General Debate 16 October 2020

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Happychappy

If you ever thought this Election wasn’t about Jacinda Ardern and her high opinion of herself you only had to read her remarks after the final debate last evening. If any other Leader of a Political party had voiced what Jacinda Ardern voiced last evening the headlines would have been screaming what arrogance . Prime Ministers Jacinda Ardern has said she would not stay on as Leader of Labour if she loses the upcoming Election. In the final Leaders debate tonight, Jessica Mutch McKay asked Ardern if she loses the Election would she stay on as Leader of the opposition? “No” Ardern said not elaborating further, Collins said she would stay on as Leader of the National Party if she lost as she was the right person with the experience needed.
Speaking after the debate Ardern confirmed she would stand down if Labour was not returned to Government
that certainly would be my choice… our plan is to succeed on Election night.
” My message would be,if people don’t want to see me resigning then vote for Labour”.
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October 16, 2020 8:00am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Every election night a group of Nat supporters gather together. This has been a celebration for the last 4 elections.
  
  Tomorrow night will be a Wake. It will be a Wake for the recently departed NZ Economy. Unlike Jesus the NZ Economy wont rise on the third day indeed it wont rise on the third year.
  
  It will sometime in the 2030s before the NZ Economy will rise a frail image of its past during the 2008/2017 period.
  
  It will take decades for future generations to pay the capital and interest as a result of the 2020 Governments poor decisions.
  
  History will say that the Government should have closed the borders to non-citizens at the beginning of February and quarantined returning citizens i hotels motels campervans. These were all emptying fast with foreigners returning home.
  In addition the Government could have used defence force facilities and of course defence force personnel to supplement Police in guarding quarantine facilities.
  
  It should have also protected the smaller age care facilities using personnel.
  
  It should have let all other NZ citizens go about their normal lives.
  
  The results would have been that the inbound tourist sector would have been the only area that suffered and that was unavoidable.
  
  Instead of balancing the medical and economic factors the Government listened to flawed medical evidence and place 100% on that and zero on the economic impact.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:17am
  - sooty
    
    I think the next question to cindy should have straight back at her, “do you intend to see out your term if elected again”. Missed that one didn’t you. J MnM.
    
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    October 16, 2020 3:01pm
- Happy1
  
  People need to look seriously at Ardern ‘s appeal. Back in February she was goneburger. Her bounce from her adroit handling of the shooting had worn off and delivery failure was front and centre. Two things, the elimination strategy and people trust her. Trust is intangible. When I was farming I always dealt with people I trusted and avoided those I didn’t. Act and National have signaled that they wouldn’t continue the elimination strategy. Just a couple of weeks ago Judith was railing about the south being at level 2 and level 3 for Auckland being over the top thus giving the impression that under her leadership things would be more business friendly but riskier. Results in tomorrow. Krazy kiwi gave his view on how deadly this virus is now I will explain mine. As he said the problem is that while you no the total number of known cases you don’t know the number of actual cases. I like the South Korean ser of figures. South Korea really did go hard and early. They aggressively traced and tested right from the start. The fact that they eliminated suggests that their number of known cases, 25,000, will be close to the actual. They have had 450 deaths giving a death rate of 1.8% 7 times Krazys rate of 0.27%. For hard stats google England Wales weekly deaths 2020. You will see 2020 weekly deaths tracking the 5 year average up until late Marc when they surge up and by mid April they are more than double the 5 year average at 22,000 a week. They plateau for a few weeks before tailing down to normal by June as Boris’s belated mitigation kicks in. 58,000 excess deaths, all covid. Here we have a death deficit of around 600 as the positive unintended consequences ( less flu, accidents etc) exceed the negative unintended consequences ( delayed medical care, stress suicide etc)
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:01pm
TWEEDSE

Ardern has declared she will not stay on if Labour looses.

So in the seemingly unlikely event of National/Act forming a government we get the Power Ball as well.
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October 16, 2020 8:00am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Cindy knows very well, the election is in the bag. That is why she made that statement. Also the statement will spur Pasifika and Maori people who adore her as GOD to get out and vote “aunty Jacinda”. National is in for a a huge defeat on election night.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:58am
  - Raphael
    
    I fear that your usually satirical statements may prove to be true on this occasion, and it scares me.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:31am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Raphael bro – I have extradinary powers to predict the future. Here is another prediction for election night results:
      Labour – 46%; National – 33%; ACT – 8%; Greens – 7%; NZ First – 4%
      
      Comfortable Labour and Greens gummit. Tonight there is a TV3 poll and Toxic Tova will slide the knife strongly into Judith Collins and National.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:44am
  - sharont
    
    No, I don’t believe it is in the bag at all. I think Cindy knows that and that is what her pitch was for. Her final minute in the debate/discussion looked pretty desperate to me for someone that is supposed to be so far out in front. It’s going to be a close election.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:38am
- DeepBlue
  
  The Captain will abandon the Team of 5 million at the first chance, if she can’t be the boss.
  
  So much for captaincy and leadership. I can’t imagine Ritchie McCaw saying that.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:36am
Steve Todd

DPF last evening: “I do wish they would give us a more precise number for NZ First. This could be anywhere from 2.5% to 3.4%.”

Jessica Mutch has just told us (on TVNZ 1’s ‘Breakfast’ show) that NZ First’s 3% in last night’s ONCB poll is actually 2.6%.

It’s all over for Winston.
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October 16, 2020 8:00am
- Cinematic
  
  Anything under 10% should be reported to one decimal place.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:04am
- G152
  
  And that in spite of the fake news attempting to get them in.
  So farewell to the whine boxer, the master baiting mafia man and the medal cheat…
  Hopefully there will be other surprises that the fake news will be distraught over
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:09am
- krazykiwi
  
  It’s not all over for Winston. It’s a new phase where, with the years remaining for him, he continues to collect on his ‘investments’. Some like the knighthood and plumb posting to London or New York will be visible to us. His hidden stash of cash less so.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:31am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    He is on the record as saying that former politicians should not receive diplomatic postings. Indeed he repeated that when he appointed Rosemary Banks, a career diplomat to Washington.
    
    Are you really suggesting that he would now be a hypocrite and accept such a posting? 🙂
    
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    October 16, 2020 8:48am
    - Biscuit
      
      Benedict, Hypocrite is Winston Hypocrite First’s middle name…
      
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      October 16, 2020 8:58am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      He’s also on record as saying he’s “not interested in the baubles of power” whilst assiduously collecting such baubles and corruptly rorting the purpose of the NZF Foundation.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:39pm
  - peterwn
    
    Even if these things were in the secret coalition agreement, they are unenforceable. Jacinda would have every reason to argue that circumstances are now different.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:35am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    I suspect Winston’s days among us are numbered. I don’t know what’s got him exactly. Politicians have a very tough life at everyone’s call and social drinking required. He’s an evident alcy and nothing like the person he once was. I don’t see Winston fit for any further appointments.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:01am
- Yvette
  
  1 News [1] showed the Greens on 8% (plus 2), Act on 8% and NZF on 3% and had the Greens above Act in the graphic display.
  
  Meanwhile Colmar Brunton on their website [2] say the Greens are 6% (down 1) and New Zealand First is 2% (plus 1)
  
  If Colmar Brunton gives the real figures, TVNZ should have actually had Act displayed above the Greens on their graphics, as well as show true figures.
  
  And who thinks massaging figures makes it easier for the plebs to understand, when no decimals seem to be involved? So why mess with the results and not display them properly?
  
  [1] https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/1-news-colmar-brunton-poll-labour-maintains-strong-lead-over-national-greens-climb
  [2] https://www.colmarbrunton.co.nz/what-we-do/1-news-poll/
  
  Full details of the poll will be released on the Colmar Brunton website 48 hours after the results are aired by TVNZ – so supposedly an hour before the Election results begin being broadcast.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:46am
  - Steve Todd
    
    That was last week’s poll, Yvette – 3-7 October.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:05am
PhilBest

Today’s important Covid-19 read: a blast of common sense from Matt Ridley in “The Spectator”

Surely expert epidemiologists should have understood this all along? By “protecting” the least vulnerable (eg school children) we ultimately maximize the death toll among the most vulnerable.

Students catching Covid-19 might help save lives
By Matt Ridley

It is counterintuitive but the current spread of Covid-19 may on balance be the least worst thing that could happen now. In the absence of a vaccine, and with no real prospect of eradicating the disease, the virus spreading among younger people, mostly without hitting the vulnerable, is creating immunity that will eventually slow the epidemic. The second wave is real, but it is not like the first. It would be a mistake to tackle it with compulsory lockdowns (even if called ‘circuit breakers’), whether national or local. The cure would be worse than the disease.

If you cannot extinguish an epidemic at the start, the best strategy is for the healthy to get infected first. Lockdowns ensure that the vulnerable and the healthy both get infected with similar probability. School closures, concluded a recent paper in the British Medical Journal, can paradoxically lead to more deaths by prioritising the protection of the least vulnerable.

This time, unlike in the spring, the virus has been mostly spreading among students. Places where more than 25 per cent of the population are university students have seven times the positive test rate of the rest of the country. Among students the infection is mostly asymptomatic or mild. As of last week, 70,000 students in the United States had tested positive with just three hospitalisations (one released) and no deaths.

By contrast, the effect of lockdowns on the mental health of young people is huge. Psychologists report that anxiety and depression have sky-rocketed, especially among the young, so that the highest mental impact is being felt among those least likely to die. It’s not Covid-19 that is causing this, but lockdown and recession.
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October 16, 2020 8:00am
- krazykiwi
  
  Matt Ridley is a credentialed, evidence based commentator. His blog – The Rational Optimist – is well worth reading, as are his books.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:31am
- KevO'Brien
  
  The mental health aspects are manifest among my family. These may yet be much worse than any COVID.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:04am
PhilBest

Another important Covid-19 read (sorry, Kiwibloggers might already have discussed this)

16 Possible Factors for Sweden’s High COVID Death Rate among the Nordics

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3674138
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October 16, 2020 8:01am
- PhilBest
  
  What I want to further point out is that expert official epidemiologists should have been onto these factors right from the start. The alarmist modelers promised 60,000 deaths for Sweden without a lockdown. They’ve nearly hit 6000.
  
  The above paper discusses why the death toll is even as high as 1/10 of the alarmists predictions. The top reason is an unusually mild couple of seasons for flu that left more old and vulnerable people alive.
  
  It is entirely plausible to apply the various factors to argue that, as people like Sir Bob Jones and myself said back in March, NZ was never going to be anywhere near as bad as the epicenters to date. If we were as bad as Sweden, that would be 3000 deaths. BUT:
  
  Our weather not being as cold as Sweden, and having more sunshine and less Vitamin D deficiency
  
  Not having urban crowding like Stockholm and other cities, especially in blocks of brutalist apartments crammed with recent immigrants who don’t understand the language
  
  Not having massive factory-scale Rest Care facilities for the most vulnerable (NZ’s big complexes are “villages” for the self-caring, independent elderly)
  
  These factors alone would have reduced Covid-19 to just a bad flu season in NZ (500 deaths).
  
  Now, you will accuse me of hindsight. No, I said these things in March. What I want to know, is how someone can be qualified and have worked in “epidemiology” all their life and all they do is baffle us with BS to justify tyranny and economic carnage, which BS is completely contrary not only to common sense and logic, but to medical science itself, in which they are supposed to be experts.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:14am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Never trust people who work with numbers to interpret the significance of their outputs.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:06am
- PhilBest
  
  If you Google search Sweden and Covid-19, you will get pages of search results from lefty websites about what a disaster Sweden is, how their approach is covered in shame, nothing about how the pandemic is over there, how other countries are still in the pandemic even with lockdowns being turned off and on again, and how there is no comparison in economic disaster and lockdown-related mortality (including for the next couple of decades).
  
  Google needs to be smashed, they can’t have this both ways. If they are a publisher picking and choosing content, then they are liable for everything from leftwing terrorists that they allow to stand, including Covid-19 misinformation from “the establishment” (which does come into the category of terrorist psy-ops).
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:21am
Humble Capitalist

Even my teenage son knows that a vote for New Conservatives or NZ First is a vote for Ardern, Davidson and Shaw. A lot of people that hate the idea of that government dont seem to get it though
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October 16, 2020 8:02am
- IC5000
  
  Interesting how you use the word hate. I wouldn’t think hate as a motivating emotion would lead to a healthy life.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:22am
  - ISeeRed
    
    OK, Captain Pedantic, would someone who hated being fat and was motivated by that to change their diet and start exercising end up having a healthy life? Hmmmm?
    
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    October 17, 2020 12:02am
- Steve Todd
  
  How do newly-established parties get a foothold on the electoral landscape if people don’t vote for them? Would you be quite so concerned about a new left-wing party that was draining votes away from Labour and the Greens? I suspect not.
  
  Everyone is perfectly entitled to give their Party vote for the party that they consider best reflects their view of life. All such votes are perfectly legitimate, regardless of whether or not they are effective in helping to elevate the parties that receive them into parliament.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:32am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    If we want people to vote according to their values Steve – 1) lower the threshold a bit eg. 3.5% is well in excess of 80,000 people without a representative in the house 2) ban polling in the 6 months leading into an election to stop people from voting strategically based on the results of 1000 people that have choose to respond to a poll. I think it would be far more interesting and a better contest if nobody was allowed to poll on party preference leading into an election.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:00am
    - Steve Todd
      
      I’m not saying that’s what we want; I’m merely suggesting that people cast their votes the way they do for a myriad of reasons, all of which are perfectly valid.
      
