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May 9, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 09 May 2022

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General Debate

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Scott

Looking at this Labour government reminds me of the British government at the beginning of World War II, as I read a biography of Winston Churchill. Churchill was pushing for action against the supply of iron ore from Sweden and Norway that was building Nazi Germany’s war machine. But he could never persuade Chamberlin and his cronies to any action. They couldn’t blockade the German ships because that would upset Norway. They couldn’t take over the iron ore mines because that would upset Sweden. Then the dominions such as Australia demanded a say in what was going on. Then they had to consult the French. Then they had to debate the issue for two weeks. Before finally deciding to do nothing. Meanwhile Hitler was winning the war.

Our government is like that. They spend months and years on analysis, on consultants, before finally deciding to do nothing. They have to consult iwi, they have to do a climate change analysis, they have to do discuss equity challenges and is this in accordance with the Treaty of Waitangi? And meanwhile nothing gets done.
No new land is release for housing while thousands of people live in state funded motels. In the 1950s and 60s we built thousands and thousands of affordable houses. Now 60 years later we suffer paralysis from analysis. We have more technology and more know-how than ever but we cannot bring ourselves to build the thousands and thousands of affordable homes that are needed.

I even wonder if this government wants us to be more prosperous? In 1939 Neville Chamberlain really didn’t want to wage war. He couldn’t bring himself to win a war that he actually didn’t want to fight. Today I don’t think a labour government wants its citizens to become rich and prosperous. They certainly have no plan for growth and prosperity.

When you vote in a labour government you should check your bank balance and your investments and calculate your net worth. That’s as good as it’s going to get. In fact you are going to get poorer. Inflation is going to eat away at your savings, your children will not be able to afford any sort of house unless you help finance it and millions of dollars of taxpayer money will be spent on useless consultants and useless projects such as a passenger train between Hamilton and Auckland that nobody uses.

This government has no aspiration, no plan for growth and prosperity and no clue. If you only want cycleways and rainbow crossings then vote labour. But if you have aspirations for a stronger more prosperous New Zealand then you will have to cast your vote elsewhere.
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May 9, 2022 8:03am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  It is commonplace to make Chamberlain the villain, and Churchill the hero, of Britain’s response to Hitler from 1938 to 1940. It’s superficial and lazy history, or course, but firmly cemented in popular imagination.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:19am
  - hmmokrightitis
    
    Could Chamberlain have seen war coming? In all honesty, probably, yes. Churchill, although at that stage an outcast, even in his own party, he had, with a few others, been sounding that call for years – preparedness was the message, and Chamberlain, knowing his people didnt want another war, wanted a different way.
    
    But that shouldn’t have stopped him getting the country ready. That said, if they had gone to war in ’38 they would have failed utterly, they just weren’t ready. If Hitler had listened more to his generals and less to himself things would have been significantly different.
    
    Chamberlain wasn’t a villain, but his path led the country perilously close to defeat. Churchill a hero? No, he oversaw some truly awful acts of war, but that’s war – and he gave the country belief which is what they really needed. Cometh the hour etc.
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:17am
    - David Garrett
      
      Hmmo: Churchill not a hero? I think even old Milky would acknowledge that if Halifax had succeeded Chamberlain rather than WSC, it is very much more likely than not that Britain would have sued for peace – and ended up at best a vassal state like Vichy France, or worse, a slave state like Poland.
      
      As for him overseeing “truly awful acts of war”, I suppose you are referring primarily to the bomber war in which he was 100% behind Harris – until right at the end, when people began to feel awkward about the continuing destruction of cities. But what else could they do from the summer of 1940 until ’44? Yes, North Africa was important, but for most Britons that was far away and not uppermost in their minds.
      
      Churchill made many mistakes in his long and illustrious career – and he was the first to admit to them.
      
      You mention Hitler not listening to his generals; that was one fault Churchill certainly didn’t have, at least not in WW II. As several biographers have noted, if the generals were all agreed, he never overruled them – one of the many lessons he learned from the Dardanelles.
      
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      May 9, 2022 10:26am
      - Rodion Raskolnikov
        
        Churchill is an exemplar of a deeply flawed figure who was in many ways an abject failure, but who was made into a hero post facto. Churchill’s primary mission in political life was to do three things:
        
        1) To preserve the British Empire;
        2) To keep socialism at bay; and
        3) To prevent any hostile power from dominating Europe.
        
        He failed spectacularly in all of these ambitions. As a result of the war, Britain lost its empire and mortgaged itself to the United States; socialism came to the UK and Europe after the war had ended; and the brutal Stalinist USSR dominated in Europe for 5o years after the war. The “iron curtain,” that Churchill famously described, fell over Europe as a direct result of Churchill selling out most of Eastern Europe in collusion with Stalin at conferences at Yalta, Teheran and Moscow. Arguably, defeating Hitler turned out far worse for Europe than helping Hitler defeat Stalin (and Hitler long sought an alliance with Britain to do so).
        
        When, as late as 1943, Spain’s General Franco expressed his fears of Soviet domination of Europe after the war. Churchill wrote back saying:
        
        “Do you really believe that a single nation is strong enough to dominate Europe after this war? And that it will be actually Russia. . . . I venture to prophesy that, after the war, England will be the greatest military power in Europe. I am sure that England’s influence will be stronger in Europe than it has ever been before since the days of the fall of Napoleon.”
        
        Churchill was known for his eloquence, but he also developed a lasting reputation for his appalling judgement.
        
        Moreover, “I suppose you are referring primarily to the bomber war in which he was 100% behind Harris.”
        
        I suggest that it was Harris who was behind Churchill, not the other way around. While at Yalta, Churchill ordered Operation Thunderclap, massive air strikes (including the firebombing of non-military targets like Dresden) to de-house German civilians to turn them into refugees to clog the roads over which German soldiers had to move to stop a Red Army offensive. Churchill said in a later memo that the strategy had been “[the] bombing of German cities simply for the sake of increasing the terror, though under other pretexts.”
        
        One account of these war crimes reads:
        
        “On the first night of the raid, 770 Lancasters arrived over Dresden around 10 p.m. In two waves three hours apart, 650,000 incendiary bombs rained down on Dresden’s narrow streets and baroque buildings, together with another 1,474 tons of high explosives. . . . The fires burned for seven days. More than 1,600 acres of the city were devastated (compared to 100 acres burned in the German raid on Coventry) and melting streets burned the shoes off those attempting to flee. Cars untouched by fire burst into flames just from the heat. Thousands sought refuge in cellars where they died, robbed of oxygen by the flames, before the buildings above them collapsed … The morning after the Lancasters struck, five hundred B-17s arrived over Dresden in two waves with three hundred fighter escorts to strafe fleeing survivors. Estimates of the dead in the firestorm range up to 250,000.”
        
        Churchill is a significant historical figure, no doubt. However, we like to tell ourselves otherwise, but barbarism isn’t restricted to only one side in any war.
        
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        May 9, 2022 1:04pm
      - David Garrett
        
        RR: Where to start with that? Let’s start with what you got right: Yes, the Empire as such didn’t survive the war; but then it was on the way out anyway. Although Churchill stubbornly opposed independence for India, by the late 30’s that was inevitable, and he was fighting a losing battle. And one can argue that the commonwealth of nations – many of them republics – that succeeded the Empire was a much better grouping anyway – and it’s lasted 80 years.
        
        Secondly yes, given the Soviet domination of much of central and Eastern Europe after 1945, you could say that socialism – or more accurately totalitarianism – won out. But had Hitler won, it would have been very much worse, even if he failed to defeat Russia, and ruled from Poland to the Spanish border. A Nazi dominated Western Europe for 50 years doesn’t bear thinking about.
        
        Do you really believe that Hitler would ever have kept to any agreement with the Brits under which they would have united against the “Bolshevism” Churchill was so opposed to? If you do, what makes you think he would have stuck to that agreement when he broke literally every other one he ever made? Because, as he said, Britain was not his natural enemy? Because they were the closest thing to the Aryans he liked so much? Perhaps…the way the Nazis behaved in Norway and Denmark would suggest otherwise.
        
        You seem not to understand that Churchill was Harris’s boss. He sacked any number of generals who either didn’t follow his directions or who he thought were wanting in some other way. If he had thought either of those things of Harris, he would have sacked him too, just as he sacked his predecessor for being ineffective. He didn’t; just hung him out to dry – and shamefully didn’t acknowledge Bomber Command’s contribution – right at the end.
        
        Dresden. You are clearly relying on an out of date source for that stat filled penultimate paragraph; David Irving perhaps? To take the last stats first, German sources now acknowledge that the death toll was more like 25,000 than 250,000; in fact contemporary sources say the latter figure came about from Goebbels simply adding a zero to the actual casualty number because that sounded so much worse than the reality, and helped him portray the Allies as uncaring brutes and murderers of children.
        
        Secondly it is quite wrong that Dresden had no military value (Irving again I suspect). In fact there were a number of precision instrument factories making instruments for German fighters. It was also a major road and rail junction crucial to shipping men and materiel to the Eastern Front which was then the major theatre of the War.
        
        Nevertheless, it is now pretty much agreed by all historians who count that at that late stage in the war the destruction of Dresden was unnecessary and unjustified. But a “war crime”? Only Irving and a few second raters would agree. It was total war, and unlike the Italians, there were was never any significant resistance to either Nazism or Adolf himself among the people. As Harris himself famously said “they have sown the wind; now they will reap the whirlwind”
        
        War is awful. As Churchill himself said several times “jaw jaw is better than war war”.
        
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        May 9, 2022 1:50pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Re bombing of ‘military targets’. The British and US were incapable of precision bombing, so pretended that cities were legitimate targets – a stance clearly at odds with international law to 1939. The Germans and Japanese also ignored the prohibition, but not the postwar tribunals didn’t have the gall to try anyone for that specific crime.
        
        As Curtis LeMay put it:
        
        I suppose if I had lost the war, I would have been tried as a war criminal…. Every soldier thinks something of the moral aspects of what he is doing. But all war is immoral and if you let that bother you, you’re not a good soldier.
        
        In short, ‘military necessity’ justifies any war crime, so long as your side is the victor.
        
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        May 9, 2022 2:28pm
    - MCōs
      
      There was two schools of thought Chamberlain and Halifax wanted peace and Churchill wanted to continue fighting.
      Chamberlain as good as lost a no confidence vote in the Commons and resigned. Halifax, the King’s preference, didn’t want the job so it went to Churchill. A far from universally popular choice.
      He formed a war cabinet that included Chamberlain who died six months later.
      Dunkirk occurred only a couple of weeks into Churchill’s leadership. A rough start.
      
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      May 9, 2022 1:41pm
  - Cassandra
    
    mike: correct again – Chamberlain was the dominant figure in his Cabinet, not the weakling now portrayed. Sadly he and his colleagues were totally wrong but then so was everyone else. Including Stalin and Mussolini!
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:19am
  - David Garrett
    
    Milky: As someone else well said the other day: why do you stick to your inane “international X day”?
    
