A responsive Commissioner

November 11th, 2013 at 9:00 am by David Farrar

I criticise the when they deserve it. For over a decade I’ve been critical of how they (don’t) prosecute electoral law offences and have called for that power to be removed from them. And the failure to promptly disclose that there had been complaints about the Roast Busters members previously was a massive fail for them.

However the details of this story in the Herald are grounds for praise, not criticism, of the Commissioner.

The Herald reports:

Police Commissioner – whose department is under fire for its handling of the Roast Busters affair – today personally phoned a man who has been publicly criticising the police over the matter. …

Mr Marshall called the person because they had lodged a complaint via the police website on Thursday in relation to police behaviour at Police National Headquarters. The person had provided their full name, address and phone number, the spokeswoman said.

“The Police Commissioner and other executive members are provided with copies of relevant expressions of praise or complaints and the Commissioner often personally follows up the matters raised with individuals, if they have supplied their contact details”, the spokeswoman said.

I think there are three things worth praising here.

  1. That feedback on the Police that people provide through the Police website actually goes to the Commissioner and Executive – not just to some PR flunky
  2. That the Commissioner will actually respond personally to a serious complaint, rather than be an out of touch desk jockey
  3. That the Commissioner was working on a Sunday

I wish more leaders would do that.

The man – who comments on Russell Brown’s Public Address blogsite under the username Kracklite – has over the last week criticised the police as an “organised pack” of misogynists with a “very sick culture” who had destroyed the public’s trust in them.

This afternoon, after criticising Mr Marshall’s performance when he was interviewed on television’s Q+A earlier today, he posted that Mr Marshall had just phoned him directly.

“I hung up immediately when he identified himself,” the man posted.

That’s rather rude. Maybe he got a bit paranoid and thought the call was in relation to his pseudo-anonymous comments on Public Address, rather than his filling in an official Police feedback complaint form – but if he hadn’t hung up immediately then he could have discovered that.

“Given the serious allegations in this particular complaint, the Commissioner phoned the individual, using the contact information they had supplied, in order to discuss the matter further. The Commissioner only got as far as identifying himself before the individual hung up, saying he did not want to speak to him further.”

Why fill in a complaint form making serious allegations, and providing your contact details, if you don’t want a response?

The Police have not handled the Roast Busters saga at all well. I certainly have several questions about why they didn’t take other action against the youths, short of prosecution. The IPCA report will be most interesting, and there are legitimate questions over the Police culture.

But I don’t believe in beating up on the Commissioner for being responsive to a complaint, as some were doing on Twitter yesterday. Marshall is known to be very popular with the rank and file Police because he isn’t cloistered at Police HQ, but actually gets out and about. His phone call is part of that style.

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54 Responses to “A responsive Commissioner”

  1. SGA (961 comments) says:

    Another keyboard warrior?

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  2. thedavincimode (6,591 comments) says:

    Loser

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  3. Pete George (23,354 comments) says:

    The initial response was due to the initial paranoic reaction from Kracklite/Rhinocrates where it was implied the police had identified him via his ID at Public Address or The Standard. This is what he posted at The Standard:

    Look out – the pigs are trying tracking their critics.

    Marshall just tried to call me personally at my own home. I hung up immediately when he identified himself.

    Maybe he had naive honourable motives… but if that were the case, it’s too little, too late.

    I find it personally disturbing that he can find out who I am and where I am. It’s intimidating.

    They’re definitely watching you.

    The situation changed substantially once it was revealed that he had left his contact details in a Police feedback form.

    It’s a bit ironic that Kracklite/Rhinocrates is being so sensitive to being ‘intimidated. He didn’t seem bothered about intimidation when he launched in =to an extended harassment of me at Dim-Post until Danyl bowed to his extortion and banned me. And bragged about it afterwards.

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  4. thedavincimode (6,591 comments) says:

    Enough of the whining already Pete. Do it in private if you have to but not in public. You’re starting to sound like bedwetter.