      You will recall there was a review of MMP by the Electoral Commission in 2012. Its recommendations, including a 4% threshold, were rejected by one Judith Collins on the spurious and self-serving ground that there was no ‘consensus’ across parliament for them.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:08am
      - Humble Capitalist
        
        So what Steve? Collins will look after her own party’s interests like all politicians will.
        What I am saying is that I would be more likely to consider backing a smaller party if it didnt mean potentially my and 100,000 other votes were not represented in parliament
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:18pm
    - Deagle
      
      I would prefer a preferential vote system.
      
      Or what if the total number of ‘wasted votes’ were added up and contribute towards empty seats meaning wasted votes do not result in concentrating the established seats.
      
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      October 16, 2020 12:18pm
    - gorse
      
      And the media weren’t allowed to comment
      
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      October 16, 2020 12:59pm
  - sharont
    
    If National were in government it would be worth taking a risk on a smaller party but when that vote is going to lead to a commie Labour/Greens government and all that entails then voting for NC or NZF is utter stupidity.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:41am
  - Observer of Life
    
    Steve: I guess it’s just exposure to the people over an election or two. Be consistent with your messaging, don’t give up, get out and make yourselves known. Most of all. Have policies and standby them.
    
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    October 16, 2020 5:25pm
- Nigel Kearney
  
  There are only three ways your vote can fail to be wasted:
  
  1. The party vote difference between ACT plus National and Green plus Labour is one or zero votes.
  
  2. The party you voted for gets exactly 5% and not one vote more and no electorate.
  
  3. A party you considered and rejected gets exactly one vote less than 5% and no electorate.
  
  In all other cases (i.e. at least 99.9999% of the time) your vote makes no difference. Sorry about that.
  
  Compared to these wild longshots, is it so unreasonable to vote for a party that can’t make it, in the hope your vote helps them stay alive and get over 5% in the future?
  
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  October 16, 2020 2:02pm
2ic

Interesting to see again how out of line NZ Herald’s crack team of ‘experts’ are with their readership again. They have the following verdicts for last night’s debate (hidden behind paywall):
Audrey Young: Jacinda Ardern
Simon Wilson: Jacinda Ardern
Claire Trevett: Draw
Fran O’Sullivan: Draw
(https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/election-2020-the-verdict-who-won-the-final-leaders-debate-our-experts-have-their-say/OKCB7BOZLPOBEWFRU264E6XJ6A/)

A poll of their readers tells a different story:
Jacinda Ardern: 39%
Judith Collins: 53%
(https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/election-2020-final-leaders-debate-jacinda-ardern-v-judith-collins/4RZAX3WM32XYHSHTT4DZMMY2QQ/)
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October 16, 2020 8:02am
- Biscuit
  
  2ic, you wonder how it is that Audrey, Simon, Claire and Fran can on the one hand be so out of sync with their readership yet on the other be so keen for that readership to fund their ‘quality’ journalism…
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:01am
  - JackRabbit
    
    $50Million reasons.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:48am
- Jimmy White
  
  Forgive them. We have yet to get a vaccine for Jacinda Obsession Syndrome. (JOS).
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:34am
Catgurl13

Jabbacindy said she would not be leader of the Labour party if she doesn’t win the election,indicating leaving politics altogether.Those words might be a bad omen for her. She might have to eat them if it comes true.
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October 16, 2020 8:03am
- Sacha
  
  She’d be off on a plane like a shot – to a nice little sinecure courtesy Bill Gates.
  I would be passingly interested to know the state os her overseas ‘investment accounts’.
  But hey, whatever it takes –
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:05am
  - ex-golfer
    
    But will she be made to pay the $3000 quarantine fee if she decides to come back?
    
    Command and control in full swing.
    No one can travel overseas unless they have stacks of cash .
    All part of the move to destroy international travel (and those carbon guzzling airlines) for anyone but the elites and therefore contribute further to the success of Agenda 21/30
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:19am
- LTA1955
  
  Even with the Mad Queens minions in MSM running the current fluff campaign, I would say there would not be enough certainty for her to make the statement that she will resign if she doesn’t win. It’s only if some feedback from the electoral bins has surfaced, by accident of course. It’s just too bloody tempting for this bunch of leftie crooks
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:47am
  - sharont
    
    That’s exactly why I won’t vote early – why give them days to handle the votes and have them riding in the back of someone’s car never to be seen again? Less chance of fiddling with your vote if you vote on the day.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:43am
    - Bloody Dago
      
      Here’s 5 million people looking for a plane or boat:
      “ATTENTION: The latest findings from the Refugees for Venezuela platform found that the number of Venezuelans who have fled the country has reached 5.5 million, meaning almost 300,000 people have left the country during the pandemic and the closure of borders,” the university said in a Twitter announcement”
      What this shows is brand of socialism that the Mad Queen endorses can move 5 million people in the space of a couple of years, it doesn’t bode well for little old New Zealand. How much that ticket to Aussie again?
      
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      October 16, 2020 12:57pm
- crikey
  
  Hoping…
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:16pm
- Observer of Life
  
  Let’s hope (beyond hope) that she LOSES. Her arrogance is breathtaking.
  
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  October 16, 2020 5:27pm
Maggy Wassilieff

This little nugget seems to have escaped the TV news last night

https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018768533/jobseeker-benefit-figures-up-more-than-40-percent-on-past-year
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October 16, 2020 8:05am
- Justitia
  
  Not to worry Maggy, Phil Twyford as Economic Development Minister will sort it. She’ll be right, Jacinda is looking after us….and Kiwis are cretins anyway.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:10am
- Gulag1917
  
  The real unemployment figures are generally double the official figures.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:43am
- cmm
  
  So 40% more people getting government love….
  
  Isn’t that proof how much she cares?
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:56am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Expect more.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:10am
Vory v zakone

Morena kiwibloggers
Hands up who hasn’t woken up with a crack pipe in their mouth this morning… ?
#Where’sHunter?
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October 16, 2020 8:08am
- Jimmy White
  
  Slow Joe but not Munter Hunter
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:38am
- Ed Snack
  
  And there’s “good old” Joe Biden raking in 50% of what his family takes in bribes.
  
  No doubt our battalion of TDS sufferers will all frantically justify this away as “Russian disinformation” and illegally stolen and/or hacked information. Damn cunning those Russkies, infiltrated “faked” emails onto a laptop at a US computer repair shop left by a crackhead who failed to collect it. They even included a trove of photos and videos of the crackhead and his family. Really, TRULY cunning.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:39am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Jacinda Ardern says she will resign if she loses the Election tomorrow. Vote counting does not start until tomorrow – tell me that the left leaning scrutineers have not opened the boxes and Jacinda has not seen preliminary results. Cheating just like the bloody Democrats.
Haere Ra you do nothing part time prime minister
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October 16, 2020 8:09am
- krazykiwi
  
  Having been a polling place manager in the past I can say the vote counting process has good checks and balances. I’m less certain about how auditable is the management of advance voting boxes. It strikes me that there’s some fraud potential there
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:16am
  - sharont
    
    Exactly why I will not vote early. Voting on the day gives them less chance to “lose” my vote.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:45am
- pdm
  
  Jacinda does not do the hard yards – and Leader of the Opposition is hard yards.
  
  Glory jobs only for her.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:25am
  - SGA
    
    meh – Pragmatics – these days sitting PMs who lose elections have rarely led their parties into the next election.
    Where was English 3 years after losing to Ardern?
    Where was Clark 3 years after losing to Key?
    Where was Shipley 3 years after losing to Clark?
    Where was Moore 3 years after losing to Bolger?
    Where was Muldoon 3 years after losing Lange?
    Where was Rowling 3 years after losing to Muldoon? (he’s the exception I think)
    Where was McLay 3 years after losing to Kirk?
    Even if they stayed in parliament (they don’t jump), they tend not to stay as Leader (they’re pushed).
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:16am
    - SGA
      
      Sorry, Marshell not McLay.
      
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      October 16, 2020 1:25pm
- RF
  
  Jessica just let that info on Ardern resigning with a – “next question please.”
  
  More interest shown on the news this morning.
  
  Missed opportunity for Jessica to ask more in-depth questions.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:31am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Scripted questions and answers for Jaspinda
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:19am
  - Paulus
    
    Jessica needs the depth to ask any question – last night showed she had none.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:18am
    - calendar girl
      
      She’s the least able political interviewer on NZ television. Surely our General Election season deserves better than she has to offer.
      
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      October 16, 2020 3:45pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Not only will resign… but will quit politics if she loses an election.
  
  Jacinda Ardern has confirmed she would quit politics after losing an election –
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/election-2020-jacinda-ardern-and-judith-collins-last-day-of-campaign-ardern-says-shell-quit-if-she-loses/XDIVO36XCW245IECR45HTK7FJY/
  
  If only Helen Clarke, Phil Goff, Lianne Dalziell, Fran Wilde, Chris Laidlaw and other failed Labour Hacks
  had gone off to a life away from the political scene.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:36am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Her Proposal is Acceptable.
    
    32 0
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    October 16, 2020 8:39am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpuPN3bT3Xw
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:20am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    It is really starting to sound like you lack an appreciation for all the Labour Party has done for the country…
    
    5 44
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    October 16, 2020 8:51am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      You mean the book of the Jacinda Government’s achievements?
      Full of blank pages.
      
      31 2
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      October 16, 2020 9:11am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        and only came out in A5
        
        8 1
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        October 16, 2020 11:49am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Tell us what Labour has done for NZ, Mike. Take your time, we will wait for your wisdom
      
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      October 16, 2020 9:22am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Mike seems to have done a runner. Back to the basement to ask Clint?
        
        9 0
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        October 16, 2020 11:56am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I think you’re on to it, MMA.
      
      Date the start of my disillusion from the 4th Labour Government and the gutting of much of NZ’s Public Service.
      
      18 1
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      October 16, 2020 9:25am
    - lifesgood
      
      MM—you what????? That has to be the most hilarious statement I’ve heard in a long time.
      
      14 2
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      October 16, 2020 9:36am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Mike examples Please. I only expect the top five.
      Please handing out money does not count anyone can write a cheque if you have an unlimited overdraft
      
      15 1
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      October 16, 2020 9:40am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Rather, we despise all the Labour Party has done to the country… including but not limited to corruption, perversion, waste, inefficiency, stupidity, sex crimes, a debt-tsunami, and did I mention stupidity.
      
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      October 16, 2020 9:49am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Let me fix that for ya
      It is really starting to sound like you lack an appreciation for all the Labour Party has done to the country…
      
      5 2
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      October 16, 2020 11:21am
  - info@cruzpro.com
    
    I’m wondering what kind of job Jacinda qualifies for if Labour doesn’t win this election and she quits politics completely? Are there any good job opportunities for communicators?
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:17am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Our local Fish and Chip shop is looking to hire
      
      11 1
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      October 16, 2020 9:41am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      She could probably find a job in a Harris-Biden administration as a Pallid House Spokesperson.
      
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      October 16, 2020 9:50am
    - sooty
      
      One overseas!
      
      3 0
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      October 16, 2020 9:53am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        Pink Floyd had a place…..
        
        1 0
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        October 16, 2020 11:22am
  - Gulag1917
    
    Outside of politics Helen Clarke, Phil Goff, Lianne Dalziell, Fran Wilde and Chris Laidlaw cannot do anything.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:51am
    - oldfella
      
      But C. Laidlaw did have some good ball skills before entering politics. 😉
      
      4 2
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      October 16, 2020 10:34am
      - oldfella
        
        Why on earth would anyone downtick this comment about Chris Laidlaw, a very good All Black in his day?
        
        5 1
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        October 16, 2020 11:37am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Suggest the Auckland Islands or outer Orkneys.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:11am
- SGA
  
  – tell me that the left leaning scrutineers have not opened the boxes and Jacinda has not seen preliminary results
  
  I doubt that somehow. I think it far more likely that she is counting on the fact that in all recent polls National+ACT struggle to reach 40%. Granted, that might all come unstuck on the night (stranger things happen at sea,as they say), but I think only the most “optimistic” here really expect a National-led government after the election.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:44am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The Labour Party of today is NOT the Labour Party of yesteryear. They are as crooked as a dog’s hind leg
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:24am
    - SGA
      
      You don’t like or trust Labour – we do get that message (fwiw, I don’t trust a lot of what I see in politics on both sides). But… if you think that the only possible reason Ardern might feel confident about this election is because Labour is taking sneaky peeks in the ballot box (which would have to be widespread and systematic to be any more reliable than the polling), then you are sounding a little paranoid, sorry.
      