    You know fuck all about military history, and it shows, every time you tap the keys.
    That said, Chamberlain wasn’t quite the silly old duffer he is portrayed as, but he was certainly an appeaser, long after it should have been glaringly obvious that Adolf wasn’t going to stop, and Churchill had been right all along.
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:58am
    - Mike
      
      I haven’t noticed any reluctance from Mr Garrett to opine about things about which he is wilfully misinformed, including:
      – history in general, but particularly ignorant of NZ and Pacific history, anything military, imperialism and colonialism
      – political theory and history
      – religion (in general, but notably weak in knowledge of Islam)
      – constitutional law and practice
      – penology
      – racism
      And too many other subjects to list concisely.
      
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      May 9, 2022 10:29am
      - David Garrett
        
        …Whereas you Milky think you know more than well renowned Churchill scholars; more than Sir Martin Gilbert, more than Anthony Beevor, more than Andrew Roberts, more than …well, name any military historian of WW II other than David Irving.
        
        More front than a London bus.
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:09pm
      - RoboRob
        
        Question for the mods, are we ‘allowed’ multipe accounts?
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:12pm
      - David Garrett
        
        …and there was one thing absent from your recent sneering dismissal of my wee list of Islamic abominations: any denial that I was making any of them up.
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:15pm
      - gump
        
        It’s important to understand that Mr Garrett ‘feels’ that he is correct in all things, and as such has no need for facts, or logic, or evidence that contradicts his assertions.
        
        If you challenge his falsifications, misunderstandings, or outright fabrications then you’ll receive an emotionally charged insult as your reply. I used to think that it was a case of being “tired and emotional” as Private Eye used to delicately put it – and maybe that’s still a contributing factor. But the broader issue is that his opinions are based on ‘feelings’ and consequently can only be defended with feelings.
        
        The young people that he frequently mocks here actually have a phrase for this. They describe a person like David as being “feels over reals”. I’m inclined to agree with their assessment.
        
        Feels over reals: (colloquial, derogatory) preference for one’s feelings or beliefs over the reality that they contradict.
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:20pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        True gump.
        He’s not really up to rational, dispassionate debate, so the only thing to do is rebut his bullshit with as much deliberate rudeness as is permitted by the moderators.
        
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        May 9, 2022 2:31pm
      - wilderbeast
        
        DG seems very well reasoned and informed to me, including his view of you Mike. The only slight criticism I might level is the amount of energy he wastes arguing with you.
        
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        May 9, 2022 5:38pm
  - leoj
    
    ….says he, writing in English and not German.
    Are you sure you’re not a whinging pom?
    After saving their arses (and the world’s) through his steadfastness, the poms dumped Churchill in the first election after the war.
    Brainless!
    
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    May 9, 2022 7:06pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  This Labour Government had 9 long years in Opposition – looks like the only thing they were working on was to push through a bicultural co-management agenda.
  
  They seem clueless about improving the wellbeing of the Nation and its citizens.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:41am
  - Thought Criminal
    
    This is so true. Have we ever had a lazier political party. What do they do all day?
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:00am
    - artemisia
      
      Hey, that’s mean, they are really busy. So many meetings, so many documents to read, so many CVs to polish, lunch.
      
      It’s called look busy in case the boss pops in.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:28am
    - Prince
      
      Apart fro seeking out consultancy jobs for friends and whanau.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:32am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      “What do they do all day?” Think about announcing an announcement one day.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:47am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    They did something about the future of work didn’t they…?
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:42am
- Aunty
  
  “….I don’t think a labour government wants its citizens to become rich and prosperous.”
  
  No Labour Government wants its citizens to become rich and prosperous. It never has and it never will.
  
  And the sooner that dumb Labour voting New Zealanders front up to that the better off they will be.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:14am
  - Nickc2
    
    Labour voters expect to be given everything they want and hey, it’s working.
    IMO, a new Govt needs to make all those on the dole and/or the DPB requalify under new criteria and if successful, such needs will only be available on a needs/limits card eg, no fringe items such as booze, tobacco, gambling, or entertainment, etc.
    This would be in an attempt to drive those who can’t afford such luxuries to get a job.
    Any money saved by such a scheme could then be used to build and service more jails for those who chose to live off the proceeds of crime.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:18am
- curry4me
  
  Very well written post. But consider this. If they did want to do anything, and were competent, we’d be New Zuela by now. It’s just as well they’re not.
  
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  May 9, 2022 2:18pm
mikenmildagain

RIP Dennis Waterman:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXH8ru3lobQ
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May 9, 2022 8:03am
Benedict Yu

I think that Luxon is making a strategic error when he says, “The Government must explain what they mean by ‘co-governance’”.

Within a medium spectrum of options, we already know “what it means”. And it is not good. He should say NO and explain how his Government would run Government institutions and policies so that they are efficient and governed well.

I just don’t get this reticence.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/local-democracy-reporting/300582278/christopher-luxon-sidesteps-te-reo-questions-to-focus-on-big-issues
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May 9, 2022 8:03am
- pdm
  
  BY – I agree.
  
  It is a disincentive to vote National.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:07am
  - Colville
    
    I disagree.
    Let Jacinda try to explain it in a way that is palatable to middle New Zealand and that is impossible even for that mealy mouthed, word mangling witch.
    Its what she wont say that will give the Nats ammo to attack her and there is plenty of time to attack.
    The election is 16 ? months away… the average punter has the attention span of a goldfish on topics of politics so now isnt the time.
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:13am
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      Have to agree with you Colville – it will force Cindy into having a conversation with her people to explain what she’s all about…
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:47am
      - Hebe123
        
        Of course it won’t. Will just be more word soup!
        
        And 3 waters will be done and dusted well before then.
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:42pm
    - mawm
      
      He’s keeping his powder dry! It’s more strategic to be a campaigner than an opposition party. //s
      
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      May 9, 2022 11:28am
    - Drone
      
      Hi @Colville, by the next election the structures being established for co-governance will be unable to be dismantled without significant protest from those benefiting. Thus the story continues..
      
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      May 10, 2022 7:00am
  - peterwn
    
    So you will be stuck with a Labour government for a bit longer.
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:15am
- crackle
  
  Luxon is a corporate weasel. Reality is need him to take back centre votes and right wingers need to vote Act hopefully seeing them get close to 10%.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:24am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Nah. He is better off letting them hang themselves and avoiding specifics as far as possible. As soon as he says something specific that gives the Government and the media something to attack.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:34am
  - chukar
    
    The problem with letting Labour self destruct. ( which they are ), is without any binding manifestos from the opposition is dangerous!
    This means anew Government ,( ex opposition)can and will do just as they like.
    National should be advertising all their plans now to build voters trust.
    Let us not forget Bolger and the RMA.
    
    Will the next be Luxon and “co – Governance”?
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:18am
- Yvette
  
  “Co-governance” in whatever form must mean making an ethnic minority of 17 percent population portion, Māori decendency, equal to non-Maori, the majority remainder of the population.
  
  To do that – in input, value, or vote – the smaller Maori population must equal the larger non-Maori section, which cannot be done without valuing Maori in a way to give their individuals greater power than their non-Maori counterparts, who would have a lesser status or standing.
  
  On a 50/50 basis – generally what “co-governance is understood to be – it would work out to be one vote for non-Maori to the value five votes for each Maori.
  
  segregation | noun
  the enforced separation of different racial groups in a country, community, or establishment
  
  … and I thought that definition usually had added – “by giving some priority to a prominent group”
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:35am
  - Nickc2
    
    Yep, four out of five people’s votes on the Non-Maori roll won’t be counted.
    That folks is Democracy NZ style!
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:02am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Democracy is just so, so, so… colonial
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:50am
- Si334
  
  I agree with the approach. Either he gets to state what they mean if they remain silent, and identify the key issues that the public will find difficult, or the government lays out what they mean and does that job for him.
  Saying no, to an undefined proposition, is an easy “but you’re just a racist” call, which is the end of discussion in our mainstream media.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:46am
  - Yvette
    
    Si334
    I also agree with Luxon’s approach, as long as he keeps hammering Ardern for a definition of “co-governance” or for her to say precisely what any nationwide “conversation” is about.
    
    He also needs to hammer the point that a “conversation” does not equal a “targeted engagement” which is reportedly what Maori already have had – it needs to be some sort of poll, preferably a referendum.
    
    A “conversation” allows Government to pretend to listen and then do exactly what they intended anyway
    
    And Luxon needs to remind the public of the Capital Gains Tax “conversation” in which the Government never revealed any own position to discuss, as well as pointing out “hate Speech” is yet to be defined better than “you will know it, when you see it”
    
    Note – “co-governance” will likely be a little harder to define than “hate speech”.
    For evidence suggesting that, read the diversity of loose demands in –
    “Key themes from Māori targeted engagement” – Te Puni Kokiri
    https://www.tpk.govt.nz/docs/tpk-undrip-keythemesmāoritargetedengagement-april2022v2.pdf
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:23am
- Niz
  
  Luxon would do better to explain what _he_ think it means.
  I know what I think it means… the end of democracy (such as it was) in NZ. One man, one vote? History.
  People like Willie Jackson don’t deny this – they smugly tell us it won’t be that bad.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:13am
- Local Miller
  
  I’m not a Luxon or National fan, but I tend to agree with Luxon’s current path. Jacinda’s a wordsmith, she’s very good at using such lose definitions of things that she can later twist it to any interpretation. Luxon is pushing Liebour for definitions that he can later use to hang them on.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:56am
- rouppe
  
  He doesn’t want to say: “Maori don’t have any greater say over the future of this country than anyone else”.
  
  I saw a piece on 3News last night about inundation of Marae due to sea level change. This pretty younf female saying “we need a seat at the table because this affects us”.
  
  Well it affects everybody. Sea level change is a fact of life. You put your property – or marae – on the sea edge and that’s down to you. It’s not my responsibility to pay for anyone having to move.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:57am
  - OTGO
    
    What that pretty young female was saying was, “give us some money so we can relocate our marae to higher ground and build us a new one.”
    
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    May 9, 2022 12:22pm
    - Nickc2
      
      The existing Marae will still be there long after your female Marae mouthpiece has passed on unless it’s neglected.
      
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      May 9, 2022 12:51pm
    - jgw739
      
      How about they build a new one using locally grown flax, paonga and some of this matauranga magic I keep hearing about.
      Money, metal, glass and sawn timber are all colonial constructs and might upset the tikanga.
      
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      May 9, 2022 6:40pm
- Raphael
  
  I do get why he said that. He wants Labour to actually have something clearly stated so that he can nail them on it.
  As long as Labour keeps it as nebulous as possible they can fob of criticism with “you don’t know what you’re talking about” and “I reject the premise of __________”
  
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  May 9, 2022 12:14pm
artemisia

In the Herald today.

Taxpayers fork out more than $800,000 for Ministry of Social Development Zoom job expos – and only 126 people attend – Ministry of Social Development employment group general manager Hugh Miller said the expos connected job seekers with employers, who could then set up follow-up meetings and interviews.

