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June 19, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 19 June 2021

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General Debate

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Happychappy

While this Story is under pay wall this just about makes me spew just reading the headlines.
“New Zealander’s top bloke in 2017, how does Clark Gayford measure up?
You would expect better from Audrey Young but then again our media are politically corrupt, but to run a story on Clark Gayford about when he became the top bloke in 2017 when the public have been shut down on any subject they pen on this germ shows there is rules for some and different rules others that dare to tempt themselves from being banned by moderation or closed down by the Police Commissioner who the Government and Prime Minister of New Zealand seem to have in their back pocket.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/nzs-top-blokes-how-does-clarke-gayford-measure-up/CLPJWGS2LOF225T5AHRHKUSZ6M/
While I believe in free speech you can’t make rules and then allow the media to please themselves what they write whilst closing down others that have heard stories about others pasts.
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June 19, 2021 8:00am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Young continues to promote Ardern’s enduring immense popularity. With recent confirmation about how the Labour Party cynically and ruthlessly utilizes the media for PR advantage, it really does make one wonder.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:37am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Coming to a NZ near you?
    https://www.chicksonright.com/blog/2021/06/18/biden-admin-tells-americans-to-turn-in-radicalized-family-friends-to-the-government-to-root-out-domestic-terrorism-2/
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:10am
    - H. Upmann
      
      Rat-Fink On Your Neighbors (or family); But Not On BLM/Antifa
      https://www.lewrockwell.com/2021/06/no_author/rat-fink-on-your-neighbors-but-not-on-blm-antifa/
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:03am
    - Nickc2
      
      What other countries encouraged their citizens to dob in others (including family members) to the authorities for so-called anti-social thought and behavior?
      Oh, that’s right, they were all Communist/Socialist countries with the exception of NZ until recently when dobbing in others for breachers of Covid Lockdown became Govt policy.
      Now, along with the curtailing of free speech and criminalization of hate speech, we have well and truly embraced Communism/Socialism and all in the space of four years of Ardern dictatorship.
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:03am
      - Ruawai
        
        Dob in illegitimate Ute users, do it for your country and the climate.
        
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        June 19, 2021 2:42pm
  - Stellaboxer
    
    The thing is there are two things going on. Firstly the media reports on Ardern and the government as a whole generally in a positive upbeat and sympathetic tone and secondly and most dangerous they censor by omission. Those people who believe ( read the National Party) this will change as the incompetence and cultural lunacy grows misunderstand the situation. Large swathes of the media are politically and ideologically aligned with the governments deep agenda as they are of the same generation of graduates. Tova O’Brien for example is an activist not a journalist she is a true believer. They believe in identity politics, white supremacists behind every curtain and the deification of indigenous and peoples of colour. The fact that the government has paid them off with subsidies and continues to with a barrage of government information advertising merely greases the wheels by persuading the media owners to not interfere . IMHO
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:43am
    - oldfella
      
      Stella, here’s a good example of a sympathetic (basically softball) headline used to soften the blow of what should be a bad news story.
      “Covid-19: The discrepancies in the vaccine roll-out”
      The government says the vaccine roll-out is well ahead of target. But plenty of New Zealanders who are eligible for the jab are asking, ‘why can’t I get it’?
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125480132/covid19-the-discrepancies-in-the-vaccine-rollout
      You can just imagine how this story would be turned into a hit piece on Govt incompetence if it were National handling the roll out.
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:57am
      - Libertysparks
        
        Try and get a place in a NZ quarantine hotel to return home. Its impossible. The accommodation is all booked up for five months. Nothing showing beyond that.
        We are expat Kiwis, vaccinated (thanks to the Malaysian Government’s efficiency with the roll out) but cant get back into NZ.
        We truly live in crazy, incompetent times
        
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        June 19, 2021 1:53pm
      - Tony Stuart
        
        That’s just it though LS – MIQ is NOT booked out, and on average, there are around 1500 MIQ beds available every day. The problem is that people aren’t being allowed to book them.
        
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        June 19, 2021 2:29pm
      - Ruawai
        
        The right of politics need to infiltrate journalism school and teachers college to control the future narrative.
        
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        June 19, 2021 2:45pm
    - Sacha
      
      I’m of an age to sit back and watch what seems the inevitable crumbling of New Zealand society.
      It seem that the current government represents its supporters very well. neither group considers the lessons of the past – they only know that whatever is wrong today, was the fault of those who went before and in turn, they will be similarly blamed by their children and grandchildren .
      I wouldn’t mind being here in 20 or 30 years to see how New Zealand evolves.
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:06am
- igm
  
  Taxpayers’ millions buy a very compliant press in New Zealand currently.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:45am
  - Lance
    
    Try this for shits and giggles..
    Honest.. would Stuff lie to you
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/about-stuff/125478666/the-backstory-why-government-money-doesnt-corrupt-our-journalism
    
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    June 19, 2021 4:37pm
    - RockyJ
      
      The stupid journalist Patrick Crewdson says Stuff is not biased towards the government, which doles out money to media organisations on the criterion they support Treaty partnership, because their own Stuff charter supports the Treaty as a partnership.
      So this means they are not only secretly biased towards the government policy but they are also openly biased towards the government.
      How dumb can you be?
      
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      June 19, 2021 5:20pm
      - Nickc2
        
        There’s no mention of PARTNERSHIP in the TOW, English or Maori versions.
        
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        June 20, 2021 9:37am
    - Nickc2
      
      What a load of BS from Stuf! How about addressing Climate Change in an objective unbiased manner? No, of course they won’t it goes against Govt bought and paid-for propaganda.
      
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      June 19, 2021 8:11pm
- doggone7
  
  You decided to write about the guy, introduce him here.
  
  Does that mean “the public have been shut down on any subject they pen on this germ”?
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:43am
  - Happychappy
    
    I would their would more facts in my story than you ever used when NZ First and Winston Peter’s launch their lies and deciet on Bill English, oh but that’s right you don’t do facts that well do you.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:23am
    - doggone7
      
      I do facts very well. You said the public have been shut down on any subject they pen on this germ.
      
      As a member of the public you have penned a piece about the “germ.”
      
      Facts? The fact is there are avenues for the public to use, which you have. On the face of it you don’t do facts very well.
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:20pm
- Bob
  
  You would expect better from Audrey Young…
  Why ever would you expect better from Audrey Young? she only ever wears red spectacles.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:24am
WaveyDavey

Perhaps it’s a British thing, but describing someone who has died as “fallen” implies a certain degree of heroism

In fact the dictionary reserves it for those who die in military combat

Apparently not in NZ

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/06/police-make-no-arrests-at-auckland-gang-funeral-for-fallen-head-hunters-mobster.html
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June 19, 2021 8:05am
- kowtow
  
  He died in custody .
  
  As far as the Media Pardy’s concerned that makes him a hero.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:56am
  - CJames
    
    If he died in custody, that would be a compulsory IPCA investigation. The fact that this isn’t mentioned in any commentary indicates that it is something police have no culpability in. Remember they prosecuted three cops for letting a drunk who died in a cell when they thought he was just sleeping it off so it is less than that. Or maybe the family is yet to wind up their victim status. .
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:49am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Pretty sure it was reported that IPCA and WorkSafe are investigating.
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:02pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Yep,
        the whole shebang is involved:
        
        *Police critical incident investigation
        *IPCA
        *Worksafe NZ
        *Coroner
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/man-who-died-after-being-found-unresponsive-in-police-custody-named-as-taranaki-fuimaono-from-westmere/VBJ5PIG45NJ7ZU7G3KBWVIMAKU/
        
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        June 19, 2021 3:31pm
- JibberJabber
  
  Maybe he fell off his scooter?
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:19am
- Exhumed
  
  I want to know why we have surrounded the streets and the rule of law to thugs.
  We’ve seen this happen on two occasions in recent weeks where the thugs take over the roads and break the law with impunity.
  
  The Police decided to Marshall the law breakers through the lights and intersections and allowed them to hang out of cars and drive on the wrong side of the road. This is part of the ‘feminisation’ of the Governments approach to policing, and to adopt some of the thoughts and practices. of academic theory.
  