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  5. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Peter Marshall is a quality man and should have been the Commissioner earlier but Helen wanted a flunky so she gave us Broad and Robinson who were both sickenly sycophantic to labour.

    Anyone who does not believe that Peter Marshall has integrity and acts in the best interests of New Zealanders should give themselves an upper cut. The sad thing is he will probably not re-new his contract which does not have long to run I believe.

    And as for the clown that hung up, if he does not have the ability to engage in a serious conversation perhaps he should just be ignored, the rooms are full of fuck wits like this, we are plagued here as well.

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  6. alex Masterley (1,502 comments) says:

    The complainer sounds like a complete numpty.

    And good on the commissioner working on a Sunday.

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  7. Pete George (23,354 comments) says:

    thedavincimode – you’re the one sounding whiny.

    It’s relevant to this, he complained about intimidation but has a hypocritical history. He’s one of many with social media bravado – here is his comment on The Standard just before the phone call:

    Here’s what that jellyfish Marshall should be saying right now:

    “The standard you walk past is the standard you accept”.

    But when the “jellyfish” rang to talk to him he was the one who wobbled and wimped out.

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  8. David Garrett (6,786 comments) says:

    Perhaps “the complainer” is so thick, or was so out of it, that he forgot he had left his contact details?

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  9. RightNow (6,844 comments) says:

    I bet his complaint was that someone stole his weed.

    Edit: on Public Address he says “I was too freaked out to engage with him at the time”

    Stoner

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  10. Chuck Bird (4,773 comments) says:

    “Peter Marshall is a quality man”

    When I look at his view on Thomas I find that hard to accept. I smell a cover up here because one of the accused was a police officier’s son. Police investigating serious crimes like this should be obliged to disclose higher up any perceived conflict of interest.

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  11. flipper (3,847 comments) says:

    I personally have no complaints over Police conduct, except in relation to their bullshit speed and liquor campaigns (never personally ticketed on either), and to giving false evidence, or hiding evidence, in several murder and similar cases. Add over-enthusiastic and inappropriate, team policing to that.

    Their handling of the “roastbuster” cases is bad, to say the least.

    But I told the sponsor of the on line petition to take her petition, tear it up…..and to breathe through her nose.

    It is an example of would-be vigilante action that we can do without.

    The Police actions in these cases are crap. The petition is crap.

    Let proper inquiry and Justice take a proper course…and let us have no more Weatherstone legislative garbage..

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  12. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    “The situation changed substantially once it was revealed that he had left his contact details in a Police feedback form.”

    How many DAYS has it been since the cops reassured us that NO complaints were made or laid by the Roast Buster victims?

    How quickly most people forget that you simply can’t take a cop’s word at face value.

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  13. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Chuck et al

    Get hold of and read the “Solicitor Generals Guide Lines for Prosecutions” (sic) that the Police are having to a bid by.

    Further ( and there is no excuse for the behaviour of these little wankers) no one is an “accused” no one has been charged and there may well be reasons for this but again its trial by KiwiBlog

    Lastly, Pete Marshall is a good bastard but I do not believe he will have a working knowledge of every file that the NZ Police are currently dealing with but the buck does stop with him and to suggest that he is corrupt is simply wrong.

    If you believe he is corrupt, drop him an email his address is on the Police Web site, tell him he’s corrupt, Id’ suggest you give reason for your beliefs rather than KiwiBlog blather though, your sense of smell Chuck might not have much cred.

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  14. backster (2,124 comments) says:

    I agree with PEB. Marshall is a fine Commissioner and the Police have achieved much under his direction. Far from calling for his resignation as the Greens appear to be doing the Government should be doing their best to encourage him to renew his contract.

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  15. RightNow (6,844 comments) says:

    jackinabox, are you saying this krackhead was a roastbusters victim?

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  16. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    “I agree with PEB. Marshall is a fine Commissioner and the Police have achieved much under his direction.

    Name one positive achievement backster.