Sounds like the Covid word was mentioned and Lo! a simple idea turned into a pot of gold, and then to dust. No doubt there was a comprehensive post implementation review into an expensive failure. //

Including actual results compared to the projected outcomes, costs, benefits, all that boring stuff. And especially why new infrastructure was needed when globally available tools were right there on the shelf.
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May 9, 2022 8:05am
- Ultima
  
  It’s more like jobs for MSD bureaucrats. Anyone that doesn’t have a job in this hot market doesn’t want one.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:57am
Benedict Yu

Councillors love throwing away money.

Today’s wasting money thing is the “half price public transport” because of climate change. Calls from local politicians to make it permanent.
“It would be a blow to pull the rug out from the 50% fee [sic] reduction when the three-month period ends,” Nash said. “I think everybody who cares about climate and public transport, and transport equity, is hoping that there will be moves in the Budget to make this kind of fee [sic] reduction permanent.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/128512928/halfprice-public-transport-fares-in-nz-could-become-permanent-at-budget

“Transport equity” 😊 A new one.

And this person from Christchurch chimes in.
“Jake McLellan, Christchurch City Council councillor (Central), also welcomed the prospect of continued half-price public transport.

“I think it’s really exciting. I can’t wait to see some of the results from the three-month trial, and it would be great if the Government did want to extend it indefinitely,” he said.

“Anything that gets more people on public transport and away from cars is good.”
Improving the public transport system in Canterbury “should be a number one priority”, he said.”
_____________
I see – so public transport is, literally, the “number one priority in Canterbury”. And we should do “anything” to get people to stop driving cars…. “anything” no matter what the cost. 🙁

I doubt that the 96 percent of people who live here, and who never use public transport would regard it as the number one priority for local government!!

Back to the real world. Fares are not the barrier to using public transport for most people. The “cost” to passengers comes in how long it takes to get anywhere, especially in Christchurch. You could pay people to use public transport and it would not shift that much. Because the “time cost” is enormous. The people who use it are folk whose time is cheap – elders, students, and people on welfare. But for most people who are employed, you would need to compensate them for the journey taking 60 minutes by bus, and perhaps making them cold and wet, versus 20 minutes in a warm car listening to Mahler’s First Symphony. Reducing the fare on the PT option from $3.00 to $1.50 is not going to cause a switch.

So how many people use public transport in Christchurch? Well not many. 4.2 percent of work and education commuting share in 2018, up from 3.7 percent in 2006, so hardly changed over 12 years, and that is looking through the earthquakes when it fell to 2 percent share in 2011 – 2013 because the central city was out of action, and people were scared of being stranded by after shocks.

https://figure.nz/chart/bh0A7OMBRPtNE0r0

This is all ideological rubbish. The best way to reduce New Zealand emissions is to start with the marginally cheapest way first and work your way down through the order from least expensive to most expensive. How hard is that to understand?

Councils should be modelling carbon prices in 2050 and asking people how they would change their travel modes in response to relative changes in transport prices, and then building the transport infrastructure to support those preferences. Not wailing about public transport that 96 percent of people do not use and asking for free money to make it cheaper.
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May 9, 2022 8:05am
- artemisia
  
  How about those councils with half price fares top of their wish list pay for their own region. I’m sure a survey of their ratepayers will show they are dead keen to pay up. Because climate emergency.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:18am
  - I remember when
    
    Cost is always going to be the ‘Achilles Heel’ of Climate Change.
    CO2 growth in the atmosphere is because its increase is the result of its production being the cheapest option.
    Until its reduction is the cheapest option there will be little change.
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:04am
    - CJames
      
      That isn’t the case – CO2 levels are growing because countries like China and India have no interest in economic suicide. Coal fired plant is the easiest most cost effective way to get cheap reliable electricity. That is unless you have a lot of natural gass when CCGTs are the way to go.
      
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      May 9, 2022 11:11am
    - Nickc2
      
      Defund the Climate Change Zealots and the perceived problem will disappear.
      
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      May 9, 2022 11:50am
- alloytoo
  
  Empty buses and trains are not good for the environment.
  
  but your point is saliently made, public transport can never get you to your destination early, sometimes it can get you there on time, but usually it’s late.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:21am
  - alloytoo
    
    Assuming of course the busses actually go where you want to go.
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:21am
- Hebe123
  
  100%. I live in chch, work from home and have taken a bus twice in 10 years. Through the Lyttelton tunnel with my bike.
  
  At 1.50 I might choose to get the bus up the hill after a ride rather than slogging it on the bike. Which saves zero in carbon emissions and makes me lazier 🤣🤣
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:28am
- Albert_Ross
  
  On the other hand, you’d get further through Mahler 1 on a 60-minute bus journey than a 20-minute car journey!
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:37am
  - Hebe123
    
    Quantity but probably not quality
    
    6 1
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    May 9, 2022 12:45pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  As always Ben, Councils use ratepayers money to subsidise other peoples bus and train rides.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:37am
- Niz
  
  “The best way to reduce New Zealand emissions is to…”
  There’s mistake number one. Emissions (I presume you mean CO2) don’t need to be reduced. CO2 is not pollution.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:16am
  - alloytoo
    
    indeed, it’s plant food.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:10am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Yes well back in the real world, New Zealand has obligations to reduce emissions. Those obligations can be met efficiently or ruinously expensively. I’ll focus on that problem.
    
    If you win on your proposition, report back. Good luck.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:16am
    - Niz
      
      “Those obligations can be met efficiently”. I think that might be mistake #2.
      Net zero ain’t gonna happen. I think you got the ruinously expensive bit right – there’s just no ‘or’.
      Do you think people should just roll over and bear the consequences of these ‘obligations’ because their dumbass leaders have bought into this rubbish? I want our leaders to get the message that the nonsense needs to stop.
      Silence is tacit agreement.
      
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      May 9, 2022 12:11pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        New Zealand does not have an international obligation to net zero. That is a domestic commitment.
        Our only international commitment is to reduce 2030 emissions by 50 percent compared to 2005.
        
        https://www4.unfccc.int/sites/ndcstaging/PublishedDocuments/New%20Zealand%20First/New%20Zealand%20NDC%20November%202021.pdf
        
        That commitment can fairly easily be met by a combination of the current ETS and by international emissions trading.
        
        Lots of confusion out there. Understandable 🙁
        
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        May 9, 2022 2:07pm
  - Nickc2
    
    CO2 is the staple of life as we know it FFS.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:25am
- Prince
  
  All New Zealanders have a right to free transport !
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:35am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Yup – that’s what you’ve got legs & feet for.
    
    10 1
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    May 9, 2022 12:03pm
- Biscuit
  
  Such ingratitude, Benedict!
  
  And you with a dedicated station outside your house that not just links you to a $6.50 return, half-hourly rapid transit service to Auckland International (a rail link built 10 years ahead of plan and at only 15% of budget) but also has the benefit of running at what-used-to-be-net-level over the late lamented tennis court Maggie Pie used to play at!
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:41am
  - pdm
    
    Biscuit I know you or someone else will quickly tell me if I am wrong but, I believe Benedict is resident in Christchurch.
    
    Is there something I haven’t heard of `Penis Lolly Man’ Woods plans for rapid rail from Benedicts house to Christchurch International Airport.
    
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    May 9, 2022 11:21am
- Taieri
  
  Today’s wasting money thing is the “half price public transport” because of climate change.
  ———–
  
  Ignoring the ideology of “climate change”, the idea of half price public transport is actually quite sound. There’s not that much cost difference between running an empty bus and a full one. If halving the price of a ride results in increased patronage there’s a number of benefits, one of which is reduced road congestion. While the urban design of NZ cities is not public transport friendly, it doesn’t mean that the public transport can’t play an important role. Not by forcing people to use it though, but rather by encouragement.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:42am
  - Hebe123
    
    They could make it free and most people I know wouldn’t use it.
    It doesn’t go where I want to go – and when.
    It’s slow.
    And I can’t take my dogs, my bike or the new fridge I just bought because white ware is not built to last. (Building appliances to last might be a better climate change strategy come to think of it!!!)
    
    We often comment that in our area it would be cheaper to provide free ubers given the diesel they must go through on the hills!
    
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    May 9, 2022 12:49pm
    - Taieri
      
      They could make it free and most people I know wouldn’t use it.
      It doesn’t go where I want to go – and when.
      It’s slow.
      ————
      
      I’d use it occasionally if it was “free”. My partner however would use it all the time. At present she doesn’t as it is too expensive.
      
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      May 9, 2022 2:54pm
  - curry4me
    
    That half price measure for public transport will end up being permanent. The same for the drop in gas tax. They don’t want to slip further in the polls.
    
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    May 9, 2022 2:27pm
- Paulus
  
  Of course it is not their money – so easy !
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:39am
- rouppe
  
  Councils who advocate for this should put their mouth where our money is.
  
  Expect them to get around using public transport. Still expect them to turn up for work on time, and be prompt for meetings
  
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  May 9, 2022 11:01am
- OTGO
  
  How do you charge an empty seat a 50% fee. And there are a shit load of them.
  
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  May 9, 2022 12:25pm
- SoloView
  
  @ Benedict Yu
  I’m disappointed Benedict. I enjoy reading your comments (whilst not necessarily agreeing with them)
  
  The article you quote states “Improving the public transport system in Canterbury “should be a number one priority”, he said.”
  It’s one councilors view and he uses the word “should”
  
  Your statement “so public transport is, literally, the “number one priority in Canterbury””
  
  The subtraction of “should” and the addition of “literally” changes the meaning of what was said.
  
  Please don’t descend to this level – “Whanganui MP Harete Hipango defends posting false Jacinda Ardern quote”
  
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  May 9, 2022 2:09pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Fair enough. I was aware that it was the expressed view of one councillor.
    
    I did not intend to mislead.
    
    I will keep in mind in future comments.
    
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    May 9, 2022 2:44pm
kiwikidsnz

Australia may even possibly have a worse Govt…but much better satire than NZ
https://youtu.be/Gz4IkzM217U
(Caution: NSFW)
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May 9, 2022 8:07am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Get them over here they would have a field day
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:27am
- Bridgenag
  
  One of those videos criticising the gummint here would be taken down or disappeared in an hour
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:42am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Part one is also good
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:18am
Tony Stuart

Another example of how our government is wisely spending the money they take from us in tax:

The Government has spent $34 million developing and proving its case for the controversial Three Waters reforms, documents show.

A Christchurch city councillor says the figure is “a lot of money to have no single pipe put in the ground”, but the Department of Internal Affairs says it is in line with the costs of other substantial reforms.

In July 2020, the Government officially launched its programme for radically changing the way water services are delivered in New Zealand.

As it now stands, the Government will force councils to hand over control of water infrastructure to four new mega-regional entities. One entity will cover the majority of the South Island, and councils and local iwi will co-govern the new entities.