  I didn’t vote for this response from the Police. I didn’t vote for this response from our government.
  
  When the next election rolls around I hope there is a serious South Island based party who takes up the mantle on our behalf. This means law breakers are dealt with in a way which is defined by laws which are meant to punish offenders and to lock away recidivists for as long as it takes.
  
  If the South Island voted as a block, even if it was just in the rural seats, and the party (Conservative Agricultural Party or something) won, then the basis of their policies should be law and order, sound economic practice, South Island infrastructure, oil exploration, mineral resource. extraction, logging, farming, education, health, and a stop to the treaty gravy train.
  
  If the NI failed to follow, then Wellington could indeed be separated by more than a cut cable.
  
  As they say in Scotland, Saor Alba Go Bragh. But as we should say down here, ‘Eilean a Deas gu bràth’
  
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  June 19, 2021 5:17pm
JibberJabber

Are you still an “Outlaw” if the Government supports your anti-social and criminal organisation?
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June 19, 2021 8:10am
Gravelroad

https://www.stuff.co.nz/about-stuff/125478666/the-backstory-why-government-money-doesnt-corrupt-our-journalism

Nice try, but don’t believe it.
At the 2017 election, people outside Wellington had barely heard of the somewhat obscure back bencher that was Jacinda Ardern.
The msm warmly embraced and marketed her as our new leader and people bought in to the journalist driven Jacindamania brand.
The likes of $tuff have been financially rewarded for making her a star and enabling the Labour government to embark on their current socialist/communist agendas.
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June 19, 2021 8:11am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Dead right Gravel. A few more years of this and our country will be have been transformed into a Cuba of the south seas while the sheeple looked the other way.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:18am
  - Bob
    
    Captain, if NZer’s don’t vote for a major changre of govt to National, then this countries future will be munted.
    We are already well down the slope into COMMUNISM
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:27am
    - Batman
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      We are nowhere near communist. We aren’t even that close to being democratic socialist.
      
      Take a few deep breaths friend. Shouting communism doesn’t make it so.
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:09am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        If you can’t see beyond the end of your nose do you still have a nose?
        
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        June 19, 2021 11:37am
      - Liberty
        
        “We are nowhere near communist.”
        Dear Leaders disciple speaks.
        
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        June 19, 2021 12:07pm
      - septic skeptic
        
        We are on a medium term path to what will be in effect a one party state. The end game of the He puapua strategy is to have an upper house elected by maori only. Given that Maori are overwhelmingly tribal Labour supporters, that gives labour an effective veto over anything a future right wing government could wish to reform, regardless of who might win a general election.
        
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        June 19, 2021 12:11pm
      - Lance
        
        Sorry Batman
        But the total corruption of the media has skewed NZ that direction.
        
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        June 19, 2021 4:40pm
    - GJM
      
      National are little better. Like Labour, but blue.
      The incremental decline slows imperceptibly with the Hats, but no real, fundamental difference.
      As agun owner, they think i am a white supremacist killer. National are dead to me.
      
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      June 19, 2021 6:14pm
- Swifty
  
  Despite his protestations they have allowed themselves to become hopelessly compromised. Can you just imagine his/their reaction should National campaign on abolishing this payola? They will be up in arms.
  
  Notice too that he failed to mention the worst aspect of all this – that poor struggling NZ families are now being forced to fund private news media companies and who’s products they never consume.
  
  “Oh, but it’s for your own good….”
  
  Our days of a free and independent news media are over and all thanks to the NZ Labour Party and their grubby little lefty media mates.
  
  Utterly shameful.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:20am
- Loddenthinks
  
  The article is complete BS. The “evidence” of their fearless impartiality rings as hollow as a pumpkin at Hallowe’en. Their campaign to discredit the NZ SAS caused the current government no embarrassment at all; in fact it allowed them to virtue signal even more.
  
  Explaining is losing $1uffed, and you’re the biggest pack of losers going round.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:21am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    What ‘campaign to discredit the NZ SAS’?
    
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    June 19, 2021 8:33am
    - Jack5
      
      Milky, you know Loddenthinks will be alluding to the campaigns by Hager the Horrible and our Leftist mediation about conduct of NZ troops in Afghanistan.
      
      What are the Left’s suggestions now, Milky, for protecting the human rights of the women and girls of Afghanistan?
      
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      June 19, 2021 8:54am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        We had a commission of inquiry which made it quite clear that without the work of those journalists the NZDF would not have been called to account for numerous failings. Perhaps you missed the report, Jack:
        https://operationburnham.inquiry.govt.nz/inquiry-report/
        As for your final, specious, comment:
        Did NATO and NZ invade Afghanistan to protect human rights of women and girls?
        Should journalists ignore stories of military misconduct?
        With the failure of the mission in Afghanistan, how does it become the media’s responsibility to do something tens of thousands of heavily armed troops failed to do?
        Nest you will be complaining that the media reporting on any police misconduct means that journalists should be out catching burglars.
        
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        June 19, 2021 10:15am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      So you firstly ask “what campaign”? and in the next breath quote the report that was the end result of the campaign. Way to engage, genius.
      
      I have no opinion on what the SAS did or didn’t do, and of course the media campaign made a difference, none of which is remotely relevant to my point.
      
      My point is that the media campaigning on this is not evidence that they’re unafraid to embarrass this government. It didn’t embarrass the government in the slightest, in fact the contrary. Another straw-man argument from $1uffed, and another major miss from you. Do try and keep up.
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:37am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        My point was that there was no ‘campaign to discredit the NZ SAS’. Journalists did what they are supposed to do: follow up stories and hold the powerful to account. Media reporting on the Afghanistan stories did embarrass the NZDF and the government. The NZDF even resorted to defaming one of the journalists involved.
        Perhaps you could choose a better example for whatever point you were trying to make. Maybe something you know about, as you have ‘no opinion on what the SAS did or didn’t do’.
        
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        June 19, 2021 12:07pm
      - Jack5
        
        Milky’s … Journalists did what they are supposed to do: follow up stories and hold the powerful to account …
        
        What if they are on the payroll of the powerful? Do they bite the hand that feeds?
        
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        June 19, 2021 1:40pm
      - Jack5
        
        Anyone else read Stuff’s chief editor, Patrick Crewdson, today denying that taxpayer money affects subsidised newspapers’ independence.
        
        Crewdson said Stuff projects are submitted to the State’s New Zealand on Air for funding approval. That’s independence?
        
        He cited the Afghanistan inquiry as an example of Stuff embarrassing the Government.
        
        It may have embarrassed a previous government, but can have but little embarrassed Labour, which is awash with Woke, Leftist, pacifist, Hager sympathisers.
        
        Stuff, by maintaining that State funds don’t compromise its independence, just digs deeper the hole of “bought off” allegations.
        
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        June 19, 2021 2:16pm
- Scott
  
  There is no doubt in my mind that the media love Jacinda, they love her agenda, they love that she is a woman, a relatively young woman and she is an object of their adoration. Having said that I think Jacinda is an excellent communicator. She smiles nicely, she answers questions well at a press conference which is mostly friendly, she has communicated excellently to the New Zealand public about Covid.
  
  Sadly while smiling nicely and speaking nicely, she is implementing the radical socialist agenda that she has always wanted to since she was the leader of the young socialists. Command control of the economy, radical social engineering such as abortion and euthanasia and transgender and hostility to traditional faith based viewpoints. Banning conversion therapy would be an example.
  
  Unfortunately the average New Zealander doesn’t know what they think any more. The average New Zealander is of little faith and is open to radical viewpoints cloaked in the language of compassion and kindness. Until we get back to our Christian understandings of life and what is right and what is wrong we will continue to go down this socialist path. Fortunately God is still in charge. So I have hope for the future. My hope is in God and not in man.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:30am
  - Swifty
    
    “There is no doubt in my mind that the media love Jacinda…”
    
    And what a coincidence that the object of their love is the very one who has handed them tens and tens of millions of taxpayer dollars.
    
    How hard is it to work out that they have supported her at least in part because they knew she and Labour would be suckers for their campaign for public funding of the news media.
    
    The whole thing is a stitch up.
    