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  17. Pete George (23,354 comments) says:

    Pauleastbay: “no one is an “accused” no one has been charged and there may well be reasons for this but again its trial by KiwiBlog”

    Pauleastbay on GD: “These young guys are too stupid to breath and just need a fucking good hiding…”

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  18. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    correct Pete, not everything needs police intervention.

    What if there are no charges laid Pete? What if the police have been correct in not laying charges( it doesnt look good I know),
    but I don’t have access to the file, do you.?

    They need a “fucking good” hiding Pete regardless, so take you wateryness away, put together a anti-violence initiative and start a youth club. What I do know is if my 13 year old had been treated even 50% as bad as what it seems this girl was , an anti-violence initiative would not have been a priority.

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  19. Manolo (13,517 comments) says:

    If Peter Marshall is being attacked by Mother Teresa, then the Police must be doing something good.

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  20. scrubone (3,090 comments) says:

    Well, no matter what you think of the police commissioner, this “Kracklite” guy has made a total fool of himself.

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  21. ObligatoryMarxist (36 comments) says:

    Considering that the Police have been contacting other people who criticize them online and threatening them with arrest and imprisonment, I think a healthy dose of paranoia is warranted.

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  22. flipper (3,847 comments) says:

    ObligatoryMarxist (16) Says:
    November 11th, 2013 at 10:17 am
    Considering that the Police have been contacting other people who criticize them online and threatening them with arrest and imprisonment
    ****

    Let us have some proof f/wit…..

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  23. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    Just because they ring you doesn’t mean you’re paranoid.

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  24. scrubone (3,090 comments) says:

    Considering that the Police have been contacting other people who criticize them online and threatening them with arrest and imprisonment, I think a healthy dose of paranoia is warranted.

    He laid a complaint, and then screamed that they had his contact details.

    So, no. This is total paranoia.

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  25. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    “He laid a complaint, and then screamed that they had his contact details.”

    Got proof of that scrubone?

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  26. Longknives (4,686 comments) says:

    For jackinabox and his Marxist chum…

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  27. scrubone (3,090 comments) says:

    “He laid a complaint, and then screamed that they had his contact details.”

    Got proof of that scrubone?

    **facepalm**

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  28. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    That LSD simulator in the background was a bit far out Longknives. lol

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  29. Pete George (23,354 comments) says:

    What I do know is if my 13 year old had been treated even 50% as bad as what it seems this girl was , an anti-violence initiative would not have been a priority.

    Would that be as “a last resort” considering you said “so lets have no knee jerk over this”.

    How would giving them “a fucking good hiding regardless” help the 13 year old who was mistreated? What sort of support do you think you could provide if you were locked up? Or do you think the police would turn a blind eye to father’s rage?

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  30. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    “*facepalm**”

    I thought more like total tool.

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  31. David Garrett (6,786 comments) says:

    Obligatory Marxist: Details please…I recently wrote a letter to Bush, Marshall’s deputy, heavily criticizing his eulogy of the late corrupt cop Bruce Hutton. It goes without saying the letter included all my contact details.

    I got a very disappointing one line reply acknowledging my letter, but I am still waiting for any threats of arrest and imprisonment….notwithstanding that I am, as they say, “known to Police”…

    So evidence please Chum, or piss off back to the Standard

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  32. RRM (9,670 comments) says:

    [Police Commissioner Howard] Broad also pointed out the impact on police resources caused by complaints made against police. ‘Every time a charge is lodged a senior officer has to spend hours bullying the complainant into abandoning it. That’s not helping anyone.’

    http://dimpost.wordpress.com/2008/05/14/new-police-code-of-conduct-three-gang-rapes-and-youre-out/

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  33. Keeping Stock (10,185 comments) says:

    This story is an absolute beat-up. It also shows how far the tabloid-by-size/tabloid-by-nature NZ Herald has sunk since its glory days. Those who made Granny Herald the nation’s premier newspaper all those years ago must be spinning in their graves.