Using the Official Information Act, Christchurch city councillor Sam MacDonald, an outspoken critic of the reforms, asked the Department of Internal Affairs to provide a breakdown of the cost of the reform programme.

The department’s response, which MacDonald shared with Stuff, said between July 1, 2020, and February 28, 2022, $34.1m was spent on the reforms.

The response showed $18.2m had been spent on “legal and consultants”, $2.7m on “accommodation and corporate support”, $6.1m on staff costs and $3.1m on contractors.

“Other operating costs”, which included the costs of a public information campaign, totalled $3m.

MacDonald’s OIA response also detailed the costs of each external contractor and consultant for the 2022 financial year. This showed:

Professional services firm EY was paid $2.4m for accounting and tax advice, as well as work relating to the funding packages for councils;
Martin Jenkins & Associates was paid $1.2m for comprehensive policy services;
Mafic Partners was paid $887,000 for commercial rating agency and other financial advice;
Senate Communications was paid $616,000 for communication services.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/128524000/34m-of-taxpayer-money-spent-developing-and-selling-three-waters-reform

The problem that I have with this is that the legislation to gives Three Waters legitimacy hasn’t even been introduced yet, let alone debated in Parliament. There was an announcement ten days ago about a few cosmetic changes, but we won’t know the fine detail – and the devil’s ALWAYS in the detail – until Nanaia Mahuta introduces the empowering legislation.

If more than $34 million has been spent before there’s even been a hole dug or a pipe laid, imagine what the cost is going to be once the Government forces councils to give up the assets ratepayers paid for. The mind boggles!
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May 9, 2022 8:09am
- cmm
  
  3W does not have to work for it to have worked. It’s the same with the bike bridge over the harbour.
  
  The real goal is to spend tens to hundreds of million dollars on Cindy’s friends – the people who make Powerpoint presentations at $200/hour.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:34am
  - Littletramp
    
    Is Tuku Morgan part of “Team Mahuta”? I just see his name bobbing up more and more frequently.
    Usually a red flag for transfer of public funds into private hands.
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:38am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Team Mahuta is very much a Tainui-Waikato team… of which Tukoroirangi Morgan is a prominent and powerful member.
      
      He’s just taken up leadership of the Iwi’s affairs again.
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/tuku-morgan-returns-as-chair-of-te-arataura/NPR5LGLOMGAOMUYXBTSL5UHHZI/
      
      Waikato-Tainui are in a close alliance with the Auckland/S.Auckland urban Maori alliance headed by the Willie Jackson faction.
      
      Politically Waikato-Tainui – Auckland Urban Alliance are in ascendance at the moment and seem to have much more say in Labour now than Ngai Tahu or the Ratana folk.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:21am
      - Prince
        
        When you say ‘in ascendance’, does that mean they have both hands firmly wedged in the Koha and Consultancy jar ?
        
        13 0
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        May 9, 2022 9:40am
      - DeepBlue
        
        Ngai Tahu still have huge influence. Look at the 3 Water boundary slashing through the middle of Marlborough and the Ngai Tahu representation Bill. This latter is even more sneaky because they are asking to appoint 2 iwi elected members without even Maori vote. They are scared a non Ngai Tahu rep could be voted in on the Maori roll instead.
        
        Stop watching Ngai Tahu at your peril. They are quiet movers.
        
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        May 9, 2022 9:43am
- Nickc2
  
  This whole 3 Waters rort is nothing more than Race Based Legalised Theft IMO.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:38am
- CJames
  
  According to reports elsewhere, a lot of money was funnelled to Mahuta’s relatives including her husband. At the very least, that is nepotism & corruption. I wonder if the Auditor General is investigating?
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:12am
  - Paulus
    
    This Government will not take any notice of the Auditor General.
    They are above all such things.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:44am
- plc
  
  But but….flag referendum
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:22am
  - alloytoo
    
    The flag referendum cost so much because of the postage on ballets.
    
    This government has saved that cost by removing the democracy part of the process.
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:14am
- pdm
  
  `The problem that I have with this is that the legislation to gives Three Waters legitimacy hasn’t even been introduced yet, let alone debated in Parliament.’
  
  Inv – with luck it never will be.
  
  Did I say luck – by that I mean the ever evident incompetence of this Government and all of it;s Ministers.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:31am
- Paulus
  
  Remember the four regions are the same as the Maori Tribal regions.
  For example Ngai Tahu will have control of all the South Island – all the lakes, rivers and of the course the electricity staions and production to the North Island.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:43am
Souvlaki

Another bloody puff piece about Ardern…being chased around the room by Neve carrying a banana.
Surely she could do a RAT test daily…if negative then go to work like any Nurse or GP is EXPECTED to do! Why do the ‘spuds’ that interview her ask salient questions such as this?? This genuinely pisses me off.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-omicron-outbreak-prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-working-from-home-after-clarke-gayford-infected/W2YGPETOK2JHDNJTXMTYMQFXFU/
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May 9, 2022 8:09am
- nathie
  
  Yes I thought “essential workers” were to RAT test daily and go to work if negative.
  
  Is the PM no longer an “essential worker”, or is she simply trying to avoid media scrutiny (by staying at home) as Labour lurches from one disaster to another on a near daily basis?
  
  Otherwise Simon Bridges proves to be correct again – PTPM!
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:19am
  - Tricati
    
    She’s running scared – Led up to budget and so many examples of excessive spending coming to light, not to mention an inept Police Minister (but diverse) and shambles in immigration inhibiting businesses getting staff. Everyday another example of ineptitude, and all they can do is spend more money, that is borrowed.
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:55am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Next Sunday Jaspinda will test positive for Covid – to avoid the budget. You are correct, she is running scared – got the shits.
      Any bets?
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:25am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    If the Prime Minister is not an “essential worker”, you have to wonder who is…
    
    43 0
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    May 9, 2022 9:01am
    - nathie
      
      TS good point, perhaps her string pulling puppet master Grant Robertson is the “essential worker”?
      
      C’mon Grant, time for you to take over, you know you want to!
      
      Better do it soon before the MSM start calling for the affable Chippie to take over!!
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:05am
    - RalphT
      
      Oh come on Tony. Surely you’re not suggesting that is essential we have her as our PM?
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:33am
      - Tony Stuart
        
        Hell no; I was referring to the job, not the individual, as being essential!
        
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        May 9, 2022 11:25am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      she could be replaced by a chatbot – never answers questions, just trots out tired pre-prepared lines in response to any line of enquiry.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:54am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Chat bots are way better than that
        
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        May 9, 2022 8:24pm
- cmm
  
  You’re being a meanie-pants. The poor lady might have to accept her honourary doctorate via Skype.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:32am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yeah, honorary doctorate, what a crock of shit
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:27am
- Gravelroad
  
  I wonder if Ms Ardern really knows how lucky she is to have such a lot of dear friends in the media?
  Always covering her back with non-news stories.
  Then we have the cartoons.
  The effort in $tuff this morning by Emma Cook is meaningless. It shows a wild haired geezer waving a stick at a board and claiming tax cuts will impact on core services.
  This is pure, unsubstantiated Labour Party electioneering,
  Added to which, it is not funny.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:34am
  - kiwikidsnz
    
    https://garricktremain.nz/cartoons
    
    These may be more to your taste
    
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    May 9, 2022 8:48am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Not funny? Well lefties are born without a sense of humour, and you can’t install one
    
    21 1
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    May 9, 2022 9:29am
    - Prince
      
      They moved away from humour years ago.
      Their intent now is to deliver Stuff’s editorial message.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:45am
- rockape
  
  She could easily take a RAT test and if clear move into her Wellington accomodation and leave her family in Auckland. She could then do her overseas trips and attend parliament as normal.
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:39am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I think they are in Wellington
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:32am
    - oldfella
      
      Steve, if they’re in Wgton, their official residence comes with household staff: cook, cleaner, nanny, etc. Are they all self isolating as well? Hmm
      
      13 0
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      May 9, 2022 12:04pm
      - Flossie
        
        Can’t be. If there was a nanny they’d be making sure child doesn’t interrupt “mummy’s work”?
        
        12 0
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        May 9, 2022 12:19pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Doubt it, they’ll be classified as ‘Essential Workers’ eh?
        
        8 0
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        May 9, 2022 12:40pm
  - G152
    
    I smell a rat
    
    12 0
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    May 9, 2022 9:40am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Does anyone believe that Our Dear PM is working?
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:44am
  - MCōs
    
    Just because she doesn’t spend all day on social media doesn’t mean she isn’t working.
    
    2 17
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    May 9, 2022 9:07am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    ‘work’ is a four letter word
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:33am
  - Over Taxed Worker
    
    I believe our PM is “woking”.
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:59am
  - Clownworld
    
    Working. Yes Ardern is always working.
    Surprised she hasn’t snuck off to see Zelensky for a photo op.
    Ardern is working on how to put final nails in NZ’s productivity coffin, make child poverdy worse, destroy tourism, crash the housing market, divide NZ into tribes, put in place woke rules, build back better, get a new regional UN position , make NZ cashless, indoctrinate NZers into a marxist mindset etc etc
    
    Ardern is working hard to ruin NZ, well on her way.
    
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    May 9, 2022 12:54pm
- pdm
  
  Seymour nailed it – scared of Question Time.
  
  Especially if the Despicable Mallard is not in the Speakers Chair.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:35am
- Paulus
  
  I am beside myself –
  – will she be well enough to go on her US publicity trip shortly ?
  I cannot wait to hear that all will be well.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:46am
  - pdm
    
    Paulus don’t take offence.
    
    Are you booked to travel with her? Or will you just be pleased to see her on her way and out of sight means out of mind.
    
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    May 9, 2022 11:27am
Maggy Wassilieff

Have our Police yet managed to charge anyone for the latest “spike, not a trend” of ramraids?
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May 9, 2022 8:20am
- G152
  
  Idea as to how to prevent such raids
  
  CS gas dispensers that rupture on impact or electrical systems that both earth and shock the offending vehicle/inhabitants upon impact.
  And none of the little shits know which building is equipped
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:41am
cmm

$600M extra in the budget to tackle gangs is insane.

There are around 10-12,000 gang members in NZ.
$600M is $50,000 to $60,000 per gang member.

That is on top of all the other ways they cost us: damage to the economy and property, incarcerations and welfare etc I expect they really end up costing us $150k a year each.

Just stop treating them as cultural clubs. Outlaw the scummy bastards and they’ll be easier to sweep up.

Sorting them out does not cost $50k each. Going softly-softly with them does.

The cops are getting $50k per gang member to manage them, not really sort them out.

Cindy has let this situation get out of control, and has actually encouraged it in many ways. Enough.
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May 9, 2022 8:30am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Does anyone remember the gang “moral panic” of thirty years ago?
  
  Seems Jarrod Gilbert does.
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/mediawatch/audio/2018840860/warning-from-history-in-gang-warfare-panics
  
  I’m still wondering if I would be in a state of “moral panic” if confronted with an angry bunch of hyped-up Mongrel Mobsters down at the Mall.
  I suspect, I’d just be old-fashioned, straight-out pooping my pants!
  
