Kiwiblog

Mind you Destiny deserve to be rubbished when they try stuff like this. Stuff reports:

Destiny Church has launched a hostile take-over battle for control of one of the country’s more respected culture organisations, the Maori Women’s Welfare League.

Hannah Tamaki, wife of bishop and founder of Destiny, Brian Tamaki, is running a slick photo-shopped campaign in a bid to become national president of the league and its nearly 4000 members.

It is causing outrage in the league, whose first patron was the legendary Princess Te Puea Herangi (1884-1952), and was led into political pre-eminence by land rights campaigner Dame Whina Cooper (1895-1994).

Hannah Tamaki says in her campaign material that her husband “is a direct descendent” of Te Puea.

Te Puea had no children.

Doh.

Hone Harawira blogs:

I understand that my going to Destiny Church last week has offended some members of MANA, and that my attendance and speech have been seen as an endorsement of Destiny’s stance on homosexuality.

That is not so.

I value the broad support that MANA has attracted from all sectors of our society, and I owe it to everyone to explain things from my own point of view.

You see … like everyone else I have gay people in my whanau, and like everyone else I also have straight people in my whanau, and like everyone else I love them all.

I would sincerely hope that my attendance at the Destiny hui is not seen as an endorsement by either myself or MANA of the views held by Bishop Brian Tamaki and the Destiny Church, in the same way that I hope my attendance at the Mormon Stake Conference on Saturday is not seen as an endorsement of their more unsavoury racial practices of the recent past, or my attendance at an Anglican church service seen as an endorsement of their practice of stealing Maori land over the centuries.

I broadly agree with Hone on this. A politician accepting a speaking engagement is not an endorsement of everything the host stands for – far from it. MPs should and do attend meetings held by groups they disagree with, and this is a good thing.

Do we think John Key endorses all the CTU policies when he addresses their national conference?

Only the most extreme groups should be considered out of bounds for an MP to speak to – basically neo-nazis and others that preach hatred.

Now I am no fan of Destiny. To my mind they come closer to the “should not address under any circumstance” group than many others. They are cult-like.

But they do actually do some good with their social services, and now that they are not also running a parallel political wing, they are not as big a threat as they once were.

The Herald reports:

Destiny Church has been branded a “cult” after Brian Tamaki said Jesus did not rise from the dead – but the self-styled bishop says he was quoted out of context.

Mark Vrankovich, director of Cultwatch, has released audio clips and transcripts of Bishop Tamaki preaching a series of messages to his followers.

He says the clips show Bishop Tamaki rejecting the physical resurrection of Jesus Christ three days after he was crucified – the core of the Christian faith.

In the sermons, Bishop Tamaki said he had been preparing his followers for a year to receive the revelation God gave him about the resurrection, so they could “understand what the Bible is really saying”.

He told the congregation they would doubt his teaching, unless they also had the revelation, because of “too many forces and too much teaching and too much backlog of religion”.

“You must get out of your mind that, that Jesus Christ is now, ah, is still Jesus of Nazareth … But Jesus did not come out of the tomb. The flesh Jesus died in the tomb.”

When I read this story, it puzzled me. Why would Archbishop Tamaki start to tell his followers that Jesus was not physically ressurected, and did not rise from the dead. After all, these are pretty fundamental Christian beliefs.

But then I read the context about how he claims to have been personally instructed by God, and that his revelations would take a year for them to accept etc.

And the only answer that makes sense to me, is that Tamaki was going to claim he is the new son of God.

I presume that a son of God can charge an even higher tithe than a Bishop or Archbishop.

One of the nine seeking Labour’s nomination for Te Atatu is Michael Kidd. I presume he is a Labour Party member in order to be able to stand.

Is he the same Michael Kidd who was ranked at No 7 on the Family Party list in 2008? The Family Party being Destiny in drag of course.

A strange political journey. Imagine the replacement for Chris Carter being a former Destiny candidate

The HoS reports:

A Destiny Church pastor working for a child-fostering organisation that gets $10 million a year of taxpayer money is placing vulnerable children with Destiny members of the congregation.

New Plymouth Destiny pastor Robyn Edmonds oversees foster placements as the Taranaki branch manager of the Open Home Foundation, which helps “disadvantaged and hurt” children.

The foster kids are expected to attend Destiny’s controversial services each Sunday. …

He said it was part of the group’s ethos to have foster children attend church on a Sunday unless their natural parents specifically objected.

Former Destiny members from Taranaki said the congregation was encouraged to open its homes to foster children.

“They were encouraging people to go into social work,” said one.