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  34. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/11/07/breaking-police-threaten-daily-blog-editor-with-6months-imprisonment-5000-fine-for-parodying-their-roast-buster-rape-inaction/

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  35. Nostalgia-NZ (5,045 comments) says:

    Sounds like this guy was having a Cheech and Chong moment…’Kracklite’s not here man.’

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  36. Pete George (23,354 comments) says:

    Considering that the Police have been contacting other people who criticize them online and threatening them with arrest and imprisonment,

    That may be referring to the Martyn Bradbury thing where police asked him to take down a fairly disgusting poster about the police (see the jackinabox link ^^)

    The relevant legislation that Bradbury could be in breach of was pointed out which listed a maximum fine and imprisonment term, but I don’t remember seeing any threat to prosecute nor any claim that imprisonment would be a possible or likely outcome.

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  37. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    Here’s another “disgusting” parody that was in the Herald Pete.

    http://bcops.wordpress.com/

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  38. Chuck Bird (4,773 comments) says:

    @PEB

    “If you believe he is corrupt, drop him an email his address is on the Police Web site, tell him he’s corrupt, Id’ suggest you give reason for your beliefs rather than KiwiBlog blather though, your sense of smell Chuck might not have much cred.”

    PEB, I have explained my reasons here many times but it appears your reading comprehension is about as good as your arithmetic. Have another go a reading.

    I spent 3 days on a rape trial where the complaint was a liar. Rather than go through the details I give the result. The jury found the defendant not guilty in under 30 minutes. The judge gave a very strong hint what he expected. Half the jury including 2 women went to the pub with the falsely accused, his lawyer and his supporters.

    The following day I called the police prosecutor and asked why the case went to court. He said it was police policy to let a jury decide if the complainant sticks to the same story. I then asked why the complainant was not charged with perjury or making a false complaint and the response was that it would discourage genuine complainants. The inference should be clear.

    When I see 3 days of court time wasted on a false complaint and I see this current case I say there is a perceived case of a conflict of interest. When police investigate another police officer, a friend, someone they know or a relation of a police officer this potential conflict of interest should be a the top of the file. It took over a week for the media to find out that the police officier’s son was one of those accused in a formal complaint.

    I believe the same should apply to judges and it should not be left up to them to decide how great the conflict of interest is. As a juror I would say it I knew anyone involved or child of someone I knew. I think the same should apply to police and judges.

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  39. Tom Jackson (2,532 comments) says:

    Rhinocrates is one of the more demented posters at The Standard, but typical of the wets who post at Public Address, which appears to be some strange menagerie of the disaffected. My favourite of them is “perpetually offended gay Maori guy”, but many others are almost as comical.

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  40. Redbaiter (8,039 comments) says:

    “Kracklite”

    Druggy if his name means anything.

    Typical of the prog fuckwits who hang out at the echo chamber of political correctness Public Address.

    (DaVaselinemode and other trolls of the government class would be far better suited over there.)

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  41. Tom Jackson (2,532 comments) says:

    Come off it Redbaiter. You are easily as touchy as the Public Address cretins.

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  42. Redbaiter (8,039 comments) says:

    Cwaig is actually pretty good fun. Goes off like a rocket when he sees that w where the r should be.

    Russell Brown on the other hand is a sniffing arrogant prog dodo who writes stuff that is so insufferably boring I seldom visit his blog at all.

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  43. RRM (9,670 comments) says:

    :lol: Every time Wedbaiter uses the words “echo chamber”, RRM LOLs.

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  44. Redbaiter (8,039 comments) says:

    Just because I won’t provide space for trolls like you doesn’t mean I won’t tolerate comments that differ.

    What worth is your continuous stream of trolling to Kiwiblog?

    Comments that are almost always completely off topic.

    Zero.

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  45. TheContrarian (1,082 comments) says:

    From what I have seen troll to redbaiter is ‘someone who doesn’t fit my preconceived narrative’

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  46. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    I called the police prosecutor and asked why the case went to court. He said it was police policy to let a jury decide if the complainant sticks to the same story. I then asked why the complainant was not charged with perjury or making a false complaint and the response was that it would discourage genuine complainants. The inference should be clear.