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  May 9, 2022 8:51am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    It goes back a lot further than 30 years Maggy. When he opened Labour’s 1972 election campaign at the Palmerston North Opera House, Norm Kirk thundered that he was going to “take the bikes of the bikies”. I wonder how that worked out…
    
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    May 9, 2022 9:05am
    - Nickc2
      
      Yes, we can’t take Gang Member’s Mororcycles of them but we can take Ratepayer’s Water Assets off them. How does that work?
      
      28 1
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      May 9, 2022 9:11am
    - MCōs
      
      Every Leader of the Opposition with ambitions to be PM in NZ in the interim has promised to ‘crack down on the gangs’.
      
      Just as an aside.
      The right wing Australian newspaper Herald Sun was reporting on a leadership spill in the Comanchero Gang the other day as if it was a political party.
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:23am
      - cmm
        
        “…reporting on a leadership spill in the Comanchero Gang the other day as if it was a political party.”
        
        These days they have more influence on people’s day-to-day lives than many political parties.
        
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        May 9, 2022 12:11pm
    - kevn
      
      @Tony… Was that about when goff bought his Norton Commando?
      
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      May 9, 2022 9:25am
    - peterwn
      
      Unlikely since the damage to the premises would greatly exceed the value of the goods taken. If a business owner wanted to stage a robbery he would steal much more and do a minimal ‘break in’. Also an insurance assessor would suspect something was fishy and recommend against a payout leaving the business owner to tough it out in court if he had the gall. Some of these cases make hilarious reading – for example the guy who purchased a can of petrol just before his leaky home caught fire and could not explain what the petrol was for (he had no boat, lawn mower etc).
      
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      May 9, 2022 10:07am
    - peterwn
      
      He also said he was going to crack down on high grocery prices with all goods having to be marked with a ‘maximum retail price’ (MRP) and manufacturers were obliged to print a ‘MRP’ shield on all their products ready for a price to be added. Trouble was, Ministers and officials could not determine what the prices should be. Muldoon trounced Labour 3 years later and the shields disappeared.
      
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      May 9, 2022 10:11am
    - David Garrett
      
      Tony S: quite so…and politicians of both major hues have made similar statements ever since. But of course it’s not as easy as Big Norm thought – and that’s not helped by stupid members of my profession who make inane comparisons between the Mongrel Mob and the Rotary Club whenever targeted laws discussed.
      
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      May 9, 2022 10:35am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  I agree that they should be outlawed, all symbols of association (patches, bandanas, Harleys and whatever they choose to take their place) outlawed, association with other known members outlawed. A large measure of what makes them effective as criminal organisations is their ability to intimidate through knowing that every gang arsehole is backed by an army – so have to take that away from them.
  
  But what do you do about gang tattoos? Incarcerate until they are removed?
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:00am
- Liberty
  
  The Police dont need extra money.
  The Labour Government just needs to stop nudge nudge wink wink to the judges.
  “Be kind to crimes.”
  
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  May 9, 2022 11:31am
Hebe123

So apparently the gov are bringing in a new scheme to get low income earners into EVs. Trade in your 20+ year old clunker and get $11k off a new EV.

Yeah let’s get low income people into debts they can never pay off. The govt will end up writing off the other $30k+. And when they need a new battery – how do they pay for that?

And I bet nobody has done the analysis of the carbon involves in building a new car vs keeping the older one going albeit with higher emissions.

Could this lot be any more stupid?
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May 9, 2022 8:32am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  So low income person buys the EV and then quickly sells it on at higher price pocketing the difference?
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:02am
- Ra Henare
  
  This is an excellent review of EVs.
  skip the first minute
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1E8SQde5rk
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:15am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “Could this lot be any more stupid?”
  Don’t encourage them, they already think it is a competition
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:01am
- surfing
  
  Link? I’d like to read the details.
  
  5 0
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  May 9, 2022 12:28pm
  - Hebe123
    
    You could find it by listening to the platform this am. Sean Plunket was talking about it. I don’t have any msm news apps anymore so not sure where it was reported.
    
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    May 9, 2022 1:03pm
    - surfing
      
      Ok, can’t find anything. Maybe it is a joke.
      
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      May 9, 2022 5:18pm
krazykiwi

Bourla (Pfizer CEO) said it: This vaccine is Safe and Effective”.

… so not surprisingly:

Ardern repeated it: Safe and Effective; and,

Bloomfield repeated it: Safe and Effective; and,

Wiles repeated it: Safe and Effective”.

As did a chorus of expert hangers-on, bought and paid for media.

There’s just one teensy-weensy problem…

The assertion is bollocks. A lie. A fabrication. And the evidence of the harm is now coming in waves that our betters will not be able to ignore. Sticking their heads in the sand won’t cut it.
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May 9, 2022 8:33am
- mandk
  
  Agreed. It’s neither, nor.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:15am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I’m gonna drop those ‘safe and effectives’ on FB, see if the mods react
  
  13 1
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  May 9, 2022 9:40am
- Ross Campbell
  
  Lets all be grateful that Kiwiblog is not representative of the general population when it comes to Covid and vaccine denial as the country is only able to train a finite level of psychiatrists per year.
  
  8 13
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  May 9, 2022 12:15pm
  - krazykiwi
    
    What is “vaccine denial”, Ross? In your own time.
    
    12 3
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    May 9, 2022 1:00pm
    - Ross Campbell
      
      I think its obvious what I mean but since you are going to “play dumb” looks like I will have to spell it out.
      In a nutshell it’s constantly cherry picking pieces of research that support your position and ignoring everything which contradicts it.
      It is the exaggerated nonsense alleging world wide conspiracies of mass medication and social control through vaccination tweaked to NZ of course so the “tyrant Ardern” and her fellow conspirators can weave their sinister plots on NZ society all in pursuit of neferious UN agendas and other assorted mumbo jumbo which is trotted out with numbing regularity on KB.
      I could go on but refer to some of your previous posts of the last year or so and you will find a bounty of examples of the type of rubbish I am talking about.
      
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      May 9, 2022 1:35pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Wow, Ross. You managed quite a rant from an invitation to describe “vaccine denial”, but even so you failed to provide a suitable description. Why is that, I wonder?
        
        Where you might be happy that the The Science™ is settled based on whatever verbal juxtapositions emanate from the mouths of so-called experts, wiser people know that science involves a continuous testing of hypotheses using empirical evidence.
        
        For anyone who does not have their head in the sand the preponderance of empirical evidence showing actual harm, including death, from the current mRNA treatments is growing at an alarming rate.
        
        Ignore this evidence if blissful ignorance is your thing, which from the looks of your comment it is.
        
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        May 9, 2022 4:11pm
      - mawm
        
        Ignore him krazy – he got off at the wrong bus stop.
        
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        May 9, 2022 7:20pm
  - Clownworld
    
    Shame NZ couldn’t train an investigative journalist, a rational clearheaded accurate modeller or a public health leader who is honest too.
    
    Instead we listened to sustained propaganda, woke political microbiologists, inaccurate modellers, scientists who thought they were politicans and politicos who thought they were scientists. Throw in the scientific religious zealots and we really did have a gaggle of fearmongering and conforming sheep in NZ.
    
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    May 9, 2022 1:03pm
Maggie Pie

We watched the watered-down version of Police 10/7 last week. Pathetic!
Rebranded as ‘Ten-7-Aotearoa’, the cops are now portrayed more as social workers….although the offenders they were chatting with still looked familiar 🙁

All this wokeness can be firmly placed at the feet of people like Auckland Mayoral hopeful Faanana Afeso Collins.
It was this single tweet last year that had TVNZ’s wokerati running for cover…..

https://twitter.com/efesocollins/status/1373364800797822978

In response, former host of the show Detective Inspector Graham Bell had this to say, “Does he want the police to ignore crime if it’s committed by Brown people?
Ignoring the over-representation of Maori and Pasifika in crime stats is just ignoring the cold, hard, uncomfortable truth.
The police don’t select the people who they are looking for. The people who commit the crimes select themselves. It’s as simple as that”

Needless to say, Race Relations Commissioner Meng Foon came out on Afeso’s side, saying….”The police are racist. They target more Brown people than White people, so therefore it is racist”

Like my my partner’s mum said… “No wonder this country is f- -ked”
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May 9, 2022 8:47am
- Niz
  
  Anything about the ram-raiders?
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:19am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Meng Foon needs to have a chat to some of the Dairy owners/ Shop Keepers who have been repeatedly robbed and threatened…and ask himself, are the thugs targeting Asian-owned properties.
  
  Then he could ask himself why this Government repeatedly fails to protect small business owners.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:34am
- David Garrett
  
  Did Meng Foon actually say something that stupid?? Perhaps he believes for every “brown person” they arrest they have to wait for another white one to come to their notice? the reasoning ability of a ten year old.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:40am
- Observer of Life
  
  I miss Graeme Bell … a good mongrel. 👍
  
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  May 9, 2022 7:28pm
Thought Criminal

The 34,000 figure for campylobacter cases is incredibly weak.

“The author, ESR scientist Andrew Ball, writes that he does not have the raw data on the level of treatment and concedes that without such information, “…it is not feasible to estimate the risk of infection from treated drinking-water”.

He makes a few assumptions about what is probable and concludes, “…from these assumptions it can be deduced that 18,000 campylobacteriosis would have arisen from registered water supplies during 2005”.

To get the 34,000 figure Ball takes the total number of gastro cases in 2000 and multiples that by 4.1%, as being his guesswork from earlier analysis on the percentage of stomach bugs due to tainted water, and gets 33,743.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/128415598/the-shaky-claims-and-untested-ideology-underpinning-three-waters

This isn’t about water quality. Its about co governance.
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May 9, 2022 9:14am
- Yvette
  
  Central to the reform agenda is the claim made by Nanaia Mahuta that 34,000 New Zealanders become ill each year from drinking poor-quality water. This number is softer than a week-old feijoa.
  It is drawn from a 2006 report and contains two estimates: 18,000 and 34,000.
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/128415598/the-shaky-claims-and-untested-ideology-underpinning-three-waters
  
  Taumata Arowai
  https://www.taumataarowai.govt.nz
  Taumata Arowai is the new water services regulator for Aotearoa New Zealand. We are committed to ensuring all communities have access to safe drinking water every day. We also have an oversight role in protecting the environment from the impacts of wastewater and stormwater.
  
  Taumata Arowai is a new Government entity – the 4th part of 3 Waters – established mid November last year with no fanfare because it knocks out the Central [argument] to the reform agenda, the claim made by Nanaia Mahuta that 34,000 New Zealanders become ill each year from drinking poor-quality water.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:45am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Yup, every unpopular initiative being rammed down our throats by govt on treaty issues, racist governance, covid comes with associated propaganda pieces on TV1 and 3, Stuff herald and dom post. Clearly team of 55million ‘native advertising’ (govt propaganda poorly disguised as stories, paid for by taxpayers)
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:04am
Maggie Pie

And did you catch our PM this a.m.?
Head nodding, hands flailing, maniacal laughter, smiling at nothing…..looking a bit ‘washed-out’ tbh 🙁

https://twitter.com/Bluebird262626/status/1523403674491314176
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May 9, 2022 9:22am
- Frank the tank
  
  Mad as hell Clarke got the Kungflu Mags.
  
