot be challenged on the basis of empirical data or repeatable experiment because it has been ‘settled’ by the consensus between the subset of ‘experts’ who adhere to it.
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May 31, 2021 8:20am
- 70andstilllearning
  
  kk – Expert? – still equals drip under pressure me thinks.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:32am
- tf78
  
  krazy, I watched Nick Hudson from Panda interviewed by Rowan Dean yesterday, he was excellent at allaying the Covid myth.
  http://www.pandata.org
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:41am
- Happy1
  
  KK, what is the basis of your IFR of 0.15%? Who’s estimate are you using? If you go on worldometer they typically have a rate for many countries of 3.5%. The thing is while the number of deaths are generally known, the other figure, the number of people infected is unknown and people like you can use whatever figure suits to give the results you want. South Korea tested,tested, tested and they would have located most people who were infected. Their IFR is around 1.5%.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:34am
  - krazykiwi
    
    The basis of my assertion is 25 published studies. Lots of fascinating stats in there. The IFR graphs with/without inclusion of nursing homes are particularly interesting.
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:29pm
- Happy1
  
  KK, 0.2% the total UK population have died of covid. (Excess deaths) but only about 15-20% of the population have had covid at most. Your fatality rate of 0.15% is nonsense.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:42am
  - krazykiwi
    
    If you want a huge IFR … try Feb 2020, Lombardy, 80+ yrs. The IFR is 30.4%!!
    
    Or August 2020, England, < 40 yrs . The IFR is 0.03%
    
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    May 31, 2021 2:36pm
krazykiwi

DPF, comment delete is still broken. I’ve had a quick look and can’t find a solution (not a WP guru), but solving this one would reduce the Mod’s workload. Does anyone out there know the fix for this?
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May 31, 2021 8:27am
- cmm
  
  This is a While they’re fixing that, it is probably worth adding a “do you really want to do this” Yes/No to REPORT.
  I’d wager that well over 90% of reports are erroneous and are caused by fat finger disease
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:52am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Yup, I’ve managed to report myself a few times 😉
    
    10 1
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    May 31, 2021 8:56am
    - Keith White
      
      With the March of Communism in NZ, we’re gonna need an ‘I Denounce Myself’ option.
      
      16 2
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      May 31, 2021 9:10am
    - Local Miller
      
      That’s a stupid bug. Since they can disable the Tumbs up/down buttons on your own comments, they should be able to disable the Report option on your own comments.
      
      Mind you, I’d love it if they made the colour of the Ticks match the colour of the Tumbs up/down. Why are they both Green?
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:37am
  - Inandout
    
    cm, so easily done but maybe if the ‘report’ was in red it may be more noticeable, even to those who are colour blind.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:30am
  - Biscuit
    
    Oh, I 100% agree with you, cmm.
    
    I hit ‘REPORT’ by accident – I swear its an accident – and then I blush with the embarrassment of knowing that some already-overworked Mod is going to have to wonder ‘But why is that wonderfully-tolerant, drop-dead-gorgeous, salt-of-the-Earth Biscuit reporting THAT innocuous comment?’
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:46pm
Happychappy

Can someone please explain why the Health Minister, Prime Minister and others are allowing the Hongi to be used as a greeting between the likes of our Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and their Prime Minister Scott Morrison.
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/ardern-morrison-write-new-pages-in-covid-19-rulebook-during-today-s-formal-talks?auto=6256693337001
Is there a rule for some in New Zealand especially with the latest Covid-19 breakout in Australia and not for others as it is not a good look or hygienic when you have a pandemic like Covd-19.
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May 31, 2021 8:27am
- tf78
  
  Happy, hygiene aside, I would have thought it was culturally inappropriate for two whities.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:43am
  - stewmar
    
    Happy, hygiene aside, I would have thought it was culturally inappropriate for two whities
    
    Where is the Maori party outcry over this?
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:03am
  - Unity
    
    I was embarrassed for ScoMo. Fancy having to be up close and personal with someone he probably doesn’t even like!! It needs to stop or just be limited to those of Maori descent. It makes me shudder.
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:16pm
- Inandout
  
  Happy, an Aussie commentator on Hosking found the whole saga cringeworthy. Shows how bloody false all this Covid propaganda is.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:46am
- Frank the tank
  
  It’s woke101. Get used to it. It ain’t going away anytime soon…….
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:51am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Yep,
  
  but if you check our Covid-19 directives, you’ll see that we are only to suspend Hongi at Level 2
  
  https://covid19.govt.nz/health-and-wellbeing/protect-yourself-and-others/maintain-physical-distancing/
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:17am
  - JackRabbit
    
    However if Covid-19 is as bad as Ardern suggests then it would be a good demonstration of principles and setting a good example.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:20am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Is Ardern Maori? What rights does she have to cultural appropriation?
  Are there no rules that woman does not break?
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:56am
  - Jack5
    
    Ay, there’s the rub, as Hamlet said.
    
    – (Act 3, Scene 1)
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:20am
- Clyde
  
  Bogie sharing is an apt description for this “custom”.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:10am
- Greg Ettridge
  
  So Scomo buggers off to NZ while 6 million are in locked down.
  Then starts snogging the NZ PM whilst a family in Warrnambool can only have 10 at a funeral for a little boy who drowned on his first camp.
  You really couldn’t make this shit up.
  So we can add to the list, its not just sportsmen and actors that are totally immune to the China virus.
  He is rightly being slagged out for what is happening in Victoria, particularly regional Victoria, this will not assist his cause.
  I notice the boyfriend standing there folding his arms,……..by definition
  “By folding one or both arms across the chest, a barrier is formed that is an unconscious attempt to block out what we perceive as a threat or undesirable circumstances.”
  Maybe they took his phone off him this time so he didn’t play with it. dummy spit of some sort.
  
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  May 31, 2021 2:07pm
MCos

You forgot to mention that Waikeria Prison was earmarked for a $750mill rebuild before that recent riot.
Every society has its bad bastards. That is never going to change & if some people got their way we’d be building twice, three times as many prison.
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May 31, 2021 8:29am
- Happychappy
  
  It doesn’t mater what crime people that go to jail for it alway Traumatizes the victims and many victims carry that in their minds for years , so are you saying these murderers, rapists, sex offenders, those that commit violent assaults, thieves and defrauders don’t belong in jail and we really don’t need more prisons to house them.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:51am
- cmm
  
  I have no problems building prisons for bad bastards.
  
  What I am opposed to is spending $2M each to house them.
  
  What’s wrong with shipping containers? $20k/prisoner tops? Get the prisoners to help in the construction too. They might actually learn useful skills and turn their lives around (like the recent guy who learned his farming trade in a prison farm).
  
  Yeah I know we’ll never be rid of crims, but you can understand why previous societies did not tolerate their destruction and would hang thieves.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:01am
  - Keith White
    
    Reopen the Rangipo Farm and have them widen the Desert Road to 4 lanes by pick and shovel, sleeping in tents like early gold miners, and wearing pink jumpsuits. Enforced by (as per the movie ‘Wedlock’) explosive collars for the really bad, and shock collars for the bad.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:12am
    - Nickc2
      
      You’ve got my vote Keith.
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:00am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Never closed.
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:24am
  - MCos
    
    So what you’re saying is these scratch beneath the surface and all these homicide (9.3%), rapists (22%), assault (20%), fraudsters(2%) are fully trained tradesmen who can be relied on to build high tech correctional facilities?
    A third are on remand.
    A fair chunk are illiterate – not the fraudsters.
    At least about 80% are low to medium risk so they might be well behaved, but that might change if you treat them like shit.
    Some people might say that’s what they deserve. I suppose that depends on what sort of person you want to emerge at the other end.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:14am
    - cmm
      
      No I am not saying that at all.
      