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    June 19, 2021 8:52am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Communications degree. Example: She is in discussions about an electric Ute – Toyota said no. She may well have had discussions with her boyfriend, the way she worded it was deliberately misleading – very clever tactic
    
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    June 19, 2021 8:56am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      I listened to some of sound bites about the electric utes. I’m not sure that Jacinda could clearly explain the difference between these fuel types. That means having a basic understating of how they work.
      
      Petrol internal combustion
      Diesel interval combustion
      HYBRID
      Plug in hybrid
      EV
      
      When she was challenged on the electric ute, she mumbled about hybrid utes and refused to back down.
      
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      June 19, 2021 9:12am
      - Liberty
        
        All Utes are equal
        Jethro’s Ute is more equal
        
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        June 19, 2021 12:17pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Yes. IMO, she is as embarrassing on the world stage for NZ as Beijing Biden is for the US.
        
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        June 19, 2021 12:24pm
    - Bloody Dago
      
      Morticia doesn’t have clever tactics, her minders come up with every media utterance for her to flap her dental work to.
      
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      June 19, 2021 9:43am
    - crikey
      
      Help me understand what is clever about making shit up.
      
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      June 19, 2021 1:24pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    They love her doling out Public Monies and mortgaging our grandchildren’s futures.
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:12am
  - lifesgood
    
    You make some excellent points but I disagree that she answers questions well at press conferences. She lies, diverts and obfuscated, all with a smile, of course.
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:12am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      That is what I meant. She had discussions but did not say who with – avoided the truth
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:43am
  - RockyJ
    
    I agree Scott. Most kiwis are decent people who find it incomprehensible that a government of this country could actually be working against them.
    We are too trusting. We are also too kind. Maori activists see our kindness and belief in a fair go as a weakness. They are using these values against us to overthrow the democratic and legal structures our forefathers fought hard to create.
    Hopefully there is a gradual awaking of the sleeping giant occurring.
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:37am
    - Nickc2
      
      Don’t bank on it RockyJ. All NZ Universities have the jump on us. Until we stop them indoctrinating our offspring with Socialistic crap, we won’t even get to the start line.
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:28pm
  - Fidel Cashflow
    
    I don’t buy the “good communicator” trope. Take away her PR team and you’ll see she is not a good communicator at all. She is inarticulate, unintelligent and visibly insincere.
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:54am
    - kowtow
      
      I agree . The simple fact is the Media Pardy have never , really pressed her .
      
      The one time it happened was at the post, I’m going to break the lockdown rules and go for a bike trip , absent health minister in a global pandemic but got caught ,press conference .
      
      The questioning was ramping up very nicely , thank you , and She , the Saviour , was getting increasingly and visibly irritated and ratty and just when they could have gone in for the coup de grace up popped a patsy and She , the Great Communicador took the question and it was like a balloon going flat , the dog pack just let go and it was over .
      
      I’d love to know which “journalist” it was who managed to stem that one , she’ll be on the Christmas drinks list for sure , and the rest of the pack will know too and why.
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:31am
      - nathie
        
        Ahh glad you brought up David Clark’s infamous bike rides.
        
        Fact: The story broke on a Thursday or Friday (without re-checking dates) by some media (eg Newshub).
        
        However it was totally ignored by State TVNZ. They didn’t run any stories.
        
        Until Sunday when David Clark issued a formal apology (which then had to be covered).
        
        Co-incidence or contrived?
        
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        June 19, 2021 11:45am
      - Tricati
        
        Mike Hosking used to really question her until she spat the dummy and refused to go his show, as she was being shown up as the lightweight she is.
        Also, Robertson stopped appearing on Peter Williams show, as I suspect he found that to tough, as Williams certainly did his homework on subjects and could see through the BS.
        Ardern & Robertson are transparent, you can see right through them.
        
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        June 19, 2021 1:32pm
    - Nickc2
      
      Agree Fidel. The sooner she climbs aboard her straw broom and flies away the better.
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:40am
    - sooty
      
      Her PR team create those lovely soundbites that roll effortlessly roll of her forked tongue!
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:09am
  - Bob
    
    she answers questions well at….
    Adern is a master of obfuscation when it comes to answering questions.
    In order to answer, one needs to understand the subject of the question. Hands waving around does not equate to answering the question, I’ve seen windmill sails that were calmer in a force 8 gale.
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:32am
  - MCos
    
    “Unfortunately the average New Zealander doesn’t know what they think any more.”
    
    What you really mean is you’re right and everyone else is wrong.
    As for Christianity being the bees knees. That’s a bit of an arrogant attitude to take, but having been brought up a Catholic entirely understandable. It took me a long time to accept some of the others might have a point.
    I see the American Catholic Bishops are angling to prevent President Biden receiving Holy Communion on account of his pro choice stance. Except it’s not up to them.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:02am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I see Scott is labouring under the misapprehension that socialism is somehow incompatible with Jesus’s teachings.
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:09pm
    - david
      
      MCos,
      I took it to mean that the NZ population is increasingly relying on others to do their thinking for them, having lost the ability of critical analysis.
      Most of us “oldies” developed bullshit meters that worked quite simply …. if this is true, then that can’t be! – or else … if this is true then that must also be true! People generally do not seem to think that way currently, instead the mantra is ….. this is true because xxxx told me….. implying that xxxx is a “trusted source of reliable information. It matters not that the statement is completely contradictory to something that xxxx told me last week.
      That winds me up.
      
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      June 19, 2021 2:05pm
  - SB2
    
    “..she is implementing the radical socialist agenda?
    
    Examples?
    
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    June 19, 2021 2:56pm
    - GJM
      
      Apartheid
      Having unelected iwi with voting rights on councils, against the wishes of the ratepayers, to the extent they banned having a referendum on it.
      This is expanded elsewhere. Want to do work for a government agency? Better be a Maori business. It is one of the listing requirements for government work.
      Giving control of of water and swathes of land to iwi.
      Confiscation of private land via the SNA process without any pretence of compensation. Confiscation of private property from firearms owners, also with minimal or no compensation such as ammunition or accessories, and paying only half the value of the confiscated guns.
      Plenty more examples such as illegal detention with the covid lock down.
      
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      June 19, 2021 6:31pm
- Unity
  
  Great to read your comments Gravelroad. I have just read the article by the Stuff Editor of how they aren’t prejudiced by the Government etc etc and I was about to reply on how I was so pleased to read his comments especially the bit about trust. However, I don’t believe him and don’t trust Stuff one little bit. What he wrote is what we would all like to hear but don’t believe a word of it.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:50am
- graham
  
  I haven’t read the article and am unlikely to – I avoid visiting Stuff as much as possible – but the headline tells me all I need to know.
  
  As Loddenthinks says, explaining is losing.
  
  I don’t know that I would think of Stuff as corrupt, in the true dictionary definition of the word, but they are hopelessly compromised by their biases, by their wokeness, and by their prejudices. They have various agendas which are plain for all to see, and much of what they publish – and just as importantly, what they REFUSE to publish – is coloured by those agendas.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:45am
- oldfella
  
  Gravel, stuffed’s tag to that story reads…
  Like you, we believe in freedom of speech, and the right of every New Zealander to have a say on the issues that affect them. Our Perspectives section is home to myriad voices, representing Aotearoa’s many different communities.
  Yep, so committed to every Kiwi having a say on issues that effect us that they didn’t open the comments on that article. And they definitely do not want to hear feedback on climate change, or the current ‘Maorification’ of NZ.
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:11am
- cmm
  
  It doesn’t corrupt them, because they were already corrupt.
  
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  June 19, 2021 4:29pm
Kiwi_in_Paris

The way things are going, and contrary to popular opinion, it seems it may well be the vaccinated who will be the ones unable to fly internationally again, due to the risk of them having blood clots or a heart attack in the air.

Well, there won’t be any pilots to fly them, so it doesn’t really matter.

UN Agenda (no fly) in full swing, it seems:

https://www.ukcolumn.org/community/forums/topic/four-ba-pilots-die-unexpectedly/
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June 19, 2021 8:24am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Now it becomes clear: the whole pandemic was a conspiracy against air travel.
  