  She wouldn’t want to be struck down with the Rona as the next pre-honeymoon to the States is fast approaching.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:28am
- Flossie
  
  I’m afraid I do not consider a child interrupting a parent at work “adorable”. Surely there is an office – with a door- for the parent to work in.
  We are told to leave family out of our criticisms but when they are trotted out to be adored (and “make”) adorable (!) cards for mummy, then are we just supposed to suck it up?
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:29am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    That ‘card’ was made by an Adult 3 year old
    
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    May 9, 2022 10:04am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  No time to put makeup on, plus she was babysitting Jethro all night, he is sick you know, poor boy.
  
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  May 9, 2022 9:45am
I remember when

I think 3 Waters is going to be a great success and work perfectly, without fault….

right up to the time when it is implemented.
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May 9, 2022 9:24am
Yabster

From the Taxpayers union

Has anybody even heard about this- I haven’t read anything about it?

Any small business owners here like to comment?

Changes to IRD rules will see an enormous new tax burden on business owners
When the Government announced its new 39% income tax bracket, we warned that high earners would simply shift income into companies and trusts.

David Parker eventually cottoned on to this problem and asked Inland Revenue to investigate ways to “crack down”. Now Inland Revenue has been quietly consulting on an alarming set of proposals that are – frankly – bonkers.

Inland Revenue has proposed whacking most small business owners with a tax on retained earnings (i.e. profits reinvested in a company) if they sell shares. Those earnings have already been taxed at the company tax rate of 28%, but Inland Revenue has suggested an extra tax upon the sale of the business to make up the difference between 28% and 39%. This means that for any non-listed company that, say, takes on a new business partner (or sells to the next generation) that proportion of retained earnings will be immediately taxed at the marginal rates for the previous owner, all in the one income year!

Next, and even worse, Inland Revenues proposes severely limiting which businesses will be eligible for the 28% company tax rate. A business owner who provides more than 50% of his or her company’s services would now be denied access to the 28% company tax rate, even if they have dozens of clients.

To add salt to the wound, big publicly-listed companies will be exempt from these tax hikes. As our tax advisors put it, “Inland Revenue is aiming for the kings but shooting the peasants”.

The full details of the complex proposals are actually even worse than I have space to describe here – for many business owners it will result in more tax payable than if there was a full capital gains tax. You can read our formal submission on the proposals here, with analysis from one of New Zealand’s leading tax advisory firms.

Inland Revenue is not taking further submissions, but we would still encourage business owners to add their voice by emailing policy.webmaster@ird.govt.nz. The good news is we understand that having read our submission and those of other experts identifying similar problems, officials are now tearing their hair out over the mess they made of the recommendations. Our sources within IRD tell us that officials know the only opportunity the Government has to ram these changes through is in this year’s omnibus tax bill expected before Parliament in the next few months. Even the mandarins in Wellington know this is an election year stink bomb.
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May 9, 2022 9:26am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Parker is a clown Yabster (as we can see from the drivel he came out with about the richest paying their “fair share”). Labour have been desperate to quash “consultants” from contracting to Companies via their personal company. Labour want to make them to become employees and Union members, and the IRD don’t want them to be claiming tax deductions via their company that they couldn’t if they were employees, plus want the monthly PAYE rather than the 3 prov tax and 1 terminal tax payment.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:56am
Maggie's partner

Ten crimes are committed. 9 are by Maori, and 1 by a white man. All ten are arrested and charged.
Apparently this means police are targeting Maori, and are therefore racist.
Seriously?
We are so rooted in NZ if this sort of fallacious bullshit can have any sort of traction at all
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May 9, 2022 9:26am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  9 were dismissed, 1 was charged and fined.
  Yep, that is racist
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:07am
- Frank the tank
  
  You have summed up what is wrong in this country in 3 sentences.
  
  It’s for this reason white people will flee New Zimbabwe in years to come reminiscent of white flight in Southern Africa over the past 30 years.
  
  And National under Te Reo Luxon won’t stop this process – only slow it down.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:11am
Frank the tank

Did my first Supermarket shop without a face nappy on the weekend. What a liberating experience and the checkout staff were as friendly as they could be and NOBODY pulled me up.

And I wasn’t the only one.

If we all do it – what could she do.
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May 9, 2022 9:30am
- H. Upmann
  
  Welcome to the new New Normal Frank.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:10am
- Ra Henare
  
  Did the same at a Bunnings and a Pak & Save.
  No comments, nobody steering away from me.
  
  Reality in action.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:25am
- Thought Criminal
  
  This is how you get back to normal. One “rebellious” act at a time.
  
  Once people stop complying politicians will change the rules removing pointless mandates and pretend that’s what they wanted all along.
  
  Masks are compulsory on public transport in NSW. Hardly anyone wears them. People are done with the pandemic and authoritarian state overreach.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:27am
- Opie
  
  Yep, I have not been challenged or asked to put one on since I stopped wearing it.
  
  I have had covid and no longer have it, so why would I wear one? Assuming of course that a mask actually does anything which obviously they don’t.
  
  Anyone asking me to wear one will receive exactly none of my money.
  
  My favorite is the sad look from others and you can tell they are thinking I wish I had the balls to not wear one.
  
  Day by day less people are complying.
  
  This ends when we make it end. Same as the mandates.
  
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  May 9, 2022 12:12pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    Haven’t worn one since the very start – except when I went into a rest home to see a couple of people.
    With the new designs, they look like a feed bag that you put on horses – or a muzzle to keep you quiet.
    
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    May 9, 2022 12:54pm
  - krazykiwi
    
    I’m regularly subjected to hand-wringing, apologetic challenge from New World and Bunnings staff.
    
    This madness is infuriating. Here’s my Friday mask diary:
    
    15:00. Visited a enormous engineering warehouse in Petone. Reception is in the main building, with one staff member and millions of cubic meters of storage. Mask required by law.
    
    16:30. Pub. Heaving with people. Barely room to squeeze past other patrons. No masks required.
    
    19:00. Restaurant. Full. No masks required
    
    21:30. Supermarket on way home. Practically empty. Mask required by law.
    
    16 2
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    May 9, 2022 1:11pm
  - Clownworld
    
    Here in Europe noticed that certain eth
    nic groups never wore masks and were never pulled up on it. Due to their refusual to change rest population followed the same , so by time masks were ended here, the public had long given them away.
    
    Best wishes to those stuck in Ardernland, may the masks fall off soon.
    
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    May 9, 2022 1:12pm
  - Ross Campbell
    
    “My favorite is the sad look from others and you can tell they are thinking I wish I had the balls to not wear one”.
    You sure as it’s easy to mix up with the look of disgust.
    
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    May 9, 2022 3:01pm
    - Opie
      
      Ross Campbell, as if I would give a flying fuck if someone was disgusted. Its probably a feeling you know well as you walk down the street angry at everyone not wearing a mask outside like you are.
      
      You can wear a mask, it’s you that’s giving away your iq.
      
      A health professional said to me today, I can’t believe we still have to wear these virtue signaling pieces of paper. It’s not like they do anything.
      
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      May 9, 2022 8:32pm
  - Diogenes
    
    I have never worn a mask on a bus. A ChCh driver (who was not wearing a mask) told me his company had informed the government that despite the notices on board of “compulsory” wearing, they would not enforce it as created too much hassle.
    It’s weeks since I’ve worn one in the supermarket, and staff, all pleasant, have never challenged me. Same with my local butcher. Sadly, at present the mask compliance here is still running at a very high rate.
    
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    May 9, 2022 3:12pm
- OTGO
  
  Everyone is complying because you want it to end but it won’t end as long as you comply.
  What a conundrum.
  
  10 1
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  May 9, 2022 12:49pm
- Hebe123
  
  About time!
  
  8 1
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  May 9, 2022 1:08pm
Maggie Pie

RANDOM IMPERTINENT QUESTION

Anyone think some of these ‘ram-raids’ may be organised for an insurance payout?

Asking for a friend.
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May 9, 2022 9:54am
- peterwn
  
  Unlikely since the damage to the premises would greatly exceed the value of the goods taken. If a business owner wanted to stage a robbery he would steal much more and do a minimal ‘break in’. Also an insurance assessor would suspect something was fishy and recommend against a payout leaving the business owner to tough it out in court if he had the gall. Some of these cases make hilarious reading – for example the guy who purchased a can of petrol just before his leaky home caught fire and could not explain what the petrol was for (he had no boat, lawn mower etc).
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:05am
- Thought Criminal
  
  Doubt it. Too much risk.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:23am
- The Housekeeper
  
  Maggie, if you’re just in on Con Air and you wanted to set up a protection racket, using teflon kids to provide a bit of persuasion to the resistors would be a genius idea.
  
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  May 9, 2022 10:28am
SmokerGuy

Listened to a couple of interviews this morning of Poto Williams. Wow, it’s hard to put into words how completely out of depth she is. It’s actually painful to listen to. She is so bad that if labour have any ambition to win the next election she has to go. Of course I hope she doesn’t because she will bring this government down on her own. The problem labour have though is who would replace her? Most of them are on the same level as Poto, never have we witnessed such an incompetent government in this country.
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May 9, 2022 10:03am
- Clownworld
  
  Ooops meant to uptick
  
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  May 9, 2022 1:13pm
Frank the tank

https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2022/05/07/maher-subsidizing-gender-studies-by-forgiving-student-loans-is-a-loser-issue/

Maher is my favorite leftwinger. On this he is spot-on.
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May 9, 2022 10:07am
Libertarians are right

The big problem with the calls for National to “have more diversity” is that when they do, they don’t count:

Bennett and Bridges – “not really Maori”
Grosser – “not really Muslim”
Finlayson – “not really Gay”

The “diversity” the media want is Leftwing activism. They already have plenty of that on the Left. How about the Right just focus on fiscal responsibility?
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May 9, 2022 10:09am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Finalyson was “gay enough” to attract homophobic interjections from the likes of Trevor Mallard and Clayton Cosgrove.
  
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  May 9, 2022 11:28am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    That’s impossible – Mallard represents and protects diverse inclusivity!
    
    20 1
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    May 9, 2022 11:53am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      You’ve forgotten “Tinkerbelle”
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5781365/Upset-over-Mallard-comment
      
      ACT’s Wellington central candidate Stephen Whittington yesterday accused openly gay Labour MPs Grant Robertson and Charles Chauvel of covering up prejudice among their caucus.
      