The object was to have members make their homes suitable as potential foster homes, from which children could be taken to church services.

Another member said the extra children meant a greater income and higher tithes. However, he said the appeal was fresh membership.

In a statement, Child, Youth and Family national operations manager John Henderson said the foundation received $8.9m in funding last year, mainly for foster-family work. The group’s own records put total taxpayer funding at $10.7m.

“There have been no concerns raised with the Ministry of Social Development or Child, Youth and Family in relation to Open Home Foundation or Destiny Church,” he said.

My views on Tamaki are well known, and I suspect the motivation for the fostering is about more membership.

However if CYF has no issues with the quality of care given by Destiny members, then good on them for offering foster homes. NZ has a shortage of good quality foster parents, and kids do better in an actual family home than they do in an institution.

Some of the work done by Destiny Church is laudable, and this is an example.

However that does not make Arch Bishop Brian the physical manifestation of God, and does not excuse the extortion tithing racket which nets him a million dollars a year.

The Herald reports:

BRIAN TAMAKI’S INCOME:
$950,000 to $1.1 million

* Salary from Destiny Auckland: $200,000
* Salary from Destiny Rotorua: $148,500
* Pastors’ tithes: $100,000
* Speaking engagements: $150,000
* First Fruits: $350,000 to $500,000

Extras

* Profits of messages sold at
Destiny Church pay for $500,000 boat
* All 20 Destiny Church branches are encouraged to give at least $1000 to buy gifts for celebrations, including birthday, Christmas Day, anniversaries and Father’s Day.

Purely from a business point of view, you have to admire the set-up. Basically Arch-Bishop Brian has combined God and Amway to make himself rich.

I wonder how he decided on God to be his commodity?

Bryce Edwards blogs:

Not only is the Destiny Church facing all sorts of internal ructions relating to its financial affairs and control, but the Christian political party that is an outgrowth of Brian Tamaki’s church – the Family Party – has just applied to cancel its registration with the Electoral Commission, and hence dissolve itself. The Family Party – one of three Christian-based parties that sought the party vote in the 2008 election – originally went under the name of ‘Destiny New Zealand’, until a major reconfiguration occurred prior to the 2008 general election.

Yay. The last thing I want is a party linked to a cult being in Parliament.

The Family Party in 2008 got only 0.35% of the vote and in 2005 Destiny itself got 0.62%.

Hopefully this means Arch-Bishop Brian has given up on ruling the country, and will leave most of us alone, and just go back to (financially) preying on his victims parishioners.

The Herald reports:

New revelations have emerged of the inner workings of Destiny Church, including claims of eftpos terminals being used to take collections, men-only church meetings, and numerous tithing nightmares.

Former churchgoers contacted the Herald after revelations that dozens of members walked out of the Brisbane branch of the church on Sunday in support of Pastor Andrew Stock, who resigned from Destiny over a recently introduced covenant that clashed with his beliefs.

One man said the church was a “cash cult” and he was “not happy with the fact they had eftpos machines in the middle of the church”.

Another described the church as “Destiny Bank”.

And essentially that is what it is. A make money scheme for Arch Bishop Brian.

The Herald reports:

Destiny Church ministers and leaders are heading to its Brisbane branch after more than half the congregation – including its pastor – walked out.

Bishop Brian Tamaki, who founded the church in New Zealand in 1998, is expected to be among those heading to Australia this week after the resignation of Pastor Andrew Stock.

Members of the Destiny Church in Brisbane, who were at Sunday’s service, contacted the Herald yesterday.

It is believed Pastor Stock – who has been at the Brisbane branch pulpit for about three years – withdrew from his role because a newly introduced covenant went against his beliefs, a member said.

Standing up for your beliefs is to be praised.

The member said the covenant told members to “give it heaps” as they worked towards a $3 million project which included building a $1.3 million budget to go towards putting Bishop Tamaki on TVNZ every morning, from Monday to Friday.

The covenant also encouraged members to go without coffee, takeaways and Sky TV for up to seven months to help give more in their church tithes.

All so Archbishop Tamaki can get even richer. I bet you he won’t be going without coffee.

The church member who contacted the Herald said many in the congregation felt the covenant was going against the Gospel.

“It was a money-making scheme. All the people who make covenant with Bishop Tamaki have to buy a $300 ring.

“You might think I’m stupid for going into the church in the first place. But I [only] found out it was a cult after I went in.”

Sadly, for many it is too late by then.

The member said it was widely known that all Destiny Church pastors had to sign a contract.

In that contract, it said if they were to withdraw as a pastor they were forbidden to pastor at any other church for two years and their new church could not be less than 50km from a Destiny Church.