      What I am saying is that these generally completely unskilled people could provide some of the labour & effort in building accommodation.
      
      I’m not saying they should design it, but anyone with an IQ over 5 can cut a 2×4 (with some supervision if needed) and swing a hammer or do some painting.
      
      “At least about 80% are low to medium risk so they might be well behaved, but that might change if you treat them like shit.” therefore we should make prison pleasant so that we don’t upset the inmates?
      
      Look, if someone learns something and does something constructive – maybe for the first time in his life – then he’s far more likely to end up going straight.
      
      Based on recidivism rates what we’re doing is not working.
      
      The vast majority of remand prisoners are evil buggers too. Most are there because they are too risky to bail. Most of them get convicted then get time off, so they are really just doing their time in advance.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:40am
    - Nickc2
      
      Who sez they have to emerge?
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:01am
lifesgood

It was reported on The Outsiders, Sky News, yesterday that a couple of states in India have been using Ivermectin to treat covid and their number of cases has plummeted by up to 80%. If this is true it is a scandal of mammoth proportions throughout the world. All the hundreds of thousands of lives lost purely because Trump recommended Ivermectin as a treatment. Orange man bad. What an absolute disgrace. The hatred of the left knows no bounds.
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May 31, 2021 8:30am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I know Pharmachick disagrees but IIRC Ivermectin has shown to be effective in trials.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:44am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Even if it was only 5% effective, that could have been 175 000 lives saved.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:12am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Check out Proven treatments for Covid 19. I’ve been following the Fluoxetine (aka Prozac) trial and the early efficacy reports are positive.
    
    3 1
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    May 31, 2021 9:32am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    A site that lists and updates meta-analyses for all studies on drugs for early treatment of covid
    https://c19early.com/
    
    Ivermectin has >90 studies to date, 55 peer reviewed, 95% of which have shown benefit, averaging out to reducing risk of death by about 80% in prophylaxis. https://ivmmeta.com/
    
    Here’s an evidence based prophylaxis + outpatient treatment regime developed by a group of doctors. (Which seems better than than do-nothing approach widely pushed by govts):
    https://covid19criticalcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/FLCCC-Alliance-I-MASKplus-Protocol-ENGLISH.pdf
    
    Over the counter safe stuff that looks useful includes vitamins D and C and zinc – no downside to everyone making sure they are getting enough of these. Melatonin and Ivermectin need prescriptions.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:58am
    - artemisia
      
      Melatonin can be obtained as a pharmacist prescription, doctor not required. This is not widely known. Believe there is an age limit though (over 55?).
      
      Much much cheaper to import direct.
      
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      May 31, 2021 1:25pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        I wouldn’t be messing round with melatonin if I was you. It has central effects in the brain (pineal gland) and regulates [partially] sleep/wake cycles.
        
        Ivermectin doesn’t work. I’m telling you I get DAIY summaries of clinical trials from Public Health Canada (1-8 pages) M-F and they’re 1-8 pages long, since March 2020. We only assess trials 250 or greater. None of them have shown benefit, and they terminated the ivermectin arm early in the Recovery trial because it was so useless.
        
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        May 31, 2021 2:02pm
  - Rumpole 294
    
    But its so expensive 10c a tablet compared to the cheaper vaccine @$7 each plus nurse to inject, if you were big pharma or a socialist govt spending up big with an announcement about a forthcoming announcement which would you pick – sarc.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:00pm
  - Juliet2554
    
    why are India’s cases dropping off a cliff then? Seems to be working.
    
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    May 31, 2021 3:09pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Trump was talking about hydroxychloroquine. But IMO Ivermectin is a good potential prophylactic and treatment. Off patent and cheap though, so the phar as will make no money.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:51am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Several medical professionals have confirmed:
    
    The four main treatments used are:
    [1] Doxycycline. (off patent)
    [2] Hydroxychloroquine.
    [3] Ivermectin.
    [4] Fresh air and sunshine. You can count on one hand (and still have free fingers), the number of documented cases of people contracting Covid-19 while at the beach. Patients wheeled outside into the sun and fresh air during the day recovered better and quicker than those lying in hospital beds.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:26am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Texas prof also recommended use of an antibiotic to handle opportunistic lung infections and specific anti-clotting agents that ameliorate the effects of micro-clotting in the same tissue. Plus Vitamin D if enough sunlight is not available.
      
      The odd thing is, with these now proven prophylactic treatments available and for that matter, dirt cheap, why isn’t NZ and others instituting them ?
      
      And with the greatest respect for Pharmachick, I don’t think she is up to speed on these treatments, or perhaps puts too much emphasis on the early and now withdrawn studies that showed that HCQ in particular was not helpful for severe hospitalised cases – which was never the claim in the first place BTW, and has the look of a deliberate attempt to fabricate opposition to the use of HCQ when appropriate.
      
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      May 31, 2021 12:29pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Hi Ed,
        
        thanks for the bullshit reply which can be basically covered as “Simply . I’m not to speed? Good shit everyone? hahah non-scientific carry-on”
        
        Even if I thought you would have enough expertise, not just a degree or two, but experience enough to be put on a national task force, I suspect you’re just a dilletante, screaming onto the [educated] wonderments.
        
        STOP WASTING MY TIME, IDIOT!
        
        3 2
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        May 31, 2021 5:16pm
    - Sacha
      
      We used to wheel the TB patients in their beds, out into the sun for their daily doses of Vit D in the TB wards. And that was 60 years ago –
      
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      May 31, 2021 5:39pm
  - Pharmachick
    
    No
    
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    May 31, 2021 5:38pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  My point at the time
  These drugs (ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquil)
  Are previously approved drugs with safe records, over a long period.
  At worst they would have had a placebo effect on Covid19.
  But theories and now results point to effectiveness against the disease…so why not try it on a large scale.
  As the desperate Indians are doing, with what appears to be good results.
  If they had, in their TDS, not blocked their use, it appears from the Indian experience, we may have saved 100,000’s of lives.
  So yes, .
  The hatred of the left knows no bounds.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:02am
- Bloody Dago
  
  Hatred by the left is a deeply “rooted” psychoses’ that has no cure
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:51am
Paulus

Am pleased to see Scott Morrison receiving a true Aotearoa Maori reception and a snog on the nose from Ardern. Ugh !
Presumably this is her way of subjecting to and saying thank you for the Maori returnees.
Would love to know what he really thinks of her and vice versa.
Would be a great comedy act as they are diametrically opposite in just about everything.
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May 31, 2021 8:34am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I am sure he thinks she is a twit.
  
  30 2
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  May 31, 2021 8:45am
  - Ruawai
    
    He is spot on!
    
    17 0
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    May 31, 2021 9:35am
  - Bloody Dago
    
    Useful idiot more likely.
    
    8 1
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    May 31, 2021 9:54am
    - sooty
      
      For what exactly?
      
      8 0
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      May 31, 2021 11:05am
- lifesgood
  
  Why did a European do a hongi? How bizarre. If any European tries to give me one they’d better watch out. I heard the Australia correspondent on Hosking this morning feeling sorry for Morrison. As he said “Fancy having to rub noses with someone you don’t like” ?
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:53am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Is Ardern trying to breathe life into Australia again?
    
    8 2
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    May 31, 2021 9:58am
  - JackRabbit
    
    “It’s bad enough I don’t like it, but do I have to rub my nose in it? What are my chances of catching rampant socialism?”
    