  5 54
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  June 19, 2021 8:34am
  - Charmaine Hawke
    
    In your attempt at sarcasm MM you have hit the nail on the head. What better way to “fix” the climate than stop people flying?
    When the great and the good told us this was their aim maybe we should have taken them at face value.
    
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    June 19, 2021 8:53am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Idiot
    
    42 4
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    June 19, 2021 8:59am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Yes, he is.
      
      5 34
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      June 19, 2021 9:00am
    - Fidel Cashflow
      
      mike’s an NPC. He’s clueless.
      
      21 3
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      June 19, 2021 9:56am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        A new acronym for me
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NPC_(meme)
        
        How apt
        If you get in a discussion with them it’s always the same buzzwords and hackneyed arguments. They’re the kind of people who make a show of discomfort when you break the status quo like by breaking the normie barrier to invoke a real discussion. it’s like in a [video game] when you accidentally talk to somebody twice and they give you the exact lines word for word once more.
        
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        June 19, 2021 10:31am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This is why I will not have the vaccine until much more research has been done. I will not be part of that research
  
  37 9
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  June 19, 2021 9:00am
  - Inandout
    
    Steve, you are not alone in this thinking. My doctor says I am perfectly healthy, I eat sensibly so why on earth would I ingest an experimental vaccine? Most telling are the comments from some retired nurses who are saying ‘no’ to the jab. They cannot be forced now they have left the health system and probably draw on their past experiences by this decision.
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:27am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Who the fuck has the right to use me as a guinea pig?
      Socialists can fuck right off
      
      30 7
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      June 19, 2021 10:02am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Don’t worry, Steve.enough non-morons will get vaccinated to provide you with the protection you don’t deserve.
        
        10 30
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        June 19, 2021 10:17am
      - lilman
        
        Steve they are using you every day as an experiment.
        You and most of NZ dont realise it.
        
        16 4
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        June 19, 2021 10:21am
- oldfella
  
  Can someone please remind this forgetful oldfella why some stories with 20+ upticks are highlighted in pink, and some in yellow?
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:14am
  - Kiwi Dave
    
    Pink appears when up-ticked posts have also attracted a significant number of down-ticks. What the magic number or ratio is, I don’t know.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:37am
  - Crisplion
    
    I think the ones in yellow have very few downticks and at least 20 more uptick than downticks. The ones in pink have lots of uptick but also quite a lot of downticks. I’m not sure exactly what the formula for that is though.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:38am
  - oldfella
    
    Bats (or whoever is moderating), can you please explain how the colour coding works?
    
    7 2
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    June 19, 2021 11:55am
  - cmm
    
    The pink colour means “controversial” – it has picked up more than a threshold of both up and down ticks.
    
    To go yellow, it needs 20 or more upticks than downticks.
    
    If it has 25 upticks and 10 down ticks it won’t be yellow yet.
    
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    June 19, 2021 4:35pm
freemark

Well I’m sure the comments will provide plenty of evidence to refute this…oh wait, no comments allowed on this BS?
Who’d have thought…
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June 19, 2021 8:27am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  They are not interested in comments that do not fit the narrative
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:01am
Maggie Pie

How long till we see this happen here we wonder?

‘Sky News banner reporting…. Police Officers in Portland have resigned en masse, after fellow Officer is charged with assault, after being accused of using ‘unlawful force’ on a violent protestor.’

This whole thing is getting silly. We watched 10/7 on Thursday….my partner reckons it’s the only time he’s seen Uber Drivers not wearing turbans.

Just saying.
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June 19, 2021 8:28am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Enough to make him Sikh?
  
  32 22
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  June 19, 2021 8:35am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Ok ok, dry humour, but you got an uptick sonny
    
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    June 19, 2021 9:03am
  - Fidel Cashflow
    
    Boomer joke fail. It’s pronounced “seek” not “sick.”
    
    15 11
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    June 19, 2021 9:58am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Maybe Mike comes from NSW? Their accent fits
      
      18 2
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      June 19, 2021 10:47am
- MCos
  
  No police in Portland resigned from the force over that issue. That is, they are still police.
  A bunch of them resigned from the Rapid Response Team and went back to regular police duties full time.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:44am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    You’re not an Uber driver are you Cossie?
    
    17 4
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    June 19, 2021 9:45am
    - MCos
      
      Close, but somehow wildly inaccurate.
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:03am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      What do you know about Uber, Maggie? Surely you are not too poor to afford a chauffeur?
      
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      June 19, 2021 10:19am
- Inandout
  
  Pakistanis don’t normally wear turbans.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:28am
- oldfella
  
  Maggie, enjoy 10-7 while it’s still on air. Seems it’s a bit… racist.
  TVNZ has commissioned an independent panel to look into how the show portrays Māori and Pasifika, along with other ethnic groups. It also asked for recommendations for future production and promotion of the show.
  Auckland councillor Efeso Collins says all the show is doing “is monetising people’s poor and vulnerable experiences”.
  https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/tvnz-commissions-independent-review-into-police-ten-7-amid-racism-claims
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:22am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    This has been coming for a while, it will be cancelled or accused of white supremacy soon, if not both.
    
    The show is fronted by Rob Lemoto, a Tongan, and reflects the reality of what Police find in New Zealand. If Maori and PI are “over-represented” in the crime show, it’s only because they’re over-represented in the ranks of those committing the crimes.
    
    The original complaint was that the segments where they asked for help to locate the bad buggers, most of them were brown-skinned, which is hardly surprising. If Maori and PI want to be seen less in the Most Wanted segments, or on the show itself, stop committing crimes.
    
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    June 19, 2021 1:17pm
Than

Apparently NZ Childcare is some of the best in the world, but also some of the most unaffordable.

Gee, I wonder if these two things might be related.

If you’re going to insist that all childcare providers must have high level qualifications, then sure, that will mean high quality childcare. But the providers with those qualifications will have proportionally high wage expectations, pushing up the cost. Pretty obvious.
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June 19, 2021 8:34am
- artemisia
  
  From those numbers, childcare is still worth it. Financially. If that’s what the family wants.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:05am
  - Than
    
    Maybe. That will depend on a few other factors – how much the parent can earn during that time, transport costs, any reduction in other income (say from benefit abatement, or moving to a higher tax bracket), etc.
    
    But the point is, high-quality/high-cost childcare may not be suited to everyone. Some people way want that and find it worth paying for well qualified caregivers. But for others, an unqualified minimum wage drone who just makes sure the children don’t hurt themselves could work better.
    
    And it’s typical of this nanny-state “we know best” (hint: you don’t) government that this choice is taken away from people.
    
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    June 19, 2021 1:32pm
- MCos
  
  I don’t think daycare/preschool teachers exactly earn a ‘high wage’.
  I often have occasion to go into my granddaughters’ daycares. The teachers are generally marvelous & some of the kids are as young as four months apparently. I don’t think the parents want to send them there so young, but they need to get out to work to keep their shit together.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:07am
  - cmm
    
    It is a stretch to call them “teachers”. Carers yet, but teachers is pushing it.
    
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    June 19, 2021 4:38pm
- Swifty
  
  And we’re about to see exactly the same scenario play out with the legislative review of the retirement industry.
  
  It’s not left to market forces to deliver value, oh no, meddling lefties must jump in and use the power of the state to coerce operators to satisfy politician’s demands – and with the inevitable result that we’ll have more and more rules and regulations to navigate; fewer, larger operators; costs will rise for retirees and taxpayers; barriers to market entry will be raised and new, innovative retirement offerings will be drowned at birth.
  
  All because lefty politicians are on this relentless crusade to feel good about themselves.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:08am
- Tall Man
  
  My son pays $A116 per day here in Oz.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:02pm
artemisia

Well who would have thunk it. NZ-Oz borders open up and suddenly NZ recruiters are getting a wave of offers for our skilled workers. (Wave so far, tsunami not far off.)

Herald this morning (paywalled) –

Out of workers: Aussie ‘predators’ offer big dollars to lure Kiwi labour
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June 19, 2021 8:37am
- Jack5
  
  That’s always going to be the way while Australia keeps the back door open to NZ.
  