      Hutt South MP Mr Mallard likened Mr Finlayson to the Peter Pan fairy during a parliamentary debate in October 2009. Waimakariri MP Clayton Cosgrove twice called Mr Finlayson Tinkerbell in the House in July 2009.
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5781365/Upset-over-Mallard-comment
      
      11 2
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      May 9, 2022 2:26pm
Fuzzysnuggleduck

Poto Williams announcing over $500 million spend as an answer to ‘soft on crime’ and concerns over gangs and ram raids.

Yet over $200 million was on the setting up of the gun register – that is, nothing to do with gangs or ram raid and only a way to hold data on the already known legal firearms owners in NZ.

There was also a lot of money around preventing reoffending/rehabilitation (LOL!), with a comment that ‘prisons don’t work’, and then something like $90 left over was actually going to actual policing (Staffing/resourcing).
At no time was it explained how this gun register targets ram raids or gangs members in particular.
The gun registration idea was basically an opening given to police in the wake of the mosque murders, hard to see how it would stop a shooter anyway, and being rolled out now has little bearing on the issues concerning NZ.
Nor did that idea or any change even address the actual point of failure which led to loss of life: that was the failure of the police to follow their own vetting/referee processes around issuing Tarrant his license.

It seems Poto does not even understand the question the public is asking, so gives a wrong answer to crime and yet announces the spending as a smokescreen. Nothing changes for the better.
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May 9, 2022 10:17am
- cmm
  
  Not that I think a gun register would work, how can it cost $200M to set one up?
  
  Software development: $1M outside.
  Deployment on servers and annual running thereof: $0. It just runs alongside the existing firearms licensing system.
  Informing people to register: Mail out to all legal firearms owners $1M. Follow up: another $1M.
  Auditing: $20 per visit to each firearm owner. Maybe $20M.
  
  So there should be change from $25M, not $200M.
  
  It seems Cindy’s mates will again have a nice trough carved out for them.
  
  20 1
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  May 9, 2022 12:20pm
  - Nickc2
    
    It’s about time most of this crap about firearms licensing was sheeted back to Cindy and her role in chairing a committee that determined new laws for Firearms Licensing (by e-mail).
    Existing rules at the time required those applying for Licenses to personally appear in a Police Station.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111438784/changes-to-gun-law-overseen-by-jacinda-ardern-described-as-crazy
    
    16 1
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    May 9, 2022 12:34pm
  - Pavel
    
    My brother worked on the INCUS project in the late 90s. Fresh out of Uni with a degree in physics he was on $27 an hour doing IT work, not bad money back then for a graduate. His position actually paid $500 an hour yet had been subcontracted down through four companies who all clipped the ticket to the point his employer was charging him out at $80 an hour. Over 80% of the cost went to other people who just passed it onto others while taking a cut. The project was eventually abandoned at a cost of $110 million.
    What’s new and why are you surprised? Government business as usual for anyone in the know.
    
    17 0
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    May 9, 2022 12:42pm
- kowtow
  
  Have a listen to her intview with M Hosking this am .
  
  Wot a train wreck .
  
  21 2
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  May 9, 2022 12:29pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Even a Possum in the headlights acts more rationally.
    
    11 1
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    May 9, 2022 12:43pm
Suze Wainwright

Who was the dickhead who cut the bike trails through the native bush near Titahi Bay?
12 1
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May 9, 2022 10:30am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Been happening for years…
  Cyclists take over any patch of native bush reserve within 20km of an urban centre.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/128578809/illegal-bike-trails-cut-through-native-bush-in-ttahi-bay-north-of-wellington
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/74999095/closing-illegal-bike-tracks-set-to-fail-riders-and-residents-say
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/121026229/lockdown-hasnt-stopped-illegal-track-builders-damaging-precious-ngaio-remnant-forest-pocket
  
  etc
  
  13 0
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  May 9, 2022 11:38am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Heh, I personally hate the idea of anyone being healthy near native bush in aotearoa
    
    9 1
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    May 9, 2022 11:55am
westernScientist

Hard to be too upset with this:

https://www.act.org.nz/budget2022

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300583039/act-party-alternative-budget-would-raise-super-age-slash-taxes-and-future-spending
19 0
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May 9, 2022 10:40am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

2000 Mules Trailer.
https://dinesh.locals.com/post/2083099/2000-mules?
7 4
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May 9, 2022 10:59am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Dennis Prager was quite surprised
  
  6 4
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  May 9, 2022 11:02am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    ‘Bewildered’ is the usual term for Prager,
    I believe. Is he still running his pretend university?
    
    3 12
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    May 9, 2022 3:25pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Idiot
      
      8 3
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      May 9, 2022 5:41pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The full movie is interesting. The Dems have done this before. That means in 2016 Trump won by a much bigger landslide. In 2000 the corruption was much bigger. Who votes at 1am in the morning? Mules do it on a huge scale.
  I am 35 minutes into the whole movie.
  
  8 4
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  May 9, 2022 11:24am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  the whole movie. Not much more in it for those who have been following closely, but eye opening for anyone not up on the play.
  https://www.bitchute.com/video/TizNoVq1qcwb/
  
  9 5
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  May 9, 2022 11:54am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yep, have to turn the sound up, it is recorded low.
    America is not a democracy anymore. Elections are run by a criminal cartel posing as Democrats. It was done in 2016 but bot well enough. The means the Trump landslide was much bigger than we know.
    2020 they did the ballot drops on a much bigger scale.
    Lefties will not believe this., but Dinesh d’Souza is no fool. Now they have to get the Police and Courts on board, they are infested with Democrat plants from the Obama years.
    
    8 4
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    May 9, 2022 1:39pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      On my FB the mods have flagged it as ‘Missing Context’ No surprise there.
      
      7 3
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      May 9, 2022 1:41pm
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        It’s going to be very entertaining watching the gatekeepers and political propagandists (aka ‘fact-checkers’) of MSM and Democrat aligned institutions twist themselves in knots and flat out lie to try and minimize the impact of the uncovering of this vast electoral fraud that clearly, on the number of mules and trips and ballots deposited at each drop box in observations, flipped the election for Biden.
        
        Step 1 appears to be mostly trying to ignore it, censor it or pretend it doesn’t exist (MSM and Big Tech are engaged in this at the moment).
        
        Second line of defense is gas-lighting, tell half truths and lies such as ‘the phone geolocation is only accurate to within a few meters so you can’t tell if they are going to drop boxes’. Except that you can – because where surveillance video is available it matches up with video of same person visiting multiple drop boxes, and in all cases the same phones are tracked along a travelling salesman type routes visiting up to 20 drop boxes across a city in the middle of the night, as well as calling in at Democrat aligned organisations (like Stacy Abrams outfit in Atlanta).
        
        There is also clear information that it was coordinated across states – like video of them adopting latex gloves in Georgia the day after a mule was indicted in Arizona using fingerprint evidence. That means Federal laws broken and Rico if a non=corrupt Federal Agency can be found to investigate.
        
        7 4
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        May 9, 2022 3:23pm
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        “Missing Context” = It’s OK when the Left lie, cheat, steal and generally shit on democracy and freedom because it is for a Noble Cause™.
        
        7 3
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        May 9, 2022 4:42pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      True Steve, Dinesh D’Souza is no fool, but he is a domestically violent mall ninja, convicted felon, historical revisionist, Christian apologist, and a general grifting wingnut.
      
      3 12
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      May 9, 2022 3:30pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Another idiot
        
        11 3
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        May 9, 2022 5:45pm
Lucia Maria

New talkback available in NZ started up by Sean Plunket

Listen online here: The Platform

Was supposed to be Michael Laws this morning, but he has The Covid. So Ani O’Brien is covering for him on their first day!
18 2
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May 9, 2022 11:04am
- Tony Stuart
  
  There’s a great advertisement playing; a very serious-sounding Sean Plunket says:
  
  “If you’re offended by anything you’ve heard on here, or if you believe we’ve broken any standards – tough!
  
  26 1
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  May 9, 2022 11:16am
  - Lucia Maria
    
    Yes, loved that. So refreshing! 😛
    
    17 1
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    May 9, 2022 11:58am
Maggie Pie

LOL!! 😀 😀 😀

“I have to be honest here.
I was born in the wrong time.
I’d be much happier living in the middle ages,
lopping off the heads of smelly peasants,
and then giving the stable boy a jolly good buggering”

– Boris Johnson, May, 2015.

https://americasbestpics.com/picture/i-have-to-be-honest-here-i-was-born-in-YjpXzx899
12 3
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May 9, 2022 11:07am
Maggy Wassilieff

I thought I was pretty well informed about what appears in our MSM news, but I seem to have overlooked the fact that between Oct 2020 and Oct 2021 there were 283 ram raids.

According to police, in the 12 months to October last year there were 283 ram raids around the country, more than five a week.

Eighty-eight per cent of those were by teenagers or even younger kids.

https://www.sunlive.co.nz/news/293391-raimraids-calls-tougher-penalties.html?fbclid=IwAR1tcQkz35SC1kFzkAe-NAFhnI4tbO9ELXju1sGjlfscR3QIBkVyOl1RxyY

It doesn’t look to me that what we have is a recent “spike”, in ram raids as Kelvin Davis states, but an established modus operandi.
24 1
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May 9, 2022 11:31am
- cmm
  
  The only spike has been in reporting and reaction.
  
  17 2
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  May 9, 2022 12:13pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    True. A few high-profile incidents can draw attention to a specific controversial ‘problem’ as defined by media and politicians (gangs, highways, boy racers, sexual harassment, etc). That’s not to deny that there are problems, but just to note that issues are seldom examined in medium- or long-term perspective.
    
    2 10
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    May 9, 2022 3:23pm
    - cmm
      
      No, bollocks.
      
      There is no spike in gang crime, ram raiding etc. It is always high and in the medium to long term it is very high.
      
      What does spike though is the way it is projected in the media. For the most part there’s an airbrushing and white washing of the problems. Occasionally they are allowed to spike through to grab the headlines to take the heat off something else.
      
      NZ’s crime is getting out of control. Recent murder rates are up compared with 2017.
      
      Even just tracking murder rates paints part of the picture. If violence levels stay the same then we should expect a gradual reduction in murder rates because improvements in medical technology have improved survivability. For example that mongrel mob scrote that was shot in the head did not die. Within a few weeks he was back on the streets inflicting mayhem on the public.
      
      Instead the murder rate is actually up since 2019 (excluding the Chch massacre which is considered an aberration for statistical purposes).
      
      8 4
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      May 9, 2022 4:37pm
Brian McDonald

I think Ukraine will be intending to rain on Putin’s parade, if not immediately fairly soon after.
8 10
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May 9, 2022 11:50am
Maggie Pie

Scenes like this show why Pro-Choicer’s have a lot to thank Louisa Wall for….

https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1523416234720518144

(full screen/sound up 😀 )
3 9
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May 9, 2022 11:51am
- Don Beckett
  
  What a disgusting display.
  
  6 4
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  May 9, 2022 12:21pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  A few choice words used. Mad as.
  
  7 3
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  May 9, 2022 1:44pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

Discussion on ZB as to how Cindy caught C19.
Blame placed on her partner…. who had been traveling around the country making new series of ‘House Movers’

Andrew Dickens tells Political reporter Jason Walls…..