    10 1
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    May 31, 2021 10:29am
  - Unity
    
    I said as much above. It really makes me cringe with embarrassment for Morrison. I’m sure he doesn’t even like her so being so up close and personal must have required enormous acting ability on his part not to show his disgust. I was so sorry for him. Is Ardern now a pseudo-Maori?!!
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:20pm
- Gravelroad
  
  bwhahah- and then she kissed him!
  Did you miss that bit?
  The hypocrisy of these conceited politicians knows no bounds.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:58am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    If I was Scott, being kissed by Ardern, I’d be looking around for the carpenters……………….
    Preparing my crucifixion.
    
    15 2
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    May 31, 2021 9:06am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    What’s she trying to do? Does she want the job of kindycare on Manus Island that badly?
    
    10 1
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    May 31, 2021 10:00am
- Jack5
  
  Sonny Bill Williams hopes to meet Scott Morrison in Queenstown and lobby him into accepting New Zealand’s Jacindarella’s offer to take Nauru refugees Australia doesn’t want.
  
  Will Sonny Bill hongi Morrison? Do Muslims hongi at all?
  
  Some Muslims won’t even shake a non-Muslim’s hand. Will Sonny Bill hongi also with Jacindarella? Or would a Muslim be horrified at the thought of hongi-ing a female?
  
  Does a hongi comply with safe practice during a pandemic? Would it be okay if the noses were washed straight afterwards? Or could a hongi be safely done through a mask – sort of prophactically?
  
  Is to hongi, a borrowing from Maori since there is no English equivalent, to be a transitive verb or an intransitive verb?
  
  To hongi … or to hongi with … that is the question. Who nose?
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:51am
  - Paulus
    
    I see overstayer Beyruht Boochani on Television telling us to take Manus criminal refugees.
    Why has he not been apprehended and deported.
    And Christchurch Uni have given him a well paid paid job.
    
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    May 31, 2021 3:39pm
    - Jack5
      
      Behrouz Boochani is one of two Ursula Bethell writers in residence at Canterbury University for this year, and he’s a senior adjunct fellow at the university’s Ngai Tahu Research Centre.
      
      Here’s the university’s description of Boochani’s project for the year:
      
      “… a short story collection named Ghobad, which is the story of indigenous generations in pre-modern Kurdistan. The work will be written in the Kalhori dialect, which has been systematically suppressed and is in danger of dying out, and it will then be translated into English.
      
      Writing in the Ngai Tahu centre of the university in a dying dialect of Kurdish.
      
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      May 31, 2021 8:48pm
RW Capitalist

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/29/world/europe/boris-johnson-married-carrie-symonds.html
What a difference to our silly girl, who announces hers as part of a political distraction.
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May 31, 2021 8:36am
- MCos
  
  By the time you’ve had as many weddings as he has they just like going to the hairdresser.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:18am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Perhaps a relevant comment by you, may solicit a response?
    
    3 1
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    May 31, 2021 12:51pm
  - Dougal10
    
    Similar things can be said of the fisherman.
    
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    May 31, 2021 4:53pm
Yvette

A person with suppressed name was clearly identified on a television news bulletin yesterday evening. Which may mean the suppression is now revoked. But how does one know that or question it when the asking of such a question with any detail allows that name to be available, even if it still has a suppression order on it.

This is one stupid consequence of suppression when the media have previously named the person – one cannot unread something they have already read. You can neither ask about it without identifying details that reveal to anyone else the means of identifying the person, nor can you actually legally report it without the same happening.
Nor can you point out convincingly how fucking moronically silly it is without giving away the same information.

Earlier a news media outlet ran an article on the suppressing of this particular person’s name and “Related News” headlines, accompanying that article, linked to another item which gave the name.
Meanwhile Google sits there usually ready to provide the information that is suppressed in New Zealand but available to the rest of the world.
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May 31, 2021 8:38am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The person has been frequently named in the MSM news.
  
  You are just not meant to connect the dots that the NZ/Australian citizen who had her Australian citizenship revoked is the woman who is being returned to NZ.
  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-56080282
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:23am
Rusty

Why are the global warming alarmists always quiet when natural disasters like the mass flooding in Canterbury happened in the weekend?

I thought the earth was meant to be getting hotter not colder!

Yet these experts are telling us the world wont be around in 30-50 years — which is convenient because many of them probably wont be alive in the future to know either way.

Weather and climate forecasters can’t even get the weather predictions for the weekend correctly all the time but they know what’s going to happen in the future??
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May 31, 2021 8:39am
- surfing
  
  A warming climate also means wetter and a greater chance of extreme weather events.. your point has backfired on you in a rather big way.
  
  No reputable expert made the claim the world will be gone in 30-50 years.
  
  You are looking at centuries rather than decades, even then, the world will never be ‘gone’. At least until the sun’s hydrogen is depleted causing the sun to expand and destroy the earth.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:24am
  - Local Miller
    
    “A warming climate also means wetter and a greater chance of extreme weather events”
    Actually this premise is wrong. As the climate warms, the band of extreme temperatures narrows, with higher “cold” conditions and a reduced temperature differentials. It’s the high temperature differential that results in extreme weather, so a warmer climate results in molder weather. This is quite easy to check historically.
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:49am
    - surfing
      
      Actual scientists beg to differ…as opposed to kiwiblog armchair experts …
      
      https://www.epa.gov/climate-indicators/weather-climate#:~:text=Scientific%20studies%20indicate%20that%20extreme,storms%2C%20floods%2C%20and%20droughts.
      
      https://www.nationalgeographic.com/climate-change/how-to-live-with-it/weather.html
      
      https://climate.nasa.gov/blog/2956/how-climate-change-may-be-impacting-storms-over-earths-tropical-oceans/
      
      https://niwa.co.nz/education-and-training/schools/students/climate-change/impacts-for-NZ
      
      https://www.science.org.au/learning/general-audience/science-climate-change/5-how-are-extreme-events-changing
      
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      May 31, 2021 1:39pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Well, at least the Weather gurus haven’t tried to tell us that this flooding is an unprecedented event for Canterbury.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/your-weather/9795243/Records-show-extreme-weather-history-repeats-for-Canterbury
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:27am
  - Flossie
    
    Good heavens….I’m sure I read something this morning about it being a “one in one hundred years” event!
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:47am
    - Bob
      
      This Canterbury disaster is about the fourth ‘one-in-one hundred-year’ weather event in the last twenty years!
      
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      May 31, 2021 11:01am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Just like a “particular month” had the hottest days on record, if you exclude all the much hotter days and months, heatwaves and high temperature periods prior to 1990.
        
        7 1
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        May 31, 2021 1:58pm
    - Paulus
      
      Like Mataura some years ago was it the first of the 100 year flood, or the last !
      
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      May 31, 2021 3:41pm
  - JackRabbit
    
    Cyclone Giselle was the worst storm recorded in New Zealand’s history.
    
    -https://my.christchurchcitylibraries.com/cyclone-giselle/
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:33am
  - kowtow
    
    Irony is they call it “extreme” weather.
    
    When in fact it’s just weather .
    
    How do they think those “floodplains” they refer to actually got there ?
    
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    May 31, 2021 11:31am
- MCos
  
  The world ain’t going anywhere, except round the sun.
  
  Or does the sun go round us?
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:21am
pdm

Hard not to feel very sorry for SCOMO having to spend most of his 24 hours at Queenstown in the company of Ardern and her lightweight fiancee.

He sure earns his pay some weeks.
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May 31, 2021 8:41am
Maggie Pie

Traffic came to a standstill in Auckland yesterday, when hundreds of patched gang members from the ‘Mighty Lycra Mob’, rode across the Harbor Bridge to protest the lack of a dedicated Bicycle-Lane.
Many were seen to be wearing the Adidas and Nike insignia on their jackets in an attempt to intimidate Authorities and other road users.
Police are appealing for the Public’s help in identifying the culprits, which may in turn lead to them being arrested and jailed.

You can find further details here….