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      October 16, 2020 9:40am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        There are times when paranoid people are right, ya know. Not often but it happens. Once it happens it’s funny how their history gets rewritten by others…
        
        4 2
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        October 16, 2020 9:51am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Ask Jaspinda if she has had a sneak preview. If she says ‘no’ that will mean yes, from a well known liar
        
        8 4
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        October 16, 2020 9:52am
      - SGA
        
        Engelbert, if you and Steve believe that Ardern could feel positive about the election only because Labour was taking a illegal sneaky look at the early voting, then good luck to you 🙂
        
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        October 16, 2020 10:30am
  - Gravelroad
    
    SGA- I suspect that Ms Ardern knows that the million plus early votes are heavily in her favour.
    Her ego is playing games with vulnerable voters who worship the ground she stands on.
    By threatening to resign if she loses the election she knows that will galvanise even more people to get out and vote for here because so many see themselves as helpless without her – which is sad.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:49am
    - SGA
      
      Perhaps – on the other hand, if she managed to lose this election from the position Labour are currently in, then it would mean a massive vote of no-confidence in her personally. As commentators here like to point out repeatedly – she is the face of the Labour Party. Resigning would be an realistic choice.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:02am
    - MCos
      
      ‘Threatening to resign’
      Who was the last NZ PM defeated in an election who didn’t resign or was dumped by their party?
      You might have to go back a long way, Keith’s Holyoake maybe.
      For that matter was he the last National leader who survived an electoral defeat?
      Even Judith Collins in her book says the Nats get rid of losing leaders, but I suspect she had her eye on the job after the election. She wrote the book when Bridges was leader.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:23am
      - gump
        
        Bill English led National to the worst electoral result in the history of the party at the 2002 election. He was recycled back into the leadership of the party at the end of 2016.
        
        Losing elections doesn’t necessarily end careers in the National party.
        
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        October 16, 2020 10:49am
      - SGA
        
        But English wasn’t the sitting PM at the time 🙂
        
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        October 16, 2020 11:28am
      - SGA
        
        Who was the last NZ PM defeated in an election who didn’t resign or was dumped by their party?
        
        Rowling, I think.
        
        2 0
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        October 16, 2020 11:30am
    - Steve Todd
      
      I suspect that Ms Ardern knows that the million plus early votes are heavily in her favour.
      
      That’s nonsense.
      
      Have a look at sections 174D and 174E of the Electoral Act 1993, Gravelroad, then explain to us how you think she could possibly know that. At best she might suspect they “are heavily in her favour”, but they won’t be.
      
      The early votes currently being cast, are a statistical sample of all votes that will be cast. As I have pointed out twice before in recent days, the percentages of the early Party votes received by each of the parties will be very close to the overall percentages that will be counted for them at the official count in a couple of weeks’ time.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:35am
      - gorse
        
        I voted early, couldn’t wait to vote ACT. I know of 8 others who did the same. Might not be as good as she thinks.
        
        4 0
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        October 16, 2020 1:05pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    We have had a massive turn around previously. Ardern R. Has offended a great many and has no legacy of achievement. All the stories about her COVID accomplishments are proven to be dubious. Plainly the public service largely ignore the govt except for polishing pressers–execution is so boring, someone else can do it.
    Religious aspects may come to the fore too. Ardern accepting praise as a Saint will not be unnoticed in the Highest places nor will mocking God by having Muslim prayer in Parliament.
    Her self worth exceeds reason and its season may have just ended.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:22am
    - MCos
      
      Are you one of these people who believes they speak for the Almighty?
      BTW
      It’s the speaker who organizes the prayer in parliament.
      If it was in line with the PM’s beliefs she’d probably scrap it, Bill English would have sought guidance thru his Catholic faith, John Key was Jewish , but not stridently so. And so on.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:18am
      - SGA
        
        John Key was Jewish , but not stridently so
        
        “Ethnically” rather than “religiously”.
        
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        October 16, 2020 11:34am
      - Twinkletoes
        
        So the Speaker chose a prayer whose first sentence reads
        “In the name of Allah, the entirely merciful, the especially merciful”
        and the last two
        “Guide us to the straight path
        The path of those upon whom you have bestowed favour, not of those who have evoked Your anger or of those who are astray” (this means all non muslims).
        
        Bet someone was laughing in some far off mosque that day!
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:17pm
Happychappy

Did anyone notice that the vote for who won the debate on the Herald website last night was pulled a couple of hours later when Collins was leading 69% to 42% after 2340 votes were cast. It might be my eyesight which I doubt very much but it hasn’t been on the sight since before 10 pm last night.
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October 16, 2020 8:11am
- Jimmy White
  
  Like twitter and facebook they pull “Fake” news
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:43am
Tarquin North

Nice looking ad in today’s Herald. Well done everyone.
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October 16, 2020 8:12am
- 2ic
  
  Can someone please upload a photo or scan so we can all see it?
  
  Please don’t make me buy a Herald!
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:13am
Chris Walden

If last night’s ONCB poll is accurate, then we’re heading for Venezuela 2.0.

I’ve already voted. At least I can say that I played no part in their election victory.
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October 16, 2020 8:13am
- MCos
  
  ‘we’re heading for Venezuela 2.0’
  People have been prophesying variations on that sort of doomsday scenario since the 1st Labour Government in 1935.
  In fact that particular administration was far more radical that this one ever will be with some of the MPs having been genuine Communists.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:32am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Lol, the IUSY president and the far left loony greens on the other hand…
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:51am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Their MPs were communists yes but they did not have control. Then.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:52am
  - Bob
    
    ‘some of the MP’s being genuine communists’..
    Sounds very much like some of the present COL Labour members.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:31am
- greybeard
  
  What I find hard to believe is that National support has apparently fallen by about 30% since the last election.
  ( 46% actual to 31% polled ).
  It just doesn’t make sense to me that so many supporters have changed, and apparently to Labour !
  I am still hoping that like me, lots of National supporters are yet to vote. The silent majority thing.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:35am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Not that many. At last election Nat 44.4 Lab 36.9 Grn 6.3 NZF 7.2 Act 0.5
    Right 45% Left 43%
    ONCB poll has 31+8=39% on right (-6%) and 46+8=54% on left (+11%), about a 9% swing, but that is down from a peak of about 18% in may.
    
    Nats were 7% ahead of labour in November, 30 behind in May and now 15 behind. After a crisis it takes up to 2 years for support to return to status quo, look at support for US presidents after crises of last few decades. Most care little for politics, it is mostly an emotional decision (switches triggered by sharp prods) that they default to until they get sufficiently annoyed.
    
    It’s been clear since April that Nats never had a chance at this election with all the face time and pandemic milking that Labour did.
    
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    October 16, 2020 8:55am
- burt
  
  New Venezealand or Aoteazuela ?
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:45am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Venezuela has nice beaches. And lots of oil that cannot be extracted because all the skilled engineers have fled. But as someone we know well would say “Go Venezuela. Doing your bit for climate change.” 🙂
    
    18 1
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    October 16, 2020 8:50am
    - Jimmy White
      
      I here that oil is plentiful. In fact it runs freely down the streets
      https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2054782206731/shocking-video-shows-venezuelan-town-flooded-with-crude-oil
      
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      October 16, 2020 9:46am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    South Venezuela
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:26am
  - Critical Thinker
    
    “Nu Tirani” – pronounced “New Tyranny”, would be better IMHO.
    
    As it’s the original Maori name for New Zealand after all ?
    https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/petitions/document/PET_99102/petition-of-bruce-mason-nu-tirani-for-new-zealand
    
    Which would also be a very fitting name for our country, if our current tyrannical regime continues for another term ?
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:29am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Wakafookedtania.
    
    Trashzealandia.
    
    Land of the Long Indebted Decline.
    
    etc.
    
    3 2
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    October 16, 2020 9:53am
- LTA1955
  
  Just for the record:
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n7mK3dYOLw&list=FLsKDsLQ6ak-dy2fLVcLdG-g&index=61
  If you haven’t voted yet, please watch this.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:46am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Sorry, haven’t got a spare 42 minutes.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:14am
  - info@cruzpro.com
    
    The one minute video ad you have to endure before getting to see anything turned me off.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:20am
  - Deagle
    
    12 minute mark, did I hear that right?
    Some of the gangs described are sympathetic to the government/ Marxist ideologies?
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:32am
  - Steve Todd
    
    I never click on links that do not have an accompanying brief summary of what they’re about, in case I immediately realise I am not in the least bit interested in the subject matter, i.e., I have wasted my time.
    
    What is this link all about LTA?
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:36am
Albert_Ross

Thinking about where we are, and Owen Jennings’ rant from yesterday’s KB.

There are three corners to public policy. There’s what actually needs to happen to genuinely make the world a better place; there’s what governments can in practice do to make it happen, given the resources and powers available to them; and there’s what politicians have to do to get themselves into government.

The gap between each of these three is vast, so vast that it is probably impossible to reconcile any two of them, let alone bring together all three. I don’t know whether this is a new phenomenon, or something I have only recently realised.

What is happening in this election, is that Jacinda is focusing all of her effort on the third corner, and that is why she is doing so well there. If she has any understanding of the other two, she is not letting on. This may be very clever, given that any politician who attempts honesty on either of the first two points, let alone on both of them and the gulf between them, inevitably damages their own interests on the third; or it may be that she simply has no idea about either of them and has given them no thought. On her performance over the last three years, the latter seems the more likely.

Judith, in contrast, clearly has given some thought to the first two points. This is why she is hamstrung in the third and it looks as if New Zealand is in for three years, at least, of suffering the consequences.

This is a bleak picture indeed and I have no idea how it can be addressed.

And to think we could have had Bill English as Prime Minister these past three years. I hope and I pray that Winston comes to experience the consequences of what he and his nasty, vindictive, spiteful ego did there and to understand his own culpability. It’s the only hope I have left for New Zealand and this point.
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October 16, 2020 8:16am
mikenmildagain

Happy World Anaesthesia Day!
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October 16, 2020 8:17am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Or you could just listen to Jacinda waffle.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:19am
- Jimmy White
  
  Its also National Liqueur Day, thats my Anaesthesia
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:49am
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  No one really is happy about an anesthetic.
  
  The people getting one wish they did not have to have the proced we’re masking with the gas-passing; and no matter how many we’ve done, there’s always (I speak for myself) a little bit of nerve-jangling ensuring that all goes well and they wake up without undue effects, and with no recollection of everything done under anesthesia.
  
  So again speaking only for myself, mmagain you can eff right off with your daily smarmy faux-joy Happy Days BS.
  
  Happy Days should be for things like new grandchildren, Dairy Milk choc, lingerie, V8 engines with superchargers, planting trees and gardens, etc: things that really bring joy.
  
  /rant off.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:57am
Nookin

The PM’s ultimatum last night suggests an unacceptable lack of commitment. She will go if she loses.

Is it just possible that she will go before the next election regardless?

Has she already got a job lined up in a couple of years?

If so, what weight do we put on the promise “not while I am PM?
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October 16, 2020 8:19am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Not you too Nookin, looking for crumbs when the loaf has already gone and the table wiped.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:17am
nathie

One thing I noticed about last night’s leaders debate and from general campaign coverage is, why isn’t National (and ACT) talking about the negatives of a majority Labour government or a potential Labour/Greens coalition, which is a government that will implement an agenda that most NZ’ers don’t want, eg:

*Govt (taxpayer) funding being prioritised towards “green transport” solutions (bikes/walking/trains) rather than highway and motorway upgrades (which is what the CoL were doing, until they panicked this year realising they didn’t have the public onside).

*Labour/Greens disinterest in maintaining NZ’s “first world industrial” status by being unsupportive of the likes the Tiwai Point aluminium smelter, NZ Steel, Marsden Point refinery etc (albeit some noises only being made now because of the election to slow down Tiwai Point’s “demise).

*Labour/Greens (NZF)’s appalling Captain’s Calls to degrade the oil and gas industries (without even seeking advice from their own bureaucrats, and making global emissions worse as NZ will need to import energy to make up the shortfalls in supply).

*Labour/Greens wanting to turn productive farms into pine forests (and killing off jobs and small service towns and communities).

National/ACT should be hammering home even though Ardern is “appealing/nice/lovely” (to many voters), it’s her government’s policies that is the issue.

And that’s where National and Collins should also be appealing to – middle of the road LABOUR supporters that don’t support these radical policies.

Anyway kudos to Collins last night for calling Ardern out on her promises not being worth anything, she and her MP’s need to do more of this!

Oh and if anyone is saying don’t do “negative” messaging, well that’s exactly what Ardern is now doing (when she says don’t put things at risk, competent team etc) plus I saw parts of an attack-ad fronted by Grant Robertson hammering National (although must be on social media rather than tv)!
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October 16, 2020 8:20am
- Catgurl13
  
  Judith did rub it in a few times about Labour’s broken promises and Kiwibuild, light rail, west Auckland rail and child poverty failings. She did it more than a few times.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:19am
Lance

Mike Hosking likened the journalism standards (and blatant bias) being displayed at the moment to that of 12 year olds.

He’s not wrong
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October 16, 2020 8:20am
- kiwikidsnz
  
  Well, he would know.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:42am
Captain Mainwaring

NZ has voted for a personality cult, not a government with a track record of achievement. We will pay the price.
I was talking with an older chap during the week. Long-time National voter. Told me he voted for the Bishop of Lower Hutt but his party vote went to ‘Mother Teresa’ because she saved us.
He will not be the only one.
Big trouble ahead, especially if the toxic greens make it in.
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October 16, 2020 8:23am
- kowtow
  
  The Media Party hold a huge responsibilty for deliberately promoting that Cult. And also for promoting the dirty politics campaign against Bridges . I’d love for some “investigative” journalist ( yeah right) to look into that Facebook campaign against him. There’s bound to be a lot more to that story . Just like the Fatgate one they’re doing on Collins.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:35am
  - oldgolfer
    
    Might have fouled their own nest. If the economy falters or falls, they will be first businesses to go.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:43am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Pravda survived years after the other apparatchiks went down. Our mediawhores are likely to do the same. Isn’t Labour already promising to gift them another 85$million after the election?
      