    They let the jury decide because the situation arises like is happening with these little toe rags now. Damned if they do damned if they dont The police have been doing this with sex offences for years due to historic out cries that they were not taking allegations seriously etc etc. the same with domestic assaults. When I stared with the police it rare that hubby got binned, more often you would just take the wife away for the night. then we were directed to arrest them all, so you do whats policy.

    Same with sex matters. the police loose a lot because they let the jury decide.

    The solicitor general makes the decision whether someone is to be charged with perjury not th police and the prosecutor made a point, there are genuine cases and these complainants need to be encourged to go with the system.

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  47. Tom Jackson (2,532 comments) says:

    The police have been doing this with sex offences for years due to historic out cries that they were not taking allegations seriously etc etc.

    Which exposes the accusations that NZ has a “rape culture” as completely ridiculous. Being accused of rape is like being accused of child molestation: even if the accusations are completely bogus, the mud sticks, and the police are so cowed by political pressure that they will prosecute just to avoid being flamed. That’s what makes this case so odd: the fact that the police wouldn’t prosecute is telling. My guess is that the standard behaviour of the teens involved in this social circle was such as to make a conviction impossible.

    I remember back in the 90s a guy was expelled from Waikato University because he’d been accused of rape. It later came out that the accuser was making it up to get out of doing exams, but the usual suspects still backed her.

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  48. davidp (3,561 comments) says:

    Is there an Oscar or a Nobel prize for being a complete and absolute tool? If not, I’d be happy to kick in $20 towards a trophy for Kracklite.

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  49. scrubone (3,090 comments) says:

    Is there an Oscar or a Nobel prize for being a complete and absolute tool? If not, I’d be happy to kick in $20 towards a trophy for Kracklite.

    Put me down for another $20 :)

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  50. Rich Prick (1,635 comments) says:

    Alright. Who left the probe in this one?

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  51. David Garrett (6,786 comments) says:

    Tom Jackson: the case you are talking about was a young guy doing law…he was a warden at one of the student hostels as well as being a student (his name will come to me shortly)

    He was charged, and IIRC convicted…but lucky for him his father was an ex cop and managed to establish – by eftpos transactions – that the guy was at a bar on the other side of Hamilton when the so called rape occurred.

    There were calls for the woman to be charged, and the head of Rape Crisis at the time made a huge song and dance about that, the net effect of which was that NO woman should ever be charged with making a false complaint in such circumstances..Again IIRC she was quietly eased out of her job…whether she would be now is another story..

    Anyway, it completely f…d this young guy; he left his legal studies and Waikato Uni (some silver lining to a dark cloud I guess) as a result of continuing suspicion that despite the clear proof, he “must have done it”

    I hasten to add this present situation appears to be very different…except that there are some ominous echoes of it in claims by some that “rape complainants must always be believed”…

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  52. backster (2,124 comments) says:

    Jackinabox(98)….You must be very young or very forgetful…Up until the ascension of Marshall the Police seemed to the average Joe Blow to be obsessed with minor traffic breeches, woe behold any cop who didn’t fill his quota, ( the same mentality that gives your crowd the man ban). The introduction of ‘P’ was ignored despite the warnings of the Police Association, and city streets were terrorised by boy racers. South Auckland was almost out of control with crims rulling the streets ……COLLINS and MARSHALL changed all that. They identified the crimes and instituted targeted solutions which have reduced major crime issues. Police morale so low under former policies seems much improved. I could go on but I shouldn’t have to.

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  53. jackinabox (781 comments) says:

    There’s more P on the streets than ever and Collins didn’t crush a single car, only traffic police were required to fill a quota and police moral is on a par with the trustworthiness ratio.

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  54. gravedodger (1,528 comments) says:

    @ David Garrett was that Nick Wills you were searching for?
    Three months from arrest to abandoned charges and from memory the chick got off lightly due to mental issues, pffft.

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