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DgcFamXX4AEwR4X.jpg
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May 31, 2021 8:41am
- krazykiwi
  
  It’s a curious thing. I’ve use bikes for touring in New Zealand, Australia, Canada, UK, France, Italy, Greece, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Sri Lanka, and Vietnam… and the country that has drivers with the most vociferous hatred of cyclists is definitely New Zealand. Anyone have any clues as to why? I’m genuinely stumped.
  
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  May 31, 2021 8:55am
  - surfing
    
    Because they caused mayhem on the motorway system for no good reason?
    
    It shows complete disregard for others and they are completely self absorbed and selfish people.
    
    Seeing that cyclist idiot on TV claiming they are taking over made me fume.
    
    Cops should have rolled in enmasse and arrested ring leaders and everyone they could get hold of.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:08am
    - krazykiwi
      
      I’m not referring to the motorway idiocy. I’d have them all arrested as a matter of course. The point I’m making is that cyclists ‘behaviour’ is pretty much the same the world over, but the rage against cyclists is, in my not-inconsiderable experience, the worst in New Zealand. Why?
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:36am
      - surfing
        
        It is worldwide….
        https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05-05/cyclists-fed-up-with-rogue-abusive-drivers/100112710
        
        https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8811943/Cyclist-pushed-punched-furious-road-rage-driver.html
        
        5 1
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        May 31, 2021 10:16am
      - 70andstilllearning
        
        Why?
        Lets look at a couple of fairly common road user scenarios.
        1) Cyclist quickly approaches intersection between two rows of stationary cars waiting for a green light with inches to spare on either side and plants himself in the middle of his preferred lane’s “green” zone in front of the first vehicle. Lights change and said cyclist slowly ambles across intersection until he reaches the next “cycle lane” which he immediately swerves across to and resumes his original quick pace.
        
        2) Car (usually driven by some old fart) ambles along for several km at between 70-80 km in open road limit area in moderate traffic conditions with a string of other vehicles behind him. As soon as said old fart sees the 400 metre passing lane advisory he speeds up so that by the time he reaches the passing lanes he’s doing just over the 100 k forcing any following driver to go even faster to pass. At the end of the passing lane he returns to his controlling 70-80 k.
        
        The common theme here is that we have a growing class of road users in this country ( the self styled road “enforcers” ) who go out of their way to deliberately frustrate traffic flow which in turn creates frustration ( rage) in other drivers, which makes the roads more dangerous for all users.
        
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        May 31, 2021 11:33am
    - MCos
      
      It’s your fumes that are half the problem.
      
      My daughter, her husband & their daughter were among the mob that busted through the police barricades.
      I asked if the passing motorists abused them with colourful language?
      No.
      I asked if Simeon Brown was kicking up bobsie die because they were blocking a car lane?
      No because they were mainly pakeha.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:30am
      - rangitoto
        
        Those cycle terrorists should have all been arrested and incarcerated on Manus Island for 40 years.
        
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        May 31, 2021 12:14pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        I suggest you are shit at those “join the dots “puzzles.
        and
        Possibly the “paint by numbers” ones too.
        
        4 1
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        May 31, 2021 12:24pm
      - Frank the tank
        
        I’ll tell you what.
        
        Let’s have another trial – ban all public servants from cars for 30 days. Let’s see how this one works out.
        
        6 1
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        May 31, 2021 1:20pm
      - surfing
        
        Should have raised your daughter to not be so self entitled.
        
        Shame on you!
        
        4 2
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        May 31, 2021 1:43pm
      - greybeard
        
        What on earth is a “pakeha” ?
        
        6 1
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        May 31, 2021 1:52pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Arrogance and disregard for the road laws with zero consequence or cost.
    and
    Vehicle owners and drivers have the privilege of paying for the very cycle lanes that they only use when they feel like it.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:09am
  - I remember when
    
    Four cyclists turned away from the Bayswater Ferry.
    A Bayswater man said they looked ‘pretty angry and upset.’
    “When the ferry doesn’t allow these bikes on, you’re pushing people into their cars and they sit in traffic.”
    Fullers confirmed 10 bikes and 3 scooters were loaded and 4 left behind. Their spokesman said, “there has always been a limit to the number carried.”
    Data from Fullers showed there were 12,000 bikes carried across 2600 ferry services in the past four weeks.
    Meanwhile talks continue between Fullers 360 and Bikes Auckland around additional capacity.
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:10am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Double the fee for taking them.
      
      11 1
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      May 31, 2021 9:32am
      - septic skeptic
        
        Triple it if you like, same result.
        
        3 0
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        May 31, 2021 11:42am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      The lycra brigade, sanctimonious narcissist’s as demonstrated by those disrupting the bridge traffic, should have given Fullers the finger and just pushed their bikes across the harbour . . .
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:37am
    - alex Masterley
      
      Averaged out the fullers data suggests 4.5 bikes per ferry service. Brings things into perspective.
      
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      May 31, 2021 9:37am
  - BananaLlama
    
    Cyclists pay nothing yet act like they own everything while dictating to every other road user how things will be. Should pass stupid laws like restricting them to one peddle or only allowed to ride a uni cycle and see how they like their own medicine.
    
    15 1
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    May 31, 2021 9:30am
    - MCos
      
      Car drivers pay road users taxes (their passengers don’t) and think they own the roads.
      Is that what you’re saying?
      I don’t know why cars stop at pedestrian crossings or insist on parking on the footpaths.
      
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      May 31, 2021 10:36am
      - BananaLlama
        
        Is that what you’re saying?
        
        No.
        
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        May 31, 2021 11:52am
  - Keith White
    
    It’s down to the Lycrans’ behavior on the roads, and attitude off the roads.
    
    11 3
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    May 31, 2021 9:55am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    The MAMILs of NZ.
    Middle-Aged Men In Lycra
    
    10 3
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    May 31, 2021 9:57am
  - yossarian
    
    I’ll try to answer. I know that in European countries cycling is a sort of right to passage. Everyone, and I mean everyone learns to ride first, then they learn to drive so every vehicle driver has experience in being a cyclist, thus some sympathy. New Zealand not so much. Yes kids bike, but mainly in designated areas, eg Mountain Bike parks, so they hardly do it on the road.
    
    I cycle for fitness but I don’t ride in bunches and I obey the road rules (within reason). Yes I run a red light biking to work at 5 in morning with no car in sight for 1km each way, but if driving I would too. Traffic light engineers are mostly idiots, but I digress.
    
    Most drivers are great (Fonterra Tanker drivers are bloody awesome) but there are horrible people out there, sorry to burst the bubble that we believe that kiwis are nice people, we’re not. I can be going along, minding my own business, well out of the way of any traffic (practically in the gutter) and some idiot will throw rubbish, or half drunk McDonald’s cokes at me…for no other reason other than people are assholes.
    
    Yes, some cyclists are assholes too (those on the bridge yesterday is an example) but putting all cyclists in the same boat as them, is like me saying everyone who drives as SUV has a small penis.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:04am
    - Ed Snack
      
      “is like me saying everyone who drives as SUV has a small penis.”
      
      You mean they don’t ?
      
      5 1
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      May 31, 2021 12:34pm
  - bruceavon
    
    when I returned to New Zealand after being overseas I realised kiwis seem very possessive of their little space around their cars. You would indicate you wanted to move lane and people would speed up to stop you from coming over. The opposite of what happens when you drive in the rest of the world. I remember Billy Connoly made a joke about this insecurity when he travelled here on his bike. The same happens when you ride your bike. People are aggressively defending their little space in their cars. I had brought my kids decent bikes and was intending them to ride them a lot, but after going out in Auckland traffic changed my mind. Driver are childishly aggressive with bikes and unless you can be in bike lanes, its too dangerous.
    