      9 1
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      October 16, 2020 9:59am
      - Twinkletoes
        
        The article I read said $75million – reward for job well done! So as the streets , cars and garages fill up with the homeless, the food banks fold under the weight of the starving, shoeless children steal the shoes off the ones who have shoes the media will still be extolling Saint Jacinda.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:37pm
    - ex-golfer
      
      The good old hastag #learntocode might have to make a come back when reality hits some of these useless people posing as journalists.
      I see a new CEO of MediaWorks has been announced. Cam Wallace, who recently left Air NZ. I wonder if he will be forced to make changes and shed some of the dead wood.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:29am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        He could start with Toxic Tova.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:50pm
  - Jimmy White
    
    They came for the National Voters first.
    Then they came for the ‘Journalists’
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:51am
Maggie Pie

OBESITY (n). The elephant in the room.
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October 16, 2020 8:24am
- JackRabbit
  
  SEDUCTION (n). Being offered “free” apples by the snake in the garden of politics.
  
  Moral: If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:36am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    SYMPATHY: (as I learned in the service): “if you’re looking for it sonny (addressed to me) it’s in the dictionary between ‘sh*t and syphilis’.”
    
    That DI had a way with words…
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:00am
- lofty
  
  I see what you did there.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:40am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Cruel… (especially to fatsos)
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:52am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Nothing sadder than the sight of a starving elephant. Huge hanging skin on bones.
    
    6 0
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    October 16, 2020 10:02am
- Lance
  
  I am intrigued by this issue.
  One might say obese people only have to eat less.
  True
  However
  Anorexics only need to eat more
  Alcoholics only need to stop drinking
  Drug addicts only need to stop taking drugs
  And if we are worried about our hospitals being overloaded, Rugby players need to play only touch and speeders only need to slow down.
  The list goes on.
  All these are personal choice, where do we draw the line?
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:01am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    National’s Dr Reti explained it well on newstalk zb a couple of days ago: National is certainly for providing the information needed, but ultimately the individual must decide and take responsibility. You’ll hear no other message in AA meetings etc.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:05am
k1w1

My vote (tmrw) is cast in the Hibiscus Coast (Orewa) electorate, where National would win if they stood an orangutan. Instead we get Mark Mitchell. Sometimes I wished I lived in more tentative electorate. Nah.
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October 16, 2020 8:26am
- Catgurl13
  
  Mitchell the little traitor trying to spoil it for National.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:20am
  - nathie
    
    I don’t understand – why is Mitchell a little traitor?
    
    Here’s what he said in context (the audio part is at the end of the interview):
    https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/mike-hosking-breakfast/audio/pollies-national-mp-mark-mitchell-breaks-ranks-with-collins-over-obesity/
    
    In fact one could say Mitchell answered well, in fact if Collins answered as well as Mitchell did with a bit of nuance, the MSM wouldn’t have continued to assault National day after day!
    
    The only person calling Mitchell a traitor is Slater who shat all over National and wonders out loud why Mitchell isn’t supporting him. Well perhaps the reason is Slater is the traitor, for shitting on National and promoting WinstonFirst.
    
    Put it another way, Slater is taking out anyone who is seen as a threat to Collins’ leadership, so expect Slater attacks on Luxon, Bridges, Mitchell, Bishop etc i.e. anyone with an ounce of potential.
    
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    October 16, 2020 12:19pm
- lifesgood
  
  Just swallow the dead rat, then, k1w1. Look at the alternative.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:40am
- Classic Liberal
  
  He deserves an informative letter from you.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:06am
artemisia

Poor old Wellington ratepayers. Some tiny blowouts in remediation costs for council buildings. Tiny because we are so used to numbers with lots of zeroes these days that the odd $50 million or $100 million here and there (and there and there and there) don’t raise eyebrows any more.

Until the chickens (aka rates bills) come home to roost.
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October 16, 2020 8:27am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Wellington only has about 60,000 ratepayers. The bills for these buildings seem to be a hell of a burden on them.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:22am
Marty McFly

I don’t get the morning paper, but has anyone seen if the ad had run today?
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October 16, 2020 8:38am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/10/general_debate_16_october_2020.html/comment-page-1#comment-2822666
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:33am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Yes full page ad in the printed Herald in our lunchroom
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:34am
  - Observer of Life
    
    Bobba: Excellent … where’s your lunchroom?
    :0)
    
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    October 16, 2020 5:42pm
Classic Liberal

Newshub poll claims.

“ Newshub-Reid Research poll shows nearly half of Kiwis think wealthy should be taxed more”

Newshub assumes this means these people want asset taxes.

Every day I’m scratching my head wondering who these ‘wealthy’ people are who have just over a million in assets. That’s just a house in Auckland! A plain, crumbling house that many can barely afford the existing wealth tax on (rates).

Many people in such homes live very frugally, earn little, have old or second hand cars and furniture, no luxury living at all. How on earth can that be called ‘wealthy’? Savings or a mum and dad rental earn very low returns and there is no way they could afford an asset tax.

The question apparently was “the Newshub-Reid Research poll asked voters if Labour should have gone further in taxing the wealthiest New Zealanders. ”

That’s nothing like asking if people want asset taxes.

Judith has it right: “ Collins says a wealth tax won’t just affect wealthy New Zealanders.

“If you own a home in Auckland and you’ve paid off your mortgage – the average house price being a million dollars – you actually won’t be feeling wealthy,” she said. ”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/10/nz-election-2020-newshub-reid-research-poll-shows-nearly-half-of-kiwis-think-wealthy-should-be-taxed-more.amp.html
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October 16, 2020 8:41am
- Isobar
  
  I think the wealth tax only applies to people who have paid of the mortgage. I could be wrong but it would severely limit those in Auckland that it applies to if it does.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:02am
  - Ruawai
    
    But most people will have paid off their mortgage by the time they retire so it will eventually effect them.
    
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    October 16, 2020 9:58am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Yes: middle aged and elderly who worked hard, lived frugally and paid the damn thing off!
    
    Now to be punished for it.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:08am
  - Paulus
    
    I assume that any Maori assets will not be included in this new tax as they do not have an actual individual ownership in the same way thy do not pay rates.
    
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    October 16, 2020 1:24pm
- Catgurl13
  
  It’s because we have a generation of self entitled people who think to succeed,someone will give money to them. We also have a disgusting bunch of woke politicians encouraging hatred against parents and elders.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:25am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Perhaps the best intergenerational revenge to be had will be to spend everything at the last minute 🙂
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:01am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Overseas! I was planning to leave most to some good national parks, but if they bring asset taxes in I would rather spend up large for a few years on holidays, then finish it. Rather that than be robbed by the watermelons.
      
      I get so angry that they want me to pay for other people’s bad contraceptive choices when true environmentalists should be encouraging maintaining a small population.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:31am
Tony Stuart

TVNZ have suddenly realised how much they are going to miss Peters when he’s gone, so they talked up his late “surge” in the polls. However, they didn’t even mention this…

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/428454/exclusive-the-secret-case-of-the-nz-first-foundation

That’s ok Jess; I’ll do your job for you ??
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October 16, 2020 8:42am
- burt
  
  Lets not forget this is our Deputy Prime Minister and our Prime Minister seems to have no concern about how it stains the “most transparent government ever” narrative she pushes.
  
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  October 16, 2020 8:48am
- Biscuit
  
  Good link, Tony.
  
  Jessica disappoointed me last night in not pressing Jacinda about the Greens’ bottom lines.
  
  Jacinda: I have said over and over that no Wealth Tax will be considered in Coalition discussions
  Jessica: But the polls say you NEED the Greens to form a Government. It’s the same as 2017 for you – if you don’t fold, the party you are negotiating with (cf Winston last time) won’t play ball with you.
  
  Admittedly, the Greens have no-one else to talk to but they COULD say ‘Well, stuff you, we’ll give you Confidence and Supply but otherwise we’ll sit on the cross benches and vote down all of your policies we don’t like.’
  
  I also wanted Jessica to pin Jacinda down on ‘Will Winston be given a knighthood?’
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:11am
- Brian McDonald
  
  If he’s on the way out Tony he’ll be able to pull the finger at those that predicted the col wouldn’t last.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:19am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  no late surge for NZF. ONCB poll had NZF <3% (insider on twitter posted 2.7 or 2.8% from memory)
  
  GFY Winston.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:31am
I remember when

Threat or a promise.
“I will not remain leader if we lose the election.”
So the last two coins have been thrown into the fountain.
You need to vote Labour if you want my radiance in your life.
Nobody wants to see that.
Also a chance to mention some minor, supposedly racist, remark about an Imam just in case you have forgotten about the mosque attacks.
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October 16, 2020 8:44am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Jacinda doesn’t think she’ll lose.
  She just wants Judith to resign so is trying to force her into taking the same position.
  It’s a statement of fear, not intent.
  She’s afraid of Judith holding her to account.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:08am
  - alloytoo
    
    She got extremely flustered when Judith did.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:37am
- RW Capitalist
  
  The party is Hitler, Hitler is Germany, and Germany is Hitler! Sieg heil!
  
  At Nuremberg, 1934
  How very similar she is, Helen Clark had the same opinion of herself.
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:45am
RRM

I’ve long expected a Liarbore second term. Judith Collins gave me some hope after the years of waiting for Bridges to fire, and the complete clusterfuck of Muller’s moment. But it felt like too little, too late and that’s how it appears to have been.

My hope remains that opinion polls were the true handbrake on Taxcinda’s excesses, even more than Winston was. We saw it when she backpedalled on trying to get a blank cheque for any and all tax reform in the 2017 campaign. We saw it when the Cullen working group told her exactly what she wanted to hear, but the polls were very against a CGT so that didn’t happen.

Taxcinda talks a huge game but has very little spine. Until the sheeple wake up, I can only hope that continues…

??
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October 16, 2020 8:46am
- ex-golfer
  
  How quickly everyone has forgotten that a Bridges-led National Party was leading the polls in Jan/Feb this year and was heading for election victory if it wasn’t for the onset of the COVID scamdemic.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:38am
MCos

In my humble opinion the Nats are losing this election because they haven’t shown any sign they have the ability to run the country & Judith Collins, Gerry Brownlee and Paul Goldsmith are an uninspiring leadership team. Their campaign has shown that.
The Labour Party is also thin on talent, but their leadership generated far more confidence than the alternative.
People see these countries in Europe & America ridden with Covid-19 and we ain’t. That’s a big deal.
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October 16, 2020 8:50am
- fernglas
  
  Fear is indeed a remarkable shaper of public opinion
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:12am
- Libertarians are right
  
  National are losing because people are afraid due to Covid and when you’re afraid you are more risk averse (so scared of change).
  That’s it.
  The fact that Labour and their allies have very actively promoted the fear doesn’t help National either (honestly, have you ever seen anyone politicise something more than Jacinda has with Covid?).
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:24am
- Catgurl13
  
  I think it’s more about idiots voting for a smiley face. There are many dummies in poorer areas who don’t understand politics,but they will vote for someone who looks nice to them. Take South Auckland for example.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:31am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Nope.
  
  Jacinda and co – well just Jacinda really – have indeed shown that they are excellent at saying the lovely, warm things that politicians need to say to get themselves elected, and Judith and co have not.
  
  But that is completely different from being able to run the country. That requires hard work, deep thinking, painful compromise and tough decisions. Even modest movement in the right direction, let alone actual results, is slow and difficult. Judith knows this, she was there when Bill English did it, and she has too much integrity to be convincing if she were to try to tell voters otherwise.
  
  What on earth have Jacinda and co actually done in the last three years that inspires you with confidence that they will be competent in government for the next three?
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:32am
- RJ
  
  Labour Party Continues to show their inability the last three years to run the country
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:01am
- JackRabbit
  
  “In my humble opinion the Nats are losing this election because they haven’t shown any sign they have the ability to run the country.”
  
  Being accountable and keep things running can appear mundane and routine, but that is the job. So yes, they appear boring and mundane.
  
  But that is only because Jacinda has set new public expectations by:
  (1) Putting on a emotional show like Liberace or Julian Clary;
  (2) Constantly throwing out political sweets like the cannibalistic witch in Hansel and Gretel;
  (3) “Saving us” from Covid-19 like the Pied Piper;
  (4) Promising NZ a rosy future like Bernie Madoff so long as you invest with me!.
  
  “…but their leadership generated far more confidence than the alternative….”
  
  It is the MO of tricksters to generate confidence! Hence the term “confidence trick”!
  
  “Confidence tricks exploit victims using their credulity, naïveté, compassion, vanity, irresponsibility, and greed. ”
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_trick
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:07am
Suze Wainwright

What does declaring a climate emergency actually mean?