“He thought ClarkE was at home with an Ankle Bracelet on”

LOL!!!
18 3
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May 9, 2022 12:31pm
- Nickc2
  
  AFIK, Cindy doesn’t have Covid. Her current partner has Covid.
  
  13 2
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  May 9, 2022 12:38pm
Maggie Pie

Things that make you go hmmm…..

“If I die under mysterious circumstances, it’s been nice knowin ya”

– ELON MUSK. 9May, 2022

(wonder if he has something on the clintons?)
13 4
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May 9, 2022 1:05pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, the man can afford the premium bodyguard services. Hillary is just a pauper by comparison and if the much hated Trump dodged the bullets……
  
  7 2
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  May 9, 2022 1:11pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    And looks like his mum’s not amused either 😀
    
    https://twitter.com/mayemusk/status/1523478931587837954
    
    3 4
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    May 9, 2022 3:09pm
- Nickc2
  
  There’s plenty to have eh?
  
  5 2
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  May 9, 2022 1:20pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Well Hillary has taken him off the Christmas Card list.
  
  6 2
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  May 9, 2022 1:47pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    Oh I bet he’s really choked about that. //
    
    6 2
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    May 9, 2022 2:28pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Do you think Musk is a republican?
    
    3 6
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    May 9, 2022 3:17pm
    - cmm
      
      No he’s a Muskian.
      He can own any politician he chooses.
      
      12 2
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      May 9, 2022 4:39pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Here’s how Musk depicts his political positioning over time
  
  10 3
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  May 9, 2022 4:21pm
Maggie Pie

Do you think Nads might be being just a wee bit precious?

NZH: ‘Nadia Lim still waiting for rich-listers apology’.

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1523440339637633024

My partner reckons, there will be thousands of poor investors out there hoping for an apology from Nadia! Specially after having piled into the ”My-Food-Bag’ IPO @ $1:85…..only to see their investment drop by about 60% 🙁

He was just saying.

(32 Ducks in the fridge by the way)
18 7
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May 9, 2022 2:41pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  How did Nadia Lim manage to force those ‘poor investors’ to buy the shares?
  
  4 14
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  May 9, 2022 3:12pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    My partner can get his people to contact your people if you need answers milkey?
    
    10 5
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    May 9, 2022 3:24pm
    - MCōs
      
      But you have to take one of those wretched ducks.
      
      4 0
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      May 9, 2022 4:32pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        Actually…came across this b4 & thort about you Cossie 😀
        
        https://twitter.com/crazyfunnystuff/status/1523391655680032768
        
        7 5
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        May 9, 2022 4:45pm
      - MCōs
        
        In my case for that to work I’d have to start drinking first.
        PS
        Delighted to know you’re thinking of me in these fraught times!
        
        2 0
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        May 9, 2022 9:31pm
  - trout
    
    The MyFood Bag IPO was a thinly disguised rort; and yes, the investors were gullible (I am surprised that Milford picked up $10 mill. worth. (perhaps they were lining up for future floats). The founders of the Company (including Lim) raised the money through a share offer; assisted by a glossy prospectus featuring Nadia Lim as described. And then they, the founders, scarpered with most of the proceeds ( in issued shares) leaving very little for the company to use to grow and develop. However Karma rules; the founders were not able to sell their shares until after the Company report due out shortly. So their imagined wealth at the time of the float will now have more than halved if they cash up their shares. The present wallowing share price will be a reflection of their large number of shares hanging over the market waiting for escrow to cease. If they have used their scrip as security against loans for a new venture they may get a call from their bank manager!
    
    14 2
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    May 9, 2022 3:40pm
  - Scooter
    
    The same way people voted for Jacinda, conned by appearance over substance.
    
    1 0
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    May 9, 2022 11:31pm
chukar

Breaking news
“ Luxon supports Labours Carbon Budgets!”

Further to my earlier “co Governance comment” today.

Where is the difference between National and Labour?
14 1
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May 9, 2022 3:03pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Anyone who believes New Zealand’s issues will be solved by tossing Ardern out and replacing her with Luxon is either:
  
  a) only just awake after sleeping for the last 10 elections
  
  b) a recently arrived alien
  
  c) willfully ignorant
  
  d) depressingly stupid
  
  19 6
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  May 9, 2022 4:17pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Unless Luxon HTFU
    
    9 3
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    May 9, 2022 5:51pm
- tf78
  
  I think Christopher knows what “Net Zero” actually means and because it means “no change” (as in : Net Zero – think about it) he is going along with it.
  
  3 0
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  May 9, 2022 7:41pm
Jack5

Michael Reddell is back at the keyboard, this time on inflation.

An important topic as prices begin to bite family living costs.

https://croakingcassandra.com/2022/05/09/what-if/
9 1
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May 9, 2022 3:16pm
- chukar
  
  Yes J5,
  A pretty depressing outlook for any self reliant people who have worked and saved for their financial progress or retirement.
  Inflation ,as Douglas and many economists have said , is theft by the state.
  The redistribution of peoples hard earned wealth has got Robbo and his mates rubbing their hands in glee!
  
  16 1
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  May 9, 2022 5:16pm
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Those people only got rich through racist colonialism – it’s time for them to pay back their share
    
    4 0
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    May 9, 2022 7:16pm
Maggie Pie

To be fair, even I have bad hair days…..

https://twitter.com/ocarolant/status/1523444245398700032
6 4
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May 9, 2022 3:48pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Stress is taking the ,,,,,,,
  
  5 2
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  May 9, 2022 5:53pm
MCōs

I read the other day the Taliban are now requiring women to wear a burqa when they step out of the house plus have reason to do so.
Meanwhile in the land of the free.
https://twitter.com/loloverruled/status/1523145616250966017?s=21&t=2AnmUI5x5FlrIHujbjumpg
6 0
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May 9, 2022 4:42pm
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  So what?? In New Zealand both women and men are required to cover their face.
  
  11 3
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  May 9, 2022 5:44pm
103PapPap

Why is it that EVERY new item in New Zealand HAS to have a maori name? Or that the local tribe have to be consulted.
I see that the Kapiti Mayor wants to rename State Highway 1; he has offered 5 Maori names, and the electorate have rejected them all.
14 2
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May 9, 2022 5:10pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Email the Mayor and say he is ‘pokohua’
  That will get somethin going
  
  6 2
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  May 9, 2022 5:57pm
  - tf78
    
    As in Pokahuntass.
    
    1 0
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    May 9, 2022 7:38pm
- kowtow
  
  Don’t worry .
  
  The way they get around that is they get the local Maoris to “gift” a name to the council and eh voila , fait accompli.
  
  That’s how Daft Dunners got around the result of a ‘consultation’, the result of which they didn’t like with the locals on what to name the Settlers Museum after a tart up. Ended up , of course with a Maori name.
  
  3 2
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  May 9, 2022 8:18pm
surfing

Heres a gem from James Shaw in his climate speech….

“We have a rare opportunity now, to uphold the power of te ao Māori and indigenous knowledge to tackle the climate crisis.”

In other words, give money to maori, so they can hire white and asian people to do the work for them. That’s maori science!
13 2
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May 9, 2022 5:21pm
Sparrow

We have been divided along so many lines. Mandated. racial, mask wearers etc etc.
Went to vets only surprising thing was the dog did not require a mask. Then to butchers no masks if you want to wear one that’s fine. Obviously the air in the butchers is different to that in the vets. Obviously where some overall power is the decision maker I.e.civil servic, education, health etc its masks while in the real world generally make your own decision. As it should be. I am not blaming the vets the staff hate it as much as most of us do.
11 0
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May 9, 2022 5:23pm
rockape

When I got involved in politics in NZ 6 years ago I wanted to see the end of Labour in NZ. I didn’t need to bother, Jacinda and Robertson aided by the likes o& Twyford Potto and Woods have done it for me!
17 2
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May 9, 2022 5:27pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Don’t give up, I have have not
  
  10 2
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  May 9, 2022 6:00pm
Maggie Pie

BBC has confirmed, the new ‘Dr Who’ will be played by Rwandan born gay black Scottish actor Ncuti Gatwa.

As one commentator wrote…..
More box-ticking! The Beeb has gone entirely woke. Of course he’d have to be black and gay. Some of the cast and crew are affectionately calling him ‘Dr Pho’.

LOL!!!
11 2
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May 9, 2022 7:07pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Missed an opportunity to have the first trans doctor though
  
  4 0
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  May 9, 2022 7:15pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQLbwOGT8eM
  
  5 1
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  May 9, 2022 7:19pm
  - curry4me
    
    Thanks for that. Daleks are my favorite robots.
    
    5 0
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    May 9, 2022 8:31pm
- kowtow
  
  Dr Who was created to encourage interest in science , now it’s just a vessel to push BBC wokery.
  
  6 2
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  May 9, 2022 8:14pm
  - MCōs
    
    I’m shocked it’s shot in colour.
    
    1 0
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    May 9, 2022 9:50pm
bwooce

Slightly odd article of the week on the rampant corruption of the covid-fund. Not quite titled that.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/128535939/170m-in-government-funding-propped-up-key-tourism-businesses-during-covid-is-the-investment-paying-off

Lots of dubious claims, actual investigations resulting in officially damning statements, with of course a factless counterpoint ,”Tourism Minister Stuart Nash estimates Stapp helped to retain 3000 jobs in an industry predicted to shed 92,000 positions in the first year of the pandemic.”

180M/3000 = 60K per job. To “save” 3% of the jobs. With…ah no evidence whatsoever. If you’re going to make things up it should probably be to make you look good.

The statistical cherrypick of the year that was the “A report by the auditor general found just over 5 per cent of Māori tourism businesses received more funding than they sought, compared with 30 per cent of non-Maori.”

WTF. Since we can’t value the funding in ROI, we’ll pretend it’s all the same and passively imply racism for not over-giving as much. It’s just so rotten, the need to slice tourism industries by race of the owners is just accepted as normal.
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May 9, 2022 10:57pm

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Waatea News Column: Sweeping public service cuts hurt M?ori, Pacifica, Beneficiaries, Renters and the working classes
The Daily Blog
Response from Devin Pope, on religious attendance
Utopia
What is a woman?
Hompaddock
Open mike 20/04/2024
The Standard
A who's who of New Zealand's dodgiest companies
No Right Turn
"Under a better Resource Management system [sic], there would be no need for fast-track approval processes."
Not PC
Can taxpayers be confident PIJF cash was spent wisely?
Point of Order
Scottish Skullduggery
No Minister
Again, hate crimes are not necessarily terrorism.
Kiwipolitico
Despair - construction consenting edition
Offsetting Behaviour
RACIST ADVERTISING
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
Is the state coming for churches?
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
Super Rugby Predictions for Week 9
Stats Chat
Coalition Promises
NZCPR
Tougher than that
Croaking Cassandra
ABs stripped of 2011 title after try disallowed
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

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