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    May 31, 2021 10:26am
  - Paulus
    
    Arrogance !
    
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    May 31, 2021 3:42pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Saw one photo with a bloke wearing an IT High Viz vest. Sums up AT as car haters.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:38am
Benedict Yu

Some frightening views on display here.

This view from a Wellington city counsellor is a great example of why Wellington is in the shit.

“As long as we have people with their own private cars and multiple per household, there is not enough space on the road for bus lanes and cycle lanes and footpaths,” she said.
_____

So that’s her agenda. She does not want private car ownership. Someone should tell her that New Zealand has the highest car ownership in the world, just slightly ahead of the USA.

How did she get elected?

But James Shaw is far more dangerous. Where did he get the mandate to embark on a mission to effectively wreck New Zealand’s transport system and to make private car ownership unaffordable got low and middle income earners?
_______

“You have to electrify your vehicle fleet, you have to do massive mode shift, you have to really invest in public transport, you have to get freight off the roads and into the rail; it’s kind of do everything”

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/q-panel-culture-shift-needed-address-long-term-transport-emissions-in-nz

I don’t know who this ‘you’ is. The ONLY way he can get large shifts to public transport is to make car ownership unaffordable. It really is that simple. People are not going to shift to public transport in large numbers for altruistic reasons. it is usually slow. It does not usually start at your departure point and does not finish at your destination. Public transport in most places in New Zealand will take betwen three and five times as long as a car. It involves walking and waiting, in winter in rain and wind. Let’s face it. It is horrible compared to a car. Not always. But usually. The train from the Wairarapa and Kapiti are notable exceptions.

And I have not even touched on Shaw’s views on freight transport.

This is not hyperbole. If James Shaw prevails, New Zealand will be impoverished and far less egalitarian. When will New Zealanders wake up?
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May 31, 2021 8:45am
- artemisia
  
  2023 – a Labour / Greens government looks most likely with Green Party as kingmaker.
  
  Hope for the best, plan for the worst.
  
  16 2
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  May 31, 2021 9:20am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    We need more Jack Reacher’s.
    
    8 0
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    May 31, 2021 10:13am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    If the continual fall of Labour and Greens since the election, rise of National and ACT.
    If this trend continues, even with the help Labour/Greens are getting from their pet media, National?ACT will be the govt. in 2023.
    I believe NZ is slowly waking up, but fast enough to achieve this.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:28pm
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Leave. They’ll crash the economy, and if NZ ever wakes up and gets rid of the idiot left govt you’ll be able to buy back in with a healthy profit (Sell high buy low).
    
    1 0
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    May 31, 2021 1:12pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  Your examples appear to show, these politicians have forgotten.
  They are representatives of us, not royalty to order us about.
  It is called …”The house of representatives” for a reason.
  People drive cars, it is not for you to order us not to.
  It is instead for you to facilitate our wish to do so.
  Further, if we want V8’s and the like, it is not for you to DEMAND we stop doing it or use OUR money to facilitate the use of electric cars.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:36am
- Ruawai
  
  Auckland Council have made the cost of parking in Auckland CBD more and more expensive over the years to try and force people onto pubic transport but all it has done is kill off the CBD shops.
  The same Council consented Newmarket Westfield making a super mall beside the Newmarket shops after taking away a lot of parking around New market streets, then allowing the mall to provide masses of car parking. So they have basically killed off high street shopping and street car parking and promoted the malls and they still expect the landlords of High Street shops to pay high rates after taking away their tenants.
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:46am
- KevO'Brien
  
  NZ has already sold of the rail/freight business. It was not efficient.
  
  4 1
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  May 31, 2021 10:08am
- Surely Knott
  
  What was James Shaws travel expenses though. Weren’t his one of the highest? Lol. It would take me 5 years to rack up a carbon foot print as high as a green party mp.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:24am
- Paulus
  
  Problem with Electric vehicles is they have no heater in the cool weather, and no air conditioning in the warmer summer.
  Do not get into a snow storm or serious traffic delay as you are stuck, unable to move and nobody can get to you to recharge.
  Silly idea !
  
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  May 31, 2021 3:46pm
kevn

@cmm… I always thought the worst could just be out worked to say… China.
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May 31, 2021 9:06am
Cassandra

NZers not great drivers at the best of times, equaled by not great cyclists. Add the two and you get our current situation of which KK complains. NZ cyclists are just as aggressive towards pedestrians as car drivers are towards cyclists. Poor old walkers at the bottom of the food chain
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May 31, 2021 9:12am
I remember when

William Shakespeare has died five months after receiving his covid jabs.
There must be a story here.
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May 31, 2021 9:12am
- kowtow
  
  A tragedy , certainly not a comedy , he’d have had a history ……
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:57am
Im Right

Due to the pecuniary interest list, its transpired not all MPs own a house, and more than a few own more than one.
Marama Davidson owns no house, but has been in parliament for at least the last 7yrs earning $150k back bencher salary and $200k as joint party leader for last 4yrs.
Question: WTF is she doing with her money? Bank interest rates for savings have been in the toilet for last few years…she really must be terrible with money if in all these years and six figured salary she is still renting! Paying someone elses mortgage.
Something just doesnt add up.
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May 31, 2021 9:50am
- Flossie
  
  No fan of Ms Davidson, but at the same time it’s actually none of my business (or yours) what she does with her money. Perhaps she lives in a home owned by her partner/trust/other family member?
  So long as she’s not asking me to pay her rent I really don’t care!
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:36am
  - Biscuit
    
    No truck here for the Greenies, either, but apparently a chunk of each MP’s salary is siphoned off for Party funds…
    
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    May 31, 2021 9:54pm
- MCos
  
  I don’t know, but I read Marilyn Waring’s book about her time in parliament.
  Her salary was split with extra staff she employed to help with electorate work etc. Must have worked because she represented a conservative rural area and she was not exactly a Muldoon favourite.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:48am
Happychappy

It’s a pity we didn’t and don’t have Journalists like Jason Morrison from Australia especially when it concerns China.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/05/australian-journalist-says-nz-needs-to-grow-up-and-distance-itself-from-china.html
Duncan Garner ask the questions and Morrison let him know in pretty quick fashion what New Zealand needs to do, grow some balls and stand up and be counted.
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May 31, 2021 9:51am
- MCos
  
  Australian reporters need to ask their leaders why they still trade with China?
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:42am
Im Right

Ps….same goes for that silly wench on TV3 Breakfast show, Amanda Gillies. Been making a great salary here and in OZ but bemoans the fact she cant afford a house, and is the shows ‘mouthpiece’ for renting stories.
I cant understand her moaning when she has had litterally years of good income/salary to buy a house but didnt.i was always patiently waiting for Mark or Duncan to ask the obvious question but they never have…suspicious. Im curious about the reason.
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May 31, 2021 9:54am
- kevn
  
  @Im… Probably has a ‘rental’ in the ‘burbs but prefers to live/rent in the leafy central city.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:41am
Surely Knott

Also from Glenn Greenwald. Federal Judge, who is himself, Southeast Asian, rules against the government prioritising business support based on racial and gender preferences as unconstitutional.

“The law, which was passed almost entirely by a party-line vote in March, grants priority status to restaurants that have 51% ownership or more composed of specific racial and ethnic groups as well as women. By effectively relegating struggling businesses owned by white males or ethnicities and nationalities excluded from a priority designation “to the back of the line,” the COVID relief program, ruled the court by a 2-1 decision, ran afoul of core constitutional guarantees.”

“instead of a targeted effort to assist all American small-restaurant owners who have suffered equally from the pandemic, the law arbitrarily grants priority to some based on racial or gender identity that has no necessary relationship to economic suffering. ”

Hello. NZ are you listening.
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May 31, 2021 10:14am
Maggie Pie

And further to my earlier post relating to cyclists unlawfully blocking traffic on the Harbor Bridge, one of the girls from tennis was saying they were held up for over an hour on Sunday, due to this selfish act by the ‘Lycra Loonies’.