Can anyone do it and does it hold any force/weight, or is it just a supreme example of virtue signaling masterclass?
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October 16, 2020 8:51am
- mark15
  
  Its a headline,nothing else.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:26am
- RJ
  
  It means your Rates will go up, taxes will go up. Then it will mean they will actually do nothing like the last 3 years
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:27am
- Catgurl13
  
  Once it’s made official, the govt can then start inventing all these new taxes. Very scary.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:33am
- krazykiwi
  
  It signals that declarer has absolutely no understanding of science, nor do they recognise how easily they’ve been manipulated into joining a cult.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:44am
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  Last night I declared a steak emergency. But nothing actually happened until I got off the couch, rode to New World, and used some money from my own pay to get some steak inbound. Just sayin’.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:03am
- JackRabbit
  
  “State of Fear” by Michael Crichton is well worth a read.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:09am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  It signals the intent to reverse the last 3 years of climate neglect where emissions are projected to have risen 17%. It will be another masterclass in woke slogans with no results from Comrade Ardern.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:23am
  - alloytoo
    
    It singles my intent to sell my 1300 and replace it with a 3.7 v6.
    
    Somebody has to feed the plants.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:40am
- tf78
  
  Suze, revenue for the great pretenders.
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:52am
UrbanNeocolonialist

Not that many. At last election Nat 44.4 Lab 36.9 Grn 6.3 NZF 7.2 Act 0.5
Right 45% Left 43%
ONCB poll has 31+8=39% on right (-6%) and 46+8=54% on left (+11%), about a 9% swing, but that is down from a peak of about 18% in may.

Nats were 7% ahead of labour in November, 30 behind in May and now 15 behind. After a crisis it takes up to 2 years for support to return to status quo, look at support for US presidents after crises of last few decades. Most care little for politics, it is mostly an emotional decision (switches triggered by sharp prods) that they default to until they get sufficiently annoyed.

It’s been clear since April that Nats never had a chance at this election with all the face time and pandemic milking that Labour did.
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October 16, 2020 8:55am
Isobar

Question for the class on the Greens – is the fear of them getting in to government:

1. That they will do some damage when in govt, unrestrained

Or is it

2. That they wont be near as bad as some think, they wont ‘scare the horses’ and therefore might actually solidify themselves as a more mainstream political party

If its 1 – then this is easy they’ll be turfed out and probably never recover, if its 2, they could be around for a very, very long time in the NZ political scene

So where does the real fear lie?

Arguably for those that are opposed to the greens, 1 might be better than 2 because it will at least be the end of them. Short term pain for long term gain. Thoughts?
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October 16, 2020 8:57am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Definitely #1.
  Look at their policies – they all damage our economy.
  That is why we don’t want them in.
  Plus Golriz and Marama are hate filled bigots and I just don’t feel it’s appropriate to have hate filled bigots in our parliament.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:58am
- Classic Liberal
  
  They have been more mainstream in the past, now they have gone full apeshit commie.
  
  None of the most essential environmental message that actually makes sense is even to be found on their website: don’t overpopulate nz.
  
  Instead they are now dangerous communists who want to seize others’ wealth and redistribute to people they are encouraging to keep having more children.
  
  Totally irresponsible and not in the least ‘green’ anymore.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:25am
Littletramp

A really interesting story coming out of USA which is receiving plenty of attention, related to the New York Post article about Hunter Biden being suppressed from circulation by Twitter and Facebook.
Step back and ask yourself, why would a random guy in a random computer repair shop feel compelled to drop a computer he has been asked to work on into the FBI in December 2019? Would it be because the guy found some emails (do computer shops read and assess all the emails on every computer they are asked to work on) , and some family photos on the computer? Why would the FBI open an investigation into Biden family dealings with Russia/Ukraine in February 2020?
Is it likely the guy in the shop may have stumbled across a concerning amount of child porn?
Watching where this goes with interest.
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October 16, 2020 9:01am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Story doesn’t stack up.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:11am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Oh yes it does mikey, and the ramifications are plain to see. But I see that your heart really isn’t in the denials, a bit to hard to spin away, isn’t it ?
    
    It is in fact verified that the laptop (or laptops, there may be up to three involved plus external drives – probably using the Apple auto backup facility) belonged to one Hunter Biden. The machines had suffered water damage and no longer started up normally, but the data stored on them was intact.
    
    HB took them to the repair shop with a request to retrieve the data on those machines – which is after all a pretty common procedure. The repair shop’s standard contract form specified that once the work was complete the owner would be notified, and they then had 3 months to pay and collect the items. If they failed to pay in that time, the items were forfeited and could be sold to defray expenses – again a pretty ordinary stipulation given that a lot of such work does get just abandoned by the owners.
    
    So by not paying or collecting, the ownership of those devices passed to the repair shop. As such, they are entitled to review what is on those items. For example if they found evidence of a crime they can inform the relevant authorities. More than one owner (a great deal more in fact) have been indicted on child pornography charges in such circumstances, so this is not uncommon.
    
    So the new owner (undisputed owner) found evidence of crimes. Because he was (justifiably) concerned about those crimes being potentially covered up he not only advised the FBI he also told others like Rudi Giuliani as a backstop. Turns out that his fears were justified as the FBI has sat on this, just like the Weiner laptop, for sometime without any action. And as we can see from samples, there’s pretty damning evidence of bribery and corruption.
    
    So what’s the instructions you are getting on the spin now mikey ? I’d it to be “Russian Disinformation”, or “stolen or hacked and thus illegitimate”. Tell us why this doesn’t add up and why Joe (and his family) should just get a free pass for corruption. And take care to distinguish why those same “stay out of jail” rules apparently (for you) DO NOT apply to Trump.
    
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    October 16, 2020 11:04am
  - virtualmark
    
    The US intelligence community warned both campaigns several weeks ago that Russian intelligence agencies were going to use Rudy Giuliani as a conduit to introduce faked emails etc in to the US election campaign.
    
    This is that Russian intelligence operation.
    
    None of the reputable media have picked up the story because it’s clearly Russian election interference.
    
    But you Trumpistas are so desperate, and so desperately naive, that you’ll latch on to anything that might help the Citrus Hitler. Even if it is from the US’s major adversary.
    
    Sad.
    
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    October 16, 2020 3:03pm
- Critical Thinker
  
  “Just saw for myself a behind the scenes look at the #HunterBiden hard drive:
  
  Drugs, underage obsessions, power deals…
  
  Druggie Hunter makes Anthony Weiner’s down under selfie addiction look normal.
  
  #BidenCrimeFamily has a lot of apologizing to do.”
  https://twitter.com/ChanelRion/status/1316737387943395328
  
  “UNDERAGE OBSESSIONS” ?
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:09am
Maggie Pie

How many morons that listen to Marcus Lush of an evening, believe him when he sez ……”he hasn’t decided who to vote for yet” LOL!!

Like my partners mum said, “Pull the other one Marcus, it plays ‘Solidarity Forever’ “
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October 16, 2020 9:02am
- Libertarians are right
  
  I have a few friends like that. They mean they haven’t decided between Labour and the Greens yet, not Left or Right.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:10am
- Biscuit
  
  Mgagie, dear wee Marcus clearly didn’t personally pocket sufficient of the $50 mill of our money Cindy ‘donated’ to keep the mee-jya compliant during Covid.
  
  On my behalf, can you drive past the radio station concerned and chuck a $2 coin at him to convince him he’s loved?
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:19am
I remember when

Makes you wonder why we didn’t allow any yachts, in the south pacific, that needed it refuge.
A wave of the wand, compassion and kindness (plus some feelgood publicity) and the Jarman’s application is re-considered.
It is a sad story, however earlier news items stated there were children on many of the yachts seeking safe anchorage here. A total of around 300 were reported.
The voyage here will likely guarantee they would all be covid free when they reached New Zealand.
The Government is there to govern not act as a selective welfare distribution centre!
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October 16, 2020 9:03am
- Ruawai
  
  The only rules around border closures should be to prevent covid, if boats are traveling more than 14 days and test on arrival then no covid risk so we should encourage as many yachts as possible to help our economy.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:07am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Indeed. Instead: yachties endangered, less work for boat yards, less trade for local shops. So kind.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:28am
I remember when

A climate emergency is when you haven’t prepared for a future unusual weather event.
If you blame ‘climate change’ it means Governments, Political parties, Councils, Governments Departments, Local bodies…….aren’t to blame.
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October 16, 2020 9:09am
Kiwi_in_Paris

The cracks are finally starting to show?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8843089/Police-search-home-French-health-minister-former-PM-Covid-probe.html
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October 16, 2020 9:18am
- Jimmy White
  
  The Vichy regime is rising from its grave
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:58am
Maggy Wassilieff

Guyon Espiner attempts to expose all…

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/428454/exclusive-the-secret-case-of-the-nz-first-foundation
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October 16, 2020 9:27am
- RJ
  
  Very damning, bye bye Winston.
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:31am
  - sooty
    
    It must be costing Whinestone a fortune to keep a lid on the box!
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:08am
Brian McDonald

Increase in under 28 year olds voting, increase in the Maori vote and talk that JT could swing Tamaki Makaurau. These are groups National didn’t target, that’s 2 elections in a row. The votes they’ve lost to Act is another strategic blunder. Having said that coming into election year so unsettled was a big disadvantage and there are indications it won’t stop.
Is National too old and inward looking, can’t that set out a long term plan and hold it together, or even make such a plan? JC may well have got the core lined up again, but little from the middle now the talk according to Garner is she will be attacked – probably by the frogs that didn’t have the guts to front this election campaign.
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October 16, 2020 9:28am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Is National too old
  
  Sure looks like that to me…
  
  Check out Judith Collin’s audiences over the last couple of weeks.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:01am
  - RJ
    
    Does age matter, look at trump. I’d say more national are just badly organised and really don’t look like the person running this campaign is the right person.
    
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    October 16, 2020 10:26am
    - Gravelroad
      
      For the National Party everything these days is all about them.
      Not the voters and not the people out in the regions who are struggling with dwindling property rights, huge compliance costs and disrespect of primary production values and people.
      National’s policy of going along with Labour led, knee jerk stuff like the gun laws has not been admired.
      I’ve been a National voter all my life but now totally disillusioned with this party.
      
      3 3
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      October 16, 2020 12:31pm
      - chukar
        
        Down tick is not intended. If I could would multiply my uptick.
        
        0 0
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        October 16, 2020 8:07pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Interesting snippet (can’t remember which article or radio show): academic not in favour of wealth tax because many low income south Auckland Polynesian families have a family home that is now quite valuable and that just gets passed on through the generations.
  
  Sounds like a potential target.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:32am
Maggie Pie

And I don’t know if anyone else has experienced this, but whenever I see Andrew Little being interviewed on telly. a feeling of ‘Impending Doom’ comes over me 🙁

Is this a sign of anything serious?
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October 16, 2020 9:30am
- Jimmy White
  
  When are Andrew and Winston going into the mine?
  Promises Promises
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:00am
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  Nah, it’s just a perfectly reasonable allergic reaction.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:04am
- cmm
  
  This goes hand in hand with Jacinda’s pouty threat to resign.
  
  Remember in 2017 how Labour was on 26% and Jacinda stepped up and scored them 37%?
  
  Well showing them Andy Little is a reminder to them: vote for ME otherwise you can have your shitty old Andy-Little Labour party back.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:30am
Critical Thinker

War is peace.
Freedom is slavery.
Ignorance is strength.

We can now say that we are officially living in an Orwellian Black Mirror episode ?

In last 24 hours Twitter has:

– Banned the NY Post Biden corruption story
– Censored an official US government website
– Locked out White House Press Secretary
– Locked out official Trump campaign
– Locked out NY Post
– Locked out pundits like Jack Posobiec

In last 24 hours Facebook has also banned the NY Post Biden corruption story.

In last 24 hours YouTube has followed Facebook and Twitter, in banning particular conspiracy theory content that “might be used to justify real-world violence.” ?

They have now removed tens of thousands of “QAnon” and “Pizzagate” videos and terminated hundreds of channels.

YouTube said it would be enforcing the updated policy immediately and plans to “ramp up in the weeks to come.”

It’s honestly hard to believe that this so called “QAnon” movement is somehow far more violent than the likes of Antifa and BurnLootMurder… ?

Facebook and Twitter Censor Biden Bombshells Weeks After Execs Join His Transition Team ?
https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2020/10/15/facebook-and-twitter-censor-biden-bombshells-weeks-after-execs-join-his-transition-team/

This is blatant election interference on a truly MASSIVE scale, the likes never seen before.

All to remove the current President of the US ?
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October 16, 2020 9:40am
- Critical Thinker
  
  C-SPAN suspends presidential debate moderator Steve Scully. After he admits he lied about his Twitter being hacked.
  https://www.foxnews.com/politics/c-span-suspends-steve-scully-indefinitely-after-he-admits-he-lied-about-his-twitter-being-hacked
  
  Trumps response to this news:
  https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1316829885147480064
  
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  October 16, 2020 9:48am
  - FatTony
    
    Oh no YouTube is removing Pizzagate videos?
    
    But then how will I know if my local pizza restaurant is run by an international conspiracy of child smuggling paedophiles?!?
    
    6 4
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    October 16, 2020 11:01am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Things are in very dire straits when US media organisations refuse to host fake news designed by foreign powers to confuse American voters.
      
      2 6
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      October 16, 2020 12:02pm
    - Batman
      
      CT is clearly devastated. They pretend not to be but CT is a Qnut and believes this stuff.
      