Never heard of God having restraint of trade clauses for his servants before.

The Herald reports:

Destiny Church supporters parted with tens of thousands of dollars for the privilege of watching 700 worshippers swear an oath of allegiance to leader Bishop Brian Tamaki.

Church officials have confirmed “several thousand” people paid $30 each to attend the ceremony, with a $60 concession for family groups.

But costs didn’t stop at the door. Oath takers paid $295 – plus a $5 administration fee – for the ring symbolising their loyalty to Bishop Tamaki. Some were given the option of paying the ring off over time.

My personal theory is that Tamaki is just a cunning businessman, who is using religion to make stacks of money. I mean $90,000 from the spectators and $210,000 from the oath takers is a sweet $300,000.

If he wasn’t selling God, he’d be promoting PONZI schemes or Scientology, or spamming viagra pills.

He likened the covenant’s provisions of non-disagreement with the way Prime Minister John Key would view party members espousing different views from the party line.

Ummm what a ridicolous comment. First of all there is no swearing an oath of loyalty to the Leader of a political party, let alone a detailed book instructing you to never disagree with the Leader in public.

More importantly party members express views different to the party line all the time. Hell I do it every week.

A timely cartoon from Blunt.

Garth George writes:

In requiring its men to swear an oath of loyalty and obedience to Brian Tamaki, the Destiny Church – having glorified the messenger above the message – has begun to transform itself into a cult.

I’ve been of the view that it has had cult like features for some time.

In a seperate article, Mr George reports:

The leader of Destiny Church, Brian Tamaki, who not long ago anointed himself bishop of the church he founded, has now proclaimed himself the church’s “spiritual father” and designated the male members of the church as “spiritual sons”.

At a special service during the church’s annual conference in Auckland at the weekend, about 700 male members of the church swore a “covenant oath” of loyalty and obedience to Mr Tamaki and were given a “covenant ring” to wear on their right hands.

A church document describes the covenant as “a solemn oath of commitment that is binding, enduring and unbreakable. You are bound to covenant … Covenant is an irrevocable, undissolvable oath of commitment”.

Just hope they don’t put him in charge of the cool-aid.

Then comes the section entitled “Protocols towards our spiritual father”, which takes 1300 words to describe in jaw-dropping detail how the “spiritual sons” shall behave towards their “spiritual father”.

Under “Public Conduct”, the sons will in all conversation always speak of Mr Tamaki in a favourable and positive light; and in formal and/or public occasions, they will always address him and his wife, Hannah, first in acknowledgments and addresses at meetings “as a sign of respect to the father of the movement”.

If any “son” is honoured either by the church or secularly, he is to mention his “mentors and role models” – Mr and Mrs Tamaki – “because Bishop is one of God’s best-known representatives in our country”.

This may give Winston ideas for some new sections in the NZ First constitution. I suspect Anderton already has such clauses in the Progressive constitution

They must endorse what Mr Tamaki endorses, fully support what he promotes and ensure that what he is involved in is supported and successful.

“Whenever Bishop speaks all other talking stops: give him your full attention. Be careful not to cut in on him when he is speaking and ensure others don’t either.

“Don’t start talking or gesturing to somebody else while Bishop is speaking.”

The “sons” must never openly disagree with Mr Tamaki in front of others and must “be careful not to become familiar (which can lead to contempt)” with him “due to his friendliness and openness”.

I’m not sure what is sadder. That Tamaki himself is so lacking in self-esteem he needs a guide like this to make him feel important, or that any of his followers read this crap without bursting out laughing.

They should come to church anticipating that God will speak through Mr Tamaki and should always be dressed well at all meetings with him. “His dress code is your dress code.”

That will get interesting if Tamaki starts cross-dressing!

They must never tolerate anyone (regardless of who they are) speaking or talking critically of Mr Tamaki and his wife/family or the church. “You are not only to stop them in their tracks but warn them that they criticise you when they criticise Bishop.”

Oh yes how dare anyone criticise the great Bishop. They must be stopped.

Well that will be ironic. Destiny Church plans to become an Urban Maori Authority, which will make it eligible for Government grants, contracts and even Treaty settlements.

The Cabinet will be pleased!

Oh this is so funny. The SST reports that Brian Tamaki is now much more relaxed about homosexuality – to the point that he will even talk to airline cabin stewards now.

I am sure gays and lesbians up and down NZ will be celebrating.

To be fair some progress is better than none. The next step is to get Archbishop Tamaki talking to male hairdressers and if he survives that maybe he could try talking to women cricket players.