  Australia is way ahead of New Zealand in GDP per capita, and the gap will increase.
  
  Australia has more mineral wealth than us, and is smart about developing. No fuckwitted politician has shut down its huge and growing gas export industry, for example.
  
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  June 19, 2021 8:57am
  - Paulus
    
    We do have large Mineral Wealth but we are not allowed to do anything with as directed by the Greens, Local Councils, Maori and the Labour Government.
    Pathetic !
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:12am
    - Jack5
      
      We’ve got minerals, but Don Brash and others went over the top by counting sea floor resources, especially hydrates, which are also found elsewhere in the world and nearer markets.
      
      We’re about one-thirtieth the size of Australia, and all those deserts in Australia’s interior mean less resistance to mining.
      
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      June 19, 2021 3:41pm
      - Lance
        
        I has at a technical conference on lightening protection once. The speaker had considerable experience with Aus gold mines. The tailings dams are so toxic going out to work on the gear involved full Hazmat suits and breathing gear, hence the emphasis on reliability of electronic/electrical gear being important.
        Because these sites were in the middle of no-where, no-one gave a shit.
        Not sure what it’s like now
        
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        June 19, 2021 4:54pm
  - MCos
    
    A few years ago the Australian company I worked for in Bangkok had work for the foreseeable future on account of mineral sales to China.
    One day China pulled the plug, for some reason, and almost overnight we were bidding for work in the States at a loss just to keep the office going.
    When you’re a trading nation things change once in awhile. Wool was king here once; now it’s a liability to the farmer.
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:21am
- artemisia
  
  From the abovementioned Herald article –
  
  In a HainesAttract survey of skilled professionals earlier this year almost a third of the 204 respondents said they were likely to head overseas once the borders opened. Of that group, 60 per cent said their destination would be Australia. Those in the 25–45 age group were the most likely to go, with the driving factor being career progression and/or employment opportunities.”
  
  Young, skilled and family oriented probably. Our loss.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:02am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  And if I was 25-30I would be off to make a fortune. The job I do gets $54 per hour in Perth
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:05am
- david
  
  Aussies are also more than willing to toss them out when the need subsides. Anyone jumping needs to have their strategies well thought out.
  
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  June 19, 2021 2:24pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Oz only “tosses out” kiwi criminals.
    
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    June 19, 2021 8:01pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Who remembers Denise Roche?
https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/matangireia/story/2018791588/series-2-episode-6-denise-roche-matangireia

Confession: I ‘m sure that this is the first time I’ve ever seen anything about her.
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June 19, 2021 8:39am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  I had also forgotten about that time John Key accused the opposition of supporting rapists.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:09am
  - Fidel Cashflow
    
    Rape is a technical word, but they do support sex offenders more broadly.
    
    16 2
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    June 19, 2021 10:02am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Mallard thinks anything worse than side-eye is rape, and isn’t shy about saying so *
      
      * under Parliamentary Privilege, the gutless wanker.
      
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      June 19, 2021 1:19pm
  - Lance
    
    Was that when Cindy tweeted support for the band that had a song about raping JK’s daughter?
    
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    June 19, 2021 4:56pm
  - Than
    
    The time he completely accurately pointed out the opposition was supporting rapists you mean?
    
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    June 19, 2021 5:23pm
- Swifty
  
  I dealt with her at Auckland City Council (pre-amalgamation) – not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:10am
- Swifty
  
  ““I have no sense of the man – of the person,” Roche said of Key.
  
  “His political persona I thought was just shockingly horrible and reeking of a type of privilege and elitism which I just find offensive to the very core”.
  
  I thought the Greens didn’t do personal attacks?
  
  Privilege and elitism? Was that during or after he grew up without a father and in a state house?
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:17am
  - Gravelroad
    
    @Swifty – it is difficult to admire or take seriously people who use immature emotional feelings as attack weapons against those they don’t like or whose intellect is a bit challenging for them.
    Mr Key made the most of the opportunities that came his way, despite his modest background, and became a respected leader.
    Ms Roche, by her own account, said she would be remembered for making soup for her Green Party colleagues.
    PS Of course the Greens do personal attacks.
    What else have they got?
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:13am
Jack5

Michael Reddell has posted an excellent article on immigration at his Croaking Cassandra blog.

Immigration and productivity, which are related, are the big economic issues for New Zealand.

We’re starting to get PR-type pushes from employers of low skilled and semi-skilled workers, and we need to know where the main political parties stand on immigration.

Meanwhile, a related issue not part of Reddell’s piece …
Dairy farming calls on immigration reflect transition from a family-farm tradition to company farms reliant on imported labour. With the pandemic changing world immigration, and with pressure from the climate-fanatic mob, what shape is the dairy industry going to take?

https://croakingcassandra.com/2021/06/18/immigration-policy-for-new-zealand-post-covid/
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June 19, 2021 8:55am
kowtow

Any wonder the criminal classes have become so emboldened .

Assault cop , previous convictions , continued drug use and risk of further offending …..

….gets you home D.

https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/north-otago/officer%E2%80%99s-fear-attack-might-prove-lethal
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June 19, 2021 9:01am
- cmm
  
  Home D suited him fine the previous time too – after killing someone in a hit and run.
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/north-otago/driver-behind-hit-and-run-death-avoids-prison-again
  
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  June 19, 2021 4:43pm
Benedict Yu

At last a critical article on the vaccine rollout.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125480132/covid19-the-discrepancies-in-the-vaccine-rollout

Only 2 percent of Group 3 has been completed. 2 percent! 2 percent since the start of May. And yet Group 4, the general population will start in July.

Hey Jacinda. This one does not involve a lot of maths. What do you think is going to happen on 1 July? Group 4 will be demanding their vaccine with only 3 percent of Group 3 completed. That may as well be zero. You need to push back group 4 until September.

What did you say? “everything is on track” OK sorry.
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June 19, 2021 9:03am
- slijmbal
  
  @Benedict – it was, surprisingly, a piece of journalism with numbers and analysis and facts, rather than opinion masquerading as such.
  
  One part of me applauded a possible return to a medium investigating and reporting facts rather than part of the cheerleading squad for St Jacinda of the Veil. The other part cynically thinks it’s still sign of bias as if they were being consistent in terms of opinions they should have ripped Labout another one. Here’s hoping.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:52am
  - sooty
    
    I see Taranaki has just left the startline!
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:24am
Brian McDonald

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Well at least no one is moaning this morning.
The Auckland Port is going flat tack, auto straddlers sidelined, new crane operators being trained and a lot of industry. Look for another boost to GDP.
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June 19, 2021 9:08am
- Jack5
  
  The imports surge in, but bugger all is exported from Auckland.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:29am
- TWEEDSE
  
  I see Brian has the same understanding of GDP as the chosen one.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:36am
  - Tall Man
    
    Can’t see the link between increased debt and increased gdp. Certainly qualifies as ignorant.
    
    Increasing government debt to boost an economy is way more destructive in the medium to long term that ramping up immigration…… Providing your immigrants are productive and not bludgers.
    
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    June 19, 2021 7:35pm
KevO'Brien

Biowar–defector bringing perspective?
https://joannenova.com.au/2021/06/rumor-top-chinese-secret-service-man-defected-says-covid-was-military-bioweapon/
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June 19, 2021 9:15am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Great minds eh’ Kev.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:23am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    A possible military threat remains a military threat until proven otherwise/.
    
    8 2
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    June 19, 2021 11:48am
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Umm….I was referring to my post directly below yours 😀
      
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      June 19, 2021 1:35pm
Maggie Pie

BREAKING! And this is HUGE…

Even twitter bestie Prof Anne-Marie Brady doesn’t know about this yet, otherwise she would have tweeted me about it earlier.

“The head of Chinese Intelligence has defected to the US!!

https://twitter.com/EmeraldRobinson/status/1405911564444655621
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June 19, 2021 9:19am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, Hunter’s laptop content is well known but little said by their MSM. What is more interesting is that he has found the well known money laundering scam by using ‘art’. He has as much artistic talent as a sea urchin, but more interesting is that he can charge half a million dollars for his ‘works’ and no one bats an eyelid. Sure beats getting cushy jobs on Chinese company boards when the same amounts can be funnelled for works of art.
  