      4 5
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      October 16, 2020 12:39pm
      - Critical Thinker
        
        As far as I can tell I don’t see what the whole big deal is about the QAnon movement ?
        
        And why there’s so much panic from certain powerful people and institutions in regards to them. They’re nothing like the violent Antifa and BurnLootMurder terrorists that have been burning down cities this past year.
        
        I honestly can’t say that I disagree with what the President of the USA has to say about it ??
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nki2y4DHZyI
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWVNkHQtdbw
        
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        October 16, 2020 1:47pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  About time the major social networks shut down Russian disinformation, isn’t it?
  There are still plenty of shitty sources, like Breitbart and the NY Post, to run the fake news.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:09am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Clear evidence of Joe Biden’s corruption. Hunter’s high-pay salary was his acting as Bagman for Joe’s influence peddling, will it lead to prosecution?:
  
  Hunter’s text to Naomi: “But I don’t receive any respect and that’s fine I guess. Works for you, apparently. I hope you all can do what I did and pay for everything for this entire family for 30 years. It’s really hard, but don’t worry, unlike Pop (Joe Biden) I won’t make you give me half your salary.”
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:11am
- Critical Thinker
  
  Reconcile ?
  
  Emails reveal how Hunter Biden tried to cash in big on behalf of family with Chinese firm
  
  “One email sent to Biden on May 13, 2017, with the subject line “Expectations,” included details of “remuneration packages” for six people involved in an unspecified business venture.
  
  In addition, the email outlined a “provisional agreement” under which 80 percent of the “equity,” or shares in the new company, would be split equally among four people whose initials correspond to the sender and three recipients, with “H” apparently referring to Biden.”
  https://nypost.com/2020/10/15/emails-reveal-how-hunter-biden-tried-to-cash-in-big-with-chinese-firm/
  
  Second batch of smoking gun emails reveal Hunter Biden’s dealings with ‘disappeared’ Chinese energy company chairman about his $30 MILLION consultancy fee ‘for introductions alone’
  
  – Hunter Biden was involved with China’s largest private energy company CEFC
  – He was given equity, ownership of a holding company and huge consulting fees
  – Hunter was dealing with CEFC chairman Ye Jianming who has since vanished
  – In one email, Hunter said a lucrative deal would be ‘interesting for my family’
  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8842965/Hunter-Biden-pursued-deals-interesting-family-major-Chinese-firm.html
  
  Hunter Biden demanded Chinese billionaire pay $10 million for ‘introductions alone,’ emails show
  
  “Hunter Biden was receiving a $10 million annual fee from a Chinese billionaire who has been accused of corruption and with whom he sought to increase the cash flow with a joint business ownership, an August 2017 email from Mr. Biden shows.
  
  The money was for “introductions alone,” said Mr. Biden, son of Democratic presidential nominee Joseph R. Biden. Another email to Hunter Biden from a consultant says that a 10% stake in an unnamed company will go to “the big guy?”
  https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/oct/15/hunter-biden-demanded-chinese-billionaire-pay-10-m
  
  Text Message From Hunter Biden to Daughter Naomi
  
  “But I don’t receive any respect and that’s fine I guess. Works for you, apparently. I hope you all can do what I did and pay for everything for this entire family for 30 years. It’s really hard, but don’t worry, unlike Pop (Joe Biden) I won’t make you give me half your salary.”
  https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/10/rudy-giuliani-releases-text-message-hunter-biden-daughter-naomi-unlike-pop-joe-biden-wont-make-give-half-salary-video
  
  Corrupt:
  adjective
  “Guilty of dishonest practices, as bribery; lacking integrity; crooked”
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:13am
  - Batman
    
    Disclaimer: none of these purported emails and text have come with metadata or been verified. So they are in the same category as Kim Dotcoms famously faked emails about the Hobbit saga.
    
    7 17
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    October 16, 2020 10:26am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      DBS shines again.
      
      8 5
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      October 16, 2020 10:31am
      - Batman
        
        Sorry that your feelings are hurt. Want a bandaid for your feelz?
        
        6 10
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        October 16, 2020 10:35am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        Very shiny mirror you have there BM.
        
        5 1
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        October 16, 2020 1:05pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Trying to defend Biden in this is just comical. There is zero reason for any company to employ Hunter, he is a drug addled wastrel. He only has value to anyone as bagman for Joe, and that he is being paid outrageously large sums is clear proof of Joe’s corruption. There is no other explanation you can offer that anyone, no matter how partisan, would truly believe (regardless of the tribal defenses they might offer). How have they managed to keep this out of the courts?
      
      Hillary had slightly more cover with Bill’s speeches and donations to Clinton Foundation in her “pay for play” – but that income has evaporated since she lost election.
      
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      October 16, 2020 10:44am
      - Critical Thinker
        
        “Hunter Biden was extremely qualified” – Joe Biden ?
        https://twitter.com/Pismo_B/status/1316796956446912512
        
        Joe Biden refuses to respond to question about Hunter Biden’s work being a conflict of interest ?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nneTP_gM4PU
        
        Joe Biden: “I don’t know” what Hunter was doing for Burisma ?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXvmLeIXoBA
        
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        October 16, 2020 11:15am
      - FatTony
        
        It shows how desperate Trump world is that all they can do now is attack Joe Biden’s son.
        
        No one with any decency would try to win an election by attacking their opponent’s children. But common decency is too much to ask for from Trump world.
        
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        October 16, 2020 11:20am
      - marcw
        
        Hunter Biden is not a child, and is an active participant in the political process. He deserves all the investigations he has attracted.
        
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        October 16, 2020 11:35am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        FatTony, do you not understand the word bagman? Hunter was the cashier for bribes being given to Joe. There is clearly no other non-corrupt explanation why those huge payments were directed to him by these dodgy enterprises (that clearly sought and benefited from Biden’s patronage).
        
        Biden has been caught red handed. He is corrupt-as-fuck. End of story.
        
        That Trump is a repulsive blowhard is beside the point.
        
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        October 16, 2020 1:23pm
      - Vory v zakone
        
        #SleepyJoe has replied to one of the allegations
        ‘I had no idea Hunter was on the board of Burisma. I thought he was in his basement smoking crack and boinking his sister-in-law’ ?
        
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        October 16, 2020 6:45pm
      - FatTony
        
        Urban, if that’s the rationalisation you need to justify it to yourself, that’s up to you man.
        
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        October 16, 2020 9:29pm
    - Ed Snack
      
      Prediction, this will not age well !
      
      And weren’t you, Batman, one of those so sure that the “Trump disrespects the military dead” anonymous story – which subsequently has NEVER been confirmed by any named source was legit ?
      
      So what’s the difference, emails from a laptop that is indisputably Hunter Biden’s complete with a load of other photos and videos featuring the man himself, and purely anonymous sources with zero verification ?
      
      Oh this is real alright, but Joe is still protected by the “magic D” after his name, so who knows what will happen now.
      
      But that’s pretty weak spin, the emails “lack meta data”, almost as weak as the debate moderator’s claim that his Twitter feed was hacked. After all his Democrat operative pals in the media backed him up and told us how honest and reliable he was, he’s been forced to own up and admit that he did send the text in question, and that he had outright lied about the hacking. I guess his official complaint to the FBI about the fake hack will be overlooked, so he’s likely off the hook for that.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:15am
      - Batman
        
        Ed, the fact that John Kelly wouldn’t deny it or say it wasn’t like that, confirms that the story is entirely correct. Mostly likely that Kelly was the source too.
        
        There is no “indisputably” about it. It’s all unverified and coming from the Rudy and Sean club.
        
        Even better, it is now being reported that US intelligence warned the White House that Giuliani was a target of Russian disinformation and they ignored it. Now here we are and you’re all making utter fools of yourselves by peddling this stuff.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:44pm
    - Critical Thinker
      
      Disclaimer: Intelligence X is politically neutral. This investigation is based on public information (open source intelligence).
      
      “It appears that the email addresses appearing in the alleged email are accurate.”
      ?
      https://blog.intelx.io/2020/10/14/an-osint-investigation-into-the-alleged-hunter-biden-email/
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:21am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Yah. IntelX is ‘politically neutral’ because it says so on the blog.
        Guess what? I’m politically neutral too.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:07pm
      - Batman
        
        Open source intelligence means crackpots doing ten minutes of Google searches and drawing the conclusions they wish to reach.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:46pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        More grist to the mill. Giuliani exposes the Biden Crime Family, and has all the evidence.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZasrHQeKiY&feature=emb_title
        
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        October 16, 2020 2:01pm
    - RJ
      
      As I understand the story the shop owner created a back up of the hard drive, that would explain the metadata. If the fbi has it people will know soon.
      
      5 2
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      October 16, 2020 11:24am
    - alloytoo
      
      Wasn’t the infamous Dotcom email a piece of paper?
      
      These emails are reported as being from a digital copy of the hard drive.
      
      Mention of metadata seems to me as being mischief making 🙂
      
      5 3
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      October 16, 2020 11:54am
      - Batman
        
        They’re pdf copies of documents purporting to be emails.
        
        So they could be faked by any teenager… Maybe a 400 pound guy in a basement?
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:47pm
      - RJ
        
        Yes or they could be real, but the good news is you will soon know as the fbi are investigating according to sources
        
        https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/feds-examining-if-alleged-hunter-biden-emails-are-linked-foreign-n1243620
        
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        October 16, 2020 2:39pm
      - virtualmark
        
        Batman, I suppose they exist, but I’ve never met a fat Russian.
        
        2 1
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        October 16, 2020 4:26pm
      - alloytoo
        
        This is real paper and ink newspaper, not some keyboard warrior in the basement.
        
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        October 16, 2020 4:26pm
  - FatTony
    
    Busy morning at the Russian troll farm.
    
    6 8
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    October 16, 2020 10:49am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Tell me Tony, are the Russians in the room with you right now ?
      
      Trying to make this a “Russia, Russia, Russia” moment is so weak. I know it is your go to explanation for anything bad about a Democrat, but credible, not so much.
      
      Just shows you for the tool, gullible tool, that you are.
      
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      October 16, 2020 11:18am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Some people are reluctant to expose their cherished beliefs to the harsh light of actual evidence.
        
        5 2
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        October 16, 2020 11:59am
      - Batman
        
        Ed has no argument, just rhetoric and insults.
        
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        October 16, 2020 12:48pm
      - virtualmark
        
        Ed, blink twice if the lizard people are making you write these comments.
        
        We can see you through the camera on your computer.
        
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        October 16, 2020 4:27pm
  - Critical Thinker
    
    Twitter is experiencing a massive outage right now.
    
    The cause is unclear.
    
    “Twitter is experiencing an outage that began in the early evening on Thursday, with some users reporting problems sending tweets and refreshing their timelines”
    https://www.theverge.com/2020/10/15/21518367/twitter-down-outage-tweets
    
    Very curious timing ?
    
    4 3
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    October 16, 2020 11:35am
  - Fletch
    
    The media just don’t care about corrupt Democrats. Just ignore them and hope it will go away. Everyone has known for a couple of years now about Biden’s blackmail of Ukraine unless they fired the prosecutor investigating Burisma. Hell, he even laughed and bragged about it in public and it’s on YouTube. If Trump had done this they would have tried to impeach him again.
    
    But it’s a Democrat, so just ignore it and hope it will go away. And when Trump brings it up with the Ukrainian President (as well he should) they impeach Trump instead!! Totally backward, and totally corrupt.
    
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    October 16, 2020 12:13pm
- RJ
  
  I just hope if this lady is right he goes down, too much of this underage crap going on
  
  https://twitter.com/ChanelRion/status/1316737387943395328
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:31am
- Billy Collins
  
  I saw a good take on Big Tech’s claims “reasons” for censoring the article:
  
  EITHER:
  The emails on the computer are real – therefore its not disinformation,.
  
  OR:
  The emails are fake – therefore they aren’t hacked private information.
  
  So, which is it? You can’t have both.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:06pm
- RJ
  
  More Biden emails? Only time will tell
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KL3UQoqy0Qw
  
  3 1
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  October 16, 2020 2:48pm
  - Critical Thinker
    
    If this doesn’t rattle your cage then nothing will!
    (12:38 – 14:38)
    https://youtu.be/KL3UQoqy0Qw?t=688
    ?
    
    2 1
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    October 16, 2020 3:52pm
- virtualmark
  
  Maybe because smart people have figured out that all those things (NY Post story, QAnon etc) are:
  * fake
  * untrue
  * stupid
  * socially destructive
  * potentially libellous
  
  Leaving only the slower among us to grieve that they are gone.
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:05pm
colinm

Was talking to a corrections officer last night. I got the distinct impression that everyone who wanted to vote did so. Including the “lifers”. I thought only those who had a sentence of three years or less could vote?
Seems like this may be worthwhile looking into….
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October 16, 2020 9:45am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Hey Jaspinda. Oma Rapeti, oma Rapeti, oma oma oma
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October 16, 2020 9:49am
Catgurl13

[deleted by Mod]cindy had to bring up March 15th didn’t she?.She was congratulating Judith for some so called speech in Parliament about it, while showing respect and compassion for a tragic event,as anyone would do. But this mention of March 15 was really to remind everyone what Jacinda did in that time, a very strange way to bring it up really.
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October 16, 2020 10:05am
Jimmy White

I recently had a positive result from the National bowel screening process. It turn out to be a false positive after second test and a MRI.
Following the result I started receiving multiple emails for Reverse Mortgages saying that they can be used for medical expenses.
Looks like the crap I sent them has leaked out somehow.
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October 16, 2020 10:08am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Same with prostate cancer. I have low level and on active surveillance. My emails are riddled with posts from cancer help people and finance people
  
  8 2
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  October 16, 2020 10:46am
- Maggie Pie
  
  My partner gave a urine sample to Lab Tests last month. Ever since he’s been swamped with emails of ‘special offers’ from Liquorland,
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:20am
  - David George
    
    You’re a gem Maggie.
    