Luckily, she managed to get a clear pic of one of the transgressors, which her hubby has now forwarded to the Police…..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ds1yEbwWsAANpSK.jpg
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May 31, 2021 10:30am
- MCos
  
  “Held up for over an hour”
  Going by the picture that’s because she was driving on the wrong side of the road.
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:40am
- sooty
  
  Now there is a reason not to wear lyca, especially pink!
  I see he’s riding a ladies bike, probably because he can’t swing the leg over the seat!
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:18am
  - oldfella
    
    But is it a man? Could be a w0man? Of just some sad non-binary obese… whatever?
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:23pm
- rockape
  
  The police should have been better prepared. I had a demo outside a RAF base against nuclear weapons. A local farmers muck spreader sorted that out. A muck spreader ahead of the cyclists would have sorted them out. Alternatively block both ends where they can’t exit and leave Them there for the night.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:26am
  - Keith White
    
    Water cannon. Usually mobs like that have people in them who really need a bath anyway. Public service, win-win.
    
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    May 31, 2021 1:26pm
RW Capitalist

What a rich vein you tapped…mentioning Shakespeare.
‘All the world’s a stage, and all the men and women merely players. They have their exits and their entrances; And one man in his time plays many parts.’
Jacinda

‘Now is the winter of our discontent’
All of us

‘The lady doth protest too much, methinks‘
Manis Island, deportees’, just political pawns, not real concern.

‘A horse! a horse! my kingdom for a horse!‘
Not Shakespeare but he did remind me of
“For want of a nail, the shoe was lost.
For want of a shoe, the horse was lost.
For want of a horse, the rider was lost.
For want of a rider, the battle was lost.
For want of a battle, the kingdom was lost,
And all for the want of a horseshoe nail.”
For the want of a competent minister/PM….
you can finish the rest.

‘Life’s but a walking shadow, a poor player, that struts and frets his hour upon the stage, and then is heard no more; it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.’
The whole Labour party.

‘Nothing will come of nothing.’
As seen in the term of this Government (loose term)

‘Neither a borrower nor a lender be; for loan oft loses both itself and friend, and borrowing dulls the edge of husbandry.’
Grant???????

‘We have seen better days.’
Longing for the 9 L O N G years of National to return.
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May 31, 2021 10:40am
- Keith White
  
  “Out, out damned scribblefaces!”
  
  – recently unearthed manuscript. Found in Tawa.
  
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  May 31, 2021 1:27pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  “look like the innocent flower, but be the serpent under’t”
  
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  May 31, 2021 2:23pm
insider

Another case of cancel culture. Council scaredy cats in CHch and Dunedin give in to threats and tell women to shut up because their discussions might upset the feelings of men, I mean because of health and safety.

https://mobile.twitter.com/NZFreeSpeech/status/1398796727793053701

libraries are supposed to be places of enquiry but now they are cancelling meetings where issues of public law are up for discussion. Of course Stuff and Radio NZ either aren’t interested or see the cancellation as heroic because women’s rights are hateful all of a sudden.
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May 31, 2021 10:53am
oldfella

This is a terrific article about 12 common assertions made by people who want to limit free speech, and why those assertions are wrong.
Well worth passing around.
https://areomagazine.com/2021/05/25/answers-to-12-bad-anti-free-speech-arguments-featuring-that-xkcd-cartoon-everyone-likes-to-quote/
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May 31, 2021 10:55am
Maggie Pie

My partner makes a good point.

Imagine if EVERY f – ing time somebody asked you a question, your ONLY response was either….
a) I refute that.
b) I deny that.
c) I reject that.

Would you not see some sort pattern forming here?
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May 31, 2021 11:03am
- MCos
  
  I couldn’t possibly comment at this time except to say we will be addressing these allegations once the appropriate authorities have been notified.
  
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  May 31, 2021 11:47am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    But we always have to ask what their definitions of these words are.
    addressing
    allegations
    appropriate authorities
    notified.
    and never any mention of “time frame”
    
    13 1
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    May 31, 2021 12:42pm
    - RW Capitalist
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W97PRqS6Lg0
      Recognize the tone?
      “the higher authority”
      
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      May 31, 2021 12:45pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  If you/me did it…the pattern/result would be……..
  a loss of friends.
  
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  May 31, 2021 12:04pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    We would be out of work, pronto.
    
    7 1
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    May 31, 2021 2:25pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  A refuge of scoundrel politicians who can’t face the music.
  
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  May 31, 2021 7:01pm
Happychappy

Any bets to how long it will take before Labour introduce this practice into New Zealand schools .
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/lifestyle/2021/05/us-parents-in-uproar-after-5yo-class-learns-of-masturbation-consensual-touch-in-health-lesson.html
With the weirdos that frequent the Labour Party in general with those in Young Labour you would know they have no values.
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May 31, 2021 11:22am
redeye

Michael Smith had this great bit of news yesterday. Apologies if it has already been covered.
https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2021/05/18-mexican-men-become-trans-women-to-get-around-gender-partity-electoral-quotas-solved.html

Tlaxcala, Mexico, May 26, 2021 / 12:52 pm

To avoid being left out of the 2021 Mexican elections because of a constitutional principle of “gender parity”, 18 male candidates from the Force for Mexico party in Tlaxcala state have filed for candidacy as trans women.

They did so in order to conform to the 2019 constitutional reform that requires that the slate of candidates of political parties throughout Mexico be made up of 50% women and 50% men.

Mexico is holding legislative, gubernatorial, and local elections June 6.
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May 31, 2021 11:31am
- alloytoo
  
  This probably does illustrate the best defence against equity rubbish. Saturate and devaluate the targeted minority.
  
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  May 31, 2021 12:31pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  Force the sex change and see how firm their convictions are.
  
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  May 31, 2021 12:32pm
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    How small minded of you.
    Gender identity is not about genitalia.
    You can still have a Pringles can attached, and be a proud woman.
    (And this is why some folk are saying such ‘Trans-women’ sharing bathrooms with little girls is fraught. But paradoxically you won’t get to discuss this or any such concerns around Trans-agenda inside a public space if it makes a he-she uncomfortable).
    
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    May 31, 2021 4:04pm
I remember when

AP: Ghost net detectives work to save endangered marine life:
An April cleanup expedition to Papahanaumokuakea – the largest protection environment in the US and a UNESCO World Heritage Site – brought back nearly 45 tonnes of nets and other lost gear.
They are analysing it to find the source of manufacture and by association probable users.
The researchers have spent about a year collecting data and hope to have findings peer reviewed and published this year.
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May 31, 2021 11:41am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Now that’s a positive ACTION to fix an environmental problem.
  re “climate change” why is their answer …always….money?
  
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  May 31, 2021 12:34pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyK1bZZ7E-s
    You’ll always have the lord on your side….ran 20 red lights in his honour.”
    “All you have to do is send $20 and all your dreams will come true”
    Sounds like the global warming alarmists to me.
    
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    May 31, 2021 12:38pm
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Sorry Mick.
      
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      May 31, 2021 12:39pm
  - Albert_Ross
    
    Are you under the impression that the Papahanaumokuakea expedition was undertaken without cost?
    
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    May 31, 2021 7:05pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  “Papahanaumokuakea” A Hawaiian marine monument.
  
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  May 31, 2021 6:58pm
oldfella

Thought for the day: “The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of its blessings. The inherent vice of socialism is the equal sharing of its miseries.” (Winston Churchill)
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May 31, 2021 12:26pm
Maggie Pie

And here’s another goodie from across the ditch….