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  June 19, 2021 9:40am
- RockyJ
  
  I heard it here first. Thanks.
  
  16 2
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  June 19, 2021 9:43am
- SB2
  
  “He’s provided DIA with the contents of Hunter Biden’s laptop. ” ??
  
  LOL
  
  Rumours have it that he might have information about e Wuhan Institute of Virology as he served in the area of Hubie
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:20am
  - Inandout
    
    SB2, your house of cards is falling regardless. The US media that is Dem compliant is starting to develop cracks, and Biden’s off-script rantings and ramblings aimed at the press corp are damaging. Almost daily something new is appearing that is not Dem approved.
    
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    June 19, 2021 10:35am
    - Batman
      
      Lol whut? He gets cranky at a reporter for thirty seconds and that’s proof of what?
      
      Meanwhile, the last guy quite literally spent years calling them enemies of the people and leading chants against them, which led to pipe bombs and death threats against them by the most unhinged of his followers.
      
      Spare us your hypocrisy.
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:03am
Jack5

Will the Covid-19 vaccine New Zealand has given Papua New Guinea, enough for 126,000 jabs, be used before it becomes useless?

Papua New Guinea faces donated vaccine becoming useless because of resistance to being vaccinated. This while it is reporting up to a thousand new cases a day of of Covid-19.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-06/png-comes-up-with-creative-way-to-vaccinate-people/100177968
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June 19, 2021 9:28am
Swifty

Today, June the 19th, is now officially recognised in the States as Juneteenth National Independence Day – commemorating the end of slavery:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juneteenth

I think this is a bloody good idea and a milestone worth celebrating.

So much so that I think we should do it here and invite KBers to nominate dates they think suitable to commemorate the British ending the longstanding and brutal slavery practices of Maori against other Maori – the horrific effects of which we can only guess at although we know, if we are to be consistent, must still be felt in the current day as with the effects of colonisation.

Also, will the Labour and Green Parties take up this so-honourable call to action?
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June 19, 2021 9:30am
- Fidel Cashflow
  
  It’s not about celebrating ending slavery, its another blow in the Cultural Revolution. It doesn’t stop at new holidays or tearing down Robert E Lee statues. If it does ever stop, it’s when there stands a quasi-Brazilian third world society on the land where America once stood, and when all traces of the founding (i.e. White) Americans are erased and their ancestors are subjugated. That is the logical conclusion. It happened in Zimbabwe, and is happening right now in South Africa. The other dominoes will fall in due course. If you think I’m exaggerating, look at how far things have fallen in even the last 4 or 5 years, and how racial antagonism and the associated racial guilt is one of the central political issues, even if there is an ongoing effort to not say this specifically. It will eventually become unavoidable. Like it or not, but it is what it is.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:13am
- Inandout
  
  Swifty, this will have Nike shaking in their running shoes. Made in slave factories in China for $6, selling in western stores $180.00. Then there is Apple.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:24am
  - Fidel Cashflow
    
    The reason Lebron James doesn’t criticise China is because the NBA is effectively owned by the Chinese.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:06am
    - Batman
      
      “effectively” – which is to say, not owned by China.
      
      Unless you can provide some financial documents which show that the National Basketball Association is majority owned by Chinese entities?
      
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      June 19, 2021 11:11am
      - oldfella
        
        Bats, FWIW, just Googled it and got:
        Since 2007, the NBA has held preseason games in China every year except one. About 800 million viewers in China watched the NBA last season, and modest estimates of the amount of revenue the league generates there are generally pegged at about $500m annually.
        Doesn’t sound like ownership, but it sure ain’t chump change. And players like LeBron make a fortune from their own merchandise made in cheap-labour Chinese factories.
        
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        June 19, 2021 11:36am
      - Fidel Cashflow
        
        “Effectively” means functionally in this case. There is huge Chinese investment in that league. They don’t “actually” own the NBA, which is why I didn’t use that word. It’s the same reason that John Cena had to come out and apologise for saying that Taiwan would be the “first country” to see his new film. If you are apologising to someone, it’s generally because they own you.
        
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        June 19, 2021 11:54am
- KevO'Brien
  
  We did it already with the Treaty. (Some Maori are wanting to return to their former opportunities.)
  
  Nothing further is needed except to stop the excess activism including He Puapua.
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:52am
Maggy Wassilieff

NZ has not released official Suicide data since 2016.

The 2017 suicide data is expected to be published in the coming weeks, he said.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/445033/new-zealand-s-high-suicide-rate-call-for-clearer-pathway-from-government
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June 19, 2021 9:36am
- MCos
  
  Provisional figures are released every year. Because some deaths wait years for a coronial investigation to be completed official figure lag behind.
  Maybe if someone is charged with murder over an apparent suicide, for example, & the coroner waits for the outcome. Is that how these things work?
  https://coronialservices.justice.govt.nz/assets/Documents/Publications/2020-Annual-Provisional-Suicide-Statistics.pdf
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:32am
  - david
    
    If that is the case, what is the magnitude of the number of those that have yet to be determined. The data would still be useful if it was:
    a) timely
    b) annotated as to accuracy.
    
    So I would rather see this week:
    2020 statistics
    357 + 6 TBD
    
    than:
    2017 statistics
    498 (final)
    
    Because:
    The trend from 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020 will be a hell of a lot more useful when it comes to policy formation than to be working 5 years behind. That is, of course, if you are concerned enough to have some meaningful policy to do something about this horrible scourge.
    
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    June 19, 2021 2:48pm
- TWEEDSE
  
  Hmm, now what happened in 2017 that changed the release of suicide figures. What could it have been…
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:45am
lastmanstanding

Next year is the 100th anniversary of the founding of the Chinese Communist Party. 2029 is the 80th anniversary of the Chinese Revolution.
IMHO the CCP will use one of these dates to “Reunify” Taiwan.
The West will offer no military resistance. They will tut tut in the UN etc but thats all.
This will embolden the CCP to set it sights on other countries in South East Asia and the South Pacific.
It will know the large Western countries wont risk nucleur war.
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June 19, 2021 9:52am
- SB2
  
  Nor China risk a Nuclear war given America’s overwhelming advantage with nukes.
  
  In other words plenty of military parades, speeches and flag-waving but little else.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:18am
  - kevn
    
    @sb2… What would you know? SFA
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:13am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Please provide us with your own military and diplomatic expertise…
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:14pm
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Based on current attitudes in the US toward China, which is fully bipartisan, I have no doubt that the US will come to the aid of the Taiwanese. Basically air and naval. Aircraft carriers out to the east of Taiwan flying missions against the invasion fleet. US submarines sinking the invasion fleet in the Taiwan Straits.
  
  How would it become nuclear? It would require China to go nuclear first. China is hardly likely to nuke Taiwan. They won’t nuke the US mainland. Would they nuke Guam or the US carriers? The last is the most likely. But they would inevitably suffer a counter nuclear strike against a Chinese military target, most probably the invasion fleet. So that would clearly end the invasion.
  
  I don’t think any of the above will happen.
  
  China knows it already has a riled up USA. One that would most likely come to the aid of Taiwan. At the very least China can no longer rule that out. An attempted invasion would turn an incipient cold war into a hot war.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:25am
  - oldfella
    
    Wayne, what if the US recognized Taiwan as an independent country? Might be a good time to do it and head off a future strike on Taiwan by China.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:41am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Darn foolish. Taiwan is plainly part of China. It was a refuge for a former army. That doesn’t give them ownership rights.
    
    Don’t engage in other’s peoples fights unless you want you nose bloodied or worse.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:56am
    - oldfella
      
      Kev, I doubt the Taiwanese see their future as reuniting with mainland China. Why would they?
      The citizens in Taiwan can change their government through elections and are held to enjoy most basic rights, according to a 2004 Freedom House report. Freedom House rates Taiwan as among the most “Free” nations in Asia, with a 1 in both Political Rights and Civil Liberties (scale of 1-7, with 1 being the highest).
      Can’t imagine Taiwan swapping that kind of freedom to become another Hong Kong.
      