    3 0
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    October 16, 2020 12:17pm
  - RJ
    
    Well what was the result, is he pregnant?
    
    3 0
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    October 16, 2020 4:01pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  if you use gmail or outlook or chrome then everything you write or receive is sniffed for hints as to subjects that are of interest to you (and advertisers). The price of using ‘free’ stuff on the interweb. You are the product
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:36pm
Bobba Fret

It surprises me that the Greens have risen to 8% in latest poll when this week its all been negative for them regarding the wealth tax. It would actually be good if they put the percentages to say one decimal place (especially the small parties) as the greens may be 7.6% or could be 8.4%.
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October 16, 2020 10:52am
- kowtow
  
  It’s tactical voting based on the polls. Labour voters ,comfortable with their lead can afford to vote Green to keep their friends in the game.
  
  Pollsters influence outcomes . Not sure that’s a good thing.
  
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  October 16, 2020 1:13pm
- Tall Man
  
  Shows that 8% of the voters are both greedy and thick.
  
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  October 16, 2020 1:58pm
- krazykiwi
  
  What I don’t get is that polls show 16% support for a wealth tax. Wtf? That indicates that (probably) half the supporters are Green voters and the other half are Labour voters. No matter, we’re screwed.
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:08pm
Bobba Fret

Everyone is commenting on Jacinda’s comment that she will resign if she loses the election (which according to polls is extremely unlikely).
What about the fact that she said she would stay for the full three year term if re-elected.
I have always been of the opinion she will leave half way through the next term.
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October 16, 2020 10:55am
- herb1
  
  She want very forthright when asked about that
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:33pm
herb1

with the massive amount of Labour adds appearing in the Herald and Stuff, it would be interesting to know the deals they are getting.
Perhaps a payback for share of $50 mill or an advance on the next round of payments.
The Government told the media pre election that they were working on another payment , which in some ways is my insidious than an actual payment.
They publicly withdrew the proposal but is any one in any doubt that Labour operatives have had “off the record “discussions on what is expected of Media for another round of payments post election
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October 16, 2020 11:03am
- sharont
  
  If they are doing so well you would wonder why they were wasting the money. Cindy’s mug is plastered all over billboards everywhere I look. I’m looking forward to her resignation Sunday.
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:48am
ex-golfer

As has been eloquently outlined in some previous articles the current Govt is one that has been a “do nothing” Govt.
They haven’t achieved anything transformational and their only real success is squandering the surpluses that Bill English’s hard work left them with.
We could count ourselves lucky that the Govt hasn’ achieved anything that would be considered part of their move to socialism. They have failed at all their major policy platforms.

Now the situation is different. The cupboard is bare, the economy is stalling, all social factors are on the decline and the welfare state is going through massive growth. The only money they can spend is the stuff they are printing. Tax revenue will be down, Govt spending will increase. Decades of deficits will result.
And a few of the more radical ideas that Labour want to impose are about to be done (hate speech, employment law etc).
Some might have faith that the Govt is so useless they will be unable to achieve any of their aims – due to their record of failure.

With the power the electorate is about to give them (as predicted by the Polls), we are heading for some rocky times. NZ will be moving rapidly further to the left. Buckle down everyone.
They are coming for your freedoms, your wealth and your rights.
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October 16, 2020 11:08am
- herb1
  
  A good way to look at Arderns legacy after only 2 years is when her baby Daughter will start University we will still be in deficit.
  That dosent take into account the damage her and Green terrorist supporters further inflict on the country
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:31pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump in Iowa attacking corrupt Bidens.
https://trendingpolitics.com/breaking-video-trump-wasted-no-time-attacking-joe-biden-after-shocking-new-leaks-expose-everything/?
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October 16, 2020 11:12am
I remember when

Are Reverse Mortgages going to be the next financing area for the big banks?
Interest rates are said to be going to stay low for a number of years.
Where are older people going to get the extra finance for holidays, house repairs, outings, theatre, etc. Many of the options for better income are foreign to our experiences. The ‘fish hooks’ more difficult to understand. Bitcoin, Technology shares – what are the up and downsides. Is it a little dabble in the Finance Companies – are they better risk now?
Have the kids annoyed you lately? Do they deserve your money?
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October 16, 2020 11:16am
- Jules99
  
  Banksters harvesting wealth from the middle classes.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:02pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  The excitement could be interest rates taking off like a rocket. It’s too early to call but the next 12 months and beyond could be a nightmare for an amateur govt. Labour have a wage/price spiral previously and lost an election because of it.
  
  Robbo has lassoed the Reserve Bank and may fight to keep the interest rates down on his his luxurious borrowings. I hope we have more capable people in charge. I’m hearing a young son advocating modern money theory and it sounds so easy. The idea is not new and no State has printed its way forward except to starving populations through inflation. Sometimes Prudence shows as a real virtue. Buying elections is not.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:13pm
  - alloytoo
    
    Why do print and spend governments need taxes?
    
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    October 16, 2020 5:49pm
- Max
  
  Should labour/greens get in on Saturday we are retired we will cash up the rental property and move to Oz and as travel opens up to other countries for three years. We don’t have kids but have Nephews and Nieces with their offspring, but they are all woke. So we have decided to spend it all over the rest of our lives hopefully for at least another twenty years.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:55pm
Engelbert Humperdink

Interesting story in the Herald about a woman repeatedly rammed on the motorway and the police completely dismissive and even though she supplied a photo and a reg, the woke Plods (or Plodettes) sez “the SUV registration was not traceable”and ending the initial interview after five minutes. “They said the only other thing they can do is to physically locate the car – until they can locate the car and locate the people that were driving it, they’re not really going to be able to do much.”

Oh, OK then. /sarc

I’m pretty sure if a Plodcar was rammed or a Green pol punched they would be all over it like flies on feces. Guess you have to appear as a Correct/Approved melanin or polanin victim to get their attention.
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October 16, 2020 11:16am
- RJ
  
  Police actually said the investigation is ongoing
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/woman-rammed-repeatedly-on-motorway-shocked-by-police-response/CBGYYP36MDMXRFKARF2WB7K3XM/
  
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  October 16, 2020 11:48am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Only after they got called out. I believe we are paying them to do their job without being publicly shamed into it first.
    
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    October 16, 2020 1:08pm
    - RJ
      
      I believe we’ve got one side of the story from the lady which isn’t always the truth, it is just her version of the truth. We’re police caught out, I’d doubt it, more than likely they were investigating it but she wasn’t happy with it.
      
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      October 16, 2020 2:33pm
- cmm
  
  I’m pretty sure that if the car had done 107kph past a speed camera they’d be able to find it too.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:02pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    As one sheep said to the other “Who in the actual flock would see a reason to downtick cmm’s comment???”
    
    2 1
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    October 16, 2020 3:19pm
septic skeptic

Well, my family votes have gone in. All different from last time.

Me Nat list Act party. Was Nat list and spoiled ballot.
Wife Nat list and Act party. Was two ticks blue.
Mother in law, who is a genuine card carrying member of the CCP – two ticks blue. Was two ticks red.
Son hasn’t bothered to enroll. So that is a missed opportunity for Cindy as he thinks we need stable government during the Covid epidemic.
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October 16, 2020 11:22am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  can still enrole and vote. Apply boot to arse.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:59pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    Would do if he wasn’t intending to vote Cindy. As Churchill once said, if you aren’t a socialist at 20 you have no heart. Guess that made me heartless then as well.
    
    4 0
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    October 16, 2020 3:28pm
- Steve Todd
  
  Me Nat list Act party.
  
  Just to be clear, you’re saying you gave your electorate / candidate vote for National, and your Party vote for ACT, aren’t you?
  
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  October 16, 2020 1:09pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    yes Nat electorate!
    
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    October 16, 2020 3:25pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Mind control.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ofz949wwxr3gukg/mind%20control.jpg?dl=0
7 2
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October 16, 2020 11:24am
- JackRabbit
  
  You have correctly identified that airborne viruses can make their way into the body through any ingress method. Eyes are good because they are already wet with fluid. Perfect sticking surface.
  
  If the threat was real, you would have seen the princess wearing the top one at all the times. As you see in docos and movies when handling virus material or going into a space with airborne viruses, pathogens, allergens etc.
  
  https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-ppe-pestilence-medical-masks.html
  
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  October 16, 2020 2:09pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Latinos for Trump parade. Estimated 30000 vehicles. Tell me again that Trump will not win bigly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVfsCn4NYY8
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October 16, 2020 11:36am
- sharont
  
  I have no doubt that Trump will win bigly.
  
  8 5
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  October 16, 2020 11:47am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Isn’t that supposed to be “big league”?
    
    3 15
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    October 16, 2020 11:56am
- Jules99
  
  Yeah, compare and contrast with a Dem rally which just has violence and hatred. Nice to happy people celebrate their country and love their president.
  
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  October 16, 2020 12:00pm
- Batman
  
  Trump won’t win bigly.
  
  5 14
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  October 16, 2020 12:50pm
  - Tall Man
    
    But he will win 😉
    
    7 3
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    October 16, 2020 2:39pm
    - Batman
      
      There are several options for him to eeek out a win on the EC, yes.
      
      Whether he can and does, is of course an open question ?
      
      But “win bigly”? Simply not going to happen in the electorate as it stands. He is simply too unpopular / not popular enough.
      
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      December 16, 2019 4:30pm
- fernglas
  
  300 million cars in America. This is the Covid maths repeated. I think that’s one in ten thousand?
  
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  October 16, 2020 2:19pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Just imagine if there were car parades in all large cities …..
    Greta would not be happy, all of that fuel and CO
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:40pm
lifesgood

I sure hope accountants, lawyers and financial advisers are working on creative ways to avoid the “I’m jealous because you’ve got more than me rich tax” which will be a certainty if/when Labour gets reelected. DPF’s analysis of the polls has made me very depressed. I was holding our hope but not any more.
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October 16, 2020 12:05pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  It’s not over until the Pie Lady sings. There’s still a day to go.
  ☑️☑️Mopping up the mess.☑️☑️
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:54pm
Fletch

Jacinda has made Brietbart. They say the “Leftist darling” will “romp” to election victory this weekend.

https://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2020/10/15/new-zealand-leftist-darling-jacinda-ardern-set-for-re-election/
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October 16, 2020 12:07pm
Maggie Pie

Just dialed into MagicTalk to see what the go was with Plunket.
GOD – to think the boys at Marist used to call ME a cockteaser!
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October 16, 2020 12:17pm
Humble Capitalist

A friend last weekend said ‘oh well its going to be a Labour/ACT government’. I explained to him that this will never ever happen as they are at the opposite ends of the political spectrum.
I just heard a caller to Magic Talk also suggesting such a coalition will happen.
Just goes to show there are so many people that just have no idea about politics and policies.
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October 16, 2020 12:23pm
Max

Just bought my first Herald for 11 years today to see the advertisement we funded under David Farrar. We counted 5 advertisements for Labour including 3 showing a grinning Jacinda, copious opinions that Labour is a winner, Jacinda won the debates or drew etc and that National will fail again in 2023, however besides our crowdfunded advert not a single advert for National, why? Also a cartoon depicting David Seymour as the pied piper? The left are sick in my opinion perhaps best National stayed away.
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October 16, 2020 12:35pm
- sooty
  
  Next election we will have to go early, go hard!
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:12pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Advertising for the left seems as though it may have been at a special rate.
  If that is because of the $50M handout this election has to be declared as Won by National because of election fraud.
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:50pm
Maggie Pie

Twitter suffers massive outage after temporarily denying access to President Trump …….LOL!!

(although it really pisses me off tbh)
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October 16, 2020 12:52pm
Suze Wainwright

I can’t imagine the Greens wanting to take a breather before introducing their mouth watering array of new taxes. Cindy’s sure to get first hand experience of what it really means to go ‘hard & fast!’

What will we see:
CGT 2.0
Death duties
Inheritance
Land tax(es)
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October 16, 2020 1:29pm
- sooty
  
  What happens to land tax on maori land, treaty settlements?
  Oh, they are exempt!
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:10pm
Suze Wainwright

As a gentleman and a non- misogynist, will James be told to give his deputy PM role to Marama?
7 0
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October 16, 2020 1:30pm
- sooty
  
  No! She will just take it and say “whatca ya gunna do about it”? I’ll give you the bash!
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:07pm
Jack5

Warning: What to expect from any new Labour or Labour-Green Government…

Karl du Fresne has an excellent column on the attack on freedom he expects from Labour or Labour-Greens if they win the election.