“WHERE ARE THEY NOW?”

Former MP’s Raymond Huo (L) & Jian Yang (N)

https://twitter.com/billbirtles/status/1399160292391542786
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May 31, 2021 12:54pm
- sooty
  
  Been recalled!
  
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  May 31, 2021 9:11pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/125294246/australian-media-has-perception-issue-jacinda-ardern-says-after-60-minutes-nzchina-probe
Mr. Gayford really should change his tailor: some sort of blue “suit” with ill-fitting coat and skinny, too-long trousers worn with brown shoes.
Jesus.
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May 31, 2021 1:33pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  ‘….change his tailor’ LOL!!!
  
  ClarkE & Jacinda dressed courtesof…..SAVEMART
  With 28 OUTLET STORES nationwide
  
  (Yes, it’s on FB 😀 )
  
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  May 31, 2021 1:57pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Hey – John Campbell dresses like that, and he is a trendsetter
  
  8 1
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  May 31, 2021 2:35pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    LOL!!
    Do you know, that across all my five SM platforms I have well over 4000 friends? Not one of them has ever said anything ‘positive’ about John Campbell.
    Even my partner’s mum thinks he’s a prize
    
    Just saying.
    
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    May 31, 2021 3:08pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      NZ’s biggest prize!
      
      3 1
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      May 31, 2021 3:50pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Serious, who wears brown shoes, rolled up jeans, blue shirt, waistcoat and a suit jacket? Not me
      
      8 1
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      May 31, 2021 3:52pm
    - MCos
      
      That’s what happens when you get your friends from buy-a-comrade.ru
      
      7 1
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      May 31, 2021 4:25pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Uptick, but you are one of them MCos
        
        1 1
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        May 31, 2021 6:33pm
lifesgood

I just caught the Tamaki Link bus home from the city. There were 3 other passengers, all European ancestry. For some reason there was a recorded voice announcing each stop…first time I’ve struck that. It was intensely annoying. Each stop was announced in English and then repeated in long and ponderous Maori. They could barely finish announcing one stop before they had to announce the next one. It was farcical. I hope this is not going to become a regular thing because if it is it will be another way to drive people off public transport and out of the city. I am positive none of the 4 passengers could understand the Maori and if there had been any Maori passengers I doubt whether they would understand too. NZ is becoming a bloody great joke pandering to a tiddly little minority at every turn.
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May 31, 2021 1:34pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Well Andrew Judd wants the tiddly little minority of 15% to have 50% of the power share.
  See post above this
  
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  May 31, 2021 2:34pm
- graham
  
  I hope this is not going to become a regular thing …
  
  Probably.
  
  The Tamaki Link bus is run by Auckland Transport, and AT’s Statemnent of Intent for 2020-2023 includes:
  
  Better Outcomes for and with Māori
  
  Mana Whenua represent the traditional guardianship of New Zealand’s Māori and as a key partner, their involvement and input into the many strands of work carried out by AT is of immense value.
  
  AT’s commitment to meeting its responsibilities under Te Tiriti o Waitangi has led to the roll out of Te Reo Māori signage across all road, walking and cycleway projects, customer announcements on buses, and the development of pioneering new staff learning modules such as the Ngā Kete Kiwai Māori education programme.
  
  https://at.govt.nz/media/1984008/at-statement-of-intent-2020-2023.pdf
  
  As you say, almost certainly none of the passengers on that particular bus could understand Maori, and probably 95% of all bus passengers across the network will be unable to. If they made the announcements in Samoan, chances are a much higher percentage of their passengers would actually understand that.
  
  At a guess I’d say this is AT following the Government’s Māori Language Strategy which they launched in 2019, where they have pledged to ensure one million people in New Zealand are able to speak basic te reo Māori by 2040. This Strategy includes:
  
  More towns and cities embracing bilingualism
  
  109. Central government will provide support in particular localities where local government, communities, and the private sector wish to come together to promote te reo Māori. Bilingual towns provide opportunities to create places (or “domains”) where the use of te reo Māori can be normalised as part of everyday life. The presence of bi-lingual signage can support these efforts.
  
  110. These domains provide the support and confidence to already proficient speakers to use te reo Māori in public, and creates exposure to the language for those who are just beginning to learn te reo Māori.
  
  The Government has “pledged” (ie made a solemn promise or undertaking) that one million of us will be able to speak basic te reo Māori by 2040. Might as well get used to it, more to come methinks …
  
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  May 31, 2021 3:01pm
  - Batman
    
    The key word here is bilingual.
    
    You’ll still be able to take the bus into the city to shout at clouds and do the shopping ?
    
    4 13
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    May 31, 2021 3:04pm
    - graham
      
      Why not trilingual?
      
      I’m really looking forward to the day when they introduce sign language announcements on the bus.
      
      7 2
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      May 31, 2021 3:26pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        It’s perfectly feasible for that to happen, via video screen.
        
        2 3
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        May 31, 2021 4:58pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        Wasn’t that used by the Police on points duty or were they revising their ballet lessons?
        
        2 2
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        May 31, 2021 6:44pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Is that like screaming “NO” at the sky when Trump wins again?????
      
      3 2
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      May 31, 2021 3:54pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    NZ Bilingualism is a farce and a waste of money. The pidgin lingo has little relevance to the present world.
    Previous attempts have all failed. Now the Te Reo is so bastardised in the pidgin form emerging it is neither Maori no English.
    Who can teach it? Mixing it with English is illegal as that modifies the use of an official language. Likewise the extensive borrowing from English into Maori is disqualified as contrary to the official language approval.
    
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    May 31, 2021 6:53pm
    - Mike
      
      Using Maori words in English. Korero mai about which law I am breaking, you fool.
      
      1 4
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      May 31, 2021 7:42pm
- MCos
  
  As a matter of interest did they have an English translation for Tamaki?
  
  In Thailand there is always English translations of signs, even way out in the boondocks, พื้นที่ห่างไกลตัวเมือง, where nobody speaks the language.
  Does anyone grizzle, ร้องทุกข์?
  No.
  Who cares. สบาย สบาย
  
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  May 31, 2021 4:45pm
- Biscuit
  
  lifesgood, I live in Upper Hutt.
  
  Occasionally, if I go to Sky Stadium for the Rugby, I catch the train.
  
  Going in, it’s
  ‘Next Station: Wallaceville’
  ‘Next Station: Trentham’
  ‘Next Station: Heretaunga’
  ‘Next Station: Silverstream’
  …
  There are, I just counted, FIFTEEN stations between Upper Hutt and Wellington.
  You quickly lose the will to live at the ‘reminding’…
  And, o joy, catching the train home after the Hurricanes have scored a trademark win, it’s
  ‘Next Station: Ngauranga’
  ‘Next Station: Petone’
  ‘Next Station: Ava’
  ‘Next Station: Waterloo’
  Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!
  
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  May 31, 2021 10:05pm
Nickc2

French Police don’t mess about. I wonder if this copper learnt his craft playing rugby? A bloody good tackle.
https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2021/05/whats-french-for-cojones.html
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May 31, 2021 1:36pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  It sounded like the gun went off in the tackle.
  Still, balls the size of watermelons.
  
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  May 31, 2021 2:25pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Buy the man a beer.
  
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  May 31, 2021 4:10pm
- curry4me
  
  Nick2: Cops 1 Moron 0. Just the way it should be.
  
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  June 1, 2021 10:28pm
RW Capitalist

Labour party planning for our future?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_7jHCEMxZY
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May 31, 2021 2:21pm
kowtow

If the state can’t keep even inmates in the most “secure” of environments safe, where it has a duty of care , then what hope for the ordinary citizen .

‘Prison guards had to wait at the door to an exercise yard while a prisoner was repeatedly stabbed and stomped on because they had to wait for back-up, a court has heard.