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      June 19, 2021 12:38pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        They may not, but historical territorial rights are long remembered. Maori are still hoping to reclaim NZ.
        
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        June 19, 2021 4:39pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Even without US assistance, I doubt that China has the resources for a successful invasion. Taiwan has a very large and well-equipped military.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:26am
  - Sponge
    
    I watched a doco on this recently that speculated that the biggest issue for China would be that they do not possess enough landing craft to get sufficient men and supplies/support to establish a proper beachhead. It was suggested that they would need to use civilian ships which would be vunerable and very slow to unload.
    
    If the producer knows what he is talking about or not I have no idea but it seems plausible to me.
    
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    December 19, 2020 12:07pm
    - Jack5
      
      Milky’s right. Taiwan wouldn’t be a pushover.
      
      The Taiwanese have close to 300 jet fighters, 90 attack helicopters, 8750 armoured vehicles including 1160 tanks, 26 destroyers or frigates, and four submarines.
      
      https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-detail.php?country_id=taiwan
      
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      June 19, 2021 3:03pm
      - Jack5
        
        The strategic value of Taiwan comes from its electronic chip industry.
        
        Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co, the world’s 11th biggest company by sharemarket value, makes more than 90 per cent of the world’s most sophisticated processors, including nearly all those for cellphones and cars.
        
        There is a world shortage of electronic chips at present, and TSMC is spending about $NZ145 billion expanding its factories, or fabs, as they are known. It costs close to $NZ30 billion to set up a fab.
        
        The Wall Street Journal likens Taiwan’s importance to the chip industry to the Middle East’s importance in oil.
        
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        June 19, 2021 5:27pm
      - chukar
        
        This is totally crazy , even thinking of nuclear war
        Have none of you heard of a nuclear winter?
        I suppose it would get rid of global warming worries!
        And sort any overpopulation issues.
        This is reality!
        
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        June 19, 2021 8:17pm
- Manu-Rau
  
  Actually, the CPC’s 100th anniversary falls on 23 July this year. The celebrations start on 1 July. I was watching the rehearsals for the military flyover over Tiananmen Square from my Chaoyang apartment this morning. Quite spectacular.
  
  And Wayne Mapp is quite correct. China knows it cannot retake Taiwan by force without destroying the island and its people, and incurring catastrophic losses itself. It simply ain’t gonna happen.
  
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  June 20, 2021 1:25am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING….

EV’s banned from using carparks at Fieldays.

https://twitter.com/samueltowen/status/1405758249685557254
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June 19, 2021 9:57am
- RockyJ
  
  Ha ha. Only thing better would have been for it to be towed out by one of those carbon spewing Ford Rangers.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:11am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Dodge Ram 5.7L Hemi petrol
    
    14 2
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    June 19, 2021 12:00pm
- Nickc2
  
  Well done Field Day organisers!
  
  17 1
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  June 19, 2021 10:24am
Maggy Wassilieff

Cultural appropriation that we will have to learn with

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/18/kiwi-wars-the-golden-fruit-fuelling-a-feud-between-new-zealand-and-china
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June 19, 2021 10:03am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Above is meant to read:
  learn to live with.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:38am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Apparently Clark Gayford will not be ditching his ute, it is sponsored, so it is different for him. Heard on red radio this morning.
There are special people in NZ
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June 19, 2021 10:05am
- godruelf
  
  Is there a prize for the first photo of Cindy riding in the sponsored Ute? Bet she won’t be going for a ride with Clark anytime soon. Could be a new ad for Waka K no one wants to ride with that Fulla
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:11am
- Gravelroad
  
  @ S. Otto – heard this last evening via HDPA and Barry Soper.
  I thought the whole reasoning behind this 4×4/Ute tax was to decrease the number of vehicles judged to be unacceptable due to their emissions.
  But now we have numpties like Ms and Mr Ardern Gayford talking about who should actually be allowed to have utes and whether they are “legitimate” users.
  Whether I buy, lease, steal or accept a sponsored Ute is irrelevant, surely?
  It’s not how or why I got it, it’s whether their emissions are deemed to be unacceptable in the era of climate change panic. No?
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:26am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Correct. Bu it is another example of ‘do as I say, not as I do’
    
    28 2
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    June 19, 2021 10:40am
  - rockape
    
    My wife is going to sponsor me into a 5 Litre supercharged Jaguar XJ.
    
    24 1
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    June 19, 2021 11:07am
    - sooty
      
      Good for you! You had better buy her some flowers, smellies and dinner to thank her!
      
      10 0
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      June 19, 2021 11:34am
  - chukar
    
    Yes Gravel,
    And its all about taking all vehicles off the peasantry and getting them out walking or biking.
    The bureaucrats and leaders will still have their own large vehicles as befits their status .
    Other New Zealanders will not be able to afford ownership.
    EVs and utes will be cost prohibitive now and there will be similar cost increases for sedans and people movers using more trumped up excuses.
    Just think of the savings ,no new roads or maintenance of rural roads.
    The good thing is this will be the end of this idiotic government.
    Any government that gets between people and their vehicles will get run over.
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:18am
  - Sacha
    
    I heard an interview on Nat rad this morning, concerning the dangers of ‘Utes’ with bullbars crushing other road users because of their size, in the city (Auckland of course) and the desirability of EVs which apparently wouldn’t run over people .
    At the end, the interviewer asked the interviewee if he had an EV.
    Pause.
    “I have 5 bikes. And a small (some sort of car) .”
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:39am
    - cmm
      
      5 bikes??? C’mon Cindy told us to stop being greedy. Can’t he send 4 of those bikes to the Islands.
      
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      June 19, 2021 4:51pm
Maggy Wassilieff

What is a normal birth?

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/jun/19/ive-been-delivering-babies-for-50-years-what-exactly-is-a-normal-birth
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June 19, 2021 10:10am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

First they said we will fix child poverty …they didn’t.
Then they said they will build plenty of houses … nope.
Then they said they will plant some trees…nope.
Then they said they are coming for our utes and trucks … I think we’re gonna be sweet
41 1
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June 19, 2021 10:14am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  they are coming for our utes and trucks
  
  I can’t see that happening before our Dear Leader has had her Gizzy wedding.
  
  Not enuf ev charging points in the district for the fleet of Journos that will be on hand to record/report the happy occasion.
  
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  June 19, 2021 10:47am
  - sooty
    
    They could transport in a range of cars and generators to charge them!
    
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    June 19, 2021 11:38am
lifesgood

Seems the lefties have worked out how to combat “Turn Ardern” . The latest hagiography by her sycophants has written a vomit inducing spiel on the back cover. It makes you ill which ever way you look at it. What to do…what to do? Probably have to put other books in front of it.
28 3
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June 19, 2021 10:38am
- Sacha
  
  I always put the mag back in behind another type of magazine. Just for fun.
  
  17 2
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  June 19, 2021 11:42am
- oldfella
  
  LF, turn the book upside down and call the campaign ‘Spin Cindy’.
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:45am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Carlson calls out Twitter.
https://rumble.com/viod3j-twitter-proves-tucker-correct-while-attempting-to-fact-check-him.html?
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June 19, 2021 10:38am
Maggie Pie

A bestie from tennis retweets….

‘This just shows how pathetically ‘WOKE’ the world has become.
Even attempting to speak Chinese has become a crime to some people’.

https://twitter.com/newscomauHQ/status/1405807495789039616
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June 19, 2021 11:21am
- oldfella
  
  Maggie, caught a video clip the other day of Jackie Chan talking about ‘royalty’, and having great trouble with the ‘R’ sound.
  Can’t wait till we tell China we are now ‘Aotearoa’. 😉
  
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  June 19, 2021 11:50am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Your Pronunciation guide:
    https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=zh-CN&text=Aotearoa&op=translate
    
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    June 19, 2021 1:09pm
Fletch

Alan Jones on how Joe Biden is an embarrassment and wonders why anyone would listen to this dementia patient..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzSAEQjqlns

It’s true. It’s an embarrassment to have this man as leader of the free world. He can’t even keep his train of thought.
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June 19, 2021 11:23am
- mikenmildagain
  
  “Person, man, woman, camera, TV”
  
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  June 19, 2021 12:16pm
- lifesgood
  
  And I’ve never seen a President so dependent on his wife before. She’s always there to take his hand and help him off the podium. Jill Biden is as much of a disgrace as the left wing media. Fancy allowing her husband to be used this way. She can’t love him much, that’s for sure.
  