A sample:

Expect much more under a re-invigorated and unrestrained Ardern government, starting with laws to curb so-called “hate speech”. The putative justification – that the Human Rights Act doesn’t protect people from attacks on the basis of their religion (for which read Islam) – can be easily fixed by a simple amendment adding religion to the existing protections against discrimination on the grounds of colour, race, nationality and ethnicity. But don’t expect the government to stop there. Using the Christchurch mosque massacres as a pretext (a false one, since the absence of restrictive speech laws didn’t cause the shootings and the introduction of tough new ones wouldn’t prevent a similar occurrence), the government is likely to crack down on any speech regarded as offensive by members of supposedly vulnerable minority groups. Egged on by provocateurs in the media, an Ardern government might decide not only to lower the threshold at which speech is considered harmful, but to extend protection to other groups demanding special treatment – for example, trans-gender people.

Du Fresne’s column, and thank you to NZCPR and Muriel Newman for putting it before us:

https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2020/10/karl-du-fresne-what-no-ones-talked.html
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October 16, 2020 1:58pm
- Tall Man
  
  What a fucking future we may have to look forward too.
  
  Thankfully they’ll fall at the final hurdle.
  
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  October 16, 2020 2:37pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Hopefully they fall tomorrow. Ardern’s pride has yet to go Poof!
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:46pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  The hypocrisy is eye watering. Religious texts will be allowed to keep offending any group. But criticism of such religious texts could land you in jail.
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:15pm
Maggie Pie

We just switched over from the Trump Town Hall to the Biden Town Hall …..
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
11 6
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October 16, 2020 2:31pm
- virtualmark
  
  Trump’s town hall is combative, and his replies to questions are gibberish word salads … I’ve been trying to parse what he actually says and you just can’t.
  
  Biden’s is fairly calm and respectful, and he’s giving meaningful answers.
  
  Frank Luntz and Sarah Longwell (two GOP-related pollsters) both have focus groups of undecided voters watching the town halls, and their tweet updates suggest those voters are angry at Trump’s style and warming to Biden’s.
  
  Trump may find it was a mistake to counter-programme the same format event at the same time such that undecided voters can just flick channels from one candidate to the other. The comparison might not favour Trump.
  
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  October 16, 2020 2:59pm
  - virtualmark
    
    Every debate delivers a singular moment that captures the event in people’s minds.
    
    In the first US Presidential debate it was Trump telling the Proud Boys to “stand back, and standby”.
    
    In this town hall head-to-head “debate” it’s “Mr Rogers vs your crazy uncle”.
    
    (Savannah Guthrie called out Trump for retweeting baseless conspiracy theories saying “You’re the President, you’re not like someone’s crazy uncle”. Mercedes Schlapp, former Trump WH staffer and now Trump campaign official, said Biden’s town hall was “like an episode of Mr Roger’s Neighbourhood”. Way to win PA Mercedes!)
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:23pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The differences are real. Biden does give simpler easier sentences but he can offer numbers or memories suggesting retirement would be a desirable choice.
    Trump reminds me of Muldoon who’s communication was often truncated as though you were on his wavelength. Nevertheless he could give a marvellous lecture on economic history.
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:44pm
    - Harriet
      
      Trump is just like Muldoon — at least you know what’s going on. 😎
      
      4 2
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      October 16, 2020 4:53pm
- sooty
  
  Your partner home for lunch?
  
  5 1
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  October 16, 2020 3:08pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    YUP – Crispy edge pancakes, maple syrip, cream & lemon juice.
    He reckons no one else can do it like me 😛
    
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    October 16, 2020 3:52pm
- Fletch
  
  Apparently, nobody even mentioned the New York Post story about Hunter Biden during the whole 90 minute town hall. No one even brought it up. Certainly not the moderator. Biden was never asked about it. The media are carrying water for him. If it were Trump it would have been one of the first questions raised.
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:52pm
  - Batman
    
    Or, back in the real world, it’s a bullshit story pushed by corrupt officials and old drunks like Rudi?
    
    Shocking, I know.
    
    4 9
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    October 16, 2020 4:16pm
    - Fletch
      
      What’s strange is that neither Twitter nor Facebook saw fit to block the stories about Trump and the Russia conspiracy which actually were false. They didn’t seem to care if those false allegations were spread around social media. But when it comes to the Dems all of a sudden they are worried about disinformation, etc, etc.
      
      It stinks from a mile off, and you know it.
      
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      October 16, 2020 4:53pm
      - Mike
        
        You are having quite a hard time distinguishing between fact and fiction, old bean.
        
        2 2
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        October 16, 2020 7:25pm
Maggy Wassilieff

I told hubby that if Greens bring the Wealth Tax in and I pop my clogs, he’s to quickly marry some young thing wanting a decent nest egg, and I’ll get hitched to a local layabout if he croaks first.

He looked at me and said… we live in Kaiti – our house isn’t a million bucks…

Whew…. the benefits of living in the ghetto.
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October 16, 2020 2:43pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  No need to undersell yoself Maggs!
  Just come up for a game of tennis sometime. There’s always a few old boys at Remuera Racquets on the pull 😛
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:20pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Apart from sad sax like me, who else will be reading this stuff on a Friday Afternoon before an election?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/10/nz-election-2020-david-seymour-s-claim-labour-turned-6b-surplus-into-1b-deficit-before-covid-19-mostly-true-aap-factcheck.html
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October 16, 2020 3:15pm
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  Both in work and life, I’ve always acted on a principle that a complete catastrophe is pretty straightforward; just hunker down, do the popcorn thing, watch and wait. It’s when there is still something I can do, that things get sporty.
  
  I’ve done in my circles of influence (not here 🙂 ) what I could. If St Pestilentia gets back in and the Greens cornhole the economy further and diversity kills us some more of us and I Want It tribal apartheid gets worse – hey, that’s not on me.
  
  You can’t win, you can’t break even, and you can’t get out of the game. There it is.
  
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  October 16, 2020 3:25pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  David Seymour is probably correct. Poohbah is proven spender–it’s other people money to pay back.
  My only consolation is that if they get returned they may give up in horror within 12 months. Their amateur status will not help them though the next 3 years. NZ is tightly bound to the global economies and these can have more affect on us than imagined.
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:33pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Senators Ted Cruz and Lindsey Graham calling out Twitter CEO over interference in the Election (the Biden story) Facebook could be subpoenaed as well.
https://www.facebook.com/whitehousebrief/posts/3393249054085550
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October 16, 2020 3:43pm
- Batman
  
  Meanwhile the left is wondering if it’s a hack as a bunch of viral anti-trump videos have had their views chopped by several hundred thousand, and accounts disabled etc.
  
  So the answer is probably that it’s a systems failure, or a good old fashioned hacking to cause a little mayhem.
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:24pm
  - RJ
    
    Plain and simply, Twitter had a boo boo
    
    “The recent issue was caused by an inadvertent change we made to our internal systems. Twitter should be working for everyone within the next few hours,” the company said.
    
    in an earlier tweet, Twitter also said that it didn’t “have any evidence of a security breach or hack.”
    
    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/is-twitter-down-outage-not-working-2020-10?r=US&IR=T
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:35pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    “Meanwhile the left is wondering if it’s a hack as a bunch of viral anti-trump videos have had their views chopped by several hundred thousand, and accounts disabled etc.”
    Love your satire Batman – and then the excuse
    
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    October 16, 2020 4:52pm
- Inandout
  
  Close Twitter and FB, or haul their heads before a select committee.
  
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  October 16, 2020 5:49pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

https://babylonbee.com/news/mark-zuckerberg-jumps-out-of-mans-shower-to-tell-him-the-story-hes-reading-is-fake-news/?
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October 16, 2020 4:02pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Amazing what $50M does to the world repeaters. Now they are not so sure??
https://www.odt.co.nz/star-news/star-national/no-international-halo-so-shabby-international-media-fire-shots-ardern?
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October 16, 2020 4:09pm
Batman

Oh this is juicy, Rudi and Co now in the headlights for being foreign intelligence stooges

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fbi-probing-alleged-hunter-biden-emails-as-possible-foreign-intelligence-operation

“The Federal Bureau of Investigation has seized the laptop central to a controversial story in the New York Post about Hunter Biden, and the agency is investigating whether the emails purportedly contained in it are products of a foreign intelligence operation, NBC reports.”
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October 16, 2020 4:26pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  DNC operatives using any and all FUD means at their disposal to try and deflect heat from their guy, and of course they will attempt to borrow legitimacy by using actors from three letter agencies to do their work – just as they did with Russia collusion bullshit and other attempts to bring down Trump.
  
  But 10’s of thousands of messages, pictures and videos are not going to get brushed away by cries of fabrication, and will provide lots of hints on places and things to look into.
  
  There is no hiding the activities of Biden and son both known, and slowly bleeding out of investigations sparked by these leaks. There will be digital trails that cannot be hidden. The next week is going to be a lot of fun.
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:39pm
- Fletch
  
  C’mon man. If it’s not true then why did Joe Biden shut down his press conference yesterday? Why did no one ask him about the matter in his town hall to give him opportunity to deny the allegations? Because they know, and we know, that it’s all true.
  
  As Tucker put it yesterday, if this is a frame up then it’s a very long and convoluted frame.
  
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  October 16, 2020 4:48pm
- RJ
  
  Btw, does anyone know why a computer repairman calls the police or fbi when working on a laptop.
  
  https://twitter.com/ChanelRion/status/1316737387943395328
  
  It is the underage part
  
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  October 16, 2020 5:24pm
Maggie Pie

Just been basting the duck for dindins. My partner came in and asked an interesting question….”should the police pursue fleeing drivers – and should Andrew Bevroft be shown the arse-card??”
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October 16, 2020 4:30pm
Benedict Yu

Why cannot New Zealand Police do this to gangs here? Another example of the two countries diverging.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/300134596/two-hells-angels-gang-members-to-be-deported-from-australia-to-new-zealand

“Australian Federal Police National Anti-Gangs Squad Detective Acting Superintendent Jason McArthur said Outlaw Motorcycle Gangs are violent, well-organised criminal networks that have zero respect for the law and regard themselves as above it.

“They are not families or a ‘brotherhood’. The Hells Angels – like every other bikie gang – is trying to recruit new members and associates only to facilitate its criminal ventures and make money,” he said.”
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October 16, 2020 5:20pm
All_on_Red

Biden Crime Family
Hunter Biden pursued deals with a major Chinese energy company including one that would be ‘interesting for me and my family’, new secret emails said to be from the presidential candidate’s son claim.

He also struck a deal for $30 million plus bonuses ‘based on introductions alone’ over three years after his father left office, then was offered a ‘much more lasting and lucrative arrangement.’
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8842965/amp/Hunter-Biden-pursued-deals-interesting-family-major-Chinese-firm.html?__twitter_impression=true

It’s notable the Biden Campaign HAS NOT disavowed the validity of these emails.
Or that Joe had the meeting with the Burisma exec. They also played golf together and there is a photo of that.
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October 16, 2020 5:56pm
- Mike
  
  Still time for indictments before the election?
  #lockthemallup
  
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  October 16, 2020 7:22pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

There are problems here on Kiwiblog. Many times I post and it comes up in the wrong place. Is there some kind of trickery going on?
This comment will prob come up on a post the I have not even read
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October 16, 2020 5:58pm
WaynelSexton

One News is doing a great job of demoralizing National voters.
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October 16, 2020 6:13pm
tranquil

Hi all –

I’ve resigned myself to the fact that Cindy will get another three years.
Sigh…….. **bashes head against wall**

The Greens will hold the balance of power and so Labour will do **anything** they say in order to stay in.
Look for **lots** of new taxes. Also look for a huge FLOOD of people leaving here for Australia.
( Heck, National reduced it to a trickle and even REVERSED it for a few months…. ).

Oh well. I will take comfort in having a massive dose of **schadenfreude** when the economy goes down the toilet.
I’ll be telling the lefties “I TOLD you so but would you listen? No!”
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October 16, 2020 6:45pm
RJ

A woman who escaped an abusive relationship says she and her four children will be forced out of their emergency accommodation and into a car, as a change in Government policy will make her housing unaffordable.

newshub

She doesn’t want to lay 25% of her income for a one room unit, which she says is $400 a week. So if $400 a week is 25% of her income why can’t she find a house? Landlords won’t rent to her, why? Landlords want to rent, they want the money, more to this story perhaps.
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October 16, 2020 6:48pm
Fletch

Open letter signed by 1,804 NZ doctors opposed to legalizing cannabis.

https://doctorssayno.nz/
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October 16, 2020 7:27pm
trevorneverliesdown

So going to vote tomorrow maybe
And Polls show as it looks like its LAb/Green
or Lab
So who to vote for?
National weak team, disorganized …so NO
Act leader great, the rest of the list, not so much
(as usual) .. so NO
NZF? of course not
God botherers ? not likely 😉
Hold my nose and vote Labour to keep Greens out?
Or not bother?
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October 16, 2020 8:49pm
- marcw
  
  If you don’t like the idea of a Labour/Green Government, then as it stands the only way to reduce this possibility or their dominance is 2 ticks National at this late stage.
  
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  October 16, 2020 10:42pm

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More Expert Wrongness, Military version: Missile Defence and the F-35
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Again, hate crimes are not necessarily terrorism.
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Why I am retiring from political blogging
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Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
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