Blake Lee was stabbed and stomped to death inside a maximum security wing of Auckland Prison, Paremoremo.’

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300320956/guards-had-to-wait-for-backup-while-prisoner-blake-lee-was-fatally-stabbed
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May 31, 2021 2:31pm
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  So prison guards keep you about as safe inside, as the police will outside.
  I presume none of them have sidearms, and so plugging the POS standing over the prone victim was not an option.
  
  In movies coming from America you get the impression there are guard in towers with M1 carbines ready to blow someone’s brains out the moment they command everyone in the yard to get on their bellies.
  In NZ, if the guards are hard or mean, then society will condemn them. Yet you have to be a pretty bad bastard to spend time inside.
  The articles said these a 3:1 prisoners, which means it needs 3 staff to 1 prisoner when inside the yard.
  Some people are animals, and need to be taken down like an animal.
  Lethal force.
  Saves the taxpayer, and society, in the long run.
  
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  May 31, 2021 4:20pm
- Ehlana
  
  If the prison guards had gone in understrength and one or more had been hurt or killed, then what would the headline say?
  The only way I can see out of this is to limit prisoner exercise based on the number of guards available – if there were only 17 on the unit, then only 5 prisoners could be allowed in the yard. That might mean shorter or less frequent exercise times.
  Or we pay for another half-dozen officers. I’m sure the prisons could find something for them to do while being present on the very unlikely chance of a stabbing, but the cost of those officers has to come out of the public purse – which means giving up something else, like teacher aides for school children, or Pharmac funding.
  It’s a question of which comprise is a vote winner with the public.
  
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  May 31, 2021 4:22pm
- mandk
  
  Shocking.
  
  Why aren’t the unions saying: ‘State run prisons can’t provide safety for inmates. They should be privatised’?
  
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  May 31, 2021 4:34pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING….

Just how careful is SPCA adoption vetting I wonder?

Big-Ups to the wonderful lady that saved this poor pooch from it’s disgusting captivity. Reading between the lines, it could well have been destined for the table 🙁

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1399203082341392386
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May 31, 2021 3:36pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Surely if it was destined for the table it would be fed like any other cuisine animal?
  
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  May 31, 2021 3:57pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    And don’t call me Shirley
    
    4 2
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    May 31, 2021 3:57pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      That was my line 😀
      
      2 1
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      May 31, 2021 4:03pm
      - Biscuit
        
        All that Tennis, Maggie, is slowing down your reflexes!
        
        1 0
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        May 31, 2021 10:06pm
Swifty

Before Labour supporters pee their panties about Nick Smith’s news they might reflect on Mallard or Fightery and many others who’s actions warranted resignation – but they didn’t have the integrity or moral compass to make such a move.
18 3
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May 31, 2021 4:25pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Whataboutism is always relevant in such cases…
  
  5 14
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  May 31, 2021 5:09pm
  - Swifty
    
    No, what is relevant is how Labour MP’s have held on for grim death, even when their resignation was the right thing to do.
    
    I have little time for Nick Smith but I endorse this decision, given the circumstances. At least he has more integrity than certain Labour MPs.
    
    12 3
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    May 31, 2021 5:41pm
    - Mike
      
      Holding on for a year showed Nick Smith has integrity?
      
      4 5
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      May 31, 2021 7:33pm
    - Tony Stuart
      
      I’m interested to know who leaked the details of a confidential Parliamentary Service investigation to the media, in order to discredit Nick Smith. Could it have anything to do with the office of the Minister in charge of the Parliamentary Service, who hates Nick Smith’s guts with a passion?
      
      13 3
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      May 31, 2021 7:42pm
      - Mike
        
        Not a great defence there, Tony.
        
        4 4
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        May 31, 2021 8:12pm
- Chuck Bird
  
  Who was about to leak? Who knew about the issue?
  
  8 3
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  May 31, 2021 5:20pm
- gump
  
  Nick Smith was one of the weaker members of National’s front bench.
  
  He should have moved on several years ago and made room for somebody with energy and enthusiasm.
  
  The only good news is that National doesn’t have to suffer the embarrassmentof losing a by-election.
  
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  May 31, 2021 5:28pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Why don’t you volunteer one of the Fraser House basement dwellers as a substitute? Rules at present are irrelevant.
    
    Nick Smith may be a little tired after 30 years of service. He has been a real help in keep the duck quackery down. His mind is real sharp and he has a fine appreciation of constitutional matters. Without that skill and experience we are on our way to letting the present mob do as they please without mandate.
    
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    May 31, 2021 6:39pm
    - gump
      
      Thirty years on the public teat?
      
      And you think that is worthy of praise?
      
      This is why we need term limits!
      
      4 2
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      May 31, 2021 7:12pm
- Prince
  
  Unfortunately this is so typical of the National caucus. Smith (and Brownlie) should have resigned after losing their electorates in the last election, but they hang around hauling in the big $’s and losing votes every time they pop up in the media.
  Now Smith is involved in some scandal, he decides to go.
  Message to National MP’s – have a serious look at how the public perceive you. If you’re not adding value, show some integrity and get out of the way. You’ve had your time.
  
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  May 31, 2021 6:27pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300321270/advance-nz-candidate-admits-failing-to-file-election-returns
What a lot of crap.
6 0
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May 31, 2021 4:29pm
Maggie Pie

This will be my last post for today…getting ready to go out for dinner 😛

WATCH:
‘Bystander rushes to help policewoman under attack from bearded looney. Doesn’t even bother putting his shopping bags down’ …LOL

https://twitter.com/henrykleeKTVU/status/1399091156420464640
7 1
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May 31, 2021 4:43pm
Steve Todd

The latest abomination perpetrated by the Roman Catholic Church has been revealed.

Have a read of this: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/thefreethinker/2021/05/op-ed-from-tuam-to-kamloops/?), and see yet another reason why I consider the RCC to be, without question, the most foul, disgusting, institution ever inflicted on the human race.
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May 31, 2021 6:17pm
- Mike
  
  I guess it’s up there with the Nazis and various commie regimes, but of course it has been perpetrating consistent evil for much, much longer.
  
  3 4
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  May 31, 2021 7:37pm
  - Steve Todd
    
    Yes, that consistent evil (over at least 1,800 years) is why I describe the RCC the way I do.
    
    As I said at GD on Sunday, 16 May, “[t]hank goodness I have had absolutely no association with it, whatsoever, throughout my life.”
    
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    June 1, 2021 9:49am
- barnacle bill
  
  The same kind of thinking inflicts several other religious institutions as well Steve.
  
  I agree the RCC is one of the worst.
  Molestation seems to come natural to those type.
  
  3 1
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  May 31, 2021 8:17pm
  - Steve Todd
    
    I have no doubt you’re right, bill.
    
    The RCC most certainly is the worst: see the last paragraph of this article, https://friendlyatheist.patheos.com/2021/05/29/remains-of-215-children-found-at-catholic-run-residential-school-in-canada/? referencing Pope Francis’ refusal in 2018 to apologise for the Church’s role in these residential schools.
    
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    June 1, 2021 9:40am
Maggy Wassilieff

Harete Hipango back to Parliament…

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300321561/harete-hipango-will-take-nick-smiths-place-in-parliament-says-national-should-increase-relevance-to-mori
8 1
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May 31, 2021 7:46pm
Scooter

Saw this paragraph online on Newstalkzb, Freudian slip maybe or does Jacinda call him a pussy in private?
“To perhaps emphasise the point, Ardern even publicly flirted with her Aussie counterpart, saying to cocktail clinkers that she was sure he wouldn’t mind being called in pubic what she calls him in private”.
5 3
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May 31, 2021 7:59pm

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