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  June 19, 2021 12:18pm
  - cmm
    
    Edith Wilson effectively functioned as President for 2 years when her hubby had a stroke.
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edith_Wilson
    
    Biden’s not far off.
    
    3 1
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    June 19, 2021 4:56pm
- SB2
  
  I wonder how the shock jock will last on Sky News given his poor track record,
  
  https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/an-advertiser-exodus-meant-the-writing-was-on-the-wall-for-alan-jones-20200512-p54s2s.html
  
  2 23
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  June 19, 2021 12:40pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    You still sleeping in the Corona overnight to get a park outside work?
    
    LOL!!!
    
    15 3
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    June 19, 2021 1:29pm
  - Inandout
    
    SB2, probably as long as you last at St Lukes.
    
    8 1
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    June 19, 2021 3:27pm
  - lifesgood
    
    Are you mad? This article was written a year ago. Alan Jones is one of Sky News’s most popular presenters. He’s going strong thank you very much
    
    9 1
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    June 19, 2021 4:08pm
- herb1
  
  “ he can’t even keep his train of thought”
  Perhaps because the train is owned by unspecified “other” interests
  
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  June 19, 2021 1:51pm
nathie

Heh, it takes the Aussies to show us how to do things. National and Judith Collins should take note, this is how you deal with the urban liberal Greens (and Labour Party) pushing their climate change BS!

And look how the Oz Government stand ups for their farmers and manufacturers (see accompanying video).

Acting Prime Minister Michael McCormack has labelled Adam Bandt a “traitor to Australia”, declaring “hell will freeze over” before the Coalition government listens to the Greens over its climate policy.

The Greens leader accused the federal government’s failure to commit to net zero emissions a “death sentence” to Australians, saying the government was “ripping apart our country’s social fabric”.

In reply, Mr McCormack criticised Mr Bandt for urging foreign nations not to trade with Australia, labelling the Member for Melbourne’s actions “treasonous” and a “disgrace”.

“You talk of global warming; hell will freeze over before I start listening to the Greens,” he said.

“The Member for Melbourne should begin to talk things up in Australia, not run us down.

“He should not write to ambassadors to Australia and urge them to tell their countries not to trade with Australia. That is, I’m sorry, a disgrace.

“Treasonous, I would call that, absolute traitor to Australia.”

So apparently the Australian Greens are writing to ambassadors telling them not to trade with Australia (see towards end of video for more), will the Green Party here be copy cats and be disloyal? Perhaps it’s just a matter of time.

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6259230759001
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June 19, 2021 11:27am
- MCos
  
  I think Mr McCormack was getting stuck into the Green Party over there for encouraging foreign powers to act against Australia’s interests.
  
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  June 19, 2021 1:16pm
Maggie Pie

And we’ve only just realised the force of that Tornado this morning.
My partners had to lower the water level in the pool by about 4cm.
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June 19, 2021 11:46am
- gravedodger
  
  Just how many partners Maggie asking for an old tennis mate?
  
  10 0
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  June 19, 2021 11:54am
- SB2
  
  You mean this kind of pool. Surely?
  
  https://www.thewarehouse.co.nz/p/bestway-fast-set-pool-6ft/R2584105.html?gclsrc=aw.ds&ds_rl=1268368&ds_rl=1268368&gclid=CjwKCAjwiLGGBhAqEiwAgq3q_iS1awQtDMOEb6R0gkFpqdLhGCx3RwrehSOaxuwWOQC75hihwhTrUhoC-iUQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
  
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  June 19, 2021 12:34pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    😀
    
    4 1
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    June 19, 2021 1:25pm
- MCos
  
  How many Rolls Royces did it take?
  
  1 0
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  June 19, 2021 2:28pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Greenpeace idiot injures people at soccer match
https://notrickszone.com/2021/06/18/nazca-style-debacle-reckless-greenpeace-publicity-stunt-goes-awry-2-hospitalized-no-regard-for-safety/
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June 19, 2021 1:22pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

There’s quite a good website you can google called…. Judge the Judges.

One they rank really low, is ‘Judge Joana Maze’, saying….

“Judge Joanna Maze has let herself down, let the country down and done nothing to win respect for the judiciary”

Reading yet another of Joana’s findings published in this mornings ODT ……well, you be the judge 🙁

https://odt.co.nz/regions/north-otago/officer's-fear-attack-might-prove-lethal
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June 19, 2021 1:23pm
- LB
  
  He should be banned from driving for 25 years after recklessly taking a life and breaking that ban should be a mandatory prison sentence, which also happens to be one of the most successful drug addiction programs as a last resort(prison)
  
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  June 19, 2021 5:52pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Anyone got any clues as to why “Stuff” is digging up old stuff on Meng Foon?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/125494841/race-relations-commissioner-meng-foon-receives-full-support-from-hrc-after-revelations-of-dia-investigation

Has Meng Foon departed from the correct script?

Has our Dear Leader realised Labour appointed a loose cannon as the race-relations commissioner?

Or is “Stuff” just indulging in a bit of Asian bashing?
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June 19, 2021 1:44pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  It’s like my partner says Maggs, “They’re all the same”
  
  6 4
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  June 19, 2021 1:55pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    But “They” are “us”
    
    9 1
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    June 19, 2021 2:40pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  A serious allegation: Meng Foon was seeking kickbacks from poker machine grant.
  
  8 1
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  June 19, 2021 4:45pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    He will have no option but to resign with this hanging over his head.
    
    4 2
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    June 19, 2021 5:31pm
Maggie Pie

And I can assure you of something else….

You’re never likely to see this in the carpark at the Tennis Club 🙁

https://twitter.com/NoPauseTv/status/1405587474760585219
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June 19, 2021 2:16pm
Maggy Wassilieff

I planted a kaffir lime over my dear departed puddy-cat, but now I must remember to call it a Thai Lime or a makrut lime.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/06/17/business-food/waitrose-lime-leaves-scli-intl-gbr/index.html
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June 19, 2021 3:01pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  It’s also in use by Muslims to refer to those who are not part of their community.
  
  5 2
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  June 19, 2021 4:42pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Indeed
    كافر
    
    5 0
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    June 19, 2021 5:11pm
- graham
  
  Oh dear … does that mean I have to toss out all my wife’s cookbooks which use “kaffir lime leaves”?
  
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  June 19, 2021 5:06pm
Maggie Pie

And I see where Batman’s sex-life is still trending on Twitter 😛

https://twitter.com/visakanv/status/1406074080168538117
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June 19, 2021 3:58pm
cmm

So both Linwood and AlNoor mosques have a problem with the way money is handled.

“In the weeks that followed the trust applied for a $100,000 ethnic communities development fund, which it claimed would be spent on Ramadan costs.”

Is someone taking the piss?

Ramadan is a month long period of fasting during the day, but mosques often provide a light meal after sundown.

It would seem that they managed to scam the taxpayers for 0ver $3000 a day to provide these breakfasts.

But whitey bad – whitey pay!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/125326270/linwood-mosque-trust-in-disarray-over-claims-terror-attack-cash-was-misused
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June 19, 2021 5:07pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Get your Ute out of the city
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/saturday/audio/2018800439/alistair-woodward-the-rise-of-the-urban-light-truck
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June 19, 2021 5:33pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Another loopy green
  
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  June 20, 2021 8:27am
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/125497786/court-strikes-down-ministers-tarakihi-catchlimit-decision
Looks as though Stuart Nash was getting the same Fishing industry benefits as did Winston Peters.
As they say: everyone has their price.
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June 19, 2021 6:18pm
GJM

Well, white people are a global minority, at 12% of the population i believe.
Oppression of minority groups is a thing so the Woke tell me, so expect more discrimination against whiteys, except for paying for everything. They are still expected to do that.
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June 19, 2021 7:36pm

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